Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news.
Speaker 2: I'm not aligned with Putin, I'm not aligned with anybody.
Speaker 2: I'm aligned with the United States of America and for
Speaker 2: the good of the world.
Speaker 3: I'm aligned with the world. You want me to be tough.
Speaker 3: I could be tougher than any human being you've ever seen.
Speaker 3: I'd be so tough, But you're never going to get
Speaker 3: a deal that way.
Speaker 4: Do you have nice ocean and don't feel now, but
Speaker 4: you will feel it.
Speaker 3: Bless You don't know that. I'm blessed, you're I'm blessed.
Speaker 3: You don't know.
Speaker 2: Don't tell us what we're gonna feel. We're trying to
Speaker 2: solve a problem. Don't tell us what we're going to feel.
Speaker 2: I'm not telling you because you're in no position to
Speaker 2: dictate that. Remember this, you're in no position to dictate
Speaker 2: what we're going to feel. You're not in a good position.
Speaker 2: You don't have the cards right now with us. You
Speaker 2: start having right now. You don't know your playing car.
Speaker 2: You're gambling with the lives and millions of people. You're
Speaker 2: gambling with world two War three. Your country is in
Speaker 2: big trouble.
Speaker 3: I know you're not winning. Oh you're not winning.
Speaker 2: This, you have a damn good chance of coming out
Speaker 2: okay because of bread.
Speaker 5: All right, there you have President Trump, President Zelenski, Vice
Speaker 5: President J. D Vance and others in a very crowded
Speaker 5: Oval Office and what was a bilateral meeting that turned
Speaker 5: into an argument. Just bringing that to you as it's
Speaker 5: coming into our newsroom right now. They jumped in about
Speaker 5: halfway through the meeting, so we might be able to
Speaker 5: get you some other comments from the beginning of that conversation.
Speaker 5: As reporters are escorted outside of the Oval Office, Donald
Speaker 5: Trump to Vladimir Zelensky, you either make a deal or
Speaker 5: we are out, he said, telling Zelensky he has to
Speaker 5: be thankful, and he said it's going to be very
Speaker 5: hard to do business like this. As President Zelenski tried
Speaker 5: to make his case to jd Vance, Donald Trump and others,
Speaker 5: things got very chippy in the middle of that meeting.
Speaker 5: And we want to assemble our political panel. They were
Speaker 5: listening along with us here our signature panel together. Rick Davis,
Speaker 5: Republicans strategist partner at Stone Court Capital, and Genie Shanzano,
Speaker 5: of course, our democratic analyst and political science professor at
Speaker 5: Iona University. Rick, I'm not sure I've ever heard anything
Speaker 5: like that come out of a meeting of world leaders
Speaker 5: in the Oval Office. Typically an argument like that would
Speaker 5: be behind closed doors. It just played out for everyone
Speaker 5: to see. Is this relationship broken? Where do we go
Speaker 5: from here?
Speaker 6: Yeah, Joe, I'm not sure you would even say that
Speaker 6: this kind of argument ever happens behind closed doors. I mean,
Speaker 6: these kinds of state to state discussions are usually finely tuned,
Speaker 6: they're prepped, They have lots of staff involved making sure
Speaker 6: that the time that the two principles spend together is
Speaker 6: well orchestrated and that the outcome is totally predetermined. The
Speaker 6: idea that you would put these two folks in the
Speaker 6: Oval Office with a bunch of reporters to hash it
Speaker 6: out is something I don't think I've ever seen in
Speaker 6: five decades of Washington state craft. So I think what
Speaker 6: we just witnessed was something that you know, look, I mean,
Speaker 6: everybody Knewald Trump kind of you know, goes his own way,
Speaker 6: but the idea that this is either good for America,
Speaker 6: good for Ukraine, or good for the world is nuts.
Speaker 6: This was an incredible failure of diplomacy. And regardless of
Speaker 6: what happens today, maybe they get a deal and they
Speaker 6: saw it, you know, showing this makes both countries look weak.
Speaker 5: Wow, Genie, give me your take on this. Was it
Speaker 5: a conversation? A lot of people stressed out went off
Speaker 5: the rails when they heard the wrong words from Voladimir Zelensky.
Speaker 5: He wasn't thankful enough? Or was this a setup? Did
Speaker 5: Donald Trump and Jade Vance plan to do this with
Speaker 5: the cameras in the room?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 7: I mean, you know, one of the big questions hanging
Speaker 7: over this meeting, in addition to security guarantees, which we
Speaker 7: could probably forget that question for right now, was can
Speaker 7: we work together? You know, Vladimir Zelenski trying to test
Speaker 7: out does Donald Trump, you know, like me enough that
Speaker 7: we can make this happen? And that kind of exchange
Speaker 7: is just a reminder and interpersonal relationships matter an awful
Speaker 7: lot in these things, So that seems to be very clear.
Speaker 7: There is not a lot of love lost there. And
Speaker 7: of course this is quite embarrassing from the perspective of
Speaker 7: the United States. He is talking to our ally in
Speaker 7: this war. He is talking to a country invaded by Putin.
Speaker 7: In twenty fourteen, seven million Ukrainians have fled their homeland.
Speaker 7: We are talking of hundreds of thousands of innocent people
Speaker 7: now dead, four millions still deplaced, and he is being
Speaker 7: told from the Vice President and the President of the
Speaker 7: United States, heretofore their allies that you are not being
Speaker 7: thankful enough to us as you sit here. And so
Speaker 7: it is quite an embarrassing spectacle. It does look made
Speaker 7: for TV from my perspective. You wouldn't believe it unless
Speaker 7: you saw it firsthand, that this was the conversation that
Speaker 7: the are having, And I can't imagine what it looks
Speaker 7: like behind the scenes. Is this is what they're displaying?
Speaker 5: Oh my god? Yeah, Well, what do you think, Rick?
Speaker 5: Did this feel spontaneous? And does this torpedo the bilateral
Speaker 5: news conference they had planned for ten minutes from now?
Speaker 6: You know, it's hard to tell what they're going to
Speaker 6: do to put this back together, you know, behind closed
Speaker 6: doors now, it's going to have to take a lot
Speaker 6: of work, because I think both principals are going back
Speaker 6: to their neutral corners ready to come out throwing punches again. Look,
Speaker 6: I mean, Donald Trump, I think started out this session
Speaker 6: pretty constructively, and I must admit, I mean the interjections
Speaker 6: by Vice President Vance really stoked a lot of anger
Speaker 6: in the room and was really counterproductive, I thought, and
Speaker 6: even Donald Trump at the end tried to bring it
Speaker 6: back and saying, look, we just wanted to stop the
Speaker 6: killing and get a deal. And the elements of a
Speaker 6: deal are there, right. I mean, he's had great meetings
Speaker 6: this week with you know, leaders of Europe in France
Speaker 6: and Great Britain, all of whom have guaranteed certain security
Speaker 6: measures that they would do in case of a ceasefire
Speaker 6: or a end of the war. And I mean, like
Speaker 6: he was walking in the President of the United States
Speaker 6: into kind of a very positive environment where he could,
Speaker 6: you know, I didn't have to commit to putting troops
Speaker 6: on the ground, but you know, could obviously continue to
Speaker 6: say we're going to supply you with materials and weapons
Speaker 6: because you're going to pay for them. And that kind
Speaker 6: of relationship is traditional for US, I mean, and it's
Speaker 6: sustainable over time. It's a real mature relationship between US
Speaker 6: and one of its allies and supporters, Ukraine. So everyone
Speaker 6: thought this was going to be sort of the beginning
Speaker 6: of a real mature relationship, one that's post combat conflict.
Speaker 6: And and my impression was that's not something JD. Van's
Speaker 6: wanted to see happen today and set out to try
Speaker 6: and derail it there in front of the American public.
Speaker 5: Just about a minute or two he left here Jeanie,
Speaker 5: Donald Trump invoked Vladimir Putin's talked about what they had
Speaker 5: gone through, how much they went through together during the
Speaker 5: Russia investigation. He started doing the Russia, Russia, Russia thing.
Speaker 5: He got very angry looking as he was referring to this.
Speaker 5: He also revealed that he just met again recently with
Speaker 5: Vladimir Putin. Do you think the Russian president had a
Speaker 5: sense of what this meeting was going to be like?
Speaker 7: You know, it's hard to know. We thought this was
Speaker 7: a win for Vladimir Zelensky that he got to Donald
Speaker 7: Trump personally, face to face first. And you know, I
Speaker 7: think there is going to be some criticism all around,
Speaker 7: obviously starting with jd Vance, but including Vladimir Zelensky. The
Speaker 7: reality is Ukraine unfortunately does not have a lot of
Speaker 7: cards to play. And those were the exact words that
Speaker 7: Donald Trump used. I'm not sure he needed to say
Speaker 7: it that viscerally, but that's what he said, and he's right.
Speaker 7: That's why Zelenski's task today was to do what they
Speaker 7: told Queen Victoria. Close your eyes and think of England.
Speaker 7: Close your eyes and think of Ukraine. And the reality
Speaker 7: is he couldn't get there in the face of JD
Speaker 7: Vance's taunting, and so I think he's going to bear
Speaker 7: some criticism on this as well, because the reality is
Speaker 7: Ukraine needs the support of the United States if they
Speaker 7: are going to sisto.
Speaker 5: Our panel's going to stay with us, GD Shanzano and
Speaker 5: Rick Davis. We're going to try to unpack what the
Speaker 5: heck just happened in the Oval Office. So stay with
Speaker 5: us right here on Bloomberg.
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Speaker 5: We're going to have a conversation ahead with former Ambassador
Speaker 5: Daniel Freed. First, we want to talk with Nick Wadams,
Speaker 5: who leads our national security coverage here in Washington, DC. Nick,
Speaker 5: have you ever seen anything like this before?
Speaker 3: No, I have not.
Speaker 8: That was one of the most extraordinary bits of television
Speaker 8: I've ever seen. Obviously, the President there getting extremely angry,
Speaker 8: and then Vice President jd Vance essentially asking Zelenski to
Speaker 8: grovel and to express thanks to the US, which of
Speaker 8: course he has done many times before for the weaponry
Speaker 8: and the aid that the US has provided. So an
Speaker 8: extraordinary moment.
Speaker 9: Well, certainly so. And I guess the question, Nick, is now,
Speaker 9: what moments come after this? Things have moved behind closed doors.
Speaker 9: But initially there was supposed to be an agreement signed
Speaker 9: in front of the press in the East Room of
Speaker 9: the White House that was supposed to be scheduled to
Speaker 9: happen at this hour. Is there any indication of whether
Speaker 9: that will still happen.
Speaker 8: Well, we are trying to figure that out. I mean,
Speaker 8: the big question here is does that go ahead or
Speaker 8: are we at an impasse where essentially the relationship is
Speaker 8: totally broken. I mean, been clear for some time that
Speaker 8: President Trump was not excited about Volodimir Zelenski. He did
Speaker 8: at one point call him a dictator. Though then in
Speaker 8: the last day or two we'd had a turn where
Speaker 8: it felt like the situation was warming up a little bit,
Speaker 8: things were getting better. They thought they had a deal
Speaker 8: that served Ukraine's interests, essentially punted a lot of questions
Speaker 8: until later, but gave President Trump a document to show
Speaker 8: his supporters to say, look, we are going to get
Speaker 8: something out of this.
Speaker 3: Now.
Speaker 8: Seems very unlikely to me that the two sides, without
Speaker 8: some further intervention, would be willing to sit down and
Speaker 8: actually put pen to paper, put their signatures on that document.
Speaker 8: Then the whole thing may end up in total collapse.
Speaker 8: But we'll just have to see. In the next hour
Speaker 8: or so, they're also supposed to have a press conference,
Speaker 8: and of course it's not going to happen, so great question.
Speaker 5: We will bring it to our viewers and listeners if
Speaker 5: it does. Nick. That was scheduled to begin seven minutes ago,
Speaker 5: but obviously things are running late. Before things started getting angry,
Speaker 5: Donald Trump said to Voladimir Zelenski, you either make a
Speaker 5: deal or we are out. You take him at his word.
Speaker 8: Yes, I would take him at his word on that.
Speaker 8: I mean, you know, the thing that's so interesting is
Speaker 8: this critical minerals deal. When you get down to it
Speaker 8: was essentially an agreement to have talks about talks at
Speaker 8: a later time, So there wasn't really anything in it
Speaker 8: that actually committed either side to much of anything. And indeed,
Speaker 8: there was some speculation that this was basically something that
Speaker 8: Ukraine and some pro Ukraine lawmakers and others in the
Speaker 8: United States could put in front of President Trump and say, listen,
Speaker 8: we got this from them. Now we can get down
Speaker 8: to the real business of actually having real negotiations, both
Speaker 8: over this deal but over a peace agreement later on.
Speaker 8: So if President Trump essentially backs out and throws himself
Speaker 8: in with the Russian side, or abandons Ukraine and lets
Speaker 8: Russia run roughshot over Ukrainian territory, I mean, this is
Speaker 8: a critical moment. This is just completely unprecedented. So again,
Speaker 8: we should have more clarity in the next couple of
Speaker 8: hours and also in the coming days. But what you
Speaker 8: really saw here was just the eruption of the hostility.
Speaker 8: We had known that President Trump felt about Ukraine from
Speaker 8: some time, but had been restrained from exhibiting. Now it
Speaker 8: feels like those shackles are basically off.
Speaker 9: All right, Bloomberg's Nick Wadams, thank you so much with
Speaker 9: reaction to the footage We've all just seen and watching
Speaker 9: it alongside us now here in our Washington, d C.
Speaker 9: Studio is Ambassador Daniel Freed, Distinguished Fellow at the Atlantic Council,
Speaker 9: also former US Ambassador to Poland and former Assistant Secretary
Speaker 9: of State for Europe here with Us on Bloomberg TV
Speaker 9: and Radio. So obviously we all saw, we all heard
Speaker 9: the exchange that happened between these three, ambassador What do
Speaker 9: you make of it?
Speaker 10: Take a step back.
Speaker 11: The US has an interest in Ukraine succeeding. Our problems
Speaker 11: in the world get better if Ukraine survives and prospers,
Speaker 11: and if Russia wins, our problems get worse. It's been
Speaker 11: quite a week. The Trump plan for Ukraine, as we
Speaker 11: understand it, could work and was getting some traction ceasefire
Speaker 11: in place, British and French led force in Ukraine, maybe
Speaker 11: with American backup, a minerals deal with Ukraine that gives
Speaker 11: President Trump the ability to say, yeah, I've got a
Speaker 11: stake in this that could come together, and now this
Speaker 11: now this blow up. Let's hope, best case that they
Speaker 11: pull it together. You know, President Trump loves drama for TV.
Speaker 11: Let's hope that they can pull it together. Sign the
Speaker 11: minerals deal, move forward, because the US, the Trump administration
Speaker 11: could succeed and Trump could get what he wants, which
Speaker 11: is to push back on Putin, be seen as doing so,
Speaker 11: and be seen as a peacemaker. Now I realize that
Speaker 11: this may be completely fanciful if in the next few
Speaker 11: hours this all blows up.
Speaker 10: I get that.
Speaker 11: But my job for forty years Foreign Service officer is
Speaker 11: to try to look at the way forward, and there
Speaker 11: is a way forward, which is why my frustration is
Speaker 11: that the administration keeps stepping on its own policy. This
Speaker 11: fight in the Oval was not necessary, especially because Zelenski
Speaker 11: is actually working accord according to Trump's plan. He's ready
Speaker 11: to sign the deal. I suspect he's ready to accept
Speaker 11: the seize fire if he gets enough security. Trump could
Speaker 11: win if he has the discipline to see it through.
Speaker 5: You've been in many rooms with world leaders for very
Speaker 5: sensitive negotiations. I'm guessing you two have never seen anything
Speaker 5: quite like that. Did it feel authentic, did it feel
Speaker 5: spontaneous or was there some show business with cameras and
Speaker 5: microphones in the room today.
Speaker 11: That's a good question. I watched it carefully. I think
Speaker 11: Vice President Vance was provoking Zelenski. I think Zelenski could
Speaker 11: have answered it differently. He was trying to explain the details.
Speaker 11: That's not what I would have done or advised him
Speaker 11: to do. But then you had the president and the
Speaker 11: Vice president basically bullying a democratic leader who is fighting
Speaker 11: for his freedom and ours. So I don't see what
Speaker 11: American interest is is advanced by having this fight.
Speaker 10: Was it deliberate? Was it an ambush?
Speaker 11: It's possible, But the larger question remains, what do we
Speaker 11: get out of having a fight? I know what Putin gets.
Speaker 11: What do we get? We get a lot. If Ukraine succeeds,
Speaker 11: and especially if we get the British and French to
Speaker 11: carry the heavy load of the security burden, that's quite
Speaker 11: a success for trumpet success for America. I'm all on board,
Speaker 11: but the administration has to follow its own plan and
Speaker 11: not get distracted by this stuff.
Speaker 9: Well, on your point, ambassador about it being in US
Speaker 9: interest to see Ukraine succeed to the extent it can,
Speaker 9: it did seem. We saw President Selensky trying to make
Speaker 9: that point when he suggested, yes, I know you're here
Speaker 9: on the other side of the Atlantic, but you could
Speaker 9: ultimately feel this. President Trump pushed back on them, saying,
Speaker 9: you know, don't tell us what to feel. But also
Speaker 9: then later suggested Zelensky, right now is toying with World
Speaker 9: War three, which presumably would involve the US, and somehow
Speaker 9: we aren't immune to conflicts like that, as we saw
Speaker 9: with the prior World War.
Speaker 10: So which is it? Yeah, President Trump was just wrong
Speaker 10: about that. We thought we.
Speaker 11: Were safe behind two oceans and then Pearl Harbor, right,
Speaker 11: we figured it out fast. We can't be the lonely
Speaker 11: bastion of freedom in the world. That's what Franklin Roosevelt,
Speaker 11: Harry Truman, and Ronald Reagan taught us. And that's the
Speaker 11: right lesson and it is the Trump administration in its
Speaker 11: more wise moments, understood that we're in a period of
Speaker 11: great power rivalry and we have adversaries Russia, China, Iran.
Speaker 11: So yeah, let's work with our friends to contend with
Speaker 11: our adversaries. And Ukraine is our friend. Maybe a little
Speaker 11: difficult sometime, but still.
Speaker 9: But the President today didn't seem to characterize Russia as
Speaker 9: an adversary necessarily. When he was asked do you feel
Speaker 9: in the middle, he said, I'm for both Ukraine and Russia.
Speaker 10: How did you interpret that?
Speaker 11: Well, that's not the language I would have used, and
Speaker 11: I don't think our position at the UN was very
Speaker 11: good on Monday where we supported a week resolution. But
Speaker 11: if that's the way President Trump wants to play it, okay,
Speaker 11: play it that way, but then land the deal, and
Speaker 11: the deal has to provide for Ukraine's security because if
Speaker 11: it doesn't, then we've been suckered by the Russians and diplomacy.
Speaker 10: Don't be the sucker.
Speaker 5: We love talking with practitioners. You're a career diplomat, bring
Speaker 5: us into the room and maybe not an extent dream
Speaker 5: like this, But when a meeting devolves, the reporters have left.
Speaker 5: Who is in the diplomatic delegation? Who gets their arms
Speaker 5: around this? Do people go to separate rooms? What do
Speaker 5: you do now? As a diplomat when the meeting just
Speaker 5: blew up in your face?
Speaker 11: You advise your principle on how to fix it? What
Speaker 11: do you do to set it right? And you and
Speaker 11: what do you do in terms of what's possible for
Speaker 11: you politically? And someone like me is supposed to find
Speaker 11: a way forward? Sosident. If I were advising President Trump,
Speaker 11: I would say, look, you made your point. Now tell
Speaker 11: Zelensky make light of it. Tells Zelensky we need a deal.
Speaker 11: Let's show people after we've pushed back that we can
Speaker 11: do that.
Speaker 5: But you get the boss alone in a room. Right now,
Speaker 5: everyone goes cool off for a minute.
Speaker 11: Now, the national security this is the job for the
Speaker 11: National Security Advisory And I think Mike Walls.
Speaker 10: Is a serious person.
Speaker 5: He was right in there.
Speaker 10: That's right now.
Speaker 11: I also think that Zelensky, he should Zelenski's people should
Speaker 11: figure out a way for him to approach Trump and
Speaker 11: make clear that yeah, he's grateful to the United States,
Speaker 11: and yeah, he appreciates Trump's role in pushing things forward.
Speaker 11: Say that it's true enough and it will help. So
Speaker 11: you at moments like this, the pros scramble, don't wring
Speaker 11: your hands, don't complain, figure out what you're going to do,
Speaker 11: figure out the way forward, and do it fast.
Speaker 5: Do They will have this news conference Kaling.
Speaker 9: Well, I was just about to ask, ambassador, do you
Speaker 9: have confidence that they are able to do that? And
Speaker 9: we'll see these two having corrected or taken the break
Speaker 9: that they need, facing the press once again, worse afternoons.
Speaker 11: I'm in an impossible position because we're going to know
Speaker 11: just how long I am. I would say this because
Speaker 11: it's Donald Trump who loves drama. And twists and turns.
Speaker 11: He could easily decide to pull it back. He could
Speaker 11: now I'm not saying he will, but I don't think
Speaker 11: all is necessarily lost.
Speaker 10: Right.
Speaker 11: He loves TV drama and he's got one going. But
Speaker 11: the drama. You don't milk that drama. If you continue
Speaker 11: the fight, you get more attention and put yourself maybe
Speaker 11: in a stronger tactical tactical position, if you can come
Speaker 11: out and say, yeah, that.
Speaker 10: Was rough, but we've agreed.
Speaker 11: So if I were advising the President, I would say, Okay,
Speaker 11: you pushed hard.
Speaker 10: Now lands Land a deal.
Speaker 5: If you're Donald Trump, you can take credit for saving
Speaker 5: this day, can't you?
Speaker 10: If things go right, that would be my advice.
Speaker 11: Again, they're not going to ask me, but somebody like
Speaker 11: me is supposed to advise the president on how to
Speaker 11: succeed on his term.
Speaker 9: Ambassador, I apologize for interrupting, but we just got a
Speaker 9: statement from the President which reads as follows. It's amazing
Speaker 9: what comes out through emotion. And I have determined that
Speaker 9: President Zelensky is not ready for peace if America is involved,
Speaker 9: because he feels our involvement gives him a big advantage
Speaker 9: in negotiations. I don't want advantage. I want peace. He
Speaker 9: goes on to say he disrespected the United States of
Speaker 9: America in its cherished Oval office. He can come back
Speaker 9: when he is ready for peace.
Speaker 5: Pretty remarkable here.
Speaker 11: Well, that's unfortunate, especially because we showed no similar toughness
Speaker 11: in New York on Monday with a week un resolution.
Speaker 11: Not good and I don't see what American interest is
Speaker 11: advanced thereby.
Speaker 5: If there was one voice we could have at the
Speaker 5: table today, it would be Daniel Freed, Ambassador, thank you
Speaker 5: so much for being with us at this critical moment
Speaker 5: in Washington. I'm Joe Matthew alongside Kaylee Lines. Will have
Speaker 5: much more ahead with our signature panel. This is Bloomberg.
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Speaker 9: Bloomberg just confirming that the joint press conference that was
Speaker 9: scheduled to be this afternoon between President Trump and Ukrainian
Speaker 9: President Vladimir Zelensky is canceled after an argument in the
Speaker 9: Oval Office. Today was originally supposed to be about signing
Speaker 9: a minerals deal, and no sign that is actually going
Speaker 9: to take place. As President Trump has taken to true
Speaker 9: Social saying he is determined that Zelensky is not ready
Speaker 9: for peace if America is involved. He went on to
Speaker 9: say he disrespected the United States of America and its
Speaker 9: cherished Oval Office. He can come back when he's ready
Speaker 9: for peace.
Speaker 5: Yeah, so we've got a problem. This was a meeting
Speaker 5: that devolved into a bit of a shouting match. Voices
Speaker 5: were raised, an argument took place, and we brought you
Speaker 5: into the Oval Office for this conversation. It was really
Speaker 5: once Vice President JD. Vance started to address and challenge vladimir'
Speaker 5: Elenski about not being thankful enough that things started to
Speaker 5: get chippy. By the time Well Trump was speaking, he
Speaker 5: was genuinely angry and threatening to pull out of all
Speaker 5: of these talks. Now you mentioned his post on truth Social.
Speaker 5: It's possible that Zelenski will talk to reporters in the
Speaker 5: driveway because we're not getting a East room news conference now.
Speaker 5: If that happens, we'll bring you into the driveway to
Speaker 5: hear more from him. His vehicle is still parked in
Speaker 5: front of the entrance to the West wing, and we've
Speaker 5: got our panel with us. Kayleie, Rick Davis and Genie
Speaker 5: Shanzano have been listening and watching along with us. We
Speaker 5: want to bring you into the oval before we get
Speaker 5: their take on what just happened for an unprecedented moment
Speaker 5: in politics, Let's watch and listen.
Speaker 3: Can I ask you? Sure?
Speaker 5: Yeah?
Speaker 3: Yeah, okay.
Speaker 4: So he occupied it our parts, big parts of Ukraine,
Speaker 4: parts of East and Crimea. So he occupied it on
Speaker 4: twenty fourteen. So during a lot of years. So I'm
Speaker 4: not speaking about Jus Biden, but those time was Obama,
Speaker 4: President Obama, then President Trump, then President Biden, now the
Speaker 4: President Trump and God bless now President Trump will stop him.
Speaker 4: But during twenty fifteen, nobody stopped him. He just occupied
Speaker 4: and took He killed people. You know what the contact
Speaker 4: twenty fifteen.
Speaker 3: Twenty.
Speaker 4: Four yea, so he kills not here, yeah, by the
Speaker 4: second right, yes, But during twenty fourteen till twenty twenty two,
Speaker 4: what the situation the same that people have been dying
Speaker 4: on the contact line. Nobody stopped him. You know that
Speaker 4: we had conversations with him a lot of conversations.
Speaker 3: My belateral conversation.
Speaker 4: And we signed with him, me like a new president
Speaker 4: in twenty nineteen, I signed with him the deal I
Speaker 4: signed with him. Mccron and mayor kill we signed ceasefire, ceasefire.
Speaker 4: All of them told me that he will never go.
Speaker 4: We signed him with guest contract quantrum. Yes, but after
Speaker 4: that he broken this is fire. He killed a people
Speaker 4: and he didn't exchange prisoners. We signed the exchange.
Speaker 3: Of prisoners, but he didn't do it. What kind of
Speaker 3: diplomacy gg us speaking about? What? What do you what
Speaker 3: do you mean?
Speaker 12: I'm talking about the kind of diplomacy that's going to
Speaker 12: end the destruction of your country. But mister President, mister president,
Speaker 12: with respect, I think it's disrespectful for you to come
Speaker 12: into the Oval Office to try to litigate this in
Speaker 12: front of the American media. Right now, you guys are
Speaker 12: going around and forcing conscripts to the front lines because
Speaker 12: you have manpower problems. You should be thanking the president
Speaker 12: for trying to bring it into this conflict.
Speaker 4: Into Ukraine that you say, what problems we have? I
Speaker 4: have been to come one.
Speaker 12: I've actually I've actually watched and seen the stories and
Speaker 12: I know what happens is you bring people, you bring them.
Speaker 3: On a propaganda tour.
Speaker 12: Mister President, are do you disagree that you've had problems
Speaker 12: bringing people in your military have? And do you think
Speaker 12: that it's respectful to come to the over office of
Speaker 12: the United States of America and attack the administration that
Speaker 12: is trying to trying to prevent the destruction of your country?
Speaker 3: A lot of questions. Let's start from the beginning. Sure,
Speaker 3: first to all.
Speaker 4: During the war, everybody has problems, even you. But you
Speaker 4: have nice ocean and don't feel now, but you will feel.
Speaker 3: It in the future. God bless you. Don't know that.
Speaker 3: I'm blessed. You're un blessed. You're not.
Speaker 2: Don't tell us what we're going to feel. We're trying
Speaker 2: to solve a problem. Don't tell us what we're going
Speaker 2: to feel. I'm not telling you because you're in no
Speaker 2: position to dictate that. Remember this, you're in no position
Speaker 2: to dictate what we're going to feel.
Speaker 3: We're going to feel very good, feel influenced.
Speaker 2: We're going to feel very good and very strong, will
Speaker 2: feel influenced. You're right now not in a very good position.
Speaker 2: You've allowed you to be in a very bad position.
Speaker 2: That happens to be right about.
Speaker 3: From the very beginning of the war, not in a
Speaker 3: good position. You don't have the cards right now with us.
Speaker 2: You start having right now, you pays. You're gambling with
Speaker 2: lives and millions of people.
Speaker 3: You're gambling with world War three. You're gambling with World
Speaker 3: War three.
Speaker 2: And what you're doing is very disrespectful to the country.
Speaker 2: This country. It's back to you far more than a
Speaker 2: lot of people said they should have.
Speaker 12: Have you said thank you once this entire meeting. No,
Speaker 12: in this entire meeting, you said thank you. You went
Speaker 12: to Pennsylvania and campaigned for the opposition in October, offers
Speaker 12: some words of appreciation for the United States of America
Speaker 12: and the president who's trying to save your country.
Speaker 4: Please, you're seeing that if you will speak were loudly
Speaker 4: about the war.
Speaker 2: He's not speaking loudly. He's not speaking loudly. Your country
Speaker 2: is in big trouble. No, No, you've done a lot of talking.
Speaker 2: Your country is in big trouble. I know you're not winning.
Speaker 2: You're not winning this. You have a damn good chance
Speaker 2: of coming out okay, because.
Speaker 3: Of the president. Were staying Yawa country.
Speaker 4: Staying strong from the very beginning of the war, we've
Speaker 4: been alone, and we are thankful.
Speaker 3: I said, thanks, you haven't been keping it. You haven't
Speaker 3: been alone.
Speaker 2: We gave you, through this stupid president, three hundred and
Speaker 2: fifty billion dollars.
Speaker 3: We gave your military equipment. You and you men are brave,
Speaker 3: but they had to use our military one.
Speaker 2: If you didn't have our military equipment, If you didn't
Speaker 2: have our military equipment, this war would have been over
Speaker 2: in two weeks.
Speaker 4: In three days, I heard it from Puttin in three days.
Speaker 4: This is how maybe less in two weeks. Of course, yes, it's.
Speaker 2: Going to be a very hard thing to do business
Speaker 2: like this.
Speaker 13: I'm gonna tell you they thank you, I said, except
Speaker 13: that they're accept the American except that there are disagreements,
Speaker 13: and let's go litigate those disagreements rather than trying to
Speaker 13: fight it out in.
Speaker 12: The American media when you're wrong. We know that you're wrong.
Speaker 2: But you see, I think it's good for the American
Speaker 2: people to see what's going on. I think it's very important.
Speaker 2: That's why I kept this going so long. You have
Speaker 2: to be thankful. You don't have the cards. You're buried there.
Speaker 2: You're people that died. You're running low on soldiers. Listen,
Speaker 2: you're running low on soldiers. It would be a damn
Speaker 2: good thing. And then then you tell us I don't
Speaker 2: want to cease fire. I don't want to cease fire.
Speaker 2: I want to go and I wanted this.
Speaker 3: Look, if you.
Speaker 2: Could get a ceasefire right now, I tell you you
Speaker 2: take it. So the bullets stopped flying and your mint
Speaker 2: stuff courting killed.
Speaker 3: We want to stop the war. But you're saying you
Speaker 3: don't want to see you.
Speaker 2: I want to see guarantee because you get a ceasefire
Speaker 2: faster than any.
Speaker 3: Greet core people about fire. What they see.
Speaker 2: That wasn't with me, That wasn't with me. That was
Speaker 2: with a guy named Biden, who was not a smart person.
Speaker 3: That was your That was with Oba. Excuse me.
Speaker 2: That was with Obama, who gave you sheets and I
Speaker 2: gave you javelins. I gave you the javelins to take
Speaker 2: out all those tanks. Obama gave you sheets. In fact,
Speaker 2: the statement is Obama gave sheets and Trump gave javelins.
Speaker 2: You got to be more thankful, because let me tell
Speaker 2: you, you don't have the cards. With us, you have the cards,
Speaker 2: but without us, you don't have any cards.
Speaker 9: And there you have it. The dispute in the Oval
Speaker 9: Office between President Trump, Vice President JD Vance, and Ukrainian
Speaker 9: President vladimir's Lensky, which has now resulted in the cancellation
Speaker 9: of a press conference that was supposed to be held
Speaker 9: at this hour with Trump and Zelensky, and Donald Trump
Speaker 9: saying on true social that Zelensky can return when he
Speaker 9: is ready for peace. We are watching outside the White
Speaker 9: House to see if the Ukrainian president does indeed depart
Speaker 9: and whether or not he speaks to press in the
Speaker 9: aftermath of this, given that the scheduled time at which
Speaker 9: he could have done so has now been called off.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 5: We should note, by the way, that this is an
Speaker 5: incredibly busy day at the White House. There are scores
Speaker 5: of reporters there who also came from Europe, came from Ukraine.
Speaker 5: Not to mention, of course, the American reporters who were
Speaker 5: there for a very important day that we expected to
Speaker 5: see the signing of a minerals deal between the US
Speaker 5: and Ukraine. The briefing room is packed, The Oval Office
Speaker 5: was packed with those selected to be part of the
Speaker 5: pool today, but there will be a throng of reporters.
Speaker 5: I believe Josh Wingrove described it as a zoo when
Speaker 5: he got there earlier this morning. They're in the driveway,
Speaker 5: as you can see now on Bloomberg TV and on YouTube,
Speaker 5: the vehicle that brought Vladimir Zelenski to the White Houses
Speaker 5: waiting for him just outside the West Wing entrance. And
Speaker 5: if we were able to pull out a bit, you'd
Speaker 5: see the sticks, as they call it, the stakeout position,
Speaker 5: where microphones and cameras are waiting for him. So, Kaylee,
Speaker 5: he may well take some questions. We'll find out together.
Speaker 9: Indeed, and while we wait to find out, we turned
Speaker 9: back to our signature political panel who was with us today,
Speaker 9: Rick Davis and Jeanie Schanzy know both Bloomberg Politics contributors. Rick,
Speaker 9: given what we all just listened to again, the tone,
Speaker 9: the language that these three were using with each other
Speaker 9: in the Oval Office of all places, are you surprised
Speaker 9: that things cannot move forward in the aftermath, or at
Speaker 9: least don't seem to be moving forward now?
Speaker 6: Yeah, you would think that they'd set aside the emotion
Speaker 6: that the statement referred to from the White House and
Speaker 6: regroup with their teams. I can imagine National Security Advisor
Speaker 6: Walls is in conversations with the President, Vice President and
Speaker 6: his team trying to make something out of this. You
Speaker 6: don't get these opportunities very often to have something go
Speaker 6: forward toward a constructive piece agreement like today was planned
Speaker 6: to be, and allow something like the spectacle and the
Speaker 6: Oval Office to derail it. But the statement is speaks
Speaker 6: for itself. It sounds like there's no further progress that
Speaker 6: will be had today and these teams will have to
Speaker 6: reset and find a new avenue toward diplomacy. So this
Speaker 6: is not followed along the lines of any diplomatic effort.
Speaker 6: I've ever seen lots of momentum coming into today with
Speaker 6: the meetings earlier this week with the Prime Minister of
Speaker 6: the UK and the President of France, and you would
Speaker 6: have thought that this would have resulted in a very positive,
Speaker 6: constructive outcome. Instead have high fives in the Kremlin. This
Speaker 6: is exactly what they would have wanted to see happen,
Speaker 6: and it's going to be a big step backwards in
Speaker 6: stopping the fight that Donald Trump claims is his number
Speaker 6: one priority, stop the bloodshed.
Speaker 5: High fives in the Kremlin. Genie, would it be smart
Speaker 5: politically for Zelenski to come out of that west wing
Speaker 5: entrance we're looking at right now, and take questions from reporters,
Speaker 5: try to make this case or is he dig the
Speaker 5: hole deeper for Ukraine.
Speaker 7: You know, it is such a tough call for Zelensky.
Speaker 7: He had one big job to do, which was to
Speaker 7: try to mend a here to for difficult relationship with
Speaker 7: Donald Trump today. And the clip you played is so
Speaker 7: important because you can hear him at the offset of
Speaker 7: that trying, you know, fairly innocently to explain to JD.
Speaker 7: Vance and the President the history he is a board
Speaker 7: leader for three years, the history of his going back
Speaker 7: to twenty fourteen, the two Minsk Agreement signed that Vladimir
Speaker 7: Putin after invading his country did not live up to,
Speaker 7: and trying to explain to them why they cannot trust
Speaker 7: or he cannot trust Putin to live up to an
Speaker 7: agreement now, and then you hear JD. Vance come in
Speaker 7: like a quite frankly, like he was talking to one
Speaker 7: of his young children or something, berating Zelenski. And then
Speaker 7: of course Donald Trump jumped right into that. And you
Speaker 7: know the reality is is that this is going to
Speaker 7: be very very tough to repair. It doesn't mean we
Speaker 7: won't get that rare earth mineral deal, but this goes
Speaker 7: so far beyond that. And I think one thing to
Speaker 7: watch for here is can Marco Rubio and Waltz, who
Speaker 7: are more interventionist in the traditional sense, walk Donald Trump
Speaker 7: off the ledge here and walk this back and get
Speaker 7: this deal back on track. I don't know if it's possible,
Speaker 7: but there is a big division in this administration between
Speaker 7: those who are non interventionists like JD. Vansho, by the way,
Speaker 7: in the Senate did not support aid for Ukraine, and
Speaker 7: those like Rubio and Waltz. And we have to see
Speaker 7: if they can bring Donald Trump back to the idea
Speaker 7: that a deal on the rare mineral or earth minerals
Speaker 7: would be give us a leg up economically, and then
Speaker 7: that would sort of, you know, lay the groundwork for
Speaker 7: them to move forward with a potentially relationship to be
Speaker 7: built on with Zelensky. But very very tough for Zolensky,
Speaker 7: three years at war, so many people dead, in displaced,
Speaker 7: to have to listen to the Vice president demanding that
Speaker 7: he be more express more gratitude and quite frankly the ahistorical,
Speaker 7: you know, renditions of what has happened in his own country, well.
Speaker 9: To Genie's point, Rick be as we consider the cast
Speaker 9: of characters here beyond just the President and Vice president,
Speaker 9: Secretary of State Marco Rubio, national Security Advisor Mike Waltz,
Speaker 9: those who are more hawkish in Congress, who have long
Speaker 9: supported Ukraine. I'm thinking here, Senators Lindsay Graham and others.
Speaker 9: Do you expect a collective voice here could come to
Speaker 9: check the impulses of the President and Vice president on
Speaker 9: this one, or is it ultimately what they say that
Speaker 9: will go because President Trump is suggesting he's communicating directly
Speaker 9: with Vladimir Putin.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I think that's a very good question, Kaylee. What
Speaker 6: the net effect is going to be with the President's
Speaker 6: leaders in Republican Party who are, as you describe them,
Speaker 6: more hawkish toward the Kremlin. So we've not seen much
Speaker 6: evidence of that, although many of them did come out
Speaker 6: and vocally reinforced the fact that when the President called
Speaker 6: Zelensky a dictator, they pushed back on that and made
Speaker 6: it clear that Vladimir Putin's the dictator. So that being said,
Speaker 6: they have not been. Congress has not played even a
Speaker 6: marginal role in the peace process, if you want to
Speaker 6: call it that. After today, and so I can't imagine
Speaker 6: anybody's going to want to stick their neck out too
Speaker 6: soon after this debacle to see where it goes from here.
Speaker 6: So I think everyone's going to wind up taking a
Speaker 6: big step back and assess the damage in our relationships
Speaker 6: that this will result from the relationship with our ally
Speaker 6: the Ukraine's NATO members, and what their reaction to this
Speaker 6: is going to be other members of our global partners
Speaker 6: and allies that we have who see this Ukraine war
Speaker 6: as a microcosm of conflicts around the world that could
Speaker 6: be to come. And this is obviously going to fan
Speaker 6: a lot of insecurity in every corner of the world
Speaker 6: after today.
Speaker 5: If you're just joining us on Bloomberg TV and radio,
Speaker 5: we were supposed to be bringing you a joint news
Speaker 5: conference between Trump and Zelenski at this time it has
Speaker 5: been canceled after a meeting in the Oval office turned
Speaker 5: sour voice as we're raised, an argument was had, and frankly,
Speaker 5: it's unclear exactly where this relationship is going and what
Speaker 5: the status of talks are with Ukraine and with Russia.
Speaker 5: We are spending time with our signature panel right now,
Speaker 5: Rick Davis and Genie Shanzeno as we try to get
Speaker 5: our heads around everything that just happened. Here, Rick, what
Speaker 5: takes place now that President Zelenski has left the White House,
Speaker 5: the Diplomatic Corps, national Security Advisor have to hash out
Speaker 5: what might be the next step here? What do you expect?
Speaker 6: Yeah, I'm sure the team is meeting right now in
Speaker 6: the Oval Office with the President of the United States,
Speaker 6: the National Security Advisor, and other leadership within the White House,
Speaker 6: those who attended the meeting and those who have responsibilities
Speaker 6: for the various branches of service that will be involved
Speaker 6: normally in an event like this with a country as
Speaker 6: close as we are to Ukraine. And the real question
Speaker 6: is where do you go from here? How do you
Speaker 6: look at a trajectory that Donald Trump clearly had a
Speaker 6: plan right He has been talking directly to Vladimir Putin,
Speaker 6: creating an opening, massaging egos in the Kremlin to get
Speaker 6: them to a place where he thinks he could get
Speaker 6: a deal, you know, probably managing some of his public
Speaker 6: statements about Ukraine with that in mind, which has strained
Speaker 6: the relationship with Ukraine, but otherwise has resulted in what
Speaker 6: we thought was going to be the first step an
Speaker 6: agreement to give US access to rarers in order to
Speaker 6: in essence payback some of the money that we've invested
Speaker 6: in the Ukraine effort that's now shot. The real question
Speaker 6: is too to me that Vladimir Lensky and his team
Speaker 6: will meet back, probably at the hotel right across the
Speaker 6: Lafayette Plaza from the White House, you can see one
Speaker 6: from the other, and they're going to have to assess
Speaker 6: do they stay in Washington, do they get on a
Speaker 6: plane and leave. Do they continue to hold interviews and
Speaker 6: press availabilities that are currently scheduled, or do they take
Speaker 6: those off the schedule. Look, this was not a good
Speaker 6: day for either individual. You know, Vladimir Zelensky came to
Speaker 6: an Oval office visit knowing Donald Trump well and knowing
Speaker 6: that he has an explosive and erratic personality sometimes And
Speaker 6: I don't put any of this on Zelensky, but his
Speaker 6: reactions didn't result in a meeting that was constructive either,
Speaker 6: And so both teams are assessing that to this minute
Speaker 6: to determine where they go from here.
Speaker 9: I think we had all drawn this conclusion already, but
Speaker 9: Bloomberg is now confirming with sources familiar that the US
Speaker 9: and Ukraine did not sign that mineral steel today. They
Speaker 9: failed to sign the agreement on Natural Resources Genie. It's
Speaker 9: also worth pointing out as we have just seen now
Speaker 9: a third world leader leaving the White House this week.
Speaker 9: This follows a meeting which by all accounts seemed to
Speaker 9: be successful between President Trump and the UK Prime Minister
Speaker 9: cair Starmer yesterday, a similar one with the French President
Speaker 9: Emmanuel Crone mcrone on Monday. Where is Europe in all
Speaker 9: of this, having just had those meetings, having those two countries,
Speaker 9: having pledged support for peacekeeping troops, if a deal is
Speaker 9: ultimately agreed to, what, how are our allies likely viewing
Speaker 9: what went down today?
Speaker 7: Well, they have to just be as stunned as we
Speaker 7: all are. I mean, this was supposed to be to
Speaker 7: your point, Kelly, the book end of this week of
Speaker 7: meetings that started off with McCrone and Starmer and seemed
Speaker 7: at least on the face of them, to have been
Speaker 7: pretty successful in terms of, you know, trying to pull
Speaker 7: Donald Trump over to the recognition that the United States
Speaker 7: has a role to play in securing the future of Ukraine.
Speaker 7: And that is obviously not you know, not at all.
Speaker 7: What we've seen go on here, and I do think
Speaker 7: we have to think long and hard now about this deal.
Speaker 7: This deal was first broached by Zelensky last year. It
Speaker 7: seems to have been Waltz and Rubio who tried to
Speaker 7: bring it up again as a means to get Donald
Speaker 7: Trump on board, because we know he likes to make
Speaker 7: deals and this would allow us to get as many
Speaker 7: rare earth minerals maybe as China, or at least move
Speaker 7: in that direction. But all along the way he has
Speaker 7: been no friend of Vladimir Zelensky or Ukraine. And of
Speaker 7: course now he has a vice president who has long
Speaker 7: expressed consternation about our support of Ukraine. So you know,
Speaker 7: as we watch this go down, I am not so
Speaker 7: sure that it is going to be resurrected quite as
Speaker 7: easily as some people think. Because for Donald Trump, this is,
Speaker 7: you know, a sense that he has long had that
Speaker 7: there are points at which Vladimir Putin has spoken that
Speaker 7: he reiterates often, and he has a very very different
Speaker 7: view of the war in Ukraine than the United States
Speaker 7: have express prior.
Speaker 5: Jenny Schanzino and Rick Davis, our signature panel Bloomberg Politics
Speaker 5: contributors on a Breaking news Friday here in Washington, d C.
Speaker 5: I'm Joe Matthew alongside Kaylee Liones. We want to bring
Speaker 5: you back to the White House right now. You just
Speaker 5: saw President Zelenski's suv with a van carrying the Ukrainian
Speaker 5: delegation head right down the driveway out of the complex,
Speaker 5: as Rick said, across Lafayette Park to the hay Adams Hotel.
Speaker 5: They drove right by our tent on the north lawn
Speaker 5: where we find Bloomberg's Tyler Kendall right now with the
Speaker 5: latest what else is going on there?
Speaker 14: Tyler, Well, Joe. Just to stark difference from when Zalinski
Speaker 14: arrived at the White House this morning, he was greeted
Speaker 14: by an honor guard. Fifty six service members carrying flags
Speaker 14: of each of the US states and territories greeted him.
Speaker 14: I watched him and President Trump have that handshake right
Speaker 14: in front of the West Wing, and then just how
Speaker 14: quickly this has evolved. I mean, waiting for Zelenski to
Speaker 14: come out here on the White House North lawn, every
Speaker 14: reporter came out. You could hear a pin drop as
Speaker 14: we waited for that door to open. Ultimately with Zelenski
Speaker 14: coming out, not answering any of our questions. We also
Speaker 14: saw the rest of his delegation pile into their vans
Speaker 14: as they slowly drove out of these Northwest gates right
Speaker 14: behind me. So big developments about what happens here next.
Speaker 14: We're waiting to see if we get any additional information
Speaker 14: from this White House, if they're going to brief US
Speaker 14: reporters about what the next steps are coming. But Bloomberg
Speaker 14: News confirming that that critical minerals deal was not signed,
Speaker 14: something that President Trump said was critical for the US
Speaker 14: to move forward when it comes to negotiations to end
Speaker 14: this war in Ukraine.
Speaker 9: All right, Bloomberg's Tyler Kendall live at the White House
Speaker 9: on a historic day. I think we can all say
Speaker 9: thank you so much. And we want to add the
Speaker 9: voice now of Kelly Griico, senior fellow with the Stimpson
Speaker 9: Centers Reimagining US Grand Strategy program with us here on
Speaker 9: Bloomberg TV and Radio. Kelly, we have been checking in
Speaker 9: with you throughout the duration of this war, which is now,
Speaker 9: of course, in its fourth year. And we should all
Speaker 9: bear in mind that the President Zelensky, who we just
Speaker 9: saw leave the White House is also leading a country
Speaker 9: who is still actively at war, and I wonder how
Speaker 9: this scene playing out in Vladimir Putin obviously going to
Speaker 9: be able to bear witness to this, impacts what will
Speaker 9: actually be happening on the ground and how things move
Speaker 9: forward from here.
Speaker 15: Yes, well, thank you for having me. I will say
Speaker 15: it's a little speechless having just watch what happened. I
Speaker 15: think the good news, if there is ending at the moment,
Speaker 15: is that just in the last few days, the Ukrainian
Speaker 15: government has said publicly that they're able to sustain themselves
Speaker 15: in terms of funds, equipment, and ammunition for at least
Speaker 15: the first half of this year, so there won't be
Speaker 15: an immediate impact on the battlefield in terms of material shortages.
Speaker 15: The only thing I can anticipate if there, for some
Speaker 15: reason the United States cut them off of information intelligence sharing.
Speaker 15: We've been providing a lot of ISR intelligence, surveillance, reconnaissance
Speaker 15: information that helps the Ukrainians with targeting, and if that
Speaker 15: was to be cut off, or if they were lose
Speaker 15: access to Starlink, which of course is a Musk company,
Speaker 15: that would have a major impact.
Speaker 5: It's pretty remarkable. To your point, Kelly, I never thought
Speaker 5: we'd be talking about a moment like this, everyone we're
Speaker 5: talking with is sharing the same sentiment that you have here.
Speaker 5: It's like that moment you can't believe you're getting into
Speaker 5: a fight or was it was that stagecraft? At the
Speaker 5: same time, this is a conversation that a lot of
Speaker 5: Donald Trump's supporters were probably looking forward to hearing and seeing,
Speaker 5: not fans of President Zelenski, and they don't think that
Speaker 5: he has been grateful enough.
Speaker 15: What's your thought, Yes, I mean, I will say that
Speaker 15: my interpretation of what happened is I see it as
Speaker 15: it looked to me like he was baited, To be honest,
Speaker 15: I think the administration was probably unhappy with his remarks
Speaker 15: at Munich, which was sort of a rebuke of the administration.
Speaker 15: I think they're concerned in the administration that Tolenski is
Speaker 15: an impediment to peace, that he is the hardest piece
Speaker 15: in some ways maybe to get peace, because he's he's
Speaker 15: still very stuck on ambitious goals for Ukraine that may
Speaker 15: not be realistic, and I think there's some probably desire
Speaker 15: to maybe publicly try to rain him in. And this
Speaker 15: seems to me like it was a tactic. It just
Speaker 15: seemed like sort of a setup right, because he didn't
Speaker 15: initiate this confrontation was initiated by you know, the Vice president.
Speaker 15: Zelenski did not handle this well. To be very clear,
Speaker 15: he fell for the bait, that's clear for sure. But
Speaker 15: I think that, you know, how this plays out, this
Speaker 15: is a risky strategy. How this plays out with the
Speaker 15: American public is going to be very interesting because on
Speaker 15: the one hand, there's this sense that Zlenskay has maybe
Speaker 15: not been sufficiently grateful, uh, and you know that we've
Speaker 15: done a lot, but it also looks a little bit
Speaker 15: like the President is, you know, publicly humiliating a wartime
Speaker 15: democratic leader of another country. And so how that plays
Speaker 15: out it is hard to say.
Speaker 3: Uh, but this.
Speaker 15: Is a This is clearly a very bad, bad moment.
Speaker 15: And I think the real the real sign to me
Speaker 15: will be whether Zelensky stays in DC or not and
Speaker 15: there's a second meeting, or if he ends up going home.
Speaker 9: Well, I guess we're all waiting to find out. Meantime,
Speaker 9: you're seeing plenty of reaction pouring in on social media,
Speaker 9: Kelly the Prime Minister of Poland, Donald Tusk saying dear Zelensky,
Speaker 9: tagging him on Twitter, dear your Ukrainian friends, you are
Speaker 9: not alone. And with that said, Kelly, we just have
Speaker 9: a minute left here. But even if the US were
Speaker 9: to say, all right, we're done with Ukraine now all
Speaker 9: of our backing is gone, is Europe able to step
Speaker 9: in to fill that void.
Speaker 15: They can fill a lot of voids, but there are
Speaker 15: certain niche capabilities like patriot interceptors, face based capabilities that
Speaker 15: are not they're not able to replace that. Only the
Speaker 15: United States has those.
Speaker 5: It's great to have you with us, Kelly Griico, Senior Fellow,
Speaker 5: Stimson Center Reimagining US Grant Strategy Program, one of many
Speaker 5: voices of experience we've brought to you over the past
Speaker 5: couple of hours here on Bloomberg TV and Radio.
Speaker 9: Yeah, we do know that President Lensky and the Ukrainian
Speaker 9: delegation have left the White House, but they have not
Speaker 9: yet left Washington, nor have they made plans to expedite
Speaker 9: that process to our knowledge at least, though they did
Speaker 9: not at least at this time sign that natural resources
Speaker 9: deal with the United States again. That is what was
Speaker 9: supposed to happen today. We were expecting to see it
Speaker 9: in fact at this hour, and that of course is
Speaker 9: not moving forward, as President Trump is suggesting that Vladimir's
Speaker 9: Lensky today is gambling with World War three.
Speaker 5: We heard some pretty wild rhetoric together. That's what you
Speaker 5: could expect on this program every day from Washington, d C.
Speaker 5: Will bring it to you unfiltered and live when we can,
Speaker 5: and we'll let you know what's going on when we
Speaker 5: get back together. Thanks for listening to the Balance of
Speaker 5: Power podcast. Make sure to subscribe if you haven't already,
Speaker 5: at Apple, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts, and
Speaker 5: you can find us live every weekday from Washington, DC
Speaker 5: at noontime Eastern at Bloomberg dot com.