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Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to Savior production of iHeartRadio. I'm Annie Reese.

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Speaker 2: And I'm Lorn Volga Baum, and today we have an

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Speaker 2: episode for you about bone marrow.

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Speaker 1: Mmmmmmmmmmm mmmmmm oh.

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Speaker 3: Oh my gosh.

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Speaker 1: I seem to recall a Saver outing where we had

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Speaker 1: bone marrow.

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Speaker 3: I believe super producer Andrew was there.

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Speaker 2: It seems entirely likely we'd go to the kind of

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Speaker 2: places where and also we are the kind of people

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Speaker 2: that if we see that on a menu, we're going

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Speaker 2: to order it.

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Speaker 1: So yes, I did go immediately after this on a

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Speaker 1: quest to find I've found some options to satisfy the cravings,

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Speaker 1: some like bone marrow soups and stuff like that. Suare

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Speaker 1: totally but I don't know, I don't know how, I

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Speaker 1: don't know which way I'm gonna go yet, but I'm

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Speaker 1: gonna something's gonna.

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Speaker 3: Happen for me.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's it's one of those things where it's it's

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Speaker 2: relatively rare to find on most restaurant menus. I have

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Speaker 2: never made it myself in my own home. Oh now

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Speaker 2: I want to.

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Speaker 1: I did find bone marrow bones at my store, and

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Speaker 1: maybe I'm afraid of the cutting up process.

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Speaker 2: No, no, no, no, no, you tell a butcher to do that, Annie, Annie,

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Speaker 2: tell a butcher to do that. I would not recommend

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Speaker 2: that for most home chefs, and I certainly do not

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Speaker 2: recommend it for you, my sweet friend, very clumsy. No no, no,

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Speaker 2: no no. You take those to the to the butcher

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Speaker 2: who was working there, and you ask them to do

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Speaker 2: what you want done with them.

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Speaker 3: Okay, all right, thank you. I love how quickly you

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Speaker 3: reacted like.

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Speaker 1: I gotta put I gotta stop this before it gets

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Speaker 1: any further.

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Speaker 3: Well, was there any particular reason this was in your mind? Lord?

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Speaker 2: Uh? Not really. I think I was just sort of

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Speaker 2: sort of looking around trying to find some kind of

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Speaker 2: animal protein related topic that we had not done yet.

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Speaker 2: And yeah, as it turns out, we have not done

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Speaker 2: this one. And uh then I wanted some and then

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Speaker 2: I was like, yeah, let's talk about it.

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Speaker 1: Mm hmm.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Like you said, I probably could count one hand how

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Speaker 1: many times I've had bone marrow is in my experience,

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Speaker 1: pretty rare, but I like it.

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Speaker 3: Every time I have it.

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Speaker 2: I like, yeah, gosh, so good. You can probably find

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Speaker 2: there's a number of like really like classy Italian themed

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Speaker 2: restaurants around town. I bet you could find also buco

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Speaker 2: on at least one menu out there that might be

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Speaker 2: that might be the way for you to go.

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Speaker 1: Okay, all right, I've got I got a couple options

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Speaker 1: I had to ponder. Yeah, you can see our past

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Speaker 1: episodes on Boulon.

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Speaker 3: I think maybe aspects that was a long time ago.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, but sure shared it has to do with

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Speaker 2: bones and stuff.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, bones and stuff awful. Uh fuh oxtail which this

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Speaker 1: did bring back. Yeah, my craving for oxtails as well always.

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Speaker 1: But I guess this brings us to our question. I

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Speaker 1: guess it does bone marrow?

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Speaker 3: What is it?

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Speaker 2: Well, bone marrow is the soft tissue inside of animal bones.

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Speaker 2: There are a couple different types, actually, but the one

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Speaker 2: that we're talking about culinarily is what's called yellow bone marrow,

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Speaker 2: which is mostly made up of facts. Just about all

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Speaker 2: bones do contain some marrow, but the highest quantities of

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Speaker 2: yellow marrow are found in the large, long bones of mammals,

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Speaker 2: specifically the femur, which is the upper rear leg bone,

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Speaker 2: the thigh bone also called the hind shank. We obtain

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Speaker 2: these marrow bones from very sizable ruminants like cattle, sheep,

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Speaker 2: and goats. Marrow can be used in various ways that

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Speaker 2: basically fall into two categories. Like you can cook marrow

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Speaker 2: out into a super stew by simmering the bones that

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Speaker 2: contain it, which will add a rich silkiness to the dish.

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Speaker 2: Or marrow can be served as like a more prominent

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Speaker 2: element onto itself by cutting the marrow bones into manageable

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Speaker 2: pieces and then roasting them, usually, which will result in

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Speaker 2: a chunk of bone filled with this sort of like

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Speaker 2: gelatinous buttery little bit of fat that can be scooped

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Speaker 2: out to be spread on toast. For example. Yeah, marrow

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Speaker 2: is bone fat. It's like a slightly more savory, less

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Speaker 2: melty butter. It is so simple and so luxurious. It's

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Speaker 2: like it's like stepping into a really well deserved bath.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, that feeling of like ah yes.

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Speaker 2: M bone marrow. Heck all right. I One of the

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Speaker 2: reasons I was excited to do this episode is because

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Speaker 2: we get to talk so much about bone science. There's

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Speaker 2: gonna be a bunch of this in the history section,

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Speaker 2: which I'm so excited that you tackled. Okay, So, mail

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Speaker 2: bones actually contain two types of bone tissue, which generally

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Speaker 2: come layered like like pockey or combos or those pyroleines purilines,

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Speaker 2: you know, the kind of hazelnut flavored things, yeah, or

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Speaker 2: you know whatever filled crunchy snack of your choices. So

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Speaker 2: the stiff, thick outer layer is sometimes called compact bone

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Speaker 2: because it's dense like like tightly packed, but porous. Inside that,

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Speaker 2: there's a layer of what's called spongy bone, which is

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Speaker 2: still stiff but looks more like like mesh. It's a

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Speaker 2: it's a network of bone plates and needles that are

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Speaker 2: each only a few cells thick, and inside of these

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Speaker 2: you generally find bone marrow. Biologically, marrow is the body's

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Speaker 2: production center for a lot of types of cells that

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Speaker 2: the body might have to replace as old cells wear

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Speaker 2: out or if an injury happens. Running through that mesh

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Speaker 2: of spongy bone, you've got what's called red marrow, and

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Speaker 2: that contains blood stem cells for yep, making blood cells

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Speaker 2: of various types. And spongybone makes up most of the

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Speaker 2: volume of the ends of bones, all right, But in

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Speaker 2: the mid body of bones, that spongy bone tends to

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Speaker 2: taper off and allows space for yellow marrow, which is

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Speaker 2: basically a small, massive fat that houses other stem cells

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Speaker 2: for making fat and bone and cartilage. Again, most bones

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Speaker 2: do contain some marrow, but like really appreciable amounts of

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Speaker 2: yellow marrow do occur in those big long hind shank

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Speaker 2: bones of larger mammals, and it's delicious. Beef marrow bones

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Speaker 2: are the most common in cuisines that you know use beef,

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Speaker 2: but any other mammal leg might be used a pig, sheep, goat, moose,

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Speaker 2: I don't know. If you don't butcher things yourself, you

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Speaker 2: can ask a butcher counter to chop shank bones for

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Speaker 2: you annie, either lengthwise or crosswise, whichever you prefer. When

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Speaker 2: the marrow is raw, it will be white, kind of

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Speaker 2: kind of speckled through with red from blood. It sort

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Speaker 2: of makes sense, So it's sort of sort of like

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Speaker 2: pinkish and kind of waxy, the way that ferm butter

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Speaker 2: would be. And then it will cook down into a

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Speaker 2: kind of oh, sort of golden gelatinous mass, which might

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Speaker 2: not sound real sexy, but it is, Believe me, it is.

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Speaker 2: In Different cultures have specific stews or soups that will

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Speaker 2: call for marrow bones, like fu or asubuco or pataphir.

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Speaker 2: Sometimes the marrow bones are like scraped out and or

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Speaker 2: cooked down so that the marrow is totally dissolved into

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Speaker 2: the dish. But sometimes the dish will be served with

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Speaker 2: pieces of the bones with the marrow still in them,

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Speaker 2: so that diners can scoop it out at the table

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Speaker 2: for themselves. The marrow can also be used as an ingredient,

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Speaker 2: like a topping for vegetables or meats, or a filling

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Speaker 2: for types of dumplings, or a binder for like a

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Speaker 2: doe dumpling. Yeah, and sometimes the sections of marrow bone

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Speaker 2: are just served unto themselves with the marrow still inside,

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Speaker 2: maybe just seasoned with like a little bit of salt

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Speaker 2: and pepper, with some toast to spread the marow on,

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Speaker 2: or you know, to like scrape in or stop the

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Speaker 2: marrow up out of. And it is just it is

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Speaker 2: so silky smooth melt in your mouth like like whipped butter,

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Speaker 2: but with a little bit of meaty flavor to it,

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Speaker 2: and you get like a little bit of char sometimes

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Speaker 2: from the roasting. And maybe you serve it with something

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Speaker 2: like nice and sharp, like a like a like a

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Speaker 2: bitter parsley salad with with some light oil and vinegar

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Speaker 2: on it. That's a really classic one that we are

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Speaker 2: also going to talk about in the history section.

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Speaker 3: We are I've got a tried it.

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Speaker 2: Oh oh no, okay, all right.

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Speaker 1: It's a it's a minor beef. Well, what about the nutrition.

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Speaker 2: Marrow is a nutrient dense food. It's got a good

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Speaker 2: punch of fats, smattering of micronutrients, and various stuff that

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Speaker 2: your body can use like collagen. Definitely, eat vegetable and

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Speaker 2: drinkle water. You know, marrow is pretty rich, so you're

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Speaker 2: not usually consuming a lot of it, Like a little

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Speaker 2: will go a long way.

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Speaker 3: Mm hmm. Well, don't really have any numbers for you.

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Speaker 2: We don't, we don't. I to be super fair, I

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Speaker 2: didn't look that hard. I didn't look that hard. But

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Speaker 2: from my brief search, really all of the numbers that

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Speaker 2: I could come up with about bone marrow are about

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Speaker 2: like bone marrow medical things like transplants and stuff, and

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Speaker 2: I I was like, that's not what we're talking about Google, right, So.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's been pretty disparate in terms of how people

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Speaker 1: use it.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I don't know if that's the right word, but it's

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Speaker 1: it's not grouped together in terms of how people use it. Globally,

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Speaker 1: I wouldn't say.

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Speaker 2: It's pretty individual.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, yeah, definitely, definitely. There's some dishes that I

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Speaker 1: was researching. Is oh my gosh, so badly.

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Speaker 2: Yes, yes, oh okay, well all right, despite not having numbers,

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Speaker 2: we do have some history for you, and we are

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Speaker 2: going to get into that as soon as we get

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Speaker 2: back from a quick break for a word from our sponsors.

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Speaker 3: And we're back.

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Speaker 1: Thank you, sponsors, yes, thank you, and we're back with

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Speaker 1: something so fascinating. Okay, yeah, So, researcher speculate that before

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Speaker 1: our human ancestors started hunting animals, they had a very

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Speaker 1: fatty diet that may in part have consisted of scavenged

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Speaker 1: bone marrow from the skeletal remains of animals killed by

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Speaker 1: other predators as far back as four million years ago. Honestly, listeners,

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Speaker 1: I could talk about this forever. It was fascinating. It

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Speaker 1: was so cool. They were talking about how our ancestors

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Speaker 1: would have walked and they wouldn't have been able to.

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Speaker 3: Kill animals very easily.

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Speaker 1: They would be watching, like other animals eat the animals anyway. Okay,

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Speaker 1: the marrow would have had a high coloric buck in

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Speaker 1: a landscape where calories were likely hard to come by,

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Speaker 1: and the bones themselves acted almost as a storage container,

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Speaker 1: preventing bacterial growth, so no fire needed to consume. It

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Speaker 1: also useful that other animals didn't have They couldn't as

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Speaker 1: easily get into.

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Speaker 2: It because, as you know, like Man the tool maker,

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Speaker 2: we could kind of smash them open.

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Speaker 3: Yes, more on that a second.

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Speaker 1: So not only did this lead to a taste for

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Speaker 1: fat in our ancestry, it may have allowed for our

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Speaker 1: ancestors to evolve and develop bigger brains.

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Speaker 2: And this is.

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Speaker 3: Cool in a lot of ways. It's pretty recent.

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Speaker 1: It's a pretty recent idea from twenty nineteen, and if

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Speaker 1: it is true, it upends the long standing hypothesis that

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Speaker 1: eating meat was the critical piece of human evolution. And

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Speaker 1: not only that, it raises other questions. The nutrients between

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Speaker 1: fat and meat are different, So what impact does that

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Speaker 1: have on our understanding of evolution? The tools required to

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Speaker 1: acquire these two things are different. A sharpened stone tool

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Speaker 1: for meat. A bone marrow probably was a smashing bone

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Speaker 1: with a stone situation, yes, and researchers speculate that could

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Speaker 1: have led to the idea or the drive to make

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Speaker 1: a tool to hunt larger animals oo oh, I like that.

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Speaker 2: Yes, because otherwise why are you going like, yeah that mammoth.

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Speaker 2: Let's take that down right.

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Speaker 3: Like exactly.

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Speaker 1: And a part of why scientists have been looking into

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Speaker 1: this has to do with the energy the human brain

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Speaker 1: requires to function, which is about twenty percent of the

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Speaker 1: body's energy while at rest, which is twice that of

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Speaker 1: other largely vegetarian primates. So some theorized it had to

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Speaker 1: do with our human ancestors hunting larger game.

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Speaker 3: They're getting more meat, therefore, bigger brain, what have you.

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Speaker 1: But the ones behind this research argue that doesn't really

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Speaker 1: make sense nutrient wise, since a lot of wild game

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Speaker 1: was lean and required a lot of energy to hunt,

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Speaker 1: and on top of that, eating a lot of meat

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Speaker 1: without fat can lead to something called protein poisoning and malnutrition.

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Speaker 1: And since larger brains predate controlled fire, eating bone marrow

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Speaker 1: as opposed to meat eliminates the problem with bacteria when

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Speaker 1: it comes to scavenged meat that was probably rotting by

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Speaker 1: the time time they got to it. Yes, oh, research

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Speaker 1: research is ongoing. Finding evidence to back this idea up

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Speaker 1: is really difficult. Researchers recently again in twenty nineteen, found

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Speaker 1: evidence that suggest humans were storing animal bones to eat

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Speaker 1: the marrow. Later, between two hundred thousand and four hundred

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Speaker 1: and twenty thousand years ago, Oh yeah, we're talking upwards

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Speaker 1: of eighty thousand bones were discovered, and almost all of

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Speaker 1: them had this mark, this cut mark that indicates the

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Speaker 1: people that stored them made an effort to get the

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Speaker 1: skin off the bone.

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Speaker 3: So they were just they were just storing just the way.

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Speaker 1: Yes, this I got got me thinking about a lot

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Speaker 1: of things, Lauren.

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Speaker 3: But they were talking about next.

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Speaker 1: Steps because it will be very difficult to back this

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Speaker 1: up obviously, millions of years we're talking about, but the

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Speaker 1: head researchture of this paper suggested starting to look at

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Speaker 1: the tools like we should be focusing on the evolution

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Speaker 1: of tools and.

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Speaker 2: When that was happening, and trying to bind those two

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Speaker 2: together into some kind of unified theory. Sure, yes, anyway,

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Speaker 2: moving way ahead.

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Speaker 1: Oh my gosh. Early thinkers and philosophers like Hippocrates believed

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Speaker 1: that the mare of the bone was the nutrient source

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Speaker 1: for bones. Aristotle thought it was a waste product, though,

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Speaker 1: and these ideas stuck around in Europe until at least

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Speaker 1: the seventeen hundreds, when anatomis started digging into it more.

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Speaker 1: One French anatomus pointed out that not all bones have marrow,

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Speaker 1: so it doesn't make sense that it was the key

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Speaker 1: to the nutrition of the bone.

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Speaker 3: But this is a food show. This one was so hard.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, the it's very It was so hard to

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Speaker 2: to narrow down to what we actually had to talk about.

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Speaker 2: I get really excited to talk about how bones are

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Speaker 2: made in our bodies. You can listen to a brain

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Speaker 2: Stuff episode about that. But yeah, yeah, basically, the yellow

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Speaker 2: marrow that supplies those cells can supply it to other

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Speaker 2: bones in the body because there's blood vessels in your

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Speaker 2: bones as well. So right, but at any rate.

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Speaker 1: At any rate, early records refer to bone marrow as

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Speaker 1: something rich and nutritious. So I think a lot of

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Speaker 1: this research is really about like the nutrition of the bone.

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Speaker 1: This early early research and perhaps a source of vitality

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Speaker 1: and manliness.

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Speaker 2: Okay.

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Speaker 3: I saw.

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Speaker 1: Sometime between four eighty and four oh six PCE, Greek

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Speaker 1: playwright Euripides wrote, love must not touch the marrow of

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Speaker 1: the soul. Our affections must be breakable chains that we

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Speaker 1: can cast them off, our titan them. So this is

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Speaker 1: from a paper I found that I think was trying

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Speaker 1: to make the point clearly. In a lot of writings,

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Speaker 1: it was saying marrow was really important and seen as

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Speaker 1: like vital to life or something. But I while I

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Speaker 1: was reading the quotes, I was kind of like, still

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Speaker 1: not got quite getting the food note.

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Speaker 3: But yeah, point to scene.

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Speaker 2: Sure, sure it might it might not be about about

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Speaker 2: marrow as a food. It might merely be these people

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Speaker 2: saying that, you know, marrow is the important inner, it's

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Speaker 2: the it's it's the creamy filling, you know.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yes, ancient Greeks may have used fire to extract

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Speaker 1: bone marrow and eaten it just like that, but more often,

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Speaker 1: probably in the form of soups. And yes, I did

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Speaker 1: find some sources that said bone marrow was later viewed

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Speaker 1: as it with me now, a yeah, it's been a

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Speaker 1: long time.

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Speaker 3: Since we've been that.

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Speaker 2: Yes, it's been a minute.

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Speaker 3: Yes, okay.

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Speaker 1: So a part of the difficulty of tracing the human

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Speaker 1: consumption of bone marrow is and this is in speculation.

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Speaker 1: This is in part speculation. On my end, it kind

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Speaker 1: of feels like one of those things people just used

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Speaker 1: and didn't write about, Like even if you weren't eating

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Speaker 1: the marrow exactly, people were probably boiling the bones into broth. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: the marrow was fortifying the liquid, and a lot of

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Speaker 1: folks all over believed it was nutritious. It is part

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Speaker 1: of our long history of making things stretch. So this

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Speaker 1: is gonna kind of feel a little sporadic, But these

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Speaker 1: are specific examples I could find. S Body records do

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Speaker 1: show bone marrow was frequently used medicinally but also culinarily

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Speaker 1: boiled into things like soups or stews are straight up roasted,

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Speaker 1: and many cultures around the world. Indigenous people in North

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Speaker 1: America used bone marrow and pemmican, which you've talked about

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Speaker 1: a lot.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, yes.

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Speaker 1: Over time, bow marrow evolved in the West into something

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Speaker 1: like a fancy food, though not all at the same

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Speaker 1: time and not everywhere that There were a few exceptions,

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Speaker 1: but generally, as it became popular in the late seventeenth century,

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Speaker 1: many upper class Europeans would eat bow marrow with specific

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Speaker 1: spoons or scoops. Some of these could be quite nice,

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Speaker 1: and according to one source I found, a man was

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Speaker 1: found guilty of stealing sixteen silver marrow spoons in London

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Speaker 1: and was shipped to Australia.

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Speaker 3: As kind of.

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Speaker 2: Wow, mayrowse spoons so valuable that like you have to

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Speaker 2: leave the continent.

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Speaker 1: Okay, that feels very specific. What a very specific crime? Well,

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Speaker 1: he had a calling a recipe out of King Henry

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Speaker 1: the Fifth Court, so sometime in the early fourteen hundreds

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Speaker 1: allegedly called for a bone marrow stuffed steak that was

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Speaker 1: then rolled up like a pancake and sweetened with honey.

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Speaker 3: Oh dau That wow sounds fancy to me. M hm.

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Speaker 1: Roasted marrow was apparently something Queen Victoria indulged in daily. Wow,

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Speaker 1: even if according to some sources it may have been

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Speaker 1: considered unladylike at the time. Okay, yes, and there is

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Speaker 1: a long history of Europeans drinking bone broth or beef

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Speaker 1: tea as well.

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Speaker 3: We talked about this in our Boollyon episode.

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Speaker 1: Pretty sure, Okay, this was not the case in a

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Speaker 1: lot of the East, though, where several variations of bone

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Speaker 1: marrow dishes emerged that, while sometimes viewed as a delicacy,

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Speaker 1: were not expensive or inaccessible, Like it was something you

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Speaker 1: didn't eat every day because it was rich, not because

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Speaker 1: it was pricey.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Yes, some of this history does seem to co side

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Speaker 1: with the introduction of things like cows, though that is

359
00:21:02,920 --> 00:21:06,680
Speaker 1: not at all the only way to consume bone marrow. Again,

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Speaker 1: you can see things like our fa episode for an example,

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Speaker 1: and there are definitely cases of dishes that were pricey

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Speaker 1: for sure.

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Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, I mean you know it's it's you only

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00:21:16,960 --> 00:21:19,240
Speaker 2: get so much, so much marrow from any given animal.

365
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Speaker 2: So there you are, right.

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Speaker 1: Bone marrow started appearing in recipes for nineteenth century classic

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Speaker 1: European dishes like Italy's osobuco francis potopia broth and Germany's

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Speaker 1: bone marrow balls.

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Speaker 2: Those are those are a little little like like like

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Speaker 2: bread bread crumb dumplings.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I never had those, but they looked good.

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Speaker 2: Yeah they do.

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Speaker 3: Yes.

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Speaker 1: Most eighteenth century New England kitches had a marrow spoon,

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Speaker 1: which if you haven't seen it, go look it up

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Speaker 1: if you have any interest. It's kind of like a long,

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Speaker 1: thin scoop. Yeah, and this seems to suggest that it

378
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Speaker 1: was fairly common in the area at the time. Different episode,

379
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Speaker 1: but Singapore's soup too Long or bone soup most likely

380
00:22:07,640 --> 00:22:09,400
Speaker 1: originated in the nineteen fifties.

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Speaker 3: I want this. It sounded so good to me.

382
00:22:14,400 --> 00:22:16,919
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, what was I'm not familiar with it.

383
00:22:17,280 --> 00:22:17,720
Speaker 3: What was in it?

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Speaker 2: Do you remember?

385
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Speaker 1: So I found it was a really great article from

386
00:22:21,560 --> 00:22:27,159
Speaker 1: NPR and it's basically like chunks of bone marrow and

387
00:22:27,280 --> 00:22:29,639
Speaker 1: a soup and it's really rich and they give you

388
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Speaker 1: a straw to stuck out the bone.

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Speaker 3: Marrow so you get all of it.

390
00:22:35,520 --> 00:22:41,719
Speaker 1: Yeah, And the person in question was trying to not

391
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Speaker 1: use the straw, but it was like stroke fumbling about

392
00:22:45,840 --> 00:22:47,720
Speaker 1: and then was like, no, please give me the straw

393
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Speaker 1: because you don't want to miss any of the bone marrow.

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Speaker 1: But it's not They were saying it was not expensive

395
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Speaker 1: and it wasn't something you have every day, but it

396
00:23:02,160 --> 00:23:04,360
Speaker 1: was easily accessible.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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00:23:05,440 --> 00:23:13,359
Speaker 1: Yeah, one day jumping ahead. Since nineteen ninety four, chef

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Speaker 1: Fergus Henderson of Saint John in London has been serving

400
00:23:16,760 --> 00:23:20,199
Speaker 1: a roasted bone marrow with parsley salad and toast. It

401
00:23:20,280 --> 00:23:22,160
Speaker 1: is the only thing that has been on the menu

402
00:23:22,280 --> 00:23:24,960
Speaker 1: since the beginning and largely informed how a lot of

403
00:23:25,040 --> 00:23:28,600
Speaker 1: chefs and customers viewed bone marrow, and.

404
00:23:28,560 --> 00:23:29,960
Speaker 3: Not just in London, like all over.

405
00:23:30,200 --> 00:23:35,160
Speaker 2: Oh yeah. Yeah, it's an extremely famous dish that is

406
00:23:35,800 --> 00:23:38,879
Speaker 2: that works so well because it's so simple and nice

407
00:23:39,040 --> 00:23:41,440
Speaker 2: and also feels very refined.

408
00:23:41,680 --> 00:23:44,639
Speaker 1: So yes, and he's got a lot of good quotes

409
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Speaker 1: about it because he's become pretty well known for it.

410
00:23:48,119 --> 00:23:53,960
Speaker 1: So here's so celebrate the bone. There's never a dull

411
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Speaker 1: moment between me and the bone.

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Speaker 3: I love it. I love it.

413
00:24:00,400 --> 00:24:04,439
Speaker 2: That's wonderful. I have to I have to admit, Annie,

414
00:24:04,480 --> 00:24:09,040
Speaker 2: I have had this dish. I'm sorry. It was really delicious.

415
00:24:09,359 --> 00:24:09,600
Speaker 1: Uh.

416
00:24:10,600 --> 00:24:12,600
Speaker 2: Ben Bollen is also mad at me about it, or

417
00:24:12,880 --> 00:24:16,720
Speaker 2: was until I believe on a relatively recent trip he

418
00:24:17,240 --> 00:24:20,679
Speaker 2: got over there and had some so he was determined

419
00:24:20,680 --> 00:24:24,800
Speaker 2: after you it was yeah, yeah, the aggression would not stand.

420
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Speaker 3: Can you When did you have it?

421
00:24:29,280 --> 00:24:32,360
Speaker 2: Oh? Gosh, a very long time ago. The only time

422
00:24:32,400 --> 00:24:38,040
Speaker 2: I've been over to England was what is time? Fifteen

423
00:24:38,160 --> 00:24:42,560
Speaker 2: ish fifteenish years ago something like that. So yeah, but

424
00:24:42,720 --> 00:24:46,480
Speaker 2: yeah it was St. Saint John was great. Everything was delicious.

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Speaker 2: It was a really nice time. I highly recommend going.

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Speaker 3: Well.

427
00:24:55,440 --> 00:24:58,760
Speaker 1: I am very jealous. I am also very happy for you.

428
00:24:59,119 --> 00:25:02,000
Speaker 1: I'm also very fueled by Spike, so I might pull

429
00:25:02,040 --> 00:25:08,000
Speaker 1: a bin bowling in the future. We'll see. No. I

430
00:25:08,040 --> 00:25:11,800
Speaker 1: am happy for you, Lauren, but also just mean just

431
00:25:11,840 --> 00:25:17,280
Speaker 1: means we have to go there, we go Okay, okay,

432
00:25:17,680 --> 00:25:20,800
Speaker 1: well mate, Well we've got so many plans.

433
00:25:20,520 --> 00:25:22,800
Speaker 2: We do, we do, but we can incorporate that one.

434
00:25:22,920 --> 00:25:26,720
Speaker 2: Come on, yeah, all the world in the world, let's go.

435
00:25:27,320 --> 00:25:29,720
Speaker 1: This dish I'm telling you popped up in so many

436
00:25:29,840 --> 00:25:32,920
Speaker 1: of the articles I did for research, So yeah, it

437
00:25:33,000 --> 00:25:33,880
Speaker 1: had a huge impact.

438
00:25:34,480 --> 00:25:37,920
Speaker 3: Mm hmm. That Parsley salad sounds so good.

439
00:25:38,359 --> 00:25:39,160
Speaker 2: It's really nice.

440
00:25:41,480 --> 00:25:41,800
Speaker 3: Whoa.

441
00:25:41,840 --> 00:25:44,320
Speaker 1: And he talked about like the presentation of it, how

442
00:25:44,359 --> 00:25:47,480
Speaker 1: you like present it when it's still kind of not ready,

443
00:25:47,520 --> 00:25:49,280
Speaker 1: and then you get to decide.

444
00:25:50,160 --> 00:25:56,000
Speaker 3: Your ratios of all right, all right, I shall move on.

445
00:25:58,840 --> 00:26:02,920
Speaker 1: So, as we've discussed before, the nose to tail movement,

446
00:26:03,400 --> 00:26:06,880
Speaker 1: or the idea of eating everything and not wasting anything

447
00:26:07,080 --> 00:26:10,800
Speaker 1: edible of an animal did lead to more bone marrow

448
00:26:10,840 --> 00:26:14,200
Speaker 1: on menus and more folks trying it. As we've said,

449
00:26:14,320 --> 00:26:17,879
Speaker 1: I would still say it's not common necessarily, but you

450
00:26:17,920 --> 00:26:21,560
Speaker 1: can't find it for sure in other areas, though they

451
00:26:21,760 --> 00:26:22,639
Speaker 1: it is and has.

452
00:26:22,520 --> 00:26:25,280
Speaker 3: Been common, as mentioned like in Singapore.

453
00:26:25,600 --> 00:26:30,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, and also this isn't quite the same thing. But

454
00:26:30,160 --> 00:26:32,359
Speaker 1: I think we would be remiss if we didn't mention

455
00:26:32,480 --> 00:26:35,840
Speaker 1: how bone broth has become a bit of a health

456
00:26:35,840 --> 00:26:39,159
Speaker 1: food here in the US and elsewhere in the West,

457
00:26:39,640 --> 00:26:41,920
Speaker 1: really taking off in twenty eighteen ish. It was a

458
00:26:41,960 --> 00:26:45,120
Speaker 1: little before then, but seemed to really take off that year.

459
00:26:45,920 --> 00:26:49,280
Speaker 1: But again, it has been pretty common throughout history and

460
00:26:49,440 --> 00:26:50,880
Speaker 1: in the East, that's not a new thing.

461
00:26:51,480 --> 00:26:52,240
Speaker 3: Yeah at all.

462
00:26:52,720 --> 00:26:55,320
Speaker 2: Yeah. I ranted about this a little bit in our

463
00:26:55,400 --> 00:26:59,159
Speaker 2: Billion episode. But yeah, bone broth just means stock. It

464
00:26:59,240 --> 00:27:02,240
Speaker 2: just means stock. You're talking about a stock. You're talking

465
00:27:02,240 --> 00:27:05,640
Speaker 2: about a soup that you have made by simmering bones

466
00:27:06,200 --> 00:27:10,600
Speaker 2: in water with other stuff and then the good stuff

467
00:27:10,600 --> 00:27:13,439
Speaker 2: in the bones gets in to the stock and then

468
00:27:13,440 --> 00:27:16,199
Speaker 2: you drink it and it's great. You know. It's this,

469
00:27:16,640 --> 00:27:19,000
Speaker 2: It is known like we have known this for forever,

470
00:27:19,840 --> 00:27:22,880
Speaker 2: and just calling it bone broth isn't making it some

471
00:27:23,000 --> 00:27:26,280
Speaker 2: like new revolutionary thing. It's a marketing term. And marketing

472
00:27:26,320 --> 00:27:33,080
Speaker 2: food terms make me really, really dizzy sometimes because I

473
00:27:33,160 --> 00:27:36,200
Speaker 2: just don't understand. I do understand why people do things,

474
00:27:36,200 --> 00:27:41,600
Speaker 2: and it's for money and that drives me nuts. But anyway, Yeah,

475
00:27:42,080 --> 00:27:45,359
Speaker 2: a large part of bone broth is usually the collagen

476
00:27:45,600 --> 00:27:48,960
Speaker 2: that's in bones, not and there is collagen and marrow,

477
00:27:49,040 --> 00:27:51,520
Speaker 2: but mostly you talking about like the connective tissue and

478
00:27:51,560 --> 00:27:55,800
Speaker 2: the small bones of like calf hooves or chicken bones

479
00:27:56,080 --> 00:27:59,399
Speaker 2: or something like that. But yeah, it can involve marrow.

480
00:28:00,240 --> 00:28:02,680
Speaker 3: Sure. Yeah.

481
00:28:02,680 --> 00:28:05,800
Speaker 1: Well, and it came up a lot when I was

482
00:28:05,840 --> 00:28:08,200
Speaker 1: researching this, and I found an article again from MPR,

483
00:28:08,240 --> 00:28:13,880
Speaker 1: a separate article where they were saying that it had

484
00:28:13,960 --> 00:28:18,760
Speaker 1: driven up bone broth and the trendiness of it in

485
00:28:18,800 --> 00:28:21,760
Speaker 1: the US had driven up the price for bone marrow bone.

486
00:28:21,520 --> 00:28:23,760
Speaker 2: From marrow bones. Sure, yeah, yes, yeah.

487
00:28:24,080 --> 00:28:28,320
Speaker 1: It was impacting the industry in that way. So it's

488
00:28:28,320 --> 00:28:30,560
Speaker 1: always good to keep those things in mind.

489
00:28:30,960 --> 00:28:31,640
Speaker 2: Yeah.

490
00:28:32,560 --> 00:28:36,840
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, I'm telling you this one had a lot

491
00:28:36,840 --> 00:28:39,720
Speaker 1: of rabbit holes. I I even at the bottom of

492
00:28:39,800 --> 00:28:43,520
Speaker 1: this outline was like, I just for just so you know, Lord,

493
00:28:43,720 --> 00:28:45,640
Speaker 1: there was a rabbit hole we did not go on.

494
00:28:45,760 --> 00:28:50,400
Speaker 1: But and it has so many dishes that I feel

495
00:28:50,480 --> 00:28:52,680
Speaker 1: we could dive into more depth.

496
00:28:53,080 --> 00:28:56,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, if you have a favorite use of bone marrow,

497
00:28:56,520 --> 00:28:58,720
Speaker 3: if you've had any of these things that we mentioned,

498
00:29:00,320 --> 00:29:02,080
Speaker 3: please please let us know.

499
00:29:02,400 --> 00:29:05,160
Speaker 2: Please do we want to hear We want to hear

500
00:29:05,280 --> 00:29:09,600
Speaker 2: about it and in detail. But yes, we do already

501
00:29:09,680 --> 00:29:11,400
Speaker 2: have some listener mail for you, and we are going

502
00:29:11,400 --> 00:29:12,760
Speaker 2: to get into that as soon as we get back

503
00:29:12,760 --> 00:29:15,560
Speaker 2: from one more quick break forward from our sponsors.

504
00:29:24,360 --> 00:29:27,479
Speaker 3: And we're back. Thank you sponsor, Yes, thank you, and

505
00:29:27,520 --> 00:29:29,600
Speaker 3: we're back with snow.

506
00:29:32,000 --> 00:29:32,200
Speaker 2: Man.

507
00:29:35,680 --> 00:29:40,320
Speaker 3: So smooth, So smooth. M hm.

508
00:29:42,040 --> 00:29:46,600
Speaker 1: Okay, Carrie wrote this spring and summer, you've brought me

509
00:29:46,720 --> 00:29:49,720
Speaker 1: way back to my childhood in the South. My mother

510
00:29:49,800 --> 00:29:53,520
Speaker 1: made the best potato salad with the combination mayonnaise and

511
00:29:53,600 --> 00:29:58,800
Speaker 1: yellow mustard dressing, always served in this giant green corningwear bowl.

512
00:29:59,560 --> 00:30:02,280
Speaker 1: The same bowl was also used for all the lime

513
00:30:02,440 --> 00:30:08,000
Speaker 1: jello pineapple salad. Anyway, we only ate potato salad at home.

514
00:30:08,400 --> 00:30:11,560
Speaker 1: All of us are distressful of potato salads anywhere else,

515
00:30:11,840 --> 00:30:14,320
Speaker 1: both for the taste and the fear of it. Having

516
00:30:14,360 --> 00:30:18,000
Speaker 1: set out for a long time, and I've been meaning

517
00:30:18,000 --> 00:30:21,480
Speaker 1: to write to you about some spring episodes. Thousand Island

518
00:30:21,560 --> 00:30:24,280
Speaker 1: for me was associated with a fancy dinner, usually a

519
00:30:24,320 --> 00:30:27,320
Speaker 1: steak dinner. My grandmother took us to a nice restaurant,

520
00:30:27,360 --> 00:30:29,400
Speaker 1: and all I remember was the toss salad with one

521
00:30:29,440 --> 00:30:33,720
Speaker 1: thousand island dressing. My parents made a steak, baked potato

522
00:30:33,880 --> 00:30:36,040
Speaker 1: and tossed salad dinner for me in a small group

523
00:30:36,080 --> 00:30:39,040
Speaker 1: of friends for my birthday. You guessed it. The salad

524
00:30:39,080 --> 00:30:44,600
Speaker 1: dressing one thousand Island. Mountain dew I came along before

525
00:30:44,640 --> 00:30:47,200
Speaker 1: the nineties and the extreme advertising.

526
00:30:47,520 --> 00:30:48,400
Speaker 3: Can you hear me yelling?

527
00:30:49,000 --> 00:30:52,200
Speaker 1: Mountain dew was a drink for a hot summer day.

528
00:30:52,800 --> 00:30:54,800
Speaker 1: I never cared for it with the meal, but by

529
00:30:54,840 --> 00:30:58,360
Speaker 1: itself in the afternoon it was perfect. Curiously, I have

530
00:30:58,560 --> 00:31:02,360
Speaker 1: met two people who were at to mountain dew. They

531
00:31:02,400 --> 00:31:05,080
Speaker 1: had to have it every day, sometimes multiple times a day.

532
00:31:05,440 --> 00:31:08,040
Speaker 1: One of them gave up mountain dew for lint.

533
00:31:08,320 --> 00:31:09,160
Speaker 3: It was scary.

534
00:31:10,360 --> 00:31:16,560
Speaker 1: Oh wow, yeah, yikes.

535
00:31:16,680 --> 00:31:23,320
Speaker 3: All right. People love what they love, sometimes to a detriment.

536
00:31:23,080 --> 00:31:25,640
Speaker 2: That it's a true statement that is accurate.

537
00:31:25,840 --> 00:31:30,520
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I do love them.

538
00:31:30,560 --> 00:31:34,440
Speaker 1: It's funny as a kid, how sometimes your whoever in

539
00:31:34,480 --> 00:31:37,440
Speaker 1: your life would take you to a nice restaurant, the

540
00:31:37,480 --> 00:31:42,480
Speaker 1: thing you remember is like the croutons or yeah, because as.

541
00:31:42,280 --> 00:31:44,520
Speaker 3: A kid, you're like, yeah, what's all this?

542
00:31:44,760 --> 00:31:50,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's your tastes are so specific and developing and yeah, yeah,

543
00:31:50,080 --> 00:31:52,040
Speaker 2: you're like, but the croutons.

544
00:31:51,440 --> 00:31:56,760
Speaker 1: Though, but the cuons, yes, delicious, yes, And I love

545
00:31:56,800 --> 00:31:59,320
Speaker 1: your very specific potato salad memories.

546
00:32:00,040 --> 00:32:03,040
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, down to the dish. And I believe my

547
00:32:03,120 --> 00:32:06,560
Speaker 2: grandmother had that same corner where bowl so here we are.

548
00:32:07,640 --> 00:32:10,080
Speaker 2: And also I don't think that she used it for

549
00:32:10,160 --> 00:32:16,800
Speaker 2: the I feel like she usually made jello salads and

550
00:32:16,960 --> 00:32:19,360
Speaker 2: individual serving sizes.

551
00:32:19,840 --> 00:32:25,680
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, whoa pretty fancy're right there.

552
00:32:26,920 --> 00:32:29,280
Speaker 2: But she absolutely would put some canned pineapple and some

553
00:32:29,320 --> 00:32:36,440
Speaker 2: lime jello. Yeah, or shredded carrots or what was the

554
00:32:36,480 --> 00:32:38,160
Speaker 2: other thing. Those are the two main ones.

555
00:32:38,240 --> 00:32:45,000
Speaker 3: Yeah. Wow, we get up to all kinds of things.

556
00:32:45,360 --> 00:32:46,720
Speaker 2: Humans, Yes, that's true.

557
00:32:48,240 --> 00:32:50,200
Speaker 3: Yes we do, that's true.

558
00:32:50,240 --> 00:32:52,280
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, No, that was like a savory side salad

559
00:32:52,960 --> 00:32:56,200
Speaker 2: that she would serve us during the summer. Yeah, it

560
00:32:56,320 --> 00:33:03,280
Speaker 2: was great, It was great, Okay, Christine wrote in the

561
00:33:03,280 --> 00:33:05,440
Speaker 2: potato Salad episode, I was so pleased to hear you

562
00:33:05,520 --> 00:33:08,440
Speaker 2: mention eggs as a known ingredient in potato salad. One

563
00:33:08,440 --> 00:33:11,560
Speaker 2: of my enduring potato salad based memories concerned a barbecue

564
00:33:11,560 --> 00:33:14,280
Speaker 2: where my mother took a potato salad that contained eggs.

565
00:33:14,760 --> 00:33:17,640
Speaker 2: The host of the barbecue, a very rude, opinionated man

566
00:33:17,680 --> 00:33:21,920
Speaker 2: who knew everything, was very loud and obnoxious about expressing

567
00:33:22,000 --> 00:33:24,760
Speaker 2: that eggs don't go in potato salad. He kept on

568
00:33:25,000 --> 00:33:27,200
Speaker 2: and on about it until his son told him to

569
00:33:27,280 --> 00:33:30,160
Speaker 2: shut the word. Rhyming with duck off and asked my

570
00:33:30,280 --> 00:33:34,080
Speaker 2: mother for the recipe. That son had just entered his

571
00:33:34,200 --> 00:33:37,000
Speaker 2: second year as a chef apprentice, and from what I

572
00:33:37,040 --> 00:33:39,640
Speaker 2: can gather, is now a foody big wig in Singapore.

573
00:33:40,400 --> 00:33:42,760
Speaker 2: Before we lost touch, I had a number of potato

574
00:33:42,800 --> 00:33:46,240
Speaker 2: salads that he had made, several of which contained eggs.

575
00:33:47,880 --> 00:33:51,400
Speaker 2: Uh overweight opinionated chauvinists aside, there aren't a lot of

576
00:33:51,400 --> 00:33:54,480
Speaker 2: hard and fast rules to Australian potato salad, probably because

577
00:33:54,520 --> 00:33:57,760
Speaker 2: it's not an important cultural dish. It's just something everyone enjoys.

578
00:33:58,440 --> 00:34:02,040
Speaker 2: My preferred potato salad use is a kip flair potatoes

579
00:34:02,040 --> 00:34:04,680
Speaker 2: for preference, but any potato is fine. It also has

580
00:34:04,720 --> 00:34:09,480
Speaker 2: celery tiny tomatoes, drained capers, finely chopped shallats, watercress or

581
00:34:09,760 --> 00:34:14,080
Speaker 2: rocket slash, arugula, and chatdar cheese. My preferred dressing is

582
00:34:15,000 --> 00:34:18,480
Speaker 2: Beerenberg beer and Berg brand Parmesan Caesar dressing. I have

583
00:34:18,560 --> 00:34:21,360
Speaker 2: no idea what an equivalent US dressing would be. Sorry.

584
00:34:22,360 --> 00:34:24,080
Speaker 2: I make it a lot because it's easy and can

585
00:34:24,080 --> 00:34:27,080
Speaker 2: be paired with anything or eaten by itself. I'm hoping

586
00:34:27,160 --> 00:34:31,440
Speaker 2: you get many other potato salad recipes, you and me

587
00:34:31,600 --> 00:34:36,320
Speaker 2: both yes, Oh yes, huh.

588
00:34:36,400 --> 00:34:39,719
Speaker 1: I love this this is so different than like any

589
00:34:39,719 --> 00:34:41,520
Speaker 1: potato salad I've encountered.

590
00:34:42,520 --> 00:34:44,960
Speaker 2: It's some of it is very similar, but some of

591
00:34:45,000 --> 00:34:50,200
Speaker 2: it like like the cheddar cheese, and for me, the

592
00:34:50,280 --> 00:34:55,080
Speaker 2: tomatoes are are like ham. It sounds great. Yeah, that

593
00:34:55,200 --> 00:34:59,600
Speaker 2: sounds like I want to eat that. I mean sea

594
00:34:59,680 --> 00:35:02,239
Speaker 2: in our potato salad, like I want to eat potatoes.

595
00:35:03,600 --> 00:35:06,200
Speaker 2: I basically just want to. Yes, like if you make

596
00:35:06,200 --> 00:35:07,920
Speaker 2: a potato salad as long as it's not going to

597
00:35:08,000 --> 00:35:11,080
Speaker 2: like low key poison me, like yes, like totally right.

598
00:35:11,680 --> 00:35:17,200
Speaker 2: But yeah, and then the caesar dressing like okay, like

599
00:35:17,239 --> 00:35:18,239
Speaker 2: all right, yeah, I.

600
00:35:18,239 --> 00:35:20,480
Speaker 1: Wouldn't have thought of that, but that makes complete sense.

601
00:35:21,920 --> 00:35:26,880
Speaker 1: I did go on a hunt. I mentioned in that episode.

602
00:35:26,920 --> 00:35:30,560
Speaker 1: I had a favorite potato salad, but that restaurant closed.

603
00:35:30,719 --> 00:35:35,600
Speaker 1: Oh no, I'm trying to find like a menu, hmm,

604
00:35:36,760 --> 00:35:39,520
Speaker 1: couldn't find Oh no, I just want to know.

605
00:35:39,560 --> 00:35:40,239
Speaker 3: What was in it?

606
00:35:40,719 --> 00:35:45,480
Speaker 2: Sure, sure, what restaurant was it from?

607
00:35:46,920 --> 00:35:50,279
Speaker 1: It was from a tiny next to a gas station

608
00:35:50,440 --> 00:35:53,120
Speaker 1: restaurant called Tambos in Alberta, Alabama.

609
00:35:54,040 --> 00:35:57,239
Speaker 2: Okay, all right, well y'all, y'all are on the case

610
00:35:57,280 --> 00:36:11,200
Speaker 2: now Tambos and Alberta, Alabama. Okay, okay, yeah.

611
00:36:10,160 --> 00:36:14,359
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's I mean I could find like the whiteboard

612
00:36:15,239 --> 00:36:15,879
Speaker 1: that had like.

613
00:36:15,800 --> 00:36:20,400
Speaker 3: The specials on it, but I couldn't find any specifics

614
00:36:20,800 --> 00:36:21,560
Speaker 3: that I need.

615
00:36:23,520 --> 00:36:29,280
Speaker 1: But anyway, yes, Thank you to both of these listeners

616
00:36:29,400 --> 00:36:31,800
Speaker 1: for writing in. If you would like to write to

617
00:36:31,880 --> 00:36:35,480
Speaker 1: as you can, Our email is hello, atsavorpod dot com.

618
00:36:35,560 --> 00:36:38,680
Speaker 2: We're also on social media. You can find us on Twitter, Facebook,

619
00:36:38,719 --> 00:36:41,279
Speaker 2: and Instagram at saber pod and we do hope to

620
00:36:41,320 --> 00:36:44,440
Speaker 2: hear from you. Save is production of iHeartRadio. For more

621
00:36:44,440 --> 00:36:47,280
Speaker 2: podcasts from my Heart Radio, you can visit the iHeartRadio app,

622
00:36:47,440 --> 00:36:50,240
Speaker 2: Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.

623
00:36:50,560 --> 00:36:53,880
Speaker 2: Thanks as always to our superproducers Dylan Fagan and Andrew Howard.

624
00:36:54,160 --> 00:36:55,920
Speaker 2: Thanks to you for listening, and we hope that lots

625
00:36:55,960 --> 00:37:05,040
Speaker 2: more good things are coming your way