1 00:00:01,480 --> 00:00:07,680 Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff You Should Know, a production of iHeartRadio. 2 00:00:11,119 --> 00:00:13,560 Speaker 2: Hey, and welcome to the podcast. I'm Josh, and there's 3 00:00:13,640 --> 00:00:16,279 Speaker 2: Chuck and Jerry's here too. We're on fire with yet 4 00:00:16,320 --> 00:00:20,200 Speaker 2: another fire episode of Stuff you Should Know About Fire. 5 00:00:21,480 --> 00:00:24,239 Speaker 3: Yeah, So Jerry asked me when you left the. 6 00:00:24,280 --> 00:00:27,400 Speaker 4: Room too, surprised we hadn't done one on fire, and 7 00:00:27,400 --> 00:00:29,280 Speaker 4: I said, well, we did years ago on just sort 8 00:00:29,320 --> 00:00:31,240 Speaker 4: of more than nuts and bolts in the science of 9 00:00:31,400 --> 00:00:35,040 Speaker 4: the actual thing that is fire, right, But I commissioned 10 00:00:35,040 --> 00:00:38,239 Speaker 4: this one from Dave. I believe that's a little more 11 00:00:38,240 --> 00:00:41,159 Speaker 4: along the lines of like what did it mean for people? 12 00:00:41,240 --> 00:00:44,960 Speaker 4: And like kind of when you know? I wondered, like, 13 00:00:45,280 --> 00:00:47,960 Speaker 4: did we learn how to make fire? Was there like 14 00:00:48,000 --> 00:00:50,199 Speaker 4: a day that that happened? And do we know that 15 00:00:50,400 --> 00:00:53,800 Speaker 4: day and that person? And the answer is no, Unfortunately, 16 00:00:53,880 --> 00:00:54,440 Speaker 4: we don't know. 17 00:00:55,200 --> 00:00:59,800 Speaker 2: We not only don't know that, also our technology will 18 00:00:59,800 --> 00:01:02,160 Speaker 2: all will certainly never be so advanced that we will 19 00:01:02,200 --> 00:01:05,600 Speaker 2: ever find out now. And one of the reasons why 20 00:01:05,680 --> 00:01:11,680 Speaker 2: is because there probably was multiple people at different times 21 00:01:12,200 --> 00:01:16,480 Speaker 2: around the world who learned how to manipulate fire. And 22 00:01:16,560 --> 00:01:20,399 Speaker 2: also there's there wasn't just like a one day where 23 00:01:20,600 --> 00:01:22,840 Speaker 2: fire didn't exist, and then all of a sudden, somebody 24 00:01:22,920 --> 00:01:26,280 Speaker 2: like strikes a flint and some hirt or something like that, 25 00:01:26,640 --> 00:01:31,120 Speaker 2: and now there's fire. It happened in stages humans interactions 26 00:01:31,160 --> 00:01:34,640 Speaker 2: with fire, and luckily for us, even though there isn't 27 00:01:34,680 --> 00:01:37,360 Speaker 2: one day that this happened and we can't say like 28 00:01:37,440 --> 00:01:39,840 Speaker 2: it was Todd, Todd was the one who invented fire. 29 00:01:40,520 --> 00:01:44,160 Speaker 2: It is a very fascinating subject. It's definitely up my alley. 30 00:01:44,520 --> 00:01:44,839 Speaker 3: Yeah. 31 00:01:44,880 --> 00:01:48,760 Speaker 4: And it may have also not been linear. We may 32 00:01:48,800 --> 00:01:51,320 Speaker 4: have had control of fire for a while and then 33 00:01:51,440 --> 00:01:52,240 Speaker 4: not for a while. 34 00:01:52,640 --> 00:01:53,240 Speaker 3: Yeah. 35 00:01:53,280 --> 00:01:58,440 Speaker 4: So basically what everyone agrees on scientifically is that the 36 00:01:58,520 --> 00:02:01,400 Speaker 4: discovery fire was not an inn, but it was a process. 37 00:02:01,920 --> 00:02:06,560 Speaker 2: Right, And the traditional story goes that Prometheus went on 38 00:02:06,600 --> 00:02:11,040 Speaker 2: a quest for fire, ended up hooking up essentially with 39 00:02:11,120 --> 00:02:14,280 Speaker 2: a human woman, and found that humans were way better 40 00:02:14,440 --> 00:02:18,240 Speaker 2: than his own species. That's right, and we got fire 41 00:02:18,280 --> 00:02:22,079 Speaker 2: from that, that's right. So we talked a little bit 42 00:02:22,080 --> 00:02:25,680 Speaker 2: about fire and how much we needed I remember saying 43 00:02:25,720 --> 00:02:28,640 Speaker 2: that I saw somewhere that we're obligate fire users, that 44 00:02:28,680 --> 00:02:32,160 Speaker 2: we essentially needed it to survive, and that raised the 45 00:02:32,240 --> 00:02:34,519 Speaker 2: question like do we still need it? And the answers yes, 46 00:02:34,560 --> 00:02:37,320 Speaker 2: we use it still today, but the role that it 47 00:02:37,360 --> 00:02:41,080 Speaker 2: played in human development is just staggering. Like just the 48 00:02:41,160 --> 00:02:47,280 Speaker 2: idea of cooking alone is like just that revolutionary change 49 00:02:47,639 --> 00:02:49,640 Speaker 2: and all of the stuff that that unlocked for ust 50 00:02:49,720 --> 00:02:52,800 Speaker 2: nutrient wise, taste wise, let's not forget about taste. But 51 00:02:52,840 --> 00:02:55,920 Speaker 2: then also like we made metals with it, we made 52 00:02:55,960 --> 00:02:59,120 Speaker 2: pottery with it, we kept animals at bay with it, 53 00:02:59,200 --> 00:03:02,960 Speaker 2: even Mosquito they don't like fires. We learned to do 54 00:03:03,040 --> 00:03:06,200 Speaker 2: all these different things to interact and manipulate our world 55 00:03:06,360 --> 00:03:10,160 Speaker 2: using fire. So the idea of not having fire, it's 56 00:03:10,200 --> 00:03:11,760 Speaker 2: just terrifying. 57 00:03:12,080 --> 00:03:13,960 Speaker 4: Yeah, for sure. And you know, I know, we talked 58 00:03:13,960 --> 00:03:17,120 Speaker 4: about this a little bit there. Theories that human language 59 00:03:17,160 --> 00:03:19,799 Speaker 4: was born around the campfire because now people were awake 60 00:03:20,480 --> 00:03:23,160 Speaker 4: and needed something to do when they sat around the fire, 61 00:03:23,240 --> 00:03:27,040 Speaker 4: like talk about what they did that day. Obviously, fires 62 00:03:27,680 --> 00:03:32,120 Speaker 4: would eventually power the fires that made steam possible and 63 00:03:32,160 --> 00:03:35,360 Speaker 4: steam engines possible and birth the industrial revolution. 64 00:03:35,640 --> 00:03:38,040 Speaker 3: So fire very important. 65 00:03:39,120 --> 00:03:46,080 Speaker 4: It's a technology which basically blew early humans minds. Obviously 66 00:03:46,120 --> 00:03:47,640 Speaker 4: they didn't learn how to make fire at first, and 67 00:03:47,640 --> 00:03:49,200 Speaker 4: we're going to go through these stages like the first 68 00:03:49,200 --> 00:03:52,680 Speaker 4: fire came from you know, a lightning strike, but even that, 69 00:03:53,880 --> 00:03:57,680 Speaker 4: you know, probably blew the minds of whatever was walking 70 00:03:57,720 --> 00:04:00,160 Speaker 4: around back then and saw the ground on fire all 71 00:04:00,200 --> 00:04:00,720 Speaker 4: of a sudden. 72 00:04:01,040 --> 00:04:03,600 Speaker 2: Well yeah, what I've found fascinating though, is the idea 73 00:04:03,720 --> 00:04:07,560 Speaker 2: that fire is actually fairly new to Earth. You know, 74 00:04:07,680 --> 00:04:12,240 Speaker 2: like Earth was a watery planet for billions of years, 75 00:04:12,240 --> 00:04:15,600 Speaker 2: and it wasn't until the atmosphere kind of congealed into 76 00:04:15,640 --> 00:04:20,840 Speaker 2: its oxygenous state like it is now and that vegetation grew, 77 00:04:21,400 --> 00:04:24,359 Speaker 2: and then you started to have lightning strikes too. You 78 00:04:24,440 --> 00:04:27,240 Speaker 2: put all those three things together, now you've got fire 79 00:04:27,480 --> 00:04:30,359 Speaker 2: and it didn't exist before on Earth. That was not 80 00:04:30,480 --> 00:04:32,839 Speaker 2: something I've ever really thought of before. I thought that 81 00:04:32,920 --> 00:04:33,560 Speaker 2: was pretty cool. 82 00:04:33,960 --> 00:04:34,200 Speaker 3: Yeah. 83 00:04:34,279 --> 00:04:36,280 Speaker 4: I think they said the Earth has been kind of 84 00:04:36,440 --> 00:04:40,559 Speaker 4: fire ideal for about four hundred and seventy million years, 85 00:04:40,600 --> 00:04:42,520 Speaker 4: which is certainly a long time, but not on the 86 00:04:42,640 --> 00:04:46,320 Speaker 4: order of you know, billions and billions of years. If 87 00:04:46,320 --> 00:04:48,600 Speaker 4: you go forward in time a bit to about six 88 00:04:48,640 --> 00:04:53,720 Speaker 4: million years ago, that's when the first homonyms appeared in Africa. 89 00:04:54,240 --> 00:04:57,200 Speaker 4: So now, all of a sudden, you have the conditions 90 00:04:57,200 --> 00:05:00,760 Speaker 4: for fire, and you have you know, say, people has 91 00:05:00,800 --> 00:05:01,400 Speaker 4: that even. 92 00:05:01,240 --> 00:05:04,240 Speaker 2: Correct Hominin's are people yeah. 93 00:05:03,960 --> 00:05:05,600 Speaker 3: Okay, I just don't even know what people means. 94 00:05:05,920 --> 00:05:07,760 Speaker 2: Hominins are people, too, Chuck. 95 00:05:07,760 --> 00:05:09,080 Speaker 3: That's what I think. 96 00:05:09,560 --> 00:05:12,640 Speaker 4: All of a sudden, you had people that could eventually 97 00:05:12,760 --> 00:05:14,800 Speaker 4: harness fire and then learn to make fire, or at 98 00:05:14,800 --> 00:05:17,680 Speaker 4: the very least realize the benefits and take great interest 99 00:05:17,680 --> 00:05:18,080 Speaker 4: in fire. 100 00:05:18,520 --> 00:05:22,640 Speaker 2: Yeah, they think, actually it's probable. So the best way 101 00:05:22,680 --> 00:05:24,719 Speaker 2: to kind of look back in this kind of prehistory 102 00:05:24,720 --> 00:05:27,920 Speaker 2: where there's not only no written record or even an 103 00:05:28,040 --> 00:05:32,600 Speaker 2: oral tradition, like there's no archaeological evidence at this point 104 00:05:32,680 --> 00:05:35,720 Speaker 2: yet still even right, so it's all just complete conjecture, 105 00:05:36,040 --> 00:05:38,240 Speaker 2: but a pretty good way to kind of approach the 106 00:05:38,240 --> 00:05:40,719 Speaker 2: whole thing is to say, Okay, how do animals interact 107 00:05:40,720 --> 00:05:43,920 Speaker 2: with fire? Right? Because those first hominins were pretty close 108 00:05:44,000 --> 00:05:49,159 Speaker 2: to the great ape ancestors we evolved from. Still, so 109 00:05:49,360 --> 00:05:50,960 Speaker 2: you can make a pretty good case that they would 110 00:05:50,960 --> 00:05:53,960 Speaker 2: have interacted with fire like other animals do it. Animals 111 00:05:54,000 --> 00:05:56,839 Speaker 2: basically run away from it, they ignore it, depending on 112 00:05:56,880 --> 00:05:58,479 Speaker 2: whether it's a third or not, and then some of 113 00:05:58,520 --> 00:06:01,760 Speaker 2: them actually use it to their advanceage, like raptors have 114 00:06:01,800 --> 00:06:06,200 Speaker 2: been seen picking up burning sticks and dropping them elsewhere 115 00:06:06,200 --> 00:06:09,520 Speaker 2: to flush out prey and corey essentially, which is a 116 00:06:09,600 --> 00:06:11,200 Speaker 2: jerk move, but it works. 117 00:06:11,360 --> 00:06:12,200 Speaker 3: Yeah, for sure. 118 00:06:12,279 --> 00:06:14,039 Speaker 4: And if there was ever any kind of you know, 119 00:06:14,120 --> 00:06:17,840 Speaker 4: wildfire that started because of a lightning strike right behind that, 120 00:06:17,880 --> 00:06:20,800 Speaker 4: you would see predators like wolves or even some birds, 121 00:06:22,200 --> 00:06:24,919 Speaker 4: either preying on the animals as a flea or just 122 00:06:24,960 --> 00:06:27,320 Speaker 4: having a better hunting ground because things were now kind 123 00:06:27,320 --> 00:06:28,080 Speaker 4: of burned down. 124 00:06:28,160 --> 00:06:31,440 Speaker 2: You could see everything, right, So you can make a 125 00:06:31,480 --> 00:06:35,320 Speaker 2: pretty good case that early early humans would have essentially 126 00:06:35,440 --> 00:06:39,800 Speaker 2: been doing the same thing that we would have eventually 127 00:06:40,320 --> 00:06:44,480 Speaker 2: figured out that fire offers things that non fiery things 128 00:06:44,560 --> 00:06:48,680 Speaker 2: don't like. For example, we probably started foraging was the 129 00:06:48,680 --> 00:06:51,960 Speaker 2: first step where after a wildfire we might have been 130 00:06:52,000 --> 00:06:54,840 Speaker 2: looking for things to eat and been like, this tastes 131 00:06:55,040 --> 00:06:58,000 Speaker 2: way better than when I catch it and pull its 132 00:06:58,040 --> 00:07:01,120 Speaker 2: head off and then start eating whatever happening here. This 133 00:07:01,200 --> 00:07:02,960 Speaker 2: fire is doing something great to this. 134 00:07:03,560 --> 00:07:07,640 Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, the idea of accidental cooked meat must 135 00:07:07,640 --> 00:07:09,760 Speaker 4: have just been mind blowing. 136 00:07:10,400 --> 00:07:13,760 Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, I mean, a rare steak is a 137 00:07:13,800 --> 00:07:19,280 Speaker 2: thing of beauty in and of itself. But yeah, I 138 00:07:19,320 --> 00:07:21,320 Speaker 2: don't want to say well done, but yes, cooked meat 139 00:07:21,400 --> 00:07:24,880 Speaker 2: is good too. A cooked turkey leg is way better 140 00:07:25,040 --> 00:07:26,440 Speaker 2: than a raw turkey leg. 141 00:07:27,240 --> 00:07:30,520 Speaker 3: Yeah. Hey, I've never tested that theory, but I bet 142 00:07:30,560 --> 00:07:30,960 Speaker 3: you're right. 143 00:07:31,320 --> 00:07:33,040 Speaker 2: It's one of those things that you don't even have 144 00:07:33,080 --> 00:07:35,480 Speaker 2: to try yourself. You just innately know it. And it's 145 00:07:35,600 --> 00:07:37,239 Speaker 2: from this era. 146 00:07:38,080 --> 00:07:38,800 Speaker 3: Yeah, that's right. 147 00:07:39,400 --> 00:07:42,600 Speaker 4: Gathering after foraging was the next step of sort of 148 00:07:42,640 --> 00:07:47,160 Speaker 4: the discovery of fire, and that's when humans were like, hey, 149 00:07:48,600 --> 00:07:50,800 Speaker 4: I have this fire. It may have happened by lightning strike, 150 00:07:51,360 --> 00:07:54,600 Speaker 4: but I now have it in a little bindle in 151 00:07:54,640 --> 00:07:57,400 Speaker 4: my hand, and I can or maybe in a log hollow, 152 00:07:57,760 --> 00:07:59,640 Speaker 4: and I can carry this thing from one place to 153 00:07:59,680 --> 00:08:02,320 Speaker 4: another now, or maybe it's just a tree branch if 154 00:08:02,360 --> 00:08:04,480 Speaker 4: you're a little bit more of a simpleton like TikTok was, 155 00:08:05,200 --> 00:08:09,119 Speaker 4: and now you could transport your fire from one area 156 00:08:09,160 --> 00:08:11,480 Speaker 4: to the other, and you can use that fire to 157 00:08:12,040 --> 00:08:15,640 Speaker 4: flush prey out or to protect yourself from the sabertooth 158 00:08:15,680 --> 00:08:16,440 Speaker 4: tiger or whatever. 159 00:08:17,280 --> 00:08:19,680 Speaker 2: Yeah, that's a big one that I hadn't really thought 160 00:08:19,720 --> 00:08:22,440 Speaker 2: of before. But you keep animals at bait because animals 161 00:08:22,480 --> 00:08:25,320 Speaker 2: are used to wildfires and not going near them. So 162 00:08:25,440 --> 00:08:28,160 Speaker 2: if you're a human or a hominin and you're huddling 163 00:08:28,200 --> 00:08:31,280 Speaker 2: around the fire, the sabertooth tiger probably isn't going to 164 00:08:31,360 --> 00:08:32,480 Speaker 2: come attack you right then. 165 00:08:33,040 --> 00:08:36,880 Speaker 3: You never saw Jungle Book, oh very. 166 00:08:36,840 --> 00:08:39,480 Speaker 2: Very long ago, and all I remember is Blue doing 167 00:08:39,520 --> 00:08:39,960 Speaker 2: his thing. 168 00:08:40,320 --> 00:08:43,280 Speaker 3: Yeah, the bare necessities. Yeah so great. 169 00:08:43,520 --> 00:08:47,160 Speaker 4: Still probably my favorite, even among the moderns. My favorite 170 00:08:47,240 --> 00:08:48,199 Speaker 4: Disney carton. 171 00:08:48,679 --> 00:08:51,360 Speaker 2: My favorite's long been Robin Hood. That was always my 172 00:08:51,440 --> 00:08:52,400 Speaker 2: favorite as a kid. 173 00:08:52,679 --> 00:08:54,680 Speaker 4: Yeah, I like that Robinhood a lot. But you just 174 00:08:54,720 --> 00:08:57,360 Speaker 4: can't beat There's so many bangers in the Jungle Book. 175 00:08:57,640 --> 00:09:01,760 Speaker 2: Okay, all right, all right with that one. Then I'll 176 00:09:01,840 --> 00:09:04,199 Speaker 2: just stop. I'll throw out my own personal favorite in 177 00:09:04,559 --> 00:09:05,280 Speaker 2: favor of yours. 178 00:09:06,160 --> 00:09:06,920 Speaker 3: Why would you do that? 179 00:09:07,720 --> 00:09:09,880 Speaker 2: I just I just want to get along. 180 00:09:09,880 --> 00:09:11,640 Speaker 3: Okay, all right. 181 00:09:11,679 --> 00:09:15,040 Speaker 4: So they're carrying fire around at this point, they may 182 00:09:15,080 --> 00:09:18,000 Speaker 4: have discovered like a way to actually keep it going better, 183 00:09:18,080 --> 00:09:21,000 Speaker 4: like I know on the survival shows, like a lone 184 00:09:21,040 --> 00:09:24,400 Speaker 4: animal dung is a great, very sort of slow burning 185 00:09:24,840 --> 00:09:28,360 Speaker 4: way to transport transport fuel, like a burning cowpie. 186 00:09:28,480 --> 00:09:30,040 Speaker 3: Maybe, yeah, for sure. 187 00:09:32,120 --> 00:09:34,520 Speaker 2: So that's the gathering thing. So we go from foraging 188 00:09:34,800 --> 00:09:37,479 Speaker 2: like we have no control over it. We just identified 189 00:09:37,480 --> 00:09:40,520 Speaker 2: that it's something special to being able to move it 190 00:09:40,559 --> 00:09:43,480 Speaker 2: around and keep it going. That's the key. Thanks to 191 00:09:43,559 --> 00:09:47,559 Speaker 2: the animal dung discovery, the cowpie and then we finally 192 00:09:47,600 --> 00:09:49,240 Speaker 2: reached the point. And this is where all of the 193 00:09:49,360 --> 00:09:53,320 Speaker 2: archaeologists and anthropologists and all the ologists want to kind 194 00:09:53,360 --> 00:09:58,560 Speaker 2: of pinpoint when did humans start making fire ourselves? And 195 00:09:58,640 --> 00:10:03,000 Speaker 2: we do have evidence of humans using fire very far back, 196 00:10:03,120 --> 00:10:07,520 Speaker 2: more than a million years ago, but for hundreds of 197 00:10:07,559 --> 00:10:11,360 Speaker 2: thousands and hundreds of thousands of years between that point 198 00:10:11,400 --> 00:10:16,200 Speaker 2: and where we are unambiguously making fire ourselves, there's a 199 00:10:16,280 --> 00:10:20,640 Speaker 2: lot of room for interpretation. Yes, we were cooking or something, 200 00:10:20,760 --> 00:10:23,200 Speaker 2: or we were using a fire. It's clear that there 201 00:10:23,200 --> 00:10:25,960 Speaker 2: were humans around this fire, but it's not clear that 202 00:10:26,080 --> 00:10:28,800 Speaker 2: humans actually made the fire. We may have gathered it. 203 00:10:29,200 --> 00:10:32,920 Speaker 2: When did we start making fire? That's the big question 204 00:10:33,360 --> 00:10:35,359 Speaker 2: in archaeology and anthropology. 205 00:10:36,240 --> 00:10:38,720 Speaker 4: That's right, boy, it sounds like a notes early, but 206 00:10:38,760 --> 00:10:41,560 Speaker 4: it sounds like a perfect place for a little Cliffhanger's break. 207 00:10:42,280 --> 00:10:43,000 Speaker 2: It's what I do. 208 00:10:43,440 --> 00:10:44,439 Speaker 3: All right, we'll be right back. 209 00:10:44,480 --> 00:10:57,760 Speaker 1: Everybody want to learn about a terrosort in college, horedactyl, how. 210 00:10:57,679 --> 00:11:00,680 Speaker 4: To take a perfect boo, all about rectal that's at. 211 00:11:00,720 --> 00:11:03,360 Speaker 3: Hunt, the Lizzie run on the plane. 212 00:11:03,400 --> 00:11:10,800 Speaker 1: Everything, word up, Jerry. 213 00:11:11,320 --> 00:11:12,280 Speaker 3: All right, we're back. 214 00:11:12,400 --> 00:11:15,640 Speaker 4: We don't have a definitive answer unfortunately, But again, we 215 00:11:15,720 --> 00:11:18,240 Speaker 4: have a lot of good ideas as far as those 216 00:11:18,280 --> 00:11:21,920 Speaker 4: three stages go, they do get a little bit easier 217 00:11:21,960 --> 00:11:25,160 Speaker 4: to pinpoint a rough timeline. But that foraging stage that 218 00:11:25,200 --> 00:11:27,640 Speaker 4: we mentioned at first is that's definitely the hardest to 219 00:11:27,880 --> 00:11:31,960 Speaker 4: kind of lock down in time. There is no archaeological 220 00:11:31,960 --> 00:11:36,720 Speaker 4: record basically during that phase. But they do think, and 221 00:11:36,800 --> 00:11:38,840 Speaker 4: again this is people just giving their best guess. They 222 00:11:38,840 --> 00:11:43,800 Speaker 4: do think that astrolopithescenes the early humans may have been 223 00:11:43,920 --> 00:11:46,400 Speaker 4: forging around fires and this is like four million ish 224 00:11:46,480 --> 00:11:46,960 Speaker 4: years ago. 225 00:11:47,720 --> 00:11:51,880 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, for sure, I didn't see why they thought that, 226 00:11:52,160 --> 00:11:56,559 Speaker 2: but like what the austrilopithekiss was doing that made them 227 00:11:56,559 --> 00:11:58,160 Speaker 2: think that, But I don't know, maybe it had to 228 00:11:58,160 --> 00:11:59,960 Speaker 2: do with their other behavior that made it seem like 229 00:12:00,000 --> 00:12:03,679 Speaker 2: they would have done that. So the gathering phase, like 230 00:12:03,720 --> 00:12:06,520 Speaker 2: I said, that dates back to about a million years ago, 231 00:12:06,960 --> 00:12:12,000 Speaker 2: where it's very clear that humans have had a fire 232 00:12:12,080 --> 00:12:16,080 Speaker 2: somewhere that it's not possible that like a lightning strike 233 00:12:16,440 --> 00:12:19,320 Speaker 2: set off a fire in the areas where we found 234 00:12:19,720 --> 00:12:25,080 Speaker 2: evidence of human habitation and fire together, say one hundred 235 00:12:25,120 --> 00:12:28,520 Speaker 2: feet from the mouth of a cave, very difficult for 236 00:12:28,559 --> 00:12:33,480 Speaker 2: a wildfire to start there, So that's unambiguous, is what 237 00:12:33,520 --> 00:12:38,480 Speaker 2: they call it, like evidence that humans were interacting or 238 00:12:38,600 --> 00:12:42,480 Speaker 2: using fire, putting fire to some controlled use at that point, 239 00:12:42,559 --> 00:12:45,760 Speaker 2: but it's far from clear whether they actually started that 240 00:12:46,080 --> 00:12:48,600 Speaker 2: and almost certainly did not a million years ago. 241 00:12:49,080 --> 00:12:51,640 Speaker 4: Yeah, and it's that can also be a little tricky 242 00:12:51,720 --> 00:12:55,920 Speaker 4: because sometimes they confuse stuff. Stuff that might look like 243 00:12:56,000 --> 00:13:01,200 Speaker 4: charcoal or ash is some naturally occurring sediment cave. So 244 00:13:01,320 --> 00:13:02,800 Speaker 4: you know, they tried to kind of parse through that 245 00:13:02,840 --> 00:13:05,679 Speaker 4: stuff over the years, but they have found, you know, 246 00:13:06,480 --> 00:13:08,719 Speaker 4: sites like there's one and we're going to go through 247 00:13:08,720 --> 00:13:10,079 Speaker 4: a few of these in a minute, but one called 248 00:13:10,080 --> 00:13:14,560 Speaker 4: the Wonderwork Cave in South Africa that they basically have 249 00:13:14,640 --> 00:13:18,880 Speaker 4: agreed is probably the oldest site of controlled on purpose 250 00:13:19,080 --> 00:13:23,640 Speaker 4: fire use because they have found burnt bones there and 251 00:13:23,720 --> 00:13:25,839 Speaker 4: this is one hundred feet into a cave. 252 00:13:26,600 --> 00:13:32,520 Speaker 2: Right, that's again unambiguous use of human fire. There's also 253 00:13:32,800 --> 00:13:36,480 Speaker 2: some contenders for when we started control like making fire 254 00:13:36,520 --> 00:13:41,280 Speaker 2: ourselves starting fires, and one's about seven hundred and eighty 255 00:13:41,320 --> 00:13:44,520 Speaker 2: thousand years ago. Four hundred thousand years seems to be 256 00:13:44,600 --> 00:13:49,360 Speaker 2: the generally accepted latest date that humans became capable in 257 00:13:49,400 --> 00:13:54,720 Speaker 2: a widespread fashion of making fire ourselves. So somewhere between 258 00:13:54,720 --> 00:13:58,120 Speaker 2: a million and four hundred thousand years ago humans became 259 00:13:58,200 --> 00:14:02,480 Speaker 2: capable of making fire star fires. And I say we 260 00:14:02,520 --> 00:14:06,120 Speaker 2: talk about some of these different locations that are contenders 261 00:14:06,120 --> 00:14:07,120 Speaker 2: for all this stuff. 262 00:14:07,720 --> 00:14:09,880 Speaker 4: Well, yeah, there's the one in South Africa that I 263 00:14:10,040 --> 00:14:14,120 Speaker 4: just mentioned. They have found and been able to date 264 00:14:14,160 --> 00:14:16,840 Speaker 4: ash from that cave to about a million years ago. 265 00:14:17,400 --> 00:14:21,240 Speaker 4: But again we're not positive that that was you know, 266 00:14:21,480 --> 00:14:24,880 Speaker 4: ignited by humans or not, and they don't know exactly 267 00:14:24,960 --> 00:14:28,600 Speaker 4: how the fires were used in that case. But it 268 00:14:28,640 --> 00:14:31,160 Speaker 4: gets a little better as we move along. The Kassim 269 00:14:31,280 --> 00:14:34,600 Speaker 4: Cave in Israel was discovered about twenty six years ago 270 00:14:34,640 --> 00:14:37,640 Speaker 4: and that is near Tel Aviv, and this is where 271 00:14:37,640 --> 00:14:41,320 Speaker 4: they have found the first fireplace, basically the first hearth. 272 00:14:42,000 --> 00:14:44,840 Speaker 4: The dates to about three hundred thousand years so that's 273 00:14:45,160 --> 00:14:46,600 Speaker 4: pretty unambiguous. 274 00:14:47,400 --> 00:14:50,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, and one of the reasons why they're like, yes, 275 00:14:50,400 --> 00:14:52,840 Speaker 2: this is a pit, because up to that point when 276 00:14:52,880 --> 00:14:56,600 Speaker 2: they find like use of fire, it's just like kind 277 00:14:56,600 --> 00:14:59,520 Speaker 2: of spread out. Maybe one fire was held there. This 278 00:14:59,640 --> 00:15:03,000 Speaker 2: is like layer after layer after layer of fires in 279 00:15:03,080 --> 00:15:06,280 Speaker 2: the same place. So that's clearly a hearth. There's another 280 00:15:06,360 --> 00:15:11,160 Speaker 2: one in Israel called gesher banat Yakov. It's in northern Israel, 281 00:15:11,600 --> 00:15:14,080 Speaker 2: and they this is the one where they think that 282 00:15:14,400 --> 00:15:18,520 Speaker 2: people were potentially starting fires as far back as seven 283 00:15:18,600 --> 00:15:21,120 Speaker 2: hundred and eighty thousand years ago, and this would have 284 00:15:21,120 --> 00:15:24,440 Speaker 2: been Homo Erectus, who was the longest lived hominin. They 285 00:15:24,600 --> 00:15:28,520 Speaker 2: lived for almost two million years. And they were clever 286 00:15:28,600 --> 00:15:30,800 Speaker 2: ones too. They were the first ones to basically take 287 00:15:30,840 --> 00:15:34,880 Speaker 2: a leap forward in stone tool technology. They also invented 288 00:15:34,960 --> 00:15:38,840 Speaker 2: Jordash jeans. And they know that the Homo Erectus were 289 00:15:38,880 --> 00:15:41,360 Speaker 2: the ones who were making or at least using this 290 00:15:41,440 --> 00:15:43,800 Speaker 2: fire seven hundred and eighty thousand years ago, because they 291 00:15:43,840 --> 00:15:47,520 Speaker 2: found their characteristic stone tools like hand axes, and they 292 00:15:47,600 --> 00:15:50,920 Speaker 2: were cooking fish essentially here on the banks of the 293 00:15:51,000 --> 00:15:53,880 Speaker 2: Jordan River karp that were up to like six and 294 00:15:53,920 --> 00:15:56,320 Speaker 2: a half feet from what I read and Chuck I 295 00:15:56,360 --> 00:15:59,520 Speaker 2: was reading about how they figured out that they were 296 00:15:59,560 --> 00:16:03,280 Speaker 2: definitely cooking fish and that they weren't just like fish 297 00:16:03,560 --> 00:16:06,680 Speaker 2: remains that they'd eaten raw and tossed into a fire. 298 00:16:07,520 --> 00:16:11,080 Speaker 2: And they tested the fish teeth that had been cooked 299 00:16:11,120 --> 00:16:13,760 Speaker 2: to see what temperature they've been exposed to it if 300 00:16:13,800 --> 00:16:15,960 Speaker 2: there were a high temperature, they probably would have been 301 00:16:16,000 --> 00:16:17,880 Speaker 2: remains just chucked in in the middle of a fire. 302 00:16:18,200 --> 00:16:20,520 Speaker 2: If it were exposed to a lower temperature, then this 303 00:16:20,560 --> 00:16:23,840 Speaker 2: probably would have been a controlled roast, and they found 304 00:16:23,920 --> 00:16:26,480 Speaker 2: the evidence for roasting, so they were cooking fish about 305 00:16:26,480 --> 00:16:28,000 Speaker 2: eight hundred thousand years ago there. 306 00:16:28,440 --> 00:16:28,680 Speaker 3: Yeah. 307 00:16:28,680 --> 00:16:31,680 Speaker 4: The next one is the Rising Star Cave in South Africa. 308 00:16:31,920 --> 00:16:35,560 Speaker 4: Very promising cave, and this one is a little controversial 309 00:16:35,640 --> 00:16:38,800 Speaker 4: in that they do think that some sort of tiny 310 00:16:38,840 --> 00:16:43,680 Speaker 4: brain species of early human they were called the Homo naletti. 311 00:16:44,400 --> 00:16:46,840 Speaker 4: They think that they built fires in this cave, and 312 00:16:46,880 --> 00:16:49,280 Speaker 4: this was about three hundred and thirty five thousand years ago, 313 00:16:50,160 --> 00:16:52,920 Speaker 4: but other people came along, said no, I'm not sure 314 00:16:52,920 --> 00:16:54,640 Speaker 4: if that's when it happened. It might have been other 315 00:16:54,680 --> 00:16:57,720 Speaker 4: people that came to that cave later. And that similar 316 00:16:57,800 --> 00:17:02,240 Speaker 4: kind of goes for another cave, k the Zuchodean Cave. 317 00:17:03,600 --> 00:17:07,879 Speaker 4: That one was excavated in the nineteen twenties and people 318 00:17:07,880 --> 00:17:10,080 Speaker 4: thought for a long long time that like, hey, here's 319 00:17:10,119 --> 00:17:14,720 Speaker 4: the oldest hearth, the oldest sort of purposeful fireplace, and 320 00:17:14,760 --> 00:17:17,560 Speaker 4: it goes back a half a million years. But it's 321 00:17:17,600 --> 00:17:19,560 Speaker 4: kind of gone back and forth since in the nineties 322 00:17:19,680 --> 00:17:23,960 Speaker 4: nineteen nineties, that is, they saw evidence of this ash 323 00:17:24,000 --> 00:17:25,760 Speaker 4: there and they said, you know, I don't think this 324 00:17:25,840 --> 00:17:26,160 Speaker 4: is ash. 325 00:17:26,200 --> 00:17:27,320 Speaker 3: Actually it was. 326 00:17:27,280 --> 00:17:30,200 Speaker 4: What Chuck will talk about later as other organic materials 327 00:17:30,200 --> 00:17:32,760 Speaker 4: that looked like ash. But then later on in the 328 00:17:32,800 --> 00:17:37,280 Speaker 4: twenty tens, other people came back and had other evidence. 329 00:17:37,640 --> 00:17:40,960 Speaker 4: They said, no, I think they were purpose built fires here, 330 00:17:41,200 --> 00:17:43,639 Speaker 4: which you know, just goes to show kind of how 331 00:17:43,680 --> 00:17:45,000 Speaker 4: hard it is to really pinpoint the. 332 00:17:45,000 --> 00:17:48,040 Speaker 2: Stuff, right, Yeah, going back and forth between the nineteen 333 00:17:48,080 --> 00:17:53,320 Speaker 2: twenties and the twenty tens like that, that's like archaeological whiplash. Yeah, 334 00:17:53,640 --> 00:17:56,119 Speaker 2: so we really need to just kind of also point 335 00:17:56,119 --> 00:18:01,680 Speaker 2: out here we're talking about Hamanin's using fire, not Homo sapiens. 336 00:18:01,960 --> 00:18:05,560 Speaker 2: Homo sapiens obviously knew how to use fire and how 337 00:18:05,560 --> 00:18:09,560 Speaker 2: to make fire, but almost certainly were not the ones 338 00:18:09,560 --> 00:18:13,440 Speaker 2: that came up with fire ourselves. We might have learned 339 00:18:13,480 --> 00:18:16,600 Speaker 2: it actually from some of the other species of humans 340 00:18:16,600 --> 00:18:19,119 Speaker 2: that were running around at the same time as we were, 341 00:18:19,359 --> 00:18:23,840 Speaker 2: like Neanderthals, And like I said, there's evidence of like 342 00:18:23,920 --> 00:18:28,000 Speaker 2: other species like Homo erectus using fire to one degree 343 00:18:28,080 --> 00:18:31,959 Speaker 2: or another as far as like maybe a million years ago, 344 00:18:32,400 --> 00:18:36,119 Speaker 2: but there's a lot of questions about did every single 345 00:18:36,320 --> 00:18:40,360 Speaker 2: species of human know how to make fire? And Neanderthals 346 00:18:40,800 --> 00:18:44,680 Speaker 2: in particular have been kind of picked on as not 347 00:18:44,760 --> 00:18:47,640 Speaker 2: necessarily knowing what they were doing with starting fires. 348 00:18:48,359 --> 00:18:51,800 Speaker 4: Yeah, this one has some pretty good arguments going. I 349 00:18:51,800 --> 00:18:57,239 Speaker 4: think in both directions. They found evidences of activity in 350 00:18:57,280 --> 00:18:58,960 Speaker 4: France and like sites in France that. 351 00:18:58,960 --> 00:19:01,560 Speaker 3: They excavated, Yeah, and they. 352 00:19:01,480 --> 00:19:03,880 Speaker 4: You know, what they found was there were more traces 353 00:19:03,920 --> 00:19:08,800 Speaker 4: of fire from periods without glaciers than periods that did 354 00:19:08,920 --> 00:19:12,480 Speaker 4: have glaciers. And it doesn't really track in some ways 355 00:19:12,480 --> 00:19:14,680 Speaker 4: because you would think that they would if they could 356 00:19:14,680 --> 00:19:17,040 Speaker 4: make fire on their own, then they would have done 357 00:19:17,040 --> 00:19:21,400 Speaker 4: that when it was colder. And also it makes sense 358 00:19:21,440 --> 00:19:24,680 Speaker 4: in a way because in the period where there aren't glaciers, 359 00:19:24,680 --> 00:19:27,200 Speaker 4: there are going to be more lightning strikes and thunderstorms, 360 00:19:27,640 --> 00:19:30,199 Speaker 4: and the vegetation's going to be dried out. So then 361 00:19:30,240 --> 00:19:32,879 Speaker 4: may be you know, using the fire even in the 362 00:19:32,920 --> 00:19:34,879 Speaker 4: warmer periods because it's just there. 363 00:19:35,560 --> 00:19:39,320 Speaker 2: Right exactly. They also find lots, or they have found 364 00:19:39,400 --> 00:19:43,959 Speaker 2: in some Neanderthal sites, lots of ash build up and 365 00:19:44,119 --> 00:19:47,399 Speaker 2: not necessarily because this is a very ancient hearth, but 366 00:19:47,480 --> 00:19:49,760 Speaker 2: because they had to keep the fire going, so it 367 00:19:49,840 --> 00:19:52,360 Speaker 2: was constantly going because they didn't know how to get 368 00:19:52,359 --> 00:19:55,320 Speaker 2: it started again if it went out. So yeah, those 369 00:19:55,359 --> 00:19:58,480 Speaker 2: are pretty good arguments for Neanderthals not being able to 370 00:19:58,520 --> 00:20:01,159 Speaker 2: make fire. But there are other people who point to 371 00:20:01,680 --> 00:20:04,359 Speaker 2: other evidence that says like, no, actually, Neanderthals knew what 372 00:20:04,400 --> 00:20:08,160 Speaker 2: they were doing. One of them is that Neanderthals made 373 00:20:08,480 --> 00:20:13,679 Speaker 2: birch bark pitch, which they used to as basically an adhesive, 374 00:20:15,200 --> 00:20:19,080 Speaker 2: like thousands of years before Homo sapiens were doing that, 375 00:20:19,840 --> 00:20:24,479 Speaker 2: and that they're also frequently found with manganese dioxide chunks 376 00:20:24,480 --> 00:20:28,520 Speaker 2: as black mineral, and it was usually interpreted as they 377 00:20:28,520 --> 00:20:31,080 Speaker 2: were using this to like decorate their bodies or maybe 378 00:20:31,119 --> 00:20:35,520 Speaker 2: even for cave art. Somebody has pointed out that no, actually, 379 00:20:35,520 --> 00:20:38,919 Speaker 2: manganese dioxide is a major component in fireworks and you 380 00:20:38,920 --> 00:20:41,000 Speaker 2: could use it as a pretty good fire starter. So 381 00:20:41,760 --> 00:20:45,119 Speaker 2: the jury's out. But for my money, they probably did 382 00:20:45,280 --> 00:20:47,959 Speaker 2: know how to start fires, because Homo sapiens have a 383 00:20:48,080 --> 00:20:52,400 Speaker 2: very very long tradition of underestimating Neanderthals and being pick 384 00:20:52,440 --> 00:20:55,480 Speaker 2: and wrong in the end as the science advances. 385 00:20:55,359 --> 00:20:58,600 Speaker 4: Yeah, for sure, and while we don't know, you know 386 00:20:58,640 --> 00:21:01,280 Speaker 4: when all this started. We definitely know the how, and 387 00:21:01,359 --> 00:21:05,480 Speaker 4: it's kind of how modern humans start primitive fires, like 388 00:21:05,520 --> 00:21:09,600 Speaker 4: without any sort of sort of man made tools. Percussion 389 00:21:09,800 --> 00:21:13,920 Speaker 4: methods is you know, when you're striking that flint off 390 00:21:13,960 --> 00:21:16,040 Speaker 4: of you know, each other, like off of a rock, 391 00:21:16,080 --> 00:21:19,120 Speaker 4: it's going to spark. And you know, maybe they saw 392 00:21:19,160 --> 00:21:21,119 Speaker 4: that and thought, hey, that looks a little bit like 393 00:21:21,240 --> 00:21:25,240 Speaker 4: lightning and gave it a shot. You've got the old 394 00:21:25,240 --> 00:21:27,800 Speaker 4: fire drill method or any kind of friction method of 395 00:21:27,880 --> 00:21:31,560 Speaker 4: rubbing something together really really fast, and that'll that'll get 396 00:21:31,560 --> 00:21:32,679 Speaker 4: a fire going if you're. 397 00:21:32,520 --> 00:21:36,120 Speaker 2: Good, Yeah, the one I've heard of. Both of those obviously, 398 00:21:36,160 --> 00:21:39,679 Speaker 2: but fire pistons I had not heard of. Essentially, you 399 00:21:39,680 --> 00:21:43,160 Speaker 2: take a tube and a piston and put together they 400 00:21:43,280 --> 00:21:46,960 Speaker 2: essentially form an air tight well coupling. I guess. You 401 00:21:47,000 --> 00:21:49,959 Speaker 2: put a little bit of tender, really really dry, almost 402 00:21:49,960 --> 00:21:56,800 Speaker 2: powdery or fibrous, like easily combustible material, right, and you 403 00:21:56,880 --> 00:22:00,159 Speaker 2: put the piston in the tube and you press it 404 00:22:00,200 --> 00:22:03,000 Speaker 2: really quickly, and that compression of air heats the air 405 00:22:03,640 --> 00:22:08,359 Speaker 2: just enough that it can actually ignite that tender. Then 406 00:22:08,400 --> 00:22:11,240 Speaker 2: you use the tender to catch more tender on fire, 407 00:22:11,280 --> 00:22:14,560 Speaker 2: and now you've got a fire started. Like when you 408 00:22:14,600 --> 00:22:16,160 Speaker 2: look back at some of this stuff, I was watching 409 00:22:16,200 --> 00:22:22,320 Speaker 2: a video of using bow drills to create fire. I 410 00:22:22,359 --> 00:22:24,959 Speaker 2: looked I was watching a really neat video. There's a 411 00:22:25,000 --> 00:22:28,000 Speaker 2: YouTube channel called make It Primitive, and they were making 412 00:22:28,240 --> 00:22:31,879 Speaker 2: birch pitch with no pots. And when you look at 413 00:22:31,880 --> 00:22:34,879 Speaker 2: this stuff they're recreating that very very ancient people figured 414 00:22:34,880 --> 00:22:38,240 Speaker 2: out how to do. It's like, how did anyone ever 415 00:22:38,640 --> 00:22:42,320 Speaker 2: accidentally stumble upon this? Like I understand we're looking at 416 00:22:42,440 --> 00:22:47,000 Speaker 2: like the developed endpoint version of this, you know, primitive technology. 417 00:22:47,560 --> 00:22:51,160 Speaker 2: But I can't even imagine how somebody figured out how 418 00:22:51,200 --> 00:22:54,960 Speaker 2: to make birch pitch in the first place. What happened, Yeah, 419 00:22:55,080 --> 00:22:58,159 Speaker 2: in some random fire somewhere that gave somebody the idea 420 00:22:58,240 --> 00:22:59,919 Speaker 2: to turn that into making pitch. 421 00:23:01,160 --> 00:23:02,680 Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean I think it's kind of cool. 422 00:23:03,800 --> 00:23:07,720 Speaker 4: Like I don't know, maybe someone rubbed their hands together 423 00:23:07,800 --> 00:23:09,800 Speaker 4: and it got hot and they were like, huh, friction 424 00:23:09,920 --> 00:23:13,800 Speaker 4: causes heat, And you know, maybe a thousand years later 425 00:23:13,880 --> 00:23:16,960 Speaker 4: that idea became maybe a lot of friction could cost 426 00:23:17,040 --> 00:23:19,240 Speaker 4: so much heat that something might actually catch on fire. 427 00:23:19,720 --> 00:23:21,920 Speaker 4: And then they start looking around on like a good 428 00:23:21,960 --> 00:23:23,600 Speaker 4: way to do that, Like that's how it had to 429 00:23:23,600 --> 00:23:25,400 Speaker 4: have happened. I just think it's amazing. 430 00:23:25,760 --> 00:23:29,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, there was probably a transition period though, where some 431 00:23:29,400 --> 00:23:33,200 Speaker 2: Porschemo's hands were bleeding they rubbed them raw so much 432 00:23:33,240 --> 00:23:35,200 Speaker 2: trying to start a fire with them before they moved 433 00:23:35,240 --> 00:23:36,280 Speaker 2: on to wood. 434 00:23:37,160 --> 00:23:37,400 Speaker 3: Yeah. 435 00:23:37,440 --> 00:23:40,600 Speaker 4: I mean what I think is amazing is that there's 436 00:23:40,640 --> 00:23:41,919 Speaker 4: really nothing new on the scene. 437 00:23:42,080 --> 00:23:45,760 Speaker 2: You know, well, they say there's nothing new under the sun, Chuck, 438 00:23:46,640 --> 00:23:49,959 Speaker 2: I guess, so do you want to take our second 439 00:23:49,960 --> 00:23:51,920 Speaker 2: break and come back and talk. I don't know about 440 00:23:51,960 --> 00:23:53,919 Speaker 2: the history of fire, Yeah, let's do it. 441 00:24:04,040 --> 00:24:06,320 Speaker 1: I want to learn about a terrorsort in college, horedactyl, 442 00:24:06,359 --> 00:24:09,760 Speaker 1: how to take a perfect Rectalis Khan. That's another hunt 443 00:24:09,880 --> 00:24:12,880 Speaker 1: the Lizzie Everything. 444 00:24:18,320 --> 00:24:21,960 Speaker 2: Word up, Jerry, so kind of at the outset we 445 00:24:22,000 --> 00:24:25,520 Speaker 2: were talking a little bit about how fire just changed 446 00:24:25,600 --> 00:24:29,879 Speaker 2: humanity and there's some specific things that we used it 447 00:24:29,920 --> 00:24:35,359 Speaker 2: for that helped advance, like different species, not just Homo sapiens. 448 00:24:35,400 --> 00:24:41,440 Speaker 2: Along one is heat, Like there's a pretty widely believed 449 00:24:41,480 --> 00:24:44,800 Speaker 2: consensus is that we could not and we did not 450 00:24:45,000 --> 00:24:48,280 Speaker 2: move into colder climates, not just Homo sapiens, but all 451 00:24:48,280 --> 00:24:52,159 Speaker 2: hominins until we had at least figured out how to 452 00:24:52,200 --> 00:24:55,000 Speaker 2: move fire from one place to another. Without it going out, 453 00:24:55,400 --> 00:24:57,720 Speaker 2: that we just would not have been able to survive 454 00:24:58,359 --> 00:25:03,119 Speaker 2: in northern latitudes. Yeah, without fire, So that was a 455 00:25:03,160 --> 00:25:05,840 Speaker 2: huge thing. It allowed us to spread further and further 456 00:25:05,920 --> 00:25:06,600 Speaker 2: away from the. 457 00:25:06,560 --> 00:25:08,280 Speaker 3: Tropics, Yeah, for sure. 458 00:25:08,359 --> 00:25:10,919 Speaker 4: And once you got out of the tropics, that allowed 459 00:25:10,920 --> 00:25:14,639 Speaker 4: you to spread further and further wherever you were. Because 460 00:25:14,680 --> 00:25:17,359 Speaker 4: it provided light, you could explore those caves, you could 461 00:25:18,600 --> 00:25:22,080 Speaker 4: explore the darkness of the world around you. I know 462 00:25:22,119 --> 00:25:26,360 Speaker 4: I've said this before about camping, and you know when 463 00:25:26,359 --> 00:25:28,399 Speaker 4: I go to the Family camp sometimes will take people 464 00:25:28,440 --> 00:25:32,960 Speaker 4: that have aversions to camping, and we have some solar 465 00:25:33,000 --> 00:25:35,080 Speaker 4: power there and string lights that light up the camp 466 00:25:35,080 --> 00:25:39,840 Speaker 4: at night. And I have learned firsthand that what I 467 00:25:39,880 --> 00:25:41,720 Speaker 4: think is going on when people say they don't like 468 00:25:41,760 --> 00:25:45,159 Speaker 4: camping is that they don't like the darkness once you 469 00:25:45,240 --> 00:25:48,919 Speaker 4: leave that campfire. Because people that say they don't like 470 00:25:48,920 --> 00:25:51,119 Speaker 4: camping have had a great time at the family camp 471 00:25:51,680 --> 00:25:54,640 Speaker 4: because it's lit up all around you, and they've said, man, 472 00:25:54,680 --> 00:25:56,240 Speaker 4: I feel it easier and I'm never at ease in 473 00:25:56,240 --> 00:25:56,600 Speaker 4: the woods. 474 00:25:56,600 --> 00:25:58,680 Speaker 3: I'm like this because you can see around you. It's 475 00:25:58,760 --> 00:26:00,879 Speaker 3: the dark. You're afraid of whatever you think is in 476 00:26:00,920 --> 00:26:01,320 Speaker 3: the dark. 477 00:26:01,720 --> 00:26:05,240 Speaker 2: I feel like you're talking about Hodgmen right now, aren't you. 478 00:26:05,240 --> 00:26:07,680 Speaker 3: You know Hodgman had a great time at the camp. 479 00:26:08,240 --> 00:26:10,080 Speaker 2: Oh, I'm sure he did. Hodgman is a good time 480 00:26:10,080 --> 00:26:12,520 Speaker 2: wherever he goes. But I can also he's a he's 481 00:26:12,560 --> 00:26:13,400 Speaker 2: a city boy. 482 00:26:14,240 --> 00:26:15,280 Speaker 3: Yeah. Yeah. 483 00:26:15,359 --> 00:26:17,679 Speaker 4: I let him sleep in my little uh my little camper, 484 00:26:17,760 --> 00:26:19,520 Speaker 4: the little one bad camper. 485 00:26:19,600 --> 00:26:20,679 Speaker 3: Yeah, we snuggled up. 486 00:26:20,720 --> 00:26:23,320 Speaker 2: That is very sweet and completely unsurprising. 487 00:26:23,520 --> 00:26:25,240 Speaker 3: Yeah, it was sweet. It was a good snug. 488 00:26:25,760 --> 00:26:28,760 Speaker 4: Uh And we also made tools John and I did 489 00:26:28,800 --> 00:26:31,760 Speaker 4: with our fire, which is something that the early humans did. 490 00:26:32,320 --> 00:26:36,000 Speaker 2: So I'm a real birch bark pitch fan. 491 00:26:35,920 --> 00:26:36,920 Speaker 3: Nowunds like it. 492 00:26:37,040 --> 00:26:39,640 Speaker 2: Yeah, this is what it's for. So it's a it's 493 00:26:39,680 --> 00:26:43,640 Speaker 2: a tarry adhesive that you make by basically burning and 494 00:26:43,760 --> 00:26:50,040 Speaker 2: condensing birch bark. Okay, which I love birch trees in 495 00:26:50,080 --> 00:26:53,600 Speaker 2: the first place. Panda is almost a birch. It's a 496 00:26:53,680 --> 00:26:57,760 Speaker 2: quaking asspen, but they're close, they're similar. Just love that bark. Yeah, 497 00:26:57,960 --> 00:27:01,000 Speaker 2: you so if you just again go watch make it 498 00:27:01,040 --> 00:27:04,160 Speaker 2: primitive and the way that they make birch bark pitch. 499 00:27:04,520 --> 00:27:07,720 Speaker 2: But you take this stuff, this tari stuff. And you say, 500 00:27:07,760 --> 00:27:11,080 Speaker 2: take an arrow, and there's an arrowhead in your right hand, 501 00:27:11,359 --> 00:27:13,800 Speaker 2: there's a shaft in your left hand. There's a string 502 00:27:13,840 --> 00:27:16,160 Speaker 2: of twine in your teeth because both your other hands 503 00:27:16,200 --> 00:27:21,199 Speaker 2: are occupied, and you wind the twine around the arrowshead 504 00:27:21,640 --> 00:27:25,560 Speaker 2: to get it to stay on the shaft of the arrow. 505 00:27:26,359 --> 00:27:29,080 Speaker 2: And then after it's on nice and tight, then you 506 00:27:29,160 --> 00:27:31,320 Speaker 2: put a bunch of pitch around it, and man, it 507 00:27:31,400 --> 00:27:35,120 Speaker 2: really holds it fast. Now you've got an arrow that's 508 00:27:35,200 --> 00:27:38,200 Speaker 2: gonna really do the job, all thanks to your birch 509 00:27:38,280 --> 00:27:41,680 Speaker 2: bark pitch. Although let's also give a hand for twine too. 510 00:27:42,480 --> 00:27:46,080 Speaker 4: You know, buddy, you are a hair's breadth away from 511 00:27:46,240 --> 00:27:48,320 Speaker 4: being a big fan of Alone, the show that I've 512 00:27:48,359 --> 00:27:52,160 Speaker 4: touted for a decade. They not watching it because all 513 00:27:52,200 --> 00:27:53,880 Speaker 4: this stuff thrills you. 514 00:27:53,480 --> 00:27:55,560 Speaker 2: Do they do? They talk in it? Those their dialogue 515 00:27:55,560 --> 00:27:58,760 Speaker 2: and narration because on make it primitive. They just do 516 00:27:58,920 --> 00:27:59,320 Speaker 2: their thing. 517 00:27:59,560 --> 00:28:03,280 Speaker 4: They don't talk, uh, I mean they put people alone 518 00:28:03,280 --> 00:28:05,800 Speaker 4: in the woods with a camera so they're you know, 519 00:28:05,880 --> 00:28:08,440 Speaker 4: they're talking somebody. There's not like Mike Road doesn't come 520 00:28:08,440 --> 00:28:10,600 Speaker 4: on and say, what Jane. 521 00:28:10,320 --> 00:28:13,119 Speaker 3: Is doing is making an arrow? 522 00:28:13,760 --> 00:28:17,800 Speaker 2: Gotcha? Yeah, okay, I maybe I'll give it a shot. 523 00:28:17,840 --> 00:28:19,800 Speaker 2: I don't know why I'm resistant to it either, Chuck. 524 00:28:19,840 --> 00:28:22,640 Speaker 2: I think it's just reality television. I have an aversion 525 00:28:22,640 --> 00:28:23,399 Speaker 2: to it in general. 526 00:28:24,600 --> 00:28:28,280 Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, I guess it's reality to me reality TV. 527 00:28:28,400 --> 00:28:31,000 Speaker 4: There's stuff like this and Top Chef that are like 528 00:28:31,119 --> 00:28:34,600 Speaker 4: real things, and then there's you know people, there's shows 529 00:28:34,600 --> 00:28:36,920 Speaker 4: where they just pit people against each other to argue 530 00:28:36,960 --> 00:28:37,639 Speaker 4: and fight like. 531 00:28:37,680 --> 00:28:38,720 Speaker 3: Those are two different. 532 00:28:38,480 --> 00:28:42,800 Speaker 2: Things, for sure, for sure. Yeah, agreed. But yeah, so 533 00:28:42,880 --> 00:28:44,880 Speaker 2: I think that's the only reason I'm just like not 534 00:28:45,320 --> 00:28:46,600 Speaker 2: diving in feet first. 535 00:28:47,120 --> 00:28:50,200 Speaker 4: Well, the real question is do you prefer to cook 536 00:28:50,240 --> 00:28:51,680 Speaker 4: your meat or smoke your meat? 537 00:28:52,000 --> 00:28:53,200 Speaker 2: Do I have to choose? 538 00:28:53,960 --> 00:28:54,520 Speaker 3: Now you don't. 539 00:28:55,240 --> 00:28:59,560 Speaker 2: Well, there's a question, Chuck, about whether people started heating 540 00:28:59,800 --> 00:29:03,080 Speaker 2: their meat to cook it or to smoke it. I'm 541 00:29:03,120 --> 00:29:06,880 Speaker 2: a smoker. I'm on team smoker, to put it in 542 00:29:06,880 --> 00:29:08,200 Speaker 2: a tailor swift kind of way. 543 00:29:08,520 --> 00:29:10,240 Speaker 3: As for what you prefer or what you think they 544 00:29:10,240 --> 00:29:10,960 Speaker 3: were doing. 545 00:29:10,800 --> 00:29:13,120 Speaker 2: What I think they were doing. I'd like smoked meat, 546 00:29:13,120 --> 00:29:16,320 Speaker 2: but it is so bad for you that I just 547 00:29:17,480 --> 00:29:18,560 Speaker 2: I eat it sparingly. 548 00:29:19,160 --> 00:29:19,920 Speaker 3: Yeah, same here. 549 00:29:20,680 --> 00:29:24,040 Speaker 4: So yeah, I mean the idea is that when they 550 00:29:24,120 --> 00:29:29,719 Speaker 4: hunted a big, large megafauna that they would have needed 551 00:29:29,720 --> 00:29:31,360 Speaker 4: to do something with that meat. You know, there's too 552 00:29:31,480 --> 00:29:34,040 Speaker 4: much meat to even cook and eat all at once, 553 00:29:34,080 --> 00:29:37,120 Speaker 4: even if everyone's super hungry. Right, So it seems like 554 00:29:37,200 --> 00:29:39,760 Speaker 4: smoking meat may have been the first thing. 555 00:29:40,080 --> 00:29:41,880 Speaker 3: How they figure that out? I have no idea. 556 00:29:43,000 --> 00:29:46,040 Speaker 2: It's all just conjecture. It just makes sense, essentially. It's 557 00:29:46,120 --> 00:29:48,320 Speaker 2: just from the size of the animal. No band of 558 00:29:48,400 --> 00:29:50,760 Speaker 2: hunter gatherers, as far as the size that we thought 559 00:29:50,960 --> 00:29:53,280 Speaker 2: or think they are, they couldn't possibly have eaten like 560 00:29:53,320 --> 00:29:55,120 Speaker 2: a wooly mammoth in one sitting. 561 00:29:56,240 --> 00:29:57,920 Speaker 4: Yeah, but how do they know they didn't just like 562 00:29:57,960 --> 00:30:00,360 Speaker 4: eat what they could and the rest went bad. 563 00:30:00,240 --> 00:30:05,240 Speaker 2: Because humans have a long history of not being wasteful, 564 00:30:05,400 --> 00:30:09,040 Speaker 2: and we still aren't today. I don't know. That's a 565 00:30:09,080 --> 00:30:13,920 Speaker 2: great question, man. That's basically the argument against that is that, well. 566 00:30:13,640 --> 00:30:16,080 Speaker 4: Maybe some of these sites, would they be able to 567 00:30:16,120 --> 00:30:18,600 Speaker 4: tell if it was just bones or if it was 568 00:30:18,720 --> 00:30:19,880 Speaker 4: like former meat. 569 00:30:21,120 --> 00:30:24,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, there's the tool marks for like getting meat off 570 00:30:24,000 --> 00:30:26,240 Speaker 2: of the bone. There's teeth marks, all right, So there 571 00:30:26,280 --> 00:30:29,440 Speaker 2: you go. Yeah, but that doesn't Yeah, I guess, Yeah, 572 00:30:29,440 --> 00:30:31,960 Speaker 2: if you looked at the whole skeleton and there was 573 00:30:32,040 --> 00:30:34,040 Speaker 2: just like one leg that was eaten and the rest 574 00:30:34,040 --> 00:30:37,040 Speaker 2: of it was there. Yeah, I think, Yeah, I'm not 575 00:30:37,080 --> 00:30:40,920 Speaker 2: sure what team I'm on now, I'm in my confused era. 576 00:30:41,600 --> 00:30:43,600 Speaker 4: Well, we're both on team hearth because I know we 577 00:30:43,640 --> 00:30:47,160 Speaker 4: both enjoy good fire and the idea that people have 578 00:30:47,280 --> 00:30:51,640 Speaker 4: been sort of really interacting with fire. I know we 579 00:30:52,080 --> 00:30:55,480 Speaker 4: said that some people say a million years. It really 580 00:30:55,480 --> 00:30:59,400 Speaker 4: became widespread around four hundred thousand ish years ago. Yeah, 581 00:30:59,440 --> 00:31:01,960 Speaker 4: and that's when we really can have have some pretty 582 00:31:01,960 --> 00:31:06,960 Speaker 4: good archaeological evidence that there are hearts all over the place. Yeah, 583 00:31:07,440 --> 00:31:10,000 Speaker 4: people are building permanent setups or at least se many 584 00:31:10,440 --> 00:31:13,880 Speaker 4: semi permanent setups where they would live, and the hearth 585 00:31:14,120 --> 00:31:15,440 Speaker 4: was a big, big part of that. 586 00:31:16,680 --> 00:31:18,720 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, for sure. You wouldn't just use a hearse 587 00:31:18,800 --> 00:31:21,680 Speaker 2: to like cook necessarily. There were different kinds of hearths 588 00:31:21,720 --> 00:31:23,640 Speaker 2: that were designed to do different kinds of things. Like 589 00:31:23,720 --> 00:31:27,600 Speaker 2: you would use the different hearths to fire, play pottery, 590 00:31:27,640 --> 00:31:30,880 Speaker 2: then you would maybe cook that one leg of masted on, 591 00:31:31,080 --> 00:31:33,720 Speaker 2: you know, and then yeah, you might have a different 592 00:31:33,720 --> 00:31:37,600 Speaker 2: hearth for sitting around the campfire and socializing and taking trooms. 593 00:31:38,000 --> 00:31:39,360 Speaker 3: I wonder if you could cook in a kiln. 594 00:31:41,320 --> 00:31:43,920 Speaker 2: I don't know, that'd be interesting. It'd be like dry 595 00:31:44,000 --> 00:31:44,520 Speaker 2: sou vd. 596 00:31:45,360 --> 00:31:45,600 Speaker 3: Yeah. 597 00:31:45,720 --> 00:31:50,280 Speaker 4: So like you cook, you're killing your or whatever curing 598 00:31:50,320 --> 00:31:52,560 Speaker 4: your pot. You might as well throw it that turkey 599 00:31:52,600 --> 00:31:53,040 Speaker 4: leg in there. 600 00:31:53,760 --> 00:31:57,000 Speaker 2: Do see what happens. Yeah, I'll bet it would not 601 00:31:57,120 --> 00:31:59,640 Speaker 2: look right. It might be fine taste wise, but it 602 00:31:59,640 --> 00:32:00,680 Speaker 2: would not look right. 603 00:32:01,080 --> 00:32:03,720 Speaker 4: Yeah, Emily's getting into pottery. Maybe we'll see. I'll try 604 00:32:03,720 --> 00:32:04,040 Speaker 4: it out. 605 00:32:04,320 --> 00:32:07,080 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, dude, let me know how to ruin her kiln. Yeah, 606 00:32:07,720 --> 00:32:11,080 Speaker 2: and see, I's gonna be like, my kiln smells like turkey. 607 00:32:11,960 --> 00:32:12,920 Speaker 3: Sorry. 608 00:32:13,360 --> 00:32:15,040 Speaker 2: One of the things that I thought was pretty cool 609 00:32:15,120 --> 00:32:19,720 Speaker 2: is that fire actually helped progress humans from age to age. 610 00:32:20,040 --> 00:32:23,520 Speaker 2: It was the reason we transitioned from the Stone Age 611 00:32:23,600 --> 00:32:26,880 Speaker 2: to the Metal ages. Starting with the Copper Age, we 612 00:32:27,040 --> 00:32:29,760 Speaker 2: learned how to use fire to smelt copper, and then 613 00:32:29,800 --> 00:32:32,640 Speaker 2: we started creating better and better tools from there. It 614 00:32:32,680 --> 00:32:35,200 Speaker 2: was all thanks to fire. The whole thing, all of 615 00:32:35,280 --> 00:32:40,200 Speaker 2: human prehistory swung on our use of fire, right there. 616 00:32:40,760 --> 00:32:41,480 Speaker 3: Yeah, for sure. 617 00:32:41,640 --> 00:32:45,560 Speaker 4: And they've also got evidence that perhaps well not evidence, 618 00:32:45,600 --> 00:32:49,000 Speaker 4: I guess the conjecture again that it has played a 619 00:32:49,080 --> 00:32:54,160 Speaker 4: role in human biology because humans have a gene mutation 620 00:32:54,280 --> 00:32:59,120 Speaker 4: that we developed after fire. Seemingly that made us less 621 00:32:59,160 --> 00:33:03,320 Speaker 4: sensitive to smoke inhalation. Like, once fire started to be 622 00:33:03,360 --> 00:33:06,760 Speaker 4: a thing, people would stand around it and start coughing 623 00:33:06,800 --> 00:33:08,360 Speaker 4: and be like, well, this is no good, so they 624 00:33:08,400 --> 00:33:11,760 Speaker 4: would stand back a little bit. But eventually the AhR gene, 625 00:33:11,800 --> 00:33:15,080 Speaker 4: which helps us regulate our response to carcinogens and would smoke, 626 00:33:16,680 --> 00:33:19,000 Speaker 4: came along. That mutation came along in that gene. So 627 00:33:19,040 --> 00:33:21,160 Speaker 4: it is a pretty clear sign I think. 628 00:33:21,640 --> 00:33:24,120 Speaker 2: Yeah, And apparently it's just found in Homo sapiens. You 629 00:33:24,160 --> 00:33:27,719 Speaker 2: can't find it in like Neanderthal DNA or Homo erectus DNA. 630 00:33:27,880 --> 00:33:30,600 Speaker 2: So it's like it just kind of goes to show 631 00:33:30,600 --> 00:33:33,680 Speaker 2: you just how important fire is. Our bodies actually evolved 632 00:33:33,760 --> 00:33:37,400 Speaker 2: to sit around fires better. Yeah, so we also learned 633 00:33:37,400 --> 00:33:39,960 Speaker 2: to shout I hate rabbits to get the smoke from 634 00:33:40,080 --> 00:33:40,680 Speaker 2: coming your way. 635 00:33:40,680 --> 00:33:41,720 Speaker 3: I wonder where that came from. 636 00:33:41,760 --> 00:33:43,400 Speaker 2: I don't know. It makes zero sense. 637 00:33:44,160 --> 00:33:45,840 Speaker 3: I bet someone knows. 638 00:33:45,800 --> 00:33:49,320 Speaker 2: Another one, Chuck, that's this makes sense, although I hadn't 639 00:33:49,360 --> 00:33:54,400 Speaker 2: really thought about it before. Our circadian rhythms changed humans. 640 00:33:54,480 --> 00:33:57,040 Speaker 2: As far as animals go, we're the most alert in 641 00:33:57,080 --> 00:33:59,680 Speaker 2: the evening. Most animals are not the most alert and 642 00:33:59,680 --> 00:34:03,120 Speaker 2: the evening they're most earlier in the day. And the 643 00:34:03,360 --> 00:34:06,320 Speaker 2: idea is that is because our interactions with fire allowed 644 00:34:06,360 --> 00:34:09,080 Speaker 2: us to stay up much later, and hence our circadian 645 00:34:09,120 --> 00:34:12,279 Speaker 2: rhythms changed and adjusted likewise. 646 00:34:12,480 --> 00:34:12,919 Speaker 3: That's right. 647 00:34:13,320 --> 00:34:16,200 Speaker 4: And then finally that all sounds good when you're sitting 648 00:34:16,200 --> 00:34:19,200 Speaker 4: around the fire talking about hunting the mastodon, But that 649 00:34:19,280 --> 00:34:21,799 Speaker 4: also means if Tuktook is sick, Tuktook is getting other 650 00:34:21,840 --> 00:34:26,400 Speaker 4: people sick. So ancient humans might have, you know, spread 651 00:34:26,400 --> 00:34:28,640 Speaker 4: disease a little more readily because people are just hanging 652 00:34:28,640 --> 00:34:29,040 Speaker 4: out more. 653 00:34:29,360 --> 00:34:31,960 Speaker 2: Yeah. I was reading a study that they said that 654 00:34:32,080 --> 00:34:36,960 Speaker 2: tuberculosis emerged in humanity about the same time we started 655 00:34:37,600 --> 00:34:42,040 Speaker 2: using fire, like being able to control it, not necessarily 656 00:34:42,320 --> 00:34:44,680 Speaker 2: make it ourselves, but at least to move it around. 657 00:34:45,000 --> 00:34:50,920 Speaker 2: And yeah, huddling together helps of a contagible or contagious disease, Yeah, 658 00:34:51,200 --> 00:34:54,880 Speaker 2: spread much more easily because not only are you closer 659 00:34:54,960 --> 00:34:57,399 Speaker 2: around the fire, you're also probably in like a rock 660 00:34:57,440 --> 00:35:03,360 Speaker 2: shelter too, So tuberculosis loves fires and rock shelters. Everybody 661 00:35:03,440 --> 00:35:04,319 Speaker 2: knows that. 662 00:35:04,320 --> 00:35:06,640 Speaker 3: That's right. And by the way, I like contagible. I 663 00:35:06,640 --> 00:35:08,000 Speaker 3: think I'm going to go with that from no one. 664 00:35:08,200 --> 00:35:11,520 Speaker 2: Thank you, thanks for that. I appreciate that. Man. This 665 00:35:11,680 --> 00:35:14,319 Speaker 2: is why you and I are so close. You're just supportive. 666 00:35:16,640 --> 00:35:17,720 Speaker 2: What else you got, Chuck? 667 00:35:18,239 --> 00:35:19,120 Speaker 3: I got nothing else? 668 00:35:19,280 --> 00:35:21,160 Speaker 2: All right? I don't have anything else either. That's the 669 00:35:21,239 --> 00:35:23,960 Speaker 2: history of fire. That's everything there is to know about fire. 670 00:35:24,320 --> 00:35:27,279 Speaker 2: So don't even try to look for more. And since 671 00:35:27,320 --> 00:35:29,920 Speaker 2: I said that, obviously it's time for listener, ma'am. 672 00:35:32,200 --> 00:35:35,160 Speaker 4: I'm going to call this follow up to gold Standard. Hey, guys, 673 00:35:35,280 --> 00:35:37,360 Speaker 4: very much enjoyed the recent episode on the gold Standard. 674 00:35:37,360 --> 00:35:40,279 Speaker 4: But I have a small correction. Weren't weren't in the 675 00:35:40,280 --> 00:35:42,719 Speaker 4: book those ruby slippers? And I guess they're talking about 676 00:35:42,760 --> 00:35:43,520 Speaker 4: the Wizard of Oz. 677 00:35:43,600 --> 00:35:46,640 Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, Remember in the gold Standard episode we were 678 00:35:46,680 --> 00:35:49,680 Speaker 2: talking about how it was an allegory for the debate 679 00:35:49,760 --> 00:35:52,319 Speaker 2: over the gold standard and the silver standard and all that, 680 00:35:52,360 --> 00:35:55,120 Speaker 2: and we're like, I guess the ruby there was the 681 00:35:55,200 --> 00:35:57,920 Speaker 2: Ruby standard and blah blah blah, And this is what 682 00:35:57,920 --> 00:35:58,799 Speaker 2: they're writing. 683 00:35:58,480 --> 00:36:00,239 Speaker 3: In about the book. 684 00:36:00,280 --> 00:36:03,480 Speaker 4: Those ruby slippers were actually silver, and we're meant to 685 00:36:03,480 --> 00:36:05,880 Speaker 4: represent the silver standard, not a ruby standard. There was 686 00:36:05,920 --> 00:36:08,160 Speaker 4: a charged debate going on in the States at the 687 00:36:08,200 --> 00:36:11,600 Speaker 4: time on whether we should use the gold or silver Standard, 688 00:36:11,600 --> 00:36:14,440 Speaker 4: which was the allegory you discussed in the episode. The 689 00:36:14,480 --> 00:36:17,759 Speaker 4: movie changes silver slippers to ruby I believe to show 690 00:36:17,760 --> 00:36:22,239 Speaker 4: off the new technicolor technology parenthetical. I'm no film buff, 691 00:36:22,239 --> 00:36:24,600 Speaker 4: so please correct me if I'm mistaken. Hey, that sounds 692 00:36:24,600 --> 00:36:27,040 Speaker 4: good to meet Liz. Yeah, thank you guys for what 693 00:36:27,080 --> 00:36:29,640 Speaker 4: you do. I'm going to see you live and Akron 694 00:36:30,280 --> 00:36:33,040 Speaker 4: all right, Liz from Cleveland, can't wait to see you there. 695 00:36:33,080 --> 00:36:34,640 Speaker 3: And that is a great email. 696 00:36:35,080 --> 00:36:37,359 Speaker 2: It is a great email. Thanks a lot, Liz, and 697 00:36:37,800 --> 00:36:40,399 Speaker 2: Liz is among a handful of other people who wrote 698 00:36:40,440 --> 00:36:42,719 Speaker 2: in to tell us that, which made the whole thing 699 00:36:42,800 --> 00:36:47,400 Speaker 2: make way more sense. So nuts to Hollywood and cheers 700 00:36:47,440 --> 00:36:49,800 Speaker 2: to the original version of something. 701 00:36:49,760 --> 00:36:51,400 Speaker 3: That's right, Ruby Standard. 702 00:36:52,160 --> 00:36:53,960 Speaker 2: If you want to be like Liz and get in 703 00:36:53,960 --> 00:36:55,880 Speaker 2: touch with us and tell us something we don't know. 704 00:36:55,960 --> 00:36:59,160 Speaker 2: We love that kind of thing, you can send it 705 00:36:59,200 --> 00:37:06,000 Speaker 2: in an email to Stuff Podcasts at iHeartRadio dot com. 706 00:37:06,160 --> 00:37:08,480 Speaker 4: Stuff you Should Know is a production of iHeartRadio. 707 00:37:08,960 --> 00:37:13,319 Speaker 1: For more podcasts myheart Radio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, 708 00:37:13,440 --> 00:37:15,240 Speaker 1: or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.