1 00:00:05,240 --> 00:00:07,640 Speaker 1: Hey, this is prettyet and this is and you're listening 2 00:00:07,680 --> 00:00:21,000 Speaker 1: to stuff mom never told you. Now today we're pretty 3 00:00:21,000 --> 00:00:23,400 Speaker 1: excited to talk through something some of y'all might be 4 00:00:23,440 --> 00:00:27,080 Speaker 1: familiar with, and that is the landscape that is mom bloggers. 5 00:00:27,680 --> 00:00:30,560 Speaker 1: So you'll notice that I didn't actually say quote mommy 6 00:00:30,600 --> 00:00:34,280 Speaker 1: bloggers because I don't actually think that term encapsulates what 7 00:00:34,560 --> 00:00:37,639 Speaker 1: moms and women are actually doing on the internet. This 8 00:00:37,760 --> 00:00:42,000 Speaker 1: is the most on point mom stuff episode ever, I think, 9 00:00:42,080 --> 00:00:44,560 Speaker 1: quite frankly so, for everyone has ever looked at the 10 00:00:44,560 --> 00:00:46,800 Speaker 1: title of our podcast and said, am I going to 11 00:00:46,880 --> 00:00:49,920 Speaker 1: hear about mom stuff today? The answer is yes. But 12 00:00:50,040 --> 00:00:53,400 Speaker 1: whether you call it mom blogging or mommy blogging is 13 00:00:53,440 --> 00:00:56,000 Speaker 1: something we're going to leave up to you. Yeah, I have. 14 00:00:56,160 --> 00:00:58,280 Speaker 1: I have made the choice to call it mom blogging 15 00:00:58,360 --> 00:01:00,800 Speaker 1: only because I feel like mommy blogging is a way 16 00:01:00,800 --> 00:01:03,200 Speaker 1: of encapsulating the kind of writing that is taking place 17 00:01:03,240 --> 00:01:05,520 Speaker 1: when a mother writes online. I feel like it's a 18 00:01:05,520 --> 00:01:08,160 Speaker 1: way to say, oh, she just writes about raising her kid, 19 00:01:08,480 --> 00:01:10,199 Speaker 1: when in reality, a lot of these women are writing 20 00:01:10,200 --> 00:01:15,360 Speaker 1: about divorce, depression, self doubt, postpartum depression, all these really important, 21 00:01:15,400 --> 00:01:17,759 Speaker 1: heavy topics, and they just sort of get framed as 22 00:01:18,240 --> 00:01:20,920 Speaker 1: moms on the internet talking about mom stuff or like 23 00:01:21,000 --> 00:01:23,839 Speaker 1: mommy stuff. I guess there's something a little extra patronizing 24 00:01:23,840 --> 00:01:28,080 Speaker 1: about mommy. It's a little infantilizing, yes, because if you're 25 00:01:28,080 --> 00:01:30,600 Speaker 1: a woman who writes about what it's like to raise 26 00:01:30,600 --> 00:01:34,959 Speaker 1: an interracial child in America, that's not just mommy blogging, 27 00:01:35,040 --> 00:01:37,479 Speaker 1: or not just blogging about apple sauce and diapers. That's 28 00:01:37,480 --> 00:01:41,839 Speaker 1: heavy stuff. And then again, there are some mommy bloggers 29 00:01:41,880 --> 00:01:44,840 Speaker 1: who probably call themselves mommy bloggers and say, why shouldn't 30 00:01:44,880 --> 00:01:47,600 Speaker 1: I write about apple sauce and diapers. Absolutely so no, 31 00:01:47,760 --> 00:01:50,720 Speaker 1: say to either of them, We're screwed, basically, And we 32 00:01:50,760 --> 00:01:53,840 Speaker 1: know that we're going to be as non mothers ourselves. 33 00:01:53,880 --> 00:01:55,480 Speaker 1: We know that we are going to put our foots 34 00:01:55,480 --> 00:01:58,280 Speaker 1: in our mouths at some point during today's podcast. And 35 00:01:58,320 --> 00:02:00,480 Speaker 1: this is your disclaimer to please go east see on us. 36 00:02:00,760 --> 00:02:03,600 Speaker 1: Thank you, thank you for adding that. So first, let's 37 00:02:03,600 --> 00:02:06,320 Speaker 1: take a look at the mom blogging landscape. Moms actually 38 00:02:06,320 --> 00:02:08,480 Speaker 1: account for a huge chunk of writing on the Internet. 39 00:02:08,600 --> 00:02:12,320 Speaker 1: According to Women's Marketing, there are four point three million 40 00:02:12,520 --> 00:02:15,560 Speaker 1: mom bloggers out there, and five hundred of them are 41 00:02:15,600 --> 00:02:19,960 Speaker 1: considered to be extremely influential amongst other mothers, which is 42 00:02:19,960 --> 00:02:23,720 Speaker 1: a very coveted advertising market, isn't it absolutely? Something I 43 00:02:23,760 --> 00:02:26,440 Speaker 1: found really cool about looking at the mom blogging landscape 44 00:02:26,560 --> 00:02:28,680 Speaker 1: is how many of these writers were able to spin 45 00:02:29,080 --> 00:02:32,320 Speaker 1: their mom blog into really luquidive projects for themselves. I'm 46 00:02:32,360 --> 00:02:35,200 Speaker 1: talking about influential bloggers like Jenny Lawson of The blogg Is, 47 00:02:35,280 --> 00:02:38,200 Speaker 1: who's written several books and as a columnist, Rebecca Wolf 48 00:02:38,240 --> 00:02:40,960 Speaker 1: of Girls Gone Child, who has a nursery Dacre web 49 00:02:41,000 --> 00:02:44,040 Speaker 1: series with HDTV, and Rage Rummond a k a. The 50 00:02:44,080 --> 00:02:46,800 Speaker 1: Pioneer Woman, who I have to admit is kind of 51 00:02:46,800 --> 00:02:51,280 Speaker 1: one of my favorites hens. Her recipes are are easy 52 00:02:51,440 --> 00:02:54,519 Speaker 1: and unhealthy. Her recipes are delicious because it's all made 53 00:02:54,520 --> 00:02:57,280 Speaker 1: with like butter, and she's like, just throw a little 54 00:02:57,360 --> 00:02:59,560 Speaker 1: couple more sticks a butt her in here. She has 55 00:02:59,560 --> 00:03:02,079 Speaker 1: this like really delicate way of being, like, just load 56 00:03:02,240 --> 00:03:05,919 Speaker 1: up the fats in your food and it's delightful. And 57 00:03:05,960 --> 00:03:09,079 Speaker 1: I'm like, yes, Ray, you are so on point by 58 00:03:09,120 --> 00:03:11,680 Speaker 1: a dear woman, I will do that. Yeah. No, shade 59 00:03:11,680 --> 00:03:15,519 Speaker 1: to her. I she's like my problematic faith. I probably 60 00:03:15,520 --> 00:03:17,359 Speaker 1: make her recipes every night, So shout out to her 61 00:03:18,160 --> 00:03:21,000 Speaker 1: and really I think it's interesting how these women have 62 00:03:21,360 --> 00:03:24,000 Speaker 1: taken something that for so long has been looked at 63 00:03:24,160 --> 00:03:27,560 Speaker 1: as not important or frivolous or without literary merit, and 64 00:03:27,560 --> 00:03:31,880 Speaker 1: sput it into actual media empires, shows on TV, book deals, 65 00:03:31,919 --> 00:03:34,200 Speaker 1: web series and all of that good stuff. I think 66 00:03:34,200 --> 00:03:38,080 Speaker 1: it's impressive in today's writing economy for any blogger who 67 00:03:38,160 --> 00:03:41,160 Speaker 1: can turn their blog into a lucrative business. And I 68 00:03:41,240 --> 00:03:44,680 Speaker 1: love seeing these women who happen to be moms crushing 69 00:03:44,720 --> 00:03:47,560 Speaker 1: it definitely. So it's interesting that you say that because 70 00:03:47,680 --> 00:03:51,440 Speaker 1: one big aspect of the mom blog landscape is marketing 71 00:03:51,560 --> 00:03:54,080 Speaker 1: and brands and other ways of making money. So you 72 00:03:54,080 --> 00:03:56,400 Speaker 1: know how moms often go to other moms for trusted 73 00:03:56,400 --> 00:03:58,640 Speaker 1: advice when they're having a tough time with motherhood. That's 74 00:03:58,680 --> 00:04:00,880 Speaker 1: one reason why the mom blogging space is so right 75 00:04:00,960 --> 00:04:04,000 Speaker 1: for marketing and moneymaking. There's a real connection between mom 76 00:04:04,040 --> 00:04:08,120 Speaker 1: blogging and brands totally. According to e Marketer, parenting and 77 00:04:08,120 --> 00:04:11,680 Speaker 1: pregnancy websites are the top source moms and expectant moms 78 00:04:11,760 --> 00:04:16,240 Speaker 1: used to learn about products and services of daily active 79 00:04:16,240 --> 00:04:19,080 Speaker 1: social media moms say they made their purchase because of 80 00:04:19,080 --> 00:04:24,440 Speaker 1: a recommendation from a personal review blog and mom bloggers 81 00:04:23,560 --> 00:04:26,800 Speaker 1: are more likely than the general blocking population to be 82 00:04:26,880 --> 00:04:29,800 Speaker 1: approached by a brand. Wow, I gotta get into mommy blogging. 83 00:04:30,440 --> 00:04:34,039 Speaker 1: Have a kid first, lady, right, I mean, you don't 84 00:04:34,040 --> 00:04:36,840 Speaker 1: want to take my stage advice on how to have 85 00:04:36,880 --> 00:04:39,680 Speaker 1: a baby and be a boss mom. You could do 86 00:04:39,680 --> 00:04:43,800 Speaker 1: dog mom blogging. You could start that. I don't think 87 00:04:43,800 --> 00:04:45,480 Speaker 1: that's I don't think anyone's doing that. If someone is 88 00:04:45,520 --> 00:04:49,560 Speaker 1: doing that, doggy mommy blogging coming to a web series 89 00:04:49,600 --> 00:04:52,600 Speaker 1: near you soon, I love that. Let me just get 90 00:04:52,600 --> 00:04:56,719 Speaker 1: back to the point here, which is bloggers have transitioned 91 00:04:56,839 --> 00:05:01,599 Speaker 1: in terms of their marketing strategies and business models around 92 00:05:01,600 --> 00:05:04,440 Speaker 1: blogging over the years. In the early days of blogging, 93 00:05:04,680 --> 00:05:07,440 Speaker 1: a lot of writers made money through banner ads. You 94 00:05:07,440 --> 00:05:11,320 Speaker 1: remember those. Yeah, those were those rectangular ads the top 95 00:05:11,360 --> 00:05:13,479 Speaker 1: of copy that you would you're supposed to click on 96 00:05:13,560 --> 00:05:15,400 Speaker 1: and it takes you away from the thing that you're reading. 97 00:05:15,760 --> 00:05:17,920 Speaker 1: And remember and they're still out there quite a bit 98 00:05:17,960 --> 00:05:20,160 Speaker 1: of them. I mean, Google display ads are a big 99 00:05:20,200 --> 00:05:22,560 Speaker 1: part of that um and in the good old days 100 00:05:22,600 --> 00:05:25,719 Speaker 1: those ads were very successful. The first banner ad was 101 00:05:25,800 --> 00:05:28,120 Speaker 1: for eighteen ten and it ran on a site called 102 00:05:28,160 --> 00:05:32,640 Speaker 1: hot wired. In of the people who sought, seventy eight 103 00:05:33,000 --> 00:05:36,320 Speaker 1: percent clicked on it, according to Susan vital, a senior 104 00:05:36,360 --> 00:05:40,640 Speaker 1: analyst at forrest Or Research. And is that true today, 105 00:05:40,760 --> 00:05:44,280 Speaker 1: bridget It is not true today. As you, me and 106 00:05:44,320 --> 00:05:47,080 Speaker 1: other folks that read content on the web get more savvy, 107 00:05:47,520 --> 00:05:49,320 Speaker 1: you know, we're not clicking on those banner ads. We 108 00:05:49,360 --> 00:05:50,880 Speaker 1: know to stay away from them, we know not to 109 00:05:50,960 --> 00:05:53,240 Speaker 1: click them, and so now they don't really get as 110 00:05:53,279 --> 00:05:55,240 Speaker 1: much attraction. Now what you see is the rise of 111 00:05:55,480 --> 00:06:00,080 Speaker 1: native ads or sponsored content, sometimes affectionately known as spawn on. 112 00:06:00,600 --> 00:06:03,279 Speaker 1: You can think of that as Instagram photos that have 113 00:06:03,320 --> 00:06:05,640 Speaker 1: a picture of a cute kid eating a specific kind 114 00:06:05,640 --> 00:06:08,279 Speaker 1: of yogurt, or someone goes on a trip and uses 115 00:06:08,279 --> 00:06:11,200 Speaker 1: a specific kind of hotel and they pick beautiful pictures 116 00:06:11,240 --> 00:06:13,080 Speaker 1: of the hotel for their Instagram and shout at the 117 00:06:13,080 --> 00:06:16,720 Speaker 1: hotel chain in the copy. And BuzzFeed is pioneered sponsored 118 00:06:16,720 --> 00:06:18,200 Speaker 1: content in a lot of ways. A lot of their 119 00:06:18,240 --> 00:06:23,599 Speaker 1: posts are sponsored by advertiser, but the content of the 120 00:06:23,600 --> 00:06:27,120 Speaker 1: post itself is not necessarily about the product or service. 121 00:06:27,200 --> 00:06:29,200 Speaker 1: It's sort of they make a connection based on what 122 00:06:29,279 --> 00:06:32,960 Speaker 1: the campaign is that they're writing. It's very complicated in 123 00:06:33,080 --> 00:06:35,800 Speaker 1: terms of ethics around it, which we're gonna get into. Yeah, 124 00:06:35,800 --> 00:06:37,559 Speaker 1: it used to be when it was a banner AD, 125 00:06:37,600 --> 00:06:40,520 Speaker 1: it was clear editorially and visually that you were clicking 126 00:06:40,560 --> 00:06:42,960 Speaker 1: on an AD. Now it's much more difficult to tell 127 00:06:43,080 --> 00:06:46,720 Speaker 1: sponsored content from editorial content. A good example would be 128 00:06:46,800 --> 00:06:49,640 Speaker 1: a BuzzFeed quiz where it's build a subway sandwich and 129 00:06:49,680 --> 00:06:53,280 Speaker 1: I'll tell you about your personality and it may be 130 00:06:53,400 --> 00:06:56,080 Speaker 1: fun to click through, but actually you're you're engaging with 131 00:06:56,120 --> 00:06:58,400 Speaker 1: an AD. That can be a little tricky to tell 132 00:06:58,400 --> 00:07:01,960 Speaker 1: it it is. Usually it will say sponsored content in 133 00:07:02,040 --> 00:07:04,000 Speaker 1: some form I think legally have to tell you. I 134 00:07:04,080 --> 00:07:06,800 Speaker 1: was going to say it should beyond that. It can 135 00:07:06,839 --> 00:07:09,240 Speaker 1: be like I found myself clicking through a quiz or 136 00:07:09,360 --> 00:07:12,480 Speaker 1: reading an article and later come to find out like, oh, 137 00:07:12,520 --> 00:07:14,520 Speaker 1: this was an AD. I was just engaging with an 138 00:07:14,520 --> 00:07:17,480 Speaker 1: adver twenty minutes. That's like a dream come true for 139 00:07:17,520 --> 00:07:21,520 Speaker 1: advertisers to hear. And you know, the question is is 140 00:07:21,560 --> 00:07:23,840 Speaker 1: that a bad thing? Did you enjoy the quiz? Like, 141 00:07:24,000 --> 00:07:26,920 Speaker 1: isn't necessarily evil? I don't. I don't think so. Yeah, 142 00:07:26,960 --> 00:07:28,960 Speaker 1: I don't necessarily think so. And I think that's where 143 00:07:28,960 --> 00:07:32,000 Speaker 1: this issue gets so complicated, because, on the one hand, 144 00:07:32,040 --> 00:07:34,320 Speaker 1: I think it's great if women who are moms want 145 00:07:34,320 --> 00:07:37,840 Speaker 1: to make extra money by you know, putting out sponsored content, 146 00:07:37,920 --> 00:07:39,800 Speaker 1: good for them. They should be they should be making 147 00:07:39,840 --> 00:07:42,440 Speaker 1: extra money. But a lot of critics out there say 148 00:07:42,520 --> 00:07:46,640 Speaker 1: that this pushed towards monetization, and this pushed toward social 149 00:07:46,640 --> 00:07:50,200 Speaker 1: media platforms like Instagram and away from gritty, first person 150 00:07:50,400 --> 00:07:54,520 Speaker 1: actual editorial content. Is making the mom blog landscape a 151 00:07:54,520 --> 00:07:56,440 Speaker 1: lot more sanitized. Where it used to be a place 152 00:07:56,440 --> 00:07:59,960 Speaker 1: to find really authentic writing about the realities of motherhood. Now, 153 00:08:00,040 --> 00:08:04,440 Speaker 1: what's this beautiful, polished airbrush place that makes motherhood look 154 00:08:05,080 --> 00:08:08,280 Speaker 1: one kind of boring but also kind of easy. Well, 155 00:08:08,320 --> 00:08:11,240 Speaker 1: it's the rise of all the problems with lifestyle bloggers 156 00:08:11,240 --> 00:08:13,760 Speaker 1: in general too. I think back to our episode on 157 00:08:13,840 --> 00:08:16,960 Speaker 1: Pinterest Perfect Life, and I would venture to guess that 158 00:08:17,000 --> 00:08:19,640 Speaker 1: people aren't reading mommy blogs to see how perfect your 159 00:08:19,720 --> 00:08:22,320 Speaker 1: life looks like, right, They are looking for connection and 160 00:08:22,360 --> 00:08:26,800 Speaker 1: relatability and solutions to challenges. And there are critics who 161 00:08:26,800 --> 00:08:29,239 Speaker 1: would say that the rise of sponsored content has made 162 00:08:29,680 --> 00:08:33,000 Speaker 1: the world of mom blogging less authentic. It used to be, 163 00:08:33,480 --> 00:08:36,840 Speaker 1: you know, chronicling women dealing with all kinds of challenging 164 00:08:36,880 --> 00:08:41,120 Speaker 1: issues like postpartum depression and divorce. And now, like you said, Bridget, 165 00:08:41,160 --> 00:08:46,880 Speaker 1: it looks like a beautiful, distilled version of your pastel, 166 00:08:47,040 --> 00:08:51,439 Speaker 1: perfect Pinterest perfection mom life, which is not possible. It 167 00:08:51,559 --> 00:08:54,839 Speaker 1: just it sets this expectation for moms who are not 168 00:08:54,960 --> 00:08:57,640 Speaker 1: living that kind of a curated life to feel bad 169 00:08:57,679 --> 00:09:00,440 Speaker 1: about themselves. And I think if there's one group of 170 00:09:00,480 --> 00:09:02,840 Speaker 1: people who don't need more incentive to feel like they're 171 00:09:02,840 --> 00:09:05,480 Speaker 1: doing a crappy job or to compare themselves to others, 172 00:09:05,600 --> 00:09:08,960 Speaker 1: it's new moms. I mean being a mom. As I understand, 173 00:09:08,960 --> 00:09:11,400 Speaker 1: it is a pretty hard thing to do. It has 174 00:09:11,480 --> 00:09:13,800 Speaker 1: ups and downs. My friends who have just had kids 175 00:09:13,800 --> 00:09:16,079 Speaker 1: are like, yeah, I got no sleep because my kid 176 00:09:16,080 --> 00:09:17,560 Speaker 1: was up all night vomiting and I don't know what 177 00:09:17,600 --> 00:09:19,840 Speaker 1: to do. Or I feel like a crappy mom because 178 00:09:19,960 --> 00:09:22,160 Speaker 1: I did X y Z. If there's one group of 179 00:09:22,160 --> 00:09:24,000 Speaker 1: people who should not be feeling like they need to 180 00:09:24,000 --> 00:09:27,439 Speaker 1: compare themselves to someone who seemingly is crushing it all 181 00:09:27,440 --> 00:09:30,920 Speaker 1: the time, it's moms. Yeah, let's give moms a break 182 00:09:31,880 --> 00:09:35,280 Speaker 1: instead of raising the bar. Absolutely. There's this great article 183 00:09:35,320 --> 00:09:38,000 Speaker 1: in the Washington Post called how the mom Internet became 184 00:09:38,040 --> 00:09:41,240 Speaker 1: a spotless sponsored void by Sarah Pulliam Bailey, and she 185 00:09:41,400 --> 00:09:43,320 Speaker 1: argues that the early days of mom blog and used 186 00:09:43,360 --> 00:09:46,160 Speaker 1: to show the unflinching, gritty realities of motherhood, and now 187 00:09:46,160 --> 00:09:49,240 Speaker 1: it's given way to this perfectly manicured vision of what 188 00:09:49,280 --> 00:09:52,760 Speaker 1: motherhood looks like. She writes, this is the mommy Internet now. 189 00:09:52,960 --> 00:09:56,520 Speaker 1: It's beautiful, it's aspirational. It's also miles from what motherhood 190 00:09:56,520 --> 00:09:58,160 Speaker 1: looks like for many of us, and miles and what 191 00:09:58,200 --> 00:10:00,840 Speaker 1: the mommy Internet looks like a decade ago. She describes 192 00:10:00,880 --> 00:10:03,800 Speaker 1: as prolific mom blogger Heather Armstrong, who had the Douce 193 00:10:03,920 --> 00:10:07,080 Speaker 1: dot com in two thousand one, and basically how the 194 00:10:07,160 --> 00:10:10,439 Speaker 1: push to make the mom landscape look perfect and airbrushed 195 00:10:10,440 --> 00:10:14,600 Speaker 1: and manicured and curated basically drove her from blogging. She writes, 196 00:10:15,080 --> 00:10:17,800 Speaker 1: when Heather Armstrong launched Doce dot com in two thousand one, 197 00:10:18,080 --> 00:10:20,800 Speaker 1: the emerging mom Internet was dominated by blogs, and those 198 00:10:20,800 --> 00:10:24,080 Speaker 1: blogs were raw and authentic. Some writers focused on parenting, 199 00:10:24,120 --> 00:10:26,560 Speaker 1: but many used a wider lens to chronicle the ups 200 00:10:26,559 --> 00:10:29,520 Speaker 1: and downs of their lives. Armstrong what about her depression, 201 00:10:29,679 --> 00:10:32,840 Speaker 1: her time in a psychiatric hospital, her divorce, her experience 202 00:10:32,880 --> 00:10:35,160 Speaker 1: is growing up in the Mormon church, and she goes 203 00:10:35,240 --> 00:10:38,480 Speaker 1: on to say that what we've lost in the quest 204 00:10:38,559 --> 00:10:42,760 Speaker 1: for sponsorship is quote a source of support and community, 205 00:10:42,920 --> 00:10:46,079 Speaker 1: a place to share vulnerability and find like minded women, 206 00:10:46,400 --> 00:10:49,800 Speaker 1: and a forum for female expertise and wisdom. It's just 207 00:10:50,120 --> 00:10:55,040 Speaker 1: so sad, says Armstrong. It's all these staged, curated photos 208 00:10:55,080 --> 00:10:58,560 Speaker 1: that don't show the messier parts of life. Yeah. The 209 00:10:58,600 --> 00:11:00,920 Speaker 1: Washington Post goes on to say, the biggest stars of 210 00:11:00,960 --> 00:11:03,600 Speaker 1: the mommy Internet now are no longer confessional blockers. They're 211 00:11:03,640 --> 00:11:06,640 Speaker 1: curators of life, their influencers, their pitch women. And so 212 00:11:06,720 --> 00:11:10,240 Speaker 1: you really have these competing forces where on the one hand, 213 00:11:10,360 --> 00:11:13,760 Speaker 1: it's women who want to chronicle the grittier realities of 214 00:11:13,760 --> 00:11:16,400 Speaker 1: what that life looks like and other women who are 215 00:11:16,760 --> 00:11:18,760 Speaker 1: really more in the space to sort of show that 216 00:11:18,800 --> 00:11:21,640 Speaker 1: curated life. I want to talk more about Heather Armstrong 217 00:11:21,640 --> 00:11:23,880 Speaker 1: and how this impacted her work with blogging after this 218 00:11:23,960 --> 00:11:34,640 Speaker 1: quick break and we're back. We were just talking about 219 00:11:34,679 --> 00:11:37,040 Speaker 1: Heather Armstrong at the Douce dot com and how her 220 00:11:37,120 --> 00:11:39,600 Speaker 1: story really is a great example of how the rise 221 00:11:39,640 --> 00:11:43,400 Speaker 1: of sponsored content has changed the mom blocking landscape. So 222 00:11:43,600 --> 00:11:46,320 Speaker 1: Armstrong with you were saying, before was really known for 223 00:11:46,400 --> 00:11:50,400 Speaker 1: these candid, confessional, kind of gritty looks into her life 224 00:11:50,400 --> 00:11:53,280 Speaker 1: as a mom. By she had a hundred thousand daily 225 00:11:53,360 --> 00:11:55,480 Speaker 1: visitors in The New York Times called her the Queen 226 00:11:55,559 --> 00:11:57,840 Speaker 1: of mommy bloggers, and so back in the day when 227 00:11:58,160 --> 00:12:02,439 Speaker 1: views and readers really paid the bills through display ads, 228 00:12:02,480 --> 00:12:05,000 Speaker 1: it sounds like that was working for her. But now 229 00:12:05,040 --> 00:12:07,560 Speaker 1: that the rise of sponsored content has more to do 230 00:12:07,640 --> 00:12:11,400 Speaker 1: with Instagram and visuals, and we know that people like 231 00:12:11,520 --> 00:12:16,000 Speaker 1: Instagram visuals that are aspirational by nature, it feels like 232 00:12:16,080 --> 00:12:18,559 Speaker 1: the message that she wants to put out there is 233 00:12:18,600 --> 00:12:22,079 Speaker 1: no longer working with a new medium that makes money exactly. 234 00:12:22,200 --> 00:12:24,600 Speaker 1: One quick technical point about that is, like most of us, 235 00:12:24,800 --> 00:12:27,240 Speaker 1: we aren't really using our browsers and our computers as 236 00:12:27,320 --> 00:12:29,559 Speaker 1: much to get content. You're usually scrolling through your phone. 237 00:12:29,559 --> 00:12:32,559 Speaker 1: And because of that, less bloggers are having their own 238 00:12:32,720 --> 00:12:36,080 Speaker 1: standalone website, you know, mom and Virginia dot blogspot dot com. 239 00:12:36,320 --> 00:12:39,640 Speaker 1: You're more likely to have Instagram or Facebook be the destination. 240 00:12:39,679 --> 00:12:41,600 Speaker 1: And so because of that trend, and that's not just 241 00:12:41,640 --> 00:12:45,280 Speaker 1: a mommy blog trend, that's an Internet trend writ large. Yeah, 242 00:12:45,360 --> 00:12:49,760 Speaker 1: and so for me, I guess I feel a little defensive. 243 00:12:50,000 --> 00:12:52,559 Speaker 1: I think probably because I'm in the space, because I'm 244 00:12:52,559 --> 00:12:54,280 Speaker 1: a writer, because I'm a blogger, because I have my 245 00:12:54,280 --> 00:12:58,440 Speaker 1: own brand. Not that we've been sponsored yet, but I'm 246 00:12:58,440 --> 00:13:01,800 Speaker 1: not at all not interested in the conversation. I feel 247 00:13:01,840 --> 00:13:05,800 Speaker 1: like vulnerability is welcome on the Internet still, you know 248 00:13:05,840 --> 00:13:08,120 Speaker 1: what I mean, Like, if she wants to blog about depression, 249 00:13:08,120 --> 00:13:12,359 Speaker 1: if she wants to write about her gritty, real world's 250 00:13:12,520 --> 00:13:15,679 Speaker 1: battles of motherhood, I think there's an audience for that. 251 00:13:15,720 --> 00:13:18,520 Speaker 1: I think the Internet would love to see some authenticity 252 00:13:18,640 --> 00:13:22,120 Speaker 1: on Instagram. And it requires being courageous. And you know 253 00:13:22,160 --> 00:13:25,720 Speaker 1: what it might mean that Tide isn't going to sponsor 254 00:13:25,840 --> 00:13:29,599 Speaker 1: your depression post. And that's just the that's the consequence, 255 00:13:29,920 --> 00:13:31,880 Speaker 1: you know what I mean. Like, I get what she's saying, 256 00:13:31,920 --> 00:13:36,199 Speaker 1: which is that the financial incentives make it less viable 257 00:13:36,240 --> 00:13:38,400 Speaker 1: for writers who want to write about the real stuff, 258 00:13:38,480 --> 00:13:41,040 Speaker 1: and make it much more incentivized to write about the 259 00:13:41,160 --> 00:13:45,640 Speaker 1: sanitized version of motherhood. But nobody's stopping you from putting 260 00:13:45,640 --> 00:13:47,720 Speaker 1: your message out there on the Internet. That's supposed to 261 00:13:47,720 --> 00:13:50,680 Speaker 1: be the beauty of the small d democratization of our media. 262 00:13:51,160 --> 00:13:54,080 Speaker 1: Just don't expect to get paid for it by sponsored advertisers. 263 00:13:54,480 --> 00:13:57,000 Speaker 1: I think you're onto something for sure. But I guess 264 00:13:57,000 --> 00:14:00,120 Speaker 1: her point would be women don't need another play on 265 00:14:00,160 --> 00:14:03,319 Speaker 1: the internet telling them to buy tide pods. Women don't 266 00:14:03,360 --> 00:14:06,520 Speaker 1: them or eat them. Moms don't need another place on 267 00:14:06,559 --> 00:14:08,319 Speaker 1: the internet telling them what kind of yogurt to buy. 268 00:14:08,400 --> 00:14:11,560 Speaker 1: They need real camaraderie. And I think that's what she's saying. 269 00:14:11,600 --> 00:14:15,160 Speaker 1: She's saying that this push toward Instagram and sponsored content 270 00:14:15,720 --> 00:14:18,800 Speaker 1: is leaving a lot of moms who relied on this 271 00:14:18,920 --> 00:14:21,720 Speaker 1: sense of community and relied on sort of getting that 272 00:14:21,960 --> 00:14:23,880 Speaker 1: having a place to make a talk authentically about that, 273 00:14:24,320 --> 00:14:26,760 Speaker 1: because that's no longer a popular thing with the rise 274 00:14:26,800 --> 00:14:29,480 Speaker 1: of sponsored content, that these women are losing out. I 275 00:14:29,520 --> 00:14:33,000 Speaker 1: hear you, and I call bullsh on that whole argument, because, 276 00:14:33,480 --> 00:14:36,080 Speaker 1: first of all, what has made my business successful is 277 00:14:36,120 --> 00:14:39,160 Speaker 1: the community we've felt online. And it took a long time, 278 00:14:39,320 --> 00:14:41,560 Speaker 1: it took a lot of work, and nobody you've sponsored it, 279 00:14:41,920 --> 00:14:43,440 Speaker 1: you know what I mean. Like, if you want to 280 00:14:43,480 --> 00:14:47,720 Speaker 1: create community, create community online and it'll work long term, 281 00:14:47,800 --> 00:14:49,320 Speaker 1: you know what I mean. But you know what, you 282 00:14:49,400 --> 00:14:51,800 Speaker 1: can't expect to get paid to build a community. You 283 00:14:51,840 --> 00:14:53,960 Speaker 1: have to build a community first and then find a 284 00:14:53,960 --> 00:14:56,920 Speaker 1: way to get paid for it. And quite frankly, I 285 00:14:56,960 --> 00:15:00,960 Speaker 1: think Instagram influencers who are doing it right in a 286 00:15:01,000 --> 00:15:05,880 Speaker 1: sustainable way our building community and they're limiting how much 287 00:15:05,920 --> 00:15:08,080 Speaker 1: they sponsored the content that they're putting out towards that 288 00:15:08,120 --> 00:15:12,520 Speaker 1: community so that they're not harming the actual value that 289 00:15:12,560 --> 00:15:15,040 Speaker 1: people are getting from their content in the long run, 290 00:15:15,360 --> 00:15:17,520 Speaker 1: because that's the risk you run. You run over doing 291 00:15:17,520 --> 00:15:20,120 Speaker 1: it and harming it. There's a twenty eight rule out 292 00:15:20,120 --> 00:15:24,200 Speaker 1: there on the Internet about sort of influencers. All of 293 00:15:24,320 --> 00:15:29,040 Speaker 1: us have to produce eight free stuff, free value that 294 00:15:29,040 --> 00:15:32,120 Speaker 1: we're giving to our community in order to justify a 295 00:15:33,000 --> 00:15:36,320 Speaker 1: ratio of selling them stuff. And I think that's part 296 00:15:36,320 --> 00:15:38,480 Speaker 1: of the golden rule of the Internet. You expect to 297 00:15:38,520 --> 00:15:41,080 Speaker 1: get free podcasts in your earbuds, you expect to get 298 00:15:41,360 --> 00:15:45,800 Speaker 1: you know, free Instagram inspo recipes every day. You expect 299 00:15:45,840 --> 00:15:49,000 Speaker 1: to be sold to on occasion. You expect to get 300 00:15:49,000 --> 00:15:53,480 Speaker 1: an advertiser interrupt your programming on occasion. And that's the 301 00:15:53,520 --> 00:15:55,920 Speaker 1: deal we're all making with our with ourselves. And it's 302 00:15:55,960 --> 00:15:59,200 Speaker 1: not easy as a creator, So I get what she's saying. 303 00:15:59,280 --> 00:16:01,800 Speaker 1: I just think you've how to adapt your message for 304 00:16:01,840 --> 00:16:05,800 Speaker 1: the medium as it changes. Yeah, I get what you're saying, 305 00:16:05,960 --> 00:16:08,080 Speaker 1: but my I guess I'm not trying to come down 306 00:16:08,160 --> 00:16:10,760 Speaker 1: and here too hard. But I do feel sensitive about 307 00:16:10,760 --> 00:16:13,360 Speaker 1: this because I'm in the mix, right. I get what 308 00:16:13,360 --> 00:16:16,000 Speaker 1: you're saying that maybe you shouldn't expect you could write 309 00:16:16,000 --> 00:16:18,920 Speaker 1: a gritty post and get paid for it and have 310 00:16:19,080 --> 00:16:21,880 Speaker 1: that be the situation. But I also think it's fair 311 00:16:21,920 --> 00:16:24,200 Speaker 1: to ask what are we losing out on in this 312 00:16:24,240 --> 00:16:27,400 Speaker 1: new situation. You know, before pretty much anybody who wanted 313 00:16:27,400 --> 00:16:30,120 Speaker 1: to put a message out there, you could use these bloggers, 314 00:16:30,120 --> 00:16:32,960 Speaker 1: could use banner ads, and you could write a you know, 315 00:16:33,320 --> 00:16:36,200 Speaker 1: long hom piece about your postpartum depression and make a 316 00:16:36,240 --> 00:16:38,600 Speaker 1: little bit of money. That's no longer possible in the 317 00:16:38,640 --> 00:16:41,160 Speaker 1: new blocking landscape. And so I guess the question is 318 00:16:41,640 --> 00:16:44,840 Speaker 1: where does that leave women? But where does that leave us? 319 00:16:44,960 --> 00:16:46,840 Speaker 1: Where does that leave us? And I think what you're 320 00:16:46,880 --> 00:16:49,960 Speaker 1: saying is fair that you know you shouldn't expect to 321 00:16:49,960 --> 00:16:52,680 Speaker 1: get paid for If no one's tied isn't gonna pay 322 00:16:52,720 --> 00:16:55,000 Speaker 1: for your depression post, that's, you know, suck it up 323 00:16:55,000 --> 00:16:58,000 Speaker 1: and deal with it. But I just think that there's 324 00:16:58,000 --> 00:17:01,160 Speaker 1: a there should be a place online where that kind 325 00:17:01,200 --> 00:17:03,280 Speaker 1: of content can do well. And I don't think that 326 00:17:03,320 --> 00:17:07,120 Speaker 1: the landscape that only privileges, you know, moms who are 327 00:17:07,200 --> 00:17:10,600 Speaker 1: killing it is doing anybody any favors. I agree, and 328 00:17:10,800 --> 00:17:13,919 Speaker 1: I would challenge brands to say, maybe you don't have 329 00:17:14,000 --> 00:17:16,879 Speaker 1: to align yourself with perfection. Maybe you can align yourself 330 00:17:16,880 --> 00:17:19,359 Speaker 1: with authenticity. Maybe there's a brand out there that will say, 331 00:17:19,600 --> 00:17:22,240 Speaker 1: you know what, life is hard, and our consumers get that, 332 00:17:22,320 --> 00:17:24,399 Speaker 1: and you want to sell to them in ways that 333 00:17:24,440 --> 00:17:27,320 Speaker 1: show that we understand that too. Bridges the capitalists coming 334 00:17:27,359 --> 00:17:29,280 Speaker 1: out right now. I'm just saying, there's gotta be a 335 00:17:29,320 --> 00:17:31,400 Speaker 1: workable way to make this work for everybody, and it's 336 00:17:31,400 --> 00:17:33,919 Speaker 1: clearly not working now. Yeah, well, there's a financial argument, 337 00:17:33,960 --> 00:17:36,720 Speaker 1: I think to embracing vulnerability. Here's what I would say. 338 00:17:36,840 --> 00:17:39,840 Speaker 1: You know, back in the day when the printing press 339 00:17:40,119 --> 00:17:44,440 Speaker 1: was the only means for mass uh production of compositions, 340 00:17:45,119 --> 00:17:48,240 Speaker 1: that's certainly limited people too, you know, and that limited 341 00:17:48,240 --> 00:17:51,840 Speaker 1: the messages that we heard. And once the printing press 342 00:17:52,160 --> 00:17:55,840 Speaker 1: was revolutionized to daily papers, that let more voices come 343 00:17:55,840 --> 00:17:58,639 Speaker 1: into play, that let more creators write for money, and 344 00:17:58,680 --> 00:18:03,320 Speaker 1: then after people stopped buying newspapers, things changed again. This 345 00:18:03,480 --> 00:18:07,320 Speaker 1: is a never ending conversation about how the medium shapes 346 00:18:07,440 --> 00:18:10,840 Speaker 1: the message, not to get to you know, psych one 347 00:18:10,880 --> 00:18:13,840 Speaker 1: oh one or media politics one oh one on us. 348 00:18:13,880 --> 00:18:17,439 Speaker 1: But I just think that it's kind of cute to 349 00:18:17,560 --> 00:18:20,600 Speaker 1: be shaking your fist at a cloud saying back in 350 00:18:20,680 --> 00:18:24,439 Speaker 1: the good old days of two thousand and nine, the 351 00:18:24,440 --> 00:18:28,320 Speaker 1: Internet was structured properly to reward the right people. And 352 00:18:28,400 --> 00:18:32,400 Speaker 1: now that it's you know, seven years later, we're mourning 353 00:18:32,440 --> 00:18:35,479 Speaker 1: the loss of the structures that paid writers. I get it, 354 00:18:36,080 --> 00:18:40,920 Speaker 1: but this cycle of like disenfranchisement is going to continue, 355 00:18:40,960 --> 00:18:42,600 Speaker 1: and we have to figure out what we're gonna do 356 00:18:42,640 --> 00:18:46,040 Speaker 1: about it. See, I actually feel completely different as someone 357 00:18:46,080 --> 00:18:48,520 Speaker 1: who is a content creator who's worked for publishers. I 358 00:18:48,520 --> 00:18:51,520 Speaker 1: think that what's happening on the mom Internet is happening everywhere. 359 00:18:51,840 --> 00:18:54,280 Speaker 1: In the Washington Post article they actually talk about how 360 00:18:54,880 --> 00:18:57,320 Speaker 1: as a publisher they're dealing with the very same thing. 361 00:18:57,400 --> 00:18:59,120 Speaker 1: And so I think when you look at the way 362 00:18:59,119 --> 00:19:01,960 Speaker 1: that Facebook not got on my like anti Facebook high horse, 363 00:19:02,000 --> 00:19:03,840 Speaker 1: but look at the way that Facebook has made it 364 00:19:03,880 --> 00:19:09,000 Speaker 1: so that publishers and content creators are completely at their will. Right, 365 00:19:09,280 --> 00:19:12,080 Speaker 1: Facebook can wake up one day and say we're making 366 00:19:12,080 --> 00:19:14,320 Speaker 1: this tweak. So all of the money that you've put 367 00:19:14,320 --> 00:19:17,560 Speaker 1: into this one content strategy, the entire staff that you've 368 00:19:17,560 --> 00:19:19,840 Speaker 1: built up to play to this strategy that we said 369 00:19:19,880 --> 00:19:22,199 Speaker 1: was the winner is done. Fire them all. When you 370 00:19:22,240 --> 00:19:25,439 Speaker 1: see publishers clean house and getting an entire staffs like 371 00:19:25,440 --> 00:19:28,400 Speaker 1: Funny or Die did earlier this year, that's what's going on. 372 00:19:28,440 --> 00:19:30,800 Speaker 1: And I think it's fair to ask, what are the 373 00:19:30,880 --> 00:19:33,560 Speaker 1: nuances that are getting lost in the way that technology 374 00:19:33,640 --> 00:19:35,879 Speaker 1: and social media is shaping the media that we produce 375 00:19:35,920 --> 00:19:38,160 Speaker 1: and a content that we produce and how it gets consumed. 376 00:19:39,040 --> 00:19:42,440 Speaker 1: Mike Drop, You've got me. Let's do it. Let's ask 377 00:19:42,440 --> 00:19:45,080 Speaker 1: those questions. I love it. Yeah. One person who was 378 00:19:45,119 --> 00:19:48,560 Speaker 1: asking those questions is blogger Josie Denise, who shuttered her 379 00:19:48,600 --> 00:19:51,960 Speaker 1: blog American Mama a few years ago. Basically, she got 380 00:19:52,040 --> 00:19:54,480 Speaker 1: fed up with the way that, she says that brands 381 00:19:54,520 --> 00:19:57,680 Speaker 1: and sponsored content made her feel muzzled. When she first 382 00:19:57,720 --> 00:20:00,200 Speaker 1: got a check for you know, writing a spot, would 383 00:20:00,200 --> 00:20:02,640 Speaker 1: post or something, she was excited, but then she got 384 00:20:02,680 --> 00:20:05,240 Speaker 1: this feeling like brands were watching her. So she didn't 385 00:20:05,240 --> 00:20:08,400 Speaker 1: want to write anything too dark, anything too gritty, anything 386 00:20:08,440 --> 00:20:11,040 Speaker 1: too real less that money dry up. And so when 387 00:20:11,080 --> 00:20:14,840 Speaker 1: she decided to quit blogging. She wrote this scathing open 388 00:20:14,920 --> 00:20:18,639 Speaker 1: letter called Dear mom Blogger to the community, basically calling 389 00:20:18,640 --> 00:20:22,240 Speaker 1: the whole thing bullsh Josie's letter says, Dear mommy Blogger, 390 00:20:22,560 --> 00:20:25,679 Speaker 1: nobody is reading your I mean no one. Even the 391 00:20:25,760 --> 00:20:28,000 Speaker 1: people that you think are reading your they aren't actually 392 00:20:28,000 --> 00:20:30,760 Speaker 1: reading it. The other mommy bloggers sure hell aren't reading it. 393 00:20:31,000 --> 00:20:32,879 Speaker 1: They are scanning it for keywords that they can use 394 00:20:32,880 --> 00:20:35,440 Speaker 1: in their comments. So cute. Yeah, I have to try this. 395 00:20:35,760 --> 00:20:38,720 Speaker 1: They've been told, like you, in order to grow your brand, 396 00:20:38,920 --> 00:20:41,400 Speaker 1: you must read and comment on similar size and similar 397 00:20:41,440 --> 00:20:44,000 Speaker 1: themed blogs. The people clicking on it from Pinterest aren't 398 00:20:44,000 --> 00:20:46,440 Speaker 1: reading it. They're looking for your recipe or helpful tip 399 00:20:46,520 --> 00:20:49,159 Speaker 1: promise in the clickbait, or are year before and after photo. 400 00:20:49,320 --> 00:20:51,320 Speaker 1: They might reap in the image and then they're done. 401 00:20:51,520 --> 00:20:53,880 Speaker 1: The people sharing on Facebook they aren't reading it either. 402 00:20:54,280 --> 00:20:56,359 Speaker 1: They just want to say whatever it is your headline says, 403 00:20:56,440 --> 00:20:59,840 Speaker 1: but can't find the words themselves. Your family Nope. The 404 00:21:00,119 --> 00:21:01,520 Speaker 1: checking to make sure that they don't have a double 405 00:21:01,520 --> 00:21:03,359 Speaker 1: shin in the photo that you post of them, and 406 00:21:03,440 --> 00:21:05,520 Speaker 1: zoning in on the paragraphs where their names are mentioned. 407 00:21:05,720 --> 00:21:09,760 Speaker 1: So basically, Josie is saying Mommy bloggers, nobody's reading your 408 00:21:10,320 --> 00:21:13,159 Speaker 1: We're all following the same guide book for how to 409 00:21:13,160 --> 00:21:15,800 Speaker 1: get followers, So for any kind of engagement you're seeing 410 00:21:15,920 --> 00:21:18,720 Speaker 1: is not actually meaningful. It's just another way of people 411 00:21:18,760 --> 00:21:21,520 Speaker 1: trying to get more followers for their own brand. Emily, 412 00:21:21,560 --> 00:21:22,760 Speaker 1: you have you seen you have a lot of thoughts 413 00:21:22,800 --> 00:21:25,359 Speaker 1: on this. What do you think? I think this woman 414 00:21:25,440 --> 00:21:28,560 Speaker 1: had a fit on the internet. Um, and I find 415 00:21:28,600 --> 00:21:33,440 Speaker 1: it really offensive. I mean, maybe nobody's reading your Josie. 416 00:21:33,480 --> 00:21:36,080 Speaker 1: Maybe the sponsor money that you started getting paid for 417 00:21:36,200 --> 00:21:38,359 Speaker 1: your on the internet. Would you say, no one reads 418 00:21:38,640 --> 00:21:42,359 Speaker 1: became really limiting and muzzling to you, and those golden 419 00:21:42,440 --> 00:21:44,800 Speaker 1: handcuffs were just too much to bear and you couldn't 420 00:21:44,800 --> 00:21:48,119 Speaker 1: be your authentic self as a writer. And maybe you 421 00:21:48,119 --> 00:21:50,440 Speaker 1: should just stop getting paid and right wherever this is 422 00:21:50,480 --> 00:21:52,960 Speaker 1: that you want to write, and then no one has 423 00:21:53,080 --> 00:21:57,800 Speaker 1: any control over you. I understand the frustration. I just 424 00:21:57,840 --> 00:22:02,080 Speaker 1: think that she's blaming other people for how the internet works. 425 00:22:02,680 --> 00:22:05,080 Speaker 1: I don't get that. Of course, people are self interested. 426 00:22:05,119 --> 00:22:07,600 Speaker 1: Everyone wants to write their own come up story. Everyone 427 00:22:07,640 --> 00:22:09,159 Speaker 1: wants to be able to get paid to do the 428 00:22:09,200 --> 00:22:11,679 Speaker 1: work that they love. But very few of us do 429 00:22:11,880 --> 00:22:14,199 Speaker 1: and I think she should read. Um, there's a lot 430 00:22:14,280 --> 00:22:17,040 Speaker 1: of great writing out there done by Elizabeth Gilbert, a 431 00:22:17,040 --> 00:22:22,360 Speaker 1: book called Big Magic about the quest for creative sustainability, 432 00:22:22,480 --> 00:22:24,720 Speaker 1: quite frankly after her mega hit that a lot of 433 00:22:24,720 --> 00:22:27,240 Speaker 1: people roll their eyes at, called Eat Pray Love and 434 00:22:27,320 --> 00:22:30,560 Speaker 1: the struggle to actually write something again after a weird 435 00:22:30,680 --> 00:22:33,840 Speaker 1: overnight success story. Can I say something very random, please, 436 00:22:34,040 --> 00:22:37,400 Speaker 1: I recently met a sminty listener in Brooklyn who has 437 00:22:37,520 --> 00:22:39,919 Speaker 1: an Eat Pray Love quote tattooed on her back. So 438 00:22:40,080 --> 00:22:41,920 Speaker 1: shout out to you. You know who you are. Thank 439 00:22:41,920 --> 00:22:43,840 Speaker 1: you for showing me your tattoo. I hope you hear 440 00:22:43,880 --> 00:22:47,440 Speaker 1: this good because I love Elizabeth Gilbert. I loved that 441 00:22:47,480 --> 00:22:49,800 Speaker 1: book but and it was the book I needed at 442 00:22:49,800 --> 00:22:51,760 Speaker 1: that time in my life when I was really struggling. 443 00:22:52,200 --> 00:22:55,320 Speaker 1: And quite frankly, what Elizabeth Gilbert writes a lot about, 444 00:22:55,400 --> 00:22:57,840 Speaker 1: what Cheryl Strade writes a lot about, is this common 445 00:22:57,960 --> 00:23:02,840 Speaker 1: quest we have for creative fulfillment and financial stability that has, 446 00:23:03,000 --> 00:23:06,200 Speaker 1: like as this tale, as old as time. So please 447 00:23:06,240 --> 00:23:11,080 Speaker 1: don't complain about how the Internet works, because it has 448 00:23:11,160 --> 00:23:14,840 Speaker 1: never been easier for you and any other random person 449 00:23:14,960 --> 00:23:19,480 Speaker 1: to have access to the tools to write something so profound, 450 00:23:19,560 --> 00:23:21,480 Speaker 1: or to write your life story down even if it 451 00:23:21,600 --> 00:23:24,360 Speaker 1: isn't profound, and start becoming the writer that you want 452 00:23:24,359 --> 00:23:27,639 Speaker 1: to be. You just risk not being paid for it, 453 00:23:27,760 --> 00:23:32,680 Speaker 1: as have every writer throughout the course of time. Right, 454 00:23:32,680 --> 00:23:35,679 Speaker 1: we've all struggled with that. I struggle with that, And 455 00:23:35,760 --> 00:23:37,639 Speaker 1: it takes a long as time to be able to 456 00:23:37,640 --> 00:23:39,800 Speaker 1: get paid to do what you're doing if you're lucky 457 00:23:39,960 --> 00:23:42,760 Speaker 1: enough to be a creator who has the privilege of 458 00:23:42,800 --> 00:23:45,879 Speaker 1: being paid for their creations. So I don't know, I 459 00:23:45,960 --> 00:23:49,719 Speaker 1: find I'm like surprising myself that has strongly I'm responding 460 00:23:49,760 --> 00:23:53,600 Speaker 1: to this person because frankly, I think it's a challenge 461 00:23:53,640 --> 00:23:56,960 Speaker 1: to herself to write something better. Well, you're not the 462 00:23:57,000 --> 00:23:58,800 Speaker 1: only person who feels that way. A lot of the 463 00:23:58,840 --> 00:24:01,800 Speaker 1: people who read her letter said pretty much the same thing. 464 00:24:01,840 --> 00:24:05,080 Speaker 1: They said, this person sounds really unhappy. This person sounds hateful. 465 00:24:05,160 --> 00:24:07,639 Speaker 1: This person sounds like they are having a hard time 466 00:24:07,920 --> 00:24:10,359 Speaker 1: coming to grips with their own hang ups as a creator, 467 00:24:10,400 --> 00:24:12,720 Speaker 1: and there rather than looking inward, they're looking outwards. So 468 00:24:12,760 --> 00:24:14,480 Speaker 1: you wouldn't be the only person who felt that way 469 00:24:14,520 --> 00:24:17,240 Speaker 1: in the community. A lot of people felt really offended 470 00:24:17,240 --> 00:24:19,520 Speaker 1: by what she said, and they weren't too keen on 471 00:24:19,640 --> 00:24:22,639 Speaker 1: being called, you know, bullsh peddlers. I do think something 472 00:24:22,680 --> 00:24:25,040 Speaker 1: that she is really kind of onto in her letter 473 00:24:25,560 --> 00:24:29,320 Speaker 1: is the way that the professional blogging industry can play 474 00:24:29,400 --> 00:24:33,640 Speaker 1: on sort of giving people the quote unquote magic tools 475 00:24:33,840 --> 00:24:36,800 Speaker 1: to be successful for a fee. And so she goes 476 00:24:36,840 --> 00:24:38,880 Speaker 1: on to talk about conferences and things like that where 477 00:24:38,880 --> 00:24:41,159 Speaker 1: you pay lots of money to learn the tips and tricks, 478 00:24:41,359 --> 00:24:45,080 Speaker 1: and that that ends up reinforcing that people are all 479 00:24:45,080 --> 00:24:47,239 Speaker 1: behaving the same way online because they've been told this 480 00:24:47,280 --> 00:24:49,480 Speaker 1: is how you make money from it, and that it's 481 00:24:49,480 --> 00:24:52,760 Speaker 1: like an echo chamber where people are not having authentic 482 00:24:52,800 --> 00:24:56,159 Speaker 1: reactions to content. They're doing what these consultants or trainers 483 00:24:56,200 --> 00:24:58,640 Speaker 1: or whatever say this is what makes money, but that 484 00:24:58,640 --> 00:25:01,000 Speaker 1: that becomes a cycle of the those people making money 485 00:25:01,040 --> 00:25:03,760 Speaker 1: and it's not actually what is necessarily going to produce 486 00:25:03,800 --> 00:25:05,800 Speaker 1: good content. And so I do think that she's onto 487 00:25:05,840 --> 00:25:08,240 Speaker 1: something there that it kind of can become a little 488 00:25:08,240 --> 00:25:11,199 Speaker 1: bit of a racket where people feel like, oh, I 489 00:25:11,280 --> 00:25:14,520 Speaker 1: have to pay all this money in order to say 490 00:25:14,560 --> 00:25:17,240 Speaker 1: anything on the Internet that's going to be seen. And 491 00:25:17,280 --> 00:25:19,119 Speaker 1: I don't think that's good. I think that people should 492 00:25:19,160 --> 00:25:21,600 Speaker 1: feel like they can put their idea kind of like 493 00:25:21,600 --> 00:25:23,520 Speaker 1: what you were saying, people should feel like that they 494 00:25:23,560 --> 00:25:26,800 Speaker 1: are empowered to put their ideas into the world and 495 00:25:26,840 --> 00:25:28,760 Speaker 1: maybe they'll get money and maybe they won't. But we 496 00:25:28,800 --> 00:25:31,920 Speaker 1: should be able to have a marketplace of ideas and content, 497 00:25:32,000 --> 00:25:34,479 Speaker 1: and all that content should be able to, you know, 498 00:25:34,520 --> 00:25:36,520 Speaker 1: get an audience if it's good, like I think that's 499 00:25:36,520 --> 00:25:38,600 Speaker 1: what they're saying that. It used to be that good 500 00:25:38,600 --> 00:25:41,280 Speaker 1: writing is what made you an audience, and good at 501 00:25:41,280 --> 00:25:43,480 Speaker 1: writing is what gave you money. And now they're saying 502 00:25:43,640 --> 00:25:46,560 Speaker 1: it's good sponsored content. The writing has taken a backseat. 503 00:25:46,600 --> 00:25:49,520 Speaker 1: And again I see that large all over media. Big 504 00:25:49,560 --> 00:25:52,359 Speaker 1: media outlets like The New York Times are saying clickbait 505 00:25:52,720 --> 00:25:55,680 Speaker 1: and things that aren't necessarily true but will rally you up. 506 00:25:55,880 --> 00:25:58,320 Speaker 1: That's what gets eyes on Facebook, that's what gets eyes 507 00:25:58,359 --> 00:26:02,040 Speaker 1: on social media. It isn't this long form, authentic, well written, 508 00:26:02,119 --> 00:26:05,800 Speaker 1: well researched piece. It's quickbait. It's things that make you angry. 509 00:26:05,800 --> 00:26:08,080 Speaker 1: It's things that will make you be you know, losing 510 00:26:08,080 --> 00:26:11,160 Speaker 1: your crap in the comments. And so I think that's absolutely, 511 00:26:11,200 --> 00:26:14,080 Speaker 1: unquestionably true. I don't think it's particular to the mom 512 00:26:14,080 --> 00:26:16,760 Speaker 1: blog industry. But I think it's fair to ask what 513 00:26:16,960 --> 00:26:20,840 Speaker 1: gets lost when our media landscape changes towards those elements, 514 00:26:21,160 --> 00:26:22,400 Speaker 1: and I think we should do more of that. After 515 00:26:22,440 --> 00:26:33,200 Speaker 1: a quick break, and we're back getting a little heated 516 00:26:33,240 --> 00:26:37,240 Speaker 1: talking about mommy blogging or mom blogging as it's more 517 00:26:37,640 --> 00:26:40,520 Speaker 1: generally known. And again, I know I said this earlier 518 00:26:40,520 --> 00:26:41,879 Speaker 1: in the show, but I want to be clear that 519 00:26:41,920 --> 00:26:43,800 Speaker 1: I don't want to come down on anybody. I think 520 00:26:43,800 --> 00:26:47,000 Speaker 1: that if your mom who is writing or is reading 521 00:26:47,200 --> 00:26:49,840 Speaker 1: really gritty, authentic stuff, that is awesome. If you're a 522 00:26:49,880 --> 00:26:52,399 Speaker 1: mom who wants to make extra money posting Instagram pictures 523 00:26:52,400 --> 00:26:55,280 Speaker 1: about how your kids love tied or whatever, good for 524 00:26:55,359 --> 00:26:57,560 Speaker 1: you too. I'm just saying that it's worth it to 525 00:26:57,560 --> 00:27:00,720 Speaker 1: ask questions about what we lose when we shift from 526 00:27:00,760 --> 00:27:03,800 Speaker 1: one and to another. And I just think consumers and 527 00:27:03,960 --> 00:27:06,680 Speaker 1: audiences should be clear about what it is their consuming, 528 00:27:06,720 --> 00:27:10,320 Speaker 1: if they should be clear about getting an ad, you know, 529 00:27:10,359 --> 00:27:13,200 Speaker 1: I think that I've seen examples, particularly with celebrities, where 530 00:27:13,200 --> 00:27:15,600 Speaker 1: it's the line is a little bit fuzzy, and the 531 00:27:15,720 --> 00:27:18,400 Speaker 1: SEC agrees and as find them or come down on them, 532 00:27:18,520 --> 00:27:21,040 Speaker 1: And I think that we should just be as consumers 533 00:27:21,320 --> 00:27:23,200 Speaker 1: clear on what we are getting and what we are 534 00:27:23,240 --> 00:27:26,360 Speaker 1: and as creators clear on what we're creating. I completely 535 00:27:26,359 --> 00:27:30,040 Speaker 1: agree and I love what you mentioned earlier about moms 536 00:27:30,080 --> 00:27:33,840 Speaker 1: are seeking community on the Internet. I think we all 537 00:27:33,880 --> 00:27:36,199 Speaker 1: seek community on the internet in our own way or 538 00:27:36,280 --> 00:27:39,840 Speaker 1: in general in life. And so if you are a 539 00:27:39,920 --> 00:27:43,359 Speaker 1: creator who's only going to create according to the very 540 00:27:43,400 --> 00:27:46,320 Speaker 1: current status of how to make money from your creation, 541 00:27:46,760 --> 00:27:49,680 Speaker 1: you are missing the point. Like the long term benefit, 542 00:27:49,720 --> 00:27:53,840 Speaker 1: in my opinion, is in creating a community where people 543 00:27:53,880 --> 00:27:56,880 Speaker 1: feel seen and heard, in creating content that helps foster 544 00:27:57,359 --> 00:28:00,359 Speaker 1: that authentic connection online. That's those are the communities I 545 00:28:00,440 --> 00:28:03,000 Speaker 1: want to belong to. Those are certainly the communities that 546 00:28:03,080 --> 00:28:08,560 Speaker 1: I'm creating. And I want to acknowledge that sometimes the 547 00:28:08,560 --> 00:28:13,320 Speaker 1: the financial incentives can bring people off course, but they're 548 00:28:13,359 --> 00:28:15,720 Speaker 1: never worth it, you know what I mean, Like, they're 549 00:28:15,760 --> 00:28:18,160 Speaker 1: never worth veering too far off course. And I'm sure 550 00:28:18,160 --> 00:28:21,159 Speaker 1: our listeners will help us hold ourselves accountable if we 551 00:28:21,200 --> 00:28:24,840 Speaker 1: ever veered too far off course in that way. And um, now, 552 00:28:24,880 --> 00:28:28,440 Speaker 1: I think it's a really interesting discussion about how moms 553 00:28:28,480 --> 00:28:32,119 Speaker 1: in particular are worthy of being seen and validated for 554 00:28:32,160 --> 00:28:34,560 Speaker 1: who they are and what their life experiences look like 555 00:28:35,000 --> 00:28:40,080 Speaker 1: not this, you know, sanitized Instagram pinches perfect version of it. 556 00:28:40,200 --> 00:28:42,920 Speaker 1: That's exactly what one reddit commenter on the subreddit blog 557 00:28:42,960 --> 00:28:45,640 Speaker 1: Snark had to say in response to the post article 558 00:28:45,640 --> 00:28:48,200 Speaker 1: that we quoted from earlier. She writes, I don't want 559 00:28:48,200 --> 00:28:52,000 Speaker 1: my Internet, with supportive communities that encourage honor sharing and yes, 560 00:28:52,080 --> 00:28:55,920 Speaker 1: even quote confessional style expression, to be replaced by delightful 561 00:28:55,920 --> 00:28:59,040 Speaker 1: pictures of immaculately clad children eating chia, putting out of 562 00:28:59,080 --> 00:29:02,480 Speaker 1: ten teenv may some jars just no, Well, you know 563 00:29:02,480 --> 00:29:05,280 Speaker 1: what the rising of is. Who does that really well? 564 00:29:05,320 --> 00:29:09,040 Speaker 1: Who balances that line really well? Christie Teagan. Christie Teagan 565 00:29:09,120 --> 00:29:11,680 Speaker 1: is beloved not because of the perfect teeny tiny Mason 566 00:29:11,760 --> 00:29:14,400 Speaker 1: jars that are in her Instagram post on occasion or 567 00:29:14,440 --> 00:29:18,000 Speaker 1: her beautifully laid out in photograph cookbooks. She is popular 568 00:29:18,040 --> 00:29:20,480 Speaker 1: because she keeps it real, because she shows you the 569 00:29:20,480 --> 00:29:23,600 Speaker 1: gritty crape. But she can keep it real because she 570 00:29:23,640 --> 00:29:28,200 Speaker 1: doesn't really need the money. Right, It's a privilege to 571 00:29:28,200 --> 00:29:30,200 Speaker 1: be able to keep it real, right if you it's 572 00:29:30,200 --> 00:29:32,360 Speaker 1: a privilege to be able to I don't think so. 573 00:29:32,560 --> 00:29:36,480 Speaker 1: I think you risk not getting paid. But people, that's 574 00:29:36,480 --> 00:29:39,120 Speaker 1: what I'm saying, People who can make that risk. Are 575 00:29:39,160 --> 00:29:42,600 Speaker 1: people who have money can't be broke like me? Sometimes? 576 00:29:43,040 --> 00:29:44,880 Speaker 1: I mean, that's what I'm saying, Like I'm saying, let's 577 00:29:44,880 --> 00:29:48,080 Speaker 1: not pretend that there isn't an element of privilege that 578 00:29:48,080 --> 00:29:50,200 Speaker 1: goes on here. That if you are a struggling single 579 00:29:50,280 --> 00:29:52,719 Speaker 1: mom who has something to say that, but you need 580 00:29:52,760 --> 00:29:54,840 Speaker 1: to work to jobs, you don't have the you don't 581 00:29:54,840 --> 00:29:57,400 Speaker 1: have the ability to say, I'll just make this content 582 00:29:57,520 --> 00:30:00,840 Speaker 1: on top of my two jobs and motherhood and not 583 00:30:00,840 --> 00:30:02,720 Speaker 1: get paid for it. And so I'm saying that that 584 00:30:03,320 --> 00:30:06,320 Speaker 1: impacts the landscape of who whose voices gets raised and 585 00:30:06,320 --> 00:30:08,600 Speaker 1: whose voices we never hear. And so I do think 586 00:30:08,640 --> 00:30:10,760 Speaker 1: it comes back to that, Yes, that is such a 587 00:30:10,800 --> 00:30:14,120 Speaker 1: good point that I was totally missing. So what you're 588 00:30:14,160 --> 00:30:18,000 Speaker 1: saying is the way that the market rewards like winners 589 00:30:18,000 --> 00:30:22,600 Speaker 1: and losers um in the mom blog space determines in 590 00:30:22,600 --> 00:30:27,000 Speaker 1: a lot of ways how privileged the voices are that 591 00:30:27,040 --> 00:30:30,800 Speaker 1: we actually hear from. And that is important exactly that 592 00:30:30,920 --> 00:30:32,959 Speaker 1: how can we fix that? I think it's I think 593 00:30:33,000 --> 00:30:35,520 Speaker 1: it's people are asking that question all over media. I 594 00:30:35,520 --> 00:30:36,760 Speaker 1: don't think I don't know if there is a fix. 595 00:30:36,880 --> 00:30:39,960 Speaker 1: Maybe this is just how our media landscape is and 596 00:30:40,600 --> 00:30:44,120 Speaker 1: it sucks, and it's new and it's scary and it's 597 00:30:44,280 --> 00:30:46,880 Speaker 1: I don't know what. I don't know. Advertisers can't advertisers 598 00:30:46,920 --> 00:30:51,360 Speaker 1: do better to reach out to more diverse voices, more 599 00:30:51,520 --> 00:30:55,280 Speaker 1: unheard voices, more. I mean, it's not in their financial 600 00:30:55,280 --> 00:30:58,480 Speaker 1: incentive necessarily, but maybe it could be. Right, That's what 601 00:30:58,520 --> 00:31:01,760 Speaker 1: I was saying earlier. Maybe there's an advertiser out there 602 00:31:02,000 --> 00:31:04,720 Speaker 1: that has enough respect for their consumer base that they 603 00:31:04,760 --> 00:31:07,640 Speaker 1: want to sponsor reality. They want to sponsor what it 604 00:31:07,640 --> 00:31:09,200 Speaker 1: actually looks like to be a mother, They want to 605 00:31:09,240 --> 00:31:12,600 Speaker 1: sponsor you know. I love the natural hair community. I 606 00:31:12,600 --> 00:31:14,960 Speaker 1: think they've done a great job of showing, you know, 607 00:31:15,080 --> 00:31:18,760 Speaker 1: we're gonna give money to women who don't necessarily have 608 00:31:19,000 --> 00:31:21,520 Speaker 1: perfect hair all the time so that women can see, 609 00:31:21,760 --> 00:31:24,080 Speaker 1: you know, if I don't have perfect curls that fall 610 00:31:24,200 --> 00:31:26,920 Speaker 1: and spiraled ringlets around my face in a perfect way 611 00:31:26,960 --> 00:31:29,800 Speaker 1: every day, this product can still work for me. Nobody 612 00:31:29,800 --> 00:31:31,760 Speaker 1: wants to buy the product that seems like it's made 613 00:31:31,800 --> 00:31:34,360 Speaker 1: for girls who look perfect already. You want the product 614 00:31:34,360 --> 00:31:36,240 Speaker 1: that's going to be there for you when you're dry 615 00:31:36,280 --> 00:31:39,280 Speaker 1: and you're crispy and you're not looking your best it 616 00:31:39,320 --> 00:31:41,120 Speaker 1: convince me that your product will be there for me 617 00:31:41,200 --> 00:31:43,360 Speaker 1: when I'm not looking my best, and I'll be I'll 618 00:31:43,360 --> 00:31:48,040 Speaker 1: be a follower for life. I hear you. Aspirational is 619 00:31:48,080 --> 00:31:51,640 Speaker 1: the challenge. That's the world we live in is aspirational advertising. 620 00:31:52,120 --> 00:31:55,240 Speaker 1: People don't want their product next to crispy hair, don't. 621 00:31:55,280 --> 00:31:58,440 Speaker 1: But women with crispy curls meet a product that's gonna 622 00:31:58,440 --> 00:32:00,800 Speaker 1: work for them. So like, w'ere isn't they want a 623 00:32:00,800 --> 00:32:03,720 Speaker 1: product that will make their hair not crispy. Yeah, that's 624 00:32:03,760 --> 00:32:06,640 Speaker 1: the aspirational part of it. I'm someone who is always 625 00:32:06,640 --> 00:32:09,960 Speaker 1: like that girl has perfect hair, and she her hair 626 00:32:10,000 --> 00:32:12,040 Speaker 1: always looks good. Like this product is not why her 627 00:32:12,080 --> 00:32:14,560 Speaker 1: hair looks good. Her hair always looks good. Well, I 628 00:32:14,600 --> 00:32:17,040 Speaker 1: think that's part of Okay, So here's an example. So 629 00:32:17,080 --> 00:32:19,880 Speaker 1: I'm struggling a lot with my skin right now, as 630 00:32:19,920 --> 00:32:24,880 Speaker 1: I'm very public about on this podcast and on my Instagram. Um, 631 00:32:24,920 --> 00:32:27,720 Speaker 1: I'm currently trying to go gluten free to help figure 632 00:32:27,760 --> 00:32:30,960 Speaker 1: it out for my skin, which is the worst because 633 00:32:31,000 --> 00:32:33,640 Speaker 1: I love carbs. That's part of why I love veganism, 634 00:32:33,640 --> 00:32:37,280 Speaker 1: because I could just live on bread all day. Anyway, 635 00:32:37,280 --> 00:32:38,960 Speaker 1: I think that part of my life might be coming 636 00:32:39,000 --> 00:32:41,760 Speaker 1: to a close. So I've been really working on my skincare, 637 00:32:42,440 --> 00:32:46,320 Speaker 1: gladly accepting products for free from from people who send 638 00:32:46,360 --> 00:32:48,640 Speaker 1: them to me for me to then try it. They're 639 00:32:48,640 --> 00:32:51,560 Speaker 1: not sending to me because I have perfect skin. They're 640 00:32:51,560 --> 00:32:53,720 Speaker 1: sending it to me to see if it helps my skin. 641 00:32:54,160 --> 00:32:56,280 Speaker 1: And I'm trying it and sharing my journey with a 642 00:32:56,320 --> 00:32:59,320 Speaker 1: lot of my followers to see if it works. And 643 00:32:59,720 --> 00:33:02,720 Speaker 1: I'm not gonna like pretend it works if it doesn't. 644 00:33:03,760 --> 00:33:06,440 Speaker 1: But that's a transformation, like you are saying about here, 645 00:33:06,760 --> 00:33:09,400 Speaker 1: that's what people want to see, and that's what I'm saying, Like, 646 00:33:09,560 --> 00:33:11,680 Speaker 1: more people should sponsor me. Yeah, that's what I'm saying, 647 00:33:11,720 --> 00:33:14,640 Speaker 1: More people reponsor you. But also that brand should get 648 00:33:14,720 --> 00:33:17,880 Speaker 1: that nuance that aligning yourself with perfection is not what 649 00:33:17,920 --> 00:33:22,080 Speaker 1: people necessarily want to see. It drives self doubt, and 650 00:33:22,120 --> 00:33:25,560 Speaker 1: self doubt is probably a very effective way to get 651 00:33:25,560 --> 00:33:27,960 Speaker 1: people to buy your products. But what people actually want 652 00:33:28,000 --> 00:33:30,760 Speaker 1: to see is someone with problem skin, not to problem 653 00:33:30,840 --> 00:33:36,000 Speaker 1: skin problematics. Yeah, people want to see that someone with 654 00:33:36,040 --> 00:33:38,840 Speaker 1: problematic skin that a product will help them. You know, 655 00:33:38,920 --> 00:33:40,680 Speaker 1: if you if you're making a product with people with 656 00:33:40,680 --> 00:33:43,360 Speaker 1: problem skin, it doesn't make sense to only have people 657 00:33:43,400 --> 00:33:46,920 Speaker 1: who have naturally glowing skin, even though that is, you know, 658 00:33:46,960 --> 00:33:50,720 Speaker 1: the attainable goal. We are very self interested in today's podcast, 659 00:33:50,760 --> 00:33:52,720 Speaker 1: y'all if you can't tell already, because do you know 660 00:33:52,760 --> 00:33:56,760 Speaker 1: who are perfectly imperfect spokespeople for any product or service? 661 00:33:57,120 --> 00:34:00,600 Speaker 1: Is you? And I? I agree? How foul doble we are. 662 00:34:00,720 --> 00:34:03,680 Speaker 1: I mean, sponsors should be banging down our doors because 663 00:34:03,720 --> 00:34:08,440 Speaker 1: of our imperfections. I totally agree speaking of imperfect sponsors, 664 00:34:08,800 --> 00:34:10,640 Speaker 1: I would be remiss to not shout out one of 665 00:34:10,719 --> 00:34:13,400 Speaker 1: my favorite things in a span kN world, and that 666 00:34:13,560 --> 00:34:16,879 Speaker 1: is Celebrity spann Con. One of my favorite podcasts, Who 667 00:34:16,920 --> 00:34:19,879 Speaker 1: Weekly was a great job of breaking down the ins 668 00:34:19,880 --> 00:34:23,359 Speaker 1: and outs of Celebrity spann Con and it once once 669 00:34:23,400 --> 00:34:27,040 Speaker 1: you start seeing the tropes, it's everywhere and it's amazing 670 00:34:27,080 --> 00:34:29,920 Speaker 1: and so definitely start looking. So just Who Weekly in 671 00:34:30,000 --> 00:34:32,759 Speaker 1: general is amazing. You turned me on to this, and god, 672 00:34:32,960 --> 00:34:36,359 Speaker 1: it's like a tabloid read. So again, just if you're 673 00:34:36,360 --> 00:34:38,480 Speaker 1: wondering Who Weekly, what the hell is that? You know? 674 00:34:38,520 --> 00:34:41,400 Speaker 1: How there's US Weekly and it's about a list celebrities. 675 00:34:41,640 --> 00:34:44,319 Speaker 1: Imagine if there was a magazine called Who Weekly for 676 00:34:44,400 --> 00:34:46,440 Speaker 1: all those celebrities where you're like, I kind of know 677 00:34:46,440 --> 00:34:47,960 Speaker 1: who that is, but who are they? Who is that 678 00:34:48,160 --> 00:34:51,279 Speaker 1: guy from that thing? Yeah, like Bella Hadid I know 679 00:34:51,360 --> 00:34:54,000 Speaker 1: that name? What she in Rita? Or I think I 680 00:34:54,040 --> 00:34:56,080 Speaker 1: saw her in this thing? But what's what is she 681 00:34:56,120 --> 00:34:58,840 Speaker 1: known for? All these people that are in your celeb 682 00:34:59,000 --> 00:35:04,279 Speaker 1: landscape that maybe aren't you know, aren't them there? And 683 00:35:04,360 --> 00:35:08,959 Speaker 1: so who's have the best sponsored content on Instagram of anybody? Well, 684 00:35:09,000 --> 00:35:11,359 Speaker 1: it does actually relate because something that they point out 685 00:35:11,400 --> 00:35:15,240 Speaker 1: so well is when celebrities, particularly Who's, are so clearly 686 00:35:15,320 --> 00:35:18,200 Speaker 1: being paid to hawk a product on Instagram. One of 687 00:35:18,200 --> 00:35:21,120 Speaker 1: the funniest ways this comes across is when you can 688 00:35:21,160 --> 00:35:24,880 Speaker 1: tell a celebrity is just copying and pasting the caption 689 00:35:24,920 --> 00:35:27,080 Speaker 1: that they're getting from a PR person for a product 690 00:35:27,280 --> 00:35:30,120 Speaker 1: into the Instagram caption. And Naomi Campbell has done this, 691 00:35:30,520 --> 00:35:33,520 Speaker 1: even Lord Scott Disick has done this, and one of 692 00:35:33,560 --> 00:35:36,720 Speaker 1: the funniest Instagram caption I've ever seen. It's a picture 693 00:35:36,760 --> 00:35:39,640 Speaker 1: of him with some sort of protein powder and the 694 00:35:39,680 --> 00:35:42,440 Speaker 1: caption that he has on Instagram is here you go 695 00:35:42,760 --> 00:35:46,560 Speaker 1: at four pm Eastern time, right the blow caption keep 696 00:35:46,640 --> 00:35:52,719 Speaker 1: up with keep up, keeping up with the summer workout 697 00:35:52,840 --> 00:35:56,879 Speaker 1: routine with my morning and then at the product, it's 698 00:35:57,120 --> 00:36:00,080 Speaker 1: so funny. I mean, so this is just my my, 699 00:36:00,080 --> 00:36:02,240 Speaker 1: my p s A. So much of what you're seeing 700 00:36:02,239 --> 00:36:05,759 Speaker 1: on Instagram is just bus and just know we know that, 701 00:36:05,880 --> 00:36:07,799 Speaker 1: but it's always good to have a reminder that it is. 702 00:36:08,080 --> 00:36:10,560 Speaker 1: Scott Distac, I'm very surprised that you just didn't even 703 00:36:10,600 --> 00:36:14,880 Speaker 1: read this you copied. I mean, actually no, I am surprised. 704 00:36:14,880 --> 00:36:17,440 Speaker 1: I expected more from Scott Distc. I'm gonna say it, Scott, 705 00:36:17,480 --> 00:36:20,520 Speaker 1: if you're listening, didn't I expected more from you? He's like, 706 00:36:21,080 --> 00:36:25,400 Speaker 1: what we oh man, Yeah, we really went off the 707 00:36:25,440 --> 00:36:29,560 Speaker 1: mommy mommy blogger rails here. But I hope this conversation 708 00:36:29,800 --> 00:36:33,880 Speaker 1: got us thinking God is asking some tough questions. And 709 00:36:33,960 --> 00:36:36,279 Speaker 1: I think the best point that you made in this 710 00:36:36,480 --> 00:36:39,800 Speaker 1: entire conversation, the best point made period in this entire episode, 711 00:36:40,320 --> 00:36:43,200 Speaker 1: was what you said about privilege, the ways in which 712 00:36:43,320 --> 00:36:49,279 Speaker 1: our media structures create winners and losers create capitalist you know, 713 00:36:49,440 --> 00:36:52,640 Speaker 1: people who are creating things that are worthy of capitalism's 714 00:36:52,680 --> 00:36:58,479 Speaker 1: financial reward versus not can have strong ramifications for those 715 00:36:58,520 --> 00:37:02,759 Speaker 1: who get erased from the content sphere altogether. And that's 716 00:37:02,800 --> 00:37:05,880 Speaker 1: really really problematic. So I want to hear from you 717 00:37:05,960 --> 00:37:08,759 Speaker 1: smithy listeners, what is the kind of content that you 718 00:37:08,800 --> 00:37:11,000 Speaker 1: want to see in the world, whether it's in the 719 00:37:11,040 --> 00:37:16,640 Speaker 1: mommy blogger space, sorry, the mom blogger space, or you know, 720 00:37:16,800 --> 00:37:22,440 Speaker 1: in podcasting and blogging and Instagram creators in general, and 721 00:37:22,480 --> 00:37:27,440 Speaker 1: how can sponsors, how can we create a marketplace for 722 00:37:27,600 --> 00:37:31,440 Speaker 1: better you know, sponsor to creator connections to make what 723 00:37:31,520 --> 00:37:34,759 Speaker 1: we're seeing on the internet not all protein powder with 724 00:37:34,840 --> 00:37:38,239 Speaker 1: pasted captions. It's a great question, and I think it's 725 00:37:38,280 --> 00:37:40,120 Speaker 1: a question that's important to be asked, and it's one 726 00:37:40,120 --> 00:37:42,160 Speaker 1: that I really want to throw to our listeners. You know, 727 00:37:42,239 --> 00:37:44,280 Speaker 1: are you a mom blogger? Are you a content creator? 728 00:37:44,360 --> 00:37:46,040 Speaker 1: What does that looks like for you? Has it been 729 00:37:46,040 --> 00:37:50,880 Speaker 1: difficult or have you embraced the Instagram Pinterest perfection of 730 00:37:51,160 --> 00:37:53,600 Speaker 1: mom blog content or are you out there trying to 731 00:37:53,680 --> 00:37:55,880 Speaker 1: keep it real and be gritty. I'm really just curious 732 00:37:55,880 --> 00:37:58,600 Speaker 1: what people are doing online, So make sure to hit 733 00:37:58,680 --> 00:38:04,320 Speaker 1: us up on Instagram. Are very unsponsored Instagram at stuff 734 00:38:04,360 --> 00:38:07,360 Speaker 1: Mom Never Told You, on Twitter at mom Stuff podcast, 735 00:38:07,760 --> 00:38:10,879 Speaker 1: and as always are inboxes open at mom Stuff, at 736 00:38:10,880 --> 00:38:14,400 Speaker 1: how stuff works dot com, and just as a final reminder, 737 00:38:14,440 --> 00:38:17,520 Speaker 1: for those of you who want to join my fireside chat, 738 00:38:17,800 --> 00:38:20,160 Speaker 1: but I'm having with stuff I've never told you listeners. 739 00:38:20,200 --> 00:38:23,279 Speaker 1: At the end of this month, I'm talking about my 740 00:38:23,360 --> 00:38:26,680 Speaker 1: departure from the show, answering your questions and getting your 741 00:38:26,760 --> 00:38:29,560 Speaker 1: feedback on how I can still create the kind of 742 00:38:29,560 --> 00:38:32,160 Speaker 1: content that you want to hear. At the end of 743 00:38:32,200 --> 00:38:34,840 Speaker 1: the day, I as a creator, I am really committed 744 00:38:34,840 --> 00:38:38,040 Speaker 1: to creating what you want to hear more of. So 745 00:38:38,160 --> 00:38:41,600 Speaker 1: join me to communicate directly with me live on a 746 00:38:41,640 --> 00:38:45,560 Speaker 1: webinar I'm hosting on February at eight pm Eastern by 747 00:38:45,600 --> 00:38:50,000 Speaker 1: going to bost up dot org slash sminty. That's bossed 748 00:38:50,040 --> 00:38:53,360 Speaker 1: up bo s s e d up dot org slash 749 00:38:53,600 --> 00:38:55,960 Speaker 1: s m n T. Why hope to see you Then 750 00:39:00,040 --> 00:39:02,279 Speaker 1: three two p