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Speaker 1: Ah beat Force. If it doesn't work, you're just not

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Speaker 1: using enough. You're listening to Software a Gradio, Special Operations,

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Speaker 1: military news and straight talk with the guys and the community.

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Speaker 1: Soft rep Radio on time on Target. Really excited to

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Speaker 1: have Ed Derek back on with us, UM to give

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Speaker 1: you some background, which I'll get into it a little bit.

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Speaker 1: Ed Derek's first appearance on the show, UM, which was

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Speaker 1: actually looking right now, was three fifteen. Was one of

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Speaker 1: our biggest episodes. It was the second most played episode

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Speaker 1: of only behind uh Sergeant Major Mike Vining. Because I

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Speaker 1: think people love hearing about Extortion seventeen and Operation Red Wings.

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Speaker 1: So I mean, we're gonna get into Ed's newest book.

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Speaker 1: But if you want to hear all about that, listen

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Speaker 1: back to three fifteen. And while I'm on the subject

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Speaker 1: to that, you can listen back to all the old

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Speaker 1: episodes at soft prep Radio dot com. Um. You know,

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Speaker 1: I got an email just recently about where's the Rob

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Speaker 1: mail or episode? Because those aren't up on SoundCloud anymore

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Speaker 1: or Apple podcasts, but they are up at Software Radio

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Speaker 1: dot com, so that's where you could hear them. Um.

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Speaker 1: It's a little bit more limited on Apple podcast and SoundCloud.

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Speaker 1: I did that because of how we changed structure and

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Speaker 1: that type of thing. But yeah, long story short Software

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Speaker 1: Radio dot Com. Before we get into everything, I wanted

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Speaker 1: to tell you all about Pelican cores. I'm so psyched

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Speaker 1: because we got into the office and we have all

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Speaker 1: this new stuff from Pelican. They gave us these custom

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Speaker 1: Software Radio tumblers, which are incredible. Yeah, these coffee themis yep.

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Speaker 1: They gave us um bigger cores. But the twenty court

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Speaker 1: core that we have in studio is just super heavy duty,

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Speaker 1: and that's one of the smaller ones. The bigger ones,

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Speaker 1: which were sent to Scott Whittner, are incredible and they'll

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Speaker 1: keep your beer cool for up to nine days, which

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Speaker 1: is insane. That's for the seventy court core. Um. So

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Speaker 1: these hard sided cores are all made in the USA completely.

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Speaker 1: Most competitive is including Yetti, make most of their stuff

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Speaker 1: overseas of an actual lifetime warranty. A wide variety of

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Speaker 1: sizes and colors, and I was looking on the site,

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Speaker 1: man eleven different colors, schemes, ten different sizes, easy poll

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Speaker 1: hard latches that aren't rubber bands like the other guys.

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Speaker 1: Pelican is a trusted brand since ninety six. They're light.

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Speaker 1: Other cools weigh thirty percent more on average. They've built

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Speaker 1: in bottle open er under the lid. How awesome is

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Speaker 1: that ergonomic handles which make them easier to carry. And

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Speaker 1: here's what we have going on. Go to Pelican Colors

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Speaker 1: dot com and uh, we have promo code, but it

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Speaker 1: only works at Pelican Coors dot com. I know you

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Speaker 1: can get Pelican Coolers just about everywhere, but our coupon

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Speaker 1: codes soft rep. What you'll get with that is you're

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Speaker 1: gonna get a free twenty two tumbler. You add the

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Speaker 1: tumbler to your cart with your order, whatever order that

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Speaker 1: you make, use the promo code soft rep, and you'll

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Speaker 1: get it absolutely free. Once again, that's Pelican Coolers dot Com.

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Speaker 1: Free two tumbler with your order, but you got to

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Speaker 1: add that your cart and you can find that tumbler

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Speaker 1: in the drink wear section at the top and use

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Speaker 1: the promo code soft rep. So get on that. I

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Speaker 1: know you were impressed with everything that we got here.

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Speaker 1: I mean, this is just these are the coolest schoolers, yeah,

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Speaker 1: and I mean it's pretty cool that they have that

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Speaker 1: offer that you can get a free one with your order.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, everyone likes free stuff like one of those basically, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean, I'm custom made for us. I'm looking at

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Speaker 1: it here in front of me. I mean it's a

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Speaker 1: huge uh coffee thermis basically well screw on top and

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Speaker 1: a little flap to drink. And I mean this is sweet.

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Speaker 1: It's made out of like metal, it's not like uh,

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Speaker 1: just like plastic e kind of stuff that's gonna break

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Speaker 1: if you drop it. I mean, it's pretty hardcore. They

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Speaker 1: sent us a bunch of the soft Up Radio one,

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Speaker 1: so we'll give one to a lucky listener. I'll I'll

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Speaker 1: get into that at the end of the show. But

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Speaker 1: I'm really excited about this man. And if you want

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Speaker 1: to see what this stuff is like, and and you haven't,

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Speaker 1: check out our social media um on Twitter and Instagram

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Speaker 1: at soft rep Radio. I'm gonna be posting all this stuff.

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Speaker 1: And then for the bigger cores, which were already sent out.

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Speaker 1: Like I said, the one is pretty awesome, but these

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Speaker 1: massive cores they have, those will be on the load

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Speaker 1: out room, and I believe Scott Whittner is going to

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Speaker 1: do a review. So really excited. Once again, Go to

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Speaker 1: Pelican cores dot com add the tumbler to your order

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Speaker 1: whatever cooler you get, and you're gonna get it for free.

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Speaker 1: It's in the drink wear section at the top. Use

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Speaker 1: the promo code soft rep and get right on that.

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Speaker 1: Because this is a limited time offer. I don't know

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Speaker 1: how long it's gonna go, but you're gonna read it

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Speaker 1: if you don't buy it, So do it. Um, getting

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Speaker 1: it to everything Before we get to ed. One thing

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Speaker 1: I wanted to mention. The government shutdown is still in effect,

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Speaker 1: and this is probably the craziest government shutdown I've ever seen.

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Speaker 1: I mean it's the longest one we've ever seen, and

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Speaker 1: both sides do not show any signs of budging. And

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Speaker 1: it's some at some point government workers are gonna need

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Speaker 1: to be paid. So it's like, what is gonna end this? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you're holding all these federal employees hostage. Um, And you know, sure,

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Speaker 1: the libertarian in me is kind of like, shut it down,

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Speaker 1: shut it all down. But this isn't right, This isn't

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Speaker 1: the way to do it. I mean, you have these

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Speaker 1: are you know, our employees working for our government, and

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Speaker 1: you know we're going to get to the point where

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Speaker 1: people are losing their houses and stuff. Um, it's it's

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Speaker 1: it's an embarrassment. Really. Um, I think I can understand

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Speaker 1: why it's happening, but it's still a disaster really, And

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Speaker 1: but I just I I have no idea what's going

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Speaker 1: to end it, because what's gonna what's gonna end it

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Speaker 1: is that the Democrats are gonna cave in and give

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Speaker 1: Trump most of what he wants. Um. You know, I

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Speaker 1: keep seeing in the in the press, like people are

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Speaker 1: always like Trump's breaking up, He's cracking up, He's going crazy,

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Speaker 1: He's losing. It's like, no, he's not, man, don't you

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Speaker 1: get it. He's having a good time. You joys this

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Speaker 1: And he doesn't have a conscience. So, I mean, he

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Speaker 1: doesn't give a funk if a bunch of federal employees

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Speaker 1: lose their homes or can't make car payments or what like.

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Speaker 1: He doesn't care about that. And as for the other side,

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Speaker 1: according to at least Trump's Twitter from what he said,

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Speaker 1: you know, speaking with Nancy Pelosi, they do not They

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Speaker 1: refused to have you know, any wall mandate or any event,

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Speaker 1: which is hysterical because you know, did you see that

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Speaker 1: that clip I posted of Chuck Schumer. I've seen I've

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Speaker 1: seen all those reposts where it's like ten fifteen minutes

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Speaker 1: straight of him in the past talking about how we

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Speaker 1: need border security and the illegals are taking our jobs.

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Speaker 1: I'm like, it just shows what not just the hypocrisy

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Speaker 1: of American politics. But it's all such a fucking joke.

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Speaker 1: It's all just a big facade. It's like we're all

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Speaker 1: rooting for sports teams. Yeah, it very much is. Um, yeah,

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Speaker 1: but there's real But there's real life repercussions of course. People,

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Speaker 1: you know, government workers as much as like the t

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Speaker 1: s A may annoy us, like it's there, it's their

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Speaker 1: job and have nothing to do with and it's not

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Speaker 1: their fault that Nancy Pelosi and Donald Trump are having

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Speaker 1: a food fight. Um, you know that there are real

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Speaker 1: life repercussions. Um. You know, border security in the meantime

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Speaker 1: is not getting solved. There's nothing happening with that, and

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Speaker 1: all these federal employees are going without pay. Um. It

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Speaker 1: just seems incredibly immoral and unethical to do this too,

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Speaker 1: you know, our workers, um, and hold them hostage in

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Speaker 1: this manner because uh, you know our president and uh

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Speaker 1: the leaders of the Democratic Party are having Twitter wars.

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Speaker 1: Also wanted to mention beyond the tumblers and all the

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Speaker 1: other cool stuff that I saw when I came in

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Speaker 1: the studio from uh, from Pelican Corps, which was really awesome.

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Speaker 1: You came in with quite a few copies review copies

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Speaker 1: of your memoir Murphy's Law, and it's it's getting me

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Speaker 1: excited for the actual release date. Yeah. These are these

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Speaker 1: are their galley copies. So they're um, like kind of

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Speaker 1: advanced readers copies that can I bring one home? Actually

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Speaker 1: you can take one, and you know, the books have

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Speaker 1: to finish. Uh, Carmen Genteel's book, which I've been taking

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Speaker 1: my sweet time with to be honest, but it's great

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Speaker 1: so far, Um it is. Uh. So this is the

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Speaker 1: the advanced copy of the book. It's just a soft cover.

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Speaker 1: The when it comes out it will be a hardcover.

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Speaker 1: Of course. It will also have fourteen pages. I think

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Speaker 1: of pictures that this edition, this advanced reader's copy is missing.

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Speaker 1: And then there's a bunch of like little typos and

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Speaker 1: little things that we're cleaning up. I just finished the

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Speaker 1: second past of the book yesterday, and um, I'm proud

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Speaker 1: of it. I mean it's uh, it's pretty raw. There's

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Speaker 1: some pretty graphic depictions of combat in this book, UM,

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Speaker 1: and I think it kind of shoots from the hip

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Speaker 1: and tells it like it like it was and like

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Speaker 1: it is. UM. You know, when I wrote the book,

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Speaker 1: I was kind of cognizant of the fa that people

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Speaker 1: come home from war and tend to write these sort

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Speaker 1: of um romantic retrospectives about war, and like the it

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Speaker 1: goes in like one or two directions. It's either you know,

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Speaker 1: the greatest men I served with, the greatest men of

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Speaker 1: our generation and the honor and the flag waving, or

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Speaker 1: it goes to the other side and it's like a

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Speaker 1: big war apology and the horrors of war. And you know,

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Speaker 1: the people write about the horrors of war typically the

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Speaker 1: people who did the most killing and the most slaughtering

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Speaker 1: in war and didn't give a shit about it, and

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Speaker 1: then they like come back and they want to write

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Speaker 1: a book like moralizing us about war. UM. I tried

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Speaker 1: to write a book that it does. It kind of

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Speaker 1: tries to do two things at once, in the sense

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Speaker 1: that I try to tell you the difference between what

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Speaker 1: I knew at the time and what I experienced and

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Speaker 1: what I felt, but also updated a little bit like

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Speaker 1: here's what I found out years later, or at the

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Speaker 1: end of the chapter about Iraq, Uh say, this is

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Speaker 1: how I've come to feel about this conflict and the

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Speaker 1: years since I left Iraq or since I left the military.

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Speaker 1: So I try to tell you the difference between a

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Speaker 1: very real soldier's experience in that moment um versus how

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Speaker 1: I came to feel about it later on. And I

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Speaker 1: think that's something some some authors do a good job

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Speaker 1: with it, but a lot of times I feel like

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Speaker 1: that kind of gets lost in the waxing poetic that

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Speaker 1: we often do about war. You know, it's interesting the

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Speaker 1: second category of book that you're mentioning of, um, guys

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Speaker 1: who are apologetic for war, that type of thing. Um.

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Speaker 1: This was really interesting to me was that when I

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Speaker 1: produced Senator Bill Bradley Show, we had in what at

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Speaker 1: least we thought at the time and he thought, was

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Speaker 1: the son of one of the men who raised the

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Speaker 1: flag at Iwo Jima. And it was interesting because Devoura,

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Speaker 1: who you met, who was the executive producers interviewing this

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Speaker 1: guy about we we did that favorite Place in America's segment,

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Speaker 1: but also interviewing him about the book, and um, you know,

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Speaker 1: saying what a hero that his dad was, and he

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Speaker 1: was extremely anti war, and he was just like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I don't see it as heroic. I don't see it

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Speaker 1: as something i'm I'm proud of. And it was actually

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Speaker 1: like the complete opposite of what you thought. And he

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Speaker 1: was very adamant about his anti war stance. But what

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Speaker 1: came out I think a couple of years later, was

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Speaker 1: that apparently his father did raise a flag at Iwo Jima,

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Speaker 1: but it was not the iconic photo of the flag

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Speaker 1: raised video a gemma he thought it was. It's not

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Speaker 1: like he was contesting false information, but apparently there were

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Speaker 1: several men who thought that they raised the flag and

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Speaker 1: that iconic photo, but that it turned out it wasn't them.

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Speaker 1: And he actually made a statement I remember in the

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Speaker 1: article that he was like, I had my suspicions that

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Speaker 1: it might have been a different one, but it's not.

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Speaker 1: It's not like he was, you know. You know, I

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Speaker 1: think when we we look back and we were flect

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Speaker 1: back on war, particularly as veterans UM, we all have

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Speaker 1: our own perspectives and some of us come to this

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Speaker 1: conclusion become very anti war UM. And there's nothing necessarily

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Speaker 1: wrong with that. It's okay to have that stance or

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Speaker 1: have that view. Um. I just think there's something incredibly

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Speaker 1: disingenuous is about you know, serving in combat um so enthusiastically, UM,

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Speaker 1: and I wanted to be there. I was a volunteer, um.

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Speaker 1: But then coming home and after the facts being like

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Speaker 1: and now now I go to the you know, a

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Speaker 1: liberal university or whatever, and now I want to fit

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Speaker 1: in with that crowd. So all of a sudden, I'm

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Speaker 1: an anti war activist or whatever. I don't believe that

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Speaker 1: ship for a second. Um. It's like you look at

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Speaker 1: people like that and you're just like, I'm not buying it,

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Speaker 1: you know, although I mean people do change as absolutely.

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Speaker 1: I just think it's important to distinguish the difference between

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Speaker 1: you know, when you you served enthusiastically and voluntarily, but

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Speaker 1: then the second you get out of the military, all

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Speaker 1: of a sudden, the horrors of war and all this

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Speaker 1: kind of stuff. It's like I can get it on

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Speaker 1: some level in that. I think that's why, I mean,

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Speaker 1: it's known, that's why guys are recruited at like seventeen eighteen,

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Speaker 1: because you know, they're not knowledgeable that this type of stuff. Oh,

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Speaker 1: I want to see some action. They're they're not well

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Speaker 1: read up on politics, and then you know, they come

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Speaker 1: back home and their view of this thing is completely changed.

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Speaker 1: And I do get, I get absolutely, and I mean

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Speaker 1: war will change you for sure. And that's why I say,

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Speaker 1: I mean, I don't hold it against anyone for coming

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Speaker 1: back from war and having anti war sentiments. I mean,

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Speaker 1: that's perfectly reasonable to feel that way. Um. I just

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Speaker 1: think that some people are disingenuous and how they express it,

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Speaker 1: or if nothing else, they're not honest about their own

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Speaker 1: frame of mind when they served. Um, they try to

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Speaker 1: make themselves out to be like victims. You know that

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Speaker 1: their consent was manufactured by you know, the machine and

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Speaker 1: the institutions of government. It's like, no, you're you're kind

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Speaker 1: of responsible for your own actions. I And you know

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Speaker 1: if you went over there and you did some things

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Speaker 1: you probably shouldn't have done. Uh, you're responsible for that too,

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Speaker 1: which we talked about in the world. We've talked about

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Speaker 1: a lot of this stuff in the past. UM. I

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Speaker 1: understand the people though, who do come back for sure,

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Speaker 1: and I think even you would be in this category

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Speaker 1: who come back and they're adamant about you know that

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Speaker 1: war is an absolute last Lastewart. Yeah, well you have

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Speaker 1: a little diplomacy and if that doesn't work, then this

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Speaker 1: is our last resort. And I'm I'm very much about

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Speaker 1: pumping the brakes on on the wars we're fighting right now.

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Speaker 1: I think it's gotten completely out of control and we

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Speaker 1: now have war as an institution in this country where

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Speaker 1: we're permanently at war and it seems like nothing can

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Speaker 1: scale that back, nothing can stop that. And this comes

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Speaker 1: out of time where we're confronting obviously the global war

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Speaker 1: on terror, but at the same time we're trying to

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Speaker 1: confront Russia, China, Iran, and North Korea and simultaneously fight

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Speaker 1: a war against terrorism worldwide. Okay, something's gotta give. It's like,

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Speaker 1: look at that list of bad guys and pick one

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Speaker 1: and I don't know if you mentioned it, uh. I mean,

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Speaker 1: but on top of that, even though there are ally

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Speaker 1: we're almost in a war with Mexico over this border wall, well,

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Speaker 1: I mean I hesitate to describe that as a war

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Speaker 1: in the same way that we're we're oh for sure,

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Speaker 1: but I mean, you know, it's definitely driving a wedge

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Speaker 1: between who's supposed to be a great ally of ours

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Speaker 1: and I get the reason why. You know, I don't

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Speaker 1: know if I mean, haven't we always been a little

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Speaker 1: bit at arm's length with Mexico. I mean, but I

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Speaker 1: think it's gotten more hostile than ever before. Well we've

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Speaker 1: been at war with Mexico for real and and many

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Speaker 1: years in the past. So I mean, I'm not sure

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Speaker 1: that this is the worst that's ever been I say,

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Speaker 1: in my life. I see, I see your point, though, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's uh, but I don't think Mexico is anywhere near

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Speaker 1: at the level of being a global competitor the way

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Speaker 1: we're competing thinking of and I know that there were

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Speaker 1: people who this isn' until I go back and criticize

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Speaker 1: stuff that was said on the campaign trail. But like

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Speaker 1: never before this president was there a guy who spoke

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Speaker 1: about the people coming from the country of our allies

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Speaker 1: and say they're rapists, they're they're gang members, they're engaging

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Speaker 1: that sort of fear mongering and racism, which I mean, look,

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Speaker 1: some of those people coming over are But you never

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Speaker 1: heard George W. Bush or Barack Obama or Bill Quintin

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Speaker 1: speak about Mexico like that. It's a very different, or

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Speaker 1: speak about Mexicans like that these are people. And yes,

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Speaker 1: there are a certain criminal element, no, no doubt about it. Um.

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Speaker 1: And that's why we have border patrol, and we we

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Speaker 1: should have border security. You don't think we should get

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Speaker 1: rid of Ice like Alexandria get rid of No, No,

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Speaker 1: I don't. I don't think we need to get rid

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Speaker 1: of these organizations. Um. But that said, I mean, most

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Speaker 1: of the people coming across the border just families who

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Speaker 1: want a better life for their kids. Uh. They're not

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Speaker 1: They're not bad people. Sure. I blame the politicians more

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Speaker 1: than anyone for you know, what is a problem of

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Speaker 1: too many people coming over and we don't know their identities?

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Speaker 1: You know, it's yeah, and the scumbag Mexican government is

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Speaker 1: corrupt to its core, and they treat America as a

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Speaker 1: pressure release out. They're like, oh, you're living in poverty,

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Speaker 1: just go to America, go to get out, get out.

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Speaker 1: Because if those people had to stay in Mexico, they'd

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Speaker 1: had they'd stage a fucking revolution against their government. And

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Speaker 1: who could blame them? Um. Before we get to add

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Speaker 1: two other things, wanted to mention real quick season two

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Speaker 1: of The Punisher, which I know is a big deal

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Speaker 1: for you. Well it isn't it isn't uh you know,

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Speaker 1: I I fell asleep watching the first season of The Punisher.

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Speaker 1: I just wanted to bring it up because, I mean,

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Speaker 1: I think we've talked about it. I'm a huge, huge

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Speaker 1: fan of the comic books and have been, um since

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Speaker 1: I was a teenager. I probably have every issue of

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Speaker 1: the comic book um and not every appearance of The

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Speaker 1: Punisher and Marvel comics, but I probably have close to

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Speaker 1: every issue of The Punisher or The Punisher War Journal

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Speaker 1: or some of the other spinoffs they did. UM. So

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Speaker 1: A pretty big fan of the comic but watching the

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Speaker 1: Netflix show. I actually liked him on when he was

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Speaker 1: in Daredevil, but the first season of The Punisher it

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Speaker 1: kind of put me to sleep. I thought it was

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Speaker 1: really like boring. And Netflix has this tendency with these

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Speaker 1: shows to like draw it out over They're like milking

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Speaker 1: the content as much as they possibly kind of draw

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Speaker 1: it out over you know, thirteen or fourteen episodes or

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Speaker 1: whatever it is, where they could have a much tighter

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Speaker 1: plot within you know, maybe eight episodes. Um. But season

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Speaker 1: two is coming out it supposedly it's gonna be a

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Speaker 1: lot better. According to some of the early reviews that

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Speaker 1: are out but I just wrote a op ed about

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Speaker 1: The Punisher because when the first season came out, there's

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Speaker 1: like this deluge of like op eds and The Guardian

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Speaker 1: the Atlantic. I mean almost everybody had one at the time,

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Speaker 1: because I think it's because Frank Castle is a white

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Speaker 1: male combat veteran who uses guns to sort out his

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Speaker 1: problems and it just scares the ship out of all

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Speaker 1: these like lefty newspaper editors. Um so they tried to

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Speaker 1: like say Frank Castle was a Nazi, or they try

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Speaker 1: to say The Punisher that that the skull symbol is

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Speaker 1: used by cops and soldiers style was associated with all that. Well,

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Speaker 1: I mean, yes, Chris Kyle, I believe we're the Punisher Skull,

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Speaker 1: but I mean ship, so did tons of other people.

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Speaker 1: I think he altered it to make it his own logo. No,

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Speaker 1: I don't. I don't think so. I'm pretty sure Marvel

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Speaker 1: could go after and like logo because I'm want to

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Speaker 1: look it up. Um Craft, Chris Kyle, because I thought he.

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Speaker 1: I thought he altered it, Yeah for the Craft logo. Look,

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Speaker 1: that looks exactly like The Punisher Craft's logo, which was

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Speaker 1: Chris Kyle's brand, or at least he was a part

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Speaker 1: of the brand. But then look isn't that a O

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Speaker 1: D A right? This one this one here quick on

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Speaker 1: that yeah, Craft International four inter Craft International. Yes, so

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Speaker 1: I mean I may maybe they didn't go after him

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Speaker 1: because we look bad, I feel, I think so, I mean, yeah,

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Speaker 1: it is very extremely similar, yeah, extreme heavily influenced. And

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Speaker 1: you know, there's one article written I think it was

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Speaker 1: like in The Guardian maybe um, and it was saying

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Speaker 1: that some some right neo Nazi world a Punisher t

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Speaker 1: shirt at one point, so they're like, you know, the

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Speaker 1: Punisher is the alt right, like making these really childish

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Speaker 1: comparisons and just stupid ship. So anyway, I wrote my

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Speaker 1: love letter to Frank Castle this morning, sitting down with

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Speaker 1: my coffee. That'll be up on the news rep. That'll yeah,

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Speaker 1: it'll be up. I think the second season comes out

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Speaker 1: on Netflix this Friday, so that op ed will be

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Speaker 1: out before then. And I talked a lot about you know,

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Speaker 1: the Punisher actually is forgive the terminology, but it's basically

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Speaker 1: a rip off of an earlier character, Mac Boland, the Executioner,

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Speaker 1: who was written by and created by Don Pendleton in

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Speaker 1: nine and very similar theme that Vietna. Nom veteran comes

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Speaker 1: home from war and his family has been killed by

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Speaker 1: the mafia. So he declares a one man war on crime.

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Speaker 1: So I get into a lot of this and what

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Speaker 1: Don Pendleton intended with his character. He was trying to

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Speaker 1: redignify the soldier after a very unpopular war in Vietnam,

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Speaker 1: and Mack Bolan was a character that tried to Don

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Speaker 1: Pendleton use this character to speak to this sort of

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Speaker 1: flower power generation that was about peace and love and

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Speaker 1: talk to them about you know, we live in a

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Speaker 1: in a world with evil and somebody has to stand

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Speaker 1: up to it. And he wasn't suggesting that we all,

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Speaker 1: you know, pick up guns and become vigilantes. That wasn't

404
00:22:37,800 --> 00:22:41,160
Speaker 1: the point. But that was a way to dramatize the action.

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Speaker 1: For he. Don Pendleton actually coined the term action adventure,

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Speaker 1: and so that that forms the drama, this one man war,

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Speaker 1: this holy war on crime. Um. But I think Don

408
00:22:53,080 --> 00:22:55,600
Speaker 1: Pendleton was just telling all of us in a sense

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Speaker 1: that you know, evil has to be confronted. And uh,

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Speaker 1: when Marvel Comics decided to create this character, the Punisher

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Speaker 1: I mean is directly lifted from the pages of Don

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Speaker 1: Pendleton's the Executioner series, so I talk a lot about

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Speaker 1: that and where this character really came from and what

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Speaker 1: he really represents. And it's not the alt right, white

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Speaker 1: male combat veteran coming back home to brutalized criminals and

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Speaker 1: conduct extra judicial murder. So yeah, I mean check that

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Speaker 1: out on the News rep dot com. Probably by the

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00:23:28,920 --> 00:23:32,040
Speaker 1: time this is up, that'll be up. Uh. And on

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Speaker 1: the Hollywood front as well. Uh, there's a new season

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Speaker 1: of True Detective and the one of the stars is

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Speaker 1: a former marine, so we're gonna have him on. And

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Speaker 1: we're also going to finally have Max Martini on soon,

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Speaker 1: so I'm excited for both of those. Um. But today

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Speaker 1: we have Ed Derek on. I know he's standing by,

425
00:23:50,480 --> 00:23:54,160
Speaker 1: so let's get right to him. Back on the podcast.

426
00:23:54,840 --> 00:23:58,639
Speaker 1: Ed Derek author of War Moments, Images and Stories of

427
00:23:58,680 --> 00:24:03,320
Speaker 1: combat in Iraq, Afghanistan and beyond. As I mentioned in

428
00:24:03,320 --> 00:24:07,439
Speaker 1: the intro, Ed's last appearance was three fifteen, and you know,

429
00:24:07,720 --> 00:24:11,400
Speaker 1: not to boost ego too much. Ed the second biggest

430
00:24:11,440 --> 00:24:15,840
Speaker 1: show OFEN only behind Sergeant Major Mike Vining, which I

431
00:24:15,880 --> 00:24:18,600
Speaker 1: think was pretty cool. Um. And if you guys want

432
00:24:18,640 --> 00:24:21,840
Speaker 1: to hear about Operation Red Wings and extortion seventeen. Listen

433
00:24:21,880 --> 00:24:24,119
Speaker 1: back to that show today we're going to talk about

434
00:24:24,119 --> 00:24:26,720
Speaker 1: the new book and some other stuff. Awesome to have

435
00:24:26,760 --> 00:24:30,840
Speaker 1: you back on. It's been about a year, I believe. Yep,

436
00:24:31,040 --> 00:24:32,880
Speaker 1: thank you guys so much. It's always a really great

437
00:24:32,920 --> 00:24:36,280
Speaker 1: pleasure to work with you guys and communicating you guys

438
00:24:36,320 --> 00:24:38,160
Speaker 1: and talk and all that kind of stuff. So I

439
00:24:38,200 --> 00:24:41,680
Speaker 1: really appreciate it. Let me talk about the new book. Yeah,

440
00:24:41,840 --> 00:24:45,960
Speaker 1: time Flies. Thanks for coming on the show again. Ed, Hey, Jack,

441
00:24:46,000 --> 00:24:49,680
Speaker 1: how you doing. I'm good? How are you great? Super great?

442
00:24:49,880 --> 00:24:51,560
Speaker 1: I don't know if that's a real thing, but I'm

443
00:24:51,600 --> 00:24:56,640
Speaker 1: super great. So things are wonderful. Loving the new book

444
00:24:56,680 --> 00:24:58,960
Speaker 1: and all the projects I'm working on right now. Yeah.

445
00:24:58,960 --> 00:25:03,560
Speaker 1: It just came out today as we're recording this. Yep. Yeah,

446
00:25:03,720 --> 00:25:06,320
Speaker 1: yeah it's and I get the advanced copies and uh,

447
00:25:07,160 --> 00:25:10,560
Speaker 1: the publisher did an absolutely magnificent job. You know, photography

448
00:25:10,600 --> 00:25:14,080
Speaker 1: books are tough. Um, it's hard getting the colors just

449
00:25:14,200 --> 00:25:17,240
Speaker 1: right and the layout. They did a magnificent job and

450
00:25:17,280 --> 00:25:20,200
Speaker 1: the layout, and I'm really really happy with It's kind

451
00:25:20,200 --> 00:25:23,359
Speaker 1: of a dream project for me. Yeah, the pictures in

452
00:25:23,400 --> 00:25:28,199
Speaker 1: it are really beautiful, and I, um, I hate I

453
00:25:28,240 --> 00:25:30,000
Speaker 1: hate to even say this because it's not as if

454
00:25:30,080 --> 00:25:33,000
Speaker 1: I'm some sort of art critic. Um. But there's a

455
00:25:33,040 --> 00:25:36,080
Speaker 1: lot of wartime photography that just doesn't strike me right

456
00:25:36,160 --> 00:25:41,000
Speaker 1: because I think the photographers sometimes that they're extremely talented,

457
00:25:41,280 --> 00:25:43,560
Speaker 1: but the way they get the frames so perfect and

458
00:25:43,600 --> 00:25:45,920
Speaker 1: the lighting is just the right way. I look at

459
00:25:45,960 --> 00:25:48,880
Speaker 1: and it's just like, where does it really look like that? Um?

460
00:25:48,920 --> 00:25:51,359
Speaker 1: But when I looked at you know, through the book

461
00:25:51,400 --> 00:25:55,720
Speaker 1: that your publishers sent me, it's they are beautiful photographs,

462
00:25:55,720 --> 00:25:58,879
Speaker 1: but they're not staged photographs. I guess that's what I'm

463
00:25:58,880 --> 00:26:02,760
Speaker 1: trying to say. Yeah, that's and it's interesting you brought

464
00:26:02,760 --> 00:26:05,359
Speaker 1: that up because I didn't stage any of them, but

465
00:26:05,960 --> 00:26:09,199
Speaker 1: I saw the geometry of the image coming together, and

466
00:26:09,200 --> 00:26:11,679
Speaker 1: I would post. I would stage myself to wait for

467
00:26:11,720 --> 00:26:15,520
Speaker 1: the shot, you know, like for instance, this one called

468
00:26:16,000 --> 00:26:19,760
Speaker 1: into the Pesh where I was inbedded with Marines and uh,

469
00:26:19,880 --> 00:26:22,440
Speaker 1: coming down after the end of a pretty big combat operation,

470
00:26:22,520 --> 00:26:25,159
Speaker 1: and you know, I wanted I like silhouette shots. I

471
00:26:25,160 --> 00:26:28,680
Speaker 1: just think they're cool. And I saw, you know, this

472
00:26:28,800 --> 00:26:32,440
Speaker 1: one marine was your freest side by side. I was like, man,

473
00:26:32,640 --> 00:26:35,600
Speaker 1: the really lighting is it's low lighting and the backgrounds

474
00:26:35,600 --> 00:26:38,120
Speaker 1: lit up really beautifully. When gonna run ahead, I'm gonna

475
00:26:38,119 --> 00:26:40,480
Speaker 1: get down low and it comes by, I'm just gonna

476
00:26:40,520 --> 00:26:43,800
Speaker 1: start shooting frames, and sure enough it came out and

477
00:26:43,800 --> 00:26:46,280
Speaker 1: there's a lot like that. You know, the cover image

478
00:26:46,400 --> 00:26:48,400
Speaker 1: that's that was like that. That was actually the same

479
00:26:48,440 --> 00:26:51,520
Speaker 1: op And as we got up to the top of

480
00:26:51,560 --> 00:26:55,320
Speaker 1: this side of the mountain, uh, on the the edge

481
00:26:55,359 --> 00:26:57,600
Speaker 1: of the Petch River valley, you know, the sun was

482
00:26:57,640 --> 00:26:59,440
Speaker 1: just coming up, and I was like, this is perfect.

483
00:26:59,480 --> 00:27:02,760
Speaker 1: Mike was he was arresting. He's a he's a one

484
00:27:02,840 --> 00:27:05,560
Speaker 1: machine gunner and he's arresting with his two forty golf

485
00:27:05,600 --> 00:27:08,199
Speaker 1: over his shoulder with his pack on, and uh, I

486
00:27:08,240 --> 00:27:11,480
Speaker 1: know that was like, it's like my favorite photograph I've

487
00:27:11,520 --> 00:27:15,000
Speaker 1: ever taken, you know, It's just awesome. So, um, it

488
00:27:15,080 --> 00:27:16,800
Speaker 1: was just a great moment. You know, That's why I

489
00:27:16,800 --> 00:27:18,920
Speaker 1: call it war moments, because it was these great moments

490
00:27:18,920 --> 00:27:21,880
Speaker 1: that you know, you you pre visualize as a photographer,

491
00:27:21,920 --> 00:27:24,040
Speaker 1: you think, Okay, what do I want to get? And

492
00:27:24,080 --> 00:27:27,879
Speaker 1: then there's also sort of images of opportunity, moments of opportunity.

493
00:27:27,960 --> 00:27:30,439
Speaker 1: So what do you want to talk a little bit

494
00:27:30,480 --> 00:27:33,359
Speaker 1: about how this book came about? Um, Because I think

495
00:27:33,760 --> 00:27:35,439
Speaker 1: as I was looking through it, it's not just pictures

496
00:27:35,480 --> 00:27:41,399
Speaker 1: of Afghanistan either, m hm mm hmm. It's Afghanistan, Iraq

497
00:27:41,520 --> 00:27:45,080
Speaker 1: and then training, so it's the full spectrum. And I

498
00:27:45,200 --> 00:27:47,919
Speaker 1: really had this. I had this idea to come up

499
00:27:47,920 --> 00:27:51,199
Speaker 1: with a unique work. A lot of people ask me, like,

500
00:27:51,240 --> 00:27:53,480
Speaker 1: what's it like to go, you know, be embedded and

501
00:27:53,520 --> 00:27:55,520
Speaker 1: being a war zone and you know, you get you

502
00:27:55,560 --> 00:27:58,440
Speaker 1: get that and you know, not embedded but well actually

503
00:27:58,560 --> 00:28:01,080
Speaker 1: have been embedded. But all so, you know, as as

504
00:28:01,080 --> 00:28:03,360
Speaker 1: a member of the seventy five, you know, I'm sure

505
00:28:03,359 --> 00:28:04,960
Speaker 1: people are all the time like what's it like? What's

506
00:28:04,960 --> 00:28:06,679
Speaker 1: it like? I'm asking me what's it like? What's it like?

507
00:28:06,760 --> 00:28:08,720
Speaker 1: And they'll be like, well, a lot of it's fun

508
00:28:08,760 --> 00:28:12,879
Speaker 1: and they're like, really, how's it fun? It's fun, you know,

509
00:28:13,240 --> 00:28:16,480
Speaker 1: and uh, and sometimes it's scary and inside thought, gosh,

510
00:28:16,600 --> 00:28:21,119
Speaker 1: what if I put together photographs and also text because

511
00:28:21,960 --> 00:28:24,879
Speaker 1: you know, like most more books are text and then

512
00:28:24,880 --> 00:28:29,880
Speaker 1: they'll have a photo insert right, um and um. So

513
00:28:29,920 --> 00:28:32,359
Speaker 1: it's it's kind of a break. You're reading and then

514
00:28:32,359 --> 00:28:35,159
Speaker 1: you're like, oh, here's some photographs, but with this and

515
00:28:35,200 --> 00:28:37,840
Speaker 1: allow you can put you each photograph is like a

516
00:28:37,920 --> 00:28:41,360
Speaker 1: chapter each photograph and the associated texts, so I can

517
00:28:41,600 --> 00:28:43,480
Speaker 1: have an image and then right there you can read

518
00:28:43,520 --> 00:28:45,840
Speaker 1: about it. You know, it's about two words, so it's

519
00:28:45,880 --> 00:28:49,080
Speaker 1: like a short little article. Uh. There's a hundred and

520
00:28:49,080 --> 00:28:51,800
Speaker 1: eight teen of them in the book, and you can

521
00:28:52,080 --> 00:28:55,680
Speaker 1: sort of jump into that moment right that that you know,

522
00:28:55,760 --> 00:28:58,880
Speaker 1: they're just like, okay, spinning up ospreys at night. You

523
00:28:58,880 --> 00:29:00,880
Speaker 1: could see it and you and like, what's going on

524
00:29:00,880 --> 00:29:02,479
Speaker 1: in this picture? This is really cool? And you can

525
00:29:02,480 --> 00:29:04,720
Speaker 1: read about it. You know, I put in the technical

526
00:29:04,720 --> 00:29:07,720
Speaker 1: information to for people who are interested in so, and

527
00:29:07,920 --> 00:29:09,760
Speaker 1: I think that's really cool. And you go from one

528
00:29:09,760 --> 00:29:12,200
Speaker 1: picture you know you've got um, you know, I'm just

529
00:29:12,240 --> 00:29:14,840
Speaker 1: open the book right now, Like there's a bird that

530
00:29:14,920 --> 00:29:17,680
Speaker 1: made a nest in a muzzle of a howitzer. I

531
00:29:17,760 --> 00:29:21,200
Speaker 1: remember that one. So we are over old Soviet artillery piece.

532
00:29:21,240 --> 00:29:23,480
Speaker 1: And then you know, you turn the next page. You know,

533
00:29:23,560 --> 00:29:26,600
Speaker 1: that was an Afghanistan and that's like something you wouldn't expect,

534
00:29:27,240 --> 00:29:28,880
Speaker 1: and I thought, wow, I got to get this photograph.

535
00:29:28,960 --> 00:29:30,640
Speaker 1: And then you turn the next page and it's a

536
00:29:31,280 --> 00:29:33,880
Speaker 1: marine at the Mount Warfare Training Center in a blizzard,

537
00:29:34,200 --> 00:29:36,680
Speaker 1: and you know training and that is tough training, and

538
00:29:36,720 --> 00:29:38,720
Speaker 1: you look at it like I'm just looking at it

539
00:29:38,800 --> 00:29:41,000
Speaker 1: right now. I can and you know, I took the photograph,

540
00:29:41,080 --> 00:29:44,920
Speaker 1: so I remember, but man, it was cold and windy

541
00:29:44,960 --> 00:29:47,000
Speaker 1: and hard, and then you go to the next page

542
00:29:47,000 --> 00:29:49,080
Speaker 1: and then something else, and so you can, you know,

543
00:29:49,200 --> 00:29:52,200
Speaker 1: you can pick it up, you know, cover cover, pick

544
00:29:52,240 --> 00:29:54,240
Speaker 1: it up in the middle, or jump around, and it's

545
00:29:54,280 --> 00:29:56,520
Speaker 1: just kind of a you know, it's it's an immersive

546
00:29:56,560 --> 00:29:58,920
Speaker 1: I wanted it to be an immersive experience for for

547
00:29:59,320 --> 00:30:02,000
Speaker 1: readers and picture lovers. So that's that's what I set

548
00:30:02,000 --> 00:30:04,680
Speaker 1: out to do. And and I'm happy to report that that,

549
00:30:04,760 --> 00:30:08,880
Speaker 1: at least for me, I think I achieved it. So well,

550
00:30:09,080 --> 00:30:13,160
Speaker 1: we're familiar, uh, you know with your you know, written journalism.

551
00:30:13,240 --> 00:30:18,720
Speaker 1: But what got you into photography? Um, that's how this

552
00:30:18,800 --> 00:30:22,280
Speaker 1: all started, you know, it was photography I was. I

553
00:30:22,320 --> 00:30:25,120
Speaker 1: was interested in, you know, climbing mountains in high school.

554
00:30:25,640 --> 00:30:28,120
Speaker 1: And when I turned sixteen, I got a Bota X

555
00:30:28,200 --> 00:30:32,000
Speaker 1: three seventy camps film camera and I had a Volkswagen

556
00:30:32,040 --> 00:30:34,640
Speaker 1: Bug and I drove up to uh Mount with me

557
00:30:34,640 --> 00:30:36,080
Speaker 1: and I try to climb out with me, and I

558
00:30:36,120 --> 00:30:39,600
Speaker 1: just would take pictures of mountains along the way and

559
00:30:39,680 --> 00:30:43,120
Speaker 1: that rolled into uh, you know, ended up at the

560
00:30:43,120 --> 00:30:47,080
Speaker 1: Mount Warfare Training Center and uh but photography, and you

561
00:30:47,080 --> 00:30:49,520
Speaker 1: know that's kind of where I started following the Marines

562
00:30:49,560 --> 00:30:52,240
Speaker 1: around and then following you know, the d O D

563
00:30:52,320 --> 00:30:54,880
Speaker 1: you know, other services around in general. That's where it

564
00:30:54,920 --> 00:30:58,360
Speaker 1: all started. Um seart jumped there from the mountain or

565
00:30:58,400 --> 00:31:00,920
Speaker 1: anything over to the military thing Marine Corps Mount war

566
00:31:00,960 --> 00:31:07,480
Speaker 1: for a training center and yeah, I just and in college, um,

567
00:31:07,720 --> 00:31:14,360
Speaker 1: I'm donna have be cause right I can't remember. Oh yeah, okay, okay, Yeah.

568
00:31:14,640 --> 00:31:16,920
Speaker 1: And in college I had this professor of Nigel Allen.

569
00:31:17,000 --> 00:31:21,960
Speaker 1: He actually I was a geography professor and um and

570
00:31:22,120 --> 00:31:24,680
Speaker 1: uh he did a lot of his work in Afghanistan,

571
00:31:24,960 --> 00:31:27,680
Speaker 1: so I always would ask him about Afghanistan. Solf was

572
00:31:27,680 --> 00:31:31,160
Speaker 1: fascinated with it, and he took me aside one day

573
00:31:31,200 --> 00:31:33,800
Speaker 1: and he was, you know, ed, you're a funk up,

574
00:31:34,080 --> 00:31:36,520
Speaker 1: but you're pretty talented sunk up as a writer. I

575
00:31:36,520 --> 00:31:39,560
Speaker 1: think you should be a writer. And I thought my

576
00:31:39,640 --> 00:31:42,200
Speaker 1: uncle was a writer, and I thought, yeah, I was

577
00:31:42,440 --> 00:31:46,000
Speaker 1: in So I started, uh actually started a publishing company

578
00:31:46,000 --> 00:31:48,800
Speaker 1: in college and published my first book about climbing Nott

579
00:31:48,920 --> 00:31:52,320
Speaker 1: McKinley and so that's what set me on my path.

580
00:31:52,480 --> 00:31:55,880
Speaker 1: And you know, I, um, you know, this is a

581
00:31:55,920 --> 00:32:00,400
Speaker 1: book number six now and uh so I I go

582
00:32:00,480 --> 00:32:03,400
Speaker 1: back and forth between you know, photography and writing and

583
00:32:03,560 --> 00:32:06,760
Speaker 1: also some cartography as well. I love all those things,

584
00:32:07,120 --> 00:32:09,880
Speaker 1: like to put them all together in magazine articles and books.

585
00:32:10,720 --> 00:32:14,320
Speaker 1: Um but I just just you know, the Warm Moments

586
00:32:14,360 --> 00:32:18,360
Speaker 1: project was just one that I thought up and and

587
00:32:18,600 --> 00:32:22,360
Speaker 1: I queried a publisher and it was crazy, um like,

588
00:32:22,560 --> 00:32:28,680
Speaker 1: I had a contract within seventy two hours. So well,

589
00:32:28,680 --> 00:32:32,840
Speaker 1: it seems it must be incredibly important to have at

590
00:32:32,920 --> 00:32:36,560
Speaker 1: least some skill as a photographer, seeing how you know,

591
00:32:36,760 --> 00:32:40,960
Speaker 1: visually motivated we are nowadays, um as opposed to just

592
00:32:41,080 --> 00:32:44,600
Speaker 1: coming back with a uh you know, something like a

593
00:32:44,680 --> 00:32:51,560
Speaker 1: newswire piece, newswire article about what's going on in Afghanistan. Yeah,

594
00:32:51,760 --> 00:32:56,960
Speaker 1: I mean it's for you know, it's such a you know,

595
00:32:57,080 --> 00:33:00,280
Speaker 1: a dynamic multivariate process. You know, I've used that term

596
00:33:00,320 --> 00:33:04,520
Speaker 1: before and it's wordy, and but it really is true,

597
00:33:04,600 --> 00:33:07,560
Speaker 1: like I mean, in so many different ways, Like I never,

598
00:33:08,560 --> 00:33:10,719
Speaker 1: if I was awake, I was doing something, you know,

599
00:33:10,720 --> 00:33:12,760
Speaker 1: when I was embedded. It was never just sitting there,

600
00:33:13,680 --> 00:33:16,440
Speaker 1: you know, I was planning photography stuff or I was writing,

601
00:33:16,760 --> 00:33:20,720
Speaker 1: and when I was out outside the wire, especially in Iraq, man,

602
00:33:20,760 --> 00:33:23,560
Speaker 1: I was still fucking scared shitless of like losing a

603
00:33:23,640 --> 00:33:26,280
Speaker 1: limb or getting killed, because you know, I was embedded

604
00:33:26,320 --> 00:33:28,560
Speaker 1: with the second Italian Third Marines in Iraq and I'm

605
00:33:28,560 --> 00:33:30,400
Speaker 1: actually writing a book about them right now and that

606
00:33:30,520 --> 00:33:33,960
Speaker 1: deployment it's going to come out later this year. But uh,

607
00:33:34,240 --> 00:33:38,240
Speaker 1: I was like, oh, and you know it's it's indescribable. Well,

608
00:33:38,480 --> 00:33:41,520
Speaker 1: you know, you were arranged, so maybe you didn't, but

609
00:33:41,680 --> 00:33:45,640
Speaker 1: you know, I certainly was scared, fucking chiless. I put

610
00:33:45,640 --> 00:33:47,840
Speaker 1: the I put the camera up and I'd started taking

611
00:33:47,840 --> 00:33:50,840
Speaker 1: pictures and it was like some weird drug where I

612
00:33:51,120 --> 00:33:53,160
Speaker 1: you know, I was aware of the danger. You know,

613
00:33:53,200 --> 00:33:55,560
Speaker 1: there's no such thing as furiousness, but you know, I

614
00:33:55,640 --> 00:33:57,320
Speaker 1: was aware of the danger, but I was fine, and

615
00:33:57,360 --> 00:33:59,400
Speaker 1: I was taking some and I got some really pretty

616
00:33:59,400 --> 00:34:02,080
Speaker 1: fantastic images out of that. You know that I was

617
00:34:02,120 --> 00:34:04,360
Speaker 1: still back then, I was a late adopter. It was

618
00:34:04,400 --> 00:34:07,320
Speaker 1: an OH seven and uh so there was a whole

619
00:34:07,320 --> 00:34:09,680
Speaker 1: thing of like, you know, as I was going like

620
00:34:09,719 --> 00:34:11,600
Speaker 1: I would be changing film and some of the Marines

621
00:34:11,640 --> 00:34:13,640
Speaker 1: had laugh at me, like hey, combat Rilo, come on

622
00:34:13,719 --> 00:34:17,680
Speaker 1: hur Yeah, you know, it's a legitimate fear. Head. I mean,

623
00:34:17,760 --> 00:34:21,360
Speaker 1: we just had on the podcast Carmen Genteel, who pretty

624
00:34:21,440 --> 00:34:23,160
Speaker 1: much was doing the same thing as you and you know,

625
00:34:23,160 --> 00:34:26,120
Speaker 1: a journalist, but his eye was shattered and you know,

626
00:34:26,320 --> 00:34:29,799
Speaker 1: embedded with a unit and he wrote a whole book

627
00:34:29,800 --> 00:34:32,560
Speaker 1: about it. So it's it's a legitimate fear to have.

628
00:34:34,280 --> 00:34:36,480
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I mean, especially as I was in the

629
00:34:36,560 --> 00:34:40,359
Speaker 1: Triad Deeta Triad and that was the second time third

630
00:34:40,400 --> 00:34:44,680
Speaker 1: Marines deployment was oh six oh seven, um, and you

631
00:34:44,760 --> 00:34:47,480
Speaker 1: know I was thereafter. It was really bad. They they

632
00:34:47,719 --> 00:34:51,040
Speaker 1: they in a few months they got control everything, but

633
00:34:51,239 --> 00:34:55,200
Speaker 1: it was still it was still it was still Harry,

634
00:34:55,239 --> 00:34:57,480
Speaker 1: you know, I mean it was you know, it was

635
00:34:57,960 --> 00:34:59,719
Speaker 1: one of the chapters in the book I'm right right

636
00:34:59,760 --> 00:35:02,680
Speaker 1: now was uh, you know, against an army of ghosts

637
00:35:02,719 --> 00:35:06,680
Speaker 1: on a battlefield of shadows because those guys like it's

638
00:35:06,719 --> 00:35:09,480
Speaker 1: so frustrating, there's no clearly to find front. It's counter

639
00:35:09,520 --> 00:35:13,439
Speaker 1: insurgency campaign. They would throw grenades with people and just duck,

640
00:35:13,680 --> 00:35:16,920
Speaker 1: you know, uh and run and then who you shoot

641
00:35:16,960 --> 00:35:20,040
Speaker 1: back at and ur I E. D S and so yeah,

642
00:35:20,160 --> 00:35:24,320
Speaker 1: it is a really um it was you know I

643
00:35:24,440 --> 00:35:27,440
Speaker 1: think about Afghanistan. I went there four times, and you

644
00:35:27,520 --> 00:35:29,279
Speaker 1: know a lot of times I find myself grinned and

645
00:35:29,320 --> 00:35:32,560
Speaker 1: I think about Iraq and my sister Clinch because you know,

646
00:35:32,680 --> 00:35:36,840
Speaker 1: it was that was tough on those marines. Lost twenty

647
00:35:36,880 --> 00:35:42,360
Speaker 1: three marines in that deployment. So but yeah, the the

648
00:35:43,320 --> 00:35:45,759
Speaker 1: it's you know, it's dangerous. You know, once you I

649
00:35:45,800 --> 00:35:48,959
Speaker 1: don't care if you're a humongous fob or some tiny

650
00:35:49,040 --> 00:35:54,480
Speaker 1: little postage stamp combat outpost, you know, surrounded by taliban um.

651
00:35:55,000 --> 00:35:56,879
Speaker 1: It's you see, easy step foot in the war zone

652
00:35:56,920 --> 00:36:00,760
Speaker 1: is dangerous. So making it happen that day today grind

653
00:36:00,880 --> 00:36:03,279
Speaker 1: starts to wear on you too. When you're going out

654
00:36:03,320 --> 00:36:05,359
Speaker 1: into it every day. It's it's one thing to get

655
00:36:05,400 --> 00:36:08,200
Speaker 1: shot at once, but then another thing where every other

656
00:36:08,280 --> 00:36:10,920
Speaker 1: day you're getting shot at or blown up or whatever.

657
00:36:12,360 --> 00:36:17,279
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yeah, I mean it. Yeah, it's been you know,

658
00:36:17,400 --> 00:36:18,880
Speaker 1: it's been a while, but some of the members are

659
00:36:18,920 --> 00:36:21,520
Speaker 1: still pretty vivid. I you know, I remember, you know,

660
00:36:21,680 --> 00:36:24,279
Speaker 1: I'm being on patrol with this one squad and I

661
00:36:24,360 --> 00:36:28,000
Speaker 1: saw tubacock on the ground and I went to kick it,

662
00:36:28,160 --> 00:36:31,360
Speaker 1: and the squadly was like, fucking don't kick that. I

663
00:36:31,480 --> 00:36:33,160
Speaker 1: was like, what he goes you see this wall here,

664
00:36:33,520 --> 00:36:35,120
Speaker 1: that could be a trigger for an I eat, it's

665
00:36:35,160 --> 00:36:39,000
Speaker 1: hitting hitting this wall. And I was like, all right, sorry,

666
00:36:39,239 --> 00:36:42,840
Speaker 1: you know, I mean anything, you know, anything or like

667
00:36:42,920 --> 00:36:45,600
Speaker 1: crossing the field. I wrote about this one sprint for

668
00:36:45,680 --> 00:36:49,320
Speaker 1: cover the title this one photograph where I was actually

669
00:36:49,440 --> 00:36:52,480
Speaker 1: laughing because we had to sprint across this field, right,

670
00:36:52,840 --> 00:36:56,400
Speaker 1: and uh and I wanted to my my you know,

671
00:36:57,200 --> 00:36:59,240
Speaker 1: gut used to be like, Okay, I'm just gonna follow

672
00:36:59,280 --> 00:37:02,000
Speaker 1: a core you know, he's a machine gunner, file Robert,

673
00:37:02,080 --> 00:37:03,839
Speaker 1: he's a squad leader. And they're like, you can't follow

674
00:37:03,840 --> 00:37:05,239
Speaker 1: any of this. You've got to be dispersed, and so

675
00:37:05,400 --> 00:37:08,960
Speaker 1: just run across this field. Nobody run across the same spot.

676
00:37:09,640 --> 00:37:11,960
Speaker 1: And uh, you know, don't get blown up if you

677
00:37:12,200 --> 00:37:14,239
Speaker 1: if you're not dispersed, it's gonna do the you know,

678
00:37:14,320 --> 00:37:16,520
Speaker 1: the enemy a bigger target. That's that's who they're gonna

679
00:37:16,520 --> 00:37:19,920
Speaker 1: shoot at. And uh, I was just like running my

680
00:37:20,040 --> 00:37:23,319
Speaker 1: ass off and think, God, this is fucking crazy. But uh,

681
00:37:24,000 --> 00:37:27,640
Speaker 1: you know that's just um, that's that's like, you know,

682
00:37:27,760 --> 00:37:29,640
Speaker 1: like you said, life in the war zone and you

683
00:37:29,680 --> 00:37:32,600
Speaker 1: can't ever let your card down, right, I mean it's just, uh,

684
00:37:33,120 --> 00:37:34,920
Speaker 1: you've always got to be thinking all these things that

685
00:37:35,280 --> 00:37:37,520
Speaker 1: all these considerations that you don't have back here in

686
00:37:37,600 --> 00:37:42,239
Speaker 1: the in the normal world. Where was this was spread

687
00:37:42,280 --> 00:37:45,800
Speaker 1: across the field. It was in Afghanistan and Helmet. So

688
00:37:46,320 --> 00:37:49,480
Speaker 1: you know, we're hopping canals and jumping over mud walls,

689
00:37:49,600 --> 00:37:52,320
Speaker 1: and you know, you look at a map and I

690
00:37:52,400 --> 00:37:54,799
Speaker 1: even wrote about this where it was you're gonna mac

691
00:37:54,840 --> 00:37:56,600
Speaker 1: a helmet and it's just like flat. He's like, oh,

692
00:37:56,719 --> 00:38:00,040
Speaker 1: used an Afghanistan as tough as hell, you know, to

693
00:38:00,080 --> 00:38:03,000
Speaker 1: all the mountains, but I take eastern Afghanistan and all

694
00:38:03,040 --> 00:38:05,480
Speaker 1: this mountain any day over Helmet. Those canals that you

695
00:38:05,560 --> 00:38:08,040
Speaker 1: get a jump, those are the worst. You know. You

696
00:38:08,320 --> 00:38:11,160
Speaker 1: you deployed down there, right down to Helmont. Now I

697
00:38:11,239 --> 00:38:14,520
Speaker 1: was never in that area. Yeah, I mean you just

698
00:38:14,600 --> 00:38:16,400
Speaker 1: got these canals and I've got that one shot in

699
00:38:16,440 --> 00:38:20,920
Speaker 1: there called canal jump, and you just see, um the Marines.

700
00:38:21,160 --> 00:38:24,320
Speaker 1: He's holding spr what the Marines called spars like I

701
00:38:24,360 --> 00:38:26,279
Speaker 1: think it said. I think it's I think it's a

702
00:38:26,320 --> 00:38:31,120
Speaker 1: five five yeah, and you know it's got a supressed

703
00:38:31,200 --> 00:38:32,759
Speaker 1: on it. Think way, it's like ten pounds. You's got

704
00:38:33,800 --> 00:38:36,680
Speaker 1: you know, fifty pound pack on or thirty five pound

705
00:38:36,719 --> 00:38:39,960
Speaker 1: pack on flat kevlar plates in it, you know, and

706
00:38:40,000 --> 00:38:42,080
Speaker 1: the guys just jumping this thing. You know, if you miss,

707
00:38:42,360 --> 00:38:45,240
Speaker 1: you know, you're gonna you know, you might wake your ankle,

708
00:38:45,360 --> 00:38:47,879
Speaker 1: You're you know, twist your knee. And I'm thinking, yeah, man,

709
00:38:47,920 --> 00:38:52,120
Speaker 1: I way rather have the steeps of tun Our Province

710
00:38:52,200 --> 00:38:56,160
Speaker 1: than doing this stuff. But yeah, so you know all

711
00:38:56,239 --> 00:38:58,600
Speaker 1: these you know, like we're talking right now. It's kind

712
00:38:58,640 --> 00:39:00,520
Speaker 1: of the way I wrote the tech in the book

713
00:39:00,560 --> 00:39:03,120
Speaker 1: and there, because it's just, you know, I just wanted

714
00:39:03,160 --> 00:39:05,239
Speaker 1: to have it to be real, you know, like this

715
00:39:05,400 --> 00:39:07,400
Speaker 1: is what it's like, here's what it looks like, and

716
00:39:07,480 --> 00:39:11,040
Speaker 1: here's what's going through my head or our heads as

717
00:39:11,080 --> 00:39:13,680
Speaker 1: we're doing this stuff. And all the while, instead of

718
00:39:13,719 --> 00:39:15,719
Speaker 1: carrying an spr all you got as a camera in

719
00:39:15,760 --> 00:39:19,960
Speaker 1: your hand. Yeah, except a couple of times those guys

720
00:39:20,080 --> 00:39:22,040
Speaker 1: let me shoot back. It was fun. I'm not gonna lie,

721
00:39:22,600 --> 00:39:26,000
Speaker 1: but it was that I know what it's like to

722
00:39:26,440 --> 00:39:28,840
Speaker 1: put rounds down range in a firefight, not like you do,

723
00:39:29,040 --> 00:39:34,120
Speaker 1: but you know, I know it, so um um, Yeah,

724
00:39:34,400 --> 00:39:38,279
Speaker 1: it was interesting. I've had a lot of interesting experiences,

725
00:39:38,680 --> 00:39:42,680
Speaker 1: so very grateful. I wouldn't do it again, but I'm

726
00:39:42,760 --> 00:39:48,320
Speaker 1: very grateful. Well, the book looks amazing. How many pictures

727
00:39:48,360 --> 00:39:53,759
Speaker 1: did you say are in there? And the Yeah, there's

728
00:39:53,800 --> 00:39:56,239
Speaker 1: a there's a photo of me that doesn't count. And

729
00:39:56,320 --> 00:39:58,560
Speaker 1: then there's a photo that's on the forward, so that

730
00:39:58,560 --> 00:40:00,320
Speaker 1: would be a hundred nineteen. But there's no text with

731
00:40:00,400 --> 00:40:04,400
Speaker 1: that one. That's Ross Schneiderman's. Um, that's his before he

732
00:40:04,480 --> 00:40:08,279
Speaker 1: did the forward. Um. As you say, each picture is

733
00:40:08,320 --> 00:40:10,759
Speaker 1: accompanied by you know, a good amount of texts, so

734
00:40:11,400 --> 00:40:14,520
Speaker 1: the pictures are contextualized. Um. You know, if you go

735
00:40:14,680 --> 00:40:18,520
Speaker 1: into it not knowing anything about Afghanistan or Iraq or

736
00:40:18,640 --> 00:40:20,680
Speaker 1: not knowing much about the military. I mean, it does

737
00:40:20,719 --> 00:40:23,040
Speaker 1: a pretty thorough job of explaining what's going on in

738
00:40:23,080 --> 00:40:28,359
Speaker 1: each picture. Okay, yeah, thank you. I mean it's uh,

739
00:40:28,800 --> 00:40:33,040
Speaker 1: you know, and I wanted everything to be um. I

740
00:40:33,120 --> 00:40:36,120
Speaker 1: wanted everything to be different, you know, like some things

741
00:40:36,320 --> 00:40:43,680
Speaker 1: I write about, like, um, the the the technical aspect

742
00:40:43,760 --> 00:40:46,360
Speaker 1: is something like, uh, you know, I talked about the

743
00:40:46,400 --> 00:40:49,120
Speaker 1: mag tat the Marine Air Ground Task Force. UH, And

744
00:40:49,239 --> 00:40:52,640
Speaker 1: sometimes I talk about like, you know, it's kind of,

745
00:40:53,520 --> 00:40:55,600
Speaker 1: for lack of a better turn, touchy feely stuff. There's

746
00:40:55,600 --> 00:40:58,200
Speaker 1: a photo in there of a marine holding a puppy

747
00:40:58,640 --> 00:41:01,000
Speaker 1: and that was a puppy that lived once and at

748
00:41:01,040 --> 00:41:03,759
Speaker 1: this little combat up post, and it was like, you

749
00:41:03,840 --> 00:41:07,880
Speaker 1: know that again, not to be dramatic, but anytime you

750
00:41:07,920 --> 00:41:10,680
Speaker 1: go outside the wire, especially at that little place, you

751
00:41:10,760 --> 00:41:12,440
Speaker 1: know you might that might be the last time. And

752
00:41:12,560 --> 00:41:15,239
Speaker 1: so it's like escape time. You know, you hold this

753
00:41:15,320 --> 00:41:18,920
Speaker 1: puppy and uh pet it and um. You know it's

754
00:41:18,920 --> 00:41:21,759
Speaker 1: one thing to hold a puppy and pet it back here,

755
00:41:22,120 --> 00:41:24,680
Speaker 1: you know, at home. You know, it's like that's always great.

756
00:41:24,680 --> 00:41:28,920
Speaker 1: The whole puppy must allergic to dogs. Uh. And another thing,

757
00:41:29,040 --> 00:41:31,400
Speaker 1: it's like when you're about to go into combat. Right,

758
00:41:31,600 --> 00:41:35,440
Speaker 1: So there's that, and then there's stuff, you know, I

759
00:41:35,520 --> 00:41:38,840
Speaker 1: write about like the h F three Echo helicopter or

760
00:41:39,160 --> 00:41:42,040
Speaker 1: c HFT be Delta expending flares and you know why,

761
00:41:42,400 --> 00:41:44,480
Speaker 1: you know why they're expending flares and what the flares

762
00:41:44,520 --> 00:41:46,520
Speaker 1: are for. So I try to cover a lot of

763
00:41:46,560 --> 00:41:50,279
Speaker 1: stuff and uh, and I don't think it's disjointed, just

764
00:41:50,400 --> 00:41:54,040
Speaker 1: because of the nature the work. It's it's my favorite

765
00:41:54,040 --> 00:41:57,360
Speaker 1: photographs of war, and you know it's not like my

766
00:41:57,440 --> 00:42:01,359
Speaker 1: favorite photographs of helicopter gun ships. It's you know, there's

767
00:42:01,400 --> 00:42:05,399
Speaker 1: some of those in there, but it's everything so um, yeah,

768
00:42:05,760 --> 00:42:09,399
Speaker 1: that's uh, that's that's that's what I what I set

769
00:42:09,440 --> 00:42:13,160
Speaker 1: out to do. The dog photo reminds me of not

770
00:42:13,320 --> 00:42:15,440
Speaker 1: too long ago on the podcast. It was just one

771
00:42:15,480 --> 00:42:18,040
Speaker 1: that I did, but we had Craig gross on and

772
00:42:18,320 --> 00:42:21,799
Speaker 1: he wrote a book about his dog Fred and there

773
00:42:21,880 --> 00:42:24,080
Speaker 1: was a huge seller on Amazon. And it is cool

774
00:42:24,120 --> 00:42:27,239
Speaker 1: to hear about these guys who meet dogs while they're

775
00:42:27,520 --> 00:42:31,200
Speaker 1: down range and adopt them, i mean, bring them home

776
00:42:31,280 --> 00:42:33,320
Speaker 1: and have an attachment to them. That's pretty cool and

777
00:42:33,360 --> 00:42:37,759
Speaker 1: it's something you don't often hear about in the media. Yeah, yeah,

778
00:42:38,000 --> 00:42:42,319
Speaker 1: I um, the whole dogs and war thing, it's it's

779
00:42:42,360 --> 00:42:45,160
Speaker 1: really interesting. I have a friend who did that. Uh,

780
00:42:45,719 --> 00:42:49,160
Speaker 1: this friend of mine, Rob Rob McDonald and he, um,

781
00:42:49,480 --> 00:42:52,600
Speaker 1: he was in mar Sock and he uh, he had

782
00:42:52,640 --> 00:42:56,080
Speaker 1: a dog and that they just you know, he was

783
00:42:56,120 --> 00:42:59,000
Speaker 1: astray in Afghanistan and they brought it back. That's the

784
00:42:59,080 --> 00:43:02,520
Speaker 1: same with the Yeah. Then as of course there's the

785
00:43:03,360 --> 00:43:07,160
Speaker 1: Belgian malmois who malan y I think that's how to pronounced.

786
00:43:07,200 --> 00:43:10,080
Speaker 1: There's the combat of Salt dogs, and then there's also

787
00:43:10,120 --> 00:43:13,000
Speaker 1: I think some of the Black Labs and I had

788
00:43:13,040 --> 00:43:17,000
Speaker 1: a they were basically you know, bomb sniffing dogs. Um,

789
00:43:17,080 --> 00:43:20,359
Speaker 1: and I took some good photographs of those of those

790
00:43:20,400 --> 00:43:23,960
Speaker 1: animals when I was downrange with the Marines in Helmand.

791
00:43:24,840 --> 00:43:26,520
Speaker 1: Have one shot in there with one of these, I

792
00:43:26,600 --> 00:43:28,399
Speaker 1: think it's a black lab. I'm pretty sure it looks

793
00:43:28,440 --> 00:43:31,719
Speaker 1: like a black lab of um, you know, the dog

794
00:43:32,640 --> 00:43:40,040
Speaker 1: saying hi to his handler and h it's pretty cool shot. Sweet.

795
00:43:40,560 --> 00:43:44,280
Speaker 1: So I've taken a look through the book. It's pretty

796
00:43:44,360 --> 00:43:47,200
Speaker 1: rad I mean, honestly I got talking about before. I

797
00:43:47,239 --> 00:43:50,239
Speaker 1: mean they all look like these very very professionally shot,

798
00:43:50,360 --> 00:43:54,120
Speaker 1: but also very candid. Um. So I appreciated, uh, the

799
00:43:54,239 --> 00:43:58,600
Speaker 1: format in the style that that you went with. That thanks,

800
00:43:58,760 --> 00:44:00,839
Speaker 1: because you know, a lot of these autographs have been

801
00:44:01,000 --> 00:44:05,000
Speaker 1: used because you know, I'm an author and writer, you know,

802
00:44:05,080 --> 00:44:06,640
Speaker 1: I guess when you're an author and you write books

803
00:44:06,640 --> 00:44:08,719
Speaker 1: and a writer when you write magazine articles. But I'm

804
00:44:08,719 --> 00:44:12,600
Speaker 1: also a photographer, and uh, you know a lot of

805
00:44:12,640 --> 00:44:15,720
Speaker 1: these photographs have been used on covers of magazines and books.

806
00:44:15,920 --> 00:44:18,080
Speaker 1: You know. The the one was using the cover of

807
00:44:18,160 --> 00:44:21,440
Speaker 1: a John krak Our book um called Where Men Win

808
00:44:21,520 --> 00:44:25,520
Speaker 1: Glory about Pat Tillman, uh, you know, and another shot

809
00:44:25,560 --> 00:44:27,680
Speaker 1: of mine was using the cover of stern Or. One

810
00:44:27,719 --> 00:44:30,760
Speaker 1: of the shots was used on the cover of Newsweek

811
00:44:30,920 --> 00:44:33,480
Speaker 1: and another on the cover of Time magazine special editions.

812
00:44:33,560 --> 00:44:38,840
Speaker 1: So they you know, I kinda I looked towards what

813
00:44:38,960 --> 00:44:42,120
Speaker 1: the market saw and like, okay, this is some of

814
00:44:42,160 --> 00:44:45,600
Speaker 1: the market's favorite favorite images of mine. And I thought, okay,

815
00:44:45,640 --> 00:44:47,640
Speaker 1: why is that? And you know they've done really well,

816
00:44:47,920 --> 00:44:51,560
Speaker 1: and I thought I put them together and um, and

817
00:44:51,840 --> 00:44:54,080
Speaker 1: an attached narrative to it. You know, you you you

818
00:44:54,200 --> 00:44:58,000
Speaker 1: hear this, a picture tells the story, right, You've probably

819
00:44:58,040 --> 00:45:00,640
Speaker 1: heard that, And I don't believe that because you know,

820
00:45:02,200 --> 00:45:04,000
Speaker 1: a picture is a picture. It's like, how does it

821
00:45:04,040 --> 00:45:06,400
Speaker 1: tell a story? You know, unless it's a picture of

822
00:45:06,440 --> 00:45:09,200
Speaker 1: a page of a book of one page stories, it

823
00:45:09,280 --> 00:45:12,480
Speaker 1: doesn't tell a story. But but there's at least a

824
00:45:12,640 --> 00:45:15,480
Speaker 1: few stories behind each image, you know, like the the

825
00:45:15,640 --> 00:45:19,320
Speaker 1: image on the cover that's Mike shoul and um, you

826
00:45:19,400 --> 00:45:22,880
Speaker 1: know there's the story of like you know, where are we?

827
00:45:23,120 --> 00:45:24,600
Speaker 1: You know, that could have been a that could have

828
00:45:24,640 --> 00:45:28,120
Speaker 1: been in Los Angeles, you know, with a stage behind it,

829
00:45:28,600 --> 00:45:30,880
Speaker 1: but it was in Afghanistan. And you know, is it

830
00:45:30,960 --> 00:45:32,880
Speaker 1: a soldier or is it a marine? Who is you

831
00:45:32,920 --> 00:45:35,000
Speaker 1: know who is this. And you know he's a marine,

832
00:45:35,040 --> 00:45:38,279
Speaker 1: he's a marine machine gunner and who is it? Uh?

833
00:45:38,440 --> 00:45:41,240
Speaker 1: You know, he's a member of Echo Companies, Segmentalian third Marines.

834
00:45:41,400 --> 00:45:43,960
Speaker 1: And he was twenty years old at the time, and

835
00:45:44,400 --> 00:45:46,520
Speaker 1: you know, as you do and war zones. We He

836
00:45:46,600 --> 00:45:50,600
Speaker 1: and I became good friends quickly. Uh. And I met

837
00:45:50,680 --> 00:45:54,680
Speaker 1: his wife upon when they went back to Hawaii K

838
00:45:54,840 --> 00:45:57,960
Speaker 1: Bay where they were based out of. And then I

839
00:45:58,040 --> 00:46:00,759
Speaker 1: saw him again and and the taxiecors are going to

840
00:46:00,840 --> 00:46:03,040
Speaker 1: Comment Center when they're getting ready to go to Iraq

841
00:46:03,520 --> 00:46:06,120
Speaker 1: and uh, and I never saw him again. And his

842
00:46:06,280 --> 00:46:08,520
Speaker 1: daughter was born and he got blown up by an

843
00:46:08,560 --> 00:46:10,919
Speaker 1: I d and they never met his daughter. So that's

844
00:46:10,960 --> 00:46:14,440
Speaker 1: the story. That's a story behind that photograph, you know,

845
00:46:14,520 --> 00:46:18,919
Speaker 1: twenty one years old and you know, and so which

846
00:46:19,040 --> 00:46:22,279
Speaker 1: stories you choose to tell about each image, because yeah,

847
00:46:22,320 --> 00:46:26,840
Speaker 1: they're striking, they're beautiful, they're candid, they're real. Uh. But

848
00:46:27,280 --> 00:46:30,279
Speaker 1: you know, to really give like this immersive experience, it's

849
00:46:30,400 --> 00:46:35,799
Speaker 1: it's a good thing, I think two to really um,

850
00:46:36,360 --> 00:46:40,360
Speaker 1: you know, put put words to photographs, like did you

851
00:46:40,440 --> 00:46:43,320
Speaker 1: hear from that? Was? I was just gonna did you

852
00:46:43,400 --> 00:46:45,600
Speaker 1: hear from any of his friends or family members that

853
00:46:45,640 --> 00:46:49,279
Speaker 1: you chose that image for the cover of the book. Yeah, yeah,

854
00:46:49,320 --> 00:46:55,080
Speaker 1: I'm friends. Um. Um, you know, it's um, it's a

855
00:46:55,160 --> 00:46:58,000
Speaker 1: delicate thing because sometimes you know, I was talking to

856
00:46:58,040 --> 00:47:02,240
Speaker 1: a friend of mine, Rob and uh, he was telling

857
00:47:02,280 --> 00:47:04,560
Speaker 1: me when he was talking to was his uncle or

858
00:47:04,600 --> 00:47:08,160
Speaker 1: something like that he was in Vietnam. He he was

859
00:47:08,280 --> 00:47:13,320
Speaker 1: on that deployment. And Rob was saying, when was it

860
00:47:14,160 --> 00:47:16,080
Speaker 1: after you got back from Vietnam that you went a

861
00:47:16,200 --> 00:47:20,759
Speaker 1: full day without thinking about it? And his uncle was

862
00:47:20,840 --> 00:47:25,359
Speaker 1: like never, you know, and um, He's like, when am

863
00:47:25,400 --> 00:47:28,080
Speaker 1: I not going to think about this for for a day?

864
00:47:28,800 --> 00:47:32,480
Speaker 1: And so I think about the family members and you know,

865
00:47:33,480 --> 00:47:36,000
Speaker 1: like that photograph was used on a on a Hallmark

866
00:47:36,120 --> 00:47:39,960
Speaker 1: greeting card and some people would think that's really that's

867
00:47:40,000 --> 00:47:43,120
Speaker 1: really cheesy, that's lame, but they love it. They love

868
00:47:43,200 --> 00:47:45,399
Speaker 1: going to you know, it was for the Marine Corps

869
00:47:45,560 --> 00:47:48,600
Speaker 1: for Memorial Day, you know, the Hallmark came out with

870
00:47:48,800 --> 00:47:50,320
Speaker 1: or they have a line of cards and once for

871
00:47:50,400 --> 00:47:52,680
Speaker 1: the Army for Memorial Day, once for the Navy, and

872
00:47:53,160 --> 00:47:55,920
Speaker 1: that was the Marine Corps one. And it made him

873
00:47:55,920 --> 00:47:58,360
Speaker 1: feel great because it's like, you know, Mike's living on

874
00:47:59,239 --> 00:48:02,320
Speaker 1: and you know, I and but at the same time, like,

875
00:48:02,800 --> 00:48:05,120
Speaker 1: you know, I don't want to call up and and

876
00:48:05,280 --> 00:48:07,840
Speaker 1: be like, let's talk about Mike and and just I

877
00:48:07,920 --> 00:48:10,719
Speaker 1: imagine I'm thinking, God, I had this moment where I

878
00:48:10,800 --> 00:48:14,719
Speaker 1: didn't think about, you know, the loss, and U asked,

879
00:48:14,760 --> 00:48:18,480
Speaker 1: I'll have to call up and remind me, right, So it's, uh,

880
00:48:19,000 --> 00:48:21,640
Speaker 1: it's it's it's one of those things. But it's kind

881
00:48:21,680 --> 00:48:24,799
Speaker 1: of like almost like a family type of thing at

882
00:48:24,840 --> 00:48:29,200
Speaker 1: this point. So and I post the pictures and and

883
00:48:29,480 --> 00:48:32,120
Speaker 1: you know, on Facebook or Twitter or whatever, and I

884
00:48:32,280 --> 00:48:35,040
Speaker 1: hear from people and they love it, you know, and

885
00:48:35,239 --> 00:48:38,840
Speaker 1: it's uh, you know, it's respectful. Um, you know, I

886
00:48:39,719 --> 00:48:41,719
Speaker 1: I uh, you know, I'm supposed to be objective, but

887
00:48:41,800 --> 00:48:43,680
Speaker 1: you know, I'm pro military, and there's no there's no

888
00:48:44,680 --> 00:48:48,000
Speaker 1: there's no uh, you know, anybody who knows the stuff

889
00:48:48,040 --> 00:48:50,520
Speaker 1: the work that I do. You know, I am pro military,

890
00:48:50,920 --> 00:48:53,600
Speaker 1: and uh and I believe in the mission and you know,

891
00:48:53,719 --> 00:48:56,560
Speaker 1: I believe, you know, and and what those guys are doing.

892
00:48:56,960 --> 00:48:58,919
Speaker 1: And a lot of people don't know what they're really

893
00:48:59,000 --> 00:49:01,560
Speaker 1: doing and what you guys are really doing, and and

894
00:49:01,760 --> 00:49:03,400
Speaker 1: you know, they want to attach narrative to it, and

895
00:49:03,680 --> 00:49:06,800
Speaker 1: you know, I don't politicized stuff or get into that.

896
00:49:07,040 --> 00:49:09,440
Speaker 1: But you know it's like, here's war. Here's how it

897
00:49:09,600 --> 00:49:12,960
Speaker 1: is as I saw it, you know how I experienced it.

898
00:49:13,239 --> 00:49:18,640
Speaker 1: So that's that's what the book is all about. Uh.

899
00:49:19,000 --> 00:49:21,239
Speaker 1: It sounds like you're a busy bee and got plenty

900
00:49:21,280 --> 00:49:25,640
Speaker 1: of other books and projects in the works as well. Yeah,

901
00:49:25,960 --> 00:49:31,959
Speaker 1: well we got some Red Wings stuff going on. Two projects. One,

902
00:49:32,360 --> 00:49:34,440
Speaker 1: I can't wait, Jack to get you in touch with

903
00:49:34,600 --> 00:49:37,399
Speaker 1: Tony Brooks. Um. He and I are working on a book.

904
00:49:37,440 --> 00:49:41,000
Speaker 1: He was in Charlie two five he recovered to Turban

905
00:49:41,040 --> 00:49:44,440
Speaker 1: three three. Uh, and he was there when you know,

906
00:49:45,239 --> 00:49:47,920
Speaker 1: when they were doing the rescuing the recovery on Operation

907
00:49:47,960 --> 00:49:51,160
Speaker 1: Red Wings. And we're doing a book right now. Interesting,

908
00:49:51,600 --> 00:49:56,840
Speaker 1: So yep, Yeah, he's a great guy. Man. I cannot

909
00:49:56,920 --> 00:49:58,880
Speaker 1: wait till you get to talk to him. You know

910
00:49:59,320 --> 00:50:03,359
Speaker 1: it sounds in saying yeah and then um. Also, I'm

911
00:50:03,400 --> 00:50:06,880
Speaker 1: doing a project. I really can't get two into this,

912
00:50:07,000 --> 00:50:10,560
Speaker 1: but it's on Danny Deets, one of the the seals

913
00:50:10,640 --> 00:50:15,880
Speaker 1: of the Reconnaissance and Surveillance Foreman Team. I'm working with

914
00:50:16,000 --> 00:50:19,160
Speaker 1: some people. I'm actually it's I'm doing this with the

915
00:50:19,320 --> 00:50:21,000
Speaker 1: Ross who did I don't know if you remember the

916
00:50:21,040 --> 00:50:23,839
Speaker 1: glob article was a cover of Newsweek that I helped

917
00:50:23,920 --> 00:50:27,279
Speaker 1: he wrote it. I helped him with that, and uh,

918
00:50:27,520 --> 00:50:30,040
Speaker 1: he and I are doing um, he and I are

919
00:50:30,080 --> 00:50:32,759
Speaker 1: doing a project on Danny Deets because there's a lot

920
00:50:32,840 --> 00:50:34,600
Speaker 1: more to him and that part of the story than

921
00:50:34,680 --> 00:50:38,840
Speaker 1: people know. Uh. He hasn't necessarily been portrayed that accurately.

922
00:50:39,320 --> 00:50:43,800
Speaker 1: So broken on, so on. A On a separate but

923
00:50:43,920 --> 00:50:46,160
Speaker 1: somewhat related topic, what do you think about all this

924
00:50:46,200 --> 00:50:48,640
Speaker 1: stuff that came out about Chapman over the last year.

925
00:50:50,280 --> 00:50:54,000
Speaker 1: I think it's disgusting, you know, I mean I think that. Um,

926
00:50:54,400 --> 00:50:57,680
Speaker 1: I think that you know, apparently you know from what

927
00:50:57,800 --> 00:50:59,319
Speaker 1: I know, from what I've read, it seems like they

928
00:50:59,400 --> 00:51:03,840
Speaker 1: try to block him getting getting an h to protect

929
00:51:03,880 --> 00:51:10,719
Speaker 1: the cover story. Yeah. I just um, again, there's more

930
00:51:10,760 --> 00:51:15,799
Speaker 1: to that story. I wish I could say, Um, it's

931
00:51:16,000 --> 00:51:19,920
Speaker 1: um just some behind the scenes stuff. Uh what do

932
00:51:20,000 --> 00:51:23,279
Speaker 1: you think about it? Curious to know your thoughts. UM.

933
00:51:25,160 --> 00:51:30,560
Speaker 1: I think that it's definitely a complicated subject. I have trouble,

934
00:51:31,080 --> 00:51:35,279
Speaker 1: um placing too much blame on the operators that were

935
00:51:35,320 --> 00:51:38,239
Speaker 1: on the ground that day, because I know they made

936
00:51:38,320 --> 00:51:43,840
Speaker 1: some difficult decisions in combat conditions. Um I, uh so,

937
00:51:43,960 --> 00:51:47,279
Speaker 1: I'm very hesitant to start, you know, throwing around accusations

938
00:51:47,320 --> 00:51:51,120
Speaker 1: of cowardice, that they ran away or something like that. Um.

939
00:51:52,400 --> 00:51:56,160
Speaker 1: There was the one theory advanced in um in the

940
00:51:56,400 --> 00:51:59,360
Speaker 1: Nailor article about it that I thought was interesting that

941
00:52:00,400 --> 00:52:04,280
Speaker 1: they saw a dead body and thought it was Chapman,

942
00:52:05,160 --> 00:52:07,080
Speaker 1: and so in their minds that they thought, and so

943
00:52:07,160 --> 00:52:10,799
Speaker 1: they confused the bodies and that was why they As

944
00:52:10,840 --> 00:52:12,680
Speaker 1: bad as it is to leave the remains of an

945
00:52:12,680 --> 00:52:17,239
Speaker 1: American soldier behind, they in their minds really legitimately may

946
00:52:17,320 --> 00:52:20,799
Speaker 1: have thought that he had expired, um, and they didn't

947
00:52:20,800 --> 00:52:23,360
Speaker 1: realize they were leaving behind someone who is alive. So

948
00:52:23,480 --> 00:52:28,399
Speaker 1: what the truth is I don't know. Um Chapman, I mean,

949
00:52:28,480 --> 00:52:31,320
Speaker 1: it seems quite clear that he fought heroically to the

950
00:52:31,400 --> 00:52:36,040
Speaker 1: last bullet and beyond. Um, so I absolutely deserves that

951
00:52:36,120 --> 00:52:40,480
Speaker 1: a war and uh, you know, the part that discussed

952
00:52:40,520 --> 00:52:45,080
Speaker 1: me is that is the is the possibility, just even

953
00:52:45,120 --> 00:52:48,120
Speaker 1: the possibility discussed me that that that ward was trying

954
00:52:48,160 --> 00:52:50,279
Speaker 1: to be blocked for him, you know, when he did that.

955
00:52:50,680 --> 00:52:54,040
Speaker 1: I mean, that's unbelievable. It's the way, it's the waysw

956
00:52:54,360 --> 00:52:57,960
Speaker 1: behaved at a political level. More than what any of

957
00:52:58,040 --> 00:53:00,600
Speaker 1: those guys did on the ground that day, rightly or wrongly.

958
00:53:00,760 --> 00:53:04,000
Speaker 1: From my point of view, Yeah, I agree with you.

959
00:53:04,160 --> 00:53:08,880
Speaker 1: I'm I am in phase if you're thinking that one. Uh.

960
00:53:09,160 --> 00:53:11,799
Speaker 1: And again, you know, it's like unless you were there

961
00:53:11,880 --> 00:53:15,680
Speaker 1: to to see, um, I guess there was some predator

962
00:53:15,760 --> 00:53:20,120
Speaker 1: feed that apparently some claim is inconclusive, but uh, you know,

963
00:53:20,760 --> 00:53:26,880
Speaker 1: they saw a movement, so uh but I mean, I

964
00:53:27,680 --> 00:53:30,880
Speaker 1: it's just unfortunate. I think one of the things that

965
00:53:31,080 --> 00:53:34,520
Speaker 1: really turns my stomach, that's really come to term my stomach,

966
00:53:34,640 --> 00:53:37,279
Speaker 1: is the way some of the family, what they have

967
00:53:37,440 --> 00:53:43,040
Speaker 1: to endure, um in the wake of all this. Uh. Again,

968
00:53:43,120 --> 00:53:45,400
Speaker 1: I can't get too into it, but one of the

969
00:53:45,880 --> 00:53:48,800
Speaker 1: one of the projects I'm working on right now. You know,

970
00:53:48,960 --> 00:53:51,719
Speaker 1: you see, it's just like a meat grinder what it

971
00:53:51,800 --> 00:53:55,839
Speaker 1: does to the family members, you know. Um, And it's

972
00:53:56,000 --> 00:53:58,400
Speaker 1: it's just a lot of people just want to be

973
00:53:58,520 --> 00:54:01,880
Speaker 1: left alone. They don't want to be reminded, like I

974
00:54:02,000 --> 00:54:05,759
Speaker 1: was talking about, and then it was you know, and

975
00:54:05,840 --> 00:54:08,480
Speaker 1: then when when when this kind of stuff comes up,

976
00:54:08,560 --> 00:54:13,040
Speaker 1: when someone has denied something that they clearly deserve, that's

977
00:54:13,120 --> 00:54:16,520
Speaker 1: just I can't even I can't even have fathom that.

978
00:54:17,080 --> 00:54:19,759
Speaker 1: It's just especially for the parents and the you know,

979
00:54:20,000 --> 00:54:23,839
Speaker 1: the you know, the family members and friends. So it's

980
00:54:24,440 --> 00:54:28,680
Speaker 1: very difficult to ascertain exactly what happens in a firefight.

981
00:54:28,920 --> 00:54:30,960
Speaker 1: But the Pentagon at the same time doesn't have a

982
00:54:31,080 --> 00:54:34,160
Speaker 1: very good track record. You can recall, you know, what

983
00:54:34,320 --> 00:54:37,680
Speaker 1: happened to the Tillman family and how they were told

984
00:54:37,760 --> 00:54:41,359
Speaker 1: that he died heroically under enemy fire and then later

985
00:54:41,480 --> 00:54:43,920
Speaker 1: on find out that it was a friendly fire incident.

986
00:54:44,040 --> 00:54:45,400
Speaker 1: And I mean, how do how do you think the

987
00:54:45,440 --> 00:54:47,640
Speaker 1: family feels about that? How do you how much trust

988
00:54:47,680 --> 00:54:49,560
Speaker 1: do you think they have left in the Pentagon after

989
00:54:49,640 --> 00:54:54,800
Speaker 1: going through something like that exactly? I mean, I can't

990
00:54:55,200 --> 00:54:57,239
Speaker 1: you know, I can't answer that question on you. You're

991
00:54:57,239 --> 00:55:00,200
Speaker 1: just thrown it out there. But I mean, it's it's um,

992
00:55:01,040 --> 00:55:06,640
Speaker 1: it's it's all. It's horrible. UM. And yeah too too,

993
00:55:07,920 --> 00:55:09,239
Speaker 1: you know, I guess what do they say the first

994
00:55:09,320 --> 00:55:12,200
Speaker 1: councult towards the truth. I don't know if I buy that,

995
00:55:12,880 --> 00:55:17,719
Speaker 1: but in some instances it's certainly true. And you know,

996
00:55:17,840 --> 00:55:20,719
Speaker 1: I was talking to a member of a unit. I

997
00:55:20,800 --> 00:55:24,279
Speaker 1: won't say which one, but he was saying that in

998
00:55:24,400 --> 00:55:27,520
Speaker 1: this in this world, in this particular world, it is

999
00:55:27,600 --> 00:55:31,839
Speaker 1: so cut for a and you know, they eat their own,

1000
00:55:32,400 --> 00:55:36,239
Speaker 1: they even eat their own, not just members of other units. Now,

1001
00:55:36,800 --> 00:55:38,480
Speaker 1: I don't think that's the way it is with the

1002
00:55:38,560 --> 00:55:42,640
Speaker 1: seventy Ranger Regiment at all. You know, from what I know,

1003
00:55:42,760 --> 00:55:46,560
Speaker 1: I don't know a lot, but I can definitely see

1004
00:55:46,560 --> 00:55:49,440
Speaker 1: how it is with others, With other ones. I mean

1005
00:55:49,920 --> 00:55:52,560
Speaker 1: in the Marine Corps. They jokingly say we eat their own,

1006
00:55:52,600 --> 00:55:56,239
Speaker 1: but they really don't. But you know, they're very competitive

1007
00:55:56,320 --> 00:56:00,520
Speaker 1: with each other. It's very type day. But boy, you know,

1008
00:56:00,600 --> 00:56:04,480
Speaker 1: it's been an eye opener. Let me I write in

1009
00:56:04,680 --> 00:56:07,480
Speaker 1: in my my own memoir that I'm kind of wrapping

1010
00:56:07,560 --> 00:56:11,480
Speaker 1: up now. I read about this incident in Iraq when

1011
00:56:11,520 --> 00:56:15,239
Speaker 1: I was with the Ranger Regiment and it was we

1012
00:56:15,640 --> 00:56:18,800
Speaker 1: killed the terrorist. Um. Well, within the r O S

1013
00:56:19,480 --> 00:56:22,800
Speaker 1: everything was legit. Um. I was in the first vehicle

1014
00:56:22,840 --> 00:56:24,880
Speaker 1: in the convoy. I was the one that had you know,

1015
00:56:25,040 --> 00:56:27,480
Speaker 1: eyes on him and ordered my gun or to open

1016
00:56:27,560 --> 00:56:30,239
Speaker 1: fire on him, so on and so forth. Uh. And

1017
00:56:30,320 --> 00:56:33,880
Speaker 1: then when I got back to the FOB, um, I

1018
00:56:33,960 --> 00:56:36,040
Speaker 1: think I remember reading about this, or I listened to

1019
00:56:36,160 --> 00:56:38,600
Speaker 1: a podcast. I've heard this story. I've heard this where

1020
00:56:39,040 --> 00:56:40,840
Speaker 1: where a guy came out of the talk and he

1021
00:56:40,920 --> 00:56:43,040
Speaker 1: started telling me that the terrorist had a gun and

1022
00:56:43,120 --> 00:56:45,359
Speaker 1: he was shooting it over his shoulder as he walked

1023
00:56:45,400 --> 00:56:49,560
Speaker 1: away from us. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't know

1024
00:56:49,640 --> 00:56:52,320
Speaker 1: where I've seen that. I may I may have written

1025
00:56:52,400 --> 00:56:54,839
Speaker 1: something about it or said something about it, But I'm

1026
00:56:54,880 --> 00:56:57,920
Speaker 1: just looking at this dude, like and he said, he

1027
00:56:58,360 --> 00:57:00,960
Speaker 1: this was the amazing part. He's saying. We saw the

1028
00:57:01,040 --> 00:57:03,160
Speaker 1: whole thing. We watched the whole thing on the Predator

1029
00:57:03,280 --> 00:57:05,600
Speaker 1: drone feed, and we saw that he was shooting a

1030
00:57:05,680 --> 00:57:09,719
Speaker 1: glock over his shoulder at you. Now, motherfucker explained to

1031
00:57:09,840 --> 00:57:13,880
Speaker 1: me how you knew you knew the type of pistol

1032
00:57:14,040 --> 00:57:17,560
Speaker 1: he was shooting from the Predator feed footage. Really yeah,

1033
00:57:18,240 --> 00:57:22,040
Speaker 1: fromt on that flear on that L three flear ball,

1034
00:57:22,520 --> 00:57:25,160
Speaker 1: you can you can you can tell the difference between

1035
00:57:25,480 --> 00:57:28,200
Speaker 1: you an H and K and a glock. Really, So,

1036
00:57:28,520 --> 00:57:32,160
Speaker 1: when when people say the first casualty of war is truth,

1037
00:57:32,240 --> 00:57:36,160
Speaker 1: I know exactly what they mean by that. Yeah, I mean,

1038
00:57:36,200 --> 00:57:38,760
Speaker 1: are we really were really really far from that? Though,

1039
00:57:39,240 --> 00:57:41,320
Speaker 1: because I can tell you this, I mean, it's totally

1040
00:57:41,360 --> 00:57:43,760
Speaker 1: different technology. But I was kind of surprised by this.

1041
00:57:43,960 --> 00:57:47,320
Speaker 1: People have jokingly been saying, how this new trend on

1042
00:57:47,440 --> 00:57:50,440
Speaker 1: Facebook this week about posting like your ten year throwback.

1043
00:57:50,840 --> 00:57:53,160
Speaker 1: There's been a bunch of memes going around. Oh you're

1044
00:57:53,200 --> 00:57:58,200
Speaker 1: helping uh Mark Zuckerberg and Facebook's facial recognition technology. But

1045
00:57:58,440 --> 00:58:01,040
Speaker 1: let me tell you something. My end who works at

1046
00:58:01,080 --> 00:58:03,040
Speaker 1: the high school, I want to send me a photo

1047
00:58:03,120 --> 00:58:05,520
Speaker 1: of my two thousand three yearbook. All right, it's a

1048
00:58:05,600 --> 00:58:09,240
Speaker 1: long time ago. My face has changed considerably. I posted

1049
00:58:09,320 --> 00:58:12,600
Speaker 1: that photo and without me doing anything, Facebook tag both

1050
00:58:12,760 --> 00:58:15,160
Speaker 1: me and my friend who was above me. So I

1051
00:58:15,240 --> 00:58:19,520
Speaker 1: mean if facial if facial recognition could tell me, uh

1052
00:58:19,840 --> 00:58:22,240
Speaker 1: you could tell what I looked like from over fifteen

1053
00:58:22,360 --> 00:58:25,560
Speaker 1: years ago, then I mean, are we really that far

1054
00:58:25,680 --> 00:58:27,760
Speaker 1: from a predator drone being able to tell what gun

1055
00:58:27,800 --> 00:58:30,920
Speaker 1: you're shooting? Well, I mean maybe a spy satellite or

1056
00:58:31,280 --> 00:58:34,440
Speaker 1: some highly developed optic could, But I mean at you know,

1057
00:58:34,520 --> 00:58:36,920
Speaker 1: this drone was probably a fifteen thousand feet up with

1058
00:58:36,960 --> 00:58:40,160
Speaker 1: a black and white screen. Um back in two thousand

1059
00:58:40,280 --> 00:58:43,840
Speaker 1: and five, with you know, five second delay. No, he

1060
00:58:43,880 --> 00:58:45,680
Speaker 1: couldn't tell what type of gun it went. And the

1061
00:58:45,760 --> 00:58:48,120
Speaker 1: point I was making with that story is that there

1062
00:58:48,280 --> 00:58:50,560
Speaker 1: was no gun like that whole thing is bullshit. He

1063
00:58:50,680 --> 00:58:52,720
Speaker 1: was never shooting at it. But I'm just saying, would

1064
00:58:52,760 --> 00:58:55,520
Speaker 1: it be possible in the near future that that will

1065
00:58:55,560 --> 00:58:59,040
Speaker 1: be able to sure eventually? Yeah? I mean, well look,

1066
00:58:59,120 --> 00:59:01,480
Speaker 1: I mean there's two great topics when I'm writing about

1067
00:59:01,560 --> 00:59:06,960
Speaker 1: right now in terms of um, you know resolution, Um yeah,

1068
00:59:07,120 --> 00:59:10,440
Speaker 1: I mean there are imagers that from that altitude you

1069
00:59:10,520 --> 00:59:13,280
Speaker 1: could you could resolve that uh and be able to

1070
00:59:13,360 --> 00:59:17,000
Speaker 1: determine what type of weapon it was. Uh. And you

1071
00:59:17,120 --> 00:59:20,520
Speaker 1: know the others r o E and skating skating skating

1072
00:59:20,720 --> 00:59:23,720
Speaker 1: r o E s and it happens like you know,

1073
00:59:23,800 --> 00:59:27,360
Speaker 1: there's guys who know, you know, like one guy even

1074
00:59:27,400 --> 00:59:29,880
Speaker 1: wrote about and in extortion one step about you know,

1075
00:59:29,880 --> 00:59:34,360
Speaker 1: Apache pilots, they you know, they they they stayed outside

1076
00:59:34,640 --> 00:59:36,760
Speaker 1: of where you can hear them, and they you know,

1077
00:59:36,960 --> 00:59:40,120
Speaker 1: they'll watch a guy and they'll see troops and they'll

1078
00:59:40,160 --> 00:59:42,600
Speaker 1: throw their RPG or the p k M in the

1079
00:59:42,680 --> 00:59:44,800
Speaker 1: grass and then they'll just walk around. And so there's

1080
00:59:45,200 --> 00:59:46,920
Speaker 1: you can't pit them, you can't p I D. Then

1081
00:59:46,920 --> 00:59:49,600
Speaker 1: you can't possitively idea ide them. But you know, and

1082
00:59:49,680 --> 00:59:53,280
Speaker 1: then um, you know, you've got that that tad's pinvice

1083
00:59:53,400 --> 00:59:56,320
Speaker 1: that you know, target acquisition designation site pilot night business

1084
00:59:56,360 --> 00:59:58,320
Speaker 1: system they got on that APACHE. You now they have

1085
00:59:58,400 --> 01:00:01,720
Speaker 1: the impacts, the modern I version. It can see a

1086
01:00:01,920 --> 01:00:04,720
Speaker 1: long way off and uh, I still don't think it

1087
01:00:04,800 --> 01:00:08,160
Speaker 1: can do resolved the type of handgun, but it certainly

1088
01:00:08,200 --> 01:00:10,400
Speaker 1: can just distinguish between an a K, a p K

1089
01:00:10,920 --> 01:00:13,920
Speaker 1: and an RPG. And this one pile I was telling me,

1090
01:00:14,000 --> 01:00:16,840
Speaker 1: He's like, yeah, we just waited for him. He grabbed

1091
01:00:16,880 --> 01:00:18,840
Speaker 1: it and then he had a hell fire up his ass,

1092
01:00:19,160 --> 01:00:23,920
Speaker 1: you know, right there. So, uh, those little thermal imaging

1093
01:00:24,040 --> 01:00:26,600
Speaker 1: balls that they were mounting on vehicles as I was

1094
01:00:26,640 --> 01:00:28,760
Speaker 1: getting out of the army in two thousand and ten,

1095
01:00:28,960 --> 01:00:34,000
Speaker 1: which I believe they were developed for the small boats

1096
01:00:34,080 --> 01:00:37,680
Speaker 1: that seal teams use UM. But those things were pretty impressive.

1097
01:00:37,800 --> 01:00:41,440
Speaker 1: I mean, the resolution was pretty amazing on them. One

1098
01:00:41,480 --> 01:00:45,560
Speaker 1: of the things about UM, about those imagers, any type

1099
01:00:45,600 --> 01:00:48,800
Speaker 1: of UM, any type of camera system, is the gimbal

1100
01:00:49,000 --> 01:00:52,440
Speaker 1: and stabilization device, because you know, you look at that

1101
01:00:52,520 --> 01:00:55,760
Speaker 1: gun tape and it's it's as if it's bolted to

1102
01:00:55,840 --> 01:00:57,640
Speaker 1: the side of a building, but you know it's on

1103
01:00:57,720 --> 01:01:02,400
Speaker 1: an APACHE that's going like nine or UM you know,

1104
01:01:02,560 --> 01:01:06,120
Speaker 1: or U S that's up high UM and as you

1105
01:01:06,200 --> 01:01:09,480
Speaker 1: know again I don't want to. We could talk technical stuff.

1106
01:01:10,000 --> 01:01:11,840
Speaker 1: You get very technical, but you know, the farther you

1107
01:01:11,880 --> 01:01:15,160
Speaker 1: get away from something with a with a passive scanner,

1108
01:01:15,240 --> 01:01:19,240
Speaker 1: which is what those things are. Um. You know, there's

1109
01:01:19,240 --> 01:01:21,440
Speaker 1: a thing called the inverse square rule where you know,

1110
01:01:21,560 --> 01:01:24,240
Speaker 1: you double the distance from a source of light to

1111
01:01:24,360 --> 01:01:27,640
Speaker 1: where you're imaging it, and you don't have the it's

1112
01:01:27,680 --> 01:01:31,240
Speaker 1: not one half of the amount of photons per unit

1113
01:01:31,280 --> 01:01:35,080
Speaker 1: area time, it's one quarter. So the farther you get away,

1114
01:01:35,240 --> 01:01:37,840
Speaker 1: you really drops. That's why these these telescopes say that

1115
01:01:37,920 --> 01:01:41,440
Speaker 1: these really big mirrors on them to do deep space photography,

1116
01:01:41,520 --> 01:01:44,920
Speaker 1: but uh, are imaging. But you know there's that, and

1117
01:01:44,960 --> 01:01:48,040
Speaker 1: then there's just also the resolution of the sensor, um,

1118
01:01:48,240 --> 01:01:51,000
Speaker 1: the internal sensor. But again this is kind of going

1119
01:01:51,080 --> 01:01:54,240
Speaker 1: way off topic. But but they are getting better and better.

1120
01:01:55,920 --> 01:01:59,800
Speaker 1: Yoh yeah, I mean some of this stuff. Uh. Um.

1121
01:02:00,200 --> 01:02:03,400
Speaker 1: There's also some inferometry type stuff that they're doing with

1122
01:02:03,560 --> 01:02:07,000
Speaker 1: multiple sensors that they fuse them. Uh. And they've been

1123
01:02:07,040 --> 01:02:09,360
Speaker 1: doing that for a long time actually since the sixties

1124
01:02:09,440 --> 01:02:13,440
Speaker 1: from space maybe the sixties, but about the seventies. Um.

1125
01:02:13,840 --> 01:02:16,320
Speaker 1: And I just I emailed to you if you want

1126
01:02:16,360 --> 01:02:19,880
Speaker 1: to write an article right now about UM the atmosphere

1127
01:02:20,000 --> 01:02:23,880
Speaker 1: and how it um it's the component of the atmosphere

1128
01:02:23,920 --> 01:02:27,600
Speaker 1: and weather for reconnaissance satellites. And the n r O

1129
01:02:27,720 --> 01:02:32,360
Speaker 1: declassified all these documents in eleven and then they just disappeared.

1130
01:02:32,400 --> 01:02:35,120
Speaker 1: But I saw him on an archive site and uh,

1131
01:02:35,600 --> 01:02:39,120
Speaker 1: just this week and I download all these It's fucking amazing,

1132
01:02:39,560 --> 01:02:44,160
Speaker 1: so fascinating. They had a guy for all through the years,

1133
01:02:44,360 --> 01:02:46,919
Speaker 1: different guy who would write a book like the book

1134
01:02:46,960 --> 01:02:53,400
Speaker 1: on the history of that classified pardon that classified internal

1135
01:02:53,560 --> 01:02:57,360
Speaker 1: history top secret. Yeah, it was a guy who wrote

1136
01:02:57,360 --> 01:03:00,920
Speaker 1: a book on the history of for instance, UH Hexagon,

1137
01:03:01,040 --> 01:03:03,880
Speaker 1: which was the name for the Cage nine satellite, was

1138
01:03:03,920 --> 01:03:08,760
Speaker 1: the last film UH satellite. UM it's a constant satellite.

1139
01:03:09,160 --> 01:03:12,320
Speaker 1: And they printed like five copies. Its top secret, and

1140
01:03:12,680 --> 01:03:14,600
Speaker 1: no one ever was like, okay, I wrote a book

1141
01:03:14,600 --> 01:03:16,240
Speaker 1: on the history and no one's no one's gonna read it.

1142
01:03:16,600 --> 01:03:19,360
Speaker 1: And then they twenty five years later or thirty years later,

1143
01:03:19,400 --> 01:03:22,600
Speaker 1: they classified it. They let it out. But that that

1144
01:03:22,880 --> 01:03:26,040
Speaker 1: FOYA site, that FOYA page on n r O dot

1145
01:03:26,080 --> 01:03:29,600
Speaker 1: gov or whatever it is, is no longer there. But

1146
01:03:29,880 --> 01:03:32,959
Speaker 1: it was some take, some work, but I was able

1147
01:03:32,960 --> 01:03:36,360
Speaker 1: to dig around and grab an archive version of it

1148
01:03:36,760 --> 01:03:40,880
Speaker 1: from an archive site. So, but it is really really fascinating.

1149
01:03:40,960 --> 01:03:43,880
Speaker 1: A lot of stuff is redacted, but the resolution is

1150
01:03:43,920 --> 01:03:46,800
Speaker 1: pretty damn good at what they do from space. But

1151
01:03:46,880 --> 01:03:50,440
Speaker 1: then it's so much easier when you're when if you're

1152
01:03:50,480 --> 01:03:52,600
Speaker 1: not in denied airspace. I mean, that's the whole reason

1153
01:03:52,640 --> 01:03:55,960
Speaker 1: that they even have spy satellites is because denied airspace.

1154
01:03:56,360 --> 01:03:59,080
Speaker 1: And uh, you know, if you're if you're you know,

1155
01:03:59,200 --> 01:04:01,880
Speaker 1: you're an air Supreme C situation or you're like an

1156
01:04:01,960 --> 01:04:03,920
Speaker 1: r Q one seventy and you know they can't see you,

1157
01:04:04,200 --> 01:04:07,160
Speaker 1: then you can get pretty low and uh and that

1158
01:04:07,360 --> 01:04:09,440
Speaker 1: inverse square rule thing, you know, you can you know

1159
01:04:09,480 --> 01:04:11,800
Speaker 1: that you need to. You can either put a much

1160
01:04:11,840 --> 01:04:14,160
Speaker 1: bigger sensor on it or put a lot of smaller

1161
01:04:14,200 --> 01:04:16,520
Speaker 1: sensors and get really low and pick up a lot

1162
01:04:16,560 --> 01:04:19,920
Speaker 1: of stuff. So anyway, so you can tell if it

1163
01:04:20,000 --> 01:04:25,640
Speaker 1: was a glock or a baretta. Well again, UM, I

1164
01:04:25,640 --> 01:04:27,720
Speaker 1: don't know how much time we have left. But one

1165
01:04:27,760 --> 01:04:29,840
Speaker 1: of the things that I love to read about and

1166
01:04:29,920 --> 01:04:35,040
Speaker 1: research is called massive measurement signature intelligence UM and and

1167
01:04:35,200 --> 01:04:39,120
Speaker 1: that's basically it's really the least known about and it's passive.

1168
01:04:39,440 --> 01:04:43,080
Speaker 1: There's there's some active for radio radioized topic. But you

1169
01:04:43,120 --> 01:04:46,400
Speaker 1: know it's it's measures, measurement and signatures. So it's like

1170
01:04:47,400 --> 01:04:49,960
Speaker 1: a great example is, um, you know what an IBM

1171
01:04:49,960 --> 01:04:52,400
Speaker 1: S electric is the typewriter. I'm kind of aging my

1172
01:04:53,480 --> 01:04:58,160
Speaker 1: revealing my age, but it's an electric typewriter. Yeah. It

1173
01:04:58,280 --> 01:05:01,840
Speaker 1: had the ball head so the revolution, you know, so

1174
01:05:02,040 --> 01:05:05,640
Speaker 1: basically when you hit a key, the ball flips up

1175
01:05:05,680 --> 01:05:09,960
Speaker 1: and it spins around and it strikes the the ribbon, uh,

1176
01:05:10,120 --> 01:05:15,560
Speaker 1: and each key so he has an auditory signature. They're

1177
01:05:15,560 --> 01:05:17,400
Speaker 1: all the same basically, you know, anyone and in the

1178
01:05:17,480 --> 01:05:20,440
Speaker 1: space part's got its own. So and then there's a

1179
01:05:20,480 --> 01:05:24,320
Speaker 1: measure between from when the there's that signature and then

1180
01:05:24,320 --> 01:05:27,840
Speaker 1: a certain number of tensive seconds or hundreds of seconds

1181
01:05:28,360 --> 01:05:31,240
Speaker 1: between hitting that and when the ball strikes. And each

1182
01:05:31,360 --> 01:05:34,720
Speaker 1: letter has a unique measurement because it's it's going to

1183
01:05:34,840 --> 01:05:36,640
Speaker 1: take the different amount of time because you know, there's

1184
01:05:36,640 --> 01:05:42,360
Speaker 1: space differently. So in Moscow in the seventies, internal documents

1185
01:05:42,400 --> 01:05:46,680
Speaker 1: were written with the US embassy with the selectric beam

1186
01:05:46,680 --> 01:05:50,440
Speaker 1: selectric or selectrict too, and the Soviets snuck in this

1187
01:05:50,640 --> 01:05:54,920
Speaker 1: thing that would measure the sound and measure you know,

1188
01:05:55,040 --> 01:05:57,920
Speaker 1: between the sounds and so as they're typing these internal

1189
01:05:58,080 --> 01:06:02,280
Speaker 1: classified documents, soviets where them in real time, knowing exactly

1190
01:06:02,360 --> 01:06:05,920
Speaker 1: what they're like. So that's a that's a great example

1191
01:06:05,960 --> 01:06:11,680
Speaker 1: of mass and aspect of mass, and where we provoke

1192
01:06:12,640 --> 01:06:15,800
Speaker 1: the opposition into taking an action and then we're able

1193
01:06:15,840 --> 01:06:19,440
Speaker 1: to measure what it is they're doing. Well, I mean

1194
01:06:19,760 --> 01:06:22,760
Speaker 1: that's that's that's sort of a fusion of human human

1195
01:06:23,120 --> 01:06:26,400
Speaker 1: you know, reaction and then the mass and um. And

1196
01:06:26,440 --> 01:06:30,960
Speaker 1: I'm unaware of that, but I certainly well, for instance,

1197
01:06:31,080 --> 01:06:32,640
Speaker 1: I mean here we can make up an example. I

1198
01:06:32,720 --> 01:06:34,200
Speaker 1: was just going to give the example of a Disha

1199
01:06:35,080 --> 01:06:37,880
Speaker 1: twelve point seven millimeter basically you know, fifty cow. I

1200
01:06:37,920 --> 01:06:39,640
Speaker 1: think that I think the twelve point seven is a

1201
01:06:39,680 --> 01:06:42,040
Speaker 1: little bit of a bigger it's a little longer, right

1202
01:06:43,640 --> 01:06:46,240
Speaker 1: g not that much, a little bit more energy, but

1203
01:06:46,320 --> 01:06:48,760
Speaker 1: they they use that as an any aircraft gun. But

1204
01:06:49,640 --> 01:06:52,640
Speaker 1: you know, the muzzle flash is a distinctive visual signature

1205
01:06:52,960 --> 01:06:56,320
Speaker 1: and the timing between those flashes that's the measurement. And

1206
01:06:56,440 --> 01:06:58,280
Speaker 1: so I think even from space they can see if

1207
01:06:58,320 --> 01:07:00,160
Speaker 1: it's a dish. I'm not sure, but you've really get

1208
01:07:00,240 --> 01:07:02,880
Speaker 1: to know what to look for or when I say that,

1209
01:07:02,920 --> 01:07:05,640
Speaker 1: I mean it's got to be zoomed right on end UM.

1210
01:07:06,040 --> 01:07:08,560
Speaker 1: So I can imagine that. Yeah, like you could provoke,

1211
01:07:08,720 --> 01:07:11,880
Speaker 1: like say in the South China, see UM, you know,

1212
01:07:11,920 --> 01:07:13,800
Speaker 1: you can fly one of those EC one thirty Command

1213
01:07:13,840 --> 01:07:16,520
Speaker 1: of solos which they stuff those things full, but all

1214
01:07:16,600 --> 01:07:19,760
Speaker 1: sorts of things, or you know, UM in RC twelve

1215
01:07:19,800 --> 01:07:25,520
Speaker 1: and n C twelve liberty flying around with UM. You know, Okay,

1216
01:07:25,640 --> 01:07:29,080
Speaker 1: here's a fleet of Chinese ships and we're gonna, you know,

1217
01:07:29,240 --> 01:07:31,520
Speaker 1: see what happens when we send in a you know,

1218
01:07:31,560 --> 01:07:35,320
Speaker 1: I don't know, destroyer or something within houtonautical miles and

1219
01:07:35,920 --> 01:07:41,040
Speaker 1: see what types of UM YAM electromagica radiation you can

1220
01:07:41,120 --> 01:07:47,280
Speaker 1: pick up. So UM, absolutely that's UM. I think one

1221
01:07:47,320 --> 01:07:49,400
Speaker 1: of the things I was reading about these classified nr

1222
01:07:49,440 --> 01:07:53,080
Speaker 1: O documents was it was pretty fascinating. They would have

1223
01:07:54,480 --> 01:07:58,640
Speaker 1: UM two or three different signals intelligence satellites. You know,

1224
01:07:58,720 --> 01:08:03,640
Speaker 1: obviously you can't park them up their orbiting, but they

1225
01:08:03,960 --> 01:08:09,120
Speaker 1: would hear a transmission pick up transmission from a Soviet submarine,

1226
01:08:09,760 --> 01:08:11,600
Speaker 1: and if they had three of them, they would be

1227
01:08:11,640 --> 01:08:16,360
Speaker 1: able to trilineate, not triangulate, but trilaneate how GPS sports

1228
01:08:16,400 --> 01:08:21,360
Speaker 1: basically um through the timing, the exact location in depth

1229
01:08:21,640 --> 01:08:25,400
Speaker 1: of where the Soviet submarines are for work. So this

1230
01:08:25,439 --> 01:08:31,840
Speaker 1: stuff's always fascinating to me. Yeah, so getting pretty far

1231
01:08:31,920 --> 01:08:38,160
Speaker 1: off that's what we do here. Yeah, it's all Jack.

1232
01:08:38,200 --> 01:08:42,479
Speaker 1: I'll email you that link or dropbox for if you

1233
01:08:42,840 --> 01:08:44,960
Speaker 1: want to check out some of those those n r

1234
01:08:45,000 --> 01:08:47,760
Speaker 1: O docks are just fascinating, you know, going back to

1235
01:08:47,840 --> 01:08:51,640
Speaker 1: the sixties. It's just it's like wow. But yeah, so

1236
01:08:53,040 --> 01:08:57,920
Speaker 1: um yeah. But also you know, just like we're talking

1237
01:08:57,960 --> 01:09:01,479
Speaker 1: about getting back to Mike Show and in the family

1238
01:09:01,560 --> 01:09:04,640
Speaker 1: and you know, the whole like just I don't want

1239
01:09:04,680 --> 01:09:06,840
Speaker 1: to say just leave me alone, but it is really

1240
01:09:07,360 --> 01:09:10,600
Speaker 1: you know, it's delicate. I I'm I try to be

1241
01:09:11,479 --> 01:09:15,040
Speaker 1: a passive not active with that, like you know, put

1242
01:09:15,120 --> 01:09:17,240
Speaker 1: it's put it up on Facebook, or like, hey, this

1243
01:09:17,320 --> 01:09:20,040
Speaker 1: book's coming out, Mike's in the cover, you know, or

1244
01:09:20,120 --> 01:09:22,320
Speaker 1: here's uh, here's one of the here's one of the

1245
01:09:22,360 --> 01:09:24,760
Speaker 1: images that I got out of Jeremy. Jeremy I had

1246
01:09:24,840 --> 01:09:28,560
Speaker 1: some great photographs to photographs of Jeremy sand Roe in

1247
01:09:28,640 --> 01:09:31,920
Speaker 1: the book, and you know, same deployment. About a month

1248
01:09:32,000 --> 01:09:36,640
Speaker 1: before Mike passed a sniper shot Jeremy and died and

1249
01:09:37,000 --> 01:09:40,519
Speaker 1: uh you know, I you know, that's another thing about

1250
01:09:40,560 --> 01:09:42,160
Speaker 1: the book. I wanted to do is make it a

1251
01:09:42,240 --> 01:09:46,679
Speaker 1: memorial um to some of those who were who were lost,

1252
01:09:47,040 --> 01:09:50,800
Speaker 1: and uh, because I have some just really great photographs

1253
01:09:50,840 --> 01:09:54,200
Speaker 1: of Jeremy on patrol and the hinder cush and was

1254
01:09:54,280 --> 01:09:57,120
Speaker 1: really looking forward to seeing him. Um when I got

1255
01:09:57,160 --> 01:10:03,559
Speaker 1: to a wrap that that didn't happen. So um yeah, yeah, Well,

1256
01:10:03,840 --> 01:10:07,200
Speaker 1: once again, the book is war moments, images and stories

1257
01:10:07,280 --> 01:10:11,040
Speaker 1: of combat in Iraq, Afghanistan and beyond. It's out right

1258
01:10:11,120 --> 01:10:13,800
Speaker 1: now in Amherst Media. Came out today as we're recording this,

1259
01:10:14,040 --> 01:10:17,800
Speaker 1: so as you're hearing this yesterday, I was looking right

1260
01:10:17,840 --> 01:10:20,519
Speaker 1: now it's number twenty five in military history on Amazon.

1261
01:10:20,720 --> 01:10:23,680
Speaker 1: Let's get that ranking better. I always like seeing the

1262
01:10:23,720 --> 01:10:27,439
Speaker 1: SOFTWAP radio audience. Um, you know, get our both the

1263
01:10:27,880 --> 01:10:30,800
Speaker 1: soft rep bump. Yeah. So it's like Oprah, but it's

1264
01:10:30,840 --> 01:10:34,040
Speaker 1: not it's not quite on that level. But it is

1265
01:10:34,040 --> 01:10:36,160
Speaker 1: always cool to see those books rise in the rankings

1266
01:10:36,200 --> 01:10:39,000
Speaker 1: because of you guys, and uh, you know, these photographs

1267
01:10:39,040 --> 01:10:41,960
Speaker 1: are incredible. Ed did an amazing job, So support the

1268
01:10:42,000 --> 01:10:44,880
Speaker 1: book and uh yeah, pick it up right there on

1269
01:10:44,960 --> 01:10:48,479
Speaker 1: Amazon or anywhere else war moments, images and stories of

1270
01:10:48,600 --> 01:10:52,719
Speaker 1: combat in Iraq, Afghanistan and beyond. Uh you could follow

1271
01:10:52,960 --> 01:10:57,000
Speaker 1: ed on Twitter and Instagram at ed Derek ed d

1272
01:10:57,240 --> 01:10:59,920
Speaker 1: A R A c K which I from what I

1273
01:11:00,120 --> 01:11:02,320
Speaker 1: remember of the last episode, I believe I'm saying right

1274
01:11:02,320 --> 01:11:04,320
Speaker 1: because it looks kind of like de Rock. That's Derek

1275
01:11:05,160 --> 01:11:09,360
Speaker 1: Uh and Derek dot Com d A r a c k. Uh.

1276
01:11:09,640 --> 01:11:12,200
Speaker 1: And as you mentioned to other Red Wings projects in

1277
01:11:12,240 --> 01:11:16,240
Speaker 1: the works, some other stuff. You're constantly working anything else

1278
01:11:16,280 --> 01:11:17,920
Speaker 1: you want to get out there before we wrap things

1279
01:11:18,000 --> 01:11:22,800
Speaker 1: up with you. Um, The Warriors of Ambar that's coming

1280
01:11:22,800 --> 01:11:26,839
Speaker 1: out later this year. That's uh. Um. It's it's Perseus

1281
01:11:26,920 --> 01:11:29,880
Speaker 1: Books and Decapo Press. It's an imprint of Hatchet, which

1282
01:11:29,960 --> 01:11:32,000
Speaker 1: is one of the Big five publishers. Yeah, I've been

1283
01:11:32,000 --> 01:11:34,240
Speaker 1: working on this project for a long time. I love

1284
01:11:34,320 --> 01:11:36,960
Speaker 1: the project. It's so I'm gonna go out there and say,

1285
01:11:37,000 --> 01:11:40,000
Speaker 1: it's just about the greatest war story I've ever come across.

1286
01:11:40,040 --> 01:11:42,400
Speaker 1: It's unbelievable. It's an entire of at Tian of Marines

1287
01:11:43,120 --> 01:11:46,200
Speaker 1: and Uh. It covers all the companies and they did

1288
01:11:46,320 --> 01:11:49,120
Speaker 1: a lot of sacrifice and it was it's just it's

1289
01:11:49,160 --> 01:11:51,599
Speaker 1: I'm finishing it up right now. It's an amazing project.

1290
01:11:51,760 --> 01:11:54,200
Speaker 1: So that's what's one of the big ones. So thank

1291
01:11:54,240 --> 01:11:56,320
Speaker 1: you for letting me. I'll have to have you back

1292
01:11:56,360 --> 01:12:00,680
Speaker 1: on and that book comes out. Absolutely Jack's thank you

1293
01:12:00,760 --> 01:12:04,360
Speaker 1: guys so much. You great, super appreciated, super appreciate your

1294
01:12:04,360 --> 01:12:07,320
Speaker 1: audience and you know, listening and you know, if you

1295
01:12:07,360 --> 01:12:09,880
Speaker 1: ever just wanna, for the hell of it, just talk

1296
01:12:09,920 --> 01:12:13,560
Speaker 1: about whatever. Like let's talk about i SR stuff. I

1297
01:12:13,640 --> 01:12:16,680
Speaker 1: mean and get technical. I mean, people like it, I think,

1298
01:12:16,800 --> 01:12:19,800
Speaker 1: so I love talking about that. I'm down. I'm a

1299
01:12:19,960 --> 01:12:24,160
Speaker 1: total military nerds. So I go on about that for hours.

1300
01:12:25,479 --> 01:12:28,479
Speaker 1: Absolutely absolutely, I love it too. It's very little, very

1301
01:12:28,560 --> 01:12:31,600
Speaker 1: little known about it. It's it's really you know, and

1302
01:12:31,720 --> 01:12:33,720
Speaker 1: it's it's like that guy who wrote that book for

1303
01:12:33,880 --> 01:12:35,880
Speaker 1: n R. Oh, it's like what you do today, honey.

1304
01:12:36,000 --> 01:12:40,160
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I was, you know, writing stuff, you know,

1305
01:12:40,280 --> 01:12:41,960
Speaker 1: writing a book. Oh you wrote a book. Yah, too

1306
01:12:41,960 --> 01:12:45,679
Speaker 1: bad you can never read it. So but uh, anyway,

1307
01:12:45,840 --> 01:12:48,200
Speaker 1: all right, man, you guys are great. Thank you. Yeah,

1308
01:12:48,280 --> 01:12:54,599
Speaker 1: thanks Ed, thank you again. Okay, take care great. Having

1309
01:12:54,840 --> 01:12:57,280
Speaker 1: ed back on the show, I mentioned it before, but

1310
01:12:57,400 --> 01:12:59,040
Speaker 1: once again, if you want to go back and listen

1311
01:12:59,080 --> 01:13:00,840
Speaker 1: to his first appear and you want to hear more

1312
01:13:00,840 --> 01:13:05,200
Speaker 1: about the operation Red Wings Extortion seventeen stuff, that's episode

1313
01:13:05,280 --> 01:13:08,320
Speaker 1: three fifteen. Be sure to check out Create Club. I

1314
01:13:08,360 --> 01:13:10,680
Speaker 1: actually just got a new package from Create Club in

1315
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Speaker 1: the mail yesterday, some really awesome stuff in it. Uh

1316
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Speaker 1: my favorite item, I mean, there's a lot of stuff

1317
01:13:16,720 --> 01:13:18,800
Speaker 1: in there. My favorite item is the flashlight because I

1318
01:13:18,880 --> 01:13:21,800
Speaker 1: think for a tiny little keychain, flashlight is pretty damn

1319
01:13:21,840 --> 01:13:25,080
Speaker 1: powerful and the thing is of use many times. So

1320
01:13:25,560 --> 01:13:28,479
Speaker 1: we have different tiers of membership depending on how prepared

1321
01:13:28,520 --> 01:13:30,960
Speaker 1: you want to be, and gift options are available as well.

1322
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Speaker 1: Scott Whittner from the Load Out Room, Army Ranger, Drew

1323
01:13:34,320 --> 01:13:36,519
Speaker 1: Wallace who you've heard on the show, and all the

1324
01:13:36,600 --> 01:13:39,639
Speaker 1: other guys from Hurricane involved with the Create Club are

1325
01:13:39,760 --> 01:13:45,040
Speaker 1: currently putting together some great gear custom products made for us,

1326
01:13:45,520 --> 01:13:48,760
Speaker 1: everything from sunglass cases to eat ec bags and other

1327
01:13:48,840 --> 01:13:52,680
Speaker 1: manly products. It's a club four men by men. You

1328
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Speaker 1: can check that all out of Create Club dot Us.

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01:13:55,200 --> 01:13:58,600
Speaker 1: Once again, that's Create Club dot Us. Also, as a

1330
01:13:58,680 --> 01:14:02,320
Speaker 1: reminder for those listening, now is the time to sign

1331
01:14:02,400 --> 01:14:04,800
Speaker 1: up for the spec Ops channel. It's our channel that

1332
01:14:04,920 --> 01:14:09,560
Speaker 1: offers the most exclusive shows, documentaries and interviews covering the

1333
01:14:09,640 --> 01:14:13,679
Speaker 1: most exciting military content today. The spec Ops Channel premier

1334
01:14:13,720 --> 01:14:17,960
Speaker 1: show Training Sell follows former Special Operations Forces as they

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Speaker 1: participate in the most advanced training in the country, everything

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Speaker 1: from shooting schools, defensive driving, jungle and winter warfare, climbing,

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Speaker 1: and much more. Again, you can watch this content by

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01:14:29,960 --> 01:14:33,599
Speaker 1: subscribing to the spec Ops Channel. Spec ops channel dot

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01:14:33,680 --> 01:14:36,880
Speaker 1: com take advantage of a membership for only four ninety

1340
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Speaker 1: nine a month. That's spec Ops channel dot com. Sign

1341
01:14:40,479 --> 01:14:44,040
Speaker 1: up right now. Last thing I'm gonna mention here that

1342
01:14:44,120 --> 01:14:46,240
Speaker 1: I've been teasing out the last few shows and we

1343
01:14:46,400 --> 01:14:49,960
Speaker 1: really hope that you subscribe the news Rep Financial Report.

1344
01:14:50,160 --> 01:14:53,479
Speaker 1: On the last episode of Joseph LaFave, we went into

1345
01:14:53,560 --> 01:14:57,240
Speaker 1: exactly what we're doing here. It's exclusive information that you

1346
01:14:57,280 --> 01:15:01,080
Speaker 1: can act on today to secure a brighter future for tomorrow.

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01:15:01,479 --> 01:15:04,080
Speaker 1: The news Rep Financial Report can help you discover new

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Speaker 1: investment strategies in the defense sector. Defense industry stocks can

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Speaker 1: be a lucrative investment if you buy at the right time.

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Speaker 1: Our team of foreign policy, security and military experts provides

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Speaker 1: real time intelligence for stocks based on global trends that

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Speaker 1: are affecting the financial markets in the national defense industry.

1353
01:15:24,560 --> 01:15:28,880
Speaker 1: By subscribing now, you'll get exclusive access to our industry expertise.

1354
01:15:29,360 --> 01:15:32,920
Speaker 1: The news Up Financial newsletter advantage is that our team

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01:15:33,040 --> 01:15:39,600
Speaker 1: offers unmatched defense industry familiarity and expertise, unbiased knowledge of

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01:15:39,680 --> 01:15:44,200
Speaker 1: geopolitical trends, end full access to news reps, foreign policy,

1357
01:15:44,320 --> 01:15:48,760
Speaker 1: security and financial intelligence platform, as well as access to

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01:15:48,880 --> 01:15:51,680
Speaker 1: our team of experts and analysts. So just go to

1359
01:15:51,720 --> 01:15:53,479
Speaker 1: the finn Rep tab It's at the top of the

1360
01:15:53,560 --> 01:15:56,760
Speaker 1: news rep dot com. To sign up. It's finn Rep

1361
01:15:57,040 --> 01:15:59,679
Speaker 1: on the news Rep. Click on that fin Rep tab

1362
01:15:59,840 --> 01:16:01,800
Speaker 1: and you could sign up today. All right, As I

1363
01:16:01,920 --> 01:16:03,519
Speaker 1: was teasing out at the beginning of the show, we're

1364
01:16:03,520 --> 01:16:05,760
Speaker 1: gonna do a giveaway. I was waiting for the end

1365
01:16:05,800 --> 01:16:07,200
Speaker 1: to tell you all about it because I want to

1366
01:16:07,240 --> 01:16:09,840
Speaker 1: save it for you guys to listen to the whole show. Um,

1367
01:16:10,200 --> 01:16:11,880
Speaker 1: you know, I know there's people probably just listen to

1368
01:16:11,880 --> 01:16:14,439
Speaker 1: the interview and turn it off. So for you guys

1369
01:16:14,520 --> 01:16:16,920
Speaker 1: who are the loyal listeners, here's what we're gonna do.

1370
01:16:17,160 --> 01:16:21,439
Speaker 1: We just got those soft up radio tumblers from our sponsor, Pelican.

1371
01:16:21,920 --> 01:16:24,360
Speaker 1: They look awesome. We're gonna give one of them away

1372
01:16:24,360 --> 01:16:27,240
Speaker 1: to you guys. This week, we'll give away that as

1373
01:16:27,280 --> 01:16:29,160
Speaker 1: well some greate club gear that we have here in

1374
01:16:29,200 --> 01:16:32,639
Speaker 1: the studio. I'll put together a package and we'll give

1375
01:16:32,720 --> 01:16:35,320
Speaker 1: it to someone who sends the best email this week

1376
01:16:35,680 --> 01:16:38,280
Speaker 1: to soft rep dot radio at soft rep dot com.

1377
01:16:38,720 --> 01:16:40,560
Speaker 1: And when I say the best email, not like a

1378
01:16:40,640 --> 01:16:44,320
Speaker 1: guest suggestion and not something super long that I'm not

1379
01:16:44,360 --> 01:16:46,160
Speaker 1: gonna be able to get to on the show. If

1380
01:16:46,200 --> 01:16:49,400
Speaker 1: you have a good question or a concise comment, the

1381
01:16:49,560 --> 01:16:53,280
Speaker 1: best this week, just this week, I'll give away that package,

1382
01:16:53,360 --> 01:16:56,680
Speaker 1: so to one lucky listeners soft rep dot Radio at

1383
01:16:56,800 --> 01:16:59,760
Speaker 1: soft rep dot com. I was originally gonna say, if

1384
01:16:59,760 --> 01:17:02,400
Speaker 1: you're at a five star review on Apple Podcasts, but

1385
01:17:02,840 --> 01:17:04,800
Speaker 1: I remember when I mentioned this to Adam and Dodd,

1386
01:17:04,880 --> 01:17:07,640
Speaker 1: he said that he doesn't know for allowed to do that, so,

1387
01:17:08,200 --> 01:17:11,240
Speaker 1: you know, giving out like gifts in exchange for positive reviews.

1388
01:17:11,760 --> 01:17:13,560
Speaker 1: So I'm gonna give it to an email or but

1389
01:17:13,560 --> 01:17:15,679
Speaker 1: I'm just gonna encourage you guys to leave a review.

1390
01:17:15,880 --> 01:17:17,720
Speaker 1: You have nothing to do with the contest, but weave

1391
01:17:17,720 --> 01:17:20,559
Speaker 1: a review on Apple Podcasts. It's like if you visit

1392
01:17:20,640 --> 01:17:23,559
Speaker 1: a prostitute, but she doesn't say she's a prostituteous leave

1393
01:17:23,560 --> 01:17:26,840
Speaker 1: an envelope of money on her nightstand. Yeah, and you

1394
01:17:26,880 --> 01:17:29,320
Speaker 1: don't talk about the money. Yeah, just go through your

1395
01:17:29,640 --> 01:17:31,680
Speaker 1: and then the envelope goes exactly. So we do. We'd

1396
01:17:31,720 --> 01:17:34,800
Speaker 1: appreciate it the letter of the law. What we do.

1397
01:17:34,960 --> 01:17:36,719
Speaker 1: We do appreciate it if you leave us a review.

1398
01:17:36,800 --> 01:17:39,240
Speaker 1: But the contest is really for an email. But leave

1399
01:17:39,280 --> 01:17:42,360
Speaker 1: a review on Apple podcast because it helps us with

1400
01:17:42,439 --> 01:17:45,960
Speaker 1: the ratings and we love Apple podcasts, So please do that.

1401
01:17:46,680 --> 01:17:49,360
Speaker 1: But for the email, I'll announce a winner next week.

1402
01:17:49,520 --> 01:17:54,240
Speaker 1: Just keep it concise and interesting, and I'll announce it

1403
01:17:54,439 --> 01:17:58,040
Speaker 1: on Tuesday, on really Wednesday recording Tuesday, I'll announce it

1404
01:17:58,200 --> 01:18:01,400
Speaker 1: on Wednesday's show. As you know, we have two shows

1405
01:18:01,520 --> 01:18:04,280
Speaker 1: each week, so I'll extend this for the whole week.

1406
01:18:04,640 --> 01:18:07,519
Speaker 1: Soft Rep dot Radio at soft rep dot com. Send

1407
01:18:07,600 --> 01:18:09,680
Speaker 1: us your email just you know, you know how they

1408
01:18:09,680 --> 01:18:12,080
Speaker 1: always say, like ship posting on Twitter, don't just send

1409
01:18:12,160 --> 01:18:16,080
Speaker 1: us some bullshit. If it's good, you might get something. Um.

1410
01:18:16,520 --> 01:18:19,439
Speaker 1: Next episode, we have Peter Gidrey coming on, which I'm

1411
01:18:19,520 --> 01:18:23,120
Speaker 1: personally really excited for. As I mentioned on the podcast

1412
01:18:23,200 --> 01:18:25,559
Speaker 1: a couple of times I watched that documentary A Leaf

1413
01:18:25,640 --> 01:18:28,600
Speaker 1: of Faith Peter Giddrey's a veteran and talked about the

1414
01:18:28,680 --> 01:18:31,639
Speaker 1: benefits of creatum. Uh. And I want to get into

1415
01:18:31,720 --> 01:18:34,720
Speaker 1: it because I was reading something that Ben Shapiro put

1416
01:18:34,800 --> 01:18:37,559
Speaker 1: up and apparently, in America right now you are as

1417
01:18:38,080 --> 01:18:40,240
Speaker 1: scary as this is. At least according to the article

1418
01:18:40,280 --> 01:18:43,040
Speaker 1: that he put up, you're more likely to die from

1419
01:18:43,080 --> 01:18:46,720
Speaker 1: opioids in America than die in a car crash. So

1420
01:18:47,240 --> 01:18:50,720
Speaker 1: if apparently so, I'll have to check the source on it,

1421
01:18:50,880 --> 01:18:52,960
Speaker 1: but it was an article that I saw Ben Shapiro

1422
01:18:53,120 --> 01:18:57,479
Speaker 1: posted yesterday. Um. And you know, at the end of

1423
01:18:57,520 --> 01:18:59,439
Speaker 1: the day, if anything is going to get people off

1424
01:18:59,479 --> 01:19:03,360
Speaker 1: opioid is whether they're veterans, whether they're civilians, if it's creatum,

1425
01:19:03,720 --> 01:19:06,840
Speaker 1: if it's you know, marijuana for some people, or cbeed oil,

1426
01:19:06,880 --> 01:19:08,640
Speaker 1: I'm all for it. I mean, I don't like to

1427
01:19:08,680 --> 01:19:11,280
Speaker 1: see people get alphopio is. It's probably the worst thing

1428
01:19:11,720 --> 01:19:15,360
Speaker 1: you could possibly have going on. So, um, I'm open

1429
01:19:15,479 --> 01:19:17,280
Speaker 1: to hearing about anything. And as I said on the

1430
01:19:17,320 --> 01:19:20,000
Speaker 1: episode with Alex, when I was in South Florida, you

1431
01:19:20,080 --> 01:19:22,400
Speaker 1: can't go, uh, you know, a mile without seeing one

1432
01:19:22,400 --> 01:19:25,479
Speaker 1: of these caba bars, which is apparently a form of

1433
01:19:25,560 --> 01:19:27,760
Speaker 1: creatum that you drink in a tea and when you

1434
01:19:27,840 --> 01:19:30,240
Speaker 1: go to South Florida, I'm telling you, everywhere you look

1435
01:19:30,280 --> 01:19:33,880
Speaker 1: there are advertisements or Caba bars everywhere. So if it's

1436
01:19:33,920 --> 01:19:37,720
Speaker 1: caught on in South Florida, which which unfortunately is like

1437
01:19:37,800 --> 01:19:40,439
Speaker 1: the rehab capital of the world or the rehab capital

1438
01:19:40,479 --> 01:19:43,040
Speaker 1: of America, I'm sure it's gonna catch on elsewhere. So

1439
01:19:43,120 --> 01:19:45,760
Speaker 1: I would like to talk about creat um uh and

1440
01:19:45,880 --> 01:19:48,880
Speaker 1: be ahead of the curve before you know, everybody's talking

1441
01:19:48,920 --> 01:19:51,080
Speaker 1: about it. So you know, I'd like to know the

1442
01:19:51,120 --> 01:19:54,280
Speaker 1: benefits of it, and um, you know, as Alex on

1443
01:19:54,439 --> 01:19:57,240
Speaker 1: the episode, do your own research, of course, but if

1444
01:19:57,280 --> 01:19:59,400
Speaker 1: it's helped Peter, I'd like to hear how it's gonna

1445
01:19:59,400 --> 01:20:03,240
Speaker 1: help other people. Yeah, um cool? Anything else before we

1446
01:20:03,280 --> 01:20:06,240
Speaker 1: get out of here, Na man, I think that's about it.

1447
01:20:06,800 --> 01:20:11,960
Speaker 1: Pre order Murphy's Law as always, pre orders help, thank you, um.

1448
01:20:12,880 --> 01:20:16,080
Speaker 1: But now just churning away on that, getting the getting

1449
01:20:16,080 --> 01:20:18,960
Speaker 1: the book done, getting some articles written, working on a

1450
01:20:19,040 --> 01:20:23,080
Speaker 1: few other things. A retired Green Berets working on an

1451
01:20:23,160 --> 01:20:26,960
Speaker 1: article for US UM about something I've been trying to

1452
01:20:27,000 --> 01:20:32,240
Speaker 1: piece together for a long time. Um about a Special

1453
01:20:32,360 --> 01:20:36,680
Speaker 1: Forces soldier who died back in the nineteen eighties and

1454
01:20:36,760 --> 01:20:38,320
Speaker 1: I've been trying to figure this thing out. But I

1455
01:20:38,400 --> 01:20:40,519
Speaker 1: think he's got the real story. I mean, he's covered

1456
01:20:40,600 --> 01:20:43,599
Speaker 1: uncovered information. It is gonna shock people. So I'm looking

1457
01:20:43,680 --> 01:20:48,559
Speaker 1: forward to publishing that. Um. But that's about it right now. Excellent,

1458
01:20:48,600 --> 01:20:51,519
Speaker 1: All right? Well, follow us at Software Up Radio on

1459
01:20:51,600 --> 01:20:55,360
Speaker 1: Twitter and Instagram. Uh, and also we have a Facebook

1460
01:20:55,360 --> 01:20:58,240
Speaker 1: page that is relatively new, so it doesn't have a

1461
01:20:58,320 --> 01:21:00,280
Speaker 1: whole lot of likes. I would appreciate if you guys

1462
01:21:00,320 --> 01:21:02,439
Speaker 1: go on there. I'm pretty sure most of you guys

1463
01:21:02,520 --> 01:21:04,840
Speaker 1: have a Facebook page. Just look up soft Rep Radio

1464
01:21:04,880 --> 01:21:07,400
Speaker 1: and give it a like, share it invite your friends,

1465
01:21:07,439 --> 01:21:10,320
Speaker 1: which is very easy to do on Facebook. Um, you'll

1466
01:21:10,360 --> 01:21:13,280
Speaker 1: see an invite friends tab on the right and you

1467
01:21:13,320 --> 01:21:15,519
Speaker 1: could just select all and invite all your friends and

1468
01:21:15,560 --> 01:21:17,240
Speaker 1: would help us out. I mean, we're trying to raise

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01:21:17,360 --> 01:21:22,200
Speaker 1: visibility on all platforms. It helps us out. Support our sponsor, Pelican.

1470
01:21:22,720 --> 01:21:24,080
Speaker 1: If you need to go back to the beginning of

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01:21:24,160 --> 01:21:26,080
Speaker 1: the show to hear how to get that free tumbler

1472
01:21:26,240 --> 01:21:29,200
Speaker 1: with your order, Uh, just listen back. It's pretty simple.

1473
01:21:29,240 --> 01:21:32,679
Speaker 1: But Pelican Coolers dot com and uh, that's it, guys.

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01:21:32,720 --> 01:21:35,360
Speaker 1: You can follow me on Twitter at Ian Scotto. You

1475
01:21:35,400 --> 01:21:58,120
Speaker 1: could follow Jack at Jack Murphy r g R Use

1476
01:21:58,200 --> 01:22:02,519
Speaker 1: them listening to Self Reply Radio. New episodes up every

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01:22:02,560 --> 01:22:06,599
Speaker 1: Wednesday and Friday. Follow the show on Instagram and Twitter

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01:22:07,000 --> 01:22:08,320
Speaker 1: at self Rep Radio