1 00:00:04,080 --> 00:00:07,480 Speaker 1: On this episode of Nuts World. I am really excited 2 00:00:07,640 --> 00:00:09,840 Speaker 1: to have Kelly Anne Conway because I've known her, I 3 00:00:09,880 --> 00:00:13,160 Speaker 1: think since she got her Girl Scout badge in government, 4 00:00:13,520 --> 00:00:16,239 Speaker 1: and I've watched her grow and really developed as an 5 00:00:16,239 --> 00:00:21,520 Speaker 1: extraordinary poster and an even more extraordinary strategic analyst. In addition, 6 00:00:21,600 --> 00:00:23,439 Speaker 1: Chillis and I both think of her as a very 7 00:00:23,480 --> 00:00:27,440 Speaker 1: close personal friend. She has been a very respected poster 8 00:00:27,560 --> 00:00:30,880 Speaker 1: for corporate and Republican clients. You've seen her on television 9 00:00:30,880 --> 00:00:34,720 Speaker 1: a lot. She is I think the first woman manager 10 00:00:34,760 --> 00:00:39,400 Speaker 1: to win a presidential election in twenty sixteen for Donald 11 00:00:39,400 --> 00:00:42,280 Speaker 1: Trump and did a great job. And her new memoir, 12 00:00:42,440 --> 00:00:45,720 Speaker 1: Here's the Deal, Kelly Anne Conway, takes you on a 13 00:00:45,800 --> 00:00:47,960 Speaker 1: journey all the way to the White House and beyond, 14 00:00:48,400 --> 00:00:50,920 Speaker 1: and she describes what it's like to be dissected on 15 00:00:51,040 --> 00:00:54,840 Speaker 1: national television, how to outsmart the media mob, and how 16 00:00:54,880 --> 00:00:58,480 Speaker 1: to outclass the crazy critics, how to survive and succeed 17 00:00:58,520 --> 00:01:07,920 Speaker 1: in a male dominated industry. Kelly Anne, it's really great 18 00:01:07,959 --> 00:01:11,240 Speaker 1: to have you here. And I should say you've debuted 19 00:01:11,240 --> 00:01:13,640 Speaker 1: at number one in the New York Times Best Subtle List, 20 00:01:13,680 --> 00:01:18,119 Speaker 1: which is an astonishing achievement for a conservative so how 21 00:01:18,160 --> 00:01:19,880 Speaker 1: does it feel. I mean, you have a number one book, 22 00:01:19,920 --> 00:01:22,280 Speaker 1: You've done all these different things where you have a 23 00:01:22,280 --> 00:01:26,280 Speaker 1: remarkable career in a great future. Well new Ingridge, First 24 00:01:26,280 --> 00:01:28,080 Speaker 1: of all, thank you very much for having me on 25 00:01:28,120 --> 00:01:30,600 Speaker 1: your podcast and for being a big part of the 26 00:01:30,720 --> 00:01:33,360 Speaker 1: ark of my career. I talk about that extensively in 27 00:01:33,400 --> 00:01:36,520 Speaker 1: my book. You are thanked by name. You deserve it. 28 00:01:37,040 --> 00:01:41,160 Speaker 1: For me personally, you've had such an impact as a leader, 29 00:01:41,200 --> 00:01:46,480 Speaker 1: as a messenger, as frankly a patient, shrewd, deliberative and 30 00:01:46,600 --> 00:01:51,480 Speaker 1: strategic thinker and doer within the conservative movement in the 31 00:01:51,520 --> 00:01:55,400 Speaker 1: Republican Party. I learned by watching, I learned by listening, 32 00:01:56,080 --> 00:02:00,640 Speaker 1: but also people like you can't really have that second 33 00:02:00,720 --> 00:02:03,480 Speaker 1: career out of office, and what you've been able to 34 00:02:03,520 --> 00:02:09,800 Speaker 1: do so beautifully and so convincingly is make sure that 35 00:02:09,840 --> 00:02:14,959 Speaker 1: people understand how to connect with what Donald Trump calls 36 00:02:14,960 --> 00:02:17,600 Speaker 1: a forgotten man, forgotten woman, and forgotten child, to really 37 00:02:17,639 --> 00:02:20,080 Speaker 1: defy the naysayers and critics and make sure the people 38 00:02:20,080 --> 00:02:23,120 Speaker 1: who need to hear your message for free are hearing that. 39 00:02:23,840 --> 00:02:26,919 Speaker 1: And I do talk in the book about I met 40 00:02:26,919 --> 00:02:29,040 Speaker 1: you at Gopack. You know, when I was a baby, 41 00:02:29,080 --> 00:02:30,639 Speaker 1: I was twenty one or twenty two years old. I 42 00:02:30,639 --> 00:02:33,000 Speaker 1: took a job for eight dollars an hour with Dick Worthlin, 43 00:02:33,520 --> 00:02:36,919 Speaker 1: who was Ronald Reagan's poster. Frank Luntz, a fellow student 44 00:02:36,919 --> 00:02:39,600 Speaker 1: of mine at Oxford University of the year before, helped 45 00:02:39,639 --> 00:02:42,440 Speaker 1: me land that summer job, and they asked me if 46 00:02:42,480 --> 00:02:44,600 Speaker 1: I wanted to go to go pack. I was excited. 47 00:02:44,600 --> 00:02:46,840 Speaker 1: I got to shake your hand. I bought those cassette 48 00:02:46,840 --> 00:02:49,680 Speaker 1: tapes like other people did and listen to the messages 49 00:02:49,720 --> 00:02:52,880 Speaker 1: and you know, nude that was nineteen eighty seven or 50 00:02:52,880 --> 00:02:55,000 Speaker 1: eighty eight. I believe it was around nineteen eighty eight. 51 00:02:55,520 --> 00:02:58,880 Speaker 1: And then there it is six short years later when 52 00:02:58,919 --> 00:03:01,840 Speaker 1: you take those messages and it meets the moment, and 53 00:03:01,960 --> 00:03:04,400 Speaker 1: you have those messengers on the Capitol steps on September 54 00:03:04,400 --> 00:03:07,600 Speaker 1: twenty seventh, nineteen ninety four, signing the contract with American 55 00:03:07,680 --> 00:03:10,120 Speaker 1: I remind people this year, they say, could this be 56 00:03:10,280 --> 00:03:12,120 Speaker 1: nineteen ninety four all over again? I said, well, it 57 00:03:12,120 --> 00:03:13,680 Speaker 1: could in a couple of ways. If you have a 58 00:03:13,680 --> 00:03:16,320 Speaker 1: transformative leader like Niging or GS number one number two, 59 00:03:16,320 --> 00:03:19,240 Speaker 1: If you have these messages written down somewhere that people 60 00:03:19,280 --> 00:03:23,560 Speaker 1: can look at them, suss them, out compare what you're 61 00:03:23,560 --> 00:03:26,720 Speaker 1: getting from this man made disaster that's the Biden Harris administration. 62 00:03:27,320 --> 00:03:30,200 Speaker 1: And they believe that you are running for the right reasons. 63 00:03:30,240 --> 00:03:33,240 Speaker 1: You had a ton of brand new first time candidates 64 00:03:33,280 --> 00:03:35,320 Speaker 1: in nineteen ninety four. I think Kevin McCarthy and the 65 00:03:35,360 --> 00:03:38,360 Speaker 1: Republicans Rona mcdanie, they're doing that again now, doing such 66 00:03:38,360 --> 00:03:43,720 Speaker 1: a fantastic job recruiting first time candidates, women, minorities, veterans, 67 00:03:43,800 --> 00:03:48,000 Speaker 1: small business owners, with very diverse backgrounds and a vision 68 00:03:48,040 --> 00:03:51,640 Speaker 1: for the country. And then finally you tell people, hold 69 00:03:51,680 --> 00:03:55,240 Speaker 1: us accountable. These are not campaign promises. This is a 70 00:03:55,320 --> 00:03:57,040 Speaker 1: vision for the country, and we want to be the 71 00:03:57,120 --> 00:04:00,080 Speaker 1: architects and executors on that. And then, of course, so 72 00:04:00,120 --> 00:04:02,680 Speaker 1: all the way to your own presidential campaign. But look 73 00:04:02,760 --> 00:04:05,240 Speaker 1: in the book, I talk about nineteen eighty, nineteen ninety four, 74 00:04:05,400 --> 00:04:10,720 Speaker 1: twenty sixteen, that Donald Trump comes along twenty two years 75 00:04:10,760 --> 00:04:14,840 Speaker 1: after the Contract with America. You've got Ronald Reagan fourteen 76 00:04:14,920 --> 00:04:17,680 Speaker 1: years before that. And I think every decade or so 77 00:04:18,360 --> 00:04:21,680 Speaker 1: you have this transformative leader who's willing to do exactly that. 78 00:04:22,160 --> 00:04:25,520 Speaker 1: People feel like they are outsiders to this system. And 79 00:04:25,560 --> 00:04:28,440 Speaker 1: if you have that chief messenger, that leader who also 80 00:04:28,640 --> 00:04:31,840 Speaker 1: is outside of the system. It works. When Donald Trump 81 00:04:31,839 --> 00:04:33,960 Speaker 1: plucked me to be the campaign manager in August of 82 00:04:34,000 --> 00:04:36,960 Speaker 1: twenty sixteen, I too was an outsider. I talk in 83 00:04:36,960 --> 00:04:39,279 Speaker 1: the book something that I think professional women will relate 84 00:04:39,320 --> 00:04:44,839 Speaker 1: to very easily, which is often being shunned to the side, dismissed, 85 00:04:45,520 --> 00:04:48,680 Speaker 1: denied by some of the people in the workforce, regardless agenda, 86 00:04:48,720 --> 00:04:51,000 Speaker 1: but often by other men. And I talk about the 87 00:04:51,040 --> 00:04:54,680 Speaker 1: Republican consultancy being a walking reco violation, always the gravy 88 00:04:54,680 --> 00:04:56,760 Speaker 1: train getting each other a seat on it. And this 89 00:04:56,880 --> 00:04:59,120 Speaker 1: is something new that I think you've been a real 90 00:04:59,200 --> 00:05:01,520 Speaker 1: leader on. It is something I want your listeners to hear. 91 00:05:02,000 --> 00:05:04,760 Speaker 1: Because they give money to Republican politicis they give money 92 00:05:04,760 --> 00:05:08,880 Speaker 1: to these candid they should understand that at this stage 93 00:05:09,279 --> 00:05:13,000 Speaker 1: we want the thinkers at the consultant level to be 94 00:05:13,080 --> 00:05:20,280 Speaker 1: much like the candidates, innovators, visionaries, risk takers who have clear, convincing, compelling, persuasive, 95 00:05:20,279 --> 00:05:24,880 Speaker 1: memorable messages that expand the conservative movement and the Republican Party. 96 00:05:25,200 --> 00:05:27,080 Speaker 1: It feels great to have a number one New York 97 00:05:27,120 --> 00:05:30,040 Speaker 1: Times bestseller. I'm going to be very humble about it. 98 00:05:30,120 --> 00:05:32,200 Speaker 1: This is my memoir and my story. People always want 99 00:05:32,200 --> 00:05:34,680 Speaker 1: to know the story behind the story. It's really the 100 00:05:34,800 --> 00:05:37,480 Speaker 1: arc of my career. My personal life as well is 101 00:05:37,520 --> 00:05:40,239 Speaker 1: in there. I loved being a working mom in Donald 102 00:05:40,240 --> 00:05:42,320 Speaker 1: Trump's White House. He was a great girl boss, as 103 00:05:42,320 --> 00:05:46,599 Speaker 1: I call him. These feminists can pretend that they're pro woman. 104 00:05:46,960 --> 00:05:50,359 Speaker 1: They're only pros on women, and Donald Trump was a 105 00:05:50,360 --> 00:05:54,440 Speaker 1: great Boston Mercedes schlap Brook Rollins, Ivanka Trump, Sarah how 106 00:05:54,480 --> 00:05:57,280 Speaker 1: to be Sanders and me Between us, we have nineteen children, 107 00:05:57,839 --> 00:06:00,240 Speaker 1: twelve daughters, seven sons at the time, between the ages 108 00:06:00,240 --> 00:06:03,040 Speaker 1: at two and sixteen. Where else could we work at 109 00:06:03,080 --> 00:06:05,960 Speaker 1: that level the highest rank assistant to the president, and 110 00:06:06,040 --> 00:06:08,840 Speaker 1: be there every day and also feel like we can 111 00:06:08,880 --> 00:06:11,960 Speaker 1: be there for our children. For all the news media hostility, 112 00:06:12,400 --> 00:06:17,880 Speaker 1: there's a fascinating difference between apparently the Biden White House 113 00:06:17,920 --> 00:06:21,159 Speaker 1: as it's now being portrayed, where people are leaving, including 114 00:06:21,200 --> 00:06:24,440 Speaker 1: virtually all of their African American appointees, and saying, look, 115 00:06:24,440 --> 00:06:27,039 Speaker 1: we don't have a position of responsibility, we're not being 116 00:06:27,040 --> 00:06:31,480 Speaker 1: given an opportunity, and the disarray therein which is beginning 117 00:06:31,480 --> 00:06:33,840 Speaker 1: to actually even affect the national media. But I have 118 00:06:33,920 --> 00:06:36,160 Speaker 1: to say, we've known each other a long time. I 119 00:06:36,240 --> 00:06:39,920 Speaker 1: had no idea that when you were seven years old 120 00:06:40,600 --> 00:06:43,800 Speaker 1: you were making homemade and Peach Nixon buttons. You have 121 00:06:43,880 --> 00:06:47,719 Speaker 1: to tell this story because you obviously have politics somewhere 122 00:06:47,760 --> 00:06:50,960 Speaker 1: in your genetic bloodstream. So tell us about the seven 123 00:06:51,040 --> 00:06:54,560 Speaker 1: year old Kelly Am. Yes, well, thank you. I remember 124 00:06:54,600 --> 00:06:57,640 Speaker 1: it was the summer of nineteen seventy four, of course, 125 00:06:57,720 --> 00:07:00,160 Speaker 1: and the impeachment hearings are going on. I think I 126 00:07:00,200 --> 00:07:02,640 Speaker 1: was just angry that they were preempting the Prices Right 127 00:07:02,760 --> 00:07:04,760 Speaker 1: and Search for Tomorrow, which I used to watch with 128 00:07:04,800 --> 00:07:07,400 Speaker 1: my grandmother, God rest her soul. But no, it's funny 129 00:07:07,400 --> 00:07:08,960 Speaker 1: that you asked that. People always say, did you come 130 00:07:09,000 --> 00:07:11,720 Speaker 1: from a political family? What did your father do? And 131 00:07:11,840 --> 00:07:13,840 Speaker 1: my father left when I was three, no child support, 132 00:07:13,880 --> 00:07:16,440 Speaker 1: no alimony. But we had a loving present relationship for 133 00:07:16,440 --> 00:07:19,200 Speaker 1: forty years from the age of twelve when I met him, 134 00:07:19,400 --> 00:07:21,880 Speaker 1: till fifty two when he passed away a few years ago. News. 135 00:07:21,880 --> 00:07:25,040 Speaker 1: So that's a great story of second chances, redemption and love. 136 00:07:25,640 --> 00:07:28,840 Speaker 1: But growing up in this house with four Italian Catholic women, 137 00:07:28,920 --> 00:07:31,480 Speaker 1: my mom, her mom to my married sisters. They talked 138 00:07:31,520 --> 00:07:33,240 Speaker 1: about a lot of things, but they really didn't talk 139 00:07:33,240 --> 00:07:36,520 Speaker 1: about politics. They voted. It was their civic duty, their 140 00:07:36,520 --> 00:07:40,880 Speaker 1: constitutional right. My aunt Marie was pretty progressive, mad at 141 00:07:40,880 --> 00:07:44,480 Speaker 1: the George Herbert Walker Bush campaign for saying that Bill 142 00:07:44,560 --> 00:07:47,360 Speaker 1: Clinton was a draft dodger and was an eighth grade 143 00:07:47,400 --> 00:07:50,760 Speaker 1: public school teacher, so she probably split her vote over 144 00:07:50,800 --> 00:07:54,280 Speaker 1: the years. But in nineteen seventy four, I made these 145 00:07:54,320 --> 00:07:56,680 Speaker 1: homemade in Peach Nixon signs and buttons that I put 146 00:07:56,680 --> 00:07:59,080 Speaker 1: on my smock, And you know what, I think it's 147 00:07:59,120 --> 00:08:00,760 Speaker 1: one of the only times I ever followed the crowd, 148 00:08:00,800 --> 00:08:02,560 Speaker 1: because I sure the heck didn't know what was going on. 149 00:08:02,720 --> 00:08:04,000 Speaker 1: I didn't know what was happening in the Word of 150 00:08:04,000 --> 00:08:06,040 Speaker 1: Gate hearings. I didn't know about the breakins. We didn't 151 00:08:06,080 --> 00:08:08,240 Speaker 1: have social media then, but you know new I like 152 00:08:08,320 --> 00:08:11,160 Speaker 1: to say that I was raised to be a conservative 153 00:08:11,920 --> 00:08:15,000 Speaker 1: without ever having a single political conversation that I can recall. 154 00:08:15,080 --> 00:08:19,080 Speaker 1: I think that's very common in America, where you are 155 00:08:19,520 --> 00:08:24,520 Speaker 1: moored with family, faith, freedom, limited governments, small business owners 156 00:08:24,520 --> 00:08:29,200 Speaker 1: all around you, veterans, military, military spouses in our family, 157 00:08:29,920 --> 00:08:34,000 Speaker 1: understanding that this is the greatest country in the world 158 00:08:34,320 --> 00:08:36,920 Speaker 1: in history. And I thank God every day that my 159 00:08:36,920 --> 00:08:39,760 Speaker 1: ancestors chose to come to America as opposed to everywhere else, 160 00:08:39,760 --> 00:08:42,079 Speaker 1: and you know, many ways we were all the fulfillment 161 00:08:42,120 --> 00:08:46,520 Speaker 1: the expansion of that legacy, and so I became a conservative. 162 00:08:46,840 --> 00:08:49,320 Speaker 1: Nobody ever had a political conversation met Ronald Reagan very 163 00:08:49,360 --> 00:08:51,280 Speaker 1: briefly when I was seventeen, when he came to town 164 00:08:51,559 --> 00:08:54,520 Speaker 1: and was smitten, a bitten, even though another Italian Catholic woman, 165 00:08:54,559 --> 00:08:56,719 Speaker 1: Geraldine Ferraro, was on the Democratic ticket that year in 166 00:08:56,800 --> 00:09:00,520 Speaker 1: nineteen eighty four. It's just fascinating. I have to point out, 167 00:09:00,520 --> 00:09:02,680 Speaker 1: by the way, that when you were seven years old 168 00:09:02,679 --> 00:09:05,480 Speaker 1: putting on your impeach Nixon Buttons was my first race 169 00:09:05,559 --> 00:09:08,480 Speaker 1: for Congress, so sort of puts a little bit of 170 00:09:08,480 --> 00:09:11,800 Speaker 1: our age difference in context, I think. But you went 171 00:09:11,880 --> 00:09:14,840 Speaker 1: on after having met Reagan, you go on and part 172 00:09:14,840 --> 00:09:17,400 Speaker 1: of what you did was attend to Oxford University. What 173 00:09:17,640 --> 00:09:19,840 Speaker 1: was that like to go to Oxford? Well, it was 174 00:09:19,880 --> 00:09:23,400 Speaker 1: life changing. I call it the year that separated past 175 00:09:23,440 --> 00:09:26,440 Speaker 1: from future for me. And I actually remember cutting that 176 00:09:26,480 --> 00:09:28,920 Speaker 1: out of a magazine and putting it on a poster 177 00:09:29,040 --> 00:09:32,360 Speaker 1: along with lots of pictures from a year abroad, which 178 00:09:32,400 --> 00:09:35,840 Speaker 1: included a ton of travel, which many coeds do. Many 179 00:09:35,840 --> 00:09:38,960 Speaker 1: college students in high school, students undertake and that was 180 00:09:39,000 --> 00:09:40,800 Speaker 1: new for me. I mean, I had parents who never 181 00:09:40,840 --> 00:09:43,400 Speaker 1: went to college. I have parents who never traveled internationally. 182 00:09:43,400 --> 00:09:45,200 Speaker 1: It was brand new for me to even have a passport, 183 00:09:45,240 --> 00:09:49,280 Speaker 1: so tremendous opportunity. And at Oxford University I actually met 184 00:09:49,880 --> 00:09:53,760 Speaker 1: Frank Months. I met Boris Johnson through Frank, of course, 185 00:09:54,240 --> 00:09:56,680 Speaker 1: now the Prime Minister of England. And you know, Frank, 186 00:09:56,800 --> 00:09:59,360 Speaker 1: I've known since I was nineteen and I'm fifty five. 187 00:09:59,480 --> 00:10:02,600 Speaker 1: So I go way back with Franklins and I credit 188 00:10:02,720 --> 00:10:05,439 Speaker 1: him for helping me start my career in polling. And 189 00:10:05,559 --> 00:10:07,240 Speaker 1: I was a lawyer in between their clerk for a 190 00:10:07,280 --> 00:10:09,480 Speaker 1: judge Knut, but went right back into polling with Frank. 191 00:10:09,640 --> 00:10:11,280 Speaker 1: He paid me just a little bit more than the 192 00:10:11,320 --> 00:10:13,640 Speaker 1: eight dollars an hour I had received in that summer 193 00:10:13,679 --> 00:10:15,480 Speaker 1: internship at Worthlan. And then when I went out on 194 00:10:15,520 --> 00:10:19,320 Speaker 1: my own after you became Speaker of the House, I 195 00:10:19,360 --> 00:10:24,000 Speaker 1: was encouraged by people like Pat Pisella and Grover Noraquist 196 00:10:24,000 --> 00:10:27,360 Speaker 1: and John Fund and Frank himself. Pat Rooney, the founder 197 00:10:27,400 --> 00:10:30,000 Speaker 1: of the Health Savings Accounts Medical Savings Accounts, encouraged to 198 00:10:30,000 --> 00:10:32,320 Speaker 1: go out on my own and I did that, and 199 00:10:32,400 --> 00:10:34,920 Speaker 1: Frank and I remained friends and colleagues ever since. But 200 00:10:35,360 --> 00:10:37,360 Speaker 1: it was a big encouragement to do that after the 201 00:10:37,400 --> 00:10:40,680 Speaker 1: Republicans took majority control to then try to help implement 202 00:10:40,720 --> 00:10:43,880 Speaker 1: the policy. So there are lots of political posters out there. 203 00:10:44,040 --> 00:10:46,600 Speaker 1: They only want to know what voters are thinking. I 204 00:10:46,679 --> 00:10:50,160 Speaker 1: fancied myself more cultural anthropologists, trying to figure out what 205 00:10:50,280 --> 00:10:53,079 Speaker 1: everybody was thinking. How do you spend your time, your money, 206 00:10:53,080 --> 00:10:55,720 Speaker 1: what are your aspirations frustrations? And I took on a 207 00:10:55,760 --> 00:10:59,400 Speaker 1: ton of clients in non political America finding out how 208 00:10:59,440 --> 00:11:02,880 Speaker 1: people make these consumer decisions every day. We vote once 209 00:11:03,040 --> 00:11:06,720 Speaker 1: every two to four years, but we consume and make 210 00:11:06,800 --> 00:11:09,679 Speaker 1: decisions like that every single day. So trying to look 211 00:11:09,720 --> 00:11:12,640 Speaker 1: at the demography, but also you know, the situational politics. 212 00:11:12,640 --> 00:11:15,200 Speaker 1: So going to Oxford was amazing because I used it 213 00:11:15,200 --> 00:11:17,920 Speaker 1: as home basic or travel all around Europe and to 214 00:11:17,920 --> 00:11:20,559 Speaker 1: see firsthand the Wall was still up and Russia was 215 00:11:20,600 --> 00:11:24,120 Speaker 1: still the communist country before President Reagan took care of that, 216 00:11:24,200 --> 00:11:26,360 Speaker 1: you still had the effects of that all through Eastern Europe. 217 00:11:26,440 --> 00:11:29,480 Speaker 1: So fascinating time to be there and learned an awful 218 00:11:29,520 --> 00:11:32,440 Speaker 1: lot of independence. There was no social media you just 219 00:11:32,520 --> 00:11:35,080 Speaker 1: learned a great deal of independence and very please have 220 00:11:35,160 --> 00:11:37,480 Speaker 1: had that experience. I recommend it to young people. I 221 00:11:37,520 --> 00:11:40,520 Speaker 1: think it's very helpful for people to both to study 222 00:11:40,559 --> 00:11:42,480 Speaker 1: abroad and it's very helpful for people to get involved 223 00:11:42,480 --> 00:11:46,840 Speaker 1: in campaigns. But I notice, for example, that you volunteered 224 00:11:47,200 --> 00:11:49,560 Speaker 1: in eighty seven to work on Kemp's campaign. As you know, 225 00:11:49,600 --> 00:11:52,560 Speaker 1: I was very close to Jack, and Jack Kemp and 226 00:11:53,040 --> 00:11:56,120 Speaker 1: Mary Cudlow a handful of other people really created the 227 00:11:56,240 --> 00:11:59,960 Speaker 1: modern supply side economic movement with tax cuts and economic growth. 228 00:12:00,600 --> 00:12:04,079 Speaker 1: But briefly talk about that. I think your experience explains 229 00:12:04,120 --> 00:12:08,040 Speaker 1: perfectly why Jack didn't quite become president. Well, yes, I 230 00:12:08,080 --> 00:12:10,679 Speaker 1: mean it's funny she'd say that. Look, it was a 231 00:12:10,679 --> 00:12:14,000 Speaker 1: crowded field, and people are trying to talk about being 232 00:12:14,000 --> 00:12:16,800 Speaker 1: the heir apparent to the Reagan Revolution, the Reagan legacy, 233 00:12:16,800 --> 00:12:19,720 Speaker 1: of course, and felt that his own Vice president, George 234 00:12:19,720 --> 00:12:23,280 Speaker 1: Herbert Walker Bush was not the obvious heir apparent to 235 00:12:23,600 --> 00:12:26,040 Speaker 1: Sure to the Reagan Bush years, perhaps, but not to 236 00:12:26,920 --> 00:12:31,480 Speaker 1: the Reagan Kemp tax cuts, or the conservative movement the 237 00:12:31,520 --> 00:12:33,800 Speaker 1: way you and at the time they call you and others, 238 00:12:33,800 --> 00:12:36,679 Speaker 1: you know, backbenchers in the Congress. Trent Lott, and I 239 00:12:36,720 --> 00:12:38,720 Speaker 1: remember you served with the first Duncan Hunter and so 240 00:12:38,760 --> 00:12:41,760 Speaker 1: many others in Jack Kemp and Vin Webber, and it 241 00:12:41,840 --> 00:12:45,720 Speaker 1: was fascinating because I volunteered on his campaign. When I 242 00:12:45,720 --> 00:12:48,920 Speaker 1: came back from Oxford, I restarted the College Republican Club 243 00:12:48,920 --> 00:12:52,040 Speaker 1: at Trinity College. It was defunct. My friend restarted the 244 00:12:52,040 --> 00:12:55,480 Speaker 1: College Democrat Club. She was from Massachusetts, where Ducoccus would 245 00:12:55,559 --> 00:12:58,520 Speaker 1: eventually be the nominee. And I was called over to 246 00:12:58,679 --> 00:13:01,280 Speaker 1: Rayburn two two five two to his office, and I 247 00:13:01,320 --> 00:13:03,200 Speaker 1: never went back to the campaign. Instead, I worked in 248 00:13:03,200 --> 00:13:05,800 Speaker 1: his congressional office for a guy named Raoul Fernandez as 249 00:13:05,840 --> 00:13:10,120 Speaker 1: his foreign policy legislative assistant. Intern well, Jack Kemp was 250 00:13:10,240 --> 00:13:13,920 Speaker 1: leading a delegation to Central American at the time. You'll 251 00:13:13,920 --> 00:13:18,319 Speaker 1: remember the Contras in Sandinista's we alted Chamorro and Daniel Tagan. 252 00:13:18,480 --> 00:13:19,839 Speaker 1: I was in charge of doing a lot of the 253 00:13:19,840 --> 00:13:23,000 Speaker 1: administrative stuff. But I think that Kemp was never really 254 00:13:23,040 --> 00:13:30,040 Speaker 1: able to convert enough of his policy accomplishments and his stewardship, 255 00:13:30,440 --> 00:13:32,839 Speaker 1: his help of the Reagan agenda. And it's tough to 256 00:13:32,960 --> 00:13:35,280 Speaker 1: run from the House of Representatives for Congress, that's for sure, 257 00:13:35,320 --> 00:13:38,120 Speaker 1: particularly in modern politics. But I think in the end, 258 00:13:38,200 --> 00:13:41,560 Speaker 1: George Herbert Walker Bush got Reagan's third term. And let's 259 00:13:41,559 --> 00:13:44,000 Speaker 1: not forget in nineteen eighty four when I met Ronald 260 00:13:44,000 --> 00:13:46,640 Speaker 1: Reagan in Hammonton, New Jersey, Blueberry capital of the world, 261 00:13:46,760 --> 00:13:49,839 Speaker 1: new as a senior in high school. That's when New 262 00:13:49,920 --> 00:13:53,800 Speaker 1: Jersey was still a competitive state for Republican presidential knas 263 00:13:53,880 --> 00:13:56,600 Speaker 1: indeed Reagan. Bush went on to win New Jersey and 264 00:13:56,840 --> 00:14:00,280 Speaker 1: forty eight other states, all but Walter Mondale's Minnesota, all 265 00:14:00,320 --> 00:14:03,640 Speaker 1: but district of Columbia. So it's a pretty telling time. 266 00:14:03,920 --> 00:14:07,560 Speaker 1: So I think you and I had the same experience 267 00:14:07,640 --> 00:14:10,920 Speaker 1: with the Bush presidency, George Herbell Walker Bush, and that 268 00:14:11,480 --> 00:14:14,760 Speaker 1: as somebody who had been very, very supportive of Reagan, 269 00:14:15,240 --> 00:14:19,520 Speaker 1: I was astonished at how aggressively the Bush people shoved 270 00:14:19,520 --> 00:14:21,960 Speaker 1: the Reagan people out, and it was almost as though 271 00:14:21,960 --> 00:14:23,920 Speaker 1: Bush had learned nothing in the eight years. I mean, 272 00:14:24,240 --> 00:14:26,880 Speaker 1: you had a similar experience because you actually had an 273 00:14:26,880 --> 00:14:29,160 Speaker 1: opportunity after your second year in law school to go 274 00:14:29,240 --> 00:14:31,640 Speaker 1: to work at the Bush White House. You know, I 275 00:14:31,800 --> 00:14:34,480 Speaker 1: was at law school at GW. George Washington Law School, 276 00:14:34,480 --> 00:14:37,080 Speaker 1: which is blocks away from the White House, New and 277 00:14:37,120 --> 00:14:39,520 Speaker 1: I got this opportunity. I had already put my name 278 00:14:39,560 --> 00:14:42,160 Speaker 1: in to work at the Bush Quail White House, and 279 00:14:42,160 --> 00:14:44,440 Speaker 1: I'm to this moment, remained very close to the Quails, 280 00:14:44,520 --> 00:14:46,440 Speaker 1: and I'm very appreciative of the Bush family and the 281 00:14:46,520 --> 00:14:49,840 Speaker 1: remarkable public service to this country. And by the time 282 00:14:49,880 --> 00:14:51,880 Speaker 1: I came through, I was already in law school in roll. 283 00:14:51,920 --> 00:14:53,400 Speaker 1: By then, my boyfriend said, you know, well, it's not 284 00:14:53,400 --> 00:14:55,120 Speaker 1: a big enough job for you to get off your 285 00:14:55,240 --> 00:14:58,400 Speaker 1: law school trajectory in my view, and he had also 286 00:14:58,440 --> 00:15:02,360 Speaker 1: heard my experience that when I interviewed at ppo Presidential 287 00:15:02,360 --> 00:15:06,400 Speaker 1: Personnel Office, it seemed like an affirmative criterion to work 288 00:15:06,400 --> 00:15:09,720 Speaker 1: in the first Bush White House was to denounce Ronald Reagan. 289 00:15:09,840 --> 00:15:12,920 Speaker 1: I mean, it was odd litmus test, and I thought 290 00:15:12,960 --> 00:15:16,680 Speaker 1: it was at the very least new ungrateful to the 291 00:15:16,720 --> 00:15:19,360 Speaker 1: fact that Bush forty one had been the vice president 292 00:15:19,400 --> 00:15:21,960 Speaker 1: for eight years to President Reagan. But I also felt 293 00:15:22,040 --> 00:15:25,200 Speaker 1: it missed the entire conservative zeitgeist and where that was headed. 294 00:15:25,840 --> 00:15:28,120 Speaker 1: So here we are getting a job offer in the 295 00:15:28,160 --> 00:15:31,280 Speaker 1: fall of nineteen eighty nine, and then four years later 296 00:15:31,320 --> 00:15:34,240 Speaker 1: they lose to Bill Clinton, and two years after that 297 00:15:34,440 --> 00:15:38,560 Speaker 1: you come back in and reclaim that Reagan camp new 298 00:15:38,640 --> 00:15:41,440 Speaker 1: Gingridge Mantle you could actually say we were the fourth 299 00:15:41,480 --> 00:15:44,080 Speaker 1: Reagan victory. I've heard many people say it about you, 300 00:15:44,120 --> 00:15:47,239 Speaker 1: and for you, there's no question. But why the interruption 301 00:15:47,360 --> 00:15:50,640 Speaker 1: in between that called the Bush forty one presidency? Read 302 00:15:50,680 --> 00:15:54,080 Speaker 1: my lips, no new taxes. So look, we're there again, 303 00:15:54,120 --> 00:15:56,920 Speaker 1: aren't we? In that if we fail to understand what 304 00:15:57,040 --> 00:15:59,800 Speaker 1: motivates voters, we don't tell voters what's important to them. 305 00:16:00,160 --> 00:16:18,720 Speaker 1: Let them tell us what's important to them. Your anthropology 306 00:16:18,720 --> 00:16:22,680 Speaker 1: comment earlier is such a great explanation of one of 307 00:16:22,680 --> 00:16:25,480 Speaker 1: your uniquenesses. And you have a story which I don't 308 00:16:25,480 --> 00:16:26,680 Speaker 1: know if it's in the book or not. I'm going 309 00:16:26,760 --> 00:16:30,320 Speaker 1: to ask you to tell it about the meaning of 310 00:16:30,800 --> 00:16:35,680 Speaker 1: change for Americans and Applebee's at Times Square, which you 311 00:16:35,760 --> 00:16:37,720 Speaker 1: told me. It blew my mind because it was so 312 00:16:37,800 --> 00:16:40,600 Speaker 1: obvious and you could never get it in traditional polling. 313 00:16:40,840 --> 00:16:43,560 Speaker 1: So just share that for a minute. I don't remember 314 00:16:43,600 --> 00:16:45,440 Speaker 1: if it made the final editor's cut, but it's a 315 00:16:45,440 --> 00:16:47,680 Speaker 1: great story. I'm so glad that you, of all people, 316 00:16:47,680 --> 00:16:50,560 Speaker 1: would remember it. Here's how it goes. You know, I 317 00:16:50,600 --> 00:16:52,720 Speaker 1: was in Washington for twenty years from the age of eighteen. 318 00:16:52,760 --> 00:16:56,000 Speaker 1: I love Washington College, Law school, start away business George, 319 00:16:56,160 --> 00:16:58,440 Speaker 1: my husband. He's a partner many years at a law 320 00:16:58,480 --> 00:17:00,960 Speaker 1: firm in New York. So we did the commuting thing 321 00:17:01,000 --> 00:17:02,960 Speaker 1: as many couples do when we first married. When we 322 00:17:02,960 --> 00:17:04,800 Speaker 1: started to have children, we decided to pick a city, 323 00:17:05,160 --> 00:17:08,719 Speaker 1: New York. One moved to New York full time, and 324 00:17:08,760 --> 00:17:10,919 Speaker 1: I said, I'm not going to begrudge the city anymore 325 00:17:10,920 --> 00:17:13,560 Speaker 1: and think it's just chaotic, filled with unhappy people who 326 00:17:13,600 --> 00:17:16,800 Speaker 1: were black clothes all year long, including in the summer. 327 00:17:17,240 --> 00:17:20,080 Speaker 1: I'm going to learn the city. And I was walking 328 00:17:20,119 --> 00:17:22,480 Speaker 1: in Times Square one day, running to a meeting in 329 00:17:22,520 --> 00:17:25,000 Speaker 1: the Reuters Building. My client at the time is Liz Claiborne, 330 00:17:25,160 --> 00:17:28,040 Speaker 1: the fashion company, and I was walking there and I 331 00:17:28,040 --> 00:17:30,600 Speaker 1: turned the corner and I was met in Times Square, 332 00:17:30,760 --> 00:17:37,320 Speaker 1: New York with Applebee's Olive Garden, Babbam Shrimp, Sabarrow's, the 333 00:17:37,400 --> 00:17:40,720 Speaker 1: largest coldstone creamer you'll see anywhere. And I said, Wow, 334 00:17:40,760 --> 00:17:44,639 Speaker 1: how could this be? How is it that America saves 335 00:17:44,720 --> 00:17:46,920 Speaker 1: up its money, comes to the big city to get 336 00:17:46,920 --> 00:17:49,159 Speaker 1: the New York experience and does exactly what they do 337 00:17:49,280 --> 00:17:52,560 Speaker 1: back home, goes to Applebee's Olive Garden. Turns out that 338 00:17:52,600 --> 00:17:56,320 Speaker 1: Olive Garden has a plaque the world's largest olive garden 339 00:17:56,600 --> 00:17:58,800 Speaker 1: and it's about four stories. Can you imagine the rent 340 00:17:58,800 --> 00:18:01,440 Speaker 1: in Times Square for this? And it made me think 341 00:18:02,040 --> 00:18:04,240 Speaker 1: we are who we are. We love to say we 342 00:18:04,320 --> 00:18:08,119 Speaker 1: are revolutionaries, we are change makers, we are independent thinkers. 343 00:18:08,200 --> 00:18:11,480 Speaker 1: Nobody owns us, and yet what do we do. We 344 00:18:11,600 --> 00:18:13,879 Speaker 1: go to McDonald's every night in the minivan and we 345 00:18:13,960 --> 00:18:16,359 Speaker 1: ordered number three. We've made it so easy just to 346 00:18:16,400 --> 00:18:18,600 Speaker 1: be creatures of our own habit that you don't have 347 00:18:18,640 --> 00:18:22,280 Speaker 1: to articulate the sandwich, just the size of the fries 348 00:18:22,320 --> 00:18:25,680 Speaker 1: and the flavor of the drink. And I tell people 349 00:18:25,680 --> 00:18:28,120 Speaker 1: all the time, if you go to Times Square, don't 350 00:18:28,119 --> 00:18:30,479 Speaker 1: do what you do at home. Go to Joe's Pizza. 351 00:18:30,560 --> 00:18:32,680 Speaker 1: You get two slices for five bucks, and you keep 352 00:18:32,720 --> 00:18:36,159 Speaker 1: walking and you see great stuff in New York. But 353 00:18:36,320 --> 00:18:38,800 Speaker 1: it tells you something about human nature. And look, I 354 00:18:38,960 --> 00:18:42,480 Speaker 1: give Americans credit. In two thousand and eight, they did 355 00:18:42,480 --> 00:18:45,200 Speaker 1: something they've never done before, shut first African American president. 356 00:18:45,240 --> 00:18:47,359 Speaker 1: I think that's wonderful in our nation's history. I voted 357 00:18:47,359 --> 00:18:50,880 Speaker 1: against him, but I'm glad that this country voted for him. 358 00:18:51,280 --> 00:18:53,640 Speaker 1: For Barack Obama many ways, but they took a chance 359 00:18:53,640 --> 00:18:56,280 Speaker 1: on someone who had very limited political experience. In fact, 360 00:18:56,400 --> 00:19:00,280 Speaker 1: it was an affirmative positive criterion for Barack Obama against 361 00:19:00,320 --> 00:19:02,879 Speaker 1: Hillary Clinton. Eight years later, the next time we have 362 00:19:02,880 --> 00:19:05,240 Speaker 1: an open presidential election, they do the same darned thing. 363 00:19:05,800 --> 00:19:08,360 Speaker 1: They go for a guy who had no political experience 364 00:19:08,400 --> 00:19:12,399 Speaker 1: whatsoever against Hillary again. And I give the country credit 365 00:19:12,440 --> 00:19:15,000 Speaker 1: because all of a sudden, newt you tapped into it 366 00:19:15,040 --> 00:19:17,679 Speaker 1: in nineteen ninety four, but you had a nationalized at 367 00:19:17,720 --> 00:19:20,399 Speaker 1: election and you had to recruit dozens and dozens of 368 00:19:20,520 --> 00:19:23,600 Speaker 1: excellent outsider candidates. At the presidential level, it's harder to 369 00:19:23,640 --> 00:19:26,639 Speaker 1: do because we want our chief executives to have a 370 00:19:26,680 --> 00:19:28,840 Speaker 1: ton of experience, who want them to come pre verified, 371 00:19:28,880 --> 00:19:30,600 Speaker 1: and all of a sudden, the country and oh eight, 372 00:19:30,600 --> 00:19:33,679 Speaker 1: but especially in sixteen with Donald J. Trump said, you 373 00:19:33,720 --> 00:19:36,280 Speaker 1: know what the heck with it? Yes, these other people 374 00:19:36,280 --> 00:19:38,040 Speaker 1: have more experienced. Hillary has a ton of it, but 375 00:19:38,040 --> 00:19:40,800 Speaker 1: it's all the wrong experience, and experience tends to corrupt 376 00:19:41,320 --> 00:19:44,639 Speaker 1: and it tends to distance yourself from the citizenry. And 377 00:19:44,720 --> 00:19:47,640 Speaker 1: they said about President Trump, I think there's a guy 378 00:19:47,800 --> 00:19:50,400 Speaker 1: I know who he is. He's not a total stranger 379 00:19:50,440 --> 00:19:52,880 Speaker 1: to me. But Donald Trump ended up becoming the wish 380 00:19:52,920 --> 00:19:56,280 Speaker 1: fulfillment presidentially of what voters had told polsters for decades. 381 00:19:56,800 --> 00:19:59,320 Speaker 1: I went, someone who has a ton of experience but 382 00:19:59,440 --> 00:20:03,160 Speaker 1: no connection into Washington and it's pretty remarkable. But I'm 383 00:20:03,160 --> 00:20:05,000 Speaker 1: glad you remember that. By the way, I've shared that 384 00:20:05,080 --> 00:20:09,160 Speaker 1: story with Cardinal Dolan in New York City, a friend 385 00:20:09,160 --> 00:20:12,080 Speaker 1: of ours, because I mentioned the Abercrombie and Fitch one day. 386 00:20:12,400 --> 00:20:16,040 Speaker 1: It's across from his residence. It's Caddy Corner to Saint Patrick's, 387 00:20:16,400 --> 00:20:18,119 Speaker 1: and I said, could you imagine if you had a 388 00:20:18,200 --> 00:20:20,560 Speaker 1: line out the door of Saint Patrick's that they have 389 00:20:20,680 --> 00:20:24,080 Speaker 1: for an eighty dollars T shirt at Abercrombie and Fitch. 390 00:20:24,480 --> 00:20:27,679 Speaker 1: But anyhow, we all should be aware of human nature. 391 00:20:27,840 --> 00:20:30,040 Speaker 1: And you know what people ask me, don't people lie 392 00:20:30,040 --> 00:20:32,240 Speaker 1: to polsters? And I say, well, sure, they lie to posters, 393 00:20:32,240 --> 00:20:35,760 Speaker 1: but remember they're lying to themselves through posters, and you 394 00:20:35,840 --> 00:20:38,200 Speaker 1: have to be able to suss that out, make people 395 00:20:38,240 --> 00:20:42,440 Speaker 1: feel comfortable to tell you that they're not sure about 396 00:20:42,480 --> 00:20:44,800 Speaker 1: this the other own policy. And if people say to 397 00:20:44,840 --> 00:20:47,639 Speaker 1: you two and a half years before the next presidential election, 398 00:20:47,840 --> 00:20:50,960 Speaker 1: I don't know except that don't push them. Which way 399 00:20:50,960 --> 00:20:52,960 Speaker 1: do you lean if you had to do it today. No, 400 00:20:53,440 --> 00:20:55,640 Speaker 1: I don't know. Is a very rich insight, and it's 401 00:20:55,640 --> 00:20:59,440 Speaker 1: one that many of us possess. Well, you know what's amazing. 402 00:21:00,359 --> 00:21:04,560 Speaker 1: You had great experience, but then, as a young woman 403 00:21:04,640 --> 00:21:07,840 Speaker 1: in a very tough industry, you started your own polling 404 00:21:07,880 --> 00:21:11,240 Speaker 1: company at twenty eight, which ought to be an inspiration 405 00:21:11,320 --> 00:21:14,000 Speaker 1: to virtually every young woman in the country that if 406 00:21:14,000 --> 00:21:16,280 Speaker 1: you have gumption and you're smart and you work hard, 407 00:21:16,680 --> 00:21:19,359 Speaker 1: the skies the limit. As a young woman in the 408 00:21:19,359 --> 00:21:23,280 Speaker 1: Republican Party of generation ago, you were faced with the 409 00:21:23,359 --> 00:21:27,200 Speaker 1: real problem, precisely because so many of the old lion 410 00:21:27,320 --> 00:21:31,760 Speaker 1: Republicans just assumed automatically that if you're an attractive woman, 411 00:21:32,119 --> 00:21:34,399 Speaker 1: you can't be taken seriously. And of course, with your 412 00:21:34,480 --> 00:21:37,320 Speaker 1: law would that help. But you really showed a lot 413 00:21:37,359 --> 00:21:40,960 Speaker 1: of courage going out on your own, becoming an entrepreneur 414 00:21:41,359 --> 00:21:45,080 Speaker 1: and convincing people that you're a principle, you're not a subordinate. 415 00:21:45,560 --> 00:21:47,879 Speaker 1: What was that like to go out and have to 416 00:21:47,960 --> 00:21:50,560 Speaker 1: pitch great point? And I want to say to those 417 00:21:50,720 --> 00:21:54,360 Speaker 1: young women that you just encouraged and mentored without realizing 418 00:21:54,359 --> 00:21:56,040 Speaker 1: it by saying you two can do this, they can 419 00:21:56,080 --> 00:22:00,400 Speaker 1: do it. But there's one other criterion. That's importants are 420 00:22:00,400 --> 00:22:02,800 Speaker 1: people who are willing to lose. You have to be 421 00:22:02,840 --> 00:22:05,959 Speaker 1: willing to risk failure to succeed, Newt. And that's not 422 00:22:06,000 --> 00:22:08,960 Speaker 1: in a hallmark card, that's in life lessons. I have 423 00:22:09,080 --> 00:22:11,359 Speaker 1: learned far more from the agony of defeat than I 424 00:22:11,400 --> 00:22:13,359 Speaker 1: have the thrill of victory. And I have had plenty 425 00:22:13,359 --> 00:22:16,639 Speaker 1: of both. But if you're not afraid to fail, you 426 00:22:16,720 --> 00:22:19,679 Speaker 1: might just succeed. And you know that firsthand. So you 427 00:22:19,760 --> 00:22:21,639 Speaker 1: ran for Congress in seventy four? Did you win? No? 428 00:22:21,840 --> 00:22:23,679 Speaker 1: Did you win the next time? No? We know the 429 00:22:23,760 --> 00:22:26,000 Speaker 1: arc of it. Bill Clinton won an eighty lost in 430 00:22:26,040 --> 00:22:29,320 Speaker 1: eighty two. Everybody should know. Ronald Reagan lost the first 431 00:22:29,320 --> 00:22:31,600 Speaker 1: time he ran for government. He lost in nineteen seventy 432 00:22:31,600 --> 00:22:34,800 Speaker 1: six million Proposition one, the big anti tax movement lost, 433 00:22:35,040 --> 00:22:38,399 Speaker 1: but then Proposition thirteen pass. I think that message for 434 00:22:38,440 --> 00:22:41,800 Speaker 1: everybody is you gotta lose. John F. Kennedy lost. I 435 00:22:41,800 --> 00:22:44,480 Speaker 1: think for class president, you have to be willing to 436 00:22:44,520 --> 00:22:47,159 Speaker 1: take those chances and lose. What was it like to 437 00:22:47,200 --> 00:22:49,600 Speaker 1: be twenty eight pitching business in Washington? We first of all, 438 00:22:49,640 --> 00:22:52,080 Speaker 1: it helped to have a law degree, even though I 439 00:22:52,080 --> 00:22:54,399 Speaker 1: didn't want to practice law. It was an affirmative credential, 440 00:22:55,000 --> 00:22:57,680 Speaker 1: and that credential in a city like Washington, which onlike 441 00:22:57,720 --> 00:23:01,679 Speaker 1: so many other cities, does not revere youth and energy 442 00:23:01,760 --> 00:23:05,919 Speaker 1: quite the same way Boston, Philly, San Francisco, Miami do. 443 00:23:06,720 --> 00:23:11,159 Speaker 1: Washington is a place where seniority rules, where longevity is 444 00:23:11,240 --> 00:23:15,160 Speaker 1: power and position. It sort of prefers the bald heads 445 00:23:15,160 --> 00:23:17,359 Speaker 1: and the gray heads. I'd like to say, and that's fine, 446 00:23:17,400 --> 00:23:19,200 Speaker 1: But I knew that, and so I had to have 447 00:23:19,240 --> 00:23:23,080 Speaker 1: some market distinction, you know what. New When I was pitching, 448 00:23:23,680 --> 00:23:26,360 Speaker 1: I wasn't afraid to be told no. I was disappointed, 449 00:23:26,800 --> 00:23:30,040 Speaker 1: but I also wasn't afraid to say yes. If someone asks, 450 00:23:30,119 --> 00:23:32,800 Speaker 1: can you stay later? Can you work this weekend? Can 451 00:23:32,840 --> 00:23:35,320 Speaker 1: you fly to St? Louis? Raise your hand and say yes. 452 00:23:36,040 --> 00:23:38,119 Speaker 1: If you keep saying no, people do not see you 453 00:23:38,160 --> 00:23:42,280 Speaker 1: as dependable and reliable and competent. But learn to accept 454 00:23:42,359 --> 00:23:44,920 Speaker 1: the word no, particularly when you're younger and just starting out, 455 00:23:44,960 --> 00:23:47,080 Speaker 1: You will be rejected. You will be passed over. Someone 456 00:23:47,080 --> 00:23:49,360 Speaker 1: will win that pitch. Who you think is not as 457 00:23:49,359 --> 00:23:51,639 Speaker 1: good a polster as you are, or not as smart 458 00:23:51,640 --> 00:23:54,639 Speaker 1: as you are, didn't deserve the promotion. It's okay. Smile 459 00:23:54,720 --> 00:23:57,160 Speaker 1: through it and when they fail, you'll be right there 460 00:23:57,200 --> 00:23:58,800 Speaker 1: to get the project the next time. The other thing 461 00:23:58,800 --> 00:24:02,400 Speaker 1: that helped me see Ann made me an offer as 462 00:24:02,400 --> 00:24:05,480 Speaker 1: their quote, this was what the chiron said, new generation 463 00:24:05,840 --> 00:24:10,639 Speaker 1: X conservative political analyst. My counterpart for Eye Judea. She 464 00:24:10,880 --> 00:24:13,879 Speaker 1: was the Generation X liberal political analyst. You would never 465 00:24:13,920 --> 00:24:17,359 Speaker 1: see these chirons now. But what CNN did in putting 466 00:24:17,359 --> 00:24:19,959 Speaker 1: me on TV in nineteen ninety six was I had 467 00:24:20,040 --> 00:24:23,639 Speaker 1: one on one audience with important people like you and 468 00:24:23,840 --> 00:24:26,359 Speaker 1: United States senators and candidates and directors of marketing all 469 00:24:26,400 --> 00:24:29,960 Speaker 1: across corporate America, and no longer come I competitors say 470 00:24:30,080 --> 00:24:32,360 Speaker 1: oh you don't want to hire her, or roll their eyes. 471 00:24:32,400 --> 00:24:33,880 Speaker 1: They'd say, I don't know. I saw her on TV 472 00:24:33,960 --> 00:24:35,760 Speaker 1: last night. She made two points I hadn't thought of. 473 00:24:36,560 --> 00:24:38,240 Speaker 1: And so not everybody's going to be able to get 474 00:24:38,240 --> 00:24:39,959 Speaker 1: on TV and have that private audience. But you can 475 00:24:40,000 --> 00:24:42,840 Speaker 1: do other things to get noticed. You can start a 476 00:24:42,840 --> 00:24:47,280 Speaker 1: great nonprofit. You can write an op ed. Don't lose 477 00:24:47,320 --> 00:24:49,600 Speaker 1: the power of the written word. Everybody, just because everything 478 00:24:49,680 --> 00:24:51,760 Speaker 1: is type now and texted. You write an op ed 479 00:24:51,960 --> 00:24:54,400 Speaker 1: for eight hundred words that makes sense and has four 480 00:24:54,480 --> 00:24:57,800 Speaker 1: great solutions in it, you will be noticed. I have 481 00:24:57,840 --> 00:24:59,560 Speaker 1: to say one of the things we did that because 482 00:24:59,600 --> 00:25:02,640 Speaker 1: remember I not only lost twice before I won the seat, 483 00:25:03,200 --> 00:25:06,159 Speaker 1: but I began the project to be a majority in 484 00:25:06,240 --> 00:25:09,960 Speaker 1: December of seventy eight. So we lost in eighty two, 485 00:25:10,119 --> 00:25:12,720 Speaker 1: eighty four, eighty six, eighty eight, ninety ninety two, and 486 00:25:12,800 --> 00:25:16,159 Speaker 1: we coined the term cheerful persistence. That's the only way 487 00:25:16,200 --> 00:25:18,560 Speaker 1: to explain what we were doing. But I have to 488 00:25:18,560 --> 00:25:21,320 Speaker 1: ask you again something I did not know until the book. 489 00:25:21,400 --> 00:25:24,600 Speaker 1: As well as I've known you, you actually first met 490 00:25:24,640 --> 00:25:27,800 Speaker 1: Trump on a condominium board when you were living in 491 00:25:27,840 --> 00:25:30,800 Speaker 1: one of his condos. I'm very curious the first time 492 00:25:30,840 --> 00:25:34,040 Speaker 1: you met him, what was your impression. My impression was, 493 00:25:34,440 --> 00:25:36,600 Speaker 1: does he really come to all the condo meetings? That's 494 00:25:36,600 --> 00:25:39,560 Speaker 1: exactly what I said. What happened, nude, is that George 495 00:25:39,560 --> 00:25:41,720 Speaker 1: and I bought a unit in Trump will Tower as 496 00:25:41,720 --> 00:25:43,800 Speaker 1: we were getting married in two thousand and one, wasn't 497 00:25:43,800 --> 00:25:47,159 Speaker 1: even built yet, moved in December of that year, splitting 498 00:25:47,160 --> 00:25:51,200 Speaker 1: our time between Washington, New York. So by two thousand 499 00:25:51,200 --> 00:25:53,040 Speaker 1: and six or so, we're pretty much there full time. 500 00:25:53,160 --> 00:25:56,360 Speaker 1: And George and a guy named Michael Cohen that one 501 00:25:56,960 --> 00:26:01,320 Speaker 1: helped Donald Trump beat back challenge by some of the 502 00:26:01,400 --> 00:26:04,320 Speaker 1: residents who wanted to change the name on the building. 503 00:26:04,400 --> 00:26:07,760 Speaker 1: Wanted to do some things anyway. Michael Cohen and George 504 00:26:07,760 --> 00:26:10,480 Speaker 1: then get big offers from Donald Trump. Michael Cohen comes 505 00:26:10,480 --> 00:26:13,040 Speaker 1: in as his special counsel and the executive vice president. 506 00:26:13,200 --> 00:26:16,280 Speaker 1: So George is offered a spot on the newly configured 507 00:26:16,320 --> 00:26:19,640 Speaker 1: condo board. And George says to Donald Trump and this 508 00:26:19,640 --> 00:26:22,600 Speaker 1: woman Sonya who works with him, I'm not going to 509 00:26:22,640 --> 00:26:24,200 Speaker 1: do that, but I bet my wife Kelly am Wood. 510 00:26:24,240 --> 00:26:26,040 Speaker 1: So they call his wife Kelly Ann, and I say, sure, 511 00:26:26,520 --> 00:26:28,040 Speaker 1: I'll do it. And I sat on the board for 512 00:26:28,080 --> 00:26:31,520 Speaker 1: eight years and I met Donald Trump. I went to 513 00:26:31,560 --> 00:26:33,880 Speaker 1: the first board meeting in Trump Tower and I got 514 00:26:33,880 --> 00:26:36,520 Speaker 1: there little early, minding my own business with my tab binder, 515 00:26:36,560 --> 00:26:39,640 Speaker 1: ready to go, and I hear his voice. I didn't 516 00:26:39,640 --> 00:26:41,000 Speaker 1: even know if he was in New York that day. 517 00:26:41,000 --> 00:26:43,000 Speaker 1: For all I know, he's building golf courses in Scottan here. 518 00:26:43,040 --> 00:26:47,119 Speaker 1: He comes no notes, knew everything about that building and 519 00:26:47,240 --> 00:26:49,679 Speaker 1: gave us his vision. I was really impressed. And what 520 00:26:49,840 --> 00:26:52,920 Speaker 1: happened new as you know, he would call me, you know, 521 00:26:53,080 --> 00:26:54,800 Speaker 1: once twice a year, maybe two three times a year 522 00:26:54,840 --> 00:26:56,560 Speaker 1: to talk politics, or he'd see me on TV and 523 00:26:56,560 --> 00:26:58,720 Speaker 1: he'd pick up the phone. I saw you say this, 524 00:26:58,760 --> 00:27:00,240 Speaker 1: What do you think of that? Then he hied me 525 00:27:00,280 --> 00:27:03,679 Speaker 1: in two eleven to do a poll for him. He 526 00:27:03,800 --> 00:27:06,280 Speaker 1: thought seriously about running for president many times, as you know, 527 00:27:06,640 --> 00:27:08,720 Speaker 1: beginning in nineteen eighty, but in two thousand and eleven 528 00:27:08,720 --> 00:27:12,400 Speaker 1: he thought he should run against Barack Obama in the reelection. 529 00:27:12,440 --> 00:27:15,200 Speaker 1: My pole showed that would be an uphill climb, especially 530 00:27:15,240 --> 00:27:17,960 Speaker 1: because people always thought Donald Trump was not serious about 531 00:27:17,960 --> 00:27:21,640 Speaker 1: being a candidate, just serious about teasing about being a candidate. 532 00:27:22,520 --> 00:27:24,840 Speaker 1: And I told him then what I told him in 533 00:27:24,920 --> 00:27:29,439 Speaker 1: twenty fifteen, which is, until you're actually a declared candidate, 534 00:27:29,480 --> 00:27:31,199 Speaker 1: you have no idea what people really think of you, 535 00:27:31,240 --> 00:27:33,080 Speaker 1: because they say, why would Donald Trump bother with that, 536 00:27:33,119 --> 00:27:35,840 Speaker 1: He's already Donald Trump, He albody has success in fame 537 00:27:35,840 --> 00:27:38,280 Speaker 1: and power, and why would he do that? And so 538 00:27:38,560 --> 00:27:40,200 Speaker 1: in two thousand and I told it was an uphill 539 00:27:40,240 --> 00:27:43,840 Speaker 1: climb that President Obama had advantages that people really weren't 540 00:27:44,040 --> 00:27:46,679 Speaker 1: key did on enough in my view in the Republican Party. Obviously, 541 00:27:46,720 --> 00:27:49,640 Speaker 1: the Romney people all missed it. So President Trump hired 542 00:27:49,680 --> 00:27:52,720 Speaker 1: another poster our friend John McLaughlin, and he did a 543 00:27:52,760 --> 00:27:54,640 Speaker 1: poll that I think showed Trump a little bit more 544 00:27:54,680 --> 00:27:56,680 Speaker 1: within striking distance of Obama, and he liked that pole. 545 00:27:56,800 --> 00:27:58,920 Speaker 1: But anyway, the rest is history, and John and I 546 00:27:58,960 --> 00:28:01,879 Speaker 1: have both done work for him. What I appreciated was 547 00:28:02,119 --> 00:28:05,159 Speaker 1: even in twenty eleven, but mister Trump sharing with me 548 00:28:05,200 --> 00:28:06,880 Speaker 1: a couple of stories about his vision. I mean, here's 549 00:28:06,920 --> 00:28:09,400 Speaker 1: a guy talking about China. Then here's a guy talking 550 00:28:09,440 --> 00:28:12,120 Speaker 1: about immigration, then here's a guy talking about trade. Then 551 00:28:12,359 --> 00:28:16,479 Speaker 1: and not unlike your contract with American seventeen years before that, 552 00:28:16,920 --> 00:28:19,760 Speaker 1: Donald Trump was also like you were doing. He was 553 00:28:19,800 --> 00:28:23,960 Speaker 1: taking issues that were mired in single digits and elevating 554 00:28:24,000 --> 00:28:28,159 Speaker 1: them to the top. Too many quote leaders are led 555 00:28:28,160 --> 00:28:31,520 Speaker 1: by the polls. Leaders have to lead people and then 556 00:28:31,520 --> 00:28:34,159 Speaker 1: it's reflected in the polls. So to take issues like 557 00:28:34,320 --> 00:28:37,880 Speaker 1: trade wasn't even ask the most polling questions and make 558 00:28:37,960 --> 00:28:40,719 Speaker 1: that an economic fairness issue. It's not fair that we're 559 00:28:40,760 --> 00:28:42,840 Speaker 1: shipping our jobs and our wealth overseas. It's not fair 560 00:28:42,880 --> 00:28:47,040 Speaker 1: that manufacturing is dying, the factories are closed, the storefronts 561 00:28:47,080 --> 00:28:49,760 Speaker 1: are blighted, and he took that to make that an 562 00:28:49,760 --> 00:28:53,120 Speaker 1: issue of economic opportunity and fairness to those who don't 563 00:28:53,120 --> 00:29:11,479 Speaker 1: have a college degree. You know, I thought part of 564 00:29:11,520 --> 00:29:15,720 Speaker 1: the brilliance of the sixteen campaign was that it was 565 00:29:15,760 --> 00:29:20,080 Speaker 1: about make America great again, not make Trump great again. 566 00:29:21,000 --> 00:29:24,400 Speaker 1: And I thought some of that was missing in twenty twenty, 567 00:29:24,560 --> 00:29:27,000 Speaker 1: that it got to be too much about Trump and 568 00:29:27,120 --> 00:29:30,360 Speaker 1: not enough about America. And I noticed a difference in 569 00:29:30,440 --> 00:29:33,280 Speaker 1: terms of your impact. I think you have an intuitive 570 00:29:33,360 --> 00:29:37,000 Speaker 1: or maybe a learned intuitive sense of where the American 571 00:29:37,080 --> 00:29:41,280 Speaker 1: people are that makes you part of this Reagan English 572 00:29:41,320 --> 00:29:43,800 Speaker 1: Trump tradition, if you will. You got to be the 573 00:29:43,920 --> 00:29:48,640 Speaker 1: campaign manager. It was an amazingly chaotic and complex campaign 574 00:29:49,040 --> 00:29:51,000 Speaker 1: close and I first talked to Trump about it, I 575 00:29:51,000 --> 00:29:54,200 Speaker 1: think in February of twenty fifteen, and it was clear 576 00:29:54,280 --> 00:29:57,000 Speaker 1: that he kind of had an insight, He had a 577 00:29:57,080 --> 00:30:00,920 Speaker 1: general direction. He also had all the weaknesses that he 578 00:30:01,000 --> 00:30:05,400 Speaker 1: still has, and so he's an inevitably controversial person. I mean, 579 00:30:05,400 --> 00:30:07,520 Speaker 1: as you were coming into the campaign and taking over 580 00:30:08,000 --> 00:30:10,320 Speaker 1: in the middle of this chaos, what did you think 581 00:30:10,440 --> 00:30:12,680 Speaker 1: was going to be the key to winning? So nude 582 00:30:12,680 --> 00:30:14,520 Speaker 1: I write about this in the opening pages of my 583 00:30:14,560 --> 00:30:17,400 Speaker 1: new memoir Here's the Deal, because I want people to 584 00:30:17,600 --> 00:30:21,280 Speaker 1: not just go into Trump's storied, famous office on the 585 00:30:21,360 --> 00:30:23,920 Speaker 1: twice sixth floor and our conversation. I wanted them to 586 00:30:24,000 --> 00:30:26,280 Speaker 1: understand a couple of things. Number one is how we 587 00:30:26,400 --> 00:30:28,960 Speaker 1: did it, and number two, most importantly, that it was 588 00:30:29,000 --> 00:30:31,040 Speaker 1: Donald Trump, not just who put me in a position, 589 00:30:31,200 --> 00:30:34,320 Speaker 1: but who said yes, I felt the three things I 590 00:30:34,360 --> 00:30:36,200 Speaker 1: asked of him, which I'll review quickly in a moment, 591 00:30:36,240 --> 00:30:38,840 Speaker 1: which is how we won. I throughout the three things 592 00:30:38,880 --> 00:30:42,200 Speaker 1: I asked of him from moment one. We're not particularly 593 00:30:42,280 --> 00:30:46,560 Speaker 1: genius points. But the difference was Donald Trump said yes. 594 00:30:46,720 --> 00:30:50,200 Speaker 1: I had shared a version of these with other campaigns, 595 00:30:50,240 --> 00:30:52,920 Speaker 1: with the Romney general election campaign, the McCain people eight 596 00:30:53,000 --> 00:30:55,400 Speaker 1: years earlier. But you know, they're all just so smart 597 00:30:55,400 --> 00:30:58,000 Speaker 1: they're going to win regardless. They don't need new advice, 598 00:30:58,000 --> 00:31:00,840 Speaker 1: fresh blood. Here's what they were said to mister Trump. 599 00:31:00,840 --> 00:31:03,400 Speaker 1: He said, well, you know, everybody says that I'm a 600 00:31:03,400 --> 00:31:05,040 Speaker 1: better candidate than Hillary. And I said, well, I think 601 00:31:05,080 --> 00:31:07,640 Speaker 1: that's empirically true, but I've looked at the polls and 602 00:31:07,680 --> 00:31:09,600 Speaker 1: she's winning. He said, oh, the polls, I said, mister Trump, 603 00:31:09,640 --> 00:31:11,360 Speaker 1: I don't know a billion things about a billion things. 604 00:31:11,480 --> 00:31:14,840 Speaker 1: I know voters, and I know consumers. We're losing the 605 00:31:14,880 --> 00:31:16,720 Speaker 1: polls now, but you don't have to right now. The 606 00:31:16,760 --> 00:31:19,600 Speaker 1: election is about you. And he said, I know I 607 00:31:19,640 --> 00:31:21,240 Speaker 1: get the best press coverage. And I said, well, you 608 00:31:21,240 --> 00:31:24,120 Speaker 1: get the most press coverage. If you can agree to 609 00:31:24,200 --> 00:31:28,440 Speaker 1: make this election more about Hillary so that it's not 610 00:31:28,520 --> 00:31:32,560 Speaker 1: just Trump or not Trump, people will be reminded everything 611 00:31:32,600 --> 00:31:35,880 Speaker 1: they don't like about her. Sixty two percent of Americans 612 00:31:35,880 --> 00:31:39,000 Speaker 1: had told the ABC News Washington Post posters they thought 613 00:31:39,080 --> 00:31:42,280 Speaker 1: Hillary Clinton was neither honest nor trustworthy. If that's true, 614 00:31:42,800 --> 00:31:45,080 Speaker 1: what can possibly follow the butt? But I think I'll 615 00:31:45,160 --> 00:31:46,560 Speaker 1: vote for her, but I want her to have the 616 00:31:46,640 --> 00:31:48,440 Speaker 1: nuclear code, but I want her to be the command 617 00:31:48,480 --> 00:31:52,040 Speaker 1: in chief. No. So we were able to tap into 618 00:31:52,880 --> 00:31:56,960 Speaker 1: this reservoir of not just bad feeling toward Hillary, but 619 00:31:57,000 --> 00:32:01,440 Speaker 1: there's suspicion that she did think that we're irredeemable and deplorable. 620 00:32:01,600 --> 00:32:03,360 Speaker 1: And then she said the quiet part out loud, that 621 00:32:03,680 --> 00:32:07,600 Speaker 1: there had been corrupt activities in smashing cell phones, or 622 00:32:08,040 --> 00:32:10,360 Speaker 1: letting this one of that one into the State department, 623 00:32:10,440 --> 00:32:13,840 Speaker 1: or giving uranium benefits to rise. So he was able 624 00:32:13,880 --> 00:32:16,120 Speaker 1: to tap into that because she was the true insider 625 00:32:16,600 --> 00:32:20,320 Speaker 1: and new females in politics are usually not the insiders. 626 00:32:20,840 --> 00:32:23,000 Speaker 1: That's changed now obviously we have Pelosi and the rest 627 00:32:23,000 --> 00:32:25,600 Speaker 1: of it that they're usually seen as the outsiders, fresh blood, 628 00:32:25,920 --> 00:32:31,720 Speaker 1: new face, incorruptible, beyond reproach, more ethical, consensus builders, unifiers. 629 00:32:31,880 --> 00:32:33,960 Speaker 1: Nobody saw Hillary Clinton that way, so that was a 630 00:32:34,000 --> 00:32:37,320 Speaker 1: benefit for us. Number two, I said to President Trump, 631 00:32:37,320 --> 00:32:38,920 Speaker 1: and we need to do this again, Nude, this is 632 00:32:38,920 --> 00:32:41,520 Speaker 1: advisable for twenty twenty four. It was missed in twenty twenty. 633 00:32:41,880 --> 00:32:44,160 Speaker 1: I said her blue wall is real. Let's focus on 634 00:32:44,200 --> 00:32:46,720 Speaker 1: the states probably ten or eleven at the time. Let's 635 00:32:46,720 --> 00:32:50,920 Speaker 1: focus on the states that Obama Biden won twice with 636 00:32:50,960 --> 00:32:53,520 Speaker 1: more than fifty percent of the vote, where Hillary is 637 00:32:53,560 --> 00:32:56,560 Speaker 1: not above fifty percent and staying there in any credible polling. 638 00:32:56,640 --> 00:33:00,120 Speaker 1: And Number three, most importantly, Nude, that ever Republican had 639 00:33:00,120 --> 00:33:03,000 Speaker 1: one statewide for governor and or a senator. So I'm 640 00:33:03,000 --> 00:33:05,480 Speaker 1: not talking about Oregon or Washington State. I am talking 641 00:33:05,480 --> 00:33:09,200 Speaker 1: about Wisconsin, Michigan, Iowa, Ohio, Pennsylvania, North Carolina, Florida, in 642 00:33:09,200 --> 00:33:11,959 Speaker 1: the Vatta, Colorado, some which we didn't win, but we 643 00:33:11,960 --> 00:33:14,000 Speaker 1: were able to focus on that because they're not allergic 644 00:33:14,040 --> 00:33:16,440 Speaker 1: to Republican leadership. In fact, when it comes to choosing 645 00:33:16,440 --> 00:33:20,840 Speaker 1: a chief executive or a senator, they went Republican. And 646 00:33:20,880 --> 00:33:22,600 Speaker 1: then I'll also asked him if I can look at 647 00:33:22,600 --> 00:33:24,760 Speaker 1: the data differently, if we can ask some questions that 648 00:33:24,760 --> 00:33:28,720 Speaker 1: weren't just a straight up silly demographic questions. Everybody can 649 00:33:28,760 --> 00:33:31,959 Speaker 1: do that, dude. He said yes to all three, and 650 00:33:32,000 --> 00:33:33,600 Speaker 1: I also told him we needed somebody else in the 651 00:33:33,640 --> 00:33:36,160 Speaker 1: c suite. Ended up being se Batton. I think even 652 00:33:36,160 --> 00:33:40,600 Speaker 1: more importantly, Dave Bossy as a deputy campaign manager. Brilliant strategists, 653 00:33:40,600 --> 00:33:43,120 Speaker 1: and you know Bannon was very helpful obviously too, but 654 00:33:43,440 --> 00:33:46,680 Speaker 1: he said yes to everything right away. Who does that? Why, 655 00:33:46,640 --> 00:33:48,040 Speaker 1: I can tell you who doesn't do that. They met 656 00:33:48,120 --> 00:33:51,320 Speaker 1: Romney people, the John McCain people, the Jebush people. And 657 00:33:51,360 --> 00:33:53,200 Speaker 1: so thank you for giving me the time to answer 658 00:33:53,200 --> 00:33:56,920 Speaker 1: that question strategically with the facts, because we need to 659 00:33:56,960 --> 00:34:00,959 Speaker 1: take that lesson and go forward again. Those states were 660 00:34:01,000 --> 00:34:04,560 Speaker 1: still swing states that people are still very divided in 661 00:34:04,680 --> 00:34:07,800 Speaker 1: terms of Republican or Democrat for their elected officials, and 662 00:34:07,840 --> 00:34:09,480 Speaker 1: we will be looking at those same states again in 663 00:34:09,480 --> 00:34:13,080 Speaker 1: twenty twenty four. Let me ask one question about the election. 664 00:34:13,520 --> 00:34:16,400 Speaker 1: I thought the most amazing single moment of the campaign 665 00:34:17,200 --> 00:34:19,560 Speaker 1: was right after the Sports Talk thing had come out, 666 00:34:19,600 --> 00:34:22,640 Speaker 1: and everything was difficult and some Republicans were saying he 667 00:34:22,640 --> 00:34:25,160 Speaker 1: ought to get off the ticket, etc. And he was 668 00:34:25,239 --> 00:34:29,239 Speaker 1: faced with the debate with Hillary, and he ends up 669 00:34:29,239 --> 00:34:33,160 Speaker 1: with the four women who had accused Bill of sexual assault. 670 00:34:34,160 --> 00:34:36,560 Speaker 1: I don't know if this was too confidential, but who 671 00:34:36,800 --> 00:34:41,000 Speaker 1: thought of that? I mean, that was such a positioning 672 00:34:41,520 --> 00:34:45,319 Speaker 1: that just stripped away everything that Hillary had planned to do. 673 00:34:46,040 --> 00:34:48,919 Speaker 1: I watched it that night and I thought, Wow, talk 674 00:34:48,960 --> 00:34:52,680 Speaker 1: about guts. It was gutsy and it paid off. I 675 00:34:52,719 --> 00:34:55,200 Speaker 1: think in many ways my conversation with the President of 676 00:34:55,200 --> 00:34:57,279 Speaker 1: the night before billion the wee hours, he had seen 677 00:34:57,840 --> 00:35:01,319 Speaker 1: all these cable news screaming headlines smut that they're going 678 00:35:01,360 --> 00:35:03,440 Speaker 1: to force him off the ticket and embarrass him off 679 00:35:03,480 --> 00:35:06,399 Speaker 1: the ballot, extract his name the way people were taking 680 00:35:06,440 --> 00:35:08,479 Speaker 1: his name off the buildings in New York because Trump 681 00:35:08,520 --> 00:35:11,040 Speaker 1: de arranged and syndrome is real, they were going to 682 00:35:11,120 --> 00:35:12,920 Speaker 1: rip him off the ballot too. And he said, can 683 00:35:12,960 --> 00:35:15,000 Speaker 1: they do that? Basically like, oh, should we get ahead 684 00:35:15,000 --> 00:35:16,839 Speaker 1: of that? And I said, no, of course not, because 685 00:35:16,840 --> 00:35:18,560 Speaker 1: you know, Donald Trump is not a quitter. Of course, 686 00:35:18,600 --> 00:35:20,200 Speaker 1: he was going to stay and regardless, and I said, no, 687 00:35:20,239 --> 00:35:21,920 Speaker 1: they can't do that. They can't print new ballots. There 688 00:35:21,920 --> 00:35:23,960 Speaker 1: are some people who have unendorsed you. They wanted to 689 00:35:24,000 --> 00:35:26,400 Speaker 1: be Mike Pence and Paul Ryan on the ticket. But 690 00:35:26,520 --> 00:35:28,879 Speaker 1: most importantly, I'm going to break some news here. It's 691 00:35:28,880 --> 00:35:30,880 Speaker 1: not in the book. You asked who thought of that? 692 00:35:30,920 --> 00:35:33,480 Speaker 1: With the accusers? It had been thought about for the 693 00:35:33,560 --> 00:35:36,960 Speaker 1: first debate at Hofstra for September twenty six, because Mark 694 00:35:37,040 --> 00:35:40,239 Speaker 1: Cuban was going to show up and sit there as 695 00:35:40,280 --> 00:35:42,040 Speaker 1: a guest of Hillary in the front road to try 696 00:35:42,040 --> 00:35:45,120 Speaker 1: to mess with Donald Trump. And he said, well, we're 697 00:35:45,120 --> 00:35:47,040 Speaker 1: going to put somebody there, and somebody came up with 698 00:35:47,080 --> 00:35:48,759 Speaker 1: the idea of the You know, it might have been 699 00:35:48,840 --> 00:35:50,680 Speaker 1: Roger Stone, who wasn't there, but I think he was 700 00:35:50,719 --> 00:35:53,040 Speaker 1: in contact with people. Could have been Steve Bannon, Dave Bossie. 701 00:35:53,080 --> 00:35:55,799 Speaker 1: But the whole idea was to sort of like who 702 00:35:55,840 --> 00:35:59,400 Speaker 1: would really rattle Hillary? And Trump himself decided against it. 703 00:35:59,760 --> 00:36:03,440 Speaker 1: And what's fascinating about that Hofster debate on September twenty six, 704 00:36:03,560 --> 00:36:07,480 Speaker 1: knew the first debate. The second debate was October ninth, 705 00:36:07,560 --> 00:36:10,520 Speaker 1: almost two weeks later, and you have access Hollywood two 706 00:36:10,560 --> 00:36:13,720 Speaker 1: days before that. What's fascinating is go back and watch 707 00:36:14,520 --> 00:36:18,320 Speaker 1: Donald Trump had planned, if he needed to, to sort 708 00:36:18,320 --> 00:36:20,760 Speaker 1: of go after Hillary and the way she had treated 709 00:36:20,800 --> 00:36:24,680 Speaker 1: those women. So it's one thing to say President Clinton 710 00:36:25,000 --> 00:36:27,560 Speaker 1: sexually harassed or assaulted it. It's quite another to talk 711 00:36:27,600 --> 00:36:30,560 Speaker 1: about the way Hillary treated those women. Remember James Carville 712 00:36:30,600 --> 00:36:33,480 Speaker 1: famously said, you drag a twenty dollar bill through a 713 00:36:33,560 --> 00:36:36,520 Speaker 1: trailer park, you don't know what you'll find. Right before 714 00:36:36,600 --> 00:36:39,840 Speaker 1: Bill Clinton paid eight hundred thousand dollars in nineteen ninety 715 00:36:39,840 --> 00:36:43,080 Speaker 1: eight money to Paula Jones. That's a big pile of cash. 716 00:36:43,160 --> 00:36:47,319 Speaker 1: So instead, mister Trump pulled his punches. He never did 717 00:36:47,320 --> 00:36:49,040 Speaker 1: that with Hillary. He said, you know, I was going 718 00:36:49,120 --> 00:36:51,160 Speaker 1: to go there. I was going to say some things tonight, Hillary, 719 00:36:51,200 --> 00:36:53,160 Speaker 1: But I see your family sitting there. I won't do it. 720 00:36:53,520 --> 00:36:55,320 Speaker 1: People asked me about that in the spin room and 721 00:36:55,360 --> 00:36:57,640 Speaker 1: many days later, and I said, well, he was being gracious, 722 00:36:57,920 --> 00:37:01,600 Speaker 1: he's a gentleman. But some of us were disappointed that 723 00:37:01,680 --> 00:37:04,840 Speaker 1: he hadn't gone for her juggular the way we had planned, 724 00:37:04,880 --> 00:37:06,759 Speaker 1: and gone for her juggular the way she had gone 725 00:37:06,800 --> 00:37:10,480 Speaker 1: for his. Over the money his father gave him to 726 00:37:10,560 --> 00:37:15,920 Speaker 1: start his business. So guess what the right time was 727 00:37:15,960 --> 00:37:18,239 Speaker 1: the second time that you're talking about, and we were 728 00:37:18,280 --> 00:37:20,480 Speaker 1: ready for that. And I gotta tell you, Nute, I 729 00:37:20,560 --> 00:37:23,920 Speaker 1: was in the room in the pre debate press conference 730 00:37:24,400 --> 00:37:28,160 Speaker 1: with those women Kathleen Willie and Paula Jones. There they 731 00:37:28,160 --> 00:37:31,400 Speaker 1: were sitting and when you saw the young and beds, 732 00:37:31,440 --> 00:37:33,960 Speaker 1: the press that was traveling around with the Trump campaign 733 00:37:34,000 --> 00:37:35,279 Speaker 1: walk in the room, they had no idea who these 734 00:37:35,320 --> 00:37:38,040 Speaker 1: people were, no idea. I remember looking at their face. 735 00:37:38,080 --> 00:37:40,880 Speaker 1: The kid from CBS is looking like huh. And they 736 00:37:40,920 --> 00:37:42,759 Speaker 1: had no idea who these are. They're not students of 737 00:37:42,960 --> 00:37:46,200 Speaker 1: modern history, I guess. But it paid off. It paid 738 00:37:46,200 --> 00:37:48,960 Speaker 1: off because, as I said to mister Trump at the time, listen, 739 00:37:49,719 --> 00:37:53,040 Speaker 1: you said it on that tape, but Bill Clinton did it, 740 00:37:54,239 --> 00:37:56,280 Speaker 1: and there's no way we're going to let these Republicans 741 00:37:56,280 --> 00:37:59,279 Speaker 1: who are not endorsing you throw the whole damn thing 742 00:37:59,320 --> 00:38:02,040 Speaker 1: to Hillary Clint. You also at the side point, I 743 00:38:02,080 --> 00:38:04,160 Speaker 1: just have to take a minute on with the exception 744 00:38:04,239 --> 00:38:09,000 Speaker 1: maybe of Lincoln and Andrew Jackson, nobody has had the 745 00:38:09,120 --> 00:38:14,000 Speaker 1: continuous beating that Trump has had from an entire national 746 00:38:14,080 --> 00:38:19,080 Speaker 1: establishment that from the minute he became real has been 747 00:38:19,120 --> 00:38:22,759 Speaker 1: mobilized to hate him. I recently wrote a piece where 748 00:38:22,800 --> 00:38:25,399 Speaker 1: I described, you know, if the Russian hoax had never 749 00:38:25,480 --> 00:38:28,840 Speaker 1: been perpetrated, and if the FBI and the Justice Department 750 00:38:28,840 --> 00:38:31,120 Speaker 1: had never played like it was real, you'd have had 751 00:38:31,120 --> 00:38:34,160 Speaker 1: a totally different Trump presidency. And I think it's hard 752 00:38:34,320 --> 00:38:35,960 Speaker 1: even for you and I, who we both know him 753 00:38:35,960 --> 00:38:38,200 Speaker 1: and closer really likes him a lot, and we knew 754 00:38:38,280 --> 00:38:41,480 Speaker 1: him about at the club here in Washington. The notion 755 00:38:41,560 --> 00:38:44,960 Speaker 1: of all the things he's endured to serve the country 756 00:38:45,640 --> 00:38:49,799 Speaker 1: is astonishing. And despite everything the media has done so 757 00:38:49,880 --> 00:38:53,200 Speaker 1: far in this off year, Trump has endorsed one hundred 758 00:38:53,239 --> 00:38:56,319 Speaker 1: and eighty seven candidates. They've had one hundred and two 759 00:38:56,640 --> 00:39:00,160 Speaker 1: decisions so far in primaries his side one nine even 760 00:39:00,320 --> 00:39:02,960 Speaker 1: lost seven from a ninety three percent. I don't know 761 00:39:02,960 --> 00:39:06,920 Speaker 1: if any person out of office who has had that 762 00:39:07,040 --> 00:39:10,400 Speaker 1: kind of nationwide impact. What do you think that means? 763 00:39:10,960 --> 00:39:14,760 Speaker 1: It means the America First Agenda is the right agenda. 764 00:39:14,880 --> 00:39:17,359 Speaker 1: And we already knew that book. It's been brought into 765 00:39:17,400 --> 00:39:22,200 Speaker 1: sharp relief newt with this Biden Harris Man made disaster 766 00:39:22,280 --> 00:39:24,720 Speaker 1: of a White House. I almost feel like they're governing 767 00:39:24,719 --> 00:39:28,120 Speaker 1: on spite. So clearly they're the Keystone cops. They can't 768 00:39:28,160 --> 00:39:31,160 Speaker 1: get anything right. No credible messengers, no great messages, you 769 00:39:31,160 --> 00:39:36,160 Speaker 1: said earlier, A harrowing fact that something like nineteen twenty 770 00:39:36,200 --> 00:39:39,919 Speaker 1: one staffers of color have left the Biden Harris White House. 771 00:39:40,120 --> 00:39:44,080 Speaker 1: She's lost at least thirteen or fourteen senior staffers. She's 772 00:39:44,120 --> 00:39:47,280 Speaker 1: the first female vice president, first vice president of color, 773 00:39:47,360 --> 00:39:50,319 Speaker 1: female vice president of color, and she can't hold on 774 00:39:50,320 --> 00:39:52,720 Speaker 1: to staff these or dream jobs. She's turned into nightmares. 775 00:39:53,360 --> 00:39:55,319 Speaker 1: And I think part of this is but they seem 776 00:39:55,360 --> 00:39:58,239 Speaker 1: to be governing on spite. Trump did it, I'll undo it. 777 00:39:58,360 --> 00:40:01,440 Speaker 1: Trump liked it, I hate it. And they don't realize 778 00:40:01,760 --> 00:40:05,880 Speaker 1: that being blinded by spite or Trump arrangement syndrome, or 779 00:40:05,920 --> 00:40:08,200 Speaker 1: even blaming him for your own shortcoming is no way 780 00:40:08,200 --> 00:40:11,880 Speaker 1: to run a country. And what I think about President 781 00:40:11,880 --> 00:40:14,640 Speaker 1: Trump's record in the primary so far, and some of 782 00:40:14,680 --> 00:40:18,360 Speaker 1: those losses were very unique to the candidates, and some 783 00:40:18,480 --> 00:40:21,800 Speaker 1: of them were very close losses, but the ninety three 784 00:40:21,239 --> 00:40:26,320 Speaker 1: percent record of endorsements means that people are still running 785 00:40:26,360 --> 00:40:29,279 Speaker 1: on the Donald Trump America First agenda, and you can 786 00:40:29,320 --> 00:40:31,719 Speaker 1: expect that to continue. If I'm a betting woman. I 787 00:40:31,800 --> 00:40:34,239 Speaker 1: believe he'll run again for president. I think he'd rather 788 00:40:34,280 --> 00:40:37,719 Speaker 1: announce sooner rather than later. It's great to be the kingmaker, 789 00:40:37,719 --> 00:40:39,480 Speaker 1: but it's even more fun to be the king. You 790 00:40:39,520 --> 00:40:43,520 Speaker 1: can get more done more quickly. But whoever runs, let's 791 00:40:43,520 --> 00:40:46,640 Speaker 1: just say, for whatever reason, President Trump says, no, whoever 792 00:40:46,760 --> 00:40:49,280 Speaker 1: runs will need to run on that America First agenda. 793 00:40:49,280 --> 00:40:51,759 Speaker 1: There have been very few, not even a handful of 794 00:40:51,800 --> 00:40:54,600 Speaker 1: candidates this time running as Republicans newt in the primaries 795 00:40:54,600 --> 00:40:57,160 Speaker 1: at every level in every state, who have not run 796 00:40:57,200 --> 00:40:59,720 Speaker 1: on the America First agenda. And they've lost, They've been whooped. 797 00:41:00,080 --> 00:41:01,560 Speaker 1: So it tells you an awful It tells you that 798 00:41:01,600 --> 00:41:05,080 Speaker 1: he didn't erect a traditional, conventional political campaign. He built 799 00:41:05,080 --> 00:41:08,440 Speaker 1: a movement, and it's based on policy. Forgotten man, forgotten 800 00:41:08,440 --> 00:41:12,160 Speaker 1: w a forgotten child. That's a real thing, the forgotten child. 801 00:41:12,239 --> 00:41:14,000 Speaker 1: Look at all the gains now in the school choice 802 00:41:14,000 --> 00:41:17,560 Speaker 1: and charters and educational freedom and people rejecting screen time 803 00:41:17,560 --> 00:41:20,360 Speaker 1: at school time, masking seven year olds, all of this nonsense, 804 00:41:20,400 --> 00:41:23,440 Speaker 1: the Woll curriculum. The school board elections, that is the 805 00:41:23,440 --> 00:41:26,359 Speaker 1: most elected position in our country. Roughly ninety five percent 806 00:41:26,400 --> 00:41:29,520 Speaker 1: of school board seats are elected, and we have people 807 00:41:29,600 --> 00:41:33,000 Speaker 1: running all over the country to really make a difference. 808 00:41:33,000 --> 00:41:36,200 Speaker 1: So it's been transformative. I believe it's no different than 809 00:41:36,800 --> 00:41:39,279 Speaker 1: you know, when you left Congress, you left the speakership, 810 00:41:39,520 --> 00:41:41,279 Speaker 1: and nobody said, oh, good nude school, and we'll get 811 00:41:41,320 --> 00:41:44,840 Speaker 1: rid of his agenda. They continue it, and we borrowed 812 00:41:44,880 --> 00:41:47,080 Speaker 1: from an awful lot of that even in twenty sixteen. 813 00:41:47,080 --> 00:41:50,719 Speaker 1: There's no question I think people if they will get 814 00:41:50,760 --> 00:41:53,839 Speaker 1: Here's the Deal a memoir, I think they will be 815 00:41:54,360 --> 00:41:59,920 Speaker 1: opening up a very personal, very human insight into politics. 816 00:42:00,440 --> 00:42:04,080 Speaker 1: I think it is remarkably educational and it's frankly encouraging. 817 00:42:04,600 --> 00:42:07,720 Speaker 1: We as a country can in fact solve all these things. 818 00:42:08,000 --> 00:42:11,560 Speaker 1: And I think that Democrats are headed towards maybe the 819 00:42:11,560 --> 00:42:15,640 Speaker 1: most stunning repudiation since nineteen twenty. But part of that 820 00:42:15,840 --> 00:42:20,880 Speaker 1: is your good sense and your intuitive understanding of humanness 821 00:42:21,440 --> 00:42:24,000 Speaker 1: that these are not numbers, that are people. And I 822 00:42:24,040 --> 00:42:26,839 Speaker 1: want to thank you for joining me, for talking so 823 00:42:26,920 --> 00:42:30,040 Speaker 1: personally about your life in politics close and I both 824 00:42:30,160 --> 00:42:33,680 Speaker 1: just love seeing you on TV and I regard you. 825 00:42:33,680 --> 00:42:35,520 Speaker 1: You know, as I don't know how to say it's 826 00:42:35,560 --> 00:42:38,200 Speaker 1: quite right, but to whatever degree you think, I have 827 00:42:38,239 --> 00:42:40,319 Speaker 1: been a mentor. I regard you as one of the 828 00:42:40,360 --> 00:42:43,120 Speaker 1: best of all my proteges. You are indeed and I 829 00:42:43,200 --> 00:42:45,279 Speaker 1: learned from you every day and God bless colisting you. 830 00:42:45,400 --> 00:42:48,719 Speaker 1: Thanks for giving me the platform today newt and look, 831 00:42:48,800 --> 00:42:52,120 Speaker 1: just to end on this, we are America. We're resilient, 832 00:42:52,480 --> 00:42:55,000 Speaker 1: we can solve these problems. I think what's different right 833 00:42:55,040 --> 00:42:58,000 Speaker 1: now is people aren't just saying it can get better, 834 00:42:58,000 --> 00:43:00,080 Speaker 1: as saying it was better not that long ago. How 835 00:43:00,120 --> 00:43:05,279 Speaker 1: do we get back there? Thank you to my guest 836 00:43:05,400 --> 00:43:07,919 Speaker 1: Kelly Ann Conway. You can get a link to buy 837 00:43:07,960 --> 00:43:10,879 Speaker 1: her new book, Here's the Deal, a Memoir on our 838 00:43:10,960 --> 00:43:14,480 Speaker 1: showpage at newtworld dot com. Newts World is produced by 839 00:43:14,480 --> 00:43:19,360 Speaker 1: Gingwidge three sixty and iHeartMedia. Our executive producer is Garnsey Slump, 840 00:43:19,760 --> 00:43:23,760 Speaker 1: our producer is Rebecca Howe, and our researcher is Rachel Peterson. 841 00:43:24,360 --> 00:43:27,520 Speaker 1: The artwork for the show was created by Steve Penley. 842 00:43:28,040 --> 00:43:30,960 Speaker 1: Special thanks to the team at Gingwidge three sixty. If 843 00:43:30,960 --> 00:43:33,560 Speaker 1: you've been enjoying Newtsworld, I hope you'll go to Apple 844 00:43:33,640 --> 00:43:37,200 Speaker 1: Podcast and both rate us with five stars and give 845 00:43:37,280 --> 00:43:40,080 Speaker 1: us a review so others can learn what it's all about. 846 00:43:40,680 --> 00:43:43,120 Speaker 1: Right now Listeners of newts World can sign up for 847 00:43:43,239 --> 00:43:47,399 Speaker 1: my three free weekly columns at Gingwidge three sixty dot 848 00:43:47,400 --> 00:43:51,759 Speaker 1: com slash newsletter. I'm Newt Gingridge. This is Newsworld