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Speaker 1: Hi. I'm Laura Vanderkamp. I'm a mother of five, an author, journalist,

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Speaker 1: and speaker.

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Speaker 2: And I'm Sarah hart Hunger, a mother of three, practicing physician, writer,

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Speaker 2: and course creator. We are two working parents who love

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Speaker 2: our careers and our families.

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Speaker 1: Welcome to best of both worlds. Here we talk about

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Speaker 1: how real women manage work, family, and time for fun.

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Speaker 1: From figuring out childcare to mapping out long term career goals.

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Speaker 1: We want you to get the most out of life.

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Speaker 1: Welcome to best of both worlds. This is Laura. This

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Speaker 1: episode is airing in mid May of twenty twenty six.

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Speaker 1: Sarah is going to be interviewing Manush Zomorodi, who is

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Speaker 1: the author of the brand new book The Body Electric,

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Speaker 1: which is all about digital life and health, and we

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Speaker 1: are so excited to have her back on the show

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Speaker 1: she has been on in the past, also talking about

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Speaker 1: our digital life. She has a previous book, Board and

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Speaker 1: Brilliant that I know we both enjoyed, so we're really

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Speaker 1: looking forward to that interview. Sarah, what maybe could tell

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Speaker 1: us a little bit about her ideas with this new book.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well, I'm super excited because I'm a Newish super fan,

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Speaker 2: so longtime listeners will know. I mean I listened to

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Speaker 2: tons of her podcasts, and I love her reporting style

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Speaker 2: on her way of weaving personal vignettes in with real

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Speaker 2: facts and science. And that's exactly what she does in

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Speaker 2: The Body Electric where she goes through many aspects of

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Speaker 2: our lives that have been impacted by the time we

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Speaker 2: now spend on screens. And as someone who is kind

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Speaker 2: of in that health field and who spends plenty of

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Speaker 2: time on screens, I kind of had a like I

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Speaker 2: gleaned a lot of what she said, but I never

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Speaker 2: knew the actual science behind it, and she really doves

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Speaker 2: into it very nicely, as well as shares the results

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Speaker 2: of a very significant, big study that they did where

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Speaker 2: they had people basically get up for five minutes every

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Speaker 2: half hour to two hours, and the changes that happened

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Speaker 2: with people's health so super interesting. Kind of rounds you

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Speaker 2: a Laura stuff in a way, because it's like it's

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Speaker 2: one thing to make a bunch of hypotheses and kind

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Speaker 2: of stand up on a soapbox and wave your hand

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Speaker 2: and talk about how phones are bad, but it's another

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Speaker 2: thing to look at actual time logs and do surveys

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Speaker 2: and like interact with actual humans and find out what works.

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Speaker 3: And she does go that.

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Speaker 2: Extra mile and that deeper layer, which I love. So

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Speaker 2: this will be a really fun episode. And I guess

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Speaker 2: I'm curious, Laura, because we're going to be talking about

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Speaker 2: movement and activity. Do you currently track your steps? So?

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Speaker 1: I do, not that I actively chose to do it,

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Speaker 1: but because my phone tracks it automatically in the health app.

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Speaker 1: Maybe there's some people who've never looked at this, but

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Speaker 1: if you click on the little heart in the iPhone

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Speaker 1: home screen, it will tell you how many steps you've

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Speaker 1: taken while the phone has been on you in the day.

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Speaker 1: And as many of us, I pretty much always have

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Speaker 1: it in my pocket, so it is not an inaccurate

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Speaker 1: view of how many steps I take. It's not one

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Speaker 1: hundred percent accurate because I don't always keep it with me,

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Speaker 1: but it's probably getting at least eighty percent of what

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Speaker 1: I'm doing. So yeah, I mean through that I can

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Speaker 1: see how many steps I take. I did a little

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Speaker 1: over eleven thousand and twenty twenty five per day. We're

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Speaker 1: down under ten thousand this year, but I think that's

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Speaker 1: because it's winter it's been cold, and not when we're

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Speaker 1: doing this now it's in May, but you know, coming

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Speaker 1: into now it has been lower, but I think it

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Speaker 1: will go up over the summer.

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Speaker 2: Fun fact, I used to average like twenty thousand steps,

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Speaker 2: like all of twenty twenty three, twenty twenty four.

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Speaker 1: Oh well that's the running. That was the running.

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Speaker 2: If you're running like fifty miles a week, Now I'm

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Speaker 2: like eight thousand steps, So like, wow, what down ship?

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Speaker 1: What change?

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Speaker 2: Although I think it's a huge difference, I actually think

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Speaker 2: there's probably less difference between like twenty thousand and eight

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Speaker 2: eight thousand than there is in like eight thousand and

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Speaker 2: zero or something like that.

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Speaker 1: So that's true. I'm sure that the first eight thousand

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Speaker 1: steps is actually huge, and if you are getting very

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Speaker 1: few steps, challenging yourself to get something like five thousand

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Speaker 1: a day is probably a really good thing to do.

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Speaker 1: And whereas if you're getting nine thousand, getting to ten thousand,

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Speaker 1: that is nice but probably not that critical.

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Speaker 2: And you don't do anything specific to like try to

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Speaker 2: get a specific number. Correct.

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Speaker 1: I try not to. There have been some moments in

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Speaker 1: my life where I've been a bit more focused on,

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Speaker 1: say streaks of how many days have I gotten over

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Speaker 1: ten thousand and then I will admit that I have

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Speaker 1: gotten up and walked around my bedroom at night, But

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Speaker 1: I don't really like that behavior, so I try not

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Speaker 1: to let it influence me that much.

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Speaker 3: That's so funny.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I've never been tempted, like I like to look

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Speaker 2: at the data. I even like write it down, actually,

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Speaker 2: but I don't actually like it's more of like an

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Speaker 2: overview than a I need to hit some specific milestone

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Speaker 2: on it. I want to look at trends, not at

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Speaker 2: individual days, if that makes sense.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Now are your steps now? Are they mostly because

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Speaker 1: you're walking back and forth like between patients, or is

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Speaker 1: it that you're specifically trying to do a walk both.

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Speaker 2: No, I usually take a walk almost every day, like

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Speaker 2: twenty to thirty minutes worth. If I'm a clinical day,

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Speaker 2: I do it during lunchtime.

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Speaker 3: If I'm home, I do it like I feel like

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Speaker 3: I need to get out.

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Speaker 2: I mean, I think it's like the stuff that my

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Speaker 2: news talks about, like you just feel toxic afters out

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Speaker 2: of time, and I'm like, I feel so much better.

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Speaker 2: And live in a place with generally good weather. It

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Speaker 2: can get dicey in the summer, but we do have

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Speaker 2: a treadmill for backup. So I do take a twenty

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Speaker 2: to thirty minute.

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Speaker 3: Walk most days.

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Speaker 2: I get tons of steps when I'm on call because

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Speaker 2: I wouldn't even have to take a walk, and I

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Speaker 2: get over ten thousand because like we have patients in

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Speaker 2: different buildings and different floors, and you have to walk

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Speaker 2: back from the office of the hospital, and like I've

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Speaker 2: looked at my watch before and like every time I

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Speaker 2: make a round from the office to the hospital, that's

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Speaker 2: at least two thousand right there. And if you do

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Speaker 2: that three times and then just go about your business, like,

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Speaker 2: you've gotten a lot of steps in.

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Speaker 3: So that's kind of cool.

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Speaker 2: It can be fun to notice activity that you're doing

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Speaker 2: and like get credit for it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, but you haven't thought you needed like a

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Speaker 1: treadmill desk or anything, like your work for one day.

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Speaker 2: Does have one, and she just put it in. I'm like, okay,

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Speaker 2: that's kind of cool. But then the funny thing is,

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Speaker 2: I'm like, hmm, I went out to walk and I

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Speaker 2: was like, do you want to come?

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Speaker 1: She's like, no, because I have my treadmill desk. Why

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Speaker 1: would I need to go for a walk. I've solved

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Speaker 1: that problem, But now she may go with me in

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Speaker 1: the future. We'll see. Yeah, well, I gotta say an

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Speaker 1: outdoor walk if that sounds much more appealing to me

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Speaker 1: than walking at like two miles per hour while being

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Speaker 1: on the phone.

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Speaker 3: Or something typing. I feel like I might get a

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Speaker 3: little typing.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, No, I would have to like rework my

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Speaker 1: workflow to be like moving well type.

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Speaker 2: I don't know.

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Speaker 1: I'm sure I could do it. Maybe I could dictate

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Speaker 1: or something. I don't know. Yeah, no, I might work

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Speaker 1: from home days. I do try to get myself up.

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Speaker 1: I mean, because so my step kind it's counting my runs,

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Speaker 1: of course, which aren't that long. I'm certainly wasn't doing

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Speaker 1: any of those twenty thousand step days. But and then

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Speaker 1: I will try to take like a five pm walk

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Speaker 1: or something if it's been a day where I've really

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Speaker 1: been sitting a lot, and just try to get a

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Speaker 1: little bit of activity, or walk down to the mailbox

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Speaker 1: or walk down to the end of the street or something.

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Speaker 2: Because you do feel better. I'm Minusha's book, I do

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Speaker 2: feel better.

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Speaker 1: You can explore, yeah, all of.

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Speaker 2: The various ways in which you feel better and how

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Speaker 2: you might build these little walk breaks into your day.

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Speaker 3: If you don't already.

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Speaker 1: Absolutely, well, I'm really excited to hear what Manuche has

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Speaker 1: to say. She's my book birthday twin, so yeah, we

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Speaker 1: were excited to see our books coming out together. But

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Speaker 1: let's hear what she has to say.

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Speaker 3: Well, I am so.

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Speaker 2: Excited to welcome Manouche Sammarodi to the podcast for the

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Speaker 2: second time. Longtime listeners might remember that I interviewed her

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Speaker 2: in twenty eighteen.

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Speaker 3: So what was that that long ago?

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Speaker 4: Was it that long ago?

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Speaker 1: It was?

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Speaker 3: I had to look it up.

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Speaker 2: I know, like my eight year old was one or

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Speaker 2: maybe even a few months old. We've recorded that episode

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Speaker 2: time wise, Manuche, I know it's true. Back then, Yeah,

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Speaker 2: you were focused on the impact of our devices on

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Speaker 2: our brains and what it did to us to no

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Speaker 2: longer be bored, and your work in that sector was

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Speaker 2: I felt very powerful and also very prescient, Like there's

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Speaker 2: just there wasn't the anxious generation yet, Like you were

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Speaker 2: one of the first voices I heard you loud and clear.

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Speaker 2: So can you share what you've been doing since then

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Speaker 2: and maybe how that has kind of morphed into your

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Speaker 2: current area of interest?

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Speaker 1: Yes?

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Speaker 4: Okay, so Sarah, I can't stop thinking about the tech

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Speaker 4: influence on our brains and our bodies. That's become my

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Speaker 4: new thing. So over the last I would say, like

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Speaker 4: four years, we talk about so much the mental health

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Speaker 4: effect of our tech use and the impact it has

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Speaker 4: on how we feel. But I started becoming obsessed with

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Speaker 4: the question of what was it actually doing to our bodies,

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Speaker 4: Like how was our tech use affecting our physical health?

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Speaker 4: And I couldn't really find very much about it. And

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Speaker 4: I will say like this became extremely urgent to me

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Speaker 4: during the pandemic because I could not understand why, like

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Speaker 4: I was safe, I was healthy. I was sitting all

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Speaker 4: day doing work and all the things on all the screens,

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Speaker 4: and I was so tired, and I just was like,

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Speaker 4: what is the problem. I've barely moved. Why do I

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Speaker 4: not want to spring up from my chair and like

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Speaker 4: go for a run or something. Why do I feel

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Speaker 4: like I can I just have enough energy to like

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Speaker 4: crawl over to the couch. And it was frustrating to me,

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Speaker 4: and I you know, oh, well, there's a lot going

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Speaker 4: on in the world, yes, all of those things, but

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Speaker 4: I wanted to know, like biologically, what was going on

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Speaker 4: in my body that felt like it was wearing me down.

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Speaker 4: So I embarked on this sort of journey. I was like, Okay,

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Speaker 4: I'm going to try and understand this. And in twenty

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Speaker 4: twenty three I ended up reading or hearing about the

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Speaker 4: work of a physiologist named Keith Diaz at Columbia University. Okay, so,

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Speaker 4: Keith's whole jam in life is to try to understand

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Speaker 4: what is the minimum amount of movement that the human

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Speaker 4: body needs, so like our screen felled, the seated lives

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Speaker 4: don't essentially put us into an early grave kind of dire.

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Speaker 1: And he had.

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Speaker 4: Found in his lab actually that a sort of rubric

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Speaker 4: like an algorithm, like essentially five minutes of gentle movement

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Speaker 4: for every half hour during prolonged sitting sedentary periods resolved

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Speaker 4: some of the biggest harms blood pressure, blood sugar, the

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Speaker 4: ability to focus, anxiety. It sort of had these outsize

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Speaker 4: effects in the lab, and I was like, that's it.

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Speaker 4: You just got to get up and move for five

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Speaker 4: minutes every half hour. And then I was like, oh,

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Speaker 4: get up and move for five minutes every half hour.

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Speaker 3: Could I do that?

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Speaker 4: I mean, it's not hard physically to do, but like,

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Speaker 4: would I do that? So I called Keith, and I

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Speaker 4: was like, what do you think, Like, do you think

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Speaker 4: people can do this? He's like, I'm not really sure

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Speaker 4: to be honest, like this is the problem. Like I'm

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Speaker 4: a researcher, I work in the lab, but I don't

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Speaker 4: actually have like real world ways of testing these sort

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Speaker 4: of solutions. So I was like, well, I do so

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Speaker 4: my host podcasts for NPR. So I reached out to

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Speaker 4: listeners and we ended up having over twenty thousand people

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Speaker 4: sign up for a global clinical trial. Nerding out here

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Speaker 4: Sarah because as a journalist that was really exciting for

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Speaker 4: me to do, like proper real medical science, and we

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Speaker 4: had them sign up to try taking movement breaks either

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Speaker 4: every half hour, every hour, or every two hours, because

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Speaker 4: part of this was like feasibility could people fit this

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Speaker 4: into their lives as well as what were the effects

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Speaker 4: that they saw? And it was really interesting. I mean

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Speaker 4: we had people like teachers and nurses, but also like

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Speaker 4: accountants and college students and uber drivers and like the

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Speaker 4: gamut and they stuck with it. Of the people who

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Speaker 4: committed to do the full two weeks, eighty percent of

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Speaker 4: them stuck with it, and they saw extraordinary change twenty

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Speaker 4: five percent on average less fatigue. They reported being able

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Speaker 4: to focus more, their mood was improved, they had more energy,

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Speaker 4: they got more work done. I would say better work

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Speaker 4: done in less time, because what we measured was that

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Speaker 4: productivity actually was not affected despite taking all these breaks

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Speaker 4: and interruptions. It did not make a difference because the

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Speaker 4: quality of the work improved. So people would come back

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Speaker 4: to their desk and their brain was fully functioning and

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Speaker 4: they were ready to go. And I'm sure as a

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Speaker 4: physician you're like, mm hmm, yep, knew it, but I

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Speaker 4: didn't know why. So that was also part of the project,

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Speaker 4: is explaining to them what exactly what was going on

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Speaker 4: in their bodies.

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Speaker 2: No, that's so fascinating, and I wouldn't give myself so

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Speaker 2: much credit to know that five minutes every half hour

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Speaker 2: would make the difference. I've just definitely been witnessed to

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Speaker 2: seeing that overall in general, like the way that our

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Speaker 2: society is built right now in the twenty twenties in

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Speaker 2: no way supports health, like to the point where you know,

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Speaker 2: at this point when someone comes in with chief complaint

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Speaker 2: of obesi, like that used to be hmm, what could

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Speaker 2: be hormonally wrong? Now it's like only one percent of

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Speaker 2: you have something hormonally wrong. Maybe less ninety nine point

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Speaker 2: nine percent of you have the society is wrong because

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Speaker 2: we're in this incredibly like obisogenic I guess environment. And

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Speaker 2: that's so fascinating to hear that, like such a small dose.

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Speaker 2: I want to delve more into like some of the specifics.

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Speaker 2: And I love how rigorous this was done. And I

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Speaker 2: read your book and I appreciated how, like.

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Speaker 3: Thank you, there was a scientist's voice.

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Speaker 2: I mean, it didn't read as a sciencey book because

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Speaker 2: you always come off as so conversational. I'm like, thanks

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Speaker 2: like a peer, but like you could tell there was

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Speaker 2: rigor behind it with Keith Diaz's work. So how were

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Speaker 2: some of these like outcomes where they mostly I mean

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Speaker 2: I would imagine, yeah, it had to be mostly self reports.

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Speaker 4: Yes, So let me clarify the difference between the lab

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Speaker 4: study versus the one we did. And I have to

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Speaker 4: say I took part in the lab study, which was

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Speaker 4: super fun. I don't know if you remember that part.

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Speaker 4: So I like went up to Columbia and I well,

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Speaker 4: first I had to wear a glucose monitor for a week.

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Speaker 4: They wanted to track my baseline. How did I respond

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Speaker 4: to like meals usually. And then I spent two days

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Speaker 4: in his lab. So one day, like my usual, sit

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Speaker 4: on my butt and work on my laptop for eight

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Speaker 4: hours straight. I got a short lunch break and some

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Speaker 4: bathroom breaks.

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Speaker 3: That was kind of it.

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Speaker 4: And I will say I was exhausted at the end

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Speaker 4: of the day. But the whole time they were measuring

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Speaker 4: my heart rate, they were measuring my blood pressure, they

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Speaker 4: were measuring my glucose, and I was doing self surveys

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Speaker 4: every half hour, like can you concentrate, are you tired?

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Speaker 4: How does it feel to do this? So that was

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Speaker 4: one day, and then the time I came back, I

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Speaker 4: had to bring the exact same lunch so that it

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Speaker 4: was like made sense scientifically. And then they did the

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Speaker 4: same and they measured all the same things, except every

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Speaker 4: half hour one of Keith's assistants would like tap me

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Speaker 4: on the shoulder and point to the treadmill, and I

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Speaker 4: would go over to the treadmill and they would put

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Speaker 4: me walking for two miles an hour. So that's like

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Speaker 4: I wasn't doing burpies, not running sprints. I was strolling.

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Speaker 4: And the difference was my blood sugar was cut in half.

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Speaker 4: The second day my blood pressure was down by five points.

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Speaker 4: My focus was so much better. I didn't it was

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Speaker 4: a weird thing.

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Speaker 3: I looked at.

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Speaker 4: I was like, did I get as much done? And

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Speaker 4: I realized, like, what I'd gotten done, the quality was

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Speaker 4: so much better that I didn't have to revisit it

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Speaker 4: to revise it the next day, So.

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Speaker 1: Do you know what I mean?

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Speaker 4: So it was like more efficient and like I would

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Speaker 4: get on the treadmill, and at first I was annoyed,

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Speaker 4: and then I would start to be like, Okay, when

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Speaker 4: I get back to my desk, I'm going to write

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Speaker 4: that email, but I really need to make sure that

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Speaker 4: I mentioned these things in that email.

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Speaker 1: Do you know what I mean?

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Speaker 4: I would like practice, And then I would get there

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Speaker 4: and I would write an email that we didn't have

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Speaker 4: to go back and forth because I had thought about

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Speaker 4: it and I actually spent the time to write it.

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Speaker 4: Whereas when you were like, oh, that person didn't read

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Speaker 4: to the end of my email, they did not actually

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Speaker 4: answer the question, you know what I mean?

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Speaker 1: I was just I.

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Speaker 2: Got our run a little bit sharper. It was sharper

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Speaker 2: exactly exactly. So then we're gonna I was gonna say,

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Speaker 2: I want to take a quick break. So I want

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Speaker 2: to talk about the content of what those breaks look like,

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Speaker 2: but I also want to hear what you have to say,

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Speaker 2: So when we get back, we are going to hear that.

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Speaker 2: All right, we are back, and Manush was talking about

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Speaker 2: how she got to be a guinea pig in the

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Speaker 2: study and went to the lab and had all these

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Speaker 2: biological parameters measured either sitting down sedentary for eight hours

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Speaker 2: straight or taking five minute breaks every half hour, and

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Speaker 2: I just interrupted her, and she was about to share

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Speaker 2: things really interesting about it. And I also want to

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Speaker 2: hear about what those breaks like, what you did while

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Speaker 2: you were on the treadmill.

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Speaker 4: Yes, okay, I get very excited, Sarah. So I I

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Speaker 4: wanted to draw the distinction, as you pointed out before

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Speaker 4: the break, between what we did in the lab and

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Speaker 4: how the results were measured versus we had twenty thousand

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Speaker 4: people all over the globe sign up to take breaks,

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Speaker 4: so obviously we couldn't measure twenty thousand people's glucose heart

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Speaker 4: rate all the rest of it. So this was primarily

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Speaker 4: self survey, which will not come as a surprise to you.

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Speaker 4: It was majority about I can't remember if it was

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Speaker 4: like seventy or eighty percent women, and Keith the researcher, said,

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Speaker 4: of course, because women are the ones who are most

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Speaker 4: willing to dedicate their time and be open to self improvement,

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Speaker 4: which is I thought was really funny actually, So they

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Speaker 4: would fill out surveys. Some of them were got surveys

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Speaker 4: really regularly. Other people, like we tried to break it.

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Speaker 4: They wanted a cross section of how people responded. I

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Speaker 4: am not the keeper of the data, but it was fascinating.

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Speaker 4: And then other people would fill it out at night

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Speaker 4: at the end of the day. And so what Keith

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Speaker 4: was able to do with all that data was quantify

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Speaker 4: the effects that people saw in terms of mood, fatigue,

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Speaker 4: and focus. But then when the project was over, so

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Speaker 4: we made a podcast about all this. But then I

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Speaker 4: was like, we have twenty thousand people who didn't just

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Speaker 4: give us like surveys with numbers. They wrote diary entries

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Speaker 4: that nobody had really gone through. So I spent the

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Speaker 4: next couple of years just trying to dig through all

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Speaker 4: the stories from people, all the things that people said

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Speaker 4: worked for them in terms of integrating these movement breaks

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Speaker 4: into their lives and trying to piece together like what

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Speaker 4: was it that made it work for some people and

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Speaker 4: not so much for others. And so that's really the

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Speaker 4: basis of the book is like, we did this thing.

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Speaker 4: It was cool, but how do you actually make it work?

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Speaker 4: Whether you are a younger person a student, whether you

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Speaker 4: are an information worker who is on a million screens

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Speaker 4: and trying to juggle all these pings and all the

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Speaker 4: rest of it, or you're an older adult who's thinking

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Speaker 4: more about longevity. Because those three cohorts were very different.

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Speaker 4: And then I also go into sort of in the

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Speaker 4: middle of the book, the effects on particular senses, like

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Speaker 4: what is happening to our eyesight, our hearing, posture, breath

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Speaker 4: rest because of our digital habits.

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Speaker 2: Ooh, and there's so much there I want to dig into.

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Speaker 2: So first of all, I guess, did the findings surprise you?

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Speaker 2: And what were in reality? I mean, I kind of

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Speaker 2: know if I'm reading, But tell our listeners some of

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Speaker 2: the ways that people made it work when one might

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Speaker 2: think it would be difficult, And like, give you a

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Speaker 2: couple of scenarios. So you mentioned a teacher, Yeah, let's

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Speaker 2: also mention somebody who's in zoom meetings that often last

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Speaker 2: like an hour in an executive position where they have

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Speaker 2: to figure out how to navigate that. And let's even

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Speaker 2: think about like a worker in I don't know, a

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Speaker 2: more structure job where they're just sort of stuck somewhere

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Speaker 2: I can't pick off the co I don't know a

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Speaker 2: radiologist or something.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, so many people, Okay, So it won't come as

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Speaker 4: any surprise that the people who succeeded were often the

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Speaker 4: ones who had choice. Right, So, if you were the

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Speaker 4: professor running the three hour workshop, you could build in

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Speaker 4: breaks every forty five minutes, and I had a lot

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Speaker 4: of students be like, I have professors who build in

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Speaker 4: breaks already, not as often, but when they do, I

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Speaker 4: know how much better I feel versus powering through for

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Speaker 4: three hours where they feel like crap. So professors started

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Speaker 4: to integrate this. Students started to use the time between

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Speaker 4: their classes not just to like check their phone or anything,

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Speaker 4: but to take a walk around the quad, right, just

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Speaker 4: to prep their brain, get their oxygenation, their blood flow moving,

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Speaker 4: because it really does make a difference. So that was

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Speaker 4: sort of students and also like in the evenings for them,

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Speaker 4: which was actually very similar to retired people, but some

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Speaker 4: people were actually more active during the day, but then

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Speaker 4: starting around like five o'clock, it was sit on the

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Speaker 4: couch and for some people it was streaming for six hours.

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Speaker 4: For other people it was doing homework for six hours.

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Speaker 4: But it was that sort of long periods in the

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Speaker 4: evening that they needed to break up with time and people,

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Speaker 4: it's not going to come as a surprise to you

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Speaker 4: that at first they needed to set their timers. They

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Speaker 4: needed a reminder that it was time to get up,

440
00:21:29,680 --> 00:21:33,320
Speaker 4: and we were like, if you need to skip it, like,

441
00:21:33,359 --> 00:21:35,080
Speaker 4: we didn't want to be like, I didn't want people

442
00:21:35,080 --> 00:21:38,240
Speaker 4: to turn into like robots doing laps around their dining room.

443
00:21:38,320 --> 00:21:38,520
Speaker 1: You know.

444
00:21:39,560 --> 00:21:42,800
Speaker 4: It was more like, start to develop the habit, set

445
00:21:42,840 --> 00:21:46,199
Speaker 4: the timer. If you're in flow, flow by all means,

446
00:21:46,280 --> 00:21:49,040
Speaker 4: flow's beautiful thing. If you're in the midst of writing something,

447
00:21:49,119 --> 00:21:51,919
Speaker 4: go for it. But if you're starting to like notice

448
00:21:51,960 --> 00:21:55,040
Speaker 4: the signals that your body is sending you that foggy brain.

449
00:21:55,720 --> 00:21:59,160
Speaker 4: For me, it's a back ache, it's also the shoulder

450
00:21:59,240 --> 00:22:03,639
Speaker 4: thing trying to work on right then listen, And so

451
00:22:04,040 --> 00:22:06,520
Speaker 4: what we also heard from people was that by the

452
00:22:06,680 --> 00:22:10,320
Speaker 4: end of the two weeks, they didn't need the timers

453
00:22:10,440 --> 00:22:13,399
Speaker 4: as much anymore. They didn't need the reminders because they

454
00:22:13,440 --> 00:22:16,800
Speaker 4: had started to learn to listen to the signals to

455
00:22:16,880 --> 00:22:19,639
Speaker 4: pick them up, and actually their body would start to

456
00:22:19,680 --> 00:22:22,640
Speaker 4: tell them like, dude, you gotta get up. I can't

457
00:22:22,640 --> 00:22:25,080
Speaker 4: do this anymore. You got to get up. So that

458
00:22:25,200 --> 00:22:31,040
Speaker 4: was really interesting. When it came to people in offices, again,

459
00:22:31,200 --> 00:22:33,679
Speaker 4: it was the people in power, right, like the people

460
00:22:33,800 --> 00:22:38,040
Speaker 4: the bosses, who would they were able to say, I'm

461
00:22:38,040 --> 00:22:41,080
Speaker 4: trying this thing, You're welcome to try with me, and

462
00:22:41,119 --> 00:22:43,240
Speaker 4: a lot of people were super psyched about that. Or

463
00:22:43,280 --> 00:22:47,080
Speaker 4: like one boss said, whenever we have a meeting, you

464
00:22:47,119 --> 00:22:49,800
Speaker 4: are welcome to stand up in place and shuffle side

465
00:22:49,800 --> 00:22:51,960
Speaker 4: to side or march in place, or we can take

466
00:22:52,000 --> 00:22:55,080
Speaker 4: walking meetings, but if we're with clients, let's not do it.

467
00:22:55,400 --> 00:22:57,800
Speaker 4: So there started to be like sort of norms in

468
00:22:57,840 --> 00:23:01,320
Speaker 4: a lot of offices, and then other people who maybe

469
00:23:01,359 --> 00:23:03,520
Speaker 4: didn't have as much control, they just.

470
00:23:03,480 --> 00:23:05,440
Speaker 3: Started to schedule.

471
00:23:05,000 --> 00:23:08,000
Speaker 4: Twenty five minute meetings instead of thirty minute meetings, or

472
00:23:08,119 --> 00:23:13,000
Speaker 4: fifty five minute meetings instead of sixty, and or they

473
00:23:13,080 --> 00:23:15,400
Speaker 4: would suggest cameras off because there's a lot of good

474
00:23:15,480 --> 00:23:18,560
Speaker 4: data that you actually don't need to see everyone on

475
00:23:18,680 --> 00:23:20,719
Speaker 4: zoom all the time, and so they would walk and

476
00:23:20,800 --> 00:23:23,440
Speaker 4: listen to zooms that they were trying that they were doing,

477
00:23:23,720 --> 00:23:26,440
Speaker 4: so just sort of little tiny hacks that they had

478
00:23:27,000 --> 00:23:30,280
Speaker 4: or just I mean, they call it friction maxing right now,

479
00:23:30,640 --> 00:23:34,280
Speaker 4: like walking across the office if they weren't an office

480
00:23:34,280 --> 00:23:37,000
Speaker 4: to go see someone and asking them to take a

481
00:23:37,080 --> 00:23:40,560
Speaker 4: lap around the cafeteria or something while they chatted. So

482
00:23:41,560 --> 00:23:44,679
Speaker 4: just sort of adding back this sort of I mean,

483
00:23:44,720 --> 00:23:48,159
Speaker 4: I think it's embodiment, right, It's like using our bodies

484
00:23:48,200 --> 00:23:51,040
Speaker 4: again in our lives, which sounds so silly, but it's.

485
00:23:50,960 --> 00:23:52,160
Speaker 3: Kind of so true.

486
00:23:52,200 --> 00:23:54,240
Speaker 2: And I really enjoy that we got to work the

487
00:23:54,320 --> 00:23:56,640
Speaker 2: term maxing into our discussion. I think that's a best

488
00:23:56,640 --> 00:23:59,520
Speaker 2: of both worlds. First but better late than never.

489
00:24:01,240 --> 00:24:03,280
Speaker 1: It finally fits.

490
00:24:03,760 --> 00:24:06,359
Speaker 2: No, that's beautiful, and I love the non absolute nature

491
00:24:06,400 --> 00:24:08,199
Speaker 2: of that, because I do feel like the first thing

492
00:24:08,240 --> 00:24:10,440
Speaker 2: that's going to turn most people off is like, oh,

493
00:24:10,520 --> 00:24:13,680
Speaker 2: I couldn't do it once, so this is stupid, Like no, no, we're.

494
00:24:13,480 --> 00:24:15,800
Speaker 3: Giving a big bluepole. You do it when it works,

495
00:24:16,400 --> 00:24:17,680
Speaker 3: and then you're probably likely that I.

496
00:24:17,560 --> 00:24:21,840
Speaker 4: Mean honestly, Yeah, And Keith, he has tested different doses.

497
00:24:21,920 --> 00:24:25,800
Speaker 4: Even moving for one minute an hour makes a difference

498
00:24:25,960 --> 00:24:29,480
Speaker 4: for your blood pressure, so like any movement is better

499
00:24:29,520 --> 00:24:31,359
Speaker 4: than none.

500
00:24:30,960 --> 00:24:31,720
Speaker 3: That is awesome.

501
00:24:31,880 --> 00:24:33,840
Speaker 2: Are there any effects that you found that were like

502
00:24:34,040 --> 00:24:38,119
Speaker 2: very surprising, Like maybe the physical ones were less of

503
00:24:38,160 --> 00:24:40,840
Speaker 2: a shock, but like the mental ones were different.

504
00:24:41,680 --> 00:24:46,840
Speaker 4: Well for me, again, you know, I took high school biology,

505
00:24:46,880 --> 00:24:48,639
Speaker 4: but that was pretty much the extent of it. But

506
00:24:48,920 --> 00:24:54,240
Speaker 4: understanding what was happening in our bodies, I can't unsee it.

507
00:24:54,320 --> 00:24:57,520
Speaker 4: So Keith said to me this image. I'm sorry in

508
00:24:57,600 --> 00:25:00,200
Speaker 4: advance that it will never leave you. But he's like, well,

509
00:25:00,200 --> 00:25:02,359
Speaker 4: you have to think of when you're sitting all that time,

510
00:25:02,400 --> 00:25:05,439
Speaker 4: that there's like a garden hose where you kink a

511
00:25:05,520 --> 00:25:08,360
Speaker 4: garden hose and you'd like pressure starts to build up.

512
00:25:08,800 --> 00:25:10,880
Speaker 4: You have to think of your legs and your torso

513
00:25:11,040 --> 00:25:15,560
Speaker 4: as like kinked garden hoses. And actually the pressure that

514
00:25:15,600 --> 00:25:17,879
Speaker 4: builds up, well, first of all, it's not great for

515
00:25:18,000 --> 00:25:21,000
Speaker 4: the inner lining, the blood cells that do the job

516
00:25:21,160 --> 00:25:24,800
Speaker 4: of bringing in oxygenation and pushing it up to the heart.

517
00:25:25,400 --> 00:25:29,760
Speaker 4: And then also he explained that when our leg muscles

518
00:25:29,760 --> 00:25:33,199
Speaker 4: are stimulated, they're actually kind of like sponges. They like

519
00:25:33,359 --> 00:25:36,240
Speaker 4: suck up the glucose, which I was like, oh my god,

520
00:25:36,240 --> 00:25:39,560
Speaker 4: I had no idea. I was like sitting here and thinking, oh,

521
00:25:39,600 --> 00:25:43,480
Speaker 4: my back hurts, but actually I was kinking my garden

522
00:25:43,520 --> 00:25:47,920
Speaker 4: hose and no, wonder you get that tired, foggy lethargic,

523
00:25:48,000 --> 00:25:52,399
Speaker 4: can't concentrate feeling, your brain does not have enough oxygen

524
00:25:52,480 --> 00:25:55,600
Speaker 4: and when that happens, CO two builds up, so you

525
00:25:55,720 --> 00:26:00,119
Speaker 4: literally are kind of expixiating yourself. So that's fun. Then

526
00:26:00,640 --> 00:26:04,600
Speaker 4: the other thing that I learned, also again had not

527
00:26:04,640 --> 00:26:07,760
Speaker 4: occurred to me, that sitting like this, you can't actually

528
00:26:07,920 --> 00:26:12,159
Speaker 4: totally fill your diaphragm, so you're not getting enough oxygen

529
00:26:12,240 --> 00:26:15,800
Speaker 4: into your lungs. And there have been some sort of

530
00:26:16,480 --> 00:26:19,880
Speaker 4: more anecdotal studies, but that people tend to hold their

531
00:26:19,920 --> 00:26:23,640
Speaker 4: breath when they're on a screen. And I've noticed one.

532
00:26:24,000 --> 00:26:28,119
Speaker 4: I'm like, what are they saying in the email? Yeah,

533
00:26:28,240 --> 00:26:32,800
Speaker 4: exactly exactly. Linda Stone got creator of that term. And

534
00:26:32,840 --> 00:26:36,479
Speaker 4: then the other one that really surprised me. And this

535
00:26:36,560 --> 00:26:38,160
Speaker 4: is a new term. I don't know if you're familiar

536
00:26:38,240 --> 00:26:41,760
Speaker 4: with it, but interroception this new sort of field of study,

537
00:26:41,800 --> 00:26:45,000
Speaker 4: which is fascinating. Is that something that you've come across.

538
00:26:44,760 --> 00:26:47,080
Speaker 2: Not until your bookieve you mentioned it in the book,

539
00:26:47,119 --> 00:26:49,399
Speaker 2: but that is not something I had heard of before.

540
00:26:50,480 --> 00:26:53,560
Speaker 4: Really interesting, I also had not heard of it, which

541
00:26:53,600 --> 00:26:58,600
Speaker 4: is this idea the interroception is listening, whether consciously or subconsciously,

542
00:26:58,680 --> 00:27:01,240
Speaker 4: to the signals that you're body is sending you about

543
00:27:01,240 --> 00:27:03,879
Speaker 4: what it needs. So like you probably don't even notice,

544
00:27:03,920 --> 00:27:06,800
Speaker 4: like you're hot, you take off your jacket. But also

545
00:27:07,400 --> 00:27:10,000
Speaker 4: I'm not listening to the signals my body is sending

546
00:27:10,000 --> 00:27:12,480
Speaker 4: me because I'm listening to the signals coming out of

547
00:27:12,480 --> 00:27:16,040
Speaker 4: my screens. So resetting that idea of like, Okay, what

548
00:27:16,119 --> 00:27:21,520
Speaker 4: does my body need right now? Does it need a walk, oxygen,

549
00:27:21,680 --> 00:27:25,600
Speaker 4: a snack, a break, sunlight, all of those things. Just

550
00:27:25,680 --> 00:27:31,200
Speaker 4: reconnecting with that idea of what we need biologically not necessarily,

551
00:27:31,560 --> 00:27:36,080
Speaker 4: like the list of stuff that we have that just

552
00:27:36,240 --> 00:27:40,080
Speaker 4: will never end. Guess what if you want to keep

553
00:27:40,119 --> 00:27:43,480
Speaker 4: going your body needs all this totally.

554
00:27:43,800 --> 00:27:45,440
Speaker 2: We're gonna take another break and then I'm gonna ask you,

555
00:27:45,560 --> 00:28:00,720
Speaker 2: do you see question about your own habits? All right,

556
00:28:00,800 --> 00:28:03,040
Speaker 2: we are back, and you talk a little bit about

557
00:28:03,080 --> 00:28:05,920
Speaker 2: this in the book. But as someone who took in

558
00:28:06,000 --> 00:28:08,919
Speaker 2: all of these people's observations and then the science and

559
00:28:08,960 --> 00:28:10,720
Speaker 2: actually got to be a labrat, which must have been

560
00:28:10,760 --> 00:28:14,359
Speaker 2: so powerful. How has your life changed been new since

561
00:28:14,400 --> 00:28:18,439
Speaker 2: all of this, Like, how are you living differently? Well?

562
00:28:18,560 --> 00:28:22,280
Speaker 4: I used to be a gym rat, and when I

563
00:28:22,800 --> 00:28:25,000
Speaker 4: learned well, first of all, I never really enjoyed it.

564
00:28:25,040 --> 00:28:27,919
Speaker 4: I always thought of exercise as like something to like

565
00:28:28,080 --> 00:28:30,720
Speaker 4: check off the list, right, got to do it, get

566
00:28:30,760 --> 00:28:35,080
Speaker 4: it done, it's over. During the pandemic, I fell off

567
00:28:35,119 --> 00:28:38,120
Speaker 4: the wagon. But the more I learned about the fact

568
00:28:38,120 --> 00:28:40,800
Speaker 4: that even if you work out in the morning, if

569
00:28:40,840 --> 00:28:43,520
Speaker 4: you sit for the rest of the day, that workout

570
00:28:43,560 --> 00:28:48,080
Speaker 4: doesn't really matter. You are in just as much jeopardy

571
00:28:48,120 --> 00:28:51,080
Speaker 4: your health. If you sit for nine to ten hours

572
00:28:51,080 --> 00:28:55,160
Speaker 4: a day, you're sixty percent more likely to have cardiac

573
00:28:55,240 --> 00:29:00,680
Speaker 4: issues other chronic health problems. So that's sort of felt

574
00:29:00,720 --> 00:29:05,600
Speaker 4: freeing to me. I was like, oh, so if I

575
00:29:05,720 --> 00:29:08,800
Speaker 4: move more often and I just do it regularly and

576
00:29:08,840 --> 00:29:11,800
Speaker 4: I don't have to change my outfit, I can sort

577
00:29:11,840 --> 00:29:15,080
Speaker 4: of like ath leisure. Hello, it's what I wear anyway.

578
00:29:15,680 --> 00:29:20,920
Speaker 4: So I just move more generally, I walk the dog

579
00:29:21,120 --> 00:29:23,720
Speaker 4: four or five times a day. I'll go to the

580
00:29:23,840 --> 00:29:27,400
Speaker 4: far coffee place. It's like as my reward and come back.

581
00:29:27,680 --> 00:29:29,960
Speaker 4: There are some days where I really struggle and I'm like, no,

582
00:29:30,240 --> 00:29:32,840
Speaker 4: you know you're gonna feel better. You always feel better.

583
00:29:33,160 --> 00:29:37,959
Speaker 4: Don't try to power through. You actually know why you cannot.

584
00:29:38,360 --> 00:29:40,120
Speaker 4: I always pay the price if I don't do it.

585
00:29:40,200 --> 00:29:43,560
Speaker 4: So that and the fact that I'm a perimenopausal woman

586
00:29:43,800 --> 00:29:45,920
Speaker 4: means I need more strength training, so I'm trying to

587
00:29:45,960 --> 00:29:49,280
Speaker 4: get that to two three times a week into my

588
00:29:49,360 --> 00:29:52,680
Speaker 4: life as well. But generally I'm just trying to be

589
00:29:53,000 --> 00:29:57,520
Speaker 4: in the world, and I find that is working for me.

590
00:29:57,680 --> 00:30:00,520
Speaker 4: Like I end up walking about five miles a day total.

591
00:30:00,880 --> 00:30:02,800
Speaker 4: I like tracking my steps. It works for me. I

592
00:30:02,800 --> 00:30:05,640
Speaker 4: know it makes some people crazy. And then I'm trying

593
00:30:05,640 --> 00:30:08,120
Speaker 4: to like keep pilates in there. You're a pilates person,

594
00:30:08,200 --> 00:30:08,680
Speaker 4: right I am.

595
00:30:08,800 --> 00:30:11,840
Speaker 2: Now I have a wild story with a heart thing

596
00:30:12,600 --> 00:30:13,680
Speaker 2: listeners know about that.

597
00:30:13,760 --> 00:30:14,560
Speaker 3: You probably don't.

598
00:30:14,600 --> 00:30:16,400
Speaker 2: But I used to be a marathon runner. I now

599
00:30:16,400 --> 00:30:18,840
Speaker 2: I'm just weight training and plates but also walking. I

600
00:30:18,880 --> 00:30:22,040
Speaker 2: love walking, and I actually do more of it now

601
00:30:22,040 --> 00:30:24,320
Speaker 2: that I don't run anymore, which is kind of funny.

602
00:30:24,360 --> 00:30:27,240
Speaker 2: Like I used to be tired, well, sometimes I would

603
00:30:27,240 --> 00:30:29,360
Speaker 2: take during the pandemic, I was not in a running phase.

604
00:30:29,360 --> 00:30:31,320
Speaker 2: I was like weightlifting and I would take walks at

605
00:30:31,360 --> 00:30:33,080
Speaker 2: work because I still have to go to work and

606
00:30:33,120 --> 00:30:35,800
Speaker 2: see patients, and I'd walk outside and then I stopped

607
00:30:35,800 --> 00:30:37,320
Speaker 2: doing it when I got into heavy running because I

608
00:30:37,360 --> 00:30:38,520
Speaker 2: was like, oh, my legs are too tired. And I

609
00:30:38,600 --> 00:30:40,880
Speaker 2: ran eight miles this morning. Now that I can't run,

610
00:30:41,000 --> 00:30:43,120
Speaker 2: I'm dying to walk at lunchtime and it's like a

611
00:30:43,200 --> 00:30:43,959
Speaker 2: highlight of my day.

612
00:30:44,000 --> 00:30:46,440
Speaker 3: I do it every day. But honestly, after reading your.

613
00:30:46,360 --> 00:30:48,560
Speaker 2: Book, I'm like, I need to also like I'm not

614
00:30:48,680 --> 00:30:51,200
Speaker 2: sedentary when I'm seeing patients because you're like seeing a patient,

615
00:30:51,200 --> 00:30:53,360
Speaker 2: then you're walking your office, you're walking back, so there's

616
00:30:53,400 --> 00:30:56,240
Speaker 2: steps happening. But like I'm like, ooh, I want to

617
00:30:56,280 --> 00:30:59,480
Speaker 2: get little five minute walk around the block breaks.

618
00:30:59,560 --> 00:31:02,360
Speaker 3: Yeah, a la minute into my life as well. So

619
00:31:02,400 --> 00:31:03,400
Speaker 3: you actually can.

620
00:31:03,480 --> 00:31:07,600
Speaker 4: Ask you, as a pediatric end of chronologist, like what

621
00:31:07,720 --> 00:31:10,240
Speaker 4: are you seeing in kids right now?

622
00:31:10,800 --> 00:31:12,560
Speaker 2: I mean I wouldn't just say it's right now. So

623
00:31:12,640 --> 00:31:16,040
Speaker 2: I've been in practice. Let's see, I've finished my fellowship

624
00:31:16,080 --> 00:31:20,880
Speaker 2: in twenty thirteen, so thirteen years like in postgraduate training

625
00:31:20,880 --> 00:31:22,520
Speaker 2: in South Florida.

626
00:31:22,560 --> 00:31:23,360
Speaker 3: I do think it's.

627
00:31:23,240 --> 00:31:26,800
Speaker 2: Gotten worse and it's gotten more complex with the new

628
00:31:26,840 --> 00:31:29,480
Speaker 2: therapies we have, because it may just be that I'm

629
00:31:29,520 --> 00:31:32,360
Speaker 2: getting more referrals because people assume there's more you I

630
00:31:32,400 --> 00:31:34,680
Speaker 2: can do medically. Although it's funny, I'll get like eight

631
00:31:34,720 --> 00:31:37,480
Speaker 2: year olds and there's not that much from a pharmaceutical

632
00:31:37,480 --> 00:31:39,800
Speaker 2: standpoint you can do for an eight year old. But

633
00:31:39,880 --> 00:31:44,200
Speaker 2: I see heartbreaking cases of obesity and metabolic disease every day.

634
00:31:44,920 --> 00:31:45,600
Speaker 3: We had an.

635
00:31:45,800 --> 00:31:49,520
Speaker 2: Enormous boom, enormous of new onset type two diabetes. We

636
00:31:49,520 --> 00:31:51,479
Speaker 2: actually wrote this up and presented it, and so did

637
00:31:51,520 --> 00:31:54,480
Speaker 2: a lot of other places, like during COVID, And honestly,

638
00:31:54,720 --> 00:31:56,960
Speaker 2: what was the one major thing that happened. These kids

639
00:31:56,960 --> 00:32:00,000
Speaker 2: stopped going to school. They sat down all day. It's like,

640
00:32:00,480 --> 00:32:02,560
Speaker 2: I mean, yes, there may have been some nutritional changes

641
00:32:02,600 --> 00:32:04,680
Speaker 2: as well, but I really actually think of it as like

642
00:32:04,680 --> 00:32:06,920
Speaker 2: the lack of natural movement in their lives that made

643
00:32:06,960 --> 00:32:10,240
Speaker 2: the biggest, most widespread impact. And it was like new

644
00:32:10,280 --> 00:32:13,760
Speaker 2: diagnosis after diagnosis, to the point where after the pandemic

645
00:32:13,800 --> 00:32:15,040
Speaker 2: it kind of slowed down for a while because I

646
00:32:15,040 --> 00:32:17,640
Speaker 2: think anybody that was like living on the edge was diagnosed.

647
00:32:18,720 --> 00:32:21,560
Speaker 2: And I mean yet still every day I have people

648
00:32:21,560 --> 00:32:24,080
Speaker 2: come in and it's like, if you have any sort

649
00:32:24,080 --> 00:32:28,280
Speaker 2: of genetic predisposition, to wakeain and if the family is

650
00:32:28,320 --> 00:32:31,200
Speaker 2: not like living in a way to purposely prevent that,

651
00:32:31,280 --> 00:32:33,640
Speaker 2: because I think nowadays you almost sort of have to,

652
00:32:33,760 --> 00:32:38,240
Speaker 2: like how do I mitigate the naturally obesigenic effects of

653
00:32:38,280 --> 00:32:41,800
Speaker 2: our environment. Then kids are struggling, and it's not their fault.

654
00:32:42,000 --> 00:32:46,520
Speaker 2: It's like they're surrounded by hyper palatable food without opportunity

655
00:32:46,640 --> 00:32:50,800
Speaker 2: to move very much, and like we're again, they come in.

656
00:32:51,080 --> 00:32:54,480
Speaker 2: Some of them know it's probably not quote hormones. They're

657
00:32:54,520 --> 00:32:58,080
Speaker 2: just looking for help, which is absolutely understandable, and others

658
00:32:58,560 --> 00:33:01,280
Speaker 2: wonder what's causing this, and it's like, again, as I

659
00:33:01,280 --> 00:33:04,320
Speaker 2: said in the beginning, ninety nine times out of one hundred,

660
00:33:04,880 --> 00:33:08,239
Speaker 2: it's society and genetics and just multifactorial rather than it

661
00:33:08,240 --> 00:33:11,360
Speaker 2: being like some sinkler disorder, like fifty years ago, i've

662
00:33:11,400 --> 00:33:13,720
Speaker 2: been oh it's thyroid, or oh it's cushings or something

663
00:33:13,760 --> 00:33:14,080
Speaker 2: like that.

664
00:33:14,280 --> 00:33:15,520
Speaker 3: Right, yeah, right right.

665
00:33:15,880 --> 00:33:20,160
Speaker 4: I mean, based on all the reading and research that

666
00:33:20,200 --> 00:33:24,200
Speaker 4: I've read, it's a real shame because movement seems to

667
00:33:24,200 --> 00:33:29,360
Speaker 4: correlate to learning better as well. So actually, if we

668
00:33:29,400 --> 00:33:31,440
Speaker 4: want our kids to do better in school, we need

669
00:33:31,480 --> 00:33:34,240
Speaker 4: to add more movement into their lives. And I don't

670
00:33:34,240 --> 00:33:36,360
Speaker 4: know about you. Like I was not an athletic kid,

671
00:33:37,640 --> 00:33:40,640
Speaker 4: and I went to a very very sporty school. And

672
00:33:40,720 --> 00:33:42,800
Speaker 4: I see that I live in New York City, Like

673
00:33:42,840 --> 00:33:46,320
Speaker 4: if you are not on the like like at five

674
00:33:46,440 --> 00:33:49,360
Speaker 4: years old, they start deciding who goes on which kind

675
00:33:49,360 --> 00:33:50,080
Speaker 4: of soccer.

676
00:33:49,800 --> 00:33:51,600
Speaker 3: Team, to the point that, like.

677
00:33:51,720 --> 00:33:53,760
Speaker 4: Kids who just want to move because it feels good

678
00:33:53,760 --> 00:33:56,040
Speaker 4: and it's nice to be with your friends, you don't

679
00:33:56,080 --> 00:33:57,120
Speaker 4: have options.

680
00:33:57,680 --> 00:34:01,400
Speaker 2: No, you're so right. There's not an just like casual

681
00:34:01,480 --> 00:34:04,880
Speaker 2: movement built into curriculums. And I don't know, like with

682
00:34:04,960 --> 00:34:07,520
Speaker 2: this hopefully we've seen this movement a little bit away

683
00:34:07,520 --> 00:34:10,160
Speaker 2: from screens in school. I feel like that's the next step.

684
00:34:10,160 --> 00:34:11,920
Speaker 2: How do we figure out how to like have a

685
00:34:12,000 --> 00:34:15,120
Speaker 2: walking break for these kids, or a dance break, or

686
00:34:16,239 --> 00:34:20,400
Speaker 2: just having them kind of start to understand that daily

687
00:34:20,760 --> 00:34:23,840
Speaker 2: and regular movement is like part of what just helps

688
00:34:23,920 --> 00:34:27,880
Speaker 2: us be vibrant humans, and how do we incorporate that life?

689
00:34:28,640 --> 00:34:31,279
Speaker 4: And I feel for teachers. I mean they have a

690
00:34:31,480 --> 00:34:34,160
Speaker 4: such a hard job. I know with my kids, I

691
00:34:34,160 --> 00:34:37,560
Speaker 4: would see, like one time, have you ever done go noodle?

692
00:34:37,920 --> 00:34:40,040
Speaker 2: I think during the pandemic one of my kids schools

693
00:34:40,120 --> 00:34:41,320
Speaker 2: was into that yeah.

694
00:34:41,239 --> 00:34:43,879
Speaker 4: Yeah, but it's up to the teacher. If they're into

695
00:34:43,880 --> 00:34:47,040
Speaker 4: go noodle, which is like dance breaks, then your kids

696
00:34:47,040 --> 00:34:49,160
Speaker 4: get dance breaks. If they don't know about it, or

697
00:34:49,160 --> 00:34:52,160
Speaker 4: if they're not interested in it, or they feel that

698
00:34:52,160 --> 00:34:54,160
Speaker 4: they don't have time, that it doesn't happen. There's no

699
00:34:54,360 --> 00:34:58,439
Speaker 4: sort of general culture of like kids need to move

700
00:34:59,040 --> 00:35:01,640
Speaker 4: and they need it off, and it's not just because

701
00:35:01,640 --> 00:35:04,880
Speaker 4: they were wiggly, it's because it's good for their brains,

702
00:35:05,440 --> 00:35:08,160
Speaker 4: it's good for their cardiovascular health. There was one study

703
00:35:08,200 --> 00:35:10,120
Speaker 4: in the book that I was just shocked about which

704
00:35:10,120 --> 00:35:16,000
Speaker 4: showed how, like kids, teenagers, hearts grew larger the less

705
00:35:16,080 --> 00:35:20,360
Speaker 4: they moved, which set them up for potential cardio risks,

706
00:35:20,400 --> 00:35:25,080
Speaker 4: major risks. So the world feels very chaotic right now.

707
00:35:25,120 --> 00:35:28,080
Speaker 4: But if there's one thing we can do to feel

708
00:35:28,080 --> 00:35:32,879
Speaker 4: a little more positive and energized and like just enjoy life,

709
00:35:32,960 --> 00:35:35,759
Speaker 4: it's just a move like that's it. Five minutes. Try

710
00:35:35,800 --> 00:35:36,600
Speaker 4: to do it more often.

711
00:35:37,000 --> 00:35:39,720
Speaker 2: Bottom line, And we didn't even get to talk about eyes.

712
00:35:39,800 --> 00:35:41,360
Speaker 2: Can we talk about eyes for like two minutes?

713
00:35:41,840 --> 00:35:42,480
Speaker 4: Oh sure?

714
00:35:42,640 --> 00:35:45,480
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm throwing this in here because I have two

715
00:35:45,520 --> 00:35:48,520
Speaker 2: kids on myopia management treatments and I was like, oh

716
00:35:48,640 --> 00:35:52,839
Speaker 2: you this. Now, in my defense, I have like very

717
00:35:52,880 --> 00:35:55,520
Speaker 2: strong genetic tendencies as well, like I'm in negative twelve

718
00:35:55,600 --> 00:35:57,920
Speaker 2: that both of my parents were, and like, who knows,

719
00:35:58,000 --> 00:35:59,960
Speaker 2: maybe it's from reading too much and not going out,

720
00:36:00,400 --> 00:36:02,960
Speaker 2: but I think it's a mix, right. But as it

721
00:36:03,000 --> 00:36:07,000
Speaker 2: started happening, our eyed doctor recommended doing this and explain

722
00:36:07,080 --> 00:36:08,560
Speaker 2: that part of it is that kids are not like

723
00:36:08,600 --> 00:36:11,360
Speaker 2: looking at the horizon in the bright sunshine enough anymore

724
00:36:11,400 --> 00:36:12,120
Speaker 2: and that's part.

725
00:36:12,000 --> 00:36:13,760
Speaker 3: Of what's making it worse. And now we have tricks

726
00:36:13,760 --> 00:36:14,239
Speaker 3: to kind of.

727
00:36:14,880 --> 00:36:18,479
Speaker 4: Reverse it, yes, which is amazing. Wait, can I ask

728
00:36:18,560 --> 00:36:20,640
Speaker 4: what kind of treatments are they getting? Like worth?

729
00:36:20,680 --> 00:36:24,160
Speaker 2: Okay, they're both on atropine drops. We tried the contacts

730
00:36:24,239 --> 00:36:26,120
Speaker 2: in my older one that like the ones you wear

731
00:36:26,200 --> 00:36:27,640
Speaker 2: during the day that reshape the lens.

732
00:36:27,680 --> 00:36:29,360
Speaker 3: I don't remember what they're called, but he could not

733
00:36:29,400 --> 00:36:29,799
Speaker 3: put them in.

734
00:36:29,920 --> 00:36:32,839
Speaker 2: So we're like, oh, we're going to try that next dar.

735
00:36:33,480 --> 00:36:35,440
Speaker 3: So we're just doing the atropine drops.

736
00:36:35,520 --> 00:36:37,560
Speaker 4: Yeah, just for people who are like, what the hell

737
00:36:37,560 --> 00:36:41,719
Speaker 4: are they talking about? So I had no idea that essentially,

738
00:36:41,960 --> 00:36:44,720
Speaker 4: the more you stare at screens, the more your eyes

739
00:36:44,800 --> 00:36:47,240
Speaker 4: are like, oh, okay, you want to look at screens,

740
00:36:47,239 --> 00:36:50,000
Speaker 4: so I'll get better at looking close. For you, I

741
00:36:50,080 --> 00:36:52,400
Speaker 4: will change I mean I talk like these eyes are

742
00:36:52,440 --> 00:36:55,040
Speaker 4: having a conversation, but essentially they are. They're saying, I

743
00:36:55,080 --> 00:36:58,040
Speaker 4: will change shape so that everything that is close is

744
00:36:58,160 --> 00:37:00,759
Speaker 4: very sharp for you because you don't to look into

745
00:37:00,800 --> 00:37:05,160
Speaker 4: the distance. So you literally become nearsighted. And obviously for

746
00:37:05,239 --> 00:37:08,200
Speaker 4: people whose eyes have stopped growing, once that happens the

747
00:37:08,239 --> 00:37:11,200
Speaker 4: ship is sailed, you are near sighted for life. But

748
00:37:11,640 --> 00:37:15,800
Speaker 4: with kids, and it's happening younger and younger. There's actually

749
00:37:15,880 --> 00:37:20,680
Speaker 4: treatments that can reshape the eyeball and make it so

750
00:37:20,719 --> 00:37:23,319
Speaker 4: they don't have to wear glasses and stave this off

751
00:37:23,320 --> 00:37:26,200
Speaker 4: for as long as possible. And I didn't know your

752
00:37:26,239 --> 00:37:30,680
Speaker 4: eyes keep growing even into your thirties, so there is

753
00:37:30,719 --> 00:37:35,520
Speaker 4: an opportunity here, like get outside, look into the horizon,

754
00:37:36,160 --> 00:37:40,080
Speaker 4: get the serotonin. They haven't shown this in humans, but

755
00:37:40,120 --> 00:37:42,560
Speaker 4: I believe it that when light hits the back of

756
00:37:42,600 --> 00:37:45,240
Speaker 4: your retina, it releases serotonin. It makes you feel positive.

757
00:37:45,520 --> 00:37:48,000
Speaker 4: They don't quite know what it is about sunlight that's

758
00:37:48,040 --> 00:37:52,120
Speaker 4: so good for eye health and growth, but it somehow

759
00:37:52,160 --> 00:37:54,560
Speaker 4: it is so like I feel like the best thing

760
00:37:54,560 --> 00:37:56,640
Speaker 4: you can do with like a kid is go for

761
00:37:56,680 --> 00:37:58,480
Speaker 4: a walk and look for birds. Love it.

762
00:37:59,160 --> 00:38:01,680
Speaker 2: Don't look at but definitely look for birds.

763
00:38:01,840 --> 00:38:05,160
Speaker 4: No, look for birds. Look if you're in near water,

764
00:38:05,320 --> 00:38:08,759
Speaker 4: look for boats. Those two things I love. The best

765
00:38:08,800 --> 00:38:11,320
Speaker 4: thing you can do for the ocular health of a

766
00:38:11,400 --> 00:38:14,200
Speaker 4: child and yourself. I would add, I love it. Well.

767
00:38:14,239 --> 00:38:16,640
Speaker 2: This book was great in this conversation. I could talk

768
00:38:16,640 --> 00:38:18,960
Speaker 2: to you all the day about this stuff, but I

769
00:38:19,000 --> 00:38:20,920
Speaker 2: know listeners are going to want to read more. So

770
00:38:21,000 --> 00:38:23,960
Speaker 2: tell them the full name of your book. And then

771
00:38:24,000 --> 00:38:25,319
Speaker 2: we have to do a love of the week, which

772
00:38:25,360 --> 00:38:26,719
Speaker 2: I didn't warn you, but we're still going to do

773
00:38:26,760 --> 00:38:27,200
Speaker 2: it any.

774
00:38:27,040 --> 00:38:29,640
Speaker 4: Oh, Okay, hopefully I'll come up with it.

775
00:38:29,640 --> 00:38:29,879
Speaker 1: Okay.

776
00:38:29,880 --> 00:38:32,520
Speaker 4: So the book is called Body Electric The Hidden health

777
00:38:32,560 --> 00:38:36,680
Speaker 4: Costs of the Digital Age and New Science to reclaim

778
00:38:36,880 --> 00:38:40,719
Speaker 4: your wellbeing. It's out May fifth. Buy it if you

779
00:38:40,760 --> 00:38:42,840
Speaker 4: feel like you don't have this issue. You move a

780
00:38:42,840 --> 00:38:45,480
Speaker 4: lot by it. For the person in your life who

781
00:38:45,560 --> 00:38:48,000
Speaker 4: is sitting on their butt and needs to get up,

782
00:38:49,040 --> 00:38:50,880
Speaker 4: I think they might get something out of it, and

783
00:38:50,920 --> 00:38:52,480
Speaker 4: I just want us all to feel a little better.

784
00:38:52,880 --> 00:38:54,680
Speaker 2: You'll get something out of it, and it's a fun read.

785
00:38:54,800 --> 00:38:57,719
Speaker 2: So I highly recommend it, so I give you time

786
00:38:57,760 --> 00:38:59,959
Speaker 2: to think while I share my love of the week.

787
00:39:00,120 --> 00:39:02,520
Speaker 2: I don't know, maybe it's controversial, but I will say

788
00:39:02,760 --> 00:39:05,480
Speaker 2: that my love of the week is when I take

789
00:39:05,520 --> 00:39:09,320
Speaker 2: my walk breaks. I love my Apple air Pods pros

790
00:39:09,360 --> 00:39:11,600
Speaker 2: like so much. I know it can be great to

791
00:39:11,600 --> 00:39:13,759
Speaker 2: also just clear your mind, but sometimes music will do

792
00:39:13,800 --> 00:39:15,560
Speaker 2: that for me, and I'll do that on a walk break.

793
00:39:15,600 --> 00:39:18,600
Speaker 2: But they just make me look forward to every time

794
00:39:18,640 --> 00:39:21,439
Speaker 2: I'm going to take a walk, and I love them.

795
00:39:21,520 --> 00:39:24,040
Speaker 3: They're great, fascinating.

796
00:39:24,040 --> 00:39:26,400
Speaker 4: Okay, so love of the week would you prefer it

797
00:39:26,440 --> 00:39:27,040
Speaker 4: to be a thing?

798
00:39:27,160 --> 00:39:27,640
Speaker 3: Anything?

799
00:39:27,880 --> 00:39:31,600
Speaker 2: A concept, a thing, a type of weather, a recent

800
00:39:31,680 --> 00:39:33,920
Speaker 2: trip you took, a movie.

801
00:39:33,960 --> 00:39:34,760
Speaker 3: It could be anything.

802
00:39:35,640 --> 00:39:40,960
Speaker 4: Okay. I'm getting very excited because I love spring flowers.

803
00:39:41,800 --> 00:39:47,840
Speaker 4: They really I'm very allergic to trees and flowering trees.

804
00:39:47,880 --> 00:39:51,160
Speaker 4: But this year, so as much as I'm excited about

805
00:39:51,160 --> 00:39:53,239
Speaker 4: this period, I also have to prepare. So I left

806
00:39:53,280 --> 00:39:57,760
Speaker 4: myself a note on my calendar a year ago, March. First,

807
00:39:57,960 --> 00:40:01,520
Speaker 4: start your allergy medicine so that I don't do it

808
00:40:01,600 --> 00:40:05,799
Speaker 4: usually happens, which is feel miserable during this period that

809
00:40:05,880 --> 00:40:08,840
Speaker 4: I love so much. So I started taking my nasal

810
00:40:08,880 --> 00:40:11,600
Speaker 4: spray and I feel great and I'm able to enjoy

811
00:40:11,719 --> 00:40:14,919
Speaker 4: all the flowering trees in my neighborhood. It's been quite

812
00:40:14,960 --> 00:40:15,320
Speaker 4: a delight.

813
00:40:15,440 --> 00:40:16,400
Speaker 3: Oh my gosh, I love this.

814
00:40:16,480 --> 00:40:18,359
Speaker 2: And as we're recording this, you're more than a month

815
00:40:18,360 --> 00:40:22,240
Speaker 2: into nasal spray treatment, so yeah, you're prepped.

816
00:40:22,239 --> 00:40:22,880
Speaker 3: You are ready.

817
00:40:23,080 --> 00:40:25,320
Speaker 2: We have some beautiful and feelings flowering trees that I

818
00:40:25,320 --> 00:40:26,919
Speaker 2: don't know what they are, but they're so so pretty.

819
00:40:26,960 --> 00:40:28,919
Speaker 2: And every time we drive by it, I'm like, look, kids,

820
00:40:28,920 --> 00:40:31,120
Speaker 2: look at that pink trees. It is so fun to

821
00:40:31,160 --> 00:40:35,239
Speaker 2: see the season so fun. Yeah, it's great. It does

822
00:40:35,280 --> 00:40:36,160
Speaker 2: feel like renewal.

823
00:40:36,239 --> 00:40:38,480
Speaker 4: We could use it. It was a long winter, it was.

824
00:40:39,120 --> 00:40:41,680
Speaker 2: Well, this has been such a pleasure. As always, thank

825
00:40:41,719 --> 00:40:44,720
Speaker 2: you so much for coming on. I guess remind listeners

826
00:40:44,719 --> 00:40:46,840
Speaker 2: also just where they can find you out in the world.

827
00:40:47,080 --> 00:40:50,319
Speaker 4: Yes, you can find me on Instagram or at my

828
00:40:50,360 --> 00:40:54,120
Speaker 4: website which is manooche Z m an o u sh

829
00:40:54,400 --> 00:40:57,279
Speaker 4: Z and I also host NPR's Ted Radio Hour, so

830
00:40:57,320 --> 00:40:58,040
Speaker 4: you can find me there.

831
00:40:58,160 --> 00:40:59,720
Speaker 3: Awesome, Thank you so much for coming.

832
00:41:00,280 --> 00:41:03,520
Speaker 1: Well, that was great. Sarah's interviewing at Manushto Murati about

833
00:41:03,520 --> 00:41:06,319
Speaker 1: her new book Body Electric and all the things we

834
00:41:06,320 --> 00:41:09,120
Speaker 1: can do to stay healthier even as we are living

835
00:41:09,200 --> 00:41:13,960
Speaker 1: our digital lives. So in the theme with that to

836
00:41:14,080 --> 00:41:18,080
Speaker 1: this week's question, any tips for saying active or healthy

837
00:41:18,239 --> 00:41:22,720
Speaker 1: with work travel or travel personally, Because whether you're personal

838
00:41:22,800 --> 00:41:25,640
Speaker 1: or work travel, it's still going to be changes to

839
00:41:25,680 --> 00:41:27,560
Speaker 1: your routine. So, Sarah, what do you try to do?

840
00:41:27,880 --> 00:41:30,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, I try to do the same types of things

841
00:41:30,320 --> 00:41:33,160
Speaker 2: that I do when I'm home. I mean, well, my

842
00:41:33,239 --> 00:41:35,960
Speaker 2: work travel is generally like recording trips with you or

843
00:41:36,000 --> 00:41:38,120
Speaker 2: bestly plans live or going to an ENDO conference. So

844
00:41:38,160 --> 00:41:40,000
Speaker 2: I'm not like a road warrior that does like a

845
00:41:40,000 --> 00:41:42,600
Speaker 2: million weeks per year. But I think if I was,

846
00:41:42,719 --> 00:41:44,920
Speaker 2: I would still do the same thing, which is the

847
00:41:44,960 --> 00:41:47,480
Speaker 2: same types of workouts I do at home and do

848
00:41:47,600 --> 00:41:50,319
Speaker 2: them early in the morning. I recognize there are certain

849
00:41:50,400 --> 00:41:51,759
Speaker 2: jobs where you have to be out late at night

850
00:41:51,840 --> 00:41:54,520
Speaker 2: and that would become work challenging, but thankfully that's not

851
00:41:54,560 --> 00:41:57,000
Speaker 2: really my situation. So I'll just try to make sure

852
00:41:57,040 --> 00:41:58,640
Speaker 2: I stay at a hotel with a gym, and I

853
00:41:58,680 --> 00:42:02,160
Speaker 2: have like totally no shame about putting a workout on

854
00:42:02,320 --> 00:42:04,839
Speaker 2: YouTube on my phone, having my earbuds in and then

855
00:42:04,920 --> 00:42:08,359
Speaker 2: like getting the weights and doing whatever it is or

856
00:42:08,640 --> 00:42:12,240
Speaker 2: maybe walking on the treadmill and like putting a audio

857
00:42:12,320 --> 00:42:15,799
Speaker 2: peloton on, and then often if I can, especially i'm

858
00:42:15,800 --> 00:42:18,200
Speaker 2: at a conference, I need that. Like, just like we

859
00:42:18,280 --> 00:42:20,279
Speaker 2: talked about in the episode, getting that walk in the

860
00:42:20,320 --> 00:42:23,560
Speaker 2: middle of the day is necessary. I cannot be butt

861
00:42:23,560 --> 00:42:26,400
Speaker 2: in seat for like twelve hours and stay focused and

862
00:42:26,440 --> 00:42:29,279
Speaker 2: feel good. So it's the word be adding in some

863
00:42:29,320 --> 00:42:32,719
Speaker 2: purposeful steps as well. And again I know this is

864
00:42:32,719 --> 00:42:34,279
Speaker 2: going to depend on the type of work travel and

865
00:42:34,320 --> 00:42:36,399
Speaker 2: some people just need to sit in meetings all day long.

866
00:42:36,480 --> 00:42:38,920
Speaker 2: But man, if there's any way of getting one of

867
00:42:38,960 --> 00:42:42,440
Speaker 2: those meetings converted to a walking meeting or figuring out

868
00:42:42,560 --> 00:42:46,160
Speaker 2: how to get outside for even fifteen minutes, I think

869
00:42:46,160 --> 00:42:47,640
Speaker 2: it could make an incredible difference.

870
00:42:47,719 --> 00:42:50,239
Speaker 1: What about you, Yeah, I as to say, using the

871
00:42:50,280 --> 00:42:53,080
Speaker 1: time before all your meetings start or your conference start

872
00:42:53,360 --> 00:42:55,640
Speaker 1: is critical if you can do it. So stay in

873
00:42:55,640 --> 00:42:58,960
Speaker 1: a hotel that has a gym, get yourself down there.

874
00:42:59,480 --> 00:43:01,640
Speaker 1: Sometimes this is really great if there's a time change,

875
00:43:01,640 --> 00:43:03,279
Speaker 1: like if you're on the East Coast and you're at

876
00:43:03,280 --> 00:43:06,520
Speaker 1: a conference in California, because you're gonna pop awake at

877
00:43:06,560 --> 00:43:09,359
Speaker 1: four am anyway, So if it's twenty four hour gym

878
00:43:09,440 --> 00:43:11,600
Speaker 1: just get yourself down there, and maybe the other people

879
00:43:11,640 --> 00:43:13,440
Speaker 1: from the East Coast will be there too, but maybe not.

880
00:43:14,120 --> 00:43:15,799
Speaker 1: So you're gonna have it to yourself from like four

881
00:43:15,800 --> 00:43:17,600
Speaker 1: to four forty five am, and then go about the

882
00:43:17,600 --> 00:43:20,719
Speaker 1: rest of your day if you can stay somewhere that's

883
00:43:20,760 --> 00:43:23,719
Speaker 1: got cool places to walk nearby. I know that I

884
00:43:24,600 --> 00:43:27,680
Speaker 1: had a really fun like speech two years ago. I

885
00:43:27,680 --> 00:43:30,600
Speaker 1: guess that I was. I hadn't realized that the hotel

886
00:43:30,760 --> 00:43:33,640
Speaker 1: was in fact right by the water, and when I

887
00:43:33,640 --> 00:43:35,839
Speaker 1: saw that, I looked on the map, I'm like, oh, well,

888
00:43:35,840 --> 00:43:37,759
Speaker 1: I wasn't planning on bringing my running shoes, but now

889
00:43:37,800 --> 00:43:40,719
Speaker 1: I'm definitely going to because I know I can run

890
00:43:40,719 --> 00:43:42,680
Speaker 1: along this trail by the water in the morning. And

891
00:43:42,719 --> 00:43:44,160
Speaker 1: so that was something that got me up a little

892
00:43:44,160 --> 00:43:48,799
Speaker 1: bit early to do it. Or just even plotting out

893
00:43:48,840 --> 00:43:51,520
Speaker 1: your schedule and if you see that, like, Okay, my

894
00:43:51,640 --> 00:43:54,640
Speaker 1: last meeting ends at like four thirty and I'm meeting

895
00:43:55,320 --> 00:43:56,799
Speaker 1: We're gonna have a little bit of downtime and then

896
00:43:56,800 --> 00:43:59,759
Speaker 1: I'm meeting my clients at for dinner at seven, right,

897
00:44:00,360 --> 00:44:02,600
Speaker 1: really use that time. Yes, you were going to want

898
00:44:02,640 --> 00:44:04,759
Speaker 1: to do all the email you didn't do during the

899
00:44:04,880 --> 00:44:06,840
Speaker 1: day and catch up with the stuff from your normal

900
00:44:06,920 --> 00:44:08,840
Speaker 1: work that you weren't doing while you were in meetings.

901
00:44:09,440 --> 00:44:12,799
Speaker 1: But just do the twenty minute walk first, and then

902
00:44:12,840 --> 00:44:14,919
Speaker 1: you can do all the email right because it'll still

903
00:44:14,960 --> 00:44:16,839
Speaker 1: be there, it'll fill any amount of time you give it.

904
00:44:17,360 --> 00:44:19,400
Speaker 1: But you could do your twenty minute walk and then

905
00:44:19,520 --> 00:44:20,880
Speaker 1: do that and then go to dinner and feel at

906
00:44:20,960 --> 00:44:23,160
Speaker 1: least like you weren't sitting down all day. The one

907
00:44:23,200 --> 00:44:25,279
Speaker 1: other thing I would say is like, be careful with

908
00:44:25,320 --> 00:44:29,040
Speaker 1: how much you're drinking, because it can be easy to

909
00:44:30,000 --> 00:44:31,840
Speaker 1: drink more than you would in your normal life, Like

910
00:44:31,880 --> 00:44:33,759
Speaker 1: most of us are not really having two drinks on

911
00:44:33,800 --> 00:44:36,840
Speaker 1: a Tuesday, but if you are at a work dinner,

912
00:44:36,880 --> 00:44:41,400
Speaker 1: that could happen without you really choosing it, just especially

913
00:44:41,400 --> 00:44:43,000
Speaker 1: if they order a bottle of wine for the table

914
00:44:43,040 --> 00:44:46,560
Speaker 1: and somebody's like pouring more in your glass. So just

915
00:44:47,480 --> 00:44:51,400
Speaker 1: be wineful of that because that can definitely interfere with

916
00:44:51,520 --> 00:44:55,120
Speaker 1: sleep and energy and everything else. And then eat fruits

917
00:44:55,160 --> 00:44:59,920
Speaker 1: and veggies if you see them totally don't pass them by,

918
00:45:00,480 --> 00:45:05,640
Speaker 1: Like if they're on the appetizer station for your conference dinner,

919
00:45:06,080 --> 00:45:09,520
Speaker 1: load up on those, like just don't let those go

920
00:45:09,640 --> 00:45:12,200
Speaker 1: to waste because that's also going to keep you feeling

921
00:45:12,960 --> 00:45:16,480
Speaker 1: more digestively healthy in the course of your trip. Yeah.

922
00:45:16,560 --> 00:45:19,200
Speaker 2: I mean, if you're someone who travels like twice a year,

923
00:45:19,239 --> 00:45:21,279
Speaker 2: you might not have to feel like you care that

924
00:45:21,360 --> 00:45:23,040
Speaker 2: much how you eat on the road. But if you're

925
00:45:23,040 --> 00:45:25,719
Speaker 2: somebody who travels as a matter of routine, like you

926
00:45:25,760 --> 00:45:27,400
Speaker 2: have to recognize those days are adding up and you

927
00:45:27,400 --> 00:45:29,640
Speaker 2: probably need to treat them more, just like regular eating

928
00:45:29,680 --> 00:45:31,080
Speaker 2: days versus I'm on vacation.

929
00:45:31,400 --> 00:45:35,840
Speaker 1: So because you're not on vacation, you're not Yes, it

930
00:45:35,920 --> 00:45:38,960
Speaker 1: is usually your normal job with that not like, oh,

931
00:45:38,960 --> 00:45:42,160
Speaker 1: I'm working so hard I deserve to have three glasses

932
00:45:42,160 --> 00:45:44,000
Speaker 1: of wine on a Tuesday. I mean, maybe you are

933
00:45:44,040 --> 00:45:45,520
Speaker 1: working really hard, but that's going.

934
00:45:45,520 --> 00:45:47,880
Speaker 2: To make the morning after size the next day, the.

935
00:45:47,880 --> 00:45:51,480
Speaker 1: Morning exercise that much harder. Maybe there's another way to

936
00:45:51,560 --> 00:45:54,920
Speaker 1: reward yourself for working really hard. So well, this has

937
00:45:54,960 --> 00:45:57,680
Speaker 1: been best of both worlds. Sarah has been interviewing Manuch

938
00:45:57,800 --> 00:46:00,480
Speaker 1: Zomarodi about her book The Body Electric. We will be

939
00:46:00,520 --> 00:46:02,640
Speaker 1: back next week with more on making work and life

940
00:46:02,680 --> 00:46:03,280
Speaker 1: fit together.

941
00:46:05,280 --> 00:46:08,080
Speaker 2: Thanks for listening. You can find me Sarah at the

942
00:46:08,080 --> 00:46:12,480
Speaker 2: shoebox dot com or at the Underscore shoebox on Instagram

943
00:46:12,920 --> 00:46:13,239
Speaker 2: and you.

944
00:46:13,200 --> 00:46:17,440
Speaker 1: Can find me Laura at Laura vandercam dot com. This

945
00:46:17,520 --> 00:46:20,759
Speaker 1: has been the best of both worlds podcasts. Please join

946
00:46:20,840 --> 00:46:23,600
Speaker 1: us next time for more on making work and life

947
00:46:23,719 --> 00:46:24,400
Speaker 1: work together