1 00:00:01,120 --> 00:00:06,440 Speaker 1: Conversations on life, style, beauty, and relationships. It's The Velvet's 2 00:00:06,519 --> 00:00:08,280 Speaker 1: Edge Podcast with Kelly Henderson. 3 00:00:11,560 --> 00:00:15,000 Speaker 2: Kyies Gibson is here as hatchet style expert, best selling 4 00:00:15,040 --> 00:00:18,040 Speaker 2: author and PhD Hi tayis Hi. 5 00:00:18,120 --> 00:00:20,360 Speaker 3: Thank you for having me. Excited to be here with you. 6 00:00:20,680 --> 00:00:22,760 Speaker 2: Well, I'm so excited to talk to you because one 7 00:00:22,760 --> 00:00:25,480 Speaker 2: of the main trends I've seen on TikTok and social 8 00:00:25,520 --> 00:00:28,280 Speaker 2: media is that people are talking a lot about shadow work. 9 00:00:28,600 --> 00:00:30,040 Speaker 2: And I know this is kind of one of your 10 00:00:30,080 --> 00:00:34,120 Speaker 2: specialties and this is not a new thing in psychology, 11 00:00:34,200 --> 00:00:36,920 Speaker 2: but it seems like people are just getting this new 12 00:00:37,040 --> 00:00:40,480 Speaker 2: awareness about shadow work. Can you talk a little bit 13 00:00:40,520 --> 00:00:43,240 Speaker 2: about maybe where this came from. I know Carl Jung 14 00:00:43,360 --> 00:00:46,519 Speaker 2: was like the founder of this thinking, so can we 15 00:00:46,600 --> 00:00:49,680 Speaker 2: take it back and explain to the listeners what shadow 16 00:00:49,680 --> 00:00:51,440 Speaker 2: work is and where did this come from? 17 00:00:52,080 --> 00:00:55,319 Speaker 1: Yes, definitely, it's such a powerful topic. So you're exactly right. 18 00:00:55,400 --> 00:00:57,360 Speaker 1: Carl Jung was one of the founders of shadow work, 19 00:00:57,400 --> 00:00:59,960 Speaker 1: are the main founder of shadow work, and he actually 20 00:01:00,120 --> 00:01:02,080 Speaker 1: describes the shadow as the part of ourselves that we 21 00:01:02,120 --> 00:01:05,960 Speaker 1: try to deny or hide, and so what essentially happens 22 00:01:06,000 --> 00:01:09,120 Speaker 1: is we all get conditioned when we're growing up. And 23 00:01:09,319 --> 00:01:12,760 Speaker 1: what conditioning does is it shapes our personality. So, for example, 24 00:01:12,800 --> 00:01:14,479 Speaker 1: if you grow up in a household with a lot 25 00:01:14,480 --> 00:01:17,400 Speaker 1: of kids, and if you're loud and boisterous, you may 26 00:01:17,400 --> 00:01:20,759 Speaker 1: get more attention, and so those conditions would be set 27 00:01:20,840 --> 00:01:24,400 Speaker 1: so that you actually get positive reinforcement because you get 28 00:01:24,400 --> 00:01:27,800 Speaker 1: more attention from being loud, and so going into your 29 00:01:27,840 --> 00:01:30,920 Speaker 1: adult life, you may be really outgoing or loud because 30 00:01:31,200 --> 00:01:35,360 Speaker 1: that's been positively reinforced and it's creating and shaping our personality. 31 00:01:35,880 --> 00:01:38,360 Speaker 1: All of our personalities are shaped through conditioning, but all 32 00:01:38,400 --> 00:01:41,000 Speaker 1: of us get different conditions. 33 00:01:40,920 --> 00:01:41,600 Speaker 3: That shape us. 34 00:01:41,680 --> 00:01:43,679 Speaker 1: So, for example, you could take somebody else in a 35 00:01:43,720 --> 00:01:46,600 Speaker 1: totally different dynamic, maybe in a different type of culture 36 00:01:46,680 --> 00:01:50,760 Speaker 1: where it's like, you know what, young women are validated 37 00:01:50,760 --> 00:01:53,680 Speaker 1: if they're quiet, if they are meek, if they sort 38 00:01:53,720 --> 00:01:56,320 Speaker 1: of blend into the background, and being loud could be 39 00:01:56,320 --> 00:01:59,560 Speaker 1: something that's not culturally appropriate for somebody totally different. And 40 00:01:59,600 --> 00:02:03,960 Speaker 1: so what happens is we all get conditioning, either positive 41 00:02:04,080 --> 00:02:08,880 Speaker 1: or negative associations to traits that we express. The things 42 00:02:08,919 --> 00:02:11,800 Speaker 1: that we think or get conditioned to believe are bad 43 00:02:11,880 --> 00:02:16,680 Speaker 1: or negative. We don't integrate properly. And what this does 44 00:02:17,080 --> 00:02:20,280 Speaker 1: is it often triggers us when other people express these 45 00:02:20,320 --> 00:02:24,040 Speaker 1: traits because we've a had negative associations to them, and 46 00:02:24,120 --> 00:02:27,760 Speaker 1: b they're actually personally not integrated in healthy ways within 47 00:02:27,800 --> 00:02:31,120 Speaker 1: the relationship to self, but they usually exist within hidden forms. 48 00:02:31,440 --> 00:02:33,600 Speaker 1: So give an example, because it's kind of complicated if there, 49 00:02:33,880 --> 00:02:36,080 Speaker 1: once we go through some exercises, I find it just 50 00:02:36,080 --> 00:02:40,000 Speaker 1: gets really simplified. So essentially what happens is, let's say 51 00:02:40,000 --> 00:02:43,079 Speaker 1: somebody grows up in a household where they are taught 52 00:02:43,120 --> 00:02:46,680 Speaker 1: that you have to absolutely be selfless in order to 53 00:02:46,680 --> 00:02:49,280 Speaker 1: be worthy of love. So somebody may grow up and 54 00:02:49,320 --> 00:02:52,639 Speaker 1: they are extremely selfless, but to the point where they 55 00:02:52,639 --> 00:02:54,919 Speaker 1: don't have a healthy amount of selfishness. They don't know 56 00:02:54,960 --> 00:02:56,519 Speaker 1: how to have their boundaries, they don't know how to 57 00:02:56,520 --> 00:03:00,960 Speaker 1: properly take themselves into consideration. They've essentially built in negative 58 00:03:00,960 --> 00:03:04,639 Speaker 1: associations to the trade of selfishness, so they press it down, 59 00:03:04,720 --> 00:03:06,720 Speaker 1: they repress it, they try not to act that way. 60 00:03:07,440 --> 00:03:10,160 Speaker 1: And then when somebody comes to them in their lives 61 00:03:10,880 --> 00:03:13,280 Speaker 1: that is a little more selfish and maybe a little 62 00:03:13,320 --> 00:03:17,960 Speaker 1: more advantageous and really takes themselves into consideration, we will 63 00:03:18,000 --> 00:03:22,239 Speaker 1: often be extremely triggered by that person because it's almost 64 00:03:22,280 --> 00:03:24,040 Speaker 1: like if you can imagine like a beach ball that 65 00:03:24,040 --> 00:03:26,120 Speaker 1: you're trying to push under the water, and the moment 66 00:03:26,160 --> 00:03:27,920 Speaker 1: you take it off, it's sort of bounces back up, 67 00:03:27,960 --> 00:03:29,840 Speaker 1: like it's pushing back up to the surface. It's almost 68 00:03:29,840 --> 00:03:31,400 Speaker 1: like the trade that we're trying so hard to press 69 00:03:31,440 --> 00:03:34,320 Speaker 1: down and avoid, it's actually seeking to come into the hole. 70 00:03:35,120 --> 00:03:37,240 Speaker 2: And so you know, we'll see these things and they 71 00:03:37,240 --> 00:03:40,720 Speaker 2: trigger us, but we're taking them personally because there's something 72 00:03:40,760 --> 00:03:45,200 Speaker 2: personal for us there to learn. That's the mirroring thing, right, 73 00:03:45,280 --> 00:03:47,200 Speaker 2: Like I hear people talk about this all the time, 74 00:03:47,240 --> 00:03:51,400 Speaker 2: that we draw in different people and different relationships because 75 00:03:51,440 --> 00:03:53,200 Speaker 2: there's certain parts of us that are ready to be 76 00:03:53,320 --> 00:03:56,160 Speaker 2: revealed or healed or whatever. Like if we're getting triggered, 77 00:03:56,560 --> 00:03:58,520 Speaker 2: that to me, I've tried to change the narrative in 78 00:03:58,520 --> 00:04:01,720 Speaker 2: my head when I'm getting triggered, I say, wait, there's 79 00:04:01,760 --> 00:04:04,800 Speaker 2: something here that is like wanting to be revealed, it's 80 00:04:04,960 --> 00:04:08,000 Speaker 2: ready to be healed. And then it gets me really 81 00:04:08,080 --> 00:04:11,880 Speaker 2: curious about what's actually going on for me because I 82 00:04:11,920 --> 00:04:14,080 Speaker 2: think often like what you said, where we look at 83 00:04:14,080 --> 00:04:16,200 Speaker 2: the other person and we get angry or we think 84 00:04:16,320 --> 00:04:18,360 Speaker 2: they're doing something wrong and it's like, no, it's actually 85 00:04:18,400 --> 00:04:20,280 Speaker 2: here to benefit you in some way. 86 00:04:20,920 --> 00:04:23,479 Speaker 1: Absolutely, that's so beautifully said, and it reminds you of 87 00:04:23,520 --> 00:04:26,360 Speaker 1: this quote by Rumy and he says, if I'm irritated 88 00:04:26,400 --> 00:04:29,159 Speaker 1: by every rub, how will I ever be polished? 89 00:04:29,920 --> 00:04:32,279 Speaker 3: And what he's saying is all the things that trigger. 90 00:04:32,080 --> 00:04:34,719 Speaker 1: Us are polishing us, are giving us this opportunity to grow, 91 00:04:34,800 --> 00:04:36,560 Speaker 1: to go and where to see what's there. And so 92 00:04:37,120 --> 00:04:39,800 Speaker 1: that's exactly the case. And in Carl Jung's words, he 93 00:04:39,839 --> 00:04:43,440 Speaker 1: talks about how until we make the unconscious conscious, it 94 00:04:43,480 --> 00:04:45,479 Speaker 1: will direct our lives and we will call it fate. 95 00:04:45,960 --> 00:04:48,920 Speaker 1: And so what's happening is when we have these triggering events, 96 00:04:49,480 --> 00:04:52,000 Speaker 1: it's a huge call for us to be able to say, Okay, 97 00:04:52,080 --> 00:04:55,440 Speaker 1: well what is triggering me in this person? What trait 98 00:04:55,600 --> 00:04:58,359 Speaker 1: is it? And what is my actual relationship to that trait? 99 00:04:58,720 --> 00:05:00,719 Speaker 1: And it's always going to fall all I find there's 100 00:05:00,720 --> 00:05:04,080 Speaker 1: this exercise that we really built out that that covers 101 00:05:04,080 --> 00:05:07,160 Speaker 1: all the basis of the shadow. I always get people 102 00:05:07,200 --> 00:05:09,400 Speaker 1: to a be able to look at what triggers them 103 00:05:09,760 --> 00:05:12,720 Speaker 1: and then b go inwards and ask themselves, where is 104 00:05:12,760 --> 00:05:16,440 Speaker 1: this not integrated? Healthily within myself or where is this 105 00:05:16,520 --> 00:05:19,200 Speaker 1: showing up in hidden forms? And there's usually three kind 106 00:05:19,240 --> 00:05:20,320 Speaker 1: of stops. 107 00:05:19,880 --> 00:05:23,479 Speaker 3: On the train. Okay, so we'll do an example. 108 00:05:23,560 --> 00:05:27,200 Speaker 1: Let's say we have somebody who is anxious in relationships, 109 00:05:27,240 --> 00:05:28,799 Speaker 1: so they're an anxious attachment style. 110 00:05:28,839 --> 00:05:31,760 Speaker 3: They sometimes presented like needy or clingy. They get really 111 00:05:31,800 --> 00:05:32,720 Speaker 3: afraid of abandonment. 112 00:05:33,200 --> 00:05:35,480 Speaker 1: Well, the biggest thing that often triggers them is when 113 00:05:35,520 --> 00:05:39,200 Speaker 1: people are dismissive to them, because they feel like, oh 114 00:05:39,200 --> 00:05:41,640 Speaker 1: my gosh, I'm not being cared about and things like that. 115 00:05:41,720 --> 00:05:44,320 Speaker 1: So when we look at the shadow of the anxious 116 00:05:44,320 --> 00:05:46,719 Speaker 1: person in relationships and they get triggered by the trait 117 00:05:46,800 --> 00:05:50,839 Speaker 1: of dismissiveness. Well, when we look inwards at the hidden 118 00:05:51,080 --> 00:05:53,840 Speaker 1: forms that that shows up within and we look at 119 00:05:53,839 --> 00:05:56,960 Speaker 1: those three stops on the train. Number one, where are 120 00:05:56,960 --> 00:05:58,440 Speaker 1: you dismissive towards yourself? 121 00:05:58,600 --> 00:06:01,839 Speaker 2: Is a first the one that is huge to me. 122 00:06:02,200 --> 00:06:05,440 Speaker 1: Yes, and usually it shows up for people who were 123 00:06:05,520 --> 00:06:07,679 Speaker 1: less familiar of like oh, I'm dismissing my own feelings 124 00:06:07,680 --> 00:06:10,479 Speaker 1: and needs or I'm dismissing my boundaries because anxiously leaning 125 00:06:10,560 --> 00:06:14,160 Speaker 1: individuals are often so you know, in people pleasing mode 126 00:06:14,400 --> 00:06:16,440 Speaker 1: and looking out for other people, it's at the expense 127 00:06:16,480 --> 00:06:19,479 Speaker 1: of the relationship to self. So where am I dismissing myself? 128 00:06:19,880 --> 00:06:25,000 Speaker 1: Number two? Where am I reacting back to this person 129 00:06:25,080 --> 00:06:27,000 Speaker 1: with that trait? So in this case, where am I 130 00:06:27,080 --> 00:06:31,240 Speaker 1: reactively dismissive? And I know for me, when I had 131 00:06:31,279 --> 00:06:34,000 Speaker 1: my attachment style to work on, I had this coworker 132 00:06:34,040 --> 00:06:36,320 Speaker 1: once and I was doing shadow work on this topic 133 00:06:36,800 --> 00:06:38,640 Speaker 1: and he was very dismissive and it was just he 134 00:06:38,680 --> 00:06:40,320 Speaker 1: and I that worked together for forty hours a week 135 00:06:40,320 --> 00:06:40,839 Speaker 1: every week. 136 00:06:41,080 --> 00:06:42,640 Speaker 3: And I remember I'd go into this place that I 137 00:06:42,640 --> 00:06:43,120 Speaker 3: worked at. 138 00:06:43,000 --> 00:06:44,640 Speaker 1: And I'd be like, good morning, how are you And 139 00:06:44,680 --> 00:06:48,320 Speaker 1: he'd be like, I'm fine, and I'd get triggered. I'd 140 00:06:48,320 --> 00:06:50,440 Speaker 1: be like, oh, he's so dismissive, and I'd get triggered. 141 00:06:50,440 --> 00:06:52,880 Speaker 1: And I remember doing shadow work and I thought this 142 00:06:53,000 --> 00:06:56,000 Speaker 1: was so funny. I remember doing shadow work and being like, Okay, 143 00:06:56,000 --> 00:06:57,600 Speaker 1: where am I dismissing myself? And I was like, oh, 144 00:06:57,640 --> 00:06:59,279 Speaker 1: my gosh, I definitely do that. I have to work 145 00:06:59,320 --> 00:07:01,440 Speaker 1: on that. Then I remember looking at where am I 146 00:07:01,480 --> 00:07:05,000 Speaker 1: reactively dismissive? And I realized that all these mornings I 147 00:07:05,000 --> 00:07:06,560 Speaker 1: would come in and be like, how was your weekend, 148 00:07:06,600 --> 00:07:08,839 Speaker 1: how are you and try to share and have a conversation. 149 00:07:08,920 --> 00:07:11,920 Speaker 1: He would be dismissive, and then I would be like, fine, 150 00:07:12,040 --> 00:07:13,400 Speaker 1: I'm not going to talk to you either. 151 00:07:13,600 --> 00:07:15,840 Speaker 2: And it's like you're punishing him. 152 00:07:15,840 --> 00:07:19,240 Speaker 1: Then yeah, but it's the react of dismissiveness, right, I'm like, 153 00:07:19,280 --> 00:07:21,560 Speaker 1: I'll just dismiss him back. And I was like, oh 154 00:07:21,600 --> 00:07:23,640 Speaker 1: my gosh, I can't believe I wasn't seeing that. And 155 00:07:23,680 --> 00:07:26,960 Speaker 1: then number three is where are you dismissing or whatever 156 00:07:26,960 --> 00:07:29,960 Speaker 1: the trait is that triggers you somebody in your life, 157 00:07:30,720 --> 00:07:34,360 Speaker 1: and then realizing and it really gives us this three 158 00:07:34,440 --> 00:07:37,320 Speaker 1: sixty degree view of where the shadow exists in hidden forms. 159 00:07:37,360 --> 00:07:39,080 Speaker 1: And for me, it was really crazy because I was 160 00:07:39,160 --> 00:07:41,160 Speaker 1: at the time working on the relationship with my father. 161 00:07:41,200 --> 00:07:42,960 Speaker 1: We had had a hard time for a couple of years, 162 00:07:43,720 --> 00:07:46,200 Speaker 1: and we were starting to work on it and like 163 00:07:46,240 --> 00:07:49,360 Speaker 1: improve the relationship, and I realized like, oh, sometimes he'll 164 00:07:49,400 --> 00:07:50,760 Speaker 1: reach out to me and like try to really make 165 00:07:50,800 --> 00:07:53,720 Speaker 1: an effort, and I'll just be like quick to dismiss 166 00:07:54,240 --> 00:07:56,040 Speaker 1: or dismiss him. And I realized, oh, my goodness, here 167 00:07:56,080 --> 00:07:58,800 Speaker 1: I am making my own father feel the way that 168 00:07:58,840 --> 00:07:59,840 Speaker 1: this person's making me. 169 00:08:00,360 --> 00:08:01,920 Speaker 3: And it was just like so eye. 170 00:08:01,760 --> 00:08:05,360 Speaker 1: Opening, and so which out of work does through that exercise, 171 00:08:05,960 --> 00:08:08,720 Speaker 1: it helps us either integrate the trait or find the 172 00:08:08,760 --> 00:08:12,000 Speaker 1: three places that we may not be expressing the trait 173 00:08:12,040 --> 00:08:15,080 Speaker 1: in the same form as that person, but it's often 174 00:08:15,120 --> 00:08:18,720 Speaker 1: existing in hidden forms within our psyche because we haven't 175 00:08:18,760 --> 00:08:20,440 Speaker 1: properly integrated it. 176 00:08:20,520 --> 00:08:22,640 Speaker 3: And so then what we do is we work through 177 00:08:23,240 --> 00:08:24,160 Speaker 3: a healthier. 178 00:08:23,760 --> 00:08:25,600 Speaker 1: Set of strategies from there, and we can talk about 179 00:08:25,720 --> 00:08:26,880 Speaker 1: all that stuff, but I just tryd to make sure 180 00:08:26,880 --> 00:08:27,920 Speaker 1: that first part is clear. 181 00:08:27,960 --> 00:08:28,880 Speaker 3: Does that all make sense? 182 00:08:28,960 --> 00:08:31,120 Speaker 2: It totally makes sense. And I love that you're using 183 00:08:31,120 --> 00:08:33,920 Speaker 2: the word integrating because I think initially when I hear 184 00:08:33,960 --> 00:08:37,120 Speaker 2: the word shadow, I go ooh, that has to be bad, 185 00:08:37,280 --> 00:08:39,680 Speaker 2: right like that? And that was the reason I wanted 186 00:08:39,720 --> 00:08:41,720 Speaker 2: to do this podcast the week of Halloween. It's like 187 00:08:41,800 --> 00:08:45,120 Speaker 2: spooky season. It just seems scary a little bit, you know, 188 00:08:45,400 --> 00:08:48,440 Speaker 2: And I think that a lot of times we can 189 00:08:48,679 --> 00:08:51,880 Speaker 2: not want to look at the darker, deeper parts of 190 00:08:51,880 --> 00:08:55,200 Speaker 2: ourselves because we're fearful of what we're gonna find. And 191 00:08:55,240 --> 00:08:57,200 Speaker 2: what I'm hearing in this a lot of it is 192 00:08:57,240 --> 00:08:59,280 Speaker 2: like it's a part of our personality that as a 193 00:08:59,320 --> 00:09:05,200 Speaker 2: young child maybe got exacerbated or stifled because of the 194 00:09:05,240 --> 00:09:08,360 Speaker 2: programming in the household. And it's not necessarily good or bad, 195 00:09:08,440 --> 00:09:12,439 Speaker 2: but awareness and integration is the way to healing. So 196 00:09:12,520 --> 00:09:15,560 Speaker 2: are there these parts of us? Like how much of 197 00:09:15,600 --> 00:09:18,080 Speaker 2: your shadow self is a part of your real personality? 198 00:09:19,080 --> 00:09:20,160 Speaker 3: It's such a great question. 199 00:09:20,200 --> 00:09:21,680 Speaker 1: So I think one of the first things to notice 200 00:09:21,720 --> 00:09:25,640 Speaker 1: that human beings are designed to be whole, and anything 201 00:09:25,679 --> 00:09:28,200 Speaker 1: we stifle or repress usually comes out in these head 202 00:09:28,200 --> 00:09:30,080 Speaker 1: and forms because it's not really the way it's meant 203 00:09:30,120 --> 00:09:32,959 Speaker 1: to be. And so you know, what's interesting is that 204 00:09:33,640 --> 00:09:35,960 Speaker 1: I don't believe that there's any such thing as real 205 00:09:36,080 --> 00:09:39,440 Speaker 1: positive or negative traits. I think we only get conditioned 206 00:09:39,480 --> 00:09:44,800 Speaker 1: to believe those things. For example, if somebody is aggressive, right, 207 00:09:45,000 --> 00:09:46,600 Speaker 1: maybe some of us think, oh my gosh, that has 208 00:09:46,640 --> 00:09:49,360 Speaker 1: to be an exclusively negative trait. Well, not if you're 209 00:09:49,360 --> 00:09:52,800 Speaker 1: a professional athlete, right, Not if you're a mother who's 210 00:09:52,840 --> 00:09:56,640 Speaker 1: protecting her child when there's something you know, dangerous happening. 211 00:09:57,040 --> 00:09:59,440 Speaker 1: So you know, it's where and how we use the 212 00:09:59,480 --> 00:10:03,720 Speaker 1: traits that matters. But when we make traits negative in 213 00:10:03,760 --> 00:10:07,199 Speaker 1: ourselves and we try to repress them, unfortunately, it often 214 00:10:07,240 --> 00:10:09,600 Speaker 1: causes us to at a deep level think that parts 215 00:10:09,600 --> 00:10:10,640 Speaker 1: of ourselves. 216 00:10:10,160 --> 00:10:12,959 Speaker 3: Are bad when when they're headen, and it. 217 00:10:12,920 --> 00:10:15,280 Speaker 1: Affects our self esteem in various ways because these parts 218 00:10:15,280 --> 00:10:17,720 Speaker 1: of ourselves that are actually designed to be a part 219 00:10:17,760 --> 00:10:21,040 Speaker 1: of the whole and used at various times in healthy forms. 220 00:10:21,320 --> 00:10:23,800 Speaker 1: Instead we're like making bad or wrong. And so there's 221 00:10:23,800 --> 00:10:27,080 Speaker 1: this really repressive element. And so I wouldn't say that, like, 222 00:10:27,160 --> 00:10:29,680 Speaker 1: how much of the shadow per se is a part 223 00:10:29,679 --> 00:10:32,559 Speaker 1: of the personality. I would say that, like, there's definitely 224 00:10:32,600 --> 00:10:35,480 Speaker 1: for every person. Probably you know a good portion of 225 00:10:35,559 --> 00:10:38,680 Speaker 1: unexpressed traits in healthy forms. But I think the main 226 00:10:38,800 --> 00:10:41,360 Speaker 1: thing with shadow work is rather than thinking like how 227 00:10:41,480 --> 00:10:44,600 Speaker 1: much should we integrate, it's what triggers us. 228 00:10:45,440 --> 00:10:46,760 Speaker 3: How often is it coming up? 229 00:10:46,840 --> 00:10:49,240 Speaker 1: And that's going to be the leading indicator for like 230 00:10:49,320 --> 00:10:52,120 Speaker 1: then that's probably how much the shadow still exists in 231 00:10:52,160 --> 00:10:55,000 Speaker 1: you and headden forms. And what we're trying to do 232 00:10:55,120 --> 00:10:57,439 Speaker 1: is not say let's get rid of the shadow. We're 233 00:10:57,480 --> 00:10:59,920 Speaker 1: trying to say, how can we make peace with the traits? 234 00:11:00,040 --> 00:11:02,000 Speaker 1: Stop judging it, See that it can be used in 235 00:11:02,080 --> 00:11:05,160 Speaker 1: various forms, Learn to use this trade and healthy forms, 236 00:11:05,440 --> 00:11:07,559 Speaker 1: and be mindful about how to not use it in 237 00:11:07,679 --> 00:11:10,520 Speaker 1: unhealthy form. So going back to that example of dismissiveness, 238 00:11:10,840 --> 00:11:13,840 Speaker 1: we might go, Okay, I probably don't want to dismiss 239 00:11:13,840 --> 00:11:15,720 Speaker 1: my father, and so I worked on that at that 240 00:11:15,800 --> 00:11:18,439 Speaker 1: period in time. But I realized that something a way 241 00:11:18,480 --> 00:11:21,360 Speaker 1: that I could use dismissiveness in a healthier form was 242 00:11:21,679 --> 00:11:24,439 Speaker 1: sometimes I would say yes to everything, all the tasks 243 00:11:24,480 --> 00:11:26,200 Speaker 1: on my plate, and I had to actually learn to 244 00:11:26,200 --> 00:11:29,400 Speaker 1: categorize and dismiss things that were lower level tasks to 245 00:11:29,440 --> 00:11:32,640 Speaker 1: stay more focused in my life and have better boundaries 246 00:11:32,640 --> 00:11:34,600 Speaker 1: and be able to like separate out the things that 247 00:11:34,640 --> 00:11:36,600 Speaker 1: I shouldn't be focusing on all the time. And so 248 00:11:37,040 --> 00:11:38,719 Speaker 1: you can see that when we have the ability to 249 00:11:38,720 --> 00:11:40,600 Speaker 1: see where that trade shows up in healthy forms, we 250 00:11:40,640 --> 00:11:44,160 Speaker 1: can leverage it, and we're showing up in unhealthy forms, 251 00:11:44,400 --> 00:11:46,400 Speaker 1: we can be like, hey, how do we actually work 252 00:11:46,440 --> 00:11:49,640 Speaker 1: through this and stop executing on these behaviors or traits? 253 00:11:50,000 --> 00:11:52,439 Speaker 2: Yeah, I hate the well this is a saying that's 254 00:11:52,480 --> 00:11:54,000 Speaker 2: really helped me through my life, but it gets I 255 00:11:54,000 --> 00:11:56,160 Speaker 2: get frustrated with it every time when someone says you 256 00:11:56,160 --> 00:11:57,840 Speaker 2: spot it, you got it, and I'm I was like, what, 257 00:11:58,280 --> 00:12:00,760 Speaker 2: how can like that nasty characteristic I'm seeing in someone 258 00:12:00,760 --> 00:12:03,080 Speaker 2: else be something that's in me. But if something does 259 00:12:03,120 --> 00:12:06,800 Speaker 2: make me mad, more than likely there is something going 260 00:12:06,840 --> 00:12:09,199 Speaker 2: on in me that I'm doing the same behavior, whether 261 00:12:09,240 --> 00:12:13,240 Speaker 2: it's subtle or very obvious. But I think your example 262 00:12:13,280 --> 00:12:14,960 Speaker 2: is the perfect one because I don't know if any 263 00:12:15,000 --> 00:12:17,280 Speaker 2: of the listeners will relate to this. But as I've 264 00:12:17,320 --> 00:12:21,520 Speaker 2: been doing work through like codependency type stuff throughout my adulthood, 265 00:12:22,040 --> 00:12:24,000 Speaker 2: one of the things that I would find myself doing 266 00:12:24,000 --> 00:12:26,680 Speaker 2: in relationships is like you know that thing where you've 267 00:12:26,720 --> 00:12:29,760 Speaker 2: over committed yourself, like you just said, and then you 268 00:12:29,880 --> 00:12:32,120 Speaker 2: get mad at the other person when things don't go 269 00:12:32,240 --> 00:12:35,400 Speaker 2: exactly how it is and you're frustrated and or they 270 00:12:35,440 --> 00:12:38,560 Speaker 2: don't appreciate it the way they should. You're killing yourself 271 00:12:38,600 --> 00:12:40,640 Speaker 2: to make all this happen? How could they not notice 272 00:12:40,720 --> 00:12:44,760 Speaker 2: all these things? And it's like what their reaction is 273 00:12:44,760 --> 00:12:48,080 Speaker 2: is typically how I'm treating myself. Like if they're being 274 00:12:48,120 --> 00:12:50,679 Speaker 2: dismissive or they're not that appreciative, I'm like, why am 275 00:12:50,679 --> 00:12:52,480 Speaker 2: I trying to earn all this left from this person? 276 00:12:52,559 --> 00:12:55,040 Speaker 2: Versus go, wait, you already have a stacked plate, like 277 00:12:55,160 --> 00:12:59,240 Speaker 2: respecting and loving myself enough to say no or set 278 00:12:59,280 --> 00:13:03,280 Speaker 2: boundaries said or actually have a feasible schedule and not 279 00:13:03,360 --> 00:13:06,400 Speaker 2: over commit myself. So they're just mirroring back to me 280 00:13:06,440 --> 00:13:10,120 Speaker 2: what I need to do with myself exactly. And I 281 00:13:10,160 --> 00:13:12,320 Speaker 2: think it brings up this really important discussion where people 282 00:13:12,360 --> 00:13:13,760 Speaker 2: will be like, oh, so, does that mean you just 283 00:13:13,840 --> 00:13:16,480 Speaker 2: let somebody get away with their dismissive behaviors. 284 00:13:17,240 --> 00:13:18,880 Speaker 3: No, we set boundaries. 285 00:13:18,880 --> 00:13:22,000 Speaker 1: We have the conversation, and that's us not dismissing ourselves 286 00:13:22,080 --> 00:13:24,440 Speaker 1: in regards to the relationship with that person. And so 287 00:13:24,480 --> 00:13:26,680 Speaker 1: we tell somebody of their behavior of ACTSS, we still 288 00:13:26,679 --> 00:13:28,960 Speaker 1: show up for it. And we even if somebody is 289 00:13:29,040 --> 00:13:32,120 Speaker 1: unhealthy around us, like a friend or a family member, 290 00:13:32,160 --> 00:13:34,120 Speaker 1: we can take a step back in that relationship if 291 00:13:34,160 --> 00:13:36,400 Speaker 1: we need to. But first of all, we have to 292 00:13:36,400 --> 00:13:38,760 Speaker 1: realize we're taking it so personally because it is personal 293 00:13:38,760 --> 00:13:39,120 Speaker 1: to us. 294 00:13:39,160 --> 00:13:40,360 Speaker 3: So I wanted to add one. 295 00:13:40,320 --> 00:13:42,319 Speaker 1: Other thing that you made me think of, okay, which 296 00:13:42,360 --> 00:13:44,760 Speaker 1: is I started doing this exercise with people that I 297 00:13:44,800 --> 00:13:46,760 Speaker 1: was working with for a very long time, and I 298 00:13:46,800 --> 00:13:49,640 Speaker 1: call it your relationship shadow and it's particular to like, 299 00:13:49,679 --> 00:13:52,080 Speaker 1: your romantic relationships. And I want it to be such 300 00:13:52,080 --> 00:13:55,360 Speaker 1: a useful exercise because what it does is you look 301 00:13:55,360 --> 00:13:57,840 Speaker 1: at the pattern of like your last couple of axes 302 00:13:58,720 --> 00:14:01,760 Speaker 1: and the pattern of like what triggered you the most 303 00:14:01,800 --> 00:14:04,079 Speaker 1: about them. And I often get people to do this 304 00:14:04,120 --> 00:14:05,880 Speaker 1: so that like listeners can do this right now. If 305 00:14:05,920 --> 00:14:08,960 Speaker 1: you look at your past exits, there's usually one or 306 00:14:08,960 --> 00:14:11,800 Speaker 1: two emerging patterns where it's like the ones that triggered 307 00:14:11,840 --> 00:14:13,440 Speaker 1: you the most, the people you used to date that 308 00:14:13,480 --> 00:14:16,319 Speaker 1: really got under your skin, there's usually like one or 309 00:14:16,360 --> 00:14:18,559 Speaker 1: two things that they often did. And I don't know 310 00:14:18,600 --> 00:14:20,640 Speaker 1: if you feel comfortable if I ask you if you 311 00:14:20,760 --> 00:14:21,400 Speaker 1: were open. 312 00:14:21,240 --> 00:14:25,560 Speaker 2: To yeah, I'm thinking okay. So with my current boyfriend, 313 00:14:25,560 --> 00:14:28,040 Speaker 2: it does feel a little different than my last. But 314 00:14:28,480 --> 00:14:31,000 Speaker 2: dismissiveness is a big one for me for sure. Like 315 00:14:31,040 --> 00:14:35,520 Speaker 2: I'm an overfunctioner in relationships typically, and so I feel 316 00:14:35,560 --> 00:14:38,480 Speaker 2: like some of my bigger triggers would come from not 317 00:14:38,640 --> 00:14:42,080 Speaker 2: being feeling seen for all that I was doing and 318 00:14:42,080 --> 00:14:43,240 Speaker 2: feeling neglected. 319 00:14:43,360 --> 00:14:47,360 Speaker 1: I guess, okay, so that's really powerful. So unseen and 320 00:14:47,440 --> 00:14:51,320 Speaker 1: neglected are sort of yes, okay, beautiful and dismissiveness, but we'd. 321 00:14:51,160 --> 00:14:53,640 Speaker 3: Cover that one, yeah yeah, yeah. So then and what 322 00:14:53,680 --> 00:14:54,560 Speaker 3: you do is you look. 323 00:14:54,480 --> 00:14:56,240 Speaker 1: At if there was that theme or pattern. It's so 324 00:14:56,320 --> 00:14:58,480 Speaker 1: valuable to look at like what your exes. That's where 325 00:14:58,480 --> 00:15:01,800 Speaker 1: it's like, hey, where are some examples of ways that 326 00:15:01,880 --> 00:15:03,000 Speaker 1: you neglect yourself? 327 00:15:03,040 --> 00:15:05,320 Speaker 2: And I'm sure, I mean the list is lengthening on 328 00:15:05,400 --> 00:15:07,720 Speaker 2: that one. Yeah, I mean that is, and that is 329 00:15:07,760 --> 00:15:09,760 Speaker 2: the healing work. I think that's probably why my relationship 330 00:15:09,760 --> 00:15:12,800 Speaker 2: now is different, because I did a ton of work 331 00:15:12,840 --> 00:15:16,520 Speaker 2: around that exact issue, realizing, wait, I'm getting mad at 332 00:15:16,600 --> 00:15:19,480 Speaker 2: him for all of the things that I'm actually doing 333 00:15:19,520 --> 00:15:22,440 Speaker 2: for my like I'm doing to myself. I'm not standing 334 00:15:22,480 --> 00:15:25,480 Speaker 2: up for myself. I'm not setting boundaries, I'm not taking 335 00:15:25,520 --> 00:15:28,800 Speaker 2: care of myself. I'm overfunctioning to the point of like 336 00:15:28,920 --> 00:15:31,760 Speaker 2: full blown meltdown. That's on me at the end of 337 00:15:31,800 --> 00:15:33,480 Speaker 2: the day one percent. 338 00:15:33,520 --> 00:15:35,000 Speaker 1: And you know what the saddest part is, because I've 339 00:15:35,040 --> 00:15:38,240 Speaker 1: totally been there before doing this work myself too, is 340 00:15:38,280 --> 00:15:41,280 Speaker 1: that when you don't tell people what you need or 341 00:15:41,280 --> 00:15:43,760 Speaker 1: what your boundaries are or what you're feeling, you don't 342 00:15:43,800 --> 00:15:46,480 Speaker 1: even give yourself the opportunity to be considered by them, 343 00:15:47,080 --> 00:15:49,120 Speaker 1: and then it's like you often feel like you're alone, 344 00:15:49,240 --> 00:15:51,160 Speaker 1: like you know, this person doesn't really see me, or 345 00:15:51,160 --> 00:15:52,800 Speaker 1: they're not really loving me the way that I need. 346 00:15:52,800 --> 00:15:54,920 Speaker 1: They must not care about me, but one of the 347 00:15:54,920 --> 00:15:57,160 Speaker 1: most beautiful things. And you're probably going through this now 348 00:15:57,200 --> 00:16:00,160 Speaker 1: because you've said that that's with your current partners. When 349 00:16:00,200 --> 00:16:02,480 Speaker 1: you actually start being vulnerable and letting people in and 350 00:16:02,520 --> 00:16:04,520 Speaker 1: like leaning on people and telling them what you need 351 00:16:04,640 --> 00:16:07,720 Speaker 1: or sharing your true yeses and nos with people, all 352 00:16:07,760 --> 00:16:10,240 Speaker 1: of a sudden, you feel love so much differently and 353 00:16:10,280 --> 00:16:13,520 Speaker 1: so much more deeply because they actually know what triggers 354 00:16:13,560 --> 00:16:15,760 Speaker 1: you or bothers you, or what you need to feel 355 00:16:15,760 --> 00:16:17,800 Speaker 1: like you're supported. And so then it makes it really 356 00:16:17,880 --> 00:16:20,280 Speaker 1: easy for the people that love us to show up 357 00:16:20,280 --> 00:16:22,440 Speaker 1: for us differently, and so that's like, yeah, it's this 358 00:16:22,600 --> 00:16:24,680 Speaker 1: double layer of like healing that takes place. 359 00:16:24,720 --> 00:16:28,000 Speaker 2: As a result, it's an entirely different type of relationship 360 00:16:28,000 --> 00:16:31,360 Speaker 2: in my experience. I mean, like I've never had such 361 00:16:31,480 --> 00:16:34,240 Speaker 2: high boundaries and such. I don't know if it's like 362 00:16:34,560 --> 00:16:37,040 Speaker 2: respect for myself maybe would be the right way to 363 00:16:37,040 --> 00:16:40,120 Speaker 2: say that, but like I really value my energy and 364 00:16:40,320 --> 00:16:42,440 Speaker 2: like what I'm giving and what I have to give. 365 00:16:42,600 --> 00:16:45,760 Speaker 2: And so because I've like carried myself that way, that 366 00:16:45,840 --> 00:16:48,920 Speaker 2: is how my partner treats me too. And it's very 367 00:16:48,960 --> 00:16:52,240 Speaker 2: interesting because when I was just dating, I mean I 368 00:16:52,280 --> 00:16:56,080 Speaker 2: will say I would quickly end, like like I would 369 00:16:56,120 --> 00:16:57,800 Speaker 2: go on a date or two dates with someone and 370 00:16:57,880 --> 00:16:59,520 Speaker 2: I was like done. If I knew, if I could 371 00:16:59,560 --> 00:17:03,120 Speaker 2: tell there wasn't like they could say one thing that's 372 00:17:03,200 --> 00:17:06,080 Speaker 2: that leaned in the way of like disrespecting me or 373 00:17:06,400 --> 00:17:08,399 Speaker 2: not valuing my time or anything like that. And it 374 00:17:08,440 --> 00:17:09,840 Speaker 2: was a no for me that was just like a 375 00:17:09,960 --> 00:17:12,800 Speaker 2: very clear boundary. And at first it felt scary because 376 00:17:12,840 --> 00:17:15,400 Speaker 2: I was like saying no more than I ever had 377 00:17:15,440 --> 00:17:17,960 Speaker 2: and ruling out people more than I had. But all 378 00:17:18,000 --> 00:17:20,320 Speaker 2: it is is like taking the people out that aren't 379 00:17:20,359 --> 00:17:22,159 Speaker 2: in alignment. And then all of a sudden it was 380 00:17:22,200 --> 00:17:25,239 Speaker 2: like just so easy when my current partner came in. 381 00:17:25,920 --> 00:17:26,240 Speaker 3: Okay. 382 00:17:26,280 --> 00:17:28,800 Speaker 1: So I love that story because that's a perfect example. 383 00:17:28,960 --> 00:17:31,960 Speaker 1: This is something that I think most people are. It 384 00:17:32,080 --> 00:17:33,919 Speaker 1: kind of stings to hear for people if they're in it, 385 00:17:33,960 --> 00:17:37,399 Speaker 1: but it's so helpful, and it's that there's a couple 386 00:17:37,440 --> 00:17:40,760 Speaker 1: things that drive this. So you articulated this so beautifully. 387 00:17:41,040 --> 00:17:43,520 Speaker 1: So your conscious mind is responsible for roughly three to 388 00:17:43,600 --> 00:17:46,399 Speaker 1: five percent of all of your beliefs and thoughts and decisions, 389 00:17:46,600 --> 00:17:48,880 Speaker 1: and your subconscious is ninety five to ninety seven. 390 00:17:49,119 --> 00:17:53,119 Speaker 2: I mean that's wild. Yeah, different number three to five 391 00:17:53,280 --> 00:17:55,560 Speaker 2: of your conscious mind. Like that's what we're putting around 392 00:17:55,560 --> 00:17:59,040 Speaker 2: with every day, and our subconscious is how much ninety ninety. 393 00:17:58,760 --> 00:18:01,000 Speaker 1: Five to ninety seven percent, and that's all of like 394 00:18:01,280 --> 00:18:04,679 Speaker 1: our pattern solve our habits. And what's so crazy is 395 00:18:04,680 --> 00:18:07,840 Speaker 1: that your subconscious mind, it's number one priority is survival, 396 00:18:08,440 --> 00:18:12,400 Speaker 1: and so it sees what's familiar as safe and that's 397 00:18:12,440 --> 00:18:15,440 Speaker 1: more likely to keep us surviving. So what's wild is 398 00:18:15,480 --> 00:18:16,919 Speaker 1: that if you grew up in a household where your 399 00:18:16,920 --> 00:18:20,240 Speaker 1: feelings and needs were dismissed, that causes you to feel like, okay, 400 00:18:20,280 --> 00:18:22,280 Speaker 1: well I'm just going to dismiss and avoid my own 401 00:18:22,280 --> 00:18:25,520 Speaker 1: feelings and needs. Then that becomes your shadow because then 402 00:18:25,520 --> 00:18:27,600 Speaker 1: you get really triggered by people who will do that 403 00:18:27,680 --> 00:18:30,840 Speaker 1: to you. As much as it triggers you, your subconscious 404 00:18:30,880 --> 00:18:34,920 Speaker 1: still chooses it because it's still familiar and that's safe. 405 00:18:35,000 --> 00:18:37,000 Speaker 1: And so what's wild is these things that trigger us 406 00:18:37,000 --> 00:18:38,679 Speaker 1: the most. All that just happened to be the thing 407 00:18:38,720 --> 00:18:39,800 Speaker 1: that we often keep choosing. 408 00:18:39,840 --> 00:18:40,720 Speaker 3: Our conscious mind is. 409 00:18:40,640 --> 00:18:43,439 Speaker 1: Like, oh, look for the emotionally available person, but our 410 00:18:43,440 --> 00:18:45,920 Speaker 1: subconscious is like, this is familiar and this is safe, 411 00:18:45,920 --> 00:18:48,080 Speaker 1: and that's where we have the butterflies and the fireworks 412 00:18:48,080 --> 00:18:50,959 Speaker 1: and all those things that create a traction. But then 413 00:18:51,359 --> 00:18:53,600 Speaker 1: if people do what you did, which is start doing 414 00:18:53,640 --> 00:18:57,000 Speaker 1: the work on themselves show up, then all of a sudden, 415 00:18:57,119 --> 00:18:59,800 Speaker 1: you start vetting differently in relationships. Then all of a 416 00:18:59,800 --> 00:19:03,359 Speaker 1: sud you're like, no, I'm actually going to care for 417 00:19:03,400 --> 00:19:06,320 Speaker 1: my boundaries, care for my needs, be more intentional, be 418 00:19:06,400 --> 00:19:08,560 Speaker 1: a little bit clearer, and like a little quicker to 419 00:19:08,600 --> 00:19:10,240 Speaker 1: write people off that may not be a good fit 420 00:19:10,280 --> 00:19:11,960 Speaker 1: for me, and do it in a healthy way, but 421 00:19:12,359 --> 00:19:13,840 Speaker 1: to uphold my standards. 422 00:19:14,160 --> 00:19:16,520 Speaker 3: And when you do that, you're. 423 00:19:16,359 --> 00:19:20,199 Speaker 1: Actually changing your subconscious comfort zone because you're rewiring the 424 00:19:20,240 --> 00:19:23,320 Speaker 1: patterns that you'll show up with, which causes you to 425 00:19:23,480 --> 00:19:26,520 Speaker 1: actually end up being more attracted to and investing in 426 00:19:26,720 --> 00:19:27,280 Speaker 1: more security. 427 00:19:27,440 --> 00:19:31,000 Speaker 2: Well yeah, that just blew my mind because you just 428 00:19:31,080 --> 00:19:33,879 Speaker 2: describe my experience. I mean, there would be situations that 429 00:19:34,000 --> 00:19:37,000 Speaker 2: in the past, had I dated those same guys, that 430 00:19:37,080 --> 00:19:39,400 Speaker 2: I would have never like wanted to let that go. 431 00:19:39,840 --> 00:19:42,280 Speaker 2: And it was so easy and quick for me because 432 00:19:42,320 --> 00:19:44,720 Speaker 2: I just knew all of a sudden, like I don't 433 00:19:44,760 --> 00:19:46,719 Speaker 2: even know if that's an awareness or if it's an 434 00:19:46,720 --> 00:19:50,120 Speaker 2: acceptance or what that is. But when you have that, 435 00:19:50,240 --> 00:19:53,600 Speaker 2: when you're like, no, I know what my energy brings, 436 00:19:53,840 --> 00:19:55,840 Speaker 2: I like, just it was just a boundary, is what 437 00:19:55,880 --> 00:19:59,080 Speaker 2: I thought it was. But I literally started drawing in 438 00:19:59,280 --> 00:20:03,480 Speaker 2: totally differentferent types of guys and like just the level 439 00:20:03,520 --> 00:20:06,119 Speaker 2: of person was better. Even does that make sense? 440 00:20:06,560 --> 00:20:07,359 Speaker 3: One hundred percent? 441 00:20:07,440 --> 00:20:09,879 Speaker 1: And so like how your subconscious gets reworked so that 442 00:20:09,920 --> 00:20:12,679 Speaker 1: we stop having all those same patterns is it's repetition 443 00:20:12,720 --> 00:20:15,840 Speaker 1: and emotion that rewires it. So when we repeatedly show 444 00:20:15,920 --> 00:20:19,800 Speaker 1: up differently, So like repetition and emotion, over time you 445 00:20:19,920 --> 00:20:22,760 Speaker 1: start having better boundaries in your life. You're clearly on 446 00:20:22,840 --> 00:20:25,399 Speaker 1: a huge journey of doing the work you're showing up to, 447 00:20:25,480 --> 00:20:27,960 Speaker 1: like honor your needs. You're working through codependency. So what 448 00:20:28,000 --> 00:20:29,800 Speaker 1: you're actually doing is as long as you keep doing 449 00:20:29,840 --> 00:20:34,240 Speaker 1: that repeatedly, you're rewiring your subconscious mind. And then that's 450 00:20:34,280 --> 00:20:36,120 Speaker 1: where you're like, oh, my energy is different. Well, your 451 00:20:36,119 --> 00:20:38,520 Speaker 1: behaviors are different, the things you're choosing are different. Everything's 452 00:20:38,520 --> 00:20:41,119 Speaker 1: different going together, and that's going to draw in more 453 00:20:41,200 --> 00:20:43,920 Speaker 1: quality people. And I should say this for the listeners 454 00:20:44,000 --> 00:20:45,879 Speaker 1: when I say, oh, it was so easy, Like the 455 00:20:45,880 --> 00:20:47,600 Speaker 1: first time I did it, I think I cried after. 456 00:20:47,720 --> 00:20:48,800 Speaker 1: I was like, oh, I think we're just so on 457 00:20:48,840 --> 00:20:50,879 Speaker 1: different journeys and I solved, you know, like I was 458 00:20:50,960 --> 00:20:52,320 Speaker 1: so upset I could. 459 00:20:52,160 --> 00:20:54,600 Speaker 2: Only do it in text. I was like very stressed 460 00:20:54,600 --> 00:20:57,160 Speaker 2: out about it, and then I would do it again 461 00:20:57,400 --> 00:20:58,840 Speaker 2: and it got easier, and I would do it again 462 00:20:58,880 --> 00:21:01,040 Speaker 2: and got easier. Like right before I met my boyfriend, 463 00:21:01,119 --> 00:21:03,560 Speaker 2: I mean, I was like flinging out boundaries like they're nothing. 464 00:21:03,720 --> 00:21:06,920 Speaker 2: You know. It's just like it had gotten so easy 465 00:21:07,040 --> 00:21:09,400 Speaker 2: for me to just be like, yeah, this, like we're 466 00:21:09,440 --> 00:21:12,560 Speaker 2: simply on different journeys, no hard feelings. I just knew 467 00:21:12,560 --> 00:21:15,640 Speaker 2: what I wanted and I stuck with it for myself, 468 00:21:15,680 --> 00:21:18,040 Speaker 2: like I didn't, you know, go outside the lines, which 469 00:21:18,040 --> 00:21:20,600 Speaker 2: I tend to do a lot. So yeah, I think 470 00:21:20,640 --> 00:21:23,000 Speaker 2: that makes so much sense. That's so much. 471 00:21:22,760 --> 00:21:25,080 Speaker 1: Amazing, and that's such a beautiful example. That's that for 472 00:21:25,080 --> 00:21:27,640 Speaker 1: our listeners, like, you know, just people like they can. 473 00:21:27,600 --> 00:21:38,320 Speaker 2: Do that too. I was going to ask you, why 474 00:21:38,440 --> 00:21:40,800 Speaker 2: is addressing your shadows so important? But I think we're 475 00:21:40,920 --> 00:21:44,120 Speaker 2: kind of giving those examples right now totally. 476 00:21:44,280 --> 00:21:46,040 Speaker 1: The first thing is that it gives you three sixties 477 00:21:46,080 --> 00:21:49,480 Speaker 1: degree view of like all of your own patterns maybe hidden. Secondly, 478 00:21:49,840 --> 00:21:52,119 Speaker 1: it allows you the ability to like integrate traits and 479 00:21:52,200 --> 00:21:55,520 Speaker 1: healthy ways so that you don't have your self esteem 480 00:21:55,560 --> 00:21:58,240 Speaker 1: affected by repressing all these parts of yourself and feeling 481 00:21:58,240 --> 00:22:00,840 Speaker 1: like parts of you are bad. You get triggered way 482 00:22:00,880 --> 00:22:03,600 Speaker 1: less often, Like it really clears your mind when you're 483 00:22:03,640 --> 00:22:07,800 Speaker 1: not personalizing everything about all these other people's behaviors. And 484 00:22:08,359 --> 00:22:11,679 Speaker 1: the fourth thing is by actually shifting your shadow traits 485 00:22:11,720 --> 00:22:16,080 Speaker 1: and dynamics over time, you choose differently. You choose more 486 00:22:16,119 --> 00:22:18,280 Speaker 1: secure people, You choose people who mirror back to the 487 00:22:18,320 --> 00:22:21,639 Speaker 1: healthiest version of yourself, because that's how you're showing up inwardly. 488 00:22:22,280 --> 00:22:23,439 Speaker 2: Well, I think we're talking about a lot of the 489 00:22:23,480 --> 00:22:26,200 Speaker 2: positives of doing the shadow work, but you just mentioned 490 00:22:26,320 --> 00:22:28,479 Speaker 2: worse and I want to talk about, like what is 491 00:22:28,520 --> 00:22:31,320 Speaker 2: the detriment to not doing this kind of work, because 492 00:22:31,359 --> 00:22:35,000 Speaker 2: to me, I've lived so many years just taking knocks 493 00:22:35,040 --> 00:22:37,240 Speaker 2: to my self esteem. And although I think from the 494 00:22:37,320 --> 00:22:40,120 Speaker 2: outside we can look a certain way, if you are 495 00:22:40,560 --> 00:22:44,200 Speaker 2: operating from a place of unworthiness, Like it doesn't matter 496 00:22:44,480 --> 00:22:46,600 Speaker 2: what you get in your life, what success is, what 497 00:22:46,760 --> 00:22:49,560 Speaker 2: looks good on the outside, what relationships look pretty, or 498 00:22:49,560 --> 00:22:52,800 Speaker 2: whatever it is if you're not really in a place 499 00:22:52,840 --> 00:22:55,960 Speaker 2: of you know, being integrated. I do think that you 500 00:22:56,000 --> 00:22:59,639 Speaker 2: can live in this like unworthy energy. So can you 501 00:22:59,680 --> 00:23:02,560 Speaker 2: talk little bit about like what is the problem with 502 00:23:02,640 --> 00:23:04,800 Speaker 2: not addressing any of this shadow stuff? 503 00:23:05,560 --> 00:23:09,960 Speaker 1: Yeah, amazing question. So when you don't address all these things. 504 00:23:10,000 --> 00:23:11,919 Speaker 1: One of the most interesting things too, going back to 505 00:23:11,960 --> 00:23:14,920 Speaker 1: that like subconscious comfort zone, is we really are moving 506 00:23:14,920 --> 00:23:17,840 Speaker 1: from this place of unworthiness because we think that all 507 00:23:17,880 --> 00:23:20,560 Speaker 1: of these traits that are actually secretly in there within 508 00:23:20,600 --> 00:23:23,000 Speaker 1: ourselves because they're usually showing up these hidden forms, are 509 00:23:23,080 --> 00:23:25,679 Speaker 1: bad and wrong and evil, and we have all these 510 00:23:25,760 --> 00:23:27,639 Speaker 1: judgments against these things, but they are parts of our 511 00:23:27,680 --> 00:23:30,760 Speaker 1: subconscious minds. So at a subconscious level, in a deeper way, 512 00:23:31,320 --> 00:23:33,560 Speaker 1: we've made all of these parts of ourselves bad and 513 00:23:33,640 --> 00:23:37,200 Speaker 1: wrong because we're not seeing them from a neutral, healthy standpoint. 514 00:23:37,280 --> 00:23:40,880 Speaker 1: And so the more that we feel that way about ourselves, 515 00:23:40,920 --> 00:23:42,800 Speaker 1: the more we're going to believe that we are unworthy. 516 00:23:42,800 --> 00:23:45,560 Speaker 1: And something that's so interesting there's a big study done 517 00:23:45,680 --> 00:23:48,600 Speaker 1: about a decade ago on people's relationship to their own 518 00:23:48,640 --> 00:23:51,679 Speaker 1: self worth and how it affected their net worth, and 519 00:23:51,720 --> 00:23:54,440 Speaker 1: they found that when people had these huge limiting beliefs 520 00:23:54,480 --> 00:23:57,359 Speaker 1: like I am unworthy or I am undeserving. They also 521 00:23:57,400 --> 00:24:01,520 Speaker 1: had sabotaging patterns in their reallyationship with money. And it 522 00:24:01,560 --> 00:24:04,439 Speaker 1: makes sense, right because your conscious mind can say I 523 00:24:04,480 --> 00:24:07,399 Speaker 1: want to make more money, but your subconscious mind is like, no, 524 00:24:07,480 --> 00:24:10,080 Speaker 1: I'm not deserving, I'm not worthy, and then your subconscious 525 00:24:10,080 --> 00:24:13,520 Speaker 1: mind just wants that familiarity because it's safety, so they'll. 526 00:24:13,240 --> 00:24:15,919 Speaker 3: Actually sabotage patterns around money. 527 00:24:16,400 --> 00:24:18,720 Speaker 1: Now, there wasn't a study downe and how that correlated 528 00:24:18,720 --> 00:24:21,240 Speaker 1: with relationships, but you can only imagine how that would 529 00:24:21,240 --> 00:24:24,680 Speaker 1: correlate with relationships, because if we don't feel worthy of love, 530 00:24:25,280 --> 00:24:28,119 Speaker 1: then we sabotage love. And I can look back on 531 00:24:28,520 --> 00:24:30,359 Speaker 1: my own self as somebody who's done a lot of 532 00:24:30,359 --> 00:24:34,080 Speaker 1: the work. I was a fearful, avoidant attachment style fifteen 533 00:24:34,160 --> 00:24:36,480 Speaker 1: years ago and started my journey doing a lot of 534 00:24:36,520 --> 00:24:39,800 Speaker 1: deep attachment and healing work on myself first, and that 535 00:24:39,880 --> 00:24:41,439 Speaker 1: was part of what got me so into this stuff. 536 00:24:41,480 --> 00:24:44,000 Speaker 1: And you know, it's so interesting because I remember there 537 00:24:44,040 --> 00:24:47,280 Speaker 1: was this one relationship that I was in in university 538 00:24:47,880 --> 00:24:51,360 Speaker 1: and it was like this very like stable, healthy, very 539 00:24:51,400 --> 00:24:54,040 Speaker 1: loving person showed up really well in the relationship, and 540 00:24:54,119 --> 00:24:57,320 Speaker 1: I remember just like doing everything I could to sabotage, 541 00:24:57,359 --> 00:24:59,800 Speaker 1: and looking back now, I'm like, oh, that's so in 542 00:25:00,040 --> 00:25:02,680 Speaker 1: interesting because for sure I didn't feel worthy of that 543 00:25:02,880 --> 00:25:06,400 Speaker 1: quality of love and connection, and so that translates into 544 00:25:06,440 --> 00:25:09,000 Speaker 1: my behavior almost felt like I'm not deserving of this, 545 00:25:09,000 --> 00:25:11,199 Speaker 1: this is this person's going to find me out that 546 00:25:11,359 --> 00:25:13,760 Speaker 1: like I'm not worthy of this, and that you know, 547 00:25:13,800 --> 00:25:15,679 Speaker 1: I'm not ready for this, and and there was this 548 00:25:15,760 --> 00:25:18,639 Speaker 1: constant fear in the background. And that's not unique to 549 00:25:18,640 --> 00:25:21,680 Speaker 1: my experience. That's something I've seen replicated and her discussions 550 00:25:22,040 --> 00:25:24,120 Speaker 1: working with so many people over the years. 551 00:25:23,920 --> 00:25:25,560 Speaker 3: Of how they felt that same way. 552 00:25:25,680 --> 00:25:29,040 Speaker 1: And so we're not just limiting ourselves and achieving our potential, 553 00:25:29,040 --> 00:25:32,119 Speaker 1: whether it's in our career or around our finances, but 554 00:25:32,320 --> 00:25:35,639 Speaker 1: absolutely when it comes to love and connection and relationships. 555 00:25:36,000 --> 00:25:37,280 Speaker 3: If we feel this way about. 556 00:25:37,080 --> 00:25:40,440 Speaker 2: Ourselves, if people are listening and they're like, Okay, maybe 557 00:25:40,480 --> 00:25:43,280 Speaker 2: I'm doing this or I'm constantly triggered, Like what is 558 00:25:43,320 --> 00:25:46,320 Speaker 2: your first step that you would give people to be 559 00:25:46,640 --> 00:25:47,600 Speaker 2: aware of your shadow? 560 00:25:48,160 --> 00:25:50,800 Speaker 1: I would say there's two main ways to work through triggers. 561 00:25:50,800 --> 00:25:53,360 Speaker 1: One is woundry programming, which maybe we can come back 562 00:25:53,400 --> 00:25:56,439 Speaker 1: to it's a really powerful tool, but with your shadow 563 00:25:56,520 --> 00:25:59,959 Speaker 1: specifically these are like my favorite too, so with your shadow. 564 00:26:00,000 --> 00:26:02,959 Speaker 1: So the very first step is when something triggers you 565 00:26:03,040 --> 00:26:05,240 Speaker 1: to do exactly what you do, which is to say, 566 00:26:05,600 --> 00:26:08,480 Speaker 1: what is this showing me about myself? Okay, to adopt 567 00:26:08,520 --> 00:26:12,160 Speaker 1: like a mindset of curiosity rather than what the mind 568 00:26:12,280 --> 00:26:14,240 Speaker 1: naturally does when we see our shadow, which is go 569 00:26:14,600 --> 00:26:17,960 Speaker 1: it goes, oh, this person's this, the person's that I 570 00:26:18,000 --> 00:26:19,920 Speaker 1: can't how dare they? And we go into the story 571 00:26:19,960 --> 00:26:22,119 Speaker 1: of them or us, and we go down the rabbit 572 00:26:22,160 --> 00:26:24,520 Speaker 1: hole and it just that takes us so far away 573 00:26:24,520 --> 00:26:28,359 Speaker 1: from anything constructive. So very first step we absolutely have 574 00:26:28,400 --> 00:26:30,679 Speaker 1: to ask ourselves what is this trying. 575 00:26:30,440 --> 00:26:32,560 Speaker 3: To show me here? Like what is going on here? 576 00:26:32,560 --> 00:26:33,919 Speaker 3: And adopt a state of curiosity. 577 00:26:34,080 --> 00:26:37,800 Speaker 1: Second, as we ask ourselves, what is the trait that 578 00:26:37,840 --> 00:26:40,560 Speaker 1: I'm judging in this person? Because when we're triggered and 579 00:26:40,560 --> 00:26:43,920 Speaker 1: our shadows come up, we're going they're rude, they don't listen, 580 00:26:43,960 --> 00:26:47,280 Speaker 1: they're dismissive, they're you know, whatever it might be. And 581 00:26:47,720 --> 00:26:50,960 Speaker 1: that's where when we're willing to be radically honest about 582 00:26:51,000 --> 00:26:53,199 Speaker 1: like if we could really put it on paper and 583 00:26:53,240 --> 00:26:55,840 Speaker 1: say everything that we're judging them as, that's where you're 584 00:26:55,840 --> 00:26:57,920 Speaker 1: going to actually start to see Okay, these are going 585 00:26:57,960 --> 00:26:59,320 Speaker 1: to be the parts of my shadow. 586 00:27:00,080 --> 00:27:02,760 Speaker 3: And then step three I. 587 00:27:02,760 --> 00:27:04,439 Speaker 1: Usually ask people is this something I just need to 588 00:27:04,440 --> 00:27:07,680 Speaker 1: integrate Because for some people it's as simple as it's selfish. 589 00:27:07,720 --> 00:27:10,439 Speaker 1: Oh my gosh, I have no level of healthy selfishness 590 00:27:10,480 --> 00:27:12,679 Speaker 1: in my life, like I no wonder and so that 591 00:27:12,720 --> 00:27:14,960 Speaker 1: can be an obvious one. But if it's not that, 592 00:27:15,080 --> 00:27:17,679 Speaker 1: then it means your shadows appearing in hidden forms. And 593 00:27:17,720 --> 00:27:20,080 Speaker 1: that's where we go through the three stops on the train. 594 00:27:20,560 --> 00:27:24,680 Speaker 1: So if it is somebody is neglecting me and I'm trigger, Okay, 595 00:27:24,720 --> 00:27:28,880 Speaker 1: they're neglectible, that's the trait that I'm judging them as. Okay, 596 00:27:28,960 --> 00:27:31,520 Speaker 1: So do I have to integrate neglect into my life? 597 00:27:31,640 --> 00:27:34,240 Speaker 1: Probably not, so I can write that off. Okay, So 598 00:27:34,320 --> 00:27:36,320 Speaker 1: what are the three stops on the train where do 599 00:27:36,359 --> 00:27:40,280 Speaker 1: I neglect my own feelings and needs? And boundaries Number two? 600 00:27:40,840 --> 00:27:44,639 Speaker 1: Where am I reactively neglectful to somebody? Oh, you're not 601 00:27:44,640 --> 00:27:46,440 Speaker 1: going to look out for me. I'm not going to 602 00:27:46,480 --> 00:27:49,040 Speaker 1: take care of your needs either. That's fine, right, where 603 00:27:49,040 --> 00:27:52,119 Speaker 1: we can actually become the trait that we're judging, because 604 00:27:52,119 --> 00:27:54,879 Speaker 1: it's from this place of reactivity. And then the third 605 00:27:54,920 --> 00:27:57,600 Speaker 1: step is is there somebody I'm neglecting in my life 606 00:27:57,600 --> 00:27:58,639 Speaker 1: and I'm not realizing it? 607 00:27:58,680 --> 00:28:00,480 Speaker 3: And it gives us that three to sixty to graeve you. 608 00:28:01,000 --> 00:28:01,879 Speaker 3: And then once we've. 609 00:28:01,720 --> 00:28:04,040 Speaker 1: Been able to really get that three sixty degree view, 610 00:28:04,040 --> 00:28:07,320 Speaker 1: there's sort of like a part two, which is, Okay, 611 00:28:07,320 --> 00:28:09,880 Speaker 1: what is one thing I can commit to right now 612 00:28:10,760 --> 00:28:14,400 Speaker 1: to stop doing this in the relationship to myself? And 613 00:28:14,440 --> 00:28:16,760 Speaker 1: what we're really looking for is something that opposes that 614 00:28:16,800 --> 00:28:19,919 Speaker 1: direct trait. So if it's neglectful, I'm going to actually 615 00:28:19,920 --> 00:28:22,240 Speaker 1: show up consistently in myself. That's going to be pretty 616 00:28:22,320 --> 00:28:24,840 Speaker 1: much the opposite of neglecting myself. And the more specific 617 00:28:24,920 --> 00:28:28,240 Speaker 1: I can get, like I'm going to take better care 618 00:28:28,280 --> 00:28:30,760 Speaker 1: of my health habits, I'm going to take better care 619 00:28:30,800 --> 00:28:33,199 Speaker 1: of rest and getting proper sleep. I'm going to take 620 00:28:33,240 --> 00:28:35,840 Speaker 1: better care of like taking time out sometimes, you know, 621 00:28:35,840 --> 00:28:37,919 Speaker 1: whatever it is that we need to stop neglecting, the 622 00:28:37,920 --> 00:28:40,840 Speaker 1: moment we do it's opposite, and the moment we're able 623 00:28:40,840 --> 00:28:43,719 Speaker 1: to actually stick to this for about twenty one days. 624 00:28:44,320 --> 00:28:46,600 Speaker 1: Research shows that it takes twenty one days to build 625 00:28:46,680 --> 00:28:48,560 Speaker 1: neural pathways that are strong enough that they are strong 626 00:28:48,640 --> 00:28:51,280 Speaker 1: enough to stay, and these are going to become our 627 00:28:51,280 --> 00:28:53,160 Speaker 1: new normals, our new habits, just like you when you 628 00:28:53,240 --> 00:28:55,720 Speaker 1: first started setting boundaries, and it was really hard at. 629 00:28:55,600 --> 00:28:57,320 Speaker 3: First, and then it got out fier. 630 00:28:57,560 --> 00:28:59,400 Speaker 2: Yeah, And so when we stick to something for twenty 631 00:28:59,400 --> 00:29:02,080 Speaker 2: one days, when we stop doing it to ourselves, we'll 632 00:29:02,080 --> 00:29:04,160 Speaker 2: also see that it doesn't show up too much in 633 00:29:04,240 --> 00:29:07,360 Speaker 2: hidden forms with others. So as I'm listening to you, 634 00:29:07,440 --> 00:29:09,520 Speaker 2: I have an old narrative going through my head that's like, oh, 635 00:29:09,600 --> 00:29:12,360 Speaker 2: it's always about me doing more work. Like it's like, 636 00:29:12,960 --> 00:29:15,560 Speaker 2: you know, when I'm seeing when I'm triggered by someone else, 637 00:29:15,640 --> 00:29:17,520 Speaker 2: it's mine to go work on or you know. And 638 00:29:17,520 --> 00:29:18,840 Speaker 2: then I guess that's like a little bit of a 639 00:29:18,960 --> 00:29:21,800 Speaker 2: victim mentality. But I think that can feel like a 640 00:29:21,840 --> 00:29:24,760 Speaker 2: heavy weight sometimes, especially if you're a person who's willing 641 00:29:24,840 --> 00:29:27,200 Speaker 2: to maybe look at themselves. I know, for me, I've 642 00:29:27,240 --> 00:29:30,720 Speaker 2: gotten a little bit abused with that in some relationships 643 00:29:30,760 --> 00:29:32,440 Speaker 2: because some people don't want to look and they like 644 00:29:32,480 --> 00:29:34,360 Speaker 2: to point the finger, and so if you're a person 645 00:29:34,400 --> 00:29:37,280 Speaker 2: that you will go look at yourself, they take advantage 646 00:29:37,320 --> 00:29:39,360 Speaker 2: of that. So as I'm listening to this, that's kind 647 00:29:39,400 --> 00:29:41,600 Speaker 2: of coming up for me. So that's obviously a shadow 648 00:29:41,760 --> 00:29:44,680 Speaker 2: piece of me that maybe needs to be addressed. But like, 649 00:29:45,200 --> 00:29:48,400 Speaker 2: what would you say to that where it's like if 650 00:29:48,400 --> 00:29:51,600 Speaker 2: you're noticing something in someone else and you have to 651 00:29:51,640 --> 00:29:53,840 Speaker 2: switch the narrative back to you, how do we not 652 00:29:54,000 --> 00:29:56,880 Speaker 2: then just like go into a massive shame spiral or 653 00:29:57,120 --> 00:30:00,840 Speaker 2: a like defeated kind of energy of just like like, oh, 654 00:30:00,960 --> 00:30:02,720 Speaker 2: why is it me that always has to have like 655 00:30:02,760 --> 00:30:05,280 Speaker 2: the lessons? And you know what I'm saying, this is. 656 00:30:05,200 --> 00:30:07,800 Speaker 3: A fantastic question. So one of the things that I 657 00:30:07,800 --> 00:30:09,560 Speaker 3: get people to go into after is what do I 658 00:30:09,640 --> 00:30:10,920 Speaker 3: need in this situation to feel right? 659 00:30:10,960 --> 00:30:11,400 Speaker 2: Okay? 660 00:30:11,600 --> 00:30:13,640 Speaker 1: And I actually want to link that back to like 661 00:30:13,680 --> 00:30:18,560 Speaker 1: where you're neglecting yourself, because where you're probably neglecting yourself. 662 00:30:18,320 --> 00:30:20,800 Speaker 3: Is voicing your needs consistently. 663 00:30:20,200 --> 00:30:20,920 Speaker 2: To other people. 664 00:30:21,840 --> 00:30:24,760 Speaker 1: So if you were voicing your needs consistently to other people, 665 00:30:25,240 --> 00:30:27,600 Speaker 1: people wouldn't be able to neglect you, or if they did, 666 00:30:27,600 --> 00:30:29,640 Speaker 1: it would be so loud and clear that like, this 667 00:30:29,720 --> 00:30:31,760 Speaker 1: isn't the type of person I want to be investing, right, 668 00:30:32,480 --> 00:30:35,040 Speaker 1: And so can I ask you, like from one to ten, 669 00:30:35,680 --> 00:30:38,000 Speaker 1: how much do you think that you consistently see your 670 00:30:38,040 --> 00:30:40,160 Speaker 1: needs through like the moment you have a need, you 671 00:30:40,200 --> 00:30:41,640 Speaker 1: know how to ask for help, you know how to 672 00:30:41,640 --> 00:30:43,480 Speaker 1: rely on people and open up and go to them, 673 00:30:43,640 --> 00:30:45,600 Speaker 1: and if somebody forgets, you're okay to be like, hey, 674 00:30:46,080 --> 00:30:47,520 Speaker 1: we said we're going to do this, and it's your 675 00:30:47,560 --> 00:30:50,080 Speaker 1: turn to do the dishes or your turn to be 676 00:30:50,160 --> 00:30:52,200 Speaker 1: more present with me or whatever it is. It's the 677 00:30:52,240 --> 00:30:55,440 Speaker 1: opposite of neglect. Like how how would you score yourself there? 678 00:30:55,960 --> 00:30:59,200 Speaker 2: I mean, I think I've gotten much much much better, 679 00:30:59,440 --> 00:31:02,800 Speaker 2: and definitely in my romantic relationships, I feel like I am. 680 00:31:03,040 --> 00:31:04,640 Speaker 2: I mean, you could ask my boyfriend. He'd be like, oh, 681 00:31:04,640 --> 00:31:07,720 Speaker 2: she sells her needs like he probably gets it harder 682 00:31:07,720 --> 00:31:10,680 Speaker 2: than anyone because that's been the place of probably in 683 00:31:10,680 --> 00:31:12,560 Speaker 2: the past where I neglected it the most and so 684 00:31:12,680 --> 00:31:15,720 Speaker 2: now I'm like super hardcore with it. But it's interesting 685 00:31:15,800 --> 00:31:18,240 Speaker 2: because as you were saying that, I was like, I've 686 00:31:18,280 --> 00:31:21,560 Speaker 2: set my life up in a way that you can't 687 00:31:21,600 --> 00:31:23,840 Speaker 2: really have needs. In my job, I do hair and 688 00:31:23,880 --> 00:31:26,959 Speaker 2: makeup and styling with celebrities, and so like the celebrities 689 00:31:27,040 --> 00:31:30,320 Speaker 2: needs are everybody's needs, and so I'm in a kind 690 00:31:30,320 --> 00:31:33,640 Speaker 2: of codependent dynamic from the get you know, like it 691 00:31:33,680 --> 00:31:36,960 Speaker 2: takes a little bit more effort in situations like that 692 00:31:37,040 --> 00:31:39,360 Speaker 2: to be able to step in for your own needs. 693 00:31:39,440 --> 00:31:43,200 Speaker 2: And like I have found ways, I would say, like 694 00:31:43,360 --> 00:31:46,760 Speaker 2: beforehand and after to do care for myself and kind 695 00:31:46,800 --> 00:31:48,719 Speaker 2: of during we were laughing about the crystals and our 696 00:31:48,720 --> 00:31:51,480 Speaker 2: brawls and stuff, but stuff like that, like I literally 697 00:31:52,320 --> 00:31:55,040 Speaker 2: carry my you know, I'm really protective of my energy 698 00:31:55,080 --> 00:31:57,080 Speaker 2: when I go to work and stuff. But yeah, do 699 00:31:57,080 --> 00:31:58,880 Speaker 2: you think that that is a place where it's like 700 00:32:00,040 --> 00:32:02,000 Speaker 2: if I'm sick or whatever, it is like you still 701 00:32:02,000 --> 00:32:03,880 Speaker 2: have to go to work. We don't have It's not 702 00:32:04,040 --> 00:32:06,000 Speaker 2: like a normal job where you get to call in sick. 703 00:32:06,080 --> 00:32:07,080 Speaker 2: You know what I'm saying, like. 704 00:32:07,560 --> 00:32:10,280 Speaker 1: Hundred person, And this is where I would urge you, 705 00:32:10,360 --> 00:32:12,120 Speaker 1: like if like so, just I think it's good to 706 00:32:12,120 --> 00:32:14,200 Speaker 1: give people the live example, I would urge you to 707 00:32:14,200 --> 00:32:16,720 Speaker 1: look for are there other ways that you could still 708 00:32:16,760 --> 00:32:20,640 Speaker 1: get those needs met? So could you hire help or 709 00:32:20,680 --> 00:32:22,960 Speaker 1: an assistant or if you're ever having a tough time, like, 710 00:32:23,000 --> 00:32:25,680 Speaker 1: are there other ways? Because that is a hard dynamic 711 00:32:25,760 --> 00:32:28,680 Speaker 1: that's really creaky. Yeah, but there's always going to be 712 00:32:28,720 --> 00:32:30,960 Speaker 1: some way that leads to off set a portion of 713 00:32:31,000 --> 00:32:33,400 Speaker 1: it to make you feel like you're really supporting yourself 714 00:32:33,480 --> 00:32:35,520 Speaker 1: and is there anything there that would show up? 715 00:32:35,720 --> 00:32:37,880 Speaker 2: Oh, I'm sure and I do think. I mean, the 716 00:32:37,920 --> 00:32:41,800 Speaker 2: perfect example is today, like I have myself my schedule 717 00:32:41,840 --> 00:32:43,560 Speaker 2: set up back to back to back to back to back, 718 00:32:43,600 --> 00:32:45,840 Speaker 2: and then I got in a small fender bender earlier 719 00:32:45,880 --> 00:32:46,160 Speaker 2: and it. 720 00:32:46,240 --> 00:32:47,719 Speaker 3: Just like, oh my gosh, the room meet. 721 00:32:47,800 --> 00:32:50,640 Speaker 2: Yeah, but it's the perfect example, right, because I knew 722 00:32:50,800 --> 00:32:53,520 Speaker 2: scheduling my day the back to back to back and 723 00:32:53,600 --> 00:32:55,680 Speaker 2: showing up I need to show up for a client 724 00:32:55,760 --> 00:32:58,680 Speaker 2: later today. I knew it was dangerous. Like when I 725 00:32:58,800 --> 00:33:01,680 Speaker 2: when it happened, I was like ugh, and my gut 726 00:33:01,960 --> 00:33:04,240 Speaker 2: was saying, this is too much, this is too much. 727 00:33:04,760 --> 00:33:06,640 Speaker 2: And then my agent was like, this is the best 728 00:33:06,720 --> 00:33:09,360 Speaker 2: day for them, so I agreed. But then the reck happened, 729 00:33:09,360 --> 00:33:12,000 Speaker 2: and I think, actually the wreck happened for me to 730 00:33:12,080 --> 00:33:15,920 Speaker 2: go you knew, See, you knew, And I'm trying not 731 00:33:15,960 --> 00:33:18,120 Speaker 2: to punish myself but just take it as another learning 732 00:33:18,160 --> 00:33:22,000 Speaker 2: experience of like overscheduling is a big part of like 733 00:33:22,200 --> 00:33:24,040 Speaker 2: one of the ways I can take better care of 734 00:33:24,080 --> 00:33:24,600 Speaker 2: mo neys. 735 00:33:25,280 --> 00:33:27,880 Speaker 1: That's an amazing example. And you can see like the 736 00:33:27,920 --> 00:33:30,960 Speaker 1: shadow piece, right, it's like I'm neglecting spare time I'm 737 00:33:31,000 --> 00:33:34,720 Speaker 1: neglecting rest, I'm neglecting tolle under the gun, and like pressure, 738 00:33:35,000 --> 00:33:38,400 Speaker 1: I'm neglecting really the time for myself. And so you 739 00:33:38,440 --> 00:33:40,240 Speaker 1: can see how that's going to be something that A 740 00:33:40,360 --> 00:33:43,160 Speaker 1: is so triggering the moment it happens externally, but B 741 00:33:44,000 --> 00:33:45,480 Speaker 1: the whole way out. 742 00:33:45,400 --> 00:33:47,960 Speaker 3: Is like repeatedly and greater new behavior. 743 00:33:48,160 --> 00:33:50,560 Speaker 1: So for twenty one days, I'm going to make a 744 00:33:50,600 --> 00:33:53,840 Speaker 1: commitment to stick to like scheduling a little more space 745 00:33:54,560 --> 00:33:55,480 Speaker 1: in my time, so. 746 00:33:55,480 --> 00:33:56,760 Speaker 3: I margin for error. 747 00:33:56,840 --> 00:33:59,960 Speaker 1: I'm gonna you know, and that is like you'll see 748 00:34:00,080 --> 00:34:02,200 Speaker 1: the moment you do that more the black to will 749 00:34:02,240 --> 00:34:03,240 Speaker 1: trickery on the outlet. 750 00:34:12,400 --> 00:34:14,319 Speaker 2: I am learning so much about myself and you guys 751 00:34:14,320 --> 00:34:16,279 Speaker 2: are just along for my therapy journey right now long. 752 00:34:16,880 --> 00:34:21,440 Speaker 2: But it ties into worth again, doesn't it. Like overscheduling 753 00:34:21,719 --> 00:34:24,319 Speaker 2: is because I'm too afraid that if I say I'm busy, 754 00:34:24,320 --> 00:34:27,080 Speaker 2: they'll use someone else and never call me again. So 755 00:34:27,120 --> 00:34:29,840 Speaker 2: it's like it ties back into like having confidence in 756 00:34:29,880 --> 00:34:32,160 Speaker 2: myself and knowing the right people are gonna be with me, 757 00:34:32,320 --> 00:34:35,360 Speaker 2: and like the right clients I'm not gonna lose, like 758 00:34:35,360 --> 00:34:37,279 Speaker 2: what's meant for you is not gonna miss you all 759 00:34:37,320 --> 00:34:39,840 Speaker 2: of that energy. But I get so programmed as a 760 00:34:39,880 --> 00:34:42,480 Speaker 2: freelancer for so many years of like no, you have 761 00:34:42,480 --> 00:34:43,719 Speaker 2: to say yes, you have to say yes. It's like 762 00:34:43,719 --> 00:34:46,920 Speaker 2: that urgency and that is it's also tied to a 763 00:34:46,960 --> 00:34:47,719 Speaker 2: worth thing, I. 764 00:34:47,680 --> 00:34:50,719 Speaker 1: Think absolutely, And you know it's tied to a work 765 00:34:50,760 --> 00:34:55,480 Speaker 1: thing when we're making sacrifices rather than compromises. Okay, so 766 00:34:55,800 --> 00:34:59,880 Speaker 1: a compromise would be something like, hey, this client's. 767 00:34:59,480 --> 00:35:00,560 Speaker 3: Going through our our time. 768 00:35:01,000 --> 00:35:02,920 Speaker 1: They really need you to come fifteen minutes earlier, and 769 00:35:02,960 --> 00:35:04,640 Speaker 1: you know what, you look at your schedule and you're like, hey, 770 00:35:04,680 --> 00:35:05,680 Speaker 1: I can do that today. 771 00:35:05,680 --> 00:35:06,640 Speaker 3: That actually works. 772 00:35:06,840 --> 00:35:09,120 Speaker 1: And it comes from this place of like maybe it's 773 00:35:09,160 --> 00:35:10,759 Speaker 1: like a little bit of a shift for me, but 774 00:35:10,800 --> 00:35:13,920 Speaker 1: it's not huge. But the sacrifice is like I didn't 775 00:35:13,920 --> 00:35:17,440 Speaker 1: consider myself. It was a compulsive yes, I just went 776 00:35:17,520 --> 00:35:19,840 Speaker 1: right for it came. I made that decision from fear 777 00:35:19,880 --> 00:35:22,400 Speaker 1: instead of truth, Like I just made it from like, oh, 778 00:35:22,440 --> 00:35:24,319 Speaker 1: fear of them going with somebody else or fear of 779 00:35:24,320 --> 00:35:26,359 Speaker 1: saying no, rather than like, hey, you know what, I've 780 00:35:26,400 --> 00:35:27,000 Speaker 1: looked at this and. 781 00:35:27,040 --> 00:35:28,000 Speaker 3: Like I can do that. 782 00:35:28,080 --> 00:35:30,480 Speaker 1: And so there's this part where so much of our 783 00:35:30,480 --> 00:35:33,040 Speaker 1: worth as well is like are we considering ourselves when 784 00:35:33,080 --> 00:35:35,840 Speaker 1: we're making decisions. Are we able to like attune to 785 00:35:35,840 --> 00:35:39,920 Speaker 1: our feelings and needs and consider that equally to other people? 786 00:35:40,600 --> 00:35:42,520 Speaker 1: And if we can do it equally, we're usually going 787 00:35:42,560 --> 00:35:44,919 Speaker 1: to find healthy compromises in middle grounds. But if we're 788 00:35:44,960 --> 00:35:47,480 Speaker 1: just like, only they matter and I don't even consider myself, 789 00:35:47,880 --> 00:35:50,680 Speaker 1: it's in this sacrificial nature. And the more we sacrifice, 790 00:35:50,680 --> 00:35:53,399 Speaker 1: the more we're also conditioning our own subconscious comfort zone 791 00:35:53,440 --> 00:35:55,960 Speaker 1: to be like, you're not worthy. Because imagine if you're 792 00:35:56,080 --> 00:35:59,160 Speaker 1: dating somebody and every time they have a need, or 793 00:35:59,200 --> 00:36:01,000 Speaker 1: somebody in your life has need, they say to you, 794 00:36:01,440 --> 00:36:02,520 Speaker 1: who cares about what you need? 795 00:36:02,560 --> 00:36:05,600 Speaker 3: Just do what they say? Who cares about considering yourself? 796 00:36:05,600 --> 00:36:07,840 Speaker 1: Your feelings don't matter? Just come on, hurry up, just 797 00:36:07,880 --> 00:36:10,040 Speaker 1: say yes. That would be terrible. 798 00:36:10,040 --> 00:36:11,520 Speaker 3: They would make you feel so unworthy. 799 00:36:11,520 --> 00:36:15,080 Speaker 1: But if we're doing that to ourselves all the time behaviorally, 800 00:36:14,800 --> 00:36:18,480 Speaker 1: we're actually creating more of the subconscious context to feel 801 00:36:18,480 --> 00:36:19,120 Speaker 1: more unworthy. 802 00:36:19,560 --> 00:36:21,560 Speaker 2: It would be terrible. But I think that that is 803 00:36:21,600 --> 00:36:25,920 Speaker 2: so common the example you just gave, especially nowadays, I 804 00:36:25,960 --> 00:36:27,360 Speaker 2: see so much work and I know you do so 805 00:36:27,440 --> 00:36:30,520 Speaker 2: much work around attachment style, So like that anxious avoidant dynamic. 806 00:36:31,040 --> 00:36:33,280 Speaker 2: A lot of the people who resonate with the anxious 807 00:36:33,320 --> 00:36:37,520 Speaker 2: are just constantly in that sacrifice place, thinking like, if 808 00:36:37,560 --> 00:36:39,920 Speaker 2: I just do this, then I get to keep the relationship. 809 00:36:39,920 --> 00:36:42,960 Speaker 2: I know I operated that way for a super long time. 810 00:36:43,640 --> 00:36:44,440 Speaker 3: One percent. 811 00:36:44,480 --> 00:36:46,319 Speaker 1: And have you ever noticed, when you really look, it's 812 00:36:46,360 --> 00:36:48,440 Speaker 1: the opposite. Have you ever noticed the people who get 813 00:36:48,480 --> 00:36:50,080 Speaker 1: chased are always the more avoidant people. 814 00:36:50,280 --> 00:36:52,640 Speaker 2: Oh? Always, Yes, It's like all. 815 00:36:52,560 --> 00:36:54,400 Speaker 3: The anxiousy boy are thinking like I have to go 816 00:36:54,440 --> 00:36:55,000 Speaker 3: in this direction. 817 00:36:55,360 --> 00:36:59,920 Speaker 1: But it really it's because we are giving subconscious cutes. 818 00:37:00,560 --> 00:37:03,839 Speaker 1: Almost ninety four percent of communication is non verbal, and 819 00:37:04,080 --> 00:37:06,880 Speaker 1: people are generally more attracted to And this is just 820 00:37:07,040 --> 00:37:09,520 Speaker 1: research backs it up. It's not me saying this is 821 00:37:09,880 --> 00:37:11,880 Speaker 1: people are generally more attracted to people have a strong 822 00:37:11,880 --> 00:37:15,200 Speaker 1: sense of self and who know what they want, aren't 823 00:37:15,200 --> 00:37:17,600 Speaker 1: afraid to show up for it, to vocalize on behalf 824 00:37:17,600 --> 00:37:20,000 Speaker 1: of it. And it's actually healthy to get there. It's 825 00:37:20,040 --> 00:37:21,759 Speaker 1: important for people to be able to get there. But 826 00:37:21,800 --> 00:37:24,880 Speaker 1: what happens is with a lot of anxious attachment styles. 827 00:37:24,920 --> 00:37:28,520 Speaker 1: For example, they have these core wounds from childhood, these 828 00:37:28,560 --> 00:37:31,759 Speaker 1: core fears that if I advocate for myself or take 829 00:37:31,840 --> 00:37:34,600 Speaker 1: up too much space. I'll be abandoned, I'll be alone, 830 00:37:34,600 --> 00:37:37,120 Speaker 1: I'll be excluded, I'll be disliked, I'll be rejected. And 831 00:37:37,160 --> 00:37:40,080 Speaker 1: these are just ideas. How a core wound really works 832 00:37:40,640 --> 00:37:43,840 Speaker 1: is we go through a painful experience and our subconscious 833 00:37:43,880 --> 00:37:46,279 Speaker 1: mind stores it and then it projects it back out 834 00:37:46,280 --> 00:37:49,480 Speaker 1: into everything. So if you imagine that, like you're in 835 00:37:49,520 --> 00:37:52,480 Speaker 1: a forest and you see a bear and you run 836 00:37:52,480 --> 00:37:54,400 Speaker 1: away from the bear and you escape and you're safe, 837 00:37:54,400 --> 00:37:56,200 Speaker 1: thank god. But then the next day you have to 838 00:37:56,239 --> 00:37:58,440 Speaker 1: go back into the woods where that bear was. 839 00:37:58,640 --> 00:37:59,160 Speaker 2: What do you do? 840 00:38:00,040 --> 00:38:02,600 Speaker 3: Your mind's like the bear could be coming, becoming and 841 00:38:02,840 --> 00:38:03,839 Speaker 3: looking everywhere. 842 00:38:04,360 --> 00:38:08,640 Speaker 1: So when we have unresolved experiences in childhood about being 843 00:38:08,680 --> 00:38:11,600 Speaker 1: abandoned or disliked or rejected, what do we do. 844 00:38:12,040 --> 00:38:13,120 Speaker 3: We're like, oh my gosh, they're. 845 00:38:12,960 --> 00:38:13,399 Speaker 2: Going to bang. 846 00:38:14,480 --> 00:38:16,360 Speaker 1: It's like the bear, and our subconscious is designed to 847 00:38:16,400 --> 00:38:18,040 Speaker 1: do that to quote unquote keep us safe. 848 00:38:18,760 --> 00:38:20,399 Speaker 3: But that's not helping us. 849 00:38:20,719 --> 00:38:22,960 Speaker 1: So what we can actually do is we can rewire 850 00:38:23,040 --> 00:38:26,239 Speaker 1: those ideas about ourselves as well. And I don't know 851 00:38:26,239 --> 00:38:28,160 Speaker 1: if you wanted to go more into some other shadow part, 852 00:38:28,239 --> 00:38:29,839 Speaker 1: but if you'd like, I can also share a tool 853 00:38:29,920 --> 00:38:33,239 Speaker 1: for like rewiring these painful ideas. Yes, youth core will 854 00:38:33,640 --> 00:38:35,880 Speaker 1: literally reak havoc on our relationships. 855 00:38:36,400 --> 00:38:38,359 Speaker 2: Yeah, I want to know the tool. What's the tool? 856 00:38:39,800 --> 00:38:42,600 Speaker 3: The tool? So it's a subconscious reprogramming tool. 857 00:38:42,719 --> 00:38:45,600 Speaker 1: It's de mined because one of the first things we 858 00:38:45,640 --> 00:38:47,440 Speaker 1: have to realize is these wounds that we have are 859 00:38:47,480 --> 00:38:49,960 Speaker 1: not conscious. Nobody's waking up being like I'm going to 860 00:38:50,000 --> 00:38:51,680 Speaker 1: tell myself I'm going to be abandoned all day and 861 00:38:51,719 --> 00:38:52,200 Speaker 1: see how I. 862 00:38:52,160 --> 00:38:55,839 Speaker 2: Feel like they're not trying who It comes out sideways, right, 863 00:38:55,880 --> 00:38:59,200 Speaker 2: It's like you're going through your boyfriend's Instagram, or it's 864 00:38:59,200 --> 00:39:01,359 Speaker 2: like something weird, like well, do you start doing these 865 00:39:01,360 --> 00:39:05,719 Speaker 2: weird behaviors looking for every text, overreading the text, responses 866 00:39:05,800 --> 00:39:08,640 Speaker 2: like analyzing every word, like those are things I used 867 00:39:08,640 --> 00:39:11,920 Speaker 2: to do exactly, those are exactly the patterns, and like 868 00:39:11,920 --> 00:39:15,240 Speaker 2: you're not choosing them. They're like these autopilot things, right, nice, 869 00:39:15,600 --> 00:39:17,279 Speaker 2: and so that's how you know they're subconscious. And so 870 00:39:17,600 --> 00:39:19,319 Speaker 2: whenever we have these wounds, I. 871 00:39:19,280 --> 00:39:23,680 Speaker 1: Don't believe in affirmations because affirmations are just your conscious 872 00:39:23,680 --> 00:39:26,000 Speaker 1: mind speaking to your conscious mind. Because your conscious mind 873 00:39:26,040 --> 00:39:30,320 Speaker 1: speaks language, but your subconscious mind speaks through emotions and images. Okay, 874 00:39:30,320 --> 00:39:32,480 Speaker 1: So if I say to you, for example, okay, whatever 875 00:39:32,560 --> 00:39:33,280 Speaker 1: you do, do. 876 00:39:33,200 --> 00:39:34,680 Speaker 3: Not think of a chocolate chip cookie. 877 00:39:34,840 --> 00:39:36,120 Speaker 2: Oh that's the first thing I think of. 878 00:39:37,440 --> 00:39:38,960 Speaker 3: Because your conscious mind here is do not. 879 00:39:39,080 --> 00:39:41,840 Speaker 1: But your subconscious is like image of the chocolate chip cookie, 880 00:39:41,840 --> 00:39:43,520 Speaker 1: and maybe like a warm, fuzzy. 881 00:39:43,160 --> 00:39:44,040 Speaker 3: Feeling or something. 882 00:39:44,120 --> 00:39:44,880 Speaker 2: Yes, for sure. 883 00:39:46,840 --> 00:39:48,680 Speaker 1: So when we have these wounds and we're like, oh 884 00:39:48,680 --> 00:39:51,080 Speaker 1: my gosh, I'm sick of fearing abandonment or sick of 885 00:39:51,280 --> 00:39:54,319 Speaker 1: like being so sensitive to rejection or being disliked, and 886 00:39:54,400 --> 00:39:56,720 Speaker 1: you want to rewire it, there's just a three steps system. 887 00:39:56,840 --> 00:39:59,759 Speaker 1: So one find the wound in its opposite. So if 888 00:39:59,800 --> 00:40:02,680 Speaker 1: it's I'm not good enough, I'm good enough. If I'm abandoned, 889 00:40:02,680 --> 00:40:05,120 Speaker 1: I'm worthy of connection, I'm unlovable, I'm lovable. 890 00:40:05,600 --> 00:40:06,080 Speaker 3: Really easy. 891 00:40:06,680 --> 00:40:11,160 Speaker 1: Step two is we need ten memories of times we 892 00:40:11,239 --> 00:40:14,440 Speaker 1: actually felt good enough or lovable or whatever the wound is. 893 00:40:14,719 --> 00:40:17,279 Speaker 1: The reason we pick memories is because every memory is 894 00:40:17,280 --> 00:40:19,560 Speaker 1: a container of emotions and images, which is the language 895 00:40:19,600 --> 00:40:21,919 Speaker 1: of the subconscious mind. If I were to say, like, oh, 896 00:40:21,960 --> 00:40:23,840 Speaker 1: tell me your favorite childhood memory, and it was you 897 00:40:23,920 --> 00:40:26,759 Speaker 1: playing at the playground with your friends, you would see 898 00:40:26,760 --> 00:40:29,560 Speaker 1: the images of the slide. And we've all seen people 899 00:40:29,560 --> 00:40:31,960 Speaker 1: when they tell stories or old memories they smile or 900 00:40:31,960 --> 00:40:35,680 Speaker 1: they laugh or because memories are containers for images and emotions. 901 00:40:35,680 --> 00:40:38,440 Speaker 1: So we get ten times that we felt good enough 902 00:40:38,880 --> 00:40:42,399 Speaker 1: or lovable or connected instead of abandoned like the new idea. 903 00:40:42,960 --> 00:40:47,520 Speaker 1: And step three we record it down, like into our phone. 904 00:40:47,560 --> 00:40:50,080 Speaker 1: For example, we say, record ourselves saying it out loud, 905 00:40:50,120 --> 00:40:52,759 Speaker 1: like I felt good enough yesterday when I showed up 906 00:40:52,760 --> 00:40:54,880 Speaker 1: as a good friend, or I felt good enough two 907 00:40:54,920 --> 00:40:56,680 Speaker 1: weeks ago when I set a hard boundary with my 908 00:40:56,719 --> 00:40:59,120 Speaker 1: partner when it was really difficult for me too. And 909 00:40:59,200 --> 00:41:01,680 Speaker 1: so we record those things saying them out loud, and 910 00:41:01,719 --> 00:41:04,720 Speaker 1: we listen back for twenty one days. And when we listen, okay, 911 00:41:04,800 --> 00:41:07,800 Speaker 1: all we have to do is visualize them and feel 912 00:41:07,800 --> 00:41:10,319 Speaker 1: about them. And what that's doing is it's creating new 913 00:41:10,400 --> 00:41:14,759 Speaker 1: programs at the subconscious level where we can actually rewire, 914 00:41:14,800 --> 00:41:17,439 Speaker 1: because neuroplasticity shows when we fire and wire new neural 915 00:41:17,520 --> 00:41:20,680 Speaker 1: pathways with repetition and emotion. That's what hardwires them into 916 00:41:20,719 --> 00:41:22,880 Speaker 1: the brain. So if you're like, hey, I don't want 917 00:41:22,880 --> 00:41:26,239 Speaker 1: to feel abandoned any longer or alone, that's all you 918 00:41:26,280 --> 00:41:29,960 Speaker 1: do is three steps and it actually changes these ideas 919 00:41:29,960 --> 00:41:30,799 Speaker 1: so that you don't have. 920 00:41:30,760 --> 00:41:32,000 Speaker 3: To feel like that any longer. 921 00:41:32,400 --> 00:41:34,840 Speaker 2: Okay, this actually leads to my next question, because I 922 00:41:34,840 --> 00:41:38,520 Speaker 2: wanted to bring up shame. And we're giving these tips obviously, 923 00:41:38,600 --> 00:41:41,279 Speaker 2: but if you're listening and you're like, the second tip 924 00:41:41,280 --> 00:41:43,719 Speaker 2: you just gave that you said, list ten things in 925 00:41:43,719 --> 00:41:45,960 Speaker 2: your childhood that you felt happy or what. I can't 926 00:41:46,000 --> 00:41:48,880 Speaker 2: remember exactly how you ordered it, but if you couldn't 927 00:41:48,920 --> 00:41:51,359 Speaker 2: think of ten, I could see that being a thing 928 00:41:51,440 --> 00:41:54,240 Speaker 2: that would maybe be triggering to like, well, my childhood 929 00:41:54,280 --> 00:41:57,840 Speaker 2: was terrible and I don't have ten experiences or whatever. 930 00:41:57,880 --> 00:41:59,680 Speaker 2: And so some of this work is really important to 931 00:41:59,719 --> 00:42:03,560 Speaker 2: do with a licensed therapist or a professional that can 932 00:42:03,600 --> 00:42:06,239 Speaker 2: help you kind of get to the rewiring place. I 933 00:42:06,239 --> 00:42:09,360 Speaker 2: would imagine, And if someone is sitting here listening and 934 00:42:09,400 --> 00:42:12,520 Speaker 2: they're thinking, Okay, this is me and I want to 935 00:42:12,560 --> 00:42:16,239 Speaker 2: do this work, how do we not attach shame to 936 00:42:16,360 --> 00:42:19,640 Speaker 2: when we're uncovering our shadow parts, whether that's working with 937 00:42:19,680 --> 00:42:23,160 Speaker 2: a professional or just in general, how do you not 938 00:42:23,320 --> 00:42:26,879 Speaker 2: go into this shame spiral of oh my god, none 939 00:42:26,960 --> 00:42:29,120 Speaker 2: of these things that have been triggering me, or these 940 00:42:29,160 --> 00:42:31,799 Speaker 2: relationships that have gone back, are about anybody else but me, 941 00:42:32,600 --> 00:42:35,279 Speaker 2: And these are all the things like I'm defective kind 942 00:42:35,320 --> 00:42:37,319 Speaker 2: of energy, Like what would you say to. 943 00:42:37,280 --> 00:42:38,960 Speaker 3: That great question? 944 00:42:39,239 --> 00:42:41,279 Speaker 1: So one of the first things is, you know, if 945 00:42:41,280 --> 00:42:43,719 Speaker 1: somebody's yeah, it's great to do that in like a 946 00:42:43,760 --> 00:42:46,760 Speaker 1: program with somebody or with a licensed therapist or something 947 00:42:46,800 --> 00:42:47,080 Speaker 1: like that. 948 00:42:47,480 --> 00:42:49,040 Speaker 3: It doesn't have to be things from childhood. It can 949 00:42:49,080 --> 00:42:49,480 Speaker 3: be just like. 950 00:42:49,440 --> 00:42:51,440 Speaker 1: Little ten memories of things you felt got of. It 951 00:42:51,440 --> 00:42:52,600 Speaker 1: can be like I got out of bed on my 952 00:42:52,600 --> 00:42:55,200 Speaker 1: first alarm. They can be super tiny if we can't 953 00:42:55,200 --> 00:42:57,360 Speaker 1: find anything, and you can always start more general and 954 00:42:57,360 --> 00:43:00,120 Speaker 1: then get more specific over time, like it's possible that 955 00:43:00,160 --> 00:43:02,320 Speaker 1: I'm improving, and then when you start to feel like 956 00:43:02,360 --> 00:43:05,440 Speaker 1: that's acceptable, Okay, I am becoming good enough, and then 957 00:43:05,480 --> 00:43:07,759 Speaker 1: when you so so anyways, there's like detail to that. 958 00:43:07,960 --> 00:43:11,680 Speaker 1: But when it comes to shame. Something that's so interesting 959 00:43:11,719 --> 00:43:14,839 Speaker 1: about shame is, you know, if we have shame, Shame 960 00:43:14,920 --> 00:43:18,359 Speaker 1: is a very interpersonal emotion, and when you really look 961 00:43:18,400 --> 00:43:22,560 Speaker 1: at shame, it does nothing productive. So I often when 962 00:43:22,560 --> 00:43:24,840 Speaker 1: I was working with clients or in our programs, I 963 00:43:24,880 --> 00:43:27,440 Speaker 1: often say to people, I give them this exercise I 964 00:43:27,600 --> 00:43:30,919 Speaker 1: sea and it almost reminds me of you, Like when 965 00:43:30,920 --> 00:43:34,000 Speaker 1: you first said that, when you get triggered by things 966 00:43:34,040 --> 00:43:35,759 Speaker 1: with your shadow, you're like, what is it showing me? 967 00:43:35,800 --> 00:43:39,600 Speaker 3: What is it telling me? I stands for inquiry, Okay. 968 00:43:39,640 --> 00:43:41,400 Speaker 3: So it's a conscious. 969 00:43:41,040 --> 00:43:43,160 Speaker 1: Process at first, like we have to like practice doing this, 970 00:43:43,239 --> 00:43:46,120 Speaker 1: but when we see ourselves in shame, one of the 971 00:43:46,120 --> 00:43:48,279 Speaker 1: first things to do is just get curious, yeah, and 972 00:43:48,480 --> 00:43:52,839 Speaker 1: ask ourselves, Okay, what is the root reason that this 973 00:43:52,880 --> 00:43:55,480 Speaker 1: took place? And I'll tell you a story and maybe 974 00:43:55,480 --> 00:43:57,560 Speaker 1: with this exercise so you can see it. So I 975 00:43:57,560 --> 00:43:59,960 Speaker 1: had this client once and he was a real turn 976 00:44:00,680 --> 00:44:03,279 Speaker 1: and he had a lovely heart. He was a really 977 00:44:03,280 --> 00:44:05,839 Speaker 1: good person, meant really well. Was he could also always 978 00:44:05,880 --> 00:44:09,040 Speaker 1: really caring about people in his life. But he had 979 00:44:09,080 --> 00:44:11,680 Speaker 1: a huge boundary issue, and he had a high stress, 980 00:44:11,760 --> 00:44:14,480 Speaker 1: high intense position, Like he just was so busy and 981 00:44:14,480 --> 00:44:17,560 Speaker 1: I had all this pressure on him. And so he 982 00:44:17,880 --> 00:44:19,560 Speaker 1: came into my office one day when I was in 983 00:44:19,600 --> 00:44:22,960 Speaker 1: private practice and he said, Tie, I've been in this 984 00:44:23,080 --> 00:44:25,680 Speaker 1: shame spiral. I like can't get out of it. I 985 00:44:25,719 --> 00:44:28,040 Speaker 1: did the worst thing. I'm so ashamed of myself, Like 986 00:44:28,080 --> 00:44:30,680 Speaker 1: I can't believe it. And I said, Okay, tell me, 987 00:44:30,719 --> 00:44:33,000 Speaker 1: like what happened? And he said, I go into this 988 00:44:33,040 --> 00:44:34,319 Speaker 1: bank and he's like, I go in once a week 989 00:44:34,360 --> 00:44:37,520 Speaker 1: to deposit checks. And you know, I was waiting in line, 990 00:44:37,520 --> 00:44:39,480 Speaker 1: and I always get this one teller and she always 991 00:44:39,560 --> 00:44:41,800 Speaker 1: messes up when I'm under the gun. And I was 992 00:44:41,840 --> 00:44:43,839 Speaker 1: waiting in line, and I was so stressed. My boss 993 00:44:43,920 --> 00:44:45,359 Speaker 1: was giving me a hard time, and I was late 994 00:44:45,360 --> 00:44:47,920 Speaker 1: to a listing appointment and I had to deposit these 995 00:44:47,960 --> 00:44:50,560 Speaker 1: checks by this deadline. And I was like waiting in 996 00:44:50,560 --> 00:44:52,319 Speaker 1: the line and I'm like, please, God, don't give me 997 00:44:52,360 --> 00:44:53,280 Speaker 1: this person. 998 00:44:53,800 --> 00:44:57,320 Speaker 3: And he's like, sure enough, I got her, and she made. 999 00:44:57,200 --> 00:44:58,800 Speaker 1: A whole bunch of mistakes and I was just stuck 1000 00:44:58,880 --> 00:45:01,920 Speaker 1: there and he was like and I got so frustrated 1001 00:45:01,960 --> 00:45:04,040 Speaker 1: and I said to her, you should pick a different 1002 00:45:04,080 --> 00:45:08,480 Speaker 1: job because you're terrible at this one. And he freaked out. 1003 00:45:08,560 --> 00:45:10,880 Speaker 1: He panicked, he you know, stormed out, and then he 1004 00:45:10,920 --> 00:45:13,320 Speaker 1: was in this like four day shame cycle before years 1005 00:45:13,760 --> 00:45:15,560 Speaker 1: the same thing. Yeah, and he was like, I'm a 1006 00:45:15,640 --> 00:45:19,000 Speaker 1: terrible person. And I was like, did you go back 1007 00:45:19,040 --> 00:45:21,319 Speaker 1: in and apologize? And he was like no, I'm never 1008 00:45:21,360 --> 00:45:22,800 Speaker 1: setting foot back in the bank again. 1009 00:45:23,400 --> 00:45:24,360 Speaker 3: Now Here's what's. 1010 00:45:24,160 --> 00:45:28,040 Speaker 1: So interesting about shame what he did, which really models 1011 00:45:28,040 --> 00:45:31,000 Speaker 1: it out as he went into the story of Mimi me, 1012 00:45:32,160 --> 00:45:34,000 Speaker 1: I'm a terrible person. I'm that, I'm this, I'm that 1013 00:45:34,880 --> 00:45:37,600 Speaker 1: the moment that happened, so I was like, okay, let's 1014 00:45:37,600 --> 00:45:41,319 Speaker 1: do ica together. So inquiry was like, hey, let's look 1015 00:45:41,320 --> 00:45:44,320 Speaker 1: at the root cause that got you here to the 1016 00:45:44,320 --> 00:45:45,799 Speaker 1: point where you said or did the thing that you 1017 00:45:45,800 --> 00:45:48,719 Speaker 1: were feeling badly about. And what we discovered with him 1018 00:45:48,840 --> 00:45:51,840 Speaker 1: is that he has really bad boundaries and. 1019 00:45:51,920 --> 00:45:54,239 Speaker 3: Because he boundary li almost like you, which is. 1020 00:45:54,200 --> 00:45:57,799 Speaker 2: So yah yah story earlier, he hitting very way back 1021 00:45:57,840 --> 00:45:58,640 Speaker 2: to back yep. 1022 00:45:59,120 --> 00:46:01,200 Speaker 1: Then he's under the guy all the time, and then 1023 00:46:01,400 --> 00:46:03,040 Speaker 1: he's like a tick. He was in that case like 1024 00:46:03,080 --> 00:46:05,040 Speaker 1: a ticking time bomb, right because he had all this 1025 00:46:05,120 --> 00:46:07,800 Speaker 1: pressure externally and then it makes it so much harder. 1026 00:46:08,200 --> 00:46:11,000 Speaker 1: And so I is inquiry, Let's look at root cause 1027 00:46:11,280 --> 00:46:13,760 Speaker 1: behind why I did what I did that I'm ashamed 1028 00:46:13,800 --> 00:46:15,160 Speaker 1: of or not feeling good about. 1029 00:46:16,000 --> 00:46:17,680 Speaker 3: C is for compassion. 1030 00:46:17,760 --> 00:46:21,719 Speaker 1: Let's have some compassion because you can see how, hey, 1031 00:46:22,080 --> 00:46:24,760 Speaker 1: you know you he had bad boundaries because as a child, 1032 00:46:25,360 --> 00:46:28,000 Speaker 1: boundaries were shamed and punished, and so if he had boundaries, 1033 00:46:28,000 --> 00:46:30,000 Speaker 1: he got in trouble for having them, and so no wonder, 1034 00:46:30,040 --> 00:46:33,840 Speaker 1: here's this person doing his best in the world with 1035 00:46:33,920 --> 00:46:36,560 Speaker 1: no boundaries, feel like everybody can do and say, you know, 1036 00:46:36,600 --> 00:46:38,680 Speaker 1: whatever they want to with his time. And so can 1037 00:46:38,719 --> 00:46:40,720 Speaker 1: we have a little compassion for like where this painful 1038 00:46:40,719 --> 00:46:42,880 Speaker 1: habit came from? And can we see like how that 1039 00:46:43,000 --> 00:46:45,279 Speaker 1: started at one point and have a little bit of 1040 00:46:45,960 --> 00:46:50,080 Speaker 1: you know, compassion for ourselves there? And then A is accountability. 1041 00:46:50,280 --> 00:46:53,120 Speaker 1: How can I solve for what I did but also 1042 00:46:53,160 --> 00:46:55,839 Speaker 1: solve for the root cause, which didn't just mean him 1043 00:46:55,840 --> 00:46:58,560 Speaker 1: going back in and actually apologizing to the bank teller, 1044 00:46:58,600 --> 00:47:00,520 Speaker 1: which he did and he made amends. He felt way 1045 00:47:00,520 --> 00:47:03,680 Speaker 1: better about but he realized, Wow, if I don't work 1046 00:47:03,680 --> 00:47:07,440 Speaker 1: on this boundary issue in practice implementing boundaries, I'm going 1047 00:47:07,520 --> 00:47:10,080 Speaker 1: to keep going through these painful cycles where I feel ashamed. 1048 00:47:10,520 --> 00:47:12,840 Speaker 1: And so shame is just an emotion that's trying to 1049 00:47:12,880 --> 00:47:15,840 Speaker 1: give us feedback. But usually when we're in shame, if 1050 00:47:15,920 --> 00:47:18,120 Speaker 1: you pay close attention, we're actually just in this like 1051 00:47:18,680 --> 00:47:19,920 Speaker 1: painful story about ourselves. 1052 00:47:20,160 --> 00:47:22,440 Speaker 3: Intead, Oh, I'm sorry to the person. 1053 00:47:22,480 --> 00:47:24,120 Speaker 1: We usually go into like me me, me, me me, 1054 00:47:24,280 --> 00:47:27,440 Speaker 1: We're like I'm this, I'm that, and so being able 1055 00:47:27,480 --> 00:47:30,640 Speaker 1: to observe. Okay, let's do ica, Let's like get clear, 1056 00:47:31,280 --> 00:47:33,640 Speaker 1: let's inquire about root cause. Let's have a little compassion 1057 00:47:33,680 --> 00:47:35,760 Speaker 1: about where that root cause came from. And it's painful 1058 00:47:35,800 --> 00:47:38,360 Speaker 1: to live in a boundaryless way. And then let's go 1059 00:47:38,400 --> 00:47:39,840 Speaker 1: see what we can do to make amends and be 1060 00:47:39,840 --> 00:47:43,680 Speaker 1: accountable and that helps us move out of that viral 1061 00:47:43,760 --> 00:47:45,560 Speaker 1: of shame that can just last for so long and 1062 00:47:45,680 --> 00:47:47,799 Speaker 1: also be completely unproductive. 1063 00:47:49,280 --> 00:47:51,080 Speaker 2: I love that I'm going to use that one. I 1064 00:47:51,120 --> 00:47:54,040 Speaker 2: think on my good days, I'm doing that, you know, naturally, 1065 00:47:54,200 --> 00:47:56,200 Speaker 2: like that's the way that I would speak to myself. 1066 00:47:56,440 --> 00:47:58,160 Speaker 2: But I do think it's easy to kind of slip 1067 00:47:58,200 --> 00:48:00,520 Speaker 2: back into old patterns, and so like having an actual 1068 00:48:00,600 --> 00:48:04,160 Speaker 2: tangible tool is so so so helpful. You've been full 1069 00:48:04,160 --> 00:48:06,360 Speaker 2: of those today, which is great because you also have 1070 00:48:06,440 --> 00:48:09,799 Speaker 2: a podcast, the Tay East Gibson Podcast, and you guys 1071 00:48:09,840 --> 00:48:12,000 Speaker 2: can find all kinds of tips like this. Also, you 1072 00:48:12,040 --> 00:48:15,040 Speaker 2: do a lot about attachment style, which I just think 1073 00:48:15,160 --> 00:48:18,920 Speaker 2: is so so so helpful to people because it's so interesting. 1074 00:48:18,920 --> 00:48:21,359 Speaker 2: The more work I've done on that within myself, the 1075 00:48:21,360 --> 00:48:24,640 Speaker 2: more I'm like, wait, every relationship that I know around 1076 00:48:24,680 --> 00:48:27,960 Speaker 2: my life is like that, like it's so prevalent these days. 1077 00:48:28,200 --> 00:48:29,799 Speaker 2: Can you tell us a little bit about what the 1078 00:48:29,840 --> 00:48:31,920 Speaker 2: listeners would find on the podcast. 1079 00:48:32,120 --> 00:48:35,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, definitely. So we talk all about attachment styles and healing. 1080 00:48:35,680 --> 00:48:37,840 Speaker 1: We really talk about like kind of going back to 1081 00:48:38,440 --> 00:48:40,880 Speaker 1: we brush on earlier, was like the subconscious mind is 1082 00:48:40,920 --> 00:48:43,799 Speaker 1: responsible for that ninety five to ninety seven percent. So 1083 00:48:44,280 --> 00:48:47,480 Speaker 1: every time we work through like a wound or a fear, 1084 00:48:47,600 --> 00:48:49,880 Speaker 1: a boundary issue or anything like that, I really make 1085 00:48:49,920 --> 00:48:52,560 Speaker 1: sure it's engaging the subconscious mind in the process so 1086 00:48:52,600 --> 00:48:55,799 Speaker 1: that we can really pattern it in because I think 1087 00:48:55,840 --> 00:48:58,759 Speaker 1: there's times where people say, oh, your attachment style and 1088 00:48:59,080 --> 00:49:01,279 Speaker 1: here's your traits. Sometimes we were like, Okay, this is 1089 00:49:01,320 --> 00:49:03,600 Speaker 1: how I am instead of like what you're doing, which 1090 00:49:03,600 --> 00:49:06,120 Speaker 1: is amazing, but you see it like not nearly enough, 1091 00:49:06,160 --> 00:49:08,120 Speaker 1: which is people are like, oh, I just am this way. 1092 00:49:08,440 --> 00:49:10,520 Speaker 1: So we really talk about how to rewire what's not 1093 00:49:10,600 --> 00:49:12,920 Speaker 1: working and really simplified tangible ways. 1094 00:49:13,320 --> 00:49:15,600 Speaker 2: Yeah, where it came from, and then how to rewire it. 1095 00:49:15,680 --> 00:49:16,760 Speaker 3: I love that exactly. 1096 00:49:17,120 --> 00:49:19,680 Speaker 2: Well, then let's also talk about the Personal Development school 1097 00:49:19,680 --> 00:49:22,120 Speaker 2: because you mentioned before we started the podcast, this is 1098 00:49:22,320 --> 00:49:24,239 Speaker 2: what you do the majority of the time now, So 1099 00:49:24,280 --> 00:49:25,920 Speaker 2: can you tell the listeners a little bit about that. 1100 00:49:26,680 --> 00:49:29,960 Speaker 1: Yeah, So the Personal Developments called mostly a ninety day 1101 00:49:29,960 --> 00:49:33,000 Speaker 1: boot cam to become securely attached. That's basically like everything 1102 00:49:33,000 --> 00:49:36,040 Speaker 1: I love all these We have all these supportive resources 1103 00:49:36,080 --> 00:49:38,480 Speaker 1: in there for other areas of life, like your limiting 1104 00:49:38,480 --> 00:49:40,400 Speaker 1: beliefs in your career and how to rewire them and 1105 00:49:40,440 --> 00:49:43,719 Speaker 1: things like that, but it really goes through healing your 1106 00:49:43,760 --> 00:49:46,440 Speaker 1: attachment style, and we have like a specific program that 1107 00:49:46,440 --> 00:49:49,279 Speaker 1: people can move through and it helps them rewire their. 1108 00:49:49,200 --> 00:49:51,360 Speaker 3: Core wounds, learn their needs, learn. 1109 00:49:51,200 --> 00:49:54,520 Speaker 1: To communicate better, have healthier boundaries than their life, which 1110 00:49:54,560 --> 00:49:57,520 Speaker 1: is such a big part of becoming securely attached, and 1111 00:49:57,560 --> 00:49:59,319 Speaker 1: making sure that they're in a position where they can 1112 00:49:59,560 --> 00:50:02,719 Speaker 1: regulate their nervous system if they're too always in fight 1113 00:50:02,800 --> 00:50:05,120 Speaker 1: or flight or too upregulated all the time and always 1114 00:50:05,160 --> 00:50:07,680 Speaker 1: under pressure, because all of those are key pillars to 1115 00:50:07,719 --> 00:50:11,280 Speaker 1: becoming securely attached. So they're all online, self paced programs. 1116 00:50:11,520 --> 00:50:13,359 Speaker 1: Then we have daily peer support groups so people can 1117 00:50:13,400 --> 00:50:16,040 Speaker 1: come in and out whenever they want, and daily webinars 1118 00:50:16,040 --> 00:50:17,719 Speaker 1: so there's two events a day. People can come in 1119 00:50:17,840 --> 00:50:22,080 Speaker 1: get personalized support from counselors, therapists, coaches, and there are 1120 00:50:22,120 --> 00:50:24,480 Speaker 1: all these guided programs for people to be able to 1121 00:50:24,560 --> 00:50:28,040 Speaker 1: jump in there and get results by engaging the subconscious mind. 1122 00:50:28,440 --> 00:50:30,120 Speaker 2: You just made such a good point because I know 1123 00:50:30,160 --> 00:50:31,920 Speaker 2: a lot of times when I'm talking about attachments, how 1124 00:50:32,040 --> 00:50:35,919 Speaker 2: we're talking about, you know, a romantic relationship. But as 1125 00:50:35,960 --> 00:50:38,880 Speaker 2: I've expressed even in this podcast, like, it goes across 1126 00:50:38,920 --> 00:50:41,719 Speaker 2: the whole board of your life. And so if you 1127 00:50:41,840 --> 00:50:44,920 Speaker 2: feel like you resonate with one attachment style or you're 1128 00:50:44,960 --> 00:50:47,880 Speaker 2: operating in codependency or whatever you want to call it, 1129 00:50:47,880 --> 00:50:50,879 Speaker 2: it's probably not just in your romantic relationships, or that's 1130 00:50:50,880 --> 00:50:52,960 Speaker 2: what I've realized. It's in my friendships, it's in my 1131 00:50:53,080 --> 00:50:56,960 Speaker 2: work relationships, all those dynamics, it's everywhere. So I think 1132 00:50:57,000 --> 00:50:58,480 Speaker 2: it's so great that you guys address that. 1133 00:50:59,320 --> 00:51:00,800 Speaker 3: I love what you said earlier. 1134 00:51:00,800 --> 00:51:02,360 Speaker 1: I thought it was such a good example for people 1135 00:51:02,360 --> 00:51:03,960 Speaker 1: to think when you were like, I'm in a bit 1136 00:51:04,000 --> 00:51:07,280 Speaker 1: of a codependent relationship at work. Yeah, with the way, 1137 00:51:07,600 --> 00:51:10,200 Speaker 1: I was like, that's such a good example because yeah, 1138 00:51:10,360 --> 00:51:13,960 Speaker 1: ultimately your attachment style or codependency that comes with an 1139 00:51:13,960 --> 00:51:16,480 Speaker 1: attachment style, those are your patterns in the relationship to 1140 00:51:16,520 --> 00:51:19,280 Speaker 1: yourself first, and that's why they go with you everywhere 1141 00:51:19,280 --> 00:51:21,680 Speaker 1: because there you're in a relationship to self, so of 1142 00:51:21,680 --> 00:51:24,880 Speaker 1: course that shows up in career or friendships or family 1143 00:51:24,920 --> 00:51:29,399 Speaker 1: relationships and really like all aspects of life. Yes, uh, well, 1144 00:51:29,400 --> 00:51:32,520 Speaker 1: if you guys are resonating at all, I'd totally recommend going. 1145 00:51:32,360 --> 00:51:34,640 Speaker 2: To check out tysis stuff. Where else can people find 1146 00:51:34,680 --> 00:51:36,680 Speaker 2: you if they were interested in just keeping up with 1147 00:51:36,719 --> 00:51:39,120 Speaker 2: your work or talking to you anything like that. 1148 00:51:39,440 --> 00:51:41,280 Speaker 3: Yeah, So I'm on YouTube. 1149 00:51:41,280 --> 00:51:43,920 Speaker 1: We post a daily video on there, it's Personal Development 1150 00:51:43,920 --> 00:51:47,360 Speaker 1: School dash Tye Gibson. And then we are on Instagram. 1151 00:51:47,360 --> 00:51:49,560 Speaker 1: We've just started like being more active on our Instagram 1152 00:51:49,600 --> 00:51:52,600 Speaker 1: channel and then of course at Personal Development School dot com. 1153 00:51:52,800 --> 00:51:54,880 Speaker 2: Okay, amazing, I'll put all of that in the description 1154 00:51:54,960 --> 00:51:57,080 Speaker 2: for of this podcast for you guys. Tey you thank 1155 00:51:57,120 --> 00:51:59,279 Speaker 2: you so much. This was like therapy for me, Like 1156 00:51:59,280 --> 00:52:03,000 Speaker 2: I said, very very helpful for me today especially, so 1157 00:52:03,040 --> 00:52:04,040 Speaker 2: I really appreciate it. 1158 00:52:04,239 --> 00:52:05,560 Speaker 3: Thank you so much for having me. 1159 00:52:05,640 --> 00:52:08,040 Speaker 1: You're amazing, you know so much, And this is such 1160 00:52:08,080 --> 00:52:11,200 Speaker 1: an inspire conversation because of how deep you go into everything. 1161 00:52:11,280 --> 00:52:12,640 Speaker 3: So I love being here. 1162 00:52:12,960 --> 00:52:15,320 Speaker 2: Thank you, Thank you, Thank you guys so much for listening. 1163 00:52:16,000 --> 00:52:17,600 Speaker 3: Thanks for listening to the Velvet's Edge. 1164 00:52:17,600 --> 00:52:20,759 Speaker 1: Podcast with Kelly Henderson, where we believe everyone has a 1165 00:52:20,800 --> 00:52:24,200 Speaker 1: little velvet and a little edge. Subscribe for more conversations 1166 00:52:24,239 --> 00:52:28,520 Speaker 1: on life, style, beauty and relationships. Search Velvet's Edge wherever 1167 00:52:28,560 --> 00:52:29,640 Speaker 1: you get your podcasts.