Speaker 1: And That's what You Really Missed with Jenna.
Speaker 2: And Kevin An iHeartRadio podcast.
Speaker 3: Welcome to You and That's what You Really miss podcast.
Speaker 3: We've got a wonderful fan from Ireland who stayed up
Speaker 3: late to chat with us, Connor. Connor Burke is here.
Speaker 3: Connor Burke is also in the arts, is an actor
Speaker 3: and playwright and has a podcast, Glee Cat, that he
Speaker 3: started during the pandemic where he was going back and
Speaker 3: watching Glee having thoughtful conversations because he is a thoughtful lad.
Speaker 2: And he also co hosts Gleek of the Week with
Speaker 2: Andrew a lot.
Speaker 4: You can tell he's a really good interviewer. Really, he
Speaker 4: kind of flipped the script on us, which we didn't mind.
Speaker 2: But also from Ireland, he's also so good.
Speaker 4: He's also so, he's got a lot of soul, he's thoughtful,
Speaker 4: he's kind.
Speaker 1: I love this conversation.
Speaker 2: I could have spoken to him for hours. He really
Speaker 2: is the Irish opera. People are saying it, everyone's saying it.
Speaker 1: Saying it. Well, here's Connor.
Speaker 5: Oh hello, hello, hello, hello, Hello. It's so good to
Speaker 5: see you both.
Speaker 2: Oh my god, thanks for saying up late for us.
Speaker 5: Oh this could have been four am.
Speaker 1: And let's be real, what time is it there?
Speaker 5: It is ten?
Speaker 1: Here is I'm already in bed at that point.
Speaker 5: This is not late.
Speaker 1: I don't see ten o'clock.
Speaker 5: Guys, I can tell you you were both glowing. Whenever
Speaker 5: I see clips on social media, I'm like that skin
Speaker 5: dot la vibe is it's really hitting filter.
Speaker 2: I'm sitting in the window to get as much light exactly.
Speaker 1: I feel direct sunlight on my face. You're so kind.
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for joining us.
Speaker 5: Thank you so much for having me. It has been
Speaker 5: the best crack ever. Listening to this podcast.
Speaker 1: I feel like, thank you.
Speaker 5: It has just been so beautiful. I have not personally,
Speaker 5: I've not watched Glee in a while. Obviously, I've dipped
Speaker 5: in and out, So like, rewatching with you guys is
Speaker 5: such an experience. It's so wonderful and it's it's been
Speaker 5: like the best time, you know, kind of like I
Speaker 5: don't know, both of you kind of taking back the
Speaker 5: narrative and like your experience is so like I feel
Speaker 5: like more people need that, you know what I mean?
Speaker 1: Mm, thank you so appreciate that.
Speaker 2: I mean, and you sort of started this whole podcast business.
Speaker 1: I mean, you are solely responsible.
Speaker 5: This is all your fault.
Speaker 1: This is you.
Speaker 5: Yeah, I'm like Joe Rogan, who hello.
Speaker 2: You invented?
Speaker 5: Basically yeah, basically that's Spotify deal is coming real quick,
Speaker 5: I am. Yeah. I set up a podcast called Glee
Speaker 5: Cap in the midst of Lockdown in I believe it
Speaker 5: was maybe April or May, and I had previously done
Speaker 5: some like voice work in Ireland and stuff like that,
Speaker 5: and I had this microphone sitting in front of me
Speaker 5: and I literally woke up one morning and I was like,
Speaker 5: I need to make a podcast about Glee.
Speaker 4: Like it was.
Speaker 5: It was like a rock had just a religious experience.
Speaker 5: It was crazy and basically yeah, And by the by
Speaker 5: the next day I had the first episode uploaded and
Speaker 5: for the next however long, there was a different guest
Speaker 5: basically every other week. People were all like Irish British
Speaker 5: theater people, creatives, so fat, people who had never seen Glee,
Speaker 5: people who were obsessed with it, and it was a
Speaker 5: different dynamic every week. Then as a result, yeah, and
Speaker 5: it was just it was the thing that kept me
Speaker 5: going through lockdown. I was I didn't go insane. It
Speaker 5: was so much work, but like such a joy. And
Speaker 5: now in twenty twenty four, I'm still talking about it,
Speaker 5: and I think I will, like if I live into
Speaker 5: my nineties, Like I'm still going to be talking about
Speaker 5: the show like to god, like it's insane.
Speaker 2: How did you find the show originally? How did it
Speaker 2: come to you?
Speaker 1: Glee?
Speaker 5: The thing about Glee was like Glee started in obviously,
Speaker 5: it first started in two thousand and nine, and so
Speaker 5: I was fourteen and it ended when I was twenty
Speaker 5: and so I feel like what people often miss from
Speaker 5: like the narrative when they talk about the show is
Speaker 5: that in those years, like you were obviously experiencing like
Speaker 5: crazy things, like you're growing up, you're figuring out who
Speaker 5: you were, You're friends with this person, but then you're
Speaker 5: friends with that person, You're like, what am I doing
Speaker 5: with my life? For me, the one constant in those
Speaker 5: six years was a TV show. And I feel like
Speaker 5: when you see conversations around fandom, you're just like, oh,
Speaker 5: they really like this person because they can really sing.
Speaker 5: But it's like it's actually more than that. It's kind
Speaker 5: of like what they represent and what the product in
Speaker 5: this case, the TV show represents for you. Right, So yeah,
Speaker 5: I mean I was fourteen years old, I was in
Speaker 5: an all boys' school in Ireland. I was like obsessed
Speaker 5: with musical theater, even though I cannot sing or do ance.
Speaker 5: That is my boss always loved it. And then of
Speaker 5: course this show comes along and it's like it's Taylor Made.
Speaker 5: It's like someone reached into my brainah and was like this,
Speaker 5: this is what you need. So there's kind of like
Speaker 5: a deep emotionality to it that I feel like maybe
Speaker 5: a lot of people don't really understand. I know, Like
Speaker 5: that's a question I had for you guys. Do you
Speaker 5: guys obviously now living through like this podcast and recopying
Speaker 5: the episode, like do you ever think you will both
Speaker 5: get to a point in your life where you're like,
Speaker 5: I understand how big of a deal this is? Or
Speaker 5: do you still struggle to comprehend it even though it's
Speaker 5: been a time since the show.
Speaker 2: And I feel like I comprehended. I feel like I
Speaker 2: do comprehend it, I think as well as I can.
Speaker 2: This podcast has absolutely helped, Like talking to people like
Speaker 2: you and learning about those perspectives has sort of filled
Speaker 2: out a bigger picture where I think in terms of
Speaker 2: if I travel anywhere. For example, I was in Houston
Speaker 2: Texas a couple of weeks ago, and was getting recognized
Speaker 2: everywhere I went in La like that doesn't happen very often,
Speaker 2: And all those things add up to like a greater
Speaker 2: picture of Oh, this show has been off the air
Speaker 2: for a long time, But I think you just described
Speaker 2: it beautifully because I have this I feel this way
Speaker 2: about certain shows or movies. But when people attach certain
Speaker 2: parts of their life to that show, to that experience,
Speaker 2: then that creates sort of the phenomenon of what it was.
Speaker 2: Because yes, like we were on cracker Boxes and you're
Speaker 2: on tour, but a real lasting impact exactly how you
Speaker 2: just described can only be felt after time has gone by,
Speaker 2: and I think through this experience like we're doing right now,
Speaker 2: it has created a much deeper understanding of the impact
Speaker 2: it has had, and especially while we were doing it,
Speaker 2: was very hard to detect or to feel right sure.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I feel like there's another there's a level of
Speaker 4: understanding and comprehension that we can kind of grasp from
Speaker 4: a viewers point of view. It's like Gray's Anatomy. For me,
Speaker 4: when that first came out, I felt like it was
Speaker 4: the an Asian character that just played herself, like I
Speaker 4: felt like there were characters I could relate to their
Speaker 4: storylines that I loved, Like there was just a lot
Speaker 4: of things about it that I hear echoed in Glee fans.
Speaker 4: But like the understanding of like the impact it had
Speaker 4: globally at such a big level, Well, it's still hard
Speaker 4: to understand that, like we were a part of that,
Speaker 4: I think. So I'm not sure if we'll ever you know,
Speaker 4: I think we'll understand it to a point, but yeah.
Speaker 5: Absolutely, because I feel like I remember so distinctly when
Speaker 5: I was fourteen or fifteen years old sitting watching Glee
Speaker 5: with my parents, who and obviously I was a gay teenager.
Speaker 5: I had known that since I was like a ten
Speaker 5: or eleven, and there was a scene happening on screen
Speaker 5: that was centered around Kurt. I can't remember what it was,
Speaker 5: and I remember so distinctly staring at my parents in
Speaker 5: my peripheral vision to try and read the reaction. Yeah,
Speaker 5: you know, that was my That was my first introduction.
Speaker 5: Like I had no idea what to do in that situation,
Speaker 5: like I was a child, and so to see this
Speaker 5: played out on screen was so powerful and it's so
Speaker 5: so beautiful and something that I see a lot like
Speaker 5: on social media around the show. It's I don't see
Speaker 5: like a lot of story like that discussed kind of enough.
Speaker 5: I'm I kind of approached Glee from a more emotional standpoint,
Speaker 5: and obviously I laugh at all the memes and stuff too,
Speaker 5: and all the great stuff that have come out. But yeah,
Speaker 5: that that's that's like a really important thing. Yeah, definitely, Yeah,
Speaker 5: So yeah, like what a beautiful thing.
Speaker 1: What about Damien coming on the show? What would.
Speaker 5: Oh my god, I was so glad to get that
Speaker 5: Irish repon. I don't know, I obviously know he was
Speaker 5: on your pod, like yeah, a couple of months or whatever.
Speaker 5: I can't remember. Did you guys ask him about that?
Speaker 5: I can't remember what his whole thing is. I think
Speaker 5: he just thinks it's hilarious.
Speaker 1: Really yeah, yeah, he took it in stride.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 2: I also think it was out of all the places,
Speaker 2: like I love that somebody from Ireland and the show.
Speaker 4: I know, I loved, we loved him so much.
Speaker 5: So yeah, I was such a gorgeous singing voice as well.
Speaker 5: I remember there was one there was one season it
Speaker 5: must have been season was obviously season three, and he
Speaker 5: came home to Ireland for Christmas and there is a
Speaker 5: very famous talk show in Ireland called The Late Late Show.
Speaker 5: It's like it's actually the longest running talk show in
Speaker 5: the world. And he was honest and it was like
Speaker 5: the Beatles, like people were going like you and of
Speaker 5: course you guys obviously don't see it from that perspective,
Speaker 5: but people were like, I remember going to the tour
Speaker 5: in Dublin.
Speaker 1: Oh my god, guys, Oh my gosh.
Speaker 5: You go to I went to the very last one.
Speaker 4: Okay, that was that was pretty crazy.
Speaker 2: Oh my god, you were there.
Speaker 1: Our energy was wild.
Speaker 5: Is it true what they say about Irish Crewds because
Speaker 5: all these musicians are always like Irish Crewds are brilliant,
Speaker 5: But then you always think, oh are they just saying
Speaker 5: that just to appease let's are we good?
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2: Well the thing about that venue was weird. They weren't
Speaker 2: allowing people to stand up.
Speaker 4: So the first show we did it was an afternoon
Speaker 4: matinee and nobody's standing and we're.
Speaker 1: Like, did they hate us, Like what's going on?
Speaker 4: And we were did They wouldn't stand never, So we
Speaker 4: had to ask them. We had to ask them to
Speaker 4: allow people to stand because we were like this will
Speaker 4: be a nightmare of show, run of shows if people
Speaker 4: can't stand up and like dance.
Speaker 2: But we just started instructing people like we're on stage,
Speaker 2: what we're going to do.
Speaker 5: I remember, Kevin, did you come out? Am I just
Speaker 5: imagining this? Did you comment in a tri color and
Speaker 5: you were singing, ohky boy? Yeah?
Speaker 2: I did.
Speaker 5: Yes, I'm glad I would erupted somebody.
Speaker 1: I remember that, Keaven.
Speaker 2: I know, I'm like, I have somebody to verify that
Speaker 2: it wasn't money.
Speaker 1: You remember that?
Speaker 5: Oh my god, one of the best nights of my life.
Speaker 5: My sister and her then boyfriend now husband brought me.
Speaker 5: It was the three of us. I think I heard
Speaker 5: you talk about this Jenna recently, Like the crowd was
Speaker 5: It's the most I've credit ever seen at a concert
Speaker 5: to this day. Yeah, Like there was literally like an
Speaker 5: eight year old woman there having the time, Like it
Speaker 5: was amazing.
Speaker 4: Damn.
Speaker 5: How did that?
Speaker 4: Like?
Speaker 1: Did you?
Speaker 4: Guys?
Speaker 5: That must have been such a relief for you that
Speaker 5: particular night, because I'm sure you had the best crack ever,
Speaker 5: but also you must have been exhausted and been like,
Speaker 5: let me go, Like it must have been such a
Speaker 5: weird conflict you know what I mean, it was.
Speaker 2: It was one of those things where I think every
Speaker 2: a lot of people were like just very tired, done
Speaker 2: over it, like we I mean that was in July.
Speaker 5: Was that in July?
Speaker 2: Yeah, we started shooting a year before or maybe it
Speaker 2: was June. I don't know. Like we had been working
Speaker 2: almost for twelve months straight, and so by the time
Speaker 2: we got to Dublin, we had just lost our minds. Yeah,
Speaker 2: and so like there were yeah, like you said, there
Speaker 2: was a part of like my dad has always wanted
Speaker 2: to go to Ireland. I could be on stage and
Speaker 2: sing oh Danny Boy with the crowd like the greatest
Speaker 2: experience ever. And then also then everyone just wanted to
Speaker 2: be done. But then during that last last show, I
Speaker 2: remember looking back and like people were just crying because
Speaker 2: it was also are we going to be able to
Speaker 2: ever do this again? Is this ever going to happen?
Speaker 2: So it is a huge conflict of we're grateful, we're tired,
Speaker 2: we love each other, we love doing this, all those
Speaker 2: things all at once, and everything came out sort of
Speaker 2: in that last show. And I love that you were
Speaker 2: there to see Yeah, oh.
Speaker 5: My god, I amazing, like literally one of the best
Speaker 5: days of my life, like I swear in my life.
Speaker 5: But you know what's so interesting when you guys always
Speaker 5: talk about the schedule and stuff like that, even when
Speaker 5: you're filming, the thing with me is and I know
Speaker 5: I will. I have never had this experience. I can
Speaker 5: talk away to like a radiator and have a full
Speaker 5: blown conversation for seven hours, but like, I am an
Speaker 5: introvert and I need time to decompress. So when you
Speaker 5: guys talk about those long hours, I'm just like, it's
Speaker 5: one thing, like the physical exhaustion, But like what I got, like,
Speaker 5: was there every time where you could just go away
Speaker 5: into the corner of like the choir room or somewhere
Speaker 5: off set and just be like, I need to lie
Speaker 5: down for twenty minutes, please don't speak.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, that happened more often than not.
Speaker 4: Yeah, there were times where like you'd be totally in
Speaker 4: the mix, you'd be laughing, you'd be hanging with everybody,
Speaker 4: and like two or three people would be off kind
Speaker 4: of doing their own thing. And then there would be
Speaker 4: times where like I'd go off and kind of sit
Speaker 4: and all the sets are pretty much close in you know,
Speaker 4: close proximity to each other, so like even shoes. Apartment
Speaker 4: was like a standing set, and so we would go
Speaker 4: and like lay in his bed because there was a
Speaker 4: real bed, so like you'd just go lay there and
Speaker 4: people would be like, just tell me where you're going
Speaker 4: next time, so I know where you are when you
Speaker 4: have to go to set. But yeah, there were definite
Speaker 4: I think everybody had a little bit of that recharge
Speaker 4: button that had to like go away for a second.
Speaker 4: And especially in those first three seasons when it was
Speaker 4: just so monstrous, we would all just we were like
Speaker 4: professional naptakers. We'd all knock out like so fast and
Speaker 4: for like twenty minutes. It would just be like the
Speaker 4: most important sleep of our day.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I would say the first season, so we were
Speaker 2: like hanging out more like we'd be playing games. And
Speaker 2: then as the show started to go on, we're like
Speaker 2: we learned to preserve. Yeah, we need to take some time. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: just like sit in silence for a little bit.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 1: How has it been doing your podcast? Still?
Speaker 5: It's been a joy. You know. I've had friends of mine,
Speaker 5: you know, for example, one of my friends, Lizzie, a
Speaker 5: year or two ago, played Tracy Turnblood in the West
Speaker 5: End production of Hers by the revival of that show,
Speaker 5: and she came on and she would talk about how
Speaker 5: like she was like I do musical theater because of Gray.
Speaker 5: So there'd be a story like that, or there'd be
Speaker 5: a story about you know, my friend Emma who when
Speaker 5: she was thirteen decided her favorite character on Glee was
Speaker 5: Emma Pill's breathe and decided to run out and die
Speaker 5: her hair ginger. I was like, I believe, yeah, so
Speaker 5: it's been beautiful. And what happened was I recapped the
Speaker 5: first four seasons and I had the time of my life.
Speaker 5: And then I went to drama school in London and
Speaker 5: obviously those hours are manic, and so I took a breather.
Speaker 5: And then relatively recently, I have been guessing very regularly
Speaker 5: on Gleek of the Week, which we all know, and
Speaker 5: it has just been this. It sounds so strange to
Speaker 5: say it has been such a joy, Like the amount
Speaker 5: of work that Andrew puts into that podcast. Believe it's
Speaker 5: a full time job. On top of his full time job,
Speaker 5: you still have these people who are so invest like,
Speaker 5: you know, we're getting dms being like I can't believe
Speaker 5: you voted that song out like that, and it's been glorious.
Speaker 5: And Andrew and I got to interview Lauren Party. Yes,
Speaker 5: that was just wonderful for many reasons. Obviously because we
Speaker 5: love her, Yes, Secondly, she just spoke so eloquently about
Speaker 5: her experience and why her life was fundamentally changed by
Speaker 5: the show. And thirdly, like quite frankly, it was an
Speaker 5: emotional experience for Andrew and I, Like, you know, it's
Speaker 5: kind of uncomfortable to say, as I imagine it's uncomfortable
Speaker 5: to hear. But there's a lot of cast members yourselves included,
Speaker 5: that mean a lot to us for a variety of reasons.
Speaker 5: And so we're kind of sitting there like, oh my god,
Speaker 5: like this is more to fine, but it's also kind
Speaker 5: of camp, you know, it's fun. But yeah, it's been
Speaker 5: a joy and and the podcast inside of it has
Speaker 5: been great. I's like, I can I can name like
Speaker 5: six clee podcasts, Like, yeah, I have got my own
Speaker 5: theories as to why people are still talking about this show.
Speaker 1: Tell us do.
Speaker 5: You know what's so funny? Actually? And this is strange,
Speaker 5: Like I was on YouTube maybe a month or two ago,
Speaker 5: and they always say that no one knows, like no
Speaker 5: one knows you like your homepage on YouTube, and the
Speaker 5: recommended video was Glee cast version of Scream, and I
Speaker 5: had not seen it in so long, and I clicked
Speaker 5: on it and I watched it, and I was like okay,
Speaker 5: and then I was like, this is just like this
Speaker 5: is just fantastic, Like the fact that that musical performance, right,
Speaker 5: a random musical performance knee deep into the middle of
Speaker 5: season three, in an episode with eight or nine musical
Speaker 5: performances was filmed, and obviously Havin yourself and Harry are
Speaker 5: amazing in it, but like the cinematography, and like, I
Speaker 5: was like, this is just people are always talking about
Speaker 5: I think Glee. People still talk about Glee because of
Speaker 5: this and this and that. It's like, well, people still
Speaker 5: talk about Glee because Glee was so good, like it was.
Speaker 5: I don't. I don't think there's ever been anything on
Speaker 5: TV since that comes close with There's been amazing stuff
Speaker 5: that have been highly influenced by it, like the rise
Speaker 5: of movie musicals and stuff like that. Yeah, but I
Speaker 5: don't there's not a there's not been a show that
Speaker 5: kind of incorporates music as well. In my opinion, the talent,
Speaker 5: like I think Robert Ulrich and his team if they
Speaker 5: ever won any awards, they deserve every award because, like,
Speaker 5: you all just played your part so well, and like
Speaker 5: I'm talking about from like from Leah and Corey all
Speaker 5: the way down to like Josh Sussman, like it was
Speaker 5: in everything, Like you all just played the part so
Speaker 5: like you did the work. Sometimes I was like, how
Speaker 5: do you guys get a script and then read this
Speaker 5: ridiculous scenario and then go from that to like what
Speaker 5: we see on screen? Mm hmmm, because quite often as
Speaker 5: an actor, and I can only speak in my experience,
Speaker 5: like quite often it's more difficult to get one or
Speaker 5: two lines of dialogue and like make at work than
Speaker 5: actually have like a juicy scene to like for.
Speaker 4: Yeah, totally, those were the hardest. Was like sitting in
Speaker 4: a choir room with twelve fourteen people and you have
Speaker 4: one line that comes in the middle of all that conversation.
Speaker 1: You're like, what is that line again?
Speaker 4: Because there's just nothing to connect it too, so you're like,
Speaker 4: don't forget it, or like I just and then and
Speaker 4: then you mess it up and you're like, what's my line?
Speaker 4: You're like the one the actor in the room. When
Speaker 4: you have one line you can.
Speaker 2: Yeah, Chris has a full monologue and three weeks yeah, yeah.
Speaker 5: Stop, yeah, I always about about mister Shoe. I was
Speaker 5: like I in some ways, I'm like I really really
Speaker 5: kind of felt bad for Matthew Morrison because I'm like,
Speaker 5: he always had the opening, Hey, we're going to do
Speaker 5: yeah so much.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 5: Yeah, And like obviously Naya and Uh and Jane Lynch
Speaker 5: with those monologues like that.
Speaker 1: Is just yeah, they were both so good at it.
Speaker 2: But I could also just memorize it.
Speaker 1: She's look at it and really remember did she do.
Speaker 5: You guys like did she have a photographic memory? Like
Speaker 5: would you be surprised?
Speaker 2: Yeah, yes, I saw her too many times do not
Speaker 2: look at the scene until the morning of and she
Speaker 2: would have a full page of you know, like rambling
Speaker 2: nonsense that does makes no sense. Yeah, because you know,
Speaker 2: like if you would have drama school, if you have
Speaker 2: a monologue and it's like a train of thought and
Speaker 2: it's written really well, you could follow that. Then it's
Speaker 2: much easier to memorize because it's a natural train of thought.
Speaker 2: When Ian is writing those like Sue in Santana monologue,
Speaker 2: it's almost Yeah, it's like joke after joke after joke
Speaker 2: after joke and with you know, like snarkiness. So not
Speaker 2: only are they able to memorize it, they're also like
Speaker 2: acting it properly. And so I would go into the
Speaker 2: hair and makeup trailer with her like sides for the day,
Speaker 2: read it over maybe once or twice, and then have
Speaker 2: it and that and I I would I remember like
Speaker 2: like yelling at her. I'm like, that is insane, howe.
Speaker 5: Why why?
Speaker 1: Absolutely rious?
Speaker 5: But do you know what as well, what I what
Speaker 5: I will say is obviously this show and I will
Speaker 5: die in this hill is one of the funniest TV
Speaker 5: shows of the past, like thirty years. It is so
Speaker 5: so witty and I literally sometimes I feel like screaming
Speaker 5: at my friends that don't watch it. I'm like, you
Speaker 5: need your ass down the show. But another thing that
Speaker 5: is so impressive about it the way all of you
Speaker 5: would like inflect your lines. And Kevin just reminded me
Speaker 5: there of when you were talking about Naya. It was
Speaker 5: it was not only what was written on the page,
Speaker 5: it was the way your voice would like inflect the lines.
Speaker 5: Did you guys just kind of was that all instinct
Speaker 5: or like just say, if you had a one liner
Speaker 5: that was really funny where you often stopped and was
Speaker 5: it like a case of Jenna, please don't say it
Speaker 5: like this, Can you like say it like that? Or
Speaker 5: was that very much up to you?
Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't think that ever happened.
Speaker 4: Really, there was no I don't think anybody got coached
Speaker 4: on their timing or delivery. I think after there was
Speaker 4: like a tone that was really set in the pilot,
Speaker 4: and the speed at which we spoke was very much
Speaker 4: faster than a lot of other shows, and the way
Speaker 4: that you delivered lines was very much a style that
Speaker 4: was kind of created for us by all of us
Speaker 4: I think together. I mean as a lot of the
Speaker 4: people in the pilot who spoke a lot, I think did.
Speaker 4: But yeah, no, very I don't think we ever got
Speaker 4: delivery notes or anything like that. It was just that
Speaker 4: they trusted us to know our characters and how we
Speaker 4: would want to say it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, if we got notes, it would be about like
Speaker 2: maybe timing or pacing.
Speaker 4: Yeah, or you said this word wrong or whatever. But
Speaker 4: the writing was so excellent that like you didn't really
Speaker 4: have to do much work, like if you just said it,
Speaker 4: like you let it do the work on its own.
Speaker 4: And so I think That's also partially where that that
Speaker 4: tone came from, was the writing was so consistent and
Speaker 4: the jokes were so consistent in that way.
Speaker 5: Sure, because it must have been a bizarre experience, or
Speaker 5: maybe it wasn't. Like okay, if I think about it right,
Speaker 5: one episode, it's Quinn getting into a car crush, it's
Speaker 5: all of the Krofsky stuff. It's Finn and Rachel getting married.
Speaker 5: The next episode is not Bomer. The next episode it's
Speaker 5: a tribute to Saturday night favorite. The next episode it's Whitney.
Speaker 1: Like, Yes, were you like, would you like open.
Speaker 5: Oh, oh look we're gonna perform a man umbrella with
Speaker 5: Were you like reading this being like this is insane?
Speaker 5: Or were you like, this is the most normal thing.
Speaker 5: Like six episodes in felt kind of normalmal.
Speaker 2: Completely normal, because when you.
Speaker 1: Say it like that, yeah, you're like what.
Speaker 2: But we never saw it like that because we were
Speaker 2: usually like filming one episode and then you get the
Speaker 2: script for the next episode in the last few days
Speaker 2: of that current episode, and you're just sort of.
Speaker 1: What are we doing next? Tell us where to go?
Speaker 2: You're just looking at anything, We're looking at the story.
Speaker 2: And so I think, like when you see what the
Speaker 2: episodes are now as a completion, you're like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 2: that's right, same night Fever and Whitney and like what
Speaker 2: it's crazy, none of those.
Speaker 5: Like how do you do that?
Speaker 2: Back to back to Matt Boemer, I think we were
Speaker 2: just in it, so you're just showing up to work
Speaker 2: like you're just on the hamster wheel.
Speaker 4: That's why I think like Matt Bohmer was such a
Speaker 4: shock to us when we watched it this time, or
Speaker 4: at least for me, because he was so underrated in
Speaker 4: my mind of that episode, because I think we were
Speaker 4: just moving so fast that when we rewatched it, I
Speaker 4: was like, how did I miss this?
Speaker 2: How did I Martin? It was like some of those
Speaker 2: people were in and out of there so quickly, so fast. Yeah,
Speaker 2: that we just had no concept of what was actually
Speaker 2: happening around to.
Speaker 5: Sure, you were part of a massive machine essentially, and
Speaker 5: I'm sure it felt that way on tour as well,
Speaker 5: like you're going to all of these great places, but
Speaker 5: like did you necessarily have the time to like relax,
Speaker 5: unwind and like no explore you know, I.
Speaker 4: Have to interviewer by the way, Yeah, you're very good
Speaker 4: at that. You're very like are we on your podcast?
Speaker 4: Are you on ours?
Speaker 5: Because do you know what I feel like, Oprah Winfrey
Speaker 5: right now? Were you silent or were you silent? I've
Speaker 5: been waiting for this since two thousand and nine, as
Speaker 5: these are.
Speaker 2: Excellent questions, very good questions. It feels like therapy. This
Speaker 2: is great.
Speaker 4: Kevin and I actually were pretty good on tour, even
Speaker 4: though I was losing my mind and my head was
Speaker 4: half off.
Speaker 1: Like, we did explore quite a bit.
Speaker 4: The two of us would like go out during the
Speaker 4: day with a security guard and try.
Speaker 1: And go see things and try the food or whatever.
Speaker 4: Like in Philadelphia we want to get like Philly steaks
Speaker 4: at the Samous place. Like it was just like we
Speaker 4: tried as much as we could to like make this
Speaker 4: a normal experience for ourselves.
Speaker 2: We didn't sometimes we were moving too quickly. When we
Speaker 2: got to Dublin, we had a full day to which
Speaker 2: was like a luxury temple Street was so much. Yeah,
Speaker 2: so we get to run around and actually.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we went to dinner. It was really fun. Yeah.
Speaker 5: Yeah, people were insane back in those days, like the
Speaker 5: Sons are are absolutely amazing, but so I just can't
Speaker 5: rock around that concept. Has your relationship with This sounds
Speaker 5: like I'm peers mooredan has your relationship with like Anderson
Speaker 5: Cooper and seeing in exclusive, but has it like has
Speaker 5: your relationship with the quote unquote fame slash being well
Speaker 5: known recognized? Like how does that sit with you now?
Speaker 5: Like are you comfortable with it? Is it kind of annoying?
Speaker 5: Is it?
Speaker 4: Like? Well, I don't feel like I'm famous anymore? So,
Speaker 4: Like I kind of feel like at the time, we
Speaker 4: were so young and we were we were Oh thank you.
Speaker 4: We were living in this like crazy hot bubble that
Speaker 4: like was just on fire the whole time, and we
Speaker 4: were just riding it like it's like a wave. I
Speaker 4: don't know, that's a really weird analogy, but.
Speaker 1: I feel like we were in it.
Speaker 4: We were in it together, so like it wasn't just
Speaker 4: one person. It wasn't like Jennifer Lawrence coming up in
Speaker 4: her career and being all by herself in this like moment,
Speaker 4: Like we were all together in it. It was happening
Speaker 4: to all of us at once, and it was very
Speaker 4: strange at the time, and I'm sure we all have
Speaker 4: our own stories about how it shaped us and affected
Speaker 4: our lives and affected our lives now even but I
Speaker 4: think now I look back on it, like, wow, what
Speaker 4: a cool, weird thing, Like fame isn't fame isn't the
Speaker 4: thing that's that's important? Like it sure, and like it
Speaker 4: was a really it did a lot for us, Like
Speaker 4: it opened a lot of doors and it's why we're
Speaker 4: able to be in the positions we're in still but
Speaker 4: like in our careers. And so I feel like, but
Speaker 4: I look back on it with that moment of like, oh, right,
Speaker 4: that was It is fleeting and it's not real and
Speaker 4: it's kind of strange, and you know, you learn lessons
Speaker 4: from it.
Speaker 2: I don't know who it was, Jenna, but you probably
Speaker 2: were there for this conversation somebody who I don't know
Speaker 2: who it was, but was very famous at the time
Speaker 2: and we were just starting and they're like, fame is
Speaker 2: not real, famous, fake, None of these people know you.
Speaker 2: They and it's really great to be admired by these
Speaker 2: people because you're a part of something that's touching a
Speaker 2: lot of lives. But if you use that or hold
Speaker 2: on to that in any sort of serious way to
Speaker 2: make yourself feel important or give your life meaning, you
Speaker 2: are going to be left because it is not a
Speaker 2: real thing, right, and like just and like once the
Speaker 2: show is done, then that fame changes, it evolves or
Speaker 2: moves away, and so I think sort of keeping that
Speaker 2: in the back of my mind the whole time. Yeah,
Speaker 2: was and like also adjusting to your relationship to fans,
Speaker 2: I think.
Speaker 1: In terms of when.
Speaker 2: You're out in public, how you interact with people, how
Speaker 2: they interact with you. Also on tour was a really
Speaker 2: interesting experience because state to state, country to country, fans
Speaker 2: interact differently, very differently, because it's a cultural thing. And
Speaker 2: so I think, like now my relationship to it is
Speaker 2: very different because maybe because I've gone through all of that,
Speaker 2: but like now I have no problem with it, easy,
Speaker 2: happy when people come say hi, you know what whatever.
Speaker 2: Back then it was because it was I think so
Speaker 2: frequent and so sometimes aggressive that you have the adverse
Speaker 2: reaction and you want to just sort of shrink into
Speaker 2: yourself and like that's it.
Speaker 4: Kevin, I think it was like a little bit scary,
Speaker 4: Like we were a little bit threatened at the time,
Speaker 4: not by the fans themselves, but just by like your
Speaker 4: own personal space being kind of.
Speaker 1: Eliminated.
Speaker 4: So there's this like level of like am I am
Speaker 4: I safe in this moment right, like, because I'm still
Speaker 4: a person, Like it's like anybody coming into your personal
Speaker 4: space and asking you for something that is very unfamiliar.
Speaker 4: But these days, I think with social media and the
Speaker 4: way we choose to put out our lives and the
Speaker 4: way that we're connecting with fans and even with this podcast,
Speaker 4: it's like I equate them with like two different things.
Speaker 4: Like I equate our fans as a very different thing
Speaker 4: than fame. Yeah, Like I fame to me is like
Speaker 4: this fake thing that's like, Yeah, the media builds you up.
Speaker 1: People kind of know who you are. They think they
Speaker 1: know who you are.
Speaker 4: You get this like rise and you know, ego and
Speaker 4: moments of like wow, people want want to be you,
Speaker 4: They want to be a part of you, they want
Speaker 4: to know it. Whereas the fans were like the we
Speaker 4: would be nowhere without our fans and without this show,
Speaker 4: Like people like you who were you were deeply impacted
Speaker 4: in an emotional way, like I've been deeply impacted by
Speaker 4: another show. Like so I see them as two completely
Speaker 4: separate things. Just to be clear, But yeah, I think
Speaker 4: it's a it's really weird.
Speaker 5: Yeah, And I think that's what both of you just said.
Speaker 5: There is so beautiful because I think from obviously I'm
Speaker 5: only one person, like I'm not speaking for all of
Speaker 5: the fans, but I think what are what are so
Speaker 5: beautiful about podcasts like this, particularly this one, is that
Speaker 5: the way you two just spoke. I think when you're
Speaker 5: a fan and you're a lifelong follower of people, you
Speaker 5: can really sense that kind of authenticity, if you know
Speaker 5: what I mean. Like your first two episodes on this
Speaker 5: podcast with Ryan Murphy was like I'm going to go
Speaker 5: on a limb here and say this two of the
Speaker 5: best podcast episodes I've to ever about anything, because it
Speaker 5: was just so like, let's just talk about this, like
Speaker 5: three human beings that love and respect and admire people
Speaker 5: and admire each other and like just have a chat
Speaker 5: like there's and you can tell that when you're listening,
Speaker 5: do you know what I mean? Like, if you've got
Speaker 5: any semblance of emotional intelligence, you can kind of tell that.
Speaker 5: And that's why this has just been so beautiful, Like
Speaker 5: it's very there's something really like moving about that, do
Speaker 5: you know what I mean? And you guys kind of
Speaker 5: come into that realization as you've gone through. Is there
Speaker 5: anything that surprised you about the show, Yeah so much.
Speaker 2: Let me season three. Yeah, And I know we've said
Speaker 2: it before, but what's my favorite part, honestly is like
Speaker 2: getting like the interactions from people who listen and being
Speaker 2: like this in season three or look out for this
Speaker 2: in season two. That's been surprising because a lot of
Speaker 2: time very different than our memories, and so having a
Speaker 2: direct connection to people in that way, like if we
Speaker 2: were on a show now and you could almost have
Speaker 2: that instant connection to see how you know, an episode
Speaker 2: affects people, but people even on Twitter back then it
Speaker 2: was different. There's a different language, slower, yeah, And so
Speaker 2: being able to hear people's favorites and what moves people,
Speaker 2: and like hearing your story about like sitting next to
Speaker 2: your parents during a Kurt like coming out scene, all
Speaker 2: of that is surprising in like a really wonderful way,
Speaker 2: because like that is something very meaningful and obviously something
Speaker 2: that you will remember, and that has been and people
Speaker 2: like you sharing that and feeling comfortable sharing that, that
Speaker 2: to me has been like the most surprising thing. And
Speaker 2: I think maybe it probably just goes back to your
Speaker 2: wonderfully astute observation and questions about when we started the podcast,
Speaker 2: I think setting it up as a place of safety,
Speaker 2: you can be honest, there's no judgment. Nobody's perfect. We
Speaker 2: all made mistakes making this thing, as everyone does at
Speaker 2: times in their lives, and so I think setting that
Speaker 2: up for fans or cast or crew to come on
Speaker 2: to share their experience has been very surprising because the perspectives,
Speaker 2: even with people we worked with, are very different than
Speaker 2: our own. And that's just been wonderful to hear.
Speaker 5: Sure, it's a.
Speaker 2: Very long way to say that. Sorry, no, I.
Speaker 5: Remember so clearly, you know, complete honesty. When NYA passed
Speaker 5: and twenty twenty and obviously that was the Height during
Speaker 5: the Height lockdown, and it was a very tough time
Speaker 5: all around the world for a myriad of reasons. And
Speaker 5: at that time a BBC journalist reached out to me
Speaker 5: to ask me to go on to BBC and talk
Speaker 5: about queer representation and why that's important, especially with what
Speaker 5: Naya and some time I did for all of us.
Speaker 5: And I did, and I went on and I was
Speaker 5: talking to them for around fifteen minutes and I hung
Speaker 5: up with the phone. But it was like an hour
Speaker 5: long slot on the radio, if you know what I mean.
Speaker 5: So I listened to like the remaining forty five minutes,
Speaker 5: and there must have been like a dozen two dozen
Speaker 5: people on after me talking about their experiences and the
Speaker 5: weight that Glee and then by extension, all of you
Speaker 5: guys held for us. And I remember in that moment,
Speaker 5: I literally just kind of broke down crying, but like
Speaker 5: obviously because of what had happened, but also because I
Speaker 5: was kind of thinking I will probably never meet these
Speaker 5: people who are talking about their experiences on the radio
Speaker 5: in my life. I don't know them. They're from different
Speaker 5: parts of the world to me, but like, here we
Speaker 5: are so connected by this like thing. Yeah, and then
Speaker 5: I was kind of like, and people who are listening
Speaker 5: are going to think that this sounds so hyperbolic and
Speaker 5: so over the top, But like I was, like, I
Speaker 5: know for a fact in that moment that this show
Speaker 5: is going to echo throughout my life in some way
Speaker 5: for the rest of my life because it came into
Speaker 5: my life at such a time when I needed it,
Speaker 5: so it implanted itself into my brain. Yeah, and there
Speaker 5: hasn't been a piece of media since it came out
Speaker 5: that I'm like, I obviously like things. I love different
Speaker 5: TV shows and stuff, but it's it's like, I'm twenty nine.
Speaker 5: Who said that, not me? I'm twenty nine now, Like
Speaker 5: the show came in when into my life when I
Speaker 5: was fourteen, that.
Speaker 1: Is right, and half my life. Wow, that's crazy.
Speaker 4: Well, it's just so nice to hear from you that
Speaker 4: it affected you so profoundly that like you you can't
Speaker 4: see like you can see this like forever connection. That's
Speaker 4: like really beautiful and I don't think anybody's ever said.
Speaker 1: It that way.
Speaker 4: And thank you for all your really wonderful, thoughtful, intentional questions.
Speaker 4: I have one more question for you before we wrap up.
Speaker 4: What is the feeling that Glee leaves you with?
Speaker 5: Oh my god, it's so lovely listening to your podcast
Speaker 5: when you ask that question, because when you're listening to
Speaker 5: it and you're just like cleaning your room or whatever
Speaker 5: as you're listening, you can always hear like a beat
Speaker 5: before someone answers that. It's so lovely. Uglee was and
Speaker 5: continues to be like one of the most important things
Speaker 5: to me. It quite literally like altered the course of
Speaker 5: my life. And I sometimes I hear I hear what
Speaker 5: I'm saying and I'm like, oh my god, Conor, I
Speaker 5: can't pletely just said that. But that's how I feel.
Speaker 5: I get so emotional about it. It was I I
Speaker 5: look past everything surrounding the show and I look I
Speaker 5: kind of look to the work and what all of
Speaker 5: you did for me. The work is the most important thing.
Speaker 5: There's a very there's a very famous Irish playwright that
Speaker 5: I love called Enda Walch who he actually, you guys,
Speaker 5: might he adapted the musical once he wanted like a
Speaker 5: Tony Ward for that. Yes, And he gave an interview
Speaker 5: to a newspaper a couple of years ago that he
Speaker 5: said all of his all of my plays are about
Speaker 5: people who haven't been loved or looked after. And I
Speaker 5: think that really resonated with me because I'm like, I
Speaker 5: think a lot of like Ryan Murphy and Co's work
Speaker 5: is centered around that team. Yes, just the essence of
Speaker 5: Glee to me, I wasn't necessarily interested in who was
Speaker 5: like in a relationship or who was breaking up. The
Speaker 5: emotional essence to me was these weird old kids following
Speaker 5: their dreams. That that was the impact for me. I
Speaker 5: was like, are they going to get into Niada? Are
Speaker 5: they going to go to New York? What is already
Speaker 5: going to do when you leave that because I was
Speaker 5: living at Yeah, you know, my dad is in a
Speaker 5: wheelchair too. My dad is a double amputee, and you know,
Speaker 5: he's the best man ever, but he's also a man
Speaker 5: of a certain age that expresses very little emotion. I
Speaker 5: remember him seeing Artie on TV for the first time
Speaker 5: and literally like an older man. So it leaves me
Speaker 5: with immense gratitude and gratefulness and I'm still talking about
Speaker 5: it today and I will continue to do that as well.
Speaker 5: All of my friends, like we just adore the show
Speaker 5: and I don't think that's ever going to ever going
Speaker 5: to change anytime soon. So thank you so much for
Speaker 5: asking me on and also thank you for just doing
Speaker 5: this in general, because I know as a fan, I
Speaker 5: think it's well needed and it's it's such a beautiful
Speaker 5: like exercise and like kind of talking your truth and
Speaker 5: stuff like that. So yeah, thank you.
Speaker 2: You're yeh jem Yeah sweet sweet, I just thank you.
Speaker 2: You're a playwright, yes, yeah, I can't imagine the things
Speaker 2: you write because you speak. Yeah, if it makes you,
Speaker 2: it makes anyone feel any better.
Speaker 5: Lee is the only thing in the world I can
Speaker 5: talk about like I'm like, bitch, don't ask me about taxes.
Speaker 1: You know, like, well no, yeah, who knows, that's about that.
Speaker 5: Thank you so much, thank you so.
Speaker 1: Much, so much speaking with you so much.
Speaker 5: Bye.
Speaker 1: Oh my goodness, what.
Speaker 4: A sweet sweet I feel moved, you know, just like
Speaker 4: sit back in your chair a little bit when you
Speaker 4: talk to people like that who just have these like
Speaker 4: really intentional, thoughtful questions.
Speaker 1: I don't know how many times I have said thoughtful
Speaker 1: in this episode, but.
Speaker 2: I think Connor, if you're still listening, I don't know
Speaker 2: if you thought to pursue journalism or being a host
Speaker 2: of some sort in your professional life. But I know
Speaker 2: you said it's only because you know so much about
Speaker 2: Glee that you can talk like this. I don't think
Speaker 2: that's true, because you're brilliant. You really sat and watched
Speaker 2: somebody who was really good at the job, and this
Speaker 2: is not what you do professionally, and and like we've
Speaker 2: been interviewed a bunch of times by a lot of
Speaker 2: people interview and you're excellent.
Speaker 1: At this, like this is and he was on our podcast.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And I just need to be your cheerleader for
Speaker 2: a hot second and be like, maybe you need to
Speaker 2: think about this and a more in like a serious way,
Speaker 2: because you're very good and it was an honor to
Speaker 2: be interviewed by you. You had incredible questions, you were
Speaker 2: engaged in listening. Listen like I'm taking notes. I will
Speaker 2: be applying them to our future interviews. Wow, I just
Speaker 2: you know good, Yeah, I know if you know you
Speaker 2: know yeah, Like we were in the presence of somebody
Speaker 2: who was excellent at what they do.
Speaker 1: Wow.
Speaker 2: And it felt like that and felt nice to share
Speaker 2: it with you.
Speaker 4: Thank you Connor to come for coming on and showing
Speaker 4: your don We really appreciate it.
Speaker 2: Hope you all enjoyed it. We're going to have some
Speaker 2: more fans in the future, so come back. That's what
Speaker 2: you really miss see ye thanks for listening and follow
Speaker 2: us on Instagram at and that's what you really miss
Speaker 2: pod and make sure to write us a review and
Speaker 2: leave us five stars. See you next time.