1 00:00:00,640 --> 00:00:04,160 Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Molly John Fast and this is Fast Politics, 2 00:00:04,360 --> 00:00:07,120 Speaker 1: where we discussed the top political headlines with some of 3 00:00:07,160 --> 00:00:11,399 Speaker 1: today's best minds. And over seventeen hundred doctors have signed 4 00:00:11,400 --> 00:00:15,240 Speaker 1: a letter urging the Senate to reject RFK Junior as 5 00:00:15,360 --> 00:00:19,920 Speaker 1: Health Secretary. How is it only seventeen thousand? We have 6 00:00:20,320 --> 00:00:23,440 Speaker 1: such a great show for you today, The Nation's jet 7 00:00:23,560 --> 00:00:26,280 Speaker 1: here gets to the bottom of why Trump is so 8 00:00:26,600 --> 00:00:32,120 Speaker 1: excited about annexing Canada. Then we'll talk to Senator Tammy Dunckworth. 9 00:00:32,280 --> 00:00:34,279 Speaker 2: But first the news Somali. 10 00:00:34,760 --> 00:00:39,559 Speaker 3: The Supreme Court shocked everyone last night and let the 11 00:00:39,560 --> 00:00:43,480 Speaker 3: sentencing go ahead with Donald Trump. And the sentencing has happened. 12 00:00:43,479 --> 00:00:44,240 Speaker 3: What are you seeing here? 13 00:00:44,479 --> 00:00:45,839 Speaker 2: Let us rephrase this. 14 00:00:45,920 --> 00:00:50,120 Speaker 1: The Supreme Court proved to not be complete partisan hacks. 15 00:00:50,800 --> 00:00:53,360 Speaker 2: This is the shock was so Trump. 16 00:00:53,640 --> 00:00:57,680 Speaker 1: He had a call earlier this week, perhaps completely unrelated 17 00:00:57,840 --> 00:01:04,360 Speaker 1: but likely not, with his good friend Justice Alito, And 18 00:01:05,080 --> 00:01:10,360 Speaker 1: who knows Alito said it. It was about recommending a 19 00:01:10,480 --> 00:01:15,160 Speaker 1: clerk for the Trump two point zero admin. Maybe perhaps 20 00:01:15,319 --> 00:01:20,880 Speaker 1: the appearance of impropriety is certainly appearing anyway, So then 21 00:01:21,000 --> 00:01:24,480 Speaker 1: Trump went to his good friends, said I shouldn't be 22 00:01:24,520 --> 00:01:29,039 Speaker 1: sentenced for this fraud stuff because I'm president or will 23 00:01:29,080 --> 00:01:30,199 Speaker 1: be president. 24 00:01:29,840 --> 00:01:31,640 Speaker 2: And ergo I am God king. 25 00:01:32,400 --> 00:01:37,000 Speaker 1: And you will be completely shocked to find out that 26 00:01:37,080 --> 00:01:43,080 Speaker 1: there are five justices who do not think Trump should 27 00:01:43,319 --> 00:01:47,840 Speaker 1: be king, and this is perhaps very good news for 28 00:01:47,880 --> 00:01:52,080 Speaker 1: American democracy. You will be very unsurprised to hear that 29 00:01:52,360 --> 00:01:57,040 Speaker 1: Thomas Alito, who have complete brainworms and our maga to 30 00:01:57,080 --> 00:02:02,440 Speaker 1: the core, and Gorsich, who who is just a complete 31 00:02:02,600 --> 00:02:07,240 Speaker 1: disaster except when it comes to Native Americans, which somehow 32 00:02:07,360 --> 00:02:11,400 Speaker 1: is one thing. And Justice keg stand three white men, 33 00:02:11,760 --> 00:02:15,600 Speaker 1: and Justice Thomas who is not white, all believe that 34 00:02:15,800 --> 00:02:19,280 Speaker 1: Donald Trump should be God king. On the other side, 35 00:02:19,400 --> 00:02:24,520 Speaker 1: we have the three liberal justices, Justice Amy, who actually 36 00:02:24,600 --> 00:02:27,560 Speaker 1: we have heard in oral arguments is quite smart though 37 00:02:27,800 --> 00:02:30,680 Speaker 1: she was put on the court to overturn row, which 38 00:02:30,680 --> 00:02:35,440 Speaker 1: she did for Trump. And Justice Roberts, who is theoretically 39 00:02:35,960 --> 00:02:40,160 Speaker 1: the chief Justice, though he's behaved in a very kind 40 00:02:40,160 --> 00:02:44,919 Speaker 1: of non chief ye way, those guys said, no, Donald 41 00:02:44,919 --> 00:02:47,120 Speaker 1: Trump can still be sentenced. We are not going to 42 00:02:47,120 --> 00:02:51,919 Speaker 1: step in. We are not going to do everything he wants. Now, look, 43 00:02:52,160 --> 00:02:54,880 Speaker 1: this is insane. Okay, we need to take a moment here. 44 00:02:55,040 --> 00:02:59,720 Speaker 1: I think I've been pretty calm about the coming Trump admin. 45 00:03:00,120 --> 00:03:03,600 Speaker 1: You know when we talk about how to protect the norms, 46 00:03:03,880 --> 00:03:08,959 Speaker 1: and this is not normal. This is not normal, even 47 00:03:09,120 --> 00:03:12,680 Speaker 1: a little right, not normal at all to have a 48 00:03:13,000 --> 00:03:16,680 Speaker 1: president call up the Supreme Court. Or maybe he was 49 00:03:16,720 --> 00:03:20,000 Speaker 1: talking about something totally different with Alito, but there certainly is. 50 00:03:20,200 --> 00:03:23,480 Speaker 1: It really feels like impropriety, and it's not normal to 51 00:03:23,520 --> 00:03:26,720 Speaker 1: go to the Supreme Court and say, please just fix 52 00:03:26,800 --> 00:03:28,840 Speaker 1: this for me. They're not supposed to be fixers. They 53 00:03:28,840 --> 00:03:31,959 Speaker 1: are supposed to be beyond politics. They are supposed to 54 00:03:32,000 --> 00:03:36,480 Speaker 1: be the arbiters of the Constitution, and so watching this 55 00:03:36,800 --> 00:03:40,800 Speaker 1: is pretty insane. So we can be grateful that there 56 00:03:40,800 --> 00:03:44,320 Speaker 1: are five still, say in Supreme Court justices, but we 57 00:03:44,360 --> 00:03:47,880 Speaker 1: should also realize that the even being here is so 58 00:03:48,360 --> 00:03:51,040 Speaker 1: beyond the norms, is so not how any of this 59 00:03:51,160 --> 00:03:54,520 Speaker 1: is supposed to work. We should be screaming from the rooftops. 60 00:03:54,560 --> 00:03:56,680 Speaker 1: There are I have said, I say again and again. 61 00:03:56,960 --> 00:03:59,880 Speaker 1: Trump is not going to annex Canada. That's just a distraction. 62 00:04:00,000 --> 00:04:01,840 Speaker 1: And a lot of this stuff is just a distraction. 63 00:04:02,320 --> 00:04:06,040 Speaker 1: Sending Junior to Greenland, distraction, distraction, distraction. I'm calling up 64 00:04:06,040 --> 00:04:08,440 Speaker 1: the Supreme Court because you want them to do something 65 00:04:08,480 --> 00:04:11,880 Speaker 1: for you. This is fucking bad, and this is the 66 00:04:11,960 --> 00:04:14,400 Speaker 1: kind of stuff that we all need to be talking 67 00:04:14,400 --> 00:04:15,960 Speaker 1: about and writing about and thinking about. 68 00:04:16,400 --> 00:04:19,200 Speaker 2: And again, there is no ethics. 69 00:04:18,839 --> 00:04:20,719 Speaker 1: Code for the Supreme Court, so they can get away 70 00:04:20,760 --> 00:04:22,599 Speaker 1: with doing whatever they want. And this is how we 71 00:04:22,680 --> 00:04:27,000 Speaker 1: got here, and it's just wrong and bad and Jesus Christ, 72 00:04:27,160 --> 00:04:30,120 Speaker 1: so that I think I have, that's as soap boxy 73 00:04:30,120 --> 00:04:30,919 Speaker 1: as I'm going to get. 74 00:04:31,120 --> 00:04:34,119 Speaker 3: Well, well, let's do a little celebrating and some good news. 75 00:04:34,120 --> 00:04:36,839 Speaker 3: Then in that case, Joe Biden first president ever to 76 00:04:36,880 --> 00:04:39,680 Speaker 3: have job growth in every month of his presidency since 77 00:04:39,680 --> 00:04:42,440 Speaker 3: they started measuring it. And this job support, we'll be 78 00:04:42,480 --> 00:04:44,280 Speaker 3: shocked to say it's doing pretty well. 79 00:04:44,480 --> 00:04:47,280 Speaker 1: Yeah, they chose not to re elect him, but the 80 00:04:47,320 --> 00:04:50,560 Speaker 1: economy he's leaving is a gift, a gift to a 81 00:04:50,640 --> 00:04:53,760 Speaker 1: guy who is planning to put tariffs on everything. 82 00:04:54,080 --> 00:04:56,719 Speaker 3: But the funny thing is Pop, Fox News Night and 83 00:04:56,800 --> 00:04:59,080 Speaker 3: Day is preparing everyone for that. The economy is going 84 00:04:59,120 --> 00:05:01,320 Speaker 3: to take. It's because Joe Biden has given Trump a 85 00:05:01,360 --> 00:05:02,800 Speaker 3: ticking time. Bob is what they. 86 00:05:02,680 --> 00:05:07,200 Speaker 1: Say, right, I mean, Rupert Murdoch sees what's going on here. 87 00:05:07,320 --> 00:05:09,880 Speaker 1: He sees the writing on the wall and so he 88 00:05:10,080 --> 00:05:13,880 Speaker 1: is trying to run a little bit of interference for 89 00:05:13,920 --> 00:05:19,120 Speaker 1: his buddy. Yeah, job growth, great economy, and then Joe 90 00:05:19,120 --> 00:05:22,040 Speaker 1: Biden cannot get reelected. You know, It's enough to make 91 00:05:22,080 --> 00:05:24,880 Speaker 1: a person very, very very depressed. 92 00:05:25,400 --> 00:05:29,400 Speaker 3: It really is something so in other horrifying Supreme Court news, 93 00:05:29,440 --> 00:05:31,359 Speaker 3: because we can't find two stories in a row that 94 00:05:31,400 --> 00:05:35,920 Speaker 3: are good. Jimmie Raskin did reprimend Samuel Alito for that 95 00:05:36,000 --> 00:05:37,400 Speaker 3: call with Trump? What are you seeing here? 96 00:05:37,720 --> 00:05:42,800 Speaker 1: Look again, protecting norms and institutions sometimes means avoiding the 97 00:05:42,839 --> 00:05:47,320 Speaker 1: appearance of impropriety, even if this wasn't improper, though I 98 00:05:47,440 --> 00:05:48,200 Speaker 1: really do believe. 99 00:05:48,320 --> 00:05:50,160 Speaker 2: Also, I just want to point out. 100 00:05:50,120 --> 00:05:55,880 Speaker 1: That Alito had this clerk fourteen years before now, so 101 00:05:55,960 --> 00:05:59,080 Speaker 1: he's had this cork, had had many other jobs after Aledo. 102 00:05:59,520 --> 00:06:02,960 Speaker 1: And the question is why was it so important for 103 00:06:03,040 --> 00:06:06,760 Speaker 1: Donald Trump to talk to Alito about this clerk when 104 00:06:06,800 --> 00:06:09,640 Speaker 1: he was you know, his fIF you know, his fifth 105 00:06:09,760 --> 00:06:13,120 Speaker 1: most recent employer. And so even if it wasn't improper, 106 00:06:13,200 --> 00:06:14,800 Speaker 1: no one knows what was said on the call, But 107 00:06:14,839 --> 00:06:19,320 Speaker 1: even if it wasn't, the appearance of impropriety is absolutely 108 00:06:19,960 --> 00:06:23,200 Speaker 1: just a norms crusher in every way. And look, you know, 109 00:06:23,320 --> 00:06:25,880 Speaker 1: a lot of politics. What we saw in Trump one 110 00:06:25,920 --> 00:06:29,200 Speaker 1: point zero is that a lot of politics was Trump 111 00:06:29,279 --> 00:06:32,920 Speaker 1: was able to crash through these guardrails because a lot 112 00:06:32,960 --> 00:06:36,960 Speaker 1: of American politics was just a certain level of gentility 113 00:06:37,680 --> 00:06:41,120 Speaker 1: that kept things in place and what allowed for some 114 00:06:41,480 --> 00:06:46,200 Speaker 1: level of It's not real corruption per se, but there 115 00:06:46,200 --> 00:06:50,920 Speaker 1: were guardrails just for the fact that these politicians had 116 00:06:50,960 --> 00:06:55,440 Speaker 1: to interact with each other, and those guardrails were really 117 00:06:55,480 --> 00:06:59,960 Speaker 1: blown through by Trump. So we really need to make 118 00:07:00,120 --> 00:07:03,320 Speaker 1: get clear that the Supreme Court is a redline and 119 00:07:03,400 --> 00:07:07,720 Speaker 1: that Donald Trump should not be able to bully them 120 00:07:07,920 --> 00:07:11,880 Speaker 1: into doing what he wants and being a rubber stamp 121 00:07:11,920 --> 00:07:14,080 Speaker 1: on him, though we know they will be to a 122 00:07:14,080 --> 00:07:14,720 Speaker 1: certain extent. 123 00:07:14,920 --> 00:07:18,120 Speaker 3: Well, there are guardrails and then there are laws, and 124 00:07:18,440 --> 00:07:21,480 Speaker 3: mister Trump broke some of them. There is now about 125 00:07:21,480 --> 00:07:23,600 Speaker 3: a week and a half left for Jack Smith to 126 00:07:23,960 --> 00:07:26,480 Speaker 3: get the details of that out to the world in 127 00:07:26,560 --> 00:07:28,600 Speaker 3: a report. What are you seeing here with what's going 128 00:07:28,600 --> 00:07:29,960 Speaker 3: on with the Federal Appeals Court? 129 00:07:30,080 --> 00:07:33,000 Speaker 1: The Federal appeals courts, and on Thursday would not block 130 00:07:33,120 --> 00:07:36,280 Speaker 1: the Justice Department from releasing the report by Special Counsel 131 00:07:36,400 --> 00:07:40,640 Speaker 1: Jack Smith. Again, this is the last possible moment for 132 00:07:41,280 --> 00:07:47,080 Speaker 1: sleepy Merrit Garland, my buddy, sleepy Republican. By the way, 133 00:07:47,320 --> 00:07:49,800 Speaker 1: poor went out for all the Republicans who did not 134 00:07:49,880 --> 00:07:51,000 Speaker 1: do shit, right. 135 00:07:50,920 --> 00:07:51,920 Speaker 2: Merrick Garland. 136 00:07:52,600 --> 00:07:56,480 Speaker 1: What about our friend head of the FBI, Chris Ray, 137 00:07:57,000 --> 00:08:01,280 Speaker 1: another Republican who did not do shit? All these people 138 00:08:01,480 --> 00:08:05,520 Speaker 1: who just were like, if we close our eyes real tight, 139 00:08:05,640 --> 00:08:07,360 Speaker 1: Donald Trump will go away. 140 00:08:08,040 --> 00:08:10,080 Speaker 2: Good work, everybody, good work. 141 00:08:10,200 --> 00:08:12,760 Speaker 3: I'm going to do a standing ovation, which you standing 142 00:08:12,840 --> 00:08:13,560 Speaker 3: up did not do. 143 00:08:14,040 --> 00:08:18,040 Speaker 2: Both sections of mister Smith's two volume report remained for 144 00:08:18,120 --> 00:08:20,600 Speaker 2: the moment under an injunction put in place this week 145 00:08:20,600 --> 00:08:23,680 Speaker 2: by a lower court judge in the state of Florida. 146 00:08:23,880 --> 00:08:27,320 Speaker 2: You know who that judge is, the one. 147 00:08:27,200 --> 00:08:30,240 Speaker 3: Who's about to replace Alito or Thomas, whichever retires first. 148 00:08:30,600 --> 00:08:34,640 Speaker 1: Yeah, or to replace Amy if cat Turd has his way. 149 00:08:35,040 --> 00:08:37,800 Speaker 3: Yes, yes, well, we know that we have to always 150 00:08:37,960 --> 00:08:40,600 Speaker 3: save a space like it's Elijah at the political table 151 00:08:40,720 --> 00:08:41,400 Speaker 3: for cat turd. 152 00:08:41,800 --> 00:08:46,360 Speaker 1: Yep, exactly, cat tired the Pat Buchanan of America, of 153 00:08:46,440 --> 00:08:50,319 Speaker 1: America of the twenty twenties, Cat tired or went out 154 00:08:50,360 --> 00:08:53,679 Speaker 1: for poor cat turd, very mad at Justice. 155 00:08:53,440 --> 00:08:56,920 Speaker 2: Amy for not taking care of his guy, Donald J. Trump. 156 00:08:57,200 --> 00:08:59,120 Speaker 1: By the way, I just want to point out what 157 00:08:59,240 --> 00:09:00,640 Speaker 1: this whole sentence in fiasco. 158 00:09:00,920 --> 00:09:02,360 Speaker 2: He was sentenced to nothing. 159 00:09:02,840 --> 00:09:06,720 Speaker 1: Yes, like I mean, yes, now he's a fallon congratulations. 160 00:09:06,760 --> 00:09:07,920 Speaker 2: But I know a lot of people. 161 00:09:08,160 --> 00:09:11,040 Speaker 1: I don't know a lot of people, but I know 162 00:09:11,360 --> 00:09:13,760 Speaker 1: a few people have gone to jail, and I think 163 00:09:13,880 --> 00:09:16,320 Speaker 1: if they were just fealons and didn't have to go 164 00:09:16,360 --> 00:09:20,760 Speaker 1: to jail, like generally, the jail part is the worst part. Again, 165 00:09:21,280 --> 00:09:24,040 Speaker 1: I am not a prison consultant, but my sense is 166 00:09:24,080 --> 00:09:25,840 Speaker 1: if you don't have to go to jail, that's a win. 167 00:09:26,520 --> 00:09:27,319 Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm with you. 168 00:09:31,240 --> 00:09:33,880 Speaker 1: Jed Here is a contributor to the nation and the 169 00:09:33,920 --> 00:09:36,440 Speaker 1: host of the Time of Monsters. 170 00:09:37,040 --> 00:09:39,400 Speaker 2: Welcome to Fast Politics. 171 00:09:39,600 --> 00:09:42,120 Speaker 4: Jed Here always great to join the program. 172 00:09:42,360 --> 00:09:44,120 Speaker 1: I am so you know why I wanted to have 173 00:09:44,160 --> 00:09:46,240 Speaker 1: you on. Besides the fact that we often have you 174 00:09:46,320 --> 00:09:48,520 Speaker 1: on and think you're very, very smart. 175 00:09:48,520 --> 00:09:51,480 Speaker 4: It's because of the fact that I'm soon to become 176 00:09:51,520 --> 00:09:56,920 Speaker 4: an American after Donald alex Is the Canada and we 177 00:09:57,040 --> 00:10:00,960 Speaker 4: become the fifty first state head al I'll let you 178 00:10:01,000 --> 00:10:06,600 Speaker 4: know of Washington, DC and Puerto Rico. I welcome our 179 00:10:07,360 --> 00:10:10,800 Speaker 4: American liberators. Although I will also say, like the last 180 00:10:10,800 --> 00:10:13,240 Speaker 4: time Canada in the United States Thought Award. The White 181 00:10:13,280 --> 00:10:14,560 Speaker 4: House did burn down. 182 00:10:14,400 --> 00:10:16,240 Speaker 2: So we're mateen twelve. 183 00:10:17,440 --> 00:10:19,040 Speaker 4: Yeah, that's right, that's it's all. 184 00:10:19,120 --> 00:10:19,280 Speaker 5: Yeah. 185 00:10:19,320 --> 00:10:21,560 Speaker 4: I think you know, like where the whole New Territory. 186 00:10:21,679 --> 00:10:23,520 Speaker 4: We're not in counses anymore, isn't. 187 00:10:23,679 --> 00:10:26,640 Speaker 1: There's like a debunked story about one of the first 188 00:10:26,720 --> 00:10:29,080 Speaker 1: ladies saving a painting. 189 00:10:29,000 --> 00:10:32,880 Speaker 4: Dolly Madison. I think, yes, that's right, that's right. Yes, yes, yeah, yeah, 190 00:10:32,880 --> 00:10:35,200 Speaker 4: I know that that did not happen. But she was 191 00:10:35,240 --> 00:10:39,319 Speaker 4: rewarded with chocolate ice cream named in her on her 192 00:10:39,360 --> 00:10:43,080 Speaker 4: behalf because she saved painting from the Canadian hordes. But 193 00:10:43,120 --> 00:10:45,080 Speaker 4: it's not true, rude, it's not true. 194 00:10:45,160 --> 00:10:48,880 Speaker 1: No, yes, it's both stupid and also didn't happen. 195 00:10:49,200 --> 00:10:50,040 Speaker 4: That's right, that's right. 196 00:10:50,120 --> 00:10:53,400 Speaker 1: Yeah, like so much of American history, but we are 197 00:10:53,400 --> 00:10:56,640 Speaker 1: making our own stupid American history right here. 198 00:10:56,960 --> 00:10:59,160 Speaker 2: So let's talk about what the fuck is going on. 199 00:10:59,360 --> 00:11:03,000 Speaker 1: Trump has decided that he is going to annex Canada. 200 00:11:03,120 --> 00:11:06,360 Speaker 1: Not really, but really, but also, can I just ask, 201 00:11:06,480 --> 00:11:09,200 Speaker 1: aren't you guys all like pretty liberal up there? 202 00:11:09,800 --> 00:11:10,079 Speaker 2: Yeah? 203 00:11:10,120 --> 00:11:12,480 Speaker 4: I mean I think that the polling does show that 204 00:11:12,520 --> 00:11:15,320 Speaker 4: if the American election were held in Canada, Kamala Harris 205 00:11:15,320 --> 00:11:17,840 Speaker 4: would have gotten something like seventy percent of the votue. 206 00:11:17,880 --> 00:11:21,560 Speaker 4: In some ways, if Canada we're annexed, it would change 207 00:11:21,559 --> 00:11:25,920 Speaker 4: American politic Their leaked It depends on jerrymandering the Electoral College. 208 00:11:25,920 --> 00:11:29,560 Speaker 4: Who does. But I don't think it's in the interest 209 00:11:29,600 --> 00:11:33,800 Speaker 4: of the United States Republican Party necessarily to do this, right. 210 00:11:33,920 --> 00:11:37,280 Speaker 1: I mean, I think that ultimately, like you'd probably be 211 00:11:37,280 --> 00:11:41,240 Speaker 1: better off adding Puerto Rico because at least Puerto Rico 212 00:11:41,840 --> 00:11:46,000 Speaker 1: has some conservatives. But again, what I think, and again, 213 00:11:46,280 --> 00:11:48,280 Speaker 1: we are going to have four years to try to 214 00:11:48,320 --> 00:11:51,280 Speaker 1: figure this out, and we did it so magically last time. 215 00:11:51,360 --> 00:11:53,040 Speaker 2: What do you think Donald Trump is doing here? 216 00:11:53,160 --> 00:11:55,920 Speaker 1: I will end up saying this sentenced ten thousand times 217 00:11:56,120 --> 00:11:59,199 Speaker 1: because basically Donald Trump has made the world his interpreter. 218 00:11:59,440 --> 00:12:01,640 Speaker 1: You remember when he was on the campaign trail and 219 00:12:01,720 --> 00:12:04,040 Speaker 1: he said bacon and everyone had to explain that he 220 00:12:04,160 --> 00:12:07,160 Speaker 1: meant the price of bacon, right, that they were all 221 00:12:07,200 --> 00:12:10,080 Speaker 1: this shorthand, but his people understood, but that if you 222 00:12:10,080 --> 00:12:14,040 Speaker 1: weren't completely read in on the machinations, you wouldn't. But basically, 223 00:12:14,080 --> 00:12:16,520 Speaker 1: what I think is happening here is that he's doing 224 00:12:16,559 --> 00:12:20,080 Speaker 1: this Nixonian thing of I'm the craziest guy in the room. 225 00:12:20,320 --> 00:12:21,600 Speaker 2: Do you think that's correct? 226 00:12:21,840 --> 00:12:23,560 Speaker 4: Yeah, sure, sur sure. I think there's a couple of 227 00:12:23,600 --> 00:12:25,200 Speaker 4: things that are going on. I mean, I do actually 228 00:12:25,200 --> 00:12:27,840 Speaker 4: think this is not a serious proposal. It is the 229 00:12:27,880 --> 00:12:31,880 Speaker 4: sort of very typical Trumpian let's throw crap against the wall, 230 00:12:32,000 --> 00:12:34,000 Speaker 4: and you know, and also a little bit of a 231 00:12:34,000 --> 00:12:38,480 Speaker 4: distraction as well. I think the and it says I 232 00:12:38,480 --> 00:12:42,480 Speaker 4: don't think there's any serious plans to take over. 233 00:12:43,480 --> 00:12:43,640 Speaker 1: Yeah. 234 00:12:43,679 --> 00:12:45,400 Speaker 4: Yeah, But having said that, I mean, I think both 235 00:12:45,400 --> 00:12:48,679 Speaker 4: Trump and I think, interestingly Elon Moss are very interested 236 00:12:48,720 --> 00:12:52,520 Speaker 4: in using the presidency to reshape not just America but 237 00:12:52,840 --> 00:12:56,360 Speaker 4: the world and American aligances with the world. And Musk 238 00:12:56,760 --> 00:13:00,480 Speaker 4: much more of course, rightly is basically trying to abilies 239 00:13:00,559 --> 00:13:04,520 Speaker 4: Europe and to push the far right in Europe, including 240 00:13:04,559 --> 00:13:07,160 Speaker 4: in Germany, where you know, like I don't think the 241 00:13:07,200 --> 00:13:10,040 Speaker 4: history of promoting fire right governments in Germany has been 242 00:13:10,080 --> 00:13:14,000 Speaker 4: a happy one. And he's, like, I mean, Musk, he's 243 00:13:14,000 --> 00:13:16,559 Speaker 4: also trying to like overthrow the government of England. He's 244 00:13:16,559 --> 00:13:20,000 Speaker 4: called for Prince Charles to call for an election. There's 245 00:13:20,000 --> 00:13:22,160 Speaker 4: a couple of things going on here. Like we know 246 00:13:22,640 --> 00:13:25,000 Speaker 4: that Trump and Musk do not like NATO, and they 247 00:13:25,000 --> 00:13:27,959 Speaker 4: don't like what they call globalism, and what they mean 248 00:13:28,080 --> 00:13:31,079 Speaker 4: like globalism is basically the system that was set up 249 00:13:31,200 --> 00:13:34,600 Speaker 4: by Franklin Roosevelt and its successors in World War two, 250 00:13:35,040 --> 00:13:37,959 Speaker 4: sort of like an international system of alliances where the 251 00:13:38,040 --> 00:13:41,600 Speaker 4: United States has collective security with other nations and has 252 00:13:41,640 --> 00:13:44,400 Speaker 4: things like NATO and also has trade agreements. And this 253 00:13:44,679 --> 00:13:46,520 Speaker 4: was you know, like one could argue that there was 254 00:13:46,559 --> 00:13:49,120 Speaker 4: a form of American im perialism, but it's also like 255 00:13:49,559 --> 00:13:52,680 Speaker 4: an attempt to work within the nations of other countries 256 00:13:52,840 --> 00:13:55,080 Speaker 4: to have some sort of system in place. And there's 257 00:13:55,080 --> 00:13:57,760 Speaker 4: always been a critique on the right that this system 258 00:13:58,240 --> 00:14:02,160 Speaker 4: of the liberal international order, the system of alliances, is 259 00:14:02,240 --> 00:14:04,240 Speaker 4: bad for the United States. It doesn't give the US 260 00:14:04,240 --> 00:14:07,520 Speaker 4: the room come maneuver, and it ties America to these 261 00:14:07,559 --> 00:14:11,720 Speaker 4: like diabolical governments in Europe that will exploit America. And 262 00:14:11,840 --> 00:14:14,320 Speaker 4: that was the critique of the right going back decades. 263 00:14:14,360 --> 00:14:17,520 Speaker 4: This was like, actually what Herbert Hoover thought, this is 264 00:14:17,559 --> 00:14:21,120 Speaker 4: what Charles Lindberg thought, this is what Robert Taff taught. 265 00:14:21,360 --> 00:14:23,920 Speaker 4: People forget this, but I mean, the Republican Party was 266 00:14:24,000 --> 00:14:27,080 Speaker 4: in the forties was against NATO, like Robert Taff had 267 00:14:27,080 --> 00:14:30,120 Speaker 4: this sort of critique of NATO that I'm articulating, And 268 00:14:30,160 --> 00:14:33,800 Speaker 4: there have always been figures on the right that haven't 269 00:14:33,840 --> 00:14:36,040 Speaker 4: wanted that, and what they wanted instead. 270 00:14:36,000 --> 00:14:39,640 Speaker 1: Right, it's this America Last phenomenon, Right, we both read 271 00:14:39,640 --> 00:14:40,120 Speaker 1: that book. 272 00:14:40,320 --> 00:14:42,760 Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, that's right. Quit yeah, So, and what they 273 00:14:42,840 --> 00:14:47,080 Speaker 4: wanted was what they call in America First policy, which 274 00:14:47,120 --> 00:14:51,120 Speaker 4: is sometimes mislabeled by the media as isolationism, but it 275 00:14:51,160 --> 00:14:55,160 Speaker 4: was actually basically a policy of hemispheric domination. The idea 276 00:14:55,160 --> 00:14:58,120 Speaker 4: is that the United States should leave Europe to the Europeans, 277 00:14:58,440 --> 00:15:02,200 Speaker 4: it should concentrate on dominating the Western hemisphere, and then 278 00:15:02,240 --> 00:15:05,400 Speaker 4: also using if it's going to expand, expand into Asia, 279 00:15:06,080 --> 00:15:09,280 Speaker 4: because the Pacific is America's lake. Now, this all sort 280 00:15:09,280 --> 00:15:11,920 Speaker 4: of fell by the wayside during the Cold War, when 281 00:15:12,080 --> 00:15:15,720 Speaker 4: with Eisenhower and Nixon and Reagan you basically had Republicans 282 00:15:15,760 --> 00:15:19,080 Speaker 4: who bought into the liberal international order, the idea of 283 00:15:19,120 --> 00:15:21,880 Speaker 4: working with NATO and work with alliances. But there'll always 284 00:15:21,920 --> 00:15:25,040 Speaker 4: been people on the right who have not thought that way, 285 00:15:25,040 --> 00:15:27,640 Speaker 4: who have like wanted to return to the foreign policy 286 00:15:27,640 --> 00:15:30,560 Speaker 4: of Charles Lindberg and Robert Taft. And I'll just remind 287 00:15:30,600 --> 00:15:34,840 Speaker 4: people Charles Lindberg's foreign policy was like, let's let Hitler 288 00:15:34,880 --> 00:15:38,240 Speaker 4: be overlord of Europe. He will protect us from the 289 00:15:38,280 --> 00:15:39,040 Speaker 4: communist right. 290 00:15:39,400 --> 00:15:39,600 Speaker 2: Yeah. 291 00:15:40,320 --> 00:15:43,720 Speaker 4: So one person who thought that way was Pat Buchanan, 292 00:15:43,800 --> 00:15:45,840 Speaker 4: who I think is a very important yes. 293 00:15:46,760 --> 00:15:50,440 Speaker 1: Yes, yes, And this is this John Dance book When 294 00:15:50,480 --> 00:15:53,440 Speaker 1: the Clock Broke, So yeah, so talk to us about 295 00:15:53,440 --> 00:15:56,880 Speaker 1: this because he makes a direct parallel from David Duke 296 00:15:57,160 --> 00:16:01,760 Speaker 1: to Pat Buchanan to early chomp is so discuss. 297 00:16:01,640 --> 00:16:04,480 Speaker 4: So I think this essential precondition was the sort of 298 00:16:04,800 --> 00:16:07,600 Speaker 4: waning of the Cold War in the nineteen eighties and 299 00:16:08,240 --> 00:16:11,320 Speaker 4: the Soviet Union not no longer being seen as a 300 00:16:11,320 --> 00:16:13,200 Speaker 4: communist threat, and there were a lot of people on 301 00:16:13,240 --> 00:16:15,800 Speaker 4: the right who are thinking, well, okay, you know, like 302 00:16:16,000 --> 00:16:18,600 Speaker 4: we're not fighting the Soviets anymore, then, like why do 303 00:16:18,640 --> 00:16:21,720 Speaker 4: we need NATO and also why don't we like return 304 00:16:21,800 --> 00:16:24,280 Speaker 4: to the foreign policy of Robert Taft? And then these 305 00:16:24,360 --> 00:16:26,920 Speaker 4: people were called paleo conservatives, and I think the most 306 00:16:27,640 --> 00:16:31,000 Speaker 4: most of them are very obscure kind of intellectuals. But 307 00:16:31,040 --> 00:16:34,560 Speaker 4: the one person people will know why we is Pat Buchanan. 308 00:16:34,840 --> 00:16:36,640 Speaker 4: I mean, there's two parts of this. One is we're 309 00:16:36,640 --> 00:16:39,520 Speaker 4: not fighting communism abroad. So we should focus on the 310 00:16:39,560 --> 00:16:42,480 Speaker 4: main enemy, which is liberalism at home, and we should 311 00:16:42,480 --> 00:16:44,560 Speaker 4: have a culture war at home. We should take the 312 00:16:44,600 --> 00:16:47,160 Speaker 4: ideas of David Duke about race and like try to 313 00:16:47,240 --> 00:16:49,800 Speaker 4: use them as our own. The second component of this 314 00:16:50,280 --> 00:16:53,000 Speaker 4: is like, yeah, returning to a Robert Taft foreign policy. 315 00:16:53,120 --> 00:16:56,960 Speaker 4: So in nineteen ninety, Pat Buchanan wrote a column where 316 00:16:57,000 --> 00:17:01,640 Speaker 4: he said American the American dream annexing most of Canada. 317 00:17:01,720 --> 00:17:04,440 Speaker 4: And Buchanan said, like, well, you know, Canada, they're having 318 00:17:04,480 --> 00:17:07,240 Speaker 4: this problem with coveect separatism. This could be an opportunity 319 00:17:07,240 --> 00:17:10,560 Speaker 4: for the United States. We should invite like parts of Canada. 320 00:17:10,800 --> 00:17:14,920 Speaker 4: He mentioned the maritime provinces, the western provinces of Verda 321 00:17:14,920 --> 00:17:18,879 Speaker 4: and Saskatchewan, and then North Northern Territories. And he added 322 00:17:18,920 --> 00:17:24,000 Speaker 4: in this column we should also buy Greenland from Denmark. 323 00:17:24,280 --> 00:17:27,480 Speaker 4: And also Pat Buchanan had a long standing belief that 324 00:17:27,560 --> 00:17:29,680 Speaker 4: it was a mistake to have handed over the Panama 325 00:17:29,720 --> 00:17:32,760 Speaker 4: Canal to the people of Panama and that the United 326 00:17:32,760 --> 00:17:34,879 Speaker 4: State should take it over. So so in nineteen ninety 327 00:17:35,119 --> 00:17:38,280 Speaker 4: Pad buy Cannon is basically saying, you know exactly what 328 00:17:38,359 --> 00:17:40,520 Speaker 4: Trump is saying. Now He's not alone. A lot of 329 00:17:40,560 --> 00:17:44,080 Speaker 4: these other paleo conservatives think along this line, and some 330 00:17:44,119 --> 00:17:47,680 Speaker 4: of our very bizarre creatures. One is Peter Brimlow, who's 331 00:17:47,760 --> 00:17:51,280 Speaker 4: most known now for a racist website called v Dare. 332 00:17:51,600 --> 00:17:55,879 Speaker 4: Another is this guy Craig Shoemaker, who Pat Buchannan quoted 333 00:17:56,000 --> 00:17:58,360 Speaker 4: and cited as an authority and who was the head 334 00:17:58,359 --> 00:18:01,560 Speaker 4: of something called the American Expansionist Party. 335 00:18:01,960 --> 00:18:04,240 Speaker 2: Oh Jesus Christ, great, should I. 336 00:18:04,280 --> 00:18:06,240 Speaker 4: Just wanted it's a little digression, but it's actually very 337 00:18:06,240 --> 00:18:08,399 Speaker 4: interesting to get a set to where these guys are 338 00:18:08,440 --> 00:18:12,359 Speaker 4: coming from. So this guy basically started off as a 339 00:18:12,520 --> 00:18:15,840 Speaker 4: gay rights activist of the sixties, but ran into problems 340 00:18:15,880 --> 00:18:20,680 Speaker 4: because he had views of women that other gay rights 341 00:18:20,680 --> 00:18:22,879 Speaker 4: people didn't like. Like he basically said, we should be 342 00:18:22,920 --> 00:18:25,320 Speaker 4: a Menzoni space. I don't want to have like this 343 00:18:25,359 --> 00:18:29,440 Speaker 4: whole gay lesbian by translating, you know, like no women, 344 00:18:29,520 --> 00:18:32,440 Speaker 4: no girls. He also was like a virulent racist who 345 00:18:32,440 --> 00:18:35,640 Speaker 4: basically said black people are and I am quoting here 346 00:18:36,000 --> 00:18:41,240 Speaker 4: the enemy who should be exterminated. We're pretty crazy crack 347 00:18:41,280 --> 00:18:43,800 Speaker 4: blaw people. So I think one of the things with 348 00:18:43,880 --> 00:18:46,120 Speaker 4: the Trump era, and I think, you know, like Musk 349 00:18:46,200 --> 00:18:48,879 Speaker 4: is also part of this is that like these kind 350 00:18:48,920 --> 00:18:52,520 Speaker 4: of crazy fringe ideas that have hovered up the wings 351 00:18:52,520 --> 00:18:55,960 Speaker 4: of the Republican Party. They've decided, let's take them up 352 00:18:56,000 --> 00:18:58,840 Speaker 4: again and let's mainstream them. And they're partially able to 353 00:18:58,880 --> 00:19:03,080 Speaker 4: do that because the old Republican elite has been discredited 354 00:19:03,119 --> 00:19:05,680 Speaker 4: and so therefore they need to juice things up. I mean, 355 00:19:06,000 --> 00:19:09,160 Speaker 4: what basically happened was, you know, the Cold War won 356 00:19:09,240 --> 00:19:13,880 Speaker 4: down the presidency of George W. Bush attempted to revive 357 00:19:13,960 --> 00:19:17,040 Speaker 4: a kind of a right wing internationalism in the form 358 00:19:17,040 --> 00:19:18,760 Speaker 4: of the Global War on Terror. But that was a 359 00:19:18,800 --> 00:19:23,680 Speaker 4: disaster that totally discredited the sort of intervention is swinging 360 00:19:23,760 --> 00:19:26,920 Speaker 4: the Republican Party, and that created a vacuum. And into 361 00:19:26,960 --> 00:19:29,679 Speaker 4: that vacuum step Donald Trump, who was able to leverage 362 00:19:29,720 --> 00:19:33,520 Speaker 4: a his celebrity and b the fact that he realized 363 00:19:33,560 --> 00:19:36,920 Speaker 4: that there were all these string components of the Republican 364 00:19:36,960 --> 00:19:40,800 Speaker 4: coalition that you could energize and get worked out by, 365 00:19:40,920 --> 00:19:43,600 Speaker 4: you know, bringing back the ideas of Pabri Canon and 366 00:19:43,640 --> 00:19:49,040 Speaker 4: Craig Shoemaker. You know that these so basically like, now 367 00:19:49,359 --> 00:19:52,359 Speaker 4: how serious it is as policy? As I said, I 368 00:19:52,440 --> 00:19:56,560 Speaker 4: don't foresee like actually buying Greveland or taking over Canada 369 00:19:56,640 --> 00:19:58,600 Speaker 4: but I do actually think that it's well, we've already 370 00:19:58,680 --> 00:20:01,000 Speaker 4: seen it. It's it's how did this reptive effect? I 371 00:20:01,000 --> 00:20:04,240 Speaker 4: mean Justin Trudeau stepped down, and I mean he's been 372 00:20:04,320 --> 00:20:05,760 Speaker 4: unpopular for a long time. I think there are a 373 00:20:05,760 --> 00:20:08,199 Speaker 4: lot of people in his own party, like you know, 374 00:20:08,240 --> 00:20:10,119 Speaker 4: like as with Joe Biden, who have wanted him to 375 00:20:10,200 --> 00:20:12,760 Speaker 4: step down for a while and make up for another leader. 376 00:20:12,960 --> 00:20:15,960 Speaker 4: But what happened was he got into a dispute with 377 00:20:16,040 --> 00:20:20,240 Speaker 4: his finance mister Christia Freeland, and in her letter resignation, 378 00:20:20,320 --> 00:20:24,040 Speaker 4: Freelance said these very important that like you know, Canada 379 00:20:24,119 --> 00:20:27,480 Speaker 4: is facing a crisis with Trump pretning carepors. We need 380 00:20:27,680 --> 00:20:30,359 Speaker 4: like a leadership that can unite the country. I no 381 00:20:30,440 --> 00:20:33,280 Speaker 4: longer feel like you can provide that leadership. That was like, 382 00:20:33,400 --> 00:20:36,159 Speaker 4: it's not the ultimate cause, which I think is you know, 383 00:20:36,240 --> 00:20:39,600 Speaker 4: it's unpopularity due to COVID and inflation, you know, as 384 00:20:39,640 --> 00:20:43,040 Speaker 4: was Joe Biden, as everyone with everyone, But I think 385 00:20:43,080 --> 00:20:46,760 Speaker 4: it was the precipitating cause that like the Canadian elite 386 00:20:47,080 --> 00:20:49,679 Speaker 4: is very very scared of what's happening. This is this 387 00:20:49,760 --> 00:20:51,680 Speaker 4: is up truely just of like so he said, Canadians 388 00:20:51,720 --> 00:20:54,440 Speaker 4: are liberal, Well we have conservators here, but I'll tell you, 389 00:20:54,520 --> 00:20:57,600 Speaker 4: like quite conservative Canadians, you know, don't want to like 390 00:20:57,840 --> 00:21:01,280 Speaker 4: lose their country and join the United State. And there 391 00:21:01,320 --> 00:21:03,720 Speaker 4: are people like the Globe and Meal is kind of 392 00:21:03,720 --> 00:21:07,240 Speaker 4: like a business newspaper. One of their more conservative columnists 393 00:21:07,280 --> 00:21:10,359 Speaker 4: Andrew Coin, who's a real sort of emblem of sort 394 00:21:10,359 --> 00:21:12,639 Speaker 4: of you know, like the sort of like old wasp 395 00:21:12,680 --> 00:21:15,399 Speaker 4: elite in Canada. His father would have been headed the 396 00:21:16,320 --> 00:21:19,320 Speaker 4: governor of the Bank of Canada. Andrew Coin has basically said, 397 00:21:19,359 --> 00:21:22,040 Speaker 4: you know, Canada can no longer rely on the United 398 00:21:22,080 --> 00:21:24,639 Speaker 4: States as a reliable ally. We have to have like 399 00:21:24,680 --> 00:21:29,080 Speaker 4: a new foreign policy, perhaps like deepen our ties with Europe, 400 00:21:29,160 --> 00:21:31,600 Speaker 4: deep in our ties with the last in American countries, 401 00:21:31,720 --> 00:21:34,000 Speaker 4: try to have some sort of counterweight that that is 402 00:21:34,000 --> 00:21:37,800 Speaker 4: a kind of like thinking that's happening even among conservative Canadians. 403 00:21:37,960 --> 00:21:41,119 Speaker 4: I think that the same thinking is happening in Europe. 404 00:21:41,160 --> 00:21:44,479 Speaker 4: I think we're already seeing a lot of people in Europe. 405 00:21:44,480 --> 00:21:47,960 Speaker 4: I mean, they're the EUS protesting against Trump's the plans 406 00:21:48,000 --> 00:21:51,080 Speaker 4: to anna Greenland, and I think that they are serious 407 00:21:51,119 --> 00:21:54,320 Speaker 4: people in Europe who are thinking, you know, like we've 408 00:21:54,320 --> 00:21:58,880 Speaker 4: relied on America for our protection for like seventy years. 409 00:21:58,880 --> 00:22:00,720 Speaker 4: What if they're going to keep electing I was like, drop, 410 00:22:01,080 --> 00:22:02,960 Speaker 4: who are gonna, like, you know, have people like Elon 411 00:22:03,080 --> 00:22:07,159 Speaker 4: Musk or literally destabilizing our societies who are promoting I 412 00:22:07,240 --> 00:22:09,960 Speaker 4: cannot begin to explain like the people that Elon Musk 413 00:22:10,000 --> 00:22:13,080 Speaker 4: are promoting, people like Tommy Douglass and the AfD. This 414 00:22:13,160 --> 00:22:16,720 Speaker 4: would be like someone from outside of America. So let's 415 00:22:16,760 --> 00:22:18,560 Speaker 4: say someone being like. 416 00:22:18,560 --> 00:22:20,520 Speaker 2: Make David Duke your president. 417 00:22:20,600 --> 00:22:22,320 Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, yeah yeah. It would be like like, as 418 00:22:22,359 --> 00:22:24,840 Speaker 4: of powerful people in Europe, we're certainly saying we want 419 00:22:24,840 --> 00:22:28,880 Speaker 4: America to elect David Duke. It's an incredibly destabilizing thing. 420 00:22:29,040 --> 00:22:31,280 Speaker 4: So there are people inside the European elite who are 421 00:22:31,280 --> 00:22:34,920 Speaker 4: now explicitly thinking, well, you know, why don't we leverage 422 00:22:35,040 --> 00:22:37,439 Speaker 4: culture ties with China. Why don't we like, you know, 423 00:22:37,480 --> 00:22:40,720 Speaker 4: open up trade ties with your China. China can offer us, 424 00:22:40,760 --> 00:22:44,119 Speaker 4: you know, five g they can offer us cheap electric cars. 425 00:22:44,280 --> 00:22:46,840 Speaker 4: President g is a tyrant. He's bad for his own people, 426 00:22:46,840 --> 00:22:49,120 Speaker 4: but he's far away from us and he doesn't want 427 00:22:49,119 --> 00:22:52,439 Speaker 4: to interpere in our domestic politics. I think that's a 428 00:22:52,560 --> 00:22:56,359 Speaker 4: very serious conversation that's happening in Europe, and it's happening 429 00:22:56,400 --> 00:22:59,840 Speaker 4: in Canada. Like, I don't think Canada would necessarily, although 430 00:22:59,880 --> 00:23:02,080 Speaker 4: I think the other interesting thing is that the Chinese 431 00:23:02,080 --> 00:23:04,040 Speaker 4: are very aware of all this. The government of China 432 00:23:04,080 --> 00:23:07,520 Speaker 4: has just basically announced to Canada that, you know, guys, 433 00:23:07,680 --> 00:23:11,640 Speaker 4: if you want, like, you know, closer trading ties with US, 434 00:23:12,359 --> 00:23:14,840 Speaker 4: you like, if you want to sell your product products 435 00:23:15,320 --> 00:23:17,200 Speaker 4: if you can't, if you have to care for and 436 00:23:17,280 --> 00:23:20,399 Speaker 4: you can't sell your products of America, we're here, You're 437 00:23:20,760 --> 00:23:22,920 Speaker 4: We'll be happy to find No. No, I don't think 438 00:23:23,080 --> 00:23:25,120 Speaker 4: for a variety of reasons, I don't think the Canadian 439 00:23:25,320 --> 00:23:27,720 Speaker 4: elite is going to go for closer ties with China. 440 00:23:27,920 --> 00:23:31,000 Speaker 4: But I think the smart play for Canada, as for Europe, 441 00:23:31,160 --> 00:23:35,200 Speaker 4: is like closer integration with each other and with Latin America. 442 00:23:35,600 --> 00:23:38,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, because they're the only people who are normal anymore. Honestly, 443 00:23:38,800 --> 00:23:41,679 Speaker 1: with Africa, it's destabilizing, and the goal is to have 444 00:23:41,760 --> 00:23:45,000 Speaker 1: it be destabilizing. And there's a larger question here about 445 00:23:45,000 --> 00:23:49,200 Speaker 1: whether tech the tech bros want to see America succeed 446 00:23:49,400 --> 00:23:52,920 Speaker 1: or want to destabilize America so that they can make 447 00:23:52,960 --> 00:23:58,280 Speaker 1: more money. It's not entirely clear that those two things 448 00:23:58,320 --> 00:23:59,520 Speaker 1: are aligned in any way. 449 00:24:00,040 --> 00:24:02,360 Speaker 4: I mean the thing is like money has no loyalty, 450 00:24:02,680 --> 00:24:05,600 Speaker 4: money has no patriotis on at resultant like Elon Musk, 451 00:24:05,880 --> 00:24:08,960 Speaker 4: I mean he wins both ways, both like a kind 452 00:24:08,960 --> 00:24:12,639 Speaker 4: of more destabilized Europe and a more details America. I 453 00:24:12,680 --> 00:24:15,240 Speaker 4: mean he gets us regulation so he can do what 454 00:24:15,280 --> 00:24:17,600 Speaker 4: he wants with his companies, but also like a stronger 455 00:24:17,680 --> 00:24:20,240 Speaker 4: China is not bad for the Elon muss right, right. 456 00:24:20,200 --> 00:24:22,639 Speaker 2: Right, exactly. And I think that's a real question. 457 00:24:22,720 --> 00:24:27,359 Speaker 1: And Elon Musk has lots of deals with China and 458 00:24:27,640 --> 00:24:32,920 Speaker 1: is very conflicted. So let's talk about what we're seeing here. 459 00:24:32,920 --> 00:24:36,080 Speaker 1: We've got Trump is coming, We're trying to sort of 460 00:24:36,119 --> 00:24:37,960 Speaker 1: figure out. You know, I feel like we're in the 461 00:24:38,040 --> 00:24:41,560 Speaker 1: calm before the storm here. So here's my question for you, 462 00:24:41,760 --> 00:24:44,199 Speaker 1: which I actually start we started talking about. Is like 463 00:24:44,440 --> 00:24:48,360 Speaker 1: the bombastic language that Trump is using. If you look 464 00:24:48,440 --> 00:24:51,199 Speaker 1: back on four years of Trump, it tended to be 465 00:24:51,359 --> 00:24:53,840 Speaker 1: he wanted people to think he was crazy and then 466 00:24:53,880 --> 00:24:57,520 Speaker 1: would sort of back down. But Trump is much older, 467 00:24:57,840 --> 00:25:00,840 Speaker 1: his rhetoric has continued to be quite a explosive. What 468 00:25:01,080 --> 00:25:04,840 Speaker 1: is your take on where the people who want the 469 00:25:04,960 --> 00:25:07,200 Speaker 1: sort of normal, what the people who want. 470 00:25:07,000 --> 00:25:09,439 Speaker 2: A sort of normal democratic order should be doing. 471 00:25:09,760 --> 00:25:11,680 Speaker 4: I think the main thing is to be much more 472 00:25:11,680 --> 00:25:14,440 Speaker 4: oppositional than they have been. I think that there has 473 00:25:14,520 --> 00:25:18,160 Speaker 4: been a kind of instinct to say, I, once seeing 474 00:25:18,200 --> 00:25:20,280 Speaker 4: what we're seeing this in the immigration vote, you know, 475 00:25:20,359 --> 00:25:23,800 Speaker 4: well Trump won like you know, a plurality of the vote, 476 00:25:24,080 --> 00:25:26,919 Speaker 4: a sort of decisively the eleccoral college, we should like 477 00:25:26,960 --> 00:25:29,520 Speaker 4: try to, you know, get along. I think that's just 478 00:25:29,600 --> 00:25:32,840 Speaker 4: like the wrong thing to do, especially since he's doing 479 00:25:33,200 --> 00:25:35,840 Speaker 4: all these crazy things. And I think like the people 480 00:25:35,880 --> 00:25:38,439 Speaker 4: who are hoping that he's like like this all just 481 00:25:38,520 --> 00:25:45,480 Speaker 4: rhetoric that you know, ultimately the more stable advisors will 482 00:25:45,480 --> 00:25:47,639 Speaker 4: come along. I mean, I think it's not just Trump 483 00:25:47,760 --> 00:25:50,119 Speaker 4: is older, but also he has a cattery of people 484 00:25:50,119 --> 00:25:53,000 Speaker 4: around him who are like not the sort of you know, 485 00:25:53,040 --> 00:25:56,080 Speaker 4: Rex Tillerson Maddest type people he had in the first term, 486 00:25:56,200 --> 00:25:59,160 Speaker 4: who are like real hardcore idologues. And I think Musk 487 00:25:59,280 --> 00:26:02,280 Speaker 4: is the wildcard here, right because like in the first term, 488 00:26:02,520 --> 00:26:06,560 Speaker 4: Trump had Steve Bannon, but I think the revoking establishment 489 00:26:06,880 --> 00:26:10,080 Speaker 4: was very cagey and very quick to kind of push 490 00:26:10,119 --> 00:26:13,320 Speaker 4: Brandon out of there, and you know, like leverage Bannon's 491 00:26:13,359 --> 00:26:16,160 Speaker 4: own bad tendencies against them. But I mean, I think 492 00:26:16,160 --> 00:26:18,280 Speaker 4: it's much harder to get rid of Ela Musk, that is, 493 00:26:18,320 --> 00:26:20,840 Speaker 4: to get rid of Steve Bannon. I mean, Musk has like, 494 00:26:20,920 --> 00:26:23,439 Speaker 4: you know, he's the richest man in the world. He 495 00:26:23,520 --> 00:26:27,320 Speaker 4: has a huge media outlet. So I think that the unstable, 496 00:26:28,960 --> 00:26:33,119 Speaker 4: radical element of Trumpism has a much like stronger power 497 00:26:33,160 --> 00:26:35,320 Speaker 4: than now than before. And to my mind that that 498 00:26:35,359 --> 00:26:39,520 Speaker 4: actually argues for like, you know, the real strategy of resistance, 499 00:26:39,560 --> 00:26:42,200 Speaker 4: which I don't think that we're seeing right now. And 500 00:26:42,280 --> 00:26:44,919 Speaker 4: I actually think in the long term, I think the 501 00:26:44,960 --> 00:26:48,679 Speaker 4: smarter play is to stake out like a position like 502 00:26:48,800 --> 00:26:51,560 Speaker 4: of like you know, like opposition, because I think a 503 00:26:51,560 --> 00:26:53,240 Speaker 4: lot of this stuff is going to come crashing down 504 00:26:53,359 --> 00:26:56,320 Speaker 4: on Trump's head sooner rather than later. And I think 505 00:26:56,400 --> 00:27:00,199 Speaker 4: that what the democratic is smart politics, is not in 506 00:27:00,240 --> 00:27:03,000 Speaker 4: fact smart politics. I think they think that, you know, 507 00:27:03,240 --> 00:27:04,400 Speaker 4: they can triangulate. 508 00:27:04,600 --> 00:27:07,359 Speaker 1: But I think there's anxiety that maybe he'll be normal 509 00:27:07,440 --> 00:27:10,919 Speaker 1: this time, which all of us want, but history shows 510 00:27:11,000 --> 00:27:13,159 Speaker 1: us that that is not how it's going to go. 511 00:27:13,480 --> 00:27:18,360 Speaker 4: Yeah. No, I just I don't see him normalizing anytime soon. 512 00:27:18,440 --> 00:27:20,760 Speaker 4: And I think the one one has to prepare for 513 00:27:21,040 --> 00:27:23,960 Speaker 4: quite a radical Trump administration. And it could well be, 514 00:27:24,080 --> 00:27:26,399 Speaker 4: though I think that real political opposition will have to 515 00:27:26,400 --> 00:27:29,280 Speaker 4: come from outside the Democratic Party, like in terms of 516 00:27:29,280 --> 00:27:30,280 Speaker 4: like social movements. 517 00:27:30,520 --> 00:27:33,359 Speaker 2: Yes, and that's a real question. Thank you, thank you, 518 00:27:33,480 --> 00:27:35,440 Speaker 2: thank you. Jeete. I hope you won't come back. 519 00:27:35,720 --> 00:27:37,560 Speaker 4: You can't give me away. I'm going to be a 520 00:27:37,560 --> 00:27:39,480 Speaker 4: fellow American anytime now. 521 00:27:42,800 --> 00:27:47,639 Speaker 1: Senator Tammy Duckworth is the junior senator from the state 522 00:27:47,760 --> 00:27:48,640 Speaker 1: of Illinois. 523 00:27:49,240 --> 00:27:52,480 Speaker 2: Welcome to Fast Politics. Senator Tammy Duckworth. 524 00:27:52,680 --> 00:27:54,920 Speaker 5: Thank you, it's good to be on. Thanks for having me. 525 00:27:55,200 --> 00:27:59,359 Speaker 1: I'm delighted to have you. So let's talk about what 526 00:27:59,480 --> 00:28:04,080 Speaker 1: is going on on your article to responsibility and these 527 00:28:04,119 --> 00:28:05,520 Speaker 1: hearings that are coming up. 528 00:28:05,800 --> 00:28:08,080 Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean, my job is to make sure that 529 00:28:08,119 --> 00:28:11,760 Speaker 5: the people who are nominated to the various positions within 530 00:28:11,840 --> 00:28:16,560 Speaker 5: the president's administration are actually qualified and capable of doing 531 00:28:16,600 --> 00:28:19,520 Speaker 5: their jobs. And I've had quite a few meetings, and 532 00:28:19,920 --> 00:28:22,639 Speaker 5: you know, I've met with Senator Rubio who's been nominated 533 00:28:22,680 --> 00:28:26,440 Speaker 5: to be Secretary of State. I've met with Hamasman Collins 534 00:28:26,480 --> 00:28:29,439 Speaker 5: who today I met with him, he's nominated to be 535 00:28:29,960 --> 00:28:32,920 Speaker 5: Secretive Veterans Affairs. I might have had very good conversations 536 00:28:32,960 --> 00:28:34,560 Speaker 5: with them where I've been able to ask them their 537 00:28:34,640 --> 00:28:37,840 Speaker 5: questions of their vision, with experience they have, how they're 538 00:28:37,880 --> 00:28:40,400 Speaker 5: kind of running the department. And then my next person 539 00:28:40,560 --> 00:28:43,560 Speaker 5: is going to be mister Pete Hesath, who is nominated 540 00:28:43,560 --> 00:28:46,920 Speaker 5: to be Secretary of Defense, but he is avoiding meeting 541 00:28:47,000 --> 00:28:49,920 Speaker 5: with me and all that the other senate them, so 542 00:28:50,120 --> 00:28:52,520 Speaker 5: I've not been able to ask in questions about his 543 00:28:52,600 --> 00:28:55,360 Speaker 5: qualifications for the job, which makes it really hard for 544 00:28:55,400 --> 00:28:56,320 Speaker 5: me to do my job. 545 00:28:56,640 --> 00:28:59,160 Speaker 1: What do you think that is? I mean, why do 546 00:28:59,200 --> 00:29:01,840 Speaker 1: you think that he's doing that? Because sooner or later 547 00:29:01,880 --> 00:29:06,600 Speaker 1: he's going to have to sit and do hearings that 548 00:29:06,680 --> 00:29:08,840 Speaker 1: are going to be public. I mean, this is the 549 00:29:08,880 --> 00:29:12,080 Speaker 1: thing I don't understand. So can you talk us through that? 550 00:29:12,440 --> 00:29:15,920 Speaker 5: Sure? So at the hearing, each senator has seven minutes 551 00:29:15,960 --> 00:29:19,600 Speaker 5: to ask questions. I certainly have more questions for him 552 00:29:19,600 --> 00:29:23,240 Speaker 5: than the seven minutes. And usually most nominees will come 553 00:29:23,240 --> 00:29:25,640 Speaker 5: and meet with the senators, especially those who sit on 554 00:29:25,680 --> 00:29:28,640 Speaker 5: the committee. You have a pretty thorough, in depth conversation 555 00:29:28,720 --> 00:29:31,080 Speaker 5: and to establish a relationship because we're going to be 556 00:29:31,080 --> 00:29:33,960 Speaker 5: working with these people for the next four years, right, 557 00:29:34,080 --> 00:29:36,800 Speaker 5: and so to make sure that we understand where they 558 00:29:36,840 --> 00:29:39,280 Speaker 5: want to take the department, what their emphasis are going 559 00:29:39,320 --> 00:29:41,240 Speaker 5: to be, and I can express to him the things 560 00:29:41,240 --> 00:29:45,000 Speaker 5: that I'm concerned about. And usually it's a pretty collegial 561 00:29:45,240 --> 00:29:48,000 Speaker 5: process because it is about the well being of the 562 00:29:48,080 --> 00:29:50,560 Speaker 5: United States of America. It is about making sure that 563 00:29:50,640 --> 00:29:53,200 Speaker 5: our country remains safe and strong, especially when it comes 564 00:29:53,240 --> 00:29:56,560 Speaker 5: to the Department of Defense. But he's only met with Republicans, 565 00:29:56,800 --> 00:30:00,480 Speaker 5: and he's only going to make himself available to meet 566 00:30:00,480 --> 00:30:03,520 Speaker 5: with me after I'm going probably after I'm going to 567 00:30:03,560 --> 00:30:05,800 Speaker 5: be asked to vote for him. So I'm only going 568 00:30:05,880 --> 00:30:08,720 Speaker 5: to get some minutes to ask him questions. And you know, 569 00:30:08,800 --> 00:30:11,520 Speaker 5: he's a TV personality. He'll stall and not answer questions, 570 00:30:11,520 --> 00:30:13,400 Speaker 5: and then we won't get answers to our questions, and 571 00:30:13,400 --> 00:30:14,840 Speaker 5: then I'm going to be asked to vote for him. 572 00:30:15,000 --> 00:30:16,960 Speaker 1: So there are a lot of people who are pretty 573 00:30:16,960 --> 00:30:20,040 Speaker 1: cynical at this moment on the left and the right 574 00:30:20,360 --> 00:30:24,840 Speaker 1: about Trump getting his nominations through. Pete Hagg said, he 575 00:30:24,920 --> 00:30:28,640 Speaker 1: has no history managing an organization, especially one with three 576 00:30:28,680 --> 00:30:32,040 Speaker 1: million plus people. Do you think that you know they 577 00:30:32,160 --> 00:30:34,560 Speaker 1: have enough Republicans to get these people through? 578 00:30:34,840 --> 00:30:35,880 Speaker 2: Do you think there. 579 00:30:35,680 --> 00:30:38,080 Speaker 1: Are Republicans you are in the setting, but in the 580 00:30:38,120 --> 00:30:39,560 Speaker 1: Senate a while, and you know a lot of these 581 00:30:39,560 --> 00:30:43,000 Speaker 1: people really, well, are there any Republicans where you have 582 00:30:43,120 --> 00:30:46,920 Speaker 1: faith that they will take their article to responsibilities? 583 00:30:46,960 --> 00:30:47,480 Speaker 2: Seriously? 584 00:30:48,160 --> 00:30:50,720 Speaker 5: If you asked me that question a couple of weeks ago, 585 00:30:51,120 --> 00:30:54,400 Speaker 5: my answer would have been yes. But unfortunately, what I 586 00:30:54,520 --> 00:30:58,160 Speaker 5: see now is that some of my Republican colleagues who 587 00:30:58,160 --> 00:31:00,880 Speaker 5: have spoken out about their concerns to miss a hexseth 588 00:31:01,200 --> 00:31:07,640 Speaker 5: immediately came under just a huge onslaught of attacks from 589 00:31:08,040 --> 00:31:12,280 Speaker 5: Resident Trump along with other you know, leaders in the 590 00:31:12,320 --> 00:31:16,120 Speaker 5: Maga Republican wing, to the point where now they have 591 00:31:16,240 --> 00:31:19,320 Speaker 5: walked back some of their concerns. So I worry that 592 00:31:19,680 --> 00:31:22,800 Speaker 5: they will bow to the pressure. I hope they won't 593 00:31:22,880 --> 00:31:25,680 Speaker 5: realize wn't happen yet, but we'll see, We'll see what happens. 594 00:31:26,040 --> 00:31:29,120 Speaker 1: So you really think they're just I mean, because we've 595 00:31:29,200 --> 00:31:32,240 Speaker 1: all had our time in the barrel in Maga world. 596 00:31:32,400 --> 00:31:36,000 Speaker 1: So you really think these people, even though they have security, 597 00:31:36,080 --> 00:31:39,520 Speaker 1: even though you know, we've seen people like Mitt Romney, 598 00:31:39,880 --> 00:31:43,440 Speaker 1: Mitch McConnell, we know what happens. Like, you really think 599 00:31:43,480 --> 00:31:45,080 Speaker 1: they can't stand up to Trump. 600 00:31:45,480 --> 00:31:48,480 Speaker 5: Well, they could, but they probably won't be Senators very long. 601 00:31:48,520 --> 00:31:51,040 Speaker 5: I mean, Romney could not get re elected in Utah, 602 00:31:51,080 --> 00:31:53,600 Speaker 5: which is why he retired. So I guess it depends 603 00:31:53,640 --> 00:31:57,000 Speaker 5: on whether my colleagues choose country over self. I hope 604 00:31:57,000 --> 00:31:57,880 Speaker 5: they choose country. 605 00:31:58,160 --> 00:32:00,880 Speaker 1: But what I saw in the last weeks was that 606 00:32:01,280 --> 00:32:07,400 Speaker 1: Murkowski did complain about the mag of movement on Jony Earnst, Like, 607 00:32:07,480 --> 00:32:11,440 Speaker 1: do you think that that is because there's some sense 608 00:32:11,480 --> 00:32:13,440 Speaker 1: that she may do the right thing, or do you 609 00:32:13,480 --> 00:32:15,440 Speaker 1: think that that is just talk. 610 00:32:15,920 --> 00:32:17,600 Speaker 5: I hope that she should do the right thing, but 611 00:32:17,680 --> 00:32:19,960 Speaker 5: we won't know until then. The best that I can 612 00:32:20,000 --> 00:32:22,280 Speaker 5: do is do my job and ask mis the hex 613 00:32:22,320 --> 00:32:25,640 Speaker 5: seth questions that show whether or not he's qualified to 614 00:32:25,680 --> 00:32:28,040 Speaker 5: do the job, and make it clear that if you 615 00:32:28,120 --> 00:32:30,960 Speaker 5: vote for this guy, you're voting for someone who is 616 00:32:31,000 --> 00:32:33,360 Speaker 5: absolutely unqualified to do this job. 617 00:32:33,480 --> 00:32:36,960 Speaker 1: So I read reporting today that a bunch of Republicans 618 00:32:37,000 --> 00:32:41,040 Speaker 1: do not feel that Tolsey Gabbert is actually not going 619 00:32:41,080 --> 00:32:43,160 Speaker 1: to make it through. Do you think there's a certain 620 00:32:43,240 --> 00:32:46,760 Speaker 1: sacrificial lamb math here, or do you think that some 621 00:32:46,800 --> 00:32:48,360 Speaker 1: of these Republicans do have a spawn. 622 00:32:48,880 --> 00:32:51,560 Speaker 5: I hope that my Republican colleagues she used to put 623 00:32:51,600 --> 00:32:54,240 Speaker 5: the national security of the United States of America above 624 00:32:54,280 --> 00:32:58,080 Speaker 5: their own personal loyalty to President Trump. None of us 625 00:32:58,160 --> 00:33:00,760 Speaker 5: swore an oath to the President of the United States. 626 00:33:01,000 --> 00:33:03,560 Speaker 5: We saw an earth of defender constitution, and so I 627 00:33:03,640 --> 00:33:06,360 Speaker 5: hope that maybe you know, more of them will step 628 00:33:06,440 --> 00:33:10,160 Speaker 5: up and say, we can't get somebody who met with 629 00:33:10,440 --> 00:33:13,880 Speaker 5: and was essentially a talking point for Bashar Assad to 630 00:33:13,960 --> 00:33:17,600 Speaker 5: be Director of National Intelligence. We don't think that somebody 631 00:33:18,000 --> 00:33:21,680 Speaker 5: who has never commanded a unit larger than leading an 632 00:33:21,720 --> 00:33:25,280 Speaker 5: infantry platoon should be in charge of three million personnel. 633 00:33:25,560 --> 00:33:27,880 Speaker 5: I hope that my colleagues would do the right thing, 634 00:33:28,200 --> 00:33:30,120 Speaker 5: but I won't know until the votes are cast. 635 00:33:30,440 --> 00:33:31,360 Speaker 4: So we'll see. 636 00:33:31,520 --> 00:33:34,880 Speaker 1: The person who keeps me up at night is cash Battal. 637 00:33:35,160 --> 00:33:39,200 Speaker 1: Does Cash Battel's hearing go after the other cabinet secretaries? 638 00:33:39,240 --> 00:33:43,040 Speaker 1: And is there any sense in which there's kind of 639 00:33:43,120 --> 00:33:46,600 Speaker 1: a more of a fullsome conversation about him as an 640 00:33:46,680 --> 00:33:53,120 Speaker 1: FBI like a bunch of these nominees seem like very unusual, strange, inappropriate, 641 00:33:53,280 --> 00:33:55,440 Speaker 1: but he seems like a whole other level. 642 00:33:55,880 --> 00:33:57,640 Speaker 5: He keeps me up at night as well to think 643 00:33:57,680 --> 00:34:01,080 Speaker 5: that this is the position that he's been nominated, and frankly, 644 00:34:01,240 --> 00:34:04,600 Speaker 5: if the likes of cash Bertel or Trolsa Gabbert are confirmed, 645 00:34:04,720 --> 00:34:06,840 Speaker 5: I don't think our allies will work with us. I mean, 646 00:34:06,880 --> 00:34:10,399 Speaker 5: if I were our allies, I would immediately cut off 647 00:34:10,480 --> 00:34:14,240 Speaker 5: all intelligence sharing with the United States because I wouldn't 648 00:34:14,280 --> 00:34:16,520 Speaker 5: trust it would be true rule of law in the 649 00:34:16,600 --> 00:34:21,120 Speaker 5: United States and true guarding of intelligence information in the 650 00:34:21,200 --> 00:34:24,520 Speaker 5: United States with the two of them in charge. And frankly, 651 00:34:25,000 --> 00:34:28,080 Speaker 5: that will put many assets in deep jeopardy and could 652 00:34:28,080 --> 00:34:31,800 Speaker 5: result in god forbid that the death of our troops 653 00:34:31,800 --> 00:34:33,359 Speaker 5: who are going to have to be in harm's way 654 00:34:33,440 --> 00:34:36,120 Speaker 5: because we're not going to receive information that could keep 655 00:34:36,160 --> 00:34:37,480 Speaker 5: our troops safe overseas. 656 00:34:37,760 --> 00:34:40,120 Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that's a real worry. That seems like 657 00:34:40,160 --> 00:34:42,719 Speaker 1: a nonpartisan worry. I mean, I know it's not a 658 00:34:42,760 --> 00:34:46,400 Speaker 1: trumpest worry because Trump has appointed her. But you must 659 00:34:46,400 --> 00:34:48,759 Speaker 1: see Republicans who can relate to this. 660 00:34:49,600 --> 00:34:51,239 Speaker 5: I know that they can relate to it, But whether 661 00:34:51,320 --> 00:34:53,239 Speaker 5: or not they will act on that is, you know, 662 00:34:53,360 --> 00:34:55,960 Speaker 5: not something that I can predict. Were this, you know, 663 00:34:56,600 --> 00:35:01,719 Speaker 5: six years ago, when you had folks around like Amid Ronney, 664 00:35:02,000 --> 00:35:04,480 Speaker 5: or if you had John McCain, if you had some 665 00:35:04,560 --> 00:35:07,160 Speaker 5: other folks. Yeah, but those folks are all gone. 666 00:35:07,400 --> 00:35:09,360 Speaker 2: Yeah, but there are still. 667 00:35:09,440 --> 00:35:13,600 Speaker 1: I mean, you don't have faith in like Collins and Murkowski. 668 00:35:13,280 --> 00:35:15,120 Speaker 5: And Collin's voted for Kavanaugh. 669 00:35:15,360 --> 00:35:16,319 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's true. 670 00:35:16,640 --> 00:35:20,120 Speaker 1: So talk to me about Senate Democrats and what you 671 00:35:20,160 --> 00:35:23,239 Speaker 1: guys are doing to sort of try to sort of 672 00:35:23,239 --> 00:35:26,680 Speaker 1: hold the line on some of Trump's scarier policies. 673 00:35:27,120 --> 00:35:31,640 Speaker 5: Well, we are united in our effort to stop these 674 00:35:31,680 --> 00:35:34,440 Speaker 5: policies that we feel will be harmful to the United States. 675 00:35:34,560 --> 00:35:36,720 Speaker 5: We are going to do everything we can to stop 676 00:35:36,760 --> 00:35:39,600 Speaker 5: these policies that are harmful to working Americans. We're going 677 00:35:39,640 --> 00:35:42,480 Speaker 5: to make sure that when they try to pay for 678 00:35:42,560 --> 00:35:46,440 Speaker 5: their billionaire tax cuts by cutting Medicare and mediciate, that 679 00:35:46,560 --> 00:35:48,279 Speaker 5: we're going to do everything we can to make sure 680 00:35:48,320 --> 00:35:50,959 Speaker 5: the American people know what they're doing and to slow 681 00:35:51,000 --> 00:35:53,239 Speaker 5: them down and try to stop them. And with the 682 00:35:53,320 --> 00:35:55,480 Speaker 5: case of Missa Hexseeth, the best thing we can do 683 00:35:55,640 --> 00:35:59,120 Speaker 5: is at this hearing to ask questions that Americans can 684 00:35:59,160 --> 00:36:00,520 Speaker 5: look at it and say, oh, you know what, that 685 00:36:00,680 --> 00:36:04,520 Speaker 5: wasn't partisan, that actually was something that makes sense. 686 00:36:04,680 --> 00:36:06,200 Speaker 4: You know what do you mean? 687 00:36:06,600 --> 00:36:10,920 Speaker 5: He has never led an organization larger than forty people, 688 00:36:11,280 --> 00:36:14,399 Speaker 5: So so really speak to whether or not these people 689 00:36:14,440 --> 00:36:16,680 Speaker 5: can do their jobs. From the fact that Tozy Gabbert 690 00:36:16,960 --> 00:36:20,600 Speaker 5: was called a Russian asset by state controlled media in 691 00:36:20,680 --> 00:36:22,200 Speaker 5: Russia should worry people. 692 00:36:22,760 --> 00:36:26,800 Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean agreed. And it's also a real question 693 00:36:27,200 --> 00:36:30,759 Speaker 1: about sort of how the government works. Trump has a 694 00:36:30,800 --> 00:36:33,960 Speaker 1: lot We know that there are a lot of executive 695 00:36:34,040 --> 00:36:36,319 Speaker 1: orders coming down the pike. We don't totally know what 696 00:36:36,360 --> 00:36:39,239 Speaker 1: they are, but there's a lot of them are pretty dystopian. 697 00:36:39,440 --> 00:36:42,400 Speaker 1: What can you guys do in the United States Senate 698 00:36:42,719 --> 00:36:44,240 Speaker 1: to come up the works? 699 00:36:44,640 --> 00:36:46,440 Speaker 5: I mean, there's a lot of procedural things that we 700 00:36:46,520 --> 00:36:48,720 Speaker 5: can do. And part of it is also just shining 701 00:36:48,719 --> 00:36:52,120 Speaker 5: a light on what is happening. Because when you shine 702 00:36:52,400 --> 00:36:55,319 Speaker 5: a strong enough light and there's enough pushback, you do win. 703 00:36:55,480 --> 00:36:58,040 Speaker 5: I mean, they tried to end the Affordable Care at 704 00:36:58,080 --> 00:36:59,919 Speaker 5: the last time around, and we were able to stop 705 00:37:00,080 --> 00:37:02,600 Speaker 5: that from happening because we rallied the American people. The 706 00:37:02,680 --> 00:37:05,680 Speaker 5: Republicans said that the Packed Act was too expensive, and 707 00:37:05,760 --> 00:37:09,080 Speaker 5: we shined a light on that and rallied Americans around, 708 00:37:09,120 --> 00:37:12,719 Speaker 5: and so that shame Republicans to voting to support the 709 00:37:12,760 --> 00:37:15,960 Speaker 5: Packed Act. So that our Iraq and Afghanistan veterans can 710 00:37:16,000 --> 00:37:18,359 Speaker 5: actually get the care that they need that they've been 711 00:37:18,760 --> 00:37:21,359 Speaker 5: injured in their service of this country. So the best 712 00:37:21,360 --> 00:37:24,120 Speaker 5: thing we can do is to be as open and 713 00:37:24,160 --> 00:37:27,239 Speaker 5: shine as strong a light as possible on these tactics 714 00:37:27,239 --> 00:37:27,680 Speaker 5: of theirs. 715 00:37:27,960 --> 00:37:30,000 Speaker 1: Because what I'm struck by is like when you think 716 00:37:30,000 --> 00:37:32,840 Speaker 1: about the Supreme Court. The Supreme Court we know is 717 00:37:32,920 --> 00:37:37,840 Speaker 1: heavily trumpy, but we did see with this immunity decision 718 00:37:38,000 --> 00:37:40,359 Speaker 1: that five to four they said, like the. 719 00:37:40,280 --> 00:37:41,319 Speaker 2: President is not a king. 720 00:37:41,440 --> 00:37:44,360 Speaker 1: Now they've done a lot of other very trumpy things 721 00:37:44,480 --> 00:37:47,960 Speaker 1: that struck me as a little bit surprising, and perhaps, 722 00:37:48,160 --> 00:37:50,480 Speaker 1: I mean, of course this is norms crushing all of it, 723 00:37:50,560 --> 00:37:51,760 Speaker 1: but I just am curious. 724 00:37:52,120 --> 00:37:56,200 Speaker 5: Well, yes, they have a lifetime appointment senators. 725 00:37:55,520 --> 00:37:58,719 Speaker 1: Right, but senators have long I mean long terms, and 726 00:37:59,480 --> 00:38:02,080 Speaker 1: people like Tillis, I mean Tillis is in a swing state, 727 00:38:02,440 --> 00:38:05,160 Speaker 1: Collins is in a blue state. I mean, the calculus 728 00:38:05,160 --> 00:38:08,120 Speaker 1: of getting re elected. You think that's largely what's happening. 729 00:38:08,520 --> 00:38:10,920 Speaker 5: Oh, I think so again. I bring up Mitt Romie, 730 00:38:11,160 --> 00:38:16,399 Speaker 5: a former Republican presidential candidate from Utah, could not win 731 00:38:16,480 --> 00:38:20,200 Speaker 5: in a primary to be re elected and has left. Right, 732 00:38:20,400 --> 00:38:23,319 Speaker 5: that's the consequence of standing up to Donald Trump. That 733 00:38:23,480 --> 00:38:27,280 Speaker 5: is a consequence of putting country above Donald Trump. 734 00:38:27,600 --> 00:38:31,680 Speaker 1: Right, yeah, no, it's worth thinking about. Thank you, thank you, 735 00:38:34,120 --> 00:38:37,560 Speaker 1: No mo pftly Jesse. 736 00:38:37,480 --> 00:38:40,920 Speaker 3: Cannon by Jung Fast. You know, one of the things 737 00:38:40,960 --> 00:38:43,319 Speaker 3: that we've been using as a tool to sleep well 738 00:38:43,360 --> 00:38:47,040 Speaker 3: at night is that these people make big claims and 739 00:38:47,080 --> 00:38:49,120 Speaker 3: they can't do it. You know, we now have the 740 00:38:49,120 --> 00:38:51,439 Speaker 3: Golf of egg prices, I mean, I'm sorry, the Gulf 741 00:38:51,480 --> 00:38:54,200 Speaker 3: of America. And then we had that Elon Musk was 742 00:38:54,239 --> 00:38:57,320 Speaker 3: going to cut the government by at least two jillion dollars. 743 00:38:57,600 --> 00:38:59,440 Speaker 3: It's looking like that ain't going to happen. 744 00:38:59,680 --> 00:39:03,040 Speaker 1: Yeah, so you'll be shocked to find out that Doge 745 00:39:03,560 --> 00:39:06,279 Speaker 1: is just not is anyone somebody who was going to 746 00:39:06,560 --> 00:39:08,560 Speaker 1: cut the federal government by at least. 747 00:39:08,280 --> 00:39:11,960 Speaker 2: Two trillion dollars. But you know, here's the thing. 748 00:39:12,320 --> 00:39:17,640 Speaker 1: He's very busy interfering with all of the other things. Look, 749 00:39:18,080 --> 00:39:21,120 Speaker 1: you know, interfering with the German election, interfering with the 750 00:39:21,120 --> 00:39:25,880 Speaker 1: British election, making fun of Trudeau. Listen, Donald Trump is 751 00:39:25,880 --> 00:39:30,160 Speaker 1: putting Elon Musk in this weird fake government position. Elon 752 00:39:30,239 --> 00:39:33,279 Speaker 1: Musk is getting all of his very rich friends. They're 753 00:39:33,320 --> 00:39:36,000 Speaker 1: going to fix the federal government. No one has ever 754 00:39:36,040 --> 00:39:38,799 Speaker 1: thought of this before. Let me just point out that, 755 00:39:38,880 --> 00:39:41,840 Speaker 1: like we're watching in real time, Elon discover how the 756 00:39:41,840 --> 00:39:45,200 Speaker 1: federal government works. It does a lot of stuff besides 757 00:39:45,239 --> 00:39:48,960 Speaker 1: give him tax incentives that made him the richest man 758 00:39:49,000 --> 00:39:51,680 Speaker 1: in the world who knew Well, see, you know, I 759 00:39:51,719 --> 00:39:53,640 Speaker 1: actually think he's going to try to cut a lot 760 00:39:53,680 --> 00:39:56,680 Speaker 1: of stuff, and I don't think that it's going to work. 761 00:39:56,800 --> 00:39:58,360 Speaker 2: But he's already hedging. 762 00:39:58,480 --> 00:40:03,320 Speaker 1: And he says he was asked by Mark Penn, famous 763 00:40:03,400 --> 00:40:06,480 Speaker 1: liberal Mark Penn, who writes pieces for The New York 764 00:40:06,560 --> 00:40:08,000 Speaker 1: Times about what liberals should do. 765 00:40:08,480 --> 00:40:11,040 Speaker 3: One might say, the king of concern trolling. 766 00:40:10,960 --> 00:40:14,680 Speaker 1: Right, this famous liberal Mark Penn, who is most famous 767 00:40:14,719 --> 00:40:21,560 Speaker 1: for trying to use no labels to stymy democratic legislation. 768 00:40:21,960 --> 00:40:24,240 Speaker 3: I thought he was most famous for giving Hillary Quinton 769 00:40:24,280 --> 00:40:26,600 Speaker 3: the advice that helped her lose to Barack Obama. 770 00:40:26,800 --> 00:40:29,640 Speaker 2: Yes, he's also famous for that, Mark Penn. That's right. 771 00:40:29,800 --> 00:40:34,200 Speaker 1: That Mark Penn was sitting with Elon because he's such 772 00:40:34,200 --> 00:40:37,719 Speaker 1: a liberal, and Elon wants to give interviews to liberals 773 00:40:37,719 --> 00:40:41,640 Speaker 1: so clearly, and he was interviewing him, and Elon said 774 00:40:41,719 --> 00:40:44,800 Speaker 1: what all of us thought which is I think we'll 775 00:40:44,880 --> 00:40:47,960 Speaker 1: try for two trillion. I think that's the best case outcome. 776 00:40:48,239 --> 00:40:51,239 Speaker 1: Must responded, but I do think you kind of have 777 00:40:51,440 --> 00:40:54,040 Speaker 1: to have some overage. I think if we try for 778 00:40:54,560 --> 00:40:58,200 Speaker 1: two trillion, we'll get to one trillion, all right, So 779 00:40:58,320 --> 00:41:01,240 Speaker 1: that is about half of what he's saying. 780 00:41:01,320 --> 00:41:03,719 Speaker 2: And if you're just making up numbers, why the fuck not. 781 00:41:04,160 --> 00:41:07,560 Speaker 1: This is vindicating for budget specialists and also for people 782 00:41:07,560 --> 00:41:10,799 Speaker 1: who have half a brain who have been deeply skeptical 783 00:41:10,960 --> 00:41:15,040 Speaker 1: about Musk's claim from the jump about any of this. Look, 784 00:41:15,360 --> 00:41:19,560 Speaker 1: everyone likes the hollowed out carcass that is Twitter. It 785 00:41:19,680 --> 00:41:22,080 Speaker 1: works really well for the nine people who are still 786 00:41:22,120 --> 00:41:24,200 Speaker 1: on there. He's going to do that. He's going to 787 00:41:24,280 --> 00:41:26,080 Speaker 1: hope he's going to try to do that to the 788 00:41:26,080 --> 00:41:28,600 Speaker 1: federal government, and let's hope he can. 789 00:41:29,040 --> 00:41:31,719 Speaker 3: I know that Doze is named after a dog, and 790 00:41:31,800 --> 00:41:34,080 Speaker 3: I think we have a sleeping dog that's going to lie. 791 00:41:34,640 --> 00:41:39,120 Speaker 1: That's it for this episode of Fast Politics. Tune in 792 00:41:39,320 --> 00:41:44,760 Speaker 1: every Monday, Wednesday, Thursday and Saturday to hear the best 793 00:41:44,840 --> 00:41:49,160 Speaker 1: minds and politics make sense of all this chaos. If 794 00:41:49,160 --> 00:41:52,240 Speaker 1: you enjoy this podcast, please send it to a friend 795 00:41:52,680 --> 00:41:55,920 Speaker 1: and keep the conversation going Thanks for listening,