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Speaker 1: The views and opinions expressed in this podcast are solely

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Speaker 1: those of the podcast author or individuals participating in the podcast,

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Speaker 1: and do not represent those of iHeartMedia, Tenderfoot TV, or

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Speaker 1: their employees. This podcast also contained subject matter which may

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Speaker 1: not be suitable for everyone. Listener discretion is advised.

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Speaker 2: I don't know if it's possible to create a monster,

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Speaker 2: but this is what happens. He had a difficult childhoods

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Speaker 2: in a negative and viomence, but it is not enough

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Speaker 2: to explain what he became twas a man who took

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Speaker 2: pleasure to hurt everything around him. He in shot, causing

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Speaker 2: pain to others. It was his way to take revenge

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Speaker 2: on what he believed life had done to him. On

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Speaker 2: top of that, yet no feeling whatsoever of other people.

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Speaker 2: It was what they call a perfect psychopaths.

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Speaker 3: A psychopath is somebody who understands emotions.

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Speaker 4: And I told them it is a very exceptional that

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Speaker 4: somebody abducts two children at the same time.

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Speaker 3: Told have been the yen of it in nineteen and six,

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Speaker 3: but my god, it was just a beginning.

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Speaker 5: I think Belgium was a paralyzed for perverts in those days.

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Speaker 6: Welcome to La Monstra. I'm your host, Matt Graves. The

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Speaker 6: arrest of Mark de True and his accomplices led to

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Speaker 6: the incredible rescue of Sabine Darden and Letitia d LEAs

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Speaker 6: and the shocking discovery of the conditions of their captivity.

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Speaker 6: An entire country was rocked by these crimes, but four

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Speaker 6: young girls were still missing, their families desperate for answers.

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Speaker 4: This basement and the crimes committed here have made this

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Speaker 4: house notorious. Every Belgian knows about Marked Truth's chamber of horrors,

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Speaker 4: that they must come here and see.

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Speaker 6: What we knew at the time was only the tip

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Speaker 6: of the iceberg of this unbelievable story. But who was

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Speaker 6: Marked a True and how did he get away with

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Speaker 6: kidnapping kids for so long? His story begins in Brussels,

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Speaker 6: in a neighborhood I know well, less than two miles

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Speaker 6: away from where I'm sitting today. Da Truth's parents hadn't

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Speaker 6: been together very long, and his father later claimed that

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Speaker 6: he thought Mark wasn't his biological son. Da True later

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Speaker 6: described his father as an agitated and unstable man and

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Speaker 6: his mother as calculating, selfish, and devious. Both parents were teachers,

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Speaker 6: and the family spent a short spell in a hours

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Speaker 6: and what was called the Belgian Congo at the time.

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Speaker 6: You may recall from episode one that I interviewed a

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Speaker 6: profiler named Karen Hutzebau who established a profile of the

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Speaker 6: type of person she believed police should be looking for

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Speaker 6: after Julian Melissa disappeared. She had some fascinating things to

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Speaker 6: say about the Tru's life during that interview. What can

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Speaker 6: you tell us about the Truth?

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Speaker 4: It's a narcisstic personality, that's first, okay, he was the

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Speaker 4: first born, and he's even born in Congo, the colony

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Speaker 4: of Belgium at the time.

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Speaker 6: A quick note to correct this small error. The True

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Speaker 6: was actually born in Brussels, but moved to Congo shortly afterwards.

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Speaker 4: And I know people personally who were also in Congo

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Speaker 4: at that time and who told me that the father

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Speaker 4: of Mardu True. They called him Loma, the man with

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Speaker 4: the big how do you say in English? He just

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Speaker 4: jumped on everything that moved his father, his father, And

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Speaker 4: when he came into the house of my witness, when

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Speaker 4: he came in his mother to call her children and

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Speaker 4: said stay here, all of you, everybody was terrified of

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Speaker 4: the father.

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Speaker 7: Of the Truth.

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Speaker 4: On the other hand, the Truth Mark was over protected

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Speaker 4: by his mother correct and already when they were back

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Speaker 4: in Belgium, the Truth had become kind of the.

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Speaker 7: Leader of the tribe.

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Speaker 4: So you can make psychopaths in two ways by too

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Speaker 4: much violence during childhood, physical violence, emotional violence, sexual violence,

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Speaker 4: name it or and they are worse the children that

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Speaker 4: are are overprotected because they will never ever take responsibility

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Speaker 4: for their own wrongdoing.

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Speaker 7: It is always somebody else's fault.

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Speaker 4: These are the man when they are older and they

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Speaker 4: rape a girl or they kill a girl, it was

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Speaker 4: her fault.

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Speaker 7: It's always somebody else's.

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Speaker 6: Do you think that, because apparently, just from what I've

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Speaker 6: read that Mark the True his father was violent.

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Speaker 7: That's part of it. He was mother overprotecting and mother

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Speaker 7: was overproductive.

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Speaker 6: So when you talked about the formation of a psychopath,

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Speaker 6: you said, you know, can go two ways. One is

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Speaker 6: extreme violence and another is overprotection. Would you think that

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Speaker 6: he had both? Do you think Mark the True had both?

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Speaker 6: What is it that you think made him? Is it

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Speaker 6: more the protection of his mother or the violence.

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Speaker 7: Combination of both, that's a combination of Yeah.

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Speaker 4: Probably each time he has been hit by his father

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Speaker 4: or maybe raped who will tell he sought protection by

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Speaker 4: his mother and she gave it to him.

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Speaker 7: Anyway, it is. It is very confusing upbringing.

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Speaker 4: It's not an excuse, but it explains that these people

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Speaker 4: and their way of thinking of things and lacking humanity,

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Speaker 4: how that comes. They say that children are born that way.

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Speaker 4: That is not true. You know, I've seen too many

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Speaker 4: criminals and child killers, and I do not judge them.

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Speaker 4: I judge their acts. So I always have very good

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Speaker 4: contact with him. Why did you?

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Speaker 7: I can be very harsh with them.

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Speaker 4: One of the offenders I have in treatment and I

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Speaker 4: film this life and it starts explaining to me, Yeah, well,

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Speaker 4: what happened?

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Speaker 7: You know the things that happened?

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Speaker 4: I say, what what are you saying?

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Speaker 7: We are the things that I said happened? No, no,

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Speaker 7: I know, I know the things I did. Ah, now

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Speaker 7: we're talking.

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Speaker 4: They really I get out of my mind if they

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Speaker 4: use where it happened?

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Speaker 7: You know what happens.

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Speaker 4: A storm can happen, an earthquake can happen, you know,

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Speaker 4: things of nature can happen. But this is nothing that

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Speaker 4: is not something that happens. This is something you did,

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Speaker 4: You decided to do, and you liked to do it.

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Speaker 4: And all those psychchatter definitions of disorder. It's bullshit, they

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Speaker 4: all tell me after six months of therapy.

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Speaker 7: I did it because I like to do it.

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Speaker 6: Upon their return from the Congo that the True family

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Speaker 6: settled in the gritty working class region around the city

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Speaker 6: of Charlware in Belgium. Charlottlah is a difficult place to

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Speaker 6: explain to people who haven't been there. It flourished economically

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Speaker 6: during the Industrial Revolution, with a huge build up of

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Speaker 6: steel and mining industries and an influx of migrants from

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Speaker 6: across Europe. After the nineteen fifties, it went from boomtown

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Speaker 6: to gloomtown, and factories were shuttered and unemployment skyrocketed. Its

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Speaker 6: nickname became Lepaignoire, or the Black Country. With the gloomy

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Speaker 6: remnants of industrial decay, the regions parked marked with shuttered mines, mills,

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Speaker 6: and spoiltips polluting the landscape. Crime flourished in the sixties

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Speaker 6: and seventies, and the name Charlevaugh soon became synonymous with

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Speaker 6: organized crime and corruption. Marke de True grew up as

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Speaker 6: a child of the sixties in this region, not the

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Speaker 6: flowery sixties of peace and love, but a much darker

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Speaker 6: existence his grade school teachers described him as undisciplined and intolerable.

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Speaker 6: He got caught stealing from one of his schools, from

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Speaker 6: which he was expelled, and was later kicked out of

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Speaker 6: another school for selling pornographic pictures to other students. His

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Speaker 6: mother said he was always trying to profit from something

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Speaker 6: and described him as quote dominating people with less personality

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Speaker 6: and never expressing any feelings whatsoever unquote. In nineteen seventy one,

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Speaker 6: his parents divorced, and at some point after that, his

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Speaker 6: mother started seeing a young man who had apparently been

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Speaker 6: one of her students. You'll remember from the last episode

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Speaker 6: that I was able to interview the True's lawyer, Ronnie Bodwin.

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Speaker 6: I asked him to share what he could about where

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Speaker 6: things started to go wrong with Mark Detrue when he

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Speaker 6: was young.

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Speaker 8: I think that, you know, the main turning point in

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Speaker 8: his youthful life was at the time that he must

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Speaker 8: have been like fifteen years old and his mother started

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Speaker 8: a relationship with one of her students who was like seventeen, okay,

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Speaker 8: And he is always returning to that point as could

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Speaker 8: not accept first of all, that his parents were going

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Speaker 8: to split up. Secondly, he then got confronted with some

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Speaker 8: kind of stepdad who was barely older than he was

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Speaker 8: at that time. And that's also why he explains that,

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Speaker 8: for instance, he is different than his younger brothers and

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Speaker 8: sisters because they were younger. The age difference between those

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Speaker 8: brothers and sisters was bigger towards the student with whom

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Speaker 8: his mother was supposed to have relationship, and therefore they

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Speaker 8: didn't live that the same way. Yes, there was a

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Speaker 8: new man in the house, and that new man should

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Speaker 8: have been him, and it was somebody else who was

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Speaker 8: barely older than he was.

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Speaker 6: This was obviously an important turning point into True's life,

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Speaker 6: which ended up with him leaving home at the age

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Speaker 6: of sixteen. We don't know a whole lot about this

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Speaker 6: time of his life. It's rumored that he lived for

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Speaker 6: a while with an older pedophile and that he got

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Speaker 6: involved with male prostitution. He worked on and off as

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Speaker 6: a mechanic while developing his skills as a small time criminal.

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Speaker 6: In nineteen seventy nine, he was convicted of theft and

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Speaker 6: spent three months in prison. His favorite hobby was ice skating.

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Speaker 6: In the early eighties, he started to spend more and

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Speaker 6: more time at ice rinks On several occasions, he was

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Speaker 6: kicked out of rinks for purposely causing girls to fall

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Speaker 6: down and then fondling them while helping them up. At

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Speaker 6: the age of twenty, he met a seventeen year old

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Speaker 6: orphan named Francoise Dubois, and the two got married. They

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Speaker 6: had two children together, but the relationship was troubled from

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Speaker 6: the start, and Francoise accused Mark of beating her. While

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Speaker 6: his wife was pregnant, Mark continued to hang out at

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Speaker 6: ice rinks, where he met a young woman named Michel Martin.

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Speaker 6: He divorced his first wife in nineteen eighty three, and

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Speaker 6: then Michele moved in with him and they had a

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Speaker 6: boy together in nineteen eighty four. All the while he

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Speaker 6: got deeper in the crime, from stealing cars to shaking

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Speaker 6: down elderly women. He also started traveling to Slovakia for

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Speaker 6: various shady dealings. While there, he was accused of raping

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Speaker 6: two teenage girls and also brought young Slovakian girls with

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Speaker 6: him back to Belgium. His wife, Michelle Martin, was aware

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Speaker 6: of these rapes and even assisted Mark in tricking victims

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Speaker 6: and filming the crimes.

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Speaker 8: To me the moment he met Michelle Martin, she was like,

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Speaker 8: I don't know whether I pronounced it right. By the catalisator.

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Speaker 8: You know, for instance, if you want to put a

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Speaker 8: piece of sugar on fire, you will not succeed. But

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Speaker 8: if you put some ashes which has already burned on

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Speaker 8: the piece of sugar and you put your match to it,

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Speaker 8: it will take fire. And that's exactly what happened. Those

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Speaker 8: two met and by themselves they were a potential danger

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Speaker 8: most probably, but it's only by meeting and coming together

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Speaker 8: that suddenly the danger really got out. Indeed, people forget

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Speaker 8: or tend to forget that she was taking the pictures,

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Speaker 8: that she was filming it on camera and stuff like that.

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Speaker 8: She was involved right from the very first moment. So

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Speaker 8: it's not like she was an innocent bystander. I know.

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Speaker 8: I've studied the file and I've studied, amongst other things,

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Speaker 8: I've studied the relationship between them both, and I'm sure

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Speaker 8: that at that time it was possible for him to

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Speaker 8: do that because he had found literally but also in

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Speaker 8: a figure of speech, a partner in crime.

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Speaker 9: Right.

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Speaker 6: Do you think she was a psychopath?

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Speaker 8: Absolutely, I'm personally convinced that she is. First of all,

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Speaker 8: to do those things what happened, you have to be

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Speaker 8: a psychopath. And especially also the way in which those

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Speaker 8: things were done. Don't forget that. For instance, they also

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Speaker 8: went to Slovakia, and there is all so a list

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Speaker 8: of Slovokian girls that got raped and stuff like that. Eh,

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Speaker 8: I mean, this was not something they did just once.

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Speaker 8: That was a way of life almost.

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Speaker 6: It was nineteen eighty five and Mark and his second wife,

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Speaker 6: Michelle Martin, were living in marginal existence in the shadows

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Speaker 6: of Charlevois. They befriended a man named Jean van Pettigam,

225
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Speaker 6: who was a drifter looking for a place to live.

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Speaker 6: Jean van Pettigam left the army in the spring of

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Speaker 6: nineteen eighty five to marry his sweetheart and settle down

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Speaker 6: in the working class region of Charlewas. The marriage only

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Speaker 6: lasted a week, and Jean soon found himself penniless and

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Speaker 6: looking for a place to live. His new friend, Mark

231
00:14:46,080 --> 00:14:48,240
Speaker 6: the True, agreed to let him live in a run

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Speaker 6: down caravan parked in the yard of his house. Jean

233
00:14:52,960 --> 00:14:56,560
Speaker 6: was a perfect mark for the True. Young, broke and

234
00:14:56,640 --> 00:14:59,520
Speaker 6: not very clever, he was soon doing his bidding in

235
00:14:59,560 --> 00:15:04,520
Speaker 6: the market underworld of Charlevois. Although educated as an electrician,

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Speaker 6: da True preferred stealing for a living, and he and

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Speaker 6: his new protegee, Jean, were learning the ropes in the

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Speaker 6: world of petty crime, from stealing cars to raiding work sites.

239
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Speaker 6: The two would hustle any angle to make a buck.

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Speaker 6: We know a lot about Jean van Pettigem's experience with

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Speaker 6: D'true from statements he later made to police and journalists.

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Speaker 6: On June seventh, nineteen eighty five, Jean van Pettigam stumbled

243
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Speaker 6: out of his caravan and joined de True and his wife,

244
00:15:32,360 --> 00:15:35,720
Speaker 6: Michelle Martin for dinner. In their kitchen, De True was

245
00:15:35,800 --> 00:15:39,480
Speaker 6: animated that evening and suggested, quote, let's go out and

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00:15:39,520 --> 00:15:43,320
Speaker 6: have some fun. His wife, Michelle Martin, knew exactly what

247
00:15:43,400 --> 00:15:45,840
Speaker 6: that meant and protested that she didn't want him to

248
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Speaker 6: take her car for that kind of fun. But Detrue

249
00:15:48,960 --> 00:15:51,000
Speaker 6: wasn't the kind of guy to let a woman tell him.

250
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Speaker 1: What to do.

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Speaker 6: Soon, they were cruising the streets of Charlevois, and Detruz

252
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Speaker 6: spotted a young girl outside a municipal pool and suggested

253
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Speaker 6: they pick her up. Isn't she a bit young, said Jean,

254
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Speaker 6: Just my type. Replied De Drue. Jean said he didn't

255
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Speaker 6: want to do it, but was indebted to the True,

256
00:16:10,520 --> 00:16:14,040
Speaker 6: so he followed orders and jumped out and grabbed eleven

257
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Speaker 6: year old Sylvia by the waist with one hand over

258
00:16:16,640 --> 00:16:19,840
Speaker 6: her mouth, and threw her into the back passenger seat.

259
00:16:20,200 --> 00:16:23,320
Speaker 6: Although this scene played out eleven years before the kidnapping

260
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Speaker 6: of Letitia de Les in Bertrie, it was strikingly similar.

261
00:16:29,520 --> 00:16:31,640
Speaker 6: A young girl on her way home from a swimming

262
00:16:31,680 --> 00:16:35,400
Speaker 6: pool was brutally snatched by markd True in a lackey accomplice.

263
00:16:36,920 --> 00:16:40,080
Speaker 6: This probably wasn't his first rodeo, and we certainly know

264
00:16:40,160 --> 00:16:43,200
Speaker 6: it wasn't his last, but at twenty nine, De True

265
00:16:43,200 --> 00:16:47,920
Speaker 6: still hadn't perfected his technique. It wasn't until years later

266
00:16:48,240 --> 00:16:51,000
Speaker 6: that he would decide to change his approach and never

267
00:16:51,080 --> 00:16:55,280
Speaker 6: let his victims go again. To True, his wife, Michele

268
00:16:55,440 --> 00:16:58,880
Speaker 6: and Jean Vanpettigin would go on to kidnap an assault

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00:16:59,120 --> 00:17:02,000
Speaker 6: several more girls and young women in nineteen eighty five.

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Speaker 6: Out of respect for the victims, I will only refer

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00:17:06,119 --> 00:17:13,320
Speaker 6: to them by their first names. On the seventeenth of

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00:17:13,359 --> 00:17:17,480
Speaker 6: October nineteen eighty five, nineteen year old Maria was walking

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Speaker 6: to the store near the town of Bansh. Jean waited

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Speaker 6: on the sidewalk until she walked by, and then pushed

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00:17:25,280 --> 00:17:29,440
Speaker 6: her into De tru'z pugeat van. There were two other

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00:17:29,480 --> 00:17:32,840
Speaker 6: accomplices in the van that day who's still never been identified.

277
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Speaker 6: One of them was described by Maria as a balding

278
00:17:37,280 --> 00:17:41,639
Speaker 6: man in his fifties. They took her to a house

279
00:17:41,720 --> 00:17:46,040
Speaker 6: and raped her several times before letting her go to

280
00:17:46,080 --> 00:17:49,919
Speaker 6: Truth threatened to kill her if she ever talked. A

281
00:17:49,920 --> 00:17:53,320
Speaker 6: few months later, on the fourteenth of December, a University

282
00:17:53,320 --> 00:17:57,040
Speaker 6: of Brussels medical student named Aksel traveled home for the

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00:17:57,080 --> 00:18:00,560
Speaker 6: weekend to the town of Naileen, just south of s Charlewois.

284
00:18:01,720 --> 00:18:05,119
Speaker 6: She left Brussels on Saturday afternoon by train to Charlerois,

285
00:18:05,400 --> 00:18:15,800
Speaker 6: where she boarded a bus to her hometown of neelim

286
00:18:15,960 --> 00:18:19,280
Speaker 6: Axcel exited the bus just after seven pm and started

287
00:18:19,320 --> 00:18:22,359
Speaker 6: walking home when she noticed a dirty white van that

288
00:18:22,440 --> 00:18:29,399
Speaker 6: seemed to be following her. Michel Martin was at the wheel,

289
00:18:29,640 --> 00:18:31,960
Speaker 6: while Mark sat in the back of the van and

290
00:18:32,080 --> 00:18:36,280
Speaker 6: Jean got out. As she passed by them, the back

291
00:18:36,320 --> 00:18:40,600
Speaker 6: doors of the van flew open. Jean pushed her into

292
00:18:40,640 --> 00:18:44,240
Speaker 6: the van while Mark pulled her in from the inside.

293
00:18:44,720 --> 00:18:47,800
Speaker 6: They immediately put masking tape over her eyes and took

294
00:18:47,800 --> 00:18:50,240
Speaker 6: her to a house where she was forced to undress

295
00:18:50,240 --> 00:18:53,600
Speaker 6: in front of all three of them. Axcel was locked

296
00:18:53,680 --> 00:18:56,760
Speaker 6: up in that house for almost twenty four hours and

297
00:18:56,840 --> 00:19:02,439
Speaker 6: repeatedly raped. Blowing Sunday, they dropped her off near her parents'

298
00:19:02,440 --> 00:19:05,840
Speaker 6: home in Neilin, but not before stealing her cash and

299
00:19:05,880 --> 00:19:12,160
Speaker 6: her pencil case. Just four days later, the trio struck again.

300
00:19:14,600 --> 00:19:17,640
Speaker 6: Fifteen year old Elizabeth was riding her bike to school

301
00:19:17,760 --> 00:19:22,120
Speaker 6: on a cold December morning. In an almost identical abduction

302
00:19:22,480 --> 00:19:25,160
Speaker 6: to what would happen ten years later to Sabine Darden.

303
00:19:26,280 --> 00:19:29,560
Speaker 6: Elizabeth was ripped off of her bike and thrown into

304
00:19:29,640 --> 00:19:33,399
Speaker 6: a dirty van. The story to True told her was

305
00:19:33,440 --> 00:19:36,439
Speaker 6: also very similar to what he would tell Sabine several

306
00:19:36,520 --> 00:19:40,480
Speaker 6: years later, that her kidnapping and rape was vengeance for

307
00:19:40,560 --> 00:19:45,160
Speaker 6: something her father had done. Unlike Sabine, however, they let

308
00:19:45,160 --> 00:19:48,960
Speaker 6: her go twelve hours later, a miscalculation that to True

309
00:19:49,000 --> 00:19:53,240
Speaker 6: would later correct. As I mentioned in the beginning, Jean

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00:19:53,359 --> 00:19:57,520
Speaker 6: van Pettign wasn't the cleverest man. He had given so

311
00:19:57,600 --> 00:20:01,320
Speaker 6: many details about himself during his conversation with victims that

312
00:20:01,400 --> 00:20:03,960
Speaker 6: police were able to piece it together and figure out

313
00:20:04,000 --> 00:20:07,879
Speaker 6: who he was. They arrested him on February third, nineteen

314
00:20:07,920 --> 00:20:11,600
Speaker 6: eighty six, and Van Petticum confessed to the police that

315
00:20:11,680 --> 00:20:15,800
Speaker 6: he was one of Excel's three kidnappers. There was no

316
00:20:15,840 --> 00:20:19,040
Speaker 6: point in denying it because investigators had found the girl's

317
00:20:19,080 --> 00:20:24,159
Speaker 6: pencil case during a search of his house. Under pressure

318
00:20:24,200 --> 00:20:27,480
Speaker 6: from police, Jean spilled the beans and admitted to carrying

319
00:20:27,520 --> 00:20:30,600
Speaker 6: out the kidnappings and rape with Detru and his wife Martin.

320
00:20:32,560 --> 00:20:38,080
Speaker 6: He confessed to the abductions and rapes of Sylvia, Maria, Axcel, Elizabeth,

321
00:20:38,320 --> 00:20:41,639
Speaker 6: and a fifth victim named Catherine, who was kidnapped and

322
00:20:41,760 --> 00:20:47,480
Speaker 6: raped under similar circumstances. The True and Martin were also arrested.

323
00:20:48,000 --> 00:20:52,240
Speaker 6: Martin first denied everything, then confessed, and then later retracted

324
00:20:52,240 --> 00:20:57,880
Speaker 6: her confession. Under pressure from de True, he denied everything,

325
00:20:58,640 --> 00:21:01,199
Speaker 6: and when they later convicted him, he declared himself a

326
00:21:01,320 --> 00:21:06,240
Speaker 6: victim and complained about a grave miscarriage of justice between

327
00:21:06,280 --> 00:21:08,920
Speaker 6: the arrest and the hearing. The True also came under

328
00:21:08,960 --> 00:21:12,280
Speaker 6: suspicion for another crime that involved the brutal robbery of

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00:21:12,320 --> 00:21:14,679
Speaker 6: a fifty eight year old woman who was tortured for

330
00:21:14,760 --> 00:21:17,840
Speaker 6: three hours by de Truan two companions in her house

331
00:21:18,000 --> 00:21:25,280
Speaker 6: until she told them where the money was. On April

332
00:21:25,320 --> 00:21:28,560
Speaker 6: twenty sixth, nineteen eighty nine, the True was sentenced to

333
00:21:28,640 --> 00:21:32,040
Speaker 6: thirteen and a half years of prison. Van Petticum got

334
00:21:32,080 --> 00:21:35,639
Speaker 6: six and a half years and Martage got five years.

335
00:21:36,280 --> 00:21:39,480
Speaker 6: The True sentence was longer because he was also convicted

336
00:21:39,520 --> 00:21:42,680
Speaker 6: of the brutal robbery of the woman. I was able

337
00:21:42,680 --> 00:21:45,600
Speaker 6: to track down one of Mark d' true's former cellmates

338
00:21:45,720 --> 00:21:49,160
Speaker 6: from his time in prison. This man's name is Danielle

339
00:21:49,160 --> 00:21:53,879
Speaker 6: de Jas. Danielle is soft spoken and articulate. He looks

340
00:21:53,920 --> 00:21:56,760
Speaker 6: nothing like a man who's been to prison three times.

341
00:21:57,400 --> 00:21:59,720
Speaker 6: He was a drug addict for twenty years and found

342
00:21:59,760 --> 00:22:01,800
Speaker 6: himself often the same prison as the True in the

343
00:22:01,840 --> 00:22:05,560
Speaker 6: late eighties, after getting busted for robbing a pharmacy in Charlehaugh,

344
00:22:06,720 --> 00:22:08,879
Speaker 6: I asked him to explain how he meant the True

345
00:22:09,000 --> 00:22:09,920
Speaker 6: in prison.

346
00:22:15,000 --> 00:22:17,600
Speaker 10: During free time, he would walk around the prison yard

347
00:22:17,640 --> 00:22:21,680
Speaker 10: with a chessboard. That's how we met, and we probably

348
00:22:21,680 --> 00:22:24,600
Speaker 10: played chess in the yard and he asked me to

349
00:22:24,640 --> 00:22:27,600
Speaker 10: be a cell mate, and that's how I ended up

350
00:22:27,640 --> 00:22:34,119
Speaker 10: with him. Afterwards, he turned out not to be easy

351
00:22:34,119 --> 00:22:36,960
Speaker 10: at all to live with, because everything had to be

352
00:22:37,040 --> 00:22:42,120
Speaker 10: exactly has. He decided, for example, to play chess when

353
00:22:42,160 --> 00:22:46,080
Speaker 10: he wanted, even if I didn't feel like playing. And

354
00:22:46,119 --> 00:22:50,160
Speaker 10: another thing at the time, I still smoked, and Marc

355
00:22:50,200 --> 00:22:55,040
Speaker 10: Dueto said he couldn't stand cigarette smoke. One time, he

356
00:22:55,160 --> 00:22:57,800
Speaker 10: was coming back from the shower and I was smoking

357
00:22:57,840 --> 00:23:00,480
Speaker 10: at the window, and he grabbed a table leg and

358
00:23:00,520 --> 00:23:04,080
Speaker 10: threw it at my head, really violently, only missing me

359
00:23:04,160 --> 00:23:09,840
Speaker 10: by a couple of centimeters. He completely denied kidnapping and

360
00:23:09,960 --> 00:23:14,439
Speaker 10: raping the young girls, but apparently it was filmed. I

361
00:23:14,440 --> 00:23:18,000
Speaker 10: don't know if he filmed it or an accomplice, but

362
00:23:18,080 --> 00:23:20,800
Speaker 10: he insisted that he had nothing to do with it

363
00:23:21,440 --> 00:23:25,560
Speaker 10: and that he had only seen video during questioning, and

364
00:23:25,600 --> 00:23:27,480
Speaker 10: he said that it showed a girl who had been

365
00:23:27,560 --> 00:23:31,320
Speaker 10: forced to get undressed and was blindfolded standing up on

366
00:23:31,359 --> 00:23:36,119
Speaker 10: a sofa, and the poor girl, blindfolded while standing on

367
00:23:36,160 --> 00:23:39,119
Speaker 10: the sofa, lost her balance and fell on her face.

368
00:23:40,000 --> 00:23:43,040
Speaker 10: And while he was telling me this, he was laughing,

369
00:23:43,160 --> 00:23:47,680
Speaker 10: like yayena, he thought it was so hilarious. It wasn't

370
00:23:47,720 --> 00:23:50,320
Speaker 10: funny at all, you know. It was a scene that

371
00:23:50,440 --> 00:23:54,080
Speaker 10: provoked compassion and pity to see the spoor girl to

372
00:23:54,160 --> 00:23:58,119
Speaker 10: be forcibly undressed and falling on her face. But he

373
00:23:58,200 --> 00:24:02,080
Speaker 10: thought it was irresistibly. And it was that sort of

374
00:24:02,119 --> 00:24:06,119
Speaker 10: thing that convinced me he was guilty, because his personality

375
00:24:06,160 --> 00:24:08,639
Speaker 10: fits so well with what he was accused of doing.

376
00:24:09,440 --> 00:24:11,960
Speaker 10: At one point, he told me he wanted to build

377
00:24:11,960 --> 00:24:16,119
Speaker 10: a hiding place, extremely well built and discreet. And he

378
00:24:16,200 --> 00:24:19,679
Speaker 10: explained what he actually did a few years later, and

379
00:24:19,720 --> 00:24:22,879
Speaker 10: he told me he needed help to build it. I said, listen,

380
00:24:23,160 --> 00:24:26,040
Speaker 10: I'm not interested. Why would I help you to do that?

381
00:24:26,640 --> 00:24:29,120
Speaker 10: And he said, well, you can hide your drugs there.

382
00:24:29,640 --> 00:24:32,040
Speaker 10: And at that point I clicked and said you want

383
00:24:32,119 --> 00:24:35,320
Speaker 10: to build that to hide girls? And he didn't answer.

384
00:24:35,760 --> 00:24:36,399
Speaker 9: And then I'll.

385
00:24:36,320 --> 00:24:39,800
Speaker 10: Remember clearly when I saw on television years later that

386
00:24:39,880 --> 00:24:43,040
Speaker 10: it was marked du true, I thought, oh my god,

387
00:24:43,160 --> 00:24:43,760
Speaker 10: he did.

388
00:24:43,600 --> 00:24:54,639
Speaker 6: It while in prison, the true one about positioning himself

389
00:24:54,680 --> 00:24:58,160
Speaker 6: as a model in me. He even attended AA meetings

390
00:24:58,200 --> 00:25:01,840
Speaker 6: despite never having been a serious dress His good behavior

391
00:25:01,920 --> 00:25:05,680
Speaker 6: earned him several temporary releases, where, accompanied by a guardian,

392
00:25:05,800 --> 00:25:10,160
Speaker 6: he visited his ailing grandmother. She was incoherent and didn't

393
00:25:10,160 --> 00:25:12,760
Speaker 6: even know he was in prison at the time, he

394
00:25:12,800 --> 00:25:15,639
Speaker 6: introduced the guardian as a friend, and the latter was

395
00:25:15,680 --> 00:25:20,240
Speaker 6: impressed with Detrue's devotion and generosity. Of course, Mark de

396
00:25:20,320 --> 00:25:23,440
Speaker 6: True knew that this guardian also sat on the parole board.

397
00:25:24,840 --> 00:25:28,200
Speaker 6: Never want to miss an opportunity, he was also using

398
00:25:28,200 --> 00:25:30,800
Speaker 6: these visits to sow the seeds that would help him

399
00:25:30,840 --> 00:25:34,040
Speaker 6: fleece his grandmother out of her pension and house after prison.

400
00:25:35,440 --> 00:25:39,480
Speaker 6: In nineteen ninety one, Mark's mother, Jeanine Lawance, wrote several

401
00:25:39,560 --> 00:25:42,800
Speaker 6: letters to the prison pleading for them not to let

402
00:25:42,800 --> 00:25:46,520
Speaker 6: her son out. In one of her letters, she wrote, quote,

403
00:25:46,960 --> 00:25:50,600
Speaker 6: I know his stubbornness to achieve whatever he wants. What

404
00:25:50,720 --> 00:25:53,520
Speaker 6: I don't know, and what everyone who knows him fears

405
00:25:54,000 --> 00:25:58,240
Speaker 6: is what he has in mind for the future unquote nonetheless.

406
00:25:58,359 --> 00:26:01,679
Speaker 6: On the sixth of April nineteen nine, Mark was released

407
00:26:01,720 --> 00:26:05,080
Speaker 6: on parole, only three years after being convicted in eighty nine.

408
00:26:06,800 --> 00:26:10,120
Speaker 6: How could a man who violently kidnapped and raped five

409
00:26:10,280 --> 00:26:13,160
Speaker 6: children and young women be let out of prison after

410
00:26:13,200 --> 00:26:16,119
Speaker 6: serving less than half a sentence that seemed too short

411
00:26:16,160 --> 00:26:16,960
Speaker 6: in the first place.

412
00:26:19,840 --> 00:26:23,160
Speaker 2: What the truth is in the eighties is really awful stuff.

413
00:26:23,480 --> 00:26:26,040
Speaker 2: It's so strageous that he spends such a small time

414
00:26:26,040 --> 00:26:26,800
Speaker 2: in prison for this.

415
00:26:27,600 --> 00:26:30,240
Speaker 6: This is the voice of Bruno Denis, who you also

416
00:26:30,280 --> 00:26:33,600
Speaker 6: heard the start of this episode. Bruno's of Belgian with

417
00:26:33,680 --> 00:26:36,720
Speaker 6: two daughters who lived through these times. I thought it

418
00:26:36,720 --> 00:26:39,640
Speaker 6: would be interesting to give voice to a normal Belgian citizen.

419
00:26:40,040 --> 00:26:43,000
Speaker 3: I mean, it's not just one girl he kidnapped and raped,

420
00:26:43,400 --> 00:26:44,520
Speaker 3: but five of them.

421
00:26:45,119 --> 00:26:48,359
Speaker 9: We're talking about girls as young as eleven years old,

422
00:26:48,920 --> 00:26:52,320
Speaker 9: addicted in the streets and then raped and abused and

423
00:26:52,480 --> 00:26:55,680
Speaker 9: threatened with the lives, and all of this before she

424
00:26:55,880 --> 00:26:57,399
Speaker 9: and Merissa were even born.

425
00:26:58,520 --> 00:27:01,879
Speaker 3: Should have been the Jenoviti in nineteen eighty six, but

426
00:27:02,080 --> 00:27:04,240
Speaker 3: my god, it was just a beginning.

427
00:27:06,280 --> 00:27:09,199
Speaker 9: What happens after he got out of prison is just

428
00:27:09,400 --> 00:27:10,440
Speaker 9: beyond belief.

429
00:27:16,160 --> 00:27:22,400
Speaker 6: Next time, on La Mansa, we saw two.

430
00:27:22,240 --> 00:27:25,520
Speaker 5: Young girls walking along the street and he said, do

431
00:27:25,560 --> 00:27:27,840
Speaker 5: you want to earn one hundred and fifty thousand Belgian

432
00:27:27,880 --> 00:27:33,560
Speaker 5: francs And I said sure, but how? And then he

433
00:27:33,640 --> 00:27:37,360
Speaker 5: said we had to kidnap the girls first. And then

434
00:27:37,359 --> 00:27:41,600
Speaker 5: he showed me she wanted me to bring her Jeli

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Speaker 5: la jeanne, and I thought, wait a minute, Jeli la

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Speaker 5: jean I was convinced he made a Freudian slip. Jealie

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Speaker 5: La Jean had gone missing way before Sabine was kidnapped.

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Speaker 5: I knew at this point that we were onto something.

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Speaker 3: Nilissa Mimi not did fill Melissa.

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Speaker 11: Mimi, my little girl. I call you in the empty house,

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Speaker 11: just to hear my voice resonate with your name like before,

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Speaker 11: and to hope for a tenth of a second that

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Speaker 11: you'll answer. But alas, I only hit a wall of silence.

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Speaker 6: So Lea Monstra is a production of Tenderfoot TV and

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Speaker 6: iHeart Radio. Hosted and executive produced by me Matt Graves,

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Speaker 6: produced by Thomas Resimont of Bubble Sound. Donald Albright and

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00:28:43,800 --> 00:28:46,960
Speaker 6: Payne Lindsay are executive producers on the behalf of Tenderfoot

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Speaker 6: TV with producer Makeup and Vanity Set. Matt Frederick and

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00:28:51,200 --> 00:28:54,840
Speaker 6: Alex Williams are executive producers on the behalf of iHeartRadio

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00:28:55,080 --> 00:28:59,840
Speaker 6: with producer Trevor Young. Original music by Jay Ragsdale, Sound

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Speaker 6: design by Cooper Skinner and Thomas resimo Mixed and mastered

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Speaker 6: by Cooper Skinner. Cover design by Trevor Eiler. La Monstra

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Speaker 6: includes archival audio from Sonuma, RTBF Archives and CNN Archives.

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Speaker 6: Special thanks to back Media and Marketing Station sixteen, Jean Savigna,

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Speaker 6: and the teams at iHeartRadio and tenderfoot TV. Find us

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00:29:23,520 --> 00:29:28,080
Speaker 6: on social media at Monster Underscore pod. For more podcasts

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Speaker 6: from iHeartRadio or tenderfoot TV, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

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Speaker 6: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.