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Speaker 1: Welcome into Real America's Voice news. This is Sunday The

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Speaker 1: Road Forward. Well, the CIA Russia report keeps getting crazier.

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Speaker 1: What a massive scandal, and it's not going to go away.

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Speaker 1: President Trump keeps winning and continuing to gain huge momentum

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Speaker 1: associated with the recent major trade deals with the UK,

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Speaker 1: the Philippines, Japan, and the EU. And this week the

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Speaker 1: GDP came in at three percent higher than expected.

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Speaker 2: Pretty amazing.

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Speaker 1: This week we also witnessed another senseless act of violence

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Speaker 1: as New York mourns the loss of another NYPD officer

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Speaker 1: and three others killed in Midtown. And then after the

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Speaker 1: Texas flooding, this week, we had a massive earthquake off

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Speaker 1: the coast of Russia eight point seven magnitude that sent

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Speaker 1: tsunami warnings for Japan, Hawaii, and Alaska and the entire

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Speaker 1: West coast of America. What a wild summer if you

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Speaker 1: can believe it. We're also not very far away from

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Speaker 1: America goes back to schools and more on this edition

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Speaker 1: of Sunday The Road Forward. As always a word of

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Speaker 1: hope and encouragement for you and those you love, especially

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Speaker 1: in these challenging times. I'm doctor Tim Clinton I'll be

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Speaker 1: your host. Our special guest joining us this week. He's

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Speaker 1: the founder and chairman of Liberty Council and host and

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Speaker 1: producer of Faith and Freedom podcast. His name Matt Stavers

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Speaker 1: with us and he is CEO of Intercessors for America.

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Speaker 2: Dave Caball is with us. She is a.

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Speaker 1: Megapopular author, speaker, and podcaster. Hidie Saint John is back

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Speaker 1: and he is Executive General Counsel for First Liberty Institute.

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Speaker 2: HIREM. Sassar's back with us. Thanks for watching.

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Speaker 1: Well, It's been another wild week in America. Social media

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Speaker 1: and the news cycles are flooded with ongoing discussions about

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Speaker 1: the Epstein files, Obama and the Russia Gate, expose Adam

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Speaker 1: Shift and his mortgage fraud issues, and more. The Democrats,

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Speaker 1: they're in trouble. The unfavorable party rating this week was

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Speaker 1: at sixty three percent. That's a thirty year low. A

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Speaker 1: Democrat sponsored poll found that voters view the Democratic Party

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Speaker 1: as weak, woke, and out of touch, which explains their

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Speaker 1: record unpopularity and so good news. The economy is rolling.

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Speaker 1: President Trump keeps winning and continuing to gain huge momentum

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Speaker 1: associated with recent major trade deals with the UK. The Philippines, Japan,

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Speaker 1: and the EU and guess what faith is Back in America,

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Speaker 1: we're continuing to see a trend, especially among young men

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Speaker 1: in particular, people everywhere claiming that revival is here in

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Speaker 1: our land. We need to continue to pray that Christ

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Speaker 1: to be exalted, and we need to pray for our

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Speaker 1: nation in times like these. Our hope, our strength, it

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Speaker 1: comes from the Lord. Here's a great verse to hold

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Speaker 1: on to this week, Psalm forty six, Verse one.

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Speaker 2: It's one of my favorites.

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Speaker 1: God is our refuge and our strength. He's a present

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Speaker 1: help during times of trouble, times when things aren't the

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Speaker 1: way they're supposed to be. Hey, I'm going to pray.

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Speaker 1: We're going to get started. Father, Thank you for being

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Speaker 1: a good father to all of us. Thank you for

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Speaker 1: your goodness and grace.

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Speaker 2: God.

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Speaker 1: We pray for our country. These are wild times. There's

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Speaker 1: so much going on.

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Speaker 2: God.

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Speaker 1: I prayed the Church would rise up and take a

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Speaker 1: rightful place, that we would stand bold for righteousness and culture.

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Speaker 1: Help us to quote reflect You, may others see you

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Speaker 1: and us. I pray all this in the strong name

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Speaker 1: of Jesus.

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Speaker 2: Amen. Let's get started.

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Speaker 1: as this. Join us now is Matt Staver. He currently

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Speaker 1: serves as senior pastor, founder and chairman of Liberty Council,

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Speaker 1: an organization that advances religious freedom, the sanctity of human life,

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Speaker 1: and the family through strategic litigation.

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Speaker 2: Matt, welcome, Thank you for joining me.

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Speaker 3: Thank you.

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Speaker 4: Good to be with you as always.

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Speaker 1: Hey, Matt, want to step back for a moment and

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Speaker 1: look the Biden Harris administration. Pretty rough ride for people

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Speaker 1: of faith, Actually a pretty sobering beatdown, if you will.

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Speaker 1: We got a new sheriff in town ever since January

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Speaker 1: twenty with President Trump and the administration there. It's been

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Speaker 1: a wild ride too, Matt. Some amazing things on the

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Speaker 1: religious liberty side. The Religious Liberty Commission put in place,

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Speaker 1: the anti Christian biased task force put in place, and

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Speaker 1: we're starting to make gains here, Matt. Just your take

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Speaker 1: from your perspective, You've been doing this for a long time.

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Speaker 4: Well, it's not in a difference between the Biden Harris

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Speaker 4: administration and what we have now with President Donald t

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Speaker 4: This leadership we have never seen in any president in

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Speaker 4: our lifetime, and that includes even during Ronald Reagan's time.

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Speaker 4: There's been a lot of talk by different presidents to

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Speaker 4: reach out to the faith community. But this presidency, as

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Speaker 4: in the first term, but the second term, is even

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Speaker 4: more so, is doing it by action. So not only

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Speaker 4: with the Religious Liberty Commission looking at anti religious and

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Speaker 4: Christian bias, but also some of the other task force

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Speaker 4: that President Donald Trump has put together and is directed

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Speaker 4: to respond and investigate. And also you have the Faith

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Speaker 4: Office right there in the West wing of the White House.

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Speaker 4: Totally different type of administration that is very sensitive to

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Speaker 4: people of faith, to issues of faith, but not only

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Speaker 4: sensitive to it, wanting to make a difference and make

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Speaker 4: a change that lasts for generations. So we are living

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Speaker 4: at an incredible, unprecedented time where there's great opportunity to

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Speaker 4: advance religious freedom, life and family.

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Speaker 1: Matt, God has used you, liberty counsel, your team down

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Speaker 1: there to really stand boldly for religious liberty. I know

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Speaker 1: you've argued before the Supreme Court more, but Matt, let

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Speaker 1: me step back. For people out there, you just have

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Speaker 1: everyday conversations around the issue of separation of church and state.

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Speaker 1: They've heard things like the Johnson Amendment and how that

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Speaker 1: kind of played into some of the quote shutdown if

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Speaker 1: you will, of people of faith having a voice. Matt,

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Speaker 1: can you take us back and just bring some clarity

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Speaker 1: to all this.

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Speaker 4: Well, this idea of separation of church and state really

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Speaker 4: came from a long ago Supreme Court case that took

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Speaker 4: Thomas Jefferson's quote out of context. And there is a

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Speaker 4: kind of church state issue that the government does not

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Speaker 4: have the right under the Constitution to come into the

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Speaker 4: church to religious organizations and dictate our doctrine and our beliefs.

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Speaker 4: But on the other hand, there is no idea that

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Speaker 4: the people of faith in the church are precluded or

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Speaker 4: have a firewall with regards to government, and they're involved

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Speaker 4: in government. And that's how this short word of separation

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Speaker 4: of church and state has been used, and it's been

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Speaker 4: used as a hammer, as a wedge, as a wall

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Speaker 4: to literally wall out people of faith in churches. And

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Speaker 4: that is part of this nineteen fifty four Johnson Amendment

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Speaker 4: that was put into the IRS Code by then Senator

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Speaker 4: Lyndon Bain Johnson, who later became president. He actually had

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Speaker 4: an election in nineteen forty eight that was a stolen election.

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Speaker 4: We now know it for a fact. It's not hypothetical,

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Speaker 4: but he actually used fake ballots to get him over

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Speaker 4: the Democratic primary to win the nomination for United States

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Speaker 4: Senator as a Democrat, and then went on to win

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Speaker 4: and became the Senator. And as a result, he then

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Speaker 4: used the Johnson Amendment as a vendetta to close out churches,

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Speaker 4: people of faith, nonprofit organizations, to shut their voices down

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Speaker 4: with this nineteen fifty four Johnson Amendment. And of course,

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Speaker 4: as we know and we can talk about, things have

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Speaker 4: changed with as you have mentioned that there's a new

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Speaker 4: shaff in town and that's President Donald Trump.

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Speaker 2: Matt.

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Speaker 1: Recently, I think the NRB intercessors for America. Dave Cobal,

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Speaker 1: who we're going to have on the broadcast today too,

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Speaker 1: filed and they won a case here, Matt that has

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Speaker 1: new precedents, and can you help walk us through what

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Speaker 1: it really means that churches now can talk about let's

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Speaker 1: just say the word politics for a moment from the

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Speaker 1: pulpit without fear of censor or loss of their five

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Speaker 1: oh one C three status or what have you.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 4: Since nineteen fifty four and then Johnson Endment came into being,

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Speaker 4: then that particular amendment has been used primarily to silence churches,

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Speaker 4: mostly conservative churches, faith based churches, evangelical churches, to intimidate

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Speaker 4: them not to say anything in favor of or an

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Speaker 4: opposition to a candidate for political office. And there's been

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Speaker 4: a lot of silencing going on, muzzling pastors and churches.

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Speaker 4: What has just happened is the IRS, in this litigation

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Speaker 4: that you just mentioned, has entered into a consent decree

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Speaker 4: which is being approved by a court. It's an enforceable

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Speaker 4: order that the IRS has said that how the IRS

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Speaker 4: will interpret this Johnson Amendment is that it will not

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Speaker 4: prevent pastors or people in the church from communicating to

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Speaker 4: their people about politics and about their positions on candidates. So,

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Speaker 4: in other words, a pastor can now freely speak from

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Speaker 4: the pulpit and speak on a wide variety of issues,

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Speaker 4: but can also speak in favor of or an opposition

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Speaker 4: specifically to a candidate running for any level of office.

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Speaker 4: The muzzle has been removed. That is a good development.

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Speaker 4: That means that there's no more excuse that people can use.

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Speaker 4: Whether they're a pastor that don't want to speak, they

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Speaker 4: can't blame it on the Johnson anymore, or whether it's

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Speaker 4: some of these other liberal groups that want to silence

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Speaker 4: pastors in churches, they can't use the Johnson Amendment anymore

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Speaker 4: to silence them. We need to now move to the

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Speaker 4: next step. President Donald Trump has led the way here.

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Speaker 4: The IRS now has come to this consent decree that's

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Speaker 4: an enforceable court order that gives freedom to pastors and churches.

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Speaker 4: We need to codify this in Congress, and there's a

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Speaker 4: bill in Congress that will do just that, so that

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Speaker 4: this is permanently removed from the IRS Code.

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Speaker 2: Do you think that's going to happen, Matt, I.

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Speaker 4: Do think it's going to happen. I served on a

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Speaker 4: commission a number of years ago that Senator Grassley convened.

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Speaker 4: It was on this, among other areas of IRS law

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Speaker 4: regarding churches, and we propose to repeal of the Johnson Amendment.

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Speaker 4: The language that we drafted is now the language that

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Speaker 4: has been put forth in bills right now in Congress

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Speaker 4: to repeal the Johnson Amendment. We need to get our

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Speaker 4: members of the House and Senate moving forward. I know

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Speaker 4: President Donald Trump would welcome to sign a bill like this.

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Speaker 4: We need to change this from a consent decree as

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Speaker 4: good as that is, from an executive order as good

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Speaker 4: as that is, to a permanent codification and repeal that

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Speaker 4: cannot be undone because you could have another presidency down

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Speaker 4: the road, like the Biden of Harris God forbid administration

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Speaker 4: that was weaponizing the government against people of faith and churches,

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Speaker 4: and they could undo all of the good gains that

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Speaker 4: we are now seeing, Matt.

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Speaker 1: I know in faith circles people begin to talk about

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Speaker 1: politics in the pew, and you've got people divided, you know,

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Speaker 1: saying politics shouldn't be front and center. But let me

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Speaker 1: back that off for a moment, and I want to

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Speaker 1: hear your perspective. We're talking about righteousness and culture. You're

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Speaker 1: talking about building on the shoulders of people like d

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Speaker 1: James Kennedy, Jerry Fallwell, James Dobson, and so many who

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Speaker 1: were out there boldly standing for example, for life. They

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Speaker 1: wanted to speak against people who were pro abortion, and

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Speaker 1: what a nightmare it was, and the threats and intimidation

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Speaker 1: that was coming at people who were speaking like that

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Speaker 1: about biblical issues, Matt, people who had sincerely held religious beliefs.

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Speaker 1: They again were being muzzled here, and people want to

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Speaker 1: split hit. It's just insane to me how they try

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Speaker 1: to unpack this conversation and then lead people down the

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Speaker 1: road to saying you shouldn't be talking about those things,

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Speaker 1: just better not to talk.

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Speaker 2: About them, etc.

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Speaker 1: No, it's coming right from the heart of what we

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Speaker 1: believe from God's word.

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Speaker 4: Well, doctor Jerry Follwell hard to believe, but at one

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Speaker 4: point in time he was apolitical, would not address the

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Speaker 4: issues of politics from the pulpit. That all changed the

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Speaker 4: day after Roe versus wear It on January twenty three,

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Speaker 4: nineteen seventy three, when he read in the Lynchburg News

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Speaker 4: and Advanced Paper about what the Supreme Court did the

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Speaker 4: day before regarding abortion and what he said as a

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Speaker 4: result of that that changed his entire perspective. He said,

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Speaker 4: he didn't become political. What happened is they intruded into

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Speaker 4: matters of faith. And to the very day that he

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Speaker 4: he died. All of the engagement that he did, whether

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Speaker 4: it was on life, religious freedom, speaking in favor of

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Speaker 4: or in opposition to candidates, He said he did it

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Speaker 4: because of his calling as a pastor. He was compelled

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Speaker 4: to speak biblical truth. And that's what we're talking about,

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Speaker 4: speaking biblical truth. If you know that God is the

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Speaker 4: creator and he gives life, how can you stand back

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Speaker 4: and say nothing when someone is slaughtering innocent children. You've

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Speaker 4: got to speak up. You've got to educate, you've got

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Speaker 4: to take a position. There's no neutrality there. And the

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Speaker 4: second point is this, no matter where you stand on

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Speaker 4: these issues, and I think it's fairly clear that the

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Speaker 4: Bible has to be primary and that means everything, including candidates,

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Speaker 4: is something that we need to talk about. But certainly,

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Speaker 4: at a minimum, we all ought to agree that the government,

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Speaker 4: the government should not be telling pastors and churches what

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Speaker 4: can or cannot be spoken from the pulpit. And that's

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Speaker 4: what the Johnson Amendment attempted to do. You could speak

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Speaker 4: on anything, just don't give your views on somebody who's

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Speaker 4: running for president United States.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, mattam.

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Speaker 1: People want to learn more about Liberty Council, maybe how

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Speaker 1: to support you, get behind your efforts.

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Speaker 2: Where can they go and.

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Speaker 4: They can go directly to our website, very simple, two letters,

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Speaker 4: LC dot org. LC dot org, lots of information. Also

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Speaker 4: a place where you can donate to give to Liberty

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Speaker 4: Council as well. LC dot org.

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Speaker 1: Appreciate all the good work you guys are doing there

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Speaker 1: at Liberty Council. Matt Savor, thank you for joining me.

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Speaker 4: Thank you.

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Speaker 1: Coming up next, he's the CEO of Intercessions for America.

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Speaker 1: Dave Cobal's with us.

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Speaker 5: Don't miss the world's premier Christian Counseling conference event, the

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Speaker 5: twenty twenty five AECC United World Conference. It has sold

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Speaker 5: out the last ten times in a row and this

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Speaker 5: Returning to the magnificent opriland Hotel in Nashville, September twenty

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Speaker 5: twenty five with amazing plentary experts, over fifty leading pre

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Speaker 5: con workshops, over twenty five counseling and recovery tracks and

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Speaker 5: over one hundred and seventy five clinical, academic, and biblical

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Speaker 5: workshops so you can tailor the conference to meet your

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Speaker 5: personal and professional goals. This year's World Conference features world

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Speaker 5: leading and dynamic experts like Kurt Thompson, Henry Cloud, Tyler Vanderwiel,

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Speaker 5: Harold Koenig, Tim Timberlake, Gary Chapman, Daniel Aman, Lisa Turkhurst,

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Speaker 5: Jenny Allen, Tim and Zach Clinton, and so much more.

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Speaker 5: Enjoy incredible praise and worship with special guests Chris Tomlins,

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Speaker 5: Katie Nicole and Faiths and Micah Tyler's to make plans

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Speaker 5: to attend now. The World Conference has sold out the

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Speaker 5: last ten times in a row, with nearly seven thousand

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Speaker 5: counselors and mental health and ministry leaders from all fifty

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Speaker 5: states and forty different different countries represented. Register now for

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Speaker 5: the best savings at Worldconference dot net. That's Worldconference dot net.

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Speaker 5: The twenty twenty five AECC United World Conference See you

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Speaker 5: in September.

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Speaker 6: For more encouragement and to stay connected, follow doctor Tim

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Speaker 6: Clinton on Facebook, Instagram, and X. We love being a

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Speaker 6: part of your life.

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Speaker 1: Join us now is Dave Cabal. He currently serves as

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Speaker 1: CEO and President of Intercessors for America. It's a massive

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Speaker 1: grassroots organization that unite citizens in the community prayer and

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Speaker 1: action on the issues confronting America.

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Speaker 2: Dave, welcome back. Good to see you. Thank you for

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Speaker 2: joining me, Doctor Clint.

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Speaker 3: Always great to be with you, especially as we talked

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Speaker 3: about the road forward. Right Ah.

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Speaker 1: Indeed, Dave, Intercessors for America it's exploding. I want you

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Speaker 1: to talk to our viewers about the mission goal, what's

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Speaker 1: happening with this organization and why does God's hands seem

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Speaker 1: to be on it.

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Speaker 3: Well, I think it's fun to phrase what I'm about

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Speaker 3: to say by saying that I have statistical evidence that

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Speaker 3: God is on the move. You know, God is doing

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Speaker 3: a great work, not just at IFA, but he's doing

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Speaker 3: great work in the hearts of millions of people across

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Speaker 3: this nation, putting the desire for them to pray for

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Speaker 3: this nation. And here at Intercessors for America, we do

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Speaker 3: three things, news, prayer, and action. And we have the

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Speaker 3: opportunity to interact with a million plus men and women

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Speaker 3: of prayer every single month and encourage them to be

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Speaker 3: united and be focused in their prayers and intercessions. So

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Speaker 3: you know, I, doctor Tim, I can tell you that

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Speaker 3: I have hope for America because he's putting on millions

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Speaker 3: of Americans heart the desire to pray for this nation.

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Speaker 1: David, you go back a few years under the Iden

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Speaker 1: Harris administration, it was pretty rough for people of faith.

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Speaker 1: I mean, you're even talking about weaponizing systems of government

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Speaker 1: against people of faith, putting people in prison. I mean, seriously,

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Speaker 1: Grandma's and stuff like that. They fast forward to where

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Speaker 1: we are today. Things have changed radically and you were

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Speaker 1: recent party, by the way, to a lawsuit with the IRS.

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Speaker 1: I think you were joined by the NRB National Religious

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Speaker 1: Broadcasters and a couple of churches or something. But Dave,

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Speaker 1: I'm sure you're limited about what you can say about

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Speaker 1: this or what have you, but love to just get

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Speaker 1: your thoughts on how this thing shook down and what

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Speaker 1: it means to churches, if you will, across the country.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, so you may. Your viewers may have seen in

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Speaker 3: the press the comments that were publicly stated were partially

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Speaker 3: true and it said that the IRS now allows churches

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Speaker 3: to endorse candidates. Well, that comment that the press was

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Speaker 3: taking is partially true. But the reality is is that

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Speaker 3: four of us sued the IRS over a year ago,

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Speaker 3: last August August of twenty twenty four, and we said

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Speaker 3: that the Johnson Amendment is the removal of rights that

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Speaker 3: are have been enjoyed by American churches for over one

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Speaker 3: hundred years book previous to that, and it limited our

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Speaker 3: ability to speak what God has put upon our hearts.

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Speaker 3: So anyways, we sued the IRS National Religious Broadcasters and

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Speaker 3: you're right, doctor Tim, two pastors in Texas, and we

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Speaker 3: said we're not going to do We said enough, and

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Speaker 3: so way it worked its way through the court. And

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Speaker 3: then about three weeks ago, maybe four weeks ago, now,

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Speaker 3: the IRS came to us with a settlement and the

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Speaker 3: settlement that we were agreeable to, and it was filed

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Speaker 3: in the same federal court system that our lawsuit has

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Speaker 3: been a part of, and so we're waiting for the

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Speaker 3: judge to make a final determination. So it's not settled.

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Speaker 3: That's the partial my caveat Tube Churches Canal endorsed Canabis.

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Speaker 3: But doctor Tim, hey, here's the deal. Here's the big picture.

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Speaker 3: The legal ease of the Johnson Amendment, what it was

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Speaker 3: before and what it is now is is irrelevant to

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Speaker 3: the point I'm about to make and here it is

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Speaker 3: the effect of the Johnson Amendment that church cannect a

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Speaker 3: church cannot talk about politics is removed. It is the

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Speaker 3: effect of the Johnson Amendment that I'm most excited about.

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Speaker 3: And I can tell you ten years ago, twenty years ago,

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Speaker 3: when I understood the impact of the Johnson Amendment, the

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Speaker 3: impact and the effect on our culture, I asked the

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Speaker 3: Lord if he would ever reverse the Johnson Amendment. And

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Speaker 3: now here it is have the opportunity for many decades,

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Speaker 3: I think at this point of prayer of wanting to

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Speaker 3: be involved to see the not only Johnson Amendment reversed,

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Speaker 3: but the impact of the Johnson Johnson removed from the

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Speaker 3: American church.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, what an amazing day.

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Speaker 1: And we've got to continue to pray that God would

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Speaker 1: continue to move for those freedoms that we cherish, we

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Speaker 1: hold dear to our hearts. I want to say this too, Dave.

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Speaker 1: People are saying everywhere faith is back. You can't help

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Speaker 1: but get up on social media and see articles, I

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Speaker 1: mean flying around saying revival is coming to America. People

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Speaker 1: are saying, man, it's amazing. What's going on?

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Speaker 2: Dave? Is that your sense?

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Speaker 1: I mean, you guys are having these these I mean

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Speaker 1: these incredible moments of prayer, movements of prayer and more.

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Speaker 1: What are you sensing, right, I mean, what do you

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Speaker 1: what are you feeling in your heart?

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Speaker 3: Well, we're seeing statistically the church attendants of gen xers

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Speaker 3: and millennials shoot up, you know, statistically it's almost fifty percent,

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Speaker 3: from like low twenty to over thirty percent. So statistically

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Speaker 3: that's a fifty percent increase. So we're seeing church attendance increased.

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Speaker 3: But I think here's the big picture that the enemy

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Speaker 3: has overplayed his hand. What we see in culture, the

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Speaker 3: leftist progressive agenda that is anti God, anti God's sense

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Speaker 3: of sexuality, anti all things biblical. It seems the younger

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Speaker 3: culture has said enough, it doesn't make any sense anymore.

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Speaker 3: They've gone too far. And so we're excited to be

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Speaker 3: a part of that and see that and fuel prayer.

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Speaker 3: And you're right, we have prayer calls where we at

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Speaker 3: ten twenty thousand on these prayer calls at various times.

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Speaker 3: We actually, Doctor Clinton, I think you were a part

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Speaker 3: of this. We actually were able to participate in the

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Speaker 3: largest live prayer call and the history of mankind. And

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Speaker 3: as our system facilitated over one hundred and fifty thousand

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Speaker 3: people live on one call. So again, doctor Tim, I

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Speaker 3: got statistical evidence.

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Speaker 2: God is on the move, David.

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Speaker 1: People want to learn more about intercessors for America. Maybe

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Speaker 1: be a part of that team. Maybe jump in on

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Speaker 1: a couple of those prayer calls.

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Speaker 2: Where do they need to go?

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Speaker 3: Gootle intercessors for America. The urel is I FA pray

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Speaker 3: dot org.

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Speaker 1: I FA pray dot Org. Dave Gibal. Always great to

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Speaker 1: have you. Thank you for joining me. Thanks Doc Tim

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Speaker 1: coming up next. She's a mega popular author, speaker and podcaster.

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439
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440
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446
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473
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474
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475
00:27:56,720 --> 00:27:58,480
Speaker 1: Join us now is Heidie Saint John's. He's the best

476
00:27:58,520 --> 00:28:01,520
Speaker 1: selling author speaker Mom the Seven Children, has a bunch

477
00:28:01,560 --> 00:28:04,520
Speaker 1: of grandchildren. She's best known for her Mom's strong book collection,

478
00:28:04,880 --> 00:28:06,159
Speaker 1: and she's going to be out on the road with

479
00:28:06,240 --> 00:28:09,640
Speaker 1: us this fall at our Extraordinary Women Conferences. I think

480
00:28:09,680 --> 00:28:12,840
Speaker 1: she'll be in Kenton, Ohio, October twenty four and twenty five.

481
00:28:13,240 --> 00:28:15,159
Speaker 2: Hetti, welcome back. Thank you for joining me.

482
00:28:16,040 --> 00:28:18,000
Speaker 7: Well, Hi, my Apprentic's great to see you. Thanks for

483
00:28:18,040 --> 00:28:18,520
Speaker 7: having me.

484
00:28:18,800 --> 00:28:21,199
Speaker 2: Hetti. I know that a lot of people have been

485
00:28:21,240 --> 00:28:22,080
Speaker 2: praying for you.

486
00:28:21,840 --> 00:28:25,200
Speaker 1: You had some health issues and you have a go

487
00:28:25,200 --> 00:28:27,520
Speaker 1: God's story. I don't if you mind sharing just a

488
00:28:27,560 --> 00:28:30,320
Speaker 1: little bit about what happened and how you're doing.

489
00:28:30,440 --> 00:28:34,520
Speaker 7: Yeah, yeah, thanks No. Back in March of this last year,

490
00:28:34,560 --> 00:28:37,960
Speaker 7: I was diagnosed with a tumor. It was pretty large.

491
00:28:37,960 --> 00:28:39,800
Speaker 7: It was a colon tumor. They were worried that I

492
00:28:39,880 --> 00:28:42,800
Speaker 7: might have a colon cancer, and I was advised to

493
00:28:44,160 --> 00:28:49,640
Speaker 7: get it addressed very quickly. So we decided to cancel

494
00:28:49,720 --> 00:28:52,520
Speaker 7: my July and August speaking season, and I went in

495
00:28:52,560 --> 00:28:55,680
Speaker 7: for surgery on July third. They removed that tumor and

496
00:28:55,760 --> 00:28:58,120
Speaker 7: I had a colon resection, which is a pretty big deal.

497
00:28:58,120 --> 00:29:00,760
Speaker 7: It's a pretty rough surgery, and the Lord has been

498
00:29:00,880 --> 00:29:04,240
Speaker 7: so faithful and so good to me. The morning after

499
00:29:04,280 --> 00:29:06,200
Speaker 7: that surgery is over, the surgical team came in and

500
00:29:06,240 --> 00:29:09,360
Speaker 7: said that they consider that surgery to be life saving.

501
00:29:09,480 --> 00:29:12,760
Speaker 7: If I had not addressed it, I certainly would it

502
00:29:12,760 --> 00:29:15,000
Speaker 7: certainly would have taken my life at some point. And

503
00:29:15,160 --> 00:29:18,360
Speaker 7: I was declared cancer free just a couple of weeks ago.

504
00:29:18,400 --> 00:29:21,160
Speaker 7: All the lymph nodes came back cancer free, and so

505
00:29:21,600 --> 00:29:24,160
Speaker 7: I just I credit this to the healing power of

506
00:29:24,200 --> 00:29:25,960
Speaker 7: God and the prayers of his people. So thank you

507
00:29:26,000 --> 00:29:28,080
Speaker 7: to everyone who's been praying for me. It really is

508
00:29:28,120 --> 00:29:28,800
Speaker 7: a God story.

509
00:29:28,920 --> 00:29:31,800
Speaker 1: How do we celebrate that with you? And we're won't pray?

510
00:29:31,920 --> 00:29:34,320
Speaker 1: God continue to say He must have something for you

511
00:29:34,360 --> 00:29:36,920
Speaker 1: to do. I thank you. Know you have a little

512
00:29:36,960 --> 00:29:38,280
Speaker 1: you got a little sass to you. You know what

513
00:29:38,280 --> 00:29:43,240
Speaker 1: I'm saying, Maybe, Hattie, I want to go back for

514
00:29:43,320 --> 00:29:45,440
Speaker 1: a moment and just take a look at social media

515
00:29:45,440 --> 00:29:48,880
Speaker 1: and everything we're seeing right now, kind of flipping the script,

516
00:29:48,920 --> 00:29:53,160
Speaker 1: if you will. America, the world watched kind of in

517
00:29:53,280 --> 00:29:57,960
Speaker 1: horror as and deep concern when they were going after

518
00:29:58,000 --> 00:30:01,040
Speaker 1: President Trump hard and their goal was to put him

519
00:30:01,040 --> 00:30:01,880
Speaker 1: in prison.

520
00:30:01,640 --> 00:30:03,360
Speaker 2: For the rest of his life. Who knows.

521
00:30:03,440 --> 00:30:09,640
Speaker 1: And we watched the assassination attempts, We saw that happening,

522
00:30:09,720 --> 00:30:13,960
Speaker 1: and Heidi, now, all of a sudden, everything that everybody

523
00:30:14,000 --> 00:30:17,160
Speaker 1: was talking about and people were getting blasted for saying

524
00:30:17,200 --> 00:30:19,560
Speaker 1: it was all conspiracy theory stuff, all kinds of things

525
00:30:19,600 --> 00:30:21,760
Speaker 1: like that. But boy, it's all coming up. You think

526
00:30:21,800 --> 00:30:26,840
Speaker 1: about the Obama Russia Gate expose, Hillary Clinton email cover up,

527
00:30:26,880 --> 00:30:30,000
Speaker 1: I'm thinking about Hey, now we're hearing about Adam Shift. Yeah,

528
00:30:30,000 --> 00:30:32,360
Speaker 1: you know how he was shifty Shift was doing all

529
00:30:32,360 --> 00:30:35,160
Speaker 1: those things. Now now he's got this mortgage crisis thing

530
00:30:35,240 --> 00:30:40,640
Speaker 1: going on and this Epstein craziness that's going Hatti, it's unbelievable.

531
00:30:40,880 --> 00:30:44,760
Speaker 1: What do you think people are thinking in their hearts

532
00:30:44,800 --> 00:30:47,080
Speaker 1: and in their minds just about everything that's been happening

533
00:30:47,080 --> 00:30:47,760
Speaker 1: in our country.

534
00:30:48,880 --> 00:30:50,560
Speaker 7: Yeah, I think for those of us who have been

535
00:30:51,040 --> 00:30:53,520
Speaker 7: on that side of the argument for a long time

536
00:30:53,560 --> 00:30:56,840
Speaker 7: but been watching what's been happening and been very discouraged

537
00:30:56,880 --> 00:31:00,360
Speaker 7: and dismayed with the obvious correction corruption of the bidenstration,

538
00:31:00,560 --> 00:31:03,880
Speaker 7: certainly of Obama, and a lot of us saw him

539
00:31:03,920 --> 00:31:07,000
Speaker 7: as sort of the puppet master behind Russia Gate and

540
00:31:07,000 --> 00:31:09,080
Speaker 7: all these things that were happening. For I think a

541
00:31:09,080 --> 00:31:12,800
Speaker 7: lot of Americans, this has been the most excruciating longest

542
00:31:12,880 --> 00:31:15,280
Speaker 7: I told you so in the history of the world, right,

543
00:31:15,400 --> 00:31:18,480
Speaker 7: and so people are waking up to it. I also

544
00:31:18,520 --> 00:31:21,280
Speaker 7: think we need to keep our eye on the ball.

545
00:31:21,760 --> 00:31:23,800
Speaker 7: It's very easy, I think for us to be a

546
00:31:23,800 --> 00:31:26,440
Speaker 7: bunch of armchair warriors and sit back and you know,

547
00:31:26,720 --> 00:31:28,560
Speaker 7: talk about it on social media and do all those things.

548
00:31:28,640 --> 00:31:32,040
Speaker 7: We need to be in prayer. This is a spiritual

549
00:31:32,120 --> 00:31:36,960
Speaker 7: battle of absolutely gigantic proportions. And so though a lot

550
00:31:37,000 --> 00:31:39,000
Speaker 7: of us, you know, I would maybe consider myself one

551
00:31:39,040 --> 00:31:43,120
Speaker 7: of those, you know, conspiracy theorists, it's not conspiracy anymore. Obviously,

552
00:31:43,120 --> 00:31:44,720
Speaker 7: a lot of these things are proving true. And I

553
00:31:44,720 --> 00:31:47,560
Speaker 7: think we need not to get mayred down to the

554
00:31:47,600 --> 00:31:50,680
Speaker 7: minutia or the hatred or the rhetoric, and instead turn

555
00:31:50,720 --> 00:31:54,600
Speaker 7: our attention to prayer, because spiritual battles require spiritual weapons,

556
00:31:54,600 --> 00:31:56,320
Speaker 7: and this is a spiritual battle.

557
00:31:56,440 --> 00:31:58,440
Speaker 2: Adi. I'm proud. I'm glad that.

558
00:32:00,000 --> 00:32:02,840
Speaker 1: Women in leadership, like you, for example, are open and

559
00:32:02,920 --> 00:32:05,920
Speaker 1: talking boldly about these kind of issues. Righteousness and culture.

560
00:32:05,960 --> 00:32:08,200
Speaker 1: You know why because you know what. You're seeing it

561
00:32:08,240 --> 00:32:11,560
Speaker 1: every day you're in the scroll. Everybody's in there. Everybody's

562
00:32:11,600 --> 00:32:13,800
Speaker 1: seeing what's going on, and people are thinking about it.

563
00:32:14,080 --> 00:32:17,800
Speaker 1: They're having kitchen table conversations about it. I mean, it's there,

564
00:32:17,960 --> 00:32:20,560
Speaker 1: and if we know it's there, then somebody needs to

565
00:32:20,600 --> 00:32:22,880
Speaker 1: quote make some sense out of it, or bring some

566
00:32:22,920 --> 00:32:25,080
Speaker 1: sense to it, if you will. How toy in the

567
00:32:25,080 --> 00:32:30,440
Speaker 1: midst of it, this whole piece on churches, now, I

568
00:32:30,480 --> 00:32:33,640
Speaker 1: think you probably saw what happened with that NRB and

569
00:32:34,600 --> 00:32:38,240
Speaker 1: Intercessions for America and that lawsuit they filed against the IRS,

570
00:32:38,800 --> 00:32:41,960
Speaker 1: and now this conclusion about quote, you can address some

571
00:32:42,000 --> 00:32:45,160
Speaker 1: of these issues I'll call it biblical issues, righteousness and

572
00:32:45,200 --> 00:32:49,720
Speaker 1: culture issues from the pulpit without fearing, you know, somebody

573
00:32:49,760 --> 00:32:52,400
Speaker 1: coming ripping your five oh one C three status away

574
00:32:52,440 --> 00:32:55,080
Speaker 1: from you or God forbid putting you in prison. We

575
00:32:55,240 --> 00:32:58,400
Speaker 1: do know that during the Biden Harris administration, I mean

576
00:32:58,440 --> 00:33:02,320
Speaker 1: they were weaponizing of government against people of faith. I mean,

577
00:33:02,360 --> 00:33:05,280
Speaker 1: that's a that's a real deal here. But thank god

578
00:33:05,320 --> 00:33:06,440
Speaker 1: we're moving in a new direction.

579
00:33:07,760 --> 00:33:10,240
Speaker 7: Yeah, it's so important, and actually I think what we

580
00:33:10,320 --> 00:33:12,760
Speaker 7: need to be praying for is that the pastors in

581
00:33:12,800 --> 00:33:16,400
Speaker 7: the United States would find their voices, that they would

582
00:33:16,400 --> 00:33:20,240
Speaker 7: stop being cowards because the truth is that the IRS

583
00:33:20,360 --> 00:33:22,840
Speaker 7: has been weaponized against churches, but they never have the

584
00:33:22,920 --> 00:33:26,160
Speaker 7: power that the churches believe that they had. And the

585
00:33:26,240 --> 00:33:28,520
Speaker 7: question for the church has always been and it remains

586
00:33:28,520 --> 00:33:30,640
Speaker 7: the same. Nothing has changed because of this ruling, which,

587
00:33:30,640 --> 00:33:33,120
Speaker 7: by the way, my friend Mike Ferris at the tip,

588
00:33:33,160 --> 00:33:34,760
Speaker 7: He's the tip of the spear on this thing. I

589
00:33:34,760 --> 00:33:38,560
Speaker 7: thank God for people like him. This is the real issue.

590
00:33:38,760 --> 00:33:40,960
Speaker 7: We have to wake up and decide do we fear

591
00:33:41,000 --> 00:33:43,440
Speaker 7: God or do we fear government? Right the Bible is

592
00:33:43,520 --> 00:33:45,640
Speaker 7: very clear. Some might trust in horses, some might trust

593
00:33:45,720 --> 00:33:48,400
Speaker 7: in chariots, some might push their trust in a political

594
00:33:48,440 --> 00:33:50,880
Speaker 7: movement or in the fear of the irs. But God's

595
00:33:50,920 --> 00:33:53,600
Speaker 7: people we trust in the name of the Lord. And

596
00:33:53,800 --> 00:33:55,880
Speaker 7: ninety nine point nine percent of the issues that we're

597
00:33:55,880 --> 00:33:59,080
Speaker 7: facing in the nation right now are spiritual at their root,

598
00:33:59,480 --> 00:34:04,640
Speaker 7: and viitual questions need spiritual answers. God's people must engage

599
00:34:04,680 --> 00:34:09,200
Speaker 7: and stop being afraid of the government and start speaking

600
00:34:09,239 --> 00:34:11,080
Speaker 7: out again. It's one of the reasons why I love

601
00:34:11,120 --> 00:34:13,920
Speaker 7: people like my friend pastor Jack Hibbs, who's been openly

602
00:34:14,040 --> 00:34:17,520
Speaker 7: defying the irs for years and years and years because

603
00:34:17,560 --> 00:34:20,080
Speaker 7: he knew that the case that they made against the

604
00:34:20,160 --> 00:34:22,400
Speaker 7: churches actually had no teeth to it. This case with

605
00:34:22,480 --> 00:34:26,879
Speaker 7: the NRB has solidified that. Now hopefully these pastors will

606
00:34:26,880 --> 00:34:30,239
Speaker 7: stop being coward and start addressing the cultural issues that

607
00:34:30,320 --> 00:34:34,520
Speaker 7: have biblical authority behind them, so that God's people understand

608
00:34:34,520 --> 00:34:37,000
Speaker 7: what God says and can act on what God says.

609
00:34:37,440 --> 00:34:38,520
Speaker 2: Heidi, before you go.

610
00:34:39,880 --> 00:34:42,840
Speaker 1: Weak or so away from America, goes back to school,

611
00:34:43,200 --> 00:34:46,880
Speaker 1: some fifty plus million going into public school systems, probably

612
00:34:46,920 --> 00:34:49,279
Speaker 1: five six men going into private school systems, which by

613
00:34:49,320 --> 00:34:52,880
Speaker 1: the way, are growing, homeschooling packed out. It's just amazing.

614
00:34:53,239 --> 00:34:56,120
Speaker 1: And I think about some of the key issues concerns

615
00:34:56,120 --> 00:34:59,640
Speaker 1: that a lot of parents have, everything from indoctrination versus

616
00:34:59,800 --> 00:35:02,520
Speaker 1: edge education you know that, and the importance of parental

617
00:35:02,600 --> 00:35:06,400
Speaker 1: rights to bullying safety, all kinds of issues. Hoti, what

618
00:35:06,440 --> 00:35:09,399
Speaker 1: are you saying to mom's dads everywhere about hey, get

619
00:35:09,400 --> 00:35:10,200
Speaker 1: this right this year?

620
00:35:11,600 --> 00:35:15,080
Speaker 7: Yeah? I think we need to hopefully people most people

621
00:35:15,160 --> 00:35:18,759
Speaker 7: now understand that education is not neutral. This is what

622
00:35:18,800 --> 00:35:21,200
Speaker 7: people need to understand. Education is not neutral. It is

623
00:35:21,239 --> 00:35:26,240
Speaker 7: the impartation of values and ideas, not just concrete ideas,

624
00:35:26,280 --> 00:35:30,160
Speaker 7: but ideologies to the next generation. Education is not neutral.

625
00:35:30,160 --> 00:35:33,640
Speaker 7: If your children are in a public school, you need

626
00:35:33,680 --> 00:35:36,480
Speaker 7: to be engaged. You need to know who's teaching those kids.

627
00:35:36,600 --> 00:35:38,560
Speaker 7: Jesus said in Luke Six's forty when a student is

628
00:35:38,560 --> 00:35:41,960
Speaker 7: fully trained, he'll be like his teacher. Parents cannot afford

629
00:35:42,080 --> 00:35:44,880
Speaker 7: to not know who is teaching their children. This is

630
00:35:44,920 --> 00:35:47,120
Speaker 7: why I've been a huge proponent of taking children out

631
00:35:47,160 --> 00:35:51,040
Speaker 7: of the public school system. Remember you, guys, this is spiritual,

632
00:35:51,440 --> 00:35:53,720
Speaker 7: and if you go for just a half a second,

633
00:35:53,840 --> 00:35:55,520
Speaker 7: do it right now. Go to the website of a

634
00:35:55,640 --> 00:35:58,200
Speaker 7: national educator's association and you will see they are not

635
00:35:58,280 --> 00:36:02,960
Speaker 7: hiding their agenda. These are radicals that are teaching our children. Parents,

636
00:36:03,280 --> 00:36:06,760
Speaker 7: God has given you the responsibility for educating your children.

637
00:36:06,760 --> 00:36:08,960
Speaker 7: We are called to bring our children up in the

638
00:36:09,040 --> 00:36:12,319
Speaker 7: nurture and admonition of the Lord. It wasn't a suggestion,

639
00:36:12,840 --> 00:36:16,320
Speaker 7: it was a command. Because these hearts are the leaders.

640
00:36:16,400 --> 00:36:19,879
Speaker 7: These are the leaders, the parents, the lawmakers. These are

641
00:36:19,880 --> 00:36:22,319
Speaker 7: the leaders of the next generation. And our job is

642
00:36:22,360 --> 00:36:24,640
Speaker 7: to steward them in righteousness. So I hope we see

643
00:36:24,719 --> 00:36:27,600
Speaker 7: this year the importance of education, and we can never

644
00:36:27,719 --> 00:36:29,080
Speaker 7: take our eye off that ball.

645
00:36:28,920 --> 00:36:31,600
Speaker 1: Again, Hatty say John, great having you back, Heiti, thank

646
00:36:31,600 --> 00:36:32,680
Speaker 1: you so much for joining me.

647
00:36:33,600 --> 00:36:35,359
Speaker 7: Thank you for having me. It's a joy to be here.

648
00:36:36,800 --> 00:36:37,640
Speaker 2: Coming up next.

649
00:36:37,840 --> 00:36:40,960
Speaker 1: He is executive General counsel for First Liberty Institute.

650
00:36:41,040 --> 00:36:42,920
Speaker 2: HIREM. Sassers back with us.

651
00:36:43,680 --> 00:36:47,680
Speaker 5: Don't miss the world's premier Christian Counseling conference event, the

652
00:36:47,760 --> 00:36:52,360
Speaker 5: twenty twenty five AACC United World Conference. It has sold

653
00:36:52,360 --> 00:36:54,799
Speaker 5: out the last ten times in a row, and this

654
00:36:54,840 --> 00:36:57,480
Speaker 5: one is shaping up to be the best one ever.

655
00:36:57,760 --> 00:37:02,600
Speaker 5: Returning to the magnificent Oprilanta Tellan, Nashville, September twenty twenty

656
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Speaker 5: five with amazing plinary experts, over fifty leading pre con workshops,

657
00:37:08,000 --> 00:37:11,359
Speaker 5: over twenty five counseling in recovery tracks, and over one

658
00:37:11,440 --> 00:37:15,799
Speaker 5: hundred and seventy five clinical, academic and biblical workshops so

659
00:37:15,880 --> 00:37:18,799
Speaker 5: you can tailor the conference to meet your personal and

660
00:37:18,880 --> 00:37:22,840
Speaker 5: professional goals. This year's World conference features world leading and

661
00:37:22,920 --> 00:37:28,880
Speaker 5: dynamic experts like Kurt Thompson, Henry Cloud, Tyler Vanderwel, Harold Koenig,

662
00:37:29,040 --> 00:37:35,080
Speaker 5: Tim Timberlake, Gary Chapman, Daniel Aman, Lisa Turkhurst, Jenny Allen,

663
00:37:35,440 --> 00:37:39,759
Speaker 5: Tim and Zach Clinton and so much more. Enjoy incredible

664
00:37:39,760 --> 00:37:48,120
Speaker 5: praise and worship with special guests Chris Tomlin, Katie Nicole

665
00:37:49,960 --> 00:38:00,680
Speaker 5: and Faeries and Micah Tyler's Good Tom Will plans to

666
00:38:00,800 --> 00:38:03,760
Speaker 5: attend now. The World Conference has sold out the last

667
00:38:03,760 --> 00:38:07,359
Speaker 5: ten times in a row, with nearly seven thousand counselors

668
00:38:07,360 --> 00:38:10,960
Speaker 5: and mental health and ministry leaders from all fifty states

669
00:38:11,000 --> 00:38:15,160
Speaker 5: and forty different countries represented. Register now for the best

670
00:38:15,160 --> 00:38:20,799
Speaker 5: savings at Worldconference dot net. That's Worldconference dot net. The

671
00:38:20,920 --> 00:38:26,200
Speaker 5: twenty twenty five AECC United World Conference. See you in September.

672
00:38:29,719 --> 00:38:32,600
Speaker 6: For more encouragement and to stay connected, follow doctor Tim

673
00:38:32,640 --> 00:38:35,880
Speaker 6: Clinton on Facebook, Instagram and X. We love being a

674
00:38:35,880 --> 00:38:41,840
Speaker 6: part of your life.

675
00:38:44,440 --> 00:38:47,440
Speaker 1: Johnnyson now is Hiram Sassar. He currently serves as Executive

676
00:38:47,480 --> 00:38:50,759
Speaker 1: General counsel for First Liberty Institute, where he oversees First

677
00:38:50,760 --> 00:38:52,760
Speaker 1: Liberties litigation and media efforts.

678
00:38:52,800 --> 00:38:52,960
Speaker 3: Hire.

679
00:38:52,960 --> 00:38:54,440
Speaker 2: I'm welcome, Thank you for joining me.

680
00:38:55,040 --> 00:38:56,040
Speaker 8: Hey, thanks for having me.

681
00:38:56,320 --> 00:39:00,360
Speaker 1: How as I guess started First Liberty, pretty amazing God's

682
00:39:00,400 --> 00:39:04,040
Speaker 1: been doing in and through Kelly Shackelford and your entire

683
00:39:04,080 --> 00:39:07,040
Speaker 1: team down there and hire them the amazing calling God's

684
00:39:07,120 --> 00:39:10,319
Speaker 1: placed on your life. Talk to our viewers a little

685
00:39:10,280 --> 00:39:15,240
Speaker 1: bit about your mission and your bold stand for religious liberty.

686
00:39:16,040 --> 00:39:20,080
Speaker 8: Well, sure, well, you know, we represent people whose religious

687
00:39:20,120 --> 00:39:23,480
Speaker 8: liberty has been trampled upon by the government, people like

688
00:39:23,520 --> 00:39:25,640
Speaker 8: Coach Kennedy or were told he can't pray on the

689
00:39:25,680 --> 00:39:29,040
Speaker 8: fifty yard line after the football games, or people like

690
00:39:29,160 --> 00:39:32,120
Speaker 8: Gerald Groff who worked for the Postal Service for all

691
00:39:32,160 --> 00:39:34,920
Speaker 8: those years and then they told him he has to

692
00:39:35,000 --> 00:39:36,640
Speaker 8: deliver on Sundays, and he said, look, I have a

693
00:39:36,719 --> 00:39:39,400
Speaker 8: religious objection to doing that, and so we had to

694
00:39:39,440 --> 00:39:41,040
Speaker 8: take those Both of those cases had to go to

695
00:39:41,080 --> 00:39:43,080
Speaker 8: the US Supreme Court, and we had to overturn fifty

696
00:39:43,160 --> 00:39:46,920
Speaker 8: years of old precedent in order to restore that religious

697
00:39:46,920 --> 00:39:51,080
Speaker 8: liberty to not only our clients, but to millions of Americans.

698
00:39:51,600 --> 00:39:54,879
Speaker 8: It's just it's been an incredible journey to be able

699
00:39:54,920 --> 00:39:58,080
Speaker 8: to go back and undo all those bad decisions that

700
00:39:58,200 --> 00:40:01,840
Speaker 8: have happened in the nineteen seventies. And we're still plowing

701
00:40:01,920 --> 00:40:04,920
Speaker 8: away at some of those old decisions decades ago that

702
00:40:05,080 --> 00:40:09,319
Speaker 8: really transformed America and in a way that was really

703
00:40:09,400 --> 00:40:12,279
Speaker 8: hostile to religious liberty. And we're being able to bring

704
00:40:12,360 --> 00:40:15,680
Speaker 8: that religious liberty back to the millions of Americans. To

705
00:40:15,800 --> 00:40:18,560
Speaker 8: enjoy once again. I mean, frankly, Tim, you have more

706
00:40:18,640 --> 00:40:21,680
Speaker 8: religious liberty today than you probably have had in your

707
00:40:21,840 --> 00:40:25,520
Speaker 8: entire lifetime. Anyone who has been who was born after

708
00:40:25,840 --> 00:40:30,120
Speaker 8: the mid nineteen seventies or even in the early the

709
00:40:30,239 --> 00:40:33,839
Speaker 8: late nineteen sixties, you have more religious liberty today than

710
00:40:33,880 --> 00:40:38,680
Speaker 8: you had even before, even at any point since that time.

711
00:40:38,800 --> 00:40:41,600
Speaker 8: So it's just been an amazing journey to be part

712
00:40:41,640 --> 00:40:44,120
Speaker 8: of rebuilding and restoring America this way.

713
00:40:45,360 --> 00:40:50,640
Speaker 1: Religious liberty it's the heart, it's the soul, if you will,

714
00:40:50,680 --> 00:40:55,200
Speaker 1: It's the cornerstone upon which everything else is kind of built.

715
00:40:55,320 --> 00:40:55,880
Speaker 2: Why is that?

716
00:40:56,080 --> 00:40:59,680
Speaker 1: And help us understand why we have to stand bold

717
00:40:59,800 --> 00:41:01,960
Speaker 1: and courageous surround this very issue.

718
00:41:03,080 --> 00:41:07,080
Speaker 8: Well, the reason why every tautalitarian and dictator, whoever takes power,

719
00:41:07,239 --> 00:41:09,680
Speaker 8: has to take away religious liberty is the very first

720
00:41:09,800 --> 00:41:12,920
Speaker 8: thing is that the citizens cannot have an allegiance to

721
00:41:13,080 --> 00:41:17,440
Speaker 8: something greater than the state if for totalitarianism to survive.

722
00:41:18,080 --> 00:41:19,480
Speaker 8: And that's one of the things that a lot of

723
00:41:19,520 --> 00:41:23,000
Speaker 8: people forget. It's in our Declaration of Independence, it's part

724
00:41:23,040 --> 00:41:25,319
Speaker 8: of the foundation of our nation. But this idea even

725
00:41:25,360 --> 00:41:29,000
Speaker 8: predates the declaration. The founding fathers didn't invent it. They

726
00:41:29,200 --> 00:41:31,680
Speaker 8: just harnessed it and harnessed the power of it. That

727
00:41:31,920 --> 00:41:37,320
Speaker 8: God created our rights. God, he is the creator. He

728
00:41:37,480 --> 00:41:41,360
Speaker 8: gave us our inalienable rights, and those rights pre exist government.

729
00:41:41,440 --> 00:41:44,080
Speaker 8: We give up a little bit of those rights by

730
00:41:44,160 --> 00:41:47,520
Speaker 8: agreement and something called a constitution, and those rights turn

731
00:41:47,600 --> 00:41:50,600
Speaker 8: into some power that we give under our consent to

732
00:41:50,680 --> 00:41:54,200
Speaker 8: the government. But we retain all of those rights. And

733
00:41:54,280 --> 00:41:57,800
Speaker 8: the constitutions very clear about this. Those are our rights,

734
00:41:58,000 --> 00:42:01,319
Speaker 8: and they existed long before the governm And so that's

735
00:42:01,320 --> 00:42:04,680
Speaker 8: why religious liberty is the foundational liberty for all other

736
00:42:04,800 --> 00:42:08,640
Speaker 8: liberties from which they flow, because it's the essential liberty

737
00:42:08,680 --> 00:42:12,040
Speaker 8: that allows us to acknowledge that it's our creator who

738
00:42:12,200 --> 00:42:15,520
Speaker 8: endowed us with our inalienable rights, and they cannot be

739
00:42:15,640 --> 00:42:18,880
Speaker 8: taken away by any government because they pre existed government

740
00:42:19,160 --> 00:42:20,840
Speaker 8: and they came from a divine source.

741
00:42:21,160 --> 00:42:25,759
Speaker 1: I remember back during the right before the first Trump administration,

742
00:42:26,800 --> 00:42:30,200
Speaker 1: there was a meeting with then Donald Trump there at

743
00:42:30,200 --> 00:42:32,440
Speaker 1: the Trump Tower with a lot of faith leaders, and

744
00:42:32,600 --> 00:42:36,600
Speaker 1: in that meeting it became evident that a lot of

745
00:42:36,680 --> 00:42:39,279
Speaker 1: faith leaders were in fear of the I R s

746
00:42:39,480 --> 00:42:43,960
Speaker 1: and others, that kind of weaponization against the people of

747
00:42:44,080 --> 00:42:47,840
Speaker 1: faith by systems of government, and the Johnson Amendment was

748
00:42:47,880 --> 00:42:51,680
Speaker 1: brought up Hireum and President Trump said, we need to

749
00:42:51,960 --> 00:42:54,120
Speaker 1: we need to get rid of that Johnson Amendment. We

750
00:42:54,200 --> 00:42:56,400
Speaker 1: got to, We've got to do something about that, because

751
00:42:56,920 --> 00:43:00,600
Speaker 1: he realized that it was really a ham string, if

752
00:43:00,640 --> 00:43:03,879
Speaker 1: you will, for people of faith, for religious leaders, talk

753
00:43:03,960 --> 00:43:08,479
Speaker 1: to us about the Johnson Amendment and a recent court

754
00:43:08,640 --> 00:43:12,359
Speaker 1: ruling against her with the I r S. That might

755
00:43:12,560 --> 00:43:14,759
Speaker 1: change that a little bit from your perspective.

756
00:43:15,760 --> 00:43:18,520
Speaker 8: Yeah, well, look, the Johnson Amendment. What cracks me up

757
00:43:18,520 --> 00:43:20,879
Speaker 8: about it is all the separation of church and state.

758
00:43:20,960 --> 00:43:24,040
Speaker 8: Crowd they love it. They always talk about, oh, we

759
00:43:24,160 --> 00:43:26,239
Speaker 8: need separation of church and state. We can't have a

760
00:43:26,280 --> 00:43:29,840
Speaker 8: tank commandments monument because see, somehow having a tank commandments

761
00:43:29,920 --> 00:43:32,800
Speaker 8: monument on the Capitol grounds is going to pollute religion,

762
00:43:32,920 --> 00:43:34,160
Speaker 8: is how they would say it. You know, it's going

763
00:43:34,200 --> 00:43:38,000
Speaker 8: to somehow affect religion. Oh but it's they but they

764
00:43:38,239 --> 00:43:42,480
Speaker 8: love that. The i r S monitors what pastors say

765
00:43:42,560 --> 00:43:45,799
Speaker 8: from the pulpit and will punish churches if pastors say

766
00:43:45,880 --> 00:43:47,719
Speaker 8: things that the I r S doesn't think they should

767
00:43:47,719 --> 00:43:50,000
Speaker 8: be able to say. And so the Johnson Amendment was

768
00:43:50,040 --> 00:43:54,200
Speaker 8: that Look, that nonprofits, including churches, would not be allowed

769
00:43:54,239 --> 00:43:57,760
Speaker 8: to endorse candidates for public office. It's just that nobody

770
00:43:58,000 --> 00:44:00,759
Speaker 8: stop by to check the historical records to see what

771
00:44:00,840 --> 00:44:03,120
Speaker 8: the founding fathers were up to when they passed this thing.

772
00:44:03,760 --> 00:44:03,880
Speaker 4: Uh.

773
00:44:04,160 --> 00:44:07,840
Speaker 8: And you know, during the American Revolution and poster American Revolution,

774
00:44:08,000 --> 00:44:13,880
Speaker 8: especially during the Civil War, pastors gave messages, they preached

775
00:44:13,960 --> 00:44:16,880
Speaker 8: from the pulpit who people should be voting for for

776
00:44:17,080 --> 00:44:20,279
Speaker 8: office they preached it was it was the elect It

777
00:44:20,360 --> 00:44:23,920
Speaker 8: was always the election sermon on the Sunday before the

778
00:44:24,040 --> 00:44:24,880
Speaker 8: Tuesday vote.

779
00:44:25,400 --> 00:44:25,520
Speaker 3: Uh.

780
00:44:25,800 --> 00:44:28,520
Speaker 8: And so they Johnson Endment came along and said, well,

781
00:44:28,520 --> 00:44:30,680
Speaker 8: you're not allowed to do that anymore, pastors. We're going

782
00:44:30,719 --> 00:44:33,719
Speaker 8: to regulate what you say from the pulpit. And and

783
00:44:33,840 --> 00:44:37,040
Speaker 8: the separation groups have tried to use that as as

784
00:44:37,120 --> 00:44:41,440
Speaker 8: a cudgel to try to attack churches, for you know,

785
00:44:41,520 --> 00:44:44,000
Speaker 8: if they if a pastor feels called by the Lord

786
00:44:44,120 --> 00:44:46,719
Speaker 8: to say, hey, folks, you know we're against certain things

787
00:44:46,760 --> 00:44:50,080
Speaker 8: like abortion and uh and other things, and we're going

788
00:44:50,160 --> 00:44:51,879
Speaker 8: to preach us from the pulpit. And if you want

789
00:44:51,920 --> 00:44:54,400
Speaker 8: to be in line with the biblical worldview, you need

790
00:44:54,440 --> 00:44:57,279
Speaker 8: to be voting for Bob or Susan or whatever. Oh,

791
00:44:57,440 --> 00:44:59,759
Speaker 8: they're going to stop try to stop everybody from doing that.

792
00:45:00,040 --> 00:45:02,719
Speaker 8: And it's the irs showing up to say, hey, we're

793
00:45:02,800 --> 00:45:05,880
Speaker 8: here and we're going to tell you Church what to do.

794
00:45:06,040 --> 00:45:08,080
Speaker 8: We're going to revoke your taxi and statisfying you a

795
00:45:08,160 --> 00:45:10,640
Speaker 8: bunch of money and that sort of stuff. Well, there

796
00:45:10,719 --> 00:45:12,759
Speaker 8: was a lawsuit that was going on prior to the

797
00:45:12,840 --> 00:45:17,680
Speaker 8: election of Donald Trump challenging the Johnson Amendment and when

798
00:45:17,920 --> 00:45:21,120
Speaker 8: and now the Department of Justice has entered a proposed

799
00:45:21,160 --> 00:45:25,040
Speaker 8: consent decree with those plaintiffs in that case. It's actually

800
00:45:25,080 --> 00:45:28,640
Speaker 8: in Texas, and to say that the Johnson Amendment is

801
00:45:28,760 --> 00:45:31,520
Speaker 8: unconstitutional will no longer be applied and that will be

802
00:45:31,600 --> 00:45:35,359
Speaker 8: binding on future administrations. It still needs to be finalized

803
00:45:36,239 --> 00:45:39,319
Speaker 8: by the federal judge that's overseeing that case right now.

804
00:45:39,840 --> 00:45:42,480
Speaker 8: But that's a great step in terms of getting rid

805
00:45:42,480 --> 00:45:45,279
Speaker 8: of the Johnson Amendment. But really Congress needs to clean

806
00:45:45,360 --> 00:45:47,239
Speaker 8: this up at some point and just get it off

807
00:45:47,280 --> 00:45:51,120
Speaker 8: the books completely. But also this consent decree. So Donald

808
00:45:51,120 --> 00:45:53,839
Speaker 8: Trump has done everything he could possibly do to get

809
00:45:53,960 --> 00:45:57,280
Speaker 8: rid of the Johnson Amendment. He's done his work. Congress

810
00:45:57,400 --> 00:46:00,960
Speaker 8: could finish it off, but he's basically put it on

811
00:46:01,080 --> 00:46:02,120
Speaker 8: life support right now.

812
00:46:02,560 --> 00:46:07,520
Speaker 2: People want to learn more, hire them about you, First Liberty.

813
00:46:07,600 --> 00:46:10,520
Speaker 8: Where can they go, Well, people go to our website

814
00:46:10,560 --> 00:46:13,719
Speaker 8: at Firstliberty dot org and we have some newsletters people

815
00:46:13,760 --> 00:46:15,440
Speaker 8: can sign up. We got a lot of free resources

816
00:46:15,480 --> 00:46:17,959
Speaker 8: people can download to find out where your religious liberty

817
00:46:18,040 --> 00:46:20,799
Speaker 8: rights are in the workplace, or or the religious liberty

818
00:46:20,880 --> 00:46:23,879
Speaker 8: rights of your church or your school, those sorts of things,

819
00:46:23,960 --> 00:46:26,279
Speaker 8: and so there's just a lot of great resources at

820
00:46:26,280 --> 00:46:27,279
Speaker 8: First Liberty dot org.

821
00:46:27,640 --> 00:46:31,359
Speaker 1: Hiram Sassar, Executive General Counsel for First Liberty Institute, Thank

822
00:46:31,400 --> 00:46:35,759
Speaker 1: you for joining me. Coming up next he is Executive

823
00:46:35,880 --> 00:46:39,160
Speaker 1: General Counsel for First Liberty Institute. Hiram Sassar is back

824
00:46:39,200 --> 00:46:44,400
Speaker 1: with us and closing. These are unprecedented times, they're difficult times,

825
00:46:44,480 --> 00:46:47,879
Speaker 1: but God, I know he's in control, and I believe

826
00:46:47,920 --> 00:46:49,600
Speaker 1: he is at work. I hope you're pressing close to

827
00:46:49,680 --> 00:46:51,360
Speaker 1: Him in his heart and know that God loves you

828
00:46:52,080 --> 00:46:54,440
Speaker 1: and that he wants to be in your life. I

829
00:46:54,560 --> 00:46:56,680
Speaker 1: hope our strength comes from the Lord. Here's again is

830
00:46:56,719 --> 00:46:58,480
Speaker 1: a great verse to hold on to this week. So

831
00:46:58,520 --> 00:47:01,040
Speaker 1: I'm forty six Verse one. It's one of my favorites

832
00:47:01,680 --> 00:47:04,279
Speaker 1: God's our refuge, on our strength. He's a present help

833
00:47:05,160 --> 00:47:08,239
Speaker 1: during times of trouble. You know you can look to

834
00:47:08,360 --> 00:47:11,560
Speaker 1: them for wisdom and direction in your everyday life. I

835
00:47:11,680 --> 00:47:14,400
Speaker 1: do let me also say this, I've learned as a

836
00:47:14,440 --> 00:47:17,680
Speaker 1: professional counselor that's normal to have concerned. Maybe some fear worry,

837
00:47:18,360 --> 00:47:20,600
Speaker 1: especially when things aren't the way they're supposed to be.

838
00:47:21,800 --> 00:47:24,600
Speaker 1: But also know that if you aren't careful, it can

839
00:47:24,680 --> 00:47:28,320
Speaker 1: begin to consume you, control you. It's easy to lose perspective.

840
00:47:29,120 --> 00:47:31,840
Speaker 1: Some feel like they've lost hope. It can get so

841
00:47:32,040 --> 00:47:34,800
Speaker 1: dark for some that they feel like life would be

842
00:47:34,880 --> 00:47:35,919
Speaker 1: better off without them.

843
00:47:36,840 --> 00:47:39,120
Speaker 2: I say this every week. You don't have to live

844
00:47:39,239 --> 00:47:39,440
Speaker 2: like that.

845
00:47:39,600 --> 00:47:42,520
Speaker 1: Simply taking a step reaching out for help it's often

846
00:47:42,600 --> 00:47:45,680
Speaker 1: the gateway to a new day. I knew you, and

847
00:47:45,719 --> 00:47:47,600
Speaker 1: if you or someone you love is struggling, I hope

848
00:47:47,600 --> 00:47:50,759
Speaker 1: you'll do that. There are wonderful counsels and pastors who

849
00:47:50,920 --> 00:47:53,640
Speaker 1: care can help you find the hope help that you're

850
00:47:53,680 --> 00:47:56,640
Speaker 1: looking for. There are also a lot of wonderful resources

851
00:47:56,680 --> 00:47:58,359
Speaker 1: out there. I'd love to connect you with some of those,

852
00:47:59,360 --> 00:48:01,080
Speaker 1: or maybe someone who can help. You can go up

853
00:48:01,120 --> 00:48:05,279
Speaker 1: on our website at AACC dot net, aacc dot net,

854
00:48:05,440 --> 00:48:11,320
Speaker 1: or a new website called christiancareconnect dot com. That's christiancareconnect

855
00:48:11,760 --> 00:48:14,840
Speaker 1: dot com. If you don't have a personal relationship with

856
00:48:14,960 --> 00:48:18,000
Speaker 1: God in christ I want you to know that you

857
00:48:18,200 --> 00:48:21,080
Speaker 1: can do that right now by asking God to come

858
00:48:21,120 --> 00:48:24,000
Speaker 1: into your life, ask him to forgive you of your

859
00:48:24,080 --> 00:48:27,040
Speaker 1: sin and to be your Lord and savior. Simply praying

860
00:48:27,040 --> 00:48:29,239
Speaker 1: a prayer from your heart to God's heart something like this.

861
00:48:29,960 --> 00:48:32,640
Speaker 1: You can pray it with me, Lord Jesus, I need you.

862
00:48:34,560 --> 00:48:37,279
Speaker 1: I know I'm broken. I'm a sinner. I believe you

863
00:48:37,440 --> 00:48:41,400
Speaker 1: died for my sins. God, you came to save me.

864
00:48:41,480 --> 00:48:43,440
Speaker 1: I want to turn from my sins and invite you

865
00:48:43,520 --> 00:48:46,040
Speaker 1: into my heart my life. I want to trust you

866
00:48:46,160 --> 00:48:49,960
Speaker 1: and follow you as my Lord and savior. God, Thank

867
00:48:50,000 --> 00:48:52,800
Speaker 1: you for loving me, for giving your life for me,

868
00:48:53,040 --> 00:48:56,560
Speaker 1: for the gift of grace, forgiveness, the gift of eternal

869
00:48:56,640 --> 00:48:57,520
Speaker 1: life in heaven with you.

870
00:48:58,520 --> 00:49:00,000
Speaker 2: I pray all this in Jesus.

871
00:49:00,000 --> 00:49:00,640
Speaker 7: This is his name.

872
00:49:01,239 --> 00:49:01,600
Speaker 2: Amen.

873
00:49:02,160 --> 00:49:04,600
Speaker 1: You know what the Bible says. The Bible says in

874
00:49:04,719 --> 00:49:07,279
Speaker 1: Romans ten nine that if you confess with your mouth

875
00:49:07,840 --> 00:49:10,279
Speaker 1: that Jesus is Lord, and you believe in your heart

876
00:49:10,360 --> 00:49:15,680
Speaker 1: that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved.

877
00:49:16,719 --> 00:49:18,480
Speaker 1: And I believe that if you've prayed that prayer from

878
00:49:18,520 --> 00:49:22,319
Speaker 1: your heart to God's heart, you are born again. Best

879
00:49:22,360 --> 00:49:24,560
Speaker 1: thing you can do now is tell others and then

880
00:49:24,640 --> 00:49:26,719
Speaker 1: go serve God for the rest of your life.

881
00:49:26,960 --> 00:49:28,360
Speaker 2: He'll give you the strength to do it.

882
00:49:28,480 --> 00:49:31,960
Speaker 1: I believe that if you're struggling with hopelessness, it's really

883
00:49:32,080 --> 00:49:35,160
Speaker 1: dark for you and you feel like you're at the

884
00:49:35,560 --> 00:49:38,279
Speaker 1: end of your rope, hope you'll pick up the phone

885
00:49:38,320 --> 00:49:41,520
Speaker 1: and talk to someone the National Suicide Prevention Lifeline. That

886
00:49:41,680 --> 00:49:44,880
Speaker 1: number is simply nine eight eight and talk with someone

887
00:49:45,480 --> 00:49:46,560
Speaker 1: nine eight eight.

888
00:49:47,480 --> 00:49:48,200
Speaker 2: Hey, before we go.

889
00:49:48,440 --> 00:49:50,399
Speaker 1: Maybe God has gifted you with the heart to help

890
00:49:50,440 --> 00:49:54,560
Speaker 1: other people. It's just natural for you. Hope you'll consider

891
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Speaker 1: being a part of our Mental Health Coach first Responder program.

892
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Speaker 1: You can enroll right now and become get on your

893
00:50:01,160 --> 00:50:04,479
Speaker 1: way to becoming a board certified mental health coach. Nearly

894
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Speaker 1: seventy thousand people have now enrolled. Everything you need to

895
00:50:08,239 --> 00:50:10,600
Speaker 1: know about this program is up at our website at

896
00:50:10,719 --> 00:50:16,400
Speaker 1: light University dot com, forward slash Mentalhealth Coach. Light University

897
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Speaker 1: dot com forward slash mental Health Coach. It's a forty

898
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Speaker 1: two hour training program featuring some of the world's leading

899
00:50:22,920 --> 00:50:26,000
Speaker 1: mental health and ministry experts, all on video. You can

900
00:50:26,040 --> 00:50:29,000
Speaker 1: study twenty four seven three sixty five the best news.

901
00:50:29,800 --> 00:50:32,359
Speaker 1: This kind of program usually costs around twenty four hundred dollars.

902
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Speaker 1: There might be a scholarship up there for someone just

903
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Speaker 1: like you. Go up to light University dot com forward

904
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Speaker 1: slash mental health coach. I'm doctor Tim Clinton has always

905
00:50:42,680 --> 00:50:43,240
Speaker 1: thanks for watching.

906
00:50:43,280 --> 00:50:45,640
Speaker 2: See you next week right here on Sunday The Road

907
00:50:45,719 --> 00:50:47,560
Speaker 2: Forward on Real America's.

908
00:50:47,160 --> 00:50:47,760
Speaker 5: Horse news

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00:50:49,480 --> 00:50:51,520
Speaker 2: Head by god Com