WEBVTT - Charlamagne Critiques NLP and the Cost of Thinking While Black 0:00:00.080 --> 0:00:02.680 Native Lamb Pod is the production of iHeartRadio in partnership 0:00:02.680 --> 0:00:10.319 with Reezing Choice Media. Welcome Home, y'all, Episode one O 0:00:10.480 --> 0:00:13.240 two of Native Lamb pot where we break down things 0:00:13.280 --> 0:00:15.560 that are all political and dip into the culture and 0:00:15.840 --> 0:00:18.800 boy ol boy, did we set off a discussion this week? 0:00:19.040 --> 0:00:21.040 We are going to get into all of that on 0:00:21.079 --> 0:00:24.000 this episode. I am your co host Tiffany Cross here 0:00:24.079 --> 0:00:28.880 with Angela Rye, Andrew Gillum and Bacari Sellers. Bakari, we 0:00:28.920 --> 0:00:31.800 are told is having some technical difficulties. You guys know, 0:00:31.880 --> 0:00:34.880 he's a very hard working trial attorney. He's in trial 0:00:34.920 --> 0:00:37.440 at the moment, so he joins us on this podcast 0:00:37.520 --> 0:00:41.560 from his office and he is having some technical difficulties. 0:00:41.600 --> 0:00:43.919 So we have seen him, we've heard from him, and 0:00:44.000 --> 0:00:46.919 he rumor has it he'll be making an appearance on 0:00:46.960 --> 0:00:49.880 the show eventually once he gets his dial up fixed. 0:00:49.960 --> 0:00:51.640 I think that's his dialupe. 0:00:51.320 --> 0:00:52.600 Beyonce would never have done. 0:00:52.640 --> 0:00:56.120 Okay, Well, while we wait on Bakari, what are we 0:00:56.120 --> 0:00:57.240 getting into on the show today? 0:00:57.280 --> 0:00:58.080 Angel what you got? 0:01:00.400 --> 0:01:00.640 Well? 0:01:00.680 --> 0:01:03.400 If we move beyond to beef, I think that we 0:01:03.760 --> 0:01:05.600 really need to talk about another beef that I have 0:01:05.720 --> 0:01:07.360 and the beef that I have is with the way 0:01:07.360 --> 0:01:12.000 that Donald Trump continues to use this government as a 0:01:12.040 --> 0:01:15.520 bank account, rolling bank account while everybody else is frozen out. 0:01:15.560 --> 0:01:18.440 So he's asking the Department of Justice for restitution for 0:01:18.720 --> 0:01:20.639 crimes he says he doesn't he didn't commit. 0:01:21.080 --> 0:01:23.640 Wow, Okay, I have thoughts on that, Andrew, what do 0:01:23.680 --> 0:01:24.280 you got? 0:01:24.560 --> 0:01:27.400 I hear that Mayor Brandon Johnson of the Great City 0:01:27.400 --> 0:01:32.039 of Chicago issued a different kind of challenge during this 0:01:32.160 --> 0:01:35.679 No Kings set of protests over the weekend, and I 0:01:35.760 --> 0:01:38.400 actually wonder if we have as a community the stomach 0:01:38.440 --> 0:01:40.600 for it. We're here about that and hopefully get into 0:01:40.600 --> 0:01:41.280 a little conversation. 0:01:41.920 --> 0:01:45.280 All right, Well, Butcari wanted to talk about something with 0:01:45.319 --> 0:01:48.720 the Congressional Black Caucus, So if we have time for that, 0:01:48.760 --> 0:01:50.200 we might have to do that on a mini pod 0:01:50.760 --> 0:01:52.760 next week. But I know he did reference that, and 0:01:52.840 --> 0:01:55.640 I want to get into this what's going on with 0:01:55.680 --> 0:01:58.640 snap benefits. I think that'll probably come up in your conversation. 0:01:58.720 --> 0:02:01.240 And I know, Angela, you did a whole on the 0:02:01.280 --> 0:02:04.400 government shut down. I just want to tell people what's 0:02:04.440 --> 0:02:09.960 happening there, and I want to stress that we this 0:02:10.000 --> 0:02:12.919 week have certainly heard from a lot of you. We 0:02:13.080 --> 0:02:15.720 looked at all your comments, and so we're going to 0:02:15.760 --> 0:02:19.639 be joined by Charlemagne the God Lenara McKelvey, host of 0:02:19.680 --> 0:02:22.680 the Breakfast Club, who had his own thoughts about what 0:02:22.720 --> 0:02:26.760 we shared and quite frankly disagreed with the discussion and 0:02:27.160 --> 0:02:28.919 wants to come on and join and share his thoughts 0:02:29.000 --> 0:02:33.560 on what anti intellectualism is to him. And so I 0:02:33.560 --> 0:02:35.880 think that will be a very spirited discussion. So stay 0:02:35.880 --> 0:02:38.919 tuned for that conversation. But for now, let's kick off 0:02:38.919 --> 0:02:43.000 the show. I oh, I think Beyonce is in the building. 0:02:43.440 --> 0:02:46.119 AOL, AOL dial. 0:02:45.960 --> 0:02:48.359 Up, get fixed, Bacary, Like, what's going on? 0:02:49.160 --> 0:02:52.440 Man? Look, this is called this is called Orangeburg, South Carolina. 0:02:52.480 --> 0:02:53.200 We welcome to the. 0:02:53.160 --> 0:02:58.920 Technological Okay, Well, we just went through our rundown on 0:02:58.960 --> 0:03:00.280 what we want to talk about. And I know that 0:03:00.320 --> 0:03:02.679 you had mentioned that you wanted to talk about something 0:03:02.680 --> 0:03:04.720 with the Congressional Black Caucus. I wasn't clear, So you 0:03:04.720 --> 0:03:05.720 should tell the viewers. 0:03:05.919 --> 0:03:07.400 Yeah, No, I mean I think that people need to 0:03:07.440 --> 0:03:10.120 understand that the Congressional Black Caucus is at risk. I 0:03:10.160 --> 0:03:13.000 think that you know what's going on with the rulings 0:03:13.000 --> 0:03:15.120 in the Supreme Court and what you're seeing throughout the South. 0:03:15.600 --> 0:03:17.639 Many of your CBC members are at risk of having 0:03:17.680 --> 0:03:20.960 their seats either squashed, cut in half, or disappeared. So 0:03:21.040 --> 0:03:23.560 it's something we need to raise awareness about, you know what. 0:03:23.639 --> 0:03:24.760 And that reminds me. 0:03:24.800 --> 0:03:28.440 We did get a really great viewer question on section 0:03:28.480 --> 0:03:30.480 two of the Voting Rights Act, so I'd love for 0:03:30.560 --> 0:03:32.040 you and Andrew to weigh in on those. 0:03:35.400 --> 0:03:36.240 For now, I have to. 0:03:36.240 --> 0:03:41.840 Tell you, I'm really concerned with Donald Trump asking for 0:03:41.960 --> 0:03:45.320 restitution from the Department of Justice. 0:03:45.320 --> 0:03:48.280 Can you explain to people exactly what that is. 0:03:48.280 --> 0:03:49.880 Explain it to me like a five year old, because 0:03:49.880 --> 0:03:50.680 I'm still. 0:03:50.400 --> 0:03:52.840 Following well for those who had forgotten, because there it 0:03:52.840 --> 0:03:55.320 feels like we've lived a decade in the last ten months. 0:03:55.760 --> 0:03:59.240 Donald Trump, before he was elected president in twenty twenty four, 0:03:59.840 --> 0:04:04.440 was charged with ninety one different counts, different felony counts. 0:04:05.120 --> 0:04:06.360 They ended up dropping three. 0:04:06.400 --> 0:04:09.880 It was reduced down to eighty eight and he was convicted. 0:04:10.160 --> 0:04:13.280 I think it was it was it thirty two felonies 0:04:13.320 --> 0:04:17.840 on the state level. Now he's saying because all of 0:04:17.880 --> 0:04:23.800 the cases that were that were mounted against him, brought 0:04:23.839 --> 0:04:26.480 by the federal government, brought by the Department of Justice. 0:04:26.839 --> 0:04:30.240 They were thrown out. He now wants restitution. But see 0:04:30.279 --> 0:04:31.560 here here, here's how it goes. 0:04:31.600 --> 0:04:36.159 Friend, Just because the case was thrown out doesn't mean 0:04:36.200 --> 0:04:39.479 that it was a malicious or selective prosecution. It was 0:04:39.520 --> 0:04:42.359 thrown out because you're lawyers, not you, Tiff. I'm just 0:04:42.360 --> 0:04:45.640 looking at you, Tiff. But his lawyers said, you know 0:04:45.680 --> 0:04:49.200 what we're gonna challenge forget civil immunity. We're gonna go 0:04:49.240 --> 0:04:52.159 for criminal immunity for anyone who served as president. That 0:04:52.279 --> 0:04:56.320 means that you cannot be liable, convicted, charged for any 0:04:56.320 --> 0:04:59.800 criminal rondoing if you did it under the auspices of 0:04:59.839 --> 0:05:03.039 be being president of these United States. So the charges 0:05:03.080 --> 0:05:06.640 that he no longer faced federally were because they could 0:05:06.640 --> 0:05:10.719 no longer bring those cases because he's now criminally immune. 0:05:10.760 --> 0:05:13.360 That's what the Supreme Court decided. So he said, let 0:05:13.360 --> 0:05:15.640 me take it a step further with my white privilege. 0:05:16.080 --> 0:05:19.760 Let me see if since I was never tried, or 0:05:19.880 --> 0:05:22.760 since the cases were thrown out, can I get you 0:05:22.839 --> 0:05:25.920 to run me my money that's not mine? So he said, tif, 0:05:26.040 --> 0:05:29.200 you pay it to this taxpayer bucket. I want your 0:05:29.279 --> 0:05:32.880 money to come to my pockets now and pay two 0:05:33.000 --> 0:05:37.719 hundred and thirty million dollars of restitution for these charges 0:05:37.760 --> 0:05:40.400 that I wasn't convicted of. Again, not because he didn't 0:05:40.400 --> 0:05:42.440 do it, just but just because he's immune. 0:05:42.440 --> 0:05:43.320 He's trying to see. 0:05:43.160 --> 0:05:46.359 How far he the judges to the Supreme Court that 0:05:46.440 --> 0:05:47.679 decided imune. 0:05:47.960 --> 0:05:50.279 Yes, that's true as well what he did, that's true 0:05:50.279 --> 0:05:54.479 as well. But the thing that is yes, no, but 0:05:54.560 --> 0:05:56.120 it's but it's true as well. And I think the 0:05:56.160 --> 0:06:00.000 other thing that's important to understand is the Florida judge 0:06:00.200 --> 0:06:02.720 who he did appoint also Andrew not just the Supreme 0:06:02.720 --> 0:06:07.800 Court justices, but Eileen Cannon said they that they've made 0:06:07.880 --> 0:06:12.760 two separate claims. No, they've I'm sorry, I'm so sorry. 0:06:12.760 --> 0:06:15.400 I'm looking at the wrong thing. They that they've made. 0:06:15.560 --> 0:06:17.680 In the case of mar A Lago Judge Eileen Cannon, 0:06:17.720 --> 0:06:19.760 who ruled in favor of Donald Trump on some very 0:06:19.760 --> 0:06:23.520 controversial issues. The one thing that Judge Cannon, who he appointed, 0:06:24.000 --> 0:06:26.359 did not rule on was that the search of his 0:06:26.480 --> 0:06:29.600 mar A Lago compound was improper or violated his rights. 0:06:29.800 --> 0:06:32.279 So let's say that there was some wrongdoing which would 0:06:32.520 --> 0:06:33.839 be the reason for restitution. 0:06:34.600 --> 0:06:36.880 There was none, and so he just says, let. 0:06:36.720 --> 0:06:39.120 Me just see if because there's a gray area or 0:06:39.120 --> 0:06:42.160 a place where it's silent, I can now recover something. 0:06:42.480 --> 0:06:44.279 He claims that what he would do with the money 0:06:44.760 --> 0:06:46.840 is that for that east wing that he's now torn down, 0:06:46.920 --> 0:06:49.320 he's over there destroying the White House and Kseyawn missed it. 0:06:49.680 --> 0:06:52.440 For that east wing, I'm going to use that money 0:06:52.480 --> 0:06:55.359 to build out this grand ballroom that the country so 0:06:55.480 --> 0:06:57.320 desperately needs in the middle of a shutdown. 0:06:57.600 --> 0:06:59.960 This sounds like, man, he's not planning on leaving the 0:07:00.000 --> 0:07:02.400 White House with maccari. Let me ask you, how likely 0:07:03.400 --> 0:07:05.000 is this to happen? Like, do we think that he 0:07:05.040 --> 0:07:07.479 will actually get two hundred and thirty million dollars of 0:07:07.560 --> 0:07:10.520 taxpayer money and restitution based on what Angela just said? 0:07:13.680 --> 0:07:18.240 He should not. Angela highlighted something that was very important 0:07:18.240 --> 0:07:20.840 about the reasoning, the legal reasonings why he should not 0:07:21.120 --> 0:07:24.840 and the indictment to regurgitate a little bit wasn't tossed 0:07:24.840 --> 0:07:28.640 out because of some finding of malicious prosecution. The timeline 0:07:28.720 --> 0:07:33.760 goes the indictments were actually just and prudent based upon 0:07:33.840 --> 0:07:39.120 what the prosecutor believed. However, subsequently, the challenges to presidential 0:07:39.160 --> 0:07:41.960 immunity were made to the Supreme Court and that expanded, 0:07:42.000 --> 0:07:45.440 and I think that timeline is very important. And so 0:07:46.200 --> 0:07:50.560 you know, it becomes a weird question. So does he 0:07:50.720 --> 0:07:58.040 pardon himself? Is that necessary to happen? The conflict is inherent, 0:07:58.120 --> 0:08:00.000 But as we know, the conflict of interest is now 0:08:00.120 --> 0:08:03.320 or bothered this White House because ultimately, and this is 0:08:03.360 --> 0:08:05.800 why I'm hesitant about saying no to the question that 0:08:05.840 --> 0:08:09.920 you asked Tiffany, Ultimately, the decision made about who's going 0:08:10.000 --> 0:08:12.600 to pay out that Tort Claim Act is going to 0:08:12.640 --> 0:08:15.840 come from the Department of Justice, where we see there 0:08:15.920 --> 0:08:18.920 is no separation. There is some unique case law over 0:08:19.000 --> 0:08:21.720 who can bring a tort claims a case which is 0:08:21.720 --> 0:08:24.600 what this falls under, is called the Federal FTCA Federal 0:08:24.640 --> 0:08:28.640 Tort Claims at case. And you know there are intentional 0:08:28.640 --> 0:08:30.520 acts that you can file a case against the federal 0:08:30.600 --> 0:08:34.760 government for you can just actually file a notice and 0:08:35.160 --> 0:08:38.160 those cases can be resolved on the basis of that notice. 0:08:38.160 --> 0:08:41.280 And so I really don't know this is this like 0:08:41.360 --> 0:08:44.840 many other things we deal with, this unprecedented novel ground. 0:08:44.960 --> 0:08:48.079 But if there was some level of ethics, the answer 0:08:48.160 --> 0:08:51.040 would be no. And this would be something that you 0:08:51.080 --> 0:08:53.000 probably wouldn't even bring up right now if you're a 0:08:53.000 --> 0:08:55.000 president of the United States. But I wouldn't be surprised 0:08:55.040 --> 0:08:57.200 if you got a check written on the backs of 0:08:57.280 --> 0:08:57.600 tax pack. 0:08:57.679 --> 0:08:59.560 Everyone's seen Andrew. 0:09:01.559 --> 0:09:05.600 Yes, he's gonna get the money, just as he achieved 0:09:06.360 --> 0:09:09.920 the prosecution of the people he told the US Attorney 0:09:09.920 --> 0:09:13.280 General to prosecute. She turned around and she prosecuted them. 0:09:13.320 --> 0:09:17.160 I don't think there's any with the respect to all 0:09:17.200 --> 0:09:19.680 the legal leaf. I don't think that there is any 0:09:19.760 --> 0:09:23.960 respect towards the law whatsoever. And I don't even believe 0:09:23.960 --> 0:09:26.640 that there's any respect towards the process. If the president 0:09:26.640 --> 0:09:28.720 tweets that he ought to get his money back from 0:09:28.760 --> 0:09:34.840 his appointed attorney general for cases that, in his words, 0:09:34.880 --> 0:09:37.680 should have never been bought and that he was never 0:09:37.720 --> 0:09:40.920 found guilty of, and of course you've heard the reasoning 0:09:40.920 --> 0:09:43.800 as to why those things didn't need to play themselves out. 0:09:44.040 --> 0:09:46.360 I think he's going to get exactly what he asked for, period. 0:09:46.679 --> 0:09:49.200 And he's telling the American people that he's going to 0:09:49.240 --> 0:09:53.760 achieve these things, and he's so gratuitous with his winnings 0:09:53.960 --> 0:09:55.320 that he's going to put it right back in the 0:09:55.320 --> 0:09:58.679 American government on an expense the American people didn't ask for, 0:09:59.280 --> 0:10:02.760 were not budget through the budgeting process, but that we're 0:10:02.800 --> 0:10:04.679 decided by the president. And I think he's going to 0:10:04.760 --> 0:10:06.600 get him and I think he'll get his money back 0:10:06.640 --> 0:10:08.880 to and if you should choose to redivert that two 0:10:08.920 --> 0:10:10.880 hundred and forty million back to his own pocket at 0:10:10.920 --> 0:10:12.760 some point, I'm sure he'll figure way to make that 0:10:12.800 --> 0:10:15.599 happen as well. I think this is a White House unconstrained, 0:10:15.640 --> 0:10:20.400 the president, unconstrained, the Attorney General unconstrained. I just hope, 0:10:20.760 --> 0:10:22.920 and I hope, and I hope, and I say this 0:10:23.200 --> 0:10:26.280 with the beliefs that it will happen, that there'll be 0:10:26.320 --> 0:10:29.080 a day after Donald Trump, and if the people who 0:10:29.280 --> 0:10:34.240 then have executed and excavated and worked around and buried 0:10:34.320 --> 0:10:37.360 underneath the laws will know that those laws will be 0:10:37.440 --> 0:10:38.679 back to haunt them one day too. 0:10:39.280 --> 0:10:40.760 I just want to say one other thing that I 0:10:40.760 --> 0:10:42.040 think is if we're in b I see you, and 0:10:42.720 --> 0:10:45.719 I will yield in just a second. Donald Trump is 0:10:45.760 --> 0:10:48.240 maintaining that any decision about whether or not he gets 0:10:48.320 --> 0:10:53.280 restitution or not will be based upon or This means 0:10:53.320 --> 0:10:55.840 that the decision will absolutely come across his desk, so 0:10:55.920 --> 0:10:59.360 he thinks that Pam BONDI will decide is the decider, 0:10:59.440 --> 0:11:01.600 and then he will sign off on it. The one 0:11:01.679 --> 0:11:04.640 flag that I have is that DJ is saying that 0:11:04.679 --> 0:11:10.800 they will defer to the career prosecutors at DJ. The 0:11:10.880 --> 0:11:14.160 problem is they're firing those, so he just will hire 0:11:14.760 --> 0:11:18.160 new you know, a career folks. And now I think 0:11:18.160 --> 0:11:20.480 that's the other problem. Yeah, I know you're about to 0:11:20.520 --> 0:11:22.280 say something, you know, Yeah. 0:11:22.080 --> 0:11:25.680 I mean, I have a really unique relationship with Merrick Garland. 0:11:26.280 --> 0:11:28.760 But this is when the criticism of Merrick Garland comes 0:11:28.800 --> 0:11:30.120 into play full front of. 0:11:30.200 --> 0:11:31.680 You should have him come on the show. 0:11:32.920 --> 0:11:35.000 I think, I mean, I think I will. Merrick Garland 0:11:35.080 --> 0:11:37.560 is a unique figure because I've actually seen him work. 0:11:38.000 --> 0:11:40.599 I worked diligently and closely with Merrick Garland and the 0:11:40.600 --> 0:11:43.679 biggest civil rights case that I had, Merrick Garland had 0:11:43.720 --> 0:11:46.760 to literally go over to the FBI building and meet 0:11:46.760 --> 0:11:49.360 with Christopher Ray at the time so that they would 0:11:49.400 --> 0:11:52.480 settle the Mother Emanuel case. It was eighty eight million 0:11:52.520 --> 0:11:54.839 dollars paid out to one of the most violent civil 0:11:54.960 --> 0:11:58.520 rights cases we've ever seen in the history of this country. 0:11:58.559 --> 0:12:01.880 I saw him spend time with those families. I saw 0:12:01.960 --> 0:12:06.120 him move mountains to make justice work. But then, you know, 0:12:06.160 --> 0:12:08.760 the flip side is you see what happens when justice 0:12:08.760 --> 0:12:13.000 moves too slowly and when justice has what is somewhat 0:12:13.040 --> 0:12:15.840 of a level of cowardice when it comes to taking 0:12:15.840 --> 0:12:18.320 on those who need to be prosecuted. Because if Marion 0:12:18.360 --> 0:12:22.960 Garland prosecuted Donald Trump the way we see other dignitaries 0:12:22.960 --> 0:12:26.240 and other countries prosecuted, we wouldn't be here, Which brings 0:12:26.280 --> 0:12:28.400 me to my second point, which is Democrats are going 0:12:28.440 --> 0:12:30.720 to have to have the courage in twenty twenty eight 0:12:30.800 --> 0:12:32.520 to run on the fact that they are going to 0:12:32.559 --> 0:12:36.560 prosecute those individuals who profoundly flaunted the law and not 0:12:36.720 --> 0:12:39.440 do what democrats do, which is just to say America 0:12:39.480 --> 0:12:41.880 wants to turn the page, let's wash our hands at 0:12:41.920 --> 0:12:44.320 this and not mention it. And so I think they 0:12:44.559 --> 0:12:47.320 looking back at history is that great is a great 0:12:47.360 --> 0:12:50.000 metric for looking forward at what we should expect from 0:12:50.000 --> 0:12:52.840 our especially people running for president of the United States. 0:12:53.920 --> 0:12:55.920 It's just frightening to me. 0:12:56.120 --> 0:13:03.080 I you know, America introduced that the ridiculous term banana 0:13:03.120 --> 0:13:06.680 Republic because it was really you know, making fun of 0:13:07.080 --> 0:13:10.959 Latin countries for corruption, but when you look at how 0:13:11.000 --> 0:13:16.640 they've handled their corrupt leaders. Argentina prosecuted their former president. 0:13:16.640 --> 0:13:19.680 We saw the same thing in Brazil at Bolsonaro. And 0:13:19.760 --> 0:13:22.560 to look at this happening here in America. For us 0:13:22.600 --> 0:13:24.560 as black folks, I think we've always viewed it as 0:13:24.559 --> 0:13:27.480 a very corrupt country. We've never looked at this government. 0:13:27.520 --> 0:13:29.560 It's something that was on the up and up. But 0:13:29.640 --> 0:13:32.959 to see it so brazenly and blatantly taking place before 0:13:32.960 --> 0:13:36.120 our eyes, I just I still question every single day, 0:13:36.840 --> 0:13:39.800 six months from now, what will I regret not doing today. 0:13:40.200 --> 0:13:44.120 You know, we are seeing a country that arrests his 0:13:44.280 --> 0:13:48.640 political enemies. We are seeing a country that calls for 0:13:49.240 --> 0:13:53.160 the killing of people who host ai videos of him 0:13:53.200 --> 0:13:56.560 literally taking a shit on protesters while wearing a queen tat, 0:13:56.679 --> 0:14:00.920 not a king, not a king's crown, a queen crown. 0:14:01.200 --> 0:14:02.560 So I you know, I don't know. 0:14:02.720 --> 0:14:07.200 I'm just very distraught seeing these things take place before 0:14:07.200 --> 0:14:08.160 our eyes every single day. 0:14:08.200 --> 0:14:10.000 It's incredibly frightening. 0:14:10.040 --> 0:14:14.400 Andrew, I mean, the only surprise here is that he 0:14:14.480 --> 0:14:20.200 waited this long for the grift. You would have thought, 0:14:20.440 --> 0:14:22.120 being Donald Trump, being Donald Trump, that he would have 0:14:22.160 --> 0:14:25.080 went for the money first. To be quite honest with you, 0:14:25.120 --> 0:14:28.480 I never thought that him trying to make himself whole 0:14:29.440 --> 0:14:31.960 from the legal cases that he well earned in this 0:14:32.040 --> 0:14:35.640 country was going to be so delayed. I really thought 0:14:35.640 --> 0:14:38.440 that it'd be in the front door. He would excuse 0:14:38.520 --> 0:14:42.800 himself the charges and get his money, rather get his 0:14:42.920 --> 0:14:45.320 money and maybe then excuse himself for the charges. But 0:14:45.400 --> 0:14:47.040 one thing that I think the American people know to 0:14:47.040 --> 0:14:49.240 be clear about this man is he is very clear 0:14:49.280 --> 0:14:52.000 on the grift. He is always coming for the money. 0:14:52.520 --> 0:14:55.160 Always follow the money with the man. He's coming for it. 0:14:55.520 --> 0:14:57.680 This is not an afterthought for Donald Trump. This was 0:14:57.720 --> 0:15:01.880 probably a before thought that somebody convinced him to integrate 0:15:01.920 --> 0:15:04.720 a little later into the game. But he was always 0:15:04.800 --> 0:15:05.640 coming for the pocket. 0:15:05.960 --> 0:15:07.840 Oh well, we have we have a lot to get 0:15:07.880 --> 0:15:09.680 to on the show today, and we still have our 0:15:09.720 --> 0:15:11.680 conversation coming up with Charlemagne and God. So I want 0:15:11.680 --> 0:15:13.360 to close us out on this. But I have to 0:15:13.360 --> 0:15:15.080 say I've been looking at some of the archives of 0:15:15.080 --> 0:15:17.240 interviews I did five or six years ago, and it's 0:15:17.280 --> 0:15:20.000 amazing what we knew about Donald Trump then. And it 0:15:20.000 --> 0:15:22.520 feels like America has failed an open book test. 0:15:22.800 --> 0:15:24.600 We knew then that he was corrupt. 0:15:24.680 --> 0:15:26.720 We knew then that in the first few months of 0:15:26.760 --> 0:15:30.240 the administration his family made over eighty billion dollars off 0:15:30.280 --> 0:15:33.200 a grift on the government. So it's frightening to see this. 0:15:33.520 --> 0:15:35.560 But I always like to make sure that we include 0:15:35.600 --> 0:15:39.120 our viewers. You for watching and listening, so thank you 0:15:39.160 --> 0:15:42.240 for sending in your videos. And we have one question 0:15:42.320 --> 0:15:44.760 now on section two of the Voting Rights Act, so 0:15:44.800 --> 0:15:45.360 let's get to that. 0:15:47.440 --> 0:15:51.000 Hi, Native Lamb, my husband and I just said us 0:15:51.040 --> 0:15:54.720 watching the episode, the latest episode one oh one, and 0:15:54.880 --> 0:16:03.400 we're trying to figure out his voters at voters Section two. 0:16:03.040 --> 0:16:06.040 He broke it down for me, gave me a better 0:16:06.120 --> 0:16:08.520 understanding vot he thinks. 0:16:08.680 --> 0:16:09.520 But we just want to. 0:16:09.520 --> 0:16:13.400 Make sure that we understand correctly why the Supreme Court 0:16:13.600 --> 0:16:17.640 is hearing this case and how will it affect the 0:16:17.640 --> 0:16:21.120 black community. So you can break it down for us 0:16:21.160 --> 0:16:24.360 and lamor lamess terms, that would be amazing. 0:16:26.400 --> 0:16:27.760 I don't know if it's a good guest or not, 0:16:27.840 --> 0:16:29.480 but it looks like she and her husband in the 0:16:29.520 --> 0:16:32.920 middle of a workout and they're discussing our show. As 0:16:33.040 --> 0:16:35.880 I want to appreciate them for working us into that 0:16:36.640 --> 0:16:40.480 and this is not different, Bacardi, than what you were 0:16:40.520 --> 0:16:43.240 mentioning at the at the earlier part of the show. 0:16:44.760 --> 0:16:47.000 You know, Section two is the part of the Voting 0:16:47.080 --> 0:16:52.440 Rights Act where essentially it allows for communities of sort 0:16:52.480 --> 0:16:56.480 of shared interests to be able to make the choice 0:16:56.520 --> 0:17:00.760 of their choosing. And to put that another way, it's 0:17:00.800 --> 0:17:06.639 one of the few ways in which the the Constitution 0:17:07.400 --> 0:17:11.600 and its subjugate amendments along the way allows for people's 0:17:11.760 --> 0:17:15.880 race to really be considered in there and in its representation. 0:17:16.600 --> 0:17:19.480 We know already through the weakening of Section two that 0:17:19.600 --> 0:17:21.919 the that the Court, at least as it's made up 0:17:21.960 --> 0:17:27.280 right now, is permitting gerrymandering or at least lines to 0:17:27.359 --> 0:17:30.800 be drawn, congressional lines to be drawn based off of 0:17:31.040 --> 0:17:35.320 how a party can gain political advantage. But it has 0:17:35.400 --> 0:17:39.600 come short of allowing lines to be drawn that basically 0:17:42.080 --> 0:17:46.520 allow for uh communities of color and communities of shared 0:17:46.560 --> 0:17:51.639 interest to be chopped up, to be reduced, to be 0:17:51.800 --> 0:17:54.760 manipulated in such a way that they lose representation or 0:17:54.800 --> 0:18:00.360 access to representation and its seats in Congress. And I'm 0:18:00.400 --> 0:18:02.959 getting why this is actually so difficult for a lot 0:18:02.960 --> 0:18:04.920 of people to understand. And I didn't have to look 0:18:04.920 --> 0:18:07.919 any further than thinking about the state of Florida, wherever 0:18:07.960 --> 0:18:11.640 the last several years, Ronda Santis has basically gotten rid 0:18:11.680 --> 0:18:14.240 of black access seats all around the state of Florida 0:18:14.520 --> 0:18:17.680 and Central Florida and North Florida, made attempts in South 0:18:17.680 --> 0:18:22.439 Florida where previously these were seats were unambiguously held by 0:18:22.520 --> 0:18:26.680 black elected officials who won them through a court's consent decree, 0:18:26.760 --> 0:18:31.280 a court's instruction that these seas be created. Donald Trump 0:18:31.400 --> 0:18:34.800 Junior or Ronda Santis has decided summarily to go through 0:18:34.920 --> 0:18:39.160 and redraw these lines, splitting black people out of the district, 0:18:39.800 --> 0:18:43.720 creating districts that are more super white with shreds or 0:18:43.840 --> 0:18:47.320 shards of black people represented in them, where the end 0:18:47.400 --> 0:18:49.840 result is that you cannot elect a black person to 0:18:49.960 --> 0:18:52.600 Congress based off of who gets to vote in those elections. 0:18:53.440 --> 0:18:55.359 So where we now find ourselves is that because this 0:18:55.440 --> 0:18:57.919 has happened in so many places, think about the states 0:18:58.240 --> 0:19:02.399 of Mississippi, of Alabama in some cases, the attempts that 0:19:02.440 --> 0:19:04.880 are being made in Georgia, but all over the South 0:19:04.920 --> 0:19:07.440 where you have black folks who are I don't know, 0:19:07.600 --> 0:19:10.680 a third of the population that come close to forty 0:19:10.760 --> 0:19:13.680 or fifty percent of the population of a place, but somehow, 0:19:13.720 --> 0:19:16.840 when it comes to their congressional representation, of six seats 0:19:16.880 --> 0:19:19.400 that are available to that state, only one of them 0:19:19.520 --> 0:19:22.560 has a Black representative in them, even though black people 0:19:22.600 --> 0:19:26.240 are more than forty percent of a state's population. You understand, 0:19:26.320 --> 0:19:28.440 the point that we're trying to make is that you 0:19:28.520 --> 0:19:31.679 can have enough black people in a state to create 0:19:31.840 --> 0:19:36.879 a significant minority, but those votes are never enough to 0:19:37.000 --> 0:19:40.560 create I don't know, out of a state of six seats, 0:19:41.080 --> 0:19:44.000 two or three of those seats being Black access seats. 0:19:44.680 --> 0:19:47.000 So this is not a crisis for a lot of 0:19:47.000 --> 0:19:49.480 people in America anymore, because they have had to live 0:19:49.560 --> 0:19:53.159 through instances where our seats have been slowly but surely 0:19:53.680 --> 0:19:56.600 taken down, and, to Begardi's point earlier in the show, 0:19:56.760 --> 0:19:59.360 eventually going to be taken out such to the point 0:19:59.400 --> 0:20:03.240 that we may not even have a representative congressional Black 0:20:03.280 --> 0:20:04.840 caucus in the US Congress anymore. 0:20:05.240 --> 0:20:07.720 That's what I wanted to ask Andrew, So sorry for interrupting, 0:20:07.760 --> 0:20:12.479 but you're kicking it right over to Bikari Bakari. I mean, 0:20:12.640 --> 0:20:14.480 was that the point that you were making is that 0:20:14.560 --> 0:20:16.479 what you mean that we could literally be looking at 0:20:16.600 --> 0:20:19.440 no more Congressional Black Caucus, which I would imagine potentially 0:20:19.520 --> 0:20:24.280 means no more tricoccus, no more k pak, no more cecio. 0:20:24.520 --> 0:20:30.119 I mean, I mean, I use some some sensationalistic language. 0:20:30.160 --> 0:20:32.639 I mean, but the number of black members will go 0:20:32.720 --> 0:20:38.040 down exponentially. I mean you'll be talking about districts like 0:20:38.560 --> 0:20:40.920 I think the sixth Congressional district in South Carolina, where 0:20:40.920 --> 0:20:42.640 I say it is probably the best example. After Jim 0:20:42.680 --> 0:20:45.920 Cliburn leaves. You can maneuver that district in places that 0:20:46.440 --> 0:20:48.640 you know that district is now twenty five percent black, 0:20:48.720 --> 0:20:51.000 and there there's an argument that you know, it makes 0:20:51.080 --> 0:20:53.399 other districts more competitive, but what we do know is 0:20:53.480 --> 0:20:56.640 that that would be one less CBC member, and you'll 0:20:56.680 --> 0:21:00.560 see that happen throughout the South in particular. And then 0:21:00.840 --> 0:21:03.240 you know, just to add a little cruelty, which sometimes 0:21:03.280 --> 0:21:05.400 that is the point, you just put two black people 0:21:05.440 --> 0:21:08.000 in one district and make them negroes fight it out. 0:21:08.200 --> 0:21:12.560 And that is happening, if I'm not mistaken. In South Florida, 0:21:12.920 --> 0:21:17.240 it's actually w Washman shows and a black Yeah debut 0:21:17.280 --> 0:21:20.480 Watchman shows and what's my other member's name, But it's certainly. 0:21:20.200 --> 0:21:23.800 What's happening in Texas. It's definitely worth what's happening in 0:21:23.880 --> 0:21:24.520 Texas right now? 0:21:25.480 --> 0:21:27.800 Yeah, yeah, exactly exactly. 0:21:27.960 --> 0:21:30.360 So you're seeing those things, and yes, I shout out 0:21:30.400 --> 0:21:32.359 to watching the show, I appreciate you. But those are 0:21:32.520 --> 0:21:34.960 those are the results of the actions that are taking 0:21:35.000 --> 0:21:36.119 place right now, I could. 0:21:36.000 --> 0:21:39.840 Say, quickly, very quickly, I just want to emphasize the 0:21:39.920 --> 0:21:42.320 difference between Section two and Section five, which we no 0:21:42.440 --> 0:21:46.119 longer have. Section two was preclearance, states that had a 0:21:46.200 --> 0:21:50.320 pattern in practice of discrimination had to submit their plans, 0:21:50.359 --> 0:21:53.560 their voter plans ahead of time to get approval, and 0:21:54.000 --> 0:21:57.359 Section two now rest on the burden rest on the 0:21:57.520 --> 0:22:00.080 voter to prove that they were deprived of this of 0:22:00.160 --> 0:22:04.040 being able to exercise their franchise and being able to 0:22:04.119 --> 0:22:07.200 elect a representative of their choice. There was a three 0:22:07.320 --> 0:22:11.520 part test in the Gingles case that Janey Nelson shout 0:22:11.520 --> 0:22:13.360 out to Jenney, we already talked to her last week, 0:22:13.680 --> 0:22:16.080 referenced in her oral arguments last week. I won't go 0:22:16.200 --> 0:22:18.880 through that three part test, but that is also available 0:22:18.920 --> 0:22:19.800 for people to understand. 0:22:19.880 --> 0:22:20.840 So now all of the. 0:22:20.880 --> 0:22:23.880 Burdens for black folks, brown folks who want to see 0:22:23.920 --> 0:22:26.639 themselves protected, voting rights protected, they have to rely on 0:22:26.720 --> 0:22:29.639 Section two if the Supreme Court doesn't also gut that, 0:22:29.760 --> 0:22:31.200 which is it is looking like? 0:22:31.400 --> 0:22:34.120 And Jennae Nelson, of course runs the NAACPLDF and as 0:22:34.119 --> 0:22:37.200 a black woman who argued before the Supreme Court, antiplated 0:22:37.200 --> 0:22:38.800 a great interview with her. If you haven't seen it, 0:22:38.840 --> 0:22:39.600 you should check it out. 0:22:40.280 --> 0:22:45.280 Only one it out, okay? I haply saying that the 0:22:45.440 --> 0:22:49.359 government right now would be the agency that has the 0:22:49.440 --> 0:22:52.840 grounds for legitimacy to bring these cases to the court 0:22:53.240 --> 0:22:56.119 on behalf of the voters. That is the piece that 0:22:56.840 --> 0:23:00.920 the US Supreme Court delayed taking additional action on the 0:23:01.080 --> 0:23:03.240 supp If the course should come to the conclusion that 0:23:03.320 --> 0:23:06.920 the government is the only entity that can argue that 0:23:08.280 --> 0:23:11.960 a state is out of line with any with any 0:23:13.000 --> 0:23:16.479 how do you say failty to the law, then if 0:23:16.520 --> 0:23:20.760 we were relying on Donald Trump's judiciary to bring that case, 0:23:21.119 --> 0:23:23.960 those cases would never come Why Because Pambondy in this 0:23:24.119 --> 0:23:28.119 case has decided against the standard government position. She's now 0:23:28.200 --> 0:23:30.200 on the other side of the government's. 0:23:29.880 --> 0:23:33.000 Arguments state governments. Andrew, just for clarity, is the state governments. 0:23:33.000 --> 0:23:34.800 They're bringing it, and we're also up a crete there. 0:23:35.440 --> 0:23:38.600 All I'm saying is that the federal government's previous position, 0:23:38.960 --> 0:23:43.040 all the way up until Pambondi's administration here was always 0:23:43.080 --> 0:23:50.080 on this was the government's position, wasn't upholding these respective 0:23:50.080 --> 0:23:52.960 standards of the law. If their position now is to 0:23:53.080 --> 0:23:56.800 collapse those to say, the state government is right to 0:23:56.920 --> 0:23:59.119 have no argument on the other side, and then the 0:23:59.200 --> 0:24:01.720 states and then the West Supreme Court says that these 0:24:01.800 --> 0:24:05.280 cases cannot be bought by interest groups anymore, like the 0:24:06.440 --> 0:24:09.200 like Janey and what she's doing at the Legal Defense Fund. 0:24:09.480 --> 0:24:11.600 If they no longer are a party to this, who 0:24:11.720 --> 0:24:13.719 is going to bring the legal cases on our behalf? 0:24:13.960 --> 0:24:19.000 Yeah, exactly, that is a question, right, Okay, Andrew was 0:24:19.000 --> 0:24:21.680 always profound. So I hate to cut you off because 0:24:21.680 --> 0:24:23.600 I wanted to hear what you had to say, But 0:24:24.200 --> 0:24:26.480 because our show is so so packed, I do want 0:24:26.520 --> 0:24:29.280 to shift us along because I'm coming right back to you, Andrew, 0:24:29.400 --> 0:24:32.280 because on the other side of this break, Chicago Mayor 0:24:32.359 --> 0:24:35.040 Brandon Johnson has quite the charge for society. 0:24:35.080 --> 0:24:37.240 We're going to get into that right after this. Stay tuned. 0:24:49.040 --> 0:24:55.000 My ancestors as slaves can lead the bravest general strait 0:24:55.400 --> 0:25:02.359 in the history of this country. Operations we can, Gooby said, 0:25:02.520 --> 0:25:21.119 today people people well people to people people relations. We 0:25:21.320 --> 0:25:37.160 are makeupations to boss to live on because of this generation. 0:25:37.640 --> 0:25:40.399 Are you letting to take it to a book to 0:25:40.560 --> 0:25:41.000 the snake? 0:25:42.359 --> 0:25:43.520 He ain't net a lampid. 0:25:43.720 --> 0:25:44.760 My name is Andrea. 0:25:45.240 --> 0:25:48.160 I am originally from Cleveland, Ohio, but I've been living 0:25:48.200 --> 0:25:51.800 in Fort Worth, Texas for the past almost ten years, 0:25:52.359 --> 0:25:56.960 and I wanted to pick y'all brains about Mayor Brandon 0:25:57.040 --> 0:26:01.720 Johnson's call for a general strike during the No King's 0:26:01.800 --> 0:26:07.520 protests this past Saturday on October eighteenth. I think that 0:26:07.840 --> 0:26:13.000 that was a very bold move by an elected official, 0:26:13.440 --> 0:26:18.159 especially during the times of like this administration. And I 0:26:18.280 --> 0:26:21.800 also think that him calling for the general strike on 0:26:21.920 --> 0:26:27.199 a national stage, even though a general strike is nothing new, 0:26:27.240 --> 0:26:30.560 it's not a new concept, but I think he's probably 0:26:30.720 --> 0:26:35.520 one of the few elected officials who has called for 0:26:35.760 --> 0:26:40.600 a general strike to meet this moment. Also, I think 0:26:40.920 --> 0:26:46.840 that in this moment, as Bakari and Tiffany had the 0:26:46.880 --> 0:26:51.240 conversation that during the one hundredth episode about the relationship 0:26:51.320 --> 0:26:55.080 between black men and black women and how Bakari stated that, 0:26:55.320 --> 0:26:58.280 you know, black men don't really get a chance to 0:26:58.359 --> 0:27:00.399 breathe and lead. I feel like think this is a 0:27:00.440 --> 0:27:05.680 perfect opportunity. I feel like Mayor Brendan Johnson has put 0:27:05.760 --> 0:27:09.399 the call to action out and I think it is 0:27:09.520 --> 0:27:13.040 a perfect opportunity for black men to meet the moment. 0:27:14.040 --> 0:27:15.040 I think that's you, Andrew. 0:27:15.840 --> 0:27:18.920 Oh, well, there's the resident black man not meeting moments. 0:27:21.080 --> 0:27:21.840 Now what that meant? 0:27:22.240 --> 0:27:25.200 I take her at her words, and I appreciate everything 0:27:25.240 --> 0:27:26.960 she had to say and the question the framing. I 0:27:27.040 --> 0:27:32.440 appreciate also the seriousness by which she interpreted the mayor's comments. 0:27:33.760 --> 0:27:36.800 I don't think it got covered in real broad swaths 0:27:36.920 --> 0:27:40.080 of American media that a general strike had been called 0:27:40.119 --> 0:27:42.600 for by the mayor of Chicago. It's one of the 0:27:42.760 --> 0:27:45.800 largest municipalities in the country. He sits at one of 0:27:45.880 --> 0:27:49.840 the most powerful purchases of political power, and he did 0:27:49.920 --> 0:27:54.480 admonish us to hold corporations accountable for their complicity in 0:27:54.560 --> 0:27:58.680 the moment. I thought it was powerful. I honestly, I 0:27:58.760 --> 0:28:01.240 wish that it was accompanied by more fanfare, that more 0:28:01.280 --> 0:28:05.879 people said what a thing was similar to what this 0:28:06.040 --> 0:28:11.679 viewer did. I question if the American people are prepared 0:28:11.760 --> 0:28:14.680 to demonstrate the kind of appetite for resistance that we 0:28:14.840 --> 0:28:19.680 say not just in a weekend's protest, but in a 0:28:19.800 --> 0:28:22.440 day in and a day out, weekend, week out, month 0:28:22.520 --> 0:28:29.359 and month out, resistance toward putting our financial dollars behind 0:28:29.400 --> 0:28:32.280 a system and behind a set of systems and corporations 0:28:32.640 --> 0:28:36.679 who have fallen fidal to this autocratic form of government, 0:28:37.000 --> 0:28:39.440 who basically saying we're okay with this so long as 0:28:39.480 --> 0:28:42.200 we keep making money, or we're okay with it so 0:28:42.320 --> 0:28:47.400 long as our deals toward consolidation of company X and 0:28:47.600 --> 0:28:52.920 Y still go forward. Or you saw with Salesforce, one 0:28:52.960 --> 0:28:55.800 of the most impactful companies in this country, the chairman 0:28:55.880 --> 0:28:59.040 of their foundation board back up, and basically, I don't 0:28:59.080 --> 0:29:02.200 recognize Benioff, don't recognize the person who I thought I 0:29:02.400 --> 0:29:05.560 was in good company with accomplishing good things for the 0:29:05.600 --> 0:29:10.080 American people when you agree with the President sending the 0:29:10.160 --> 0:29:13.760 National Guard into the excuse me, into the city of 0:29:14.040 --> 0:29:20.760 San Francisco. So I'll just double down on compliments for 0:29:21.960 --> 0:29:26.040 Mayor Johnson on his call, and I would just hope 0:29:26.120 --> 0:29:30.800 similar to how we've seen our brother in Atlanta helped 0:29:30.840 --> 0:29:34.520 to to to that's Jamal Bryant. That is to create 0:29:34.640 --> 0:29:38.000 a framework around what protests out to look like, what 0:29:38.200 --> 0:29:41.000 impact ought to look like. That there's some people who 0:29:41.000 --> 0:29:42.840 are part of that movement who are willing to put 0:29:42.880 --> 0:29:46.520 pen to paper to sketch a to sketch a resistance 0:29:46.560 --> 0:29:49.880 and what that resistance looks like. That might help to 0:29:49.880 --> 0:29:52.200 build the appetite amongst American people to say, you know what, 0:29:52.320 --> 0:29:54.240 I am willing to put my money where my mouth is, 0:29:54.400 --> 0:29:57.640 where my where my street shoes are, and say I 0:29:57.720 --> 0:30:00.840 can protest not just for days resistance, but I can 0:30:00.920 --> 0:30:04.440 protest for the next foreseeable future so that we can 0:30:04.600 --> 0:30:06.920 still have the democracy if we can keep it. 0:30:09.120 --> 0:30:09.800 Angela, what do you? 0:30:09.880 --> 0:30:10.160 What do you? 0:30:11.080 --> 0:30:12.600 I have so many questions I want to hear you. 0:30:12.560 --> 0:30:15.560 At thoughts fars Well, just a few things. The first 0:30:15.600 --> 0:30:17.320 thing is, you know, since we. 0:30:19.120 --> 0:30:24.000 Talk about black intellectualism at least over the last couple podcasts, 0:30:25.520 --> 0:30:29.760 I've been thinking a lot about the approach. We've talked 0:30:29.800 --> 0:30:33.520 before about Congressman Rangel saying whether or not we took 0:30:33.600 --> 0:30:37.240 the right path and in our liberation from economic roots 0:30:37.320 --> 0:30:40.320 versus social roots. We think about the beefs that is, 0:30:40.400 --> 0:30:42.160 like we didn't create beefs y'all believe that, believe it 0:30:42.280 --> 0:30:45.400 or not, between Booker T. Washington and w E b 0:30:45.520 --> 0:30:48.360 DU Boys or w E b DU Boys and Marcus 0:30:48.480 --> 0:30:51.640 Garvey and all of the others Jay Z and oas right, 0:30:51.960 --> 0:30:55.480 all the others that have existed. And I think that 0:30:56.520 --> 0:30:59.800 what comes to mind is that ultimately most of us, 0:31:01.160 --> 0:31:04.280 I say, ninety five percent of us agree that black 0:31:04.320 --> 0:31:06.719 people need to be free in this country. 0:31:07.560 --> 0:31:12.400 We often disagree on the means. And I was looking at. 0:31:13.960 --> 0:31:17.880 Stuff on the General Strike and like, why wb DU 0:31:17.920 --> 0:31:22.400 Boys says that it was enslaved people and their general 0:31:22.440 --> 0:31:25.600 strike that really resulted in our emancipation, and so have 0:31:25.840 --> 0:31:28.520 we since. And I had thought about it because of 0:31:28.560 --> 0:31:30.360 what Brandon said at the top of his remarks, which 0:31:30.400 --> 0:31:32.480 was like, it was our ancestors and the general strike 0:31:32.520 --> 0:31:34.240 that led to our freedom. So I was like, I 0:31:34.400 --> 0:31:36.000 know that from somewhere, and then I was like, Oh, 0:31:36.000 --> 0:31:37.480 it's w B DU Boys, who I just so I 0:31:37.520 --> 0:31:40.280 happen to talk about. But the thing is in Black 0:31:40.440 --> 0:31:43.920 Reconstruction in America, he has an entire chapter on the 0:31:44.040 --> 0:31:46.760 General Strike. And I wonder, if we don't take this 0:31:46.920 --> 0:31:48.640 moment you keep saying to if we need to go 0:31:48.760 --> 0:31:52.200 back and read books, but read the book for how 0:31:52.320 --> 0:31:55.480 it applies in this moment. What is the lesson that 0:31:55.600 --> 0:31:58.000 we can learn the call to action from the various 0:31:58.080 --> 0:32:01.080 scholarly pieces that exist, and if it's quotes from people 0:32:01.080 --> 0:32:04.520 who didn't necessarily write books, but they were an essential 0:32:04.560 --> 0:32:08.560 part of different movements and movement building. What is the 0:32:08.680 --> 0:32:11.960 role of the black person in labor, you know, not 0:32:12.120 --> 0:32:14.680 just the person in black labor leadership, but the actual 0:32:14.840 --> 0:32:16.560 dues paying labor union members. 0:32:16.720 --> 0:32:19.160 Educator, Yeah, what's the role of all of us? 0:32:19.440 --> 0:32:24.360 The commentator, you know, the influencer, who's the creative content producer, 0:32:24.440 --> 0:32:25.120 whatever it is. 0:32:25.840 --> 0:32:28.440 What is the role that we must play in this moment? 0:32:28.520 --> 0:32:30.640 And if we are to strive towards a general strike, 0:32:30.960 --> 0:32:35.360 do we have commonality around understanding for what that means 0:32:35.760 --> 0:32:38.160 at that point? That's not just a boycott of a 0:32:38.240 --> 0:32:42.240 business and withholding your dollar for Black Friday or Christmas Eve. 0:32:42.960 --> 0:32:46.880 Now we're talking about workers saying if you don't respect 0:32:47.000 --> 0:32:50.040 my labor, I don't respect your business and I'm not 0:32:50.160 --> 0:32:54.080 going to go. Do we feel that our people are 0:32:54.760 --> 0:32:59.320 willing to sacrifice their paycheck they're going to work? 0:33:00.120 --> 0:33:00.600 Is a strike? 0:33:01.080 --> 0:33:03.800 Right like it is saying I'm withholding my labor. I'm 0:33:03.840 --> 0:33:07.040 not just withholding my dollar and supporting your business. I'm 0:33:07.120 --> 0:33:11.400 saying that since you don't respect my personhood, you also 0:33:11.440 --> 0:33:13.880 are not going to be a benef You're not gonna 0:33:13.880 --> 0:33:16.480 be gonna be a beneficiary of my labor. I'm going 0:33:16.560 --> 0:33:20.040 to deprive you of that because now we're at a 0:33:20.080 --> 0:33:23.440 crossroads where, you know, it's not just about democracy anymore, 0:33:23.480 --> 0:33:25.960 it's literally about my ability to survive in this space. 0:33:26.480 --> 0:33:28.720 It is dangerous, it's as risky. 0:33:28.880 --> 0:33:31.160 Well it sounds even privileged that that would even be 0:33:31.200 --> 0:33:31.560 a question. 0:33:31.800 --> 0:33:34.200 Well, but you know, but I think that W. E. B. 0:33:34.360 --> 0:33:37.600 Du Bois at the time would argue it was not 0:33:37.800 --> 0:33:41.640 privileged for enslaved people to withhold their labor. It was 0:33:41.680 --> 0:33:44.680 a matter of survival. And so then the question becomes, 0:33:44.840 --> 0:33:47.880 are we at that type of crossroads where now our 0:33:48.040 --> 0:33:51.640 labor and are withholding that labor as risky and as 0:33:51.680 --> 0:33:54.160 sacrificial as it is, is that the only way that 0:33:54.240 --> 0:33:56.280 we'll truly see liberation in this country? 0:33:56.320 --> 0:33:56.760 Well? WB. 0:33:56.840 --> 0:33:59.080 De Boys was also criticized at the time. I mean, 0:33:59.120 --> 0:34:01.360 he you know, and this is of course post slavery, 0:34:01.480 --> 0:34:04.280 where he, you know, was leading a cause and always 0:34:04.400 --> 0:34:07.320 thought that there would be a path in this country 0:34:07.360 --> 0:34:10.759 where black folks could be accepted. You know, he was saying, like, 0:34:10.920 --> 0:34:13.080 no black people. He wasn't saying withhold your labor. He 0:34:13.200 --> 0:34:16.719 was saying, go participate in this system, go fight in 0:34:16.880 --> 0:34:19.000 this war, because then if you do that, you will 0:34:19.200 --> 0:34:22.279 they cannot deny you. They cannot deny your citizenship, they 0:34:22.320 --> 0:34:25.120 cannot deny your equal rights. Of course, he later changed 0:34:25.160 --> 0:34:29.520 that changes, right, Yeah, he changed his attitude. But I'm 0:34:29.600 --> 0:34:31.200 just saying at the time when he was saying that 0:34:31.600 --> 0:34:35.240 there they had be for real, and Marcus Garvey said 0:34:35.480 --> 0:34:37.640 of w E B du boys, this is the white 0:34:37.719 --> 0:34:38.279 man's nigga. 0:34:38.360 --> 0:34:39.040 Y'all listening to you. 0:34:40.239 --> 0:34:43.080 And so I just think at this time I would 0:34:43.080 --> 0:34:47.439 have a hard time telling somebody, yeah, withhold your labor 0:34:47.520 --> 0:34:48.880 and don't get that paycheck, you. 0:34:48.920 --> 0:34:50.920 Know, because that's the very thing Brandon is coming for. 0:34:51.560 --> 0:34:53.600 I agree, this is why I have questions about it. 0:34:53.760 --> 0:34:57.239 And so I'm just trying to think realistically, what does 0:34:57.320 --> 0:34:59.759 it look like for us to not only withhold our labor, 0:35:00.000 --> 0:35:03.000 because now we're talking about with hold our participation in 0:35:03.120 --> 0:35:08.160 this white constructed society, and so any and anytime I 0:35:08.200 --> 0:35:10.520 think about that, I think, Okay, we build our own communities, 0:35:10.560 --> 0:35:12.719 we live off the grid, you know, we grow our 0:35:12.760 --> 0:35:15.400 own food. And when that has happened, they've come and 0:35:15.480 --> 0:35:17.920 destroyed our communities. They've literally burned them down. At me, 0:35:18.000 --> 0:35:20.800 just Tulsa, I mean, we can go over more than fifty. 0:35:21.480 --> 0:35:24.680 You can look up the Red Summer of nineteen nineteen, 0:35:25.000 --> 0:35:28.840 which predated Tulsa, of course, and look at all the cities, 0:35:28.880 --> 0:35:32.600 all the white violence, all the despotism that we've survived. 0:35:32.840 --> 0:35:35.520 So again I would ask us, is this a time 0:35:35.719 --> 0:35:36.200 to flee? 0:35:36.680 --> 0:35:41.200 That doesn't to me that is perhaps an act of violence, 0:35:41.680 --> 0:35:43.440 or not an act of violence, an act of resistance. 0:35:43.760 --> 0:35:47.840 But I really stay well, I was to teeing that 0:35:48.000 --> 0:35:52.239 up to get Andrew's perspective on this, only because for me, 0:35:52.600 --> 0:35:56.160 I only have me, you know, like I do have family, 0:35:56.520 --> 0:35:59.280 but what I don't have is a spouse and children, 0:35:59.640 --> 0:36:02.080 school systems to worry about. I guess health care. Health 0:36:02.120 --> 0:36:04.760 care isn't an issue for me, but like healthcare systems, 0:36:04.800 --> 0:36:06.680 not just for myself, but because other people. I will 0:36:06.680 --> 0:36:08.160 you say that what does that really look like? And 0:36:08.239 --> 0:36:10.920 that is a real last question, and how and Andrew 0:36:10.960 --> 0:36:13.680 you're in Florida, You're in the belly of the beast, Like, 0:36:14.000 --> 0:36:16.000 at what point or I don't know, just your thoughts 0:36:16.040 --> 0:36:17.640 on all of it. I was gonna say, at what point, Well. 0:36:17.520 --> 0:36:20.840 Rebirth the beast. Yeah, the parents of the beast. We 0:36:20.880 --> 0:36:21.359 are the beast. 0:36:21.640 --> 0:36:23.480 Some people say he is a dick of the country, 0:36:23.560 --> 0:36:25.719 but that's another Well, you know, there's that. 0:36:27.480 --> 0:36:31.040 So, first of all, I do think the amount of 0:36:33.400 --> 0:36:40.120 racial consolidation around this idea, in order for success to 0:36:40.239 --> 0:36:43.680 be had in all, you know, points across this land 0:36:44.239 --> 0:36:47.600 would be significant. White people would have to find themselves 0:36:48.520 --> 0:36:51.919 as at risk as many of us find ourselves at risk, 0:36:52.320 --> 0:36:55.480 I think to participate. I wonder whether or not the 0:36:55.560 --> 0:36:58.520 appetite for that exists, and I mean for a general strike. Right, 0:36:58.640 --> 0:37:03.640 So we're talking about at all levels of society, largely 0:37:03.760 --> 0:37:07.560 against the owners, right, the same owners who helped us 0:37:07.600 --> 0:37:13.320 develop these narratives of these very meaningless, bifurcated meritives, narratives 0:37:13.360 --> 0:37:16.600 on the workplace that put black and white people and 0:37:16.719 --> 0:37:19.680 black and white bodies at strife toward each other. Anyway, Right, 0:37:19.719 --> 0:37:22.720 I'm gonna give you a title and a promotion without 0:37:22.760 --> 0:37:25.200 any financial increase, just so that we can keep the 0:37:25.280 --> 0:37:27.880 turbulence between blacks and white so that we can be 0:37:28.080 --> 0:37:30.799 sure that you'll never find the same side with each other. 0:37:30.920 --> 0:37:33.680 You'll never end up fighting on the same side, because 0:37:33.680 --> 0:37:36.600 we've now created a level of difference between you, and 0:37:36.680 --> 0:37:39.560 that difference now will always exists. So are folks who 0:37:39.640 --> 0:37:43.240 are who were susceptible to that kind of divide before? 0:37:43.960 --> 0:37:46.080 Are they going to be equally as succeptable to it? 0:37:46.280 --> 0:37:50.840 Are they willingly? Are they going to be willingly able 0:37:50.960 --> 0:37:53.440 to walk away from their jobs, their workplaces, and the 0:37:53.480 --> 0:37:59.680 places that they patronize frankly out of solidarity with the 0:37:59.760 --> 0:38:02.080 kind But they don't see it as the country right 0:38:02.120 --> 0:38:05.120 now because they only you know, because but for their 0:38:05.200 --> 0:38:07.920 favorite late night comedian, they hadn't seen themselves in the 0:38:07.960 --> 0:38:08.959 crosshairs of its. 0:38:08.880 --> 0:38:10.160 Impacts talk about it. 0:38:10.840 --> 0:38:14.040 So are they now willing to see themselves truly in 0:38:14.120 --> 0:38:16.840 the crosshairs of the impact and are now willing to 0:38:16.920 --> 0:38:18.480 lay their bodies on the line? And I mean their 0:38:18.520 --> 0:38:22.320 physical bodies. I don't know how we get a general 0:38:22.360 --> 0:38:29.040 strike that is successful if once again it relies on 0:38:29.239 --> 0:38:33.000 black and brown bodies to lay themselves at the sacrifice 0:38:33.440 --> 0:38:38.160 of everything horrible that happens in society and whatever little 0:38:38.200 --> 0:38:40.920 good that they are able to extract from society so 0:38:41.080 --> 0:38:43.560 that everybody else gets to be the benefactor of their 0:38:43.719 --> 0:38:44.759 of their sacrifice. 0:38:45.200 --> 0:38:47.359 I do well really quick. I just want to say, Andrew, 0:38:47.400 --> 0:38:49.799 we're not making you the sole black man here. As 0:38:49.800 --> 0:38:53.600 you guys know, Bakari joins this podcast while he's in trial, 0:38:53.960 --> 0:38:56.000 so he had to run to court, but he will 0:38:56.040 --> 0:38:58.600 be joining us for our interview with Charlemagne and the God, 0:38:58.600 --> 0:39:01.680 which is coming up right after this segment, So don't 0:39:01.680 --> 0:39:03.200 go anywhere. I just wanted to let folks know why 0:39:03.239 --> 0:39:05.040 Bakari wasn't weighing in. He had to run, but he's 0:39:05.080 --> 0:39:07.000 coming right back for that important conversation. 0:39:07.480 --> 0:39:09.480 I think the other thing that we might need to 0:39:09.560 --> 0:39:11.960 consider is, like you know, just like anything else, is 0:39:12.160 --> 0:39:14.680 just focusing on not leaving the country, but on this 0:39:14.800 --> 0:39:20.040 general strike concept. There is something to be said about 0:39:20.320 --> 0:39:23.480 the privilege piece that you mentioned. And one thing that 0:39:23.520 --> 0:39:25.360 I would love to see My dad has been saying 0:39:25.400 --> 0:39:29.000 this for years and every time something goes down, particularly 0:39:29.200 --> 0:39:32.920 in athletics, my dad is like, I wish the players 0:39:32.960 --> 0:39:35.279 would do X, Y or Z. And one thing that 0:39:35.400 --> 0:39:38.320 comes to mind here is It would be incredible, Like 0:39:38.440 --> 0:39:39.520 the NBA. 0:39:39.440 --> 0:39:40.120 Just opened up. 0:39:40.120 --> 0:39:43.640 It's a preseason over game opener, you know, just a 0:39:43.719 --> 0:39:46.279 couple of days ago. It would be dope to see 0:39:46.600 --> 0:39:51.040 entire teams say, until my personhood is respected, until my 0:39:51.120 --> 0:39:54.200 community's respected, until democracy is no longer compromised. 0:39:54.600 --> 0:39:55.920 I don't have anything for you. 0:39:56.520 --> 0:39:59.000 And what would it take to organize players around that, 0:39:59.040 --> 0:40:03.160 Whether it's the NBA, the MLB, or the NFL, what 0:40:03.239 --> 0:40:05.080 would it take for them to say, like at a 0:40:05.640 --> 0:40:08.520 pivotal moment, whether it's a season opener, it is right 0:40:08.560 --> 0:40:11.759 before playoffs start, like until we get some things done. 0:40:11.840 --> 0:40:16.200 And I wonder really if they know their power or 0:40:16.400 --> 0:40:18.479 if they could if they're willing, like we keep saying, 0:40:18.480 --> 0:40:21.000 you know, it would be a sacrifice for maybe these 0:40:21.120 --> 0:40:23.680 hourly wage workers. I know it would be sacrificial as 0:40:23.719 --> 0:40:26.960 well for players who support their whole families. But I 0:40:27.040 --> 0:40:30.560 don't know where the buck stops. No pun intended, right, 0:40:30.600 --> 0:40:33.480 It's like it has to stop somewhere. So if the 0:40:33.600 --> 0:40:37.480 Miszoo athletes could come together, the football players and say 0:40:38.320 --> 0:40:41.799 we're organizing with other students on campus and administration at 0:40:41.880 --> 0:40:45.480 Maszoo until you hear what they're saying we can't play 0:40:45.560 --> 0:40:45.919 for y'all. 0:40:46.160 --> 0:40:47.399 It turned immediately. 0:40:47.760 --> 0:40:50.320 I think there's so much of what we're fighting against 0:40:50.400 --> 0:40:53.520 and protesting and people are carrying signs and banners and 0:40:53.600 --> 0:40:54.640 bullhorns for that. 0:40:54.760 --> 0:40:58.840 If a few of the elites, yeah, and by that I. 0:40:58.880 --> 0:41:02.040 Mean people who actually made it's a professional leagues said 0:41:02.200 --> 0:41:05.920 we're not going to do this with you until you 0:41:06.040 --> 0:41:08.320 respect us in this way. I think that could be 0:41:08.840 --> 0:41:11.239 well a general strike that that could at least kick 0:41:11.280 --> 0:41:11.560 it off. 0:41:11.760 --> 0:41:13.680 Can I ask you then, because we've had this conversation, 0:41:13.800 --> 0:41:16.680 how do you square that with Because somebody could argue 0:41:17.360 --> 0:41:20.920 Jay Z's partnership with the NFL, he's providing entertainment for. 0:41:21.000 --> 0:41:23.719 This, like does like how do you square that with? 0:41:24.680 --> 0:41:24.719 Like? 0:41:24.800 --> 0:41:26.479 Does he have a role to play in saying because 0:41:26.480 --> 0:41:28.680 he said we're beyond protesting. You know, that was part 0:41:28.719 --> 0:41:31.360 of the discord I think was he and Colin Kaepernick. 0:41:31.400 --> 0:41:32.719 A small clip of what he said. 0:41:33.120 --> 0:41:35.160 He said beyond kneeling, and I think he was talking 0:41:35.200 --> 0:41:36.839 about I think he said right after that that it's 0:41:36.880 --> 0:41:38.480 time to stand up and take us right. 0:41:38.520 --> 0:41:42.040 But his intention was we were beyond what Colin Kaepernick 0:41:42.320 --> 0:41:44.280 was doing. He was trying to take the next step. 0:41:44.719 --> 0:41:47.200 In conversation with Colin Kaepernick, he has had pushback on that, 0:41:47.400 --> 0:41:50.320 of course, But I wonder as we talk about that, 0:41:50.560 --> 0:41:53.240 the people who are in a position like that, should 0:41:53.400 --> 0:41:57.440 they be leading an effort to get athletes to stop 0:41:57.480 --> 0:42:00.279 playing or leading an effort to provide aner tayment for 0:42:00.320 --> 0:42:04.000 the Super Bowl delivering a political political message. And it's 0:42:04.080 --> 0:42:07.200 not either one and again or both in I agree, 0:42:07.320 --> 0:42:09.480 and I think that what I'm saying is what we 0:42:09.760 --> 0:42:10.319 keep doing. 0:42:10.440 --> 0:42:12.680 And I really think this is where we shoot ourselves 0:42:12.719 --> 0:42:16.680 in the proverbial foot. We keep trying to get one entity, 0:42:17.080 --> 0:42:20.320 one person of influence, one person of power, to be 0:42:20.560 --> 0:42:22.480 all things to all of us, and I don't think 0:42:22.560 --> 0:42:23.239 that's their role. 0:42:23.560 --> 0:42:23.759 There. 0:42:23.840 --> 0:42:26.480 The people who would most likely be the most influential 0:42:27.000 --> 0:42:29.680 with athletes to get them to sit down are the 0:42:29.760 --> 0:42:32.880 veterans in the league. Are the people who they like, 0:42:33.200 --> 0:42:34.759 the people who are the old heads in the league, 0:42:34.840 --> 0:42:37.360 like they're yeah, they're they're veterans. 0:42:37.400 --> 0:42:39.320 So, but I'm not talking about I see what you 0:42:39.400 --> 0:42:40.960 think they're They're not. 0:42:41.239 --> 0:42:44.000 They're no longer out of the military. I'm talking about 0:42:44.040 --> 0:42:47.719 people who are old. And then also the people who 0:42:47.800 --> 0:42:51.359 have tried it. It's been so long, but it would 0:42:51.360 --> 0:42:53.319 have been like a Muhammad Ali. There are a lot 0:42:53.360 --> 0:42:55.480 of folks who went back to learn from Muhammad Ali. 0:42:55.680 --> 0:42:58.280 It would have been a Jim Brown before he changed. 0:42:58.360 --> 0:43:01.000 I said, before he changed, what would have been those folks. 0:43:01.400 --> 0:43:04.640 It's the it's the the John Carlos Is and the 0:43:04.760 --> 0:43:07.719 Times Smith. Why did you take this approach? And what 0:43:07.840 --> 0:43:10.360 did you sacrifice in doing that? And can I stomach that? 0:43:10.760 --> 0:43:11.840 Am I brave enough to do? 0:43:12.080 --> 0:43:12.239 Yeah? 0:43:12.600 --> 0:43:18.520 I've seen by the top one percent ever, and certainly 0:43:18.600 --> 0:43:21.160 not one towards the success. This is This is why 0:43:21.360 --> 0:43:25.360 coon tycoons tycoons of industry, is why Henry Ford decided 0:43:25.400 --> 0:43:27.960 that his best tactic was going to be to separate 0:43:28.000 --> 0:43:31.839 the proletariat, to put one man who feels equal next 0:43:31.880 --> 0:43:34.560 to this the other man that feels equal. Because in 0:43:34.680 --> 0:43:39.200 my experience, having you know, watched these things, I don't 0:43:39.239 --> 0:43:41.279 know that there's a lot of common cause between me 0:43:41.440 --> 0:43:43.800 and the top one percent of athletes in this country 0:43:43.960 --> 0:43:47.680 or the top earners who are largely who largely constitute 0:43:48.440 --> 0:43:52.120 the who largely make up the players of the National 0:43:52.239 --> 0:43:55.520 Basketball League. But I'm actually also not looking for enemies here. 0:43:55.640 --> 0:43:57.720 I think we want friends on all sides. 0:43:58.000 --> 0:43:59.520 Andrew, can't you see where. 0:44:01.160 --> 0:44:01.640 It could drive? 0:44:02.600 --> 0:44:04.160 Just let me just let me just ask you this 0:44:04.280 --> 0:44:06.759 really quick. Can you see where the. 0:44:06.920 --> 0:44:10.320 People who are the players are more like the laborers 0:44:10.840 --> 0:44:13.480 and the owners are more like the heads of corporations? Well, 0:44:13.480 --> 0:44:16.960 they are, they are they literally they literally have unions, 0:44:17.080 --> 0:44:17.640 not at all. 0:44:19.320 --> 0:44:23.080 Because regular people are usually unionizing over the ability to 0:44:23.120 --> 0:44:25.160 put food on the table from one check to the next. 0:44:25.560 --> 0:44:28.000 And I think when you sit at this is why 0:44:28.239 --> 0:44:30.280 you know what folks are like? Well, what about athletes 0:44:30.320 --> 0:44:32.320 such and such and such, And why wouldn't he be 0:44:32.440 --> 0:44:36.680 against a ross holding a fund raiser for Trump because 0:44:36.719 --> 0:44:39.359 he would be a guest and invited guests at such 0:44:39.520 --> 0:44:42.000 a dinner. Because that's the that is the strata in 0:44:42.080 --> 0:44:45.319 which people roll. And I just don't think that our 0:44:45.520 --> 0:44:50.160 shared race can can, can can can any longer be 0:44:50.320 --> 0:44:55.359 a topical connection between uh us as a group of people. 0:44:55.400 --> 0:44:57.400 We we are not we are not advocating for the 0:44:57.440 --> 0:44:59.880 same things in the tax bracket because we're not in 0:45:00.040 --> 0:45:03.759 acted by the same things in the tax bracket. The 0:45:03.840 --> 0:45:06.680 reason why I can see that fifty cent comes down 0:45:06.800 --> 0:45:10.480 differently on his politics toward a bush or toward a 0:45:10.719 --> 0:45:14.160 Trump and then where I could ever come down, it's 0:45:14.239 --> 0:45:17.279 because we don't. Our pocketbooks don't look the same, our 0:45:17.440 --> 0:45:21.959 checks don't look the same. And I think power corrupts absolutely, 0:45:22.600 --> 0:45:24.920 and in this day and age, power is in so 0:45:25.080 --> 0:45:28.600 many ways interpreted by your money, not by who you 0:45:28.640 --> 0:45:30.680 can call them the cell phone necessarily, but by how 0:45:30.719 --> 0:45:33.920 much money you have. That that's the trading card, that's 0:45:34.000 --> 0:45:38.520 the currency. I think we have better if we could 0:45:38.560 --> 0:45:41.400 get over this big issue of race. I think our 0:45:41.480 --> 0:45:43.759 better cause is going to be toward the man or 0:45:43.800 --> 0:45:46.800 the woman I'm standing next to earning similar amount to 0:45:47.400 --> 0:45:51.239 being separated by superficial differences that are no differences at all, 0:45:51.680 --> 0:45:53.160 and for them to wake up and realize that the 0:45:53.200 --> 0:45:56.279 same enemy we're trying to withhold our services from are 0:45:56.280 --> 0:45:59.600 the same ones who have their foot on your neck too. 0:46:00.400 --> 0:46:02.440 And I just think it's harder for wealthy people to 0:46:02.520 --> 0:46:07.120 see that with other wealthy people. I think it's an easier, easier, common, 0:46:08.080 --> 0:46:12.279 a common reframe that working folks see in other working people. 0:46:12.760 --> 0:46:19.080 But you know what, can I failed at this Booker T. 0:46:19.320 --> 0:46:22.560 Washington failed that all of those who tried to move 0:46:22.640 --> 0:46:26.760 this argument to be one of economics have almost always 0:46:26.800 --> 0:46:29.440 failed at this, largely funded by the big pooh bahs 0:46:29.640 --> 0:46:32.759 who have made the issue about race right. Every time 0:46:32.800 --> 0:46:34.719 we talk about money, they want to talk about race. 0:46:35.560 --> 0:46:38.480 Every time we have a share ground, they want to 0:46:38.600 --> 0:46:41.400 change the narrative to one that's more superficial in nature 0:46:41.640 --> 0:46:43.600 to keep us from grasping at the thing we know 0:46:43.719 --> 0:46:44.280 we share. 0:46:44.120 --> 0:46:46.040 The most that can. 0:46:46.080 --> 0:46:49.400 I just say, this is why I love our conversations 0:46:49.840 --> 0:46:53.480 because we all have very different perspectives. I don't know 0:46:53.560 --> 0:46:56.560 that I have a perspective here, but I'm curious about 0:46:56.719 --> 0:46:59.200 you all's perspective because I'm looking for guidance here. 0:46:59.280 --> 0:47:00.640 This is not an area where I can lead. 0:47:00.880 --> 0:47:03.160 You know, I'm not either. I'm trying to figure out out. 0:47:03.239 --> 0:47:04.239 But you say that, but you do. 0:47:04.360 --> 0:47:06.560 I think you do have like charging orders like you 0:47:06.680 --> 0:47:08.520 do say like here's what I think we should do 0:47:08.600 --> 0:47:09.279 when people ask me. 0:47:09.600 --> 0:47:12.160 I try because the things haven't worked. 0:47:12.480 --> 0:47:14.920 But even even having an idea like here's what we 0:47:14.960 --> 0:47:17.680 should try, I think that is something that's needed. Andrew, 0:47:17.760 --> 0:47:20.840 you have like very clear positions on this. So I 0:47:21.320 --> 0:47:23.480 just love when I get to listen on this podcast 0:47:23.560 --> 0:47:26.359 and learn something. So I really learned from you guys, 0:47:26.360 --> 0:47:27.840 I'm sorry, but Cary has to run the court. But 0:47:27.920 --> 0:47:31.680 he's literally running back right now because it is time 0:47:31.760 --> 0:47:33.560 for us to move along and finally get to that 0:47:33.640 --> 0:47:38.040 conversation that we've talked about all show. Charlemagne the God 0:47:38.120 --> 0:47:40.520 is going to join us for this conversation to talk 0:47:40.560 --> 0:47:44.040 about anti black intellectualism and get his take. 0:47:57.440 --> 0:48:03.200 I define an intellectual not based on how much a 0:48:03.320 --> 0:48:09.120 person knows, but I define an intellectual as someone who 0:48:09.160 --> 0:48:14.000 has a tremendous desire to know, someone who's incredibly curious, 0:48:14.760 --> 0:48:19.960 someone who loves the question. And there are these curious 0:48:20.080 --> 0:48:24.640 people with tremendous desires to know, who are incarcerated, who 0:48:24.840 --> 0:48:28.879 are houseless, who are in c suites, who are in universities, 0:48:28.920 --> 0:48:32.160 who are dropouts, they're everywhere. And these people who are 0:48:32.280 --> 0:48:35.960 everywhere I define as intellectuals. And I define a black 0:48:36.040 --> 0:48:39.400 intellectual as not only a black person with a tremendous 0:48:39.480 --> 0:48:43.160 desire to know, but a black person who is seeking 0:48:43.280 --> 0:48:47.439 to acquire knowledge for power. Not knowledge for knowledge's sake, 0:48:47.840 --> 0:48:49.640 but knowledge for power's sake. 0:48:50.600 --> 0:48:51.560 Man, that was powerful. 0:48:51.840 --> 0:48:54.120 I mean I think that I think we all agree 0:48:54.160 --> 0:48:56.239 he is the definition of an intellectual. And none other 0:48:56.320 --> 0:48:59.960 than Ebram Candy. Shout out to my brother for always 0:49:00.040 --> 0:49:03.960 speaking truth to power. Speaking of someone who I love 0:49:04.040 --> 0:49:07.800 and a door speaks truth to power. Always very very curious. 0:49:08.000 --> 0:49:10.960 We have none other than Charlemagne, the god I think Angela. 0:49:11.000 --> 0:49:13.000 You call him by his full government, but I call 0:49:13.120 --> 0:49:15.719 him Charlemagne. That's what we call him down in Monk's Quarter, 0:49:15.840 --> 0:49:17.480 That's what we call him up and down twenty six. 0:49:17.560 --> 0:49:20.200 So Charlemagne, welcome to the show, my brother. How you feel, Cary, 0:49:20.400 --> 0:49:21.239 what's up, my brother? 0:49:21.440 --> 0:49:23.320 How are you? I just heard your name. I was 0:49:23.400 --> 0:49:25.960 with us ce Sue Williams earlier. He said your name. 0:49:27.320 --> 0:49:29.520 Cecil Williams for y'all who don't know, is one of 0:49:29.560 --> 0:49:32.320 the greatest civil rights photographers that we've ever seen. I 0:49:32.440 --> 0:49:35.080 challenge everybody to google see Sir Williams and then check 0:49:35.160 --> 0:49:37.480 out his museum. He had the legendary picture he just 0:49:37.560 --> 0:49:40.480 walked New York Fashion Week and he has the picture 0:49:40.600 --> 0:49:43.200 of him drinking out of a whites only water fountain. 0:49:43.600 --> 0:49:46.359 And since we're doing something right here, make sure y'all 0:49:46.400 --> 0:49:50.400 go and contribute to Cecil Williams Museum in Orangeburg, South Carolina. 0:49:50.400 --> 0:49:53.520 It's those type of artifacts of relics of our community 0:49:53.600 --> 0:49:54.800 that we need to make sure we support. 0:49:54.880 --> 0:49:58.040 So can I Saycary, that's all that, Michael, Harriet's uncle, 0:50:03.520 --> 0:50:06.600 all related to everybody and probably cousin. 0:50:07.320 --> 0:50:14.359 But oh man, lucky to have you brother. 0:50:16.200 --> 0:50:17.759 Well, so we had that much time. 0:50:17.840 --> 0:50:19.000 So we we love you. 0:50:19.560 --> 0:50:21.319 You know that we're nice to you. We're gonna keep going. 0:50:21.680 --> 0:50:26.200 So you are here because we had a very interesting 0:50:26.840 --> 0:50:30.480 exchange on our show last week and also over the weekend, 0:50:31.080 --> 0:50:35.560 true to normal sibling chatter, we had conversations about you know, 0:50:35.719 --> 0:50:38.080 where you thought we were right, where you thought we 0:50:38.200 --> 0:50:41.480 were wrong. And I think really what it gives us 0:50:41.520 --> 0:50:45.040 the opportunity to do is to back into uh, you 0:50:45.120 --> 0:50:48.640 know device that exists across our community, from gender to 0:50:49.000 --> 0:50:53.400 class to degree attainment to you know, who gets to 0:50:53.480 --> 0:50:55.760 speak for who and what why you get to speak 0:50:55.800 --> 0:50:58.319 for that person. And so I just thought it would 0:50:58.360 --> 0:51:02.080 be a good thing to have you come on talk 0:51:02.160 --> 0:51:04.759 about some of what you're hearing, some of what you 0:51:04.880 --> 0:51:08.360 felt listening to our show, listening to the response on 0:51:08.560 --> 0:51:12.160 Joe Budden's podcast on the other side of what was 0:51:12.239 --> 0:51:14.840 a disagreement with Mark and Flip, and would love to 0:51:14.920 --> 0:51:17.960 hear your thoughts on that and in broadening the conversation. 0:51:19.320 --> 0:51:21.080 Wait wait, wait, wait, wait, are we not going to 0:51:21.160 --> 0:51:23.160 let the record reflect that we were just a peaceful 0:51:23.200 --> 0:51:29.080 place for people to talk before Bakar joined this show, Yeah, 0:51:29.520 --> 0:51:32.520 started fighting with everybody on every block. I just think, 0:51:32.760 --> 0:51:34.640 you know, for historical record, we should put a pin 0:51:34.719 --> 0:51:34.880 in it. 0:51:35.840 --> 0:51:40.520 I agree that is not misinformation. We got more fights everywhere, 0:51:40.680 --> 0:51:41.600 and we fight each other. 0:51:41.719 --> 0:51:42.279 B way to go. 0:51:43.239 --> 0:51:44.719 Now you want to talk time out. 0:51:44.760 --> 0:51:46.880 I just I just have to clarify the record as 0:51:46.920 --> 0:51:50.400 we are doing this. I don't talk trash about people individually, 0:51:50.520 --> 0:51:52.920 except even A because I go out too much in 0:51:53.040 --> 0:51:54.879 these streets and I don't want to bump into people 0:51:54.920 --> 0:51:56.960 in one of the dark corners in one of these bars. 0:51:56.760 --> 0:51:59.760 I'd be able to get hit in the back of everybody. 0:52:00.480 --> 0:52:01.120 I love everybody. 0:52:01.120 --> 0:52:05.120 Go ahead, No, I mean, you know, sometimes I don't 0:52:05.120 --> 0:52:08.320 even like to have a private conversations publicly. But you know, 0:52:08.400 --> 0:52:11.560 when I first saw you know what y'all talked about 0:52:11.880 --> 0:52:14.320 last week, I hit Angela and I was like, I 0:52:14.440 --> 0:52:16.759 want to talk about what y'all was just speaking about, 0:52:16.800 --> 0:52:18.239 not saying I want to talk about it on the show, 0:52:18.239 --> 0:52:20.280 I said, I just want to talk to you personally. 0:52:20.760 --> 0:52:22.600 And then you know, when I when I saw what 0:52:23.120 --> 0:52:27.000 you know, Joe Budden said about it, I agreed with Joe, 0:52:27.440 --> 0:52:29.759 you know, I felt like, you know, it came off, 0:52:30.040 --> 0:52:33.200 you know, very elitists, you know, very Jack and Jill, 0:52:33.800 --> 0:52:36.959 you know, very you know, I got my nose up. 0:52:36.880 --> 0:52:39.279 At these these negroes over here. 0:52:40.200 --> 0:52:42.200 And I don't think that, you know, you make any 0:52:43.360 --> 0:52:47.440 you don't make any scribes and connecting community by by 0:52:47.560 --> 0:52:49.840 by doing, by doing that conversation and the way the 0:52:49.880 --> 0:52:50.719 way that it was done. 0:52:50.800 --> 0:52:53.319 You know, I feel like, you know, whenever there's UH, 0:52:54.160 --> 0:52:54.560 instead of. 0:52:54.600 --> 0:52:56.680 Calling people out, sometimes you should, you should call people 0:52:56.760 --> 0:53:00.680 in and and you know, the whole conversation around who's 0:53:00.680 --> 0:53:03.480 an intellectual and who's not intellectual. My biggest issue with 0:53:03.560 --> 0:53:06.120 it was, well, damn, you know, a person who's an 0:53:06.160 --> 0:53:10.480 intellectual should look at the whole context of a situation 0:53:10.640 --> 0:53:12.480 before they have a conversation about it. I feel like, 0:53:12.520 --> 0:53:14.480 you know, Andrew said one of the strongest points last 0:53:14.480 --> 0:53:16.399 week when Andrew was like, I don't watch the show 0:53:16.520 --> 0:53:19.759 enough to have an opinion about it, you know, and 0:53:20.320 --> 0:53:22.640 then he said, and then he said, but I trust Mark, 0:53:23.040 --> 0:53:26.480 you know, being marked not to be in spaces where 0:53:26.800 --> 0:53:29.239 you know, he knows he needs to be in. And 0:53:29.400 --> 0:53:31.560 as I'm listening to the combent, I told Angela that 0:53:31.719 --> 0:53:34.279 even when she told me that y'all wanted to talk 0:53:34.320 --> 0:53:37.240 about it, it came up as a topic of discussion. 0:53:37.239 --> 0:53:40.040 I said, well, make sure you watch the whole thing 0:53:40.160 --> 0:53:43.120 in context before you just watch a clip of it 0:53:43.480 --> 0:53:45.160 and then you know, speak on it for the next 0:53:45.200 --> 0:53:48.160 twenty or thirty minutes, because to me, that's what an 0:53:48.280 --> 0:53:51.160 intellectual should do, right, Like, that's what an intelligent person 0:53:51.160 --> 0:53:53.680 should do. An intelligent person should get the whole context 0:53:53.760 --> 0:53:56.720 of something before they comment on it, instead of watching 0:53:56.800 --> 0:53:59.520 like two or three minutes or something and then actually 0:53:59.640 --> 0:54:02.200 taking to clip out of context. Because if you watch 0:54:02.280 --> 0:54:06.440 the clip in context, Mark was actually wrong. You know, 0:54:06.600 --> 0:54:08.719 if there's a right or wrong in this situation, Mark 0:54:08.880 --> 0:54:10.840 was actually the one who was who was wrong in 0:54:10.920 --> 0:54:12.920 that situation, so much so that he even came back 0:54:12.960 --> 0:54:17.040 and apologized, you know, the next week, and I just, yeah, 0:54:17.080 --> 0:54:19.480 I just did the conversation just really just it just 0:54:19.600 --> 0:54:21.960 kind of made me feel a way, like, damn, like 0:54:22.080 --> 0:54:25.680 that's how we look at each other as black can. 0:54:25.560 --> 0:54:28.040 I tif I want you to go here because this, 0:54:28.200 --> 0:54:32.160 this is TIFF's conversation. But I do want to oh no, 0:54:32.440 --> 0:54:35.560 but this was Tiffs's idea. Tiff is ready to claim that. 0:54:35.920 --> 0:54:37.839 And we're fine. We all weighed in, we all said 0:54:37.880 --> 0:54:40.400 what we said. But I have a quick question for you, 0:54:40.840 --> 0:54:43.560 and this is a focus group for this podcast. How 0:54:43.640 --> 0:54:46.600 many of you all were in Jack and Jail? Raise 0:54:46.600 --> 0:54:51.120 your hands? How many of you all or have any 0:54:51.239 --> 0:54:55.680 sorority or fraternity affiliation? Raise your hands? How many of 0:54:55.760 --> 0:54:59.120 you all are in the Links? I quit, I was 0:54:59.160 --> 0:55:01.520 in the links. How many of you all are in 0:55:01.600 --> 0:55:06.960 the Bulet? Raise your hands. I'm doing that because Andrew 0:55:07.120 --> 0:55:10.560 was the most relatable person to them, per their own commentary. 0:55:10.840 --> 0:55:13.040 And Andrew's the only one who was into Bulet. We 0:55:13.160 --> 0:55:15.239 are not even into Bulet, so we get label for 0:55:15.280 --> 0:55:16.320 stuff that we're not even in. 0:55:16.440 --> 0:55:18.520 But tipy, I didn't. I didn't hear Charlemagne say that. 0:55:18.960 --> 0:55:19.319 He didn't. 0:55:19.360 --> 0:55:20.640 He said Jack and Jail of y'all? 0:55:20.800 --> 0:55:22.239 Yeah, I I I yeah. 0:55:22.480 --> 0:55:25.040 But I want to say, uh, just to set the 0:55:25.080 --> 0:55:27.200 record straight, because I hear what Charlemagne is saying, and 0:55:27.239 --> 0:55:31.000 I think a lot of comments echoed that my personal 0:55:31.080 --> 0:55:34.480 background aside, I want to say that as a journalist, 0:55:34.520 --> 0:55:36.799 before I bring up anything on this show, I want 0:55:36.800 --> 0:55:40.080 our viewers to know I have indeed done my due diligence. 0:55:41.040 --> 0:55:44.440 So I didn't just watch the clip. How I prepared 0:55:44.520 --> 0:55:47.360 for that segment. I didn't pay for Patreon, but I 0:55:47.440 --> 0:55:50.080 did read the transcript of what happened. I even understood 0:55:50.080 --> 0:55:53.200 the word in question that was tricky was a lude. 0:55:53.520 --> 0:55:57.920 I understood that the conversation was about payment discrepancy. I 0:55:58.000 --> 0:56:00.359 spoke to Mark before I did the segment. I looked 0:56:00.360 --> 0:56:02.319 at literacy rates before I. 0:56:02.360 --> 0:56:02.920 Did this segment. 0:56:03.200 --> 0:56:05.720 I watched a few clips or not clips with segments, 0:56:05.800 --> 0:56:09.080 different segments from Joe Budden's podcasts before I did this segment. 0:56:09.480 --> 0:56:11.399 And I will say I stand by what I said. 0:56:12.480 --> 0:56:15.120 My perspectives and opinions don't sway in the winds of 0:56:15.160 --> 0:56:19.040 public opinion. Sometimes the cheese will stand alone. I do 0:56:19.200 --> 0:56:24.279 think there is very much a toxic landscape that is 0:56:24.400 --> 0:56:27.880 fueled by a lot of podcasts, Bros. But I definitely 0:56:27.880 --> 0:56:30.440 agree with you, Charlemagne. Before you have an interview with anybody, 0:56:30.800 --> 0:56:33.200 before you sit down and speak on something, I would 0:56:33.200 --> 0:56:37.600 advise anyone to be well informed. Rather it's politics, sports, 0:56:38.360 --> 0:56:40.920 anything like that, and so I don't think. 0:56:40.840 --> 0:56:42.680 That the issue was that. 0:56:44.160 --> 0:56:46.200 The collective was not well informed. I don't think that 0:56:46.360 --> 0:56:48.799 was my perspective. I think the issue that a lot 0:56:48.840 --> 0:56:52.840 of people felt is they felt attacked. And so I 0:56:52.960 --> 0:56:56.879 want to be clear that I wasn't saying who wasn't 0:56:56.960 --> 0:57:00.279 intellectual and who was not. My perspective was there is 0:57:00.280 --> 0:57:05.560 an anti intellectual movement ravaging the black community. I also 0:57:05.680 --> 0:57:07.960 want to be clear that I was not saying that 0:57:08.239 --> 0:57:11.560 no one should talk to Flip or Joe Budden. Certainly 0:57:11.719 --> 0:57:15.319 somebody should, someone should be reaching out to them. That's 0:57:15.400 --> 0:57:18.480 not my ministry. Things I care about are the incarcerated 0:57:19.200 --> 0:57:22.760 and puppies, most importantly pitbulls. I don't like that tens 0:57:22.800 --> 0:57:25.480 of thousands of them get euthanized every month. It breaks 0:57:25.520 --> 0:57:28.200 my heart. I think about the incarcerated all the time. 0:57:28.320 --> 0:57:30.680 I don't want our Black men and women in prison 0:57:30.720 --> 0:57:33.360 thinking they're forgotten about. I think it's a bit arrogant 0:57:33.400 --> 0:57:37.240 to me to say Angela Bakari Andrew y'all should be 0:57:37.280 --> 0:57:40.520 talking to the incarcerated. That's not their ministry. But if 0:57:40.560 --> 0:57:43.640 Angela feels like no, those are the people, or U Sharman, 0:57:43.640 --> 0:57:45.360 if you feel like, no, those are the very people 0:57:45.440 --> 0:57:48.320 I want to be speaking to. Then, by all means, 0:57:48.520 --> 0:57:50.960 go do that. I'm saying, it's hard to fill a 0:57:51.000 --> 0:57:53.840 cup that's already full. So if I'm telling you something 0:57:54.000 --> 0:57:57.360 and you're insulting me from my intelligence, I don't need 0:57:57.440 --> 0:57:59.680 to be where fools gather. So I stand on what 0:57:59.720 --> 0:58:02.840 I say said. I'm not disrespecting any of them, but 0:58:02.920 --> 0:58:05.320 I just want to be clear our viewers know. I 0:58:05.520 --> 0:58:09.400 never come on this podcast ever without being very well 0:58:09.520 --> 0:58:13.600 informed and researched and fact checked, and FactCheck is not 0:58:13.640 --> 0:58:15.919 a thirty second Google search before I come on this show. 0:58:16.360 --> 0:58:18.240 It takes a lot of work to prepare for anything 0:58:18.280 --> 0:58:20.760 I introduce, and I would hope that we all do that. 0:58:21.320 --> 0:58:21.440 Well. 0:58:21.720 --> 0:58:24.160 If it's interesting you say you like talking to the incarcerated, 0:58:24.200 --> 0:58:26.440 Like who do you think they incarcerated or are listening to? 0:58:27.000 --> 0:58:29.280 Like they incarcerated are listening to things like the Joe 0:58:29.320 --> 0:58:32.920 Budden podcast, Like they're listening to, you know, places like 0:58:33.000 --> 0:58:35.360 the Breakfast Club, Like that's who they're actually tuning into. 0:58:35.440 --> 0:58:37.560 I know because I go speak at the jails. I 0:58:37.640 --> 0:58:39.040 was at right gu Island a couple of weeks ago 0:58:39.080 --> 0:58:41.640 with Shaka Sin Koor. You know, I know when you 0:58:41.720 --> 0:58:44.440 know these brothers from Rikers Island are writing into the 0:58:44.480 --> 0:58:46.480 breakfast club and telling me, like you know, what they 0:58:46.640 --> 0:58:48.560 like to listen to, what they like to read. So 0:58:48.600 --> 0:58:51.680 if you are trying to reach the incarcerated, you got 0:58:51.800 --> 0:58:54.080 to go where the incarcerated is that. 0:58:54.680 --> 0:58:57.480 I go directly into the prisons as well through a 0:58:57.560 --> 0:59:00.400 teaching program and also through a journalism program I've talked 0:59:00.440 --> 0:59:05.960 about here. Prison journalism is a project that I support. 0:59:06.200 --> 0:59:08.760 So I'm not necessarily trying to talk to Joe Budden 0:59:08.880 --> 0:59:11.160 to talk to the incarcerated. I'm trying to talk directly 0:59:11.240 --> 0:59:12.040 to the incarcerated. 0:59:12.240 --> 0:59:12.959 I don't want to air. 0:59:12.880 --> 0:59:15.120 Out anybody's business, but I got people in my immediate 0:59:15.200 --> 0:59:18.640 family who are the incarcerated, which is another thing I 0:59:18.720 --> 0:59:20.640 think it's important for people to understand. 0:59:21.840 --> 0:59:22.240 I am not. 0:59:23.480 --> 0:59:27.240 I don't think that intellect has anything to do with degrees, pedigree, 0:59:27.600 --> 0:59:29.160 how much money you make, because I saw a lot 0:59:29.160 --> 0:59:30.840 of comps they all make more money than you. I 0:59:30.960 --> 0:59:33.040 know a lot of rich fools, and I know a 0:59:33.080 --> 0:59:36.080 lot of degreed idiots. I've sat across from tables of 0:59:36.160 --> 0:59:39.000 CEOs who I did not find terribly intelligent. I went 0:59:39.040 --> 0:59:40.960 to school with a lot of debutantes that I don't 0:59:40.960 --> 0:59:44.680 find terribly intelligent. It's not ass to them, but I 0:59:44.720 --> 0:59:47.840 wouldn't necessarily put them in that category either. I think 0:59:48.480 --> 0:59:52.040 it's important. I just want people to know I don't 0:59:52.160 --> 0:59:55.840 come from I wasn't born with a silver spoon in 0:59:55.960 --> 0:59:56.360 my mouth. 0:59:56.760 --> 0:59:58.400 I am my family right now. 0:59:58.840 --> 1:00:01.200 I just I'm not of that world. And I don't 1:00:01.240 --> 1:00:03.919 think you know what we called like elitism. I don't 1:00:03.960 --> 1:00:06.560 necessarily think being of that world is a bad thing. 1:00:06.640 --> 1:00:08.680 I don't also don't believe in putting people down because 1:00:08.680 --> 1:00:10.960 you did grow up privileged, or because you did have 1:00:11.120 --> 1:00:13.880 parents who have multiple degrees or money, that none of 1:00:13.960 --> 1:00:14.560 these things. 1:00:14.440 --> 1:00:15.560 Makes you a bad person. 1:00:15.880 --> 1:00:16.080 To me. 1:00:16.200 --> 1:00:20.080 What I find frustrating is when you are not receptive 1:00:20.320 --> 1:00:23.440 or curious. I don't need to talk to people wherever 1:00:23.600 --> 1:00:26.160 you are, whatever your background is. If you're not receptive 1:00:26.280 --> 1:00:28.720 or curious, then you are likely not my audience and 1:00:28.760 --> 1:00:31.760 I'm likely not yours. I am curious about things. I 1:00:31.840 --> 1:00:36.200 can learn from anybody, but I don't necessarily respect everybody's opinion, 1:00:36.640 --> 1:00:38.280 and I don't think all the people say I respect 1:00:38.280 --> 1:00:38.919 everybody's opinion. 1:00:38.920 --> 1:00:41.000 You'se a lie, I don't believe that. 1:00:42.400 --> 1:00:42.920 Go ahead, can you? 1:00:43.120 --> 1:00:46.480 Can you be intellectually curious without respecting everybody's opinion. 1:00:47.080 --> 1:00:50.960 Yes, you're looking at somebody who's intellectually curious without respecting everybody. 1:00:51.040 --> 1:00:53.840 Because I consider myself intellectually and curious. So I'm the 1:00:53.880 --> 1:00:56.320 type of person that I'm gonna hear you out. You know, 1:00:56.520 --> 1:00:58.480 I may not want to hear you again, but I'm 1:00:58.600 --> 1:01:00.360 at least take the opportunity to live listen to you 1:01:00.840 --> 1:01:02.040 at least one time. 1:01:02.680 --> 1:01:06.840 No, there's a gentleman by the name of Corey. He 1:01:07.120 --> 1:01:10.920 is a lovely person. He happens to be schizophrenic and homeless, 1:01:10.960 --> 1:01:12.720 and he's in the front of my building, and he 1:01:12.840 --> 1:01:15.280 has an opinion on everything. And I sit there and 1:01:15.320 --> 1:01:17.320 chat with Corey sometimes just because he's so nice and 1:01:17.400 --> 1:01:19.680 so sweet, and I give him bread because he lightly 1:01:19.720 --> 1:01:23.200 feed the birds. I don't respect Corey's opinion on anything. 1:01:23.240 --> 1:01:25.760 He got opinion on the financial systems and the banks 1:01:25.840 --> 1:01:27.600 and all the things that he wants to tell me about. 1:01:27.960 --> 1:01:30.040 I'm nice to him, I'm kind to him, I give 1:01:30.120 --> 1:01:31.880 him bread. I would be lying to you to say 1:01:32.240 --> 1:01:35.080 I respect Corey's opinion when I have interest you had to. 1:01:35.080 --> 1:01:36.680 Speak to him, you had to speak to him at 1:01:36.760 --> 1:01:38.240 least one time to understand him. 1:01:38.320 --> 1:01:40.560 Yes, I can speak to anybody. I'm never saying I 1:01:40.600 --> 1:01:43.320 don't speak to anybody. But once I ascertain, oh, you 1:01:43.440 --> 1:01:46.040 are not a curious person, once you are saying things 1:01:46.120 --> 1:01:48.919 to me like you're using tricky words, and this isn't 1:01:49.000 --> 1:01:52.320 just a center flipping that conversation, because I'm really trying 1:01:52.360 --> 1:01:55.920 to broaden this out into anybody who's incurious. Once you 1:01:56.000 --> 1:01:58.840 are clear to me that you are not curious about 1:01:58.880 --> 1:02:01.000 what I have to say. And I would inter myself 1:02:01.080 --> 1:02:05.120 when I would interview different like men on the street 1:02:05.200 --> 1:02:08.640 interviews during the Obama race, and people would say the 1:02:08.720 --> 1:02:12.120 most ignorant things to me, or when you would hear 1:02:12.200 --> 1:02:15.040 lazy reporters go out to Trump rallies and they would say, well, 1:02:15.080 --> 1:02:18.120 you know Obama gave Iran millions of dollars. You know 1:02:18.200 --> 1:02:20.480 he's in cahoots with Iran and he's a Muslim. I 1:02:20.600 --> 1:02:24.160 don't respect your opinion anymore now, like you sound like 1:02:24.200 --> 1:02:26.360 a fool, And I'm giving you reason right there in 1:02:26.480 --> 1:02:29.200 real time, challenging you. But I can't fill a cup 1:02:29.240 --> 1:02:32.240 that's already for so now, No, I don't respect your opinion. 1:02:32.560 --> 1:02:34.680 And Bacari said, this is South Carolina saying, but I 1:02:34.720 --> 1:02:36.760 think all black folks say this. If I'm arguing with 1:02:36.840 --> 1:02:39.480 a fool from a distance, you can't tell the difference. 1:02:39.720 --> 1:02:42.160 I don't need to be where fools gather. If somebody 1:02:42.200 --> 1:02:44.920 else feels called to say no, it is my ministry 1:02:45.240 --> 1:02:47.440 to go inform, to go educate this. 1:02:47.600 --> 1:02:50.560 Particular group of people. I would never shit on that, Like, 1:02:50.640 --> 1:02:52.600 that's just not even my way. I'm like, live and 1:02:52.720 --> 1:02:54.880 let live go do it. That's just not what I 1:02:54.960 --> 1:02:55.400 choose to do. 1:02:55.680 --> 1:02:58.160 I understand. I guess the issue comes in. I can't 1:02:58.160 --> 1:03:00.560 believe I'm on here defending the Joe Budden podcast us, right, 1:03:00.640 --> 1:03:03.560 But but I guess the issue is I don't think 1:03:03.960 --> 1:03:06.560 fools go together at the Joe Budden Podcast, Like, I 1:03:06.600 --> 1:03:09.160 don't think anybody I never say that for the record, Yeah, 1:03:09.280 --> 1:03:10.880 I don't think anybody in that room. 1:03:10.800 --> 1:03:11.240 Is a fool. 1:03:11.520 --> 1:03:13.840 And I also feel like, you know, we should be 1:03:13.960 --> 1:03:16.760 happy that people like Mark Lamont Hill want to be 1:03:17.040 --> 1:03:20.240 on big black platforms. I think that's the biggest problem 1:03:20.280 --> 1:03:23.400 I have right now, is that you know, we tend 1:03:23.480 --> 1:03:27.400 to knock, you know, certain platforms when what we should 1:03:27.440 --> 1:03:30.760 be doing is infiltrating those platforms. 1:03:30.240 --> 1:03:32.320 Like you know, I know everybody likes to you know, 1:03:32.440 --> 1:03:33.600 go as Steven A. Smith. 1:03:34.040 --> 1:03:38.960 I want to see more black elected officials, more black politicians, 1:03:39.040 --> 1:03:42.800 you know, uh, more black spiritual leaders, more black activists, 1:03:42.840 --> 1:03:45.280 more black people with something to say about black issues, 1:03:45.480 --> 1:03:47.760 go on platforms like Steven A. Smith, because all the 1:03:47.800 --> 1:03:49.760 white elected officials are taking advantage of it. 1:03:50.520 --> 1:03:51.480 They're taking advantage of it. 1:03:51.880 --> 1:03:54.360 They're laughing at a fool that when people like about 1:03:54.400 --> 1:03:57.280 because I think that's such an important point. White politicians 1:03:57.320 --> 1:04:00.440 are going on there because they are elevating him to 1:04:00.520 --> 1:04:03.000 a position and they only do this specifically in the 1:04:03.040 --> 1:04:05.600 black community. They are elevating him into a position that 1:04:05.760 --> 1:04:08.640 he did not earn. He is an expert in sports, 1:04:08.880 --> 1:04:10.880 and so you will have white people all the time 1:04:11.240 --> 1:04:15.320 pluck an entertainer, right, well, he whatever he expert in, 1:04:15.480 --> 1:04:16.560 is not politics, it's. 1:04:16.440 --> 1:04:17.480 Not policy, and. 1:04:19.040 --> 1:04:19.880 He has an audience. 1:04:19.920 --> 1:04:23.360 An audience does not equate to intellect, if we can. 1:04:23.960 --> 1:04:25.880 I'm not saying that what you have to say about 1:04:26.400 --> 1:04:28.080 about defendence, go ahead. 1:04:27.920 --> 1:04:28.840 Yeah, I'm not saying it does. 1:04:28.880 --> 1:04:31.320 I'm just saying these audience, these these black people who 1:04:31.440 --> 1:04:34.840 have these large audiences. Instead of sitting on the sidelines 1:04:34.880 --> 1:04:37.040 complaining about them having a large audience and who didn't 1:04:37.120 --> 1:04:37.919 learn what how. 1:04:37.800 --> 1:04:40.640 About go on that platform and deliver some of that truth? 1:04:40.880 --> 1:04:44.000 Are some of that intellect that you have to his audience, 1:04:44.240 --> 1:04:45.919 Like even if you sit around and you talk about 1:04:46.200 --> 1:04:48.600 you know, you saying about the person that you that 1:04:48.680 --> 1:04:50.520 sits outside of a stoop and they have a lot 1:04:50.560 --> 1:04:53.640 of misinformation, are you talking about the people that were 1:04:53.640 --> 1:04:56.440 saying the things about Obama? Those people will continue to 1:04:56.600 --> 1:04:59.960 have misinformation if somebody doesn't go to them and inform them. 1:05:00.240 --> 1:05:02.640 But this was the point that miss, let me, let 1:05:02.680 --> 1:05:05.200 me just respond, please, This is the point that maybe you, miss, 1:05:05.320 --> 1:05:08.600 I'm saying when I'm trying to inform you, when I'm saying, no, 1:05:08.800 --> 1:05:11.640 that is actually not true about Obama, and somebody say 1:05:11.800 --> 1:05:15.160 yes it is because Okay, you are not curious at that. 1:05:15.320 --> 1:05:17.160 You are not right. 1:05:17.440 --> 1:05:19.720 I can't feel your bucket is full. You don't want 1:05:19.720 --> 1:05:21.800 to hear what I have to say. Number two, I'm 1:05:21.840 --> 1:05:25.320 not complaining about anyone having a large audience. I'm complaining 1:05:25.360 --> 1:05:28.280 about who his audience is. He has a large audience 1:05:28.360 --> 1:05:31.320 of mostly conservative, white folks, and they are treating him. 1:05:31.320 --> 1:05:31.600 This is no. 1:05:33.080 --> 1:05:33.440 Tiffany. 1:05:33.520 --> 1:05:36.120 Do you have statistics that say Stephen A. Smith's audience 1:05:36.360 --> 1:05:37.680 is majority conservatives? 1:05:37.720 --> 1:05:41.000 I do Nielsen ratings or his ESPN show. Nielsen Ratings 1:05:41.280 --> 1:05:41.800 qualifies that. 1:05:41.880 --> 1:05:43.600 Well, no, that's the ESPN. I'm talking about his podcast 1:05:43.600 --> 1:05:45.680 because most of the time of these funerals, I don't. 1:05:45.720 --> 1:05:47.600 I don't know his podcast. I just know he built 1:05:47.640 --> 1:05:49.720 his audience on a majority of white people. So I 1:05:49.800 --> 1:05:51.880 don't and I would I would love to dig into 1:05:51.920 --> 1:05:53.760 and I'm happy to come on here next week because 1:05:53.760 --> 1:05:55.960 I would love somebody to prove to me that his 1:05:56.040 --> 1:05:57.760 audience is a majority of black people. 1:05:58.200 --> 1:06:00.480 That's a feeling, but that's a fact. So does that 1:06:00.560 --> 1:06:02.680 make you anti intellectual because you're spewing feelings? 1:06:03.800 --> 1:06:09.360 You know, I'm gonna respond to It's literally five minutes 1:06:09.400 --> 1:06:11.120 left in the conversation. I want to respond to what 1:06:11.200 --> 1:06:14.880 he said. Weigh in, but I'm going to respond to 1:06:14.960 --> 1:06:18.920 this he said, that's a feeling or an opinion. Not necessarily, 1:06:19.040 --> 1:06:22.280 it's somewhat informed because if you look at who his audience, 1:06:22.320 --> 1:06:25.280 how he built his audience, the suggestion that a majority 1:06:25.360 --> 1:06:27.960 of his audience would be comprised of black people is 1:06:28.080 --> 1:06:31.200 not a well informed one. It's it's logic to say 1:06:31.400 --> 1:06:34.200 most of his audience are white people. Are you suggesting 1:06:34.240 --> 1:06:35.680 that most of his audience are black people. 1:06:36.280 --> 1:06:37.720 I don't know what most of his audience is, but 1:06:37.760 --> 1:06:39.920 I know I started, you know, reading steven A's columns 1:06:39.960 --> 1:06:41.880 when he was writing for the Philadelphia Inquirer, when he 1:06:41.960 --> 1:06:43.800 was covering Allen obviously way back in the day, and 1:06:43.880 --> 1:06:46.720 then I followed him the cold pizzin first Take and 1:06:46.840 --> 1:06:49.840 everything else. I think that this new, you know, political 1:06:49.880 --> 1:06:53.080 Stephen A with a conservative audience is relatively new, so 1:06:53.200 --> 1:06:56.280 I would before these white people were talking about him. 1:06:56.440 --> 1:06:58.480 It was majority black people in the barbershop that was 1:06:58.520 --> 1:07:00.920 talking about steven A. But I'm just talking about the 1:07:01.040 --> 1:07:03.800 audience in general. Like you said Mark la mont Hill 1:07:03.840 --> 1:07:08.520 shouldn't be on Joe budden show, why you actually said 1:07:08.560 --> 1:07:10.920 You actually said he should be on CNN. 1:07:11.160 --> 1:07:13.280 Yes, So that's the difference between saying he should not 1:07:13.400 --> 1:07:15.400 be on Joe Budden. I'm saying he should be on 1:07:15.520 --> 1:07:17.960 CNN because he should have never gotten fired from CNN. 1:07:18.280 --> 1:07:20.640 If Mark is happy on Joe Budden's podcast, more power 1:07:20.720 --> 1:07:23.800 to it. What I said was they lack an understanding 1:07:23.880 --> 1:07:26.880 of Mark. I felt like he's disrespected on that podcast 1:07:26.960 --> 1:07:29.760 based on clips that I had seen what Angela said, 1:07:29.760 --> 1:07:32.000 and Angela caught a lot of strays for things I said, 1:07:32.040 --> 1:07:34.440 so I wanted to be clear. What Angela reference was 1:07:34.480 --> 1:07:37.560 a moment where they dismissed his humanity on that show 1:07:37.600 --> 1:07:41.440 when he talked about his friends being killed in Palestine. 1:07:41.680 --> 1:07:44.200 And I do think that is based on what I've seen. 1:07:44.320 --> 1:07:47.480 I do think that is a consistent, consistent pattern where 1:07:47.520 --> 1:07:50.200 I do feel like Mark is not necessarily well received there. 1:07:50.240 --> 1:07:52.120 But Angela once again, other people. 1:07:52.040 --> 1:07:55.160 I just I will say Joe did apologize. 1:07:57.120 --> 1:07:58.680 It's more than just you two in here. 1:07:58.880 --> 1:08:02.440 Just you got a hard out, but you get these 1:08:02.520 --> 1:08:03.080 dudes in here. 1:08:03.480 --> 1:08:06.960 I know, but Joe is crazy, But Joe did apologize 1:08:07.000 --> 1:08:07.640 for that moment. 1:08:07.920 --> 1:08:12.280 I get to all that if we sort I want. 1:08:12.280 --> 1:08:13.600 We can continue, Charlene, and. 1:08:19.400 --> 1:08:22.920 To be continued, you trying to talk twenty minutes ago, 1:08:23.600 --> 1:08:27.360 I got to like one, you got time got. 1:08:29.120 --> 1:08:29.679 That's crazy. 1:08:29.760 --> 1:08:32.200 I was just appreciating watching the mini pod that. 1:08:34.000 --> 1:08:38.719 I know, the Invisible Man, Robert's a good conversation. 1:08:40.520 --> 1:08:44.439 It was it was all right, the only the only uh, 1:08:45.000 --> 1:08:48.799 My only criticism of us, I think as we approach 1:08:48.880 --> 1:08:52.240 these discussions is that we are part of that intellectual 1:08:52.320 --> 1:08:55.080 curiosity that we all must have. We must be able 1:08:55.160 --> 1:08:59.840 to accept criticism without necessarily being defensive, and that being 1:09:00.000 --> 1:09:03.160 our immediate posture to it. And one of the things 1:09:03.160 --> 1:09:05.320 that I saw in the comments, and one of the 1:09:05.400 --> 1:09:08.879 things that I saw when Joe Button was making those comments, 1:09:09.080 --> 1:09:12.680 is we want to be individuals that people come to. 1:09:13.040 --> 1:09:16.280 It's in our phrase, it's welcome home, that feel as 1:09:16.360 --> 1:09:19.240 if there is a comfort level to come in to 1:09:19.520 --> 1:09:22.200 our doors and hear the things we have to say, 1:09:22.840 --> 1:09:24.840 and whether or not we're talking about it from a 1:09:24.960 --> 1:09:31.200 respect perspective or intellect perspective. I think that throughout that conversation, 1:09:32.040 --> 1:09:34.840 it's not that we can't sit out here and be like, 1:09:34.920 --> 1:09:37.400 I'm sorry you felt that way, because that's like human 1:09:37.479 --> 1:09:40.360 gut gas lighting. We have to acknowledge that there were 1:09:40.439 --> 1:09:43.599 people who felt foreclosed from a conversation because of our tone, 1:09:43.680 --> 1:09:45.880 ten or vocabulary. And how do we make sure that 1:09:45.960 --> 1:09:47.559 these are some of the people that we do want 1:09:47.640 --> 1:09:49.240 to reach, or at least I want to reach. That 1:09:49.320 --> 1:09:51.920 may not be everybody's ministry, but I would like to meet. 1:09:52.200 --> 1:09:54.280 I would like to have some of those listeners from 1:09:54.400 --> 1:09:57.519 Joe that are like, you know, maybe maybe we can 1:09:57.560 --> 1:09:59.519 come over there too, maybe there's an hour we can 1:09:59.600 --> 1:10:02.080 spend there too, And that may never happen, but uh, 1:10:02.240 --> 1:10:05.400 you know, that's just kind of my perspective on it. 1:10:05.439 --> 1:10:07.800 And I feel like the only other thing that I 1:10:07.880 --> 1:10:10.240 felt was like weird, and I know we don't do that, 1:10:10.320 --> 1:10:11.960 and we fixed it, but I was glad that we 1:10:12.120 --> 1:10:16.800 didn't necessarily stick with using you know that Joe Button 1:10:16.840 --> 1:10:20.400 in the title and y'all had my face. It was handsome, 1:10:20.439 --> 1:10:22.440 but we had like Joe Button in the title. 1:10:22.560 --> 1:10:24.600 On you get to that be don't be trying to 1:10:24.600 --> 1:10:25.160 scoop me be. 1:10:25.520 --> 1:10:26.559 I told Angela that too. 1:10:26.680 --> 1:10:29.000 I was like, you know what I'm it was first, 1:10:29.360 --> 1:10:31.400 but it was my face and I didn't know, and 1:10:31.479 --> 1:10:34.559 I just felt like I just felt like, right, damn. 1:10:36.120 --> 1:10:38.280 Description, because I don't have no no problem. 1:10:38.400 --> 1:10:39.519 So we had our thumbnail. 1:10:39.560 --> 1:10:41.479 What but car is talking about is the thumbnail for 1:10:41.640 --> 1:10:45.679 last week's show, said Joe Button's podcast and the dumbing 1:10:45.760 --> 1:10:48.280 down of America and Bacari's standing there in the middle 1:10:48.600 --> 1:10:49.800 getting the haze up. 1:10:49.800 --> 1:10:52.040 He did for another too much, so he was in 1:10:52.080 --> 1:10:54.479 the middle of it, and I think that what what 1:10:54.720 --> 1:10:56.240 we did wrong, and I do want to. 1:10:56.840 --> 1:11:01.080 I do want to apologize to Joe Button's cast, to 1:11:01.200 --> 1:11:03.880 their team, to their production company for that title. I'm 1:11:03.880 --> 1:11:06.760 an EP on this show and so I own that wholeheartedly. 1:11:06.920 --> 1:11:10.880 We should have titled it differently. Maybe they wouldn't have 1:11:10.920 --> 1:11:12.680 looked at it. But they they got us back. They 1:11:12.760 --> 1:11:17.200 got the whole podcast taken down for copyright and fishment 1:11:17.240 --> 1:11:19.680 because we actually used their clip. They only took that 1:11:19.800 --> 1:11:22.519 clip out. It's still under challenge. We reposted it without 1:11:22.560 --> 1:11:25.000 the clip, but I would just say to them, well played. 1:11:25.040 --> 1:11:27.880 But I do apologize for titling the podcast. 1:11:28.000 --> 1:11:30.360 Maybe we should for that purpose though. I mean, the 1:11:30.400 --> 1:11:32.200 conversation we had was about the dumbing down. 1:11:32.720 --> 1:11:34.479 But I think that what they took offense to is 1:11:34.520 --> 1:11:36.280 that it looked like we were saying that they are 1:11:36.400 --> 1:11:37.519 responsible for the dummy. 1:11:37.800 --> 1:11:45.800 Well, we all apologize, thanks Tiff. 1:11:46.760 --> 1:11:49.680 Well, I don't apologize one. I don't necessarily credit all 1:11:49.720 --> 1:11:51.760 of us with wanting to be curious. I think we 1:11:51.920 --> 1:11:53.720 have to declare that for ourselves and then act that 1:11:53.840 --> 1:11:55.639 way if it's a true statement. 1:11:57.040 --> 1:11:57.200 Too. 1:11:57.600 --> 1:12:00.960 Typically, I'm never confused about what perspective you're coming from, 1:12:01.000 --> 1:12:03.720 because you kind of stated very clearly every time you 1:12:04.000 --> 1:12:07.599 say a thing, and it is often clear, I think 1:12:07.640 --> 1:12:10.040 to the audience. You know how you'll have relatives or 1:12:10.120 --> 1:12:12.760 uncles or friends who you're like, they don't suffer fools Like, 1:12:13.080 --> 1:12:15.560 that's just not the uncle you're gonna go to to 1:12:15.680 --> 1:12:19.800 bring up that kind of mess with. And I don't 1:12:19.840 --> 1:12:22.479 necessarily take offense from that uncle. I just know what 1:12:22.560 --> 1:12:24.920 I'm getting when I walk in the door, that that's 1:12:25.000 --> 1:12:28.080 not the one who's gonna play with Nichols with me. 1:12:28.240 --> 1:12:31.200 He don't believe woulden Nichols are wooden, and therefore we're 1:12:31.200 --> 1:12:33.160 not gonna play a game with the where the where 1:12:33.200 --> 1:12:37.000 the Nikels are wooden? Tiff, You're kind of that for 1:12:37.160 --> 1:12:39.360 me as it relates to this show. And I don't 1:12:39.360 --> 1:12:41.960 think you hold yourself out there as being something that's 1:12:41.960 --> 1:12:44.640 you're not one either curious about the things that are 1:12:44.720 --> 1:12:47.280 incurious to you. That's not to say you're not curious 1:12:47.280 --> 1:12:49.720 about things, but things that you've determined to be in 1:12:49.800 --> 1:12:52.080 curious to you. You don't want to go the next 1:12:52.160 --> 1:12:54.439 layer layer. And if many of us are being honest, 1:12:55.040 --> 1:12:58.040 there's some people we're not gonna waste time with or 1:12:58.360 --> 1:13:03.240 issues upon because it doesn't say she had us in 1:13:03.360 --> 1:13:05.800 any way, form or fashion. And I wish more of 1:13:05.880 --> 1:13:09.200 us would frankly be honest about that part of ourselves, 1:13:09.360 --> 1:13:12.000 Like I'm not going to feign curious. I'm not going 1:13:12.080 --> 1:13:17.040 to and curious. I'm not going to feign interested and 1:13:17.200 --> 1:13:19.040 what it is that everybody has to say because I'm 1:13:19.080 --> 1:13:23.519 not that isn't necessarily my personal testimony. My personal testimony 1:13:23.640 --> 1:13:25.920 is sort of closer to that, to that tank half 1:13:26.080 --> 1:13:29.760 empty versus half full scenario. If you have room in 1:13:29.920 --> 1:13:32.479 your brain, if you've got room in the conversation for 1:13:32.560 --> 1:13:35.280 what I have to contribute, and I mean legitimately, then 1:13:35.320 --> 1:13:37.240 I feel like this is a conversation I can stay 1:13:37.240 --> 1:13:39.439 a part of. But if it becomes very clear to 1:13:39.520 --> 1:13:42.800 me there's no room here for what I have to contribute, 1:13:42.880 --> 1:13:45.080 no matter in what way or at what level of 1:13:45.160 --> 1:13:47.920 substance I do it, then it's a waste of all 1:13:48.000 --> 1:13:49.960 of our times for us to continue that going on. 1:13:50.200 --> 1:13:52.639 I'm actually I didn't know we were at a war 1:13:52.720 --> 1:13:55.320 of words with other podcasts till this morning. My brother 1:13:55.439 --> 1:14:01.600 told me he's a subscriber to Patrina Patreon Patreon, and 1:14:01.680 --> 1:14:03.719 he was like, I was about to cancel my subscription 1:14:04.240 --> 1:14:06.240 if they were go come at you. And I was like, 1:14:06.240 --> 1:14:07.920 who are you talking about, because I don't even know 1:14:07.960 --> 1:14:10.800 who Patreon is. And then you know, we get in 1:14:10.840 --> 1:14:13.080 the dialogue and he's telling me who is what, and 1:14:13.160 --> 1:14:15.240 I'm like, yeah, we said something, but it was a 1:14:15.320 --> 1:14:17.560 response to this. That and the third I say that 1:14:17.680 --> 1:14:19.880 to say, I know, we feel like these things are 1:14:19.960 --> 1:14:22.000 much bigger than what they really are in the in 1:14:22.120 --> 1:14:25.240 the scale and in the frame of the world to everybody, 1:14:25.400 --> 1:14:27.519 but it isn't that serious to a lot of people. 1:14:28.439 --> 1:14:30.880 I hope we can keep this sort of at that level. 1:14:31.200 --> 1:14:33.040 One of the most brilliant things I heard at the 1:14:33.080 --> 1:14:36.240 opening of this topic was from Brother Abram ken Deing, 1:14:36.280 --> 1:14:40.360 where he basically was like he considers the intellectual you know, 1:14:40.479 --> 1:14:43.639 sort of the intellectual drivers and thinkers of our day, 1:14:43.680 --> 1:14:45.800 to be the ones who are the most curious. And 1:14:45.920 --> 1:14:48.320 I thought that was beautiful. And I think it's beautiful 1:14:48.320 --> 1:14:50.040 to the extent that it leads to a pathway of 1:14:50.080 --> 1:14:53.600 greater understanding. But I'm also not down for going on 1:14:53.680 --> 1:14:57.920 the platform that's the largest I don't know that we 1:14:58.000 --> 1:15:01.639 find ourselves in competition in those places, partly because I'm 1:15:01.680 --> 1:15:04.080 not sure what made you the largest. I'm looking around 1:15:04.120 --> 1:15:07.320 at some people's numbers. I'm like, well, God, who juiced 1:15:07.439 --> 1:15:11.160 this machine to make this the outcome. I just think 1:15:11.200 --> 1:15:13.560 we ought to go places that allow us to be ourselves, 1:15:14.200 --> 1:15:17.280 that allow us to state truth. And yes, the truth 1:15:17.320 --> 1:15:20.240 can be challenged, but it's still mine if I've expressed it, 1:15:20.960 --> 1:15:24.400 and then that has some intellectual honesty that they're not 1:15:24.479 --> 1:15:26.920 gas like men. I'm not gaslighting you to think that 1:15:27.000 --> 1:15:29.800 the thing is when it really isn't. And if some 1:15:29.960 --> 1:15:33.160 of those norms can be absorbed, then all cool, Great, 1:15:33.439 --> 1:15:35.080 I'm taking this hot ass sweat off. 1:15:39.760 --> 1:15:41.400 I agree with the last thing you said, Andrew. 1:15:41.439 --> 1:15:43.760 I think that you know the one thing off and 1:15:44.360 --> 1:15:45.760 Floyd in the summertime, I. 1:15:45.760 --> 1:15:47.360 Think the one thing that would keep me from going 1:15:47.439 --> 1:15:50.120 to a place is it's not if it's not a 1:15:50.200 --> 1:15:53.360 good faith conversation. Absolutely, that's the one thing that keep 1:15:53.439 --> 1:15:56.000 me from going to a place. But you said something else. 1:15:56.680 --> 1:15:58.680 You said, people that allow you I think was the 1:15:58.680 --> 1:16:00.280 first thing you said, people that allow you to be 1:16:00.320 --> 1:16:00.720 who you are. 1:16:00.880 --> 1:16:03.200 Yeah, that you don't have to change codes to like 1:16:03.439 --> 1:16:03.840 show up. 1:16:03.880 --> 1:16:04.800 That that's on you. 1:16:05.840 --> 1:16:06.320 No, no, no, no no. 1:16:06.400 --> 1:16:08.840 What I mean by that is you're not welcomed and 1:16:08.880 --> 1:16:12.880 you're not legitimated in the space unless you're splitting certain 1:16:12.960 --> 1:16:16.640 verbs in that verbs, unless you're laying down lines, you know, 1:16:16.760 --> 1:16:18.840 like you're laying down a track. And I'm just saying 1:16:19.479 --> 1:16:21.759 to the extent that that is the environment that's created 1:16:21.880 --> 1:16:25.080 or else you're debased or legitimized in the audit, in 1:16:25.200 --> 1:16:28.240 the eyes of the people you're in discourse with. Then 1:16:28.280 --> 1:16:30.920 it can't be an honest and intellectual conversation in my opinion, 1:16:31.080 --> 1:16:32.719 like I can't, but you can't. 1:16:32.520 --> 1:16:33.080 Want me to. 1:16:34.920 --> 1:16:37.760 It's okay, beca you. If you express a different thought, 1:16:37.800 --> 1:16:40.120 it's totally cool. All I'm saying is is I don't 1:16:40.120 --> 1:16:43.640 want to feel outside of myself in order to enter 1:16:43.800 --> 1:16:46.559 You're right, that is completely controlled by me, Charlemagne, whether 1:16:46.600 --> 1:16:49.000 I feel in or outside of myself. I don't want 1:16:49.040 --> 1:16:51.519 the pressure to be outside of myself in order for 1:16:51.600 --> 1:16:54.479 me to fill at home in the conversation. And I 1:16:54.560 --> 1:16:57.320 can be outside of myself, I can be in environments 1:16:57.320 --> 1:16:59.720 that are completely different every day of the week. I've 1:16:59.760 --> 1:17:01.840 done that. I've run for election in one of the 1:17:01.880 --> 1:17:05.479 most incurious states I think out there right in so 1:17:05.640 --> 1:17:08.360 many ways, so it's not unlike me to be in 1:17:08.520 --> 1:17:11.920 those places. I've never felt the pressure, however, to show 1:17:12.000 --> 1:17:14.400 up as something that I'm that I'm that I'm not. 1:17:15.200 --> 1:17:18.240 And so so long as the conversation can stay legit 1:17:19.160 --> 1:17:22.240 on those various planks, we're good to go. And if 1:17:22.280 --> 1:17:24.000 they can't, I'm not likely going there anyway. 1:17:26.240 --> 1:17:32.560 I just I for me personally, I think that I 1:17:32.640 --> 1:17:34.519 want to stand on something I said earlier, which is 1:17:34.600 --> 1:17:37.680 that in a portion of being intellectually curious, is you 1:17:37.760 --> 1:17:42.680 cannot be above reproach from criticism, understanding that criticism, and 1:17:42.840 --> 1:17:45.280 at least at least sitting in it for a moment 1:17:45.400 --> 1:17:46.960 to see whether or not it's something that can make 1:17:47.000 --> 1:17:49.400 you better, or it's something you cast aside. Is it 1:17:49.520 --> 1:17:52.640 constructive or is it destructive? But the other thing is, 1:17:52.760 --> 1:17:55.640 and I think this is where I'm somewhat disagreeing with 1:17:55.800 --> 1:17:59.000 with with my brother Andrew, is that I have this 1:17:59.200 --> 1:18:04.280 unique belief that Andrew Gillam is the most talented political 1:18:04.560 --> 1:18:08.760 communicator official that I've ever been around. And I say 1:18:08.840 --> 1:18:11.160 that with a great deal of humility, because I think 1:18:11.200 --> 1:18:16.200 I'm really really good at this right and Andrew. But 1:18:16.360 --> 1:18:18.320 Andrew is the only person that I can say that 1:18:18.360 --> 1:18:20.800 I've been around and be like, man, buddy better than 1:18:20.840 --> 1:18:23.360 me at this, Like he gets it, he conceptualized it, 1:18:23.479 --> 1:18:26.320 he puts policy, and he can go and articulate. And 1:18:26.560 --> 1:18:29.160 that is one of the major reasons I disagree with 1:18:29.280 --> 1:18:33.360 you in Tiffany's kind of a thesis here, because I 1:18:33.479 --> 1:18:36.160 think we're missing the moment where it's incumbent upon us 1:18:36.240 --> 1:18:39.320 to meet people where they are. We have a skill 1:18:39.439 --> 1:18:42.160 set and this is not this is not some anti 1:18:42.280 --> 1:18:45.040 intellectual putting us on another play, But I believe that 1:18:45.120 --> 1:18:48.439 there is a skill set which is measured for this moment, 1:18:49.320 --> 1:18:51.280 something that I don't even think that the Chuck Schumer's 1:18:51.320 --> 1:18:53.800 and the King Jeffries, et cetera. Have, But for this 1:18:53.960 --> 1:18:56.720 particular moment where we it's incumbent upon us in a 1:18:56.800 --> 1:19:00.360 responsibility to meet people where they are, and we can't 1:19:00.439 --> 1:19:03.880 disregard who those people are or disregard the platform upon 1:19:03.960 --> 1:19:06.160 which we may meet them. And so I just feel 1:19:06.240 --> 1:19:09.439 that to be a part of the responsibility, even with 1:19:09.720 --> 1:19:12.240 the skill set and talent that I hold all of 1:19:12.320 --> 1:19:13.800 you all up to have, but I just think that 1:19:14.000 --> 1:19:16.679 was important for me to couch Andrew in that discussion, 1:19:16.800 --> 1:19:19.000 so one he knows how I feel about him. But 1:19:19.160 --> 1:19:22.479 to the reason that I say that, yeah, I get 1:19:22.560 --> 1:19:25.480 it right. This shit may be hard, it may be uncomfortable, 1:19:25.560 --> 1:19:28.080 They may not even give you the benefit of their humanity. 1:19:28.479 --> 1:19:31.920 But oftentimes you're not even talking to that individual. You're 1:19:32.000 --> 1:19:35.680 talking to that impressurable mind. That may be somebody that 1:19:35.800 --> 1:19:39.160 you can change, even slightly, if it's a city council race, 1:19:39.320 --> 1:19:42.120 or it's a proposition or whatever it may be. And 1:19:42.200 --> 1:19:45.280 I think we miss that sometimes, understanding that, yeah, protecting 1:19:45.320 --> 1:19:47.920 our piece is something we have to do, but understanding 1:19:47.960 --> 1:19:51.760 your skill set, God's responsibility, the platform we have, I 1:19:51.800 --> 1:19:55.320 would just say in synopsis, never be above reproach to 1:19:55.400 --> 1:19:58.080 criticism and to you know, I think that we have 1:19:58.200 --> 1:19:59.959 to accept the challenge of meeting people. 1:19:59.720 --> 1:20:04.439 With Are are we using the word intellectual wrong? 1:20:04.960 --> 1:20:07.760 Because because what y'all should be saying is academic, right, 1:20:07.760 --> 1:20:10.280 Because intellectual is just to be able to think, reason 1:20:10.360 --> 1:20:12.240 and understand objectively. 1:20:12.400 --> 1:20:12.519 Right. 1:20:12.640 --> 1:20:15.120 Like I think what y'all are saying is y'all y'all 1:20:15.120 --> 1:20:19.840 are talking about academics like anybody. Joe is an intellectual. 1:20:19.920 --> 1:20:22.320 Joe Budden is one of the most prolific rappers ever. 1:20:22.479 --> 1:20:25.120 Joe Joe probably got a better macabulat. 1:20:24.640 --> 1:20:28.000 Than all of us. Stop card, Joe Budden can rap 1:20:28.040 --> 1:20:28.599 his ass off. 1:20:28.800 --> 1:20:31.320 Now you're about to make this man hate me because 1:20:31.320 --> 1:20:31.800 I'm about to be. 1:20:34.160 --> 1:20:37.800 Remember from the one song, But y'all remember Joe from 1:20:37.840 --> 1:20:40.200 the podcast. I remember Joe from Rappings. But I'm just 1:20:40.240 --> 1:20:41.200 saying why. 1:20:41.200 --> 1:20:43.559 Leonard think he older than us. Y'all just know him 1:20:43.560 --> 1:20:44.320 from the podcast. 1:20:44.400 --> 1:20:45.360 I know him when he had. 1:20:47.960 --> 1:20:49.960 Because you and Leonard are the same age and the 1:20:50.040 --> 1:20:50.960 rest of us are young. 1:20:51.120 --> 1:20:57.479 First of all, you're younger junior down Andrew, you've been 1:20:57.520 --> 1:20:58.040 trying to get in. 1:20:58.160 --> 1:21:00.479 After that, I want to get back to quick, which 1:21:00.520 --> 1:21:03.880 was simply say I haven't disqualified any platform. In particular. 1:21:03.960 --> 1:21:06.080 I talked about a couple of planks that I need 1:21:06.200 --> 1:21:08.120 to be in place for me to be anywhere, and 1:21:08.760 --> 1:21:12.080 that's not to disqualify a place. And I and I 1:21:12.439 --> 1:21:17.599 and I generically think that, yeah, it does require. All 1:21:17.720 --> 1:21:21.680 communication requires at a certain level, meeting people where they 1:21:21.760 --> 1:21:24.080 are if each side is going to be heard. I 1:21:24.240 --> 1:21:28.280 just don't always. I don't always. That doesn't always equal 1:21:28.360 --> 1:21:32.360 to me the glass half empty side of the equation 1:21:32.520 --> 1:21:36.360 every time. Meeting people where they are doesn't require them 1:21:36.479 --> 1:21:41.160 dumbing down or me smartening up necessarily. The way I 1:21:41.280 --> 1:21:43.400 consider what it means to meet somebody where they are 1:21:43.600 --> 1:21:46.800 is to see that their situation and circumstances might be 1:21:47.000 --> 1:21:50.320 right just like mine, or it might be or me 1:21:50.880 --> 1:21:53.800 maybe the up too, so opposite side of where I am, 1:21:54.400 --> 1:21:58.080 and they still deserve what is a respectful exchange, you know, 1:21:58.280 --> 1:22:01.680 off jump, I people don't have to use the same 1:22:01.760 --> 1:22:03.720 vocabulary as me. For us, we meet met each other 1:22:03.760 --> 1:22:05.760 where we are. We don't have to go to the 1:22:05.800 --> 1:22:09.000 same schools. And I've never credentialed myself by education. I 1:22:09.080 --> 1:22:11.680 think I probably carry the lowest amongst it, amongst my 1:22:11.720 --> 1:22:15.120 siblings who have been educated, amongst my friend base who 1:22:15.240 --> 1:22:17.080 have been educated, so. 1:22:17.240 --> 1:22:18.760 That you don't count anyway. 1:22:22.439 --> 1:22:25.200 On that point. So I don't think those are righteous 1:22:25.240 --> 1:22:27.519 criteria in my opinion. I don't think your degrees are 1:22:27.600 --> 1:22:30.639 righteous criteria for me. I don't think where your parents 1:22:30.720 --> 1:22:32.680 come from, what was before and after your name or 1:22:32.760 --> 1:22:36.960 righteous criteria for me. My criteria are much more a 1:22:37.080 --> 1:22:39.519 humane and basic level of entry than that. 1:22:40.000 --> 1:22:43.479 So if we're saying, Leonard, you raised that you thought 1:22:43.520 --> 1:22:46.280 we were saying we met academic when we said intellectual, 1:22:46.280 --> 1:22:48.160 and I don't think any of us think that. Is 1:22:48.200 --> 1:22:50.720 there a way that we're defining And I'm saying we 1:22:50.800 --> 1:22:53.200 are very loosely because we all clearly have very different 1:22:53.200 --> 1:22:55.360 opinions here, But is there a way that you're hearing 1:22:55.479 --> 1:22:59.120 any of us describe or define intellectual that is striking 1:22:59.200 --> 1:23:00.320 you as more actandemic? 1:23:00.400 --> 1:23:02.479 And if you can't explain that, that would be helpful. 1:23:02.640 --> 1:23:04.360 I mean, I think the whole conversation. 1:23:04.479 --> 1:23:07.519 But that's what's so interesting because Mark isn't on that 1:23:07.680 --> 1:23:10.280 show to be an academic, you know what I'm saying, 1:23:10.400 --> 1:23:13.320 Marcus on that show talking about pop culture, Marcus on 1:23:13.400 --> 1:23:16.920 that show talking about you know, women like he's just 1:23:17.040 --> 1:23:19.519 talking about regular things that they would normally be talking 1:23:19.560 --> 1:23:20.000 on that show. 1:23:20.000 --> 1:23:23.080 And then when the conversation, you know, turns to something 1:23:23.479 --> 1:23:24.479 that might be around. 1:23:24.320 --> 1:23:28.320 Social justice or you know, activism or you know politics, 1:23:28.680 --> 1:23:31.879 then he comes in and he's Mark Lamont Hill to academic. 1:23:31.960 --> 1:23:33.880 But I think a lot of us look at Mark 1:23:33.920 --> 1:23:36.479 a certain way, and so you think that's what Mark 1:23:36.600 --> 1:23:39.400 is doing on when it's not. 1:23:39.800 --> 1:23:41.519 That's why I say him and Flip can have that brotherly, 1:23:41.680 --> 1:23:42.360 you know, kurk. 1:23:42.200 --> 1:23:44.960 Fuffle that back and forth because that's how they they 1:23:45.040 --> 1:23:47.200 get down on the show, like they talk about things 1:23:47.240 --> 1:23:50.120 that happen behind the scenes, they bring it to the 1:23:50.240 --> 1:23:53.320 podcast and they're able to have those type of interactions. 1:23:53.400 --> 1:23:56.639 But that wasn't an academic debate like to where where 1:23:56.720 --> 1:24:00.160 Mark was using some you know, fifteen letter words and 1:24:00.240 --> 1:24:02.200 Flip was confused about the words. 1:24:02.280 --> 1:24:03.960 That was that was just some nigga ship. 1:24:04.080 --> 1:24:08.439 Yeah, well we talked about that because I heard from 1:24:08.439 --> 1:24:11.599 a lot of men who are Joe Budden podcast listeners, 1:24:12.040 --> 1:24:15.000 and what they said to me, Leonard is there are 1:24:15.040 --> 1:24:18.600 so few spaces for black men to gather. There are 1:24:18.640 --> 1:24:21.639 so few spaces where black men can go and exhale 1:24:21.680 --> 1:24:24.479 and be themselves. And what they said is, you know 1:24:24.760 --> 1:24:28.719 that Mark Lamont Hill and Flip exchange is so common. 1:24:28.840 --> 1:24:32.720 They're like Tiffany. That's happening everywhere across barbershops right now, 1:24:32.840 --> 1:24:37.280 on street corners, everywhere. And the intimation was, and I 1:24:37.760 --> 1:24:40.680 receive it, but the intimation was, you were weighing in 1:24:41.520 --> 1:24:44.880 on something that you don't touch. You're weighing in on 1:24:44.960 --> 1:24:48.120 a culture of that exists between black men that you 1:24:49.560 --> 1:24:52.680 that's exactly what they said, I'm from we. 1:24:52.840 --> 1:24:55.360 Now apparently share a vagina, were the same person, and 1:24:55.479 --> 1:24:58.400 why all of what Tiff said. I also said, they 1:24:58.439 --> 1:25:00.600 can't even distinguish between the two us because they're like, 1:25:00.600 --> 1:25:01.240 why y'all in the. 1:25:01.240 --> 1:25:02.960 Angel caught a lot of straits or things I said, 1:25:03.000 --> 1:25:06.320 But I did receive what black men were saying, and 1:25:06.600 --> 1:25:08.400 they were saying, like, don't you do some like, you know, 1:25:08.560 --> 1:25:10.800 ignorant shit because they acknowledge, like, yeah, some ignoran shit 1:25:10.840 --> 1:25:12.599 on that show, But so what is our ignorant shit? 1:25:12.640 --> 1:25:13.400 And it's for us? 1:25:13.560 --> 1:25:15.960 And you know, no, I didn't look at it as 1:25:16.000 --> 1:25:18.680 a gender thing at all. It was literally just just 1:25:18.760 --> 1:25:20.880 a black Yeah, it was just it was just a 1:25:20.960 --> 1:25:21.960 black community thing. 1:25:22.040 --> 1:25:22.240 To me. 1:25:22.400 --> 1:25:25.800 It was like, yo, man, if we're trying to build community, 1:25:25.880 --> 1:25:27.400 and we need community. 1:25:27.040 --> 1:25:30.759 Now more than ever. Like, it's not even about knocking 1:25:30.800 --> 1:25:31.200 the platform. 1:25:31.200 --> 1:25:32.960 I don't think you should knock the platform, but don't 1:25:33.080 --> 1:25:35.960 don't knock Mark's role on that platform, because I think 1:25:36.040 --> 1:25:38.759 Mark's role on that platform is very important. 1:25:38.800 --> 1:25:40.080 I think when you got there, when. 1:25:39.920 --> 1:25:42.400 You command the type of audience that you know, Joe 1:25:42.439 --> 1:25:45.240 Budden has for all the type of issues that will 1:25:45.360 --> 1:25:48.080 be you know coming up and have been coming up 1:25:48.080 --> 1:25:49.519 over the last ten months, and we'll. 1:25:49.320 --> 1:25:51.760 Be coming up for the next few years. You need 1:25:51.920 --> 1:25:52.720 somebody like him. 1:25:52.760 --> 1:25:54.960 And that just beef with our conversation about it was 1:25:55.080 --> 1:25:57.519 I felt like we may have positioned marks like the 1:25:57.640 --> 1:25:59.960 guy fighting out of the corner, you know, the keep, 1:26:00.720 --> 1:26:02.600 and I was thinking, which is why I said, I 1:26:02.640 --> 1:26:05.280 wish we could interpret what we think is being said. 1:26:05.560 --> 1:26:07.720 And I think where we into the conversation was like 1:26:08.360 --> 1:26:10.760 each of those men knew exactly what was being said, 1:26:10.840 --> 1:26:13.720 what shot was being fired across which bow, and they 1:26:13.760 --> 1:26:17.320 were prepared to meet each other at that respective place. 1:26:17.560 --> 1:26:20.880 There were no fools, there were no there was no 1:26:21.000 --> 1:26:25.439 confusion about the words exchange or anything like that. I 1:26:25.560 --> 1:26:28.760 just felt like each man met the moment for for 1:26:28.920 --> 1:26:30.840 what they had going on, for the exchange that was 1:26:30.880 --> 1:26:32.920 going on. And I heard directly from a good friend 1:26:32.920 --> 1:26:35.320 of mine, he's a lawyer. Came it was family home 1:26:35.360 --> 1:26:39.720 company rescued me out of my corpse of a house 1:26:39.760 --> 1:26:42.120 and basically was like, look, man, I'm just saying I 1:26:42.240 --> 1:26:44.960 know it's something shit don't listening to. That's why I 1:26:45.080 --> 1:26:48.600 listened to it. And at the same token, he's subscribing 1:26:48.680 --> 1:26:51.560 to NPR every morning, and it's listening, you know, so 1:26:51.680 --> 1:26:55.480 it doesn't even have to be a fight of amongst hedgemonds, 1:26:55.600 --> 1:26:58.120 Like I'm listening to the smartest thing versus the thing 1:26:58.160 --> 1:27:00.120 you're listening to. It's not how you got downe with 1:27:00.200 --> 1:27:02.400 it at all. It was like it's some nigga ship 1:27:02.479 --> 1:27:04.040 and I love it and that's why I listened to it. 1:27:04.120 --> 1:27:05.960 But I love y'all too, and I listened to that 1:27:06.800 --> 1:27:08.720 on the Native Lamp podcast. And that's the thing that 1:27:08.800 --> 1:27:14.439 I guess frustrates me the most awesome. Yeah, every I 1:27:14.640 --> 1:27:17.960 know y'all, single one of y'all. I'm here in the 1:27:18.040 --> 1:27:21.200 corner like I don't even know what we signed up. 1:27:23.080 --> 1:27:24.479 Even when you look at even when you look at 1:27:24.520 --> 1:27:28.479 the conversation that was happening, Look how the audience is interested. 1:27:28.880 --> 1:27:31.000 There's people who listen to Native who listen to Joe, 1:27:31.080 --> 1:27:32.960 people who listen to Joe who listened to the Native land. 1:27:33.040 --> 1:27:34.960 So that lets you know that Joe y'all are not 1:27:35.160 --> 1:27:37.200 far from each other in any way shape of fact. 1:27:37.200 --> 1:27:39.519 Thing that I think that was my money that was 1:27:39.840 --> 1:27:40.640 that was you. 1:27:40.680 --> 1:27:43.240 Need to get the briefing on not cutting people off 1:27:43.479 --> 1:27:44.120 in the middle of it. 1:27:44.880 --> 1:27:50.760 I mean if I if I don't cut nobody off, yeah, 1:27:51.280 --> 1:27:53.439 it'll just be tiffing and Angelo over and talking about 1:27:54.520 --> 1:27:56.000 I should want like. 1:27:59.120 --> 1:28:01.840 At that point, go ahead, Lena, you are the way. 1:28:02.160 --> 1:28:03.559 Listen, he has a heart out. 1:28:03.880 --> 1:28:05.960 Go ahead, Bakari, and then we'll go ahead, Bakari, and 1:28:06.000 --> 1:28:06.960 then Leonardo closes. 1:28:07.160 --> 1:28:08.400 Now I just want to make sure. I want to 1:28:08.400 --> 1:28:10.720 make sure that listeners know that I don't think we 1:28:10.880 --> 1:28:12.840 say this and I definitely don't believe it that there 1:28:12.920 --> 1:28:15.920 is a huge gulf between you know, what goes on 1:28:16.040 --> 1:28:18.320 over there and where we are and if it is 1:28:18.400 --> 1:28:20.680 a golf Hopefully the conversations we can have, we can 1:28:20.720 --> 1:28:22.800 have them on a certain level, that we can bring 1:28:22.880 --> 1:28:25.760 communities together in the spirit of welcome home instead of 1:28:25.840 --> 1:28:27.960 drive people apart that that is the only thing that 1:28:28.040 --> 1:28:30.640 frustrated me in reading the comments. I felt like we 1:28:30.720 --> 1:28:34.040 put ourselves in a position to and it was you know, 1:28:34.080 --> 1:28:36.160 when you drive people, when you when you jones people 1:28:36.200 --> 1:28:37.720 like I was talking about pump pump, pump it up 1:28:37.760 --> 1:28:39.880 and all that stuff. That's one thing, But to just 1:28:39.960 --> 1:28:43.080 push people away from not having a purpose or seat 1:28:43.080 --> 1:28:44.800 at the table, I think is another. And I think 1:28:44.880 --> 1:28:46.880 that people felt that whether or not that was our 1:28:46.920 --> 1:28:50.160 intention or not, that's literally all it was. 1:28:50.240 --> 1:28:53.120 It's just like the rhetoric seems like y'all were so 1:28:54.080 --> 1:28:56.600 far apart, are you know, you know, y'all look at 1:28:56.680 --> 1:28:58.560 them in a certain way, like, you know, kind of 1:28:58.600 --> 1:29:00.639 looking down on them, And I'm like, no, we should 1:29:00.640 --> 1:29:01.240 be looking. 1:29:01.040 --> 1:29:05.280 At each other, you know, eye to eye, because I 1:29:05.439 --> 1:29:07.400 want to see everything. 1:29:07.439 --> 1:29:09.320 I want to see Mark Lemon Hill on Joe Budden, 1:29:09.960 --> 1:29:13.280 I want to see Angela Rai on steven A because 1:29:13.320 --> 1:29:16.760 I know, you know, whoever wants to go to these platforms, 1:29:16.840 --> 1:29:19.559 whoever we on these platforms. I want to see Bakari 1:29:19.600 --> 1:29:21.599 and steven A have a conversation, even though that might 1:29:21.640 --> 1:29:25.360 not ever happen, Like it's the reason we bring, you know, 1:29:25.680 --> 1:29:28.479 so many different voices on Breakfast Club. It's like, wherever 1:29:28.720 --> 1:29:32.880 the audience is, let's amplify the people who have, you know, 1:29:33.080 --> 1:29:35.519 something to say. Like it's just weird that you know, 1:29:35.560 --> 1:29:38.439 everybody's drawing a line in the sand and we're being 1:29:38.560 --> 1:29:42.840 so divisive to each other as a community. Because if 1:29:42.880 --> 1:29:45.800 we're really trying to build community, let's build community for real. 1:29:46.479 --> 1:29:48.120 Yeah, And I think I think that we are. 1:29:48.200 --> 1:29:49.960 I think that we do also have to understand that 1:29:50.040 --> 1:29:52.840 everybody plays a different part. So if Tiff is saying 1:29:52.920 --> 1:29:54.680 this is my ministry over here, this is the thing 1:29:54.720 --> 1:29:56.360 that I can do and I do well, then we 1:29:56.479 --> 1:29:58.599 have to trust that somebody else can play their position. 1:29:59.120 --> 1:30:02.439 I really would like for us to get underneath this. 1:30:04.000 --> 1:30:09.720 Blanket labeling that we do of anti intellectualism, of elitism, 1:30:10.200 --> 1:30:14.880 of the boulet, of the democratic shields, Like what is 1:30:14.960 --> 1:30:15.920 beneath all of that? 1:30:16.080 --> 1:30:18.840 And can you really hear people for the distinctions? 1:30:18.840 --> 1:30:21.800 One of my favorite things about this show as long 1:30:21.840 --> 1:30:25.240 as we've been on is that we there's always a distinction. 1:30:25.400 --> 1:30:28.200 There's always a fine point that somebody offers where it 1:30:28.320 --> 1:30:30.800 may even shift my opinion, you know, it really might. 1:30:30.960 --> 1:30:33.000 I was glad when Leonard was like, I want you 1:30:33.000 --> 1:30:33.639 to listen to the show. 1:30:33.680 --> 1:30:35.280 I promise you. I was like, I am not listening 1:30:35.320 --> 1:30:36.960 to their show. I am not listening to it. 1:30:37.040 --> 1:30:38.479 I just knew they were gonna be it was gonna 1:30:38.479 --> 1:30:41.360 be some craziness, and I am so grateful that you 1:30:41.479 --> 1:30:43.360 pushed me to listen to the show, so much so 1:30:43.720 --> 1:30:45.840 that I went into our chat dropped the show link. 1:30:45.880 --> 1:30:48.040 It was like Leonard said, listen to this, here's the 1:30:48.120 --> 1:30:51.519 time stamp. It changed my perspective a lot. On flip 1:30:51.760 --> 1:30:53.519 it changed my person I could feel like I heard 1:30:53.560 --> 1:30:57.000 the pain in Joe. It felt like, no matter how 1:30:57.120 --> 1:30:59.320 high up you get, you never get the recognition you 1:30:59.360 --> 1:31:02.000 truly deserve, which is amongst your people. And that's something 1:31:02.080 --> 1:31:04.000 that whether we have the same degree, went to the 1:31:04.040 --> 1:31:06.400 same school, live in the same area, or make the 1:31:06.439 --> 1:31:08.759 same amount of money, that's something that we all should 1:31:08.760 --> 1:31:10.439 be able to relate to as black folks. So I think, 1:31:10.479 --> 1:31:13.040 if there's nothing else, if we know where our end 1:31:13.080 --> 1:31:15.679 goal is, liberation for black people, even if our means 1:31:15.760 --> 1:31:18.040 is different, that's the conversation I really want to have, 1:31:18.120 --> 1:31:20.200 and it's the one that I've been in earnest having 1:31:20.280 --> 1:31:22.519 for several months now since this terrorist cuts off. 1:31:22.800 --> 1:31:25.879 Imagine if Bakari and tiff never went on Abbey Phillips show. 1:31:27.240 --> 1:31:29.800 Think get about that I'm conflicted about and we need 1:31:29.920 --> 1:31:30.559 you in that space. 1:31:30.640 --> 1:31:32.160 You're great in that space. 1:31:33.640 --> 1:31:35.519 Because if you weren't there, how many things would just 1:31:35.880 --> 1:31:38.200 go would just fly and people would probably just take 1:31:38.280 --> 1:31:40.280 his gospel if Tiffany wasn't there to dispute it. 1:31:40.439 --> 1:31:42.479 If Bakari wasn't there to dispute it. 1:31:42.600 --> 1:31:45.800 Like think about Obama going on O'Reilly back in the day, 1:31:45.880 --> 1:31:48.160 Think about John Stewart going on Fox News back in 1:31:48.160 --> 1:31:51.439 the day. Imagine if people didn't go in those spaces 1:31:51.720 --> 1:31:53.080 to combat some of the bullshit. 1:31:53.840 --> 1:31:58.040 I think that we need to be everywhere there's eyeballs. 1:31:58.120 --> 1:32:01.320 We need to be everywhere our people are listening, because 1:32:01.720 --> 1:32:03.920 you know that truth does get the people. 1:32:03.960 --> 1:32:05.519 And you may not see it in that moment. Yeah 1:32:05.600 --> 1:32:05.880 you might. 1:32:06.240 --> 1:32:08.200 You might be in that studio and feel like you 1:32:08.320 --> 1:32:10.280 just wasted your time because you was arguing with somebody. 1:32:10.439 --> 1:32:12.080 But think about the millions of people that are at 1:32:12.120 --> 1:32:14.240 home watching. Are the millions of people that are at 1:32:14.280 --> 1:32:17.839 home listening they're getting something from it. They're like, damn yo, Macari, 1:32:18.000 --> 1:32:19.920 Really you know said some ship last night on seeing 1:32:20.000 --> 1:32:20.639 in a Tiffany? 1:32:20.680 --> 1:32:22.240 Really doesn't it last night? On seeing it? And like 1:32:22.439 --> 1:32:23.519 you need that? 1:32:23.760 --> 1:32:26.719 Mark sets in on Joe Budden podcast. I personally feel 1:32:26.800 --> 1:32:28.800 like you you need that, and I don't think we 1:32:28.840 --> 1:32:30.080 should we should knock it. 1:32:30.160 --> 1:32:33.840 Ever, Well, I have I have thought some questions on that, 1:32:34.080 --> 1:32:36.360 but that's a conversation. I don't have to text you 1:32:36.400 --> 1:32:39.960 about because I'm I'm I'm seriously conflicted about going on 1:32:40.040 --> 1:32:41.559 that show. We've talked about it a little bit here, but. 1:32:42.240 --> 1:32:44.200 Angela stopped listening to Angela and it will probably be 1:32:44.760 --> 1:32:45.679 she can testify. 1:32:46.439 --> 1:32:47.280 No, don't listen to me. 1:32:47.400 --> 1:32:50.880 No, I make my She's not intellectually curious about what 1:32:51.000 --> 1:32:52.240 I have to say on this top. 1:32:54.120 --> 1:32:56.120 On this topic, Angela think we all need to be 1:32:56.200 --> 1:32:58.799 on there or as a no go, So that's something different. 1:32:58.840 --> 1:33:00.439 I think Angela's was the agreement. 1:33:00.600 --> 1:33:02.040 Yes, but I have I have. 1:33:02.200 --> 1:33:05.720 Conflict about going on that show, Charla Mane, because I 1:33:05.760 --> 1:33:08.040 think it is dangerous the way that they are platforming 1:33:08.120 --> 1:33:11.439 literal white supremacists, and not everybody deserves my audience, not 1:33:11.560 --> 1:33:15.639 everybody deserves my debate, and so it does feel icky 1:33:15.720 --> 1:33:18.400 to me, Like I watch people on there when you 1:33:18.479 --> 1:33:20.400 are getting to the point where you debate in slavery. 1:33:20.720 --> 1:33:23.320 Something about that does feel beneath me. And I don't 1:33:23.320 --> 1:33:25.920 think it's anything wrong with feeling that way, or even 1:33:25.960 --> 1:33:27.960 somebody does think is wrong. Then that's just where I stand, 1:33:28.040 --> 1:33:29.080 and I'm just on the wrong. 1:33:28.920 --> 1:33:29.240 Side of you. 1:33:29.880 --> 1:33:32.160 But let me also let me also, I mean, it's 1:33:32.280 --> 1:33:35.280 it's one of the only shows where you have whatever 1:33:35.640 --> 1:33:37.680 however you want to describe people where you have that 1:33:38.360 --> 1:33:41.600 cross section of individuals that are there. But also like, 1:33:42.240 --> 1:33:45.120 we have to not come from a place where we 1:33:45.439 --> 1:33:49.080 are foreclosing on platforms we won't go to like we 1:33:49.520 --> 1:33:52.160 we have to. I mean, you're too talented. I mean 1:33:52.200 --> 1:33:53.920 I feel like I said the same thing about Andrew, 1:33:54.360 --> 1:33:57.960 Like we there. It seems like we we always come 1:33:58.040 --> 1:34:00.280 up with a litany or list of like I'm not 1:34:00.560 --> 1:34:02.800 gonna go there. I have, but we have to be 1:34:02.920 --> 1:34:06.679 willing to take our talents in these spaces, not quite 1:34:06.760 --> 1:34:09.639 come as you are a type of deal, but take 1:34:09.640 --> 1:34:11.679 your talents in these spaces and be willing to Yeah, 1:34:12.160 --> 1:34:15.280 have these discussions and realize that at the end of 1:34:15.320 --> 1:34:18.280 the day, it's not about changing that person's mind that's 1:34:18.280 --> 1:34:20.120 sitting at the table from you. At the end of 1:34:20.160 --> 1:34:22.840 the day, it's about talking to the broader audience that 1:34:23.000 --> 1:34:26.880 is thirsting during this vacuum for somebody like Tiffany Cross 1:34:27.000 --> 1:34:28.960 and so I wasn't a part of those conversations. But 1:34:29.439 --> 1:34:32.600 let me just ask you to, you know, politely, reconsider 1:34:33.120 --> 1:34:36.720 that notion. Just if you're weighing as a balance, I 1:34:36.840 --> 1:34:40.439 want you to reconsider it because the need is probably 1:34:40.600 --> 1:34:44.519 greater than the can then the condemnation you may have 1:34:45.200 --> 1:34:48.080 for the particular person you may be may be there with. 1:34:48.240 --> 1:34:48.639 I think. 1:34:50.640 --> 1:34:53.320 Tif gave the best example, Tiffany, you gave the best example, 1:34:53.560 --> 1:34:58.840 that Slavery example. Imagine somebody wasn't there to combat that 1:34:59.040 --> 1:35:01.080 because there are people peple out there who believe it. 1:35:01.360 --> 1:35:04.200 There's people out there who actually believe what that young 1:35:04.280 --> 1:35:06.600 lady said. It's actually people out there who think just 1:35:06.800 --> 1:35:08.680 like her. So somebody has to be out there to 1:35:08.680 --> 1:35:10.080 give the real information. 1:35:09.920 --> 1:35:10.400 That they're not. 1:35:11.920 --> 1:35:14.600 For platforming that person because seeing they should not be 1:35:14.920 --> 1:35:17.800 putting them on. To me, that's where I began my 1:35:18.280 --> 1:35:21.880 broadcast journalism career, and it is abhorrent to me to 1:35:22.080 --> 1:35:24.840 witness them devolve into that kind of thing. It is 1:35:25.000 --> 1:35:28.719 not actually healthy political discourse. It is a Jerry Springer 1:35:28.920 --> 1:35:32.080 like segment where you literally will have a white supremacist 1:35:32.479 --> 1:35:35.360 sitting across from somebody like me, or you'll literally have 1:35:35.479 --> 1:35:41.439 Scott James regurgitating white supremacist attitudes, policies, politics, et cetera. 1:35:41.800 --> 1:35:45.920 And I'm supposed to legitimize this point by debating him. 1:35:46.160 --> 1:35:50.360 It's not necessarily you know, like I shouldn't be a 1:35:50.400 --> 1:35:53.479 part of the debate. It is this news organization should 1:35:53.520 --> 1:35:55.720 not be putting setting up that kind of conversation. 1:35:56.160 --> 1:35:57.200 I think that's a disgrace. 1:35:57.360 --> 1:36:00.200 I agree with you to this parameters. I don't don't 1:36:00.200 --> 1:36:02.040 think this is pick on tiffany day, but I'll just 1:36:02.080 --> 1:36:05.439 say definitely at the that and I said this to 1:36:05.520 --> 1:36:08.880 you directly, that we have to check ego a lot 1:36:08.960 --> 1:36:10.840 of times and a lot of these spaces and to 1:36:10.960 --> 1:36:15.360 the if the most salient point, like echoing in your 1:36:15.479 --> 1:36:18.760 mind is this person doesn't deserve me across from them, 1:36:20.000 --> 1:36:22.800 I just say that's the wrong part of the that's 1:36:22.840 --> 1:36:24.360 not a place to begin in the conversation. 1:36:24.479 --> 1:36:26.760 They may not stand down ten toes down. I don't 1:36:26.760 --> 1:36:28.360 know why supremisist does not deserve. 1:36:29.640 --> 1:36:31.719 They don't deserve And as. 1:36:31.560 --> 1:36:34.800 You are, all I'm simply saying is is we have 1:36:34.920 --> 1:36:41.360 to challenge our own ego and some of it. And 1:36:41.439 --> 1:36:44.439 I don't think it's ego to not when we say 1:36:44.520 --> 1:36:45.960 this person does deserve. 1:36:45.720 --> 1:36:47.160 To be, Oh, well, then I guess I got an 1:36:47.200 --> 1:36:49.840 ego because that's me. That's that's where I draw a car. 1:36:50.080 --> 1:36:51.479 I don't want to deride it. I don't want to 1:36:51.520 --> 1:36:54.240 really drive us down in the conversation. I apologize for 1:36:54.360 --> 1:36:57.880 moving us that direction. This is meant and and and 1:36:58.040 --> 1:36:59.880 real love for you, and not just for you, but 1:37:00.080 --> 1:37:01.920 for all of us. Because I have to do it myself. 1:37:02.400 --> 1:37:05.200 I'm like, I've debated at that level before, I've debated 1:37:05.240 --> 1:37:07.560 above that level. There's no reason for me to have 1:37:11.720 --> 1:37:16.360 a legitimate, a legitimate person who sympathizes with white supremacists, 1:37:17.040 --> 1:37:19.120 as I said in the debate, one who if if 1:37:19.160 --> 1:37:21.120 I'm not calling him it, the ones who are it 1:37:21.280 --> 1:37:23.880 seem to believe they're in good company with them, So 1:37:24.360 --> 1:37:27.120 so I get that. But there are people who are 1:37:27.600 --> 1:37:31.479 legit moved by your words, who might be where they 1:37:31.600 --> 1:37:34.880 are and the position of the debate simply because they 1:37:34.920 --> 1:37:37.160 haven't heard the other side. That's all. 1:37:37.320 --> 1:37:37.600 That's it. 1:37:38.000 --> 1:37:40.160 They maybe where they are simply because they don't know 1:37:40.240 --> 1:37:41.880 the fruits of the other side. 1:37:42.840 --> 1:37:44.400 And I gotta run. I gotta run. But I do 1:37:44.479 --> 1:37:45.200 want to say one thing. 1:37:45.240 --> 1:37:48.360 Andrew said something on this podcast a couple of weeks ago, 1:37:48.880 --> 1:37:51.280 and he said he never wanted to be blind sided 1:37:51.360 --> 1:37:54.799 again about what the other side thinks in this country. 1:37:55.080 --> 1:37:58.160 So therefore, when I see these people platformed on the CNNs, 1:37:58.680 --> 1:38:01.320 you know the MSNBC's of course you see them on Fox. 1:38:01.680 --> 1:38:04.240 I watched that because I too want to know what 1:38:04.400 --> 1:38:07.400 other people are thinking. But I am very appreciative when 1:38:07.439 --> 1:38:10.120 there's a Tiffany Cross, when there's a Bacari Sellers or 1:38:10.160 --> 1:38:11.160 whoever to confront that. 1:38:11.400 --> 1:38:13.800 And I will end with this, are we better than 1:38:13.840 --> 1:38:14.640 our ancestors? 1:38:14.880 --> 1:38:18.799 Because I know Malcolm X, James Baldwin, they publicly debated 1:38:18.920 --> 1:38:22.439 the debated white supremacists all the time. They publicly confronted 1:38:22.600 --> 1:38:25.000 white supremacists all the time, and they would smack them 1:38:25.040 --> 1:38:27.599 down with their black intellect and they're black excellence. 1:38:27.680 --> 1:38:28.559 So wherever there's. 1:38:28.400 --> 1:38:30.960 White supremacy on cable TV, I want to see black 1:38:31.040 --> 1:38:34.120 intellect and black excellence like the Tiffany Crosses of the world. 1:38:34.280 --> 1:38:36.600 And I'm glad and I thank you for your service. 1:38:36.360 --> 1:38:40.680 To be continued. This is a conversation that's ongoing. Thank you, 1:38:40.760 --> 1:38:42.479 What are you got to You gave us way more 1:38:42.560 --> 1:38:44.840 time than you had, so thank you Lenar for joining 1:38:44.880 --> 1:38:49.360 the conversation. All right, well, we're moving us right along. 1:38:49.479 --> 1:38:51.280 I think now we got to get into some calls 1:38:51.320 --> 1:38:53.840 to action. We kept you all here for a long time. 1:38:53.920 --> 1:38:55.640 It's a long show today, but we wanted to be 1:38:55.680 --> 1:38:57.439 sure to address this issue because we did read a 1:38:57.479 --> 1:38:59.559 lot of your comments and did hear from a lot 1:38:59.600 --> 1:39:01.720 of you for laying in. So thank you all to 1:39:01.800 --> 1:39:03.400 our viewers, and we also want to let you know 1:39:04.000 --> 1:39:06.439 if you're watching this show or listening, at the end 1:39:06.479 --> 1:39:09.479 of the show, we are going to play Angela Roun's 1:39:09.920 --> 1:39:12.719 a professional development program of young folks, and she asks 1:39:12.760 --> 1:39:14.599 them the way in with their thoughts on the whole 1:39:14.880 --> 1:39:17.200 intellectual debate. So at the end of the show you'll 1:39:17.200 --> 1:39:19.080 be able to hear their thoughts as well. But for 1:39:19.200 --> 1:39:20.880 now we're going to move on to cause to action. 1:39:27.920 --> 1:39:29.000 Who cares about truth? 1:39:29.080 --> 1:39:30.120 On the last more than. 1:39:32.720 --> 1:39:34.080 Okay, we told you it was going to be a 1:39:34.120 --> 1:39:36.920 spirited conversation and it certainly is. Thank you guys for 1:39:37.000 --> 1:39:39.479 sticking with us on a long show today. I do 1:39:39.600 --> 1:39:43.080 want to remind you that please tune into our mini 1:39:43.160 --> 1:39:47.280 pod because we get to sit down with Ajaka Owen's mom. 1:39:47.680 --> 1:39:51.559 She's the subject of a very striking documentary on Netflix, 1:39:52.280 --> 1:39:54.479 The Perfect Neighbor. It was so striking it is number 1:39:54.520 --> 1:39:57.360 one on Netflix right now. It is about a woman 1:39:57.600 --> 1:40:01.080 who was murdered by a white woman who happened to 1:40:01.120 --> 1:40:03.240 be her neighbor, and I encourage you all to watch it, 1:40:03.360 --> 1:40:06.879 but please be sure to tune into Native Lampod's conversation 1:40:07.120 --> 1:40:10.680 with them. And right now we have another that was 1:40:10.760 --> 1:40:12.360 not my call to action. For the record, I have 1:40:12.439 --> 1:40:14.160 another call to action, but I'm gonna kick it off 1:40:14.280 --> 1:40:15.360 with my co host, Angela. 1:40:15.439 --> 1:40:16.080 You want to go first. 1:40:16.320 --> 1:40:16.599 Sure. 1:40:17.479 --> 1:40:20.240 My call to action is to talk to somebody you 1:40:20.320 --> 1:40:23.880 don't agree with this week and really listen. I had 1:40:23.920 --> 1:40:27.320 the opportunity to do that last week, and to listen 1:40:27.400 --> 1:40:29.560 to a podcast that I don't normally listen to. 1:40:30.280 --> 1:40:32.439 It proved to be enlightening. So that is my challenge 1:40:32.479 --> 1:40:32.760 to y'all. 1:40:34.240 --> 1:40:36.320 I like it, Andrew was yours. 1:40:37.560 --> 1:40:41.080 Build your things on things that last, Put your hopes 1:40:41.120 --> 1:40:43.960 on things that last. Put all everything you're building on 1:40:44.040 --> 1:40:48.240 things that last, because slippery is all of the ground. 1:40:50.920 --> 1:40:53.560 And learn from the movements that have actually something to 1:40:53.680 --> 1:40:56.160 teach us. There was a time in this country where 1:40:56.200 --> 1:40:59.559 eighty percent of Americans believed in social security and retirement benefits. 1:41:00.360 --> 1:41:02.160 There was a time in this country where eighty percent 1:41:02.200 --> 1:41:05.760 of the politepole believed in workplace protections. There was a 1:41:05.880 --> 1:41:08.840 time when eighty percent of this country was prepared to 1:41:08.960 --> 1:41:13.240 go after big oligarchs and the wealthiest, consuming as much 1:41:13.240 --> 1:41:16.559 as they could for themselves, and it was a widely 1:41:16.680 --> 1:41:21.160 popular set of ideas, the New Deal, And when the 1:41:21.240 --> 1:41:24.360 New Deal was popular, it was popular amongst over eighty 1:41:24.400 --> 1:41:27.920 percent of Americans until those people realize that those same 1:41:28.000 --> 1:41:31.080 benefits would be extended to black people. And that's when 1:41:31.120 --> 1:41:37.599 the benefit, the support for those benefits dissipated. So check 1:41:37.640 --> 1:41:39.479 out the sum of us. Read a little bit about 1:41:39.920 --> 1:41:42.439 these parts of movements that I think we can build from, 1:41:42.640 --> 1:41:45.880 grow from, learn what we can from them, and leave 1:41:45.920 --> 1:41:49.720 the rest that doesn't serve us behind. Because our only 1:41:49.760 --> 1:41:51.320 pathway out of this is going to be on the 1:41:51.400 --> 1:41:56.400 ground that's solid and that gets shored up by our 1:41:56.479 --> 1:41:59.679 continued activism in this space. At least that's what I believe. 1:41:59.760 --> 1:42:04.800 I'll continue to believe that until a new belief takes over. 1:42:05.400 --> 1:42:07.960 Did you say, build your hopes on the things that. 1:42:08.120 --> 1:42:11.040 Last, Build build everything on the things that last. 1:42:10.920 --> 1:42:12.280 Build everything on it. I just want to get it 1:42:12.320 --> 1:42:13.760 right from when I repeat it like it was my own. 1:42:14.360 --> 1:42:16.200 Everything on the things that last. 1:42:17.520 --> 1:42:20.080 Dream, build it last. 1:42:19.960 --> 1:42:22.120 Build your hopes and dreams on the things that last. Honestly, 1:42:22.120 --> 1:42:25.240 that's beautiful, Andrew, thank you for that. I do want 1:42:25.280 --> 1:42:27.559 to share Bakari. So, Bakari has been going back and forth, 1:42:28.120 --> 1:42:30.360 as I said, because he's in court, but he did 1:42:30.640 --> 1:42:32.720 when he was running out, he did tell us his 1:42:32.800 --> 1:42:34.360 CTA and it was really similar to yours. 1:42:34.400 --> 1:42:37.479 Angela. He said, I need no, no, no. 1:42:37.720 --> 1:42:43.080 He he just said, to basically approach conversations open. I 1:42:43.160 --> 1:42:45.320 think it's all you know, all about our conversations that 1:42:45.880 --> 1:42:47.760 we've had. So he kind of shared his ct and 1:42:47.840 --> 1:42:52.160 his perspective and our conversation with Charlemagne. But essentially he 1:42:52.320 --> 1:42:56.280 was saying, you know, be open to have conversations with people. 1:42:56.479 --> 1:43:00.080 Show go to where people are even you know, no 1:43:00.160 --> 1:43:03.320 matter what your preconceived notions about them. So sorry, b 1:43:03.560 --> 1:43:06.599 if I have butchered your CTA, but next. 1:43:06.479 --> 1:43:07.559 Time, keep your ass here. 1:43:07.840 --> 1:43:09.440 Next time homework. 1:43:13.400 --> 1:43:15.160 But if I mess it up, you can correct me. 1:43:15.760 --> 1:43:17.920 Next week you can do a dis tape on social 1:43:18.000 --> 1:43:20.040 media like you probably. 1:43:19.960 --> 1:43:23.160 Probably we sorry Beyonce from messing up as your backup dancers. 1:43:23.720 --> 1:43:27.680 My ct A is this week in Minnesota, Texas, New York, 1:43:27.720 --> 1:43:30.840 and Pennsylvania. Uh, they are looking at dwindling funds for 1:43:31.040 --> 1:43:35.800 SNAP benefits and uh even Wick which which helps to 1:43:35.880 --> 1:43:39.559 feed over seven million low income mothers and children. Those 1:43:39.640 --> 1:43:43.200 funds are running low. SNAP is of course federally funded, 1:43:43.240 --> 1:43:45.920 but it's administered by the states, and so the shutdown 1:43:46.600 --> 1:43:49.600 impacts the people who get these benefits. So if you 1:43:49.680 --> 1:43:53.439 are able to help in any way feed someone who 1:43:53.840 --> 1:43:56.360 may not have their benefits, who may be too proud 1:43:57.240 --> 1:43:59.839 to ask. You can anonymously leave a bag of groceries 1:43:59.880 --> 1:44:02.920 on their door, mail them food. You can have food 1:44:03.000 --> 1:44:05.760 delivered to them if you feel in fancy, Uber eats 1:44:05.800 --> 1:44:08.479 them dinner for a week. Whatever you can do, even 1:44:08.520 --> 1:44:10.439 if it's somebody you don't know, if you see somebody 1:44:10.560 --> 1:44:13.280 on the news talking about it. However, we can help 1:44:13.320 --> 1:44:17.440 each other in this time. I think it's so incredibly important, 1:44:17.840 --> 1:44:20.800 and I'm cheating because I have another call to action. 1:44:21.680 --> 1:44:25.000 I do want to tell our Native Land Pod audience 1:44:25.479 --> 1:44:30.599 that Angela Rye turns twenty nine years old this week. 1:44:30.920 --> 1:44:33.120 She's celebrating forty six. 1:44:33.320 --> 1:44:36.280 She is turned at forty six this week, and so 1:44:36.360 --> 1:44:38.880 we want to wish our dear sister a happy birthday. 1:44:40.560 --> 1:44:43.720 I hope that you spend that day I don't think 1:44:43.800 --> 1:44:45.479 you will, but I hope you spend that day doing 1:44:45.960 --> 1:44:48.560 nothing in service to anyone but yourself. 1:44:48.240 --> 1:44:48.960 Like to go to sleep. 1:44:49.320 --> 1:44:51.040 Okay, is that what you're planning on doing? Sleeping? 1:44:51.120 --> 1:44:51.720 I do think so. 1:44:51.840 --> 1:44:53.479 And I was like, for my birthday, wish is for 1:44:53.600 --> 1:44:56.120 Andrew to get well, because I'm watching him blow his nose. 1:44:56.160 --> 1:44:56.840 It's so nice. 1:44:57.479 --> 1:44:58.960 He's been sweating the whole show. 1:44:59.040 --> 1:45:02.679 Andrew's been fighting bickness since last week because the show. 1:45:02.760 --> 1:45:04.560 Last week, ever, he got well. Here's what you know. 1:45:04.640 --> 1:45:06.760 I'm not gonna do my birthday be around Andrew because 1:45:06.760 --> 1:45:07.679 I do not want whatever. 1:45:08.600 --> 1:45:12.160 Angel You need some rest, and Andrew and Angela you 1:45:12.240 --> 1:45:16.080 need celebration. I will say, you guys know the Machetes 1:45:16.920 --> 1:45:20.600 always we are a very giving, loving, supportive group of girlfriends, 1:45:21.280 --> 1:45:24.840 and so you do. You have something coming your way 1:45:25.080 --> 1:45:28.320 from us, But I won't say what it is. We 1:45:28.400 --> 1:45:31.360 can talk about it later. But if you guys catch 1:45:31.439 --> 1:45:35.240 this on numberfore Sunday, be sure to wish Angela a 1:45:35.400 --> 1:45:38.040 very happy birthday. I will be tweeting out her personal 1:45:38.080 --> 1:45:40.800 cell phone number so you can tell her directly. Stay 1:45:40.840 --> 1:45:43.320 tuned for that. And as always, we want to remind 1:45:43.360 --> 1:45:45.400 everybody if you like what you heard today, and I 1:45:45.479 --> 1:45:48.120 really hope you did, because we've been Andrew's stripping. 1:45:48.360 --> 1:45:53.280 I don't know what's happening. He's getting undressed. I was 1:45:53.360 --> 1:45:56.200 distracted though, like I saw Andrew stripping. I don't know 1:45:56.240 --> 1:45:59.360 it's happening. But uh, we're here for it, Andrew, We're 1:45:59.400 --> 1:46:00.200 here for it, not. 1:46:02.240 --> 1:46:02.960 Go straight. 1:46:03.439 --> 1:46:05.400 But no, that is why I know you said because 1:46:05.439 --> 1:46:08.000 you've been hot and cold, Andela being rude talking about you. 1:46:17.160 --> 1:46:20.040 If you liked any part of this conversation, truly, I 1:46:20.400 --> 1:46:22.760 just wanted to say all of us really appreciated reading 1:46:22.840 --> 1:46:26.960 your comments, hearing from you all, So please share the video. 1:46:27.680 --> 1:46:30.120 Tell a friend about the podcast. You know, some people 1:46:30.160 --> 1:46:32.840 were complaining, like, oh, you guys are doing this for clicks. 1:46:33.760 --> 1:46:36.240 We talk about things of substance. You know, Angela had 1:46:36.240 --> 1:46:38.880 a great interview with Jenny Nelson. Please, by all means 1:46:38.960 --> 1:46:43.639 go flood that clip with comments. I don't know he's 1:46:43.720 --> 1:46:44.400 going through menopause. 1:46:44.400 --> 1:46:45.240 He's like chill. 1:46:45.880 --> 1:46:49.519 Menopause shows up in all different phases. To be guilty. 1:46:50.120 --> 1:46:52.719 But no, I was shaking my head your comment about 1:46:52.920 --> 1:46:53.960 they're just doing that for clicks. 1:46:54.000 --> 1:46:57.280 I'm like, click for who We'll just we're saying like 1:46:57.320 --> 1:46:59.360 we wanted more viewers, and of course we always do, 1:46:59.439 --> 1:47:02.479 and that's that's why we show not by any means 1:47:02.520 --> 1:47:04.280 and certainly not by being messy, but but having a 1:47:04.439 --> 1:47:06.920 very healthy exchange of ideas and ideology, which we do 1:47:07.040 --> 1:47:11.200 on this show every week about things of Stuffarence. Okay, 1:47:12.120 --> 1:47:13.599 we got two minutes before we got to be out 1:47:13.640 --> 1:47:15.320 of the studio, so I just want to tell everybody 1:47:15.880 --> 1:47:17.599 that there are other clips and things that we would 1:47:17.640 --> 1:47:19.760 love to have from this week that we discussed that 1:47:19.760 --> 1:47:21.320 we would love to hear from you on. Feel free 1:47:21.360 --> 1:47:24.240 to drop a video, drop a question, share the video. Also, 1:47:24.280 --> 1:47:27.760 please check out other choices on Reason Choice Media. Our 1:47:27.800 --> 1:47:31.400 girl Jamil Hill shout out to the Macheties, she hosts 1:47:32.280 --> 1:47:36.280 Politics and Si Cup hosts Off the Cup and I 1:47:36.400 --> 1:47:38.479 know it's the edition which we talked about Noah de 1:47:38.560 --> 1:47:41.439 Borasso with the more you know, and please be sure 1:47:41.560 --> 1:47:43.960 to give us a follow on all our platforms. 1:47:44.000 --> 1:47:44.960 We certainly heard. 1:47:44.840 --> 1:47:46.760 From a lot of you, so you just showed up 1:47:46.800 --> 1:47:49.240 to make a comment on our alleged beef. We hope 1:47:49.280 --> 1:47:51.640 that you will stick around for the substance that we 1:47:51.800 --> 1:47:54.599 try to offer on this show every week. 1:47:55.080 --> 1:47:56.120 I don't know how. 1:47:56.040 --> 1:48:00.720 Many days there are until midterm elections, because at this point, Oh, 1:48:01.200 --> 1:48:04.639 Angela's telling me there are three hundred and seventy six days, 1:48:04.800 --> 1:48:08.920 which is almost a year. Isn't that crazy? Three hundred 1:48:08.920 --> 1:48:11.800 and seventy six days left until midterm elections. I'm not 1:48:11.920 --> 1:48:15.640 sure if we're gonna have free and fair elections, but 1:48:16.160 --> 1:48:18.400 certainly now's the time to be informed and stay focused 1:48:18.400 --> 1:48:20.519 on what's happening while we prepare for the worst to come. 1:48:21.000 --> 1:48:23.240 Thank you guys for joining us. We are your hosts. 1:48:23.400 --> 1:48:26.600 Bakari Sellers allegedly is somewhere fighting a good fight in 1:48:26.640 --> 1:48:29.680 the courtroom. Andrew Gillam, who is going through the menopause 1:48:29.720 --> 1:48:33.720 hot and cold. We send our prayers. Angela Rai, who 1:48:33.800 --> 1:48:35.640 is getting ready to turn up for her birthday, and 1:48:35.680 --> 1:48:37.679 by turn up, I mean turn it down, getting comfy 1:48:37.840 --> 1:48:41.040 in the bed, relaxing. We're on down for what she 1:48:41.200 --> 1:48:44.519 deserves it. And Tiffany Cross, thank you guys for tuning in. 1:48:44.680 --> 1:48:48.600 Welcome Home, Welcome Home to the Native Landing on the 1:48:48.680 --> 1:48:52.000 podcast space Tess and for greatness sixteen minutes it's so hit, 1:48:52.320 --> 1:48:54.759 not too long for the crazy ships. High level combo 1:48:54.920 --> 1:48:57.479 politics in a way that you could taste it then 1:48:57.600 --> 1:49:00.599 got chested. Politics touches you will and if you don't 1:49:00.640 --> 1:49:03.880 touch it, so get invested across the t's and dop 1:49:03.960 --> 1:49:06.160 the i's, kill them back to get them staying on 1:49:06.280 --> 1:49:08.960 business with ride. You could have been anywhere, but you 1:49:09.080 --> 1:49:11.920 truset us natively and podcast the brand that you can 1:49:12.040 --> 1:49:12.439 trust you. 1:49:30.320 --> 1:49:35.120 Hey, everybody, So, because we had such a long, in 1:49:35.240 --> 1:49:38.240 depth conversation today, we're actually gonna move some of our 1:49:38.320 --> 1:49:41.200 viewers questions and comments over to our sub stack. We 1:49:41.360 --> 1:49:44.400 invite you to continue the conversation over there, real or 1:49:44.520 --> 1:49:48.640 perceived beef whatever. We're broadening out this conversation into what 1:49:48.800 --> 1:49:51.439 it means to be an intellectual, what it means to 1:49:52.000 --> 1:49:54.559 find common ground with all of us, so that we're 1:49:54.600 --> 1:49:58.759 not excluding anyone. We are not engaged in the math 1:49:59.600 --> 1:50:03.759 the power politics of subtraction or division. We are engaged 1:50:03.800 --> 1:50:06.360 in additional multiplication and for that reason we want to 1:50:06.400 --> 1:50:10.120 hear your thoughts. Go over and leave your comments, let 1:50:10.240 --> 1:50:11.920 us know what you think, send us a video as 1:50:11.960 --> 1:50:14.080 you normally do, and hopefully we'll see you over there 1:50:14.120 --> 1:50:14.639 on substance. 1:50:15.160 --> 1:50:17.920 Native Landpod is a production of iHeartRadio and partnership with 1:50:18.000 --> 1:50:21.240 Resent Choice Media. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the 1:50:21.280 --> 1:50:24.760 iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your 1:50:24.760 --> 1:50:25.479 favorite shows.