Speaker 1: I can't stress enough what a severe hit it is
Speaker 1: on the people in this business, people that get their
Speaker 1: paycheck from from golf. So we're gonna do everything that
Speaker 1: we can to make sure that we're safe, but to
Speaker 1: stay open as long as we can. So we're putting
Speaker 1: a lot of things in place today while we're not open,
Speaker 1: so we can best protect our employees and our customers
Speaker 1: when we do. In reality, we expect to expect most
Speaker 1: people to reschedule and travel to put twenty one. The
Speaker 1: cool thing about go Hill Park is it's such a
Speaker 1: community spirit. You know. I got people coming out of
Speaker 1: the woodward just to just to volunteer to pull weeds,
Speaker 1: you know. With another logo, Nobody Getting This is the
Speaker 1: fire Pit hosted by Matt Jane. One of the benefits
Speaker 1: of being around a fire pit is that the conversation
Speaker 1: can go in a lot of directions. In this episode,
Speaker 1: it's not one good story about golf, it's several perspectives
Speaker 1: on the state of the game before we get started.
Speaker 1: To be sure to follow my social handles because on Monday,
Speaker 1: we're posting a live auction which will include items donated
Speaker 1: by all my guests on this show, and it will
Speaker 1: benefit Feeding America, the nation's largest domestic hunger relief organization.
Speaker 1: With social distancing in place for weeks now and a
Speaker 1: flattening of the curb the United States, when and where
Speaker 1: does science and safety start yielding to the greater good
Speaker 1: of the economy and mental and physical well being of
Speaker 1: a country. Thankfully, I'm not in a position to make
Speaker 1: those difficult decisions. Although there is division and confusion, one
Speaker 1: thing is clear. We all admire, respect, celebrate, and support
Speaker 1: the doctors, nurses, and first responders risking their lives to
Speaker 1: save others. The front lines of this war are, in
Speaker 1: most cases hospitals down street. We cry for the people
Speaker 1: who are dying alone, leaving loved ones who are grieving alone.
Speaker 1: It's devastating and overwhelming. We are riddled with dual channels
Speaker 1: of anxiety, not only for the good of mankind, but
Speaker 1: also for the future of our families and finances. So
Speaker 1: where does golf and the golf industry fit into all this?
Speaker 1: Some could care less, and I obviously get that they
Speaker 1: have more pressing priorities and concerns I can only imagine,
Speaker 1: but almost all of my friends work in the golf industry.
Speaker 1: My life and my future are tied to a game.
Speaker 1: As trivial as that sounds, it's real, and admittedly I
Speaker 1: find a slight comfort knowing I'm not alone. The National
Speaker 1: Golf Foundation estimates the game supports one point eight million
Speaker 1: jobs and is an eighty four billion dollar industry, with
Speaker 1: almost one in every nine Americans playing some form of golf.
Speaker 1: It's the number one outdoor, pay to play individual participation
Speaker 1: sport in America. As of April sixteen, there are fifteen
Speaker 1: states with mandates in place disallowing play. With that being said,
Speaker 1: and having recently launched this podcast, I found a few
Speaker 1: friends and leadership positions within the industry. I scheduled a
Speaker 1: Zoom roundtable, looking for insight into where we are now
Speaker 1: and to get some sense of what the future looks like.
Speaker 1: At some point we will emerge from our homes. As
Speaker 1: the n GF reports, the itch to play golf is
Speaker 1: intensifying despite financial and personal anxieties, When and how can
Speaker 1: we play this game safely and responsibly by minimizing the
Speaker 1: risk of life and death? Joining me on this call
Speaker 1: where Dr r A. Sapaya, a functional sports medical expert
Speaker 1: who I've worked with at the Golf Channel for the
Speaker 1: last few years, Doctor Rro is only available for about
Speaker 1: a half an hour. He ducks out in the middle
Speaker 1: of the call. Marty car CEO of car Golf Group,
Speaker 1: which is based in Ireland and includes car Golf Travel
Speaker 1: and car Golf Management. Josh Lesnik, president of Kember Sports
Speaker 1: and Kember Lesnik, which manages over a d golf facilities
Speaker 1: in States. Tom Pashley, president of Fine Nurse Resort, which
Speaker 1: is often referred to as the cradle of American golf.
Speaker 1: John Ashworth, who's the co founder of Link Soul and
Speaker 1: who manages Go to Hill Park, a municipal course in Oceanside, California.
Speaker 1: And Lou Thompson, owner of Forest Students, a multi course
Speaker 1: facility in the middle of Michigan. Why don't we just
Speaker 1: sort of start with and around the horn of sorts
Speaker 1: in which you kind of just give your perspective of
Speaker 1: of the way COVID is impacting your your professional world.
Speaker 1: At this point, we're really getting into sort of the
Speaker 1: industry perspective as it relates to the course or courses,
Speaker 1: or the destinations or all the properties that you represent.
Speaker 1: Um dr are he's limited time, so UM I want
Speaker 1: to also sort of include a lot of his perspective
Speaker 1: and commentary on the front end of this before we
Speaker 1: end up having losing that about one third. You know,
Speaker 1: from where you sit, where are we at as it
Speaker 1: relates to COVID nineteen uh, you know, looking at America
Speaker 1: as a whole, I see signs of it starting to
Speaker 1: tap it down, meaning we've hit a plateau, right, And
Speaker 1: that's very reassuring, very promising, and it's great news. And
Speaker 1: I see that even in in in our state in Florida,
Speaker 1: where we were expected to have quite a significant surge
Speaker 1: happening in the last week of April into the first
Speaker 1: week of May, and we've been we're looking at the
Speaker 1: numbers and it's not going to be as bad as
Speaker 1: we thought it's going to be, which is great news, okay.
Speaker 1: But the other side to this is as quickly as
Speaker 1: it shot up and it plateaus, don't expect it to
Speaker 1: come down as quickly that the down slope is much
Speaker 1: much slower. Okay. So that's where, yes, it's great news,
Speaker 1: but I think the situation is going to linger on
Speaker 1: a little bit longer than more people have the patients.
Speaker 1: We still have to put those measures in when we
Speaker 1: start coming down the slope. Okay, So social distancing, handwashing,
Speaker 1: all those things are going to be still around at
Speaker 1: least for another month. And from what I can see,
Speaker 1: there's there's one model that I saw, um which I
Speaker 1: trust actually from University of Washington. They they look at
Speaker 1: a model that I saw that if you remove social
Speaker 1: distancing measures on first of May, it predicted a significant
Speaker 1: surge in August. You know, and if that that's the
Speaker 1: kind of scenarios do not want to face. So looking
Speaker 1: looking from the front line, that's what I see right
Speaker 1: now as it relates to golf dr are right here.
Speaker 1: Let's say you know, the Orlando area, Winner Park nine
Speaker 1: is closed, Winner Pines is open, Interlocking is closed, Country
Speaker 1: Club of Orlando is open. That's you know, and then
Speaker 1: one state is total lockdown and one state is playing
Speaker 1: off like it was you know every week as a
Speaker 1: member of guest. That's the kind of the confusing intersection
Speaker 1: of where the game meets sort of reality and the
Speaker 1: rubber meets the road and sciences is meeting economy. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's it's frustrating because you know, I live on on
Speaker 1: Eagle Creek golf course right and here before the match
Speaker 1: just came in, everything was as normal. And then when
Speaker 1: the states started climbing down a little bit and they
Speaker 1: put the curfew in place, in Orange County, people were
Speaker 1: still playing golf. And what the club did was they said,
Speaker 1: all the practice areas shut down and they've put distances
Speaker 1: between the practice the boxes and everybody is on their
Speaker 1: own cards, so there's no removing flags. So you know,
Speaker 1: I do see that as a good thing. Uh, if
Speaker 1: you can absolutely be strict and be diligent and watch
Speaker 1: out for each other and keep the distance, I think
Speaker 1: going on the golf course, exposing yourself to sunlight, getting
Speaker 1: some access life, getting some you know, stress out, and
Speaker 1: actually giving a sense of normalcy is very very important
Speaker 1: at this time. But I share your frustration, like why
Speaker 1: why are some places completely shut down? And then the
Speaker 1: other places have you know, some golf still being played
Speaker 1: and then you go to you know, down the road
Speaker 1: I'll work and it's completely open. You know that that's
Speaker 1: kind of and at the end of the day, just
Speaker 1: to be clear, as it relates to science, being you know,
Speaker 1: more than six ft apart, being out in the open air,
Speaker 1: not touching flagsticks or rakes, being an individual carts or
Speaker 1: you know, no caddies or carrying your own bag walking
Speaker 1: only all of that in theory, you know that that's
Speaker 1: a very low risk scenario in which you'd actually pass
Speaker 1: on the virus or get and you know, it's it's
Speaker 1: no different than us working out you know, outside my
Speaker 1: my my front y'all. You know, I'm out in the sun.
Speaker 1: I'm doing my own thing. You know, even if someone
Speaker 1: else running past me and the six ft away, that's
Speaker 1: completely fine. So if you can do those things that
Speaker 1: you very you know nicely pointed out. If you can
Speaker 1: do those things, then I think playing golf is not
Speaker 1: a risk high risk endeavor. No, um, all right, thank
Speaker 1: you dr All right, So, Josh Kemper Sports hundred and
Speaker 1: twenty courses running the gamut of low green fees to
Speaker 1: the to the bandon dunes and stream songs of the
Speaker 1: world and sprinkled throughout the country of the How many
Speaker 1: are still open, how many are closed, how many are
Speaker 1: on the brink of of closing for good? Yeah, Kemper Sports.
Speaker 1: We manage very diverse portfolio, as you're saying, you know,
Speaker 1: our very first management contracts and nine whole municipal course
Speaker 1: in Vernon Hills, Illinois and then going on to the
Speaker 1: as you said, the Chambers Bass, dream song banded Dunes
Speaker 1: of the World and pretty much everything in between. And
Speaker 1: we operate in twenty five states across the country. On
Speaker 1: Fortunately at this point only thirty of our facilities are
Speaker 1: open in some capacity, meaning se are closed. And it's uh,
Speaker 1: you know, it's such a severe hit on each and
Speaker 1: every one of the businesses, even the thirty percent that
Speaker 1: are open. Yes, I can say right now that in
Speaker 1: in places where golf is open, the golf courses are
Speaker 1: frankly busier than they've ever been. Obviously our sport is
Speaker 1: always weather dependent, but um, they're busier than than they've
Speaker 1: ever been. People uh need as as Dr Era was saying,
Speaker 1: you know, the the exercise, the sunlight, the entertainment, the
Speaker 1: stress relief. Um, it's a it's a great uh just
Speaker 1: form of a healthy lifestyle. Um. So we're seeing that.
Speaker 1: But of course, the golf courses that are open are
Speaker 1: now operating under you know, different procedures. Uh. For example,
Speaker 1: you know, no one no one's going in the pro shop.
Speaker 1: There's no food and beverage, uh no, uh no touching
Speaker 1: the flags, that no rakes. You know a lot of
Speaker 1: places no carts. Some places you're allowed to single ride
Speaker 1: in a cart um. And it's very different all over
Speaker 1: the country, some places county by county um as to
Speaker 1: how we operate. So what we're doing at this point
Speaker 1: is just trying to advise our clients through this time.
Speaker 1: A majority of the properties that we run are managed
Speaker 1: on behalf of other owners. We still do own some
Speaker 1: least some and have some consulting agreements, And at this
Speaker 1: point we're really just advising our clients and are leaders
Speaker 1: at each course how to manage best through this pandemic.
Speaker 1: And it's I can't stress enough what a severe hit
Speaker 1: it is on on the people in this business, the
Speaker 1: hourly people, the people that get their paycheck from from
Speaker 1: golf or the independent contractors, the caddies. This is such
Speaker 1: a severe hit, and the longer it goes on, really
Speaker 1: the worst it gets for people. How much longer do
Speaker 1: you think before this is just a tipping point of
Speaker 1: pure disaster. If we're not there already, look if this,
Speaker 1: if if we can't get golf courses open, you know
Speaker 1: before July one, Um, it's it's a it's a disaster scenario.
Speaker 1: And I think you know everyone who's leading our country
Speaker 1: through this knows that, Um, whether it's whether it's golf
Speaker 1: or restaurants or lodging. Um, you know, I think everyone's
Speaker 1: aware of the unemployment rates now getting up to where
Speaker 1: they were at the Great Depression. How many months can
Speaker 1: a small business go with with basically zero revenue? You know,
Speaker 1: you're talking at daily fee golf courses that are closed.
Speaker 1: You have zero revenue? You know, can you afford to
Speaker 1: keep the superintendent and afford to keep some staff to
Speaker 1: keep the golf courses alive? Where do you draw the line?
Speaker 1: Everyone's such a key staff when you're open, but when
Speaker 1: you're you're closed for business. So obviously there's a lot
Speaker 1: of a lot of damage there, and uh it frankly,
Speaker 1: it can't can't go on that much longer. That's of
Speaker 1: course an economic opinion, and um there's a science side
Speaker 1: to this too that we all have to abide by.
Speaker 1: So it's really a severe situation, Uh, Tom patially of Pinehurst,
Speaker 1: When did you guys realize this is this is a
Speaker 1: no fly zone and we need to be responsible. This
Speaker 1: is a place that you know is considered the cradle
Speaker 1: of American golf. Where do you guys sit on all this. Yeah,
Speaker 1: we've got you know, nine golf courses plus the cradle,
Speaker 1: three hotels and tens and restaurants, and so it was
Speaker 1: March eighteen when the State of North Carolina mandated that
Speaker 1: the restaurants closed. That for us, that took two hotels
Speaker 1: with it. We've closed our two smallest hotels, and then
Speaker 1: we held out hope we stayed open. We consolidated everybody
Speaker 1: into the Carolina Hotel, the flagship hotel, but then it
Speaker 1: became to an extent of safety issue for our employees
Speaker 1: and for our guests, and it also just became an
Speaker 1: economics issue of not needing to have a large hotel open.
Speaker 1: So on March twenty we closed the Carolina Hotel. Now
Speaker 1: are our nine golf courses are still open. Piners has
Speaker 1: over golfing members and so as Josh mentioned, you know,
Speaker 1: there's the beautiful spring days that we're enjoying right now.
Speaker 1: The dog Woods and as Alias are in full bloom.
Speaker 1: It's it's perfect, and the courses are in great shape.
Speaker 1: So we have a lot of golf being played by
Speaker 1: our members. But typically this is when we would be
Speaker 1: full full of people kind of coming from the Northeast,
Speaker 1: people who had just watched masters. People who've got the itch.
Speaker 1: They would all be here right now enjoying it, and
Speaker 1: and they're not here. What what kind of safety stipulations
Speaker 1: are the members operating under and and how how is
Speaker 1: that also impact like how about the maintenance crew and
Speaker 1: sort of the infrastructure of providing that experience. Yeah, it's uh,
Speaker 1: we've gone from employees down to two hundred employees. A
Speaker 1: lot of those are on the golf maintenance staff just
Speaker 1: to keep the nine courses mode. Uh, certainly it's a
Speaker 1: it's a reduced maintenance practice then you would normally have.
Speaker 1: But we're trying to keep the courses in good enough
Speaker 1: condition so that when we are able to reopen to
Speaker 1: the outside world, that that everybody will have a great experience.
Speaker 1: Same things that were mentioned about single carts, um, you know,
Speaker 1: the little PVC in the in the cups so that
Speaker 1: people don't have to reach all the way in and
Speaker 1: touch everything, the flagsticks, the rakes, um, all the typical
Speaker 1: things that everyone else is doing. Is or the practices
Speaker 1: that we're adopting and and what we've seen, you know,
Speaker 1: a trend is in walking. You know, that's one of
Speaker 1: the things that I hope will come out of this
Speaker 1: is that more people will enjoy the walking game. We
Speaker 1: just got a shipment of push cards in. You know,
Speaker 1: you can use a pushcard on pine ER's number two now,
Speaker 1: which we didn't used to allow. But now we've got
Speaker 1: push cards on all nine of our golf forces and
Speaker 1: we're seeing a lot more people doing that, and I
Speaker 1: think that's hopefully going to be a nice outcome when
Speaker 1: this is all over, that more people are going to
Speaker 1: be walking the game. Can you imagine a scenario in
Speaker 1: which in sort of the greater part of Pinehurst, North Carolina,
Speaker 1: if you sucked out all golf and just shut it down,
Speaker 1: what does what does that do? Yeah, well it is
Speaker 1: you know, is we've we're making judgment calls. We're trying
Speaker 1: to maintain safety. We could be open, the hotels could
Speaker 1: be open right now. But we do think that, you know,
Speaker 1: to an extent, the cradle of American golf is out
Speaker 1: there carrying the flag for for a lot of people,
Speaker 1: and particularly golf in North Carolina, if not in the country.
Speaker 1: So we're gonna do everything that we can to make
Speaker 1: sure that we're safe, but to stay open as long
Speaker 1: as we can, and so far that the state has
Speaker 1: recognized that it's important to communicate the safety initiatives that
Speaker 1: you're taking. We let the state know what we're doing
Speaker 1: so that so that they don't get misinformation and and
Speaker 1: get a random photo of a foursome that looks like
Speaker 1: they're standing too close together. I mentioned our members earlier.
Speaker 1: Our members are doing a little bit of policing because
Speaker 1: our facility is still open to the public. People are
Speaker 1: coming here and playing golf that are not members. But
Speaker 1: there was a group of about six of them gathered
Speaker 1: together on the putting green, and one of our members
Speaker 1: went over to them and kind of wagged a finger
Speaker 1: at them, because you know, if things get a little sideways,
Speaker 1: if someone shows up from the state and they see
Speaker 1: that we're not maintaining these social distances, they could shut
Speaker 1: us down. M Luta Sen Forest Dunes. You have you know,
Speaker 1: you purchased this resort several years ago. You've added the
Speaker 1: Loop by Tom Doak, You're about to open a short
Speaker 1: course at ten whole, Part three course by Keith rad
Speaker 1: and Riley Johns, and you've got a scheduled opening, not
Speaker 1: unlike Bandon Dunes has a scheduled opening of Sheep Ranch.
Speaker 1: As you know, the first part of June. Where do
Speaker 1: you sit, lou What's what's your perspective of being in
Speaker 1: the middle of Michigan very much a destination resort on
Speaker 1: what seemingly was going to be your greatest year by far.
Speaker 1: As of now, we were scheduled open this Friday. Uh,
Speaker 1: the Snight of Michigan has got us on a shutdown order. Uh.
Speaker 1: We don't know when we're gonna get told. We don't
Speaker 1: know if that's my one. Uh. The governor might come
Speaker 1: out in the next week or two and move that
Speaker 1: to June, which is the members that we pardoned, you know,
Speaker 1: which creates a huge problem because we need staffing. You
Speaker 1: hard for me to get staffing in there today to
Speaker 1: get ready because you call people, I'm gonna stay at
Speaker 1: home order. You know, I don't want to. I can't
Speaker 1: go to work. Um, so you know, I can't wait
Speaker 1: till the day we open and bring in seventy people.
Speaker 1: So uh, and not knowing when that is it's a
Speaker 1: huge problem for it. We don't know if even when
Speaker 1: we open golf, if the restaurant's going to be open
Speaker 1: or restaurants carry out today, we don't know what we're
Speaker 1: gonna be able to do UM at this time. You know,
Speaker 1: it's pretty sad times. How many how many employees do
Speaker 1: you have? It for us stance today, I've got about
Speaker 1: twenty some employees that's on the Pyroad, that stays on
Speaker 1: the pyrow year round. And uh we'll add about sending
Speaker 1: about the employees when we first open. Uh, but I
Speaker 1: don't want to bring them people onto the Pyroad today
Speaker 1: if I'm not gonna get open until Junior, Dy long.
Speaker 1: So you know, I'm sitting here kind of talking to
Speaker 1: management daily. What do you hear? What? What can we do? Uh?
Speaker 1: At this time, we don't know. And you're maintaining these
Speaker 1: courses as though you're going to open. I mean that's
Speaker 1: a lot of maintaining they're going to be perfectly open.
Speaker 1: So uh, but again we don't know what that is
Speaker 1: going to be. Uh. And you know Tom said it
Speaker 1: bestball ago. You know, the biggest issue we are dealing
Speaker 1: with is we have to do what's best for Psychety,
Speaker 1: for our employees and our customers. So we're putting a
Speaker 1: lot of things in place today while we're not open,
Speaker 1: so we can best protect our employees and our customers
Speaker 1: when we do them. Marty Carr of car golf travel
Speaker 1: obviously facilitating you know, trips within the UK and and
Speaker 1: UH and also a vast majority of people coming from
Speaker 1: the U S. You're you're at a total rense. What's
Speaker 1: the situation right, It's not it's not unlike what's happening
Speaker 1: in the in the golf course side. We we are
Speaker 1: all also the management business like Kemper that managed golf
Speaker 1: courses and they're all closed over here and Ireland. Basically
Speaker 1: it was about eleven and a half thousand cases of
Speaker 1: of the coronavirus and we have about four hundred and
Speaker 1: six deaths. So it's there really are slowing the curve here.
Speaker 1: It's it's just at about five percent at the moment,
Speaker 1: and they're hoping to relax the restrictions here, the stay
Speaker 1: at home restrictions by the fifth of May. So we
Speaker 1: are involved in an aggressive campaign to lobby on the
Speaker 1: safety of golf. And I've flipped you on an article
Speaker 1: before about how a doctor was quote in the Irish
Speaker 1: Time today talking about he's the foremost expert in infectious
Speaker 1: to these in Ireland about how it's safe to play golf.
Speaker 1: And I think it's really just I know it as
Speaker 1: related to the travel question. But it's important that that
Speaker 1: that that that that the science it comes out about
Speaker 1: golf is supposed to the industry because the industry are obviously,
Speaker 1: like every other industry, is trying to get back to normal.
Speaker 1: And as far as the traveler is concerned, that clearly,
Speaker 1: you know, zero revenue, everybody is moving their reservations to
Speaker 1: one it's it's, it's, it's it's a bit of a
Speaker 1: mess came upolis very quickly. So all that the April
Speaker 1: May June businesses all rebooking for and the suppliers, the
Speaker 1: golf courses and the hotels are all offering credits to
Speaker 1: rebook for, and most cases people are looking for full refunds,
Speaker 1: but in many cases we would have passed on those
Speaker 1: deposits are large part of those deposits to the suppliers,
Speaker 1: And so it is that we're talking to a lot
Speaker 1: of people about rescheduling trips July, probably in the mix
Speaker 1: of the moment, and hopefully there will be the ability
Speaker 1: to start traveling again maybe August September, but in reality
Speaker 1: we expect expect most people to to reschedule and travel
Speaker 1: to one then is going to see a huge amount
Speaker 1: of rebookings U and the Open having moved to twenty
Speaker 1: twenty two from St. Andrews is a big help for
Speaker 1: that because clearly we see one probably being of the
Speaker 1: peak and I think things may be getting back to
Speaker 1: level part in two. So that's a very our view
Speaker 1: of the world at the moment. But again it's really
Speaker 1: just a lot of problem solving and dealing with a
Speaker 1: lot of clients who don't know what to do. And
Speaker 1: clearly you're looking at two years of revenue for two
Speaker 1: years of costs and one year revenue, so it's very
Speaker 1: very challenging times two years of cost one year of revenue.
Speaker 1: That really sums it up, right, I mean pretty much
Speaker 1: pretty much. Yet, I had a meeting with my CFO
Speaker 1: on the first of March and we were looking at
Speaker 1: revenue has been up seven percent a year on year,
Speaker 1: three percent ahead of budget. Have days great here And
Speaker 1: thirty days later we're sitting down and he's like, this
Speaker 1: has like being in a movie, you know, I mean,
Speaker 1: we're here just having a completely different conversation. And his
Speaker 1: his assistant said to it, well, the only problem with
Speaker 1: this movie there's no superhero going to fly in through
Speaker 1: the window. So yeah, I mean, it's it's the same
Speaker 1: one over but look at it, well, we get through it.
Speaker 1: I just wish it was. It's it's easier in a
Speaker 1: small country like Ireland to unify policy and and lobby.
Speaker 1: I think I think your situation is a bit more fragmented.
Speaker 1: It is all about the safety of the customer and
Speaker 1: the and the and the staff and indeed every and
Speaker 1: the owners if nobody wants to go into an unsafe environment.
Speaker 1: So I think it's really clear that we need to
Speaker 1: all make a very clear case that that it is
Speaker 1: a safe environment. But it's really important that we get
Speaker 1: the medics on board. A lot of the medics in
Speaker 1: Ireland a golfers. So that's our challenge for the next
Speaker 1: ten days is to make sure that people get out
Speaker 1: there and and and really really make you make it
Speaker 1: very clear. Of the four hundred and fifty courses in
Speaker 1: Ireland roughly, how many do you think are on on
Speaker 1: on in serious you know, a threat of having to
Speaker 1: close for good. I would say that there's a lot
Speaker 1: of golf courses that are on life support anyway, you
Speaker 1: know what I mean. And and and and this goes
Speaker 1: back ten years. We've been very much part of managing
Speaker 1: assets on behalf of investors or banks. I had a
Speaker 1: college today, but the head of the Golfing Union of Ireland,
Speaker 1: which is the governing body of of golf for Ireland
Speaker 1: both north and South and the UK, is mandating different
Speaker 1: closures than the Republic and that causes a bit of
Speaker 1: a conflict there. But I did say to him that
Speaker 1: if we get in as part of this loosening up
Speaker 1: on the early May, you know, I reckon thirty courses
Speaker 1: probably won't open if it goes to the first of July.
Speaker 1: You're probably talking, are wow Now. I suspect though that
Speaker 1: the courses that that that you guys come over and
Speaker 1: play are not the ones we're talking about. These are
Speaker 1: the domestic bread and butter golf courses that the average guy.
Speaker 1: We have seven hundred thousand people here who are on
Speaker 1: state support from two hundreds or half a million people
Speaker 1: have gone on state support here, and the government here
Speaker 1: has been very quick to offer small business support. So
Speaker 1: that is staving off some of the the the armygadon
Speaker 1: of of of shedding jobs. It's it's giving us ninety
Speaker 1: days too to buy time to see if we can
Speaker 1: get back open. So I guess it's probably easier when
Speaker 1: you're in a small boat as opposed to it the battleship,
Speaker 1: you know, speaking of small boats. John Ashworth, who took
Speaker 1: over the lease and is the overseer of all things
Speaker 1: goth Hill Park in addition to a small business like
Speaker 1: Links Soul, you're you're you're trying to keep this this
Speaker 1: little boat known as the goat Hill Park afloat um.
Speaker 1: How's it going, John? Well, we, uh, we closed on
Speaker 1: March up until then we've kept you know, like everybody else.
Speaker 1: This thing was such a kind of caught everybody off guarden.
Speaker 1: It kind of came in waves to where okay, you know,
Speaker 1: well we'll not have people, uh pick head touch the flagsticks.
Speaker 1: Then we'll take away the rags and then you know,
Speaker 1: we we we we kind of whittled it down to
Speaker 1: where we had when we were open. The last week
Speaker 1: we were you had to book online, you had to
Speaker 1: pay online. We were just doing on sums um walking only, yeah,
Speaker 1: walking only. Uh and uh you know you could literally,
Speaker 1: you know, come out to the course and not get
Speaker 1: within twenty ft of a human being, you know, and
Speaker 1: play golf. And it was it was actually working. We
Speaker 1: we were we were booked. We were booked from seven
Speaker 1: thirty in the morning until five five o'clock at night.
Speaker 1: And we're doing nine whole loops, so we can you know,
Speaker 1: people could play eight team, but they had to book
Speaker 1: both nines. But anyway, it was you know, I was
Speaker 1: all for doing whatever the consensus of the government wanted
Speaker 1: to so, you know, again, like you guys say, I mean,
Speaker 1: it was safety first, for the for the for our employees,
Speaker 1: and for the and for the customers, and that was
Speaker 1: first and foremost. And we were one of the last
Speaker 1: counties in San Diego County to be open. But when
Speaker 1: it came down to shut we you know, obviously, okay,
Speaker 1: we'll shut it. And you know, and we're we're a
Speaker 1: you know, public daily fee, you know, small green fee,
Speaker 1: you know, low overhead situation and uh no food and beverage,
Speaker 1: really no food and beverage. So you know, for us,
Speaker 1: it was it was pretty easy to manage, and I
Speaker 1: felt like we had the safest possible environment. But now
Speaker 1: it's you know, two weeks later, which feels like about
Speaker 1: three months to be honest with you, Uh, you know,
Speaker 1: we've I've had to cut back some staff, uh, you know,
Speaker 1: and but the cool thing about got Hill Park is
Speaker 1: it's such a community spirit. And uh so we've got
Speaker 1: a few projects going on just to make the course better.
Speaker 1: And you know, I got people coming out of the
Speaker 1: woodwork just to just to volunteer to pull weeds, you know.
Speaker 1: So it's it's from that point of view, it's pretty cool.
Speaker 1: But but yeah, it's it's crazy times. I hope, I
Speaker 1: hope we can get back after it. From what you know,
Speaker 1: I think things will totally be different for the next
Speaker 1: foreseeable future in terms of safety. And I agree with
Speaker 1: pass On. You know, you're gonna see a lot more
Speaker 1: people walking playing golf, which is a great thing. Uh
Speaker 1: and we may be walking only for a while. It
Speaker 1: could be looked at as planned recreation, you know, like
Speaker 1: very disciplined recreation for people. So you know, if we
Speaker 1: all do it right, if we if we practice the
Speaker 1: safety measures, the it's you know, it's it's beneficial for
Speaker 1: the for the community and for the health and recreation
Speaker 1: for people. You know, I can't help knowing what we
Speaker 1: know and seeing what we see, and you know, put
Speaker 1: golf at its core of its culture is about policing
Speaker 1: yourself just at the at the base of all this integrity. Um,
Speaker 1: you know, Josh, you know, for someone who says, you know,
Speaker 1: I don't give a shit about golf, what does golf mean?
Speaker 1: You know? People are dying, you know, which, of course
Speaker 1: you know that that is the situation. But at the
Speaker 1: end of the day, don't you think that this is
Speaker 1: there is a window a place for some sort of
Speaker 1: compromise in which, yes, we can acknowledge the the health risks,
Speaker 1: but we can also advance some slice of that economic
Speaker 1: puzzle that allows for something to sort of go on
Speaker 1: and operate safely as a golfer. It's frustrating because I
Speaker 1: think we all know that, as you're saying right at
Speaker 1: the at the soul of the game is it's a
Speaker 1: self policing game. So to think that golfers uh would
Speaker 1: not do anything other than play by all these new
Speaker 1: rules that all of us, as course operators and owners
Speaker 1: are are doing. I mean we are as everyone is
Speaker 1: here preparing our golf courses now for reopening and what
Speaker 1: the new normal is going to become. And the frustrating
Speaker 1: part is, you know, right now golf seems uh to
Speaker 1: be a really safe thing. Perhaps it could be one
Speaker 1: of the first things that comes back. You know, just
Speaker 1: just yesterday in the state of Texas, the governor reversed
Speaker 1: the closure of golf courses and allowed judges in their
Speaker 1: own jurse stiction to decide whether golf can be open
Speaker 1: or not. And in several counties golf reopened. That was
Speaker 1: specific to Texas. And again every state is different and
Speaker 1: sometimes even counties are different. But that that was a
Speaker 1: positive sign that that state recognized, UM, not only golf
Speaker 1: is important to the economy. UM and I think the
Speaker 1: golf industry has done a good job in the last
Speaker 1: few years. UM. You know, led by the p G
Speaker 1: A and U s g A and PGA Tour, PGA
Speaker 1: America and UH creating We Are Golf and which is
Speaker 1: a group of you know, golf people involved in the
Speaker 1: golf industry sharing that this is you know, a billion
Speaker 1: dollar industry in the United States and employees you know,
Speaker 1: hundreds of thousands of people. And um and is really
Speaker 1: a safe activity to do and allows people to get
Speaker 1: out of their house in a safe way. Still practice
Speaker 1: social distancing, have some entertainment, have some camaraderie, have uh
Speaker 1: the exercise that goes along with golf. And that's the
Speaker 1: frustrating part that I think we all in the industry
Speaker 1: realize that this is a safe thing to do, but
Speaker 1: we're not doctors. So this is again this is science
Speaker 1: versus the economy. But I'm hopeful that golf is one
Speaker 1: of the first things in the economy that can can
Speaker 1: reopen and give people an outlet party. I think you
Speaker 1: sent me this article as well. Australia will will allow
Speaker 1: golf and tennis to open and on May one, acknowledging
Speaker 1: and identifying these two sports is something other than you know,
Speaker 1: rugby and soccer or whatever else they may be. Uh.
Speaker 1: And and to your point of Josh, having these conversation
Speaker 1: of what the new normal is, does it feel like
Speaker 1: we're we're inching closer to something that's that's sensible. I
Speaker 1: think so. I think, like clearly, I think that golf.
Speaker 1: Golf will be one of the first to return. I
Speaker 1: don't see people, you know, rushing to the cinema or
Speaker 1: you know, jumping on a plane. First thing. I don't
Speaker 1: see people, you know, going to a Pact concert, But
Speaker 1: I do see people go to the golf course if
Speaker 1: they're allowed. I mean a lot of the lot of
Speaker 1: the steps we've taken and part of it that the
Speaker 1: operating procedures we're putting forward and we're going to widely
Speaker 1: circulate them is basically members and member of guests only
Speaker 1: and getting all the contact details for contact tracing and
Speaker 1: people not traveling to the golf course together and make
Speaker 1: it absolutely irrefutable the golf can be executed in the
Speaker 1: safe manner where you don't need to go anywhere, you know,
Speaker 1: paying payment online. As Josh said, I mean the catering
Speaker 1: is gone pretty much at the pro shop. I mean
Speaker 1: basically keeping people at the door of the building. So
Speaker 1: I hope. Well, I was talking to, as I said,
Speaker 1: some of the Gulf officials today, they taught that golf
Speaker 1: slipping in under the the early opening here on the
Speaker 1: fifth and may could be a bit optimistic, and I said, well,
Speaker 1: we've got to try harder, because you know, there's no
Speaker 1: reason that can't be. I mean there's a lot of
Speaker 1: a lot of posts going around the social media now
Speaker 1: about people standing in queues and walmarts and and and
Speaker 1: supermarkets and you know, a single gulf of walking down
Speaker 1: the fairway. It absolutely makes no sense. So hopefully we
Speaker 1: can get that message across and I think it's it's
Speaker 1: a hold to all of us to keep pushing hard
Speaker 1: on that, you know, really really hard on on the
Speaker 1: simple facts, the the new normal passion. What what do
Speaker 1: you what do you? What do you envision on what
Speaker 1: we call quote new normal coming on the back end
Speaker 1: of this. Yeah, we're working on a lot of that
Speaker 1: right now, between hotel operations, food and beverage operations. You know,
Speaker 1: hope of your meetings right now shifting to sort of
Speaker 1: you know, the future. Yeah, that was actually a theme
Speaker 1: of a meeting today. I'd likened to going through the
Speaker 1: five stages of grief, you know who we've we're going
Speaker 1: down this this slope and and we've kind of bottomed out.
Speaker 1: And now as I drove into the office this morning,
Speaker 1: people were out. We were beginning to plant flowers as
Speaker 1: you approached the Pineers Clubhouse. And so they gave me,
Speaker 1: they gave me hope. You know, we're we're planning flowers
Speaker 1: right now, anticipating the arrival of guests, and we're trying
Speaker 1: to decide what are the things that that those guests
Speaker 1: are gonna expect. The most important thing that someone said
Speaker 1: this morning is if people were coming here, they're coming
Speaker 1: by choice. So Let's remember that they're coming because they
Speaker 1: want to and it's our obligation to make sure that
Speaker 1: they're safe. But but we need to be anticipating what
Speaker 1: are the new things that they're going to expect from?
Speaker 1: You know, again back to hotel operations. Do you does
Speaker 1: the bellman, you know, get us involved in unpacking your
Speaker 1: car as he once did. Do you throw the keys
Speaker 1: to the ballet or or do you have a whole
Speaker 1: different expectation of what you want from a From a
Speaker 1: housekeeping standpoint, you know, something is as crazy as do
Speaker 1: you expect your room to have been empty for forty
Speaker 1: eight hours? Uh? You know, do you want to do
Speaker 1: you want to check in right after someone has checked out?
Speaker 1: And what are the cleaning procedures and protocols? And almost
Speaker 1: that you know that safety band as you enter your
Speaker 1: room that gives you that sense of security. Okay, this
Speaker 1: room has been cleaned. I've never been a glass glassware
Speaker 1: guy in the bathroom, but you know, forget about that
Speaker 1: disposable cups. You know, you I want to rip the
Speaker 1: plastic off of the cup and know that that I'm
Speaker 1: the first one to touch it. So there's just a
Speaker 1: myriad of things like that that we're going through. I
Speaker 1: think the least of of our our time is going
Speaker 1: to be spent on golf. You know, as we've said,
Speaker 1: the golf is outdoors, it's natural spacing. Maybe it'll be
Speaker 1: more geared towards walking the golf cart protocols maybe a
Speaker 1: little different, But I think we're going to be spending
Speaker 1: a lot more time figuring out what does a guest
Speaker 1: want from a food and beverage standpoint, What are we
Speaker 1: allowed to do? And what do you expect of your
Speaker 1: your accommodations when you check into a hotel? What about
Speaker 1: Where does maintenance come in all this? Where is the
Speaker 1: staff that actually you know, huddles in the maintenance barn?
Speaker 1: And how you know there's this there's the underbelly of
Speaker 1: golf that is that is necessary? How how? How you know?
Speaker 1: A lot of people keep saying keep you know that
Speaker 1: it's the maintenance that's the problem. It's the superintendent, the
Speaker 1: staff and the crew that manage the golf that's the
Speaker 1: problem is And I've worked on maintenance crews. You know,
Speaker 1: it's a pretty isolated for the most part. If you
Speaker 1: get on your machine or you go to your part
Speaker 1: of the golf course, it can be a pretty isolated experience.
Speaker 1: I never was working shoulder to shoulder with a large
Speaker 1: group people. We may huddle back in the same barn,
Speaker 1: but Josh, what's how do how are you managing all
Speaker 1: of that from a from a from a staff standpoint, Yeah,
Speaker 1: you know, I think what we're working with our superintendent's
Speaker 1: where our company is organized as we have regional agronomous
Speaker 1: all over the country that helped lead their superintendents at
Speaker 1: at each property. And and really what it's all about
Speaker 1: for us is coming up with the best practices. So um,
Speaker 1: you know, just for example, for a superintendent calling there,
Speaker 1: uh their crew in and saying this, this is when
Speaker 1: I'm gonna get you set up and get you set
Speaker 1: up to go out into your spot on the golf course,
Speaker 1: and whether that's going one at a time or three
Speaker 1: at a time and everyone's staying ten feet apart um,
Speaker 1: but getting them their daily instructions and getting them out
Speaker 1: on the golf course when they need to be out
Speaker 1: on the golf course. It's really not necessary to have
Speaker 1: everybody you know. Of course, during normal operation, Yeah, there's
Speaker 1: team building. There's occasionally team lunches together, uh, team meetings,
Speaker 1: Safety meetings, all those things, and a lot of those
Speaker 1: can be carried out in in different ways where you're
Speaker 1: practicing social distance, and that's you know, that's what it's
Speaker 1: all about. And you know, there's right down the you know,
Speaker 1: of course, is that you know, in seasonal areas in
Speaker 1: the Midwest and mid Atlantic that are just getting ready
Speaker 1: to open, where we have really small you know, hopefully
Speaker 1: you can keep your superintendents and typically you need to
Speaker 1: keep your mechanic and maybe a couple of people. We
Speaker 1: have a lot bigger crews now, but you know, maybe
Speaker 1: you're using some growth regulators on the on the golf course,
Speaker 1: so you just don't have as much mowing to do. Um,
Speaker 1: you know. So there's there's best practices that we try
Speaker 1: and give all our superintendents again just to manage the
Speaker 1: best way they can to get through this. I heard
Speaker 1: stream Song redoing their greens on the Red and the
Speaker 1: Blue at a time in which you would have had
Speaker 1: a jam packed t sheet making a choice to say
Speaker 1: maybe we can Hey, we're zero we're zeroed out. We
Speaker 1: might as well spin it into some sense of positive
Speaker 1: because we can. Right yeah, you know, I think there
Speaker 1: are there are some silver lining good stories if you will.
Speaker 1: There's way more many bad stories and good stories. But
Speaker 1: you know, it is a time where if you were
Speaker 1: planning to do some improvements to your golf course, even
Speaker 1: if they're smaller agronomic things where you wanted to arrify
Speaker 1: all your fairways, you know, the golf courses that that
Speaker 1: are going to come out of this, okay, that have budgets,
Speaker 1: that have capital funds. Now is a great time to
Speaker 1: get projects done. Um, whether you're closed or partly closed.
Speaker 1: And we all know, as Tom said, you know ten restaurants.
Speaker 1: That's a part of the experience that people want when
Speaker 1: they come to a golfers or obviously so even if
Speaker 1: the golf course is open, which stream song right now,
Speaker 1: the black courses open, but really things are closed down
Speaker 1: for the for the most part. So it's a good time.
Speaker 1: We're gonna regrass the greens on the Red and the
Speaker 1: Blue course. So when we you know, again no one
Speaker 1: knows exactly when we're gonna open, but in theory open
Speaker 1: next fall with you know, perfect putting greens that at
Speaker 1: all three courses, and so now it's a good time
Speaker 1: to do it. If if you can't, okay, well, Lou
Speaker 1: Lou Thompson Forest Dunes. Just going back to you for
Speaker 1: a second. You know you've you've had this momentum at
Speaker 1: for students, obviously the loop of reversible routing and now
Speaker 1: the investment into a new short course. You were telling
Speaker 1: me you were your bookings were up se from last year. Yeah,
Speaker 1: at the end of end of February, our book endo
Speaker 1: was up sevent over last year at the same time.
Speaker 1: And last year was a good year. Last year was
Speaker 1: a good year. And uh, you know today, UM, a
Speaker 1: lot of this is big groups, corporate groups that were
Speaker 1: expecting to lose some of them just because a lot
Speaker 1: of them flying in from all over different states. We
Speaker 1: don't expect that to happen. Uh, do we know how
Speaker 1: much we're gonna lose. No, we don't. Um, we just
Speaker 1: have no idea and it's Tom. Tom will tell um
Speaker 1: what the end results it's gonna be. I mean, we're
Speaker 1: gonna be prepared, We're gonna be ready, We're gonna have
Speaker 1: the course machen, We're gonna put in every safety percaution
Speaker 1: we can. Uh. I feel like you're golf in northern Michigan.
Speaker 1: I mean we're sitting on guarteen hundred acres in the
Speaker 1: middle of eight hundred thousand acre National Forest. I wish
Speaker 1: I was there today instead of where I'm at today.
Speaker 1: I can't think of a safer place I'd rather be
Speaker 1: than not there. Uh. And if we put in all
Speaker 1: the practical things that we should do to help, you know,
Speaker 1: come back this virus potential, Um, you know, we could
Speaker 1: have a good year. John. How much? How much longer
Speaker 1: can you can you? Si? Dana? And are you getting
Speaker 1: help from the City of Oceanside? Are you able to
Speaker 1: apply for some of of what's being offered in terms of, uh,
Speaker 1: you know, support for small businesses and how is that going?
Speaker 1: Not at the moment, no help from the city. And
Speaker 1: uh having a tough time getting the payroll protection program
Speaker 1: in place with my bank anyway, So that's been very frustrating. Um.
Speaker 1: You know, I'm hoping to see us back up and
Speaker 1: going as soon as possible, but I'm kind of gearing
Speaker 1: for June one for some reason. Um, and we should
Speaker 1: will be all right. Uh, you know, if it goes
Speaker 1: much longer than let's say, July, it's not looking real good.
Speaker 1: I have to figure out some sort of creative financing
Speaker 1: just to you know, pull things together. But you know,
Speaker 1: we'll figure it out. You know, I'm an optimist, you know,
Speaker 1: I know this thing is tough on everybody, but I
Speaker 1: know that golf is h It's such an important game
Speaker 1: to so many people, and it is resilient, and it's
Speaker 1: going to be part of the healing process once we
Speaker 1: do get back and be able to go outside and
Speaker 1: and sort of interact with people once again. So it's
Speaker 1: a very important game to society and to humanity. Uh
Speaker 1: So we just all have to band together and pull
Speaker 1: through this thing. Passion In terms of getting creative, I
Speaker 1: know you you guys, you got creative, created an online
Speaker 1: auction and raised over three hundred thousand dollars for your employees.
Speaker 1: Talk a little bit about that and how that you know,
Speaker 1: what came of that, and now where is that? Where's
Speaker 1: that going? Yeah? That was that was a lot of fun.
Speaker 1: That was a bright light when things were pretty dark
Speaker 1: around us um started out. You know, it got very
Speaker 1: personal when we had to say hopefully a temporary goodbye
Speaker 1: to a lot of our employees. So so necessity got
Speaker 1: our minds churning, and on a whim, we threw up
Speaker 1: some t times on course number two on on our
Speaker 1: Facebook page to have a little auction, twenty four hour
Speaker 1: auction and see if people would would buy them, with
Speaker 1: the proceeds going to help employees. And and you know,
Speaker 1: a couple of people paid a thousand dollars for a
Speaker 1: forsome on number two, and so the lightbulb went off.
Speaker 1: While we've got an opportunity here to do something really neat,
Speaker 1: and so we we began brainstorming. He's once in a
Speaker 1: lifetime Pinehurs experiences that we wanted to auction off. Um.
Speaker 1: We did things like a weekend stay in the Donald
Speaker 1: Ross cottage, dorn At Cottage with three rounds of golf.
Speaker 1: We we were inspired by by Riggs escape to Pinehurst,
Speaker 1: and we put together a package where you could pay
Speaker 1: play all ten courses over six nights. Um, we put
Speaker 1: together something this was great. Gil Hants agreed to come
Speaker 1: and play pine ER's number four, the course he redesigned
Speaker 1: with a forsome. Bill Core agreed to walk pine ER's
Speaker 1: number two with a forsome and explain the architectural details
Speaker 1: that Donald Ross put together. So just we we have
Speaker 1: our brewer, our head brewer is gonna co cobrew a
Speaker 1: beer with someone who auctioned or bid on this auction item,
Speaker 1: so really neat unique experiences specific to Pinehurst, the Dorknet cottage,
Speaker 1: for instance, Donald Ross's house sold for dollars. So one,
Speaker 1: it was great fun to put these items together too.
Speaker 1: It was great to see the generosity of people what
Speaker 1: they were willing to do to help the little guy,
Speaker 1: to help our employees who are in in great need.
Speaker 1: And and three the creativity of of what we were
Speaker 1: able to put together with so much fun. So we
Speaker 1: we have extended healthcare coverage for all of our employees
Speaker 1: through the month of May. Originally we were gonna we
Speaker 1: were gonna get through April and decide. Now we can
Speaker 1: tell them they're they're covered through the end of May.
Speaker 1: Um we're delivering care packages to our employees once a week.
Speaker 1: They come by the hotel and we're giving them food
Speaker 1: and essentials, and we really been able to supplement those efforts.
Speaker 1: UH This past week we we gave Little UH an
Speaker 1: Easter meal and some Easter egg decorating supplies and it
Speaker 1: was neat to see our employees use those. And then
Speaker 1: we have an employee Relief Fund where employees and the
Speaker 1: greatest need can go to their fellow employees who control
Speaker 1: a pool of resources and they make grants and gifts
Speaker 1: and are helping people. So, like I said, it was
Speaker 1: a bright light during a time of great darkness. And
Speaker 1: more than anything, it reminded us that our employees are
Speaker 1: are the reason people come to Pinehers. Yeah, they're nine
Speaker 1: golf courses in great hotels, but its their interactions with
Speaker 1: our staff that are become lifetime memories. And it was
Speaker 1: great to see people step up the way that they
Speaker 1: did to support our folks when we need them. I know.
Speaker 1: You know, caddies is something that's that's brought up a
Speaker 1: lot independent contractors. Obviously pineheers for students a lot of
Speaker 1: courses in Ireland as you know, junior caddy academies. But
Speaker 1: then you go Josh to Abandon and stream Song and
Speaker 1: some of these, some of these places you know, and
Speaker 1: people say, oh what you know, I got feedback like
Speaker 1: I don't give a ship. You know, what do I
Speaker 1: care about caddies? Well, what we care about caddies is
Speaker 1: as much as we care about anybody out there. They
Speaker 1: they've moved to an area there, they work their asses off,
Speaker 1: they enhance an experience and it just happens to be
Speaker 1: not unlike getting your haircut. It's a it's a very
Speaker 1: it's a very intimate relationship that you have with said
Speaker 1: golfer as a caddy, exchanging clubs and carrying clubs and
Speaker 1: you know, reading putts. Where do where do caddies fit
Speaker 1: in all this? I know a caddy fund to start
Speaker 1: a bandon Duns that's raised over a hundred thousand dollars
Speaker 1: right now, how do you handle and manage that? Josh?
Speaker 1: You know, people, people may originally come to Pinehurst and
Speaker 1: places like Bandon and Sand Valley and stream Song for
Speaker 1: and and forest dunes of course, you know, for for
Speaker 1: the golf courses. But the reason they come back is
Speaker 1: the people, the relationships they build. And nobody spends more
Speaker 1: time with the customers than the caddies. So while they
Speaker 1: you know, are not not employees, um, they're hired by
Speaker 1: the golfers, and there are like lifelong relationships that are
Speaker 1: made between golfers and their caddies. Our golfers keep more
Speaker 1: in touch with our caddies then than anyone. You know,
Speaker 1: this is there, this is their point of contact at
Speaker 1: the resort. They have personal relationships with them that go
Speaker 1: beyond just caddying. UM. So they're they're really a vital
Speaker 1: part of our game, um where where they're used at
Speaker 1: the at the resorts, at the clubs that have caddies
Speaker 1: are just just a vital part of the game. So
Speaker 1: I think, you know, seeing certainly you know, Pine Hursts
Speaker 1: has been a leader and what they can do for
Speaker 1: raising money. The band and Dunes caddies really started their
Speaker 1: own fund because they started it because a lot of
Speaker 1: customers reached out to them and said, you know, how
Speaker 1: can we best give money? So, uh, they partnered with
Speaker 1: a local five oh one c three abandoned so that
Speaker 1: the money that's given can be tax deductible for people.
Speaker 1: And like you said, I mean in the first day,
Speaker 1: I think they're up to a hundred and fifty thousand
Speaker 1: yesterday was maybe the first day or the day before,
Speaker 1: and have raised up two hundred and fifty thousand bucks
Speaker 1: to be spread amongst the you know, three hundred or
Speaker 1: so caddies. And you know, um, there's a lot of
Speaker 1: people in the Gulf business, whether they're hourly staff or
Speaker 1: caddies that may live more on a on a paycheck
Speaker 1: to paycheck or loop to loop basis, and when that
Speaker 1: goes away, you know, hopefully they've been great squirrels and
Speaker 1: have stocked some money away. But but how long can
Speaker 1: that really, Like, how long can you expect someone to last?
Speaker 1: These are hardworking people that are so vital to our
Speaker 1: experiences and so vital to our game. You can't expect
Speaker 1: them to have three, four or five six months of
Speaker 1: living expenses saved up. Some of these people have families,
Speaker 1: and and so I think you just kind of have
Speaker 1: to do your best and try and support these things,
Speaker 1: like the Bandoned Caddy Fund, like the Pinehers Fund. I
Speaker 1: know the Outpost Club has something called the Outpost Foundation
Speaker 1: raising money for caddies and locker room attendance and people
Speaker 1: that live you know, great on tips um. So, as usual,
Speaker 1: the golf industry is filled with a lot of great people,
Speaker 1: and there's a lot of great ideas, and there there's
Speaker 1: people that want to help other people in this industry,
Speaker 1: and so I think we all need to support those
Speaker 1: as best we can. Marty, it feels like we just
Speaker 1: had clear, you know, just had sort of really put
Speaker 1: two thousand two nine in the rear view mirror, and then,
Speaker 1: as you said, overnight we're right back in the thick
Speaker 1: of it. And even if not worse? Is um Is
Speaker 1: there anything? You know? National Golf Foundations is for the
Speaker 1: percent of golf courses right now are open, four up
Speaker 1: from last week. A lot of people are quick to
Speaker 1: say golf is dead, Golf is dying, Golf doesn't make
Speaker 1: any sense, and yet it's so much more resilient and
Speaker 1: so much more, so much tougher than we get a
Speaker 1: credit for. Is that your sense from where you sit
Speaker 1: in Ireland maintaining that sense of positive outlook? Yeah, I
Speaker 1: would actually say that. You know, we kind of call
Speaker 1: it the Green Jersey Brigade and after two you know,
Speaker 1: Ireland got absolutely it's very very hard the last prosession
Speaker 1: and we have to nationalize the bank debt and and
Speaker 1: it was it was a horror show. So you know,
Speaker 1: the IRISHIP have been used to struggles over the years.
Speaker 1: I think everybody's come together and it's a Green Jersey
Speaker 1: brigade and I think this is the honeymoon period because
Speaker 1: subsidies that are in that flowed through much quicker than
Speaker 1: than John had had a line too. It's been run
Speaker 1: by the revenue over here, so you know we're getting
Speaker 1: sevent support for anybody under thirty seven thousand for twelve weeks,
Speaker 1: and that stays the decisions to some of the really
Speaker 1: hard decisions that need to be made on employees. Social
Speaker 1: distancing is here to stay in about what anybody says,
Speaker 1: and it's a lot longer than thirty sixty nine days.
Speaker 1: People are going to be staying clear of crowded spaces.
Speaker 1: So I think Gold probably will be a winner. And
Speaker 1: I think it's up to all of us to really
Speaker 1: make sure that when when it does open over here.
Speaker 1: What I've been warned is that everybody's got to get
Speaker 1: on board because if if one or two people mess
Speaker 1: around and don't apply by the rules, then they'll shut
Speaker 1: everybody down. Final thoughts loop. No, everyone still needs to
Speaker 1: help support the golf industry, and I think it's good
Speaker 1: for people to get out. Uh and you know, we
Speaker 1: might have a good season. People have been stuck in
Speaker 1: for three months. You know, get some exercise, go play golf,
Speaker 1: take up golf, get your grandkids, get your brother, will
Speaker 1: spend a day working on the golf course. Uh. That
Speaker 1: would help the golf industry better than anyone anything else
Speaker 1: that could happen. It's getting more people involved in golf
Speaker 1: and getting outside and enjoying ourself or a change, John,
Speaker 1: that that would help the soul industry, right, that whole
Speaker 1: industry of our soul. Right. That was that's the point
Speaker 1: you've always made, Right, It's going to be important to
Speaker 1: uh on the whole healing process. I think of coming
Speaker 1: out of this thing, and I think people are gonna
Speaker 1: have a lot better attitude and just a different perspective
Speaker 1: on having the freedom to actually play golf. You know.
Speaker 1: I think that's gonna be Uh, It's gonna be a
Speaker 1: liberating experience once people can come out back out to
Speaker 1: the golf course. Any message out there to other municipals
Speaker 1: like yourself, you know, hang in there and put your
Speaker 1: arms around the community and really you know, sort of
Speaker 1: bring them in, bring them into the process somehow create
Speaker 1: you know, so they feel they feel ownership into what
Speaker 1: you know, what what there is for the community. You know,
Speaker 1: it's it's a it's an important gathering point. It's it
Speaker 1: should be the center of more communities, to be honest
Speaker 1: with you, golf courses, I guess past plant some flowers, right,
Speaker 1: get ready, Matt. I'd tell you know, we we may
Speaker 1: have gotten a little so we we had, like Lou
Speaker 1: we were pacing to be well ahead of last year.
Speaker 1: Last year was a record, and I maybe we were
Speaker 1: beginning to take our success a little bit for granted.
Speaker 1: And where I when I think about what I'm gonna
Speaker 1: do when I see that first, you know, ate some
Speaker 1: of folks on a buddy's trip walking up the brick
Speaker 1: path to the clubhouse, I'm gonna be so thankful, you know,
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna just on my way to the next destination.
Speaker 1: I'm going to be thankful that they're here. You'll violate
Speaker 1: all social distancing just to you. Just whatever we do,
Speaker 1: keep Riggs away from a William Jesus. But I hope
Speaker 1: were beginning to appreciate the little things again. You know.
Speaker 1: I think we're going to be thankful for what we
Speaker 1: do have and and that feeling will last, hopefully for
Speaker 1: a long time. Josh, he Are you guys learning something
Speaker 1: every day from the feedback you're getting and the reflections
Speaker 1: you're making as a company and the on the on
Speaker 1: the wide you know sort of birth of what you
Speaker 1: you know, sort of the wide range of facilities. Are
Speaker 1: you guys, just are you guys also taking some time
Speaker 1: to kind of think about how it's going to change
Speaker 1: your business forever. Yeah, I mean, there's no doubt I think.
Speaker 1: I mean, we're so fortunate we have got the most
Speaker 1: talented management team. I'm talking about our company, Kemper Sports,
Speaker 1: led by our CEO, Steve Skinner, who is I mean,
Speaker 1: as sort of as Tom's alluding to, we're working harder
Speaker 1: now than ever on behalf of our clients and our
Speaker 1: customers to figure out what this is going to look
Speaker 1: like going forward, because, as Marty alluded to, you know,
Speaker 1: golf may reopen, but the new normal there may you know,
Speaker 1: are there going to be those big Monday corporate outings.
Speaker 1: Are there going to be wet You know a lot
Speaker 1: of these golf courses rely on other things other than
Speaker 1: just daily fee golf and big occasions and social gatherings
Speaker 1: and weddings, and that part of the business is gonna
Speaker 1: be different for a long time, maybe this whole year
Speaker 1: and maybe in the next year. And and so thankfully
Speaker 1: we're led by this brilliant management team. They're learning every day,
Speaker 1: working hard to help our clients through this and uh
Speaker 1: and hopefully, you know, on the other side, we're all
Speaker 1: going to be stronger for it. Marty, Um any any
Speaker 1: words of wisdom you've seen it all. You've been in
Speaker 1: the golf industry your whole life. You're born into a
Speaker 1: into a push cart, probably into a carry bag. I guess,
Speaker 1: m you know, what do you got for us, buddy,
Speaker 1: Give us some I wasn't. I thought we were on
Speaker 1: the home run in to play a lot of golf,
Speaker 1: and the just kind of said me retired out of Waterville.
Speaker 1: But I guess it's one last lap of the track
Speaker 1: care before we do that. I think, Look, I think
Speaker 1: at the end of the day, sometimes when you're in
Speaker 1: the middle of the woods, it's very hard to see
Speaker 1: out through the trees. But look, I think we will
Speaker 1: come through it. I think I think it's six months
Speaker 1: we'll be looking at this in the rear view mirror.
Speaker 1: And I think, as as Josh, and it is a wig,
Speaker 1: of course, I think it's there's a lot of things
Speaker 1: that you know. My biggest trill every day now is
Speaker 1: cycling two and a half kilometers and go for a
Speaker 1: swim in the sea every day and I just love it.
Speaker 1: And so I think I think, I think it's back
Speaker 1: to the simple things in life. And I think are
Speaker 1: resident Budge. I think we're very lucky to be in
Speaker 1: the industry. We're in him, and I think a fraternity
Speaker 1: of golf will prevail um and I just can't wait
Speaker 1: to raise that first point of Guinness down the water
Speaker 1: when they let me out of the home arrest. This
Speaker 1: is the fire pit. And I've actually had the pleasure
Speaker 1: of being at a fire pit with everybody on this call,
Speaker 1: and in some cases at one time. Which is which
Speaker 1: is you know, lucky me? But actually we know your
Speaker 1: favorite fire pit, as you told us an episode one
Speaker 1: of this podcast, is at goat Hill Park right there
Speaker 1: off the first he I'd give anything to be there
Speaker 1: right now, one of those Irish guinnesses and and being
Speaker 1: surrounded by you guys. But lou what, what's your favorite
Speaker 1: fire pit? Well, Matton, four students have several fire pits
Speaker 1: were enjoyable to me. And you go up to a
Speaker 1: group of twenty guys from Ohau or Indiana or New
Speaker 1: York that's never been to a poor students and set
Speaker 1: around and visit with feel and get to do them.
Speaker 1: This is gonna be a hard problem for me this year.
Speaker 1: I try to shake a d hands to day when
Speaker 1: I'm at four students. That's gonna be a little problem
Speaker 1: this year. I don't. Yeah, do the elbow bob yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: the knuckle throw, you know, just throw. We're sitting here,
Speaker 1: you know, talking about our sympathy. We don't need to
Speaker 1: forget all the people who has lost loved once because
Speaker 1: of this virus. And uh, you know, we really feel
Speaker 1: for all these people and so unfortunate that it's affected
Speaker 1: so many people's lives that ever shaped form of the
Speaker 1: country in the world. Yeah, and and the doctors and
Speaker 1: nurses and first responders. It goes you know, really, it
Speaker 1: doesn't go without saying, because it's always worth saying, especially now.
Speaker 1: And you see these images and I can't I can't imagine. Obviously,
Speaker 1: I can't even come close. Um pass um favorite fire pit,
Speaker 1: some someplace you love to put yourself in when you're
Speaker 1: and your deepest and darkest moments. There's a there's a
Speaker 1: really nice one right behind Dornet Cottage, um Donald Ross's home.
Speaker 1: You get a view of the Third Green. I get
Speaker 1: a feeling maybe right before we reopened, we'll we'll we'll
Speaker 1: spend some time there and like like Marty said, hopefully
Speaker 1: six months from now we're all looking back on this
Speaker 1: and shaking our heads and thankful that we got through it,
Speaker 1: but I could see having a little bit of introspection
Speaker 1: there and Ross, I'm sure faced some adversity while while
Speaker 1: he was here he didn't have the firepit. We just
Speaker 1: put it in. But I'm probably gonna find myself there. Yeah,
Speaker 1: Marty favorite fire pit, Well, we're building one in Waterville
Speaker 1: outside a little sheep being at the back of a
Speaker 1: little golf lodge. But what happened not sat around at
Speaker 1: episode U in set was has actually golfling something quig
Speaker 1: on the water and I've spent many a night there
Speaker 1: and it's it's it's that's when all the stories and
Speaker 1: the suns and all the bullshit is it's flowing, so
Speaker 1: that would be the one for me. Josh Um, you
Speaker 1: make a good fire pit. I know you up like
Speaker 1: seven Bayard. I have to say, it's a it's a
Speaker 1: special skill of mine and something I love to do.
Speaker 1: And I think, you know, maybe there's so many I love,
Speaker 1: But the fact of the matter is, you know, it's
Speaker 1: it's not always where you are, it's who you're with.
Speaker 1: And and one of the small silver linings about this
Speaker 1: stay at home order and we're all or as Marty
Speaker 1: culls it, house. The rest is getting a little bit
Speaker 1: more time with family, and um, I should say a
Speaker 1: lot more time with family. And it's pretty special because
Speaker 1: we're all running in different directions. You know, things maybe
Speaker 1: on a little different budget right now, but you still
Speaker 1: have the time with your family and that can be
Speaker 1: really special. Um. So it's really who you're with. I
Speaker 1: mean the fire pits I've been around with you guys.
Speaker 1: Obviously abandoned dunes is uh, that's my favorite place on earth,
Speaker 1: no doubt. But just being in my backyard with my
Speaker 1: kids around the fire pits pretty special. Alright, One last thing, Marty,
Speaker 1: give us a good joke, Get us out of here
Speaker 1: with a laugh, give us somewhere. If we are around
Speaker 1: the fire pit, we always turned to the best joke telling.
Speaker 1: Now Thompson's like one of the greatest storytellers I've ever heard,
Speaker 1: and as she's got a good laugh. But Marty, you're
Speaker 1: you're like the best joke teller known demand kind. So
Speaker 1: hit us. Hit us with a good one, would you please?
Speaker 1: About what about how kosher does it need to be? Well,
Speaker 1: it's a podcast and we're around the fire pits, so
Speaker 1: you know, you can all use a really good laugh.
Speaker 1: Give us one the one about along those long tail,
Speaker 1: short legged, hard back, doubling fighting dog. I'll try to
Speaker 1: keep it very sure. That's about these two guys. They
Speaker 1: go into an Irish pub and this guy is pretty
Speaker 1: hammered and he's sitting at the bar and the barman
Speaker 1: comes over and he knocks it laughs off the bar,
Speaker 1: and before it reaches the ground, this dog he has
Speaker 1: with them grabs the glass and swallows the choosing a
Speaker 1: swallows at home and he looks over the bar of
Speaker 1: the barman and he sees this. He's what one of
Speaker 1: a dog is that? He said, it's a long noticed,
Speaker 1: long tail, short legged, hard back, doubling fighting dog. Jesus.
Speaker 1: So anyway, he has a chat with his brother and
Speaker 1: he comes over. So I tell you, I'll bention the
Speaker 1: knights Takens. We have a we have a kerry blue
Speaker 1: out the back that will take that joke on and
Speaker 1: we'll have a we'll have a fight. So he said,
Speaker 1: it's a fighting dog. We'll have a fight out the
Speaker 1: back with the two dogs. So the hole the patrons,
Speaker 1: they emptied the tail. They bet that the Knights Takings.
Speaker 1: They go out the back and they get the carry
Speaker 1: blue out of the shed and they pet the carry
Speaker 1: Blue and they blow a whistle and all the bets
Speaker 1: are riding and outgoes to carry Blue, and it runs
Speaker 1: towards the long noose, long tail, short legged, hard back
Speaker 1: doun and fighting dog. And along those long tails, short
Speaker 1: thick and hard fact double and fight dog snaps his
Speaker 1: neck off. The capitates to carry Blue, and the two
Speaker 1: lads are devastated. And they woke up and they said, look,
Speaker 1: we've been raising fighting dogs on our eyes. But what's
Speaker 1: one of the dog is that? He said, it's a
Speaker 1: long nose, long tailed, short legged, hard back doubling fighting dog.
Speaker 1: In some countries they call them crocodiles. It sounds better.
Speaker 1: It sounds better around the fire pit. I love you guys.
Speaker 1: I appreciate, appreciate your time and perspective. Obviously, um you
Speaker 1: know when we say we are all in this together,
Speaker 1: that that goes so far beyond golf and and our lives,
Speaker 1: and it goes it goes global, right, So appreciate you
Speaker 1: guys and what you do and how you do it.
Speaker 1: And I hope to be around a real fire pit
Speaker 1: in the near future. And when we do, um, well,
Speaker 1: those long nose, long tailed bubble Pact short thing and
Speaker 1: we'll raise one Irish Guinness Chairs Chairs. Guys, thank you
Speaker 1: for listening to the the fire Pit. To support the band
Speaker 1: and caddies, go to go fund me dot com and
Speaker 1: search Bandoned Caddy Relief Fund. To support the Outpost Club's charity,
Speaker 1: go to Outpost Foundation dot org and be sure to
Speaker 1: follow my social animals as we're posting a live auction
Speaker 1: which will include items donated by all of my guests
Speaker 1: on the show, and it will benefit Feeding America, the
Speaker 1: nation's largest domestic hunger relief organization. This podcast is produced
Speaker 1: by Alex Upeggy, edited by Rex Lint. Theme song by
Speaker 1: Joe Horowitz. Please rate and review on Apple Podcasts and
Speaker 1: you might find your review featured in a future episode.
Speaker 1: Got a question, comment, or a story for us to
Speaker 1: track down. You can find me on Twitter at Matt
Speaker 1: Janella or on Instagram at Matt Underscore Janella