WEBVTT - Amazon Union Win in NYC and Chinese Tech Stocks Rebounding 0:00:02.360 --> 0:00:05.760 From the heart of where innovation, money and power collide 0:00:06.480 --> 0:00:10.959 in Silicon Valley and beyond. This is Bloomberg Technology with 0:00:11.039 --> 0:00:26.720 Emily Jay. I'm Emily check in San Francisco, and this 0:00:26.760 --> 0:00:29.160 is Bloomberg Technology. Coming up in the next hour, a 0:00:29.280 --> 0:00:32.240 water gen moment for Amazon and all of its workers. 0:00:32.440 --> 0:00:36.040 A vote to unionize at the second largest private employer 0:00:36.520 --> 0:00:40.080 in the country will drive a push for organized labor 0:00:40.159 --> 0:00:44.720 across the United States. We will discuss plus a U 0:00:44.880 --> 0:00:48.640 turn in China's tech delisting plan. Chinese authorities preparing to 0:00:48.640 --> 0:00:52.400 give US regulators full access to auditing reports of the 0:00:52.479 --> 0:00:57.040 majority of the two hundred plus companies Chinese companies listed 0:00:57.040 --> 0:01:00.520 in New York. We will break it down and Bractel 0:01:00.720 --> 0:01:03.600 is the new n f T gaming company in town, 0:01:03.880 --> 0:01:06.880 created by Twitch co founder Justin Kahn. Why does he 0:01:06.959 --> 0:01:09.360 think n f T s or the future of gaming? 0:01:09.680 --> 0:01:13.000 Con joins us in an exclusive interview this hour, workers 0:01:13.040 --> 0:01:15.120 at an Amazon warehouse in New York have voted to 0:01:15.240 --> 0:01:18.840 join a union. It is a historic victory for organized labor. 0:01:19.280 --> 0:01:22.000 Amazon has managed to keep unions out of its US 0:01:22.080 --> 0:01:25.880 operations for more than a quarter century. The vote wasn't 0:01:25.880 --> 0:01:28.880 even close. Those in favor of the union, winning by 0:01:28.920 --> 0:01:31.280 ten percentage points. We are joined now by Lynn Vincent, 0:01:31.319 --> 0:01:33.800 assistant professor at the MJ. Whitman's School of Management at 0:01:33.800 --> 0:01:37.840 Syracuse University, along with our Bloomberg Senior executive editor Brad Stone, 0:01:37.840 --> 0:01:42.000 who has been covering Amazon himself for decades. Brad, Amazon 0:01:42.080 --> 0:01:44.640 is the second largest private employer in the country, so 0:01:44.680 --> 0:01:48.400 this could potentially be huge. Just how remarkable do you 0:01:48.440 --> 0:01:54.080 think this is? Well, it's certainly historic. As as you said, 0:01:54.160 --> 0:01:57.760 Amazon has been fighting union attempts in the US, probably 0:01:57.760 --> 0:01:59.840 since the late nineties when it first started in a 0:02:00.000 --> 0:02:03.960 customer service call center outside Seattle. And if you remember, 0:02:04.000 --> 0:02:07.080 Amazon closed that facility and just moved the work elsewhere. 0:02:07.320 --> 0:02:10.160 So it's fault these efforts bitterly. In Europe, there have 0:02:10.320 --> 0:02:14.079 been unions there having work stoppages. Amazon typically kind of 0:02:14.160 --> 0:02:17.000 routes around it, and so I think, look, it's historic, 0:02:17.040 --> 0:02:19.799 it's unusual for Amazon, but it's just the beginning. I mean, 0:02:19.840 --> 0:02:23.079 this is one facility. Amazon, as we reported today, is 0:02:23.120 --> 0:02:25.680 going to contest it, probably in court. But then the 0:02:25.720 --> 0:02:28.720 real work begins bargaining. And will Amazon even sit down 0:02:28.720 --> 0:02:33.000 with this new and very untested union, And you know, 0:02:33.080 --> 0:02:36.320 and then will it renegotiate things that it does give employees, 0:02:36.360 --> 0:02:39.239 like a fifteen hour wage. I think this this group 0:02:39.360 --> 0:02:41.720 led by Chris Small, as a former Amazon employee, is 0:02:41.720 --> 0:02:45.079 now going to be very, very much tested. Chris Smalls 0:02:45.120 --> 0:02:47.960 has been a huge character in this whole story. I 0:02:47.960 --> 0:02:51.320 want to read Amazon statement here, Amazon saying we're disappointed 0:02:51.320 --> 0:02:53.600 with the outcome of the election in Staten Island because 0:02:53.600 --> 0:02:56.919 we believe having a direct relationship with the company is 0:02:57.000 --> 0:03:01.639 best for employees. Were evaluating our options, including filing objections 0:03:01.680 --> 0:03:05.120 based on the inappropriate and undue influence by the n 0:03:05.240 --> 0:03:09.560 l r B that we and others witnessed in this election. 0:03:10.160 --> 0:03:12.880 When it sounds like Amazon is intending to make the 0:03:12.960 --> 0:03:16.840 argument that basically President Biden's pick to run the labor 0:03:16.880 --> 0:03:19.880 board swung list in an activist direction, does that argument 0:03:20.040 --> 0:03:28.040 hold water? I don't know about the the legal implications there, 0:03:28.080 --> 0:03:36.560 but historically, when we look at organizations and unionization attempts, 0:03:37.080 --> 0:03:45.120 the power imbalances in favor of organizations. So I would 0:03:45.160 --> 0:03:50.280 be surprised if that held a lot of water in court. 0:03:51.040 --> 0:03:54.200 But I wasn't on the ground. I didn't see what 0:03:54.240 --> 0:04:00.160 happens specifically in the distribution center. So what is your 0:04:00.440 --> 0:04:05.600 outlook on just how this could ripple across the United States, 0:04:05.600 --> 0:04:09.680 across other Amazon warehouses, but at other companies where employee 0:04:09.760 --> 0:04:11.800 employees could look at this and say maybe we should 0:04:11.800 --> 0:04:16.960 do this too. It could have enormous effects because Walmart 0:04:17.080 --> 0:04:21.400 and Amazon were the untouchable giants, and now they're not 0:04:21.520 --> 0:04:26.839 so untouchable. It's still an uphill climb for other Amazon 0:04:26.960 --> 0:04:31.520 distribution centers and other organizations. But the momentum is there, 0:04:31.640 --> 0:04:37.320 and we've seen the momentum continue through the the nation. 0:04:37.400 --> 0:04:40.680 I mean, we have movement at Starbucks, at ari I, 0:04:41.120 --> 0:04:45.760 at Conde Nast alphabet workers. So it's there and I 0:04:45.839 --> 0:04:49.240 don't see that this movement is going to go away 0:04:49.320 --> 0:04:54.120 soon now, Brad. At the same time, you're looking at 0:04:54.120 --> 0:04:57.880 a similar vote in Alabama. This is a do over 0:04:58.000 --> 0:05:01.719 vote because controversy around the first vote that one going 0:05:01.839 --> 0:05:04.320 at this point in the other direction. It's too close 0:05:04.360 --> 0:05:07.160 to call. It will likely be challenged. But so far 0:05:07.160 --> 0:05:09.559 in Alabama, it's looking like the Union is not coming 0:05:09.600 --> 0:05:16.120 out on top. Why why are we seeing different outcomes here? Well, 0:05:16.160 --> 0:05:18.880 I mean, I think look looking at Staten Island in 0:05:18.960 --> 0:05:21.840 New York City is probably pretty important. I mean, this 0:05:21.920 --> 0:05:24.680 is I think the second most unionized state after Hawaii, 0:05:24.720 --> 0:05:27.360 and in the country. New York cities have even higher 0:05:27.400 --> 0:05:30.719 Staaten Island probably even higher just in terms of union membership. 0:05:31.240 --> 0:05:33.280 You had a group here with Chris Smalls and as 0:05:33.320 --> 0:05:37.599 colleagues that employed the kind of community activists playbook in 0:05:37.680 --> 0:05:40.840 terms of using social media and getting arrested, a very 0:05:41.040 --> 0:05:46.800 very innovative UM playbook, and also speaking as former Amazon employees, 0:05:46.839 --> 0:05:49.320 So I think that had something to do with it. UM. 0:05:49.360 --> 0:05:51.680 I think I think Lin's right. There's some important, kind 0:05:51.680 --> 0:05:55.160 of symbolic victories here for a labor movement, an organized 0:05:55.200 --> 0:05:57.720 labor movement that's probably been losing ground over the past 0:05:57.720 --> 0:05:59.960 few decades just in terms of the sheer number of 0:06:00.080 --> 0:06:03.360 union members. But I still think it's it's too soon 0:06:03.440 --> 0:06:06.560 to say that the tide is really turning. I think Amazon, 0:06:06.680 --> 0:06:11.000 it has this immune system response to two unions in 0:06:11.080 --> 0:06:13.719 its supply chain, and it fights them to the nail. 0:06:14.040 --> 0:06:16.320 And I think probably workers at other fulfillment centers are 0:06:16.360 --> 0:06:19.440 going to be watching and waiting to see if Chris 0:06:19.440 --> 0:06:22.920 Smalls and his colleagues can convert today's important and very 0:06:22.920 --> 0:06:26.920 symbolic victory in the meaningful changes for Amazon workers. We're 0:06:26.920 --> 0:06:30.000 actually looking at video of Chris Small's popping a bottle 0:06:30.040 --> 0:06:34.359 of champagne on the back of this vote. Lynn, You know, 0:06:34.680 --> 0:06:38.600 do we need a character like that? If other pushes 0:06:38.600 --> 0:06:40.520 for organized labor in other parts of the country, at 0:06:40.560 --> 0:06:44.640 other Amazon warehouses, at other companies, is really going to succeed. 0:06:47.800 --> 0:06:52.200 I think the case of Chris Smalls is particularly interesting 0:06:52.240 --> 0:06:57.880 because he led that independent union. When we look at 0:06:58.600 --> 0:07:04.880 the tactics he used in terms of change management, coalition building, 0:07:05.000 --> 0:07:10.080 he's really smart. Amazon has a particular playbook that they 0:07:10.200 --> 0:07:15.760 use when it comes to fighting unions, and Christmas tactics 0:07:16.920 --> 0:07:22.040 kind of subverted them. It was really clever. It's the 0:07:22.120 --> 0:07:29.040 next step will be negotiating, which is going to take 0:07:29.080 --> 0:07:33.320 a lot of effort, a lot of resource allocation, um, 0:07:33.520 --> 0:07:40.800 so the transition to that process will be harder. But 0:07:41.960 --> 0:07:47.040 he seems to be focusing on participation and bringing the 0:07:47.040 --> 0:07:51.520 workers involvement in so if he continues to do that, 0:07:51.600 --> 0:07:55.600 he could be very successful. Brad, what kind of roadblocks 0:07:55.680 --> 0:08:02.920 do you think Amazon will throw up next here and elsewhere? Boy, 0:08:03.000 --> 0:08:06.800 we we we probably can't even conceive of what they'll 0:08:06.840 --> 0:08:09.960 resort to. If you look back across the arc of 0:08:10.000 --> 0:08:13.600 Amazon history. They've shut down facilities, They've walked away from 0:08:13.560 --> 0:08:17.040 the scissist facilities that have even attempted to organize. I 0:08:17.360 --> 0:08:21.120 don't think in under Andy Jasse, Amazon can or will 0:08:21.200 --> 0:08:23.800 do that, although you know, Frankly, a couple of years ago, 0:08:24.320 --> 0:08:26.600 they shut down, as you remember Emily h the HQ 0:08:26.760 --> 0:08:30.200 two project in Long Island City because basically it had 0:08:30.240 --> 0:08:34.400 become about unions, and mayor at the time Bill Deblasio said, uh, 0:08:34.720 --> 0:08:37.200 New York City is a union town. Amazon, You're gonna 0:08:37.200 --> 0:08:39.280 have to accept it. And they and the next day 0:08:39.320 --> 0:08:42.720 they close shop. So but you know, Jesse is a 0:08:42.760 --> 0:08:45.000 little bit of a different CEO than Bezos. I don't 0:08:45.000 --> 0:08:47.080 think they'll do that, but I think they'll fight tooth 0:08:47.080 --> 0:08:49.720 and nail. I think these legal objections are just the beginning. 0:08:50.200 --> 0:08:54.640 I think, uh, bargaining tooth and nail for for everything 0:08:55.120 --> 0:08:58.200 um with Chris Malt and his colleagues. We can certainly 0:08:58.440 --> 0:09:01.319 anticipate that and maybe don't reach a contract, and maybe 0:09:01.320 --> 0:09:05.160 there's a strike and maybe Amazon resorts to replacement labor 0:09:05.440 --> 0:09:07.680 and we have a big battle with the world watching. 0:09:07.840 --> 0:09:11.640 I really don't think they're going to allow Smalls and 0:09:11.880 --> 0:09:14.679 his union to kind of set an example because they 0:09:14.720 --> 0:09:16.679 do view it as a little bit of an existential 0:09:16.760 --> 0:09:19.319 challenge for the company and the relationship they have with 0:09:19.400 --> 0:09:22.440 their million plus workers. Lann, I see you nodding your 0:09:22.440 --> 0:09:25.480 head in agreement with what Brad is saying here. What 0:09:25.559 --> 0:09:33.280 do you think comes next from Amazon? I I think 0:09:33.280 --> 0:09:38.319 they are going to fight to snything I'll just was said. Um, 0:09:38.400 --> 0:09:43.280 so they the location offers some challenges and benefits. Mean 0:09:43.320 --> 0:09:47.160 they are it's in a pro labor town in a 0:09:47.280 --> 0:09:52.400 pro labor state. Uh that, and they have a lot 0:09:52.559 --> 0:09:55.680 invested in the area. They have multiple distribution centers, would 0:09:55.679 --> 0:10:00.280 be hard to shut those down easily. That being said, 0:10:00.600 --> 0:10:04.640 they are in a large urban area with a greater 0:10:05.480 --> 0:10:13.000 labor supply possibility. So it's they have some things going 0:10:13.360 --> 0:10:15.400 for them in against them. Will be interesting to see 0:10:15.400 --> 0:10:18.120 what they choose to do. While the scale of this 0:10:18.400 --> 0:10:22.160 is certainly potentially massive, Amazon employing one and a half 0:10:22.280 --> 0:10:28.040 million workers in the United States alone. Lynn Vincent, assistant 0:10:28.040 --> 0:10:30.120 Professor at the M. J. Whitman School of Management at 0:10:30.120 --> 0:10:34.200 Syracuse University, along with our own senior executive editor Rad Stone, 0:10:34.240 --> 0:10:37.240 thank you. Both will continue to follow Sticking with Amazon, 0:10:37.320 --> 0:10:40.200 The tech giant gave CEO Andy Jase a pay package 0:10:40.240 --> 0:10:42.880 worth two hundred twelve million dollars last year. Almost all 0:10:42.920 --> 0:10:45.920 of that came in a stock award sixty one thousand shares. 0:10:46.320 --> 0:10:50.800 Those vests between next year and one. Jesse took over 0:10:50.880 --> 0:10:55.560 from Amazon founder Jeff Bezos back in July. Coming up, 0:10:55.679 --> 0:10:59.160 Apple's four into fintech, how the iPhone maker plans to 0:10:59.200 --> 0:11:01.640 develop its own pay it's processing technology, and what it 0:11:01.679 --> 0:11:04.280 all means for the rest of the fintech world. Next, 0:11:04.640 --> 0:11:36.880 Mrs Bloomberg, you soon may be able to pay for 0:11:36.920 --> 0:11:40.000 your iPhone or other Apple hardware in the same way 0:11:40.080 --> 0:11:42.800 that you pay for I Cloud, Apple TV Plus, or 0:11:42.840 --> 0:11:46.600 Apple Music. Apples working on a secret project to create 0:11:46.640 --> 0:11:49.920 an iPhone subscription service that would allow users to pay 0:11:49.960 --> 0:11:53.040 for their phone monthly via their app Store account. This 0:11:53.080 --> 0:11:56.600 would differ from normal Apple and carrier insolvent plans, as 0:11:56.640 --> 0:11:59.760 the feet would be a proprietary price based on which 0:11:59.800 --> 0:12:02.720 I phone model the user chose, versus just the cost 0:12:02.760 --> 0:12:05.160 of the device, divide it up by twelve or twenty 0:12:05.200 --> 0:12:08.600 four months. As part of the initiative, Apple would let 0:12:08.600 --> 0:12:12.040 iPhone users replace their model each year. As new versions 0:12:12.040 --> 0:12:15.480 are released over time. Of course, the recurring revenue would 0:12:15.480 --> 0:12:18.080 generate even more money for Apple, but it would also 0:12:18.120 --> 0:12:21.320 allow consumers to get new iPhones were frequently and not 0:12:21.480 --> 0:12:23.840 have to pay a thousand dollars outright for a new 0:12:23.920 --> 0:12:28.120 high end model. Apple has also internally discussed tying the 0:12:28.160 --> 0:12:31.959 program to Apple one its services bundles that include TV Plus, 0:12:32.240 --> 0:12:36.520 Apple Music, Cloud Storage, News, Fitness Plus, and more, in 0:12:36.559 --> 0:12:41.280 addition to Apple Care technical support plans. Similarly, Apples also 0:12:41.320 --> 0:12:44.400 working on a widespread by now pay lead service for 0:12:44.440 --> 0:12:48.080 Apple Pay it All goes to plan, Apple could launch 0:12:48.080 --> 0:12:54.480 the hardware subscription service later or sometime. I'm Mark German. 0:12:54.840 --> 0:13:01.160 This is power On, Mark German air for Bloomberg and 0:13:01.160 --> 0:13:03.600 don't forget to sign up for his weekly newsletter power 0:13:03.640 --> 0:13:07.800 On at Bloomberg dot com. Seeking with Apple, Bloomberg and 0:13:07.800 --> 0:13:10.559 Mark reporting earlier this week that the Iphonemaker is developing 0:13:10.600 --> 0:13:15.560 its own payments processing technology and infrastructure for future financial products. 0:13:15.800 --> 0:13:18.400 To talk about that and other fintech news, I want 0:13:18.440 --> 0:13:21.320 to bring in Jackie Racist, CEO and founder of post 0:13:21.480 --> 0:13:24.640 House Capital. Jackie, great to have you back with us. 0:13:24.640 --> 0:13:27.120 I'm curious what you're I'm curious. What your read is 0:13:27.520 --> 0:13:31.880 on Apple digging even deeper into the financial services world 0:13:31.920 --> 0:13:35.559 and what this means for other fintech players, Well, I'm 0:13:35.600 --> 0:13:38.800 not at all surprised. I mean, for a few reasons. First, 0:13:38.840 --> 0:13:43.320 they process hundreds of billions of dollars worts of payments 0:13:43.360 --> 0:13:46.560 throughout the entire Apple ecosystem, and so the skill with 0:13:46.640 --> 0:13:50.560 which they operate is extraordinary for any type of payment 0:13:50.640 --> 0:13:54.120 system to run throughout their network. The second thing is 0:13:54.480 --> 0:13:57.320 they've been in payments for eight years and they've already 0:13:57.320 --> 0:14:02.000 shown interest in launching both himen and credit products. And 0:14:02.080 --> 0:14:05.439 what they're doing in particular with pay and for for example, 0:14:06.240 --> 0:14:10.719 is enabling consumers to just buy in another form. So 0:14:10.880 --> 0:14:13.360 it's a tender type, meaning it's a type of money 0:14:13.480 --> 0:14:16.480 that you can use. And what they do is make 0:14:16.520 --> 0:14:20.480 it easier to pay with your device and pay over 0:14:20.840 --> 0:14:23.600 a period of time. That makes it easier for consumers 0:14:23.600 --> 0:14:27.320 to control their monthly spend. And so it obviously is 0:14:27.320 --> 0:14:31.760 helpful because from Apple's point of view, it creates engagement. 0:14:31.920 --> 0:14:36.000 It creates this relationship even after a transaction, because the 0:14:36.080 --> 0:14:39.920 servicing relationship for a pay and four enables them to 0:14:40.040 --> 0:14:43.280 continue to build a relationship with a consumer on their phone. 0:14:43.680 --> 0:14:46.760 So there's tons of utility there, both for the consumer 0:14:47.040 --> 0:14:50.240 who wants to control monthly expenses, as well as for 0:14:50.280 --> 0:14:52.680 Apple who wants to continue to dig a little bit 0:14:52.720 --> 0:14:57.280 deeper into the consumer's wallet. Who does this hurt the most? 0:14:57.360 --> 0:15:01.160 What does it mean for a PayPal for example. I 0:15:01.200 --> 0:15:03.720 don't think it's gonna hurt anybody. I think it is 0:15:03.760 --> 0:15:06.880 a new form factor and way to pay, and you'll 0:15:06.920 --> 0:15:10.920 see it proliferate across while it's everywhere, and so you'll 0:15:10.960 --> 0:15:14.280 see the credit card providers do it, You'll see specialists 0:15:14.720 --> 0:15:19.640 do it, like a firm after pay Klarna, and I 0:15:19.680 --> 0:15:23.240 think you'll see it as just another payment vehicle for 0:15:23.360 --> 0:15:27.800 consumers to use. And so maybe it changes the whether 0:15:27.920 --> 0:15:31.480 someone uses debit, whether they use credit, or they use 0:15:31.520 --> 0:15:34.640 a digital form factor. But it's just another way to 0:15:34.720 --> 0:15:39.040 expand the relationship and continue to give options amongst all 0:15:39.040 --> 0:15:43.240 of their products. We've seen a number of fintech stocks 0:15:43.280 --> 0:15:45.360 take up beating this quarter. I mean we're looking at 0:15:45.360 --> 0:15:47.640 a lot of red on the screen. There a firm. 0:15:47.680 --> 0:15:49.360 I know you're on the board of a firm PayPal, 0:15:49.560 --> 0:15:52.520 so Fi Block he used to work at Square for 0:15:52.600 --> 0:15:56.840 many years. Why do you think fintech in particular is 0:15:56.880 --> 0:16:00.600 taking this I know there's a broader down market. Fintech 0:16:00.600 --> 0:16:04.200 seems to be taking it pretty hard, you know it. 0:16:04.520 --> 0:16:10.640 Fintech had an unbelievable series of years between one where 0:16:10.880 --> 0:16:17.400 funding and valuations reached fairly heady heights, and so you 0:16:17.480 --> 0:16:21.280 see a reset back to valuations that are more standardized 0:16:21.320 --> 0:16:25.320 levels of valuations. Particularly given the growth of these companies, 0:16:25.600 --> 0:16:29.000 I think you'll always see them operate with disruptive multiples, 0:16:29.080 --> 0:16:32.400 meaning they'll operate with multiples that are higher than the 0:16:32.600 --> 0:16:37.040 non technically advanced companies in the payments and financial sector. 0:16:37.520 --> 0:16:41.440 But they came back to a more sustainable multiple level 0:16:41.680 --> 0:16:46.160 in this overall market reset. Having said that, the private 0:16:46.200 --> 0:16:51.280 market also reset, and uh in one alone, you saw 0:16:51.480 --> 0:16:59.920 sixty increase in crypto investments, you saw a similar increase 0:17:00.240 --> 0:17:03.920 in fintech investing, and all of that had reached a 0:17:04.040 --> 0:17:09.960 level of valuations and um levels of interest that really 0:17:10.000 --> 0:17:12.280 had peaked, and it just kind of came back to earth. 0:17:12.440 --> 0:17:15.520 I still see huge opportunities in this sector. It's one 0:17:15.560 --> 0:17:18.040 of the biggest sectors in the United States and around 0:17:18.040 --> 0:17:21.200 the world, and it's a sector where the traditional companies 0:17:21.240 --> 0:17:24.520 that operate in this market are for the majority of 0:17:24.560 --> 0:17:28.440 the public companies over fifty years and older as companies, 0:17:28.480 --> 0:17:32.560 and so there's incredible opportunity to be disruptive in this space. 0:17:33.119 --> 0:17:36.879 So I still see lots of opportunity and lots of investment. UM. 0:17:36.920 --> 0:17:40.159 Even today, you're an investor in the crypto market, and 0:17:40.200 --> 0:17:44.000 I'm so curious how you're thinking about DEFY an adoption trends. 0:17:44.040 --> 0:17:46.920 The Inner Information just came out with a pretty explosive 0:17:46.960 --> 0:17:51.159 headline talking about entries and Horowitz versus Jack Dorsey and 0:17:51.200 --> 0:17:56.119 the crypto quote unquote holy war that is brewing. Okay, 0:17:56.160 --> 0:18:00.119 I think that's a little dramatic. Having said that, UM, 0:18:00.160 --> 0:18:04.600 it is entertaining. UM. I think Defy is fascinating because 0:18:04.720 --> 0:18:08.040 it changes the paradigm of who controls and who owns 0:18:08.080 --> 0:18:11.679 companies and who who operates them, and so I do 0:18:11.800 --> 0:18:16.280 think there's an opportunity to expand the aperture of how 0:18:16.320 --> 0:18:19.800 these companies are run and created. I also think we're 0:18:19.840 --> 0:18:23.520 only in the first inning of DEFY. We really are 0:18:23.560 --> 0:18:27.680 seeing tons of experimentation, whether it be an infrastructure or 0:18:27.720 --> 0:18:31.760 even in vertical products, but you haven't really seen use 0:18:31.840 --> 0:18:36.440 cases come to fruition and build significant scale companies where 0:18:36.480 --> 0:18:40.280 you're seeing the broader use cases used in consumers day 0:18:40.320 --> 0:18:43.600 and day outlives. But the experimentation that's out there is 0:18:43.600 --> 0:18:47.160 pretty exciting and I think it, along with the rest 0:18:47.160 --> 0:18:50.399 of the crypto market and the fintech market, continues to 0:18:50.480 --> 0:18:54.120 show the level of interest in investing in this area 0:18:54.320 --> 0:18:58.399 of of the United States economy. Jackie, before you go, 0:18:58.440 --> 0:19:00.480 I want to ask you quickly about your new book, 0:19:00.720 --> 0:19:04.080 Self Made Boss, which you co wrote and you talk 0:19:04.240 --> 0:19:09.199 to entrepreneurs, owners of small and medium businesses. Really you 0:19:09.240 --> 0:19:10.959 know some of your customers when you were working at 0:19:10.960 --> 0:19:16.640 Square Capital. What was the catalyst for this quickly um 0:19:16.800 --> 0:19:20.119 catalysts is small businesses need help to start, run and 0:19:20.160 --> 0:19:23.040 grow their business. They are half of the economy two 0:19:23.080 --> 0:19:26.280 thirds of job growth in the United States. Lauren Weinberg, 0:19:26.320 --> 0:19:29.280 my co author, and I really saw the need to 0:19:29.320 --> 0:19:33.120 create a pragmatic guide to help small businesses build their 0:19:33.119 --> 0:19:36.679 companies through feedback from other small businesses, and it's a 0:19:36.680 --> 0:19:39.640 helpful tool to help them again start run and grow 0:19:39.680 --> 0:19:46.119 their business. Jackie reesis post House Capital and new author 0:19:46.320 --> 0:19:48.520 Self Made Boss. You can check it out on Amazon. 0:19:48.600 --> 0:20:00.520 Thank you, Jackie. For joining us. Welcome back to Blow Technology. 0:20:00.520 --> 0:20:03.880 I'm emily changing in San Francisco. Potentially huge news from 0:20:03.880 --> 0:20:07.280 Twitter today or is it news at all? Twitter tweeting 0:20:07.800 --> 0:20:11.359 that the company is working on an edit button. Then again, 0:20:11.800 --> 0:20:13.960 it's April fools Day? Ed what do you think? Is 0:20:13.960 --> 0:20:16.960 it a joke? Reminding you m all day long it's 0:20:17.000 --> 0:20:20.159 April Fool's Day. This is a joke, right, this is 0:20:20.160 --> 0:20:22.600 what the people want, but clearly this is a joke. 0:20:22.680 --> 0:20:25.000 This is what I want. But I'm guessing this is 0:20:25.000 --> 0:20:30.960 a joke. Unfortunately Twitter has resisted for years and edit button, right, 0:20:31.040 --> 0:20:33.000 so why would they do it now? And on April 0:20:33.000 --> 0:20:35.760 Fool's Day? Give us the edit button? And even investors 0:20:35.800 --> 0:20:41.280 think it's a joke because chet check. All right, well, 0:20:41.040 --> 0:20:44.160 well we'll have to see tomorrow. And yes, you were 0:20:44.160 --> 0:20:47.640 the one preparing all of us not to fall for it. Um, 0:20:47.680 --> 0:20:49.560 all right, i'd boodlow. Thank you. I want to talk 0:20:49.600 --> 0:20:53.520 more about Chinese tech sos rallying now with Race Capital 0:20:53.560 --> 0:20:56.119 partner Edith Young. If first of all, what do you 0:20:56.160 --> 0:20:59.560 make of the Chinese government potentially taking a really unprecedented 0:20:59.560 --> 0:21:03.640 step by that's given how secretive and protective the government 0:21:03.720 --> 0:21:07.480 is about its own companies. Well, I hope this is 0:21:07.520 --> 0:21:13.320 not a April four jokes from from the Chinese authority UM. 0:21:13.359 --> 0:21:16.040 Who knows they also have a sense of humor as well. 0:21:16.280 --> 0:21:20.240 Point And I think, you know, obviously, you know, based 0:21:20.280 --> 0:21:23.160 on what you and I just discussed, you know, it's 0:21:23.240 --> 0:21:26.359 it's amazing to see to Stoff really rally up this morning. 0:21:26.560 --> 0:21:28.879 And you know, for the last twelve months all the 0:21:28.960 --> 0:21:32.760 Chinese stock and the two plus companies been under a 0:21:32.760 --> 0:21:35.800 lot of pressure and haven't been It's just been a really, 0:21:35.800 --> 0:21:37.760 really tough time for them. So I think like this 0:21:37.800 --> 0:21:41.040 particular announcement UM, from from my point of view, is 0:21:41.400 --> 0:21:45.040 the three implication. One is it's amazing to see the 0:21:45.160 --> 0:21:49.600 Chinese authority is willing to work with UM, the US 0:21:49.720 --> 0:21:52.639 to potentially open this up. We will see how it 0:21:52.680 --> 0:21:54.919 goes during the summer. But this is really at the 0:21:55.040 --> 0:21:58.760 government level UM in terms of cooperations, sort of amazing 0:21:58.800 --> 0:22:02.400 to see. And in this particular implication, in some sense 0:22:02.400 --> 0:22:05.280 it's very historic because it's been a lot of pushback, 0:22:05.680 --> 0:22:09.000 you know, for many, many years. So number two is 0:22:09.280 --> 0:22:13.439 it's great news for the listed companies because compagned market 0:22:13.440 --> 0:22:16.600 cap is almost over two point one trillion that we're 0:22:16.600 --> 0:22:21.000 talking about is really nervous for many many other investors, 0:22:21.000 --> 0:22:24.119 for for all the CEOs in the public listed companies. 0:22:24.160 --> 0:22:27.000 So now it's you know, the Chinese authorities are willing 0:22:27.080 --> 0:22:29.399 to sort of really sort of lead the charge. So 0:22:29.520 --> 0:22:32.680 it's that's great news. And number three, from the point 0:22:32.680 --> 0:22:35.400 of view from a startups, there's so many different startups 0:22:35.880 --> 0:22:39.720 really been wanting to go I p O in the US, 0:22:39.880 --> 0:22:42.240 and now there's light at the end of the tunnel, 0:22:42.280 --> 0:22:45.000 so it's great news overall. And last but not least, 0:22:45.000 --> 0:22:48.920 I still have family and friends. Now is under complete lockdown, 0:22:49.240 --> 0:22:54.040 particularly in Shanghai now and it's just so bad. So economically, 0:22:54.320 --> 0:22:57.480 we really need some good news in China. Well. So 0:22:57.600 --> 0:22:59.879 I wonder if this is going to be part of 0:22:59.880 --> 0:23:02.480 a longer term strategy, given that the Chinese government has 0:23:02.520 --> 0:23:05.800 been cracking down on its own tech companies for months 0:23:05.880 --> 0:23:08.919 upon months now, are we going to see a broader 0:23:09.280 --> 0:23:15.359 easing up? Um? I really hope. So it's I don't 0:23:15.560 --> 0:23:18.560 I'm definitely not qualified to a comment on you know, 0:23:18.720 --> 0:23:21.320 what Chinese authority and government would do, but one thing 0:23:21.359 --> 0:23:24.560 for sure, I think that Chinese government really wants to 0:23:25.080 --> 0:23:29.280 know support the economy um, and think what happened without 0:23:29.359 --> 0:23:32.080 at the end grouped or of course it's not purely 0:23:32.160 --> 0:23:35.679 just for regulatory with with ATTACH or or or or 0:23:35.720 --> 0:23:39.879 the fintech so sectors. It's just overall. I think the 0:23:39.920 --> 0:23:44.200 whole economy because of COVID has been been, um really 0:23:44.200 --> 0:23:46.600 going through self tough times. And I think right now 0:23:46.640 --> 0:23:49.600 the government really wants to sort of help and push 0:23:49.880 --> 0:23:52.960 this along. And at least you know, for us from 0:23:53.000 --> 0:23:56.560 from an early stage investor, and that's from a startup 0:23:56.600 --> 0:23:59.280 point of view, this is really really good news and 0:23:59.320 --> 0:24:01.959 I think they really wanted helped it, not to suppress it. 0:24:02.920 --> 0:24:06.720 So what is your assessment now whether investors should be 0:24:07.280 --> 0:24:11.320 getting into or staying in Chinese tech stocks public companies, 0:24:11.440 --> 0:24:15.159 and whether Chinese companies in general are smart from a 0:24:15.160 --> 0:24:19.560 private market or venture capitalist investment perspective as well? Then well, 0:24:19.600 --> 0:24:22.120 I think like from my private market, um, there are 0:24:22.160 --> 0:24:25.400 many many areas. It's a little bit more. I don't 0:24:25.400 --> 0:24:28.159 know one I want you go from healthcare or signmi 0:24:28.240 --> 0:24:32.880 conductors um or any sort of electric cars. And you know, frankly, 0:24:33.160 --> 0:24:35.760 China has been the one of the fastest growing market 0:24:35.800 --> 0:24:39.320 for companies like Tesla, so China actually as a whole 0:24:39.440 --> 0:24:42.359 is still the one of the second largest in terms 0:24:42.400 --> 0:24:46.479 of um GDP in the world, So it's a huge market, 0:24:46.840 --> 0:24:48.680 and I think as much as so the ten Cent 0:24:48.880 --> 0:24:51.280 and end group of the world or Buy Do. Seems 0:24:51.320 --> 0:24:54.280 like the stock PLA hasn't been done so great, but 0:24:54.280 --> 0:24:57.760 but still is huge, huge in terms of user base. 0:24:57.920 --> 0:25:01.159 And I'm so really really bull about the Chinese market. 0:25:01.720 --> 0:25:04.439 We can predict what Chinese government wants to do, but 0:25:04.520 --> 0:25:06.920 at the same time, just in terms of the health 0:25:07.040 --> 0:25:10.680 and the future of the economy is still really really bright. 0:25:10.760 --> 0:25:14.400 So in general, I take a very positive attitude. Now 0:25:14.440 --> 0:25:17.120 I want to turn the crypto now because you've backed 0:25:17.600 --> 0:25:21.040 some of the biggest crypto names out there yet Salona 0:25:21.440 --> 0:25:24.960 f t X. Why do you think we're seeing such 0:25:25.880 --> 0:25:28.320 hesitance on the part of public market investors to double 0:25:28.359 --> 0:25:31.800 down on crypto amidst this broader market downturn. There was 0:25:31.800 --> 0:25:36.399 a thought that cryptocurrencies could potentially be decoupled from traditional equities, 0:25:36.400 --> 0:25:40.560 but we're not really seeing that. Well. I actually, I mean, 0:25:40.600 --> 0:25:43.080 I guess it really depends on the day. Um Emily, 0:25:43.080 --> 0:25:46.200