Speaker 1: I miss a green, for example, I'm already upset. When
Speaker 1: I find my ball in the bunker, I'm really upset.
Speaker 1: And when I find my ball.
Speaker 2: In a fried egg Friday egg, the dreaded Frida Egg
Speaker 2: Friday fridagg Bride egg.
Speaker 1: Lie, I'm about ready to run off of the hump.
Speaker 1: Welcome back to another edition of the Friday Golf Podcast.
Speaker 1: I am your host, Andy Johnson. Today I am excited
Speaker 1: to release an interview. We've had this in the camp
Speaker 1: for a while, we just haven't had a spot to
Speaker 1: put it. It was a great interview. Really enjoyed chatting
Speaker 1: with James Nicholas, a up and coming player who won
Speaker 1: on the Corn Ferry Tour earlier this year and is
Speaker 1: if he continues to play good golf, likely to earn
Speaker 1: his PGA Tour card for twenty twenty six. James is
Speaker 1: also a pretty big content creator. He's very popular on
Speaker 1: Instagram and TikTok. He really does an amazing job of
Speaker 1: kind of documenting life as a professional golfer and the
Speaker 1: pursuit of a PGA Tour card. One of the things
Speaker 1: I really respect about James is that he kind of
Speaker 1: talks about the highs and the lows. You don't just
Speaker 1: hear from him when he's had a good round, you
Speaker 1: hear from him all the time. He is a very
Speaker 1: very talented videographer. I remember seeing a lot of his
Speaker 1: work that he would do when he was in college
Speaker 1: at Yale, and I would think, Oh, that's somebody that
Speaker 1: I would want to hire to make videos. So it
Speaker 1: was really great to have Jame on. I'm really happy
Speaker 1: that he's playing some really good golf this year and
Speaker 1: hope that continues for the rest of the year. So
Speaker 1: I hope you guys enjoy this. It was really fun
Speaker 1: to chat with James. And as a reminder, we recorded
Speaker 1: this I think about five weeks ago, so it's I
Speaker 1: don't think there's any dated information in it, to be
Speaker 1: completely honest. But before we get to James, let's talk
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Speaker 1: let's get to James Nicholas. All right, James, we've seen
Speaker 1: in recent weeks Jacob Bridgman talk about, Hey, I couldn't
Speaker 1: feel my hands coming down the stretch. We talked about
Speaker 1: we saw Lowry just this weekend. You know, you had
Speaker 1: kind of a collapse at the Cognizant in Palm Beach,
Speaker 1: and he talked about like not being able to feel
Speaker 1: the club all of a sudden out of nowhere. I'm
Speaker 1: curious for you. You won a couple of weeks ago
Speaker 1: on the corn Ferry Tour. What were the nerves like
Speaker 1: for you coming down the stretch?
Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't think I had the similar feelings. Actually
Speaker 2: I could feel the club, I could feel my hands,
Speaker 2: but it was more so like just like out of
Speaker 2: body experience for me. I don't know. I just felt
Speaker 2: like my mind was ump and all over the place.
Speaker 2: I needed to stay really present and do a lot
Speaker 2: of work to stay present. I will say on that
Speaker 2: final putt, I did feel something in my body that
Speaker 2: I never felt before. I don't know if it was
Speaker 2: like not feeling my hands or what it was, but
Speaker 2: it just felt weird, right, like the anxiety not the anxiety,
Speaker 2: but the excitement of Okay, hey like this puts to
Speaker 2: win and if I win, what's what's gonna happen? And
Speaker 2: then once like that putt went in, then I just
Speaker 2: lost all feeling and I was like, I don't even
Speaker 2: know what's going on anymore.
Speaker 1: I you talked about the present, stay in the present.
Speaker 1: I do think what's interesting you came to the seventy
Speaker 1: second hole. I believe you were tied. You made the
Speaker 1: eagle to go to win by two. Yeah, a great
Speaker 1: way to close out a tournament eagle. But the you know,
Speaker 1: for you, is it harder to stay in the present
Speaker 1: if you have a lead like those guys had where
Speaker 1: Bridgeman's I think they both were actually up three three
Speaker 1: shots coming down the ste Do you think it's harder
Speaker 1: to stay in the present when you've when you've carved
Speaker 1: out a big lead and you know, if I don't
Speaker 1: screw this up, I'm going to win.
Speaker 2: No, it's a great question. Most people don't really realize that.
Speaker 2: It's like when you have a four or five six
Speaker 2: shot lead. For me, at least this is my experience.
Speaker 2: I go into this fear of failure mindset where I
Speaker 2: have nothing to gain and everything to lose because people
Speaker 2: are expecting me to win versus if I'm one shot back,
Speaker 2: two shots back or all you know tied. Me and
Speaker 2: my mental coach work on work on this, doctor Joe parent.
Speaker 2: You know, it's like this mindset that I go into
Speaker 2: is like watch this, like look what I can do.
Speaker 2: You know, like I'm gonna come for you. And I
Speaker 2: kind of had this mindset and hockey and football growing
Speaker 2: up of you know, if we're one goal down with
Speaker 2: a minute to play, it's like, put me on the
Speaker 2: ice and give me the puck or give me the ball.
Speaker 2: You know, I want that situation. Versus if you've got
Speaker 2: a three goal lead, you kind of get a little
Speaker 2: bit lazy, little Laci days a goal and you maybe
Speaker 2: let a little say some something slip because that focus laps.
Speaker 2: So when you do have that three shot lead, you know,
Speaker 2: I didn't have that, but I have had it in
Speaker 2: the past, and I've let it slip a little bit
Speaker 2: because I get way less thorough than I would be
Speaker 2: if I was one shot back, two shots back. And
Speaker 2: that's sort of the mantra for the week for me
Speaker 2: every week going forward, is let's be thorough in every situation,
Speaker 2: no matter what. And because of that, I don't look
Speaker 2: at leaderboards anymore. Even if I have a ten shot
Speaker 2: lead a ten shot deficit, I don't want to know.
Speaker 2: I just pretend that I'm two back all the time.
Speaker 1: Do you active actively, like when you try not to
Speaker 1: look at leader boards? I mean they're big and sometimes
Speaker 1: they are almost unavoidable. Do you just like look away
Speaker 1: at well? How do you avoid doing that? And if
Speaker 1: you catch it, if you catch it out of the
Speaker 1: corner of your eye, how do you process that?
Speaker 2: So yeah, again with my mental coach, I think these
Speaker 2: are all like mental parts of the game where I
Speaker 2: work on and during practice rounds, I figure out where
Speaker 2: they are and I know where they are, so when
Speaker 2: I get to home, I'm like, Okay, I'm not looking
Speaker 2: in that direction. But there are times when I just like,
Speaker 2: you know, we'll look at somebody's put and I'll see
Speaker 2: in the background and be like, oh, James, like let's
Speaker 2: tee three whatever whatever it might be, And I'm not
Speaker 2: going to pretend I didn't see it. At that point.
Speaker 2: It's like, Okay, let's digest the information. How does that
Speaker 2: make me feel? How do I want to feel and
Speaker 2: move on, so I'm sixteen t in the final round
Speaker 2: and Bogata. I actually looked at the leader board on
Speaker 2: purpose because I had such an urge to look, and
Speaker 2: I realized, you know, if I had this urge to
Speaker 2: look and I'm hindering that urge, then I'm just like
Speaker 2: increasing anxiety. So if I look and I see that
Speaker 2: I'm four shots up or two shots back, whatever, it is, like,
Speaker 2: hopefully that will express some of that which it did.
Speaker 2: I saw that I was one back with three to play,
Speaker 2: and then I was like, okay, reset, I need to
Speaker 2: make a birdy to get to and to get into
Speaker 2: a playoff, two birdies to win. And in that moment
Speaker 2: it worked for me. But on Thursday Friday, it does
Speaker 2: not matter where you are, Like, you know, whether you're
Speaker 2: four back or ten back or two it's so much
Speaker 2: golf we played. And I think that I got so
Speaker 2: anxious early in the weeks because I was like, oh
Speaker 2: at a one shot lead after Thursday, like, does not matter.
Speaker 2: If you don't go Bertie twenty more holes, you're not
Speaker 2: gonna win.
Speaker 1: So that's why, you know, I always say this on
Speaker 1: our other pun shotcuts start. You know, we do a
Speaker 1: Friday recording, and it's like, you know, you want to
Speaker 1: talk about results. It's like nobody talks about basketball game
Speaker 1: at the end of the first quarter, right yeah, and
Speaker 1: golf because I think there's that day break, you know,
Speaker 1: we we don't think about it like other sports. You're
Speaker 1: you're a great athlete. You are a great, great athlete.
Speaker 1: You know, I don't want to diminish what you're doing now,
Speaker 1: Like professional golf at a high level, you are a
Speaker 1: great athlete, but you had a you know, you played
Speaker 1: hockey at extremely high level football in college. The the
Speaker 1: idea of golf, the four rounds are effectively quarters, but
Speaker 1: nobody talks about them in that context. And I think
Speaker 1: what the difference in it versus every sport is is
Speaker 1: the marathon of of the breaks, you know, where it's
Speaker 1: one quarter. You know, imagine a basketball game where you
Speaker 1: took a break between a day break between each quarter,
Speaker 1: or a hockey game where between periods we just said, hey,
Speaker 1: everybody goes sleep, we'll reconvene tomorrow.
Speaker 2: I mean, if the only way you would be similar
Speaker 2: is if you're playing a one B one match, right
Speaker 2: and you played day one, then a reset, day two,
Speaker 2: day three. But that's not the case when you play,
Speaker 2: you know, golf, it's okay, the implications of Thursday, the
Speaker 2: results of Thursday, I have implications for Friday, implications for
Speaker 2: Saturday and Sunday. So like they all kind of connect
Speaker 2: and you've got to build versus if you lose game one,
Speaker 2: game two, game you can still win. Even if you
Speaker 2: lost by you know, one hundred points on game one,
Speaker 2: two and three, you win, the next four you win.
Speaker 2: So for me, it's like, okay, how do we just
Speaker 2: like calm down, reset, make decisions that not won't throw
Speaker 2: us out of the tournament, right because you're not thinking
Speaker 2: about the negatives. But it's like, okay, how can we
Speaker 2: be so present in this moment knowing that we have
Speaker 2: seventy holes left, you know, we're talking about the second
Speaker 2: hole of the tournament, seventy holes left to make great
Speaker 2: decisions to make up for maybe a small mistake here there.
Speaker 2: So I mean, that's one of the reasons why I
Speaker 2: love golf. It's a mental battle for four days versus just,
Speaker 2: you know, two hours.
Speaker 1: In my experience, I always enjoyed the seventy two holes
Speaker 1: where I struggled, And I know you played like the
Speaker 1: minor league tour, which are these just straight sprints. I
Speaker 1: always struggled with the idea of like this is one round,
Speaker 1: and I think it might be like I have ADHD.
Speaker 1: I'm a procrastinator. The idea of having seventy two holes
Speaker 1: was like always soothing to me, where I could be like, oh,
Speaker 1: you know, if I make a bogie, it's not a
Speaker 1: big deal. I can just keep, you know, like I've
Speaker 1: got millions of holes left to you know, effectively procrastinate.
Speaker 1: I can procrastinate away a slow start, but in a
Speaker 1: eighteen hole sprint or qualifier, this is you know, I
Speaker 1: have to I have to be pedal of the metal
Speaker 1: right from the gate. How how do you approach you know,
Speaker 1: I guess like you probably aren't going to have many
Speaker 1: of these outside of like the US Open qualifying. How
Speaker 1: do you approach the kind of sprint tournaments versus these
Speaker 1: these long seventy two hole tournaments.
Speaker 2: I actually prefer them, and I need to get into
Speaker 2: a mindset, like like take the mindset from those one
Speaker 2: dayers to the seventy two hole events. Because I play
Speaker 2: really well in my backs against the wall and when
Speaker 2: I have, you know, like not nothing to lose, but
Speaker 2: when I have to do it right. There's eighteen aal
Speaker 2: event and it's a Monday qualifier. My first ever Monday
Speaker 2: shot eleven under broke a course record by four and
Speaker 2: one won the qualifier by five, and I was like, like,
Speaker 2: I wonder why, like what did I learn from that?
Speaker 2: And it was because every single shot I had like
Speaker 2: made to be so important, like this is the shot.
Speaker 2: I need to hit this shot well versus seventy two holes,
Speaker 2: I kind of get a little lazy and I'm like, oh,
Speaker 2: I'm just gonna punch this out and I'll punch it
Speaker 2: out through through the fairway into a bunker and I'm
Speaker 2: not like laser focused on it. So the mindset for
Speaker 2: me actually on seven two hole days is how can
Speaker 2: we be as thorough on each shot as we can
Speaker 2: as if it were an eighteen whole event. So I'm
Speaker 2: actually the opposite, right, Like I think the mindset of
Speaker 2: having like oh if I'm if I make a bogie here,
Speaker 2: like I'll get it back is what gets me in
Speaker 2: trouble because I almost like lose focus. I'm like, ah,
Speaker 2: that's okay to make these silly mistakes because it only
Speaker 2: matters on Sunday. But if you do that too often,
Speaker 2: you don't make it to Sunday, So it's finding like
Speaker 2: the happy medium.
Speaker 1: I guess being two, that must be why you know.
Speaker 1: And I'm just curious if this is this was true
Speaker 1: your your college coach college she and told me your
Speaker 1: backup plan was that you're going to be a doctor.
Speaker 1: That must be the difference between a doctor and a
Speaker 1: podcaster is you're you're on top of things from right
Speaker 1: from the jump versus me, who's always tried to put
Speaker 1: things off.
Speaker 2: I'm trying to trying to, that's for sure.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know one thing you mentioned about about the fear,
Speaker 1: You know that that creeps in when you have a
Speaker 1: bigger lead. It's embarra like the embarrassment anxiety. You know
Speaker 1: what's interesting. I never really pick up magazines. This is
Speaker 1: the second time I've referenced this, but I was reading
Speaker 1: an article I can't remember the mental coach's name in
Speaker 1: uh the recent golf digest, I believe, and they talked
Speaker 1: about that's the same fee, the same kind of mental
Speaker 1: block that overcomes you when you that most people feel
Speaker 1: on short putts because there's an expect you're afraid of
Speaker 1: being embarrassed that you missed a short putt because of
Speaker 1: the same anxiety. So for you the the same. It's
Speaker 1: just to be thorough and go through the whole routine.
Speaker 2: Right, yeah, No, it's exactly if I have an eight footer, right,
Speaker 2: it's okay, I'm expecting to make this. I know it's
Speaker 2: fifty percent on tour whatever. But it's if I'm an
Speaker 2: eight footer for Birdie, I'm like, oh wow, like this
Speaker 2: is a great opportunity. If I miss it, I have failed.
Speaker 2: Not Oh if I make it, I have succeeded. And
Speaker 2: I talk about the fifty to fifty put because it
Speaker 2: is fifty to fifty. They should be waited equally. Even
Speaker 2: though you're sitting there and being like, if I miss this,
Speaker 2: I'm a failure. You know, if you rewind there, pull
Speaker 2: that back to fifteen, eighteen, twenty feet now, it's like, oh,
Speaker 2: if I miss it, I'm supposed to miss it. It's
Speaker 2: not that big a deal. If it goes in, awesome,
Speaker 2: like let's go. And I tend to make those more
Speaker 2: often than not because you let go of that anxiety,
Speaker 2: let go of that expectation, and then if you even
Speaker 2: get creeper, you know, if you creep closer to the
Speaker 2: whole five feet four feet now it's like I have
Speaker 2: to make it otherwise you know, I'm really screwed, or
Speaker 2: like I've lost a full stroke, right, and as you
Speaker 2: close to the hole, that's when people start getting you know,
Speaker 2: we'll not use the word, but you know mental blocks
Speaker 2: with putting. And I've done a good job at like
Speaker 2: be like, whatever happens happens. That's the last thing I
Speaker 2: say when I'm over a putt. I'm gonna make my read.
Speaker 2: I'm gonna make my stroke and then whatever happens. You know,
Speaker 2: if I miss it, it's the green's fault, not mine,
Speaker 2: you know, or knowing if I push it a pull
Speaker 2: it and then I gotta go to the rain, go
Speaker 2: to the putting green. In practice, it's.
Speaker 1: An interesting way you described it with the percentages, right,
Speaker 1: and where my head immediately went when you did that
Speaker 1: is weather right, And if you're if you're five feet away,
Speaker 1: and I don't know what the exact percentage is, but
Speaker 1: let's just call it seventy thirty or seventy five, twenty five,
Speaker 1: whatever it is from five feet and this is probably
Speaker 1: the zone where people are like, oh, I missed a
Speaker 1: shorty I should have shot one lower than I did,
Speaker 1: but I didn't make that putt on this hole. But
Speaker 1: if you think about it in terms of weather, if
Speaker 1: it said twenty five percent chance rain and rain, you
Speaker 1: wouldn't be like.
Speaker 2: So no, not all. It's interesting you say that. I
Speaker 2: think it's like it's in our control. We feel like
Speaker 2: the putting, whether it's not really so it just like whatever.
Speaker 2: But when I think about yeah, and when I think
Speaker 2: about putting, like you said it there, you said should
Speaker 2: have like I should have been one under. But what
Speaker 2: I work on with my mental coach is I could
Speaker 2: have been one under or one better. So if I
Speaker 2: could have shot eight under today, it's phrasing a positive way.
Speaker 2: If I say I should have shot eight under, it's oh,
Speaker 2: I failed to do something that I should have done.
Speaker 2: That's a failure. So it's like shifting all of these
Speaker 2: little words, these little phrases into a positive way. That
Speaker 2: way you trick your brain to be like, oh, this
Speaker 2: is like even though it might have been a failure,
Speaker 2: it actually was positive, Like, oh, I really could have
Speaker 2: shot nine under today. You know, got to go clean
Speaker 2: a couple of things up, and I'm gonna be there
Speaker 2: versus you know, I should have shot nine under today,
Speaker 2: Like I can't believe I hit that shot. Like that
Speaker 2: was bad. This was bad. And that slight little switch
Speaker 2: is what's like the difference between people who build their
Speaker 2: mental strength on the golf course and actually use it
Speaker 2: as like a detchment of the game.
Speaker 1: I mean, this is this isn't just golf too, this
Speaker 1: is absolutely life everything I I often I, you know,
Speaker 1: one of my you know, I get to go travel
Speaker 1: and do amazing things like from the casual onlooker, my
Speaker 1: life's amazing. But travel is hard for me because I'm
Speaker 1: away from my family a lot, and you know, there's
Speaker 1: anxiety about missing you know, what's going on at home
Speaker 1: and you know, having my wife have to pick up
Speaker 1: the load a lot for what I what I'm gone
Speaker 1: And I often say I, I, you know, I have
Speaker 1: to go do this. And like what's helped me recently
Speaker 1: is the shift of saying, like, you know, I get
Speaker 1: to go do this and like that just that slight
Speaker 1: switch in in terms of changing my mental approach. I
Speaker 1: saw it this weekend. I was playing a golf tournament
Speaker 1: and you know, I hold I hold out in the
Speaker 1: final round of this tournament for eagle, you know, from
Speaker 1: one hundred and fifteen yards. But I found myself at
Speaker 1: one point being like, man, I miss missed the short putt.
Speaker 1: I should have shot you know this. But then but
Speaker 1: it's like we mask. It's like, okay, like I hooped
Speaker 1: one from one hundreds ten yards, like I missed a shorty,
Speaker 1: but like I made that shot. And it's it's like
Speaker 1: golfers wash away the positives so often, and I think it's,
Speaker 1: as you said, you're not building your mental approach what
Speaker 1: you're doing when you're talking to yourself like I should
Speaker 1: have shot this because I missed the shorty. It's opposed
Speaker 1: to to being like I, you know I did this.
Speaker 1: This was this was amazing what I did? You know?
Speaker 2: It's so funny. My wife actually, in one of my
Speaker 2: rounds last year, I was complaining about a bad balance.
Speaker 2: I was like, gosh, I can't believe it like bounced
Speaker 2: like this or whatever. And she goes James, like, do
Speaker 2: you realize the whole before you hit it in the
Speaker 2: dead center of the woods and a bounced down the
Speaker 2: middle of the fairway and I was like, yeah, but like,
Speaker 2: you know, it's supposed to happen. And she's like, why
Speaker 2: don't you ever talk about like the good bounces and
Speaker 2: like the good breaks and like the good luck that
Speaker 2: you get. And I'm like, yeah, it's true, Like I
Speaker 2: did have a bunch of good breaks, but I'm just
Speaker 2: focusing on one bad one because you know, if that
Speaker 2: one bounce in the fairway, it's we always go to
Speaker 2: the negative. We always go to the bad. And that's
Speaker 2: something that I'm trying to, you know, obviously, keep working on.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that's like a common refrain from like
Speaker 1: a pro golfers. It's like you anybody that plays golf,
Speaker 1: it's like you always I I had a similar thing
Speaker 1: happened with my wife, you know, who doesn't know anything
Speaker 1: about golf. She's like, why why do you keep saying
Speaker 1: like I should have this could have happened when I
Speaker 1: was talking about around She's like, and it's like it's
Speaker 1: refreshing to get that kind of like outside perspective sometimes.
Speaker 2: Definitely.
Speaker 1: So you played a wide array of sports growing up
Speaker 1: up your I think your whole family, I don't be
Speaker 1: you know, it characterized great athletes. I believe you have
Speaker 1: some brothers that are playing high level. I feel like
Speaker 1: I'm losing track of time. I've followed you for so long.
Speaker 1: Maybe like college hockey.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I got my Our youngest youngest sibling is playing
Speaker 2: college hockey right now.
Speaker 1: Brown. Yeah, and you know you played hockey football at
Speaker 1: Yale before focusing on golf, I believe your sophomore year.
Speaker 1: Do you ever think about what would have happened if
Speaker 1: you had played if you had focused on golf from
Speaker 1: the start.
Speaker 2: No, A lot of people ask me that question, right
Speaker 2: if I had, you know, specialized early. But my dad
Speaker 2: has wrote tons of research papers actually on this, and
Speaker 2: specialization early in life doesn't really doesn't tend to lead
Speaker 2: to excellence later in life. You see some guys do it, right,
Speaker 2: but that's, you know, good for them. For me, I
Speaker 2: think that playing football, hockey, lacrosse, basketball, baseball, swim team,
Speaker 2: dive team, all those different things taught me body control,
Speaker 2: developed different muscles that would not have otherwise been developed
Speaker 2: and have led me to my current state right now.
Speaker 2: Which again, if I look back and said, oh, if
Speaker 2: I started playing golf full time at age nine, where
Speaker 2: would I be? I probably working a desk job, using
Speaker 2: my degree at Yale for something better than golf, because
Speaker 2: I would have been burnt out hated the game, and
Speaker 2: you know, maybe in a position where I was like,
Speaker 2: I'm over it. But since I really didn't pick it up,
Speaker 2: not pick it up, but really started focusing on it
Speaker 2: until I was twenty seven, eight years ago, I'm like
Speaker 2: still fresh, I'm still young. I feel like an eighteen
Speaker 2: year old kid just going out and trying to compute
Speaker 2: with these other guys. So my golf age is very young,
Speaker 2: but I'm definitely getting older and been called a VET
Speaker 2: this year, so you know, we'll see going forward. But
Speaker 2: to answer your question, I think that playing as many
Speaker 2: sports as possible is only only good for your game.
Speaker 1: The good news you you know, you get to progress
Speaker 1: if you you keep playing good golf, you progress to
Speaker 1: the next next level of golf, and you'll be right
Speaker 1: back to being the young guy.
Speaker 2: Yeah, exactly, exactly. You know.
Speaker 1: It's it's funny. I have a kid that's like starting athletics.
Speaker 1: I have neighbors that have kids in full and athletic flight,
Speaker 1: and I think about my childhood and I grew up
Speaker 1: playing like every single sport imaginable, and you know, like
Speaker 1: the house league, local house league, baseball league. We had,
Speaker 1: you know, a obscene amount of division, I athletes that
Speaker 1: were just from my little five thousand person towns, you know,
Speaker 1: house league. But one of the things was we all
Speaker 1: played sports against each other all the time. You know,
Speaker 1: whether it was the All American wrestler who ended up
Speaker 1: going on to be an All American wrestler, was also
Speaker 1: playing basketball and baseball against you know, the guys that
Speaker 1: went and played on baseball. And I think, like it's
Speaker 1: fascinating for me now as I sit as a parent
Speaker 1: talking to other parents about like we're driving four hours
Speaker 1: for my nine year old's baseball, you know, to go
Speaker 1: play one game against you know, some town, some far
Speaker 1: flung town, and I'm like, why why don't you just
Speaker 1: play at the baseball field in town against other kids?
Speaker 1: And it's like, well, this is the travel league. We
Speaker 1: have to do the travel league, you know, so on
Speaker 1: and so forth. And it forces these kids, like in
Speaker 1: parents more so with like just the sheer cost to
Speaker 1: like be like you have to play one sport. And
Speaker 1: I think you hit on something like the muscle development
Speaker 1: that you get from playing multiple sports. How do you
Speaker 1: think some of your athletic backgrounds in terms of like
Speaker 1: playing all these sports at high level kind of show
Speaker 1: up in your golf game. What about your golf game
Speaker 1: do you thin I think represents your experience playing football
Speaker 1: and hockey at an extremely high level.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean, first things, versus speed, Right, I cruise
Speaker 2: around one eighty five ball speed, and that's from hockey.
Speaker 2: You know, I got pretty big legs, and they've definitely
Speaker 2: shrunk over the years as I've not played hockey. But
Speaker 2: that base of you know, hockey player legs, hockey player
Speaker 2: hips has given me that speed that I can work
Speaker 2: off of in terms of you know football, Right, Like
Speaker 2: we're in the gym doing power cleans and hang cleans
Speaker 2: and squats and bench and deadlift, and those might not
Speaker 2: translate directly to golf, but it gives you that base,
Speaker 2: that foundation where okay, these big muscle groups are targeted. Now,
Speaker 2: how do we work off of that and use golf
Speaker 2: to get those small muscle groups. And then you've got
Speaker 2: both versus just doing rotation stuff and whatnot. In terms
Speaker 2: of the travel schedule between hockey travel hockey and football
Speaker 2: and lacrosse and the swim team, you got to work
Speaker 2: on your time management. So then when you get to
Speaker 2: college and you play college sports, now you know how
Speaker 2: to balance the academic life, with the social life, with
Speaker 2: the athletic life, and it's not just right like the
Speaker 2: muscle groups, but it's everything about it. Now. If I
Speaker 2: think about swimming, swimming is like the best workout you
Speaker 2: can possibly do. And when I was on the swim team,
Speaker 2: just swimming like all day. When I go on the
Speaker 2: golf course and I walk a golf course, it's like
Speaker 2: a walk in the park versus you get these guys
Speaker 2: in Panama who it's ninety five degrees and you're walking
Speaker 2: up this hill. They're huffing and puffing, And I'm like,
Speaker 2: since I've continued that you know, workout regime, I'm able
Speaker 2: to lower my heart rate, keep it lower for longer,
Speaker 2: and also when I'm done with the round, be ready
Speaker 2: for the next day. So the combination of all those things,
Speaker 2: all those experiences that I've had in the past, have
Speaker 2: helped me in today's world and today's you know, corn
Speaker 2: Ferry Tour season and will help me as I go forward.
Speaker 2: For sure.
Speaker 1: I think the other thing that you hit on, like
Speaker 1: doing all those you know, the hockey the football workouts,
Speaker 1: what I like about that, And I think like there's
Speaker 1: like I'm not you know, I think a lot of
Speaker 1: people have done really successful stuff with with like the
Speaker 1: speed training with like speed sticks and such like that.
Speaker 1: But like, the thing that I don't like about speed
Speaker 1: sticks is like, Okay, I'm swinging like one hundred and
Speaker 1: twenty percent on a stick, and it's I think it's
Speaker 1: going to infiltrate into my golf swing because it's the
Speaker 1: same motion versus the idea of of you know, you're
Speaker 1: building big muscles that enhance speed without having any impact
Speaker 1: on my swing, you know, and the fundamentals and getting
Speaker 1: into bad habits. It's like kind of keeping church and state.
Speaker 1: I think, like you hit on stuff, and I always
Speaker 1: urge people. It's like go do if you want speed,
Speaker 1: like go do other things. Like my best my best
Speaker 1: year of amateur golf came after I played I didn't
Speaker 1: touch a club all winter. I play basketball three times
Speaker 1: a week. And what I noticed was I came back
Speaker 1: I was just like I had I picked up fifteen
Speaker 1: or twenty yards just from sheer explosion, you know, and
Speaker 1: it was like I spent the whole winter, you know,
Speaker 1: basketball centric workouts, basketball, you know it, and it was
Speaker 1: like it's just like amazing to me what you can
Speaker 1: do with this cross with cross training, not to mention
Speaker 1: like the competitive level like when you're playing you know
Speaker 1: those athletics that are are very very competitive, like the
Speaker 1: hyper competitive level and the mentality that you bring. And
Speaker 1: you know, I do think the other thing you hit
Speaker 1: on with with the with swimming is just like the
Speaker 1: sheer endurance of of golf when you like people laugh
Speaker 1: about it, but like eighteen holes over four straight days
Speaker 1: in competitive setting is exhausting.
Speaker 2: And combine that with Monday, you know, practice, Tuesday practice,
Speaker 2: Wednesday practice and pro am like it's not and then also,
Speaker 2: this is your face week in a row doing it
Speaker 2: seventies a week. So that's the difference. When people watch
Speaker 2: on TV, they say they see Thursday, Thursday to Sunday, like, oh,
Speaker 2: this is easy, but some guys are on there six
Speaker 2: week in a row doing this every single day. You know,
Speaker 2: you're in your forty second day of walking seven miles
Speaker 2: a day with your heart rate at one forty for
Speaker 2: the whole day. Look at your string, you know it's
Speaker 2: gonna be pretty high.
Speaker 1: M h. Yeah. It's the mental stress too, like the
Speaker 1: mental exhaustion that you go through. How do you balance
Speaker 1: that on the corn ferry tour where it I mean,
Speaker 1: I think like this. Nobody really talks about this, but
Speaker 1: it's like you guys are in such a tough position
Speaker 1: because you have the schedule that's set, and if you
Speaker 1: take a week off, you feel you have to feel
Speaker 1: like you're just losing ground because it's like there is
Speaker 1: no middle ground. It's it's unlike the PGA Tour, where
Speaker 1: it's like, Okay, if I finish forty fortieth or forty eighth,
Speaker 1: it's not a big felt corn fairy tour. It is
Speaker 1: top twenty or bus.
Speaker 2: Yeah, pretty much. I mean I wouldn't say top twenty
Speaker 2: or bus, but it's top twenty, top seventy five or bust. Right.
Speaker 2: If you if you lose your job and you gotta
Speaker 2: go back to Q school, that's tough. But if you
Speaker 2: keep your Cornferry Tour card, solid year and not what
Speaker 2: you wanted, but the goal is to get to the
Speaker 2: PGA Tour. So, like you said, if you take a
Speaker 2: week off, other guys just jumping in the points, you
Speaker 2: feel like you're losing ground. The schedule is much better
Speaker 2: this year. I think my first year, we had eleven
Speaker 2: week in a row stretch and I played all of
Speaker 2: them this year. I think the longest is five, maybe six,
Speaker 2: so you don't really have to take a week off.
Speaker 2: I'm gonna take a week off in the middle of
Speaker 2: the summer. I've got my best friend's wedding that I
Speaker 2: got to go to, and I've started to realize, like,
Speaker 2: you can't everything you get to go, I get to
Speaker 2: go exactly. And no, it's true. It's like and I want,
Speaker 2: I want to go, you know. That's more what I
Speaker 2: wanted to say is I want to go and I
Speaker 2: don't have to skip it. I guess it's like there's
Speaker 2: there's like this like you know, oh, you have to
Speaker 2: play every single event. It's like no, like you can
Speaker 2: make decisions and you can, you know, maybe take that
Speaker 2: week off, work on your mental fatigue, exploit like do
Speaker 2: different things, go to the wedding and enjoy time with friends,
Speaker 2: and that'll recharge your batteries for when you get back.
Speaker 2: You play exponentially better than you would have if you
Speaker 2: had played all of them.
Speaker 1: So you went to Yale obviously a little bit different
Speaker 1: than most of your peers in terms of college experience workload.
Speaker 1: When you talk to your friends on the corn Ferry tour,
Speaker 1: what do you think, how do you think your college
Speaker 1: experience helped you in the profession of playing golf.
Speaker 2: Yeah, well, I played with I'm not going to name names,
Speaker 2: but I played with a player at Oklahoma State and
Speaker 2: we were talking about our college experiences and I was like,
Speaker 2: what'd you major in? He was like communications, and I
Speaker 2: was like, he's like when I major? I was like biology.
Speaker 2: I was like, how is your you know, workload, Like
Speaker 2: what was it like just to get like an understanding
Speaker 2: what other people's situations were, like what their experiences were like.
Speaker 2: And he was like, dude, I went to the range
Speaker 2: in the morning and like coach would make us sit
Speaker 2: down and do work for like thirty minutes or an hour,
Speaker 2: fair what it was. And then that was really it.
Speaker 2: I was like, did you go to class? He's like,
Speaker 2: oh no, Like we never went to class. I was like,
Speaker 2: what do you mean, So you just like went to
Speaker 2: school and you like just played golf every day and
Speaker 2: he's like yeah, And I was like, okay, Like nice,
Speaker 2: he obviously got his work in, like, you know, did
Speaker 2: well enough to stay on the team. And I was like, well,
Speaker 2: we had guys in our team that didn't want to
Speaker 2: play in the event. That weekend because they had a
Speaker 2: test coming up that next Monday. It was just a
Speaker 2: complete different mindset right for me. That was not me.
Speaker 2: I always wanted to play like I was, like coach
Speaker 2: put me in the lineup, I'm playing, I'm working. But
Speaker 2: on top of that, I maintained I think a three
Speaker 2: point seventy nine or three something around that GPA the
Speaker 2: last two years I had a four point zero. Took
Speaker 2: me a little bit time. I think I got three
Speaker 2: point one my first year and then got really good
Speaker 2: at studying, got really good at test taking towards the
Speaker 2: end of my four years. But I was really proud
Speaker 2: of that, and that's something that I can brag about
Speaker 2: because like I earned it right, and I would put
Speaker 2: in my time on the course, and I would put
Speaker 2: in my time in the library, and I had a
Speaker 2: study buddy who we would study close to one hundred
Speaker 2: hours for every single exam. So starting two weeks before
Speaker 2: the test started, we would study multiple multipliple multiple hours
Speaker 2: a day to make sure that we were in the
Speaker 2: best you know, like I've been talking about five you know,
Speaker 2: five hours a night two weeks before to make sure
Speaker 2: that we were in the best possible shape to take
Speaker 2: the test, and this helping my golf game because I
Speaker 2: was managing my time. So if I knew I need
Speaker 2: to study from say seven pm to midnight, and that
Speaker 2: includes p sets and homework and stuff, then I would
Speaker 2: need to do all my golf practice from two to six,
Speaker 2: have dinner from six to seven, maybe you know, hang
Speaker 2: out with friends as a study break, you know, a
Speaker 2: half hour and there somewhere or so. To sum that
Speaker 2: all up, I would always plan tomorrow the night before,
Speaker 2: so sitting in my room at midnight whatever, I'd go
Speaker 2: into my notes, SAP on my phone schedule, you know,
Speaker 2: four am, wake up, four to thirty lift, five thirty
Speaker 2: shower change, six am, we're hit balls in the team
Speaker 2: room until eight thirty, eight thirty at breakfast. Nine o'clock
Speaker 2: starts class. Class ends at about twelve, get to the course
Speaker 2: abound twelve thirty one, practice from one to six, dinner
Speaker 2: from six to seven, started from seven to midnight, wind down,
Speaker 2: and then do the whole thing over again. So you know,
Speaker 2: that was my typical day when I was in college,
Speaker 2: especially with football, we'd have four am lifts, so it
Speaker 2: was a pretty early wake up. But uh, you know,
Speaker 2: that's kind of the thing I had to do to
Speaker 2: a guitar. Where I was today, I guess.
Speaker 1: I mean from watching your content. I mean this, this structure,
Speaker 1: the schedule type stuff has has carried over into your
Speaker 1: professional career now like it took me. Yeah, like I
Speaker 1: I'm not a planner. I look at it. I'm like,
Speaker 1: I can't believe he plans us out and he sticks
Speaker 1: to it.
Speaker 2: Let's see this. This is the next two days, right,
Speaker 2: So like I've got essentially I got all of today.
Speaker 2: Obviously I've got most of tomorrow because Tomorrow is around one.
Speaker 2: So I have a five forty wake up tomorrow and
Speaker 2: it's ten am on Wednesday. But I'd like to know
Speaker 2: what time I'm waking up for my turnaround so that
Speaker 2: I can plan on Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday waking up earlier
Speaker 2: so that way when I wake up at five forty
Speaker 2: am on Thursday, it's not a shock. You're I'm gonna
Speaker 2: go get a workout in so my body. So I
Speaker 2: plan everything based on the Thursday to Sunday and then
Speaker 2: I work backwards.
Speaker 1: I think the other thing, you know, the way you're
Speaker 1: describing your college experience, it kind of reminds me of
Speaker 1: when I started working and tried to play golf. But
Speaker 1: like the the idea of of golf not feeling like
Speaker 1: your entire world is a huge advantage.
Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean that's like I got married in August,
Speaker 2: and my wife and I obviously in my vows it's
Speaker 2: like my vow to hers, I'm putting her first, right,
Speaker 2: she comes away before golf, and that needs to be
Speaker 2: the case. And I also need to put other things
Speaker 2: before golf. So I guess when I was in college,
Speaker 2: my only focus was let's get see as good as
Speaker 2: I can get and how good you know school and grades, like,
Speaker 2: let's just hammer those two and see where I can get.
Speaker 2: And then you get a little bit older and you realize, well,
Speaker 2: life's not really about well one golf, two like your career,
Speaker 2: like how much money you make it that's all like vanity.
Speaker 2: It doesn't really matter whatsoever when you boil it down
Speaker 2: to it's the people that you have in your in
Speaker 2: your inner circles what I call it. At my wedding,
Speaker 2: I gave a little speech about my inner circle, and
Speaker 2: it's the people who I can rely on, I can
Speaker 2: count on, and I can call up at any point
Speaker 2: in the day and they'd be there for me. And
Speaker 2: you know, I've my wife and I have created our
Speaker 2: own little inner circle, and that inner circle is everything
Speaker 2: to me. When I made the US Open, they all
Speaker 2: flew out to Oakmont and came and watched me, and
Speaker 2: like that was what it was about, sharing that moment
Speaker 2: with them, not oh, how did I play and what
Speaker 2: did I finish? It was like the experience that I
Speaker 2: had with them, and playing golf gives me that opportunity
Speaker 2: to share those moments with them and really create memories
Speaker 2: and moments with the people that I love and to
Speaker 2: care about. And you know, on top of that, it's
Speaker 2: doing vacations or trips or experiences with those people and
Speaker 2: enjoying it. And then obviously, you know, golf is my
Speaker 2: career and it's something I care deeply about and also
Speaker 2: making sure that I put enough time into my schedule
Speaker 2: that you know, I'm the best version of myself on
Speaker 2: the golf course I can be.
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Speaker 1: thanks to the g C S A A. And let's
Speaker 1: get back to James Nicholas. When you turn pro, Uh,
Speaker 1: you were really, I would say, the first Uh, you know,
Speaker 1: maybe not the first, but you're you're an og of
Speaker 1: what we see a lot of now of documenting your
Speaker 1: life as a pro. I feel like most pro golfers
Speaker 1: you know, in the history of golf have have kind
Speaker 1: of like kept what they're doing doing silent, out of
Speaker 1: out of public view. You use, you know, Instagram, TikTok
Speaker 1: to really show people in a modern way the journey,
Speaker 1: the good, the good and the bad of it. Was
Speaker 1: there ever a point where you thought about, like, I
Speaker 1: can't do both. I can't just let people into my
Speaker 1: life like this because I think this is just my
Speaker 1: personal stance, Like I think it's like it would be
Speaker 1: very hard for me to just allow people and give
Speaker 1: people the raw view that you allow people in on
Speaker 1: with your with your you know, social media content.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean I still think that that question every
Speaker 2: single day, Like I just want to take a break.
Speaker 2: I want to give this up, Like let's just focus
Speaker 2: on golf. It'll be way easier. But the amount of
Speaker 2: opportunities that social media has given me on top of that,
Speaker 2: like that you would not trade it. Sure there's negatives,
Speaker 2: but there's also a lot of positives. Like I did
Speaker 2: this giveaway a couple of weeks ago where I gave
Speaker 2: sixty of my followers a couple of my shirts and
Speaker 2: towels and headcovers and stuff, and the overwhelming response of
Speaker 2: positive feedback that I got made it worth it. Sure,
Speaker 2: I sat in my garage for like three hours folding
Speaker 2: packages and finding addresses and whatnot, but it was worth it.
Speaker 2: It's like, I'm in this opportunity where I get to
Speaker 2: share this and try to show people what it's like,
Speaker 2: and it's amazing, you know, I get to do this right, Like,
Speaker 2: this is something that I get to do, and when
Speaker 2: I look back on it, I was the first I
Speaker 2: don't know of anybody who was documenting themselves as a
Speaker 2: pro golfer, and.
Speaker 1: I didn't I didn't want anybody to come out of
Speaker 1: the woodwork. I believe you were the first two. Yeah,
Speaker 1: because like I'd never see anything like it.
Speaker 2: And I write the day of term pro I posted
Speaker 2: on Instagram. I'm like, hey, guys, like I had a
Speaker 2: travel Instagram and it was like I want to be
Speaker 2: j Alvarez type deal, you know. And now I was like,
Speaker 2: you know, the data term pro. This is my focus
Speaker 2: and I'm going to make a golf Instagram and I'm
Speaker 2: going to showcase the journey. I'm gonna showcase the ups
Speaker 2: the downs that the qualifiers, the first stage of Q school.
Speaker 2: And it's easy to look at it now and be like, oh,
Speaker 2: like yeah, you know you're showcasing the corn Ferry tour.
Speaker 2: It's like, yeah, rewind five years. I was practicing ten
Speaker 2: hours a day, every single day, no matter what rainshine,
Speaker 2: it does not matter. I was putting in the work
Speaker 2: and I was showcasing that. You know, you don't make
Speaker 2: much money when you don't have any status on any tour.
Speaker 2: But hopefully the goal is to be doing this when
Speaker 2: I'm more number one. And you know, obviously, as I've got,
Speaker 2: as I've grown, Like right now, i think I'm two
Speaker 2: sixty in the world and it's the highest I ever
Speaker 2: been ranked. But as you climb the world rankings, you
Speaker 2: get a lot more things thrown at you. You know,
Speaker 2: people want your time, people want your attention, and it
Speaker 2: gets a lot harder to then go back and balance
Speaker 2: the social media stuff. So, you know, I built out
Speaker 2: a team for my YouTube channel and they've helped take
Speaker 2: over that. So it's also finding time to let other
Speaker 2: people help you and being okay with that. And that's
Speaker 2: something in the past that haven't been okay with. I've
Speaker 2: wanted to control everything and make sure that it's up
Speaker 2: to my standards. But to also let go of control
Speaker 2: and let people help you has been a big thing
Speaker 2: for me, and it's been it's been great. And you know,
Speaker 2: Gary and the whole YouTube team Nick, they've absolutely crushed
Speaker 2: it and they've helped me immensely. But I'm still doing
Speaker 2: all the Instagram TikTok short form stuff because you know,
Speaker 2: it's just like a part of my identity now.
Speaker 1: I guess I mean full disclosure for the audience when
Speaker 1: you turn pro I think I reached out to you
Speaker 1: about like doing maybe some video contract work. I was like, yeah,
Speaker 1: we could pay you somebody your travel stuff. I would
Speaker 1: look at it and I'm like, Jesus, this guy is
Speaker 1: so good at at making you know, video content, and
Speaker 1: I think like it that talent U, it's extraordinary. I
Speaker 1: think you could have gone on to have a great
Speaker 1: career making appreciated video content. The I it's what you
Speaker 1: hit on, I think is a fascinating life thing, and
Speaker 1: I think it most people notice. It's most with like bands.
Speaker 1: But you have this killer album, the first album that
Speaker 1: you pour your life into. And if you think about
Speaker 1: the setup is like nobody knows who a band is
Speaker 1: before their first album, so they have all the time
Speaker 1: in the world to devote to this album. But then
Speaker 1: the album comes out is to smash success, and everybody
Speaker 1: floods in and wants the time. And what happens is
Speaker 1: then what is eroded is that creative time, that creative
Speaker 1: space that you spend to create these works of art,
Speaker 1: and you are doing all these other things, corporate appearances
Speaker 1: that how are you attempting to balance As you said,
Speaker 1: more and more things cover your way, less time to
Speaker 1: spend on YouTube, but how are you trying to balance
Speaker 1: that with life? Knowing that as you continue to succeed,
Speaker 1: this is just going to be more and more of
Speaker 1: a hurle.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you need to learn to say no, you know,
Speaker 2: like especially even with podcasts like I I've had like
Speaker 2: eighty not eighty, probably forty requests in the last two weeks.
Speaker 2: But like I message you guys like hey, guys, this
Speaker 2: time works for me, and you were like boom done.
Speaker 2: I'm like, and that's when I'll do things. You know,
Speaker 2: if it works on my time, then it's like, hey,
Speaker 2: I'm in. But if you know I went back and
Speaker 2: you're like hey, like this is this time only works
Speaker 2: and it's the middle of a practice around day and
Speaker 2: I have to shift things around. It's like, sorry, no,
Speaker 2: I can't do it. Now. I've in the past maybe
Speaker 2: have not said no ever, but now it's really learning
Speaker 2: to say no, respecting my time and doing things that
Speaker 2: I want to do when I want to do it.
Speaker 2: So when I go home, I have a lot of
Speaker 2: people asking me, hey, do you want to play? Do
Speaker 2: you want to do this? Like maybe we can do
Speaker 2: like and I have to say no. So when I
Speaker 2: get home, I just leave my weeks for me and
Speaker 2: I say, if you want to schedule something, you can
Speaker 2: message me the night before and I'll let you know,
Speaker 2: once I make my daily schedule, if I can fit
Speaker 2: it into that schedule, and people might say like no,
Speaker 2: I think it's it's you gotta respect your you gotta
Speaker 2: respect your time. Like there's like this week, I did
Speaker 2: a shoot for Delta. I've done two podcasts already, like
Speaker 2: this is my third, and it's like that's okay. Though
Speaker 2: I'm on the road and I'm managing my time. It's
Speaker 2: like I have a pro am in about four hours
Speaker 2: after this ends, I'm gonna go work out. Then I'm
Speaker 2: gonna practice for two hours and then I'm ready to go.
Speaker 2: But I'm not gonna be doing anything else this morning.
Speaker 2: Like this is Wednesday. This is my relaxed day, so
Speaker 2: like this fits in perfectly. So it's finding the times
Speaker 2: to do things. It's respecting my own time, my own schedule,
Speaker 2: and then also knowing when to say no even when
Speaker 2: it's hard. Yeah, Like I got invited to play some
Speaker 2: epic golf courses and travel to some cool places and
Speaker 2: I was like, I can't do it. I I you know,
Speaker 2: I want to be home. I want to I want
Speaker 2: to just be home and be with my wife and
Speaker 2: enjoy our time together because I can't be traveling twenty
Speaker 2: four to seven.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and it's hard too because sometimes people don't understand
Speaker 1: that it just, you know, you have to do all this.
Speaker 1: I often have people that come that will occasionally accompany
Speaker 1: me on a trip and they're like, WHOA, I didn't
Speaker 1: realize how much goes into like being on the road.
Speaker 1: And it's you know that people just see the the
Speaker 1: the cool stuff you do. I play golf for a
Speaker 1: living and often don't realize like how much work it
Speaker 1: is to to do that.
Speaker 2: Mm hmmm. Yeah, there's so much bend the scenes for everything.
Speaker 2: It's like it's you know, when when you're traveling and
Speaker 2: your flight gets delayed, it's another two hours of the
Speaker 2: day Washington. You got to pick up the time somewhere else.
Speaker 2: There's so many things that go on and you only
Speaker 2: see when you're coming down the church on Sunday, who
Speaker 2: is winning the tournament and the big check that they get.
Speaker 2: They don't see everything else.
Speaker 1: Back to the content a little bit, was what was
Speaker 1: like the toughest day to make content if you think
Speaker 1: just off the top of the head, like it was
Speaker 1: the toughest day to be like, Okay, I gotta turn
Speaker 1: the camera on and talk about this and what has
Speaker 1: been your been your favorite day to turn on on
Speaker 1: the camera and talk about it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think they might have both happened this year
Speaker 2: at second stage of Q School, I was trying to
Speaker 2: make my way to finals then to have a chance
Speaker 2: at one of those top five spots. And through round
Speaker 2: three I was one shot out at advancing the finals,
Speaker 2: and I get to round four. End up, I was
Speaker 2: six hunderd through twelve, so cruising, I was like five
Speaker 2: clear the number playing grey golf, and then a storm
Speaker 2: rolled through and canceled round four. So the tour made
Speaker 2: a decision to cancel round four, go back to round three,
Speaker 2: and I went on Instagram and I just talked about it.
Speaker 2: You go, hey, it's like, it's this is what it
Speaker 2: says in the bylaws. It's not the rules of Visual's fault.
Speaker 2: They're following the laws. Should I think like the rules
Speaker 2: and the laws should be changed. Yes, one hundred percent.
Speaker 2: That means I'm gonna be missing my chance at getting
Speaker 2: a pgtcord by one shot and I have to, you know, now,
Speaker 2: just get ready for next year. So that was in November,
Speaker 2: and then fast forward to Boguita. A couple weeks ago,
Speaker 2: through three rounds, I sorted through two rounds. They sent
Speaker 2: out out a little notice and they was like, hey, guys,
Speaker 2: you know round four might be canceled because there's a
Speaker 2: storm coming. So during round three, I told myself, I'm
Speaker 2: not gonna let this happen again. I'm gonna try to
Speaker 2: get the lead by the end of round three, and
Speaker 2: I did so round four got canceled. I actually had
Speaker 2: the win, but round four was played and I got
Speaker 2: the win, And obviously that day was just full of
Speaker 2: you for it, and that was like the best day
Speaker 2: to go on there. Make some content post that little
Speaker 2: meme I did of the Wesley Bryan and Brad Dalkey
Speaker 2: thing and you know, all the all these these cool
Speaker 2: videos that it had from the wind. But you know,
Speaker 2: over the years the win was great. But I have
Speaker 2: some really cool posts about Q School where you know,
Speaker 2: I made an eight foot and last hole of advanced
Speaker 2: to second stage, and like, there's been so many moments
Speaker 2: and I think Q School tops it. Like the pure
Speaker 2: elation and overwhelming just relief that you get when you
Speaker 2: make it through Q School is almost greater than the
Speaker 2: satisfaction of winning. And I know that that's a hard
Speaker 2: thing to maybe grasp, but Q schools make it or
Speaker 2: break it. If you miss a Q school, you've got
Speaker 2: no job next year, if you had no chance to win.
Speaker 2: When you win, it's great, but it's almost like, Okay,
Speaker 2: I still have a chance to win again next week
Speaker 2: and the week after and the week after, and then
Speaker 2: we after and the week after and twenty more times.
Speaker 2: Q school is one and done. So whenever I get
Speaker 2: through Q school and I'm able to post those successes,
Speaker 2: it's amazing. But on the other hand, if you miss
Speaker 2: a Q school, that's the tough pill to swallow because
Speaker 2: you realize you have no job for next year.
Speaker 1: Did any part of you feel you know what Scottie
Speaker 1: Shuffler talked about last year where he's like, you win,
Speaker 1: You've you've thought about, dreamed about winning, and you kind
Speaker 1: of get done with it, and you're like, all right, I.
Speaker 2: Had so I actually used that speech. I remember him
Speaker 2: talking about it. And after I was done with interviews,
Speaker 2: after done with sunny autographs, taking pictures, all the things
Speaker 2: I had to do for the sponsors, I grabbed my
Speaker 2: wife and I said, let's go sit in the grand
Speaker 2: stands and we walked to the top of the grand
Speaker 2: stands and it was completely empty, and we sat there
Speaker 2: for about half an hour and just looked over eighteen
Speaker 2: and I said like, this is like look how cool.
Speaker 2: This is Like let's just take it in. Let's enjoy
Speaker 2: the moment. Then after sitting there and talking for a
Speaker 2: little bit, took her hand. We walked down eighteen. We
Speaker 2: walked hand in hand down eighteen to our hit my
Speaker 2: appro shot, and we just really we were so present,
Speaker 2: we enjoy the moment. And I think that was really
Speaker 2: really special and really important for us, because if you
Speaker 2: just left the course and went to dinner and that
Speaker 2: was it, there's no real like realization of what you've
Speaker 2: accomplished together. And we took as much time as possible
Speaker 2: and just walked around and I took I took I
Speaker 2: took the signs off of every single building. I was like,
Speaker 2: there was like a member's only sign, I took it.
Speaker 2: There was a range like range limited to two hundred yards,
Speaker 2: I took it. There was another one that said players
Speaker 2: and caddies only. I took that one. So in my garage,
Speaker 2: I got a bunch of these signs and I was like,
Speaker 2: I just want to remember this moment you know, you
Speaker 2: never know we're gonna have it again, and I tried.
Speaker 2: And I also had two weeks off after, so I
Speaker 2: did a celebration dinner with my friends in Florida, you know,
Speaker 2: spend some time with my family, and I really got
Speaker 2: to soak it in and enjoy it. So I would say, no,
Speaker 2: I actually did get, you know, two weeks of just
Speaker 2: like pure elation, pure enjoyment and really just realizing what
Speaker 2: we had done. And called my wife last night and
Speaker 2: I was like, I still can't believe we won, and
Speaker 2: she was like, me neither. So yeah, we're still living
Speaker 2: on a high.
Speaker 1: That's that's awesome. That's uh, that's cool. I love that
Speaker 1: you admitted to some petty theft on the pod too.
Speaker 2: Of course, of course, I think it was for the takings.
Speaker 2: I probably would have found the trash.
Speaker 1: Anyway outside of kind of status. Buddy, the things that
Speaker 1: you know, the obvious things that come on the PGA tour.
Speaker 1: What excites you the most about the prospect of playing
Speaker 1: on tour?
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it's easy to look ahead. I'm focused
Speaker 2: on the in the present right this this usually is
Speaker 2: just a good start, you know, I've got a long
Speaker 2: ways to go, got to keep the pedal down. The
Speaker 2: PJ Tours, that the greatest tour in the world. Winning
Speaker 2: on the PJ Tours in my life, you know, not
Speaker 2: lifelong dream because I was dreaming winning Olympic gold in
Speaker 2: the hockey team. But that's that's you know, when I
Speaker 2: since I've been twenty, since I quit football, you know,
Speaker 2: winning a PJ Tour event is everything you dream about
Speaker 2: and playing against the best players in the world, seeing
Speaker 2: where your talent level stacks up. And I've played a
Speaker 2: few events PGA Tour, played Pisco Championship, the Bermuda Championship twice,
Speaker 2: the Zurich Classic, the Rock and Mortgage, and these guys
Speaker 2: are true professionals. There's nothing like it, Like every single
Speaker 2: one of them is the best at their craft and
Speaker 2: the pinnacle of golf. So I want to try to
Speaker 2: put my name up there and compete with them and
Speaker 2: see where that lands myself and see what all my
Speaker 2: hard work has really not proven, but see where it
Speaker 2: stacks up against the best.
Speaker 1: What's your favorite memory you grew up in the New
Speaker 1: York area. What's your favorite memory growing up playing in
Speaker 1: the Mets section.
Speaker 2: Wow, the Mets section, I have so many I remember
Speaker 2: when I played my first MGA event at Fire's Head.
Speaker 2: It was the IKE. I think I was fourteen years
Speaker 2: old and I qualified and my coach asked me, Gary
Speaker 2: Weir as my coach at the time, He goes, what's
Speaker 2: your goal for this week? And I said, my goal
Speaker 2: is to win? What do you mean? And it was
Speaker 2: a little bit a naive statement because I was just
Speaker 2: this fourteen year old kid who was a very good
Speaker 2: at hockey and football and other sports. And if you
Speaker 2: lost the game, that was a failure. You either won
Speaker 2: or your lost. There was no one between. With golf,
Speaker 2: there's a lot in between between first and one hundred
Speaker 2: and twenty fifth whatever it was. And I ended up
Speaker 2: shooting like eighty seven in the first round, missed the cut,
Speaker 2: didn't eve get a chance to play a second round
Speaker 2: or whatever it was. And I was like, well, there's
Speaker 2: my introduction to met section golf. It's a very talented
Speaker 2: group of guys and you know, playing in things like
Speaker 2: the Carry Cup and taking down gu and I Great
Speaker 2: Britain or GB and I or sorry, the Carry Cup
Speaker 2: is just Ireland the golfing guy, Golfing Union of Ireland
Speaker 2: taking them down with a huge comeback on the last
Speaker 2: day was amazing and representing the MGA and the entire
Speaker 2: section was incredible. Qualifying in the met section for the
Speaker 2: US Open last year one of the coolest experiences of
Speaker 2: my life. Having everybody who's watched me grow up, you know,
Speaker 2: the rules officials, the volunteers like Chris Gaffney and Brian
Speaker 2: Mahoney and Charles and all these guys that watched me
Speaker 2: as a junior. Then realized the stream of playing my
Speaker 2: first major championship is just like this. They've been there
Speaker 2: since the beginning, since the Williamson Cup days, since the
Speaker 2: Carry Cup days, since that first Ike, and then to
Speaker 2: cap it off with that major championship qualification last year
Speaker 2: was just incredible. So a lot of good memories in
Speaker 2: that section.
Speaker 1: Yeah. I was with a couple buddies who have played
Speaker 1: in the met section and I mentioned last week. I
Speaker 1: was like, I think I have James On in the
Speaker 1: near future, and they were like, oh god, I remember
Speaker 1: the first time we saw him at the Anderson and
Speaker 1: he hit a teacher and we like turned to each
Speaker 1: other and we're like, WHOA like that? That came off different.
Speaker 2: I The Anderson was one of the most special championships
Speaker 2: that I've ever won, and I still wish that I
Speaker 2: could play in it. I love team events, but I'll
Speaker 2: never forget it. On whole number one two three four east,
Speaker 2: I hit driver up the left and then I hit
Speaker 2: this two iron around the corner to this for a
Speaker 2: tap an eagle. And as we're walking up there, the
Speaker 2: fifty is you can kind of just take a shortcut,
Speaker 2: and the guys are playing with just go yeah, that's good,
Speaker 2: and they just walked to the fifteen. I had to
Speaker 2: walk like one hundred and fifty yards to the green,
Speaker 2: pick up my ball, and walk to the next and
Speaker 2: all the members were like what just happened? And like
Speaker 2: I guess like word had spread that like I had
Speaker 2: a two iron from like two ninety to this, and
Speaker 2: like that story just like still lives on and people
Speaker 2: like come up to me like, oh do you remember
Speaker 2: when you I'm like, yes, I remember. It was it
Speaker 2: was a combination of luck and a great golf shop.
Speaker 2: But you know, we'll take it. So Anderson is a
Speaker 2: special event.
Speaker 1: I you know, I as I grew up in Chicago,
Speaker 1: you know, and I think like I think I always
Speaker 1: looked at the met with envy. I think just they
Speaker 1: they're such a class amateur golf organization in terms of
Speaker 1: like the the venues and the events, and there's there's
Speaker 1: so much his obviously history, but the the the events
Speaker 1: are such a high tier level between the golf courses
Speaker 1: and the competition. Do you think that the met you know,
Speaker 1: would say was a fundamental part of where you've gotten
Speaker 1: to today.
Speaker 2: Oh, one thousand percent to be able to play in
Speaker 2: these championships as a kid and play like this Cup,
Speaker 2: played Ridgewood, Arcola, which hosted a US Amateur, played wing Foot,
Speaker 2: which is hoping hosted US Opens, and Shinnecock and Bethpage
Speaker 2: Black which has hosted Ryder Cups, and all these courses
Speaker 2: are just like your run of the mill MGA events.
Speaker 2: This year they have the Meta Amateur at Deepdale, which
Speaker 2: is of course I grew up playing at for high
Speaker 2: school golf. Our home courses were Fenway, Metropolis, quaker Ridge,
Speaker 2: Like these are top one hundred golf courses in the
Speaker 2: world and we're just playing them on an average Tuesday
Speaker 2: for a high school match. So to be able to
Speaker 2: get this experience of playing the METS section and yeah,
Speaker 2: one hundred percent spoiled little you know country club kids
Speaker 2: is what my football coach used to call us. Yeah,
Speaker 2: it definitely led to this ability on the golf course
Speaker 2: because I didn't grow up grinding every single I just
Speaker 2: wouldn't go out and play golf. I would go out
Speaker 2: and play Quakeerage or wing Foot or Westchester Country Club
Speaker 2: or you know, Deepdale and take it for granted because
Speaker 2: that's all I knew. But now looking back on it,
Speaker 2: I'm like I got to play the best golf courses
Speaker 2: in the world every single day, and not that it was,
Speaker 2: you know, like nothing, but yeah, I almost treated as
Speaker 2: if it was just like an average day at the
Speaker 2: golf course, you know, and my my buddies would would
Speaker 2: host me at their club and then I would host
Speaker 2: them at theirs, and it just felt like we could
Speaker 2: play tilling Hast, you know, golf courses like McKenzie not
Speaker 2: maybe not McKenzie, but like McDonald Rainers. You know, you
Speaker 2: play some just incredible designed golf courses in the met
Speaker 2: section like it was nothing and to be able to
Speaker 2: be exposed so that design and that caliber golf course
Speaker 2: day in and day out, and then win tournaments at
Speaker 2: places like Arcola and you know where else have I
Speaker 2: played really well at Hudson National and Hollywood and you
Speaker 2: know all the banks courses like like pop piping rock,
Speaker 2: and so it's just it's definitely added to my development
Speaker 2: as a golfer.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I you know, I just like appreciate how they
Speaker 1: are able to get these clubs to say yes, and
Speaker 1: I appreciate the commitment throughout the entire section. As a kid,
Speaker 1: I remember I grew up at Ammuni and like I
Speaker 1: remember the first time I played a tournament at a
Speaker 1: country club and like the green speeds were just overwhelming
Speaker 1: to me, Like I didn't know what to do. And
Speaker 1: it's like those things. I remember qualifying for an event
Speaker 1: at Olympia Fields and it would being like this huge,
Speaker 1: like I was so just excited about, like yes, I
Speaker 1: get to go play a tournament at Olympia Fie like
Speaker 1: the you know, this is where I watched Tiger play
Speaker 1: US Open. You know like that. But for the met
Speaker 1: their ability to just like it, obviously they have like
Speaker 1: a surplus of courses, but their ability to cultivate like it.
Speaker 1: It is such a great shaping for young golfers, aspiring
Speaker 1: golfers because you're playing, as you said, Wingfoot or you know,
Speaker 1: Friar's Head or Ridgewood, and then you qualify for a
Speaker 1: us USGA event or whatever. It may be a big event,
Speaker 1: and you go there and it's not something you haven't experienced.
Speaker 1: There's no shell shock because you've played them in these
Speaker 1: regular events. Yeah.
Speaker 2: I played the US Open this ye at Oakmont, and
Speaker 2: you hear everybody talking about how hard it is, and
Speaker 2: it honestly felt like another day playing wingfoot, just you
Speaker 2: know from the obviously from the back tees and the
Speaker 2: green speeds were just like I experienced a deep tail
Speaker 2: and you know these the bunkers were just as deep
Speaker 2: as you know this course. So it just feels like
Speaker 2: the METS section prepares you for everything in golf, whether
Speaker 2: it's a USGA event or a high level college event
Speaker 2: or a high level amateur event. Growing up playing these tournaments,
Speaker 2: the MET Open, the metam the Ike, the Met Junior,
Speaker 2: the Met Boys like they're major championships. The greens are
Speaker 2: fourteen plus, the rough is long, and you got hit
Speaker 2: the ball straight, So there's nothing else to it other
Speaker 2: than that.
Speaker 1: James, thank you so much for your time. Well, I
Speaker 1: hope you know you get some new fans. From this,
Speaker 1: but looking forward to watching you continue the stellar start
Speaker 1: to the corn Ferry Tour season and hopefully we'll see
Speaker 1: you at some events here soon. But thank you so
Speaker 1: much for the time and and we'll be rooting for
Speaker 1: you of course.
Speaker 2: Thanks for having me on. I appreciate it.
Speaker 1: All right, Big thanks for listening to another edition of
Speaker 1: Friday Podcast, and big thanks to PJ Clark for editing
Speaker 1: and producing this. I'm back in the country. I'm a
Speaker 1: little jet lagged, but excited to pump out sport episodes
Speaker 1: here in the coming weeks, so we'll be back next week.
Speaker 1: Thanks as always for the support.