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Speaker 1: Welcome to How the Money. I'm Joel and I am Matt,

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Speaker 1: and today we're talking online privacy, creepy social media, and

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Speaker 1: cyber security with Carol Tario. Chances are you pay for

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Speaker 1: something recently, or maybe you gave some money to a friend,

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Speaker 1: But you likely didn't do that with physical cash, right.

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Speaker 1: You probably did it via a digital payments online or

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Speaker 1: maybe with an app like Venmo or the cash app.

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Speaker 1: And this presents a whole host of issues. We know

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Speaker 1: how to keep people from stealing our money right al

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Speaker 1: of our wallets and out of our purses, but what

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Speaker 1: about the money that we have in our accounts online? Uh?

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Speaker 1: And So our guest today is Carol Tario. Carol knows

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Speaker 1: a thing or two about internet security. She founded the

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Speaker 1: so FoST Naked security site years ago and she now

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Speaker 1: co hosts the podcast Smashing Security. She lives and breathes

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Speaker 1: all things cybersecurity, and we are so glad that she's

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Speaker 1: here with us today to talk about protecting our identity

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Speaker 1: and ultimately protecting our money. So, Carol, thank you for

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Speaker 1: joining us today on the podcast. Oh guys, I'm so

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Speaker 1: honored to be here. Thank you so much for having me.

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Speaker 1: We're so happy to have you, Carol and Um, Matt

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Speaker 1: and I we always drink it craftier on every episode.

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Speaker 1: Today on the show, we're drinking a raspberry chocolate stout.

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Speaker 1: They're really excited about. I know you have a beer

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Speaker 1: over there as well, correct, I do. I'm drinking the

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Speaker 1: Wild Beer's a company a Quantic. It's a session I

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Speaker 1: p a with citrus, fresh pine and extra pale. So

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Speaker 1: you already you already getting a plus for participation in

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Speaker 1: the show. So I'm not a beer drinker, but I

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Speaker 1: really wanted to play ball taking one for the team.

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Speaker 1: I appreciate it. Well, the sacrifices we may exactly exactly

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Speaker 1: to to create a good podcast. Uh well, here all

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Speaker 1: the first question we ask anyone who comes on the show.

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Speaker 1: Because Matt and I do really like craft beer, and

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Speaker 1: we're willing to spend a little bit more money right

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Speaker 1: now on beer while we're saving well and investing for

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Speaker 1: the future. What is your craft beer equivalent? What's the

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Speaker 1: thing you're willing to splore John in the here and now. Well,

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Speaker 1: unlike your entry, I do have a few extra hobbies

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Speaker 1: outside cyber Um. Probably podcast is probably my biggest thing

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Speaker 1: that I spend my time on. But um, I I art, right,

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Speaker 1: I don't like to call myself an artist, but I

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Speaker 1: try and do art every day. Like I paint, I draw,

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Speaker 1: I do ink stuff and I love. I'm loving the

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Speaker 1: whole journey to getting better. So my pleasure is art

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Speaker 1: supplies gorgeous stuff at that professional quality paints, watercolors, oils,

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Speaker 1: you know, papers from arches, inks, charcoals, brushes, all that stuff.

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Speaker 1: I just bought this monster paint brush Slize twenty two,

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Speaker 1: which will me nothing to know painters. But you guys

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Speaker 1: know what I'm talking about is that as big as

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Speaker 1: my hand or small borrow. It's probably like probably an

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Speaker 1: inch and diam and it's kind of like a tear

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Speaker 1: drop and the whole thing is just full of it.

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Speaker 1: You can just really slap the paint on and it

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Speaker 1: like set me back hunter of bucks, which is a

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Speaker 1: lot of for one brush, right, Yeah it is. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it is the premium brush. That's that's brush you're gonna

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Speaker 1: pass down through the generation unicorn hairs or something like that.

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Speaker 1: But you know, I don't do that often, and I

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Speaker 1: can take you know, I think about it for months

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Speaker 1: before and it sits my in box and then I

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Speaker 1: just go for it when I'm right, when I'm really sure,

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Speaker 1: and I'm loving it, So it's all good. That's great. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: when you find a deal as well a discount. Uh well, Carol,

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Speaker 1: let's kind of dive into this right. Over the past

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Speaker 1: couple of decades, we've seen more aspects of our lives

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Speaker 1: shifting online and going digital, right, like banking and investing. Obviously,

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Speaker 1: we're huge fans of the convenience and benefits this offers.

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Speaker 1: But how concerned should we be with the digital security

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Speaker 1: you know, of the apps and of the websites that

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Speaker 1: we're using. Not at all, it's just a big hoax.

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Speaker 1: It's just a joke. No, Seriously, You've got to be really, really,

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Speaker 1: really concerned. I hate to say that, right, it is

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Speaker 1: really kind of a failing of the you know, the

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Speaker 1: the environment and technology working together. There's lots of solutions

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Speaker 1: that those lots of ways you can be better, but

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Speaker 1: it's not easy. So it means we have to think. Um,

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Speaker 1: if you think about it, you know, when we all

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Speaker 1: look for the same kind of information, right, like like

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Speaker 1: a Brexit or pandemic or elections all that stuff, we're

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Speaker 1: all more vulnerable because we're we're looking for information. We're

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Speaker 1: all looking for the same information. So it tells like

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Speaker 1: bad guys to say, this is what they're looking for.

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Speaker 1: So if we can somehow dupe them into thinking we're

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Speaker 1: going to give them the information they want. And we're

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Speaker 1: all looking for the same thing, we're kind of like

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Speaker 1: sitting like we're fishing, you know, we're goldfish and the

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Speaker 1: fish bowl basically. So that's why it's important to think

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Speaker 1: about security. So so in particular, um, right when we're searching,

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Speaker 1: there are there are spamming results that can come up,

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Speaker 1: and and that can you know, there's malware and all

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Speaker 1: sorts of things that can happen if we're doing that.

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Speaker 1: Let's say there's a company that we have a relationship with,

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Speaker 1: right like a bank or in an investment company, an

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Speaker 1: investment house, and you know, we we log into there consistently,

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Speaker 1: you know, maybe once a month, maybe once a week

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Speaker 1: to check our balance to see how things are going.

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Speaker 1: What are the potential risks in logging into a website

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Speaker 1: with a company that we do business with on the regular,

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Speaker 1: and how can we avoid some of the potential pitfalls? Okay,

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Speaker 1: so one of the ways you can avoid the pitfalls

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Speaker 1: is by having bona fide apps from those providers. So

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Speaker 1: let's say you bank with ABC Bank, and ABC Banks say, hey,

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Speaker 1: this is our portal, this is our app, right, and

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Speaker 1: banks are pretty good at security pretty generally across the board.

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Speaker 1: You know, there's like certain regulations they need to meet,

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Speaker 1: so they tend to be much more trustworthy than your

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Speaker 1: typical retail shop. So my my, my trick with those

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Speaker 1: things is use apps. Then what can happen the things

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Speaker 1: you're trying to avoid, for example, is you may get

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Speaker 1: a text message. In fact, I got one on this

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Speaker 1: weekend but said hey, my Halifax, which is a bank

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Speaker 1: in the UK, my Halifax account has been h and

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Speaker 1: to call Halifax on this number immediately. Now I don't

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Speaker 1: have a Halifax account, but if I did, what would

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Speaker 1: I have done? Right? So, what some people will do,

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Speaker 1: and what we're warning people against, and what they're trying

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Speaker 1: to get you to do, is to click on that

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Speaker 1: number because it's so easy, right, it's right for you exactly.

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Speaker 1: So what in those situations, if ever you're concerned, do

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Speaker 1: not click on those links. Do not click on that

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Speaker 1: phone number. Go to the bona Fide website or the app,

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Speaker 1: find the phone number that they advertise for everyone, and

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Speaker 1: call them and say that you're a customer and then

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Speaker 1: explain what happened, because what happens they route you into

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Speaker 1: someone who pretends to be a bank and they say

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Speaker 1: to you, hello, mr, can you just confirm your password

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Speaker 1: and your user name? And you give them all the

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Speaker 1: information to verify who you are and then guess what

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Speaker 1: they do with that information go to your account and

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Speaker 1: empty yet clean you out. And so let's talk about

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Speaker 1: passwords too. You know, I'm sure you're gonna tell us

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Speaker 1: that strong passwords are clutched, right like ABC one tooth thread,

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Speaker 1: Like that's not going to cut it at today's lingo clutch.

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Speaker 1: I like that outcast. I think we use that word. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: we get called out for using that. I don't know

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Speaker 1: if it's more of a Southern kind of dial you know,

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Speaker 1: I don't I'm not totally sure if it's like a

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Speaker 1: millennial guy thing using okay, yeah so yeah yeah, so

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Speaker 1: like yeah, when you're creating a new password though, you know,

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Speaker 1: like a lot of sites will gauge the strength of

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Speaker 1: it as you're typing it out. But you know, like

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Speaker 1: how long should passwords actually be and should we like

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Speaker 1: include you know the special characters and the numbers. What's

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Speaker 1: what's a good sort of routine that we should go

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Speaker 1: through when we're creating these new passwords. I know. Okay,

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Speaker 1: passwords are everyone the bane of our lives, aren't They

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Speaker 1: have worked? Now, let me tell you something. So there's

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Speaker 1: these great research. There's some great research into passwords. So

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Speaker 1: twenty three million account holders, let's take your company, their

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Speaker 1: passwords were one, two, three, five, six. Okay, yeah, fifty

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Speaker 1: one of people use the same password for both work

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Speaker 1: and home personal accounts, right, so they use it across

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Speaker 1: all their accounts, same password because they've developed a good one, right,

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Speaker 1: they may have a good one, and they use it

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Speaker 1: across all their accounts. The problem with that is if

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Speaker 1: someone gets in somewhere, they can then just go around

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Speaker 1: to every single popular app and try the password. Right,

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Speaker 1: So rather than you just being hacked on one place,

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Speaker 1: save Facebook, you're hacked across every single social media account

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Speaker 1: you've got. And oh maybe if you're using it with

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Speaker 1: your bank as well, then the banks are a bit

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Speaker 1: more a bit more, you know, they have a few

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Speaker 1: more hurdles to get through. But ultimately that's what criminals want,

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Speaker 1: is your mullah right, and they're going to get it

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Speaker 1: by either trying to sell your data, your information, or

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Speaker 1: by actually just going to your account trying to get

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Speaker 1: into it. So there's these things in our my world

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Speaker 1: called like targeted social engineering, and this is where someone

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Speaker 1: basically dupes you, scams you, right. And the problem is,

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Speaker 1: like six of us adults have this habit of incorporating

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Speaker 1: pieces of information in their past word that can be

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Speaker 1: found out on their social media account. So a third

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Speaker 1: use a pet's name, a fifth use their own name, right,

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Speaker 1: fifteen percent put down the name of their partner in it,

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Speaker 1: like I slept with John last time, right, right, and

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Speaker 1: and and the thing is is those those those are

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Speaker 1: all clues to someone who's trying to get into your account.

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Speaker 1: And these are people. This is I think in a

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Speaker 1: lot of people's heads. You're thinking, oh, why would anyone

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Speaker 1: target me? Well, they're not targeting you, you're just maybe

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Speaker 1: in the spitfire. Like. Yes, some attacks are very targeted,

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Speaker 1: but they tend to go after people with the big bucks, right,

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Speaker 1: like with a lot of money or a lot of celebiness,

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Speaker 1: or they have a political difference or something like that.

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Speaker 1: For people, you know, the average Joe, what you're worrying

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Speaker 1: about is being lazy, and the job is to just

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Speaker 1: be safer than your neighbor. It sounds harsh, but it's

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Speaker 1: really the way to go. So it's like when the

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Speaker 1: bears chasing, you just gotta run faster than the other person, right, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I think there was some actual and there's some actual

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Speaker 1: doctoral research on that. Basically you shouldn't do because it

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Speaker 1: makes you bad. Yeah. Basically, it's like if you have

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Speaker 1: a house, um, and there's a burglar on the street,

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Speaker 1: he's going to case the whole street, right, and he's

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Speaker 1: going to look for the one that's easiest to get

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Speaker 1: into because they want to get in get out, right,

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Speaker 1: So don't be Yeah, don't be easiest. You make it a

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Speaker 1: a little bit harder. Have a dog, have a stick,

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Speaker 1: have floodlights, have locked doors. So that's the same kind

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Speaker 1: of concept. You've got to think about it when you're

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Speaker 1: in the digital world. So the reason I think care

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Speaker 1: all that that so many people will use the same

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Speaker 1: password across so many different platforms, and like you said, um,

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Speaker 1: they shouldn't be doing that is just because it is

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Speaker 1: a heavy lift to remember all these different passwords, and

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Speaker 1: so there are now password managers that you claim to

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Speaker 1: help you with that, and um, they will. Essentially they'll

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Speaker 1: do the thinking and remembering of those passwords for you.

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Speaker 1: So what's your take on you know, things like one

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Speaker 1: password bit Warden the companies that will do that for you,

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Speaker 1: sometimes for a price and sometimes for free. I'm a huge,

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Speaker 1: huge fan of password managers. I do recommend them, and

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Speaker 1: I'm glad you brought them up because so I use personally,

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Speaker 1: I use last Us. There are loads of good ones

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Speaker 1: out there and the same idea happened. So the way

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Speaker 1: they work is it's basically an online diary and you

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Speaker 1: need to remember the password to get into the diary.

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Speaker 1: That's the only password you as a user need to remember.

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Speaker 1: And inside this diary, this vault, all your other passwords

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Speaker 1: are lists, are listed and and encrypted. So the way

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Speaker 1: it's the way it works is to say you're on

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Speaker 1: your browser and you go to a particular website, like

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Speaker 1: say you went to I don't know Facebook, Um, it

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Speaker 1: would automatically recognize that you're on the bona fide Facebook

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Speaker 1: page and fill it in. Now, that's the super cool

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Speaker 1: thing about password managers is say you got you you

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Speaker 1: got duped by someone by through an email and you

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Speaker 1: clicked on a link and the whole page looked exactly

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Speaker 1: like Facebook, but you actually weren't on the Facebook page,

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Speaker 1: and it just had some tiny like maybe they put

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Speaker 1: in the Facebook zero instead of the letter zero, the

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Speaker 1: letter oh, something's tiny that you wouldn't want to see.

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Speaker 1: Your password manager would see it, right, they go, this

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Speaker 1: is not the right page, this is not what you

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Speaker 1: should be I'm not filling it in. And that's the

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Speaker 1: real trick of them. So I love them, and they're

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Speaker 1: I mean, there's lots of them that are free for

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Speaker 1: home use, that are recommended. You can get them to

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Speaker 1: talk amongst between devices if you pay some and not

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Speaker 1: a lot of money. We're not talking a ton of money.

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Speaker 1: But if there was one big security thing I would

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Speaker 1: say to everyone to do, it's watch your passwords. Unique long,

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Speaker 1: complicated passwords that you could not remember yourself. If someone

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Speaker 1: held you at night point said tell me your password,

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Speaker 1: you go, I don't know. I don't know. It's like

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Speaker 1: my my passwords are mostly fifty characters. Wow, and not

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Speaker 1: because I wouldn't remember that in a million years. But

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Speaker 1: I've got tons of them, right, I've got probably a

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Speaker 1: thousand passwords, but you do know the one password to

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Speaker 1: that rules them all, that rules them all exactly exactly. Well,

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Speaker 1: so kind of all that note, right, in addition to

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Speaker 1: password management software, what about anti virus software? You know,

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Speaker 1: is that something that that everyone should have? I feel

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Speaker 1: like it's something that we saw more like, I don't know,

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Speaker 1: in the nineties. Like when I think of like like

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Speaker 1: the basic uh antivirus software, it seems dated and I personally,

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Speaker 1: I honestly don't know if it's something that I should

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Speaker 1: be looking at or not. Yeah, well, you know what

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Speaker 1: you're talking like an Apple user, aren't you? Oh yeah,

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Speaker 1: so so so the Apple ecosystem is slightly different from

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Speaker 1: the Windows versions, right, So so I can understand I

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Speaker 1: don't know if I agree, but I can understand why

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Speaker 1: Apple users might be more like, hey, do I really

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Speaker 1: need this? Um? And that's because Apple has a very

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Speaker 1: good ecosystems of apps like it. It's the app environment

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Speaker 1: within Apple is pretty safe. They vet the apps that

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Speaker 1: go in there, and if there's a problem, they go

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Speaker 1: after it. Right. They have this kind of reputation of

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Speaker 1: doing it, and they've been doing it for over a decade.

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Speaker 1: Others don't tend to have that same environment. So in

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Speaker 1: sort of the Android world or Google world, right, there's

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Speaker 1: tons of different phones. All those phones have different uise,

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Speaker 1: every single provider of apps is acts differently and all

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Speaker 1: this kind of stuff. So so in the you know,

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Speaker 1: in the kind of Microsoft and all those different worlds,

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Speaker 1: there's lots of different software available. And I in those

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Speaker 1: environments where you can just download apps from the internet

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Speaker 1: and slapped them on your machine, willy nilly, I'm a

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Speaker 1: little bit more like, yeah, you should have a V

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Speaker 1: on your computer, antivirus on your computer. The reason is

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Speaker 1: is that's the thing that's protecting your desktop. Now, you're right,

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Speaker 1: it is getting maybe less important as we move everything

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Speaker 1: to the cloud. Maybe in ten years time, our whole

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Speaker 1: lives are going to be like iPads, right, we will

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Speaker 1: just have this system and then everything we interact on

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Speaker 1: is actually its own little app. And that's a different

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Speaker 1: environment from a computer where you can have a desktop,

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Speaker 1: you have your own data on your system, you've got

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Speaker 1: things that work on the computer, and you're using the cloud.

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Speaker 1: So a V on a computer, I think it's a

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Speaker 1: good idea. A V on your phone. I don't know

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Speaker 1: if I would do it. I don't one other thing too.

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Speaker 1: You know, we talk about using WiFi like you started

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Speaker 1: to talk about cell phones there. But you know, when

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Speaker 1: we're using our our phones, we recommend for folks often

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Speaker 1: to use WiFi in order to save money, right, in

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Speaker 1: order to limit their their data usage. But what about

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Speaker 1: public WiFi? You know, like how safe is that? Is

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Speaker 1: that something we want to avoid altogether? Or are some

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Speaker 1: networks maybe a little bit safer than others? Yeah? You

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Speaker 1: all every answer I want to say. It depends, right,

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Speaker 1: salesman depends Um? So okay, So the way to think

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Speaker 1: of WiFi is that's like a middleman, right. It's the

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Speaker 1: middleman that takes the question from your phone or the

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Speaker 1: search you're making on your phone and delivers it to

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Speaker 1: wherever you need it to be delivered to. And they're

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Speaker 1: just basically batting the ball back and forth, and the

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Speaker 1: ball the tennis ball that goes back and forth. Um.

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Speaker 1: So if you're using encrypted services, so once I could

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Speaker 1: come off top of my head, there's like what'sapp or signal?

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Speaker 1: These are apps that offer encryption within the app. The

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Speaker 1: middleman can't see what you're doing. You're giving him the

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Speaker 1: ball inside a box, right, they don't know what's inside

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Speaker 1: the box. It could be anything and they're just bringing

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Speaker 1: it back and forth. Um, but when you're using your

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Speaker 1: device and on something that isn't encrypted, then the WiFi

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Speaker 1: agent that little you know, sees everything. So your local

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Speaker 1: coffee shop, for example, their WiFi, they probably don't care

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Speaker 1: and aren't looking at what you're searching for. But what

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Speaker 1: if someone's in the coffee shop that sets up a

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Speaker 1: fake WiFi hot spot that looks super super similar to

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Speaker 1: the real hot spots. So you get in there and

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Speaker 1: you go, oh, there's two of them. Maybe this won't

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Speaker 1: be faster, and you know it may have a legit

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Speaker 1: sounding name, and then you know you might you know,

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Speaker 1: I don't know if I would spot that. So so

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Speaker 1: the tricks to this, right, if this happens, it is

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Speaker 1: two things you want to protect when what you're worried

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Speaker 1: about in that situation is protecting the data on your phone.

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Speaker 1: And there's there's a few ways you can do that.

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Speaker 1: You can use VPNs. Right that the VPN on your

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Speaker 1: phone and you turn it on when you're using any

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Speaker 1: WiFi that you're not like, this is not mine or

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Speaker 1: my mom's or my best friends. Right, use the VPN.

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Speaker 1: People don't like it because it does slow things down

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Speaker 1: a little bit because it's scrambling everything up as it

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Speaker 1: does the transfer. But it means what you're doing is

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Speaker 1: going to be encrypted. Now again, you've got to trust

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Speaker 1: the VPN guy, right, because if you don't trust the

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Speaker 1: VPN guy, they're seeing everything you're sending them. So it'll

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Speaker 1: be quiet until it gets to them. You know, the

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Speaker 1: VPN guys can see it. So this is again you

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Speaker 1: want to go for bona fide names. If you're new

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Speaker 1: to VPNs, go for the big guys. There's a lot

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Speaker 1: of suspicious VPN companies out there, let's put it that way,

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Speaker 1: So trust your VPN provider before you decide. And so

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Speaker 1: many more ads for VPNs lately to money. Yeah, it

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Speaker 1: seems like it's like something that's proliferating as people are

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Speaker 1: more concerned about their privacy online. A lot of people

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Speaker 1: are really looking into into the VPN thing. So yeah,

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Speaker 1: is that something that more people should be considering you think?

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Speaker 1: I mean, if you're at home a lot and you

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Speaker 1: tend to just use your home WiFi or trusted WiFi

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Speaker 1: at people's houses or at places you trust, and when

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Speaker 1: you're out you tend to use sell data. I think

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Speaker 1: you probably wouldn't need it, so I would never I

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Speaker 1: wouldn't bother using us a VPN at home, for example.

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Speaker 1: But if ever you're in a coffee shop or an

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Speaker 1: airport or in places like that when you're bored, you know,

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Speaker 1: like think about the places where you're bor I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: plan my phone for a bit, right, and I don't

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Speaker 1: want to really hammer my my own you know, my

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Speaker 1: own dicell data coverage, so I'll just go I'll just

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Speaker 1: go on the WiFi. Totally cool. Think about either using

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Speaker 1: a VPN in that state, or if you're doing something

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Speaker 1: that's like if you're just streaming a movie, you know,

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Speaker 1: maybe that's okay, right, like that the VPN might interfere

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Speaker 1: with that. So that's where the problem is always cost

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Speaker 1: benefit with security, right, Phones and all these devices are

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Speaker 1: there to make your life sexier and faster and more

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Speaker 1: fun and you know, slicker, and then on the other

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Speaker 1: side you got this thing go oh, but be careful, right,

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Speaker 1: So so it's about like the bells and whistles, and

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Speaker 1: also about responsibility. Cars are really cool, Porsches are gray,

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Speaker 1: Lamborghins are great, but you need a seat belt in

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Speaker 1: air bag. So that's the way to think about it. Okay, No,

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Speaker 1: that's really helpful. All right, we'll care all we have.

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Speaker 1: We have a lot more questions for you. Beer, start drinking,

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Speaker 1: and we'll take a break, and then when we get back,

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Speaker 1: we'll start talking about social media and how creepy can

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Speaker 1: me Alright, we're back from the break. We're speaking with

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Speaker 1: Carol about cybersecurity, and Carol, let's let's talk about social media.

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Speaker 1: You know, we we teased to it before the break,

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Speaker 1: So let's talk about technology creeping me out? You know,

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Speaker 1: what's the deal with being fed ads for a product

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Speaker 1: or a company after mentioning it in real life? You know,

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Speaker 1: like there have been times where when I know that

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Speaker 1: I haven't searched for something online and where I've only

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Speaker 1: talked about it in real life, and then the next

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Speaker 1: time I hop on Instagram, right there's an advertisement right

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Speaker 1: there that's just waiting on me, that is the exact product,

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Speaker 1: even though it's not something I would ever uh normally

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Speaker 1: search for. How does that happen? Okay? Well, okay, so

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Speaker 1: so so I don't know, but I'm with you, Okay,

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Speaker 1: I've got I'm with you because I feel the same

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Speaker 1: thing was happening, right. I kept seeing that I'd be

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Speaker 1: talking to someone where I would send Like I would

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Speaker 1: be on the phone with my brother, I would send

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Speaker 1: him a link and suddenly in of my feeds would

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Speaker 1: be that thing. And you're like, how did that happen?

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Speaker 1: What it turned out to be And this is thanks

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Speaker 1: to Apple's latest update when they did Abida. They started

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Speaker 1: showing what information was being transferred over from app to app,

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Speaker 1: and it turned out that when you copy and paste,

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Speaker 1: like say a link to put it into a text message,

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Speaker 1: sometimes the apps would pick those up right. And so

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Speaker 1: loads like New York Times for example, did it read

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Speaker 1: it was doing it. Loads of like bona fide good

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Speaker 1: apps were doing it, and it was just this kind

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Speaker 1: of hidden thing. So they just go and hoover your

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Speaker 1: whatever is in your clipboard when the when you open

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Speaker 1: the app, for example, and people started shouting. But that's

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Speaker 1: why I think it was happening, right, Because if you're

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Speaker 1: on Facebook and you're like, oh, I saw this really

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Speaker 1: cool thing. I'm gonna send it to my friend via

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Speaker 1: whatever another app, you're copying it, aren't you You're copying

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Speaker 1: and pasting, and you're leaving the app and you're coming

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Speaker 1: back in. So that's what I think was happening, and

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Speaker 1: maybe on iPhones it will stop now because a lot

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Speaker 1: of people pulled out because I you know, iPhone made

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Speaker 1: a big people that saw it made a big stay

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Speaker 1: to Apple about it and to the apps. That begs

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Speaker 1: the question then about the requests that apps make when

425
00:21:07,040 --> 00:21:09,800
Speaker 1: you do download them, Like they want microphone access or

426
00:21:09,840 --> 00:21:12,320
Speaker 1: camera access, and so they're asking for for access to

427
00:21:12,359 --> 00:21:15,960
Speaker 1: all these different privileges on your phone. And how should

428
00:21:16,000 --> 00:21:18,119
Speaker 1: we think about that? I mean, should we just have

429
00:21:18,320 --> 00:21:20,480
Speaker 1: fewer apps, a few or more trusted apps? I mean,

430
00:21:20,520 --> 00:21:23,520
Speaker 1: like how do I decide which apps we're going to

431
00:21:23,560 --> 00:21:26,600
Speaker 1: download which ones we aren't? Yeah, so less apps is

432
00:21:26,600 --> 00:21:28,400
Speaker 1: a good thing. I think a lot of us need

433
00:21:28,440 --> 00:21:31,840
Speaker 1: to do a bit of you know, iPhone or phone hygiene. Right.

434
00:21:32,119 --> 00:21:34,119
Speaker 1: So there are a lot of game apps or stuff

435
00:21:34,119 --> 00:21:36,320
Speaker 1: you downloaded because you're babysitting your nephew, you are playing

436
00:21:36,359 --> 00:21:38,399
Speaker 1: with your kids, are doing something right, and it's just

437
00:21:38,480 --> 00:21:41,679
Speaker 1: sitting there and you got it because it was free. Well,

438
00:21:42,000 --> 00:21:45,000
Speaker 1: free apps are trying to get something out of you

439
00:21:45,080 --> 00:21:48,880
Speaker 1: as well. Maybe it's information, maybe it's at buyings inside.

440
00:21:48,920 --> 00:21:51,720
Speaker 1: Once you've downloaded the app. So my advice on this

441
00:21:51,920 --> 00:21:54,600
Speaker 1: is check your apps, right, the ones you don't use,

442
00:21:54,680 --> 00:21:56,560
Speaker 1: get rid of, and I don't just mean delete them,

443
00:21:56,880 --> 00:21:59,240
Speaker 1: try and close the account before you delete it, but

444
00:21:59,280 --> 00:22:02,000
Speaker 1: get it off your phone. Keep the apps you like.

445
00:22:02,680 --> 00:22:05,480
Speaker 1: In the apps you like, go check the configuration options

446
00:22:05,600 --> 00:22:08,880
Speaker 1: just to make sure you're comfy. They're not very complicated, right.

447
00:22:09,119 --> 00:22:11,040
Speaker 1: And what I do, because I'm a big geek on

448
00:22:11,080 --> 00:22:14,760
Speaker 1: this is I check their privacy stuff because, for example,

449
00:22:14,800 --> 00:22:16,919
Speaker 1: how much information do you put on Facebook or on

450
00:22:16,960 --> 00:22:19,879
Speaker 1: your social media's and you know, do you care that

451
00:22:19,960 --> 00:22:23,719
Speaker 1: they might just share that with any third party they deem? Okay,

452
00:22:23,720 --> 00:22:26,320
Speaker 1: be that anyone, right, it's not to you who they

453
00:22:26,320 --> 00:22:28,760
Speaker 1: share it with. So sometimes you want to go read

454
00:22:28,800 --> 00:22:30,600
Speaker 1: these things and decide, actually, I'm gonna be using it

455
00:22:30,640 --> 00:22:33,679
Speaker 1: for this specific person purpose and I don't actually trust

456
00:22:33,760 --> 00:22:37,480
Speaker 1: this particular company or this app with that information. So

457
00:22:37,880 --> 00:22:39,640
Speaker 1: again you got to use your nose. Right. The same

458
00:22:39,680 --> 00:22:41,560
Speaker 1: as a car, you know, if I said, hey, I'll

459
00:22:41,600 --> 00:22:43,200
Speaker 1: come pick you up, and you saw my old beater

460
00:22:43,720 --> 00:22:47,000
Speaker 1: right with three wheels and no and no winshield, no seatbelts,

461
00:22:47,040 --> 00:22:49,760
Speaker 1: you might go, actually it might take the bus, thanks, Right,

462
00:22:49,840 --> 00:22:51,040
Speaker 1: So that's the kind of thing you got to do

463
00:22:51,080 --> 00:22:52,959
Speaker 1: with apps just because they got pretty pictures. Don't think

464
00:22:52,960 --> 00:22:55,199
Speaker 1: they're all built the same, right, Yeah, I feel like

465
00:22:55,200 --> 00:22:57,040
Speaker 1: so many apps are are kind of guilty of this,

466
00:22:57,119 --> 00:22:58,840
Speaker 1: you know. But I don't like the idea of these

467
00:22:58,840 --> 00:23:01,760
Speaker 1: different tech companies leaning and harvesting my, like my data.

468
00:23:01,880 --> 00:23:05,119
Speaker 1: I'm personally less worried about their ability to to target

469
00:23:05,160 --> 00:23:07,840
Speaker 1: me with you know, customized ads um and I'm more

470
00:23:07,880 --> 00:23:10,080
Speaker 1: concerned with, you know, with hackers trying to break into

471
00:23:10,119 --> 00:23:13,240
Speaker 1: my accounts, you know, and say you drain my savings account,

472
00:23:13,280 --> 00:23:16,240
Speaker 1: like you mentioned earlier. And so how can the information

473
00:23:16,560 --> 00:23:19,520
Speaker 1: that we post on social media put our our money

474
00:23:19,560 --> 00:23:22,760
Speaker 1: at risk? Well, like we were talking about earlier, people

475
00:23:22,840 --> 00:23:25,120
Speaker 1: tend to give lots of stuff away on social media.

476
00:23:25,240 --> 00:23:27,760
Speaker 1: Pictures of their kids, maybe the front of their house.

477
00:23:27,840 --> 00:23:30,280
Speaker 1: They might name the town or the street they live on.

478
00:23:30,760 --> 00:23:34,359
Speaker 1: They might all these little glimpses of information, these little

479
00:23:34,400 --> 00:23:37,399
Speaker 1: tiny piece of information can be just hoovered up and

480
00:23:37,480 --> 00:23:40,280
Speaker 1: to build up a profile of who you are. And

481
00:23:40,320 --> 00:23:43,280
Speaker 1: that is what right now is kind of traded amongst

482
00:23:43,320 --> 00:23:46,080
Speaker 1: the ad companies, right the Google sell this to add companies.

483
00:23:46,119 --> 00:23:47,840
Speaker 1: They say, this is the profile of this person. So

484
00:23:47,840 --> 00:23:50,879
Speaker 1: then they can target those ads at you. Now. Just today,

485
00:23:50,880 --> 00:23:53,040
Speaker 1: I recorded Smashing Securely earlier today and we had a

486
00:23:53,040 --> 00:23:55,840
Speaker 1: guy on Tim Hwang who's just written a book saying, actually,

487
00:23:55,920 --> 00:23:59,320
Speaker 1: that bubble is crazy. They they're hoovering all that information

488
00:23:59,359 --> 00:24:02,040
Speaker 1: from you, but they they're using it isn't actually working

489
00:24:02,080 --> 00:24:04,760
Speaker 1: for them. It's not actually ending up in money in

490
00:24:04,760 --> 00:24:07,240
Speaker 1: the pockets of the advertisers. It's ending on the pockets

491
00:24:07,240 --> 00:24:10,240
Speaker 1: of people like Google. Right. So, so he's kind of

492
00:24:10,280 --> 00:24:12,080
Speaker 1: referring to almost like he calls the book is called

493
00:24:12,080 --> 00:24:14,480
Speaker 1: like some prime. So it's like a big ad bubble,

494
00:24:14,640 --> 00:24:16,879
Speaker 1: same as the housing bubble that existed, which would be

495
00:24:16,920 --> 00:24:20,040
Speaker 1: perfect for this podcast. Ads are a crazy, crazy environment

496
00:24:20,119 --> 00:24:22,040
Speaker 1: right now. The digital ads you see on websites are

497
00:24:22,080 --> 00:24:25,880
Speaker 1: all digitally placed and not handcrafted by people that care. Um.

498
00:24:26,320 --> 00:24:28,240
Speaker 1: They're there to try and get you to click on them,

499
00:24:28,280 --> 00:24:30,119
Speaker 1: and everyone's trying to get a piece of the money

500
00:24:30,119 --> 00:24:31,719
Speaker 1: out of it, and not all of Some of them

501
00:24:31,760 --> 00:24:34,480
Speaker 1: have are malicious, right, Some of the ads might look

502
00:24:34,480 --> 00:24:36,280
Speaker 1: bona fide, but actually click on it and you're going

503
00:24:36,280 --> 00:24:38,040
Speaker 1: to a site that looks exactly like the place you

504
00:24:38,080 --> 00:24:41,400
Speaker 1: wanted to go, but it's actually a fake site, so

505
00:24:41,480 --> 00:24:43,439
Speaker 1: you got to check your links. So don't click on

506
00:24:43,480 --> 00:24:46,000
Speaker 1: ads is basically the answer. And use ad blockers. That's

507
00:24:46,000 --> 00:24:48,639
Speaker 1: what I suggest. Use an ad blocker. Using that blocker,

508
00:24:48,720 --> 00:24:50,520
Speaker 1: just get them out of your face. Your web experience

509
00:24:50,560 --> 00:24:53,520
Speaker 1: is so much nicer with an ad blocker, and they'll

510
00:24:53,520 --> 00:24:55,280
Speaker 1: figure out a new way to monetize the web. Don't

511
00:24:55,320 --> 00:24:59,040
Speaker 1: worry about them. Well, as we're talking about to like

512
00:24:59,080 --> 00:25:01,080
Speaker 1: it's something we haven't covered yet. We're talking about social

513
00:25:01,080 --> 00:25:03,959
Speaker 1: media and oftentimes, like you can log in with your

514
00:25:03,960 --> 00:25:07,160
Speaker 1: Facebook account or with your Google account. Um, good point

515
00:25:07,640 --> 00:25:11,359
Speaker 1: on like hundreds of websites. Now, is there anything inherently

516
00:25:11,560 --> 00:25:14,920
Speaker 1: risky about logging in with you know that one log

517
00:25:14,960 --> 00:25:17,200
Speaker 1: in on like just tons of different websites that you

518
00:25:17,240 --> 00:25:19,959
Speaker 1: do business with, whether it's an online retailer or whoever.

519
00:25:20,480 --> 00:25:23,520
Speaker 1: So let's say it was your Facebook account and your

520
00:25:23,640 --> 00:25:30,439
Speaker 1: password was Bob the Dog. It's great, and that password

521
00:25:30,560 --> 00:25:34,080
Speaker 1: somehow got guessed by someone because there's lots of pictures

522
00:25:34,080 --> 00:25:36,800
Speaker 1: of Bob the Dog on your social media and they

523
00:25:36,840 --> 00:25:38,760
Speaker 1: find it, so then they can go around and find

524
00:25:38,920 --> 00:25:41,800
Speaker 1: every other website that might be using that same interest.

525
00:25:41,960 --> 00:25:44,879
Speaker 1: So I'm not a fan of those I'm similar to

526
00:25:45,080 --> 00:25:48,480
Speaker 1: using the same password across all platforms. Yeah, so I'm

527
00:25:48,520 --> 00:25:51,200
Speaker 1: a big fan of the whole password manager every store.

528
00:25:51,400 --> 00:25:54,159
Speaker 1: Just again, you have to trust the password manager, right,

529
00:25:54,160 --> 00:25:55,920
Speaker 1: So don't go with someone you don't trust. Do your

530
00:25:55,920 --> 00:25:58,640
Speaker 1: research on that. That's the most important bit. And then

531
00:25:58,680 --> 00:26:01,520
Speaker 1: that is your vault, and it gives you unique places everywhere.

532
00:26:01,560 --> 00:26:04,200
Speaker 1: So if someone hacks one thing, they're hacking only that

533
00:26:04,280 --> 00:26:07,240
Speaker 1: one thing. Which you know, how many websites do most

534
00:26:07,240 --> 00:26:09,960
Speaker 1: people have at least fifty probably with Lawkins, I mean

535
00:26:10,040 --> 00:26:12,239
Speaker 1: about thousands. But you know I'm I'm on the other

536
00:26:12,320 --> 00:26:15,960
Speaker 1: side of that. I'm the digital sphere, right, So, yeah,

537
00:26:16,160 --> 00:26:18,000
Speaker 1: that that's what I would advise on that. Right. So

538
00:26:18,040 --> 00:26:20,239
Speaker 1: we're talking about Facebook, let's shoft gears a little bit.

539
00:26:20,240 --> 00:26:22,400
Speaker 1: What about cameras? You know, should we should we take

540
00:26:22,400 --> 00:26:25,639
Speaker 1: our cues from Mark Zuckerberg. Uh, there's this photo of

541
00:26:25,760 --> 00:26:27,800
Speaker 1: him sitting at his laptop working and he's got some

542
00:26:27,920 --> 00:26:30,800
Speaker 1: tape over his camera on his laptop. Should we be

543
00:26:30,880 --> 00:26:32,800
Speaker 1: taking keys from him and kind of be doing something

544
00:26:32,880 --> 00:26:35,200
Speaker 1: like that? Do you know? I want to ten years ago,

545
00:26:35,320 --> 00:26:37,479
Speaker 1: maybe when they first started coming out, you know, cameras

546
00:26:37,480 --> 00:26:39,200
Speaker 1: that we had to do video calls in my in

547
00:26:39,240 --> 00:26:41,840
Speaker 1: the business world, and I would have a camera over

548
00:26:41,880 --> 00:26:43,880
Speaker 1: mind all the time that piece of tape over mind

549
00:26:43,920 --> 00:26:46,280
Speaker 1: that it was actually a three M three M sticky note, right,

550
00:26:46,760 --> 00:26:49,440
Speaker 1: And all my colleagues were all geek here than me,

551
00:26:49,720 --> 00:26:52,640
Speaker 1: laughed at me, laughed at me about doing that, thinking

552
00:26:52,680 --> 00:26:55,560
Speaker 1: I was so paranoid, And five years later they're all

553
00:26:55,640 --> 00:26:58,600
Speaker 1: doing it. So I have a cover on all my phones.

554
00:26:58,680 --> 00:27:01,280
Speaker 1: I actually have electrical tape my mobile phone case because

555
00:27:01,280 --> 00:27:04,359
Speaker 1: it wouldn't take my little snippity thing. I think the

556
00:27:04,400 --> 00:27:07,600
Speaker 1: digital ecosystem is basically the wild West right now, and

557
00:27:07,680 --> 00:27:11,040
Speaker 1: it's full of flux. It's super exciting, like every year

558
00:27:11,119 --> 00:27:14,600
Speaker 1: we're hearing something crazy new. But it's because it's the

559
00:27:14,640 --> 00:27:17,719
Speaker 1: wild West. It's not necessarily safe out there, right it's

560
00:27:17,720 --> 00:27:19,399
Speaker 1: a little bit crazy. If you're going to go into it,

561
00:27:19,480 --> 00:27:21,800
Speaker 1: you've got to just keep your nerves. And everyone's addicted

562
00:27:21,840 --> 00:27:23,840
Speaker 1: to it. People have got Alexis in their house and

563
00:27:23,880 --> 00:27:27,119
Speaker 1: all these kind of things, Like everyone's constantly connected to

564
00:27:27,280 --> 00:27:29,600
Speaker 1: the Internet, and so in the same way that you

565
00:27:29,640 --> 00:27:31,960
Speaker 1: would teach your kid out across the road, that is

566
00:27:32,040 --> 00:27:33,680
Speaker 1: what we need to do when we're using these things.

567
00:27:33,800 --> 00:27:36,960
Speaker 1: Even though it seems easy, there's some hidden pitfalls you

568
00:27:36,960 --> 00:27:39,239
Speaker 1: want to you don't want to fall down? Right all right?

569
00:27:39,280 --> 00:27:43,080
Speaker 1: You mentioned smart speakers alexas, Like, how nervous should I

570
00:27:43,200 --> 00:27:45,040
Speaker 1: be that I have one of those in my house?

571
00:27:45,320 --> 00:27:47,480
Speaker 1: And um, usually you know, all we're doing on it

572
00:27:47,640 --> 00:27:49,840
Speaker 1: is asking Alexa to play music for us so we

573
00:27:49,920 --> 00:27:53,920
Speaker 1: can have awesome dance parties. But like, should I should

574
00:27:53,920 --> 00:27:55,359
Speaker 1: I be concerned about having that in my house and

575
00:27:55,400 --> 00:27:58,480
Speaker 1: the fact that it's like listening to everything we're saying? Apparently, well,

576
00:27:58,560 --> 00:28:02,600
Speaker 1: you have it presumably on connected all the time and

577
00:28:02,760 --> 00:28:06,239
Speaker 1: you use it occasionally, right pretty much? Yeah, I mean

578
00:28:06,359 --> 00:28:09,239
Speaker 1: maybe we should unplug it more, That's what I think. Right,

579
00:28:09,280 --> 00:28:11,440
Speaker 1: So I don't have very much. I I would tea

580
00:28:11,480 --> 00:28:13,320
Speaker 1: in my house. And the reason I don't have it's

581
00:28:13,359 --> 00:28:15,760
Speaker 1: not because it's not sexy. I get it. It's so sexy.

582
00:28:15,840 --> 00:28:19,680
Speaker 1: Go hey, Lex, play Hello from Little Ritchie? Right. If

583
00:28:19,720 --> 00:28:21,560
Speaker 1: it works, it works right, and it's easy. You don't

584
00:28:21,560 --> 00:28:23,800
Speaker 1: even have to get up. It's like the lazy man's dream.

585
00:28:24,560 --> 00:28:28,120
Speaker 1: But all these devices are not being made by security experts.

586
00:28:28,160 --> 00:28:30,880
Speaker 1: They're being made by companies that are trying to outbid

587
00:28:31,080 --> 00:28:35,080
Speaker 1: their competitors and get a sale, and they're adding features

588
00:28:35,200 --> 00:28:37,800
Speaker 1: in whiz Bang and if they're racing to get these

589
00:28:37,840 --> 00:28:39,600
Speaker 1: things out the market because it is a hot market,

590
00:28:39,680 --> 00:28:43,680
Speaker 1: the IoT market, how many of these hundreds of different

591
00:28:43,720 --> 00:28:47,560
Speaker 1: companies are actually investing the time into baking insecurity. That's

592
00:28:47,600 --> 00:28:49,600
Speaker 1: what we call it, right Like, so from the get

593
00:28:49,680 --> 00:28:52,360
Speaker 1: go of developing something we want kind of like, what's

594
00:28:52,400 --> 00:28:54,880
Speaker 1: the security implications of this? What's the security implications of this?

595
00:28:55,160 --> 00:28:57,800
Speaker 1: Every step of the way and right now, Because it's

596
00:28:57,840 --> 00:29:00,960
Speaker 1: the wild West, that's not always happening, which is why

597
00:29:01,120 --> 00:29:04,680
Speaker 1: we have those situations of like Alexa recording private conversations

598
00:29:05,200 --> 00:29:08,080
Speaker 1: or private events that happened between family members, or baby

599
00:29:08,120 --> 00:29:10,760
Speaker 1: monitors scaring the poo out of moms, you know because

600
00:29:10,800 --> 00:29:14,400
Speaker 1: they've been hacked, or TVs that watch you back, or

601
00:29:14,480 --> 00:29:16,800
Speaker 1: you've got room bas that actually can map your house

602
00:29:16,840 --> 00:29:19,520
Speaker 1: and then load that up into the cloud, and you've

603
00:29:19,560 --> 00:29:21,680
Speaker 1: got door systems that lock you out of your own house.

604
00:29:21,800 --> 00:29:23,920
Speaker 1: Like these are all the things that are happening right

605
00:29:23,960 --> 00:29:26,120
Speaker 1: now that are in the press day after day. So

606
00:29:26,280 --> 00:29:29,600
Speaker 1: the question you need to ask yourself is is this

607
00:29:29,840 --> 00:29:32,240
Speaker 1: IoT needed in my house? Will it make my life

608
00:29:32,440 --> 00:29:36,320
Speaker 1: measurably better? To incur the risk that I'm in producing

609
00:29:36,360 --> 00:29:40,000
Speaker 1: into my environment. Right, So if Hello by Little Richie

610
00:29:40,080 --> 00:29:41,800
Speaker 1: is what you need to hear every night, then you

611
00:29:41,920 --> 00:29:45,720
Speaker 1: need an Alexa, right? And then maybe do you need

612
00:29:45,800 --> 00:29:48,080
Speaker 1: it on all the time? Right? So do you need

613
00:29:48,120 --> 00:29:50,760
Speaker 1: it to be plugged in and sitting there humming constantly?

614
00:29:51,240 --> 00:29:53,360
Speaker 1: Because all of these things are built by human beings.

615
00:29:53,400 --> 00:29:56,840
Speaker 1: All human beings make mistakes, and you're basically putting microphones

616
00:29:56,880 --> 00:29:59,719
Speaker 1: and video cameras around your house, inside where you live,

617
00:29:59,760 --> 00:30:02,040
Speaker 1: where you're trying and then you're trying to protect privacy.

618
00:30:02,840 --> 00:30:06,880
Speaker 1: So it's it's a really hard it's a hard environment. Yeah.

619
00:30:06,920 --> 00:30:09,760
Speaker 1: So I saw a story recently about a coffee maker

620
00:30:11,200 --> 00:30:13,719
Speaker 1: that some you know, some security experts. They basically we're

621
00:30:13,720 --> 00:30:15,720
Speaker 1: trying to figure out like where are the security issues.

622
00:30:15,880 --> 00:30:18,200
Speaker 1: They were able to reverse engineering and basically make it

623
00:30:18,280 --> 00:30:21,160
Speaker 1: to where like something like where the coffee maker could

624
00:30:21,280 --> 00:30:24,520
Speaker 1: demand a ransom, Like did you see something about that? Yeah? Yeah,

625
00:30:24,600 --> 00:30:26,560
Speaker 1: so so that has kind of been blown out of proportion.

626
00:30:26,640 --> 00:30:28,600
Speaker 1: So they did, they were you know, just you know

627
00:30:28,760 --> 00:30:31,360
Speaker 1: so that so but that was something. So it's true

628
00:30:31,400 --> 00:30:35,040
Speaker 1: that there were bugs inside the software, um, but they

629
00:30:35,080 --> 00:30:37,600
Speaker 1: would be so hard to hack, like you'd have to

630
00:30:37,680 --> 00:30:40,480
Speaker 1: have access to the coffee maker, to the person's phone

631
00:30:40,760 --> 00:30:44,600
Speaker 1: in order to make that hack that this researcher found work. Right.

632
00:30:44,680 --> 00:30:47,040
Speaker 1: So so that's one of the things where we're useful.

633
00:30:47,120 --> 00:30:49,280
Speaker 1: People like us, like smashing security and stuff are useful

634
00:30:49,280 --> 00:30:50,840
Speaker 1: because we'll be able to say, look, I know you

635
00:30:50,960 --> 00:30:54,160
Speaker 1: heard about that in the mainstream press because everyone got excited. Right,

636
00:30:54,240 --> 00:30:55,960
Speaker 1: But that's not when we need to worry about what

637
00:30:56,080 --> 00:30:58,120
Speaker 1: the real things we need to worry about are. Because

638
00:30:58,160 --> 00:31:00,560
Speaker 1: some of them are exciting, you know, joint jurnalist get

639
00:31:00,560 --> 00:31:03,120
Speaker 1: bored to remember that, right, Journalists get bored, and they

640
00:31:03,280 --> 00:31:07,400
Speaker 1: like nice sexy titles and hack coffee machine. Who doesn't

641
00:31:07,400 --> 00:31:11,920
Speaker 1: want to react, right, right, But but it is true

642
00:31:11,960 --> 00:31:15,240
Speaker 1: that IoT is often more easily hacked than not. And

643
00:31:15,320 --> 00:31:17,880
Speaker 1: again it will get better. But right now, you're kind

644
00:31:17,880 --> 00:31:19,600
Speaker 1: of a trail brazer if you're bringing this stuff in

645
00:31:19,640 --> 00:31:21,479
Speaker 1: your house. Even though people say, oh my god, I've

646
00:31:21,480 --> 00:31:24,160
Speaker 1: already got version three, you're still in the big grand

647
00:31:24,200 --> 00:31:26,360
Speaker 1: scheme of things, a trailblazer and bringing these things into

648
00:31:26,400 --> 00:31:29,080
Speaker 1: your house. So do your due diligence, check your privacies.

649
00:31:30,000 --> 00:31:32,040
Speaker 1: You know you're paying for this, right, Remember that you're

650
00:31:32,040 --> 00:31:35,000
Speaker 1: paying for these pieces of kit. So if the privacy says, oh,

651
00:31:35,000 --> 00:31:36,720
Speaker 1: we're gonna share your data with everybody and it's totally

652
00:31:36,760 --> 00:31:38,440
Speaker 1: cool and we're gonna track you everywhere you go, is

653
00:31:38,520 --> 00:31:41,360
Speaker 1: that okay with you? It sounds like being a luddite

654
00:31:41,520 --> 00:31:44,959
Speaker 1: is better for our security and better for our wallets too.

655
00:31:45,080 --> 00:31:48,000
Speaker 1: Right there you go. I'm certainly still when I'm clinging,

656
00:31:48,520 --> 00:31:53,640
Speaker 1: clinging to my wooden desk desperately. All right, well, coirl,

657
00:31:53,680 --> 00:31:56,000
Speaker 1: We've got a couple more questions for you, including kind

658
00:31:56,040 --> 00:31:59,760
Speaker 1: of cybersecurity and the upcoming presidential election. Um, so we'll

659
00:31:59,800 --> 00:32:02,920
Speaker 1: get a couple of those questions with you right after

660
00:32:03,000 --> 00:32:14,200
Speaker 1: this break. All right, we're back from the break talking

661
00:32:14,240 --> 00:32:17,880
Speaker 1: with Carol. And Carol you're you're a Canadian the UK,

662
00:32:18,120 --> 00:32:20,520
Speaker 1: so I'm not sure if you've heard, but here in

663
00:32:20,520 --> 00:32:22,160
Speaker 1: the US we're actually in the middle of an election,

664
00:32:22,360 --> 00:32:27,000
Speaker 1: are you. Yeah, it's been really civil and fun. Yeah,

665
00:32:27,400 --> 00:32:30,480
Speaker 1: it's been. It's looked so fun, really really felt. I've

666
00:32:30,520 --> 00:32:33,240
Speaker 1: really been so jealous of all of you, just all

667
00:32:33,280 --> 00:32:36,680
Speaker 1: the normal times that we're having over here. However, you know,

668
00:32:36,720 --> 00:32:41,400
Speaker 1: are there individual security concerns surrounding the presidential election? I

669
00:32:41,440 --> 00:32:43,280
Speaker 1: would like to hear. Yeah, it's just some of the

670
00:32:43,320 --> 00:32:46,440
Speaker 1: stories that you've been researching in regards to that. Well,

671
00:32:46,560 --> 00:32:48,520
Speaker 1: this is this is a perfect kind of almost like

672
00:32:48,600 --> 00:32:51,360
Speaker 1: a segue to what we were talking about at the beginning, right. So,

673
00:32:51,800 --> 00:32:55,240
Speaker 1: so we're in the era right now of fake news

674
00:32:55,400 --> 00:32:59,120
Speaker 1: and misinformation, right so, and we know that this is happening.

675
00:32:59,160 --> 00:33:02,360
Speaker 1: Everyone is telling that's happening, and lots of parties are

676
00:33:02,600 --> 00:33:05,800
Speaker 1: trying to convince this and change our ideologies to you know,

677
00:33:05,920 --> 00:33:08,920
Speaker 1: to to really strengthen our views in certain ways. And

678
00:33:09,200 --> 00:33:11,360
Speaker 1: it's again, it's about us to be able to read

679
00:33:11,600 --> 00:33:14,600
Speaker 1: what you carefully what we're sending before we send it on.

680
00:33:14,720 --> 00:33:16,440
Speaker 1: So that's the biggest thing on that front. That's how

681
00:33:16,520 --> 00:33:20,080
Speaker 1: you can help. Don't send stuff because the title was nice, right,

682
00:33:20,200 --> 00:33:21,600
Speaker 1: check it out first and make sure you want to

683
00:33:21,600 --> 00:33:24,760
Speaker 1: send it to people. So we have this election going on,

684
00:33:25,080 --> 00:33:26,840
Speaker 1: and remember at the beginning of this we were talking

685
00:33:26,880 --> 00:33:29,400
Speaker 1: about how everyone is focused on the same thing. Well,

686
00:33:29,440 --> 00:33:31,960
Speaker 1: guess what, you guys are like little goldfish in a

687
00:33:32,040 --> 00:33:34,880
Speaker 1: fish bowl for hackers, because all of you care about

688
00:33:34,920 --> 00:33:38,120
Speaker 1: the elections no matter what side anyone's on, you care

689
00:33:38,160 --> 00:33:40,000
Speaker 1: about the outcome. You care about it in your state,

690
00:33:40,040 --> 00:33:41,600
Speaker 1: you care about it, in your cities, you care about

691
00:33:41,600 --> 00:33:44,280
Speaker 1: in your country, and so you may be looking for

692
00:33:44,440 --> 00:33:47,840
Speaker 1: information online to try and maybe check out an opinion

693
00:33:48,000 --> 00:33:51,680
Speaker 1: validate your own opinions. And people know that, and they're

694
00:33:51,680 --> 00:33:53,800
Speaker 1: going to try and lead you down roots that you

695
00:33:53,840 --> 00:33:55,880
Speaker 1: don't necessarily want to go down, by pretending to be

696
00:33:55,960 --> 00:33:58,480
Speaker 1: a news article about exactly what you want to read about,

697
00:33:58,520 --> 00:34:01,240
Speaker 1: and inside that news article might be hey, get this free,

698
00:34:02,000 --> 00:34:04,360
Speaker 1: uh you know, e book all about this, and that

699
00:34:04,480 --> 00:34:07,480
Speaker 1: might be malicious. So again you have to keep your

700
00:34:07,520 --> 00:34:09,719
Speaker 1: wits about you. The other way they get through to you.

701
00:34:09,840 --> 00:34:11,320
Speaker 1: So the big things you want to watch out for

702
00:34:11,480 --> 00:34:15,399
Speaker 1: is electoral ads, So don't click on the ads. Watch

703
00:34:15,520 --> 00:34:18,920
Speaker 1: out for emails in your system, like especially if it

704
00:34:18,960 --> 00:34:21,799
Speaker 1: comes like safe from your anti Hilda and it says, how,

705
00:34:21,800 --> 00:34:23,920
Speaker 1: oh my god, news about the elections. You've got to

706
00:34:23,960 --> 00:34:26,360
Speaker 1: read this and you think anti Hilda hasn't written to

707
00:34:26,400 --> 00:34:30,000
Speaker 1: me in six months? What? Okay, she may have been hacked, right,

708
00:34:30,080 --> 00:34:33,200
Speaker 1: And so the name of the person that has emailed

709
00:34:33,239 --> 00:34:35,960
Speaker 1: you is not the soul way you should validate and

710
00:34:36,120 --> 00:34:39,360
Speaker 1: emails you know to be good, Okay, you have to

711
00:34:39,440 --> 00:34:42,880
Speaker 1: look at if it doesn't feel right trusted. Now, what's

712
00:34:42,920 --> 00:34:45,120
Speaker 1: good is lots of email. If you guys have been

713
00:34:45,160 --> 00:34:48,400
Speaker 1: keeping up to date with all your security patches, you

714
00:34:48,480 --> 00:34:50,360
Speaker 1: know how your computers will say, oh, you have an

715
00:34:50,440 --> 00:34:53,759
Speaker 1: update waiting right, don't don't delay on those things right

716
00:34:53,960 --> 00:34:57,440
Speaker 1: update right away. That's really important. Those are like new

717
00:34:57,520 --> 00:35:00,480
Speaker 1: found vulnerabilities that hackers are going after because trying to

718
00:35:00,640 --> 00:35:03,439
Speaker 1: race you from updating it. Try and get that whole.

719
00:35:03,800 --> 00:35:07,960
Speaker 1: So always do your updates. Don't click on emails and

720
00:35:08,120 --> 00:35:10,120
Speaker 1: links and emails go to the website. So if you

721
00:35:10,360 --> 00:35:12,400
Speaker 1: read something that sounds really interesting, then go to the

722
00:35:12,480 --> 00:35:14,360
Speaker 1: web and go search for that thing. Don't click on

723
00:35:14,400 --> 00:35:17,640
Speaker 1: the link from it and watch your emails, because that

724
00:35:17,800 --> 00:35:19,560
Speaker 1: is where it's going to happen. You may get a

725
00:35:19,640 --> 00:35:23,120
Speaker 1: government or a you know what, a local local election

726
00:35:23,440 --> 00:35:26,160
Speaker 1: information that the you know, the place is closed, for example.

727
00:35:26,280 --> 00:35:28,160
Speaker 1: You might panic, and you might that's what they want

728
00:35:28,320 --> 00:35:30,000
Speaker 1: you to do. They want you to panic and click

729
00:35:31,040 --> 00:35:32,919
Speaker 1: and you feel that panic rise. Just take a breath,

730
00:35:33,040 --> 00:35:35,440
Speaker 1: calm down and read it again and then decide what

731
00:35:35,440 --> 00:35:36,600
Speaker 1: you want to do. And if you don't know what

732
00:35:36,680 --> 00:35:38,640
Speaker 1: to do, don't do anything. Call someone who knows more

733
00:35:38,680 --> 00:35:41,600
Speaker 1: about it. Right, Just stop right, right, Yeah, basically, I

734
00:35:41,600 --> 00:35:43,440
Speaker 1: mean it sounds like they're looking. I mean they see

735
00:35:43,440 --> 00:35:46,160
Speaker 1: an opportunity sort of like you're saying, like, this is

736
00:35:46,200 --> 00:35:48,640
Speaker 1: what people are talking about. This is on people's minds,

737
00:35:48,680 --> 00:35:51,800
Speaker 1: and because of that, they're looking to exploit that emotion,

738
00:35:52,000 --> 00:35:54,600
Speaker 1: take advantage of people looking for more that information that's

739
00:35:54,600 --> 00:35:57,560
Speaker 1: out there. They're pouncing on that opportunity. And think about it.

740
00:35:57,640 --> 00:35:59,640
Speaker 1: There's a lot of people right now out of work,

741
00:36:00,160 --> 00:36:02,480
Speaker 1: all right, there's a lot of people facing out of work,

742
00:36:02,480 --> 00:36:03,640
Speaker 1: and there's a lot of people they're going to be

743
00:36:03,680 --> 00:36:06,880
Speaker 1: facing a lot of difficult decisions and difficult bills. You know,

744
00:36:07,000 --> 00:36:09,120
Speaker 1: no one wants to be scammed, no one wants to

745
00:36:09,200 --> 00:36:13,120
Speaker 1: be hacked. So so just be very wary of of

746
00:36:13,760 --> 00:36:15,400
Speaker 1: you know, people need to make money and this is

747
00:36:15,440 --> 00:36:17,640
Speaker 1: a great way. This is attracting more and more people.

748
00:36:17,719 --> 00:36:20,719
Speaker 1: So this is not just Russian organized criminals that are

749
00:36:20,800 --> 00:36:23,560
Speaker 1: doing these kind of things, right, It's also people that

750
00:36:23,600 --> 00:36:26,120
Speaker 1: could live down the street from you and because they're

751
00:36:26,120 --> 00:36:27,719
Speaker 1: they're you know, they know a bit about computers and

752
00:36:27,760 --> 00:36:29,799
Speaker 1: they're in a tight way, right, they need some cash.

753
00:36:30,680 --> 00:36:32,239
Speaker 1: So what you want to watch out through these things

754
00:36:32,280 --> 00:36:34,719
Speaker 1: because ransomware is another thing you want to work worry about, right,

755
00:36:34,760 --> 00:36:37,040
Speaker 1: So these are the downsides to all these things. If

756
00:36:37,040 --> 00:36:39,480
Speaker 1: you actually click on the phishing emails, is like suddenly

757
00:36:39,560 --> 00:36:41,960
Speaker 1: all your content on your computer is locked and you

758
00:36:42,000 --> 00:36:43,520
Speaker 1: can't get access to it unless you give him a

759
00:36:43,560 --> 00:36:46,600
Speaker 1: grand right. And and that can be a very difficult

760
00:36:46,600 --> 00:36:48,440
Speaker 1: situation because do you want to pay the bad guy

761
00:36:48,520 --> 00:36:50,360
Speaker 1: for your information or do you want it to be

762
00:36:50,400 --> 00:36:54,000
Speaker 1: splashed all over the internet. So there are difficult things, right,

763
00:36:54,040 --> 00:36:55,960
Speaker 1: And we use these computers and often we try to

764
00:36:56,000 --> 00:36:57,800
Speaker 1: be like ostriches. We just don't which close aurizes that

765
00:36:57,800 --> 00:36:59,120
Speaker 1: they won't happen to me, and what happened to me

766
00:36:59,160 --> 00:37:01,439
Speaker 1: happen to me, but it literally and this is where

767
00:37:01,560 --> 00:37:03,520
Speaker 1: the silver lining to all this. If you use a

768
00:37:03,560 --> 00:37:07,640
Speaker 1: password manager, you have different passports for every single website

769
00:37:07,640 --> 00:37:09,520
Speaker 1: that you use, and you use that manager to manage

770
00:37:09,600 --> 00:37:12,520
Speaker 1: that you employed if where you can you know multi

771
00:37:12,600 --> 00:37:15,319
Speaker 1: factor of authentication or two factor authentication, that's when they

772
00:37:15,360 --> 00:37:18,280
Speaker 1: send you an SMS code or they send you an

773
00:37:18,320 --> 00:37:21,560
Speaker 1: authenticator on your phone. Those things are really good. It's

774
00:37:21,600 --> 00:37:23,960
Speaker 1: like a second kind of hurdle to make sure you

775
00:37:24,120 --> 00:37:26,400
Speaker 1: are you, and it makes it that much harder for

776
00:37:26,440 --> 00:37:28,759
Speaker 1: bad guys. They get over the first hurtle, they it's

777
00:37:28,840 --> 00:37:31,200
Speaker 1: very rare to get over the second one. Speaking about

778
00:37:31,239 --> 00:37:33,680
Speaker 1: not letting our information get in other people's hands, get

779
00:37:33,680 --> 00:37:36,200
Speaker 1: splashed all over the internet. Sometimes on the show Matt

780
00:37:36,280 --> 00:37:37,800
Speaker 1: and I, we talked about ways to to make some

781
00:37:38,040 --> 00:37:41,640
Speaker 1: quick money by decluttering, get getting rid of any valuables

782
00:37:41,760 --> 00:37:44,160
Speaker 1: laying around the house. Oftentimes those are you know, old

783
00:37:44,200 --> 00:37:47,440
Speaker 1: computers that you have, um or or old cell phones

784
00:37:47,680 --> 00:37:49,600
Speaker 1: and some of your personal information is on there. So

785
00:37:49,920 --> 00:37:53,000
Speaker 1: before you're selling a phone or a laptop or or

786
00:37:53,000 --> 00:37:55,680
Speaker 1: a personal computer, like, what should you do? What steps

787
00:37:55,719 --> 00:37:58,520
Speaker 1: that should you take to know that somebody's not gonna

788
00:37:58,520 --> 00:38:00,920
Speaker 1: have access to your personal information and um, once it's

789
00:38:00,960 --> 00:38:03,000
Speaker 1: in their possession. I think put it in a blender

790
00:38:04,800 --> 00:38:07,320
Speaker 1: is the only way. Well, in the old days, In

791
00:38:07,360 --> 00:38:09,120
Speaker 1: the old days, right, you used to be able to

792
00:38:09,200 --> 00:38:11,120
Speaker 1: use a magnet and it would just wipe all the

793
00:38:11,239 --> 00:38:13,360
Speaker 1: information off the phone, like off the tapes, right, but

794
00:38:13,440 --> 00:38:17,799
Speaker 1: now lives out video tape, right, Yeah, but now it's

795
00:38:17,840 --> 00:38:20,320
Speaker 1: all flash drive. So like magnet's don't work. Okay, So

796
00:38:20,440 --> 00:38:21,840
Speaker 1: what do you do the first thing you want to

797
00:38:21,880 --> 00:38:25,040
Speaker 1: do is you want to first get your new device

798
00:38:25,200 --> 00:38:28,520
Speaker 1: up and running. Okay, you do not wipe your phone

799
00:38:28,640 --> 00:38:32,799
Speaker 1: before your new devices up and running. Please to then

800
00:38:33,000 --> 00:38:36,440
Speaker 1: wipe your device and you want to do a factory

801
00:38:36,560 --> 00:38:40,479
Speaker 1: default reset, and my advice don't do it just once,

802
00:38:40,719 --> 00:38:44,480
Speaker 1: do it three or four times because that's rewriting the information.

803
00:38:44,880 --> 00:38:46,920
Speaker 1: And it's kind of like, um, it's kind of like

804
00:38:47,040 --> 00:38:49,360
Speaker 1: a cake layer. So imagine put I get I had

805
00:38:49,400 --> 00:38:51,440
Speaker 1: a thousand dollars at the bottom of a cake, and

806
00:38:51,480 --> 00:38:53,200
Speaker 1: then I just put icing in a cake layer, another

807
00:38:53,320 --> 00:38:54,920
Speaker 1: ic and cake lay, another icing and cake laire. You

808
00:38:55,000 --> 00:38:56,680
Speaker 1: might not get there if you're eating your way through

809
00:38:56,719 --> 00:38:58,560
Speaker 1: to get to it. So so that's the same idea

810
00:38:58,560 --> 00:39:01,120
Speaker 1: as wiping a phone. You just each layer is something

811
00:39:01,239 --> 00:39:05,200
Speaker 1: more difficult for someone to get to. Um. Decouple your

812
00:39:05,320 --> 00:39:08,480
Speaker 1: phone from all the systems that's connected to. So if

813
00:39:08,520 --> 00:39:13,800
Speaker 1: you're an Apple gal like me, your maybe your laptop

814
00:39:13,920 --> 00:39:16,640
Speaker 1: is connected to your desktop, is connected to your iPad

815
00:39:16,880 --> 00:39:19,400
Speaker 1: or to your phone or whatever. Right, so before you

816
00:39:19,680 --> 00:39:21,440
Speaker 1: you want to make sure that's all disconnected from your

817
00:39:21,440 --> 00:39:23,279
Speaker 1: systems as well. You don't want to have any trace

818
00:39:23,360 --> 00:39:27,640
Speaker 1: of you still connecting to anything and make sure um

819
00:39:28,280 --> 00:39:30,600
Speaker 1: yeah again, make sure your new device is running very

820
00:39:30,640 --> 00:39:33,160
Speaker 1: smoothly before you start this process. For example, if you're

821
00:39:33,280 --> 00:39:37,320
Speaker 1: using multi factor authentication where someone sends you a code

822
00:39:37,360 --> 00:39:40,520
Speaker 1: to your phone rather than an SMS and it doesn't

823
00:39:40,520 --> 00:39:43,600
Speaker 1: erected bide the phone, you don't get the code right.

824
00:39:44,120 --> 00:39:45,719
Speaker 1: So you want to make sure that all the really

825
00:39:45,800 --> 00:39:49,560
Speaker 1: important services, your banks, your passwords, your security stuff, knows

826
00:39:49,640 --> 00:39:52,000
Speaker 1: that this new device is the new device that you

827
00:39:52,120 --> 00:39:55,640
Speaker 1: want to you know, use to do your business. Yeah,

828
00:39:55,719 --> 00:39:59,680
Speaker 1: that could be a huge pain in the butt up

829
00:39:59,719 --> 00:40:01,040
Speaker 1: and then you feel like things are going to go.

830
00:40:01,280 --> 00:40:04,440
Speaker 1: You've wiped your old one, sold it, maybe already on eBay,

831
00:40:04,520 --> 00:40:07,200
Speaker 1: and then you can't log into Yeah, you're not receiving

832
00:40:07,239 --> 00:40:09,000
Speaker 1: the code. I'll be able to log into your savings

833
00:40:09,040 --> 00:40:12,400
Speaker 1: account or your checking account. See yeah, on the iPhone,

834
00:40:12,400 --> 00:40:14,160
Speaker 1: at least on the iPhone, at least I know. There's

835
00:40:14,200 --> 00:40:16,719
Speaker 1: two different types of restores. So, for example, on my

836
00:40:16,760 --> 00:40:19,120
Speaker 1: old iPhone, the screen kept being really dark, you know,

837
00:40:19,200 --> 00:40:20,759
Speaker 1: even when it was full brightness, it was still dark.

838
00:40:20,840 --> 00:40:22,680
Speaker 1: So I had to do a factory reset. But I

839
00:40:22,800 --> 00:40:25,360
Speaker 1: was able to do what they call a soft factory reset,

840
00:40:25,440 --> 00:40:28,759
Speaker 1: where it reset the OS, the operating system of the phone,

841
00:40:29,280 --> 00:40:31,399
Speaker 1: but didn't change any of my information, so I still

842
00:40:31,520 --> 00:40:34,319
Speaker 1: was logged into all my apps that I had. Where

843
00:40:34,400 --> 00:40:36,600
Speaker 1: you want to do a full factory reset, right, So

844
00:40:36,680 --> 00:40:37,960
Speaker 1: you want to go check that. You want to make

845
00:40:37,960 --> 00:40:40,279
Speaker 1: sure the apps have been removed from your phone that

846
00:40:40,440 --> 00:40:42,400
Speaker 1: you can't open. They're not even present, right, it's like

847
00:40:42,440 --> 00:40:44,480
Speaker 1: a completely new phone. You want to do that three

848
00:40:44,600 --> 00:40:46,040
Speaker 1: or four times and make sure and go in and

849
00:40:46,080 --> 00:40:48,480
Speaker 1: say I can't see anything with me here. Yeah, So

850
00:40:48,719 --> 00:40:50,759
Speaker 1: on the note, you know, you're talking about taking care

851
00:40:50,760 --> 00:40:52,600
Speaker 1: of your here mobile device. Like I've heard that it's

852
00:40:52,600 --> 00:40:55,160
Speaker 1: a good idea to reboot your your cell phone every

853
00:40:55,200 --> 00:40:57,680
Speaker 1: morning when you get up. Is that true? I don't know,

854
00:40:58,080 --> 00:41:00,520
Speaker 1: I have not heard that. Well, no I'm not. I'm

855
00:41:00,520 --> 00:41:02,080
Speaker 1: not saying it's not a good idea. I mean I'm

856
00:41:02,200 --> 00:41:03,799
Speaker 1: very bad with that though. I tend to leave things

857
00:41:03,920 --> 00:41:06,080
Speaker 1: running a lot, like even sometimes I'm like on my computer,

858
00:41:06,200 --> 00:41:07,920
Speaker 1: I don't know, I tend to leave it on standby,

859
00:41:08,320 --> 00:41:10,400
Speaker 1: off WiFi, but I leave it on standby, you know,

860
00:41:10,440 --> 00:41:12,839
Speaker 1: sam here. Well, okay, so what are like a few

861
00:41:12,880 --> 00:41:16,800
Speaker 1: other like best practices then that we could easily implement,

862
00:41:16,960 --> 00:41:19,279
Speaker 1: you know, on our phones or on our computers. That

863
00:41:19,360 --> 00:41:21,719
Speaker 1: would go like a really long way when it comes

864
00:41:21,760 --> 00:41:25,640
Speaker 1: to cybersecurity. You already mentioned the password managers managers, you know,

865
00:41:25,760 --> 00:41:27,560
Speaker 1: like that definitely seems like one that you've come to

866
00:41:27,680 --> 00:41:29,520
Speaker 1: multiple times here, So I'm gonna say that that's probably

867
00:41:29,520 --> 00:41:31,920
Speaker 1: the first thing that you would recommend. But yeah, well, like,

868
00:41:31,920 --> 00:41:33,880
Speaker 1: what are a few other things that we should know

869
00:41:33,960 --> 00:41:36,200
Speaker 1: hanging fruit? Yeah, I would go around your house and

870
00:41:36,320 --> 00:41:38,320
Speaker 1: have a list of all the smart devices that you

871
00:41:38,440 --> 00:41:40,920
Speaker 1: have in your house, right, so list them out and

872
00:41:41,080 --> 00:41:43,560
Speaker 1: list out what the version of numbers are of that.

873
00:41:43,840 --> 00:41:46,560
Speaker 1: I know it sounds ridiculous, but you will be shocked

874
00:41:46,840 --> 00:41:48,759
Speaker 1: at how many devices you have in your house that

875
00:41:48,880 --> 00:41:52,840
Speaker 1: have microphones and cameras and GPS functionality. You will be shocked.

876
00:41:52,880 --> 00:41:54,520
Speaker 1: I bet it's brown ten or twenty for most of

877
00:41:54,560 --> 00:41:57,640
Speaker 1: your listeners, Okay, which will blow your mind. So all

878
00:41:57,719 --> 00:42:00,200
Speaker 1: those things you've got to think about, are they up today? Eight?

879
00:42:00,640 --> 00:42:02,520
Speaker 1: Have I been looking after them? So if you've got

880
00:42:02,600 --> 00:42:04,680
Speaker 1: like really old, you know, do you have old, old

881
00:42:04,719 --> 00:42:06,759
Speaker 1: equipment that you have an updated Old computers that are

882
00:42:06,760 --> 00:42:11,160
Speaker 1: still connected that haven't been updated in ages, they're a problem. Okay,

883
00:42:11,239 --> 00:42:13,279
Speaker 1: just because you don't use and it's still on, that's

884
00:42:13,320 --> 00:42:15,359
Speaker 1: a problem. So you want to get that off your

885
00:42:15,400 --> 00:42:16,960
Speaker 1: kind of home network, if you will. You want to

886
00:42:17,000 --> 00:42:18,360
Speaker 1: get it off your system, You want it out of

887
00:42:18,400 --> 00:42:20,440
Speaker 1: your house. You don't want those kind of things because

888
00:42:20,480 --> 00:42:23,359
Speaker 1: basically as as those things are laying around their vulnerabilities right,

889
00:42:23,440 --> 00:42:27,600
Speaker 1: and they're not getting update and if they're on exactly right,

890
00:42:27,760 --> 00:42:29,560
Speaker 1: So so there's a really So this is where it's

891
00:42:29,560 --> 00:42:31,279
Speaker 1: really hard because people are like, well, works fine, why

892
00:42:31,320 --> 00:42:32,960
Speaker 1: should I change it? I don't want to update every

893
00:42:33,000 --> 00:42:35,600
Speaker 1: time I update. It doesn't work very well, right, And

894
00:42:35,680 --> 00:42:38,120
Speaker 1: so I can understand that, but these this is again

895
00:42:38,200 --> 00:42:40,880
Speaker 1: where I'm kind of preaching to a simpler life, Like

896
00:42:41,040 --> 00:42:43,759
Speaker 1: I understand technology is really integral to our lives, but

897
00:42:44,040 --> 00:42:47,040
Speaker 1: maybe not as much as we all think. And maybe

898
00:42:47,080 --> 00:42:49,439
Speaker 1: we just need to think about what technologies we really

899
00:42:49,520 --> 00:42:51,800
Speaker 1: want in our homes where we have our families and

900
00:42:51,880 --> 00:42:55,040
Speaker 1: all the private moments we have. I think that's a

901
00:42:55,239 --> 00:42:58,440
Speaker 1: great point and an incredible note to wrap up on, Carol.

902
00:42:58,520 --> 00:43:02,080
Speaker 1: This has been a great convertation. I've learned so much personally, um,

903
00:43:02,200 --> 00:43:03,759
Speaker 1: and so thank you so much for taking the time

904
00:43:03,800 --> 00:43:05,440
Speaker 1: to join us and work and our listeners find out

905
00:43:05,520 --> 00:43:08,000
Speaker 1: more about you and what you're up to. You can

906
00:43:08,080 --> 00:43:10,920
Speaker 1: find me at Smashing Security. This is a podcast I

907
00:43:11,080 --> 00:43:14,080
Speaker 1: do every week. And there's another podcast I've just launched

908
00:43:14,200 --> 00:43:16,640
Speaker 1: which is called Sticky Pickles and you can find me there.

909
00:43:17,120 --> 00:43:19,279
Speaker 1: It's it's a little bit rude, so it's for the

910
00:43:19,320 --> 00:43:23,239
Speaker 1: adulter audience. Good to know. You want to give like

911
00:43:23,400 --> 00:43:25,680
Speaker 1: a brief synopsis or a brief summary of what that

912
00:43:25,800 --> 00:43:28,239
Speaker 1: that shows. That's an interesting stick pickle. That's not something

913
00:43:28,239 --> 00:43:30,320
Speaker 1: you hear every day. Yeah, yes, okay, So Sticky Pickles

914
00:43:30,400 --> 00:43:32,719
Speaker 1: is all about being knee deep in a dilemma. Right,

915
00:43:32,800 --> 00:43:34,920
Speaker 1: we've all been there. What do you do now? So

916
00:43:35,560 --> 00:43:38,680
Speaker 1: we've created I have a co host, the gorgeous Anna Braiding,

917
00:43:38,760 --> 00:43:41,200
Speaker 1: who I do it with, and I try and present

918
00:43:41,239 --> 00:43:43,799
Speaker 1: her with a sticky pickle, a dilemma that I think

919
00:43:43,840 --> 00:43:45,440
Speaker 1: she wouldn't be able to get herself out of. It's

920
00:43:45,520 --> 00:43:48,000
Speaker 1: just too sticky, too cringe e, too awful, and then

921
00:43:48,080 --> 00:43:49,759
Speaker 1: she has to try and get herself out of it

922
00:43:50,000 --> 00:43:55,279
Speaker 1: without losing faces. She does to. These are social situations. Yes,

923
00:43:55,320 --> 00:43:58,160
Speaker 1: there's social scism technology related, No, not at all, thank god.

924
00:43:58,239 --> 00:44:00,239
Speaker 1: You see another breath of fresh air and that's a

925
00:44:00,320 --> 00:44:02,279
Speaker 1: press for share. Yeah. No, it's all about relationships like

926
00:44:02,360 --> 00:44:04,560
Speaker 1: me with boss, mother in law, boyfriends like so we

927
00:44:04,640 --> 00:44:07,000
Speaker 1: go across the spectrum. It's really fun to do. It's

928
00:44:07,040 --> 00:44:10,399
Speaker 1: been a pandemic special. That's great. That's great. We will

929
00:44:10,440 --> 00:44:11,960
Speaker 1: be sure to link to both of those in our

930
00:44:11,960 --> 00:44:15,080
Speaker 1: show notes. Uh and Carol, we really appreciate Thank you

931
00:44:15,160 --> 00:44:17,640
Speaker 1: for for taking the time to talk to us today.

932
00:44:17,880 --> 00:44:19,759
Speaker 1: It was an absolute pleasure, guys. And thank you for

933
00:44:19,840 --> 00:44:24,200
Speaker 1: teaching me the word clutch. Carol, you are welcome. Joel,

934
00:44:24,200 --> 00:44:26,400
Speaker 1: I hope that's not not a term that we overuse,

935
00:44:26,480 --> 00:44:27,759
Speaker 1: you know. I feel it might be one of those

936
00:44:27,800 --> 00:44:29,480
Speaker 1: words I go to too often. I I tend to

937
00:44:29,520 --> 00:44:31,799
Speaker 1: do it as well. But what a great interview though

938
00:44:31,880 --> 00:44:34,440
Speaker 1: that we just had here with Carol. I feel like

939
00:44:34,520 --> 00:44:36,880
Speaker 1: this is the perfect topic to bring somebody on for right.

940
00:44:37,000 --> 00:44:39,320
Speaker 1: It's it's something where it's related to our money, but

941
00:44:39,400 --> 00:44:41,719
Speaker 1: it's not so on the nose, and it's not something

942
00:44:41,800 --> 00:44:44,600
Speaker 1: that we are too terribly familiar with, but it is

943
00:44:44,880 --> 00:44:47,080
Speaker 1: so important, you know. She we talked through all the

944
00:44:47,120 --> 00:44:49,800
Speaker 1: many different ways that we need to make sure that

945
00:44:49,840 --> 00:44:52,000
Speaker 1: we're being smart, you know, with with with the devices

946
00:44:52,040 --> 00:44:54,000
Speaker 1: that we're using, with our different accounts, with our passwords.

947
00:44:54,280 --> 00:44:56,480
Speaker 1: So yeah, for you man, what was your your big takeaway.

948
00:44:56,600 --> 00:44:58,680
Speaker 1: What's the one thing that you're gonna start doing now

949
00:44:58,920 --> 00:45:01,000
Speaker 1: in order to make sure that you're being uh smarter

950
00:45:01,120 --> 00:45:03,359
Speaker 1: and safer online? All right, Well, I learned a lot,

951
00:45:03,440 --> 00:45:05,040
Speaker 1: and there are probably a few changes I'll make, but

952
00:45:05,120 --> 00:45:06,920
Speaker 1: I think that the biggest thing that stuck out to me,

953
00:45:07,040 --> 00:45:11,000
Speaker 1: the biggest takeaway I had was will a smart device?

954
00:45:11,120 --> 00:45:14,319
Speaker 1: Will it make your life measurably better? That's what Carol said,

955
00:45:14,560 --> 00:45:16,719
Speaker 1: And you said, if not, skip it or take it

956
00:45:16,760 --> 00:45:18,560
Speaker 1: out of your home if it's not making a big

957
00:45:18,600 --> 00:45:20,840
Speaker 1: difference in your life. And so for us, we do

958
00:45:21,040 --> 00:45:24,040
Speaker 1: have UM a couple of Alexa speakers, and the girls

959
00:45:24,160 --> 00:45:26,400
Speaker 1: love to like play Frozen two or whatever it does.

960
00:45:26,440 --> 00:45:28,279
Speaker 1: They want to listen to on the device. And I

961
00:45:28,400 --> 00:45:29,640
Speaker 1: like at night just to be able to yell at

962
00:45:29,640 --> 00:45:31,200
Speaker 1: my speaker and tell it to play me whatever I

963
00:45:31,239 --> 00:45:33,279
Speaker 1: want to listen to. UM to not have to get up,

964
00:45:33,320 --> 00:45:35,719
Speaker 1: because yeah, it is kind of for the lazy man

965
00:45:35,880 --> 00:45:38,279
Speaker 1: like myself, that's what she said, the lazy man. We

966
00:45:38,320 --> 00:45:40,120
Speaker 1: don't even have to get up. It works. It's even

967
00:45:40,200 --> 00:45:42,920
Speaker 1: swipe or type with your thumb. Yeah. But but you

968
00:45:43,000 --> 00:45:46,680
Speaker 1: know what, maybe during certain parts of the day, I'll

969
00:45:46,719 --> 00:45:50,200
Speaker 1: turn it completely off. Um, I'll unplug the device so

970
00:45:50,360 --> 00:45:52,480
Speaker 1: that it's not listening to me, because that's the problem

971
00:45:52,560 --> 00:45:54,640
Speaker 1: with those smart devices. And I'm not one of those

972
00:45:54,680 --> 00:45:57,640
Speaker 1: people that that has a lot of connected Internet of

973
00:45:57,719 --> 00:45:59,840
Speaker 1: Things stuff going on in my house. But I'm going

974
00:45:59,880 --> 00:46:01,320
Speaker 1: to take another look, like what is it that I

975
00:46:01,440 --> 00:46:03,600
Speaker 1: do have here and and what can I get rid

976
00:46:03,640 --> 00:46:06,040
Speaker 1: of that isn't making a big difference that I don't

977
00:46:06,120 --> 00:46:08,759
Speaker 1: need that could potentially be a problem in my life

978
00:46:08,880 --> 00:46:11,279
Speaker 1: leading to someone knowing more about me than they need

979
00:46:11,360 --> 00:46:13,839
Speaker 1: to know. So I think that's my big takeaway from

980
00:46:13,920 --> 00:46:16,239
Speaker 1: from this conversation. Matt, what's yours? Yeah, I think I've

981
00:46:16,239 --> 00:46:18,400
Speaker 1: got a couple takeaways here and and but they all

982
00:46:18,440 --> 00:46:21,600
Speaker 1: have to call the big takeaway yet you choose multiples. Uh.

983
00:46:21,719 --> 00:46:23,279
Speaker 1: They both have to do with your cell phone though.

984
00:46:23,320 --> 00:46:26,040
Speaker 1: How about that? Uh? You know she mentioned how going

985
00:46:26,120 --> 00:46:30,239
Speaker 1: with the bona fide apps for a specific banking institutions,

986
00:46:30,440 --> 00:46:33,040
Speaker 1: how that's just a slam dunk way to make sure that,

987
00:46:33,600 --> 00:46:35,839
Speaker 1: uh that your data is encrypted. You know she's talking

988
00:46:35,840 --> 00:46:39,320
Speaker 1: about how, Uh, there's basically a higher standard that those

989
00:46:39,440 --> 00:46:41,759
Speaker 1: companies have to adhere to. And it makes sense, right,

990
00:46:41,800 --> 00:46:43,960
Speaker 1: You know, when you have thousands and hundreds of thousands

991
00:46:44,000 --> 00:46:46,360
Speaker 1: of of individuals dollars maybe in a specific account, you

992
00:46:46,400 --> 00:46:48,239
Speaker 1: need to make sure that it's difficult for folks to

993
00:46:48,360 --> 00:46:51,080
Speaker 1: get into those accounts. Uh So that was encouraging to hear.

994
00:46:51,560 --> 00:46:53,839
Speaker 1: And the other thing has to do with saving money.

995
00:46:54,280 --> 00:46:56,680
Speaker 1: I often will jump on Wi Fi no matter where

996
00:46:56,760 --> 00:46:59,400
Speaker 1: I am in order to to keep my data usage low,

997
00:46:59,719 --> 00:47:02,320
Speaker 1: even when I'm not necessarily aware as to who is

998
00:47:02,480 --> 00:47:05,640
Speaker 1: running that WiFi network, right, And so I was encouraged

999
00:47:05,680 --> 00:47:07,640
Speaker 1: maybe to not do that, you know, if I didn't

1000
00:47:07,640 --> 00:47:10,560
Speaker 1: know who is running that network. But then also if

1001
00:47:10,600 --> 00:47:12,320
Speaker 1: I do decide, it's kind of like a frugal or

1002
00:47:12,400 --> 00:47:15,839
Speaker 1: cheap thing, right Yeah, yeah, seriously, five bucks in Daddy

1003
00:47:15,880 --> 00:47:17,920
Speaker 1: used to you're gonna span might be worth it compared

1004
00:47:17,960 --> 00:47:20,560
Speaker 1: to someone you know getting access to your information. Right,

1005
00:47:20,600 --> 00:47:23,040
Speaker 1: But if you are gonna be frugal or maybe borderline

1006
00:47:23,080 --> 00:47:25,760
Speaker 1: cheap to consider, you know, some of those virtual private

1007
00:47:25,840 --> 00:47:28,719
Speaker 1: network systems, you know, the VPN. If you are going

1008
00:47:28,800 --> 00:47:30,880
Speaker 1: to be on someone else's WiFi and you're not totally

1009
00:47:30,960 --> 00:47:33,600
Speaker 1: sure if the security there, that is when a VPN

1010
00:47:33,680 --> 00:47:35,160
Speaker 1: makes sense. It's not something that you need to be

1011
00:47:35,440 --> 00:47:37,839
Speaker 1: concerned about when you're on your own WiFi, but when

1012
00:47:37,840 --> 00:47:40,080
Speaker 1: you're out and about, those are the kind of situations

1013
00:47:40,239 --> 00:47:42,279
Speaker 1: where a VPN might make sense for you. So yeah,

1014
00:47:42,320 --> 00:47:44,360
Speaker 1: if if you're on the road more, if you travel

1015
00:47:44,400 --> 00:47:47,000
Speaker 1: a lot, like, yeah, VPN might be something that you

1016
00:47:47,040 --> 00:47:48,719
Speaker 1: need to look into. But you know, if you're more

1017
00:47:48,760 --> 00:47:51,320
Speaker 1: of a homebody like me and only rarely make it

1018
00:47:51,360 --> 00:47:53,239
Speaker 1: out to the outside world where you're gonna hop on

1019
00:47:53,280 --> 00:47:55,279
Speaker 1: someone else's WiFi, that's not something that I need to

1020
00:47:55,320 --> 00:47:57,520
Speaker 1: worry about. Well, I hear too that if you have

1021
00:47:57,560 --> 00:48:00,520
Speaker 1: a VPN, you can watch like Netflix content it in

1022
00:48:00,920 --> 00:48:04,399
Speaker 1: Canada or Scandinavia or whatever like, because well, he doesn't

1023
00:48:04,440 --> 00:48:06,840
Speaker 1: know where you're at locationalize and so you have access

1024
00:48:06,880 --> 00:48:10,040
Speaker 1: to some of the streaming content from Netflix around the world,

1025
00:48:10,560 --> 00:48:13,520
Speaker 1: which you know, they've got different contracts negotiated with different

1026
00:48:13,560 --> 00:48:16,440
Speaker 1: providers in in every single country, and so yeah, what's

1027
00:48:16,440 --> 00:48:18,600
Speaker 1: available in India is different than what's available in the

1028
00:48:18,719 --> 00:48:21,400
Speaker 1: United States. Um, that's a little park something I heard

1029
00:48:21,440 --> 00:48:24,319
Speaker 1: on the street. But um, yeah, alright, So Matt, let's

1030
00:48:24,320 --> 00:48:26,000
Speaker 1: go back to the beer that we had on the

1031
00:48:26,040 --> 00:48:29,239
Speaker 1: show today. While we were chatting with Carol, she had

1032
00:48:29,280 --> 00:48:31,080
Speaker 1: a beer herself. But the beer that we had is

1033
00:48:31,440 --> 00:48:35,360
Speaker 1: called Duh Snake Blood by Dissolver Brewing. This is a

1034
00:48:35,440 --> 00:48:38,239
Speaker 1: beer you picked up for us UM recently and it's

1035
00:48:38,280 --> 00:48:41,080
Speaker 1: a raspberry chocolate Imperial stout. So yeah, what was your

1036
00:48:41,080 --> 00:48:42,640
Speaker 1: take on this beer? Man? Yeah, this is one of

1037
00:48:42,680 --> 00:48:45,120
Speaker 1: the breweries that Kat and I poked our head into

1038
00:48:45,280 --> 00:48:47,520
Speaker 1: and got a couple of beers while we were there visiting.

1039
00:48:48,000 --> 00:48:51,320
Speaker 1: This was, uh, like you said, a raspberry chocolate imperial

1040
00:48:51,360 --> 00:48:55,400
Speaker 1: stuff that has raspberry vanilla, French broad cocoa, nibs and husks.

1041
00:48:55,640 --> 00:48:58,040
Speaker 1: I'm not totally sure what husks are like, like corn husks.

1042
00:48:58,280 --> 00:49:00,560
Speaker 1: I don't know, Man, that's weird. This was a really

1043
00:49:00,600 --> 00:49:03,279
Speaker 1: tasty stout, and this is one that's perfect for you know,

1044
00:49:03,360 --> 00:49:06,200
Speaker 1: these cooling temperatures. I love having beers that fit with

1045
00:49:06,320 --> 00:49:09,359
Speaker 1: the season. Um. But man, I will say this particular beer.

1046
00:49:09,800 --> 00:49:11,520
Speaker 1: I gave your cup the first pour, like the first

1047
00:49:11,560 --> 00:49:13,200
Speaker 1: half of the of the beer, and I got the

1048
00:49:13,239 --> 00:49:15,799
Speaker 1: second half. I'll be honest, it got a little thick

1049
00:49:15,840 --> 00:49:17,440
Speaker 1: there towards the bottom of my glass. I don't know

1050
00:49:17,440 --> 00:49:20,440
Speaker 1: if that's a quality control issue per se, or if

1051
00:49:20,480 --> 00:49:22,960
Speaker 1: that's just how they Maybe that's the husks. Actually it

1052
00:49:23,000 --> 00:49:25,800
Speaker 1: could be. Well, I just looked it up. Coco husks

1053
00:49:25,960 --> 00:49:28,640
Speaker 1: are the outer shell of the cocoa bean um and

1054
00:49:28,760 --> 00:49:30,600
Speaker 1: like the being, they're also edible. So yeah, it's just

1055
00:49:30,680 --> 00:49:32,960
Speaker 1: two different parts of the cocoa bean that we're used

1056
00:49:32,960 --> 00:49:35,320
Speaker 1: in the making of this beer. But interestingly enough, I

1057
00:49:35,400 --> 00:49:38,360
Speaker 1: agree like this this beer probably should have been filtered,

1058
00:49:38,400 --> 00:49:40,719
Speaker 1: and it's okay when some beers are unfiltered. In fact,

1059
00:49:40,800 --> 00:49:42,680
Speaker 1: I like many of my beers in particular, I p

1060
00:49:42,760 --> 00:49:45,200
Speaker 1: a s unfiltered. I feel like there's more flavor sometimes,

1061
00:49:45,239 --> 00:49:48,239
Speaker 1: but when you're using bigger ingredients like that, maybe um,

1062
00:49:48,400 --> 00:49:51,520
Speaker 1: a more intense filtering process is helpful. I really like

1063
00:49:51,600 --> 00:49:54,160
Speaker 1: the beer. I like the flavors like dark chocolate and raspberry.

1064
00:49:54,400 --> 00:49:55,880
Speaker 1: But at the same time, the mouth feel was a

1065
00:49:55,920 --> 00:49:59,040
Speaker 1: little bit off just because of the lack of filtering.

1066
00:49:59,080 --> 00:50:02,560
Speaker 1: I think, little tooth thick, little too chunky my mouth. Right, Uh, yeah,

1067
00:50:02,600 --> 00:50:04,120
Speaker 1: I'm with you, and I will say, man, of course

1068
00:50:04,120 --> 00:50:05,680
Speaker 1: I got this beer for you. Right. It's a big

1069
00:50:05,719 --> 00:50:07,680
Speaker 1: old style, but it's got raspberry in it. It's too

1070
00:50:07,760 --> 00:50:10,080
Speaker 1: kind of I appreciate that. Try to be thoughtful where

1071
00:50:10,080 --> 00:50:11,640
Speaker 1: I can. Yeah, well, it's a fun one. Glad we

1072
00:50:11,680 --> 00:50:13,359
Speaker 1: got to have this one together. And I can see

1073
00:50:13,400 --> 00:50:15,319
Speaker 1: why they called it snake blood, because snak blow would

1074
00:50:15,320 --> 00:50:18,399
Speaker 1: be like dark with like a hint of raspberry color.

1075
00:50:18,400 --> 00:50:20,560
Speaker 1: I would think, right, yeah, I would agree. I'm guessing

1076
00:50:20,560 --> 00:50:23,600
Speaker 1: I haven't ever killed the snake, but that's my assumption,

1077
00:50:24,000 --> 00:50:27,560
Speaker 1: or enjoyed his blood exactly. Gross. All right, well, um,

1078
00:50:27,800 --> 00:50:29,839
Speaker 1: that's gonna do it for this episode. For folks who

1079
00:50:29,840 --> 00:50:31,680
Speaker 1: want the show notes, including links to some of the

1080
00:50:31,880 --> 00:50:34,719
Speaker 1: things that Carol mentioned in our conversation, will have those

1081
00:50:34,760 --> 00:50:37,200
Speaker 1: available for you at how to money dot com. And

1082
00:50:37,239 --> 00:50:39,080
Speaker 1: if you listen to this episode you found it helpful

1083
00:50:39,120 --> 00:50:41,279
Speaker 1: and enjoyable, we would ask for you to leave us

1084
00:50:41,320 --> 00:50:43,640
Speaker 1: a review over at Apple Podcast. And if you've already

1085
00:50:43,680 --> 00:50:45,680
Speaker 1: done that, we would ask for you to to tell

1086
00:50:45,800 --> 00:50:47,880
Speaker 1: a friend or a family member about the show. That

1087
00:50:48,000 --> 00:50:49,719
Speaker 1: helps us to get the word out and it helps

1088
00:50:49,800 --> 00:50:52,960
Speaker 1: them to start doing smarter things with their money as well.

1089
00:50:53,040 --> 00:50:54,960
Speaker 1: So Joel, that's gonna be a buddy. Until next time,

1090
00:50:55,160 --> 00:50:56,919
Speaker 1: Best Friends Out, Best Friends Out.