1
00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:02,360
Speaker 1: This episode of the Chuck Todcast is brought to you

2
00:00:02,400 --> 00:00:06,240
Speaker 1: by Wild Grain. Wild Grain is the first bake from

3
00:00:06,400 --> 00:00:11,280
Speaker 1: frozen subscription box for sour dough breads, artisonal pastries, and

4
00:00:11,320 --> 00:00:14,800
Speaker 1: fresh pastas, plus all the items conveniently baked in twenty

5
00:00:14,800 --> 00:00:18,759
Speaker 1: five minutes or less. Unlike many store brought options, Wild

6
00:00:18,840 --> 00:00:21,880
Speaker 1: Grain uses some simple ingredients you can pronounce and a

7
00:00:22,040 --> 00:00:25,480
Speaker 1: slow fermentation process that can be a lot easier on

8
00:00:25,520 --> 00:00:28,080
Speaker 1: your belly, little gut health there right, and richer in

9
00:00:28,200 --> 00:00:32,600
Speaker 1: nutrients antioxidants. There's also no preservatives and no shortcuts. The

10
00:00:32,640 --> 00:00:35,800
Speaker 1: Wild Grain boxes are fully customizable. In addition to their

11
00:00:35,880 --> 00:00:38,920
Speaker 1: variety box, they have a gluten free box, a vegan box,

12
00:00:39,200 --> 00:00:42,559
Speaker 1: and a new protein box. I will tell you I

13
00:00:42,600 --> 00:00:44,960
Speaker 1: have done the gluten free box. I have done it

14
00:00:44,960 --> 00:00:48,600
Speaker 1: a second time. I have also used the code the

15
00:00:48,680 --> 00:00:52,040
Speaker 1: todcast code. You use the promo code toodcast at checkout

16
00:00:52,080 --> 00:00:55,640
Speaker 1: you get thirty dollars off. I've already used it as

17
00:00:55,680 --> 00:00:58,880
Speaker 1: a gift to somebody else who loves this bread. It

18
00:00:59,000 --> 00:01:02,560
Speaker 1: is hard to find good gluten free bread. It is fantastic.

19
00:01:02,720 --> 00:01:05,720
Speaker 1: They give you step by step instructions. I really dig this.

20
00:01:06,520 --> 00:01:09,760
Speaker 1: There is nothing like having an artesian bakery in your

21
00:01:09,800 --> 00:01:12,560
Speaker 1: freezer to chase away the winter chill. Now is the

22
00:01:12,560 --> 00:01:15,920
Speaker 1: best time to stay in and enjoy some comforting homemade

23
00:01:15,920 --> 00:01:19,440
Speaker 1: meals with Wild Grain. I obviously highly recommend it. It

24
00:01:19,520 --> 00:01:22,240
Speaker 1: is worth giving Wild Grain to try. Right now. Wildgrain

25
00:01:22,319 --> 00:01:24,919
Speaker 1: is offering my listeners thirty dollars off your first box

26
00:01:25,040 --> 00:01:28,720
Speaker 1: plus free croissants for life. Come on when you go

27
00:01:28,800 --> 00:01:32,920
Speaker 1: to wildgrain dot com slash podcast to start your subscription today.

28
00:01:33,040 --> 00:01:36,360
Speaker 1: That's thirty dollars off your first box and free croissants

29
00:01:36,360 --> 00:01:39,640
Speaker 1: for life when you visit wildgrain dot com slash podcast,

30
00:01:39,800 --> 00:01:43,040
Speaker 1: or simply use the promo code podcast at check out.

31
00:01:43,480 --> 00:01:50,080
Speaker 1: This is a sponsor I absolutely embrace, so use that code.

32
00:01:51,480 --> 00:01:55,080
Speaker 1: Hello there, Happy Thursday, and welcome to another episode of

33
00:01:55,120 --> 00:01:57,480
Speaker 1: the Chuck Podcast. I am coming to you. I'm traveling.

34
00:01:58,200 --> 00:02:02,840
Speaker 1: I just wrapped up a panel that I moderated on

35
00:02:02,920 --> 00:02:06,120
Speaker 1: behalf of the Harvard Kennedy School. I'm not a I

36
00:02:06,400 --> 00:02:10,120
Speaker 1: literally just was an invited moderator. My panel was a

37
00:02:10,120 --> 00:02:14,080
Speaker 1: long time MAYBC News political reportner Britney Shepherd, former DNC

38
00:02:14,240 --> 00:02:17,960
Speaker 1: chair Jamie Harrison, and former Republican Congressman from Illinois Rodney

39
00:02:18,040 --> 00:02:22,480
Speaker 1: Davis and we basically did a mid term preview. In fact,

40
00:02:22,600 --> 00:02:24,800
Speaker 1: many of the things I talked about there you've heard

41
00:02:24,800 --> 00:02:31,120
Speaker 1: me talk about here. But it is, it is. It

42
00:02:31,240 --> 00:02:36,120
Speaker 1: was interesting to hear sort of what people feel like

43
00:02:36,160 --> 00:02:38,560
Speaker 1: they have to say publicly. And I say that, and

44
00:02:38,600 --> 00:02:42,640
Speaker 1: I think that you know you you know, no partisan

45
00:02:43,280 --> 00:02:46,000
Speaker 1: and I get it right. Partisans want to be careful

46
00:02:46,040 --> 00:02:49,400
Speaker 1: and they want to want to be on message. But

47
00:02:49,560 --> 00:02:53,400
Speaker 1: needless to say, Rodney Davis, who works the Chamber of Commerce,

48
00:02:53,560 --> 00:02:56,440
Speaker 1: he sort of acknowledged that there are some there are

49
00:02:56,560 --> 00:03:00,840
Speaker 1: some concerns that the Republican Party is being remade a

50
00:03:00,880 --> 00:03:03,320
Speaker 1: party that is not as appealing to the Chamber of

51
00:03:03,360 --> 00:03:07,399
Speaker 1: Commerce Republicans as it once were. And Jamie Harrison acknowledged

52
00:03:07,440 --> 00:03:10,960
Speaker 1: plenty of problems that the Democrats have and speaking to

53
00:03:11,160 --> 00:03:15,320
Speaker 1: rural America. But anyway, you won't be surprised by this,

54
00:03:15,440 --> 00:03:17,720
Speaker 1: but that you know, those Harvard students a pretty smart

55
00:03:18,360 --> 00:03:21,640
Speaker 1: last time I checked, and they asked some terrific questions

56
00:03:21,680 --> 00:03:24,560
Speaker 1: in there. So my thanks to the wonderful hosts at

57
00:03:24,560 --> 00:03:28,720
Speaker 1: the Harvard Kennedy School and the Institute of Politics. There

58
00:03:28,760 --> 00:03:32,519
Speaker 1: are a lot of this is sort of the original

59
00:03:32,639 --> 00:03:34,800
Speaker 1: IOP and there are a lot of it. They've been

60
00:03:34,840 --> 00:03:38,160
Speaker 1: a great model for Institute of Politics all around the

61
00:03:38,200 --> 00:03:40,000
Speaker 1: country on that. So my thanks to there. But that

62
00:03:40,120 --> 00:03:43,560
Speaker 1: is why I'm not in the home studio. But it

63
00:03:43,560 --> 00:03:46,960
Speaker 1: doesn't mean I don't have that. I have some trunccated

64
00:03:46,960 --> 00:03:50,520
Speaker 1: show for you, actually just the opposite, fun little program. Today,

65
00:03:50,560 --> 00:03:55,760
Speaker 1: my guest is Paul Reikoff. He is the founder is

66
00:03:55,960 --> 00:03:57,640
Speaker 1: When I first got to know him, he had founded

67
00:03:57,640 --> 00:04:06,080
Speaker 1: the Iraq and Afghanistan Veterans Veterans Association that was essentially

68
00:04:06,200 --> 00:04:09,880
Speaker 1: there to advocate and lobby on behalf of veterans of

69
00:04:09,920 --> 00:04:12,600
Speaker 1: Iraq and Afghanistan here in the twenty first century. He

70
00:04:12,680 --> 00:04:17,919
Speaker 1: has since helped found an organization called Independence for America,

71
00:04:18,720 --> 00:04:23,000
Speaker 1: and he describes himself as somebody that's part of the

72
00:04:23,000 --> 00:04:26,880
Speaker 1: angry middle and needless to say, we have an interesting

73
00:04:26,880 --> 00:04:29,000
Speaker 1: conversation about that, but we also talk about sort of

74
00:04:29,400 --> 00:04:33,840
Speaker 1: veterans issues in general, how Democrats move veterans, how Republicans

75
00:04:33,839 --> 00:04:37,440
Speaker 1: move veterans. One thing about Paul is he's not shy.

76
00:04:37,640 --> 00:04:40,480
Speaker 1: He's got a lot of strong opinions, and I think

77
00:04:40,520 --> 00:04:43,440
Speaker 1: it's a very fascinating conversation. But before we get to that,

78
00:04:43,920 --> 00:04:45,599
Speaker 1: I have a few things I want to get to

79
00:04:45,680 --> 00:04:49,040
Speaker 1: and in fact, let's start with the midterms. I know

80
00:04:49,040 --> 00:04:51,240
Speaker 1: we've had a lot of crazy stuff happened this week,

81
00:04:51,320 --> 00:04:59,160
Speaker 1: right the Pam bondi Epstein hearings. You know, I'm not

82
00:04:59,200 --> 00:05:02,839
Speaker 1: going to do what everybody starts does these days, which

83
00:05:02,920 --> 00:05:05,719
Speaker 1: is say, you know, Congressional hearings are all theater. Yes

84
00:05:05,760 --> 00:05:12,760
Speaker 1: they're all theater. But the theater can matter if there's

85
00:05:12,800 --> 00:05:16,320
Speaker 1: a SoundBite that lives or a moment that lingers. That's

86
00:05:16,320 --> 00:05:19,479
Speaker 1: why these hearings do. I wish that more members of

87
00:05:19,520 --> 00:05:23,599
Speaker 1: Congress figured out how to not make themselves the focus

88
00:05:23,640 --> 00:05:25,960
Speaker 1: and make the witness and the question that they want

89
00:05:25,960 --> 00:05:30,640
Speaker 1: the witness to answer, the focal point. I think, in fact,

90
00:05:31,320 --> 00:05:34,960
Speaker 1: a great example of this was Illinois Congressman Sean Casten

91
00:05:35,000 --> 00:05:37,039
Speaker 1: and the question that he asked a couple of weeks

92
00:05:37,080 --> 00:05:41,240
Speaker 1: ago of Scott Bessant asking about some technicalities about what

93
00:05:41,320 --> 00:05:45,960
Speaker 1: is Treasury's authority when it comes to overseeing the money

94
00:05:45,960 --> 00:05:48,280
Speaker 1: that comes from the Venezuela oil. And you could just

95
00:05:48,320 --> 00:05:52,320
Speaker 1: see Scott Bessett look like the student in the classroom

96
00:05:52,360 --> 00:05:55,279
Speaker 1: that got caught not reading, not doing the homework assignment

97
00:05:55,320 --> 00:05:58,200
Speaker 1: the night before and the teacher called on them. In

98
00:05:58,240 --> 00:06:01,599
Speaker 1: some ways, I found it to be more effective then

99
00:06:01,920 --> 00:06:04,640
Speaker 1: you do the argument back and forth. But I understand

100
00:06:05,800 --> 00:06:09,120
Speaker 1: the politics of that. The members are trying, you know,

101
00:06:09,200 --> 00:06:12,799
Speaker 1: sometimes it's the only time their constituents know they're doing anything.

102
00:06:12,880 --> 00:06:15,120
Speaker 1: Are at these hearings, And of course we know in

103
00:06:15,120 --> 00:06:18,120
Speaker 1: the Trump administration, cabinet secretaries have an audience of one.

104
00:06:19,200 --> 00:06:23,440
Speaker 1: And it was bizarre to hear Pam Bondi pushback on

105
00:06:23,440 --> 00:06:25,480
Speaker 1: one Epstein question by saying, how come we're not talking

106
00:06:25,520 --> 00:06:28,599
Speaker 1: about the Dow crossing the fifty thousand market? You're like,

107
00:06:28,760 --> 00:06:30,680
Speaker 1: what does the Attorney General have anything to do with

108
00:06:30,720 --> 00:06:35,280
Speaker 1: the Dow Jones industrial average? So, but we do know

109
00:06:35,400 --> 00:06:38,360
Speaker 1: that's that's a comment that was meant for an audience

110
00:06:38,440 --> 00:06:42,440
Speaker 1: of what the man over at sixteen hundred Pennsylvania Avenue.

111
00:06:42,839 --> 00:06:49,720
Speaker 1: But you know, Bondi's credibility issues are pretty she's accumulating

112
00:06:49,760 --> 00:06:53,080
Speaker 1: quite a few of them. It's been a you know,

113
00:06:53,120 --> 00:06:56,320
Speaker 1: it's not been a good good week for the Justice Department.

114
00:06:56,480 --> 00:06:59,479
Speaker 1: Jeanine Piro tried to do get a grand jury. You know,

115
00:06:59,640 --> 00:07:03,320
Speaker 1: infamous grand juries can indict supposedly can indict a hand sandwich,

116
00:07:03,320 --> 00:07:08,479
Speaker 1: but they can't seem to indict people that that the

117
00:07:08,480 --> 00:07:10,800
Speaker 1: public doesn't think deserve to be indicted, and so they

118
00:07:10,800 --> 00:07:13,440
Speaker 1: try to get indictment on those members of Congress who

119
00:07:13,520 --> 00:07:16,960
Speaker 1: made the video that told rank and file soldiers that

120
00:07:17,000 --> 00:07:21,880
Speaker 1: they do not have to follow illegal orders, which is true.

121
00:07:22,200 --> 00:07:23,760
Speaker 1: That's upholding your oath.

122
00:07:24,920 --> 00:07:25,680
Speaker 2: So it.

123
00:07:27,800 --> 00:07:31,720
Speaker 1: I think the decision by the grand jury not to

124
00:07:31,720 --> 00:07:35,440
Speaker 1: bring those indictments, I hope for those of you that

125
00:07:35,520 --> 00:07:40,400
Speaker 1: are concerned that somehow the government isn't responsive, that people

126
00:07:40,440 --> 00:07:46,480
Speaker 1: aren't listening, that should be a reminder that, you know,

127
00:07:46,520 --> 00:07:49,160
Speaker 1: the public public is paying more attention than I think

128
00:07:49,480 --> 00:07:51,800
Speaker 1: activists and other members of the media think at times,

129
00:07:51,800 --> 00:07:57,320
Speaker 1: and certainly how elected officials. The public's paying attention. And ultimately,

130
00:07:57,360 --> 00:07:59,520
Speaker 1: you're going to have to trust the voters that they're

131
00:07:59,520 --> 00:08:01,680
Speaker 1: going to do the right thing when it is up

132
00:08:01,720 --> 00:08:03,760
Speaker 1: to them to do the right thing. And those Grand

133
00:08:03,800 --> 00:08:06,040
Speaker 1: jurors did the right thing when it was their time

134
00:08:06,080 --> 00:08:09,600
Speaker 1: to do the right thing. So I hope those of

135
00:08:09,600 --> 00:08:11,960
Speaker 1: you that have been losing some faith in the democracy,

136
00:08:12,040 --> 00:08:16,000
Speaker 1: losing some faith that you realize now when trust the voter,

137
00:08:17,560 --> 00:08:21,880
Speaker 1: just trust the voter. Eventually we always figure it out. Okay,

138
00:08:21,960 --> 00:08:24,440
Speaker 1: the question is how much damage gets done before we

139
00:08:24,600 --> 00:08:27,480
Speaker 1: as an electorate have to figure it out. But we

140
00:08:27,520 --> 00:08:29,640
Speaker 1: do always figure it out. That's what our history shows.

141
00:08:30,040 --> 00:08:31,760
Speaker 1: And I'm confident we're going to figure it out again,

142
00:08:31,880 --> 00:08:34,160
Speaker 1: and we're going to get to a better place, and

143
00:08:34,240 --> 00:08:36,160
Speaker 1: we're going to figure out how to be have a

144
00:08:36,160 --> 00:08:39,160
Speaker 1: democracy that's more responsive to left, right and center, which

145
00:08:39,160 --> 00:08:41,000
Speaker 1: is part of the conversation I have with Paul Rykoff.

146
00:08:41,320 --> 00:08:44,760
Speaker 1: This is not about just TDS, you know here, This

147
00:08:44,920 --> 00:08:48,320
Speaker 1: is about the system as a whole. Trust the voter here,

148
00:08:48,520 --> 00:08:51,680
Speaker 1: and I think that decision by those grand jurors not

149
00:08:52,440 --> 00:08:54,839
Speaker 1: to go along with that indictment and it's, you know,

150
00:08:54,880 --> 00:08:58,840
Speaker 1: another embarrassment for the Justice Department. But remember it was

151
00:08:58,840 --> 00:09:03,720
Speaker 1: Pam Bondi who gave out those who claimed that she

152
00:09:03,800 --> 00:09:06,280
Speaker 1: had all these Epstein files on her desk and she

153
00:09:06,440 --> 00:09:08,760
Speaker 1: was doing all this, and then now she's in the

154
00:09:08,840 --> 00:09:11,440
Speaker 1: role of pay no attention to these Epstein files. Right

155
00:09:11,600 --> 00:09:13,560
Speaker 1: when she first got there, it was all about riling

156
00:09:13,679 --> 00:09:17,040
Speaker 1: up the magabase that cared about the Epstein files. And

157
00:09:17,080 --> 00:09:20,160
Speaker 1: now that they've had to put their money where their

158
00:09:20,160 --> 00:09:22,520
Speaker 1: mouth is and been forced to actually release these files.

159
00:09:22,520 --> 00:09:25,160
Speaker 1: And now they've been you know, suddenly they want to

160
00:09:25,200 --> 00:09:28,400
Speaker 1: redact more. They're afraid of certain things. There's been a

161
00:09:29,120 --> 00:09:32,760
Speaker 1: lot of protecting of Donald Trump here, even though again

162
00:09:34,520 --> 00:09:40,559
Speaker 1: it's interesting, there seems to be plenty of semi exculpatory

163
00:09:40,640 --> 00:09:44,400
Speaker 1: things for Trump in these files, right, including the FBI

164
00:09:44,559 --> 00:09:47,679
Speaker 1: notes that he talked to an FBI agent and seemed

165
00:09:47,720 --> 00:09:49,840
Speaker 1: to think that what Epstein and Dyline Maxwell are up

166
00:09:49,880 --> 00:09:53,199
Speaker 1: to was no good. But he seems to be awfully

167
00:09:53,200 --> 00:09:55,360
Speaker 1: nervous about it. Is it too many friends that are

168
00:09:55,360 --> 00:09:58,080
Speaker 1: caught up in it? Is it the fact that it

169
00:09:58,160 --> 00:10:00,400
Speaker 1: is his close friend? Is it the fact that they

170
00:10:00,600 --> 00:10:03,760
Speaker 1: are that when they were all when when when Trump

171
00:10:03,760 --> 00:10:07,280
Speaker 1: and Millennia were a new couple, that the one couple

172
00:10:07,320 --> 00:10:10,640
Speaker 1: that they interactive with quite a bit was Maxwell and Epstein.

173
00:10:11,040 --> 00:10:17,920
Speaker 1: Whatever it is, it is Trump is behaving like he's

174
00:10:17,960 --> 00:10:21,360
Speaker 1: got more to hide than what we all have actually seen. Right.

175
00:10:21,440 --> 00:10:24,280
Speaker 1: It's a bit of a head scratcher. So needless to say,

176
00:10:24,320 --> 00:10:28,520
Speaker 1: I think that that BONDI has cemented her legacy is

177
00:10:29,120 --> 00:10:35,240
Speaker 1: more partisan, frankly partisan warrior sitting there and not you know,

178
00:10:35,880 --> 00:10:38,160
Speaker 1: I don't think that's going to be her Attorney general

179
00:10:41,160 --> 00:10:44,679
Speaker 1: portrait is going to be one that is hung up

180
00:10:44,800 --> 00:10:50,200
Speaker 1: very often by successive attorneys general. I think her portrait

181
00:10:50,240 --> 00:10:52,520
Speaker 1: will likely be in the basement of that Justice Department

182
00:10:52,520 --> 00:10:58,520
Speaker 1: building for a long, long, long time. But with that,

183
00:10:58,559 --> 00:11:01,160
Speaker 1: I want to focus obviously, Look, I'm a campaign guy,

184
00:11:01,200 --> 00:11:04,080
Speaker 1: I'm a politics guy, and it's an even numbered year,

185
00:11:04,200 --> 00:11:06,720
Speaker 1: so you know, when when in doubt, I'm going to

186
00:11:06,760 --> 00:11:11,920
Speaker 1: focus on where we are politically at the moment, and

187
00:11:12,040 --> 00:11:15,880
Speaker 1: there is Look, I made it clear that you know,

188
00:11:15,920 --> 00:11:18,360
Speaker 1: it looks like the House has already gone. The question

189
00:11:18,520 --> 00:11:20,000
Speaker 1: is is it going to be a small majority for

190
00:11:20,000 --> 00:11:22,920
Speaker 1: the Democrats or a large majority for the Democrats. Structurally,

191
00:11:23,280 --> 00:11:25,320
Speaker 1: it's hard to see how it becomes a large majority

192
00:11:25,360 --> 00:11:26,920
Speaker 1: for the Democrats. In fact, some of the feedback I

193
00:11:26,960 --> 00:11:29,560
Speaker 1: got on my substack, I took what I gave to

194
00:11:29,600 --> 00:11:31,839
Speaker 1: you guys on Monday, and I basically put some charts

195
00:11:31,840 --> 00:11:37,160
Speaker 1: together as well, and it's in the substack on how

196
00:11:38,400 --> 00:11:41,800
Speaker 1: you know, essentially saying the cake is basically baked. You've

197
00:11:41,800 --> 00:11:45,520
Speaker 1: got you know, we've already crossed the fifty plus open

198
00:11:45,559 --> 00:11:49,160
Speaker 1: seat list. There's already thirty Republican retirements that are more

199
00:11:49,200 --> 00:11:52,440
Speaker 1: than are likely to come. You've got presidential job ratings

200
00:11:52,480 --> 00:11:55,520
Speaker 1: sitting in the very low forties. There's even a handful

201
00:11:55,559 --> 00:12:00,480
Speaker 1: of polls it shows his approval rating in the high

202
00:12:00,559 --> 00:12:05,400
Speaker 1: thirties and disapproval rating creeping over sixty. That is a

203
00:12:05,440 --> 00:12:10,880
Speaker 1: recipe for a midterm flip. The question is are there

204
00:12:11,040 --> 00:12:15,760
Speaker 1: enough congressional districts that Democrats can make competitive to take

205
00:12:15,800 --> 00:12:18,320
Speaker 1: a Instead of winning ten to fifteen seats, can they

206
00:12:18,360 --> 00:12:24,319
Speaker 1: win twenty to thirty seats. I had a few One

207
00:12:24,320 --> 00:12:27,840
Speaker 1: of the polster that I trust quite a bit, who

208
00:12:27,840 --> 00:12:29,760
Speaker 1: really is more of an independent these days, but certainly

209
00:12:29,800 --> 00:12:31,800
Speaker 1: is more familiar with the Republican side of the aisle.

210
00:12:33,640 --> 00:12:35,800
Speaker 1: He shared with me some numbers and reminding me that

211
00:12:35,840 --> 00:12:41,280
Speaker 1: in twenty eighteen, I believe not a single congressional district

212
00:12:41,760 --> 00:12:43,880
Speaker 1: that Donald Trump got fifty seven percent or more in

213
00:12:44,240 --> 00:12:46,720
Speaker 1: Democrats were able to flip that there is there is

214
00:12:46,960 --> 00:12:49,800
Speaker 1: a ceiling, right, there is a ceiling. And then even

215
00:12:49,800 --> 00:12:53,200
Speaker 1: in the twenty twenty five Virginia Assembly races, you know,

216
00:12:53,840 --> 00:12:57,160
Speaker 1: Democrats were able to win districts that Trump won by

217
00:12:57,160 --> 00:12:59,480
Speaker 1: five points or less. They were not able to win

218
00:12:59,559 --> 00:13:02,720
Speaker 1: districts where he won by more than five points. And

219
00:13:02,760 --> 00:13:06,600
Speaker 1: we've seen Democrats are trying to put some double digit

220
00:13:06,679 --> 00:13:09,960
Speaker 1: Trump districts in play, including one of the Montana seats

221
00:13:10,000 --> 00:13:13,560
Speaker 1: with Ryan Zinky, one of the Colorado seats in and

222
00:13:13,600 --> 00:13:19,040
Speaker 1: around Colorado Springs. BILLOK, that's smart strategy, right, You want

223
00:13:19,080 --> 00:13:22,840
Speaker 1: to try to stretch the field, make the incumbent party

224
00:13:22,880 --> 00:13:25,880
Speaker 1: spend more money. The Republicans have more money than the

225
00:13:25,880 --> 00:13:28,920
Speaker 1: Democrats right now, so if you're in the challenger position,

226
00:13:29,280 --> 00:13:32,559
Speaker 1: you want to make them spread dilute their resources a

227
00:13:32,600 --> 00:13:37,440
Speaker 1: little bit. But the Republicans have a huge problem on

228
00:13:37,480 --> 00:13:39,880
Speaker 1: their hands. They've got a president who is not interested

229
00:13:39,920 --> 00:13:43,960
Speaker 1: in helping Republicans actually succeed in the midterms. Right The

230
00:13:43,960 --> 00:13:48,400
Speaker 1: most glaring example is what he's not what he's done

231
00:13:48,440 --> 00:13:49,920
Speaker 1: in the state of Texas, or what he's not done

232
00:13:49,920 --> 00:13:52,000
Speaker 1: in the state of Texas. By staying out of that

233
00:13:52,040 --> 00:13:57,120
Speaker 1: Texas Centate primary, he is perhaps going to cost his

234
00:13:57,320 --> 00:14:02,479
Speaker 1: party a half a billion dollars to try to rescue

235
00:14:02,640 --> 00:14:05,880
Speaker 1: one of the most flawed, ethically and morally challenged nominees

236
00:14:05,920 --> 00:14:08,520
Speaker 1: that they could ever have. You know, only Roy Moore

237
00:14:08,640 --> 00:14:11,480
Speaker 1: is worse if they end up with Ken Paxton as

238
00:14:11,520 --> 00:14:13,920
Speaker 1: a nominee, and it's going to cost them an arm

239
00:14:13,960 --> 00:14:16,920
Speaker 1: and a leg, no matter who the Democratic nominees, whether

240
00:14:16,960 --> 00:14:20,080
Speaker 1: it is Tallerico or it is Crockett. Because Paxon himself

241
00:14:20,120 --> 00:14:22,720
Speaker 1: is not popular, there are plenty of Bush Republicans and

242
00:14:22,800 --> 00:14:26,440
Speaker 1: Cornn Republicans who are among those who voted to impeach

243
00:14:26,480 --> 00:14:29,320
Speaker 1: him in the state House, who are not big fans

244
00:14:29,320 --> 00:14:34,960
Speaker 1: of him. And because Paxson's been very loyal to Trump,

245
00:14:35,000 --> 00:14:38,760
Speaker 1: Trump can't bring himself to endorse against Paxton. He views

246
00:14:38,840 --> 00:14:42,800
Speaker 1: corn as somebody that's not been trumpy enough. He sees

247
00:14:42,880 --> 00:14:44,920
Speaker 1: Cornn and there's plenty of people that have whispered in

248
00:14:44,960 --> 00:14:48,480
Speaker 1: Trump's here that Cornyn's really McConnell and a cowboy hat.

249
00:14:49,600 --> 00:14:52,880
Speaker 1: And yet if Trump were doing what was in the

250
00:14:52,920 --> 00:14:57,040
Speaker 1: best interest of the Republican Party, he'd have endorsed Cornn

251
00:14:57,720 --> 00:15:01,560
Speaker 1: months ago, and that primary fee might not have been cleared,

252
00:15:02,440 --> 00:15:06,320
Speaker 1: but he'd been a lot better place than where they

253
00:15:06,320 --> 00:15:06,760
Speaker 1: are now.

254
00:15:06,960 --> 00:15:07,200
Speaker 2: Now.

255
00:15:07,240 --> 00:15:09,560
Speaker 1: Maybe he comes in late and he does endorse. Maybe

256
00:15:09,560 --> 00:15:12,000
Speaker 1: he is going to wait till the runoff to pick

257
00:15:12,080 --> 00:15:15,600
Speaker 1: between two. Right, Wesley Hunt's flown on Air Force one right,

258
00:15:15,720 --> 00:15:18,760
Speaker 1: he's been sucking up to Trump. We know Paxton is

259
00:15:19,240 --> 00:15:22,920
Speaker 1: frankly on issues, has been closer to Trump than anybody

260
00:15:22,960 --> 00:15:26,000
Speaker 1: else he was. He was pro Trump before it was

261
00:15:26,040 --> 00:15:31,800
Speaker 1: cool among some Texas conservatives and that matters to Trump.

262
00:15:33,000 --> 00:15:36,480
Speaker 1: But it was interesting to read the stories about this

263
00:15:37,040 --> 00:15:42,080
Speaker 1: donor retreat earlier this week among Republicans and they were

264
00:15:42,120 --> 00:15:48,480
Speaker 1: getting this, they were getting this presentation about the trouble

265
00:15:48,520 --> 00:15:50,960
Speaker 1: in Texas. Well, there's one easy way to solve the problem,

266
00:15:51,040 --> 00:15:54,240
Speaker 1: and Trump won't do it. It's fascinating to see, Like when

267
00:15:54,280 --> 00:15:58,200
Speaker 1: you look at the Senate map for Republicans, Trump has

268
00:15:58,240 --> 00:16:01,000
Speaker 1: made it harder for them, right, Trump Chase Tom Tillis

269
00:16:01,040 --> 00:16:04,000
Speaker 1: out of the race, and now they have a harder look.

270
00:16:04,520 --> 00:16:07,440
Speaker 1: It is maybe Cooper runs against tell Us too, but

271
00:16:07,520 --> 00:16:12,920
Speaker 1: an incumbent till Us against Cooper is a Look, the

272
00:16:13,040 --> 00:16:15,400
Speaker 1: races are going to be competitive either way, but Tillis

273
00:16:15,400 --> 00:16:18,040
Speaker 1: would be starting with a greater advantage than Watley, the

274
00:16:18,080 --> 00:16:20,600
Speaker 1: former R and C chair who Trump is endorsed. So

275
00:16:20,840 --> 00:16:24,240
Speaker 1: they've made North Carolina tougher thanks to Donald Trump. Texas

276
00:16:24,360 --> 00:16:28,960
Speaker 1: is a problem thanks to Donald Trump. What's fascinating. And

277
00:16:29,360 --> 00:16:33,880
Speaker 1: he just actually potentially just screwed his candidate in Michigan,

278
00:16:34,000 --> 00:16:39,360
Speaker 1: Mike Rogers, because out of nowhere, and you know, talk

279
00:16:39,360 --> 00:16:43,600
Speaker 1: about then the under the radar. Once again, the corrupt

280
00:16:43,840 --> 00:16:48,040
Speaker 1: lobbying stories of the Trump administration are the stories that

281
00:16:48,080 --> 00:16:51,080
Speaker 1: gets that go under the radar more than any right,

282
00:16:51,360 --> 00:16:53,680
Speaker 1: the story I spent a lot of time with last

283
00:16:53,680 --> 00:16:58,800
Speaker 1: week about the Abu Dhabi investments into the Trump organization

284
00:16:58,920 --> 00:17:03,200
Speaker 1: four days before the inauguration, which you could you start

285
00:17:03,200 --> 00:17:05,679
Speaker 1: to line up. It was filled with quid pro quos

286
00:17:05,760 --> 00:17:12,159
Speaker 1: that touched the Binance pardon that seemed to launch it

287
00:17:12,240 --> 00:17:16,439
Speaker 1: seemed to change policy on what chips could be sold

288
00:17:16,440 --> 00:17:19,440
Speaker 1: to the UAE, which now could potentially backchannel and sell

289
00:17:19,440 --> 00:17:23,560
Speaker 1: them to China. Right, all of this that is to

290
00:17:23,680 --> 00:17:26,280
Speaker 1: me a story that is as bad as any story

291
00:17:26,280 --> 00:17:30,560
Speaker 1: in the history of presidential politics and graft, right, worse

292
00:17:30,600 --> 00:17:34,560
Speaker 1: than Teapot Dome when you when you put it all together,

293
00:17:34,600 --> 00:17:40,240
Speaker 1: and as Andy McCarthy, the legal the conservative legal analysts

294
00:17:40,240 --> 00:17:42,040
Speaker 1: at National Review was put it, you had to add

295
00:17:42,040 --> 00:17:45,399
Speaker 1: a couple of zeros to Biden, you know. And he

296
00:17:45,560 --> 00:17:48,720
Speaker 1: was very hard on Biden. Thought what Biden the Bidens

297
00:17:48,720 --> 00:17:51,920
Speaker 1: were doing was very corrupt. And he said, he put

298
00:17:51,920 --> 00:17:54,119
Speaker 1: the he said, what the Trump family has done, you

299
00:17:54,160 --> 00:17:55,560
Speaker 1: had to add a couple of zeros to what the

300
00:17:55,560 --> 00:17:59,040
Speaker 1: Bidens did to get anywhere near the corruption of what

301
00:17:59,480 --> 00:18:03,800
Speaker 1: the Trump family has done in this specific scenario. Well

302
00:18:03,840 --> 00:18:07,000
Speaker 1: Trump did it again. So you may have read about

303
00:18:07,040 --> 00:18:12,200
Speaker 1: the brand new bridge that would connect Detroit to Windsor, Canada.

304
00:18:13,080 --> 00:18:16,560
Speaker 1: And Windsor Canada is that just across the just across

305
00:18:16,600 --> 00:18:23,200
Speaker 1: the river there in Michigan, the border of Canada. When

306
00:18:23,200 --> 00:18:26,160
Speaker 1: I was younger, I one time did the Windsor Ballet.

307
00:18:26,480 --> 00:18:28,159
Speaker 1: And I'll just sit here and say, if you know,

308
00:18:28,240 --> 00:18:31,320
Speaker 1: you know, and I'd love to hear from those of

309
00:18:31,359 --> 00:18:35,000
Speaker 1: you that may be familiar with the Windsor Ballet. And again,

310
00:18:35,960 --> 00:18:38,240
Speaker 1: I'm not going any further because I don't know how

311
00:18:38,240 --> 00:18:40,280
Speaker 1: many people will be upset about that, So I'll just

312
00:18:40,359 --> 00:18:43,879
Speaker 1: leave that on the side. But let's just say Windsor's

313
00:18:44,080 --> 00:18:49,040
Speaker 1: a lot of fun anyway. But it's a huge, you know,

314
00:18:49,040 --> 00:18:53,360
Speaker 1: it's important business corridor for Michigan's economy and for Canada's economy.

315
00:18:54,160 --> 00:18:56,320
Speaker 1: And there's only been one bridge for a long time.

316
00:18:56,359 --> 00:18:58,639
Speaker 1: And the guy who owns that bridge makes a lot

317
00:18:58,680 --> 00:19:02,600
Speaker 1: of money being the sort of the most important, you know,

318
00:19:02,880 --> 00:19:06,840
Speaker 1: transit point between Canada and the United States. Well, Canada

319
00:19:07,840 --> 00:19:12,120
Speaker 1: wanted another bridge. They wanted to be able to you know, Essentially,

320
00:19:12,520 --> 00:19:17,760
Speaker 1: you know, the Loan Bridge was a lot of congestion,

321
00:19:17,920 --> 00:19:21,800
Speaker 1: It was slowing down movement between the two countries, and

322
00:19:21,880 --> 00:19:25,680
Speaker 1: so Canada agreed to pay for a new bridge connecting

323
00:19:25,760 --> 00:19:28,480
Speaker 1: Windsor and Detroit. And it was going to be and

324
00:19:28,520 --> 00:19:32,320
Speaker 1: it's jointly owned by the State of Michigan and Canada

325
00:19:32,560 --> 00:19:35,520
Speaker 1: and Canada and Canada paid for it, Gordy Howe Bridge.

326
00:19:36,560 --> 00:19:39,440
Speaker 1: It is seen as a economic boon for a lot

327
00:19:39,440 --> 00:19:42,200
Speaker 1: of Michigan companies, very important to the State of Michigan's

328
00:19:42,200 --> 00:19:49,679
Speaker 1: economy and very important to Canada. And the owner of

329
00:19:49,840 --> 00:19:52,080
Speaker 1: the other bridge, or the guy who can basically gets

330
00:19:52,080 --> 00:19:54,439
Speaker 1: all the all the fees from the use of that

331
00:19:54,480 --> 00:19:58,320
Speaker 1: other bridge, lobbies halut Nick at the Commerce Department, tells

332
00:19:58,400 --> 00:20:01,240
Speaker 1: him about this, and then within a day, Trump's on

333
00:20:01,600 --> 00:20:06,640
Speaker 1: truth social manufacturing some outrage saying he's going to shut

334
00:20:06,680 --> 00:20:08,680
Speaker 1: down this bridge or he's going to take it over,

335
00:20:11,320 --> 00:20:16,479
Speaker 1: and all because a billionaire got access complained about that

336
00:20:16,520 --> 00:20:19,679
Speaker 1: it was going to cost him money. Perhaps they've written

337
00:20:19,720 --> 00:20:22,120
Speaker 1: their sheriff checks to the Trump campaign. So Trump felt

338
00:20:22,160 --> 00:20:26,000
Speaker 1: like he had to be responsive. Well, it put his

339
00:20:26,040 --> 00:20:29,720
Speaker 1: Senate candidate, Republican Mike Rogers, in a pretty tough spot

340
00:20:29,880 --> 00:20:32,040
Speaker 1: because this is just good for the Michigan company. This

341
00:20:32,160 --> 00:20:34,520
Speaker 1: is not one of those things that is a democratic

342
00:20:34,560 --> 00:20:39,200
Speaker 1: bridge or a Republican bridge. This is good for Michigan's economy,

343
00:20:39,240 --> 00:20:43,720
Speaker 1: hard stop. Mike Rogers is a what I'd call a

344
00:20:43,760 --> 00:20:49,280
Speaker 1: pretty conventional Republican, pro business Republican, and here he's got

345
00:20:49,320 --> 00:20:52,359
Speaker 1: his president putting him in an awkward position where he

346
00:20:52,400 --> 00:20:57,120
Speaker 1: wants to essentially use the power of the federal government

347
00:20:58,040 --> 00:21:02,320
Speaker 1: to make it harder for business to do to trade

348
00:21:02,359 --> 00:21:06,520
Speaker 1: with Canada. Can't think of anything more less republican than that.

349
00:21:07,920 --> 00:21:11,080
Speaker 1: But this is the larger issue that Trump's introduced for

350
00:21:11,160 --> 00:21:13,879
Speaker 1: a lot of Republicans running for office, and his entire

351
00:21:13,960 --> 00:21:17,480
Speaker 1: sort of protectionist agenda at times with tariffs and things

352
00:21:17,600 --> 00:21:19,000
Speaker 1: like this. And I'm going to get to that in

353
00:21:19,000 --> 00:21:21,400
Speaker 1: a moment with that House vote. But the point is

354
00:21:21,400 --> 00:21:27,359
Speaker 1: is that Donald Trump keeps making decisions, making proclamations that

355
00:21:27,560 --> 00:21:32,080
Speaker 1: actually do tactical harm to the Republican chances of holding

356
00:21:32,160 --> 00:21:35,840
Speaker 1: the Senate and holding the House. He's undermining Mike Rogers'

357
00:21:35,880 --> 00:21:39,679
Speaker 1: campaign in Michigan with this Gordi how Bridge business. He

358
00:21:39,760 --> 00:21:41,639
Speaker 1: has made it harder for his part. He's going to

359
00:21:41,680 --> 00:21:45,560
Speaker 1: cost him literally a half a billion dollars if Cornan's

360
00:21:45,600 --> 00:21:49,240
Speaker 1: not the nominee in Texas. And like I said, it's

361
00:21:49,240 --> 00:21:51,800
Speaker 1: all because people have whispered in Trump's ear that Cornan

362
00:21:51,880 --> 00:21:58,840
Speaker 1: is McConnell with a cowboy hat. This episode of the

363
00:21:58,880 --> 00:22:01,800
Speaker 1: Chuck Podcast is brought to you by American Financing. Let's

364
00:22:01,840 --> 00:22:04,159
Speaker 1: be honest, the math just isn't adding up lately. Between

365
00:22:04,200 --> 00:22:07,280
Speaker 1: the grocery store and those skyrocketing insurance premiums, even with

366
00:22:07,320 --> 00:22:09,800
Speaker 1: a steady job, more families are being forced to rely

367
00:22:09,880 --> 00:22:12,800
Speaker 1: on high interest credit cards to cover expenses. So if

368
00:22:12,840 --> 00:22:15,840
Speaker 1: you're a homeowner caught in this cycle, carrying balances with

369
00:22:15,920 --> 00:22:18,760
Speaker 1: interest rates in the twenties, frankly even the thirties, it's

370
00:22:18,760 --> 00:22:20,720
Speaker 1: time to get some relief. Right now, mortgage rates are

371
00:22:20,760 --> 00:22:23,080
Speaker 1: at a three year low, and my friends at American

372
00:22:23,119 --> 00:22:26,800
Speaker 1: Financing are helping homeowners pay off that high interest debt

373
00:22:26,840 --> 00:22:30,840
Speaker 1: at rates in the low fives. Their salary based mortgage

374
00:22:30,880 --> 00:22:34,080
Speaker 1: consultants don't just push loans on you, they build exit

375
00:22:34,240 --> 00:22:38,080
Speaker 1: strategies from debts. On average, they're saving their customers eight

376
00:22:38,160 --> 00:22:40,679
Speaker 1: hundred dollars a month. So if you start today, you

377
00:22:40,720 --> 00:22:43,159
Speaker 1: may even delay the next two mortgage payments. There are

378
00:22:43,200 --> 00:22:46,080
Speaker 1: no upfront fees or obligations. To find out how much

379
00:22:46,200 --> 00:22:50,439
Speaker 1: you can save America's Home for home loans is American

380
00:22:50,600 --> 00:22:55,000
Speaker 1: Financing eight six six eight eight five ten eighty one.

381
00:22:55,160 --> 00:22:58,760
Speaker 1: That's eight six six eight eight five ten eighty one

382
00:22:59,080 --> 00:23:04,920
Speaker 1: or American Financing dot net slash the Chuck Toodcast. Important

383
00:23:04,960 --> 00:23:10,359
Speaker 1: disclaimer nm LS one A two three three four NMLS

384
00:23:10,400 --> 00:23:14,280
Speaker 1: Consumer Access dot Org APR for rates in the five

385
00:23:14,400 --> 00:23:17,120
Speaker 1: start at six point one ninety six percent for well

386
00:23:17,200 --> 00:23:20,480
Speaker 1: qualified buyers. Call eight six six eight eight five one

387
00:23:20,600 --> 00:23:23,880
Speaker 1: zero eight one for details about credit costs and terms,

388
00:23:24,040 --> 00:23:29,560
Speaker 1: or Americanfinancing dot net slash the Chucktodcast. Having good life

389
00:23:29,560 --> 00:23:33,719
Speaker 1: insurance is incredibly important. I know from personal experience. I

390
00:23:33,760 --> 00:23:35,960
Speaker 1: was sixteen when my father passed away. We didn't have

391
00:23:36,000 --> 00:23:39,040
Speaker 1: any money. He didn't leave us in the best shape.

392
00:23:39,080 --> 00:23:43,359
Speaker 1: My mother, single mother, now widow. Myself sixteen trying to

393
00:23:43,359 --> 00:23:45,040
Speaker 1: figure out how am I going to pay for college

394
00:23:45,480 --> 00:23:48,520
Speaker 1: and lo and behold, my dad had one life insurance

395
00:23:48,520 --> 00:23:51,480
Speaker 1: policy that we found wasn't a lot, but it was

396
00:23:51,520 --> 00:23:54,639
Speaker 1: important at the time, and it's why I was able

397
00:23:54,720 --> 00:23:58,080
Speaker 1: to go to college. Little did he know how important

398
00:23:58,119 --> 00:24:01,920
Speaker 1: that would be in that moment. Well, guess what. That's

399
00:24:01,960 --> 00:24:04,280
Speaker 1: why I am here to tell you about Ethos Life.

400
00:24:04,640 --> 00:24:07,000
Speaker 1: They can provide you with peace of mind knowing your

401
00:24:07,040 --> 00:24:10,320
Speaker 1: family is protected even if the worst comes to pass.

402
00:24:10,720 --> 00:24:13,960
Speaker 1: Ethos is an online platform that makes getting life insurance

403
00:24:14,000 --> 00:24:17,080
Speaker 1: fast and easy, all designed to protect your family's future

404
00:24:17,119 --> 00:24:20,640
Speaker 1: in minutes, not months. There's no complicated process, and it's

405
00:24:20,760 --> 00:24:24,959
Speaker 1: one hundred percent online. There's no medical exam require you

406
00:24:25,080 --> 00:24:27,520
Speaker 1: just answer a few health questions online. You can get

407
00:24:27,560 --> 00:24:29,240
Speaker 1: a quote in as little as ten minutes, and you

408
00:24:29,320 --> 00:24:33,040
Speaker 1: can get same day coverage without ever leaving your home.

409
00:24:33,760 --> 00:24:35,600
Speaker 1: You can get up to three million dollars in coverage,

410
00:24:35,640 --> 00:24:37,680
Speaker 1: and some policies start as low as two dollars a

411
00:24:37,760 --> 00:24:41,040
Speaker 1: day that would be billed monthly. As of March twenty

412
00:24:41,080 --> 00:24:44,080
Speaker 1: twenty five, Business Insider named Ethos the number one no

413
00:24:44,200 --> 00:24:48,600
Speaker 1: medical exam instant life insurance provider. So protect your family

414
00:24:49,080 --> 00:24:51,879
Speaker 1: with life insurance from Ethos. Get your free quote at

415
00:24:51,880 --> 00:24:56,160
Speaker 1: ethos dot com slash chuck. So again, that's Ethos dot

416
00:24:56,200 --> 00:25:00,800
Speaker 1: com slash chuck. Application times may vary and the rates

417
00:25:00,840 --> 00:25:04,200
Speaker 1: themselves may vary as well, but trust me. Life Insurance

418
00:25:04,240 --> 00:25:06,959
Speaker 1: is something you should really think about it, especially if

419
00:25:06,960 --> 00:25:13,119
Speaker 1: you've got a growing family. And then there's the tariff

420
00:25:13,160 --> 00:25:17,840
Speaker 1: mess where he's divided his own party, and of course,

421
00:25:17,920 --> 00:25:20,359
Speaker 1: you know, Mike Johnson has no control over it. He

422
00:25:20,520 --> 00:25:23,480
Speaker 1: is a speaker in name only. But the reason I

423
00:25:23,480 --> 00:25:25,480
Speaker 1: call him a spino a speaker in name only, is

424
00:25:25,520 --> 00:25:28,200
Speaker 1: because he can't even control the floor of the House

425
00:25:28,240 --> 00:25:33,159
Speaker 1: of Representatives. You know, normally control of the House of

426
00:25:33,200 --> 00:25:36,760
Speaker 1: Representatives is absolute right. You can have a one seat majority.

427
00:25:36,800 --> 00:25:39,680
Speaker 1: But if you're you're the organizing party. Because the speaker

428
00:25:40,080 --> 00:25:42,040
Speaker 1: has his own committee can decide what gets to the

429
00:25:42,080 --> 00:25:45,119
Speaker 1: floor and what doesn't. It's called the Rules Committee. But

430
00:25:45,200 --> 00:25:49,719
Speaker 1: of course the Rules Committee is how the cranky conservatives

431
00:25:49,720 --> 00:25:55,080
Speaker 1: that hated Kevin McCarthy and essentially created that drama having

432
00:25:55,080 --> 00:25:56,720
Speaker 1: to do who the hell was going to be speaker

433
00:25:57,359 --> 00:26:00,680
Speaker 1: the last time Republicans you know, back in and at

434
00:26:00,680 --> 00:26:04,800
Speaker 1: the start of at the start of twenty three, the

435
00:26:04,840 --> 00:26:08,680
Speaker 1: price of Mike Johnson becoming speaker was to give essentially

436
00:26:08,720 --> 00:26:14,760
Speaker 1: these cranky conservatives kind of the old Freedom Caucus guys

437
00:26:14,800 --> 00:26:18,880
Speaker 1: seats on the Rules Committee. And it is astonishing how

438
00:26:18,920 --> 00:26:22,920
Speaker 1: often that a handful of Republicans vote with the Democrats

439
00:26:23,160 --> 00:26:29,800
Speaker 1: and essentially screw the speaker and leadership on their ability

440
00:26:29,800 --> 00:26:34,440
Speaker 1: to control the floor, so they couldn't stop this procedural

441
00:26:34,560 --> 00:26:39,040
Speaker 1: vote on tariff. So what happened. Now You've got more

442
00:26:39,080 --> 00:26:41,439
Speaker 1: Republicans when the vote comes on the floor to repeal

443
00:26:41,480 --> 00:26:45,560
Speaker 1: tariffs on Canada, more Republicans have joined Democrats to repeal

444
00:26:45,600 --> 00:26:51,119
Speaker 1: those tariffs. All over the Midwest, these tariffs are enormously unpopular.

445
00:26:51,359 --> 00:26:53,600
Speaker 1: I mean, it has made the farm economy in Iowa.

446
00:26:53,800 --> 00:26:56,560
Speaker 1: Crater I shared with you a couple of weeks ago

447
00:26:56,560 --> 00:26:59,480
Speaker 1: how their GDP has dropped to fiftieth in the state

448
00:26:59,520 --> 00:27:03,000
Speaker 1: of the Union, in the out of fifty states they're

449
00:27:03,080 --> 00:27:05,600
Speaker 1: statewide GDP And it's all due to these tariffs and

450
00:27:05,640 --> 00:27:08,639
Speaker 1: what it's done to the farm economy and soybean's essentially

451
00:27:08,720 --> 00:27:13,000
Speaker 1: sitting there and not being bought by the Chinese in Michigan,

452
00:27:13,119 --> 00:27:15,600
Speaker 1: none of these the tariffs that they've put on these

453
00:27:15,640 --> 00:27:18,359
Speaker 1: auto parts. And then you've got Trump deciding he may

454
00:27:18,480 --> 00:27:22,640
Speaker 1: pull out of his version of NAFTA that he calls

455
00:27:22,640 --> 00:27:26,320
Speaker 1: the USMCA just completely pull out. Now, you know, as

456
00:27:26,359 --> 00:27:29,040
Speaker 1: I remind people all the time, with Trump, follow what

457
00:27:29,080 --> 00:27:32,080
Speaker 1: he does more than following. You should follow what he does,

458
00:27:32,160 --> 00:27:34,080
Speaker 1: not always what he says. He says a lot of stuff.

459
00:27:34,480 --> 00:27:36,800
Speaker 1: He talked about pulling out of the USMCA before, and

460
00:27:36,840 --> 00:27:41,119
Speaker 1: he ended up signing a new deal. But that would

461
00:27:41,119 --> 00:27:45,200
Speaker 1: be yet another gift to Democrats in an election year

462
00:27:45,920 --> 00:27:50,080
Speaker 1: if he totally up ends both the Texas and Michigan

463
00:27:50,200 --> 00:27:55,720
Speaker 1: economies and other economies by blowing up the USMCA. It's

464
00:27:55,760 --> 00:27:57,959
Speaker 1: a fair question to ask yourself. Does Donald Trump care

465
00:27:58,000 --> 00:28:01,359
Speaker 1: about the republic future of the Republican Party? I have

466
00:28:01,480 --> 00:28:05,320
Speaker 1: contended here he does not. If there is no president,

467
00:28:06,000 --> 00:28:10,520
Speaker 1: no Republican president elected after him, and while he's alive,

468
00:28:10,840 --> 00:28:13,320
Speaker 1: he will see that as a victory, not as a disappointment.

469
00:28:15,000 --> 00:28:16,760
Speaker 1: If he can make it clear that the only person

470
00:28:16,800 --> 00:28:20,200
Speaker 1: that can win as a Republican is Donald Trump, he'd

471
00:28:20,320 --> 00:28:25,000
Speaker 1: rather have that than to see the party grow. There

472
00:28:25,119 --> 00:28:30,000
Speaker 1: is a selfishness to him. He's got this huge financial

473
00:28:31,600 --> 00:28:35,680
Speaker 1: war chest that he's put together, all these different slush funds.

474
00:28:36,359 --> 00:28:37,800
Speaker 1: Is he actually going to how much of it is

475
00:28:37,800 --> 00:28:39,440
Speaker 1: he going to be willing to spend in the midterms.

476
00:28:40,440 --> 00:28:43,400
Speaker 1: Is he going to spend it to help elect Republicans

477
00:28:44,360 --> 00:28:46,480
Speaker 1: or is he going to spend it in order to

478
00:28:46,520 --> 00:28:50,120
Speaker 1: focus on his grievances, right, I mean, look at all

479
00:28:50,120 --> 00:28:54,080
Speaker 1: the money he's wasting against Thomas Massing in order to

480
00:28:54,120 --> 00:28:58,240
Speaker 1: deal with a grievance. Or look what he's done in Louisiana.

481
00:28:59,000 --> 00:29:02,600
Speaker 1: Now that's a safer way if he wanted to punish Cassidy.

482
00:29:02,800 --> 00:29:07,280
Speaker 1: I politically understand why he does. But he's lucky that

483
00:29:07,320 --> 00:29:12,600
Speaker 1: had John Bell Edwards, the last Democrats to win statewide

484
00:29:12,720 --> 00:29:15,320
Speaker 1: in Louisiana, decided not to run for Senate. Now, I

485
00:29:15,400 --> 00:29:19,240
Speaker 1: think it would be a big uphill battle, but that

486
00:29:19,280 --> 00:29:27,200
Speaker 1: could have thrown that race into it tizzy. It is

487
00:29:27,320 --> 00:29:32,360
Speaker 1: already hard enough for elected Republicans. And then the icing

488
00:29:32,400 --> 00:29:36,320
Speaker 1: on the cake this week. If you're an elected Republican

489
00:29:36,520 --> 00:29:40,160
Speaker 1: incumbent member of Congress, House or Senate, and you're trying

490
00:29:40,200 --> 00:29:42,560
Speaker 1: to make the case to voters re elect that because

491
00:29:42,600 --> 00:29:45,440
Speaker 1: we've got this great agenda, Donald Trump said no, no, no, no, no,

492
00:29:46,280 --> 00:29:49,479
Speaker 1: I want no legislation passed this year. He said no

493
00:29:49,560 --> 00:29:54,000
Speaker 1: to doing another reconciliation bill, which is an opportunity to

494
00:29:54,160 --> 00:29:57,160
Speaker 1: use your congressional majorities to get more of your agenda through.

495
00:29:57,880 --> 00:29:59,360
Speaker 1: He says, and oh, but I got everything I wanted

496
00:29:59,360 --> 00:30:02,040
Speaker 1: from the one big, a full bill. Well, that's good

497
00:30:02,080 --> 00:30:05,520
Speaker 1: for Donald Trump. That's a terrible message of Ryon, incumbent

498
00:30:05,560 --> 00:30:07,680
Speaker 1: member of Congress. Yeah, okay, you did that. What else

499
00:30:07,680 --> 00:30:09,840
Speaker 1: are you going to do? How come you didn't do

500
00:30:09,880 --> 00:30:14,640
Speaker 1: anything this year? What are these tariffs doing? He is

501
00:30:14,760 --> 00:30:19,400
Speaker 1: making it strategically forget just take your politics out of

502
00:30:19,440 --> 00:30:24,600
Speaker 1: it a second. Strategically, Republicans have an opportunity to put together,

503
00:30:25,120 --> 00:30:28,200
Speaker 1: you know, a party line bill of some sort. You know,

504
00:30:28,400 --> 00:30:30,680
Speaker 1: maybe they could put some stuff in there that creates

505
00:30:30,720 --> 00:30:36,160
Speaker 1: difficult votes for Democrats, but they don't know how to

506
00:30:36,640 --> 00:30:40,120
Speaker 1: do politics one on one sometimes, and you have amateur

507
00:30:40,160 --> 00:30:44,239
Speaker 1: hour speaker, you know, which is why you've seed like

508
00:30:44,600 --> 00:30:47,520
Speaker 1: it is it is. You know, if you if you

509
00:30:47,600 --> 00:30:50,600
Speaker 1: gave John Thune truth sirum and ask him what kind

510
00:30:50,600 --> 00:30:52,360
Speaker 1: of partner Mike Johnson is? I think he would say,

511
00:30:52,400 --> 00:30:55,120
Speaker 1: Mike Johnson's a nice guy who's weighing over his head.

512
00:30:57,640 --> 00:31:01,080
Speaker 1: And Donald Trump doesn't care. And the message he's sending

513
00:31:01,120 --> 00:31:03,880
Speaker 1: by no Reconciliation bill when he said no to doing

514
00:31:03,880 --> 00:31:05,760
Speaker 1: another bill, which a bunch of Republicans wanted to do,

515
00:31:05,840 --> 00:31:10,000
Speaker 1: is I really don't care about you. I don't care

516
00:31:10,000 --> 00:31:13,160
Speaker 1: if you have nothing to run on. You just should

517
00:31:13,240 --> 00:31:15,440
Speaker 1: just keep running on the one big beautiful bill. Okay,

518
00:31:16,280 --> 00:31:19,760
Speaker 1: look he got a good job report this week. By

519
00:31:19,800 --> 00:31:23,320
Speaker 1: the way, somebody ought to investigate. There's been some it's

520
00:31:23,440 --> 00:31:25,840
Speaker 1: really bizarre. And this is a little bit of an aside.

521
00:31:25,880 --> 00:31:31,400
Speaker 1: But Peter Navarro went on TV two days ago and said, Hey,

522
00:31:31,480 --> 00:31:34,160
Speaker 1: this job's report. You know we're gonna you know, don't

523
00:31:34,200 --> 00:31:36,960
Speaker 1: be prepared. This won't This may not be the best

524
00:31:37,000 --> 00:31:40,640
Speaker 1: first jobs report. We've had a lot of deportations, it's

525
00:31:40,640 --> 00:31:46,120
Speaker 1: having some there's some haywire. And then somebody made a

526
00:31:46,120 --> 00:31:48,480
Speaker 1: lot of money on Calshi making a prediction that the

527
00:31:48,560 --> 00:31:53,320
Speaker 1: job report was going to be a good job report. Somebody,

528
00:31:54,280 --> 00:31:57,600
Speaker 1: I'm going to ask the question, are there administration officials

529
00:31:58,760 --> 00:32:02,560
Speaker 1: that are saying certain things in public to move the

530
00:32:02,600 --> 00:32:07,880
Speaker 1: prediction markets one way so they can cash in on

531
00:32:07,960 --> 00:32:13,960
Speaker 1: them or their friends can cash in on them another way.

532
00:32:14,760 --> 00:32:17,920
Speaker 1: I'm not saying, I'm just saying, first of all, this

533
00:32:18,000 --> 00:32:23,000
Speaker 1: needs to be looked at. I mean literally, Peter Navarrow

534
00:32:23,040 --> 00:32:25,600
Speaker 1: went on TV downplaying that this wasn't going to be

535
00:32:25,600 --> 00:32:30,680
Speaker 1: a good jobs report, and it did affect the Calshie numbers.

536
00:32:31,880 --> 00:32:33,680
Speaker 1: If you watch if you go back and look at it,

537
00:32:34,160 --> 00:32:37,800
Speaker 1: go look at the at the line, and then all

538
00:32:37,840 --> 00:32:42,680
Speaker 1: of a sudden the number to go over the forecasted

539
00:32:42,760 --> 00:32:53,400
Speaker 1: number to make your bet. Somebody made some money either

540
00:32:53,440 --> 00:32:57,560
Speaker 1: hedging Peter Navarro's prediction or they knew damn well what

541
00:32:57,680 --> 00:33:02,040
Speaker 1: was going on. And this is why, folks, these prediction markets,

542
00:33:04,560 --> 00:33:09,640
Speaker 1: when somebody knows the answer, are extraordinarily corruptible. They're going

543
00:33:09,680 --> 00:33:13,120
Speaker 1: to be corruptible. Whether it's as silly as you know

544
00:33:13,200 --> 00:33:16,400
Speaker 1: what you know, how long will the Caroline Levitt press

545
00:33:16,400 --> 00:33:19,280
Speaker 1: briefing be the fact that you're allowed to bet on

546
00:33:19,320 --> 00:33:23,160
Speaker 1: that seems like something that shouldn't be allowed, or excuse me,

547
00:33:23,520 --> 00:33:29,480
Speaker 1: predict when you when you see something like this with

548
00:33:29,520 --> 00:33:32,600
Speaker 1: the jobs report, where literally Peter Navarro win on Fox

549
00:33:32,680 --> 00:33:36,880
Speaker 1: Business to downplay it, certainly sounded as if he already knew.

550
00:33:36,960 --> 00:33:39,360
Speaker 1: In fact, some of us, you know, you saw what

551
00:33:39,400 --> 00:33:42,080
Speaker 1: he said, and you're like, oh, I guess they're trying

552
00:33:42,120 --> 00:33:43,480
Speaker 1: to get ahead of what they think is going to

553
00:33:43,480 --> 00:33:46,400
Speaker 1: be a bad job report. Oh, by the way, why

554
00:33:46,440 --> 00:33:47,160
Speaker 1: is it leaking out?

555
00:33:47,200 --> 00:33:47,320
Speaker 2: Now?

556
00:33:47,320 --> 00:33:50,719
Speaker 1: Why do this many people know about it? It's supposed

557
00:33:50,720 --> 00:33:52,080
Speaker 1: to be embargo, it's supposed to be all that you're

558
00:33:52,080 --> 00:33:54,000
Speaker 1: not supposed to be able to move markets like this,

559
00:33:54,600 --> 00:33:57,200
Speaker 1: but then it turns out to the exact opposite. I'm

560
00:33:57,200 --> 00:34:01,480
Speaker 1: just asking questions to say, a lot of other people

561
00:34:01,520 --> 00:34:05,360
Speaker 1: need to be asking questions on this one. But it

562
00:34:05,400 --> 00:34:09,440
Speaker 1: was a good jobs number. It's good jobs report. That's it.

563
00:34:09,680 --> 00:34:13,120
Speaker 1: Maybe if it's sustainable, and maybe Republicans then run on

564
00:34:13,800 --> 00:34:17,239
Speaker 1: more money in people's pockets if it indeed actually gets

565
00:34:17,440 --> 00:34:20,959
Speaker 1: stay in their pockets. I think the concern I would

566
00:34:20,960 --> 00:34:23,759
Speaker 1: have as an incumbent Republican is that when these tax

567
00:34:23,800 --> 00:34:26,480
Speaker 1: rebates come and their tax refunds are there, that people

568
00:34:26,520 --> 00:34:31,400
Speaker 1: are frustrated that this incredible new refund all had to

569
00:34:31,440 --> 00:34:35,279
Speaker 1: go to paying for health care, higher electric bills, and

570
00:34:35,360 --> 00:34:40,239
Speaker 1: higher food costs, and the refund disappears even faster than

571
00:34:40,280 --> 00:34:44,000
Speaker 1: the refund they got a year ago. And how's that

572
00:34:44,040 --> 00:34:46,600
Speaker 1: going to make them feel? By June or July? Are

573
00:34:46,600 --> 00:34:50,000
Speaker 1: they going to love this economy? Then the point is

574
00:34:51,880 --> 00:34:55,000
Speaker 1: what Trump has done the congressional Republicans is he's basically

575
00:34:55,000 --> 00:35:00,920
Speaker 1: said it's either that or the party's doomed. Either. The

576
00:35:01,520 --> 00:35:05,000
Speaker 1: big tax rebates that come to people are excite the

577
00:35:05,200 --> 00:35:12,600
Speaker 1: electorate so much that it secures that makes people feel

578
00:35:12,640 --> 00:35:17,120
Speaker 1: better and that somehow this antagonism against Trump starts to dissipate.

579
00:35:20,120 --> 00:35:24,280
Speaker 1: Call me skeptical, but the bottom line is the biggest

580
00:35:24,320 --> 00:35:30,680
Speaker 1: impediment right now for congressional Republicans to keep their majorities

581
00:35:31,239 --> 00:35:34,279
Speaker 1: is their own president. He is standing in the way,

582
00:35:34,480 --> 00:35:39,239
Speaker 1: and if Democrats win the Senate, they might only have

583
00:35:39,320 --> 00:35:43,600
Speaker 1: Donald Trump to think considering how he's messed, how he's

584
00:35:43,680 --> 00:35:49,040
Speaker 1: made the map harder for his own party. It's quite

585
00:35:49,040 --> 00:35:51,640
Speaker 1: the feat. But again, if you know Donald Trump well

586
00:35:53,280 --> 00:35:55,680
Speaker 1: cares more about Trump than he does the Republican Party.

587
00:35:55,680 --> 00:35:58,880
Speaker 1: And it's something all Republicans need to be thinking about

588
00:35:59,560 --> 00:36:01,920
Speaker 1: because any of these folks are going to get elected

589
00:36:03,080 --> 00:36:07,520
Speaker 1: and in theory, be in office long after Donald Trump's

590
00:36:07,600 --> 00:36:10,719
Speaker 1: running the party. So the point is, you see more

591
00:36:10,719 --> 00:36:14,520
Speaker 1: Republicans willing to vote against him in Congress, more Republicans

592
00:36:14,560 --> 00:36:16,480
Speaker 1: willing to come out against them, and there's a reason

593
00:36:17,560 --> 00:36:21,799
Speaker 1: he's making their life harder. He's making their life a

594
00:36:21,840 --> 00:36:26,240
Speaker 1: lot harder. All right, I'm gonna pivot to Paul Rykoff

595
00:36:26,360 --> 00:36:33,960
Speaker 1: because you know, he's making a pitch for independence and

596
00:36:35,239 --> 00:36:38,640
Speaker 1: basically supporting a lot of independent candidates running for state

597
00:36:38,680 --> 00:36:44,000
Speaker 1: wide office but also running for local office. And you've

598
00:36:44,040 --> 00:36:46,360
Speaker 1: heard me say, look, you know, you've got to figure

599
00:36:46,360 --> 00:36:49,040
Speaker 1: out how to win the middle. But the question is

600
00:36:49,080 --> 00:36:51,200
Speaker 1: what is the middle? And can you be of the middle.

601
00:36:51,480 --> 00:36:58,719
Speaker 1: And I bring this up because I find it interesting

602
00:36:59,440 --> 00:37:02,680
Speaker 1: what happened in Japan over the week over last weekend

603
00:37:03,239 --> 00:37:08,680
Speaker 1: where the new prime minister basically she got she she

604
00:37:08,800 --> 00:37:14,040
Speaker 1: ended up with essentially veto proof majorities in her legislature,

605
00:37:17,680 --> 00:37:21,360
Speaker 1: and she ended up they her coalition did even better

606
00:37:21,400 --> 00:37:26,279
Speaker 1: than they thought, right, And what's interesting is that she

607
00:37:26,760 --> 00:37:30,520
Speaker 1: was able to defeat what was a centrist coalition right.

608
00:37:30,560 --> 00:37:35,640
Speaker 1: That Centrist for form alliance was basically a shotgun wedding

609
00:37:36,480 --> 00:37:40,760
Speaker 1: in Japan between the Constitutional Democratic Party and the Komu

610
00:37:41,120 --> 00:37:43,040
Speaker 1: Okay and it was sort of center left, center right,

611
00:37:43,200 --> 00:37:45,480
Speaker 1: was trying to trying to be a moderate alternative. And

612
00:37:45,520 --> 00:37:48,440
Speaker 1: we've seen this, this happened in Israel and for a

613
00:37:48,480 --> 00:37:51,799
Speaker 1: brief period of time a sort of model, a coalition

614
00:37:52,000 --> 00:37:55,200
Speaker 1: of the others, right, everybody who didn't like Bibi got

615
00:37:55,200 --> 00:37:57,800
Speaker 1: together and they were able to beat Bbe. But the

616
00:37:57,840 --> 00:38:01,960
Speaker 1: problem is they couldn't do anything after that. And it

617
00:38:02,040 --> 00:38:05,480
Speaker 1: is a reminder and I vacillate myself on this right,

618
00:38:05,520 --> 00:38:09,880
Speaker 1: which is when people call themselves independent, are they also

619
00:38:09,960 --> 00:38:13,719
Speaker 1: calling themselves centrist or moderate or are they simply saying, hey, no,

620
00:38:14,080 --> 00:38:18,080
Speaker 1: I'm independent, all right, you can't put me in any box.

621
00:38:18,520 --> 00:38:20,680
Speaker 1: It doesn't mean I don't say independent, because I'm only

622
00:38:20,680 --> 00:38:25,720
Speaker 1: in the centrist box. And the fact is the centrist

623
00:38:25,719 --> 00:38:30,359
Speaker 1: coalitions who have tried to sort of beat back a

624
00:38:30,400 --> 00:38:34,000
Speaker 1: populist or beat backup populasty have struggled. Right, We've seen

625
00:38:34,000 --> 00:38:37,279
Speaker 1: it in this country, right, You've got a coalition of

626
00:38:37,320 --> 00:38:39,560
Speaker 1: AOC and Liz Cheney wanting to get rid of Donald

627
00:38:39,600 --> 00:38:43,719
Speaker 1: Trump and trump Ism. But what the hell does this

628
00:38:43,760 --> 00:38:48,600
Speaker 1: opposition to Trump stand for other than not being for Trump, right,

629
00:38:48,600 --> 00:38:52,680
Speaker 1: being anti Trump? And so I think the real challenge,

630
00:38:53,440 --> 00:38:55,920
Speaker 1: and Paul and I get into this a little bit.

631
00:38:55,920 --> 00:38:58,080
Speaker 1: I think the real challenge for this movement of independence

632
00:38:58,080 --> 00:39:00,759
Speaker 1: because as you know, like I think the parties are

633
00:39:00,840 --> 00:39:03,799
Speaker 1: hurting us more than they're helping us right now. I

634
00:39:03,800 --> 00:39:05,759
Speaker 1: think the country would be better served either if we

635
00:39:05,800 --> 00:39:09,440
Speaker 1: had no parties or we had four national parties. Trying

636
00:39:09,440 --> 00:39:12,919
Speaker 1: to fit everybody into two parties is quite difficult, right,

637
00:39:13,440 --> 00:39:16,239
Speaker 1: you know, It's like going to the store T shirt

638
00:39:16,280 --> 00:39:19,040
Speaker 1: store and finding out the only choices are you know,

639
00:39:19,320 --> 00:39:23,239
Speaker 1: extra small and extra large, and you're like, I wear

640
00:39:23,320 --> 00:39:24,520
Speaker 1: something somewhere in between.

641
00:39:24,560 --> 00:39:24,759
Speaker 2: There.

642
00:39:28,480 --> 00:39:32,960
Speaker 1: I absolutely think our politics would be easier to understand

643
00:39:33,040 --> 00:39:36,839
Speaker 1: and we'd have more successful coalition politics is if we

644
00:39:36,840 --> 00:39:40,640
Speaker 1: were correctly in our four parties, where there were no

645
00:39:40,680 --> 00:39:42,640
Speaker 1: party could ever get control on their own, they had

646
00:39:42,640 --> 00:39:47,000
Speaker 1: to work with one of the other three parties. But

647
00:39:47,040 --> 00:39:50,520
Speaker 1: this is the world we're in, and it is and

648
00:39:50,560 --> 00:39:53,520
Speaker 1: I think that it's a fair debate, and I like

649
00:39:53,560 --> 00:39:56,600
Speaker 1: I say, I vacillated on this political you know, political

650
00:39:56,640 --> 00:39:58,680
Speaker 1: science will tell you that if you're in the if

651
00:39:58,719 --> 00:40:02,719
Speaker 1: you're sort of in the mushy middle, you're not going

652
00:40:02,760 --> 00:40:07,000
Speaker 1: to please anybody. And yet if you alienate the middle,

653
00:40:07,120 --> 00:40:11,560
Speaker 1: that's how you lose races. Right, So the question is

654
00:40:11,680 --> 00:40:14,120
Speaker 1: it better to try to appeal to the middle or

655
00:40:14,160 --> 00:40:16,800
Speaker 1: to force the middle to come to your side because

656
00:40:16,800 --> 00:40:20,360
Speaker 1: they just can't stomach the other side? And what is

657
00:40:20,400 --> 00:40:28,759
Speaker 1: a more durable governing coalition. I think we've seen, you know,

658
00:40:29,320 --> 00:40:33,919
Speaker 1: the Cold War era allowed both parties to be more

659
00:40:34,000 --> 00:40:39,239
Speaker 1: centrist once and because there was the concern about security

660
00:40:40,200 --> 00:40:43,960
Speaker 1: and security of the country and nuclear war and war

661
00:40:44,000 --> 00:40:49,920
Speaker 1: with the Soviets, and so it sort of it it's

662
00:40:49,920 --> 00:40:52,759
Speaker 1: the public sort of was comfortable, sort of staying in

663
00:40:52,800 --> 00:40:56,880
Speaker 1: between the thirty five yard lines. Once that threat ended,

664
00:40:57,880 --> 00:41:05,760
Speaker 1: we saw more of our colorful spectrum of political ideology

665
00:41:06,719 --> 00:41:11,279
Speaker 1: on display. And I think it's a fair I think

666
00:41:11,320 --> 00:41:14,640
Speaker 1: it's a fair debate. Can you know, so, if you're

667
00:41:14,680 --> 00:41:16,400
Speaker 1: going to try to win as an independent, you've got

668
00:41:16,440 --> 00:41:20,840
Speaker 1: to stand for something, not just stand for compromise. And

669
00:41:20,880 --> 00:41:22,480
Speaker 1: I think this has been the that was sort of

670
00:41:22,480 --> 00:41:25,080
Speaker 1: the mistake of twenty twenty and the mistake of the

671
00:41:25,080 --> 00:41:29,200
Speaker 1: Democrats in the Trump era of assuming what people wanted

672
00:41:29,400 --> 00:41:32,279
Speaker 1: was was more compromised. They didn't want that, right, They

673
00:41:32,719 --> 00:41:34,480
Speaker 1: they didn't like the old way of politics. They wanted

674
00:41:34,520 --> 00:41:38,040
Speaker 1: a new way of politics. And Democrats were doing restoration

675
00:41:38,680 --> 00:41:40,239
Speaker 1: and Donald Trump was saying, no, We're going to try

676
00:41:40,239 --> 00:41:43,520
Speaker 1: something different. And ultimately they want a different not restoration.

677
00:41:45,920 --> 00:41:51,279
Speaker 1: And yet Democrats can't win majorities in the House and

678
00:41:51,320 --> 00:41:54,319
Speaker 1: the Senate without winning over the middle. So what is

679
00:41:54,360 --> 00:41:57,000
Speaker 1: the best way to win the middle? I have to say,

680
00:41:57,040 --> 00:41:59,960
Speaker 1: I think that's still an open question, and there are

681
00:42:00,160 --> 00:42:04,279
Speaker 1: various theories of the case, and I think it's going

682
00:42:04,320 --> 00:42:06,840
Speaker 1: to be a conversation. We're going to continue, but for

683
00:42:06,920 --> 00:42:09,840
Speaker 1: right now, the conversation I'm going to have on this

684
00:42:10,000 --> 00:42:12,520
Speaker 1: issue is with my friend Paul Rykoff, and we're going

685
00:42:12,600 --> 00:42:17,880
Speaker 1: to talk to him right after this break. This episode

686
00:42:17,920 --> 00:42:20,400
Speaker 1: of the Chuck Podcast is being brought to you by Quints.

687
00:42:20,520 --> 00:42:22,880
Speaker 1: As you know, a well built wardrobe is about the

688
00:42:22,920 --> 00:42:25,720
Speaker 1: pieces that work together, hold up over time, and frankly

689
00:42:25,800 --> 00:42:29,160
Speaker 1: allow you to be flexible and sort of business casual,

690
00:42:29,360 --> 00:42:32,880
Speaker 1: to say social casual. Quints does this really well. They

691
00:42:32,920 --> 00:42:36,520
Speaker 1: have premium material, thoughtful design, and some everyday staples that

692
00:42:36,600 --> 00:42:39,200
Speaker 1: feel easy to wear, easy to rely on even as

693
00:42:39,239 --> 00:42:42,359
Speaker 1: the weather shifts. I've got some sweaters from Quints. I

694
00:42:42,440 --> 00:42:45,239
Speaker 1: love them. I can use them for here on the podcast.

695
00:42:45,280 --> 00:42:47,239
Speaker 1: I can do a business meeting with them. They have

696
00:42:47,280 --> 00:42:49,960
Speaker 1: every day essentials. I love the quality so far. It's

697
00:42:50,040 --> 00:42:52,040
Speaker 1: lasting really well. I've had it for a while. They

698
00:42:52,120 --> 00:42:55,000
Speaker 1: have organic cotton sweaters, polos for every occasion. They have

699
00:42:55,040 --> 00:42:58,360
Speaker 1: some nice jackets, including you know, lighter jackets as things

700
00:42:58,560 --> 00:43:00,680
Speaker 1: I hope warm up at some point here in the

701
00:43:00,719 --> 00:43:02,759
Speaker 1: mid Atlantic. The list goes on. All of it is

702
00:43:02,800 --> 00:43:05,080
Speaker 1: built to hold up for you to wear this stuff

703
00:43:05,120 --> 00:43:07,680
Speaker 1: all the time, right, Not just something you pull out

704
00:43:07,719 --> 00:43:10,400
Speaker 1: once a quarter to look nice at work. No stuff

705
00:43:10,440 --> 00:43:12,520
Speaker 1: that you might wear every week. They only partner with

706
00:43:12,560 --> 00:43:17,600
Speaker 1: factories that meet some rigorous standards for crashmanship and ethical product.

707
00:43:17,680 --> 00:43:20,560
Speaker 1: Bottom line, I wear it, I'm happy. It's been really good.

708
00:43:20,719 --> 00:43:23,920
Speaker 1: It isn't going to break the bank, So refresh your

709
00:43:23,960 --> 00:43:27,479
Speaker 1: wardrobe with Quints. Go to quins dot com slash chuck

710
00:43:27,840 --> 00:43:30,480
Speaker 1: for free shipping on your order and a three hundred

711
00:43:30,480 --> 00:43:33,600
Speaker 1: and sixty five day opportunity to return it. Now available

712
00:43:33,600 --> 00:43:38,800
Speaker 1: in Canada too. That's qui nc dot com slash chuck,

713
00:43:38,960 --> 00:43:41,960
Speaker 1: free shipping, three hundred and sixty five day returns quints

714
00:43:42,040 --> 00:43:46,560
Speaker 1: dot com slash chuck. Do you hate hangovers, We'll say

715
00:43:46,600 --> 00:43:49,160
Speaker 1: goodbye to hangovers. Out of Office gives you the social

716
00:43:49,239 --> 00:43:51,879
Speaker 1: buzz without the next day regret. They're best selling out

717
00:43:51,880 --> 00:43:54,840
Speaker 1: of office. Gumpanies were designed to provide a mild, relaxing buzz,

718
00:43:54,960 --> 00:43:58,479
Speaker 1: boost your mood and enhance creativity and relaxation. With five

719
00:43:58,520 --> 00:44:01,240
Speaker 1: different strengths, you can tailor the do to fit your vibe.

720
00:44:01,280 --> 00:44:05,359
Speaker 1: From a gentle one point five milligram microdose to their

721
00:44:05,400 --> 00:44:09,359
Speaker 1: newest fifteen milligram gummy for a more elevated experience. Their

722
00:44:09,400 --> 00:44:13,239
Speaker 1: THHC beverages and gummies are a modern, mindful alternative to

723
00:44:13,280 --> 00:44:15,600
Speaker 1: a glass of wine or a cocktail. And I'll tell

724
00:44:15,600 --> 00:44:18,799
Speaker 1: you this, I've given up booze. I don't like the hangovers.

725
00:44:19,000 --> 00:44:22,640
Speaker 1: I prefer the gummy experience. Soul is a wellness brand

726
00:44:22,640 --> 00:44:25,520
Speaker 1: that believes feeling good should be fun and easy. Soul

727
00:44:25,600 --> 00:44:29,600
Speaker 1: specializes in delicious hemp derived THC and CBD products, all

728
00:44:29,640 --> 00:44:32,759
Speaker 1: designed to boost your mood and simply help you unwine.

729
00:44:32,960 --> 00:44:35,040
Speaker 1: So if you struggle to switch off at night, Soul

730
00:44:35,080 --> 00:44:38,000
Speaker 1: also has a variety of products specifically designed to just

731
00:44:38,040 --> 00:44:40,600
Speaker 1: simply help you get a better night's sleep, including their

732
00:44:40,640 --> 00:44:43,840
Speaker 1: top selling Sleepy gummies. It's a fan favorite for deep,

733
00:44:44,040 --> 00:44:46,919
Speaker 1: restorative sleep. So bring on the good vibes and treat

734
00:44:46,960 --> 00:44:50,400
Speaker 1: yourself to Sold today. Right now, Soul is offering my

735
00:44:50,480 --> 00:44:53,719
Speaker 1: audience thirty percent off your entire order, So go to

736
00:44:53,760 --> 00:44:57,760
Speaker 1: getsold dot Com use the promo code toodcast. Don't forget

737
00:44:57,800 --> 00:45:01,920
Speaker 1: that code. That's getsold dot Com promo code toodcast for

738
00:45:02,040 --> 00:45:08,960
Speaker 1: thirty percent off and joining me now is somebody I've

739
00:45:09,000 --> 00:45:13,400
Speaker 1: known a long time. Somebody that I've would feature as

740
00:45:13,480 --> 00:45:17,520
Speaker 1: much as possible in my NBC days. He is founder

741
00:45:17,560 --> 00:45:23,279
Speaker 1: of the Iraq and Afghanistan Veterans of America. He had

742
00:45:23,280 --> 00:45:26,320
Speaker 1: been a fierce advocate and still is a fierce advocate

743
00:45:26,840 --> 00:45:32,160
Speaker 1: for veterans when it appears the VA is not giving

744
00:45:32,200 --> 00:45:35,800
Speaker 1: our returning soldiers the care and attention that they need.

745
00:45:36,640 --> 00:45:40,640
Speaker 1: An he owes a terrific podcast Independence that's focused really

746
00:45:40,800 --> 00:45:43,840
Speaker 1: on as he calls himself the angry middle, or he

747
00:45:43,840 --> 00:45:46,279
Speaker 1: wants to be representative of the angry middle. As you know,

748
00:45:46,360 --> 00:45:50,640
Speaker 1: that's sort of I think of politics from the middle out.

749
00:45:50,719 --> 00:45:56,239
Speaker 1: I call myself an incrementalist. Paul calls himself an independent

750
00:45:56,400 --> 00:45:59,160
Speaker 1: representing the angry middle. So that's going to be a

751
00:45:59,200 --> 00:46:01,560
Speaker 1: lion's share of our conversation. We did a home and away.

752
00:46:01,560 --> 00:46:05,719
Speaker 1: I was in his podcast earlier this month, so I

753
00:46:05,760 --> 00:46:08,600
Speaker 1: appreciate him return in the favor of me. Mister Raikoff.

754
00:46:08,640 --> 00:46:10,240
Speaker 1: Good to see man, Good.

755
00:46:10,000 --> 00:46:12,759
Speaker 3: To see you, Chuck. I really appreciated you coming on mine.

756
00:46:12,760 --> 00:46:15,480
Speaker 3: We had a great Super Bowl conversation too, Yeah we did.

757
00:46:15,920 --> 00:46:17,759
Speaker 2: But folks, here you talk about politics, but when you

758
00:46:17,760 --> 00:46:19,560
Speaker 2: talk about football it's even better.

759
00:46:19,680 --> 00:46:23,120
Speaker 1: I mean, well, you know, I maybe even pocketed a

760
00:46:23,120 --> 00:46:26,839
Speaker 1: couple of bucks with a very conventional wisdom. Super Bowl,

761
00:46:26,920 --> 00:46:28,920
Speaker 1: it sort of went exactly like every expert said it

762
00:46:28,920 --> 00:46:29,239
Speaker 1: would go.

763
00:46:29,800 --> 00:46:31,800
Speaker 2: You know, yeah, it was also you know, it was

764
00:46:31,840 --> 00:46:33,640
Speaker 2: a really good team super Bowl, and.

765
00:46:33,600 --> 00:46:36,080
Speaker 3: Maybe that's more of what we need in America right now.

766
00:46:36,080 --> 00:46:38,680
Speaker 3: I mean, it was old school blocking and tackling. I

767
00:46:38,719 --> 00:46:40,440
Speaker 3: told my sons, like, even though I've got two young

768
00:46:40,480 --> 00:46:43,359
Speaker 3: boys who play football, that was the best blocking game

769
00:46:43,440 --> 00:46:44,919
Speaker 3: I've seen in a long time.

770
00:46:44,960 --> 00:46:47,360
Speaker 2: Seattle is a really good blocking.

771
00:46:46,920 --> 00:46:49,640
Speaker 3: Team working together eleven people, and that's kind of more

772
00:46:49,719 --> 00:46:51,200
Speaker 3: what we need in America right now.

773
00:46:51,560 --> 00:46:54,879
Speaker 1: Well that, well, this is why I'm I've always been

774
00:46:54,920 --> 00:46:58,400
Speaker 1: a such a huge advocate of football, almost more so

775
00:46:58,480 --> 00:47:02,560
Speaker 1: than every other team sport, because you know, you really

776
00:47:02,640 --> 00:47:05,880
Speaker 1: have to row in the same direction. You have to

777
00:47:05,920 --> 00:47:09,160
Speaker 1: have eleven guys doing their job. You cannot. You can.

778
00:47:09,400 --> 00:47:12,560
Speaker 1: You can have a basketball team where four guys slack off,

779
00:47:12,960 --> 00:47:14,680
Speaker 1: you can have a baseball team where there a few

780
00:47:14,719 --> 00:47:17,440
Speaker 1: guys slack off. You cannot have it in football. And

781
00:47:17,480 --> 00:47:22,759
Speaker 1: it's just it is such an important life skill to

782
00:47:22,840 --> 00:47:25,480
Speaker 1: get across, which is why I'm happy to see flag football,

783
00:47:26,080 --> 00:47:30,440
Speaker 1: which creates more gender opportunities gender equity there. I mean,

784
00:47:30,600 --> 00:47:33,319
Speaker 1: I just think the whole concept of football is so

785
00:47:34,360 --> 00:47:38,399
Speaker 1: team oriented. More so that it is. It is a

786
00:47:37,280 --> 00:47:39,200
Speaker 1: great teaching tool.

787
00:47:39,840 --> 00:47:43,200
Speaker 3: Yeah, it requires selflessness at a time when most sports

788
00:47:43,239 --> 00:47:47,120
Speaker 3: are really about individuals. And look at me, and you know,

789
00:47:47,120 --> 00:47:49,920
Speaker 3: I've coached football for many years, played football, played in college,

790
00:47:50,200 --> 00:47:50,720
Speaker 3: and I don't.

791
00:47:50,520 --> 00:47:52,080
Speaker 2: Think that there's anything like it because.

792
00:47:51,920 --> 00:47:56,120
Speaker 3: It requires sacrifice, it requires teamwork, it requires cooperation, it

793
00:47:56,160 --> 00:48:01,240
Speaker 3: requires forward planning. It's obviously strategic in terms of field position.

794
00:48:01,080 --> 00:48:03,080
Speaker 2: And all the other elements. But I think it's the

795
00:48:03,160 --> 00:48:03,879
Speaker 2: ultimate team game.

796
00:48:03,920 --> 00:48:06,080
Speaker 3: And I've played rugby, I've played baseball, I've coached a

797
00:48:06,080 --> 00:48:08,440
Speaker 3: lot of sports. It's very hard to teach young people

798
00:48:08,600 --> 00:48:11,480
Speaker 3: because it's so complicated, but I think it really instills

799
00:48:11,520 --> 00:48:15,080
Speaker 3: the values, and I think it reflects the cooperation and

800
00:48:15,120 --> 00:48:16,480
Speaker 3: teamwork we need in democracy.

801
00:48:16,520 --> 00:48:18,080
Speaker 2: You know, football is a lot like democracy.

802
00:48:18,239 --> 00:48:19,960
Speaker 3: If we don't figure out a way to work together,

803
00:48:20,360 --> 00:48:22,320
Speaker 3: things can get brutal real quick. And I feel like

804
00:48:22,360 --> 00:48:25,600
Speaker 3: our democracy looks like Drake may under constant pressure and

805
00:48:25,600 --> 00:48:26,680
Speaker 3: getting hit from all sides.

806
00:48:26,760 --> 00:48:29,840
Speaker 1: Oh right, we have no left side of the offensive line.

807
00:48:30,200 --> 00:48:32,919
Speaker 2: Right that four guys, I mean the left side's gone,

808
00:48:33,000 --> 00:48:34,960
Speaker 2: the right side's gone, and we got to depend on

809
00:48:35,000 --> 00:48:35,400
Speaker 2: the middle.

810
00:48:36,160 --> 00:48:39,640
Speaker 1: Hey, before we leave football, since you have coached it

811
00:48:39,680 --> 00:48:42,560
Speaker 1: and you watch it in a way that's probably not

812
00:48:42,680 --> 00:48:46,120
Speaker 1: just from a fan perspective. It really does seem like

813
00:48:46,160 --> 00:48:50,160
Speaker 1: in the last forty eight months, both in college and

814
00:48:50,200 --> 00:48:53,520
Speaker 1: the pros, which is defense is not just caught up

815
00:48:53,560 --> 00:48:56,520
Speaker 1: to offense. But I think we're now in a mode.

816
00:48:56,560 --> 00:48:59,560
Speaker 1: I mean, it was you look at the college football

817
00:48:59,560 --> 00:49:03,240
Speaker 1: playoffs and look Miami and Indiana one because of their defense.

818
00:49:03,239 --> 00:49:05,360
Speaker 1: That's why they got to that finals. You know it

819
00:49:05,560 --> 00:49:09,000
Speaker 1: was and you could say, well, look, you know, if

820
00:49:09,400 --> 00:49:12,120
Speaker 1: a little better offensive performance by Miami, maybe they win

821
00:49:12,200 --> 00:49:15,239
Speaker 1: that game. But the point being is that the defenses

822
00:49:15,480 --> 00:49:18,080
Speaker 1: were the dominant. You know, Ole Miss didn't have one.

823
00:49:18,360 --> 00:49:21,040
Speaker 1: That's why they They were limited in how far they

824
00:49:21,040 --> 00:49:25,200
Speaker 1: could go. And we see it in what happened in

825
00:49:25,520 --> 00:49:28,720
Speaker 1: the NFL this year, where it was the defensive teams

826
00:49:29,080 --> 00:49:32,480
Speaker 1: and by the way, two defensive coaches making it to

827
00:49:32,520 --> 00:49:34,400
Speaker 1: the Super Bowl, which might be a first.

828
00:49:35,520 --> 00:49:36,799
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'd build on that.

829
00:49:36,880 --> 00:49:39,399
Speaker 3: I mean, you know, defense gets you to the championship,

830
00:49:39,440 --> 00:49:42,040
Speaker 3: but defense is not the difference in the championship. And

831
00:49:42,040 --> 00:49:44,359
Speaker 3: I think We've seen that in both the college game

832
00:49:44,400 --> 00:49:46,120
Speaker 3: and in the pro game. And what I would tell

833
00:49:46,120 --> 00:49:48,600
Speaker 3: you is it ultimately comes down to leadership, and it

834
00:49:48,680 --> 00:49:51,120
Speaker 3: ultimately comes down to the quarterback, and it comes down

835
00:49:51,200 --> 00:49:54,120
Speaker 3: to the quarterback. Who's not going to make the great play,

836
00:49:54,160 --> 00:49:56,520
Speaker 3: but the quarterback makes the bad play. And we saw

837
00:49:56,560 --> 00:49:59,000
Speaker 3: that in the Indiana game. You know, and your Carson

838
00:49:59,040 --> 00:49:59,680
Speaker 3: Beck I was not.

839
00:49:59,640 --> 00:50:03,280
Speaker 1: Re He had a bad play and Mendoza.

840
00:50:01,280 --> 00:50:04,479
Speaker 3: Did everything else being equal, if Carson Beck makes those

841
00:50:04,520 --> 00:50:07,560
Speaker 3: plays and Mendosa doesn't, it goes the other way. Drake

842
00:50:07,600 --> 00:50:10,040
Speaker 3: may had an opportunity to make the game close. You know,

843
00:50:10,200 --> 00:50:12,439
Speaker 3: in the third quarter, he throws a pick. He makes

844
00:50:12,440 --> 00:50:15,240
Speaker 3: some bad throws. So I think it really there's nothing

845
00:50:15,320 --> 00:50:17,480
Speaker 3: like being a quarterback on a football field. In leadership,

846
00:50:17,480 --> 00:50:19,920
Speaker 3: it's kind of like elected office or an executive function.

847
00:50:20,000 --> 00:50:22,560
Speaker 3: You think about a president or a governor. It's all

848
00:50:22,560 --> 00:50:25,160
Speaker 3: eyes on the quarterback. And the quarterback is important too,

849
00:50:25,200 --> 00:50:27,080
Speaker 3: because he doesn't just have to know his job.

850
00:50:27,120 --> 00:50:28,200
Speaker 2: He has to know all.

851
00:50:28,160 --> 00:50:31,360
Speaker 3: Eleven people's jobs every single time and has to be

852
00:50:31,400 --> 00:50:34,960
Speaker 3: the ultimate coordinator. That's why, frankly, I'm excited about Mendoza

853
00:50:35,080 --> 00:50:37,240
Speaker 3: as a role model for our culture.

854
00:50:37,360 --> 00:50:39,800
Speaker 2: If this kid runs for political office, and I hope.

855
00:50:39,640 --> 00:50:42,640
Speaker 3: He runs as an independent, He's exactly the kind of

856
00:50:42,680 --> 00:50:46,480
Speaker 3: leader that people need. He's selfless, he's humble, he's kind.

857
00:50:47,120 --> 00:50:49,040
Speaker 3: He's an example of the kind of leader that we need.

858
00:50:49,080 --> 00:50:52,919
Speaker 3: I'm glad that he especially was elevated during this last

859
00:50:52,920 --> 00:50:53,520
Speaker 3: couple of weeks.

860
00:50:53,800 --> 00:50:56,719
Speaker 1: I'm with you, there's something you know. Sometimes some guys

861
00:50:56,719 --> 00:50:58,120
Speaker 1: are too good to be true, and you're like, boy,

862
00:50:58,120 --> 00:51:02,600
Speaker 1: I hope I'm not missing something here. Let me go

863
00:51:02,960 --> 00:51:05,040
Speaker 1: a little bit. I know a little bit of your

864
00:51:05,040 --> 00:51:08,960
Speaker 1: origin story, but I don't know if all my listeners do.

865
00:51:10,640 --> 00:51:12,799
Speaker 1: How did you get into the military, Why did you

866
00:51:14,239 --> 00:51:18,719
Speaker 1: and this is what you're doing now? What's an alternative

867
00:51:18,840 --> 00:51:21,480
Speaker 1: path that you thought you'd be doing twenty years ago?

868
00:51:23,160 --> 00:51:23,560
Speaker 2: Wow?

869
00:51:24,000 --> 00:51:27,480
Speaker 3: Well, twenty years ago, I guess I was already out

870
00:51:27,480 --> 00:51:31,640
Speaker 3: of college and the football dream was gone. But you know,

871
00:51:32,200 --> 00:51:34,960
Speaker 3: I did not expect this kind of winding path. But

872
00:51:35,000 --> 00:51:37,120
Speaker 3: it started with my time in the military, and it

873
00:51:37,160 --> 00:51:38,320
Speaker 3: started with a sense of service.

874
00:51:38,680 --> 00:51:40,400
Speaker 2: My father was drafted during Vietnam.

875
00:51:40,480 --> 00:51:43,200
Speaker 3: My grandfather was drafted during World War Two and spent

876
00:51:43,239 --> 00:51:45,319
Speaker 3: three years in the South Pacific, And I thought that

877
00:51:45,440 --> 00:51:47,319
Speaker 3: was how everybody's family was when I was growing up,

878
00:51:47,320 --> 00:51:50,560
Speaker 3: your third generation, I am, but you know I was

879
00:51:50,560 --> 00:51:53,000
Speaker 3: the first to volunteer, which I think is also a

880
00:51:53,040 --> 00:51:55,560
Speaker 3: reflection of our times, right. I mean, I came from

881
00:51:55,600 --> 00:51:58,440
Speaker 3: an immigrant family. My grandfather immigrated from Germany and spoke

882
00:51:58,480 --> 00:52:01,680
Speaker 3: no English. My grandmother and the other side came from Hungary.

883
00:52:01,400 --> 00:52:04,760
Speaker 2: And spoke no English. But that generation they all served.

884
00:52:04,760 --> 00:52:09,200
Speaker 3: My other grandmother had eleven brothers and sisters had nine brothers.

885
00:52:09,239 --> 00:52:12,480
Speaker 3: All nine brothers served, all Italian Americans from the Bronx.

886
00:52:12,680 --> 00:52:13,840
Speaker 2: They all served.

887
00:52:13,880 --> 00:52:16,520
Speaker 3: So I came from a community and a family and

888
00:52:16,560 --> 00:52:20,000
Speaker 3: a working class background where service was pretty much expected.

889
00:52:20,680 --> 00:52:22,160
Speaker 3: I was the first one that didn't have to go,

890
00:52:22,200 --> 00:52:23,800
Speaker 3: but I wanted to go. I wanted to give back.

891
00:52:23,920 --> 00:52:26,440
Speaker 3: I wanted I felt like I owed it to my

892
00:52:26,640 --> 00:52:28,520
Speaker 3: family and to my community and to my country.

893
00:52:28,760 --> 00:52:30,480
Speaker 2: Because I was the first one that didn't have to go.

894
00:52:30,520 --> 00:52:32,480
Speaker 3: I got to go to college, I got to play football,

895
00:52:33,000 --> 00:52:35,360
Speaker 3: I got a great education. But I really wanted to

896
00:52:35,360 --> 00:52:37,400
Speaker 3: give something back, and it came down to either the

897
00:52:37,440 --> 00:52:39,120
Speaker 3: Peace Corps or the military.

898
00:52:39,200 --> 00:52:41,200
Speaker 2: I viewed them both as ways to give back.

899
00:52:41,480 --> 00:52:43,160
Speaker 3: And the military, you know, I wanted to jump out

900
00:52:43,160 --> 00:52:45,640
Speaker 3: of airplanes and blow stuff up. And I also wanted

901
00:52:45,640 --> 00:52:47,359
Speaker 3: to challenge myself in a way that I had never

902
00:52:47,400 --> 00:52:48,640
Speaker 3: been tested before.

903
00:52:48,880 --> 00:52:51,520
Speaker 2: And I think I got a lot of that. But

904
00:52:51,600 --> 00:52:55,600
Speaker 2: it also sparked in me in understanding that politics.

905
00:52:55,280 --> 00:52:58,360
Speaker 3: Impacts all of us, and maybe no more so acutely

906
00:52:58,400 --> 00:53:00,560
Speaker 3: than when you're in the military. There's nothing more serious

907
00:53:00,560 --> 00:53:02,479
Speaker 3: our politics can do than send young men and women

908
00:53:02,520 --> 00:53:05,120
Speaker 3: to war. And that's what pulled me into activism, and

909
00:53:05,160 --> 00:53:08,040
Speaker 3: that's what pulled me into this work, and frankly.

910
00:53:08,000 --> 00:53:08,960
Speaker 2: Still drives me. Now.

911
00:53:09,239 --> 00:53:10,800
Speaker 3: I want to fight for our country. I want to

912
00:53:10,800 --> 00:53:13,200
Speaker 3: fight for our democracy in whatever way I can. And

913
00:53:13,280 --> 00:53:16,400
Speaker 3: instead of a rifle, now I've got a microphone.

914
00:53:17,080 --> 00:53:19,440
Speaker 1: What kind of scarred at Vietnam? Leave for your father?

915
00:53:20,040 --> 00:53:22,400
Speaker 1: Because Vietnam scarred my father and he didn't serve, and

916
00:53:22,560 --> 00:53:24,839
Speaker 1: I'll tell you the story in a minute, But what

917
00:53:24,920 --> 00:53:26,040
Speaker 1: kind of scar did that lead?

918
00:53:26,320 --> 00:53:27,759
Speaker 2: So my father got very lucky.

919
00:53:27,800 --> 00:53:30,440
Speaker 3: He got drafted in nineteen sixty eight, but did not

920
00:53:30,520 --> 00:53:32,560
Speaker 3: get sent to Vietnam, So he got sent to Europe.

921
00:53:33,239 --> 00:53:35,320
Speaker 3: But you know, plenty of his buddies in the Bronx,

922
00:53:35,400 --> 00:53:37,160
Speaker 3: you know, were killed. Guys he went to high school.

923
00:53:37,440 --> 00:53:41,200
Speaker 3: He always told me the story of when how he

924
00:53:41,239 --> 00:53:44,759
Speaker 3: found out he was getting drafted. My grandfather pulled out

925
00:53:44,800 --> 00:53:47,280
Speaker 3: an envelope and he felt in the bottom of the envelope.

926
00:53:47,280 --> 00:53:48,800
Speaker 3: It was from the government, and there was a subway

927
00:53:48,840 --> 00:53:51,320
Speaker 3: token in it, and if you felt the subway token,

928
00:53:51,400 --> 00:53:53,879
Speaker 3: you knew you were getting drafted. And my grandfather looked

929
00:53:53,880 --> 00:53:57,520
Speaker 3: at my father and said, PAULI, you're getting drafted for Vietnam, right,

930
00:53:57,719 --> 00:53:59,400
Speaker 3: And that was the way they found out. I think

931
00:53:59,680 --> 00:54:03,359
Speaker 3: the real important thing, even more than the scarring, was

932
00:54:03,400 --> 00:54:04,880
Speaker 3: there was a social accountability.

933
00:54:05,120 --> 00:54:06,719
Speaker 2: Everybody felt like they had skin in.

934
00:54:06,680 --> 00:54:09,160
Speaker 3: The game, except you know, for Donald Trump and some

935
00:54:09,200 --> 00:54:11,399
Speaker 3: of the elites who got out of it. But there

936
00:54:11,440 --> 00:54:13,360
Speaker 3: was an understanding that we were all in this together

937
00:54:13,719 --> 00:54:16,120
Speaker 3: and there was that shared sacrifice. So my grandfather and

938
00:54:16,160 --> 00:54:18,359
Speaker 3: my father will talk about the hard times, but they

939
00:54:18,360 --> 00:54:20,800
Speaker 3: also talk about the unity. They talk about the diversity

940
00:54:21,000 --> 00:54:23,799
Speaker 3: in different terms. They don't say diversity. But they all

941
00:54:24,080 --> 00:54:25,719
Speaker 3: got out of a train together, they all went to

942
00:54:25,760 --> 00:54:28,160
Speaker 3: basic together, and then they all went across the country.

943
00:54:28,160 --> 00:54:30,440
Speaker 3: And my father is best man in his wedding was

944
00:54:30,440 --> 00:54:32,480
Speaker 3: a guy who served in the army with from Chicago.

945
00:54:32,520 --> 00:54:34,680
Speaker 3: They never knew each other until they went in the army.

946
00:54:34,840 --> 00:54:37,920
Speaker 3: So those relationships I think are really important and maybe

947
00:54:38,040 --> 00:54:40,160
Speaker 3: a bit of the silver lining from those times that

948
00:54:40,239 --> 00:54:43,480
Speaker 3: we're missing right now, that social connection, that cohesion. But

949
00:54:43,760 --> 00:54:46,879
Speaker 3: I've also worked with countless Vietnam vets. The scars are

950
00:54:46,920 --> 00:54:50,280
Speaker 3: significant and I think also cresting now in some ways,

951
00:54:50,360 --> 00:54:53,480
Speaker 3: Chuck that people don't understand. The suicide rate is now

952
00:54:53,680 --> 00:54:57,120
Speaker 3: over seventeen per day, and many of them are older veterans.

953
00:54:57,440 --> 00:55:00,160
Speaker 3: They're suffering from agent orange and tox and exposure.

954
00:55:00,280 --> 00:55:02,160
Speaker 2: Mental health. COVID has been hard.

955
00:55:02,440 --> 00:55:05,120
Speaker 3: They deal with isolation and economic stress, and I think

956
00:55:05,160 --> 00:55:08,200
Speaker 3: these times are compounding a lot of things for veterans

957
00:55:08,320 --> 00:55:09,839
Speaker 3: that are making it especially tough.

958
00:55:10,400 --> 00:55:10,640
Speaker 2: Yeah.

959
00:55:11,000 --> 00:55:14,040
Speaker 1: Look, my dad's best friend, he had a sort of

960
00:55:16,040 --> 00:55:18,200
Speaker 1: the last few years of his childhood were kind of

961
00:55:18,200 --> 00:55:22,640
Speaker 1: a mess with his father, in particular his mother, and

962
00:55:22,680 --> 00:55:25,960
Speaker 1: his best friend, who's about a year or two older,

963
00:55:26,239 --> 00:55:32,000
Speaker 1: dies in training in Pensacola after being drafted, and it

964
00:55:32,280 --> 00:55:35,360
Speaker 1: just it made him obsessed with not going, and it

965
00:55:35,400 --> 00:55:37,839
Speaker 1: made him obsess with it, and in fact, he ended up.

966
00:55:37,920 --> 00:55:40,560
Speaker 1: He will say that the reason he became a Republican

967
00:55:41,080 --> 00:55:43,960
Speaker 1: is he blamed Johnson for killing his best friend. That's

968
00:55:44,000 --> 00:55:46,200
Speaker 1: how he viewed it. He viewed it very personally, and

969
00:55:46,200 --> 00:55:48,640
Speaker 1: there were so many You're not alone, right these different ways.

970
00:55:48,800 --> 00:55:50,600
Speaker 1: By the way, the other thing that I was it

971
00:55:51,040 --> 00:55:53,040
Speaker 1: sort of it's made me and I'm curious how you

972
00:55:53,080 --> 00:55:56,759
Speaker 1: feel about certain active I'll just tell you the person

973
00:55:56,880 --> 00:56:01,719
Speaker 1: Richard Blumenthal. When Richard Blumenthal said he couldn't remember everything

974
00:56:01,760 --> 00:56:06,279
Speaker 1: about about his draft status. When my dad died, I

975
00:56:06,320 --> 00:56:09,880
Speaker 1: found a foul folder of every single piece of paper,

976
00:56:11,800 --> 00:56:15,360
Speaker 1: every thing he needed to know about his draft status,

977
00:56:15,800 --> 00:56:19,239
Speaker 1: about eligibility. And at first he was able, he was

978
00:56:19,280 --> 00:56:21,400
Speaker 1: not eligible, and then he became elegron. He just ended

979
00:56:21,480 --> 00:56:24,040
Speaker 1: up getting a high lottery number and he didn't have

980
00:56:24,080 --> 00:56:26,360
Speaker 1: to get picked. But I remember thinking, and it was

981
00:56:26,400 --> 00:56:28,680
Speaker 1: sort of one of those things that sixteen year old

982
00:56:28,719 --> 00:56:31,239
Speaker 1: me said. You know, anybody of the Vietnam Era, if

983
00:56:31,239 --> 00:56:34,360
Speaker 1: they tell you, oh, I don't remember how it happened,

984
00:56:34,400 --> 00:56:39,280
Speaker 1: I don't remember bullshit you were. My father was obsessed

985
00:56:39,320 --> 00:56:40,839
Speaker 1: with it. He had all and he kept it all.

986
00:56:40,880 --> 00:56:42,680
Speaker 1: He saved it all. He felt like he had have

987
00:56:42,800 --> 00:56:45,840
Speaker 1: all his record with him. So I've always found the

988
00:56:45,920 --> 00:56:48,160
Speaker 1: easiest way to find out who a lying politician was

989
00:56:48,200 --> 00:56:53,799
Speaker 1: from that was of eligible to serve in Vietnam, when

990
00:56:53,840 --> 00:56:55,960
Speaker 1: they tell you they're not quite sure. They think they

991
00:56:56,000 --> 00:56:58,399
Speaker 1: got this, they think they got that. They don't want

992
00:56:58,400 --> 00:56:59,440
Speaker 1: to tell you the details.

993
00:56:59,719 --> 00:57:00,000
Speaker 2: Yeah.

994
00:57:00,280 --> 00:57:02,640
Speaker 3: Yeah, every guy I know who got drafted and remembers

995
00:57:02,680 --> 00:57:03,080
Speaker 3: that moment.

996
00:57:03,120 --> 00:57:06,000
Speaker 2: They knew the raft, the lottery, everything about it, right, Yeah.

997
00:57:05,880 --> 00:57:08,279
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, you know, my father talked about it,

998
00:57:08,320 --> 00:57:10,040
Speaker 3: and he knew when his buddies in high school went.

999
00:57:10,239 --> 00:57:10,400
Speaker 2: You know.

1000
00:57:10,440 --> 00:57:13,200
Speaker 3: I think there's also something interesting about Vietnam check with

1001
00:57:13,200 --> 00:57:16,200
Speaker 3: regard to our politics, is the Vietnam veterans took so

1002
00:57:16,400 --> 00:57:20,600
Speaker 3: much of that angst and frustration and disillusionment, and they

1003
00:57:20,640 --> 00:57:23,560
Speaker 3: took it on personally in a way that we never have.

1004
00:57:23,680 --> 00:57:26,320
Speaker 3: And I don't know if any generation of American veterans has.

1005
00:57:26,440 --> 00:57:29,440
Speaker 2: Right. That was a generation where the country confused the.

1006
00:57:29,440 --> 00:57:32,360
Speaker 3: People with the politics, and I think it manifested itself

1007
00:57:32,360 --> 00:57:34,560
Speaker 3: in so many ways, all the way through to the

1008
00:57:34,560 --> 00:57:37,080
Speaker 3: fact that they might be the only generation of veterans

1009
00:57:37,080 --> 00:57:38,000
Speaker 3: that never had a president.

1010
00:57:38,480 --> 00:57:40,720
Speaker 2: They came close. And I talked to John McCain and

1011
00:57:40,760 --> 00:57:41,520
Speaker 2: other folks about this.

1012
00:57:41,840 --> 00:57:43,480
Speaker 3: There was a point where you had John McCain was

1013
00:57:43,480 --> 00:57:46,480
Speaker 3: a presidential candidate. John Kerry was a presidential candidate. At

1014
00:57:46,480 --> 00:57:48,920
Speaker 3: one point, I think there were three Vietnam veterans in

1015
00:57:49,000 --> 00:57:49,920
Speaker 3: Obama's cabinet.

1016
00:57:50,000 --> 00:57:51,840
Speaker 2: You had Shinseki Hegel and.

1017
00:57:51,880 --> 00:57:54,280
Speaker 3: Carrie and the number of Vietnam bets said, you know,

1018
00:57:54,320 --> 00:57:56,479
Speaker 3: we came close, but we never got the White House.

1019
00:57:56,520 --> 00:57:59,320
Speaker 1: It's the strangest thing, and I wonder if it really

1020
00:57:59,400 --> 00:58:07,400
Speaker 1: is that that they were that the public view of

1021
00:58:07,480 --> 00:58:10,800
Speaker 1: Vietnam veteran is too politically scarred to lead. Maybe they

1022
00:58:10,800 --> 00:58:12,880
Speaker 1: didn't say it that way.

1023
00:58:12,960 --> 00:58:14,840
Speaker 2: There was a lot of different like evolutions.

1024
00:58:14,840 --> 00:58:16,480
Speaker 3: If you think about like when Bob Kerrey was a

1025
00:58:16,520 --> 00:58:19,160
Speaker 3: presidential candidate. He's a friend and mentor and a Medal

1026
00:58:19,200 --> 00:58:22,280
Speaker 3: of Honor recipient, right, we were much more conflicted about it,

1027
00:58:22,320 --> 00:58:24,400
Speaker 3: even talking about Bill Clinton's lack of vel.

1028
00:58:24,400 --> 00:58:27,040
Speaker 1: Bob and Bob Carey story only got more complicated the

1029
00:58:27,040 --> 00:58:30,360
Speaker 1: more we learned about his Medal of Honor, you know.

1030
00:58:30,320 --> 00:58:30,760
Speaker 2: Right, right.

1031
00:58:30,800 --> 00:58:33,480
Speaker 3: But I think I think the the insight is that

1032
00:58:34,720 --> 00:58:38,480
Speaker 3: the political trajectory of Vietnam veterans is a reflection of

1033
00:58:38,520 --> 00:58:40,320
Speaker 3: the way the country processed all of it. And at

1034
00:58:40,360 --> 00:58:42,360
Speaker 3: the end of the day, they never elected a Vietnam

1035
00:58:42,400 --> 00:58:45,240
Speaker 3: better now now now flip that around, now We've got

1036
00:58:45,280 --> 00:58:47,240
Speaker 3: a vice president who was the first post nine to

1037
00:58:47,240 --> 00:58:50,560
Speaker 3: eleven veteran in jd Vance. Trump has loaded up his

1038
00:58:50,640 --> 00:58:54,320
Speaker 3: cabinet with with veterans the Democrats. I have Reuben Diego

1039
00:58:54,560 --> 00:58:56,840
Speaker 3: on my show today. I mean, he's a post nine

1040
00:58:56,840 --> 00:58:59,240
Speaker 3: to eleven veteran. We have long said that we think

1041
00:58:59,280 --> 00:59:01,680
Speaker 3: we will have a post nine to eleven veteran in

1042
00:59:01,680 --> 00:59:03,680
Speaker 3: the White House. You'll probably have a couple, and you

1043
00:59:03,720 --> 00:59:06,720
Speaker 3: can envision any number of scenarios from Pete XXth to

1044
00:59:06,800 --> 00:59:08,640
Speaker 3: Wes Moore, everybody in between.

1045
00:59:09,120 --> 00:59:11,840
Speaker 2: There's a unique moment for them to meet right now.

1046
00:59:12,200 --> 00:59:15,840
Speaker 3: And also, I think reset the way the country understands service.

1047
00:59:16,800 --> 00:59:20,280
Speaker 1: Are you surprised that the scars from Iraq and Afghanistan

1048
00:59:20,320 --> 00:59:26,280
Speaker 1: and didn't hit our politics the same way Vietnam did?

1049
00:59:29,240 --> 00:59:31,720
Speaker 3: I mean, I think we're still processing it, Chuck. I mean,

1050
00:59:31,760 --> 00:59:34,320
Speaker 3: I think there's a different part of our politics, which

1051
00:59:34,360 --> 00:59:38,400
Speaker 3: is we were the first generation that went to war

1052
00:59:38,440 --> 00:59:41,560
Speaker 3: while most of America lived life uninterrupted. Right we were

1053
00:59:41,600 --> 00:59:45,080
Speaker 3: the first pro tact job of the all volunteer military.

1054
00:59:45,680 --> 00:59:47,760
Speaker 2: So I think we're still processing now.

1055
00:59:47,800 --> 00:59:50,960
Speaker 3: When Trump can strike Venezuela or talk about hitting Iran

1056
00:59:51,320 --> 00:59:54,240
Speaker 3: because it's other people's children, and I think that maybe

1057
00:59:54,240 --> 00:59:56,480
Speaker 3: that is one of the most important things to understand

1058
00:59:56,520 --> 00:59:59,440
Speaker 3: about this time, is that the all volunteer military is

1059
00:59:59,480 --> 01:00:02,120
Speaker 3: great for them military, but I would argue it's terrible

1060
01:00:02,120 --> 01:00:05,120
Speaker 3: for our democracy because there is no social connectivity, there

1061
01:00:05,160 --> 01:00:07,360
Speaker 3: is no backstop. And that's why I work so much

1062
01:00:07,400 --> 01:00:10,440
Speaker 3: with independent veterans, because they don't want to pick a side, right.

1063
01:00:10,520 --> 01:00:13,000
Speaker 3: So many of them view themselves as country first, and

1064
01:00:13,000 --> 01:00:14,920
Speaker 3: they're like, hey, I'm wearing a camouflage uniform.

1065
01:00:14,920 --> 01:00:16,800
Speaker 2: I don't want to choose blue or red. I want

1066
01:00:16,800 --> 01:00:17,800
Speaker 2: to keep camouflage.

1067
01:00:17,880 --> 01:00:18,920
Speaker 1: I want to stay true.

1068
01:00:18,960 --> 01:00:21,560
Speaker 3: And I think it's very exciting to understand that so

1069
01:00:21,640 --> 01:00:23,640
Speaker 3: many of them are there and they want to serve,

1070
01:00:23,960 --> 01:00:27,120
Speaker 3: especially in this moment. So I think we're still processing it,

1071
01:00:27,200 --> 01:00:31,360
Speaker 3: processing nine to eleven, processing the manipulation.

1072
01:00:31,040 --> 01:00:34,240
Speaker 2: Around the Iraq War, and even you know, rewriting history.

1073
01:00:34,240 --> 01:00:36,360
Speaker 3: If you look at someone like Hegseth, you know he's

1074
01:00:36,400 --> 01:00:40,040
Speaker 3: talking about Iraq and Afghanistan in very different terms. He's

1075
01:00:40,080 --> 01:00:43,439
Speaker 3: talking about being okay with leaving the Geneva Convention, being

1076
01:00:43,480 --> 01:00:45,920
Speaker 3: okay with getting out of NATO, stuff that would have

1077
01:00:45,960 --> 01:00:48,600
Speaker 3: been unimaginable even just twenty years ago, and he could

1078
01:00:48,680 --> 01:00:51,000
Speaker 3: do it in part because he's kind of cloaked in

1079
01:00:51,040 --> 01:00:53,960
Speaker 3: that veterans status, and I think both parties use it.

1080
01:00:54,480 --> 01:00:58,120
Speaker 3: They understand that veterans are uniquely powerful politically, but so far,

1081
01:00:58,240 --> 01:01:01,320
Speaker 3: for the most part, they've also been proxy for both parties,

1082
01:01:01,600 --> 01:01:03,480
Speaker 3: and that may be true all the way to the

1083
01:01:03,520 --> 01:01:05,960
Speaker 3: twenty twenty eight election, where you could have a Democrat

1084
01:01:05,960 --> 01:01:07,439
Speaker 3: and Republican veat against each other.

1085
01:01:16,880 --> 01:01:17,560
Speaker 2: What do you.

1086
01:01:20,480 --> 01:01:24,680
Speaker 1: At what point do you worry about how military recruiting

1087
01:01:24,720 --> 01:01:26,520
Speaker 1: is changing under Pete hegsett.

1088
01:01:27,000 --> 01:01:27,919
Speaker 2: Every day all day.

1089
01:01:28,840 --> 01:01:30,600
Speaker 3: I mean, I think that you and I have talked

1090
01:01:30,600 --> 01:01:32,320
Speaker 3: about this a bit, but maybe not on your show.

1091
01:01:32,800 --> 01:01:36,040
Speaker 3: I think it's really important to understand that Trump's strategy,

1092
01:01:36,360 --> 01:01:39,320
Speaker 3: in my view, has been extremely focused and extremely effective,

1093
01:01:39,960 --> 01:01:42,840
Speaker 3: and in his view, he wanted to transform the way

1094
01:01:42,880 --> 01:01:47,200
Speaker 3: the country operated, and the most important place to start

1095
01:01:47,600 --> 01:01:50,360
Speaker 3: was the Pentagon. That's why he nominated Hegseet first, a

1096
01:01:50,360 --> 01:01:52,600
Speaker 3: person that many of us know and thought would never

1097
01:01:52,640 --> 01:01:55,040
Speaker 3: get through a Senate confirmation hearing. But he threw the

1098
01:01:55,040 --> 01:01:57,880
Speaker 3: long ball and he got hegg Set through, and that

1099
01:01:57,920 --> 01:02:02,160
Speaker 3: really bust open a hole for Tulsey, Gabbard and Kennedy

1100
01:02:02,200 --> 01:02:04,400
Speaker 3: and so many others that would have normally seemed like

1101
01:02:04,440 --> 01:02:06,800
Speaker 3: a long shot, but they went for the Pentagon first

1102
01:02:07,040 --> 01:02:10,280
Speaker 3: because it's the most powerful, it's the biggest budget, it's

1103
01:02:10,320 --> 01:02:13,040
Speaker 3: got tremendous cultural influence, it's easy to.

1104
01:02:13,120 --> 01:02:15,000
Speaker 2: Move, and it's where the guns are.

1105
01:02:15,200 --> 01:02:17,840
Speaker 3: So when they secured the Pentagon, it was kind of

1106
01:02:17,840 --> 01:02:20,280
Speaker 3: the first chess piece on the board, and that allowed

1107
01:02:20,280 --> 01:02:23,240
Speaker 3: them to put in place, in my view, a culture warrior,

1108
01:02:23,320 --> 01:02:25,320
Speaker 3: because that's what Hegseth is And if you want to

1109
01:02:25,360 --> 01:02:28,360
Speaker 3: wage culture war, you started the Pentagon and you move outward.

1110
01:02:28,680 --> 01:02:32,320
Speaker 3: So I'm very concerned because the Pentagon is how Trump

1111
01:02:32,320 --> 01:02:34,680
Speaker 3: wants the rest of the world to look. That is

1112
01:02:34,760 --> 01:02:39,000
Speaker 3: more male, more white, less diverse, less politically diverse, which

1113
01:02:39,040 --> 01:02:42,480
Speaker 3: is maybe the most alarming. We don't want it to

1114
01:02:42,520 --> 01:02:45,240
Speaker 3: be a maga army, but if you continue to drive

1115
01:02:45,320 --> 01:02:49,520
Speaker 3: people away who don't feel welcome, it will increasingly become

1116
01:02:49,600 --> 01:02:51,320
Speaker 3: politically monolithic.

1117
01:02:51,560 --> 01:02:54,360
Speaker 2: It'll become gender monolithic. And we see that already.

1118
01:02:54,440 --> 01:02:57,200
Speaker 3: So you can goose the numbers in the beginning and say, hey,

1119
01:02:57,240 --> 01:03:00,919
Speaker 3: we've got tremendous recruiting, but that is not sustainable over time,

1120
01:03:00,960 --> 01:03:03,280
Speaker 3: and you have to ask a question of quality right,

1121
01:03:03,480 --> 01:03:06,440
Speaker 3: what kind of military are we building? And the reality

1122
01:03:06,560 --> 01:03:09,440
Speaker 3: is people can see what ICE looks like. The military

1123
01:03:09,520 --> 01:03:11,840
Speaker 3: is more and more looking like Ice, but you don't

1124
01:03:11,840 --> 01:03:13,360
Speaker 3: see them. They're on military.

1125
01:03:13,360 --> 01:03:16,040
Speaker 1: I'm just going to say the ICE recruit, Look, you recruit,

1126
01:03:16,760 --> 01:03:19,800
Speaker 1: how you recruit is what type of force you're going

1127
01:03:19,880 --> 01:03:24,920
Speaker 1: to build? Right? And those ICE recruitment videos, excuse me?

1128
01:03:26,120 --> 01:03:30,000
Speaker 1: Were they where they specifically addressed blue cities? I remember,

1129
01:03:30,360 --> 01:03:33,000
Speaker 1: you know, I'm we started our conversation with football. I'm

1130
01:03:33,040 --> 01:03:36,760
Speaker 1: an obsessive college football guy. And what was interesting this

1131
01:03:36,920 --> 01:03:40,160
Speaker 1: fall is how often you'd see during these football games,

1132
01:03:40,400 --> 01:03:44,720
Speaker 1: whatever market was the primary market of whatever team lived,

1133
01:03:44,920 --> 01:03:47,200
Speaker 1: it would you know, so you're watching a University of

1134
01:03:47,280 --> 01:03:50,400
Speaker 1: Washington game, you get this ad that said, hey, Seattle

1135
01:03:50,520 --> 01:03:53,120
Speaker 1: law enforcement, are you tired of not being able to

1136
01:03:53,160 --> 01:03:54,280
Speaker 1: do your job?

1137
01:03:54,400 --> 01:03:54,640
Speaker 2: Right?

1138
01:03:54,720 --> 01:03:59,160
Speaker 1: It's this, it's this sort of negative pitch. You know, well,

1139
01:03:59,240 --> 01:04:01,720
Speaker 1: guess what if you come to ICE, We're going to

1140
01:04:01,800 --> 01:04:03,280
Speaker 1: first of all, throw a bunch of money at you,

1141
01:04:03,360 --> 01:04:06,680
Speaker 1: fifty grand signing bonus, which is that's a big chunk

1142
01:04:06,720 --> 01:04:09,640
Speaker 1: of change. That's that is that gets you out of debt,

1143
01:04:09,680 --> 01:04:11,560
Speaker 1: that's a that's a get me out of student debt.

1144
01:04:11,600 --> 01:04:14,200
Speaker 1: That's a right size, that's a down payment on a house,

1145
01:04:14,240 --> 01:04:17,680
Speaker 1: that's a it's life changing. Fifty grand is is both

1146
01:04:17,920 --> 01:04:19,640
Speaker 1: is a lot of money for a lot of people.

1147
01:04:20,080 --> 01:04:22,200
Speaker 1: And it can it can alter, it can it can

1148
01:04:22,480 --> 01:04:27,240
Speaker 1: accelerate a path in life. But you're recruiting them on this,

1149
01:04:27,400 --> 01:04:29,600
Speaker 1: you don't get to do your job. And essentially you're

1150
01:04:29,640 --> 01:04:33,240
Speaker 1: saying it's it's going to appeal to a certain type

1151
01:04:33,520 --> 01:04:38,400
Speaker 1: of law enforcement official. Are you seeing those same tactics

1152
01:04:38,440 --> 01:04:42,880
Speaker 1: in military and it should? Are more of our friends

1153
01:04:42,880 --> 01:04:44,480
Speaker 1: in the press corps missing a story here?

1154
01:04:45,440 --> 01:04:45,680
Speaker 2: Yes?

1155
01:04:46,480 --> 01:04:49,120
Speaker 3: I mean you know, I've long said that Trump wants

1156
01:04:49,160 --> 01:04:52,440
Speaker 3: to transform society. He wants to transform the Western hemisphere,

1157
01:04:52,440 --> 01:04:55,520
Speaker 3: and he'd probably love to transform the whole world.

1158
01:04:55,680 --> 01:04:57,000
Speaker 2: And if you want to see what.

1159
01:04:56,880 --> 01:04:59,400
Speaker 3: It looks like, it does look like the Department of Defense.

1160
01:04:59,400 --> 01:05:02,400
Speaker 3: And let me go as deeper, things like book banning. Right,

1161
01:05:02,440 --> 01:05:04,280
Speaker 3: when they decide what books they want to ban, they

1162
01:05:04,320 --> 01:05:07,120
Speaker 3: can do them at military schools because the military has

1163
01:05:07,160 --> 01:05:09,680
Speaker 3: to do what you say, right, And it's not like

1164
01:05:09,800 --> 01:05:12,040
Speaker 3: you're going to go into Cincinnati or into Miami and

1165
01:05:12,080 --> 01:05:14,160
Speaker 3: have a debate with the school board. If the Secretary

1166
01:05:14,200 --> 01:05:15,640
Speaker 3: Defense is these books are gone.

1167
01:05:15,880 --> 01:05:16,320
Speaker 2: They're gone.

1168
01:05:16,360 --> 01:05:19,400
Speaker 3: They can restrict women's rights, they can restrict abortion access,

1169
01:05:19,480 --> 01:05:22,360
Speaker 3: they can change recruiting quotas, so they can move the

1170
01:05:22,520 --> 01:05:25,760
Speaker 3: edges in ways that will transform the complexion of what

1171
01:05:25,800 --> 01:05:28,640
Speaker 3: the military looks like. And yes, I think the most

1172
01:05:28,720 --> 01:05:31,280
Speaker 3: important one of the most important stories is that the

1173
01:05:31,280 --> 01:05:35,440
Speaker 3: military is becoming more partisan. It's becoming more politicized, in

1174
01:05:35,520 --> 01:05:38,040
Speaker 3: part because it's built in the image of Hegseth, who,

1175
01:05:38,040 --> 01:05:41,240
Speaker 3: in my view, is the most overtly political Secretary of

1176
01:05:41,280 --> 01:05:44,160
Speaker 3: Defense we've ever had. I do think he's a culture warrior.

1177
01:05:44,200 --> 01:05:46,880
Speaker 3: He's got an ideological approach to the way he wants

1178
01:05:46,880 --> 01:05:49,520
Speaker 3: to transform not just the military, but our culture.

1179
01:05:49,800 --> 01:05:52,200
Speaker 2: That includes an emphasis on Chaplains.

1180
01:05:52,240 --> 01:05:55,040
Speaker 3: For example, if you hear Hegseth talk, he's not doing

1181
01:05:55,120 --> 01:05:58,600
Speaker 3: Jewish prayers, he's not talking to agnostics and atheists.

1182
01:05:58,640 --> 01:06:01,600
Speaker 2: It is Christianity. It is a lot of white men.

1183
01:06:01,960 --> 01:06:05,840
Speaker 3: It has really attacked diversity, and they openly say they want.

1184
01:06:05,680 --> 01:06:08,080
Speaker 2: To destroy DEI, right.

1185
01:06:08,160 --> 01:06:10,120
Speaker 3: I think it's important for people to understand that the

1186
01:06:10,160 --> 01:06:13,880
Speaker 3: first real DEI initiative in modern times was for veterans.

1187
01:06:14,400 --> 01:06:17,560
Speaker 3: There's a veteran's preference in hiring at the Pentagon at

1188
01:06:17,560 --> 01:06:20,040
Speaker 3: the VA across the entire federal government.

1189
01:06:20,320 --> 01:06:22,959
Speaker 2: But that's a water's edge that they haven't hit yet.

1190
01:06:23,000 --> 01:06:26,040
Speaker 3: So I do think the overall transformation of the Pentagon

1191
01:06:26,440 --> 01:06:28,560
Speaker 3: is very very important. And I think the biggest story

1192
01:06:28,600 --> 01:06:31,000
Speaker 3: in America, and I've said this to anybody I can

1193
01:06:31,040 --> 01:06:33,600
Speaker 3: talk to, is that Donald Trump can do anything he

1194
01:06:33,680 --> 01:06:36,479
Speaker 3: wants with the most powerful military the world has ever seen,

1195
01:06:36,800 --> 01:06:40,040
Speaker 3: and nothing stopping it. He can bomb rn he can

1196
01:06:40,080 --> 01:06:43,320
Speaker 3: send them into American cities, he can remove women from

1197
01:06:43,320 --> 01:06:46,280
Speaker 3: combat arms. He can do anything he wants with this military,

1198
01:06:46,360 --> 01:06:49,440
Speaker 3: and almost nothing has stopped him. And the Congress, in

1199
01:06:49,440 --> 01:06:52,640
Speaker 3: my view, has completely abdicated their responsibility. And I do

1200
01:06:52,680 --> 01:06:56,040
Speaker 3: think that the Press Corps especially has a failure of

1201
01:06:56,080 --> 01:06:59,120
Speaker 3: imagination around what he can do with the military. To

1202
01:06:59,160 --> 01:07:01,320
Speaker 3: the most immediate threat, which I would argue is the

1203
01:07:01,320 --> 01:07:04,960
Speaker 3: Insurrection Act. He can invoke the Insurrection Act at any minute.

1204
01:07:05,360 --> 01:07:06,560
Speaker 2: Congress won't stop him.

1205
01:07:06,720 --> 01:07:10,000
Speaker 3: He'll send the eleventh Airborn Corps into, for example, Minneapolis,

1206
01:07:10,280 --> 01:07:13,720
Speaker 3: and Congress will be protesting afterward. But the eleventh Airborn

1207
01:07:13,760 --> 01:07:16,280
Speaker 3: Corp Will be in Minneapolis in the same way he's

1208
01:07:16,280 --> 01:07:19,840
Speaker 3: deployed ice and the same way he's deployed federalized troops

1209
01:07:19,840 --> 01:07:21,920
Speaker 3: in other places, and I think that will be a

1210
01:07:22,040 --> 01:07:24,120
Speaker 3: very important break class moment.

1211
01:07:24,160 --> 01:07:25,560
Speaker 2: For our country.

1212
01:07:25,920 --> 01:07:27,800
Speaker 1: So it sounds like that what you're saying is that

1213
01:07:27,880 --> 01:07:31,200
Speaker 1: more people are to see what's happening. Right now, it's

1214
01:07:31,200 --> 01:07:32,880
Speaker 1: really hard to report on the military. Mean, look what

1215
01:07:32,920 --> 01:07:35,040
Speaker 1: they just did to the Stars and Stripes publication.

1216
01:07:36,360 --> 01:07:37,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I.

1217
01:07:37,000 --> 01:07:39,120
Speaker 3: Mean it's in part hard to report in the military

1218
01:07:39,160 --> 01:07:41,400
Speaker 3: because they're totally stone walling the press.

1219
01:07:41,400 --> 01:07:43,200
Speaker 2: They've removed the Pentagon Press Corps.

1220
01:07:43,360 --> 01:07:46,480
Speaker 3: They've replaced it with what I call the Propaganda Press Corps,

1221
01:07:46,560 --> 01:07:50,400
Speaker 3: which is Laura Lumer. It's hard to guys TV Network, right,

1222
01:07:50,440 --> 01:07:52,880
Speaker 3: but even this Chuck, they haven't done a press conference

1223
01:07:52,920 --> 01:07:55,480
Speaker 3: with them in two months, right, they haven't even done

1224
01:07:55,520 --> 01:07:57,880
Speaker 3: one with them. And so some of these right wing

1225
01:07:57,920 --> 01:08:01,000
Speaker 3: activists Matt Gates and others are pissed off because they're

1226
01:08:01,000 --> 01:08:03,640
Speaker 3: not getting information and they're not getting access. So I

1227
01:08:03,680 --> 01:08:06,920
Speaker 3: do think again that their war on the press started

1228
01:08:06,960 --> 01:08:09,680
Speaker 3: in de Pentagon before they came after guys like Don Lemon.

1229
01:08:09,920 --> 01:08:12,520
Speaker 3: They were removing the Pentagon Press Corp and kicking out

1230
01:08:12,720 --> 01:08:13,520
Speaker 3: the Washington Post.

1231
01:08:13,560 --> 01:08:15,440
Speaker 2: And it's all in coordination.

1232
01:08:15,840 --> 01:08:18,679
Speaker 3: Because if there is no oversight over where you're moving

1233
01:08:18,680 --> 01:08:21,719
Speaker 3: troops or even when troops die. Right, We're not getting

1234
01:08:21,920 --> 01:08:25,719
Speaker 3: casualty reports about where troops are dying, how many are wounded,

1235
01:08:26,000 --> 01:08:29,320
Speaker 3: how they're doing, and not to mention they struck another

1236
01:08:29,360 --> 01:08:32,120
Speaker 3: boat last night off the coast of Venezuela, Right, and

1237
01:08:32,200 --> 01:08:34,439
Speaker 3: there was a survivor, Chuck. Let me give you an example.

1238
01:08:34,560 --> 01:08:37,400
Speaker 3: There was a survivor. We don't know who that survivor is,

1239
01:08:37,760 --> 01:08:39,760
Speaker 3: we don't know where they've gone, we don't know if

1240
01:08:39,760 --> 01:08:42,760
Speaker 3: they've been interrogated. It just kind of goes away, and

1241
01:08:42,800 --> 01:08:45,920
Speaker 3: we still haven't had the conversations about war crimes and accountability.

1242
01:08:46,120 --> 01:08:48,720
Speaker 3: So I think the number one focal point for everybody

1243
01:08:49,000 --> 01:08:51,719
Speaker 3: should be national security because it's where they've got the nukes,

1244
01:08:52,000 --> 01:08:53,920
Speaker 3: it's where they've got the tanks, it's where they've got

1245
01:08:53,920 --> 01:08:56,559
Speaker 3: the national Guard, and it's where they literally could put

1246
01:08:56,640 --> 01:08:59,439
Speaker 3: troops on your corner if they want to.

1247
01:09:00,040 --> 01:09:04,439
Speaker 1: It's literally the most dangerous part of government if it

1248
01:09:04,479 --> 01:09:10,360
Speaker 1: gets partisanized. Yeah right, Yeah, it's the biggest weapon that

1249
01:09:10,400 --> 01:09:10,920
Speaker 1: can be used.

1250
01:09:11,439 --> 01:09:15,600
Speaker 3: And not just not just partisanized, Chuck, but totally unchecked.

1251
01:09:16,160 --> 01:09:16,400
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1252
01:09:16,479 --> 01:09:18,320
Speaker 3: Right, I mean, you know, if you've got a let's

1253
01:09:18,320 --> 01:09:21,439
Speaker 3: say he's whimsical at best. If Trump decides he wants

1254
01:09:21,479 --> 01:09:25,240
Speaker 3: to strike Mexico, he will do it, and then Congress

1255
01:09:25,360 --> 01:09:27,919
Speaker 3: and Blumenthal and everyone else will whind about it afterward.

1256
01:09:28,240 --> 01:09:28,439
Speaker 2: Right.

1257
01:09:28,479 --> 01:09:31,040
Speaker 3: I mean, he is all gas and no breaks, and

1258
01:09:31,120 --> 01:09:34,080
Speaker 3: nothing is slowing him down. Even for example, when the

1259
01:09:34,120 --> 01:09:37,120
Speaker 3: courts ruled in Washington, d C. That the National Guard

1260
01:09:37,200 --> 01:09:41,200
Speaker 3: deployments were illegal, they claim they filed for an extension

1261
01:09:41,240 --> 01:09:43,559
Speaker 3: because the two National Guard troops were shot in the

1262
01:09:43,600 --> 01:09:44,760
Speaker 3: head and they got it.

1263
01:09:44,960 --> 01:09:47,360
Speaker 2: So those national Guard troops are still in DC.

1264
01:09:47,960 --> 01:09:51,080
Speaker 3: Right, so he can even push away the courts, find

1265
01:09:51,120 --> 01:09:53,719
Speaker 3: an excuse, find a reason. And I think the overall

1266
01:09:53,720 --> 01:09:57,120
Speaker 3: strategic landscape that people need to understand is he continues

1267
01:09:57,160 --> 01:09:59,479
Speaker 3: to push with the military n ice and kind of

1268
01:09:59,479 --> 01:10:04,240
Speaker 3: toggle deeper and further without any real block or slow

1269
01:10:04,280 --> 01:10:05,840
Speaker 3: down from Congress or anyone else.

1270
01:10:05,880 --> 01:10:08,400
Speaker 2: The only thing stopping him is himself.

1271
01:10:08,360 --> 01:10:11,080
Speaker 3: And maybe Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Dan Kane,

1272
01:10:11,160 --> 01:10:13,880
Speaker 3: who might be the single most important person in America

1273
01:10:13,960 --> 01:10:17,599
Speaker 3: because he's probably the only one stopping Trump from doing

1274
01:10:17,960 --> 01:10:19,040
Speaker 3: whatever else he wants to do.

1275
01:10:19,120 --> 01:10:22,240
Speaker 1: What's what we saw with Milly in the first term. Right,

1276
01:10:22,320 --> 01:10:25,439
Speaker 1: And you know, I feel like Millie has become a

1277
01:10:25,479 --> 01:10:29,120
Speaker 1: polarizing figure to some where. Simply he was just trying

1278
01:10:29,160 --> 01:10:34,559
Speaker 1: to preserve preserve norms, Like he didn't do anything outwardly politically.

1279
01:10:34,560 --> 01:10:37,960
Speaker 1: He was just trying to preserve the apolitical status of

1280
01:10:38,000 --> 01:10:42,880
Speaker 1: the US uniformed military.

1281
01:10:43,080 --> 01:10:44,719
Speaker 3: I mean, there's an old saying in the Marine Corps,

1282
01:10:44,720 --> 01:10:48,080
Speaker 3: no better friend, no worse enemy, and I think that

1283
01:10:48,080 --> 01:10:51,000
Speaker 3: that is true in politics when it comes to veterans. Right,

1284
01:10:51,040 --> 01:10:53,240
Speaker 3: if you've got Pete Hegseth on your side, and you

1285
01:10:53,280 --> 01:10:55,160
Speaker 3: can wrap him in the American flag, and he can

1286
01:10:55,200 --> 01:10:57,080
Speaker 3: do lots of pull ups, and he can talk the

1287
01:10:57,120 --> 01:11:00,760
Speaker 3: tough talk. He's a very formidable political act. And let's

1288
01:11:00,840 --> 01:11:03,599
Speaker 3: use the flip side. You got somebody like Senator Mark Kelly,

1289
01:11:03,800 --> 01:11:07,360
Speaker 3: who Trump is focusing on because he's uniquely effective, because

1290
01:11:07,360 --> 01:11:11,599
Speaker 3: he's an astronaut. Because also, I think an underreported story, Chuck,

1291
01:11:11,840 --> 01:11:14,000
Speaker 3: if you can shut up Mark Kelly, you can send

1292
01:11:14,000 --> 01:11:18,040
Speaker 3: a chilling effect across two million military retirees in America,

1293
01:11:18,080 --> 01:11:19,880
Speaker 3: because they don't just want to shut up Mark Kelly,

1294
01:11:20,000 --> 01:11:22,280
Speaker 3: they want to shut up me. Any other veteran who

1295
01:11:22,320 --> 01:11:24,800
Speaker 3: can be uniquely effective in pushing back on any of

1296
01:11:24,840 --> 01:11:27,360
Speaker 3: these issues we've talked about. So I think it's really

1297
01:11:27,400 --> 01:11:30,320
Speaker 3: important to note that in this term especially, Trump has

1298
01:11:30,320 --> 01:11:32,960
Speaker 3: been extremely strategic, and I think he's on.

1299
01:11:33,040 --> 01:11:34,320
Speaker 2: Plan, or even ahead of plan.

1300
01:11:34,439 --> 01:11:36,920
Speaker 3: Imagine how far he'd be if Hegseth wasn't screwing up

1301
01:11:36,960 --> 01:11:37,599
Speaker 3: all the time.

1302
01:11:37,680 --> 01:11:39,960
Speaker 2: Right, I mean, Imagine how much further they would be

1303
01:11:40,320 --> 01:11:41,120
Speaker 2: toward their goals.

1304
01:11:41,120 --> 01:11:43,400
Speaker 3: In twenty twenty five for Trump, in my view, was

1305
01:11:43,439 --> 01:11:47,240
Speaker 3: about dominating America. Twenty twenty six is about dominating the

1306
01:11:47,240 --> 01:11:52,040
Speaker 3: Western hemisphere, from Greenland to Venezuela to potentially Cuba and

1307
01:11:52,120 --> 01:11:53,240
Speaker 3: other places in between.

1308
01:11:53,439 --> 01:12:01,200
Speaker 1: What's your historical analysis as to why Democrats, why why

1309
01:12:01,479 --> 01:12:07,000
Speaker 1: many active military veterans just pause a little bit more

1310
01:12:07,520 --> 01:12:09,960
Speaker 1: when it comes to democratic leadership of the military than

1311
01:12:10,000 --> 01:12:11,479
Speaker 1: Republican leadership of the military.

1312
01:12:12,160 --> 01:12:15,880
Speaker 3: You know, I think that's an oversimplification that's changed the bay.

1313
01:12:15,960 --> 01:12:17,720
Speaker 1: I hear that. I know I'm oversimplifizing.

1314
01:12:18,960 --> 01:12:20,040
Speaker 2: Look I go back.

1315
01:12:20,120 --> 01:12:22,600
Speaker 1: Look the fact is a majority of veterans voted for

1316
01:12:22,640 --> 01:12:26,840
Speaker 1: Bush over Kerry. That's true, yeah, you know, but a

1317
01:12:26,880 --> 01:12:29,800
Speaker 1: majority of veterans in the Obama you know, it was

1318
01:12:29,800 --> 01:12:32,760
Speaker 1: a pretty sizeable victory over McCain. But a majority veterans

1319
01:12:32,760 --> 01:12:33,400
Speaker 1: support McCain.

1320
01:12:33,439 --> 01:12:36,519
Speaker 3: I believe, yeah, I think you know, veterans are a

1321
01:12:36,600 --> 01:12:38,559
Speaker 3: reflection of the country, right, And if you took a

1322
01:12:38,560 --> 01:12:41,479
Speaker 3: group of older white men who tend to be from

1323
01:12:41,520 --> 01:12:44,240
Speaker 3: the South, they're going to vote Republican, right, and and

1324
01:12:44,280 --> 01:12:46,640
Speaker 3: that you know, that's what the officer corps looks like

1325
01:12:46,840 --> 01:12:47,519
Speaker 3: in the military.

1326
01:12:47,520 --> 01:12:49,840
Speaker 1: So it's more you almost it's almost more where that

1327
01:12:50,200 --> 01:12:52,439
Speaker 1: it's it's more of I always say, we're all born

1328
01:12:52,439 --> 01:12:56,160
Speaker 1: with original bias, literally where you're born, who you're born to,

1329
01:12:56,320 --> 01:13:00,000
Speaker 1: all of that's that has It's not the military it's

1330
01:13:00,080 --> 01:13:04,240
Speaker 1: self that pushes veterans to lean right. It's their own

1331
01:13:04,320 --> 01:13:10,600
Speaker 1: cultural essentially formation as a child that makes them lean right.

1332
01:13:10,720 --> 01:13:13,720
Speaker 3: Yeah, And the military kind of like football, is like

1333
01:13:13,800 --> 01:13:17,719
Speaker 3: a family affair. I mean, the oversimplification is that there's

1334
01:13:17,840 --> 01:13:18,759
Speaker 3: kind of three kinds.

1335
01:13:18,560 --> 01:13:20,559
Speaker 2: Of people who join the military nowadays. Right.

1336
01:13:20,680 --> 01:13:22,560
Speaker 3: It's people who join because they're family joined it was

1337
01:13:22,560 --> 01:13:24,639
Speaker 3: a family business, or it's part of their legacy.

1338
01:13:24,720 --> 01:13:24,920
Speaker 2: Right.

1339
01:13:25,240 --> 01:13:28,280
Speaker 3: There's people who yeah, and then there's people who legitimately

1340
01:13:28,320 --> 01:13:31,240
Speaker 3: want to serve. Right, this is maybe the smallest percentage

1341
01:13:31,400 --> 01:13:33,320
Speaker 3: the folks that want to fight the good fight, or

1342
01:13:33,360 --> 01:13:34,880
Speaker 3: they want to give back and then there's a lot

1343
01:13:34,880 --> 01:13:36,679
Speaker 3: of people who need health care or want the money

1344
01:13:36,680 --> 01:13:39,559
Speaker 3: for school. And I think that that's an important subset too,

1345
01:13:39,600 --> 01:13:43,880
Speaker 3: because the enlisted ranks, especially prior to this administration, tended

1346
01:13:43,920 --> 01:13:47,160
Speaker 3: to be more diverse ethnically racially in terms of gender,

1347
01:13:47,360 --> 01:13:50,000
Speaker 3: and they were more gettable for Democrats, and they tended

1348
01:13:50,040 --> 01:13:53,759
Speaker 3: to vote more Democrat. Right now, the veterans population is different.

1349
01:13:53,920 --> 01:13:56,360
Speaker 3: That's nineteen million people who have gotten out. They tend

1350
01:13:56,400 --> 01:13:59,320
Speaker 3: to be older white men, and older white men tend

1351
01:13:59,360 --> 01:14:03,160
Speaker 3: to vote republic So I think what's really interesting is

1352
01:14:03,200 --> 01:14:07,720
Speaker 3: that over fifty percent of veterans and active duty are independent,

1353
01:14:08,080 --> 01:14:11,519
Speaker 3: politically unaffiliated, and they haven't had a home, so a

1354
01:14:11,520 --> 01:14:13,759
Speaker 3: lot of them stay on the sidelines. They will sometimes

1355
01:14:13,840 --> 01:14:16,719
Speaker 3: choose a John McCain or they'll choose a John Kerry,

1356
01:14:16,760 --> 01:14:19,519
Speaker 3: and I do think they tend to gravitate toward another veterans.

1357
01:14:19,520 --> 01:14:22,240
Speaker 3: But the reality is they're looking for a Mark Millie,

1358
01:14:22,240 --> 01:14:24,680
Speaker 3: they're looking for a Colin Powell. They're looking for an

1359
01:14:24,680 --> 01:14:27,519
Speaker 3: Admiral mccraven, who's an example I know you will give.

1360
01:14:27,640 --> 01:14:31,280
Speaker 3: And they're like most Americans. Most Americans are independent. Now

1361
01:14:31,320 --> 01:14:33,920
Speaker 3: forty five percent was the last gallup poll only twenty

1362
01:14:33,920 --> 01:14:36,200
Speaker 3: seven percent of Democrats and Republicans.

1363
01:14:36,400 --> 01:14:38,360
Speaker 2: Those numbers are shrinking in the military too.

1364
01:14:38,840 --> 01:14:42,840
Speaker 3: On a trajectory basis, now you do have Republicans and

1365
01:14:42,960 --> 01:14:46,400
Speaker 3: Fox News watchers and petext fans that are over indexing

1366
01:14:46,439 --> 01:14:48,479
Speaker 3: in the military right now, But if you look at

1367
01:14:48,479 --> 01:14:52,200
Speaker 3: it longitudinally, they are reflective of where the elector is

1368
01:14:52,280 --> 01:14:53,160
Speaker 3: for the most part.

1369
01:14:56,439 --> 01:14:58,320
Speaker 1: When you look at the twenty eight field, you know,

1370
01:14:58,320 --> 01:15:05,080
Speaker 1: it's fascinating to see that essentially we haven't elected a

1371
01:15:05,120 --> 01:15:07,519
Speaker 1: military veteran as president since George H. W.

1372
01:15:07,680 --> 01:15:09,880
Speaker 2: Bush.

1373
01:15:09,880 --> 01:15:12,719
Speaker 1: I think some would argue national guard service. With George W. Bush,

1374
01:15:12,720 --> 01:15:17,120
Speaker 1: I'll put that in the it's it's somewhere in the middle.

1375
01:15:17,439 --> 01:15:19,960
Speaker 1: Where do you I mean, no, as a military veteran,

1376
01:15:19,960 --> 01:15:21,559
Speaker 1: where do you put that? Where do you put national

1377
01:15:21,560 --> 01:15:22,160
Speaker 1: guard service?

1378
01:15:22,880 --> 01:15:25,960
Speaker 3: I mean it's better than nothing, right, But he's not

1379
01:15:26,000 --> 01:15:26,760
Speaker 3: a combat.

1380
01:15:26,520 --> 01:15:29,040
Speaker 1: And it's different today. Right if you were the National

1381
01:15:29,080 --> 01:15:31,160
Speaker 1: Guard in the twenty first century, you may have been

1382
01:15:31,160 --> 01:15:33,600
Speaker 1: sent overseas. I think when the National Guard of the

1383
01:15:34,160 --> 01:15:35,719
Speaker 1: sixties or seventies, you weren't right.

1384
01:15:35,800 --> 01:15:37,840
Speaker 3: And too often this becomes like a keeping up with

1385
01:15:37,880 --> 01:15:40,280
Speaker 3: the Joneses thing within the military. But I think for veterans.

1386
01:15:40,680 --> 01:15:42,880
Speaker 3: Have you served at all? That's important, right. I think

1387
01:15:42,880 --> 01:15:45,040
Speaker 3: that's important to the country as well. Have you put

1388
01:15:45,040 --> 01:15:48,200
Speaker 3: the country ahead of yourself and to me doing National Guard? Yeah,

1389
01:15:48,240 --> 01:15:50,439
Speaker 3: all right, in anywhere, that's plenty of folks, more than

1390
01:15:50,479 --> 01:15:53,559
Speaker 3: most people. Yeah, But then combat service is important in

1391
01:15:53,720 --> 01:15:56,800
Speaker 3: understanding the human cost of war up front, having your

1392
01:15:56,840 --> 01:15:59,280
Speaker 3: buddies die, you know, knowing what it's like to write

1393
01:15:59,280 --> 01:16:01,200
Speaker 3: a letter home to your mother in case you're killed.

1394
01:16:01,600 --> 01:16:05,200
Speaker 3: John Kerry understood that. George Bush the first understood that.

1395
01:16:05,640 --> 01:16:07,519
Speaker 3: And I think now you're going to have a generation

1396
01:16:07,600 --> 01:16:11,000
Speaker 3: from both the Republican and the Democratic Party that understands that.

1397
01:16:11,040 --> 01:16:13,599
Speaker 3: And I think these are actually the people to watch, Chuck.

1398
01:16:13,640 --> 01:16:16,559
Speaker 3: I mean, Jade Vance is obviously on the playing field.

1399
01:16:16,640 --> 01:16:19,719
Speaker 3: Who knows what hegseth is. You've got people like Tom Cotton,

1400
01:16:20,120 --> 01:16:23,280
Speaker 3: Ron DeSantis served in the Navy. Almost every one of

1401
01:16:23,280 --> 01:16:25,240
Speaker 3: them has got some kind of military service. On the

1402
01:16:25,280 --> 01:16:27,599
Speaker 3: other side, you've got Mark Kelly, who we've talked about.

1403
01:16:27,640 --> 01:16:30,880
Speaker 3: You've got Reuben Diego, You've got Mikey Cheryl, the governor

1404
01:16:31,000 --> 01:16:31,639
Speaker 3: of New Jersey.

1405
01:16:31,640 --> 01:16:33,559
Speaker 2: You've got Wes Moore in Maryland.

1406
01:16:33,720 --> 01:16:36,519
Speaker 3: I mean, they all have some kind of military service

1407
01:16:36,520 --> 01:16:40,200
Speaker 3: and combat experience. Now how they view that combat experience

1408
01:16:40,320 --> 01:16:42,880
Speaker 3: is dramatically different, and that's why I argue they're often

1409
01:16:42,960 --> 01:16:46,120
Speaker 3: proxies for the parties, but they are very effective proxies

1410
01:16:46,120 --> 01:16:47,920
Speaker 3: for the party so far. And I think that was

1411
01:16:47,960 --> 01:16:52,120
Speaker 3: an under reported part of Mikey Cheryl's victory, Spanberger's victory.

1412
01:16:52,320 --> 01:16:54,560
Speaker 3: They were able to appeal to a broad swath and

1413
01:16:54,680 --> 01:16:58,880
Speaker 3: especially to independence because of their national security experience, because

1414
01:16:58,880 --> 01:17:01,639
Speaker 3: of their veterans experience, and they're leading with that because

1415
01:17:01,680 --> 01:17:04,519
Speaker 3: most of all, Chuck, it establishes trust, and I think

1416
01:17:04,560 --> 01:17:08,200
Speaker 3: people don't trust politicians, they don't trust authenticity, they don't

1417
01:17:08,240 --> 01:17:10,240
Speaker 3: trust that they're going to fight for them, And there's

1418
01:17:10,280 --> 01:17:15,240
Speaker 3: a natural baked in respect for veterans that can transcend

1419
01:17:15,360 --> 01:17:17,839
Speaker 3: party in a way that almost nothing else can. Maybe

1420
01:17:18,000 --> 01:17:21,080
Speaker 3: celebrity and money, but veterans are kind of like a

1421
01:17:21,120 --> 01:17:24,320
Speaker 3: secret superpower in politics that can always work.

1422
01:17:24,920 --> 01:17:27,639
Speaker 1: That's where why you and I are so in line

1423
01:17:27,680 --> 01:17:30,800
Speaker 1: on this. I think that I certainly view it this

1424
01:17:30,880 --> 01:17:34,080
Speaker 1: way for when we're trying to repair something that's broken

1425
01:17:34,120 --> 01:17:36,439
Speaker 1: in the moment right and the r right now, where

1426
01:17:36,840 --> 01:17:41,840
Speaker 1: our politics is broken, and are a military veteran might

1427
01:17:41,880 --> 01:17:44,439
Speaker 1: be the best way to go. And frankly, it's not

1428
01:17:44,560 --> 01:17:45,960
Speaker 1: lost on me. And I think I said this to

1429
01:17:46,000 --> 01:17:49,000
Speaker 1: you before that for me, there are two presidents that

1430
01:17:49,080 --> 01:17:51,519
Speaker 1: stand out as being the closest we've ever had to

1431
01:17:51,560 --> 01:17:56,160
Speaker 1: actually having independence as presidents, people that truly did put

1432
01:17:56,640 --> 01:18:02,400
Speaker 1: country over party. One was our first one, and he's

1433
01:18:02,439 --> 01:18:04,400
Speaker 1: got plenty of receipts to prove that one and the

1434
01:18:04,439 --> 01:18:07,760
Speaker 1: other's Eisenhower, and I don't really think there's anybody else

1435
01:18:07,800 --> 01:18:11,560
Speaker 1: that comes close. Do you concur with that or do

1436
01:18:11,560 --> 01:18:12,760
Speaker 1: you think I mean a.

1437
01:18:12,720 --> 01:18:13,679
Speaker 2: Different roll of the dice.

1438
01:18:13,720 --> 01:18:15,559
Speaker 3: And it could have been Colin Powell, right, Colin Powell

1439
01:18:15,600 --> 01:18:17,880
Speaker 3: could have been the first African American president, you know,

1440
01:18:17,920 --> 01:18:20,719
Speaker 3: first black president in history, right, if it had gone differently.

1441
01:18:20,920 --> 01:18:22,040
Speaker 2: And I think that's important to.

1442
01:18:22,000 --> 01:18:24,840
Speaker 3: Recognize too, because at that time he had a unique

1443
01:18:24,840 --> 01:18:29,120
Speaker 3: credibility and popularity in the country that was probably even

1444
01:18:29,160 --> 01:18:30,519
Speaker 3: higher than John McCain or.

1445
01:18:30,479 --> 01:18:31,160
Speaker 2: Someone like that.

1446
01:18:31,320 --> 01:18:34,800
Speaker 3: Right, So there was there was a potential opportunity there.

1447
01:18:34,800 --> 01:18:37,600
Speaker 3: But I do see especially at the local level, and

1448
01:18:37,640 --> 01:18:40,040
Speaker 3: this is what I'm doing now with Independent Veterans of America.

1449
01:18:40,080 --> 01:18:42,080
Speaker 2: We're running one hundred candidates this fall.

1450
01:18:42,280 --> 01:18:44,639
Speaker 3: We're running as many as seven or eight for Senate,

1451
01:18:44,880 --> 01:18:47,280
Speaker 3: who I think will be competitive in places.

1452
01:18:46,960 --> 01:18:48,400
Speaker 2: Where Democrats are Republicans can.

1453
01:18:48,479 --> 01:18:52,640
Speaker 3: But at the local level, mayor's school board, county executives,

1454
01:18:52,880 --> 01:18:57,000
Speaker 3: people don't want a partisan school board representative, right, you shouldn't.

1455
01:18:57,040 --> 01:18:58,840
Speaker 3: I my view, you shouldn't have a Republican or a

1456
01:18:58,840 --> 01:19:02,000
Speaker 3: democratic school board. And veterans are now stepping up and

1457
01:19:02,040 --> 01:19:04,240
Speaker 3: they want to run, but we have to help create

1458
01:19:04,280 --> 01:19:06,599
Speaker 3: a pathway where they can be viable, where they can

1459
01:19:06,640 --> 01:19:08,800
Speaker 3: get ballid access, where they can compete with the big

1460
01:19:08,840 --> 01:19:11,480
Speaker 3: money and the parties, where we can have open primaries,

1461
01:19:11,479 --> 01:19:13,160
Speaker 3: something I know you've talked about.

1462
01:19:12,920 --> 01:19:13,519
Speaker 2: And focused on.

1463
01:19:13,800 --> 01:19:17,200
Speaker 3: But if the field is leveled, veterans will serve and

1464
01:19:17,240 --> 01:19:19,559
Speaker 3: they can get things done. They can be pragmatic, they

1465
01:19:19,560 --> 01:19:22,760
Speaker 3: can represent everybody, and they can represent what is the

1466
01:19:22,760 --> 01:19:25,400
Speaker 3: biggest voting block now in the country, the forty five

1467
01:19:25,400 --> 01:19:28,960
Speaker 3: percent of the independence and unaffiliateds that are also the

1468
01:19:29,040 --> 01:19:32,559
Speaker 3: fastest growing percentage of our electric sixty percent of young people.

1469
01:19:33,120 --> 01:19:36,559
Speaker 3: Every demographic. We see that people are saying no to both.

1470
01:19:36,600 --> 01:19:39,240
Speaker 3: And it's not just middle chuck, it's none of the above.

1471
01:19:39,720 --> 01:19:41,519
Speaker 3: They're just throwing a middle finger up to all of it.

1472
01:19:41,680 --> 01:19:44,120
Speaker 3: They don't want corporations, they don't want corporate media, they

1473
01:19:44,120 --> 01:19:46,320
Speaker 3: don't want the parties, and they want to be independent

1474
01:19:46,360 --> 01:19:48,080
Speaker 3: in the spirit of George Washington.

1475
01:19:48,479 --> 01:19:51,240
Speaker 1: And this is I think the challenge you this continues

1476
01:19:51,240 --> 01:19:54,360
Speaker 1: to be the challenge of tapping into this on what

1477
01:19:54,439 --> 01:19:57,759
Speaker 1: on paper looks like an incredible group to tap into.

1478
01:19:57,800 --> 01:20:00,519
Speaker 1: And yet the problem when you take the is forty

1479
01:20:00,800 --> 01:20:04,599
Speaker 1: plus percent that I self identify as not either party. Right,

1480
01:20:04,680 --> 01:20:07,080
Speaker 1: they say, no, I'm independent. I'm really not comfortable with

1481
01:20:07,120 --> 01:20:10,960
Speaker 1: either party. Obviously, when you push you can figure out, oh,

1482
01:20:11,040 --> 01:20:14,240
Speaker 1: culturally they lean this way, and culturally they lean that way,

1483
01:20:14,280 --> 01:20:17,559
Speaker 1: and all of that. It is hard to find a

1484
01:20:17,720 --> 01:20:21,400
Speaker 1: unifying set of issues for this independent movement. This is

1485
01:20:21,439 --> 01:20:24,400
Speaker 1: what I've what you what becomes the flaw and the

1486
01:20:24,400 --> 01:20:28,599
Speaker 1: ointment here? Right, what seems like a no brainer on paper, Look,

1487
01:20:28,640 --> 01:20:31,839
Speaker 1: people pick independence for a reason. Right, Bernie Sanders is independent.

1488
01:20:33,600 --> 01:20:36,519
Speaker 2: I hear you, he's not a real independent.

1489
01:20:37,000 --> 01:20:40,360
Speaker 1: Well what he he's not comfortable being with either major party,

1490
01:20:40,640 --> 01:20:44,560
Speaker 1: but he's obviously ideologically wants something a little bit different.

1491
01:20:44,439 --> 01:20:46,040
Speaker 2: And he caucuses with the Democrats.

1492
01:20:46,200 --> 01:20:49,679
Speaker 1: But there are a lot of people who call themselves

1493
01:20:49,680 --> 01:20:55,880
Speaker 1: independent but are decidedly either you know, sort of conservative

1494
01:20:55,920 --> 01:20:59,760
Speaker 1: libertarians or progressive independence.

1495
01:21:01,200 --> 01:21:03,879
Speaker 3: There's a lot of different reasons for folks to be independent.

1496
01:21:03,920 --> 01:21:06,320
Speaker 3: I think it's really important for folks to think about

1497
01:21:06,479 --> 01:21:09,680
Speaker 3: the fact that independent is an attitude more than it

1498
01:21:09,800 --> 01:21:11,280
Speaker 3: is a political affiliation.

1499
01:21:11,720 --> 01:21:11,880
Speaker 2: Right.

1500
01:21:11,960 --> 01:21:15,120
Speaker 3: It's not an ideology, it's not an ideology, right. But

1501
01:21:15,160 --> 01:21:18,280
Speaker 3: what the unifying factor is. They reject the status quo,

1502
01:21:18,680 --> 01:21:21,400
Speaker 3: and they reject both parties, and they're looking I would

1503
01:21:21,479 --> 01:21:25,240
Speaker 3: argue for leaders even more than issues, and too often.

1504
01:21:25,080 --> 01:21:27,040
Speaker 2: They're dismissed as spoilers or they're leaning.

1505
01:21:27,479 --> 01:21:29,519
Speaker 3: Very seldom do we actually have a chance to vote

1506
01:21:29,560 --> 01:21:32,240
Speaker 3: for an independent candidate because oftentimes they can't even make

1507
01:21:32,280 --> 01:21:35,120
Speaker 3: the ballot. They have higher thresholds to reach the ballots,

1508
01:21:35,200 --> 01:21:37,640
Speaker 3: they don't have the same fundraising mechanisms, and that's a

1509
01:21:37,680 --> 01:21:39,120
Speaker 3: problem that we're working against.

1510
01:21:39,200 --> 01:21:40,240
Speaker 2: But when you look at.

1511
01:21:40,080 --> 01:21:43,880
Speaker 3: Someone like Jesse Ventura, he won he won a governor's

1512
01:21:43,960 --> 01:21:45,160
Speaker 3: race in Minnesota.

1513
01:21:45,360 --> 01:21:47,639
Speaker 2: This was decades ago, right, and I think.

1514
01:21:47,479 --> 01:21:50,040
Speaker 3: In many ways that's an indicator for what can be

1515
01:21:50,120 --> 01:21:52,840
Speaker 3: happening now. Because he had the power of celebrity, he

1516
01:21:52,920 --> 01:21:55,479
Speaker 3: was able to obviously master the media. But there's an

1517
01:21:55,520 --> 01:21:59,240
Speaker 3: independent mayor of Colorado Springs right now named Yemi Mobilatti,

1518
01:22:00,000 --> 01:22:03,880
Speaker 3: an independent mayor of Chattanooga, Tennessee named Tim Kelly. And

1519
01:22:03,920 --> 01:22:06,880
Speaker 3: there are a number of veterans running for Senate, like

1520
01:22:06,960 --> 01:22:10,160
Speaker 3: Dan Osborne in Nebraska who can potentially win in a

1521
01:22:10,200 --> 01:22:12,720
Speaker 3: Senate race where a Democrat can't. There may be one

1522
01:22:12,720 --> 01:22:15,640
Speaker 3: in Montana which might be the most ripe for the

1523
01:22:15,680 --> 01:22:18,760
Speaker 3: Senate in terms of running an independent candidate, because right

1524
01:22:18,760 --> 01:22:21,600
Speaker 3: now we know that the Democrats are very unpopular and

1525
01:22:21,600 --> 01:22:24,559
Speaker 3: the Republicans are very unpopular, and independents are in a

1526
01:22:24,640 --> 01:22:27,840
Speaker 3: unique position to run against everybody to say I'm against

1527
01:22:27,920 --> 01:22:30,200
Speaker 3: all of it. And if you capture that with the

1528
01:22:30,280 --> 01:22:33,080
Speaker 3: veteran persona like I think some of these folks are

1529
01:22:33,200 --> 01:22:36,479
Speaker 3: or celebrity. If Matthew McConaughey decides to run in Texas

1530
01:22:36,960 --> 01:22:39,240
Speaker 3: or The Rock decides to run for president. And I

1531
01:22:39,240 --> 01:22:42,000
Speaker 3: don't say that dismissively because Ronald Reagan once did it,

1532
01:22:42,160 --> 01:22:45,160
Speaker 3: just Event Tour once did it. If people can can jump.

1533
01:22:44,960 --> 01:22:46,920
Speaker 1: Do Donald Trump has done it. Let's not pretending to

1534
01:22:47,439 --> 01:22:49,080
Speaker 1: other than a celebrity.

1535
01:22:49,320 --> 01:22:52,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, the moment is ripe right now.

1536
01:22:52,080 --> 01:22:54,080
Speaker 3: And the other thing that I think we're close to

1537
01:22:54,200 --> 01:22:58,880
Speaker 3: Chuck is a significant scalable investment. The left has the

1538
01:22:58,880 --> 01:23:01,320
Speaker 3: Soroses of the world and the right has the Koch Brothers.

1539
01:23:01,600 --> 01:23:04,920
Speaker 2: There's been no real billionaires jumping in to this. Elon

1540
01:23:05,040 --> 01:23:06,200
Speaker 2: Musk has talked about it.

1541
01:23:06,439 --> 01:23:09,360
Speaker 3: But there is a market opportunity here that sooner or

1542
01:23:09,439 --> 01:23:12,639
Speaker 3: later somebody is going to recognize. And I think it's

1543
01:23:12,640 --> 01:23:15,200
Speaker 3: really like an oil well set to be spikes. So

1544
01:23:15,200 --> 01:23:16,640
Speaker 3: we're going to run one hundred of them. We're going

1545
01:23:16,680 --> 01:23:18,920
Speaker 3: to take some good shots. But if we win one

1546
01:23:19,200 --> 01:23:23,840
Speaker 3: Senate seat, and it could be Idaho, South Dakota, Montana, Nebraska,

1547
01:23:24,000 --> 01:23:26,240
Speaker 3: and we may see a couple others, then that will

1548
01:23:26,280 --> 01:23:28,719
Speaker 3: immediately be the single most powerful member of the Senate.

1549
01:23:28,760 --> 01:23:32,120
Speaker 3: An independent fulcrum who doesn't caucus with either the Republicans

1550
01:23:32,240 --> 01:23:34,960
Speaker 3: or Democrats, especially if it's a veteran, could be the

1551
01:23:35,000 --> 01:23:36,320
Speaker 3: most powerful member of the Senate.

1552
01:23:36,360 --> 01:23:48,479
Speaker 4: And that's what we're shooting for this fall. I've never understood.

1553
01:23:48,520 --> 01:23:51,000
Speaker 1: I mean, it's been one of my frustrations with Angus

1554
01:23:51,080 --> 01:23:53,759
Speaker 1: King in there, which is I thought he could build

1555
01:23:54,200 --> 01:23:58,120
Speaker 1: All you need is four to six members, right, you

1556
01:23:58,160 --> 01:24:02,200
Speaker 1: already really have two foundations members of this independent block.

1557
01:24:02,280 --> 01:24:05,080
Speaker 1: Who I do think who if they would agree, basically,

1558
01:24:05,520 --> 01:24:07,880
Speaker 1: we're either all going to vote for one party or

1559
01:24:07,880 --> 01:24:11,599
Speaker 1: the other, depending on what you're promising when it comes

1560
01:24:11,600 --> 01:24:15,600
Speaker 1: to the independent Senate agenda. Angus King and Lisa Murkowski

1561
01:24:15,680 --> 01:24:20,800
Speaker 1: could be these ten polls and they won't do it.

1562
01:24:20,840 --> 01:24:23,479
Speaker 1: And I don't know why, right, which, because if they

1563
01:24:23,520 --> 01:24:27,120
Speaker 1: would pledge to do this, they already have the backing

1564
01:24:27,160 --> 01:24:30,120
Speaker 1: of their own states to do this. So if they

1565
01:24:30,120 --> 01:24:32,120
Speaker 1: would join hands, and they could have done it with

1566
01:24:32,240 --> 01:24:37,320
Speaker 1: Mansion and Cinema and likely recruited a Susan Collins, although

1567
01:24:37,320 --> 01:24:40,679
Speaker 1: I don't know, but in theory, let's say they could

1568
01:24:40,680 --> 01:24:43,760
Speaker 1: have done that. Maybe a Todd Young I could throw

1569
01:24:43,760 --> 01:24:47,679
Speaker 1: in there, maybe a John Curtis out of Wyoming. Where

1570
01:24:47,680 --> 01:24:50,360
Speaker 1: that says, look, we're going to be independence first, and

1571
01:24:50,880 --> 01:24:53,280
Speaker 1: we're going to vote as a block to decide which

1572
01:24:53,320 --> 01:24:56,080
Speaker 1: party gets to organize the Senate based on here are

1573
01:24:56,200 --> 01:25:01,840
Speaker 1: our five demands. You don't need the majority, right, It's

1574
01:25:01,880 --> 01:25:05,000
Speaker 1: exactly what you're saying. And I don't know why this

1575
01:25:05,120 --> 01:25:07,559
Speaker 1: has been so hard to get somebody to try to

1576
01:25:07,560 --> 01:25:08,760
Speaker 1: be the leader of the independence.

1577
01:25:08,760 --> 01:25:12,040
Speaker 3: To be frank well, politicians are often behind the curve,

1578
01:25:12,120 --> 01:25:12,640
Speaker 3: not ahead of it.

1579
01:25:12,760 --> 01:25:14,800
Speaker 2: Right, And I think the people want this.

1580
01:25:14,880 --> 01:25:16,560
Speaker 3: But if you look at someone like Angus King or

1581
01:25:17,080 --> 01:25:20,320
Speaker 3: Bernie Sators, they were essentially elected with the expectation that

1582
01:25:20,320 --> 01:25:21,799
Speaker 3: they would caucus with the Democrats.

1583
01:25:21,840 --> 01:25:24,879
Speaker 2: Right, So I would challenge whether the reason.

1584
01:25:24,680 --> 01:25:27,040
Speaker 1: I single out Angus King is when Angus King rings

1585
01:25:27,120 --> 01:25:29,360
Speaker 1: ran for governor, he ran against both parties. Oh yeah,

1586
01:25:29,360 --> 01:25:30,360
Speaker 1: but he won his governorship.

1587
01:25:30,439 --> 01:25:31,040
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1588
01:25:31,040 --> 01:25:33,160
Speaker 1: By the time he had ran as the Senate, You're right,

1589
01:25:33,200 --> 01:25:35,719
Speaker 1: Democrats just said, hey, we're not going to recruit somebody

1590
01:25:35,760 --> 01:25:38,360
Speaker 1: against him, and if we don't, he'll probably cauc us

1591
01:25:38,400 --> 01:25:38,640
Speaker 1: with us.

1592
01:25:38,720 --> 01:25:40,840
Speaker 3: Yeah. And I do think Angus King is probably the

1593
01:25:40,880 --> 01:25:43,479
Speaker 3: closest thing we have in the Senate to being that leader.

1594
01:25:43,680 --> 01:25:45,599
Speaker 3: And I've had this conversation with him on my show

1595
01:25:45,640 --> 01:25:47,559
Speaker 3: and I've challenged him on it. But I also think

1596
01:25:47,600 --> 01:25:50,559
Speaker 3: we're close to a breaking point, Chuck, where we only

1597
01:25:50,600 --> 01:25:53,000
Speaker 3: need one or two to break ranks and defect.

1598
01:25:53,200 --> 01:25:54,560
Speaker 2: And let me give you two examples.

1599
01:25:54,920 --> 01:25:57,639
Speaker 3: Jared Golden in Maine is a Democrat, a veteran who

1600
01:25:57,720 --> 01:26:00,920
Speaker 3: very easily could break ranks with the Democrats and declare

1601
01:26:00,960 --> 01:26:02,760
Speaker 3: his independence, become unaffiliated.

1602
01:26:03,080 --> 01:26:04,920
Speaker 2: And someone like Don Bacon.

1603
01:26:04,920 --> 01:26:07,960
Speaker 3: Also a veteran from Nebraska who continues to buck against

1604
01:26:07,960 --> 01:26:10,360
Speaker 3: his party. If the two of them came together and said,

1605
01:26:10,360 --> 01:26:12,360
Speaker 3: we're going to send a message, We're going to break

1606
01:26:12,400 --> 01:26:15,120
Speaker 3: the seal. It's safe out here. You can leave the

1607
01:26:15,120 --> 01:26:18,400
Speaker 3: Democratic and Republican Party. You can get media attention, you

1608
01:26:18,400 --> 01:26:20,280
Speaker 3: will have other people who look out for you, and

1609
01:26:20,320 --> 01:26:21,160
Speaker 3: there will be money.

1610
01:26:21,200 --> 01:26:22,559
Speaker 2: Because here's the real truth, Tuck.

1611
01:26:22,800 --> 01:26:24,160
Speaker 3: I've got a lot of folks who call me up

1612
01:26:24,160 --> 01:26:26,800
Speaker 3: and say, you know, I'm thinking about running, But does

1613
01:26:26,840 --> 01:26:29,360
Speaker 3: anybody have like ten million dollars for me if I run?

1614
01:26:29,760 --> 01:26:30,800
Speaker 1: Yeah, they need air cover.

1615
01:26:31,479 --> 01:26:33,719
Speaker 2: Amerroe mccraven says he doesn't want to run.

1616
01:26:33,840 --> 01:26:36,200
Speaker 3: If Mike Bloomberg gives him a hundred million dollars, he

1617
01:26:36,320 --> 01:26:37,640
Speaker 3: might rethink that situation.

1618
01:26:38,320 --> 01:26:38,519
Speaker 2: Right.

1619
01:26:38,600 --> 01:26:41,320
Speaker 3: So we have to, I think, simultaneously attack the systems

1620
01:26:41,320 --> 01:26:43,640
Speaker 3: with open primaries. We have to address the lack of

1621
01:26:43,680 --> 01:26:48,320
Speaker 3: infrastructure around fundraising ballot access. But we also need super

1622
01:26:48,360 --> 01:26:50,800
Speaker 3: captivating leaders, and I think we're.

1623
01:26:50,560 --> 01:26:51,720
Speaker 2: Very close to seeing that.

1624
01:26:51,840 --> 01:26:55,479
Speaker 3: Dan Osborne, I think broke through tremendously in Nebraska because

1625
01:26:55,479 --> 01:26:58,040
Speaker 3: of his realism, because he was a steam worker. You know,

1626
01:26:58,280 --> 01:27:00,960
Speaker 3: he's a union guy. He's tough, he's got tattoos, he's

1627
01:27:01,000 --> 01:27:04,800
Speaker 3: talking real. We're going to run like one hundred Dan Osborne's.

1628
01:27:04,960 --> 01:27:07,839
Speaker 3: But we're also one step away from getting Mark Millie

1629
01:27:08,080 --> 01:27:10,200
Speaker 3: or Admiral mccraven or someone like that. And I think

1630
01:27:10,240 --> 01:27:12,960
Speaker 3: once we get a high visibility person that can drive

1631
01:27:13,000 --> 01:27:16,439
Speaker 3: that infrastructure behind them, people are going to defect. They're

1632
01:27:16,439 --> 01:27:18,880
Speaker 3: not happy as Democrats and Republicans. They just have to

1633
01:27:18,920 --> 01:27:21,200
Speaker 3: know that if they leave, they can survive. And that's

1634
01:27:21,240 --> 01:27:23,000
Speaker 3: where the people come in. You have to support those

1635
01:27:23,000 --> 01:27:26,040
Speaker 3: independent candidates and make it viable for people who put

1636
01:27:26,040 --> 01:27:28,080
Speaker 3: country over party, and the people that want to kill

1637
01:27:28,120 --> 01:27:29,479
Speaker 3: it the most are the parties.

1638
01:27:29,800 --> 01:27:31,640
Speaker 2: The parties do not want us to do this.

1639
01:27:32,120 --> 01:27:36,800
Speaker 3: That's why when Brad Lander and Mom Donnie when they won,

1640
01:27:37,280 --> 01:27:39,479
Speaker 3: one of the first things they did was kill the

1641
01:27:39,560 --> 01:27:41,800
Speaker 3: open primaries initiative to get on the ballot in New

1642
01:27:41,840 --> 01:27:44,040
Speaker 3: York City because they want to slam the door behind him.

1643
01:27:44,160 --> 01:27:47,839
Speaker 3: The DSA ran the table, they worked the Democratic primary,

1644
01:27:48,040 --> 01:27:50,640
Speaker 3: and they want to ensure there are no open primaries

1645
01:27:50,680 --> 01:27:52,960
Speaker 3: going forward. Because if you want a counter to Mom

1646
01:27:53,040 --> 01:27:56,519
Speaker 3: Donnie or Trump, open primaries is probably it.

1647
01:27:57,880 --> 01:28:00,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, look, it's the two parties. So the reason why

1648
01:28:02,760 --> 01:28:04,880
Speaker 1: you can't it is so difficult in some states to

1649
01:28:04,880 --> 01:28:06,920
Speaker 1: even get on the ballot, which I know you're experiencing

1650
01:28:07,400 --> 01:28:09,400
Speaker 1: with what you're helping. Let me flip the script there

1651
01:28:09,520 --> 01:28:13,720
Speaker 1: this way, if you were if the Democratic Party and

1652
01:28:13,760 --> 01:28:16,280
Speaker 1: the and or the Republican Party came to you. In fact,

1653
01:28:16,320 --> 01:28:19,360
Speaker 1: I wanted you to answer both questions, and they say, okay, Paul,

1654
01:28:21,320 --> 01:28:23,600
Speaker 1: we're we need to figure out how to appeal to

1655
01:28:23,720 --> 01:28:27,960
Speaker 1: this large block of independent veterans. What's your advice to

1656
01:28:28,000 --> 01:28:30,760
Speaker 1: the Democrats? What's your advice to the Republicans? Is it

1657
01:28:30,760 --> 01:28:32,759
Speaker 1: the same or is it different advice for each party?

1658
01:28:33,280 --> 01:28:35,040
Speaker 2: Well, they do that, I will tell you, Cantley.

1659
01:28:35,040 --> 01:28:37,280
Speaker 3: I hear from a lot of elected leaders and leaders

1660
01:28:37,280 --> 01:28:39,759
Speaker 3: from both parties, and what I tell them, most of folles,

1661
01:28:40,160 --> 01:28:43,880
Speaker 3: drop your party affiliation because your brand is shit. You

1662
01:28:43,920 --> 01:28:47,519
Speaker 3: can't the minute you put in our d the truth

1663
01:28:47,640 --> 01:28:48,680
Speaker 3: nothing but skepticism.

1664
01:28:48,680 --> 01:28:49,840
Speaker 2: For this is the truth is.

1665
01:28:50,400 --> 01:28:54,360
Speaker 3: That Americans don't trust Republicans or Democrats, and their brands

1666
01:28:54,400 --> 01:28:57,400
Speaker 3: are sinking. You know, Like I think ten thousand people

1667
01:28:57,439 --> 01:29:00,720
Speaker 3: are leaving the Democratic and Republican Party every single day.

1668
01:29:01,000 --> 01:29:01,800
Speaker 2: They're checking out.

1669
01:29:01,840 --> 01:29:04,760
Speaker 3: And I think it's a new normal where people can

1670
01:29:04,880 --> 01:29:07,920
Speaker 3: order fifteen different couches from Amazon, but they only have

1671
01:29:08,000 --> 01:29:11,439
Speaker 3: two options on the ballot. People want more choices and

1672
01:29:11,479 --> 01:29:13,760
Speaker 3: that's the future of America in my view. So the

1673
01:29:13,840 --> 01:29:16,839
Speaker 3: number one thing they can do is not be themselves,

1674
01:29:16,880 --> 01:29:19,000
Speaker 3: which is hard for them to do. But I do

1675
01:29:19,040 --> 01:29:21,439
Speaker 3: think it comes down to a focus on national security,

1676
01:29:21,479 --> 01:29:25,840
Speaker 3: for example, focus on issues like law enforcement and first responders,

1677
01:29:26,080 --> 01:29:28,960
Speaker 3: talk about things that they don't want to talk about sometimes.

1678
01:29:28,520 --> 01:29:29,800
Speaker 2: Like taxes. Right.

1679
01:29:30,040 --> 01:29:32,920
Speaker 3: But I do think that most independence more than anything else,

1680
01:29:33,360 --> 01:29:35,880
Speaker 3: want to hear that you will be independent, meaning you

1681
01:29:35,880 --> 01:29:39,160
Speaker 3: won't be beholden to donors, you won't be beholden to parties,

1682
01:29:39,320 --> 01:29:42,639
Speaker 3: you won't be beholden to ideology, and you will truly

1683
01:29:42,720 --> 01:29:45,240
Speaker 3: put the country and your community first. And the ones

1684
01:29:45,240 --> 01:29:48,439
Speaker 3: who can do that with authenticity will get independence right.

1685
01:29:48,439 --> 01:29:51,000
Speaker 2: And Trump knows how to play that tune. He does it.

1686
01:29:51,080 --> 01:29:53,040
Speaker 2: He knows what populism sounds like.

1687
01:29:53,200 --> 01:29:55,640
Speaker 3: He also knows how to capture culture right where you

1688
01:29:55,640 --> 01:29:59,000
Speaker 3: can get politically adjacent people who watch sports, who watch music,

1689
01:29:59,160 --> 01:30:01,439
Speaker 3: and I think those foks are more movable as well.

1690
01:30:01,680 --> 01:30:04,680
Speaker 3: So my advice to them is to legitimately be independent,

1691
01:30:04,800 --> 01:30:06,760
Speaker 3: show you can buck your party, and let me give

1692
01:30:06,760 --> 01:30:10,559
Speaker 3: you a really good example Wes Moore and Gavin Newsom.

1693
01:30:10,840 --> 01:30:13,920
Speaker 3: The redistricting that they're doing in their states is great

1694
01:30:13,920 --> 01:30:16,800
Speaker 3: for the Democrats. In my view, it's bad for our democracy.

1695
01:30:16,960 --> 01:30:20,240
Speaker 3: Fighting fire with fire is not good for America. And

1696
01:30:20,320 --> 01:30:22,480
Speaker 3: I would argue that if they want to attract independence

1697
01:30:22,479 --> 01:30:24,240
Speaker 3: in their states, or if they want to run for president,

1698
01:30:24,760 --> 01:30:28,679
Speaker 3: don't do the redistricting. Don't do the redistricting and support

1699
01:30:28,720 --> 01:30:32,840
Speaker 3: open primaries in your state, which would empower millions of

1700
01:30:32,880 --> 01:30:35,120
Speaker 3: people to vote equally in your state. That's a really

1701
01:30:35,120 --> 01:30:38,280
Speaker 3: easy one, Chuck. You can understand and appreciate the true

1702
01:30:38,320 --> 01:30:42,040
Speaker 3: cowardice of a democratic Republican. If they won't support open primaries,

1703
01:30:42,439 --> 01:30:45,240
Speaker 3: they won't support an equal vote for someone like me

1704
01:30:45,280 --> 01:30:48,280
Speaker 3: who serve their country and doesn't have the same power

1705
01:30:48,520 --> 01:30:51,800
Speaker 3: as someone who decides to run to participate in their

1706
01:30:51,880 --> 01:30:56,400
Speaker 3: private primary, which is publicly funded, uses public resources and

1707
01:30:56,479 --> 01:30:57,320
Speaker 3: public schools.

1708
01:30:57,880 --> 01:30:58,040
Speaker 2: Right.

1709
01:30:58,520 --> 01:31:01,200
Speaker 1: Oh, I don't see how it's constant. I don't think

1710
01:31:01,240 --> 01:31:03,800
Speaker 1: that this stuff is unconstitutional. I think it violates the

1711
01:31:03,840 --> 01:31:06,120
Speaker 1: equal Protection Clause. And I think the idea that I

1712
01:31:06,160 --> 01:31:08,759
Speaker 1: got to register for a party. Luckily I live in Virginia,

1713
01:31:09,000 --> 01:31:12,320
Speaker 1: no party registration, so I can I've got all the

1714
01:31:12,360 --> 01:31:15,280
Speaker 1: freedom as a voter. That is not the case. I

1715
01:31:15,280 --> 01:31:17,439
Speaker 1: believe you're in New York. Not the case in New York.

1716
01:31:18,040 --> 01:31:21,760
Speaker 1: And that's just I thought we used to call those

1717
01:31:21,800 --> 01:31:25,519
Speaker 1: poll taxes. No, that's right, that's exactly right. And I

1718
01:31:25,520 --> 01:31:27,439
Speaker 1: think it's really important for people to think about this. Look,

1719
01:31:27,720 --> 01:31:29,920
Speaker 1: I would argue everyone should declare their independence.

1720
01:31:30,360 --> 01:31:32,280
Speaker 3: Right, you have a lot more power as a voter

1721
01:31:32,400 --> 01:31:34,640
Speaker 3: if you are politically and now you could argue you

1722
01:31:34,680 --> 01:31:37,160
Speaker 3: want to vote in the primaries, but this is the

1723
01:31:37,240 --> 01:31:39,599
Speaker 3: way things are going. And if you just give them

1724
01:31:39,640 --> 01:31:42,439
Speaker 3: your name, you give them your affiliation, and you don't

1725
01:31:42,439 --> 01:31:45,519
Speaker 3: make them work for it, you're an easy get right.

1726
01:31:45,560 --> 01:31:48,599
Speaker 3: And I think more Americans are tired of that, and

1727
01:31:48,640 --> 01:31:51,080
Speaker 3: they don't feel like they feel like the Republicans are

1728
01:31:51,280 --> 01:31:54,360
Speaker 3: driving our country off a cliff and the Democrats can't

1729
01:31:54,400 --> 01:31:57,400
Speaker 3: stop them. So they want alternatives who can hold the

1730
01:31:57,439 --> 01:32:02,040
Speaker 3: line and represent more people. I do think they want unity, right,

1731
01:32:02,080 --> 01:32:04,760
Speaker 3: And if you're an independent, I think you can legitimately

1732
01:32:04,880 --> 01:32:08,080
Speaker 3: offer unity and at the same time challenge people who

1733
01:32:08,080 --> 01:32:08,559
Speaker 3: are extreme.

1734
01:32:08,600 --> 01:32:11,200
Speaker 2: Whether you view Trump or Mom Donnie as extreme.

1735
01:32:13,040 --> 01:32:15,320
Speaker 1: Let's let's try to get at lighter here at the

1736
01:32:15,400 --> 01:32:19,960
Speaker 1: end you're trying to you you're running an independent media operation.

1737
01:32:20,080 --> 01:32:22,200
Speaker 1: I'm running an independent media operation. I'll tell you the

1738
01:32:22,200 --> 01:32:27,479
Speaker 1: one thing that I feel growing with me all the time,

1739
01:32:27,560 --> 01:32:31,879
Speaker 1: which is I feel like I'm so focused on content

1740
01:32:32,080 --> 01:32:34,720
Speaker 1: that I'm not doing enough ingestion, and I have to

1741
01:32:34,720 --> 01:32:38,880
Speaker 1: carve out time and it is increasingly difficult to keep

1742
01:32:38,960 --> 01:32:43,960
Speaker 1: up simply because there's more good content available than ever before,

1743
01:32:44,080 --> 01:32:47,920
Speaker 1: thanks to sort of this massive fragmentation. We're all you know,

1744
01:32:48,720 --> 01:32:51,920
Speaker 1: I mean, look at the world of podcasts. There are

1745
01:32:52,000 --> 01:32:54,559
Speaker 1: more hours of podcasts that I want to listen to

1746
01:32:54,600 --> 01:32:57,160
Speaker 1: than I have time during the week. How do you

1747
01:32:57,200 --> 01:33:00,240
Speaker 1: do it? What's your diet? Give me your diet? How

1748
01:33:00,240 --> 01:33:05,559
Speaker 1: do you still do leisurely reading and podcasts listening? Because

1749
01:33:05,560 --> 01:33:08,240
Speaker 1: I think finding that's the time I'm struggling to find.

1750
01:33:08,280 --> 01:33:12,760
Speaker 1: It's like everything is all geared towards the work product

1751
01:33:12,880 --> 01:33:19,479
Speaker 1: that I'm finding myself missing my casual stuff. You know,

1752
01:33:19,640 --> 01:33:22,360
Speaker 1: whatever it is, your sports podcast, maybe a movie pod,

1753
01:33:22,479 --> 01:33:25,479
Speaker 1: whatever it is. I'm curious. You're doing a lot. That's

1754
01:33:25,520 --> 01:33:27,240
Speaker 1: why I got to think. And you've got a kid

1755
01:33:27,280 --> 01:33:30,439
Speaker 1: at home. Still I'm empty nest, Yeah, I'm empty nest.

1756
01:33:30,439 --> 01:33:33,599
Speaker 1: So I've got a little less of that responsibility. How

1757
01:33:33,600 --> 01:33:34,680
Speaker 1: are you balancing this?

1758
01:33:35,600 --> 01:33:38,519
Speaker 3: I mean, the short answer is discipline, right, and that

1759
01:33:38,560 --> 01:33:41,120
Speaker 3: comes from the military, and part it comes from being

1760
01:33:41,200 --> 01:33:42,120
Speaker 3: a social entrepreneur.

1761
01:33:42,200 --> 01:33:44,320
Speaker 2: An entrepreneur comes from being a dad.

1762
01:33:44,600 --> 01:33:48,360
Speaker 3: But I am extremely rigorous about getting up at a

1763
01:33:48,439 --> 01:33:51,080
Speaker 3: very early time each day. And the first thing I

1764
01:33:51,120 --> 01:33:53,519
Speaker 3: do is I go get some sunlight, and I make

1765
01:33:53,560 --> 01:33:55,760
Speaker 3: sure I get direct sun, and I get some fresh air,

1766
01:33:55,800 --> 01:33:57,680
Speaker 3: and I get some coffee, and I get to do

1767
01:33:57,720 --> 01:34:01,080
Speaker 3: some breathing and stretching and exercise and a really cold

1768
01:34:01,120 --> 01:34:03,840
Speaker 3: shower because I want to do hard things to start

1769
01:34:03,880 --> 01:34:05,080
Speaker 3: my day, and I get interested.

1770
01:34:06,040 --> 01:34:07,120
Speaker 1: You're a cold shower guy.

1771
01:34:07,200 --> 01:34:07,960
Speaker 2: I don't have a cold.

1772
01:34:08,240 --> 01:34:09,640
Speaker 3: I live in New York City, so I can't have

1773
01:34:09,680 --> 01:34:12,120
Speaker 3: a cold plunge, and I don't have a lake outside.

1774
01:34:12,160 --> 01:34:15,080
Speaker 3: But I do think starting my day without my phone,

1775
01:34:15,600 --> 01:34:17,800
Speaker 3: where I can set the tempo, I can lay out

1776
01:34:17,800 --> 01:34:19,920
Speaker 3: my goals, I can reflect and get my body in

1777
01:34:19,960 --> 01:34:22,920
Speaker 3: my mind right, is really really key before the kids

1778
01:34:22,920 --> 01:34:25,720
Speaker 3: get up, before the assault of news comes. And then

1779
01:34:25,760 --> 01:34:28,840
Speaker 3: I do read like I mean, I read newspapers and

1780
01:34:28,920 --> 01:34:32,000
Speaker 3: international papers and blogs. I try to consume as much

1781
01:34:32,040 --> 01:34:35,400
Speaker 3: information as I can because part of my job is

1782
01:34:35,439 --> 01:34:37,519
Speaker 3: helping people navigate it, and that's the I think the

1783
01:34:37,560 --> 01:34:41,040
Speaker 3: upside of this, Chuck is that you are like a

1784
01:34:41,040 --> 01:34:43,439
Speaker 3: compass for people. You're an asthmyth, and I think at

1785
01:34:43,479 --> 01:34:46,360
Speaker 3: times like this, it's our job to help people process

1786
01:34:46,400 --> 01:34:49,120
Speaker 3: and find a path through the chaos. And that's the

1787
01:34:49,160 --> 01:34:51,559
Speaker 3: exciting part here is I think they actually can trust us.

1788
01:34:51,600 --> 01:34:54,080
Speaker 3: We don't have corporate sponsors and we don't have to

1789
01:34:54,360 --> 01:34:57,080
Speaker 3: run by agrads all the time. We can wake up

1790
01:34:57,120 --> 01:34:59,000
Speaker 3: and focus on the things we care about, and I

1791
01:34:59,040 --> 01:35:02,000
Speaker 3: do think that it requires me to be especially disciplined

1792
01:35:02,040 --> 01:35:05,639
Speaker 3: around things like veterans issues. I'm covering the suicide numbers,

1793
01:35:05,680 --> 01:35:08,799
Speaker 3: even though it's not exciting first responders issues.

1794
01:35:08,840 --> 01:35:10,600
Speaker 2: I'm focused on the fact that the nine to.

1795
01:35:10,600 --> 01:35:13,360
Speaker 3: Eleven records have not been fully released, right because I

1796
01:35:13,400 --> 01:35:15,840
Speaker 3: know who my audience is, I know who my community is.

1797
01:35:16,360 --> 01:35:18,880
Speaker 3: Vets are depending on me to talk about the VA

1798
01:35:19,200 --> 01:35:22,559
Speaker 3: because almost nobody else does, right, and that forces me,

1799
01:35:22,680 --> 01:35:26,000
Speaker 3: I think, to have a degree of discipline, And frankly,

1800
01:35:26,080 --> 01:35:29,000
Speaker 3: national security is the ultimate clarifier. So if I'm worried

1801
01:35:29,000 --> 01:35:32,280
Speaker 3: about too much stuff, you know, nukes are a great clarifier.

1802
01:35:32,479 --> 01:35:36,120
Speaker 3: Attacks on Iran are a great clarifier. I still also

1803
01:35:36,160 --> 01:35:39,479
Speaker 3: have to make time for joy and for creativity. So

1804
01:35:39,520 --> 01:35:41,600
Speaker 3: you and I talked on my show about.

1805
01:35:41,360 --> 01:35:42,560
Speaker 2: You know, fallout.

1806
01:35:42,640 --> 01:35:44,719
Speaker 1: I know we got it. Both got obsessed with that.

1807
01:35:44,880 --> 01:35:45,840
Speaker 2: Right fallout.

1808
01:35:45,960 --> 01:35:48,840
Speaker 3: And you know, I love Landman and I watch tons

1809
01:35:48,880 --> 01:35:51,800
Speaker 3: of sports, but I think it's also important.

1810
01:35:51,320 --> 01:35:53,439
Speaker 2: Too, Chuck. I shut it off when I spend time

1811
01:35:53,439 --> 01:35:53,960
Speaker 2: with my boys.

1812
01:35:54,600 --> 01:35:56,800
Speaker 3: And there's nothing more important to me than being with

1813
01:35:56,880 --> 01:35:59,759
Speaker 3: my boys who are ten and six, and I coach,

1814
01:36:00,600 --> 01:36:03,040
Speaker 3: which I think is the most important clarifier, because I

1815
01:36:03,040 --> 01:36:05,400
Speaker 3: can't turn on my phone, I can't get distracted.

1816
01:36:05,680 --> 01:36:07,880
Speaker 2: I've got six year olds on a football field or.

1817
01:36:07,800 --> 01:36:10,680
Speaker 3: A basketball court and they're all looking at me, and that,

1818
01:36:10,720 --> 01:36:12,559
Speaker 3: in some ways is the most important thing I think

1819
01:36:12,560 --> 01:36:15,520
Speaker 3: many of us can do, which is demonstrate good leadership

1820
01:36:15,760 --> 01:36:19,280
Speaker 3: and be good role models in our community. And I

1821
01:36:19,320 --> 01:36:21,880
Speaker 3: tell my boys all the time, you gotta read readers

1822
01:36:21,960 --> 01:36:24,599
Speaker 3: or leaders. It's over my shoulder here. My son won

1823
01:36:24,760 --> 01:36:30,360
Speaker 3: super reader, and you gotta be disciplined and read, Chuck.

1824
01:36:30,400 --> 01:36:31,639
Speaker 2: That's my long winded answer.

1825
01:36:31,680 --> 01:36:34,120
Speaker 3: Beyond the cold showers and doing lots of push ups

1826
01:36:34,120 --> 01:36:36,040
Speaker 3: and stretching, you got to read people.

1827
01:36:36,120 --> 01:36:41,960
Speaker 1: You got to read the Colt shower ideas. That's something

1828
01:36:42,040 --> 01:36:45,280
Speaker 1: I might. I might because I'm an obsessive early riser

1829
01:36:45,280 --> 01:36:47,800
Speaker 1: for the same reason I want as much time without

1830
01:36:47,880 --> 01:36:50,960
Speaker 1: distractions as I can. Yeah, right, And the only time

1831
01:36:51,000 --> 01:36:54,080
Speaker 1: of day you can get it is somewhere between four

1832
01:36:54,080 --> 01:36:54,599
Speaker 1: and seven.

1833
01:36:55,479 --> 01:36:55,679
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1834
01:36:55,720 --> 01:36:57,719
Speaker 3: I mean, I like doing one of the hardest things

1835
01:36:57,720 --> 01:37:00,080
Speaker 3: possible to start my day, because then I know I

1836
01:37:00,160 --> 01:37:01,120
Speaker 3: knocked out something hard.

1837
01:37:01,120 --> 01:37:03,000
Speaker 2: I mean, I'm not a craven making my bed.

1838
01:37:03,120 --> 01:37:06,720
Speaker 3: Making my beds important too, But if you freeze your

1839
01:37:06,760 --> 01:37:09,439
Speaker 3: ass off in a nice coal shower, you're awake and

1840
01:37:09,479 --> 01:37:10,960
Speaker 3: you know that you can do other.

1841
01:37:10,800 --> 01:37:11,519
Speaker 2: Things after that.

1842
01:37:11,640 --> 01:37:14,439
Speaker 3: But I also think it's very very important for us

1843
01:37:14,479 --> 01:37:17,400
Speaker 3: to talk about mental health, and it's about your mental

1844
01:37:17,400 --> 01:37:19,640
Speaker 3: health and making sure you taking care of yourself and

1845
01:37:19,680 --> 01:37:22,400
Speaker 3: what is not only chaotic times, but likely to be

1846
01:37:22,520 --> 01:37:25,800
Speaker 3: sustained chaotic times. This is our new normal, Chuck, there

1847
01:37:25,800 --> 01:37:27,840
Speaker 3: are going to be no days off from the news cycle.

1848
01:37:27,920 --> 01:37:30,760
Speaker 1: Hey, listen, citizenship is active, you know. I remember the

1849
01:37:30,800 --> 01:37:38,160
Speaker 1: first time I visited Israel. It was an six And look,

1850
01:37:38,479 --> 01:37:40,040
Speaker 1: there are a lot of people that have very strong

1851
01:37:40,080 --> 01:37:42,439
Speaker 1: opinions about Israel in the moment because of what happened

1852
01:37:42,479 --> 01:37:46,120
Speaker 1: in Gaza, and I respect that, but what I want

1853
01:37:46,120 --> 01:37:49,040
Speaker 1: to drive at in Israel is an Israel. To be

1854
01:37:49,080 --> 01:37:54,040
Speaker 1: a citizen is an active job. You're surrounded. It's you know,

1855
01:37:54,160 --> 01:37:56,639
Speaker 1: being the only democracy sort of from a you know,

1856
01:37:56,920 --> 01:38:00,760
Speaker 1: one of the in that region, or certainly more democratic

1857
01:38:00,840 --> 01:38:06,080
Speaker 1: than than than other other entities in that region. It

1858
01:38:06,240 --> 01:38:10,000
Speaker 1: is you've got to be a participant. It's a there's

1859
01:38:10,040 --> 01:38:13,760
Speaker 1: an activist, there's an there's an activist mindset to be

1860
01:38:13,840 --> 01:38:17,760
Speaker 1: a citizen in Israel. We had that in this country

1861
01:38:17,920 --> 01:38:20,559
Speaker 1: for over one hundred years. You know, when you read

1862
01:38:20,560 --> 01:38:22,960
Speaker 1: Detchfold Democracy in America and he was trying to figure

1863
01:38:22,960 --> 01:38:25,840
Speaker 1: you know, sort of figure this out. And he was

1864
01:38:25,880 --> 01:38:29,639
Speaker 1: this outside observer, you know, he marveled at a few things,

1865
01:38:29,640 --> 01:38:32,320
Speaker 1: how interested and local we were, and sort of how

1866
01:38:32,360 --> 01:38:33,479
Speaker 1: active everybody was.

1867
01:38:33,560 --> 01:38:33,960
Speaker 2: It was.

1868
01:38:34,080 --> 01:38:39,639
Speaker 1: It was participatory. It does feel as if we got

1869
01:38:39,720 --> 01:38:44,040
Speaker 1: you know, and I vacillate on this. Perhaps apathy is

1870
01:38:44,080 --> 01:38:48,040
Speaker 1: a sign of stability. And it is not lost on

1871
01:38:48,080 --> 01:38:50,599
Speaker 1: me that our highest turnouts over the last in my

1872
01:38:50,680 --> 01:38:54,040
Speaker 1: lifetime have all come since the era of Trump. That

1873
01:38:54,120 --> 01:38:58,719
Speaker 1: the instability Trump is is uh brought to the system

1874
01:38:59,360 --> 01:39:02,600
Speaker 1: has brought more people to pay attention, and we have

1875
01:39:02,680 --> 01:39:06,519
Speaker 1: higher vote We've had higher voter participation rates, pure and simple.

1876
01:39:07,800 --> 01:39:10,360
Speaker 1: It's interesting to me that it's it's because people are

1877
01:39:10,400 --> 01:39:12,840
Speaker 1: nervous that they show up to the polls, not because

1878
01:39:12,880 --> 01:39:19,200
Speaker 1: people are satisfied. And so I I I vacillate there

1879
01:39:19,200 --> 01:39:22,720
Speaker 1: on that. But I wonder, you know, how do we

1880
01:39:22,840 --> 01:39:25,680
Speaker 1: make people feel as if you know, hey, look, citizenship

1881
01:39:25,800 --> 01:39:30,719
Speaker 1: is there's it is a job, and you can't be passive.

1882
01:39:31,960 --> 01:39:35,519
Speaker 2: Yeah, vigilance is the price of freedom. Talk about it.

1883
01:39:35,720 --> 01:39:37,160
Speaker 1: What's your tagline? You say it all the.

1884
01:39:37,160 --> 01:39:39,839
Speaker 2: Time, stay vigilant.

1885
01:39:39,840 --> 01:39:41,800
Speaker 1: And I'm going to build on why you say that.

1886
01:39:41,840 --> 01:39:42,640
Speaker 1: What do you mean by it?

1887
01:39:42,640 --> 01:39:45,200
Speaker 3: Well, because you know I would put it in in

1888
01:39:45,479 --> 01:39:49,160
Speaker 3: these most focused terms. Somebody once said, you know, you

1889
01:39:49,200 --> 01:39:52,360
Speaker 3: might not be into politics, but politics is into you,

1890
01:39:52,439 --> 01:39:55,160
Speaker 3: right And and I think the reality that folks need

1891
01:39:55,200 --> 01:39:59,120
Speaker 3: to face, either now or later, is that your democracy,

1892
01:39:59,400 --> 01:40:03,960
Speaker 3: your freedom, your security, your economic prosperity, in my view,

1893
01:40:04,040 --> 01:40:06,240
Speaker 3: is under direct threat right now, whether you know it

1894
01:40:06,320 --> 01:40:08,519
Speaker 3: or not. There is a war going on in America

1895
01:40:08,600 --> 01:40:10,719
Speaker 3: for the soul of America, for the future of our country.

1896
01:40:10,760 --> 01:40:13,679
Speaker 3: And I would argue for freedom worldwide. So my job

1897
01:40:14,080 --> 01:40:16,360
Speaker 3: is to is to fight for freedom foreign and domestics,

1898
01:40:16,360 --> 01:40:19,200
Speaker 3: supporting you know, the freedom fighters in Ukraine and supporting

1899
01:40:19,479 --> 01:40:21,639
Speaker 3: protesters in Minneapolis who are standing up for.

1900
01:40:21,600 --> 01:40:22,719
Speaker 2: The constitutional rights.

1901
01:40:22,920 --> 01:40:25,760
Speaker 3: In my view, this is a moment some folks in

1902
01:40:25,840 --> 01:40:28,599
Speaker 3: generations say, I wish I lived in the Civil rights time.

1903
01:40:28,640 --> 01:40:29,920
Speaker 2: I wish I lived during Vietnam.

1904
01:40:30,240 --> 01:40:31,920
Speaker 1: We are here now, We're here now.

1905
01:40:31,960 --> 01:40:32,760
Speaker 2: I used to buy the way.

1906
01:40:32,800 --> 01:40:33,799
Speaker 1: I was one of those people.

1907
01:40:34,000 --> 01:40:34,200
Speaker 2: Yeah.

1908
01:40:34,200 --> 01:40:36,759
Speaker 1: I remember as a reporter, young reporter in the nineties,

1909
01:40:36,880 --> 01:40:40,320
Speaker 1: I used to think, oh, man, I there's a part

1910
01:40:40,360 --> 01:40:43,360
Speaker 1: of me that wishes I had I had something more

1911
01:40:43,680 --> 01:40:45,559
Speaker 1: defining for the country to cover.

1912
01:40:46,200 --> 01:40:48,800
Speaker 3: Little did I know. And it is literally, it is

1913
01:40:48,880 --> 01:40:52,599
Speaker 3: literally at your doorstep. Right, this is you and I,

1914
01:40:52,720 --> 01:40:54,599
Speaker 3: You and I, Chuck. Let's break it down right, talk

1915
01:40:54,640 --> 01:41:00,200
Speaker 3: about independent media. They arrested Don Lemon. They can arrest you.

1916
01:41:00,240 --> 01:41:02,680
Speaker 3: They can arrest me. They can arrest anybody with a

1917
01:41:02,720 --> 01:41:06,519
Speaker 3: substack account, right, anybody who speaks out. If you're a

1918
01:41:06,520 --> 01:41:10,240
Speaker 3: military retiree like Senator Kelly, you could have posted something

1919
01:41:10,280 --> 01:41:12,479
Speaker 3: on your Facebook and they could come after.

1920
01:41:12,280 --> 01:41:14,479
Speaker 2: You for your retirement. The important point, I think is

1921
01:41:14,479 --> 01:41:15,040
Speaker 2: that Ice.

1922
01:41:14,960 --> 01:41:17,599
Speaker 1: You're not Mark Kelly. If they do that Mark Kelly

1923
01:41:17,680 --> 01:41:19,439
Speaker 1: can at least shine a light on this.

1924
01:41:19,640 --> 01:41:21,200
Speaker 2: Ice has made it immediate.

1925
01:41:21,520 --> 01:41:25,080
Speaker 3: I think everybody can recognize that ICE might knock at

1926
01:41:25,120 --> 01:41:27,479
Speaker 3: your door, and if not your door or your neighbor's door,

1927
01:41:27,640 --> 01:41:29,240
Speaker 3: or they might be outside of the end of your street,

1928
01:41:29,280 --> 01:41:31,080
Speaker 3: or they might snatch up someone you know, or they

1929
01:41:31,160 --> 01:41:33,920
Speaker 3: might disrupt your place of employment. I think that the

1930
01:41:33,960 --> 01:41:36,839
Speaker 3: immediacy of that threat and the clarity of that threat

1931
01:41:37,200 --> 01:41:41,799
Speaker 3: without warrants, without badges, without it feels unconstitutional. It feels unlawful,

1932
01:41:41,800 --> 01:41:45,559
Speaker 3: and really importantly, Chuck, it feels deeply un American. And

1933
01:41:45,600 --> 01:41:47,519
Speaker 3: even for people who can't call it what it is

1934
01:41:47,520 --> 01:41:51,000
Speaker 3: now they're understanding that feels deeply un American. And it's

1935
01:41:51,080 --> 01:41:54,200
Speaker 3: it's inspiring a new kind of patriotism that's really about

1936
01:41:54,240 --> 01:41:54,599
Speaker 3: a fight.

1937
01:41:54,920 --> 01:41:55,960
Speaker 2: You've got to fight for it.

1938
01:41:56,080 --> 01:41:58,240
Speaker 3: And if you think you can be a pedestrian right now,

1939
01:41:58,280 --> 01:42:00,760
Speaker 3: if you think you're not on the battlefield, then you're

1940
01:42:00,800 --> 01:42:03,840
Speaker 3: the prey, right And that's the approach I take for

1941
01:42:03,920 --> 01:42:05,400
Speaker 3: everybody in this country right now.

1942
01:42:05,479 --> 01:42:07,760
Speaker 1: Right So when are you running for office.

1943
01:42:09,160 --> 01:42:12,880
Speaker 3: If it becomes viable for an independent Chuck, right, I mean,

1944
01:42:12,920 --> 01:42:14,639
Speaker 3: And that's the truth. Like I have thought about running

1945
01:42:14,640 --> 01:42:16,719
Speaker 3: for office. I've been recruited by both parties.

1946
01:42:16,760 --> 01:42:18,840
Speaker 1: Actually, you're a New York City resident, right.

1947
01:42:18,960 --> 01:42:21,360
Speaker 3: I am a New York City resident, and I am

1948
01:42:21,400 --> 01:42:24,479
Speaker 3: a political independent. If I was a billionaire, maybe I

1949
01:42:24,520 --> 01:42:27,360
Speaker 3: could run against Kathy Hokel as an independent, and if

1950
01:42:27,400 --> 01:42:30,479
Speaker 3: she was running against someone like Stephanic, maybe there's a

1951
01:42:30,479 --> 01:42:33,559
Speaker 3: pathway for me. But the reality is, I'm trying to

1952
01:42:33,560 --> 01:42:38,160
Speaker 3: build the infrastructure for people like me and for thousands

1953
01:42:38,160 --> 01:42:40,200
Speaker 3: of others who want to run. So that's where I'm

1954
01:42:40,200 --> 01:42:43,160
Speaker 3: focused right now, is you using my microphone to fight

1955
01:42:43,280 --> 01:42:46,519
Speaker 3: for freedom and democracy and to try to create a

1956
01:42:46,560 --> 01:42:49,479
Speaker 3: pathway for others. And that's really why what we're building

1957
01:42:49,640 --> 01:42:52,160
Speaker 3: with independent veterans of America is so important. We have

1958
01:42:52,240 --> 01:42:55,200
Speaker 3: to make it viable for people like Man. Maybe for you, Chuck,

1959
01:42:55,360 --> 01:42:58,439
Speaker 3: you know, I assume you're politically independent. We need folks

1960
01:42:58,479 --> 01:43:00,240
Speaker 3: like you and the game as well. But we're starting

1961
01:43:00,439 --> 01:43:02,760
Speaker 3: with veterans as a tip of the spear because we

1962
01:43:02,800 --> 01:43:04,880
Speaker 3: think it's the easiest to understand. It's I think they're

1963
01:43:04,880 --> 01:43:08,519
Speaker 3: the most incredible, Yeah leaders, We want to create a given.

1964
01:43:09,120 --> 01:43:12,120
Speaker 3: We want to create a model for veterans that's scalable

1965
01:43:12,160 --> 01:43:15,360
Speaker 3: for any independent American that wants to run for office.

1966
01:43:15,400 --> 01:43:18,160
Speaker 3: So for now, I'm building the machine. I'm supporting my

1967
01:43:18,160 --> 01:43:21,360
Speaker 3: brothers and sisters. I'm excited about the candidates that we've gotten.

1968
01:43:21,400 --> 01:43:23,320
Speaker 3: I'll tell you one other thing, Chuck, I say this

1969
01:43:23,360 --> 01:43:26,120
Speaker 3: a lot. I'm kind of like Zelenski. I don't need

1970
01:43:26,160 --> 01:43:29,479
Speaker 3: a ride. I need AMMO. Right, we need ammunition for

1971
01:43:29,560 --> 01:43:30,000
Speaker 3: this fight.

1972
01:43:30,120 --> 01:43:32,120
Speaker 1: And so letting people got say they want to help

1973
01:43:32,160 --> 01:43:32,439
Speaker 1: you out.

1974
01:43:32,920 --> 01:43:37,120
Speaker 3: Independent Veterans of America dot org you can help us recruit, train,

1975
01:43:37,280 --> 01:43:40,320
Speaker 3: support independent veterans to run for office, but also to

1976
01:43:40,360 --> 01:43:42,720
Speaker 3: be actors in their community. And there's a campaign we

1977
01:43:42,880 --> 01:43:45,920
Speaker 3: just launched yesterday, Chuck that I think is important. We're

1978
01:43:45,960 --> 01:43:49,599
Speaker 3: focusing specifically on veterans because one third of ICE agents

1979
01:43:49,600 --> 01:43:53,000
Speaker 3: are veterans. ICE is heavily recruiting veterans. We're saying, don't

1980
01:43:53,080 --> 01:43:56,600
Speaker 3: join ICE, join us, Join us instead of ICE. You

1981
01:43:56,600 --> 01:43:58,880
Speaker 3: want to serve your community, you want to lead for

1982
01:43:58,960 --> 01:44:01,120
Speaker 3: the people around you. You want to do something that's

1983
01:44:01,120 --> 01:44:03,960
Speaker 3: truly patriotic and not do something criminal that might end

1984
01:44:04,040 --> 01:44:06,840
Speaker 3: up putting you in jail. Down the line, don't join ICE,

1985
01:44:07,080 --> 01:44:09,960
Speaker 3: join us. We need you, your country needs you. You

1986
01:44:10,000 --> 01:44:11,840
Speaker 3: don't have to run for office, but you can start

1987
01:44:11,840 --> 01:44:14,240
Speaker 3: at school board. And if that's not interesting to you,

1988
01:44:14,240 --> 01:44:15,760
Speaker 3: you can support other people who can.

1989
01:44:16,280 --> 01:44:18,240
Speaker 2: And we are the future, Chuck. I say that we're

1990
01:44:18,240 --> 01:44:19,120
Speaker 2: not moving the needle.

1991
01:44:19,200 --> 01:44:21,600
Speaker 3: We are the needle, and the future of politics in

1992
01:44:21,640 --> 01:44:24,360
Speaker 3: America is independent and we're recruiting.

1993
01:44:24,479 --> 01:44:26,120
Speaker 2: So, Chuck, I hope you can run one day.

1994
01:44:26,160 --> 01:44:32,439
Speaker 1: Look, man, your enthusiasm is infectious and your determination is

1995
01:44:32,840 --> 01:44:36,160
Speaker 1: you know, let's just say that you strike me as

1996
01:44:36,160 --> 01:44:37,960
Speaker 1: somebody that ought to be at the front of this line,

1997
01:44:38,720 --> 01:44:40,400
Speaker 1: not just the head recruiter.

1998
01:44:40,520 --> 01:44:40,760
Speaker 2: Brother.

1999
01:44:41,600 --> 01:44:44,360
Speaker 3: Well, you know, I'm trying to be effective in whatever

2000
01:44:44,400 --> 01:44:46,960
Speaker 3: way I can if that moment comes and I can

2001
01:44:47,040 --> 01:44:47,400
Speaker 3: meet it.

2002
01:44:47,520 --> 01:44:50,120
Speaker 1: Get those boys raised. I do think focus on that

2003
01:44:50,240 --> 01:44:52,080
Speaker 1: this politics ain't great for kids.

2004
01:44:52,560 --> 01:44:55,040
Speaker 2: No, And look, Chuck, that's a real thing too.

2005
01:44:55,040 --> 01:44:58,200
Speaker 3: I got little kids, and you know that it's a

2006
01:44:58,320 --> 01:45:01,320
Speaker 3: very difficult environment. But I also will tell you I'm

2007
01:45:01,360 --> 01:45:03,639
Speaker 3: not kicking the can down the road. I do think

2008
01:45:03,680 --> 01:45:06,599
Speaker 3: in this year, in this moment, I want to create

2009
01:45:07,160 --> 01:45:10,840
Speaker 3: hundreds of George Washington's right, hundreds of Dan Osborne's, hundreds

2010
01:45:10,880 --> 01:45:13,000
Speaker 3: of mc craven's, and they're ready to go.

2011
01:45:13,120 --> 01:45:13,360
Speaker 2: Chuck.

2012
01:45:13,400 --> 01:45:15,720
Speaker 3: Every day we hear from more and said, you know what,

2013
01:45:16,000 --> 01:45:17,800
Speaker 3: I never wanted to get in, but I'm in now,

2014
01:45:18,200 --> 01:45:22,400
Speaker 3: and Ice in particular has been a really activating threat

2015
01:45:22,840 --> 01:45:24,760
Speaker 3: in a way I never could have imagined.

2016
01:45:25,040 --> 01:45:26,439
Speaker 2: So I hope it's not just veterans.

2017
01:45:26,439 --> 01:45:30,160
Speaker 3: I hope it's teachers and firefighters and even you know,

2018
01:45:30,920 --> 01:45:33,200
Speaker 3: iconic media figures like yourself.

2019
01:45:33,640 --> 01:45:34,360
Speaker 2: Paul Raykoff.

2020
01:45:35,000 --> 01:45:39,000
Speaker 1: Always fascinating to talk with you. I always learned something

2021
01:45:39,000 --> 01:45:40,519
Speaker 1: and more important, I always feel a little bit better

2022
01:45:40,520 --> 01:45:42,040
Speaker 1: about me in America.

2023
01:45:42,400 --> 01:45:43,559
Speaker 2: Well I feel the same, Chuck.

2024
01:45:43,600 --> 01:45:46,320
Speaker 3: Appreciate all your public service in your years of a

2025
01:45:46,400 --> 01:45:47,519
Speaker 3: leadership in public service.

2026
01:45:47,560 --> 01:45:49,000
Speaker 2: Thank you, Chuck. You got it.

2027
01:45:49,280 --> 01:45:52,080
Speaker 1: And we got one more episode of Fallout right for

2028
01:45:52,160 --> 01:45:52,639
Speaker 1: this season.

2029
01:45:52,720 --> 01:45:56,320
Speaker 3: I haven't watched the last one, neither of I no worry,

2030
01:45:56,360 --> 01:45:56,760
Speaker 3: neither of VI.

2031
01:45:57,160 --> 01:45:58,760
Speaker 2: It's so damn good.

2032
01:46:00,880 --> 01:46:03,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm trying to is it real life or not.

2033
01:46:06,880 --> 01:46:09,160
Speaker 3: I'll tell you what, as we talked about on my

2034
01:46:09,240 --> 01:46:12,200
Speaker 3: show is it has definitely got a lot.

2035
01:46:12,040 --> 01:46:14,160
Speaker 2: Of parallels to our real life right now.

2036
01:46:14,640 --> 01:46:16,559
Speaker 1: And it's sort of what I love about it is

2037
01:46:16,600 --> 01:46:20,519
Speaker 1: I think it's sort of like, here's an extreme ending

2038
01:46:21,479 --> 01:46:22,759
Speaker 1: if we take the wrong path.

2039
01:46:23,720 --> 01:46:25,760
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, if you saw a Handmaid's Tale and

2040
01:46:25,800 --> 01:46:27,719
Speaker 3: you were like, oh my god, that could be our future.

2041
01:46:28,240 --> 01:46:31,200
Speaker 3: Fallout is an even further extension of how bad it

2042
01:46:31,240 --> 01:46:33,599
Speaker 3: can get if you don't stay vigilant.

2043
01:46:34,560 --> 01:46:37,880
Speaker 1: Well, especially in the relationship with corporate America, which is

2044
01:46:38,360 --> 01:46:43,680
Speaker 1: the most fascinating bad guy template that I feel like

2045
01:46:43,720 --> 01:46:47,439
Speaker 1: all of Hollywood is shifting towards these days. Oh yes,

2046
01:46:47,520 --> 01:46:48,720
Speaker 1: they become more corporatized.

2047
01:46:48,800 --> 01:46:51,280
Speaker 2: That's the oh yeah, and the Epstein Files.

2048
01:46:51,040 --> 01:46:52,160
Speaker 1: Or where do we watch Fallout?

2049
01:46:52,160 --> 01:46:55,200
Speaker 3: By the way, we talked about this, Unfortunately you have

2050
01:46:55,240 --> 01:46:56,880
Speaker 3: to watch it on Jeff Bezos's Prime.

2051
01:46:57,520 --> 01:47:03,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, but Thai corporate screed on Jeff Bezos' problem. You

2052
01:47:03,360 --> 01:47:04,000
Speaker 1: can't make it up.

2053
01:47:04,200 --> 01:47:06,320
Speaker 3: Yeah, Well, if you want to create the opposite of

2054
01:47:06,600 --> 01:47:09,519
Speaker 3: Jeff Bezos, it's somebody like Dan Osborne, who's been the

2055
01:47:09,520 --> 01:47:10,479
Speaker 3: guy turning the wrench.

2056
01:47:11,160 --> 01:47:14,240
Speaker 2: And so that's going to be next season on some network.

2057
01:47:14,280 --> 01:47:16,160
Speaker 3: We're going to do a different kind of hero and

2058
01:47:16,200 --> 01:47:18,439
Speaker 3: they're not going to be the billionaires, They're going to.

2059
01:47:18,360 --> 01:47:19,080
Speaker 2: Be the citizens.

2060
01:47:19,520 --> 01:47:19,880
Speaker 1: That's right.

2061
01:47:19,920 --> 01:47:21,920
Speaker 3: And the music is really good and everything else is

2062
01:47:21,960 --> 01:47:23,400
Speaker 3: really good too, right, I mean, it's so.

2063
01:47:23,479 --> 01:47:27,320
Speaker 1: Good, it's it's very good. It is it is all right,

2064
01:47:27,360 --> 01:47:38,360
Speaker 1: brother talk soon, Thank you, sir. Well keep track, as

2065
01:47:38,400 --> 01:47:39,720
Speaker 1: you know, I'm going to be keeping track of these

2066
01:47:39,760 --> 01:47:45,520
Speaker 1: independent candidates running, particularly in South Dakota, Montana, Idaho, Mississippi

2067
01:47:45,920 --> 01:47:48,559
Speaker 1: on the Senate level. Those are the most fascinating to me.

2068
01:47:49,080 --> 01:47:51,880
Speaker 1: Let's see, you know, can they I don't expect any

2069
01:47:51,880 --> 01:47:55,400
Speaker 1: of And of course Dan Osborne and Nebraska. Osborne in

2070
01:47:55,479 --> 01:48:00,400
Speaker 1: Nebraska might be the one that could win. We'll see,

2071
01:48:00,400 --> 01:48:02,560
Speaker 1: since he's been since he's done this before, there's a

2072
01:48:02,560 --> 01:48:05,960
Speaker 1: little more familiarity to him running it as sort of

2073
01:48:06,040 --> 01:48:07,320
Speaker 1: as a populist independent.

2074
01:48:10,720 --> 01:48:11,120
Speaker 2: I think the.

2075
01:48:13,640 --> 01:48:15,880
Speaker 1: Measure of success for those other independent candida can he

2076
01:48:15,920 --> 01:48:19,879
Speaker 1: get in the forties, right, and especially if the Democrats

2077
01:48:19,920 --> 01:48:22,240
Speaker 1: aren't going to put a candidate on the ballot, that

2078
01:48:22,320 --> 01:48:25,479
Speaker 1: gives him perhaps a better shot to get into the

2079
01:48:25,600 --> 01:48:29,200
Speaker 1: low forties in an Idaho or South Dakota. Probably more

2080
01:48:29,240 --> 01:48:31,479
Speaker 1: likely in a South Dakota than Idaho. But we shall

2081
01:48:33,240 --> 01:48:36,760
Speaker 1: we shall see on that. And of course, the most

2082
01:48:36,800 --> 01:48:41,120
Speaker 1: interesting race statewide race featuring an independent I think is

2083
01:48:41,160 --> 01:48:45,839
Speaker 1: the Michigan governor's race with former Democratic Mayor Detroit Mike Dugant.

2084
01:48:46,160 --> 01:48:52,400
Speaker 1: But lay, let's do some questions, ask Chuck. First question,

2085
01:48:52,439 --> 01:48:54,559
Speaker 1: comes from Kevin. He says, Hey, I've heard on your

2086
01:48:54,600 --> 01:48:56,800
Speaker 1: podcast and others that Biden quote failed at the border

2087
01:48:56,840 --> 01:48:59,800
Speaker 1: while Trump succeeded. But that framing feels overly simplistic. Isn't

2088
01:48:59,800 --> 01:49:03,080
Speaker 1: con responsible for immigration policy. Biden may have made the

2089
01:49:03,120 --> 01:49:05,600
Speaker 1: mistake of trusting Congress to act, only for Republicans to

2090
01:49:05,600 --> 01:49:07,799
Speaker 1: back away once Trump wanted a campaign on the issue.

2091
01:49:07,920 --> 01:49:11,240
Speaker 1: Appreciate your centrist approach. There's that centrist word again, right,

2092
01:49:12,000 --> 01:49:14,960
Speaker 1: incrementalist approach is what I would prefer, Kevin, But thank you.

2093
01:49:15,200 --> 01:49:17,599
Speaker 1: I appreciate your centrist approach. But I hope future coverage

2094
01:49:17,640 --> 01:49:20,800
Speaker 1: kids more nuanced scrutiny to both sides. No, it's look

2095
01:49:20,880 --> 01:49:24,200
Speaker 1: what the failure at the border, though, was not allowing

2096
01:49:24,720 --> 01:49:28,880
Speaker 1: look Congress. This issue with the with Congress is five

2097
01:49:29,479 --> 01:49:33,920
Speaker 1: five presidential five president presidential administrations old right. George W.

2098
01:49:34,000 --> 01:49:36,080
Speaker 1: Bush tried to do it No. Five and it blew

2099
01:49:36,160 --> 01:49:40,640
Speaker 1: up in his face. Barack Obama tried to do it

2100
01:49:40,640 --> 01:49:44,160
Speaker 1: in twenty thirteen, with the Gang of Eight. John McCain

2101
01:49:44,240 --> 01:49:47,120
Speaker 1: Mark or Rubio being the two most prominent Republicans a

2102
01:49:47,160 --> 01:49:49,280
Speaker 1: part of that, but John Baynor decided not to put it.

2103
01:49:49,520 --> 01:49:53,640
Speaker 1: John Baynor has said he regrets not putting that comprehensive

2104
01:49:53,680 --> 01:49:58,080
Speaker 1: immigration reform package on the floor of the House. Now,

2105
01:49:58,160 --> 01:49:59,519
Speaker 1: the reason he didn't do it then is it he

2106
01:49:59,520 --> 01:50:02,200
Speaker 1: thought it would cost them as speakership well as he

2107
01:50:02,280 --> 01:50:05,760
Speaker 1: ended up finding out just simply trying to govern was

2108
01:50:05,760 --> 01:50:09,240
Speaker 1: going to eventually cost them as speakership, and that's why

2109
01:50:09,280 --> 01:50:11,639
Speaker 1: he has some regret that he just didn't go for broke.

2110
01:50:11,840 --> 01:50:17,400
Speaker 1: Back then, we saw a near miss DACA for the

2111
01:50:17,160 --> 01:50:21,840
Speaker 1: for the wall. Back in twenty eighteen, Schumer and Trump were,

2112
01:50:22,200 --> 01:50:25,200
Speaker 1: I guess, semi negotiating. Seemed like maybe there'd be some movement,

2113
01:50:26,000 --> 01:50:28,400
Speaker 1: and then there was the pollyannish approach that Biden took.

2114
01:50:28,439 --> 01:50:30,479
Speaker 1: And I'm sorry I take it as a Pollyannish approach

2115
01:50:30,520 --> 01:50:34,000
Speaker 1: because he he was asking for things that were never

2116
01:50:34,040 --> 01:50:36,799
Speaker 1: going you cannot do. You're not going to get immigration

2117
01:50:36,840 --> 01:50:38,800
Speaker 1: reform done unless both parties have skin in the game,

2118
01:50:41,880 --> 01:50:46,599
Speaker 1: and it just it's that was the issue I think

2119
01:50:46,640 --> 01:50:49,720
Speaker 1: with Biden. But what it really was was the enforcement right,

2120
01:50:49,960 --> 01:50:58,720
Speaker 1: not not you know you talked to I want to

2121
01:50:58,720 --> 01:51:00,519
Speaker 1: be careful here, but if you talk to people that

2122
01:51:00,600 --> 01:51:03,639
Speaker 1: worked in Biden's DHS, they will tell you they feel

2123
01:51:03,640 --> 01:51:05,160
Speaker 1: like their hands were tied by the White House in

2124
01:51:05,200 --> 01:51:07,920
Speaker 1: the West Way. And then there was a new chief

2125
01:51:07,920 --> 01:51:09,639
Speaker 1: of Staff in the last two years, and they realized

2126
01:51:09,640 --> 01:51:12,720
Speaker 1: what a political problem was that the border, that there

2127
01:51:12,840 --> 01:51:15,640
Speaker 1: was constant surge at the border, that they weren't deporting

2128
01:51:16,439 --> 01:51:21,519
Speaker 1: folks right away the way they did during Obama's second term,

2129
01:51:21,840 --> 01:51:25,040
Speaker 1: where Jay Johnson, you know, and that's how Obama got

2130
01:51:25,040 --> 01:51:28,080
Speaker 1: the nickname to Porter in Chief Jay Johnson and his

2131
01:51:28,160 --> 01:51:34,439
Speaker 1: deputy Alimi Orcus, who would become Biden's DHS secretary, working

2132
01:51:34,439 --> 01:51:36,920
Speaker 1: with a guy like Tom Holman. By the way, we're

2133
01:51:37,080 --> 01:51:45,559
Speaker 1: keeping the border from becoming congested, overwhelmed, whelming, etc. And look,

2134
01:51:46,200 --> 01:51:49,719
Speaker 1: I've always thought Stephen Miller and Trump deserved more blame

2135
01:51:49,800 --> 01:51:52,000
Speaker 1: for the chaos at the border in twenty twenty one

2136
01:51:52,160 --> 01:51:57,120
Speaker 1: when Biden became president, because Miller scoured the public health

2137
01:51:57,160 --> 01:52:01,840
Speaker 1: emergency laws and ordered to you essentially shut the shut

2138
01:52:01,840 --> 01:52:05,720
Speaker 1: the border down completely, using the public health emergency over

2139
01:52:05,760 --> 01:52:08,360
Speaker 1: COVID to do it. You know, as I've said, he

2140
01:52:08,400 --> 01:52:11,760
Speaker 1: basically kinked the hose, and that's what they handed. They

2141
01:52:11,760 --> 01:52:15,439
Speaker 1: had no policy, and then you know, Biden was was

2142
01:52:15,520 --> 01:52:19,680
Speaker 1: gonna unkink the hose, and it's like Okay, let's reopen

2143
01:52:19,760 --> 01:52:24,360
Speaker 1: the border. Right, the public health emergency is now mitigated. Well,

2144
01:52:24,600 --> 01:52:27,400
Speaker 1: what happened was it served as a magnet, and so

2145
01:52:27,600 --> 01:52:30,080
Speaker 1: folks saw it as well, Trump's not letting anybody in.

2146
01:52:30,400 --> 01:52:32,559
Speaker 1: We better hurry up and get in while Biden's there

2147
01:52:32,600 --> 01:52:35,240
Speaker 1: before somebody else comes back, and and I let it.

2148
01:52:35,680 --> 01:52:39,840
Speaker 1: So the point is is that in there was a

2149
01:52:40,360 --> 01:52:44,519
Speaker 1: there was less enforcement at the border in that first

2150
01:52:44,600 --> 01:52:48,680
Speaker 1: eighteen months of the Biden presidency. So yes, it contributed.

2151
01:52:49,040 --> 01:52:53,240
Speaker 1: It wasn't just a perception that he had a porous border.

2152
01:52:53,360 --> 01:52:57,559
Speaker 1: That was the policy. What did they do when they

2153
01:52:57,560 --> 01:53:02,080
Speaker 1: needed to tighten things up? The point is is that

2154
01:53:02,280 --> 01:53:04,840
Speaker 1: they could tighten things up if they chose to. Now,

2155
01:53:04,880 --> 01:53:08,559
Speaker 1: this was this was the impact of the interest groups,

2156
01:53:08,680 --> 01:53:11,280
Speaker 1: and there were a lot of Look, I understand the

2157
01:53:11,320 --> 01:53:14,720
Speaker 1: empathy that many of these immigration rights groups had on

2158
01:53:14,760 --> 01:53:17,840
Speaker 1: what was happening with kids in cages and everything that

2159
01:53:17,920 --> 01:53:21,880
Speaker 1: happened twenty eighteen and twenty nineteen. In twenty twenty, so

2160
01:53:21,960 --> 01:53:25,000
Speaker 1: I understand the anger and the empathy that was there.

2161
01:53:27,439 --> 01:53:30,719
Speaker 1: And there was this concern, and certainly you had a

2162
01:53:30,760 --> 01:53:33,599
Speaker 1: Biden West wing led by Ron Klain, the first chief

2163
01:53:33,640 --> 01:53:37,200
Speaker 1: of staff, who was very empathetic to the progressive groups,

2164
01:53:38,040 --> 01:53:41,400
Speaker 1: and they didn't want to And that's why I can

2165
01:53:41,439 --> 01:53:45,280
Speaker 1: tell you my sources that were inside of DHS were like, hey,

2166
01:53:45,720 --> 01:53:49,040
Speaker 1: we had our hands tied, and you know, there were

2167
01:53:49,080 --> 01:53:51,400
Speaker 1: things that could have been done that would have had

2168
01:53:51,400 --> 01:53:55,320
Speaker 1: a more humane approach when you approach that Jay Johnson

2169
01:53:55,400 --> 01:54:00,320
Speaker 1: used in during Obama's second term to keep the order

2170
01:54:00,400 --> 01:54:03,720
Speaker 1: under control, not to shut the border down, but to

2171
01:54:03,840 --> 01:54:07,080
Speaker 1: bring some order to the border and order to the

2172
01:54:07,080 --> 01:54:10,639
Speaker 1: asylum system. Yes, ultimately this is all on Congress, but

2173
01:54:10,680 --> 01:54:13,439
Speaker 1: my god, Congress is at the root of all of

2174
01:54:13,479 --> 01:54:14,200
Speaker 1: our problems.

2175
01:54:14,280 --> 01:54:14,439
Speaker 2: Right.

2176
01:54:14,600 --> 01:54:18,560
Speaker 1: Congress's inability to take control of the of tariffs or

2177
01:54:18,600 --> 01:54:20,639
Speaker 1: why we're all paying more money at the grocery store.

2178
01:54:20,880 --> 01:54:24,920
Speaker 1: Congress is inability to do any accountability on the Trump administration.

2179
01:54:25,000 --> 01:54:27,280
Speaker 1: Is why pay to play is now the only way

2180
01:54:27,280 --> 01:54:31,240
Speaker 1: to do business in Washington. And yes, Congress is inability

2181
01:54:31,240 --> 01:54:35,240
Speaker 1: to do anything on the border and on the asylum

2182
01:54:35,280 --> 01:54:38,040
Speaker 1: system and to add more and to try to bring

2183
01:54:38,080 --> 01:54:41,960
Speaker 1: some order to modernize our immigration system. Is why this

2184
01:54:42,080 --> 01:54:48,959
Speaker 1: is essentially thrust upon DHS as sort of the agency

2185
01:54:48,960 --> 01:54:53,880
Speaker 1: of last resort here. So I totally understand your frustration Kevin.

2186
01:54:54,720 --> 01:54:57,240
Speaker 1: But that is why when I say that Biden failed

2187
01:54:57,240 --> 01:54:59,480
Speaker 1: at the border. Yes, you're right, it is Congress. It

2188
01:54:59,520 --> 01:55:04,840
Speaker 1: is the ultimate failure. But Biden's West wing did not

2189
01:55:06,240 --> 01:55:09,680
Speaker 1: did not let DHS do the basics that could have

2190
01:55:10,520 --> 01:55:16,280
Speaker 1: minimized some of that chaos that many of us saw

2191
01:55:16,280 --> 01:55:20,240
Speaker 1: at the boar. Next question comes from Scott see and

2192
01:55:20,280 --> 01:55:22,560
Speaker 1: Placidus in New Mexico, and he goes, Hey, love the podcast.

2193
01:55:22,560 --> 01:55:25,680
Speaker 1: Really appreciate how you how deep you're able to go

2194
01:55:25,720 --> 01:55:27,640
Speaker 1: on each topic. Quick question? Do you think one reason

2195
01:55:27,720 --> 01:55:29,560
Speaker 1: Christy Nome is still in Trump's orbit is that he

2196
01:55:29,600 --> 01:55:32,400
Speaker 1: has his site set on Mount Rushmore. Hasn't set it directly,

2197
01:55:32,400 --> 01:55:33,920
Speaker 1: but it would fit his style. Thanks for all you

2198
01:55:33,960 --> 01:55:39,280
Speaker 1: do well. I just don't think she has any role

2199
01:55:39,360 --> 01:55:42,800
Speaker 1: over that. But that's an interesting theory, and certainly that's

2200
01:55:42,840 --> 01:55:48,080
Speaker 1: how she used to work her magic into getting him

2201
01:55:48,320 --> 01:55:50,880
Speaker 1: happy with her, which I think she even brought a

2202
01:55:50,920 --> 01:55:54,000
Speaker 1: little model of what Mount Rushmore would look like if

2203
01:55:54,000 --> 01:55:56,800
Speaker 1: they added a fifth profile there. No, I think it

2204
01:55:57,040 --> 01:56:00,240
Speaker 1: is it is. It is Corey Lewandowski, and I think

2205
01:56:00,240 --> 01:56:03,760
Speaker 1: it's more of there was an old expression. I think

2206
01:56:03,800 --> 01:56:09,000
Speaker 1: it was attributed to LBJ. Do you want somebody pissing

2207
01:56:09,040 --> 01:56:12,920
Speaker 1: on your ten or pissing inside your tent. The point being,

2208
01:56:12,960 --> 01:56:15,800
Speaker 1: you know, I think I'm batching this a little bit.

2209
01:56:15,840 --> 01:56:18,720
Speaker 1: And my apologies for the terrible visual mom I know

2210
01:56:18,760 --> 01:56:23,440
Speaker 1: you don't love when I do some of these more

2211
01:56:25,120 --> 01:56:31,839
Speaker 1: shall we say, visually uncomfortable metaphors. But the point being

2212
01:56:32,200 --> 01:56:35,480
Speaker 1: is if he cuts Nome loose, that also means he

2213
01:56:36,040 --> 01:56:39,320
Speaker 1: will cut Corey Lewandowski, his first campaign manager, loose. And

2214
01:56:39,800 --> 01:56:42,840
Speaker 1: Corey's a NYE fighter. You know, He's not going to

2215
01:56:42,920 --> 01:56:46,720
Speaker 1: go down quietly. And you know, I think it's you know,

2216
01:56:46,960 --> 01:56:49,560
Speaker 1: why is Kimberly gilfor an ambassador grease even though she's

2217
01:56:49,600 --> 01:56:53,040
Speaker 1: no longer the fiance of Donald Trump Junior. Because he

2218
01:56:53,040 --> 01:56:59,640
Speaker 1: doesn't want somebody filling him themselves with grievance, perhaps becoming

2219
01:56:59,640 --> 01:57:03,800
Speaker 1: good sources for people like me. And in the first term,

2220
01:57:03,880 --> 01:57:07,879
Speaker 1: all the firings he did, all those you know, where

2221
01:57:07,920 --> 01:57:12,520
Speaker 1: no staffer ever felt safe, he ended up creating a

2222
01:57:12,600 --> 01:57:16,040
Speaker 1: lot of sources for a lot of reporters. And so

2223
01:57:16,200 --> 01:57:19,440
Speaker 1: I do think the number one thing that keeps Christy

2224
01:57:19,520 --> 01:57:24,880
Speaker 1: Nome's job safe is her relationship with with her with

2225
01:57:24,880 --> 01:57:28,440
Speaker 1: with Corey Lewandowski. And I'm not when I say relationship

2226
01:57:28,560 --> 01:57:31,360
Speaker 1: or a professional relationship. I know all the rumors that

2227
01:57:31,400 --> 01:57:33,440
Speaker 1: are around and all that stuff, but the point being

2228
01:57:33,560 --> 01:57:39,560
Speaker 1: is I don't think Trump and I think that some

2229
01:57:39,720 --> 01:57:45,720
Speaker 1: of the Trump White House don't want a Corey Lewandowski

2230
01:57:45,800 --> 01:57:54,280
Speaker 1: or Christi Nomes available to air dirty laundry. Next question

2231
01:57:54,320 --> 01:57:56,920
Speaker 1: comes from Alex Why, and he writes, Hey, I just

2232
01:57:56,960 --> 01:57:59,200
Speaker 1: finished listening to your recent podcast on sports betting. I've

2233
01:57:59,200 --> 01:58:01,160
Speaker 1: been a fan of yours for at least past decade

2234
01:58:01,160 --> 01:58:02,320
Speaker 1: and generally miss you and me the press.

2235
01:58:02,320 --> 01:58:02,520
Speaker 2: Thank you.

2236
01:58:02,560 --> 01:58:05,480
Speaker 1: I'd love to hear a deeper conversation on wealthy athletes

2237
01:58:05,520 --> 01:58:08,480
Speaker 1: and actors endorsing industries that often harm people, like gambling,

2238
01:58:08,520 --> 01:58:12,000
Speaker 1: crypto and insurance companies. My own experience with State Farm

2239
01:58:12,120 --> 01:58:18,000
Speaker 1: after the line of fire showed how some companies actively

2240
01:58:18,040 --> 01:58:20,720
Speaker 1: hurt customers, and maybe a question why high profile figures

2241
01:58:20,800 --> 01:58:22,960
Speaker 1: lend them credibility. Appreciate all the thoughtful work you do.

2242
01:58:23,040 --> 01:58:27,440
Speaker 1: Go back, go Alex Why. Well, it's interesting and look

2243
01:58:27,480 --> 01:58:34,320
Speaker 1: at somebody who's wants you know, certainly needs advertisers to

2244
01:58:34,400 --> 01:58:37,240
Speaker 1: support what we're doing. I want to keep everything free

2245
01:58:37,240 --> 01:58:41,440
Speaker 1: for all of you whatever I'm doing, but I do

2246
01:58:41,480 --> 01:58:44,280
Speaker 1: try to make sure that I'm you know, I certainly

2247
01:58:44,560 --> 01:58:48,080
Speaker 1: make sure I'm comfortable with the companies I'm going that

2248
01:58:48,200 --> 01:58:51,000
Speaker 1: you want to associate themselves with me, and vice versa.

2249
01:58:53,600 --> 01:58:57,600
Speaker 1: I think it's a I wonder if you're going to

2250
01:58:57,760 --> 01:59:04,480
Speaker 1: see some athletes express regret in the next few years,

2251
01:59:04,520 --> 01:59:10,800
Speaker 1: just like you. I think had some actors quietly realized that,

2252
01:59:10,960 --> 01:59:13,960
Speaker 1: you know, what they did with Crypto and FTX, that

2253
01:59:14,080 --> 01:59:14,760
Speaker 1: was a bad luck.

2254
01:59:15,080 --> 01:59:15,280
Speaker 2: Right.

2255
01:59:16,360 --> 01:59:18,600
Speaker 1: As many of you know, I've not been quiet about

2256
01:59:18,600 --> 01:59:22,480
Speaker 1: my about my interest in the In the TV show Fallout,

2257
01:59:23,520 --> 01:59:26,840
Speaker 1: one of the Walter Groggin's character, he plays, you know,

2258
01:59:26,960 --> 01:59:29,920
Speaker 1: sort of two timelines, right, and there's the pre the

2259
01:59:29,960 --> 01:59:33,320
Speaker 1: pre sort of destruction of Earth as we know it

2260
01:59:33,680 --> 01:59:38,600
Speaker 1: and the posts sort of the post apocalyptic Earth. And

2261
01:59:39,640 --> 01:59:46,160
Speaker 1: in pre apocalyptic Earth, he's the spokesperson for the company selling, uh,

2262
01:59:46,720 --> 01:59:51,160
Speaker 1: selling access to these to these pods, right that you know,

2263
01:59:51,320 --> 01:59:53,320
Speaker 1: these these pods that you would live in, you know,

2264
01:59:53,360 --> 01:59:58,800
Speaker 1: these whatever they call them. And you can see, you know,

2265
01:59:58,880 --> 02:00:01,040
Speaker 1: that's almost part of the storyline is it develops. You

2266
02:00:01,040 --> 02:00:03,280
Speaker 1: can see is discomfort. He's wondering, am I am I

2267
02:00:03,360 --> 02:00:06,200
Speaker 1: aligned with the wrong company? Am I am I misleading people?

2268
02:00:06,240 --> 02:00:10,920
Speaker 1: Am I a spokesperson for uh, essentially the Evil Doer?

2269
02:00:10,960 --> 02:00:13,040
Speaker 1: And it turns out yes, he was the spokesperson for

2270
02:00:13,080 --> 02:00:17,240
Speaker 1: the the Evil Doer. Look, I think in this day,

2271
02:00:17,520 --> 02:00:20,120
Speaker 1: I believe we're entering a moment where there's going to

2272
02:00:20,160 --> 02:00:23,120
Speaker 1: be you know that this is a it's that the

2273
02:00:23,160 --> 02:00:25,400
Speaker 1: most unpopular figures in America are going to be the

2274
02:00:25,440 --> 02:00:28,880
Speaker 1: corporate CEOs and the and the big companies. Right now,

2275
02:00:30,280 --> 02:00:32,520
Speaker 1: you know, we're already we're we're already only like our politicians,

2276
02:00:32,520 --> 02:00:36,280
Speaker 1: We're like people like me and the media. I think

2277
02:00:36,520 --> 02:00:39,880
Speaker 1: business leaders are next, and and and you're starting to

2278
02:00:39,920 --> 02:00:48,520
Speaker 1: see it. But it's a it's a it's a fair question.

2279
02:00:49,880 --> 02:00:55,240
Speaker 1: And I do think this conversation on on on sports gambling,

2280
02:00:55,280 --> 02:00:58,440
Speaker 1: particularly mobile sports gambling, is one that's going to get

2281
02:00:58,480 --> 02:01:02,520
Speaker 1: more traction because I do think the more the the

2282
02:01:02,680 --> 02:01:06,120
Speaker 1: most effective conversation to have with the public about sort

2283
02:01:06,120 --> 02:01:10,280
Speaker 1: of big tech is sort of the harm how big

2284
02:01:10,320 --> 02:01:14,200
Speaker 1: tech is preying on our most or on sort of

2285
02:01:14,240 --> 02:01:19,360
Speaker 1: the most on some of our most vulnerable, right kids,

2286
02:01:20,440 --> 02:01:26,000
Speaker 1: young adults and older adults. And I think that everything

2287
02:01:26,040 --> 02:01:29,680
Speaker 1: you're describing sort of the success of those industries in

2288
02:01:29,720 --> 02:01:38,040
Speaker 1: many ways is is their banking on essentially a lot

2289
02:01:38,120 --> 02:01:40,760
Speaker 1: of people that can't afford to be gambling, to be gambling,

2290
02:01:42,080 --> 02:01:44,480
Speaker 1: and it's you know, it's a bummer because, like I said,

2291
02:01:44,560 --> 02:01:49,000
Speaker 1: I enjoy I enjoy gambling, but I can afford to lose.

2292
02:01:49,120 --> 02:01:52,240
Speaker 1: I don't was always you know, you're always taught don't

2293
02:01:52,280 --> 02:01:55,640
Speaker 1: gamble any don't gamble any money you can't afford to lose.

2294
02:01:58,240 --> 02:02:00,680
Speaker 1: And I think we all need to do a job

2295
02:02:00,960 --> 02:02:05,840
Speaker 1: of expressing that to folks, particularly younger people, particularly you know,

2296
02:02:05,960 --> 02:02:09,720
Speaker 1: in your in your family, orbit reminding people of that

2297
02:02:09,880 --> 02:02:12,680
Speaker 1: all the time, not just some of the time, and

2298
02:02:12,760 --> 02:02:19,640
Speaker 1: not just you know, uh once or twice at the end.

2299
02:02:20,040 --> 02:02:23,280
Speaker 1: Thanks to speed up legal legal ease that says call

2300
02:02:23,600 --> 02:02:25,600
Speaker 1: one eight hundred New York Hope or whatever it is,

2301
02:02:25,640 --> 02:02:29,160
Speaker 1: you know, if you've got a gambling problem, perhaps they

2302
02:02:29,160 --> 02:02:31,680
Speaker 1: shouldn't be just I can't tell you how many podcasts

2303
02:02:31,680 --> 02:02:33,360
Speaker 1: where I noticed they put they put all of it

2304
02:02:33,360 --> 02:02:35,360
Speaker 1: now at the very end of the podcast. They don't

2305
02:02:35,400 --> 02:02:40,600
Speaker 1: do it during the gambling ad itself. The fact that

2306
02:02:40,600 --> 02:02:45,280
Speaker 1: that's allowed is probably it's probably a mistake there. But

2307
02:02:45,760 --> 02:02:48,080
Speaker 1: it's a fair question. And I wonder if celebrities will

2308
02:02:48,120 --> 02:02:52,960
Speaker 1: start to be a bit more discerning on at least

2309
02:02:52,960 --> 02:02:55,720
Speaker 1: some of them, probably the higher profile celebrities. Some people, Hey, look,

2310
02:02:57,160 --> 02:03:01,480
Speaker 1: you know, everybody's got a price. We all do. Don't

2311
02:03:01,480 --> 02:03:03,840
Speaker 1: think you you know, some of you may say, not me.

2312
02:03:04,720 --> 02:03:07,520
Speaker 1: We all do. Maybe our price is super high and

2313
02:03:07,560 --> 02:03:11,600
Speaker 1: it takes over, you know, and you know, but everybody's.

2314
02:03:11,040 --> 02:03:14,600
Speaker 2: Got a price, all right.

2315
02:03:14,680 --> 02:03:17,400
Speaker 1: Jim for Michigan. With Democrats pulling out record low approval,

2316
02:03:17,400 --> 02:03:19,680
Speaker 1: could the best strategy for holding or flipping seats be

2317
02:03:19,800 --> 02:03:22,600
Speaker 1: for moderates to follow Dan Osborne's lead and run as independence.

2318
02:03:22,640 --> 02:03:25,400
Speaker 1: As Joe Manchin pointed out, the party label alone can

2319
02:03:25,400 --> 02:03:28,040
Speaker 1: be disqualifying in red states. Wooden candidates like Shared Brown,

2320
02:03:28,120 --> 02:03:31,080
Speaker 1: Mallory McMorrow, John Asso, James Solarico's stand a better chance

2321
02:03:31,120 --> 02:03:34,160
Speaker 1: this way, especially when party in fighting sometimes turns on

2322
02:03:34,280 --> 02:03:37,560
Speaker 1: them unfairly. Jim for Michigan. Well, it's certainly what I

2323
02:03:37,680 --> 02:03:40,040
Speaker 1: thought in places like it was one of the questions

2324
02:03:40,080 --> 02:03:42,440
Speaker 1: I put to Rob sand when he was on this podcast.

2325
02:03:42,440 --> 02:03:46,680
Speaker 1: He's the likely Democratic nominee for governor in Iowa. Uh

2326
02:03:46,720 --> 02:03:48,800
Speaker 1: And I think that, you know, while he's been a

2327
02:03:48,840 --> 02:03:51,880
Speaker 1: Democrat and elected as a Democrat, if he ran as

2328
02:03:51,920 --> 02:03:54,839
Speaker 1: an eye, I think it's a virtue signal that would

2329
02:03:54,880 --> 02:03:58,600
Speaker 1: probably help him in that race, right, but it does

2330
02:03:58,640 --> 02:04:00,640
Speaker 1: get you know, I do think there is a brand issue,

2331
02:04:00,680 --> 02:04:05,560
Speaker 1: and I do think independent can have a halo effect, but.

2332
02:04:09,760 --> 02:04:10,280
Speaker 2: It is.

2333
02:04:11,800 --> 02:04:13,960
Speaker 1: You know, I think that you know, the biggest challenge

2334
02:04:13,960 --> 02:04:18,160
Speaker 1: in it when it comes to this growing independent movement

2335
02:04:18,560 --> 02:04:24,400
Speaker 1: is so you heard Paul say it, right, you've sort

2336
02:04:24,400 --> 02:04:28,000
Speaker 1: of where twenty seven percent d twenty seven percent are

2337
02:04:28,080 --> 02:04:31,960
Speaker 1: and essentially forty five to forty six percent independent. But

2338
02:04:32,360 --> 02:04:35,320
Speaker 1: if you put those forty six percent of independence on

2339
02:04:35,400 --> 02:04:40,560
Speaker 1: an ideological spectrum, you'd have about half of them would

2340
02:04:40,560 --> 02:04:44,360
Speaker 1: call themselves would probably be self described moderates, but about

2341
02:04:44,360 --> 02:04:46,840
Speaker 1: a quarter would call themselves conservative, and about a quarter

2342
02:04:46,880 --> 02:04:54,280
Speaker 1: would call themselves liberal. And so, you know, would I

2343
02:04:54,360 --> 02:04:56,320
Speaker 1: like to see an independent candidate run more as a

2344
02:04:56,360 --> 02:04:59,400
Speaker 1: constitutionalist and saying, look, this is this is more about

2345
02:04:59,440 --> 02:05:08,680
Speaker 1: restoring congressional authority, restoring the representative part of the representative democracy.

2346
02:05:09,440 --> 02:05:13,880
Speaker 1: You know, it's now sometimes it's hard to motivate voters

2347
02:05:13,880 --> 02:05:17,400
Speaker 1: on process right, voters at the end of the day,

2348
02:05:17,720 --> 02:05:20,040
Speaker 1: we're all you know. One of the other things that

2349
02:05:20,080 --> 02:05:21,960
Speaker 1: I say I've learned all the time is what is

2350
02:05:22,000 --> 02:05:25,920
Speaker 1: this little thing taught me we're all a little bit

2351
02:05:26,000 --> 02:05:29,360
Speaker 1: narcissistic because we all think what's happening around us is

2352
02:05:29,360 --> 02:05:32,680
Speaker 1: important enough to share. But it also means we're all

2353
02:05:32,800 --> 02:05:36,680
Speaker 1: sort of looking what's the benefit to us, And it's

2354
02:05:36,720 --> 02:05:40,720
Speaker 1: been hard to translate how a function in Congress will

2355
02:05:40,760 --> 02:05:44,760
Speaker 1: eventually be a benefit to you. And so running is

2356
02:05:44,760 --> 02:05:47,440
Speaker 1: the person that's going to pledge to actually restore Article

2357
02:05:47,480 --> 02:05:51,800
Speaker 1: one in the Constitution. It's not the sexiest message. And

2358
02:05:51,880 --> 02:05:53,520
Speaker 1: at the end of the day, people, you know, it's

2359
02:05:53,560 --> 02:05:56,560
Speaker 1: like it's like when when Kamala Harris closed on the

2360
02:05:56,560 --> 02:06:00,280
Speaker 1: democracy message, right, rather than an affordability mesas it's at

2361
02:06:00,280 --> 02:06:03,040
Speaker 1: the end of her presidential campaign. You know, I remember

2362
02:06:03,080 --> 02:06:04,920
Speaker 1: talking with some voters who said, look, I care about

2363
02:06:04,920 --> 02:06:08,120
Speaker 1: the democracy, but you know, I don't have the luxury

2364
02:06:08,160 --> 02:06:13,360
Speaker 1: to worry about it. In addition to worrying about paying

2365
02:06:13,400 --> 02:06:17,160
Speaker 1: the paying the grocery bill. You know, I've got the

2366
02:06:17,240 --> 02:06:20,879
Speaker 1: luxury to be frustrated and outraged about the current situation

2367
02:06:20,960 --> 02:06:25,280
Speaker 1: we're in because I don't have a trauma at my

2368
02:06:25,320 --> 02:06:28,600
Speaker 1: house that I'm dealing with, or or an unexpected healthcare

2369
02:06:28,640 --> 02:06:32,360
Speaker 1: bill or something like that. And I think that that's

2370
02:06:32,400 --> 02:06:36,480
Speaker 1: what's made I think that's what makes appealing as an

2371
02:06:36,520 --> 02:06:40,040
Speaker 1: independent very difficult, because you almost feel the need you've

2372
02:06:40,040 --> 02:06:42,480
Speaker 1: got to criticize both parties. Then you come across as

2373
02:06:42,560 --> 02:06:50,480
Speaker 1: both sides are and it's just it's, you know, I

2374
02:06:50,480 --> 02:06:54,320
Speaker 1: think it's more doable for governors. And I say it

2375
02:06:54,360 --> 02:06:57,480
Speaker 1: in that I do think that I think you'll when

2376
02:06:57,520 --> 02:07:00,800
Speaker 1: you hear this, you'll have already heard my little about

2377
02:07:01,520 --> 02:07:04,280
Speaker 1: how I do think that you'll see in a South Dakota. Yeah,

2378
02:07:04,360 --> 02:07:06,680
Speaker 1: an independent Senate candidate is going to be more appealing

2379
02:07:07,120 --> 02:07:13,040
Speaker 1: than a Democratic Senate candidate. You know, the question is

2380
02:07:13,040 --> 02:07:18,600
Speaker 1: can Democrats expand their brand to in such a way

2381
02:07:18,800 --> 02:07:24,080
Speaker 1: that it's perfectly normal for them to have guys like

2382
02:07:24,160 --> 02:07:27,720
Speaker 1: Joe Manchin. Look, the Democratic Party of the eighties and

2383
02:07:27,800 --> 02:07:32,480
Speaker 1: nineties was that way, and you know, arguably they were

2384
02:07:32,520 --> 02:07:34,720
Speaker 1: even you know, there was both parties were a little

2385
02:07:34,760 --> 02:07:38,960
Speaker 1: more ideologically diverse when I was younger, and that lack

2386
02:07:39,160 --> 02:07:43,560
Speaker 1: of perceived ideological diversity is what's driven so many people

2387
02:07:43,760 --> 02:07:46,360
Speaker 1: to say, you know what, I'm an independent. I can't

2388
02:07:46,360 --> 02:07:49,960
Speaker 1: associate with them, with the Democrats because they've both been defined,

2389
02:07:50,000 --> 02:07:53,040
Speaker 1: their brains have been defined by their extremes right, the

2390
02:07:53,080 --> 02:07:56,440
Speaker 1: Republican Party has been defined by MAGA and Trump. Democratic

2391
02:07:56,480 --> 02:08:00,040
Speaker 1: Party is more defined right now by its progressives, and

2392
02:08:00,120 --> 02:08:05,080
Speaker 1: it is by its moderates. And so I think that

2393
02:08:05,080 --> 02:08:09,240
Speaker 1: that's you know, can can a party successfully rebrand itself

2394
02:08:09,240 --> 02:08:14,920
Speaker 1: as ideologically diverse without coming accus across as a mush

2395
02:08:15,080 --> 02:08:22,360
Speaker 1: or a squash? And I think that's been a huge challenge.

2396
02:08:28,600 --> 02:08:31,960
Speaker 1: Last question comes from Dakota. He goes, hey, I always

2397
02:08:31,960 --> 02:08:35,160
Speaker 1: appreciate your thoughtful takes. What about my unthoughtful takes? Dakota?

2398
02:08:36,000 --> 02:08:38,720
Speaker 1: All right, I don't always share the unthoughtful ones. Utah

2399
02:08:38,720 --> 02:08:41,520
Speaker 1: Republicans recently passed a lot to expand the state Supreme Court,

2400
02:08:41,840 --> 02:08:44,560
Speaker 1: already filled with chop appointees to protect jerry mandered maps.

2401
02:08:44,560 --> 02:08:47,280
Speaker 1: Doesn't that class with Governor Spencer Cottson disagree? Better image

2402
02:08:47,320 --> 02:08:49,960
Speaker 1: and he just another politician playing a centrist? Could this

2403
02:08:50,000 --> 02:08:52,400
Speaker 1: open the door for Democrats to make their own moves

2404
02:08:52,440 --> 02:08:54,800
Speaker 1: on court packing? The fact of the matter is the

2405
02:08:54,840 --> 02:08:57,280
Speaker 1: answer to what you're saying is yes, right, which is

2406
02:08:57,920 --> 02:09:01,320
Speaker 1: what opened the door for Democrats to go harder on jerrymandering.

2407
02:09:01,920 --> 02:09:04,440
Speaker 1: Texas decided to open the door in jerrymandering. I mean,

2408
02:09:04,480 --> 02:09:07,280
Speaker 1: this is this is where I as sort of somebody

2409
02:09:07,320 --> 02:09:10,160
Speaker 1: who sees themselves more as a political reformer than anything else.

2410
02:09:10,760 --> 02:09:12,760
Speaker 1: If you're going to try to force me to sort

2411
02:09:12,760 --> 02:09:16,040
Speaker 1: of saying, what activist role would you want to play

2412
02:09:16,360 --> 02:09:19,680
Speaker 1: outside of journalists, and it would be political reformer. Right,

2413
02:09:19,720 --> 02:09:22,839
Speaker 1: We've got and you've heard me rant about these various reforms.

2414
02:09:22,880 --> 02:09:26,240
Speaker 1: I think, you know, we should truly have a judiciary

2415
02:09:26,280 --> 02:09:29,600
Speaker 1: that is filled with referees. So we should probably you know,

2416
02:09:30,080 --> 02:09:32,760
Speaker 1: Supreme Court justice probably should need seventy five votes to

2417
02:09:32,760 --> 02:09:37,600
Speaker 1: get confirmation. If you truly want a justice that is

2418
02:09:37,680 --> 02:09:41,120
Speaker 1: not that is as neutral as you can possibly find,

2419
02:09:41,520 --> 02:09:43,800
Speaker 1: make them get seventy five votes and you're and you're

2420
02:09:43,880 --> 02:09:48,520
Speaker 1: likely to have something like that. So yes, if they

2421
02:09:48,560 --> 02:09:51,280
Speaker 1: do this and a Spencer Cox right who sort of

2422
02:09:51,480 --> 02:09:54,120
Speaker 1: then you're going to see others try to do but

2423
02:09:54,200 --> 02:09:56,800
Speaker 1: this is not healthy for our democracy. And yeah, I

2424
02:09:56,840 --> 02:09:59,960
Speaker 1: think Look, I look forward to speaking with Governor Cock

2425
02:10:00,120 --> 02:10:02,120
Speaker 1: pretty soon. I'm hopeful to get them on one of

2426
02:10:02,120 --> 02:10:04,560
Speaker 1: my shows, either the podcast or a new sphere in

2427
02:10:04,600 --> 02:10:06,320
Speaker 1: the in the fairly near future. I'm gonna ask them

2428
02:10:06,360 --> 02:10:09,080
Speaker 1: about this because I think you're right. I think it's

2429
02:10:09,160 --> 02:10:11,840
Speaker 1: it's sort of like, do we have anybody that wants

2430
02:10:11,880 --> 02:10:18,080
Speaker 1: to you know, look, I'll take an ideologue left or

2431
02:10:18,160 --> 02:10:23,360
Speaker 1: right if you still will put the constitution first. And

2432
02:10:24,200 --> 02:10:29,440
Speaker 1: I think that that's let's just say, I expect better

2433
02:10:29,560 --> 02:10:31,560
Speaker 1: out of Spencer Cox. I need to learn more about this,

2434
02:10:32,840 --> 02:10:39,120
Speaker 1: about this idea of expanding their state Supreme Court. But

2435
02:10:40,240 --> 02:10:42,440
Speaker 1: I think one thing we've learned in politics is that

2436
02:10:42,720 --> 02:10:45,840
Speaker 1: both parties are copycatters, and when one does it, the

2437
02:10:45,840 --> 02:10:48,600
Speaker 1: other is going to do it. And that's been you know,

2438
02:10:48,960 --> 02:10:53,520
Speaker 1: one of my big concerns that Democrats decide if you

2439
02:10:53,520 --> 02:10:57,320
Speaker 1: can't beat Trump, join them, and it's like, okay, they'll

2440
02:10:57,360 --> 02:10:59,640
Speaker 1: do They'll find their own billionaires and they'll find their

2441
02:10:59,680 --> 02:11:03,360
Speaker 1: own to players, and we're going to have this like okay,

2442
02:11:03,560 --> 02:11:07,080
Speaker 1: you purged everybody from this board. We're going to purge

2443
02:11:07,080 --> 02:11:11,600
Speaker 1: everybody from this board. And you did that. You know, eventually,

2444
02:11:11,640 --> 02:11:14,880
Speaker 1: it's going to make government even more dysfunctional than it

2445
02:11:14,920 --> 02:11:21,080
Speaker 1: appears now if we continue down this road. So you know,

2446
02:11:21,160 --> 02:11:24,360
Speaker 1: like I said, I I'm trying to be realistic. I know,

2447
02:11:24,800 --> 02:11:28,680
Speaker 1: trying to create a campaign message that's about political reform

2448
02:11:28,720 --> 02:11:33,600
Speaker 1: and fairness ain't sexy, but it is something we need,

2449
02:11:34,240 --> 02:11:36,600
Speaker 1: which is why I think, Fine, that's the role I'll play.

2450
02:11:36,640 --> 02:11:42,440
Speaker 1: That's what you know, that's what I will continue to

2451
02:11:42,520 --> 02:11:46,720
Speaker 1: use my podcast to do. All right, that's good this

2452
02:11:46,840 --> 02:11:54,240
Speaker 1: week for questions on this front. Oh, I got to

2453
02:11:54,240 --> 02:11:56,880
Speaker 1: take this next question because it's from Bloomington, Illinois. And

2454
02:11:56,880 --> 02:11:58,160
Speaker 1: I'll tell you why I have to take the question

2455
02:11:58,160 --> 02:12:01,840
Speaker 1: from Bloomington, Illinois, because that's where my mother was born.

2456
02:12:01,880 --> 02:12:06,640
Speaker 1: In Bloomington, Illinois. My grandfather had a family business that

2457
02:12:06,680 --> 02:12:11,800
Speaker 1: he started in Bloomington, Illinois, clothing store there Bloomington. So

2458
02:12:11,880 --> 02:12:14,960
Speaker 1: this next question comes. It's greetings from Bloomington, Illinois. It's

2459
02:12:15,040 --> 02:12:17,640
Speaker 1: very smart by Lucas to lead with the Bloomington Illinois

2460
02:12:17,640 --> 02:12:20,160
Speaker 1: So it ended up sneaking a sixth questionnaire. He says, Hey,

2461
02:12:20,200 --> 02:12:22,240
Speaker 1: as a public school teacher and proud Army veteran, I'm

2462
02:12:22,240 --> 02:12:24,720
Speaker 1: increasingly concerned that too many schools are failing our students

2463
02:12:25,040 --> 02:12:26,720
Speaker 1: and that's a real threat to our democracy. What can

2464
02:12:26,760 --> 02:12:29,080
Speaker 1: be done to modernize education for today's world? Also, why

2465
02:12:29,120 --> 02:12:32,040
Speaker 1: isn't there more momentum around creating some form of mandatory

2466
02:12:32,080 --> 02:12:34,200
Speaker 1: national service to help American see each other as fellow

2467
02:12:34,240 --> 02:12:37,960
Speaker 1: citizens and not strangers. Thanks Lucas well. I hope you've

2468
02:12:37,960 --> 02:12:40,560
Speaker 1: heard the conversation I had with rom Emmanuel earlier this week,

2469
02:12:40,560 --> 02:12:45,280
Speaker 1: because we we went deep on education. I think I

2470
02:12:45,320 --> 02:12:50,880
Speaker 1: was at a an off the record setting with a

2471
02:12:50,920 --> 02:12:56,280
Speaker 1: former cabinet secretary and a former governor, a Democrat who said,

2472
02:12:56,640 --> 02:12:59,360
Speaker 1: you know who was talking about all the different things

2473
02:12:59,360 --> 02:13:01,160
Speaker 1: that Democrats need to sort of speak a little more

2474
02:13:01,200 --> 02:13:05,200
Speaker 1: truth to power, and one of them was lamenting the

2475
02:13:05,200 --> 02:13:08,480
Speaker 1: fact that we've not really done We've not you know,

2476
02:13:09,200 --> 02:13:13,000
Speaker 1: the public the basic design of America's public school system

2477
02:13:14,040 --> 02:13:18,680
Speaker 1: hasn't changed in one hundred years. That we've not modernized it.

2478
02:13:18,920 --> 02:13:23,080
Speaker 1: We've not you know, you know, when I was just

2479
02:13:23,120 --> 02:13:27,440
Speaker 1: finished in college, I think most people thought we were

2480
02:13:27,440 --> 02:13:31,200
Speaker 1: going to have, you know, that the public school system

2481
02:13:31,240 --> 02:13:33,560
Speaker 1: was going to expand from K through twelve to K

2482
02:13:33,640 --> 02:13:36,880
Speaker 1: through fourteen, meaning that there was going to be some

2483
02:13:36,960 --> 02:13:39,320
Speaker 1: form of a thirteenth and fourteenth grade. Maybe we would

2484
02:13:39,320 --> 02:13:42,160
Speaker 1: call it the first two years of communities, maybe be

2485
02:13:42,200 --> 02:13:44,200
Speaker 1: community college, whatever it was, but that there was going

2486
02:13:44,240 --> 02:13:46,720
Speaker 1: to be a that we were going to essentially add

2487
02:13:46,720 --> 02:13:52,200
Speaker 1: two years to the public education system. Maybe it's college credits,

2488
02:13:52,720 --> 02:13:57,640
Speaker 1: technical credits. And we never did, right, We never got full.

2489
02:14:00,160 --> 02:14:02,040
Speaker 1: But I think that, you know, I look at the

2490
02:14:02,080 --> 02:14:04,560
Speaker 1: school system I grew up in Miami Dade and I

2491
02:14:04,600 --> 02:14:07,520
Speaker 1: think Miami Dade County, and it is turned into a

2492
02:14:07,560 --> 02:14:14,200
Speaker 1: four tiered school system that is as follow as you

2493
02:14:14,280 --> 02:14:18,480
Speaker 1: get the private schools and you have the wealthy have

2494
02:14:18,680 --> 02:14:23,320
Speaker 1: access to that, you have charter schools and magnet schools,

2495
02:14:24,880 --> 02:14:28,000
Speaker 1: and that takes parents to know how to navigate and

2496
02:14:28,040 --> 02:14:31,120
Speaker 1: how to figure out which one works best for their kid,

2497
02:14:31,200 --> 02:14:34,520
Speaker 1: and the application process and how to get into a

2498
02:14:34,560 --> 02:14:36,480
Speaker 1: magnet or how to you know, how to qualify for

2499
02:14:36,480 --> 02:14:39,800
Speaker 1: a magnet, or how to get accepted into a charter,

2500
02:14:39,800 --> 02:14:43,800
Speaker 1: which is a quasi application process. And then the fourth

2501
02:14:43,840 --> 02:14:47,760
Speaker 1: tier is just if you if you can't get into

2502
02:14:47,800 --> 02:14:49,840
Speaker 1: a magnet or a charter or a private, you're just

2503
02:14:49,840 --> 02:14:53,600
Speaker 1: stuck with whatever school's left. And those schools what I've

2504
02:14:53,680 --> 02:14:56,200
Speaker 1: never understood. And my old high schools turned into one

2505
02:14:56,200 --> 02:14:59,600
Speaker 1: of these words. They didn't become a magnet, and it

2506
02:14:59,760 --> 02:15:04,440
Speaker 1: just sort of deteriorated over time. The schools in mind

2507
02:15:04,520 --> 02:15:07,320
Speaker 1: that were that became magnet schools for something, maybe for

2508
02:15:07,360 --> 02:15:11,440
Speaker 1: the arts, maybe for stem maybe for they've even had

2509
02:15:11,440 --> 02:15:14,160
Speaker 1: one for like, you know, meteorology, and coding all sorts

2510
02:15:14,160 --> 02:15:19,080
Speaker 1: of things. Having those magnet schools rose the success rate

2511
02:15:19,120 --> 02:15:22,640
Speaker 1: of the entire school system, of the that entire school

2512
02:15:26,320 --> 02:15:30,080
Speaker 1: And I do think the magnet system, of all the

2513
02:15:30,160 --> 02:15:35,920
Speaker 1: different experiments has been was was the one that was

2514
02:15:36,840 --> 02:15:37,720
Speaker 1: open to everybody.

2515
02:15:37,800 --> 02:15:37,920
Speaker 2: Right.

2516
02:15:37,960 --> 02:15:42,840
Speaker 1: It wasn't wasn't fully gaming the system, but it was

2517
02:15:42,840 --> 02:15:45,120
Speaker 1: a reminder every school should be a magnet for something.

2518
02:15:45,360 --> 02:15:51,800
Speaker 1: Every school should have a specialty in something. There's also

2519
02:15:51,840 --> 02:15:54,680
Speaker 1: this issue of age, right, which is you know, there's

2520
02:15:54,920 --> 02:15:59,520
Speaker 1: there's a lot more there's a lot more research that

2521
02:15:59,560 --> 02:16:07,080
Speaker 1: indicates everybody learns at different paces, and some people need

2522
02:16:07,120 --> 02:16:09,520
Speaker 1: fifteen years to get through twelve years of school and

2523
02:16:09,560 --> 02:16:11,560
Speaker 1: some people maybe need ten years to get through twelve

2524
02:16:11,600 --> 02:16:15,320
Speaker 1: years of school. But we've not, you know, we continue

2525
02:16:15,560 --> 02:16:18,400
Speaker 1: and certainly the socialization matters a lot, and there's plenty

2526
02:16:18,440 --> 02:16:21,640
Speaker 1: of studies that indicate that, you know, that's that also

2527
02:16:21,760 --> 02:16:26,960
Speaker 1: can be stunting, right if people aren't with their peers

2528
02:16:27,760 --> 02:16:31,280
Speaker 1: every step of the way, But we've created you know,

2529
02:16:31,480 --> 02:16:34,120
Speaker 1: I think it's held us back into figuring out how

2530
02:16:34,160 --> 02:16:36,959
Speaker 1: to you know, if the goal is like what's the

2531
02:16:37,000 --> 02:16:40,520
Speaker 1: best way to teach kids hard stop?

2532
02:16:41,959 --> 02:16:42,240
Speaker 2: Right?

2533
02:16:43,240 --> 02:16:48,280
Speaker 1: And you know, whether it's look, Rob Emmanuel, I thought

2534
02:16:48,280 --> 02:16:50,680
Speaker 1: put it pretty well, and he said, you know, the

2535
02:16:50,720 --> 02:16:53,279
Speaker 1: Republican answer in education has simply been got the public

2536
02:16:53,280 --> 02:16:56,640
Speaker 1: school system and just go vouchers and let people decide

2537
02:16:56,680 --> 02:17:00,520
Speaker 1: on their own, you know, essentially, let a market sort

2538
02:17:00,560 --> 02:17:02,039
Speaker 1: of decide which are the good schools and which are

2539
02:17:02,040 --> 02:17:04,879
Speaker 1: the bad schools. And he said, and the Democrats gave

2540
02:17:04,920 --> 02:17:08,520
Speaker 1: up on accountability, right, They pushed back against teacher testing,

2541
02:17:08,520 --> 02:17:11,560
Speaker 1: pushed back against student testing, and now you're starting to

2542
02:17:11,600 --> 02:17:17,520
Speaker 1: see maybe student testing is back. In fact, Ram sounded

2543
02:17:17,600 --> 02:17:20,440
Speaker 1: like he missed No Child Left Behind, which was a

2544
02:17:20,480 --> 02:17:24,560
Speaker 1: famous Bush initiative that he passed with Ted Kennedy. But

2545
02:17:25,320 --> 02:17:29,960
Speaker 1: for whatever reason, education has fallen off the national conversation.

2546
02:17:30,760 --> 02:17:34,080
Speaker 1: And I know that obviously, in education is one of

2547
02:17:34,120 --> 02:17:38,240
Speaker 1: those issues that are yes, we all know it's locally controlled,

2548
02:17:39,000 --> 02:17:40,879
Speaker 1: but it is an important issue. It's one of the

2549
02:17:40,879 --> 02:17:43,240
Speaker 1: top three issues for most people under the age of fifty.

2550
02:17:43,800 --> 02:17:46,760
Speaker 1: They got kids in school usually, and that matters. In fact,

2551
02:17:46,879 --> 02:17:49,200
Speaker 1: I think one of the reasons why Republicans have made

2552
02:17:49,200 --> 02:17:52,960
Speaker 1: inroads with Latinos is you do any poll of Latinos

2553
02:17:52,959 --> 02:17:55,480
Speaker 1: and usually the top two issues are the economy and education.

2554
02:17:55,560 --> 02:18:01,800
Speaker 1: In some order, and Democrats basically for the last fifteen

2555
02:18:01,840 --> 02:18:04,760
Speaker 1: years have just stopped talking about education nationally. Rob and

2556
02:18:04,800 --> 02:18:07,640
Speaker 1: I talked about this on my podcast earlier this week.

2557
02:18:10,680 --> 02:18:13,720
Speaker 1: Republicans are the ones talking about it, you know, And

2558
02:18:13,760 --> 02:18:17,920
Speaker 1: I think it explains why you've seen Latinos be open

2559
02:18:18,120 --> 02:18:22,039
Speaker 1: to supporting Republicans, because Latinos have been more open to

2560
02:18:22,080 --> 02:18:26,640
Speaker 1: school choice. They want good education, whatever it takes. And

2561
02:18:26,680 --> 02:18:28,600
Speaker 1: I think it's sort of like, what's the best energy

2562
02:18:28,640 --> 02:18:32,520
Speaker 1: policy all of the above, what's the best education policy

2563
02:18:32,600 --> 02:18:37,360
Speaker 1: all of the above. And I think ultimately that's what

2564
02:18:37,400 --> 02:18:39,480
Speaker 1: we all want to hear. Now. As for your national service,

2565
02:18:40,200 --> 02:18:43,520
Speaker 1: and count me in, I've you know, I think mandatory

2566
02:18:43,560 --> 02:18:48,120
Speaker 1: national service. I think when you look at the incredible

2567
02:18:50,200 --> 02:18:55,880
Speaker 1: devotion Israelis have for their citizenship, they all have to serve,

2568
02:18:56,440 --> 02:18:59,560
Speaker 1: right for two years, they basically have a mandatory national service.

2569
02:19:03,040 --> 02:19:08,959
Speaker 1: It and look, they have messy politics, but it does

2570
02:19:09,000 --> 02:19:14,560
Speaker 1: create an identity. And I think when we had the draft,

2571
02:19:15,520 --> 02:19:18,160
Speaker 1: sort of forced national military service, if you will, for

2572
02:19:18,640 --> 02:19:23,400
Speaker 1: many basically for you know, my generations, the first one

2573
02:19:23,440 --> 02:19:27,240
Speaker 1: that didn't get didn't have to deal with a mandatory draft.

2574
02:19:27,320 --> 02:19:32,039
Speaker 1: Essentially my father did, my grandfather did, my grandfather's, my

2575
02:19:32,080 --> 02:19:39,440
Speaker 1: great grandfather did. All ended up drafted or eligibly drafted. Now,

2576
02:19:39,480 --> 02:19:41,400
Speaker 1: no one's saying we should go back to a military draft,

2577
02:19:41,440 --> 02:19:46,000
Speaker 1: although I do think that sharing that, but mandatory national

2578
02:19:46,040 --> 02:19:51,120
Speaker 1: service where you have Right America and Blue America kids

2579
02:19:51,160 --> 02:19:54,720
Speaker 1: and from both of those areas working together, maybe in

2580
02:19:54,840 --> 02:19:59,920
Speaker 1: a rural school, maybe in an urban school, maybe clean

2581
02:20:00,240 --> 02:20:06,480
Speaker 1: up a river, maybe helping to build housing, maybe to

2582
02:20:08,720 --> 02:20:12,720
Speaker 1: work at a food kitchen, whatever it is, but service

2583
02:20:12,800 --> 02:20:16,160
Speaker 1: to the country. Look, I think citizenship when you go

2584
02:20:16,200 --> 02:20:18,320
Speaker 1: to Israel, when you visit Israel. Remember the first time

2585
02:20:18,440 --> 02:20:21,400
Speaker 1: I went to Israel, it really hit me that citizenship

2586
02:20:21,520 --> 02:20:24,800
Speaker 1: was active there. Whatever you whatever your opinion is about

2587
02:20:24,800 --> 02:20:30,600
Speaker 1: the Israeli government, Israeli citizens, they take their citizenship seriously

2588
02:20:30,640 --> 02:20:33,200
Speaker 1: because you know, they got to keep their head on

2589
02:20:33,200 --> 02:20:41,920
Speaker 1: a swivel. I do think national service would help us

2590
02:20:44,520 --> 02:20:51,320
Speaker 1: collectively value our citizenship more citizenship. There's a little bit

2591
02:20:51,320 --> 02:20:53,920
Speaker 1: of work that comes with it, not a lot, but

2592
02:20:54,000 --> 02:20:57,680
Speaker 1: a little bit. And if you know, ultimately, you know

2593
02:20:57,720 --> 02:21:00,560
Speaker 1: it's like I say this to you, don't like what

2594
02:21:00,760 --> 02:21:04,880
Speaker 1: you know? It's on you. Ultimately everybody plays a role here.

2595
02:21:06,200 --> 02:21:10,000
Speaker 1: You can't hope some politician bails, you know, fixes this problem,

2596
02:21:10,280 --> 02:21:13,360
Speaker 1: or some celebrity or some member of the press. It's

2597
02:21:13,400 --> 02:21:15,320
Speaker 1: going to do your job. You got to do the job.

2598
02:21:15,879 --> 02:21:18,200
Speaker 1: And I do think national service. It's interesting to see

2599
02:21:18,200 --> 02:21:22,240
Speaker 1: who's who are the big advocates for national service.

2600
02:21:22,280 --> 02:21:22,680
Speaker 2: George W.

2601
02:21:22,760 --> 02:21:27,879
Speaker 1: Bush was I don't think Trump thinks about it. Wes

2602
02:21:27,920 --> 02:21:32,960
Speaker 1: Moore is doing a pilot state, basically a National service

2603
02:21:33,040 --> 02:21:36,000
Speaker 1: like project. You know, essentially in exchange for National service,

2604
02:21:36,080 --> 02:21:38,600
Speaker 1: you get two years of free college something like that. Right,

2605
02:21:38,640 --> 02:21:38,879
Speaker 1: you do?

2606
02:21:39,440 --> 02:21:39,720
Speaker 2: You do?

2607
02:21:40,720 --> 02:21:43,840
Speaker 1: You know, that's you give to the country, country gets

2608
02:21:43,840 --> 02:21:47,560
Speaker 1: back to you, sort of almost a GI bill for

2609
02:21:47,640 --> 02:21:54,600
Speaker 1: the country. And yeah, I think it would lessen polarization.

2610
02:21:55,360 --> 02:21:57,640
Speaker 1: It's not a full depolarization, but I think it would

2611
02:21:57,680 --> 02:22:01,120
Speaker 1: lessen to polarization. But here's the most import and think Lucas.

2612
02:22:01,760 --> 02:22:05,600
Speaker 1: My favorite question of the day came from somebody from Bloomington, Illinois.

2613
02:22:05,600 --> 02:22:10,520
Speaker 1: It's going to make my family very happy. Smart question,

2614
02:22:12,320 --> 02:22:17,680
Speaker 1: pro very patriotic question, very important question, touching a lot

2615
02:22:17,680 --> 02:22:22,680
Speaker 1: of nerves. And I looked at you, there's no This

2616
02:22:22,760 --> 02:22:25,400
Speaker 1: is why I'm always an advocate of military veterans running

2617
02:22:25,400 --> 02:22:28,600
Speaker 1: for office, because I think they understand the importance of

2618
02:22:29,080 --> 02:22:33,119
Speaker 1: the first hand they've gotten, they've seen the importance of citizenship.

2619
02:22:33,520 --> 02:22:46,520
Speaker 1: They've also they they serve with people that are liberal, conservative, red, blue, rural, urban, black, white, Hispanic,

2620
02:22:46,959 --> 02:22:51,560
Speaker 1: jew Christian, Muslim. You get my point, and all of

2621
02:22:51,600 --> 02:22:56,520
Speaker 1: them have each other's back, and if they don't, they

2622
02:22:56,560 --> 02:22:59,920
Speaker 1: all get hurt. Right, So you know it better than

2623
02:23:00,080 --> 02:23:02,640
Speaker 1: most being an Army veteran, Lucas, so you get it.

2624
02:23:04,160 --> 02:23:08,440
Speaker 1: But we all need to get it better. And I

2625
02:23:08,480 --> 02:23:15,240
Speaker 1: think national service, you know, it is is a I

2626
02:23:15,240 --> 02:23:19,280
Speaker 1: think it's something we need now more than ever because

2627
02:23:19,280 --> 02:23:21,920
Speaker 1: of this, you know, sort of the lost faith we've

2628
02:23:21,959 --> 02:23:26,560
Speaker 1: had in each other, lost faith we have in our democracy,

2629
02:23:27,879 --> 02:23:31,480
Speaker 1: and maybe this is a way to a way to

2630
02:23:31,840 --> 02:23:36,120
Speaker 1: take a step to try to repair it. Well with that,

2631
02:23:37,040 --> 02:23:40,520
Speaker 1: I think that's a much better note to end on. Look,

2632
02:23:40,560 --> 02:23:44,160
Speaker 1: it's the big light sports weekend. I will just say

2633
02:23:44,200 --> 02:23:48,440
Speaker 1: here I am I'm I love the Olympics. My friends

2634
02:23:48,440 --> 02:23:52,200
Speaker 1: at the Gold Zone. I love the Gold Zone. This

2635
02:23:52,360 --> 02:23:55,600
Speaker 1: is the you know, man, I love when the Olympics

2636
02:23:55,600 --> 02:23:57,680
Speaker 1: are in Europe because you get up in the morning

2637
02:23:57,680 --> 02:24:01,440
Speaker 1: on the East Coast Saturday morning, by the way, you know,

2638
02:24:01,480 --> 02:24:03,080
Speaker 1: I get up early no matter what, because I've got

2639
02:24:03,120 --> 02:24:05,119
Speaker 1: dogs that are going to get up no matter what. Right,

2640
02:24:05,160 --> 02:24:08,039
Speaker 1: So I'm getting up early, get that coffee going, and

2641
02:24:08,080 --> 02:24:10,880
Speaker 1: the Olympics are up and there's active stuff going on.

2642
02:24:10,959 --> 02:24:13,119
Speaker 1: And what I love about the Gold Zone is, look,

2643
02:24:13,480 --> 02:24:16,440
Speaker 1: I I you know, the sappy stories are nice and

2644
02:24:16,480 --> 02:24:18,400
Speaker 1: all of this, and I know some people love the

2645
02:24:18,760 --> 02:24:21,240
Speaker 1: sort of the soap opera of the Olympics. I like

2646
02:24:21,280 --> 02:24:25,039
Speaker 1: the competition. And what's great about the Gold Zone is

2647
02:24:25,080 --> 02:24:27,760
Speaker 1: they go to competition and it's not always just follow

2648
02:24:27,800 --> 02:24:31,879
Speaker 1: the Americans. They just wherever there's a gold medal competition happening,

2649
02:24:31,879 --> 02:24:35,000
Speaker 1: they take it to it. So you end up getting

2650
02:24:35,000 --> 02:24:37,120
Speaker 1: to see a variety of sports. So look, I know

2651
02:24:37,200 --> 02:24:40,280
Speaker 1: there's no football and we're all pining. You know, some

2652
02:24:40,320 --> 02:24:42,119
Speaker 1: of us are going to be bummed out about that.

2653
02:24:42,160 --> 02:24:46,760
Speaker 1: But you know what, the Olympics are terrific. And the technology,

2654
02:24:47,480 --> 02:24:49,920
Speaker 1: I mean, the ability to follow these skiers now and

2655
02:24:49,959 --> 02:24:53,039
Speaker 1: all of this stuff and all the different camera angles

2656
02:24:53,040 --> 02:24:56,080
Speaker 1: that you have and the go pros, it's unbelievable. It's

2657
02:24:56,160 --> 02:25:00,520
Speaker 1: an incredible experience to watch on TV these days. In fact,

2658
02:25:00,600 --> 02:25:03,280
Speaker 1: it's scary that it is. The Olympics are much better

2659
02:25:03,320 --> 02:25:06,640
Speaker 1: to see, and I think on TV than they are

2660
02:25:06,680 --> 02:25:11,320
Speaker 1: in person, unless you have a family member competing, it's

2661
02:25:11,400 --> 02:25:15,199
Speaker 1: that good. And hey, we're two weeks from March Madness beginning,

2662
02:25:15,240 --> 02:25:17,720
Speaker 1: so you got to start thinking about those brackets. You

2663
02:25:17,760 --> 02:25:19,920
Speaker 1: got to if you want to try to do well,

2664
02:25:19,920 --> 02:25:22,480
Speaker 1: you got to start watching some of these. And we're

2665
02:25:22,480 --> 02:25:25,280
Speaker 1: getting We're in the heart of conference season, and there's

2666
02:25:25,400 --> 02:25:29,160
Speaker 1: nothing more fun than watching a ranked team go on

2667
02:25:29,200 --> 02:25:32,240
Speaker 1: the road try to win a conference road game. Because

2668
02:25:32,280 --> 02:25:35,240
Speaker 1: the toughest thing in sports, I think the toughest thing

2669
02:25:35,280 --> 02:25:41,080
Speaker 1: in all of college sports is to win a conference

2670
02:25:41,240 --> 02:25:43,480
Speaker 1: road game. And I don't care how good you are

2671
02:25:43,879 --> 02:25:46,680
Speaker 1: and how bad the team is, it is there's nothing

2672
02:25:46,760 --> 02:25:50,120
Speaker 1: like going into an enemy arena. The crowd gets fired up,

2673
02:25:50,200 --> 02:25:53,040
Speaker 1: students just want to storm the court. I do think

2674
02:25:53,080 --> 02:25:55,160
Speaker 1: my friends at the University of Miami didn't need to

2675
02:25:55,160 --> 02:25:57,960
Speaker 1: be storming a court after beating North Carolina. You should

2676
02:25:57,959 --> 02:26:00,959
Speaker 1: expect to beat North Carolina at home. So I do

2677
02:26:01,040 --> 02:26:06,520
Speaker 1: think we're court storming a bit too much. But I

2678
02:26:06,560 --> 02:26:09,280
Speaker 1: know I've got plenty to watch this weekend, So whether

2679
02:26:09,320 --> 02:26:11,720
Speaker 1: it's a couple of great college basketball games or the

2680
02:26:11,760 --> 02:26:14,039
Speaker 1: Gold Zone, that's how I'm going to be spending my

2681
02:26:14,080 --> 02:26:17,560
Speaker 1: sports weekend. Yes, I'll miss a little bit of football,

2682
02:26:17,560 --> 02:26:20,840
Speaker 1: but you know I've got my side hustle on sports

2683
02:26:20,840 --> 02:26:22,920
Speaker 1: cards to keep me busy as well. So with that,

2684
02:26:23,360 --> 02:26:29,879
Speaker 1: I'll see in seventy two hours