1 00:00:04,840 --> 00:00:09,680 Speaker 1: On Monday, November twenty fifth, nineteen sixty three, President Kennedy 2 00:00:09,800 --> 00:00:13,960 Speaker 1: was laid to rest in Arlington National Cemetery at the 3 00:00:14,000 --> 00:00:18,159 Speaker 1: First Lady's request. The ceremony followed the same protocols for 4 00:00:18,280 --> 00:00:22,720 Speaker 1: Abraham Lincoln's funeral nearly one hundred years earlier. The flag 5 00:00:22,800 --> 00:00:26,599 Speaker 1: drape casket was drawn by six gray horses. It was 6 00:00:26,680 --> 00:00:31,520 Speaker 1: followed by one riderless black horse. Crowds line Pennsylvania Avenue 7 00:00:31,600 --> 00:00:35,920 Speaker 1: as the procession passed, Only the sounds of the drums 8 00:00:36,360 --> 00:00:39,600 Speaker 1: and the clacking of horses hoofs on the pavement could 9 00:00:39,640 --> 00:00:44,160 Speaker 1: be heard. I'll never forget the rhythm bum bum bum 10 00:00:44,200 --> 00:00:47,800 Speaker 1: bump up bup bum bum bum bup up up bum 11 00:00:47,840 --> 00:00:53,000 Speaker 1: bum bum bump bup, bup bum bum bum bum. Missus Kennedy, 12 00:00:53,120 --> 00:00:58,560 Speaker 1: surrounded by family, friends, official dignitaries, and a military escort, 13 00:00:59,360 --> 00:01:03,240 Speaker 1: walked to Saint Matthew's Cathedral for the service. Heads of 14 00:01:03,280 --> 00:01:07,399 Speaker 1: state and representatives from more than one hundred countries attended 15 00:01:07,440 --> 00:01:11,800 Speaker 1: the funeral. Millions of people around the world tuned in 16 00:01:11,880 --> 00:01:16,360 Speaker 1: to watch on television. After the service, the president's remains 17 00:01:16,480 --> 00:01:20,800 Speaker 1: were laid to rest at Arlington Memorial Cemetery, where Missus 18 00:01:20,880 --> 00:01:25,399 Speaker 1: Kennedy lit an eternal flame. Two hundred and fifty thousand 19 00:01:25,440 --> 00:01:30,280 Speaker 1: people waited up to ten hours in freezing temperatures to 20 00:01:30,360 --> 00:01:35,880 Speaker 1: pay their respects. The nation was in mourning at virtually 21 00:01:35,920 --> 00:01:40,000 Speaker 1: the same time, Lee Harvey Oswald, who had been murdered 22 00:01:40,040 --> 00:01:44,440 Speaker 1: twenty four hours earlier on live television by nightclub owner 23 00:01:44,560 --> 00:01:49,160 Speaker 1: Jack Ruby, was also being put to rest. Along with 24 00:01:49,280 --> 00:01:52,880 Speaker 1: Oswald's remains, secrets were buried. 25 00:01:57,680 --> 00:02:02,080 Speaker 2: This is who killed JFK. Sixty years later? What can 26 00:02:02,120 --> 00:02:06,320 Speaker 2: we uncover about the greatest murder mystery in American history? 27 00:02:06,920 --> 00:02:10,080 Speaker 2: And why does it still matter today? I'm your host, 28 00:02:10,240 --> 00:02:11,200 Speaker 2: Solidad O'Brien. 29 00:02:12,040 --> 00:02:14,920 Speaker 1: We've shown evidence that indicates that at the time of 30 00:02:14,919 --> 00:02:18,520 Speaker 1: the shooting, Oswald was not on the sixth floor of 31 00:02:18,560 --> 00:02:22,440 Speaker 1: the Texas school Book Depository building. He seemed to know 32 00:02:22,560 --> 00:02:26,040 Speaker 1: that he was part of something, but likely didn't know 33 00:02:26,160 --> 00:02:29,520 Speaker 1: exactly what it was. But when he heard that the 34 00:02:29,560 --> 00:02:32,920 Speaker 1: president had been shot, he realized at that point that 35 00:02:33,000 --> 00:02:35,520 Speaker 1: he was in danger. He fled the scene, and he 36 00:02:35,600 --> 00:02:39,519 Speaker 1: was ultimately arrested at the Texas Movie Theater. At the 37 00:02:39,600 --> 00:02:43,280 Speaker 1: Dallas police station, he claimed his innocence when he spoke 38 00:02:43,360 --> 00:02:47,919 Speaker 1: this phrase, I'm just a Patsy. Within forty eight hours 39 00:02:47,919 --> 00:02:51,120 Speaker 1: of his arrest, Jack Ruby saw to it that Lee 40 00:02:51,200 --> 00:02:55,760 Speaker 1: Harvey Oswald would never speak again. A year later, the 41 00:02:55,800 --> 00:02:59,600 Speaker 1: Warren Commission report was released to the public. It set 42 00:02:59,600 --> 00:03:02,880 Speaker 1: out with goal of pinning it all on Oswald, and 43 00:03:02,960 --> 00:03:06,040 Speaker 1: it did. They wanted him to look like a lone gunman. 44 00:03:06,480 --> 00:03:08,840 Speaker 1: Here's what they had to say about Jack Ruby. 45 00:03:09,960 --> 00:03:14,080 Speaker 2: The Warren Commission report says, quote, no direct or indirect 46 00:03:14,120 --> 00:03:18,720 Speaker 2: relationship between Lee Harvey Oswald and Jack Ruby has been 47 00:03:18,800 --> 00:03:21,760 Speaker 2: discovered by the Commission, nor has it been able to 48 00:03:21,760 --> 00:03:25,720 Speaker 2: find any credible evidence that either knew the other. The 49 00:03:25,720 --> 00:03:28,720 Speaker 2: Commission has found no evidence that Jack Ruby acted with 50 00:03:28,800 --> 00:03:32,320 Speaker 2: any other person in the killing of Lee Harvey Oswald. 51 00:03:32,800 --> 00:03:35,280 Speaker 1: And they took Ruby at his word when he told 52 00:03:35,320 --> 00:03:38,880 Speaker 1: them that he had killed Oswald out of sympathy for Jackie. 53 00:03:39,000 --> 00:03:41,840 Speaker 1: He wanted to spare her the pain of having to 54 00:03:41,880 --> 00:03:43,920 Speaker 1: return to Dallas for a trial. 55 00:03:44,400 --> 00:03:49,200 Speaker 2: That seems just a bit absurd as an excuse. 56 00:03:49,760 --> 00:03:53,000 Speaker 1: Yes it does, but it wasn't all that Jack Ruby 57 00:03:53,040 --> 00:03:56,560 Speaker 1: had to say. He said something to his jailer after 58 00:03:56,600 --> 00:03:59,880 Speaker 1: being arrested for killing Oswald, and it speaks to some 59 00:04:00,000 --> 00:04:03,400 Speaker 1: something much much bigger. Solo, Dad, Could you read this? 60 00:04:03,960 --> 00:04:07,640 Speaker 2: Sure quote? Now they're going to find out about Cuba, 61 00:04:07,840 --> 00:04:10,320 Speaker 2: the guns, New Orleans and everything. 62 00:04:10,960 --> 00:04:14,640 Speaker 1: Ruby was concerned that his connection to the CIA funded 63 00:04:14,840 --> 00:04:17,680 Speaker 1: anti castro operations would be uncovered. 64 00:04:18,160 --> 00:04:22,039 Speaker 2: How exactly is a guy like Jack Ruby connected to 65 00:04:22,040 --> 00:04:24,239 Speaker 2: what's happening in Cuba and New Orleans. 66 00:04:24,720 --> 00:04:28,080 Speaker 1: Well to understand that, we need to understand who exactly 67 00:04:28,200 --> 00:04:33,159 Speaker 1: Jack Ruby was. Jack Ruby was born in Chicago. He 68 00:04:33,279 --> 00:04:37,800 Speaker 1: was born Jacob Leon Rubinstein. At eleven, he was arrested 69 00:04:37,839 --> 00:04:41,880 Speaker 1: for truancy. He spent time in foster homes. He dropped 70 00:04:41,880 --> 00:04:45,799 Speaker 1: out of school and eventually joined the Teamsters Union. After 71 00:04:45,839 --> 00:04:48,520 Speaker 1: serving in World War Two, he moved to Dallas. He 72 00:04:48,600 --> 00:04:51,800 Speaker 1: changed his name to Jack Ruby, and he started managing 73 00:04:51,920 --> 00:04:54,480 Speaker 1: nightclubs and strip joints around town. 74 00:04:55,240 --> 00:05:00,560 Speaker 3: There's evidence he also became involved in narcotics, prostitution, and 75 00:05:00,640 --> 00:05:03,880 Speaker 3: obviously these are all businesses that are connected to the mob. 76 00:05:04,560 --> 00:05:08,520 Speaker 1: The Dallas County Sheriff, Steve Guthrie told the FBI that 77 00:05:08,600 --> 00:05:14,320 Speaker 1: he believed quote Ruby operated some prostitution activities and other 78 00:05:14,440 --> 00:05:17,880 Speaker 1: vices in his club. He was cozy with the Dallas police. 79 00:05:18,680 --> 00:05:21,000 Speaker 1: Officers would come into his club and he'd give them 80 00:05:21,040 --> 00:05:24,040 Speaker 1: free booze, and he'd make sure that the women paid 81 00:05:24,240 --> 00:05:25,560 Speaker 1: proper attention. 82 00:05:25,480 --> 00:05:26,880 Speaker 2: Hum quite the host. 83 00:05:27,680 --> 00:05:32,200 Speaker 1: Along with running his clubs, Ruby became involved in running 84 00:05:32,279 --> 00:05:33,400 Speaker 1: guns for the mob. 85 00:05:34,080 --> 00:05:37,720 Speaker 2: A friend of Ruby's named James E. Baird spoke to 86 00:05:37,760 --> 00:05:41,599 Speaker 2: the Dallas Morning News and testified to the FBI saying 87 00:05:41,640 --> 00:05:45,279 Speaker 2: that Jack Ruby quote stored guns and ammunition in a 88 00:05:45,320 --> 00:05:49,320 Speaker 2: two story house between the waterfront and the railroad tracks 89 00:05:49,360 --> 00:05:53,800 Speaker 2: in Kema, Texas. Baird personally saw Ruby and his associates 90 00:05:54,000 --> 00:05:59,080 Speaker 2: load quote many boxes of new guns, including automatic rifles 91 00:05:59,240 --> 00:06:04,360 Speaker 2: and handguns. Where exactly was he running these guns too? 92 00:06:05,000 --> 00:06:10,560 Speaker 1: Cuba. In September nineteen fifty nine, Ruby traveled to Havana 93 00:06:10,880 --> 00:06:14,960 Speaker 1: as a guest of a close friend named Louis J. Mcwilly. 94 00:06:15,800 --> 00:06:21,200 Speaker 1: Before Castro took over, Florida, mob boss Santos Traficanti chose 95 00:06:21,240 --> 00:06:25,040 Speaker 1: mcwilly to run his casino in Havana, and after Castro 96 00:06:25,160 --> 00:06:28,600 Speaker 1: came to power, mcwilly was arrested and thrown out of 97 00:06:28,640 --> 00:06:33,160 Speaker 1: the country. Back in the US, mcwilly was hired by Meyer, Lanski, 98 00:06:33,320 --> 00:06:37,000 Speaker 1: and Sam Giancana to run their casinos in Las Vegas. 99 00:06:37,560 --> 00:06:41,200 Speaker 3: Five days before Kennedy was gunned down in Dallas. Ruby 100 00:06:41,279 --> 00:06:44,279 Speaker 3: was seen at the Thunderbird in Vegas with mcwilly. 101 00:06:44,960 --> 00:06:48,160 Speaker 1: You know, people often get lost in the semantics of 102 00:06:48,560 --> 00:06:51,720 Speaker 1: whether or not Ruby was a mobster. Well, he wasn't 103 00:06:51,720 --> 00:06:55,080 Speaker 1: a made man himself, but he had clear connections to 104 00:06:55,160 --> 00:06:57,800 Speaker 1: the mob It's the world he grew up in and 105 00:06:57,839 --> 00:07:01,400 Speaker 1: the world he operated from in Dallas. They say you 106 00:07:01,440 --> 00:07:04,160 Speaker 1: can tell a lot about a person by the company 107 00:07:04,200 --> 00:07:08,799 Speaker 1: they keep. The House Select Committee looked at Ruby's phone 108 00:07:08,839 --> 00:07:12,080 Speaker 1: records in the days leading up to November twenty second, 109 00:07:12,680 --> 00:07:16,120 Speaker 1: and they discovered that he had made numerous phone calls 110 00:07:16,360 --> 00:07:17,520 Speaker 1: to known mobsters. 111 00:07:18,360 --> 00:07:22,840 Speaker 3: Their report showed that weeks prior to the assassination, Ruby 112 00:07:22,880 --> 00:07:27,160 Speaker 3: made approximately one hundred and twenty calls to mobsters associated 113 00:07:27,200 --> 00:07:29,800 Speaker 3: with Sam g and Kanna and Carlos Marcello. 114 00:07:30,520 --> 00:07:32,680 Speaker 2: So how does this relate back to Oswald. 115 00:07:33,600 --> 00:07:36,800 Speaker 1: Well, just like we saw an uptick in activity around 116 00:07:36,840 --> 00:07:40,360 Speaker 1: Oswald leading up to the assassination, the same was true 117 00:07:40,400 --> 00:07:44,600 Speaker 1: of Ruby. Ruby and Oswald operated in the same sphere. 118 00:07:45,040 --> 00:07:47,800 Speaker 1: So it should come as no surprise when I tell 119 00:07:47,840 --> 00:07:51,960 Speaker 1: you that, contrary to the Warrant Commission's conclusion that there 120 00:07:52,040 --> 00:07:56,120 Speaker 1: was no direct or indirect relationship between Lee Harvey Oswald 121 00:07:56,280 --> 00:07:59,720 Speaker 1: and Jack Ruby. There is plenty of evidence that the 122 00:07:59,760 --> 00:08:02,280 Speaker 1: two some of them knew each other. How do we 123 00:08:02,320 --> 00:08:05,680 Speaker 1: know that, Well, there are eyewitnesses who talked on the 124 00:08:05,760 --> 00:08:08,480 Speaker 1: record about Ruby and Oswald's relationship. 125 00:08:09,320 --> 00:08:13,040 Speaker 3: Dorothy Markham, a woman who dated Ruby, told the FBI 126 00:08:13,720 --> 00:08:18,600 Speaker 3: that Oswald worked for Ruby during June and July. Clyde 127 00:08:18,600 --> 00:08:21,840 Speaker 3: Malcolm Limbaugh, who worked for Ruby for three years, said 128 00:08:21,880 --> 00:08:26,800 Speaker 3: he saw Oswald in Ruby's office on several occasions. Helen K. Smith, 129 00:08:27,080 --> 00:08:30,239 Speaker 3: who worked at the Carousel Club, told the Dallas Police 130 00:08:30,240 --> 00:08:33,480 Speaker 3: that she saw Ruby and Oswald together on many occasions. 131 00:08:34,280 --> 00:08:38,640 Speaker 3: And Robert Roy, Ruby's auto mechanic, said that Oswald used 132 00:08:38,640 --> 00:08:41,240 Speaker 3: to drop off Ruby's car for repairs. 133 00:08:41,760 --> 00:08:45,080 Speaker 1: And then there's Sharry Angel, one of the most popular 134 00:08:45,160 --> 00:08:49,320 Speaker 1: strippers at Ruby's club. Dick interviewed her years ago. 135 00:08:50,240 --> 00:08:53,319 Speaker 3: I heard that you remember Oswald being in the club 136 00:08:53,360 --> 00:08:56,360 Speaker 3: as well. Yeah, what do you remember about that. 137 00:08:56,679 --> 00:09:01,320 Speaker 2: Nancy carrying twist been hitting ruin town? 138 00:09:02,360 --> 00:09:05,920 Speaker 4: Got my husband of communist, called your husband a common 139 00:09:06,080 --> 00:09:06,920 Speaker 4: for an audience. 140 00:09:07,040 --> 00:09:11,080 Speaker 1: Yeah, if you miss that. She said that she remembers 141 00:09:11,240 --> 00:09:14,599 Speaker 1: Oswald doing the twist with a woman named Kathy k 142 00:09:15,240 --> 00:09:19,119 Speaker 1: and her husband hitting him because Oswald called him a communist. 143 00:09:19,559 --> 00:09:23,000 Speaker 3: So Oswald and Ruby definitely knew each other in the 144 00:09:23,080 --> 00:09:24,360 Speaker 3: club before it happened. 145 00:09:24,520 --> 00:09:25,000 Speaker 5: Oh yeah. 146 00:09:26,120 --> 00:09:30,000 Speaker 2: And none of those witnesses testified to the Warren Commission. 147 00:09:30,720 --> 00:09:34,679 Speaker 1: None. And it wasn't until seven months after he killed 148 00:09:34,760 --> 00:09:39,160 Speaker 1: Oswald that Ruby was even interviewed by the Commission. And 149 00:09:39,320 --> 00:09:43,599 Speaker 1: what he said and didn't get to say will shock you. 150 00:09:55,240 --> 00:09:58,880 Speaker 2: Why did the Warren Commission wait so long to interview 151 00:09:59,040 --> 00:10:01,480 Speaker 2: Jack Ruby? How was he not at the top of 152 00:10:01,559 --> 00:10:01,880 Speaker 2: the list? 153 00:10:02,120 --> 00:10:05,760 Speaker 1: You tell me? Before being interviewed by the Commission, Ruby 154 00:10:05,840 --> 00:10:08,200 Speaker 1: insisted on taking a lie detector test. 155 00:10:08,920 --> 00:10:12,520 Speaker 2: In the Warren Commission report, it says that quote as 156 00:10:12,600 --> 00:10:16,640 Speaker 2: early as December of nineteen sixty three, Jack Ruby expressed 157 00:10:16,679 --> 00:10:20,360 Speaker 2: his desire to be examined with a polygraph, truth serum 158 00:10:20,679 --> 00:10:24,679 Speaker 2: or any other scientific device which would test his veracity. 159 00:10:25,480 --> 00:10:26,400 Speaker 2: And did they give him one? 160 00:10:26,720 --> 00:10:29,719 Speaker 1: Well, no, not at first. Eventually they did. 161 00:10:30,320 --> 00:10:31,000 Speaker 2: What did it show? 162 00:10:31,679 --> 00:10:34,840 Speaker 1: The Warren Commission said that they found it inconclusive. 163 00:10:35,400 --> 00:10:37,360 Speaker 2: What does inconclusive mean? 164 00:10:37,920 --> 00:10:41,199 Speaker 1: Well, they said that they couldn't verify the answers as 165 00:10:41,360 --> 00:10:45,400 Speaker 1: true or false based on concerns they had over Ruby's 166 00:10:45,720 --> 00:10:48,240 Speaker 1: mental state it was an excuse that they used for 167 00:10:48,360 --> 00:10:52,480 Speaker 1: other witnesses that didn't perfectly fit into the predetermined narrative. 168 00:10:53,160 --> 00:10:56,600 Speaker 1: Ruby was frustrated, and when the war report came out, 169 00:10:57,160 --> 00:10:58,680 Speaker 1: this is what he said to the press. 170 00:10:59,320 --> 00:11:03,079 Speaker 2: Ruby said, quote, the Warren Report never gave me the 171 00:11:03,200 --> 00:11:06,719 Speaker 2: true authentity when I requested a polygraph test. He then 172 00:11:06,800 --> 00:11:09,680 Speaker 2: goes on to say, why they held back the answers 173 00:11:10,000 --> 00:11:13,120 Speaker 2: the results, whether they're true or false, that's for you 174 00:11:13,320 --> 00:11:16,880 Speaker 2: to find out. That's for you to find out. That's 175 00:11:17,200 --> 00:11:18,000 Speaker 2: pretty ominous. 176 00:11:19,200 --> 00:11:21,240 Speaker 1: I think he wanted to tell the truth about why 177 00:11:21,280 --> 00:11:24,120 Speaker 1: he killed Oswald, but he knew that his life would 178 00:11:24,120 --> 00:11:27,000 Speaker 1: be in danger if he did so. Ruby told the 179 00:11:27,040 --> 00:11:29,400 Speaker 1: Warren Commission that if they got him out of Dallas, 180 00:11:29,920 --> 00:11:31,640 Speaker 1: he would tell them everything he knew. 181 00:11:32,400 --> 00:11:35,440 Speaker 2: He would tell them everything. Kind of can't get more 182 00:11:35,480 --> 00:11:36,040 Speaker 2: loaded than that. 183 00:11:36,559 --> 00:11:40,560 Speaker 1: No, no, you can't. And he said, quote, gentlemen, unless 184 00:11:40,559 --> 00:11:43,320 Speaker 1: you take me to Washington, you can't get a fair 185 00:11:43,440 --> 00:11:45,800 Speaker 1: shake out of me. If you want to hear any 186 00:11:45,880 --> 00:11:48,880 Speaker 1: further testimony out of me, you'll have to get me 187 00:11:49,000 --> 00:11:52,400 Speaker 1: to Washington soon. I want to tell the truth, and 188 00:11:52,520 --> 00:11:55,319 Speaker 1: I can't tell it here. This isn't the place for 189 00:11:55,480 --> 00:11:57,720 Speaker 1: me to tell you what I want to tell. 190 00:11:58,600 --> 00:11:59,600 Speaker 2: Did they take him to DC? 191 00:12:00,160 --> 00:12:01,600 Speaker 1: He never left Dallas. 192 00:12:02,800 --> 00:12:06,720 Speaker 3: After he was denied his trip to Washington. Ruby said quote, 193 00:12:07,559 --> 00:12:10,480 Speaker 3: I may not live tomorrow to give any further testimony. 194 00:12:11,120 --> 00:12:12,880 Speaker 3: I want to get out to the public, and I 195 00:12:13,000 --> 00:12:13,800 Speaker 3: can't say it here. 196 00:12:15,160 --> 00:12:17,640 Speaker 2: Why couldn't he speak in Dallas? Why do you think 197 00:12:17,679 --> 00:12:19,560 Speaker 2: he wanted to move so badly? 198 00:12:20,200 --> 00:12:23,439 Speaker 1: He was terrified for his life, He said, quote, I 199 00:12:23,640 --> 00:12:27,160 Speaker 1: tell you, gentlemen, my whole family is in jeopardy. He 200 00:12:27,240 --> 00:12:30,199 Speaker 1: didn't want to end up like George de Mornshield, who 201 00:12:30,280 --> 00:12:33,760 Speaker 1: mysteriously died the day he was subpoenaed to testify to 202 00:12:33,840 --> 00:12:37,720 Speaker 1: the House Select Committee, or Johnny Roselli, who was found 203 00:12:37,840 --> 00:12:40,440 Speaker 1: chopped up and stuffed in an oil drum right before 204 00:12:40,800 --> 00:12:44,600 Speaker 1: he was supposed to appear before the committee, or Richard K. Snagel, 205 00:12:44,960 --> 00:12:48,319 Speaker 1: who died the day he received a subpoena to testify 206 00:12:48,679 --> 00:12:50,920 Speaker 1: to the Assassination Record's Review Board. 207 00:12:51,360 --> 00:12:53,920 Speaker 3: Here is how Robert Blakey, head of the House Select 208 00:12:53,960 --> 00:12:57,439 Speaker 3: Committee on Assassinations, interpreted Ruby's remarks. 209 00:12:58,000 --> 00:13:01,199 Speaker 2: Blakey said, quote, Ruby, I was trying to tell the 210 00:13:01,320 --> 00:13:05,200 Speaker 2: truth about the conspiracy he knew existed, but he feared 211 00:13:05,240 --> 00:13:09,199 Speaker 2: for his life. You'll remember that Robert Blakey had a 212 00:13:09,320 --> 00:13:11,880 Speaker 2: background in targeting organized crime. 213 00:13:13,080 --> 00:13:17,280 Speaker 4: No Mah kills witnesses who are potential people who can 214 00:13:17,360 --> 00:13:20,800 Speaker 4: tell the true story. And that's the reason I think 215 00:13:20,920 --> 00:13:23,600 Speaker 4: Jack Ruby shortly Harvey Osweoll. 216 00:13:24,600 --> 00:13:26,959 Speaker 1: From the time Kennedy was shot and killed until he 217 00:13:27,120 --> 00:13:30,719 Speaker 1: himself was shot and killed, Oswald was in custody for 218 00:13:31,000 --> 00:13:34,839 Speaker 1: just under forty eight hours. Here's a transcript from a 219 00:13:35,080 --> 00:13:38,600 Speaker 1: press conference during that period. Sola ed, could you read. 220 00:13:38,520 --> 00:13:43,920 Speaker 2: This sure, reporter, did you kill the President Oswald? No, sir, 221 00:13:44,040 --> 00:13:47,079 Speaker 2: I didn't. People keep asking me that, reporter, did you 222 00:13:47,160 --> 00:13:51,319 Speaker 2: shoot the President Oswald? I work in that building? Reporter? 223 00:13:51,760 --> 00:13:55,199 Speaker 2: Were you in the building at the time? Oswald? Naturally 224 00:13:55,280 --> 00:13:58,640 Speaker 2: if I work in that building, yes, sir, reporter, did 225 00:13:58,720 --> 00:14:01,079 Speaker 2: you shoot the President Oswald? 226 00:14:01,520 --> 00:14:01,559 Speaker 4: No? 227 00:14:01,840 --> 00:14:03,719 Speaker 2: They are taking me in because of the fact that 228 00:14:03,800 --> 00:14:06,880 Speaker 2: I lived in the Soviet Union. I'm just a patsy. 229 00:14:07,640 --> 00:14:11,560 Speaker 2: It's remarkable that he's just out there fending for himself. Usually, 230 00:14:11,960 --> 00:14:14,880 Speaker 2: you know, in any press conference with a suspected criminal, 231 00:14:15,360 --> 00:14:16,840 Speaker 2: their lawyer would speak for them. 232 00:14:17,480 --> 00:14:19,360 Speaker 3: Oswald was never granted a lawyer. 233 00:14:19,800 --> 00:14:21,160 Speaker 2: Did he get to make any phone calls? 234 00:14:21,560 --> 00:14:25,280 Speaker 1: He called Marina at Ruth Paynes, and there's evidence that 235 00:14:25,360 --> 00:14:29,880 Speaker 1: he made one other call and it's significant. He placed 236 00:14:29,920 --> 00:14:34,120 Speaker 1: a call to a military counter intelligence officer in North 237 00:14:34,200 --> 00:14:37,200 Speaker 1: Carolina named John Hurt. And how do we know that 238 00:14:38,000 --> 00:14:41,280 Speaker 1: because there's a receipt showing that the operator placed the call. 239 00:14:41,720 --> 00:14:45,560 Speaker 1: The switchboard operators who placed long distance calls for people 240 00:14:45,680 --> 00:14:49,000 Speaker 1: inside the jail were required to fill out a slip. 241 00:14:49,680 --> 00:14:53,200 Speaker 1: A researcher found the slip with the date eleven twenty 242 00:14:53,280 --> 00:14:57,680 Speaker 1: three sixty three and John Hurt's name and telephone number. 243 00:14:58,280 --> 00:15:01,680 Speaker 1: The woman working the switchboard evening said that the call 244 00:15:01,880 --> 00:15:04,840 Speaker 1: was never answered and that the two men in suits 245 00:15:05,240 --> 00:15:08,320 Speaker 1: that were in the room likely made sure that the 246 00:15:08,440 --> 00:15:09,640 Speaker 1: call never went through. 247 00:15:10,480 --> 00:15:13,960 Speaker 3: Researchers found John Hurd decades later to ask him about 248 00:15:14,000 --> 00:15:17,240 Speaker 3: the call. He claimed he never knew Oswald and was 249 00:15:17,320 --> 00:15:20,880 Speaker 3: completely unaware that Oswald had tried to call him, But 250 00:15:21,240 --> 00:15:25,400 Speaker 3: he also didn't share the fact that he was military counterintelligence. 251 00:15:26,040 --> 00:15:28,640 Speaker 2: What do you think he was hoping to accomplish with 252 00:15:28,840 --> 00:15:31,160 Speaker 2: the call? If he actually got Hurt on the line, 253 00:15:31,400 --> 00:15:32,440 Speaker 2: it was likely, and. 254 00:15:32,520 --> 00:15:36,960 Speaker 3: This process has been confirmed by XCIA agents, that Oswald 255 00:15:37,080 --> 00:15:40,200 Speaker 3: was trying to reach a cutout a go between to 256 00:15:40,280 --> 00:15:43,320 Speaker 3: get a message to his case officer. He was going 257 00:15:43,400 --> 00:15:46,320 Speaker 3: through a process designed for people on intelligence missions to 258 00:15:46,400 --> 00:15:49,400 Speaker 3: get help, but since the call was never put through, 259 00:15:50,160 --> 00:15:51,920 Speaker 3: Oswald was hung out to dry. 260 00:15:52,760 --> 00:15:55,720 Speaker 1: In another press conference at the police station, a reporter 261 00:15:55,920 --> 00:16:00,320 Speaker 1: asks did you kill the president? And Oswald says, quote, no, 262 00:16:00,760 --> 00:16:04,120 Speaker 1: I have not been charged with that. In fact, nobody 263 00:16:04,160 --> 00:16:08,200 Speaker 1: has said that to me yet. The reporter then tells Oswald, 264 00:16:08,560 --> 00:16:12,560 Speaker 1: you have been charged, and Oswald is absolutely stunned. 265 00:16:13,120 --> 00:16:16,440 Speaker 2: In the televised report of this moment, you can really 266 00:16:16,600 --> 00:16:19,560 Speaker 2: see his shock reaction to this in real time. 267 00:16:19,920 --> 00:16:24,200 Speaker 1: He's realizing the implications of it all, that this horrific 268 00:16:24,360 --> 00:16:27,200 Speaker 1: crime is going to be pinned on him. And again, 269 00:16:27,800 --> 00:16:30,520 Speaker 1: he didn't just say that he was innocent. He said 270 00:16:30,560 --> 00:16:34,400 Speaker 1: he was a patsy. He knew that the men responsible 271 00:16:34,440 --> 00:16:37,840 Speaker 1: for this had used him. That's why from the moment 272 00:16:38,000 --> 00:16:42,200 Speaker 1: Oswald is brought to the police station, Jack Ruby starts 273 00:16:42,320 --> 00:16:46,560 Speaker 1: to stalk him. Ruby's movements just before he kills Oswald 274 00:16:46,640 --> 00:16:51,440 Speaker 1: show that this was not a spontaneous emotional decision. Ruby 275 00:16:51,600 --> 00:17:07,480 Speaker 1: was part of something much bigger. Jack Ruby showed up 276 00:17:07,480 --> 00:17:11,280 Speaker 1: at the police station at least twice before he found 277 00:17:11,320 --> 00:17:15,400 Speaker 1: the opportunity on his third visit to take Oswald out. 278 00:17:16,000 --> 00:17:18,280 Speaker 1: He was there during a press conference. 279 00:17:18,400 --> 00:17:22,560 Speaker 3: At DA Henry Wade's press conference when Wade mistakenly identified 280 00:17:22,600 --> 00:17:26,480 Speaker 3: Oswald as a member of the anti Castro Free Cuba Committee. 281 00:17:27,080 --> 00:17:31,880 Speaker 3: Ruby corrected the DA saying, quote, no, sir, mister District Attorney, 282 00:17:32,280 --> 00:17:35,040 Speaker 3: Oswald was a member of the Fair Play for Cuba Committee. 283 00:17:35,600 --> 00:17:38,400 Speaker 1: None of the press, or police or FBI there caught 284 00:17:38,440 --> 00:17:43,040 Speaker 1: the DA's mistake, but nightclub owner Jack Ruby did. It's 285 00:17:43,280 --> 00:17:46,600 Speaker 1: just so bizarre. First of all, why is a nightclub 286 00:17:46,680 --> 00:17:49,320 Speaker 1: owner at this press conference to begin with? And second, 287 00:17:50,040 --> 00:17:53,200 Speaker 1: how does he know the difference between the Free Cuba 288 00:17:53,520 --> 00:17:55,520 Speaker 1: and the Fair Play for Cuba Committee? 289 00:17:55,680 --> 00:17:58,399 Speaker 2: So what exactly is the implication there. 290 00:17:58,680 --> 00:18:00,880 Speaker 3: That Ruby knew all about Oswald. 291 00:18:01,720 --> 00:18:04,280 Speaker 1: We spoke with a man named John Currington about the 292 00:18:04,359 --> 00:18:08,359 Speaker 1: time leading up to Oswald's death. Now, John Currington, for 293 00:18:08,560 --> 00:18:12,080 Speaker 1: years was the right hand man for oil Baron hl Hunt. 294 00:18:12,720 --> 00:18:15,000 Speaker 1: Hunt was one of the richest men in America, with 295 00:18:15,200 --> 00:18:18,680 Speaker 1: influence at the highest levels of government and the mafia. 296 00:18:19,119 --> 00:18:23,000 Speaker 1: Now Here is John Carrington talking about a call he 297 00:18:23,160 --> 00:18:27,200 Speaker 1: received on Saturday, November twenty third from hl Hunt. 298 00:18:27,600 --> 00:18:30,840 Speaker 5: He called me about four or five Clark and asked 299 00:18:30,880 --> 00:18:33,520 Speaker 5: me to go down to the police station and check 300 00:18:33,640 --> 00:18:37,919 Speaker 5: on what security, if any, there was around Lee Harvey 301 00:18:38,119 --> 00:18:41,080 Speaker 5: orwoll And he said, whenever you find out what I 302 00:18:41,200 --> 00:18:44,280 Speaker 5: won't know about security, come to the house. 303 00:18:44,480 --> 00:18:45,440 Speaker 1: So what did you find? 304 00:18:46,080 --> 00:18:49,040 Speaker 5: I go down to police station and I had no 305 00:18:49,240 --> 00:18:52,560 Speaker 5: trouble walking in walking out. I did have a briefcase 306 00:18:52,640 --> 00:18:56,159 Speaker 5: with me. Nobody looked in that brafcase and I was 307 00:18:56,240 --> 00:18:59,919 Speaker 5: satisfied that there was no security or whatsoever surrounding Lee 308 00:19:00,119 --> 00:19:01,119 Speaker 5: Harvey ol Waldt. 309 00:19:01,400 --> 00:19:04,280 Speaker 1: And why did mister Hunt ask you to check out 310 00:19:04,320 --> 00:19:05,560 Speaker 1: the security situation? 311 00:19:06,119 --> 00:19:10,280 Speaker 5: He wroted Lee Harvey ol wall of silence without having 312 00:19:10,320 --> 00:19:12,560 Speaker 5: any kind of court here or any something else. 313 00:19:13,320 --> 00:19:16,679 Speaker 1: They knew that they could easily get to oswald They 314 00:19:16,920 --> 00:19:19,840 Speaker 1: just needed the right guy to handle the job, and 315 00:19:20,280 --> 00:19:22,760 Speaker 1: Hunt knew just who to turn to. 316 00:19:23,320 --> 00:19:27,000 Speaker 5: I went after mister Holt's house and he said, I 317 00:19:27,160 --> 00:19:29,639 Speaker 5: want to get a hold of Joe Savello and have 318 00:19:29,800 --> 00:19:32,240 Speaker 5: him here as early as they can Sunday morning. 319 00:19:32,800 --> 00:19:35,600 Speaker 1: Joseph Ello was the head of the mob in Dallas. 320 00:19:37,359 --> 00:19:40,480 Speaker 1: It's the morning of the twenty fourth, two days after 321 00:19:40,600 --> 00:19:42,359 Speaker 1: the assassination at. 322 00:19:42,280 --> 00:19:46,960 Speaker 3: Ten thirty five, Ira Walker, a television technician, is inside 323 00:19:47,040 --> 00:19:50,920 Speaker 3: the station's news van outside the city hall. Jack Ruby 324 00:19:50,960 --> 00:19:53,320 Speaker 3: comes up to the window and asks has he been 325 00:19:53,359 --> 00:19:54,080 Speaker 3: brought down yet? 326 00:19:55,040 --> 00:19:59,520 Speaker 1: The he is Lee Harvey Oswald. Ruby knows that Oswald 327 00:19:59,640 --> 00:20:02,080 Speaker 1: is going to be moved that day, and he hangs 328 00:20:02,160 --> 00:20:05,400 Speaker 1: around to make sure that he is there when it happens. 329 00:20:06,520 --> 00:20:11,520 Speaker 1: At eleven seventeen, Ruby walks up an alley, passes through 330 00:20:11,560 --> 00:20:14,840 Speaker 1: the crowd, and enters the ramp into the police station. 331 00:20:15,280 --> 00:20:19,240 Speaker 1: Within minutes, he's positioned directly in front of Oswald and 332 00:20:19,400 --> 00:20:22,520 Speaker 1: then he shoots Oswald. 333 00:20:24,720 --> 00:20:26,480 Speaker 2: Here's David Talbot again. 334 00:20:27,560 --> 00:20:30,800 Speaker 1: He's a mafia eron boy. That's why he killed Oswald. 335 00:20:31,280 --> 00:20:34,320 Speaker 3: In the mafia was the Aeron boys for the CIA. 336 00:20:34,800 --> 00:20:37,000 Speaker 3: They used the mafia to do their dirty work. 337 00:20:37,560 --> 00:20:41,400 Speaker 2: And here's the head of the House Select Committee, Robert Blakey. 338 00:20:42,040 --> 00:20:46,359 Speaker 4: Jack Ruby was the perfect guy to do it. Mob connected, 339 00:20:46,640 --> 00:20:47,240 Speaker 4: but loosely. 340 00:20:47,920 --> 00:20:50,800 Speaker 1: Ruby gave an interview in March of nineteen sixty five, 341 00:20:51,240 --> 00:20:52,600 Speaker 1: a year after his conviction. 342 00:20:53,280 --> 00:20:57,040 Speaker 2: In the interview, Ruby said, quote, everything pertaining to what's 343 00:20:57,119 --> 00:21:00,240 Speaker 2: happening has never come to the surface. The world will 344 00:21:00,320 --> 00:21:03,400 Speaker 2: never know the true facts of what occurred my motives. 345 00:21:03,880 --> 00:21:06,400 Speaker 2: The people who had so much to gain and had 346 00:21:06,440 --> 00:21:08,879 Speaker 2: such an ulterior motive for putting me in the position 347 00:21:09,000 --> 00:21:12,159 Speaker 2: I'm in will never let the true facts come above 348 00:21:12,320 --> 00:21:13,200 Speaker 2: board to the world. 349 00:21:14,440 --> 00:21:18,760 Speaker 1: In nineteen sixty six, Jack Ruby died in prison, three 350 00:21:18,880 --> 00:21:22,560 Speaker 1: years after the assassination of President Kennedy. He died of 351 00:21:22,640 --> 00:21:27,080 Speaker 1: a pulmonary embolism caused by complications from a cancer that 352 00:21:27,240 --> 00:21:35,320 Speaker 1: came on suddenly and aggressively. In the next episode, we'll 353 00:21:35,440 --> 00:21:39,320 Speaker 1: lay out in detail how we think the assassination took place. 354 00:21:40,040 --> 00:21:43,320 Speaker 1: We will name the shooters and give you their locations. 355 00:21:44,160 --> 00:21:47,400 Speaker 1: But before we finished this episode, we need to talk 356 00:21:47,440 --> 00:21:50,880 Speaker 1: about something that for the most part, has been ignored, 357 00:21:51,920 --> 00:21:55,200 Speaker 1: and that's the impact that Kennedy's death had on the 358 00:21:55,280 --> 00:21:56,080 Speaker 1: rest of the world. 359 00:21:56,640 --> 00:22:00,520 Speaker 3: On the day of the assassination, Fidel Castro was lunch 360 00:22:00,680 --> 00:22:04,399 Speaker 3: with a French reporter named Jean Danielle. Danielle reported that 361 00:22:04,520 --> 00:22:07,280 Speaker 3: when Castro got word that the president had been shot, 362 00:22:07,800 --> 00:22:13,720 Speaker 3: he said, sunamala noisia, this is bad news. He said 363 00:22:13,720 --> 00:22:17,560 Speaker 3: it three times. Then when he got confirmation that Kennedy 364 00:22:17,600 --> 00:22:22,240 Speaker 3: had died, he said, quote, everything is going to change. Then, 365 00:22:22,359 --> 00:22:26,399 Speaker 3: as he processed the situation, Castro said, quote, now they 366 00:22:26,440 --> 00:22:29,840 Speaker 3: will have to find the assassin quickly, but very quickly. 367 00:22:30,520 --> 00:22:34,040 Speaker 3: Otherwise you watch and see, I know them. They will 368 00:22:34,119 --> 00:22:36,480 Speaker 3: try to put the blame on us for this thing. 369 00:22:37,040 --> 00:22:38,520 Speaker 1: Which is exactly what they did. 370 00:22:39,119 --> 00:22:43,520 Speaker 2: Reports that were declassified in twenty seventeen show that the 371 00:22:43,680 --> 00:22:47,400 Speaker 2: KGB held a series of emergency meetings when they heard 372 00:22:47,440 --> 00:22:52,119 Speaker 2: the news. Sergei Khrushchev, Nikita's son wrote in a memoir 373 00:22:52,160 --> 00:22:55,159 Speaker 2: about his father that when his father heard the news, 374 00:22:55,280 --> 00:22:59,360 Speaker 2: he quote fell to his knees and sobbed. The Soviet 375 00:22:59,440 --> 00:23:03,960 Speaker 2: parties knew newspaper Pravda ran a biography depicting Kennedy as 376 00:23:04,040 --> 00:23:05,280 Speaker 2: a champion of peace. 377 00:23:06,040 --> 00:23:10,200 Speaker 1: It's completely counterintuitive to think that the Soviets or the 378 00:23:10,320 --> 00:23:14,000 Speaker 1: Cubans had anything to do with this. Kennedy was trying 379 00:23:14,040 --> 00:23:16,840 Speaker 1: to forge a path towards peace with them. He was 380 00:23:16,880 --> 00:23:17,639 Speaker 1: their great hope. 381 00:23:18,160 --> 00:23:20,560 Speaker 2: Then who did these foreigners think? 382 00:23:20,800 --> 00:23:21,040 Speaker 4: Did it? 383 00:23:21,560 --> 00:23:23,920 Speaker 1: I believe that the answer to your question can be 384 00:23:24,040 --> 00:23:27,040 Speaker 1: provided by French President Charles de gaull. 385 00:23:27,400 --> 00:23:31,080 Speaker 3: Degall shared his thoughts about the assassination with his Information 386 00:23:31,280 --> 00:23:35,439 Speaker 3: Minister Roger Parafiet, who then shared these thoughts in. 387 00:23:35,480 --> 00:23:40,520 Speaker 2: His memoir Degall says, quote what happened to Kennedy is 388 00:23:40,600 --> 00:23:43,639 Speaker 2: what nearly happened to me. The security forces were in 389 00:23:43,800 --> 00:23:48,760 Speaker 2: cahoots with extremists. Then Paraft asked a Gaull, do you 390 00:23:48,920 --> 00:23:53,040 Speaker 2: think Oswald was affront Everything leads me to believe it. 391 00:23:53,320 --> 00:23:57,080 Speaker 2: De Gaull replied, they got their hands on this communist 392 00:23:57,200 --> 00:24:00,560 Speaker 2: who wasn't one while still being one. He had a 393 00:24:00,640 --> 00:24:04,640 Speaker 2: subpar intellect and was an exalted fanatic, just the man 394 00:24:04,760 --> 00:24:07,480 Speaker 2: they needed, the perfect one to be accused. The guy 395 00:24:07,600 --> 00:24:11,639 Speaker 2: ran away because he probably became suspicious. They wanted to 396 00:24:11,720 --> 00:24:14,000 Speaker 2: kill him on the spot before he could be grabbed 397 00:24:14,080 --> 00:24:19,520 Speaker 2: by the judicial system. Degall continued, security forces all over 398 00:24:19,600 --> 00:24:22,120 Speaker 2: the world are the same when they do this kind 399 00:24:22,160 --> 00:24:25,200 Speaker 2: of dirty work. As soon as they succeed in wiping 400 00:24:25,240 --> 00:24:29,240 Speaker 2: out the false assassin, they declare that the justice system 401 00:24:29,400 --> 00:24:33,000 Speaker 2: no longer need be concerned, that no further public action 402 00:24:33,240 --> 00:24:37,359 Speaker 2: was needed now that the guilty perpetrator was dead. Better 403 00:24:37,520 --> 00:24:40,760 Speaker 2: to assassinate an innocent man than to let a civil 404 00:24:40,840 --> 00:24:46,240 Speaker 2: war break out. Better an injustice than disorder. Degall said, 405 00:24:46,760 --> 00:24:51,240 Speaker 2: America is in danger of upheavals, but you'll see all 406 00:24:51,320 --> 00:24:55,119 Speaker 2: of them together, will observe the law of silence. They 407 00:24:55,160 --> 00:24:59,920 Speaker 2: will close ranks. They'll do everything to stifle any scandal, 408 00:25:00,440 --> 00:25:02,760 Speaker 2: in order to not lose face in front of the 409 00:25:02,840 --> 00:25:06,800 Speaker 2: whole world, in order to not risk unleashing riots in 410 00:25:06,880 --> 00:25:10,560 Speaker 2: the United States, in order to preserve the Union, and 411 00:25:10,640 --> 00:25:13,399 Speaker 2: to avoid a new civil war, in order to not 412 00:25:13,760 --> 00:25:17,760 Speaker 2: ask themselves questions they don't want to know, they don't 413 00:25:17,840 --> 00:25:22,160 Speaker 2: want to find out. They won't allow themselves to find out. 414 00:25:23,520 --> 00:25:25,480 Speaker 1: De gall was right on just about all of it 415 00:25:25,840 --> 00:25:29,920 Speaker 1: except one thing. I believe Americans do want to find out. 416 00:25:30,480 --> 00:25:32,720 Speaker 1: We do want to know what happened, and on the 417 00:25:32,800 --> 00:25:35,040 Speaker 1: next episode we're going to tell you. 418 00:25:40,160 --> 00:25:44,840 Speaker 2: Next episode, Rob and Dick finally answer the question who 419 00:25:44,960 --> 00:25:49,240 Speaker 2: killed JFK. I see the hallmarks or the markers of 420 00:25:49,400 --> 00:25:54,120 Speaker 2: this potentially being a CIA operation that rogues would have conducted. 421 00:25:54,600 --> 00:25:58,080 Speaker 1: This was the top secret facility. He was there all 422 00:25:58,200 --> 00:26:01,600 Speaker 1: during that fateful weekend. RVO was a damn thing in 423 00:26:01,680 --> 00:26:02,760 Speaker 1: the world. But a dicoy. 424 00:26:05,600 --> 00:26:08,960 Speaker 2: Who Killed JFK? Is hosted by Rob Reiner and me 425 00:26:09,320 --> 00:26:13,800 Speaker 2: Solidad O'Brien and our executive producers are Rob Reiner, Michelle Reiner, 426 00:26:14,000 --> 00:26:18,560 Speaker 2: Matt George Jason English, David Hoffman and Me Solidad O'Brien. 427 00:26:19,200 --> 00:26:22,800 Speaker 2: Our writer is David Hoffman, with research by Dick Russell. 428 00:26:23,240 --> 00:26:27,280 Speaker 2: Our story editors are Rob Reiner and Julie Pineto. Our 429 00:26:27,359 --> 00:26:32,320 Speaker 2: senior producer is Julie Pinneto. Our producers are Tristan Nash, 430 00:26:32,600 --> 00:26:37,439 Speaker 2: Dick Russell, Michelle Goldfein, and Amari Lee. Our editors are 431 00:26:37,520 --> 00:26:41,880 Speaker 2: Tristan Nash, Julie Pinneo, and Marcus de Laudro. Our project 432 00:26:41,960 --> 00:26:48,200 Speaker 2: manager is Carol Klein. Our associate producer is emilse Kiros. Mixing, 433 00:26:48,440 --> 00:26:52,399 Speaker 2: mastering and sound design by Ben la Julier. Research and 434 00:26:52,520 --> 00:26:57,600 Speaker 2: fact checking by Girl Friday and emilse Kiros. Archival audio 435 00:26:57,840 --> 00:27:01,080 Speaker 2: in this episode thanks to Dick Russell and Rob Reiner. 436 00:27:01,560 --> 00:27:05,840 Speaker 2: Business affairs by Hennan Narea and Jonathan Fermit. Our consulting 437 00:27:05,920 --> 00:27:10,520 Speaker 2: producer is Razanne Galliini. Recorded in part at CDM Studio 438 00:27:10,720 --> 00:27:15,520 Speaker 2: and Fourth Street Recording Studio. Show logo by Lucy Quintanilla. 439 00:27:16,040 --> 00:27:20,000 Speaker 2: Special thanks to Johenig Rose Arsay and Dan Storper. If 440 00:27:20,040 --> 00:27:22,639 Speaker 2: you're enjoying the show, leave us a rating and review 441 00:27:22,840 --> 00:27:26,600 Speaker 2: on your favorite podcast platform. Who Killed JFK as a 442 00:27:26,640 --> 00:27:30,280 Speaker 2: production of Solidad O'Brien productions and iHeart podcasts.