WEBVTT - Reconfiguring the Democratic Party

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<v Speaker 1>Good morning, peeps, and welcome to wik f Daily with

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<v Speaker 1>Meet your Girl Daniel Moody, recording from the Home Bunker, Folks.

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<v Speaker 1>Yesterday was the oral arguments being heard in the Scrammatic

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<v Speaker 1>case at the Supreme Court that are going to decide

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<v Speaker 1>transgender rights in this country. The case is being argued

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<v Speaker 1>by and openly trans attorney Chase Strangio with the ACLU.

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<v Speaker 1>And you know, with this six to three court that

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<v Speaker 1>we have, we can already predict what is going to

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<v Speaker 1>happen here. But what it got me thinking about is

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<v Speaker 1>humanity and that when will there come a time when

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<v Speaker 1>human beings are allowed to just be, to just exist,

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<v Speaker 1>free from oppression, from persecution, free from the opinions of

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<v Speaker 1>nine unelected black robes to decide whether or not you

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<v Speaker 1>deserve dignity and respect and a full and complete and

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<v Speaker 1>abundant and beautiful life. And I say this to you,

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<v Speaker 1>and I'm kind of choking up a bit because it

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<v Speaker 1>never ends. The targets just change, but it never ends.

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<v Speaker 1>And I think about Brown versus the Board of Education,

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<v Speaker 1>and I think about Plusy versus Ferguson, and I think

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<v Speaker 1>about the dread Scott decision, and I think about being

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<v Speaker 1>label three fifths of a human being. And I think

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<v Speaker 1>about all of the decisions that are made largely by

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<v Speaker 1>unelected bodies that get to decide whose body is worthy

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<v Speaker 1>and whose is not, and that for so long, those

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<v Speaker 1>that sat on high were straight white men making the

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<v Speaker 1>decisions about other people's bodies and their humanities, and nothing

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<v Speaker 1>has really changed. Sure, there are a couple of women

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<v Speaker 1>that are on the court and two people of color,

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<v Speaker 1>but really only one because we all know Clarence Thomas

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<v Speaker 1>hates himself and hates black people. But it just it

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<v Speaker 1>never stops. And so I think about being there as

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<v Speaker 1>a trans person and arguing about your right to exist,

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<v Speaker 1>your right to take hormones, right to identify in the

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<v Speaker 1>way that you choose. Why is it so hard? I

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<v Speaker 1>really don't understand why it is so hard, As Tim

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<v Speaker 1>Wall said, to mind your own fucking business. What does

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<v Speaker 1>a transperson taking hormones have to do with me if

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<v Speaker 1>I'm not the one ingesting them. What does someone marrying

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<v Speaker 1>someone of the same sex have to do with me

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<v Speaker 1>and my life if nobody is forcing me to marry.

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<v Speaker 1>Why can't we just acknowledge people as human beings worthy

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<v Speaker 1>of dignity and respect for no other reason than they

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<v Speaker 1>were born. I don't think that I'll ever live inside

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<v Speaker 1>of that world, but I really do hope that somebody does.

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<v Speaker 1>Coming up next my conversation with our friend, our in

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<v Speaker 1>house doctor, doctor Jonathan Metzel, offering up his reflections on

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<v Speaker 1>the last four years of our weekly conversations on WOKF

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<v Speaker 1>that have been such a guiding light for me through

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<v Speaker 1>some really dark times. And I'm just so grateful and

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<v Speaker 1>appreciative that Jonathan will be closing out the year with

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<v Speaker 1>us and with this show, and we will, dear friends,

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<v Speaker 1>have some exciting news on the horizon, because you know,

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<v Speaker 1>new space, new opportunities is what is coming our way.

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<v Speaker 1>So coming up next that conversation with our friend Jonathan Metzel, Folks,

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<v Speaker 1>I am always very pleased when I have the opportunity

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<v Speaker 1>to speak with our in house doctor, doctor Jonathan Metzel

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<v Speaker 1>as we close out Jonathan WOKEF at the end of

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<v Speaker 1>this year. I guess one of the first questions that

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<v Speaker 1>I want to ask you today, as I'm very much

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<v Speaker 1>in reflection mode as many people are, that's kind of

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<v Speaker 1>what the end of the year brings. We've been in

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<v Speaker 1>conversation for the last four years on a weekly basis

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<v Speaker 1>for four years, and we have been through a lot

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<v Speaker 1>during that time, and I guess I want to ask you, like,

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<v Speaker 1>what has stood out to you during this time of

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<v Speaker 1>less being in conversation during a global health pandemic and

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<v Speaker 1>insurrection like multiple One cannot count the amount of mass

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<v Speaker 1>shootings that we've talked about.

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<v Speaker 2>It was really that we realized that we were having

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<v Speaker 2>a conversation that wasn't happening in a lot of other places.

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<v Speaker 2>I think you know, you and I started talking during

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<v Speaker 2>the intense period of the pandemic, and we realized that

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<v Speaker 2>there just wasn't a space for like not just factual information,

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<v Speaker 2>but like processing everything that was happening and thinking about

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<v Speaker 2>how the frameworks that we bring to all this crazy

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<v Speaker 2>shit would help us understand and articulate it. And so,

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<v Speaker 2>I don't know, our conversation has felt like really honest,

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<v Speaker 2>because it's in part like, hey, why isn't the information

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<v Speaker 2>getting out, which is going to be even more important

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<v Speaker 2>as we destroy our information networks in society, But also

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<v Speaker 2>it's just felt very super validating in that way. And

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<v Speaker 2>so for me, what's stood out more than anything is

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<v Speaker 2>the emotional resonance of having these conversations and how important

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<v Speaker 2>that's been, and it's felt really honest, honestly, and so

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<v Speaker 2>for me that's I'm very very grateful. It's actually been

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<v Speaker 2>very personally meaning for me. Also.

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<v Speaker 1>You know, it's really interesting that you bring up the

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<v Speaker 1>word honest, because as we're reflecting and still unpacking what

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<v Speaker 1>has happened over the last couple of weeks since the

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<v Speaker 1>election and as we move into this transitional period of

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<v Speaker 1>the Trump regime, one of the things that keep coming

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<v Speaker 1>up with regard to people's distrust in corporate mainstream media

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<v Speaker 1>is the fact that they don't believe that they're being

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<v Speaker 1>told the truth. That one of the reasons why Donald Trump,

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<v Speaker 1>of all people, has resonated is because he bucks systems

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<v Speaker 1>and people feel like he is authentic. And I want

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<v Speaker 1>to ask you about like our feelings around authenticity and

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<v Speaker 1>actual authenticity, because we all know, for instance, that Donald

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<v Speaker 1>Trump is an habitual liar. We all know that mainstream

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<v Speaker 1>corporate media gave up on fact checking him many years ago.

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<v Speaker 1>But the fact is is that people still feel like

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<v Speaker 1>the media is lying to them, but Donald Trump is

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<v Speaker 1>telling them the truth. Can you help us understand why

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<v Speaker 1>that is?

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<v Speaker 2>Well, there's an olviator saying one man's authenticity is another

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<v Speaker 2>man's potato pancake. No, I just made that up.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm like a lot. No.

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<v Speaker 2>You know, there's a trick of a salesman, which is

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<v Speaker 2>to make people feel like they're being heard and then

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<v Speaker 2>twist that toward whatever. I mean, that's what politicians do,

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<v Speaker 2>and for whatever reason, Trump is exceptionally good at that, right.

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<v Speaker 2>In other words, people feel heard when he's in a rally.

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<v Speaker 2>People feel like he's connecting and talking to them. And

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<v Speaker 2>it's a moment now where people want they want their

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<v Speaker 2>anger reflected, they want their frustration reflected. You know, you

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<v Speaker 2>and I talked right when Kamala Harris became the nominee

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<v Speaker 2>about whether joy was going to sell, whether happiness was

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<v Speaker 2>to sumble, and I said at the time, I hope

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<v Speaker 2>that's the case, but I don't think it's going to

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<v Speaker 2>be the case, just because we're not. In a moment.

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<v Speaker 2>People want their anger or frustrations acknowledged. And Trump, for

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<v Speaker 2>all of his messed upness, is incredibly good at that. Right.

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<v Speaker 2>He's incredibly good at like feeling the room. It's not

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<v Speaker 2>like he stands for one thing. He can feel a

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<v Speaker 2>room and tell people what they want to hear. There

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<v Speaker 2>are democratic politicians who do that. So if we were

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<v Speaker 2>going to play that game, Kambala Harris would not have

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<v Speaker 2>been our nominee. You know, she's somebody who sounds like

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<v Speaker 2>an insider, and so, you know, everything else aside, it

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<v Speaker 2>was an election of two very different affects in a way.

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<v Speaker 2>So so I mean, I guess the question is is

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<v Speaker 2>that going to be the case whenever we have our

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<v Speaker 2>next election in twenty seven years or something like that.

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<v Speaker 2>But I can't say that Trump is very good at mirroring,

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<v Speaker 2>amplifying people's anger and rage and then twisting at prison thing,

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<v Speaker 2>which is again what good salespeople do. And given that

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<v Speaker 2>that was the tone of this moment, everything else aside,

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<v Speaker 2>Kamal Hairs was not that right. She was somebody who

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<v Speaker 2>sounds like an institutional luster or something like that. So

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<v Speaker 2>there are two very different frameworks.

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<v Speaker 1>My thing is that because here's what Democrats are really

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<v Speaker 1>good at and what they're doing right now, which is

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<v Speaker 1>just a ton of finger pointing, a ton of finger pointing,

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<v Speaker 1>a ton of complaining and just doing the same things

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<v Speaker 1>over and over again and expecting a different result. Donald

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<v Speaker 1>Trump and Maga upended the political norms ten years ago,

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<v Speaker 1>and we're still grappling with like what that means, understanding

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<v Speaker 1>what that means as we're getting ready to go now

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<v Speaker 1>into a new wave that is now going to finish

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<v Speaker 1>the job that began in twenty seventeen to decimate our institutions,

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<v Speaker 1>to decimate credibility. And in that time span, it's as

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<v Speaker 1>if democratic not even as if they haven't learned anything.

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<v Speaker 1>And so while people are still saying, oh, well, Kamala

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<v Speaker 1>Harris sounded like an institutionalist, is that because she was coherent?

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<v Speaker 1>Is that because she showed that she understood how government works?

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<v Speaker 1>And what people want right now is just to break things.

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<v Speaker 1>I guess that's what I'm trying to understand. Because if

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<v Speaker 1>you're talking about this vibe check of somebody ushering in

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<v Speaker 1>joy and truth versus somebody that says I'm going to

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<v Speaker 1>break everything and I'm going to make people pay for it,

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<v Speaker 1>and that being what resonated, I don't know how you

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<v Speaker 1>would ever combat that, because again, we're trying to operate

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<v Speaker 1>in a place of fact and information and Donald Trump

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<v Speaker 1>is not.

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<v Speaker 2>I was on a panel for NPR right before the election,

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<v Speaker 2>and it was with Rachel bit Kaffer, who was saying

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<v Speaker 2>we're wasting all our money on positive ads. We should

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<v Speaker 2>just be doing negative ads all the time, because that's

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<v Speaker 2>the only way to combat this. And I've thought a

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<v Speaker 2>lot about this. I mean, you know, that's what you

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<v Speaker 2>do when you lose. When you lose, you figure out,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, what the hell how do we not lose again?

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<v Speaker 2>And so we are quite good at that. But also

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<v Speaker 2>I do think that there's a post mortem that is

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<v Speaker 2>important right now, right, I mean, there are different They're

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<v Speaker 2>just decisions we have to make now about how to

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<v Speaker 2>go forward. And so I don't think finger pointing is

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<v Speaker 2>I mean, I wouldn't call it finger pointing. I think

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<v Speaker 2>that there's a post mortem that needs to happen that

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<v Speaker 2>is instructive about I want to know where we went wrong.

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<v Speaker 2>And so I don't know. I mean, I guess you're right,

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<v Speaker 2>like should we have hired should we have just put

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<v Speaker 2>up somebody? I mean, it's all relative. We lost, So

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<v Speaker 2>you tell me how do we go forward?

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<v Speaker 1>I mean I guess my question is, like, well, one,

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<v Speaker 1>I don't think that we're being honest. I don't think

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<v Speaker 1>that Democrats are being honest, and I don't think that

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<v Speaker 1>there is. Again, I think that you need to look

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<v Speaker 1>at quote unquote failure in a different way. Donald Trump

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<v Speaker 1>did not receive a mandate. He did not win overwhelmingly.

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<v Speaker 1>You're talking about like a percentage point. You're talking about

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<v Speaker 1>a handful of votes literally in a handful of states.

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<v Speaker 1>And so when you're competing with somebody that is telling

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<v Speaker 1>you that these people are to blame for your ills,

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<v Speaker 1>and I'm saying, no, they're not. It's actually the rich.

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<v Speaker 1>But that's not the message that Kamala Harris had. Her

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<v Speaker 1>message was We're going to reach across the aisle. I'm

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<v Speaker 1>going to put a Republican in my cabinet, but here

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<v Speaker 1>are the ways in which for black men, for Latino men,

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<v Speaker 1>I can make life better and offer up these different opportunities.

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<v Speaker 1>I think that people wanted a quick fix, and even

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<v Speaker 1>if that quick fix is a lie, that's what they

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<v Speaker 1>went for. And I wonder, though, in hindsight, if Kamala

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<v Speaker 1>Harris had just hammered home an economic message, which was

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<v Speaker 1>that the Biden administration didn't have anything to defend. We

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<v Speaker 1>have the best economy. You just saw. Of course, after

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<v Speaker 1>the election, Lois thanksgiving prices, Lois cost for dinner, like

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<v Speaker 1>jobs have returned all of these things. If you had

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<v Speaker 1>focused solely on that, on a progressive populist message as

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<v Speaker 1>opposed to linking arms with Republicans, that to me is

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<v Speaker 1>the only thing the message that should have been hammered

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<v Speaker 1>over and over and over again, and that wasn't. And

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<v Speaker 1>there was still this push to what no longer exists

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<v Speaker 1>as the center, which kind of made in some ways

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<v Speaker 1>Kamala Harris seem like Republican light.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Again, you know, it's just I mean, I guess

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<v Speaker 2>the question now is in response to the Democrats go

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<v Speaker 2>farther left or do they go toward the center?

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, this is there is no sense so that

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<v Speaker 1>like that's my argument now, is that like that is

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<v Speaker 1>a false question to ask because the center doesn't exist.

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<v Speaker 1>So you either continue to follow the extremists over a

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<v Speaker 1>cliff or you retain and reimagine what it is that

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<v Speaker 1>the progressive base actually wants.

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<v Speaker 2>I was reading an interesting article this morning that asked,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, would higher turnout have helped Kamala Harris? Was

0:14:25.760 --> 0:14:28.280
<v Speaker 2>this a question of turnout? And it's just funny because

0:14:28.280 --> 0:14:30.880
<v Speaker 2>it mirrored something that I've been thinking, which is it

0:14:31.000 --> 0:14:33.960
<v Speaker 2>just really felt like Republicans were playing by different rules

0:14:34.000 --> 0:14:37.760
<v Speaker 2>than we were for this election, and so there's something

0:14:37.800 --> 0:14:41.920
<v Speaker 2>about like winning hearts and minds. They were doing something else.

0:14:42.440 --> 0:14:44.920
<v Speaker 2>I don't know what it was, but yeah, I mean,

0:14:44.920 --> 0:14:46.640
<v Speaker 2>I hope you're right. I'm not gonna I'm not going

0:14:46.720 --> 0:14:48.440
<v Speaker 2>to push back except to say that I hope you're right.

0:14:48.440 --> 0:14:50.560
<v Speaker 2>I hope we get a chance to fix this. I

0:14:50.640 --> 0:14:52.920
<v Speaker 2>hope there's still a system in which we can fix this.

0:14:53.760 --> 0:14:55.440
<v Speaker 2>But let's see how that plays out.

0:14:57.440 --> 0:14:59.960
<v Speaker 1>I guess the fact is is that it isn't gonna

0:15:00.120 --> 0:15:03.440
<v Speaker 1>play out because I have said for the longest time,

0:15:03.440 --> 0:15:05.200
<v Speaker 1>and I hope to be wrong that I don't think

0:15:05.240 --> 0:15:07.560
<v Speaker 1>that we actually get another bite at the apple here.

0:15:07.880 --> 0:15:10.280
<v Speaker 1>Everyone wants to hold their breath and believe that there's

0:15:10.320 --> 0:15:12.720
<v Speaker 1>going to be an opportunity in mid terms. I'm going

0:15:12.760 --> 0:15:15.960
<v Speaker 1>to disagree with that statement. I don't think that there's

0:15:16.040 --> 0:15:18.280
<v Speaker 1>going to be an opportunity with midterms because I don't

0:15:18.280 --> 0:15:21.680
<v Speaker 1>think that we're having them. And so that being said,

0:15:22.360 --> 0:15:26.440
<v Speaker 1>if you have an entire now fascist maga movement that

0:15:26.560 --> 0:15:30.320
<v Speaker 1>has no guardrails, that is completely unleashed, the response to

0:15:30.360 --> 0:15:33.960
<v Speaker 1>that can't be centrist thinking. And I'm wondering in your

0:15:34.080 --> 0:15:38.920
<v Speaker 1>mind what it takes then for Democrats to realize that

0:15:39.000 --> 0:15:41.480
<v Speaker 1>they once again have been chasing the wrong dragon.

0:15:42.280 --> 0:15:44.840
<v Speaker 2>I mean again, the rules of everything, because of all

0:15:44.880 --> 0:15:48.040
<v Speaker 2>the dismantling that's about to happen, the rules are going

0:15:48.120 --> 0:15:51.560
<v Speaker 2>to be totally different. And so I do worry that

0:15:52.400 --> 0:15:55.720
<v Speaker 2>we have a lot of institutionalists who are still running

0:15:55.720 --> 0:15:58.160
<v Speaker 2>the party, and I think what we need right now

0:15:58.400 --> 0:16:01.440
<v Speaker 2>is outside the box people in a way. And so

0:16:02.040 --> 0:16:04.280
<v Speaker 2>I don't know, because I don't know there's some plan.

0:16:04.360 --> 0:16:06.760
<v Speaker 2>I mean, when you have somebody at the head of

0:16:06.840 --> 0:16:11.800
<v Speaker 2>the Department of Education and the FBI and every other

0:16:11.880 --> 0:16:16.400
<v Speaker 2>organization who's in place to basically destroy that organization as

0:16:16.400 --> 0:16:18.920
<v Speaker 2>it's been known and remake it, the rules are just

0:16:18.960 --> 0:16:21.360
<v Speaker 2>going to be totally different. And so I guess I

0:16:21.400 --> 0:16:24.240
<v Speaker 2>hope we have people who are nimble and force full

0:16:24.360 --> 0:16:27.960
<v Speaker 2>and bare knuckles enough to combat that. I just think

0:16:28.000 --> 0:16:30.640
<v Speaker 2>that the rules are different and we have to there's

0:16:30.640 --> 0:16:33.760
<v Speaker 2>something very responsive about it. So I'm not avoiding that question.

0:16:34.320 --> 0:16:36.800
<v Speaker 2>It's just we're about to create a new reality here.

0:16:37.400 --> 0:16:40.560
<v Speaker 2>I mean I feel it most deeply with health, for example.

0:16:41.000 --> 0:16:43.080
<v Speaker 2>I mean that's kind of where I'm consumed right now,

0:16:43.120 --> 0:16:48.200
<v Speaker 2>because dismantling all the health infrastructure that Kennedy and those

0:16:48.240 --> 0:16:50.840
<v Speaker 2>guys are going to do is going to be catastrophic

0:16:50.920 --> 0:16:53.200
<v Speaker 2>and it's going to create new realities. And so to

0:16:53.240 --> 0:16:54.840
<v Speaker 2>then say we just need to build things back the

0:16:54.880 --> 0:16:56.920
<v Speaker 2>way they were is not going to work.

0:16:59.040 --> 0:17:02.000
<v Speaker 1>I feel like we need to be like everything is

0:17:02.000 --> 0:17:04.960
<v Speaker 1>going to be dismantled, and to be honest, I'm in

0:17:05.000 --> 0:17:07.960
<v Speaker 1>a place where I am recognizing that they were never

0:17:08.040 --> 0:17:11.840
<v Speaker 1>created to work for all people anyway. So while there's

0:17:11.880 --> 0:17:15.120
<v Speaker 1>going to be a lot of pain and there's going

0:17:15.200 --> 0:17:16.720
<v Speaker 1>to be a lot of harm that is going to

0:17:16.800 --> 0:17:19.600
<v Speaker 1>be done, I really wish that Democrats would be in

0:17:19.600 --> 0:17:23.560
<v Speaker 1>a place of imagination rather than reaction to what it

0:17:23.640 --> 0:17:26.520
<v Speaker 1>is that Republicans are going to do. Because the fact

0:17:26.680 --> 0:17:29.560
<v Speaker 1>is is that, like, if we're honest, this incremental shit

0:17:29.760 --> 0:17:33.360
<v Speaker 1>was not working. It doesn't work. People are still you're

0:17:33.400 --> 0:17:38.000
<v Speaker 1>talking about healthcare paying astronomical premiums. People are still having

0:17:38.080 --> 0:17:40.640
<v Speaker 1>to come out of pocket for costs that like the

0:17:40.920 --> 0:17:45.240
<v Speaker 1>insurance refuses to cover. So there are so many things

0:17:45.520 --> 0:17:48.040
<v Speaker 1>and for one me, being a person that pays for

0:17:48.080 --> 0:17:51.119
<v Speaker 1>their health insurance out of pocket, are strapped with so

0:17:51.240 --> 0:17:55.440
<v Speaker 1>many fucking costs that I'm like, so you get rid

0:17:55.480 --> 0:17:58.040
<v Speaker 1>of it. Yes, there's going to be a ton of pain,

0:17:58.160 --> 0:18:00.880
<v Speaker 1>but like, when are democrats ever going to move from

0:18:00.880 --> 0:18:03.520
<v Speaker 1>a place of creation rather than a place of reaction?

0:18:04.000 --> 0:18:07.879
<v Speaker 1>And I just don't know. It's still this dismantling is

0:18:07.960 --> 0:18:09.359
<v Speaker 1>going to be that aha moment.

0:18:10.240 --> 0:18:14.000
<v Speaker 2>It's just interesting, you know, because the health infrastructure that

0:18:14.040 --> 0:18:17.959
<v Speaker 2>we have is based on like shared cooperation. You know,

0:18:18.080 --> 0:18:22.560
<v Speaker 2>vaccines and public health and smoking bands and seat belts,

0:18:22.560 --> 0:18:26.120
<v Speaker 2>all these things work by people like cooperating. And that's

0:18:26.520 --> 0:18:28.600
<v Speaker 2>not the world we're about to enter. The world We're

0:18:28.760 --> 0:18:32.280
<v Speaker 2>about to enter as a very health libertarian moment from

0:18:32.359 --> 0:18:35.919
<v Speaker 2>a public health perspective, but also a financial perspective, and

0:18:36.040 --> 0:18:38.679
<v Speaker 2>so on the new show. Let's keep talking about this

0:18:38.720 --> 0:18:41.320
<v Speaker 2>because I think what health becomes, I think is going

0:18:41.359 --> 0:18:45.879
<v Speaker 2>to be incredibly, incredibly important, as many of these things are.

0:18:45.960 --> 0:18:47.639
<v Speaker 2>And I just I guess I agree with you that

0:18:47.720 --> 0:18:50.359
<v Speaker 2>we need people who are creative and who are setting

0:18:50.359 --> 0:18:54.240
<v Speaker 2>the agenda, not people who are trying to recreate the

0:18:54.280 --> 0:18:55.520
<v Speaker 2>past that's that's gone.

0:18:55.760 --> 0:18:58.480
<v Speaker 1>Because that's where I feel like democrats are right now

0:18:58.560 --> 0:19:01.360
<v Speaker 1>and where they continue to be, which is why at

0:19:01.359 --> 0:19:04.639
<v Speaker 1>this stage in my political career. I'm saying that it

0:19:04.720 --> 0:19:08.400
<v Speaker 1>is time to have real, honest conversations about a viable

0:19:08.440 --> 0:19:11.199
<v Speaker 1>third party because I do not think that Democrats are

0:19:11.240 --> 0:19:13.680
<v Speaker 1>here to meet this moment. I think that they are

0:19:13.800 --> 0:19:16.959
<v Speaker 1>fine with the way that things are and just ticking

0:19:17.000 --> 0:19:20.080
<v Speaker 1>away at that. And what Donald Trump is offering is

0:19:20.160 --> 0:19:23.520
<v Speaker 1>to destroy it. And I think that that is why people,

0:19:24.040 --> 0:19:28.240
<v Speaker 1>you know, the racism, the deep seated racism and misogyny.

0:19:28.600 --> 0:19:32.040
<v Speaker 1>In addition, I also think people are sitting back and saying,

0:19:32.040 --> 0:19:34.960
<v Speaker 1>you know what, this shit still doesn't work. It still

0:19:35.000 --> 0:19:37.439
<v Speaker 1>doesn't work for me. And so if he's coming in

0:19:37.480 --> 0:19:40.240
<v Speaker 1>with a sledgehammer, maybe that's what is needed.

0:19:40.720 --> 0:19:43.040
<v Speaker 2>Well. You know, the risk of a third party, though,

0:19:43.040 --> 0:19:46.439
<v Speaker 2>in our system, is that you just become a permanent opposition.

0:19:46.800 --> 0:19:49.359
<v Speaker 2>People always ask me, like, how could people support Trump

0:19:49.480 --> 0:19:53.679
<v Speaker 2>when he's you know, obviously abcd all these horrible things.

0:19:54.200 --> 0:19:57.679
<v Speaker 2>But you know, when Obama was president, the Republican Party

0:19:57.760 --> 0:20:01.520
<v Speaker 2>was in many places being kicked and the proverbial scrotum

0:20:01.960 --> 0:20:08.160
<v Speaker 2>and Trump came in and said, I said, proverbial, I apologize, yes,

0:20:08.800 --> 0:20:10.640
<v Speaker 2>And Trump came in and for all of his shit,

0:20:10.720 --> 0:20:12.800
<v Speaker 2>he said, like, we're going to win here's my model

0:20:12.800 --> 0:20:15.439
<v Speaker 2>for winning or something like that. And even though it

0:20:15.600 --> 0:20:19.280
<v Speaker 2>was wrapped in horrible bacon and it was all these

0:20:19.320 --> 0:20:23.600
<v Speaker 2>things and problematic, but people got addicted to like being

0:20:23.640 --> 0:20:26.600
<v Speaker 2>on the winning side again. And so you know, it

0:20:26.720 --> 0:20:29.280
<v Speaker 2>was strong man, maybe fall strong man, all these kind

0:20:29.359 --> 0:20:33.240
<v Speaker 2>of things, but it was like he was promising retribution

0:20:33.600 --> 0:20:36.920
<v Speaker 2>and victory and cleaning house and all these kind of things.

0:20:37.400 --> 0:20:39.000
<v Speaker 2>And so the question will be, is there going to

0:20:39.040 --> 0:20:41.879
<v Speaker 2>be somebody who emerges on the Democratic side who presents

0:20:42.400 --> 0:20:43.919
<v Speaker 2>a new model of winning.

0:20:44.440 --> 0:20:47.159
<v Speaker 1>Ah uh huh, yep, this is the question.

0:20:47.680 --> 0:20:50.879
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, because because let's be honest, if Trump or somebody

0:20:50.920 --> 0:20:53.760
<v Speaker 2>like Trump had been like a liberal Democrat and said

0:20:54.119 --> 0:20:56.440
<v Speaker 2>I'm going to kick the crap out of the conservatives

0:20:56.480 --> 0:20:58.359
<v Speaker 2>and we're going to implement everything we ever dreamed of,

0:20:58.400 --> 0:21:00.520
<v Speaker 2>and we're going to control the courts, I think a

0:21:00.520 --> 0:21:03.679
<v Speaker 2>lot of liberals would have followed that person. Yep, you know,

0:21:04.000 --> 0:21:07.240
<v Speaker 2>given any kind of baggage, because he was basically saying,

0:21:07.640 --> 0:21:10.479
<v Speaker 2>I want to get you retribution over your enemies, but

0:21:10.520 --> 0:21:13.760
<v Speaker 2>also I'm going to blow up the system and recast

0:21:13.800 --> 0:21:16.040
<v Speaker 2>it in a way that we're going to be winning

0:21:16.080 --> 0:21:20.200
<v Speaker 2>for eons and stuff like that. And so it's crazy

0:21:20.240 --> 0:21:23.320
<v Speaker 2>that he pulled it off, honestly, But the Democrats need

0:21:23.359 --> 0:21:25.880
<v Speaker 2>a model of winning, and I just my concern about

0:21:25.920 --> 0:21:29.600
<v Speaker 2>a third party is that it becomes like another Green

0:21:29.680 --> 0:21:33.200
<v Speaker 2>Party or even another like Democratic Party or a very

0:21:33.240 --> 0:21:36.840
<v Speaker 2>far progressive party, something that is always critiquing what's happening.

0:21:37.040 --> 0:21:40.520
<v Speaker 1>But here's the thing. What we are facing right now

0:21:40.840 --> 0:21:47.760
<v Speaker 1>is a new Republican party. They absolutely rebranded, reconfigured, created

0:21:47.800 --> 0:21:52.280
<v Speaker 1>an entirely different ideology, created an entirely different mode. They

0:21:52.320 --> 0:21:58.120
<v Speaker 1>did it without quote unquote creating another Republican party. They

0:21:58.400 --> 0:22:04.280
<v Speaker 1>just deconstructed. And then I don't know what is it, Frankenstein,

0:22:04.720 --> 0:22:07.679
<v Speaker 1>the old party. And what I'm saying is that, like

0:22:07.960 --> 0:22:10.480
<v Speaker 1>if it isn't going to be a viable third party,

0:22:10.520 --> 0:22:14.800
<v Speaker 1>to your point, that just sits in opposition, Democrats do

0:22:14.920 --> 0:22:17.439
<v Speaker 1>need a new strategy for winning, and they need to

0:22:17.480 --> 0:22:20.560
<v Speaker 1>reconfigure the Democratic Party as it is.

0:22:22.080 --> 0:22:24.600
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, Okay, I agree, whatever it is. I just I

0:22:24.640 --> 0:22:26.919
<v Speaker 2>don't want to be like I just always think of

0:22:26.960 --> 0:22:29.640
<v Speaker 2>the cover of the Bernie Sanders book, where like Bernie

0:22:29.680 --> 0:22:32.240
<v Speaker 2>is like this, It's just like, yeah, we're going to

0:22:32.280 --> 0:22:36.960
<v Speaker 2>be protesting against authority forever. And I'd rather have somebody

0:22:37.000 --> 0:22:39.240
<v Speaker 2>like Trump who's like, actually, here's what we can do

0:22:39.440 --> 0:22:41.000
<v Speaker 2>to win in this new system.

0:22:41.240 --> 0:22:44.720
<v Speaker 1>So interesting. All right, well, we'll leave it there today.

0:22:45.560 --> 0:22:49.240
<v Speaker 1>But that is the what does a new strategy for

0:22:49.359 --> 0:22:51.720
<v Speaker 1>winning look like for the Democratic Party?

0:22:51.960 --> 0:22:53.680
<v Speaker 2>Which is not how we thought about That's how they've

0:22:53.720 --> 0:22:55.280
<v Speaker 2>thought about it. We thought about that.

0:22:55.560 --> 0:22:58.560
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, okay, well, thank you, my friend. We will leave

0:22:58.560 --> 0:23:02.639
<v Speaker 1>it there today and pick up next week. Always appreciate you.

0:23:05.000 --> 0:23:07.760
<v Speaker 1>That is it for me today. Dear friends on Woke

0:23:07.800 --> 0:23:12.080
<v Speaker 1>af AS, always, power to the people and to all

0:23:12.520 --> 0:23:16.240
<v Speaker 1>the people. Power, get woke and stay woke as fuck.