1 00:00:03,080 --> 00:00:07,040 Speaker 1: On this episode of Sports Illustrated Weekly, with rumors circulating 2 00:00:07,040 --> 00:00:08,840 Speaker 1: that Urban Meyer is set to take a job at 3 00:00:08,840 --> 00:00:12,680 Speaker 1: Fox Sports, everyone from prominent media members to the Jacksonville 4 00:00:12,720 --> 00:00:17,000 Speaker 1: Jaguars owner is talking about meyers short and disastrous time 5 00:00:17,000 --> 00:00:20,360 Speaker 1: in the NFL. SI Stafford connor Or is here to 6 00:00:20,440 --> 00:00:23,400 Speaker 1: review the long list of problems that led to Meyer 7 00:00:23,480 --> 00:00:28,400 Speaker 1: being fired after just thir teen games, and later, before 8 00:00:28,480 --> 00:00:31,480 Speaker 1: Memphis Grizzlies point guard John Morant suffered a knee injury 9 00:00:31,520 --> 00:00:34,200 Speaker 1: in the second round against the Warriors, he was playing 10 00:00:34,240 --> 00:00:36,920 Speaker 1: some of the best basketball of anyone in the playoffs, 11 00:00:37,520 --> 00:00:41,599 Speaker 1: continuing on his incredible regular season. As I Stafford Mike 12 00:00:41,640 --> 00:00:45,280 Speaker 1: Peena joins us to discuss Jah making the leap to Superstarter. 13 00:00:46,159 --> 00:00:49,560 Speaker 1: But first the wild true story of how a small 14 00:00:49,640 --> 00:00:53,760 Speaker 1: rugby team in Italy took on the Mafia. It's Wednesday, 15 00:00:53,760 --> 00:00:58,240 Speaker 1: May eleven. I'm your host, John Gonzalez from Sports Illustrated 16 00:00:58,280 --> 00:01:09,640 Speaker 1: and I Heart Radio. This is Sports Illustrated Weekly. The 17 00:01:09,720 --> 00:01:13,520 Speaker 1: name Briganty it comes from the word brigand, which is 18 00:01:13,880 --> 00:01:17,360 Speaker 1: someone who's a rebel or a pirate, or someone rallying 19 00:01:17,400 --> 00:01:19,839 Speaker 1: against the status quo of the authorities at the time 20 00:01:20,440 --> 00:01:23,959 Speaker 1: and actually briganty also comes from this collabriating folks song 21 00:01:23,959 --> 00:01:27,400 Speaker 1: called Briganti sim morty or roughly to die a brigand. 22 00:01:27,840 --> 00:01:30,640 Speaker 1: And there's a key line from that song and it goes, 23 00:01:31,160 --> 00:01:34,199 Speaker 1: the land is ours and nobody can touch it. Let's 24 00:01:34,240 --> 00:01:49,279 Speaker 1: make our enemies tremble. There's been equipment stolen, someone fired 25 00:01:49,280 --> 00:01:52,000 Speaker 1: a bullet into the door of the clubhouse. It's just 26 00:01:52,080 --> 00:01:55,040 Speaker 1: an ongoing fight against organized crime in Labrino, and it's 27 00:01:55,080 --> 00:01:58,760 Speaker 1: not going to stop anytime soon. The players feel so 28 00:01:58,880 --> 00:02:01,760 Speaker 1: strongly about their club these days that they actually put 29 00:02:01,760 --> 00:02:05,480 Speaker 1: in night shifts to guard the Santiadoro every night. Can 30 00:02:05,520 --> 00:02:08,799 Speaker 1: you imagine Leo Messi or Neymark putting a night shifts 31 00:02:08,800 --> 00:02:14,519 Speaker 1: to guard the park the prompts in Paris. This is 32 00:02:14,560 --> 00:02:17,680 Speaker 1: Sean Williams. He traveled to the foot of Mount Etna 33 00:02:17,960 --> 00:02:20,280 Speaker 1: to write a story for Sports Illustrated about a rugby 34 00:02:20,360 --> 00:02:23,320 Speaker 1: club standing up to the mafia. From here on out, 35 00:02:23,440 --> 00:02:25,560 Speaker 1: you'll hear his voice and some of the people he 36 00:02:25,680 --> 00:02:30,880 Speaker 1: met through a translator. Labrino is a sprawling suburb of Catania, 37 00:02:30,919 --> 00:02:33,160 Speaker 1: which is the second largest city on the Italian island 38 00:02:33,200 --> 00:02:35,919 Speaker 1: of Sicily. It was built in the late sixties and 39 00:02:36,040 --> 00:02:41,280 Speaker 1: seventies as a modern utopia, feeding the city with workers. 40 00:02:41,760 --> 00:02:44,360 Speaker 1: As it turned out, the money dried up, the city 41 00:02:44,440 --> 00:02:47,280 Speaker 1: didn't build the shops and the swimming pools and the 42 00:02:47,400 --> 00:02:49,640 Speaker 1: gyms and the facilities that the people have been promised, 43 00:02:50,040 --> 00:02:52,680 Speaker 1: and rather than be a utopia, it kind of ended 44 00:02:52,760 --> 00:02:57,880 Speaker 1: up as a ruined, dystopian, crumbling collection of tower blocks. 45 00:02:58,720 --> 00:03:00,440 Speaker 1: One of the most interesting guys I met while I 46 00:03:00,480 --> 00:03:02,840 Speaker 1: was in Catania was a player for the first men's 47 00:03:02,880 --> 00:03:11,799 Speaker 1: team called a Lessio Pana Biancobo. So my relationship, but 48 00:03:11,919 --> 00:03:16,280 Speaker 1: with Librino it's love and hate in the same time. 49 00:03:16,800 --> 00:03:20,160 Speaker 1: Hate because it is not a good place where you 50 00:03:20,280 --> 00:03:23,639 Speaker 1: can grow up, but also I love it because it's 51 00:03:23,680 --> 00:03:26,720 Speaker 1: their place where I grew up. It's my childhood. There 52 00:03:26,800 --> 00:03:30,359 Speaker 1: wasn't a single high school, opportunities were scarce, and in 53 00:03:30,480 --> 00:03:37,520 Speaker 1: scenarios like this, the mafia can easily take hold. Just 54 00:03:37,640 --> 00:03:39,600 Speaker 1: down the road is the center of Catania. That's like 55 00:03:39,680 --> 00:03:43,520 Speaker 1: an ancient city, cobblestone streets, beautiful churches, all the things 56 00:03:43,600 --> 00:03:46,800 Speaker 1: you might think about when you think of Sicily, Italy, 57 00:03:47,040 --> 00:03:49,000 Speaker 1: or even The god Father, which of course was set 58 00:03:49,040 --> 00:03:52,520 Speaker 1: on the island and is how most people think Italian 59 00:03:52,600 --> 00:03:57,240 Speaker 1: mafia mafiosi looked like although the people who run Librino, 60 00:03:57,560 --> 00:03:59,960 Speaker 1: they're not wearing pinstripes and they don't have Tommy gunns 61 00:04:00,040 --> 00:04:03,320 Speaker 1: in violent cases, this is a very very different type 62 00:04:03,320 --> 00:04:10,960 Speaker 1: of organized crime. These were track suit wearing drugs smuggling 63 00:04:11,080 --> 00:04:14,320 Speaker 1: thugs who murdered thousands in a series of wars and 64 00:04:14,400 --> 00:04:20,799 Speaker 1: bombing campaigns across the era. Finally, in six Sicilian authorities 65 00:04:20,839 --> 00:04:24,080 Speaker 1: cracked down and conducted the world's largest trial and a 66 00:04:24,160 --> 00:04:29,960 Speaker 1: special made bunker inside of a Palermo prison by prosecutors 67 00:04:29,960 --> 00:04:33,000 Speaker 1: are convicted three hundred and thirty eight of the so 68 00:04:33,160 --> 00:04:41,600 Speaker 1: called Maxi trials four hundred and seventy five defendants. Later 69 00:04:41,720 --> 00:04:46,680 Speaker 1: that year, mob assassin's murdered those prosecutors, shocking Sicilians, but 70 00:04:46,800 --> 00:04:49,600 Speaker 1: the deaths were the last convulsions of an underworld on 71 00:04:49,680 --> 00:04:53,400 Speaker 1: its knees. In the following years, the Islands mafia grew 72 00:04:53,480 --> 00:04:57,719 Speaker 1: more diffuse with the growing income divide. Wealthier mobsters moved 73 00:04:57,760 --> 00:05:02,200 Speaker 1: into white colored crimes. Small time crooks battle for scraps 74 00:05:02,279 --> 00:05:06,360 Speaker 1: in poor local markets such as Labrino, peddling stolen goods 75 00:05:06,400 --> 00:05:09,679 Speaker 1: and drugs through kids who stood to face only reduced 76 00:05:09,760 --> 00:05:14,200 Speaker 1: juvenile prison terms. This is a poor social, poor condition. 77 00:05:14,640 --> 00:05:18,880 Speaker 1: Actually it's um. It's gold for the market because maybe 78 00:05:18,920 --> 00:05:22,440 Speaker 1: they have cash, cash money to to support the family. 79 00:05:24,080 --> 00:05:29,440 Speaker 1: Enter Briganti Delabrino, a rugby club. It started at the 80 00:05:29,480 --> 00:05:33,000 Speaker 1: local social club when one of the leaders, Pierre Mancuso, 81 00:05:33,120 --> 00:05:35,720 Speaker 1: brought in a rugby ball and started tossing it around 82 00:05:35,760 --> 00:05:40,640 Speaker 1: between the members. The club's philosophy was staunchly left wing, 83 00:05:41,000 --> 00:05:45,280 Speaker 1: anti fascist, anti racist, welcoming everyone into the fold in 84 00:05:45,320 --> 00:05:47,599 Speaker 1: a city which was pretty right wing at the time. 85 00:05:48,120 --> 00:05:50,800 Speaker 1: They wanted to give everyone a good start, basically keep 86 00:05:50,880 --> 00:05:54,720 Speaker 1: kids away from crime. Rugby isn't very popular in southern 87 00:05:54,800 --> 00:05:57,960 Speaker 1: Italy or Sicily at all. Some people play in the north, 88 00:05:58,040 --> 00:06:00,600 Speaker 1: but really it's soccer or caucio in the local language, 89 00:06:00,600 --> 00:06:03,480 Speaker 1: which is the pre eminent sport. But soccer has a 90 00:06:03,600 --> 00:06:07,279 Speaker 1: long and sordid history with the mafia. Members of Naples 91 00:06:07,400 --> 00:06:11,440 Speaker 1: Camorra crime syndicate plied Diego Maradonna with drugs and sex 92 00:06:11,520 --> 00:06:18,640 Speaker 1: workers in the nineteen eighties. There's so much that is 93 00:06:18,680 --> 00:06:22,719 Speaker 1: intertwined in Italian sport with organized crime. There are dozens 94 00:06:22,800 --> 00:06:26,239 Speaker 1: of clubs where there have been matfio c running the place. 95 00:06:26,880 --> 00:06:30,719 Speaker 1: Mankuzo was also wary of soccer's on field culture, which 96 00:06:30,800 --> 00:06:34,800 Speaker 1: rewards flops and theatricality, and which centers on an obsession 97 00:06:34,920 --> 00:06:39,360 Speaker 1: with individual talent. In contrast, Noble reaches the opposing try 98 00:06:39,480 --> 00:06:46,320 Speaker 1: line without everybody's involvement. Soccer is balletic. Rugby is trench warfare. 99 00:06:50,200 --> 00:06:53,840 Speaker 1: In rugby, you needed to loose at what you have 100 00:06:54,000 --> 00:06:57,320 Speaker 1: around your work. There is in the Slade ground. It's 101 00:06:57,360 --> 00:07:00,280 Speaker 1: not enough to have in your team like really good 102 00:07:00,360 --> 00:07:04,560 Speaker 1: play here they have also to work with the others. 103 00:07:05,560 --> 00:07:09,200 Speaker 1: If you fall, says Gloria Mentally, the captain of Briganti 104 00:07:09,320 --> 00:07:12,880 Speaker 1: Senior women's team, teammates will help you back up. This 105 00:07:13,080 --> 00:07:16,920 Speaker 1: is the like life because this will help you always 106 00:07:17,040 --> 00:07:21,440 Speaker 1: to to live standing up again after you fell. So 107 00:07:21,880 --> 00:07:24,800 Speaker 1: you fall and then you stand up and new continue. 108 00:07:28,880 --> 00:07:32,400 Speaker 1: The Santiodoro is Briganti's beloved ground, but they actually started 109 00:07:32,400 --> 00:07:36,960 Speaker 1: there as squatters. It was built in the World University Games, 110 00:07:37,160 --> 00:07:38,720 Speaker 1: but no one ever even used it and it just 111 00:07:38,880 --> 00:07:42,760 Speaker 1: laid their growing mass and going derelict. But Mancuso was 112 00:07:42,840 --> 00:07:45,200 Speaker 1: pretty sure that he wanted this to be his home turf, 113 00:07:45,880 --> 00:07:48,000 Speaker 1: so from when the club was first formed in two 114 00:07:48,080 --> 00:07:51,360 Speaker 1: thousand six, all the way up to the club was 115 00:07:51,520 --> 00:07:56,320 Speaker 1: essentially squatters, just being there illegally playing training without the 116 00:07:56,480 --> 00:07:58,920 Speaker 1: consent of the authorities or the police or anyone. It's 117 00:07:59,000 --> 00:08:09,480 Speaker 1: much less the Mafia on A, which was uncoincidentally thirty 118 00:08:09,560 --> 00:08:12,920 Speaker 1: two years to the day after Italy was liberated from fascism, 119 00:08:13,480 --> 00:08:17,000 Speaker 1: Mancuzo moved everybody into the Santiadoro and declared it to 120 00:08:17,040 --> 00:08:22,120 Speaker 1: be their official home. Paperwork be damned. Giuseppe Consulo was 121 00:08:22,240 --> 00:08:24,240 Speaker 1: exactly the kind of kid the club was aiming at. 122 00:08:24,720 --> 00:08:27,480 Speaker 1: He was a thirteen year old from Labrino and he 123 00:08:27,560 --> 00:08:29,080 Speaker 1: was kind of getting wound up in some of the 124 00:08:29,200 --> 00:08:33,240 Speaker 1: darker side of the neighborhood's activities. In two thousand and twelve, 125 00:08:33,480 --> 00:08:36,160 Speaker 1: just after the club rocked up at the Santiadoro, he 126 00:08:36,280 --> 00:08:39,439 Speaker 1: was knocked off his moped and killed. No one truly 127 00:08:39,520 --> 00:08:42,199 Speaker 1: knows what happens to him, but pretty much everyone in 128 00:08:42,240 --> 00:08:44,240 Speaker 1: the club suspects it was to do with his activities 129 00:08:44,280 --> 00:08:50,880 Speaker 1: in the Mafia. So on A Giuseppe Briganty named their 130 00:08:50,920 --> 00:08:54,160 Speaker 1: clubhouse after him. It became kind of a focal point, 131 00:08:54,200 --> 00:08:56,640 Speaker 1: at rallying point for the club to kind of cement 132 00:08:56,720 --> 00:08:58,839 Speaker 1: their vision to try and buck the trend of the 133 00:08:58,920 --> 00:09:01,760 Speaker 1: mafia neil nice crime that was taken over Labrino at 134 00:09:01,800 --> 00:09:11,319 Speaker 1: the time. But the Jiuseppe Councilo clubhouse, that's just one 135 00:09:11,360 --> 00:09:14,360 Speaker 1: small part of the whole Santi Adora complex. You've got 136 00:09:14,440 --> 00:09:16,440 Speaker 1: the field and you've got the play in areas, of course, 137 00:09:16,520 --> 00:09:19,760 Speaker 1: but you've also got these giant hangars like air hangers. 138 00:09:20,120 --> 00:09:21,920 Speaker 1: One of them's got a gym in it, another one's 139 00:09:21,920 --> 00:09:24,800 Speaker 1: got a cafe. There's a bar, there's a learning area, 140 00:09:24,880 --> 00:09:27,600 Speaker 1: there's a library for kids. It's really like a holistic 141 00:09:27,760 --> 00:09:30,480 Speaker 1: neighborhood spot that all the kids can come to. But 142 00:09:30,600 --> 00:09:32,680 Speaker 1: above all they can be safe and they have someone 143 00:09:32,720 --> 00:09:35,199 Speaker 1: to look out for them and look after them. Over 144 00:09:35,240 --> 00:09:38,080 Speaker 1: the coming years, the club grew and grew, and hundreds 145 00:09:38,120 --> 00:09:40,400 Speaker 1: of young kids from the local neighborhood were getting involved 146 00:09:40,440 --> 00:09:45,000 Speaker 1: in becoming brigands against the organized crime. But that wasn't 147 00:09:45,160 --> 00:09:50,320 Speaker 1: the end of the club's war against the mafia. At 148 00:09:50,400 --> 00:09:57,359 Speaker 1: midnight on Jann ablaze broke out in the Giuseppe Councilor clubhouse, 149 00:09:58,000 --> 00:10:04,120 Speaker 1: destroying almost everything inside. Authorities never officially connected the fire 150 00:10:04,200 --> 00:10:07,160 Speaker 1: to the cost In Austra, who rely heavily on arson 151 00:10:07,240 --> 00:10:10,959 Speaker 1: as an intimidation tactic, but to Briguanty there was a 152 00:10:11,040 --> 00:10:15,800 Speaker 1: clear message from the mob we run Labrino brush into 153 00:10:15,920 --> 00:10:18,480 Speaker 1: this ends. They want to show that power. When they 154 00:10:18,559 --> 00:10:22,000 Speaker 1: burned out here, they wanted to say we are here, 155 00:10:22,880 --> 00:10:27,319 Speaker 1: this is us. They know that we take from the 156 00:10:27,480 --> 00:10:34,760 Speaker 1: streets the guys that could be their workers. The following morning, 157 00:10:34,800 --> 00:10:38,760 Speaker 1: everyone showed up to train players, staff and their families 158 00:10:39,559 --> 00:10:42,559 Speaker 1: and the place was a wreck. But rather than sit 159 00:10:42,600 --> 00:10:46,120 Speaker 1: around or feel sorry for themselves, Briganti did, I guess 160 00:10:46,160 --> 00:10:49,480 Speaker 1: what Briguanty do best, and that's just carry on playing, 161 00:10:50,240 --> 00:10:54,400 Speaker 1: so we must react. The day after the fire, we 162 00:10:54,520 --> 00:10:57,760 Speaker 1: did the after schools on the stairs and they did 163 00:10:57,800 --> 00:11:01,880 Speaker 1: their training. They ran drews. They just kind of carried 164 00:11:01,920 --> 00:11:04,000 Speaker 1: on through, which is what they've done ever since they 165 00:11:04,040 --> 00:11:07,720 Speaker 1: were first founded. There was a huge response from outside 166 00:11:07,720 --> 00:11:10,640 Speaker 1: the club, in the Rugby World clubs from Ireland and 167 00:11:10,720 --> 00:11:13,560 Speaker 1: Australia and New Zealand and England and France. They all 168 00:11:13,640 --> 00:11:16,880 Speaker 1: came together stumping up the cash and the gear to 169 00:11:17,120 --> 00:11:21,200 Speaker 1: to build Briganty back up from the ashes. There's been 170 00:11:21,240 --> 00:11:25,000 Speaker 1: equipment stolen. Someone fired a bullet into the door of 171 00:11:25,120 --> 00:11:29,640 Speaker 1: the clubhouse. Someone came over to the Briganti clubhouse and 172 00:11:29,720 --> 00:11:32,480 Speaker 1: they torched the club bus that was sitting behind the 173 00:11:32,559 --> 00:11:35,160 Speaker 1: place at the time. The club have still kept that 174 00:11:35,280 --> 00:11:38,679 Speaker 1: burnt out tire marks from that incident so that everyone 175 00:11:38,800 --> 00:11:41,920 Speaker 1: can see just what it means to be a Brigand 176 00:11:42,720 --> 00:11:45,720 Speaker 1: it's just an ongoing fight against organized crime in Labrino 177 00:11:45,800 --> 00:11:50,000 Speaker 1: and it's not going to stop anytime soon. The players 178 00:11:50,040 --> 00:11:53,040 Speaker 1: feel so strongly about their club these days that they 179 00:11:53,080 --> 00:11:56,679 Speaker 1: actually put in night shifts to guard the Santiador every night, 180 00:11:57,200 --> 00:11:59,559 Speaker 1: so they will go in groups of three or four 181 00:11:59,640 --> 00:12:01,960 Speaker 1: at im and they'll stay there all the way through 182 00:12:02,000 --> 00:12:04,840 Speaker 1: the night, guarding the doors, making sure no one's coming 183 00:12:04,880 --> 00:12:07,240 Speaker 1: in to torch the place or to threaten them, or 184 00:12:07,520 --> 00:12:10,520 Speaker 1: to steal equipment, or even still the astro turf that 185 00:12:10,559 --> 00:12:13,280 Speaker 1: they've built their new field out of, which actually happened 186 00:12:13,280 --> 00:12:20,240 Speaker 1: pretty recently. These young guys are Buguanty through and through. 187 00:12:20,320 --> 00:12:22,839 Speaker 1: They've been there for years, they've seen the best of it, 188 00:12:23,000 --> 00:12:24,640 Speaker 1: the worst of it, and they're determined to kind of 189 00:12:24,720 --> 00:12:26,679 Speaker 1: push it to the next level. And that's not just 190 00:12:26,840 --> 00:12:30,120 Speaker 1: behind the scenes or as a social outreach program. They 191 00:12:30,120 --> 00:12:32,760 Speaker 1: actually want to be good on the field. They're trying 192 00:12:32,760 --> 00:12:34,400 Speaker 1: to move up the league's They want to be a 193 00:12:34,480 --> 00:12:37,559 Speaker 1: part of the higher even semi pro or professional leagues 194 00:12:37,559 --> 00:12:40,080 Speaker 1: in Italy. They've certainly got the whole of the local 195 00:12:40,120 --> 00:12:47,040 Speaker 1: neighborhood behind them, so the sky is the limit. We 196 00:12:47,280 --> 00:12:49,880 Speaker 1: resisted and we continue, but nothing is a turn not 197 00:12:50,000 --> 00:12:52,719 Speaker 1: so we don't know. Maybe something will put us in 198 00:12:52,800 --> 00:12:56,319 Speaker 1: the situation that we cannot continue, but for now we 199 00:12:56,400 --> 00:13:07,360 Speaker 1: are winning. This club means so so much more to 200 00:13:07,480 --> 00:13:10,439 Speaker 1: its players and their family and the whole community than 201 00:13:10,600 --> 00:13:12,960 Speaker 1: just a bunch of guys turning up on a Saturday 202 00:13:13,040 --> 00:13:18,959 Speaker 1: or a Sunday to play rugby. Briganty is part of 203 00:13:19,040 --> 00:13:22,840 Speaker 1: Labrino now. It's just become such a lifeline for kids 204 00:13:22,920 --> 00:13:26,600 Speaker 1: who have grown up in poor or even violent families 205 00:13:26,640 --> 00:13:30,240 Speaker 1: associated with organized crime. I mean, it's impossible to get 206 00:13:30,360 --> 00:13:32,480 Speaker 1: away from the sort of crime that's on the streets 207 00:13:32,520 --> 00:13:36,880 Speaker 1: in this area. There's people dealing drugs everywhere, violent clashes 208 00:13:36,920 --> 00:13:41,040 Speaker 1: between rival gangs pretty much every other day, and Briganty 209 00:13:41,280 --> 00:13:44,199 Speaker 1: is a safe haven. More than one player described it 210 00:13:44,240 --> 00:13:48,400 Speaker 1: to me as their happy place. One of the most 211 00:13:48,480 --> 00:13:51,160 Speaker 1: interesting guys I met while I was in Catania was 212 00:13:51,240 --> 00:13:54,559 Speaker 1: one of the first men's team players called Lessio pana Bianco. 213 00:13:54,920 --> 00:13:59,520 Speaker 1: He's a squat, really muscular, really cool, talented player, but 214 00:13:59,600 --> 00:14:02,360 Speaker 1: he's also has this really piercing stare in a way 215 00:14:02,400 --> 00:14:05,120 Speaker 1: of speaking, really passionate here about the club. And it's 216 00:14:05,120 --> 00:14:07,080 Speaker 1: not surprising given that he's grown up just a couple 217 00:14:07,120 --> 00:14:12,640 Speaker 1: of blocks away from the Santiadoro. Um. I was in London. 218 00:14:13,040 --> 00:14:15,880 Speaker 1: I wasn't born here, but I grew up here and 219 00:14:16,000 --> 00:14:20,000 Speaker 1: I started playing rugby at the age of twelve. I 220 00:14:20,120 --> 00:14:23,480 Speaker 1: didn't know about rugby before I started with the Briganti. 221 00:14:24,440 --> 00:14:28,040 Speaker 1: And he feels like such a huge responsibility. He's one 222 00:14:28,080 --> 00:14:30,040 Speaker 1: of these young generations and he wants to teach the 223 00:14:30,160 --> 00:14:33,440 Speaker 1: younger kids. He takes training there all the time. I mean, 224 00:14:33,480 --> 00:14:36,040 Speaker 1: there literally isn't a day where this guy isn't down 225 00:14:36,080 --> 00:14:39,680 Speaker 1: at the club, either teaching young people how to play rugby, 226 00:14:40,360 --> 00:14:42,480 Speaker 1: or hanging out of the library or just like messing 227 00:14:42,520 --> 00:14:45,160 Speaker 1: about with his friends. Here's one thing he told me. 228 00:14:45,720 --> 00:14:49,680 Speaker 1: Of course, I can say also, my parents have a part, 229 00:14:49,840 --> 00:14:53,040 Speaker 1: but the eighty percent of what I am today is 230 00:14:53,120 --> 00:15:00,760 Speaker 1: the Briganti. That image in my life, very dark without light, 231 00:15:01,520 --> 00:15:14,640 Speaker 1: a brigant our delight. Sean Williams wrote the story the 232 00:15:14,760 --> 00:15:17,520 Speaker 1: Land is Ours and Nobody Can Touch It, which appears 233 00:15:17,560 --> 00:15:20,520 Speaker 1: in the magazine and on SI dot com. You can 234 00:15:20,560 --> 00:15:23,520 Speaker 1: also listen to him on the Underworld podcast. We'll have 235 00:15:23,600 --> 00:15:26,880 Speaker 1: a link in our show notes. After a break, we 236 00:15:26,960 --> 00:15:29,160 Speaker 1: take a look back at Urban Myers no good, very 237 00:15:29,240 --> 00:15:35,560 Speaker 1: bad time as head coach of the Jacksonville Jaguars. Hey, y'all, 238 00:15:35,840 --> 00:15:38,880 Speaker 1: just a quick heads up. As we were finishing this segment, 239 00:15:39,000 --> 00:15:42,400 Speaker 1: news broke that former Jaguars kicker Josh Lambo is suing 240 00:15:42,480 --> 00:15:46,320 Speaker 1: the team over Urban Meyer allegedly kicking him. Now, we 241 00:15:46,400 --> 00:15:49,000 Speaker 1: discussed that incident in this piece, but it's yet another 242 00:15:49,080 --> 00:15:52,840 Speaker 1: reminder that Myer's tenure with Jacksonville was an utter debacle. 243 00:15:53,640 --> 00:15:58,200 Speaker 1: And with that update, here's the segment. It's my privileged 244 00:15:58,240 --> 00:16:02,440 Speaker 1: to interviews the new head coach of the Jackson Belle Jaguars, 245 00:16:03,080 --> 00:16:06,760 Speaker 1: Urban Meyer. Well, thanks, Sean. I would first like to 246 00:16:06,800 --> 00:16:09,840 Speaker 1: thank shot Con for this opportunity to lead the organization 247 00:16:09,960 --> 00:16:22,120 Speaker 1: into and beyond breaking news actually happened overnight. Urban Meyer 248 00:16:22,920 --> 00:16:28,120 Speaker 1: is now officially Urban fired. The year that was for 249 00:16:28,320 --> 00:16:32,240 Speaker 1: Urban Meyer in the NFL, there ain't much good. There 250 00:16:32,440 --> 00:16:35,800 Speaker 1: is a lot of that liar fraud you name it, 251 00:16:36,080 --> 00:16:39,160 Speaker 1: because that's who Urban Meyer is. With several controversies since 252 00:16:39,200 --> 00:16:41,520 Speaker 1: it's hiring in January, including the latest report I just 253 00:16:41,640 --> 00:16:45,280 Speaker 1: mentioned physically kicking a player. His thirteen games are the 254 00:16:45,360 --> 00:16:53,480 Speaker 1: fewest by non interim head coach in Jaguars history. Let's 255 00:16:53,520 --> 00:16:56,040 Speaker 1: just say that when the Jacksonville Jaguars bet on Urban 256 00:16:56,120 --> 00:16:59,080 Speaker 1: Meyer as their head coach, it didn't exactly pay off. 257 00:17:00,080 --> 00:17:02,800 Speaker 1: Meyer had one of the worst and most maligne runs 258 00:17:02,960 --> 00:17:06,359 Speaker 1: of any head coach in NFL history, and now with 259 00:17:06,560 --> 00:17:10,160 Speaker 1: rumors circulating that he'll return to the broadcast booth, everyone 260 00:17:10,240 --> 00:17:13,240 Speaker 1: from the media to the Jaguars owner has lately talked 261 00:17:13,240 --> 00:17:16,840 Speaker 1: about Meyer's disastrous time with the Jags and in pretty 262 00:17:16,880 --> 00:17:20,240 Speaker 1: harsh and candid terms. To review all of that, we 263 00:17:20,320 --> 00:17:22,880 Speaker 1: brought in one of our favorite SI staffers and recurring 264 00:17:22,920 --> 00:17:29,680 Speaker 1: guests from the mm QB podcast, Connor Or, Welcome back 265 00:17:29,720 --> 00:17:33,560 Speaker 1: to Sports Illustrated Weekly. I'm getting comfortable in this chair now, 266 00:17:33,640 --> 00:17:36,400 Speaker 1: I like Covin dots SI Weekly. This is good. We're 267 00:17:36,400 --> 00:17:38,440 Speaker 1: gonna give you a producer credit. You're here so much 268 00:17:39,160 --> 00:17:41,359 Speaker 1: constantly on Sports Illustrated Weekly. We love to have you 269 00:17:41,480 --> 00:17:43,399 Speaker 1: here and I'm excited to talk to you about this 270 00:17:43,480 --> 00:17:47,400 Speaker 1: specific topic, because you really shine in pointing out where 271 00:17:47,440 --> 00:17:51,439 Speaker 1: everybody else screws up, and man, did Irvin Meyer screw up? 272 00:17:51,520 --> 00:17:54,640 Speaker 1: Reports are swirling at the former Jaguars head coach. We'll 273 00:17:54,680 --> 00:17:57,240 Speaker 1: be taking a job at Fox Sports to talk college football, 274 00:17:57,280 --> 00:17:59,920 Speaker 1: which you know, sure, I guess, but he was fired 275 00:18:00,160 --> 00:18:03,880 Speaker 1: unceremoniously as the head coach of the Jacksonville Jaguars. There's 276 00:18:03,880 --> 00:18:06,440 Speaker 1: a long list of misdeeds while he was in Jacksonville, 277 00:18:06,480 --> 00:18:08,800 Speaker 1: which we're going to get into. But Connor, as our 278 00:18:08,920 --> 00:18:12,720 Speaker 1: resident NFL historian, where does this rank among the worst 279 00:18:12,800 --> 00:18:17,200 Speaker 1: flameouts in league history? Uh? Well, thank you for the introduction, 280 00:18:17,280 --> 00:18:19,680 Speaker 1: and I will just add that I screw up all 281 00:18:19,720 --> 00:18:22,160 Speaker 1: the time too, so if anyone ever wants to ask 282 00:18:22,240 --> 00:18:24,080 Speaker 1: me about those, I'm more than happy to be fair 283 00:18:24,160 --> 00:18:26,720 Speaker 1: and equitable in that. But where does this rank among 284 00:18:26,760 --> 00:18:30,560 Speaker 1: the worst coaching hires of all time? I mean, gosh, 285 00:18:30,640 --> 00:18:33,640 Speaker 1: I would say, given the stakes, right, because you're drafting 286 00:18:33,800 --> 00:18:37,359 Speaker 1: Trevor Lawrence and he is a generational quarterback prospect who 287 00:18:37,440 --> 00:18:41,120 Speaker 1: we've talked about for like three years coming out into 288 00:18:41,119 --> 00:18:44,480 Speaker 1: the NFL. You, as Shad Khan, staked your reputation on this. 289 00:18:45,160 --> 00:18:48,520 Speaker 1: You got rid of a coaching staff and a GM 290 00:18:48,680 --> 00:18:50,920 Speaker 1: that had taken Blake Bortles to the a f C 291 00:18:51,119 --> 00:18:54,359 Speaker 1: Championship Game a month ago. I mean, it has to 292 00:18:54,440 --> 00:18:57,320 Speaker 1: be among the worst, if not the worst. Yeah, it's 293 00:18:57,359 --> 00:18:59,800 Speaker 1: certainly one of the worst, and not just because of 294 00:18:59,840 --> 00:19:02,639 Speaker 1: all the things that went wrong, but also because of 295 00:19:02,640 --> 00:19:06,600 Speaker 1: the residual effect and obvious acrimony that remains. JAG's owner. 296 00:19:06,680 --> 00:19:09,639 Speaker 1: Shot con was recently asked about why he dismissed Meyer, 297 00:19:10,200 --> 00:19:12,040 Speaker 1: and he said it wasn't about wins and losses. He 298 00:19:12,119 --> 00:19:14,800 Speaker 1: noted that Doug Maron and Gus Bradley were also losers, 299 00:19:15,040 --> 00:19:17,040 Speaker 1: and so Maron and Bradley out there minding their own 300 00:19:17,080 --> 00:19:20,159 Speaker 1: business and just catching strays in this one. But Con said, quote, 301 00:19:20,480 --> 00:19:23,760 Speaker 1: when you lose the respect, the trust, and an issue 302 00:19:23,840 --> 00:19:26,800 Speaker 1: of truthfulness, how can you possibly work with somebody like that? 303 00:19:27,000 --> 00:19:29,840 Speaker 1: It's not possible, Connor, that's not just an indictment of 304 00:19:29,920 --> 00:19:33,440 Speaker 1: Meyer the coach. That's an indictment of Meyer the man. Yeah, 305 00:19:33,600 --> 00:19:36,600 Speaker 1: and shed Con is interesting to me, right. I think 306 00:19:36,720 --> 00:19:39,600 Speaker 1: he's among the better owners in the NFL. And everyone's 307 00:19:39,600 --> 00:19:42,320 Speaker 1: always like you're out of your mind. It's crazy. I 308 00:19:42,400 --> 00:19:45,720 Speaker 1: don't think so. Because he holds onto coaches like he 309 00:19:45,920 --> 00:19:49,320 Speaker 1: gives people a long runway, like he gives them time. 310 00:19:49,359 --> 00:19:52,280 Speaker 1: And it's not for lack of concern or lack of caring. 311 00:19:52,359 --> 00:19:54,600 Speaker 1: It's like, you know, it's like, hey, I believe in 312 00:19:54,680 --> 00:19:57,720 Speaker 1: this person, and he believed in Gus Bradley. He loved 313 00:19:57,760 --> 00:20:01,080 Speaker 1: Gus Bradley. And so I think he's one of those 314 00:20:01,240 --> 00:20:04,040 Speaker 1: guys that's not necessarily like Jerry Jones or it's like 315 00:20:04,119 --> 00:20:06,400 Speaker 1: I'm a handshake kind of guy, but it's like, yeah, 316 00:20:06,480 --> 00:20:09,520 Speaker 1: if you cross Shad Gun in a way and come 317 00:20:09,560 --> 00:20:13,920 Speaker 1: across as visibly either insubordinate or untrustworthy, I think he 318 00:20:14,000 --> 00:20:15,520 Speaker 1: has no choice but to let you go. And it 319 00:20:16,000 --> 00:20:19,600 Speaker 1: it's a stunning admission from an owner, not certain owners, 320 00:20:19,640 --> 00:20:22,360 Speaker 1: but I think him in particular, it's a very stunning admission. 321 00:20:22,800 --> 00:20:25,359 Speaker 1: It is a stunning admission. And especially in retrospect, I 322 00:20:25,440 --> 00:20:29,080 Speaker 1: think we forget because obviously everything went so terribly awry. 323 00:20:29,720 --> 00:20:32,159 Speaker 1: But at the beginning, there were really high hopes for 324 00:20:32,280 --> 00:20:35,800 Speaker 1: Meyer in Jacksonville, especially because, as you mentioned, Trevor Lawrence 325 00:20:35,880 --> 00:20:38,440 Speaker 1: is the young quarterback and there was all this hype about, 326 00:20:38,520 --> 00:20:42,040 Speaker 1: oh urban Meyer working with Trevor Lawrence. Won't that be 327 00:20:42,720 --> 00:20:45,399 Speaker 1: a perfect marriage I mean, I think we forget about 328 00:20:45,920 --> 00:20:47,919 Speaker 1: the way that it was build in the run up. 329 00:20:48,920 --> 00:20:52,719 Speaker 1: Jacksonville just got the world's smartest stockbroker. There were an 330 00:20:52,760 --> 00:20:55,840 Speaker 1: eight dollar stock. The minute they draft Trevor Lawrence. There 331 00:20:55,880 --> 00:20:58,800 Speaker 1: are twenty eight dollar stock, and Urban Meyer with that 332 00:20:58,960 --> 00:21:01,679 Speaker 1: cap space few free agents, there are forty eight dollar stock. 333 00:21:02,200 --> 00:21:04,640 Speaker 1: I feel like I was fairly critical from the beginning. 334 00:21:05,160 --> 00:21:07,880 Speaker 1: I think my column on draft night when they draft 335 00:21:07,920 --> 00:21:10,400 Speaker 1: Trevor Lawrence was are we share about this? You can 336 00:21:10,480 --> 00:21:12,800 Speaker 1: still get out of it if you want to, But 337 00:21:13,119 --> 00:21:16,119 Speaker 1: you know, I think my antennas started to raise up 338 00:21:16,160 --> 00:21:19,080 Speaker 1: when you looked at the staff, because that's always a 339 00:21:19,160 --> 00:21:22,080 Speaker 1: big thing when college coaches come to the NFL. He 340 00:21:22,160 --> 00:21:24,720 Speaker 1: obviously had the controversy with the strength and conditioning coach 341 00:21:24,880 --> 00:21:29,120 Speaker 1: from Iowa, but generally speaking, like you're taking guys who 342 00:21:29,960 --> 00:21:31,639 Speaker 1: probably aren't at the top of a lot of people's 343 00:21:31,680 --> 00:21:33,760 Speaker 1: coordinator lists, Like there wasn't a lot of people like 344 00:21:33,960 --> 00:21:35,960 Speaker 1: beating down the door there to work with him. And 345 00:21:36,040 --> 00:21:39,280 Speaker 1: I think that his reputation preceded him because it's like 346 00:21:39,400 --> 00:21:41,359 Speaker 1: two sides of the ink blot test, how are you 347 00:21:41,440 --> 00:21:45,720 Speaker 1: looking at? Urban Meyer got really successful for being demanding 348 00:21:45,760 --> 00:21:49,000 Speaker 1: and holding people accountable, or urban Meyer got really successful 349 00:21:49,040 --> 00:21:50,800 Speaker 1: by scaring the bid Jesus out of all of his 350 00:21:50,840 --> 00:21:53,159 Speaker 1: assistant coaches and screaming at them all the time. And 351 00:21:53,359 --> 00:21:56,640 Speaker 1: kids right, and and so yeah, and like eighteen year olds, 352 00:21:56,840 --> 00:22:00,119 Speaker 1: we walked this fine line with all great coaches. We do. 353 00:22:00,480 --> 00:22:03,199 Speaker 1: It's just some degree, maybe not necessarily as far as 354 00:22:03,280 --> 00:22:06,680 Speaker 1: urban Meyer, but I think his reputation in that regard 355 00:22:07,119 --> 00:22:09,800 Speaker 1: preceded him. And that's when my antenna went up. It's like, 356 00:22:10,240 --> 00:22:13,000 Speaker 1: I don't know. I mean, it's such a cliche to say, 357 00:22:13,080 --> 00:22:15,119 Speaker 1: you know, college coaches failing in the NFL, but this 358 00:22:15,280 --> 00:22:17,600 Speaker 1: is such an egregious example of it. I want to 359 00:22:17,680 --> 00:22:20,960 Speaker 1: walk through what went wrong from Meyer in Jacksonville. And 360 00:22:21,000 --> 00:22:23,760 Speaker 1: the short answer there is obviously everything, But the long 361 00:22:23,800 --> 00:22:27,000 Speaker 1: answer requires some reviews. So I'll rattle off some of 362 00:22:27,119 --> 00:22:29,520 Speaker 1: these things and after each one you can just respond, 363 00:22:29,640 --> 00:22:32,320 Speaker 1: all right. He pushed for live contact drills right away, 364 00:22:34,240 --> 00:22:37,320 Speaker 1: so I wrote this a couple months ago. Him and 365 00:22:37,440 --> 00:22:41,560 Speaker 1: Joe Judge are the last faux tough guy head coaches 366 00:22:41,600 --> 00:22:44,360 Speaker 1: that will ever exist in the NFL. It's done. It's 367 00:22:44,400 --> 00:22:47,479 Speaker 1: absolutely done. Like in the league before, We've always had 368 00:22:47,520 --> 00:22:49,840 Speaker 1: that flip in that flop, Right, The joke is always 369 00:22:50,040 --> 00:22:51,760 Speaker 1: you put the ping pong table in the locker room, 370 00:22:51,840 --> 00:22:53,399 Speaker 1: then you pull it out and put it in. You know. 371 00:22:53,760 --> 00:22:55,560 Speaker 1: Urban Meyer was that, you know, let's pull the ping 372 00:22:55,600 --> 00:22:57,800 Speaker 1: pong table out, let's beat the crap out of each other. 373 00:22:57,920 --> 00:23:01,320 Speaker 1: And it was just such a dated philosophy, and I 374 00:23:01,440 --> 00:23:05,439 Speaker 1: just think nobody responds to that anymore because players are 375 00:23:05,640 --> 00:23:08,840 Speaker 1: so aware of all the dangers that they're putting their 376 00:23:08,880 --> 00:23:10,680 Speaker 1: body through that they're like, why am I going to 377 00:23:11,000 --> 00:23:15,000 Speaker 1: multiply this in a useless practice that you're not even 378 00:23:15,080 --> 00:23:18,560 Speaker 1: running correctly anyway? Yeah, nobody's running win sprints after practice anymore. 379 00:23:18,560 --> 00:23:20,080 Speaker 1: A right, here's another one for you. He held a 380 00:23:20,160 --> 00:23:22,600 Speaker 1: Winter Loser drill that led to a broken finger. For 381 00:23:22,720 --> 00:23:26,520 Speaker 1: d J. Chark, It's just like, I don't know. I mean, 382 00:23:26,680 --> 00:23:29,000 Speaker 1: I would guess I'm thirty three, right, so I would 383 00:23:29,000 --> 00:23:32,280 Speaker 1: guess my generation is probably the last that did those 384 00:23:32,400 --> 00:23:36,159 Speaker 1: torturous games when we like played football when we grew up, right, 385 00:23:36,520 --> 00:23:39,159 Speaker 1: Bull in the Ring or the Oklahoma drill or all 386 00:23:39,200 --> 00:23:40,960 Speaker 1: that stuff that you were just like scared the b 387 00:23:41,160 --> 00:23:43,159 Speaker 1: Jesus out of you as a nine year old that 388 00:23:43,160 --> 00:23:45,439 Speaker 1: you had to do in youth football, and Urban Meyer's 389 00:23:45,480 --> 00:23:48,200 Speaker 1: doing it with still doing it here thirty year old guys. 390 00:23:48,720 --> 00:23:51,760 Speaker 1: With these thirty year old guys, He forbade players from 391 00:23:51,800 --> 00:23:54,840 Speaker 1: speaking to opponents, and he braided a player so harshly 392 00:23:54,920 --> 00:23:59,920 Speaker 1: he cried, it's just ridiculous. Like when was the last 393 00:24:00,160 --> 00:24:05,080 Speaker 1: time honestly that you think maybe Pittsburgh and Cincinnati in 394 00:24:05,160 --> 00:24:07,480 Speaker 1: the NFL, but there was a rivalry where like you 395 00:24:07,680 --> 00:24:10,760 Speaker 1: just hated those guys because of the uniform that doesn't 396 00:24:10,840 --> 00:24:15,720 Speaker 1: exist anymore. And to come in and assume, like in college, 397 00:24:16,000 --> 00:24:19,680 Speaker 1: this is a typical college coach mistake, pitfall, Right, you're 398 00:24:19,720 --> 00:24:22,920 Speaker 1: able to convince these children that they should hate the 399 00:24:22,960 --> 00:24:25,399 Speaker 1: guys in the other uniform. There's some sort of like 400 00:24:26,080 --> 00:24:29,240 Speaker 1: you know, provincial thing going on there or they said 401 00:24:29,320 --> 00:24:32,080 Speaker 1: this about you or whatever, blah blah blah. But in 402 00:24:32,119 --> 00:24:34,080 Speaker 1: the NFL, it's like, yeah, I hang out with all 403 00:24:34,119 --> 00:24:36,879 Speaker 1: those guys, I train with all those guys. Yeah, I 404 00:24:36,920 --> 00:24:40,200 Speaker 1: mean professionalism. You can be professional and still compete. Here's 405 00:24:40,280 --> 00:24:43,359 Speaker 1: my favorite one, although probably wasn't for the player. He 406 00:24:43,560 --> 00:24:46,560 Speaker 1: kicked the kicker, Josh Lambeau. And not only did he 407 00:24:46,680 --> 00:24:49,639 Speaker 1: kick the kicker Josh Lambo, he said he didn't and 408 00:24:49,720 --> 00:24:52,720 Speaker 1: then Lambeau said, yeah he did. He comes up to 409 00:24:52,800 --> 00:24:57,879 Speaker 1: me and he says, hey, dip another word, uh make 410 00:24:57,960 --> 00:25:01,239 Speaker 1: your and kicks and then proceeds to kick me right 411 00:25:01,280 --> 00:25:03,840 Speaker 1: in the lag, right in the hamstring. This one always 412 00:25:04,000 --> 00:25:06,960 Speaker 1: like it was my favorite part of the story. And 413 00:25:07,000 --> 00:25:10,400 Speaker 1: again it's not for Josh obviously. If you can imagine, 414 00:25:10,600 --> 00:25:14,199 Speaker 1: Josh is an NFL veteran, right and an adult an 415 00:25:14,240 --> 00:25:16,560 Speaker 1: adult yeah, and you and I so you and I 416 00:25:16,960 --> 00:25:19,520 Speaker 1: are you know, we've been in this business for enough 417 00:25:19,600 --> 00:25:21,280 Speaker 1: time that I feel like we could stand on our 418 00:25:21,280 --> 00:25:23,720 Speaker 1: own two feet and we can say to someone like, hey, 419 00:25:24,119 --> 00:25:26,600 Speaker 1: don't talk to me that way. And Josh Lambo is 420 00:25:26,680 --> 00:25:28,720 Speaker 1: that in the NFL, he was a long term kicker. 421 00:25:28,840 --> 00:25:32,480 Speaker 1: And to imagine a grown man coming up to you 422 00:25:33,040 --> 00:25:36,280 Speaker 1: who's never coached in the NFL before and then kicked him. 423 00:25:36,359 --> 00:25:39,199 Speaker 1: And Josh said, hard enough where it bothered me right 424 00:25:39,280 --> 00:25:41,520 Speaker 1: like it wasn't like a playful kick like it was. 425 00:25:42,320 --> 00:25:44,720 Speaker 1: The report insinuated that there was at least some kind 426 00:25:44,760 --> 00:25:46,840 Speaker 1: of a wind up, you know, and he and he 427 00:25:46,920 --> 00:25:49,280 Speaker 1: kicked him hard enough to bother him. Like I make 428 00:25:49,320 --> 00:25:52,080 Speaker 1: an Urban Meyer kicking joke on the m MQB podcast 429 00:25:52,200 --> 00:25:55,639 Speaker 1: at least once a week and have for months because 430 00:25:55,680 --> 00:25:59,719 Speaker 1: it's just so unbelievably stunning to me and just shows 431 00:26:00,240 --> 00:26:03,879 Speaker 1: the most insane lack of awareness. Yet another reason to 432 00:26:03,920 --> 00:26:06,639 Speaker 1: listen to the mm QB podcast with Connor Or and 433 00:26:06,680 --> 00:26:09,280 Speaker 1: Gary Grambling. Some more serious stuff here, I mean something 434 00:26:09,359 --> 00:26:11,600 Speaker 1: that's some of the lighter, dumber I can't believe he 435 00:26:11,640 --> 00:26:14,360 Speaker 1: would go that route stuff. Then there's some stuff here 436 00:26:14,440 --> 00:26:17,200 Speaker 1: where you go, Okay, this is beyond the pale, much 437 00:26:17,280 --> 00:26:19,639 Speaker 1: more serious, like when he said the players couldn't make 438 00:26:19,680 --> 00:26:21,919 Speaker 1: fifteen dollars an hour outside of the NFL. That has 439 00:26:22,000 --> 00:26:26,600 Speaker 1: some obvious, really gross, ugly racist undertones. And forget about 440 00:26:26,600 --> 00:26:28,879 Speaker 1: the undertones, there were some overtones where he said that 441 00:26:29,000 --> 00:26:32,080 Speaker 1: John Brown ran a wrong route and practice and he said, hey, Trevor, 442 00:26:32,240 --> 00:26:34,640 Speaker 1: talking about Trevor Lawrence, you've got to slow it down 443 00:26:34,760 --> 00:26:38,280 Speaker 1: for him. These boys from the South, their transcripts ain't right. 444 00:26:38,359 --> 00:26:41,600 Speaker 1: I mean, that's just disgusting commentary from a head coach, 445 00:26:42,320 --> 00:26:46,480 Speaker 1: from anybody. Yeah, And what's really interesting to me is 446 00:26:46,840 --> 00:26:51,880 Speaker 1: this is happening on the heels of the most significant 447 00:26:52,440 --> 00:26:56,879 Speaker 1: social justice movement in sports in a long time, like 448 00:26:57,040 --> 00:26:59,680 Speaker 1: in decades maybe since you know, the raising of the 449 00:26:59,760 --> 00:27:02,639 Speaker 1: fifth in the Olympics, and there were so many coaches 450 00:27:02,640 --> 00:27:05,680 Speaker 1: in the NFL who couldn't care less but got on 451 00:27:05,800 --> 00:27:08,399 Speaker 1: board because they understood what it meant to their players. 452 00:27:08,680 --> 00:27:11,840 Speaker 1: And so for Urban to come from a college environment 453 00:27:11,840 --> 00:27:13,760 Speaker 1: where I felt like that was accepted a lot sooner 454 00:27:13,800 --> 00:27:16,280 Speaker 1: than it was in the NFL, and then to not 455 00:27:16,560 --> 00:27:18,920 Speaker 1: get that a is just the basic human being. You're 456 00:27:18,920 --> 00:27:21,240 Speaker 1: not supposed to talk to people that way, but be 457 00:27:21,840 --> 00:27:24,199 Speaker 1: as a leader of men like you can't understand how 458 00:27:24,240 --> 00:27:26,920 Speaker 1: that's gonna play in the locker room. It's complete ignorance 459 00:27:26,960 --> 00:27:30,639 Speaker 1: in a way that like, it's just surprising, like you 460 00:27:30,800 --> 00:27:33,560 Speaker 1: have that that low of a sense of self awareness. 461 00:27:34,200 --> 00:27:37,359 Speaker 1: Holy indefensible, really gross conduct by him. You had mentioned 462 00:27:37,480 --> 00:27:41,400 Speaker 1: the coaching staff previously. He was not at all easy 463 00:27:41,520 --> 00:27:44,000 Speaker 1: on them, constantly threatened to fire them, belittle the staff 464 00:27:44,040 --> 00:27:46,639 Speaker 1: in front of players, called them losers, and identified himself 465 00:27:46,640 --> 00:27:49,280 Speaker 1: as a winner, which l O L. And demanded that 466 00:27:49,359 --> 00:27:52,720 Speaker 1: they show their resumes and what they've done, which also 467 00:27:53,240 --> 00:27:55,159 Speaker 1: super l O L. I mean, can you imagine me 468 00:27:55,200 --> 00:27:58,440 Speaker 1: in a meeting and he's demanding, like, what have you 469 00:27:58,480 --> 00:28:00,600 Speaker 1: ever done? Show me your resume? You fired me. Guy. 470 00:28:01,560 --> 00:28:04,360 Speaker 1: They were like a decent handful of guys who had 471 00:28:04,480 --> 00:28:07,200 Speaker 1: Super Bowl rings in that room. If I'm not mistaken, 472 00:28:07,240 --> 00:28:09,119 Speaker 1: like I know Darryl Bevil would have had one the 473 00:28:09,520 --> 00:28:12,160 Speaker 1: offensive coordinator. There was a lot of people in there 474 00:28:12,200 --> 00:28:14,080 Speaker 1: that won a lot of games in the NFL, which 475 00:28:14,160 --> 00:28:17,640 Speaker 1: was funny to me. But I think this is where 476 00:28:17,680 --> 00:28:20,200 Speaker 1: it resonates with me. I talked to a lot of coaches, 477 00:28:20,320 --> 00:28:22,920 Speaker 1: especially on the younger end of the spectrum, and I 478 00:28:23,040 --> 00:28:25,880 Speaker 1: hear a lot about what they gave up to get 479 00:28:26,040 --> 00:28:28,960 Speaker 1: to this place. And this is true about players too, 480 00:28:29,040 --> 00:28:32,480 Speaker 1: but coaches generally, are you know my age and beyond 481 00:28:32,640 --> 00:28:36,880 Speaker 1: young families, right, you're moving across the country constantly. One 482 00:28:36,920 --> 00:28:39,000 Speaker 1: coach told me recently, I walked out the door and 483 00:28:39,080 --> 00:28:40,920 Speaker 1: my daughter was three, and I walked back in and 484 00:28:41,000 --> 00:28:44,200 Speaker 1: she was sixteen, you know, And that's my life. And 485 00:28:44,360 --> 00:28:47,160 Speaker 1: so to be able to have that effort that you 486 00:28:47,280 --> 00:28:51,240 Speaker 1: put into something so brazenly insulted, like that's the part 487 00:28:51,280 --> 00:28:53,920 Speaker 1: of it. Like we'll say this word over and over again, right, 488 00:28:53,960 --> 00:28:57,160 Speaker 1: it's awareness. It's awareness. It's thinking of, wow, how is 489 00:28:57,200 --> 00:28:58,880 Speaker 1: that going to come off? If I say to somebody 490 00:28:58,920 --> 00:29:01,360 Speaker 1: who literally gave their life and all the good things 491 00:29:01,440 --> 00:29:04,320 Speaker 1: in it to this sport to insult them that way. 492 00:29:04,360 --> 00:29:07,240 Speaker 1: It's crazy. I'm glad that you mentioned and use the 493 00:29:07,280 --> 00:29:10,160 Speaker 1: word awareness, because clearly he didn't have much of it. 494 00:29:10,360 --> 00:29:12,040 Speaker 1: He didn't seem to know the NFL system of the 495 00:29:12,080 --> 00:29:14,000 Speaker 1: big players are. At one point he didn't know Aaron 496 00:29:14,120 --> 00:29:17,120 Speaker 1: Donald's name, which was kind of wild. And then awareness 497 00:29:17,280 --> 00:29:19,440 Speaker 1: off the field as well. He was caught on camera 498 00:29:19,520 --> 00:29:22,240 Speaker 1: grinding with a young woman at a bar, and shortly 499 00:29:22,280 --> 00:29:24,720 Speaker 1: after there were photos of his wife at home with 500 00:29:24,800 --> 00:29:27,280 Speaker 1: the children at the same time. So I guess you 501 00:29:27,360 --> 00:29:30,160 Speaker 1: take all of this together, right, and my question is 502 00:29:30,200 --> 00:29:33,160 Speaker 1: how did it even last as long as he did? Yeah, 503 00:29:33,360 --> 00:29:37,680 Speaker 1: that again is like Shad wants to believe in people. 504 00:29:37,960 --> 00:29:40,840 Speaker 1: He is one of those owners that like, really, you know, 505 00:29:41,080 --> 00:29:43,000 Speaker 1: when you tell me you're going to do something that 506 00:29:43,160 --> 00:29:46,880 Speaker 1: represents like a personal thing between us, and I think 507 00:29:47,040 --> 00:29:50,120 Speaker 1: Urban is really good at the setup, right, He's good 508 00:29:50,120 --> 00:29:52,280 Speaker 1: at the meeting, the initial meeting, saying I'm gonna do 509 00:29:52,360 --> 00:29:54,480 Speaker 1: all this stuff and we're going to change the way 510 00:29:54,560 --> 00:29:56,720 Speaker 1: we think about everything and act and do and blah 511 00:29:56,720 --> 00:29:59,480 Speaker 1: blah blah blah blah. And we can all say this 512 00:29:59,560 --> 00:30:02,520 Speaker 1: in twenty twenty. Hindsight, I don't know what it would 513 00:30:02,520 --> 00:30:04,480 Speaker 1: have been like in a hiring position to sit there 514 00:30:04,560 --> 00:30:07,240 Speaker 1: and be like, huh. Obviously he had that background at 515 00:30:07,280 --> 00:30:09,640 Speaker 1: Ohio State that would have raised red flags for all 516 00:30:09,720 --> 00:30:11,320 Speaker 1: of us. I mean some of the stuff that he did, 517 00:30:11,400 --> 00:30:13,600 Speaker 1: holding onto the coaches that he held onto and everything. 518 00:30:13,720 --> 00:30:18,320 Speaker 1: But when you're an owner that's so desperate to get 519 00:30:18,520 --> 00:30:21,800 Speaker 1: somewhere other than where you are, you're in a vulnerable position. 520 00:30:21,840 --> 00:30:24,080 Speaker 1: And I think he's kind of good at capitalizing on that. 521 00:30:25,080 --> 00:30:29,480 Speaker 1: With Fox Sports deciding to flirt with him again, all 522 00:30:29,520 --> 00:30:31,880 Speaker 1: of this stuff from his past is being brought up, right, 523 00:30:31,960 --> 00:30:34,600 Speaker 1: We're talking about it. People are mentioning what happened at 524 00:30:34,640 --> 00:30:37,000 Speaker 1: Ohio State. People are running through all the things that 525 00:30:37,120 --> 00:30:41,560 Speaker 1: went wrong in Jacksonville. Your former NFL Network colleague Rich 526 00:30:41,640 --> 00:30:44,440 Speaker 1: Eisen is having an absolute field day with this dunking 527 00:30:44,560 --> 00:30:51,960 Speaker 1: on urban Meyer. The idea of urban Meyer being, as 528 00:30:52,040 --> 00:30:58,640 Speaker 1: I said here, the biggest coaching flop in the history 529 00:30:58,720 --> 00:31:01,360 Speaker 1: of the NFL. And there's been a lot of them. 530 00:31:01,480 --> 00:31:04,400 Speaker 1: There's been a lot of them. But to find out 531 00:31:04,800 --> 00:31:08,000 Speaker 1: that just how bad we thought it was wasn't as 532 00:31:08,040 --> 00:31:12,760 Speaker 1: bad as it really was is beyond the pail, but 533 00:31:12,920 --> 00:31:17,560 Speaker 1: maybe not shocking, just real quick Doug Peterson. Things that 534 00:31:17,640 --> 00:31:20,680 Speaker 1: he will not do is threatened to fire his coaches 535 00:31:20,720 --> 00:31:25,480 Speaker 1: after calling them losers. We knew about that already. He 536 00:31:25,600 --> 00:31:30,200 Speaker 1: will not make a player cry because he has so critical. 537 00:31:30,280 --> 00:31:32,440 Speaker 1: If I'm Sean con I see this article, I'm thinking 538 00:31:32,480 --> 00:31:38,040 Speaker 1: of suing. What a fraud. My question is should he 539 00:31:38,200 --> 00:31:40,200 Speaker 1: be back? I mean, should he be on Fox Sports? 540 00:31:40,280 --> 00:31:42,560 Speaker 1: Or should he just like go off into the wilderness 541 00:31:42,600 --> 00:31:44,960 Speaker 1: never to be heard from again. I mean, if there's 542 00:31:44,960 --> 00:31:51,040 Speaker 1: any network that would know I'm just kidding, but you know, no, 543 00:31:51,520 --> 00:31:55,440 Speaker 1: I obviously right, you know, but I would wonder from 544 00:31:55,520 --> 00:31:59,160 Speaker 1: a strategic standpoint, if you're Fox, one of two things. 545 00:31:59,560 --> 00:32:01,880 Speaker 1: Do you think that anything he's going to say is 546 00:32:01,960 --> 00:32:05,280 Speaker 1: going to be taken seriously? Right? Because I think every 547 00:32:05,320 --> 00:32:07,160 Speaker 1: Saturday what he'll do is he'll be like, oh, well, 548 00:32:07,160 --> 00:32:08,920 Speaker 1: what the coach should have done is this, and we're 549 00:32:08,960 --> 00:32:11,680 Speaker 1: going to be able to almost you know, not to 550 00:32:11,800 --> 00:32:15,440 Speaker 1: draw the comparison, but like our former president, you know, 551 00:32:15,600 --> 00:32:17,840 Speaker 1: there was always an example of him doing the exact 552 00:32:17,920 --> 00:32:19,800 Speaker 1: opposite of that, like we need to do this, and 553 00:32:19,880 --> 00:32:21,920 Speaker 1: he would do that, and someone would pull up the tweet, 554 00:32:22,040 --> 00:32:23,960 Speaker 1: you know, and with Urban Meyer, it's like, Oh, the 555 00:32:24,040 --> 00:32:25,880 Speaker 1: coach has got to have integrity. And then someone would 556 00:32:25,880 --> 00:32:28,720 Speaker 1: be like, well, you know, there's there's so many things 557 00:32:28,800 --> 00:32:30,800 Speaker 1: that he won't be able to say on the air. 558 00:32:31,040 --> 00:32:33,360 Speaker 1: But I also wonder, do you not care? And is 559 00:32:33,400 --> 00:32:35,240 Speaker 1: that part of the draw that you know that people 560 00:32:35,280 --> 00:32:37,000 Speaker 1: are going to watch just to see what he does. 561 00:32:37,160 --> 00:32:40,080 Speaker 1: I don't know. I'm not in high ranking TV meetings, 562 00:32:40,120 --> 00:32:41,640 Speaker 1: so I don't know how any of that stuff works. 563 00:32:41,680 --> 00:32:45,320 Speaker 1: But no, if I were an executive, I would not. However, 564 00:32:45,720 --> 00:32:49,920 Speaker 1: as a content consumer and a content producer. Great for us. 565 00:32:50,000 --> 00:32:52,480 Speaker 1: Can't wait to watch that train wreck. And also for 566 00:32:52,560 --> 00:32:55,000 Speaker 1: the Jaguars, congratulations to them being in a better spot. 567 00:32:55,000 --> 00:32:57,320 Speaker 1: They have Doug Peterson. Now go Birds. So it worked 568 00:32:57,360 --> 00:33:00,440 Speaker 1: out just fine. Read him on SI dot com, listened 569 00:33:00,440 --> 00:33:03,040 Speaker 1: to him on the mm QB podcast. He would never 570 00:33:03,160 --> 00:33:06,800 Speaker 1: kick a kicker, Connor or thanks for us, Thank you. 571 00:33:09,960 --> 00:33:12,800 Speaker 1: After a break, we discussed the Young Human highlight reel, 572 00:33:12,920 --> 00:33:23,560 Speaker 1: John Morant and his rise to superstar. Michael Peena, Welcome 573 00:33:23,600 --> 00:33:26,080 Speaker 1: to Sports Illustrated Weekly. Finally, this is one of the 574 00:33:26,120 --> 00:33:28,320 Speaker 1: greatest days of my life. John, Thank you so much 575 00:33:28,360 --> 00:33:30,360 Speaker 1: for having me. We have you on to talk about 576 00:33:30,440 --> 00:33:32,800 Speaker 1: John Morant making the leap to superstardom, and I still 577 00:33:32,840 --> 00:33:35,200 Speaker 1: want to have that conversation. But you and I offline 578 00:33:35,280 --> 00:33:38,240 Speaker 1: have talked about how jobs like never afraid of the moment, 579 00:33:38,760 --> 00:33:40,560 Speaker 1: but there was one moment from late in game three 580 00:33:40,600 --> 00:33:44,560 Speaker 1: that he'd probably liked to forget John Morant, it was 581 00:33:44,680 --> 00:33:47,600 Speaker 1: right de bott would have happened right here on this play. 582 00:33:47,840 --> 00:33:52,640 Speaker 1: You see George poll go grabbit grabbed the met After 583 00:33:52,760 --> 00:33:55,200 Speaker 1: that game he was injured, and John tweeted about the 584 00:33:55,280 --> 00:33:58,000 Speaker 1: code and then deleted it, and grizz head coach Taylor 585 00:33:58,080 --> 00:34:00,200 Speaker 1: Jenkins mentioned the code, and Jared Jackson, you and you 586 00:34:00,320 --> 00:34:01,920 Speaker 1: mentioned the code, and there's a lot of talk about 587 00:34:01,960 --> 00:34:04,480 Speaker 1: the code. So explain to everybody what happened with the 588 00:34:04,520 --> 00:34:09,000 Speaker 1: code is So the code is something that Golden State 589 00:34:09,040 --> 00:34:13,920 Speaker 1: Warriors head coach Steve Kerr referenced after Game two when 590 00:34:14,040 --> 00:34:18,640 Speaker 1: Dylan Brooks swung his arm and connected with Gary Payton. 591 00:34:18,719 --> 00:34:25,200 Speaker 1: The seconds head right down a little foul hard Payton's paid. 592 00:34:26,239 --> 00:34:28,239 Speaker 1: Gary Payton the second was in mid air, he came 593 00:34:28,280 --> 00:34:30,960 Speaker 1: crashing to the ground. He fractured his elbow. He is 594 00:34:31,040 --> 00:34:33,560 Speaker 1: out for a few weeks at least, he's definitely out 595 00:34:33,600 --> 00:34:36,680 Speaker 1: for the rest of this series, and a lot of 596 00:34:36,800 --> 00:34:39,680 Speaker 1: players on Golden State side thought that that was a 597 00:34:39,800 --> 00:34:43,279 Speaker 1: dirty play. Steve Kerr called it dirty. I don't know 598 00:34:43,280 --> 00:34:47,120 Speaker 1: if it was intentional, but it was dirty. Playoff basketball 599 00:34:47,200 --> 00:34:49,920 Speaker 1: is gonna it's supposed to be physical, but there's a 600 00:34:50,040 --> 00:34:55,320 Speaker 1: code in this league. You never put a guy's season 601 00:34:55,560 --> 00:34:59,160 Speaker 1: slash career in jeopardy. He broke the code. Dylan Brooks 602 00:34:59,239 --> 00:35:04,560 Speaker 1: broke the code the Memphis Grizzlies, and Dylan Brooks responded 603 00:35:05,160 --> 00:35:09,120 Speaker 1: by essentially saying that it's the playoffs. Things happen when 604 00:35:09,160 --> 00:35:12,600 Speaker 1: you are going one hundred miles an hour and that 605 00:35:12,800 --> 00:35:16,239 Speaker 1: nothing was intentional. John Morant at the end of Game three. 606 00:35:16,560 --> 00:35:18,840 Speaker 1: Ran has been dealing with right knee sore nous for 607 00:35:19,560 --> 00:35:22,160 Speaker 1: the entirety of the postseason. He missed a couple of 608 00:35:22,200 --> 00:35:24,560 Speaker 1: weeks of action at the end of the regular season 609 00:35:24,760 --> 00:35:28,040 Speaker 1: with knee soreness, and there was one play at the 610 00:35:28,440 --> 00:35:33,320 Speaker 1: end of Game three when Golden State Warriors guard Jordan's 611 00:35:33,320 --> 00:35:36,239 Speaker 1: pool Uh looked like he was reaching for the ball 612 00:35:36,960 --> 00:35:42,840 Speaker 1: and he inadvertently grabbed Jaw's knee and tweaked it a 613 00:35:42,920 --> 00:35:46,359 Speaker 1: little bit. And after the game, as you said. John 614 00:35:46,400 --> 00:35:50,760 Speaker 1: tweeted a clip of the play and referenced Steve Kerr's 615 00:35:51,040 --> 00:35:54,360 Speaker 1: talk about the code. The way that I perceived this 616 00:35:54,640 --> 00:35:58,000 Speaker 1: was the Memphis Grizzlies are a team that you know, 617 00:35:58,040 --> 00:36:00,160 Speaker 1: they stand up for one another, and so this is 618 00:36:00,680 --> 00:36:03,480 Speaker 1: less Jaws way of calling out Jordan Pool. I don't 619 00:36:03,520 --> 00:36:05,359 Speaker 1: think that was his intention to say that Jordan Pool 620 00:36:05,400 --> 00:36:08,719 Speaker 1: is dirty, but more to say, hey, this is the playoffs. 621 00:36:08,800 --> 00:36:11,400 Speaker 1: Things happen, and it wasn't cool that you said what 622 00:36:11,520 --> 00:36:14,800 Speaker 1: you said about my teammate, my brother Dylan Brooks. So 623 00:36:14,920 --> 00:36:17,520 Speaker 1: that was how I saw that. Yeah, a whole lot 624 00:36:17,640 --> 00:36:20,800 Speaker 1: of conversation about dirty plays and the code going on 625 00:36:21,000 --> 00:36:24,919 Speaker 1: right now, including in our colleague Chris Herring's newsletter about 626 00:36:24,920 --> 00:36:28,600 Speaker 1: the NBA, which I highly recommend everybody subscribe to. This instance, 627 00:36:28,680 --> 00:36:32,640 Speaker 1: an application of the code feels off because when I 628 00:36:32,760 --> 00:36:35,479 Speaker 1: watched that play, especially in real time, it didn't feel 629 00:36:35,520 --> 00:36:37,680 Speaker 1: like a dirty play to me from Jordan Pool. It 630 00:36:37,760 --> 00:36:39,480 Speaker 1: felt like he was going for the ball, kind of 631 00:36:39,560 --> 00:36:41,000 Speaker 1: hit his name. We don't even know if that's the 632 00:36:41,080 --> 00:36:43,520 Speaker 1: moment when Jah hurt his name, So it felt like 633 00:36:43,960 --> 00:36:47,120 Speaker 1: they were crying a little bit too much. Wolf On 634 00:36:47,200 --> 00:36:49,399 Speaker 1: this particular plot, I think, if you were to give 635 00:36:49,960 --> 00:36:53,239 Speaker 1: truth serum, I don't think any of them actually are 636 00:36:53,320 --> 00:36:56,359 Speaker 1: casting malicious dispersions on Jordan Pool, on the Golden State 637 00:36:56,400 --> 00:36:59,799 Speaker 1: Warriors for retaliation or anything like that. I honestly think 638 00:36:59,840 --> 00:37:03,319 Speaker 1: that they took offense to the way Steve Kerr characterized 639 00:37:03,400 --> 00:37:06,359 Speaker 1: the play with Dylan Brooks taking somebody out in mid 640 00:37:06,400 --> 00:37:09,600 Speaker 1: air and clubbing him across the head. It was a 641 00:37:09,680 --> 00:37:14,040 Speaker 1: dangerous play objectively, there's a lot of physicality. Um, things 642 00:37:14,120 --> 00:37:17,719 Speaker 1: happen at extremely fast speeds. I hope that everyone can 643 00:37:17,760 --> 00:37:20,120 Speaker 1: move on from the dirty playtok because it's not cool, 644 00:37:20,560 --> 00:37:22,799 Speaker 1: all right. So as we record this prior to Game five, 645 00:37:22,840 --> 00:37:24,960 Speaker 1: we don't know if Job will be available even if 646 00:37:25,000 --> 00:37:27,719 Speaker 1: he does come back, though, Mike, the Grizzlies are down 647 00:37:27,800 --> 00:37:30,960 Speaker 1: three one. Do you give Memphis any chance even with Jah, 648 00:37:32,760 --> 00:37:38,160 Speaker 1: you know, down three one against Steph Curry, against Draymond Green, 649 00:37:38,239 --> 00:37:41,120 Speaker 1: against the closest thing that we had to a dynasty 650 00:37:41,320 --> 00:37:44,759 Speaker 1: in recent NBA history, That's gonna be pretty difficult. When 651 00:37:44,920 --> 00:37:47,960 Speaker 1: three games in a row that technically has been done 652 00:37:48,000 --> 00:37:51,400 Speaker 1: before by someone named Lebron James. So it's it is possible, 653 00:37:52,160 --> 00:37:54,600 Speaker 1: and the Memphis resually is only lost by three points 654 00:37:54,680 --> 00:37:58,880 Speaker 1: in San Francisco Monday Night, are rally by the Warriors 655 00:37:59,760 --> 00:38:02,439 Speaker 1: here in came four royal of course, successful three point 656 00:38:02,480 --> 00:38:07,080 Speaker 1: field goals. They take a three one series lead and 657 00:38:07,200 --> 00:38:11,480 Speaker 1: on the precipice of it, fancy to the Western Conference Finals. 658 00:38:12,719 --> 00:38:15,959 Speaker 1: You add John Moran to the mix. I'm not gonna 659 00:38:16,080 --> 00:38:18,520 Speaker 1: bet my life on a Memphis Grizzlies come back, but 660 00:38:18,600 --> 00:38:23,560 Speaker 1: I will say that this team is super unique, super athletic, 661 00:38:24,120 --> 00:38:26,319 Speaker 1: believes in itself in a way that not every team 662 00:38:26,360 --> 00:38:29,080 Speaker 1: down three one would. I will not say that the 663 00:38:29,200 --> 00:38:32,800 Speaker 1: series is a dent over. And John Moran is a 664 00:38:32,880 --> 00:38:35,600 Speaker 1: very special talent. He has a self awareness that he 665 00:38:35,719 --> 00:38:40,799 Speaker 1: mixes with a confidence that borders on cocky and could 666 00:38:40,840 --> 00:38:44,120 Speaker 1: be described as brash. But he just believes he's always 667 00:38:44,160 --> 00:38:48,320 Speaker 1: the best player on the floor. And if any superstar 668 00:38:48,400 --> 00:38:50,279 Speaker 1: in the league could lead their team back right now 669 00:38:50,400 --> 00:38:52,640 Speaker 1: from a deficit like that, I think he's He's up 670 00:38:52,640 --> 00:38:55,600 Speaker 1: there in that conversation. Yeah, whether or not the Grizzlies 671 00:38:55,600 --> 00:38:57,839 Speaker 1: can actually claw their way back into the series, I'm 672 00:38:57,880 --> 00:38:59,799 Speaker 1: with you. John is a special player, and we all 673 00:39:00,160 --> 00:39:02,359 Speaker 1: that he's okay because we want to see him back 674 00:39:02,400 --> 00:39:04,520 Speaker 1: on the floor again because he's been such a delight 675 00:39:04,640 --> 00:39:10,320 Speaker 1: to watch. Absolutely so, how would you describe John Morant's 676 00:39:10,320 --> 00:39:17,000 Speaker 1: style of play. It is captivating. Moran flows by prevote attack. 677 00:39:20,719 --> 00:39:26,799 Speaker 1: It is compelling. Avery Bradley with the deflection against an 678 00:39:26,840 --> 00:39:31,759 Speaker 1: incredible block blocks it with two hands. It is must 679 00:39:31,800 --> 00:39:43,600 Speaker 1: see television. Adams going along. He has incredible bounds. He 680 00:39:43,960 --> 00:39:46,479 Speaker 1: just had one of the greatest junks of his entire 681 00:39:46,640 --> 00:39:50,080 Speaker 1: career in Game five of the first round over poor 682 00:39:50,239 --> 00:39:53,200 Speaker 1: Malik Beasley. Winter take a three two lead and his 683 00:39:53,280 --> 00:40:00,279 Speaker 1: opening round series Morant hot job breaker. He's a joy. 684 00:40:00,400 --> 00:40:06,439 Speaker 1: He's a pure joy to watch play basketball. The leap 685 00:40:06,560 --> 00:40:09,239 Speaker 1: that he's taken from last season to this season was 686 00:40:09,360 --> 00:40:11,840 Speaker 1: just so massive because he was good, but he was 687 00:40:11,920 --> 00:40:14,800 Speaker 1: also sort of inefficient, right, And this year he's taking 688 00:40:14,880 --> 00:40:17,320 Speaker 1: that leap from not just being good too great, but 689 00:40:17,480 --> 00:40:19,680 Speaker 1: being one of the best players in the entire league, 690 00:40:19,680 --> 00:40:22,280 Speaker 1: and we're seeing him do it on this national stage. 691 00:40:22,560 --> 00:40:26,640 Speaker 1: That's a famed saying the third year leap, that's when 692 00:40:26,800 --> 00:40:31,000 Speaker 1: super duper stars really go from Okay, we're pretty good 693 00:40:31,040 --> 00:40:34,440 Speaker 1: in our first two years too, Okay, now you have 694 00:40:34,560 --> 00:40:38,520 Speaker 1: to reckon with us in games that actually matter. But 695 00:40:39,120 --> 00:40:43,440 Speaker 1: for him to increase his scoring from nineteen to twenty 696 00:40:43,560 --> 00:40:46,480 Speaker 1: seven and a half points per game, to up his efficiency, 697 00:40:46,719 --> 00:40:51,080 Speaker 1: to see his usage just absolutely skyrocket that stuff that 698 00:40:51,200 --> 00:40:56,320 Speaker 1: you don't see, and the pieces around him are basically 699 00:40:56,880 --> 00:41:00,760 Speaker 1: the exact same. But the real improvement is in the paint, 700 00:41:01,000 --> 00:41:04,520 Speaker 1: where he led all players in the whole league in 701 00:41:04,640 --> 00:41:08,640 Speaker 1: points in the paint. He's acrobatic in mid air. He 702 00:41:08,840 --> 00:41:11,000 Speaker 1: stays in the air as hang time is longer than 703 00:41:11,080 --> 00:41:14,359 Speaker 1: basically everybody else's, so everybody hits the ground, he's still 704 00:41:14,960 --> 00:41:17,320 Speaker 1: in the air and is able to finish over you. 705 00:41:17,719 --> 00:41:20,960 Speaker 1: He's incredible. A rand against Westbrook Priest to take him 706 00:41:20,960 --> 00:41:27,440 Speaker 1: off the beast strands, he schools follows even better to 707 00:41:27,520 --> 00:41:31,080 Speaker 1: send you know, all those yellow goat whatever called the 708 00:41:31,239 --> 00:41:33,880 Speaker 1: jerney do you want to call home side? You can 709 00:41:33,960 --> 00:41:41,360 Speaker 1: take that back there. He wins the Most Improved Player award. 710 00:41:42,320 --> 00:41:45,000 Speaker 1: Mike I didn't have a vote for this. We did 711 00:41:45,080 --> 00:41:48,400 Speaker 1: it for s I. I voted for Jo as the 712 00:41:48,440 --> 00:41:51,360 Speaker 1: most improved player, as did everybody else, because he deserved it. 713 00:41:51,520 --> 00:41:54,839 Speaker 1: And yet it doesn't really feel like that award does 714 00:41:54,880 --> 00:41:58,680 Speaker 1: it justice, right. It almost feels insufficient when you're in 715 00:41:59,000 --> 00:42:03,240 Speaker 1: m v P, Converse stations, and Lebron James called everyone 716 00:42:03,360 --> 00:42:06,360 Speaker 1: who voted for him for Most Improved Player a dweep, 717 00:42:07,080 --> 00:42:10,480 Speaker 1: which is very kind of him. But yeah, it's like, 718 00:42:10,600 --> 00:42:13,000 Speaker 1: I don't wanna pooh pooh most Improved Player. It's an 719 00:42:13,040 --> 00:42:18,160 Speaker 1: important award, but when you go from star to top 720 00:42:18,280 --> 00:42:22,280 Speaker 1: ten player, usually those players don't win Most Improved Player. 721 00:42:22,520 --> 00:42:26,440 Speaker 1: He had the profile of a most valuable player, so 722 00:42:26,520 --> 00:42:28,600 Speaker 1: when you have that in you win Most Improved Player, 723 00:42:28,640 --> 00:42:31,320 Speaker 1: it seems like a step down. Give him all the awards. 724 00:42:31,600 --> 00:42:34,160 Speaker 1: He's gonna win all the awards before his career is over, 725 00:42:34,239 --> 00:42:38,759 Speaker 1: that's for sure. Give him all the awards. He deserved it, 726 00:42:38,880 --> 00:42:42,360 Speaker 1: And yet he didn't quite seem like he wanted to 727 00:42:42,400 --> 00:42:46,120 Speaker 1: tell people what John did with his actual Most Improved 728 00:42:46,160 --> 00:42:49,359 Speaker 1: Player award, and it kind of dovetails nicely with another 729 00:42:49,400 --> 00:42:53,200 Speaker 1: guy you just wrote about. Right, So John spent the 730 00:42:53,239 --> 00:42:57,040 Speaker 1: whole season lobbying for Desmond Bain to win Most Improved Player, 731 00:42:57,160 --> 00:43:00,279 Speaker 1: never talking about himself in any type of conversation like that. 732 00:43:00,520 --> 00:43:02,880 Speaker 1: So when he actually wins the award. When Ja won 733 00:43:02,960 --> 00:43:05,160 Speaker 1: the award, he took the trophy and drove it to 734 00:43:05,719 --> 00:43:08,360 Speaker 1: Desmond Bain's house and left it in his kitchen on 735 00:43:08,440 --> 00:43:11,640 Speaker 1: his counter for him. So the actual trophy is in 736 00:43:11,800 --> 00:43:14,920 Speaker 1: Desmond Bain's possession right now, which is I don't think 737 00:43:15,000 --> 00:43:18,680 Speaker 1: that's ever happened before. I think it's a very cool story. 738 00:43:18,800 --> 00:43:21,040 Speaker 1: I wonder if he had a key, but still want 739 00:43:21,040 --> 00:43:23,520 Speaker 1: to mention he joined Lebron and Kobe is the only 740 00:43:23,560 --> 00:43:26,320 Speaker 1: players to score forty five points or more in multiple 741 00:43:26,400 --> 00:43:30,440 Speaker 1: playoff games before turning twenty three, which is so mind blowing. Right, 742 00:43:30,560 --> 00:43:33,680 Speaker 1: his future is incredibly bright. Everybody is raving about him, 743 00:43:33,719 --> 00:43:36,319 Speaker 1: including Chris Paul, who you spoke to. What did Chris 744 00:43:36,400 --> 00:43:37,960 Speaker 1: Paul have to say? I mean, Chris Paul right now 745 00:43:38,400 --> 00:43:42,680 Speaker 1: is himself having an unbelievable playoff run. What did you 746 00:43:42,760 --> 00:43:45,840 Speaker 1: have to say about John? Yeah? Jummer and actually attended 747 00:43:46,760 --> 00:43:49,719 Speaker 1: one of Chris Paul's camps, King Tom Camp when he 748 00:43:49,920 --> 00:43:52,319 Speaker 1: he was in college, and I remember seeing him when 749 00:43:52,360 --> 00:43:55,840 Speaker 1: he came down in North Carolina. Uh, he was. He 750 00:43:56,000 --> 00:43:58,719 Speaker 1: was explosive doing right. I gotter hoop in one day. 751 00:43:58,760 --> 00:44:01,239 Speaker 1: All of them was just dunking, don't con duncan. And 752 00:44:01,320 --> 00:44:03,920 Speaker 1: so when you've got that ability that he had, but 753 00:44:04,080 --> 00:44:06,800 Speaker 1: then you got the dogs too, right, you got the hunger. 754 00:44:07,040 --> 00:44:09,359 Speaker 1: You got that grid when you can hope and play 755 00:44:09,800 --> 00:44:12,040 Speaker 1: and still feel like you're in the backyard, but you're 756 00:44:12,080 --> 00:44:14,479 Speaker 1: in the NBA. You know, this guy is always in limit. 757 00:44:14,840 --> 00:44:17,680 Speaker 1: He's just loose. You see him dancing on the court. 758 00:44:18,080 --> 00:44:20,520 Speaker 1: He's playing like no one's watching. He's playing like he's 759 00:44:20,520 --> 00:44:23,880 Speaker 1: in the backyard still. And when you can do that 760 00:44:23,960 --> 00:44:26,080 Speaker 1: and you have the talent that John has, when you're 761 00:44:26,080 --> 00:44:29,640 Speaker 1: not afraid of the moment, you're a scary force in 762 00:44:29,840 --> 00:44:35,720 Speaker 1: in professional basketball. Are we looking at one day saying 763 00:44:35,800 --> 00:44:39,080 Speaker 1: John Morants the best player in the league. I think 764 00:44:39,160 --> 00:44:44,800 Speaker 1: that that is possible. Absolutely. I think that even more likely, 765 00:44:45,760 --> 00:44:50,440 Speaker 1: which is just as impressive, is we will probably look 766 00:44:50,520 --> 00:44:52,879 Speaker 1: at it. There will be a day in the near 767 00:44:53,000 --> 00:44:55,600 Speaker 1: future where he is also the face of the NBA. 768 00:44:55,880 --> 00:44:58,840 Speaker 1: He is the most popular player in the NBA that 769 00:44:58,960 --> 00:45:02,840 Speaker 1: has been Lebron Jame for well over a decade, and 770 00:45:02,920 --> 00:45:04,719 Speaker 1: there's going to be a vacuum that needs to be 771 00:45:04,800 --> 00:45:08,240 Speaker 1: filled pretty soon. And if I had to pick someone, 772 00:45:08,600 --> 00:45:12,360 Speaker 1: I'd probably picked Jaw as that guy to fill it 773 00:45:12,600 --> 00:45:17,160 Speaker 1: because he transcends the casual fan. You don't have to 774 00:45:17,200 --> 00:45:19,880 Speaker 1: know anything about basketball to sit down watch the Memphis 775 00:45:19,920 --> 00:45:24,640 Speaker 1: Grizzlies and be completely enthralled, completely entertained, transfixed by what 776 00:45:24,760 --> 00:45:27,120 Speaker 1: this person is doing with his body on a basketball court. 777 00:45:27,680 --> 00:45:31,320 Speaker 1: So when he gets to his prime, he might already 778 00:45:31,360 --> 00:45:35,120 Speaker 1: have a championship by then, when he's twenty years old. 779 00:45:35,680 --> 00:45:38,200 Speaker 1: I don't know if there will be a more popular 780 00:45:38,320 --> 00:45:42,160 Speaker 1: player in basketball, and there might not be a better one. 781 00:45:42,320 --> 00:45:44,520 Speaker 1: To your point, I can't wait to see what that 782 00:45:44,640 --> 00:45:48,680 Speaker 1: looks like. It's already incredibly fun and, as you mentioned, transfixing. 783 00:45:48,760 --> 00:45:51,359 Speaker 1: Read his excellent story on jaw on SI dot com, 784 00:45:51,440 --> 00:45:53,200 Speaker 1: which we will link to in our show notes. Listen 785 00:45:53,239 --> 00:45:56,080 Speaker 1: to him on open Floor. He's the writer equivalent of 786 00:45:56,120 --> 00:45:59,080 Speaker 1: a John Morant poster. Doncan, Mike Peena, thanks for us, 787 00:45:59,680 --> 00:46:07,960 Speaker 1: Thank you guns. Sports Illustrated Weekly is a production of 788 00:46:08,040 --> 00:46:11,279 Speaker 1: Sports Illustrated and I Heart Radio. For more podcasts from 789 00:46:11,320 --> 00:46:14,640 Speaker 1: I Heart Radio, visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, 790 00:46:14,840 --> 00:46:17,719 Speaker 1: or wherever you get your favorite shows. And for more 791 00:46:17,760 --> 00:46:20,879 Speaker 1: of Sports Illustrated, its best stories and podcasts, visit SI 792 00:46:21,000 --> 00:46:24,440 Speaker 1: dot com. This episode of Sports Illustrated Weekly was produced 793 00:46:24,440 --> 00:46:27,800 Speaker 1: by Cooper McKim, Jessica Armoski, and Isaac Lee, who is 794 00:46:27,880 --> 00:46:31,800 Speaker 1: also our sound engineer. Our Senior producer is Dan Bloom. 795 00:46:32,239 --> 00:46:35,719 Speaker 1: Our executive producers are Scott Brody and me John Gonzalez. 796 00:46:36,040 --> 00:46:39,080 Speaker 1: Our theme song is by Nolan Schneider. Thanks for listening 797 00:46:39,280 --> 00:46:41,360 Speaker 1: and if you stuck around this long, we leave you 798 00:46:41,440 --> 00:46:44,400 Speaker 1: with this. Do you want me to say Soko by 799 00:46:44,400 --> 00:46:46,080 Speaker 1: the way, Is that going to piss people off? Because 800 00:46:46,080 --> 00:46:48,760 Speaker 1: this is American? No okay,