1 00:00:02,960 --> 00:00:07,280 Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, radio News. 2 00:00:08,400 --> 00:00:10,959 Speaker 2: This is Bloomberg Business of Sports. 3 00:00:11,119 --> 00:00:13,920 Speaker 3: Business of Sports can be intimidating for hard for a 4 00:00:13,960 --> 00:00:14,920 Speaker 3: start to break into. 5 00:00:15,040 --> 00:00:18,000 Speaker 4: We really appreciate when our owners are actually there, you know, 6 00:00:18,079 --> 00:00:19,600 Speaker 4: with us through the journey. 7 00:00:19,200 --> 00:00:22,920 Speaker 5: Teams ours especially then very intentional to diversify at all 8 00:00:23,000 --> 00:00:23,759 Speaker 5: levels of the company. 9 00:00:23,840 --> 00:00:26,239 Speaker 6: Maybe we're in the golden gears for the NFL and 10 00:00:26,360 --> 00:00:27,040 Speaker 6: college football. 11 00:00:27,120 --> 00:00:30,120 Speaker 4: Our demographic reach has continued to explode. 12 00:00:30,280 --> 00:00:33,880 Speaker 7: This is going to be really unlocking the streaming platform 13 00:00:33,960 --> 00:00:34,920 Speaker 7: for sports fans. 14 00:00:35,000 --> 00:00:37,480 Speaker 2: Sports evaluations arising. We'll see when they peak. 15 00:00:37,520 --> 00:00:40,120 Speaker 7: You don't have to be the best in your sports 16 00:00:40,159 --> 00:00:43,040 Speaker 7: to make a whole ton of money. 17 00:00:43,080 --> 00:00:46,280 Speaker 2: Bloomberg Business of Sports from Bloomberg Radio. 18 00:00:47,320 --> 00:00:49,800 Speaker 8: This is the Bloomberg Business of Sports show where we 19 00:00:49,840 --> 00:00:51,960 Speaker 8: explore the big money issues in the world of sports. 20 00:00:52,000 --> 00:00:54,840 Speaker 6: I'm Michael Blaher, I'm Scarlet Foox and Dimmian Sas hour 21 00:00:54,960 --> 00:00:59,880 Speaker 6: coming up, we're talking March Madness and the art of bracketology. 22 00:01:00,280 --> 00:01:03,560 Speaker 8: We speak with a professor of mathematics and computer science 23 00:01:03,600 --> 00:01:06,600 Speaker 8: to help us build the perfect bracket. 24 00:01:06,400 --> 00:01:09,320 Speaker 3: In our models. Rather than saying a game is worth 25 00:01:09,400 --> 00:01:12,839 Speaker 3: one game, we will upweight it both with time, saying 26 00:01:12,840 --> 00:01:15,280 Speaker 3: that as you move deeper in the season, closer to 27 00:01:15,319 --> 00:01:18,280 Speaker 3: March Madness, it's more predictive of how you'll play. And 28 00:01:18,319 --> 00:01:20,959 Speaker 3: then also if you win on the road or on 29 00:01:21,000 --> 00:01:23,600 Speaker 3: a neutral court, and in these models, it also means 30 00:01:23,640 --> 00:01:26,280 Speaker 3: that you're beating high quality teams at those times. That 31 00:01:26,360 --> 00:01:29,000 Speaker 3: actually does a good job of finding teams that sometimes 32 00:01:29,000 --> 00:01:29,960 Speaker 3: can be misseeded. 33 00:01:30,280 --> 00:01:32,480 Speaker 5: And a friend of the show is joining us. Bloomberg 34 00:01:32,520 --> 00:01:35,720 Speaker 5: Originals chief correspondent Jason Kelly stopping by to talk about 35 00:01:35,760 --> 00:01:37,759 Speaker 5: the latest episode of The Deal. 36 00:01:38,080 --> 00:01:41,320 Speaker 6: It's a new show from Bloomberg Originals. He hosts alongside 37 00:01:41,480 --> 00:01:44,800 Speaker 6: one Alex Rodriguez, and this week's guest is none other 38 00:01:45,440 --> 00:01:47,080 Speaker 6: than Derek Jeter. 39 00:01:46,959 --> 00:01:49,880 Speaker 8: Wo All that and more is coming up, but first, 40 00:01:49,920 --> 00:01:53,520 Speaker 8: The MLB kicked off this week in South Korea with 41 00:01:53,640 --> 00:01:55,760 Speaker 8: arguably the sports biggest star. 42 00:01:56,040 --> 00:01:58,880 Speaker 5: That would be Sho Heyo Tani. His Los Angeles Dodgers 43 00:01:58,880 --> 00:02:00,840 Speaker 5: were and sold this week for US special two game 44 00:02:00,960 --> 00:02:04,280 Speaker 5: series against the San Diego Padres. It was a glimpse 45 00:02:04,360 --> 00:02:08,160 Speaker 5: of how the MLB might try leveraging Otani's star power 46 00:02:08,160 --> 00:02:09,120 Speaker 5: on the global stage. 47 00:02:09,320 --> 00:02:12,440 Speaker 8: Bloomberg's Lucas Shaw has been keeping up with this and 48 00:02:12,680 --> 00:02:15,560 Speaker 8: he is here now, Lucas my man. Welcome to the 49 00:02:15,600 --> 00:02:16,960 Speaker 8: Bloomberg Business of Sports. 50 00:02:17,440 --> 00:02:18,240 Speaker 7: Thanks for having me. 51 00:02:18,320 --> 00:02:20,160 Speaker 8: Well, first, I'm going to get the elephant out of 52 00:02:20,160 --> 00:02:24,040 Speaker 8: the room. And if it is true, it is kind 53 00:02:24,080 --> 00:02:29,360 Speaker 8: of a shame show. Heyotani's best friend and interpreter apparently 54 00:02:29,440 --> 00:02:33,560 Speaker 8: now has been fired by the Dodgers because he is 55 00:02:33,600 --> 00:02:37,960 Speaker 8: accused of stealing money from show he Otani several million 56 00:02:38,080 --> 00:02:41,679 Speaker 8: dollars because of gambling debts. Can can you expand more 57 00:02:41,720 --> 00:02:41,920 Speaker 8: on that? 58 00:02:42,280 --> 00:02:42,560 Speaker 2: Yeah? 59 00:02:42,560 --> 00:02:45,399 Speaker 7: Look, I don't have a ton more to say than 60 00:02:45,440 --> 00:02:49,280 Speaker 7: what has been publicly reported other than this is just 61 00:02:49,320 --> 00:02:52,400 Speaker 7: about the worst start to the season that you could 62 00:02:52,440 --> 00:02:56,079 Speaker 7: imagine for the Dodgers for Otani from Major League Baseball. 63 00:02:56,639 --> 00:03:01,040 Speaker 7: You know, his signing attracted so much attention for him 64 00:03:01,080 --> 00:03:04,040 Speaker 7: in the sport, which was seen as this big positive. 65 00:03:04,040 --> 00:03:06,680 Speaker 7: They're playing these games and Soul their first games in Korea, 66 00:03:06,760 --> 00:03:10,040 Speaker 7: all part of baseball's plan to really build out its 67 00:03:10,080 --> 00:03:12,960 Speaker 7: fan bases worldwide and in Asia. And instead of the 68 00:03:13,000 --> 00:03:16,040 Speaker 7: conversation being about you know, the Dodgers and Padres, two 69 00:03:16,080 --> 00:03:19,360 Speaker 7: good teams playing and all the excitement and six different 70 00:03:19,360 --> 00:03:22,840 Speaker 7: players from Japan and South Korea, that right, before the 71 00:03:22,880 --> 00:03:26,680 Speaker 7: second game, everything becomes about Otani, and there's really no 72 00:03:26,919 --> 00:03:29,959 Speaker 7: way I can see this ending well because there's one 73 00:03:30,000 --> 00:03:33,040 Speaker 7: scenario where his interpreter and best friend has been stealing 74 00:03:33,040 --> 00:03:35,960 Speaker 7: from him to place all these bets, which is just, 75 00:03:36,320 --> 00:03:39,360 Speaker 7: you know, bad news. Or then there's the sort of 76 00:03:39,360 --> 00:03:42,760 Speaker 7: the more conspiratorial among us, who are convinced that, like 77 00:03:42,840 --> 00:03:45,880 Speaker 7: the whether it's the interpreter is a fall guy, or 78 00:03:45,920 --> 00:03:48,600 Speaker 7: there's a cover up, or there's something and none of 79 00:03:48,640 --> 00:03:50,920 Speaker 7: this is good. And I do find it a little bit. 80 00:03:51,040 --> 00:03:53,280 Speaker 7: I don't know if ironic or weird is the right word, 81 00:03:53,560 --> 00:03:56,960 Speaker 7: considering how much sports media has been shoving gambling down 82 00:03:57,000 --> 00:04:00,560 Speaker 7: our throat that it's gambling that's what gets these guys 83 00:04:00,560 --> 00:04:02,960 Speaker 7: in trouble, which yeah, I mean, we kind. 84 00:04:02,760 --> 00:04:04,880 Speaker 5: Of always knew, or at least I had this feeling 85 00:04:04,920 --> 00:04:07,720 Speaker 5: that there was going to be some big collision between 86 00:04:07,800 --> 00:04:11,640 Speaker 5: the fevered interest in sports gambling and professional athletes. 87 00:04:11,680 --> 00:04:13,440 Speaker 9: At some point the two would collide. 88 00:04:13,680 --> 00:04:15,720 Speaker 5: I just didn't expect it to be the biggest name 89 00:04:15,800 --> 00:04:18,880 Speaker 5: in baseball at this point. The start of the season, 90 00:04:19,400 --> 00:04:22,279 Speaker 5: you wrote about Shohio Atani in a Bloomberg Business Week story. 91 00:04:22,600 --> 00:04:25,039 Speaker 5: The thing about Otani is that he is pretty quiet. 92 00:04:25,080 --> 00:04:28,000 Speaker 5: It's not like he goes around putting himself out there. 93 00:04:28,080 --> 00:04:31,040 Speaker 5: He's really preferred to let his talent on the field 94 00:04:31,080 --> 00:04:34,200 Speaker 5: speak for itself. At some point he might need to 95 00:04:34,480 --> 00:04:39,239 Speaker 5: address this issue with his best friend, slash translators gambling debts. 96 00:04:40,120 --> 00:04:42,240 Speaker 5: What do we know about how willing he is to 97 00:04:42,279 --> 00:04:46,120 Speaker 5: talk about himself and reveal himself to the public. 98 00:04:46,680 --> 00:04:51,279 Speaker 7: He's been very guarded since he got the US, and 99 00:04:51,360 --> 00:04:54,799 Speaker 7: really before then, he didn't do a lot of press. 100 00:04:54,839 --> 00:04:57,480 Speaker 7: You know. The probably the one story that stand out 101 00:04:57,480 --> 00:05:00,760 Speaker 7: to everyone is he did grant access and spend some 102 00:05:00,839 --> 00:05:03,159 Speaker 7: time with this reporter for a GQ cover story a 103 00:05:03,200 --> 00:05:07,320 Speaker 7: couple of years ago. And he does do press after games, 104 00:05:07,360 --> 00:05:10,640 Speaker 7: not every game, and there are more limitations around access 105 00:05:10,680 --> 00:05:12,159 Speaker 7: to him in the locker room than others. You know, 106 00:05:12,200 --> 00:05:14,039 Speaker 7: I went to spring training earlier this year and I 107 00:05:14,040 --> 00:05:16,160 Speaker 7: got a press pass here and May said that when 108 00:05:16,240 --> 00:05:18,240 Speaker 7: the locker room is open that I could go up 109 00:05:18,279 --> 00:05:20,640 Speaker 7: and talk to anyone except for Showhy, which I took 110 00:05:20,680 --> 00:05:23,680 Speaker 7: as a sign. But he does scrums where you have 111 00:05:23,760 --> 00:05:26,680 Speaker 7: you know, forty people around him ask answering or excuse me, 112 00:05:26,760 --> 00:05:30,600 Speaker 7: asking questions, and he's going to do some press conferences. 113 00:05:30,880 --> 00:05:32,640 Speaker 7: I don't know how they're going to respond to this, 114 00:05:32,760 --> 00:05:35,440 Speaker 7: because compared to most athletes, he does not say as 115 00:05:35,520 --> 00:05:38,520 Speaker 7: much and he certainly divulges very little about himself, which 116 00:05:38,520 --> 00:05:41,040 Speaker 7: is why it became big news a few weeks ago 117 00:05:41,120 --> 00:05:43,360 Speaker 7: when he announced on Instagram that he had been married. 118 00:05:43,720 --> 00:05:46,400 Speaker 5: Yeah, and let's just mention as well that the translator, 119 00:05:46,600 --> 00:05:49,800 Speaker 5: Mizuhara is the one who helps translates his words when 120 00:05:49,839 --> 00:05:50,760 Speaker 5: he does talk to press. 121 00:05:50,800 --> 00:05:51,600 Speaker 9: So awkward. 122 00:05:51,880 --> 00:05:54,000 Speaker 6: Take it back, Lucas, to nineteen ninety four, right, I mean, 123 00:05:54,080 --> 00:05:56,160 Speaker 6: let's take it back to Deeo Nomo when he first 124 00:05:56,240 --> 00:05:59,640 Speaker 6: joined Major League Baseball. I'm thinking it, Chiro Suzuki, I'm 125 00:05:59,640 --> 00:06:02,800 Speaker 6: thinking Deki Metsu. These gentlemen were not out there in 126 00:06:02,839 --> 00:06:04,720 Speaker 6: the press every day either, right, And maybe that is 127 00:06:04,760 --> 00:06:06,520 Speaker 6: something to do, as you rightly point out in your 128 00:06:06,520 --> 00:06:09,359 Speaker 6: BusinessWeek article, just about baseball players in general, and the 129 00:06:09,360 --> 00:06:11,400 Speaker 6: fact that they're not basketball players and they're not involved 130 00:06:11,440 --> 00:06:12,720 Speaker 6: in every play in the game. 131 00:06:13,040 --> 00:06:13,680 Speaker 1: So it's hard. 132 00:06:13,839 --> 00:06:16,080 Speaker 6: And there are one hundred and sixty two games, Lucas, right, 133 00:06:16,080 --> 00:06:18,120 Speaker 6: So how much time do they really have to be 134 00:06:18,240 --> 00:06:20,960 Speaker 6: out there socially, to be out there with the public, 135 00:06:21,000 --> 00:06:23,440 Speaker 6: with the press. But my goodness, we don't want to 136 00:06:23,440 --> 00:06:26,200 Speaker 6: be you know, making you know, comparisons to Pete Rose here. 137 00:06:26,240 --> 00:06:27,960 Speaker 6: I mean, what is show hey going to have to 138 00:06:28,000 --> 00:06:28,920 Speaker 6: do to write the ship. 139 00:06:29,120 --> 00:06:32,680 Speaker 7: I think there's there's a difference in how baseball players 140 00:06:32,720 --> 00:06:34,640 Speaker 7: interact with the press and other sports. There's also a 141 00:06:34,680 --> 00:06:38,640 Speaker 7: difference in how Japanese players interact with the press than 142 00:06:38,760 --> 00:06:42,640 Speaker 7: American players. Right, there's an expectation on the US side 143 00:06:43,040 --> 00:06:44,280 Speaker 7: that you know, you see at the end of the 144 00:06:44,320 --> 00:06:47,080 Speaker 7: basketball game, like Lebron basically has to do press every 145 00:06:47,120 --> 00:06:49,560 Speaker 7: single day, right, and so he just goes and he 146 00:06:49,600 --> 00:06:52,320 Speaker 7: answers questions. And we also are just in a society 147 00:06:52,360 --> 00:06:56,440 Speaker 7: where our biggest celebrities post a lot about themselves all 148 00:06:56,480 --> 00:06:59,320 Speaker 7: over social media. Now not everyone does, but it is 149 00:06:59,320 --> 00:07:02,160 Speaker 7: sort of custom, and you it's almost it's more a 150 00:07:02,200 --> 00:07:05,720 Speaker 7: surprise if you don't do that. I think the relationship 151 00:07:05,760 --> 00:07:08,280 Speaker 7: in Japan is a little bit different. There is a 152 00:07:08,320 --> 00:07:11,800 Speaker 7: little more respect for the personal lives of some of 153 00:07:11,840 --> 00:07:17,040 Speaker 7: these people, which is why that being said, the amount 154 00:07:17,080 --> 00:07:20,440 Speaker 7: of attention on someone like Otani, the amount of press 155 00:07:20,480 --> 00:07:23,840 Speaker 7: devoted to some like Otani in the Japanese press is 156 00:07:24,040 --> 00:07:27,840 Speaker 7: unlike anything you know, we've seen with anyone here. Right, 157 00:07:28,440 --> 00:07:32,600 Speaker 7: The press in Japan treats everything that Otani does kind 158 00:07:32,600 --> 00:07:34,520 Speaker 7: of like he's the president of the country, and so 159 00:07:34,760 --> 00:07:37,760 Speaker 7: I can understand the reluctance to put yourself out there 160 00:07:37,760 --> 00:07:39,920 Speaker 7: when you have a press that's that interested in you. 161 00:07:40,360 --> 00:07:42,440 Speaker 7: I mean, in terms of writing the ship, I don't know. 162 00:07:42,480 --> 00:07:43,200 Speaker 8: It's it's so. 163 00:07:43,200 --> 00:07:45,880 Speaker 7: Early in this it's hard. He's going to continue to play. 164 00:07:46,200 --> 00:07:48,239 Speaker 7: It's going to be a huge distraction for the team. 165 00:07:48,680 --> 00:07:51,600 Speaker 7: I imagine that Major League Baseball will have and the 166 00:07:52,080 --> 00:07:54,200 Speaker 7: Dodgers will have to weigh in at some point. But 167 00:07:54,280 --> 00:07:56,160 Speaker 7: I assume at least in the short term, they're saying, 168 00:07:56,160 --> 00:07:58,800 Speaker 7: you know, we're going to let the legal proceedings and 169 00:07:58,840 --> 00:08:01,520 Speaker 7: all this play out and they'll just pray that they 170 00:08:01,520 --> 00:08:02,480 Speaker 7: don't have to take action. 171 00:08:02,640 --> 00:08:04,680 Speaker 6: Well, Michael Barr, let's put some numbers around this. Yeah, 172 00:08:04,720 --> 00:08:08,400 Speaker 6: I mean, Tani in December signed a ten year, seven 173 00:08:08,520 --> 00:08:11,360 Speaker 6: hundred million dollar contract, most of it deferred, the largest 174 00:08:11,400 --> 00:08:15,480 Speaker 6: contract by far in team sports. His jersey sold at 175 00:08:15,560 --> 00:08:18,080 Speaker 6: double the pace of Leo Messi double the pace. Just 176 00:08:18,080 --> 00:08:19,720 Speaker 6: to give you a sense of, you know what we're 177 00:08:19,720 --> 00:08:22,520 Speaker 6: talking about, and more importantly, ticket prices for Dodgers games 178 00:08:22,520 --> 00:08:24,160 Speaker 6: are up what ten to fifteen percent on the year, 179 00:08:24,240 --> 00:08:26,760 Speaker 6: So I mean the dollars speak to the fact that, 180 00:08:26,800 --> 00:08:29,360 Speaker 6: you know, there's no avoiding the press. I mean, show, 181 00:08:29,400 --> 00:08:32,559 Speaker 6: Heyotani must confront the press here. What kind of message 182 00:08:32,559 --> 00:08:35,559 Speaker 6: can he possibly deliver at the beginning of the season 183 00:08:35,960 --> 00:08:37,800 Speaker 6: to get the fans comfortable with what's going on? 184 00:08:38,080 --> 00:08:41,280 Speaker 7: Oh well, I was in Japan last December, and you 185 00:08:41,320 --> 00:08:44,280 Speaker 7: see his face everywhere. He's on the billboard, He's in 186 00:08:44,360 --> 00:08:47,280 Speaker 7: so many different advertisements. He is the most famous person 187 00:08:47,280 --> 00:08:49,200 Speaker 7: in the country. And then yeah, I mean at spring training, 188 00:08:49,520 --> 00:08:52,120 Speaker 7: there are hundreds of people there, and even though he 189 00:08:52,640 --> 00:08:54,400 Speaker 7: was new to the team, and this is a team 190 00:08:54,440 --> 00:08:56,400 Speaker 7: that has Mookie Betts, who's one of the five best 191 00:08:56,440 --> 00:08:58,440 Speaker 7: players in baseball, and Freddie Freeman, who's one of the 192 00:08:58,440 --> 00:09:00,880 Speaker 7: five or ten best players in baseball. At least every 193 00:09:00,880 --> 00:09:03,240 Speaker 7: other jersey, if not seventy percent of the jerseys were 194 00:09:03,280 --> 00:09:06,400 Speaker 7: already Otani, and you had a whole Some of that 195 00:09:06,520 --> 00:09:09,760 Speaker 7: was you know, your average just diehard baseball fan, and 196 00:09:09,760 --> 00:09:12,600 Speaker 7: some of it you there was a recognizable contingent where 197 00:09:12,600 --> 00:09:15,680 Speaker 7: I'd say it probably half the press and like twenty 198 00:09:15,760 --> 00:09:17,680 Speaker 7: to thirty percent of the fans that spring training where 199 00:09:17,720 --> 00:09:19,400 Speaker 7: Japanese and did not speak English. 200 00:09:19,640 --> 00:09:22,640 Speaker 5: On top of that, you've written about in that article 201 00:09:22,720 --> 00:09:26,360 Speaker 5: for Bloomberg Business Week about the different sponsorship deals that 202 00:09:26,480 --> 00:09:28,800 Speaker 5: not just Otani has signed, but the Dodgers have a 203 00:09:28,800 --> 00:09:31,920 Speaker 5: lot of new advertisers because they know that they're being 204 00:09:31,960 --> 00:09:35,000 Speaker 5: broadcast to a global audience in Japan, in South Korea, 205 00:09:35,080 --> 00:09:39,200 Speaker 5: in Taiwan, and that extends even teams are playing the Dodgers. 206 00:09:39,240 --> 00:09:42,400 Speaker 5: So it's not just the Dodgers that are reaping the spoils. 207 00:09:42,600 --> 00:09:45,240 Speaker 7: Yeah, I mean the amount of money available to everyone 208 00:09:45,400 --> 00:09:48,680 Speaker 7: around Otani, assuming that this kind of this latest news 209 00:09:48,720 --> 00:09:53,280 Speaker 7: that doesn't ruin it is pretty unprecedented. You know, Stan Kasten, 210 00:09:53,360 --> 00:09:56,640 Speaker 7: who's the runs the Dodgers day to day, told me 211 00:09:56,679 --> 00:09:58,920 Speaker 7: that they were going to announce a whole new suite 212 00:09:59,000 --> 00:10:01,880 Speaker 7: of spongor before the season. I don't believe they've done 213 00:10:01,920 --> 00:10:03,679 Speaker 7: that yet, but that's going to be you know, folks 214 00:10:03,679 --> 00:10:06,280 Speaker 7: who bought signage at stadium, they'll probably be some food, 215 00:10:06,400 --> 00:10:10,800 Speaker 7: special food and beverage that's related to Japan. And there 216 00:10:10,840 --> 00:10:14,199 Speaker 7: are also you can buy these these ads that if 217 00:10:14,240 --> 00:10:16,840 Speaker 7: you watch the TV broadcast, they sort of show up 218 00:10:16,880 --> 00:10:20,680 Speaker 7: behind the plate that gets digitally inserted. They sold out 219 00:10:20,679 --> 00:10:22,280 Speaker 7: of that, and so that was where he said that 220 00:10:22,440 --> 00:10:25,719 Speaker 7: he's heard from sponsors and from other teams that they 221 00:10:25,720 --> 00:10:28,320 Speaker 7: were just buying into other teams games, but only for 222 00:10:28,400 --> 00:10:30,560 Speaker 7: the ones against the Dodgers, because we've got these Japanese 223 00:10:30,600 --> 00:10:33,560 Speaker 7: companies that want anything affiliated with showhy. 224 00:10:34,720 --> 00:10:35,880 Speaker 8: So you know, I. 225 00:10:36,480 --> 00:10:39,200 Speaker 7: Talked to one person who projected the Dodgers might make 226 00:10:39,240 --> 00:10:41,600 Speaker 7: as much as an extra one hundred million dollars this year. 227 00:10:41,640 --> 00:10:43,839 Speaker 7: Some said that that was high that it would be, 228 00:10:43,880 --> 00:10:46,000 Speaker 7: but it would definitely be in the tens of millions 229 00:10:46,040 --> 00:10:49,079 Speaker 7: of dollars. You know, that's one thing where a gambling 230 00:10:49,120 --> 00:10:51,720 Speaker 7: scandal definitely doesn't help. But I assume most of that 231 00:10:51,760 --> 00:10:53,000 Speaker 7: money is already committed. 232 00:10:52,960 --> 00:10:54,920 Speaker 6: You know, Scarlet. One thing Lucas points out in his 233 00:10:54,920 --> 00:10:58,000 Speaker 6: Bloomberg BusinessWeek article, which is, I mean really great and 234 00:10:58,280 --> 00:11:00,319 Speaker 6: you know, by the way, just throw audience becaus is 235 00:11:00,360 --> 00:11:02,599 Speaker 6: a Dodger fan, just full disclosure. But you know what 236 00:11:03,640 --> 00:11:05,960 Speaker 6: Lucas points out is, you know, all this hype about 237 00:11:06,000 --> 00:11:11,079 Speaker 6: South Korea and Japan, yet most a very significant portion 238 00:11:11,320 --> 00:11:14,640 Speaker 6: of Major League Baseball players hail from Latin America. Yet 239 00:11:14,640 --> 00:11:17,520 Speaker 6: the focus, the center of the baseball universe today is 240 00:11:17,559 --> 00:11:20,040 Speaker 6: certainly Asia, Lucas. I mean it's a great point. I mean, 241 00:11:20,400 --> 00:11:21,679 Speaker 6: talk to us a little bit about that. 242 00:11:22,200 --> 00:11:23,000 Speaker 9: Why is that? 243 00:11:23,320 --> 00:11:25,720 Speaker 7: Why is it that that that focuses Asia, because there's 244 00:11:25,760 --> 00:11:27,920 Speaker 7: just way much more way, there's way more money there. Yeah, 245 00:11:27,960 --> 00:11:30,960 Speaker 7: I mean you think about Latin America. Yes, there are 246 00:11:31,000 --> 00:11:34,880 Speaker 7: a lot of players from Dominican Republic, from Venezuela, from Kurtistaff, 247 00:11:34,920 --> 00:11:38,520 Speaker 7: from all all over the region, Puerto Rico, part of 248 00:11:38,559 --> 00:11:44,960 Speaker 7: the US. But they're not large media markets, so there's 249 00:11:45,040 --> 00:11:47,000 Speaker 7: only so much money to be made there. Most of 250 00:11:47,000 --> 00:11:50,880 Speaker 7: the countries have fairly low GDP per capita, so it's 251 00:11:50,920 --> 00:11:52,560 Speaker 7: not like you've got folks who are going to spend 252 00:11:52,600 --> 00:11:55,760 Speaker 7: a ton of money on merchandise. You do have past, 253 00:11:56,000 --> 00:11:57,559 Speaker 7: like a lot of good players, and you do have 254 00:11:57,679 --> 00:12:01,240 Speaker 7: local leagues. But even though leagues are sort of less 255 00:12:01,240 --> 00:12:05,240 Speaker 7: commercialized than what you're seeing in Japan and South Korea, 256 00:12:05,280 --> 00:12:07,880 Speaker 7: which are already the second and third biggest markets commercially 257 00:12:07,880 --> 00:12:11,199 Speaker 7: from Major League Baseball, they have strong local leagues, they 258 00:12:11,200 --> 00:12:14,440 Speaker 7: have a decent number of players, they have rabid fans 259 00:12:14,480 --> 00:12:17,000 Speaker 7: with money to spend, and so I think they see 260 00:12:17,000 --> 00:12:19,400 Speaker 7: a lot of opportunity there. They see some opportunity in 261 00:12:19,440 --> 00:12:21,880 Speaker 7: Europe and they're just going to try to gradually build 262 00:12:21,880 --> 00:12:24,160 Speaker 7: out The following from Major League Baseball Around the. 263 00:12:24,160 --> 00:12:28,000 Speaker 8: World Bloomberg's Lucas Shaw. You can read his latest piece, 264 00:12:28,040 --> 00:12:32,160 Speaker 8: Superstar show, Hey Otani, We'll Transform Baseball if he wants 265 00:12:32,200 --> 00:12:35,880 Speaker 8: to now at Bloomberg dot Com. Plus be on the 266 00:12:35,920 --> 00:12:39,760 Speaker 8: lookout for it in the upcoming edition of Bloomberg BusinessWeek magazine. 267 00:12:40,000 --> 00:12:43,600 Speaker 8: Thank you so much, Lucas for joining us up Next, 268 00:12:43,720 --> 00:12:46,160 Speaker 8: we take a look at the latest episode of the 269 00:12:46,200 --> 00:12:49,280 Speaker 8: Deal with Alex Rodriguez and Jason Kelly, a new show 270 00:12:49,600 --> 00:12:52,959 Speaker 8: from Bloomberg Originals. You're listening to Bloomberg Business of Sports 271 00:12:53,160 --> 00:12:55,760 Speaker 8: from Bloomberger Radio around the World. 272 00:13:01,400 --> 00:13:06,800 Speaker 2: This is Bloomberg Business of Sports from Bloomberg Radio. This 273 00:13:07,000 --> 00:13:09,640 Speaker 2: is the Bloomberg Business of Sports show. We explored the 274 00:13:09,679 --> 00:13:11,920 Speaker 2: big money issues in the world of sports. I'm Michael 275 00:13:11,920 --> 00:13:16,040 Speaker 2: Barr along with Scarlet Fu and Damien Sassaur. The Deal 276 00:13:16,240 --> 00:13:19,520 Speaker 2: with Alex Rodriguez and Jason Kelly is a new series 277 00:13:19,559 --> 00:13:23,440 Speaker 2: from Bloomberg Originals and the latest episode features none other 278 00:13:24,040 --> 00:13:30,120 Speaker 2: than New York Yankees legend Derek g toap Alex Jason 279 00:13:30,320 --> 00:13:34,920 Speaker 2: and Derek cover a lot of ground, from team ownership, investing, 280 00:13:35,000 --> 00:13:38,079 Speaker 2: and even Derek's relationship with a Rod take a listen. 281 00:13:38,200 --> 00:13:40,839 Speaker 10: People need to put it to bed. I think at 282 00:13:40,880 --> 00:13:44,320 Speaker 10: some point, I mean, this was twenty something. You have 283 00:13:44,400 --> 00:13:46,480 Speaker 10: known him for thirty years, you know what I mean. 284 00:13:46,559 --> 00:13:49,680 Speaker 10: And I get asked more about our relationship than I 285 00:13:49,760 --> 00:13:54,520 Speaker 10: do my wife. I'm saying, yeah, I mean, it's just 286 00:13:54,600 --> 00:13:57,679 Speaker 10: put it to bed. We save we're fine working together again. 287 00:13:58,400 --> 00:14:01,040 Speaker 10: You know, you can't change history. History, it's over and 288 00:14:01,040 --> 00:14:01,320 Speaker 10: done with. 289 00:14:01,400 --> 00:14:01,840 Speaker 8: You move on. 290 00:14:02,040 --> 00:14:06,199 Speaker 4: What's funny our partners r Hannah and Jack. I think 291 00:14:06,200 --> 00:14:09,040 Speaker 4: they're happy that we're in this place. I've had so 292 00:14:09,160 --> 00:14:12,080 Speaker 4: many New York Yankee fans come up and say, I'm 293 00:14:12,120 --> 00:14:13,720 Speaker 4: so glad that you guys. I don't care if your 294 00:14:13,760 --> 00:14:15,760 Speaker 4: best friends. I'm just glad that you guys are working together. 295 00:14:15,840 --> 00:14:16,160 Speaker 1: Yeah. 296 00:14:16,200 --> 00:14:19,160 Speaker 4: And when they have their hero and someone that they 297 00:14:19,200 --> 00:14:23,760 Speaker 4: admire together, they're one together. I think if it's warming 298 00:14:23,840 --> 00:14:27,000 Speaker 4: to their heart to know that where we are getting along, Yeah, 299 00:14:27,040 --> 00:14:27,720 Speaker 4: that's my thought. 300 00:14:28,040 --> 00:14:30,480 Speaker 8: Here to tell us more about the latest episode of 301 00:14:30,560 --> 00:14:33,840 Speaker 8: the Deal featuring Derek, Jeter is co host an old 302 00:14:33,880 --> 00:14:39,320 Speaker 8: friend of the show, Bloomberg Originals Chief correspondent Jason Kelly, Hello, Jason, 303 00:14:39,360 --> 00:14:39,880 Speaker 8: welcome back. 304 00:14:39,960 --> 00:14:41,560 Speaker 1: I just wander in every now and again. 305 00:14:42,680 --> 00:14:47,000 Speaker 8: Jason, Man, this show is just off like a rock. 306 00:14:47,320 --> 00:14:49,280 Speaker 1: Thank you so much. Yeah, we're having a lot of 307 00:14:49,320 --> 00:14:49,800 Speaker 1: fun with it. 308 00:14:50,080 --> 00:14:53,680 Speaker 11: Reception has been good so far, but especially excited about 309 00:14:53,680 --> 00:14:54,360 Speaker 11: this week's edition. 310 00:14:54,600 --> 00:14:59,920 Speaker 8: Yeah, because you know, now with the baseball season officially underway, 311 00:15:00,240 --> 00:15:05,280 Speaker 8: because they played in South Korea. A Rod's old teammate 312 00:15:06,000 --> 00:15:08,320 Speaker 8: number two, Derek. 313 00:15:08,480 --> 00:15:11,359 Speaker 9: Je Ta captain to your name, captain. 314 00:15:11,120 --> 00:15:14,760 Speaker 8: Yes, number two, and he laid down some knowledge Jason 315 00:15:15,160 --> 00:15:19,960 Speaker 8: about what he thinks about when he goes through investing 316 00:15:20,120 --> 00:15:22,320 Speaker 8: and his own personal thoughts. 317 00:15:22,520 --> 00:15:25,640 Speaker 10: I invest in people. You know, you run into people 318 00:15:25,680 --> 00:15:27,440 Speaker 10: all the time. They have great ideas. Everyone has a 319 00:15:27,480 --> 00:15:29,120 Speaker 10: great idea. Everyone has a business is going to be 320 00:15:29,120 --> 00:15:32,200 Speaker 10: a billion dollar business. But you have to invest in people, 321 00:15:32,400 --> 00:15:33,920 Speaker 10: and you have to get to know them, and you 322 00:15:33,960 --> 00:15:36,240 Speaker 10: have to know if they're passionate about what they're doing. 323 00:15:36,520 --> 00:15:39,360 Speaker 10: Some people have businesses where they're in it to make money. Look, 324 00:15:39,400 --> 00:15:41,040 Speaker 10: we all want to make money, but if that's your 325 00:15:41,160 --> 00:15:43,680 Speaker 10: number one priority, if you're not passionate about it, then 326 00:15:43,680 --> 00:15:44,920 Speaker 10: I think that's a red flag. 327 00:15:45,120 --> 00:15:49,400 Speaker 8: These guys. You talk about being smart with their money. Jason, 328 00:15:49,600 --> 00:15:51,360 Speaker 8: they're out of the park forgive the plant. 329 00:15:51,680 --> 00:15:54,880 Speaker 11: Well, and Jeter is you know, for Yankee fans and 330 00:15:54,920 --> 00:15:57,840 Speaker 11: even for folks beyond Yankee world. I mean, certainly one 331 00:15:57,880 --> 00:15:59,960 Speaker 11: of one in terms of where he sits and kind 332 00:15:59,960 --> 00:16:03,040 Speaker 11: of the firmament. You think about all the famous Yankees 333 00:16:03,120 --> 00:16:06,160 Speaker 11: who have gone through the Bronx over the years, and 334 00:16:06,480 --> 00:16:08,520 Speaker 11: he certainly it is on that list. And I have 335 00:16:08,600 --> 00:16:10,600 Speaker 11: to say, you know, I'd spent a little bit of 336 00:16:10,640 --> 00:16:12,280 Speaker 11: time with him, not as much time as we spent 337 00:16:12,360 --> 00:16:12,880 Speaker 11: for the deal. 338 00:16:13,040 --> 00:16:15,440 Speaker 1: And he's just a fascinating character. 339 00:16:15,280 --> 00:16:18,080 Speaker 5: A fascinating character who, to be honest, New Yorkers don't 340 00:16:18,120 --> 00:16:20,520 Speaker 5: know that well we know of him, but he always 341 00:16:20,720 --> 00:16:22,640 Speaker 5: played his cards really close to the vest. 342 00:16:22,680 --> 00:16:23,560 Speaker 9: Is that the right metaphor? 343 00:16:23,680 --> 00:16:27,280 Speaker 5: He just you know, didn't open himself up that much, 344 00:16:27,320 --> 00:16:30,160 Speaker 5: but that helped him survive all those years in New York. 345 00:16:30,560 --> 00:16:32,800 Speaker 5: What did you notice about him when'd you observe about him? 346 00:16:33,000 --> 00:16:36,320 Speaker 11: Well, it's interesting you say that because we took that issue, 347 00:16:36,400 --> 00:16:40,240 Speaker 11: you know, sort of head on, because he did manage 348 00:16:40,360 --> 00:16:44,440 Speaker 11: to be utterly drama free for the most part. Was 349 00:16:44,520 --> 00:16:47,120 Speaker 11: that certainly drama of his own making? And one of 350 00:16:47,120 --> 00:16:50,560 Speaker 11: the things he said was he realized, you know, being 351 00:16:50,680 --> 00:16:54,640 Speaker 11: under the hot lights and all the expectation and attention 352 00:16:54,720 --> 00:16:59,240 Speaker 11: of New York that as long as he essentially answered 353 00:16:59,280 --> 00:17:02,320 Speaker 11: the question one and then didn't answer it again, that 354 00:17:02,480 --> 00:17:05,359 Speaker 11: was a winning playbook for people basically leaving him alone. 355 00:17:05,400 --> 00:17:08,520 Speaker 11: And you know, meanwhile, he had other people, including my 356 00:17:08,560 --> 00:17:12,520 Speaker 11: co host during his time, who were talking maybe more 357 00:17:12,840 --> 00:17:16,800 Speaker 11: shall we say to the media, and you know, Derek 358 00:17:16,960 --> 00:17:19,080 Speaker 11: just managed to, you know, sort of walk that line. 359 00:17:19,080 --> 00:17:21,960 Speaker 11: He played his whole career twenty years with the Yankees 360 00:17:22,000 --> 00:17:25,000 Speaker 11: five world series, so he proved him all right. 361 00:17:24,920 --> 00:17:26,040 Speaker 9: He figured out a formula. 362 00:17:26,240 --> 00:17:28,520 Speaker 6: I am a huge Derek Jeter fan. I'm a huge 363 00:17:28,560 --> 00:17:31,600 Speaker 6: a Rod fan. But their relationship wasn't always so simple. 364 00:17:31,840 --> 00:17:35,200 Speaker 6: You know, what did you notice about their interaction between 365 00:17:35,240 --> 00:17:35,679 Speaker 6: one another? 366 00:17:35,880 --> 00:17:38,560 Speaker 11: So, I mean it is the question, right, I mean, 367 00:17:38,600 --> 00:17:41,880 Speaker 11: this is this is a relationship that played out very publicly. 368 00:17:42,560 --> 00:17:43,040 Speaker 1: I would say. 369 00:17:43,119 --> 00:17:46,520 Speaker 11: The thing that I noticed is there's a lot of 370 00:17:46,640 --> 00:17:50,000 Speaker 11: history there. You know, these are two guys and you'll 371 00:17:50,000 --> 00:17:52,680 Speaker 11: hear it and see it in this episode who've known 372 00:17:52,720 --> 00:17:56,840 Speaker 11: each other longer than they haven't and you know they 373 00:17:56,920 --> 00:18:00,480 Speaker 11: met when I believe Alex was seventeen, Derek was nineteen, 374 00:18:01,400 --> 00:18:04,240 Speaker 11: and you know, they were the hottest shortstops. They were 375 00:18:04,280 --> 00:18:07,560 Speaker 11: both playing shortstop. They were generational talents, they were friends. 376 00:18:07,600 --> 00:18:10,119 Speaker 11: They would you know, stay at each other's houses. 377 00:18:11,640 --> 00:18:13,760 Speaker 9: Was part of that crew too, right, absolutely, yeah. 378 00:18:13,560 --> 00:18:16,640 Speaker 11: I mean that generated you know, for baseball fans among us, 379 00:18:16,960 --> 00:18:19,080 Speaker 11: you think back to those shorts. I mean, it was 380 00:18:19,280 --> 00:18:21,640 Speaker 11: just it was an embarrassment of riches for the league. 381 00:18:21,680 --> 00:18:25,440 Speaker 11: And actually before we filmed the episode actually showed Alex. 382 00:18:26,000 --> 00:18:26,119 Speaker 8: Uh. 383 00:18:26,760 --> 00:18:29,560 Speaker 11: This is in the video version of the deal that 384 00:18:29,600 --> 00:18:33,960 Speaker 11: cover of Sports illustrated that they shared in nineteen ninety seven. 385 00:18:34,040 --> 00:18:38,919 Speaker 11: So obviously their relationship got complicated when Alex came to 386 00:18:38,960 --> 00:18:41,800 Speaker 11: New York. Alex said some things that he has since 387 00:18:41,800 --> 00:18:46,840 Speaker 11: apologized for. What I saw was two guys who they've 388 00:18:46,880 --> 00:18:50,200 Speaker 11: sort of grown up, and they I think appreciate each other. 389 00:18:50,720 --> 00:18:54,040 Speaker 11: They appreciate what they were able to do together. And 390 00:18:55,080 --> 00:18:58,240 Speaker 11: we talk about this notion that when you look at 391 00:18:58,280 --> 00:19:02,120 Speaker 11: great deals that have happened in baseball, getting Alex Rodriguez 392 00:19:02,160 --> 00:19:05,119 Speaker 11: to the Yankees and by the way, shifting him to 393 00:19:05,240 --> 00:19:07,840 Speaker 11: third base, let's not overlook the fact that, you know, 394 00:19:07,880 --> 00:19:10,080 Speaker 11: this was one of the most talented short stops to 395 00:19:10,080 --> 00:19:13,480 Speaker 11: ever play the game and moved to third played right there, 396 00:19:13,520 --> 00:19:15,639 Speaker 11: you know, a few feet from Derek Jeter, and they 397 00:19:15,680 --> 00:19:17,439 Speaker 11: won the O nine World Series. By the way, the 398 00:19:17,520 --> 00:19:20,320 Speaker 11: last time the Yankees won the World Series was that team. 399 00:19:20,400 --> 00:19:23,640 Speaker 11: And so it's a relationship that is certainly matured. They're 400 00:19:23,680 --> 00:19:26,399 Speaker 11: working together on Fox now. I mean, Derek has a 401 00:19:26,400 --> 00:19:30,160 Speaker 11: great line in the show when I asked them directly 402 00:19:30,200 --> 00:19:32,640 Speaker 11: about it, and he says, man, I get asked more 403 00:19:32,640 --> 00:19:35,600 Speaker 11: about my relationship with him than I do my wife. 404 00:19:36,480 --> 00:19:37,600 Speaker 6: You know, I got to ask you, Jason. 405 00:19:37,600 --> 00:19:37,800 Speaker 10: You know. 406 00:19:37,840 --> 00:19:39,879 Speaker 6: One of the things that from the interview obviously that 407 00:19:40,160 --> 00:19:42,320 Speaker 6: Derek Jutor says is he invests in people. Yeah, you know, 408 00:19:42,600 --> 00:19:44,639 Speaker 6: And I remember an interview after he left the game 409 00:19:45,040 --> 00:19:47,520 Speaker 6: and he was asked, what do you missed most about 410 00:19:47,560 --> 00:19:50,359 Speaker 6: the game, And for me, it stuck with me because 411 00:19:50,400 --> 00:19:52,760 Speaker 6: he really he said, you know what I really miss 412 00:19:52,880 --> 00:19:55,639 Speaker 6: the people the locker room, you know. And one person 413 00:19:55,680 --> 00:19:58,280 Speaker 6: that he mentioned was Hedeki Matsui, who, if you remember 414 00:19:58,320 --> 00:20:01,920 Speaker 6: the Yankees, he translator speak English very well. But I mean, 415 00:20:02,240 --> 00:20:04,640 Speaker 6: what a champion, what a great New York Yankee. In fact, 416 00:20:04,640 --> 00:20:06,280 Speaker 6: by the way, his lock or time our country club 417 00:20:06,320 --> 00:20:08,240 Speaker 6: is right next to mine. And you know the question 418 00:20:08,280 --> 00:20:11,359 Speaker 6: I have about you know, what Derek Jeter looks for 419 00:20:11,920 --> 00:20:14,720 Speaker 6: in people, I mean for someone like a Hideki Matsu 420 00:20:14,800 --> 00:20:17,200 Speaker 6: and pop into his head when that questions asked, what's 421 00:20:17,200 --> 00:20:19,160 Speaker 6: your take, like, what kind of person is he looking 422 00:20:19,160 --> 00:20:19,760 Speaker 6: to invest in? 423 00:20:20,080 --> 00:20:23,400 Speaker 11: You know, I think he is looking for people who 424 00:20:24,040 --> 00:20:26,080 Speaker 11: are you know, people of integrity, you know, sort of 425 00:20:26,119 --> 00:20:28,159 Speaker 11: all the obvious things. But one of the things that 426 00:20:28,680 --> 00:20:31,919 Speaker 11: comes across so clearly in all of these episodes, especially 427 00:20:31,920 --> 00:20:36,280 Speaker 11: when we're talking to former athletes, is this, you know, 428 00:20:36,440 --> 00:20:41,160 Speaker 11: the discipline, the commitment to hard work, the coach ability, 429 00:20:41,600 --> 00:20:44,120 Speaker 11: being on a team, knowing how to win and lose. 430 00:20:44,520 --> 00:20:48,000 Speaker 11: And I think, you know, part of what Derek and 431 00:20:48,119 --> 00:20:51,639 Speaker 11: Alex appreciate is the cliche is true. If you can 432 00:20:51,680 --> 00:20:53,320 Speaker 11: make it here, you can make it anywhere. And if 433 00:20:53,359 --> 00:20:55,880 Speaker 11: you're playing for the New York Yankees, you are playing 434 00:20:56,840 --> 00:21:00,399 Speaker 11: in a place at a level in a mill you 435 00:21:00,680 --> 00:21:05,800 Speaker 11: not just in Yankee Stadium, but beyond that, the lights 436 00:21:05,800 --> 00:21:07,800 Speaker 11: are a little bit brighter, the sounds are a little 437 00:21:07,840 --> 00:21:10,240 Speaker 11: bit louder, and so if you can do it in 438 00:21:10,560 --> 00:21:12,720 Speaker 11: that environment, then you've proven something. 439 00:21:12,920 --> 00:21:16,000 Speaker 5: So we know that a rod has been you know, 440 00:21:16,080 --> 00:21:20,280 Speaker 5: he's been photographed talking with and investing with Warren Buffett, 441 00:21:20,320 --> 00:21:23,320 Speaker 5: or certainly learning from Warren Buffett. What about dark Jeter's 442 00:21:23,359 --> 00:21:26,080 Speaker 5: path to entrepreneurship and investment. 443 00:21:25,880 --> 00:21:27,840 Speaker 11: Yeah, I mean his has been a little bit different 444 00:21:27,840 --> 00:21:29,760 Speaker 11: in the sense that, you know, he jumped more or 445 00:21:29,800 --> 00:21:32,720 Speaker 11: less right into baseball. 446 00:21:32,280 --> 00:21:34,320 Speaker 1: Management and ownership with the Miami Marlins. 447 00:21:34,400 --> 00:21:38,280 Speaker 11: Ultimately he left there after just just a couple of years. 448 00:21:38,480 --> 00:21:40,800 Speaker 11: You know, he's talked about sort of strategic differences he 449 00:21:40,880 --> 00:21:45,720 Speaker 11: had with the ownership of that club. He is not, 450 00:21:46,440 --> 00:21:49,320 Speaker 11: i think, eager to return to that sort of job. 451 00:21:49,680 --> 00:21:53,720 Speaker 11: You know, whether ownership in some other former fashion comes 452 00:21:53,800 --> 00:21:54,440 Speaker 11: his way. 453 00:21:55,800 --> 00:21:56,440 Speaker 1: Hard to say. 454 00:21:57,000 --> 00:22:01,159 Speaker 11: You know, he has invested in a collect company, He's 455 00:22:01,640 --> 00:22:04,680 Speaker 11: you know, done a lot of endorsements. I think he's 456 00:22:04,800 --> 00:22:07,840 Speaker 11: really I got the sense that he's sort of taking 457 00:22:07,840 --> 00:22:10,159 Speaker 11: a beat and you know, trying to figure out what 458 00:22:10,280 --> 00:22:12,280 Speaker 11: he what he wants to do and what he wants 459 00:22:12,320 --> 00:22:12,480 Speaker 11: to be. 460 00:22:13,000 --> 00:22:14,000 Speaker 1: Has young kids. 461 00:22:14,760 --> 00:22:18,520 Speaker 9: You know, these guys, they they put their lives on hold. 462 00:22:18,960 --> 00:22:21,240 Speaker 11: They do I mean, listen, they are well paid, they 463 00:22:21,240 --> 00:22:24,439 Speaker 11: are well compensated, and you know, and and adored and 464 00:22:24,480 --> 00:22:28,080 Speaker 11: all these different things. But in the very basics of life. 465 00:22:28,119 --> 00:22:31,359 Speaker 11: You know that we've all been able to take advantage 466 00:22:31,359 --> 00:22:34,280 Speaker 11: of They're a little bit delayed in being able to 467 00:22:34,320 --> 00:22:36,600 Speaker 11: do that, and so I think I think he is 468 00:22:36,720 --> 00:22:39,760 Speaker 11: enjoyed that right now. I think he also, you know, 469 00:22:40,000 --> 00:22:42,920 Speaker 11: we actually tape this in Los Angeles last fall when 470 00:22:43,080 --> 00:22:47,480 Speaker 11: when Alex and Derek and Big Poppy and Kevin Burkhart 471 00:22:47,520 --> 00:22:51,359 Speaker 11: were doing their playoff baseball deal. And I think he 472 00:22:51,480 --> 00:22:53,400 Speaker 11: likes that, you know, I think he likes being back 473 00:22:53,440 --> 00:22:56,120 Speaker 11: in the mix and being able to talk about baseball 474 00:22:57,480 --> 00:22:58,440 Speaker 11: from a step removed. 475 00:22:58,840 --> 00:23:03,760 Speaker 8: So you got too rich handsome guys, which is six. 476 00:23:03,560 --> 00:23:08,000 Speaker 11: Three three, Michael, I would say, I would say three three, yeah, right, three. 477 00:23:08,080 --> 00:23:11,240 Speaker 8: He got Jason in there. I'm sorry, man, you're running 478 00:23:11,280 --> 00:23:15,000 Speaker 8: wing man for everybody, and you know it's which brings 479 00:23:15,080 --> 00:23:18,560 Speaker 8: us to the point. Now, this is the heck of 480 00:23:18,600 --> 00:23:22,440 Speaker 8: a man segue. Bloomberg's annual brackets. 481 00:23:21,920 --> 00:23:25,000 Speaker 1: For Okay, other rich guys, Okay, other rich. 482 00:23:24,880 --> 00:23:29,080 Speaker 8: Guys in this let's talk about that. You guys talk 483 00:23:29,080 --> 00:23:30,040 Speaker 8: about that in the show. 484 00:23:29,880 --> 00:23:30,040 Speaker 3: Do you. 485 00:23:30,680 --> 00:23:32,280 Speaker 11: We don't talk about it in the show, but we 486 00:23:32,960 --> 00:23:34,719 Speaker 11: But this is a project that I've been working on. 487 00:23:34,840 --> 00:23:36,720 Speaker 11: This is the eighth year that I've been doing it 488 00:23:36,760 --> 00:23:38,760 Speaker 11: here nine years total that we've been in this year 489 00:23:38,760 --> 00:23:42,280 Speaker 11: A Bloomberg. It's an annual tradition where we go to 490 00:23:42,440 --> 00:23:46,280 Speaker 11: Titans of Wall Street, Corporate America. 491 00:23:47,119 --> 00:23:48,159 Speaker 1: And the sports world. 492 00:23:48,600 --> 00:23:51,440 Speaker 11: We have I think we're gonna end up with close 493 00:23:51,480 --> 00:23:55,160 Speaker 11: to fifty five participants that each pluge twenty thousand dollars. 494 00:23:55,520 --> 00:23:58,679 Speaker 11: They pick a charity and they fill out brackets for 495 00:23:58,720 --> 00:24:01,359 Speaker 11: both the women's and the men's turn, and the top 496 00:24:01,400 --> 00:24:04,520 Speaker 11: three on each side get to split the money among 497 00:24:04,680 --> 00:24:08,359 Speaker 11: their charities. So Steve Palauka, actually owner of the Boston 498 00:24:08,359 --> 00:24:12,399 Speaker 11: Celtics UH is the defending champion on the men's side, 499 00:24:12,440 --> 00:24:14,480 Speaker 11: so he's looking to repeat. 500 00:24:14,840 --> 00:24:16,760 Speaker 1: And it's super super fun. 501 00:24:16,880 --> 00:24:17,040 Speaker 8: You know. 502 00:24:17,200 --> 00:24:21,399 Speaker 11: Peter Grauer, our chairman, is a huge devotee of this. 503 00:24:21,480 --> 00:24:25,240 Speaker 11: He participates. He's a big unc target guy. He has 504 00:24:25,480 --> 00:24:29,000 Speaker 11: not what he ca He placed one year, okay, Mike 505 00:24:29,040 --> 00:24:30,479 Speaker 11: Bloomberg plays. 506 00:24:30,520 --> 00:24:31,640 Speaker 1: He has also never won. 507 00:24:33,320 --> 00:24:36,840 Speaker 11: But we it's a it's a huge amount of fun 508 00:24:36,880 --> 00:24:39,280 Speaker 11: and it is a very fun time for me every 509 00:24:39,359 --> 00:24:42,320 Speaker 11: year because I get to see, you know, the these 510 00:24:42,320 --> 00:24:45,400 Speaker 11: people that we are all right about on a near 511 00:24:45,520 --> 00:24:46,879 Speaker 11: daily basis. 512 00:24:46,640 --> 00:24:50,000 Speaker 1: Talking a little trash. They're they're spoiler alert they're a 513 00:24:50,040 --> 00:24:51,520 Speaker 1: little competitive. 514 00:24:51,720 --> 00:24:54,120 Speaker 9: With each other, so it's to see their brackets before 515 00:24:54,119 --> 00:24:55,000 Speaker 9: you fill yours out. 516 00:24:55,200 --> 00:24:59,400 Speaker 11: Yeah, exactly, that's true. That's true. So I got. 517 00:25:00,960 --> 00:25:01,359 Speaker 1: I don't know. 518 00:25:01,440 --> 00:25:03,560 Speaker 11: I mean, you guys, I think are going to talk 519 00:25:03,560 --> 00:25:07,160 Speaker 11: to an expert about this, I mean, filling out brackets heavy. 520 00:25:07,200 --> 00:25:12,000 Speaker 11: Bracketology is a science or ark or maybe or luck, 521 00:25:12,119 --> 00:25:13,560 Speaker 11: I don't know, or something. 522 00:25:13,440 --> 00:25:17,719 Speaker 8: Our Thanks to Bloomberg Originals Chief correspondent Jason Kelly, don't 523 00:25:17,880 --> 00:25:20,760 Speaker 8: miss the latest episode of the Deal with Alex Rodriguez 524 00:25:20,800 --> 00:25:24,280 Speaker 8: and Jason Kelly. Catch it on Fridays at seven pm 525 00:25:24,320 --> 00:25:28,760 Speaker 8: Eastern on Bloomberg Television, stream it on Thursdays at nine 526 00:25:28,840 --> 00:25:32,159 Speaker 8: pm Eastern on Bloomberg Originals, and of course, listen on 527 00:25:32,280 --> 00:25:36,760 Speaker 8: demand anytime on your favorite podcast platform. Up next, we 528 00:25:36,840 --> 00:25:42,320 Speaker 8: dive into Brackettology with March Madness getting underway. You're listening 529 00:25:42,320 --> 00:25:45,840 Speaker 8: to the Bloomberg Business of Sports from Bloomberg Radio around 530 00:25:45,920 --> 00:25:52,000 Speaker 8: the world. 531 00:25:52,040 --> 00:25:57,320 Speaker 2: This is Bloomberg Business of Sports from Bloomberg Radio. This 532 00:25:57,520 --> 00:26:00,159 Speaker 2: is the Bloomberg Business of Sports show. But wiggs were 533 00:26:00,200 --> 00:26:02,800 Speaker 2: the big money issues in the world of sports. I'm 534 00:26:02,840 --> 00:26:07,240 Speaker 2: Michael Barr along with Scarlett Foo and Damien Sassaur Oh, man, 535 00:26:07,560 --> 00:26:10,920 Speaker 2: if there was any part of this show, and We've 536 00:26:10,920 --> 00:26:12,879 Speaker 2: got a lot of great parts of this show that 537 00:26:13,040 --> 00:26:18,320 Speaker 2: I have my pen and pencil and paper ready because 538 00:26:18,359 --> 00:26:22,080 Speaker 2: I'm working on my brackets and crossing my fingers. Tim 539 00:26:22,160 --> 00:26:26,159 Speaker 2: churned here. He is the Joseph R. Morton Professor of 540 00:26:26,200 --> 00:26:30,720 Speaker 2: Mathematics and Computer Science at Davison College. And what's even 541 00:26:30,760 --> 00:26:33,880 Speaker 2: more important is that my man is going to help 542 00:26:33,960 --> 00:26:38,159 Speaker 2: me in bracketology. Tim, thank you Sarah for joining us 543 00:26:38,160 --> 00:26:39,720 Speaker 2: on the Bloomberg Business of Sports. 544 00:26:40,040 --> 00:26:41,959 Speaker 3: Oh, thank you, and thanks for bringing a pencil. 545 00:26:44,119 --> 00:26:46,680 Speaker 8: I'm going to be chewing it man through the whole tournament. 546 00:26:48,600 --> 00:26:51,720 Speaker 8: What is it? This is a real general question, But 547 00:26:51,760 --> 00:26:56,040 Speaker 8: what's that one big secret when you're filling out a 548 00:26:56,080 --> 00:26:58,320 Speaker 8: bracket that you need to know? Well? 549 00:26:58,359 --> 00:27:00,359 Speaker 3: I would say there are two things. One of them 550 00:27:00,520 --> 00:27:03,359 Speaker 3: involves math, and one of them does but kind of doesn't. 551 00:27:03,400 --> 00:27:05,359 Speaker 3: One of them is that you have to move away 552 00:27:05,480 --> 00:27:08,639 Speaker 3: from unless you're just doing it for fun. You have 553 00:27:08,720 --> 00:27:12,080 Speaker 3: to move away from your personal preferences with colleges because 554 00:27:12,080 --> 00:27:15,159 Speaker 3: it can really make you make some choices that if 555 00:27:15,200 --> 00:27:18,200 Speaker 3: you only look at the data, won't hold. And that's 556 00:27:18,359 --> 00:27:21,040 Speaker 3: very true for me. Teaching in North Carolina where people 557 00:27:21,040 --> 00:27:23,840 Speaker 3: could have some pretty strong opinions about different shades blue. 558 00:27:24,080 --> 00:27:24,560 Speaker 8: No. Not. 559 00:27:27,800 --> 00:27:30,200 Speaker 3: The other one that comes into it is actually that 560 00:27:30,640 --> 00:27:34,720 Speaker 3: factors like strength of schedule, where that's in the ability 561 00:27:34,720 --> 00:27:36,959 Speaker 3: to play at home versus a way in who you 562 00:27:37,040 --> 00:27:39,960 Speaker 3: beat in that strength of schedule tends to be at 563 00:27:40,080 --> 00:27:42,800 Speaker 3: least predictive to an extent. There's a lot of randomness 564 00:27:42,800 --> 00:27:45,680 Speaker 3: in March madness, which is just inherently difficult to predict. 565 00:27:46,000 --> 00:27:50,639 Speaker 5: How much research do people do into each matchup? Or 566 00:27:50,720 --> 00:27:53,520 Speaker 5: is this something where for a newbie or someone who 567 00:27:53,600 --> 00:27:56,840 Speaker 5: doesn't follow college basketball, you have a number three seed 568 00:27:56,920 --> 00:27:58,639 Speaker 5: versus a number fifteen seed, you're going to pick the 569 00:27:58,720 --> 00:28:00,720 Speaker 5: number three seed because of course that makes more sense. 570 00:28:00,880 --> 00:28:01,080 Speaker 8: Yeah. 571 00:28:01,119 --> 00:28:02,960 Speaker 3: One of the things that you can actually do if 572 00:28:03,000 --> 00:28:05,640 Speaker 3: you're a newbie is just kind of look for the 573 00:28:05,680 --> 00:28:10,840 Speaker 3: tendencies of which seeds tend to beat other seeds, Like 574 00:28:10,960 --> 00:28:12,960 Speaker 3: we tend to have number one, number two, and number 575 00:28:13,000 --> 00:28:15,520 Speaker 3: three seeds that get all the way to the finals. 576 00:28:15,760 --> 00:28:18,639 Speaker 3: That can kind of help people who aren't following the 577 00:28:18,720 --> 00:28:22,320 Speaker 3: sport as much. I actually have a website March Mathness 578 00:28:22,440 --> 00:28:25,640 Speaker 3: dot Davidson dot edu, where people make very simple choices, 579 00:28:25,840 --> 00:28:27,800 Speaker 3: and I actually work with middle school kids so that 580 00:28:27,840 --> 00:28:30,760 Speaker 3: they can use math to make their choices. And behind 581 00:28:30,800 --> 00:28:34,040 Speaker 3: it is that strength of schedule type thing. So either way, 582 00:28:34,119 --> 00:28:37,000 Speaker 3: people can play with that. But it's also you're not 583 00:28:37,160 --> 00:28:39,280 Speaker 3: going to get a perfect bracket just because it's so 584 00:28:39,520 --> 00:28:43,680 Speaker 3: incredibly improbable. So sometimes it's fun just to just give 585 00:28:43,720 --> 00:28:46,520 Speaker 3: a shot in the dark and go with the team anyway. 586 00:28:46,560 --> 00:28:48,800 Speaker 3: But there are like the five twelve is a common 587 00:28:48,840 --> 00:28:50,840 Speaker 3: one that we expect to happen. 588 00:28:51,320 --> 00:28:54,959 Speaker 6: Tim, you receive the alphad Peaceloan Research Fellowship for Research 589 00:28:55,000 --> 00:28:58,800 Speaker 6: and mathematics. You're the vice president for the Mathematical Association 590 00:28:58,880 --> 00:29:01,560 Speaker 6: of America. We just have one question for you. Are 591 00:29:01,560 --> 00:29:04,080 Speaker 6: you ban from any casinos in Las Vegas or Atlantic 592 00:29:04,120 --> 00:29:06,520 Speaker 6: City at this point? And are you allowed to place 593 00:29:06,600 --> 00:29:08,320 Speaker 6: bets on fandel or DraftKings. 594 00:29:09,840 --> 00:29:13,959 Speaker 3: Well, I actually do not do any sports betting, and 595 00:29:14,000 --> 00:29:16,000 Speaker 3: that's because I work on the other side. I do 596 00:29:16,320 --> 00:29:20,760 Speaker 3: weekly consulting for the NBA League Office on game integrity 597 00:29:20,880 --> 00:29:24,200 Speaker 3: in the context of sports betting, So I do not bet. 598 00:29:24,880 --> 00:29:27,080 Speaker 1: But yeah, well, Tim, I'm just kidding. 599 00:29:27,080 --> 00:29:29,960 Speaker 6: But you mentioned strength of schedule, and you know that 600 00:29:30,040 --> 00:29:31,959 Speaker 6: takes me to my next question and it's an important 601 00:29:31,960 --> 00:29:33,680 Speaker 6: one here. Look at the Big East, look at the 602 00:29:33,720 --> 00:29:35,760 Speaker 6: teams that were omitted from the Big East, and then 603 00:29:35,760 --> 00:29:37,520 Speaker 6: look at the Mountain West and look at the low 604 00:29:37,560 --> 00:29:39,200 Speaker 6: seeds coming out of the Mountain West, although they got 605 00:29:39,200 --> 00:29:41,160 Speaker 6: a lot more teams in the tournament. How do your 606 00:29:41,240 --> 00:29:43,840 Speaker 6: models establish strength of schedule when there seems to be 607 00:29:43,880 --> 00:29:46,000 Speaker 6: such confusion across the NCAA. 608 00:29:46,240 --> 00:29:48,160 Speaker 3: Yeah, And that's a really important point. Is that the 609 00:29:48,200 --> 00:29:52,080 Speaker 3: fact that there are so few games being played between conferences, 610 00:29:52,640 --> 00:29:56,160 Speaker 3: that's what can trick the strength of schedule methods. It's 611 00:29:56,160 --> 00:29:58,760 Speaker 3: one of the things that we struggle with as researchers. 612 00:29:59,040 --> 00:30:01,840 Speaker 3: It's also why we like looking at March Madness is 613 00:30:01,880 --> 00:30:04,720 Speaker 3: because it's such a great example of not a lot 614 00:30:04,760 --> 00:30:07,640 Speaker 3: of data. Even though it's five thousand games, it's three 615 00:30:07,720 --> 00:30:10,479 Speaker 3: hundred and fifty teams, it's not that much data. So 616 00:30:11,160 --> 00:30:13,480 Speaker 3: it is a tricky part that even though we have 617 00:30:13,720 --> 00:30:17,360 Speaker 3: fairly good models that will come out with predictions at 618 00:30:17,360 --> 00:30:21,520 Speaker 3: the same time, afterwards we can sometimes look more carefully 619 00:30:22,080 --> 00:30:25,520 Speaker 3: at the data and see why, like one game between 620 00:30:25,520 --> 00:30:28,320 Speaker 3: two conferences might be all we're relying on, or just 621 00:30:28,360 --> 00:30:31,080 Speaker 3: a couple games, and that they were so close that 622 00:30:31,360 --> 00:30:35,360 Speaker 3: winning models or the scoring percentage models don't really pan 623 00:30:35,440 --> 00:30:36,080 Speaker 3: out for us. 624 00:30:36,600 --> 00:30:39,240 Speaker 8: Jim, you're a very noble man because in your position, 625 00:30:39,400 --> 00:30:44,400 Speaker 8: you don't been on sports. I do, and I remember 626 00:30:44,520 --> 00:30:50,520 Speaker 8: last year fairly Dickinson just shattered brackets all the hell shattered. 627 00:30:50,760 --> 00:30:55,360 Speaker 8: I mean, boom, it just oh my goodness. The odds 628 00:30:55,760 --> 00:30:59,520 Speaker 8: of a perfect bracket, which has never happened, it's one 629 00:30:59,640 --> 00:31:03,120 Speaker 8: in ten two point three billion. I mean, that's why 630 00:31:03,200 --> 00:31:06,000 Speaker 8: we talk about it. When someone picks, you know, is 631 00:31:06,040 --> 00:31:09,120 Speaker 8: perfect through the Sweet sixteen. Can you talk about more 632 00:31:09,120 --> 00:31:10,280 Speaker 8: about a perfect bracket? 633 00:31:10,640 --> 00:31:14,080 Speaker 3: Sure? So the two point three billion statistic is coming 634 00:31:14,120 --> 00:31:17,520 Speaker 3: from that people are. It's assuming that people are seventy 635 00:31:17,560 --> 00:31:21,120 Speaker 3: one percent correct on average within the tournament. So that's 636 00:31:21,160 --> 00:31:24,240 Speaker 3: where that's coming from. In terms of that, sometimes even 637 00:31:24,320 --> 00:31:26,440 Speaker 3: that is a difficult number to kind of get in 638 00:31:26,480 --> 00:31:29,040 Speaker 3: your head in terms of how big is that. That's 639 00:31:29,160 --> 00:31:33,000 Speaker 3: like me picking one given second in seventy four years, 640 00:31:33,040 --> 00:31:35,800 Speaker 3: and you have to pick which second I chose. And 641 00:31:35,840 --> 00:31:38,800 Speaker 3: that's why it's so difficult to do. If you're flipping 642 00:31:38,840 --> 00:31:41,800 Speaker 3: a coin like you just have no idea what's going on, 643 00:31:42,240 --> 00:31:44,800 Speaker 3: the odds go to fifty to fifty and suddenly you 644 00:31:44,920 --> 00:31:48,680 Speaker 3: have one in nine quintillion. That's like me picking one 645 00:31:48,800 --> 00:31:53,280 Speaker 3: second in almost three hundred billion years. And so that's 646 00:31:53,320 --> 00:31:56,640 Speaker 3: why we don't see it because you can't just reduce 647 00:31:56,800 --> 00:31:59,440 Speaker 3: the what we call the sample space. You can't reduce 648 00:31:59,480 --> 00:32:02,200 Speaker 3: it much because the upsets are going to happen and 649 00:32:02,240 --> 00:32:06,040 Speaker 3: you really don't know where. And so it's a fun problem. 650 00:32:06,240 --> 00:32:08,520 Speaker 3: It creates the madness, and it's why we all have 651 00:32:08,640 --> 00:32:10,760 Speaker 3: a lot to talk about in the coming week. 652 00:32:11,080 --> 00:32:13,240 Speaker 5: One thing that I'm fascinated by is that you teach 653 00:32:13,560 --> 00:32:16,240 Speaker 5: march madness in your classes. You have a math modeling 654 00:32:16,240 --> 00:32:19,800 Speaker 5: class where you learn ranking methods that can produce brackets. 655 00:32:20,120 --> 00:32:23,080 Speaker 5: There's an independent study part of the course that studies 656 00:32:23,160 --> 00:32:26,800 Speaker 5: data analytics and the context of madness. Has enrollment in 657 00:32:26,840 --> 00:32:30,400 Speaker 5: your classes and interest in this part of your curriculum 658 00:32:30,600 --> 00:32:36,040 Speaker 5: shot up with sports betting and the overall number ology 659 00:32:36,280 --> 00:32:38,280 Speaker 5: of sports in the past ten. 660 00:32:38,200 --> 00:32:41,479 Speaker 3: Years, Yes, it has, but part of it actually, some 661 00:32:41,560 --> 00:32:43,520 Speaker 3: of it can be in the context of sports betting, 662 00:32:43,880 --> 00:32:45,880 Speaker 3: but a lot of it actually has to do with 663 00:32:46,000 --> 00:32:50,320 Speaker 3: wanting to work in data analytics or specifically sports analytics. 664 00:32:50,400 --> 00:32:51,000 Speaker 9: Oh interesting. 665 00:32:51,000 --> 00:32:53,520 Speaker 3: Some of the students that I've worked with, one works 666 00:32:53,520 --> 00:32:55,880 Speaker 3: for the Bulls, one worked for the Jets, one works 667 00:32:55,880 --> 00:32:58,560 Speaker 3: for FanDuel and so forth and so on, and others 668 00:32:58,640 --> 00:33:02,640 Speaker 3: have gone to Amazon, in Microsoft and firms like that. 669 00:33:02,880 --> 00:33:05,800 Speaker 5: They come in having read Moneyball and thinking this is 670 00:33:05,800 --> 00:33:06,440 Speaker 5: what I want to do. 671 00:33:06,640 --> 00:33:07,560 Speaker 8: Yeah. Yes. 672 00:33:07,640 --> 00:33:10,400 Speaker 3: And the group that I created started with three students 673 00:33:10,440 --> 00:33:13,280 Speaker 3: and grew to be one hundreds where they are actually 674 00:33:13,520 --> 00:33:17,880 Speaker 3: supplying analytics to support the college coaches at Davidson College 675 00:33:17,920 --> 00:33:19,000 Speaker 3: to get ready for games. 676 00:33:19,200 --> 00:33:21,160 Speaker 5: There's never been a perfect bracket. Has there ever been 677 00:33:21,200 --> 00:33:24,480 Speaker 5: a perfect a bracket that's completely imperfect where no one 678 00:33:24,480 --> 00:33:26,600 Speaker 5: got any good question of the picks? 679 00:33:26,680 --> 00:33:30,880 Speaker 3: Right? Yeah, Now that's equally difficult. Both are very very difficult. 680 00:33:30,880 --> 00:33:33,160 Speaker 3: When I give talks, I'll point out that either getting 681 00:33:33,240 --> 00:33:35,720 Speaker 3: in the ninety ninth percent stile beating ninety nine percent 682 00:33:35,800 --> 00:33:39,080 Speaker 3: of brackets in one of these massive online pools, or 683 00:33:39,160 --> 00:33:43,120 Speaker 3: being under one percent is also very very difficult. You 684 00:33:43,160 --> 00:33:46,920 Speaker 3: can sometimes create it where you just make nonsense type predictions, 685 00:33:46,960 --> 00:33:50,440 Speaker 3: but even then it's very difficult. One time, my son 686 00:33:50,520 --> 00:33:53,480 Speaker 3: created one that was under the one percentile, and I 687 00:33:53,520 --> 00:33:56,000 Speaker 3: asked him, how did you create your bracket? And he said, 688 00:33:56,000 --> 00:33:58,840 Speaker 3: I did coin flipping, And I said, well, normally coin 689 00:33:58,880 --> 00:34:01,160 Speaker 3: flipping is like three or four percent, like I've actually 690 00:34:01,240 --> 00:34:03,880 Speaker 3: tested that. I said, who did you have winning the tournament? 691 00:34:03,960 --> 00:34:06,360 Speaker 3: And he said Davidson College. And I was like, you 692 00:34:06,440 --> 00:34:09,960 Speaker 3: had Davidson winning, which is where I teach winning the tournament? 693 00:34:09,960 --> 00:34:12,399 Speaker 3: Said yes, every time Davidson played, I slipped the coin 694 00:34:12,480 --> 00:34:13,080 Speaker 3: until they won. 695 00:34:15,719 --> 00:34:17,319 Speaker 9: Nice, Tim, talk to us. 696 00:34:17,239 --> 00:34:20,200 Speaker 6: A little bit about how your models incorporate where the 697 00:34:20,239 --> 00:34:22,080 Speaker 6: games are being played. We all know about the home 698 00:34:22,120 --> 00:34:24,960 Speaker 6: court advantage, right, and I know that's really important when 699 00:34:24,960 --> 00:34:27,839 Speaker 6: you're talking about basketball. I mean, I mean, I mean, 700 00:34:27,840 --> 00:34:31,920 Speaker 6: are your models I mean running before a selection Sunday 701 00:34:32,000 --> 00:34:33,879 Speaker 6: or did they just kick in right afterwards? They find 702 00:34:33,920 --> 00:34:35,960 Speaker 6: out where these teams are playing, and does that have 703 00:34:36,040 --> 00:34:39,560 Speaker 6: a very big or small impact on what you're picking here? 704 00:34:40,080 --> 00:34:42,839 Speaker 3: It has a big impact. We upweight. So the way 705 00:34:42,840 --> 00:34:46,359 Speaker 3: that it works is that in our models, rather than 706 00:34:46,360 --> 00:34:49,200 Speaker 3: saying a game is worth one game, we will upweight 707 00:34:49,280 --> 00:34:52,280 Speaker 3: it both with time, saying that as you move deeper 708 00:34:52,320 --> 00:34:54,920 Speaker 3: in the season, closer to March Madness, it's more predictive 709 00:34:54,960 --> 00:34:57,879 Speaker 3: of how you'll play. And then also if you win 710 00:34:58,080 --> 00:35:00,359 Speaker 3: on the road or on a neutral court, the neutral 711 00:35:00,400 --> 00:35:02,480 Speaker 3: court is something like March Madness where neither of them 712 00:35:02,480 --> 00:35:05,160 Speaker 3: are playing at home, and the various many tournaments they 713 00:35:05,160 --> 00:35:09,200 Speaker 3: play during the tournament generally when you upweight away and 714 00:35:09,719 --> 00:35:13,360 Speaker 3: the neutral court later in the season, and in these models, 715 00:35:13,360 --> 00:35:15,960 Speaker 3: it also means that you're beating high quality teams at 716 00:35:16,000 --> 00:35:18,400 Speaker 3: those times. That actually does a good job of finding 717 00:35:18,400 --> 00:35:20,360 Speaker 3: teams that sometimes can be misseeded. 718 00:35:20,640 --> 00:35:21,880 Speaker 9: A lot to think about there. 719 00:35:22,360 --> 00:35:24,960 Speaker 5: I want to continue on something you had mentioned earlier, 720 00:35:25,000 --> 00:35:26,719 Speaker 5: which is a lot of your students have moved on 721 00:35:26,840 --> 00:35:29,880 Speaker 5: to be the analytics guys for the Bulls for instance, 722 00:35:30,800 --> 00:35:34,239 Speaker 5: what is the placement record for your students they have 723 00:35:34,280 --> 00:35:35,799 Speaker 5: to go on to get a master's degree? I mean, 724 00:35:35,840 --> 00:35:40,440 Speaker 5: is there a real thirst for data analytic talent out 725 00:35:40,480 --> 00:35:43,120 Speaker 5: of universities for these franchises. 726 00:35:43,719 --> 00:35:46,520 Speaker 3: Yes, there is. And one of the tricks is that 727 00:35:46,560 --> 00:35:50,919 Speaker 3: if you come out into a professional sports organization, you're 728 00:35:50,960 --> 00:35:54,920 Speaker 3: expected to know what you're doing and support immediately. Those 729 00:35:54,960 --> 00:35:57,600 Speaker 3: that go on either into industry or on too a 730 00:35:57,640 --> 00:36:00,440 Speaker 3: master's degree kind of get more training and then can 731 00:36:00,480 --> 00:36:03,120 Speaker 3: move into professional sports. But all the ones that I 732 00:36:03,200 --> 00:36:08,200 Speaker 3: mentioned went directly out of our program in and even 733 00:36:08,239 --> 00:36:10,920 Speaker 3: this semester, we're working with a NASCAR team, working with 734 00:36:10,960 --> 00:36:13,439 Speaker 3: a major League Baseball team. And then this one group 735 00:36:13,520 --> 00:36:15,799 Speaker 3: is helping me with March Madness, so they get a 736 00:36:15,840 --> 00:36:18,600 Speaker 3: lot of hands on experience at the college level which 737 00:36:18,640 --> 00:36:19,600 Speaker 3: helps them in the market. 738 00:36:19,960 --> 00:36:22,440 Speaker 6: Tim last question I have for you, and really is 739 00:36:22,560 --> 00:36:25,399 Speaker 6: what you what's your vibe from these students that you're 740 00:36:25,440 --> 00:36:28,920 Speaker 6: teaching here is you know, behavioral? You know, like question, 741 00:36:29,080 --> 00:36:30,759 Speaker 6: you know, talk to us about like they come in 742 00:36:30,800 --> 00:36:33,319 Speaker 6: with their preconceived notions, the teams that they like, you know, 743 00:36:33,360 --> 00:36:35,839 Speaker 6: where they're from, you know, the things that they look for, 744 00:36:36,160 --> 00:36:37,640 Speaker 6: you know, and then you know, they've got to throw 745 00:36:37,640 --> 00:36:38,959 Speaker 6: it all out the door, right and let the numbers 746 00:36:38,960 --> 00:36:40,960 Speaker 6: speak for themselves. Talk to us a little bit about 747 00:36:41,360 --> 00:36:44,680 Speaker 6: the focus that these students of yours have on the 748 00:36:44,760 --> 00:36:48,320 Speaker 6: math and how can they break out of their behavioral biases? 749 00:36:48,360 --> 00:36:49,840 Speaker 6: And do you see you know, do you see a 750 00:36:49,840 --> 00:36:51,680 Speaker 6: lot of students having difficulty doing that? 751 00:36:52,440 --> 00:36:54,600 Speaker 3: Yeah. And one of the reasons I do March Madness 752 00:36:54,640 --> 00:36:57,799 Speaker 3: is precisely for that reason is that students, well, even 753 00:36:57,840 --> 00:37:00,440 Speaker 3: if they don't follow sports, not all the students in 754 00:37:00,480 --> 00:37:03,840 Speaker 3: the class follow sports. Like mentioned earlier, maybe you have 755 00:37:03,840 --> 00:37:06,160 Speaker 3: a friend that went to Colgate and you have some 756 00:37:06,320 --> 00:37:09,920 Speaker 3: other reason that you actually like at school, and so 757 00:37:10,200 --> 00:37:13,520 Speaker 3: actually in the coming weeks, I will actually start class, 758 00:37:13,560 --> 00:37:16,200 Speaker 3: but I will wait a little bit because the students 759 00:37:16,239 --> 00:37:19,440 Speaker 3: have their brackets and they talk to each other about 760 00:37:19,560 --> 00:37:23,200 Speaker 3: why things went wrong. You know, I had the initial model, 761 00:37:23,640 --> 00:37:25,759 Speaker 3: and Duke was doing better than I wanted them to. 762 00:37:25,920 --> 00:37:29,040 Speaker 3: So I changed my numbers and change my model, and 763 00:37:29,120 --> 00:37:31,879 Speaker 3: they begin to talk about the decisions that they made. 764 00:37:31,960 --> 00:37:35,440 Speaker 3: So in a way, March Madness makes the point without 765 00:37:35,520 --> 00:37:37,839 Speaker 3: me needing to make the point. And when I make 766 00:37:37,880 --> 00:37:41,120 Speaker 3: the point in about a month, everyone has context to 767 00:37:41,200 --> 00:37:42,280 Speaker 3: understand what I'm saying. 768 00:37:42,960 --> 00:37:44,560 Speaker 9: You just let it be revealed. 769 00:37:44,800 --> 00:37:47,280 Speaker 3: Yes, exactly. Yeah. 770 00:37:47,360 --> 00:37:53,239 Speaker 8: Our thanks to Tim Shartier, Davison College Professor of Mathematics 771 00:37:53,280 --> 00:37:56,480 Speaker 8: and Computer Science, for joining us to talk through the 772 00:37:56,600 --> 00:38:00,440 Speaker 8: art of bracketology. Thanks for listening to the Bloomberg Business 773 00:38:00,440 --> 00:38:02,840 Speaker 8: of Sports. We're here each and every week at the 774 00:38:02,880 --> 00:38:07,000 Speaker 8: same time for my colleague Scarlett Foo and Damien Sasaur. 775 00:38:07,120 --> 00:38:09,759 Speaker 8: I'm Michael Barr. Tune in again next week for the 776 00:38:09,840 --> 00:38:12,719 Speaker 8: latest on the stories moving big old money in the 777 00:38:12,760 --> 00:38:15,960 Speaker 8: world of sports. You're listening to The Bloomberg Business of 778 00:38:16,000 --> 00:38:19,040 Speaker 8: Sports from Bloomberg Radio around the world.