1 00:00:05,160 --> 00:00:07,600 Speaker 1: Hey, this is Annie and Samantha. I'come stuff I never 2 00:00:07,680 --> 00:00:19,400 Speaker 1: told you production of by Her Radio and welcome to 3 00:00:19,560 --> 00:00:22,880 Speaker 1: another edition of Monday Mini Today. As we record this, 4 00:00:23,079 --> 00:00:27,840 Speaker 1: it is May seventh, twenty twenty five, and a quick 5 00:00:28,320 --> 00:00:35,239 Speaker 1: content warning, we're just transphobic, transphobic things that are happening, 6 00:00:36,040 --> 00:00:38,599 Speaker 1: a lot of transphobia. But I put in the date 7 00:00:38,640 --> 00:00:43,080 Speaker 1: because it's it's moving. This is all pretty recent and 8 00:00:43,120 --> 00:00:45,000 Speaker 1: there's a lot of stuff that's happening around it. But 9 00:00:45,880 --> 00:00:51,760 Speaker 1: today we are talking about the British Supreme Court's recent 10 00:00:51,880 --> 00:00:57,800 Speaker 1: decision around the definition of women. So in April twenty 11 00:00:57,800 --> 00:01:00,560 Speaker 1: twenty five, the British Supreme Court decided that the legal 12 00:01:00,560 --> 00:01:04,360 Speaker 1: definition of a woman was based on biology and someone 13 00:01:04,480 --> 00:01:09,080 Speaker 1: born biologically as female. In the eighty eight page ruling, 14 00:01:09,400 --> 00:01:12,840 Speaker 1: the court writes, the quote concept of sex is binary. 15 00:01:13,120 --> 00:01:16,240 Speaker 1: A person is either a woman or a man. The 16 00:01:16,280 --> 00:01:19,840 Speaker 1: Deputy President of the Supreme Court said, quote the unanimous 17 00:01:19,840 --> 00:01:22,920 Speaker 1: decision of this Court is that the terms woman and 18 00:01:23,200 --> 00:01:28,640 Speaker 1: sex refer to a biological woman in biological sex. Of note, 19 00:01:28,640 --> 00:01:31,600 Speaker 1: transactivists and people were largely left out of this case, 20 00:01:31,640 --> 00:01:38,720 Speaker 1: even though they had lawfully legally petitioned to be involved. 21 00:01:39,800 --> 00:01:44,080 Speaker 1: So what does this mean. It means a lot of things. 22 00:01:44,120 --> 00:01:51,520 Speaker 1: A lot of it is confusing. But government issued certificates, 23 00:01:51,600 --> 00:01:55,760 Speaker 1: formally and officially recognized new genders do not guarantee to 24 00:01:55,840 --> 00:01:59,800 Speaker 1: be protected by the twenty ten Equality Act, specifically the 25 00:02:00,240 --> 00:02:06,560 Speaker 1: base protections. So I obviously we're not legal scholars, especially 26 00:02:06,560 --> 00:02:08,680 Speaker 1: not for a country that we did not grow up in. 27 00:02:08,919 --> 00:02:11,000 Speaker 1: But if you want to look it up, it's pretty 28 00:02:11,000 --> 00:02:14,800 Speaker 1: complicated because there's this twenty ten Equality Act and then 29 00:02:14,800 --> 00:02:19,560 Speaker 1: there are a couple of other acts that come into play. 30 00:02:19,600 --> 00:02:25,520 Speaker 1: But according to this ruling that won't apply anymore. It 31 00:02:25,560 --> 00:02:28,000 Speaker 1: applies to all sorts of situations in terms of like 32 00:02:28,080 --> 00:02:32,600 Speaker 1: public facilities, changing rooms, hostels, communal accommodations, and all manner 33 00:02:32,680 --> 00:02:37,239 Speaker 1: of public organizations. According to the BBC quote, since then, 34 00:02:37,280 --> 00:02:40,799 Speaker 1: interim guidance says in places like hospital shops and restaurants, 35 00:02:41,000 --> 00:02:44,560 Speaker 1: trans women, biological men should not be permitted to use 36 00:02:44,600 --> 00:02:48,600 Speaker 1: the women's facilities. It also goes out of its way 37 00:02:48,639 --> 00:02:51,840 Speaker 1: to say that only biological women can be pregnant and 38 00:02:51,919 --> 00:02:55,799 Speaker 1: get any protections related to pregnancy. But as I said, 39 00:02:55,800 --> 00:02:59,040 Speaker 1: it's really confusing just in terms of how it contradicts 40 00:02:59,160 --> 00:03:03,240 Speaker 1: other ruling and almost its own ruling. At times, the 41 00:03:03,320 --> 00:03:06,040 Speaker 1: court kept saying it provides clarity, like they were like, 42 00:03:06,120 --> 00:03:10,760 Speaker 1: finally we've provided clarity, but it really really doesn't. And 43 00:03:10,800 --> 00:03:14,320 Speaker 1: this does lead to a much larger conversation that's happening 44 00:03:14,360 --> 00:03:18,160 Speaker 1: in the US and elsewhere. How quite do you determine 45 00:03:18,320 --> 00:03:25,040 Speaker 1: someone's biological sex and the dangerous box this opens. This 46 00:03:25,639 --> 00:03:28,880 Speaker 1: was thanks to, at least in part, a long running 47 00:03:28,960 --> 00:03:33,239 Speaker 1: legal battle that originated in Scotland in twenty eighteen, which 48 00:03:33,240 --> 00:03:36,080 Speaker 1: is also a little complicated, but briefly, in twenty eighteen, 49 00:03:36,200 --> 00:03:39,200 Speaker 1: a law was passed in Scotland that required every Scottish 50 00:03:39,200 --> 00:03:42,160 Speaker 1: public organization must have at least fifty percent women on 51 00:03:42,200 --> 00:03:45,440 Speaker 1: their boards. At the time, this included trans women as 52 00:03:45,440 --> 00:03:49,000 Speaker 1: long as they had this government issued certificate, the Gender 53 00:03:49,080 --> 00:03:54,200 Speaker 1: Recognition Certificate or GRC, saying that they were women. But 54 00:03:54,560 --> 00:03:59,720 Speaker 1: of course this whole thing infuriated Turfs, including the Group 55 00:04:00,080 --> 00:04:04,360 Speaker 1: for Women Scotland. They immediately rallied to challenge the law. 56 00:04:04,680 --> 00:04:07,800 Speaker 1: They claimed that they were worried about how including trans 57 00:04:07,840 --> 00:04:12,760 Speaker 1: people would impact single sex services for women in the health, 58 00:04:12,800 --> 00:04:18,000 Speaker 1: abuse in sports categories particularly. They sued Scotland to limit 59 00:04:18,240 --> 00:04:21,640 Speaker 1: these services to only people who were born biologically female. 60 00:04:22,200 --> 00:04:26,559 Speaker 1: They lost, but they didn't stop fighting, and the UK 61 00:04:26,720 --> 00:04:30,680 Speaker 1: Supreme Court overruled the previous rulings in favor of groups 62 00:04:30,839 --> 00:04:36,640 Speaker 1: like Poor Scotland Women, which unfortunately brings us too. She 63 00:04:36,920 --> 00:04:43,719 Speaker 1: who must not be named, yep, JK. Rowing She is 64 00:04:43,800 --> 00:04:48,000 Speaker 1: a part of four Women's Scotland. She helped bankroll the campaign. 65 00:04:49,080 --> 00:04:51,919 Speaker 1: She posted an image on social media of her smoking 66 00:04:51,920 --> 00:04:54,920 Speaker 1: a cigar and drinking captioned when the hard work pays off, 67 00:04:55,160 --> 00:05:03,760 Speaker 1: celebrating this win. And very several feminist groups and even 68 00:05:03,920 --> 00:05:09,240 Speaker 1: LGB organizations supported this ruling. And just by the way, JK. 69 00:05:09,360 --> 00:05:12,920 Speaker 1: Rowling recently came for ACE people too. Uh she's an 70 00:05:12,960 --> 00:05:17,120 Speaker 1: equal opportunity hater. Yeah, I mean she has jumped all 71 00:05:17,120 --> 00:05:19,920 Speaker 1: the way off board right for all people. Like she's like, 72 00:05:20,440 --> 00:05:27,880 Speaker 1: get all of y'all suck when she really sucks. She yes, yep, yep, 73 00:05:28,080 --> 00:05:31,880 Speaker 1: it was pretty In the words of Pedro Pascal Hates 74 00:05:33,080 --> 00:05:36,240 Speaker 1: that's what he said about the social post. But anyway, 75 00:05:36,440 --> 00:05:41,599 Speaker 1: so that happened, and then here in the US we 76 00:05:41,640 --> 00:05:45,880 Speaker 1: have a lot of similar things. Obviously, this is a 77 00:05:45,920 --> 00:05:48,159 Speaker 1: Monday Mini, We're gonna have to come back and do 78 00:05:48,240 --> 00:05:51,840 Speaker 1: a full episode. But right now we've got the U. S. 79 00:05:51,839 --> 00:05:55,799 Speaker 1: Supreme Court up holding Trump's band on transgender people serving 80 00:05:55,839 --> 00:05:59,080 Speaker 1: in the US military. But that it is. That is 81 00:05:59,120 --> 00:06:04,080 Speaker 1: one of like many, many, many attacks on trans rights 82 00:06:04,120 --> 00:06:07,560 Speaker 1: in the US. There are pushes for only recognizing two 83 00:06:07,600 --> 00:06:11,919 Speaker 1: genders on official documents like passports and the one checked 84 00:06:12,000 --> 00:06:14,159 Speaker 1: must be the one assigned at birth, and of course 85 00:06:14,279 --> 00:06:17,800 Speaker 1: around sports, which I'm kind of confounded by. Honestly, I'm 86 00:06:17,800 --> 00:06:20,599 Speaker 1: confounded by a lot of this, but the real focus 87 00:06:20,600 --> 00:06:27,440 Speaker 1: on sports. But also this has led to legal issues too, 88 00:06:27,640 --> 00:06:31,400 Speaker 1: just in the way certain documentation works and how somebody 89 00:06:31,440 --> 00:06:34,799 Speaker 1: can legally be both a man and a woman even 90 00:06:34,920 --> 00:06:39,480 Speaker 1: under these things. So there's no clarity. There's this clarity 91 00:06:39,520 --> 00:06:43,960 Speaker 1: that they're saying it's not here, No, it doesn't exist, 92 00:06:43,960 --> 00:06:47,600 Speaker 1: and you're making it worse. But yeah, all of this 93 00:06:47,680 --> 00:06:50,800 Speaker 1: is clearly part of the continuing concerted efforts to attack 94 00:06:50,839 --> 00:06:53,480 Speaker 1: trans rights. While some of the UK are clear that 95 00:06:53,480 --> 00:06:57,240 Speaker 1: trans folks still have legal protections against discrimination and harassment, 96 00:06:57,520 --> 00:07:01,400 Speaker 1: others worry that this is a slippery slope. That being said, 97 00:07:01,440 --> 00:07:05,039 Speaker 1: Scottish Trans a charity group, urged supporters not to panic. 98 00:07:05,120 --> 00:07:09,080 Speaker 1: So basically, it's like, not everything is gone. This is bad, 99 00:07:09,880 --> 00:07:12,760 Speaker 1: but not everything is gone again. We're not from the UK. 100 00:07:13,240 --> 00:07:17,400 Speaker 1: UK listeners, please let us know. There has already been 101 00:07:17,440 --> 00:07:20,640 Speaker 1: fallout though. Some sports teams and organizations that had previously 102 00:07:20,680 --> 00:07:24,400 Speaker 1: been accepting of trans people trans women are cutting trans women. 103 00:07:24,520 --> 00:07:27,160 Speaker 1: Although I saw that some of it's getting pushed back 104 00:07:28,640 --> 00:07:33,400 Speaker 1: pretty fiercely, so it might go backwards, I hope, but 105 00:07:34,080 --> 00:07:38,520 Speaker 1: it's like we said, it's still going. Trans folks have 106 00:07:39,360 --> 00:07:41,280 Speaker 1: all over I have spoken out about how this is 107 00:07:41,320 --> 00:07:43,720 Speaker 1: another instance of just chipping away their rights and how 108 00:07:44,080 --> 00:07:47,000 Speaker 1: they're sometimes scared about the door or just exist in public. 109 00:07:48,160 --> 00:07:51,160 Speaker 1: Here's a quote from a Harvard Kennedy School article by 110 00:07:51,200 --> 00:07:55,280 Speaker 1: Diego Garcia Blum and Timothy Patrick McCarthy. Quote Critically, the 111 00:07:55,320 --> 00:07:59,120 Speaker 1: court's ruling relied extensively on arguments presented by trans exclusive 112 00:07:59,240 --> 00:08:03,000 Speaker 1: gender critical activist while notably excluding any direct input from 113 00:08:03,040 --> 00:08:07,120 Speaker 1: trans voics themselves. By positioning misogyny as inherently tied to 114 00:08:07,240 --> 00:08:11,360 Speaker 1: biological sex rather than the broader societal oppression long recognized 115 00:08:11,400 --> 00:08:17,040 Speaker 1: by feminist movements, the decision revives problematic biological essentialism. Historically, 116 00:08:17,120 --> 00:08:21,440 Speaker 1: biological essentialism was also used to exclude CIS women, confining 117 00:08:21,480 --> 00:08:24,080 Speaker 1: them to the domestic sphere and denying them access to 118 00:08:24,160 --> 00:08:27,640 Speaker 1: education and occupations on the premise that their biology made 119 00:08:27,640 --> 00:08:31,200 Speaker 1: them solely suitable for motherhood and therefore uncapable of carrying 120 00:08:31,240 --> 00:08:35,640 Speaker 1: out other roles. Returning to biological essentialism then risk returning 121 00:08:35,640 --> 00:08:39,760 Speaker 1: to periods where women enjoyed less, not more equality relative 122 00:08:39,800 --> 00:08:51,040 Speaker 1: to men. Yeah, he so frustrating, But there are as 123 00:08:51,080 --> 00:08:55,959 Speaker 1: always organizations people fighting to contest rulings like this in 124 00:08:56,000 --> 00:09:00,960 Speaker 1: the UK and US all over, so all hope is 125 00:09:00,960 --> 00:09:04,000 Speaker 1: not lost and we would love to hear from you listeners, 126 00:09:04,120 --> 00:09:06,080 Speaker 1: if you're part of any of these organizations, if you 127 00:09:06,160 --> 00:09:08,480 Speaker 1: know anybody or anything we should start out. If you 128 00:09:08,480 --> 00:09:13,160 Speaker 1: have any resources that would be fantastic. You can email 129 00:09:13,200 --> 00:09:15,600 Speaker 1: us at Hello at stuffwennevertold You dot com. You can 130 00:09:15,640 --> 00:09:17,800 Speaker 1: find us on blue Sky at mopstuff podcast, or on 131 00:09:17,840 --> 00:09:20,160 Speaker 1: Instagram and TikTok at stuff on Never Told You. We're 132 00:09:20,160 --> 00:09:21,640 Speaker 1: also on YouTube. We have a te public story, a 133 00:09:21,640 --> 00:09:23,640 Speaker 1: group of book you can get wherever you get your books. Thanks, 134 00:09:23,640 --> 00:09:26,000 Speaker 1: It's always serious. Super producer Christina or executive producer my 135 00:09:26,120 --> 00:09:28,880 Speaker 1: udercontructor Joey. Thank you and thanks see you for listening. 136 00:09:29,160 --> 00:09:30,800 Speaker 1: Stuff I Never Told You is production by heart Radio. 137 00:09:30,800 --> 00:09:32,240 Speaker 1: For more podcasts from our heart Radio, you can check 138 00:09:32,280 --> 00:09:34,240 Speaker 1: out the heart Radio Appicle podcasts, or wherever you listen 139 00:09:34,320 --> 00:09:35,319 Speaker 1: to your favorite shows.