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Speaker 1: How do you spend five minutes with Lauren Conlin and

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Speaker 1: not just fall in love with her vivacious and contagious spirit.

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Speaker 2: The answer is, I don't know.

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Speaker 1: Because I adore her and I did the moment I

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Speaker 1: met her. She is a reporter, a podcaster. She's an

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Speaker 1: expert in pop culture and true crime. Y'all know her

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Speaker 1: from Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, Prime Time Crime, and

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Speaker 1: Crime con She has covered cases that y'all has just

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Speaker 1: landed her on People dot Com, l Magazine, and The

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Speaker 1: Today Show.

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Speaker 2: Y'all see her everywhere. She knows everybody.

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Speaker 1: I have never once said to her, Hey, if you

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Speaker 1: ever heard of she goes, Oh, I love them. She

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Speaker 1: knows everybody, but y'all. She didn't come here alone.

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Speaker 2: She brought a slick tailored attorney. JAREDT. Farantino a federal and.

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Speaker 1: State trial lawyer with two decades of experience. He is

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Speaker 1: a nationally recognized true crime personality.

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Speaker 2: He has worked over a hundred.

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Speaker 1: Murder, sexual assault, and drug trafficking cases. Y'all also know

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Speaker 1: him from Crime Stories with Nancy Grace twenty twenty, The

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Speaker 1: ID Network, and Crime Nation. Now I got to tell you,

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Speaker 1: I am so thrilled they are both here together.

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Speaker 2: But something y'all may not know.

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Speaker 1: Lauren and I have worked a case together a few

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Speaker 1: where we try to connect some dots and sometimes maybe

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Speaker 1: find some evidence nobody has seen yet. And Jared and

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Speaker 1: I have worked a case together that the first time

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Speaker 1: I met him, I'm gonna.

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Speaker 2: Tell y'all something.

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Speaker 1: It was straight out of a movie that lawyer dressed perfectly,

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Speaker 1: hair slicked back, smoking a cigar, fully tailored.

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Speaker 2: By a swimming pool. I was like, who in the

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Speaker 2: world is that? And it didn't take me about two

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Speaker 2: seconds to go, Yep, he's the real deal. So I

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Speaker 2: want to just.

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Speaker 1: Tell y'all welcome Lauren and Jarrett to Zone seven.

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Speaker 3: Thank you, Cheryl, I'm laughing. That was the best introduction

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Speaker 3: I've ever heard. Jared, what do you think?

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Speaker 4: Likewise? Thank you Cheryl, And believe me, meeting you was

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Speaker 4: a special for me. You were not in a tailored

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Speaker 4: suitor smoking a cigar, but you were beautiful, southern and

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Speaker 4: hot on the trail of a killer in South Carolina.

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Speaker 4: So great to be here with you, and great to

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Speaker 4: be here with Lauren as always too.

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Speaker 3: Yes, thank you for having us, Cheryl, and you are

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Speaker 3: literally amazing. I mean Jarrett and I meeting is essentially

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Speaker 3: because you.

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Speaker 1: Oh well, I love to hear that, because I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: tell you, I didn't even know the two of y'all

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Speaker 1: knew each other, and all of a sudden it just

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Speaker 1: pops up out Wider podcast and I see the two

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Speaker 1: of you.

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Speaker 2: And I'm like, yes, this should absolutely have happened. And

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Speaker 2: I could not click that thing quick enough. It was

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Speaker 2: so good, so good.

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Speaker 4: We have you to blame. So Cheryl is Cheryl was

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Speaker 4: my conduit and connection to the Nancy Grace Show, and

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Speaker 4: then I met Lauren there, so without you, this tag

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Speaker 4: team would have never happened. So thank you.

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Speaker 3: That's exactly right.

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Speaker 2: I should be thanking y'all. It's fantastic.

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Speaker 1: And again I love the way y'all just come at

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Speaker 1: something from completely different worlds, really, and the way y'all

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Speaker 1: tag team it. It's a beautiful thing.

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Speaker 3: Jared and I connected after Nancy. I had him on

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Speaker 3: my show The Outlier, and we decided to start Primetime

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Speaker 3: Crime together, which starts it off as a pre recorded show.

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Speaker 3: We would throw up the video on YouTube discussing different cases,

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Speaker 3: and then we decided to make it a live stream

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Speaker 3: so the audience and people in the chat could interact

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Speaker 3: and it's been incredible. And I have to say, I mean,

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Speaker 3: I come from a perspective where I like to ask

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Speaker 3: the questions that people might be thinking but are afraid

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Speaker 3: to ask. I genuinely am learning as I go, and

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Speaker 3: you guys both know that about me. I'm not afraid

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Speaker 3: to maybe sound silly every once in a while, like, oh,

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Speaker 3: she should probably know that, well, surprised I didn't know that,

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Speaker 3: and I'm asking about it, and once you tell me,

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Speaker 3: I learn. But Jared is incredible because he's able to

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Speaker 3: break things down in terms that everybody understands, and he

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Speaker 3: doesn't make you feel stupid about it. He doesn't make

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Speaker 3: you feel silly for asking. He actually makes you feel

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Speaker 3: good about asking certain questions in the way he explains them.

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Speaker 3: So I think we make a really good team. We're

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Speaker 3: both very aggressive, you know, we have the same goals

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Speaker 3: we want just for all of the cases that come

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Speaker 3: across our desk.

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Speaker 1: Brilliant and Lauren, that's a great segue for me because

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Speaker 1: one of the first things I wanted to ask is

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Speaker 1: the case that y'all have taken on, and that's the

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Speaker 1: Kansas City Moms. So I'm going to start with Jared,

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Speaker 1: since you tossed me that so beautifully. You know they're

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Speaker 1: looking at these suspects. There's five of them. Do you

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Speaker 1: think they're going to be tried together or separately? So

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Speaker 1: let's just get right into that.

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Speaker 4: Really, that decision is going to be made by the judge,

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Speaker 4: and he or she will be in the best position

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Speaker 4: to make that call once their defense is clarify. If

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Speaker 4: they start pointing the finger at one another, you're going

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Speaker 4: to have a hard time trying them together. And that

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Speaker 4: really remains to be seen. Warren and I have gotten

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Speaker 4: our hands on every filing thus far. We're starting to

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Speaker 4: see some cracks in the conspiracy with regard to the

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Speaker 4: information that's being requested. And again, having done this, having

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Speaker 4: looked at other cases and Warren two were able to

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Speaker 4: pick apart those little signs. So as a prosecutor, you

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Speaker 4: want these cases to be tried together. You could appreciate

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Speaker 4: the fact that you don't want defense lawyers to have

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Speaker 4: five bites at the apple over five separate trials. You

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Speaker 4: don't want to put your witnesses, some of them are

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Speaker 4: children in this case, through five separate trials. The goal

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Speaker 4: really would be let's do it together. Judicial economy, you know,

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Speaker 4: convenience for the parties, convenience for the witness. But it

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Speaker 4: really remains to be seen either way. It is going

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Speaker 4: to be a wild trial.

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Speaker 2: It is gonna be wild, Lauren.

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Speaker 1: Can you just give everybody a brief background of what

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Speaker 1: we're talking about.

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Speaker 3: Yes, absolutely, Cheryl. So this case it seriously pulls at

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Speaker 3: my heart NonStop. I'm close with some of the locals

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Speaker 3: and even some of the family members in this case.

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Speaker 3: But Veronica Butler was a I guess you could call

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Speaker 3: her a single mom. She had two young kids, She

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Speaker 3: was split from her baby's father, and they had some

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Speaker 3: issues with custody. So they were going back and forth

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Speaker 3: with this horrible custody battle where at one point her

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Speaker 3: I'll just call her her mother in law for all

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Speaker 3: intents and purposes, even though the baby's father, Wrangler, and

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Speaker 3: Veronica were never married. Wrangler's mother, Tiffany, stepped in to

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Speaker 3: try and take care of the children, and she got

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Speaker 3: a little bit too comfortable. She thought those kids were

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Speaker 3: her own. She wanted those kids for herself, and Veronica

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Speaker 3: at the point that she disappeared with another woman whose

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Speaker 3: name was Gillian Kelly, she was just Veronica's court appointed

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Speaker 3: supervisor for the day. And actually, what's so heartbreaking about

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Speaker 3: this whole thing is that there was another corn appointed

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Speaker 3: supervisor who called out that day, and we still don't

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Speaker 3: know exactly what made her call out, but she did,

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Speaker 3: and so Jillian took over. And at this point, Veronica

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Speaker 3: was seeing her two children once a week. She was

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Speaker 3: very very close to getting her kids overnight again, and

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Speaker 3: the court appointed supervisor had nothing bad to say. So

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Speaker 3: Veronica was gonna get her kids back. And her mother

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Speaker 3: in law, Tiffany Adams, that is her name, and Wrangler's mother,

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Speaker 3: she didn't want that. She did not want that at all.

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Speaker 3: She did not think that that is what's best for

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Speaker 3: the children. And this is me speculating based on what

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Speaker 3: allegedly happened next. But the day that Gillian and Veronica

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Speaker 3: were driving to see the children from Kansas to Oklahoma,

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Speaker 3: it's you know, their bordering states, you know, they disappeared.

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Speaker 3: We didn't know where they went. It was the day

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Speaker 3: before Easter that they disappeared. There was a week long

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Speaker 3: man hunt for them, and they turned up a week

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Speaker 3: later on rental property. Unfortunately, their bodies were discovered fifteen

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Speaker 3: feet underground in a large chest freezer, and we later

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Speaker 3: found out I think it was maybe two weeks later

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Speaker 3: that Tiffany was arrested and three other suspects at the

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Speaker 3: time were arrested, her boyfriend Tad Collum and two other

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Speaker 3: people other friends, Cora and Cole Twombly. And it turns

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Speaker 3: out Cora and Cole's daughter gave the most information to police,

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Speaker 3: and that, along with what police found evidence wise, led

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Speaker 3: to their arrest. I mean, they had Google searches of how, yeah,

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Speaker 3: how to get someone to leave their house because they

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Speaker 3: had planned to kill Veronica months before by throwing an

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Speaker 3: anvil through her windshield, and they had bought stun guns,

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Speaker 3: they bought prepaid phones. I mean, it was insane. So

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Speaker 3: when the car was actually found in this rural area,

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Speaker 3: it you know, there was pools of blood all around

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Speaker 3: the car. There was kitty litter around the car. Cheryl.

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Speaker 3: It's disgusting, Like they're so stupid the thought that would

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Speaker 3: just soak up all the blood. I'm thinking, I mean,

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Speaker 3: these are just not smart suspects. So there was another

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Speaker 3: man named on the affidavit, the original rest affidavit, but

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Speaker 3: he wasn't arrested until maybe I want to say, three

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Speaker 3: weeks later that was Paul Grice. And then one of

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Speaker 3: the freakiest things about this whole thing is that they

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Speaker 3: were essentially part of a cult, and they called themselves

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Speaker 3: God's Misfits, and so they would have meetings at friends' houses.

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Speaker 3: And I think one of the reasons that so many

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Speaker 3: people are afraid to talk about this case locally is

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Speaker 3: because there was a lot more than five people at

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Speaker 3: these Gods Misfits meetings, so that means there's a lot

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Speaker 3: more of them out there.

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Speaker 1: Well, I'm just gonna say this about that they got

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Speaker 1: that name half right. I don't think God's involved, but

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Speaker 1: I know, gag you know, daggum whale misfits or involved.

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Speaker 2: Because here's the thing.

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Speaker 1: When I first heard about the cave, and you're looking

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Speaker 1: at the timeline and looking at what occurred quickly, these

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Speaker 1: folks leave their house in one state and Veronica and

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Speaker 1: Jillian are driving just across the border to a meeting

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Speaker 1: spot predetermined by the mother in law.

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Speaker 2: And she doesn't show up.

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Speaker 1: Now, everybody listening to me has either got a family

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Speaker 1: member or a friend that went through a divorce that

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Speaker 1: was ugly, and everybody hates their body and everybody you know,

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Speaker 1: throws shade and talks, you know, bad about somebody. If

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Speaker 1: that mother in law had been at that meeting spot

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Speaker 1: and Veronica did not show up to get those children

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Speaker 1: on one of the children's birthday, she would have been

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Speaker 1: the first person on social media. She would have been

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Speaker 1: the first person calling the court system telling everybody that

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Speaker 1: would listen to her, how sorry and good for nothing

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Speaker 1: Veronica was for not showing up when she did not

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Speaker 1: do that baby. That's flag.

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Speaker 3: I didn't even really think about that, and I if

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Speaker 3: people are listening that are a little confused as to

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Speaker 3: why Veronica didn't have custody of her children. You know,

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Speaker 3: I'm not really going over that in detail because to me,

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Speaker 3: in my opinion, a lot of it is unclear. There's

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Speaker 3: I don't want to say rumors. There was some sort

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Speaker 3: of history that was documented of abuse, not by Veronica

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Speaker 3: but by a family member. But in turn, there was

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Speaker 3: also documented potential abuse by Tiffany and even Wrangler back

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Speaker 3: in the day. But at this point we don't exactly

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Speaker 3: know what is true one hundred percent true, I should say,

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Speaker 3: so that's why I didn't necessarily want to go down

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Speaker 3: that road. But just thinking, in case anybody is wondering

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Speaker 3: who's listening.

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Speaker 4: You raise a really good point. There is an arrogance

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Speaker 4: to this conspiracy. I believe that there is a justification

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Speaker 4: in their minds that they believe the ends justified the means.

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Speaker 4: I think they knew damn well their entire conspiracy was

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Speaker 4: going to be caught. They are ready for this thing,

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Speaker 4: and basically they've acted in a way jointly. There were

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Speaker 4: admissions made according to the affidavit by Gryce and by

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Speaker 4: Tiffany Adams. But you said it. Tiffany Adams isn't stupid.

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Speaker 4: She's been in she's been on boards, she's been active

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Speaker 4: in the community. She knew damn well they'd be looking

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Speaker 4: for her. And in short order, I believe, as I

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Speaker 4: look at this and Lauren and I really dig into

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Speaker 4: this thing, there is an arrogance here, and there is

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Speaker 4: a preceived justification for their conduct, whether it's wrapped up

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Speaker 4: in their cult beliefs or some incorrect belief in the law.

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Speaker 4: But that's what I'm that's what I'm speculating. It was

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Speaker 4: a bitter custody situation. I believe Tiffany conspired with these

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Speaker 4: other individuals thing basically, we have to do whatever we

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Speaker 4: got to do to protect these kids, and the government

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Speaker 4: and the judge involved are failing these kids. And that's

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Speaker 4: basically what I think brought about the unfortunate and tragic

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Speaker 4: end of Veronica Angelians.

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Speaker 1: Absolutely, And you know, Paul, he was not arrested for

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Speaker 1: weeks and weeks, and I kept thinking and theorizing the

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Speaker 1: whole time is because he was flipping. I thought he

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Speaker 1: was talking. And then when they arrested him and never

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Speaker 1: said anything, I thought, what in the world then, was

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Speaker 1: what were they doing?

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Speaker 4: That's the first thing I thought as well, And he

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Speaker 4: has provided statements oftentimes if that was developing while the

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Speaker 4: arrests were coming down, they were getting information from Paul

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Speaker 4: confirming what their evidence was showing, and they were negotiating

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Speaker 4: what to actually charge him with. And it may have

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Speaker 4: taken time, and it looks that this way they charged

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Speaker 4: him with the whole kitten kaboodle and may work backwards.

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Speaker 4: But my approach on any of these cases is, I'm

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Speaker 4: sure you know you got five defendants, find the weakest

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Speaker 4: link to make a deal fast, turn them on everybody else,

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Speaker 4: and in five with five, you're gonna find one.

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Speaker 1: I want the weak one. I want the dumb one.

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Speaker 1: I want the one that's scared to death. That's who

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Speaker 1: you want and that's how you go after, which, again,

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Speaker 1: is the one that I thought they would have put

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Speaker 1: the handcuffs home first.

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Speaker 4: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: I everything that I've gathered and researched, and the people

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Speaker 3: I've spoken to in town, they all agreed that Paul

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Speaker 3: Grice was absolutely the weakest link out of the five

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Speaker 3: of them, which I found to be interesting because I

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Speaker 3: always thought maybe it would be Cora Twombly, but no,

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Speaker 3: it's all pointing to Paul.

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Speaker 2: I'll tell you another hero in this thing is the daughter.

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Speaker 4: Oh absolutely, that's an interesting point too. I would find

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Speaker 4: something to pull on the heartstrings of the Twombleas and

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Speaker 4: say the gig is up. Do you want your daughter

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Speaker 4: to have to testify against the two of you or

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Speaker 4: do you want to become joint witnesses in this thing?

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Speaker 4: Stand with her? You brought her into this. I mean,

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Speaker 4: you're the ones who made her a witness. And the

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Speaker 4: last memory basically their daughter would have with them as

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Speaker 4: free people is looking at them in a courtroom in

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Speaker 4: front of a jury, pointing the finger at them for

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Speaker 4: the quote unquote mission they were on. That is a

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Speaker 4: huge component to this case that I think, And if

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Speaker 4: you look at Cora's filings, the lawyers are doing a

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Speaker 4: good job. There's a lot of pre trial fighting right now,

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Speaker 4: but Cora's lawyers have been filing for information related to

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Speaker 4: the domestic disputes between Tiffany and Veronica, and it seems

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Speaker 4: to me that Cora's lawyers are starting to get that

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Speaker 4: information and Tiffany was trying to block it. That's the

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Speaker 4: first sign of trouble amongst the conspiracy because Cora is

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Speaker 4: trying to pad her defense with the information from those

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Speaker 4: domestic filings. So it's clear to me something is amiss

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Speaker 4: here with the conspiracy.

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Speaker 1: Well, we're going to keep following this with y'all, and

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Speaker 1: I can't overstate that I think this is going to

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Speaker 1: be something that not only grabs that entire community, but

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Speaker 1: all of us because this is something that I think

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Speaker 1: resonates with folks on some level. Again, everybody's been through

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Speaker 1: it where a horrible turn could take. Because I believe

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Speaker 1: in this case, you have a grandmama that thought she

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Speaker 1: was doing the right thing and was able to convince

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Speaker 1: for other people she was right.

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Speaker 4: Over an extended period of time to shell like it's

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Speaker 4: conspiracies are always fascinating. But at no time, and Lauren

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Speaker 4: made a good point too, this had been going on

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Speaker 4: for months, the preparation that went into this thing. It's

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Speaker 4: still gotten messed up. But at no time does somebody say,

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Speaker 4: you know, this is probably not a good idea. You know,

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Speaker 4: it's like they were committed to Tiffany and carrying this

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Speaker 4: thing out, which is fat it's fascinating.

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Speaker 1: And you know, I've got four older sisters and at

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Speaker 1: one point I think all four of them have made

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Speaker 1: a horrible romantic choice. However, no matter when the five

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Speaker 1: of us got together talking about how sorry one of

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Speaker 1: them was, or how good for nothing one of them was,

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Speaker 1: nobody ever wound up in a pit with a back hole.

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Speaker 1: So again for us to be angry one night and

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Speaker 1: have our sisters back and yes, agree that this person

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Speaker 1: is the devil. Right at some point, Jared to your point.

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Speaker 1: The next Monday, the next Wednesday, we're like, you know what,

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Speaker 1: forget him. You should already be on a date with

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Speaker 1: somebody else, Like we've moved on from it. You don't

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Speaker 1: plot and plan and scheme and then have one felled

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Speaker 1: attempt where you're going to use an anvil like you're

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Speaker 1: a cartoon character. I mean, the whole thing is just

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Speaker 1: acdine and sad. But again, I think it's important for

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Speaker 1: people to learn the facts about the case.

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Speaker 3: Something that really just kills me inside is that these

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Speaker 3: women were just so unsuspecting. Veronica and Jillian were, you know,

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Speaker 3: they just they came at them out of the blue.

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Speaker 3: The affidavits say Cora and Cole were there to divert

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Speaker 3: the truck. And since we don't know, we don't know

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Speaker 3: what happened to them. We don't know what was done

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Speaker 3: to them with stun guns, with you know, a pistol,

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Speaker 3: We have no idea. So it just it kills me

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Speaker 3: to think about the fact that those horrific faces were

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Speaker 3: the last faces that those women ever saw, not their children.

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Speaker 3: Jillian had four children, she had a husband, she was

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Speaker 3: a preacher's wife. You know, Veronica's children were still small.

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Speaker 3: They loved their mom so much, and Veronica was a

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Speaker 3: great mom. No matter what Tiffany said, Veronica was a

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Speaker 3: wonderful mother and that's what she should be remembered for.

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Speaker 3: But my heart breaks for just the families and the children.

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Speaker 1: And you know, That's the reason I think this is

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Speaker 1: so important because to say there were no flags, absolutely

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Speaker 1: there were. There were flags that were me by Veronica,

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Speaker 1: by the court, by the police, by extended family. There's

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Speaker 1: no way that that mother in law kept her mouth shut.

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Speaker 1: There's no way she didn't send certain text messages, certain threats,

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Speaker 1: certain you know, she showed her hand. I can guarantee

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Speaker 1: you she did. Her hatred for that girl was not

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Speaker 1: hidden in any form or fashion. And I will say this,

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Speaker 1: I can guarantee that something was going on with that

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Speaker 1: birthday party where that mother in law said, no, we're

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Speaker 1: not doing this, No, you can't pick them up here,

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Speaker 1: No I'm not available. Then and then all of a sudden,

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Speaker 1: I bet you she said yes. And I bet she

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Speaker 1: picked the place they were supposed to meet, the abandoned place,

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Speaker 1: because there wouldn't be no cameras, there wouldn't be no people.

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Speaker 1: She did that, and once she started driving the train

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Speaker 1: should have been a clue, unfortunately to both of those women.

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Speaker 3: And I'm sure they'll come out, you know, in the trial,

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Speaker 3: all of these horrific text messages, if they exist, which

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Speaker 3: again I'm sure they do. But I just would think

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Speaker 3: to myself, they wouldn't go alone if they had an

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Speaker 3: inkling that something was going to happen. I mean, it

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Speaker 3: was reported that Gillian had a mag but not a pistol,

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Speaker 3: you know. So it's like, if you were suspecting something,

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Speaker 3: wouldn't you come prepared or bring someone else? And I

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Speaker 3: do I get like worked up about it because they should.

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Speaker 3: They should still be alive and the people.

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Speaker 1: You're one hundred percent right. But let me tell you something.

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Speaker 1: Veronica did go with somebody. She thought she was doing

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Speaker 1: the right thing. She had an officer of the court

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Speaker 1: for all intents and purposes with her right, so she thought,

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Speaker 1: Because here's the thing, Lauren. If you say, hey, I'm

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Speaker 1: going to go here and meet friends for dinner, but

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Speaker 1: the only way I can get back to my car

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Speaker 1: is to cut through two alleys, you.

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Speaker 2: May not do it.

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Speaker 1: But if it's me and you girl come home, you

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Speaker 1: all of a sudden feel safer, even though it's the

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Speaker 1: same level of danger.

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Speaker 4: I think there was a lot of and I think

385
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Speaker 4: maybe there was a naive key and an immortality belief here.

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Speaker 4: I'm sure Tiffany was a lot more bark prior to

387
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Speaker 4: be invite I think that that's the other thing, And

388
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Speaker 4: I think, who in the blue hell thinks we're going

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Speaker 4: to be brutally murdered in broad daylight when we get there.

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Speaker 4: I mean, there's a false sense of security here that

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Speaker 4: kids are being exchanged. At that point, you let your

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Speaker 4: guard down. Her desire to see her children, I'm sure

393
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Speaker 4: trumped any personal concern she may have had for herself,

394
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Speaker 4: and you know what, have tremendous ruse and motivation to

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Speaker 4: get her out there. So it's just so sad. And

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Speaker 4: that's the fascinating thing too about this case is you

397
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Speaker 4: have a grandmother acting this way and her friends acting

398
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Speaker 4: this way, which is so be Maybe in our experience

399
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Speaker 4: it's not foreign, but to people who aren't in the

400
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Speaker 4: murder and mayhem business, it's certainly a foreign concept, correct.

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Speaker 1: And especially in a little bitty town. You know, that's

402
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Speaker 1: another thing that struck me. You know, you're telling me

403
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Speaker 1: that in a two minute period of time, she should

404
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Speaker 1: have showed up to shange the children, but she didn't.

405
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Speaker 1: But that's the exact same moment a complete stranger, a transient,

406
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Speaker 1: happened to intersect with them and kidnap both of them

407
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Speaker 1: and take them somewhere not a chance and you got

408
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Speaker 1: to see it.

409
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Speaker 3: You got to see the area. I mean, Cheryl, I

410
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Speaker 3: know you've seen it, but if anybody listening, you've got

411
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Speaker 3: to google this area. You know. It's like, guy, I'm

412
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Speaker 3: in Oklahoma, Elkhart, Kansas. It's just so rural. It gives

413
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Speaker 3: you chills, you know, when you see these pictures and

414
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Speaker 3: you see just how abandoned it is. But I know

415
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Speaker 3: a lot of the locals are worried. Not I guess

416
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Speaker 3: they're worried about the system. And like you said, it's

417
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Speaker 3: it's a small town quote unquote, but simmer And County

418
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Speaker 3: where they normally live. Cole Twombly's brother is the sheriff.

419
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Speaker 3: Now they're being held in Texas County. But I think

420
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Speaker 3: a lot of people are worried that somehow the system

421
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Speaker 3: is going to fail. And that's also what worries me

422
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Speaker 3: as well. With all these proceedings and all of these

423
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Speaker 3: motions and these filings, and you know, if they're tried together,

424
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Speaker 3: like Jared, it does it freaks me out to think, like,

425
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Speaker 3: could anything go wrong if they're tried together? Could they

426
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Speaker 3: try three of them together and then you know, two

427
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Speaker 3: of them separately. I just it makes me nervous. I mean,

428
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Speaker 3: Tiffany wanted a gag order with the media and she

429
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Speaker 3: actually listed Nancy Grace's show because Nancy had a headline

430
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Speaker 3: that called her killer Granny. And the judge was like, nope, sorry,

431
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Speaker 3: you're not getting it, which is a great sign, but

432
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Speaker 3: again it makes me nervous.

433
00:24:29,880 --> 00:24:35,160
Speaker 2: Well, she didn't lift us, honey, Yeah, yeah, I just think.

434
00:24:35,080 --> 00:24:38,159
Speaker 4: Yeah, obviously there are a million things that can go wrong,

435
00:24:38,359 --> 00:24:41,640
Speaker 4: but I'm looking at this. You got to trust the system.

436
00:24:41,680 --> 00:24:44,800
Speaker 4: You have to have faith in the system here. This

437
00:24:44,920 --> 00:24:48,880
Speaker 4: is a tragic, tragic, brutal case. And I don't care

438
00:24:48,920 --> 00:24:51,840
Speaker 4: if you're the sheriff for the president of the United States.

439
00:24:51,920 --> 00:24:55,600
Speaker 4: They're going to be held accountable and it's gonna take time.

440
00:24:55,680 --> 00:24:57,760
Speaker 4: Though Cheryl Lauren doesn't like when I say this, but

441
00:24:58,119 --> 00:25:01,200
Speaker 4: this trialing happened until two thousand at least.

442
00:25:01,680 --> 00:25:03,240
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm with you on that one.

443
00:25:03,760 --> 00:25:06,879
Speaker 1: And listen, you know, I think we ought to just

444
00:25:07,160 --> 00:25:11,720
Speaker 1: move on to something that is non controversial, a case

445
00:25:11,760 --> 00:25:14,880
Speaker 1: that nobody's talking about, and that's Karen Reid.

446
00:25:18,200 --> 00:25:22,400
Speaker 4: Because you're right, that comes my headache.

447
00:25:22,359 --> 00:25:24,440
Speaker 2: Oh my gosh. And here's the thing.

448
00:25:24,880 --> 00:25:27,840
Speaker 1: All three of us come from a very different place,

449
00:25:27,920 --> 00:25:30,320
Speaker 1: and all three of us kind of have the same

450
00:25:30,560 --> 00:25:34,040
Speaker 1: Oh no, And I'm just gonna put mine out there first,

451
00:25:34,040 --> 00:25:36,520
Speaker 1: and then I'm gonna let y'all take over. And as

452
00:25:36,520 --> 00:25:40,760
Speaker 1: a crime scene investigator, here's what blows my freaking mind.

453
00:25:41,359 --> 00:25:45,160
Speaker 1: If there's going to be a retrial. If and y'all

454
00:25:45,160 --> 00:25:50,040
Speaker 1: hear me, if you don't have a lead detective. Now,

455
00:25:50,119 --> 00:25:52,919
Speaker 1: I don't know how many homicide cases y'all ever sat through,

456
00:25:53,440 --> 00:25:57,560
Speaker 1: but in forty four years, I have never sat through

457
00:25:57,600 --> 00:26:00,679
Speaker 1: one that didn't have a lead detective. You don't have

458
00:26:00,720 --> 00:26:04,119
Speaker 1: a chain of custody. You don't have a confession that

459
00:26:04,200 --> 00:26:06,600
Speaker 1: was written down, which in my world means you ain't

460
00:26:06,600 --> 00:26:09,840
Speaker 1: got one. You don't have a crime scene that was secured.

461
00:26:10,080 --> 00:26:14,040
Speaker 1: You have a law enforcement person on the stand that

462
00:26:14,119 --> 00:26:17,520
Speaker 1: said the body was pointed out to me that it

463
00:26:17,600 --> 00:26:18,480
Speaker 1: was laying over there.

464
00:26:19,640 --> 00:26:21,719
Speaker 2: What so you don't even know where the body was.

465
00:26:22,600 --> 00:26:24,680
Speaker 1: You don't have an expert that can prove a hit

466
00:26:24,680 --> 00:26:28,959
Speaker 1: and run from the commonwealth. And this is when I

467
00:26:28,960 --> 00:26:32,640
Speaker 1: think I literally just slumped back in my chair when

468
00:26:33,560 --> 00:26:36,320
Speaker 1: the FBI interjected themselves in this thing.

469
00:26:36,800 --> 00:26:38,840
Speaker 2: Okay, am I the only one that was like, what

470
00:26:39,000 --> 00:26:42,359
Speaker 2: is happening? Right now? How is this a thing? And

471
00:26:42,400 --> 00:26:42,840
Speaker 2: then my.

472
00:26:42,880 --> 00:26:46,239
Speaker 1: Favorite part is afterwards, all these folks are under an

473
00:26:46,280 --> 00:26:50,160
Speaker 1: ia and the scariest part, one of them wasn't even

474
00:26:50,200 --> 00:26:53,640
Speaker 1: involved in this scene, which tells you it's broader than

475
00:26:53,680 --> 00:26:59,080
Speaker 1: they want us to believe. Jarrett Farantino, take it, Oh boy, of.

476
00:26:58,960 --> 00:27:01,120
Speaker 4: Where do you go from this? So all of those

477
00:27:01,200 --> 00:27:04,320
Speaker 4: points you made are enough for her to walk out

478
00:27:04,359 --> 00:27:08,600
Speaker 4: of that courtroom. That's number one. So it's no longer

479
00:27:08,600 --> 00:27:11,720
Speaker 4: any one of those points that developed properly by the defense.

480
00:27:11,840 --> 00:27:14,760
Speaker 4: I thought her defense a couple of things. Number One,

481
00:27:14,880 --> 00:27:19,160
Speaker 4: I think she's totally overcharged in this case. Okay, if

482
00:27:19,160 --> 00:27:23,840
Speaker 4: you believe the prosecution, this is a manslaughter case at best. Okay.

483
00:27:24,600 --> 00:27:27,760
Speaker 4: Number two, all of the issues you pointed out on

484
00:27:27,800 --> 00:27:31,840
Speaker 4: their own are enough for Karen to be acquitted. Here's

485
00:27:31,880 --> 00:27:35,440
Speaker 4: what people get confused about. The truth is important, and

486
00:27:35,520 --> 00:27:39,320
Speaker 4: it's paranoun, but it doesn't necessarily matter in that courtroom.

487
00:27:39,400 --> 00:27:43,359
Speaker 4: What matters is what you can prove, okay. And there's

488
00:27:43,440 --> 00:27:46,000
Speaker 4: more to life than being right when you get in there.

489
00:27:46,280 --> 00:27:51,240
Speaker 4: So you have all of these investigative issues okay that really,

490
00:27:51,400 --> 00:27:54,680
Speaker 4: if they're not solid, you chip away at that beyond

491
00:27:54,680 --> 00:27:59,159
Speaker 4: a reasonable doubt my opinion. Okay, that story about what

492
00:27:59,280 --> 00:28:01,600
Speaker 4: may have gone on inside the house and things of

493
00:28:01,600 --> 00:28:04,879
Speaker 4: that nature, that is a little bit fantastical to me.

494
00:28:05,160 --> 00:28:08,760
Speaker 4: I think she walks based on chipping away at the

495
00:28:08,760 --> 00:28:12,360
Speaker 4: integrity of the investigation alone. I believe if she did this,

496
00:28:12,880 --> 00:28:15,560
Speaker 4: she hit him, She hit him with her car and

497
00:28:15,640 --> 00:28:18,800
Speaker 4: took off, never intending to kill him, never thinking he

498
00:28:18,880 --> 00:28:21,960
Speaker 4: was going to fall down and die that night. That

499
00:28:22,160 --> 00:28:25,560
Speaker 4: is a major issue if it's retried without that lead

500
00:28:25,600 --> 00:28:28,720
Speaker 4: investigator and all the things they did, and how damaged

501
00:28:28,760 --> 00:28:32,200
Speaker 4: and compromise the credibility of the police are. I've had cases,

502
00:28:32,240 --> 00:28:37,159
Speaker 4: believe it or not, where the FBI was collaterally investigating

503
00:28:37,200 --> 00:28:40,800
Speaker 4: individuals involved. In my case, it is a black cloud

504
00:28:41,080 --> 00:28:44,920
Speaker 4: that hangs over your trial. It makes you extremely nervous,

505
00:28:45,000 --> 00:28:47,960
Speaker 4: and it finds its way into that corporate So the

506
00:28:48,000 --> 00:28:51,160
Speaker 4: reality is all of those issues you pointed out. If

507
00:28:51,240 --> 00:28:53,520
Speaker 4: she gets another trial, you're going to have a hell

508
00:28:53,560 --> 00:29:00,680
Speaker 4: of a time getting a conviction, is all.

509
00:29:00,600 --> 00:29:03,440
Speaker 2: I can say. All Right, Lauren, you're on that jury.

510
00:29:03,440 --> 00:29:07,040
Speaker 3: So jered you you do think that she hit him

511
00:29:07,040 --> 00:29:08,240
Speaker 3: with her car? Most likely?

512
00:29:08,280 --> 00:29:11,760
Speaker 4: That's what I think. That's the most plausible to me,

513
00:29:12,280 --> 00:29:16,080
Speaker 4: explanation all other things aside, but again, I don't know

514
00:29:16,120 --> 00:29:18,040
Speaker 4: that they're going to be able to get up that hill.

515
00:29:18,560 --> 00:29:21,040
Speaker 3: You said this to me and it always stuck with me,

516
00:29:21,200 --> 00:29:23,440
Speaker 3: and they said it on the twenty twenty episode. It's

517
00:29:23,480 --> 00:29:26,719
Speaker 3: called something in Latin. But the simplest answer is the

518
00:29:26,720 --> 00:29:28,360
Speaker 3: most logical. What is that called.

519
00:29:28,360 --> 00:29:31,600
Speaker 2: It's called it's called ass whoopus?

520
00:29:31,800 --> 00:29:35,920
Speaker 3: Wait, well whatever? And you know, I thought about it,

521
00:29:35,960 --> 00:29:38,600
Speaker 3: and I'm like, okay, yeah, that makes sense. And then

522
00:29:38,760 --> 00:29:41,239
Speaker 3: I sat through the trial and I was like, no

523
00:29:41,800 --> 00:29:45,400
Speaker 3: way is she getting convicted. I was even surprised that

524
00:29:45,440 --> 00:29:48,960
Speaker 3: there was a mistrial based on everything that I saw,

525
00:29:49,040 --> 00:29:53,920
Speaker 3: and I'm talking everything from the dufist that is Trooper Paul.

526
00:29:53,960 --> 00:29:55,920
Speaker 3: And I'm actually a really nice person, but that was

527
00:29:55,960 --> 00:29:59,240
Speaker 3: so hard to sit through. And then, Cheryl, when you mentioned,

528
00:29:59,800 --> 00:30:02,760
Speaker 3: you know, they're affectionately known on the internet as crash

529
00:30:02,840 --> 00:30:06,200
Speaker 3: Daddy's but Arca, who was hired by the FEDS when

530
00:30:06,240 --> 00:30:10,560
Speaker 3: they came in, and I mean, these guys had their doctorates,

531
00:30:10,600 --> 00:30:14,200
Speaker 3: they you know, they just they were incredible. They were

532
00:30:14,280 --> 00:30:18,080
Speaker 3: absolutely incredible, and they convinced me there was no way

533
00:30:18,640 --> 00:30:20,800
Speaker 3: that John was hit by a car. You know, they

534
00:30:20,880 --> 00:30:24,560
Speaker 3: convinced me of this, and then you know, I studied

535
00:30:24,840 --> 00:30:28,200
Speaker 3: these witnesses and even some of the officers. I mean,

536
00:30:28,560 --> 00:30:31,840
Speaker 3: you know, you've got Officer Sarah who did not once

537
00:30:32,080 --> 00:30:34,560
Speaker 3: say to the grand jury that he heard Karen Reid

538
00:30:34,600 --> 00:30:37,120
Speaker 3: say she hit him, she hit him, she had him, Oh,

539
00:30:37,240 --> 00:30:39,560
Speaker 3: I hit him. He did not stay that to the

540
00:30:39,560 --> 00:30:41,720
Speaker 3: grand jury. He didn't put that in any reports. And

541
00:30:41,800 --> 00:30:43,640
Speaker 3: yet he's up there on the stand saying that he

542
00:30:43,640 --> 00:30:47,240
Speaker 3: heard that. And this goes for many other witnesses. And sorry,

543
00:30:47,280 --> 00:30:48,760
Speaker 3: I feel like I'm yelling right now because I just

544
00:30:48,800 --> 00:30:54,160
Speaker 3: get so I know, I'm sorry. I'm sorry.

545
00:30:54,440 --> 00:30:58,520
Speaker 2: Jared. Listen now, Jarreed, you're Italian. You know that's just passion.

546
00:31:00,360 --> 00:31:04,479
Speaker 4: My hands go like crazy, we literally mine are.

547
00:31:04,600 --> 00:31:06,560
Speaker 3: But yeah, you'll have to forgive me. My voice is

548
00:31:06,640 --> 00:31:10,960
Speaker 3: very loud. But no, every single witness, in my opinion,

549
00:31:11,520 --> 00:31:14,840
Speaker 3: was off. They had something to hide. And Cheryl, it's

550
00:31:14,880 --> 00:31:18,800
Speaker 3: your fault for introducing me to Peter Hyatt, because I

551
00:31:18,840 --> 00:31:23,080
Speaker 3: break everything down. When Matt McCabe, yeah, who was supposed

552
00:31:23,080 --> 00:31:26,040
Speaker 3: to be a friend of Officer John o'keef, is texting

553
00:31:26,120 --> 00:31:29,280
Speaker 3: Brian Albert saying the guy never went in the house

554
00:31:29,560 --> 00:31:33,720
Speaker 3: and then Albert writes back, exactly, I've said this before,

555
00:31:33,760 --> 00:31:35,920
Speaker 3: but this is like what my eight year old daughter

556
00:31:35,960 --> 00:31:37,959
Speaker 3: and I do to my son when I don't want

557
00:31:38,000 --> 00:31:40,480
Speaker 3: him to have ice cream. I say, hey, the ice

558
00:31:40,520 --> 00:31:45,360
Speaker 3: cream shop is closed, and Paisley says, yeah, exactly. And

559
00:31:45,400 --> 00:31:47,800
Speaker 3: we're trying to like make this whole you know what

560
00:31:47,800 --> 00:31:51,000
Speaker 3: I'm saying, And sure, yeah, there's there's that, there's the

561
00:31:51,040 --> 00:31:53,440
Speaker 3: fact that, and listen, it could mean nothing. But if

562
00:31:53,440 --> 00:31:57,120
Speaker 3: you don't believe in coincidences, there's too many, right they

563
00:31:57,160 --> 00:31:59,600
Speaker 3: sell thirty four Affair of You. The police never go

564
00:31:59,680 --> 00:32:01,920
Speaker 3: inside the house or actually, I'm sorry, they went inside

565
00:32:01,920 --> 00:32:04,640
Speaker 3: the house, but they didn't inspect the basement or do

566
00:32:04,760 --> 00:32:07,560
Speaker 3: anything in the basement. They rehomed the dog. When John's

567
00:32:07,680 --> 00:32:10,520
Speaker 3: arm shows up and people say, oh, it looks like

568
00:32:10,720 --> 00:32:13,560
Speaker 3: dog bites, and Marie, doctor Marie Russell went on the

569
00:32:13,560 --> 00:32:16,320
Speaker 3: stand and said, those are definitely dog bites. I mean,

570
00:32:16,600 --> 00:32:21,200
Speaker 3: there are so many things here that to me were like, okay,

571
00:32:21,520 --> 00:32:26,280
Speaker 3: I'm not buying it. But then again, the whole conspiracy

572
00:32:26,520 --> 00:32:28,800
Speaker 3: of him being in the house getting the shit kicked

573
00:32:28,800 --> 00:32:31,240
Speaker 3: out of him being dragged outside, I don't know about

574
00:32:31,280 --> 00:32:33,320
Speaker 3: that either. And I've thought of these things in my head,

575
00:32:33,360 --> 00:32:35,480
Speaker 3: but it's not really my job to come up with

576
00:32:35,960 --> 00:32:39,760
Speaker 3: what tragically happened to Officer O'Keefe. It's not my job.

577
00:32:39,800 --> 00:32:43,200
Speaker 3: But still I'm not convinced of either one that he

578
00:32:43,280 --> 00:32:45,040
Speaker 3: was killed in the house and dragged as I'm just

579
00:32:45,080 --> 00:32:47,280
Speaker 3: not I'm not convinced that that she hit him. I

580
00:32:47,280 --> 00:32:51,160
Speaker 3: mean the black blob that one of the witnesses saw, Like,

581
00:32:51,200 --> 00:32:54,200
Speaker 3: no one's talking about that either. It's just everything doesn't

582
00:32:54,240 --> 00:32:56,760
Speaker 3: make sense. I'm sorry that was long winded, and I

583
00:32:56,840 --> 00:32:59,280
Speaker 3: actually probably could go on for another twenty minutes, which

584
00:32:59,320 --> 00:32:59,840
Speaker 3: is so sad.

585
00:33:00,640 --> 00:33:03,640
Speaker 2: But do you know what that is. That's a reasonable doubt.

586
00:33:03,760 --> 00:33:05,160
Speaker 4: Oh, it's a lot of doubts.

587
00:33:06,000 --> 00:33:06,480
Speaker 2: And listen.

588
00:33:07,080 --> 00:33:11,200
Speaker 1: And that's why early on I tweeted that this is

589
00:33:11,760 --> 00:33:14,560
Speaker 1: Casey Anthony and Mark Furman had a baby?

590
00:33:14,840 --> 00:33:15,800
Speaker 2: Is Troop or Proctor?

591
00:33:17,760 --> 00:33:19,240
Speaker 1: And let me tell you why I said that, because

592
00:33:19,240 --> 00:33:21,160
Speaker 1: a lot of people didn't understand my reference.

593
00:33:21,280 --> 00:33:22,320
Speaker 2: My reference was.

594
00:33:23,800 --> 00:33:26,600
Speaker 1: One of the first times Nancy Grace ever cut my mic.

595
00:33:27,040 --> 00:33:29,520
Speaker 1: Is when I said Casey Anthony was going to walk

596
00:33:29,560 --> 00:33:30,440
Speaker 1: out of that courtroom.

597
00:33:30,720 --> 00:33:32,040
Speaker 2: And here's the reason I said it.

598
00:33:32,880 --> 00:33:36,280
Speaker 1: You could not find me a picture of her and

599
00:33:36,360 --> 00:33:40,400
Speaker 1: that baby that they weren't happy. That baby was clean,

600
00:33:40,560 --> 00:33:44,600
Speaker 1: that baby was happy, That baby was healthy, she was dressed, adorable,

601
00:33:44,680 --> 00:33:48,080
Speaker 1: She was playing with something all the time. Casey was

602
00:33:48,120 --> 00:33:50,120
Speaker 1: tossing her in the air, she was hugging her. They

603
00:33:50,120 --> 00:33:53,040
Speaker 1: were in the pool, they were at the beach. You

604
00:33:53,080 --> 00:33:57,440
Speaker 1: couldn't find me anything visually to show me that was

605
00:33:57,480 --> 00:34:01,240
Speaker 1: not a happy mama and child. To me, that was relevant.

606
00:34:01,280 --> 00:34:04,320
Speaker 1: And the second thing that I could not get away from.

607
00:34:04,640 --> 00:34:07,400
Speaker 1: I could ask fifty people, how do you think the

608
00:34:07,400 --> 00:34:10,600
Speaker 1: baby died? Everybody has a different answer. It was an

609
00:34:10,640 --> 00:34:15,360
Speaker 1: accidental drowning. She accidentally got in mama's drugs. Mamma used chloroform.

610
00:34:15,719 --> 00:34:17,759
Speaker 1: I think she maybe fail and hit her head and

611
00:34:17,800 --> 00:34:21,920
Speaker 1: Mama freaked out. Nobody can tell me how that baby died.

612
00:34:21,960 --> 00:34:23,640
Speaker 1: If you don't know how the baby died, you ain't

613
00:34:23,640 --> 00:34:27,040
Speaker 1: got murder. Same with John O'Keefe. If you cannot tell

614
00:34:27,080 --> 00:34:29,440
Speaker 1: me how he died, you ain't got murder. And the

615
00:34:29,520 --> 00:34:32,160
Speaker 1: thing is, you take that arm, and you show that

616
00:34:32,320 --> 00:34:35,399
Speaker 1: arm to one hundred nurses, I guarantee you eighty five

617
00:34:35,440 --> 00:34:37,799
Speaker 1: percent are going to say dog bite because they've seen

618
00:34:37,840 --> 00:34:40,719
Speaker 1: it that many times. If you look at the injury.

619
00:34:41,239 --> 00:34:43,839
Speaker 1: What are the odds? And if you look at the

620
00:34:43,880 --> 00:34:47,720
Speaker 1: pieces of the tail, like, you cannot find one piece

621
00:34:48,160 --> 00:34:50,759
Speaker 1: that would make those parallel scratches.

622
00:34:50,920 --> 00:34:54,399
Speaker 3: No tailate's plastic, Cheryl, what about that whole thing?

623
00:34:54,480 --> 00:34:54,640
Speaker 2: Right?

624
00:34:54,719 --> 00:34:56,840
Speaker 1: But even if you have that, but even if you

625
00:34:56,880 --> 00:35:00,239
Speaker 1: have that little tip, it's going to make one scratch,

626
00:35:00,280 --> 00:35:03,759
Speaker 1: not two parallel scratches. And then they it's like two

627
00:35:03,960 --> 00:35:06,600
Speaker 1: and two and two and two and they're slightly in

628
00:35:06,680 --> 00:35:08,040
Speaker 1: different directions.

629
00:35:08,080 --> 00:35:11,120
Speaker 2: Not possible. I mean I called it a magic tail light.

630
00:35:11,520 --> 00:35:14,560
Speaker 3: The cocktail loss was intact too, So that's the other thing.

631
00:35:14,600 --> 00:35:17,040
Speaker 3: It's like, couldn't have been glass either, and there wouldn't

632
00:35:17,080 --> 00:35:19,040
Speaker 3: I mean, yeah, I didn't go into the details, but

633
00:35:19,040 --> 00:35:21,080
Speaker 3: there would have been a lot more damage to the car.

634
00:35:21,400 --> 00:35:23,640
Speaker 3: I mean, and you know what pisces me off to

635
00:35:24,080 --> 00:35:26,920
Speaker 3: is the reason or one of the reasons they upped

636
00:35:26,960 --> 00:35:31,040
Speaker 3: the charge to murder is because of the messages, like

637
00:35:31,080 --> 00:35:34,839
Speaker 3: the hate messages that she left him after she murdered him.

638
00:35:35,239 --> 00:35:39,759
Speaker 3: I mean, right, totally. And Jared, we've talked about this

639
00:35:40,040 --> 00:35:43,719
Speaker 3: where I think it was it was like Scott Peterson,

640
00:35:43,840 --> 00:35:47,160
Speaker 3: Jody Arius, They're leaving me sweet messages after they you know,

641
00:35:47,280 --> 00:35:51,200
Speaker 3: murdered their spouse. The only person that left those horrific

642
00:35:51,239 --> 00:35:54,200
Speaker 3: messages was Betty Broderick, and she, you know, she had

643
00:35:54,200 --> 00:35:58,480
Speaker 3: some well documented issues and had done a few other

644
00:35:58,520 --> 00:36:01,279
Speaker 3: things besides leave messages like that. But I was just

645
00:36:01,400 --> 00:36:04,239
Speaker 3: everything just bothered me so much about this, and it

646
00:36:04,400 --> 00:36:07,920
Speaker 3: really just grinds my gears about you know, just the

647
00:36:07,960 --> 00:36:10,399
Speaker 3: state of Massachusetts, and they just need to get their

648
00:36:10,440 --> 00:36:11,719
Speaker 3: act together, my goodness.

649
00:36:11,760 --> 00:36:14,520
Speaker 4: In the end, Cheryl, you make a powerful point. You

650
00:36:14,600 --> 00:36:18,160
Speaker 4: take the Casey Anthony pictures and the failure to really

651
00:36:18,200 --> 00:36:21,279
Speaker 4: explain the death and the murder. That's really what the

652
00:36:21,280 --> 00:36:23,760
Speaker 4: heart of the Karen Reid case is. If you can't

653
00:36:23,840 --> 00:36:27,160
Speaker 4: convince them what the hell happened, how can you convince

654
00:36:27,200 --> 00:36:31,640
Speaker 4: them who's responsible? What happened? Is question number one? Who

655
00:36:31,800 --> 00:36:34,399
Speaker 4: done it? Is question number two. If you can't answer one,

656
00:36:34,760 --> 00:36:35,480
Speaker 4: you got nothing.

657
00:36:36,120 --> 00:36:38,399
Speaker 1: And question number three should never even get in there,

658
00:36:38,400 --> 00:36:41,320
Speaker 1: but it's going to and that is how does three

659
00:36:41,360 --> 00:36:45,279
Speaker 1: police departments and fifteen people missed the tail light but

660
00:36:45,440 --> 00:36:46,880
Speaker 1: Proctor suddenly found it.

661
00:36:47,239 --> 00:36:49,919
Speaker 2: That's where the Mark Furman comes in. Then I didn't

662
00:36:49,920 --> 00:36:50,600
Speaker 2: even mention it.

663
00:36:50,640 --> 00:36:54,719
Speaker 1: In my first little die tribe his text messages, so

664
00:36:54,880 --> 00:36:57,840
Speaker 1: you say that till the end. And now they won't

665
00:36:57,840 --> 00:36:59,799
Speaker 1: even tell us the rest of what they found on

666
00:36:59,800 --> 00:37:02,600
Speaker 1: that phone because they know they know it's going to

667
00:37:02,640 --> 00:37:05,480
Speaker 1: blow up. Oh, I don't know, sixteen twenty more cases.

668
00:37:06,320 --> 00:37:08,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, like the Anna Walsh case. Proctor was one of

669
00:37:08,880 --> 00:37:11,640
Speaker 3: the lead detectives on that. And you know, I was

670
00:37:11,800 --> 00:37:16,160
Speaker 3: very shocked because whether you like him or hate him,

671
00:37:16,760 --> 00:37:19,480
Speaker 3: Turtle Boy, Aiden Carney and I'm not even talking but

672
00:37:19,640 --> 00:37:23,040
Speaker 3: anything else he's done except for this. He did interview

673
00:37:23,120 --> 00:37:26,680
Speaker 3: a juror, and this juror did not was not one

674
00:37:26,680 --> 00:37:29,000
Speaker 3: of the jurors that went to the defense or to

675
00:37:29,080 --> 00:37:33,440
Speaker 3: the state. But this juror said that they thought that

676
00:37:33,560 --> 00:37:37,920
Speaker 3: the Canton police were the ones that were not great,

677
00:37:38,160 --> 00:37:40,520
Speaker 3: not you know, just not did a horrible job, and

678
00:37:40,560 --> 00:37:42,840
Speaker 3: that the mass Date Police did a good job because

679
00:37:42,880 --> 00:37:45,680
Speaker 3: they're the ones that found the tail light. So I

680
00:37:45,760 --> 00:37:48,240
Speaker 3: was I was shocked at that. I was like, wait, really,

681
00:37:48,280 --> 00:37:51,680
Speaker 3: you're not really grouping them as one and doing this

682
00:37:52,040 --> 00:37:55,600
Speaker 3: god awful investigation. They actually had more respect for the

683
00:37:55,640 --> 00:37:57,640
Speaker 3: mass State Police minus Procter.

684
00:37:58,320 --> 00:38:01,160
Speaker 1: And y'all, I think there's cases he's we've never heard

685
00:38:01,160 --> 00:38:04,680
Speaker 1: of that whatever they found in that phone, I mean

686
00:38:04,719 --> 00:38:08,040
Speaker 1: the prosecutor flat said, I mean people would be in

687
00:38:08,120 --> 00:38:09,640
Speaker 1: danger if they released it.

688
00:38:09,760 --> 00:38:10,680
Speaker 2: What does that tell you?

689
00:38:11,239 --> 00:38:14,480
Speaker 4: That should be a lesson to every investigator out there.

690
00:38:14,840 --> 00:38:19,560
Speaker 4: Don't don't be stupid. If oh, could you imagine sitting

691
00:38:19,600 --> 00:38:22,840
Speaker 4: in that courtroom with your lead detective reading those texts,

692
00:38:22,840 --> 00:38:25,160
Speaker 4: I would have threw a shoe at him.

693
00:38:25,560 --> 00:38:29,200
Speaker 1: Let me tell you, I told my chief this needs

694
00:38:29,239 --> 00:38:32,080
Speaker 1: to be shown at every single police academy in the country.

695
00:38:32,320 --> 00:38:36,080
Speaker 4: Well, I'm speaking at the Pennsylvania State Police Academy in

696
00:38:36,200 --> 00:38:39,080
Speaker 4: two weeks, and I promise you there will be a

697
00:38:39,120 --> 00:38:42,879
Speaker 4: picture of Proctor incorporated into my presentation.

698
00:38:43,600 --> 00:38:45,640
Speaker 1: And you know, to me, the most damming of the

699
00:38:45,680 --> 00:38:49,120
Speaker 1: whole thing is when the defense attorney said, read this,

700
00:38:49,719 --> 00:38:53,120
Speaker 1: and then he his own words, he said C word

701
00:38:54,040 --> 00:38:56,399
Speaker 1: and the defense startey said, no, no, no, that ain't

702
00:38:56,440 --> 00:38:57,080
Speaker 1: what you wrote.

703
00:38:57,200 --> 00:38:59,480
Speaker 2: You know you read what you wrote.

704
00:39:00,160 --> 00:39:03,480
Speaker 1: So that to me, that to me even showed buddy,

705
00:39:03,680 --> 00:39:05,279
Speaker 1: that's how bad you know this is.

706
00:39:05,440 --> 00:39:06,520
Speaker 2: You don't even want to say it.

707
00:39:06,600 --> 00:39:08,879
Speaker 3: Yes, and it's just funny that you said that. Sorry,

708
00:39:08,920 --> 00:39:10,919
Speaker 3: it's not funny. I shouldn't say that. But because I've

709
00:39:10,960 --> 00:39:15,520
Speaker 3: watched that whole thing so many times, he's looking down

710
00:39:16,120 --> 00:39:19,279
Speaker 3: and he says the C word, and then Judge Canoni says,

711
00:39:19,320 --> 00:39:22,239
Speaker 3: these are your words, Trooper Proctor, Yes, your honor, go

712
00:39:22,280 --> 00:39:26,440
Speaker 3: ahead and say them. I literally I'm like, yes, for once, Judge,

713
00:39:26,480 --> 00:39:28,239
Speaker 3: I agree with you. Go ahead and say them.

714
00:39:29,360 --> 00:39:31,480
Speaker 1: I mean, that's what you sent to God and country.

715
00:39:31,480 --> 00:39:33,600
Speaker 1: You didn't care who saw it. You knew it was

716
00:39:33,640 --> 00:39:36,200
Speaker 1: a possibility that this was going to happen.

717
00:39:37,000 --> 00:39:39,600
Speaker 4: Sure one of the other things too. Another lesson to

718
00:39:39,640 --> 00:39:42,839
Speaker 4: be taken from this. You know, go back to your

719
00:39:42,920 --> 00:39:45,480
Speaker 4: police officers. I know you talk to police officers all

720
00:39:45,520 --> 00:39:48,600
Speaker 4: over the country and investigators like, be smart about what

721
00:39:48,640 --> 00:39:51,600
Speaker 4: you're putting on social media, be smart about what you're

722
00:39:51,640 --> 00:39:54,759
Speaker 4: liking and sharing. I do that whenever I speak. I

723
00:39:54,800 --> 00:39:57,040
Speaker 4: speak at these academies and I tell them, and I

724
00:39:57,080 --> 00:40:00,560
Speaker 4: see the same look on their faces, like they're like, oh, shoot,

725
00:40:00,920 --> 00:40:04,640
Speaker 4: that text or that Facebook joke that I liked that

726
00:40:04,680 --> 00:40:08,239
Speaker 4: could be inferred as racist, or a picture of me

727
00:40:08,640 --> 00:40:12,360
Speaker 4: passed out drunk. I say, go clean up your Facebook,

728
00:40:12,400 --> 00:40:16,080
Speaker 4: go clean up your Instagram, because all of that is

729
00:40:16,280 --> 00:40:19,279
Speaker 4: fair game and it's public. These are the kind of

730
00:40:19,320 --> 00:40:21,719
Speaker 4: things you want to wear that badge, and then inevitably

731
00:40:21,800 --> 00:40:24,200
Speaker 4: somebody will say freedom of speech. This I'll tell you why.

732
00:40:24,400 --> 00:40:26,279
Speaker 4: When you're on the stand and you're in the hot

733
00:40:26,320 --> 00:40:29,680
Speaker 4: seat and somebody's bringing up some racial slur you made

734
00:40:29,760 --> 00:40:32,279
Speaker 4: up or you made two years ago, I'm going to

735
00:40:32,360 --> 00:40:34,719
Speaker 4: yell up from my seat. Remember the first Amendment. I

736
00:40:34,760 --> 00:40:36,480
Speaker 4: hope you're happy. You know.

737
00:40:40,960 --> 00:40:44,480
Speaker 1: Mark Furman used one word a lot about it. This

738
00:40:44,600 --> 00:40:49,680
Speaker 1: man used horrible language, horrible situations. He brought up suicide,

739
00:40:49,719 --> 00:40:53,400
Speaker 1: he brought up her medical event, he used profanity. I

740
00:40:53,440 --> 00:40:56,760
Speaker 1: mean he hit all the highlights. Because there's nobody sitting

741
00:40:56,800 --> 00:41:00,319
Speaker 1: in that jurabox that has not been affected by suicide

742
00:41:00,400 --> 00:41:03,759
Speaker 1: in some way. A childhood friend, a family friend, a coworker.

743
00:41:04,080 --> 00:41:06,879
Speaker 1: No way, you've escaped that. And then you bring up

744
00:41:06,920 --> 00:41:11,400
Speaker 1: such horrible words regarding women. Well, you offended somebody, at

745
00:41:11,480 --> 00:41:15,160
Speaker 1: least one. I mean, there was nothing that he said.

746
00:41:15,520 --> 00:41:18,440
Speaker 1: And then when he went to her health issues, I

747
00:41:18,440 --> 00:41:21,759
Speaker 1: don't care who you are, that is not okay what

748
00:41:21,840 --> 00:41:25,440
Speaker 1: he did. So to me, he was just after he

749
00:41:25,480 --> 00:41:29,319
Speaker 1: had been discredited and after he looked like a fool. No,

750
00:41:29,400 --> 00:41:32,360
Speaker 1: I didn't go to the crime scene. What lead detective

751
00:41:32,400 --> 00:41:35,480
Speaker 1: doesn't go to the homicide crime scene. I know it

752
00:41:35,520 --> 00:41:38,720
Speaker 1: was a joke, and then no, I don't write it down.

753
00:41:39,440 --> 00:41:42,080
Speaker 1: You don't write it down, You don't make sure that

754
00:41:42,120 --> 00:41:44,680
Speaker 1: scene is secure, you don't make sure that you bring

755
00:41:44,719 --> 00:41:47,719
Speaker 1: in the very best person that you've got. And remember,

756
00:41:48,200 --> 00:41:51,239
Speaker 1: this is a homicide of a police officer, not that

757
00:41:51,320 --> 00:41:53,560
Speaker 1: they would get special treatment, not that they're going to

758
00:41:53,600 --> 00:41:56,960
Speaker 1: get things other people don't get. But you absolutely know

759
00:41:57,080 --> 00:42:00,000
Speaker 1: in your heart you're not fixing a call Boston until

760
00:42:00,000 --> 00:42:01,640
Speaker 1: tell them you didn't do everything perfect.

761
00:42:02,080 --> 00:42:04,680
Speaker 4: And imagine for a moment if this is one hundred

762
00:42:04,680 --> 00:42:07,840
Speaker 4: percent true Karen Reid. This is just for the purposes

763
00:42:07,880 --> 00:42:11,719
Speaker 4: of my point. Imagine if it's one hundred percent true

764
00:42:11,719 --> 00:42:14,680
Speaker 4: that Karen Reid caused the death of John O'Keefe. Could

765
00:42:14,719 --> 00:42:18,320
Speaker 4: you imagine what an embarrassment it is when another officer

766
00:42:18,719 --> 00:42:22,440
Speaker 4: is there prosecuting the death of a colleague, of a brother,

767
00:42:22,920 --> 00:42:27,520
Speaker 4: and that's what's being read. His disrespectful And here's what happened, Cheryl.

768
00:42:27,920 --> 00:42:32,440
Speaker 4: Not only is his he's in he's uncredible. Now his

769
00:42:32,560 --> 00:42:36,080
Speaker 4: texts were incredible. And here's why. It shows a level

770
00:42:36,160 --> 00:42:40,759
Speaker 4: of immaturity, It shows stupidity, and worse, it shows an

771
00:42:40,840 --> 00:42:45,000
Speaker 4: animus in a disregard for Karen Reid and her rights

772
00:42:45,040 --> 00:42:49,319
Speaker 4: and all of that that cocktail together spell's disaster for

773
00:42:49,480 --> 00:42:52,000
Speaker 4: anybody looking to have faith in anything.

774
00:42:51,680 --> 00:42:54,919
Speaker 1: He's said well stated, And that's why I've told people

775
00:42:54,960 --> 00:42:56,399
Speaker 1: they're never going to retry her.

776
00:42:56,800 --> 00:42:57,920
Speaker 2: They're not going to do it.

777
00:42:58,160 --> 00:43:02,400
Speaker 1: How how do you do it without a detective that

778
00:43:02,600 --> 00:43:05,120
Speaker 1: ran the show supposedly? How do you do it with

779
00:43:05,239 --> 00:43:09,400
Speaker 1: no new evidence, no decent eyewitness, They've lost the video.

780
00:43:09,600 --> 00:43:12,200
Speaker 1: The other video is inverted in backwards. I mean, what

781
00:43:12,400 --> 00:43:13,240
Speaker 1: are we doing?

782
00:43:13,960 --> 00:43:18,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's really bad. It's gross. That whole department seemed

783
00:43:18,880 --> 00:43:21,359
Speaker 3: like they were just so misogynousts and just going back

784
00:43:21,400 --> 00:43:24,879
Speaker 3: to like not one person was like, hey, maybe don't

785
00:43:24,880 --> 00:43:27,480
Speaker 3: put this in writing. Hey and maybe you know, no

786
00:43:27,520 --> 00:43:30,359
Speaker 3: one said don't do that. That's wrong. I mean, it's

787
00:43:30,400 --> 00:43:31,080
Speaker 3: just gross.

788
00:43:31,560 --> 00:43:32,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's what I'm saying.

789
00:43:32,880 --> 00:43:35,879
Speaker 1: And when you look at the internal affairs investigations, there's

790
00:43:35,920 --> 00:43:38,120
Speaker 1: some folks that got caught in that net that were

791
00:43:38,160 --> 00:43:39,279
Speaker 1: not involved in this case.

792
00:43:39,280 --> 00:43:40,720
Speaker 2: And that tells me all I need.

793
00:43:40,960 --> 00:43:44,640
Speaker 1: It's wider and deeper and uglier than they have let

794
00:43:44,719 --> 00:43:45,000
Speaker 1: us know.

795
00:43:45,480 --> 00:43:49,000
Speaker 3: Think about Kevin Albert, who Procter was forced to admit

796
00:43:49,080 --> 00:43:52,480
Speaker 3: on this stand and also, like all these people drinking

797
00:43:52,520 --> 00:43:55,720
Speaker 3: and driving, and like I said, Proctor and Kevin Albert

798
00:43:55,719 --> 00:43:58,360
Speaker 3: were forced to admit that they were in a police

799
00:43:58,400 --> 00:44:01,520
Speaker 3: cruiser in the Cape drinking and he left his badge

800
00:44:01,520 --> 00:44:04,279
Speaker 3: and gun there. I mean, it's just it's absurd. And

801
00:44:05,040 --> 00:44:08,080
Speaker 3: all of these people who who it's a blizzard out

802
00:44:08,120 --> 00:44:10,439
Speaker 3: and you're at a bar and you're having X many

803
00:44:10,520 --> 00:44:12,440
Speaker 3: drinks and you're all getting in your car. I mean,

804
00:44:12,520 --> 00:44:15,239
Speaker 3: Karen included here. This is it's just weird. And they

805
00:44:15,280 --> 00:44:18,799
Speaker 3: all seem to not care about letting underaged kids drink.

806
00:44:18,880 --> 00:44:21,319
Speaker 3: I mean this whole I get it, small town, but

807
00:44:21,560 --> 00:44:22,720
Speaker 3: my goodness.

808
00:44:22,360 --> 00:44:25,160
Speaker 4: Taking Rhodies out of the bar to the next bar.

809
00:44:25,680 --> 00:44:26,600
Speaker 2: Yeah.

810
00:44:26,960 --> 00:44:27,720
Speaker 3: Yeah.

811
00:44:27,760 --> 00:44:32,719
Speaker 1: And that's why I've said the Commonweltz case gets weaker,

812
00:44:33,239 --> 00:44:35,560
Speaker 1: it cannot ever get stronger.

813
00:44:35,400 --> 00:44:40,399
Speaker 4: I agree with every passing day. And here's the other thing.

814
00:44:40,719 --> 00:44:43,760
Speaker 4: Even if they were to retry this and get her Cheryl,

815
00:44:43,920 --> 00:44:46,359
Speaker 4: she's going to remain out on bail with all these

816
00:44:46,400 --> 00:44:51,439
Speaker 4: collateral issues out there. The federal investigation that case has

817
00:44:51,480 --> 00:44:54,920
Speaker 4: to get through a jury to beyond a reasonable doubt

818
00:44:55,080 --> 00:44:59,160
Speaker 4: and survive the rigors of appeals that are forthcoming. And

819
00:44:59,719 --> 00:45:03,600
Speaker 4: this federal investigation that hangs over, which will inevitably result

820
00:45:03,640 --> 00:45:07,759
Speaker 4: in challenges to the case that was ultimately made if

821
00:45:07,800 --> 00:45:11,239
Speaker 4: it's made against Karen Reid. So even if they get her,

822
00:45:11,600 --> 00:45:13,240
Speaker 4: Karen Reid does not go to jail.

823
00:45:13,880 --> 00:45:16,359
Speaker 2: Well, Jared, I'll say this to you.

824
00:45:16,360 --> 00:45:20,919
Speaker 1: You said that you believe she was overcharged. I think

825
00:45:21,000 --> 00:45:24,160
Speaker 1: Casey Anthony was overcharged too. But I think if you

826
00:45:24,280 --> 00:45:28,960
Speaker 1: have a second trial and you even attempt to overcharge her,

827
00:45:29,360 --> 00:45:32,279
Speaker 1: I think that's an ethics issue because you know you

828
00:45:32,320 --> 00:45:32,920
Speaker 1: don't have it.

829
00:45:33,280 --> 00:45:35,319
Speaker 2: A jury has already told you you don't have it.

830
00:45:35,719 --> 00:45:40,600
Speaker 4: Well, and again, I think it's such a political football

831
00:45:40,719 --> 00:45:44,040
Speaker 4: and everything out there. I believe she was overcharged, you know,

832
00:45:44,200 --> 00:45:47,680
Speaker 4: to take those texts and make it intense. So what

833
00:45:47,840 --> 00:45:51,080
Speaker 4: was her plan? To slightly back over him with the

834
00:45:51,120 --> 00:45:53,200
Speaker 4: car or knock him down with the car and h

835
00:45:53,200 --> 00:45:55,359
Speaker 4: til it out of there. That was her intention, and

836
00:45:55,400 --> 00:45:57,719
Speaker 4: that he would die in the snow like a dog

837
00:45:58,160 --> 00:46:00,920
Speaker 4: like that would happen. So you would say, Okay, she

838
00:46:01,120 --> 00:46:04,120
Speaker 4: was pissed off. This gives her intent. This is the

839
00:46:04,160 --> 00:46:07,080
Speaker 4: plan she comes up with. I mean, let me knock

840
00:46:07,160 --> 00:46:10,959
Speaker 4: him down, let him die in the snot that's the problem.

841
00:46:11,000 --> 00:46:13,000
Speaker 4: Why it's an overcharge. None of it makes sense. They

842
00:46:13,080 --> 00:46:16,440
Speaker 4: don't meld together very easily. So if they go to

843
00:46:16,560 --> 00:46:20,440
Speaker 4: round two, trial number two, my recommendation would be go

844
00:46:20,640 --> 00:46:24,160
Speaker 4: all in on the manslaughter, say this was the way

845
00:46:24,200 --> 00:46:27,600
Speaker 4: it happened, was reckless, whatever she took off, and focus

846
00:46:27,680 --> 00:46:30,320
Speaker 4: on that. But again, you still run into all the problems.

847
00:46:30,480 --> 00:46:32,879
Speaker 4: The integrity of the scene, all of that is still

848
00:46:32,920 --> 00:46:34,959
Speaker 4: tested in that scenario as well.

849
00:46:35,680 --> 00:46:37,839
Speaker 3: But they had the chance to. I mean, I think

850
00:46:37,920 --> 00:46:41,200
Speaker 3: the state still could drop the two charges, but they

851
00:46:41,280 --> 00:46:44,640
Speaker 3: just argued in front of Judge Canoni and she wouldn't budge.

852
00:46:44,719 --> 00:46:49,319
Speaker 3: Everything is sticking, So I mean, that is hu. It's

853
00:46:49,360 --> 00:46:51,520
Speaker 3: crazy to me, and it's so true, Like you said,

854
00:46:51,760 --> 00:46:54,799
Speaker 3: that was her plan back over him while people are

855
00:46:54,880 --> 00:46:58,720
Speaker 3: going inside this party, I mean, this house. It's so silly.

856
00:46:58,760 --> 00:47:01,120
Speaker 3: And then call him out and call him a pervert

857
00:47:01,160 --> 00:47:03,120
Speaker 3: and say you're with his kids? Where is he? And

858
00:47:03,200 --> 00:47:07,560
Speaker 3: listen those voicemails. She's pretty truthful if you ask me.

859
00:47:07,680 --> 00:47:09,840
Speaker 3: She's pretty damn angry.

860
00:47:10,160 --> 00:47:10,360
Speaker 4: You know.

861
00:47:10,400 --> 00:47:13,160
Speaker 2: But again, you know, y'all mentioned the perfect storm.

862
00:47:13,840 --> 00:47:18,400
Speaker 1: What police officer that has a stranger dead on their

863
00:47:18,440 --> 00:47:21,879
Speaker 1: front lawn don't come out of the house, so you're

864
00:47:21,920 --> 00:47:25,839
Speaker 1: telling me these police officers did not come outside with

865
00:47:25,960 --> 00:47:27,960
Speaker 1: their friend dead in the front yard.

866
00:47:28,080 --> 00:47:31,279
Speaker 3: No, Brian Albert did not go outside, not.

867
00:47:31,880 --> 00:47:35,120
Speaker 1: But the other people didn't come either, Remember, so you

868
00:47:35,160 --> 00:47:38,279
Speaker 1: know you let the girlfriend go, but you don't come

869
00:47:38,480 --> 00:47:41,400
Speaker 1: Like none of this makes any sense to me that

870
00:47:41,400 --> 00:47:43,720
Speaker 1: that would never be true in my world.

871
00:47:43,760 --> 00:47:45,640
Speaker 2: That would never exist.

872
00:47:45,480 --> 00:47:47,200
Speaker 4: Just even if you weren't a police officer.

873
00:47:47,239 --> 00:47:51,640
Speaker 1: They're on your front lawn one hundred percent, one hundred percent.

874
00:47:51,840 --> 00:47:54,560
Speaker 1: But there's no way a police officer ain't going out there.

875
00:47:54,880 --> 00:47:59,799
Speaker 1: There's no chance. All right, So before we go and

876
00:48:00,200 --> 00:48:03,000
Speaker 1: has flown by. So y'all have got to come back

877
00:48:03,000 --> 00:48:05,000
Speaker 1: because I didn't even get to the missing people that

878
00:48:05,080 --> 00:48:08,799
Speaker 1: y'all highlight and the important work you're doing. Just tell

879
00:48:08,880 --> 00:48:13,360
Speaker 1: everybody a little bit more about your show and direct

880
00:48:13,400 --> 00:48:15,440
Speaker 1: them to how to get there, because they don't need

881
00:48:15,480 --> 00:48:16,600
Speaker 1: to miss this at all.

882
00:48:17,200 --> 00:48:19,960
Speaker 4: Well, let me say this. On Wednesday nights at eight

883
00:48:19,960 --> 00:48:24,320
Speaker 4: o'clock on YouTube Primetime crime show Lauren and I Go Live,

884
00:48:24,840 --> 00:48:28,160
Speaker 4: I spent the first part of my podcasting life talking

885
00:48:28,200 --> 00:48:31,720
Speaker 4: to myself. I wanted to find a partner that raises

886
00:48:31,800 --> 00:48:35,840
Speaker 4: the issues and did an independent investigation and ask the

887
00:48:35,960 --> 00:48:40,040
Speaker 4: questions that everybody out there had, and Lauren is that person.

888
00:48:40,560 --> 00:48:44,239
Speaker 4: I try, with my background as best I can to

889
00:48:44,360 --> 00:48:48,919
Speaker 4: break down the law and whatever major true crime big

890
00:48:49,000 --> 00:48:52,400
Speaker 4: cases out there. Lauren and I and our conversations and

891
00:48:52,440 --> 00:48:56,040
Speaker 4: our guests. Our hope is to contribute to solving some

892
00:48:56,200 --> 00:49:00,760
Speaker 4: unsolved cases and really explain to people is our system working,

893
00:49:01,120 --> 00:49:04,760
Speaker 4: how's it working? And dispel misconceptions out there, and really

894
00:49:04,920 --> 00:49:07,439
Speaker 4: educate and entertain, because, believe it or not, in all

895
00:49:07,440 --> 00:49:10,400
Speaker 4: this murder and mayhemon blood and guts. One of the

896
00:49:10,400 --> 00:49:12,319
Speaker 4: other goals I have on every episode is to try

897
00:49:12,360 --> 00:49:13,239
Speaker 4: to make Lauren laugh.

898
00:49:13,400 --> 00:49:16,480
Speaker 3: So we try to get there, right, Lauren, Yes, So

899
00:49:16,520 --> 00:49:20,080
Speaker 3: we get there sometimes, and he also keeps me in line. Hey, Lauren,

900
00:49:20,200 --> 00:49:21,160
Speaker 3: that's defamatory.

901
00:49:21,239 --> 00:49:24,600
Speaker 4: No, I'm just kidding, and not get soon.

902
00:49:25,239 --> 00:49:28,280
Speaker 3: Yeah exactly, And I'm not good soon. But no, Jared,

903
00:49:28,320 --> 00:49:31,080
Speaker 3: he nails it. But we also we cover big stories

904
00:49:31,120 --> 00:49:33,400
Speaker 3: that everybody wants to hear about, but it is important

905
00:49:33,400 --> 00:49:36,279
Speaker 3: to us to also cover small stories. And that's why

906
00:49:36,400 --> 00:49:39,719
Speaker 3: I think that the true crime community in general is

907
00:49:40,280 --> 00:49:44,160
Speaker 3: just amazing, and people might have misconceptions about people that

908
00:49:44,239 --> 00:49:47,840
Speaker 3: are into, you know, stories that involve missing people or

909
00:49:47,920 --> 00:49:52,440
Speaker 3: missing children, but really it's this community coming together that

910
00:49:52,560 --> 00:49:55,440
Speaker 3: helps solve them, which is so incredible to me. I mean,

911
00:49:55,880 --> 00:50:01,320
Speaker 3: just tagging reporters, content creators, you Nancy Grace in certain

912
00:50:01,400 --> 00:50:05,000
Speaker 3: missing people's cases, and you know Nancy will cover it

913
00:50:05,040 --> 00:50:06,879
Speaker 3: on her show or will cover it, and I mean,

914
00:50:06,920 --> 00:50:09,239
Speaker 3: you know, Nancy is the queen. She's in, you know,

915
00:50:09,280 --> 00:50:12,960
Speaker 3: a different stratosphere than you know, Jara and I obviously,

916
00:50:13,040 --> 00:50:15,480
Speaker 3: but it's like we we look up to her and

917
00:50:15,520 --> 00:50:17,480
Speaker 3: we see what she's doing, and we would love to

918
00:50:17,560 --> 00:50:20,320
Speaker 3: highlight cases like that and and help solve them because

919
00:50:20,360 --> 00:50:23,759
Speaker 3: it's just, you know, it's it's it's becoming a thing

920
00:50:23,840 --> 00:50:27,880
Speaker 3: now for for cyberus loops and content creators and just

921
00:50:28,440 --> 00:50:33,360
Speaker 3: people on the internet to help solve murders and find

922
00:50:33,400 --> 00:50:36,200
Speaker 3: missing people. So we want to contribute to that.

923
00:50:36,920 --> 00:50:39,640
Speaker 1: I've had the opportunity to work independently with both of

924
00:50:39,680 --> 00:50:46,520
Speaker 1: you extraordinary individually, but together, honey, y'all are own to something.

925
00:50:46,880 --> 00:50:49,479
Speaker 1: So I just I can't wait to see what y'all

926
00:50:49,520 --> 00:50:52,000
Speaker 1: do next and anything I can do to help call me.

927
00:50:52,360 --> 00:50:59,680
Speaker 3: You know, I won't hesitate, Cheryl. I never hesitated so much, y'all.

928
00:50:59,680 --> 00:51:01,440
Speaker 2: I'm going to end Zone seven the way that I

929
00:51:01,520 --> 00:51:03,280
Speaker 2: always do with a quote.

930
00:51:04,480 --> 00:51:08,759
Speaker 1: Find a group of people who challenge and inspire you,

931
00:51:09,520 --> 00:51:12,560
Speaker 1: and spend a lot of time with them. It'll change

932
00:51:12,560 --> 00:51:18,239
Speaker 1: your life, Amy Poehler. I'm Cheryl McCollum, and this is

933
00:51:18,320 --> 00:51:18,880
Speaker 1: Zone seven.