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Speaker 1: From UFOs to psychic powers and government conspiracies. History is

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Speaker 1: riddled with unexplained events. You can turn back now or

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Speaker 1: learn this stuff they don't want you to know. A

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Speaker 1: production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 2: Welcome back to the show. My name is Matt, my

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Speaker 2: name is Nol.

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Speaker 3: They call me Ben. We're joined as always with our

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Speaker 3: super producer Alexis codenamed Doc Holliday Jackson. Most importantly, you

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Speaker 3: are you. You are here. That makes this the stuff

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Speaker 3: they don't want you to know. In twenty twenty four,

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Speaker 3: you guys, can you believe it?

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Speaker 4: Barely weird?

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Speaker 2: I'm not stoked.

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Speaker 4: Use your date, man. Once we hit twenty twenties. Now

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Speaker 4: everything just sounds like it's supposed to be megafuturistic and

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Speaker 4: it's just not minus weird. Robot attacks, did you guys

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Speaker 4: hear about that? Apparently happened a year ago, but U

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Speaker 4: Tesla robot on a factory floor in Texas attacked and

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Speaker 4: mauled an employee, and that the story just came out.

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Speaker 4: But that's sort of my future. But it happened a

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Speaker 4: year ago, it just now started getting reported on. I

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Speaker 4: thought that it was maybe a thing that was already known,

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Speaker 4: and that I just was, you know, missing the boat.

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Speaker 4: But I looked it up and it does seem that

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Speaker 4: it was a thing that happened. That it was a

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Speaker 4: clawed assembly line sort of robot arm that basically pinned

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Speaker 4: and mauled an employee who then fell down a shoot

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Speaker 4: intended for scrap metal.

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Speaker 3: Very willy wonka, also very margin of error kind of thing, right.

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Speaker 2: But it didn't do it because it wanted to, Right,

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Speaker 2: That's the.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I was considering doing that as as today's strange

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Speaker 4: deduce from me. But I feel like it's such a

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Speaker 4: buzzy fake out kind of thing where it's like robots attacking. No,

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Speaker 4: that is not that there was an emergency stop thing.

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Speaker 4: It must have. It was unclear from the article exactly

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Speaker 4: what caused it to target this individual, but I don't

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Speaker 4: think it was out of malice.

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Speaker 3: The human rates to what do we attribute, right, like

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Speaker 3: like what is the motivation of a plant, of an

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Speaker 3: algorithm and so on? Or the Supreme Court. We're going

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Speaker 3: to get to that. We're going to talk about some

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Speaker 3: big picture stuff. We're going to touch on an epidemic

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Speaker 3: amid the US deer population. We're going to talk about

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Speaker 3: menthol cigarettes, and we're going to talk about the US

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Speaker 3: Supreme Court because America, we need to have a conversation

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Speaker 3: to America.

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Speaker 4: You're drunk, go home or maybe not, Ben you you

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Speaker 4: brought I think for a little kind of yea to

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Speaker 4: start with for the new year.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, let's talk about good news. So we wanted to

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Speaker 3: start the year off with some cool ideas. We got

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Speaker 3: one in here. I don't know if it's good news,

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Speaker 3: but did you guys hear that humans can make jet

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Speaker 3: fuel from hoop?

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Speaker 2: Now? You know what? That makes sense with all the

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Speaker 2: burn pit information we've been getting lately, like burning the

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Speaker 2: poops seem to have just as many bad effects as

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Speaker 2: burning the jet fuel.

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Speaker 4: And of course, since I'm a child, my mind immediately

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Speaker 4: condures a cartoon image of someone with fire shooting out

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Speaker 4: of their butt. That's just a me.

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Speaker 3: Thing, No, that's I think that's an everybody thing. That'd

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Speaker 3: be pretty cool if you could, if you could fart

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Speaker 3: well enough.

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Speaker 4: To be a jet runing that the very first South

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Speaker 4: Park episode where Cartman's like, there'sh.

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Speaker 3: There are some extinct animals that have been rediscovered, right,

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Speaker 3: like Mark Twain said, the uh the reports of their

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Speaker 3: deaths have been greatly exaggerated, So shout out to the

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Speaker 3: shimmering golden mole.

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Speaker 4: Which the shimmering gold that's that like the opposite of

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Speaker 4: the naked It sounds shimmering golden, right, I want to

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Speaker 4: catch them all. I was really having my fingers crossed

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Speaker 4: for the Dodo though, No, Dodo.

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Speaker 3: We got to call Lucky. We have a covenant.

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Speaker 2: Toto's coming back for real, though, I remember seeing, Yeah,

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Speaker 2: they're trying to bring Dodo back.

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Speaker 4: Oh but that's a science y thing. This is okay,

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Speaker 4: it's like an experiment.

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Speaker 2: Guys. I just had a vision for our future. Oh

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Speaker 2: my god, this talk about positivity. We've been looking for

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Speaker 2: a way to get a universal basic income. If everybody

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Speaker 2: is just pooping on the regular and we all do it,

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Speaker 2: what if we're all just making jet fuel and the

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Speaker 2: government pays us poop.

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Speaker 4: Stop, It'll be a matrix situation. We'll I'll just have

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Speaker 4: tubes hooked up to our butts.

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Speaker 3: And Eisenhower was right, Military industrial poop complex.

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Speaker 4: Matt stop it with these pithy suggestions that are just.

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Speaker 3: It's ancient technology. Night soil is a real thing. It's

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Speaker 3: the first fertilizer, so why can't it be the new biofuel,

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Speaker 3: serious biofuel.

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Speaker 4: We are the batteries, guys. We are the batteries fueling

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Speaker 4: the military industrial complex from our butts.

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Speaker 2: You just change up the sewer system like minorly and

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Speaker 2: add in and intake. Oh my god, we can do this.

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Speaker 4: Everybody, write your congress person, folks. Matt said it here first.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, send a physical letters so they'll pay attention.

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Speaker 3: So another piece of good news. Minimum wage is going

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Speaker 3: to increase in twenty two states across the US on

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Speaker 3: January first. Shout out to MPR. Shout out to everybody

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Speaker 3: listening now, who is one of the nine point nine

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Speaker 3: million workers who will see an increase.

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Speaker 4: I'm assuming this is just as a result of a

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Speaker 4: benevolent state sort of situation, right Ben, someone was just

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Speaker 4: like they deserve it, give it to them, they worked

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Speaker 4: for it.

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Speaker 3: I don't know a lot of our fellow conspiracy realist

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Speaker 3: will point out with validity that inflation has accelerated.

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Speaker 4: So is this is this one of those tools right,

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Speaker 4: like the FED adjusting you know, rates and such. I'm

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Speaker 4: really obviously a math scientist.

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Speaker 2: Well, this is this is really good news, you guys.

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Speaker 2: I'm just looking at that and per article you shared, Ben,

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Speaker 2: and it looks like some states are going to see

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Speaker 2: almost seven dollars additionally added to the minimum wage number.

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Speaker 4: That's amazing significant.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, that's life changing, hopefully for the better. We

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Speaker 3: also are one other piece of good news. Scientists have

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Speaker 3: successfully destroyed cancer cells using vibrating molecules, which I don't

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Speaker 3: pretend to understand, but shout out to the journalist David

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Speaker 3: Neild if that's real.

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Speaker 2: We've received a lot of messages and we've seen stories

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Speaker 2: over the years of using vibrations to cure people of things, right,

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Speaker 2: like different vibes but different different types of literal vibration

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Speaker 2: just being shot through parts of the human If this

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Speaker 2: is true, I want to learn more about that. So

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Speaker 2: we need to do a deeper dive into that.

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Speaker 4: And this isn't the first story of the year, even

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Speaker 4: that's been about advances and eradicating cancer, like we are

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Speaker 4: in a future. You know, I made the joke about

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Speaker 4: twenty twenty four seeming so futuristic, but there are things

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Speaker 4: that are happening despite my bad jokes. A cure for

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Speaker 4: cancer is the kind of thing that always had this

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Speaker 4: ring of like unattainability, and now it does feel like

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Speaker 4: we're inching towards something resembling that. Right.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, it turns out if you shake up these aminocyanine

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Speaker 3: molecules with something that's not quite infrared light, they will

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Speaker 3: vibrate in sync the same way people would like dance

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Speaker 3: at a wedding across the world. They'll do it like

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Speaker 3: a weird line dance, and this will break out the

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Speaker 3: membranes of cancer cells. This is pretty cool news. We

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Speaker 3: are indeed talking about good vibrations. Shout out to that band,

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Speaker 3: the Beach Boys. I really think they're going places.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I heard of them, dude, Amino Cionine. Never heard

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Speaker 2: of this.

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Speaker 3: This is incredible, It is incredible, right, I agree with you, guys.

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Speaker 3: Like the strange thing about this is that so often

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Speaker 3: on Strange News we bring you stories that don't quite

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Speaker 3: get into the headlines or don't quite get the analysis

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Speaker 3: they deserve, and a lot of times we don't make

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Speaker 3: space to talk about the good stuff. And there is

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Speaker 3: good stuff happening, right, There are uplifting things occurring in

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Speaker 3: the world, and we hope that we can launch our

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Speaker 3: own project twenty twenty five in a good way. Right,

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Speaker 3: And speaking of segues, the amazing invention here in the US.

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Speaker 3: But speaking of conversational segues, there is a group of

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Speaker 3: people that will be very important to you next year.

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Speaker 3: Odds are you have not spoken with these folks directly.

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Speaker 3: Odds are you don't know all their names, but if

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Speaker 3: you live in the United States, they are the rock

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Speaker 3: stars of law and order.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I have a really cool acronym. It's fun to

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Speaker 4: say and sounds a lot like scrotum.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, they're they're they're the seemingly invincible characters that

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Speaker 2: they live on planet Earth. Right, they they get in

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Speaker 2: their position, there's nothing you could do too bad. They're there.

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Speaker 2: That's it. I don't know, in a weird way, I

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Speaker 2: do see them as like, I don't know, the way

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Speaker 2: you're describing them and makes me see them as comic

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Speaker 2: book characters.

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Speaker 3: I think that's accurate, Matt. I mean, like, we're we're

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Speaker 3: talking about a democracy, a democracy that is also a

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Speaker 3: republic in some ways, and a lot of people get

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Speaker 3: mad about the semantics of that. But in a very

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Speaker 3: real process, the laws of the United States are written

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Speaker 3: by Congress, right, they're co signed or derided by the President.

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Speaker 3: But it's a Lord of the Rings situation. There are

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Speaker 3: nine people right now who are basically ring raiths. You

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Speaker 3: do not elect them as a US citizen. They do

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Speaker 3: not really get fired. They have the job for the

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Speaker 3: entirety of their lives. They are called to your point

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Speaker 3: Noel Scotus, Supreme Court of the United States, and oh boy,

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Speaker 3: we need to talk about them. We need to talk

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Speaker 3: about them. This is not quite strange news for twenty

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Speaker 3: twenty three. This is strange news for twenty twenty four

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Speaker 3: and twenty twenty five.

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Speaker 4: And I guess the update ish maybe that puts it

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Speaker 4: sort of in the news and for end of twenty

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Speaker 4: twenty three. Is this Code of Ethics thing which seems

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Speaker 4: like it should have already been in place, but is

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Speaker 4: seemingly relatively toothless and kind of just more symbolic than anything, right.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, So we've talked about it in the past.

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Speaker 3: There's a lot of ongoing controversy around things like insider

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Speaker 3: trading laws for members of Congress. Congress on both sides

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Speaker 3: of the political aisle, made a lot of money during

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Speaker 3: the pandemic by short selling things like toilet paper, sanitizer,

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Speaker 3: vaccination deployment.

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Speaker 2: Game stop, game stop.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, shout out to our stock friends right. The issue, however,

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Speaker 3: rarely gets to the level of the Supreme Court, the

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Speaker 3: idea of corruption, because this court is seen in American

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Speaker 3: history as largely infallible. It is seen as the consciousness

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Speaker 3: of the American public despite the fact that these folks

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Speaker 3: are again unelected, often above reproach and don't hold themselves

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Speaker 3: to the same standards that you would be held to. Congratulations, Hey,

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Speaker 3: guess what if you bought a mortgage, you have to

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Speaker 3: deal with stuff. But if you're in, if you're the Supremes,

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Speaker 3: you can you can get some workarounds because.

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Speaker 4: You have synchronized dance moves.

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Speaker 3: They don't. I mean, I don't know's there's no video

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Speaker 3: allowed in the court, so maybe they got a caol.

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Speaker 4: They have outfits like.

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Speaker 3: So let's go to the point you raised. The US

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Speaker 3: Supreme Court has adopted its first ever ethics code. To

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Speaker 3: be clear, Congress does have an ethics code and has

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Speaker 3: for some time. I'd gallon paper.

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Speaker 4: Sure, look what it took for what's his face to

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Speaker 4: get ejected first first ever? Remember I believe it was

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Speaker 4: he Congress or was he representative? I'm talking about of

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Speaker 4: course Santas. So yeah, Santos, I mean, that guy was

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Speaker 4: just doing crimes left, right and center. And even that

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Speaker 4: was a remarkable feat that he was ejected. I scoff

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Speaker 4: because clearly their code of ethics is pretty toothless too.

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Speaker 4: I'm sorry inter out. I'm just blown away by that.

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Speaker 3: Well, George Santos was ejected. I think he was his

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Speaker 3: House of Representatives, so he's not his senator. He's the

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Speaker 3: sixth member of the House of Reps in all of

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Speaker 3: American history who was ejected. It was it was a

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Speaker 3: thing where this divided country came together and said, ah,

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Speaker 3: this guy. But this doesn't often happen with members of

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Speaker 3: the Supreme Court. And when the Supreme Court decided that

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Speaker 3: they would do some sort of ethics standard thing, they

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Speaker 3: raised a lot of questions, and they raised a lot

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Speaker 3: of criticism. They issued the following statement, and this comes

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Speaker 3: to us from a great MPR article by Annie Gersh

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Speaker 3: and Nina Totenberg. Here's the quote. The absence of a

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Speaker 3: code has led in recent years to the misunderstanding that

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Speaker 3: the justices of this Court, unlike all other jurists in

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Speaker 3: this country, regard themselves as unrestricted by any ethics rule.

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Speaker 3: To dispel this misunderstanding, we are issuing this code, which

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Speaker 3: largely represents a codification of principles that we have long

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Speaker 3: regarded as governing our conduct. This happens in step with

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Speaker 3: and folks, we hate to say it, this happens in

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Speaker 3: step with growing controversy over a member of the Court

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Speaker 3: who is from our state of Georgia, as Thomas No

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Speaker 3: I know not critical hit.

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Speaker 2: Twenty was wrote, Yeah, that gosh, man, just reading about

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Speaker 2: this stuff. Well, I've got an idea. I'm gonna throw

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Speaker 2: it out at the end, so let you yeah, let's

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Speaker 2: keep going. I've got like a concept. I think you

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Speaker 2: guys are going to be into.

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Speaker 3: You got a pitch yep?

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Speaker 2: Nice?

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Speaker 3: All right, So we know this occurs. Nothing happens in

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Speaker 3: a vacuum, right, So the US public has a very

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Speaker 3: low opinion of the Supreme Court right now as of

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Speaker 3: twenty twenty three, going into twenty twenty four, more and

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Speaker 3: more where people are saying, hey, why don't these guys

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Speaker 3: have consequences? Right, Like, why don't these folks have the

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Speaker 3: same sort of experiences that we have to live under.

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Speaker 3: For instance, you know there's the Row versus Wade overturning.

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Speaker 3: There's a lot of scuttle butt occurring. Now, scuttle butt

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Speaker 3: is a word I learned from the late Scalia. You

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Speaker 3: guys remember Scalia.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, he's a Scotus.

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Speaker 3: But oh my gosh, can we do a sound Q

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Speaker 3: on that? Those excellent. So the the issue here is

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Speaker 3: that for a democracy to exist, all members of the

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Speaker 3: public servitude, industry or genre should be following the letters

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Speaker 3: of the law that they write. And increasingly the American

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Speaker 3: public regards wardless of demographic, ideology or age. The American

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Speaker 3: public is increasingly cynical regarding these institutions. We have maybe

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Speaker 3: heard stories about Clarence Thomas, in particular, taking big, big,

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Speaker 3: weird vacations with billionaire donors. You guys remember that.

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Speaker 4: Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, like and you know, getting all

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Speaker 4: sorts of elaborate meals and gifts and just I mean,

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Speaker 4: it's it's nearly impossible to classify that stuff as anything

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Speaker 4: but bribes. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: Well, when the individual, the individual that is giving these gifts, right,

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Speaker 2: or these trips or these vacations, whatever you want to

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Speaker 2: call them, when that individual is a huge money player

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Speaker 2: in politics, it's a big deal because those justices have

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Speaker 2: to come together and decide in the end what the

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Speaker 2: law means.

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Speaker 4: Right, yeah, in a closed door session, in a vacuum, basically,

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Speaker 4: you know what I mean. It's unilateral to your pointment,

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Speaker 4: the power that these raiths wield, so to even have

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Speaker 4: the perception of that kind of compromise is outrageous.

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Speaker 2: But it's not as though Clarence Thomas was the only

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Speaker 2: justice that was doing this kind of stuff, right. Other

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Speaker 2: people have been shown to have these meetings, trips in

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Speaker 2: you know, vacations as you put it in I think

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Speaker 2: that's probably the best word for it. But just hanging

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Speaker 2: out with donors who run the political parties.

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Speaker 4: They're supposed to be out of their reach, they're supposed

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Speaker 4: to beyond reproach. It's horses. They're clearly none of those things.

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Speaker 3: It's tough. It's tough also because we know from previous

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Speaker 3: I almost said exercises keeping it. We know from previous

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Speaker 3: examples that one of the first things you do when

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Speaker 3: you overthrow a democracy is control the courts.

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Speaker 4: Right. That's why that's why.

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Speaker 3: Courts turn into rubber stamps under dictators of any stripe.

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Speaker 3: That's why justices get harassed, exiled, or even murdered. And

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Speaker 3: one of the big big controversies a few years back

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Speaker 3: was the installation of Supreme Court justices and the installation

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Speaker 3: of appellate justices and federal level federal level judges. And

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Speaker 3: this is going to be important in the near future,

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Speaker 3: sooner than perhaps any of us in the US would

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Speaker 3: like to imagine, because we're in a situation where the

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Speaker 3: folks who are hired by a guy have to rule

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Speaker 3: for or against that guy.

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Speaker 4: Even the confirmation process of justices seems largely symbolic. You know,

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Speaker 4: it's basically, if the president picks the person, they're gonna

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Speaker 4: get confirmed, no matter how controversial they are. I don't

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Speaker 4: know that I've ever seen in my lifetime one that

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Speaker 4: was rejected short of maybe, like you know, proven allegations

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Speaker 4: of like sexual misconduct on the front end. Can you

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Speaker 4: think of one? I can't. I don't know.

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Speaker 2: I thought that just happened pretty much.

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Speaker 4: Was there one? There was that one guy. No, No,

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Speaker 4: that one guy got confirmed and.

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Speaker 2: He got confirmed, but previously to him, there were several

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Speaker 2: other or no after him, there were several okay, people

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Speaker 2: that got put for.

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Speaker 4: Still, it's just it's yeah, well it seems very symbolic largely,

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Speaker 4: but anyway, I just the process is really creepy. I

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Speaker 4: don't like it. I don't like it. It's a strange

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Speaker 4: what it's going to ask you really quickly, because when

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Speaker 4: when you brought us up in our group textdress, I

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Speaker 4: thought you were also maybe referring to the situation with

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Speaker 4: uh state supreme courts and like keeping a candidate off

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Speaker 4: the ballot. I don't want to pivot too much, but

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Speaker 4: I'd love to talk more about that in the coming

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Speaker 4: weeks and months as we see how that process is achieved,

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Speaker 4: what allows it to succeed and what causes it to fail,

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Speaker 4: and maybe state supreme courts is also an interesting thing

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Speaker 4: to roll into a larger episode about the Supreme Court.

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Speaker 3: Ah, yes, you're talking about Colorado.

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Speaker 4: Eh, that's right.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, that's a fantastic point, and it's something that can

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Speaker 3: maybe put some folks into a snoozefest. Right, who wants

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Speaker 3: to talk about who wants to talk about the weird

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Speaker 3: state of courts in the United States? Well, people who

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Speaker 3: go to prison, first off, are friends at Lava for

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Speaker 3: Good and people who want to pull shenanigans. Again, we're

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Speaker 3: being a political with this. We're pointing out a structural conspiracy.

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Speaker 3: There is some stuff they don't want you to know

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Speaker 3: when it comes to the idea of packing courts.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I think the biggest deal with this whole ethics thing,

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Speaker 2: and like, here's a solution, right, we will offer you

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Speaker 2: an internal solution. We will sign a piece of paper

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Speaker 2: that says we won't do anything bad. But there's no mechanism.

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Speaker 2: There's no lever that gets pulled or a wire that

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Speaker 2: gets tripped if they do something that is, you know,

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Speaker 2: contrary to that agreement that they signed. So really it's toothless,

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Speaker 2: doesn't mean anything, I think guys, Oh, here's the pitch.

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Speaker 2: If you imagine all the surveillance that we as citizens

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Speaker 2: are under, well, you know, some of it overt some

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Speaker 2: of it just that's happening through third parties and applications

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Speaker 2: we sign up for and sign terms of agreements with.

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Speaker 2: If you imagine just how much data is collected on

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Speaker 2: us individually. What if there was a special version of

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Speaker 2: that kind of thing that was for publicly serving officials, right,

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Speaker 2: someone who gets elected or someone who gets appointed, like

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Speaker 2: to the Supreme Court, where they are monitored just a

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Speaker 2: little more fully like.

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Speaker 4: A rate my professor type situation.

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Speaker 2: No, it's not external, right, So the information is internally

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Speaker 2: to whatever this is, this you know, oversight committee, this

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Speaker 2: thing that just shows every meeting like every major person

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Speaker 2: that in agenda them there things like that where it's just.

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Speaker 4: Calendar is what I mean by agenda? Like, you know,

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Speaker 4: who are they taking meetings with that should be public?

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Speaker 4: Is it not? To some degree it doesn't exist? Okay?

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Speaker 3: The degree of surveillance also, I would pause, it does exist.

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Speaker 3: It's not available to the public. But the justices and

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Speaker 3: the alphabet are I can only imagine very aware.

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Speaker 4: They might know.

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Speaker 3: You know what they might know Supreme Court bowel movement schedules.

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Speaker 2: Well they probably do. I mean, I'm sure they know mine,

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Speaker 2: so like, why wouldn't they know theirs?

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Speaker 3: Well, you got to get off that app, Matt. You

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Speaker 3: gotta stop logging in.

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Speaker 2: I don't even bring my phone around me when I

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Speaker 2: poop anymore, and they still see me doing it.

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Speaker 4: No, you gotta make your jet fuel some somehow, somehow,

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Speaker 4: there we go. Making jet fuel should becoming new euphemism

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Speaker 4: for pooping.

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Speaker 3: By the way, I love it. Matt's a loop. What

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Speaker 3: are you proposing here?

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Speaker 2: I feel like, if you are going to take the

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Speaker 2: great responsibility of being one of those sitting justices. There

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Speaker 2: should be some kind of.

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Speaker 4: Scrutiny, high level scrutiny.

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Speaker 2: Like when you choose to do that, you were going

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Speaker 2: to make quite a bit of money. You're not going

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Speaker 2: to be, you know, a billionaire, but you're gonna make

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Speaker 2: quite a bit of money in that position, and you're

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Speaker 2: going to wield a ton of power. I think there's

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Speaker 2: got to be some kind of mechanism set up there

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Speaker 2: that make sure you are actually doing what that position

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Speaker 2: is supposed to do, rather than serving yourself or your

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Speaker 2: family or whatever other thing it is that you hold

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Speaker 2: up higher than the public good.

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Speaker 4: But if there's not, which there's not, you have to

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Speaker 4: ask yourself, is this by design? Is this the nature

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Speaker 4: of this system? You know there? I think it is

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Speaker 4: to a large degree. I don't think. I think people

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Speaker 4: want to be able to have that opportunity to work

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Speaker 4: their way to that level of power. That's the dream.

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Speaker 4: Then you can, you know, get whatever you want for

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Speaker 4: your family and your cronies and your connections for life.

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Speaker 4: That's the reason a lot of people get into politics.

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Speaker 4: I think, you know, and I don't think it should

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Speaker 4: be that. I don't think it should be that at all.

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Speaker 3: Shout out to the Taft family. One of the biggest

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Speaker 3: US presidents in many ways on many levels, also served

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Speaker 3: in the Supreme Court. So do you guys think it's

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Speaker 3: worth it to do an episode about the Supreme Court?

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Speaker 4: Yeah, and maybe we throw in a little bit of

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Speaker 4: stuff about some of the state stuff as well. I

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Speaker 4: think it's great, Ben, and I think this is a

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Speaker 4: great primer and really valuable information to start us off strong.

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Speaker 4: Give our paranoia a kick, a shot in the arm.

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Speaker 3: There we go. So shout out to our fellow conspiracy

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Speaker 3: realist folks. We would love to hear your opinions on

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Speaker 3: the Supreme Court of the United States, especially if you

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Speaker 3: have spent time in countries other than the US. Let

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Speaker 3: us know conspiracy Diehart Radio dot com what eight three

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Speaker 3: three s T d W y t K. We're going

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Speaker 3: to pause for a word from our sponsors, and then

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Speaker 3: we are going to return with a story from the

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Speaker 3: natural world. Not super pigs, but another you know, another situation.

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Speaker 2: Wake up, grab a human thrown down the way chute.

437
00:26:27,920 --> 00:26:32,120
Speaker 2: Sorry sorry, robot chops.

438
00:26:33,080 --> 00:26:39,320
Speaker 4: Say, actually that's kind of weird. I am serious.

439
00:26:39,480 --> 00:26:42,000
Speaker 2: It was referenced in some podcast I was listening to

440
00:26:42,080 --> 00:26:44,600
Speaker 2: over the holiday break. So that's sorry about that.

441
00:26:46,960 --> 00:26:50,760
Speaker 4: A voice that got really cool, great operatic pipes on

442
00:26:50,840 --> 00:26:51,320
Speaker 4: that guy.

443
00:26:52,720 --> 00:26:55,160
Speaker 2: Dude, seriously, system of a down if you didn't catch

444
00:26:55,200 --> 00:26:58,639
Speaker 2: a reference. Okay, so we were back, and guys, let's

445
00:26:58,640 --> 00:27:02,439
Speaker 2: start out by talking about mad cow disease. We lived

446
00:27:02,480 --> 00:27:05,960
Speaker 2: through that whole thing when we were slightly younger. What

447
00:27:06,040 --> 00:27:09,040
Speaker 2: was that? What causes mad cow disease? Why is it dangerous?

448
00:27:09,400 --> 00:27:09,960
Speaker 3: Prions?

449
00:27:10,080 --> 00:27:10,280
Speaker 4: Right?

450
00:27:10,400 --> 00:27:12,800
Speaker 2: Yes, I always say prions. I think it might be wrong,

451
00:27:12,840 --> 00:27:16,560
Speaker 2: but p R I O N s. I'm gonna say

452
00:27:16,560 --> 00:27:18,920
Speaker 2: prions because that's just the way my brain works around

453
00:27:18,960 --> 00:27:19,320
Speaker 2: that thing.

454
00:27:19,359 --> 00:27:22,679
Speaker 4: But not to be confused with prawns, which are delightful

455
00:27:22,800 --> 00:27:24,680
Speaker 4: shrimp esque crustaceans.

456
00:27:24,840 --> 00:27:30,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, no, none, spongefore sponge offm in cephalopathy.

457
00:27:30,440 --> 00:27:33,879
Speaker 2: That's wow. That's it, Ben, Yes, that is the thing

458
00:27:33,960 --> 00:27:36,959
Speaker 2: that we all heard about. It was in popular media

459
00:27:37,040 --> 00:27:40,280
Speaker 2: all over the place. It was in the news. Thousands

460
00:27:40,320 --> 00:27:43,360
Speaker 2: and thousands of cows lost their lives because they were

461
00:27:43,400 --> 00:27:48,560
Speaker 2: potentially exposed to the prions that caused this thing. It

462
00:27:48,600 --> 00:27:52,040
Speaker 2: was a horrible, big deal not that long ago here

463
00:27:52,040 --> 00:27:54,280
Speaker 2: in the United States, in the United Kingdom, and several

464
00:27:54,320 --> 00:27:56,639
Speaker 2: other places in the world. And the reason why it

465
00:27:56,640 --> 00:28:01,439
Speaker 2: was so dangerous. It's because these weird malformedes called prions

466
00:28:02,200 --> 00:28:07,040
Speaker 2: infect an animal and then slowly change that animal and

467
00:28:07,280 --> 00:28:09,480
Speaker 2: spread throughout that animal till it gets to their brain.

468
00:28:10,080 --> 00:28:13,639
Speaker 2: And there is no medicine you can give an animal

469
00:28:13,680 --> 00:28:17,119
Speaker 2: infected with these things these prions, no way to cure

470
00:28:17,160 --> 00:28:20,000
Speaker 2: this thing. And there's also well, let's just say it's

471
00:28:20,119 --> 00:28:25,720
Speaker 2: extremely difficult to eradicate these prions once they're out in

472
00:28:25,800 --> 00:28:29,240
Speaker 2: the environment, and they can exit an infected animal in

473
00:28:29,280 --> 00:28:32,440
Speaker 2: all kinds of ways, like through their saliva, through their waste,

474
00:28:32,600 --> 00:28:37,639
Speaker 2: through their dead, decaying body. It's really really dangerous stuff,

475
00:28:37,680 --> 00:28:39,520
Speaker 2: and it can stay in the soil, kind of like

476
00:28:39,560 --> 00:28:42,200
Speaker 2: the way those potential fungal infections can occur, and they

477
00:28:42,240 --> 00:28:44,720
Speaker 2: just hang out in the soil for long periods of time.

478
00:28:45,600 --> 00:28:46,320
Speaker 2: Really scary.

479
00:28:46,520 --> 00:28:49,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, you can't eat the flesh, or you shouldn't eat

480
00:28:49,520 --> 00:28:56,800
Speaker 3: the flesh as well. You're absolutely right on multiple accounts. Prions, pons,

481
00:28:57,320 --> 00:29:01,480
Speaker 3: prions is the way ions. You're right. I think it's prions.

482
00:29:01,560 --> 00:29:04,720
Speaker 2: Well that's a whole thing. Now we're going to introduce

483
00:29:04,760 --> 00:29:06,600
Speaker 2: to you something that you may not have heard of,

484
00:29:07,080 --> 00:29:11,600
Speaker 2: called chronic wasting disease or CWD.

485
00:29:12,120 --> 00:29:14,320
Speaker 3: Is that like a Dungeons and dragons.

486
00:29:14,840 --> 00:29:20,000
Speaker 2: Definitely, Oh, definitely, yes, it's a spell that is cast. No. No,

487
00:29:20,200 --> 00:29:24,720
Speaker 2: this is another disease caused by similar prions, but in

488
00:29:24,840 --> 00:29:28,880
Speaker 2: a different class of animals, different species. So matt cow,

489
00:29:28,960 --> 00:29:34,040
Speaker 2: it's cows, right, bovines in CWD. It is in animals

490
00:29:34,160 --> 00:29:39,160
Speaker 2: like deer, elk, moose, caribou and rein deer and this

491
00:29:39,280 --> 00:29:42,080
Speaker 2: thing it acts very much in the same way. And

492
00:29:42,120 --> 00:29:45,680
Speaker 2: it's also called the zombie deer disease.

493
00:29:46,080 --> 00:29:47,280
Speaker 4: Ohikes.

494
00:29:47,960 --> 00:29:51,320
Speaker 2: Now there's a reason for that because when an animal

495
00:29:51,480 --> 00:29:54,239
Speaker 2: is infected with this stuff, and it can take, by

496
00:29:54,280 --> 00:29:57,000
Speaker 2: the way, up to a year to potentially two three

497
00:29:57,120 --> 00:30:00,080
Speaker 2: years to actually see the effects of an infection in

498
00:30:00,120 --> 00:30:00,600
Speaker 2: an animal.

499
00:30:01,200 --> 00:30:01,520
Speaker 4: Uh.

500
00:30:01,680 --> 00:30:07,880
Speaker 2: The animals become drooling, lethargic, emaciated like they're not eating enough,

501
00:30:08,200 --> 00:30:13,400
Speaker 2: stumbling around and they have this uh The Guardian. Todd Wilkinson,

502
00:30:13,440 --> 00:30:16,960
Speaker 2: writing in The Guardian on December twenty second, he describes

503
00:30:17,000 --> 00:30:22,000
Speaker 2: it as a telltale blank stare like just like like

504
00:30:22,080 --> 00:30:23,840
Speaker 2: a zombie.

505
00:30:23,440 --> 00:30:25,360
Speaker 4: And then they crave brains.

506
00:30:25,400 --> 00:30:30,160
Speaker 3: No doubt that thousand league stare the double zeros. Stephen

507
00:30:30,240 --> 00:30:33,160
Speaker 3: King talks about eyes when looking at a serial killer.

508
00:30:33,880 --> 00:30:37,440
Speaker 3: Oh yeah, dead eyes like Kirsten Dunst in literally every Man,

509
00:30:38,760 --> 00:30:43,520
Speaker 3: My God, I said it, It's true. Watch even and

510
00:30:43,640 --> 00:30:45,600
Speaker 3: bring it on, dude, watch the eyes.

511
00:30:46,680 --> 00:30:53,000
Speaker 4: Actually in Fargo season two, she's a classic blank character choice.

512
00:30:53,040 --> 00:30:54,280
Speaker 2: Guys, it's a character choice.

513
00:30:54,440 --> 00:30:56,560
Speaker 4: I'm with you, Matt, I'm with you. I'm with you.

514
00:30:56,720 --> 00:30:57,720
Speaker 4: Come on, all right?

515
00:30:57,800 --> 00:31:01,600
Speaker 3: So yes, yes, walk down the street that one. But this,

516
00:31:01,880 --> 00:31:05,200
Speaker 3: you know, Matt, this story reminds me a little bit

517
00:31:05,320 --> 00:31:10,840
Speaker 3: of the dolphin atavism that we discussed earlier. It reminds

518
00:31:10,880 --> 00:31:14,320
Speaker 3: me a little bit of the hybrid super pig. Definitely

519
00:31:14,400 --> 00:31:20,120
Speaker 3: reminds me of our Cortyceps episodes. This zombie deer disease, right,

520
00:31:20,840 --> 00:31:22,960
Speaker 3: how is it spreading? Is it zoonotic?

521
00:31:23,560 --> 00:31:24,600
Speaker 2: What do you mean zoonotic?

522
00:31:24,920 --> 00:31:26,120
Speaker 3: Can it go to humans?

523
00:31:26,200 --> 00:31:30,720
Speaker 2: Okay? So before with mad cow disease, the big fear

524
00:31:31,000 --> 00:31:33,960
Speaker 2: was that this disease would somehow jump to humans, right

525
00:31:34,200 --> 00:31:38,840
Speaker 2: as we've seen other diseases like a covid you know,

526
00:31:39,000 --> 00:31:42,560
Speaker 2: a bird disease jumping to humans. They were nervous that

527
00:31:42,600 --> 00:31:45,040
Speaker 2: mad cow disease. If you ate the meat, you might

528
00:31:45,120 --> 00:31:47,920
Speaker 2: get it as a human. There was a potential danger

529
00:31:47,920 --> 00:31:50,160
Speaker 2: for that. But there wasn't a lot of danger for that.

530
00:31:50,280 --> 00:31:52,920
Speaker 2: It was mostly we don't want to spread any of

531
00:31:52,960 --> 00:31:54,240
Speaker 2: this around, right.

532
00:31:54,240 --> 00:31:57,240
Speaker 4: Things like mad cow disease mainly come from press coverage

533
00:31:57,880 --> 00:32:00,920
Speaker 4: or was that like some sort of official designation.

534
00:32:01,760 --> 00:32:04,600
Speaker 2: Well, it was a real disease caused by that's.

535
00:32:04,680 --> 00:32:07,160
Speaker 4: Not the official name for the disease. There's like a

536
00:32:07,240 --> 00:32:09,640
Speaker 4: scientific name for a mad cow is more of a

537
00:32:09,680 --> 00:32:14,240
Speaker 4: shorthand sort of like serial killer names.

538
00:32:13,560 --> 00:32:14,920
Speaker 3: Bovine sponge of form.

539
00:32:15,520 --> 00:32:18,320
Speaker 4: I'm just asking like, does something like calling it mad

540
00:32:18,400 --> 00:32:21,680
Speaker 4: cow come from scientific community or is that more just

541
00:32:21,800 --> 00:32:25,400
Speaker 4: like some you know, reporter coins it.

542
00:32:25,480 --> 00:32:29,000
Speaker 2: I'm just I don't know. I assume it's from probably

543
00:32:29,120 --> 00:32:32,840
Speaker 2: farmers who began seeing the disease and began calling it

544
00:32:32,880 --> 00:32:35,640
Speaker 2: that cow got mad well before they knew what it was,

545
00:32:35,680 --> 00:32:38,440
Speaker 2: because he caused some of the same stuff in the cows.

546
00:32:39,240 --> 00:32:42,720
Speaker 2: But ben right now, there's a lot of fear about

547
00:32:42,960 --> 00:32:46,640
Speaker 2: this chronic wasting disease spreading, right because these are deer

548
00:32:47,040 --> 00:32:48,840
Speaker 2: and there are a lot of hunters out there who

549
00:32:48,960 --> 00:32:52,080
Speaker 2: kill a lot of deer, and more and more hunters

550
00:32:52,160 --> 00:32:56,240
Speaker 2: are seeing animals with this disease, and they're trying to

551
00:32:56,280 --> 00:32:59,360
Speaker 2: harvest the meat and it's you know, it's kind of

552
00:32:59,360 --> 00:33:01,840
Speaker 2: the questionable. Can I actually eat this meat? Is it

553
00:33:01,880 --> 00:33:05,240
Speaker 2: gonna affect me the way these animals were affected. There

554
00:33:05,280 --> 00:33:07,480
Speaker 2: are a lot of questions about that. Still. Right now,

555
00:33:07,520 --> 00:33:11,200
Speaker 2: there are no confirmed cases of chronic wasting disease transferring

556
00:33:11,240 --> 00:33:14,760
Speaker 2: to humans, either by the saliva of a deer, the

557
00:33:15,240 --> 00:33:17,560
Speaker 2: waste of a deer, or eating the meat of a

558
00:33:17,640 --> 00:33:21,480
Speaker 2: killed deer. But it is a potential thing that could occur.

559
00:33:21,600 --> 00:33:24,240
Speaker 2: Right there could be some kind of mutation in those

560
00:33:24,280 --> 00:33:28,000
Speaker 2: prions that allows it to jump to humans somehow at

561
00:33:28,040 --> 00:33:30,320
Speaker 2: some point, and likely it will happen at some point

562
00:33:30,400 --> 00:33:34,080
Speaker 2: in the future. It hasn't happened yet. It is likely

563
00:33:34,160 --> 00:33:35,920
Speaker 2: that there's going to be a mutation of some sort

564
00:33:36,000 --> 00:33:40,440
Speaker 2: that it'll just jump to whatever. Right, given enough time, yeah,

565
00:33:40,480 --> 00:33:42,640
Speaker 2: give enough time, it's probably gonna happen, as we've seen

566
00:33:42,680 --> 00:33:43,160
Speaker 2: in the past.

567
00:33:43,320 --> 00:33:45,800
Speaker 3: What about other animals that eat deer.

568
00:33:45,720 --> 00:33:49,480
Speaker 2: Well, yeah, that's a fear, right anything living out in

569
00:33:49,640 --> 00:33:52,680
Speaker 2: let's say, the northwest of the United States, there are

570
00:33:52,720 --> 00:33:59,000
Speaker 2: creatures that consume deer. There is a worry about that. Cougars, coyotes, wolves, bears,

571
00:33:59,000 --> 00:34:01,560
Speaker 2: all kinds of stuff are eating deer all the time,

572
00:34:01,840 --> 00:34:04,960
Speaker 2: there's a potential for that, but again it's not known yet,

573
00:34:05,160 --> 00:34:08,080
Speaker 2: at least from the writing I've seen. The reason why

574
00:34:08,080 --> 00:34:11,320
Speaker 2: we're talking about it today is because this chronic wasting

575
00:34:11,360 --> 00:34:14,879
Speaker 2: disease has been observed for a long time, since two

576
00:34:14,920 --> 00:34:18,640
Speaker 2: thousand and five, I think is really the start of

577
00:34:19,000 --> 00:34:25,120
Speaker 2: major United States wide monitoring for this disease in deer populations,

578
00:34:25,640 --> 00:34:27,560
Speaker 2: but it is. I'm just going to name off some

579
00:34:27,680 --> 00:34:31,080
Speaker 2: states right now that I saw over the past basically

580
00:34:31,120 --> 00:34:37,920
Speaker 2: two months of news stories. Kentucky, Idaho, Texas, Mississippi, Alabama,

581
00:34:38,239 --> 00:34:42,880
Speaker 2: and Wyoming have all reported new cases of chronic wasting

582
00:34:42,920 --> 00:34:45,400
Speaker 2: disease animals in various parts of those states.

583
00:34:45,680 --> 00:34:50,280
Speaker 3: Interesting because they're not contiguous, so no, we could assume

584
00:34:50,480 --> 00:34:55,640
Speaker 3: maybe like maybe there are states, you know, adjacent to

585
00:34:55,719 --> 00:34:58,720
Speaker 3: the reporting states that just haven't found a case.

586
00:34:59,040 --> 00:35:03,640
Speaker 2: It's very likely because the only way currently that the CDC,

587
00:35:03,680 --> 00:35:06,440
Speaker 2: which is one of the organizations monitoring this stuff, local

588
00:35:06,560 --> 00:35:10,719
Speaker 2: fish and Game, wildlife organization, parks organizations, they're all looking

589
00:35:10,719 --> 00:35:14,160
Speaker 2: at this stuff, and they're all kind of independently reporting.

590
00:35:14,280 --> 00:35:18,240
Speaker 2: When a hunter finds a potentially infected animal and sends

591
00:35:18,239 --> 00:35:20,879
Speaker 2: in a sample to be tested, that's the only way

592
00:35:20,880 --> 00:35:24,600
Speaker 2: they know when there are animals with chronic wasting disease.

593
00:35:24,719 --> 00:35:27,360
Speaker 2: Unless an individual hunter who was out there and scoped

594
00:35:27,360 --> 00:35:30,359
Speaker 2: an animal that was clearly suffering from this thing and

595
00:35:30,400 --> 00:35:34,440
Speaker 2: then reports it, they don't know. And remember, this disease

596
00:35:34,440 --> 00:35:38,239
Speaker 2: can take years to manifest, so you could actually see it.

597
00:35:38,440 --> 00:35:41,439
Speaker 2: So you may shoot a buck as a hunter, let's

598
00:35:41,440 --> 00:35:44,960
Speaker 2: say somewhere in Georgia, and you think that animal's fine,

599
00:35:45,080 --> 00:35:47,040
Speaker 2: you take it, You take it to a tax dermis

600
00:35:47,160 --> 00:35:50,040
Speaker 2: or whatever, you clean it, you get all the meat,

601
00:35:50,360 --> 00:35:52,319
Speaker 2: and then you're eating that meat over the course of

602
00:35:52,360 --> 00:35:55,600
Speaker 2: a year, right, all that venison. It may be infected

603
00:35:56,120 --> 00:35:59,560
Speaker 2: with these prions. You just don't know it unless you

604
00:35:59,600 --> 00:36:03,279
Speaker 2: send us sample to a participating taxidermist or another you

605
00:36:03,320 --> 00:36:07,000
Speaker 2: know group within your state or county that may send

606
00:36:07,040 --> 00:36:07,960
Speaker 2: it to the CDC.

607
00:36:08,160 --> 00:36:12,360
Speaker 4: Are places where maybe hunting is more prevalent and consuming

608
00:36:12,400 --> 00:36:15,319
Speaker 4: this type of game meet more common. Are they are

609
00:36:15,320 --> 00:36:17,719
Speaker 4: they more at risk for this kind of thing? Because

610
00:36:17,760 --> 00:36:19,920
Speaker 4: actually I was talking with my partner and people over

611
00:36:20,000 --> 00:36:22,880
Speaker 4: Christmas about eating venison, and it really is. It seems

612
00:36:22,920 --> 00:36:25,200
Speaker 4: to be something that some people just have never done

613
00:36:25,360 --> 00:36:26,440
Speaker 4: in their entire lives.

614
00:36:27,680 --> 00:36:31,560
Speaker 2: I think it's more discovered in places that have large,

615
00:36:31,800 --> 00:36:34,480
Speaker 2: like let's say, deer or elk populations that are actively

616
00:36:34,560 --> 00:36:38,920
Speaker 2: hunted only because you're you have more human beings interacting

617
00:36:38,960 --> 00:36:43,839
Speaker 2: with that large population and seeing the effects. Right, there

618
00:36:43,840 --> 00:36:48,240
Speaker 2: are way more cases being seen actively in hunting season,

619
00:36:48,280 --> 00:36:50,879
Speaker 2: which gosh, it's been going I guess for a bit now,

620
00:36:50,920 --> 00:36:54,120
Speaker 2: and it lasts until usually like January or February, depending

621
00:36:54,120 --> 00:36:56,120
Speaker 2: on which state you're in. The reason why we're talking

622
00:36:56,120 --> 00:36:59,759
Speaker 2: about today though, is because Yellowstone National Park in the

623
00:36:59,760 --> 00:37:05,120
Speaker 2: northwest corner of Wyoming had their first ever known case,

624
00:37:05,239 --> 00:37:10,000
Speaker 2: let's say, of chronic wasting disease in a deer, which

625
00:37:10,080 --> 00:37:14,000
Speaker 2: means the CDC and other organizations are calling for every

626
00:37:14,120 --> 00:37:17,600
Speaker 2: single hunter that's going out there every time you bag

627
00:37:17,640 --> 00:37:21,040
Speaker 2: a deer. It's the term they use every time you

628
00:37:21,200 --> 00:37:23,320
Speaker 2: kill a deer, whether it's a dough or a buck,

629
00:37:24,040 --> 00:37:27,160
Speaker 2: no matter where it is, take a sample and send

630
00:37:27,160 --> 00:37:30,480
Speaker 2: it in to check to see if that deer was infected,

631
00:37:31,040 --> 00:37:33,240
Speaker 2: and that way there can be a large enough sample

632
00:37:33,320 --> 00:37:36,040
Speaker 2: size that we can really get an understanding of where

633
00:37:36,200 --> 00:37:39,680
Speaker 2: these I think they're called chronic wasting zones that are

634
00:37:40,920 --> 00:37:43,640
Speaker 2: they're being called that by the CDC and other organizations

635
00:37:43,760 --> 00:37:47,080
Speaker 2: to say, hey, chronic wasting disease exists here in this

636
00:37:47,160 --> 00:37:49,520
Speaker 2: corner of this county, or is found here in this

637
00:37:49,600 --> 00:37:53,319
Speaker 2: specific part of Yellowstone National Park. Because as I said,

638
00:37:53,320 --> 00:37:56,520
Speaker 2: those primes can last for like a year in the

639
00:37:56,560 --> 00:37:59,560
Speaker 2: soil on a rock where a deer just got a

640
00:37:59,600 --> 00:38:02,520
Speaker 2: little bit of spittle as it's walking around emaciated and

641
00:38:02,600 --> 00:38:05,120
Speaker 2: with its mouth hanging open, another deer can come by

642
00:38:05,320 --> 00:38:07,839
Speaker 2: and mess with that, get it on their hoof, even

643
00:38:08,040 --> 00:38:11,600
Speaker 2: there's all there. It's crazy how infectious this is and

644
00:38:11,640 --> 00:38:14,800
Speaker 2: how difficult it is to eradicate it. I want to

645
00:38:14,840 --> 00:38:19,160
Speaker 2: read this tiny section from that same Guardian article quote,

646
00:38:19,360 --> 00:38:22,600
Speaker 2: once this environment is infected, any environment where this stuff is,

647
00:38:23,120 --> 00:38:26,360
Speaker 2: the pathogen is extremely hard to eradicate. It can persist

648
00:38:26,480 --> 00:38:29,960
Speaker 2: for years in dirt or on surfaces, and scientists report

649
00:38:30,080 --> 00:38:35,879
Speaker 2: it is resistant to disinfectants, formaldehyde, radiation and incineration at

650
00:38:35,960 --> 00:38:39,880
Speaker 2: six hundred degrees celsius or one hundred degrees fahrenheit.

651
00:38:40,040 --> 00:38:40,880
Speaker 3: Holy smooks.

652
00:38:41,239 --> 00:38:45,359
Speaker 2: So like, once it's there, it's there, right, So they

653
00:38:45,400 --> 00:38:48,920
Speaker 2: have to designate areas chronic wasting disease zones and then

654
00:38:49,000 --> 00:38:53,040
Speaker 2: monitor all populations of all potentially infected animals that move

655
00:38:53,160 --> 00:38:55,360
Speaker 2: through that in part of their regular migration.

656
00:38:55,600 --> 00:38:59,960
Speaker 3: Twenty twenty four Zombie Dear and super pigs. We're doing

657
00:39:00,160 --> 00:39:04,840
Speaker 3: like a universe thing, Matt. One question I think a

658
00:39:04,880 --> 00:39:08,840
Speaker 3: lot of people will have in the audience tonight, how

659
00:39:08,920 --> 00:39:14,960
Speaker 3: would you, the average person, identify a deer that had

660
00:39:15,000 --> 00:39:19,399
Speaker 3: this infection? Would you? Would it be strange behavior? Is it?

661
00:39:19,440 --> 00:39:23,040
Speaker 2: Like generally, any hunter would probably be able to tell

662
00:39:23,239 --> 00:39:26,120
Speaker 2: because you get you when you're hunting, you can understand,

663
00:39:26,160 --> 00:39:30,440
Speaker 2: You begin to understand the normal activities of especially let's

664
00:39:30,440 --> 00:39:32,799
Speaker 2: say a white tailed deer. You understand kind of how

665
00:39:32,840 --> 00:39:36,239
Speaker 2: they move. Do you understand why they make movements and

666
00:39:36,280 --> 00:39:39,600
Speaker 2: what they alert to and all those things. A deer

667
00:39:39,600 --> 00:39:42,279
Speaker 2: that's infected by this, that is showing symptoms is going

668
00:39:42,320 --> 00:39:45,520
Speaker 2: to act very abnormally and different to that kind of

669
00:39:45,560 --> 00:39:48,880
Speaker 2: going to be again, imagine a zombie deer. If you

670
00:39:48,920 --> 00:39:51,359
Speaker 2: see one, a deer that looks like a zombie kind

671
00:39:51,360 --> 00:39:53,680
Speaker 2: of that's probably that's what's going on.

672
00:39:54,000 --> 00:39:55,120
Speaker 4: Red flag for sure.

673
00:39:55,200 --> 00:39:57,799
Speaker 2: But because of that time it takes, you never know

674
00:39:57,960 --> 00:40:01,440
Speaker 2: if a normal looking deer is actually infected by this,

675
00:40:01,560 --> 00:40:03,759
Speaker 2: it just hasn't shown any symptoms yet.

676
00:40:03,960 --> 00:40:05,720
Speaker 4: Now I'm sorry if I missed it, and I realized

677
00:40:05,760 --> 00:40:07,399
Speaker 4: earlier I may have asked sort of a silly question

678
00:40:07,440 --> 00:40:12,040
Speaker 4: about places where hunting and consumption of venison is more common.

679
00:40:12,400 --> 00:40:14,879
Speaker 4: If those are places more to be concerned about. Does

680
00:40:14,960 --> 00:40:18,000
Speaker 4: this have any effect on humans if they consume the meat?

681
00:40:18,360 --> 00:40:21,880
Speaker 2: Unknown currently doesn't seem to have any effect on humans

682
00:40:21,920 --> 00:40:25,920
Speaker 2: because humans have undoubtedly ingested this stuff and we haven't

683
00:40:25,960 --> 00:40:28,680
Speaker 2: noticed anything with you know, a human coming down with

684
00:40:28,960 --> 00:40:32,839
Speaker 2: chronic human wasting disease or whatever. The worry is that

685
00:40:32,960 --> 00:40:36,200
Speaker 2: like swine flu or you know, a bird flu, it

686
00:40:36,280 --> 00:40:41,400
Speaker 2: could jump species the way those did, right, becomes zoonotic. Yeah,

687
00:40:41,560 --> 00:40:44,719
Speaker 2: so just be aware, that's all. That's really all. And

688
00:40:45,040 --> 00:40:49,000
Speaker 2: I would say, if you are actively hunting, do send

689
00:40:49,040 --> 00:40:51,400
Speaker 2: in samples, like, find out who you can send a

690
00:40:51,440 --> 00:40:53,520
Speaker 2: sample into, and then just do it.

691
00:40:53,719 --> 00:40:58,200
Speaker 3: Please, please do it. You're absolutely right. Sounds like maybe

692
00:40:58,280 --> 00:41:01,799
Speaker 3: it's a it's a pain to deal with bureaucracy which

693
00:41:01,880 --> 00:41:05,960
Speaker 3: is often slow moving. But let's not forget that doctor

694
00:41:06,080 --> 00:41:12,279
Speaker 3: Michael Osterholm, the US epidemiologist who first tipped Britain to

695
00:41:12,480 --> 00:41:16,239
Speaker 3: mad cow disease, Let's not forget that he said, this

696
00:41:16,480 --> 00:41:20,480
Speaker 3: chronic wasting disease and deer could become a quote slow

697
00:41:20,560 --> 00:41:21,480
Speaker 3: moving disaster.

698
00:41:21,680 --> 00:41:24,560
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, and here's a quote from that same Guardian article.

699
00:41:24,600 --> 00:41:28,120
Speaker 2: This one's from doctor Corey Anderson. This freaked me out.

700
00:41:28,520 --> 00:41:31,480
Speaker 2: That's why he said quote, We're dealing with a disease

701
00:41:31,520 --> 00:41:37,200
Speaker 2: that is invariably fatal, incurable and highly contagious, made into

702
00:41:37,239 --> 00:41:39,400
Speaker 2: the worries that we don't have an effective way to

703
00:41:39,520 --> 00:41:42,759
Speaker 2: eradicate it, neither from the animals it infects nor the

704
00:41:42,880 --> 00:41:47,160
Speaker 2: environments it contaminates. Just think about that for a while

705
00:41:47,239 --> 00:41:49,000
Speaker 2: while you listen to these ads. We'll be right back

706
00:41:49,000 --> 00:41:50,000
Speaker 2: with more strange news.

707
00:41:50,160 --> 00:41:53,360
Speaker 3: Eight deer bray smokement thal cigarettes, two crimes.

708
00:41:53,560 --> 00:41:55,640
Speaker 4: No wait what, I didn't mean.

709
00:41:55,600 --> 00:42:04,640
Speaker 5: It, And we're back with one more piece of strange

710
00:42:04,719 --> 00:42:07,480
Speaker 5: news for this your first day of twenty twenty four.

711
00:42:08,360 --> 00:42:10,680
Speaker 4: This one's a doozy. We talked a bit about this

712
00:42:10,840 --> 00:42:13,920
Speaker 4: off air, and I think we've mentioned the idea of

713
00:42:13,960 --> 00:42:17,879
Speaker 4: a ban on menthol cigarettes coming down from the United

714
00:42:17,920 --> 00:42:22,879
Speaker 4: States federal government that has been postponed into twenty twenty four.

715
00:42:23,040 --> 00:42:26,279
Speaker 4: Unknown as to exactly when it will happen, but it

716
00:42:26,320 --> 00:42:28,319
Speaker 4: most likely will unless some of the measures we're going

717
00:42:28,400 --> 00:42:31,839
Speaker 4: to talk about in this news bit kind of do

718
00:42:31,960 --> 00:42:35,680
Speaker 4: what they're setting out to do. During the second Republican

719
00:42:35,719 --> 00:42:39,680
Speaker 4: presidential debate, there was an advertisement that played on Fox

720
00:42:39,800 --> 00:42:45,920
Speaker 4: Business that talked about how Biden's ban on menthol cigarettes

721
00:42:45,960 --> 00:42:49,320
Speaker 4: could This is quoting the ad fuel an illicit market

722
00:42:49,440 --> 00:42:54,640
Speaker 4: lining the pockets of the Mexican cartels, featuring some very

723
00:42:55,239 --> 00:42:58,960
Speaker 4: inflammatory imagery of border fences and stacks of one hundred

724
00:42:59,000 --> 00:43:04,439
Speaker 4: dollars bills and men carrying coffins and such. And this

725
00:43:04,600 --> 00:43:09,640
Speaker 4: ad was paid for by something called the Border Security Alliance.

726
00:43:10,480 --> 00:43:13,080
Speaker 4: And I read a really great article on Mother Jones

727
00:43:13,840 --> 00:43:18,239
Speaker 4: by Dan Friedman and Isabella Diaz from just about a

728
00:43:18,280 --> 00:43:21,560
Speaker 4: week ago this past in twenty twenty three, in December

729
00:43:22,080 --> 00:43:24,480
Speaker 4: twenty first of twenty twenty three. You can find it yourself.

730
00:43:24,520 --> 00:43:27,000
Speaker 4: It's a pretty deep dive, much more than we can

731
00:43:27,040 --> 00:43:29,000
Speaker 4: get to in this segment. But I did want to

732
00:43:29,040 --> 00:43:34,000
Speaker 4: talk a bit about how the idea of these tobacco companies,

733
00:43:34,040 --> 00:43:36,120
Speaker 4: you know, R. J. Reynolds, you know, being first and

734
00:43:36,200 --> 00:43:39,759
Speaker 4: foremost on that list and their parent company, Altria, are

735
00:43:39,760 --> 00:43:42,759
Speaker 4: having to kind of pivot with all of the you know,

736
00:43:42,880 --> 00:43:46,520
Speaker 4: science behind cigarettes and all of the horrible health conditions

737
00:43:46,520 --> 00:43:48,800
Speaker 4: that they can cause, and also some of the issues

738
00:43:48,840 --> 00:43:53,280
Speaker 4: surrounding vapes and also knowing how a lot of these

739
00:43:53,520 --> 00:43:57,880
Speaker 4: vapes are coming from places like China, places like you know,

740
00:43:57,920 --> 00:44:02,480
Speaker 4: other other countries, and there is a certainly a black

741
00:44:02,560 --> 00:44:05,560
Speaker 4: market of some sort to be talked about, to be

742
00:44:05,680 --> 00:44:08,600
Speaker 4: to be addressed with this kind of stuff, and that

743
00:44:08,760 --> 00:44:14,040
Speaker 4: of course, organized crime organizations have often looked to changes

744
00:44:14,080 --> 00:44:17,720
Speaker 4: in regulations, you know, by the FDA around certain things

745
00:44:17,920 --> 00:44:20,960
Speaker 4: to pivot their business models into, you know, what they

746
00:44:21,400 --> 00:44:24,560
Speaker 4: decide they want to smuggle into this country. So again

747
00:44:24,960 --> 00:44:26,920
Speaker 4: I'm just saying a lot of those things are true.

748
00:44:27,560 --> 00:44:30,680
Speaker 4: What is very interesting is how the tobacco companies are

749
00:44:31,400 --> 00:44:34,640
Speaker 4: kind of spinning it here, right, the idea that and

750
00:44:34,719 --> 00:44:38,080
Speaker 4: like who they're referencing, the kind of fear mongering behind

751
00:44:38,080 --> 00:44:40,640
Speaker 4: a lot of this stuff, And what is the Border

752
00:44:40,880 --> 00:44:46,719
Speaker 4: Security Alliance? A tweet from the bsa underscore US official

753
00:44:46,960 --> 00:44:51,080
Speaker 4: Twitter x whatever account Border Security Alliance says, our border

754
00:44:51,160 --> 00:44:54,080
Speaker 4: is at a crisis point. We are battling ruthless cartels

755
00:44:54,080 --> 00:44:56,719
Speaker 4: on a daily basis. And now in the Biden administrations

756
00:44:56,840 --> 00:45:00,799
Speaker 4: is considering a ban on menthol cigarettes. That's irresp The

757
00:45:00,840 --> 00:45:04,880
Speaker 4: president's ban will fuel an illicit market lining the pockets

758
00:45:04,920 --> 00:45:09,640
Speaker 4: of Mexican cartels and throughout the life of this kind

759
00:45:09,640 --> 00:45:15,880
Speaker 4: of talking point, which is relatively recent, as we've seen,

760
00:45:15,960 --> 00:45:20,600
Speaker 4: you know, the conflicts between Israel and Gaza. UH now

761
00:45:21,320 --> 00:45:25,200
Speaker 4: terrorist organizations has kind of they has joined the chat

762
00:45:25,880 --> 00:45:29,040
Speaker 4: and even referencing, you know, stuff like groups like Hamas

763
00:45:29,040 --> 00:45:33,040
Speaker 4: and Hezbollah, and of course in political rhetoric, those are

764
00:45:33,080 --> 00:45:36,520
Speaker 4: things that get people's dander up nice and good. So

765
00:45:36,560 --> 00:45:38,040
Speaker 4: I don't know, I just wanted to see what you

766
00:45:38,040 --> 00:45:42,759
Speaker 4: guys thought about this kind of politicization of something seemingly

767
00:45:43,160 --> 00:45:46,120
Speaker 4: as innocuous as banning menthol cigarettes, which, as we know,

768
00:45:46,520 --> 00:45:49,319
Speaker 4: based on some studies, you know, would help prevent a

769
00:45:49,320 --> 00:45:52,400
Speaker 4: lot of young people from starting to smoke. Menthol cigarettes

770
00:45:52,400 --> 00:45:55,760
Speaker 4: are kind of considered a gateway cigarette because they taste

771
00:45:55,880 --> 00:45:58,520
Speaker 4: nice or whatever. They've got a minty flavor. I don't

772
00:45:58,520 --> 00:46:01,600
Speaker 4: know how much I necessarily believe that, But what do

773
00:46:01,640 --> 00:46:05,560
Speaker 4: you guys think? What's at play here? And is this

774
00:46:05,640 --> 00:46:09,400
Speaker 4: a shadowy lobbying effort or is this just a company

775
00:46:09,440 --> 00:46:12,720
Speaker 4: trying to keep other countries from eating their lunch.

776
00:46:13,440 --> 00:46:15,799
Speaker 2: Let me put this out there, at risk of being

777
00:46:15,880 --> 00:46:19,520
Speaker 2: gross to most people listening to this right now, at

778
00:46:19,520 --> 00:46:23,759
Speaker 2: one point in my life, I smoked mentalated cigarettes. Yes,

779
00:46:24,160 --> 00:46:28,000
Speaker 2: that's right disgusting, and I'm sorry, but I did.

780
00:46:28,200 --> 00:46:30,720
Speaker 4: A lot of people do, Matt, I mean it's they're popular.

781
00:46:31,440 --> 00:46:34,240
Speaker 2: Well, at the time when I did, that was the

782
00:46:34,280 --> 00:46:38,319
Speaker 2: only type of smoke that I would use, right, that

783
00:46:38,320 --> 00:46:42,640
Speaker 2: I would purchase in that state of mind that I

784
00:46:42,680 --> 00:46:44,839
Speaker 2: was in at the time. When I was smoking those,

785
00:46:45,760 --> 00:46:49,239
Speaker 2: I would I would drive twenty minutes if I knew

786
00:46:49,280 --> 00:46:51,880
Speaker 2: I could get them somewhere, right Like, if I couldn't

787
00:46:51,880 --> 00:46:54,120
Speaker 2: find them my local gas station, I would drive out

788
00:46:54,120 --> 00:46:55,640
Speaker 2: of my way to go and get them because I

789
00:46:55,680 --> 00:46:57,680
Speaker 2: needed them, and I felt like I needed them, and

790
00:46:58,360 --> 00:47:01,839
Speaker 2: in many ways I felt help addicted to that specific

791
00:47:02,040 --> 00:47:03,239
Speaker 2: type of cigarette.

792
00:47:03,320 --> 00:47:05,080
Speaker 4: Dude, now that I think back on it, I started

793
00:47:05,120 --> 00:47:07,680
Speaker 4: smoking by smoking menthol cigarettes when I was very young.

794
00:47:07,800 --> 00:47:09,960
Speaker 4: Just putting that out there, absolutely true.

795
00:47:10,080 --> 00:47:14,000
Speaker 2: I think that it's true potentially that if you ban

796
00:47:14,200 --> 00:47:18,440
Speaker 2: this specific type of thing, there would be a black

797
00:47:18,480 --> 00:47:22,040
Speaker 2: market for it that may open up, or at least

798
00:47:22,080 --> 00:47:25,240
Speaker 2: a spin on it that would end up being legal,

799
00:47:25,400 --> 00:47:28,160
Speaker 2: but it would taste kind of the same, But there

800
00:47:28,200 --> 00:47:31,120
Speaker 2: would be something that would fill in that market space, right,

801
00:47:31,440 --> 00:47:33,960
Speaker 2: because there are going to be millions of people that

802
00:47:34,239 --> 00:47:36,359
Speaker 2: smoke them right now that are going to need them,

803
00:47:36,360 --> 00:47:38,640
Speaker 2: but they're going to feel like they need them, right,

804
00:47:39,360 --> 00:47:39,759
Speaker 2: But is.

805
00:47:39,719 --> 00:47:44,520
Speaker 4: It coming from the cartels? Is it coming from hesba lah? Like,

806
00:47:44,800 --> 00:47:49,200
Speaker 4: that's my question. It seems like an over complication of

807
00:47:49,640 --> 00:47:53,400
Speaker 4: you know, yeah, there's a black market for freaking raw milk,

808
00:47:53,640 --> 00:47:56,120
Speaker 4: you know, if you if you can't get it legally.

809
00:47:56,320 --> 00:47:59,120
Speaker 4: Black markets come up during any kind of prohibition. But

810
00:47:59,280 --> 00:48:05,640
Speaker 4: is this funding terrorism and you know, weakening our border security.

811
00:48:06,000 --> 00:48:08,359
Speaker 3: I'll come in after you met. I think I would

812
00:48:08,400 --> 00:48:08,800
Speaker 3: just say.

813
00:48:09,320 --> 00:48:13,920
Speaker 2: I got you. I think it would fund either market innovation,

814
00:48:14,400 --> 00:48:20,520
Speaker 2: right or organized crime, which doesn't mean terrorism, doesn't mean cartels,

815
00:48:21,000 --> 00:48:24,960
Speaker 2: It means like prohibition era stuff, right. I mean, in

816
00:48:25,000 --> 00:48:26,120
Speaker 2: my mind that's what it is.

817
00:48:26,239 --> 00:48:31,040
Speaker 4: Speakeasys flappers, but meilated.

818
00:48:30,480 --> 00:48:35,040
Speaker 3: Cigarettes selling Lucy's selling selling a square.

819
00:48:35,480 --> 00:48:37,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, I guess what I mean is I just don't know.

820
00:48:37,239 --> 00:48:39,560
Speaker 2: I don't know if that is the same thing, right,

821
00:48:39,680 --> 00:48:41,600
Speaker 2: And I don't know how you would prove that that

822
00:48:41,760 --> 00:48:45,160
Speaker 2: is the same thing as terrorists and car Yeah.

823
00:48:44,960 --> 00:48:49,000
Speaker 3: It's a it's a bit rich, I think, especially in

824
00:48:49,120 --> 00:48:54,759
Speaker 3: a land where the or in a ecosystem where tobacco

825
00:48:55,480 --> 00:49:02,719
Speaker 3: legacy companies immediately pivoted to vapes that are essentially Halloween

826
00:49:02,760 --> 00:49:07,080
Speaker 3: candy flavored at all times. Like that, that is the still,

827
00:49:07,400 --> 00:49:11,279
Speaker 3: that is the menthilation, the gateway that you're talking about, NOL.

828
00:49:12,040 --> 00:49:15,759
Speaker 3: The idea of equating it to terrorism makes a lot

829
00:49:15,800 --> 00:49:20,759
Speaker 3: of sense because you can easily get more funding. I'd

830
00:49:20,800 --> 00:49:25,480
Speaker 3: like to shout out the allies of the Border Security Alliance,

831
00:49:25,920 --> 00:49:30,840
Speaker 3: which is not a governmental organization, right right, So shout

832
00:49:30,840 --> 00:49:35,360
Speaker 3: out to the Arizona Police Association, Combined Law Enforcement Associations

833
00:49:35,360 --> 00:49:42,080
Speaker 3: of Arizona, Glendale Police Officer Association, Arizona Probation Officer Association,

834
00:49:42,600 --> 00:49:48,279
Speaker 3: Tucson Police Officer Association, and some friends in Albuquerque. Like

835
00:49:48,320 --> 00:49:50,960
Speaker 3: the list goes on. What I'm saying is there are

836
00:49:51,120 --> 00:49:54,959
Speaker 3: people with a horse in the race. It is very

837
00:49:55,000 --> 00:49:59,720
Speaker 3: good not to not to light up a Cadillac Newport

838
00:50:00,239 --> 00:50:03,759
Speaker 3: if you if you can avoid it, it'll cost you

839
00:50:03,840 --> 00:50:07,200
Speaker 3: a lot of money, either either at a gas station

840
00:50:07,520 --> 00:50:08,960
Speaker 3: or later in a hospital.

841
00:50:09,120 --> 00:50:09,719
Speaker 2: What is that?

842
00:50:10,080 --> 00:50:14,080
Speaker 3: Cadillac is a street term for the longer new Ports.

843
00:50:14,520 --> 00:50:17,600
Speaker 4: Okay, like a like a like a one hundred yeah yeah, yeah,

844
00:50:17,680 --> 00:50:19,239
Speaker 4: just so can I add to that really quickly, But

845
00:50:19,320 --> 00:50:21,920
Speaker 4: just to just to get this out there, Another divisive

846
00:50:22,239 --> 00:50:25,400
Speaker 4: use of the divisive piece of rhetoric is the notion

847
00:50:25,520 --> 00:50:32,200
Speaker 4: that this ban is inherently racist because black people disproportionately

848
00:50:32,719 --> 00:50:37,320
Speaker 4: prefer smoking menthol cigarettes to non menthol cigarettes. Again, don't

849
00:50:37,320 --> 00:50:39,640
Speaker 4: know if that's true. Kind of almost feels like a

850
00:50:39,840 --> 00:50:42,960
Speaker 4: like an unfair stereotype. But maybe there's data to back

851
00:50:43,000 --> 00:50:45,520
Speaker 4: that up. But it doesn't stop people from throwing that around,

852
00:50:45,840 --> 00:50:50,200
Speaker 4: you know, as if to mean or to malign this

853
00:50:50,200 --> 00:50:50,640
Speaker 4: this action.

854
00:50:51,000 --> 00:50:56,840
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's interesting too, because putting the terrorism idea aside,

855
00:50:57,400 --> 00:51:01,120
Speaker 3: the like just bracketing that for a second. We know

856
00:51:01,400 --> 00:51:07,759
Speaker 3: that banning tobacco has worked in various countries, right there

857
00:51:07,760 --> 00:51:11,600
Speaker 3: are countries where you can, as a visitor bring in

858
00:51:11,800 --> 00:51:15,680
Speaker 3: a set amount of tobacco, whether it's measured by weight

859
00:51:16,000 --> 00:51:19,000
Speaker 3: or in the case of cigarettes, it's i should say,

860
00:51:19,000 --> 00:51:22,600
Speaker 3: in the carton of cigarettes, it's measured by a number

861
00:51:23,600 --> 00:51:28,920
Speaker 3: of coffin nails. But the thing is here, we're looking

862
00:51:29,040 --> 00:51:35,080
Speaker 3: at something that may simply fade away. Indeed, the best

863
00:51:35,120 --> 00:51:40,080
Speaker 3: propaganda for cigarettes, for what the kids are calling old

864
00:51:40,120 --> 00:51:43,719
Speaker 3: school cigarettes now instead of apes, it's going to be Hollywood.

865
00:51:44,080 --> 00:51:47,040
Speaker 3: It's going to be all those old films, all the

866
00:51:47,440 --> 00:51:52,359
Speaker 3: old TV series where in the coolest or most mysterious

867
00:51:52,480 --> 00:51:55,560
Speaker 3: or most dangerous person you know, all of a sudden

868
00:51:55,640 --> 00:51:59,120
Speaker 3: has a cigarette whatever they're doing. So I think that

869
00:51:59,239 --> 00:52:03,040
Speaker 3: you have to beat propaganda before you clamp down on

870
00:52:03,080 --> 00:52:07,000
Speaker 3: this stuff and call it terrorism. Also, how much money, no,

871
00:52:07,239 --> 00:52:11,960
Speaker 3: how much money would terrorist groups make off selling Lucy's I.

872
00:52:11,960 --> 00:52:15,440
Speaker 4: Good question, Ben. What I do know though, is that

873
00:52:15,520 --> 00:52:20,319
Speaker 4: tobacco use is way down in the United States, like

874
00:52:20,760 --> 00:52:23,720
Speaker 4: in a pretty significant way, and also among young people,

875
00:52:23,800 --> 00:52:27,080
Speaker 4: you know, who aren't starting to smoke combustible cigarettes, you know,

876
00:52:27,120 --> 00:52:30,520
Speaker 4: and that maybe doesn't necessarily always wrap in the vape stuff,

877
00:52:30,560 --> 00:52:33,000
Speaker 4: which we also know have their own problems, And it's

878
00:52:33,000 --> 00:52:35,800
Speaker 4: one of those things where long term the effects of

879
00:52:35,880 --> 00:52:39,400
Speaker 4: vapes are yet to really they're kind of TBD. Which

880
00:52:40,080 --> 00:52:44,120
Speaker 4: is wild to me that any form of vape is

881
00:52:44,360 --> 00:52:48,000
Speaker 4: FDA approved or is able to be acquired legally. But now,

882
00:52:48,120 --> 00:52:49,960
Speaker 4: I mean, anytime you go to a gas station or

883
00:52:50,040 --> 00:52:52,919
Speaker 4: like a smoke shop, a tobacco you know, headshop, whatever

884
00:52:52,960 --> 00:52:56,480
Speaker 4: you call it, and you see these little disposable guys,

885
00:52:56,520 --> 00:52:59,400
Speaker 4: like these elf bars or whatever, it's my understanding that

886
00:52:59,480 --> 00:53:05,200
Speaker 4: those aren't entirely legal because they taste like mango and afriking,

887
00:53:05,560 --> 00:53:09,120
Speaker 4: you know, papaya and stuff, and they're pretty colors, and

888
00:53:09,440 --> 00:53:11,600
Speaker 4: I just I don't quite understand how those are able

889
00:53:11,640 --> 00:53:14,120
Speaker 4: to be sold, if that's a black market thing or

890
00:53:14,120 --> 00:53:17,920
Speaker 4: if it's just a loophole thing. Because Jewel got pilloried

891
00:53:18,200 --> 00:53:20,080
Speaker 4: for all of this stuff. They kind of became the

892
00:53:20,080 --> 00:53:23,160
Speaker 4: whipping boy for a lot of this debate, and they

893
00:53:23,200 --> 00:53:26,279
Speaker 4: aren't allowed to sell anything that has a you know,

894
00:53:27,239 --> 00:53:29,799
Speaker 4: fruity flavor anymore. Right, I don't quite understand where these

895
00:53:29,840 --> 00:53:31,040
Speaker 4: elf bars are coming from.

896
00:53:31,040 --> 00:53:36,400
Speaker 3: Well, I suspect, I'm sure I suspect the legacy tobacco

897
00:53:36,520 --> 00:53:39,839
Speaker 3: companies again have their hand in the cookie jar here,

898
00:53:40,280 --> 00:53:43,759
Speaker 3: or have their hand in the tobacco barn, because that

899
00:53:43,840 --> 00:53:48,040
Speaker 3: can replace the market demand. Right, you get a candy

900
00:53:48,080 --> 00:53:53,520
Speaker 3: flavor nicotine substance that replaces the your earlier experience as

901
00:53:53,560 --> 00:53:57,080
Speaker 3: a child with mentallyated cigarettes, as you call them, Matt.

902
00:53:57,800 --> 00:54:01,719
Speaker 3: The idea though that I don't know. I sound like

903
00:54:01,760 --> 00:54:08,080
Speaker 3: I'm cracking on the the ulterior motives of the border

904
00:54:08,200 --> 00:54:11,920
Speaker 3: alliance here, But just to be fair, you have to

905
00:54:11,920 --> 00:54:16,240
Speaker 3: point out our earlier conversation in a previous Strange News

906
00:54:16,280 --> 00:54:21,040
Speaker 3: segment when the cartel took over the avocado trade just

907
00:54:21,120 --> 00:54:23,840
Speaker 3: so they could, you know, make some money. So maybe

908
00:54:24,040 --> 00:54:26,080
Speaker 3: maybe they are in.

909
00:54:26,080 --> 00:54:29,440
Speaker 4: The way overthrew the government to sell pineapples or whatever whatever,

910
00:54:29,560 --> 00:54:33,200
Speaker 4: like with the was it Jaquita? Remember there was a

911
00:54:33,200 --> 00:54:35,960
Speaker 4: whole coup like to sell bananas.

912
00:54:35,680 --> 00:54:38,520
Speaker 3: Oh in nineteen fifty four, the free of Throw of Guatemala.

913
00:54:38,520 --> 00:54:40,920
Speaker 4: Correct, yes, yes, I'm saying like this is yeah. Sorry, man,

914
00:54:40,920 --> 00:54:43,560
Speaker 4: you're absolutely right. I'm just thinking of other examples.

915
00:54:43,680 --> 00:54:47,080
Speaker 3: You're right, yeah, I mean also, that's the thing I'm

916
00:54:47,160 --> 00:54:50,200
Speaker 3: looking at this in some of the notes who provided

917
00:54:50,280 --> 00:54:54,400
Speaker 3: us here. No, I'm looking at the Management of Border

918
00:54:54,520 --> 00:54:58,880
Speaker 3: Security Alliance, And if you go to their about section,

919
00:54:59,560 --> 00:55:04,760
Speaker 3: you see that there's a lot of Arizona Arizona Area

920
00:55:05,200 --> 00:55:09,480
Speaker 3: l eos who are on their board or managing the place,

921
00:55:09,680 --> 00:55:15,200
Speaker 3: and they're primarily concerned with what they call border security.

922
00:55:15,280 --> 00:55:20,640
Speaker 3: They're primarily concerned with emigration and drug seizures.

923
00:55:21,239 --> 00:55:22,000
Speaker 4: So is this.

924
00:55:23,800 --> 00:55:26,920
Speaker 3: Really one of their core missions or is this something

925
00:55:27,000 --> 00:55:31,279
Speaker 3: to get into the headlines and then further push the

926
00:55:31,400 --> 00:55:34,360
Speaker 3: Overton window of what they want the conversation to be.

927
00:55:34,920 --> 00:55:37,799
Speaker 4: To be fair, our j. Reynolds was reached out to

928
00:55:37,920 --> 00:55:40,719
Speaker 4: by Mother Jones and asked to give a comment, they

929
00:55:40,760 --> 00:55:44,759
Speaker 4: said the following. Like many other companies, Reynolds supports organizations

930
00:55:44,800 --> 00:55:47,960
Speaker 4: that contribute to the debate on issues that are important

931
00:55:47,960 --> 00:55:51,440
Speaker 4: to our consumers. Reynolds has been clear on where it

932
00:55:51,480 --> 00:55:54,160
Speaker 4: stands on this topic. We strongly believe there are more

933
00:55:54,200 --> 00:55:58,280
Speaker 4: effective ways to deliver tobacco harm reduction than banning products.

934
00:55:58,440 --> 00:56:01,960
Speaker 4: Banning products often leads to a tended consequences, such as

935
00:56:02,000 --> 00:56:06,000
Speaker 4: the increase of illegal, unregulated products flooding the market.

936
00:56:06,320 --> 00:56:10,279
Speaker 3: Ooh, you gotta admire that linguistic park wore though, huh

937
00:56:10,360 --> 00:56:13,320
Speaker 3: a couple of matrix dodges. They did a backflip.

938
00:56:13,480 --> 00:56:15,200
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's not bad. And then you know, there are

939
00:56:15,239 --> 00:56:19,120
Speaker 4: other organizations mentioned in this this article to your pointment.

940
00:56:19,640 --> 00:56:24,200
Speaker 4: Another one is the National Organization of Black Law Enforcement Executives,

941
00:56:24,760 --> 00:56:28,200
Speaker 4: which is a group that until very recently listed R J.

942
00:56:28,400 --> 00:56:31,600
Speaker 4: Reynolds as being one of their major supporters and now

943
00:56:32,680 --> 00:56:35,880
Speaker 4: just decided to pivot to mentioning Altria, which is that

944
00:56:36,040 --> 00:56:39,960
Speaker 4: parent company of Philip Morris. You know, so it's a

945
00:56:40,000 --> 00:56:43,799
Speaker 4: little better optics, but there's skin in the game for

946
00:56:43,840 --> 00:56:47,000
Speaker 4: this stuff, and the idea of linking it to hot

947
00:56:47,040 --> 00:56:52,080
Speaker 4: button issues certainly isn't a new technique, but I find

948
00:56:52,080 --> 00:56:56,000
Speaker 4: it to be disingenuous and a little on the creepy side.

949
00:56:57,000 --> 00:56:59,440
Speaker 4: I think it's something to look into further, especially as

950
00:56:59,440 --> 00:57:03,160
Speaker 4: we see developments in this kind of thing, because prohibition

951
00:57:03,200 --> 00:57:06,120
Speaker 4: of any kind does always have I will totally agree.

952
00:57:06,120 --> 00:57:09,799
Speaker 4: I think we all will have unintended consequences that can

953
00:57:09,840 --> 00:57:14,920
Speaker 4: oftentimes be predicted. And I think maybe banning mental cigarettes

954
00:57:14,960 --> 00:57:16,760
Speaker 4: is not even that is it going to make that

955
00:57:16,800 --> 00:57:19,000
Speaker 4: big of an impact. But I could be wrong, because

956
00:57:19,040 --> 00:57:21,479
Speaker 4: you're right, Matt. I do remember a lot of young

957
00:57:21,480 --> 00:57:24,520
Speaker 4: people I knew that started smoking started smoking by smoking

958
00:57:24,680 --> 00:57:28,480
Speaker 4: like cools or something that like had that it was easier,

959
00:57:28,520 --> 00:57:31,600
Speaker 4: It was a gateway because you know, Marlborough Reds are

960
00:57:31,720 --> 00:57:36,280
Speaker 4: gross but freaking you know, cools or Newports or whatever

961
00:57:36,320 --> 00:57:39,400
Speaker 4: they've got this they are there's a certain candy quality

962
00:57:39,440 --> 00:57:41,360
Speaker 4: to them. That's that's you're not wrong.

963
00:57:41,480 --> 00:57:46,360
Speaker 3: Oh and prohibition. Another way to phrase prohibition. I agree

964
00:57:46,400 --> 00:57:50,440
Speaker 3: with your points here. I think that's brilliant astute. Another

965
00:57:50,480 --> 00:57:57,600
Speaker 3: way to phrase prohibition is the perverse incentive concept. So

966
00:57:58,080 --> 00:58:01,360
Speaker 3: you know, especially here in the States, you tell people

967
00:58:01,520 --> 00:58:04,919
Speaker 3: they can't have a thing, right, Remember, even you don't

968
00:58:04,960 --> 00:58:07,680
Speaker 3: tell I can right, right right, And lest we sound

969
00:58:07,920 --> 00:58:12,800
Speaker 3: too political, let's remember in New York when someone banned

970
00:58:13,080 --> 00:58:18,040
Speaker 3: large sodas right at your local bodega. People were up

971
00:58:18,080 --> 00:58:21,280
Speaker 3: in arms, even John Stewart, who clearly have better things

972
00:58:21,320 --> 00:58:24,520
Speaker 3: to do. Uh, soda is different because it will it

973
00:58:24,560 --> 00:58:30,360
Speaker 3: will have us health effects less less immediately damaging averse

974
00:58:30,440 --> 00:58:36,959
Speaker 3: health effects. But gosh, selling cigarette selling Lucy's the mother

975
00:58:37,080 --> 00:58:41,400
Speaker 3: Jones article you mentioned here. Noel also talks about UH

976
00:58:42,000 --> 00:58:45,600
Speaker 3: terrorist groups in the Middle East, not just Mexican cartels.

977
00:58:45,720 --> 00:58:48,000
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, it was, and that was sort of added

978
00:58:48,080 --> 00:58:50,360
Speaker 4: later in terms of the language. And I think a

979
00:58:50,360 --> 00:58:52,960
Speaker 4: lot of that had to do with UH some of

980
00:58:53,000 --> 00:58:56,200
Speaker 4: the you know, the conflicts going on, you know with

981
00:58:56,280 --> 00:58:58,120
Speaker 4: Gaza and stuff that are very much in the news

982
00:58:58,160 --> 00:59:01,160
Speaker 4: right now. As a way of like tying it to

983
00:59:01,280 --> 00:59:07,120
Speaker 4: something that people understand as PoTA, that people divisively understand

984
00:59:07,160 --> 00:59:11,400
Speaker 4: as a threat. It's just weird. It's all just lobbying

985
00:59:11,480 --> 00:59:15,360
Speaker 4: and marketing, and it's a bunch of bulls. But it's

986
00:59:15,760 --> 00:59:18,280
Speaker 4: very fast episode. Uh, I think so too, Yeah, And

987
00:59:18,360 --> 00:59:21,400
Speaker 4: I think we leave it there today. This one has

988
00:59:21,480 --> 00:59:24,040
Speaker 4: run long, but I think, man, what a great way

989
00:59:24,080 --> 00:59:25,880
Speaker 4: to kick off the new year, and hey, at least

990
00:59:25,920 --> 00:59:28,760
Speaker 4: we started off with some positive stuff. Guys, right, Thank

991
00:59:28,840 --> 00:59:31,280
Speaker 4: you for that, Ben, I gotta say, and.

992
00:59:31,240 --> 00:59:34,600
Speaker 3: Thank you everyone for tuning in. We hope you are

993
00:59:34,720 --> 00:59:38,600
Speaker 3: off to a rollicking start for twenty twenty four. We

994
00:59:38,680 --> 00:59:42,720
Speaker 3: hope you tune into our future episodes. We hope that

995
00:59:42,800 --> 00:59:45,800
Speaker 3: you show up on air with us, be a part

996
00:59:45,920 --> 00:59:49,240
Speaker 3: of the show. We have a listener mail segment that

997
00:59:49,400 --> 00:59:53,400
Speaker 3: may feature you coming later this week. If you want

998
00:59:53,440 --> 00:59:56,920
Speaker 3: to be part of the show, please take a page

999
00:59:56,960 --> 01:00:01,360
Speaker 3: from our weird book of secrets and contact us at

1000
01:00:01,440 --> 01:00:03,959
Speaker 3: any number of ways. You don't have to walk winter

1001
01:00:04,080 --> 01:00:07,320
Speaker 3: shins at a crossroad at midnight. You can, uh, you

1002
01:00:07,360 --> 01:00:09,439
Speaker 3: can just find us on online. Right.

1003
01:00:09,720 --> 01:00:15,720
Speaker 4: So yeah, Still, we're still conspiracy stuff on Twitter x

1004
01:00:15,880 --> 01:00:18,240
Speaker 4: whatever you want to call it. This year. We'll see

1005
01:00:18,360 --> 01:00:21,000
Speaker 4: interesting things developing with that Elon Muskfellow too, that we

1006
01:00:21,040 --> 01:00:24,520
Speaker 4: should probably cover at some point. We are also conspiracy

1007
01:00:24,560 --> 01:00:28,640
Speaker 4: stuff on YouTube and Facebook. Lots of fun videos more

1008
01:00:28,680 --> 01:00:31,360
Speaker 4: to come this year, excited to make. I think we

1009
01:00:31,400 --> 01:00:34,560
Speaker 4: all enjoy and we appreciate your comments on them. We

1010
01:00:34,600 --> 01:00:38,680
Speaker 4: are conspiracy stuff show, however, on Instagram and TikTok.

1011
01:00:39,560 --> 01:00:45,640
Speaker 2: Ben what is winter sins or winter counterclockwisewise? Yeah, okay, cool?

1012
01:00:46,440 --> 01:00:49,920
Speaker 4: Say anti clockwise, which I recently learned w I D

1013
01:00:50,040 --> 01:00:50,480
Speaker 4: D E.

1014
01:00:50,720 --> 01:00:52,920
Speaker 3: R shins got it?

1015
01:00:53,120 --> 01:00:56,800
Speaker 2: Okay? Thanks? Hey, do you want to call us? Tell

1016
01:00:56,880 --> 01:01:01,040
Speaker 2: us cool things that you did in twenty twenty, weird

1017
01:01:01,120 --> 01:01:04,080
Speaker 2: things that happen to you in twenty twenty three, or

1018
01:01:04,240 --> 01:01:07,920
Speaker 2: things that you anticipate happening this year. Why don't you

1019
01:01:07,920 --> 01:01:12,680
Speaker 2: call one eight three three STDWYTK. It's a voicemail system.

1020
01:01:12,720 --> 01:01:15,160
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1021
01:01:15,200 --> 01:01:17,280
Speaker 2: yourself a cool nickname and let us know if we

1022
01:01:17,280 --> 01:01:20,040
Speaker 2: can use your name and message on the air. If

1023
01:01:20,080 --> 01:01:21,880
Speaker 2: you got more to say than that, you got links,

1024
01:01:21,920 --> 01:01:24,720
Speaker 2: maybe attachments? Why not? And said shoot us an email.

1025
01:01:24,960 --> 01:01:46,480
Speaker 3: We are conspiracy at iHeartRadio dot com.

1026
01:01:46,680 --> 01:01:48,720
Speaker 2: Stuff they don't want you to know. Is a production

1027
01:01:48,840 --> 01:01:53,360
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1028
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