1 00:00:02,800 --> 00:00:07,120 Speaker 1: Broadcasting live from the Abraham Lincoln Radio Studio, the George 2 00:00:07,160 --> 00:00:12,480 Speaker 1: Washington Broadcast Center, Jack Armstrong, Joe Getty, arms Strong and Getty, 3 00:00:12,600 --> 00:00:19,279 Speaker 1: and he Armstrong and Getty. 4 00:00:24,960 --> 00:00:28,800 Speaker 2: US and Saudi fighter aircraft struck multiple terrorists, logistics and 5 00:00:28,880 --> 00:00:32,920 Speaker 2: weapons sites across Iraq in a strong response to over 6 00:00:33,479 --> 00:00:37,440 Speaker 2: thirty IRGC directed aerial drone attacks in the last seventy 7 00:00:37,479 --> 00:00:41,840 Speaker 2: two hours. The unwarranted attacks against US forces were not successful. 8 00:00:42,040 --> 00:00:45,199 Speaker 2: And that's the latest proof that in this newly shaped 9 00:00:45,280 --> 00:00:49,839 Speaker 2: Middle East, Saudi Arabia is on the same side as Israel. 10 00:00:50,320 --> 00:00:54,000 Speaker 3: President Trump, reacting to that Iranian attack on US forces 11 00:00:54,040 --> 00:00:57,760 Speaker 3: overnight in Jordan, President Trump tells Fox News about Iran, 12 00:00:57,920 --> 00:01:01,280 Speaker 3: we are going to beat the f s out of them. 13 00:01:01,560 --> 00:01:03,760 Speaker 3: He went on to say, we'll be hitting them hard. 14 00:01:03,880 --> 00:01:05,440 Speaker 3: They're going to get a beating. 15 00:01:06,319 --> 00:01:09,679 Speaker 4: The problem, of course, being that if you say that 16 00:01:09,920 --> 00:01:12,360 Speaker 4: every other day and then often they'll follow through on it. 17 00:01:12,440 --> 00:01:14,080 Speaker 4: The I don't know if you're familiar with the whole 18 00:01:14,160 --> 00:01:17,560 Speaker 4: Boyo cried Wolf story, but major attack on a US 19 00:01:17,640 --> 00:01:19,440 Speaker 4: military base by Iran yesterday. 20 00:01:19,520 --> 00:01:22,119 Speaker 1: Luckily we were able to defend it. But it doesn't 21 00:01:22,160 --> 00:01:25,480 Speaker 1: change the intent. I want to get into some of 22 00:01:25,520 --> 00:01:28,679 Speaker 1: the bizarre media coverage of this, but that can wait 23 00:01:28,760 --> 00:01:31,800 Speaker 1: till we discuss the basics of the situation with military 24 00:01:31,800 --> 00:01:35,320 Speaker 1: analyst Mike Lyons, who joins us now. Mike, welcome, How 25 00:01:35,360 --> 00:01:37,680 Speaker 1: are you egg one of guys back to be back? 26 00:01:38,360 --> 00:01:41,840 Speaker 1: What do you make of the attack by Iran, the 27 00:01:42,240 --> 00:01:45,119 Speaker 1: heightened involvement of various proxies around the region. Where are 28 00:01:45,160 --> 00:01:45,720 Speaker 1: we right now? 29 00:01:46,720 --> 00:01:49,320 Speaker 5: Well, you know, obviously this surprise attack takes place during 30 00:01:49,320 --> 00:01:52,400 Speaker 5: the funeral of Lindsey Graham. You know, this is just 31 00:01:52,520 --> 00:01:54,320 Speaker 5: I think it's a message in who we're dealing with 32 00:01:54,360 --> 00:01:56,400 Speaker 5: when on the raining side, and the fact that they 33 00:01:56,760 --> 00:02:00,280 Speaker 5: decided to do that. The US didn't attack when they 34 00:02:00,320 --> 00:02:04,160 Speaker 5: were doing that ceremony for Comania back then, So I 35 00:02:04,160 --> 00:02:06,320 Speaker 5: I'm surprised, but it just shows that they have a 36 00:02:06,360 --> 00:02:08,680 Speaker 5: will and have got some level of fight. I you know, 37 00:02:08,760 --> 00:02:11,760 Speaker 5: as I'm reading from Institute Study of War, they are 38 00:02:11,880 --> 00:02:16,000 Speaker 5: reporting that the multiple different factions inside of Iran that 39 00:02:16,000 --> 00:02:18,600 Speaker 5: that are controlling lots of different things right now. So 40 00:02:18,600 --> 00:02:23,079 Speaker 5: so the power is very decentralized, and while one one 41 00:02:23,160 --> 00:02:25,400 Speaker 5: sector can fire a missile at the other, one sector 42 00:02:25,440 --> 00:02:27,240 Speaker 5: is trying to do a deal with the United States. 43 00:02:27,280 --> 00:02:29,000 Speaker 5: I mean, then when Trump get Son says, you know, 44 00:02:29,040 --> 00:02:30,720 Speaker 5: they're they're talking to us, they want to, they want to, 45 00:02:30,960 --> 00:02:33,760 Speaker 5: they're begging us to stop. Well, that's might be somebody 46 00:02:33,760 --> 00:02:35,720 Speaker 5: in Iran doing that, but it's not the people that 47 00:02:35,760 --> 00:02:38,440 Speaker 5: control all the weapons. So it's still very very confusing 48 00:02:38,560 --> 00:02:39,239 Speaker 5: and very fluid. 49 00:02:39,560 --> 00:02:43,040 Speaker 4: Well, somebody who controls some pretty powerful weapons decided to 50 00:02:43,120 --> 00:02:46,040 Speaker 4: attack a US military base, so uh yeah, you know, 51 00:02:46,160 --> 00:02:48,320 Speaker 4: I don't know how many people agreed with them, how 52 00:02:48,400 --> 00:02:54,000 Speaker 4: how how big of an attack was that, and what 53 00:02:54,040 --> 00:02:55,840 Speaker 4: would it have been like if we hadn't been able 54 00:02:55,840 --> 00:02:56,839 Speaker 4: to intercept them all. 55 00:02:57,560 --> 00:03:01,120 Speaker 5: Well, you know, again, the air defense systems that we 56 00:03:01,160 --> 00:03:03,600 Speaker 5: have there are in layers and they depends on what 57 00:03:03,720 --> 00:03:05,680 Speaker 5: part of the atmosphere they're coming from, and likely with 58 00:03:05,720 --> 00:03:09,440 Speaker 5: the Patriot missiles what took them out and the naval 59 00:03:09,440 --> 00:03:11,920 Speaker 5: assets that we have in the region there, but the 60 00:03:11,960 --> 00:03:15,079 Speaker 5: targeting would have been important in terms of location, and 61 00:03:15,840 --> 00:03:17,680 Speaker 5: we think that they're getting you know, the Ranians are 62 00:03:17,720 --> 00:03:20,880 Speaker 5: likely getting this targeting data from Russia or China. It's 63 00:03:21,000 --> 00:03:23,639 Speaker 5: very difficult for them with a few missiles that they're firing. 64 00:03:23,720 --> 00:03:26,560 Speaker 5: Usually they have to fire them more in mass. The 65 00:03:26,600 --> 00:03:28,320 Speaker 5: fact that they could be as accurate as they've been 66 00:03:28,560 --> 00:03:30,480 Speaker 5: is telling, and I think we have to admit to 67 00:03:30,480 --> 00:03:32,840 Speaker 5: the fact that they're getting help from somebody in it 68 00:03:32,919 --> 00:03:34,920 Speaker 5: to either Russia or China or somebody that has this 69 00:03:35,520 --> 00:03:39,800 Speaker 5: other capability. But we have to get out of the 70 00:03:39,800 --> 00:03:42,120 Speaker 5: missile defense business, frankly, and get back in the missile 71 00:03:42,160 --> 00:03:44,400 Speaker 5: offense business and go more on the offense. 72 00:03:46,120 --> 00:03:48,840 Speaker 1: Wow, okay, I was going to ask you the forces 73 00:03:48,840 --> 00:03:51,080 Speaker 1: that we have aligned there in the region, how do 74 00:03:51,160 --> 00:03:56,080 Speaker 1: they match up with what we need to accomplish? Although 75 00:03:56,360 --> 00:03:58,480 Speaker 1: it's so complicated because you've got to figure out first 76 00:03:58,520 --> 00:04:00,720 Speaker 1: what is the strategy? Is the strategy is you really 77 00:04:00,760 --> 00:04:05,080 Speaker 1: truly the economic squeeze and just waiting till they capitulate 78 00:04:05,160 --> 00:04:09,760 Speaker 1: or beg for mercy? Do you see things strategically right now? 79 00:04:10,280 --> 00:04:11,080 Speaker 1: They haven't committed. 80 00:04:11,280 --> 00:04:14,040 Speaker 5: They haven't communicated that very well, and so I would 81 00:04:14,080 --> 00:04:17,239 Speaker 5: say as the strategy is, is the military tax combined 82 00:04:17,240 --> 00:04:21,839 Speaker 5: with the sanctions, combined with some negotiations, combined with pressure 83 00:04:21,880 --> 00:04:24,240 Speaker 5: from allies, and that would order to get them back 84 00:04:24,240 --> 00:04:27,839 Speaker 5: to the negotiation table. In a perfect world you have 85 00:04:27,920 --> 00:04:31,360 Speaker 5: regime change maybe, but right now we're looking forward regime compliance. 86 00:04:31,400 --> 00:04:36,000 Speaker 5: I think that's would be a reasonable answer. The first 87 00:04:36,080 --> 00:04:38,800 Speaker 5: MoU now has completely failed. I mean that's not even 88 00:04:38,839 --> 00:04:41,280 Speaker 5: a starting point. And the first MoU had so many 89 00:04:41,279 --> 00:04:43,359 Speaker 5: holes in it that that's the reason why it failed. 90 00:04:43,400 --> 00:04:45,680 Speaker 5: So we have to learn from that decide if we're 91 00:04:45,720 --> 00:04:47,400 Speaker 5: going to do this again. But I would like to 92 00:04:47,440 --> 00:04:49,960 Speaker 5: see a thirty to thirty five days air campaign like 93 00:04:50,000 --> 00:04:52,120 Speaker 5: we did, you know, back, kind of a desert storm 94 00:04:52,400 --> 00:04:56,680 Speaker 5: of continuous treading their capability, using military force to do 95 00:04:56,720 --> 00:05:00,559 Speaker 5: this in order to see if a run does break 96 00:05:00,560 --> 00:05:02,839 Speaker 5: from the inside, or finally some of those co listons 97 00:05:02,880 --> 00:05:04,320 Speaker 5: come together to decide they want to have a deal. 98 00:05:04,640 --> 00:05:05,120 Speaker 1: Yeah, there's a. 99 00:05:05,120 --> 00:05:07,320 Speaker 4: Report the other day that Trump was getting some advice 100 00:05:07,360 --> 00:05:10,159 Speaker 4: that the reason that we had stopped after fourteen straight 101 00:05:10,279 --> 00:05:13,479 Speaker 4: nights of bombing was he as told, we're, you know, 102 00:05:13,480 --> 00:05:15,680 Speaker 4: if kind of hit all the targets we can hit, 103 00:05:15,720 --> 00:05:18,360 Speaker 4: and we're down to stuff that it's really not worth 104 00:05:18,360 --> 00:05:20,240 Speaker 4: the expenditure weapons blah blah blah. 105 00:05:20,320 --> 00:05:22,200 Speaker 1: Do you agree with that or no? 106 00:05:22,200 --> 00:05:25,560 Speaker 5: No, No, I don't think so. I think you have 107 00:05:25,640 --> 00:05:28,760 Speaker 5: to bait them out now. At this point, they have 108 00:05:28,920 --> 00:05:32,440 Speaker 5: so few missiles, but they can't fire at scale, and 109 00:05:32,480 --> 00:05:34,839 Speaker 5: so at this point you have to bait them out 110 00:05:34,839 --> 00:05:37,000 Speaker 5: and see when they bring them, and then we go 111 00:05:37,040 --> 00:05:40,040 Speaker 5: and lunch stales attacks, use AI, use satellites, use all 112 00:05:40,040 --> 00:05:42,760 Speaker 5: our soft technology and power in order to kind of 113 00:05:42,760 --> 00:05:45,600 Speaker 5: do that because they on their side, are not going 114 00:05:45,640 --> 00:05:48,600 Speaker 5: to necessarily expend all their AMMO as well when they 115 00:05:48,680 --> 00:05:50,200 Speaker 5: take a shot. They want to make a shot that 116 00:05:50,200 --> 00:05:53,760 Speaker 5: they think they're going to hit something. But for you know, 117 00:05:53,760 --> 00:05:55,760 Speaker 5: they could still have five hundred missiles up. That's still 118 00:05:55,760 --> 00:05:58,320 Speaker 5: a significant amount of missiles that they desired to fire 119 00:05:58,360 --> 00:06:00,760 Speaker 5: all at once would be damaging. 120 00:06:01,480 --> 00:06:03,680 Speaker 1: One of the big stories over the weekend and Monday, 121 00:06:03,680 --> 00:06:05,599 Speaker 1: I think it was, was that the other reason that 122 00:06:05,600 --> 00:06:07,440 Speaker 1: Trump decided to call off the dogs is that we're 123 00:06:07,480 --> 00:06:09,960 Speaker 1: running so dangerously low on patriot missiles. We kind of 124 00:06:10,000 --> 00:06:13,560 Speaker 1: had to. I think whoever leaked that to the media 125 00:06:13,920 --> 00:06:17,640 Speaker 1: is tiptoeing up to the line of treason. I can't 126 00:06:17,680 --> 00:06:22,360 Speaker 1: believe that somebody would leak that. Am I overboard with that? Yeah? 127 00:06:22,560 --> 00:06:25,680 Speaker 5: I don't think that's the case. But again, the weapons 128 00:06:25,760 --> 00:06:28,920 Speaker 5: aren't an endless supply. Its we go to the patriotry 129 00:06:28,960 --> 00:06:31,080 Speaker 5: and pick up some more patriot missiles and decide we're 130 00:06:31,120 --> 00:06:33,880 Speaker 5: going to have them to fire there is a finite 131 00:06:33,960 --> 00:06:36,240 Speaker 5: number as to what that is. I think we've been 132 00:06:36,240 --> 00:06:39,560 Speaker 5: growing the Patriot inventory year over years for about the 133 00:06:39,600 --> 00:06:43,240 Speaker 5: past thirty years. We did give a couple of batteries 134 00:06:43,279 --> 00:06:45,880 Speaker 5: and I think five batteries to Ukraine over the past 135 00:06:45,960 --> 00:06:49,280 Speaker 5: few years, and they've expended some missiles, so there are canisters. 136 00:06:49,320 --> 00:06:51,640 Speaker 5: But I'd like to think we're not going to run 137 00:06:51,640 --> 00:06:53,560 Speaker 5: out of ammunition. But like anything else, we have to 138 00:06:53,600 --> 00:06:56,960 Speaker 5: be prudent from the economic side of it. We will 139 00:06:57,000 --> 00:06:59,599 Speaker 5: get to a point where we have to really think 140 00:06:59,640 --> 00:07:02,760 Speaker 5: through on us as to when we could start manufacturing. 141 00:07:02,800 --> 00:07:06,760 Speaker 5: I'd like to see us start re manufacturing, re energize 142 00:07:06,800 --> 00:07:09,479 Speaker 5: the defense budget, and are all. For example, this is 143 00:07:09,600 --> 00:07:14,040 Speaker 5: a company that's doing things out of the extraordinary, not 144 00:07:14,160 --> 00:07:17,760 Speaker 5: on the regular. You know, the military acquisition systems. They're 145 00:07:17,800 --> 00:07:21,000 Speaker 5: getting missile defense systems to the market faster. We've now 146 00:07:21,040 --> 00:07:24,440 Speaker 5: allowed the Ukrainians to license the manufactured Patrio missile. They'll 147 00:07:24,440 --> 00:07:26,200 Speaker 5: get that, they'll get a factory up and running very quickly, 148 00:07:26,200 --> 00:07:28,280 Speaker 5: and they're going to be very much dependent on their 149 00:07:28,360 --> 00:07:30,680 Speaker 5: own air defenses I think when their conflict is over. 150 00:07:31,000 --> 00:07:33,120 Speaker 4: Okay, So that gets into I think your piece you 151 00:07:33,160 --> 00:07:36,120 Speaker 4: wrote for real clear Defense dot com. The Iran War 152 00:07:36,240 --> 00:07:39,800 Speaker 4: is back. The deal that ends up must not rearm Tehran. 153 00:07:40,720 --> 00:07:44,000 Speaker 4: And you wrote that before they attacked our base yesterday. 154 00:07:44,000 --> 00:07:46,720 Speaker 1: But what was your what was your main point? Well, 155 00:07:46,880 --> 00:07:48,440 Speaker 1: it just comes back to China again. 156 00:07:48,440 --> 00:07:51,920 Speaker 5: There's reports now this morning Reuters is reporting that the 157 00:07:52,000 --> 00:07:55,080 Speaker 5: Chinese are shipping manpads, which are those shoulder fired air 158 00:07:55,080 --> 00:07:57,840 Speaker 5: defense systems, to try to help with the Iranian air 159 00:07:57,880 --> 00:08:00,400 Speaker 5: defense systems. They won't be able to get their large 160 00:08:00,400 --> 00:08:03,040 Speaker 5: scale you know SA four hundreds that they come from Russia, 161 00:08:03,840 --> 00:08:07,480 Speaker 5: but the Chinese are now trying looking to possibly rearm 162 00:08:07,600 --> 00:08:08,240 Speaker 5: the Uranians, and. 163 00:08:08,520 --> 00:08:09,560 Speaker 1: So will the Russians there. 164 00:08:09,600 --> 00:08:12,040 Speaker 5: I think one thing we haven't talked about is the 165 00:08:12,080 --> 00:08:14,520 Speaker 5: front now opening up in the Ukrainian War into the 166 00:08:14,560 --> 00:08:18,000 Speaker 5: Caspian Sea which borders on Iran, which is Iran has 167 00:08:18,040 --> 00:08:22,000 Speaker 5: shipped their supplies and materials into Russia. They're Shihi drones 168 00:08:22,040 --> 00:08:24,280 Speaker 5: and the things that go there. So so overall, the 169 00:08:24,320 --> 00:08:27,280 Speaker 5: next MoU has got to cover not just US in 170 00:08:27,320 --> 00:08:29,040 Speaker 5: Iran and what Iran's going to do, but it's got 171 00:08:29,040 --> 00:08:31,880 Speaker 5: to make sure that Russia or China doesn't have any 172 00:08:31,920 --> 00:08:34,360 Speaker 5: capability to rearm Iran in the near future. 173 00:08:35,040 --> 00:08:37,040 Speaker 1: You know, I prefer not to go to knee jerk 174 00:08:37,160 --> 00:08:41,120 Speaker 1: alarmism or deal with cliches. But what you just said 175 00:08:41,160 --> 00:08:48,040 Speaker 1: definitely raises our level on the World War defcon scale. 176 00:08:48,320 --> 00:08:52,280 Speaker 1: This is this is a spreading, not just geographically, but 177 00:08:52,760 --> 00:08:55,199 Speaker 1: it's become a different kind of conflict. If that sort 178 00:08:55,240 --> 00:08:57,280 Speaker 1: of thing is out in the open, where are we 179 00:08:57,480 --> 00:09:01,160 Speaker 1: in you know in that? Yeah, would you measure your point? 180 00:09:01,160 --> 00:09:01,280 Speaker 3: No? 181 00:09:01,160 --> 00:09:05,800 Speaker 5: No, because that with Ukraine now entering this Iran US conflict, 182 00:09:05,800 --> 00:09:08,559 Speaker 5: but by by hitting Russian ships in the Caspian Sea. 183 00:09:08,640 --> 00:09:11,880 Speaker 5: I mean, look five years ago when this started, no 184 00:09:11,960 --> 00:09:14,120 Speaker 5: one ever thought Ukraine would able to hit a Russian 185 00:09:14,160 --> 00:09:17,280 Speaker 5: anything in the Castpi and Cea a thousand kilometers away. 186 00:09:18,760 --> 00:09:21,640 Speaker 5: The Caspian t is a landlocked piece of of of 187 00:09:21,640 --> 00:09:25,800 Speaker 5: of a sea that borders Iran and Russia and Kazakhstan. 188 00:09:25,880 --> 00:09:26,520 Speaker 1: Those areas there. 189 00:09:26,679 --> 00:09:28,800 Speaker 5: Russia thought they could put military assets in there and 190 00:09:28,840 --> 00:09:31,480 Speaker 5: have a free rant in everybody's But no NATO vehicle 191 00:09:31,480 --> 00:09:33,040 Speaker 5: ever in there. That we have no eyes in that 192 00:09:33,120 --> 00:09:35,720 Speaker 5: at all. But the fact that the Ukrainians have opened 193 00:09:35,800 --> 00:09:38,640 Speaker 5: up that front now is huge. So no question this 194 00:09:38,640 --> 00:09:41,600 Speaker 5: this conflict is expanding. You had BBI and Selenski and 195 00:09:41,720 --> 00:09:44,359 Speaker 5: Washington yesterday looking at each other. I think talking specifically 196 00:09:44,400 --> 00:09:46,199 Speaker 5: about that. I think you know, Israel is also part 197 00:09:46,240 --> 00:09:46,960 Speaker 5: of that game as well. 198 00:09:47,520 --> 00:09:51,920 Speaker 1: Holy Cow Military analyst Mike Allions, Mike, we appreciate. The 199 00:09:51,960 --> 00:09:55,280 Speaker 1: perspective is always great stuff. Let's stay in touch. Great guys, 200 00:09:55,280 --> 00:09:58,120 Speaker 1: thanks for having me. Thanks. You know, I wasn't going 201 00:09:58,160 --> 00:10:00,240 Speaker 1: to get into it I brought up earlier, but the yeah, 202 00:10:00,280 --> 00:10:03,480 Speaker 1: the headline New York Times Iran war live updates US 203 00:10:03,520 --> 00:10:06,480 Speaker 1: and Saudi airstrikes dragged more countries into fighting. 204 00:10:07,160 --> 00:10:10,440 Speaker 4: Well yeah, right with like it's something we did to 205 00:10:10,480 --> 00:10:14,000 Speaker 4: make this worse as opposed to, Iran attacked a US 206 00:10:14,040 --> 00:10:17,200 Speaker 4: military basis today, one of their strongest attacks. Yeah, thank 207 00:10:17,200 --> 00:10:19,200 Speaker 4: god we're able to shoot down all the missiles. But 208 00:10:21,200 --> 00:10:24,360 Speaker 4: that and then we responded with the Saudi's help because 209 00:10:24,400 --> 00:10:26,720 Speaker 4: the Saudis are being attacked by the Huthis, who do 210 00:10:26,800 --> 00:10:27,880 Speaker 4: what Iran tells them to do. 211 00:10:28,360 --> 00:10:32,320 Speaker 1: Right, Yeah, that is it. We dragged him into the fighting. Okay, 212 00:10:33,120 --> 00:10:36,040 Speaker 1: it's despicable. Interesting perspective. 213 00:10:36,040 --> 00:10:38,160 Speaker 4: I heard on a podcast the other day from David 214 00:10:38,160 --> 00:10:40,319 Speaker 4: French guy who writes for The New York Times, that. 215 00:10:41,200 --> 00:10:43,280 Speaker 1: There is a tendency. 216 00:10:44,640 --> 00:10:51,719 Speaker 4: To think sometimes that your opponents can't be dumb or myopic, 217 00:10:51,880 --> 00:10:56,560 Speaker 4: or overreach or make mistakes. And maybe the Iranians just 218 00:10:56,760 --> 00:11:01,600 Speaker 4: plane misplayed their hand when they started this back up, 219 00:11:01,600 --> 00:11:03,920 Speaker 4: because I was saying at the time, why didn't they 220 00:11:04,000 --> 00:11:06,520 Speaker 4: keep this going? They got the greatest deal in the world, 221 00:11:06,600 --> 00:11:09,439 Speaker 4: this MoU thing, and it stopped, and now they get 222 00:11:09,480 --> 00:11:12,360 Speaker 4: to keep secretly trying to get a nuclear weapon while 223 00:11:12,400 --> 00:11:15,120 Speaker 4: they're selling oil and making money. I thought they were 224 00:11:15,120 --> 00:11:17,000 Speaker 4: going to drag that out for years until there was 225 00:11:17,040 --> 00:11:19,640 Speaker 4: a new president, but no, they started the war back up. 226 00:11:20,040 --> 00:11:23,280 Speaker 4: It's possible that they just made they did a dumb thing. 227 00:11:24,720 --> 00:11:26,679 Speaker 4: If we can do dumb things, they can do dumb things. 228 00:11:27,040 --> 00:11:32,120 Speaker 1: Oh yeah, absolutely true. Yeah, uh yeah. I'd have to 229 00:11:32,120 --> 00:11:34,840 Speaker 1: think about what they're thinking. I've been trying now for 230 00:11:35,040 --> 00:11:38,880 Speaker 1: quite a few weeks. I you know what, Now, I'll 231 00:11:38,920 --> 00:11:41,160 Speaker 1: fall back to the argument I've made before. They have 232 00:11:41,240 --> 00:11:43,400 Speaker 1: decided that control of the straight of hormones is their 233 00:11:43,440 --> 00:11:47,040 Speaker 1: new nuclear weapon, It's their new deterrent. As long as 234 00:11:47,080 --> 00:11:49,719 Speaker 1: we control the straight, nobody's gonna mess with us or 235 00:11:49,760 --> 00:11:52,600 Speaker 1: attack us anymore because they so desperately need the straight, 236 00:11:53,000 --> 00:11:55,280 Speaker 1: And so we're going to fight tooth and nail to 237 00:11:55,360 --> 00:11:57,920 Speaker 1: control the straight That's the only thing I can come 238 00:11:58,000 --> 00:12:03,120 Speaker 1: up with. The biggest denide that is one necessary. 239 00:12:03,600 --> 00:12:06,920 Speaker 4: The biggest unknown is what Mike Lions brought up at 240 00:12:06,960 --> 00:12:10,520 Speaker 4: the beginning there. To me is who's making these decisions 241 00:12:10,520 --> 00:12:13,520 Speaker 4: in Iran? Is it two different groups? Is it fifteen 242 00:12:13,600 --> 00:12:17,080 Speaker 4: different groups? And then to me the fact that, well, 243 00:12:17,160 --> 00:12:19,720 Speaker 4: one of the groups that wants to fight has their 244 00:12:19,800 --> 00:12:22,680 Speaker 4: finger on the button of ballistic missiles, so they must 245 00:12:22,720 --> 00:12:25,920 Speaker 4: be a pretty powerful group. There might be other groups 246 00:12:26,240 --> 00:12:29,280 Speaker 4: out there with different ideas, but they ain't got control 247 00:12:29,320 --> 00:12:29,920 Speaker 4: of the missiles. 248 00:12:31,080 --> 00:12:33,520 Speaker 1: Well, and remember in a situation like that, that all 249 00:12:33,559 --> 00:12:37,360 Speaker 1: those groups and power centers are eyeing each other suspiciously 250 00:12:37,400 --> 00:12:39,280 Speaker 1: with their hands ready to reach for their gun in 251 00:12:39,360 --> 00:12:43,240 Speaker 1: effect and saying, yeah, yeah, sure, buddy, I agree with you, palell, 252 00:12:43,360 --> 00:12:45,640 Speaker 1: let's hang together on this one there. And then they 253 00:12:45,640 --> 00:12:48,959 Speaker 1: go back to their separate meeting places and say, holy cow, 254 00:12:49,040 --> 00:12:50,560 Speaker 1: those guys are nuts. We got to keep an eye 255 00:12:50,600 --> 00:12:53,240 Speaker 1: on them. So, I mean, it's beyond volatile. 256 00:12:53,559 --> 00:12:58,120 Speaker 4: And with Saudi Arabia, as Peter Doucy pointed out, with 257 00:12:58,160 --> 00:13:02,360 Speaker 4: Saudi Arabia fighting on the see of Israel, which because 258 00:13:02,400 --> 00:13:05,760 Speaker 4: they're ally of ours, the United States. Saudi Arabian Israel 259 00:13:05,840 --> 00:13:09,400 Speaker 4: fighting against Iran, I mean that was Saudi Arabia fighting 260 00:13:09,400 --> 00:13:12,359 Speaker 4: on the side of Israel was unthinkable. 261 00:13:12,240 --> 00:13:17,400 Speaker 1: Not very long ago. Sure, yeah, wow, Around and round 262 00:13:17,400 --> 00:13:19,880 Speaker 1: and round she goes where she stops. Nobody knows. God 263 00:13:20,000 --> 00:13:22,760 Speaker 1: coming up, and I'm looking forward to this. A brief 264 00:13:23,200 --> 00:13:27,200 Speaker 1: ish discussion of the founding fathers and slavery, which is 265 00:13:27,240 --> 00:13:31,520 Speaker 1: a topic that has been absolutely twisted by progressives who 266 00:13:31,520 --> 00:13:33,559 Speaker 1: want to tear down the Constitution and then the United 267 00:13:33,600 --> 00:13:37,320 Speaker 1: States from the sixteen nineteen project of the Democratic Socialists 268 00:13:37,320 --> 00:13:39,880 Speaker 1: of America like to sit you straight, at least to 269 00:13:39,880 --> 00:13:41,960 Speaker 1: some extent, in a whole lot more. 270 00:13:42,640 --> 00:13:44,160 Speaker 4: Did you see the piece in the Wall Street Journal 271 00:13:44,200 --> 00:13:48,400 Speaker 4: about why so many American cities have no kids? Yes, 272 00:13:48,600 --> 00:13:50,800 Speaker 4: that's interesting. Maybe we'll talk about that at some point. 273 00:13:50,920 --> 00:13:52,079 Speaker 1: Lots on the way. Stay here. 274 00:14:00,520 --> 00:14:03,080 Speaker 6: So this discussion post was the portion of my student's 275 00:14:03,080 --> 00:14:06,920 Speaker 6: midterm And if you look, looks normal, right. But if 276 00:14:06,920 --> 00:14:10,760 Speaker 6: you copy and paste this in white ink, I hid 277 00:14:11,280 --> 00:14:15,800 Speaker 6: placed the word Madagascar somewhere in the response in a 278 00:14:15,800 --> 00:14:21,280 Speaker 6: way that makes no sense. So if Madagascar was somewhere 279 00:14:21,280 --> 00:14:23,560 Speaker 6: in my student's response in a way that did not 280 00:14:23,680 --> 00:14:26,960 Speaker 6: make sense. I knew that they copy and paste the 281 00:14:27,120 --> 00:14:30,320 Speaker 6: entire thing and just threw it an AI. 282 00:14:31,240 --> 00:14:33,880 Speaker 4: That's a professor explaining a clever way of catching kids 283 00:14:33,960 --> 00:14:38,360 Speaker 4: using AI. It did not understand that at all. I'm 284 00:14:38,360 --> 00:14:39,760 Speaker 4: sorry you did not understand it. 285 00:14:39,800 --> 00:14:44,080 Speaker 1: Not. Yeah, he hid the word Madagascar in certain passages 286 00:14:44,360 --> 00:14:46,800 Speaker 1: that they were not supposed to copy and paste. And 287 00:14:48,320 --> 00:14:50,360 Speaker 1: his point was, not only did they cheat, but they 288 00:14:50,360 --> 00:14:52,760 Speaker 1: didn't even read what they sent me because they would 289 00:14:52,800 --> 00:14:55,920 Speaker 1: have seen the ridiculous word Madagascar in the middle of 290 00:14:55,960 --> 00:14:58,600 Speaker 1: a sentence. I said, hey, what you know even more 291 00:14:58,640 --> 00:15:02,000 Speaker 1: relevant than that free press, I'm a Brown University professor. 292 00:15:02,280 --> 00:15:05,640 Speaker 1: Half my students are cheating. Washington Post was reporting even 293 00:15:05,680 --> 00:15:09,080 Speaker 1: elite colleges are scrambling to root out AI cheating. You 294 00:15:09,120 --> 00:15:11,040 Speaker 1: can't absolutely ramp them. You're not going to. 295 00:15:11,080 --> 00:15:12,920 Speaker 4: You got to come up with completely different ways of 296 00:15:12,920 --> 00:15:14,520 Speaker 4: going about it. Yeah, because I got a friend who 297 00:15:14,600 --> 00:15:16,760 Speaker 4: teaches classes, and he said, oh, yeah, it's just it's 298 00:15:16,800 --> 00:15:19,560 Speaker 4: it's endless, and they do it in class. You're not 299 00:15:19,680 --> 00:15:23,960 Speaker 4: allowed to. I said, well, don't let them have their phones. 300 00:15:24,120 --> 00:15:26,400 Speaker 4: That's a safety issue. The university won't allow you to 301 00:15:26,400 --> 00:15:28,360 Speaker 4: take their phones. What if there was a shooting. Oh, 302 00:15:28,480 --> 00:15:31,680 Speaker 4: give me a freaking break. So every kid has to 303 00:15:31,720 --> 00:15:34,440 Speaker 4: have his phone in the one in a gazillion chance 304 00:15:34,480 --> 00:15:37,760 Speaker 4: an active shooter comes onto the campus and your phone 305 00:15:37,800 --> 00:15:41,400 Speaker 4: would have somehow helped you in that situation. So because 306 00:15:41,400 --> 00:15:43,240 Speaker 4: he got your phone, they cheat on all the tests. 307 00:15:43,760 --> 00:15:46,320 Speaker 4: And Professor Getty, here's the rule for this class. Phone 308 00:15:46,320 --> 00:15:48,360 Speaker 4: stays in your pocket. If I see it, you lose 309 00:15:48,400 --> 00:15:50,560 Speaker 4: half a letter grade. If I see it the second time, 310 00:15:50,720 --> 00:15:52,080 Speaker 4: you lose a full letter grade. 311 00:15:52,120 --> 00:15:53,360 Speaker 1: Right, No, no, This. 312 00:15:53,400 --> 00:15:55,840 Speaker 4: Professor friend of mine explaining to me that the parents 313 00:15:55,880 --> 00:15:59,720 Speaker 4: would immediately be on the university officials saying, hey, we're 314 00:15:59,720 --> 00:16:02,960 Speaker 4: paying forty thousand dollars a year for this exactly. 315 00:16:03,160 --> 00:16:06,120 Speaker 1: Yeah, as we're discussing the other day, students are not 316 00:16:06,200 --> 00:16:10,320 Speaker 1: students anymore. They are customers at a luxury resort. Actually 317 00:16:10,360 --> 00:16:13,480 Speaker 1: that holds some lectures in. It's more like a daycare. 318 00:16:13,720 --> 00:16:17,480 Speaker 4: The parents are the customers because they're the ones calling 319 00:16:17,520 --> 00:16:20,840 Speaker 4: and complaining, and you know, you're worried the kids might 320 00:16:20,920 --> 00:16:23,640 Speaker 4: tell the customer when they get home from school. I 321 00:16:23,640 --> 00:16:26,120 Speaker 4: didn't like my teacher today, you know, as if they're 322 00:16:26,120 --> 00:16:30,800 Speaker 4: five years old. Except for twenty years old. Right, yeah, yeah, 323 00:16:30,840 --> 00:16:33,160 Speaker 4: he's he regularly, he's a he's a PhD. He's a 324 00:16:33,160 --> 00:16:37,040 Speaker 4: professor at a major university, and parents call him and complain, 325 00:16:37,120 --> 00:16:39,680 Speaker 4: and or the university officials say, we get parents are 326 00:16:39,720 --> 00:16:41,840 Speaker 4: complaining about your blah blah blah blah blah. 327 00:16:41,880 --> 00:16:42,120 Speaker 1: What. 328 00:16:42,480 --> 00:16:45,040 Speaker 4: My parents were completely unaware of what I was doing 329 00:16:45,080 --> 00:16:46,000 Speaker 4: in class. 330 00:16:46,480 --> 00:16:49,960 Speaker 1: My parents only complaint was about me my behavior. 331 00:16:50,120 --> 00:16:52,200 Speaker 4: Oh one AI thing I wanted to throw in, and 332 00:16:52,240 --> 00:16:55,880 Speaker 4: we were talking about AI there, Navidia. Nvidia just spent 333 00:16:56,000 --> 00:16:58,320 Speaker 4: seven hundred and fifty billion dollars on some of the 334 00:16:58,400 --> 00:17:02,080 Speaker 4: other AI companies who are by their chips, and Bloomberg 335 00:17:02,160 --> 00:17:06,399 Speaker 4: points out the whole reigniting the circular AI fears that 336 00:17:06,440 --> 00:17:08,879 Speaker 4: this is all just people investing in each other and 337 00:17:08,920 --> 00:17:09,960 Speaker 4: we still don't know what. 338 00:17:09,880 --> 00:17:12,840 Speaker 1: The products ever are gonna do. The founding fathers in 339 00:17:12,960 --> 00:17:16,000 Speaker 1: Slavery a brief introduction. You have Michael had his bubble 340 00:17:16,040 --> 00:17:18,040 Speaker 1: noise hand. He I'd be asking when the player right now, 341 00:17:18,640 --> 00:17:23,480 Speaker 1: Armstrong and Geddy. A lot of cities, particularly in California, 342 00:17:23,720 --> 00:17:26,920 Speaker 1: ain't got no kids left. Kids are disappearing like at 343 00:17:26,960 --> 00:17:28,520 Speaker 1: a crazy rate. 344 00:17:29,400 --> 00:17:31,920 Speaker 4: Which is going to have a big effect on public policy, 345 00:17:31,960 --> 00:17:32,679 Speaker 4: I gotta believe. 346 00:17:34,040 --> 00:17:37,560 Speaker 1: Yeah, and different ripples of effects too. I can't wait 347 00:17:37,600 --> 00:17:42,120 Speaker 1: to talk about that. I almost lost my nerve for 348 00:17:42,240 --> 00:17:45,359 Speaker 1: this segment for reasons I'll explain in a minute. I 349 00:17:45,480 --> 00:17:49,280 Speaker 1: was reading last night Tim Sander for his favorite fabulous 350 00:17:49,320 --> 00:17:53,320 Speaker 1: proclaiming Liberty John Adams Tom Jefferson in the Declaration of 351 00:17:53,440 --> 00:17:58,240 Speaker 1: Independence and the section I was reading, and it's worth 352 00:17:58,280 --> 00:18:04,480 Speaker 1: mentioning the sixteen nineteen Project is a cynical, awful work 353 00:18:04,520 --> 00:18:07,159 Speaker 1: of fiction. The idea that the revolution was held to 354 00:18:07,280 --> 00:18:12,880 Speaker 1: perpetuate slavery is so completely, wildly cynically untrue it's hard 355 00:18:12,880 --> 00:18:17,320 Speaker 1: to believe anybody believed it. But the book's absolutely wonderful 356 00:18:17,320 --> 00:18:19,240 Speaker 1: because it talks about all of the things that are 357 00:18:19,280 --> 00:18:20,760 Speaker 1: in the sixth Declaration. 358 00:18:20,960 --> 00:18:25,119 Speaker 4: Project's not wonderful, That's not the book is wonderful. Yeah, sorry. 359 00:18:25,160 --> 00:18:27,600 Speaker 1: The book is wonderful because it describes all of the 360 00:18:27,640 --> 00:18:31,640 Speaker 1: specifics in the Declaration of Independence and what they were 361 00:18:31,720 --> 00:18:35,600 Speaker 1: talking about. He has sent forth the swarms of officers 362 00:18:35,680 --> 00:18:38,480 Speaker 1: to you know, plague our people and eat out our substance. 363 00:18:38,680 --> 00:18:41,040 Speaker 1: He has forced legislatures to convene in weird, out of 364 00:18:41,080 --> 00:18:43,440 Speaker 1: the way places. And I've never really understood that. I'd 365 00:18:43,440 --> 00:18:46,320 Speaker 1: never gotten that as like he did or they did, 366 00:18:46,359 --> 00:18:49,240 Speaker 1: because it was all about Parliament, and yeah, sure enough, 367 00:18:49,280 --> 00:18:52,000 Speaker 1: and it's just such a wonderful story of the lead 368 00:18:52,040 --> 00:18:54,480 Speaker 1: up to the revolution. But last night I was reading 369 00:18:56,080 --> 00:18:59,920 Speaker 1: the section about Thomas Jefferson in the late seventeen sixties, 370 00:19:00,119 --> 00:19:03,840 Speaker 1: in very early seventeen seventies, and how he was Thomas 371 00:19:03,920 --> 00:19:11,800 Speaker 1: Jefferson crusading against slavery, and the reason I almost lost 372 00:19:11,840 --> 00:19:14,280 Speaker 1: my nerve was I just kept reading, thinking, this stuff 373 00:19:14,320 --> 00:19:16,400 Speaker 1: is great. We need to talk about this on the show. 374 00:19:16,600 --> 00:19:20,200 Speaker 1: This is fabulous. And then this morning is I'm about 375 00:19:20,240 --> 00:19:24,080 Speaker 1: to start this, I realized there's like eight pages of 376 00:19:24,240 --> 00:19:28,919 Speaker 1: like fine print, single space, and I had not like 377 00:19:29,320 --> 00:19:31,439 Speaker 1: rewritten it and highlighted it and stuff like that. But 378 00:19:31,760 --> 00:19:34,840 Speaker 1: I'm going to give you the general version of it. 379 00:19:35,200 --> 00:19:37,520 Speaker 1: And I think it would be an absolutely wonderful excuse 380 00:19:37,560 --> 00:19:39,080 Speaker 1: to have Tim back on the show to talk about 381 00:19:39,080 --> 00:19:41,920 Speaker 1: this specifically. But I am going to start. He loves 382 00:19:42,040 --> 00:19:47,080 Speaker 1: this topic. Oh yeah, well, and it's so interesting. I mean, 383 00:19:47,400 --> 00:19:50,399 Speaker 1: never mind, you know, my feelings and patriotism and my 384 00:19:50,440 --> 00:19:52,200 Speaker 1: point of view or whatever. It's just it's much more 385 00:19:52,240 --> 00:19:56,480 Speaker 1: interesting than the idiotic oversimplified story that y'all have been 386 00:19:56,560 --> 00:19:58,680 Speaker 1: fed a lot of you. Anyway, I'm going to start 387 00:19:58,680 --> 00:20:03,080 Speaker 1: at the end or nearly at the end. What is extraordinary, 388 00:20:03,200 --> 00:20:07,639 Speaker 1: indeed unprecedented about the American revolutionaries was that time and 389 00:20:07,760 --> 00:20:11,520 Speaker 1: again they conceded that the principles for which they thought 390 00:20:11,680 --> 00:20:16,560 Speaker 1: would require the liberation of the enslaved, even if racial prejudices, 391 00:20:16,640 --> 00:20:22,199 Speaker 1: including their own, still seemed like an insuperable barrier. They 392 00:20:22,240 --> 00:20:26,760 Speaker 1: talked a lot, they wrote a lot about Hey, this 393 00:20:27,040 --> 00:20:31,399 Speaker 1: all men are created equal. Stuff. We've got slaves going on. 394 00:20:32,000 --> 00:20:35,920 Speaker 1: That doesn't work. They were utterly open about it. They 395 00:20:35,960 --> 00:20:39,040 Speaker 1: talked about it all the time. They wrote brilliant treatises 396 00:20:39,080 --> 00:20:42,480 Speaker 1: on it. Thomas Jefferson was a young crusading lawyer who 397 00:20:42,680 --> 00:20:46,480 Speaker 1: kept trying to roll back slavery. Why did he keep 398 00:20:46,480 --> 00:20:49,359 Speaker 1: his slaves? Why didn't he turn them loose? There's a 399 00:20:49,400 --> 00:20:53,520 Speaker 1: partial explanation for that, But why he didn't follow the 400 00:20:53,560 --> 00:20:55,719 Speaker 1: example of George Washington, who in his will said, by 401 00:20:55,720 --> 00:20:58,760 Speaker 1: the way, almost slaves are free when I die. It's 402 00:20:58,760 --> 00:21:01,679 Speaker 1: not clear. It's a bit of a mystery, but the 403 00:21:01,760 --> 00:21:03,840 Speaker 1: idea that they were just kind of hammin and hawn 404 00:21:03,920 --> 00:21:09,480 Speaker 1: and ignoring the obvious, you know, inconsistency. I don't want 405 00:21:09,480 --> 00:21:12,080 Speaker 1: to call it hypocrisy because they called it out to themselves, 406 00:21:13,240 --> 00:21:16,720 Speaker 1: but why it existed. A couple of tidbits for you. 407 00:21:19,040 --> 00:21:24,040 Speaker 1: First of all, young Thomas Jefferson tried to in a 408 00:21:24,119 --> 00:21:26,840 Speaker 1: case in seventeen sixty nine, I think it was tried 409 00:21:26,880 --> 00:21:30,720 Speaker 1: to limit slavery and was absolutely slapped down and humiliated 410 00:21:31,359 --> 00:21:34,879 Speaker 1: by it, or in the case rather by the powers 411 00:21:34,880 --> 00:21:37,320 Speaker 1: that be and the judges and the other attorneys and 412 00:21:37,600 --> 00:21:41,960 Speaker 1: uh and that, and you know those folks. And Tim 413 00:21:42,000 --> 00:21:43,800 Speaker 1: goes on to point out that slavery and other forms 414 00:21:43,840 --> 00:21:47,399 Speaker 1: of compulsory servitude were ubiquitous in America and all over 415 00:21:47,440 --> 00:21:52,960 Speaker 1: the world, hundreds of thousands of people. Ben Franklin was 416 00:21:53,040 --> 00:21:56,879 Speaker 1: an apprentice. He was a forced laborer for a limited 417 00:21:56,920 --> 00:21:59,119 Speaker 1: amount of time, that was one of the several different 418 00:21:59,200 --> 00:22:02,680 Speaker 1: kinds of that sort of thing, and suffered so severely 419 00:22:02,720 --> 00:22:05,760 Speaker 1: as an apprentice that he had run away breaking colonial law. 420 00:22:06,920 --> 00:22:09,720 Speaker 1: Some of the other interesting points that Tim makes, and 421 00:22:10,080 --> 00:22:16,160 Speaker 1: he cites all of the contemporary documents, is that, well 422 00:22:16,200 --> 00:22:18,119 Speaker 1: he goes into a fair amount of detail about you know, 423 00:22:18,160 --> 00:22:24,280 Speaker 1: their entire philosophy made slavery look absolutely terrible. But every 424 00:22:24,320 --> 00:22:28,880 Speaker 1: time they tried to limit it, roll it back emancipate slaves, 425 00:22:29,200 --> 00:22:33,399 Speaker 1: Parliament and Britain said no, you can't. They would not 426 00:22:33,600 --> 00:22:37,359 Speaker 1: let the colonists pass laws to liberate slaves under any 427 00:22:37,400 --> 00:22:41,520 Speaker 1: circumstances except very very narrow ones. And Parliament, which at 428 00:22:41,520 --> 00:22:45,960 Speaker 1: the time was claiming it had ultimate unchecked power over 429 00:22:46,000 --> 00:22:50,640 Speaker 1: the King, over the colonists, over everybody. If they said 430 00:22:50,640 --> 00:22:52,320 Speaker 1: it was the law, it was the law. You have 431 00:22:52,480 --> 00:22:55,160 Speaker 1: no rights. Parliament will tell you what your rights are. 432 00:22:55,520 --> 00:22:58,239 Speaker 1: That's the reason. Really, if you want to, you know, 433 00:22:58,760 --> 00:23:01,159 Speaker 1: encompass it. In one sentence, we broke away from England 434 00:23:01,359 --> 00:23:04,720 Speaker 1: because of parliamentary supremacy. But anyway, every time we tried 435 00:23:04,760 --> 00:23:08,040 Speaker 1: to do something, they said, no, the Royal African Company 436 00:23:08,240 --> 00:23:13,560 Speaker 1: is you know, approved and supported by the by England, 437 00:23:13,560 --> 00:23:15,400 Speaker 1: it's part of the government, and you would be doing 438 00:23:15,480 --> 00:23:18,359 Speaker 1: injury to them. That was the great slave importer, So no, 439 00:23:18,480 --> 00:23:21,440 Speaker 1: you can't do that. Sorry. So the founding fathers tried 440 00:23:21,520 --> 00:23:23,520 Speaker 1: over and over and over it again to limit the 441 00:23:23,560 --> 00:23:26,600 Speaker 1: scope of slavery as much as they could and were 442 00:23:26,600 --> 00:23:29,960 Speaker 1: told no by the Crown or I'm sorry really by Parliament, 443 00:23:30,080 --> 00:23:34,280 Speaker 1: which I found very very interesting. The other part of 444 00:23:34,320 --> 00:23:37,000 Speaker 1: it that nobody wants to talk about because AA doesn't 445 00:23:37,000 --> 00:23:41,120 Speaker 1: serve their purposes or be it's uncomfortable. And I'm sorry, Jack, 446 00:23:41,560 --> 00:23:43,359 Speaker 1: I don't mean a monologue on this. Feel free to 447 00:23:43,400 --> 00:23:44,120 Speaker 1: bust in any time. 448 00:23:44,200 --> 00:23:46,080 Speaker 4: I was just thinking about Tim and I were talking 449 00:23:46,119 --> 00:23:48,720 Speaker 4: about when you were gone. This was around the fourth 450 00:23:48,760 --> 00:23:52,800 Speaker 4: of July time. I had rewatched the first couple episodes 451 00:23:53,040 --> 00:23:56,959 Speaker 4: of the John Adams mini series that they're running on 452 00:23:57,440 --> 00:24:01,679 Speaker 4: HBO or Netflix or someplace anyway. It before, but episode 453 00:24:01,800 --> 00:24:05,400 Speaker 4: two of the first season, that's when they get into 454 00:24:05,440 --> 00:24:08,359 Speaker 4: the Declaration of Independence, the voting, and he's sitting in 455 00:24:08,400 --> 00:24:12,000 Speaker 4: the attic there. It's him and Franklin and Thomas Jefferson 456 00:24:12,000 --> 00:24:13,439 Speaker 4: had just written it and are reading it for the 457 00:24:13,440 --> 00:24:15,879 Speaker 4: first time. And John Adams gets to the you know, 458 00:24:15,920 --> 00:24:18,760 Speaker 4: the we hold these truths to be self evident part, 459 00:24:19,000 --> 00:24:25,720 Speaker 4: which was like they weren't when when h Thomas Jefferson, 460 00:24:25,720 --> 00:24:27,680 Speaker 4: when TJ was given the task, if you know, write 461 00:24:27,720 --> 00:24:30,760 Speaker 4: up a declaration of independence, it didn't include and you know, 462 00:24:30,960 --> 00:24:33,000 Speaker 4: form a new kind of government that nobody's ever done 463 00:24:33,000 --> 00:24:33,480 Speaker 4: it before. 464 00:24:34,080 --> 00:24:36,000 Speaker 1: He kind of gave on his own, gave it back 465 00:24:36,000 --> 00:24:37,600 Speaker 1: to him. All men of creative and John. 466 00:24:37,440 --> 00:24:40,520 Speaker 4: Adams says, this isn't just a declaration of independence, this 467 00:24:40,600 --> 00:24:43,800 Speaker 4: is a declaration of a new way of structuring society, 468 00:24:43,880 --> 00:24:45,440 Speaker 4: completely right. 469 00:24:45,760 --> 00:24:51,080 Speaker 1: And jeffersones, well, that's what I think. So uh to 470 00:24:51,160 --> 00:24:54,359 Speaker 1: the question of okay, So the founding Papa's understood that 471 00:24:54,400 --> 00:24:58,199 Speaker 1: slavery was incompatible with you know, the the truths that 472 00:24:58,280 --> 00:25:02,040 Speaker 1: we hold most sacred Americans. So why didn't they turn 473 00:25:02,080 --> 00:25:05,520 Speaker 1: all the slaves loose? I get why people ask that 474 00:25:05,520 --> 00:25:08,760 Speaker 1: as a legitimate question, and the answer, a good answer 475 00:25:08,800 --> 00:25:10,919 Speaker 1: would be long and complicated, but I'll give you just 476 00:25:11,040 --> 00:25:13,240 Speaker 1: a couple of tastes of it. Only a few years 477 00:25:13,240 --> 00:25:16,640 Speaker 1: after the declaration, Jefferson published Notes on the State of Virginia, 478 00:25:16,680 --> 00:25:19,080 Speaker 1: in which he set forth his quote suspicion that the 479 00:25:19,119 --> 00:25:22,520 Speaker 1: blacks are inferior to the whites. A later generation seized 480 00:25:22,560 --> 00:25:26,040 Speaker 1: on his words to justify slavery, and although Jefferson himself 481 00:25:26,080 --> 00:25:29,520 Speaker 1: denied this connection quote, whatever be their degree of talent, 482 00:25:29,680 --> 00:25:33,280 Speaker 1: it is no measure of their rights, he said. He 483 00:25:33,359 --> 00:25:35,919 Speaker 1: did come to the conclusion that biological as well as 484 00:25:36,040 --> 00:25:39,480 Speaker 1: historical differences between the races made it impossible for them 485 00:25:39,520 --> 00:25:43,320 Speaker 1: to live together permanently. In North America. Jefferson was one 486 00:25:43,320 --> 00:25:46,480 Speaker 1: of many white Southerners who, while regarding slavery as evil, 487 00:25:46,760 --> 00:25:51,160 Speaker 1: found it impossible to imagine a peaceful multiracial democracy. Such 488 00:25:51,160 --> 00:25:54,760 Speaker 1: a thing had no historical precedent. The record with which 489 00:25:54,800 --> 00:25:57,960 Speaker 1: the founding fathers were familiar suggested that racially and religiously 490 00:25:58,000 --> 00:26:02,040 Speaker 1: diverse societies could only be got by emperors, as with Rome, 491 00:26:02,400 --> 00:26:07,560 Speaker 1: or through legal segregation, as with medieval Jerusalem. No civilization 492 00:26:07,720 --> 00:26:11,080 Speaker 1: known to man had ever successfully abolished slavery. History seemed 493 00:26:11,119 --> 00:26:15,479 Speaker 1: instead to prove that mass emancipation led inevitably to deadly 494 00:26:15,600 --> 00:26:19,399 Speaker 1: reprisals in civil war. Even Yankees such as John Adams 495 00:26:19,440 --> 00:26:23,160 Speaker 1: agreed on this point. Immediate emancipation, wrote Adams, quote would 496 00:26:23,200 --> 00:26:26,520 Speaker 1: probably excite insurrections among the blacks to rise against their 497 00:26:26,560 --> 00:26:31,080 Speaker 1: masters and imbrew their hands in innocent blood. So you've 498 00:26:31,080 --> 00:26:35,240 Speaker 1: got the combination of m fear of what emancipation would 499 00:26:35,240 --> 00:26:37,600 Speaker 1: look like. Just on a practical level, there will be 500 00:26:37,960 --> 00:26:41,879 Speaker 1: a civil war and incredible blood shed. You got the 501 00:26:41,880 --> 00:26:45,639 Speaker 1: crown saying or I'm sorry again, Parliament saying you're not 502 00:26:45,680 --> 00:26:48,479 Speaker 1: allowed to do that. We're not gonna letch you. And 503 00:26:48,520 --> 00:26:51,280 Speaker 1: then you've got the pressure as they're trying to put 504 00:26:51,320 --> 00:26:56,199 Speaker 1: a country together of the southern colonies, saying our economic 505 00:26:56,400 --> 00:27:00,400 Speaker 1: system depends on this, so we're putting that over there, 506 00:27:00,960 --> 00:27:03,800 Speaker 1: you know, to the side. We're gonna table that until 507 00:27:03,880 --> 00:27:08,880 Speaker 1: we tell you or we will not sign on. Combined 508 00:27:08,920 --> 00:27:12,840 Speaker 1: with the fact that none of this was had any precedent, 509 00:27:12,920 --> 00:27:16,720 Speaker 1: what do we do now? And so, you know, if 510 00:27:16,760 --> 00:27:20,640 Speaker 1: you want to do lambast them for not being aggressive 511 00:27:20,720 --> 00:27:24,320 Speaker 1: or fast enough in answering what seems like the unanswerable. 512 00:27:24,640 --> 00:27:28,760 Speaker 1: That's fair, and historians can argue about that. But the 513 00:27:28,920 --> 00:27:32,520 Speaker 1: idea that it was just some sort of winking I 514 00:27:32,560 --> 00:27:35,920 Speaker 1: don't see anything hypocrisy among Thomas Jefferson and the Founding fathers. 515 00:27:36,560 --> 00:27:40,760 Speaker 1: The contrast between our founding words and slavery. It's not true. 516 00:27:40,760 --> 00:27:44,000 Speaker 1: In fact, it's the opposite of true. They were sickened 517 00:27:44,000 --> 00:27:46,800 Speaker 1: by it, they wrestled with it constantly and didn't know 518 00:27:46,840 --> 00:27:47,480 Speaker 1: what to do. 519 00:27:50,080 --> 00:27:53,160 Speaker 4: Yeah, I don't like that Jefferson had slaves and kept 520 00:27:53,160 --> 00:27:54,159 Speaker 4: slaves while writing that. 521 00:27:54,280 --> 00:27:58,560 Speaker 1: I wish that weren't a fact. Oh yeah, it's awful, 522 00:27:59,320 --> 00:28:07,639 Speaker 1: and and especially given Washington's example, nobody can really explain 523 00:28:07,760 --> 00:28:10,040 Speaker 1: why he did what he did In the way he 524 00:28:10,080 --> 00:28:12,480 Speaker 1: did it. It's it's a blot on his. 525 00:28:14,000 --> 00:28:22,719 Speaker 4: On his legacy because of his idea for not just 526 00:28:22,920 --> 00:28:26,200 Speaker 4: declaring independence from England, but for forming an entirely new 527 00:28:26,400 --> 00:28:29,520 Speaker 4: way of government, but just a new idea that we 528 00:28:29,640 --> 00:28:33,199 Speaker 4: have were born with natural rights, that a new idea. 529 00:28:33,760 --> 00:28:35,600 Speaker 4: I don't think you were here for this conversation that 530 00:28:35,920 --> 00:28:40,600 Speaker 4: Tim mentioned that he he said, he decided and he 531 00:28:40,680 --> 00:28:43,840 Speaker 4: told his wife. He said, Thomas Jefferson is not only 532 00:28:43,880 --> 00:28:47,680 Speaker 4: my favorite Founding father, he's my favorite person who's ever lived. 533 00:28:48,680 --> 00:28:52,680 Speaker 1: And his wife said me too. Wow. 534 00:28:54,480 --> 00:28:57,560 Speaker 4: Wow, that's something you get two people who get married 535 00:28:57,640 --> 00:28:59,880 Speaker 4: or in love with each other who both their fa 536 00:29:00,000 --> 00:29:02,280 Speaker 4: favorite person who ever lived is not each other. 537 00:29:02,520 --> 00:29:06,680 Speaker 1: It's Thomas Jefferson and that is their bond. Wow. Wow. 538 00:29:07,000 --> 00:29:09,840 Speaker 1: My wife and I bonded over Supertramp, but you know, 539 00:29:09,960 --> 00:29:14,440 Speaker 1: to each their own each other. Yeah, that is so 540 00:29:15,960 --> 00:29:19,480 Speaker 1: for you. It's Thomas Jefferson. Me too, Me too. So 541 00:29:19,600 --> 00:29:25,600 Speaker 1: it's a bit of a throutle. So if there's one 542 00:29:25,680 --> 00:29:29,520 Speaker 1: takeaway I want you to take away, hence the term takeaway, 543 00:29:31,160 --> 00:29:34,800 Speaker 1: it's that far from pretending it wasn't the case. The 544 00:29:34,880 --> 00:29:39,120 Speaker 1: Founding generation wrestled with this question. I think it's safe 545 00:29:39,120 --> 00:29:44,560 Speaker 1: to say every single day from the seventeen sixties through 546 00:29:44,600 --> 00:29:51,520 Speaker 1: the eighteen sixties, every day they thought slavery's evil. Nobody's 547 00:29:51,560 --> 00:29:54,640 Speaker 1: outlawed it on Earth. Oh, the Brits get credit for 548 00:29:54,720 --> 00:29:57,520 Speaker 1: ending the slave trade. That's partly well, let's say company, 549 00:29:57,600 --> 00:30:02,640 Speaker 1: that's another story. But America was constantly saying, how do 550 00:30:02,760 --> 00:30:06,480 Speaker 1: we get rid of slavery at a time when slavery 551 00:30:06,600 --> 00:30:10,320 Speaker 1: was ubiquitous everywhere on Earth. The Arabs, the Africans themselves, 552 00:30:10,520 --> 00:30:14,920 Speaker 1: the Native Americans all had slaves like crazy and considered 553 00:30:14,960 --> 00:30:19,440 Speaker 1: it normal. Muslims, what do you mean I lost slavery? 554 00:30:19,720 --> 00:30:23,040 Speaker 1: Mohammad himself says, slavery is great, no freaking way we're out. 555 00:30:23,360 --> 00:30:26,320 Speaker 1: The Americans were unique and saying, we've got to find 556 00:30:26,440 --> 00:30:30,880 Speaker 1: a way to do this. Burn in Hell sixteen nineteen 557 00:30:30,920 --> 00:30:33,080 Speaker 1: project you Lying Liars. 558 00:30:32,800 --> 00:30:36,640 Speaker 4: Which is probably in your kids' school library or maybe 559 00:30:36,640 --> 00:30:37,080 Speaker 4: even in. 560 00:30:36,960 --> 00:30:39,959 Speaker 1: The classroom they're teaching him right now. You know what, 561 00:30:40,000 --> 00:30:43,760 Speaker 1: I will commission to him. I will pay his princely 562 00:30:43,800 --> 00:30:46,760 Speaker 1: fee to write a children's book on this very topic. 563 00:30:47,600 --> 00:30:50,480 Speaker 1: That'd be a good one. I could write it, but 564 00:30:50,520 --> 00:30:51,959 Speaker 1: I'm a man who craves leisure. 565 00:30:52,280 --> 00:30:56,520 Speaker 4: Also, the percentage of black slaves that were purchased from 566 00:30:56,720 --> 00:30:58,000 Speaker 4: black people who had. 567 00:30:57,920 --> 00:31:01,400 Speaker 1: Enslaved other black people. It was so left out of 568 00:31:01,400 --> 00:31:05,240 Speaker 1: the whole conversation. Oh yeah, yeah, well, and you could 569 00:31:05,280 --> 00:31:08,960 Speaker 1: make the well, it's like the drug control argument. There 570 00:31:09,040 --> 00:31:13,239 Speaker 1: was a voracious appetite for black slaves in America. So 571 00:31:14,360 --> 00:31:17,200 Speaker 1: that's why the black people enslaved the other tribes of 572 00:31:17,240 --> 00:31:19,680 Speaker 1: black people or whoever they beaten war or whatever, and 573 00:31:19,720 --> 00:31:22,480 Speaker 1: send them to America for profit. It's America's fault for 574 00:31:22,600 --> 00:31:26,680 Speaker 1: wanting slaves, right, But that's that's not a strong argument. 575 00:31:27,000 --> 00:31:29,320 Speaker 1: If you're making a moral argument. You can't go to 576 00:31:29,360 --> 00:31:32,000 Speaker 1: that argument, right right, right right. 577 00:31:33,760 --> 00:31:36,280 Speaker 4: Disappearing kids in California and all over the country and 578 00:31:36,360 --> 00:31:39,040 Speaker 4: all over the world. Really, that and other topics on 579 00:31:39,080 --> 00:31:41,120 Speaker 4: the way stay here. 580 00:31:47,840 --> 00:31:50,080 Speaker 7: More than a dozen kids at camp in New Jersey 581 00:31:50,200 --> 00:31:53,120 Speaker 7: fell ill last week after they allegedly ate chocolate that. 582 00:31:53,240 --> 00:31:54,480 Speaker 1: Was laced with mushrooms. 583 00:31:54,840 --> 00:31:56,880 Speaker 7: And that was the day they all learned how to 584 00:31:56,920 --> 00:32:01,280 Speaker 7: make a campfire with their minds. 585 00:32:03,080 --> 00:32:04,760 Speaker 4: I want to get this headline before I get to 586 00:32:04,840 --> 00:32:08,720 Speaker 4: the troubling disappearance of kids, and I should say, people 587 00:32:08,720 --> 00:32:12,080 Speaker 4: aren't having kids neighbors kids are just yeah. 588 00:32:12,120 --> 00:32:13,840 Speaker 1: Otherwise you think it's a Q and. 589 00:32:13,880 --> 00:32:18,920 Speaker 4: On rapture thing, yeah or Q and on right, saw 590 00:32:18,960 --> 00:32:22,080 Speaker 4: this headline Jeff Bezos is reportedly and talks to bid 591 00:32:22,080 --> 00:32:24,680 Speaker 4: for a thirty percent stake in an English soccer team. 592 00:32:24,960 --> 00:32:28,360 Speaker 4: You know what went on there? His wife got caught 593 00:32:28,440 --> 00:32:30,320 Speaker 4: up in World Cup mania. 594 00:32:30,120 --> 00:32:33,880 Speaker 1: And we should get a soccer team, buy a soccer team. Honey, 595 00:32:34,000 --> 00:32:35,960 Speaker 1: I don't need a soccer team. Just watch the ones 596 00:32:36,000 --> 00:32:39,560 Speaker 1: on TV. No, I want a soccer team. Everybody's talking 597 00:32:39,560 --> 00:32:41,320 Speaker 1: about soccer. We need to get a soccer team. 598 00:32:41,360 --> 00:32:43,400 Speaker 4: And then he took his big lipped wife and then 599 00:32:43,440 --> 00:32:45,560 Speaker 4: they went and bought a soccer Then you got Mark 600 00:32:45,640 --> 00:32:47,840 Speaker 4: Zuckerberg telling everybody don't worry about AI. 601 00:32:47,880 --> 00:32:50,640 Speaker 1: It's fine, trust me. Oh hilarious. 602 00:32:51,680 --> 00:32:53,520 Speaker 4: Oh, and how did David Lee Roth come up on 603 00:32:53,560 --> 00:32:55,120 Speaker 4: the show the other day? It doesn't matter. Friend of 604 00:32:55,160 --> 00:32:57,520 Speaker 4: mine who lives in Salt Lake City and does. 605 00:32:57,440 --> 00:32:59,640 Speaker 1: Radio there, we do radio there. We're on in Salt 606 00:32:59,680 --> 00:32:59,959 Speaker 1: Lake City. 607 00:33:00,000 --> 00:33:04,280 Speaker 4: Hey, everybody, now, they canceled a David Lee Roth's show 608 00:33:04,320 --> 00:33:06,560 Speaker 4: at a venue that only seats eleven hundred. 609 00:33:06,280 --> 00:33:08,440 Speaker 1: People for four tickets sales out? 610 00:33:08,520 --> 00:33:10,600 Speaker 4: How many people have bought tickets out of an eleven 611 00:33:10,680 --> 00:33:11,560 Speaker 4: hundred seat arena. 612 00:33:12,200 --> 00:33:15,240 Speaker 1: Not very many apparently, might as well jump Go ahead 613 00:33:15,280 --> 00:33:17,680 Speaker 1: and jump. Don't jump, Dave, don't jump. 614 00:33:18,800 --> 00:33:23,080 Speaker 4: To the disappearing kids story. People aren't having kids all 615 00:33:23,120 --> 00:33:26,400 Speaker 4: around the world. As we've talked about a lot. Doesn't matter, your. 616 00:33:26,240 --> 00:33:31,120 Speaker 1: Politics, your income, your skin color, doesn't matter. People have 617 00:33:31,240 --> 00:33:34,720 Speaker 1: just stopped having kids. So and nobody knows why. 618 00:33:35,560 --> 00:33:38,240 Speaker 4: But in cities it's more noticeable than anywhere else. San 619 00:33:38,320 --> 00:33:44,360 Speaker 4: Jose leads the way most California cities do. San Jose, California, 620 00:33:45,520 --> 00:33:49,280 Speaker 4: has seen a drop of kids under age five. 621 00:33:50,640 --> 00:33:52,000 Speaker 1: Of thirty four. 622 00:33:51,880 --> 00:33:56,960 Speaker 4: Percent in the past ten years. In ten years, Wow, 623 00:33:57,000 --> 00:34:00,560 Speaker 4: that's just a different city. That's a different makeup of 624 00:34:00,640 --> 00:34:03,160 Speaker 4: human beings. If you have that big a drop in. 625 00:34:03,200 --> 00:34:07,320 Speaker 1: Kids, which will be the engine of a huge change 626 00:34:07,320 --> 00:34:07,920 Speaker 1: in governance. 627 00:34:09,200 --> 00:34:11,200 Speaker 4: And some people will say, oh, it's so expensive to 628 00:34:11,239 --> 00:34:14,120 Speaker 4: live there, that's why, Okay. And even in affordable cities, 629 00:34:14,480 --> 00:34:17,080 Speaker 4: the number of children has fallen. Albuquerque, New Mexico, one 630 00:34:17,080 --> 00:34:20,200 Speaker 4: of the most affordable cities in America, fifteen percent drop 631 00:34:20,239 --> 00:34:23,000 Speaker 4: over ten years, Milwaukee eleven percent drop, double digit drop 632 00:34:23,000 --> 00:34:26,160 Speaker 4: over ten years. To Poline having kids. They started with 633 00:34:26,200 --> 00:34:28,160 Speaker 4: some neighborhood where an old woman said, it used to 634 00:34:28,160 --> 00:34:29,800 Speaker 4: be kids riding bikes around here all the time. I 635 00:34:29,800 --> 00:34:31,879 Speaker 4: mean that was what the neighborhood was. Park was full 636 00:34:31,880 --> 00:34:32,239 Speaker 4: of kids. 637 00:34:32,280 --> 00:34:36,160 Speaker 1: Now no kids. Yeah, I read this. Nelly BOWLESK putting 638 00:34:36,200 --> 00:34:38,920 Speaker 1: out this case study from Charlotte, North Carolina, a wonderful city. 639 00:34:39,400 --> 00:34:41,640 Speaker 1: It's a case study highlighting a local couple who think 640 00:34:41,680 --> 00:34:43,600 Speaker 1: they don't make enough money to have children yet. And 641 00:34:43,640 --> 00:34:45,560 Speaker 1: she points out that people love saying the birth rate 642 00:34:45,680 --> 00:34:47,160 Speaker 1: is falling because of the cost of living, and they 643 00:34:47,160 --> 00:34:49,480 Speaker 1: get very upset when't you suggest said anything else. So 644 00:34:49,640 --> 00:34:51,719 Speaker 1: here's the situation. The woman owns a house with her 645 00:34:51,760 --> 00:34:55,680 Speaker 1: husband fifteen year mortgage, pays an additional four thousand dollars 646 00:34:55,760 --> 00:34:59,080 Speaker 1: monthly toward the principle just for peace of mind. We 647 00:34:59,120 --> 00:35:01,120 Speaker 1: can't feel like we can have kids until we feel 648 00:35:01,160 --> 00:35:05,160 Speaker 1: more financially secure. Her husband makes one hundred and ninety 649 00:35:05,239 --> 00:35:08,680 Speaker 1: K blah blah blah, so their total household income is 650 00:35:08,760 --> 00:35:13,280 Speaker 1: three hundred and eighty thousand dollars annually. You're making almost 651 00:35:13,320 --> 00:35:15,520 Speaker 1: four hundred K in Charlotte and you don't think you 652 00:35:15,600 --> 00:35:17,600 Speaker 1: make enough money to support a kid. You need to 653 00:35:17,600 --> 00:35:20,840 Speaker 1: admit you just don't want kids, which is okay, but 654 00:35:21,040 --> 00:35:24,680 Speaker 1: stop leaving leaning on that financial explanation, right, people don't 655 00:35:24,680 --> 00:35:25,160 Speaker 1: want kids. 656 00:35:25,200 --> 00:35:28,080 Speaker 4: Why people don't want kids is the question, and nobody's 657 00:35:28,120 --> 00:35:29,120 Speaker 4: really got the answer for that. 658 00:35:31,400 --> 00:35:32,520 Speaker 1: Armstrong and Getty