1
00:00:02,520 --> 00:00:07,000
Speaker 1: Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news.

2
00:00:10,000 --> 00:00:12,560
Speaker 2: This is the Blueberg Day ba Q podcast. Good morning,

3
00:00:12,600 --> 00:00:15,240
Speaker 2: It's Friday, the ninth of January. I'm Caroline Hepkat in

4
00:00:15,280 --> 00:00:16,200
Speaker 2: London and.

5
00:00:16,120 --> 00:00:19,599
Speaker 3: I'm Stephen Caroline Brussels. Coming up today, the US Supreme

6
00:00:19,640 --> 00:00:22,480
Speaker 3: Court could decide as soon as today if Trump's sweeping

7
00:00:22,560 --> 00:00:24,320
Speaker 3: global tariffs are illegal.

8
00:00:25,000 --> 00:00:29,920
Speaker 2: Iran cntsaw phone and internet access as demonstrations across the

9
00:00:30,000 --> 00:00:30,800
Speaker 2: country grow.

10
00:00:31,480 --> 00:00:35,519
Speaker 3: Plus why starting a blog is the new Silicon Valley trend.

11
00:00:35,960 --> 00:00:38,040
Speaker 2: Let's start with the roundup of our top stories.

12
00:00:38,479 --> 00:00:40,920
Speaker 3: The US Supreme Court could rule as soon as today

13
00:00:40,960 --> 00:00:44,279
Speaker 3: on the legality of President Trump's sweeping tariffs rolled out

14
00:00:44,280 --> 00:00:47,400
Speaker 3: in April of last year. America's top court has scheduled

15
00:00:47,400 --> 00:00:50,080
Speaker 3: this Friday as an opinion day when it issues decisions,

16
00:00:50,080 --> 00:00:53,360
Speaker 3: and cases already argued. A ruling against Trump would leave

17
00:00:53,400 --> 00:00:55,880
Speaker 3: the US government on the hook for tens of billions

18
00:00:55,920 --> 00:00:58,800
Speaker 3: of dollars in tariff free funds. The levies and question

19
00:00:58,880 --> 00:01:01,280
Speaker 3: of so far generation had roughly one hundred and fifty

20
00:01:01,320 --> 00:01:04,919
Speaker 3: billion dollars for the US Treasury. Zoe Tillman is Bloomberg's

21
00:01:05,000 --> 00:01:06,720
Speaker 3: senior legal reporter in Washington.

22
00:01:07,240 --> 00:01:10,440
Speaker 1: Back in April, there were a handful of lawsuits filed

23
00:01:10,520 --> 00:01:13,840
Speaker 1: saying that the President simply doesn't have the authority to

24
00:01:13,959 --> 00:01:18,520
Speaker 1: rely on a nineteen seventy seven Emergency Powers law to

25
00:01:18,720 --> 00:01:22,560
Speaker 1: order these kinds of tariffs, and lower courts repeatedly agreed

26
00:01:22,600 --> 00:01:25,280
Speaker 1: with the challengers said he doesn't have authority to do this.

27
00:01:25,920 --> 00:01:28,520
Speaker 1: The case made its way to the Supreme Court, and

28
00:01:28,560 --> 00:01:31,600
Speaker 1: in the weeks after the court heard arguments on November fifth,

29
00:01:32,040 --> 00:01:35,560
Speaker 1: we've seen this onslaught of activity in court as companies

30
00:01:35,640 --> 00:01:38,880
Speaker 1: have come in with their own lawsuits saying we agree,

31
00:01:39,080 --> 00:01:41,720
Speaker 1: we don't think it's lawful, and if the Supreme Court

32
00:01:41,720 --> 00:01:44,000
Speaker 1: strikes this down, we want our money back.

33
00:01:45,120 --> 00:01:48,200
Speaker 3: Zoe Tillman, speaking there. The Trump administration has signaled that

34
00:01:48,240 --> 00:01:51,240
Speaker 3: if the Supreme Court rules the tariffs are illegal, it

35
00:01:51,320 --> 00:01:54,160
Speaker 3: intends to reimpose most, if not all, of them, under

36
00:01:54,160 --> 00:01:55,480
Speaker 3: different legal provisions.

37
00:01:56,680 --> 00:02:00,560
Speaker 2: Internet and phone services in a row and have been

38
00:02:00,640 --> 00:02:04,040
Speaker 2: cut off after protests ramped up overnight in the country.

39
00:02:04,360 --> 00:02:08,320
Speaker 2: Unverified social media videos show thousands taking to the streets

40
00:02:08,320 --> 00:02:12,520
Speaker 2: in the capital Tehran. The unrest started on the twenty

41
00:02:12,560 --> 00:02:16,080
Speaker 2: eighth of December in Tehran's Grand Bazaar, to sudden decline

42
00:02:16,080 --> 00:02:19,280
Speaker 2: in the value of Iran's currency and is emerging as

43
00:02:19,320 --> 00:02:23,760
Speaker 2: a challenge to the authority of Supreme Leader Iotola Ali Homne.

44
00:02:24,000 --> 00:02:26,919
Speaker 2: The US President Donald Trump says he has warned Iran's

45
00:02:26,960 --> 00:02:29,400
Speaker 2: regime not to resort to violence.

46
00:02:29,960 --> 00:02:33,200
Speaker 4: I have put Arano noticed that if they start shooting

47
00:02:33,280 --> 00:02:36,919
Speaker 4: at him. These people are totally unarmed people, and they

48
00:02:36,960 --> 00:02:39,720
Speaker 4: love their country. They want something to happen. Look at

49
00:02:39,720 --> 00:02:42,679
Speaker 4: their country. They've gone, They've gone back one hundred and

50
00:02:42,720 --> 00:02:46,800
Speaker 4: fifty years. But I've fold them that if they do

51
00:02:46,960 --> 00:02:48,799
Speaker 4: anything bad to these people, We're going.

52
00:02:48,760 --> 00:02:49,560
Speaker 5: To hit them very hard.

53
00:02:51,040 --> 00:02:54,640
Speaker 2: Despite President Chump's comments to Fox News, the Human Rights

54
00:02:54,639 --> 00:02:57,959
Speaker 2: News Agency estimates the state crackdown has already killed forty

55
00:02:58,000 --> 00:02:58,760
Speaker 2: two people.

56
00:03:00,240 --> 00:03:03,600
Speaker 3: The US is considering paying Greenland's residence up to one

57
00:03:03,680 --> 00:03:07,560
Speaker 3: hundred thousand dollars each. That's according to Reuter's, which sites

58
00:03:07,680 --> 00:03:12,000
Speaker 3: sources saying the payments would be intended to convince Greenland

59
00:03:12,040 --> 00:03:15,760
Speaker 3: to split from Denmark. Speaking to Fox News yesterday, US

60
00:03:15,840 --> 00:03:19,200
Speaker 3: Vice President JD Vance said Trump's warnings about the territory

61
00:03:19,200 --> 00:03:20,000
Speaker 3: should be heeded.

62
00:03:20,639 --> 00:03:22,720
Speaker 6: The President of the United States is saying very clearly,

63
00:03:23,040 --> 00:03:26,600
Speaker 6: you are not doing a good job with respect to Greenland.

64
00:03:26,760 --> 00:03:29,160
Speaker 6: We're going to make sure we defend America's interest and

65
00:03:29,200 --> 00:03:30,760
Speaker 6: I think the President's willing to go as far as

66
00:03:30,760 --> 00:03:32,000
Speaker 6: he has to to make sure he does that.

67
00:03:33,320 --> 00:03:36,320
Speaker 3: Yes, Vice President jd. Vance there was speaking after Francis

68
00:03:36,400 --> 00:03:40,520
Speaker 3: Emmanuel Macron criticized recent US actions during his annual speech

69
00:03:40,560 --> 00:03:42,119
Speaker 3: to French ambassadors yesterday.

70
00:03:44,000 --> 00:03:46,160
Speaker 7: That's the big risk of the international order that we

71
00:03:46,200 --> 00:03:49,000
Speaker 7: live under. The US as an established power, but one

72
00:03:49,040 --> 00:03:52,800
Speaker 7: that's gradually turning away from certain allies and moving away

73
00:03:52,800 --> 00:03:56,360
Speaker 7: from international rules promoted just recently, whether that's with regards

74
00:03:56,400 --> 00:03:59,360
Speaker 7: to trade and certain elements of security we.

75
00:03:59,360 --> 00:04:02,440
Speaker 3: Do as a Macron, speaking there at the Lisa's Conference

76
00:04:02,440 --> 00:04:05,080
Speaker 3: of Ambassadors, where he also highlighted what he called a

77
00:04:05,120 --> 00:04:09,280
Speaker 3: growing temptation to divide the world amongst great powers.

78
00:04:10,040 --> 00:04:12,680
Speaker 2: Now onto copp News, Rio Tinto is in talks to

79
00:04:12,800 --> 00:04:15,640
Speaker 2: buy rival glen Core. A tie up would create the

80
00:04:15,640 --> 00:04:18,520
Speaker 2: world's biggest mining company, with a market value of more

81
00:04:18,520 --> 00:04:22,279
Speaker 2: than two hundred billion dollars. The new negotiations come a

82
00:04:22,320 --> 00:04:26,680
Speaker 2: little over a year after previous talks between the two

83
00:04:26,680 --> 00:04:31,000
Speaker 2: firms collapsed. Clara Ferrera Marquez is Bloomberg's Managing editor for

84
00:04:31,080 --> 00:04:33,280
Speaker 2: Commodities and energy in Asia.

85
00:04:33,760 --> 00:04:35,800
Speaker 8: They were talking back in twenty twenty four. At that

86
00:04:35,839 --> 00:04:38,080
Speaker 8: point it was glen Core making a move for Reo.

87
00:04:38,120 --> 00:04:40,320
Speaker 8: It looks like this time it might be the reverse.

88
00:04:40,360 --> 00:04:43,600
Speaker 8: They're a very obvious combination. Rio has been interested in

89
00:04:43,720 --> 00:04:47,120
Speaker 8: iron ore and glen Core has a lot better coper

90
00:04:47,160 --> 00:04:48,360
Speaker 8: assets really than Rea does.

91
00:04:49,720 --> 00:04:53,120
Speaker 2: That was Clara Ferra Marquez speaking there, as demand for

92
00:04:53,200 --> 00:04:56,279
Speaker 2: copper has never been stronger than metal. Sword to record

93
00:04:56,360 --> 00:04:59,640
Speaker 2: highs above thirteen thousand dollars a ton earlier this week.

94
00:05:00,680 --> 00:05:03,680
Speaker 3: China's inflation is accelerating at the fastest pace in nearly

95
00:05:03,760 --> 00:05:07,159
Speaker 3: three years, as higher food price as hide deeper concerns.

96
00:05:07,480 --> 00:05:11,000
Speaker 3: December's CPI reading showed prices up zero point eight percent

97
00:05:11,080 --> 00:05:13,919
Speaker 3: compared to the previous year, in line with estimates. The

98
00:05:13,960 --> 00:05:16,560
Speaker 3: increase in food prices drove the rise, but the rest

99
00:05:16,560 --> 00:05:19,480
Speaker 3: of China's economy has been plagued by weak consumption and

100
00:05:19,600 --> 00:05:23,560
Speaker 3: price wars. Producer prices fell by two point one percent

101
00:05:23,600 --> 00:05:26,880
Speaker 3: in the same period, for the thirty ninth straight month

102
00:05:26,920 --> 00:05:27,680
Speaker 3: of declines.

103
00:05:28,760 --> 00:05:31,479
Speaker 2: Now to the UK, where there's been a surge in

104
00:05:31,480 --> 00:05:33,800
Speaker 2: the number of people at risk of losing their jobs.

105
00:05:34,240 --> 00:05:37,240
Speaker 2: That's according to New figures, which will likely set off

106
00:05:37,240 --> 00:05:39,320
Speaker 2: alarm bells at the Bank of England. To Bloomberg Tea

107
00:05:39,400 --> 00:05:40,720
Speaker 2: at a BAIO has more.

108
00:05:41,160 --> 00:05:44,400
Speaker 9: More British workers face losing their job now than at

109
00:05:44,440 --> 00:05:48,080
Speaker 9: any point in almost three years. That's according to fresh

110
00:05:48,160 --> 00:05:51,400
Speaker 9: data from the government's Insolvency Service about the number of

111
00:05:51,400 --> 00:05:55,000
Speaker 9: potential redundancies, which are at their second highest level since

112
00:05:55,040 --> 00:05:58,760
Speaker 9: the pandemic. It's a spike that's especially concerning given job

113
00:05:58,800 --> 00:06:02,479
Speaker 9: losses typically slow over the festive period. Now the pressure

114
00:06:02,560 --> 00:06:04,880
Speaker 9: is on policy makers at the Bank of England to

115
00:06:05,000 --> 00:06:09,039
Speaker 9: continue lowering interest rates this year as the labor market shakeout.

116
00:06:09,120 --> 00:06:12,839
Speaker 9: Intense advice in London, Ty had a Bayo Bloomberg Radio.

117
00:06:13,279 --> 00:06:15,680
Speaker 2: And those are our top stories for you this morning.

118
00:06:15,800 --> 00:06:18,360
Speaker 2: Looking at the markets, equities are trading within a really

119
00:06:18,440 --> 00:06:20,800
Speaker 2: narrow range because there are two big risk events that

120
00:06:20,839 --> 00:06:25,320
Speaker 2: we've just mentioned, the US payrolls report and this possible

121
00:06:25,320 --> 00:06:30,120
Speaker 2: Supreme Court ruling on President Trump's tariffs. The Japanese yen

122
00:06:30,320 --> 00:06:33,280
Speaker 2: above the one hundred and fifty seven level. The Swiss

123
00:06:33,800 --> 00:06:36,800
Speaker 2: franc is also ticking lower, and it looks like the

124
00:06:36,839 --> 00:06:39,960
Speaker 2: dollars in line for the best week since November. Oil

125
00:06:40,040 --> 00:06:44,520
Speaker 2: prices extending gains, so investors clearly a monitoring what's going

126
00:06:44,520 --> 00:06:47,800
Speaker 2: on in Venezuela and Iran. Break Crew futures up by

127
00:06:47,839 --> 00:06:50,480
Speaker 2: eight tenths of one percent, six two dollars forty seven

128
00:06:50,760 --> 00:06:54,039
Speaker 2: stop futures for the USOX swifty futures also gaining four

129
00:06:54,080 --> 00:06:57,400
Speaker 2: tenths of one percent. Those are the markets.

130
00:06:57,520 --> 00:06:59,200
Speaker 3: Well In a moment, more on what could be that

131
00:06:59,320 --> 00:07:02,200
Speaker 3: huge day for Ronald Trump's trade tariffs, Plus we'll hear

132
00:07:02,200 --> 00:07:05,839
Speaker 3: from Michelle Hassein's interview with Trump's trade advisor Peter Navarro.

133
00:07:06,000 --> 00:07:08,440
Speaker 3: Another story that we've been reading this morning on why

134
00:07:08,520 --> 00:07:11,680
Speaker 3: even the most high tech executives are going low tech.

135
00:07:11,840 --> 00:07:14,600
Speaker 3: Bloomberg depinion columnist Dave Lee has been writing about a

136
00:07:14,640 --> 00:07:17,160
Speaker 3: subject that plunges me certainly, right back to the middle

137
00:07:17,160 --> 00:07:21,080
Speaker 3: of the two thousands, blogging the simpler time on the Internet.

138
00:07:21,600 --> 00:07:23,600
Speaker 3: At the end of December, the Microsoft CEO sauch And

139
00:07:23,640 --> 00:07:28,000
Speaker 3: Nadalla started his personal blog called sn Scratchpad, and Dave

140
00:07:28,000 --> 00:07:30,240
Speaker 3: actually writes that it's the format rather than the content

141
00:07:30,320 --> 00:07:33,400
Speaker 3: that's most interesting about it. It's very minimal style, uses

142
00:07:33,440 --> 00:07:36,400
Speaker 3: a simple template, nobells or whistles. Nadella's name doesn't even

143
00:07:36,520 --> 00:07:39,080
Speaker 3: appear on the site, although there are two links to

144
00:07:39,080 --> 00:07:43,400
Speaker 3: his social media profiles. Why this approach, Dave says maybe

145
00:07:43,400 --> 00:07:45,840
Speaker 3: it's a new cliche in the tech world, allowing the

146
00:07:45,880 --> 00:07:49,960
Speaker 3: sectors visionaries to opine freely without a filter, although he

147
00:07:50,000 --> 00:07:52,080
Speaker 3: does point out the blog was read by two senior

148
00:07:52,080 --> 00:07:53,880
Speaker 3: Microsoft figures before being published.

149
00:07:54,240 --> 00:07:56,960
Speaker 2: Okay, I think this is really interesting. I mean, look,

150
00:07:58,040 --> 00:08:00,400
Speaker 2: on the downside, asking me to read your blog feels

151
00:08:00,400 --> 00:08:02,880
Speaker 2: a bit like having to do my HMRC tax forms.

152
00:08:03,240 --> 00:08:06,200
Speaker 2: But on the other hand, at least that it shows

153
00:08:06,200 --> 00:08:09,680
Speaker 2: that maybe ideas matter, maybe they are back in vogue.

154
00:08:09,760 --> 00:08:14,080
Speaker 2: Human content and thought perhaps are actually valuable to someone

155
00:08:14,120 --> 00:08:15,720
Speaker 2: out there. That gives me some hope.

156
00:08:16,080 --> 00:08:19,640
Speaker 3: I'm quite nostalgic about that moment when the blogger sphere

157
00:08:19,680 --> 00:08:21,440
Speaker 3: was a big thing on the Internet, you know, before

158
00:08:21,480 --> 00:08:23,520
Speaker 3: we all started screaming at each other on social media.

159
00:08:23,640 --> 00:08:26,480
Speaker 3: I think this could be a very interesting idea of

160
00:08:26,480 --> 00:08:27,840
Speaker 3: people moving more back to it. Of course, we've had

161
00:08:27,880 --> 00:08:30,800
Speaker 3: the substack phenomenon as well, which has attracted popstars Choice

162
00:08:30,800 --> 00:08:34,040
Speaker 3: Ivan among them, most recently joining the fact of being

163
00:08:34,080 --> 00:08:36,680
Speaker 3: able to try and publish those direct masters to people.

164
00:08:36,720 --> 00:08:39,920
Speaker 3: So perhaps another shift in the fabric of the Internet.

165
00:08:40,000 --> 00:08:41,760
Speaker 3: You can read Day's full piece a Bloomberg dot com

166
00:08:41,800 --> 00:08:42,520
Speaker 3: slash opinion.

167
00:08:43,520 --> 00:08:47,360
Speaker 2: Let's bringing more now on the expected decision today from

168
00:08:47,400 --> 00:08:51,040
Speaker 2: the US Supreme Court on whether President Trump exceeded his

169
00:08:51,240 --> 00:08:56,600
Speaker 2: powers in imposing his blanket tariffs last April. Our trades

170
00:08:56,640 --> 00:08:58,839
Speaker 2: are Brendan Murray joins us now for more on this.

171
00:08:59,240 --> 00:09:02,600
Speaker 2: Brendan good to speak to what exactly, then, is the

172
00:09:02,720 --> 00:09:03,680
Speaker 2: court looking at.

173
00:09:04,880 --> 00:09:08,560
Speaker 10: So, the Court is looking specifically at the authority that

174
00:09:08,600 --> 00:09:13,880
Speaker 10: the President used to impose tariffs under this so called

175
00:09:14,080 --> 00:09:19,200
Speaker 10: International Emergency Economic Powers Act. The short term for it

176
00:09:19,280 --> 00:09:23,280
Speaker 10: is AEPA, and this is an acronym that applies to

177
00:09:23,400 --> 00:09:27,120
Speaker 10: about three quarters of the tariffs that President Trump has

178
00:09:27,160 --> 00:09:30,520
Speaker 10: collected so far in his second term, amounting to about

179
00:09:30,679 --> 00:09:33,760
Speaker 10: one hundred and fifty billion dollars of a total of

180
00:09:33,840 --> 00:09:36,720
Speaker 10: two hundred billions. So there's quite a lot at stake

181
00:09:36,760 --> 00:09:40,760
Speaker 10: here today. We don't know exactly whether the Supreme Court

182
00:09:40,840 --> 00:09:42,720
Speaker 10: is going to rule today. We just know they're going

183
00:09:42,800 --> 00:09:46,240
Speaker 10: to start reading some opinions around ten am Washington time.

184
00:09:46,760 --> 00:09:51,640
Speaker 10: And because this tariff case has been expedited, we do

185
00:09:51,720 --> 00:09:55,719
Speaker 10: expect it to be among the first of these opinions

186
00:09:55,760 --> 00:09:59,560
Speaker 10: to be addressed this year, so, but it could spill

187
00:09:59,559 --> 00:10:02,240
Speaker 10: into next week as well. But we are on high

188
00:10:02,280 --> 00:10:07,480
Speaker 10: alert for anything the court might say about ruling either

189
00:10:07,559 --> 00:10:12,000
Speaker 10: for or against the centerpiece of President Trump's economic policies.

190
00:10:12,320 --> 00:10:15,280
Speaker 3: So, if the court does decide that these the imposing

191
00:10:15,320 --> 00:10:18,000
Speaker 3: of these tariffs was illegal, what would it mean for

192
00:10:18,040 --> 00:10:20,240
Speaker 3: the tariffs that happened in force up at the now.

193
00:10:21,520 --> 00:10:23,280
Speaker 10: Well, it would mean he would have to come up

194
00:10:23,320 --> 00:10:27,960
Speaker 10: with other ways to collect revenue and impose tariffs. And

195
00:10:28,000 --> 00:10:32,640
Speaker 10: he has at least a handful of other legal ways

196
00:10:32,679 --> 00:10:35,240
Speaker 10: to do that, and they could do it pretty quickly.

197
00:10:35,280 --> 00:10:41,160
Speaker 10: The administration could impose a fifteen percent across the board

198
00:10:41,200 --> 00:10:47,000
Speaker 10: tariff on countries using a different authority under its code

199
00:10:47,000 --> 00:10:50,200
Speaker 10: in the law, under the number one twenty two we've

200
00:10:50,200 --> 00:10:54,280
Speaker 10: heard about two thirty two's. Those are authorities he can

201
00:10:54,400 --> 00:10:58,600
Speaker 10: use already he has on steel and aluminum and autos.

202
00:10:58,880 --> 00:11:01,880
Speaker 10: There's another authority with another number of the three to

203
00:11:01,920 --> 00:11:05,720
Speaker 10: zero ones, and those could also come and we expect

204
00:11:05,760 --> 00:11:10,200
Speaker 10: that the administration would move pretty quickly to essentially replicate

205
00:11:10,240 --> 00:11:13,760
Speaker 10: the tariffs that are out there under this other authority

206
00:11:13,800 --> 00:11:19,199
Speaker 10: that's being challenged with these new authorities, So tariffs aren't

207
00:11:19,200 --> 00:11:23,000
Speaker 10: going away. They just might be coming back around if

208
00:11:23,040 --> 00:11:26,480
Speaker 10: there will court rules against President Trump under these different

209
00:11:27,040 --> 00:11:29,960
Speaker 10: authorities that he has, So a lot.

210
00:11:29,840 --> 00:11:32,400
Speaker 2: Of people wondering, then what about the money that has

211
00:11:32,440 --> 00:11:35,640
Speaker 2: already been paid under these tariffs? What would happen?

212
00:11:36,720 --> 00:11:38,280
Speaker 10: Yeah, that's going to be the big question. You know,

213
00:11:38,320 --> 00:11:41,960
Speaker 10: one hundred and fifty billion dollars is a lot of money.

214
00:11:42,280 --> 00:11:49,079
Speaker 10: When you're talking about the amount of refunds that companies

215
00:11:49,120 --> 00:11:53,640
Speaker 10: could seek if these tariffs are ruled illegal, it's going

216
00:11:53,720 --> 00:11:57,920
Speaker 10: to be a messy situation. There are thousands and thousands

217
00:11:57,920 --> 00:12:00,600
Speaker 10: of companies that would want to apply for these refunds.

218
00:12:00,640 --> 00:12:04,280
Speaker 10: They essentially have to petition the government for these and

219
00:12:04,960 --> 00:12:08,320
Speaker 10: the Customs Agency recently said that they're going to go

220
00:12:08,440 --> 00:12:14,079
Speaker 10: to all electronic refunds starting in early February, so that

221
00:12:14,120 --> 00:12:17,199
Speaker 10: could help expedite the process. But it's going to be

222
00:12:17,559 --> 00:12:23,720
Speaker 10: an administrative nightmare really to try to return the funds

223
00:12:23,760 --> 00:12:27,080
Speaker 10: back to back to the companies that paid them. Remember,

224
00:12:27,360 --> 00:12:30,640
Speaker 10: many of them would have said to their foreign suppliers, hey,

225
00:12:30,679 --> 00:12:33,280
Speaker 10: can you give me a discount. Many of them would

226
00:12:33,280 --> 00:12:37,439
Speaker 10: have passed some of these cost increases along to consumers,

227
00:12:37,800 --> 00:12:40,440
Speaker 10: and so it gets really kind of It gets really

228
00:12:40,520 --> 00:12:46,080
Speaker 10: kind of complicated to see who actually paid for these tariffs.

229
00:12:46,240 --> 00:12:49,679
Speaker 10: But the bottom line is the importer of record is

230
00:12:49,720 --> 00:12:51,400
Speaker 10: the one that paid for them, and they're going to

231
00:12:51,440 --> 00:12:53,760
Speaker 10: want their money back from Uncle Sam if the Supreme

232
00:12:53,800 --> 00:12:55,280
Speaker 10: Court rules against Trump today.

233
00:12:55,800 --> 00:12:58,520
Speaker 3: Okay, Brandon Murray, our trades are thank you very much.

234
00:13:00,200 --> 00:13:00,360
Speaker 1: Us.

235
00:13:00,480 --> 00:13:03,360
Speaker 3: More from Bloomberg Daybreak Europe coming up after this.

236
00:13:05,040 --> 00:13:08,160
Speaker 2: Now, US President Donald Trump's tough talk about China and

237
00:13:08,320 --> 00:13:11,480
Speaker 2: tariffs can be traced back, in large part to the

238
00:13:11,520 --> 00:13:15,280
Speaker 2: economist Peter Navarro. He's a well known China corehawk. He's

239
00:13:15,320 --> 00:13:18,160
Speaker 2: written books arguing that Beijing poses a threat to the

240
00:13:18,240 --> 00:13:22,000
Speaker 2: US economy and its national security. Now, on this week's

241
00:13:22,320 --> 00:13:26,840
Speaker 2: The Michelle Hussein Show, Navarro talks about US China relations

242
00:13:26,960 --> 00:13:31,720
Speaker 2: and the upcoming Supreme Court ruling that could unravel many

243
00:13:31,760 --> 00:13:33,200
Speaker 2: of President Trump's tariffs.

244
00:13:34,120 --> 00:13:35,559
Speaker 5: Let's start with the case itself.

245
00:13:35,960 --> 00:13:39,400
Speaker 11: The case is about whether you can use the emergency

246
00:13:39,480 --> 00:13:42,400
Speaker 11: powers of the president to impose terror and it was.

247
00:13:42,320 --> 00:13:45,040
Speaker 12: Your advice that he could. You you were clear that

248
00:13:45,120 --> 00:13:47,840
Speaker 12: this was the way the IEEPA, this was the act.

249
00:13:48,240 --> 00:13:52,920
Speaker 11: If the Supreme Court wants to essentially ratify the president's

250
00:13:53,040 --> 00:13:56,600
Speaker 11: use of terrorists under AIPA. The law is on its

251
00:13:56,679 --> 00:13:59,800
Speaker 11: side and our side, and the law is simply this.

252
00:14:00,080 --> 00:14:03,400
Speaker 11: There's two salient points for your viewers.

253
00:14:03,960 --> 00:14:05,040
Speaker 5: One is the.

254
00:14:05,040 --> 00:14:10,000
Speaker 11: Question of whether a tariff is a tax, and in

255
00:14:10,040 --> 00:14:13,319
Speaker 11: this context, in an emergency context, it's absolutely not.

256
00:14:14,240 --> 00:14:19,320
Speaker 5: Teriffs. Tax revenues are incidental.

257
00:14:19,560 --> 00:14:25,520
Speaker 11: Now. The other, the other issue is a language issue,

258
00:14:25,600 --> 00:14:30,400
Speaker 11: is whether teriffs are legitimate form of import restriction, and

259
00:14:30,480 --> 00:14:34,240
Speaker 11: of course they are. So the Supreme Court has has

260
00:14:34,320 --> 00:14:37,800
Speaker 11: the ability now with respect to Plan B. Whatever Plan

261
00:14:37,960 --> 00:14:41,120
Speaker 11: B is will not be as good as Plan A.

262
00:14:41,400 --> 00:14:45,320
Speaker 11: So we have to recognize that this will be because.

263
00:14:45,720 --> 00:14:49,360
Speaker 12: Doctor lots of companies will have to be compensated, won't

264
00:14:49,400 --> 00:14:51,320
Speaker 12: they for m depends.

265
00:14:50,960 --> 00:14:54,720
Speaker 5: On what the discs. Let's not go there until we

266
00:14:54,760 --> 00:14:55,400
Speaker 5: have to go there.

267
00:14:55,480 --> 00:14:59,120
Speaker 11: I mean, I'm very confident that we have a very

268
00:14:59,280 --> 00:15:01,600
Speaker 11: very good chance. I mean, the laws on our side,

269
00:15:02,240 --> 00:15:05,680
Speaker 11: the laws on our side here, So let's win that. Now,

270
00:15:06,000 --> 00:15:09,680
Speaker 11: if we don't win, there's the whole alphabet number soup

271
00:15:09,840 --> 00:15:12,400
Speaker 11: of things we've got. We've got the Section two thirty

272
00:15:12,400 --> 00:15:16,840
Speaker 11: two's which we are using aggressively already on things like

273
00:15:16,880 --> 00:15:21,920
Speaker 11: steel and aluminum, on lumber, on critical minerals on pharmaceuticals.

274
00:15:21,920 --> 00:15:25,520
Speaker 11: We have that, we have the three oh one section

275
00:15:25,680 --> 00:15:29,760
Speaker 11: which we used on China to impose tariffs, which we

276
00:15:29,840 --> 00:15:30,360
Speaker 11: can do.

277
00:15:30,240 --> 00:15:32,920
Speaker 5: On any country in the world that's cheating us. It

278
00:15:32,960 --> 00:15:33,240
Speaker 5: is wrong.

279
00:15:33,360 --> 00:15:36,960
Speaker 12: If this case goes against you, it will affect your standing,

280
00:15:37,000 --> 00:15:38,840
Speaker 12: won't it in the White House? Because you are the

281
00:15:38,840 --> 00:15:42,360
Speaker 12: one who was convinced that this route was the right

282
00:15:42,400 --> 00:15:44,880
Speaker 12: one to go down with the bulk of tariff policy.

283
00:15:44,920 --> 00:15:47,280
Speaker 12: Would you consider resigning if the case is lost?

284
00:15:47,880 --> 00:15:51,240
Speaker 11: Of course, that's silly, I mean, and why I just like,

285
00:15:51,320 --> 00:15:54,320
Speaker 11: I'm part of a trade team. We've got Scott Bessett

286
00:15:54,600 --> 00:15:58,560
Speaker 11: as the Treasury Secretary, Howard Latnik is the Commerce Secretary,

287
00:15:59,160 --> 00:16:05,200
Speaker 11: Jamison Career as the United States Trade Representative, and myself

288
00:16:06,200 --> 00:16:10,280
Speaker 11: with a JD. Vance weying in. And the only person

289
00:16:10,280 --> 00:16:15,320
Speaker 11: who matters is President Trump. Okay, So we are proceeding

290
00:16:15,520 --> 00:16:19,920
Speaker 11: as the vision of how to go about this was

291
00:16:20,000 --> 00:16:23,600
Speaker 11: crafted not by me, but by a group of people.

292
00:16:23,600 --> 00:16:28,760
Speaker 11: We're doing exactly what we should be doing. We've anticipated contingencies,

293
00:16:29,360 --> 00:16:31,960
Speaker 11: but we think that the most important thing to do

294
00:16:32,000 --> 00:16:35,280
Speaker 11: now is focus on winning that case. As the Supreme Court,

295
00:16:35,360 --> 00:16:38,520
Speaker 11: that's where we're at. If we lose, then we have

296
00:16:38,600 --> 00:16:41,280
Speaker 11: a plan. B. It's not for me to talk about

297
00:16:41,280 --> 00:16:44,080
Speaker 11: that to the world because I don't think we're going to.

298
00:16:44,120 --> 00:16:46,880
Speaker 5: Lose, but if we do, we are certainly prepared.

299
00:16:47,320 --> 00:16:51,680
Speaker 12: Imagine the refund bill, which Thomas saying could be as

300
00:16:51,760 --> 00:16:53,240
Speaker 12: much as one hundred billion dollars.

301
00:16:53,720 --> 00:16:57,320
Speaker 11: I think you're basically making the case why what we've

302
00:16:57,360 --> 00:16:58,400
Speaker 11: done is a very good thing.

303
00:16:58,720 --> 00:16:59,400
Speaker 5: I mean, think about it.

304
00:17:00,280 --> 00:17:04,440
Speaker 11: Did from the Democrats who spent money, as we say

305
00:17:04,480 --> 00:17:07,159
Speaker 11: on this side of the pond, like drunken sailors. Okay,

306
00:17:07,480 --> 00:17:12,880
Speaker 11: just totally fiscally irresponsibile, like crazy stuff. And we were

307
00:17:12,920 --> 00:17:16,879
Speaker 11: looking when we got into office at a fiscal cliff

308
00:17:16,960 --> 00:17:20,240
Speaker 11: that was going to crush us with higher interest rates,

309
00:17:20,280 --> 00:17:25,720
Speaker 11: inability to fancy and and this tariff revenue, if you

310
00:17:25,960 --> 00:17:30,679
Speaker 11: just cost it out, is the difference between a dangerous

311
00:17:31,240 --> 00:17:35,160
Speaker 11: deficit and a healthy pay down in our debt.

312
00:17:35,359 --> 00:17:37,760
Speaker 12: We're coming towards towards the end of the conversation. And

313
00:17:37,840 --> 00:17:40,760
Speaker 12: I quite often ask people what they do at the weekends,

314
00:17:40,840 --> 00:17:44,040
Speaker 12: and I'm conscious, like, what are your weekends like work?

315
00:17:44,600 --> 00:17:47,439
Speaker 11: When you look, it's like when you're working for the

316
00:17:47,440 --> 00:17:51,480
Speaker 11: White House, It's it's like being at sea or being

317
00:17:51,520 --> 00:17:53,119
Speaker 11: on deployment for the military.

318
00:17:53,720 --> 00:17:55,160
Speaker 5: You're working every day.

319
00:17:55,480 --> 00:18:00,440
Speaker 11: And I know better than most because I remember the

320
00:18:00,560 --> 00:18:03,560
Speaker 11: last day from the first term and it was like,

321
00:18:03,880 --> 00:18:05,560
Speaker 11: you know, you're living in well.

322
00:18:05,600 --> 00:18:06,720
Speaker 5: There was some stuff we.

323
00:18:06,720 --> 00:18:08,400
Speaker 11: Left on the table we could have should have got

324
00:18:08,440 --> 00:18:11,200
Speaker 11: done and we didn't. And I try to tell people

325
00:18:11,920 --> 00:18:15,800
Speaker 11: who there, it's like, look, the clock's ticking and we

326
00:18:15,920 --> 00:18:16,560
Speaker 11: got a lot.

327
00:18:16,440 --> 00:18:18,040
Speaker 5: Of work to do for the American people.

328
00:18:18,760 --> 00:18:22,720
Speaker 11: Spend as much time as you can without it influencing

329
00:18:23,280 --> 00:18:24,800
Speaker 11: or harming your family time.

330
00:18:25,600 --> 00:18:29,359
Speaker 5: But this job is not a job. It's not a job.

331
00:18:29,400 --> 00:18:31,560
Speaker 5: It's a mission. I mean, there's no I.

332
00:18:31,600 --> 00:18:34,359
Speaker 11: Mean it's like, if this were just a job, I

333
00:18:34,359 --> 00:18:38,600
Speaker 11: wouldn't be doing it because I'm at the retirement age

334
00:18:39,280 --> 00:18:43,280
Speaker 11: and I could just as easily be working on my

335
00:18:43,440 --> 00:18:44,480
Speaker 11: next book or whatever.

336
00:18:46,000 --> 00:18:48,760
Speaker 3: This is Bloomberg Daybreak Europe, your morning brief on the

337
00:18:48,800 --> 00:18:51,880
Speaker 3: stories making news from London to Wall Streets and beyond.

338
00:18:52,200 --> 00:18:55,359
Speaker 2: Look for us on your podcast feed every morning on Apple,

339
00:18:55,520 --> 00:18:58,320
Speaker 2: Spotify and anywhere else you get your podcasts.

340
00:18:58,359 --> 00:19:01,399
Speaker 3: You can also listen live each morning on London DAB Radio,

341
00:19:01,440 --> 00:19:04,159
Speaker 3: the Bloomberg Business app, and Bloomberg dot Com.

342
00:19:04,200 --> 00:19:06,960
Speaker 2: Our flagship new York Station is also available on your

343
00:19:07,000 --> 00:19:11,679
Speaker 2: Amazon Alexa devices. Just say Alexa play Bloomberg eleven thirty.

344
00:19:11,920 --> 00:19:13,240
Speaker 2: I'm Caroline Hepka and.

345
00:19:13,200 --> 00:19:15,840
Speaker 3: I'm Stephen Carol. Join us again tomorrow morning for all

346
00:19:15,880 --> 00:19:18,280
Speaker 3: the news you need to start your day right here

347
00:19:18,320 --> 00:19:23,520
Speaker 3: on Bloomberg Daybreak Europe