Speaker 1: Another sad day in this country's history, another mass shooting.
Speaker 1: I'd like to welcome you to another episode of Civic Cipher.
Speaker 1: I am your host, Ramsey's job. Big shout out to
Speaker 1: Maman q Ward, who is still globe trotting, but I
Speaker 1: promised this is the last week we will be without him. Fortunately,
Speaker 1: we have another guest in the studio, a longtime friend
Speaker 1: of the show was helping me as I broadcast from
Speaker 1: the Hip Hop Weekly Studios. Doctor Camillo Wessenberg is back
Speaker 1: in the building. Welcome back to the show. You thank you, okay, okay.
Speaker 1: And for those who don't know, doctor Westnberg is Professor
Speaker 1: Emeritus of English and Music for over forty years. Is
Speaker 1: where as well as the second vice president for Political
Speaker 1: Action of the Maricopa County Branch of the NAACP, and
Speaker 1: she will be sitting in on some conversations that we
Speaker 1: definitely need to have, including, as I mentioned, the most
Speaker 1: recent mass shooting in Jacksonville, Florida, that was specifically targeting
Speaker 1: black people in a black community as they were going
Speaker 1: about their lives. So we're going to take a little
Speaker 1: bit of time today to discuss the cesspit of hatred
Speaker 1: and the cancerous nature of chat online chat rooms that
Speaker 1: harbor these sorts of sentiments and allow these echo chambers
Speaker 1: to exist and ultimately manifest and death being honest, but
Speaker 1: also other harms perpetuated against black and brown communities. And
Speaker 1: we're also going to spend the second part of the
Speaker 1: show talking about DEI training, diversity equity and inclusion training,
Speaker 1: and the recent attacks on DEI in the workplace and
Speaker 1: in other parts of life in America. And we are
Speaker 1: going to make a case not that we thought we
Speaker 1: needed to, but make a case for y DEEI training
Speaker 1: is good for all of us. That and so much
Speaker 1: more to stick around for for today's episode of Civic Cipher.
Speaker 1: But first and foremost, we are going to discuss some
Speaker 1: ebony excellence. As always in today's ABNY, Excellence is sponsored
Speaker 1: by Major Threads for innovative fashionable sports. Were Checkmajor threads
Speaker 1: dot com. Today's reading comes from Bionnews dot com and
Speaker 1: we are talking about a fourteen year old girl who
Speaker 1: earned her third college degree before finishing her first year
Speaker 1: of high school. According to Black Enterprise, Anita Bennett, age fourteen,
Speaker 1: made history when she graduated summa cum laude and received
Speaker 1: her Associates of Science from Cuyahoya Community College. As a
Speaker 1: freshman at Ohio Connections Academy, Bennett has already earned an
Speaker 1: Associate of Arts and an Associate of Technical Studies in
Speaker 1: childcare Administration and Management. The fourteen year old was able
Speaker 1: to graduate with three degrees through Ohio's dual enrollment program
Speaker 1: College Credit Plus, which allows her to take high school
Speaker 1: and college courses at the same time, and it said
Speaker 1: she plans to complete a bachelor's degree before she graduates
Speaker 1: high school. Quote, when you don't know about college that
Speaker 1: kind of stuff, it can seem really easy, really hard,
Speaker 1: and it could seem impossible at times. But just knowing
Speaker 1: that if you put your mind to it, you can
Speaker 1: do it, and that disguise the limit and you create
Speaker 1: your own boundaries, she said. The fourteen year old said
Speaker 1: her mom inspired her to work and push herself to
Speaker 1: achieve her goals. She goes on to say, seeing my
Speaker 1: mother and how hard she worked and how she got
Speaker 1: her business running and how successful it really was, inspired
Speaker 1: me to go into that field as well. And I've
Speaker 1: always had a passion and love for children, so I
Speaker 1: knew I wanted to do something like that with my life.
Speaker 1: So seeing her already have a successful business, it only
Speaker 1: makes sense to me to take over when I get older,
Speaker 1: since I wanted to work in the childcare industry as well.
Speaker 1: And so today we salute you, Anita Ben at age
Speaker 1: fourteen for again having your third college degree before you
Speaker 1: finished your first year of high school. That is spectacular, incredible, right,
Speaker 1: and of course it is an example of ed the excellence.
Speaker 1: Moving on, so the Jacksonville mass shooting. I know that
Speaker 1: I know that we have to go through it line
Speaker 1: by line and detail what happened. But I'd like to
Speaker 1: ask you what your early thoughts were when you first
Speaker 1: heard about the shooting and put them in context of
Speaker 1: not just the recent attacks on black people and Hispanic
Speaker 1: people and Jewish and Muslim people that we've seen around
Speaker 1: this country in recent years, but also in the context
Speaker 1: of what your idea of terrorism is, your personal idea
Speaker 1: having lived rather longer than than I have.
Speaker 2: Well, I suppose it was. It's happening again. Here it
Speaker 2: is again. I can't believe we are experiencing this again.
Speaker 2: We have had a history of African Americans being killed,
Speaker 2: assassinated by one person or groups of people, and it
Speaker 2: is history. It was occurring from my childhood, from slavery
Speaker 2: and up until today.
Speaker 1: And I guess.
Speaker 2: The question is, given that we are supposed to be
Speaker 2: a civilized society and improved society, a progressive society, a
Speaker 2: democratic society that has values, how is it that a
Speaker 2: segment of our population continues to harbor some of the
Speaker 2: sentiments that separate us and degrade people and see them
Speaker 2: as less than inferior to the extent that they have
Speaker 2: to pick up a weapon, go and kill someone and
Speaker 2: even kill themselves. What is it that is so innately
Speaker 2: a part of you that allows you to engage in
Speaker 2: that type of activity. Where was your mind a few
Speaker 2: minutes before? And what do you go through physically? How
Speaker 2: do you see people through your eyes? Mind boggling to
Speaker 2: me that we have people who can walk in and
Speaker 2: randomly shoot people, chase them down and shoot people. It's
Speaker 2: happened again, and we keep saying that it's happened again. Oh,
Speaker 2: it's happened again. It isn't a novelty any longer. So
Speaker 2: what can we do within our society to change this
Speaker 2: pattern that we have Because it has become a pattern,
Speaker 2: it's the norm. We need to find some mechanism to
Speaker 2: change it, and we stop and we give condolences to
Speaker 2: the family, and then the people come out and they
Speaker 2: put their flowers, and you know, they mong the loss
Speaker 2: of people, and still they go back in fear themselves.
Speaker 1: We are a people.
Speaker 2: In fear. We're not peaceful, and we are doing that
Speaker 2: to ourselves. We are fostering that type of human environment
Speaker 2: in which we are existing now, and we have the
Speaker 2: capacity to charge that.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, absolutely. Now, in case you are not entirely
Speaker 1: aware of what it is we're talking about, which I'm
Speaker 1: sure you are, I have to paint a picture for
Speaker 1: those of us who are just getting up to speed.
Speaker 1: So I'm gonna share a little bit from CNN. Jacksonville
Speaker 1: gunman was turned away from an HBCU before racist shooting
Speaker 1: that killed three at a nearby store. Authorready say, all right,
Speaker 1: the gunman who killed three people Saturday at so it's
Speaker 1: sort of been last Saturday at a Dollar General in Jackson, Florida,
Speaker 1: had earlier been turned away from the campus of a
Speaker 1: historically black university just blocks away from the site, shooting
Speaker 1: authorities said was a targeted attack against black people. The gunman,
Speaker 1: identified as twenty one year old you know, we don't
Speaker 1: say their names on this show. Bought a handgun in
Speaker 1: April and an Air fifteen style rifle in June. The
Speaker 1: sheriff said he lived with his parents in nearby Orange
Speaker 1: Park and had no criminal arrest history, although he had
Speaker 1: been temporarily involuntarily held under the Baker Act in twenty seventeen.
Speaker 1: The sheriff said the gunman used racial slurs, left behind
Speaker 1: a racist I believe this is creed or screed, and
Speaker 1: drew swastikas on his firearm. Authorities said he was armed
Speaker 1: with an Air fifteen style rifle and a handgun, and
Speaker 1: was wearing a tactical vest and blue latex gloves. The
Speaker 1: sheriff said victims were identified as Angela Michelle Carr fifty two,
Speaker 1: Gerald Gallion, twenty nine, and Annult Joseph aj Legera junior,
Speaker 1: age nineteen. At one away PM at the Dollar General
Speaker 1: parking lot, the gunman shot into a black Kia and
Speaker 1: killed car, the sheriff said, then entered the store and
Speaker 1: fatally shot Laghea. The sheriff said others fled out the
Speaker 1: rear exit of the store, and the suspect exited the
Speaker 1: same door before returning inside The gunman then fatally shot Gallion,
Speaker 1: who had just walked into the store, and chased after
Speaker 1: and shot at Gallion's lean girlfriend. The sheriff said at
Speaker 1: one eighteen pm, the gunman texted his father and told
Speaker 1: him to go into his room, but the father found
Speaker 1: a will and a suicide note. Sheriff said. Officers entered
Speaker 1: the store a minute later, eleven minutes from the start
Speaker 1: of the shooting and heard one gun shot, which is
Speaker 1: presumed to be when the gunman shot and killed himself.
Speaker 1: The shooting came five years to the day a mass
Speaker 1: shooting in downtown Jacksonville at a Madden video game tournament.
Speaker 1: The attack also coincided with the commemoration of the sixtieth
Speaker 1: anniversary of the March on Washington, the iconic civil rights
Speaker 1: demonstration that called on the government to better protect the
Speaker 1: rights of black people. So, a couple of things that
Speaker 1: I want to add to some of the questions that
Speaker 1: you posited, you know, in kind of bringing us up
Speaker 1: to speed in terms of your initial reaction. Some of
Speaker 1: the research that I've done into the sort of as
Speaker 1: I mentioned that like the cess pit, the breeding grounds
Speaker 1: for people that feel like these mass shooters feel they
Speaker 1: are in online forums where people feel like they can
Speaker 1: blame their problems on other people and they are provided
Speaker 1: as sort of like echo chamber to express themselves where
Speaker 1: they won't be challenged and they can they have other
Speaker 1: people around them that help them make sense of the
Speaker 1: world that affirms and reaffirms what it is that they
Speaker 1: thought things were supposed to be. In other words, let's
Speaker 1: take for a moment, a white male, right. I want
Speaker 1: to make sure that it is said plainly that white
Speaker 1: men are our brothers. And if we're painting with broad strokes,
Speaker 1: they might be having a tough time adjusting to the
Speaker 1: changing climate, racial compositions, political climate of this country. Okay,
Speaker 1: our brothers right, and we being the older brothers and sisters,
Speaker 1: being of African descent, being the first humans, I've always
Speaker 1: felt like, despite our troubles and our issues, we also
Speaker 1: have to be mindful and historically we have been very
Speaker 1: patient and very mindful of our younger brothers and sisters
Speaker 1: that we share this planet with. There is a degree
Speaker 1: of compassion and grace that I found often in black
Speaker 1: women who're older than me, those people that pray, you know,
Speaker 1: I'm not a person that engages to the same degree
Speaker 1: that some other folks do. But I see the emotion,
Speaker 1: I see the commitment to positivity and hoping for positive outcomes.
Speaker 1: I've never seen black women take up arms and pitchforks
Speaker 1: and that sort of thing, and that has not been
Speaker 1: my reality. So for our white male brothers who have
Speaker 1: been promised the American dream, who have been promised when
Speaker 1: you get older.
Speaker 3: You can you can do. You can be anything you
Speaker 3: want to do right. You can be a movie star,
Speaker 3: you can be an NBA player, you can whatever. And
Speaker 3: then you know, as they.
Speaker 1: Develop into men and they realize that they don't have
Speaker 1: access to money, opportunities, companionship, you know that they thought,
Speaker 1: there's a realization that life may not ultimately hold everything
Speaker 1: that they expected, and they are prime for the why.
Speaker 1: And if they are fed information from sources that have
Speaker 1: ulterior motives, a separate agenda, et cetera, they could be
Speaker 1: convinced that in the case of El Paso, Texas, it's
Speaker 1: Mexican people crumbing across the border, stealing your jobs, affecting
Speaker 1: the economy, and this is why your life looks like this,
Speaker 1: as opposed to unfettered capitalism, corporate creed. You know, these
Speaker 1: sorts of things. The people that are taking from you
Speaker 1: look just like you. You know they you know they're
Speaker 1: they're able to receive disinformation and misinformation. If the political
Speaker 1: climate looks like people are having conversations about white supremacy
Speaker 1: and white privilege, and these white men look at their
Speaker 1: own lives and say, well, shoot, I wish I had
Speaker 1: some white supremacy, I wish I had some white privilege. Man,
Speaker 1: that would certainly change things around here, then it's easier
Speaker 1: for them to push back, and they can find themselves
Speaker 1: being upset because when they look at TV and they
Speaker 1: see these black millionaires and more recently black millionaires who
Speaker 1: have all of the things, all the reality that they
Speaker 1: want to live. To them, they're connecting dots that they've
Speaker 1: been primed to connect, right, They're not looking at numbers,
Speaker 1: they're not looking at things in mass. And so the
Speaker 1: long and short of it is that it's easy for
Speaker 1: them to end up receiving information that allows them to
Speaker 1: feel more comfortable about where they are and why they
Speaker 1: haven't done more, and then they end up moving in
Speaker 1: this direction. It sounds like you want to jump in police.
Speaker 2: Yeah, there are a couple of things that cross my
Speaker 2: mind as you were talking when you mentioned that they
Speaker 2: were in this echo chamber in the social media environment
Speaker 2: where everyone is bouncing off of each other with the
Speaker 2: same concept. There isn't anyone in there to differ with
Speaker 2: what they are chanting. It's easy to buy into that
Speaker 2: and to become grounded in that particular environment. And one
Speaker 2: of the things is human beings. I don't know why.
Speaker 2: The analogy is like a choir. Everybody's singing their song
Speaker 2: on social media and whatever link that is, and they're
Speaker 2: just chiming in and they're giving their part, and everyone
Speaker 2: wants to be somebody within there that some come out
Speaker 2: and they do their solo act, and the solo act
Speaker 2: is with that gun. That's how they demonstrate I am
Speaker 2: with you, I am I am somebody within this environment,
Speaker 2: especially if they're looking to be acknowledged on who they are.
Speaker 2: So that's one of the things. The other thing is,
Speaker 2: as a whole, people need to understand that you can
Speaker 2: be whatever you want to be, you can go wherever
Speaker 2: you want to go. The fact is, and I'll set
Speaker 2: this in class, especially to my athletes and to people
Speaker 2: in the arts, that I say it, said doctor Westinberg,
Speaker 2: I'm going to make it to the pro And I said,
Speaker 2: you need to work on this assignment, or you need
Speaker 2: to do this this English assignment. But I'm gonna I'm
Speaker 2: gonna have a secretary. I'm going to have I'm gonna
Speaker 2: you know, I don't need it. There are so many
Speaker 2: slots in the world for you to get to that point.
Speaker 2: I would say here in Phoenix, if you look at
Speaker 2: the number of high school football players, are basketball players
Speaker 2: that want to get to the pros. And I'm changing
Speaker 2: over a little bit. This isn't about guns. But you
Speaker 2: want to get to the pros. There are just so
Speaker 2: many slots that are there to be filled. And you
Speaker 2: think about each one of the high schools and each
Speaker 2: one of the young men of the ladies in that
Speaker 2: in that respect, everybody's not going to get there. It's
Speaker 2: simply not going to happen. So always say you have
Speaker 2: to find something else, some safety net sure that you
Speaker 2: can use. And the young people that are engaging in
Speaker 2: this racism, that's all that they know. They have bought
Speaker 2: into it. They have not put themselves in any other
Speaker 2: environment to latch onto. It's like in a cell and
Speaker 2: they're locked in and they can't get out, and so
Speaker 2: they just continue to move in that direction. And that's
Speaker 2: the unfortunate so aspect of it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, so watch this. There's unfortunately, there's these corners
Speaker 1: of the internet, you know, in my in my research
Speaker 1: that are very very toxic and very very sick. And
Speaker 1: what ends up happening is there are people sharing these
Speaker 1: really hateful ideas about black people, about anybody who's not
Speaker 1: really straight and white, et cetera. But they're women in
Speaker 1: these forms as well, and they actually encourage this. They
Speaker 1: praise the previous mass shooter, and then they encourage whoever
Speaker 1: is currently working on a manifesto to get a higher
Speaker 1: score and to go out and do more harm. And
Speaker 1: they suggest these folks that they'll be remembered and worshiped
Speaker 1: as a hero. And you got to think, if you're
Speaker 1: at a point in your life where you feel like
Speaker 1: your life has no value, no one cares, No one
Speaker 1: cares if you're here or not, even if you do
Speaker 1: something awful and die, at least your life meant something.
Speaker 1: And for some people fueled by hate and the desire
Speaker 1: to matter because they've been promised that you know, you're
Speaker 1: special and you're unique and you can do anything. I
Speaker 1: think the intersection of those two elements is really part
Speaker 1: and parcel to what I see in most of these
Speaker 1: backstories of these mass shooters. And unfortunately, we as a people,
Speaker 1: we end up bearing the brunt of it, and then
Speaker 1: the society at large and children, and you know, there's
Speaker 1: been plenty of mass shootings that are not specifically racially
Speaker 1: targeted and so but a lot of these components remain
Speaker 1: the same. You know, if they're not mad at black
Speaker 1: people specifically, they're mad at liberals in general, or they're
Speaker 1: you know, these are often conservative folks carrying out these attacks,
Speaker 1: deeply radically conservative. I guess that's.
Speaker 2: Why I think there should be legislatively some process to
Speaker 2: limit restrict the type of messaging. And I believe in
Speaker 2: freedom of speech, but there should be legislation to limit
Speaker 2: any messaging that is destructive to society.
Speaker 1: And I want to agree with you here because in
Speaker 1: the nation state of Germany, where they have a history
Speaker 1: of systematically exterminating human beings, and obviously once upon a
Speaker 1: time it was under Nazi rule, they have very strict
Speaker 1: rules in place, and Germany, for the most part, is
Speaker 1: exactly what we would consider in terms of like a
Speaker 1: free country, but just like in this country, you can't
Speaker 1: go into a movie theater and yell fire. A certain
Speaker 1: speech is not protected, and that certainly is a move
Speaker 1: that we could consider, in addition to what many people
Speaker 1: agree is the problem everybody having access to guns, and
Speaker 1: people doubling and tripling down on the Second Amendment rights
Speaker 1: that were written for muskets, and now people have aks
Speaker 1: and so forth. We'll keep talking, but that's where we
Speaker 1: are now.