1 00:00:05,960 --> 00:00:08,399 Speaker 1: Hi, there, Rain Drove. So before we get to the 2 00:00:08,480 --> 00:00:13,360 Speaker 1: episode of Evane K. Williams and I recapping what's happening 3 00:00:14,000 --> 00:00:17,279 Speaker 1: with Dr Wendyocepho and her husband Eddiocepho. 4 00:00:17,920 --> 00:00:20,480 Speaker 2: I first want to start r by breaking. 5 00:00:20,120 --> 00:00:25,840 Speaker 1: The news that Wendy has officially resigned. She did not 6 00:00:25,960 --> 00:00:32,280 Speaker 1: get fire, Okay, but doctor Wendy has resigned from West 7 00:00:32,360 --> 00:00:38,920 Speaker 1: Lehand University amid fraud charges. The reality star and political 8 00:00:39,000 --> 00:00:45,840 Speaker 1: commentator was previously announced as a distinguished visiting professor at 9 00:00:45,840 --> 00:00:53,520 Speaker 1: the private Connecticut institution. So this news broke today, Okay, 10 00:00:53,840 --> 00:00:57,840 Speaker 1: So this is what's going on. Doctor Wendyocepho, in a 11 00:00:57,920 --> 00:01:03,400 Speaker 1: statement to People Magazine on behalf of her spokesperson wanted 12 00:01:03,400 --> 00:01:07,919 Speaker 1: to clarify that doctor Wendy was not fired. Okay, news 13 00:01:07,920 --> 00:01:10,959 Speaker 1: broke that she was fired. But this is what her 14 00:01:11,160 --> 00:01:15,640 Speaker 1: spokesperson has to say about it, and I quote. Contrary 15 00:01:15,680 --> 00:01:20,360 Speaker 1: to recent media reports, doctor Wendy Osepha was not terminated 16 00:01:20,880 --> 00:01:26,400 Speaker 1: from a faculty position at West Lean University. She formally 17 00:01:26,440 --> 00:01:33,000 Speaker 1: submitted her letter of resignation prior to any public announcement 18 00:01:33,760 --> 00:01:40,640 Speaker 1: made by the university. Doctor Oceppha made the voluntary decision 19 00:01:41,200 --> 00:01:44,680 Speaker 1: to step down from her role. This decision was made 20 00:01:44,760 --> 00:01:52,080 Speaker 1: independently and communicated directly to the university before any external 21 00:01:52,200 --> 00:01:58,680 Speaker 1: reports surfaced. Now, the reason why they're saying in the 22 00:01:58,760 --> 00:02:05,360 Speaker 1: statement that doctor Wendy resigned before any external reports surface, 23 00:02:06,000 --> 00:02:12,120 Speaker 1: it's because was Lean University. They did confirm Oseppho's resignation 24 00:02:12,919 --> 00:02:17,960 Speaker 1: by telling People magazine Wendy Oceppho is no longer an 25 00:02:17,960 --> 00:02:22,919 Speaker 1: employee of west Lean University. She resigned from her position. 26 00:02:23,880 --> 00:02:27,760 Speaker 1: So prior to that, news were saying that she was fired, 27 00:02:28,320 --> 00:02:32,480 Speaker 1: so they wanted to clear that up. So again, doctor 28 00:02:32,480 --> 00:02:40,000 Speaker 1: Wendy did not get fired, She actually resigned. Now what 29 00:02:40,080 --> 00:02:42,200 Speaker 1: is so fast that I think about all of this 30 00:02:42,440 --> 00:02:45,679 Speaker 1: is the fact that doctor Wendy was supposed to teach 31 00:02:45,720 --> 00:02:52,160 Speaker 1: a class that she wrote up calling it the Sociology 32 00:02:52,400 --> 00:02:58,800 Speaker 1: of Reality TV. At that time, she spoke highly of 33 00:02:58,840 --> 00:03:03,560 Speaker 1: her relationship with wes Lean University as she reflected on 34 00:03:03,720 --> 00:03:08,960 Speaker 1: past teaching positions where she did not feel appreciated. In 35 00:03:08,960 --> 00:03:13,720 Speaker 1: a November interview back in twenty twenty four, doctor Wendy 36 00:03:13,760 --> 00:03:17,519 Speaker 1: did say, I didn't feel like people saw the value 37 00:03:17,560 --> 00:03:20,880 Speaker 1: in what I brought to the institution, But for wes 38 00:03:21,000 --> 00:03:25,200 Speaker 1: Lean as much prestige as they have to see me 39 00:03:25,400 --> 00:03:26,320 Speaker 1: and to say. 40 00:03:27,639 --> 00:03:30,920 Speaker 3: Not only do we want you, but we want you. 41 00:03:30,919 --> 00:03:36,360 Speaker 1: To have a title of distinguished professor. I was like 42 00:03:36,480 --> 00:03:43,240 Speaker 1: this as a sign. So, of course this is all 43 00:03:43,360 --> 00:03:47,680 Speaker 1: unfortunate news. As more reports are detailing whether or not 44 00:03:49,360 --> 00:03:55,560 Speaker 1: doctor Wendy will continue promoting this season of Potomac. As 45 00:03:55,600 --> 00:04:00,200 Speaker 1: I've recorded a Monday Night Live with Dustin and Claudia. 46 00:04:00,680 --> 00:04:03,360 Speaker 1: Doctor Wendy this week was supposed to appear and watch 47 00:04:03,400 --> 00:04:06,920 Speaker 1: What Happens Live and have pressed in New York. Her 48 00:04:07,040 --> 00:04:13,960 Speaker 1: episode on Watching Happens Live is being replaced by KK 49 00:04:14,120 --> 00:04:19,080 Speaker 1: coming on the show instead of Wendy. What has also 50 00:04:19,400 --> 00:04:24,800 Speaker 1: sort of been revealed due to stacy Instagram posts, it 51 00:04:24,880 --> 00:04:28,880 Speaker 1: appears that the Potomac Ladies are shooting their APPA show. 52 00:04:30,680 --> 00:04:35,159 Speaker 1: Stacy posted a video on a set that appears to 53 00:04:35,200 --> 00:04:40,559 Speaker 1: be the after show where one or two or three 54 00:04:41,040 --> 00:04:46,479 Speaker 1: housewives come together separately to give us the audience their 55 00:04:46,520 --> 00:04:51,839 Speaker 1: thoughts on each episode and that airs exclusively on Peacock. 56 00:04:52,480 --> 00:04:56,480 Speaker 1: We did see Stacy by herself, we do not know 57 00:04:56,560 --> 00:05:00,840 Speaker 1: whether or not Wendy was also there, so we don't 58 00:05:00,880 --> 00:05:08,560 Speaker 1: know if Wendy has started filming back on Potomac Base 59 00:05:08,640 --> 00:05:12,200 Speaker 1: on what's been happening so far, and we don't know whether 60 00:05:12,279 --> 00:05:16,920 Speaker 1: or not Wendy has committed to her duties on taping 61 00:05:16,960 --> 00:05:21,080 Speaker 1: the after show as well. What we do know as 62 00:05:21,120 --> 00:05:24,520 Speaker 1: of now is Wife Swap now has a premiere date. 63 00:05:25,520 --> 00:05:28,960 Speaker 1: As you all know, the episode of White Swap was 64 00:05:29,000 --> 00:05:33,280 Speaker 1: supposed to be Doctor Wendy as their premiere episode. The 65 00:05:33,360 --> 00:05:38,479 Speaker 1: network has since decided to pull her episode. They delayed 66 00:05:38,480 --> 00:05:41,839 Speaker 1: the premiere. It is now happening Tuesday, October twenty first 67 00:05:42,440 --> 00:05:47,640 Speaker 1: at nine pm easterd and the episode will be Angie 68 00:05:47,880 --> 00:05:52,560 Speaker 1: from the Real Housewives of Salt Lake City, So that 69 00:05:52,600 --> 00:05:55,640 Speaker 1: will be the premiere episode of White Swap. This is 70 00:05:55,680 --> 00:05:59,880 Speaker 1: a four episode special. As of today, we do not 71 00:06:00,240 --> 00:06:06,040 Speaker 1: know whether or not Doctors Wendy's episode will make air 72 00:06:06,960 --> 00:06:10,760 Speaker 1: so without y'all all know always say this wrong, so 73 00:06:10,760 --> 00:06:15,120 Speaker 1: I'm gonna give it right without much further ado, I 74 00:06:15,160 --> 00:06:19,000 Speaker 1: think I survived that child. Here is M. D. K. 75 00:06:19,200 --> 00:06:24,640 Speaker 1: Williams and I on the Doctor Wendy and Eddie cakese Hey, 76 00:06:24,720 --> 00:06:28,400 Speaker 1: rain Dross, I mean listen. Ever since news broke. 77 00:06:28,200 --> 00:06:33,960 Speaker 4: Out about Doctor Wendy and Eddie Osepho, my timeline has 78 00:06:34,000 --> 00:06:38,919 Speaker 4: been blowing up tremendously and I'm pretty sure hers as well, 79 00:06:39,040 --> 00:06:42,200 Speaker 4: which made me feel good the fact that my audience 80 00:06:42,240 --> 00:06:45,760 Speaker 4: in the world really only cared to hear about Emny K. 81 00:06:45,960 --> 00:06:49,719 Speaker 4: Williams's expert opinion when it comes to anything relating to 82 00:06:50,680 --> 00:06:54,679 Speaker 4: you know, crime, politics, political stuff. 83 00:06:55,200 --> 00:06:57,920 Speaker 2: And this woman is ready listen. 84 00:06:58,040 --> 00:06:59,719 Speaker 4: I wanted to make sure she had enough time to 85 00:06:59,760 --> 00:07:02,520 Speaker 4: do her due diligence, because, like me, she's not gonna 86 00:07:02,560 --> 00:07:06,200 Speaker 4: hop on just to have a conversation without having all 87 00:07:06,240 --> 00:07:10,600 Speaker 4: the information she needed. So ladies, gentlemen, gays and bays, 88 00:07:10,680 --> 00:07:13,640 Speaker 4: give it up for the woman y'all have been begging 89 00:07:13,680 --> 00:07:15,720 Speaker 4: for me to talk to ever since news broke out 90 00:07:15,720 --> 00:07:18,000 Speaker 4: about their cephos Ebony K. 91 00:07:18,560 --> 00:07:22,280 Speaker 3: William Carlos the King as happy as I am to 92 00:07:22,600 --> 00:07:26,560 Speaker 3: see you, my darling, looking very delicious and cozy. Might 93 00:07:26,600 --> 00:07:30,440 Speaker 3: I add this in this green, ever green velvet, you 94 00:07:30,480 --> 00:07:32,760 Speaker 3: know this chill hit the air, baby, and Carlos said, 95 00:07:32,800 --> 00:07:37,960 Speaker 3: y'all gonna get your velveteen baby, you know it. You 96 00:07:38,000 --> 00:07:41,000 Speaker 3: know I do wish gathering. I love you so much. 97 00:07:41,040 --> 00:07:43,920 Speaker 3: I wish we were gathering under better circumstances. But here 98 00:07:44,000 --> 00:07:47,920 Speaker 3: we are to discuss simply the facts simply the facts 99 00:07:47,960 --> 00:07:52,400 Speaker 3: as we know them as of this moment regarding the 100 00:07:52,480 --> 00:07:56,760 Speaker 3: indictment and charges related to doctor Wendy and Edward osseoppho. 101 00:07:57,000 --> 00:07:58,840 Speaker 2: Yeah, so let's just get right into it. Listen. 102 00:07:59,240 --> 00:08:02,200 Speaker 4: As of now we all know what has happened, but 103 00:08:02,320 --> 00:08:04,600 Speaker 4: I'll update the rain drops as well. 104 00:08:05,080 --> 00:08:05,480 Speaker 2: Listen. 105 00:08:06,480 --> 00:08:10,720 Speaker 1: Last Friday, it was revealed that Eddie and doctor Wendy 106 00:08:10,920 --> 00:08:19,600 Speaker 1: were arrested for allegations of insurance fraud, counts of insurance frau, 107 00:08:19,800 --> 00:08:24,360 Speaker 1: counts of conspiracy of fraud in addition to falsifying a 108 00:08:24,400 --> 00:08:29,400 Speaker 1: police report by alleging that the burglary that they reported 109 00:08:29,480 --> 00:08:35,280 Speaker 1: last year actually did not happen. They could face up to, 110 00:08:35,520 --> 00:08:38,040 Speaker 1: from what I've read, in the state of Maryland, fifteen 111 00:08:38,120 --> 00:08:41,400 Speaker 1: years in prison if convicted of this crime. 112 00:08:41,760 --> 00:08:43,440 Speaker 2: The Ocephos have. 113 00:08:43,400 --> 00:08:48,800 Speaker 4: Released a statement stating that look, they want privacy at 114 00:08:48,840 --> 00:08:52,400 Speaker 4: this time, but they look forward to seeing their day 115 00:08:52,440 --> 00:08:56,680 Speaker 4: in court. Ebany, I really just want to go many 116 00:08:56,720 --> 00:08:58,840 Speaker 4: ways with you, But first I want to start with 117 00:08:58,880 --> 00:09:06,120 Speaker 4: the fact that to Wendy professor for degrees, Eddie a lawyer, 118 00:09:06,520 --> 00:09:10,760 Speaker 4: has his law degree licensed to pre were you just 119 00:09:10,920 --> 00:09:14,440 Speaker 4: as surprise as the rest of us was when this 120 00:09:14,600 --> 00:09:16,480 Speaker 4: news hit last Friday. 121 00:09:16,640 --> 00:09:20,719 Speaker 3: See, you're probably asking the wrong person, Parlos, because unfortunately, 122 00:09:20,880 --> 00:09:27,360 Speaker 3: due to my almost twenty years of legal expert experience myself, 123 00:09:27,760 --> 00:09:29,559 Speaker 3: what I know is there's no such thing as a 124 00:09:29,679 --> 00:09:34,520 Speaker 3: usual suspect. There's no such thing as a usual suspect, right, 125 00:09:35,720 --> 00:09:39,679 Speaker 3: So surprised in the general sense. Sure, sure you know. 126 00:09:39,920 --> 00:09:44,600 Speaker 3: I've been at Bravocan with the Osfos. I've shared spaces 127 00:09:45,280 --> 00:09:47,600 Speaker 3: in a variety of ways over the many years that 128 00:09:47,679 --> 00:09:50,480 Speaker 3: those of us that live in this wonderful world that 129 00:09:50,600 --> 00:09:56,920 Speaker 3: intersects between academia and politics and mass media. Do you 130 00:09:56,960 --> 00:09:59,440 Speaker 3: know we are certainly colleagues. I've had both Eddie and 131 00:09:59,480 --> 00:10:02,280 Speaker 3: Wendy on on my Grio show. When I hosted The 132 00:10:02,320 --> 00:10:05,600 Speaker 3: Grilloh with Vany K Williams, which was a nightly news show, 133 00:10:05,880 --> 00:10:10,000 Speaker 3: they had dsfos graciously came on my show to promote 134 00:10:10,080 --> 00:10:14,720 Speaker 3: Happy Eddie, you know, their cannabis line. So my point 135 00:10:14,800 --> 00:10:18,920 Speaker 3: is giving context to the rain drops. My relationship was 136 00:10:19,120 --> 00:10:22,480 Speaker 3: very casual with with Theosephos, but one that was rooted 137 00:10:22,640 --> 00:10:26,440 Speaker 3: in shared values as it relates to everything that you 138 00:10:26,559 --> 00:10:31,599 Speaker 3: named academics, community service and you know, the betterment of 139 00:10:31,640 --> 00:10:35,880 Speaker 3: our people. So in that generalized sense, sure, but again, 140 00:10:36,200 --> 00:10:38,680 Speaker 3: you know, those of us that do this legal thing 141 00:10:38,800 --> 00:10:41,880 Speaker 3: for real, for real and for a living, we always 142 00:10:41,960 --> 00:10:46,360 Speaker 3: kind of hold out the possibility that it could be anybody. Carlos, 143 00:10:46,400 --> 00:10:50,240 Speaker 3: nobody's above the program. No one is a perfect person. 144 00:10:50,600 --> 00:10:53,680 Speaker 3: I want to reiterate what we all know. The Ocephos 145 00:10:53,760 --> 00:10:57,720 Speaker 3: are innocent, innocent, innocent, innocent until proven in a court 146 00:10:57,760 --> 00:11:00,760 Speaker 3: of law to be guilty. So we're gonna operate with 147 00:11:00,840 --> 00:11:03,280 Speaker 3: that presumption of innocence, and we're gonna lay out the 148 00:11:03,320 --> 00:11:05,040 Speaker 3: facts as we know them, and we're going to talk 149 00:11:05,040 --> 00:11:07,679 Speaker 3: about possibilities and next steps. 150 00:11:07,760 --> 00:11:10,000 Speaker 2: Let's let's talk about next steps. 151 00:11:10,080 --> 00:11:14,480 Speaker 4: We know that they bail themselves out of jail fifty 152 00:11:14,520 --> 00:11:15,960 Speaker 4: thousand dollars a piece. 153 00:11:16,360 --> 00:11:17,600 Speaker 2: They are at home. 154 00:11:18,520 --> 00:11:21,600 Speaker 4: Doctor Wendy was supposed to be in New York City 155 00:11:21,640 --> 00:11:25,559 Speaker 4: this week doing press watch What Happens Live has canceled 156 00:11:25,880 --> 00:11:29,520 Speaker 4: her appearance on the show that was supposed to take 157 00:11:29,760 --> 00:11:34,120 Speaker 4: this week. Her Wife Swap episode, which was the season 158 00:11:34,240 --> 00:11:37,600 Speaker 4: premiere that was supposed to air this week, has now 159 00:11:37,720 --> 00:11:42,360 Speaker 4: been erased. And by erase, I mean as of today, 160 00:11:42,440 --> 00:11:45,080 Speaker 4: we are not going to see Doctor Wendy's episode. 161 00:11:45,120 --> 00:11:47,600 Speaker 2: Why swap Wive Swap has been pushed back. 162 00:11:47,480 --> 00:11:51,880 Speaker 4: A week or two in order to replace her episode 163 00:11:51,960 --> 00:11:55,160 Speaker 4: as the premiere episode to another one. Those are the 164 00:11:55,200 --> 00:11:59,440 Speaker 4: facts in which we know based on what you have 165 00:11:59,760 --> 00:12:05,240 Speaker 4: read and Ebany K. Williams in the court documents, Does 166 00:12:05,280 --> 00:12:07,720 Speaker 4: it concern you based on what you've read? 167 00:12:08,160 --> 00:12:10,560 Speaker 2: Right, Yes, they're inno sense of proven guilty. 168 00:12:10,960 --> 00:12:18,920 Speaker 4: The burglary being investigated, the allegations of returning items that 169 00:12:18,960 --> 00:12:24,520 Speaker 4: they claim in their insurance allegations of doctor Wendy wearing 170 00:12:24,559 --> 00:12:27,839 Speaker 4: the wedding ring the band that she and Eddie got 171 00:12:27,840 --> 00:12:30,160 Speaker 4: twenty five, three hundred and eighty dollars for from the 172 00:12:30,160 --> 00:12:32,520 Speaker 4: insurance company. They're now saying she wore it in a 173 00:12:32,559 --> 00:12:36,080 Speaker 4: social media post. The things you're reading, dude, are you 174 00:12:36,160 --> 00:12:39,480 Speaker 4: concerned about whether or not they'll be able to prove 175 00:12:39,520 --> 00:12:41,800 Speaker 4: their innocence if that's what they want to do. 176 00:12:41,960 --> 00:12:47,760 Speaker 3: So two things I want to bifurcate these issues for 177 00:12:47,880 --> 00:12:52,440 Speaker 3: the rain Drops, So everything you just laid out accurately, Carlos, 178 00:12:52,520 --> 00:12:55,800 Speaker 3: I'm going to put in the category of media impact, 179 00:12:56,320 --> 00:13:00,560 Speaker 3: the cancelation of Watch What Happens Live, the reshuffling of 180 00:13:00,679 --> 00:13:03,200 Speaker 3: the new edit that's going to be necessary, for the 181 00:13:03,200 --> 00:13:07,520 Speaker 3: White Swap series and anything else, you know, whether or not. 182 00:13:07,960 --> 00:13:09,960 Speaker 3: I think it's being reported that cameras are up to 183 00:13:10,080 --> 00:13:13,000 Speaker 3: now already start pre record for the new season of 184 00:13:13,040 --> 00:13:16,160 Speaker 3: Potomac Housewives. So all of that I'm going to put 185 00:13:16,160 --> 00:13:20,040 Speaker 3: in the category, Carlos, of media impact. That's over there. 186 00:13:21,160 --> 00:13:25,800 Speaker 3: Let me first address legal impact. Okay, So from the 187 00:13:25,920 --> 00:13:28,960 Speaker 3: legal impact space, here's what we know so far. Like 188 00:13:29,040 --> 00:13:32,440 Speaker 3: you said, they had been arrested following the indictment, which 189 00:13:32,480 --> 00:13:37,600 Speaker 3: is general procedure, they immediately posted fifty thousand dollars bond 190 00:13:37,600 --> 00:13:41,000 Speaker 3: apiece and they were released. That is typical. So for 191 00:13:41,040 --> 00:13:44,160 Speaker 3: anybody wondering was that abnormally high or low? That is 192 00:13:44,160 --> 00:13:49,480 Speaker 3: a standard kind of rate, if you will, for release 193 00:13:49,800 --> 00:13:52,880 Speaker 3: given the charges and the amount associated, which is around 194 00:13:52,920 --> 00:13:57,560 Speaker 3: half a million dollars worth of kind of damages being claimed. 195 00:13:58,880 --> 00:14:01,439 Speaker 3: You know, I think it's a to know, Carlos, like 196 00:14:01,520 --> 00:14:06,200 Speaker 3: the fact that insurance fraud is a very specific kind 197 00:14:06,480 --> 00:14:11,480 Speaker 3: of criminal activity. I say that because unlike let's say, 198 00:14:11,640 --> 00:14:16,480 Speaker 3: tax fraud, which we've seen before with Teresa Judae and 199 00:14:16,640 --> 00:14:19,960 Speaker 3: her ex husband, which you know, you were a huge 200 00:14:19,960 --> 00:14:23,640 Speaker 3: producer for Teresa in the series, it's a little different, right, 201 00:14:23,800 --> 00:14:28,600 Speaker 3: because in tax fraud and even tax evasion, typically you've 202 00:14:28,640 --> 00:14:34,080 Speaker 3: got third party players. You've got the accountants, you've got 203 00:14:34,160 --> 00:14:39,360 Speaker 3: other tax specialists conceivably that I think can help create 204 00:14:39,480 --> 00:14:45,800 Speaker 3: defense arguments that lend themselves to more creativity. Said another way, 205 00:14:46,120 --> 00:14:48,520 Speaker 3: you could blame it on the accountant. You can say 206 00:14:48,560 --> 00:14:51,040 Speaker 3: I didn't know. You can do things of this nature. Now, 207 00:14:51,080 --> 00:14:54,920 Speaker 3: they're not always successful, which is why Judice is deported 208 00:14:54,960 --> 00:14:57,680 Speaker 3: to this day and Theresa did prison time and they 209 00:14:57,720 --> 00:15:01,040 Speaker 3: were convicted. So I'm not saying that that's get out 210 00:15:01,040 --> 00:15:03,600 Speaker 3: of jail free card. I'm simply saying for the rain 211 00:15:03,720 --> 00:15:07,880 Speaker 3: drops that that from a legal defense strategy point, which 212 00:15:07,920 --> 00:15:10,160 Speaker 3: is what we're talking about in this part of the conversation, 213 00:15:10,640 --> 00:15:15,640 Speaker 3: it gives you more opportunity, perhaps to have alternative arguments 214 00:15:15,680 --> 00:15:19,800 Speaker 3: for the defense. But when you're talking about an insurance 215 00:15:19,880 --> 00:15:22,600 Speaker 3: claim in the way in which we're hearing these facts 216 00:15:22,880 --> 00:15:26,800 Speaker 3: that it was indeed doctor Wendy and Eddie directly themselves 217 00:15:27,240 --> 00:15:30,840 Speaker 3: picking up the phone and asserting these claims straight to 218 00:15:31,000 --> 00:15:34,040 Speaker 3: their insurance companies. And let's be clear, there were three 219 00:15:34,160 --> 00:15:38,200 Speaker 3: different insurance companies allegedly involved here, right, so we know 220 00:15:38,280 --> 00:15:45,200 Speaker 3: that there's allegedly a claim against Travelers Insurance, Home Site Insurance, 221 00:15:45,840 --> 00:15:50,440 Speaker 3: and a third insurance company known as Jewelers Mutual. Okay, 222 00:15:50,680 --> 00:15:55,120 Speaker 3: so all three of those insurance companies are at play. Allegedly, 223 00:15:55,200 --> 00:16:00,440 Speaker 3: all three insurance companies had claims filed directly from the 224 00:16:00,480 --> 00:16:05,840 Speaker 3: oseppos around costs associated with items and contents in this 225 00:16:05,880 --> 00:16:09,160 Speaker 3: alleged burglary. The reason I'm saying this, Carlos, is that 226 00:16:09,200 --> 00:16:14,360 Speaker 3: could make it more difficult from the defense posture because 227 00:16:14,400 --> 00:16:18,000 Speaker 3: according to the Sheriff's department, and we learned a lot 228 00:16:18,040 --> 00:16:21,400 Speaker 3: of this information during that press conference that the local 229 00:16:21,440 --> 00:16:24,600 Speaker 3: sheriff's department and state attorney held. Now, I want to 230 00:16:24,640 --> 00:16:27,440 Speaker 3: be clear, Carlos King, Like a lot of folks, I 231 00:16:27,440 --> 00:16:29,800 Speaker 3: didn't like that we got that press conference. And let 232 00:16:29,800 --> 00:16:32,760 Speaker 3: me tell you why. Yeah, I didn't like it at all. 233 00:16:33,400 --> 00:16:38,200 Speaker 3: It gave cloud chasing, It gave happy to be seen, 234 00:16:39,320 --> 00:16:41,840 Speaker 3: especially during the Q and A when the sheriff to me, 235 00:16:41,960 --> 00:16:45,080 Speaker 3: had a couple of very cringey moments where he's kind of, 236 00:16:46,880 --> 00:16:50,479 Speaker 3: you know, kind of trying to be cute with the 237 00:16:50,520 --> 00:16:52,960 Speaker 3: press that was in present. You know, Oh, do you 238 00:16:53,000 --> 00:16:55,320 Speaker 3: watch the show? I don't watch the show. It was 239 00:16:55,360 --> 00:16:58,040 Speaker 3: too tongue in cheek. It was too casual for something 240 00:16:58,080 --> 00:16:59,880 Speaker 3: of this magnitude, don't you and I see you not? 241 00:17:00,240 --> 00:17:00,920 Speaker 3: You agree, right? 242 00:17:01,080 --> 00:17:03,160 Speaker 4: Couldn't wait to ask you about that because I wanted 243 00:17:03,160 --> 00:17:05,680 Speaker 4: to ask you, you know, when the share first of all, 244 00:17:05,720 --> 00:17:08,440 Speaker 4: a press conference in general, for like, for a situation 245 00:17:08,600 --> 00:17:11,560 Speaker 4: like this. In addition to him asking the reporters, I 246 00:17:11,560 --> 00:17:13,520 Speaker 4: don't care if she's a real housewife or an old 247 00:17:13,520 --> 00:17:16,560 Speaker 4: housewife and asking the reporter, I mean, do you watch it? 248 00:17:16,560 --> 00:17:20,120 Speaker 4: It's okay, admit it, I thought like, look, I understand 249 00:17:20,119 --> 00:17:24,600 Speaker 4: this relaciousness surrounding this particular situation with them being celebrities, 250 00:17:25,040 --> 00:17:27,080 Speaker 4: but I thought it were going to focus on the law. 251 00:17:27,520 --> 00:17:29,720 Speaker 4: And I want to ask you this, is it normal 252 00:17:29,760 --> 00:17:33,840 Speaker 4: for a press conference to be held under these circumstances? 253 00:17:33,840 --> 00:17:38,080 Speaker 3: No, no, no, Carlos King, absolutely not. It is highly atypical. 254 00:17:38,520 --> 00:17:42,840 Speaker 3: Now they're gonna say in their defense that doctor Wendy 255 00:17:42,880 --> 00:17:45,680 Speaker 3: and Edward are Seppo, are not typical defendants, which is true. 256 00:17:45,760 --> 00:17:47,560 Speaker 3: And this is true. This is true of all of 257 00:17:47,640 --> 00:17:50,880 Speaker 3: us that choose to live our lives publicly. We often 258 00:17:51,040 --> 00:17:55,800 Speaker 3: lose some of the protection that what so called private 259 00:17:55,960 --> 00:17:59,920 Speaker 3: citizens continue to enjoy. We talked about this a little bit, Carlos. 260 00:18:00,040 --> 00:18:04,560 Speaker 3: We talked about the the Frost and their and their son. Right, 261 00:18:04,880 --> 00:18:09,640 Speaker 3: So the law does treat public figures differently. It does, 262 00:18:09,720 --> 00:18:12,639 Speaker 3: and whether it's criminal, as we're seeing in this case, 263 00:18:13,040 --> 00:18:17,200 Speaker 3: or whether it's civil, which we've also seen, whether it's libel. 264 00:18:17,320 --> 00:18:19,560 Speaker 3: And you know, the standard of proving that somebody has 265 00:18:19,600 --> 00:18:23,720 Speaker 3: defamed a so called celebrity famous person is much higher 266 00:18:24,359 --> 00:18:26,840 Speaker 3: than it is if someone tried to defame Carlos King 267 00:18:27,800 --> 00:18:31,800 Speaker 3: or Giselle Bryant, because you know that bar becomes raised 268 00:18:31,920 --> 00:18:34,840 Speaker 3: according to your profile. Quite frankly so in this case, 269 00:18:34,920 --> 00:18:40,120 Speaker 3: because doctor Wendy and Edward Osseppo have Eddie have decided 270 00:18:40,119 --> 00:18:43,560 Speaker 3: to live their life publicly, this Sheriff's department is set. 271 00:18:43,640 --> 00:18:48,280 Speaker 3: It is claiming that they're getting overwhelmed with so many 272 00:18:48,520 --> 00:18:51,919 Speaker 3: media inquiries and that I believe that. I believe. I 273 00:18:51,960 --> 00:18:56,800 Speaker 3: do believe everybody from TMZ to local outlets, to national 274 00:18:56,840 --> 00:19:00,960 Speaker 3: network news, to cable news, to every blow and content 275 00:19:01,040 --> 00:19:05,679 Speaker 3: creator known demand was calling their phone, emailing them asking 276 00:19:05,800 --> 00:19:09,280 Speaker 3: about the latest and greatest with doctor Wendy and Eddie 277 00:19:09,280 --> 00:19:12,440 Speaker 3: and these charges. I believe that. And also did they 278 00:19:12,600 --> 00:19:15,320 Speaker 3: have to take the step of having a press conference, 279 00:19:15,400 --> 00:19:18,760 Speaker 3: a televised press conference. They did not, So that was 280 00:19:18,800 --> 00:19:22,760 Speaker 3: a choice. Further to me, Carlos, if you're gonna do that, 281 00:19:22,920 --> 00:19:25,719 Speaker 3: to say, hey, let us address the entire public at 282 00:19:25,720 --> 00:19:30,000 Speaker 3: one time, let us give everybody the same information, so 283 00:19:30,080 --> 00:19:33,439 Speaker 3: everyone's dealing with the same facts. I could buy that. 284 00:19:34,000 --> 00:19:36,000 Speaker 3: You know where they lost me, Carlos, was the Q 285 00:19:36,119 --> 00:19:39,800 Speaker 3: and A because normally, let's think back to other press 286 00:19:39,840 --> 00:19:43,000 Speaker 3: conferences we've seen recently. We saw press conferences with Sean 287 00:19:43,080 --> 00:19:48,399 Speaker 3: Combs's trial. We've seen press conferences with Meg the Stallion's case, 288 00:19:48,680 --> 00:19:53,160 Speaker 3: the Tory Lanez shooting. We've seen press conferences recently with celebrities. 289 00:19:53,320 --> 00:19:56,920 Speaker 3: And nine out of ten times, after the law enforcement agency, 290 00:19:57,359 --> 00:20:01,240 Speaker 3: the cops or the sheriff or the distri attorneys speaks, 291 00:20:01,760 --> 00:20:06,840 Speaker 3: what do they do, Carlos, They say, no questions, thank you, 292 00:20:07,840 --> 00:20:10,320 Speaker 3: we will let you know if we have updated information, 293 00:20:10,400 --> 00:20:13,800 Speaker 3: and they leave the podium. That's typically what that looks 294 00:20:13,840 --> 00:20:17,359 Speaker 3: like when you're really to me about the business. But 295 00:20:17,480 --> 00:20:21,080 Speaker 3: when you start entertaining Q and A and questions and 296 00:20:21,480 --> 00:20:24,960 Speaker 3: chit chat and small talk at the podium, that's giving 297 00:20:25,119 --> 00:20:28,840 Speaker 3: an alternative agenda for me. That's giving a different intentionality, 298 00:20:28,880 --> 00:20:31,160 Speaker 3: and I didn't like that on behalf of If those 299 00:20:31,160 --> 00:20:34,600 Speaker 3: were my clients, I would have held a counter press conference. 300 00:20:34,680 --> 00:20:37,840 Speaker 3: Quite frankly, if I represented the Osfos Carlos, Oh baby, 301 00:20:38,560 --> 00:20:42,439 Speaker 3: oh baby. Now, my clients wouldn't have been there, but 302 00:20:42,520 --> 00:20:44,359 Speaker 3: I would have been, Ebany K. Williams. That's why I 303 00:20:44,400 --> 00:20:47,480 Speaker 3: would have been there, greeting the press and letting them 304 00:20:47,520 --> 00:20:50,639 Speaker 3: know that my clients are horrified by the charges. They 305 00:20:50,680 --> 00:20:53,920 Speaker 3: are horror bied by the accusations. They're loving on their 306 00:20:53,960 --> 00:20:58,400 Speaker 3: three babies. They look forward to defending themselves and against 307 00:20:58,400 --> 00:21:03,159 Speaker 3: these heinous accusations. And please believe, this is America still. 308 00:21:03,520 --> 00:21:07,480 Speaker 3: This is America still where we presume and enjoy the 309 00:21:07,520 --> 00:21:10,399 Speaker 3: presumption of innocence, and we can't wait for all the 310 00:21:10,400 --> 00:21:13,040 Speaker 3: facts to come out. Thank you and have a nice day. 311 00:21:13,200 --> 00:21:14,879 Speaker 3: Oh y'all would have got that if I was a 312 00:21:14,960 --> 00:21:16,400 Speaker 3: Vince counsel. Absolutely. 313 00:21:19,280 --> 00:21:20,240 Speaker 2: I want to ask you this. 314 00:21:20,520 --> 00:21:26,160 Speaker 4: In their statement, somebody outlined to me, Ebany that there 315 00:21:26,359 --> 00:21:31,360 Speaker 4: wasn't this proclaimed in a sense that most released statements 316 00:21:31,680 --> 00:21:36,480 Speaker 4: and press releases have under people who are being prosecuted 317 00:21:36,520 --> 00:21:39,920 Speaker 4: for a crime. Do you think the omission of yourself 318 00:21:39,960 --> 00:21:44,399 Speaker 4: are saying, and you know, we proclaim our innocence and 319 00:21:44,440 --> 00:21:46,920 Speaker 4: we can't wait to defend in the court. Is that 320 00:21:47,000 --> 00:21:51,120 Speaker 4: omission something that raises eyebrows to you too much. 321 00:21:51,000 --> 00:21:54,960 Speaker 3: Into that I could hear someone being curious or speculative. 322 00:21:55,640 --> 00:21:58,600 Speaker 3: We don't do a lot of speculation here with what 323 00:21:58,640 --> 00:22:01,280 Speaker 3: we do. We really follow the facts, and I'm proud 324 00:22:01,320 --> 00:22:03,840 Speaker 3: of that for us, Carlos. So, I wouldn't go too 325 00:22:03,880 --> 00:22:06,440 Speaker 3: far down a rabbit hole that says because there wasn't 326 00:22:06,480 --> 00:22:10,080 Speaker 3: a staunch defense in the way in which we want 327 00:22:10,119 --> 00:22:12,360 Speaker 3: to hear it or we're used to hearing it, that 328 00:22:12,359 --> 00:22:15,760 Speaker 3: that could be interpreted as takeed admission. No, No, I 329 00:22:15,760 --> 00:22:19,679 Speaker 3: wouldn't say that. I would say the statement was extraordinarily broad, 330 00:22:20,359 --> 00:22:23,600 Speaker 3: extraordinarily general, and it leaves space for a lot of 331 00:22:23,600 --> 00:22:27,560 Speaker 3: different things. It leaves space for a staunch, adamant defense 332 00:22:27,600 --> 00:22:30,880 Speaker 3: that could go to trial. It leaves space for the 333 00:22:31,119 --> 00:22:35,879 Speaker 3: prosecution's case falling apart pre trial. It leaves space for 334 00:22:36,440 --> 00:22:42,119 Speaker 3: cooperation while a plea bargain of some sort being worked 335 00:22:42,160 --> 00:22:45,760 Speaker 3: on or worked out, so a litany of things could happen. 336 00:22:45,840 --> 00:22:48,360 Speaker 3: And that statement, to me gives us no real indication 337 00:22:48,480 --> 00:22:49,640 Speaker 3: as to where this will go. 338 00:22:49,840 --> 00:22:53,120 Speaker 4: Based on the stuff you ran the court documents, Should 339 00:22:53,400 --> 00:22:56,800 Speaker 4: Eddie and Wendy be very concerned because it appears that 340 00:22:58,280 --> 00:22:59,720 Speaker 4: the state has a good case. 341 00:22:59,720 --> 00:23:01,320 Speaker 2: Again, well, I. 342 00:23:01,240 --> 00:23:03,639 Speaker 3: Certainly think the state has a case. Now, let's go 343 00:23:03,760 --> 00:23:05,919 Speaker 3: to standards. Let's go back to the law school one 344 00:23:05,920 --> 00:23:07,640 Speaker 3: oh one, Let's go back to how do you get 345 00:23:07,680 --> 00:23:09,879 Speaker 3: how does one even get to the place of indictment, 346 00:23:10,320 --> 00:23:16,600 Speaker 3: because that's that's not always a guarantee. You know, there's 347 00:23:16,640 --> 00:23:20,280 Speaker 3: a saying a prosecutor can indict a ham sandwich. That's 348 00:23:20,320 --> 00:23:23,760 Speaker 3: becoming less and less than less true. People the public, 349 00:23:23,920 --> 00:23:27,600 Speaker 3: social media, the people are less and less inclinent these days, 350 00:23:27,640 --> 00:23:31,600 Speaker 3: Carlos king to just indict because a prosecutor says so. So, 351 00:23:31,640 --> 00:23:36,840 Speaker 3: I do want to alert rain drops that this prosecution office, 352 00:23:36,840 --> 00:23:40,840 Speaker 3: this state's attorney's office, this sheriff's office, and their investigators 353 00:23:41,119 --> 00:23:45,440 Speaker 3: did have to present evidence in front of a grand jury, 354 00:23:45,480 --> 00:23:50,240 Speaker 3: and that grand jury decided based off of the paperwork 355 00:23:51,000 --> 00:23:54,480 Speaker 3: any witnesses that testified everything that came before them via 356 00:23:54,520 --> 00:23:58,240 Speaker 3: as evidence, they decided it was fifty one percent likely, 357 00:23:58,359 --> 00:24:03,520 Speaker 3: meaning more likely than not, that the allegations were true. 358 00:24:03,960 --> 00:24:09,640 Speaker 3: That Eddie and Wendy indeed worked in cooperation with each 359 00:24:09,640 --> 00:24:15,320 Speaker 3: other conspiracy. That's hence the conspiracy piece to commit insurance fraud, 360 00:24:15,640 --> 00:24:21,280 Speaker 3: to claim lost money around items totally up to the 361 00:24:21,320 --> 00:24:24,800 Speaker 3: maximum of their insurance policies, that four hundred and fifty 362 00:24:24,880 --> 00:24:29,640 Speaker 3: thousand dollars mark, to recover those funds in a way 363 00:24:29,680 --> 00:24:35,240 Speaker 3: that was fraudulent and fictitious and erroneous. I do think 364 00:24:35,280 --> 00:24:38,159 Speaker 3: it's important to note, as much as I hated the 365 00:24:38,240 --> 00:24:40,960 Speaker 3: Q and A, it did give us some facts. The 366 00:24:41,000 --> 00:24:43,320 Speaker 3: one question I thought was valuable, Carlos, was when one 367 00:24:43,320 --> 00:24:47,240 Speaker 3: of the journalists asked the sheriff, what made you suspicious? 368 00:24:47,680 --> 00:24:51,400 Speaker 3: People found insurance claims every day in this country, many 369 00:24:51,440 --> 00:24:54,239 Speaker 3: of them for high dollar amounts. But he said, the 370 00:24:54,240 --> 00:24:57,040 Speaker 3: fact that it was at the policy max four hundred 371 00:24:57,080 --> 00:25:01,520 Speaker 3: and fifty thousand dollars, that was a little bit concerning, 372 00:25:01,640 --> 00:25:06,400 Speaker 3: But we still carried out an investigation per the reported burglary. 373 00:25:06,440 --> 00:25:10,560 Speaker 3: But the fact that then the social media was displaying 374 00:25:10,720 --> 00:25:13,720 Speaker 3: that we saw the twenty five thousand dollars diamond anniversary 375 00:25:13,800 --> 00:25:17,520 Speaker 3: ring allegedly showing up on social media after it was 376 00:25:17,520 --> 00:25:21,480 Speaker 3: in the claim. Now some of y'all perused the comments. 377 00:25:21,960 --> 00:25:26,159 Speaker 3: Several people commented, including real housewife of Atlanta of Portia 378 00:25:26,200 --> 00:25:32,200 Speaker 3: Williams that, Hey, wealthy people, celebrity people, people with means 379 00:25:32,200 --> 00:25:37,159 Speaker 3: often get dupes made of their high worth jewelry items. 380 00:25:37,560 --> 00:25:40,359 Speaker 3: You know, they'll get a jeweler to make a dupe 381 00:25:40,359 --> 00:25:44,800 Speaker 3: of an engagement ring, anniversary band, even a watch. Right. 382 00:25:46,240 --> 00:25:48,640 Speaker 3: I think it's an interesting argument. I think that there's 383 00:25:48,720 --> 00:25:51,040 Speaker 3: going to be an argument made. But this is also 384 00:25:51,240 --> 00:25:54,120 Speaker 3: very easy to prove true or not true, Carlos, because 385 00:25:54,560 --> 00:25:57,400 Speaker 3: most of these high end jewelry items, you know, take 386 00:25:57,400 --> 00:25:59,920 Speaker 3: off any number of those wealthy items you're wearing now, 387 00:26:01,000 --> 00:26:04,040 Speaker 3: those wealthy items you're wearing now, honey, and we're gonna 388 00:26:04,040 --> 00:26:08,040 Speaker 3: see indicators on the inside, right, whether it's engravements, whether 389 00:26:08,080 --> 00:26:11,000 Speaker 3: it's fourteen care of Goals stamps, twenty four carric you know. 390 00:26:11,359 --> 00:26:17,159 Speaker 3: So while it's an interesting, exciting defense possibility, it's going 391 00:26:17,240 --> 00:26:19,240 Speaker 3: to be very easy to shoot it down or make 392 00:26:19,280 --> 00:26:21,119 Speaker 3: the case. You know, was it a duke, was it 393 00:26:21,160 --> 00:26:22,680 Speaker 3: not a duke. We're going to figure it out real 394 00:26:22,720 --> 00:26:27,920 Speaker 3: clean again. I think that if I had to point 395 00:26:27,960 --> 00:26:30,560 Speaker 3: to a piece that the state is arguing evidence, why 396 00:26:30,640 --> 00:26:34,119 Speaker 3: is Carlos? That is most concerning from a defense strategy. 397 00:26:34,560 --> 00:26:38,880 Speaker 3: It's the emails. It's the email. The fact that the 398 00:26:38,880 --> 00:26:42,720 Speaker 3: sheriff talks about that on the receipts that were submitted 399 00:26:42,800 --> 00:26:46,080 Speaker 3: by the oscephos themselves. See that's also not great. That's 400 00:26:46,119 --> 00:26:48,439 Speaker 3: not a great. Fact is that a lot of the 401 00:26:48,480 --> 00:26:54,160 Speaker 3: evidence that the prosecution is alleging to hold came straight 402 00:26:54,520 --> 00:26:59,880 Speaker 3: from the defendants, not their handlers necessarily, not their accountants. 403 00:27:00,119 --> 00:27:03,120 Speaker 3: I was saying, third party, not their business managers. No, no, no, 404 00:27:03,760 --> 00:27:07,720 Speaker 3: this came straight allegedly from doctor Wendy and Eddie. The 405 00:27:07,760 --> 00:27:10,879 Speaker 3: receipts to prove the valuation to get them to that 406 00:27:10,920 --> 00:27:14,679 Speaker 3: four hundred and fifty thousand dollars insurance cap total. And 407 00:27:14,760 --> 00:27:18,160 Speaker 3: on some of those receipts were email addresses from both 408 00:27:18,200 --> 00:27:21,440 Speaker 3: Wendy and Eddie. And on those email addresses, that's how 409 00:27:21,480 --> 00:27:23,919 Speaker 3: then the law enforcement was able to because how do 410 00:27:24,000 --> 00:27:25,480 Speaker 3: you access somebody emails? 411 00:27:25,520 --> 00:27:25,680 Speaker 1: Right? 412 00:27:25,720 --> 00:27:26,360 Speaker 3: That's private? 413 00:27:26,480 --> 00:27:26,680 Speaker 1: Right? 414 00:27:27,280 --> 00:27:30,040 Speaker 3: They were a because you gave it to me, I 415 00:27:30,200 --> 00:27:33,400 Speaker 3: now get to execute a search warrant on that basis 416 00:27:33,640 --> 00:27:37,280 Speaker 3: as law enforcement. And when I execute my search warrant, Carlos, 417 00:27:37,600 --> 00:27:40,320 Speaker 3: I now get to pull up the content of those emails. 418 00:27:40,359 --> 00:27:43,359 Speaker 3: You essentially gave me your emails. See they got to 419 00:27:43,359 --> 00:27:46,280 Speaker 3: connect all these dots when we give people evidence, okay, 420 00:27:46,760 --> 00:27:48,840 Speaker 3: and when they did that, they're able to now see 421 00:27:48,880 --> 00:27:54,280 Speaker 3: emails from Eddie saying Hey, Wendy, And this is the 422 00:27:54,320 --> 00:27:57,520 Speaker 3: conspiracy allegation. This is where that comes in, Hey, can 423 00:27:57,560 --> 00:28:01,239 Speaker 3: you give me more high value items so that we 424 00:28:01,320 --> 00:28:05,399 Speaker 3: can meet this inventory requirement to reach the four hundred 425 00:28:05,400 --> 00:28:08,960 Speaker 3: and fifty thousand dollars maximum threshold on our insurance policy. 426 00:28:09,400 --> 00:28:13,000 Speaker 3: That's that's a line of facts, Parloughs that gets us 427 00:28:13,040 --> 00:28:17,679 Speaker 3: to conspiracy allegedly and fraud allegedly. 428 00:28:17,359 --> 00:28:21,080 Speaker 4: Based on that email alone. Excuse me, based only email alone? 429 00:28:22,880 --> 00:28:24,760 Speaker 2: Is it? 430 00:28:24,800 --> 00:28:28,640 Speaker 4: Is it going to be hard for the defense to 431 00:28:28,680 --> 00:28:35,879 Speaker 4: try to rationalize why someone would suggest to their wife, hey, 432 00:28:36,160 --> 00:28:39,920 Speaker 4: add more stuff on this claim so that we're able 433 00:28:40,160 --> 00:28:45,320 Speaker 4: to reach the maximum. Is that alone at least account 434 00:28:45,520 --> 00:28:48,280 Speaker 4: of guilt versus the other seven he's facing it. 435 00:28:48,560 --> 00:28:50,520 Speaker 3: I can't say it's a count of guilt. I can 436 00:28:50,600 --> 00:28:53,480 Speaker 3: say it's going to be difficult depending on This is 437 00:28:53,480 --> 00:28:56,840 Speaker 3: why jury is so important. You know, can you convince 438 00:28:56,880 --> 00:29:01,400 Speaker 3: a juror one of twelve presumably that when you said, hey, baby, 439 00:29:02,600 --> 00:29:05,480 Speaker 3: can you add some more hot ticket items to this list? 440 00:29:05,520 --> 00:29:07,280 Speaker 3: So we can get to the number we're supposed to 441 00:29:07,320 --> 00:29:10,200 Speaker 3: get to. Can you find a juror that interprets that 442 00:29:10,480 --> 00:29:15,440 Speaker 3: as Hey, honey, I forgot how many Chanelle flats you have? 443 00:29:15,560 --> 00:29:17,880 Speaker 3: Can you remind me so that we can make sure 444 00:29:17,880 --> 00:29:21,560 Speaker 3: that we're covering all our bases here. If you can 445 00:29:21,600 --> 00:29:25,800 Speaker 3: convince a juror to a juror to interpret it that way, 446 00:29:26,400 --> 00:29:30,800 Speaker 3: you're in good position. I think that's gonna be hard. 447 00:29:31,360 --> 00:29:34,840 Speaker 3: I think most jurors are gonna hear that email and 448 00:29:34,920 --> 00:29:39,240 Speaker 3: interpret it as hustle. But this is where there, this 449 00:29:39,280 --> 00:29:42,520 Speaker 3: is where who their lawyer is is gonna matter a lot. 450 00:29:43,320 --> 00:29:46,000 Speaker 3: And if this goes to trial, who is on that 451 00:29:46,080 --> 00:29:50,240 Speaker 3: jury is gonna matter a lot. You see how just 452 00:29:50,280 --> 00:29:52,400 Speaker 3: the I can give you the same the same email, 453 00:29:52,680 --> 00:29:56,080 Speaker 3: but I can. I could argue it, Hey honey, you 454 00:29:56,160 --> 00:29:59,320 Speaker 3: have such an enormous wardrobe, you have so many great items. 455 00:29:59,520 --> 00:30:01,720 Speaker 3: Was it was it the gucciese? Was it the Chanelle's? 456 00:30:01,840 --> 00:30:05,480 Speaker 3: Was it the van she helped me out? Or girl? 457 00:30:05,520 --> 00:30:06,920 Speaker 3: You know what, you know what it is, you know 458 00:30:06,920 --> 00:30:09,520 Speaker 3: what we're trying to do over here, Go ahead and 459 00:30:09,520 --> 00:30:11,560 Speaker 3: ask some more to this. Because we were a little light, 460 00:30:11,880 --> 00:30:15,360 Speaker 3: we're a little light on the balance, same facts, but 461 00:30:15,440 --> 00:30:19,240 Speaker 3: I'm arguing in it in two different ways. How successful 462 00:30:19,240 --> 00:30:22,240 Speaker 3: can you be as a litigator in getting your jewelry 463 00:30:22,360 --> 00:30:25,160 Speaker 3: to buy the version you need them to buy. That's 464 00:30:25,200 --> 00:30:26,400 Speaker 3: the brilliance of a good lawyer. 465 00:30:26,480 --> 00:30:27,760 Speaker 2: I know we have a short amount of time. 466 00:30:27,800 --> 00:30:30,560 Speaker 4: I want to get a few more questions before I'll 467 00:30:30,640 --> 00:30:33,440 Speaker 4: let you go. In the case of Teresa and Joe, 468 00:30:33,520 --> 00:30:37,080 Speaker 4: Judai is one of the arguments that the defense team 469 00:30:37,320 --> 00:30:40,120 Speaker 4: didn't make was Teresa had no idea what she was 470 00:30:40,120 --> 00:30:44,480 Speaker 4: signing on behalf of being a wife to Joe. Joe said, 471 00:30:44,600 --> 00:30:46,640 Speaker 4: my wife had nothing to do with it. I did 472 00:30:46,680 --> 00:30:50,000 Speaker 4: everything give her leniency. A lot of people did feel 473 00:30:50,000 --> 00:30:54,120 Speaker 4: ebony that based on just Teresa being guilty based on 474 00:30:54,280 --> 00:30:56,120 Speaker 4: signature alone. 475 00:30:56,280 --> 00:30:58,920 Speaker 1: That's the only sort of proof they had was her signature. 476 00:30:59,400 --> 00:31:02,280 Speaker 1: That because she was a celebrity, our best were off 477 00:31:02,320 --> 00:31:05,840 Speaker 1: and they were made an example out of the ones 478 00:31:05,880 --> 00:31:06,120 Speaker 1: they were. 479 00:31:06,280 --> 00:31:10,000 Speaker 2: They were both found guilty, but they both served. 480 00:31:11,360 --> 00:31:15,880 Speaker 4: They're sentencing at different times because they wanted to at 481 00:31:16,000 --> 00:31:18,280 Speaker 4: least have one parent be with their minor children. 482 00:31:18,800 --> 00:31:20,080 Speaker 2: In this particular case, you have a. 483 00:31:20,080 --> 00:31:23,400 Speaker 4: Married couple who are both accused of fraud. Do you 484 00:31:23,480 --> 00:31:27,120 Speaker 4: see a world where Eddie can say I did everything, 485 00:31:27,320 --> 00:31:30,400 Speaker 4: I'm guilty. Wendy had no idea what was going on. 486 00:31:31,680 --> 00:31:33,760 Speaker 4: In order for this not to be something where our 487 00:31:33,840 --> 00:31:39,120 Speaker 4: kids have to suffer for this, I am guilty. Give 488 00:31:39,160 --> 00:31:42,000 Speaker 4: her leniency and give me and throw the book at me. 489 00:31:42,160 --> 00:31:46,400 Speaker 3: Could it happen? Sure? Will this? Will that be a 490 00:31:46,480 --> 00:31:50,480 Speaker 3: harder sell for Wendy than it was for Teresa. Yes, 491 00:31:50,520 --> 00:31:52,760 Speaker 3: and let me tell you why. First of all, let 492 00:31:52,800 --> 00:31:55,480 Speaker 3: me say, because they do have the three small children. 493 00:31:55,640 --> 00:31:58,440 Speaker 3: If worst case scenario for the Oseephos they were both 494 00:31:58,480 --> 00:32:02,440 Speaker 3: convicted and both got active jail sentences, I don't see 495 00:32:02,680 --> 00:32:05,320 Speaker 3: a world in which they're made to serve them concurrently. 496 00:32:05,760 --> 00:32:10,920 Speaker 3: I do believe at the same time, at the same simultaneously. Rather, 497 00:32:11,240 --> 00:32:13,280 Speaker 3: I do believe they will get to serve them back 498 00:32:13,320 --> 00:32:15,160 Speaker 3: to back for the exact same reasons you said the 499 00:32:15,240 --> 00:32:16,400 Speaker 3: JUDI were able to do. 500 00:32:16,480 --> 00:32:16,560 Speaker 1: So. 501 00:32:17,000 --> 00:32:25,440 Speaker 3: Here's where Wendy's rightful in my opinion, rightful ownership and 502 00:32:25,520 --> 00:32:33,040 Speaker 3: pride of her education and savvy and brilliant and academic 503 00:32:33,320 --> 00:32:36,760 Speaker 3: excellence will work against her. Now, I don't want to 504 00:32:36,760 --> 00:32:38,960 Speaker 3: say speak out a turn about Teresa, but I'm not 505 00:32:39,080 --> 00:32:44,080 Speaker 3: familiar of Teresa having an extraordinary academic background. I'm not 506 00:32:44,200 --> 00:32:50,120 Speaker 3: familiar with Teresa having extraordinary academic or professional pursuits as 507 00:32:50,120 --> 00:32:56,840 Speaker 3: it relates to esteemed intelligence or accolades. I'm not aware 508 00:32:56,880 --> 00:33:02,160 Speaker 3: of that. We are aware of wind having at least 509 00:33:02,200 --> 00:33:08,000 Speaker 3: four academic professional degrees. We're aware that Wendy has worked 510 00:33:08,160 --> 00:33:14,320 Speaker 3: very successfully in academia and professionalism and media broadly. So 511 00:33:14,440 --> 00:33:17,680 Speaker 3: when if Wendy, excuse me, if Eddie were to make 512 00:33:17,760 --> 00:33:21,480 Speaker 3: the case that you laid out Carlos your honor. We 513 00:33:21,840 --> 00:33:24,080 Speaker 3: you know we've been convicted. This is all on me. 514 00:33:24,440 --> 00:33:26,840 Speaker 3: Throw the book at me. My wife had nothing to 515 00:33:26,880 --> 00:33:29,920 Speaker 3: do with it. She didn't know. She was ignorant to 516 00:33:29,960 --> 00:33:32,320 Speaker 3: what I had going on and what I was doing, 517 00:33:32,880 --> 00:33:37,520 Speaker 3: and she thus should be held harmless. That's gonna be 518 00:33:37,520 --> 00:33:42,160 Speaker 3: hard for a judge to buy Carlos when everybody knows, 519 00:33:42,320 --> 00:33:47,480 Speaker 3: and it's public record that your wife is brilliant. Your wife, 520 00:33:47,600 --> 00:33:53,040 Speaker 3: some could argue, is more educated than you are. Counselor Ocevo. 521 00:33:53,920 --> 00:33:56,600 Speaker 3: It's certainly to be believed that she is a woman 522 00:33:56,640 --> 00:34:03,160 Speaker 3: of extreme brilliance, high intelligence, and documented academic record. So 523 00:34:03,280 --> 00:34:06,400 Speaker 3: this court would find it difficult to believe that she 524 00:34:06,640 --> 00:34:09,759 Speaker 3: was near about as ignorant as you would lead us 525 00:34:09,800 --> 00:34:12,720 Speaker 3: to think based off this argument. See the difference. 526 00:34:14,520 --> 00:34:16,080 Speaker 2: Yeah, I do, I do, I do. 527 00:34:16,760 --> 00:34:20,680 Speaker 4: And what's interesting is Eddie is a lawyer. Even based 528 00:34:20,719 --> 00:34:24,000 Speaker 4: on the fact that a lawyer is being accused of fraud, 529 00:34:25,760 --> 00:34:30,200 Speaker 4: in a harder case for the defense to even say 530 00:34:30,239 --> 00:34:32,520 Speaker 4: that Eddie may not have known what he was doing 531 00:34:32,600 --> 00:34:36,560 Speaker 4: and did not have that intent when he was sending 532 00:34:36,560 --> 00:34:41,120 Speaker 4: these emails and when everything else happened. And the part 533 00:34:41,160 --> 00:34:43,799 Speaker 4: be that question is do you think based on this 534 00:34:43,960 --> 00:34:46,240 Speaker 4: that there's a possibility of him being disbarred? 535 00:34:46,560 --> 00:34:49,960 Speaker 3: I answer the first part first, Yes, he's held to 536 00:34:50,000 --> 00:34:53,080 Speaker 3: a higher standard. No, he will not have an easy 537 00:34:53,120 --> 00:34:56,520 Speaker 3: time making a defense claim of I didn't know. I'll 538 00:34:56,560 --> 00:34:59,440 Speaker 3: prove it to you, and I'll take some risk here, Carlos. 539 00:34:59,520 --> 00:35:02,879 Speaker 3: Let's say you and I had a contract going on. 540 00:35:03,800 --> 00:35:08,720 Speaker 3: Because I am an attorney and still hold a law license. 541 00:35:08,760 --> 00:35:12,160 Speaker 3: I'm not active in North Carolina now, but I still 542 00:35:12,160 --> 00:35:16,959 Speaker 3: have my license, right, the contract would be construed more 543 00:35:17,080 --> 00:35:22,440 Speaker 3: strictly against me than you. Even if the nature of 544 00:35:22,480 --> 00:35:26,120 Speaker 3: the contract was just you sold me a baloney sandwich 545 00:35:26,160 --> 00:35:29,239 Speaker 3: for two dollars, you could say, well, I didn't know 546 00:35:29,320 --> 00:35:32,440 Speaker 3: she was expecting it to be fried. And if I said, well, 547 00:35:32,520 --> 00:35:34,040 Speaker 3: yea right, No, of course I wanted it to be fried. 548 00:35:34,120 --> 00:35:37,240 Speaker 3: Everybody knows a baloney sandwich contract is a fried sandwich. 549 00:35:37,719 --> 00:35:40,279 Speaker 3: The court would say, none, no, no, Miss Williams. One of 550 00:35:40,320 --> 00:35:42,799 Speaker 3: y'all two went to law school. One of y'all two 551 00:35:42,800 --> 00:35:45,440 Speaker 3: took a bar exam. One of y'all two passed it. 552 00:35:46,080 --> 00:35:48,680 Speaker 3: You did, Miss Williams, So you should know that if 553 00:35:48,719 --> 00:35:53,239 Speaker 3: you expected your baloney sandwich to be fried, show it 554 00:35:53,239 --> 00:35:55,080 Speaker 3: to me in the four corners of the document where 555 00:35:55,120 --> 00:35:57,640 Speaker 3: you specified that you wanted a fried baloney sandwich for 556 00:35:57,680 --> 00:36:00,520 Speaker 3: the price of two dollars. See how that worked. The 557 00:36:00,600 --> 00:36:05,000 Speaker 3: contract is construed more strictly against the person with formal 558 00:36:05,120 --> 00:36:09,400 Speaker 3: legal training and legal experience. And just to show you 559 00:36:09,440 --> 00:36:11,759 Speaker 3: how minutia this plays out, because I've actually seen this. 560 00:36:11,760 --> 00:36:13,880 Speaker 3: This is a great line of questioning. By the way, Carlos, 561 00:36:13,960 --> 00:36:17,360 Speaker 3: you don't sometimes understand the brilliance of the minutia of 562 00:36:17,400 --> 00:36:19,960 Speaker 3: what you asked. Let's say this was me and a 563 00:36:20,040 --> 00:36:24,320 Speaker 3: law student. That law student would have some some burden, 564 00:36:24,760 --> 00:36:27,280 Speaker 3: but I would be held to a higher standard because 565 00:36:27,320 --> 00:36:30,480 Speaker 3: I completed law school and passed a bar. But if 566 00:36:30,760 --> 00:36:34,160 Speaker 3: it was you and the law student in a contract, 567 00:36:34,480 --> 00:36:37,640 Speaker 3: the law student would be held to a higher standard 568 00:36:37,760 --> 00:36:41,839 Speaker 3: than you. So they really do interpret it on a 569 00:36:41,880 --> 00:36:45,719 Speaker 3: case by case basis. If this was, you know, a 570 00:36:45,760 --> 00:36:50,240 Speaker 3: first year lawyer, maybe a little more leeway. To my knowledge, 571 00:36:50,360 --> 00:36:52,120 Speaker 3: Eddie is at least to think about as old as 572 00:36:52,160 --> 00:36:54,160 Speaker 3: I am. So Eddie is about twenty years in the game. 573 00:36:55,520 --> 00:36:58,880 Speaker 3: As an attorney that goes they have they cut us 574 00:36:59,080 --> 00:37:02,440 Speaker 3: very little margin. The expectation is that we know what 575 00:37:02,480 --> 00:37:05,839 Speaker 3: we sign, we know what we report, we know what 576 00:37:05,880 --> 00:37:08,600 Speaker 3: we call in, and we know what the hell we're doing. 577 00:37:08,719 --> 00:37:11,120 Speaker 3: That is the presumption. Now I'm not saying it's impossible 578 00:37:11,120 --> 00:37:13,120 Speaker 3: to argue your way out of that, but that is 579 00:37:13,160 --> 00:37:16,080 Speaker 3: going to be a very high threshold. The same thing 580 00:37:16,239 --> 00:37:19,920 Speaker 3: basically that has afforded the cephos rightfully. In my opinion, 581 00:37:20,320 --> 00:37:27,120 Speaker 3: prestige and deference and respect are all things that are 582 00:37:27,160 --> 00:37:32,600 Speaker 3: going to be held against them respectfully as it relates 583 00:37:32,640 --> 00:37:37,520 Speaker 3: to crafting a believable successful defense in a case involving fraud. 584 00:37:37,719 --> 00:37:41,520 Speaker 4: Last question, ebid K Williams, based on what you read, 585 00:37:41,760 --> 00:37:46,280 Speaker 4: based on your expertise, does ebny K Williams think those 586 00:37:46,320 --> 00:37:50,040 Speaker 4: cephos will serve jail time, whether it's the maximum fifteen 587 00:37:50,120 --> 00:37:52,000 Speaker 4: years or six months or whatever. 588 00:37:52,600 --> 00:37:55,120 Speaker 2: Do you think they'll ultimately serve jalp If they. 589 00:37:55,000 --> 00:37:58,399 Speaker 3: Are convicted, they will serve time. And part of that 590 00:37:58,719 --> 00:38:02,040 Speaker 3: I don't like in the sense that if that was 591 00:38:02,239 --> 00:38:06,200 Speaker 3: Mary Joe and Bobby Smith, I don't know that I 592 00:38:06,200 --> 00:38:08,600 Speaker 3: would give you that same answer their first time offender. 593 00:38:08,680 --> 00:38:11,360 Speaker 3: If they are convicted, they will be first time offenders. 594 00:38:12,040 --> 00:38:14,719 Speaker 3: It is a nonviolent crime, not saying that it is 595 00:38:14,800 --> 00:38:17,239 Speaker 3: a harmless crime, but it is a nonviolent crime. We 596 00:38:17,280 --> 00:38:21,279 Speaker 3: all can agree on that, as certainly we have seen 597 00:38:21,320 --> 00:38:24,319 Speaker 3: cases where people get probation and not what we call 598 00:38:24,440 --> 00:38:29,759 Speaker 3: non custodial sentences. But to me, this Sheriff's office, this 599 00:38:29,880 --> 00:38:33,879 Speaker 3: state prosecutor have already told us Carlow's king that they 600 00:38:33,960 --> 00:38:38,160 Speaker 3: are making examples out of these wealthy, famous black people. 601 00:38:38,600 --> 00:38:43,200 Speaker 3: They are. We know that from the press conference alone, 602 00:38:43,400 --> 00:38:47,759 Speaker 3: and we also know that Clock t when that state 603 00:38:47,840 --> 00:38:51,000 Speaker 3: attorney came out and one of the first things he 604 00:38:51,120 --> 00:38:54,120 Speaker 3: said out of his mouth was don't think of insurance 605 00:38:54,200 --> 00:38:57,879 Speaker 3: fraud as a victimless crime. He didn't have to say that, 606 00:38:58,480 --> 00:39:02,080 Speaker 3: did you Clock Tea on that? Because that was making 607 00:39:02,160 --> 00:39:06,680 Speaker 3: sure The first foundational premise of his remarks was that 608 00:39:06,719 --> 00:39:12,520 Speaker 3: this impacts you and me. This impacts every American that 609 00:39:12,640 --> 00:39:16,440 Speaker 3: folds an insurance policy and any capacity, and all of 610 00:39:16,520 --> 00:39:20,160 Speaker 3: us are impacted negatively. When people go about the business 611 00:39:20,160 --> 00:39:24,160 Speaker 3: of committing insurance fraud, all of our premiums rise, all 612 00:39:24,200 --> 00:39:27,239 Speaker 3: of our coverage decreases. He went into all of that 613 00:39:27,400 --> 00:39:31,200 Speaker 3: first and foremost. That is an indicator, Carlos, that they 614 00:39:31,239 --> 00:39:37,560 Speaker 3: intend to be as harsh and scrutinizing as legally possible 615 00:39:38,160 --> 00:39:41,000 Speaker 3: in this particular matter. And I don't like that. I 616 00:39:41,040 --> 00:39:44,400 Speaker 3: will tell you objectively, whether those semples are guilty or 617 00:39:44,480 --> 00:39:47,920 Speaker 3: not is not my business or even at this point 618 00:39:47,960 --> 00:39:51,600 Speaker 3: my concern. What I am concerned with is the fairness 619 00:39:51,680 --> 00:39:55,319 Speaker 3: of this process right now, and that indicates to me 620 00:39:55,760 --> 00:39:59,080 Speaker 3: that there is a tipped balancing of the scales as 621 00:39:59,120 --> 00:40:03,120 Speaker 3: it relates to the intentionality going into the case, and 622 00:40:03,400 --> 00:40:05,319 Speaker 3: I do not like that. So I think that they 623 00:40:05,360 --> 00:40:08,400 Speaker 3: if they are convicted, they will serve an active jail sentence. 624 00:40:08,400 --> 00:40:10,560 Speaker 3: I don't think there is any question about it. And 625 00:40:10,600 --> 00:40:13,879 Speaker 3: I think that that was determined at the onset of 626 00:40:13,920 --> 00:40:16,920 Speaker 3: the case because of all the facts that have been 627 00:40:16,960 --> 00:40:20,200 Speaker 3: laid out, because of who it is, because of how 628 00:40:20,239 --> 00:40:25,560 Speaker 3: they are perceived as wealthy, as black, as affluent, as 629 00:40:25,640 --> 00:40:30,279 Speaker 3: highly educated, and if this political, and don't think for 630 00:40:30,320 --> 00:40:32,799 Speaker 3: one second, Carlos, that the politics of the moment aren't 631 00:40:32,800 --> 00:40:37,399 Speaker 3: at play, because they are. They absolutely are. And there 632 00:40:37,480 --> 00:40:41,479 Speaker 3: is a cultural backlash that is happening in America again, 633 00:40:41,520 --> 00:40:45,600 Speaker 3: whether they're guilty or not. That says some of you 634 00:40:45,680 --> 00:40:49,839 Speaker 3: negroes have gotten way too much and we don't like it, 635 00:40:50,600 --> 00:40:53,439 Speaker 3: and we are looking to course correct in every way 636 00:40:53,440 --> 00:40:56,000 Speaker 3: available to us. And I think that is also very 637 00:40:56,040 --> 00:40:56,600 Speaker 3: much at play. 638 00:40:56,760 --> 00:40:58,640 Speaker 2: Thank you, m k Williams. 639 00:40:59,719 --> 00:41:02,759 Speaker 4: I would love to bring you back as further information 640 00:41:03,840 --> 00:41:07,680 Speaker 4: arise from this unfortunate situation. And like Ebany K Williams said, 641 00:41:08,239 --> 00:41:11,719 Speaker 4: rain Joss, remember they are innocent until proven guilty. So 642 00:41:11,920 --> 00:41:13,840 Speaker 4: thank you, Ebany, give my best at Baby Liberty. 643 00:41:13,920 --> 00:41:16,680 Speaker 3: Thank you dearly, See you soon by rain Drops. 644 00:41:18,960 --> 00:41:23,480 Speaker 1: Reality with the King is executive produced by me Carlos King, 645 00:41:23,880 --> 00:41:27,880 Speaker 1: produced by Lizzie Nimitz, and a partnership. 646 00:41:27,239 --> 00:41:29,360 Speaker 2: With the Lack of Effect Network. 647 00:41:29,719 --> 00:41:32,440 Speaker 1: You can also find us on my YouTube channel at 648 00:41:32,480 --> 00:41:35,720 Speaker 1: the Carlos King Underscore