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Speaker 1: That is really hard because you are not aware of

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Speaker 1: all the things that they had to do to get there.

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Speaker 1: You're just on your first six months of your record

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Speaker 1: deal contract and you're trying to figure out, like why

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Speaker 1: you're not selling out a stadium yet.

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Speaker 2: Welcome to episode five oh eight Troy Cartwright. Troy has

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Speaker 2: a podcast called ten Year Town. That's how I was

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Speaker 2: introduced to him. It's a really good podcast. It's I

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Speaker 2: would say, a better version of this show.

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Speaker 3: You would say that, yeah, probably.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. He's like a legit songwriter. He's a legit artist,

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Speaker 2: and we talk a lot about that. But I was

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Speaker 2: drawn to his podcast because I was following it on

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Speaker 2: TikTok and the clips would come up and now I

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Speaker 2: was like, dang. And I went into his podcast and

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Speaker 2: I don't think it's as big yet, but I was like, yeah,

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Speaker 2: this is a better version of what I do in that.

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Speaker 3: While though you see something on TikTok and you think

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Speaker 3: it's massive, Like I've been seeing his clip for a

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Speaker 3: long time now, and it's weird seeing he's per inspected

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Speaker 3: from his side.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I really like it. I like him a lot,

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Speaker 2: and so we'll talk to him coming up in just

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Speaker 2: a second. As we hop in to episode five O eight,

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Speaker 2: I was watching Speaking of TikTok, was watching clips from

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Speaker 2: your podcast, Mike Movie Mike's Movie Podcast, and I am

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Speaker 2: fascinated and have been fascinated with the Oklahoma City bombing.

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Speaker 3: I'm like so into That's kind of how I learned

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Speaker 3: about it. I just watched the Netflix documentary that just

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Speaker 3: came out.

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Speaker 2: Oh there is one, yeah, I saw so that's why

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Speaker 2: I saw you talking to I didn't know that was

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Speaker 2: on Netflix.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, director of the documentary, the director of it.

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Speaker 3: Because I was too young when it happened. I don't

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Speaker 3: really remember it, and watching that documentary is me learning

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Speaker 3: all the details for the first time.

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Speaker 1: Age Flex, I hear you, age Flex.

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Speaker 2: That story is crazy because there's like eight avenues of crazy,

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Speaker 2: meaning you could go there out of who really was he?

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Speaker 1: Who are they working for? There's all that. There's also

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Speaker 1: just how it was caught that's wild.

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Speaker 3: It was also crazy that when they didn't know it

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Speaker 3: was him, they started accusing other people. They were like, oh,

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Speaker 3: we saw Middle Eastern people coming out of that a building.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it doesn't it show I mean, and that stuff

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Speaker 1: still happening to It just shows like.

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Speaker 3: Even back in the nineties, like that was just there.

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Speaker 2: And in the nineties there was nobody to speak out

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Speaker 2: against it because there wasn't social media or other forms

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Speaker 2: of tell or other or eighty networks to go, hey,

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Speaker 2: we don't think that's right. There were like three channels,

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Speaker 2: four channels. But so the bomb goes off, it's not

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Speaker 2: a spoiler because it's a relevant in the history. The

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Speaker 2: bomb goes off and the guy who set the bombs

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Speaker 2: drives away and his license plate the explosion actually shook

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Speaker 2: the car somebody, his license plate fell to the ground

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Speaker 2: and that they found the license plate.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and he was driving like seventy miles from there,

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Speaker 3: got pulled over for another for.

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Speaker 2: Reason, Yeah, because he had no license plate, not because

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Speaker 2: they were like that's the guy they And then he

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Speaker 2: had a gun on him and no license plate. So

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Speaker 2: they put him in jail, but not because of the bombing.

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Speaker 2: And then he's in jail the whole time, and they're

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Speaker 2: looking for, like you said, a Middle Eastern guy. They're

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Speaker 2: looking for all these fake and he's sitting right there

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Speaker 2: in prison. It's a all. It's tragic, it's sad, and

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Speaker 2: he almost got ahead of.

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Speaker 3: Jail, like he was in court. They were like a

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Speaker 3: better let this guy go, Like wait a minute, yep.

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Speaker 2: So go check out Movie Mike's Movie podcast. I would

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Speaker 2: say if you love movies, it's a great podcast obviously,

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Speaker 2: but even if you want to learn more about that,

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Speaker 2: because you're talking with the director of that project.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, one of the retired FBI agents who was there

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Speaker 3: rescuing people.

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Speaker 2: I went to the building across the street because I

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Speaker 2: went and toward the whole thing, and so went up

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Speaker 2: and there's audio of from the building across the street

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Speaker 2: as they're having a city a town hall meeting because

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Speaker 2: they record all the town hall meetings, and you hear

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Speaker 2: it in the town hall meeting how loud the explosion

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Speaker 2: was to the people across the street.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: I didn't realize how massive the destruction was too.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: So, and again there are a lot of conspiracy lanes

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Speaker 2: to travel down if you choose.

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Speaker 1: But that's everything.

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Speaker 2: But yeah, you're right, check out that on Movie Mike's

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Speaker 2: Movie Podcast. And not so much just a plug about

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Speaker 2: Mike's podcast, which is great, but I'm super interested in that.

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Speaker 2: I'm super interested in songwriters and especially the viewpoints of songwriters,

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Speaker 2: which is what Troy does. He brings on others and

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Speaker 2: they have talks, and so this is my talk with him.

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Speaker 2: This is Troy Cartwright and again the ten year Town podcast.

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Speaker 2: I love it. Here's the episode. Enjoy Troy.

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Speaker 1: Good to see you, Good to see you. How you

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Speaker 1: I don't know, it's kind of like that, I don't know. Good.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, My days I think are layered a bit different

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Speaker 2: than yours. Yeah, just from the waking up part, right,

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Speaker 2: So I think we're When people ask me that question,

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Speaker 2: it's often like how you doing, I'm like, you know,

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Speaker 2: I think it's I'm at a different stage of my day,

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Speaker 2: so it's relative to what stage of the day you

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Speaker 2: know you're in.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 2: I was gonna say before, I really like you, by

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Speaker 2: the way, and we spent time on your podcast, and

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Speaker 2: I definitely want to talk about that. Yeah, I didn't

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Speaker 2: know you, but i'd seen ten Yuretown on TikTok, saw

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Speaker 2: the clips. Yeah, and really had a great time on

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Speaker 2: your podcast, and I hope it was well received and

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Speaker 2: very You have to say that, so I don't want

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Speaker 2: you to say it. You have to say it. It's

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Speaker 2: an obligation to say that. But yeah, you do a

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Speaker 2: great job. And I left going man, that was fun

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Speaker 2: for me because I didn't feel like I had to

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Speaker 2: do what I feel like I often have to do,

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Speaker 2: which is take controls. So it's not a dude, and

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Speaker 2: I'm not right when I do that, but I didn't

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Speaker 2: have to do that with you.

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Speaker 1: You owned it.

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Speaker 2: And I hope people hear this and go, wow, maybe

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Speaker 2: if this interview is not terrible, I'll go check out

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Speaker 2: Troy's podcast.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so, how are you enjoying that? I'm loving it still.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah. It's one of those things right where if

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Speaker 1: I would have known how hard it was when I started,

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Speaker 1: I'm not sure I would have done it. That's this

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Speaker 1: whole career too.

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Speaker 2: I mean that's a microcosm for everything, this whole freaking city.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. So it's been a lot of work, but it's

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Speaker 1: you know, it's been really rewarding and I you know,

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Speaker 1: I enjoy getting to like to tell the stories, you know,

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Speaker 1: and I like talking to people. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: I think you like what people should like about podcasting

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Speaker 2: because I feel like you pay attention, you care, you

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Speaker 2: are interested and curious, like you have all the things

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Speaker 2: that I think I wish I cared about. Where I'm

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Speaker 2: just like, ah, god, it's a lot to say, and

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Speaker 2: there's another human in the room, and let's just see

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Speaker 2: what happens. Like That's what I liked about, because you're

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Speaker 2: very warm. I'll come back to the podcast. I wanted

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Speaker 2: to lead with that, though, because I do feel that way,

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Speaker 2: and I know we've texted on once. Yeah, once or twice,

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Speaker 2: But I wanted to say that at the beginning, so

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Speaker 2: I didn't forget.

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Speaker 1: But thank you.

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Speaker 2: What I didn't know a lot about as far as

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Speaker 2: your career was your music.

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Speaker 1: You're writing.

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Speaker 2: I knew you from doing the podcast, but I knew

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Speaker 2: you did the podcast because you were also a writer,

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Speaker 2: but I didn't really know what that story was. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: I'm seeing now on TikTok because I'm a psycho super

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Speaker 2: fan of yours.

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Speaker 1: Are you writing again?

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Speaker 2: Are you now writing and making content with what you're writing?

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Speaker 1: Because I'm seeing content? Yeah, So where are you in

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Speaker 1: that stage? Uh? So I am writing every day? Have

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Speaker 1: you always been writing every day? I've been writing every

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Speaker 1: day more or less since I moved to Nashville eight

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Speaker 1: years ago, almost nine years ago. Now I'm coming up

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Speaker 1: on the title of my podcast. You know, so some

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Speaker 1: Some's got a break soon.

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Speaker 2: You're about to be a millionaire then, because if you

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Speaker 2: make it ten years, you're automatically a Millionaire's how it works.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, So I'm writing all the time, and I

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Speaker 1: have been working towards a new record for my my

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Speaker 1: artist project, and you know, in addition to that, I

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Speaker 1: am writing songs for other people.

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Speaker 2: So is that why I'm seeing you do you in

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Speaker 2: music content? Because you're working on you? Yeah, that would

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Speaker 2: make sense. Yeah, it's because.

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Speaker 1: If you're.

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Speaker 2: Writing and you have a publishing deal, you're writing independent

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Speaker 2: whatever you're doing, and you're writing for other people or

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Speaker 2: you're writing to be pitched, you're probably not putting a

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Speaker 2: lot of that content.

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Speaker 1: On social media. It makes sense if you're doing your

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Speaker 1: own project. Yes, and it is, you know it. It's

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Speaker 1: a it's a it's quite a long story and I'm

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Speaker 1: happy to go into it if you podcast wants stretch it,

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Speaker 1: string it. But it's kind of like what we talked

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Speaker 1: about on when you came on my podcast about like

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Speaker 1: there's this opportunity with making content, you know, which is

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Speaker 1: like the buzzword of the day, where you can really

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Speaker 1: get heard, you know, you can get discovered, you can

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Speaker 1: reach people, and when you're writing and making songs you're

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Speaker 1: trying to you hope that it can mean something to somebody.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, the environment is very different and also the same

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Speaker 2: in the way of what's great about now is the

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Speaker 2: finger quote gatekeepers have far less control. Yeah, but the

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Speaker 2: finger quote gatekeepers are now an algorithm.

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Speaker 1: That right, you don't even know who they are.

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Speaker 2: Well, at least you kind of knew the devil you

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Speaker 2: were dancing with before. H But the freedom now is

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Speaker 2: is that you have it, and it just takes the

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Speaker 2: right thing at the right time and the right algorithm

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Speaker 2: looking for the.

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Speaker 1: Right yeah, for it to hit right. There's something I

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Speaker 1: heard one time about like increasing your your luck surface

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Speaker 1: area so you you still got it. Like if you

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Speaker 1: go if you want to go viral, you know, it

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Speaker 1: takes a lot of luck, but can be more tries

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Speaker 1: lead to more luck. And that's hard work. And and

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Speaker 1: I've had, you know, some stuff go really viral.

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Speaker 2: What's really viral to a few reels last few years

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Speaker 2: define a number.

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Speaker 1: I think when I posted That's why, which was trying

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Speaker 1: to think if it was twenty three or twenty two.

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Speaker 1: I think it was twenty two. I posted it right

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Speaker 1: before Valentine's Day, and I went to bed. It wouldn't post.

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Speaker 2: It was weird it like I love. I went to

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Speaker 2: bed story and wake up and it was big. It's

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Speaker 2: like a Bailey's Donement type days. It was happening for

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Speaker 2: so many people.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, but literally, yeah, I posted this thing and I

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Speaker 1: was uncomfortable. I was singing to my camera, you know,

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Speaker 1: not really my it's really my vibe. Yeah, it feels

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Speaker 1: a little goofy. Yeah. I went to bed. I think

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Speaker 1: that one was many hundreds of thousands, if not close

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Speaker 1: to a million. The next day. The next day, and

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Speaker 1: I had just gotten dropped from my record deal, so

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Speaker 1: it was like, okay, here we go. You know, I

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Speaker 1: was right, Are you a god guy? Yeah? Yeah, in

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Speaker 1: my own way.

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Speaker 2: Yes, And and I and I think it's a great

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Speaker 2: answer in your own way, yes, because I am in

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Speaker 2: my own way as well.

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Speaker 1: I think we all are and we have our own.

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Speaker 2: Different But did that was that ever part of it

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Speaker 2: where it's like something It didn't have to be a

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Speaker 2: god thing, something bigger just showed me that whatever I

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Speaker 2: lost in that, hey you've now been dropped, that maybe it's.

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Speaker 1: Not all lost. What did that happen at all?

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Speaker 2: With you?

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Speaker 1: Yeah? You know, there's this. There's this quote I really

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Speaker 1: like that says opportunity is a strange beast that frequently

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Speaker 1: appears after a loss. And I and that has been

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Speaker 1: true for me a lot of times. And it was

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Speaker 1: it was an interesting time because I was dealing with

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Speaker 1: sort of a little bit of an identity crisis because

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Speaker 1: ever since I when I first moved to town, I

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Speaker 1: had some momentum coming when I came here from Texas,

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Speaker 1: momentum based on what based on some music I had

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Speaker 1: put out. And this was very very like, you know,

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Speaker 1: comparatively small, but it was there was something bubbling up

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Speaker 1: and I was doing something that I think, you know,

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Speaker 1: somebody somebody liked, and that your artist.

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Speaker 2: You're you're sick because you have different versions of your career. Yes,

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Speaker 2: I have performance, got it?

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Speaker 1: Yeah? Yes, I have kind of a songwriting an artist

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Speaker 1: and and now a podcast. You gotta do you want to.

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Speaker 2: Final like I'm five at times? Okay, So you move

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Speaker 2: here with some momentum, yes, based on your performance correct

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Speaker 2: performing I had started.

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Speaker 1: Up until that point, I was just living in Dallas, writing,

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Speaker 1: you know, in in my bedroom basically, and I had

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Speaker 1: made a record and I had put part of that

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Speaker 1: record out and somebody that worked as like an independent

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Speaker 1: radio promoter invited me. They said, you should come to

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Speaker 1: Nashville and you should meet some people. So that's how

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Speaker 1: I met a publisher named Jake Gear and then he

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Speaker 1: set me up on some co writs. Blah blah blah.

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Speaker 1: Like a year later, I moved to Nashville and I

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Speaker 1: got on the radar of somebody at the label and

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Speaker 1: they signed me. It happened pretty quick, you know, I

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Speaker 1: got I got a record deal, and that was that

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Speaker 1: was a dream at the time. It was a dream

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Speaker 1: come true.

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Speaker 2: It happened so quick that you didn't really got the

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Speaker 2: eyes and cross the t's and or even understand that

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Speaker 2: that was a thing.

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Speaker 1: You know, I've been thinking about this a little bit.

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Speaker 1: It's it was a perfectly fine deal. Yeah I was.

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Speaker 2: I'm not insinuating it was lu Pearlman shady right right right, Uh,

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Speaker 2: it was.

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Speaker 1: There's a lot of things looking back on that I

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Speaker 1: wasn't thinking about. Part of that was just like what

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Speaker 1: do I want to sound like? What do I want

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Speaker 1: to say? How old are you? I was twenty six.

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Speaker 2: You're just starting at that age to figure out what

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Speaker 2: You're just starting to figure out.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, you don't even know what you ask

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Speaker 1: to that crisis. I understand the cirl. Okay, so what

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Speaker 1: happens is you come to town. Here I go from writing.

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Speaker 1: I was very rigid with my schedule when I when

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Speaker 1: I was writing by myself, I woke up every day,

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Speaker 1: I started writing at eleven, and I wrote until two

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Speaker 1: or three in the afternoon every day. So when I

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Speaker 1: moved to Nashville, Okay, now I'm getting set up on

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Speaker 1: these co writes, and I'm writing with people, and now

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Speaker 1: there's these things called track guys. So now you're getting

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Speaker 1: like these almost basically you're ending the day with a

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Speaker 1: song that kind of sounds like a record, but you're

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Speaker 1: you're going through you know, maybe one hundred different combinations

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Speaker 1: of writers. So so over time, when you don't know

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Speaker 1: exactly what you want to say and what you want

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Speaker 1: to sound like, you can strangely lose your voice in

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Speaker 1: the in that process. Mind me up.

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Speaker 2: And it's not exactly the same that quote if you

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Speaker 2: don't stand for something, you'll stand for anything, Yeah, And

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Speaker 2: it's that you aren't for sure, yeah, And you're around

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Speaker 2: a lot of other people who kind of bar for sure,

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Speaker 2: and so you're kind of pulled in directions of what

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Speaker 2: you think might be the thing that works.

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Speaker 1: No doubt, And and what happens is then you get

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Speaker 1: a record deal. Well they're geniuses, they know, so I

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Speaker 1: want to do what they say. You know, I want

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Speaker 1: to be you know, I like, I want to be

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Speaker 1: a good artist and well liked and I'm a people pleaser.

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Speaker 1: So all of these things. It's nothing, nothing nefarious is happening.

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Speaker 1: It's just it start, it starts to slant towards the middle,

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Speaker 1: you know, and then I'm making music that sounds like

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Speaker 1: the radio, which is cool, but lost your edge though.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, the things that got you here you no longer

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Speaker 2: have one because you're now here and you're trying to

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Speaker 2: sound like here, which is very easy to do because yeah,

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Speaker 2: same anybody that moves to town and you're around quote

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Speaker 2: these geniuses, Yeah they're just us.

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Speaker 1: And when they moved here, they saw the geniuses. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: It's almost a cycle that everybody goes through, and you

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Speaker 2: have to do it wrong in order to fully understand

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Speaker 2: that no one's ever right.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, nobody knows anything. You just you do. Eventually have

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Speaker 1: to get back to a place where you go like,

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Speaker 1: what do I what do, I want to say, you know,

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Speaker 1: and and part of that is just learning the lessons

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Speaker 1: of taking the hits, you know. I mean, that's that's

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Speaker 1: a big part of it. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: To me, it was if I'm going to fail, because

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Speaker 2: I've already failed a bunch of times here doing different things,

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Speaker 2: at least I want to fail doing it my way,

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Speaker 2: because at least that feels like I honestly failed.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and there's something there's a real truth to.

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Speaker 2: Success or failure when it's your truth, because you know

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Speaker 2: it's genuine either way. Where if I you know, there

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Speaker 2: were times my first couple of years here, I was hated.

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Speaker 2: I was hated because I was way different. So at

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Speaker 2: times I would manipulate or modify and it wouldn't go well.

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Speaker 2: And it got to the point where it was, if

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Speaker 2: it's not gonna go well, I'd rather it not go

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Speaker 2: well with me being exactly me, because then I know

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Speaker 2: it's me, it's not whatever I'm chasing.

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Speaker 1: Do you feel like you were you were modifying yourself

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Speaker 1: to like fit into like some mold that you thought

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Speaker 1: it was supposed to fit into.

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Speaker 2: My situations, as similar as it was to yours, was

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Speaker 2: different in that.

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Speaker 1: Mine was genuine I hate you.

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Speaker 2: The word hatred, it would I would say uneducated hatred

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Speaker 2: from the industry because I was so different in the

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Speaker 2: industry is a big evil man that doesn't have a face.

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Speaker 2: It's like when people can complain about the rady and

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Speaker 2: I'm not mister fight for radio either, but it's like

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Speaker 2: radio just won't. That's not a thing, right, It's so

360
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Speaker 2: when I say that. So it was an uneducated hatred

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Speaker 2: toward me because I was different and I challenged norms

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Speaker 2: and norms that felt comfortable then felt threatened, and after

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Speaker 2: a long time of it being difficult for me, I thought,

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Speaker 2: what can I do to make this not so difficult

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Speaker 2: for me? So it wasn't that I was going, I'm

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Speaker 2: going to do this to get better because I have

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Speaker 2: confidence in that area, but it was this sucks, like

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Speaker 2: I'm having articles written that aren't true about me, and

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Speaker 2: like local music industry magazines, I'm having four or five

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Speaker 2: different type of of of deal and I'm like, you

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Speaker 2: know what, I'm just I'm going to lose some of

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Speaker 2: my edge, so some of that edge is not given

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Speaker 2: back to me. So the parallels are from your story

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Speaker 2: of mine are similar, but the same thing it still.

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Speaker 1: Didn't go well. Once I changed and got a little softer.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I was like, I'm just gonna be me and

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Speaker 2: then if I fail, at least the truth is I

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Speaker 2: failed because I failed with with who I was totally.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. You you almost think it's gonna be easier because

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Speaker 1: you give in to what you think you're supposed to do,

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Speaker 1: but the you know, the end result is uh. I

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Speaker 1: was just I was becoming very dissatisfied. I was waking

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Speaker 1: up and looking in the mirror and being like, I'm

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Speaker 1: not this feels out of sync.

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Speaker 4: Let's take a quick pause for a message from our sponsor,

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Speaker 4: and we're back on the Bobby Cast.

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Speaker 1: I bek you're losing yourself. Yeah, because what happens is

388
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Speaker 1: you are surrounded by the system that is holding you

389
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Speaker 1: are constantly standing in comparison to the most successful artists

390
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Speaker 1: on the planet, and that is really hard because you

391
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Speaker 1: are not aware of all the things that they had

392
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Speaker 1: to do to get there. You're just on your first

393
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Speaker 1: six months of your record deal contract and you're trying

394
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Speaker 1: to figure out, like why you're not selling out a

395
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Speaker 1: stadium yet. You know you've got to kind of like, okay,

396
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Speaker 1: well I'm going to reverse engineer this and try and

397
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Speaker 1: sound like this. And it's not even always intentional, it's

398
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Speaker 1: just sort of the way that the like I said,

399
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Speaker 1: the table is slanted towards the middle, so you just

400
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Speaker 1: kind of end up making stuff that is palatable to

401
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Speaker 1: this this middle. But in the in the process, you know,

402
00:20:50,640 --> 00:20:57,719
Speaker 1: I lost me in there, and that is you know,

403
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Speaker 1: it sucked and it was hard, and then it all

404
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Speaker 1: went away and that was hard.

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Speaker 2: So and that was my next question. Did it take

406
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Speaker 2: it all going away for you to realize nothing to lose,

407
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Speaker 2: got to get back, got to get back on my track?

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Speaker 1: Yeah? So, I mean it was so out of the

409
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Speaker 1: blue to me when they when they dropped you, Oh,

410
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Speaker 1: you had no idea it was coming, no idea I had.

411
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Speaker 1: I had a record coming out. It wasn't even out

412
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Speaker 1: yet when that happened, which which you know, what's the call?

413
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Speaker 1: What's that call? Then?

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Speaker 2: Uh, it's it's it's an ep No, no, no, what's

415
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Speaker 2: the call? When they call you or they in your

416
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Speaker 2: oh what's the call? What do they say to you?

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Speaker 2: Because that sounds like, yeah, well that's when something is underperforming.

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Speaker 1: But what's interesting is that no one ever called me, oh,

419
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Speaker 1: you're still signed. You have no idea, but you're still signed. Yeah,

420
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Speaker 1: my my manager, you were never dropped. Yeah, it's just

421
00:21:54,119 --> 00:21:56,840
Speaker 1: in Yeah. My manager asked me to go to lunch.

422
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Speaker 1: I was not writing that day.

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Speaker 2: Uh.

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Speaker 1: It was like a Monday or a Tuesday. We went

425
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Speaker 1: over to uh Ed Lee's in twelve South and we

426
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Speaker 1: were sitting outside on the patio and and he was like, look,

427
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Speaker 1: I had to tell you something and it's not good.

428
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Speaker 1: Oh God, And yeah, I mean, you know, I still

429
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Speaker 1: remember it.

430
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Speaker 2: What was his explanation? What was the justification? Because they

431
00:22:18,800 --> 00:22:22,720
Speaker 2: obviously saw something in you? Yeah, and then they didn't.

432
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Speaker 2: So something happened in the middle where Yeah, was there

433
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Speaker 2: a change in any sort of executive.

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Speaker 1: You know, I don't know. And and I've I've since

435
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Speaker 1: seen some of those those people, and and I've I've

436
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Speaker 1: asked the question many times, uh, you know from my manager,

437
00:22:41,960 --> 00:22:44,199
Speaker 1: and I don't know that there ever was like a

438
00:22:44,200 --> 00:22:47,720
Speaker 1: great answer, a great answer or a satisfying answer. Uh.

439
00:22:47,720 --> 00:22:51,120
Speaker 1: And the answer may just be like it came from

440
00:22:51,320 --> 00:22:54,440
Speaker 1: on high that they're spending this many dollars and they

441
00:22:54,440 --> 00:22:57,480
Speaker 1: need to spend this many dollars, Like I don't know,

442
00:22:59,760 --> 00:23:03,040
Speaker 1: but but yeah, it just it just it went away,

443
00:23:03,200 --> 00:23:05,080
Speaker 1: you know, And did you lose confidence?

444
00:23:06,640 --> 00:23:06,760
Speaker 2: Uh?

445
00:23:07,320 --> 00:23:13,879
Speaker 1: I had to. I had a really uh high wire

446
00:23:14,680 --> 00:23:19,240
Speaker 1: to walk because my record was still the songs that

447
00:23:19,240 --> 00:23:22,680
Speaker 1: I had done were still planning on coming out, even

448
00:23:22,680 --> 00:23:25,399
Speaker 1: though they had told me that they weren't going to

449
00:23:27,640 --> 00:23:30,000
Speaker 1: that they weren't going to move forward after that, so they.

450
00:23:29,920 --> 00:23:31,040
Speaker 2: Were going to put it out, but they were going

451
00:23:31,119 --> 00:23:33,280
Speaker 2: to put any money into promotion of it. Yeah.

452
00:23:33,280 --> 00:23:34,520
Speaker 1: It was sort of one of those things where like,

453
00:23:35,000 --> 00:23:39,160
Speaker 1: but maybe, hey, maybe if something happened to catch, then

454
00:23:39,160 --> 00:23:40,840
Speaker 1: maybe we're not going to best anything in it.

455
00:23:40,840 --> 00:23:43,320
Speaker 2: But if it happens to catch, yeah, so so now

456
00:23:43,480 --> 00:23:45,960
Speaker 2: so now I'm faced with this situation where I'm promoting

457
00:23:46,000 --> 00:23:46,640
Speaker 2: a record.

458
00:23:47,800 --> 00:23:52,840
Speaker 1: I'm my mask right is is full of of confidence

459
00:23:52,920 --> 00:23:57,800
Speaker 1: and and doing like some press stuff, you know. But

460
00:23:57,840 --> 00:24:02,360
Speaker 1: I'm just defeated, and I'm just waking up every morning wondering,

461
00:24:02,480 --> 00:24:05,120
Speaker 1: like what I'm gonna do for the rest of my life.

462
00:24:05,119 --> 00:24:07,880
Speaker 1: I mean, you think it's over, You think you think

463
00:24:07,880 --> 00:24:09,200
Speaker 1: that your dream is dead.

464
00:24:09,560 --> 00:24:11,719
Speaker 2: Did you have some money that to get you through

465
00:24:11,760 --> 00:24:14,439
Speaker 2: for a few months?

466
00:24:15,040 --> 00:24:17,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, I had a publishing deal. Okay, so you're still

467
00:24:17,640 --> 00:24:21,320
Speaker 1: writing in a pay Yeah, And then I knew that

468
00:24:21,400 --> 00:24:24,720
Speaker 1: when the so I basically didn't tell anyone, even though

469
00:24:24,760 --> 00:24:27,399
Speaker 1: I knew, I didn't tell anybody for like four months.

470
00:24:27,440 --> 00:24:30,359
Speaker 1: So that was very, very lonely because I didn't want

471
00:24:30,400 --> 00:24:35,560
Speaker 1: to say something. And then and then it changed, and

472
00:24:35,760 --> 00:24:38,280
Speaker 1: I wanted. I was worried that people wouldn't want to

473
00:24:38,280 --> 00:24:40,320
Speaker 1: write with me anymore if I wasn't as signed artist.

474
00:24:40,560 --> 00:24:43,280
Speaker 1: So I was like, I'm gonna let this play out

475
00:24:43,320 --> 00:24:45,439
Speaker 1: for as long as I can before I have to

476
00:24:45,760 --> 00:24:51,760
Speaker 1: say something, so you know it. It It went on,

477
00:24:52,080 --> 00:24:54,600
Speaker 1: and then the new year happened. I think this was

478
00:24:54,640 --> 00:24:59,160
Speaker 1: turning into twenty twenty two, and uh, and then by

479
00:24:59,200 --> 00:25:03,680
Speaker 1: publishing deal also went away, you know, and then you're

480
00:25:03,720 --> 00:25:07,240
Speaker 1: really faced with like, oh man, what am I gonna do?

481
00:25:08,000 --> 00:25:11,359
Speaker 1: You know? Somebody has I had this jinga tower and

482
00:25:11,400 --> 00:25:14,800
Speaker 1: somebody somebody kicked it over, you know, and I've got

483
00:25:14,840 --> 00:25:18,879
Speaker 1: to rebuild it. And then I thought I had a

484
00:25:19,000 --> 00:25:22,399
Speaker 1: single on an artist as a writer. I thought I

485
00:25:22,440 --> 00:25:26,960
Speaker 1: had their next single and got a call that that

486
00:25:27,160 --> 00:25:32,600
Speaker 1: wasn't happening. And that day is the day that I thought, well,

487
00:25:32,640 --> 00:25:34,919
Speaker 1: I got absolutely nothing to lose at this point, and

488
00:25:34,960 --> 00:25:37,960
Speaker 1: I sang this song called That's Why into my phone

489
00:25:38,480 --> 00:25:43,040
Speaker 1: and posted it and went to bed, and then you know,

490
00:25:43,440 --> 00:25:46,280
Speaker 1: it blew up and then my and then my life

491
00:25:47,200 --> 00:25:47,840
Speaker 1: changed again.

492
00:25:48,240 --> 00:25:52,040
Speaker 2: You know, the timeline of you being told that's not

493
00:25:52,080 --> 00:25:54,400
Speaker 2: going to be a single, but it's still cut by

494
00:25:54,400 --> 00:25:58,080
Speaker 2: the artist, so it's not gonna be the single. The

495
00:25:58,119 --> 00:26:01,560
Speaker 2: timeline of being told that and recording this was was.

496
00:26:01,640 --> 00:26:03,639
Speaker 1: What the song was recorded?

497
00:26:03,760 --> 00:26:05,760
Speaker 2: No, no, no, I'm trying to figure out when you're

498
00:26:05,760 --> 00:26:08,280
Speaker 2: told it's not the single anymore. And that's crushing because

499
00:26:08,760 --> 00:26:11,320
Speaker 2: that's where the money is. Yeah, So when you record

500
00:26:11,359 --> 00:26:13,479
Speaker 2: a song into your phone, is it same? You say

501
00:26:13,640 --> 00:26:15,560
Speaker 2: the same day, week and week?

502
00:26:15,800 --> 00:26:18,520
Speaker 1: Uh, I'm not. I'm not sure. I'm totally understanding the question.

503
00:26:18,600 --> 00:26:20,480
Speaker 1: Are you talking about this? I'm calling you right now.

504
00:26:20,600 --> 00:26:23,159
Speaker 2: Hey, I'm artist, I'm I'm Jimmy Jams, and we're not

505
00:26:23,280 --> 00:26:26,080
Speaker 2: I'm not cutting your song as a single and you're

506
00:26:26,119 --> 00:26:26,800
Speaker 2: now heartbroken.

507
00:26:26,840 --> 00:26:30,040
Speaker 1: When do you record the song that goes viral? Okay? Gotcha?

508
00:26:30,160 --> 00:26:35,480
Speaker 1: So the song that went viral I had I had

509
00:26:35,480 --> 00:26:37,800
Speaker 1: written just with some friends of mine, so it was

510
00:26:37,840 --> 00:26:40,679
Speaker 1: like it was like a demo. Uh, and I just

511
00:26:41,760 --> 00:26:43,760
Speaker 1: that's what I posted was just it was like a

512
00:26:43,800 --> 00:26:47,359
Speaker 1: piano vocal It wasn't even you singing. It was me singing.

513
00:26:47,400 --> 00:26:49,640
Speaker 1: But it wasn't like the fool. It wasn't a full

514
00:26:49,680 --> 00:26:53,320
Speaker 1: on record, right, I was it that night? Uh? That song?

515
00:26:53,560 --> 00:26:54,960
Speaker 1: I don't know. It was a few months old. No,

516
00:26:55,080 --> 00:26:56,840
Speaker 1: the song, the song had just been sitting with me.

517
00:26:57,320 --> 00:27:01,320
Speaker 2: I'm not asking the question right from being told you're

518
00:27:01,359 --> 00:27:03,320
Speaker 2: not the single to you getting on your phone and

519
00:27:03,359 --> 00:27:04,600
Speaker 2: recording that on TikTok.

520
00:27:05,240 --> 00:27:10,800
Speaker 1: Different songs, correct, Yeah, yeah, but what what's the what's

521
00:27:10,840 --> 00:27:12,760
Speaker 1: the time difference in them going up? This is not

522
00:27:12,800 --> 00:27:14,720
Speaker 1: a single, and you're going, okay, screwed, I'm just gonna

523
00:27:14,720 --> 00:27:18,240
Speaker 1: sing on TikTok two hours? That is my point.

524
00:27:18,440 --> 00:27:21,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, that was exactly what I was leading it up too,

525
00:27:22,200 --> 00:27:25,360
Speaker 2: freaking hours. Yeah, and that's I think that's also why

526
00:27:25,359 --> 00:27:29,879
Speaker 2: I was so confusing, because that's almost like alien abnormal.

527
00:27:29,400 --> 00:27:33,000
Speaker 1: Type stuff totally doesn't make sense, doesn't make sense, doesn't

528
00:27:33,040 --> 00:27:33,520
Speaker 1: make sense.

529
00:27:33,640 --> 00:27:36,320
Speaker 2: So you record it, Yeah, you go to bed, you

530
00:27:36,359 --> 00:27:38,439
Speaker 2: wake up, you're like, well how about that? Well I

531
00:27:38,440 --> 00:27:42,240
Speaker 2: guess like this what happens then? Does anybody like slide

532
00:27:42,280 --> 00:27:45,119
Speaker 2: into the DMS to go, hey, I like your sound,

533
00:27:45,320 --> 00:27:46,840
Speaker 2: or do you let it build for a again?

534
00:27:46,880 --> 00:27:52,000
Speaker 1: Because it doesn't just stop right. So at that point

535
00:27:52,200 --> 00:27:55,120
Speaker 1: I was like, all right, I gotta put this song out. Yea, yeah,

536
00:27:55,160 --> 00:27:57,119
Speaker 1: there's some like logistical things I gotta figure out to

537
00:27:57,160 --> 00:28:00,720
Speaker 1: do that. Maybe maybe three weeks later the song out

538
00:28:01,040 --> 00:28:05,080
Speaker 1: far and away like the biggest release of my career.

539
00:28:05,200 --> 00:28:10,359
Speaker 1: Did it stream dude like crazy? It was like you

540
00:28:10,400 --> 00:28:14,199
Speaker 1: know iTunes downloads, It was on the it was on

541
00:28:14,240 --> 00:28:16,479
Speaker 1: the chart. I mean, it was the thing I'd always

542
00:28:16,560 --> 00:28:21,760
Speaker 1: dreamed of happening, and here it is happening to me

543
00:28:22,000 --> 00:28:23,959
Speaker 1: and I and I owned it all. I mean that

544
00:28:24,040 --> 00:28:26,040
Speaker 1: was that was the craziest part. If this would have

545
00:28:26,119 --> 00:28:29,600
Speaker 1: happened six months earlier, it would have been it still

546
00:28:29,600 --> 00:28:34,119
Speaker 1: would have been life changing, but it was. It was

547
00:28:34,200 --> 00:28:38,560
Speaker 1: life changing to me financially when it happened, because it

548
00:28:38,880 --> 00:28:41,800
Speaker 1: I was, as we've just been over, like, I was

549
00:28:41,840 --> 00:28:46,760
Speaker 1: not necessarily in a great position to uh to uh

550
00:28:46,840 --> 00:28:49,720
Speaker 1: have a career in the music industry at that point,

551
00:28:49,760 --> 00:28:50,960
Speaker 1: What did you think your options were?

552
00:28:51,000 --> 00:28:52,920
Speaker 2: As soon as they said hey, because it feels like

553
00:28:53,320 --> 00:28:56,360
Speaker 2: your last life draft at that time was the single

554
00:28:56,400 --> 00:28:58,800
Speaker 2: that was probably going to be cut by artists, Well,

555
00:28:58,920 --> 00:29:01,480
Speaker 2: what did you think your option were once they said

556
00:29:01,480 --> 00:29:02,360
Speaker 2: that wasn't happening.

557
00:29:03,120 --> 00:29:06,400
Speaker 1: I think I'd gone through the thought work of being

558
00:29:07,680 --> 00:29:12,400
Speaker 1: so low for so long. You have moving home, No,

559
00:29:12,520 --> 00:29:18,400
Speaker 1: I didn't because my wife, I very vividly remember, we

560
00:29:18,440 --> 00:29:22,680
Speaker 1: went out to Utah. We went to like, what's the

561
00:29:22,680 --> 00:29:24,320
Speaker 1: one with the I think it's called Arches. I was

562
00:29:24,320 --> 00:29:27,880
Speaker 1: gonna say the one with the arches, but Arches? And uh,

563
00:29:28,000 --> 00:29:30,600
Speaker 1: you drive from Salt Lake, it's like a four hour drive.

564
00:29:31,080 --> 00:29:34,840
Speaker 1: And I was like, look, I don't know, like, I

565
00:29:34,880 --> 00:29:36,400
Speaker 1: don't know, I don't know if I can keep doing this,

566
00:29:36,640 --> 00:29:39,280
Speaker 1: Like I I don't know if I have it in

567
00:29:39,320 --> 00:29:44,959
Speaker 1: me to keep going. And uh. And she told me,

568
00:29:45,040 --> 00:29:47,960
Speaker 1: she was like, look, you're you're too good and you're

569
00:29:48,000 --> 00:29:50,720
Speaker 1: too close to give up. Now you you have to

570
00:29:50,800 --> 00:29:51,320
Speaker 1: keep going.

571
00:29:51,640 --> 00:29:53,840
Speaker 2: What's funny about you saying that is the fact that

572
00:29:53,840 --> 00:29:55,840
Speaker 2: she could see how close you were, but you felt

573
00:29:55,880 --> 00:29:59,680
Speaker 2: so far away at the exact same time.

574
00:30:00,160 --> 00:30:02,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, and and and there have been many times since

575
00:30:02,880 --> 00:30:08,160
Speaker 1: then where you know she's believed in me. You you

576
00:30:08,240 --> 00:30:13,240
Speaker 1: need you need that belief. I'm I'm so lucky to

577
00:30:13,360 --> 00:30:16,720
Speaker 1: have people in my in my life like that, and

578
00:30:16,720 --> 00:30:21,040
Speaker 1: and and ultimately, you know, you gotta believe in yourself

579
00:30:21,280 --> 00:30:23,120
Speaker 1: and that can be the hardest one. That can be

580
00:30:23,160 --> 00:30:24,920
Speaker 1: the hardest one to find of all. I think some

581
00:30:24,960 --> 00:30:30,160
Speaker 1: of it though, is that you look like Jesus. Get

582
00:30:30,200 --> 00:30:31,440
Speaker 1: It's like people are just like, you know what, the

583
00:30:31,480 --> 00:30:34,200
Speaker 1: guy looks like Jesus. Let's say, let's give a song

584
00:30:34,240 --> 00:30:37,680
Speaker 1: a stream. Yeah, I get, I get Jesus and uh

585
00:30:37,840 --> 00:30:43,440
Speaker 1: and diet Ryan heard a lot wish Yeah.

586
00:30:43,080 --> 00:30:46,000
Speaker 2: That's funny. I'm I'm really good friends of Ryan. I

587
00:30:46,000 --> 00:30:47,000
Speaker 2: was text about them last night.

588
00:30:47,120 --> 00:30:48,800
Speaker 1: Yeah. He just put out a record that's really good.

589
00:30:48,880 --> 00:30:51,600
Speaker 1: It's so great. Uh you wrote on did you write

590
00:30:51,640 --> 00:30:53,040
Speaker 1: in that one? I didn't write on that one. I

591
00:30:53,080 --> 00:30:55,080
Speaker 1: wrote in the one before. What'd you write for him before?

592
00:30:55,520 --> 00:30:56,200
Speaker 1: What are you drinking?

593
00:30:56,440 --> 00:30:58,600
Speaker 2: That's a good one too. I'm big Ryan fans, so yeah,

594
00:30:58,680 --> 00:31:01,320
Speaker 2: so same. I know all of ustuff just because we're friends.

595
00:31:01,320 --> 00:31:02,920
Speaker 2: And if I don't, he quiz me and then I'll

596
00:31:02,920 --> 00:31:03,440
Speaker 2: be a loser.

597
00:31:03,440 --> 00:31:06,360
Speaker 1: But that's a great song. Yeah.

598
00:31:06,680 --> 00:31:09,720
Speaker 2: So I was looking through some of the cuts Ryan

599
00:31:10,800 --> 00:31:18,080
Speaker 2: Don't don't don't don't tell me, okay, Cody Johnson, Yeah,

600
00:31:18,680 --> 00:31:19,560
Speaker 2: I don't know what was a song?

601
00:31:19,680 --> 00:31:21,960
Speaker 1: Wished it was you. It's some of the record that

602
00:31:22,040 --> 00:31:25,720
Speaker 1: just came out. How so not a single.

603
00:31:25,760 --> 00:31:30,120
Speaker 2: But how does Cody's albums, he's a big artist do well. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

604
00:31:30,240 --> 00:31:32,760
Speaker 2: And it's hard to make money if your song is

605
00:31:32,800 --> 00:31:35,320
Speaker 2: not a single. But are you are you seeing anything

606
00:31:35,360 --> 00:31:37,840
Speaker 2: off of that not being a single?

607
00:31:37,880 --> 00:31:39,640
Speaker 1: But because of Cody and Heed does stream so well,

608
00:31:40,320 --> 00:31:44,600
Speaker 1: I think I will. It's it's like for those people

609
00:31:44,640 --> 00:31:47,440
Speaker 1: that that don't know that there's a there's a long

610
00:31:47,520 --> 00:31:50,440
Speaker 1: there's a pretty a lot of lag time in between

611
00:31:50,720 --> 00:31:53,680
Speaker 1: when a song comes out. I think that record came

612
00:31:53,720 --> 00:31:57,200
Speaker 1: out in the fall, and so I haven't even seen

613
00:31:58,000 --> 00:32:02,560
Speaker 1: you know it had It'll be whatever June quarter is

614
00:32:02,880 --> 00:32:09,280
Speaker 1: before I see any other not Creed Nickelback, Nickelback, Yeah,

615
00:32:09,360 --> 00:32:13,800
Speaker 1: it's pretty crazy. That was a weird one. Please uh

616
00:32:15,360 --> 00:32:19,200
Speaker 1: long story short? I want I want long story mid

617
00:32:19,280 --> 00:32:23,920
Speaker 1: at least. Yeah. So I I my publisher at the time,

618
00:32:24,080 --> 00:32:28,560
Speaker 1: This guy named will Overton uh he uh was over

619
00:32:28,720 --> 00:32:31,920
Speaker 1: at Warner Chapel and he got an email from somebody

620
00:32:32,040 --> 00:32:35,760
Speaker 1: who was working with Nickelback and they were looking for songs.

621
00:32:36,520 --> 00:32:38,680
Speaker 1: I don't even remember what the prompt was. What the

622
00:32:38,720 --> 00:32:40,640
Speaker 1: prompt was was not what the song was about.

623
00:32:41,000 --> 00:32:43,800
Speaker 2: So you didn't have this song already to give them

624
00:32:43,880 --> 00:32:46,480
Speaker 2: they gave you the prompt for something they were looking

625
00:32:46,520 --> 00:32:48,080
Speaker 2: to have, so you went and wrote it.

626
00:32:48,600 --> 00:32:51,800
Speaker 1: No, the song was written. Somebody reached out to my

627
00:32:51,800 --> 00:32:54,680
Speaker 1: publisher and said, we're looking for songs like this, do

628
00:32:54,720 --> 00:32:57,400
Speaker 1: you have anything got it? So my publisher put together

629
00:32:58,280 --> 00:33:00,280
Speaker 1: a link of like I think it was a six

630
00:33:00,320 --> 00:33:02,640
Speaker 1: songs and just send it over. And this happens all

631
00:33:02,680 --> 00:33:05,640
Speaker 1: the time, and it never works. Never. It's like an audition.

632
00:33:05,760 --> 00:33:08,880
Speaker 1: It never happened. You never get the audition and projecting

633
00:33:08,880 --> 00:33:12,160
Speaker 1: because I never get the audition. Yeah, yeah, uh. And

634
00:33:12,240 --> 00:33:16,120
Speaker 1: I think it was probably six weeks later he gets

635
00:33:16,120 --> 00:33:22,240
Speaker 1: an email or a call and it says, hey, this song,

636
00:33:23,480 --> 00:33:28,360
Speaker 1: this is Chad's favorite song. He loves this song. And

637
00:33:28,720 --> 00:33:33,000
Speaker 1: so Will called me and told me that, and I'm like, okay,

638
00:33:33,800 --> 00:33:36,680
Speaker 1: like what what does this even mean? He's like, I

639
00:33:36,680 --> 00:33:38,840
Speaker 1: have no idea. Oh that was it.

640
00:33:38,880 --> 00:33:42,040
Speaker 2: There was no no other It was just his favorite song.

641
00:33:42,080 --> 00:33:43,120
Speaker 2: It's not like, hey, he's.

642
00:33:43,000 --> 00:33:44,720
Speaker 1: Gonna cut it. Hey Ha's cutting Yeah. I mean at

643
00:33:44,720 --> 00:33:46,600
Speaker 1: that point you're like, I think he's going to cut it. Yeah,

644
00:33:46,600 --> 00:33:48,360
Speaker 1: but it's just right now, just he likes it. He

645
00:33:48,520 --> 00:33:51,160
Speaker 1: likes it. Yeah, So all right, we're dancing we're at

646
00:33:51,160 --> 00:33:53,760
Speaker 1: the dance. It's a good spot to be. Two and

647
00:33:53,760 --> 00:33:57,080
Speaker 1: a half years ago, by holy so, I think I'm

648
00:33:57,520 --> 00:34:00,600
Speaker 1: you know, I've moved on. You know. I had this

649
00:34:00,600 --> 00:34:02,600
Speaker 1: this like jet ski in my mind that I was

650
00:34:02,640 --> 00:34:06,800
Speaker 1: going to buy with that money and and uh and uh,

651
00:34:07,120 --> 00:34:10,520
Speaker 1: you know that dream had died and then uh it

652
00:34:10,560 --> 00:34:15,319
Speaker 1: was Yeah, it was like after I was on the road.

653
00:34:15,360 --> 00:34:19,640
Speaker 1: I was driving back from a show in Houston, I think,

654
00:34:21,000 --> 00:34:24,719
Speaker 1: you know then like a Walmart and like, uh, little

655
00:34:24,800 --> 00:34:26,560
Speaker 1: rock or something, and I could just get a text

656
00:34:26,560 --> 00:34:30,080
Speaker 1: and it's the song the File Bady cut and they

657
00:34:30,080 --> 00:34:31,600
Speaker 1: sat the file had cut it, and then and he

658
00:34:31,840 --> 00:34:34,160
Speaker 1: and and Chad came in and like he he had

659
00:34:34,200 --> 00:34:37,640
Speaker 1: like tweaked a couple of things and uh and yeah

660
00:34:37,680 --> 00:34:39,520
Speaker 1: and then that was the song. And it was like,

661
00:34:39,600 --> 00:34:43,920
Speaker 1: I mean, it was crazy because uh, Nickelback's Silver Side

662
00:34:44,000 --> 00:34:46,920
Speaker 1: Up was the second record I ever bought, you know,

663
00:34:47,000 --> 00:34:51,600
Speaker 1: when I was twelve, and everybody had it. It was

664
00:34:51,719 --> 00:34:52,440
Speaker 1: it's a great record.

665
00:34:52,480 --> 00:34:53,280
Speaker 3: It's a great record.

666
00:34:53,440 --> 00:34:54,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, they have great songs.

667
00:34:54,800 --> 00:34:58,400
Speaker 2: And I am a hater of Nickelback haters.

668
00:34:58,600 --> 00:35:00,480
Speaker 1: You don't have to be Nickelback lover, but there's no

669
00:35:00,560 --> 00:35:02,359
Speaker 1: reason to being a Nickelback hater. It's just because they

670
00:35:02,400 --> 00:35:05,840
Speaker 1: make good freaking music. Dude, people hate stuff it's popular,

671
00:35:06,120 --> 00:35:08,080
Speaker 1: you know. I think that's all it is. I just

672
00:35:08,160 --> 00:35:11,600
Speaker 1: had I was just talking to h to a chief

673
00:35:11,600 --> 00:35:15,040
Speaker 1: who's who's was was their manager and is now their

674
00:35:15,080 --> 00:35:19,080
Speaker 1: manager again, and uh, and yeah, it's just it's just

675
00:35:19,080 --> 00:35:21,760
Speaker 1: one of those things. You know. Every everybody hated FGL

676
00:35:21,840 --> 00:35:24,160
Speaker 1: for a while for for some reason, you know, and

677
00:35:24,640 --> 00:35:27,080
Speaker 1: my personal reasons. But yes, I understood that.

678
00:35:27,200 --> 00:35:30,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, Coldplay, if you get so big, you get corny,

679
00:35:30,920 --> 00:35:31,560
Speaker 2: even if you're not.

680
00:35:31,920 --> 00:35:32,240
Speaker 1: Yeah.

681
00:35:32,280 --> 00:35:34,439
Speaker 2: My question has been and I've asked that a couple

682
00:35:34,440 --> 00:35:37,640
Speaker 2: of times to friends and even on this podcast, Like

683
00:35:38,160 --> 00:35:41,359
Speaker 2: I'm waiting for Morgan Wallen to get corny, even if

684
00:35:41,360 --> 00:35:44,720
Speaker 2: nothing changes with what he does. You reach a level

685
00:35:44,840 --> 00:35:49,200
Speaker 2: of popularity where it doesn't matter how great you can be,

686
00:35:49,480 --> 00:35:54,600
Speaker 2: sustained greatness. But once you hit this level of so

687
00:35:54,760 --> 00:35:58,319
Speaker 2: many people love you, then it's corny to also be

688
00:35:58,440 --> 00:36:01,040
Speaker 2: one of the people that loves you. Yeah, and so

689
00:36:01,120 --> 00:36:03,839
Speaker 2: it's I wonder when Morgan Walling gets corny And he's

690
00:36:03,880 --> 00:36:06,520
Speaker 2: not there yet. But if you it's just a popular

691
00:36:06,600 --> 00:36:09,080
Speaker 2: When you get so popular, yeah, you get a bit

692
00:36:09,160 --> 00:36:11,040
Speaker 2: corny only because you're so popular.

693
00:36:11,360 --> 00:36:15,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, it becomes the It almost like the potency

694
00:36:15,360 --> 00:36:17,479
Speaker 1: of what you're doing almost gets deluded because so many

695
00:36:17,520 --> 00:36:19,719
Speaker 1: people start doing it as well. I mean you see

696
00:36:19,760 --> 00:36:23,680
Speaker 1: you see it happening right now with Morgan, you know,

697
00:36:23,960 --> 00:36:26,280
Speaker 1: I mean a lot of people are chasing that sound

698
00:36:26,360 --> 00:36:29,480
Speaker 1: and it's a great sound. So so I understand it.

699
00:36:30,520 --> 00:36:42,960
Speaker 5: The Bobby cast will be right back. This is the

700
00:36:43,000 --> 00:36:44,960
Speaker 5: Bobby Cast.

701
00:36:44,480 --> 00:36:47,360
Speaker 2: And I could even understand why people would go out, Well,

702
00:36:47,560 --> 00:36:49,840
Speaker 2: that doesn't feel nice, like you're saying Morgan Wallan's corny. No,

703
00:36:49,880 --> 00:36:52,200
Speaker 2: I'm saying I'm using Morgan Wallen as the standard of

704
00:36:52,760 --> 00:36:56,120
Speaker 2: when you look at massive acts, Yeah, who got so

705
00:36:56,320 --> 00:36:58,759
Speaker 2: big and so many people love them that it was

706
00:36:58,800 --> 00:37:01,000
Speaker 2: no longer cool to be one of the people that

707
00:37:01,040 --> 00:37:03,840
Speaker 2: love them because so many people love them that you're

708
00:37:04,120 --> 00:37:05,520
Speaker 2: just part of the herd, and nobody wants to be

709
00:37:05,600 --> 00:37:08,920
Speaker 2: part of the herd. Yeah, And so it's cool to

710
00:37:08,920 --> 00:37:14,439
Speaker 2: see Morgan. It's cool to see like Zach Bryan. It's

711
00:37:14,480 --> 00:37:20,000
Speaker 2: cool to see Luke Combs not be corny yet and

712
00:37:20,400 --> 00:37:23,520
Speaker 2: be able to do stadiums. Yeah, because that's about the

713
00:37:23,560 --> 00:37:25,880
Speaker 2: time when you become so popular people feel like I

714
00:37:25,920 --> 00:37:28,399
Speaker 2: don't want to be a fan anymore because everybody loves them.

715
00:37:28,719 --> 00:37:30,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's kind of hard to imagine, Like, was Tom

716
00:37:30,880 --> 00:37:34,160
Speaker 1: Petty corny at some point? Did that happen?

717
00:37:34,480 --> 00:37:36,560
Speaker 2: It's dude, First of all, I love Tom Petty like

718
00:37:36,600 --> 00:37:38,600
Speaker 2: that is like my favorite. I was watching a TikTok

719
00:37:38,680 --> 00:37:41,719
Speaker 2: last night because I'm on Tom Petty TikTok like I

720
00:37:41,880 --> 00:37:42,279
Speaker 2: used to be.

721
00:37:42,880 --> 00:37:44,360
Speaker 1: It's one of the best places to be.

722
00:37:44,480 --> 00:37:47,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, and so, oh, we're gonna side really on this

723
00:37:47,480 --> 00:37:49,919
Speaker 2: one for a second. So Tom Petty to me top

724
00:37:49,960 --> 00:37:52,719
Speaker 2: three Grace American rock artists of all time. I say

725
00:37:52,719 --> 00:37:54,400
Speaker 2: American because you can go through the debate. I did

726
00:37:54,480 --> 00:37:56,200
Speaker 2: have Ringo Star here a few weeks ago. It was awesome.

727
00:37:56,200 --> 00:37:59,799
Speaker 1: Wow. Yeah, I hit with everybody rub that in there.

728
00:38:00,440 --> 00:38:06,839
Speaker 2: So Tom Petty was talking about how if he went

729
00:38:06,840 --> 00:38:11,760
Speaker 2: to watch Ray Charles, he would want to hear Ray Charles.

730
00:38:11,840 --> 00:38:11,920
Speaker 1: Do.

731
00:38:13,600 --> 00:38:17,000
Speaker 2: I forget what song he said specifically, but what I said,

732
00:38:17,360 --> 00:38:20,440
Speaker 2: whatever song it was, Yeah, and he said, I know

733
00:38:20,520 --> 00:38:23,600
Speaker 2: he started playing that thing after fifty years, but if

734
00:38:24,560 --> 00:38:27,719
Speaker 2: he doesn't play it, I'm disappointed. Yeah, And he said,

735
00:38:27,760 --> 00:38:31,480
Speaker 2: I have three songs that I feel that way about.

736
00:38:33,080 --> 00:38:36,640
Speaker 2: And so I paused it because I'm insane in my head,

737
00:38:36,840 --> 00:38:39,239
Speaker 2: and so I played a trivia game with myself. We're

738
00:38:39,280 --> 00:38:40,680
Speaker 2: the only person that could win or lose with me,

739
00:38:41,000 --> 00:38:43,239
Speaker 2: and so I tried to guess the three songs that

740
00:38:43,280 --> 00:38:45,440
Speaker 2: Tom Petty was about to say that they expect him

741
00:38:45,440 --> 00:38:48,120
Speaker 2: to play at every show, And before he even said

742
00:38:48,120 --> 00:38:50,360
Speaker 2: the songs, he said, I played them at every show.

743
00:38:51,480 --> 00:38:53,680
Speaker 2: I don't mess a lot with the melodies, but I

744
00:38:53,719 --> 00:38:55,520
Speaker 2: try to put them in places that excites me, and

745
00:38:55,560 --> 00:38:56,960
Speaker 2: I try to put them up as a part of

746
00:38:57,000 --> 00:38:58,839
Speaker 2: things that can still excite me because I don't get

747
00:38:58,880 --> 00:39:01,760
Speaker 2: excited about playing them because I've played him so many times.

748
00:39:01,960 --> 00:39:03,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, he wasn't the second.

749
00:39:03,160 --> 00:39:06,920
Speaker 2: They weren't great, and I can understand that. On like

750
00:39:06,960 --> 00:39:08,799
Speaker 2: the radio side, we do a segment. It's called tell

751
00:39:08,840 --> 00:39:10,480
Speaker 2: Me something Good. We've done our fifteen years, we'd it

752
00:39:10,480 --> 00:39:12,200
Speaker 2: four times a day. I can never do it again

753
00:39:12,239 --> 00:39:13,960
Speaker 2: to be the happiest person ever in my life. But

754
00:39:14,040 --> 00:39:17,279
Speaker 2: it tests so well, it researches so well. I go

755
00:39:17,400 --> 00:39:20,400
Speaker 2: places and people sing the jingle to me, and so

756
00:39:20,480 --> 00:39:23,040
Speaker 2: I owe it if people like it, to keep doing it.

757
00:39:23,200 --> 00:39:24,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, totally.

758
00:39:25,480 --> 00:39:29,160
Speaker 2: So I'm not Tom Petty close, No, not at all,

759
00:39:29,200 --> 00:39:31,319
Speaker 2: But I can understand in that way where it's like

760
00:39:31,640 --> 00:39:33,200
Speaker 2: one of the things that people say the most to

761
00:39:33,239 --> 00:39:35,399
Speaker 2: me and that they love the most. I don't really

762
00:39:35,440 --> 00:39:38,799
Speaker 2: like doing yeah, but I used to love doing it,

763
00:39:39,000 --> 00:39:41,600
Speaker 2: and I understand why people like it, and repetition is

764
00:39:41,640 --> 00:39:44,160
Speaker 2: going to warm me out. So with Tom Petty, what

765
00:39:44,200 --> 00:39:45,600
Speaker 2: do you think that three songs are?

766
00:39:46,000 --> 00:39:51,919
Speaker 1: Uh, American Girl, free fall In, and I'm gonna guess

767
00:39:51,920 --> 00:39:56,000
Speaker 1: won't back down all three? I would have said, probably

768
00:39:56,000 --> 00:39:58,160
Speaker 1: because he has so many songs. Yeah. The three that

769
00:39:58,239 --> 00:39:59,240
Speaker 1: he said were.

770
00:40:00,719 --> 00:40:06,040
Speaker 2: Last Dance, Mary Jane, Yeah, free Falling and Renegade Renegade,

771
00:40:06,920 --> 00:40:09,640
Speaker 2: and he said he just had no interest in playing

772
00:40:09,680 --> 00:40:12,480
Speaker 2: them anymore, and he thought they were great when he

773
00:40:12,520 --> 00:40:15,080
Speaker 2: wrote them, but when they would show up, people are like,

774
00:40:15,120 --> 00:40:15,600
Speaker 2: oh my god.

775
00:40:15,600 --> 00:40:18,160
Speaker 1: So we had to find ways to make it, could

776
00:40:18,239 --> 00:40:20,560
Speaker 1: keep it interesting, to keep it interesting to him. Yeah,

777
00:40:20,680 --> 00:40:21,680
Speaker 1: there would be times too.

778
00:40:22,320 --> 00:40:24,359
Speaker 2: By the way, this is why I enjoy you over

779
00:40:24,360 --> 00:40:25,919
Speaker 2: here because I feel like we can just talk music,

780
00:40:25,960 --> 00:40:26,680
Speaker 2: which is nice.

781
00:40:26,840 --> 00:40:27,120
Speaker 1: Yeah.

782
00:40:27,200 --> 00:40:29,759
Speaker 2: Also because you're like a savant like Berkeley, and then

783
00:40:29,760 --> 00:40:31,840
Speaker 2: you're like super genius and I'm not near smartest you,

784
00:40:31,840 --> 00:40:33,239
Speaker 2: so I can ask you things and get smarter like

785
00:40:33,239 --> 00:40:34,160
Speaker 2: I like being around.

786
00:40:33,920 --> 00:40:34,400
Speaker 1: People like that.

787
00:40:34,960 --> 00:40:41,080
Speaker 2: So there are artists that I love and have been

788
00:40:41,120 --> 00:40:43,520
Speaker 2: to their shows, and as similar thing has happened when

789
00:40:43,560 --> 00:40:45,200
Speaker 2: they've played a song so many times where they start

790
00:40:45,400 --> 00:40:48,360
Speaker 2: messing with the melodies and changing.

791
00:40:48,080 --> 00:40:50,920
Speaker 1: The words a little bit. I don't like that. Yeah,

792
00:40:51,000 --> 00:40:52,200
Speaker 1: I understand that.

793
00:40:52,560 --> 00:40:54,719
Speaker 2: And you can do like Creep from Radiohead, when they

794
00:40:54,760 --> 00:40:55,960
Speaker 2: just stop playing it for a decade.

795
00:40:56,280 --> 00:40:57,759
Speaker 1: Well, yeah, you get tired of it.

796
00:40:57,680 --> 00:41:00,959
Speaker 2: For sure, But it's to have the awareness like Tom

797
00:41:00,960 --> 00:41:05,799
Speaker 2: Petty's awareness of I'm so tired of this. But let

798
00:41:05,800 --> 00:41:09,080
Speaker 2: me put myself as a fan, and if I were

799
00:41:09,080 --> 00:41:11,440
Speaker 2: at a Ray Charles show, I would want to hear

800
00:41:11,480 --> 00:41:14,200
Speaker 2: that song even though I know he feels how I feel,

801
00:41:14,440 --> 00:41:15,399
Speaker 2: so he kept playing it.

802
00:41:15,520 --> 00:41:19,239
Speaker 1: Garth does the same thing. Yeah, Garth plays all the hits. Yeah,

803
00:41:19,960 --> 00:41:22,080
Speaker 1: you know he's tired of it. You know as an artist,

804
00:41:22,440 --> 00:41:28,200
Speaker 1: you being an artist, you want to play new, fun, creative, fulfilling,

805
00:41:29,040 --> 00:41:32,160
Speaker 1: exciting things. You want to go where that excitement is.

806
00:41:32,200 --> 00:41:35,400
Speaker 1: But but you think the thing that that that I

807
00:41:36,320 --> 00:41:39,880
Speaker 1: always try and remember with with That's why, for example,

808
00:41:39,880 --> 00:41:44,359
Speaker 1: I played that song so many times, but I know

809
00:41:45,160 --> 00:41:50,120
Speaker 1: I know that it means a lot to people. And

810
00:41:50,160 --> 00:41:52,520
Speaker 1: I know, I know that there are people coming to

811
00:41:52,560 --> 00:41:56,919
Speaker 1: that to my show because it was their first dance

812
00:41:56,960 --> 00:42:00,360
Speaker 1: at their wedding or or it was playing for you know,

813
00:42:00,400 --> 00:42:03,000
Speaker 1: when they got engaged or whatever that is. It's it's

814
00:42:03,040 --> 00:42:07,480
Speaker 1: their songs. So I know that I I, you know,

815
00:42:08,560 --> 00:42:14,040
Speaker 1: I'm super grateful for the opportunity to like have created

816
00:42:14,440 --> 00:42:15,400
Speaker 1: something meaningful.

817
00:42:15,960 --> 00:42:18,920
Speaker 2: I to remind myself to be grateful because I think

818
00:42:19,160 --> 00:42:20,640
Speaker 2: it's easy for me to forget. And it's not like

819
00:42:20,680 --> 00:42:22,560
Speaker 2: I'm working at the mill like my stepdad, But it's

820
00:42:22,600 --> 00:42:24,359
Speaker 2: easy to forget because we're in our own little world.

821
00:42:24,400 --> 00:42:27,040
Speaker 2: We're trying to create ten thousand things at once. And

822
00:42:27,120 --> 00:42:29,640
Speaker 2: is this good as as bad? Where all of our

823
00:42:29,719 --> 00:42:34,840
Speaker 2: insecurity security is based on the feedback of people by consuming.

824
00:42:35,760 --> 00:42:38,080
Speaker 2: It's a nutty world, right, Like a screw's got to

825
00:42:38,120 --> 00:42:39,080
Speaker 2: be off for us to do this.

826
00:42:39,200 --> 00:42:47,000
Speaker 1: Hopefully it's the right screw. And so the fact that.

827
00:42:48,400 --> 00:42:50,759
Speaker 2: Tom Petty had the awareness to make him a fan,

828
00:42:50,920 --> 00:42:53,520
Speaker 2: to keep him from being good to his fans was

829
00:42:53,600 --> 00:42:56,239
Speaker 2: so freaking cool to me because he is He's at

830
00:42:56,280 --> 00:42:57,080
Speaker 2: the top of the mountain.

831
00:42:57,640 --> 00:43:01,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, same man, I mean, he's he's the guy you know,

832
00:43:02,160 --> 00:43:06,640
Speaker 1: and like reading, uh, conversations with Tom Petty. I don't

833
00:43:06,640 --> 00:43:08,319
Speaker 1: know if you've you've ever picked that up, but it's

834
00:43:09,000 --> 00:43:12,080
Speaker 1: it's just a collection of things he said in interviews,

835
00:43:12,120 --> 00:43:15,600
Speaker 1: you know, and it's it's it's it's inspiring to read,

836
00:43:15,680 --> 00:43:17,839
Speaker 1: you know. I mean, he's just a guy like everybody else,

837
00:43:17,880 --> 00:43:20,160
Speaker 1: but he he was tapped into something.

838
00:43:20,320 --> 00:43:26,200
Speaker 2: R be hypocritical wrophin am when Bob Dylan went acoustic

839
00:43:26,320 --> 00:43:29,000
Speaker 2: to electric, Yeah, it's exact opposite, right.

840
00:43:29,239 --> 00:43:31,080
Speaker 1: Well, I was I was going to bring that up,

841
00:43:31,120 --> 00:43:35,200
Speaker 1: you know, you think about like, uh, somebody like a

842
00:43:35,320 --> 00:43:37,879
Speaker 1: uh like a like a Bob Dylan or and Neil

843
00:43:37,960 --> 00:43:40,440
Speaker 1: Young that just they're playing shows and they don't care,

844
00:43:40,840 --> 00:43:45,880
Speaker 1: and they're they're changing their songs completely. They're kind of

845
00:43:47,040 --> 00:43:49,000
Speaker 1: I think. I think a lot of creativity is just

846
00:43:49,040 --> 00:43:56,720
Speaker 1: sort of chasing, chasing this undefinable and attainable thing. And

847
00:43:56,760 --> 00:43:59,400
Speaker 1: maybe that's what they got to do to keep to

848
00:43:59,480 --> 00:44:04,160
Speaker 1: keep doing it. And uh, and that's that's what they've

849
00:44:04,239 --> 00:44:05,000
Speaker 1: chosen to do.

850
00:44:05,160 --> 00:44:09,480
Speaker 2: It's a courage and a confidence. Yeah, because I saw

851
00:44:09,480 --> 00:44:10,960
Speaker 2: Arim once. They never played a hit. It was the

852
00:44:10,960 --> 00:44:13,560
Speaker 2: worst experience in my life. And I love r Em. Yeah,

853
00:44:13,600 --> 00:44:17,880
Speaker 2: they played an entire new record. I hated that show.

854
00:44:18,880 --> 00:44:22,200
Speaker 2: I respect that show. Yeah, because they knew everybody was

855
00:44:22,239 --> 00:44:22,759
Speaker 2: gonna hate it.

856
00:44:22,880 --> 00:44:25,520
Speaker 1: That's tough. They had to do it, I guess.

857
00:44:25,640 --> 00:44:29,040
Speaker 2: But if Michael Stipe got famous, because again he has

858
00:44:29,080 --> 00:44:32,240
Speaker 2: a couple of screws loose, they're the right screws rim

859
00:44:32,800 --> 00:44:38,520
Speaker 2: you know, very late seventies, eighties, you know, in early

860
00:44:38,600 --> 00:44:42,840
Speaker 2: nineties were massive. Yeah, for a reason they were different.

861
00:44:44,360 --> 00:44:47,239
Speaker 2: I was pissed. I was like, this sucks. And it

862
00:44:47,360 --> 00:44:50,320
Speaker 2: still pisses me off that I saw a band that

863
00:44:50,360 --> 00:44:52,080
Speaker 2: I love not play a single song that I know.

864
00:44:52,360 --> 00:44:54,840
Speaker 2: But that doesn't mean I also can't respect the courage

865
00:44:55,239 --> 00:44:56,279
Speaker 2: and the confidence that.

866
00:44:56,239 --> 00:45:01,439
Speaker 1: It took to do that. Yeah, well they're u. It's

867
00:45:01,560 --> 00:45:05,080
Speaker 1: it's a fine line to walk. But uh, you know,

868
00:45:05,160 --> 00:45:08,640
Speaker 1: sometimes I just think of like Bob Dylan, and I'm like,

869
00:45:08,680 --> 00:45:11,600
Speaker 1: that is a that is a very free man. He

870
00:45:11,680 --> 00:45:16,240
Speaker 1: is he's walking through life playing only by the rules

871
00:45:16,280 --> 00:45:19,359
Speaker 1: that he wants to play at and uh, and it's

872
00:45:19,440 --> 00:45:22,960
Speaker 1: very tempting to want to do that. That's somebody who

873
00:45:22,960 --> 00:45:25,319
Speaker 1: knows who they are, and I'm jealous of that. Yeah,

874
00:45:25,360 --> 00:45:28,160
Speaker 1: It's it's it's a very uh you have you have

875
00:45:28,200 --> 00:45:31,520
Speaker 1: to have a very strong sense of self to be

876
00:45:31,640 --> 00:45:36,160
Speaker 1: able to operate that way, and you gotta be wildly irrational. Uh,

877
00:45:36,680 --> 00:45:39,239
Speaker 1: just all this business, well, I mean that is that

878
00:45:39,360 --> 00:45:42,360
Speaker 1: is the absurdity of life. You have to be so irrational.

879
00:45:42,520 --> 00:45:46,320
Speaker 2: Think about just even you thinking that you're good enough

880
00:45:46,560 --> 00:45:48,439
Speaker 2: to be able to record something and people will spend

881
00:45:48,480 --> 00:45:51,600
Speaker 2: three minutes of their day which they have limited time listenings,

882
00:45:52,080 --> 00:45:54,759
Speaker 2: or or spending a few bucks to come watch a

883
00:45:54,800 --> 00:45:59,280
Speaker 2: show that you're gonna play at, or like me thinking

884
00:45:59,280 --> 00:46:01,680
Speaker 2: I'm gonna go to a theater and people are gonna

885
00:46:01,719 --> 00:46:05,439
Speaker 2: buy a ticket or spend fifteen minutes or an hour.

886
00:46:07,000 --> 00:46:08,239
Speaker 1: That is such interrational.

887
00:46:09,120 --> 00:46:13,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, and a balance of I'm wildly insecure, yet I

888
00:46:13,680 --> 00:46:15,640
Speaker 2: still think everybody needs to listen to everything that I do.

889
00:46:16,800 --> 00:46:20,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, but I think what you're just what you're talking

890
00:46:20,320 --> 00:46:23,759
Speaker 1: about is are you familiar with this this idea of

891
00:46:23,800 --> 00:46:29,080
Speaker 1: like the absurd? Yes, So, like you know, like Albert Camus,

892
00:46:29,200 --> 00:46:34,839
Speaker 1: like the universe doesn't care about you, and the only

893
00:46:34,880 --> 00:46:37,160
Speaker 1: the way that we create value as a human being

894
00:46:37,360 --> 00:46:40,560
Speaker 1: is to like do it anyway, you know, And I

895
00:46:40,840 --> 00:46:44,200
Speaker 1: and I think exactly what you're describing, You're going to

896
00:46:44,239 --> 00:46:48,160
Speaker 1: show up to a theater and like, you know, hope

897
00:46:48,160 --> 00:46:50,320
Speaker 1: that people show up, which is it's absurd.

898
00:46:50,680 --> 00:46:53,400
Speaker 2: It's absurd that people would spend Yes, it's absurd to

899
00:46:53,480 --> 00:46:56,400
Speaker 2: think that I think I'm good enough for people to

900
00:46:56,440 --> 00:46:57,920
Speaker 2: dedicate their time and money to kind of do it.

901
00:46:57,960 --> 00:47:00,680
Speaker 1: But don't you feel like doing it? Do you feel

902
00:47:00,719 --> 00:47:02,759
Speaker 1: like that gives your life? Yeah?

903
00:47:02,960 --> 00:47:06,480
Speaker 2: At the same time, it's it's the dichotomy of all dichotomies. Yeah,

904
00:47:06,600 --> 00:47:12,680
Speaker 2: that I am a wildly insecure person. At the same time,

905
00:47:13,040 --> 00:47:16,799
Speaker 2: I can still have a massive ego m that I

906
00:47:16,840 --> 00:47:19,279
Speaker 2: think I manage healthily eighty eight percent of the time.

907
00:47:20,440 --> 00:47:24,279
Speaker 2: So yeah, it's an odd business, especially when you start

908
00:47:24,280 --> 00:47:27,120
Speaker 2: to diversifying two different things like you've done from being

909
00:47:27,120 --> 00:47:29,880
Speaker 2: an artist, yeah, being a songwriter.

910
00:47:30,640 --> 00:47:32,759
Speaker 1: Doing the podcast I did see.

911
00:47:33,800 --> 00:47:35,200
Speaker 2: I mean I didn't love it, but you know, I

912
00:47:35,239 --> 00:47:37,680
Speaker 2: got followed by two better podcasts, which was you had

913
00:47:37,719 --> 00:47:39,640
Speaker 2: Kip on you had Craig Wiseman, and I was like, god, dang,

914
00:47:39,680 --> 00:47:41,239
Speaker 2: if people forgot about me so quick on the A

915
00:47:41,280 --> 00:47:43,520
Speaker 2: ten Year Town podcast, that's a little bit, that's right,

916
00:47:43,560 --> 00:47:45,480
Speaker 2: you know, that was the opening act. You know, I

917
00:47:45,520 --> 00:47:47,400
Speaker 2: was a baby I was a baby act on theodcast.

918
00:47:49,360 --> 00:47:51,560
Speaker 1: I really enjoyed our conversation out there.

919
00:47:51,960 --> 00:47:55,080
Speaker 4: Let's take a quick pause for a message from our sponsor.

920
00:48:00,080 --> 00:48:06,279
Speaker 1: M HM, and we're back on the Bobby Cast. Wait

921
00:48:06,320 --> 00:48:09,040
Speaker 1: you think about Kip. I love Kip. I think Kip

922
00:48:09,160 --> 00:48:12,840
Speaker 1: is a is a is a real artist.

923
00:48:13,200 --> 00:48:17,240
Speaker 2: I think we talked about Bob Dylan like for different reasons.

924
00:48:17,280 --> 00:48:19,640
Speaker 2: I think Kip in the same way that Kip just

925
00:48:19,680 --> 00:48:22,120
Speaker 2: does his own freaking thing. And I think for a minute,

926
00:48:22,239 --> 00:48:26,200
Speaker 2: Kip would probably admit that. For a while he was like,

927
00:48:26,239 --> 00:48:28,960
Speaker 2: you know, I'll make kids, and finally he was like,

928
00:48:29,040 --> 00:48:30,360
Speaker 2: screw it, I'm just gonna do what I do.

929
00:48:31,400 --> 00:48:31,520
Speaker 1: Ki.

930
00:48:31,680 --> 00:48:33,680
Speaker 2: Kip and I got into a big fight once, and

931
00:48:33,960 --> 00:48:35,520
Speaker 2: it's the only artist I've ever done this with. And

932
00:48:35,560 --> 00:48:37,839
Speaker 2: I've been in many fights with many people just because

933
00:48:37,880 --> 00:48:40,000
Speaker 2: I say stuff, and I say stuff for five hours

934
00:48:40,000 --> 00:48:43,399
Speaker 2: a day, and sometimes I say stuff that's accurate, inaccurate,

935
00:48:44,680 --> 00:48:52,799
Speaker 2: overly opinionated, unfair, fair numbers, game right, right, And Kip

936
00:48:52,880 --> 00:48:54,480
Speaker 2: and I got into it pretty good about some stuff

937
00:48:54,480 --> 00:49:00,440
Speaker 2: that I said about him personally. Yeah, I actually think

938
00:49:00,480 --> 00:49:02,600
Speaker 2: it was about a parody of one of his songs

939
00:49:02,760 --> 00:49:04,879
Speaker 2: that I was doing just be funny, But it wasn't

940
00:49:04,880 --> 00:49:07,759
Speaker 2: about him and keeps a serious guy when it comes

941
00:49:07,800 --> 00:49:09,279
Speaker 2: to music in his art, and he deserves to be

942
00:49:09,760 --> 00:49:12,120
Speaker 2: And so he was upset, and so I was like,

943
00:49:12,320 --> 00:49:14,560
Speaker 2: screw it, I don't give a crap. I'll do it again.

944
00:49:15,680 --> 00:49:20,279
Speaker 2: And Kep was like, hey, will you meet me for breakfast? Like,

945
00:49:20,400 --> 00:49:23,200
Speaker 2: oh man, I don't want I want to do that.

946
00:49:23,680 --> 00:49:26,440
Speaker 2: I don't do anybody. I don't like hanging out with anybody,

947
00:49:26,680 --> 00:49:27,680
Speaker 2: not because I don't like people.

948
00:49:27,680 --> 00:49:28,360
Speaker 1: I just awkward.

949
00:49:28,400 --> 00:49:30,920
Speaker 2: I'm not This is the only place I thrive is

950
00:49:30,920 --> 00:49:32,920
Speaker 2: with a microphone. Like if I were to see you,

951
00:49:32,960 --> 00:49:34,960
Speaker 2: I'd be like, dude, it's so good to see you. Okay,

952
00:49:35,040 --> 00:49:37,320
Speaker 2: I want to like I'm not good as a human.

953
00:49:37,520 --> 00:49:38,360
Speaker 2: That's not my strength.

954
00:49:39,760 --> 00:49:40,400
Speaker 1: I relate to that.

955
00:49:41,200 --> 00:49:42,360
Speaker 2: And I was like, I did not want to do this.

956
00:49:42,400 --> 00:49:43,680
Speaker 2: And Kep when I set at a restaurant, I just

957
00:49:43,719 --> 00:49:49,080
Speaker 2: talked it out for like half an hour, and like

958
00:49:49,160 --> 00:49:54,080
Speaker 2: I respected that process with him because he asked for it,

959
00:49:54,640 --> 00:50:02,160
Speaker 2: expected it, and delivered his fairness to it. And I

960
00:50:02,200 --> 00:50:04,719
Speaker 2: love Kip because of that. Kip and I are not

961
00:50:04,760 --> 00:50:07,000
Speaker 2: alike in a lot of ways. We have our birthdays

962
00:50:07,000 --> 00:50:09,319
Speaker 2: one day apart. It's pretty cool, But I love Kip

963
00:50:09,360 --> 00:50:11,160
Speaker 2: and if people were like, hey, dude, can you come

964
00:50:11,200 --> 00:50:12,640
Speaker 2: pick me up six hours away? I will get in the

965
00:50:12,680 --> 00:50:14,279
Speaker 2: car and go get him. Yeah, but are we going

966
00:50:14,360 --> 00:50:16,560
Speaker 2: to hang out? Probably not because he like does muscle stuff.

967
00:50:16,560 --> 00:50:20,040
Speaker 2: He like climbs stuff and does man stuff. Craig Wiseman.

968
00:50:21,800 --> 00:50:23,400
Speaker 2: And you should go listen to the episode that you

969
00:50:23,400 --> 00:50:27,440
Speaker 2: did with Craig. Like the guy has done, seen and

970
00:50:27,640 --> 00:50:28,279
Speaker 2: worn it all.

971
00:50:28,960 --> 00:50:32,200
Speaker 1: He's done a lot of different stuff. Yeah, and he Uh,

972
00:50:32,960 --> 00:50:37,600
Speaker 1: it's still I think the most inspiring part of it

973
00:50:37,680 --> 00:50:40,760
Speaker 1: to me is with Craig. You know, it still comes

974
00:50:40,760 --> 00:50:45,200
Speaker 1: from this desire to be close to that, to that thing,

975
00:50:45,840 --> 00:50:49,080
Speaker 1: you know, to to where to Like we just want

976
00:50:49,080 --> 00:50:50,799
Speaker 1: to get as close as we can to like where

977
00:50:50,800 --> 00:50:53,520
Speaker 1: the magic is happening. Can you get to the magic? Though?

978
00:50:53,520 --> 00:50:55,560
Speaker 2: Because I don't feel like you actually can. I feel

979
00:50:55,560 --> 00:50:58,680
Speaker 2: like I can't. I'll never get to this place that

980
00:50:59,239 --> 00:51:02,520
Speaker 2: I am suing. That doesn't mean I've stopped or tried

981
00:51:02,560 --> 00:51:04,680
Speaker 2: anything less. I just don't know if that place exists.

982
00:51:06,120 --> 00:51:07,880
Speaker 2: But that doesn't mean it's not true. Can you get

983
00:51:07,920 --> 00:51:09,680
Speaker 2: to Is there a magic place that you can get

984
00:51:09,719 --> 00:51:10,760
Speaker 2: to and be fully fulfilled?

985
00:51:12,680 --> 00:51:15,520
Speaker 1: Uh? You have to ex For me, I can only

986
00:51:15,560 --> 00:51:20,440
Speaker 1: speak for my own self. I think you have to

987
00:51:20,520 --> 00:51:24,160
Speaker 1: fall in love with what the process is and not

988
00:51:24,960 --> 00:51:27,600
Speaker 1: what the result is. And so there's a there's a

989
00:51:27,680 --> 00:51:30,520
Speaker 1: moment that that there's a place that you can go

990
00:51:30,680 --> 00:51:33,800
Speaker 1: to when you were making when you were writing a song,

991
00:51:34,440 --> 00:51:38,239
Speaker 1: where you are Craig talked about it a little bit

992
00:51:39,200 --> 00:51:42,600
Speaker 1: on ten Year Town. But where it's like it's called

993
00:51:42,600 --> 00:51:46,200
Speaker 1: like a thin place where you are in the presence

994
00:51:47,080 --> 00:51:52,799
Speaker 1: of something of of like you know, the creator or

995
00:51:52,840 --> 00:51:55,799
Speaker 1: the universe, whatever you want to call it. And and

996
00:51:57,560 --> 00:52:02,040
Speaker 1: I have, I have been there a few times. Do

997
00:52:02,080 --> 00:52:07,960
Speaker 1: you know you're there when you're there a little bit?

998
00:52:08,200 --> 00:52:12,719
Speaker 1: But but but you it's kind of like, uh, you

999
00:52:12,760 --> 00:52:15,000
Speaker 1: don't want to think about it too much. It's it's

1000
00:52:15,080 --> 00:52:18,560
Speaker 1: it's very surreal, and it's it's a very very hard

1001
00:52:18,760 --> 00:52:22,160
Speaker 1: place to get to. It doesn't happen very often. But

1002
00:52:22,800 --> 00:52:26,880
Speaker 1: I mean I think, uh, like I'm not a good golfer,

1003
00:52:28,160 --> 00:52:30,200
Speaker 1: but I'll play a few times a year, and every

1004
00:52:30,280 --> 00:52:33,200
Speaker 1: now and then you just you just hit one. You're like,

1005
00:52:33,480 --> 00:52:37,720
Speaker 1: oh my gosh, I could go pro And it's songwritings.

1006
00:52:39,000 --> 00:52:41,719
Speaker 1: It's it's similar. Man. It's just some days you you

1007
00:52:41,800 --> 00:52:46,040
Speaker 1: know you're in the presence of something really powerful, and

1008
00:52:46,080 --> 00:52:49,640
Speaker 1: that is uh, that is like worthy of for me,

1009
00:52:49,719 --> 00:52:52,120
Speaker 1: It's worthy of like dedicating my life to chase.

1010
00:52:53,400 --> 00:52:56,640
Speaker 2: My analogy would be playing crabs. M you ever play

1011
00:52:56,640 --> 00:52:58,640
Speaker 2: craps at all? Because you know I love playing craps.

1012
00:52:59,160 --> 00:53:05,680
Speaker 2: If I I'm writing for whatever book jokes, yeah, if

1013
00:53:05,680 --> 00:53:06,560
Speaker 2: I'm just.

1014
00:53:08,160 --> 00:53:10,480
Speaker 1: Live on the air of feeling it killing it.

1015
00:53:11,480 --> 00:53:14,760
Speaker 2: If I'm at a table and I'm I'm just throwing

1016
00:53:14,840 --> 00:53:19,640
Speaker 2: and I'm hitting points, I'm not crapping out. I'm not

1017
00:53:19,760 --> 00:53:21,680
Speaker 2: in my head. I'm not going well, I wonder what

1018
00:53:21,800 --> 00:53:23,560
Speaker 2: I'm gonna crap out. I wonder how long this isn't

1019
00:53:23,560 --> 00:53:27,160
Speaker 2: gonna go. I'm I'm just in it, not thinking about

1020
00:53:27,160 --> 00:53:28,640
Speaker 2: it too much because I think if I think about it,

1021
00:53:28,640 --> 00:53:30,840
Speaker 2: it's gonna end. But then when it's over, I'm like,

1022
00:53:30,880 --> 00:53:34,200
Speaker 2: holy crap, Like I was. We went forty minutes. I

1023
00:53:34,680 --> 00:53:37,799
Speaker 2: didn't crap out for forty minutes. When I get in

1024
00:53:37,840 --> 00:53:39,560
Speaker 2: those spaces, it feels like I had a great run

1025
00:53:39,560 --> 00:53:42,080
Speaker 2: at the crab's table, and like I can't.

1026
00:53:42,280 --> 00:53:44,000
Speaker 1: I can slightly.

1027
00:53:43,480 --> 00:53:45,319
Speaker 2: Acknowledge it's happening, but I don't want to do it

1028
00:53:45,360 --> 00:53:49,680
Speaker 2: too much because then I'm gonna roll freaking seven right, right.

1029
00:53:49,680 --> 00:53:53,600
Speaker 1: You're you're you're in the I think what happens is

1030
00:53:53,600 --> 00:53:58,040
Speaker 1: you're you're very, very present. And so when you're in

1031
00:53:58,040 --> 00:54:01,520
Speaker 1: that creative place where with the crabs table, you're so

1032
00:54:01,960 --> 00:54:04,719
Speaker 1: in the moment, there's a there's it's almost like a

1033
00:54:04,960 --> 00:54:10,120
Speaker 1: like a bubble, right, You just don't something's gonna you know,

1034
00:54:10,760 --> 00:54:13,400
Speaker 1: someone's gonna come along and pop the bubble. You just

1035
00:54:13,800 --> 00:54:15,040
Speaker 1: trying not to think about it.

1036
00:54:15,040 --> 00:54:18,000
Speaker 2: The bubble's never live forever, No, but the bubble's pretty

1037
00:54:18,000 --> 00:54:19,600
Speaker 2: awesome to be in, and it's rare to get in it.

1038
00:54:19,640 --> 00:54:21,040
Speaker 2: So when you get in it, you really want to

1039
00:54:21,080 --> 00:54:28,680
Speaker 2: try to experience it without me having a complete inner

1040
00:54:28,800 --> 00:54:32,000
Speaker 2: monologue of why I'm experiencing what I'm experiencing, what's this

1041
00:54:32,000 --> 00:54:32,719
Speaker 2: experience going to end?

1042
00:54:32,800 --> 00:54:34,360
Speaker 1: Is there ever gonna happen again? Yeah?

1043
00:54:34,400 --> 00:54:37,080
Speaker 2: I run from that, Yeah, and just and just try

1044
00:54:37,120 --> 00:54:39,640
Speaker 2: to live in it. But dude, it's so cool to

1045
00:54:39,920 --> 00:54:42,120
Speaker 2: just see what you're doing.

1046
00:54:42,960 --> 00:54:43,240
Speaker 1: Again.

1047
00:54:43,280 --> 00:54:46,160
Speaker 2: I said that to you during the podcast, but then

1048
00:54:46,200 --> 00:54:48,200
Speaker 2: even after, like, I enjoy talking with you afterwards too

1049
00:54:48,200 --> 00:54:50,400
Speaker 2: because I was just like, hey, whatever you need, Like,

1050
00:54:50,440 --> 00:54:53,680
Speaker 2: I see what you're doing and keep doing it, and

1051
00:54:53,719 --> 00:54:56,920
Speaker 2: it sucks but so does everything else that's awesome. Like

1052
00:54:56,960 --> 00:55:00,480
Speaker 2: everything that's awesome sucks because it's supposed to suck or

1053
00:55:00,520 --> 00:55:01,560
Speaker 2: everybody will be doing it.

1054
00:55:02,520 --> 00:55:04,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's hard, but it's rewarding.

1055
00:55:05,000 --> 00:55:07,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, both and two things can be true. Yeah, it

1056
00:55:07,880 --> 00:55:10,160
Speaker 2: can suck and be awesome at the same time. Yeah,

1057
00:55:10,200 --> 00:55:12,319
Speaker 2: and sometimes not the exact same time. But sometimes things

1058
00:55:12,360 --> 00:55:14,439
Speaker 2: can suck until they get awesome, until they suck again,

1059
00:55:14,600 --> 00:55:18,840
Speaker 2: until they get awesome again. Yeah, and podcast is great.

1060
00:55:19,239 --> 00:55:20,880
Speaker 2: What have you learned from the podcast?

1061
00:55:21,760 --> 00:55:28,320
Speaker 1: Mmm? I think I've learned a lot about how much

1062
00:55:28,480 --> 00:55:37,560
Speaker 1: everyone's journey is. When I think about all the twists

1063
00:55:37,560 --> 00:55:39,920
Speaker 1: and turns in mind, I feel like an alien a

1064
00:55:39,920 --> 00:55:42,080
Speaker 1: little bit, you know. I think I've always felt that

1065
00:55:42,120 --> 00:55:43,520
Speaker 1: way my whole life, Like I'm a little bit of

1066
00:55:43,560 --> 00:55:47,160
Speaker 1: an alien on the outside looking in. And so getting

1067
00:55:47,840 --> 00:55:53,360
Speaker 1: getting to hear other people's stories, you start to understand likes.

1068
00:55:53,480 --> 00:55:55,359
Speaker 1: That's kind of part of it, that's part of life.

1069
00:55:55,600 --> 00:55:58,840
Speaker 1: I've learned a lot from that, and I've gained a

1070
00:55:58,840 --> 00:56:03,520
Speaker 1: lot of inspiration from hearing other people's stories.

1071
00:56:06,120 --> 00:56:15,000
Speaker 2: Other people's stories have made me not feel as alone

1072
00:56:16,320 --> 00:56:19,239
Speaker 2: in my group of aliens. Yeah, there are there are

1073
00:56:19,239 --> 00:56:22,000
Speaker 2: other aliens, like me use the I'll use alien too.

1074
00:56:22,080 --> 00:56:23,799
Speaker 2: I didn't think there were. I didn't think there were

1075
00:56:24,160 --> 00:56:25,880
Speaker 2: and no other aliens exactly like me. But there are,

1076
00:56:25,920 --> 00:56:27,600
Speaker 2: there are other aliens like me. They go through the

1077
00:56:27,600 --> 00:56:34,320
Speaker 2: same struggles, mental struggles, uh, imposter syndrome struggles, totally success struggles,

1078
00:56:34,320 --> 00:56:35,960
Speaker 2: comparison struggles.

1079
00:56:36,000 --> 00:56:37,879
Speaker 1: All of that's happening to all of us.

1080
00:56:38,040 --> 00:56:39,600
Speaker 2: Yeah, but since we're not talking about it, we're not

1081
00:56:39,640 --> 00:56:41,440
Speaker 2: seeing It's very a much social media culture as well,

1082
00:56:41,480 --> 00:56:43,000
Speaker 2: right too. Like you cae only see the good stuff,

1083
00:56:43,040 --> 00:56:44,799
Speaker 2: you don't only see the bad, so then you think, well,

1084
00:56:44,800 --> 00:56:45,880
Speaker 2: my life's note as good as theirs.

1085
00:56:46,680 --> 00:56:50,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, there's a there's a disconnect. I think that happens

1086
00:56:50,520 --> 00:56:54,799
Speaker 1: on sometimes can happen on social media where it does

1087
00:56:55,000 --> 00:57:00,360
Speaker 1: all look good, you know, And I think, uh, I

1088
00:57:00,360 --> 00:57:02,759
Speaker 1: think there's a real opportunity right now, just like we're

1089
00:57:02,800 --> 00:57:07,480
Speaker 1: having right now, for for for honest conversations and and

1090
00:57:07,600 --> 00:57:14,080
Speaker 1: authenticity and and I'm you know, I'm I'm obviously like

1091
00:57:14,600 --> 00:57:16,520
Speaker 1: trying to figure out figure it out as I go

1092
00:57:16,800 --> 00:57:19,800
Speaker 1: and just trying to figure out how how all of

1093
00:57:19,840 --> 00:57:24,640
Speaker 1: this stuff goes together, you know, And the beauteo is

1094
00:57:24,680 --> 00:57:25,120
Speaker 1: you will.

1095
00:57:24,920 --> 00:57:28,240
Speaker 2: Never figure it out it doesn't go together probably, I mean,

1096
00:57:28,280 --> 00:57:30,600
Speaker 2: that's it. It doesn't go together and we'll never figure

1097
00:57:30,600 --> 00:57:33,520
Speaker 2: it out. But that's what that's what's about it. Before

1098
00:57:33,520 --> 00:57:37,000
Speaker 2: you came in, we talked about the podcast and what

1099
00:57:37,000 --> 00:57:38,920
Speaker 2: do you want to say about about your music that's

1100
00:57:38,960 --> 00:57:39,280
Speaker 2: coming out?

1101
00:57:39,440 --> 00:57:40,880
Speaker 1: We talked a bit about it, but what do you

1102
00:57:40,880 --> 00:57:46,760
Speaker 1: want to say? I think I'm just I I have.

1103
00:57:47,160 --> 00:57:50,400
Speaker 1: We we went into it a little bit about that's why,

1104
00:57:50,920 --> 00:57:56,480
Speaker 1: and you know, doing all of that music independently allowed

1105
00:57:56,520 --> 00:58:02,120
Speaker 1: me a lot of latitude to with with income and

1106
00:58:02,520 --> 00:58:05,960
Speaker 1: resources to like create some stuff that I've always dreamed

1107
00:58:06,000 --> 00:58:08,480
Speaker 1: about making. The podcast is one of those that that

1108
00:58:08,560 --> 00:58:12,680
Speaker 1: is an offshoot of of my successes as a recording artist,

1109
00:58:12,760 --> 00:58:18,640
Speaker 1: and I wanted to make the record that I've always

1110
00:58:18,680 --> 00:58:23,880
Speaker 1: wanted to make without any kind of, you know, stipulations

1111
00:58:23,920 --> 00:58:28,400
Speaker 1: on what it needed to sound like, or it needed

1112
00:58:28,400 --> 00:58:31,240
Speaker 1: to have this this hit or that hit or whatever.

1113
00:58:31,280 --> 00:58:36,640
Speaker 1: I just wanted to make something that that I've worked

1114
00:58:36,720 --> 00:58:38,600
Speaker 1: could work hard on and be very proud of and

1115
00:58:38,640 --> 00:58:42,120
Speaker 1: be excited to like put out into the world that

1116
00:58:42,200 --> 00:58:46,120
Speaker 1: I felt feel like is reflective of of of who

1117
00:58:46,160 --> 00:58:50,320
Speaker 1: I am. You make any money on the podcast? Getting there,

1118
00:58:50,880 --> 00:58:54,040
Speaker 1: I had, I had a lot. I had. You really

1119
00:58:54,120 --> 00:58:54,640
Speaker 1: inspired me.

1120
00:58:54,680 --> 00:58:57,200
Speaker 2: Actually, I actually asked you that question on your podcast

1121
00:58:57,200 --> 00:58:58,200
Speaker 2: here and.

1122
00:58:58,440 --> 00:59:00,480
Speaker 1: I said, and I said, I think I said no,

1123
00:59:00,880 --> 00:59:01,640
Speaker 1: which was true.

1124
00:59:02,160 --> 00:59:04,480
Speaker 2: But that's all I mean, it's it's impossible. But yes,

1125
00:59:04,560 --> 00:59:06,200
Speaker 2: that's why I asked. I really wanted to know.

1126
00:59:06,440 --> 00:59:10,120
Speaker 1: Well, you told me. I don't know if you remember this. Uh,

1127
00:59:11,080 --> 00:59:14,720
Speaker 1: we were talking afterwards and you said, uh, you were

1128
00:59:14,760 --> 00:59:19,200
Speaker 1: telling me about cold emailing people. And I'm like, okay,

1129
00:59:20,600 --> 00:59:23,800
Speaker 1: well he's doing he's doing it. Why can't I like,

1130
00:59:24,080 --> 00:59:26,520
Speaker 1: I mean, I feel awkward, but I'm just going to

1131
00:59:26,600 --> 00:59:30,320
Speaker 1: do it. And I, yeah, I did. I literally just

1132
00:59:30,360 --> 00:59:33,680
Speaker 1: copied you. I I went on LinkedIn and I found

1133
00:59:33,720 --> 00:59:35,479
Speaker 1: some people that I thought might be a good fit.

1134
00:59:35,560 --> 00:59:39,360
Speaker 1: And I and I did some combinations to figure out

1135
00:59:39,440 --> 00:59:43,280
Speaker 1: this company's email format of this person's names so that

1136
00:59:43,360 --> 00:59:49,080
Speaker 1: I could get into their inbox and uh, and it worked.

1137
00:59:49,400 --> 00:59:50,040
Speaker 1: It's crazy.

1138
00:59:50,240 --> 00:59:52,600
Speaker 2: It's actually not crazy, but it's crazy. It's crazy because

1139
00:59:52,600 --> 00:59:56,320
Speaker 2: it's so simple. Yeah, and but it was awkward. It's

1140
00:59:56,520 --> 00:59:59,240
Speaker 2: but so was recording that song. So was recording your

1141
00:59:59,240 --> 01:00:01,720
Speaker 2: song after your single had been said, No, it was

1142
01:00:01,760 --> 01:00:03,200
Speaker 2: awkward to put the phone up and sing a song.

1143
01:00:03,240 --> 01:00:07,280
Speaker 2: Into a freaking camera. Yeah, and then it goes viral. Yeah.

1144
01:00:07,400 --> 01:00:09,640
Speaker 2: You just do it anyway. You do it when you're uncomfortable.

1145
01:00:10,280 --> 01:00:10,520
Speaker 1: Dude.

1146
01:00:10,520 --> 01:00:12,720
Speaker 2: I'm I'm a big fan, you know. I was looking

1147
01:00:12,720 --> 01:00:15,440
Speaker 2: forward to seeing you again. I'm rooting for you. I watched,

1148
01:00:15,880 --> 01:00:16,840
Speaker 2: you know, watch your stuff.

1149
01:00:17,080 --> 01:00:19,720
Speaker 1: Yeah, thank you. It's pretty cool. I don't even know

1150
01:00:19,760 --> 01:00:22,920
Speaker 1: you as the artist. It's what's crazy.

1151
01:00:22,960 --> 01:00:24,880
Speaker 2: That's it's weird because sometimes people will be like, I

1152
01:00:24,920 --> 01:00:27,160
Speaker 2: don't really they don't listen to the radio show though

1153
01:00:28,040 --> 01:00:29,600
Speaker 2: I've watched Idol.

1154
01:00:29,320 --> 01:00:31,240
Speaker 1: For years or whatever it was. I'll know me for

1155
01:00:31,280 --> 01:00:31,880
Speaker 1: these weird things.

1156
01:00:31,880 --> 01:00:34,400
Speaker 2: And I'm like, oh, I don't really think that that's funny.

1157
01:00:34,480 --> 01:00:38,760
Speaker 2: Is that disorienting at all? It's I wouldn't say disorienting.

1158
01:00:38,800 --> 01:00:39,960
Speaker 2: There's just no orientation to.

1159
01:00:39,920 --> 01:00:42,760
Speaker 1: It at all. Yeah, to any of it. It's just

1160
01:00:42,840 --> 01:00:43,280
Speaker 1: all the.

1161
01:00:43,920 --> 01:00:46,200
Speaker 2: It's all yeah, and it's awesome. It's great unless they

1162
01:00:46,240 --> 01:00:51,240
Speaker 2: try to stab you. Otherwise it's it's great. And I'm famous,

1163
01:00:51,280 --> 01:00:59,080
Speaker 2: so fractured mm hmm. Nobody's famous yet everybody's famous, and yeah,

1164
01:00:59,560 --> 01:01:02,200
Speaker 2: boy like and like you said, there's a chance for

1165
01:01:02,800 --> 01:01:06,320
Speaker 2: if you just do it enough. There are no gatekeepers

1166
01:01:07,200 --> 01:01:10,600
Speaker 2: actual human form gatekeepers. There's an algorithm we can't figure out,

1167
01:01:11,240 --> 01:01:14,120
Speaker 2: but it's a different gatekeeper, but it's at least it's

1168
01:01:14,160 --> 01:01:18,800
Speaker 2: not one that is going to get you know, canceled

1169
01:01:18,880 --> 01:01:20,920
Speaker 2: for doing inappropriate things in an office, you know.

1170
01:01:21,320 --> 01:01:26,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's just it's it's pulled out under

1171
01:01:28,240 --> 01:01:29,680
Speaker 1: beyond understanding algorithm.

1172
01:01:29,840 --> 01:01:32,200
Speaker 2: Everybody has a chance though, yeah, and everybody didn't always

1173
01:01:32,200 --> 01:01:34,680
Speaker 2: have a chance, right, and everybody has a chance now.

1174
01:01:34,760 --> 01:01:37,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's it's an exciting time. Well, I'm a big fan.

1175
01:01:37,560 --> 01:01:39,840
Speaker 2: We put all your information down in the notes as well,

1176
01:01:39,960 --> 01:01:45,080
Speaker 2: and check out the podcast, and I'm going to go

1177
01:01:45,120 --> 01:01:47,120
Speaker 2: in what Nickelback song was that.

1178
01:01:47,080 --> 01:01:49,240
Speaker 1: I want to horizon? Okay, check it out.

1179
01:01:49,320 --> 01:01:52,560
Speaker 2: That's my favorite Nickelback song ever. I know I don't

1180
01:01:52,600 --> 01:01:54,120
Speaker 2: know what it is, but I wanna those do that.

1181
01:01:54,120 --> 01:01:55,800
Speaker 2: That's pretty cool.

1182
01:01:56,120 --> 01:01:58,240
Speaker 1: I believe you when you said it you got a skill.

1183
01:01:59,400 --> 01:02:00,440
Speaker 1: There's no way I believe that.

1184
01:02:01,080 --> 01:02:03,920
Speaker 2: But that's pretty cool to hear like somebody, like a

1185
01:02:04,600 --> 01:02:08,360
Speaker 2: familiar voice singing something that you created in your brain regardless.

1186
01:02:08,480 --> 01:02:12,920
Speaker 1: That's cool. Yeah, Like the feeling of when I just

1187
01:02:12,960 --> 01:02:15,560
Speaker 1: press played the first time in the and the guitars

1188
01:02:15,600 --> 01:02:19,240
Speaker 1: are playing, that's cool. Yeah, it's crazy. It doesn't you know,

1189
01:02:19,320 --> 01:02:21,280
Speaker 1: it doesn't make sense, but but it did happen.

1190
01:02:21,840 --> 01:02:24,120
Speaker 2: Check out ten Year Time podcast and everything else is

1191
01:02:24,160 --> 01:02:26,520
Speaker 2: down in the notes. Good to see you, Troy, and

1192
01:02:26,920 --> 01:02:28,120
Speaker 2: let's do this again soon, all

1193
01:02:28,200 --> 01:02:31,160
Speaker 5: Right, Thank you for having me, Thanks for listening to

1194
01:02:31,240 --> 01:02:32,600
Speaker 5: a Bobby Cast production