1 00:00:03,200 --> 00:00:07,960 Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg Law with June Brussel from Bloomberg Radio. 2 00:00:09,160 --> 00:00:13,560 Speaker 1: Who is America's trumpius lawyer. Well, one lawyer who hasn't 3 00:00:13,600 --> 00:00:17,840 Speaker 1: led past securities, fraud charges or corruption allegations from former 4 00:00:17,960 --> 00:00:20,680 Speaker 1: staff stopped him from being the first to sue the 5 00:00:20,680 --> 00:00:25,239 Speaker 1: Biden administration is certainly in the running. Texas Attorney General 6 00:00:25,320 --> 00:00:29,200 Speaker 1: Ken Paxton. He's fought scandals before and has earned a 7 00:00:29,240 --> 00:00:32,919 Speaker 1: reputation as something of a serial rule breaker, and of 8 00:00:32,960 --> 00:00:36,920 Speaker 1: course he has connections to the former president. Joining me 9 00:00:37,000 --> 00:00:41,519 Speaker 1: is David Yaffie Bellini, Bloomberg Legal reporter, start by telling 10 00:00:41,600 --> 00:00:45,080 Speaker 1: us about what some would call the merit list lawsuit 11 00:00:45,159 --> 00:00:49,479 Speaker 1: he filed regarding the election. People in Texas have known 12 00:00:49,520 --> 00:00:51,839 Speaker 1: about Ken Paxton's for a really long time, but I 13 00:00:51,880 --> 00:00:55,760 Speaker 1: think he really arrived in the consciousness of a majority 14 00:00:55,760 --> 00:00:59,160 Speaker 1: of Americans in December twenty twenty when he filed a 15 00:00:59,240 --> 00:01:02,360 Speaker 1: lawsuit with Supreme Court. Directly to the Supreme Court, it 16 00:01:02,480 --> 00:01:07,160 Speaker 1: was Texas suing other states attempting to overturn the results 17 00:01:07,200 --> 00:01:10,640 Speaker 1: of the election. This was kind of the sort of 18 00:01:10,760 --> 00:01:15,600 Speaker 1: final hail Mary pass thrown by the Republicans who were 19 00:01:15,640 --> 00:01:18,680 Speaker 1: trying to reverse the election results. It was a type 20 00:01:18,720 --> 00:01:21,360 Speaker 1: of case one state doing other states that can be 21 00:01:21,400 --> 00:01:24,040 Speaker 1: heard directly by the Supreme Court um and so it 22 00:01:24,160 --> 00:01:28,640 Speaker 1: bypasses the normal kind of winding legal process and theoretically 23 00:01:28,680 --> 00:01:31,800 Speaker 1: could have achieved this sort of fast turnaround for those 24 00:01:31,920 --> 00:01:35,360 Speaker 1: Republican forces. And Ken Paxton of Texas as the man 25 00:01:35,760 --> 00:01:38,680 Speaker 1: who put his name to that lawsuit, which was of course, 26 00:01:38,720 --> 00:01:42,399 Speaker 1: you know, promptly rejected as completely meritalists by the Supreme Court. 27 00:01:42,880 --> 00:01:46,560 Speaker 1: And since then, since Biden has taken office, but he's 28 00:01:46,600 --> 00:01:53,520 Speaker 1: sort of making Texas what California was in the Jump administration. Yeah, 29 00:01:53,560 --> 00:01:56,360 Speaker 1: he's really been at the vanguard of the kind of 30 00:01:56,400 --> 00:02:00,360 Speaker 1: Republican u legal groups that are you know, suing the 31 00:02:00,400 --> 00:02:04,360 Speaker 1: Biden administration to try to reverse all sorts of executive actions. 32 00:02:04,440 --> 00:02:07,720 Speaker 1: So he was actually the first Republican attorney general to 33 00:02:07,800 --> 00:02:11,480 Speaker 1: sue Biden. He filed the suit mir days after the inauguration, 34 00:02:11,960 --> 00:02:15,760 Speaker 1: challenging a moratorium on importations that Biden established at the 35 00:02:15,800 --> 00:02:19,520 Speaker 1: US Mexico border, and he was actually successful in temporarily 36 00:02:19,560 --> 00:02:24,239 Speaker 1: at least for now, blocking that moratorium. He's also sued 37 00:02:24,280 --> 00:02:26,480 Speaker 1: to try to make it part of for asylum seekers 38 00:02:26,480 --> 00:02:28,639 Speaker 1: to get into the country, a lot of his focus 39 00:02:28,720 --> 00:02:31,720 Speaker 1: UM as a as a Texan has been on immigration issues. 40 00:02:32,400 --> 00:02:35,320 Speaker 1: So every time I read a story about him, it 41 00:02:35,440 --> 00:02:41,720 Speaker 1: says he's under investigation for securities fraud. That's been years 42 00:02:41,760 --> 00:02:44,800 Speaker 1: and years. What's that about. So he's actually it's not 43 00:02:44,880 --> 00:02:48,080 Speaker 1: just under investigation. He's been under indictment for securities fraud 44 00:02:48,360 --> 00:02:51,360 Speaker 1: UM since his persons. Early in his first term back 45 00:02:51,520 --> 00:02:58,320 Speaker 1: in he was accused by state authorities in Texas of 46 00:02:58,360 --> 00:03:01,359 Speaker 1: trying to get friends in a see it's is to 47 00:03:01,720 --> 00:03:06,000 Speaker 1: invest in a sort of struggling technology company without revealing 48 00:03:06,000 --> 00:03:08,480 Speaker 1: to those people that he was actually being compensated by 49 00:03:08,520 --> 00:03:11,520 Speaker 1: the company for soliciting their investments. And that was an 50 00:03:11,520 --> 00:03:14,800 Speaker 1: apparent violation of the securities law that he'd actually looked 51 00:03:14,800 --> 00:03:17,920 Speaker 1: a pass during its time of Texas legislature. UM. And 52 00:03:17,960 --> 00:03:21,480 Speaker 1: so he was indicted UM you know, released on bond, 53 00:03:22,120 --> 00:03:26,320 Speaker 1: and has proceeded to basically grind those legal proceedings to 54 00:03:26,440 --> 00:03:30,480 Speaker 1: a halt by waging a series of procedural disputes over 55 00:03:30,960 --> 00:03:34,040 Speaker 1: the charges that actually don't get at the central issue 56 00:03:34,040 --> 00:03:36,200 Speaker 1: of whether he broke the law. So there's been a 57 00:03:36,320 --> 00:03:39,520 Speaker 1: long run dispute over the venue for any trial, should 58 00:03:39,560 --> 00:03:42,960 Speaker 1: it be in Ken Paxton's you know home county of 59 00:03:43,040 --> 00:03:45,880 Speaker 1: Column County, Texas outside Dallas. You know, could he get 60 00:03:45,880 --> 00:03:47,680 Speaker 1: a fair trial there or should it be held somewhere 61 00:03:47,680 --> 00:03:50,160 Speaker 1: else like Houston. And so there's been huge legal back 62 00:03:50,160 --> 00:03:53,040 Speaker 1: and forth about the venue that flows things down. But 63 00:03:53,160 --> 00:03:55,720 Speaker 1: really his main weapon kind of preventing this case from 64 00:03:55,720 --> 00:03:59,800 Speaker 1: going anywhere, is that he's been challenging the funding of 65 00:03:59,840 --> 00:04:04,520 Speaker 1: the prosecution. And the prosecution was vulnerable because the local 66 00:04:04,560 --> 00:04:07,360 Speaker 1: district attorney, who would normally have overseen this case, had 67 00:04:07,400 --> 00:04:09,720 Speaker 1: to accuse himself because he was a friend of Paxton. 68 00:04:10,240 --> 00:04:13,280 Speaker 1: And so a judge hired two special prosecutors, to kind 69 00:04:13,280 --> 00:04:17,080 Speaker 1: of media savvy criminal defense lawyers from Houston to serve 70 00:04:17,120 --> 00:04:19,880 Speaker 1: as special prosecutors in this case. And so they have 71 00:04:19,960 --> 00:04:23,240 Speaker 1: become a target for um Paxton his supporters in the 72 00:04:23,320 --> 00:04:26,040 Speaker 1: same way that Robert Mueller and the special counsel's officers 73 00:04:26,040 --> 00:04:29,440 Speaker 1: targets accompany his supporters. And you know, Paxton and his 74 00:04:29,560 --> 00:04:32,360 Speaker 1: people have been arguing for years now that the three 75 00:04:32,560 --> 00:04:36,120 Speaker 1: d dollar hourly rate that the special prosecutors were charging 76 00:04:36,160 --> 00:04:39,000 Speaker 1: the local government to work on this case is somehow excessive, 77 00:04:39,560 --> 00:04:42,960 Speaker 1: and they've actually succeeded in cutting off all funding to 78 00:04:43,080 --> 00:04:46,080 Speaker 1: the prosecution. So there's been this long run dispute over 79 00:04:46,080 --> 00:04:48,600 Speaker 1: whether the prosecutor should be paid, the equally long run 80 00:04:48,680 --> 00:04:51,359 Speaker 1: dispute over where the trial should take place, and and 81 00:04:51,440 --> 00:04:53,640 Speaker 1: sort of that's combined to sort of prevent us from 82 00:04:53,640 --> 00:04:57,400 Speaker 1: really getting anywhere. In your story, you talk about how 83 00:04:57,440 --> 00:05:02,320 Speaker 1: his reputation as a serial rule breaker started a long 84 00:05:02,400 --> 00:05:06,440 Speaker 1: time ago in a Texas courthouse. Explained that. Sure, so 85 00:05:06,560 --> 00:05:08,600 Speaker 1: back in back in two thousand and thirteam in Kent 86 00:05:08,640 --> 00:05:11,400 Speaker 1: Paxton but still a state senator in Texas, he was 87 00:05:11,440 --> 00:05:14,719 Speaker 1: caught in a kind of green security camera footage, you know, 88 00:05:14,800 --> 00:05:18,600 Speaker 1: appearing to pluck a one thousand dollar mont Blanc pen 89 00:05:19,240 --> 00:05:22,320 Speaker 1: um at the security desk of a local courthouse. The 90 00:05:22,360 --> 00:05:25,680 Speaker 1: pen belonged to another lawyer who just left it there accidentally, 91 00:05:25,680 --> 00:05:28,359 Speaker 1: and you can see on video Ken Paxton kind of 92 00:05:28,360 --> 00:05:31,200 Speaker 1: picking it up and and and pocketing it um. Eventually 93 00:05:31,200 --> 00:05:33,159 Speaker 1: the lawyer has lost the pen. Contact of the local 94 00:05:33,200 --> 00:05:36,799 Speaker 1: sheriff used the footage and went to Paxton tax turned 95 00:05:36,800 --> 00:05:39,640 Speaker 1: the pen and said, this was a great misunderstanding. You know, 96 00:05:39,680 --> 00:05:42,000 Speaker 1: I did nothing wrong, but as you can imagine, this 97 00:05:42,040 --> 00:05:44,960 Speaker 1: is you know, picked up in the Texas political media, um, 98 00:05:45,120 --> 00:05:47,600 Speaker 1: and it became this kind of funny story that captured 99 00:05:47,640 --> 00:05:51,200 Speaker 1: some of these, you know, broader ethical concerns about Paxton, 100 00:05:51,480 --> 00:05:53,640 Speaker 1: the argument being that he's the type of person who 101 00:05:53,680 --> 00:05:56,320 Speaker 1: just want to commit teddy beast and think nothing about it. 102 00:05:56,400 --> 00:05:58,320 Speaker 1: And you know, he also has these sort of broader 103 00:05:58,400 --> 00:06:01,880 Speaker 1: legal issues paying over him. And he ran for re election. 104 00:06:02,040 --> 00:06:06,120 Speaker 1: I saw the photo where the person running against him 105 00:06:06,160 --> 00:06:09,800 Speaker 1: had a truck with a huge picture of Ken Paxson's 106 00:06:09,839 --> 00:06:13,560 Speaker 1: booking photos. That didn't affect the election. He's proved to 107 00:06:13,600 --> 00:06:17,160 Speaker 1: have nine lives politically, and yes, he was re elected 108 00:06:17,200 --> 00:06:21,400 Speaker 1: in eighteen. He didn't have a Republican opponent in the primary, 109 00:06:21,880 --> 00:06:24,680 Speaker 1: partly because he had succeeded in running so far at 110 00:06:24,720 --> 00:06:28,120 Speaker 1: the rights that they weren't really conservatives who could kind 111 00:06:28,120 --> 00:06:29,839 Speaker 1: of outflank him on the right, which is how you 112 00:06:29,880 --> 00:06:32,799 Speaker 1: win Republican primaries in Texas. And his kind of pr 113 00:06:32,880 --> 00:06:35,479 Speaker 1: campaign against the securities Broaden Bay. Then the idea that 114 00:06:35,560 --> 00:06:37,880 Speaker 1: it was a witch hunt, that the charges were trumped up, 115 00:06:38,279 --> 00:06:41,320 Speaker 1: that it was a politicized prosecution of a political figure. 116 00:06:41,560 --> 00:06:44,640 Speaker 1: You know, that really kind of resonated with Republicans in Texas, 117 00:06:44,680 --> 00:06:47,240 Speaker 1: and it presented him from that primary challenge. So of 118 00:06:47,279 --> 00:06:49,320 Speaker 1: course he had a Democrat challenged him in the general 119 00:06:49,400 --> 00:06:52,599 Speaker 1: of a Yale educated lawyer named Justin Nelson, who had 120 00:06:52,600 --> 00:06:56,720 Speaker 1: a very impressive resume though no real political background. And 121 00:06:56,760 --> 00:06:59,599 Speaker 1: Nelson turned the securities case into the centerpiece of his 122 00:06:59,720 --> 00:07:02,120 Speaker 1: camp Pine And yes, he appeared in front of a 123 00:07:02,160 --> 00:07:04,880 Speaker 1: truck with you know, Ken Paxton's mug shot blown up. 124 00:07:04,920 --> 00:07:07,480 Speaker 1: He actually got a hold of that security footage of 125 00:07:07,920 --> 00:07:11,120 Speaker 1: Paxton allegedly stealing the pen and turned that into attack 126 00:07:11,120 --> 00:07:12,960 Speaker 1: ads that you know, the featured on the John all 127 00:07:13,000 --> 00:07:15,360 Speaker 1: of the show, and so he really burrowed in on 128 00:07:15,400 --> 00:07:19,080 Speaker 1: the depical issues. But you know, ultimately, Democrats don't win 129 00:07:19,240 --> 00:07:22,400 Speaker 1: statewide elections in Texas. That hasn't happened in decades um, 130 00:07:22,440 --> 00:07:24,640 Speaker 1: and it's been the kind of holy grail of the 131 00:07:24,680 --> 00:07:28,160 Speaker 1: Texas Democratic Party for a long time. And Nelson came close, 132 00:07:28,240 --> 00:07:31,320 Speaker 1: but he ultimately lost, which is sort of a testament 133 00:07:31,400 --> 00:07:33,680 Speaker 1: to the strength of the Republican Party in Texas that 134 00:07:33,800 --> 00:07:36,400 Speaker 1: even somebody like Paxton, with all of the legal and 135 00:07:36,600 --> 00:07:39,760 Speaker 1: escal issues hanging over that still one re election in 136 00:07:39,760 --> 00:07:43,680 Speaker 1: the circumstances. He also is using his connection to Trump 137 00:07:43,960 --> 00:07:48,360 Speaker 1: to his benefit. Absolutely, he's succeeded in really buddying up 138 00:07:48,400 --> 00:07:51,800 Speaker 1: to Trump. Trump endorsed him in eighteen at a at 139 00:07:51,320 --> 00:07:55,400 Speaker 1: a National Rifle Association convention where Trump was speaking, he 140 00:07:55,480 --> 00:07:58,120 Speaker 1: had I endorsed Ken Taxon. I also endorsed his wife, 141 00:07:58,200 --> 00:08:00,840 Speaker 1: Angela Paxton, who was running from the state Senate. And 142 00:08:00,880 --> 00:08:04,000 Speaker 1: so he's really kind of cast himself as Trump's biggest 143 00:08:04,080 --> 00:08:07,640 Speaker 1: legal defender. And Trump's incredibly popular in Texas, and so 144 00:08:07,920 --> 00:08:10,800 Speaker 1: you know, it's been a successful political strategy for paxts. 145 00:08:11,280 --> 00:08:14,960 Speaker 1: He is involved in yet another scandal. Eight people within 146 00:08:15,080 --> 00:08:18,680 Speaker 1: his office became whistleblowers. So this was a scandal that 147 00:08:19,280 --> 00:08:22,160 Speaker 1: exploded in the fall, and for a while it really 148 00:08:22,200 --> 00:08:24,600 Speaker 1: looked like it could end Paxton's career, like he might 149 00:08:24,640 --> 00:08:26,760 Speaker 1: actually be forced to resign in the wake of this. 150 00:08:27,400 --> 00:08:30,320 Speaker 1: Taxon had a longstanding friendship with a guy named Nate 151 00:08:30,400 --> 00:08:33,480 Speaker 1: Paul who's a real estate developer in Austin who has 152 00:08:33,520 --> 00:08:35,880 Speaker 1: had his own legal trouble but has also become a 153 00:08:35,960 --> 00:08:38,520 Speaker 1: kind of prominent figure in the Austin real estate world 154 00:08:38,520 --> 00:08:43,640 Speaker 1: by buying up lots of high price, high value downtown 155 00:08:43,679 --> 00:08:46,480 Speaker 1: properties in the city. So he impacts him with friends 156 00:08:46,520 --> 00:08:49,480 Speaker 1: in twenty nineteen, Paul became the subject of an FBI 157 00:08:49,520 --> 00:08:52,360 Speaker 1: investigation and his home was actually greeted by the FBI, 158 00:08:52,640 --> 00:08:54,920 Speaker 1: and that sort of triggered a series of events in 159 00:08:54,920 --> 00:08:58,760 Speaker 1: which Paxton kind of intervened in various ways to try 160 00:08:58,800 --> 00:09:02,040 Speaker 1: to help Paul out. So, for instance, Paul wanted information 161 00:09:02,080 --> 00:09:05,320 Speaker 1: about why the FBI had rated his department, and so 162 00:09:05,360 --> 00:09:07,880 Speaker 1: he filed an open records request to try to get 163 00:09:08,080 --> 00:09:11,040 Speaker 1: some of that information. It would be very unusual for 164 00:09:11,120 --> 00:09:14,520 Speaker 1: the Texas government to turnover documents relating to an open 165 00:09:14,600 --> 00:09:18,240 Speaker 1: FBI investigation, but that request ended up that Taxton's office, 166 00:09:18,280 --> 00:09:21,960 Speaker 1: and Paxton started pressuring his top stackers, his top aid 167 00:09:22,160 --> 00:09:25,000 Speaker 1: to to do something to to help get these records 168 00:09:25,320 --> 00:09:30,040 Speaker 1: to Paul. At the same time, he also basically forced 169 00:09:30,160 --> 00:09:33,040 Speaker 1: the Attorney General's office, over the objections of his staff, 170 00:09:33,120 --> 00:09:36,440 Speaker 1: to intervene in a lawsuit that Paul was involved in 171 00:09:36,440 --> 00:09:38,559 Speaker 1: and to intervene on Paul's behalf to kind of help 172 00:09:38,640 --> 00:09:41,439 Speaker 1: him out in that way as well. Paul also kind 173 00:09:41,440 --> 00:09:46,960 Speaker 1: of concocted a theory that FBI agents and US prosecutors 174 00:09:47,000 --> 00:09:49,599 Speaker 1: had somehow altered the warrant for the search of his 175 00:09:49,720 --> 00:09:52,079 Speaker 1: house that had been granted by a judge in ways 176 00:09:52,120 --> 00:09:55,520 Speaker 1: that were illegal, and he wanted to text turn General's 177 00:09:55,520 --> 00:09:59,920 Speaker 1: office to investigate the Paxton appointed a special prosecutor to 178 00:10:00,040 --> 00:10:02,400 Speaker 1: look into this. There's a certain irony and tax at 179 00:10:02,480 --> 00:10:05,520 Speaker 1: hiring a special prosecute after railing against a special prosecutor 180 00:10:05,559 --> 00:10:07,680 Speaker 1: in his own securities case, but he gets a special 181 00:10:07,679 --> 00:10:09,880 Speaker 1: prosecutor to work on it. You know, even after his 182 00:10:09,920 --> 00:10:13,439 Speaker 1: own staff objective and his staff was serious about what 183 00:10:13,480 --> 00:10:16,040 Speaker 1: was going on, had had deep concerns, you know, thought 184 00:10:16,080 --> 00:10:18,839 Speaker 1: that Paxton might be being bribed by Paul, that I 185 00:10:18,960 --> 00:10:22,200 Speaker 1: might be the victim of blackmail and on mask. This 186 00:10:22,440 --> 00:10:26,840 Speaker 1: group of top deputies resigned reported tax into local authorities, 187 00:10:26,880 --> 00:10:29,240 Speaker 1: you know, went public to the press, and it was 188 00:10:29,280 --> 00:10:33,480 Speaker 1: a huge scandal in Texas politics. And Republicans stood by 189 00:10:33,559 --> 00:10:36,760 Speaker 1: Paxton during the Securities for US case started coming out 190 00:10:36,800 --> 00:10:39,040 Speaker 1: and criticizing him, saying, this looks really bad. You know, 191 00:10:39,120 --> 00:10:42,200 Speaker 1: this looks corrupt. So we've got US prosecuters in San 192 00:10:42,200 --> 00:10:45,280 Speaker 1: Antonio who are investigating taxon, so that could be a 193 00:10:45,280 --> 00:10:48,480 Speaker 1: federal indictment on state indictment that he's already contending with. 194 00:10:48,760 --> 00:10:51,040 Speaker 1: You know, he's had to rebuild his staff, which has 195 00:10:51,080 --> 00:10:53,360 Speaker 1: caused various issues. You know, at the same time that 196 00:10:53,400 --> 00:10:56,040 Speaker 1: all this was happening, Texas was preparing a big anti 197 00:10:56,040 --> 00:10:58,719 Speaker 1: trust case against Google. The guy who was spearheading that 198 00:10:58,800 --> 00:11:01,200 Speaker 1: work was one of the age resigned in protests, and 199 00:11:01,280 --> 00:11:03,800 Speaker 1: so Taxison's had to go to outside law firms to 200 00:11:03,840 --> 00:11:06,199 Speaker 1: ask the legislature for more money to help them hire 201 00:11:06,280 --> 00:11:08,760 Speaker 1: people to come in and work on that Google case. So, 202 00:11:09,320 --> 00:11:12,680 Speaker 1: you know, there have been all kinds of issues, both political, legal, 203 00:11:12,679 --> 00:11:17,040 Speaker 1: and practical, stemming from this Nate Paul situation. It's also 204 00:11:17,120 --> 00:11:21,760 Speaker 1: emerged that Paul was the employer of Paxiston's former mistress, 205 00:11:21,760 --> 00:11:24,439 Speaker 1: sort of adding another kind of element to this mix 206 00:11:24,520 --> 00:11:27,400 Speaker 1: and also providing a kind of potential rationale for what 207 00:11:27,440 --> 00:11:30,679 Speaker 1: Taxian is doing. You know, he wanted Paul to give 208 00:11:30,720 --> 00:11:32,959 Speaker 1: a job to this mistress, you know, and you know, 209 00:11:33,200 --> 00:11:35,320 Speaker 1: keep her happy and keep Paul happy. That's the type 210 00:11:35,320 --> 00:11:38,079 Speaker 1: of hypothesis the people in Texas political circulture kind of 211 00:11:38,120 --> 00:11:41,400 Speaker 1: floating around. But ultimately, you know, we don't really know 212 00:11:41,480 --> 00:11:43,679 Speaker 1: the full story of what was kind of motivating his 213 00:11:43,800 --> 00:11:46,719 Speaker 1: sort of unusual actions on behalf of Paul, but it 214 00:11:46,840 --> 00:11:51,360 Speaker 1: certainly inflicted a lot of political damage. It's motivated to Republicans, 215 00:11:51,400 --> 00:11:54,360 Speaker 1: to prominent Texas Republicans so far to announce primary challenges 216 00:11:54,400 --> 00:11:57,120 Speaker 1: against him, if it's the heart of this FBI investigation 217 00:11:57,160 --> 00:11:59,520 Speaker 1: that's ongoing, and so it's really put him in tail. 218 00:12:00,679 --> 00:12:04,760 Speaker 1: And as you point out, it was the extramarital affair 219 00:12:05,120 --> 00:12:09,200 Speaker 1: that seems to be more problematic for conservatives than the 220 00:12:09,280 --> 00:12:12,080 Speaker 1: rest of the things he's accused of doing. Certainly for 221 00:12:12,120 --> 00:12:13,719 Speaker 1: some people. I mean, there's a there. There are a 222 00:12:13,840 --> 00:12:16,160 Speaker 1: range of views on this, and there are certainly conservative 223 00:12:16,280 --> 00:12:18,840 Speaker 1: Texas who are appalled by the corruption allegations and for 224 00:12:18,920 --> 00:12:21,600 Speaker 1: whom that's the main issue. But an important thing to 225 00:12:21,640 --> 00:12:24,520 Speaker 1: understand about Paxton. He's often compared to Trump, and he 226 00:12:24,559 --> 00:12:26,880 Speaker 1: does have certain similarities Trump in the way that he's 227 00:12:26,920 --> 00:12:29,120 Speaker 1: kind of adjacent to a criminal behavior and that there 228 00:12:29,120 --> 00:12:31,720 Speaker 1: are all these kinds of ethical concerns. Yet he survived. 229 00:12:32,240 --> 00:12:35,480 Speaker 1: But you know, unlike Trump, he had a reputation as 230 00:12:35,480 --> 00:12:38,199 Speaker 1: a kind of a boy scout. He was a super religious, 231 00:12:38,280 --> 00:12:42,160 Speaker 1: well behaved at a strong marriage, strong family life. That 232 00:12:42,240 --> 00:12:46,120 Speaker 1: was a big element of his appeal to conservatives in Texas. 233 00:12:46,160 --> 00:12:48,400 Speaker 1: So whereas for Trump, it's not really a big deal, 234 00:12:48,440 --> 00:12:51,440 Speaker 1: at least politically, for him to be accused of having 235 00:12:51,840 --> 00:12:55,400 Speaker 1: affairs for for Paxton, it's pretty damaging because it kind 236 00:12:55,400 --> 00:12:59,320 Speaker 1: of chips away at the whole basis of his political appeal. 237 00:12:59,559 --> 00:13:03,000 Speaker 1: And so he's had, you know, evangelical conservatives who supported 238 00:13:03,080 --> 00:13:05,920 Speaker 1: him for years turn away from him over the allegation 239 00:13:05,960 --> 00:13:09,040 Speaker 1: of his affair, which he's never denied. And unlike Trump, 240 00:13:09,360 --> 00:13:13,800 Speaker 1: he's the top law enforcement authority in the state of Texas. 241 00:13:13,840 --> 00:13:17,120 Speaker 1: So it seems so strange to me that he can 242 00:13:17,120 --> 00:13:21,000 Speaker 1: have all these charges and still survive as the Texas 243 00:13:21,080 --> 00:13:23,800 Speaker 1: Attorney General. I think it's really a story about the 244 00:13:23,840 --> 00:13:26,640 Speaker 1: strength of the Republican Party in Texas over the last 245 00:13:26,640 --> 00:13:29,040 Speaker 1: two decades. And it's also a story about the power 246 00:13:29,080 --> 00:13:32,640 Speaker 1: of Donald Trump and about how savvy political operators aligned 247 00:13:32,679 --> 00:13:36,040 Speaker 1: themselves with Trump and basically used their association with him 248 00:13:36,040 --> 00:13:39,880 Speaker 1: as a political lifeline. And the question now is does 249 00:13:39,920 --> 00:13:43,960 Speaker 1: that still work in you know, Trump's out of office, 250 00:13:44,000 --> 00:13:46,480 Speaker 1: He's still an incredibly influential figure in the party. But 251 00:13:47,040 --> 00:13:51,120 Speaker 1: is he so powerful that alignment with him can help 252 00:13:51,160 --> 00:13:55,400 Speaker 1: you overcome allegations of corruption, allegations of an affair. And 253 00:13:55,440 --> 00:13:58,320 Speaker 1: we're going to find out next year when he when 254 00:13:58,360 --> 00:14:01,560 Speaker 1: Paxton goes up against George P. Bush that Jeb Son 255 00:14:02,000 --> 00:14:06,000 Speaker 1: in a Republican primary for re election as attorney general. 256 00:14:06,320 --> 00:14:09,960 Speaker 1: You spoke to the DC Attorney General, Carl Rassine, what's 257 00:14:10,040 --> 00:14:13,320 Speaker 1: his interest in Paxton sorg. Carl Rasin that the attorney 258 00:14:13,360 --> 00:14:16,640 Speaker 1: General in DC as a former law school classmate of Paxtons, 259 00:14:16,840 --> 00:14:21,720 Speaker 1: and as part of his response to the January six riot, 260 00:14:22,080 --> 00:14:25,640 Speaker 1: he's been looking very closely at what various speakers at 261 00:14:25,640 --> 00:14:29,320 Speaker 1: the event said before the riot started, including Trump, and 262 00:14:29,320 --> 00:14:32,240 Speaker 1: he's even raised the possibility at various points and nothing 263 00:14:32,280 --> 00:14:34,600 Speaker 1: has happened that you know, he might consider some sort 264 00:14:34,600 --> 00:14:39,280 Speaker 1: of misdemeanor charge against Trump related to incitement of the riot. So, 265 00:14:39,360 --> 00:14:40,880 Speaker 1: you know, when I spoke to him, he was very 266 00:14:40,880 --> 00:14:43,800 Speaker 1: clear that you know, he heard what Paxson said as well. 267 00:14:43,880 --> 00:14:45,840 Speaker 1: He thought Paximan on the wrong side of history, and 268 00:14:45,880 --> 00:14:48,040 Speaker 1: that he had those commons on tape and he was 269 00:14:48,080 --> 00:14:51,200 Speaker 1: looking at him. The ability of the DC Attorney General 270 00:14:51,480 --> 00:14:56,320 Speaker 1: to bring criminal charges is limited. Can't prosecute some any 271 00:14:56,360 --> 00:14:58,880 Speaker 1: cases in DC. That's the responsibility of the U. S. 272 00:14:58,880 --> 00:15:01,320 Speaker 1: Attorney's Office and just the District of Columbia, which is 273 00:15:01,320 --> 00:15:04,480 Speaker 1: a branch of the federal government. So you know, whether 274 00:15:04,560 --> 00:15:08,440 Speaker 1: he'll actually bring any charges over incitement of January six 275 00:15:08,520 --> 00:15:12,040 Speaker 1: against any of the speakers is unclear. It's probably unlikely, 276 00:15:12,520 --> 00:15:15,200 Speaker 1: but it's not impossible. And certainly in the early days 277 00:15:15,200 --> 00:15:17,240 Speaker 1: after January six, the scene is making a lot of 278 00:15:17,280 --> 00:15:21,520 Speaker 1: noises about investigating people who are there at the valley. Well, 279 00:15:21,560 --> 00:15:24,920 Speaker 1: you spoke to so many people for this story, and 280 00:15:25,280 --> 00:15:28,600 Speaker 1: do they all attest to the fact that, you know 281 00:15:28,680 --> 00:15:31,680 Speaker 1: he works well under pressure. With all these things coming 282 00:15:31,720 --> 00:15:36,320 Speaker 1: at him, he might actually have a fighting chance. I mean, look, 283 00:15:36,360 --> 00:15:39,000 Speaker 1: he's a good politician. There's a reason he survived in 284 00:15:39,160 --> 00:15:42,080 Speaker 1: Texas politics at the statewide level for so long. He's 285 00:15:42,120 --> 00:15:45,480 Speaker 1: really personable. He's got a kind of folksy charm. He's 286 00:15:45,520 --> 00:15:48,280 Speaker 1: not a super charismatic speaker. He doesn't bring the house 287 00:15:48,320 --> 00:15:50,680 Speaker 1: down the way somebody like Ted Cruz has sort of 288 00:15:50,760 --> 00:15:53,000 Speaker 1: learned to do over the years. But he's good one 289 00:15:53,040 --> 00:15:57,120 Speaker 1: on one. He's got good relationships with other Republicans in Texas. 290 00:15:57,160 --> 00:15:59,240 Speaker 1: He's been able to buddy up the Trump And yeah, 291 00:15:59,240 --> 00:16:00,760 Speaker 1: I mean, this isn't the time he has been at 292 00:16:00,760 --> 00:16:04,080 Speaker 1: the center of a scandal and excused as violating criminal law. 293 00:16:04,240 --> 00:16:06,440 Speaker 1: And so I think he'll probably feel that he can 294 00:16:06,600 --> 00:16:08,280 Speaker 1: ride this out, but this is a new kind of 295 00:16:08,360 --> 00:16:10,880 Speaker 1: challenge from what he's ever faced before. He's never had 296 00:16:11,040 --> 00:16:14,320 Speaker 1: a serious primary opponent since he was elected. This is 297 00:16:14,360 --> 00:16:17,640 Speaker 1: a different type of challenge. Also, if he is indicted 298 00:16:17,680 --> 00:16:20,920 Speaker 1: by federal prosecutors, it's hard to imagine you could survive. 299 00:16:21,120 --> 00:16:23,800 Speaker 1: He would probably have to resign immediately for he to 300 00:16:23,840 --> 00:16:25,880 Speaker 1: be indicted. But you know, there's the question mark of 301 00:16:25,920 --> 00:16:28,320 Speaker 1: the leave of us going to happen. That investigation has 302 00:16:28,360 --> 00:16:31,480 Speaker 1: been going on for six seven eight months at this point, 303 00:16:31,520 --> 00:16:34,760 Speaker 1: there haven't been any charges. Based on people I've spoken 304 00:16:34,800 --> 00:16:37,600 Speaker 1: to who know about the investigation. The guy who's running 305 00:16:37,600 --> 00:16:40,200 Speaker 1: at a US prosecutor in San Antonio named Joe Blackwell 306 00:16:40,280 --> 00:16:43,320 Speaker 1: is kind of a public corruption specialist, you know, talking 307 00:16:43,480 --> 00:16:44,920 Speaker 1: you know, one on one with at least one of 308 00:16:44,920 --> 00:16:50,200 Speaker 1: these whistleblowers. Um who uh, you know flagged the misconduct, 309 00:16:50,280 --> 00:16:53,200 Speaker 1: the alleged misconduct and taxes office. Um. There are other 310 00:16:53,200 --> 00:16:55,520 Speaker 1: people kind of involved in this case that that black 311 00:16:55,560 --> 00:16:57,920 Speaker 1: girl has been in touch with. And so it's clear 312 00:16:57,960 --> 00:17:00,360 Speaker 1: that he's been taking this seriously. But whether that mean 313 00:17:00,600 --> 00:17:03,000 Speaker 1: a criminal indictment can pack him of the half de 314 00:17:03,120 --> 00:17:06,320 Speaker 1: Waite and the Sea. Thanks David. That's Bloomberg Legal reporter 315 00:17:06,440 --> 00:17:10,840 Speaker 1: David Yaffi Bellini. All eyes are on the Supreme Court 316 00:17:10,880 --> 00:17:13,199 Speaker 1: in the last days of the term, with the question 317 00:17:13,240 --> 00:17:16,360 Speaker 1: being whether eighty two year old Justice Stephen Bryer will 318 00:17:16,400 --> 00:17:19,800 Speaker 1: retire so that President Joe Biden can appoint a black 319 00:17:19,840 --> 00:17:22,720 Speaker 1: woman to the Court as he's promised. In the meantime, 320 00:17:22,760 --> 00:17:26,040 Speaker 1: Biden is continuing to nominate judges to circuit and district 321 00:17:26,080 --> 00:17:29,960 Speaker 1: courts at a fast pace, confirming nominees faster than any 322 00:17:30,040 --> 00:17:32,800 Speaker 1: president since Nixon at this time in the first year. 323 00:17:33,640 --> 00:17:36,160 Speaker 1: Joining me as Carl Tobias, a professor at the University 324 00:17:36,160 --> 00:17:40,200 Speaker 1: of Richmond Law School, how many circuit court vacancies has 325 00:17:40,280 --> 00:17:45,080 Speaker 1: Biden filled and how many does he have remaining to fill? Well, 326 00:17:45,119 --> 00:17:49,080 Speaker 1: he has filled two and one was confirmed last week 327 00:17:49,600 --> 00:17:53,840 Speaker 1: Candice Jackson at roomy for the seventh Circuits. And there 328 00:17:53,840 --> 00:18:01,440 Speaker 1: are seven present vacancies for which he's nominated five four uh, 329 00:18:01,480 --> 00:18:05,800 Speaker 1: and so he's working at a very quick pace. Then 330 00:18:05,840 --> 00:18:10,000 Speaker 1: there are a number of future circuits vacancies, like seven more, 331 00:18:10,720 --> 00:18:15,440 Speaker 1: but those would not be ready to be filled. So 332 00:18:15,560 --> 00:18:18,760 Speaker 1: that's where we are on the heels Court. Are these 333 00:18:18,880 --> 00:18:24,919 Speaker 1: just replacing judges appointed by Democrats, so there's no chance 334 00:18:25,000 --> 00:18:27,720 Speaker 1: of flipping a circuit. Yes and no. I mean the 335 00:18:27,760 --> 00:18:31,359 Speaker 1: person I just mentioned for the seventh Circuit replaces someone 336 00:18:32,359 --> 00:18:36,879 Speaker 1: I believe a Republican president I think Ford appointed, So 337 00:18:36,920 --> 00:18:40,360 Speaker 1: if you're counting that way, it does make a difference. 338 00:18:41,440 --> 00:18:45,159 Speaker 1: Brown Jackson replaced, of course, Mark Carland, who was a 339 00:18:45,240 --> 00:18:50,160 Speaker 1: Democratic appointee. Clinton tell us about Candice Jackson Echo Wilmy, 340 00:18:50,200 --> 00:18:53,600 Speaker 1: who was confirmed to the Seventh Circuit. She is the 341 00:18:53,720 --> 00:18:59,159 Speaker 1: second black woman to serve on that court. Uh and 342 00:18:59,440 --> 00:19:02,360 Speaker 1: it had had no people of color on the court 343 00:19:02,440 --> 00:19:07,320 Speaker 1: until she was confirmed. Um. She was a federal public 344 00:19:07,560 --> 00:19:12,280 Speaker 1: defender in I think Chicago for the last decade or so, 345 00:19:13,080 --> 00:19:16,399 Speaker 1: and has also been in private practice. But she had 346 00:19:16,440 --> 00:19:20,399 Speaker 1: a very strong hearing uh and I was confirmed fifty 347 00:19:20,440 --> 00:19:23,920 Speaker 1: to forty three. So she got support from a few 348 00:19:23,960 --> 00:19:30,040 Speaker 1: Republicans Senator Susan Collins, Lindsay Graham, and Lisa Murkowski. Why 349 00:19:30,160 --> 00:19:33,440 Speaker 1: are the others not voting for these candidates? I mean, 350 00:19:33,480 --> 00:19:36,080 Speaker 1: is it just a party line that they're not going 351 00:19:36,160 --> 00:19:40,639 Speaker 1: to vote for any of Biden's nominees. But to some 352 00:19:40,800 --> 00:19:44,200 Speaker 1: extent that's true. It does seem like there's lockstep voting, 353 00:19:44,240 --> 00:19:48,440 Speaker 1: with some exceptions, especially at the pellate level. That's less 354 00:19:48,480 --> 00:19:53,639 Speaker 1: true at the district level. Remember back the first three, 355 00:19:53,640 --> 00:19:56,240 Speaker 1: the two from New Jersey for the district courts and 356 00:19:56,720 --> 00:20:02,440 Speaker 1: Rodriguez for the Colorado Court. They were pretty strong bipartisan 357 00:20:02,520 --> 00:20:06,320 Speaker 1: voting for the district nominees eight one to sixteen for 358 00:20:07,000 --> 00:20:10,239 Speaker 1: Dahi Karashi, who's the first Muslim to ever sit on 359 00:20:10,320 --> 00:20:14,000 Speaker 1: the district bench. Uh and so the other two were 360 00:20:14,000 --> 00:20:18,000 Speaker 1: pretty strong as well for district courts. So I think 361 00:20:18,040 --> 00:20:22,200 Speaker 1: that's the pattern you might be seeing very strong Republican 362 00:20:22,280 --> 00:20:27,360 Speaker 1: bipartisan voting on district nominees, but resistant on the appellate nominees. 363 00:20:27,600 --> 00:20:30,920 Speaker 1: It's consistent with you know, the stress that Trump put 364 00:20:31,000 --> 00:20:34,359 Speaker 1: on the appellate bens. It just seems that the partisan 365 00:20:34,520 --> 00:20:38,720 Speaker 1: nature of the judicial confirmations at the circuit courts, it 366 00:20:38,760 --> 00:20:42,120 Speaker 1: seems like nothing is going to change it. Well, that's right, 367 00:20:42,200 --> 00:20:46,560 Speaker 1: there are some bipartisan measures they could take, but as 368 00:20:46,560 --> 00:20:49,840 Speaker 1: you suggest, I think at that level, because those are 369 00:20:49,840 --> 00:20:52,960 Speaker 1: such critical positions, you know, they're essentially supreme courts in 370 00:20:53,080 --> 00:20:56,560 Speaker 1: their regions. Because the Supreme Court here is so few cases, 371 00:20:57,040 --> 00:21:00,359 Speaker 1: there's much more perceived to be in actually at stake 372 00:21:00,480 --> 00:21:04,359 Speaker 1: in each one of these nominations and confirmations, so they're 373 00:21:04,400 --> 00:21:08,560 Speaker 1: closely scrutinized, and the votes and committee often are closed, 374 00:21:08,640 --> 00:21:11,600 Speaker 1: and sometimes there are ties, And I think you're right, 375 00:21:11,680 --> 00:21:14,720 Speaker 1: there is a lot of party line voting that is 376 00:21:14,760 --> 00:21:17,560 Speaker 1: going on as to the appeals courts, less so with 377 00:21:17,600 --> 00:21:21,080 Speaker 1: the district courts right now, So three of the openings 378 00:21:21,440 --> 00:21:24,800 Speaker 1: at the circuit court level are at the Second Circuit. 379 00:21:24,960 --> 00:21:28,560 Speaker 1: Biden is nominated to tell us about them. One is 380 00:21:28,880 --> 00:21:34,439 Speaker 1: unite ly nominated on May twelve, and she has about 381 00:21:34,440 --> 00:21:38,600 Speaker 1: two decades of experience both in the state and federal 382 00:21:38,640 --> 00:21:43,280 Speaker 1: systems as a public defender. She's black, and I think 383 00:21:43,320 --> 00:21:47,359 Speaker 1: there's no black person on the Second Circuit currently, and 384 00:21:47,560 --> 00:21:51,640 Speaker 1: she had a hearing last month, and so she would 385 00:21:51,640 --> 00:21:53,800 Speaker 1: get a committee vote, I think when they come back 386 00:21:54,000 --> 00:21:59,600 Speaker 1: on the fifteenth of July. And the second Second Circuit 387 00:21:59,640 --> 00:22:03,200 Speaker 1: nominee is near No Perez, who heads up the Voting 388 00:22:03,200 --> 00:22:06,440 Speaker 1: Writs Project at n y U Law School, and she's 389 00:22:06,440 --> 00:22:10,320 Speaker 1: been very active on voting rights issues and was recommended 390 00:22:10,320 --> 00:22:13,960 Speaker 1: by Senator Schumer dominated on the fifteenth of June. I 391 00:22:14,040 --> 00:22:17,600 Speaker 1: wonder if she's going to face a lot of opposition 392 00:22:17,880 --> 00:22:22,680 Speaker 1: or tough questions from Republicans because she has worked at 393 00:22:22,720 --> 00:22:27,679 Speaker 1: the very liberal rent and center. Well, that's possible, but 394 00:22:27,840 --> 00:22:31,760 Speaker 1: all the nominees for the appeals courts have faced rigorous 395 00:22:31,840 --> 00:22:37,280 Speaker 1: and sometimes difficult questioning. Unice Lee did two questions about 396 00:22:37,280 --> 00:22:42,600 Speaker 1: her ability on a generalist court here civil cases since 397 00:22:42,640 --> 00:22:47,359 Speaker 1: her practice was almost exclusively criminal defense work. And Veronica 398 00:22:47,520 --> 00:22:50,280 Speaker 1: Rossman for the tense circuit, has been a long time 399 00:22:50,400 --> 00:22:54,560 Speaker 1: federal public defender too, and say similar questions. But you're right, 400 00:22:54,800 --> 00:22:57,520 Speaker 1: I think that's true. And they've already been some critical 401 00:22:57,560 --> 00:23:01,960 Speaker 1: comments about Perez and s and Grassley. The ranking member 402 00:23:02,560 --> 00:23:06,800 Speaker 1: has talked a lot about what he characterized as criminal 403 00:23:06,880 --> 00:23:11,120 Speaker 1: defense attorneys and wondering can they handle the civil docket? 404 00:23:11,280 --> 00:23:15,040 Speaker 1: Are they grasping at straws here? Years ago? Did you 405 00:23:15,080 --> 00:23:18,960 Speaker 1: ask even Supreme Court justices about could they handle the 406 00:23:19,000 --> 00:23:22,680 Speaker 1: criminal docket if they were civil? Is this something new? No? 407 00:23:22,920 --> 00:23:25,840 Speaker 1: And that's a really good point. Think about Louis Powell. 408 00:23:25,880 --> 00:23:29,120 Speaker 1: I think he never had a criminal case, yet he 409 00:23:29,200 --> 00:23:32,320 Speaker 1: wrote some of the most important decisions in his time 410 00:23:32,400 --> 00:23:35,520 Speaker 1: on the court in the criminal procedure area. He was 411 00:23:35,560 --> 00:23:38,960 Speaker 1: basically a corporate civil attorney. He didn't do a lot 412 00:23:39,000 --> 00:23:43,320 Speaker 1: of litigation. Everybody admired and respected him as a fine 413 00:23:43,440 --> 00:23:46,760 Speaker 1: jurist for the period he served, So you're correct, and 414 00:23:46,840 --> 00:23:49,760 Speaker 1: think back to the Trump appellet nominees. They were not 415 00:23:49,960 --> 00:23:54,879 Speaker 1: questioned when they had either little or no civil or 416 00:23:54,880 --> 00:23:57,520 Speaker 1: criminal experience. Many of them, for example, where prosecutors and 417 00:23:57,640 --> 00:24:00,399 Speaker 1: had not done much civil work. So a bit of 418 00:24:00,400 --> 00:24:03,000 Speaker 1: a double standard here. That's how's he doing compared to 419 00:24:03,040 --> 00:24:08,119 Speaker 1: other presidents. Well, he's doing very well. He has confirmed 420 00:24:08,160 --> 00:24:11,679 Speaker 1: two people for the appellate courts and buy for the 421 00:24:11,800 --> 00:24:16,000 Speaker 1: district courts. And the last time a president filled so 422 00:24:16,160 --> 00:24:21,560 Speaker 1: many by July four recess was President Nixon. So you 423 00:24:21,640 --> 00:24:24,639 Speaker 1: have to go back to I think sixty nine to 424 00:24:25,040 --> 00:24:28,440 Speaker 1: find a president who had come out of the starting 425 00:24:28,440 --> 00:24:30,960 Speaker 1: blocks so quickly. And don't forget there are a whole 426 00:24:31,040 --> 00:24:35,040 Speaker 1: number of people in the pipeline um. Next month we'll 427 00:24:35,080 --> 00:24:38,439 Speaker 1: see in a couple of more hearings and we'll have 428 00:24:38,680 --> 00:24:42,679 Speaker 1: many votes and confirmation. So I think if we're talking 429 00:24:42,720 --> 00:24:47,080 Speaker 1: at the August recess, we're likely to see fifteen or 430 00:24:47,520 --> 00:24:52,680 Speaker 1: maybe even more people confirmed, which also I think will 431 00:24:52,840 --> 00:24:55,480 Speaker 1: go back quite a way before you can find another 432 00:24:55,480 --> 00:24:59,720 Speaker 1: president who's been so active with such a good process. 433 00:24:59,760 --> 00:25:01,359 Speaker 1: I mean, I think they're moving to the White House, 434 00:25:01,359 --> 00:25:04,359 Speaker 1: they're moving to the committee hearings every two weeks, then 435 00:25:04,520 --> 00:25:07,520 Speaker 1: committee votes and then flour votes, and so it does 436 00:25:07,560 --> 00:25:11,760 Speaker 1: look like a well oiled and orchestrated machine. Are you 437 00:25:11,840 --> 00:25:15,360 Speaker 1: surprised because I thought that the Trump administration would get 438 00:25:15,359 --> 00:25:20,840 Speaker 1: the top grade for moving judicial nominees through. Well, he 439 00:25:20,920 --> 00:25:23,600 Speaker 1: didn't start as quickly, and not to understand why he 440 00:25:23,640 --> 00:25:27,080 Speaker 1: wasn't familiar with the federal government how it worked. But Biden, 441 00:25:27,119 --> 00:25:31,040 Speaker 1: of course, remember has fifty years of experience with selected 442 00:25:31,160 --> 00:25:35,080 Speaker 1: judges and administrations, and in the Senate for more than 443 00:25:35,160 --> 00:25:38,879 Speaker 1: three decades and its Chair of Judiciary, so it's not 444 00:25:38,960 --> 00:25:43,639 Speaker 1: surprising that he um is very astute about how the 445 00:25:43,680 --> 00:25:48,600 Speaker 1: process works nomination and confirmation and would have great people 446 00:25:48,600 --> 00:25:50,760 Speaker 1: around him, which he does. Of course, Ron claimed, the 447 00:25:50,840 --> 00:25:54,000 Speaker 1: chiefest Staff is acutely aware of this because in earlier 448 00:25:54,040 --> 00:25:58,840 Speaker 1: democratic administrations he had had responsibility for judicial selection and 449 00:25:59,080 --> 00:26:02,360 Speaker 1: one big criticism of Obama's first year was not much 450 00:26:02,400 --> 00:26:06,880 Speaker 1: activity on that front. And I think this administration has 451 00:26:06,960 --> 00:26:10,000 Speaker 1: learned a lesson from that and has moved very quickly 452 00:26:10,440 --> 00:26:14,600 Speaker 1: and effectively. Do you know who's leading the charge at 453 00:26:14,600 --> 00:26:18,840 Speaker 1: the White House. Yes, it's Dana Ramos, who is the 454 00:26:18,840 --> 00:26:22,720 Speaker 1: White House Council. And then there I think a couple 455 00:26:22,760 --> 00:26:28,240 Speaker 1: of associate White House Councils who are working closely with her. 456 00:26:28,640 --> 00:26:32,640 Speaker 1: But as I understand, the President is often interviewing himself. 457 00:26:33,359 --> 00:26:36,760 Speaker 1: The Palate nominee is not all the district nominees because 458 00:26:36,960 --> 00:26:40,359 Speaker 1: there just isn't enough time. But the nominees are being 459 00:26:40,520 --> 00:26:45,280 Speaker 1: of candidates are being thoroughly bettered before they are actually nominated, 460 00:26:45,840 --> 00:26:48,800 Speaker 1: and the people in that office are people who have 461 00:26:48,840 --> 00:26:51,639 Speaker 1: either worked on the Hill on judicial selection, worked in 462 00:26:51,720 --> 00:26:55,920 Speaker 1: prior White Houses unjudicial selection, and are intimately familiar with 463 00:26:56,080 --> 00:26:59,600 Speaker 1: the processes. So now I'm going to switch to the 464 00:26:59,600 --> 00:27:03,440 Speaker 1: Supreme Court for a moment. Justice Stephen Bryer. There are 465 00:27:03,440 --> 00:27:06,479 Speaker 1: no indications whether he's going to retire or not. He 466 00:27:06,600 --> 00:27:10,639 Speaker 1: has actually hired four clerks for next term, so that 467 00:27:10,720 --> 00:27:13,280 Speaker 1: might be an indication that he's not going to retire. 468 00:27:13,720 --> 00:27:16,840 Speaker 1: If he doesn't retire, what do you make of Senator 469 00:27:16,920 --> 00:27:22,000 Speaker 1: Mitch McConnell saying that if the Republicans retake the majority 470 00:27:22,040 --> 00:27:25,680 Speaker 1: in the Senate, it's highly unlikely that he'll let President 471 00:27:25,760 --> 00:27:29,520 Speaker 1: Biden confirm a Supreme Court vacancy if one opened up 472 00:27:29,560 --> 00:27:32,760 Speaker 1: in four, And we don't even know what he would 473 00:27:32,760 --> 00:27:36,920 Speaker 1: do if there were an opening in three. I think 474 00:27:36,960 --> 00:27:39,919 Speaker 1: you are correct. He's already issued a threat that he 475 00:27:39,960 --> 00:27:44,640 Speaker 1: would repeat what happened with Marrick Garland in the vacancy 476 00:27:45,520 --> 00:27:49,399 Speaker 1: if something similar happened. So, on the other hand, it 477 00:27:49,480 --> 00:27:54,600 Speaker 1: may be the Justice Briar would step down in the 478 00:27:54,640 --> 00:27:57,959 Speaker 1: Democrats would still have a majority in the Senate. UH, 479 00:27:58,040 --> 00:28:03,120 Speaker 1: And the Democrats may win and hold onto the Senate. UM. 480 00:28:03,400 --> 00:28:06,920 Speaker 1: So there are a lot of scenarios. UM. McConnell can't 481 00:28:06,960 --> 00:28:11,959 Speaker 1: do very much by way of obstruction UM until he 482 00:28:12,119 --> 00:28:16,960 Speaker 1: has a majority, and so that won't happen at the 483 00:28:17,040 --> 00:28:21,480 Speaker 1: earliest until so we still have UH. There's another year 484 00:28:21,600 --> 00:28:25,720 Speaker 1: in which um, the Democrats could nominate and confirm someone 485 00:28:25,840 --> 00:28:29,600 Speaker 1: for Friar's seat should he step down. Of course, the 486 00:28:29,800 --> 00:28:34,200 Speaker 1: Progressives like to point out that it's and anything can 487 00:28:34,240 --> 00:28:38,360 Speaker 1: happen to one of the Democratic senators. That's true, that 488 00:28:38,560 --> 00:28:41,480 Speaker 1: is possible, UH, And I'm sure the Senators are thinking 489 00:28:41,480 --> 00:28:44,480 Speaker 1: about that, as is the White House. UM. But those 490 00:28:44,480 --> 00:28:49,760 Speaker 1: are delicate, difficult kinds of issues, and one of the 491 00:28:49,800 --> 00:28:52,800 Speaker 1: most important decisions that anyone makes is you know, whether 492 00:28:52,960 --> 00:28:56,200 Speaker 1: to retire, And so I think we'll just have to 493 00:28:56,280 --> 00:29:00,800 Speaker 1: wait and see. Briar's position is so like that of 494 00:29:01,040 --> 00:29:04,480 Speaker 1: the late Ruth Bader Ginsburg, where he now is the 495 00:29:04,520 --> 00:29:09,160 Speaker 1: most senior among the liberal justices and has the authority 496 00:29:09,400 --> 00:29:13,600 Speaker 1: to assign opinions if the Liberals are in the majority. 497 00:29:13,720 --> 00:29:18,400 Speaker 1: And that's exactly the position that Ginsberg was in. Yes, 498 00:29:18,520 --> 00:29:23,040 Speaker 1: but fortunately he doesn't have, as far as we know, um, 499 00:29:23,080 --> 00:29:26,040 Speaker 1: some of the health issues that she had, and he 500 00:29:26,120 --> 00:29:31,280 Speaker 1: is significantly younger than she was at the time. UM, 501 00:29:31,320 --> 00:29:35,160 Speaker 1: so hopefully he is in good shape. And he certainly 502 00:29:35,280 --> 00:29:39,480 Speaker 1: seems to be keeping up with everything in terms of 503 00:29:39,520 --> 00:29:43,280 Speaker 1: his secuity and ability to turn out opinions and to 504 00:29:43,480 --> 00:29:47,080 Speaker 1: ask searching questions during our arguments. And so we'll see, 505 00:29:47,560 --> 00:29:50,680 Speaker 1: and we may see in the next few days, because 506 00:29:51,440 --> 00:29:56,240 Speaker 1: justices often retire after the last opinions of the term 507 00:29:56,280 --> 00:29:59,760 Speaker 1: are handed down, So that will be on Thursday. We'll 508 00:29:59,800 --> 00:30:02,320 Speaker 1: keep an eye out for that. Thanks so much, Carl. 509 00:30:02,440 --> 00:30:06,120 Speaker 1: That's Professor Carl Tobias of the University of Richmond Law School. 510 00:30:06,480 --> 00:30:08,760 Speaker 1: And that's it for the edition of the Bloomberg Law Show. 511 00:30:09,240 --> 00:30:11,280 Speaker 1: Remember you can always get the latest legal news on 512 00:30:11,320 --> 00:30:14,800 Speaker 1: our Bloomberg Law podcast. I'm June Grosso, and you're listening 513 00:30:14,880 --> 00:30:15,640 Speaker 1: to Bloomberg