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Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.

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Speaker 2: Is a serial killer stalking the women of Portland. So far,

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Speaker 2: the body count is up to six young women, all

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Speaker 2: very similar to each other, found just miles in and

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Speaker 2: around Portland, miles apart from each other. Are they connected?

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Speaker 2: I'm Nancy Grace. This is Crime Stories. Thank you for

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Speaker 2: being with us here at Fox Nation and series XEM

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Speaker 2: one eleven. It all started here. Take a listen to

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Speaker 2: our friends at kp TV.

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Speaker 3: Melissa Smith says Kristen was last seen here near mil

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Speaker 3: Twell five. Take a look at this flyer they've posted

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Speaker 3: around parts of Portland. Melissa says she likes to wear

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Speaker 3: different wigs, so she may not look exactly like the

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Speaker 3: photo on this flyer, but she has a tattoo a

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Speaker 3: red butterfly on her right hand.

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Speaker 4: It is quite like a piece of you is missing.

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Speaker 5: Each day that passes and Melissa and Hayley Smith don't

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Speaker 5: hear from twenty two year old Kristin Smith, they get

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Speaker 5: more concerned she's in danger.

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Speaker 6: A main concern of ours now is sex trafficking. We

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Speaker 6: don't know, but with things we've been told or you know,

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Speaker 6: people that know her are saying it's a possibility. Because

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Speaker 6: this is not like her to just disappear.

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Speaker 7: Not like her at all. Listen.

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Speaker 5: Kristen's mom, Melissa, last talked to her on November nineteenth

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Speaker 5: and hasn't had contact with her since. She says, Kristen

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Speaker 5: always checks in with family and friends at least once

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Speaker 5: a week, if not more.

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Speaker 6: But then when I try to reach out to her again,

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Speaker 6: she didn't answer, and I thought that was strange. I

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Speaker 6: was like, well, she might be busy next day, same thing,

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Speaker 6: and then phone just went straight to voice smel And

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Speaker 6: that's where my this is very odd.

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Speaker 7: Something's not right.

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Speaker 2: Well, those feelings that intuition turn out to be true.

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Speaker 2: Take a listen to our friend Seeng Kim.

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Speaker 8: The Portland Police Bureau says they responded to reports of

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Speaker 8: human remains found in a wooded area near southeast Deerdorf

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Speaker 8: Road and Flavell Street on February nineteenth. Now authorities have

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Speaker 8: confirmed the remains belonged to Kristin.

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Speaker 7: I think of her every moment of every day.

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Speaker 8: And her family search has turned into one for answers

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Speaker 8: what happened.

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Speaker 6: I know she didn't just suddenly die out there.

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Speaker 7: Somebody did something.

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Speaker 8: But they say closure would be finding out what happened

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Speaker 8: to Kristin.

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Speaker 7: From the truth to come out. She deserves justice.

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Speaker 2: That disappearance, that death, that discovery of Kristin Smith h.

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Speaker 2: Twenty two body kicked off a series of discoveries of

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Speaker 2: young women, all all in the same area, all similar

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Speaker 2: in physical characteristics, all left out in the open, such

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Speaker 2: as in a rural, a forested area, one in a

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Speaker 2: gutter to be found. What do we know now, Let's

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Speaker 2: start at the beginning, and the beginning as we know

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Speaker 2: it right now is the disappearance of Kristin Smith. Joining

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Speaker 2: me in All Star panel, But first I want to

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Speaker 2: go to a net Newle with k Excel News and

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Speaker 2: host of speaking Freely with a Net Newle and net

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Speaker 2: thank you for being with us. Tell me about the

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Speaker 2: discovery of Kristin Smith's body.

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Speaker 9: Her body was found in a wooded area in southeast

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Speaker 9: Portland's Pleasant Valley neighborhood.

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Speaker 2: While the case of the murder of Kristin Smith, and

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Speaker 2: I find it really difficult to believe that anyone would

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Speaker 2: assume that she just goes off into the forest and dies.

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Speaker 7: I mean, this is clearly a homicide.

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Speaker 2: That said, while that case is still under investigation just

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Speaker 2: days later, yet another body is found.

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Speaker 7: Take a listen to our friends at crimeonline dot com.

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Speaker 10: With three children, she could always count on her family

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Speaker 10: to be there for In the first week of April,

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Speaker 10: when family members hadn't heard from her for a few days,

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Speaker 10: they started reaching out. After not getting her by phone,

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Speaker 10: family members started talking to one another, trying to retrace

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Speaker 10: their steps back to figure out who talked to her last.

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Speaker 10: And more importantly, when realizing it had been longer than

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Speaker 10: anybody realized, the entire family got worried about Joanna Speaks.

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Speaker 2: That's right, a mother of three, Johanna speaks the next person.

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Speaker 7: Take a listen now to our friends at Fox twelve.

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Speaker 11: Just before six pm, Richfield Police and Clark Cowlitzfire responded

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Speaker 11: to this abindon property and found Speaks dead near the barn.

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Speaker 11: A medical examination ruled it a murderer and Clark County

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Speaker 11: Sheriff's believe she was killed elsewhere then moved to this location.

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Speaker 11: But her killer has not been found and there is no.

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Speaker 4: That she would have gone down without a fight.

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Speaker 12: So whoever did do this, like we had injuries or

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Speaker 12: something like that personally as well from her fighting back.

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Speaker 11: How do you continue on?

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Speaker 10: I don't know.

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Speaker 4: Ye, nothing is off the table as to what we're

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Speaker 4: thinking could have happened.

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Speaker 11: The family of Johanna Speaks is left shock and speechless

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Speaker 11: after getting a phone call that their thirty two year

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Speaker 11: old sister from Oregon City was found near an abandoned

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Speaker 11: barn in Ridgefield, Washington.

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Speaker 2: Joining me right now, professor of forensics at Jacksonville State University,

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Speaker 2: author of Blood Beneath My Fate on Amazon, and star

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Speaker 2: of a hit series Body Bags with Joseph Scott Morgan.

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Speaker 2: He coincidentally is marking the one hundredth program this week.

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Speaker 2: Jo Scott, thank you for being with us. I find

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Speaker 2: it really interesting that no one is saying Kristen Smith

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Speaker 2: was murdered, because I believe she was. Why would you

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Speaker 2: go off to a secluded, heavily forested area and just

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Speaker 2: die of natural causes? That doesn't make sense. But I'm

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Speaker 2: curious about what you think regarding the discovery of the

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Speaker 2: second woman, Joanna Speaks. That's one out of six so

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Speaker 2: far found in the Portland area, where police are convinced

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Speaker 2: that that was not where she died, that she was

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Speaker 2: brought there, dumped there, which as an entire new dimension

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Speaker 2: to these murders.

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Speaker 13: Yeah, and with Misspeaks, you're talking about a case that

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Speaker 13: is actually not in Oregon. This case actually originates in Washington,

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Speaker 13: across the river.

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Speaker 7: But still all then just a few miles from each other.

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Speaker 13: Yeah, within a few miles absolutely. And it's interesting that

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Speaker 13: they say that she was not killed in this location,

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Speaker 13: and they've stated near a barn and then in a barn.

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Speaker 13: So that's that's kind of curious because that's a location,

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Speaker 13: isn't it, Nancy. It's not like just saying out in

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Speaker 13: the woods or out in a wooded area that gives

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Speaker 13: you an indication that an individual may have had knowledge

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Speaker 13: of a specific structure if they were looking to hide

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Speaker 13: a body. Also very significant here, this is the single

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Speaker 13: case out of this cluster of six that we're talking

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Speaker 13: about where we have a manner and a cause of death.

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Speaker 13: And Nancy, this is very personal. This is not someone

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Speaker 13: that was shot at a great distance. We're talking about

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Speaker 13: blunt force trauma to the head and the neck, which

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Speaker 13: means that somebody either used an instrument like a bludgeoning tool,

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Speaker 13: or they use their hands to literally beat her to

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Speaker 13: death or perhaps even stomp on And we don't know yet,

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Speaker 13: but You're talking about intimate contact at this moment tome,

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Speaker 13: and this raises it to a completely different level because

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Speaker 13: this is just purely horrific.

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Speaker 2: Well, I agree, it's horrific, but I'm curious about why

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Speaker 2: they believe that she was dumped there. This was a

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Speaker 2: disposal site, which makes it at least a secondary crime scene,

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Speaker 2: if not a tertiary.

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Speaker 7: So is that true for all of the women?

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Speaker 2: Because I'm looking for connections, similarities and dissimilarities.

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Speaker 14: Listen, Multlm County deputies need your help after what they're

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Speaker 14: calling a suspicious death in the area of Ainsworth State

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Speaker 14: Park on Monday, someone found the body of Charity Perry

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Speaker 14: of Longview in a colvert near east Historic Columbia River

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Speaker 14: Highway and Northeast Tumult Road.

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Speaker 7: Before that, she.

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Speaker 14: Was seen last month in downtown Portland around southwest fourth

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Speaker 14: and Washington. If you have any information in this case,

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Speaker 14: please contact Moultnama County Deputies.

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Speaker 2: So now we have a third body that emerges. There

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Speaker 2: is Christa Smith, h twenty two, There is Johanna Speaks,

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Speaker 2: aged thirty two, and now Charity Perry. Charity Perry's dead

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Speaker 2: body has been found back to at Newell joining us

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Speaker 2: kx L News, and that explain to me how Charity

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Speaker 2: Perry's body was found.

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Speaker 9: She's twenty four years old. Her body was found in

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Speaker 9: a culvert near Ainsworth State Park and that's in East

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Speaker 9: Moltnomah County. It is again in a rural area. And

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Speaker 9: you know, I just got a message from one of

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Speaker 9: the family members of one of these victims saying, help

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Speaker 9: us find these young, beautiful women who've lost their lives

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Speaker 9: all around the same time. And she said, I don't

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Speaker 9: know whether there's one serial killer on the loser, multiple

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Speaker 9: homicidal maniacs on the loose, but I don't know which

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Speaker 9: one I'm terrified of more. And that's how a lot

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Speaker 9: of people are feeling right now.

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Speaker 2: I'm thinking about this Ainsworth State Park and when you

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Speaker 2: research it, it's beautiful, but it's very, very heavily forested.

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Speaker 2: There are waterfalls, there are hiking paths, very very rough terrain,

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Speaker 2: multiple falls there in Oregon is a feeder from Eagle

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Speaker 2: Creek the Columbia River tributary, and it's got a lot

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Speaker 2: of visitors every year, but you've got to be made

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Speaker 2: of stern stuff to go hiking there. And that is

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Speaker 2: where this woman the third victim that we're talking about,

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Speaker 2: Charity Perry's body is found. Please join us now on

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Speaker 2: Fox Nation for a brand new investigation, Parallels of Evil

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Speaker 2: the Bundy and Idaho Killings. In this gripping special investigation,

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Speaker 2: we bring together an incredible panel of guests who analyze

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Speaker 2: disturbing similarities of evil between these horrible crimes. We speak

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Speaker 2: with two female Ed Bundy survivors, Karen Pryor and Cheryl Thomas,

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Speaker 2: who described their life before and after they were victims

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Speaker 2: of Ted Bundy. We also speak with the renowned private

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Speaker 2: investigator Bill Warner who worked the cases, and Ted Bundy's

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Speaker 2: defense attorney, John Henry Brown. We traveled to Moscow, Idaho,

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Speaker 2: to speak with Washington State University students and interview neighbors

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Speaker 2: of Brian Coburger. One neighbor shares exclusive insights about the

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Speaker 2: suspect in the Idaho killings, Brian Coburger. Don't miss Parallels

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Speaker 2: of Evil the Bundy and Idaho Killings, streaming now exclusively

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Speaker 2: on Fox.

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Speaker 1: Nation Crime Stories with Nancy Gray.

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Speaker 2: Joining me right now is a veteran homicide detective, Chris McDonough,

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Speaker 2: who has investigated over three hundred homicides He is the

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Speaker 2: founder and director at the Cold Case Foundation and you

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Speaker 2: can find him on the interview room on YouTube.

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Speaker 7: Chris, thanks for being with us. I want to talk

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Speaker 7: to you about the method.

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Speaker 2: Of disposal that we have so far and the unwillingness

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Speaker 2: of authorities in this area to entertain the idea that

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Speaker 2: these cases, or some of them, if not all of them,

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Speaker 2: are absolutely connected. How can six women turn up dead

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Speaker 2: in this short space of time, all with seventy miles

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Speaker 2: from Portland, all in secluded areas, out in the open.

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Speaker 2: Nobody's found inside a house or buried or wrapped up

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Speaker 2: in plastic or in some type of a structure an outhouse,

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Speaker 2: curtilage as we call it under the law, tool shed,

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Speaker 2: fishing shed, nothing like that. They're all disposed of much

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Speaker 2: in the same manner. What do you make of it,

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Speaker 2: chrismin Dunnet.

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Speaker 15: Well, it's interesting so far, Nancy, just listening to the

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Speaker 15: information that we have available in the public that the

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Speaker 15: authorities have not come out in a press conference of

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Speaker 15: some sort and relate to the public that look, it

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Speaker 15: appears that these incidents are similar in nature and relationship

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Speaker 15: to the geographic locations and what we're doing. I e

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Speaker 15: is an investigation. Arm of this is to let the

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Speaker 15: public know, please be vigilant, please be aware, pay attention

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Speaker 15: to the transit systems, because we're trying to connect these

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Speaker 15: thoughts currently. What that does is open the valve to

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Speaker 15: the public for information to flow correctly, even if it's

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Speaker 15: to a single agency. The fact that the victims at

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Speaker 15: this point, some of them have the very obvious connections,

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Speaker 15: i e. The geographic area within three miles two bodies,

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Speaker 15: and then of course you have the wooded areas. Those

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Speaker 15: are very interesting and from victim one, Kristen Smith, the

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Speaker 15: victim two, Joanne speaks, it's interesting that on the second

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Speaker 15: one they say her body was moved to that location

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Speaker 15: after death. Joe, the autopsy has obviously presented information that

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Speaker 15: showed she was deceased and potentially could have been placed

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Speaker 15: into that other geographic location.

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Speaker 2: When you say autopsy, I naturally think of Joe Scott

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Speaker 2: Morgan death investigator, Joe Scott.

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Speaker 7: What would you find.

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Speaker 2: On a body to indicate the body had been moved

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Speaker 2: to that location?

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Speaker 13: For me, one of the first things that my kind

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Speaker 13: of fallback relative to movement of bodies in the post

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Speaker 13: mortem state after death is distribution of post mortem lividity,

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Speaker 13: which simply means that's the gravitational settling of blood. And

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Speaker 13: I'll give you an example. If somebody dies on their back,

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Speaker 13: for instance, that is face up in a supine position,

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Speaker 13: the blood will literally literally settle to dependent areas, which

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Speaker 13: is all going to be on the backside.

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Speaker 2: In other words, if you die alining, face up, all

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Speaker 2: the blood in your body settles on your backside, your back,

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Speaker 2: your your end, the back of your legs, the back

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Speaker 2: of your arms, all the body sinks down to the

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Speaker 2: lowest common area, the backside. And the reverse, if you're

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Speaker 2: found on your stomach at all, yes, sinks to the

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Speaker 2: front of your body.

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Speaker 7: Go ahead.

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Speaker 13: And so after a period of time, and this is key,

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Speaker 13: After a period of time, lividity fixes nancy, which means

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Speaker 13: that all those little vessels we have just underneath the skin,

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Speaker 13: our capillary beds, those the blood that has settled in

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Speaker 13: those areas begins to leech out of those little capillary

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Speaker 13: beds and it literally stains what's called the interstitial tissue,

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Speaker 13: all that tissue that surrounds those vessels, and it just

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Speaker 13: stains the skin. And it doesn't matter what happens. You

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Speaker 13: can't get rid of it. So let's just say, for instance,

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Speaker 13: you have an individual that is lying on their back

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Speaker 13: for a protracted period of time after death. Okay, the

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Speaker 13: blood settles on the back side, you take the body,

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Speaker 13: you move the body to another location. Let's say you

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Speaker 13: lay the body on the right side or on the

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Speaker 13: left side, or maybe even face down. You still have

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Speaker 13: lividity on the back. You can't make it go away, Nancy.

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Speaker 13: So that's one of the first things we look for

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Speaker 13: and from a forensic standpoint, at a scene, to see

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Speaker 13: if a body has been moved, If it blanches, which

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Speaker 13: means when you press it, that means that there's you're

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Speaker 13: within about a four hour window of the of the death,

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Speaker 13: because it takes about that long for lividity to begin

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Speaker 13: to set in. But if you blanch it, or you

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Speaker 13: try to press down on the skin and it doesn't blanch,

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Speaker 13: that means that the person the lividity has been fixed.

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Speaker 2: John, When you say blanche, you mean when you press

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Speaker 2: your finger into skin it turns a little bit white.

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Speaker 13: Yeah. Yeah, And people can do that at home. Just

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Speaker 13: press press down on your skin and you'll see your

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Speaker 13: skin turns, it blanches out.

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Speaker 2: So if you don't blanch that means four hours. Yes, yeah,

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Speaker 2: Scott Morgan. When I heard a net nwle from k

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Speaker 2: Excel State Detectives thought Joanna Speaks had been moved to

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Speaker 2: that location. I was thinking that maybe part of her body.

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Speaker 2: I was just thinking of her backside, like her legs

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Speaker 2: or her back had movement marks, like when you get

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Speaker 2: scraped from being from hitting asphalt or being dragged across gravel,

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Speaker 2: it leaves that marking on the back of your skin.

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Speaker 2: Or if she had been dragged that maybe her pants

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Speaker 2: or her socks or some part of her clothing had

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Speaker 2: been pulled in that direction, do you see what I mean?

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Speaker 2: Or maybe there was some particle on her light gravel

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Speaker 2: like I'm not even sure what that affixed to her

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Speaker 2: that was not in the environment where she was found,

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Speaker 2: like an asphalt scrape, And of course those particles would

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Speaker 2: still be in the scrapes if they looked at them.

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Speaker 2: Yet she's found on a lawn or sitting up against

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Speaker 2: that barn. That's what I thought of. But what you

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Speaker 2: said was really interesting about the lividity and the blanching

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Speaker 2: hold on guys. Kathleen Murphy, lawyer joining us out of

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Speaker 2: North Carolina. You can find her in c North Carolina,

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Speaker 2: Incdomestic law dot com. She has also investigated and worked

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Speaker 2: on many many cases that end in homicide.

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Speaker 7: Kathleen jump in.

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Speaker 16: Thank you, Nancy. I just want to point out some

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Speaker 16: similarities of these victims. I was doing a little bit

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Speaker 16: of reading and a lot of these sweet women have

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Speaker 16: been very petite build They have a very small build

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Speaker 16: five feet five to one, smaller frames, easy to carry,

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Speaker 16: easy to place, and a lot of the women involved

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Speaker 16: clearly clearly come from loving families who are missing them,

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Speaker 16: and we need to find some type of connection or

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Speaker 16: some type of answers for these families because the women

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Speaker 16: involved had a very very similar type of lifestyle and

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Speaker 16: they had a similar time type of family connections. Nancy,

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Speaker 16: if I could jump in about that. You know, Portland,

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Speaker 16: Oregon is a very outdoorsy place. People love to hike,

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Speaker 16: they go to the public parks, they're out and about,

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Speaker 16: and all of these women seem to have been apprehended

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Speaker 16: when they were out in public. And I think that's

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Speaker 16: a very important similarity. This is not like somebody is

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Speaker 16: breaking into their apartment or into their cars. You know,

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Speaker 16: remember Richard Ramirez the Night stalker. He broke into women's homes.

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Speaker 4: At night while they were in their beds. So that's

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Speaker 4: a very specific offending style to apprehend women, murder them,

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Speaker 4: take them to a different place when they are already outdoors.

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Speaker 4: Tells us something about this guy that maybe he's an outdoorsman.

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Speaker 4: Maybe he's the kind of guy who watches women as

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Speaker 4: they hike, or as they picnic, or as they hang

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Speaker 4: out with their friends. There's been plenty of cases where

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Speaker 4: serial killers will find young lovers who are maybe in

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Speaker 4: a lover's lane kind of situation, or having sex or

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Speaker 4: making out in their cars by a lake. That's a

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Speaker 4: particular type of offending style paired with victims selection. Again,

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Speaker 4: Richard Ramirez would break into people's homes look at Coburger.

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Speaker 4: We don't know if he would have gone on to

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Speaker 4: become a prolific serial killer, but he targeted college women

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Speaker 4: who are in sorority houses. So this at least gives

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Speaker 4: the public some kind of clue if there's a serial

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Speaker 4: killer that ties all of these cases together, he is

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Speaker 4: kind of on the move out in public.

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Speaker 2: You know what, that's a really good observation you're hearing,

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Speaker 2: Doctor Bethany Marshall, renowned psycho analysts, joining us out of

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Speaker 2: Beverly Heels. You can find her at Doctorbethanymarshall dot com.

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Speaker 2: That is a really good analysis of how these women

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Speaker 2: may have been accosted ending up dead. We have described

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Speaker 2: Kristen Smith's discovery, Joanna Speaks, and Charity Perry. But then

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Speaker 2: an unidentified Native American is found. Guys, take a listen

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Speaker 2: to our cut b.

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Speaker 17: An unidentified woman between twenty five and forty years old

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Speaker 17: was found dead near I to A five in southeast

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Speaker 17: Flavelle Street. The Moltnoman County Medical Examiner's Office is asking

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Speaker 17: for the public's help identifying her and provided this sketch.

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Speaker 17: They say she was possibly Native American with medium length

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Speaker 17: black hair and about five foot one. At the time,

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Speaker 17: they say she was wearing a longsleeve green T shirt,

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Speaker 17: a black and white jacket, and black and white Adidas cleats.

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Speaker 17: She also had two tattoos, a black music note with

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Speaker 17: the letter V on her chest and the Buddha on

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Speaker 17: her back.

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Speaker 2: Straight back out to death investigator and Professor Forensics Jacksonville

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Speaker 2: State University as Morgan Scott. How is it that in

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Speaker 2: this age fingerprints in DNA and.

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Speaker 7: Dental records, that.

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Speaker 2: We have an unidentified female body, and how do they

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Speaker 2: know that she is Native American?

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Speaker 13: Well, obviously they've they've probably employed the use of a

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Speaker 13: forensic anthropologist here because when it comes to identification of race,

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Speaker 13: that's their forte. That's what they're going to go into.

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Speaker 13: And we don't really know how extensive any kind of

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Speaker 13: changes in the body might be relative to her. But

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Speaker 13: what we do know is that there's at least significant

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Speaker 13: soft tissue because they're identifying tattoos with her Nancy, we're

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Speaker 13: talking about a musical note. We're also talking about an

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Speaker 13: image of the Buddha, which is significant and those are identified.

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Speaker 7: Scott.

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Speaker 2: Yes, ma'am, just throw out something like that, because to me,

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Speaker 2: that's a bombshell. You said the Buddha is significant.

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Speaker 13: Yes, it is.

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Speaker 2: I find the tattoo significant in my mind because I

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Speaker 2: may be able to trace the tattoo parlor and figure

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Speaker 2: out from them who came in and got the believe

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Speaker 2: it's a butterfly, and then the next tattoo, and very

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Speaker 2: often once a person gets one tattoo, they go back

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Speaker 2: to the same tattoo parlor. Tattoos have been critical in

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Speaker 2: identifying bodies and even proving cases. For instance, if I'm

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Speaker 2: trying somebody for murderer and they have a tattoo such

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Speaker 2: as a tear coming out of their eye, which in

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Speaker 2: some places signifies they've already killed one person, it can

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Speaker 2: mean other things as well.

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Speaker 7: I can't wait to show that to a Jerry.

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Speaker 2: So here, this woman has a musical note. Yes it

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Speaker 2: was a musical note, not a butterfly and Buddha. So

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Speaker 2: very often they go back to the same tattoo parlor.

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Speaker 2: Maybe I can identify her through that, or maybe Buddha

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Speaker 2: indicates how she worships. You don't know, but it opens

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Speaker 2: up a plethora of possibilities. But what were you talking

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Speaker 2: about when you said it's very significant.

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Speaker 13: Well, it's significant. First off, you've got a combination, right,

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Speaker 13: It's not just like you have the singular image of

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Speaker 13: the boot or the singular image of the musical note.

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Speaker 13: You have a combination. So that makes her distinctive. As

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Speaker 13: to dental identification, hey, look, in order to make a

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Speaker 13: dental identification, you gotta have pre death dental records, and

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Speaker 13: right now they don't know. Now if they can narrow

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Speaker 13: this down, possibly and as far as fingerprints go. We

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Speaker 13: don't know what the status of her body was. Were

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Speaker 13: they able to lift prints off of her, that is,

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Speaker 13: to roll a print off of her fingerpad, or was

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Speaker 13: her body compromised to the point decomposed that is where

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Speaker 13: they couldn't do that. And if she's never been hooked

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Speaker 13: up on charges at all, means she's not going to

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Speaker 13: be in the system.

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Speaker 2: Okay, what he's saying is, in many jurisdictions, if you

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Speaker 2: have a felony charge, you give your DNA, not all

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Speaker 2: by far because the ACLU is fighting that tooth and claw.

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Speaker 7: Or what about this? If she's ever put her.

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Speaker 2: DNA out there for genetic genealogy, do you know that's

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Speaker 2: a possibility? Who's jumping in?

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Speaker 7: Who's this? This is in net?

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Speaker 9: Nowel I was just looking at the Mulde mccunny Medical

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Speaker 9: Examiner's office statement about this, and in addition to the tattoos,

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Speaker 9: they also mentioned two large scars on her lower left

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Speaker 9: leg to help identify her.

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Speaker 7: So I thought that that might be interesting.

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Speaker 2: Well, thank you, Now, what could that indicate? If it

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Speaker 2: were like across her tummy, I say, oh, it's a

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Speaker 2: Syrian section, or across the throat, I would say some

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Speaker 2: type of a tray or something to do with her

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Speaker 2: vocal cords, which would then we could trace back to

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Speaker 2: a hospital. But what does the leg star mean to you?

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Speaker 2: Was it some type of an accident Joscott?

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Speaker 13: Yeah, and you would have to qualify that. You know,

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Speaker 13: when they say scars, that's every single one of every

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Speaker 13: one of us on this panel has the scar of

437
00:26:56,200 --> 00:26:58,840
Speaker 13: some kind. And so you don't know if it's surgical

438
00:26:58,840 --> 00:27:01,960
Speaker 13: in nature, which they could take at autopsy even with

439
00:27:02,160 --> 00:27:05,480
Speaker 13: severely decomposed bodies, you can appreciate that. Or did she

440
00:27:05,560 --> 00:27:07,840
Speaker 13: have a bicycle accident when she was a little girl

441
00:27:08,160 --> 00:27:10,600
Speaker 13: and fell off of her bike and she sustained these scars.

442
00:27:10,600 --> 00:27:12,320
Speaker 13: We don't know at this point.

443
00:27:26,040 --> 00:27:26,320
Speaker 7: Time.

444
00:27:26,400 --> 00:27:31,280
Speaker 1: Stories with Nancy Grace, Joe Scott.

445
00:27:31,320 --> 00:27:33,240
Speaker 2: Just last night and I was talking to John David

446
00:27:33,240 --> 00:27:36,320
Speaker 2: and Lucy and John David actually has a scarlet looks

447
00:27:36,359 --> 00:27:40,000
Speaker 2: like a smiley face on his thumb where he cut

448
00:27:40,080 --> 00:27:43,840
Speaker 2: himself on a scout camp out and he was catch

449
00:27:43,880 --> 00:27:46,880
Speaker 2: this showing somebody else how to use a knife. All right,

450
00:27:47,000 --> 00:27:50,879
Speaker 2: So that said, and you're right, this could come from

451
00:27:50,920 --> 00:27:52,720
Speaker 2: a bike accident when she was a little kid. It

452
00:27:52,800 --> 00:27:55,399
Speaker 2: could come from a motorcycle accident. It could come from

453
00:27:55,440 --> 00:28:00,320
Speaker 2: a surgery. Oh but Annette Knewell, how many people have

454
00:28:00,720 --> 00:28:06,399
Speaker 2: a musical note tattoo, a Buddha tattoo and a scar

455
00:28:06,760 --> 00:28:07,520
Speaker 2: on her leg?

456
00:28:08,119 --> 00:28:10,879
Speaker 7: You're so write Anett Newell two.

457
00:28:11,160 --> 00:28:14,600
Speaker 9: Two large scars on her left lower leg.

458
00:28:14,560 --> 00:28:18,360
Speaker 2: And still unidentified. Well, I've only made it to four

459
00:28:18,480 --> 00:28:22,080
Speaker 2: victims so far, so let me move to a thirty

460
00:28:22,160 --> 00:28:26,920
Speaker 2: one year old young lady, Bridget Webster take a listen

461
00:28:27,440 --> 00:28:30,000
Speaker 2: to our friends at crime online.

462
00:28:30,080 --> 00:28:33,879
Speaker 12: Bridget, also known as Breebery Ramsey Webster, comes from a

463
00:28:34,000 --> 00:28:37,400
Speaker 12: large and tight knit family. She's close with her two brothers,

464
00:28:37,480 --> 00:28:41,280
Speaker 12: Dylan and Brendan, who described their sister as beautiful, goofy,

465
00:28:41,440 --> 00:28:45,440
Speaker 12: and intelligent. Webster frequently shares cooking tips from her mother

466
00:28:45,560 --> 00:28:48,680
Speaker 12: and photos of her two cats on Facebook. In fact,

467
00:28:48,760 --> 00:28:52,120
Speaker 12: Webster recently welcomed three kittens and is working on finding

468
00:28:52,120 --> 00:28:53,160
Speaker 12: them good homes.

469
00:28:53,480 --> 00:28:55,160
Speaker 7: Then Webster disappears.

470
00:28:55,320 --> 00:28:58,000
Speaker 2: Doctor Bethany Marshall, you know, it strikes me about what

471
00:28:59,120 --> 00:29:01,200
Speaker 2: our forensic crime online dot com just said.

472
00:29:01,720 --> 00:29:03,040
Speaker 7: It sounds like all of us.

473
00:29:03,400 --> 00:29:08,600
Speaker 2: I'm constantly sending pictures of recipes and something I made

474
00:29:08,720 --> 00:29:12,560
Speaker 2: and this and that and the other thing, and talking

475
00:29:12,560 --> 00:29:14,360
Speaker 2: about finding homes for the kittens.

476
00:29:14,400 --> 00:29:17,280
Speaker 7: It makes her so real to.

477
00:29:17,320 --> 00:29:20,720
Speaker 4: Me, Nancy, this is a woman who loves her mother,

478
00:29:21,320 --> 00:29:25,160
Speaker 4: loves her siblings, they love her. She sounds like she's

479
00:29:25,280 --> 00:29:28,160
Speaker 4: fostered three kittens after having a cat of her own,

480
00:29:28,200 --> 00:29:30,320
Speaker 4: and now she wants to find good homes for them.

481
00:29:30,920 --> 00:29:34,240
Speaker 4: This is a good person. I mean, this humanizes her.

482
00:29:34,360 --> 00:29:38,800
Speaker 4: This places here in the context of family relationships and community.

483
00:29:39,280 --> 00:29:41,480
Speaker 4: But you know, it's a Native American. I was thinking

484
00:29:41,520 --> 00:29:45,640
Speaker 4: about those tattoos. They really tell a story. They tell

485
00:29:45,680 --> 00:29:49,200
Speaker 4: a story of somebody who maybe has a Native American heritage,

486
00:29:49,800 --> 00:29:54,440
Speaker 4: has migrated to maybe an out culture type situation where

487
00:29:54,640 --> 00:29:58,240
Speaker 4: now she's interested in Buddhism. Maybe she's gone to college

488
00:29:58,280 --> 00:30:01,200
Speaker 4: and studied music, or she plays in some kind of

489
00:30:01,200 --> 00:30:06,600
Speaker 4: a band. So these tattoos also tell a story of

490
00:30:06,640 --> 00:30:11,160
Speaker 4: a rich life, a person with a personality with the community.

491
00:30:11,600 --> 00:30:14,360
Speaker 4: You don't just get a musical note tattoo if you're

492
00:30:14,400 --> 00:30:18,360
Speaker 4: not embedded in the music community in some way. So

493
00:30:18,400 --> 00:30:21,560
Speaker 4: we look at these two victims and now there are

494
00:30:21,600 --> 00:30:27,400
Speaker 4: there are overlapping circles between different communities, the music community,

495
00:30:28,080 --> 00:30:31,640
Speaker 4: the animal shelter community, people who foster kittens, and then

496
00:30:31,760 --> 00:30:35,880
Speaker 4: rehome them or rehouse them, or people who generally know

497
00:30:36,080 --> 00:30:41,480
Speaker 4: the different rescue, animal rescue centers or veterinary clinics, and

498
00:30:41,520 --> 00:30:44,840
Speaker 4: a certain community, people who send recipes. They may be

499
00:30:44,920 --> 00:30:48,040
Speaker 4: a part of an online cooking community. So now this

500
00:30:48,280 --> 00:30:53,080
Speaker 4: really places these women's personalities, their lives in the context

501
00:30:53,240 --> 00:30:57,240
Speaker 4: of culture, community, friendships, love. So we can begin to

502
00:30:57,320 --> 00:31:00,760
Speaker 4: delve a little further into who they are and nancy

503
00:31:01,080 --> 00:31:05,320
Speaker 4: who might have accosted them, murdered them, who may have

504
00:31:05,480 --> 00:31:08,400
Speaker 4: known them, What is the thread that ties all of

505
00:31:08,440 --> 00:31:09,080
Speaker 4: this together?

506
00:31:09,360 --> 00:31:14,760
Speaker 2: And not only the unique individual characteristics, but as doctor

507
00:31:14,800 --> 00:31:19,920
Speaker 2: Bethany Marshall just said, we're looking for commonalities these characteristics

508
00:31:20,000 --> 00:31:23,080
Speaker 2: as they relate to characteristics of the other woman. Right now,

509
00:31:23,120 --> 00:31:26,600
Speaker 2: we're talking about one, two, three, four five, the fifth

510
00:31:27,880 --> 00:31:31,400
Speaker 2: female victim in the Portland area whose body has just

511
00:31:31,520 --> 00:31:35,520
Speaker 2: been found April thirty, twenty twenty three, Bridget Webster take

512
00:31:35,520 --> 00:31:38,400
Speaker 2: a listener, Forensic KOI and cut fourteen.

513
00:31:38,640 --> 00:31:42,520
Speaker 18: The Pope County Sheriff's Office investigating after a Milwaukee woman's

514
00:31:42,520 --> 00:31:46,120
Speaker 18: body was found abandoned in their jurisdiction. A deputy say

515
00:31:46,200 --> 00:31:49,640
Speaker 18: Bridget Webster's body was found on Sunday near Mill Creek

516
00:31:49,800 --> 00:31:53,120
Speaker 18: in Northwest Polk County. They say Webster was last seen

517
00:31:53,200 --> 00:31:56,680
Speaker 18: alive in the Portland metro area. The Sheriff's office asking

518
00:31:56,760 --> 00:31:59,800
Speaker 18: anyone who knew her or has information about her death

519
00:32:00,080 --> 00:32:01,160
Speaker 18: to call detectives.

520
00:32:01,360 --> 00:32:03,960
Speaker 7: Back to Annette Newel joining us k x L.

521
00:32:04,680 --> 00:32:08,840
Speaker 2: How was Bridget Webster's body found? Thirty one year old

522
00:32:08,880 --> 00:32:13,240
Speaker 2: Bridget Webster. Yeah, in Northwest Polk County. Othough, it doesn't

523
00:32:13,280 --> 00:32:16,880
Speaker 2: mean that that's where she where she died. We don't

524
00:32:16,880 --> 00:32:17,360
Speaker 2: know that yet.

525
00:32:17,400 --> 00:32:20,960
Speaker 9: But you know, one thing I want to mention about

526
00:32:21,000 --> 00:32:23,760
Speaker 9: Bridget and another of the victims, Joanna, is that they

527
00:32:23,880 --> 00:32:26,280
Speaker 9: knew each other. You notice how close in age those

528
00:32:26,280 --> 00:32:29,040
Speaker 9: two are, thirty one and thirty two. They were actually

529
00:32:29,160 --> 00:32:34,280
Speaker 9: childhood friends, Bridget and who knows each other? Joanna speaks,

530
00:32:34,520 --> 00:32:36,760
Speaker 9: They were actually very close as children.

531
00:32:37,040 --> 00:32:41,280
Speaker 2: Okay, right there, right there, Joe Scott Morgan.

532
00:32:41,920 --> 00:32:43,400
Speaker 7: How are authorities.

533
00:32:42,960 --> 00:32:46,360
Speaker 2: Saying that these cases are not connected? How are they

534
00:32:46,440 --> 00:32:49,520
Speaker 2: saying that that there's not a serial killer? How can

535
00:32:49,560 --> 00:32:54,120
Speaker 2: there be this coincidence two young ladies similar in age

536
00:32:54,160 --> 00:32:57,360
Speaker 2: thirty one thirty two one found April thirty one found

537
00:32:57,440 --> 00:33:03,800
Speaker 2: April eighth, in the same area. Yeah, and their childhood friends. Impossible.

538
00:33:03,880 --> 00:33:06,600
Speaker 13: You're not talking about a metro population of like five

539
00:33:06,720 --> 00:33:10,360
Speaker 13: thousand people, Nancy, We're talking about Portland, Oregon, which has

540
00:33:10,360 --> 00:33:14,080
Speaker 13: a huge population. What are the odds that these two

541
00:33:14,120 --> 00:33:16,719
Speaker 13: would have known one another in childhood and then they

542
00:33:16,760 --> 00:33:20,440
Speaker 13: would both be found to seized in isolated areas in

543
00:33:20,480 --> 00:33:26,360
Speaker 13: pretty close proximity. From a chronological standpoint, it's very hard

544
00:33:26,400 --> 00:33:29,000
Speaker 13: to get past that. Intellectually, I think you begin to

545
00:33:29,040 --> 00:33:31,719
Speaker 13: think about this, what kind of connection do you have

546
00:33:31,920 --> 00:33:35,320
Speaker 13: between these two women? When where they last together? I

547
00:33:35,360 --> 00:33:40,240
Speaker 13: think that that's significant. When had they both had communications

548
00:33:40,280 --> 00:33:44,200
Speaker 13: with one another? And you begin to see a connection.

549
00:33:44,360 --> 00:33:47,920
Speaker 13: And then even further, who are the common components in

550
00:33:47,960 --> 00:33:50,640
Speaker 13: their life? Who are the individuals that they still have

551
00:33:51,560 --> 00:33:56,040
Speaker 13: contact with that know something about them intimately? Is there

552
00:33:56,120 --> 00:34:00,360
Speaker 13: anybody in their current situation in life that knows their

553
00:34:00,360 --> 00:34:03,040
Speaker 13: comings and goings that you can tie back to that

554
00:34:03,160 --> 00:34:05,720
Speaker 13: individual That's somebody I'd like to ask some questions.

555
00:34:06,040 --> 00:34:11,960
Speaker 2: Guys, we haven't even gotten to the sixth victim, Ashley Reel.

556
00:34:12,920 --> 00:34:17,400
Speaker 2: Take a listen to our three our friends at k GW.

557
00:34:17,560 --> 00:34:20,920
Speaker 19: We've heard from two of the law enforcement agency agencies

558
00:34:20,920 --> 00:34:24,040
Speaker 19: handling these cases and Basically, they're not ruling anything out

559
00:34:24,080 --> 00:34:26,320
Speaker 19: at this point. They're talking with partner agencies on the

560
00:34:26,360 --> 00:34:29,720
Speaker 19: off chance these cases are somehow connected, and this comes

561
00:34:29,760 --> 00:34:32,120
Speaker 19: as a relief to the family of one of the

562
00:34:32,160 --> 00:34:35,319
Speaker 19: five victims. These woods off Southeast Judd Road in rural

563
00:34:35,360 --> 00:34:38,920
Speaker 19: Clackamus County is where deputies discovered the remains of Ashley Reel.

564
00:34:39,280 --> 00:34:41,160
Speaker 19: The twenty two year old was last seen in late

565
00:34:41,160 --> 00:34:43,719
Speaker 19: March at a fast food restaurant and transit center in

566
00:34:43,719 --> 00:34:46,319
Speaker 19: East Portland. These photos of Reel are some of the

567
00:34:46,400 --> 00:34:49,280
Speaker 19: last before she turned up dead in that heavily wooded area.

568
00:34:49,440 --> 00:34:56,040
Speaker 2: I want to understand why authorities would say these cases

569
00:34:56,120 --> 00:35:00,759
Speaker 2: are not connected to Kathleen Murphy vein t lawyer joining

570
00:35:00,840 --> 00:35:01,840
Speaker 2: us out of North Carolina.

571
00:35:01,880 --> 00:35:02,600
Speaker 7: What do you think?

572
00:35:02,800 --> 00:35:05,920
Speaker 16: I am shocked at the news that the two victims

573
00:35:06,000 --> 00:35:10,200
Speaker 16: knew each other. I am concerned that all of these

574
00:35:10,239 --> 00:35:14,000
Speaker 16: women had similar builds. I tied together the location of

575
00:35:14,040 --> 00:35:18,279
Speaker 16: all of the bodies, and it's concerning to me that

576
00:35:18,560 --> 00:35:22,680
Speaker 16: all of these women were in a very walkable, transit

577
00:35:23,360 --> 00:35:27,040
Speaker 16: transit based area, and it seems to be something that's

578
00:35:27,040 --> 00:35:29,840
Speaker 16: fairly easy to pick up a small woman. And I

579
00:35:29,880 --> 00:35:34,920
Speaker 16: do think that there's a connection between these deaths and

580
00:35:35,200 --> 00:35:37,799
Speaker 16: the location and the manner of death.

581
00:35:38,000 --> 00:35:40,480
Speaker 7: Night Toinette Neil joining us from k Excel.

582
00:35:41,000 --> 00:35:44,960
Speaker 2: What do we know about the circumstances surrounding the discovery

583
00:35:45,000 --> 00:35:46,200
Speaker 2: of Ashley Reel.

584
00:35:46,440 --> 00:35:49,000
Speaker 9: There's actually a video of her that police have been

585
00:35:49,040 --> 00:35:52,160
Speaker 9: posting that was the last time she was seen alive.

586
00:35:52,360 --> 00:35:55,480
Speaker 9: She was at a fast food restaurant in Southeast Division

587
00:35:55,520 --> 00:35:59,239
Speaker 9: Street on March twenty seventh, and that she may have

588
00:35:59,280 --> 00:36:01,440
Speaker 9: also been at a T transit center a MAX station

589
00:36:01,800 --> 00:36:06,120
Speaker 9: that same day. And she is She's an Hispanic female,

590
00:36:06,200 --> 00:36:09,160
Speaker 9: four feet eleven inches tall, as you mentioned, eighty five pounds,

591
00:36:09,200 --> 00:36:11,120
Speaker 9: a very small young woman.

592
00:36:11,800 --> 00:36:13,120
Speaker 7: And we know that.

593
00:36:14,800 --> 00:36:17,880
Speaker 9: Let's see, they have descriptions of what she was last wearing.

594
00:36:19,120 --> 00:36:22,520
Speaker 9: She was carrying a tote bag. And it just created

595
00:36:22,560 --> 00:36:25,840
Speaker 9: a lot of panic in the area when we were like,

596
00:36:25,880 --> 00:36:28,200
Speaker 9: this is like you said, this is a sixth person

597
00:36:28,480 --> 00:36:30,840
Speaker 9: in a row that we've been asked to try to find.

598
00:36:30,880 --> 00:36:33,680
Speaker 9: And then and then again she's found in a wooded

599
00:36:33,760 --> 00:36:37,280
Speaker 9: area in the Southeast area.

600
00:36:37,440 --> 00:36:41,359
Speaker 2: Guys, this is what they're publicly saying. Take a listen

601
00:36:41,400 --> 00:36:44,120
Speaker 2: to our cut eighteen our friends and ko I.

602
00:36:44,360 --> 00:36:46,880
Speaker 20: M It's definitely something that they're looking at. You know,

603
00:36:47,040 --> 00:36:49,600
Speaker 20: they're aware that there's there seems to be some similarities there,

604
00:36:49,600 --> 00:36:51,720
Speaker 20: but it's too soon for them to say that there's,

605
00:36:51,800 --> 00:36:53,879
Speaker 20: you know, anything directly linked between these.

606
00:36:54,320 --> 00:36:56,960
Speaker 21: The deaths of Perry, Webster and Real are all being

607
00:36:57,000 --> 00:37:00,040
Speaker 21: investigated as suspicious. We spoke to neighbors near where the

608
00:37:00,080 --> 00:37:03,320
Speaker 21: Smith's body was found in February, telling us law enforcement

609
00:37:03,400 --> 00:37:06,279
Speaker 21: teams have been back to the scene several times since then,

610
00:37:06,440 --> 00:37:09,360
Speaker 21: where teams were walking shoulder to shoulder in the fields.

611
00:37:09,400 --> 00:37:12,520
Speaker 20: We're a big enough metro region, especially here where you know,

612
00:37:12,560 --> 00:37:14,600
Speaker 20: people come and go across the bridges, and so we're

613
00:37:14,680 --> 00:37:16,600
Speaker 20: they're very used to working with the other agencies in

614
00:37:16,640 --> 00:37:17,160
Speaker 20: other states.

615
00:37:17,280 --> 00:37:20,319
Speaker 7: Okay, let's figure out why they're saying that.

616
00:37:20,840 --> 00:37:25,280
Speaker 2: Why they're saying is too soon to say anything directly

617
00:37:25,400 --> 00:37:29,440
Speaker 2: linked between them when two of them were childhood friends.

618
00:37:29,760 --> 00:37:32,200
Speaker 7: Joe Scott, what is happening?

619
00:37:32,440 --> 00:37:35,520
Speaker 13: Oh, I don't know, you know, My thought is how

620
00:37:35,560 --> 00:37:38,399
Speaker 13: far back in time do we want to take this

621
00:37:38,560 --> 00:37:41,359
Speaker 13: to find out if there are other women? I think

622
00:37:41,400 --> 00:37:44,759
Speaker 13: this is going to be significant that fit this this

623
00:37:44,920 --> 00:37:47,640
Speaker 13: grouping that we have, you know, what we know slightly

624
00:37:47,640 --> 00:37:50,280
Speaker 13: built this sort of thing. They're found in isolated areas

625
00:37:50,280 --> 00:37:54,399
Speaker 13: and rural rural depositions out here. I'd like to know,

626
00:37:55,239 --> 00:37:59,200
Speaker 13: are are there any others, you know, looking back one, two,

627
00:37:59,239 --> 00:38:03,120
Speaker 13: three years that remain unsolved where we have questions about this.

628
00:38:03,560 --> 00:38:09,040
Speaker 13: Are healthy, healthy young women? Now these are under forty, Nancy,

629
00:38:09,280 --> 00:38:12,080
Speaker 13: just walking out into rural areas and falling over dead

630
00:38:12,080 --> 00:38:15,239
Speaker 13: as a hammer. I don't understand that, you know, that's

631
00:38:15,320 --> 00:38:18,799
Speaker 13: the big question. And to this point, other than misspeaks,

632
00:38:19,320 --> 00:38:22,160
Speaker 13: we don't have a cause of death on any of these.

633
00:38:22,160 --> 00:38:24,800
Speaker 13: But Nancy, as you know, as a guy that deals

634
00:38:24,920 --> 00:38:27,839
Speaker 13: you know, in medical legal death investigation, it really makes

635
00:38:27,880 --> 00:38:30,080
Speaker 13: me scratch my head. I want to know why these

636
00:38:30,080 --> 00:38:32,120
Speaker 13: young women are dying, and why are they dying in

637
00:38:32,160 --> 00:38:33,880
Speaker 13: isolated locations.

638
00:38:33,400 --> 00:38:36,120
Speaker 2: And I want to know why the authorities are saying

639
00:38:36,280 --> 00:38:41,000
Speaker 2: they're not connected when they're in such close proximity and

640
00:38:41,120 --> 00:38:45,320
Speaker 2: two of them were childhood friends. They even look similar

641
00:38:45,800 --> 00:38:50,000
Speaker 2: physically to doctor Bethany Marshall. Have you ever looked at

642
00:38:50,080 --> 00:38:54,440
Speaker 2: all of Ted Bundy's victims side by side. They are

643
00:38:54,800 --> 00:38:57,759
Speaker 2: amazingly similar, right down to the part in their hair.

644
00:38:57,920 --> 00:39:01,319
Speaker 4: Nancy, it's so true. And these victims, I was just

645
00:39:01,360 --> 00:39:04,719
Speaker 4: looking at their photos. Some of the similarities are that

646
00:39:04,840 --> 00:39:08,040
Speaker 4: they have a certain kind of an innocent look to them.

647
00:39:09,200 --> 00:39:13,319
Speaker 4: They look very natural. They don't look like a California

648
00:39:13,360 --> 00:39:15,759
Speaker 4: sorority girl who has had their teeth fixed and their

649
00:39:15,800 --> 00:39:19,480
Speaker 4: hair dyed and you know, everything just perfect perfect. These

650
00:39:19,520 --> 00:39:22,960
Speaker 4: are girls who are like, have been outdoors, who maybe

651
00:39:23,080 --> 00:39:27,680
Speaker 4: exposed to the elements. Hikers, bikers, they're very natural looking.

652
00:39:27,680 --> 00:39:31,200
Speaker 4: At women, they're fetitue. They mostly they have dark hair.

653
00:39:31,760 --> 00:39:36,680
Speaker 4: So there's definitely victims selection and profiling going on. I

654
00:39:36,719 --> 00:39:39,000
Speaker 4: have some thought about why the police are saying that,

655
00:39:39,520 --> 00:39:41,319
Speaker 4: you know, none of these they don't know what the

656
00:39:41,440 --> 00:39:44,440
Speaker 4: connection is between all these cases. And you know, I

657
00:39:44,440 --> 00:39:47,239
Speaker 4: don't know the police like you do, but it does

658
00:39:47,480 --> 00:39:51,600
Speaker 4: place pressure on them to solve the crime very quickly.

659
00:39:51,800 --> 00:39:54,879
Speaker 4: As soon as the public knows that there is a

660
00:39:54,920 --> 00:40:01,080
Speaker 4: serial killer on the loose, there is panic and ammonium. Again,

661
00:40:01,160 --> 00:40:05,320
Speaker 4: I reference Richard Ramirez the nightstalker. I mean, just because

662
00:40:05,360 --> 00:40:09,040
Speaker 4: that's my own personal experience with that kind of thing,

663
00:40:09,080 --> 00:40:12,520
Speaker 4: because I was in graduate school at the time. My

664
00:40:12,600 --> 00:40:15,640
Speaker 4: roommates and I were terrified to go to sleep. We

665
00:40:15,640 --> 00:40:19,160
Speaker 4: would have one person stay up. We would tie rope

666
00:40:19,520 --> 00:40:22,160
Speaker 4: around our windows, even though we had locks, we would

667
00:40:22,200 --> 00:40:25,480
Speaker 4: like Bluey trap everything because we were so terrified. And

668
00:40:25,520 --> 00:40:28,400
Speaker 4: this story still makes its way into my practice today

669
00:40:28,480 --> 00:40:32,319
Speaker 4: women who are traumatized by that. So we have potentially

670
00:40:32,600 --> 00:40:37,319
Speaker 4: traumatic situation that could just cause a mass hysteria. And

671
00:40:37,360 --> 00:40:40,160
Speaker 4: I think they're trying to maybe put the clues together

672
00:40:40,200 --> 00:40:42,440
Speaker 4: a little bit more before they'd start to say that

673
00:40:42,440 --> 00:40:44,160
Speaker 4: there's a serial killer on the loop guy.

674
00:40:44,280 --> 00:40:47,680
Speaker 2: So far, I've counted six agencies working this Portland pay

675
00:40:47,760 --> 00:40:52,800
Speaker 2: day Maltlamont County, Oregon State Police, Polk County, Clark County,

676
00:40:52,960 --> 00:40:54,040
Speaker 2: and Clackamas County.

677
00:40:54,120 --> 00:40:56,440
Speaker 9: And they say they're all working together and that they

678
00:40:56,480 --> 00:40:57,640
Speaker 9: are sharing information.

679
00:40:58,000 --> 00:41:00,000
Speaker 7: Well, that's good to know, and I hope that's true.

680
00:41:00,120 --> 00:41:04,399
Speaker 2: If you have or think you have information regarding this investigation,

681
00:41:05,040 --> 00:41:10,480
Speaker 2: dial five zero three eight two three zero zero zero

682
00:41:10,680 --> 00:41:16,319
Speaker 2: zero repeat five three eight two three.

683
00:41:16,640 --> 00:41:20,480
Speaker 7: We wait as this investigation of the thoughts goodbye