Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Molly John Fast and this is Fast Politics,
Speaker 1: where we discussed the top political headlines with some of
Speaker 1: today's best minds, and more than thirty Republican congressmen have
Speaker 1: announced there leaving conference, we have said you great Joe
Speaker 1: for you. Today, the Lincoln Project's own Rick Wilson joins
Speaker 1: us to discuss the Trump Administration's attempt to cover up
Speaker 1: the murder of Renee Good, and we'll talk to the
Speaker 1: New Yorkers Johnathan Blitzer about how the Trump administration is
Speaker 1: making Democratic Congresswoman le Monica mcgiver's life hell. But first
Speaker 1: we have the stories the media is missing Somali.
Speaker 2: We are known haters of AI and it wiped out
Speaker 2: four hundred billion dollars for the stock market this week.
Speaker 2: And one of the funniest things is this week is
Speaker 2: as this is happening, we find out that a bunch
Speaker 2: of tech bros tried to create a hyperstition for those
Speaker 2: who don't know hyperstitions where you say something and try
Speaker 2: to make it real even though it's not real, and
Speaker 2: you know it. That these claud bots were all talking
Speaker 2: to each other that AI has said to you, it's well,
Speaker 2: it's well at more advanced than it actually is, and
Speaker 2: because of all this mythologizing, we are seeing a massive
Speaker 2: re structuring of our economy.
Speaker 1: I'm going to make this clear. AI is not doing
Speaker 1: what they told us it was going to do. It
Speaker 1: is not this sentient super being. It is just better computing,
Speaker 1: but is not changing the world. We are not going
Speaker 1: to all lose our jobs because of AI. This is
Speaker 1: good news, This should be good news. The problem is
Speaker 1: our entire economy is puffed up on the fantasy that
Speaker 1: AI is supercomputers. And so either what had to happen
Speaker 1: was that the stock market was going to create or
Speaker 1: AI was going to replace all of us, and we
Speaker 1: were going to live, as Elon Mush says, live care
Speaker 1: free in the world of Elon Mush, and we were
Speaker 1: all going to get universal basic income, not from him,
Speaker 1: of course, and not from our government. Well here's what's happened.
Speaker 1: The truth is AI is good and getting better, but
Speaker 1: he's not going to replace all of us, and that's
Speaker 1: really probably good news. And if our stock market had
Speaker 1: been normal, we would be fine. But instead it has
Speaker 1: puffed up our economy and so everybody's going to lose
Speaker 1: a lot of money. And that's what we saw this week.
Speaker 1: AI four hundred billion this week in paper returns in
Speaker 1: the market. So that sucks, and it sucks for people
Speaker 1: like Cora sam Altman, who felt useless and sad using
Speaker 1: his own AI to code. All right, honestly, fuck all
Speaker 1: of them. We could have avoided all of this if
Speaker 1: people hadn't been fucking liars, and that is how we
Speaker 1: got here, so conned again by stupid white guys.
Speaker 3: And as a side effect, we all get higher electricity fees.
Speaker 1: But I'm just glad that there are enormous data centers
Speaker 1: built everywhere in our country using water to make AI
Speaker 1: slop of Donald Trump. So just say no to AI.
Speaker 1: Don't use it, don't post the photos, don't let them
Speaker 1: fuck up stuff, just let it go.
Speaker 2: So in really ridiculous news and something that I uh.
Speaker 1: Find Mark Ebstein, I'm sorry. I see the headline of
Speaker 1: Jeffrey Epstein's brother, and I know and by the way
Speaker 1: I say this, I take no pleasure to report that.
Speaker 1: This makes me so angry. But you go and then
Speaker 1: I'll tell you why Mark Ebstein makes me furious.
Speaker 2: Okay, So over the weekend, what we saw is that
Speaker 2: first there is a big controversy where Jeffrey Epstein's death
Speaker 2: statement is dated the day before it happened, which there
Speaker 2: is some rational explanations for this. But another thing everybody's
Speaker 2: been discussing all week is that Mark Epstein submitted a
Speaker 2: tip that Donald Trump ordered the execution of his brother
Speaker 2: Jeffrey Epstein to cover up for him naming names. And
Speaker 2: he confirmed to the Independent that he did indeed submit
Speaker 2: this tip.
Speaker 1: All right, listen, here's the deal. What if the conspiracy
Speaker 1: is not any of these conspiracies, but it's a conspiracy
Speaker 1: that a rich, white, sociopathic guy and his horrendous British
Speaker 1: girlfriend got away with sex trafficking thousands of women and girls.
Speaker 1: What if that is the scandal. What if that is
Speaker 1: the conspiracy. What if the conspiracy is a conspiracy of silence.
Speaker 1: What if the conspiracy is that people still let these
Speaker 1: people be in government. What if the conspiracy is that
Speaker 1: Donald Trump was friends with Jeffrey Epstein, that half of
Speaker 1: his cabinet did business. I mean, you got Letnick doing
Speaker 1: business with jeffff You got John Phalen riding in Jeffrey
Speaker 1: Epstein's plane. Michael Wolfe has a huge substack and he
Speaker 1: is was giving media advice and getting free shoes from
Speaker 1: Jeffrey Epstein. Jeffrey Epstein spent ten thousand dollars buying underwear
Speaker 1: for Woody Allen. What if the conspiracy is that these
Speaker 1: fucking guys get to serve in our government and walk
Speaker 1: among us. What if that's the conspiracy. What if it's
Speaker 1: the fact that no one got prosecuted except Glayne, That,
Speaker 1: in my mind is a bigger conspiracy than anything else.
Speaker 1: And am I saying that Jeffrey Epstein wasn't murdered. I
Speaker 1: don't know what happened to Jeffrey Epstein, but I honestly
Speaker 1: care more about why there are not other people being
Speaker 1: held accountable. And that is what makes me the most furious.
Speaker 1: So that is why I say, do not get involved
Speaker 1: in the conspiracies. Get involved in the larger conspiracy, which
Speaker 1: is we do not believe women victims. That should be
Speaker 1: the conspiracy. Women are being treated terribly. They're being raped
Speaker 1: and assaulted and abused, and people are not listening to them.
Speaker 1: And is year twenty twenty six. That is a conspiracy
Speaker 1: that I think deserves your attention.
Speaker 4: Agreed.
Speaker 2: So we saw a big controversy this week where apparently
Speaker 2: Donald Trump wanted a bunch of things named after him
Speaker 2: and exchanged for unfreezing some funding. And this week we
Speaker 2: saw a US judge unfreeze the funding for the Gateway Tunnel,
Speaker 2: which would go from Central Manhattan to Union City, New
Speaker 2: Jersey and help lots of trades move faster and really
Speaker 2: help our economy.
Speaker 3: What do you see it here, Molly.
Speaker 1: It comes back to this central law of Trumpism, which
Speaker 1: is Trump is trying to do a lot of illegal shit,
Speaker 1: and if you fight back in the courts, he loses.
Speaker 1: And that's what this is, right, Donald Trump said, I'll
Speaker 1: give you the money. It's not his to give. Okay,
Speaker 1: it's federal money put together by the federal government and
Speaker 1: Donald Trump briefly as president again, but that does not
Speaker 1: make this money his. And like, the problem with the
Speaker 1: Trump cryptocracy is that my man behaves like a monarch
Speaker 1: and everyone's like, oh, it's his to give. It's not
Speaker 1: his to give. I mean, this is one of the
Speaker 1: big problems of where we are at this moment. A
Speaker 1: lot of this is just norms and not laws. So
Speaker 1: we expect our president to behave a certain way because
Speaker 1: of norms, when in fact we should have laws in
Speaker 1: place because when you get someone who doesn't follow laws,
Speaker 1: like oh, Donald Trump, this is what happens. So again
Speaker 1: the judge unfreezes the funding. It was frozen by Trump.
Speaker 1: It's sixteen billion dollars. It was allocated to this tunnel project.
Speaker 1: Donald Trump has been playing I'm not going to give
Speaker 1: it to you unless he told Chuck Schumer that he
Speaker 1: want a Penn station named after him. Again, why anyone
Speaker 1: would want Penn station named after you, I don't know,
Speaker 1: but it's a good point, Like none of this is his.
Speaker 1: You know, you just have to keep going in court.
Speaker 1: The illegal stuff will not stay. You know, we do
Speaker 1: think God have judges and laws and we are not
Speaker 1: of an honor republic, and so people have to just fight.
Speaker 1: And you know it's unfrozen. They'll be able to eventually
Speaker 1: build this tunnel. Donald Trump will costs us all billions
Speaker 1: of dollars. And you know he's doing this because he's
Speaker 1: mad that none of us voted for him. Because he's
Speaker 1: a fucking criminal, and that is where we are, so
Speaker 1: none of us should be surprised. It's just what he does.
Speaker 1: This is how we got here, this is what it is,
Speaker 1: and we need our Democrats to fight, fight, fight and
Speaker 1: protect our norms and institutions and also you know, everything
Speaker 1: else and everyone else.
Speaker 2: So to go back to the beginning of this broadcast
Speaker 2: where we were talking about AI and how it's pretty incompetent.
Speaker 2: You know what, I don't want it doing what scanting
Speaker 2: photos of ice protesters and then removing people at scans
Speaker 2: from the TSA pre check. It seems like nothing will
Speaker 2: go wrong with that, definitely not.
Speaker 1: The other thing that's kind of amazing about it is
Speaker 1: it's such a like trumpy idea. It's like, we're going
Speaker 1: to make it harder for them in the airport. That's
Speaker 1: how we're going to stick it to them. It's just
Speaker 1: a completely stupid I think that this is very stupid.
Speaker 1: I think that it's not going to work. I think
Speaker 1: that at every point they're trying to interest closer to
Speaker 1: a police state. The good news is the technology is
Speaker 1: not there. But next time there's going to be a
Speaker 1: president and the technology is going to be there. And
Speaker 1: the question is when we have the laws in place
Speaker 1: to prevent him from doing the kind of stuff that
Speaker 1: Trump has tried to do here. And I think that
Speaker 1: should be something that all of us are thinking about
Speaker 1: all the time. Rick Wilson is the founder of the
Speaker 1: Lincoln Project and the host of the Enemy's List. Rick Wilson,
Speaker 1: how are you?
Speaker 4: I am.
Speaker 1: Very cold in the northeast here. Things are not Mistakes
Speaker 1: were made, and we all now we're long underwear speaking
Speaker 1: of mistakes being made. Tell us the Gabbard. First of all,
Speaker 1: you know some of the worst people in Trump's administration.
Speaker 1: I take no pleasure to say this are Democrats. Talk
Speaker 1: us through this whistleblower.
Speaker 4: Sure, sure, so. Last year, sometime prior to June sixth,
Speaker 4: we know that part the National Security Agency picked up
Speaker 4: a person quote unquote close to Trump discussing intelligence matters
Speaker 4: concerning Iran with someone in a hostile foreign intelligence service.
Speaker 4: That's what we know so far. Gabbered, instead of reporting
Speaker 4: this appropriately throughout the intelligence community to develop countermeasures for it,
Speaker 4: et cetera, took it directly to Susie Wiles. This is
Speaker 4: way outside the normal procedure that one would do on this,
Speaker 4: and gave it to Susie Wiles for unknown purposes. After that,
Speaker 4: someone in the intelligence community said, whatever happened to that?
Speaker 4: And they were told basically shut the fuck up and
Speaker 4: to pay no attention. And so they reported it through
Speaker 4: the inspector general system in the intelligence community in the
Speaker 4: d and I apparently Tulsi Gabbard decided not to follow
Speaker 4: the rules and the law where that has to be
Speaker 4: made known within thirty days to the Gang of Eight
Speaker 4: in Congress, this the eight senior bipartisan Intelligence and Defense
Speaker 4: Oversight members. Because of that, we had to wait a
Speaker 4: year almost until we found out about this. And Gabbard
Speaker 4: has now been out lying about the sequence of events,
Speaker 4: lying about the timeline, lying about what the Inspector General said,
Speaker 4: And she is in some deep, deep, deep deep shit.
Speaker 4: This is one of those things that's like the intelligence community.
Speaker 4: People that are still around, they give a damn about
Speaker 4: their job, they give a damn about the country and
Speaker 4: the security, and she has put us in danger.
Speaker 1: There are sort of all these different national security protocols
Speaker 1: and ways that it's supposed to be done. Tulsey flouted those.
Speaker 1: But also the security the information that's been leaked or
Speaker 1: had that she leaked is like the highest level. Can
Speaker 1: you explain that.
Speaker 4: Yeah, this is something that is so compartmentalized. So folks
Speaker 4: have all heard about secret and top secret, and a
Speaker 4: lot of people now have heard about what they call
Speaker 4: sci compartmentalized information, and a compartmentalized program could have a
Speaker 4: thousand people in it, or it could have four people
Speaker 4: in it. This is at a level apparently that is
Speaker 4: so above and beyond because of both the nature of
Speaker 4: the target whoever this foreign intelligence person was, and the
Speaker 4: collection system from the NESSA that got the information. So
Speaker 4: this is something incredibly sensitive Crown Jewels level stuff, to
Speaker 4: the point where it could not have been transmitted outside
Speaker 4: of a group of probably like a dozen people in
Speaker 4: the entire government. This is a very like blazing red
Speaker 4: flag about Gabbard's inability and lack of temperament to do
Speaker 4: this job.
Speaker 1: Is it worse or better than being at than adding
Speaker 1: the editorom chief of The Atlantic to a signal chat
Speaker 1: about bombing around?
Speaker 4: This is wild worse.
Speaker 1: So how bad can it be? That seems good.
Speaker 4: Because that foreign intelligence person almost certainly will now become
Speaker 4: aware that we are targeting them in a certain way
Speaker 4: using a certain method, they will communicate differently. The other
Speaker 4: part of this is what it implicates in the Trump administration.
Speaker 4: We have seen in what we know of the complaints
Speaker 4: so far, is that the person they were talking to
Speaker 4: was quote close to Trump. This does not mean it
Speaker 4: is a government official, given Donald Trump's propensity for using
Speaker 4: outside actors Steve Whitcoff, Jared Kushner, et cetera, who are
Speaker 4: not government officials to conduct diplomacy and intelligence and foreign policy.
Speaker 4: I'm deeply concerned that somebody inside the Trump government told
Speaker 4: what say it was Jared. I have no evidence that
Speaker 4: it was Jared someone, but let's say it's someone like
Speaker 4: a Jared who gets on the phone and calls another person.
Speaker 1: By the way, many investors, did you.
Speaker 4: Hear about this? Correct? Did you hear about this thing
Speaker 4: that we're doing. I don't think this that's.
Speaker 1: The scenario you're describing.
Speaker 4: I don't think it right. I don't think it's Jared
Speaker 4: per se, but it is. I think it is a
Speaker 4: person in that category, most likely, because if it had
Speaker 4: been a government official, they would have said a Trump
Speaker 4: administration official in the.
Speaker 1: Compute, and they would have been fired.
Speaker 4: Hypothetically in a normal admiration, in a world where you
Speaker 4: and I were in charge, they'd be right.
Speaker 1: I'm going to actually want to move on for a
Speaker 1: minute to something that is not on our schedule, but
Speaker 1: I think is important. Is like this week, there was
Speaker 1: huge reporting out of the Wall Street Journal about the
Speaker 1: crypto scam amazing and how the Trump kids, the boys,
Speaker 1: even Barren are involved in this making handover first money
Speaker 1: in crypto and then cashing out before the investors.
Speaker 4: Yes, you know why they're Actually they may not be
Speaker 4: a smart family, but they recognize when they're in a
Speaker 4: con and they're gonna rug pull people, they need to
Speaker 4: get out before the rug gets pulled.
Speaker 1: But half the rug was sold to the United Arab Emirates.
Speaker 4: Discuss one of those many many things where if you
Speaker 4: added up all the bs that the House Oversight Committee
Speaker 4: claimed that Hunter Biden was involved in, they said, oh,
Speaker 4: Hunter Biden and the Biden family brought in twenty seven
Speaker 4: million dollars.
Speaker 1: The Biden crime family.
Speaker 4: Biden crime family. Yes, exactly twenty seven million dollars so far,
Speaker 4: as the Times outlined, we're talking about five hundred million,
Speaker 4: five point fifty. I think it was from the UAE,
Speaker 4: from the Shadowy Prince as they called him, who runs
Speaker 4: the UA's intelligence services, because that couldn't possibly be a
Speaker 4: conflict at all, who also does a lot of business
Speaker 4: with China.
Speaker 1: Yeah no, no, I mean the klepto krat stuff. The
Speaker 1: kryptocracy is just astounding. And it's so astounding that Andrew
Speaker 1: McCarthy talk us through that, because that is so when
Speaker 1: you've lost.
Speaker 4: From yeah, lost Andrew McCarty. Now look, let me let
Speaker 4: me describe it. Andrew. Andy McCarthy is I know, you know,
Speaker 4: Andrew McCarthy is a Republican attorney, former DJ Guy conservative,
Speaker 4: no fan of either Barack Obama or Joe Biden by
Speaker 4: any conceivable circumstances. But I will give Andy credit on something.
Speaker 4: He's been a very straight shooter on the Trump corruption issue.
Speaker 4: And he has said quite openly and to the and
Speaker 4: to the very ugly reaction of their readers, to the
Speaker 4: readers of National Review, this corruption stinks on ice. It
Speaker 4: is unbelievably enormous and consequential and dangerous for this country.
Speaker 4: And Donald Trump is running basically a racket. And he
Speaker 4: wrote a very very strong piece about it. You know,
Speaker 4: he continued to condemn the Biden's fine whatever, but he
Speaker 4: he laid out this unbelievably powerful case against Trump. And
Speaker 4: the right wing reaction has been very like, how dare you, sir,
Speaker 4: point out the criminality of our criminal.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And and I mean I think that's the problem
Speaker 1: that you see these people are incentivized to go along
Speaker 1: with everything because the base is so radicalized and the
Speaker 1: base is so convinced that anything any kind of criticism
Speaker 1: of Trump is you know, but I want you.
Speaker 4: To get They think it gives the Libs a.
Speaker 1: Win right, exactly as opposed, and the road to just
Speaker 1: a complete dictatorship is paved with don't let win right
Speaker 1: and and just this insane propaganda that Trump world needs.
Speaker 1: And by the way, I mean that's why I want
Speaker 1: to get to this Renee Good stuff, because.
Speaker 3: Yeah, there's more.
Speaker 1: It's think every day is just a nightmare of news.
Speaker 1: Renee Good, she was murdered by Ross Jonathan Ross, an
Speaker 1: ice agent. Now there was that one video where it
Speaker 1: almost looked like she They had one video which was
Speaker 1: from like ten miles away that made it look like
Speaker 1: maybe she was trying to hit him, But every other
Speaker 1: piece of forensic evin and shows.
Speaker 4: It exactly was the case.
Speaker 1: Yeah, she was turning the car, she was driving away.
Speaker 1: She was I'm not mad, bro, and he was any shotter.
Speaker 1: So talk to us about cash Battel.
Speaker 4: We now know that when the FBI agents assigned to
Speaker 4: the Minneapolis Field office began to do what they were
Speaker 4: required by law to do, which is to their education,
Speaker 4: their jobs, to open an investigation of the killing of
Speaker 4: an American citizen by federal law enforcement officers. They were
Speaker 4: told to stand down. They were examining Renee Goods vehicle
Speaker 4: when they were told by senior FBI agents now from reporting,
Speaker 4: including cash Ptel himself, to stop. Why would he order that?
Speaker 4: Why would he wandered that, Molly, he would order that
Speaker 4: because they understand what they did. They understood right away
Speaker 4: what happened. They understand that if you, if you allow
Speaker 4: the process of the law to play out, Jonathan Ross
Speaker 4: and the other FBI or the other ICE agents that
Speaker 4: were in the street that day are going to prison. Yeah,
Speaker 4: and Trump cannot afford to let Jonathan Ross or the
Speaker 4: guys who shot Alex Pretty go to prison. His base
Speaker 4: has been conditioned, like you just talked about. The insane
Speaker 4: propaganda has told seventy million Americans who loved Donald Trump
Speaker 4: that Alex Pretty was a murderer of domestic terrorists coming
Speaker 4: there to slaughter ICE agents, and Renee Good was a
Speaker 4: radical left wing paid activist, lesbian danger to the lives
Speaker 4: of these poor innocent ICE agents trying to do their job.
Speaker 4: That propaganda machine cannot have those people go down. And
Speaker 4: so that's why cash Bettel directly intervened, suborting a legitimate
Speaker 4: civil rights and law enforcement investigation into the murder of
Speaker 4: Renee Good to protect Donald Trump, and to protect worse
Speaker 4: than just protect Donald Trump, to protect the Magan narrative.
Speaker 4: If you're saddened and disgusted by it, folks, that's the
Speaker 4: reaction of a normal human being.
Speaker 1: I also think that much of the people in Trump's
Speaker 1: second administration are here to cover for him, Yeah, cover
Speaker 1: for his bad policy.
Speaker 4: Abler, Right.
Speaker 1: So it's either you know, they're covering for bad policy
Speaker 1: and they're covering for poorly trained ice agents, or they're
Speaker 1: covering for kleptocracy, or they're I mean, like the central
Speaker 1: theme of this conversation right now is watching members of
Speaker 1: Trump administration. And again, Tulsea Gabbert is a good example.
Speaker 1: Like Tulsey knew that somebody in that talk with someone
Speaker 1: that what she was put in place to keep from
Speaker 1: getting in trouble wick Cough.
Speaker 4: If it's a if it's a Cushner, if it's.
Speaker 1: A whoever, whoever.
Speaker 4: She she put politics above national security.
Speaker 1: Right, And cash Battel put law and order, law and order,
Speaker 1: and at every point here what we're seeing is an
Speaker 1: administration that exists largely to protect Trump and protect trump Ism.
Speaker 1: And by the way, it's a stark contrast to the Democrats,
Speaker 1: who are I mean, what's going on.
Speaker 4: Look, I'm going to give them props on one thing
Speaker 4: this week because mostly my love is just tough, not
Speaker 4: just love. But but the Democrats correctly this year held
Speaker 4: the line on all this redistricting crap. Yes, Texas has
Speaker 4: blown up on them and the and the whining bitches
Speaker 4: like ted cruising, how dare you do this? But is
Speaker 4: it redising? Which, yeah, yeah, you started it, We finished it.
Speaker 1: Sorry Pale Virginia.
Speaker 4: But look, they need to hold the line on on
Speaker 4: this Epstein stuff and on Ice. They need to keep
Speaker 4: the pressure up, not let it go down. And I
Speaker 4: know the natural instinct of people like Chuck Schumer is like,
Speaker 4: let's let let's breathe, let's let's all sit and reason together.
Speaker 1: Right, that's a by gone No, my.
Speaker 4: Honorable friend across the aisle. No, you have no honorable
Speaker 4: friends across the aisle anymore, buddy, Yeah, they don't exist.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I think there will be a moment when
Speaker 1: things start to shift back to what American democracy once
Speaker 1: was in the you know progs would and there is
Speaker 1: going to need to be real introspection of how we
Speaker 1: got here. And it means that, as you know, even
Speaker 1: though Trump was the kleptocrat that you know that was
Speaker 1: that that really moved us to the next level of
Speaker 1: democratic rod there were there are ways in which we
Speaker 1: failed to regulate that Goddess here hundreds.
Speaker 4: Of different examples in our current moment, Molly where and
Speaker 4: it's not always, and it's not universal. Where where normalcy
Speaker 4: bias made Democrats think, Okay, well, I you know, the
Speaker 4: Republican My Republican buddies are faking this. It's okay, we'll
Speaker 4: work it out. Or hundreds of examples of normalcy bias
Speaker 4: with Republicans who thought, you know, we can uh, he
Speaker 4: wants to do the silly shit on Twitter, will run
Speaker 4: the government. None of those things held up. And they
Speaker 4: didn't hold up because as an as a country that
Speaker 4: once believed institutions had power to keep things glued together,
Speaker 4: those institutions kept handing Trump individually more and more and
Speaker 4: more and more power, whether it was the Supreme Court,
Speaker 4: whether it was Congress, whether it was the media, all
Speaker 4: of these institutions that should have been fighting instead said,
Speaker 4: you know what, it's too much noise, it's too loud,
Speaker 4: there's too much risk, there's too much pain. I don't
Speaker 4: want to be the one who goes out and loses
Speaker 4: my job over over telling you know the truth about
Speaker 4: this guy, and over and over again. I think that
Speaker 4: really has something. I think you're right, we have to
Speaker 4: We're gonna have to have a painful reconciliation when this
Speaker 4: is over Nuremberg and it's gonna Yeah, it's gonna have
Speaker 4: to people unless some people go to.
Speaker 1: Jail, yeah over this and will keep happening.
Speaker 4: It will keep happening. The incentive structure of bad action
Speaker 4: right now has not yet met a single person being
Speaker 4: punished for the bad actions.
Speaker 1: That's right. I think we have to realize that it
Speaker 1: has to change. I want to talk to you about
Speaker 1: the This I think is actually kind of a good thing.
Speaker 1: So Donald Trump did a racist, disgusting thing, which is
Speaker 1: in case you're wondering his brand.
Speaker 4: This should not surprise anyone.
Speaker 1: Go on, Yeah, racist disgusting thing, posting a photo of
Speaker 1: the Obamas apes, a video that had the Obamas apes.
Speaker 1: I think this is meaningful, and you and I both
Speaker 1: agree he was condemned.
Speaker 4: Even by a lot of Republicans.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's what I'm talking about.
Speaker 3: I mean they.
Speaker 4: Didn't and a lot of them didn't couch it in
Speaker 4: the usual like this can't possibly be my beloved Donald Trump,
Speaker 4: racial healer. Most of them like this is disgusting. Take
Speaker 4: it the fuck down.
Speaker 1: So we had Susan Collins, we had Tim Scott. So
Speaker 1: what do you think? I mean, I don't think. Look,
Speaker 1: they know he's a racist. He does a lot of
Speaker 1: disgusting shit all the time. I think they see the
Speaker 1: poll numbers.
Speaker 4: I think you are absolutely correct. They see the poll
Speaker 4: numbers and what and inside those poll numbers, And I
Speaker 4: know this is a weird, like flashback to that redistricting
Speaker 4: conversation we were just having. When the Texas folks built
Speaker 4: that redistricting model, they thought all Hispanic voters will behave
Speaker 4: like they did in twenty twenty four and they'll stick
Speaker 4: with Trump.
Speaker 1: Well, I don't know why they thought that.
Speaker 4: They're just not that bright. Yeah, honestly, that's a real
Speaker 4: that's the true answer. Now they've been in a they've
Speaker 4: been in a super majority for so long, they're arrogant.
Speaker 4: But inside those polling numbers, we they're seeing right now
Speaker 4: not only have the numbers with African Americans including young men,
Speaker 4: which is where they did make some progress in twenty four,
Speaker 4: but all African Americans, including the people they won in
Speaker 4: twenty four, they've gone way back in the other direction.
Speaker 4: It's worse than it's ever been for Republicans. Hispanics are
Speaker 4: have moved way back in most states. In a couple
Speaker 4: of states it's still lagging a little bit, But in
Speaker 4: most states, Hispanic have gone all the way back to
Speaker 4: where they were, or a little worse.
Speaker 1: Ask the Democratic Mayor of Miami.
Speaker 4: Correct and and and the consequences of ice DHS, the
Speaker 4: ending of the TPS program throughout the Cuban and Venezuelan communities,
Speaker 4: all these things are rippling out right now. And that
Speaker 4: so that damage hasn't stopped, it's only just started. And
Speaker 4: and when you go out and you use one of
Speaker 4: the most grotesque tropes about black Americans, mm hmm. If
Speaker 4: you want to go back to the Jim Crow era,
Speaker 4: are you want to go back to the to the
Speaker 4: to the reconstruction era? What was it? What was the
Speaker 4: image of black people that was portrayed in in newsprint
Speaker 4: back then. It was the savage ape. It was the
Speaker 4: it was the mindless you know, monkey raping women. It's
Speaker 4: such a shitty, horrible, ancient trope. And by the way,
Speaker 4: Trump's old enough to kind of remember some of that stuff. Yeah,
Speaker 4: that was that had not vanished from the white discourse
Speaker 4: about race, even in Queens in the nineteen fifties when
Speaker 4: he was growing up.
Speaker 1: Rick Wilson Mama drunk Fast. Jonathan Blitzer is a reporter
Speaker 1: at The New Yorker. Welcome, Welcome, Jonathan, Thanks thanks for
Speaker 1: having me tell us the story of La Monica Magiver.
Speaker 5: Okay, the plot itself is a little complicated, which I
Speaker 5: think is actually part of the point of why the
Speaker 5: administration has gone after her in the first place. Lamonica
Speaker 5: MacIvor is a first term Democratic congresswoman from Newark and
Speaker 5: has been a pretty outspoken advocate of immigrants rights. Not
Speaker 5: someone by the way, who campaigned on this when she
Speaker 5: first ran for office. This is an issue that I
Speaker 5: think kind of fell in her lap because she saw
Speaker 5: the you know, the way the country was going and
Speaker 5: what was starting to happen in her district, and so
Speaker 5: what was happening in her district was that the first
Speaker 5: detentions center to open under the current administration is a
Speaker 5: place called Delaney Hall in Newark, which almost immediately is controversial,
Speaker 5: not just because it's involved in the administration's broader sort
Speaker 5: of mass deportation campaign, but because local officials from the
Speaker 5: mayor's office and beyond were saying from the very beginning
Speaker 5: that the private prison company that ran this facility, called
Speaker 5: the Geogroup, wasn't getting any of the necessary municipal permits
Speaker 5: for plumbing, for fire hazard, all the obvious stuff. They
Speaker 5: were claiming that this was, you know, all happening on
Speaker 5: an expedited basis. City authorities weren't being consulted. There was
Speaker 5: all kinds of complaints about what was happening inside the facility,
Speaker 5: and so on May ninth of last year, Congresswoman MacIvor
Speaker 5: and two other Democrats showed up unannounced to take a
Speaker 5: tour of this detention center. Now, this is something that
Speaker 5: members of Congress have a legal right to do. It
Speaker 5: is written into a statute. Actually, this statute grew out
Speaker 5: of abuses committed during Trump's first term where members of
Speaker 5: Congress based decided that you know, if Congress is going
Speaker 5: to appropriate money to the Department for Land Security. There
Speaker 5: need to be some basic checks and basic oversight responsibilities
Speaker 5: that members of Congress are allowed to have, and that
Speaker 5: if members of Congress alert detention center authorities that they're
Speaker 5: going to show up at a given place to conduct
Speaker 5: a tour ahead of time, then what often happens is
Speaker 5: the conditions get sanitized, things get clean, detainees are better treated,
Speaker 5: et cetera. And so the idea from the very beginning
Speaker 5: was that members of Congress should have the right to
Speaker 5: show up unannounced and give it and receive some sort
Speaker 5: of tour of the facilities pursuant to their oversight responsibilities
Speaker 5: in Congress. So Congresswaran MacIvor on May ninth shows up
Speaker 5: with Bonnie Watson Coleman and Rob men Endez Junior to
Speaker 5: conduct one of these tours, and they're basically stonewall two.
Speaker 1: Other New Jersey congress people.
Speaker 5: That's right, and you know, both of whom are you know,
Speaker 5: pretty outspoken immigrants rights advocates, kind of well versed in
Speaker 5: this procedure.
Speaker 3: Bonnie Watson Coleman is eighty years old.
Speaker 5: They had recently the three of them visited in another
Speaker 5: facility in New Jersey, and.
Speaker 3: You know, showed up.
Speaker 5: Initially, the guard at the front kind of gave them
Speaker 5: a little bit of a run around. Bonnie Watson Coleman,
Speaker 5: eighty year old, sort of fierce season member of Congress,
Speaker 5: produces a printed copy of the statute. They're eventually waved in,
Speaker 5: given a tour. No problems this time. They're basically railroaded
Speaker 5: and kind of given a whole run around. An hour passes,
Speaker 5: an hour and a half pass. Still they're not granted
Speaker 5: access to this particular facility. Congressman MacIver is especially annoyed
Speaker 5: because months earlier, she and Menendez, the other congressman, had
Speaker 5: actually met with ice officers in the state to talk
Speaker 5: precisely about doing this sort of thing, and they had
Speaker 5: both felt like those conversations went well, that they had
Speaker 5: been totally transparent, that they had acted in good faith,
Speaker 5: and here they were basically getting stonewalled now before they
Speaker 5: showed up. And the reason I'm telling you this whole
Speaker 5: plot is because it actually matters. So before they showed up,
Speaker 5: they had coordinated with the mayor of Newark, Ross Baraka
Speaker 5: to meet them outside the facility after they were done
Speaker 5: with their tour for a press conference, Baraka shows up.
Speaker 5: He doesn't see the members of Congress. He assumes that
Speaker 5: they're finishing their tour because at this point it would
Speaker 5: have been, you know, at least a couple of hours
Speaker 5: since they arrived. He, while standing outside, is basically allowed
Speaker 5: in by one of the private prison guards who mans
Speaker 5: the outer gate of the facility. He stands basically in
Speaker 5: the outer parking lot waiting for the members of Congress
Speaker 5: to come out. And then what follows becomes the basis
Speaker 5: of these criminal charges brought against Congressman MacIvor, which.
Speaker 3: Is first a bunch of armed DHS agents march out
Speaker 3: to the parking lot, right past the three members of
Speaker 3: Congress who have been waiting to gain entry for this tour.
Speaker 3: They go to arrest the mayor ross Baraka for trespassing. Now,
Speaker 3: when they first threaten him with this arrest, he eventually,
Speaker 3: after some initial hesitation, actually leaves the facility. The DHS
Speaker 3: agents and in this case specifically ICE agents nevertheless go
Speaker 3: outside the gates of the facility to public property to
Speaker 3: arrest him on public property for trespassing. What we now
Speaker 3: know we didn't know in the moment, but what we now.
Speaker 5: Know based on body camera footage was that the lead
Speaker 5: ICE agent who goes outside to make this arrest is
Speaker 5: on the phone, and when he finishes his call, we
Speaker 5: don't know specifically who he's on the phone with, but
Speaker 5: when he hangs up his cell phone, he turns to
Speaker 5: the other agents and he says to them explicitly, we
Speaker 5: have orders from the Deputy Attorney General of the United States,
Speaker 5: this is Todd Blanche at the Justice the number two
Speaker 5: at the Justice Department, to go arrest the mayor of Newark,
Speaker 5: even though he was now on public property. And so
Speaker 5: the members of Congress who are on hand are obviously outraged.
Speaker 5: They try to intercede. What follows is an incredibly chaotic
Speaker 5: mess of a.
Speaker 1: Situation which I've seen videos exactly.
Speaker 5: And a lot of people have probably at this point
Speaker 5: seen some snippet of video, and in the course of
Speaker 5: this kind of general altercation is these agents try to
Speaker 5: surround and arrest ross Broca. Congresswoman MacIver makes contact with
Speaker 5: two of the ICE agents at two different moments in
Speaker 5: this kind of whole scene, and at the time doesn't
Speaker 5: even realize that she did anything that the government found objectionable,
Speaker 5: because what happened was these ICE agents eventually take ross
Speaker 5: Baraka away, and the three members of Congress after this
Speaker 5: whole drama are basically allowed to go on their tour.
Speaker 5: And so it's not until ten days later that the
Speaker 5: congresswoman realizes, in the form of hearing an announcement from
Speaker 5: the then US Attorney in New Jersey, that she was
Speaker 5: being charged with a crime of assaulting to federal agents.
Speaker 5: And when the US Attorney announces that, she simultaneously announces
Speaker 5: that they're actually dropping the trespassing charges against Ross Barrokka
Speaker 5: because there was never any substance of those charges to
Speaker 5: begin with. And that's what begins this legal saga for
Speaker 5: Congresswoman maciv.
Speaker 1: And is she the only one of that group that's
Speaker 1: being prosecuted?
Speaker 3: That's right?
Speaker 1: Why?
Speaker 3: Well, it's a good question. You know.
Speaker 5: I've thought a lot about this, and I think there
Speaker 5: probably two general ways to explain. The first is just
Speaker 5: in terms of the actual plot points of what happened
Speaker 5: that day. There is no question that Congressman MacIvor, as
Speaker 5: compared to the other two congressmen there was the most exercised,
Speaker 5: the most upset, the most willing to dive into the fray.
Speaker 1: Not illegal, though not illegal.
Speaker 5: Not particularly objectionable, and I will say, by the way,
Speaker 5: I've now interviewed a number of current and former DOJ
Speaker 5: officials who had visibility into these types of investigations. In
Speaker 5: the past, there used to be an office at the
Speaker 5: Department of Justice called the Public Integrity Section that basically
Speaker 5: would be consulted and would need to sign off anytime
Speaker 5: the Department of Justice wanted to charge a member of Congress,
Speaker 5: precisely because after Watergate there was this great fear that,
Speaker 5: if unchecked, the Department of Justice could weaponize the justice
Speaker 5: system against political opponents. But you know, a week before
Speaker 5: Congressman Macchiv was charged, that office, the Public Integrity Section
Speaker 5: was basically dismantled, And so you know, by any objective standard,
Speaker 5: the idea that they're bringing charges against her is outlandish
Speaker 5: and very scary. But if you spend time pouring over
Speaker 5: this footage, she I think probably looks like the easiest
Speaker 5: target because she really is upset, she's swearing, she's outspoken.
Speaker 5: I will say, for what it's worth, you know, Bonnie
Speaker 5: Watson Coleman is eighty years old. She's right there next
Speaker 5: to Maciv by the way, But I think probably a
Speaker 5: lot harder to make a strong.
Speaker 3: Case against an eighty year old member of Congress.
Speaker 5: I first, like want to go through those sort of
Speaker 5: plot preliminaries before I say this, but I do think
Speaker 5: race has a lot to do with the fact that
Speaker 5: the government has alighted on Congresswoman MacIvor.
Speaker 3: You have a young black congresswoman in her first term from.
Speaker 5: Newark, who doesn't have a deep pocket, who doesn't have
Speaker 5: a lot of resources at her disposal, who has turned into,
Speaker 5: by the government's design, the kind of face of this,
Speaker 5: you know, sort of angry, physical resistance to ice. And
Speaker 5: that's kind of what the government script has been from
Speaker 5: the very start, and so to the extent that they can,
Speaker 5: they've tried to isolate images of just her physically clashing
Speaker 5: with these agents without really panning out and allowing people
Speaker 5: to see or understand the broader context.
Speaker 3: And at various points.
Speaker 5: In this kind of legal saga, which is very much ongoing,
Speaker 5: the government has actually put out very obvious lies about
Speaker 5: what happened. And this isn't my judgment, This isn't even
Speaker 5: my judgment after having watched the tape and interviewed people
Speaker 5: and interviewed witnesses and so on. But an actual district
Speaker 5: court judge who's been hearing this case at a certain
Speaker 5: point had to issue orders to the Justice Department saying, look,
Speaker 5: you can't have government agencies putting out lies and misinformation
Speaker 5: about the details of this case while this case is pending.
Speaker 5: And at a certain point I was in court what
Speaker 5: had happened. One of the DOJ lawyers basically shrugged and said,
Speaker 5: this is all coming from headquarters at the Department of Homelandsecurity.
Speaker 5: We don't have control over this, which gives you a
Speaker 5: sense I think of how this whole thing has been
Speaker 5: really a kind of political project from the start.
Speaker 1: Where is the case now?
Speaker 5: The case now is basically in a process of pre
Speaker 5: trial appeals, so basically comes from Maciver's lawyers tried to
Speaker 5: get the case thrown out on two grounds. First that
Speaker 5: this represented a selective and vindictive prosecution of democratic critic of.
Speaker 1: The administration, which it clearly did. Which it did, but which.
Speaker 5: Like legally, is a very hard thing to prove and
Speaker 5: was kind of always going to be an uphill battle
Speaker 5: from a legal perspective. The second claim that Maciver's lawyers made,
Speaker 5: which I actually thought potentially would have more attraction.
Speaker 3: I'm not a lawyer.
Speaker 5: But my understanding was that this had a little bit
Speaker 5: more give was that she had legislative community because she
Speaker 5: basically showed up that day to conduct oversight. She wasn't
Speaker 5: there to participate in a protest, and arguably even when
Speaker 5: she left the facility to figure out what was going on.
Speaker 5: You know, her lawyers have said, look, Ross Broka, the
Speaker 5: mayor of Newark is one of her constituents. I mean,
Speaker 5: insofar as she's there to oversee ICE's conduct and behavior
Speaker 5: at this facility, it's not out of the question to
Speaker 5: characterize her even being outside the facility interceding in that moment,
Speaker 5: as being some form of oversight. But that does require
Speaker 5: a bit of an extended legal argument, and the judge
Speaker 5: so far has refused to accept those claims. And so
Speaker 5: this case is moving toward a jury trial. There's going
Speaker 5: to be kind of a little bit more back and
Speaker 5: forth in the appellate process, but it seems possible, if
Speaker 5: not likely, that this case will go to trial this year.
Speaker 5: And to be clear of the stakes, you know, all
Speaker 5: the chargers have these kind of maximum sentences. If you
Speaker 5: add them all up, what she faces potentially is seventeen
Speaker 5: years in prison for allegedly assaulting these two federal agents.
Speaker 1: This is so fucking nuts. Now, I want you to
Speaker 1: talk about another piece you wrote five years ago when
Speaker 1: we were all still in our thirties. Actually I was
Speaker 1: just in my forties, but when we were young and
Speaker 1: life was good, the salad days. Explain to us this story.
Speaker 3: This is about Stephen Miller.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 5: Well, you know, it's interesting because this story about hungressoan MacIvor.
Speaker 5: In some ways, there is also a story about Miller's
Speaker 5: increasing influence from Trump One to Trump too. At the
Speaker 5: tail end of the first Trump administration, I profiled Stephen Miller,
Speaker 5: and at the time I was fascinated by his role
Speaker 5: in that administration, particularly because you know, I spent most
Speaker 5: of my time covering immigration and politics at the New Yorker,
Speaker 5: and what I was seeing and hearing from people inside
Speaker 5: that first Trump administration, whether you know high ranking political
Speaker 5: appointees or you know career civil servants at key agencies
Speaker 5: or in key offices, was that this young upstart Stephen Miller,
Speaker 5: who for you know, much of his career in Washington,
Speaker 5: was kind of in the wilderness of the Republican Party
Speaker 5: and was seen as something of a crank and an
Speaker 5: absolutely unhinged ideologue on the issue of immigration, was actually
Speaker 5: punching above his weight inside that administration and getting major
Speaker 5: things done.
Speaker 3: And so the idea was to try to understand how
Speaker 3: that was happening.
Speaker 1: And it's important just to remind people that he worked
Speaker 1: for the really the absolute worst Alabama senator, is that
Speaker 1: fair to say, And that's how he came up. Talk
Speaker 1: about how he came up.
Speaker 5: Miller's trajectory is incredibly interesting in striking because he basically
Speaker 5: went from you know, really being in a kind of
Speaker 5: circle of the Republican Party that most Republicans wrote off
Speaker 5: as being crazy and irrelevant. So basically, Miller kind of
Speaker 5: first came to semi prominence in Republican circles in Washington
Speaker 5: when he worked as the communications director to then Alabama
Speaker 5: Senator Jeff Sessions.
Speaker 1: Right, who was one of the first Trump endorsements, right.
Speaker 5: The first Republican senator to endorse Trump in twenty sixteen.
Speaker 5: And actually that story is interesting because you know, Sessions
Speaker 5: was someone who inside the Republican Party had always been
Speaker 5: probably one of the most conservative, hostile voices on immigration
Speaker 5: in all forms, not just the idea of border crossings.
Speaker 5: And so on but specifically wanting to actually restrict the
Speaker 5: legal immigration system. He's someone who had a kind of deep,
Speaker 5: thorough going vision of you know, the need for the
Speaker 5: US to tamp down on immigration in all forms. And
Speaker 5: as a result, he again was on the margins of
Speaker 5: the Republican Party. He didn't have the influence to persuade
Speaker 5: people to his position, but he and Miller quickly realized
Speaker 5: that they had the influence to sabotage, you know, legislative
Speaker 5: efforts to you know, work on this issue. And so
Speaker 5: in twenty thirteen, when the Obama administration was trying to
Speaker 5: shepherd comprehensive immigration reform through Congress, you know, it passed
Speaker 5: through the Senate and basically languished in the House, which
Speaker 5: at the time was controlled by Republicans, and the Republican
Speaker 5: speaker didn't want to bring it to the floor for
Speaker 5: a vote because it was, you know, kind of too
Speaker 5: tendentious inside his conference, even though a majority of members
Speaker 5: of Congress probably would have supported that comprehensive reform push.
Speaker 5: And the role of Miller in Sessions in scuttling that
Speaker 5: deal is quite important because it showed, first of all,
Speaker 5: that they could have significant influence even though they were
Speaker 5: on the margins. I mean, Miller is someone who you know,
Speaker 5: I should say, And this came up when I first
Speaker 5: profiled him. You know, I interviewed congressional staffers, members of Congress,
Speaker 5: the usual suspects in Republican life in DC at that time,
Speaker 5: who basically said, every day they get these crazy, long,
Speaker 5: nutty emails for Miller, pushing all kinds of outrageous conspiracy
Speaker 5: theories or kind of racist views of immigration and immigrants,
Speaker 5: and they would basically just delete these emails and like
Speaker 5: to the extent that any of them could ignore the
Speaker 5: guy because he was just so far afield. But here
Speaker 5: in twenty thirteen twenty fourteen, there was this real kind
Speaker 5: of inflection point inside the party where Miller and Sessions
Speaker 5: were able to attack other Republicans for being kind of
Speaker 5: insufficiently conservative on the immigration issue. And this is where
Speaker 5: they started to flirt with really blasting out lies about
Speaker 5: different aspects of that reform bill. They went at people
Speaker 5: like Marco Rubio, people who at the time had a
Speaker 5: more moderate bent on immigration reform, and in the process
Speaker 5: a number of people said to me, Miller kind of
Speaker 5: got this perverse education in immigration policy and immigration law,
Speaker 5: because essentially what he was doing was trying to find
Speaker 5: where all of the bodies were buried in terms of
Speaker 5: past legislative consensus on immigration policy, because he was now
Speaker 5: trying to weaponize this issue to go after other Republicans
Speaker 5: to get them on sort of more or less on
Speaker 5: his side, or the very least, you know, lining them
Speaker 5: up against any kind of productive legislation on the subject.
Speaker 5: And so this is where Miller really, i think, first
Speaker 5: rose to prominence. And when Trump announced his candidacy back
Speaker 5: in twenty fifteen, there was a fascinating conversation that Joshua
Speaker 5: Green reports on in his book, which I think remains
Speaker 5: the kind of definitive account of this conversation what josh
Speaker 5: Wass book, Devil's Bargain, It's about Steve Bannon and kind
Speaker 5: of this world. And it was incredibly illuminating to me
Speaker 5: at the time because it was a conversation essentially in
Speaker 5: which Steve Bannon had this talk with Jeff Sessions and said, look,
Speaker 5: this is your chance. You have had this view on
Speaker 5: immigration forever, and you're basically and finally you have a
Speaker 5: guy in Trump who's charismatic enough and who's forceful enough
Speaker 5: to kind of personify your positions and to actually, you know,
Speaker 5: be a mouthpiece for a worldview that you've had forever.
Speaker 5: So you know, endorse this guy and like your agenda
Speaker 5: will finally get the kind of prominence it deserves. And
Speaker 5: that was the basis of Sessions coming out and endorsing
Speaker 5: Trump and being the first Republican senator to endorsed Trump.
Speaker 5: And it mattered at the time very much for Trump,
Speaker 5: who didn't have the conservative credentials among the real ideologues,
Speaker 5: and so the idea of having someone like Jeff Sessions
Speaker 5: vouch for his conservatism, you know, meant something to the
Speaker 5: ideologus and the party. And Miller was one of the
Speaker 5: first people to actually work on Trump's nascent presidential campaign
Speaker 5: at a time when you know, most people wrote it
Speaker 5: off as a clown show.
Speaker 3: And so that began Miller's real assent in Trump's.
Speaker 1: Washington unbelievably disturbing and also insane. Yeah, oh yeah, Jonathan,
Speaker 1: thank you, thank you for joining us.
Speaker 3: Oh thanks for having me.
Speaker 1: No moment time, Rick Wilson by the junk folst we
Speaker 1: are at that time?
Speaker 4: Is it that moment of fuckery? I have one for
Speaker 4: this week?
Speaker 1: Yes, we hear it. Yes, So if you are a.
Speaker 4: Guy brought in by a billionaire to run a fabled,
Speaker 4: storied journalistic institution like the Washington Post, and then you
Speaker 4: proceed to turn it into a Trump cheer squad, and
Speaker 4: it starts to fall apart, you start losing readership because
Speaker 4: no one needs Fox Light, no one wants diet Fox
Speaker 4: as I like to say that if they wanted that
Speaker 4: kind of crap, they go to the Washington Times. And
Speaker 4: then you destroy the quality of the paper. Then you
Speaker 4: fire a third of the staff seemingly kind of at random,
Speaker 4: and then you go and have parties at the Super
Speaker 4: Bowl week out in San Francisco and don't even bother
Speaker 4: to join the zoom call. Firing eight hundred people.
Speaker 1: Walk the ropeline.
Speaker 4: Maybe maybe when you get fired yourself, it's karma. And
Speaker 4: I think the karma of him getting fired at the
Speaker 4: Post is perfection.
Speaker 1: And you'll remember that Will Lewis did not want to
Speaker 1: cover the phone hacking scandal which he was involved in,
Speaker 1: and that is why Sally Buzby, the editor of the
Speaker 1: Washington Post, quit, So he has long been a bad actor.
Speaker 1: During his two year term, he.
Speaker 4: Comes out of the rupert versus people right.
Speaker 1: Now that said, the Wall Street Journal is doing excellent reporting.
Speaker 4: So I got to give the Wall Street Journal a
Speaker 4: lot of credit right now, Molly, they have been hammering
Speaker 4: tongs on all this stuff lately, and there seems to
Speaker 4: be a flavor change over there. I don't know what
Speaker 4: it is quite.
Speaker 1: From the Tucker Baby woman had her own chief. God blesser, yeah,
Speaker 1: God blesser. But I do think. Look, Jeff Bezos has
Speaker 1: many billions of dollars. He has bought the Washington Post.
Speaker 1: He has destroyed the Washington Post. Now he refuses to
Speaker 1: sell the Washington Post. Right, someday Jeff Bezos, probably sooner
Speaker 1: rather than later, will pretend that he never did any
Speaker 1: of this. Just like when you watch those videos of
Speaker 1: Jadvan's being booed at the Olympics, you know that this
Speaker 1: worm is going to turn real fast and these people
Speaker 1: are going to have to pretend they were never involved
Speaker 1: in it.
Speaker 4: There's a book out right now. It's about Israel and Gaza,
Speaker 4: but it's called Someday Everyone will have been against this. Yeah,
Speaker 4: and someday everyone will have been against all of this. Yeah,
Speaker 4: they will all know. I wasn't me, man, I wasn't
Speaker 4: that guy. But they all will be that guy the
Speaker 4: Internet does not forget.
Speaker 1: Hopefully that'll be sooner rather than later. Thank you, Rick Wilson.
Speaker 4: See Yah.
Speaker 1: That's it for this episode of Fast Politics. Tune in
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