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Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Molly John Fast and this is Fast Politics,

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Speaker 1: where we discussed the top political headlines with some of

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Speaker 1: today's best minds. And you're going to be shocked to

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Speaker 1: hear this Home Depot says it's raising prices. You know

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Speaker 1: why because of the tariffs. We have a great show

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Speaker 1: for you today, talking Points memos, own Josh Marshall stops

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Speaker 1: by to talk about Trump's unpopular agenda. Then we'll talk

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Speaker 1: to the Cato Institute's Scott Linscombe about tariffs and how

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Speaker 1: they are completely undermining our entire economy. But first we

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Speaker 1: have the most important stories that aren't getting the attention

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Speaker 1: they deserve. Mai, we're giddy with how terrible everything is.

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Speaker 2: Let's go that's kind of accurate. Actually today this is

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Speaker 2: really something. So I think of how much trauma of

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Speaker 2: my childhood was, how much I was policed and home

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Speaker 2: monitored as a kid because I was a bad kid.

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Speaker 2: But now, this is how the Republicans in Texas are

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Speaker 2: behaving towards democh product representatives. Is they want them to

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Speaker 2: get basically like whole passes to move around, and they

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Speaker 2: want them to have police escorts so they can't leave

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Speaker 2: the state. Because they really want to do this, stupid

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Speaker 2: Jerrymander that's going to really fuck them over.

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Speaker 1: Yes, Okay, So here's the thing. Republicans in Texas are

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Speaker 1: stealing five seats in Congress. And they're doing this because

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Speaker 1: Donald Trump asked them to and because Governor Abbot thinks

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Speaker 1: that he can run for president. I mean, that's really

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Speaker 1: what this is. Okay. Governor Abbot is a Republican. He

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Speaker 1: knows the only way to inherit Maga is with the

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Speaker 1: blessing of Donald Trump. He thinks that somehow he will

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Speaker 1: become the inheritor of Maga, and so he is giving

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Speaker 1: Donald Trump five seats in Congress. Now, let me explain

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Speaker 1: to you why this is insane. Okay, mid decade redistricting

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Speaker 1: is almost unprecedented. Right, we have a census. The census

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Speaker 1: tells you what the numbers are, gives you the number

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Speaker 1: of congressional seats. There's redistricting around this. What happened here

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Speaker 1: was literally Donald Trump was like, I cannot lose the

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Speaker 1: House because then there'll be some accountability. I cannot have

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Speaker 1: any accountability because I'm having too good a time right now, airgo,

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Speaker 1: you have to make sure I keep the House. Democrats

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Speaker 1: did the only thing that they could possibly do because

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Speaker 1: they do not control state legislature, and they left right

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Speaker 1: that Texas has a thing where you can deny a

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Speaker 1: quorum if you leave this date. Now the special session

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Speaker 1: is over, it's August nineteenth. They came back. They're going

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Speaker 1: to fight it in another way. Do I think it's

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Speaker 1: the right move. No. I think they should have just

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Speaker 1: stayed out of the state until November. I think that

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Speaker 1: would have prevented this, and it would have made time

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Speaker 1: for Republicans to realize that a lot of them are

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Speaker 1: going to get jerry mandered out of their seats if

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Speaker 1: this if we open the door to this, but I

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Speaker 1: think it's too late. So now Republicans are going to

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Speaker 1: go along with stealing these five seats. One Democrat, Representative

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Speaker 1: Collier of District ninety five and Fort Worth, has refused

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Speaker 1: to sign these permission slips, and so she is going

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Speaker 1: to sit in the chamber. I understand that all of

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Speaker 1: this seems stupid to Trumpers, to people who are cynical,

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Speaker 1: but the reality is the only way we're going to

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Speaker 1: say survive this period is if people do brave shit

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Speaker 1: like this. Okay, if they say no, I'm not going

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Speaker 1: to do that if they say no. And so as

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Speaker 1: much as you may not like Representative Collier, this is

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Speaker 1: extremely important to do things like this. You know, this

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Speaker 1: is like a terrible moment in American life where things

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Speaker 1: are really fucking scary and she just says, I'll just

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Speaker 1: sit here. I don't know. I guess I'll wait till Wednesday.

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Speaker 1: So good for her, and we should support people who

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Speaker 1: are being brave, because most people are being fucking cowards.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. When I think of though, there's this weird gray

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Speaker 2: area where you're like, what the fuck is going on

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Speaker 2: with something? So a few weeks ago, Dan Bongino, no

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Speaker 2: friend of ours, kind of let it rip that like

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Speaker 2: he was pretty disturbed by what he saw on the

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Speaker 2: Epstein files, and it seems he might be on the

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Speaker 2: way out at the FBI.

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Speaker 1: Wait you think Bongino is not going to last at

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Speaker 1: the FBI.

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Speaker 2: I have to tell you one of the things, like

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Speaker 2: when we're always deciphering between the bullshit artists and the

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Speaker 2: true believers, there is this like weird thing that he

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Speaker 2: has like a little bit of both in him, Like

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Speaker 2: you know, he'll grift you for protein shake, but he'll

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Speaker 2: also really seems seems like his anger towards things fuels him.

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Speaker 2: And I will tell you I bought that he was

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Speaker 2: a little shook by the Epstein files. It seems a

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Speaker 2: lot of the reporting has set up.

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Speaker 1: Or he just makes a lot more money doing the podcast.

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Speaker 2: Well, I mean that can be.

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Speaker 1: I mean, I would love to ascribe meaning to Dan

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Speaker 1: Bongino's temper tantrums, but I just what there is math.

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Speaker 1: There is a thing called math. He has more power

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Speaker 1: and makes more money doing the podcast than sitting in

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Speaker 1: an office. So but either way, who are we to

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Speaker 1: cast aspersions at Dan Bongino? He may very I'll be

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Speaker 1: on his way out. We are thrilled to welcome Andrew

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Speaker 1: Bailey as co Deputy Director of the FBI. Bondie told

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Speaker 1: state run media Fox News Digital he has served as

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Speaker 1: Distinguished date Attorney General and also another Trump Lackie. Congratulations

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Speaker 1: to all who celebrate, it's going.

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Speaker 3: To be great.

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Speaker 2: Speaking of unsympathetic characters, at least the phonic just the

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Speaker 2: goal to show her space in public. She's thinking about

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Speaker 2: trying her Hannah as running for governor, which is really

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Speaker 2: going to go great considering at this appearance, I've heard

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Speaker 2: a lot of booze before, sometimes even when I've been

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Speaker 2: on stage, but nothing like.

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Speaker 1: This Marry Christmas.

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Speaker 2: In fact, I think I was once booed for, say

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Speaker 2: a joke about who she's going to run against for governor.

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Speaker 1: At least Dephonic. I think I was there for that,

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Speaker 1: Yes you were. It was drowned out by relentless booze

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Speaker 1: when she's spoken a Memorial Day event on Monday. Now

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Speaker 1: she's not in New York, she's not in Brooklyn, she's

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Speaker 1: in Plattsburgh. When she gets booed. All right, I want

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Speaker 1: to say two things about this. One least Devonic thinks

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Speaker 1: she's going to be governor next year of New York State.

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Speaker 1: But Lee Stevonic may also get Jerry Mander out of

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Speaker 1: her seat because since Texas stole five congressional seats, there's

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Speaker 1: a very likely scenario where New York I mean, Cuomo

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Speaker 1: did set it up so they couldn't have partisan redistricting

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Speaker 1: and put a GOP judge on that panel. But there

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Speaker 1: is a world where if Hochel is worth anything, which

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Speaker 1: I'm not convince she is, but if she is, she

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Speaker 1: will redistrict those five seats, and my man Aleis Stevonic

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Speaker 1: will neither be governor nor a member of Congress. I

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Speaker 1: for one, would love to see it the same.

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Speaker 2: So this is really exactly that. You know, often we're

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Speaker 2: saying we.

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Speaker 1: Particularly other shouted trader and go home, and some attendees

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Speaker 1: yelled a Nazi. You don't want to be called the

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Speaker 1: nazi anyway. Continue.

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Speaker 2: Yes, So a lot of the time we're discussing things

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Speaker 2: for twenty twenty five that came true. But this is

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Speaker 2: the type of thing that wasn't quite in there to

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Speaker 2: my memory at least. But I was like, this is

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Speaker 2: definitely gonna happen. Citizenship reviews now ask immigrants to show

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Speaker 2: positive contributions to the.

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Speaker 1: US, positive contributions right. Like, By the way, I'm so

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Speaker 1: angry about this because I've just you know, I have

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Speaker 1: so many friends who live in DC who have been

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Speaker 1: telling me about these horror stories about what has happened

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Speaker 1: under federalized DC, which is basically, there are a lot

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Speaker 1: of fat guys wearing vests that say police, and they

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Speaker 1: are chasing around anyone who's brown and who looks like

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Speaker 1: they're Hispanic, and they are chasing them down the streets

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Speaker 1: and beating them up and sending them in unmarked cars

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Speaker 1: to go to detention facilities to maybe get deported to

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Speaker 1: their own country and maybe get deported to Sudan where

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Speaker 1: they will die. This is so the idea that a

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Speaker 1: good moral character, like good moral character starts at home. Man,

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Speaker 1: we are not showing good and moral character. We are

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Speaker 1: in a country now where there is a militarized group

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Speaker 1: that has billions of dollars, that has no accountability, that

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Speaker 1: does not show its badge, that will not tell you

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Speaker 1: their name, that are plucking people off the street because

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Speaker 1: of the way they look. Like a year ago, this

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Speaker 1: would have been unprecedented. So if you're listening to this

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Speaker 1: like this is not okay, like none of this is okay,

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Speaker 1: we are in unprecedented moment in American life. And by

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Speaker 1: the way, good moral character begins at home. Josh Marshall

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Speaker 1: is the editor of Talking Points Memo. Josh Marshall, thank

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Speaker 1: you for coming on too fast politics.

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Speaker 3: I always love it here.

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Speaker 1: I was really mean, but it's because it's my birthday,

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Speaker 1: and also because Ice has arrested my friend's brother and

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Speaker 1: he is now waiting. He just disappeared and now they're

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Speaker 1: trying to figure out if he's going to be deported

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Speaker 1: to his native country or is he going to be

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Speaker 1: deported to Sudan?

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Speaker 3: Wow, that's heavy, so.

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Speaker 1: He can die there? That is people in DC, because

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Speaker 1: DC has become federalized. And that means now that all

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Speaker 1: of the really scary people who Donald Trump has made

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Speaker 1: his militia are targeting anyone who looks like they are

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Speaker 1: not white.

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Speaker 4: You know, the thing with the Sudan thing. I've watched

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Speaker 4: that closely. But my impression at least is that, you know,

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Speaker 4: they're deporting tons and tons of people, and my impression

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Speaker 4: at least is that it's a pretty small subset that

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Speaker 4: is being deported to Sudan. But I haven't had a

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Speaker 4: sense of, you know, what the basis of that subset is, right, Like,

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Speaker 4: is it who do they pick? I assume it's something

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Speaker 4: to do with obviously they're from countries where there may

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Speaker 4: be some legal impediment or something like that.

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Speaker 3: But I don't have a But that sounds horrific.

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Speaker 4: I mean, it sounds horrific to be deported to any

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Speaker 4: country that you've never been to before.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, But I also think and I want to talk

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Speaker 1: about this for a minute because I think it's so important.

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Speaker 1: Like we've seen these photos of these ice skies chasing

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Speaker 1: you know, the uber drivers, you know, the food delivery guys,

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Speaker 1: the deporting, the lady who worked at the nail salon.

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Speaker 1: You know, people been here twenty thirty, forty years. People

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Speaker 1: have been here as long as we have. Right, what's

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Speaker 1: the goal here? Because Americans have had the opportunities to

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Speaker 1: do these jobs and they have not wanted to.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, and it's not like when certainly when I was

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Speaker 4: much younger, and probably when you were two. You know,

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Speaker 4: there have been times where you know, and certainly during

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Speaker 4: you know, briefly during the Great Recession, where you have

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Speaker 4: unemployment approaches double digits. Right, we've basically been in a

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Speaker 4: full employment economy as economists define it for a number

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Speaker 4: of years, you know, under five percent. So kind of

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Speaker 4: by definition, there's nobody else who wants to do this

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Speaker 4: job because everybody's got a job. Now, we know, obviously

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Speaker 4: some people don't have a job, but when you talk

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Speaker 4: about this gets into the technical economics of it, there

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Speaker 4: are not other people who want this job who are

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Speaker 4: not doing it.

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Speaker 3: And when you talk about the goal, I think people.

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Speaker 4: For understandable reasons, don't like analogies or kind of blanched

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Speaker 4: analogies go back to the Third Reich and the imposition

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Speaker 4: of Hitler's dictatorship. One of the things that happened during it,

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Speaker 4: A political scientist have a name for this, I can't

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Speaker 4: remember it exactly, is that it was fairly disorganized in

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Speaker 4: a lot of ways, and Hitler had a system where

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Speaker 4: he kind of relied on people to you know, be

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Speaker 4: self starters and kind of do stuff on their own,

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Speaker 4: people in the state in governmental positions to sort of

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Speaker 4: compete with each other to achieve his aims. And there

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Speaker 4: is at least something like that going on with Trump

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Speaker 4: in the sense that when you say, you know, what

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Speaker 4: is the point here, well, well, clearly one of the

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Speaker 4: points here is that Stephen Miller like literally went over

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Speaker 4: to Ice, went over to DHS and said, I want

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Speaker 4: three thousand people a day taken into custody and put

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Speaker 4: into the system for deportation. Now, there's clearly a lot

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Speaker 4: of people in Ice who want to be nasty people,

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Speaker 4: and there's a lot of polalization of Ice, but that

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Speaker 4: clearly created a situation where you've got to go where

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Speaker 4: the numbers are, and the numbers are people who are

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Speaker 4: living law abiding lives and just kind of where you

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Speaker 4: think they are, because they're basically long standing residents in

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Speaker 4: the United States, and they show up for their immigration hearings,

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Speaker 4: and they show up for their job. And that's why

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Speaker 4: you have this thing of just you know, kind of

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Speaker 4: regular people kind of doing their jobs and I shows

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Speaker 4: up and grabs them. And you know, the woman who

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Speaker 4: worked at your nail slan, she's not there with like

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Speaker 4: an ak right now. She's going to fight them off

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Speaker 4: right when they come. These are by definition, fairly pliant people.

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Speaker 4: So that's part of it. But you know, you have

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Speaker 4: this mix of people who want to deport a lot

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Speaker 4: of people for sort of ideological and racial reasons. Also

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Speaker 4: have a lot of people who want to punish people.

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Speaker 4: They want to see those pictures of terrified families and everything.

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Speaker 4: So you have all these kind of things going together.

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Speaker 4: But you know, one of the things about the Trump

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Speaker 4: system is that you usually have that kind of you know,

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Speaker 4: chaos and disorganization, and some of that is that these

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Speaker 4: aren't terribly competent or often very smart people.

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Speaker 1: Are you saying they're not sending their.

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Speaker 4: Best, They are not sending their well, they are sending

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Speaker 4: their best, they don't their best are not that good.

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Speaker 3: I think, yes, it's the way to put it.

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Speaker 4: But another dimension of sort of trump Ism is they

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Speaker 4: don't like bureaucracy. They don't like people like, oh, you've

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Speaker 4: been here for thirty years, you know how to make

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Speaker 4: this system run. Get the fuck out of here. But

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Speaker 4: what that means is you have this system where it's

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Speaker 4: all kind of at the whim of the top guy.

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Speaker 4: So all these things kind of flow together and create

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Speaker 4: this system with a lot of sort of predatory behavior

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Speaker 4: and malicious behavior and not only hurting people because you

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Speaker 4: kind of can't not hurt people if you're trying to

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Speaker 4: arrest three thousand people a day. But because hurting people,

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Speaker 4: as our Fred Sewer says it, you know, is the point.

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Speaker 4: Cruelty is the point.

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Speaker 1: Let's talk about Donald Trump's triumphant meeting with all of

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Speaker 1: the heads of Europe. You know, you're in great shape

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Speaker 1: when all of the heads of Europe, every single one

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Speaker 1: comes to Washington. They don't have anything else to do

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Speaker 1: to try to get Trump not to be putin's stoode.

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Speaker 3: Yeah. Well it's sort of like you know, you know,

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Speaker 3: you know the shape you're in by who shows up

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Speaker 3: at your intervention.

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Speaker 4: Yes, yeah, right, you know you know, you caught your

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Speaker 4: first year college roommate is there and you're like, wow,

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Speaker 4: thread here real.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, no, I mean, you know, it's so funny because

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Speaker 1: it's like, I'm old enough to remember when Georgia Maloney

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Speaker 1: was the biggest outlier. Right, She's part of this neo

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Speaker 1: fascist Yeah, so one of the bad guys, right, one

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Speaker 1: of the bad guys coming to Washington to beg Donald

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Speaker 1: Trump not to get rolled by Vladimir Putin.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, you're too You're too far gone here, dude, it's

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Speaker 4: too much. It's more than I can accept.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I like the White House. There's a podcast I listen

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Speaker 1: to that is very access see and the woman on

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Speaker 1: it was like, wow, the White House didn't have huge

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Speaker 1: plans for the Alaska summit. Oh okay, they didn't. They

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Speaker 1: just oh okay, they just went to Alaska because they

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Speaker 1: just want to hang out with Putin.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, the whole thing is pretty you know. On the

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Speaker 4: other hand, there was this weird thing of like, you know,

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Speaker 4: they did it in Alaska where you can basically be

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Speaker 4: sure that if you're not on the plane on the

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Speaker 4: you know, the traveling White House press love Alaska.

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Speaker 3: But it's not a big media State, right.

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Speaker 4: I mean, it's certainly not on the Air Force base

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Speaker 4: where we have our sort of strategic bombers or whatever.

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Speaker 3: And they did it on what in the you know,

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Speaker 3: on the east.

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Speaker 4: Coast in the US is going to be you know,

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Speaker 4: kind of late Friday after the hottest August day of

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Speaker 4: the year kind of thing. So there's all kinds of

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Speaker 4: kind of weird like it that is kind of how

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Speaker 4: you'd kill a story. So I don't know quite what

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Speaker 4: that was about. But you know, Donald Trump doesn't do things.

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Speaker 4: He doesn't do things like lo fi, Like you're not

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Speaker 4: going to hear like thirty years from like oh yeah,

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Speaker 4: he used to go over to soup kitchen and like

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Speaker 4: serve stuff.

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Speaker 3: But no, he didn't tell me.

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Speaker 1: You'd never get it.

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Speaker 4: He did that every Thursday evening, but he never you know,

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Speaker 4: step out.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, you're never going to find out he was

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Speaker 1: serving homeless people in soup kitchen. But I want you

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Speaker 1: to talk about this for a second, because I'm very

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Speaker 1: suspicious about this Alaska summit.

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Speaker 3: I think as you should be.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, and I think that this was completely about

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Speaker 1: trying to kill the Epstein story and not about anything else, right,

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Speaker 1: Like this whole idea is like, and I'm going to

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Speaker 1: win a Nobel Peace Prize, and so I'm going to

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Speaker 1: have all of these countries, these leaders from countries that

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Speaker 1: are warring, and they're going to come in. And the

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Speaker 1: timing of this is just when the Magabas is fighting

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Speaker 1: about Ebstein. But that's probably just a coincidence. I mean,

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Speaker 1: if you think about Trump, right, he's sitting there and

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Speaker 1: he's going like it's August, which is the deadest time.

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Speaker 1: So the House is out, the Senate is out, I

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Speaker 1: can't try to do anything insane legislative way. I can

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Speaker 1: send the National Guard into Washington, DC, which is painful

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Speaker 1: and horrible and fun, but then there's nothing else to distract.

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Speaker 1: So you could see where this would just work.

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Speaker 3: It's definitely possible.

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Speaker 4: I mean, I I have lost it's so easy to

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Speaker 4: lose track of the forward pace of time and when

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Speaker 4: happened or when another thing happened.

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Speaker 3: But it was certainly my impression. It wasn't like we

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Speaker 3: knew in June.

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Speaker 4: Oh yeah, there's the there's the August summit, right, they

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Speaker 4: just announced that on a pretty short notice. The thing

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Speaker 4: is with him is, as we know, these publicity events,

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Speaker 4: it's always hard to know, like why did he do this,

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Speaker 4: you know, kind of publicity event.

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Speaker 3: It's sort of like, why is a crack addict smoking

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Speaker 3: crack this time?

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Speaker 1: Because they're yeah, yeah, yeah, that.

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Speaker 4: Is really the primary reason. And he's addicted to publicity.

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Speaker 4: He's addicted to chaotic and kinetic moments where he is

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Speaker 4: the center of attention and his actions have everybody is

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Speaker 4: reacting to his actions. So some of it is just that.

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Speaker 4: But yeah, I mean they're trying to and to a

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Speaker 4: certain extent, it seems like they've maybe kind of achieved

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Speaker 4: it with at least moment, at least for now at

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Speaker 4: the epscene stuff. It's not you know, there's not she

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Speaker 4: hasn't been moved from one prison to another recently, or.

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Speaker 1: I mean she's she already got to the better prison.

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Speaker 4: But yes, yeah, well she I mean I assume there's

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Speaker 4: you could be transferred to like Tahiti, you know, I mean,

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Speaker 4: you can the sky's the limit.

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Speaker 3: But yeah, it's hard to tell.

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Speaker 4: But again, it's sort of like, why is this crack

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Speaker 4: addict smoking crack because he's addicted to crack?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that's right. I just think like all

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Speaker 1: of this timing is kind of suspicious. So Trump said

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Speaker 1: that there's some security guarantees. I mean, this is all

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Speaker 1: ridiculous because we know what Putin's going to do. Putin's

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Speaker 1: going to run right through this. And I mean, has

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Speaker 1: he even stopped bombing Ukraine? He's still bombing Ukraine.

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Speaker 4: No, I don't, there's no there's no stop in. I mean,

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Speaker 4: everything has continued, and this is I think, what is

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Speaker 4: I mean the irony of I was I think I

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Speaker 4: posted maybe on Blue Sky about you know, the sort

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Speaker 4: of the latest addition of how much gold shlock he

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Speaker 4: has in the in the in the you know, in

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Speaker 4: the Oval office. But it was actually a picture of

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Speaker 4: his meeting with Zelenski, and I was looking at it

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Speaker 4: and thinking, like, I hate to say it, but like

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Speaker 4: this went better than the last meeting with Zelenski at least,

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Speaker 4: I mean, you know, they're kind of buds now sort

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Speaker 4: of maybe, you know, or at least at least to the

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Speaker 4: extent he's not humiliating him. And the reason that that

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Speaker 4: happened is that Trump clearly did get irritated that when

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Speaker 4: Trump made clear that at least stopping the fighting, if

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Speaker 4: not bringing a treaty or a truce or something was

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Speaker 4: his goal. He felt he needed that, he wanted it

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Speaker 4: that Pudin responded by upping the ante. It's not like

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Speaker 4: he'd been holding back but doing more. You know, the

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Speaker 4: real action is over there in the east where you're

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Speaker 4: trying to take territory. But they also do things with

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Speaker 4: They just throw a lot of missiles at Kiev or

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Speaker 4: something like that, and so he's upping the anti kind

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Speaker 4: of humiliating Trump, and that whole thing.

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Speaker 3: Just remains, you know.

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Speaker 4: I was thinking last night that I think Iowa was

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Speaker 4: one of the first people back in twenty sixteen to

401
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Speaker 4: write an article basically saying there's something weird going on

402
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Speaker 4: with this guy and Russia. I think it was in

403
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Speaker 4: July twenty sixteen, and I didn't really have a sense

404
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Speaker 4: of I didn't say and because I didn't know what

405
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Speaker 4: it was. Most of the big stuff we didn't know then.

406
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Speaker 4: But they're just all these connections. They're just weird, weird, weird, weird.

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Speaker 4: You don't have like, oh, how many you know, how

408
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Speaker 4: many connections did Eisenhower have da Khrushchev or you know,

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Speaker 4: it was. It was so strange, and we've learned a

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Speaker 4: lot since then. It's still what the hold he has

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Speaker 4: over Trump is still laffling, not clear to me and

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Speaker 4: baffling at many levels. But I don't know if you

413
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Speaker 4: or maybe your listeners saw there was a hot mic

414
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Speaker 4: moment where Trump said in in the meetings yesterday, I

415
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Speaker 4: think it was Emmanuel Macron, but it's one of the

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Speaker 4: European leaders. You're like, hey, I think he really wants

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Speaker 4: to make a deal with me. It like sounds crazy,

418
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Speaker 4: but I really feel it. And it was just like, dude,

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Speaker 4: what is your problem? I mean, like, it's like the

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Speaker 4: guy who buys a lap dance and things like the

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Speaker 4: stripper's in love with them.

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Speaker 3: It's like, what's going on with it?

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Speaker 4: For all the things we know and all of the

424
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Speaker 4: corrupt things, I think one day we will find out

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Speaker 4: we're going on there is a supplicant, submissive thing he

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Speaker 4: has with this guy that all the other stuff may

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Speaker 4: be true.

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Speaker 3: It still would completely explain that.

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Speaker 1: It does not make a ton of sense.

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Speaker 3: Right, It really doesn't.

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Speaker 4: There are a lot of things that sort of give

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Speaker 4: you an idea why it might be kind of like that,

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Speaker 4: but none of them quite get you to the just

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Speaker 4: you know, sometimes someone's got a hold on someone that

435
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Speaker 4: goes beyond any literal thing.

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Speaker 3: It's just the other person kind.

437
00:21:57,800 --> 00:22:00,600
Speaker 4: Of goes weak in the knees and you know, they

438
00:22:00,760 --> 00:22:02,720
Speaker 4: roll over on their back and need to be belly

439
00:22:02,800 --> 00:22:03,560
Speaker 4: rubbed or something.

440
00:22:03,840 --> 00:22:07,000
Speaker 1: Yes, with a fascist dictator, that's totally normal.

441
00:22:07,160 --> 00:22:07,480
Speaker 2: Yeah.

442
00:22:07,640 --> 00:22:09,800
Speaker 1: The thing I was so struck by was like, as

443
00:22:09,880 --> 00:22:13,880
Speaker 1: the child of an alcoholic, that you sometimes do all

444
00:22:13,960 --> 00:22:17,840
Speaker 1: this stuff to try to keep your alcoholic from like

445
00:22:18,040 --> 00:22:21,879
Speaker 1: completely killing themselves and the rest of you. And this

446
00:22:22,160 --> 00:22:25,359
Speaker 1: feels very much like that. You know, obviously it's not

447
00:22:25,400 --> 00:22:27,919
Speaker 1: an alcoholic because he doesn't drink, but like, we have

448
00:22:28,160 --> 00:22:32,320
Speaker 1: all of Europe coming to America, coming to Washington, DC

449
00:22:32,960 --> 00:22:36,320
Speaker 1: to make sure that Trump doesn't do something which puts

450
00:22:36,320 --> 00:22:40,920
Speaker 1: the entire continent in jeopardy. This is our president. Yeah,

451
00:22:41,000 --> 00:22:45,480
Speaker 1: I mean, like these people can protect their constituents from him,

452
00:22:45,800 --> 00:22:47,320
Speaker 1: but who protects us?

453
00:22:47,640 --> 00:22:48,080
Speaker 3: No one?

454
00:22:48,600 --> 00:22:51,399
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, no, that is true. It's funny. I was

455
00:22:51,400 --> 00:22:53,440
Speaker 4: just writing a post about a kind of a related

456
00:22:53,480 --> 00:22:57,080
Speaker 4: issue that moves us in a slightly different direction, but

457
00:22:57,240 --> 00:23:03,119
Speaker 4: the basically the importance of the state governments. Yeah, because Trump,

458
00:23:03,480 --> 00:23:06,680
Speaker 4: because he has the executive branch and Congress, and because

459
00:23:06,720 --> 00:23:10,320
Speaker 4: the courts, the Supreme Court has chosen to interpret the

460
00:23:10,359 --> 00:23:12,439
Speaker 4: law and the Constitution in such a way that Trump is,

461
00:23:12,480 --> 00:23:15,560
Speaker 4: within the federal government basically an absolute monarch.

462
00:23:15,720 --> 00:23:17,920
Speaker 3: You can do anything if anybody.

463
00:23:18,080 --> 00:23:20,399
Speaker 4: You know, he's like Anthony in that, you know, sending

464
00:23:20,400 --> 00:23:23,600
Speaker 4: people to the cornfield right in the federal government. But

465
00:23:23,680 --> 00:23:26,640
Speaker 4: we have this quirk of the American political system, which

466
00:23:26,680 --> 00:23:29,600
Speaker 4: is the states which have their separate sovereignty that are

467
00:23:30,560 --> 00:23:33,280
Speaker 4: subordinate to the federal government but separate from it. And

468
00:23:33,359 --> 00:23:35,879
Speaker 4: for us who live in blue states, that is a

469
00:23:36,480 --> 00:23:40,000
Speaker 4: powerful bundle of sovereign power that I think we are

470
00:23:40,040 --> 00:23:44,400
Speaker 4: really we need the state leaders to understand that we're

471
00:23:44,400 --> 00:23:44,639
Speaker 4: going to.

472
00:23:44,640 --> 00:23:48,240
Speaker 1: Be fucked if the state leaders don't stand up for us.

473
00:23:48,320 --> 00:23:54,320
Speaker 1: I mean we are, We're already so fucked. But like Kathy, yeah, yes,

474
00:23:54,520 --> 00:23:57,440
Speaker 1: Kathy Hokle, if you're listening, like this is it man,

475
00:23:57,720 --> 00:24:01,000
Speaker 1: I mean, you know, Gavin Newsome, that's it, because he

476
00:24:01,280 --> 00:24:05,320
Speaker 1: is so ambitious that he will, you know, run over

477
00:24:05,400 --> 00:24:08,280
Speaker 1: his granny for a chance to run for president. And

478
00:24:08,440 --> 00:24:12,760
Speaker 1: thank god, lucky for the people of California, because what's

479
00:24:12,760 --> 00:24:15,199
Speaker 1: happening in DC wouldn't be able to you know, they

480
00:24:15,240 --> 00:24:17,960
Speaker 1: wouldn't be able to do it in quite the same way.

481
00:24:18,119 --> 00:24:20,520
Speaker 1: But I do think it is important to remember too,

482
00:24:20,560 --> 00:24:23,800
Speaker 1: what's happening in DC is happening in DC for a reason,

483
00:24:23,960 --> 00:24:28,640
Speaker 1: right A, because cinema and mansion suck, and so they

484
00:24:28,720 --> 00:24:32,560
Speaker 1: refuse to make the mistake, and so the federal government

485
00:24:32,600 --> 00:24:34,240
Speaker 1: has a lot of power there. But the other reason

486
00:24:34,359 --> 00:24:36,399
Speaker 1: is because a lot of journalists and a lot of

487
00:24:36,480 --> 00:24:40,439
Speaker 1: legislators and a lot of people who could be brave

488
00:24:41,119 --> 00:24:45,240
Speaker 1: live in that city. Sorry, that's cool, Josh Marshall, thank you,

489
00:24:45,320 --> 00:24:47,320
Speaker 1: thank you, thanks for joining.

490
00:24:47,240 --> 00:24:50,240
Speaker 3: Thanks for having me as usual. I love coming on.

491
00:24:52,600 --> 00:24:57,200
Speaker 1: Scott Lindseicolm is the vice president of General Economics at

492
00:24:57,240 --> 00:25:02,879
Speaker 1: the right leaning Tato Institute. Dude, welcome to Fast Politics, Scott, Oh,

493
00:25:02,920 --> 00:25:06,200
Speaker 1: thanks for having Trade wars are good and easy to win.

494
00:25:06,680 --> 00:25:09,200
Speaker 1: I was told by Donald J. Trump in the first

495
00:25:09,200 --> 00:25:13,000
Speaker 1: season of Trump Destroys America. Are we winning well?

496
00:25:13,119 --> 00:25:15,400
Speaker 3: Depends on how you measure victory.

497
00:25:15,440 --> 00:25:18,480
Speaker 5: I think if what you want is a giant tariff

498
00:25:18,480 --> 00:25:23,680
Speaker 5: wall around the country and a really amazing vehicle for

499
00:25:24,040 --> 00:25:30,560
Speaker 5: handing out political favors and boosting political power generally, then

500
00:25:30,960 --> 00:25:33,680
Speaker 5: Trump two point zero has been a massive victory and

501
00:25:34,359 --> 00:25:40,399
Speaker 5: surprisingly has resulted in much less foreign retaliation than last

502
00:25:40,400 --> 00:25:44,640
Speaker 5: time around. So in terms of trade wars, there's less conflict.

503
00:25:44,880 --> 00:25:48,720
Speaker 5: You know, China and to a lesser extent, Canada have retaliated,

504
00:25:48,760 --> 00:25:50,320
Speaker 5: but nobody else has smartly.

505
00:25:50,640 --> 00:25:55,479
Speaker 3: From the economics perspective, so if you like tariffs.

506
00:25:55,240 --> 00:25:59,680
Speaker 5: And you think that other countries not retaliating will somehow

507
00:25:59,680 --> 00:26:02,360
Speaker 5: boost your exports because you're a mercantilist.

508
00:26:02,000 --> 00:26:02,680
Speaker 3: Then you've won.

509
00:26:03,000 --> 00:26:07,960
Speaker 5: But from an economics perspective and the political perspective.

510
00:26:07,520 --> 00:26:09,960
Speaker 3: We at CATO are anti corporatist.

511
00:26:10,040 --> 00:26:13,600
Speaker 5: We're not big into government croniism and corruption and all

512
00:26:13,640 --> 00:26:14,360
Speaker 5: that jazz.

513
00:26:14,600 --> 00:26:16,240
Speaker 1: You're not big into corruption.

514
00:26:16,760 --> 00:26:22,320
Speaker 5: No, No, like a limited government, enumerated powers, and prefer

515
00:26:23,080 --> 00:26:27,040
Speaker 5: corporations to focus on their actual business and not lobbying

516
00:26:27,119 --> 00:26:28,320
Speaker 5: the government for favors.

517
00:26:28,920 --> 00:26:30,199
Speaker 3: If you believe in that stuff.

518
00:26:30,240 --> 00:26:32,840
Speaker 5: The tariffs are proving to be just as problematic as

519
00:26:33,080 --> 00:26:35,360
Speaker 5: the dreaded economists predicted.

520
00:26:35,480 --> 00:26:37,880
Speaker 3: The fact is we now have an.

521
00:26:37,560 --> 00:26:42,120
Speaker 5: Effective tariff rate of well above ten percent, up from

522
00:26:42,119 --> 00:26:45,560
Speaker 5: a rate of maybe two to three percent pre Trump.

523
00:26:45,560 --> 00:26:48,560
Speaker 5: Two point zero so back just back in January. It's

524
00:26:48,560 --> 00:26:52,359
Speaker 5: scheduled to go even higher, probably fifteen percent by the

525
00:26:52,440 --> 00:26:55,960
Speaker 5: end of the year. Because there's all sorts of loopholes

526
00:26:56,040 --> 00:27:00,760
Speaker 5: and exemptions and cases, investigations and others. And that gets

527
00:27:00,800 --> 00:27:03,920
Speaker 5: to the second point. We have massive amounts of uncertainty

528
00:27:03,960 --> 00:27:08,880
Speaker 5: and complexity that are being just injected into our trade

529
00:27:08,920 --> 00:27:12,280
Speaker 5: bloodstream as we speak. That adds cost. So you're not

530
00:27:12,320 --> 00:27:14,919
Speaker 5: only taxing people to the tune of hundreds of billions

531
00:27:14,920 --> 00:27:18,240
Speaker 5: of dollars a year, mainly American companies and consumers going

532
00:27:18,320 --> 00:27:21,160
Speaker 5: to pay that, but you're also imposing these really weird

533
00:27:21,240 --> 00:27:28,159
Speaker 5: and visible taxes for the uncertainty and complexity and importers, customs, professionals, businesses,

534
00:27:28,240 --> 00:27:29,840
Speaker 5: institutional investors.

535
00:27:29,359 --> 00:27:30,920
Speaker 3: Are all like, I don't know what they have to do.

536
00:27:31,119 --> 00:27:33,840
Speaker 1: I want you to first talk about this because this,

537
00:27:33,920 --> 00:27:36,760
Speaker 1: I think is really interesting, which is there has to

538
00:27:36,840 --> 00:27:39,520
Speaker 1: be a sort of layer of people who put these

539
00:27:39,560 --> 00:27:43,399
Speaker 1: tariffs in, who collect them, who make sure that the

540
00:27:43,440 --> 00:27:46,400
Speaker 1: goods are paid. You know, it's no longer are these

541
00:27:46,520 --> 00:27:50,200
Speaker 1: goods drugs or something illegal. It's now like, are these

542
00:27:50,240 --> 00:27:53,520
Speaker 1: goods paying the rate of tariff that they're supposed to do?

543
00:27:54,000 --> 00:27:56,479
Speaker 5: Yeah, And I think the way to think about it

544
00:27:56,560 --> 00:28:00,280
Speaker 5: is pre Trump and now I think it's better to

545
00:28:00,320 --> 00:28:03,399
Speaker 5: go back to twenty sixteen because that's probably the last

546
00:28:03,400 --> 00:28:06,719
Speaker 5: time twenty seventeen, last time we had a really relatively

547
00:28:06,880 --> 00:28:10,119
Speaker 5: clean US tariff system because then, of course Trump in

548
00:28:10,160 --> 00:28:12,840
Speaker 5: his first term had steel and aluminum tariffs in China

549
00:28:12,840 --> 00:28:14,000
Speaker 5: tariffs and some other stuff.

550
00:28:14,280 --> 00:28:17,359
Speaker 3: But pre Trump one point zero, you basically, if you

551
00:28:17,400 --> 00:28:20,399
Speaker 3: were a business, when you were importing a product, you

552
00:28:20,600 --> 00:28:23,959
Speaker 3: only had to worry about where it comes from and

553
00:28:24,000 --> 00:28:27,800
Speaker 3: what the tariff rate is. And where the tariff rate

554
00:28:27,920 --> 00:28:32,240
Speaker 3: is was pretty easy for the vast majority of countries.

555
00:28:32,320 --> 00:28:35,000
Speaker 3: The only exceptions were some free trade agreement partners and

556
00:28:35,080 --> 00:28:38,400
Speaker 3: some special preference programs we called, so this was a

557
00:28:38,480 --> 00:28:42,200
Speaker 3: very easy process. Tariffs were also generally low, like I said,

558
00:28:42,240 --> 00:28:44,200
Speaker 3: you know, around two percent, so a lot of times

559
00:28:44,280 --> 00:28:48,320
Speaker 3: you weren't even paying a tariff. You just were importing,

560
00:28:48,600 --> 00:28:51,600
Speaker 3: filing your paperwork, and then you've add on tax. It

561
00:28:51,640 --> 00:28:53,920
Speaker 3: was a little bit, right, It was super easy.

562
00:28:54,040 --> 00:28:56,920
Speaker 5: And we had this thing called the Deminimus exception, which

563
00:28:57,040 --> 00:28:59,960
Speaker 5: for Shian Timu and others meant you could order dire

564
00:29:00,000 --> 00:29:04,400
Speaker 5: directly from a different country, not just China, anywhere in

565
00:29:04,400 --> 00:29:06,520
Speaker 5: the world and it could be shipped to you directly

566
00:29:06,560 --> 00:29:07,160
Speaker 5: and you could.

567
00:29:06,960 --> 00:29:08,840
Speaker 3: Avoid all of those formalities.

568
00:29:08,920 --> 00:29:09,160
Speaker 2: Right.

569
00:29:09,240 --> 00:29:12,760
Speaker 5: So Trump comes along and starts messing with this in

570
00:29:12,800 --> 00:29:18,840
Speaker 5: twenty seventeen twenty eighteen, suddenly Chinese goods got a tariff,

571
00:29:18,920 --> 00:29:21,600
Speaker 5: but maybe they were subject to an exclusion, and there

572
00:29:21,600 --> 00:29:25,040
Speaker 5: were all these processes and stuff for that. Steel and

573
00:29:25,160 --> 00:29:30,680
Speaker 5: aluminum got tariffs, but then there were agreements that carved

574
00:29:30,680 --> 00:29:32,840
Speaker 5: some of that out. You could lobby the government for

575
00:29:32,880 --> 00:29:36,720
Speaker 5: your own exclusion. But then they extended the terrace to

576
00:29:36,880 --> 00:29:39,520
Speaker 5: downstream steel and a limb stuff made with steel in

577
00:29:39,560 --> 00:29:42,280
Speaker 5: a limb, what they call derivatives. Tons of litigation as well,

578
00:29:42,680 --> 00:29:47,640
Speaker 5: so that began the complexity stuff. Now everything's been turned

579
00:29:47,720 --> 00:29:51,760
Speaker 5: up to eleven. Now through the reciprocal tariff regime, you

580
00:29:51,880 --> 00:29:57,200
Speaker 5: have different tariff rates for dozens of different countries that

581
00:29:57,440 --> 00:30:00,720
Speaker 5: are not replacing the old tear tariffs we had. They're

582
00:30:00,720 --> 00:30:02,760
Speaker 5: applying on top of those. So you need to figure

583
00:30:02,760 --> 00:30:04,959
Speaker 5: out what was the old tariff. Okay, what's the new tariff,

584
00:30:05,040 --> 00:30:07,920
Speaker 5: what's the country. But that's just the starting point. Then

585
00:30:08,000 --> 00:30:11,200
Speaker 5: you have to figure out is there any Chinese content

586
00:30:11,280 --> 00:30:14,120
Speaker 5: in it? Because there are different rules for Chinese content

587
00:30:14,120 --> 00:30:16,560
Speaker 5: what they call transhipment. Does it have any steel and

588
00:30:16,640 --> 00:30:20,120
Speaker 5: aluminum in it? Because now we're taxing the content of

589
00:30:20,160 --> 00:30:24,280
Speaker 5: those products of course there are random exemptions and exclusions

590
00:30:24,320 --> 00:30:27,480
Speaker 5: as well, but this time around they're not transparent. You

591
00:30:27,480 --> 00:30:29,040
Speaker 5: could used to be able to go to a website

592
00:30:29,080 --> 00:30:32,120
Speaker 5: finding exclusion. Now it's again much harder. And that's just

593
00:30:32,320 --> 00:30:36,040
Speaker 5: one set of tariffs. There's all these other ones that

594
00:30:36,120 --> 00:30:39,400
Speaker 5: have started. Now we have automotive goods subject of tariffs,

595
00:30:39,400 --> 00:30:44,080
Speaker 5: copper subject of teriffs, investigations on semiconductors and consumer electronics,

596
00:30:44,120 --> 00:30:45,800
Speaker 5: and wood products on minerals.

597
00:30:45,840 --> 00:30:47,240
Speaker 3: I mean, you can go on and on and on.

598
00:30:47,520 --> 00:30:51,360
Speaker 5: So it has turned the US tariff regime from a

599
00:30:51,400 --> 00:30:55,360
Speaker 5: relatively simple and transparent one that basically anybody and his

600
00:30:55,440 --> 00:30:59,960
Speaker 5: uncle could operate to something that is its own tariff

601
00:31:00,320 --> 00:31:05,719
Speaker 5: right because the flexities attacks on smaller businesses and a

602
00:31:05,760 --> 00:31:08,960
Speaker 5: subsidy to big business. You know, GM and FOD they

603
00:31:09,000 --> 00:31:13,360
Speaker 5: have an Apple. They have like entire divisions of logistics

604
00:31:13,360 --> 00:31:16,360
Speaker 5: pros and supply chain pros. People who are just you know,

605
00:31:16,480 --> 00:31:19,479
Speaker 5: starting a small business importing a few products, or like

606
00:31:19,560 --> 00:31:21,920
Speaker 5: running in like an auto repair shop and they just

607
00:31:22,000 --> 00:31:24,240
Speaker 5: need a couple of parts. All of a sudden, they're

608
00:31:24,240 --> 00:31:28,480
Speaker 5: getting bills from DHL for one hundred, two hundred and

609
00:31:28,520 --> 00:31:31,960
Speaker 5: fifty bus dollars. They're getting tariff bills from customs in

610
00:31:32,040 --> 00:31:35,040
Speaker 5: the tens of thousands of dollars. And by the way,

611
00:31:35,400 --> 00:31:37,320
Speaker 5: if they get any of this role, let's say they

612
00:31:37,320 --> 00:31:40,800
Speaker 5: get the country of origin wrong or the steel content wrong,

613
00:31:41,280 --> 00:31:43,920
Speaker 5: all of a sudden, they could get fined by customs,

614
00:31:43,960 --> 00:31:48,400
Speaker 5: investigated by DOJ because they just lacked the ability to

615
00:31:48,520 --> 00:31:49,800
Speaker 5: figure all this out.

616
00:31:49,960 --> 00:31:52,040
Speaker 1: I want to do like a lightning around with you

617
00:31:52,080 --> 00:31:54,719
Speaker 1: here because this is complicated, but I also think there

618
00:31:54,760 --> 00:31:57,320
Speaker 1: are some really important points here. So the first thing

619
00:31:57,360 --> 00:32:00,400
Speaker 1: I want you to just true or falls and explained

620
00:32:00,400 --> 00:32:04,400
Speaker 1: it to me. Is this our tariff's attax a corporate tax. Yeah,

621
00:32:04,440 --> 00:32:08,320
Speaker 1: so there are a tax on imports. The big question

622
00:32:08,600 --> 00:32:10,680
Speaker 1: is who pays the tax.

623
00:32:11,240 --> 00:32:16,320
Speaker 5: So legally most import taxes, most tariffs are paid by

624
00:32:16,360 --> 00:32:19,440
Speaker 5: American importers. So US business is located in the United

625
00:32:19,440 --> 00:32:23,360
Speaker 5: States importing from somebody overseas, they legally have to pay

626
00:32:23,360 --> 00:32:23,840
Speaker 5: the tariff.

627
00:32:23,880 --> 00:32:27,200
Speaker 3: There's one exception. Will avoid that. The bigger question is

628
00:32:27,240 --> 00:32:28,640
Speaker 3: the economic incidents.

629
00:32:28,760 --> 00:32:31,520
Speaker 5: It could be foreign exporters they could lower their prices

630
00:32:31,880 --> 00:32:35,320
Speaker 5: kind of eat the tariff. American companies and consumers. Trump

631
00:32:35,320 --> 00:32:38,480
Speaker 5: one point zero, almost one hundred percent of the tariffs

632
00:32:38,520 --> 00:32:41,520
Speaker 5: were being paid by American companies and consumers. They were

633
00:32:41,600 --> 00:32:45,360
Speaker 5: kind of splitting it. Company gets the product, maybe passes

634
00:32:45,400 --> 00:32:48,880
Speaker 5: on the cost via higher price, maybe maybe doesn't. This

635
00:32:49,040 --> 00:32:51,720
Speaker 5: time around, foreign explorers are paying a little bit more,

636
00:32:51,760 --> 00:32:54,480
Speaker 5: but it's still like ten percent max. And then the

637
00:32:54,520 --> 00:32:58,160
Speaker 5: rest is being split among companies and consumers. So far

638
00:32:58,360 --> 00:32:59,960
Speaker 5: with companies paying more like a corp.

639
00:33:00,840 --> 00:33:03,920
Speaker 1: I want you to talk about the washing machines. So

640
00:33:04,040 --> 00:33:07,440
Speaker 1: in the first Trump administration, explain this.

641
00:33:07,880 --> 00:33:10,200
Speaker 5: Yeah, so, washing machines are a great example of some

642
00:33:10,240 --> 00:33:13,680
Speaker 5: of the weird and unintended consequences of tariffs. So we

643
00:33:14,040 --> 00:33:17,960
Speaker 5: imposed a safeguard measure, basically a global tariff on all

644
00:33:18,400 --> 00:33:22,840
Speaker 5: washing machines to help the American washing machine industry, mainly Whirlpool,

645
00:33:22,880 --> 00:33:25,120
Speaker 5: who was lobbying heavily for those.

646
00:33:25,200 --> 00:33:27,840
Speaker 1: By the way, how fucking corrupt is that? Oh yeah,

647
00:33:28,000 --> 00:33:32,680
Speaker 1: Worldpool could lobby heavily for this, and so we tariffed

648
00:33:32,720 --> 00:33:34,840
Speaker 1: another country's washing machines.

649
00:33:34,960 --> 00:33:36,880
Speaker 3: This is trade policy, one oh one.

650
00:33:37,000 --> 00:33:40,880
Speaker 5: The modern lobbying system in the United States has its

651
00:33:40,960 --> 00:33:44,800
Speaker 5: origins in like nineteenth century US tariff policy, which Congress

652
00:33:44,880 --> 00:33:48,920
Speaker 5: used to handle and it was just an absolute corruption buffet, right.

653
00:33:48,840 --> 00:33:52,120
Speaker 1: Which it still is. Right, because fucking Whirlpool does not

654
00:33:52,280 --> 00:33:53,680
Speaker 1: deserve to have in the.

655
00:33:53,600 --> 00:33:57,520
Speaker 5: Steel industry and the shipbuilding industry and the textile guys

656
00:33:57,520 --> 00:34:00,000
Speaker 5: and the sugar guys. So you get yourself a trade,

657
00:34:00,320 --> 00:34:04,520
Speaker 5: you lobby for protection. And because tariffs are mostly invisible,

658
00:34:04,560 --> 00:34:06,560
Speaker 5: like you don't see it on your sales receipt, right,

659
00:34:06,880 --> 00:34:09,720
Speaker 5: because they target foreigners, and we have these anti foreign

660
00:34:09,800 --> 00:34:14,600
Speaker 5: biases because they supposedly support jobs and patriotism and all that,

661
00:34:14,800 --> 00:34:17,760
Speaker 5: it's very politically seductive and pretty easy to get protection.

662
00:34:18,000 --> 00:34:20,520
Speaker 5: The only way we short circuited that dynamic was through

663
00:34:20,560 --> 00:34:22,839
Speaker 5: trade agreements, which, of course Trump has now blown up.

664
00:34:22,960 --> 00:34:25,320
Speaker 5: So we're kind of back in they just wild West

665
00:34:25,520 --> 00:34:30,120
Speaker 5: where you hire a lobbyist. Trade lobbying has skyrocketed this year.

666
00:34:30,560 --> 00:34:32,920
Speaker 5: You hire a lobbyist, you go to Washington, get you

667
00:34:32,960 --> 00:34:35,320
Speaker 5: try to get your own tariff, or you get yourself

668
00:34:35,320 --> 00:34:37,800
Speaker 5: a carve out if you're a big company like Apple,

669
00:34:38,120 --> 00:34:40,279
Speaker 5: where the rest of us are just eating it.

670
00:34:40,600 --> 00:34:44,360
Speaker 3: Right. Oh so, anyway, washing machine tariffs, So we imposed

671
00:34:44,640 --> 00:34:48,040
Speaker 3: washing machine tariffs. Prices of washing machines went up in

672
00:34:48,080 --> 00:34:50,839
Speaker 3: the United States. But the kicker is that prices of

673
00:34:50,960 --> 00:34:53,799
Speaker 3: dryers went up too, because you buy your washer and

674
00:34:53,800 --> 00:34:54,680
Speaker 3: your dryer together.

675
00:34:55,160 --> 00:34:57,480
Speaker 1: If you're going to pay three thousand dollars for your

676
00:34:57,520 --> 00:35:00,160
Speaker 1: washing machine, you're not going to pay two thousand dollar

677
00:35:00,200 --> 00:35:02,399
Speaker 1: for your dryer. Why not make the dryers three thousand docks.

678
00:35:02,600 --> 00:35:04,239
Speaker 3: Yeah, so companies figure this out.

679
00:35:04,280 --> 00:35:07,120
Speaker 5: Domestic companies like Worldpool figure this out too, and it

680
00:35:07,239 --> 00:35:10,799
Speaker 5: turns out that consumers ended up paying more than one

681
00:35:10,880 --> 00:35:13,840
Speaker 5: hundred percent of the tariff cost because the price of

682
00:35:13,840 --> 00:35:17,680
Speaker 5: the dryers went up too. So the kicker, however, is

683
00:35:17,719 --> 00:35:21,120
Speaker 5: that Wirlpool hasn't really even benefited. It turns out that

684
00:35:21,520 --> 00:35:25,640
Speaker 5: Samsung and LG had some factories in the United States

685
00:35:25,640 --> 00:35:29,080
Speaker 5: they were already building, so you have Samsung and LG factories,

686
00:35:29,080 --> 00:35:32,560
Speaker 5: whereas Worldpool's actually still struggling, which again is trade policy.

687
00:35:32,719 --> 00:35:35,000
Speaker 1: I have to say, though, that is a little bit

688
00:35:35,000 --> 00:35:38,279
Speaker 1: of a happy ending, because fuck Worldpool, I can say

689
00:35:38,360 --> 00:35:41,840
Speaker 1: because it's my podcast, But no, such a good example

690
00:35:41,920 --> 00:35:43,719
Speaker 1: of how none of this is going to have the

691
00:35:43,760 --> 00:35:45,560
Speaker 1: first roarer of effects we think.

692
00:35:45,600 --> 00:35:48,000
Speaker 5: Right, and it's going to have all sorts of weird

693
00:35:48,520 --> 00:35:50,840
Speaker 5: effects that we're only going to see in retrospect. And

694
00:35:50,880 --> 00:35:54,560
Speaker 5: that's another reason why tariffs are so politically seducted. It

695
00:35:54,640 --> 00:35:56,759
Speaker 5: takes a while for all of this stuff to kind

696
00:35:56,760 --> 00:36:00,880
Speaker 5: of work its way through the economy. You know, a

697
00:36:00,920 --> 00:36:05,080
Speaker 5: company like GM has like three tiers of suppliers, So

698
00:36:05,160 --> 00:36:08,200
Speaker 5: if the supplier at the bottom end is paying the

699
00:36:08,239 --> 00:36:11,360
Speaker 5: tariff and it passes on some and so it's gonna

700
00:36:11,440 --> 00:36:14,040
Speaker 5: it just takes forever for this stuff to wash out.

701
00:36:14,120 --> 00:36:18,120
Speaker 5: Now we're now a good six seven months into this,

702
00:36:18,560 --> 00:36:22,759
Speaker 5: and the economic data are finally starting to show the

703
00:36:22,840 --> 00:36:28,520
Speaker 5: tariff costs, the economic pain, higher prices, slower growth, the

704
00:36:28,560 --> 00:36:29,799
Speaker 5: lobbying stuff, and the rest.

705
00:36:29,880 --> 00:36:33,879
Speaker 1: Right, So, last week, before Donald Trump decided to have

706
00:36:33,920 --> 00:36:38,840
Speaker 1: an emergency summit with Vladimir Putin, totally because it needed

707
00:36:38,840 --> 00:36:42,439
Speaker 1: to happen on that Friday and not to distract from

708
00:36:42,480 --> 00:36:45,160
Speaker 1: anything else, right, those, of course would he there were

709
00:36:45,160 --> 00:36:49,440
Speaker 1: two bits of news that showed that the tariffs are

710
00:36:49,480 --> 00:36:52,040
Speaker 1: going to be a fucking disaster. Talk us through them.

711
00:36:52,440 --> 00:36:55,800
Speaker 5: Yeah, So we had last week the Consumer Price Index

712
00:36:55,920 --> 00:36:59,160
Speaker 5: data that's basically the United States government looks at the

713
00:36:59,640 --> 00:37:01,480
Speaker 5: price you and I are paying for stuff.

714
00:37:01,719 --> 00:37:03,560
Speaker 3: And here you're starting.

715
00:37:03,200 --> 00:37:11,160
Speaker 5: To see the prices of goods that are mainly importing toys, clothes, appliances,

716
00:37:11,239 --> 00:37:14,080
Speaker 5: other things. Those are starting to go up. The bigger

717
00:37:14,160 --> 00:37:17,480
Speaker 5: surprise was in the producer price index, which is the

718
00:37:17,520 --> 00:37:20,359
Speaker 5: prices that producers in the United States, so these don't

719
00:37:20,360 --> 00:37:23,759
Speaker 5: include tariffs, are just selling to each other. That was

720
00:37:23,800 --> 00:37:28,480
Speaker 5: a really big upside surprise, and the big driver were

721
00:37:28,520 --> 00:37:31,360
Speaker 5: the companies that deal in the import space, so like

722
00:37:31,440 --> 00:37:38,040
Speaker 5: wholesalers and distributors, sellers of manufactured machinery and other things.

723
00:37:38,400 --> 00:37:41,680
Speaker 5: So that had everybody looking at those things and going Aha,

724
00:37:42,080 --> 00:37:45,560
Speaker 5: terrifs are starting to really leak into the general inflation

725
00:37:45,719 --> 00:37:48,560
Speaker 5: data and the general price The other data piece we

726
00:37:48,640 --> 00:37:52,160
Speaker 5: got less reported is that we get data on import prices,

727
00:37:52,520 --> 00:37:55,760
Speaker 5: and here import prices were up.

728
00:37:55,600 --> 00:37:57,400
Speaker 3: A little bit. Now why does that important.

729
00:37:57,440 --> 00:38:01,239
Speaker 5: Well, import prices in this data set don't include tariffs,

730
00:38:01,760 --> 00:38:04,760
Speaker 5: so if we were to see, as Donald Trump claims,

731
00:38:04,840 --> 00:38:08,400
Speaker 5: foreigners paying the tariffs, we would expect import prices to

732
00:38:08,440 --> 00:38:12,000
Speaker 5: actually be down a lot, but they're not really at all.

733
00:38:12,440 --> 00:38:16,440
Speaker 5: So this is more evidence that it is Americans mainly

734
00:38:16,760 --> 00:38:20,200
Speaker 5: that are paying these billions in teriffs, and along with

735
00:38:20,280 --> 00:38:24,239
Speaker 5: of course higher prices for American made goods, because the

736
00:38:24,320 --> 00:38:27,480
Speaker 5: steel guys and the copper guys and the whirlpools of

737
00:38:27,480 --> 00:38:29,280
Speaker 5: the world, they're not going to sit around and go, oh,

738
00:38:29,320 --> 00:38:31,840
Speaker 5: you know we're gonna we're gonna charge low prices because

739
00:38:31,960 --> 00:38:34,479
Speaker 5: you know, our competitors higher, they're go in charge higher

740
00:38:34,480 --> 00:38:37,480
Speaker 5: prices too. That's what being insulated from competition. That's the

741
00:38:37,520 --> 00:38:39,720
Speaker 5: whole point, right, And that's what we're getting.

742
00:38:39,840 --> 00:38:45,480
Speaker 1: That is so incredibly unshocking and unsurprising. And I want

743
00:38:45,520 --> 00:38:48,759
Speaker 1: to talk for a minute about like a week before that,

744
00:38:49,160 --> 00:38:51,919
Speaker 1: I read an article that said that all the money

745
00:38:51,960 --> 00:38:54,879
Speaker 1: the government was making from tariffs, because the government right

746
00:38:54,920 --> 00:38:58,200
Speaker 1: now is making a gazillion dollars from tariffs, right, what

747
00:38:58,280 --> 00:38:58,960
Speaker 1: are the numbers.

748
00:38:59,360 --> 00:39:02,680
Speaker 5: It's like fifty billion a month right now, so pretty solid.

749
00:39:02,719 --> 00:39:06,200
Speaker 5: Now it's compared to where we were pre Trump era.

750
00:39:06,360 --> 00:39:09,400
Speaker 5: We would maybe clear one hundred billion a year in

751
00:39:09,480 --> 00:39:12,600
Speaker 5: tarrisks because we did have some tariffs on stuff like

752
00:39:12,920 --> 00:39:15,320
Speaker 5: shoes and clothes, because of course, you know, let's tax

753
00:39:15,360 --> 00:39:17,799
Speaker 5: those things, right, But generally we weren't making a lot.

754
00:39:17,880 --> 00:39:20,440
Speaker 3: Now we have a lot of revenue coming in.

755
00:39:20,760 --> 00:39:25,320
Speaker 1: So fifty billion a month, right, and that's ridiculous numbers.

756
00:39:25,760 --> 00:39:28,640
Speaker 1: I was reading an article that said that no one's

757
00:39:28,680 --> 00:39:31,040
Speaker 1: going to be able to undo the tariffs because this

758
00:39:31,200 --> 00:39:33,640
Speaker 1: money is so delicious and it's going to pay down

759
00:39:33,719 --> 00:39:35,319
Speaker 1: the debt, and we're going to be able to use

760
00:39:35,360 --> 00:39:41,040
Speaker 1: it to fund a whole new gestoppo ice whatever and

761
00:39:41,160 --> 00:39:44,320
Speaker 1: make new Alligator Alcatraz is in all of the things

762
00:39:44,360 --> 00:39:48,040
Speaker 1: that Trump World dreams of. But here's my hottest take

763
00:39:48,120 --> 00:39:51,440
Speaker 1: for you. We are on the precipice of a complete

764
00:39:51,600 --> 00:39:55,560
Speaker 1: financial meltdown. The reason that people, we haven't had tariffs

765
00:39:55,640 --> 00:39:59,000
Speaker 1: like this since the nineteen twenties or thirties.

766
00:39:59,120 --> 00:40:01,720
Speaker 3: Right, Yeah, I got to go back basically to Smooth Holly.

767
00:40:01,800 --> 00:40:03,239
Speaker 1: How did Smooth Holly end?

768
00:40:03,560 --> 00:40:07,239
Speaker 3: It ended with well, the Great Depression in World War Two?

769
00:40:07,719 --> 00:40:11,239
Speaker 1: But but yes, but there was good stuff in between there.

770
00:40:11,320 --> 00:40:14,200
Speaker 5: I'm going to be the calm intellectual here for a

771
00:40:14,239 --> 00:40:19,040
Speaker 5: second and say, most folks think that that tariff's exacerbated

772
00:40:19,160 --> 00:40:22,120
Speaker 5: other economic problems in the United States. Yeah, I'm not

773
00:40:22,200 --> 00:40:23,160
Speaker 5: as dire.

774
00:40:23,080 --> 00:40:25,279
Speaker 3: As you are. I see this more.

775
00:40:25,320 --> 00:40:27,920
Speaker 5: The way I describe it is it doesn't have to

776
00:40:27,920 --> 00:40:31,840
Speaker 5: be economic catastrophe for economic catastrophe for it to be bad.

777
00:40:32,360 --> 00:40:33,240
Speaker 3: I could cut.

778
00:40:33,040 --> 00:40:36,239
Speaker 5: Off my foot and still hobble around and live. That

779
00:40:36,320 --> 00:40:38,480
Speaker 5: doesn't mean cutting off my foot is a good idea.

780
00:40:38,680 --> 00:40:41,920
Speaker 5: And I think that's more where tariff policy is today

781
00:40:42,120 --> 00:40:43,160
Speaker 5: than the Great Depression.

782
00:40:43,400 --> 00:40:46,080
Speaker 1: Oh that said, at this point, there's only one sector

783
00:40:46,080 --> 00:40:48,560
Speaker 1: of the market that's growing, which is AI.

784
00:40:49,120 --> 00:40:52,520
Speaker 5: Yeah, very likely be above all, right, But remember the

785
00:40:52,640 --> 00:40:56,280
Speaker 5: United States is a massive, I mean thirty trillion dollar economy.

786
00:40:56,400 --> 00:41:00,040
Speaker 5: Imports are only around ten percent of our GDP. The

787
00:41:00,320 --> 00:41:02,640
Speaker 5: United States is actually not as much of a globally

788
00:41:02,640 --> 00:41:07,920
Speaker 5: integrated economy as you think. We're huge, dynamic services economy.

789
00:41:08,360 --> 00:41:10,719
Speaker 5: So you can do a lot of damage in the

790
00:41:10,719 --> 00:41:15,640
Speaker 5: trade and goods sector that'll leak into the services like

791
00:41:15,920 --> 00:41:19,239
Speaker 5: auto repair and other things, but it's not going to

792
00:41:20,320 --> 00:41:25,120
Speaker 5: likely tip us into whatever because so much of the

793
00:41:25,160 --> 00:41:28,080
Speaker 5: rest of the economy can be just fine without you know,

794
00:41:28,120 --> 00:41:31,000
Speaker 5: pay a little more, but be okay. The worry, I

795
00:41:31,040 --> 00:41:36,000
Speaker 5: think is that there's contagion, right, so people start freaking

796
00:41:36,040 --> 00:41:39,000
Speaker 5: out and they don't see that in April as the

797
00:41:39,040 --> 00:41:42,400
Speaker 5: worst case scenarios kind of people started thinking worst case

798
00:41:43,000 --> 00:41:45,279
Speaker 5: and I think that that's when you get into the

799
00:41:45,280 --> 00:41:46,080
Speaker 5: scary area.

800
00:41:46,239 --> 00:41:47,560
Speaker 3: It's that contagion stuff.

801
00:41:47,600 --> 00:41:51,480
Speaker 5: I don't think the director even indirect effects are alone enough.

802
00:41:51,520 --> 00:41:53,920
Speaker 5: But the fact is that you know, the US economy

803
00:41:54,080 --> 00:41:57,440
Speaker 5: was weakening before Trump took off. This it wasn't bad,

804
00:41:57,760 --> 00:42:01,239
Speaker 5: but it wasn't firing on all cylinders. And so the

805
00:42:01,280 --> 00:42:04,279
Speaker 5: problem with all this tariff stuff is that it's just

806
00:42:04,360 --> 00:42:05,560
Speaker 5: making us even weaker.

807
00:42:05,800 --> 00:42:08,279
Speaker 1: Say tomorrow, Donald Trump, and I don't think we're going

808
00:42:08,320 --> 00:42:10,399
Speaker 1: into a depression, but I certainly don't think we're going

809
00:42:10,400 --> 00:42:13,279
Speaker 1: anywhere good. Donald Trump tomorrow says, you know what, I

810
00:42:13,400 --> 00:42:18,360
Speaker 1: made a mistake. Triffs are inflationary. I was elected to

811
00:42:18,400 --> 00:42:21,960
Speaker 1: make things cheaper and also to be mean to people

812
00:42:22,200 --> 00:42:25,600
Speaker 1: who were not born here. I have now made a

813
00:42:25,680 --> 00:42:28,800
Speaker 1: huge mistake. I want to get rid of these tariffs.

814
00:42:28,920 --> 00:42:31,520
Speaker 1: You can't do it, so talk us through how hard

815
00:42:31,560 --> 00:42:32,279
Speaker 1: it is to do it.

816
00:42:32,480 --> 00:42:35,399
Speaker 3: Well, legally, he can't. He could literally sign a piece

817
00:42:35,400 --> 00:42:37,640
Speaker 3: of paper and they'd all go away tomorrow. But will

818
00:42:37,719 --> 00:42:41,239
Speaker 3: prices go down, No, very unlikely.

819
00:42:41,320 --> 00:42:41,520
Speaker 4: You know.

820
00:42:41,600 --> 00:42:44,399
Speaker 5: It's kind of like when the price at the gas

821
00:42:44,440 --> 00:42:46,479
Speaker 5: station goes up, it takes forever for him to come down.

822
00:42:46,880 --> 00:42:49,400
Speaker 5: When it comes to generally to the price level in

823
00:42:49,440 --> 00:42:52,400
Speaker 5: the United States. What you have to do, and this

824
00:42:52,440 --> 00:42:55,200
Speaker 5: is kind of similar to what happened during the Biden era,

825
00:42:55,800 --> 00:42:58,320
Speaker 5: is you have to just wait for wages to catch

826
00:42:58,400 --> 00:43:01,439
Speaker 5: up to where prices are. U won't keep heading up,

827
00:43:01,800 --> 00:43:04,279
Speaker 5: they'll just kind of flatten out, and that's what you.

828
00:43:04,280 --> 00:43:04,719
Speaker 3: Have to do.

829
00:43:05,080 --> 00:43:09,440
Speaker 5: I think the bigger issue, quite frankly, is the money.

830
00:43:09,800 --> 00:43:12,400
Speaker 5: Like you said, I think the tariffs can prove quite

831
00:43:12,520 --> 00:43:16,480
Speaker 5: durable because now you have tens, if not hundreds of

832
00:43:16,560 --> 00:43:20,000
Speaker 5: billions of dollars in new tax revenue, tax revenue that

833
00:43:20,160 --> 00:43:24,479
Speaker 5: for some insane reason, anti tax Republicans are cheering, and

834
00:43:24,960 --> 00:43:27,960
Speaker 5: we have fiscal problems. So I think it's just going

835
00:43:28,040 --> 00:43:31,439
Speaker 5: to be really hard for it to go away now

836
00:43:31,480 --> 00:43:33,759
Speaker 5: that it started. And this, by the way, again is

837
00:43:33,920 --> 00:43:39,000
Speaker 5: exactly why folks like me warn against tariffs, not just

838
00:43:39,040 --> 00:43:42,640
Speaker 5: the economic harms, not just how they hurt small businesses,

839
00:43:43,080 --> 00:43:46,040
Speaker 5: but because man, once they're in place, they are.

840
00:43:45,920 --> 00:43:48,480
Speaker 3: Incredibly difficult to remove.

841
00:43:48,800 --> 00:43:51,359
Speaker 5: And unfortunately that's what we got to deal with, and

842
00:43:51,520 --> 00:43:53,840
Speaker 5: we do dealing with, of course, because Congress won't do

843
00:43:53,880 --> 00:43:56,319
Speaker 5: its job and actually fix the laws that allow a

844
00:43:56,320 --> 00:43:58,240
Speaker 5: guy like Trump to do this stuff in the first place.

845
00:43:58,480 --> 00:44:01,960
Speaker 1: Scott, thank you, my pleasure. I hope you'll come back.

846
00:44:02,080 --> 00:44:02,480
Speaker 3: Of course.

847
00:44:04,760 --> 00:44:09,240
Speaker 1: No, Mom, Sickly, Jesse Cannon.

848
00:44:09,120 --> 00:44:13,239
Speaker 2: Molly, we got some serious, seriously fuckery going on right here.

849
00:44:13,480 --> 00:44:17,000
Speaker 1: This is special Molly's birthday. Fuck Ray so let's go.

850
00:44:17,400 --> 00:44:19,240
Speaker 1: Jesse Cannon, I'm scared.

851
00:44:19,480 --> 00:44:22,799
Speaker 2: You know, basically I am eight months older than you.

852
00:44:22,800 --> 00:44:24,799
Speaker 2: You give me tons of shit about this. You talk

853
00:44:24,840 --> 00:44:27,560
Speaker 2: about the guest sage. So today what I'm giving you

854
00:44:27,600 --> 00:44:30,520
Speaker 2: as a president is I'm going to tell you every

855
00:44:30,600 --> 00:44:34,960
Speaker 2: politician that is our age, so you can feel absolutely

856
00:44:35,080 --> 00:44:36,439
Speaker 2: terrible about how old we are.

857
00:44:37,040 --> 00:44:38,800
Speaker 1: This is the worst thing out.

858
00:44:38,840 --> 00:44:40,640
Speaker 2: So for listeners out of the note the past, I

859
00:44:40,719 --> 00:44:43,839
Speaker 2: used to buy Molli cabios from people like Rudy Giuliani,

860
00:44:44,040 --> 00:44:46,480
Speaker 2: Alan Dershowitz. I look at the list this year and

861
00:44:46,520 --> 00:44:49,320
Speaker 2: it's just too repulsive of who I would be giving money.

862
00:44:49,440 --> 00:44:51,680
Speaker 1: You don't want to give those people any money anymore.

863
00:44:52,320 --> 00:44:54,160
Speaker 1: It's just no good came up from that.

864
00:44:54,440 --> 00:44:56,880
Speaker 2: So I figured this is the less cruel thing to do,

865
00:44:57,040 --> 00:44:59,000
Speaker 2: even though this is about to be very cruel. Are

866
00:44:59,000 --> 00:45:01,000
Speaker 2: you ready for a list of people who are just

867
00:45:01,080 --> 00:45:02,200
Speaker 2: as old as you?

868
00:45:02,239 --> 00:45:02,319
Speaker 1: No.

869
00:45:03,040 --> 00:45:09,560
Speaker 6: Emmanuel McCrone, Really, he's accomplished so much more. Georgia Belodi,

870
00:45:10,239 --> 00:45:13,239
Speaker 6: she's also accomplished so much more. God damn it, they're

871
00:45:13,280 --> 00:45:15,120
Speaker 6: both forty seven. That's horrendous.

872
00:45:15,400 --> 00:45:17,799
Speaker 2: Technically within a year of us is what I'm doing here.

873
00:45:17,840 --> 00:45:20,480
Speaker 2: So it's like you can't do exactly but the Prime

874
00:45:20,520 --> 00:45:25,480
Speaker 2: Minister of Denmark Metta Fredericson, Oh wow, Congressman Seth multen

875
00:45:26,560 --> 00:45:31,040
Speaker 2: voldemir is Lenski what. Yeah, he was born on January

876
00:45:31,080 --> 00:45:33,839
Speaker 2: twenty fifth, nineteen seventy eight, which makes him seventeen days

877
00:45:33,920 --> 00:45:34,400
Speaker 2: younger than me.

878
00:45:34,760 --> 00:45:36,200
Speaker 1: Oh, Jesus fucking Christ.

879
00:45:36,239 --> 00:45:38,279
Speaker 2: All right, this one you're gonna be very proud of.

880
00:45:38,719 --> 00:45:39,640
Speaker 2: Mark Wayne Mullen.

881
00:45:39,880 --> 00:45:42,960
Speaker 1: Wait, that guy's our age, Jay, that guy.

882
00:45:42,880 --> 00:45:45,759
Speaker 2: Is our age. He's technically a hair older than me.

883
00:45:46,600 --> 00:45:48,640
Speaker 1: Mark, Wayne and Jesus Christ.

884
00:45:48,800 --> 00:45:51,920
Speaker 2: Okay, but this is the one that always really hurts

885
00:45:52,000 --> 00:45:55,200
Speaker 2: because she's just a few days older than me. Representative

886
00:45:55,280 --> 00:45:55,919
Speaker 2: Nancy Mace.

887
00:45:56,400 --> 00:45:59,360
Speaker 1: Wow, kind of makes you think.

888
00:45:59,440 --> 00:46:02,360
Speaker 2: Didn't we have a friend of the show, Robert Garcia,

889
00:46:02,400 --> 00:46:03,880
Speaker 2: who's just a few days older than me?

890
00:46:04,280 --> 00:46:06,399
Speaker 1: Ah, Robert Garcia.

891
00:46:07,160 --> 00:46:11,240
Speaker 2: Then, to get into our profession of punditry, Alex Wagner

892
00:46:11,600 --> 00:46:15,680
Speaker 2: is our age. Yeah, she's just two months older than me.

893
00:46:15,880 --> 00:46:18,000
Speaker 1: Also way more successful.

894
00:46:17,800 --> 00:46:21,560
Speaker 2: Just under the gun of being almost exactly a year

895
00:46:21,960 --> 00:46:24,840
Speaker 2: older than you, but still a little less is Steve Kornaki.

896
00:46:25,920 --> 00:46:31,040
Speaker 1: Steve Karnaki, congratulations Karnaki and being our age but you

897
00:46:31,080 --> 00:46:31,359
Speaker 1: know who.

898
00:46:31,360 --> 00:46:35,280
Speaker 2: You're about a month younger than who, Jesse Waters.

899
00:46:36,120 --> 00:46:40,719
Speaker 1: And I'm only married to my first husband, so damn it.

900
00:46:41,400 --> 00:46:43,360
Speaker 2: Okay, we still got a few more to go and

901
00:46:43,400 --> 00:46:44,239
Speaker 2: then this will be over.

902
00:46:44,400 --> 00:46:47,640
Speaker 1: Let's go. No, I never wanted to end. Keep going.

903
00:46:47,840 --> 00:46:51,160
Speaker 2: Okay, you're just a few months older than Representative Byron

904
00:46:51,239 --> 00:46:56,200
Speaker 2: Donald's all right, go on, Victoria Sparts just a few

905
00:46:56,239 --> 00:46:56,840
Speaker 2: months older.

906
00:46:56,920 --> 00:47:01,640
Speaker 1: Then I'm not going to say anything. I don't want

907
00:47:01,640 --> 00:47:02,360
Speaker 1: to get canceled.

908
00:47:03,560 --> 00:47:07,439
Speaker 2: Just a few months older, did Maryland Governor Wes Moore?

909
00:47:08,400 --> 00:47:10,040
Speaker 1: I knew because we went to school together.

910
00:47:10,520 --> 00:47:14,120
Speaker 2: I knew that. Actually, okay, but you got just almost

911
00:47:14,200 --> 00:47:16,960
Speaker 2: exactly a month on Governor Ron DeSantis.

912
00:47:17,320 --> 00:47:20,640
Speaker 1: Wait, I'm a month older than Ron DeSantis, younger, younger,

913
00:47:20,800 --> 00:47:23,240
Speaker 1: I look a lot younger, I think I would agree.

914
00:47:23,280 --> 00:47:24,920
Speaker 1: And I'm also a lot taller than Ron.

915
00:47:26,480 --> 00:47:28,840
Speaker 2: John Oliver is in the same year.

916
00:47:28,719 --> 00:47:33,800
Speaker 1: As us, whoa also more successful than we are. That's annoying.

917
00:47:34,280 --> 00:47:37,440
Speaker 2: Then we have a Congressman Mark Livin.

918
00:47:37,160 --> 00:47:38,520
Speaker 1: Yeah he looks older than we do.

919
00:47:38,800 --> 00:47:42,080
Speaker 2: Then we have former Congressman Adam Kinsinger.

920
00:47:41,719 --> 00:47:43,080
Speaker 1: Yeah he looks younger than we do.

921
00:47:43,719 --> 00:47:47,200
Speaker 2: And then, last, but not least, we have the one,

922
00:47:47,680 --> 00:47:52,040
Speaker 2: the only Senator Josh Holly, who's about a year younger

923
00:47:52,080 --> 00:47:52,440
Speaker 2: than us.

924
00:47:52,880 --> 00:47:57,040
Speaker 1: I mean, yes, Josh Holly, how.

925
00:47:56,880 --> 00:47:58,600
Speaker 2: Do you feel now, BALI did it? Did I cheer

926
00:47:58,640 --> 00:47:59,280
Speaker 2: up your birthday?

927
00:47:59,360 --> 00:48:00,080
Speaker 1: I hate you?

928
00:48:01,800 --> 00:48:03,640
Speaker 2: Well, I had to do it.

929
00:48:04,360 --> 00:48:05,399
Speaker 1: I truly hate you.

930
00:48:05,719 --> 00:48:08,680
Speaker 2: It was this our funding fascist. So there you go.

931
00:48:09,239 --> 00:48:12,480
Speaker 1: Thank you, thank you. Let's have a clean out here.

932
00:48:12,719 --> 00:48:13,720
Speaker 2: I'm taking a ballot.

933
00:48:13,719 --> 00:48:16,000
Speaker 1: Thank you. I'm going to go have an urban breakdown.

934
00:48:16,200 --> 00:48:20,879
Speaker 1: Thank you. That's it for this episode of Fast Politics.

935
00:48:21,360 --> 00:48:27,080
Speaker 1: Tune in every Monday, Wednesday, Thursday and Saturday to hear

936
00:48:27,360 --> 00:48:31,719
Speaker 1: the best minds and politics make sense of all this chaos.

937
00:48:32,000 --> 00:48:34,840
Speaker 1: If you enjoy this podcast, please send it to a

938
00:48:34,920 --> 00:48:38,920
Speaker 1: friend and keep the conversation going. Thanks for listening.