1 00:00:03,000 --> 00:00:06,520 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind, a production of iHeartRadio. 2 00:00:10,760 --> 00:00:13,039 Speaker 2: Hey you, welcome to Stuff to Blow your Mind a 3 00:00:13,039 --> 00:00:15,360 Speaker 2: listener mail. My name is Robert Lamb. 4 00:00:15,400 --> 00:00:17,919 Speaker 3: And I am Joe McCormick, and Hey, today we're going 5 00:00:18,000 --> 00:00:21,079 Speaker 3: to be reading back a batch of messages from our 6 00:00:21,239 --> 00:00:24,880 Speaker 3: email address. If you have never gotten in touch before, 7 00:00:25,239 --> 00:00:27,680 Speaker 3: why not give it a try sometime. You can always 8 00:00:27,720 --> 00:00:30,880 Speaker 3: email us at contact at stuff to Blow your Mind 9 00:00:31,040 --> 00:00:34,840 Speaker 3: dot com. We love messages of all kinds of feedback 10 00:00:34,840 --> 00:00:37,680 Speaker 3: to recent episodes, especially if you have something interesting to 11 00:00:37,760 --> 00:00:39,920 Speaker 3: add to a topic that we've talked about on the show. 12 00:00:40,479 --> 00:00:43,080 Speaker 3: Of course, if corrections are ever necessary, you can reach 13 00:00:43,159 --> 00:00:45,839 Speaker 3: us at contact at stuff to Blow Yourmind dot com. 14 00:00:45,880 --> 00:00:48,400 Speaker 3: You can also just write in to say hi, tell 15 00:00:48,479 --> 00:00:51,000 Speaker 3: us where you listen from, how you listen to the show, 16 00:00:51,200 --> 00:00:53,040 Speaker 3: how you found out about us, that sort of thing. 17 00:00:53,080 --> 00:00:56,960 Speaker 3: That's always stuff we like to learn. Anyway. Again, contact 18 00:00:57,000 --> 00:01:00,320 Speaker 3: at Stuff to Blow your Mind dot com always free 19 00:01:00,400 --> 00:01:03,000 Speaker 3: to get in touch, and your message may end up 20 00:01:03,040 --> 00:01:05,520 Speaker 3: being featured on a listener mail episode like this one. 21 00:01:05,840 --> 00:01:09,319 Speaker 2: Yeah, Yeah, and hey. We also have a discord server. 22 00:01:09,800 --> 00:01:12,399 Speaker 2: If you want to join that, email us at the 23 00:01:12,400 --> 00:01:14,440 Speaker 2: same address and we'll send you the like. 24 00:01:15,080 --> 00:01:17,560 Speaker 3: Let's see, Rob, how about we start off with this 25 00:01:17,720 --> 00:01:22,080 Speaker 3: response to our shield Wall episodes from our listener, Ahmed, 26 00:01:22,120 --> 00:01:23,360 Speaker 3: do you want to read this or should I? 27 00:01:24,120 --> 00:01:32,319 Speaker 2: Sure? Sure, I'll read this one, Ahmed says, Hey, guys, 28 00:01:32,440 --> 00:01:35,440 Speaker 2: Ahmed again here. I just listened to your first episode 29 00:01:35,480 --> 00:01:40,040 Speaker 2: about the speculation around captured Roman legionarias in Western China 30 00:01:40,360 --> 00:01:43,480 Speaker 2: and thought of another firmer example of different cultures meeting 31 00:01:43,560 --> 00:01:46,800 Speaker 2: and our knowledge of that via armor cling it coin 32 00:01:46,880 --> 00:01:51,800 Speaker 2: armor Here's one example, but you can easily find others online. 33 00:01:52,120 --> 00:01:54,640 Speaker 3: And then Rob, I pulled in a couple of images 34 00:01:54,960 --> 00:01:57,960 Speaker 3: of what Ahmed linked here into the outline, but I 35 00:01:57,960 --> 00:02:00,400 Speaker 3: think it's some kind of hide or leather base. And 36 00:02:00,400 --> 00:02:03,880 Speaker 3: then on top of that, there is just this array 37 00:02:04,120 --> 00:02:07,520 Speaker 3: of metal coins, all side by side, sort of strung 38 00:02:07,560 --> 00:02:11,880 Speaker 3: together that creates a scale like formation. Actually, to come 39 00:02:11,880 --> 00:02:13,280 Speaker 3: back to the image of fish scales. 40 00:02:13,840 --> 00:02:16,240 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, it's quite impressive. You know, I believe I 41 00:02:16,320 --> 00:02:18,560 Speaker 2: had read about this at some point in the past, 42 00:02:19,240 --> 00:02:21,359 Speaker 2: but I don't know that I've ever seen an example 43 00:02:21,400 --> 00:02:23,320 Speaker 2: of it in person, and for that matter, I'm not 44 00:02:23,360 --> 00:02:25,200 Speaker 2: even sure i've seen a photo of it before. I 45 00:02:25,200 --> 00:02:28,120 Speaker 2: think I just read like a casual mention somewhere or another. 46 00:02:28,919 --> 00:02:32,960 Speaker 2: But Ahmed continues and says the Tlinket of Pacific Northwest 47 00:02:33,040 --> 00:02:36,320 Speaker 2: were involved in both conflict and trade with Russians looking 48 00:02:36,360 --> 00:02:39,080 Speaker 2: for fur in the sixteen hundreds of the eighteen hundreds, 49 00:02:39,080 --> 00:02:42,400 Speaker 2: and through them were exposed to Chinese Chian coins, whose 50 00:02:42,440 --> 00:02:45,000 Speaker 2: central doughnut hole made for an easy way to secure 51 00:02:45,040 --> 00:02:47,440 Speaker 2: the coins into a layer. This is one of those 52 00:02:47,480 --> 00:02:50,520 Speaker 2: examples that exist squarely in the historical record, But I 53 00:02:50,560 --> 00:02:53,600 Speaker 2: often think about how nuts it would seem if it 54 00:02:53,639 --> 00:02:55,920 Speaker 2: did not, and we had to guess that the links 55 00:02:55,919 --> 00:02:59,560 Speaker 2: that brought Chinese currency into this use in North America. 56 00:03:00,160 --> 00:03:00,959 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah. 57 00:03:01,240 --> 00:03:04,160 Speaker 2: Even beyond this example, I think the Tlingett and other 58 00:03:04,280 --> 00:03:07,240 Speaker 2: Pacific Coast people like the Hata had some of the 59 00:03:07,240 --> 00:03:10,480 Speaker 2: coolest and most unique armor in North America, with elaborately 60 00:03:10,520 --> 00:03:13,240 Speaker 2: carved heavy wooden armor, often covering the trunk as well 61 00:03:13,280 --> 00:03:15,480 Speaker 2: as the neck and head, leaving just a slit for 62 00:03:15,520 --> 00:03:16,000 Speaker 2: the eyes. 63 00:03:16,840 --> 00:03:18,680 Speaker 3: And again here rob I pulled in a picture that 64 00:03:18,760 --> 00:03:22,680 Speaker 3: Ahmed linked into the outline. This is of armor, the 65 00:03:22,800 --> 00:03:25,799 Speaker 3: armor he mentioned in a museum collection today and this 66 00:03:25,840 --> 00:03:29,600 Speaker 3: also looks very interesting, very cool, Like the armored part 67 00:03:29,639 --> 00:03:33,560 Speaker 3: on the torso is composed of kind of ribs, like 68 00:03:33,760 --> 00:03:37,600 Speaker 3: vertically aligned ribs that all all go side to side 69 00:03:37,640 --> 00:03:40,000 Speaker 3: around the lower part of the torso, and then a 70 00:03:40,080 --> 00:03:44,480 Speaker 3: narrower plate of ribs like that coming up through the chest. Yeah, 71 00:03:44,480 --> 00:03:46,920 Speaker 3: and then the helmet part of it is fascinating. It's 72 00:03:46,920 --> 00:03:50,120 Speaker 3: sort of bullet shaped, coming up into a cone on 73 00:03:50,200 --> 00:03:53,880 Speaker 3: the top with beautiful like red and orange decorations, and 74 00:03:53,920 --> 00:03:56,080 Speaker 3: then below that the carvings on the face have a 75 00:03:56,160 --> 00:04:01,080 Speaker 3: kind of monstrous marine mammal face kind of design. Is 76 00:04:01,400 --> 00:04:02,320 Speaker 3: that what you're seeing too? 77 00:04:02,680 --> 00:04:08,480 Speaker 2: Yeah, Yeah, yeah, it's it's it's very cool. Ahmed continues 78 00:04:08,520 --> 00:04:10,960 Speaker 2: here and says, for anybody interested in this, I highly 79 00:04:11,000 --> 00:04:14,280 Speaker 2: recommend the book Native North American Armor, Shields and Fortifications 80 00:04:14,280 --> 00:04:17,000 Speaker 2: by David Jones. It makes it clear that while we 81 00:04:17,000 --> 00:04:19,279 Speaker 2: do not typically think of the indigenous people of North 82 00:04:19,320 --> 00:04:22,640 Speaker 2: America being armored, that's because we imagine them largely in 83 00:04:22,680 --> 00:04:26,520 Speaker 2: the firearm age. Just like contemporary European armies who came 84 00:04:26,520 --> 00:04:29,000 Speaker 2: from a tradition of heavy armor. Think of a medieval 85 00:04:29,080 --> 00:04:32,960 Speaker 2: versus a Napoleonic soldier, Indigenous Americans put protection aside in 86 00:04:33,000 --> 00:04:37,400 Speaker 2: favor of mobility. Once firearms made heavy armor and shields obsolete, 87 00:04:37,920 --> 00:04:40,760 Speaker 2: with some interesting exceptions in areas like the Great Plains 88 00:04:41,040 --> 00:04:44,840 Speaker 2: and the Pueblo cultures where shields had spiritual significance. It's 89 00:04:44,880 --> 00:04:47,400 Speaker 2: a great look at the very diverse cultural spheres in 90 00:04:47,480 --> 00:04:52,520 Speaker 2: pre colonial North America seen through the lens of military defenses. Anyways, 91 00:04:52,839 --> 00:04:54,640 Speaker 2: keep up the great work, Amed. 92 00:04:54,640 --> 00:04:57,880 Speaker 3: Well, thank you so much, Ahmed. Yeah, this was really interesting. 93 00:04:57,960 --> 00:05:00,000 Speaker 3: Thank you for sharing with us. In fact, you always 94 00:05:00,160 --> 00:05:02,719 Speaker 3: write such great emails. Please get in touch after every 95 00:05:02,760 --> 00:05:03,320 Speaker 3: series we do. 96 00:05:04,200 --> 00:05:06,920 Speaker 2: All right, looks like we received some listener mail related 97 00:05:06,960 --> 00:05:08,839 Speaker 2: to our series on cynicism. 98 00:05:09,640 --> 00:05:11,919 Speaker 3: Yes, let's see, Rob, you want me to do this 99 00:05:12,000 --> 00:05:21,359 Speaker 3: one from Tea? Yeah, Tea says morning fellas loved the 100 00:05:21,360 --> 00:05:24,039 Speaker 3: series on cynicism. If you'd be so kind to throw 101 00:05:24,040 --> 00:05:26,280 Speaker 3: it back into the Saturday Mix in a few months, 102 00:05:26,440 --> 00:05:28,760 Speaker 3: I'd like to listen to it again after some time 103 00:05:28,800 --> 00:05:33,280 Speaker 3: to reflect. Can't promise anything, Tea. Usually we let it 104 00:05:33,560 --> 00:05:36,039 Speaker 3: around a year ago by maybe before we do a rerun, 105 00:05:36,080 --> 00:05:38,760 Speaker 3: but it varies some but you will probably hear it 106 00:05:38,760 --> 00:05:42,000 Speaker 3: again anyway. Of course, you can listen to it anytime 107 00:05:42,040 --> 00:05:46,080 Speaker 3: you want, right, Yeah, yeah, the magic of asynchronous media, 108 00:05:46,960 --> 00:05:49,400 Speaker 3: So Tea goes on to say, one thing I did 109 00:05:49,440 --> 00:05:52,920 Speaker 3: want to point out is that legitimate companies are training 110 00:05:53,000 --> 00:05:57,160 Speaker 3: their customer base to be cynical to anything that seems 111 00:05:57,200 --> 00:06:01,760 Speaker 3: to be communication from them. The fish and the smishers 112 00:06:01,920 --> 00:06:04,159 Speaker 3: have gotten so good. I'm not sure if I know 113 00:06:04,200 --> 00:06:07,159 Speaker 3: the phrase smishers fishers of course, is you know, people 114 00:06:07,200 --> 00:06:10,760 Speaker 3: fishing for information through like emails and stuff smishers? Would 115 00:06:10,760 --> 00:06:12,720 Speaker 3: that be SMS fishers. 116 00:06:12,320 --> 00:06:14,479 Speaker 2: Text message pad too that I just I know from 117 00:06:14,520 --> 00:06:18,080 Speaker 2: context of the sentence that they're bad as well, and 118 00:06:18,120 --> 00:06:21,280 Speaker 2: I don't trust them. Actually, JJ just confirmed for us 119 00:06:21,360 --> 00:06:24,760 Speaker 2: that smishers does in fact mean that, which is nice 120 00:06:24,800 --> 00:06:27,600 Speaker 2: because now I have a nicer name for them than 121 00:06:27,640 --> 00:06:29,640 Speaker 2: the one I usually call them when when I get 122 00:06:29,640 --> 00:06:31,120 Speaker 2: one of these messages on my phone. 123 00:06:31,680 --> 00:06:35,240 Speaker 3: But if it's SMS, why are they smishers and not smissshers? 124 00:06:36,400 --> 00:06:38,200 Speaker 2: I think you answered your own question there. 125 00:06:38,400 --> 00:06:42,359 Speaker 3: Anyway, Tea Rights, I'm adjacent to the mortgage industry, and 126 00:06:42,480 --> 00:06:45,360 Speaker 3: part of our product sends out emails about paying your 127 00:06:45,400 --> 00:06:48,960 Speaker 3: mortgage or things that happened on your account. We actively 128 00:06:49,000 --> 00:06:52,039 Speaker 3: avoid putting links to anything in those emails, simply so 129 00:06:52,160 --> 00:06:56,000 Speaker 3: the instructions to the customers can be to never click 130 00:06:56,040 --> 00:06:59,159 Speaker 3: on links and emails that seem to be about your mortgage. 131 00:06:59,520 --> 00:07:03,600 Speaker 3: Always go log into the portal. The text messages we 132 00:07:03,640 --> 00:07:06,720 Speaker 3: send out never have an actionable link in them. They're 133 00:07:06,760 --> 00:07:09,720 Speaker 3: all essentially this payment was made to your account. If 134 00:07:09,800 --> 00:07:12,680 Speaker 3: you have questions, log into your portal. And this is 135 00:07:12,760 --> 00:07:15,840 Speaker 3: also the customer service can reiterate to the customers to 136 00:07:16,000 --> 00:07:20,240 Speaker 3: not click on things about your mortgage. If you've bought 137 00:07:20,240 --> 00:07:23,040 Speaker 3: a house recently, likely there are footers at the bottom 138 00:07:23,080 --> 00:07:27,040 Speaker 3: of your agent's emails, your lenders emails, your title attorney's emails, etc. 139 00:07:27,760 --> 00:07:31,800 Speaker 3: Saying to not trust any wiring instructions without verifying first. 140 00:07:32,160 --> 00:07:35,080 Speaker 3: There are some real horror stories of fishers getting to 141 00:07:35,280 --> 00:07:38,320 Speaker 3: a buyer at just the wrong time and having them 142 00:07:38,360 --> 00:07:41,680 Speaker 3: wire their down payment for the house to them instead 143 00:07:41,680 --> 00:07:46,640 Speaker 3: of the Escro agent. Thanks as always, Tea from Florida. Yeah, 144 00:07:46,680 --> 00:07:49,240 Speaker 3: te this is really interesting and I have a number 145 00:07:49,280 --> 00:07:51,600 Speaker 3: of thoughts here. This actually connects to something I've said 146 00:07:51,640 --> 00:07:54,200 Speaker 3: on the show. I think months or even years ago 147 00:07:54,240 --> 00:07:56,480 Speaker 3: before we did the Cynicism series, and so I'll come 148 00:07:56,560 --> 00:07:59,520 Speaker 3: back to that in a minute. But I remember when 149 00:07:59,600 --> 00:08:03,120 Speaker 3: I was not too long ago going through the mortgage process, 150 00:08:03,520 --> 00:08:06,120 Speaker 3: we got lots of warnings exactly like this, that we 151 00:08:06,160 --> 00:08:10,280 Speaker 3: would likely be hammered with attempted scams, you know, while 152 00:08:10,320 --> 00:08:13,080 Speaker 3: you're involved in getting a mortgage, or when you've recently 153 00:08:13,120 --> 00:08:16,080 Speaker 3: gotten a mortgage, Just be aware of that. Also, all 154 00:08:16,120 --> 00:08:18,760 Speaker 3: this stuff you're mentioning, don't wire money except to this 155 00:08:18,920 --> 00:08:23,240 Speaker 3: exact account. Ignore emails giving you a link to click on, 156 00:08:23,440 --> 00:08:26,320 Speaker 3: or saying that account details have changed, stuff like that. 157 00:08:27,000 --> 00:08:31,560 Speaker 3: And I would argue that this kind of particular preparation 158 00:08:31,760 --> 00:08:36,920 Speaker 3: within the mortgage lending scenario falls more under the reasonable 159 00:08:37,000 --> 00:08:41,719 Speaker 3: social skepticism umbrella than under social cynicism. And remember in 160 00:08:41,760 --> 00:08:44,319 Speaker 3: the series, we made the distinction that, at least as 161 00:08:44,320 --> 00:08:47,600 Speaker 3: we were using the terms, skepticism is like doing your 162 00:08:47,640 --> 00:08:50,880 Speaker 3: best to either grant or withhold trust on the basis 163 00:08:50,880 --> 00:08:55,480 Speaker 3: of evidence. You're looking for objective clues, objective information about 164 00:08:55,520 --> 00:08:59,280 Speaker 3: the trustworthiness of a person or situation, whereas cynicism is 165 00:08:59,320 --> 00:09:04,280 Speaker 3: a bias, it's an evidence neutral bias against trust. So 166 00:09:04,400 --> 00:09:07,160 Speaker 3: another way I'd put it relevant to your example t 167 00:09:07,600 --> 00:09:10,360 Speaker 3: is that I would not call it cynical to be 168 00:09:10,520 --> 00:09:15,199 Speaker 3: cautious of scams in a situation where scams are very 169 00:09:15,240 --> 00:09:18,240 Speaker 3: common and very dangerous. It would be cynical to be 170 00:09:18,280 --> 00:09:21,360 Speaker 3: cautious of scams in a situation where you have no 171 00:09:21,480 --> 00:09:25,000 Speaker 3: good reason or evidence to suspect a scam is taking place. 172 00:09:25,520 --> 00:09:29,840 Speaker 2: Yeah, Like, it's cynical to assume everyone is Jason Vorhees, 173 00:09:30,640 --> 00:09:34,360 Speaker 2: but it's it's healthy to assume that anyone wandering through 174 00:09:34,400 --> 00:09:36,839 Speaker 2: the woods in a hockey mask with a big old 175 00:09:36,880 --> 00:09:39,880 Speaker 2: machete is Jason Vorhees. And that's what and that's the 176 00:09:39,920 --> 00:09:44,360 Speaker 2: thing most of these sketchy emails and texts are. They 177 00:09:44,400 --> 00:09:47,560 Speaker 2: are very sketchy for a reason, you know. I mean, 178 00:09:47,559 --> 00:09:50,960 Speaker 2: I guess some are more convincing than others, obviously, But yeah, 179 00:09:50,960 --> 00:09:53,520 Speaker 2: this is a healthy amount of skepticism that people are 180 00:09:53,559 --> 00:09:54,360 Speaker 2: employing here. 181 00:09:55,040 --> 00:09:58,000 Speaker 3: Great analogy, exactly right. So yeah, so I would call 182 00:09:58,040 --> 00:10:02,760 Speaker 3: this like reasonable situation skepticism rather than cynicism. On the 183 00:10:02,840 --> 00:10:06,680 Speaker 3: other hand, tee, I think I get exactly the point 184 00:10:06,679 --> 00:10:09,720 Speaker 3: you're driving at. We looked at a bunch of studies 185 00:10:09,920 --> 00:10:13,240 Speaker 3: in the Cynicism series pointing to the fact that a 186 00:10:13,280 --> 00:10:18,040 Speaker 3: person's level of social cynicism is I think partly an 187 00:10:18,080 --> 00:10:22,480 Speaker 3: aspect of their fixed personality, but it's partly, not partially. 188 00:10:22,600 --> 00:10:25,880 Speaker 3: It is something that can fluctuate, According to our experiences, 189 00:10:26,679 --> 00:10:30,160 Speaker 3: and so I would suspect that having to deal with 190 00:10:30,280 --> 00:10:34,800 Speaker 3: a lot of situations in which a reasonable evidence based 191 00:10:34,840 --> 00:10:38,560 Speaker 3: approach is to be very wary and stingy with trust, 192 00:10:39,240 --> 00:10:43,080 Speaker 3: that having those sorts of experiences could sort of bump 193 00:10:43,240 --> 00:10:47,560 Speaker 3: up your general cynical biases in unrelated areas of life, 194 00:10:47,600 --> 00:10:50,959 Speaker 3: whether or not those biases are actually protecting you the 195 00:10:51,720 --> 00:10:54,319 Speaker 3: same way they would in these situations rife with scams. 196 00:10:54,840 --> 00:10:58,480 Speaker 3: And another thing is beyond just like the mortgage process, 197 00:10:59,480 --> 00:11:02,720 Speaker 3: certain things about modern life I would say, especially about 198 00:11:02,720 --> 00:11:09,439 Speaker 3: communications technology, I think have the toxic effect of creating 199 00:11:09,600 --> 00:11:14,320 Speaker 3: a digitally ever present threat of scams because the Internet 200 00:11:14,559 --> 00:11:18,360 Speaker 3: and also various forms of computer based automation have made 201 00:11:18,400 --> 00:11:21,480 Speaker 3: scamming so much more efficient in the last couple decades. 202 00:11:21,559 --> 00:11:23,560 Speaker 3: Like you can you know, it used to be real 203 00:11:23,640 --> 00:11:27,040 Speaker 3: work to develop each scam lead, you know, back in 204 00:11:27,080 --> 00:11:29,760 Speaker 3: the day, and now you can just spam millions of 205 00:11:29,800 --> 00:11:32,800 Speaker 3: people with attempts to initiate an email or text message 206 00:11:32,800 --> 00:11:35,960 Speaker 3: scam at extremely little cost. And even more, sort of 207 00:11:36,000 --> 00:11:40,000 Speaker 3: customized or targeted scams are easier to confect with the 208 00:11:40,080 --> 00:11:45,480 Speaker 3: digital tools available today. So even though in most aspects 209 00:11:45,520 --> 00:11:48,920 Speaker 3: of life, most people most of the time are still 210 00:11:49,120 --> 00:11:54,120 Speaker 3: very trustworthy. The fact that you are always digitally a 211 00:11:54,200 --> 00:11:57,840 Speaker 3: few clicks away from an ever present threat of having 212 00:11:57,880 --> 00:12:00,959 Speaker 3: your identity still in or having somebody steal your life savings, 213 00:12:01,880 --> 00:12:07,280 Speaker 3: that the proximity of that threat throughout your entire life now, 214 00:12:08,080 --> 00:12:10,760 Speaker 3: I think, just kind of waters the weeds of cynicism 215 00:12:10,920 --> 00:12:13,560 Speaker 3: so that they grow everywhere in your mind, not just 216 00:12:13,760 --> 00:12:16,640 Speaker 3: where they belong, like which is like on sketchy looking 217 00:12:16,679 --> 00:12:20,360 Speaker 3: emails and text messages. And so given all this, I 218 00:12:20,640 --> 00:12:23,400 Speaker 3: think I've said this on the show before, I believe 219 00:12:23,440 --> 00:12:30,480 Speaker 3: that it is underappreciated how maliciously influential internet and phone 220 00:12:30,559 --> 00:12:34,079 Speaker 3: based scams are in our culture today, not just because 221 00:12:34,440 --> 00:12:37,640 Speaker 3: of people's material losses. I mean, I think almost everybody 222 00:12:37,720 --> 00:12:40,240 Speaker 3: knows somebody or has a has a close relative who's 223 00:12:40,280 --> 00:12:42,000 Speaker 3: lost a bunch of money to some like, you know, 224 00:12:42,080 --> 00:12:45,600 Speaker 3: to an email or phone scammer. But it's not just 225 00:12:45,760 --> 00:12:50,120 Speaker 3: the material losses which can be devastating. It's because the 226 00:12:50,240 --> 00:12:55,840 Speaker 3: presence of these types of scams viciously undermines general social trust, 227 00:12:56,280 --> 00:12:58,800 Speaker 3: which I think we now have even better reason to 228 00:12:58,840 --> 00:13:01,640 Speaker 3: believe and a better underst standing of how that kind 229 00:13:01,640 --> 00:13:05,240 Speaker 3: of generalized cynicism is a really really bad thing for 230 00:13:05,320 --> 00:13:07,199 Speaker 3: each individual and for the culture. 231 00:13:07,920 --> 00:13:10,040 Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I feel like it's honestly ruined some 232 00:13:10,080 --> 00:13:13,120 Speaker 2: forms of communication, Like I don't answer my phone. Like 233 00:13:13,200 --> 00:13:17,160 Speaker 2: if someone calls me, I just assume that it's some 234 00:13:17,200 --> 00:13:21,760 Speaker 2: sort of at worst nefarious force, but perhaps just some 235 00:13:21,800 --> 00:13:23,719 Speaker 2: sort of like a cold call, you know, trying to 236 00:13:23,760 --> 00:13:26,040 Speaker 2: get me to donate money and sometimes to a good cause. 237 00:13:26,200 --> 00:13:27,679 Speaker 2: But I'm not going to do that over the phone 238 00:13:27,920 --> 00:13:31,680 Speaker 2: because of all the scammers. So you know, I just 239 00:13:31,760 --> 00:13:33,679 Speaker 2: been like, all right, let it go to voicemail and 240 00:13:33,960 --> 00:13:35,360 Speaker 2: I will probably delete it there. 241 00:13:35,600 --> 00:13:41,000 Speaker 3: Yeah, our digital and communications environment has created an asymmetrical 242 00:13:41,280 --> 00:13:45,120 Speaker 3: scam thread where it's weird that I think it really 243 00:13:45,160 --> 00:13:48,280 Speaker 3: still is the case that you can trust most people 244 00:13:48,400 --> 00:13:50,840 Speaker 3: most of the time, but at the same time, through 245 00:13:50,880 --> 00:13:55,240 Speaker 3: electronic communication, a scammer is always just is right there 246 00:13:55,280 --> 00:13:58,320 Speaker 3: waiting for you. You know, they're like a picked up 247 00:13:58,360 --> 00:14:01,079 Speaker 3: phone call or a text message reply away. 248 00:14:01,800 --> 00:14:03,959 Speaker 2: Yeah, we've made the world smaller in a lot of 249 00:14:04,040 --> 00:14:06,880 Speaker 2: wonderful ways, but also in a lot of terrifying ways. 250 00:14:07,160 --> 00:14:10,120 Speaker 2: So I might not put my faith in phone calls anymore. 251 00:14:10,360 --> 00:14:13,280 Speaker 2: Maybe I should put my faith instead into mystery cults. 252 00:14:14,320 --> 00:14:16,080 Speaker 2: We of course did a series on mystery cults, and 253 00:14:16,200 --> 00:14:19,720 Speaker 2: we continue to hear back from some folks about this topic. 254 00:14:20,160 --> 00:14:28,040 Speaker 2: This one comes to us from Lex like says, super 255 00:14:28,080 --> 00:14:30,760 Speaker 2: short message, but this was too funny and on point 256 00:14:30,800 --> 00:14:33,880 Speaker 2: not to send your way. In your episodes about mystery cults, 257 00:14:33,880 --> 00:14:37,560 Speaker 2: you discussed that certain techniques or special special effects might 258 00:14:37,600 --> 00:14:40,800 Speaker 2: be off putting because they seem deceptive or irreverent in 259 00:14:40,800 --> 00:14:44,360 Speaker 2: some way. Looks like some churches are really towing that line, 260 00:14:44,960 --> 00:14:47,000 Speaker 2: and they included a link for us to check out here. 261 00:14:47,040 --> 00:14:51,040 Speaker 2: And I'm not going to tell you how to define this. 262 00:14:51,680 --> 00:14:53,520 Speaker 2: I don't know. Maybe you're sure familiar with this already, 263 00:14:53,560 --> 00:14:57,200 Speaker 2: but it involves some sort of a church environment where 264 00:14:57,240 --> 00:15:01,280 Speaker 2: there's like a big drop cloth that presents the this 265 00:15:01,360 --> 00:15:04,160 Speaker 2: kind of like puppet Jesus that rises up from the tomb. 266 00:15:04,560 --> 00:15:06,480 Speaker 2: Am I interpreting this correctly? Yeah? 267 00:15:06,560 --> 00:15:08,720 Speaker 3: Yeah, So there's like an altar and then behind it, 268 00:15:08,840 --> 00:15:11,040 Speaker 3: by the way, it looks to me like it's an 269 00:15:11,040 --> 00:15:13,040 Speaker 3: Easter service, but I can't tell for sure, and I 270 00:15:13,040 --> 00:15:16,480 Speaker 3: don't know where or what church this is, but yeah, 271 00:15:16,480 --> 00:15:19,040 Speaker 3: there's like a tapestry in the background showing a golden 272 00:15:19,120 --> 00:15:24,240 Speaker 3: archway and a sunrise landscape. Also electronic dance music is thumping. 273 00:15:24,320 --> 00:15:27,080 Speaker 3: It's like a four on the floor beat. But then 274 00:15:27,120 --> 00:15:30,480 Speaker 3: suddenly the tapestry falls away and it reveals a different painting. 275 00:15:30,520 --> 00:15:33,120 Speaker 3: It's like a blooming garden and a blue sky. And 276 00:15:33,160 --> 00:15:37,000 Speaker 3: then a spring loaded Jesus statue launches up out of 277 00:15:37,040 --> 00:15:39,840 Speaker 3: some hidden device in front of the painting, so that 278 00:15:39,960 --> 00:15:42,400 Speaker 3: his head is framed by like a big painted halo 279 00:15:42,480 --> 00:15:45,440 Speaker 3: on the backdrop. Jesus is also holding a flag looks 280 00:15:45,480 --> 00:15:48,520 Speaker 3: like a red velvet flag. And no judgment by the way, 281 00:15:48,560 --> 00:15:51,200 Speaker 3: you know, religious art and special effects. It's a matter 282 00:15:51,240 --> 00:15:53,720 Speaker 3: of taste to some degree at least, But the switchblade 283 00:15:53,800 --> 00:15:56,720 Speaker 3: Jesus was indeed funny to me. I think the funniest 284 00:15:56,720 --> 00:16:00,160 Speaker 3: part was the speed at which Jesus rises up. He 285 00:16:00,200 --> 00:16:02,960 Speaker 3: had just risen slower, it would have been less funny. 286 00:16:03,280 --> 00:16:05,440 Speaker 2: I mean, I'm all for it. Yeah, throw some production 287 00:16:07,080 --> 00:16:11,320 Speaker 2: into it, you know. Puppet Jesus'. Like I say, puppetry 288 00:16:11,480 --> 00:16:17,440 Speaker 2: is a legitimate and very ancient medium. It is an 289 00:16:17,520 --> 00:16:21,640 Speaker 2: art form. Therefore, I think it's perfectly fine. It's great 290 00:16:21,680 --> 00:16:25,680 Speaker 2: that it should be involved in religious rites. It has 291 00:16:25,720 --> 00:16:28,920 Speaker 2: been since time out of mind anyway, Le says, love 292 00:16:28,920 --> 00:16:31,040 Speaker 2: the show and appreciate your hard work to bring it 293 00:16:31,040 --> 00:16:31,360 Speaker 2: to us. 294 00:16:31,440 --> 00:16:35,560 Speaker 3: Happy Friday, Lex, Okay, general call the listeners here, please 295 00:16:35,600 --> 00:16:42,200 Speaker 3: send us more examples of puppetry, animate statues and automata 296 00:16:42,440 --> 00:16:45,760 Speaker 3: used in earnest not for laughs, in religious services. I 297 00:16:46,000 --> 00:16:46,880 Speaker 3: want to see more of that. 298 00:16:47,320 --> 00:16:49,480 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I mean there are some terrific example. You know, 299 00:16:49,600 --> 00:16:53,480 Speaker 2: very recently my family went and saw a performance of 300 00:16:53,840 --> 00:17:00,600 Speaker 2: Javanese puppetry here at Emory here in Atlanta, Emory University, 301 00:17:01,000 --> 00:17:06,240 Speaker 2: and you know, these are generally they're telling retelling Hindu epics, 302 00:17:06,640 --> 00:17:10,080 Speaker 2: you know, and it is a very traditional and like 303 00:17:10,200 --> 00:17:14,360 Speaker 2: sacred performance. So yeah, I'd love to hear more examples 304 00:17:14,359 --> 00:17:17,560 Speaker 2: of that sort of thing, as well as like contemporary examples, 305 00:17:17,600 --> 00:17:19,639 Speaker 2: like there's a lot of church puppetry out there, like 306 00:17:19,680 --> 00:17:24,359 Speaker 2: in Protestant services, and yeah, that that stuff can be 307 00:17:25,040 --> 00:17:26,720 Speaker 2: can be interesting in its own right as well. 308 00:17:34,640 --> 00:17:37,480 Speaker 3: All right, let's see here we got a message from Carlos. 309 00:17:37,720 --> 00:17:40,520 Speaker 3: This is in response to our series on pretend play 310 00:17:40,840 --> 00:17:45,920 Speaker 3: subject line in defense of Vygotsky. So, Rob, it's been 311 00:17:45,960 --> 00:17:48,920 Speaker 3: a little while since we did this episode, so I've 312 00:17:48,960 --> 00:17:52,520 Speaker 3: kind of forgotten the context of The person here that 313 00:17:52,560 --> 00:17:56,320 Speaker 3: Carlos is talking about is the twentieth century Russian psychologist 314 00:17:56,480 --> 00:17:59,000 Speaker 3: Love Vygotsky. Can you can you remind me what the 315 00:17:59,160 --> 00:18:01,720 Speaker 3: context was in the episode that Vygotsky came up. 316 00:18:01,880 --> 00:18:04,959 Speaker 2: Basically, I think we were talking more about the ideas 317 00:18:04,960 --> 00:18:08,600 Speaker 2: of doctor Sandra Russ. There's a paper talking about her 318 00:18:08,640 --> 00:18:11,040 Speaker 2: ideas and also comparing some of her ideas to those 319 00:18:11,040 --> 00:18:14,240 Speaker 2: of Viogotsky. If memory serves though, I don't think any 320 00:18:14,240 --> 00:18:17,600 Speaker 2: of Russ's ideas were like necessarily tearing down Vogotsky, but 321 00:18:17,720 --> 00:18:22,760 Speaker 2: you know, kind of like building upon them. But then again, 322 00:18:22,880 --> 00:18:25,639 Speaker 2: I think that the comments here that Carlos wrote in 323 00:18:25,680 --> 00:18:28,280 Speaker 2: about it are fair. So yeah, let's good and hear him. 324 00:18:28,480 --> 00:18:31,080 Speaker 3: Okay, Carlos says, Hey, y'all just wanted to write in 325 00:18:31,200 --> 00:18:34,800 Speaker 3: to defend Vygotsky, whom you featured in your recent episodes 326 00:18:34,800 --> 00:18:38,480 Speaker 3: on imagination and play. In your episode, he came off 327 00:18:38,520 --> 00:18:41,520 Speaker 3: as stodgy and anti play, but I'm not sure that's fair. 328 00:18:41,840 --> 00:18:44,240 Speaker 3: I was already acquainted with his work as it pertains 329 00:18:44,240 --> 00:18:48,000 Speaker 3: to art and literature, especially his the psychology of art. 330 00:18:48,359 --> 00:18:50,800 Speaker 3: In this work, he seems to really appreciate the value 331 00:18:50,800 --> 00:18:53,359 Speaker 3: of art. While this isn't quite the same as play, 332 00:18:53,440 --> 00:18:56,920 Speaker 3: it definitely gets into the importance of the imagination. Just 333 00:18:56,960 --> 00:18:59,960 Speaker 3: a couple of quotes from the Mit Press Edition nineteen 334 00:19:00,080 --> 00:19:04,120 Speaker 3: seventy one. Quote, Thus, poetry or art is a special 335 00:19:04,160 --> 00:19:07,239 Speaker 3: way of thinking which, in the final analysis, leads to 336 00:19:07,320 --> 00:19:11,399 Speaker 3: the same results as scientific knowledge, but in a different way. 337 00:19:12,040 --> 00:19:16,600 Speaker 3: And then also quote, psychological investigation reveals that art is 338 00:19:16,720 --> 00:19:21,760 Speaker 3: the supreme center of biological and social individual processes in society, 339 00:19:22,119 --> 00:19:25,439 Speaker 3: that it is a method for finding an equilibrium between 340 00:19:25,520 --> 00:19:28,640 Speaker 3: man and his world in the most critical and important 341 00:19:28,640 --> 00:19:32,320 Speaker 3: stages in his life. And then Carlos picks up again, 342 00:19:32,400 --> 00:19:34,720 Speaker 3: not directly related to play, but he does seem to 343 00:19:34,720 --> 00:19:37,600 Speaker 3: have a great appreciation for the role of creativity, perhaps 344 00:19:37,600 --> 00:19:40,960 Speaker 3: above and beyond productivity in society. 345 00:19:41,320 --> 00:19:45,240 Speaker 2: Thanks Carlos, Yeah, yeah, well, thanks for writing in, Carlos, 346 00:19:47,320 --> 00:19:50,160 Speaker 2: A point well taken. And these are also some wonderful 347 00:19:50,200 --> 00:19:53,200 Speaker 2: quotes here. All right, let's get into a little weird 348 00:19:53,240 --> 00:19:57,080 Speaker 2: house cinema listener mail. It looks like we're continuing to 349 00:19:57,119 --> 00:20:00,720 Speaker 2: hear from folks about the telephone box. This one comes 350 00:20:00,760 --> 00:20:08,760 Speaker 2: to us from Bo. Bo says, Hi, guys, I love 351 00:20:08,800 --> 00:20:10,960 Speaker 2: your show and have listened for years. I'm a little 352 00:20:10,960 --> 00:20:12,600 Speaker 2: behind in the moment, but I was thrilled to hear 353 00:20:12,640 --> 00:20:16,000 Speaker 2: your episode on La Caabina. This struck a chord with me. 354 00:20:16,119 --> 00:20:19,240 Speaker 2: You mentioned that some films or movies viewed as a 355 00:20:19,320 --> 00:20:21,800 Speaker 2: child may leave a lasting impression, and for me this 356 00:20:22,040 --> 00:20:24,800 Speaker 2: was the one. I'm Norwegian but lived a few years 357 00:20:24,840 --> 00:20:27,400 Speaker 2: in Spain as a child in the seventies. At the time, 358 00:20:27,440 --> 00:20:30,440 Speaker 2: there were only two TV channels there, both controlled by 359 00:20:30,440 --> 00:20:34,119 Speaker 2: the regime. TV one was the news propaganda channel and 360 00:20:34,200 --> 00:20:37,119 Speaker 2: TV two was a bit more for entertainment. Mind you, 361 00:20:37,400 --> 00:20:39,639 Speaker 2: no channels apping, as you had to go over to 362 00:20:39,680 --> 00:20:42,040 Speaker 2: the TV and push a button to change the channel. 363 00:20:42,240 --> 00:20:43,000 Speaker 3: Good old days. 364 00:20:43,160 --> 00:20:47,040 Speaker 2: Yeah, So, one day, watching whatever was on TV two, 365 00:20:47,200 --> 00:20:49,560 Speaker 2: this film was shown. This was in seventy three or 366 00:20:49,600 --> 00:20:51,840 Speaker 2: seventy four, so it was a rerun. I was twelve 367 00:20:51,960 --> 00:20:54,119 Speaker 2: or thirteen, and it started out as funny, that is 368 00:20:54,320 --> 00:20:56,919 Speaker 2: until the end, which scared the Bejesus out of me 369 00:20:57,200 --> 00:20:59,720 Speaker 2: and gave me nightmares for some time, and it definitely 370 00:20:59,760 --> 00:21:04,000 Speaker 2: became unforgettable. At the same time, of course, I had 371 00:21:04,000 --> 00:21:06,600 Speaker 2: no idea about the symbolism of the film. The director 372 00:21:06,600 --> 00:21:08,560 Speaker 2: says that the film can be interpreted in many ways, 373 00:21:08,560 --> 00:21:11,680 Speaker 2: which is true, but for me, in the grown up hindsight, 374 00:21:11,880 --> 00:21:16,160 Speaker 2: it is clearly a political statement. Remember that disappearances actually 375 00:21:16,240 --> 00:21:19,399 Speaker 2: happened at this time under the Franco regime. What happened 376 00:21:19,400 --> 00:21:21,960 Speaker 2: to those people, Well, obviously they did not end up 377 00:21:21,960 --> 00:21:24,520 Speaker 2: in telephone boxes in a bunker. But this is what 378 00:21:24,640 --> 00:21:28,680 Speaker 2: the film carefully addresses. And then we get a bullet list. Here. 379 00:21:29,080 --> 00:21:32,240 Speaker 2: The surveillance view of the plaza may may be someone 380 00:21:32,440 --> 00:21:36,240 Speaker 2: pushing the button. If someone suspicious enters the box, the 381 00:21:36,359 --> 00:21:40,800 Speaker 2: tie is key as a symbol of nonconformity, a slash suspicion. 382 00:21:41,160 --> 00:21:43,320 Speaker 2: The other guy caught in a separate box also has 383 00:21:43,320 --> 00:21:46,600 Speaker 2: an unusual tie. We talked about the pattern a bit above, 384 00:21:46,680 --> 00:21:50,160 Speaker 2: all these times with a dotted pattern. On the other hand, 385 00:21:50,200 --> 00:21:52,679 Speaker 2: there is a short scene during the transport where a 386 00:21:52,720 --> 00:21:55,440 Speaker 2: guy who exits a red telephone box with no problem. 387 00:21:55,560 --> 00:21:57,480 Speaker 2: He wears a nice neutral gray tie. 388 00:21:57,960 --> 00:21:59,840 Speaker 3: H I didn't notice that. 389 00:22:00,160 --> 00:22:05,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, the mindless telecompany workers, non thinking and just doing 390 00:22:05,040 --> 00:22:09,280 Speaker 2: their job, actually symbolizing normal people not wanting to upset anything. 391 00:22:09,920 --> 00:22:14,280 Speaker 2: The apartment complex building, the uniform, the uniform frame for 392 00:22:14,359 --> 00:22:18,600 Speaker 2: the followers, and the circus performers are the marginalized weirdos 393 00:22:18,640 --> 00:22:22,120 Speaker 2: that are non threatening to the regime, providing plausible excuse 394 00:22:22,240 --> 00:22:25,119 Speaker 2: for openness. I could go on, the bottom line is 395 00:22:25,160 --> 00:22:27,480 Speaker 2: that this film deeply touched me and I am glad 396 00:22:27,520 --> 00:22:31,080 Speaker 2: that you covered it. Bes regards Bo now living in Copenhagen. 397 00:22:30,800 --> 00:22:32,680 Speaker 3: Well thanks, Bo, I think, yeah, you make some great 398 00:22:32,720 --> 00:22:34,960 Speaker 3: points there. I think we talked about this in the episode. 399 00:22:34,960 --> 00:22:37,800 Speaker 3: But my take on it was despite the director saying that, 400 00:22:38,280 --> 00:22:41,639 Speaker 3: you know, the film could be interpreted as being about 401 00:22:41,640 --> 00:22:46,119 Speaker 3: whatever kind of box metaphorically you are trapped in, it 402 00:22:46,359 --> 00:22:49,080 Speaker 3: just struck me as that it had to at some 403 00:22:49,200 --> 00:22:51,760 Speaker 3: level be a political analysis like that it was a 404 00:22:51,760 --> 00:22:54,479 Speaker 3: political comment, especially when some of the comments the director 405 00:22:54,480 --> 00:22:56,760 Speaker 3: made about it not being a direct critique of the 406 00:22:56,760 --> 00:23:01,080 Speaker 3: Franco regime were made early on, where it seems like 407 00:23:01,160 --> 00:23:03,200 Speaker 3: he may have thought he had to say that, right, 408 00:23:03,280 --> 00:23:05,320 Speaker 3: you know, in order to actually get it out, he 409 00:23:05,359 --> 00:23:07,240 Speaker 3: had to say no, no, no, this isn't a threatening 410 00:23:07,280 --> 00:23:10,679 Speaker 3: piece of art. It seems to me like it obviously is. 411 00:23:10,800 --> 00:23:14,119 Speaker 3: It's clearly supposed to be politically subversive, though I can 412 00:23:14,160 --> 00:23:17,080 Speaker 3: also believe that it had these secondary meanings as well, 413 00:23:17,119 --> 00:23:19,840 Speaker 3: that it's not just a political allegory. It's just like 414 00:23:20,640 --> 00:23:22,359 Speaker 3: it can mean a lot of things, and there is 415 00:23:22,440 --> 00:23:24,720 Speaker 3: one thing especially that it seems to mean. 416 00:23:25,440 --> 00:23:32,840 Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, it's interesting thinking about how repressive regimes take 417 00:23:34,119 --> 00:23:36,879 Speaker 2: art that is open to interpretation, because I think, you know, 418 00:23:36,920 --> 00:23:40,760 Speaker 2: there are plenty of examples of skilled artists being able 419 00:23:40,840 --> 00:23:45,159 Speaker 2: to sneak something by them sneak commentary and criticism and 420 00:23:46,240 --> 00:23:49,040 Speaker 2: so forth past the sensors. But then there are, you know, 421 00:23:49,080 --> 00:23:52,680 Speaker 2: any number of cases where the sensors are latching onto 422 00:23:52,720 --> 00:23:55,919 Speaker 2: things that maybe do not have a political intention, but 423 00:23:56,560 --> 00:23:58,880 Speaker 2: since you know, they're vague enough, since they are open 424 00:23:58,920 --> 00:24:02,760 Speaker 2: to interpretation, they are open to criticism from any given 425 00:24:02,800 --> 00:24:06,720 Speaker 2: regime anyway, Both, thanks for writing in. I do always 426 00:24:06,800 --> 00:24:11,359 Speaker 2: enjoy hearing about how listeners encounter these different movies and 427 00:24:11,400 --> 00:24:16,080 Speaker 2: shows in the wild in their lives and the influence 428 00:24:16,080 --> 00:24:18,800 Speaker 2: of those films had over their lives. So yeah, thanks 429 00:24:18,840 --> 00:24:19,399 Speaker 2: for writing in. 430 00:24:19,760 --> 00:24:23,439 Speaker 3: Totally Thanks both, all right, This next Weird House Cinema 431 00:24:23,440 --> 00:24:31,840 Speaker 3: message is from Megan. Meghan says, Hello, I would like 432 00:24:31,880 --> 00:24:34,359 Speaker 3: to recommend a film for Weird House Cinema. The nineteen 433 00:24:34,480 --> 00:24:39,800 Speaker 3: eighty eight Canadian horror film called pin Pi. In Canadians 434 00:24:39,840 --> 00:24:43,040 Speaker 3: around my age of forty nine, may remember it, however, 435 00:24:43,200 --> 00:24:46,679 Speaker 3: I know I always conflated it with The Changeling, a 436 00:24:46,720 --> 00:24:49,760 Speaker 3: more well known Canadian horror movie, since the box ard 437 00:24:49,840 --> 00:24:56,119 Speaker 3: for both films use imagery of a spooky wheelchair both movies. Also, 438 00:24:57,040 --> 00:24:59,600 Speaker 3: both movies always looked very frightening to me, so I 439 00:24:59,680 --> 00:25:03,440 Speaker 3: only recently decided to finally watch Pin. I would classify 440 00:25:03,480 --> 00:25:07,040 Speaker 3: it as odd and uncomfortable and having some Freudian slash 441 00:25:07,080 --> 00:25:10,719 Speaker 3: adult themes, but not really scary. Two fun facts, the 442 00:25:10,720 --> 00:25:14,160 Speaker 3: male protagonist acted in a Canadian classic you've just talked 443 00:25:14,160 --> 00:25:17,560 Speaker 3: about in listener mail, and that is Cube, not Jim 444 00:25:17,640 --> 00:25:21,920 Speaker 3: Henson's The Cube, but the Canadian I don't know puzzle 445 00:25:21,920 --> 00:25:24,240 Speaker 3: horror movie Cube, where people are in a bunch of 446 00:25:24,240 --> 00:25:26,560 Speaker 3: cubes and most of the cubes have like a razor 447 00:25:26,600 --> 00:25:27,800 Speaker 3: that cuts you apart or something. 448 00:25:28,119 --> 00:25:29,720 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, we may coming back to that one in 449 00:25:29,760 --> 00:25:33,400 Speaker 2: Weird House Cinema. It's become a classic in its own way. 450 00:25:33,680 --> 00:25:35,959 Speaker 3: Did I mention this last time that Cube is one 451 00:25:35,960 --> 00:25:39,320 Speaker 3: of those movies where I saw its terrible sequels before 452 00:25:39,359 --> 00:25:40,359 Speaker 3: I saw the original. 453 00:25:40,640 --> 00:25:42,480 Speaker 2: Oh no, I don't remember if you did. 454 00:25:42,760 --> 00:25:47,680 Speaker 3: Yeah, I think I first saw Cube two Hypercube. I 455 00:25:47,680 --> 00:25:49,919 Speaker 3: don't know if i'd say that one's worth it, but 456 00:25:50,000 --> 00:25:51,920 Speaker 3: I worked my way back to the original and it's 457 00:25:51,960 --> 00:25:54,080 Speaker 3: been many, many years, but I remember liking it at 458 00:25:54,080 --> 00:25:54,440 Speaker 3: the time. 459 00:25:55,200 --> 00:25:57,880 Speaker 2: I remember the scene in which the dude is cut 460 00:25:57,920 --> 00:26:02,320 Speaker 2: into little cubes by wires being like just super impressive 461 00:26:02,320 --> 00:26:05,960 Speaker 2: at the time. I think the cubes within cubes. Yeah, 462 00:26:06,000 --> 00:26:08,400 Speaker 2: that was the main thing I connected with back then, 463 00:26:09,000 --> 00:26:10,520 Speaker 2: was that that was a really cool that was a 464 00:26:10,600 --> 00:26:14,080 Speaker 2: quality kill, not so much some of the the ideas 465 00:26:14,119 --> 00:26:15,879 Speaker 2: bound up in the concept, so that one would be 466 00:26:15,920 --> 00:26:17,520 Speaker 2: a fun one for me to revisit, for sure. 467 00:26:18,359 --> 00:26:20,720 Speaker 3: Let's see. Megan goes on to say, I have a 468 00:26:20,760 --> 00:26:24,119 Speaker 3: personal connection to pen because a second cousin of mine, 469 00:26:24,160 --> 00:26:29,520 Speaker 3: Bronwyn Mantle, plays the mother. Okay, anyway, this film isn't 470 00:26:29,520 --> 00:26:33,240 Speaker 3: as wild as my previous recommendation, treasurer of the Four Crowns, 471 00:26:33,560 --> 00:26:35,000 Speaker 3: but it might be a good one to watch if 472 00:26:35,000 --> 00:26:38,520 Speaker 3: you like, if you'd like to explore some Canadian content. Megan, 473 00:26:38,640 --> 00:26:42,480 Speaker 3: that was you. We actually took your recommendation and covered 474 00:26:42,480 --> 00:26:45,359 Speaker 3: Treasure of the Four Crowns on Weird House. Absolutely not 475 00:26:45,560 --> 00:26:47,600 Speaker 3: one of the better movies we have watched, but I 476 00:26:47,600 --> 00:26:50,960 Speaker 3: have very fond memories of covering it on the show. 477 00:26:51,040 --> 00:26:54,000 Speaker 3: That one often comes to mind when I think about 478 00:26:54,000 --> 00:26:56,840 Speaker 3: how the quality of our Weird House episode seems to 479 00:26:56,840 --> 00:26:59,400 Speaker 3: be kind of unrelated to the quality of the films. 480 00:27:00,240 --> 00:27:02,919 Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, you never know what's gonna Sometimes it's just 481 00:27:02,960 --> 00:27:05,879 Speaker 2: great to talk about a great film. Other times, you know, 482 00:27:07,520 --> 00:27:09,680 Speaker 2: maybe more often than not, the ones I really get 483 00:27:09,680 --> 00:27:12,560 Speaker 2: into are films that are rougher around the edges, but 484 00:27:12,640 --> 00:27:15,359 Speaker 2: have those gems embedded in them that he's kind of 485 00:27:15,359 --> 00:27:18,880 Speaker 2: have to dig out with your fingernails. I don't call 486 00:27:18,960 --> 00:27:22,159 Speaker 2: what the real gems inside that particular movie were, but 487 00:27:22,240 --> 00:27:23,320 Speaker 2: I think we did find a few. 488 00:27:23,920 --> 00:27:26,280 Speaker 3: Yeah, it had fewer gyms than most I think, but 489 00:27:26,320 --> 00:27:29,080 Speaker 3: it was still. Like I've said about several things recently, 490 00:27:29,080 --> 00:27:32,240 Speaker 3: it is not good, but it's a good time anyway. 491 00:27:32,400 --> 00:27:35,159 Speaker 3: Megan says, as always, thank you for all the wonderful content, 492 00:27:35,240 --> 00:27:38,320 Speaker 3: both the regular science episodes and all the fun bonus content. 493 00:27:38,400 --> 00:27:41,840 Speaker 3: I love it all. Smiley face emoticon Megan. 494 00:27:42,359 --> 00:27:45,680 Speaker 2: Yeah, I have not seen Ken, but it is notable 495 00:27:45,720 --> 00:27:50,000 Speaker 2: that it's based on a novel by and Andrew Niederman, 496 00:27:50,080 --> 00:27:53,240 Speaker 2: who also wrote the book that the Devil's Advocate is 497 00:27:53,280 --> 00:27:56,400 Speaker 2: based upon the al Pacino Devil Lawyer movie from the nineties. 498 00:27:56,560 --> 00:27:56,840 Speaker 2: Uh huh. 499 00:27:56,960 --> 00:27:59,480 Speaker 3: Yeah. We were just talking about that movie off Mike 500 00:27:59,520 --> 00:28:01,680 Speaker 3: before we started here today, and I have a very 501 00:28:01,680 --> 00:28:05,400 Speaker 3: specific memory of being a kid in the nineties and 502 00:28:05,480 --> 00:28:09,520 Speaker 3: thinking about the Devil's Advocate. This is a serious movie 503 00:28:09,520 --> 00:28:11,479 Speaker 3: for grown ups? 504 00:28:12,560 --> 00:28:14,480 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I think it did have that air at 505 00:28:14,560 --> 00:28:16,680 Speaker 2: the time. I have not seen it since it came out, 506 00:28:16,720 --> 00:28:17,640 Speaker 2: though I have. 507 00:28:17,880 --> 00:28:20,359 Speaker 3: I don't know if it's a serious movie for grown ups, 508 00:28:21,200 --> 00:28:23,960 Speaker 3: but anyway, looking at Pin, it looks to me so 509 00:28:24,000 --> 00:28:28,520 Speaker 3: it's like a kind of bizarre psychological horror thriller. It's 510 00:28:28,560 --> 00:28:33,359 Speaker 3: got like weird family relationships and murders. The main premise, 511 00:28:33,400 --> 00:28:35,240 Speaker 3: from what I can tell, is that there's a doctor 512 00:28:35,720 --> 00:28:40,880 Speaker 3: played by Terry O'Quinn who creates an anatomically realistic human 513 00:28:40,960 --> 00:28:44,600 Speaker 3: dummy named Pin to use in educating his small children 514 00:28:44,640 --> 00:28:47,880 Speaker 3: about medicine and the human body. Unfortunately, I think at 515 00:28:47,920 --> 00:28:51,440 Speaker 3: least one of his children sort of turns into Norman Bates, 516 00:28:51,520 --> 00:28:54,320 Speaker 3: but sub in this dummy instead of Norman Bates his mother. 517 00:28:54,840 --> 00:28:56,760 Speaker 2: Hmm, all right, that doesn't sound good. 518 00:28:57,280 --> 00:29:00,280 Speaker 3: Also, Robie attached a screenshot of what the dummy looks 519 00:29:00,320 --> 00:29:02,680 Speaker 3: like there appear to be a couple of varieties. There's 520 00:29:02,680 --> 00:29:07,200 Speaker 3: a skin on and skin off variety, and yeah, super creepy. 521 00:29:07,320 --> 00:29:09,560 Speaker 2: Yeah, I agree. I agree, this is a very creepy 522 00:29:09,560 --> 00:29:13,480 Speaker 2: looking dummy for sure. Skin on also it's pretty bad 523 00:29:14,920 --> 00:29:17,000 Speaker 2: skin skin off is creepier skin but I don't know, 524 00:29:17,080 --> 00:29:20,520 Speaker 2: skin on is also kind of creepy, So yeah, I agree. 525 00:29:21,040 --> 00:29:23,120 Speaker 2: You know, I've actually been very interested in doing some 526 00:29:23,160 --> 00:29:25,920 Speaker 2: sort of ventral equos dummy horror film at some point 527 00:29:26,000 --> 00:29:29,080 Speaker 2: or Another one that I had been considering already is 528 00:29:29,360 --> 00:29:32,080 Speaker 2: the film Devil Do all black and white picture that 529 00:29:32,120 --> 00:29:34,560 Speaker 2: some of you remember from Mystery Science three thousand. But 530 00:29:34,640 --> 00:29:38,160 Speaker 2: then we also had listeners. A listener write in with 531 00:29:38,200 --> 00:29:40,480 Speaker 2: a recommendation for another one that's kind of been on 532 00:29:40,520 --> 00:29:41,000 Speaker 2: my radar. 533 00:29:41,400 --> 00:29:44,920 Speaker 3: Oh yeah, right, So our listener, Chris says, Hey, Joe 534 00:29:44,920 --> 00:29:47,240 Speaker 3: and Robert, I would like to recommend the nineteen seventy 535 00:29:47,280 --> 00:29:51,480 Speaker 3: eight film Magic, starring Anthony Hopkins and Burgess Meredith. It's 536 00:29:51,480 --> 00:29:53,680 Speaker 3: sort of an evil dummy made Me do it movie, 537 00:29:53,720 --> 00:29:57,480 Speaker 3: though there's more to it than that, Chris says. Hopkins 538 00:29:57,480 --> 00:30:00,480 Speaker 3: does an outstanding performance for what is this essentially a 539 00:30:00,560 --> 00:30:02,840 Speaker 3: ninety minute episode of Tales from the Crypt to keep 540 00:30:02,920 --> 00:30:04,680 Speaker 3: up the great work, guys, Chris. 541 00:30:05,120 --> 00:30:10,000 Speaker 2: Yeah again, Yeah. Attenborough screenplay by William Goldman, based on 542 00:30:10,080 --> 00:30:13,040 Speaker 2: his novel So yeah, it's there are a number of 543 00:30:13,080 --> 00:30:14,640 Speaker 2: attractive elements here. You know. 544 00:30:14,680 --> 00:30:16,800 Speaker 3: I think I was just browsing recently and there's a 545 00:30:16,880 --> 00:30:19,160 Speaker 3: vinegar syndrome blu ray of devil doll. 546 00:30:19,400 --> 00:30:21,720 Speaker 2: Ooh okay, yeah that's right. I think I got an 547 00:30:21,720 --> 00:30:24,360 Speaker 2: email about that. Yeah, have to check that one out. 548 00:30:24,640 --> 00:30:28,000 Speaker 2: That's one that I remember, even in its Mystery Science 549 00:30:28,040 --> 00:30:32,280 Speaker 2: Theater three thousand and form, I found pretty unsettling, just 550 00:30:32,320 --> 00:30:35,520 Speaker 2: something about it. Its tone, and there's kind of like 551 00:30:35,560 --> 00:30:47,120 Speaker 2: a dead pan uncanniness to it. This next one comes 552 00:30:47,160 --> 00:30:50,160 Speaker 2: to us from Oh it's another Robert. That's why I 553 00:30:50,200 --> 00:30:53,880 Speaker 2: was thrown off guard there this Robert says. Dear Robert 554 00:30:53,920 --> 00:30:57,160 Speaker 2: and Joe. First, thanks for a wonderfully varied podcast. I 555 00:30:57,200 --> 00:30:59,600 Speaker 2: listened regularly on my walk to and from the university, 556 00:30:59,600 --> 00:31:02,880 Speaker 2: where I can each creative writing. I just heard the 557 00:31:02,920 --> 00:31:05,560 Speaker 2: listener Mail episode from April third, twenty twenty five, and 558 00:31:05,640 --> 00:31:08,760 Speaker 2: noted one of the suggestions for the upcoming anniversary is 559 00:31:08,760 --> 00:31:12,880 Speaker 2: the Japanese film Wild Zero. Hearing it brought me back 560 00:31:12,880 --> 00:31:16,120 Speaker 2: to seeing the film in grand style at the Fantasia 561 00:31:16,160 --> 00:31:20,760 Speaker 2: Festival in Montreal in nineteen ninety nine. The director Tatsuro 562 00:31:20,800 --> 00:31:23,960 Speaker 2: Takuci was in attendance, and I recall him looking fab 563 00:31:24,040 --> 00:31:27,440 Speaker 2: in a silver sequin blazer and a feather boa, along 564 00:31:27,440 --> 00:31:31,240 Speaker 2: with an entourage of twelve or fifteen comrades, all dressed 565 00:31:31,320 --> 00:31:35,400 Speaker 2: in the over the top Shibuya chai style popular in 566 00:31:35,480 --> 00:31:38,560 Speaker 2: Tokyo at the time. The film's a science fiction rock 567 00:31:38,600 --> 00:31:42,000 Speaker 2: and roll, zombie apocalypse comedy romance gender bender, and it 568 00:31:42,040 --> 00:31:44,760 Speaker 2: holds a very special place in my heart. The real 569 00:31:44,800 --> 00:31:47,160 Speaker 2: life band at the center of the story, Guitar Wolf, 570 00:31:47,520 --> 00:31:50,320 Speaker 2: was the inspiration for a fictional band that appears in 571 00:31:50,360 --> 00:31:53,560 Speaker 2: one of my children's novels, The Creature Department, a band 572 00:31:53,600 --> 00:31:57,080 Speaker 2: with a name I know you'll enjoy, Boris Minor and 573 00:31:57,160 --> 00:32:00,440 Speaker 2: the Carlofs. It might not make the anniversary episode, but 574 00:32:00,480 --> 00:32:02,960 Speaker 2: I'd love to hear Wild Zero get the weird House treatment. 575 00:32:03,200 --> 00:32:04,760 Speaker 2: Very kind regards Robert. 576 00:32:05,160 --> 00:32:06,960 Speaker 3: As I think I said last time, I saw this 577 00:32:07,040 --> 00:32:08,880 Speaker 3: movie way back when I was in high school, and 578 00:32:09,160 --> 00:32:11,920 Speaker 3: I remember it made a very positive impression on me 579 00:32:11,960 --> 00:32:15,840 Speaker 3: then it I remember it had the feeling of a 580 00:32:15,840 --> 00:32:17,880 Speaker 3: movie with a real zest for life. 581 00:32:19,160 --> 00:32:21,440 Speaker 2: Yeah, I actually never saw it, but I'm very familiar 582 00:32:21,440 --> 00:32:25,520 Speaker 2: with seeing it's poster art, you know, definitely, you know, 583 00:32:25,640 --> 00:32:28,080 Speaker 2: going to places where I could rent or see movies 584 00:32:28,200 --> 00:32:30,880 Speaker 2: or learn about movies. I do remember seeing this box 585 00:32:31,000 --> 00:32:31,520 Speaker 2: art a lot. 586 00:32:32,320 --> 00:32:35,640 Speaker 3: All right, This next message is from uber Cthulhu. Uber 587 00:32:35,640 --> 00:32:38,880 Speaker 3: Cthulhu says, And by the way, you know, friends, you 588 00:32:38,920 --> 00:32:42,320 Speaker 3: can always write in with the pseudonym. Just specify. We'll 589 00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:44,400 Speaker 3: use whatever name you give us, and if you use 590 00:32:44,400 --> 00:32:52,040 Speaker 3: your real name, we'll just use your first name. Uber 591 00:32:52,080 --> 00:32:55,240 Speaker 3: Cuthulhu says, Hey, guys, I absolutely love your shows. I 592 00:32:55,280 --> 00:32:58,080 Speaker 3: listened to them regularly. You have a masterful way of 593 00:32:58,120 --> 00:33:02,760 Speaker 3: dissecting and appreciating the films you feature. Thank you. I'm 594 00:33:02,760 --> 00:33:06,040 Speaker 3: curious if you have ever done a show on the equinox. 595 00:33:06,200 --> 00:33:08,960 Speaker 3: It is a film that I saw once at about 596 00:33:09,000 --> 00:33:13,000 Speaker 3: age eight and never came across again for many years, 597 00:33:13,320 --> 00:33:16,760 Speaker 3: but it really made an impression on my youthful, malleable brain. 598 00:33:17,240 --> 00:33:19,880 Speaker 3: Fast forward about thirty five years and I was having 599 00:33:19,880 --> 00:33:22,760 Speaker 3: a conversation with a great, dearly departed friend of mine 600 00:33:23,040 --> 00:33:26,000 Speaker 3: about strange films that we had seen. He turned out 601 00:33:26,040 --> 00:33:28,000 Speaker 3: to be the only other person I had ever met 602 00:33:28,080 --> 00:33:30,600 Speaker 3: that had seen it. In any case, I sought it 603 00:33:30,640 --> 00:33:34,080 Speaker 3: out and after a long search in almost eighty dollars, 604 00:33:34,240 --> 00:33:37,840 Speaker 3: I procured it. Wow, it's just as strange as I remember. 605 00:33:38,120 --> 00:33:40,160 Speaker 3: In a few words, I will describe it as young 606 00:33:40,200 --> 00:33:43,920 Speaker 3: couples in a woodsy area trying to picnic, beset by 607 00:33:44,240 --> 00:33:49,960 Speaker 3: demonic possession, other dimensions, and Ray Harryhausen type creatures. Oh boy, 608 00:33:50,000 --> 00:33:53,520 Speaker 3: you know how to get our attention, Uber Cuthulhu says, 609 00:33:53,520 --> 00:33:57,400 Speaker 3: and get this. It features a young young Herb Tarlik 610 00:33:57,480 --> 00:34:02,320 Speaker 3: from WKRP in Cincinnati. Anyway, sorry to be long winded, 611 00:34:02,360 --> 00:34:05,760 Speaker 3: love your shows, please feature it. Uber Cthulhu out peace, 612 00:34:06,600 --> 00:34:10,880 Speaker 3: Love getting tidings of peace from uber Cuthulhu. But also, wow, 613 00:34:11,000 --> 00:34:13,239 Speaker 3: I was not previously aware of this movie. I looked 614 00:34:13,280 --> 00:34:16,320 Speaker 3: it up and it looks good. According to what I've read, 615 00:34:17,080 --> 00:34:20,480 Speaker 3: it sounds like a combination of the original Evil Dead 616 00:34:20,680 --> 00:34:26,120 Speaker 3: and a movie that I've seen called The Daytime Ended One. Yeah, 617 00:34:26,200 --> 00:34:28,759 Speaker 3: it's like where a family goes to a house in 618 00:34:28,800 --> 00:34:32,720 Speaker 3: the desert to be repeatedly subjected to encounters with special 619 00:34:32,760 --> 00:34:36,759 Speaker 3: effects reels. It's mostly stop motion dinosaurs, but also there's 620 00:34:36,800 --> 00:34:39,640 Speaker 3: like a looks like a Betamax camera that floats around 621 00:34:39,680 --> 00:34:40,080 Speaker 3: in the air. 622 00:34:40,800 --> 00:34:41,240 Speaker 2: Yeah. 623 00:34:41,400 --> 00:34:44,840 Speaker 3: Yeah, but I compare it to that because so, like 624 00:34:45,000 --> 00:34:48,040 Speaker 3: Uber Cuthulhu said, Equinox is about a group of young 625 00:34:48,040 --> 00:34:49,799 Speaker 3: people who go up for a picnic. I think they're 626 00:34:49,800 --> 00:34:53,400 Speaker 3: in southern California. But the Evil Dead comparison is, I 627 00:34:53,400 --> 00:34:56,240 Speaker 3: think they find a book which allows them to summon 628 00:34:56,400 --> 00:34:59,560 Speaker 3: various demons. And then the other element is these demons 629 00:34:59,560 --> 00:35:02,879 Speaker 3: are of a of Harry House in Persuasion. So I've 630 00:35:02,920 --> 00:35:05,319 Speaker 3: found a stream of it online and I was just 631 00:35:05,360 --> 00:35:08,040 Speaker 3: like skipping through to various parts. There's one part in 632 00:35:08,040 --> 00:35:10,440 Speaker 3: the middle where a cabin in the woods is being 633 00:35:10,440 --> 00:35:14,680 Speaker 3: attacked by a giant land squid with green thorny arms. 634 00:35:15,680 --> 00:35:18,560 Speaker 3: Then there's another section that's got a monster with like 635 00:35:18,560 --> 00:35:21,520 Speaker 3: three fins on his head and big ribs protruding out 636 00:35:21,560 --> 00:35:24,760 Speaker 3: of his body. Also, at some point, the human characters 637 00:35:24,800 --> 00:35:27,040 Speaker 3: are fighting a big green guy in a pelt who 638 00:35:27,120 --> 00:35:30,040 Speaker 3: looks like a combination of Ega and the Incredible Hulk. 639 00:35:30,440 --> 00:35:31,319 Speaker 3: You see this guy here? 640 00:35:32,200 --> 00:35:35,160 Speaker 2: Yeah, I've seen some clips from this film. I've never 641 00:35:35,200 --> 00:35:39,120 Speaker 2: watched it in full. It's my understanding that it's that 642 00:35:39,160 --> 00:35:42,000 Speaker 2: the effects are largely the work of David Allen, who's 643 00:35:42,040 --> 00:35:44,200 Speaker 2: come up on the show before because he's had his 644 00:35:44,239 --> 00:35:48,160 Speaker 2: hand in stop motion effects for so many films, including 645 00:35:48,200 --> 00:35:52,080 Speaker 2: two that we've watched before, The Dungeon Master and Robot Jocks. 646 00:35:52,840 --> 00:35:53,399 Speaker 3: There we go. 647 00:35:54,400 --> 00:35:56,760 Speaker 2: So yeah, I'd be up for Equinox at some point. 648 00:35:57,400 --> 00:35:59,279 Speaker 2: One I've never seen, but it's kind of been on 649 00:35:59,320 --> 00:36:01,359 Speaker 2: the list for a long time. 650 00:36:01,880 --> 00:36:04,399 Speaker 3: I reject your reality and substitute my own. 651 00:36:06,360 --> 00:36:08,200 Speaker 2: All Right, we're going to close things out here with 652 00:36:09,160 --> 00:36:12,480 Speaker 2: a message from our discord server. This one comes to 653 00:36:12,560 --> 00:36:14,880 Speaker 2: us from hot Nae Palm Death, who writes and it says, 654 00:36:15,360 --> 00:36:18,160 Speaker 2: I was thinking you guys might consider doing the Denzel 655 00:36:18,360 --> 00:36:24,160 Speaker 2: Washington trilogy since you did Virtuosity, Fallen, and Ricochet complete 656 00:36:24,560 --> 00:36:28,799 Speaker 2: the triumvirate of Denzel versus Psycho. You did the sci fi. 657 00:36:29,160 --> 00:36:33,240 Speaker 2: Ricochet is hard drama, but Fallen is supernatural. Otherwise, basically 658 00:36:33,280 --> 00:36:37,520 Speaker 2: the same idea Denzel versus super smart Psycho all came 659 00:36:37,560 --> 00:36:38,520 Speaker 2: out in the nineties. 660 00:36:38,920 --> 00:36:42,280 Speaker 3: I remember Fallen was like a movie that a bunch 661 00:36:42,320 --> 00:36:45,000 Speaker 3: of my friends in high school thought was really cool, 662 00:36:45,040 --> 00:36:46,560 Speaker 3: and I never saw the whole thing. I think I 663 00:36:46,560 --> 00:36:48,319 Speaker 3: saw like a few minutes of it on TV and 664 00:36:48,360 --> 00:36:48,799 Speaker 3: that's it. 665 00:36:49,160 --> 00:36:51,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it was on in the background, like 666 00:36:51,040 --> 00:36:54,920 Speaker 2: when I was in school or something. Now. Ricochet. I 667 00:36:55,320 --> 00:36:58,480 Speaker 2: do remember seeing that one, because this is something that 668 00:36:59,520 --> 00:37:02,759 Speaker 2: the listener here gets into. But John Lithgow is in 669 00:37:02,800 --> 00:37:05,680 Speaker 2: it playing the villain, and he's a deliciously over the 670 00:37:05,680 --> 00:37:09,480 Speaker 2: top psycho villain in that picture. All right, So they 671 00:37:09,480 --> 00:37:11,719 Speaker 2: continue in there, right. Also, The Quick and the Dead, 672 00:37:11,880 --> 00:37:14,960 Speaker 2: which we mentioned, is particularly good and provides connections to 673 00:37:15,040 --> 00:37:18,400 Speaker 2: so many other things. Russell Crowe, Gene Hackman, Sharon Stone, 674 00:37:18,480 --> 00:37:23,640 Speaker 2: Leonardo DiCaprio, Lance Hendrickson, Keith David All directed by Sam Raimi. 675 00:37:24,360 --> 00:37:27,720 Speaker 2: I fully believe John Lithgow is the most versatile actor 676 00:37:27,760 --> 00:37:30,960 Speaker 2: of his generation. He is great as a villain, both 677 00:37:31,000 --> 00:37:35,719 Speaker 2: subtle dexter realistic but extreme Ricochet and completely over the 678 00:37:35,719 --> 00:37:36,960 Speaker 2: top Buckeroo Bonzai. 679 00:37:37,160 --> 00:37:39,840 Speaker 3: Oh where he's doctor Lizardo in Buffer Bonzai. 680 00:37:40,040 --> 00:37:44,200 Speaker 2: Yeah, but he is equally at home in subtle comedy world. 681 00:37:44,239 --> 00:37:48,040 Speaker 2: According to Garth, a normal comedy third Rock from the 682 00:37:48,080 --> 00:37:53,040 Speaker 2: Sun to Zany Buckeroo Bonzai again, or dramatic roles like Footloose, 683 00:37:53,160 --> 00:37:55,640 Speaker 2: Rise of the Planet of the Apes, Terms of Endearment 684 00:37:56,080 --> 00:37:58,719 Speaker 2: and so forth. Yeah, I think that's a solid read 685 00:37:58,800 --> 00:38:01,920 Speaker 2: on John liftgot he he has such a wide range 686 00:38:02,040 --> 00:38:06,200 Speaker 2: and he is He's proven himself believable in so many 687 00:38:06,200 --> 00:38:09,040 Speaker 2: different sorts of roles. I don't know that he's played 688 00:38:09,080 --> 00:38:11,120 Speaker 2: a or I haven't seen him in a villain role 689 00:38:11,160 --> 00:38:13,560 Speaker 2: in a while. So it's at times it's almost it 690 00:38:13,560 --> 00:38:16,439 Speaker 2: almost shakes me to remember that, Oh yeah, this guy 691 00:38:16,440 --> 00:38:19,200 Speaker 2: playing like the sweet old man character has played some 692 00:38:19,320 --> 00:38:21,360 Speaker 2: just vicious psychopaths in his past. 693 00:38:21,600 --> 00:38:26,480 Speaker 3: This is funny. I'm like apparently unusually underexposed to John Lithgow, 694 00:38:26,600 --> 00:38:28,600 Speaker 3: so I know him from Buckaroo Bonzi, where of course 695 00:38:28,600 --> 00:38:30,800 Speaker 3: I love him as he's the villain there. He's got 696 00:38:30,840 --> 00:38:33,560 Speaker 3: like sharp teeth and he's usually got electricity coming out 697 00:38:33,560 --> 00:38:35,560 Speaker 3: of him and stuff. But I never made it to 698 00:38:35,600 --> 00:38:39,399 Speaker 3: his season on Dexter. Never seen Ricochet, never seen the World, 699 00:38:39,400 --> 00:38:42,440 Speaker 3: according to Garp, never seen Third Rock from the Sun 700 00:38:43,640 --> 00:38:47,920 Speaker 3: or Footloose or terms of endearment. I'm just all behind. 701 00:38:47,760 --> 00:38:48,960 Speaker 2: Harry and the Henderson stuff. 702 00:38:49,760 --> 00:38:52,280 Speaker 3: I think I have seen that. It's been a while. 703 00:38:53,280 --> 00:38:55,040 Speaker 2: The most recent thing I think I saw him in 704 00:38:55,239 --> 00:38:58,719 Speaker 2: is the the what they did the two seasons of 705 00:38:59,560 --> 00:39:03,000 Speaker 2: of an new Perry Mason series on HBO that I 706 00:39:03,440 --> 00:39:06,560 Speaker 2: think was underappreciated. I thought it was excellent. John Lithgott 707 00:39:06,560 --> 00:39:11,520 Speaker 2: plays Perry Mason's this this lawyer that he looks up 708 00:39:11,520 --> 00:39:13,879 Speaker 2: to and works for early in his career, and it's 709 00:39:13,920 --> 00:39:15,480 Speaker 2: just it's it's a great performance. 710 00:39:16,239 --> 00:39:18,960 Speaker 3: Oh wait, I did catch him in he was in Conclave. 711 00:39:19,600 --> 00:39:22,120 Speaker 3: I don't want to spoil any spoil anything about Conclave, 712 00:39:22,200 --> 00:39:24,000 Speaker 3: but he's got an interesting role in that. 713 00:39:24,000 --> 00:39:25,759 Speaker 2: That's the movie where they picked the next pope, right, 714 00:39:25,800 --> 00:39:27,320 Speaker 2: that's where they picked the next I don't want to 715 00:39:27,320 --> 00:39:29,719 Speaker 2: spoilers on the pope selection, so I'm not gonna watch 716 00:39:29,719 --> 00:39:31,240 Speaker 2: it until until we get a new Pope. 717 00:39:31,239 --> 00:39:33,440 Speaker 3: I guess actually quite enjoyed Conclave. 718 00:39:33,760 --> 00:39:35,040 Speaker 2: All right, Well i'll have I'll have to give it 719 00:39:35,080 --> 00:39:37,319 Speaker 2: a look. I'll put it on the list of new 720 00:39:37,320 --> 00:39:41,760 Speaker 2: releases right under Death of the Unicorn, Death of Unicorn Conclave. 721 00:39:43,000 --> 00:39:45,160 Speaker 3: For a second, I was mixing up characters though, because 722 00:39:45,200 --> 00:39:47,080 Speaker 3: I was like, wait a minute, is John lithgow the 723 00:39:47,440 --> 00:39:50,600 Speaker 3: the pope candidate who vapes? No, he's not. That's a 724 00:39:50,600 --> 00:39:54,080 Speaker 3: different pope candidate in it. It's got a vaping, perhaps Pope. 725 00:39:54,120 --> 00:39:56,440 Speaker 2: Is this a part of the Jude law? Young Pope 726 00:39:56,480 --> 00:39:58,920 Speaker 2: Hot Pope universe or is this separate? 727 00:39:59,280 --> 00:40:02,320 Speaker 3: No? No, oh, it's not hot. No, it's not especially 728 00:40:02,360 --> 00:40:05,800 Speaker 3: hot or young or hip, but it is interesting. 729 00:40:06,080 --> 00:40:10,000 Speaker 2: Okay, all right, We're gonna go ahead and close up 730 00:40:10,000 --> 00:40:12,000 Speaker 2: the mail bag for this episode, but we'd love to 731 00:40:12,040 --> 00:40:15,959 Speaker 2: hear from you all of your Conclave related thoughts and more. 732 00:40:16,800 --> 00:40:19,320 Speaker 2: You can write into us at that email address that 733 00:40:19,360 --> 00:40:21,759 Speaker 2: we reference to the top of the episode, and Joe 734 00:40:21,800 --> 00:40:23,840 Speaker 2: will throw it out again here in a minute as well. 735 00:40:24,440 --> 00:40:26,640 Speaker 2: Let's see other places you can find us on Instagram 736 00:40:26,640 --> 00:40:30,000 Speaker 2: where stbim podcast. If you're on letterbox dot com, you 737 00:40:30,040 --> 00:40:32,759 Speaker 2: can follow weird House there. Use your name weird House. 738 00:40:32,800 --> 00:40:34,359 Speaker 2: We got a nice list of all the movies we've 739 00:40:34,360 --> 00:40:36,319 Speaker 2: covered over the years, and sometimes a peek ahead at 740 00:40:36,320 --> 00:40:38,040 Speaker 2: what comes next Huge things. 741 00:40:38,040 --> 00:40:41,400 Speaker 3: As always to our excellent audio producer JJ Posway. If 742 00:40:41,400 --> 00:40:42,960 Speaker 3: you would like to get in touch with us with 743 00:40:43,040 --> 00:40:45,279 Speaker 3: feedback on this episode or any other, to suggest a 744 00:40:45,360 --> 00:40:47,680 Speaker 3: topic for the future, or just to say hello, you 745 00:40:47,719 --> 00:40:50,200 Speaker 3: can email us at contact at stuff to Blow your 746 00:40:50,239 --> 00:40:58,040 Speaker 3: Mind dot com. 747 00:40:58,160 --> 00:41:01,120 Speaker 1: Stuff to Blow Your Mind is production of iHeartRadio. For 748 00:41:01,200 --> 00:41:05,040 Speaker 1: more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app Apple Podcasts 749 00:41:05,120 --> 00:41:06,920 Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows,