1 00:00:01,240 --> 00:00:05,880 Speaker 1: You're listening to Monster BTK, a production of iHeart Podcasts 2 00:00:06,160 --> 00:00:10,080 Speaker 1: and Tenderfoot TV. Listener discretion is advised. 3 00:00:14,080 --> 00:00:19,400 Speaker 2: One afternoon in two thousand and five, we noticed everything 4 00:00:19,480 --> 00:00:23,600 Speaker 2: went very quiet at the police department. No one would 5 00:00:23,600 --> 00:00:26,760 Speaker 2: return our calls, no one would even talk to us. 6 00:00:27,480 --> 00:00:30,280 Speaker 2: And I remember talking to our police reporter and she said, 7 00:00:30,320 --> 00:00:34,199 Speaker 2: something's up, and I thought exactly the same thing. And 8 00:00:34,240 --> 00:00:38,479 Speaker 2: in a few minutes, we heard traffic in Park City 9 00:00:39,040 --> 00:00:42,159 Speaker 2: that they had stopped a car in Park City, Kansas, 10 00:00:43,080 --> 00:00:47,200 Speaker 2: and every detective from the Wichitaw Police Department was out there, 11 00:00:47,440 --> 00:00:51,879 Speaker 2: so obviously we went out there and sure enough it 12 00:00:52,120 --> 00:00:58,200 Speaker 2: was Dennis Raider AKABTK and that's when the story exploded 13 00:00:58,480 --> 00:01:04,040 Speaker 2: in Wichita The networks flew their powerful anchors and reporters in. 14 00:01:04,880 --> 00:01:10,080 Speaker 2: Everybody wanted to interview denistrator, including me, and it was 15 00:01:10,160 --> 00:01:13,400 Speaker 2: kind of a free for all, and it was just crazy. 16 00:01:14,160 --> 00:01:16,280 Speaker 2: And all of the stories that I liked to cover 17 00:01:16,400 --> 00:01:20,199 Speaker 2: on wonderful people doing wonderful things, that was all put 18 00:01:20,440 --> 00:01:24,559 Speaker 2: by the wayside, and now it was BTK all the time, 19 00:01:24,760 --> 00:01:29,920 Speaker 2: every day as he's incarcerated in the Sedgwick County Detention Center. 20 00:01:30,680 --> 00:01:34,560 Speaker 2: I like every other reporter wrote to him and said, 21 00:01:35,080 --> 00:01:36,080 Speaker 2: I want to interview you. 22 00:01:36,600 --> 00:01:38,720 Speaker 3: Please let me interview you. 23 00:01:39,760 --> 00:01:43,160 Speaker 2: Well, we all wanted an interview, but that wasn't going 24 00:01:43,200 --> 00:01:46,319 Speaker 2: to happen. But I did write to him and I 25 00:01:46,360 --> 00:01:49,200 Speaker 2: gave him my phone number and I said, if you 26 00:01:49,360 --> 00:01:52,720 Speaker 2: can call me, this is my home phone. Give me 27 00:01:52,760 --> 00:01:55,160 Speaker 2: a call. Now he's incarcerated, he's not going to come 28 00:01:55,200 --> 00:01:59,800 Speaker 2: after me. And one Saturday morning he called me and 29 00:02:00,120 --> 00:02:02,280 Speaker 2: the operator said, no, I have a collect call from 30 00:02:02,280 --> 00:02:03,800 Speaker 2: the Sedgwy County Detention Center. 31 00:02:03,840 --> 00:02:05,040 Speaker 3: Will you accept the charges? 32 00:02:05,920 --> 00:02:09,840 Speaker 2: And you go, wow, yes I will. And on the 33 00:02:09,880 --> 00:02:11,280 Speaker 2: other end, he said. 34 00:02:11,840 --> 00:02:15,960 Speaker 3: Larry, this is Dennis Rider. Okay, here we go. 35 00:02:16,919 --> 00:02:19,399 Speaker 2: I had my phone already set up to be able 36 00:02:19,400 --> 00:02:24,400 Speaker 2: to record audio, and the problem was the phone in 37 00:02:24,480 --> 00:02:29,120 Speaker 2: the jail is terrible. You talk about bad audio, this 38 00:02:29,200 --> 00:02:32,760 Speaker 2: was bad audio. Pops and buzzes and beeps, and I 39 00:02:32,800 --> 00:02:34,760 Speaker 2: have no clue how many people were listening on it. 40 00:02:35,960 --> 00:02:39,160 Speaker 2: I said, well, I appreciate you calling me. I have 41 00:02:39,560 --> 00:02:43,160 Speaker 2: thirty years of questions and he said I have twenty minutes. 42 00:02:43,680 --> 00:02:45,280 Speaker 3: I said, okay, So. 43 00:02:45,320 --> 00:02:48,639 Speaker 2: I started asking him questions. And one of the questions 44 00:02:48,680 --> 00:02:50,560 Speaker 2: that I asked him and I will never forget this. 45 00:02:50,680 --> 00:02:56,560 Speaker 2: I said, how could you kill two children? And he said, oh, well, 46 00:02:56,600 --> 00:02:58,359 Speaker 2: they were just collateral. 47 00:02:59,120 --> 00:03:03,520 Speaker 3: Just collise. I will never forget that. 48 00:03:04,560 --> 00:03:09,120 Speaker 2: And he spoke about it as you would speak to 49 00:03:09,240 --> 00:03:11,920 Speaker 2: the baker as you pick up a dozen donuts at 50 00:03:11,960 --> 00:03:16,720 Speaker 2: the bakery, without feeling, without excitement, that they were just collateral. 51 00:03:17,720 --> 00:03:22,359 Speaker 2: And that I found that stunning. And then a few 52 00:03:22,360 --> 00:03:25,720 Speaker 2: months later the trial began in the Central County District Court. 53 00:03:33,040 --> 00:03:36,040 Speaker 2: Someone killed four members of a family. 54 00:03:36,280 --> 00:03:39,160 Speaker 4: Had you vanished from her home suddenly last weekend? Her 55 00:03:39,160 --> 00:03:41,520 Speaker 4: phone lines had been cut, her door left open. 56 00:03:41,800 --> 00:03:45,080 Speaker 2: You see the victim playing there with plastic bags over 57 00:03:45,120 --> 00:03:49,280 Speaker 2: their heads, strangled. You could tell there was a planned scenario. 58 00:03:49,560 --> 00:03:51,960 Speaker 4: Well, police have said no more about the contents of 59 00:03:52,000 --> 00:03:54,800 Speaker 4: the letter. It does contain some sort of threat and 60 00:03:54,880 --> 00:03:57,080 Speaker 4: implies the killer may strike again. 61 00:03:57,400 --> 00:04:00,600 Speaker 2: He's going to play with these victims to the point 62 00:04:00,720 --> 00:04:04,320 Speaker 2: of death and then bring them back, and then brings 63 00:04:04,360 --> 00:04:05,640 Speaker 2: them back to the point of death. 64 00:04:07,320 --> 00:04:12,760 Speaker 5: From My Heart Podcasts and Tenderfoot TV. I'm Susan Peters 65 00:04:13,440 --> 00:04:23,520 Speaker 5: and this is Monster BTK. On February twenty eight, two 66 00:04:23,560 --> 00:04:27,160 Speaker 5: thousand and five, just three days after he was arrested, 67 00:04:27,800 --> 00:04:32,239 Speaker 5: Dennis Rader was charged with ten counts of first degree murder. 68 00:04:33,000 --> 00:04:36,599 Speaker 5: During his initial interrogation, Rader had revealed that he was 69 00:04:36,640 --> 00:04:40,200 Speaker 5: responsible for two murders the police hadn't known he was 70 00:04:40,240 --> 00:04:46,040 Speaker 5: connected to those of Marine Hedge and Dolores Davis. While 71 00:04:46,040 --> 00:04:51,200 Speaker 5: awaiting trial, Raider was held in the Sedgwick County Detention Center. Meanwhile, 72 00:04:51,560 --> 00:04:55,560 Speaker 5: prosecutors were starting to build their case. It was assigned 73 00:04:55,560 --> 00:04:59,520 Speaker 5: to Nola Fulston, the Sedgwick County District Attorney, and working 74 00:04:59,560 --> 00:05:02,839 Speaker 5: with her was Kevin O'Connor, who at the time was 75 00:05:02,880 --> 00:05:07,000 Speaker 5: the deputy district attorney. Their first goal was to keep 76 00:05:07,080 --> 00:05:09,720 Speaker 5: Raider in jail, so. 77 00:05:09,720 --> 00:05:12,120 Speaker 6: There was a process in deciding how to charge it. 78 00:05:12,680 --> 00:05:16,719 Speaker 6: You charged the ten murders. I remember Judge Waller asking 79 00:05:16,760 --> 00:05:19,360 Speaker 6: what kind of bond we wanted, and I think I 80 00:05:19,400 --> 00:05:21,520 Speaker 6: said something to the effect of a I mean, Judge, 81 00:05:21,560 --> 00:05:25,080 Speaker 6: I don't know ten kazillion million. I don't know if 82 00:05:25,120 --> 00:05:28,160 Speaker 6: there is a number that you could ask for on bond. 83 00:05:29,680 --> 00:05:34,320 Speaker 5: The next question was what sentence would the prosecutors seek. 84 00:05:35,880 --> 00:05:38,159 Speaker 6: There was a lot of discussion at the time, a 85 00:05:38,160 --> 00:05:40,560 Speaker 6: lot of thoughts about whether or not he should get 86 00:05:40,560 --> 00:05:44,440 Speaker 6: the death penalty. Kansas didn't have a death penalty during 87 00:05:44,480 --> 00:05:47,280 Speaker 6: the years that he was committing these crimes. Kansas has 88 00:05:47,320 --> 00:05:50,279 Speaker 6: one now but didn't then, and so you had a 89 00:05:50,279 --> 00:05:54,120 Speaker 6: lot of confusion about why the death penalty wasn't being sought. 90 00:05:55,960 --> 00:05:59,480 Speaker 5: The death penalty had been banned in Kansas up until 91 00:05:59,600 --> 00:06:04,120 Speaker 5: nineteen ninety four, when it was officially reinstated, but this 92 00:06:04,360 --> 00:06:07,520 Speaker 5: was long after Raider's last murder, which took place in 93 00:06:07,600 --> 00:06:12,839 Speaker 5: nineteen ninety one. Therefore, prosecutors had no choice but to 94 00:06:12,960 --> 00:06:15,800 Speaker 5: instead seek life without parole. 95 00:06:17,120 --> 00:06:20,839 Speaker 6: We couldn't seek the death penalty. It wasn't an available 96 00:06:21,040 --> 00:06:24,479 Speaker 6: punishment at the time he was committing these murders. The 97 00:06:24,520 --> 00:06:28,120 Speaker 6: sentence was life, but sentence in Kansas the life sentence 98 00:06:28,160 --> 00:06:31,640 Speaker 6: meant fifteen years, So for each. 99 00:06:31,480 --> 00:06:35,120 Speaker 5: Of Rader's ten murders, he would receive fifteen years in 100 00:06:35,200 --> 00:06:36,799 Speaker 5: prison if found guilty. 101 00:06:38,160 --> 00:06:42,120 Speaker 6: The last murder of Dolores Davis occurred in ninety one, 102 00:06:42,760 --> 00:06:46,400 Speaker 6: where there was a hard forty is what it was called, 103 00:06:46,480 --> 00:06:48,679 Speaker 6: and that would mean that you got a life sentence, 104 00:06:49,200 --> 00:06:52,080 Speaker 6: but you couldn't be paroled until you serve forty years, 105 00:06:52,800 --> 00:06:55,320 Speaker 6: and you had to have a sentencing hearing on that. 106 00:06:56,680 --> 00:07:00,479 Speaker 5: Remember, Raider was fifty nine years old. So this hard 107 00:07:00,560 --> 00:07:04,800 Speaker 5: forty rule effectively meant that if he was successfully convicted, 108 00:07:05,320 --> 00:07:07,720 Speaker 5: Raider would spend the rest of his life in prison 109 00:07:08,200 --> 00:07:13,360 Speaker 5: with no chance at parole. It seemed like Dennis Rader 110 00:07:13,400 --> 00:07:17,120 Speaker 5: had his work cut out for him, but apparently he 111 00:07:17,160 --> 00:07:20,320 Speaker 5: didn't want any part of it. He didn't find a 112 00:07:20,400 --> 00:07:23,960 Speaker 5: lawyer or speak much at all after his initial interrogation, 113 00:07:24,600 --> 00:07:28,880 Speaker 5: even though many attorneys had tried to represent him. 114 00:07:29,720 --> 00:07:32,960 Speaker 6: I remember getting a call from the jail saying that 115 00:07:33,000 --> 00:07:37,360 Speaker 6: a local attorney was trying to get access to Dennis Raider, 116 00:07:37,920 --> 00:07:41,440 Speaker 6: and I remember running from my office over to the 117 00:07:41,560 --> 00:07:45,240 Speaker 6: jail because that attorney wasn't entitled to have contact with him. 118 00:07:45,240 --> 00:07:48,480 Speaker 6: He hadn't requested an attorney at that time, but the 119 00:07:48,560 --> 00:07:50,960 Speaker 6: jail had let him have access, and after that he 120 00:07:51,000 --> 00:07:52,640 Speaker 6: decided he didn't want to talk anymore. 121 00:07:53,840 --> 00:07:56,520 Speaker 5: We don't know what happened that made Raider choose to 122 00:07:56,560 --> 00:08:01,280 Speaker 5: stay quiet after that interaction, but he wouldn't talk again 123 00:08:01,840 --> 00:08:06,720 Speaker 5: until months later. At one press conference, Nola Fulston and 124 00:08:06,800 --> 00:08:09,520 Speaker 5: Kevin O'Connor were asked if there would be any talks 125 00:08:09,520 --> 00:08:11,080 Speaker 5: of a plea deal with Raider. 126 00:08:12,320 --> 00:08:15,360 Speaker 6: I mean, in my opinion, you can't ple negotiated a 127 00:08:15,400 --> 00:08:17,440 Speaker 6: Dennis Raider BTK case. 128 00:08:18,760 --> 00:08:21,400 Speaker 5: In the conclusion to the State's summary of the evidence, 129 00:08:21,760 --> 00:08:25,120 Speaker 5: the destruct Attorney's Office echoed this sentiment. 130 00:08:26,520 --> 00:08:30,000 Speaker 1: Dennis Rader did not suffer from any mental disease or defect. 131 00:08:30,560 --> 00:08:33,400 Speaker 1: He was not the victim of any psychological, physical, or 132 00:08:33,480 --> 00:08:39,040 Speaker 1: sexual abuse. Rader murdered with premeditation and deliberation. He killed 133 00:08:39,040 --> 00:08:44,520 Speaker 1: methodically and systematically, uninhibited by any moral concerns or considerations. 134 00:08:45,200 --> 00:08:48,760 Speaker 1: Dennis Rader killed because he wanted to kill. The evil 135 00:08:48,800 --> 00:08:52,760 Speaker 1: depravity of his deeds are beyond human comprehension. The time 136 00:08:52,800 --> 00:08:56,040 Speaker 1: has come to hold Raider accountable, to punish him for 137 00:08:56,080 --> 00:09:00,520 Speaker 1: his atrocities. Rader deserves the harshest punishment allowed law. 138 00:09:03,760 --> 00:09:07,920 Speaker 5: Raider's first court appearance was March first, two thousand and five. 139 00:09:08,559 --> 00:09:12,200 Speaker 5: Just a few days after his arrest, Steve Osburne and 140 00:09:12,240 --> 00:09:17,040 Speaker 5: Sarah McKinnon were appointed as public defenders. They hired two 141 00:09:17,120 --> 00:09:22,000 Speaker 5: people from Cambridge for Insant Consultants to perform a psychological 142 00:09:22,000 --> 00:09:26,320 Speaker 5: assessment on Raider to determine his competency to stand trial. 143 00:09:27,400 --> 00:09:32,959 Speaker 5: Competency evaluations are not comprehensive mental health examinations. They focus 144 00:09:33,080 --> 00:09:37,559 Speaker 5: only on present mental ability to participate in the various 145 00:09:37,600 --> 00:09:41,920 Speaker 5: parts of the legal process. It was doctor Robert Mendoza 146 00:09:41,960 --> 00:09:46,360 Speaker 5: who performed the examination. Here's an excerpt from Confession of 147 00:09:46,360 --> 00:09:50,480 Speaker 5: a Serial Killer describing Mendoza's findings as read by a 148 00:09:50,559 --> 00:09:51,280 Speaker 5: voice actor. 149 00:09:52,559 --> 00:09:55,800 Speaker 7: Mendoza noted that there was no history of mental illness 150 00:09:55,920 --> 00:10:00,360 Speaker 7: or drug abuse and no medical conditions. I'm in the 151 00:10:00,400 --> 00:10:03,439 Speaker 7: journals and drawings that Rader had made and the crime 152 00:10:03,480 --> 00:10:08,040 Speaker 7: scene photos. He also watched the videotape of Raider's police 153 00:10:08,080 --> 00:10:14,719 Speaker 7: interrogation and examined medical school and prison records. During the evaluation, 154 00:10:14,960 --> 00:10:19,960 Speaker 7: Raider was depressed, even tearful. His level of attention had declined, 155 00:10:20,320 --> 00:10:23,920 Speaker 7: he had lost weight, and he was anxious. He said 156 00:10:24,000 --> 00:10:27,840 Speaker 7: he had considered suffocating himself in his cell, but despite 157 00:10:27,880 --> 00:10:30,440 Speaker 7: his circumstances, he wanted to live. 158 00:10:32,120 --> 00:10:38,400 Speaker 5: This report also identified narcissistic personality disorder and obsessive compulsive 159 00:10:38,440 --> 00:10:43,640 Speaker 5: personality disorder. Neither of these diagnoses rose to the level 160 00:10:43,800 --> 00:10:47,559 Speaker 5: of a major mental illness for Raider, and so they 161 00:10:47,600 --> 00:10:51,920 Speaker 5: did not affect his competency to stand trial, and thus 162 00:10:52,160 --> 00:10:56,079 Speaker 5: the prosecuting attorney sought to finalize a trial date. They 163 00:10:56,120 --> 00:10:59,120 Speaker 5: did not want Rader to get away with a plea deal. 164 00:11:00,679 --> 00:11:03,240 Speaker 6: We wanted to have that hearing. A lot of people 165 00:11:03,280 --> 00:11:06,920 Speaker 6: criticize the district attorney, thinking that she was a media hound. 166 00:11:07,320 --> 00:11:10,400 Speaker 6: You know, she just wanted the media attention. I can 167 00:11:10,440 --> 00:11:13,360 Speaker 6: tell you and being in those meetings with her, that 168 00:11:13,440 --> 00:11:16,480 Speaker 6: the goal was to make all the information a public record. 169 00:11:17,200 --> 00:11:19,680 Speaker 6: As you all may know that police reports are not 170 00:11:19,960 --> 00:11:24,280 Speaker 6: public information, but things that are presented in open court are. 171 00:11:25,200 --> 00:11:28,000 Speaker 6: So the ideal was is we're going to put it 172 00:11:28,080 --> 00:11:32,079 Speaker 6: all out in open court, so any member of the public, 173 00:11:32,559 --> 00:11:37,360 Speaker 6: any journalist, would have access to that information and be 174 00:11:37,440 --> 00:11:41,280 Speaker 6: able to describe who Dennis Rader really was. Just an evil, 175 00:11:41,400 --> 00:11:44,320 Speaker 6: sadistic murderer, that's all he was. 176 00:11:46,000 --> 00:11:51,240 Speaker 5: They got their wish. Raiders first public hearing was scheduled 177 00:11:51,520 --> 00:11:54,280 Speaker 5: for June twenty seventh, two thousand and five. 178 00:12:04,320 --> 00:12:05,440 Speaker 1: From Kate News. 179 00:12:05,600 --> 00:12:09,079 Speaker 8: This is a special report BTK Journey to. 180 00:12:09,280 --> 00:12:13,800 Speaker 5: Justice and Good Morning. Susan and Peters, along with Jeff Herndon, 181 00:12:13,960 --> 00:12:19,000 Speaker 5: welcome the live team coverage of the BTK case. Each 182 00:12:19,080 --> 00:12:22,920 Speaker 5: previous hearing built with mystery. This is no different. No 183 00:12:23,000 --> 00:12:25,880 Speaker 5: one really knows what is going to happen, except for 184 00:12:26,200 --> 00:12:31,880 Speaker 5: Dennis Raider himself. June twenty seventh, two thousand and five 185 00:12:32,440 --> 00:12:35,160 Speaker 5: was one of the wildest days of my life. I 186 00:12:35,280 --> 00:12:38,400 Speaker 5: led the coverage from the Cake studios that morning. As 187 00:12:38,480 --> 00:12:42,960 Speaker 5: my colleagues reported from outside the courthouse, the front steps 188 00:12:43,000 --> 00:12:48,640 Speaker 5: were flooded with national media cameras, tents, and microphones everywhere. 189 00:12:49,360 --> 00:12:52,079 Speaker 5: It was about eight thirty am when the families of 190 00:12:52,120 --> 00:12:54,160 Speaker 5: the victims started to appear. 191 00:12:55,280 --> 00:12:57,880 Speaker 1: We have some live pictures now from the courthouse. 192 00:12:58,320 --> 00:13:02,600 Speaker 5: These are family members at the courthouse, victims of family members. 193 00:13:03,080 --> 00:13:07,079 Speaker 5: It looks like Charles Bright is there. I see him. 194 00:13:07,400 --> 00:13:10,640 Speaker 5: The big question this morning was whether Dennis Rader would 195 00:13:10,760 --> 00:13:14,559 Speaker 5: change his plea. At a previous hearing, Raider refused to 196 00:13:14,600 --> 00:13:18,360 Speaker 5: speak at all or enter into any formal plea, so 197 00:13:18,480 --> 00:13:21,160 Speaker 5: by default, the judge entered him into a plea of 198 00:13:21,400 --> 00:13:25,760 Speaker 5: not guilty on his behalf. But things had changed since then, 199 00:13:26,240 --> 00:13:30,280 Speaker 5: and there were rumors that Raider planned to flip his plea. 200 00:13:31,559 --> 00:13:34,080 Speaker 9: There's really been a last minute decision that's being made, 201 00:13:34,120 --> 00:13:36,480 Speaker 9: that they kept all their cards together, and they're going 202 00:13:36,559 --> 00:13:39,839 Speaker 9: to evaluate things as late as this morning and figure 203 00:13:39,840 --> 00:13:42,360 Speaker 9: out what's going to happen. And I also get the 204 00:13:42,360 --> 00:13:44,720 Speaker 9: feeling that Dennis Raider is very much in charge of 205 00:13:44,720 --> 00:13:45,800 Speaker 9: that final decision. 206 00:13:47,440 --> 00:13:50,319 Speaker 5: I know for a fact that the families wanted Raider 207 00:13:50,480 --> 00:13:54,439 Speaker 5: to plead guilty. They wanted an end to this nightmare, 208 00:13:54,960 --> 00:13:58,000 Speaker 5: and a guilty plea would move things much faster than 209 00:13:58,040 --> 00:14:02,200 Speaker 5: a lengthy trial. Still, all of us were in suspense 210 00:14:02,720 --> 00:14:10,200 Speaker 5: as to what Raider's choice would eventually be. At about 211 00:14:10,240 --> 00:14:15,360 Speaker 5: eight forty am, the attorneys entered the courtroom. According to 212 00:14:15,440 --> 00:14:19,680 Speaker 5: many sources, raiders defense attorneys appeared nervous. 213 00:14:21,000 --> 00:14:24,200 Speaker 10: These attorneys have been working with the Raider since the 214 00:14:24,400 --> 00:14:27,400 Speaker 10: very since the first appearance when they were assigned. There 215 00:14:27,440 --> 00:14:30,880 Speaker 10: have been some rumors that there is some discord amongst 216 00:14:31,440 --> 00:14:34,000 Speaker 10: them with or between them and Raider. 217 00:14:35,400 --> 00:14:41,560 Speaker 5: Finally, after everyone else was settled, Dennis Raider entered the courtroom. 218 00:14:41,840 --> 00:14:44,600 Speaker 5: There's Dennis Raider walking into court. 219 00:14:44,800 --> 00:14:47,600 Speaker 11: He does have a bulletproof vest on, it appears. Let's 220 00:14:47,640 --> 00:14:48,680 Speaker 11: listen into the proceedings. 221 00:14:49,880 --> 00:14:52,080 Speaker 3: Thank you, please be seated all right? 222 00:14:52,120 --> 00:14:55,440 Speaker 12: At this time comes on before the court case captioned 223 00:14:55,440 --> 00:14:58,200 Speaker 12: of the State of Kansas Plaintiff versus Dennis L. 224 00:14:58,440 --> 00:14:59,520 Speaker 3: Raider, Defendive. 225 00:15:01,120 --> 00:15:05,360 Speaker 5: After going through the standard introductory remarks, Judge Gregory Waller 226 00:15:05,680 --> 00:15:10,840 Speaker 5: asked Rader the question everyone was waiting for how would 227 00:15:10,920 --> 00:15:11,880 Speaker 5: he plead. 228 00:15:13,080 --> 00:15:15,720 Speaker 13: Yarn At this time, mister Rader wave his right to 229 00:15:15,720 --> 00:15:19,120 Speaker 13: a jury trial and interplea of guilty to all ten counts. 230 00:15:19,920 --> 00:15:23,040 Speaker 12: Sir, I have been advised as your desire to enter 231 00:15:23,080 --> 00:15:24,920 Speaker 12: a plea of guilty in this case. 232 00:15:25,040 --> 00:15:26,280 Speaker 3: Is that correct, yes, sir. 233 00:15:27,680 --> 00:15:31,080 Speaker 5: At perhaps the last minute, Dennis Rader chose to plead 234 00:15:31,160 --> 00:15:36,160 Speaker 5: guilty to all ten counts of murder and thus avoid 235 00:15:36,160 --> 00:15:41,560 Speaker 5: a trial. Then Judge Waller prompted Rader to explain how 236 00:15:41,600 --> 00:15:46,880 Speaker 5: he murdered his victims. Surprisingly, Rader was more than happy 237 00:15:47,440 --> 00:15:49,720 Speaker 5: to oblige. 238 00:15:50,880 --> 00:15:54,600 Speaker 13: On January fifteenth, nineteen seventy four, I'm maliciously, intentionally and 239 00:15:54,720 --> 00:15:56,600 Speaker 13: premeditation killed Joseph of Terrell. 240 00:15:57,000 --> 00:16:00,160 Speaker 12: Had you planned this beforehand. 241 00:16:00,080 --> 00:16:00,760 Speaker 13: To some degree? 242 00:16:00,840 --> 00:16:01,080 Speaker 11: Yes? 243 00:16:01,680 --> 00:16:04,280 Speaker 13: If forgot in the house that I lost control of it, 244 00:16:04,320 --> 00:16:07,600 Speaker 13: But it was, you know, back of my mind. I 245 00:16:07,600 --> 00:16:08,680 Speaker 13: had some ideas what I was. 246 00:16:08,600 --> 00:16:09,120 Speaker 3: Going to do. 247 00:16:10,840 --> 00:16:16,040 Speaker 5: Raider spared none of the graphic details, shedding not an 248 00:16:16,160 --> 00:16:20,200 Speaker 5: ounce of remorse or betraying any emotion. 249 00:16:21,880 --> 00:16:24,160 Speaker 13: I put a plastic bag over his head, and then 250 00:16:24,200 --> 00:16:26,960 Speaker 13: some cords and fighting it after that. 251 00:16:27,840 --> 00:16:29,000 Speaker 3: I did miss this Otero. 252 00:16:30,000 --> 00:16:33,480 Speaker 13: I had never strangled anyone before, so I really don't 253 00:16:33,480 --> 00:16:34,840 Speaker 13: know how much pressure you had to put on a 254 00:16:34,880 --> 00:16:36,240 Speaker 13: person or how long it take. 255 00:16:37,840 --> 00:16:43,520 Speaker 5: This went on for forty five minutes straight, Raider going 256 00:16:43,560 --> 00:16:49,600 Speaker 5: through each murder, not only admitting to them, but excitedly 257 00:16:49,800 --> 00:16:56,080 Speaker 5: explaining his every move. My colleague Glarry Hedeberg was stunned. 258 00:16:57,640 --> 00:17:01,840 Speaker 2: The judge asked Dennis Rader to take him through all 259 00:17:01,920 --> 00:17:06,680 Speaker 2: the killings in the courtroom live on TV. That was 260 00:17:06,880 --> 00:17:10,320 Speaker 2: absolutely amazing. And here was Dennis Raider, and he was 261 00:17:10,520 --> 00:17:15,240 Speaker 2: like the ringmaster in the center ring, and the spotlight 262 00:17:15,400 --> 00:17:18,679 Speaker 2: was on him, and he was having the time of 263 00:17:18,720 --> 00:17:24,479 Speaker 2: his life recounting in detail how he killed ten people. 264 00:17:25,240 --> 00:17:31,560 Speaker 2: It was extraordinary, unbelievable, really, because he told it in 265 00:17:31,600 --> 00:17:34,040 Speaker 2: the same method that he had talked to me on 266 00:17:34,119 --> 00:17:41,160 Speaker 2: the phone, without feeling, without remorse, just very matter of fact. Well, 267 00:17:41,240 --> 00:17:43,480 Speaker 2: I tied her up this way, and then I strangled 268 00:17:43,480 --> 00:17:46,439 Speaker 2: her hair, thought about cutting her throat, and it's just 269 00:17:46,920 --> 00:17:49,560 Speaker 2: like somebody talking about picking up their laundry. 270 00:17:50,880 --> 00:17:54,320 Speaker 5: Many of the family members present simply couldn't stand to 271 00:17:54,400 --> 00:18:02,520 Speaker 5: listen to this, including Steve Ralford, surviving son a Shirley Vyanne. 272 00:18:01,440 --> 00:18:04,280 Speaker 3: Guy that walked out. Everybody fucking followed me. 273 00:18:04,119 --> 00:18:07,119 Speaker 8: I didn't want to hear what time to dad say? 274 00:18:08,000 --> 00:18:11,280 Speaker 5: All the other victims families walked out with you, but 275 00:18:11,359 --> 00:18:12,760 Speaker 5: you were the first one to get up. 276 00:18:13,119 --> 00:18:18,040 Speaker 8: Damn great, he said, can they do that? What the 277 00:18:18,080 --> 00:18:18,919 Speaker 8: fuck they want to do? 278 00:18:20,080 --> 00:18:22,040 Speaker 5: Why didn't you want to stay in court? 279 00:18:22,520 --> 00:18:23,320 Speaker 8: I'm here? 280 00:18:23,359 --> 00:18:24,600 Speaker 3: What he fucking had to say? 281 00:18:25,680 --> 00:18:26,520 Speaker 5: What did you want to do? 282 00:18:27,800 --> 00:18:32,920 Speaker 8: It's not loud on here, not allowed home? 283 00:18:33,760 --> 00:18:38,240 Speaker 5: So you you didn't want to give him the satisfaction 284 00:18:38,960 --> 00:18:41,600 Speaker 5: of Is that why you walked out and everyone else 285 00:18:41,680 --> 00:18:42,920 Speaker 5: walked out to do you think? 286 00:18:43,520 --> 00:18:44,080 Speaker 3: Pretty much? 287 00:18:44,400 --> 00:18:46,080 Speaker 5: What do you think he was doing that day? 288 00:18:47,119 --> 00:18:48,440 Speaker 8: Shelf pity? 289 00:18:48,800 --> 00:18:51,120 Speaker 5: I mean he went on and on about each murder. 290 00:18:51,240 --> 00:18:52,240 Speaker 14: What do you what do you. 291 00:18:52,359 --> 00:18:54,440 Speaker 5: Think he was doing that day? 292 00:18:55,600 --> 00:19:00,720 Speaker 8: Well, I forget what you call it, but glory, find 293 00:19:01,320 --> 00:19:04,240 Speaker 8: money done, and not any fucking remorse. 294 00:19:04,359 --> 00:19:09,800 Speaker 3: She had this for himself. I won't hear a shit. Oh, 295 00:19:09,840 --> 00:19:10,520 Speaker 3: I hear none of it. 296 00:19:13,200 --> 00:19:18,440 Speaker 5: When Rader was done, Judge Waller formally declared the conviction. 297 00:19:20,000 --> 00:19:22,679 Speaker 12: I will accept these pleas are guilty, and I judge 298 00:19:22,680 --> 00:19:26,600 Speaker 12: you Dennis L. Raider guilty of murder in the first 299 00:19:26,600 --> 00:19:31,600 Speaker 12: degree in count won a Class A felony. 300 00:19:31,640 --> 00:19:35,760 Speaker 5: It was a moment of mixed emotions. On one hand, 301 00:19:36,160 --> 00:19:39,800 Speaker 5: it was a triumphant relief Dennis Rader had been found 302 00:19:39,840 --> 00:19:44,359 Speaker 5: guilty on all charges. On the other hand, it was 303 00:19:44,400 --> 00:19:49,280 Speaker 5: a moment of quiet sadness. The way Rader described his 304 00:19:49,480 --> 00:19:56,360 Speaker 5: murders in grave detail left everyone shaken. People shuffled out 305 00:19:56,359 --> 00:20:01,320 Speaker 5: of the courtroom silently. It was a bittersweet, even though 306 00:20:01,520 --> 00:20:09,840 Speaker 5: justice had prevailed. Following his guilty plea and verdict, Rader 307 00:20:09,920 --> 00:20:12,719 Speaker 5: was sent back to the Sedgua County Detention Center to 308 00:20:12,800 --> 00:20:16,919 Speaker 5: await his sentencing. The date of the sentencing hearing was 309 00:20:16,960 --> 00:20:22,199 Speaker 5: set for August eighteenth. Meanwhile, Larry Hadiberg was determined to 310 00:20:22,280 --> 00:20:25,960 Speaker 5: interview him again. You heard about his phone interview with 311 00:20:26,040 --> 00:20:29,000 Speaker 5: Rader at the top of the episode, But this time 312 00:20:29,440 --> 00:20:32,520 Speaker 5: Larry wanted to see him in person. 313 00:20:33,680 --> 00:20:37,840 Speaker 2: And so I asked before he was sent to prison, 314 00:20:38,480 --> 00:20:40,920 Speaker 2: I said, I'd like to talk to you in person. 315 00:20:41,600 --> 00:20:46,399 Speaker 2: Is that possible? And I got permission to talk to 316 00:20:46,480 --> 00:20:49,359 Speaker 2: him in person. Didn't have much time, about fifteen minutes 317 00:20:49,359 --> 00:20:51,800 Speaker 2: with him, and I went up with one of the 318 00:20:51,800 --> 00:20:58,760 Speaker 2: other anchors from KTV. I was nervous about shaking his hand. 319 00:21:00,200 --> 00:21:01,800 Speaker 2: When you go up there and talk to him, you 320 00:21:01,920 --> 00:21:06,000 Speaker 2: have to do a prison handshake. He's on one side 321 00:21:06,000 --> 00:21:08,320 Speaker 2: of the plexiglass, I'm on the other. He puts his 322 00:21:08,440 --> 00:21:11,400 Speaker 2: hand up here like this. Then I put my hand 323 00:21:11,520 --> 00:21:14,679 Speaker 2: up here like this, and we basically that's a prison 324 00:21:14,760 --> 00:21:18,960 Speaker 2: hand shake. My son in law, guy who married my daughter, 325 00:21:19,119 --> 00:21:21,399 Speaker 2: is a federal agent here in Wichita, and I was 326 00:21:21,440 --> 00:21:22,960 Speaker 2: talking to him about this and I said, I don't 327 00:21:22,960 --> 00:21:25,320 Speaker 2: want to do it. I just simply don't want to 328 00:21:25,359 --> 00:21:27,600 Speaker 2: do it. And he looked at me and he said, well, 329 00:21:27,640 --> 00:21:30,720 Speaker 2: how bad do you want the information? If you don't 330 00:21:30,760 --> 00:21:33,879 Speaker 2: shake his hand, he's going to take that as an 331 00:21:33,960 --> 00:21:37,520 Speaker 2: insult and he's going to shut up and not say anything. 332 00:21:38,760 --> 00:21:42,960 Speaker 2: So I reluctantly did it, and I still regret it 333 00:21:43,000 --> 00:21:45,959 Speaker 2: to this day. But we had a conversation, you know, 334 00:21:46,880 --> 00:21:50,040 Speaker 2: and he told me he was looking forward to prison. 335 00:21:50,880 --> 00:21:53,439 Speaker 2: I said, why are you looking forward to prison? And 336 00:21:53,520 --> 00:21:55,720 Speaker 2: he said, I'm going to learn things. You know, how 337 00:21:55,760 --> 00:21:58,800 Speaker 2: to burn a building down, you know how to do this, 338 00:21:58,960 --> 00:22:01,760 Speaker 2: how to do how to commit a crime. He was 339 00:22:01,840 --> 00:22:06,080 Speaker 2: really looking forward to it. He was unbelievable in that 340 00:22:06,119 --> 00:22:10,560 Speaker 2: he had no soul. He just he didn't care about 341 00:22:10,600 --> 00:22:12,080 Speaker 2: other people, particularly women. 342 00:22:13,440 --> 00:22:16,240 Speaker 5: My impression was that after the June twenty seventh theory, 343 00:22:16,880 --> 00:22:20,520 Speaker 5: Raider was feeling pretty good about himself. The way he 344 00:22:20,680 --> 00:22:24,400 Speaker 5: talked about his murders in such a detailed and nonchalant 345 00:22:24,440 --> 00:22:27,199 Speaker 5: manner tells me that he was ready to tell his 346 00:22:27,280 --> 00:22:32,200 Speaker 5: story on his terms. Here he was on national TV 347 00:22:32,440 --> 00:22:35,560 Speaker 5: with the world watching, and he got to read what 348 00:22:35,720 --> 00:22:40,800 Speaker 5: was essentially his manifesto out loud for everyone to hear. 349 00:22:41,600 --> 00:22:45,159 Speaker 5: His attitude leaving the courtroom that day appeared to be 350 00:22:45,280 --> 00:22:50,879 Speaker 5: one of success. But what Raider wasn't prepared for is 351 00:22:50,920 --> 00:22:54,840 Speaker 5: that he would soon get his due. At the August 352 00:22:54,880 --> 00:22:59,160 Speaker 5: eighteenth sentencing hearing, the family members of his victims would 353 00:22:59,240 --> 00:23:04,840 Speaker 5: finally get the chance to speak up and address Raider directly. 354 00:23:13,560 --> 00:23:18,800 Speaker 5: On August eighteenth, Raiders' sentencing hearing began, The family members 355 00:23:18,840 --> 00:23:21,360 Speaker 5: of the victims would each have a chance to speak, 356 00:23:22,119 --> 00:23:26,120 Speaker 5: but first investigators were given the floor to tell their 357 00:23:26,240 --> 00:23:30,280 Speaker 5: side of the story and present all the evidence they 358 00:23:30,640 --> 00:23:33,400 Speaker 5: had uncovered the police. 359 00:23:33,560 --> 00:23:36,240 Speaker 4: They wanted everything my dad had done on record. They 360 00:23:36,240 --> 00:23:38,719 Speaker 4: wanted it in public record because most of the details 361 00:23:38,760 --> 00:23:41,520 Speaker 4: were not known at that point. Still, like all the 362 00:23:41,560 --> 00:23:46,480 Speaker 4: case materials, weapons, times, dates, a lot of that was 363 00:23:46,560 --> 00:23:47,200 Speaker 4: not public. 364 00:23:48,280 --> 00:23:51,160 Speaker 5: This is Dennis Raider's daughter, Carrie Rawson. 365 00:23:52,359 --> 00:23:55,000 Speaker 4: They wanted it all in the record, so they went 366 00:23:55,080 --> 00:23:57,320 Speaker 4: through all of that. They brought in like the knife, 367 00:23:57,320 --> 00:24:00,960 Speaker 4: he youths for Catherine, brought in all of this stuff 368 00:24:01,280 --> 00:24:03,520 Speaker 4: just to put it under the record. They brought in 369 00:24:03,560 --> 00:24:04,280 Speaker 4: the polaroids. 370 00:24:05,600 --> 00:24:09,920 Speaker 5: If you remember, Denis Rator at some point took polaroid 371 00:24:10,000 --> 00:24:14,520 Speaker 5: pictures of himself where he would dress up in women's 372 00:24:14,520 --> 00:24:19,920 Speaker 5: clothing and reenact his murders. The police had confiscated all 373 00:24:19,960 --> 00:24:23,480 Speaker 5: of these when they searched the Raider household. 374 00:24:24,400 --> 00:24:26,520 Speaker 4: Now were they trying to humiliate my dad on the stand. 375 00:24:26,520 --> 00:24:26,919 Speaker 2: I don't know. 376 00:24:27,720 --> 00:24:32,280 Speaker 4: My dad was not expecting that. He was pretty lividly pissed. 377 00:24:32,680 --> 00:24:33,359 Speaker 3: How do you react? 378 00:24:33,920 --> 00:24:34,439 Speaker 13: Just angry. 379 00:24:34,520 --> 00:24:36,679 Speaker 4: You can see him trying to be under control in 380 00:24:36,720 --> 00:24:41,639 Speaker 4: the videos of him just trying to maintain composure of 381 00:24:41,720 --> 00:24:44,000 Speaker 4: these guys mocking him in court. 382 00:24:44,400 --> 00:24:45,640 Speaker 1: But he's exposed. 383 00:24:45,680 --> 00:24:47,639 Speaker 4: Now, he's exposed and known for what he is. 384 00:24:49,240 --> 00:24:53,120 Speaker 5: Carrie says that her father was visibly shaken by this 385 00:24:53,320 --> 00:24:56,200 Speaker 5: barrage of evidence from the prosecutors. 386 00:24:57,359 --> 00:25:00,719 Speaker 4: He was not expecting that, and he's completely thrown and 387 00:25:00,760 --> 00:25:03,920 Speaker 4: you see him trying to maintain control, and he's trying 388 00:25:03,960 --> 00:25:07,120 Speaker 4: to hold those outer protective layers, and he's just sort 389 00:25:07,119 --> 00:25:10,159 Speaker 4: of disintegrating. Mike Us would be inside. You see his 390 00:25:10,320 --> 00:25:14,280 Speaker 4: voice change, he clicks his mouth like he's acting like 391 00:25:14,320 --> 00:25:18,159 Speaker 4: he's like bored. He's just trying to keep control, and 392 00:25:18,240 --> 00:25:21,679 Speaker 4: you can see it. He's almost tearing up. He's so upset, 393 00:25:21,720 --> 00:25:24,160 Speaker 4: he's almost tearing up. And then he's also like really mad. 394 00:25:25,560 --> 00:25:28,920 Speaker 5: Of course, this was also the Raider family's first time 395 00:25:29,280 --> 00:25:31,960 Speaker 5: hearing about Dennis's evil deeds. 396 00:25:33,240 --> 00:25:37,160 Speaker 4: My family did not know about the bondage. We didn't 397 00:25:37,200 --> 00:25:39,800 Speaker 4: know about my dad and the women's lingerie. We didn't 398 00:25:39,880 --> 00:25:43,080 Speaker 4: know my dad dressed up and victim's clothing and took 399 00:25:43,080 --> 00:25:47,760 Speaker 4: polaroids in his parents' basement. Basically, he was recreating Josephino 400 00:25:47,840 --> 00:25:51,920 Speaker 4: Tero's murderer. I didn't know any of that. So I'm 401 00:25:52,000 --> 00:25:54,639 Speaker 4: finding this out with the rest of the world, and 402 00:25:54,720 --> 00:25:57,040 Speaker 4: I was mad. I was mad at the police for 403 00:25:57,119 --> 00:25:59,480 Speaker 4: not trusting us enough to tell us, or for Paris. 404 00:26:00,400 --> 00:26:02,720 Speaker 4: I think they were trying to protect us, but obviously 405 00:26:03,320 --> 00:26:04,879 Speaker 4: now it's just all at once. 406 00:26:09,200 --> 00:26:13,000 Speaker 5: Finally, the family members of the victims had a chance 407 00:26:13,080 --> 00:26:17,719 Speaker 5: to speak, and Dennis Rader had no choice but to listen. 408 00:26:19,240 --> 00:26:22,000 Speaker 15: Now it was my turn. He has his spot life 409 00:26:22,040 --> 00:26:24,800 Speaker 15: for a long time. Now it's going to be my turn. 410 00:26:25,560 --> 00:26:28,360 Speaker 15: I was gonna call him everything that I could possibly 411 00:26:28,400 --> 00:26:31,320 Speaker 15: get away with, calling him on network GAV. 412 00:26:32,800 --> 00:26:37,720 Speaker 5: This is Jeff Davis, son of Dolores Davis. He gave 413 00:26:37,760 --> 00:26:42,600 Speaker 5: one of the longest and most comprehensive victim impact statements. 414 00:26:43,320 --> 00:26:44,840 Speaker 15: I did a pretty good job of it. I was 415 00:26:44,840 --> 00:26:47,879 Speaker 15: pretty creative the stuff that I came up with. And 416 00:26:47,920 --> 00:26:51,159 Speaker 15: I did it because I knew he was watching, and 417 00:26:51,400 --> 00:26:56,560 Speaker 15: every interview was focused directly at him. When I looked 418 00:26:56,600 --> 00:26:59,440 Speaker 15: at the person I was interviewing, I wasn't looking at him. 419 00:26:59,520 --> 00:27:03,119 Speaker 15: I was looking him. I wanted him to know that 420 00:27:03,160 --> 00:27:07,040 Speaker 15: it was my turn. And now it's even time, and 421 00:27:07,080 --> 00:27:10,280 Speaker 15: now I'm the one point in barged in your direction 422 00:27:10,960 --> 00:27:12,960 Speaker 15: and tell me how much do you like it? A 423 00:27:13,040 --> 00:27:17,359 Speaker 15: smart boy, and I knew getting under his skin, and 424 00:27:17,480 --> 00:27:19,320 Speaker 15: I love every minute of it. 425 00:27:20,760 --> 00:27:23,320 Speaker 16: For the last five three and twenty six days, I 426 00:27:23,359 --> 00:27:25,199 Speaker 16: have wondered what it would be like to confront the 427 00:27:25,240 --> 00:27:30,360 Speaker 16: walking cesspool that took my mother's precious life. Throughout that time, 428 00:27:30,440 --> 00:27:32,840 Speaker 16: I always envisioned this day as being one for avenging 429 00:27:32,920 --> 00:27:35,600 Speaker 16: the past. I could think of nothing but savoring the 430 00:27:35,600 --> 00:27:38,320 Speaker 16: bittersweet taste of revenge as justice is served upon this 431 00:27:38,440 --> 00:27:42,080 Speaker 16: social sewage here before us today. Now that has arised, 432 00:27:42,280 --> 00:27:46,080 Speaker 16: surprise arrived. Surprisingly, I realized that this day is not 433 00:27:46,280 --> 00:27:50,840 Speaker 16: just about avenging crafts past crimes. Sitting here before us 434 00:27:51,400 --> 00:27:55,159 Speaker 16: is a depraved predator, a rabbit animal that has murdered people, 435 00:27:55,240 --> 00:27:58,560 Speaker 16: poisoned countless lives, and terrorized this community for thirty years, 436 00:27:58,920 --> 00:28:02,399 Speaker 16: all the while relish every minute of it. As such, 437 00:28:02,440 --> 00:28:04,920 Speaker 16: there can be no justice harsh enough for revenge bitter 438 00:28:05,040 --> 00:28:07,440 Speaker 16: enough in this world, at least to cause the pain 439 00:28:07,480 --> 00:28:10,359 Speaker 16: and suffering which a social malignancy like this has coming. 440 00:28:13,040 --> 00:28:15,600 Speaker 15: He wouldn't look at me. It was a four minute, 441 00:28:15,680 --> 00:28:18,719 Speaker 15: thirty stecond in tirade. He would not look at me 442 00:28:18,800 --> 00:28:21,879 Speaker 15: one time. He didn't have the guts to look at me. 443 00:28:25,200 --> 00:28:28,000 Speaker 17: All I could think about was revenge, revenge, get my 444 00:28:28,000 --> 00:28:29,840 Speaker 17: hands on him. 445 00:28:29,920 --> 00:28:33,800 Speaker 5: This is Charlie o'teroll, eldest brother of the surviving o'taro 446 00:28:33,920 --> 00:28:37,879 Speaker 5: family members. He says that this hearing was the first 447 00:28:37,880 --> 00:28:42,600 Speaker 5: time he heard certain details about the murder of his parents. 448 00:28:43,640 --> 00:28:46,720 Speaker 17: I had no inside information or anything about how my 449 00:28:46,760 --> 00:28:47,400 Speaker 17: family had died. 450 00:28:47,840 --> 00:28:50,040 Speaker 3: I didn't know any of that stuff that he said. 451 00:28:50,800 --> 00:28:52,880 Speaker 17: When he said that my mom's last words and may 452 00:28:52,920 --> 00:28:55,479 Speaker 17: God forgive you, I knew that that's something my mom 453 00:28:55,560 --> 00:28:59,680 Speaker 17: would probably have said because that's how she was. And 454 00:28:59,800 --> 00:29:02,360 Speaker 17: it just broke my heart again, that feeling I had 455 00:29:02,360 --> 00:29:05,600 Speaker 17: on my chest being tore open in my heart, it 456 00:29:05,640 --> 00:29:08,440 Speaker 17: just came all came back to me. I knew that 457 00:29:08,480 --> 00:29:10,040 Speaker 17: if I acted up, then I would never get a 458 00:29:10,120 --> 00:29:14,080 Speaker 17: chance at him. So I had to maintain to wait 459 00:29:14,120 --> 00:29:17,600 Speaker 17: for my chance. That and the world's sitting there and 460 00:29:17,640 --> 00:29:19,640 Speaker 17: my brother and my sister, and once again the big 461 00:29:19,680 --> 00:29:22,440 Speaker 17: brother Manto thing comes in. I gotta be strong in 462 00:29:22,440 --> 00:29:23,440 Speaker 17: front of them. 463 00:29:24,360 --> 00:29:29,760 Speaker 5: Then, like Jeff Charlie gave his own victim impact statement. 464 00:29:30,520 --> 00:29:31,959 Speaker 17: That's what I had to be good for. I had 465 00:29:31,960 --> 00:29:33,920 Speaker 17: to get my impact statement, and I couldn't screw. I 466 00:29:33,960 --> 00:29:36,920 Speaker 17: wanted to make that statement. But I also planned, this 467 00:29:36,960 --> 00:29:38,880 Speaker 17: is gonna be my chance to get my hands on him, 468 00:29:39,480 --> 00:29:42,000 Speaker 17: so I was prepared to go all. 469 00:29:41,840 --> 00:29:43,760 Speaker 3: The way with my revenge plans. 470 00:29:44,840 --> 00:29:48,880 Speaker 17: What happened was we left for lunch break and I 471 00:29:48,920 --> 00:29:52,040 Speaker 17: had a couple of beers right away. I'm getting my 472 00:29:52,240 --> 00:29:56,200 Speaker 17: strength up, my courage up, and then I planned to 473 00:29:56,240 --> 00:29:58,520 Speaker 17: get my hands on him. And as we were walking 474 00:29:59,000 --> 00:30:05,200 Speaker 17: to the detector, I got stopped by my filmmaker. We 475 00:30:05,240 --> 00:30:08,640 Speaker 17: made a documentary and the filmmaker was there filming and 476 00:30:08,680 --> 00:30:11,000 Speaker 17: he said, Charlie, you have a phone call. It was 477 00:30:11,080 --> 00:30:13,880 Speaker 17: the mother of my son, who I had never seen before. 478 00:30:14,600 --> 00:30:18,400 Speaker 17: He was named Joseph, his same name as my brother 479 00:30:18,560 --> 00:30:23,120 Speaker 17: and my dad. It was Annette. Lynnette says, Charlie, there's 480 00:30:23,120 --> 00:30:24,920 Speaker 17: been an accident. Joe has been hit by a car. 481 00:30:25,040 --> 00:30:29,680 Speaker 17: He's and the phone went dead and I'm like, he's what, 482 00:30:29,800 --> 00:30:31,760 Speaker 17: He's what, He's dead, He's alive, He's okay. 483 00:30:33,280 --> 00:30:34,280 Speaker 3: I called Lynette again. 484 00:30:34,320 --> 00:30:37,680 Speaker 17: I call her back and she said, Charlie, Joseph's been 485 00:30:37,720 --> 00:30:38,240 Speaker 17: hit by a car. 486 00:30:38,320 --> 00:30:39,160 Speaker 3: He's in a coma. 487 00:30:40,080 --> 00:30:41,880 Speaker 17: And I'm like, what is it? 488 00:30:41,960 --> 00:30:45,360 Speaker 3: An induced coma? Is it? They said, no, it's he's in. 489 00:30:45,320 --> 00:30:48,960 Speaker 17: A coma and he's got brain injuries that he's got 490 00:30:49,000 --> 00:30:53,040 Speaker 17: shaken baby syndrome from being hit by the car. I 491 00:30:53,040 --> 00:30:56,120 Speaker 17: start thinking about this. I'm thinking, how can I ask 492 00:30:56,360 --> 00:30:57,600 Speaker 17: God to save my son? 493 00:30:58,360 --> 00:30:59,600 Speaker 3: If I am going. 494 00:30:59,480 --> 00:31:03,560 Speaker 17: To go do au dacardly deed, why would he save 495 00:31:03,600 --> 00:31:08,120 Speaker 17: my son? So it's hard to describe it. Put in 496 00:31:08,200 --> 00:31:11,880 Speaker 17: that instant, I got my religion back. I got my 497 00:31:11,920 --> 00:31:18,240 Speaker 17: faith back because all desire for that revenge went away instantly, 498 00:31:18,680 --> 00:31:21,880 Speaker 17: truly went away, and all I could think about was 499 00:31:21,920 --> 00:31:25,120 Speaker 17: saving my son. I said, God, save my son. I'll 500 00:31:25,160 --> 00:31:27,600 Speaker 17: give you my life, I'll do anything you want. You 501 00:31:27,640 --> 00:31:31,959 Speaker 17: can take me right now, just save my son. So 502 00:31:32,400 --> 00:31:36,719 Speaker 17: when we went back in there, the opportunity came. They 503 00:31:36,760 --> 00:31:39,560 Speaker 17: took him out one door, and the family's out another door, 504 00:31:39,800 --> 00:31:41,960 Speaker 17: and they screwed up, and there was nobody between me 505 00:31:42,000 --> 00:31:42,680 Speaker 17: and him. 506 00:31:42,960 --> 00:31:44,320 Speaker 3: There might have been people next to him. 507 00:31:44,200 --> 00:31:46,480 Speaker 17: And stuff, but he was I looked right at him, 508 00:31:46,640 --> 00:31:51,080 Speaker 17: with nobody between me and him, all desire that I 509 00:31:51,200 --> 00:31:53,800 Speaker 17: had to get my hands on him was gone because 510 00:31:53,800 --> 00:31:55,840 Speaker 17: I knew the prison would take care of it, because 511 00:31:55,840 --> 00:31:56,400 Speaker 17: that's what they did. 512 00:31:56,400 --> 00:31:59,680 Speaker 3: To child molesterers and child killers and stuff. I walked 513 00:31:59,680 --> 00:32:00,360 Speaker 3: out the door. 514 00:32:01,080 --> 00:32:04,560 Speaker 17: I went outside, and some people started sticking microphones in 515 00:32:04,600 --> 00:32:06,920 Speaker 17: my face, and somebody said, Charlie, you know the world's 516 00:32:06,920 --> 00:32:09,680 Speaker 17: praying for you, And I said, no, no, no, don't 517 00:32:09,680 --> 00:32:12,640 Speaker 17: pray for me. Pray for my son. He's been hit 518 00:32:12,680 --> 00:32:15,120 Speaker 17: by a car and he needs prayer right now. He's 519 00:32:15,120 --> 00:32:19,640 Speaker 17: in a coma and behold months later weeks. Weeks and 520 00:32:19,680 --> 00:32:23,440 Speaker 17: weeks later, he wakes up a newborn child. I believe 521 00:32:23,480 --> 00:32:24,120 Speaker 17: the Lord gave me. 522 00:32:24,080 --> 00:32:24,680 Speaker 3: Back my son. 523 00:32:28,640 --> 00:32:32,480 Speaker 5: Steve Ralford was also given the chance to give a statement. 524 00:32:33,520 --> 00:32:36,320 Speaker 8: And when I got up to speak, I stuck close 525 00:32:37,160 --> 00:32:40,880 Speaker 8: about powered every where everybody. I couldn't talk. I lost 526 00:32:40,880 --> 00:32:45,760 Speaker 8: seeming anger at that point. I'm bringing you fuck what 527 00:32:45,920 --> 00:32:50,360 Speaker 8: anybody talk. I knew what I thought, I knew, I 528 00:32:50,360 --> 00:32:51,040 Speaker 8: couldn't knew it. 529 00:32:53,280 --> 00:32:56,760 Speaker 5: Steve was simply too upset to say much of anything. 530 00:32:57,520 --> 00:33:00,480 Speaker 5: For him, the difficulty of that day was it's nearly 531 00:33:00,600 --> 00:33:05,480 Speaker 5: impossible to bear. But he wasn't alone. He was comforted 532 00:33:05,480 --> 00:33:08,760 Speaker 5: by the fact that others like Jeff Davis and Charlie 533 00:33:08,800 --> 00:33:11,240 Speaker 5: o'taro shared in his anger. 534 00:33:12,680 --> 00:33:18,520 Speaker 15: My emotion was pure, unadulterated rage. Now as I knew 535 00:33:18,560 --> 00:33:22,080 Speaker 15: they would. They had six of the biggest sheriff's officers 536 00:33:22,120 --> 00:33:23,000 Speaker 15: I've ever seen. 537 00:33:22,800 --> 00:33:23,720 Speaker 3: In my life. 538 00:33:24,240 --> 00:33:27,760 Speaker 15: They had three on each side of him, shouldered and shoulder. 539 00:33:28,360 --> 00:33:31,600 Speaker 15: Because it wasn't just me who wanted him. Charlie o'tarroll 540 00:33:31,720 --> 00:33:35,800 Speaker 15: wanted him, Steve Ralphord wanted him. There was a bunch 541 00:33:35,840 --> 00:33:38,880 Speaker 15: of us that wanted peace to him, and we knew 542 00:33:38,920 --> 00:33:43,280 Speaker 15: we couldn't do it, obviously, but I know I was 543 00:33:43,320 --> 00:33:46,680 Speaker 15: still filled with rage that I was sitting there and 544 00:33:46,760 --> 00:33:50,720 Speaker 15: knew how when you stare at somebody just right, they 545 00:33:50,760 --> 00:33:55,240 Speaker 15: can feel you staring at him. He knew, he knew 546 00:33:56,080 --> 00:33:57,960 Speaker 15: that I was burning a hole in the back of 547 00:33:58,000 --> 00:33:59,400 Speaker 15: his head, that he. 548 00:33:59,480 --> 00:34:01,360 Speaker 3: Wasn't trying to look at me because you don't have 549 00:34:01,440 --> 00:34:01,840 Speaker 3: the gut. 550 00:34:02,920 --> 00:34:05,640 Speaker 15: One of the stairs officers came over to me and 551 00:34:05,720 --> 00:34:08,600 Speaker 15: he told me, he said, you need to sit back 552 00:34:08,600 --> 00:34:11,320 Speaker 15: and relaxed, and he said, you look like you're getting 553 00:34:11,320 --> 00:34:13,520 Speaker 15: ready to jump over that rail and go after him. 554 00:34:14,000 --> 00:34:16,120 Speaker 15: He said, if the judge tosses you out of here, 555 00:34:16,160 --> 00:34:21,200 Speaker 15: you won't get back in. So I was physically almost 556 00:34:21,480 --> 00:34:24,920 Speaker 15: like I was raised the spring. I knew I couldn't 557 00:34:24,960 --> 00:34:27,520 Speaker 15: do it, but I was just that chanced that I 558 00:34:27,760 --> 00:34:31,840 Speaker 15: used to just grabbing on said the rails, and I 559 00:34:31,880 --> 00:34:35,080 Speaker 15: was probably white and knuckle by magine. So I had 560 00:34:35,120 --> 00:34:38,200 Speaker 15: to call myself down, stick back down before I got 561 00:34:38,200 --> 00:34:39,720 Speaker 15: myself in trouble. 562 00:34:42,600 --> 00:34:46,920 Speaker 5: This shared hatred of Denis Rator had the effect of 563 00:34:47,080 --> 00:34:51,680 Speaker 5: bonding these men. That day, they sat together in unison 564 00:34:52,239 --> 00:34:56,680 Speaker 5: as they delivered their barbs to a cold faced denistrator. 565 00:34:57,480 --> 00:35:01,640 Speaker 5: He said nothing and never looked in the eyes, but 566 00:35:01,760 --> 00:35:06,480 Speaker 5: they knew that their words had cut him. After they 567 00:35:06,520 --> 00:35:10,799 Speaker 5: were finished, Raider was given thirty minutes to respond. Here 568 00:35:10,840 --> 00:35:14,000 Speaker 5: is an excerpt of what he said, as read by 569 00:35:14,000 --> 00:35:14,840 Speaker 5: a voice actor. 570 00:35:16,440 --> 00:35:19,480 Speaker 11: The dark side was there, but now I think the 571 00:35:19,600 --> 00:35:23,400 Speaker 11: light is beginning to shine. And I appreciate the family 572 00:35:23,400 --> 00:35:26,120 Speaker 11: and friends and who I can be thankful for, and 573 00:35:26,200 --> 00:35:28,799 Speaker 11: I think that will keep me from finally going to 574 00:35:28,840 --> 00:35:35,920 Speaker 11: the dark side or hell. And finally, a final apologize 575 00:35:36,320 --> 00:35:39,920 Speaker 11: to the victims' families. There's no way that I can 576 00:35:39,960 --> 00:35:40,680 Speaker 11: ever repay you. 577 00:35:42,440 --> 00:35:45,720 Speaker 5: Raider actually appeared to tear up during his final speech. 578 00:35:46,560 --> 00:35:51,160 Speaker 5: The victim's families were convinced that Raider's tears were for himself. 579 00:35:51,920 --> 00:35:55,160 Speaker 5: Jeff Davis and the other families had no desire to 580 00:35:55,200 --> 00:35:59,280 Speaker 5: listen to his self pity, so they decided once again 581 00:35:59,760 --> 00:36:00,720 Speaker 5: to walk out. 582 00:36:02,400 --> 00:36:05,960 Speaker 15: And I was the instigator. I'm the one that is idea. 583 00:36:06,000 --> 00:36:09,200 Speaker 15: It was that when he's stood up to talk, I'm 584 00:36:09,239 --> 00:36:11,880 Speaker 15: the one that said, let's get out here, let's walk out. 585 00:36:12,600 --> 00:36:15,560 Speaker 15: And minute he got up before he could open his mouth, 586 00:36:16,360 --> 00:36:20,000 Speaker 15: about eight of us got up and just walked out 587 00:36:20,000 --> 00:36:22,759 Speaker 15: of the courtroom, and everybody said to look on his 588 00:36:22,880 --> 00:36:27,440 Speaker 15: face was priceless because he's like, wait, I haven't had 589 00:36:27,520 --> 00:36:30,319 Speaker 15: my stay yet, and you're leaving because I told all 590 00:36:30,320 --> 00:36:33,560 Speaker 15: those people I said he to stay. I want to 591 00:36:33,600 --> 00:36:37,680 Speaker 15: hear everything out of his nostril lie. So we just 592 00:36:37,719 --> 00:36:39,480 Speaker 15: got and walked out. It was great. It was the 593 00:36:39,520 --> 00:36:40,760 Speaker 15: destulity in the world. 594 00:36:42,160 --> 00:36:45,800 Speaker 5: Sedgwick County District Attorney Nola Fulston had this to say 595 00:36:46,000 --> 00:36:47,320 Speaker 5: about Raider's words. 596 00:36:48,640 --> 00:36:51,319 Speaker 14: It's pitiful for mister Rader to stand here, looking all 597 00:36:51,360 --> 00:36:54,399 Speaker 14: pale and pasty and say how sorry he is. Well, 598 00:36:54,480 --> 00:36:57,480 Speaker 14: that's usually the culmination of what happens when defendants go 599 00:36:57,520 --> 00:36:59,640 Speaker 14: to their last chance in order to convince a judge 600 00:36:59,800 --> 00:37:03,200 Speaker 14: you know, gosh, I'm really sorry. Well, what else do 601 00:37:03,239 --> 00:37:06,080 Speaker 14: you say after you kill ten people? He doesn't have 602 00:37:06,120 --> 00:37:07,440 Speaker 14: the ability to be arrogant. 603 00:37:07,520 --> 00:37:14,200 Speaker 5: Today, after nearly three days of testimony, it was finally 604 00:37:14,320 --> 00:37:18,400 Speaker 5: time the judge called the court to order. He picked 605 00:37:18,440 --> 00:37:23,399 Speaker 5: up a piece of paper and slowly confidently, he read 606 00:37:23,440 --> 00:37:27,680 Speaker 5: out loud Denis Rader's sentenced to the courtroom and to 607 00:37:27,800 --> 00:37:37,600 Speaker 5: the world. Next time on Monster BTK. 608 00:37:38,600 --> 00:37:41,000 Speaker 4: I wanted to help him, like I'm mad at you 609 00:37:41,160 --> 00:37:44,080 Speaker 4: when one second, I'm worried you're cold, and like I 610 00:37:44,160 --> 00:37:45,640 Speaker 4: love you, I still love you. 611 00:37:45,960 --> 00:37:47,120 Speaker 2: We write some letters. 612 00:37:47,560 --> 00:37:50,600 Speaker 14: He wanted me to solve some codes. 613 00:37:51,120 --> 00:37:54,600 Speaker 2: The reason I stay kind of involved in it is 614 00:37:54,640 --> 00:37:58,680 Speaker 2: that we still do not know what caused BTK to 615 00:37:58,760 --> 00:38:00,239 Speaker 2: become a murderer. 616 00:38:00,480 --> 00:38:02,960 Speaker 11: I really wanted to go sleep Ennis in person, to 617 00:38:03,080 --> 00:38:04,680 Speaker 11: see who he is. 618 00:38:05,160 --> 00:38:08,960 Speaker 17: The intensity of the anguish and the grief is still there. 619 00:38:09,600 --> 00:38:13,239 Speaker 18: Raider said, you know, I have a fantasy that I 620 00:38:13,560 --> 00:38:16,759 Speaker 18: wish I could have lived out. I've always wanted to 621 00:38:16,920 --> 00:38:20,160 Speaker 18: kidnap a female from a launder map. 622 00:38:28,600 --> 00:38:33,640 Speaker 1: Monster BTK is a production of Tenderfoot TV and iHeart Podcasts. 623 00:38:34,320 --> 00:38:37,880 Speaker 1: The show is written by Nomes Griffin, Trevor Young, and 624 00:38:38,000 --> 00:38:43,520 Speaker 1: Jesse Funk. Our host is Susan Peters. Executive producers on 625 00:38:43,600 --> 00:38:47,720 Speaker 1: Behalf of Tenderfoot TV include Donald Albright and Payne Lindsay, 626 00:38:48,160 --> 00:38:53,319 Speaker 1: alongside supervising producer Tracy Kaplan. Executive producers on behalf of 627 00:38:53,360 --> 00:38:59,240 Speaker 1: iHeart Podcasts include Matt Frederick and Trevor Young, alongside producers Nomes, 628 00:38:59,280 --> 00:39:05,720 Speaker 1: Griffin and Funk and supervising producer Rima Ilkali. Marketing support 629 00:39:05,880 --> 00:39:10,000 Speaker 1: by David Wasserman and Alison Wright. At iHeart Podcasts and 630 00:39:10,200 --> 00:39:16,320 Speaker 1: Caroline Rigemma at tenderfoot TV. Additional research by Claudia Dafrico, 631 00:39:16,800 --> 00:39:21,600 Speaker 1: original artwork by Kevin Mister Soul Harp, original music by 632 00:39:21,600 --> 00:39:25,640 Speaker 1: Makeup and Vanity Set. Special thanks to Orrin Rosenbaum and 633 00:39:25,719 --> 00:39:29,239 Speaker 1: the team at UTA and the Nord Group. For more 634 00:39:29,280 --> 00:39:34,120 Speaker 1: podcasts from iHeartRadio and Tenderfoot TV, visit the iHeartRadio app, 635 00:39:34,360 --> 00:39:38,000 Speaker 1: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. 636 00:39:38,800 --> 00:39:39,720 Speaker 1: Thanks for listening.