Speaker 1: Welcome to Wrongful Conviction, False Confessions. I'm Laura and I
Speaker 1: writer and I'm Steve Drissen. Today we'll tell you about
Speaker 1: a Michigan murder case with an unusual suspect, a small
Speaker 1: town police officer named Ray McCann. After Ray helped investigate
Speaker 1: the disappearance of a little girl, he was wrongfully accused
Speaker 1: of her murder, cops turned on one of their own
Speaker 1: in one of the worst cases of tunnel vision we've seen.
Speaker 1: In pursuit of their only suspect, police turn Ray's whole
Speaker 1: life into an interrogation room.
Speaker 2: One of the things we've tried to do this season
Speaker 2: is to show that you don't need a full confession
Speaker 2: in order to bring charges against somebody. A false admission
Speaker 2: that implicates you in the crime, or a false statement
Speaker 2: of fact, a lie in this case could bring the
Speaker 2: weight of the system down against an innocent person. And
Speaker 2: all of that stems from what happens in the interrogation room.
Speaker 1: Police have so much power over what you say in
Speaker 1: the interrogation room and the way in which what you
Speaker 1: say can be used against you in court. It's that
Speaker 1: power and the misuse of that power that's what Ray
Speaker 1: McCann's case.
Speaker 2: Is all about We've seen tunnel vision in other cases,
Speaker 2: but I've never seen tunnel vision that was this extreme,
Speaker 2: this longstanding, and that included coercion both in and outside
Speaker 2: of the interrogation room.
Speaker 1: You have the police officers lying, right. The police officers
Speaker 1: don't get charged. It's Ray who gets charged. I mean,
Speaker 1: this is asymmetric warfare.
Speaker 2: Right, And it becomes even more asymmetrical when they charge
Speaker 2: him with perjury. Ray mccannn a reserve police officer who
Speaker 2: all he wanted to do was assist police. All he
Speaker 2: wanted to do was to be a police officer. They
Speaker 2: ran him over like a truck.
Speaker 1: Today's story starts in Constantine, Michigan, a small town of
Speaker 1: two thousand people in the southern corner of the state.
Speaker 1: Constantine is an old fashioned dairy farming community, the kind
Speaker 1: of place that looks like time stopped a half century ago.
Speaker 1: The town's historic main street is lined with shops that
Speaker 1: have been kept immaculate for decades. Annual events like the
Speaker 1: car show and barbecue cookoff are marked on everyone's calendar.
Speaker 1: But in the autumn of two thousand and seven, this
Speaker 1: Michigan town was hit by a crime that no one
Speaker 1: could have expected. It was November eighth, four forty five,
Speaker 1: in the afternoon, only an hour before sunset. Eleven year
Speaker 1: old Jody Perrick left her friend's house on her bike
Speaker 1: and headed for dinner at home a half mile away.
Speaker 1: But when Joe he didn't arrive on time, her mom
Speaker 1: called the police, and words spread fast. As the sun
Speaker 1: went down and temperatures plummeted too, it seemed like the
Speaker 1: whole town was out searching for Jody. Joining the search
Speaker 1: was Ray McCann, a forty year old family man born
Speaker 1: and raised in Constantine. Ray was a reserve police officer
Speaker 1: who hoped one day to join the Michigan State Police.
Speaker 1: He wasn't a full fledged cop, but he was allowed
Speaker 1: to carry a badge and do basic police work like
Speaker 1: making traffic stops and searching for missing people. In this
Speaker 1: particular missing person case, Ray's son was good friends with Jody,
Speaker 1: so Ray didn't have to be asked twice to help
Speaker 1: look for her. Along with many of his neighbors, Ray
Speaker 1: threw on a coat and went out to look for Jody.
Speaker 1: He searched high and low at the baseball field, at
Speaker 1: the Dollar General, even at a local riverside walking trail
Speaker 1: called the tumble Dam Path. Others searched elsewhere, but no
Speaker 1: luck for anyone, no Jody. Around ten thirty at night,
Speaker 1: Ray met up with Jody's mom to talk about where
Speaker 1: they should look next. That's when Ray McCann asked if
Speaker 1: anyone had searched the cemetery. No one had, so Jody's
Speaker 1: mom headed that way, followed by Ray in another car.
Speaker 1: The cemetery is where they found Jody. She'd been sexually
Speaker 1: assaulted and strangled to death. Her bike was lying next
Speaker 1: to her on the ground. Jody's mom bent down tried
Speaker 1: to embrace her daughter's body, but Ray knew this was
Speaker 1: a crime scene that shouldn't be disturbed. He gently guided
Speaker 1: her away from Jody's body and sat her down in
Speaker 1: her car. The police arrived quickly at the scene, but
Speaker 1: as they hunted for leeds, they locked almost immediately onto
Speaker 1: Ray McCann as a suspect because Ray had been the
Speaker 1: person who suggested searching the cemetery. Based on that coincidence,
Speaker 1: police questioned Ray that night. He adamantly denied involvement in
Speaker 1: this horrible crime. Somehow, though reserve off Sir Ray McCann
Speaker 1: became the sole suspect, the only person police focused on
Speaker 1: for the next five years.
Speaker 2: When someone discovers a body, they're going to be a
Speaker 2: person of interest in a police investigation because of their
Speaker 2: proximity to the crime. It's a basis for wanting to
Speaker 2: question somebody about what they were doing on the evening
Speaker 2: in question. But they focused on him as the sole
Speaker 2: and exclusive suspect, and they did so because they grew desperate.
Speaker 2: This is a crime that is absolutely devastating to this community,
Speaker 2: and police did everything in their power to close that
Speaker 2: vice on Ray.
Speaker 1: Now, it's not like there was any evidence against Ray.
Speaker 1: Police compared Ray's DNA to the DNA left on Jody's body,
Speaker 1: but it didn't match. No physical evidence implicated him, and
Speaker 1: no eyewitnesses had identified him. But as Jody's murders sat
Speaker 1: unsolved for years, pressure escalated on the authorities to come
Speaker 1: up with a culprit. After a new police chief was
Speaker 1: elected in twenty ten, new investigators were assigned to the case,
Speaker 1: and they immediately doubled down on prime suspect Ray McCann.
Speaker 1: Over the next few years, police interrogated Ray more than
Speaker 1: twenty times. Again and again, police asked him to describe
Speaker 1: what he did on the night of Jody's disappearance, where
Speaker 1: he searched, who he talked to. During these interrogations, police
Speaker 1: gradually but relentlessly upped the ante. The evidence against you
Speaker 1: was insurmountable.
Speaker 3: They told him, we know scientifically that you touched her body.
Speaker 2: Oh God, no, I did not, and your people whatever,
Speaker 2: you can think that out of thinking that it's.
Speaker 1: Proven now, that was a lie. But these kinds of
Speaker 1: lies can be extremely coercive, even on a cop, even
Speaker 1: on someone like Ray McCann.
Speaker 3: You guys can do all you're talking and talking to
Speaker 3: talk and talking, but you know what, I did my
Speaker 3: job that night.
Speaker 4: I wish I knew what half dor because then I
Speaker 4: guess we wouldn't be having this conversation.
Speaker 2: The way they questioned Ray was for one purpose, and
Speaker 2: one purpose only, to get him to give them information
Speaker 2: that they could use to charge him with this prayer.
Speaker 1: And Ray called them out about that.
Speaker 2: Too, over and over again.
Speaker 4: I don't know what you're trying to do. Give me,
Speaker 4: Confessa something I didn't they have no power of, and now.
Speaker 3: You guys are doing in the air.
Speaker 1: That's the thing. He knew exactly what they were doing.
Speaker 1: He's a cop.
Speaker 2: You want me to admit to something I didn't do,
Speaker 2: I'm not gonna do it.
Speaker 4: You want a confession that I can't give you. I
Speaker 4: didn't find or I didn't put it there, didn't kill her.
Speaker 3: I did.
Speaker 1: But the more Ray insisted on his innocence, the more
Speaker 1: police became obsessed with proving him guilty. Here's the really
Speaker 1: twisted thing. Their obsession began to spread beyond the interrogation room.
Speaker 1: They blamed Ray for Jody's death in the local media,
Speaker 1: ruined his reputation, and they viciously attacked his personal life.
Speaker 1: Police tracked down Ray's friends and relatives and worked to
Speaker 1: turn them against him. Police told Ray's family that physical
Speaker 1: evidence DNA proved he had killed Jody, even though that
Speaker 1: wasn't true, and they went even further for no clear reason.
Speaker 1: They told Ray's wife that he'd been unfaithful. They falsely
Speaker 1: told Ray's teenage son, the one who'd been friends with
Speaker 1: Jody when he was younger, that his dad was a
Speaker 1: drug addict. They also told the boy that his dad
Speaker 1: was visiting online chat rooms the worst kind I guess
Speaker 1: that these cops could imagine. Just listen to this.
Speaker 3: The computer shows activity in a chat room regularly of
Speaker 3: gay nature, homosexual behavior, talking about how this man on
Speaker 3: man sexual encounter is going to go, and then how
Speaker 3: it did go.
Speaker 1: There's been no signs of any of that personally from that,
Speaker 1: I haven't seen anything like that.
Speaker 3: Okay, is there any part of you at all that
Speaker 3: questions your dad's sexuality.
Speaker 1: Or what you're saying is absolutely honest to God?
Speaker 5: True?
Speaker 3: I can tell you that it is your computer. I
Speaker 3: took it off there.
Speaker 1: Yeah, then yeah, of course it's going to make me
Speaker 1: question it. None of this was honest to God true.
Speaker 1: The cops were lying again, and that's bad enough, But
Speaker 1: the fact that they equated visiting gay chat rooms with
Speaker 1: raping and killing an eleven year old girl, I'm sorry,
Speaker 1: but that's beyond offensive in any event. Until Ray confessed,
Speaker 1: police were hell bent on taking his life apart peace
Speaker 1: by piece, and I guess this cop thought that telling
Speaker 1: Ray's teenage son that his dad was gay would be
Speaker 1: a good way to accomplish that.
Speaker 2: Their purpose was to make life for Ray McCann in Constantine, Michigan, unendurable,
Speaker 2: to make his life so miserable and so painful that
Speaker 2: they could bring him to a place where he could
Speaker 2: confess to killing Jody Parrick.
Speaker 1: Despite all this, years go by and Ray doesn't confess. Finally,
Speaker 1: the cops had to plan. They'll file charges against Ray
Speaker 1: and see if that gets him to admit guilt. An
Speaker 1: officer is caught saying as much during a taped interview
Speaker 1: with Ray's wife. He's going to have to be charged.
Speaker 1: The officer says, he'll get so scared he'll talk. It
Speaker 1: may just come to that.
Speaker 2: At a certain point in time, they should have realized
Speaker 2: that Ray had nothing to do with this, and there
Speaker 2: were all kinds of reasons for them to believe that,
Speaker 2: beginning with the DNA evidence, But they didn't care one
Speaker 2: bit about Ray. This was the first time that I
Speaker 2: had seen tunnel vision so take over law enforcement officers
Speaker 2: that they were willing to sacrifice the life of another
Speaker 2: officer to close a case.
Speaker 1: Now, the police didn't have any evidence against Ray would
Speaker 1: allow them to charge him with murder, so they came
Speaker 1: up with a different plan and different charges. In twenty twelve,
Speaker 1: police served Ray mccannn with an investigative subpoena requiring him
Speaker 1: to answer questions yet again about the night Jody disappeared.
Speaker 1: Five years earlier because of the subpoena, though this time
Speaker 1: Ray had to give answers under oath.
Speaker 2: Ray did bring a lawyer with him. By this point
Speaker 2: in time, Gray's reputation in the community was so damaged,
Speaker 2: so tarnished. He couldn't go anywhere without people looking at
Speaker 2: him as if he had killed Jody Parrick. So the
Speaker 2: lawyer advised him to go in and talk to the
Speaker 2: authorities as a way to maybe put an end to this.
Speaker 1: The police's subpoena strategy worked. It did put an end
Speaker 1: to the harassment, but not the end Ray had hoped for.
Speaker 1: After the interview, on July seventeenth, twenty fourteen, prosecutors accused
Speaker 1: Ray McCann of lying under oath and charged him with
Speaker 1: five counts of perjury. He was arrested and thrown into
Speaker 1: the local jail. So did Ray McCann lie under oath.
Speaker 1: Four of the five perjury charges were based on incredibly
Speaker 1: minor inconsistencies between the details Ray remembered about the knight
Speaker 1: Jodi died five years earlier, and the details that other
Speaker 1: people remembered.
Speaker 5: You know, what stands out to me in this story
Speaker 5: is how a completely innocent man who is just out
Speaker 5: trying to help got caught up in this web of
Speaker 5: lies that was spun by the detectives. It's unbelievable that
Speaker 5: that could have happened and frightening.
Speaker 1: That's Ken Colker, a journalist based in Grand Rapids, Michigan.
Speaker 1: He's been covering Ray McCann's case for years.
Speaker 5: I'm an investigative reporter, so my job is to just
Speaker 5: sniff around and look for things that seem wrong. You know,
Speaker 5: the perjury charges seemed totally unfounded. I mean, if somebody
Speaker 5: asked me what I had for lunch, I might say
Speaker 5: taco bell, but maybe it wasn't and is that really
Speaker 5: a lie.
Speaker 1: Here's one example of what Ray was charged with under oath.
Speaker 1: Ray McCann said that at one point while he was searching,
Speaker 1: he saw Jody's mom with a blonde haired kid, and
Speaker 1: he thought Jody had been found. He testified that he
Speaker 1: said to Jody's mom, oh good, you found her.
Speaker 2: Now.
Speaker 1: Everyone agreed that a local seventh grader with blonde hair
Speaker 1: named Katie was with Jody's mom during the search, but
Speaker 1: Jody's mom couldn't remember whether five years earlier Ray had said,
Speaker 1: oh good, you found her. One of these perjury charges
Speaker 1: was based on this so called discrepancy. Here's another example.
Speaker 1: Police told Ray they found his DNA on Jody's body,
Speaker 1: even though that was a lie. In a desperate attempt
Speaker 1: to provide some explanation, Ray made a guest. Yes, he
Speaker 1: thought back to the moment he and Jody's mom discovered
Speaker 1: her little girl's body. He remembered guiding Jody's mom away
Speaker 1: and helping her sit down in her car. Maybe sometime
Speaker 1: later the mother had been grieving over her daughter's body.
Speaker 1: He said, maybe his DNA had been transferred from Jody's
Speaker 1: mom to the little girl. But five years after the fact,
Speaker 1: Jody's mom didn't remember Ray pulling her away, or taking
Speaker 1: her to the car, or much of anything else from
Speaker 1: that terrible moment. So the cops charged Ray with another
Speaker 1: count of perjury.
Speaker 5: What's interesting is that Ray McCann was a reserved police
Speaker 5: officer and for some reason they turned on him. That's
Speaker 5: the suspect they're focused on. So they're just hammering and
Speaker 5: hammering and telling him far more lies than they claim
Speaker 5: he told them.
Speaker 2: Ray's history as a police officer may have offered him
Speaker 2: some protection against a false confession, but it couldn't protect
Speaker 2: him against another weapon in the police officers arsenal, the
Speaker 2: weapon of perjury. In Ray's case, they turned a series
Speaker 2: of inconsistencies in his statements over a five year period
Speaker 2: into perjurious lies. The penalties for perjury in Michigan are extreme,
Speaker 2: and they charged him with five counts of perjury.
Speaker 5: So under investigative subpoena, especially in a murder case, telling
Speaker 5: a lie of police is actually punishable by up to
Speaker 5: life in prison. The punishment is as bad as if
Speaker 5: you committed the crime.
Speaker 1: Four of those five charges were based on ridiculous inconsistencies,
Speaker 1: like the ones we've talked about. The fifth charge, though,
Speaker 1: was different. The fifth charge was based on Ray's sworn
Speaker 1: statement that he'd searched for Jody near that riverside walking trail,
Speaker 1: the tumble Dam path.
Speaker 5: They claimed, well, that's a lie, because we've got video
Speaker 5: showing that nobody went to the tumble Dam that time
Speaker 5: of night. We don't see your car, we don't see
Speaker 5: your headlights or whatever. There was a video camera on
Speaker 5: this nearby creamery that supposedly was aimed right at the
Speaker 5: tumble Dam. And the quote unquote lie that they got
Speaker 5: him on was the fact that he said he was
Speaker 5: at the tumble Dam, but the surveillance video proved he
Speaker 5: wasn't there.
Speaker 1: Police claimed that video proved Ray was lying. In fact,
Speaker 1: an officer even took the stand at Ray's first court
Speaker 1: hearing and swore that this video proved Ray had committed perjury.
Speaker 1: For his part, Ray couldn't figure it out. He knew
Speaker 1: he'd gone to the tumble Dam path that night to
Speaker 1: search for Jody. But his trial approached and five possible
Speaker 1: life sentences loomed, Ray finally broke He didn't confess to
Speaker 1: killing Jody. Instead, on March twentieth, twenty fifteen, he pled
Speaker 1: no contest to that fifth perjury charge.
Speaker 2: A no contest plea is an admission that the state
Speaker 2: has sufficient evidence against you to convict you. As a
Speaker 2: matter of law, it's treated within the system just as
Speaker 2: any other guilty plea would be treated.
Speaker 1: For that plea of no contest to perjury, Ray received
Speaker 1: a sentence of twenty months in prison. In exchange, the
Speaker 1: state dropped the other four charges. They hadn't gotten Ray
Speaker 1: for murder, but they'd gotten him for something, and I
Speaker 1: guess that was good enough. Fast forward five months after
Speaker 1: Ray entered his plea to August twenty fifteen, Ray was
Speaker 1: in prison serving his perjury sentence, and every day was horrific.
Speaker 5: He was a suspected child rapist and killer, and he
Speaker 5: talked about, you know what other prisoners do to child
Speaker 5: rapists and killers. He got dragged off of his bunk
Speaker 5: one night, got smashed over the head with what he
Speaker 5: thinks was a padlock, and somebody tried to gouge his
Speaker 5: eyes out. I mean, that's what happened to the poor
Speaker 5: guy in prison.
Speaker 1: While Ray suffered, there was a development. A man named
Speaker 1: Daniel Furlong, who lived one town over from Constantine, lured
Speaker 1: a ten year old girl into his garage and attacked her.
Speaker 1: She escaped, thank god, and was able to lead police
Speaker 1: to Furlong's door. They arrested him and took his DNA
Speaker 1: and what did it match? The DNA left eight years
Speaker 1: earlier on Jody Perick's body. Police questioned Daniel Furlong on
Speaker 1: October eighteenth, twenty fifteen, and he admitted that he'd raped
Speaker 1: and killed Jody. Furlong used to live in Constantine, a
Speaker 1: few blocks away from the Parick family. When he saw
Speaker 1: Jody riding by on her bike, he lured her into
Speaker 1: his garage, just like the other girl. That's where he
Speaker 1: assaulted and killed Jody. And he did it all alone.
Speaker 1: Furlong told investigators he didn't know Ray McCann.
Speaker 5: We saw the videotape of police interviewing Daniel Furlong, and
Speaker 5: they were a lot nicer to him than they were
Speaker 5: to Ray McCann. They asked Furlong, so what did you
Speaker 5: think when you saw that in a newspaper that they
Speaker 5: were focusing on Ray McCann, And he thought, well, I'm
Speaker 5: in the clear.
Speaker 2: So, in other words, the fact that the police had
Speaker 2: pursued this wrongful prosecution of Ray made Furlong feel enough
Speaker 2: comfort to strike again, and that blew me away.
Speaker 1: It was crystal clear Ray McCann was never involved in
Speaker 1: Jody's disappearance. All he did was try to help a
Speaker 1: distraught mom find her missing kid. The police's suspicions about
Speaker 1: Ray had been wrong from the start. In November twenty fifteen,
Speaker 1: Daniel Furlong pled guilty to killing Jody Perrick by himself
Speaker 1: and received a sentence of thirty to sixty years, but
Speaker 1: the state wasn't ready to exonerate Ray mc cann. Not yet.
Speaker 1: Ray had been convicted of perjury, and the state insisted
Speaker 1: that even if Ray hadn't committed murder, he had still
Speaker 1: lied under oath.
Speaker 5: I started in this case because we were doing stories
Speaker 5: about the real killer who confessed and was getting sentenced
Speaker 5: to prison, and nobody was talking about what happened to
Speaker 5: Ray McCann. It's like, well, what about this guy who
Speaker 5: had nothing to do with it.
Speaker 1: In December twenty fifteen, Ray was paroled from a Michigan
Speaker 1: prison after serving his sentence. He was still a convicted felon,
Speaker 1: a perjurer in the eyes of the law. It was
Speaker 1: right around that time that his case came across Steve's desk.
Speaker 2: Ray had been out of prison for a few months.
Speaker 2: He was having a hard time reintegrating back in the community.
Speaker 2: The police officers were still suggesting to the general public
Speaker 2: that he knew things about this crime and he had
Speaker 2: spent twenty months locked up for something he didn't do.
Speaker 2: Thank God for Ken Colker for taking the interest to
Speaker 2: tell this story about Ray, because if it wasn't for him,
Speaker 2: I never would have known about the case.
Speaker 5: I had seemed the work done by this Center for
Speaker 5: Wrongful Convictions at Northwestern End I just reached out to
Speaker 5: Steve and said, here's an interesting case.
Speaker 2: I was so angry at what these law enforcement officers
Speaker 2: had done to Ray, and so I called up the
Speaker 2: Michigan Innocence Clinic at the University of Michigan Law School,
Speaker 2: and I said, will you work on this case with me.
Speaker 1: The legal team's task was to prove Ray innocence of
Speaker 1: the only perjury charge he'd been convicted of. That was
Speaker 1: the charge where the police had sworn under oath that
Speaker 1: they had a surveillance tape showing the tumble Dam path,
Speaker 1: a video that they said proved Ray had lied about
Speaker 1: going there to search for Jody Well. Ken Kolker got
Speaker 1: a hold of a copy of that videotape.
Speaker 5: I remember going down to Ray McCann's home and meeting
Speaker 5: Stephen Drisen down there. Yeah, that was like a could
Speaker 5: have been a scene in a movie, actually standing around
Speaker 5: this dining room table with my laptop open watching this
Speaker 5: video that would eventually lead to Ray mccannn's case being dismissed.
Speaker 2: What we saw was that you couldn't see anything from
Speaker 2: the camera footage. It was simply too dark to make
Speaker 2: out what kinds of cars were on the street, whether
Speaker 2: there were any people on the street.
Speaker 1: You couldn't see the tumble dawn path at all, let
Speaker 1: alone who was walking on it. So the legal team
Speaker 1: actually went to the creamery, the business that had taken
Speaker 1: the surveillance video, and looked at their security camera. The
Speaker 1: creamery owner assured them that the camera hadn't been moved
Speaker 1: since the night of Jody's disappearance.
Speaker 5: The video camera wasn't even aimed at the dam The
Speaker 5: surveillance camera that they claimed showed he wasn't there was
Speaker 5: aimed elsewhere. I wish I'd have been the one that
Speaker 5: noticed that.
Speaker 2: Under no circumstances could the creamery camera footage have proven
Speaker 2: that that Ray was not at the tumble damn path.
Speaker 1: The whole damn thing was made up.
Speaker 2: It was a lie. The video was essentially worthless as evidence.
Speaker 1: This video certainly didn't prove that Ray McCann had lied
Speaker 1: under oath. Instead, what it proved was that the police
Speaker 1: were the ones who had lied. In order to convict him.
Speaker 2: Ray's wish had come true. He needed to have some
Speaker 2: kind of evidence to demonstrate that he didn't lie at all,
Speaker 2: but that the police officers were lying, and that camera
Speaker 2: footage proved it.
Speaker 1: Based on that video. Ray's attorneys filed a motion for relief,
Speaker 1: and on December seventh, twenty seventeen, the court threw out
Speaker 1: Ray's perjury conviction. Ray McCann was innocent of the murder
Speaker 1: and innocent of perjury. He was exonerated.
Speaker 5: The prosecutor decided not to fight it and to allow
Speaker 5: the judge to dismiss the case. And I just felt
Speaker 5: great for Ray. I mean, you can't take away the
Speaker 5: twenty months that he's spent in prison, but you know,
Speaker 5: at least he was able to clear his name.
Speaker 1: That was the end of Ray McCann's legal ordeal. But
Speaker 1: what happened to the officers who lied to convict him? Okay, Steve,
Speaker 1: So I'm really hoping you're going to tell us that
Speaker 1: after Ray was exonerated, these cops were tried for perjury.
Speaker 2: I wish I could tell you that, But nothing has
Speaker 2: happened to these police officers. The prosecutor eventually ended up
Speaker 2: losing in his next election, but these police officers have
Speaker 2: never faced any consequences.
Speaker 1: They were the ones who lied, not Ray. They were
Speaker 1: the ones who should have gone down for perjury.
Speaker 2: That's the ultimate irony here.
Speaker 1: And what about Ray McCann. What's life like for him?
Speaker 2: Now?
Speaker 1: In many ways, it's still really hard.
Speaker 5: I mean, they took a lot away from this guy.
Speaker 5: He barely talks to one of his sons, this wife
Speaker 5: divorced him, he missed the birth of a grandchild. I'm
Speaker 5: sure there are people in that town who still think
Speaker 5: Ray McCann had something to do with it. And so,
Speaker 5: you know, his name is, in some people's eyes, is
Speaker 5: still mud and constantine.
Speaker 1: The only thing Ray McCann ever wanted was to find
Speaker 1: the killer of Jody Perick, and that's been accomplished. Now
Speaker 1: raise free to put his life back together as best
Speaker 1: he can.
Speaker 4: Ray.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Oh hey, Ray, it's Laura.
Speaker 2: How are you doing pretty good?
Speaker 1: So you're living up north in Michigan. Have you got
Speaker 1: snow on the ground yet?
Speaker 4: Yeah? Actually just got some yesterday. I want to go
Speaker 4: get some wood and stuff, and all of a sudden
Speaker 4: it start coming back.
Speaker 1: Tell me about your wife, Ray, I'm delighted to hear
Speaker 1: that you're married.
Speaker 4: Yeah, we got married in April twelfth. I actually on
Speaker 4: my dad's birthday in twenty eighteen.
Speaker 1: Well that's a beautiful way to honor your dad. How
Speaker 1: did you meet your wife.
Speaker 4: We work together. If she caught my eye right.
Speaker 2: Away, you must have caught her eye too.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I must have done something right. We were actually
Speaker 4: in southwest Michigan there for a while, and we made
Speaker 4: a decision to start a new life somewhere else because
Speaker 4: it just, you know, it was hard for me. It's
Speaker 4: been going a lot better since we made the move
Speaker 4: up here. It really has I struggle at times, you know,
Speaker 4: I met that I go through a lot of depression.
Speaker 4: My wife knows I go through that, and she's there
Speaker 4: for me. I am so thankful to my daughter Ashley.
Speaker 4: She wasn't with me the whole time this was going
Speaker 4: on and still is with me. And I just love
Speaker 4: you know, the grandkids. They keep it busy, that's for sure.
Speaker 1: You're a good man, Ray, and a survivor. Steve and
Speaker 1: I are with you all the way.
Speaker 2: One of the jobs that we as innocence lawyers have
Speaker 2: is to try to tell the story of our clients
Speaker 2: in a way that can bring them back some measure
Speaker 2: of their reputation. To tell the story in a way
Speaker 2: that makes it abundantly clear that Ray McCann is innocent.
Speaker 1: We can't undo the trauma that Ray experienced, but at
Speaker 1: least we can establish that he never committed the crime
Speaker 1: he was accused of. In fact, a crime was committed
Speaker 1: against him.
Speaker 2: One of the arguments against allowing police officers to lie
Speaker 2: during interrogations is that it creates a culture in which
Speaker 2: lying is acceptable not only during interrogations, but when police
Speaker 2: officers come into court and testify about cases, and that
Speaker 2: may very well have been what happened here.
Speaker 1: You're allowed to lie to get a confession, why not
Speaker 1: lie to get a conviction.
Speaker 2: It's one of the strongest arguments for banning deception during
Speaker 2: police interrogations.
Speaker 1: When you allow police to lie, that sends a message
Speaker 1: that truthfulness is not essential to the task of enforcing
Speaker 1: the law, and of course it is. It's vital. And
Speaker 1: that's the story of Ray McCann. Join us next week
Speaker 1: when we take you to Ada, Oklahoma to tell you
Speaker 1: about Tommy Ward. After detectives learned about a strange dream
Speaker 1: he had, Tommy was accused of a local woman's murder
Speaker 1: and found himself on death row. Tommy remains behind bars
Speaker 1: to this day, but a team of lawyers, including our
Speaker 1: Center on Wrongful Convictions, is fighting to end Tommy's Nightmare.
Speaker 1: Wrongful Conviction, False Confessions is a production of Lava for
Speaker 1: Good Podcasts in association with Signal Company Number one Special
Speaker 1: thanks to our executive producers Jason Flamm and Kevin Wardis.
Speaker 1: Our production team is headed by senior producer Ann Pope
Speaker 1: along with producers Joshi Hammer and Jess Shane. Our show
Speaker 1: is mixed by Genie Montalvo. John Colbert is our intrepid intern.
Speaker 1: Our music was composed by Jay Ralph. You can follow
Speaker 1: me on Instagram or Twitter at Laura and iRider, and you.
Speaker 2: Can follow me on twist s Drizzen.
Speaker 1: For more information on the show, visit wrongfulconvictionpodcast dot com.
Speaker 1: Be sure to follow the show on Instagram at Wrongful Conviction,
Speaker 1: on Facebook at Wrongful Conviction Podcast, and on Twitter at
Speaker 1: wrong Conviction