1 00:00:00,240 --> 00:00:06,680 Speaker 1: Welcome to this week's classic episode. Folks. What is media manipulation? 2 00:00:06,880 --> 00:00:09,119 Speaker 1: That's the title that we have for this back in 3 00:00:10,600 --> 00:00:14,200 Speaker 1: but it's it's a really good question, you know, like, um, 4 00:00:14,360 --> 00:00:18,400 Speaker 1: we made this as the world was collectively learning the 5 00:00:18,400 --> 00:00:22,400 Speaker 1: phrase fake news, I believe, uh. And there there's serious 6 00:00:22,440 --> 00:00:27,320 Speaker 1: questions like how often do news outlets bury a story right? 7 00:00:27,360 --> 00:00:30,560 Speaker 1: Who determines what gets reported? And how? Yeah, it is 8 00:00:30,560 --> 00:00:33,360 Speaker 1: a big question because there are so many allegations that 9 00:00:33,479 --> 00:00:37,720 Speaker 1: there's some kind of governmental entity or some larger private 10 00:00:37,760 --> 00:00:41,880 Speaker 1: industry entity that can somehow decide what all the different 11 00:00:41,880 --> 00:00:46,400 Speaker 1: outlets can and can't do, right? And is it that 12 00:00:46,680 --> 00:00:50,720 Speaker 1: wide ranging or is it more granular than that? Is 13 00:00:51,040 --> 00:00:53,760 Speaker 1: there actually some kind of control mechanism in there? We'll 14 00:00:53,800 --> 00:00:58,400 Speaker 1: find out in this classic episode from UFOs two Ghosts 15 00:00:58,400 --> 00:01:02,000 Speaker 1: and Government cover Ups. Is jury is riddled with unexplained events. 16 00:01:02,480 --> 00:01:05,080 Speaker 1: You can turn back now or learn the stuff they 17 00:01:05,120 --> 00:01:15,480 Speaker 1: don't want you to now. Pictory America as one large, 18 00:01:16,000 --> 00:01:21,560 Speaker 1: unblinking uh. According to a two thousand thirteen ball of pole, 19 00:01:21,959 --> 00:01:25,800 Speaker 1: about fifty five of this eye gets its news about 20 00:01:25,920 --> 00:01:30,319 Speaker 1: current events from television. The Internet is a distant second, 21 00:01:30,520 --> 00:01:35,440 Speaker 1: at about a smaller bit of the eye. Maybe nine 22 00:01:35,480 --> 00:01:40,360 Speaker 1: percent still reads print and newspapers, while that last six 23 00:01:40,400 --> 00:01:44,360 Speaker 1: percent the moat in the eye if you will listen 24 00:01:44,640 --> 00:01:50,280 Speaker 1: to the radio. But where is this eye looking and 25 00:01:50,320 --> 00:01:55,120 Speaker 1: who decides what it sees? Welcome back to the show. 26 00:01:55,120 --> 00:01:58,200 Speaker 1: My name is Matt and Ben and as always we 27 00:01:58,240 --> 00:02:00,840 Speaker 1: are here with our super produce us your know, the 28 00:02:00,920 --> 00:02:05,040 Speaker 1: spin Dr Brown. So most of the American audience, I 29 00:02:05,280 --> 00:02:08,840 Speaker 1: would say, much of the American audience holds a cynical 30 00:02:08,919 --> 00:02:10,960 Speaker 1: view of what they're told on the news or what 31 00:02:11,000 --> 00:02:13,360 Speaker 1: they read or see in the news. A lot of 32 00:02:13,400 --> 00:02:17,679 Speaker 1: them do. Yeah, yeah, And these audiences can be partisan 33 00:02:17,720 --> 00:02:22,040 Speaker 1: in their viewpoints, right, arguing that one outlet is real journalism, 34 00:02:22,639 --> 00:02:25,960 Speaker 1: one outlet is just complete hogwash. And you know, maybe 35 00:02:25,960 --> 00:02:28,480 Speaker 1: they have a hidden agenda, maybe they're connected to the 36 00:02:28,480 --> 00:02:33,040 Speaker 1: Illuminati or something short that's on that's on the far reaches, 37 00:02:33,160 --> 00:02:36,760 Speaker 1: but it's there, and it leads us to a big question. Right, 38 00:02:36,800 --> 00:02:40,400 Speaker 1: We've been thinking about this all week. Yeah, So who's correct? 39 00:02:41,040 --> 00:02:43,320 Speaker 1: And to what degree could it be possible that media 40 00:02:43,320 --> 00:02:47,080 Speaker 1: outlets have crossed this line from reporting the news to 41 00:02:47,240 --> 00:02:52,000 Speaker 1: creating it? And here's where it gets crazy. Yes, absolutely, 42 00:02:52,040 --> 00:02:55,080 Speaker 1: this is a very popular trick, and we should go 43 00:02:55,120 --> 00:02:58,760 Speaker 1: ahead and add here, Matt that you and I and 44 00:02:59,080 --> 00:03:00,919 Speaker 1: I assume NOL is well as on board with this. 45 00:03:01,480 --> 00:03:05,280 Speaker 1: We are not picking sides. We're not here to say 46 00:03:05,320 --> 00:03:10,040 Speaker 1: that one particular CNN or MSNBC or Fox News or 47 00:03:10,280 --> 00:03:14,160 Speaker 1: Al Jazeera is or RT why don't we throw that 48 00:03:14,200 --> 00:03:20,399 Speaker 1: in there too, is better, right or necessarily worse. We're 49 00:03:20,400 --> 00:03:23,440 Speaker 1: here to talk about a phenomenon, a systemic phenomenon, which 50 00:03:23,639 --> 00:03:30,040 Speaker 1: is uh, different groups, I guess, different institutions using the 51 00:03:30,120 --> 00:03:36,000 Speaker 1: media to report things that are agendas disguised as objective facts. 52 00:03:36,480 --> 00:03:39,160 Speaker 1: And it's a creepy thing, but it's a thing a 53 00:03:39,160 --> 00:03:42,760 Speaker 1: lot of people expect, and it's a very old trick 54 00:03:42,880 --> 00:03:45,720 Speaker 1: to write. Oh yeah, this is something that we've been 55 00:03:45,760 --> 00:03:49,600 Speaker 1: seeing for a long time, even before Edward Edward Burns. 56 00:03:49,680 --> 00:03:54,280 Speaker 1: But he was, you know, kind of the originator, let's say, 57 00:03:54,400 --> 00:03:56,760 Speaker 1: of some of the techniques that are even used today. 58 00:03:57,200 --> 00:04:01,480 Speaker 1: He he has this quote that is pretty great. He 59 00:04:01,560 --> 00:04:04,720 Speaker 1: said that quote, the United States has become a small 60 00:04:04,800 --> 00:04:10,280 Speaker 1: room in which a single whisper is magnified thousands of times. Yeah, 61 00:04:10,320 --> 00:04:14,800 Speaker 1: that's from his nineteen seven essay The Engineering of Consent, 62 00:04:14,920 --> 00:04:18,760 Speaker 1: which you can check out for free online. Alright, So, Matt, 63 00:04:19,279 --> 00:04:21,039 Speaker 1: people who have listened to our show for a while 64 00:04:21,320 --> 00:04:26,240 Speaker 1: know that you and I are fascinated with Edward Burnets, 65 00:04:26,600 --> 00:04:29,600 Speaker 1: and we even because we are really into this guy, 66 00:04:29,800 --> 00:04:31,640 Speaker 1: and which is strange because he is sort of a 67 00:04:31,720 --> 00:04:37,120 Speaker 1: Darth Vader of manipulation. But is he an Emperor Palpatine? 68 00:04:37,440 --> 00:04:39,120 Speaker 1: I'm not sure right in and let us know what 69 00:04:39,160 --> 00:04:42,520 Speaker 1: you think. But but we actually had gott some really 70 00:04:42,600 --> 00:04:46,440 Speaker 1: nice notes from Chuck from stuff you should know, because 71 00:04:46,480 --> 00:04:49,080 Speaker 1: they did a podcast on Burnets and they were checking 72 00:04:49,080 --> 00:04:52,200 Speaker 1: our stuff out. So this guy is maybe the most 73 00:04:52,279 --> 00:04:57,839 Speaker 1: popular supervillain anti hero mad scientists, maybe in in how 74 00:04:57,880 --> 00:05:01,080 Speaker 1: stuff works currently. Yeah, I can see him as this 75 00:05:01,200 --> 00:05:04,720 Speaker 1: anti hero because he is a hero to a lot 76 00:05:04,760 --> 00:05:10,600 Speaker 1: of people. He's created huge swaths of jobs all across 77 00:05:10,760 --> 00:05:15,080 Speaker 1: the world. He's better known as the father of public relations. 78 00:05:15,120 --> 00:05:19,479 Speaker 1: He pioneered numerous advertising tactics that kind of blur the 79 00:05:19,520 --> 00:05:25,160 Speaker 1: line between commercials, professional advice, and even journalism. Yes, and today, 80 00:05:25,200 --> 00:05:27,440 Speaker 1: as we said, the majority of news outlets have all 81 00:05:27,480 --> 00:05:30,480 Speaker 1: been accused at one point or another of twisting the 82 00:05:30,560 --> 00:05:35,120 Speaker 1: facts to support an agenda or to oppose one. But 83 00:05:35,400 --> 00:05:38,800 Speaker 1: this doesn't necessarily mean that any given TV channel is 84 00:05:38,839 --> 00:05:42,960 Speaker 1: going to lie or misrepresent the story. Um, it just 85 00:05:43,040 --> 00:05:45,400 Speaker 1: means that maybe they're not reporting on it, maybe they're 86 00:05:45,400 --> 00:05:48,640 Speaker 1: focusing instead on something else, something I don't know, a 87 00:05:48,640 --> 00:05:51,599 Speaker 1: little more on the surface, like let's say a celebrity's 88 00:05:51,680 --> 00:05:57,359 Speaker 1: latest faux paw, Yeah, as celebrity's latest stumble, Kanye West 89 00:05:57,560 --> 00:06:02,240 Speaker 1: latest outrace statement, or uh, let's see bibs in there 90 00:06:02,279 --> 00:06:06,400 Speaker 1: all the time? Sure, yeah, or Cyrus Clint Eastwood says 91 00:06:06,440 --> 00:06:12,400 Speaker 1: something someone gets in a fight, yeah, Mel Gibson's right, yeah, 92 00:06:12,480 --> 00:06:15,960 Speaker 1: and this this stuff. While I'm not saying that it's 93 00:06:16,000 --> 00:06:19,840 Speaker 1: not important, I think we can as a group agree 94 00:06:20,440 --> 00:06:27,880 Speaker 1: that large political movements, economic trends, international crimes, these things 95 00:06:28,440 --> 00:06:32,120 Speaker 1: are more important to the common person and have more 96 00:06:32,160 --> 00:06:35,279 Speaker 1: of an impact on their life, unless, of course, you 97 00:06:35,279 --> 00:06:37,960 Speaker 1: are one of the very small percent of people who 98 00:06:38,000 --> 00:06:41,520 Speaker 1: works directly with or for a celebrity, in which case 99 00:06:41,839 --> 00:06:45,839 Speaker 1: I'm sorry, I hope you're okay. I'm gonna just kind 100 00:06:45,880 --> 00:06:47,520 Speaker 1: of make a line in the sand here and say, 101 00:06:47,560 --> 00:06:50,599 Speaker 1: I don't think those celebrity stories are important whatsoever. You 102 00:06:50,600 --> 00:06:53,680 Speaker 1: don't think so, I don't think so. Even if it's 103 00:06:53,720 --> 00:06:56,800 Speaker 1: a person you could make the argument that their opinion 104 00:06:56,960 --> 00:07:00,360 Speaker 1: shapers sure there that when they when they're a ininion 105 00:07:00,720 --> 00:07:05,680 Speaker 1: is adverse to let's say, the progressive views, the current 106 00:07:06,120 --> 00:07:10,960 Speaker 1: progressive views. I can see that being harmful in some way. 107 00:07:10,960 --> 00:07:15,600 Speaker 1: But man, yeah, I think I just I'm sorry, I 108 00:07:15,600 --> 00:07:17,400 Speaker 1: have I just have to say it, or else I 109 00:07:17,400 --> 00:07:20,520 Speaker 1: would feel horrible after this podcast. I understand, and I 110 00:07:21,040 --> 00:07:23,920 Speaker 1: see you see what I'm saying, Like it would matter 111 00:07:24,160 --> 00:07:27,520 Speaker 1: more if it was if it directly affects someone. Yes, 112 00:07:27,720 --> 00:07:31,840 Speaker 1: But these larger issues I think have a more direct 113 00:07:32,000 --> 00:07:35,640 Speaker 1: effect on the average John and j Q public than 114 00:07:35,840 --> 00:07:40,600 Speaker 1: do the stories of you know, strangers I've always found. 115 00:07:40,680 --> 00:07:42,440 Speaker 1: And I know this is terrible. I don't know if 116 00:07:42,440 --> 00:07:44,600 Speaker 1: I've talked about this on the air before, but you 117 00:07:44,640 --> 00:07:47,440 Speaker 1: know this, Matt, No, you've heard me say it before too. 118 00:07:48,200 --> 00:07:51,560 Speaker 1: For a long time, I kind of resented celebrities. It's 119 00:07:51,560 --> 00:07:54,320 Speaker 1: it's the idea you're a stranger and it's my job 120 00:07:54,400 --> 00:07:56,080 Speaker 1: to know who you are and be caught up on 121 00:07:56,120 --> 00:07:59,840 Speaker 1: your stuff. Has something changed, No, I'm just it's it's 122 00:08:00,000 --> 00:08:03,040 Speaker 1: an ongoing process. Of course, celebrities are people too. I 123 00:08:03,040 --> 00:08:05,000 Speaker 1: don't want to be I don't want to be rude, 124 00:08:05,280 --> 00:08:10,280 Speaker 1: but it's it's also strange. You know, I find it 125 00:08:10,360 --> 00:08:13,440 Speaker 1: presumptuous that I should be expected to know what's going 126 00:08:13,520 --> 00:08:16,000 Speaker 1: on with you. You know, I I don't know what's 127 00:08:16,040 --> 00:08:18,960 Speaker 1: going on with some of my cousins. And we're related 128 00:08:20,680 --> 00:08:24,360 Speaker 1: right here. Actually, so this can happen. It does happen. 129 00:08:24,520 --> 00:08:27,240 Speaker 1: It happens often. If you're a fan of Last Week 130 00:08:27,280 --> 00:08:30,880 Speaker 1: Tonight the way that Matt and I are, then you 131 00:08:31,000 --> 00:08:34,480 Speaker 1: have probably seen the episode where where I think they 132 00:08:34,520 --> 00:08:38,280 Speaker 1: show the cutaway from a congresswoman talking about a fairly 133 00:08:38,320 --> 00:08:43,480 Speaker 1: important issue to actually no lie a report about Justin Bieber. Yeah, 134 00:08:44,080 --> 00:08:45,920 Speaker 1: this is breaking news. I'm gonna have to stop you 135 00:08:46,000 --> 00:08:48,800 Speaker 1: right there. We're going over here, right yeah, But we 136 00:08:48,840 --> 00:08:51,920 Speaker 1: have to be careful and to ask ourselves the question 137 00:08:52,160 --> 00:08:56,440 Speaker 1: is this intentional or is you know, is there some 138 00:08:56,720 --> 00:09:03,640 Speaker 1: nefarest scheme, or is this simply a sincere decision that 139 00:09:03,640 --> 00:09:06,000 Speaker 1: that's what people want to see? And that's what this 140 00:09:06,160 --> 00:09:09,400 Speaker 1: sort of bread and circus vibe is what feeds. If 141 00:09:09,480 --> 00:09:11,720 Speaker 1: we don't cut to the Beaver story, then people are 142 00:09:11,720 --> 00:09:14,560 Speaker 1: gonna cut away to you know, they're gonna turn their channel, 143 00:09:14,960 --> 00:09:18,600 Speaker 1: right and and some experts see this this kind of 144 00:09:18,640 --> 00:09:23,439 Speaker 1: manipulation or censorship as an act of self censorship, as 145 00:09:23,520 --> 00:09:27,920 Speaker 1: something that the the company, or the journalists themselves or 146 00:09:27,960 --> 00:09:32,840 Speaker 1: the blogger for instance, would decide to do to preserve 147 00:09:33,040 --> 00:09:36,880 Speaker 1: their career longevity. Right, There's a great book called The 148 00:09:36,920 --> 00:09:39,959 Speaker 1: Business Media, Corporate Media, and the Public Interest by these 149 00:09:40,000 --> 00:09:43,840 Speaker 1: authors named David Creteau and William Hoyn's and they and 150 00:09:43,880 --> 00:09:49,200 Speaker 1: I may be mispronouncing your names, guys, sorry, They argue that, uh, this, 151 00:09:49,200 --> 00:09:53,760 Speaker 1: this act of self censorship is an understandable rational move. 152 00:09:53,920 --> 00:09:55,800 Speaker 1: I agree. I don't know if that makes it right, 153 00:09:55,840 --> 00:09:59,880 Speaker 1: but I totally agree. And it brings me to something 154 00:10:00,040 --> 00:10:02,000 Speaker 1: it was interesting that I think you and I should 155 00:10:02,000 --> 00:10:04,920 Speaker 1: talk about. All Right, so we've got we've got a 156 00:10:04,960 --> 00:10:07,080 Speaker 1: couple of different ways that this can occur, a couple 157 00:10:07,080 --> 00:10:11,320 Speaker 1: of different entities that can affect the news that people 158 00:10:11,360 --> 00:10:13,920 Speaker 1: will watch. Not just in the States, of course, because 159 00:10:14,040 --> 00:10:17,840 Speaker 1: let's also remember that quite a few countries have state 160 00:10:17,920 --> 00:10:22,640 Speaker 1: owned media and that that can lead to all kinds 161 00:10:22,679 --> 00:10:25,760 Speaker 1: of sticky conflicts of interest. But one question you and 162 00:10:25,800 --> 00:10:32,840 Speaker 1: I get often is, hey, guys, have you ever been 163 00:10:32,840 --> 00:10:35,080 Speaker 1: shut down? Has there been something that you were told 164 00:10:35,120 --> 00:10:37,800 Speaker 1: you could not report on? No, Ben, we have not 165 00:10:37,920 --> 00:10:40,560 Speaker 1: been shut down on any of the subjects. Scientology was 166 00:10:40,600 --> 00:10:42,560 Speaker 1: one of those that we had to tiptoe around, but 167 00:10:42,640 --> 00:10:46,960 Speaker 1: we didn't get shut down. Yeah, you know, I guess 168 00:10:47,040 --> 00:10:51,240 Speaker 1: we should say thanks Church of Scientology for not suing us, 169 00:10:51,280 --> 00:10:54,240 Speaker 1: but we didn't. Oh man, that was that was a 170 00:10:54,240 --> 00:10:57,560 Speaker 1: weird one because we always try to be respectful of 171 00:10:57,679 --> 00:11:02,920 Speaker 1: people's personal beliefs, even if those are spiritual values, which 172 00:11:03,040 --> 00:11:05,000 Speaker 1: you know, we don't describe or whatever. And you and 173 00:11:05,040 --> 00:11:08,400 Speaker 1: I and Noel or none of us are scientologists at 174 00:11:08,440 --> 00:11:12,040 Speaker 1: least that we know of, So we're watching Noel when 175 00:11:12,040 --> 00:11:14,480 Speaker 1: you said that, just to see his reaction. So we 176 00:11:14,520 --> 00:11:18,800 Speaker 1: did a video on and a podcast on Operations Snow White, 177 00:11:19,280 --> 00:11:21,880 Speaker 1: and we just stuck to the facts, just just the 178 00:11:22,000 --> 00:11:25,760 Speaker 1: publicly available things that have come about through court documents 179 00:11:25,760 --> 00:11:30,120 Speaker 1: and Freedom of Information Act requests. And yeah, we we 180 00:11:30,200 --> 00:11:32,199 Speaker 1: didn't make a two and a half hour long documentary 181 00:11:32,200 --> 00:11:34,880 Speaker 1: about it. We're good. But check out Going Clear if 182 00:11:34,920 --> 00:11:36,720 Speaker 1: you're interested in that story. And you for some reason, 183 00:11:36,760 --> 00:11:39,200 Speaker 1: I haven't seen it yet. And Matt, you and I 184 00:11:39,280 --> 00:11:43,480 Speaker 1: found that we were pretty fortunate. The folks at how 185 00:11:43,480 --> 00:11:46,559 Speaker 1: stuff works in general, are are pure podcasts are pretty 186 00:11:46,559 --> 00:11:50,440 Speaker 1: fortunate as well, because we haven't had someone come down 187 00:11:50,480 --> 00:11:54,880 Speaker 1: like a hammer. But if someone is manipulating the media, 188 00:11:55,080 --> 00:11:58,680 Speaker 1: here are the three entities that are most likely to 189 00:11:58,720 --> 00:12:06,840 Speaker 1: be responsible. The first one is the money, the corporate sponsorship. Now, 190 00:12:08,120 --> 00:12:11,640 Speaker 1: this can be a problem for let's say, for profit 191 00:12:11,720 --> 00:12:16,800 Speaker 1: media like television, the internet, uh, the radio, pretty much, 192 00:12:16,840 --> 00:12:20,679 Speaker 1: any of them. Sure, any for profit reporting institution. Yeah. 193 00:12:20,760 --> 00:12:24,800 Speaker 1: It depends on advertising almost always, and it can it 194 00:12:24,840 --> 00:12:27,439 Speaker 1: can occasionally find itself in a conflict of interest where 195 00:12:27,480 --> 00:12:30,160 Speaker 1: you've got someone who is providing money for you to 196 00:12:30,240 --> 00:12:33,880 Speaker 1: make your show that has done something wrong or at 197 00:12:33,960 --> 00:12:38,440 Speaker 1: least you know, uh, it doesn't have to necessarily be wrong, 198 00:12:38,480 --> 00:12:41,480 Speaker 1: but it can be bad for pr right right, Yeah, 199 00:12:41,559 --> 00:12:45,960 Speaker 1: it could be a conflict of interest, for sure, and 200 00:12:46,040 --> 00:12:49,680 Speaker 1: that's understandable. This, this corporate interference could also be something 201 00:12:49,960 --> 00:12:53,520 Speaker 1: as simple as killing a story or you know, burying 202 00:12:53,559 --> 00:12:58,520 Speaker 1: it somewhere, or as misleading as having a jumped up 203 00:12:58,559 --> 00:13:05,280 Speaker 1: pseudo expert or a industry financed by a study become 204 00:13:05,440 --> 00:13:08,400 Speaker 1: a big focus for a news piece. You know what 205 00:13:08,440 --> 00:13:11,320 Speaker 1: I mean? This is where and let me do an 206 00:13:11,320 --> 00:13:14,600 Speaker 1: example that's not too scary. This would be something like 207 00:13:14,880 --> 00:13:23,880 Speaker 1: where they have just make up a name male or female, Richie, Richie. 208 00:13:23,920 --> 00:13:30,640 Speaker 1: What's Richie's last name? Jacobson? So, uh, doctor Richie Jacobson 209 00:13:31,280 --> 00:13:38,800 Speaker 1: from the American Dairy Growers Association, Institute for Innovation or 210 00:13:38,840 --> 00:13:42,640 Speaker 1: whatever whatever, some sort of official name. Anyway, Dr Jacobson 211 00:13:43,120 --> 00:13:47,480 Speaker 1: is interviewed on CNN or Fox or MSNBC, and I 212 00:13:47,559 --> 00:13:49,200 Speaker 1: keep naming them all because I want to be fair. 213 00:13:49,880 --> 00:13:53,319 Speaker 1: And the interview is about the health benefits of butter. 214 00:13:53,559 --> 00:13:57,400 Speaker 1: Are people eating enough butter? Studies show they are not? 215 00:13:58,480 --> 00:14:01,920 Speaker 1: What could the dangers be? Well, yeah, so that kind 216 00:14:01,960 --> 00:14:04,920 Speaker 1: of stuff can happen, and Bernese really did popularize that. 217 00:14:05,600 --> 00:14:09,400 Speaker 1: But then there's another related possibility that we see when 218 00:14:09,440 --> 00:14:13,480 Speaker 1: big companies start eating each other and creating leviathans. It's 219 00:14:13,559 --> 00:14:18,600 Speaker 1: that they could prevent access to competitor news the same 220 00:14:18,640 --> 00:14:23,760 Speaker 1: way that cable companies and uh, internet service providers and 221 00:14:23,920 --> 00:14:30,880 Speaker 1: things like Netflix are currently in Uh what would they say, beefing. Yeah, 222 00:14:30,920 --> 00:14:33,840 Speaker 1: they're beefing pretty harder. They were beefing a lot harder 223 00:14:34,400 --> 00:14:39,000 Speaker 1: like this previous year before that. But there's there's lots 224 00:14:39,000 --> 00:14:41,160 Speaker 1: of beef to go around in that sector. Who is 225 00:14:41,160 --> 00:14:43,640 Speaker 1: going to be watching the media and where which Apple 226 00:14:43,640 --> 00:14:45,440 Speaker 1: are you're going to use, right, and so we can 227 00:14:45,440 --> 00:14:50,080 Speaker 1: see that happening. If an I s P. Also owns 228 00:14:50,680 --> 00:14:56,520 Speaker 1: a news outfit, then logically, from a business perspective, you 229 00:14:56,560 --> 00:14:59,360 Speaker 1: can you can follow the breadcrumbs to to learn how 230 00:14:59,400 --> 00:15:03,640 Speaker 1: they would eventually decide. Wait, let's not have these other 231 00:15:03,720 --> 00:15:07,360 Speaker 1: people use our road to take our business, you know 232 00:15:07,400 --> 00:15:11,240 Speaker 1: what I mean. The second possibility is that you've got 233 00:15:11,320 --> 00:15:16,560 Speaker 1: some kind of government interference or state level manipulation. Oh man, 234 00:15:16,640 --> 00:15:19,160 Speaker 1: you know this is my favorite one, right, yeah. I 235 00:15:19,200 --> 00:15:24,000 Speaker 1: love stories where an unnamed official reported but they couldn't 236 00:15:24,120 --> 00:15:28,160 Speaker 1: make it, couldn't make a public statement. So an unnamed 237 00:15:28,280 --> 00:15:31,320 Speaker 1: and there's always a little hint like an unnamed State 238 00:15:31,320 --> 00:15:35,760 Speaker 1: Department official, an unnamed high level intelligence official and unnamed 239 00:15:36,040 --> 00:15:41,480 Speaker 1: White House person right or unnamed right? Yeah, yeah, And 240 00:15:41,720 --> 00:15:46,920 Speaker 1: when that happens, we would caution you to be hypersensitive 241 00:15:46,960 --> 00:15:49,400 Speaker 1: to it because what that means is that someone is 242 00:15:49,520 --> 00:15:55,000 Speaker 1: manufacturing a leak. It is sanctioned when people do that 243 00:15:55,080 --> 00:15:59,120 Speaker 1: in general, it is sanctioned. And it's there because your 244 00:15:59,160 --> 00:16:04,000 Speaker 1: opinion should is meant to be suede Yes, we're yeah 245 00:16:04,160 --> 00:16:08,360 Speaker 1: to to provide a counterpoint, perhaps to something that's being 246 00:16:08,360 --> 00:16:11,000 Speaker 1: talked about in the media, or even like a small 247 00:16:11,320 --> 00:16:14,960 Speaker 1: giving in just a small amount to a negative news 248 00:16:15,000 --> 00:16:19,520 Speaker 1: story that's that's circulating, right, Yeah, exactly, a little bit, 249 00:16:19,560 --> 00:16:22,760 Speaker 1: a little bit of spin. And this of course is 250 00:16:24,360 --> 00:16:28,280 Speaker 1: legal at this point, right, we know it's legal if 251 00:16:28,280 --> 00:16:32,640 Speaker 1: it's sanctioned by the actors. But then state level actors, 252 00:16:32,680 --> 00:16:35,760 Speaker 1: and when we say state actors, what we mean are 253 00:16:36,280 --> 00:16:41,600 Speaker 1: the governing regimes of any country. Right, So state level 254 00:16:41,640 --> 00:16:46,400 Speaker 1: actors can also prevent media outlets from publishing information that 255 00:16:46,480 --> 00:16:50,760 Speaker 1: they think would be damaging. You. Often hear this associated 256 00:16:50,760 --> 00:16:55,240 Speaker 1: with the phrase national security, almost always the great boogeyman. Yeah, 257 00:16:55,280 --> 00:16:58,120 Speaker 1: if you can get away with preventing a story coming 258 00:16:58,120 --> 00:17:02,360 Speaker 1: out in the news that national security phrases in there somewhere. 259 00:17:02,840 --> 00:17:05,400 Speaker 1: So this is something when we see, like the New 260 00:17:05,440 --> 00:17:10,080 Speaker 1: York Times has been accused of withholding information. But I 261 00:17:10,119 --> 00:17:14,000 Speaker 1: think there's a big gray area here too, because if 262 00:17:14,200 --> 00:17:19,879 Speaker 1: publishing some sort of information harms people when you publish it, 263 00:17:20,119 --> 00:17:23,959 Speaker 1: then ethically should you sit on it? I don't know, 264 00:17:24,040 --> 00:17:26,640 Speaker 1: and maybe it goes case by case. But another thing 265 00:17:27,040 --> 00:17:28,359 Speaker 1: I just want to say, I think it depends on 266 00:17:28,440 --> 00:17:32,679 Speaker 1: how you view what the media is, it's function in 267 00:17:32,680 --> 00:17:38,200 Speaker 1: a democracy. Should the media be a merciless reporting machine, right? 268 00:17:38,240 --> 00:17:42,639 Speaker 1: Should it exist not to help, not to hinder, but 269 00:17:42,880 --> 00:17:48,600 Speaker 1: only to propagate facts? Should it? I mean maybe in 270 00:17:48,640 --> 00:17:51,080 Speaker 1: a perfect world. I don't think we've ever seen it 271 00:17:51,119 --> 00:17:54,879 Speaker 1: function that way. No. Pro Publica, which we I believe 272 00:17:54,880 --> 00:17:59,200 Speaker 1: we've mentioned on the show before, is a nonprofit entity 273 00:17:59,320 --> 00:18:04,280 Speaker 1: that is, you know, in depth investigative journalism. Yeah, but 274 00:18:04,680 --> 00:18:09,680 Speaker 1: there there are a lot of stories that they will 275 00:18:09,720 --> 00:18:14,320 Speaker 1: have a tough time getting to just due to time demands, 276 00:18:13,880 --> 00:18:18,160 Speaker 1: as I think sometimes yeah, no kidding. Another thing one 277 00:18:18,200 --> 00:18:20,919 Speaker 1: thing that I don't think Pro Publica has done, but 278 00:18:21,040 --> 00:18:26,399 Speaker 1: that a lot of countries work with media outlets to 279 00:18:26,440 --> 00:18:32,200 Speaker 1: create our stories that are written largely by the government. 280 00:18:33,119 --> 00:18:36,920 Speaker 1: So for example, we'll pick on RT a little bit 281 00:18:36,920 --> 00:18:40,439 Speaker 1: here Russian Times. That's what the RT stood for before 282 00:18:40,480 --> 00:18:45,960 Speaker 1: it pulled a TLC, right, And what you will see 283 00:18:46,040 --> 00:18:49,879 Speaker 1: often here are going to be you'll see stuff like 284 00:18:50,000 --> 00:18:53,960 Speaker 1: an unnamed official from the Ministry of blah blah blah 285 00:18:54,520 --> 00:18:58,119 Speaker 1: has said that the latest act of the US is 286 00:18:58,320 --> 00:19:01,359 Speaker 1: total malarkey. And here's why. I don't think they would 287 00:19:01,440 --> 00:19:03,520 Speaker 1: use the word malarkey, but I'd love it if they did. 288 00:19:04,080 --> 00:19:05,520 Speaker 1: I don't know how to. I don't know if there's 289 00:19:05,520 --> 00:19:09,400 Speaker 1: a Russian word for malarkey. Rtie is a news source 290 00:19:09,480 --> 00:19:14,000 Speaker 1: that I find helpful because they will give you that 291 00:19:14,119 --> 00:19:16,360 Speaker 1: opposing viewpoint from a lot of the news you'll see 292 00:19:16,680 --> 00:19:19,960 Speaker 1: in the Western media. But yeah, yeah, like Ben said, 293 00:19:20,000 --> 00:19:25,240 Speaker 1: there there are things that if you're consciously watching and 294 00:19:25,240 --> 00:19:29,240 Speaker 1: and really paying attention, you'll see some of the the 295 00:19:29,359 --> 00:19:34,040 Speaker 1: hints at that stuff, right, Yeah, that the government is 296 00:19:34,040 --> 00:19:38,800 Speaker 1: is writing the think pieces or the drum sometimes, well, 297 00:19:38,880 --> 00:19:41,879 Speaker 1: I would say it's pretty often, and yeah, yeah, I 298 00:19:41,920 --> 00:19:44,920 Speaker 1: mean that's maybe I'm wrong, but it seems like that's 299 00:19:44,960 --> 00:19:47,800 Speaker 1: the case. It seems like that it is used often 300 00:19:47,960 --> 00:19:52,480 Speaker 1: for propaganda purposes. And that leads us to another another 301 00:19:52,640 --> 00:19:55,439 Speaker 1: entity that can control these things, the third one. So 302 00:19:55,480 --> 00:19:59,280 Speaker 1: we did the money right, the corporate sponsorship, we did 303 00:19:59,359 --> 00:20:05,000 Speaker 1: the state level interference, and there's something here that's very individual, 304 00:20:05,800 --> 00:20:09,959 Speaker 1: very very John Galt, I guess the the ideology of 305 00:20:10,040 --> 00:20:13,440 Speaker 1: the owner. Yeah, it's no surprise. These are corporations. If 306 00:20:13,480 --> 00:20:17,359 Speaker 1: you're a large news entity, you're you're probably a corporation. 307 00:20:18,080 --> 00:20:24,080 Speaker 1: And corporations have boards. Corporations have owners, which is kind 308 00:20:24,080 --> 00:20:25,919 Speaker 1: of the board, but also c E. O s and 309 00:20:26,280 --> 00:20:29,639 Speaker 1: all these other people that make up everything right right, 310 00:20:29,840 --> 00:20:34,960 Speaker 1: high powered media barons, and case in point, Rupert Murdoch. 311 00:20:35,040 --> 00:20:39,719 Speaker 1: Whether you agree, whether you agree with what he thinks 312 00:20:39,840 --> 00:20:42,240 Speaker 1: or what he wants to see happen in the world, 313 00:20:42,560 --> 00:20:48,359 Speaker 1: or whether you disagree, it's it would be misleading. It 314 00:20:48,359 --> 00:20:52,439 Speaker 1: would be dishonest to say that he does not actively 315 00:20:52,680 --> 00:20:57,439 Speaker 1: use his possession, his position to influence political views and 316 00:20:57,520 --> 00:21:01,960 Speaker 1: actions of his audience. And it is totally legal. I 317 00:21:02,000 --> 00:21:05,960 Speaker 1: don't know if it's ethical, but until he willfully distorts 318 00:21:06,080 --> 00:21:11,840 Speaker 1: the news, then it is legal. But there's so many 319 00:21:11,920 --> 00:21:17,040 Speaker 1: different ways you can affect the news or influence it 320 00:21:17,119 --> 00:21:19,920 Speaker 1: without quiet crossing that line, you know what I mean. 321 00:21:20,720 --> 00:21:25,200 Speaker 1: So we have we have a quote for another example. 322 00:21:25,240 --> 00:21:27,080 Speaker 1: Here we have a quote from The New Yorker in 323 00:21:27,119 --> 00:21:31,120 Speaker 1: two thousand thirteen, uh piece called a Word from our 324 00:21:31,160 --> 00:21:35,040 Speaker 1: Sponsor by Jane Meyer. And this gives us a little 325 00:21:35,080 --> 00:21:39,240 Speaker 1: bit of insight into the Koch Brothers, specifically David Coke. 326 00:21:39,840 --> 00:21:43,440 Speaker 1: In the nineteen eighties, he began expanding his charitable contributions 327 00:21:43,440 --> 00:21:46,840 Speaker 1: to the media, donating twenty three million dollars to public 328 00:21:46,880 --> 00:21:51,119 Speaker 1: television over the years. In he began serving as a 329 00:21:51,160 --> 00:21:55,720 Speaker 1: trustee of Boston's public broadcasting operation w g b H, 330 00:21:55,840 --> 00:21:57,760 Speaker 1: and in two thousand and six, he joined the board 331 00:21:57,800 --> 00:22:01,679 Speaker 1: of New York's public television outlet w and ET. Recent 332 00:22:01,720 --> 00:22:04,440 Speaker 1: news reports have suggested that the Koch Brothers are considering 333 00:22:04,480 --> 00:22:09,080 Speaker 1: buying eight daily newspapers owned by the Tribune Company, one 334 00:22:09,119 --> 00:22:13,560 Speaker 1: of the country's largest media empires, raising concerns that it's publications, 335 00:22:13,760 --> 00:22:17,119 Speaker 1: which include the Chicago Tribune in the Los Angeles Times, 336 00:22:17,440 --> 00:22:20,520 Speaker 1: might slant news coverage to serve the interests of their 337 00:22:20,560 --> 00:22:25,400 Speaker 1: new owners, either through executive mandates or through self censorship. 338 00:22:26,240 --> 00:22:29,879 Speaker 1: Clarence Page, a Liberal Tribune columnist, recently said that the 339 00:22:29,920 --> 00:22:33,520 Speaker 1: Cokes appeared intent on using a media company as a 340 00:22:33,640 --> 00:22:38,080 Speaker 1: vehicle for their political voice. And this, this example just 341 00:22:38,400 --> 00:22:42,000 Speaker 1: shows us, I think, a quick walk through of what 342 00:22:42,119 --> 00:22:45,400 Speaker 1: could happen if if someone has an ideology and everybody 343 00:22:45,440 --> 00:22:49,080 Speaker 1: has some sort of ideology, right, some sort of belief system. Sure, 344 00:22:49,160 --> 00:22:50,800 Speaker 1: and and it should be noted that that is a 345 00:22:50,800 --> 00:22:54,040 Speaker 1: big what if. That is a speculation on what might 346 00:22:54,119 --> 00:22:58,120 Speaker 1: happen if this goes through. It is not speculation that 347 00:22:58,200 --> 00:23:02,160 Speaker 1: he did take those actions, absolutely, but the very last 348 00:23:02,200 --> 00:23:08,560 Speaker 1: part there, and to be fair, it sounds like Mr. Page, 349 00:23:08,920 --> 00:23:13,240 Speaker 1: as a Liberal Tribune columnist, has reason to be concerned, 350 00:23:13,960 --> 00:23:16,600 Speaker 1: right because he probably does not align with the Koch 351 00:23:16,680 --> 00:23:20,480 Speaker 1: brother vision. We have other examples. Let's do some examples 352 00:23:20,520 --> 00:23:25,840 Speaker 1: of times this has happened. So Jane Acre in journalist 353 00:23:25,880 --> 00:23:30,120 Speaker 1: named Jane Akre and her then husband and partner Steve Wilson, 354 00:23:30,440 --> 00:23:34,320 Speaker 1: were journalists for a little station called w t v 355 00:23:34,560 --> 00:23:39,000 Speaker 1: T in Tampa, Florida that's part of Fox Broadcasting Company, 356 00:23:39,280 --> 00:23:42,520 Speaker 1: and they were working on a story Matt about Monsanto 357 00:23:43,000 --> 00:23:49,280 Speaker 1: and r b g H or its formeral name recombinant 358 00:23:49,320 --> 00:23:52,920 Speaker 1: bovine growth hormone. This is an additive that people put 359 00:23:53,040 --> 00:23:57,680 Speaker 1: in milk. The f d A approved it, but this additive, 360 00:23:57,800 --> 00:24:01,679 Speaker 1: this r b g H, is also blamed for a 361 00:24:01,840 --> 00:24:05,760 Speaker 1: number of alleged health issues. Yeah. R b g H 362 00:24:05,960 --> 00:24:09,000 Speaker 1: is that thing that they inject into the cows to 363 00:24:09,080 --> 00:24:12,439 Speaker 1: make them produce more milk. And I remember when I 364 00:24:12,480 --> 00:24:16,639 Speaker 1: was reading about the story. It makes the they get puss, 365 00:24:16,720 --> 00:24:19,240 Speaker 1: the cows get puss in their utters, and then it 366 00:24:19,280 --> 00:24:21,679 Speaker 1: gets into the milk and it was just a really 367 00:24:22,400 --> 00:24:25,760 Speaker 1: it was a nasty thing. So definitely health issues for 368 00:24:25,800 --> 00:24:30,000 Speaker 1: the cattle. Yes, um and possible health issues for humans 369 00:24:30,000 --> 00:24:33,400 Speaker 1: consuming it, but that was kind of because it gets 370 00:24:33,400 --> 00:24:37,119 Speaker 1: pasteurized anyway, I see, I see, well, okay. So Steve 371 00:24:37,160 --> 00:24:42,679 Speaker 1: Wilson and Jane Acre, they had planned a investigative report 372 00:24:42,720 --> 00:24:47,440 Speaker 1: on this, a long form, four part report. Monsanto, however, 373 00:24:47,760 --> 00:24:50,960 Speaker 1: or representative of Monsanto, wrote to the president of Fox 374 00:24:51,040 --> 00:24:54,640 Speaker 1: News Channel an attempt to have the report quote reviewed 375 00:24:54,680 --> 00:24:59,800 Speaker 1: for bias and because of concerns of potentially enormous damage. Yeah, 376 00:25:00,280 --> 00:25:03,160 Speaker 1: if you knew that there was this thing that sounds 377 00:25:03,200 --> 00:25:06,919 Speaker 1: really gross, that does gross things to the cows, you know, 378 00:25:06,960 --> 00:25:09,480 Speaker 1: from the milk that you're eating, probably you know, you 379 00:25:09,560 --> 00:25:13,000 Speaker 1: might not buy milk that week. You might try something else. 380 00:25:13,800 --> 00:25:15,840 Speaker 1: I think silk was coming out around that time or 381 00:25:15,960 --> 00:25:18,160 Speaker 1: becoming really big. Is that the soy milk, the soy 382 00:25:18,240 --> 00:25:20,800 Speaker 1: milk and all of that. I don't know. It could 383 00:25:20,800 --> 00:25:24,720 Speaker 1: have been really bad for business, been well. Either way, 384 00:25:25,080 --> 00:25:28,040 Speaker 1: w t VT there in Tampa, Florida killed the report 385 00:25:28,160 --> 00:25:30,359 Speaker 1: and they said officially they killed it because this was 386 00:25:30,440 --> 00:25:35,160 Speaker 1: not breakthrough journalism. Snow we're looking for you, guys. Jeez. So, 387 00:25:35,520 --> 00:25:39,240 Speaker 1: Wilson and Acre then claimed w t v T was lying, 388 00:25:40,000 --> 00:25:43,520 Speaker 1: and the channel said that this decision occurred for the 389 00:25:43,560 --> 00:25:46,560 Speaker 1: sake of fairness, I have fair and balance, show both 390 00:25:46,600 --> 00:25:51,000 Speaker 1: sides of the issue. That's what Fox's motto. According to 391 00:25:51,119 --> 00:25:55,960 Speaker 1: Acre and Wilson, the two rewrote this report, and rewrote 392 00:25:55,960 --> 00:25:59,280 Speaker 1: this report, and rewrote it, and they went through about 393 00:25:59,320 --> 00:26:05,200 Speaker 1: eighty visions than w t v T fired them without 394 00:26:05,240 --> 00:26:08,040 Speaker 1: just cause or did not renew their contracts which would 395 00:26:08,080 --> 00:26:12,040 Speaker 1: have been up for renewal in the channel. W t 396 00:26:12,160 --> 00:26:15,000 Speaker 1: VT then later ran a report about mon Santo and 397 00:26:15,359 --> 00:26:19,920 Speaker 1: r v g H the year after, and this report 398 00:26:20,000 --> 00:26:24,240 Speaker 1: included defenses directly from Monsanto, So they had the other side. 399 00:26:24,960 --> 00:26:28,280 Speaker 1: So they show both sides, which is something you know, 400 00:26:28,320 --> 00:26:32,840 Speaker 1: oddly enough on our show, we we do right to do. Yeah, 401 00:26:32,920 --> 00:26:35,159 Speaker 1: I guess I can see it. So Acres and Wilson 402 00:26:35,200 --> 00:26:39,000 Speaker 1: took this to court, fired unjustly. Uh. Acre saw herself 403 00:26:39,119 --> 00:26:42,840 Speaker 1: as a whistleblower, saying this is what shut down. This 404 00:26:42,960 --> 00:26:46,360 Speaker 1: is not real journalism, this is unethical. Uh. They had 405 00:26:46,359 --> 00:26:49,880 Speaker 1: a long court battle, They went through appeals. They finally 406 00:26:49,960 --> 00:26:53,320 Speaker 1: lost the case in two thousand seven, their final challenge 407 00:26:53,359 --> 00:26:57,040 Speaker 1: with the FCC because the FCC called the conflict an 408 00:26:57,200 --> 00:27:03,040 Speaker 1: editorial dispute rather than a deliberate effort to distort the news. 409 00:27:03,080 --> 00:27:07,200 Speaker 1: So was this just a debate over how the story 410 00:27:07,240 --> 00:27:09,919 Speaker 1: should be presented to the public, or was this a 411 00:27:09,960 --> 00:27:14,280 Speaker 1: debate over covering up a story? You know what I mean? 412 00:27:14,600 --> 00:27:17,119 Speaker 1: And the FCC said it was just a debate about 413 00:27:17,600 --> 00:27:21,040 Speaker 1: essentially how how it's presented or the tone. Well, let's 414 00:27:21,040 --> 00:27:23,360 Speaker 1: go to one of my personal favorite ones, another example, 415 00:27:23,520 --> 00:27:26,600 Speaker 1: Edward Burnet's and the American support for the coupe data 416 00:27:26,880 --> 00:27:32,360 Speaker 1: in Guatemala in nineteen fifty four, United Fruit Company, great company. 417 00:27:32,359 --> 00:27:34,720 Speaker 1: You should really learn as much as you can about 418 00:27:34,720 --> 00:27:38,280 Speaker 1: the United Fruit Company. Yeah, United Fruit Company had a 419 00:27:38,320 --> 00:27:42,639 Speaker 1: problem with the democratically elected government of Guatemala, which was 420 00:27:42,720 --> 00:27:46,480 Speaker 1: that the government of Guatemala felt it was being unfairly 421 00:27:46,520 --> 00:27:53,280 Speaker 1: treated by a foreign owned company that was intensely corrupt 422 00:27:53,640 --> 00:27:57,440 Speaker 1: and violent towards the people of Guatemala and large and powerful, 423 00:27:57,960 --> 00:28:02,160 Speaker 1: right and large and more powerful than the government of Guatemala. 424 00:28:02,400 --> 00:28:06,480 Speaker 1: So United Fruit hired Edward Burns to portray the company 425 00:28:06,920 --> 00:28:11,399 Speaker 1: as a victim of the unfair Guatemalan government to spread 426 00:28:11,440 --> 00:28:17,880 Speaker 1: misinformation building support in the US amidst voters and influencers 427 00:28:18,040 --> 00:28:23,440 Speaker 1: link in Congress to build support for a coup in Guatemala, 428 00:28:23,480 --> 00:28:26,879 Speaker 1: which launched a civil war that went on for decades 429 00:28:27,400 --> 00:28:31,480 Speaker 1: and was absolutely brutal and did not end until the 430 00:28:31,560 --> 00:28:36,840 Speaker 1: nineteen nineties. That's what happened. And this, this, this thing 431 00:28:36,920 --> 00:28:40,840 Speaker 1: that worked so well, was necessary really for support of 432 00:28:40,840 --> 00:28:44,880 Speaker 1: the coup because at that time, you know, like the 433 00:28:44,880 --> 00:28:49,360 Speaker 1: average person again going back to John and Jane Quotitian public, 434 00:28:49,480 --> 00:28:52,960 Speaker 1: that's what the Q stands for. They were they were 435 00:28:53,040 --> 00:28:55,800 Speaker 1: not likely to support a foreign intervention. You know, how, 436 00:28:55,920 --> 00:28:57,440 Speaker 1: what what does this have to do with us? That 437 00:28:57,600 --> 00:29:00,920 Speaker 1: was what do I gain from this action? But it 438 00:29:01,040 --> 00:29:07,680 Speaker 1: worked and the R. Bens government was overthrown thanks to this, uh, 439 00:29:07,800 --> 00:29:11,240 Speaker 1: this series of reports. So that was a while ago. 440 00:29:11,640 --> 00:29:14,360 Speaker 1: Right now, we're in this brand new age of the 441 00:29:14,360 --> 00:29:17,640 Speaker 1: Internet bend. You can get information as quickly as you 442 00:29:17,720 --> 00:29:20,880 Speaker 1: want it and as much of it from any different 443 00:29:20,920 --> 00:29:25,600 Speaker 1: place that you want to. So misinformation unfortunately, in this 444 00:29:25,680 --> 00:29:29,600 Speaker 1: brand new world, it can spread more easily than ever before. 445 00:29:30,360 --> 00:29:34,040 Speaker 1: And Gadget knocked four billion off the Apple market cap. 446 00:29:34,920 --> 00:29:37,640 Speaker 1: Do you remember this? It was due to an internal 447 00:29:37,680 --> 00:29:41,040 Speaker 1: Apple email about the delay of an OS and operating 448 00:29:41,080 --> 00:29:45,120 Speaker 1: system Leopard back in two thousand seven. So just by 449 00:29:45,360 --> 00:29:51,000 Speaker 1: Engadget talking about this, it went flup. There's four billion 450 00:29:51,040 --> 00:29:54,400 Speaker 1: down the drain. Yeah, Apple stocked tank. There was a 451 00:29:54,440 --> 00:29:57,840 Speaker 1: massive sell off. And then Apple quickly notified in gadget 452 00:29:58,040 --> 00:30:01,160 Speaker 1: that this was a hoax and that there was no delay. Oh, 453 00:30:01,360 --> 00:30:04,840 Speaker 1: it was just a hoax. Okay, Yeah, speaking of hoaxes, right, 454 00:30:04,920 --> 00:30:08,120 Speaker 1: Green Peace also did a hoax. Uh. Then there was 455 00:30:08,160 --> 00:30:12,520 Speaker 1: a video, an alleged video of Shell executives celebrating a 456 00:30:12,640 --> 00:30:15,960 Speaker 1: new drilling venture. Several news sources must take it for 457 00:30:16,040 --> 00:30:20,040 Speaker 1: something legit and was actually a production involving the Yes Men, 458 00:30:20,520 --> 00:30:23,560 Speaker 1: which you you're familiar with, right Matt, Yeah, great, And 459 00:30:23,680 --> 00:30:25,360 Speaker 1: I think it was the first thing they were in 460 00:30:25,400 --> 00:30:29,360 Speaker 1: was a documentary that they made about what they were doing, 461 00:30:29,840 --> 00:30:33,480 Speaker 1: where they would impersonate an official from some giant corporation 462 00:30:34,120 --> 00:30:38,720 Speaker 1: and basically get other corporations or the one that they 463 00:30:38,720 --> 00:30:42,320 Speaker 1: were impersonating to admit things, admit or try to get 464 00:30:42,320 --> 00:30:47,600 Speaker 1: them to admit wrongdoing. Yes, yeah, exactly, or say we apologize, 465 00:30:47,840 --> 00:30:51,240 Speaker 1: and they would pretend to be representatives of a bank 466 00:30:51,440 --> 00:30:54,640 Speaker 1: or some other large company, oil company, right yeah, and 467 00:30:54,680 --> 00:30:57,440 Speaker 1: they would say we apologize for whatever, We're going to 468 00:30:57,480 --> 00:31:00,840 Speaker 1: give donate billions of dollars. The one I remember most 469 00:31:00,960 --> 00:31:04,240 Speaker 1: is when they represented Union Carbide and they came out 470 00:31:04,360 --> 00:31:10,120 Speaker 1: and publicly apologized for the Beau Paul spill and disaster. Uh, 471 00:31:10,160 --> 00:31:14,760 Speaker 1: and they said they were gonna pay I think I 472 00:31:14,800 --> 00:31:17,120 Speaker 1: think they said they were going to pay people in 473 00:31:17,160 --> 00:31:21,480 Speaker 1: Bo Paul for all the harm that they caused. Oh right, Yeah. 474 00:31:21,520 --> 00:31:25,560 Speaker 1: This was in two thousand and four, twenti anniversary of 475 00:31:25,840 --> 00:31:28,600 Speaker 1: the disaster. A guy claiming to be a Dow representative 476 00:31:28,920 --> 00:31:32,840 Speaker 1: was interviewed on BBC World News. He said the company 477 00:31:32,960 --> 00:31:34,960 Speaker 1: was going to clean up the site and compensate everyone 478 00:31:35,000 --> 00:31:38,360 Speaker 1: harmed in that incident because they were gonna liquidate you 479 00:31:38,440 --> 00:31:42,800 Speaker 1: and Union Carbide for like twelve billion dollars. Dal quickly said, 480 00:31:42,920 --> 00:31:47,080 Speaker 1: we don't know this guy. Everything he's saying is not correct, 481 00:31:47,200 --> 00:31:50,720 Speaker 1: and that was all happening while he was on the air, right, Yeah, 482 00:31:50,760 --> 00:31:54,400 Speaker 1: they jumped on it pretty quickly. This manipulation could also 483 00:31:54,440 --> 00:31:57,880 Speaker 1: be a matter of timing. And there's something really neat 484 00:31:57,920 --> 00:32:00,400 Speaker 1: that we'd like to introduce you guys to here in 485 00:32:00,400 --> 00:32:04,280 Speaker 1: the West, a lot of possibly disruptive, unfavorable around popular 486 00:32:04,400 --> 00:32:09,120 Speaker 1: stories are issued on a Friday afternoon or early evening, 487 00:32:09,480 --> 00:32:14,760 Speaker 1: and it's often called a Friday news Dump. If you 488 00:32:14,760 --> 00:32:17,280 Speaker 1: want to learn more about this, we highly recommend you 489 00:32:17,400 --> 00:32:21,160 Speaker 1: check out the subreddit Friday news Dump, right. Yeah, and 490 00:32:21,160 --> 00:32:23,280 Speaker 1: if you just scroll through that, you'll see a bunch 491 00:32:23,320 --> 00:32:27,560 Speaker 1: of stories that are allegedly stuff, maybe not stuff they 492 00:32:27,560 --> 00:32:29,280 Speaker 1: don't want, you know, but stuff they hope you don't 493 00:32:29,280 --> 00:32:33,920 Speaker 1: pay too much attention. They reported it, but not not 494 00:32:34,040 --> 00:32:36,320 Speaker 1: many eyes are on it at that time when it's 495 00:32:36,440 --> 00:32:40,160 Speaker 1: really hot, right when at that moment when it comes out. Yeah, 496 00:32:40,160 --> 00:32:43,560 Speaker 1: And speaking of learning more and fantastic segways, we have 497 00:32:43,680 --> 00:32:45,959 Speaker 1: some stuff you to check out if you would like 498 00:32:46,160 --> 00:32:52,560 Speaker 1: to delve into the strange world of media manipulation. The 499 00:32:52,560 --> 00:32:54,480 Speaker 1: first would be the book we mentioned at the top 500 00:32:54,480 --> 00:32:56,800 Speaker 1: of the Business of Media, Corporate Media and the Public 501 00:32:56,840 --> 00:33:00,680 Speaker 1: Interest with David Crouteaux and William Hoynes. That second one 502 00:33:00,760 --> 00:33:04,600 Speaker 1: is the essay we mentioned by Edward Burns called Engineering Consent. 503 00:33:04,840 --> 00:33:13,440 Speaker 1: And also I would say maybe even first read Propaganda. Yes, Propaganda, Wow, 504 00:33:13,520 --> 00:33:16,400 Speaker 1: what a great book. I had a copy of that somewhere. 505 00:33:17,440 --> 00:33:19,520 Speaker 1: Did I steal it from you? I don't know. I 506 00:33:19,520 --> 00:33:22,440 Speaker 1: don't know if there's some books met that I don't 507 00:33:22,440 --> 00:33:25,120 Speaker 1: think anybody really owens. I'm gonna check my shelves when 508 00:33:25,160 --> 00:33:27,640 Speaker 1: I go home. Okay, well, then if you find it, 509 00:33:28,160 --> 00:33:31,760 Speaker 1: just just pass it along to someone else. Yeah. And 510 00:33:31,800 --> 00:33:34,280 Speaker 1: then we have a more recent book, The Image, A 511 00:33:34,320 --> 00:33:38,400 Speaker 1: Guide to Pseudo Events in America by Daniel J. Boston. 512 00:33:38,760 --> 00:33:42,400 Speaker 1: This is more recent than Propaganda, but it's still It 513 00:33:42,480 --> 00:33:46,200 Speaker 1: was published in nineteen sixty two. And this this concept 514 00:33:46,240 --> 00:33:49,080 Speaker 1: of pseudo events, This is stuff like a press conference 515 00:33:49,160 --> 00:33:54,080 Speaker 1: or presidential debate manufactured solely to be reported. And how 516 00:33:54,120 --> 00:33:57,240 Speaker 1: the definition of a celebrity at the time this book 517 00:33:57,280 --> 00:34:00,320 Speaker 1: was being written was transforming to someone who is known 518 00:34:00,840 --> 00:34:06,000 Speaker 1: for being well known, so not someone who contributes artistically 519 00:34:06,160 --> 00:34:14,120 Speaker 1: or materially or intellectually to society. Someone who is just 520 00:34:14,400 --> 00:34:19,600 Speaker 1: is a stranger you are supposed to know for doing anything, 521 00:34:19,640 --> 00:34:22,560 Speaker 1: even if it's just being in this being good at 522 00:34:22,719 --> 00:34:27,440 Speaker 1: being in the spotlight. Yeah right, Yeah, and then this 523 00:34:27,480 --> 00:34:33,000 Speaker 1: guy kind of cast a vision of us at least 524 00:34:33,160 --> 00:34:37,440 Speaker 1: that is consumed by its own illusions that sort of 525 00:34:37,520 --> 00:34:41,080 Speaker 1: feed on themselves, and how difficult it can be to 526 00:34:41,200 --> 00:34:46,720 Speaker 1: find actual information. Right. The next one is called trust 527 00:34:46,760 --> 00:34:51,879 Speaker 1: Me I'm Lying. Confessions of a Media Manipulator by Ryan Holiday. Now, 528 00:34:52,000 --> 00:34:55,240 Speaker 1: Ryan Holiday right has written some great stuff for Forbes, 529 00:34:56,080 --> 00:34:59,520 Speaker 1: and he would be I think the phrase uses is 530 00:34:59,800 --> 00:35:04,560 Speaker 1: me he a strategist, but the media manipulator is what 531 00:35:04,640 --> 00:35:07,240 Speaker 1: he's what he's called it before, and he talked about, 532 00:35:07,560 --> 00:35:13,040 Speaker 1: you know, these malicious online rumors costing companies millions of dollars. Uh, 533 00:35:13,400 --> 00:35:20,479 Speaker 1: these scandals just sweeping across the political landscape, leining someone's career. 534 00:35:20,560 --> 00:35:24,320 Speaker 1: That way, someone all this is some product or celebrity 535 00:35:25,200 --> 00:35:28,799 Speaker 1: becomes a viral sensation. But he says this doesn't happen 536 00:35:28,840 --> 00:35:32,520 Speaker 1: by accident. There's usually someone responsible for it. And he 537 00:35:32,560 --> 00:35:37,840 Speaker 1: says he establishes three things about today's culture. The first 538 00:35:37,880 --> 00:35:42,360 Speaker 1: one is blogs online blogs like think about the Gawker 539 00:35:42,719 --> 00:35:48,319 Speaker 1: or huff Po, Huffington Post or BuzzFeed. These sites they've 540 00:35:48,360 --> 00:35:52,759 Speaker 1: spit out so much stuff and they are meant to 541 00:35:53,400 --> 00:35:58,160 Speaker 1: bait you into clicking. Right, you won't believe what how 542 00:35:58,200 --> 00:36:03,640 Speaker 1: clickable they are. Keyboards hate them, write something like that, 543 00:36:03,880 --> 00:36:08,279 Speaker 1: Microsoft and other keyboard makers love them right right, But 544 00:36:08,520 --> 00:36:10,320 Speaker 1: stick around for the rest of the list because number 545 00:36:10,320 --> 00:36:14,040 Speaker 1: two will blow your mind. Number two bloggers are slaves 546 00:36:14,080 --> 00:36:18,759 Speaker 1: to money, technology and deadlines. And his his language there, 547 00:36:19,000 --> 00:36:20,759 Speaker 1: I don't know that if that comparison is very good 548 00:36:20,800 --> 00:36:24,720 Speaker 1: but you know, the point is there there are things 549 00:36:24,760 --> 00:36:28,959 Speaker 1: that these bloggers have to depend upon, right, Yeah, they 550 00:36:29,040 --> 00:36:32,600 Speaker 1: can't just be magically nurtured by the gods of good 551 00:36:32,640 --> 00:36:37,799 Speaker 1: investigative journalism. True yet, which is a shame one day 552 00:36:38,000 --> 00:36:42,240 Speaker 1: number three. Manipulators whield these levers to shape everything you read, 553 00:36:42,560 --> 00:36:48,040 Speaker 1: everything you see and watch online and sometimes offline. Right, 554 00:36:48,120 --> 00:36:53,240 Speaker 1: the Bernese legacy continues and in these in these books 555 00:36:53,280 --> 00:36:58,120 Speaker 1: you can learn more about the behind the scenes and now, 556 00:36:58,239 --> 00:37:01,000 Speaker 1: be honest, some of it's pretty dirty, the behind the 557 00:37:01,080 --> 00:37:07,359 Speaker 1: scenes behavior that goes into the the story. You all 558 00:37:07,400 --> 00:37:10,799 Speaker 1: of a sudden saw the Internet go nuts over, like 559 00:37:10,840 --> 00:37:14,720 Speaker 1: the what color was the dress? Thing? Right, which was 560 00:37:15,080 --> 00:37:17,799 Speaker 1: a thing that people seem to be very interested in, 561 00:37:18,080 --> 00:37:20,080 Speaker 1: but it was was it because it was really interested 562 00:37:20,200 --> 00:37:24,080 Speaker 1: or was there a manufactured wave of attention? You know, 563 00:37:24,200 --> 00:37:27,320 Speaker 1: that's a good question. I don't know the answer to it. However, 564 00:37:27,400 --> 00:37:32,280 Speaker 1: we hope that this introduction to media manipulation has given 565 00:37:32,280 --> 00:37:35,200 Speaker 1: you some things to think about and some tools to 566 00:37:35,400 --> 00:37:38,400 Speaker 1: use when you're watching stuff. Now, Matt, I think you 567 00:37:38,480 --> 00:37:42,120 Speaker 1: and I have said this before, but if you go 568 00:37:42,160 --> 00:37:46,200 Speaker 1: in assuming that every place, every every show, ours included, 569 00:37:46,280 --> 00:37:50,840 Speaker 1: perhaps has an agenda. Then what you find is that 570 00:37:50,960 --> 00:37:56,160 Speaker 1: the best way to learn the objective facts or truth 571 00:37:56,200 --> 00:38:01,160 Speaker 1: about something is not to rely on one source. Right. Absolutely, 572 00:38:01,160 --> 00:38:04,279 Speaker 1: spread it out a little bit, because you're those points 573 00:38:04,320 --> 00:38:07,600 Speaker 1: of perspective from all these different outlets are going to 574 00:38:07,640 --> 00:38:12,160 Speaker 1: give you better perspective, right Exactly. So it's true that 575 00:38:13,040 --> 00:38:18,959 Speaker 1: r T and maybe the Washington Post will publish very 576 00:38:19,040 --> 00:38:24,600 Speaker 1: different accounts of maybe the same event. Right And instead 577 00:38:24,680 --> 00:38:29,520 Speaker 1: of thinking, well, I'm going to find one place reporting 578 00:38:29,560 --> 00:38:33,359 Speaker 1: this that isn't clearly a hit piece or doesn't have 579 00:38:33,440 --> 00:38:36,120 Speaker 1: some sort of agenda, it takes a little more effort, 580 00:38:36,200 --> 00:38:39,520 Speaker 1: but it is more rewarding to check out both of 581 00:38:39,560 --> 00:38:43,040 Speaker 1: them and say what, what what do I think? It's true, 582 00:38:43,040 --> 00:38:45,359 Speaker 1: it's like going to the doctor for something serious, get 583 00:38:45,360 --> 00:38:49,200 Speaker 1: a second opinion every time. Absolutely. Before we wrap up, 584 00:38:49,239 --> 00:38:53,160 Speaker 1: inn I was interested if you would like to hear 585 00:38:53,160 --> 00:39:02,200 Speaker 1: some listener mail. Alright, so listener mail today, we have 586 00:39:02,320 --> 00:39:05,200 Speaker 1: some corrections. Ladies and gentlemen come to us courtesy of 587 00:39:05,320 --> 00:39:10,200 Speaker 1: Stephen Kay. And Stephen Kay pointed out a huge goof 588 00:39:10,239 --> 00:39:14,120 Speaker 1: that we made in the episode. Yeah, lb J was 589 00:39:14,239 --> 00:39:18,320 Speaker 1: not running for re election. In fact, two months before 590 00:39:19,400 --> 00:39:22,440 Speaker 1: Robert Kennedy was killed l b J said, I shall 591 00:39:22,440 --> 00:39:24,960 Speaker 1: not seek and I will not accept the nomination of 592 00:39:25,000 --> 00:39:29,319 Speaker 1: my party for another term as your president. Right, And 593 00:39:29,400 --> 00:39:31,680 Speaker 1: you are correct, Stephen, And thanks so much for writing 594 00:39:32,040 --> 00:39:35,120 Speaker 1: and we we appreciate it. We appreciate your time there. Okay, 595 00:39:35,120 --> 00:39:36,600 Speaker 1: we've got a little bit of time. Let's do one 596 00:39:36,640 --> 00:39:40,600 Speaker 1: more all right. This message comes from Corey. He says, Hey, guys, 597 00:39:40,760 --> 00:39:43,560 Speaker 1: really enjoy your show. Thanks dude, I was listening to 598 00:39:43,600 --> 00:39:45,920 Speaker 1: the most recent episode on Robert Kennedy and the theory 599 00:39:45,960 --> 00:39:50,200 Speaker 1: regarding whether he was assassinated by a Manchurian candidate. You 600 00:39:50,239 --> 00:39:52,239 Speaker 1: may want to take a look at the hypnotism and 601 00:39:52,320 --> 00:39:55,920 Speaker 1: mentalism community. While you mentioned Darren Brown, take a look 602 00:39:55,920 --> 00:40:00,359 Speaker 1: at Anthony Waukin's hypnotism seminars and products he as one 603 00:40:00,440 --> 00:40:05,840 Speaker 1: called reality is Plastic and the Trilby connection and the 604 00:40:05,880 --> 00:40:10,080 Speaker 1: Manchurion approach all sound interesting, uh. In addition, there are 605 00:40:10,120 --> 00:40:12,600 Speaker 1: some other magic esque products out there on the market, 606 00:40:12,680 --> 00:40:16,680 Speaker 1: like mind Eraser by Joe Broguey, which according to them, 607 00:40:16,719 --> 00:40:21,399 Speaker 1: makes people forget simple information like the chosen card their 608 00:40:21,440 --> 00:40:26,040 Speaker 1: own name. What my personal belief is that hypnotism doesn't work. 609 00:40:26,320 --> 00:40:29,800 Speaker 1: It's based on routines, that are psychological and aid and 610 00:40:29,840 --> 00:40:32,720 Speaker 1: assisting people to believe. Perhaps you can do a show 611 00:40:32,840 --> 00:40:38,719 Speaker 1: on head hacking see j Noble Izada. Anyhow, I hope 612 00:40:38,760 --> 00:40:42,320 Speaker 1: this helps interesting stuff. Corey. Yeah, thank you for writing 613 00:40:42,360 --> 00:40:44,560 Speaker 1: Inquiry one. One thing I will say is that it 614 00:40:44,600 --> 00:40:50,000 Speaker 1: really depends on what your concept of hypnotism is. We did, ah, 615 00:40:50,040 --> 00:40:52,800 Speaker 1: I did a piece for brain Stuff on hypnotism earlier, 616 00:40:53,200 --> 00:40:59,640 Speaker 1: and this state of suggestibility concept does it does have 617 00:41:00,200 --> 00:41:04,399 Speaker 1: hand to However, it's the the idea that you could 618 00:41:04,640 --> 00:41:10,160 Speaker 1: mentally overpower someone, put them in a trance and make 619 00:41:10,200 --> 00:41:14,920 Speaker 1: them do something insane. It's not that simple, nor that 620 00:41:14,960 --> 00:41:19,120 Speaker 1: clear cut, and it's not right. Yeah, exactly, uh and 621 00:41:19,160 --> 00:41:21,160 Speaker 1: how cool would it be? And we hope that you 622 00:41:21,200 --> 00:41:25,479 Speaker 1: guys have enjoyed the podcast so far because there's one 623 00:41:25,520 --> 00:41:29,040 Speaker 1: more thing we do at the end of every episode, now, 624 00:41:29,160 --> 00:41:31,520 Speaker 1: isn't that right? That's right, Ben, It's time for our 625 00:41:31,680 --> 00:41:35,200 Speaker 1: moment with NOL. Hey buddy, Hey guys, how's how's it going. 626 00:41:35,480 --> 00:41:38,440 Speaker 1: It's going okay, there we go doing pretty well. See, 627 00:41:38,440 --> 00:41:41,040 Speaker 1: you've got a double set of headphones in today. Well, 628 00:41:41,040 --> 00:41:42,880 Speaker 1: it's just a proper set of headphones and then a 629 00:41:42,920 --> 00:41:47,560 Speaker 1: single earbudon yeah, nice, you're a renaissance man. Can I 630 00:41:47,640 --> 00:41:50,560 Speaker 1: bring something up that our audience maybe doesn't know? Sure? 631 00:41:50,640 --> 00:41:52,440 Speaker 1: And you guys might be a little embarrassed, but I 632 00:41:52,440 --> 00:41:55,400 Speaker 1: just want to get into it. Just if that's okay? 633 00:41:55,680 --> 00:41:58,080 Speaker 1: Do it? So? I have now seen both of you 634 00:41:58,160 --> 00:42:02,600 Speaker 1: perform live in front of audio in things that are 635 00:42:02,640 --> 00:42:05,680 Speaker 1: outside of work. Are you guys okay with me talking 636 00:42:05,680 --> 00:42:08,560 Speaker 1: about this? Okay? Well, should we get through you first? 637 00:42:08,680 --> 00:42:13,719 Speaker 1: Let's get done with you first. Let's do let's okay? Okay? Alright? Noel, yes? 638 00:42:14,120 --> 00:42:16,239 Speaker 1: Uh so. I don't know how many people out here. No, 639 00:42:16,360 --> 00:42:21,000 Speaker 1: but you're a musician. You're an excellent bassist, You're excellent 640 00:42:21,000 --> 00:42:25,200 Speaker 1: on a keyboard, you're composer, you are a multi instrumental 641 00:42:25,760 --> 00:42:29,440 Speaker 1: kind of you, sir, and I I don't know. I 642 00:42:29,480 --> 00:42:30,919 Speaker 1: just want to bring this up. I want to talk 643 00:42:30,920 --> 00:42:35,200 Speaker 1: about performing live in front of an audience because I 644 00:42:35,239 --> 00:42:37,640 Speaker 1: haven't done this in a good long while. I played drums, 645 00:42:37,719 --> 00:42:40,560 Speaker 1: used to play drums live a lot. But how do you, 646 00:42:40,600 --> 00:42:44,000 Speaker 1: guys approach that? Do you still have, like get the 647 00:42:44,080 --> 00:42:47,160 Speaker 1: nervous feeling when you do that stuff? I mean, I 648 00:42:47,200 --> 00:42:49,040 Speaker 1: guess it's all about your comfort level. Like I look 649 00:42:49,080 --> 00:42:50,960 Speaker 1: at something like what Ben does where he's you know, 650 00:42:51,480 --> 00:42:53,320 Speaker 1: doing stuff off the cuff in front of a crowd, 651 00:42:53,680 --> 00:42:56,360 Speaker 1: and that just makes me feel like a crazy person 652 00:42:56,560 --> 00:42:59,520 Speaker 1: that like, you know, I mean, I can improvise playing music, 653 00:42:59,560 --> 00:43:01,600 Speaker 1: but nine times out of ten, I'm doing something that's 654 00:43:01,600 --> 00:43:03,719 Speaker 1: pretty well rehearsed and then I'm real comfortable with and 655 00:43:04,360 --> 00:43:07,040 Speaker 1: you know, I feel the exact same way as a drummer. 656 00:43:07,200 --> 00:43:12,600 Speaker 1: So everybody been, I thank you for asking, Thank you 657 00:43:12,600 --> 00:43:18,000 Speaker 1: for asking. I primarily, uh, I primarily count on mescaline. 658 00:43:18,120 --> 00:43:24,920 Speaker 1: You know. That's how live performances, yeah, is you know, 659 00:43:24,960 --> 00:43:28,480 Speaker 1: I mean, just take a bunch of mescaline, right, and 660 00:43:28,480 --> 00:43:30,440 Speaker 1: then the spirit is with you and then it's a 661 00:43:30,480 --> 00:43:34,680 Speaker 1: spirit journey whatever you're doing. Just in all, in all farness, 662 00:43:35,200 --> 00:43:38,440 Speaker 1: I have never tried mescaline. I'm not that. I'm not 663 00:43:38,560 --> 00:43:42,000 Speaker 1: that uh cool or really even that enterprising. I don't 664 00:43:42,040 --> 00:43:44,319 Speaker 1: know where I would find it. I'm not plugged in enough. 665 00:43:44,360 --> 00:43:47,200 Speaker 1: I'm too square. Uh But I hear it's in the desert, 666 00:43:47,440 --> 00:43:50,560 Speaker 1: like you gotta tap a cactus or something nice. Do 667 00:43:50,600 --> 00:43:53,640 Speaker 1: you have a secret tap? I don't know. I think 668 00:43:53,680 --> 00:43:58,279 Speaker 1: I learned that from watching the Doors movie. Yes, so well, 669 00:43:58,440 --> 00:44:00,520 Speaker 1: live performance you know, we have a lot of performers 670 00:44:00,680 --> 00:44:03,239 Speaker 1: in our audience too, and every so often we get 671 00:44:03,520 --> 00:44:05,640 Speaker 1: an email from them. I want to invite you guys 672 00:44:05,640 --> 00:44:07,560 Speaker 1: to feel free if you if you would like to 673 00:44:07,600 --> 00:44:10,320 Speaker 1: send some music our way that you think is cooled, 674 00:44:10,360 --> 00:44:13,240 Speaker 1: and yeah, we'd love to hear it. Any performance really well, 675 00:44:13,480 --> 00:44:18,640 Speaker 1: any safe your work, your performance, don't crack it up 676 00:44:18,640 --> 00:44:20,719 Speaker 1: a little bit there. You know what I've been revisiting lately. 677 00:44:20,760 --> 00:44:22,360 Speaker 1: I don't know if you guys are into this. Have 678 00:44:22,440 --> 00:44:27,520 Speaker 1: you heard of the group Destroyers? Yes, they were big 679 00:44:27,560 --> 00:44:30,120 Speaker 1: on album eight for All Time. Yeah, let's this guy, 680 00:44:30,200 --> 00:44:33,400 Speaker 1: Dan b b har b Jar. It's a jounce so 681 00:44:33,400 --> 00:44:35,160 Speaker 1: but he was also in the band the New Pornographers. 682 00:44:35,160 --> 00:44:37,920 Speaker 1: But his stuff is Destroyer. I've been kind of revisiting 683 00:44:37,960 --> 00:44:42,400 Speaker 1: and he's got some pretty pretty interesting little conspiratorial tidbits 684 00:44:42,400 --> 00:44:46,640 Speaker 1: in his layers, very kind of apocalyptic, kind of little 685 00:44:46,920 --> 00:44:49,719 Speaker 1: urns of phrase. Well I'm a big fan of Yeah, 686 00:44:49,719 --> 00:44:51,879 Speaker 1: all right, I'm gonna go check that out right now. 687 00:44:51,960 --> 00:44:54,640 Speaker 1: Thank you for telling me. You know, I love there's 688 00:44:54,680 --> 00:44:57,560 Speaker 1: something that I felt like maybe I would have wanted 689 00:44:57,560 --> 00:45:00,000 Speaker 1: to hear you guys touch on in the episode today. Um, 690 00:45:00,080 --> 00:45:01,920 Speaker 1: I guess it hasn't really made a huge splash, but 691 00:45:02,000 --> 00:45:05,359 Speaker 1: it came out maybe yesterday yesterday that Brian Williams in 692 00:45:05,400 --> 00:45:13,719 Speaker 1: fact not going to be resuming his post. Really, Brian Williams, 693 00:45:14,000 --> 00:45:18,200 Speaker 1: didn't he get in trouble for uh exaggerating right this 694 00:45:18,280 --> 00:45:20,920 Speaker 1: story about the helicopter. Yeah, and then you know, and 695 00:45:20,920 --> 00:45:22,720 Speaker 1: I think that called attention to the fact that maybe 696 00:45:22,719 --> 00:45:25,799 Speaker 1: there were some other things that he wasn't completely you know, 697 00:45:25,920 --> 00:45:27,759 Speaker 1: above board with, and it just kind of made me 698 00:45:27,760 --> 00:45:30,920 Speaker 1: think of this idea as like news reporters as celebrities. Yeah, 699 00:45:31,000 --> 00:45:33,520 Speaker 1: that's exactly want to bring up. He crosses the divide 700 00:45:33,520 --> 00:45:38,000 Speaker 1: there a regular Anderson Cooper, So it really starts blurring 701 00:45:38,000 --> 00:45:40,880 Speaker 1: the lines. And you're talking about like reporting celebrity gossip, 702 00:45:40,960 --> 00:45:44,520 Speaker 1: and then you have these reporters who themselves are celebrities 703 00:45:44,840 --> 00:45:50,440 Speaker 1: doing a performance. So I don't know, Yeah, uh, that 704 00:45:50,440 --> 00:45:53,160 Speaker 1: that's that's an excellent example and thank you so much 705 00:45:53,160 --> 00:45:55,760 Speaker 1: for raising it. And this is a great way for 706 00:45:55,880 --> 00:45:59,399 Speaker 1: us to ask you for advice. Ladies and gentlemen, What 707 00:45:59,480 --> 00:46:02,880 Speaker 1: do you think are some of the most often censored 708 00:46:03,040 --> 00:46:06,640 Speaker 1: or suppressed news stories? What do you what do you 709 00:46:06,680 --> 00:46:12,480 Speaker 1: think is dishonest about the media today and why if 710 00:46:12,480 --> 00:46:14,960 Speaker 1: you if you had to guess why, I'd really like 711 00:46:15,040 --> 00:46:18,359 Speaker 1: to know stories, at least recent stories that you think 712 00:46:18,400 --> 00:46:21,800 Speaker 1: have been either pushed to the side or just covered 713 00:46:22,280 --> 00:46:27,040 Speaker 1: like just on top with a giant pancake of celebrity. 714 00:46:27,080 --> 00:46:29,200 Speaker 1: I just I mean the biggest pancake you can imatch 715 00:46:29,280 --> 00:46:32,359 Speaker 1: to it on top. And that's the end of this 716 00:46:32,480 --> 00:46:36,680 Speaker 1: classic episode. If you have any thoughts or questions about 717 00:46:36,840 --> 00:46:39,680 Speaker 1: this episode, you can get into contact with us in 718 00:46:39,680 --> 00:46:41,800 Speaker 1: a number of different ways. One of the best is 719 00:46:41,840 --> 00:46:43,919 Speaker 1: to give us a call. Our number is one eight 720 00:46:44,120 --> 00:46:47,480 Speaker 1: three three st d w y t K. If you 721 00:46:47,480 --> 00:46:49,319 Speaker 1: don't want to do that, you can send us a 722 00:46:49,360 --> 00:46:52,799 Speaker 1: good old fashioned email. We are conspiracy at i heart 723 00:46:52,920 --> 00:46:56,319 Speaker 1: radio dot com. Stuff they Don't want you to Know 724 00:46:56,560 --> 00:46:59,560 Speaker 1: is a production of I heart Radio. For more podcasts 725 00:46:59,560 --> 00:47:01,799 Speaker 1: from my heart Radio, visit the i heart Radio app, 726 00:47:01,880 --> 00:47:04,720 Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.