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Speaker 1: You're listening to The Freeway Phanom, a production of iHeartRadio,

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Speaker 1: Tenderfoot TV, and Black bar Mitzvah. The views and opinions

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Speaker 1: expressed in this podcast are solely those of the podcast

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Speaker 1: author or individuals participating in the podcast, and do not

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Speaker 1: represent those of iHeartMedia, Tenderfoot TV, Black bar Mitzvah, or

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Speaker 1: their employees. This podcast also contains subject matter that may

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Speaker 1: not be suitable for everyone. Listener discretion is advised.

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Speaker 2: He wanted to show off, and this is something that

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Speaker 2: he will do in his real life all the time

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Speaker 2: because of his.

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Speaker 3: Poor self image.

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Speaker 2: He feels the need to prove his greatness and whether

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Speaker 2: that's in his vocabulary that he uses or in the

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Speaker 2: quote conquests that he makes, he wants to prove how

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Speaker 2: much of a man he is. And this letter, especially

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Speaker 2: when he has used these multi syllabic words to show

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Speaker 2: off and he gets one of them wrong.

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Speaker 3: So I think I should just launch into the profile.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, let's do it.

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Speaker 5: The homicide detectives termed the cases the Little Girl cases.

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Speaker 2: This child was laying on the side of the road.

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Speaker 6: I wouldn't go no way. I would call up my house.

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Speaker 2: Those first five murders should have been a huge warning

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Speaker 2: bell for the police.

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Speaker 4: We just want to know what happened.

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Speaker 5: This person must have saw that they were thinking that

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Speaker 5: maybe it's just one person, and he says, they need

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Speaker 5: to know.

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Speaker 4: This is me.

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Speaker 7: I thought that they would catch him.

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Speaker 4: I thought it was just a.

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Speaker 7: Matter of time.

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Speaker 8: I'm Celeste Headley and this is Freeway Phantom. In the

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Speaker 8: last episode, we talked about the original, outdated psychological profile

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Speaker 8: for the Freeway Phantom, and we revealed that we commissioned

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Speaker 8: a new profile from the former FBI Special Agent Jim Clemente.

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Speaker 8: So now we'll jump right into Jim Clemente's new profile

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Speaker 8: of the Freeway Phantom, and that starts with a little

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Speaker 8: bit of scene setting.

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Speaker 2: So the first thing that we have to understand is

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Speaker 2: the victim availability factor was higher back then.

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Speaker 3: In the seventies.

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Speaker 2: You didn't have the Internet, which gave people access immediately

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Speaker 2: to everything that happens around the country every day twenty

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Speaker 2: four seven, three sixty five. So generally smaller communities were

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Speaker 2: they felt insulated. If nothing happened in your community, then

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Speaker 2: you weren't really concerned about certain.

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Speaker 3: Things like child abductions.

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Speaker 2: The fact is that in the United States of America,

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Speaker 2: approximately one hundred and sixty to two hundred times a

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Speaker 2: year a child is abducted by a non family member

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Speaker 2: for a long period of time, one hundred and sixty

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Speaker 2: times to two hundred times a year. Now you match

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Speaker 2: that against Nick Mick's reports of missing kids over eight

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Speaker 2: hundred thousand a year, but only one sixty to two

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Speaker 2: hundred of them are actually non familiar long term abductions.

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Speaker 3: So what does that tell you. It's a very rare event.

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Speaker 2: But with the Internet, you now know about every single

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Speaker 2: one of them, well at least every one of them

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Speaker 2: that is a blond haired, blue eyed, white girl.

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Speaker 3: But you hear about many.

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Speaker 2: Of them that occur much more than you would have before.

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Speaker 2: So people started locking their doors more often, restricting the

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Speaker 2: freedoms of their kids, not letting them just ride their

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Speaker 2: bikes down the street alone or walk to the store alone.

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Speaker 2: And so that is a very important thing. This guy,

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Speaker 2: although he was able to abduct six seven girls, they.

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Speaker 3: Were much more available to him.

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Speaker 2: So this is not a criminal sophistication level that is

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Speaker 2: extremely high. It is more a product of the times.

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Speaker 2: So that's the first part of the profile. He chooses

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Speaker 2: victims of opportunity, but they must meet his.

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Speaker 3: Physical and gender requirements.

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Speaker 2: And so I think that they're all black, they're all female,

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Speaker 2: they're all petite, they're all alone, and they're all on foot.

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Speaker 2: So there are certainly offenders who will follow a woman

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Speaker 2: in a car down a secluded route and bump into

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Speaker 2: the car pull them over as a fake cop. There

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Speaker 2: are people who are sophisticated enough to do that.

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Speaker 7: He is not.

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Speaker 2: He's looking for children, he's not looking to go into

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Speaker 2: their home and risk their family members. He's very cost

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Speaker 2: All these things are going to be evinced in his

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Speaker 2: actual life.

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Speaker 5: When you say sophisticated, is that the same as intelligence.

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Speaker 5: Are we talking about someone who's of lower intelligence.

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Speaker 2: No, criminal sophistication is based on experience committing these kinds

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Speaker 2: of crimes. Generally, in these offenses we see precursor crimes

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Speaker 2: that lead up to the abduction, like peeping or breaking

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Speaker 2: into a house, stealing somebody's underwear, you know, doing things

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Speaker 2: like that.

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Speaker 3: But in this case, I do not believe he broke

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Speaker 3: into anybody's house.

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Speaker 2: I believe he doesn't have the guts to do it

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Speaker 2: or the physical skills to do it. And that could

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Speaker 2: be because he's overly heavy, or it could be because he's.

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Speaker 3: Just not confident.

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Speaker 2: I believe that he's likely short himself, although he has

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Speaker 2: very powerful hands, probably due to the kind of work

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Speaker 2: he does.

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Speaker 3: I believe he's not scary.

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Speaker 2: He's able to get close enough to these victims to

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Speaker 2: not scare.

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Speaker 3: Them away before he can control them.

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Speaker 2: So I believe he controls them with a knife or

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Speaker 2: a gun, and he very quickly binds them and or

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Speaker 2: throws them in a trunk of a car. Speaking of that,

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Speaker 2: I think he either has a van, a panel van,

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Speaker 2: which is much more common in the seventies, or a

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Speaker 2: station wagon like one of those green, metallic woody station wagons,

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Speaker 2: where he can open the back, toss them in and

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Speaker 2: close it and they're not going to be seen by anybody.

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Speaker 2: So he fits into the community. He's a blackmail or

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Speaker 2: mixed race, and everyone sees right through him. He's invisible

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Speaker 2: to the neighborhood because he is just one of the guys.

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Speaker 2: He probably doesn't come off as being gruff or an asshole.

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Speaker 2: He probably comes off as being meek, but he does

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Speaker 2: try to show off any opportunity he gets.

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Speaker 8: Next, Clemente talked about the kind of work the killer

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Speaker 8: likely did, which would also explain how he got around

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Speaker 8: the neighborhood.

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Speaker 3: He either trolls via his work.

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Speaker 2: For example, he could be a tow truck driver or

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Speaker 2: a traveling repair person, someone who picks up junk or

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Speaker 2: hauls away trash for people, something that gives him the

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Speaker 2: opportunity to drive any place at any hour of the

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Speaker 2: day or night, or he has just has the freedom

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Speaker 2: to do that. He works for himself and he doesn't

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Speaker 2: have to clock in anywhere in particular. Also, if he's

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Speaker 2: in a living relationship, it could be with a parent,

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Speaker 2: or it could be with a paramore. However, he definitely

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Speaker 2: does not have to answer to another person in terms

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Speaker 2: of where he is at what hour, because he's been

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Speaker 2: able to do this at any hour at any time.

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Speaker 3: He grew up in a very religious family, one.

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Speaker 2: That would have condemned the thoughts and desires that he knew.

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Speaker 2: By the time he hit puberty, he knew that he

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Speaker 2: was sexually attracted to children.

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Speaker 3: He knew that this was wrong.

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Speaker 2: He may have acted on it and been scolded and

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Speaker 2: punished extremely.

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Speaker 3: By his mother.

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Speaker 2: This would have gone on throughout his entire childhood that

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Speaker 2: he would have been very severely physically punished and also demeaned,

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Speaker 2: and the demeaning part was probably even more damaging than

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Speaker 2: the physical punishment. He has a foot or shoe fetish,

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Speaker 2: and that's why he keeps the shoes as souvenirs. And

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Speaker 2: there's a difference between souvenirs and trophies. Souvenirs is something

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Speaker 2: that he keeps privately to himself to remind himself and

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Speaker 2: encourage the fantasies that he will have as he's reliving

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Speaker 2: these experiences these offenses.

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Speaker 3: Trophies are something that you show off.

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Speaker 2: For example, trophy might be a necklace that you take

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Speaker 2: from a victim and give to somebody in your life

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Speaker 2: so you can see it every day.

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Speaker 3: It's much more insidious.

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Speaker 2: So, as I said before, I believe that most likely

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Speaker 2: through his work he's developed very strong hands, powerful hands

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Speaker 2: and arms, and this is something that he probably deliberately

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Speaker 2: did as a line of work because he's small and

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Speaker 2: he feels powerless and he wants to feel more powerful.

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Speaker 2: He feels like he doesn't measure up, and that again

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Speaker 2: was something that was drilled into him as a kid,

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Speaker 2: and especially if they found out about his deviant sexual

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Speaker 2: behavior and desires. So he feels very diminished. He's get

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Speaker 2: an extremely poor sense of self. He knew since he

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Speaker 2: was a child that these dirty, evil thoughts were wrong

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Speaker 2: and that he was not normal, and he's fixated on

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Speaker 2: petite probably just pubescent children. This may have been the

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Speaker 2: first sexual experience that he.

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Speaker 3: Had was with a girl of that age.

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Speaker 2: Whether he was that age or older, I don't know,

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Speaker 2: but probably either a younger relative or somebody that he

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Speaker 2: had access to through the family was the first person

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Speaker 2: that he molested. And he may have gotten caught, and

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Speaker 2: that's why when he started this particular killing series, he

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Speaker 2: actually killed his victims because he didn't want to ever

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Speaker 2: get caught again.

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Speaker 5: Would he have been able to stop for any reason

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Speaker 5: other than being caught or something else happening, Would he've

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Speaker 5: had the come out of control.

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Speaker 2: He would have needed to stop, absolutely, because every single

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Speaker 2: one of them can stop. And the proof of that

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Speaker 2: is that they don't do it in front of everybody else.

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Speaker 4: They hide it.

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Speaker 2: They do it only when they can get away with it,

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Speaker 2: and that is the ultimate control. They know that it's wrong,

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Speaker 2: they know that it's illegally, they know they will get

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Speaker 2: arrested and maybe spend the rest of their life in

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Speaker 2: jail or get the death penalty, and they avoid it

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Speaker 2: by operating only when they can get away with it.

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Speaker 2: That's all the proof I need that they're in control.

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Speaker 2: The people who are criminally insane don't realize that what

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Speaker 2: they're doing is wrong, so they don't make any attempt

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Speaker 2: to hide it.

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Speaker 3: And so this guy is.

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Speaker 4: Not like that, not at all.

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Speaker 2: So one particular victim really stands out to me, and

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Speaker 2: that's Brenda Woodard. And she was eighteen years old, so

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Speaker 2: she was the oldest victim that we know of, and

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Speaker 2: yet she was very petite as well and fit all

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Speaker 2: of the other desirability factors. He probably didn't know that

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Speaker 2: she was eighteen. She probably looked younger to him. That

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Speaker 2: may mean that he had to follow her at a

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Speaker 2: great distance, or that he didn't have much time to

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Speaker 2: make a decision with respect to her.

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Speaker 3: But this offense really affected him.

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Speaker 2: As I said earlier, she was stabbed repeatedly, but when

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Speaker 2: her body was placed, a coat was placed over a

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Speaker 2: chest where where she was stabbed, and that's an aspect

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Speaker 2: of undoing.

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Speaker 3: So he lost his cool. He was enraged by her behavior.

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Speaker 2: She didn't follow the script he had in his mind,

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Speaker 2: and therefore he punished her for that, but he felt

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Speaker 2: bad about it, and that's the reason why I believe

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Speaker 2: he was brought up in a very religious family, a

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Speaker 2: very strict religious family that basically chastised him and said

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Speaker 2: he was going to be punished for his sins, and

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Speaker 2: so that was an outward manifestation of this enforced remorse

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Speaker 2: basically for what he did. The extent to which Brenda

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Speaker 2: fought back really bothered him and it undermined his confidence

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Speaker 2: for quite a while, and that's why he didn't operate

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Speaker 2: for so long. He may have also been walking around

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Speaker 2: with physical manifestations of that, scratches on his face, bruised eyes, whatever.

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Speaker 2: It is something that made him feel like he was

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Speaker 2: ultimately vulnerable because of what she did. So post defense behavior,

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Speaker 2: I would say after each of the murders, he hunkered

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Speaker 2: down and sort of repented outwardly, but inwardly, what he

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Speaker 2: was doing was he was reliving the fantasy of what

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Speaker 2: he done over and over again, probably trying to correct

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Speaker 2: the things that went wrong. And this is one of

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Speaker 2: the things that drives them to do it over and

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Speaker 2: over again because it never goes exactly as they fantasize,

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Speaker 2: and they want to do it right, and they want

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Speaker 2: it to be right so they can have this amazing.

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Speaker 3: Fulfilled fantasy.

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Speaker 2: This guy has a rich inner fantasy life, and I

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Speaker 2: think that led him to read a lot and engage

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Speaker 2: in fantasy type behavior. Today's version of that would be

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Speaker 2: playing certain fantasy games, but back in the seventies that

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Speaker 2: wasn't really there. But he may have engaged in that

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Speaker 2: kind of behavior on the side for his hobby.

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Speaker 3: He likes to show off how smart he is.

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Speaker 2: Is probably annoys the hell out of anybody that he

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Speaker 2: knows or people that he comes in contact with. His

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Speaker 2: fantasies are all about young girls, and he may have

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Speaker 2: from time to time slipped up and let somebody know like, oh,

248
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Speaker 2: isn't she hot or something like that, making comments. Wants

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Speaker 2: to feel powerful and having this power over these girls

250
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Speaker 2: makes him feel powerful.

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Speaker 8: When I heard this, it reminded me of Brenda Crockett,

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Speaker 8: the ten year old who the Freeway Phantom allowed to

253
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Speaker 8: call home a few times. I asked Clemente if he

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Speaker 8: thought that was one of the killers displays of power.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well, this is one of the things the mother

256
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Speaker 2: was out looking for. I think that he saw the mother,

257
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Speaker 2: and he wanted to make sure that she didn't see him.

258
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Speaker 2: That's why he had her tell her mother, I'm in

259
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Speaker 2: a house with a white man in Virginia. That tells

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Speaker 2: me they were not in Virginia, and he was not

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Speaker 2: a white man, and so he expected that if the

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Speaker 2: mother had seen him with her.

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Speaker 3: She would have said, but who was that black man.

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Speaker 4: I saw you with?

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Speaker 2: But she didn't say that, right, So I think that

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Speaker 2: was a test to see and that's why he had

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Speaker 2: her call back twice.

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Speaker 8: Next, Jim Clemente talked about the killer's likely living situation.

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Speaker 2: He has a private house or garage or shed where

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Speaker 2: he keeps these girls where he has total privacy and control.

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Speaker 2: It's in the Beltway area, but it's not in Virginia.

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Speaker 2: He excluded that by using Virginia in that call. So

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Speaker 2: somewhere in Maryland or DC he grew up there or

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Speaker 2: works in that area. And I believe that in nineteen

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Speaker 2: seventy one he was probably mid twenties to mid thirties.

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Speaker 2: I believe this was the beginning of his offending career,

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Speaker 2: and I think something significant happened right after this that

278
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Speaker 2: could have been he moved went into the military, was arrested,

279
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Speaker 2: but some significant event happened which changed his offending behavior

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Speaker 2: stopped it at this point, at least in this area.

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Speaker 2: And that could also have been that he got married,

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Speaker 2: he got into a relationship, that he found someone who

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Speaker 2: empowered him and that he was not.

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Speaker 3: Afraid to be with.

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Speaker 2: But it could also have been somebody who completely dominates

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Speaker 2: and controls him, like his mother did. But that's the

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Speaker 2: only two types of relationships that I believe he would

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Speaker 2: have been in.

289
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Speaker 4: What about the washing.

290
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Speaker 5: He seems to have washed at least some of them,

291
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Speaker 5: if not all of them.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well, part of that could be he washed the

293
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Speaker 2: feet because he has a foot fetish, so for him,

294
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Speaker 2: interacting with their feet is a sexual behavior. It's also

295
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Speaker 2: possible that that's a level of forensic sophistication. So yes,

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Speaker 2: there were green fibers found on several of the bodies.

297
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Speaker 2: That shows a lack of forensic sophistication in that area.

298
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Speaker 2: But he may have washed any evidence of sexual contact

299
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Speaker 2: with these girls. Clearly, they were able to determine that

300
00:18:05,480 --> 00:18:09,400
Speaker 2: they were raped in most of the cases, so he

301
00:18:09,480 --> 00:18:13,640
Speaker 2: wasn't able to undo that, but he did at least

302
00:18:13,720 --> 00:18:17,880
Speaker 2: make an effort and I think that it's either part

303
00:18:17,880 --> 00:18:21,840
Speaker 2: of his ritual. So there's MO aspects to every crime.

304
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Speaker 2: Those are modus operandi, the action's necessary to commit to

305
00:18:25,840 --> 00:18:28,240
Speaker 2: crime and escape undetected.

306
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Speaker 3: But there's also ritual aspects.

307
00:18:30,720 --> 00:18:33,400
Speaker 2: And although MO is learned and that you get better

308
00:18:33,440 --> 00:18:36,960
Speaker 2: and better over time, that's where you developed criminal sophistication.

309
00:18:37,640 --> 00:18:41,119
Speaker 2: I'm not saying that he isn't criminally sophisticated. I'm saying

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Speaker 2: that his criminal sophistication level does not rise to the

311
00:18:45,640 --> 00:18:48,440
Speaker 2: level that will give him the ability to break into

312
00:18:48,480 --> 00:18:52,480
Speaker 2: somebody's protected home and take them from their own environment.

313
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Speaker 2: That is a criminal sophistication level that is much higher

314
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Speaker 2: than someone who takes someone who's on foot on.

315
00:19:00,840 --> 00:19:03,399
Speaker 3: The street, so he has a car, they don't have

316
00:19:03,440 --> 00:19:03,879
Speaker 3: a car.

317
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Speaker 2: The problem with taking somebody who has a car on foot,

318
00:19:08,240 --> 00:19:09,720
Speaker 2: you know when they get out of their car, is

319
00:19:09,760 --> 00:19:11,840
Speaker 2: that you leave the car there, so everybody knows where

320
00:19:11,840 --> 00:19:15,280
Speaker 2: they were taken from, and the window of opportunity can

321
00:19:15,320 --> 00:19:19,000
Speaker 2: be seriously limited by that. So he's taking people who

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Speaker 2: are on foot who you know won't be expected back

323
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Speaker 2: home immediately, right, so there's more of a time delay.

324
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Speaker 2: The alarm doesn't go off right away, gives them a

325
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Speaker 2: chance to get.

326
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Speaker 3: Away to his secure location.

327
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Speaker 2: That's what I meant by saying he wasn't as criminally

328
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Speaker 2: sophisticated as somebody who would do in home abductions. So

329
00:19:41,960 --> 00:19:46,199
Speaker 2: he could have a history, and his history would have

330
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Speaker 2: been sexually victimizing children, one in his family or somehow

331
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Speaker 2: that he got access to in his teens or early twenties,

332
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Speaker 2: because that is what was available to him.

333
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Speaker 3: But eventually he figure.

334
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Speaker 2: Out a way to get out and hunt, and he

335
00:20:07,560 --> 00:20:11,800
Speaker 2: probably hunted a little bit away from where he lived

336
00:20:12,320 --> 00:20:16,560
Speaker 2: and then took them to this place that is secure,

337
00:20:17,240 --> 00:20:21,199
Speaker 2: then dumped them a little ways away from where he

338
00:20:21,280 --> 00:20:24,880
Speaker 2: lived or where he did this because he didn't want

339
00:20:24,920 --> 00:20:29,359
Speaker 2: to point people in the direction of where he lived.

340
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Speaker 3: But I know in one case.

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Speaker 2: The victim was left right by where her mother takes

342
00:20:36,320 --> 00:20:40,200
Speaker 2: the bus every day. Her shoes were placed very neatly

343
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Speaker 2: by the side of her body. That's a ritualistic kind

344
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Speaker 2: of behavior, and so that could mean that there's some

345
00:20:47,760 --> 00:20:51,440
Speaker 2: kind of connection between them. I don't know, but it's

346
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Speaker 2: a very risky thing to do too.

347
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Speaker 5: You said that his behavior would have always been towards

348
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Speaker 5: young girls, and you said pretty clearly that that that's

349
00:21:00,160 --> 00:21:03,840
Speaker 5: what motivates him. So this is probably not someone who

350
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Speaker 5: would have changed the opposite.

351
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Speaker 9: This is not.

352
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Speaker 5: Somebody who raped twenty five year olds at one point

353
00:21:09,760 --> 00:21:13,520
Speaker 5: and then for this period of time preyed on young girls.

354
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Speaker 3: Absolutely, no, that's not who it is.

355
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Speaker 2: Yeah, if he can successfully break into homes and rape

356
00:21:22,040 --> 00:21:24,800
Speaker 2: twenty five year olds or get them while they're on

357
00:21:24,840 --> 00:21:27,480
Speaker 2: the street, no he's not doing that.

358
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Speaker 3: No, his sexual fantasies are about children.

359
00:21:33,160 --> 00:21:37,159
Speaker 8: That concludes Jim Clemente's profile of the Freeway phantom, and

360
00:21:37,240 --> 00:21:40,119
Speaker 8: there's a lot to break down here, so we asked

361
00:21:40,119 --> 00:21:42,640
Speaker 8: someone else to sit down with us and provide their

362
00:21:42,680 --> 00:22:05,040
Speaker 8: thoughts on this new profile. Jim Clementi's profile is striking

363
00:22:05,080 --> 00:22:07,960
Speaker 8: for a number of reasons. It suggests the killer was

364
00:22:08,000 --> 00:22:11,800
Speaker 8: a local person, someone with limited resources and a lower

365
00:22:11,880 --> 00:22:16,920
Speaker 8: level of sophistication than previously believed. It also suggests they

366
00:22:16,920 --> 00:22:21,560
Speaker 8: were primarily motivated by fetishes, in turn demonstrating a level

367
00:22:21,600 --> 00:22:27,159
Speaker 8: of psychopathy before unconsidered. We wanted to analyze Clemente's profile

368
00:22:27,240 --> 00:22:30,800
Speaker 8: with a professional investigator, so we decided to run all

369
00:22:30,800 --> 00:22:34,080
Speaker 8: of this by Detective Jim Trainam. We showed him Clemente's

370
00:22:34,119 --> 00:22:36,359
Speaker 8: new profile, and here were his thoughts.

371
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Speaker 7: One of the things that he said that really made

372
00:22:41,040 --> 00:22:44,359
Speaker 7: sense to me is the fact that he believes that

373
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Speaker 7: this person fantasized about this, especially with the first victim,

374
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Speaker 7: and planned it, and that's why he was able to

375
00:22:51,080 --> 00:22:53,760
Speaker 7: keep her as long as he did, because he had

376
00:22:53,760 --> 00:22:56,919
Speaker 7: everything set up and ready to go. What I'm wondering

377
00:22:57,040 --> 00:22:59,240
Speaker 7: is is how many false starts he may have had

378
00:22:59,280 --> 00:23:03,960
Speaker 7: before that with other children. And one thing that I

379
00:23:04,040 --> 00:23:06,159
Speaker 7: did want to bring up, I don't look if you

380
00:23:06,240 --> 00:23:09,200
Speaker 7: consider this is he was talking about the time between

381
00:23:09,240 --> 00:23:12,119
Speaker 7: the abduction and the body was found. But we know

382
00:23:12,400 --> 00:23:16,480
Speaker 7: that with the first victim, she was abducted kept somewhere

383
00:23:16,680 --> 00:23:19,480
Speaker 7: because when she was found, the medical examiner was able

384
00:23:19,520 --> 00:23:21,679
Speaker 7: to say she had been there only like two or

385
00:23:21,680 --> 00:23:24,280
Speaker 7: three days, and so she was alive for several days

386
00:23:24,280 --> 00:23:26,920
Speaker 7: before then. But with the other victims, we don't really

387
00:23:26,960 --> 00:23:29,000
Speaker 7: know exactly when they were killed, so it may have

388
00:23:29,040 --> 00:23:32,520
Speaker 7: been a much shorter time period. He may have abducted them,

389
00:23:32,840 --> 00:23:34,240
Speaker 7: killed them, and then dumped them.

390
00:23:34,160 --> 00:23:37,960
Speaker 9: They were found some time later. But what's interesting is

391
00:23:37,960 --> 00:23:43,440
Speaker 9: is that does that mean that he singled out this

392
00:23:43,720 --> 00:23:47,919
Speaker 9: first victim and did he know her, And with the

393
00:23:48,000 --> 00:23:50,480
Speaker 9: other victims, like the second victim, we always kind of

394
00:23:50,520 --> 00:23:53,560
Speaker 9: theorized that says they were from the same neighborhood, disappeared

395
00:23:53,600 --> 00:23:55,320
Speaker 9: the same way that he may have known her too.

396
00:23:55,800 --> 00:23:58,720
Speaker 9: But the other ones, were they actually ones that he

397
00:23:59,160 --> 00:24:02,720
Speaker 9: identified before forehand? Because I got the impression that that's

398
00:24:02,720 --> 00:24:04,960
Speaker 9: what Jim was saying. I may be wrong that he

399
00:24:05,000 --> 00:24:09,640
Speaker 9: identified his victims beforehand and then planned it and then

400
00:24:09,680 --> 00:24:13,639
Speaker 9: abducted them. And is it that or were they just

401
00:24:14,080 --> 00:24:17,359
Speaker 9: was he driving around and having victims of opportunity that

402
00:24:17,480 --> 00:24:19,800
Speaker 9: kind of fit the type of person that he was

403
00:24:19,800 --> 00:24:23,040
Speaker 9: looking for, somebody who was small, somebody who was vulnerable,

404
00:24:23,240 --> 00:24:26,520
Speaker 9: somebody who was isolated for a short period of time

405
00:24:26,600 --> 00:24:28,639
Speaker 9: so that he could go up and make his play.

406
00:24:29,480 --> 00:24:33,480
Speaker 9: That would be one question. I don't remember seeing anything

407
00:24:33,680 --> 00:24:36,800
Speaker 9: in any of the investigative reports about them trying to

408
00:24:36,800 --> 00:24:41,600
Speaker 9: find out, especially at first, how many other times had

409
00:24:41,960 --> 00:24:46,439
Speaker 9: girls been approached by strangers or someone they knew. So

410
00:24:46,760 --> 00:24:50,240
Speaker 9: that was my first observation, where each of these victims

411
00:24:50,280 --> 00:24:53,159
Speaker 9: identified beforehand, or was it just the first one and

412
00:24:53,200 --> 00:24:56,600
Speaker 9: the rest were part of his hunting pattern and you

413
00:24:56,800 --> 00:24:59,199
Speaker 9: just happened to cross them at the right date and

414
00:24:59,200 --> 00:24:59,800
Speaker 9: the right time.

415
00:25:02,119 --> 00:25:05,680
Speaker 8: Trainum also says he found Clemente's analysis of the time

416
00:25:05,720 --> 00:25:07,480
Speaker 8: period to be very interesting as well.

417
00:25:08,600 --> 00:25:10,840
Speaker 9: You know, this was a time period where people did hitchhike.

418
00:25:11,600 --> 00:25:14,600
Speaker 9: I mean, back in nineteen seventy one, I was hitchhiking,

419
00:25:14,800 --> 00:25:16,560
Speaker 9: you know, I was in high school, and that's how

420
00:25:16,560 --> 00:25:19,359
Speaker 9: we got around. And children were out on the street,

421
00:25:19,400 --> 00:25:22,880
Speaker 9: and they were much more freer, I think, and less

422
00:25:22,880 --> 00:25:26,679
Speaker 9: fearful than we are these days. And I think that

423
00:25:27,000 --> 00:25:30,520
Speaker 9: a lot of child sex abeziers like he was talking

424
00:25:30,520 --> 00:25:34,439
Speaker 9: about very easily could in some cases have lured them

425
00:25:34,480 --> 00:25:37,440
Speaker 9: into the car without any kind of threat of violence,

426
00:25:38,040 --> 00:25:40,760
Speaker 9: and then used a knife to keep them under control

427
00:25:40,800 --> 00:25:41,640
Speaker 9: of that sort of thing.

428
00:25:42,840 --> 00:25:44,639
Speaker 8: We asked train Um what he thought about some of

429
00:25:44,680 --> 00:25:46,680
Speaker 8: the geographical analysis.

430
00:25:47,359 --> 00:25:50,760
Speaker 9: If you go and look at all the other abduction sites,

431
00:25:51,160 --> 00:25:52,760
Speaker 9: I mean, all of them are pretty much on the

432
00:25:52,800 --> 00:25:55,960
Speaker 9: side of an open road, and traffic wasn't as heavy

433
00:25:56,040 --> 00:25:58,960
Speaker 9: then as it is now, and you could drive up

434
00:25:59,119 --> 00:26:02,719
Speaker 9: and stop your car there and you really wouldn't look suspicious.

435
00:26:03,240 --> 00:26:05,480
Speaker 9: And it doesn't take that long just to haul something

436
00:26:05,520 --> 00:26:08,440
Speaker 9: out if you have a clear area. But let's say

437
00:26:08,520 --> 00:26:11,639
Speaker 9: that you haul the body out, laid it down and

438
00:26:11,920 --> 00:26:15,199
Speaker 9: suddenly a police car comes up behind you. What is

439
00:26:15,240 --> 00:26:18,199
Speaker 9: your story. I was driving down the road and I

440
00:26:18,240 --> 00:26:20,240
Speaker 9: saw something over here, so I pulled over to check

441
00:26:20,280 --> 00:26:24,240
Speaker 9: on it. But when he dropped off Brenda Woodard, he

442
00:26:24,320 --> 00:26:28,040
Speaker 9: had to get off the interstate go around this you know,

443
00:26:28,960 --> 00:26:33,200
Speaker 9: much narrower exit stop where there was no place to stop.

444
00:26:33,280 --> 00:26:36,240
Speaker 9: There was no place to pull off. He had to

445
00:26:36,280 --> 00:26:38,960
Speaker 9: be out in the road in order to put her

446
00:26:39,000 --> 00:26:42,080
Speaker 9: body where he put it. So I think he had

447
00:26:42,119 --> 00:26:45,680
Speaker 9: a much higher chance of being spotted as being seen

448
00:26:45,720 --> 00:26:49,280
Speaker 9: as somebody doing something suspicious, and so you know why

449
00:26:49,320 --> 00:26:52,880
Speaker 9: he chose that spot always puzzled me. I've heard this.

450
00:26:53,440 --> 00:26:55,919
Speaker 9: I've never been able to really find any documentation in

451
00:26:55,960 --> 00:26:59,320
Speaker 9: my memory about how her mother actually worked at the

452
00:26:59,320 --> 00:27:02,040
Speaker 9: hospital right next to where the body was found and

453
00:27:02,119 --> 00:27:04,320
Speaker 9: all of that. Could it be because he had some

454
00:27:04,400 --> 00:27:07,240
Speaker 9: kind of exchange with her and knew that her mother

455
00:27:07,280 --> 00:27:08,480
Speaker 9: worked at the hospital there.

456
00:27:10,080 --> 00:27:12,760
Speaker 8: Trenham says he's also curious about the type of sexual

457
00:27:12,800 --> 00:27:14,280
Speaker 8: assaults that the killer committed.

458
00:27:15,400 --> 00:27:18,879
Speaker 9: There was evidence that they were strangled not only manually,

459
00:27:19,200 --> 00:27:22,679
Speaker 9: but with the ligature as well. But with Brenda, she

460
00:27:22,840 --> 00:27:26,400
Speaker 9: was strangled with the literature. It stabbed, Like Jim said,

461
00:27:26,440 --> 00:27:29,600
Speaker 9: you probably she had written the letter and she knew that,

462
00:27:29,720 --> 00:27:32,639
Speaker 9: you know, the shit was up, and she'd try to

463
00:27:32,640 --> 00:27:35,040
Speaker 9: protect herself because she had already been sexually assaulted, her

464
00:27:35,040 --> 00:27:38,639
Speaker 9: clothes and put back on, and when she was stabbed,

465
00:27:38,800 --> 00:27:41,800
Speaker 9: her clothes were inside out, her shirt was inside out,

466
00:27:42,160 --> 00:27:45,280
Speaker 9: and the knife holes in the shirt matched up to

467
00:27:45,359 --> 00:27:49,480
Speaker 9: the knife entries there. I was wondering if he was possibly,

468
00:27:49,800 --> 00:27:53,320
Speaker 9: as part of his control and sexual fantasy, strangling them

469
00:27:53,359 --> 00:27:55,879
Speaker 9: during sex and letting them pass out and come to

470
00:27:56,480 --> 00:27:59,480
Speaker 9: I mean, because Brenda was probably not killed by strangulation

471
00:28:00,359 --> 00:28:02,760
Speaker 9: of a knife injuries, So I'm thinking that the strangulation

472
00:28:02,880 --> 00:28:07,280
Speaker 9: came first. I think that the most logical or the

473
00:28:07,280 --> 00:28:11,480
Speaker 9: theory that fits those facts is that the clothes were removed,

474
00:28:11,640 --> 00:28:15,720
Speaker 9: she was sexually assaulted, she was redressed like the other victims,

475
00:28:15,760 --> 00:28:18,720
Speaker 9: and then maybe during the writing out of the notes

476
00:28:19,040 --> 00:28:26,879
Speaker 9: something happened and that's what she stabbed. I thought the

477
00:28:26,920 --> 00:28:29,919
Speaker 9: point about the first one having the most planning is

478
00:28:29,960 --> 00:28:35,280
Speaker 9: really the most interesting thing myself, because even with the

479
00:28:35,320 --> 00:28:38,320
Speaker 9: third victim, Crockett, I mean, he had to have had

480
00:28:38,320 --> 00:28:40,560
Speaker 9: a place to take her to make that phone call.

481
00:28:41,200 --> 00:28:43,480
Speaker 9: I really was wondering, you know, if he knew the mother,

482
00:28:43,720 --> 00:28:46,680
Speaker 9: or if the mother actually saw him at some point.

483
00:28:47,000 --> 00:28:49,760
Speaker 9: That's always been a question in my mind. Would he

484
00:28:49,800 --> 00:28:53,520
Speaker 9: have aborted, would he have tried to cover up what

485
00:28:53,600 --> 00:28:56,520
Speaker 9: he was doing, maybe by bringing her back and saying

486
00:28:56,560 --> 00:28:57,280
Speaker 9: that he found her.

487
00:28:57,600 --> 00:28:58,120
Speaker 4: I don't know.

488
00:28:58,640 --> 00:29:01,640
Speaker 9: Honestly, I think that if she had said, you know,

489
00:29:01,720 --> 00:29:05,920
Speaker 9: mama saw you, or in some way provided that information

490
00:29:06,120 --> 00:29:09,040
Speaker 9: that you know, she might be alive, because he would

491
00:29:09,080 --> 00:29:13,320
Speaker 9: have felt that he could not carry through without further

492
00:29:13,800 --> 00:29:14,880
Speaker 9: risk to himself.

493
00:29:16,280 --> 00:29:18,800
Speaker 8: And lastly, Trainam had a lot to say about the

494
00:29:18,800 --> 00:29:22,160
Speaker 8: new profiles take on the handwritten note, which included the

495
00:29:22,200 --> 00:29:24,320
Speaker 8: Moniker Freeway phantom.

496
00:29:24,960 --> 00:29:27,880
Speaker 9: Yeah, the name was coined by I believe a reporter

497
00:29:27,920 --> 00:29:32,840
Speaker 9: for WTP at the time, Pat Collins. But one thing

498
00:29:32,880 --> 00:29:35,400
Speaker 9: that was proposed at one point was that he was

499
00:29:35,440 --> 00:29:38,440
Speaker 9: pissed off because the police were at that point we're

500
00:29:38,440 --> 00:29:42,000
Speaker 9: still saying, oh no, there's no serial killer, no comment.

501
00:29:42,400 --> 00:29:45,120
Speaker 9: They were really downplaying it. And so yeah, we had

502
00:29:45,160 --> 00:29:47,840
Speaker 9: always kind of thought that he's now proud of himself.

503
00:29:47,880 --> 00:29:50,640
Speaker 9: He wants to show the world that you know, this

504
00:29:50,800 --> 00:29:54,240
Speaker 9: is my handiwork, and I'm smarter than the cops are.

505
00:29:54,920 --> 00:29:58,640
Speaker 9: And so he's actually bragging about that. But the fact

506
00:29:58,680 --> 00:30:03,040
Speaker 9: that Brenda wentz South arum. We always felt that that

507
00:30:03,200 --> 00:30:07,240
Speaker 9: was the reason for that ten months delay between victims

508
00:30:07,320 --> 00:30:07,800
Speaker 9: right there.

509
00:30:09,200 --> 00:30:11,760
Speaker 8: My take on all of this is that the profile

510
00:30:11,800 --> 00:30:16,200
Speaker 8: suggests the killer could have stopped killing, but his tendencies

511
00:30:16,240 --> 00:30:19,120
Speaker 8: to want to show off his skill or ability would

512
00:30:19,160 --> 00:30:21,719
Speaker 8: have remained the same. He would have followed the freeway

513
00:30:21,760 --> 00:30:26,000
Speaker 8: phantom cases and basked in that moniker, enjoying that he

514
00:30:26,080 --> 00:30:30,640
Speaker 8: outsmarted law enforcement. But that over confidence made him vulnerable

515
00:30:31,120 --> 00:30:34,520
Speaker 8: because anyone near him could witness his behavior and his

516
00:30:34,760 --> 00:30:38,720
Speaker 8: enjoyment of the coverage and then report him to the police.

517
00:30:38,920 --> 00:30:43,560
Speaker 8: That's still possible even today. But if the killer was

518
00:30:43,680 --> 00:30:47,000
Speaker 8: less sophisticated than we initially thought, then why was it

519
00:30:47,080 --> 00:30:50,200
Speaker 8: so difficult to capture him? As we've talked about on

520
00:30:50,200 --> 00:30:54,840
Speaker 8: this podcast, The answer is complicated, but it ultimately boils

521
00:30:54,880 --> 00:30:59,520
Speaker 8: down to a blend of primitive investigative technology, racism and

522
00:30:59,560 --> 00:31:02,720
Speaker 8: apathy in the police force, a lack of willingness in

523
00:31:02,760 --> 00:31:06,280
Speaker 8: the community to come forward, and pure luck on behalf

524
00:31:06,320 --> 00:31:10,400
Speaker 8: of the killer. The thing is, many of those issues

525
00:31:10,440 --> 00:31:14,800
Speaker 8: remain true today. According to DC Witness. That's a nonprofit

526
00:31:14,840 --> 00:31:18,680
Speaker 8: that collects and analyzes violent crime data in the nation's capital.

527
00:31:19,120 --> 00:31:22,800
Speaker 8: The homicide rate is consistently rising here and the closure

528
00:31:22,880 --> 00:31:26,840
Speaker 8: rate is dropping. In twenty twenty two, only forty two

529
00:31:26,960 --> 00:31:31,560
Speaker 8: percent of homicide cases were closed nationwide. Black girls and

530
00:31:31,600 --> 00:31:34,640
Speaker 8: women are at a significantly higher risk of being the

531
00:31:34,720 --> 00:31:38,600
Speaker 8: victims of violent crime, and a twenty twenty DC Witness

532
00:31:38,600 --> 00:31:41,720
Speaker 8: study showed that the rate of homicide among black girls

533
00:31:41,720 --> 00:31:45,719
Speaker 8: and women rose thirty three percent that year in comparison

534
00:31:45,720 --> 00:31:51,160
Speaker 8: to fifteen percent among their white counterparts. So why why

535
00:31:51,360 --> 00:31:54,320
Speaker 8: are black girls still at risk and why aren't these

536
00:31:54,320 --> 00:31:56,040
Speaker 8: cases getting solved?

537
00:31:56,880 --> 00:32:00,280
Speaker 10: A lot of variables playing into closure rate. It's not

538
00:32:00,360 --> 00:32:03,480
Speaker 10: always just a racial thing, and sometimes it is a

539
00:32:03,560 --> 00:32:08,200
Speaker 10: racial thing. It would be irresponsible of me to say

540
00:32:08,520 --> 00:32:12,040
Speaker 10: that the closure rate is solely dependent on color. I

541
00:32:12,120 --> 00:32:13,760
Speaker 10: will say that they're variables.

542
00:32:14,200 --> 00:32:16,760
Speaker 4: We live and die. Some people by the street code.

543
00:32:16,800 --> 00:32:19,680
Speaker 10: Some people out there they know who murdered this person,

544
00:32:19,760 --> 00:32:21,800
Speaker 10: they know who committed this.

545
00:32:21,920 --> 00:32:46,960
Speaker 4: Armed robbery, but they won't come forward. I could just

546
00:32:47,000 --> 00:32:49,240
Speaker 4: tell you, you.

547
00:32:48,000 --> 00:32:49,680
Speaker 10: Know, there's some of the variables and some of the

548
00:32:49,720 --> 00:32:54,479
Speaker 10: reasons why there's lack of resistance within the communities to crime.

549
00:32:55,560 --> 00:32:56,040
Speaker 4: Robbery.

550
00:32:56,520 --> 00:33:01,080
Speaker 10: There's a millisecond away from a homicide whenever you draw

551
00:33:01,120 --> 00:33:04,760
Speaker 10: a fire on and those same people who are committing

552
00:33:04,800 --> 00:33:08,600
Speaker 10: these homicides will snatch your baby out your living room

553
00:33:08,920 --> 00:33:11,719
Speaker 10: and should be a missing person. All of this is

554
00:33:11,760 --> 00:33:16,040
Speaker 10: all in the same vein, and that's why it's so important.

555
00:33:16,040 --> 00:33:18,600
Speaker 4: To bring closure to the community.

556
00:33:19,120 --> 00:33:24,280
Speaker 10: It's so important to solve these cases and the whole

557
00:33:24,800 --> 00:33:25,840
Speaker 10: folks accountable.

558
00:33:27,400 --> 00:33:32,200
Speaker 8: This is Henderson long, CEO of DC's Missing Voice. Henderson

559
00:33:32,320 --> 00:33:36,080
Speaker 8: is dedicated to building trust between DC's black community and

560
00:33:36,120 --> 00:33:39,560
Speaker 8: the police with the goal of bettering the homicide solve rate.

561
00:33:40,120 --> 00:33:42,440
Speaker 8: He also played a key role in helping us in

562
00:33:42,480 --> 00:33:45,440
Speaker 8: the early stages of our Freeway Phantom investigation.

563
00:33:47,320 --> 00:33:50,680
Speaker 10: I augment the Metropolitan Police Department in the private sector

564
00:33:51,280 --> 00:33:56,720
Speaker 10: to assist with trace investigations, to locate missing persons and

565
00:33:56,840 --> 00:33:58,760
Speaker 10: some of the similar work that needs.

566
00:33:58,600 --> 00:33:59,840
Speaker 4: To be done in the community.

567
00:34:00,600 --> 00:34:03,480
Speaker 10: I do a lot of that work in terms of outreach,

568
00:34:03,840 --> 00:34:08,800
Speaker 10: in terms of investigating cases, in terms of whatever these

569
00:34:08,920 --> 00:34:10,160
Speaker 10: detectives may need.

570
00:34:10,840 --> 00:34:12,040
Speaker 4: We promote cases.

571
00:34:12,160 --> 00:34:15,800
Speaker 10: We developed a big platform when we stay in close

572
00:34:15,880 --> 00:34:19,799
Speaker 10: contact with the lead detectives and stuff is so important.

573
00:34:20,840 --> 00:34:24,600
Speaker 8: Henderson says, this type of work is personally very significant

574
00:34:24,640 --> 00:34:25,160
Speaker 8: to him.

575
00:34:25,920 --> 00:34:29,120
Speaker 10: I'm an eight time homicide loser and my aunt was

576
00:34:29,320 --> 00:34:33,640
Speaker 10: missing and found murder. She was missing for twenty years,

577
00:34:34,440 --> 00:34:39,080
Speaker 10: and through the technology a DNA match, we found out

578
00:34:39,160 --> 00:34:44,240
Speaker 10: about her whereabouts and it was confirmed. My partner, John Andrews,

579
00:34:44,239 --> 00:34:45,879
Speaker 10: one of the guys I've worked with over the Missing

580
00:34:45,960 --> 00:34:49,600
Speaker 10: Persons unit who does cold cases, got the family to

581
00:34:49,800 --> 00:34:53,239
Speaker 10: submit their DNA and trust the police, and we put

582
00:34:53,239 --> 00:34:55,439
Speaker 10: it in the database. We compare it against the set

583
00:34:55,480 --> 00:34:58,200
Speaker 10: of bones and there it is. You know, I mean

584
00:34:58,239 --> 00:35:01,759
Speaker 10: after twenty years. Her body had been recovered a year later,

585
00:35:02,520 --> 00:35:08,840
Speaker 10: but by us being uneducated, by it being some fear

586
00:35:09,080 --> 00:35:11,880
Speaker 10: within our family about putting up your group was just

587
00:35:11,920 --> 00:35:16,839
Speaker 10: talking about DNA giving my DNA jam me up on that.

588
00:35:17,280 --> 00:35:20,000
Speaker 10: Maybe that homicide I committed last year, or maybe I

589
00:35:20,560 --> 00:35:22,840
Speaker 10: mean people just apprehensive.

590
00:35:22,160 --> 00:35:25,560
Speaker 4: About DNA social security numbers. No.

591
00:35:27,640 --> 00:35:30,400
Speaker 8: Henderson says one of the biggest issues in cases like

592
00:35:30,440 --> 00:35:33,520
Speaker 8: the Freeway phantom or any of the other dozen cases

593
00:35:33,520 --> 00:35:36,600
Speaker 8: he works on is that many of DC's black communities

594
00:35:36,640 --> 00:35:40,680
Speaker 8: simply don't trust law enforcement. When a murder occurs, it's

595
00:35:40,800 --> 00:35:43,759
Speaker 8: usually likely that someone in the neighborhood knows something, but

596
00:35:43,840 --> 00:35:47,480
Speaker 8: they won't tell the cops. Henderson's goal is to act

597
00:35:47,520 --> 00:35:51,239
Speaker 8: as a neutral ambassador and hopefully convince those witnesses to

598
00:35:51,280 --> 00:35:56,480
Speaker 8: come forward. How do you convince because I mean you

599
00:35:56,560 --> 00:35:59,560
Speaker 8: probably are aware that trust in polices at an all

600
00:35:59,600 --> 00:36:04,480
Speaker 8: time lovel So how do you convince people to.

601
00:36:04,680 --> 00:36:05,920
Speaker 11: Work with the police.

602
00:36:05,960 --> 00:36:07,160
Speaker 4: You get out in the community.

603
00:36:07,600 --> 00:36:10,839
Speaker 10: We may set up and feed people hot dogs one

604
00:36:10,920 --> 00:36:13,920
Speaker 10: day and just hand out resources and educate them, let them.

605
00:36:13,760 --> 00:36:16,279
Speaker 4: Know we were here for you. When they see me

606
00:36:16,560 --> 00:36:17,400
Speaker 4: with the commander.

607
00:36:18,200 --> 00:36:20,920
Speaker 10: I have creds in the street as being just an

608
00:36:20,920 --> 00:36:24,200
Speaker 10: honest person. You can have a keilo or cocaine. I'm

609
00:36:24,200 --> 00:36:27,280
Speaker 10: not here for the kilo. I'm here for the missing person.

610
00:36:27,600 --> 00:36:30,120
Speaker 10: So if you want your block to run, you need

611
00:36:30,160 --> 00:36:31,960
Speaker 10: to tell them you help with this missing This is

612
00:36:32,000 --> 00:36:33,920
Speaker 10: some of the things how you persuade because it's a

613
00:36:34,040 --> 00:36:36,080
Speaker 10: language within the street and you have to kind of

614
00:36:36,640 --> 00:36:39,520
Speaker 10: know the language, kind of know the area you in.

615
00:36:40,560 --> 00:36:42,480
Speaker 10: You know, before you go to a neighborhood and you

616
00:36:42,520 --> 00:36:45,480
Speaker 10: start jibber jabbing, you do a static drive too.

617
00:36:45,520 --> 00:36:47,759
Speaker 4: You look at the neighborhood, you call one.

618
00:36:47,680 --> 00:36:50,920
Speaker 10: Of the people up, the guys from the neighborhood, and

619
00:36:51,000 --> 00:36:55,080
Speaker 10: you ask him what's popping? Can you walk with me?

620
00:36:55,560 --> 00:36:58,480
Speaker 10: They see you with him. These are ways you do

621
00:36:58,520 --> 00:37:00,960
Speaker 10: it in a safe manner. It's a lot of different

622
00:37:00,960 --> 00:37:06,200
Speaker 10: ways to acquire information through computer databases to face to

623
00:37:06,239 --> 00:37:11,000
Speaker 10: face interviews. You have the DNA, the forensic technology. All

624
00:37:11,040 --> 00:37:14,080
Speaker 10: these things are at your disposal. You know, you have

625
00:37:14,160 --> 00:37:18,360
Speaker 10: business associates you may go interview, you have credit card information,

626
00:37:18,880 --> 00:37:22,680
Speaker 10: you have video surveillance you can use. Somebody may call

627
00:37:22,800 --> 00:37:25,920
Speaker 10: me and say we saw a little girl over in southeast.

628
00:37:26,440 --> 00:37:28,439
Speaker 10: I'll get with the detective and he'll go and pull

629
00:37:28,440 --> 00:37:31,319
Speaker 10: the video and there she is. So now we got

630
00:37:31,320 --> 00:37:33,920
Speaker 10: her schedule. We know she kind of coming here at

631
00:37:33,960 --> 00:37:37,879
Speaker 10: a certain time. So these are all investigated.

632
00:37:37,960 --> 00:37:38,760
Speaker 4: Like how you work.

633
00:37:39,040 --> 00:37:42,640
Speaker 10: You understand the person's where they like to go, where

634
00:37:42,640 --> 00:37:43,600
Speaker 10: do they frequent, what.

635
00:37:43,680 --> 00:37:46,600
Speaker 4: Time of day do they go there? You know, having

636
00:37:46,600 --> 00:37:48,320
Speaker 4: that good physical description.

637
00:37:48,520 --> 00:37:51,200
Speaker 10: If you'd be surprised how many families don't have an

638
00:37:51,280 --> 00:37:52,680
Speaker 10: up to date photo.

639
00:37:52,880 --> 00:37:55,359
Speaker 5: Even while they're carrying their phone their camera with them

640
00:37:55,360 --> 00:37:57,120
Speaker 5: all the time, you know what I mean.

641
00:37:57,200 --> 00:37:59,520
Speaker 10: Like let's say if you had a child, and a

642
00:37:59,560 --> 00:38:02,080
Speaker 10: lot of kids now they're too cool to take pictures,

643
00:38:02,520 --> 00:38:05,319
Speaker 10: so you might have an old picture and I'm just

644
00:38:05,320 --> 00:38:06,799
Speaker 10: gonna say this kind of like in some of the

645
00:38:06,800 --> 00:38:09,719
Speaker 10: inner city communities, we don't really take a lot of pictures,

646
00:38:09,880 --> 00:38:10,279
Speaker 10: so I.

647
00:38:10,200 --> 00:38:11,479
Speaker 4: Get a picture that's old.

648
00:38:11,520 --> 00:38:15,160
Speaker 10: But my point is having a good physical description, having

649
00:38:15,200 --> 00:38:21,440
Speaker 10: a good photo, having fingerprints on file. These are tools.

650
00:38:21,520 --> 00:38:25,960
Speaker 10: These are all investigative tools. Having their medical data, knowing

651
00:38:26,000 --> 00:38:28,840
Speaker 10: about it, like some people may be on medication and

652
00:38:28,880 --> 00:38:34,280
Speaker 10: they wander off. So having all these things on file,

653
00:38:35,200 --> 00:38:38,560
Speaker 10: having a community to understand this is in your custody,

654
00:38:38,640 --> 00:38:40,839
Speaker 10: meaning you can have a child ID kit in your

655
00:38:40,920 --> 00:38:43,839
Speaker 10: custody with all this stuff in it. The National Center

656
00:38:43,880 --> 00:38:47,960
Speaker 10: Missing Spool Kids, they send me a thousand child out

657
00:38:48,000 --> 00:38:48,680
Speaker 10: the kids and I.

658
00:38:48,600 --> 00:38:50,719
Speaker 4: Get out in the community and we try to get

659
00:38:50,719 --> 00:38:51,560
Speaker 4: into the schools.

660
00:38:52,120 --> 00:38:54,880
Speaker 11: I have a completed one of my son's fingerprints sitting

661
00:38:54,960 --> 00:38:55,879
Speaker 11: in my sav at home.

662
00:38:56,160 --> 00:38:57,720
Speaker 4: Yeah, and the medical data.

663
00:38:58,080 --> 00:39:01,600
Speaker 10: When someone goes missing, this actually a child is chaos.

664
00:39:02,320 --> 00:39:04,520
Speaker 10: You don't know how to put your left shoe on

665
00:39:04,600 --> 00:39:08,080
Speaker 10: from the right. Use some things you think you will remember,

666
00:39:08,520 --> 00:39:10,520
Speaker 10: you won't remember. But if you got it in the kid,

667
00:39:10,640 --> 00:39:14,520
Speaker 10: you just hand them a kid that's their full physical description.

668
00:39:14,719 --> 00:39:16,280
Speaker 4: These are things important.

669
00:39:16,440 --> 00:39:20,200
Speaker 11: It's interesting because on one side you're talking about things

670
00:39:20,239 --> 00:39:23,800
Speaker 11: like forensic and CCTV, which they didn't have in the

671
00:39:23,880 --> 00:39:26,920
Speaker 11: nineteen seventies when the freeway phantom was preying on children.

672
00:39:27,520 --> 00:39:30,440
Speaker 11: On the other side, you're talking about stuff like talking

673
00:39:30,480 --> 00:39:33,080
Speaker 11: to community members and getting people to speak with you.

674
00:39:33,480 --> 00:39:37,520
Speaker 11: That absolutely was available back in the nineteen seventies. But

675
00:39:37,640 --> 00:39:40,480
Speaker 11: when I look at the photos, the crime scene photos,

676
00:39:40,880 --> 00:39:45,440
Speaker 11: I'm looking at photos of about twenty five white dudes

677
00:39:46,239 --> 00:39:51,000
Speaker 11: in a black community investigating a black girl's death, and

678
00:39:51,239 --> 00:39:56,319
Speaker 11: I have to ask wonder to myself how successful were

679
00:39:56,360 --> 00:40:00,200
Speaker 11: these white cops in nineteen seventy one at getting the community.

680
00:40:00,520 --> 00:40:01,880
Speaker 11: You're shaking your head already.

681
00:40:02,760 --> 00:40:07,719
Speaker 10: Well, you know, he was elusive, he was something to

682
00:40:07,760 --> 00:40:08,160
Speaker 10: deal with.

683
00:40:08,239 --> 00:40:10,000
Speaker 4: This was some monster guy.

684
00:40:10,800 --> 00:40:14,720
Speaker 10: The way the curate is some suspicion about some type

685
00:40:14,719 --> 00:40:19,759
Speaker 10: of maybe law enforcement training or some kind of military

686
00:40:19,800 --> 00:40:23,880
Speaker 10: training to understand how to dispose of the bodies and

687
00:40:23,920 --> 00:40:28,399
Speaker 10: how to mess with their head the police because he was, oh,

688
00:40:28,440 --> 00:40:31,040
Speaker 10: he was doing some damage and he was getting away.

689
00:40:31,239 --> 00:40:33,120
Speaker 4: He was he didn't leave very much.

690
00:40:33,440 --> 00:40:36,840
Speaker 10: And at the time, as you spoke about, they didn't

691
00:40:36,920 --> 00:40:41,120
Speaker 10: have But what they have now. I'm just fortunate to

692
00:40:41,280 --> 00:40:45,960
Speaker 10: have talked to the older detectives who taught me about

693
00:40:45,960 --> 00:40:48,840
Speaker 10: how to shake the bushes and just how to move

694
00:40:48,880 --> 00:40:51,239
Speaker 10: in the street. You have to know how to move

695
00:40:51,239 --> 00:40:53,319
Speaker 10: in the street. You have to know how to what

696
00:40:53,480 --> 00:40:55,200
Speaker 10: areas to go in and what areas.

697
00:40:54,880 --> 00:40:57,680
Speaker 4: You cannot go in. They don't care who you are.

698
00:40:59,360 --> 00:41:03,320
Speaker 10: No police, he's working with no police. Bush you open,

699
00:41:03,920 --> 00:41:07,399
Speaker 10: you gotta know, or if you know, somebody knows them

700
00:41:07,440 --> 00:41:10,560
Speaker 10: and they got some cribs, you can go in the neighborhood.

701
00:41:10,560 --> 00:41:13,200
Speaker 4: And this is how I mainly how I work. I

702
00:41:13,239 --> 00:41:14,359
Speaker 4: always have If.

703
00:41:14,280 --> 00:41:18,399
Speaker 10: I'm going into a really rough neighborhood, I'm always unarmed.

704
00:41:19,040 --> 00:41:22,400
Speaker 4: I'm always unarmed. I don't I don't carry a pistol.

705
00:41:22,440 --> 00:41:22,719
Speaker 4: I don't.

706
00:41:23,040 --> 00:41:26,560
Speaker 10: Why not, Because I got my patrol units, and I

707
00:41:26,640 --> 00:41:30,279
Speaker 10: have people that's not far away on speed dial.

708
00:41:30,440 --> 00:41:33,680
Speaker 4: I got a sergeant that's rarely available, you know.

709
00:41:33,880 --> 00:41:36,880
Speaker 10: And and I go in there, and and and I

710
00:41:36,960 --> 00:41:40,799
Speaker 10: go in there on the strength of credibility, on the

711
00:41:40,800 --> 00:41:44,120
Speaker 10: strength of knowing somebody, because that's what take care of

712
00:41:44,400 --> 00:41:46,680
Speaker 10: the gun is not somebody get to drop on me.

713
00:41:47,000 --> 00:41:49,920
Speaker 10: I can have a gun all I want, and I

714
00:41:49,960 --> 00:41:51,120
Speaker 10: still could lose my life.

715
00:41:51,160 --> 00:41:52,040
Speaker 4: Somebody get the drop.

716
00:41:52,080 --> 00:41:54,759
Speaker 10: Well, you gotta have that credibility, you have to have

717
00:41:54,840 --> 00:41:56,600
Speaker 10: those relationships.

718
00:41:58,000 --> 00:42:00,920
Speaker 8: On a recent trip to DC, my producer Jamie and

719
00:42:01,000 --> 00:42:03,719
Speaker 8: I did a ride along with Henderson, following him on

720
00:42:03,760 --> 00:42:06,120
Speaker 8: his usual route through the neighborhood as he checked in

721
00:42:06,120 --> 00:42:08,759
Speaker 8: with folks throughout the region, and he brings up a

722
00:42:08,800 --> 00:42:10,800
Speaker 8: recent case that we'll talk about later.

723
00:42:12,480 --> 00:42:14,279
Speaker 10: What we gonna do is we gra to go to

724
00:42:14,320 --> 00:42:18,320
Speaker 10: an area where two month old Kayan Jones, who was

725
00:42:18,360 --> 00:42:22,080
Speaker 10: a missing person in Washington, DC, went missing. His case,

726
00:42:22,160 --> 00:42:25,799
Speaker 10: his remains have not been recovered, so he's still a

727
00:42:25,840 --> 00:42:30,600
Speaker 10: missing person. The mom had confessed on public television that

728
00:42:30,680 --> 00:42:33,000
Speaker 10: she through the baby in the dumpster.

729
00:42:33,239 --> 00:42:36,239
Speaker 4: She actually confessed right in front of me. We just

730
00:42:36,280 --> 00:42:37,560
Speaker 4: gonna go to the neighborhood.

731
00:42:37,760 --> 00:42:41,080
Speaker 10: We're gonna talk a little bit in general about just

732
00:42:41,120 --> 00:42:45,400
Speaker 10: some general things about the case and how unfortunate the

733
00:42:45,480 --> 00:42:52,319
Speaker 10: case was, and just get a visual of the atmosphere

734
00:42:52,480 --> 00:42:57,240
Speaker 10: where the mother lived at, you know, the environment, cause.

735
00:42:57,080 --> 00:43:01,600
Speaker 4: That plays a part in you know, why these cases

736
00:43:01,640 --> 00:43:02,280
Speaker 4: are occurring.

737
00:43:02,400 --> 00:43:06,320
Speaker 10: The missing person's event in the first place, is the

738
00:43:06,320 --> 00:43:09,200
Speaker 10: the conditions, the living conditions, and you know, all of

739
00:43:09,239 --> 00:43:12,879
Speaker 10: that stuff plays in. So we just gonna ride there

740
00:43:14,080 --> 00:43:17,000
Speaker 10: and you know, you guys can take a look. This

741
00:43:17,040 --> 00:43:19,279
Speaker 10: is every day what you gonna see every single day,

742
00:43:19,520 --> 00:43:22,200
Speaker 10: sun up to sundown. This is what's going on in

743
00:43:22,200 --> 00:43:27,320
Speaker 10: the community, and it's perpetuating our most severe cases.

744
00:43:27,400 --> 00:43:31,000
Speaker 4: So yup, it's right up the street.

745
00:43:32,280 --> 00:43:32,919
Speaker 10: So when you were.

746
00:43:33,040 --> 00:43:34,960
Speaker 4: Walk like, if you were to walk over there and

747
00:43:35,120 --> 00:43:39,040
Speaker 4: get out flyers, what would you say? What would I

748
00:43:39,080 --> 00:43:39,640
Speaker 4: say to him?

749
00:43:40,120 --> 00:43:42,000
Speaker 10: I would just tell him that, you know, the the

750
00:43:42,080 --> 00:43:45,200
Speaker 10: child is missing m and the child is missing in

751
00:43:45,200 --> 00:43:48,600
Speaker 10: this area. You know, I'm her uncle, you know, can

752
00:43:48,640 --> 00:43:51,160
Speaker 10: you help me this, this, that and the other. You know,

753
00:43:51,200 --> 00:43:53,359
Speaker 10: I know her mom and we all trying to look

754
00:43:53,400 --> 00:43:56,680
Speaker 10: for her. Laws. Some people recognize me by face and

755
00:43:56,680 --> 00:43:59,640
Speaker 10: they automatically start talking to me about it, and some

756
00:43:59,680 --> 00:44:02,799
Speaker 10: people don't, you know, but you y you know, I

757
00:44:02,840 --> 00:44:04,840
Speaker 10: know the area. I know this area pretty well. I

758
00:44:04,920 --> 00:44:08,440
Speaker 10: frequent this area, so I really don't stick stand out

759
00:44:08,760 --> 00:44:09,399
Speaker 10: to any of them.

760
00:44:09,400 --> 00:44:11,240
Speaker 4: They seen me before. Most of 'em.

761
00:44:11,320 --> 00:44:13,399
Speaker 10: If they see me coming, they already know what I'm

762
00:44:13,440 --> 00:44:16,399
Speaker 10: coming for. So I usually, you know, just give 'em

763
00:44:16,400 --> 00:44:16,800
Speaker 10: a spill.

764
00:44:16,960 --> 00:44:18,000
Speaker 4: I mean, I just tell 'em.

765
00:44:18,200 --> 00:44:20,480
Speaker 10: If I don't know 'em, I'll tell them anything, you know,

766
00:44:21,200 --> 00:44:22,920
Speaker 10: to get 'em to possibly help.

767
00:44:24,320 --> 00:44:28,440
Speaker 4: Or tell me something. You know, there's no standing script.

768
00:44:28,560 --> 00:44:31,239
Speaker 10: You know, you you say whatever you feel in your

769
00:44:31,239 --> 00:44:34,719
Speaker 10: heart at the time. You know, most people are a

770
00:44:34,760 --> 00:44:37,640
Speaker 10: little more sympathetic when it's your niece or a family member.

771
00:44:38,560 --> 00:44:41,280
Speaker 10: Then if you tell them you're an investigator, you working

772
00:44:41,320 --> 00:44:43,479
Speaker 10: with the police or whatever, usually they.

773
00:44:43,400 --> 00:44:44,399
Speaker 4: Shut down on you.

774
00:44:44,440 --> 00:44:47,880
Speaker 10: So, uh, I usually give them some story, you know,

775
00:44:48,560 --> 00:44:51,560
Speaker 10: I give 'em a little story, a lie. Be honest

776
00:44:51,600 --> 00:44:54,440
Speaker 10: with you, Jamie, you would do better out here investigating

777
00:44:54,480 --> 00:44:55,040
Speaker 10: than I would.

778
00:44:55,920 --> 00:44:56,640
Speaker 7: Why is God?

779
00:44:57,400 --> 00:45:00,759
Speaker 10: Because I mean, for one, you're a woman, if you're

780
00:45:00,760 --> 00:45:04,160
Speaker 10: a good looking d y, you not any kind of

781
00:45:04,239 --> 00:45:07,080
Speaker 10: threat to them. They don't say anything to try to

782
00:45:07,160 --> 00:45:09,719
Speaker 10: have a conversation with you. And that's like if you

783
00:45:09,760 --> 00:45:13,080
Speaker 10: got you your interviewing somebody and it's a male, sometimes

784
00:45:13,120 --> 00:45:19,000
Speaker 10: you do better interviewing them than another f another male interviewer.

785
00:45:19,480 --> 00:45:21,879
Speaker 10: So sometimes when you get out and you're dealing with men,

786
00:45:23,239 --> 00:45:25,359
Speaker 10: you can you know, you can charm 'em a little bit,

787
00:45:25,520 --> 00:45:27,640
Speaker 10: you can. That's these are things you can use when

788
00:45:27,680 --> 00:45:30,120
Speaker 10: you are you be wondering what do you say? Sometimes

789
00:45:30,120 --> 00:45:33,840
Speaker 10: your persona and your your your overall how they perceive

790
00:45:33,920 --> 00:45:36,839
Speaker 10: you when you first walk up. You know what you say,

791
00:45:36,920 --> 00:45:39,040
Speaker 10: really don't matter. You you can just tell them you

792
00:45:39,120 --> 00:45:41,200
Speaker 10: looking for the missing person, you're a family member.

793
00:45:41,680 --> 00:45:43,200
Speaker 4: But all these things weigh in.

794
00:45:44,680 --> 00:45:46,960
Speaker 10: When you trying to persuade people, You trying to get

795
00:45:46,960 --> 00:45:49,680
Speaker 10: people to give you information, Cause that's the whole business

796
00:45:49,680 --> 00:45:53,719
Speaker 10: of investigative work. You just gathering all the pertinent information.

797
00:45:53,920 --> 00:45:56,520
Speaker 10: That's all you You y'all trying to get something that

798
00:45:56,560 --> 00:46:00,719
Speaker 10: you don't already have, and that's information. So whatever you

799
00:46:00,760 --> 00:46:03,080
Speaker 10: can use, you use.

800
00:46:02,960 --> 00:46:04,880
Speaker 3: It, you know, you know.

801
00:46:08,520 --> 00:46:11,799
Speaker 8: On our ride along, Henderson mentioned the missing person's case

802
00:46:11,840 --> 00:46:15,239
Speaker 8: of two month old Kaion Jones. Kyon was reported missing

803
00:46:15,320 --> 00:46:18,120
Speaker 8: by his mother in May of twenty twenty one. DC

804
00:46:18,280 --> 00:46:21,719
Speaker 8: Police were investigating his case when Henderson spoke to his mother,

805
00:46:22,080 --> 00:46:26,800
Speaker 8: Ladonia Boggs. Ladonia confessed to Henderson and CBS nine News

806
00:46:27,360 --> 00:46:30,160
Speaker 8: that she rolled over on Kaion and he stopped breathing.

807
00:46:30,960 --> 00:46:35,160
Speaker 8: She said she discarded him in a trash dumpster. Sadly,

808
00:46:35,520 --> 00:46:39,000
Speaker 8: Kayan's remains were never found, but Henderson is determined to

809
00:46:39,040 --> 00:46:46,280
Speaker 8: find out the truth and find Kayon's remains. Unfortunately, Henderson

810
00:46:46,320 --> 00:46:49,440
Speaker 8: admits there wasn't a trace investigator like him in the

811
00:46:49,480 --> 00:46:53,120
Speaker 8: nineteen seventies. During the freeway phantom case, the level of

812
00:46:53,160 --> 00:46:57,200
Speaker 8: trust between officers and community was likely lower than with

813
00:46:57,360 --> 00:47:01,760
Speaker 8: no middleman present to mitigate. Had that been different, maybe

814
00:47:01,760 --> 00:47:05,800
Speaker 8: the freeway phantom cases would have been solved. The silver

815
00:47:05,920 --> 00:47:08,480
Speaker 8: lining here is that things have the potential to be

816
00:47:08,480 --> 00:47:11,719
Speaker 8: better today. With the rise of social media. We saw

817
00:47:11,840 --> 00:47:15,000
Speaker 8: increased attention on the issue in twenty sixteen when the

818
00:47:15,040 --> 00:47:17,880
Speaker 8: hashtag DC missing Girls went.

819
00:47:17,800 --> 00:47:22,080
Speaker 12: Viral when the Washington DC Police Department tried to raise

820
00:47:22,120 --> 00:47:26,320
Speaker 12: awareness about missing children and teenagers by posting their images

821
00:47:26,360 --> 00:47:31,680
Speaker 12: on social media. The campaign backfired, sparking some national outrage

822
00:47:31,960 --> 00:47:34,960
Speaker 12: and fears of an epidemic of missing children of color.

823
00:47:36,000 --> 00:47:39,520
Speaker 8: As we mentioned in episode one, the initial Twitter post

824
00:47:39,560 --> 00:47:42,560
Speaker 8: claimed young black girls were going missing at an alarming

825
00:47:42,680 --> 00:47:47,120
Speaker 8: rate in DC, and that post spread like wildfire. It

826
00:47:47,160 --> 00:47:50,040
Speaker 8: was retweeted by a whole host of celebrities and high

827
00:47:50,040 --> 00:47:53,040
Speaker 8: profile figures. But then it came to light that the

828
00:47:53,160 --> 00:47:57,560
Speaker 8: numbers were highly inflated and so the post was somewhat misleading.

829
00:47:58,840 --> 00:48:00,279
Speaker 11: I wanted to talk about.

830
00:48:00,280 --> 00:48:05,200
Speaker 5: What happened with the viral hashtag of DC missing girls

831
00:48:05,239 --> 00:48:08,520
Speaker 5: and how they could get it so wrong. What did

832
00:48:08,560 --> 00:48:09,319
Speaker 5: you think about that.

833
00:48:10,440 --> 00:48:11,280
Speaker 4: I knew the truth.

834
00:48:11,360 --> 00:48:14,600
Speaker 10: I knew that they were advertising it on Twitter. Every

835
00:48:14,640 --> 00:48:18,040
Speaker 10: case was getting advertised, So you saw a heavy volume

836
00:48:18,080 --> 00:48:19,080
Speaker 10: of kids.

837
00:48:19,560 --> 00:48:20,880
Speaker 4: That you didn't see before.

838
00:48:21,600 --> 00:48:25,520
Speaker 10: There wasn't a spike, but they were advertising it. Every

839
00:48:25,560 --> 00:48:26,799
Speaker 10: case got advertised.

840
00:48:26,840 --> 00:48:29,120
Speaker 4: At one point the watch commander.

841
00:48:28,680 --> 00:48:32,719
Speaker 10: Had discretion to decide which ones went out on their

842
00:48:32,760 --> 00:48:40,440
Speaker 10: Twitter feed. Now, every missing person, regardless of race, creed, color, gender, you,

843
00:48:40,520 --> 00:48:43,279
Speaker 10: whatever you are, all that you're going to get a

844
00:48:43,320 --> 00:48:47,120
Speaker 10: missing person's report that go out on Twitter from MPD.

845
00:48:47,680 --> 00:48:52,920
Speaker 10: And so they saw this and somebody took and hashtagged

846
00:48:53,280 --> 00:48:57,719
Speaker 10: that fourteen girls were going missing. Maxwell saw it, Shanaiah

847
00:48:57,800 --> 00:49:00,879
Speaker 10: Lathen saw it. El cool j he sent it out

848
00:49:01,480 --> 00:49:04,279
Speaker 10: once they tweeted out. Now it's the law, and it

849
00:49:04,320 --> 00:49:08,600
Speaker 10: really wasn't. Fourteen girls and went missing. And a part

850
00:49:08,680 --> 00:49:12,600
Speaker 10: of our education is getting the community to understand the

851
00:49:12,640 --> 00:49:15,560
Speaker 10: criteria for the amblert because there was some concern of

852
00:49:15,640 --> 00:49:18,279
Speaker 10: why has an amblert went on and black kids don't

853
00:49:18,280 --> 00:49:21,799
Speaker 10: get the ambuler. Where's the criteria and that's strictly for

854
00:49:22,680 --> 00:49:24,520
Speaker 10: in case of some form of abduction.

855
00:49:25,239 --> 00:49:28,600
Speaker 4: They used the amb alert. It was a good thing overall.

856
00:49:29,239 --> 00:49:32,920
Speaker 10: Why do you say that because all of the media

857
00:49:33,000 --> 00:49:37,560
Speaker 10: attention we got now. MPD developed a website which is

858
00:49:37,600 --> 00:49:40,640
Speaker 10: strictly for missing persons. I know you saw it, where

859
00:49:40,680 --> 00:49:42,680
Speaker 10: you can go in and you can get information. It's

860
00:49:42,719 --> 00:49:46,200
Speaker 10: not real time, but it's much better than it was.

861
00:49:46,800 --> 00:49:51,719
Speaker 10: Every missing person gets their information sent out, and you

862
00:49:51,920 --> 00:49:57,760
Speaker 10: eliminate the question of race because now everybody is getting

863
00:49:58,280 --> 00:50:00,560
Speaker 10: a press release to every media outlet.

864
00:50:02,760 --> 00:50:05,640
Speaker 8: In many ways, that increased visibility was a good thing.

865
00:50:06,320 --> 00:50:09,719
Speaker 8: Despite what the hashtag got wrong, it highlighted a very

866
00:50:09,800 --> 00:50:12,840
Speaker 8: real issue that had gone ignored for far too long.

867
00:50:13,440 --> 00:50:16,719
Speaker 8: But even now, six years later, cases of missing and

868
00:50:16,800 --> 00:50:20,480
Speaker 8: murdered black girls still get less media attention than the

869
00:50:20,520 --> 00:50:24,040
Speaker 8: cases involving their white counterparts, and the closure rate has

870
00:50:24,080 --> 00:50:27,359
Speaker 8: had little to no improvement, And so we have to

871
00:50:27,400 --> 00:50:31,920
Speaker 8: ask have things actually gotten better since the nineteen seventies.

872
00:50:32,960 --> 00:50:35,680
Speaker 8: When we talked to Henderson about the Freeway phantom case,

873
00:50:36,080 --> 00:50:38,399
Speaker 8: he said many of these same issues from back then

874
00:50:38,520 --> 00:50:41,960
Speaker 8: can be found in cases today. Henderson brought up one

875
00:50:42,000 --> 00:50:45,880
Speaker 8: case with very different circumstances, but which serves as an

876
00:50:45,880 --> 00:50:48,880
Speaker 8: example of how black girls today are as at risk

877
00:50:48,960 --> 00:50:51,920
Speaker 8: of victimization as they were in nineteen seventy.

878
00:50:53,040 --> 00:50:56,880
Speaker 10: Well, you know militia, right, that's the case that its

879
00:50:56,920 --> 00:51:00,480
Speaker 10: shatsh you. You know, I probably take my last breath

880
00:51:00,680 --> 00:51:03,719
Speaker 10: still working in some form of fashion, if it's not

881
00:51:03,760 --> 00:51:08,200
Speaker 10: training somebody else or another young person. But these cases,

882
00:51:08,239 --> 00:51:11,560
Speaker 10: I'll never stop working until it's closed. And if I die,

883
00:51:12,040 --> 00:51:15,120
Speaker 10: I'm gonna lay out this is all here we're documenting.

884
00:51:15,200 --> 00:51:19,280
Speaker 10: This is a part of DC history, this is national history.

885
00:51:19,560 --> 00:51:23,400
Speaker 10: If you open up Relicia Rudd's case and you look,

886
00:51:24,040 --> 00:51:27,440
Speaker 10: first of all, the headline is an eight year old child,

887
00:51:27,960 --> 00:51:31,040
Speaker 10: and next to it you got murder to her legacy,

888
00:51:31,600 --> 00:51:36,160
Speaker 10: you got deception, people pointing the finger, nobody's saying nothing.

889
00:51:36,360 --> 00:51:39,280
Speaker 10: Then you got suicide, and then you got some drug abuse,

890
00:51:39,719 --> 00:51:43,160
Speaker 10: you got the foster care system, got the you got.

891
00:51:42,960 --> 00:51:44,480
Speaker 4: A whole bunch of stuff.

892
00:51:44,520 --> 00:51:47,640
Speaker 10: And at the end, when you got all that, all

893
00:51:47,680 --> 00:51:51,000
Speaker 10: these dynamics, that's what you get. You get something that

894
00:51:51,040 --> 00:51:53,839
Speaker 10: you got to scratch your head and say, did that

895
00:51:53,960 --> 00:51:54,680
Speaker 10: really happen?

896
00:51:54,960 --> 00:52:04,240
Speaker 4: Did she just vanish?

897
00:52:04,719 --> 00:52:06,360
Speaker 8: Next time on freeway Phantom.

898
00:52:07,120 --> 00:52:10,680
Speaker 6: We were very alarmed, but we were very determined to

899
00:52:10,800 --> 00:52:11,840
Speaker 6: find Relicia.

900
00:52:12,320 --> 00:52:15,239
Speaker 10: This is an age progression photo of what relasia would

901
00:52:15,280 --> 00:52:16,040
Speaker 10: look like today.

902
00:52:17,000 --> 00:52:20,520
Speaker 5: In cases such as that, the response of the very

903
00:52:20,640 --> 00:52:23,759
Speaker 5: first responding officers of utmost importance.

904
00:52:24,040 --> 00:52:28,800
Speaker 6: Each year, there are over six hundred thousand people reported

905
00:52:28,920 --> 00:52:33,160
Speaker 6: missing in the United States and close to forty percent

906
00:52:33,239 --> 00:52:34,600
Speaker 6: of persons of coloring.

907
00:52:35,239 --> 00:52:37,560
Speaker 1: And I've always been trying to figure out a way

908
00:52:37,800 --> 00:52:39,040
Speaker 1: to get the hurd off of me.

909
00:52:40,000 --> 00:52:43,480
Speaker 3: After all these years, I don't know if it's important anymore.

910
00:52:43,640 --> 00:52:46,360
Speaker 4: I just know that if.

911
00:52:46,160 --> 00:52:48,719
Speaker 8: You do wrong, wrong would come back on you.

912
00:52:49,320 --> 00:52:52,960
Speaker 9: If I can bring resolution to these cases, I will

913
00:52:53,080 --> 00:52:53,319
Speaker 9: do it.

914
00:52:53,880 --> 00:52:55,640
Speaker 7: I'm going to try my best to do it.

915
00:53:00,640 --> 00:53:04,279
Speaker 1: Freeway FANOM is a production of iHeart Radio, Tenderfoot TV, and.

916
00:53:04,280 --> 00:53:05,239
Speaker 4: Black bar MITZVAH.

917
00:53:05,520 --> 00:53:06,640
Speaker 1: Our host is CELESE.

918
00:53:06,680 --> 00:53:07,000
Speaker 3: Hiley.

919
00:53:07,440 --> 00:53:10,880
Speaker 1: The show is written by Trevor Young, Jamie Albright, and CELESE.

920
00:53:10,920 --> 00:53:11,240
Speaker 4: Hiley.

921
00:53:11,600 --> 00:53:15,320
Speaker 1: Executive producers on behalf of iHeart Radio include Matt Frederick

922
00:53:15,440 --> 00:53:19,480
Speaker 1: and Alex Williams, with supervising producer Trevor Young. Executive producers

923
00:53:19,520 --> 00:53:23,440
Speaker 1: on behalf of Tenderfoot TV include Donald Albright and Payne Lindsay,

924
00:53:23,600 --> 00:53:27,920
Speaker 1: with producers Jamie Albright and Tracy Kaplan. Executive producers on

925
00:53:27,960 --> 00:53:31,520
Speaker 1: behalf of Black bar Mitzvah include myself, Jay Ellis and

926
00:53:31,640 --> 00:53:36,440
Speaker 1: Aaron Bergman, with producer Sidney Fools. Lead researcher is Jamie Albright.

927
00:53:36,760 --> 00:53:40,480
Speaker 1: Artwork by Mister Soul two one six, original music by

928
00:53:40,680 --> 00:53:44,840
Speaker 1: Makeup and Vanity Set Special thanks to a teammate, Uta

929
00:53:45,040 --> 00:53:48,560
Speaker 1: Beck Media and Marketing and the Nord Group. Tenderfoot TV

930
00:53:48,920 --> 00:53:52,000
Speaker 1: and iHeartMedia, as well as Black Bar Mitzvah, have increased

931
00:53:52,040 --> 00:53:55,160
Speaker 1: the reward for information leading to the arrest and conviction

932
00:53:55,320 --> 00:53:59,080
Speaker 1: of the person or persons responsible for their Freeway Fanom murders.

933
00:53:59,280 --> 00:54:02,240
Speaker 1: The previous reward of up to one hundred and fifty

934
00:54:02,239 --> 00:54:06,240
Speaker 1: thousand dollars offered by the Metropolitan Police Department has been matched.

935
00:54:06,520 --> 00:54:09,080
Speaker 1: A new total reward of up to three hundred thousand

936
00:54:09,160 --> 00:54:12,240
Speaker 1: dollars is now being offered. If you have any information

937
00:54:12,400 --> 00:54:16,200
Speaker 1: relating to these unsolved crimes, contact the Metropolitan Police Department

938
00:54:16,280 --> 00:54:20,120
Speaker 1: at area code two zero two seven two seven nine

939
00:54:20,280 --> 00:54:25,160
Speaker 1: zero ninety nine. For more information, please visit Freeway Dashfanom

940
00:54:25,320 --> 00:54:29,439
Speaker 1: dot com. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio and Tenderfoot TV,

941
00:54:29,920 --> 00:54:33,160
Speaker 1: visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you listen

942
00:54:33,239 --> 00:54:35,400
Speaker 1: to your favorite shows. Thanks for listening.