1 00:00:08,039 --> 00:00:13,160 Speaker 1: Y'all welcome to the crime round up, and today I 2 00:00:13,240 --> 00:00:16,959 Speaker 1: have got a legal question for miss Nancy Gray. Good morning, honey, 3 00:00:17,000 --> 00:00:17,400 Speaker 1: how are you. 4 00:00:17,880 --> 00:00:20,720 Speaker 2: I'm angry. I want justice the same. 5 00:00:21,040 --> 00:00:26,360 Speaker 1: That's a beautiful start to your day. I'm angry. Hey, listen, 6 00:00:26,480 --> 00:00:31,639 Speaker 1: here's my question regarding the Alexander brothers. I know the 7 00:00:31,760 --> 00:00:35,160 Speaker 1: judge throughout one case because he said the victim didn't 8 00:00:35,159 --> 00:00:39,600 Speaker 1: file in the right amount of time. Can the prosecution 9 00:00:39,960 --> 00:00:45,920 Speaker 1: still use her to show similar transaction? Can she still testify? Yes. 10 00:00:46,240 --> 00:00:49,080 Speaker 2: I've had defense attorneys argue when I would try to 11 00:00:49,120 --> 00:00:52,199 Speaker 2: bring in a similar transaction, Oh, it's too old. That 12 00:00:52,360 --> 00:00:55,640 Speaker 2: is not necessarily a requirement in very many jurisdictions. Some 13 00:00:55,760 --> 00:00:58,080 Speaker 2: jurisdictions do want it to be within the last let's 14 00:00:58,120 --> 00:01:02,680 Speaker 2: say ten years. Not every jurisdiction and not most jurisdictions. 15 00:01:03,080 --> 00:01:06,600 Speaker 2: Because my response to that is, oh, so it didn't happen. 16 00:01:07,160 --> 00:01:10,080 Speaker 2: It didn't happen. It just shows he's had all these 17 00:01:10,200 --> 00:01:13,679 Speaker 2: years doing the same thing to perfect his mo motus 18 00:01:13,720 --> 00:01:18,120 Speaker 2: our BRENDI met of operation. So long story short, while 19 00:01:18,240 --> 00:01:24,360 Speaker 2: a similar, as we call it, similar transaction may not 20 00:01:24,800 --> 00:01:30,040 Speaker 2: be prosecuted because it's pasted the Statute of limitations. For instance, 21 00:01:31,200 --> 00:01:34,880 Speaker 2: here's ago one. There's pretty short statues on civil cases, 22 00:01:35,040 --> 00:01:37,560 Speaker 2: like if some guide bangs into you in the grocery 23 00:01:37,560 --> 00:01:41,280 Speaker 2: store parking lot, you have somewhere between two five years 24 00:01:41,360 --> 00:01:44,480 Speaker 2: to see Okay, If you don't, it's over. That's so 25 00:01:44,800 --> 00:01:48,160 Speaker 2: the respondent, you're the planet. The respondent does it goe 26 00:01:48,240 --> 00:01:52,720 Speaker 2: their whole life looking over their shoulder. There you go. Now, 27 00:01:52,840 --> 00:01:55,600 Speaker 2: same thing in criminal cases, you have a statue of limitation. 28 00:01:55,680 --> 00:01:58,160 Speaker 2: Now here's micro question. And I'm going to find out 29 00:01:58,360 --> 00:02:00,960 Speaker 2: before we cover this again, because it just occurred to 30 00:02:01,000 --> 00:02:04,920 Speaker 2: me as we were talking, you know, after me too, 31 00:02:06,160 --> 00:02:11,400 Speaker 2: in other words, why stain right? A lot of much 32 00:02:11,520 --> 00:02:17,239 Speaker 2: was made of statutes being told t o l L 33 00:02:17,720 --> 00:02:23,959 Speaker 2: ed like a toll on a highway, in other words, postponed. 34 00:02:24,840 --> 00:02:31,160 Speaker 2: Some statutes are told based on certain circumstances. For instance, 35 00:02:31,400 --> 00:02:34,960 Speaker 2: if the victim couldn't speak out, if the victim had 36 00:02:34,960 --> 00:02:37,600 Speaker 2: repressed the memory of just a lot of reasons, it 37 00:02:37,639 --> 00:02:40,760 Speaker 2: could be told. And I'm just wondering if any of 38 00:02:40,760 --> 00:02:46,480 Speaker 2: the me too statutes could possibly be an effect in 39 00:02:46,520 --> 00:02:50,600 Speaker 2: that jurisdiction. I'm going to find that out, and I 40 00:02:50,600 --> 00:02:52,480 Speaker 2: will let you know we discussed it I'm just trying 41 00:02:52,480 --> 00:02:55,560 Speaker 2: to think of ways to get around that statute running 42 00:02:55,560 --> 00:02:59,480 Speaker 2: on the one victim that I know of that the 43 00:02:59,560 --> 00:03:01,720 Speaker 2: judge out, and the judge had to throw it out. 44 00:03:02,080 --> 00:03:03,560 Speaker 2: And I'll tell you why the judge had to throw 45 00:03:03,600 --> 00:03:06,480 Speaker 2: it out. If the judge had not funded it out. 46 00:03:06,560 --> 00:03:09,519 Speaker 2: It was District Court Judge Lewis Caplin, Southern District in 47 00:03:09,560 --> 00:03:13,760 Speaker 2: New York. The accusation was by Angela Parker. If the 48 00:03:13,840 --> 00:03:17,080 Speaker 2: judge had not funded out and it went forward, this 49 00:03:17,160 --> 00:03:19,799 Speaker 2: is a civil lawsuit, and for it to have gone forward, 50 00:03:19,840 --> 00:03:24,120 Speaker 2: it would have to have happened after June eighteen, twenty seventeen. 51 00:03:24,680 --> 00:03:28,680 Speaker 2: If he had not throwned it out and they tried 52 00:03:28,720 --> 00:03:31,240 Speaker 2: the case, it would have been reversed on appeal for 53 00:03:31,440 --> 00:03:36,000 Speaker 2: this very reason. Okay, So that's why I mean. It 54 00:03:36,120 --> 00:03:38,200 Speaker 2: was do it now or have a trial, and it 55 00:03:38,240 --> 00:03:42,760 Speaker 2: gets reversed. So there you go. That's what happened. 56 00:03:42,960 --> 00:03:46,200 Speaker 1: Watching you all those years again. When you start to 57 00:03:46,200 --> 00:03:49,720 Speaker 1: tell a story, Nancy, which you could do better than 58 00:03:49,760 --> 00:03:53,520 Speaker 1: anybody else. Even if it was something that you could 59 00:03:53,560 --> 00:03:57,800 Speaker 1: not use in this particular case to charge somebody, you 60 00:03:57,840 --> 00:04:01,520 Speaker 1: could still bring him in. Just show this this person 61 00:04:01,600 --> 00:04:04,960 Speaker 1: has not been violent for five years. He hasn't been 62 00:04:05,000 --> 00:04:10,080 Speaker 1: violid for ten years. He's been violent for twenty years. 63 00:04:10,600 --> 00:04:13,320 Speaker 1: And I think that's so powerful for the jury. 64 00:04:13,680 --> 00:04:17,599 Speaker 2: Here's another thing sometimes, and I'd have to do research 65 00:04:17,680 --> 00:04:22,040 Speaker 2: to find it out. If I saw a defendant committed 66 00:04:22,080 --> 00:04:24,040 Speaker 2: violent crime, let's say rape, and then there was a 67 00:04:24,120 --> 00:04:26,640 Speaker 2: lull for say five or seven years, I didn't see anything. 68 00:04:27,360 --> 00:04:30,520 Speaker 2: A lot of times they'd have been in jail, Okay, right, 69 00:04:30,720 --> 00:04:32,719 Speaker 2: you have to find out where were they during that? 70 00:04:32,920 --> 00:04:35,800 Speaker 2: Did they move to a jurisdiction, another jurisdiction and I 71 00:04:35,839 --> 00:04:37,719 Speaker 2: don't know about it. Are their rapes there? 72 00:04:38,040 --> 00:04:38,240 Speaker 1: Good? 73 00:04:38,320 --> 00:04:40,880 Speaker 2: Because I'll find them and they'll be similar transactions too, 74 00:04:41,320 --> 00:04:45,000 Speaker 2: exactly right, if you know there was some reason, and 75 00:04:45,080 --> 00:04:47,240 Speaker 2: sometimes I find out they had actually been in jail. 76 00:04:47,240 --> 00:04:48,679 Speaker 2: In the minute they get out, they do it again. 77 00:04:49,040 --> 00:04:53,320 Speaker 1: Correct. We were just talking about the Britney Drexel case yesterday. 78 00:04:53,800 --> 00:04:56,560 Speaker 1: That's one of those things that happened. He was in prison, 79 00:04:57,040 --> 00:04:59,960 Speaker 1: so of course there's a void where he's not committing crime. 80 00:05:00,640 --> 00:05:02,400 Speaker 1: Then as soon as he gets out and it gets 81 00:05:02,400 --> 00:05:05,400 Speaker 1: off parole, there you go, he's going to start right 82 00:05:05,440 --> 00:05:08,800 Speaker 1: back up. Raven Moody. So that's important and I think 83 00:05:08,839 --> 00:05:13,000 Speaker 1: it's great that we now have that understanding. So watching 84 00:05:13,040 --> 00:05:16,600 Speaker 1: this trial, we've got ten victims right now, but that 85 00:05:16,680 --> 00:05:19,600 Speaker 1: number could and I would not be surprised at all 86 00:05:19,680 --> 00:05:20,400 Speaker 1: if it went up. 87 00:05:20,800 --> 00:05:24,239 Speaker 2: You know, in that case, Britney tracks just seventeen, that's 88 00:05:24,400 --> 00:05:27,760 Speaker 2: the age of the twins, and the killer says he 89 00:05:27,800 --> 00:05:32,279 Speaker 2: and his girlfriend were quote hunting for a victim the 90 00:05:32,440 --> 00:05:35,600 Speaker 2: night he killed Britney. It's just, you know, it's hard 91 00:05:35,640 --> 00:05:42,560 Speaker 2: to imagine people like that are walking amongst us, because, 92 00:05:42,680 --> 00:05:44,839 Speaker 2: you know, Cheryl, I grew up in the middle of nowhere, 93 00:05:45,600 --> 00:05:47,640 Speaker 2: as I've said, on a red dirt road. And one 94 00:05:47,680 --> 00:05:50,320 Speaker 2: time David Lynch shut up. David tried to correct me, 95 00:05:50,400 --> 00:05:53,359 Speaker 2: said the road was paved. I'm like, yeah, when I 96 00:05:53,400 --> 00:05:57,080 Speaker 2: met you, it was paved by then by the time 97 00:05:57,120 --> 00:05:59,400 Speaker 2: I was in college and did get paid. That's true. 98 00:05:59,720 --> 00:06:02,760 Speaker 2: But I grew up on a red, muddy, muddy I 99 00:06:02,839 --> 00:06:05,600 Speaker 2: might add, dirt road, and a big tree was growing 100 00:06:05,680 --> 00:06:06,960 Speaker 2: up in the middle of it, right in front of 101 00:06:06,960 --> 00:06:09,680 Speaker 2: our house, in the middle of the road. For kidding 102 00:06:09,680 --> 00:06:13,000 Speaker 2: about that. But I couldn't have had a better childhood, 103 00:06:13,320 --> 00:06:15,280 Speaker 2: you know. I had a working mom or working dad, 104 00:06:15,320 --> 00:06:18,200 Speaker 2: and my dad worked all sorts of crazy shifts for 105 00:06:18,200 --> 00:06:21,760 Speaker 2: the railroad. But we were very, very loved. I didn't 106 00:06:21,760 --> 00:06:26,560 Speaker 2: know we were poort, just like everybody else. And we 107 00:06:26,600 --> 00:06:29,680 Speaker 2: always had amazing food on the table that my mom 108 00:06:29,680 --> 00:06:33,400 Speaker 2: would cook. And I loved her church and I loved 109 00:06:33,400 --> 00:06:37,040 Speaker 2: her school. I mean, we could. I could, as I've 110 00:06:37,040 --> 00:06:43,520 Speaker 2: told you, ride my bike, my blue bike, un till 111 00:06:43,920 --> 00:06:48,400 Speaker 2: we would here literally hear the hymns in the church 112 00:06:48,560 --> 00:06:52,920 Speaker 2: at our Methodist church, people the chimes, God will take 113 00:06:52,960 --> 00:06:55,440 Speaker 2: care of you, Rock of Ages, his eyes on the spirit. 114 00:06:56,000 --> 00:06:57,880 Speaker 2: And then when we got to go home, cyber supper, 115 00:06:58,760 --> 00:07:03,520 Speaker 2: and that was fine, It was completely fine. And I 116 00:07:03,560 --> 00:07:11,800 Speaker 2: had no idea that people like Britney Drexel's killers even existed. 117 00:07:11,840 --> 00:07:15,440 Speaker 2: I knew nothing about that, you know, Yeah, I didn't 118 00:07:15,480 --> 00:07:20,000 Speaker 2: know anything was different anywhere else. And when I read about, 119 00:07:20,640 --> 00:07:26,400 Speaker 2: for instance, Britney Drexel, that these freaks Raymond Moody and 120 00:07:26,880 --> 00:07:32,360 Speaker 2: Angel Cooper Vows were out hunting a victim. I mean, 121 00:07:33,240 --> 00:07:36,560 Speaker 2: and I think most people are like me and that 122 00:07:36,560 --> 00:07:38,920 Speaker 2: that this is alien to them and they shouldn't know 123 00:07:38,960 --> 00:07:40,800 Speaker 2: about it, It should not be part of their lives. 124 00:07:41,320 --> 00:07:43,960 Speaker 1: I can't agree more. And the devil in this whole 125 00:07:44,000 --> 00:07:48,240 Speaker 1: thing to me is when you've got two monsters that meet. 126 00:07:48,320 --> 00:07:50,360 Speaker 2: We're going to be monsters together together. 127 00:07:51,000 --> 00:07:53,800 Speaker 1: Because you know, when I think of Angel and this 128 00:07:53,840 --> 00:07:58,080 Speaker 1: whole thing with Britney Drexel, what she did allegedly, but 129 00:07:58,200 --> 00:08:03,880 Speaker 1: what she did to me is almost more horrific. If 130 00:08:03,920 --> 00:08:08,480 Speaker 1: you're with this person that almost cannot, for whatever demonic reason, 131 00:08:08,600 --> 00:08:14,920 Speaker 1: help himself. She drove that child to that destination. Why 132 00:08:14,960 --> 00:08:16,800 Speaker 1: he held her captive in the back of that van. 133 00:08:17,560 --> 00:08:22,240 Speaker 1: She sat with that child in a tent while he 134 00:08:22,520 --> 00:08:27,040 Speaker 1: left to go back to the hotel to take a 135 00:08:27,120 --> 00:08:31,040 Speaker 1: shower and to get drugs and sex toys and come 136 00:08:31,160 --> 00:08:36,600 Speaker 1: back to rape her and kill her. Angel could have 137 00:08:36,760 --> 00:08:41,079 Speaker 1: let her go, and she chose not to do that 138 00:08:41,200 --> 00:08:43,440 Speaker 1: for at least forty minutes. 139 00:08:43,720 --> 00:08:46,520 Speaker 2: Yep, He's going to hell awful now, Rick, Can I 140 00:08:46,559 --> 00:08:49,400 Speaker 2: tell you something else about that? The real estate bros 141 00:08:49,440 --> 00:08:50,800 Speaker 2: Er as I call him, the rape bros. 142 00:08:51,000 --> 00:08:53,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, speaking of people that get together with other devils, 143 00:08:53,400 --> 00:08:54,120 Speaker 1: go ahead. 144 00:08:53,880 --> 00:08:59,920 Speaker 2: Exactly did you know that one of their friends surrender? 145 00:09:00,880 --> 00:09:05,840 Speaker 2: A friend of the real estate Brows surrendered on a 146 00:09:05,920 --> 00:09:08,680 Speaker 2: claim he helped the two of them rape a woman 147 00:09:08,880 --> 00:09:12,280 Speaker 2: nearly a decade ago. I know his name, o' hod 148 00:09:12,320 --> 00:09:14,079 Speaker 2: Fisherman in his thirties. 149 00:09:14,440 --> 00:09:16,560 Speaker 1: That's the one that held the victim Dale. 150 00:09:16,520 --> 00:09:20,079 Speaker 2: Yep return from his honeymoon in Japan and surrender to 151 00:09:20,080 --> 00:09:25,120 Speaker 2: the Miami Day Court House. Now I see him as 152 00:09:25,160 --> 00:09:30,120 Speaker 2: a prime witness. I'm just wondering if the state's going 153 00:09:30,200 --> 00:09:32,840 Speaker 2: to do a deal with him to get his testimony. 154 00:09:32,920 --> 00:09:37,040 Speaker 2: They don't need him because there's enough victims. They don't 155 00:09:37,120 --> 00:09:40,480 Speaker 2: need him. I wouldn't take I would not take a 156 00:09:40,480 --> 00:09:42,960 Speaker 2: play with him. I put them all in the same 157 00:09:43,040 --> 00:09:45,440 Speaker 2: pot and let them stew together. Right on. 158 00:09:46,120 --> 00:09:48,400 Speaker 1: Think of what he knows, Nancy, you know. 159 00:09:48,400 --> 00:09:54,880 Speaker 2: What, I have a long standing family mottoe. Screw him 160 00:09:55,000 --> 00:09:57,920 Speaker 2: and the horse he rode in on, because I don't 161 00:09:58,160 --> 00:10:01,679 Speaker 2: need him to prove this case. If I thought the 162 00:10:01,800 --> 00:10:06,400 Speaker 2: victim could not testify, or her testimony was weak, or 163 00:10:06,440 --> 00:10:10,720 Speaker 2: for whatever reason, Yep, I consider it. But that's the 164 00:10:10,880 --> 00:10:14,160 Speaker 2: last thing I want is to use a code definance testimony. 165 00:10:14,920 --> 00:10:18,120 Speaker 2: You've got the victim, you have other people, You've got 166 00:10:18,160 --> 00:10:22,120 Speaker 2: other victims. That evening there have been a New Year's 167 00:10:22,120 --> 00:10:28,400 Speaker 2: Eve barbecue and one of the bros and the victim 168 00:10:28,559 --> 00:10:31,200 Speaker 2: pictures of people already there, like come on, come, on, 169 00:10:31,240 --> 00:10:34,080 Speaker 2: come on, give you everybody's here. She got there and 170 00:10:34,120 --> 00:10:39,400 Speaker 2: the only people there or the rape bros. And this 171 00:10:39,840 --> 00:10:43,760 Speaker 2: dude that surrendered himself. Oh had Fisherman and two maids. 172 00:10:44,120 --> 00:10:46,160 Speaker 2: Uh oh, here he comes. Shut up, David. Let me 173 00:10:46,200 --> 00:10:54,280 Speaker 2: just tell you ahead of time. But I mean, you 174 00:10:54,320 --> 00:10:58,559 Speaker 2: can get the two maids. You may may maybe able 175 00:10:58,600 --> 00:11:03,199 Speaker 2: to get that digital evidence of where he sent the pictures. 176 00:11:03,280 --> 00:11:08,880 Speaker 2: She may have saved that. And the Alexander Brose and 177 00:11:09,000 --> 00:11:11,920 Speaker 2: Fisherman at Fisherman take her trey in them to a bedroom. 178 00:11:12,400 --> 00:11:15,880 Speaker 2: Fisherman held her down, the twins took turns raping her, 179 00:11:16,160 --> 00:11:20,959 Speaker 2: and she was instructed not to tell anyone. Now. Catch 180 00:11:21,040 --> 00:11:26,480 Speaker 2: this the defense attorney Flowman, here's his quote. Mister Fisherman 181 00:11:26,559 --> 00:11:29,959 Speaker 2: is anxious to resolve this and to vindicate his name. 182 00:11:30,320 --> 00:11:35,560 Speaker 2: What oh oh h l n No, he would not 183 00:11:35,640 --> 00:11:37,880 Speaker 2: be a witness. I'd like to send him over there 184 00:11:37,920 --> 00:11:40,440 Speaker 2: with the rape ros and watch them all fair at 185 00:11:40,480 --> 00:11:44,600 Speaker 2: each other and you know, gnash their teeth and twitch 186 00:11:44,679 --> 00:11:45,760 Speaker 2: their tails. 187 00:11:45,600 --> 00:11:49,320 Speaker 1: In vindicate his name. Hal, I know, really well, I'd 188 00:11:49,360 --> 00:11:51,120 Speaker 1: love to see how they're gonna spin that. 189 00:11:51,760 --> 00:11:54,640 Speaker 2: But you mentioned this last time we talked about it, 190 00:11:54,760 --> 00:11:58,240 Speaker 2: that according to witnesses this because all the way back 191 00:11:58,280 --> 00:12:01,080 Speaker 2: back to high school where they have like a bust 192 00:12:01,360 --> 00:12:05,600 Speaker 2: of swords part in front of the home where the 193 00:12:05,679 --> 00:12:11,240 Speaker 2: parents were, and they would take girls in there and 194 00:12:11,240 --> 00:12:14,560 Speaker 2: they would end up getting sex assaulted and quote everybody knew, 195 00:12:14,720 --> 00:12:15,880 Speaker 2: quote what was going on. 196 00:12:16,280 --> 00:12:20,000 Speaker 1: Well, that's kind of standard sometimes with these folks. Everybody 197 00:12:20,040 --> 00:12:25,200 Speaker 1: does know this group. I will say, they took video Nancy, 198 00:12:25,640 --> 00:12:28,920 Speaker 1: and they sent it around. So you know, the person 199 00:12:28,960 --> 00:12:31,599 Speaker 1: that gets some of these videos and gets these photographs, 200 00:12:31,880 --> 00:12:35,439 Speaker 1: how many people are they showing. So the ripple effect 201 00:12:36,240 --> 00:12:38,679 Speaker 1: is going to be tremendous the amount of people that 202 00:12:38,920 --> 00:12:43,240 Speaker 1: absolutely had knowledge and on the videotape. From what I understand, 203 00:12:43,600 --> 00:12:48,240 Speaker 1: it is clear these women are not in their right mind. 204 00:12:48,280 --> 00:12:52,120 Speaker 1: They're either intoxicated drugs somehow, but it's clear they are 205 00:12:52,160 --> 00:12:52,959 Speaker 1: not consenting. 206 00:12:56,880 --> 00:12:58,560 Speaker 2: Can we talk about go Berger, yes? 207 00:12:58,600 --> 00:12:58,920 Speaker 1: Please? 208 00:12:59,200 --> 00:13:03,880 Speaker 2: And Taylor not the dress shop. The defense attorney is 209 00:13:03,920 --> 00:13:08,120 Speaker 2: trying to get DNA evidence thrown out. It's not gonna work. Okay, 210 00:13:08,240 --> 00:13:10,880 Speaker 2: this is what she's arguing. It's a very weak argument, 211 00:13:10,920 --> 00:13:16,120 Speaker 2: but I guess you have to try everything. And I 212 00:13:16,200 --> 00:13:19,079 Speaker 2: know the first time I saw this, I'm like, what 213 00:13:20,400 --> 00:13:22,640 Speaker 2: a lawyer can try the case. They can try their 214 00:13:22,679 --> 00:13:26,080 Speaker 2: guts out on the case a defense attorney. And then 215 00:13:26,200 --> 00:13:30,840 Speaker 2: after the conviction and the defendants sitting in jail and 216 00:13:30,880 --> 00:13:34,840 Speaker 2: will do anything to get out, they always claim ineffective 217 00:13:34,960 --> 00:13:37,800 Speaker 2: assistance of counsel on the defense attorney, no matter how 218 00:13:38,040 --> 00:13:39,400 Speaker 2: hard the defense attorney tribe. 219 00:13:39,760 --> 00:13:40,199 Speaker 1: That's right. 220 00:13:40,360 --> 00:13:44,240 Speaker 2: And what I didn't understand is defense attorneys go along 221 00:13:44,240 --> 00:13:46,320 Speaker 2: with it. They go, oh, yeah, I was ineffective, you know, 222 00:13:46,440 --> 00:13:53,320 Speaker 2: because it may give their client an out, So you 223 00:13:53,360 --> 00:13:57,839 Speaker 2: know that will be That's a typical claim, no matter 224 00:13:57,880 --> 00:14:01,040 Speaker 2: how great the defense attorney was. If there's conviction, there 225 00:14:01,080 --> 00:14:04,199 Speaker 2: will be a claim on appeal that the defense Turnham 226 00:14:04,240 --> 00:14:07,840 Speaker 2: was ineffective. That said, in this case, she is arguing 227 00:14:07,920 --> 00:14:14,240 Speaker 2: the FBI I gathered DNA evidence without a warrant and 228 00:14:14,320 --> 00:14:17,560 Speaker 2: that they use these genealogy databases to id Coburger as 229 00:14:17,600 --> 00:14:19,760 Speaker 2: a suspect. Well, that's not going to work. That goes 230 00:14:19,800 --> 00:14:23,760 Speaker 2: all the way back to the Golden State Killer Joseph DiAngelo. 231 00:14:25,360 --> 00:14:29,080 Speaker 2: Genetic genealogy was used in that case, which is amazing 232 00:14:29,320 --> 00:14:34,720 Speaker 2: that we deal with that on practically every Bloodline Detective show, 233 00:14:35,640 --> 00:14:38,840 Speaker 2: which I love that program. I'm so fortunate that I 234 00:14:38,880 --> 00:14:42,400 Speaker 2: got forgotten to do that. I think we're we've just 235 00:14:42,440 --> 00:14:47,240 Speaker 2: finished the fifth season all sorts of DNA breakthrough technology. 236 00:14:48,000 --> 00:14:52,640 Speaker 2: That's why it's called Bloodline Detectives. But that's not going 237 00:14:52,720 --> 00:14:55,640 Speaker 2: to work because it's been upheld in the Joseph DiAngelo case. 238 00:14:56,640 --> 00:15:00,560 Speaker 2: And the way that works, Cheryl, since nobody asked, is 239 00:15:01,200 --> 00:15:04,479 Speaker 2: they get DNA on the scene and they're like, okay, 240 00:15:04,720 --> 00:15:09,320 Speaker 2: they put it into at the database, the national database. 241 00:15:10,760 --> 00:15:14,240 Speaker 2: They don't get a match. They're like, dang, he didn't 242 00:15:14,240 --> 00:15:16,360 Speaker 2: commit a crime, all right, now what can we do? 243 00:15:16,960 --> 00:15:23,000 Speaker 2: Then you pluck it into let's just say, ancestry. What's 244 00:15:23,000 --> 00:15:26,200 Speaker 2: the name of that one ancestry dot com? And there's 245 00:15:26,360 --> 00:15:30,080 Speaker 2: twenty one and me and all that, Oh my goodness 246 00:15:30,520 --> 00:15:36,000 Speaker 2: train of thought. Lucy had to get her ancestry. She 247 00:15:36,080 --> 00:15:38,840 Speaker 2: had to. I'm like, Lucy, you do know you're putting 248 00:15:38,880 --> 00:15:41,560 Speaker 2: your great grandchildren in grave danger if one of them 249 00:15:41,600 --> 00:15:43,880 Speaker 2: commits the crime. You do know this. That meant nothing 250 00:15:43,920 --> 00:15:48,040 Speaker 2: to her, Okay, so we did it. I found out 251 00:15:49,160 --> 00:15:54,280 Speaker 2: that we are Congolese from the Congo, and we're ashk 252 00:15:54,360 --> 00:15:59,440 Speaker 2: Nazi as well, and I already knew that part, but 253 00:15:59,520 --> 00:16:02,000 Speaker 2: I didn't know a whole lot, and this was the 254 00:16:02,000 --> 00:16:06,960 Speaker 2: funniest thing. David has sworn he's Scottish as long as 255 00:16:06,960 --> 00:16:09,440 Speaker 2: I've known him. I mean, he says it so many times. 256 00:16:09,480 --> 00:16:11,040 Speaker 2: One time it's a joke. The children gave him a 257 00:16:11,120 --> 00:16:15,640 Speaker 2: kilt for Christmas, made him wear it, so funny. Anyway, 258 00:16:15,960 --> 00:16:19,800 Speaker 2: that said, he is no more Scottish than the dog 259 00:16:19,880 --> 00:16:26,320 Speaker 2: fat boy, and I mean, and his disappointment was grave. 260 00:16:26,800 --> 00:16:31,040 Speaker 2: Now he keeps trying to say that the that what 261 00:16:31,240 --> 00:16:34,360 Speaker 2: the ancestry dot com or is twenty one, I mean, 262 00:16:34,480 --> 00:16:37,560 Speaker 2: one of those really says is that he is Scottish 263 00:16:37,640 --> 00:16:40,280 Speaker 2: and we all just look at him. The Irish part 264 00:16:40,840 --> 00:16:43,320 Speaker 2: or the whatever part he or the Swedish part, I 265 00:16:43,320 --> 00:16:48,640 Speaker 2: don't know what part he says, Well, that's really Scottish, right, Okay, whatever, anyway, 266 00:16:48,960 --> 00:16:55,360 Speaker 2: back to genetic genealogy. Okay, here we go. She's claiming 267 00:16:55,560 --> 00:17:00,240 Speaker 2: that genetic genealogy is unconstitutional, that in these to be 268 00:17:00,280 --> 00:17:04,440 Speaker 2: thrown out because that's how his DNA was identifying through 269 00:17:04,480 --> 00:17:07,719 Speaker 2: the use of genetic genealogy. So you don't get a 270 00:17:07,760 --> 00:17:10,080 Speaker 2: match in the national database, so you put it in. 271 00:17:10,320 --> 00:17:15,080 Speaker 2: Let's just pretend ancestry dot com. They don't use ancestry 272 00:17:15,119 --> 00:17:18,520 Speaker 2: dot com because that's private. They use a public is 273 00:17:19,760 --> 00:17:25,359 Speaker 2: like I think it's jedmatch anyway, or some public database. 274 00:17:26,880 --> 00:17:29,399 Speaker 2: Then they kind of get a hit from like a 275 00:17:29,560 --> 00:17:34,360 Speaker 2: hundred years ago, right, Okay, Then they have to follow 276 00:17:34,480 --> 00:17:38,440 Speaker 2: the family tree down, down, down, down, down down down. 277 00:17:38,600 --> 00:17:41,040 Speaker 2: It could be one hundred years. It takes a while 278 00:17:41,080 --> 00:17:44,600 Speaker 2: to do it. And then they get to present day 279 00:17:44,760 --> 00:17:48,560 Speaker 2: and then they see who has that strain of DNA 280 00:17:48,920 --> 00:17:53,080 Speaker 2: in the area at the time of the incident. That's 281 00:17:53,119 --> 00:17:53,760 Speaker 2: how it works. 282 00:17:54,280 --> 00:17:57,360 Speaker 1: And here's the other thing. I have a question. When 283 00:17:57,400 --> 00:18:01,440 Speaker 1: you take your sample and you may to ancestry dot 284 00:18:01,480 --> 00:18:04,200 Speaker 1: com or twenty three and meter you're giving it away, 285 00:18:04,840 --> 00:18:07,320 Speaker 1: Why is that an issue even if it's a private company. 286 00:18:07,760 --> 00:18:11,200 Speaker 2: Well, when you use a private company like ancestry dot com, 287 00:18:11,280 --> 00:18:17,440 Speaker 2: they guarantee privacy. But there are public with public sites 288 00:18:17,800 --> 00:18:21,800 Speaker 2: that do not. For those there's no guarantee of privacy. 289 00:18:21,920 --> 00:18:23,680 Speaker 2: That can we talk about guarantee your privacy. And I 290 00:18:23,720 --> 00:18:27,399 Speaker 2: don't want to go too far in the weeds with 291 00:18:27,760 --> 00:18:32,240 Speaker 2: the law under the Fourth Amendment. And this came from 292 00:18:32,600 --> 00:18:37,080 Speaker 2: our colonial forefathers that did not want their homes busted 293 00:18:37,080 --> 00:18:40,040 Speaker 2: into by British troops. This is where this came from 294 00:18:40,440 --> 00:18:44,640 Speaker 2: you must have a warrant to enter someone's home, and 295 00:18:44,720 --> 00:18:49,879 Speaker 2: sometimes poor not always because of Carol versus United States 296 00:18:49,920 --> 00:18:53,880 Speaker 2: exegen circumstances that came out during the Moonshine era. Now 297 00:18:54,720 --> 00:19:02,160 Speaker 2: privacy that has been interpreted to me that even though 298 00:19:02,160 --> 00:19:04,640 Speaker 2: we don't want the British troops breaking down our door 299 00:19:05,280 --> 00:19:08,960 Speaker 2: over the years, case law says that you have to 300 00:19:09,040 --> 00:19:13,280 Speaker 2: have a warrant to take somebody's blood. Okay, so it's 301 00:19:13,320 --> 00:19:17,640 Speaker 2: coming from all the way back to those times. That's 302 00:19:17,680 --> 00:19:21,640 Speaker 2: where the right to privacy comes from. But if you've 303 00:19:21,680 --> 00:19:26,080 Speaker 2: got a public DNA database, then there is no right 304 00:19:26,280 --> 00:19:30,760 Speaker 2: to privacy. There's many, many of them. 305 00:19:31,359 --> 00:19:33,880 Speaker 1: You're so smart. A lot of people think, oh, well 306 00:19:33,920 --> 00:19:36,200 Speaker 1: she's a lawyer, she was a prosecutor and that's it. 307 00:19:36,600 --> 00:19:39,640 Speaker 1: But you went back to NYU and got some more 308 00:19:39,840 --> 00:19:42,680 Speaker 1: education in the law, and I appreciate that. 309 00:19:43,400 --> 00:19:47,440 Speaker 2: So long story short, that's what she's claiming, because that 310 00:19:47,680 --> 00:19:51,000 Speaker 2: is what the case wide open is. When they've got 311 00:19:51,040 --> 00:19:55,160 Speaker 2: that DNA match off the sheath of the knife. Yeah, 312 00:19:55,400 --> 00:20:02,280 Speaker 2: now also they got disposed DNA. This is what happened. 313 00:20:02,760 --> 00:20:07,080 Speaker 2: So they see that clerk at that convenience story. God 314 00:20:07,160 --> 00:20:11,040 Speaker 2: bless her who sees the Aluntra going by like three am. 315 00:20:11,840 --> 00:20:14,840 Speaker 2: And in my neck of the woods, if a car 316 00:20:14,880 --> 00:20:17,560 Speaker 2: goes by at three am, they're one of thousands. But 317 00:20:17,680 --> 00:20:19,760 Speaker 2: growing up, if a car went by at three am, 318 00:20:19,920 --> 00:20:23,520 Speaker 2: you noticed the car. Okay, where I grew up. If 319 00:20:23,560 --> 00:20:25,760 Speaker 2: my grandmother heard an ambulance, she was on the phone, Hey, 320 00:20:25,760 --> 00:20:29,880 Speaker 2: I heard an ambulance. Is anybody dead? Like no, we're all. 321 00:20:29,920 --> 00:20:35,240 Speaker 2: You're but there. When that clerk saw a vehicle go 322 00:20:35,359 --> 00:20:39,359 Speaker 2: by at three am, she's like, whoa, Okay, it was 323 00:20:39,400 --> 00:20:47,040 Speaker 2: the Elantra. So that and other circumstances led to the 324 00:20:47,080 --> 00:20:51,239 Speaker 2: public safety that you know, the school security over at 325 00:20:51,280 --> 00:20:55,479 Speaker 2: Pullman where he was to look for an Elantra and 326 00:20:55,560 --> 00:20:59,119 Speaker 2: they found it. Alantra's registered to like three people I 327 00:20:59,119 --> 00:21:01,520 Speaker 2: think it was, and then immediately found his in launcher. 328 00:21:01,560 --> 00:21:04,440 Speaker 2: So he went on the list right then without any DNA, 329 00:21:05,040 --> 00:21:10,280 Speaker 2: So he was on a watch list right then, and 330 00:21:10,480 --> 00:21:13,679 Speaker 2: that could have been the PC probable cause to follow 331 00:21:13,800 --> 00:21:17,480 Speaker 2: him home or with Thanksgiving break to the Poconos. Then 332 00:21:17,520 --> 00:21:21,840 Speaker 2: they watched his house right there and they saw trash 333 00:21:21,840 --> 00:21:25,480 Speaker 2: being thrown out and they got disposed DNA. They got 334 00:21:25,520 --> 00:21:29,679 Speaker 2: the dad's DNA based on the dad's DNA compared to 335 00:21:29,880 --> 00:21:32,000 Speaker 2: what was on the sheaf at the murder scene under 336 00:21:32,040 --> 00:21:38,000 Speaker 2: a victim, it was conclusive that the owner of the 337 00:21:38,080 --> 00:21:42,960 Speaker 2: sheaf had to be the male child of the contributing 338 00:21:43,080 --> 00:21:46,800 Speaker 2: DNA the father Coburger's father, and he only has one son, 339 00:21:46,840 --> 00:21:50,560 Speaker 2: Brian Coburger. Bam. Now, I'm sure we're going to hear 340 00:21:50,720 --> 00:21:53,800 Speaker 2: variation of those facts. That's just what I'm gleaning from 341 00:21:53,800 --> 00:21:57,000 Speaker 2: what we know right now. But that's generally the scheme 342 00:21:57,040 --> 00:22:00,040 Speaker 2: of what happened. And she is trying to get the 343 00:22:00,440 --> 00:22:02,520 Speaker 2: thrown out right now? Was that too much? I had 344 00:22:02,600 --> 00:22:06,200 Speaker 2: to go death com four in the law? Can I 345 00:22:06,280 --> 00:22:08,080 Speaker 2: get back to Coburger real quick? You know another thing 346 00:22:08,119 --> 00:22:11,440 Speaker 2: they're going to try to do, which I'm and this 347 00:22:11,520 --> 00:22:13,760 Speaker 2: is to be expected. I don't know why everybody's acting 348 00:22:13,840 --> 00:22:19,480 Speaker 2: like this is something new. You know. One of the roommates, 349 00:22:21,200 --> 00:22:26,800 Speaker 2: Dylan Mortenson, the defense is going to try to attack 350 00:22:26,920 --> 00:22:33,159 Speaker 2: her at trial and get her eyewitness testimony thrown out. Okay, 351 00:22:33,520 --> 00:22:38,199 Speaker 2: she survived, She came face to face with Coburger just 352 00:22:38,480 --> 00:22:46,960 Speaker 2: after the quadruple homicide. And now another roommate, uh Bethany Funk, 353 00:22:47,119 --> 00:22:53,280 Speaker 2: also survived, but long story short, she is very important 354 00:22:53,359 --> 00:22:58,919 Speaker 2: Dylan Mortenson, okay, because she saw coburger. Therefore, the more 355 00:22:58,960 --> 00:23:02,560 Speaker 2: important your witnesses, the more they're going to be attacked. 356 00:23:03,800 --> 00:23:09,840 Speaker 2: So she's going to be attacked on Vagary thinks she 357 00:23:09,960 --> 00:23:16,880 Speaker 2: can and not she can and cannot say any other statement. 358 00:23:16,960 --> 00:23:20,159 Speaker 2: She's given sense, and they're going to try to have 359 00:23:20,200 --> 00:23:24,359 Speaker 2: her testimony thrown out. But that won't happen. And this 360 00:23:24,440 --> 00:23:29,320 Speaker 2: is why a witness may be terrible and they may 361 00:23:29,359 --> 00:23:31,840 Speaker 2: be destroyed on cross exam. That does not mean a 362 00:23:31,960 --> 00:23:34,240 Speaker 2: judge says, okay, you can't put the witness on because 363 00:23:34,240 --> 00:23:37,879 Speaker 2: they're a bad witness. That is up to cross examination. 364 00:23:38,960 --> 00:23:43,520 Speaker 2: The law is that credibility is within the sole province 365 00:23:43,560 --> 00:23:46,919 Speaker 2: of the jury, not the judge. So if the jury 366 00:23:47,000 --> 00:23:50,000 Speaker 2: chooses to disbelieve her after cross examination, that's up to 367 00:23:50,000 --> 00:23:53,760 Speaker 2: the jury. It would actually be unconstitutional to throw her 368 00:23:53,800 --> 00:23:57,199 Speaker 2: testimony out and not let her take the stand. So 369 00:23:57,280 --> 00:23:59,840 Speaker 2: that's not going to happen. But she will undergo a 370 00:23:59,840 --> 00:24:02,240 Speaker 2: w the in cross examination. I can tell you that much, 371 00:24:02,400 --> 00:24:04,040 Speaker 2: because your testimony is so important. 372 00:24:04,560 --> 00:24:08,760 Speaker 1: Absolutely, and hopefully they will prepare her so that she 373 00:24:09,000 --> 00:24:10,200 Speaker 1: is just rock solid. 374 00:24:11,040 --> 00:24:13,560 Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't know that there is a way to 375 00:24:13,720 --> 00:24:16,480 Speaker 2: fully prepare it. Witness who'll live through what she'll live 376 00:24:16,560 --> 00:24:19,720 Speaker 2: through and have it all brought back up on cross 377 00:24:19,720 --> 00:24:23,640 Speaker 2: examination and have to relive it on the stand. It's 378 00:24:23,680 --> 00:24:25,680 Speaker 2: not going to be easy by any stretch. 379 00:24:29,840 --> 00:24:34,640 Speaker 1: Lake and Rileigh. You remember her roommates, they were fantastic 380 00:24:35,160 --> 00:24:38,320 Speaker 1: and you tell they had been prepared for what might 381 00:24:38,400 --> 00:24:39,280 Speaker 1: be thrown at them. 382 00:24:39,760 --> 00:24:43,440 Speaker 2: And you know that bill was just signed to Lake 383 00:24:43,480 --> 00:24:48,880 Speaker 2: and Riley bill and I'm hoping it will make a difference. 384 00:24:48,920 --> 00:24:54,320 Speaker 2: And people point out, well, illegal immigrants aka migrants, they 385 00:24:54,320 --> 00:24:57,439 Speaker 2: only make up a small amount of criminal wrong during 386 00:24:57,560 --> 00:24:59,879 Speaker 2: you know what. That may be true, but that's not 387 00:25:00,880 --> 00:25:07,800 Speaker 2: out goodbye. And I'm very torn on throwing people out 388 00:25:07,800 --> 00:25:11,240 Speaker 2: of the country because as a Christian, you know, I 389 00:25:11,280 --> 00:25:14,879 Speaker 2: always say what would Jesus do? But when it comes 390 00:25:14,880 --> 00:25:18,840 Speaker 2: to fighting violent crime, I'm pretty sure the right thing 391 00:25:18,840 --> 00:25:20,600 Speaker 2: to do is to keep them out of the country. 392 00:25:20,600 --> 00:25:23,160 Speaker 2: They should not be here to start with. Much last 393 00:25:23,240 --> 00:25:25,720 Speaker 2: with the criminal David, have you been hiding at the 394 00:25:25,800 --> 00:25:28,320 Speaker 2: kitchen table so you would have to make me tea 395 00:25:29,080 --> 00:25:32,199 Speaker 2: completely ignoring me? I honestly don't think you can hear me. 396 00:25:32,520 --> 00:25:35,080 Speaker 1: Okay, throw some in it David. 397 00:25:38,119 --> 00:25:40,199 Speaker 2: He knows just how to do it. He knows just 398 00:25:40,280 --> 00:25:42,200 Speaker 2: have and I can tell you something and has saved 399 00:25:42,200 --> 00:25:44,080 Speaker 2: our marriage because I want I'll tell you when I 400 00:25:44,119 --> 00:25:48,320 Speaker 2: almost divorced him when the twins went to Scout camp. Okay, now, 401 00:25:48,359 --> 00:25:52,360 Speaker 2: the first time I made him the threat of physical harm, 402 00:25:52,840 --> 00:25:56,600 Speaker 2: go trade to be a Scout counselor. And wait went 403 00:25:56,680 --> 00:25:57,400 Speaker 2: the Scout camp. 404 00:25:57,600 --> 00:25:58,600 Speaker 1: No, I remember that. 405 00:25:58,760 --> 00:26:02,720 Speaker 2: It was a brutal, brutal it was miserable. Okay, I 406 00:26:02,760 --> 00:26:05,359 Speaker 2: actually had kind of a good time. So then if 407 00:26:05,359 --> 00:26:08,240 Speaker 2: you don't mind taking showers for big long grandity longloves 408 00:26:09,359 --> 00:26:15,600 Speaker 2: then and literally teaching out in the woods. But that said, 409 00:26:15,760 --> 00:26:18,680 Speaker 2: the next year we were going back and guess what 410 00:26:19,520 --> 00:26:21,520 Speaker 2: you know. He works on a deal all year long 411 00:26:21,640 --> 00:26:24,879 Speaker 2: and then it culminates right there a Scout camp and 412 00:26:24,880 --> 00:26:27,680 Speaker 2: couldn't go. So when were home alone without the toys 413 00:26:27,680 --> 00:26:30,800 Speaker 2: for the first time in fourteen years, it was awful. 414 00:26:31,560 --> 00:26:33,080 Speaker 2: I'm like, hey, if this is how it's going to 415 00:26:33,160 --> 00:26:35,160 Speaker 2: be when they go to college, god, will you I'm 416 00:26:35,160 --> 00:26:38,440 Speaker 2: getting divorce right now and starting over. I'm so mad 417 00:26:38,480 --> 00:26:43,040 Speaker 2: at him about that stupid deal, and I swear I 418 00:26:43,480 --> 00:26:46,680 Speaker 2: almost divorced him right then. I'm glad I didn't, because 419 00:26:46,680 --> 00:26:49,400 Speaker 2: who would make my tea for Pete's sake? That man 420 00:26:49,520 --> 00:26:52,240 Speaker 2: is a same He's true and you know, throwing my 421 00:26:52,359 --> 00:26:54,840 Speaker 2: mother living with us, and he really is a saint. 422 00:26:55,480 --> 00:27:00,160 Speaker 2: He's more than a saint. It should be canonized. What 423 00:27:00,200 --> 00:27:02,760 Speaker 2: other case do we need to analyze? You know what 424 00:27:02,800 --> 00:27:05,160 Speaker 2: if I start diddy, that'll take me into a whole 425 00:27:05,200 --> 00:27:05,760 Speaker 2: nother week. 426 00:27:06,080 --> 00:27:07,800 Speaker 1: Yes it will, Lord have mercy. 427 00:27:08,600 --> 00:27:12,800 Speaker 2: But they did just they did just just announce a 428 00:27:12,880 --> 00:27:18,440 Speaker 2: superseding indictment, which sounds confusing. It's not. Usually in a 429 00:27:18,520 --> 00:27:23,560 Speaker 2: superseding indictment they add counts. They did not really add counts, 430 00:27:23,600 --> 00:27:28,320 Speaker 2: but they they netting additional victims within the counts, like 431 00:27:28,359 --> 00:27:32,280 Speaker 2: for instance, sex trafficking. They added additional victims to that. 432 00:27:33,640 --> 00:27:36,000 Speaker 2: And I think that's going to a I think it's 433 00:27:36,520 --> 00:27:41,560 Speaker 2: likely true, and so why not. But I think this 434 00:27:41,960 --> 00:27:44,840 Speaker 2: to boltster the case that they have, because when you 435 00:27:44,960 --> 00:27:48,760 Speaker 2: have more victims separating in time and space, saying the 436 00:27:48,800 --> 00:27:52,800 Speaker 2: same thing, it adds credibility to your other victims. So 437 00:27:52,840 --> 00:27:53,880 Speaker 2: I think that's why they. 438 00:27:53,800 --> 00:27:56,600 Speaker 1: Did it one or two victims. People may question it 439 00:27:56,680 --> 00:28:00,560 Speaker 1: twenty five thirty three, forty two. They're not to question 440 00:28:00,680 --> 00:28:04,479 Speaker 1: that much longer. That's a pretty solid case, especially when 441 00:28:04,520 --> 00:28:08,160 Speaker 1: the mos are similar. The you know, people that are 442 00:28:08,200 --> 00:28:11,479 Speaker 1: involved are the same. There's your pattern and that's what 443 00:28:11,520 --> 00:28:15,520 Speaker 1: we always preach, Nancy, those patterns. You cannot deny them. 444 00:28:15,760 --> 00:28:18,760 Speaker 2: That's something I always loved. Aren't you intuit? Jury? Are 445 00:28:18,800 --> 00:28:24,040 Speaker 2: you going to believe all of these victims you all 446 00:28:24,240 --> 00:28:28,359 Speaker 2: had the same experience, almost a fingerprint crime. 447 00:28:28,600 --> 00:28:29,560 Speaker 1: Or are you gonna believe him? 448 00:28:29,720 --> 00:28:33,840 Speaker 2: And then when all look at him, they would just 449 00:28:33,840 --> 00:28:36,560 Speaker 2: be saying they're going But. 450 00:28:36,600 --> 00:28:39,640 Speaker 1: You know you mentioned a little while ago about ineffective council. 451 00:28:40,240 --> 00:28:45,440 Speaker 1: My favorite of all time was when Ted Bundy represented 452 00:28:45,560 --> 00:28:49,800 Speaker 1: himself and then filed ineffective council. 453 00:28:51,520 --> 00:28:54,880 Speaker 2: You know, and Bundy was no idiot. Bundy was no 454 00:28:55,080 --> 00:28:59,200 Speaker 2: idiot at all. And when people choose to represent themselves, 455 00:28:59,240 --> 00:29:03,760 Speaker 2: like Lori coltmam is doing right now. The judge asked 456 00:29:03,800 --> 00:29:06,400 Speaker 2: them over and over that dark well better be put 457 00:29:06,440 --> 00:29:09,000 Speaker 2: on the record, because unless it's written down by court reporter, 458 00:29:09,960 --> 00:29:13,680 Speaker 2: then it doesn't exist in the world of appeals. He 459 00:29:14,120 --> 00:29:16,800 Speaker 2: I'm sure, asked her over and over and over. You 460 00:29:16,840 --> 00:29:18,800 Speaker 2: have a right to a lawyer to state we'll pay 461 00:29:18,840 --> 00:29:21,400 Speaker 2: for a lawyer if you cannot afford once and she 462 00:29:21,640 --> 00:29:25,200 Speaker 2: went forward, as did Bundy, and that is suicide. 463 00:29:25,320 --> 00:29:29,600 Speaker 1: That's suit side to do that agreed. Well, honey, I 464 00:29:29,640 --> 00:29:33,520 Speaker 1: appreciate your legal mind and I appreciate your friendship so much. 465 00:29:33,880 --> 00:29:36,560 Speaker 1: This has been fun today. I've learned a lot, are 466 00:29:36,560 --> 00:29:37,120 Speaker 1: you say, Jesse? 467 00:29:37,240 --> 00:29:38,440 Speaker 2: Other times have not been fun? 468 00:29:40,160 --> 00:29:44,120 Speaker 1: Never ever, not with you. It's always a party. 469 00:29:44,360 --> 00:29:49,440 Speaker 2: In I Cheryl sadly, there's never a lack of business. 470 00:29:49,120 --> 00:29:51,520 Speaker 1: Sister, there, it's never a lack of business. 471 00:29:52,040 --> 00:29:54,840 Speaker 2: Last question, power your sisters. 472 00:29:55,480 --> 00:30:00,720 Speaker 1: Everybody is fantastic. Sheila is still in remission. Ellie has 473 00:30:01,080 --> 00:30:04,400 Speaker 1: all but done away with not just a Walker but 474 00:30:04,440 --> 00:30:08,280 Speaker 1: a Caine. She is doing just miraculous. I mean, you're 475 00:30:08,320 --> 00:30:10,360 Speaker 1: looking at two miracles, that's all I can tell you. 476 00:30:10,840 --> 00:30:12,520 Speaker 1: Walkin miracle, both of them. 477 00:30:12,880 --> 00:30:15,320 Speaker 2: Okay, with that, I will say ad all 478 00:30:15,400 --> 00:30:17,640 Speaker 1: Right, sugar, have a good weekend, my dear