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Speaker 1: Nicole Galley and our guest here. It's just so many

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Speaker 1: number one songs, but her last three number one as

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Speaker 1: a songwriter include Gone, Here You Go, I've Been Gone,

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Speaker 1: I've Been Gone, half of my Hometown from Kelsey and

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Speaker 1: Kenny Beers on Me from Derek Spentley Swing. So she's

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Speaker 1: got an album called First Born that came out last month.

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Speaker 1: It shocks about it. You know, it's not a big, big,

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Speaker 1: massive label. We put on a record, we're gonna support

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Speaker 1: it with millions of dollars, we're gonna do all. But

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Speaker 1: it has slowly and organically become something really cool because

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Speaker 1: she's really cool. She's a great writer, she's a really

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Speaker 1: good singer. She's just creatively different and very special, and

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Speaker 1: so I really think that's the reason of its success. Um,

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Speaker 1: we're featuring this song on the Women of I Heart

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Speaker 1: Country this weekend. This song is called Tendencies Made but

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Speaker 1: I'm can't shave what but it shows little ways I've

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Speaker 1: never been a lead, but I got tendencies. Mama was

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Speaker 1: a real good secret keeper, so it makes sense me.

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Speaker 1: So I Nicole galleon episode three, which, by the way,

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Speaker 1: years ago we had Nicole in just as a songwriter

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Speaker 1: h way back. That's interesting. I just thought about that.

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Speaker 1: We could actually supplement this in a few days and

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Speaker 1: put that older one up to Yeah, that's pretty cool,

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Speaker 1: and there's nothing it's cool to hear that one. I

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Speaker 1: haven't heard that one since we did it. I guess

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Speaker 1: here is Nicole Galleon follow her Nick and Knight Music

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Speaker 1: and I see at n I t E Music, Nick

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Speaker 1: at Night Music and enjoy. When you walked in, you

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Speaker 1: said we haven't seen each other in a while. I don't,

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Speaker 1: and I guess this is social media. I don't feel that,

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Speaker 1: which is weird because I have, like I hugged you,

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Speaker 1: and I guess I haven't hugged you and years, I

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Speaker 1: mean literally and you were like, i've seen you in

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Speaker 1: a while, and I was like, yeah, that checks out.

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Speaker 1: I get. But I mean, as much as people bag

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Speaker 1: on social media, and I think that's there are a

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Speaker 1: lot of things wrong with the way people use it.

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Speaker 1: But I don't feel like I have like not seen you,

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Speaker 1: which is weird. And maybe I shouldn't feel as much

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Speaker 1: of that. And maybe it's because I'm just gone a

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Speaker 1: lot too. They don't see anybody, But anyway, I feel

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Speaker 1: like I'm your biggest fan in the whole world, and

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Speaker 1: I've I was like, oh, it'll be good to see

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Speaker 1: Nicole in today. I don't really gonna see each other

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Speaker 1: in years. Well, I feel the same way. I think.

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Speaker 1: I think I feel connected. Maybe that's it, Like I

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Speaker 1: feel I think I know enough about you before, we

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Speaker 1: have enough history too then to watch your life evolve.

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Speaker 1: It's like there's a foundation to be able to just

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Speaker 1: like add to when you just watch somebody. But I

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Speaker 1: haven't seen you since you got married. I haven't seen

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Speaker 1: you since so many things. Yeah, I think the connection

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Speaker 1: thing is right. Also, like I root for you, so

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Speaker 1: I think inside of whatever this internal feeling and um

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Speaker 1: machine that does all the thoughts and prayers and roots

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Speaker 1: and like you're in that because I root for you

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Speaker 1: all the time, regardless of what it is. If if

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Speaker 1: it's you have so many you know, projects going on,

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Speaker 1: and we'll talk about obviously the record, which is great.

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Speaker 1: I feel like at this point if I and I'm

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Speaker 1: gonna say this person, i'mnna say very sincerely, it really

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Speaker 1: is wonderful than it really is wonderful. And we were

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Speaker 1: supposed to do this weeks ago and I got COVID

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Speaker 1: and you invited me over to your house whenever you

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Speaker 1: did a first showing, and I was somewhere. We just

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Speaker 1: have never We've just always like been off somewhere, and

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Speaker 1: so it really is wonderful. Now when I say that,

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Speaker 1: I would like to now take a step back and

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Speaker 1: go A lot of people think it's wonderful. And you

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Speaker 1: were so good at what you do. And I was

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Speaker 1: having a conversation with a couple of different people who

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Speaker 1: are really it was. One was Dan of Dan and Jay.

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Speaker 1: One was Carrie Underwood, and I was like, you guys

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Speaker 1: are so good. People don't want to tell you're, like, hey,

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Speaker 1: good job, because you're probably always here it all the time.

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Speaker 1: And that literally is how what I felt about you

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Speaker 1: before I said that. Now that being said, they both

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Speaker 1: were like, no, we still like to hear it because

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Speaker 1: we're human beings. But you guys are so good at it.

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Speaker 1: People like me feel ridiculous when we say hey, good job,

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Speaker 1: because we know that you know you did a good job,

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Speaker 1: even though I know the insecurity of creating something and

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Speaker 1: it's gonna come back around in a second. But I

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Speaker 1: was with a friend of mine the other day, um,

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Speaker 1: and we we hung out. He texts me. He goes, hey,

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Speaker 1: I just listened to I don't know what it was.

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Speaker 1: Something he said, Hey, that was really good, and I thought, man,

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Speaker 1: nobody ever tells me that I do good. And I went,

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Speaker 1: oh my god, this is why I have to tell

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Speaker 1: people they do good because I liked it, because nobody

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Speaker 1: ever tells me a good job and stuff because I

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Speaker 1: think they just think I hear it and I don't

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Speaker 1: hear it from anybody. Because so anyway, it's really freaking

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Speaker 1: good and you poured so much of your artistry and

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Speaker 1: yourself into it, and you should be really proud of it,

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Speaker 1: and I know you are, but I just want to

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Speaker 1: say that it's awesome. Thank you, and it means it

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Speaker 1: means the world truly. I on one hand, it's like, um,

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Speaker 1: I the d m s and the things like that

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Speaker 1: are a bit of a blur, um, But every time

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Speaker 1: I read one, I'm like, I mean it, truly, You're right,

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Speaker 1: it does mean something. And I never really, um, I

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Speaker 1: really never thought that this was going to be that

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Speaker 1: vulnerable of a thing because I thought I was just

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Speaker 1: doing it for me. But then when it came time

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Speaker 1: to put it out, everyone was like, this is so

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Speaker 1: brave and and I see what they mean. Um, But

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Speaker 1: it is fun to get to get those texts, and

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Speaker 1: I can feel, I can feel the connection with people

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Speaker 1: when they do reach out and say good job. You know. Um.

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Speaker 1: What I'm finding though the most is that people are

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Speaker 1: what it's doing. More than good job is people want

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Speaker 1: to tell me their story, which to me is the

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Speaker 1: ultimate win in this for me, you know, because I

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Speaker 1: keep saying that word connection today, but it seems like

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Speaker 1: that's what I'm getting out of it the most. Did

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Speaker 1: you feel And there are times when I felt this too,

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Speaker 1: but that you were being and people say brave that's

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Speaker 1: always weird thing. But vulnerable if you're being vulnerable in

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Speaker 1: your project that you thought, all right, I being vulnerable here,

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Speaker 1: people are gonna hear it, maybe they feel a certain

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Speaker 1: way about me after they hear it, and maybe they

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Speaker 1: feel differently about me. And I'm gonna be vulnerable and

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Speaker 1: we'll see how it turns out. But then in reality

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Speaker 1: it which is people going, no, I'm like you more

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Speaker 1: than more than you expected. And I think where I

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Speaker 1: felt that the most is how specific I was in

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Speaker 1: in like a song like Winner, I was like, no

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Speaker 1: one else is going to really care about this, but

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Speaker 1: I'm going to be so proud of it that I'm

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna this is where I'm gonna go with this record.

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Speaker 1: But it's just wild how many people. And it's not

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Speaker 1: just it's not the obvious character, you know, it's like

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Speaker 1: a fifty year old man. It's like, oh my gosh,

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Speaker 1: this made me think of this, and I'm like, really,

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Speaker 1: I thought no one would care about this. When I

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Speaker 1: wrote my first book, I'd written a lot of stuff

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Speaker 1: in there that I thought people were going to judge me.

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Speaker 1: And I was embarrassed, not of it, but I was

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Speaker 1: embarrassed that people would feel sorry for me. And that

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Speaker 1: has always been like my trauma is I got. You know,

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Speaker 1: it wasn't a charity. I wouldn't be here as a kid,

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Speaker 1: want to eat, to do anything. And I was so

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Speaker 1: embarrassed of this stuff, and I was like, man, nobody's

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Speaker 1: everybody's gonna think less than me or think differently, and

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Speaker 1: it all like you're saying, it's exactly what you're saying.

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Speaker 1: People were like, hey, uh yeah, that that's me too.

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Speaker 1: With always like a six degree difference, so it's always

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Speaker 1: very close but slightly a little different. But I was like, Man,

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Speaker 1: that to me opened up the world of being creatively

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Speaker 1: vulnerable and speaking from me. And you've written so many songs,

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Speaker 1: but they really haven't been from your face or mouth

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Speaker 1: or name, and you know that's got to be I

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Speaker 1: don't want to use the word pressure, but a different weight.

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Speaker 1: You know, whenever you're deciding to record or even want

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Speaker 1: lyrics to what to put in us on with you singing?

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Speaker 1: It like, was that a factor? It actually was easier

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Speaker 1: because I knew what I hadn't been able to say

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Speaker 1: all these years, because I was having to compromise. That's

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Speaker 1: interesting and collaborate, be so collaborative. Yeah, and um, it

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Speaker 1: didn't feel like pressure. It felt like creative freedom actually

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Speaker 1: more than anything. Um, even things like picking when a

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Speaker 1: record comes out, or like getting to put songs in

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Speaker 1: a sequence on a track list, like those are things

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Speaker 1: that people take for granted that songwriters have never gotten

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Speaker 1: to have that freedom and get to be creative in

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Speaker 1: that way. So from the get go it just felt like, oh, wow,

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Speaker 1: I have so many options. What didn't feel like pressure

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Speaker 1: at all. Brag on you to you a little bit

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Speaker 1: more like I would see even the imagery and the

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Speaker 1: promost promo pieces that you did to me, they were

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Speaker 1: even so much cooler than just the standard promo work.

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Speaker 1: But I would see it in the time and effort

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Speaker 1: that you went through to do it again, even just

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Speaker 1: as a passion piece, as you would say what it

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Speaker 1: was in your mind and what you're making it. It

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Speaker 1: was so heads and shoulders above what these what what

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Speaker 1: everybody else does? And I just would would look at

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Speaker 1: your prom but before I heard anything, maybe I heard

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Speaker 1: a clip of a couple, but even early, and I

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Speaker 1: was like, if you weren't doing the songwriting, if you

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Speaker 1: weren't putting out an art a record as an artist,

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Speaker 1: like you would totally dominate that space too, Like you

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Speaker 1: have some some gift of aesthetics. Thank you. I um,

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Speaker 1: I enjoy it, and I think it's the thing that

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Speaker 1: I don't have um any pressure around because it isn't

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Speaker 1: technically a part of my day job. Like I've always

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Speaker 1: loved editing video and editing photos, and like long before Instagram,

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Speaker 1: I wanted to have a video blog. And so I

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Speaker 1: think it's just like an extension of storytelling for me,

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Speaker 1: and I've never fully gotten to do that, Like I

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Speaker 1: start to get to be a part of the beginning

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Speaker 1: of telling a story with a song, and then the

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Speaker 1: artist takes it on and then they go make it

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Speaker 1: look how they wanted to look for them And I

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Speaker 1: didn't realize how hungry I was for that part of

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Speaker 1: the process until this started. And honestly, that was a

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Speaker 1: part of the process that felt really vulnerable because I

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Speaker 1: I think I think I found a safety in being

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Speaker 1: like a little bit behind the scenes, and I think

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Speaker 1: I had some I don't know, maybe some messaging early

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Speaker 1: on in my life that was like, don't get too

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Speaker 1: big for your bridges, which was like a Midwest, you know,

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Speaker 1: blue collar mentality that I think kept me in that

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Speaker 1: safe space and not really ever stepping out and putting

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Speaker 1: myself out front. So when it came time to go like, oh,

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Speaker 1: you're gonna put your photo on the front of this

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Speaker 1: this record, I was like, no, this is the scary part.

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Speaker 1: Now I have to own that this is about me. Um.

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Speaker 1: In fact, we the original creative concept for all the

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Speaker 1: visuals and aesthetic for the record was for me to

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Speaker 1: do selfie photos in all these different mirrors where you

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Speaker 1: never saw my face. It was just gonna be me

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Speaker 1: taking a photo of myself. But then you never saw

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Speaker 1: my face in the mirror because I again, I was

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Speaker 1: just not quite ready to sit there and show of

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Speaker 1: face and name and be like this is really about me.

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Speaker 1: But then then the project just took on a life

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Speaker 1: of its own once I got the creative the right

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Speaker 1: creative people around it. But now I'm kind of like,

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Speaker 1: I feel like I'm opened Pandora's box. I'm like, I

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Speaker 1: want to make more things like this. So, alright, you're

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Speaker 1: rich and and I definitely want to get to some

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Speaker 1: of this specifically, But you're rich and to make more things,

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Speaker 1: but you're also running a label, and you're also writing songs,

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Speaker 1: and you're also and I would never be someone to

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Speaker 1: say you can't do all these things, because I just

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Speaker 1: I wouldn't um. My company at times has said, hey,

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Speaker 1: you're you're doing too much. You're you know, you can't

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Speaker 1: focus enough here, and I don't agree with them at times.

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Speaker 1: At times they have been right. Mostly not, I've done,

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Speaker 1: in my opinion, really good job of putting the amount

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Speaker 1: of work into the project that needs to have the work.

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Speaker 1: How do you feel about that same situation happening to you.

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Speaker 1: I think the word that's like I keep going back

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Speaker 1: to was just integrity, because this conversation is coming up

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Speaker 1: a lot right now. People are asking me this question,

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Speaker 1: and I'm like, I just want to make my time

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Speaker 1: decisions based on integrity. If I've entered into a label

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Speaker 1: deal with someone, I want to handle that with integrity.

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Speaker 1: And when it comes to a point where I'm not

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Speaker 1: doing it that way anymore, than I need to make

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Speaker 1: a change, Um, when I'm not showing up for the

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Speaker 1: things that I've you know, committed to showing up too,

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Speaker 1: and I can't do that anymore, and then includes my

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Speaker 1: family too, like, um, But I think I think if

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Speaker 1: you had asked me a year ago about this record,

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Speaker 1: like what would you do to support it? I would

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Speaker 1: have had a pretty small answer and a safe answer

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Speaker 1: of like I'm gonna put it out and it's gonna

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Speaker 1: be precious, and it's gonna sit there on Spotify and

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Speaker 1: Apple and and I'll feel like this was for my

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Speaker 1: this was more for my legacy and for my like

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Speaker 1: bucket list, and and then I'll just go right back

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Speaker 1: to work a year later. Now now that it's been

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Speaker 1: out a few weeks, Um, I think I'm a lot

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Speaker 1: more honest with myself about how much energy and Tom

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Speaker 1: I'm gonna put into the record and promoting it because

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Speaker 1: I'm seeing what it's doing to people when they see

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Speaker 1: it or when they hear it, and so I feel

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Speaker 1: like I owe it out of integrity to that project

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Speaker 1: to give it all I've got UM and I don't.

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Speaker 1: And I think all things are connected. What is that

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Speaker 1: all ships rise or whatever that saying is raises all ships? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I did to check out half with that saying. But yes,

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Speaker 1: I think I think you and I are the same

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Speaker 1: and that we're like both and people like this is

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Speaker 1: going to make this stronger, and it's all gonna I'm

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Speaker 1: gonna learn things through this one process that I can then,

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Speaker 1: like I'm learning so much putting out my own album

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Speaker 1: that that I can bring back an offer to the

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Speaker 1: label side to be able to look at an artist

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Speaker 1: and say, I've actually done what you're doing, and I

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Speaker 1: have empathy and understanding UM and can tell you that

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Speaker 1: some more truths based on my experience as being an

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Speaker 1: artist myself. That's a unique tool that a lot of

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Speaker 1: other label exects don't have in their toolbox. So that's

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Speaker 1: how I look at it. I don't look at them

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Speaker 1: as as they're in competition with each other. I actually

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Speaker 1: look at it as if this could if this record

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Speaker 1: were too No matter where it goes, I'm going to

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Speaker 1: bring all the other people along with me. And that's

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Speaker 1: the point of Songs and Daughters. That's the point of

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Speaker 1: all of it. Now. The other thing I'm learning with

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Speaker 1: age that I'm sure that you have is that you

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Speaker 1: always have the permission to change your mind. And I

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Speaker 1: think as an opportunity, if there were a huge opportunity

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Speaker 1: to come up, I'm allowed to say, hey, I need

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Speaker 1: to take a break from something. I need to pull

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Speaker 1: back from writing for a month or two to do

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Speaker 1: this um. And I'm just trying to make those decisions

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Speaker 1: based on what matters. When I'm eighty years old and

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Speaker 1: I look back on this time, am I going to

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Speaker 1: kick myself that I didn't give my record all I

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Speaker 1: had because of twenty to thirty songs that I needed

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Speaker 1: to write this fall. I don't know. You know when

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Speaker 1: you mentioned with age with me, it was I don't know,

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Speaker 1: seven eight years ago when I was like, yeah, I

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Speaker 1: think the world doesn't mean it's a bad a way

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Speaker 1: like it's it's easily manipulated, not the people, But you

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Speaker 1: can bend it. We're always told it's got to be rigid.

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Speaker 1: This is how the world works, you gotta do it

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Speaker 1: this way. No, the more time I spend here, the

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Speaker 1: more I realize completely bendable. All the rules that you

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Speaker 1: know their rules because they've been set because other people

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Speaker 1: did them that way, but doesn't mean you have to

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Speaker 1: do And in most times you're gonna be unsuccessful if

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Speaker 1: you go against but it's a few times that you

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Speaker 1: are very successful that kind of creates a whole new

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Speaker 1: path for everybody else. And so that has been the thing,

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Speaker 1: and you know you're it's like preaching to the choir

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Speaker 1: when you say that stuff to me, and I say

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Speaker 1: it back to you, like the world's bendable. You can write,

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Speaker 1: and you can be over thirty and start artist's career,

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Speaker 1: or you can be It literally can be done, and

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Speaker 1: because it hasn't been done doesn't mean it won't be

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Speaker 1: done at a just a superior level. And I think

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Speaker 1: that even if you decided to quit after this, I

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Speaker 1: think that it's thing for people to see and go.

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Speaker 1: All I can do is create some good m HM.

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Speaker 1: At the end of the day, that's what it is.

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Speaker 1: Just create something good, and that is your extremely strong

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Speaker 1: base their strategic decisions you have to make. But but,

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Speaker 1: but there are so many people that aren't creating something

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Speaker 1: good but then have all the other stuff, or they

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Speaker 1: have something mediocre are pretty good. They're like, I can't

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Speaker 1: figure it out. You got if you can create something good,

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Speaker 1: you can almost go anywhere and do anything with it. No,

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Speaker 1: you're so right. I'm watching that happen right now, like

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Speaker 1: we've not been. You know how the music business, the

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Speaker 1: whole entertainment world is one big favor. Someone's asking someone

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Speaker 1: for a favor in return for a favor, and it

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Speaker 1: doesn't always look that way to the average consumer. But

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Speaker 1: that's a lot of the economics of our business. And

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Speaker 1: we have not been asking anyone for favors because we

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Speaker 1: just the goal was to put it out and to

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Speaker 1: make it exist, and that was a big enough goal

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Speaker 1: as it was with all the other things I had

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Speaker 1: going on. So then, so now I guess to your point,

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Speaker 1: it's kind of starting to work on its own, which

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Speaker 1: I think is what you're saying, Like you don't have

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Speaker 1: to scream about something if it speaks for itself. Um

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Speaker 1: So I'm I'm just curious right now to see, like

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Speaker 1: even justus. That's good. I think that's where I am.

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Speaker 1: Big picture. It's like, i feel satisfied that I did it,

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Speaker 1: and now I'm curious to see what else it's gonna do.

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Speaker 1: What do you want it to do? UM? I wanted

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Speaker 1: to be heard. I think that's because I feel kind

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Speaker 1: of what I on the back of what I just

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Speaker 1: said from what I've seen so far. When people hear

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Speaker 1: and see and when I say see what there's another

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Speaker 1: visual component of the album. There's a visual version of

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Speaker 1: the album that you can hit play that has not

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Speaker 1: been released yet. It's coming very soon. UM that I

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Speaker 1: think when we show people that or they hear the record, UM,

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Speaker 1: it's it. Um, people start telling other people about it

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Speaker 1: and they want to show it to other people, and

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Speaker 1: so I just want to. I just want people to.

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Speaker 1: I want people to have that experience because people are

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Speaker 1: you know, whether it's someone in my family or someone

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Speaker 1: in the music business that's seen the video or heard

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Speaker 1: the record, they start, Oh, it's it's doing this human

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Speaker 1: thing that's beyond the music business, which is making people

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Speaker 1: think about their own story in their own life. And

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Speaker 1: that's the heart of storytelling. So be honest with me,

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Speaker 1: For a second best case scenario in your mind before

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Speaker 1: you put it out, because best case can be you're

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Speaker 1: playing stadiums and you're like the ZAC attack and you're right,

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Speaker 1: I mean really that that that's always my best case

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Speaker 1: scenario with anything, Like I'm I show as popular, they

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Speaker 1: like me president like that. I have the biggest, wildest

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Speaker 1: best case scenarios, also have the worst worst case scenarios

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Speaker 1: where I die and somebody shoots me and it's like,

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Speaker 1: I'm on both sides. But you, as you're making the project,

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Speaker 1: what was best case scenario in your mind? Um? Wow?

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Speaker 1: As I was making it as big as I would

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Speaker 1: let myself go, was just to get it finished because

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Speaker 1: it was a fight. I was like clawing to get

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Speaker 1: it finished, Like why because my schedule it was nothing

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Speaker 1: and there's nothing convenient there were. I had every excuse

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Speaker 1: in the world and every reason in the world and

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Speaker 1: conflict in the world for this to never be finished.

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Speaker 1: It's a lot to write and make a record and

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Speaker 1: and to really be the driving force behind it. I

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Speaker 1: don't technically have. At the time, it was really just me.

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Speaker 1: No one else other than me and my producers knew

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Speaker 1: that I was doing it. No one was pushing it along,

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Speaker 1: giving me a deadline. It was all on me. UM,

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Speaker 1: So that was the goal when I was making it.

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Speaker 1: Now I would say, like best case scenario, you know,

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Speaker 1: like literally, like when a Grammy get nominated for a Grammy,

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Speaker 1: like those those kinds of things. UM, I would love

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Speaker 1: I would love for it to be commercially successful enough

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Speaker 1: to be able to, um do it again, you know,

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Speaker 1: and as you know, like there's a team around this. Now.

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Speaker 1: I've built a small, lean and mean team of pretty

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Speaker 1: young people that are doing a lot of this stuff

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Speaker 1: for the first time, and we're all learning as we go,

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Speaker 1: and I would love for them. I would love to

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Speaker 1: support that infrastructure so I to be successful, if for

401
00:20:02,160 --> 00:20:04,520
Speaker 1: nothing else, for that, so that we can keep doing this.

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Speaker 1: Why not put any of your artists on it as

403
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Speaker 1: a feature because it wasn't their story. Um. I felt

404
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Speaker 1: like I was so insular, just it was so many

405
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Speaker 1: of the ideas and concepts for this where I needed

406
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Speaker 1: to make it about me. And I know that sounds

407
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Speaker 1: kind of selfish, but there was this I was like,

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Speaker 1: that's why I've it's taken me twenty years to do

409
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Speaker 1: it was because I was so afraid to make it

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Speaker 1: too much about me. And that's something I think I've evolved.

411
00:20:40,440 --> 00:20:43,760
Speaker 1: I've grown through a lot of work and self awareness

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Speaker 1: and wisdom with age to realize that that's that's not um,

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Speaker 1: It's not a bad thing to make it about me.

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Speaker 1: What maha carew are doing me? I mean there's a

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Speaker 1: lot of me, um. But you know, by doing you right,

416
00:20:56,760 --> 00:21:00,720
Speaker 1: you can also do for others really right. Yeah, And

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Speaker 1: I do yes, UM. And I do trust myself that

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Speaker 1: if this word of growing too something much bigger, that

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Speaker 1: I have enough examples now in my career to look

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Speaker 1: back and say, anytime I've been elevated, I've looked for

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00:21:12,400 --> 00:21:16,640
Speaker 1: opportunities to elevate others. And so I trust myself with

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Speaker 1: the power that could potentially come with a project or

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Speaker 1: anything in my life getting bigger. Let's go to the

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Speaker 1: first song that you cut? Which one was the first?

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Speaker 1: You not not track one, so I don't want to

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00:21:28,520 --> 00:21:31,280
Speaker 1: go easy and go let's check out Torongolan, But which

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Speaker 1: one did you record first? And then I want to

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Speaker 1: talk about after it was done. I think we started Sunflower, Ah,

429
00:21:43,800 --> 00:21:47,280
Speaker 1: I think we started um Sunflower and Deathbed maybe around

430
00:21:47,359 --> 00:21:49,639
Speaker 1: the same time. They were the first ones to go

431
00:21:49,680 --> 00:21:52,199
Speaker 1: in and like sing on and put some production on.

432
00:21:52,359 --> 00:22:01,720
Speaker 1: Let's play Sunflower like crazy Chid you that you're super

433
00:22:04,600 --> 00:22:08,280
Speaker 1: that sick till's fun. I want to find place since

434
00:22:08,400 --> 00:22:13,240
Speaker 1: So you wrote that with Jimmy Robbins and Sasha Sloan

435
00:22:13,359 --> 00:22:16,439
Speaker 1: who were friends with Sasha and Henry. And she's just

436
00:22:17,040 --> 00:22:21,040
Speaker 1: she's freaking awesome. Um. So you know that song is

437
00:22:21,040 --> 00:22:23,520
Speaker 1: a little brighter than most of sasha songs. You know,

438
00:22:23,600 --> 00:22:25,560
Speaker 1: so you are you and Sasha friends? How did that

439
00:22:25,600 --> 00:22:29,200
Speaker 1: write come together? Sasha and I have become songwriting sisters

440
00:22:29,240 --> 00:22:32,240
Speaker 1: over the last i'd say three or four years. Um.

441
00:22:32,280 --> 00:22:35,480
Speaker 1: I was a super fan first um her. I heard

442
00:22:35,480 --> 00:22:37,760
Speaker 1: her song Thoughts, having no idea who she was, and

443
00:22:37,800 --> 00:22:41,280
Speaker 1: I was like, oh my god, I want everything about this. Um.

444
00:22:41,440 --> 00:22:44,080
Speaker 1: And then I wrote a few songs with her for

445
00:22:44,160 --> 00:22:46,560
Speaker 1: her for her records. UM. We wrote a song called

446
00:22:46,600 --> 00:22:48,800
Speaker 1: House with Them Mirrors and is It Just Me? That

447
00:22:48,880 --> 00:22:52,560
Speaker 1: has Charlie Pooth on it, and I hearded that one girl,

448
00:22:53,240 --> 00:22:58,280
Speaker 1: is it just me? I don't know that that sounds awesome?

449
00:22:58,359 --> 00:23:02,040
Speaker 1: Thank you? Yeah? I love right with her and she's um,

450
00:23:02,160 --> 00:23:05,360
Speaker 1: she's just so good. She's like this hidden gym in Nashville.

451
00:23:05,400 --> 00:23:09,000
Speaker 1: Nobody knows. She's like a hidden resource almost, but I

452
00:23:09,040 --> 00:23:10,960
Speaker 1: wrote a lot with her, and I think the thing

453
00:23:11,160 --> 00:23:13,280
Speaker 1: she has the most songs on this record, and it's

454
00:23:13,359 --> 00:23:17,280
Speaker 1: because the more the more I wanted to get human

455
00:23:17,400 --> 00:23:21,320
Speaker 1: and real and maybe daring with an idea. She was

456
00:23:21,359 --> 00:23:23,840
Speaker 1: the one that I felt safest to try that with

457
00:23:24,480 --> 00:23:26,520
Speaker 1: Um because she's one of those yes people that's like, yeah,

458
00:23:26,560 --> 00:23:28,800
Speaker 1: we could write anything, and she's kind of I think

459
00:23:28,960 --> 00:23:31,959
Speaker 1: our journeys to becoming artists were similar and that we

460
00:23:32,000 --> 00:23:33,919
Speaker 1: love writing with other people, but there were a lot

461
00:23:34,000 --> 00:23:35,800
Speaker 1: of things that we wanted. I think she would say

462
00:23:35,800 --> 00:23:38,520
Speaker 1: this too. There were topics that she wanted to write

463
00:23:38,520 --> 00:23:42,080
Speaker 1: about for herself that there were there weren't other artists

464
00:23:42,119 --> 00:23:43,600
Speaker 1: that she got to write about that with, and so

465
00:23:43,680 --> 00:23:46,400
Speaker 1: that's how she became Sasha Sloan. That's kind of how

466
00:23:46,440 --> 00:23:50,600
Speaker 1: I became firstborn. Um. I was just like, I want

467
00:23:50,640 --> 00:23:51,960
Speaker 1: to write a song about being tall, I want to

468
00:23:52,000 --> 00:23:54,640
Speaker 1: write a song about being a working mom. Like there's

469
00:23:54,680 --> 00:23:57,480
Speaker 1: nobody to write those things with. Is it easier to

470
00:23:58,600 --> 00:24:01,639
Speaker 1: vulnerable things? I think I know the answer here, but

471
00:24:01,920 --> 00:24:04,760
Speaker 1: with people that has been vulnerable with you when you're

472
00:24:04,760 --> 00:24:07,000
Speaker 1: writing things, and I kind of feel like that's a

473
00:24:07,000 --> 00:24:08,240
Speaker 1: bit of what you're saying that if you have with

474
00:24:08,280 --> 00:24:11,080
Speaker 1: Sasha she's like porner guts out, then you feel safer

475
00:24:11,119 --> 00:24:13,520
Speaker 1: to pour your guts out with her. Just on the

476
00:24:13,520 --> 00:24:17,040
Speaker 1: flip side of that, yeah, yeah, And I loved getting

477
00:24:17,080 --> 00:24:19,679
Speaker 1: to do some two ways two on this, like I

478
00:24:19,760 --> 00:24:21,760
Speaker 1: have Disney World with her, it's just the two of

479
00:24:21,840 --> 00:24:24,160
Speaker 1: us and younger women. Was just me and Hillary Lindsay.

480
00:24:24,200 --> 00:24:27,000
Speaker 1: And I think there's something even more intimate when it's

481
00:24:27,080 --> 00:24:29,280
Speaker 1: just two people in a room. It's funny. You look

482
00:24:29,320 --> 00:24:32,000
Speaker 1: at these like pop songs and there's twenty four writers

483
00:24:32,000 --> 00:24:34,240
Speaker 1: on them, and I'm like, could anyone really do like

484
00:24:34,280 --> 00:24:36,240
Speaker 1: a big deep dive on their feelings in that room?

485
00:24:36,320 --> 00:24:39,160
Speaker 1: It feels I think the less people and I think

486
00:24:39,200 --> 00:24:43,280
Speaker 1: that around the whole project, like the less input, it

487
00:24:43,400 --> 00:24:46,480
Speaker 1: was almost like the more real and the more aligned

488
00:24:46,560 --> 00:24:50,520
Speaker 1: everything could could be. I find if I'm writing jokes

489
00:24:50,600 --> 00:24:53,840
Speaker 1: or I'm writing something funny and there's more three or

490
00:24:53,840 --> 00:24:55,960
Speaker 1: four people in the room and only two of them laugh,

491
00:24:56,000 --> 00:25:00,240
Speaker 1: I'm like, oh, I must not be right. However, that's you. You. Actually,

492
00:25:00,280 --> 00:25:02,240
Speaker 1: if I'm with one person we're writing and they laugh hard,

493
00:25:02,280 --> 00:25:04,800
Speaker 1: that's just it. I just know one on one. They

494
00:25:04,800 --> 00:25:06,960
Speaker 1: were actually dialed in. They were listening with working together,

495
00:25:07,359 --> 00:25:10,119
Speaker 1: like that's funny, and I shouldn't base it because I

496
00:25:10,160 --> 00:25:12,400
Speaker 1: have the same issue on a much lower level obviously,

497
00:25:12,440 --> 00:25:16,800
Speaker 1: when I'm writing things to say on stage, and I

498
00:25:16,880 --> 00:25:18,879
Speaker 1: have tried to stop doing that as well, because I

499
00:25:18,960 --> 00:25:21,040
Speaker 1: can't judge on two people that don't laugh. We have

500
00:25:21,080 --> 00:25:23,119
Speaker 1: four people in a room. I like work with one

501
00:25:23,160 --> 00:25:24,919
Speaker 1: person and if they laugh, I just commit to it.

502
00:25:25,200 --> 00:25:27,359
Speaker 1: When you're creating, will you sometimes get so deep in

503
00:25:27,400 --> 00:25:30,800
Speaker 1: it that you don't know if it's good anymore? Yeah?

504
00:25:30,840 --> 00:25:32,719
Speaker 1: And I don't think I was that concerned with how

505
00:25:32,760 --> 00:25:34,840
Speaker 1: good it was. Okay, let me let me take the

506
00:25:34,880 --> 00:25:36,919
Speaker 1: word good back. That is a very generic word. I

507
00:25:37,000 --> 00:25:42,800
Speaker 1: meant for quality. If I'm doing something and I stand

508
00:25:42,840 --> 00:25:44,800
Speaker 1: in a long time, I'm like, oh, this sucks because

509
00:25:44,800 --> 00:25:47,880
Speaker 1: I can't Sometimes I'll lose it. I'll lose whatever that

510
00:25:48,200 --> 00:25:50,000
Speaker 1: instinctual thing that made me go for it. I go

511
00:25:50,119 --> 00:25:53,679
Speaker 1: this isn't funny or this isn't compelling. You've done it

512
00:25:53,720 --> 00:25:55,920
Speaker 1: at a high level for so long, either for others

513
00:25:56,000 --> 00:25:58,600
Speaker 1: or now yourself, do you get into that point where

514
00:25:58,600 --> 00:25:59,800
Speaker 1: you're you've been in it for a while and you're like,

515
00:25:59,840 --> 00:26:02,199
Speaker 1: is this even good anymore? Yeah, I think I'm a

516
00:26:02,200 --> 00:26:07,160
Speaker 1: pretty fast writer, um, And I think that that where

517
00:26:07,200 --> 00:26:09,600
Speaker 1: I tend to start to wonder if it's good is

518
00:26:09,640 --> 00:26:11,920
Speaker 1: if you get stuck on something for a long time,

519
00:26:12,000 --> 00:26:13,960
Speaker 1: like there's one line or there's one part of the

520
00:26:14,000 --> 00:26:16,639
Speaker 1: song that you just it's almost it almost feels like

521
00:26:16,800 --> 00:26:19,240
Speaker 1: a helicopter, where like the propeller has to just keep

522
00:26:19,280 --> 00:26:22,800
Speaker 1: moving for me too, for me to keep moving forward creatively.

523
00:26:22,880 --> 00:26:24,920
Speaker 1: But like once you get stuck on something for a

524
00:26:25,000 --> 00:26:29,439
Speaker 1: really long time, a lot of doubt creeps in and

525
00:26:30,040 --> 00:26:32,600
Speaker 1: it's almost like I just my brain turns into knots

526
00:26:33,080 --> 00:26:35,359
Speaker 1: and I can't And that's where I lose perspective, is

527
00:26:35,359 --> 00:26:37,520
Speaker 1: when you just get stuck on one thing. So I'm

528
00:26:37,560 --> 00:26:40,240
Speaker 1: more like, Okay, let's just keep bouncing around to get

529
00:26:40,240 --> 00:26:42,960
Speaker 1: these parts that we know can work. Because when I say,

530
00:26:43,040 --> 00:26:44,439
Speaker 1: there are some people that want to sit there and

531
00:26:44,480 --> 00:26:48,520
Speaker 1: grind for six or seven hours on an idea, and

532
00:26:48,560 --> 00:26:53,040
Speaker 1: it's almost like almost feels like masochistic. I mean, it

533
00:26:53,040 --> 00:26:54,720
Speaker 1: feels like we gotta just sit there. It has to

534
00:26:54,760 --> 00:26:58,080
Speaker 1: be difficult in order for it to be good. And

535
00:26:58,119 --> 00:27:00,160
Speaker 1: I'm I'm more of kind of like, let's just oh,

536
00:27:00,280 --> 00:27:04,280
Speaker 1: let's just keep it moving, um, because when it slows down,

537
00:27:04,320 --> 00:27:07,199
Speaker 1: I I lose perspective and I'm like, uh, why are

538
00:27:07,200 --> 00:27:16,160
Speaker 1: we even doing this? Replaying some the death bed, which

539
00:27:16,200 --> 00:27:33,320
Speaker 1: is the same three writers here, any symbolism gonna be

540
00:27:33,359 --> 00:27:37,119
Speaker 1: the last track? You think? Yes, I knew. I actually

541
00:27:37,119 --> 00:27:40,040
Speaker 1: made the track list for the record, um before I

542
00:27:40,080 --> 00:27:43,240
Speaker 1: wrote any of the songs. Um, they made the track

543
00:27:43,320 --> 00:27:45,520
Speaker 1: list for the Okay, you can't just say that and

544
00:27:45,560 --> 00:27:47,840
Speaker 1: walk away from it. You wrote the track list of

545
00:27:47,920 --> 00:27:51,920
Speaker 1: the record before you wrote the songs, Okay, now please

546
00:27:51,960 --> 00:27:54,040
Speaker 1: explain how you did that. So I thought about it

547
00:27:54,080 --> 00:27:56,000
Speaker 1: like a book, because I've been saying this is kind

548
00:27:56,040 --> 00:27:58,119
Speaker 1: of like a memoir, which was the purpose was to

549
00:27:58,400 --> 00:28:01,480
Speaker 1: leave my story from my kids until now right. And

550
00:28:01,560 --> 00:28:05,480
Speaker 1: so I had the idea for Firstborn in I've realized.

551
00:28:05,480 --> 00:28:07,359
Speaker 1: I was like, oh, twenty two is my lucky number.

552
00:28:07,520 --> 00:28:10,520
Speaker 1: I wonder when my birthday is on seven twenty two,

553
00:28:10,760 --> 00:28:13,600
Speaker 1: And it was a Friday, and on that day I

554
00:28:13,640 --> 00:28:16,480
Speaker 1: was like, I'm putting out a record that day. It

555
00:28:16,560 --> 00:28:18,919
Speaker 1: was as simple as that is so weird. But so

556
00:28:19,000 --> 00:28:21,680
Speaker 1: then the idea for Firstborn came a couple of months later,

557
00:28:22,359 --> 00:28:25,760
Speaker 1: I screenshot it and wrote out Firstborn Nicole galleon seven

558
00:28:25,800 --> 00:28:28,720
Speaker 1: twenty two, and I texted that screenshot to like three

559
00:28:28,800 --> 00:28:31,879
Speaker 1: or four people and like of my close friends, not

560
00:28:31,960 --> 00:28:33,680
Speaker 1: even really in the music business, and I'm like, I'm

561
00:28:33,680 --> 00:28:37,200
Speaker 1: putting out a record this day accountability, and that makes

562
00:28:37,200 --> 00:28:39,640
Speaker 1: it feel real to me and even aesthetically to see it.

563
00:28:39,680 --> 00:28:41,480
Speaker 1: I just made it like in a note or something.

564
00:28:41,880 --> 00:28:45,120
Speaker 1: So then from there I gave myself, um all of

565
00:28:45,880 --> 00:28:47,760
Speaker 1: one So I said, I'm not even going to think

566
00:28:47,800 --> 00:28:50,840
Speaker 1: about it until January one, and I'll have it finished

567
00:28:50,880 --> 00:28:53,920
Speaker 1: by the end of twenty one. So when January came around,

568
00:28:54,040 --> 00:28:57,000
Speaker 1: I it's almost like I had invited these ideas to

569
00:28:57,080 --> 00:28:59,200
Speaker 1: kind of come to me, and I started to write

570
00:28:59,240 --> 00:29:01,960
Speaker 1: down these titles. UM. I had like a bit of

571
00:29:01,960 --> 00:29:05,520
Speaker 1: a creative burst, as I would say, and just started

572
00:29:05,560 --> 00:29:09,520
Speaker 1: thinking of all these keywords like sunflower, UM, younger, woman,

573
00:29:09,640 --> 00:29:11,640
Speaker 1: like things that I'm like, that's somehow tied to my

574
00:29:11,720 --> 00:29:15,840
Speaker 1: life UM, and I just kept and then I compiled

575
00:29:15,920 --> 00:29:17,440
Speaker 1: them and then I put them in where they would

576
00:29:17,440 --> 00:29:19,760
Speaker 1: live in my life. Winner obviously being first because I'm

577
00:29:19,760 --> 00:29:23,240
Speaker 1: born in winter, deathbed being last because that's the end.

578
00:29:24,240 --> 00:29:26,560
Speaker 1: UM and filled in the blanks in the middle, and

579
00:29:26,600 --> 00:29:28,560
Speaker 1: then I just kind of ruminated on them for like

580
00:29:29,760 --> 00:29:31,640
Speaker 1: a month or two as I was living in my

581
00:29:31,680 --> 00:29:34,160
Speaker 1: hometown in Kansas at this at this point, so I

582
00:29:34,200 --> 00:29:36,800
Speaker 1: was like going for jogs in my hometown, seeing the

583
00:29:36,840 --> 00:29:40,760
Speaker 1: old houses I grew up in and so um. Once

584
00:29:40,800 --> 00:29:43,880
Speaker 1: I kind of concepted what each word, like, what what

585
00:29:44,040 --> 00:29:47,040
Speaker 1: is some What what does sunflower mean to me? You know?

586
00:29:47,240 --> 00:29:49,080
Speaker 1: What is the meaning of that? Once I did that

587
00:29:49,160 --> 00:29:52,040
Speaker 1: to all the songs, then I wrote out the writers

588
00:29:52,520 --> 00:29:58,640
Speaker 1: beside them as if the song was finished Winner McNally, Osborne, Sunflower,

589
00:30:00,040 --> 00:30:04,360
Speaker 1: Robin's Sloan. No, Yeah, I did. And then I called

590
00:30:04,360 --> 00:30:07,120
Speaker 1: my friends and I said, I like, I called Sasha

591
00:30:07,360 --> 00:30:10,479
Speaker 1: and Jimmy first. Jimmy was always in on this from

592
00:30:10,520 --> 00:30:13,520
Speaker 1: the beginning. He's been the one that was like, when

593
00:30:13,520 --> 00:30:16,080
Speaker 1: are when are we starting? I don't have to produce it,

594
00:30:16,120 --> 00:30:18,160
Speaker 1: but I'm helping you do this, like you know, and

595
00:30:18,200 --> 00:30:21,240
Speaker 1: he obviously was going to always be a producer. But

596
00:30:21,440 --> 00:30:22,880
Speaker 1: I called them and I'm like, I got a couple

597
00:30:22,920 --> 00:30:26,600
Speaker 1: of ideas, and then I just started texting back and

598
00:30:26,600 --> 00:30:28,720
Speaker 1: forth with Sasha like what if Sunflower was this? And

599
00:30:28,800 --> 00:30:31,240
Speaker 1: she'd hit me back, like what if it was this

600
00:30:31,360 --> 00:30:34,280
Speaker 1: and what if you were you know, superpower with Sunflower

601
00:30:34,360 --> 00:30:38,040
Speaker 1: And so we had like skeletons of the ideas once

602
00:30:38,120 --> 00:30:41,960
Speaker 1: I showed up for the right But I have screenshots

603
00:30:41,960 --> 00:30:44,680
Speaker 1: in my phone of the whole track list with all

604
00:30:44,720 --> 00:30:47,400
Speaker 1: the potential, like the writers I wanted to write it with,

605
00:30:47,520 --> 00:30:50,240
Speaker 1: and it didn't end up being exactly that I would

606
00:30:50,240 --> 00:30:54,120
Speaker 1: say of what the record is ended up being that way.

607
00:30:54,160 --> 00:30:57,440
Speaker 1: But I think that was also me like just being

608
00:30:57,520 --> 00:31:00,400
Speaker 1: hungry for that part of the process, you know, writing

609
00:31:00,400 --> 00:31:02,200
Speaker 1: pieces like I get to write all the time, but

610
00:31:02,280 --> 00:31:04,840
Speaker 1: getting to create a body of work I've never really

611
00:31:04,840 --> 00:31:07,280
Speaker 1: gotten to do. So that part was I think the

612
00:31:07,320 --> 00:31:09,520
Speaker 1: part that I was most excited about. Well, if the

613
00:31:09,560 --> 00:31:11,560
Speaker 1: word power ball comes to you and some numbers afterward

614
00:31:11,600 --> 00:31:14,440
Speaker 1: takes out to me, just to send that over and

615
00:31:14,480 --> 00:31:18,200
Speaker 1: that that would be awesome. Your hometown in Kansas, you're

616
00:31:18,760 --> 00:31:20,600
Speaker 1: you know, you're very proud of it. You go you

617
00:31:20,640 --> 00:31:22,680
Speaker 1: live there for part of the year. Still I'm assuming, right,

618
00:31:22,680 --> 00:31:25,040
Speaker 1: you know, I know you did. Um, So when you

619
00:31:25,080 --> 00:31:28,560
Speaker 1: go back, how do they treat you there? Um? Like

620
00:31:28,880 --> 00:31:31,400
Speaker 1: they have no idea what I do? Almost um? And

621
00:31:31,440 --> 00:31:34,960
Speaker 1: I think that's why I love it so much. Um,

622
00:31:35,120 --> 00:31:37,200
Speaker 1: they know me now because we lived there for a

623
00:31:37,280 --> 00:31:38,640
Speaker 1: year and a half. They know me now more as

624
00:31:38,720 --> 00:31:43,400
Speaker 1: like Charlie and Ford's mom. You know. Um we lived

625
00:31:43,440 --> 00:31:45,080
Speaker 1: there for a year and a half. And the last

626
00:31:45,120 --> 00:31:49,200
Speaker 1: week that I was there, Um, I was on this

627
00:31:49,520 --> 00:31:53,960
Speaker 1: CMT like camp Fire Sessions or something with Kelsey Ballerini

628
00:31:54,040 --> 00:31:57,200
Speaker 1: and it was on TV and it just happened to

629
00:31:57,200 --> 00:31:58,800
Speaker 1: be on a night that I was getting together with

630
00:31:58,840 --> 00:32:01,840
Speaker 1: some of like all my mom girl friends there and

631
00:32:01,880 --> 00:32:04,360
Speaker 1: so we ended up watching it and they were like, now,

632
00:32:05,040 --> 00:32:07,080
Speaker 1: this is so cool, but why are you on here? Not?

633
00:32:07,200 --> 00:32:09,120
Speaker 1: Can you explain to us why exactly she would ask

634
00:32:09,120 --> 00:32:12,320
Speaker 1: you to be on here? And it was so refreshing

635
00:32:12,440 --> 00:32:13,880
Speaker 1: because I had been there for a year and a

636
00:32:13,920 --> 00:32:16,000
Speaker 1: half and they know I'm in the music business, but

637
00:32:16,720 --> 00:32:20,040
Speaker 1: this niche thing of being a songwriter and being behind

638
00:32:20,120 --> 00:32:23,640
Speaker 1: the scenes is it's kind of hard to explain, and

639
00:32:23,720 --> 00:32:27,040
Speaker 1: so I'm not treated any differently. I don't think you'd

640
00:32:27,080 --> 00:32:28,840
Speaker 1: have to ask other people there if they think that

641
00:32:28,920 --> 00:32:31,760
Speaker 1: I am or not to get the true answer. But

642
00:32:31,800 --> 00:32:34,000
Speaker 1: it's almost the opposite where I think people are kind

643
00:32:34,000 --> 00:32:37,760
Speaker 1: of like, nah, don't forget that you're just we remember

644
00:32:37,840 --> 00:32:40,440
Speaker 1: you as sixteen, don't get too big for your bridges.

645
00:32:41,080 --> 00:32:43,520
Speaker 1: So it's a weird and I would even say if

646
00:32:43,520 --> 00:32:45,320
Speaker 1: you put them beside each other, a red juxtaposition of

647
00:32:45,560 --> 00:32:49,280
Speaker 1: I go home, same situation. But also at the same time,

648
00:32:49,320 --> 00:32:51,320
Speaker 1: I don't believe their bridge is big enough to hold me.

649
00:32:52,600 --> 00:32:55,640
Speaker 1: So it's like I have to not be too big

650
00:32:55,680 --> 00:32:57,520
Speaker 1: for my bridges at home because they will tell me

651
00:32:57,840 --> 00:33:01,320
Speaker 1: and they're right. But I also again, there are no

652
00:33:01,360 --> 00:33:04,200
Speaker 1: bridges that I feel like can restrain me in any way.

653
00:33:04,600 --> 00:33:06,960
Speaker 1: And sometimes I miss you know, I'm a little wrong

654
00:33:07,000 --> 00:33:10,280
Speaker 1: sometimes on both sides. Uh, But it's coming from a

655
00:33:10,320 --> 00:33:14,760
Speaker 1: small town like you did. It is definitely when I

656
00:33:14,800 --> 00:33:17,400
Speaker 1: go back to Mountain Pine or Hot Springs, it's definitely

657
00:33:17,480 --> 00:33:21,360
Speaker 1: that it's a reset almost and a reminder of don't

658
00:33:21,400 --> 00:33:23,880
Speaker 1: forget now you can dream as big as you want,

659
00:33:23,880 --> 00:33:26,479
Speaker 1: but don't forget where you came from. Your hometown has

660
00:33:26,480 --> 00:33:29,800
Speaker 1: how many people? And what kind of you went to school?

661
00:33:29,880 --> 00:33:31,440
Speaker 1: Was your was that was your school in your town?

662
00:33:32,280 --> 00:33:34,800
Speaker 1: And well how big was the school I graduated with?

663
00:33:34,840 --> 00:33:38,400
Speaker 1: Thirty eight in my grade? That's pretty small? Pretty small? Yeah,

664
00:33:39,120 --> 00:33:41,560
Speaker 1: I think you say reset. I think what it brings

665
00:33:41,600 --> 00:33:45,040
Speaker 1: me is perspective, you know, And I um, no one's

666
00:33:45,080 --> 00:33:47,880
Speaker 1: actively trying to bring me down, But I think what

667
00:33:47,960 --> 00:33:49,440
Speaker 1: it is when I sit on my porch there and

668
00:33:49,440 --> 00:33:52,000
Speaker 1: I watched my neighbors mowing their yard or the kids, right,

669
00:33:52,080 --> 00:33:55,480
Speaker 1: I'm like, they don't give a crap about the music business,

670
00:33:55,480 --> 00:33:58,520
Speaker 1: and it allows me to get out of the bubble

671
00:33:58,560 --> 00:34:01,520
Speaker 1: of it and to go don't take it all that seriously.

672
00:34:01,720 --> 00:34:03,960
Speaker 1: We all get all up in this business of music

673
00:34:04,040 --> 00:34:07,160
Speaker 1: and we think that it's the whole world. There's when

674
00:34:07,200 --> 00:34:09,920
Speaker 1: you go back there, it's like nobody cares, you know.

675
00:34:10,040 --> 00:34:11,879
Speaker 1: And I think they love the music when it comes

676
00:34:11,880 --> 00:34:14,680
Speaker 1: through the radio speakers and what the music means in

677
00:34:14,719 --> 00:34:17,120
Speaker 1: their life. But all this ego stuff that happens behind,

678
00:34:17,239 --> 00:34:19,719
Speaker 1: you know, in the conflict and like the who got

679
00:34:19,760 --> 00:34:23,560
Speaker 1: what in Nashville, it just I call bs on all

680
00:34:23,600 --> 00:34:26,080
Speaker 1: of it when I go home, and that's it's really refreshing,

681
00:34:26,400 --> 00:34:29,120
Speaker 1: and for me, it's a reminder of what like real

682
00:34:29,160 --> 00:34:31,200
Speaker 1: life folks do, not the dumb craft that I do

683
00:34:31,280 --> 00:34:33,640
Speaker 1: all the time, which I'm like because I can. I'm

684
00:34:33,640 --> 00:34:36,200
Speaker 1: in a room five hours a day for five days

685
00:34:36,200 --> 00:34:38,640
Speaker 1: a week, and then I'm usually on a plane going

686
00:34:38,719 --> 00:34:41,040
Speaker 1: to do a TV show or do some comedy, and

687
00:34:41,120 --> 00:34:46,400
Speaker 1: I don't unless I'm purposefully going back into the real world,

688
00:34:46,719 --> 00:34:48,080
Speaker 1: I don't ever get to it, not because I don't

689
00:34:48,120 --> 00:34:50,080
Speaker 1: want to, because I just stretched myself so freaking thin.

690
00:34:50,280 --> 00:34:52,560
Speaker 1: The good thing about being married is she makes me

691
00:34:52,600 --> 00:34:54,960
Speaker 1: do that, and not in a way of like you must.

692
00:34:55,040 --> 00:34:57,040
Speaker 1: But we spent four days in Oklahoma with their family,

693
00:34:57,200 --> 00:35:00,080
Speaker 1: who were great, But that's a it's just it's a

694
00:35:00,080 --> 00:35:03,000
Speaker 1: whole different world and one that I'm so grateful that

695
00:35:03,080 --> 00:35:05,480
Speaker 1: I have because we're just in a small town in Oklahoma,

696
00:35:05,960 --> 00:35:09,719
Speaker 1: going to the lake, cooking dinner, going to Chili's, and

697
00:35:09,800 --> 00:35:12,880
Speaker 1: that is that's just it. And and again it just

698
00:35:13,200 --> 00:35:16,040
Speaker 1: for me is uh, it takes me a little bit

699
00:35:16,040 --> 00:35:18,120
Speaker 1: of a little bit out of my my opic vision

700
00:35:18,120 --> 00:35:21,120
Speaker 1: of just what I only see for me and for

701
00:35:21,200 --> 00:35:23,480
Speaker 1: what we're doing here. But I think that's so refreshing

702
00:35:23,520 --> 00:35:26,399
Speaker 1: about just what you do generally and even not even

703
00:35:26,480 --> 00:35:31,839
Speaker 1: just this project, but what you promote almost universally, which

704
00:35:31,880 --> 00:35:35,040
Speaker 1: is that they're just going back to Kansas and that

705
00:35:35,080 --> 00:35:38,680
Speaker 1: can be a metaphor for anything, and you know, everywhere.

706
00:35:39,160 --> 00:35:42,760
Speaker 1: But and it's represented pretty well inside of this record too.

707
00:35:43,239 --> 00:35:46,640
Speaker 1: And I'm assuming that was very important to you. Yeah,

708
00:35:46,920 --> 00:35:50,080
Speaker 1: I am. It's funny. I think people would have probably

709
00:35:50,120 --> 00:35:52,600
Speaker 1: guess the overender on how many hometown songs would have

710
00:35:52,600 --> 00:35:56,920
Speaker 1: been on here, but because I'm like notorious for overwriting

711
00:35:56,960 --> 00:35:59,759
Speaker 1: about how much I love my hometown, but there aren't

712
00:35:59,800 --> 00:36:03,880
Speaker 1: really any hometown songs on the record. But that town

713
00:36:03,920 --> 00:36:07,759
Speaker 1: made me some of the things that you're some of

714
00:36:07,760 --> 00:36:11,920
Speaker 1: the songs are about we're created in a town like yours. Yeah, yeah,

715
00:36:12,040 --> 00:36:14,080
Speaker 1: that I was made in that town. So if you're

716
00:36:14,080 --> 00:36:15,880
Speaker 1: write about how I was, how I came to be,

717
00:36:16,040 --> 00:36:20,200
Speaker 1: you're indirectly writing about Sterling, Kansas. And I think to

718
00:36:20,320 --> 00:36:22,920
Speaker 1: your point, I love like when you were saying Chili's

719
00:36:23,040 --> 00:36:25,040
Speaker 1: Lake cook out, I'm like, oh, yes, it's like a

720
00:36:25,160 --> 00:36:28,600
Speaker 1: drug to me, Like oh normal, normal, But even more

721
00:36:28,640 --> 00:36:31,279
Speaker 1: than that, it's like, as you and you know this

722
00:36:31,400 --> 00:36:34,080
Speaker 1: better than anyone in town. The more successful you have,

723
00:36:34,200 --> 00:36:38,279
Speaker 1: the more it starts to revolve around you. And it's

724
00:36:38,440 --> 00:36:41,960
Speaker 1: nice to go somewhere where it doesn't revolve around you.

725
00:36:42,040 --> 00:36:44,600
Speaker 1: And I'm sure to some people that sounds like really

726
00:36:44,640 --> 00:36:47,239
Speaker 1: attractive to have things revolve around you, but it's nice

727
00:36:47,280 --> 00:36:50,560
Speaker 1: and it's like nobody, nobody cares what my schedule is

728
00:36:50,640 --> 00:36:53,560
Speaker 1: their whole. They have a whole world that operates without me.

729
00:36:53,600 --> 00:36:56,520
Speaker 1: In Sterling, Kansas. That town is doing just fine without

730
00:36:56,520 --> 00:36:59,440
Speaker 1: me being there. So it's nice to go and kind

731
00:36:59,440 --> 00:37:01,279
Speaker 1: of get humble done that way. Yeah, it's funny you

732
00:37:01,320 --> 00:37:03,520
Speaker 1: say that. I was doing an interview with some I

733
00:37:03,640 --> 00:37:06,200
Speaker 1: was doing press for my Snake in the Grass show

734
00:37:06,239 --> 00:37:09,200
Speaker 1: and they were asking about my wife, And it's funny.

735
00:37:09,239 --> 00:37:11,120
Speaker 1: What you what? You just said? What I was like,

736
00:37:11,120 --> 00:37:12,359
Speaker 1: you know, I used to think I was the sun,

737
00:37:13,440 --> 00:37:15,120
Speaker 1: just because I've been the sun for so long. Either

738
00:37:15,120 --> 00:37:17,600
Speaker 1: I'm grinding it out trying to feel like I'm a son,

739
00:37:18,200 --> 00:37:20,600
Speaker 1: or once you get to a point, everything just starts.

740
00:37:22,040 --> 00:37:25,479
Speaker 1: It's all it's orbiting you all the things. And I said,

741
00:37:25,520 --> 00:37:29,840
Speaker 1: but now that I have a wife and her family,

742
00:37:30,200 --> 00:37:32,759
Speaker 1: and I said, I'm just a comment, I'm not even

743
00:37:32,760 --> 00:37:36,879
Speaker 1: a freaking planet anymore. And that's awesome. It's a it's

744
00:37:36,920 --> 00:37:41,960
Speaker 1: a different pressure. It's a lesser pressure in ways, but

745
00:37:41,960 --> 00:37:43,480
Speaker 1: it's a more pressure in other ways that I'm not

746
00:37:43,520 --> 00:37:45,680
Speaker 1: good at. That. Being a human is tough for me.

747
00:37:46,200 --> 00:37:47,960
Speaker 1: Like I think I was very human for a whole

748
00:37:47,960 --> 00:37:49,440
Speaker 1: long time and then I just kind of checked out.

749
00:37:49,480 --> 00:37:50,680
Speaker 1: I was like, I don't be human anymore of the

750
00:37:50,719 --> 00:37:53,600
Speaker 1: stucks this this is uh, this hurts. So what did

751
00:37:53,600 --> 00:37:56,239
Speaker 1: you turn into? If you were cyborg that just works

752
00:37:56,280 --> 00:37:58,879
Speaker 1: all the time and has no room for anything at

753
00:37:58,880 --> 00:38:02,520
Speaker 1: all ever, and so but now that human is starting

754
00:38:02,560 --> 00:38:04,960
Speaker 1: to like crack out of it again, just like coming out.

755
00:38:05,080 --> 00:38:07,040
Speaker 1: But I think that's what your your music is too.

756
00:38:07,040 --> 00:38:12,799
Speaker 1: It's like it's so human and you're so specific. Like

757
00:38:12,880 --> 00:38:16,200
Speaker 1: I think that's just what makes the project obviously there

758
00:38:16,400 --> 00:38:18,200
Speaker 1: that when you double meaning words and you have a

759
00:38:18,800 --> 00:38:20,960
Speaker 1: you know, your pre court, all of the technical stuff

760
00:38:21,000 --> 00:38:22,640
Speaker 1: you're great at, You've done that so many times. But

761
00:38:22,719 --> 00:38:27,560
Speaker 1: it's how distinctly specific you are that allows people to

762
00:38:28,200 --> 00:38:30,840
Speaker 1: feel and understand in their own specific way, which is

763
00:38:30,880 --> 00:38:32,279
Speaker 1: weird because they can have You can say something really

764
00:38:32,280 --> 00:38:34,560
Speaker 1: specific and somebody else relates in a super specific way

765
00:38:34,680 --> 00:38:37,680
Speaker 1: that's not exactly your way, but they still find a

766
00:38:37,760 --> 00:38:40,320
Speaker 1: relation to it. So I think that's really the power

767
00:38:40,360 --> 00:38:41,880
Speaker 1: of the project. But that's just my opinion. What do

768
00:38:41,960 --> 00:38:44,640
Speaker 1: I Everybody's gonna have an opinion and feel differently about it,

769
00:38:44,680 --> 00:38:48,440
Speaker 1: But I feel like it's so human and it's so

770
00:38:49,840 --> 00:38:52,479
Speaker 1: at times, the won would be the word I would

771
00:38:52,520 --> 00:38:56,839
Speaker 1: use for this because if I'm being extremely vulnerable, it's

772
00:38:56,880 --> 00:39:00,800
Speaker 1: not always it's my best, but it's not always my

773
00:39:00,960 --> 00:39:04,080
Speaker 1: prettiest representation because it's real. And I think some of

774
00:39:04,120 --> 00:39:06,279
Speaker 1: your songs are so real that you had to go

775
00:39:06,800 --> 00:39:09,640
Speaker 1: all right, I'm gonna check out of being cool and

776
00:39:09,719 --> 00:39:11,640
Speaker 1: Nicole who runs label, I gotta be the person that's

777
00:39:11,640 --> 00:39:14,799
Speaker 1: got a lot of insecurities here. Yeah. I think it

778
00:39:14,880 --> 00:39:17,920
Speaker 1: was therapy doing it. I think it. You know, people

779
00:39:17,960 --> 00:39:20,080
Speaker 1: probably sound like it's some pr sound by it for

780
00:39:20,120 --> 00:39:21,920
Speaker 1: me for me to be like, no, I did this

781
00:39:21,960 --> 00:39:24,439
Speaker 1: for me and my family. I mean, I really did.

782
00:39:24,600 --> 00:39:29,480
Speaker 1: I It wasn't I really there was no performance element

783
00:39:29,880 --> 00:39:32,359
Speaker 1: to it because I don't really I think I don't

784
00:39:32,520 --> 00:39:34,560
Speaker 1: really know how to perform. Have you been practicing and

785
00:39:34,600 --> 00:39:38,520
Speaker 1: performing when you've played song you've sang publicly? So I

786
00:39:38,520 --> 00:39:41,239
Speaker 1: don't want to say, but have you know eventually you'll

787
00:39:41,280 --> 00:39:45,080
Speaker 1: probably have to do well. That being said, let me

788
00:39:45,080 --> 00:39:46,960
Speaker 1: just say I didn't even think about this. I called

789
00:39:47,000 --> 00:39:48,000
Speaker 1: you a few days ago and I was like, Hey,

790
00:39:48,000 --> 00:39:49,600
Speaker 1: I'm gonna go host the Todays show for a few days,

791
00:39:49,600 --> 00:39:51,480
Speaker 1: which haven't even announced yet. But if this beats it,

792
00:39:51,520 --> 00:39:53,440
Speaker 1: I don't care and I said hey. They asked me, like,

793
00:39:53,480 --> 00:39:55,120
Speaker 1: who do you want to bring anybody up here to

794
00:39:55,120 --> 00:39:58,560
Speaker 1: play the show? And I just made sure you were available,

795
00:39:58,560 --> 00:40:00,080
Speaker 1: and I said, I gave him your name first so

796
00:40:00,080 --> 00:40:01,399
Speaker 1: they could probably call you. I don't know if I'm

797
00:40:01,400 --> 00:40:02,840
Speaker 1: gonna call you, but I said that because I was

798
00:40:02,840 --> 00:40:05,080
Speaker 1: also scared they're gonna be like we decided to go

799
00:40:05,120 --> 00:40:07,759
Speaker 1: all rap, we gonna do all polka. But they said

800
00:40:07,760 --> 00:40:10,239
Speaker 1: who do you want? And I very first said to you,

801
00:40:10,680 --> 00:40:11,920
Speaker 1: And so then I was like, oh crap, let me

802
00:40:11,920 --> 00:40:15,920
Speaker 1: make sure she can do it. But then you may

803
00:40:15,920 --> 00:40:17,960
Speaker 1: be wrong. But then you said, I haven't really have

804
00:40:17,960 --> 00:40:20,920
Speaker 1: a performed on TV. Have you perform on TV well

805
00:40:21,040 --> 00:40:27,240
Speaker 1: as yourself? No? Not really mm hmm no. And I'm

806
00:40:27,280 --> 00:40:29,520
Speaker 1: every time I do something for the first time around

807
00:40:29,520 --> 00:40:32,799
Speaker 1: this project, it ends up being better than I ever

808
00:40:32,840 --> 00:40:35,239
Speaker 1: thought that it could be. So now I'm almost just

809
00:40:35,280 --> 00:40:38,480
Speaker 1: like looking for that next first, you know, I'm like, oh,

810
00:40:38,680 --> 00:40:40,640
Speaker 1: so when you called me first of all, I was like,

811
00:40:41,239 --> 00:40:42,719
Speaker 1: I was in I was at a co write and

812
00:40:42,760 --> 00:40:45,440
Speaker 1: I went into the bathroom and I was like, oh

813
00:40:45,560 --> 00:40:48,000
Speaker 1: my gosh, like trying to like play my play cool

814
00:40:48,040 --> 00:40:51,719
Speaker 1: because I like I saw your text in the co write. Um,

815
00:40:51,760 --> 00:40:53,120
Speaker 1: I was ready. I forget who I was with, like

816
00:40:53,200 --> 00:40:57,000
Speaker 1: Jimmy Robbins somebody, and I was like, don't be a jerk,

817
00:40:58,080 --> 00:41:00,319
Speaker 1: and like I immediately just wanted to Like my mom

818
00:41:00,360 --> 00:41:03,080
Speaker 1: would be like even if I don't get on there,

819
00:41:03,080 --> 00:41:06,319
Speaker 1: probably thought of me. But I was in a rite

820
00:41:06,360 --> 00:41:08,680
Speaker 1: and I couldn't. So I just went to the bathroom

821
00:41:08,719 --> 00:41:11,520
Speaker 1: and then message you back and I, um, I've always

822
00:41:11,560 --> 00:41:14,480
Speaker 1: said that the Today Show was like a dream, like

823
00:41:14,480 --> 00:41:17,200
Speaker 1: a bucket list thing. I just never knew what vehicle

824
00:41:17,280 --> 00:41:19,319
Speaker 1: would get me there, you know. I didn't know if

825
00:41:19,320 --> 00:41:21,280
Speaker 1: I would get there as a songwriter, as a label.

826
00:41:21,560 --> 00:41:23,239
Speaker 1: You know, I've always wanted to write a book. I

827
00:41:23,280 --> 00:41:24,760
Speaker 1: was like, maybe that's how I'll get on the Today

828
00:41:25,000 --> 00:41:28,400
Speaker 1: having no idea that. I mean, I've never told you

829
00:41:28,440 --> 00:41:33,640
Speaker 1: that obviously, and so that just felt. It's just constant affirmation, um,

830
00:41:33,920 --> 00:41:37,000
Speaker 1: from true friends that keep coming coming through on this

831
00:41:37,040 --> 00:41:39,160
Speaker 1: project and saying how can I help? And that's what

832
00:41:39,200 --> 00:41:40,600
Speaker 1: you said, and that the end of your message is

833
00:41:40,640 --> 00:41:42,200
Speaker 1: like how can I help you? You know, and I

834
00:41:42,239 --> 00:41:46,160
Speaker 1: hope this helps, So thank you and not and and listen,

835
00:41:46,200 --> 00:41:49,200
Speaker 1: I think you're awesome and whatever you ever needed in

836
00:41:49,239 --> 00:41:52,279
Speaker 1: like personal real life it does mat or like here

837
00:41:52,320 --> 00:41:55,319
Speaker 1: we go, but I wouldn't vouch for it. Also if

838
00:41:55,320 --> 00:41:58,120
Speaker 1: it wasn't great, Like that's the second layer of that,

839
00:41:58,480 --> 00:41:59,719
Speaker 1: and that I could be like, hey, come to the

840
00:41:59,760 --> 00:42:02,840
Speaker 1: pod guest. You know we get uh, you know, a

841
00:42:02,960 --> 00:42:05,200
Speaker 1: million people a month that will listen to this. I

842
00:42:05,200 --> 00:42:07,239
Speaker 1: could do that to somebody that sucked and be like

843
00:42:07,280 --> 00:42:11,640
Speaker 1: come on, but me going, hey, I'm going on to

844
00:42:11,680 --> 00:42:14,359
Speaker 1: do this. You should come and do this nationally. And

845
00:42:14,400 --> 00:42:16,279
Speaker 1: I'm going to say I invited you up to play

846
00:42:16,320 --> 00:42:18,440
Speaker 1: because I think you're so good. Like that's one of

847
00:42:18,480 --> 00:42:20,759
Speaker 1: those things that I hope you see as that's not

848
00:42:20,760 --> 00:42:22,480
Speaker 1: me and you're being friends. That's me going like I

849
00:42:22,560 --> 00:42:26,480
Speaker 1: believe in you the artist and as the performer in

850
00:42:26,520 --> 00:42:28,920
Speaker 1: the creative that you are, So that's a different that's no.

851
00:42:29,080 --> 00:42:31,720
Speaker 1: I feel that because I've never felt you endorse something

852
00:42:31,719 --> 00:42:34,839
Speaker 1: that you didn't stand behind. So that's I think maybe

853
00:42:34,840 --> 00:42:37,719
Speaker 1: where the weight of that call or that message really

854
00:42:37,760 --> 00:42:40,400
Speaker 1: came from. I was like, he didn't have to. You know,

855
00:42:41,520 --> 00:42:46,799
Speaker 1: pressure is awesome, it is, it's awesome. I'm i that

856
00:42:46,880 --> 00:42:50,239
Speaker 1: word curious. I think that's the thing. I'm like, we

857
00:42:50,280 --> 00:42:52,879
Speaker 1: don't know what could happen if I play on play

858
00:42:52,920 --> 00:42:54,600
Speaker 1: it on the Today Show because I've never done it.

859
00:42:54,880 --> 00:42:59,400
Speaker 1: Who knows who the reach, who knows who could be

860
00:42:59,440 --> 00:43:02,000
Speaker 1: affected by my record if I got a bigger platform,

861
00:43:02,160 --> 00:43:06,040
Speaker 1: you know. And so I'm yeah, I think I think

862
00:43:06,080 --> 00:43:08,160
Speaker 1: I'm learning right now that there's a lot of people that,

863
00:43:08,280 --> 00:43:12,839
Speaker 1: after being in Nashville for twenty years, are are really

864
00:43:12,840 --> 00:43:16,160
Speaker 1: showing up for me out of friendship but also passion

865
00:43:16,200 --> 00:43:19,560
Speaker 1: for the project. And it's like it's making me my

866
00:43:19,600 --> 00:43:23,000
Speaker 1: mind get bigger and dream bigger. Um, so maybe I

867
00:43:23,040 --> 00:43:25,719
Speaker 1: will be touring this next year. I don't know, you know,

868
00:43:25,880 --> 00:43:28,360
Speaker 1: it's just kind of one day at a time whenever,

869
00:43:28,560 --> 00:43:30,520
Speaker 1: because again they said, hey, I was just gonna do

870
00:43:30,560 --> 00:43:32,920
Speaker 1: one day at first, and they were like, hey, come up,

871
00:43:32,960 --> 00:43:34,880
Speaker 1: you can bring somebody. And then it turned from one

872
00:43:34,920 --> 00:43:37,520
Speaker 1: day into oh, what have you do too? But now

873
00:43:37,520 --> 00:43:39,240
Speaker 1: it's going to be because the Monday is like a holiday,

874
00:43:39,239 --> 00:43:41,120
Speaker 1: but I want to do Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, the three

875
00:43:41,160 --> 00:43:42,600
Speaker 1: days on there. And so then they came and said

876
00:43:42,600 --> 00:43:44,400
Speaker 1: do two days. I didn't think much about it, and

877
00:43:44,440 --> 00:43:46,040
Speaker 1: I was like, They're like, who else would you want?

878
00:43:46,040 --> 00:43:48,960
Speaker 1: I was like, uh, A big fan of this lame Tierra,

879
00:43:49,080 --> 00:43:50,560
Speaker 1: Why don't you hit her up? I don't even think

880
00:43:50,640 --> 00:43:53,560
Speaker 1: that's that you guys. I know that she is on

881
00:43:53,680 --> 00:43:57,200
Speaker 1: your label, but I love her anyway regardless of you.

882
00:43:57,239 --> 00:43:58,960
Speaker 1: And I had her open shows, you know, for me.

883
00:43:59,280 --> 00:44:00,880
Speaker 1: But then once they were like, yeah, she's in, I

884
00:44:01,000 --> 00:44:05,319
Speaker 1: was like, I'm just feeding the hole and Nicole Gallium monster, no,

885
00:44:05,520 --> 00:44:09,520
Speaker 1: I know, I am. Yes. Um, that wasn't purposeful, that's

886
00:44:09,520 --> 00:44:11,879
Speaker 1: the thing. Well, and I didn't think. I didn't think

887
00:44:11,880 --> 00:44:13,960
Speaker 1: that it was. I was just like, wow, you know,

888
00:44:14,000 --> 00:44:15,799
Speaker 1: because you know, you like, there's a lot of things

889
00:44:15,800 --> 00:44:18,239
Speaker 1: in this business that you quietly lay the groundwork for

890
00:44:18,239 --> 00:44:21,160
Speaker 1: for years and years and years invisibly and nobody sees them.

891
00:44:21,160 --> 00:44:24,040
Speaker 1: And then you you hope that in three to five

892
00:44:24,160 --> 00:44:26,480
Speaker 1: years some of this stuff will start to like the

893
00:44:26,520 --> 00:44:29,120
Speaker 1: dots will connect on their own. And this is an

894
00:44:29,120 --> 00:44:31,799
Speaker 1: example of that. It's like, you know, I signed tire

895
00:44:31,880 --> 00:44:34,200
Speaker 1: to a publishing deal to a couple of years ago,

896
00:44:34,440 --> 00:44:36,879
Speaker 1: and a couple of years ago I started dreaming about

897
00:44:36,880 --> 00:44:39,320
Speaker 1: making a record, having no idea that in one week

898
00:44:39,640 --> 00:44:43,279
Speaker 1: we could potentially be performing as you know on the

899
00:44:43,320 --> 00:44:47,440
Speaker 1: Today Show. Um, and I've been joking. Then it's going

900
00:44:47,480 --> 00:44:49,960
Speaker 1: to be a Songs and Daughters takeover potentially, but just

901
00:44:50,040 --> 00:44:53,640
Speaker 1: so fun. That's pretty cool. So you've got the record?

902
00:44:53,680 --> 00:44:56,279
Speaker 1: Are you still writing? Though? Now for other folks, you are,

903
00:44:56,480 --> 00:45:00,560
Speaker 1: You're still really I am. I wrote four songs last week. Um.

904
00:45:00,600 --> 00:45:03,040
Speaker 1: I've been gone to Kansas this whole summer, throughout the

905
00:45:03,040 --> 00:45:07,440
Speaker 1: whole rollout of the record, because I always go to Kansas. Um.

906
00:45:07,480 --> 00:45:10,400
Speaker 1: And so I just got back started writing full time.

907
00:45:10,440 --> 00:45:15,400
Speaker 1: My calendars booked as if nothing else is going on, um,

908
00:45:15,440 --> 00:45:19,080
Speaker 1: as if this record is like not real. But I

909
00:45:19,120 --> 00:45:21,080
Speaker 1: told some people on my team last week. I was like,

910
00:45:21,120 --> 00:45:23,799
Speaker 1: we take this one week at a time, you know. Um,

911
00:45:23,840 --> 00:45:26,200
Speaker 1: I have no reason to start canceling things yet. But

912
00:45:26,560 --> 00:45:28,279
Speaker 1: if I go play with the Today Show, I'm sorry,

913
00:45:28,280 --> 00:45:29,920
Speaker 1: I'm going to go to New York, you know, and

914
00:45:30,680 --> 00:45:33,319
Speaker 1: um and those things. I'm giving myself permission to change

915
00:45:33,400 --> 00:45:36,520
Speaker 1: my mind. We'll see, we'll see where I am every

916
00:45:36,880 --> 00:45:38,200
Speaker 1: If you'd have told me a week ago I was

917
00:45:38,200 --> 00:45:40,200
Speaker 1: playing the Today Show, I wouldn't have believed you. So

918
00:45:41,239 --> 00:45:43,560
Speaker 1: I'm kind of like, let's see where we are in

919
00:45:43,600 --> 00:45:47,080
Speaker 1: October and November and in the spring. But I'm writing

920
00:45:47,080 --> 00:45:51,120
Speaker 1: four songs this week. Um, you know, they're all connected.

921
00:45:51,520 --> 00:45:53,879
Speaker 1: You know. It's good too. It's also good to get

922
00:45:53,880 --> 00:45:56,480
Speaker 1: out of my orbit. I've been thinking about myself and

923
00:45:56,520 --> 00:45:59,120
Speaker 1: this record more than I'm used to, so it's nice

924
00:45:59,160 --> 00:46:02,960
Speaker 1: to go in and write with other people. With that said,

925
00:46:04,360 --> 00:46:08,920
Speaker 1: I think I can't unknow how much fun writing for

926
00:46:09,000 --> 00:46:12,279
Speaker 1: me has become and how meaningful it is. And it's

927
00:46:12,280 --> 00:46:14,719
Speaker 1: a little bit I've noted. I noticed last week coming

928
00:46:14,719 --> 00:46:18,719
Speaker 1: back to writing, it felt a little I don't know

929
00:46:18,840 --> 00:46:22,640
Speaker 1: what what a fair word would be. It didn't quite

930
00:46:22,719 --> 00:46:25,080
Speaker 1: feel as meaningful to just write a song to sell

931
00:46:25,120 --> 00:46:27,680
Speaker 1: some beer. Did it feel like it was inside of

932
00:46:27,680 --> 00:46:29,359
Speaker 1: a formula you've done so many times you just kind

933
00:46:29,360 --> 00:46:31,319
Speaker 1: of hop back into it. Yeah. I was writing with

934
00:46:31,360 --> 00:46:34,719
Speaker 1: a couple of guys, um and they didn't do anything wrong.

935
00:46:34,840 --> 00:46:36,879
Speaker 1: They're guys I've written with for years. But they said

936
00:46:36,920 --> 00:46:40,680
Speaker 1: they literally said that line of well, we were throwing

937
00:46:40,680 --> 00:46:42,719
Speaker 1: out ideas and they're like, well, I mean, what's gonna

938
00:46:42,719 --> 00:46:45,200
Speaker 1: sell some beer? Guys? You know? And I was like, wow,

939
00:46:45,560 --> 00:46:47,440
Speaker 1: I have not. I've been in that headspace for a

940
00:46:47,480 --> 00:46:49,560
Speaker 1: lot of years, but I've not been in that headspace

941
00:46:49,560 --> 00:46:51,160
Speaker 1: for the last couple of months. So it was kind

942
00:46:51,160 --> 00:46:53,279
Speaker 1: of like a rude awakening of oh yeah, back to

943
00:46:53,320 --> 00:46:57,160
Speaker 1: the day job of trying to get on the radio again,

944
00:46:57,239 --> 00:47:00,640
Speaker 1: you know, And that's not what this record. That's not

945
00:47:00,680 --> 00:47:09,040
Speaker 1: where my head was with making a record, did you

946
00:47:09,239 --> 00:47:11,399
Speaker 1: or when you go to the doctor or anywhere that's

947
00:47:11,400 --> 00:47:17,840
Speaker 1: like occupation? What do you put? Um? I put songwriter first.

948
00:47:18,440 --> 00:47:20,760
Speaker 1: I mean probably out to have it, because that's where

949
00:47:20,800 --> 00:47:25,480
Speaker 1: all things go back to that I've um. This conversation

950
00:47:25,520 --> 00:47:27,359
Speaker 1: has come up a little bit in the last year

951
00:47:27,400 --> 00:47:30,560
Speaker 1: or two. And what feels what what feels like I'm

952
00:47:30,600 --> 00:47:34,040
Speaker 1: moving toward is more of like a creative CEO, I think,

953
00:47:34,200 --> 00:47:37,280
Speaker 1: and I don't that sounds pretentious, but it actually feels.

954
00:47:37,800 --> 00:47:39,759
Speaker 1: It's uncomfortable for me to say out loud and to

955
00:47:39,800 --> 00:47:42,160
Speaker 1: own that. But I think if you're on paper, if

956
00:47:42,160 --> 00:47:44,440
Speaker 1: you wrote down all the things I was doing, it

957
00:47:44,560 --> 00:47:47,839
Speaker 1: might be a fact that even as a songwriter, I'm

958
00:47:47,880 --> 00:47:51,000
Speaker 1: a creative CEO. You know, in my making this project,

959
00:47:51,080 --> 00:47:55,279
Speaker 1: I was definitely CEO of everything because I was basically independent,

960
00:47:55,880 --> 00:47:58,680
Speaker 1: like an indie artist making this. So as an indie

961
00:47:58,719 --> 00:48:00,520
Speaker 1: artist would tell you like, you are the CEO of

962
00:48:00,560 --> 00:48:04,480
Speaker 1: the project. So I think that's probably that's not what

963
00:48:04,560 --> 00:48:08,239
Speaker 1: I put down at the doctor. But it soon enough.

964
00:48:08,520 --> 00:48:12,040
Speaker 1: Maybe yeah when you I'm gonna ask us forever. But

965
00:48:13,640 --> 00:48:15,200
Speaker 1: Y a year ago, maybe two years ago, you were

966
00:48:15,360 --> 00:48:18,680
Speaker 1: cans In of the Year. A yeah, what do you

967
00:48:18,719 --> 00:48:20,920
Speaker 1: get for that? And I've been waiting to talk to

968
00:48:20,960 --> 00:48:22,640
Speaker 1: you about that? So what happens? How do they let

969
00:48:22,640 --> 00:48:26,560
Speaker 1: you know? What's the deal? Oh my gosh, this is

970
00:48:26,560 --> 00:48:31,160
Speaker 1: so funny. Um, you get a really weird experience at

971
00:48:31,160 --> 00:48:34,879
Speaker 1: a banquet in a conference room in Topeka, Kansas. That's

972
00:48:34,880 --> 00:48:40,440
Speaker 1: what you get. Um. It's very political. Um, it's it's

973
00:48:41,239 --> 00:48:44,799
Speaker 1: the organization that picks cans In of the Year is

974
00:48:45,120 --> 00:48:48,759
Speaker 1: very politics based. So that whole room was a lot

975
00:48:48,760 --> 00:48:52,239
Speaker 1: of white haired guys. Um. And then me and I

976
00:48:52,440 --> 00:48:54,719
Speaker 1: was actually, this makes it even funnier. I was co

977
00:48:54,920 --> 00:48:58,719
Speaker 1: Canson of the Year with a guy that had done

978
00:48:58,719 --> 00:49:03,600
Speaker 1: phenomenal work and politics for like the state Education Department,

979
00:49:03,600 --> 00:49:06,920
Speaker 1: and he was like seventy years old. And every person

980
00:49:07,000 --> 00:49:11,280
Speaker 1: that's in like the government in Kansas was there. The

981
00:49:11,680 --> 00:49:14,680
Speaker 1: governor like made a speech and they had this beautifully

982
00:49:14,680 --> 00:49:18,680
Speaker 1: put together like package for him. The governor spoke and

983
00:49:18,719 --> 00:49:23,320
Speaker 1: then they're like and now Nicole Galleon songwriter, and everyone's

984
00:49:23,360 --> 00:49:26,399
Speaker 1: like you know, that's not a creative group of people necessarily, right,

985
00:49:26,840 --> 00:49:29,680
Speaker 1: And I'm what thirty five at the time, and they're

986
00:49:29,719 --> 00:49:31,640
Speaker 1: like looking at me. And I made this like one

987
00:49:31,640 --> 00:49:35,440
Speaker 1: of my cool little instagram ish videos. It was like

988
00:49:35,440 --> 00:49:39,839
Speaker 1: a bit of a highlight reel, very different vibe than

989
00:49:39,920 --> 00:49:42,799
Speaker 1: what the State Department put together for this other man,

990
00:49:44,000 --> 00:49:46,480
Speaker 1: and it was very awkward. Everyone just kind of stared

991
00:49:46,520 --> 00:49:49,480
Speaker 1: at me, and to be honest, I kind of wanted

992
00:49:49,480 --> 00:49:51,200
Speaker 1: the night to just be over. I was like, this

993
00:49:51,280 --> 00:49:54,120
Speaker 1: is not what I thought it was going to be. Um,

994
00:49:54,160 --> 00:49:57,399
Speaker 1: but it sure looks good on Wikipedia, you know, I agree. Cool.

995
00:49:57,440 --> 00:49:59,239
Speaker 1: When I saw it, I was like, that's awesome. Hands

996
00:49:59,400 --> 00:50:01,640
Speaker 1: of the Year. We just redid some of my bio

997
00:50:01,760 --> 00:50:05,279
Speaker 1: stuff and um, my manager Olivia was like, so do

998
00:50:05,320 --> 00:50:07,400
Speaker 1: you want to keep cans in? I was like, you

999
00:50:07,440 --> 00:50:09,640
Speaker 1: watch your mouth. I'll keep cans in the Year over

1000
00:50:09,680 --> 00:50:11,759
Speaker 1: anything else for the rest of my life. Yeah, the

1001
00:50:11,880 --> 00:50:14,160
Speaker 1: night doesn't be awesome for the ward to always last

1002
00:50:14,200 --> 00:50:16,600
Speaker 1: and be awesome. Um, okay, I want to play a

1003
00:50:16,640 --> 00:50:18,319
Speaker 1: couple more clips. We played a couple in a very

1004
00:50:18,400 --> 00:50:20,839
Speaker 1: very intro before we started talking. But I do want

1005
00:50:20,840 --> 00:50:23,640
Speaker 1: to give self care because if I'm I'm just going

1006
00:50:23,640 --> 00:50:26,640
Speaker 1: from memory. If I'm wrong, just slat me. Were you like,

1007
00:50:27,520 --> 00:50:28,840
Speaker 1: did you have like stuff on your face or in

1008
00:50:28,880 --> 00:50:31,560
Speaker 1: a shower? Right? Am I right about the imagery? Yes? Okay,

1009
00:50:31,640 --> 00:50:33,600
Speaker 1: I was in a bathroom. Okay, that's what it was,

1010
00:50:33,640 --> 00:50:36,040
Speaker 1: with like wet hair, no makeup. I had like a

1011
00:50:36,080 --> 00:50:38,600
Speaker 1: face mask on for part of the video. Okay, But

1012
00:50:38,640 --> 00:50:42,000
Speaker 1: that's how good when I say what you did? Visually?

1013
00:50:42,880 --> 00:50:45,160
Speaker 1: I see ten million things a day that people are

1014
00:50:45,200 --> 00:50:49,800
Speaker 1: like this. That pick song, it's just but I can remember.

1015
00:50:49,920 --> 00:50:52,719
Speaker 1: I remember that, and I can. I'm gonna be wrong here,

1016
00:50:52,760 --> 00:50:54,880
Speaker 1: but some color blind is crap? What color was the title?

1017
00:50:57,120 --> 00:50:59,359
Speaker 1: Blues and greens are very similar to me? So are

1018
00:50:59,400 --> 00:51:03,239
Speaker 1: you color? Yes? So is my husband. Yes. Yeah, I'm

1019
00:51:03,320 --> 00:51:07,760
Speaker 1: lucky that he can. He's like brown, he's darker tones

1020
00:51:07,800 --> 00:51:11,799
Speaker 1: like brown's, greens, navies all kind of turned into each other.

1021
00:51:12,239 --> 00:51:15,000
Speaker 1: Anything over like a certain threshold of dark. All looks

1022
00:51:15,000 --> 00:51:17,920
Speaker 1: black to me. So very so, very similar right? Similar?

1023
00:51:17,960 --> 00:51:25,360
Speaker 1: Here is self care? Thank I'm fatterly soul, baby, baby,

1024
00:51:25,400 --> 00:51:33,279
Speaker 1: I'm crazy. Maybe I'm I'm scared to change. Gave me.

1025
00:51:34,160 --> 00:51:40,600
Speaker 1: I can't can't make my self care. You mentioned Rodney,

1026
00:51:40,880 --> 00:51:42,960
Speaker 1: there is a song with just you two guys, I know,

1027
00:51:43,160 --> 00:51:44,960
Speaker 1: the first one we've ever written. I was going to

1028
00:51:45,040 --> 00:51:47,640
Speaker 1: say I was surprised to see yeah, yeah. I mean

1029
00:51:47,680 --> 00:51:49,960
Speaker 1: I can't write a record from my kids about my

1030
00:51:50,200 --> 00:51:52,640
Speaker 1: life story and then not write a song with their dad,

1031
00:51:52,719 --> 00:51:55,840
Speaker 1: you know. Um. We waited as the last song for

1032
00:51:55,880 --> 00:51:59,120
Speaker 1: the record, um, and I think it was it was

1033
00:51:59,200 --> 00:52:02,000
Speaker 1: daunting to write just because I had I had that

1034
00:52:02,120 --> 00:52:04,399
Speaker 1: title five year Plan written down in the track list

1035
00:52:04,400 --> 00:52:06,920
Speaker 1: with just Rodney's name next to it for months and months,

1036
00:52:06,920 --> 00:52:08,880
Speaker 1: but we just never could find time at our house.

1037
00:52:08,920 --> 00:52:11,000
Speaker 1: Like I don't know if you know if you're this

1038
00:52:11,040 --> 00:52:12,840
Speaker 1: way or not, but like when you come home, you're

1039
00:52:13,880 --> 00:52:17,839
Speaker 1: we don't have kids. Yeah that's true, and so we Um.

1040
00:52:17,920 --> 00:52:20,120
Speaker 1: Like I said, I gave myself the deadline to have

1041
00:52:20,200 --> 00:52:24,160
Speaker 1: the record done the end of one and December came

1042
00:52:24,200 --> 00:52:26,839
Speaker 1: like first of December, and I'm like, the records basically done,

1043
00:52:26,840 --> 00:52:28,800
Speaker 1: but I still have not written this song with Rodney

1044
00:52:28,800 --> 00:52:31,040
Speaker 1: because we just couldn't find time. So we were going

1045
00:52:31,120 --> 00:52:34,120
Speaker 1: to a Morgan wall And show like December like fifth

1046
00:52:34,200 --> 00:52:38,040
Speaker 1: or six, and we were looking at hotel rooms and

1047
00:52:38,040 --> 00:52:39,479
Speaker 1: I was like, why don't we just try to write

1048
00:52:39,480 --> 00:52:41,520
Speaker 1: this song, while we're in this hotel room at the show,

1049
00:52:42,400 --> 00:52:45,640
Speaker 1: and he as I was looking at this, like, you know, Hampton,

1050
00:52:45,719 --> 00:52:47,719
Speaker 1: and I'm like, I don't think we're gonna write this

1051
00:52:48,040 --> 00:52:50,840
Speaker 1: super meaningful song in a hotel room at the Hampton,

1052
00:52:50,920 --> 00:52:53,319
Speaker 1: and it just doesn't look inspiring. So we got a

1053
00:52:53,320 --> 00:52:57,440
Speaker 1: tour bus and we're both used to as songwriters going

1054
00:52:57,440 --> 00:52:59,680
Speaker 1: out on the road. I'm doing weekend runs to write

1055
00:52:59,719 --> 00:53:01,120
Speaker 1: for our us while they were on tour. So I

1056
00:53:01,160 --> 00:53:03,719
Speaker 1: was like, let's just get a bus and we're saying

1057
00:53:03,760 --> 00:53:05,719
Speaker 1: we're not coming back to Nashville until we have our

1058
00:53:05,760 --> 00:53:08,400
Speaker 1: song written. And so we ended up writing it. It

1059
00:53:08,480 --> 00:53:11,880
Speaker 1: fell out really fast in a couple of hours, and

1060
00:53:11,880 --> 00:53:13,400
Speaker 1: and that's kind of like part of the lyric at

1061
00:53:13,400 --> 00:53:15,400
Speaker 1: the end of the song says like I'm backstage a

1062
00:53:15,480 --> 00:53:17,840
Speaker 1: show and here we are and this life is so

1063
00:53:17,920 --> 00:53:20,879
Speaker 1: much better than anything I would have planned. So that

1064
00:53:20,960 --> 00:53:23,120
Speaker 1: was we squeaked that one in at the end. But

1065
00:53:23,280 --> 00:53:26,600
Speaker 1: I I think that kind of opened Pandora's box again

1066
00:53:26,640 --> 00:53:30,120
Speaker 1: for me of how much I loved writing with him. Really,

1067
00:53:30,280 --> 00:53:32,520
Speaker 1: we have not written together. I mean, we didn't write

1068
00:53:32,520 --> 00:53:35,240
Speaker 1: to go the first ten years we were married, because

1069
00:53:35,239 --> 00:53:38,120
Speaker 1: he just knew I was fiercely independent and didn't want

1070
00:53:38,239 --> 00:53:43,760
Speaker 1: his career to overshadow mine, which was so loving and wise.

1071
00:53:44,680 --> 00:53:46,600
Speaker 1: But then once I started to have success, we wrote

1072
00:53:46,600 --> 00:53:50,120
Speaker 1: together a little bit with other people for other people,

1073
00:53:50,120 --> 00:53:52,239
Speaker 1: but we had never done this thing where it's like,

1074
00:53:52,719 --> 00:53:54,400
Speaker 1: you're the only person that knows I do have a

1075
00:53:54,440 --> 00:53:57,720
Speaker 1: maximum in two thousand three, and you're the only person

1076
00:53:57,760 --> 00:54:00,920
Speaker 1: that could put that in this song. So, um, I

1077
00:54:00,920 --> 00:54:03,160
Speaker 1: think there's more where that came from. For sure, here

1078
00:54:03,320 --> 00:54:08,960
Speaker 1: is five year plan. Yeah. I had a four bench

1079
00:54:09,080 --> 00:54:15,600
Speaker 1: and a little big offense and two batches us checking

1080
00:54:15,840 --> 00:54:19,160
Speaker 1: calls it out sitting now all of a sudden, got

1081
00:54:19,160 --> 00:54:23,120
Speaker 1: to bring on my finger. Think being single just got

1082
00:54:23,200 --> 00:54:29,680
Speaker 1: knocked off the top of bs because baby don't in

1083
00:54:29,800 --> 00:54:38,360
Speaker 1: a five year plan. So I'm gonna ask you this,

1084
00:54:38,360 --> 00:54:40,440
Speaker 1: and I would only ask you this because you wrote

1085
00:54:40,840 --> 00:54:44,200
Speaker 1: about it publicly. It's not about your project. But I

1086
00:54:44,280 --> 00:54:48,040
Speaker 1: remember looking on Instagram one day and you had written

1087
00:54:48,440 --> 00:54:50,840
Speaker 1: that the Beers on Me song sounded a bit like

1088
00:54:50,880 --> 00:54:54,120
Speaker 1: something you had written. I did not say anything about

1089
00:54:54,120 --> 00:55:01,400
Speaker 1: any specific songs. Yeah, yeah, true, but because it's very similar,

1090
00:55:01,840 --> 00:55:05,920
Speaker 1: So what what motivated you to write that? In the

1091
00:55:06,040 --> 00:55:09,360
Speaker 1: land of everybody just goes, well, there's only so many chords,

1092
00:55:09,360 --> 00:55:12,080
Speaker 1: there's only so many notes you can do because you're

1093
00:55:12,120 --> 00:55:14,279
Speaker 1: now a writer on the song, right, And did that

1094
00:55:14,320 --> 00:55:19,120
Speaker 1: get contentious at all? Um? Yeah, it was complicated. Um

1095
00:55:19,200 --> 00:55:23,400
Speaker 1: for sure. Um, I think you ask about motive or

1096
00:55:23,440 --> 00:55:29,000
Speaker 1: like what you know why. I think I've noticed in

1097
00:55:29,120 --> 00:55:31,520
Speaker 1: Nashville and it wasn't just about that song, but it

1098
00:55:31,640 --> 00:55:33,760
Speaker 1: was a bigger picture where there is a gray area

1099
00:55:34,160 --> 00:55:36,520
Speaker 1: in rooms. You know, you're right, there are so many

1100
00:55:36,640 --> 00:55:40,200
Speaker 1: only so many notes. But in the fifteen years of

1101
00:55:40,200 --> 00:55:43,960
Speaker 1: me having a publishing deal, what feels like writing on

1102
00:55:44,000 --> 00:55:47,520
Speaker 1: top of something else has gotten way more loose than

1103
00:55:47,560 --> 00:55:52,319
Speaker 1: it used to be. UM. And I think I think

1104
00:55:52,400 --> 00:55:54,359
Speaker 1: I felt like some good could come out of just

1105
00:55:54,400 --> 00:55:57,920
Speaker 1: shining a light on on that because I've had so

1106
00:55:57,960 --> 00:56:00,960
Speaker 1: many writers come up to me after her and say, man,

1107
00:56:01,360 --> 00:56:03,040
Speaker 1: you know not you got us all thinking, Like the

1108
00:56:03,080 --> 00:56:05,840
Speaker 1: next week we were we were like about to finish

1109
00:56:05,880 --> 00:56:08,359
Speaker 1: our song and we thought maybe it sounded like too

1110
00:56:08,400 --> 00:56:10,040
Speaker 1: much like this other song. So we pulled the other

1111
00:56:10,080 --> 00:56:12,759
Speaker 1: song up and we listened to it, and UM, and

1112
00:56:12,760 --> 00:56:15,160
Speaker 1: I'm like, yeah, I think that's really where my heart

1113
00:56:15,320 --> 00:56:18,400
Speaker 1: was was, like, I think we've inched our away a

1114
00:56:18,520 --> 00:56:21,920
Speaker 1: little too far into the gray zone. UM, and I

1115
00:56:21,960 --> 00:56:27,759
Speaker 1: think everyone, um is capable myself being first of you know,

1116
00:56:28,440 --> 00:56:31,640
Speaker 1: writing on top of other things, I think, Um, I

1117
00:56:31,680 --> 00:56:34,840
Speaker 1: think I just think awareness. It was just really all

1118
00:56:34,960 --> 00:56:37,279
Speaker 1: that I wanted out of that. There were a couple

1119
00:56:37,280 --> 00:56:38,879
Speaker 1: of people that had mentioned them to me. They were

1120
00:56:38,880 --> 00:56:41,680
Speaker 1: just happy you did it because everybody kept talking about

1121
00:56:41,680 --> 00:56:44,400
Speaker 1: doing it and everybody knew what was happening, and nobody

1122
00:56:44,440 --> 00:56:45,880
Speaker 1: would do it, and they were just like, we just

1123
00:56:45,920 --> 00:56:48,040
Speaker 1: need somebody to kind of be a leader and go

1124
00:56:48,120 --> 00:56:49,400
Speaker 1: for it. It It didn't have to be this sense. It

1125
00:56:49,960 --> 00:56:52,319
Speaker 1: could have been a thousand different, as you said, because

1126
00:56:52,320 --> 00:56:54,680
Speaker 1: it's happening everywhere. Well, that's why there were no song

1127
00:56:54,760 --> 00:56:57,200
Speaker 1: titles involved. It was more about I just want our

1128
00:56:57,200 --> 00:56:59,040
Speaker 1: community to just kind of like look in the mirror

1129
00:56:59,080 --> 00:57:01,760
Speaker 1: and say, like, are we being are we having integrity?

1130
00:57:01,800 --> 00:57:04,280
Speaker 1: You know? And that's just that's between me and myself

1131
00:57:04,360 --> 00:57:07,680
Speaker 1: and you and yourself and the next writer and themselves themselves,

1132
00:57:07,680 --> 00:57:12,480
Speaker 1: and I am and I think you're right. Hughes reminded

1133
00:57:12,520 --> 00:57:16,200
Speaker 1: me of last year when this went down. I feel

1134
00:57:16,840 --> 00:57:19,760
Speaker 1: like the more success you have and the more privileged

1135
00:57:19,800 --> 00:57:23,080
Speaker 1: you have in in whatever position, you're in. It comes

1136
00:57:23,080 --> 00:57:28,040
Speaker 1: with responsibility, and I see why, you know, I see

1137
00:57:28,080 --> 00:57:31,120
Speaker 1: why you need somebody that's in my position who's not

1138
00:57:31,280 --> 00:57:34,640
Speaker 1: worried if I'm being completely honest about my kids college

1139
00:57:34,640 --> 00:57:36,520
Speaker 1: being paid for anymore. I think if I was in

1140
00:57:36,560 --> 00:57:39,960
Speaker 1: the beginning of my career, and I see this happen

1141
00:57:40,000 --> 00:57:41,920
Speaker 1: a lot. I know a lot of I know a

1142
00:57:41,920 --> 00:57:45,440
Speaker 1: lot of situations in our industry where somebody feels like

1143
00:57:45,920 --> 00:57:49,120
Speaker 1: they want to speak up, but then they're afraid to

1144
00:57:49,240 --> 00:57:53,919
Speaker 1: become the villain of a situation that and they don't

1145
00:57:53,920 --> 00:57:55,920
Speaker 1: want to hurt their their livelihood. You know, everyone's just

1146
00:57:55,960 --> 00:57:58,080
Speaker 1: trying to keep their lights on. And being a songwriter

1147
00:57:58,200 --> 00:58:00,320
Speaker 1: is tough top to bottom no matter who you are,

1148
00:58:01,440 --> 00:58:05,480
Speaker 1: but it's you know, I had less to lose, and

1149
00:58:05,520 --> 00:58:07,720
Speaker 1: I felt like that's what leadership is is if you

1150
00:58:07,760 --> 00:58:10,320
Speaker 1: can stick your neck out there and be honest and

1151
00:58:10,440 --> 00:58:15,920
Speaker 1: be true, um, then the people that look up to

1152
00:58:15,960 --> 00:58:18,080
Speaker 1: me are more likely to be honest and true when

1153
00:58:18,120 --> 00:58:21,360
Speaker 1: they become me. And that's you know, while that was

1154
00:58:21,400 --> 00:58:25,880
Speaker 1: a complicated situation, I felt I felt like I was

1155
00:58:25,960 --> 00:58:30,080
Speaker 1: me in that situation, and I felt peace about I

1156
00:58:30,120 --> 00:58:32,960
Speaker 1: felt more peace after I had shared and and you know,

1157
00:58:33,000 --> 00:58:36,440
Speaker 1: shone a light on it. So it um one of

1158
00:58:36,440 --> 00:58:42,400
Speaker 1: the weirder things in my career so far. But um,

1159
00:58:42,440 --> 00:58:45,200
Speaker 1: but you know, I think everything that's happened in my

1160
00:58:45,280 --> 00:58:46,960
Speaker 1: career has happened for me. And I think that that

1161
00:58:47,040 --> 00:58:50,160
Speaker 1: happened for me. I learned a lot about myself for that.

1162
00:58:50,440 --> 00:58:52,480
Speaker 1: What I and again I saw what I took from it,

1163
00:58:52,480 --> 00:58:53,640
Speaker 1: and we'll move off this and be done with it.

1164
00:58:53,680 --> 00:58:56,360
Speaker 1: But what I took from it was I remember going, well,

1165
00:58:56,400 --> 00:58:58,560
Speaker 1: she doesn't, she definitely doesn't have to do this like

1166
00:58:58,600 --> 00:59:01,080
Speaker 1: it wasn't. It wasn't like you had no success and

1167
00:59:01,120 --> 00:59:02,800
Speaker 1: you're screaming that someone ripped a song off of you

1168
00:59:02,840 --> 00:59:05,800
Speaker 1: so you could get on a on right like you.

1169
00:59:06,320 --> 00:59:08,200
Speaker 1: It wasn't gonna change your life at all. I mean

1170
00:59:08,360 --> 00:59:12,280
Speaker 1: really very very little yet and you knew probably what

1171
00:59:12,400 --> 00:59:15,600
Speaker 1: the possibilities of blowback were going to be. I know

1172
00:59:15,640 --> 00:59:19,160
Speaker 1: what the possibilities in this town where I mean, I

1173
00:59:19,240 --> 00:59:21,280
Speaker 1: say stuff all the time and then I get black

1174
00:59:21,320 --> 00:59:23,160
Speaker 1: bault in certain areas until I'm just not anymore. It's

1175
00:59:23,160 --> 00:59:25,600
Speaker 1: just a weird, weird place to wear in. Remember thinking,

1176
00:59:26,760 --> 00:59:30,280
Speaker 1: all right, she's not going to gain a lot from this. Um,

1177
00:59:30,320 --> 00:59:32,960
Speaker 1: she's not doing it because of that. Let's see where

1178
00:59:33,000 --> 00:59:35,280
Speaker 1: this goes. So I thought it was a I thought

1179
00:59:35,280 --> 00:59:37,840
Speaker 1: it was a brave and bold thing to do, and

1180
00:59:37,880 --> 00:59:41,320
Speaker 1: I think other people have felt the same. I my

1181
00:59:41,400 --> 00:59:44,920
Speaker 1: reputation with myself is more important than my reputation with others,

1182
00:59:45,320 --> 00:59:48,800
Speaker 1: and I felt like I was. I liked I like

1183
00:59:48,920 --> 00:59:51,760
Speaker 1: that version of me. You know, my reputation of myself

1184
00:59:51,880 --> 00:59:54,840
Speaker 1: just still a weenie. And it's with others too. So

1185
00:59:54,840 --> 00:59:57,880
Speaker 1: what do you know it's only common? Um? Okay, well, look,

1186
00:59:58,000 --> 01:00:01,560
Speaker 1: I don't want to say. It's just you're inspiring in

1187
01:00:01,600 --> 01:00:05,880
Speaker 1: many ways. Um, I don't know, it's just just what

1188
01:00:05,880 --> 01:00:07,800
Speaker 1: do you say? Just keep on because a lot of

1189
01:00:07,800 --> 01:00:10,360
Speaker 1: people are seeing what you're doing and going, oh, that

1190
01:00:10,400 --> 01:00:14,880
Speaker 1: can be done. And I think that's probably, in my mind,

1191
01:00:14,880 --> 01:00:17,680
Speaker 1: the biggest compliment I could give you is that you're

1192
01:00:17,720 --> 01:00:22,120
Speaker 1: allowing other people to see what can actually be done

1193
01:00:22,120 --> 01:00:25,400
Speaker 1: and that the world's bendable. And so don't freaking stop.

1194
01:00:25,400 --> 01:00:28,600
Speaker 1: It's aspiring to me. You know, it's awesome. Um, I'll

1195
01:00:28,720 --> 01:00:31,640
Speaker 1: end on this. Did your daughter like Hamilton's, Oh my gosh,

1196
01:00:31,720 --> 01:00:33,520
Speaker 1: she's obsessed. I think I have a little fest Maian

1197
01:00:33,600 --> 01:00:36,320
Speaker 1: on my hands. Yeah, I was never in musicals. I

1198
01:00:36,400 --> 01:00:38,440
Speaker 1: was I would play piano kind of in the pit

1199
01:00:38,600 --> 01:00:42,600
Speaker 1: for the musicals, but she's obsessed. It was so fun

1200
01:00:43,200 --> 01:00:45,160
Speaker 1: whenever I saw you guys. I saw on your Instagram

1201
01:00:45,200 --> 01:00:46,760
Speaker 1: she was on the program and I thought they went

1202
01:00:46,760 --> 01:00:48,520
Speaker 1: to but it's here high. I was here. Yeah, I

1203
01:00:48,560 --> 01:00:51,160
Speaker 1: was here in Nashville, Yester. I didn't know. I watched

1204
01:00:51,240 --> 01:00:54,680
Speaker 1: in New York and I go in, We'll hold on

1205
01:00:54,720 --> 01:00:57,440
Speaker 1: wait till you hear the story. I'm by myself. I'm

1206
01:00:57,520 --> 01:00:59,560
Speaker 1: up there doing some work and at my agent was like, hey,

1207
01:00:59,560 --> 01:01:01,920
Speaker 1: how good. Go to Hamilton's. And I was like, all right,

1208
01:01:02,040 --> 01:01:03,720
Speaker 1: bout myself, I'll go. I don't know anything about It

1209
01:01:03,720 --> 01:01:05,320
Speaker 1: was way early. I didn't know how lucky I was

1210
01:01:05,360 --> 01:01:07,880
Speaker 1: to get tickets way early. I think it was before

1211
01:01:07,880 --> 01:01:13,040
Speaker 1: the phenomenon started to exist. And so I go, and

1212
01:01:13,200 --> 01:01:14,440
Speaker 1: a lot of people there, but I go what, I'm

1213
01:01:14,440 --> 01:01:16,120
Speaker 1: sitting down and I'm like and they start the show

1214
01:01:16,160 --> 01:01:17,960
Speaker 1: and they're like, I'm a better deep about and I'm like,

1215
01:01:17,960 --> 01:01:19,439
Speaker 1: all right, I can't really keep up, but they'll start

1216
01:01:19,440 --> 01:01:21,160
Speaker 1: talking soon enough, so I'm just gonna lay back and

1217
01:01:21,200 --> 01:01:23,080
Speaker 1: relax until they talk and I can catch up. They

1218
01:01:23,120 --> 01:01:24,760
Speaker 1: never talked, they just wrapped the whole show. It took

1219
01:01:24,760 --> 01:01:25,880
Speaker 1: about half the show for me to go, oh, I

1220
01:01:25,880 --> 01:01:28,720
Speaker 1: gotta pay attention because they're never stopping rapping. So I

1221
01:01:28,760 --> 01:01:31,160
Speaker 1: set through half of it just going okay, eventually they'll

1222
01:01:31,200 --> 01:01:32,960
Speaker 1: catch me up with their words. But then once I

1223
01:01:33,040 --> 01:01:35,120
Speaker 1: was able to like sit in it and just go,

1224
01:01:35,600 --> 01:01:37,680
Speaker 1: then my mind was blown. Her mind was, well, I

1225
01:01:37,760 --> 01:01:40,040
Speaker 1: wish I would have known. I'm such a don't see

1226
01:01:40,040 --> 01:01:42,560
Speaker 1: a spoiler guy that I don't I don't even know.

1227
01:01:42,600 --> 01:01:44,880
Speaker 1: It was all hip hop the whole time. I wish

1228
01:01:44,920 --> 01:01:47,120
Speaker 1: I would have looked. But then I go, what if

1229
01:01:47,120 --> 01:01:48,760
Speaker 1: it had been spoiled? But then I go, that's history,

1230
01:01:48,760 --> 01:01:50,080
Speaker 1: you idiot. You could have read it in a book

1231
01:01:50,120 --> 01:01:52,840
Speaker 1: in eighth grade, so it really wasn't a spoiler. It's

1232
01:01:52,840 --> 01:01:55,320
Speaker 1: his history. But that's cool that she likes it. Yeah,

1233
01:01:55,400 --> 01:01:58,640
Speaker 1: I've um she's so obsessed with the songs. I've heard all.

1234
01:01:58,680 --> 01:02:00,960
Speaker 1: I mean, I've watched it with her on Disney Plus

1235
01:02:01,000 --> 01:02:03,120
Speaker 1: or something. I don't know what's on, but I've watched

1236
01:02:03,160 --> 01:02:05,520
Speaker 1: it once or twice. But listen to this. I've had

1237
01:02:05,560 --> 01:02:08,800
Speaker 1: to hear the songs a million times, and even still

1238
01:02:08,880 --> 01:02:11,560
Speaker 1: yesterday when I saw it. I was like, I catch

1239
01:02:11,680 --> 01:02:14,840
Speaker 1: something different. There's so many words, and it's so brilliant

1240
01:02:14,880 --> 01:02:16,720
Speaker 1: the way there's like these three lines of how they

1241
01:02:16,800 --> 01:02:19,439
Speaker 1: keep coming back to the same melodies and songs about

1242
01:02:19,480 --> 01:02:21,880
Speaker 1: the whole thing. I mean, it's just it's on another level.

1243
01:02:21,920 --> 01:02:24,800
Speaker 1: I was in awe. Well, Nicole, we've said it all.

1244
01:02:25,760 --> 01:02:27,120
Speaker 1: What do you do now? Do you go and like

1245
01:02:27,160 --> 01:02:30,840
Speaker 1: work on some sort of atomic reactor over? I don't know, Like,

1246
01:02:30,840 --> 01:02:33,080
Speaker 1: what do you do now? Right now? I'm actually going

1247
01:02:33,200 --> 01:02:38,960
Speaker 1: to meet um my manager Olivia and uh cheese Gal.

1248
01:02:39,200 --> 01:02:42,200
Speaker 1: You know cheese Gal Courtney Laque. Yeah she did cheese

1249
01:02:42,240 --> 01:02:45,120
Speaker 1: for us. Yeah, she's incredible. We um we may have

1250
01:02:45,280 --> 01:02:47,400
Speaker 1: a little something up oar sleeve. We're going to go

1251
01:02:47,440 --> 01:02:49,360
Speaker 1: meet and have a little pow wow a song about cheese.

1252
01:02:49,400 --> 01:02:51,000
Speaker 1: I'm into it. That's the kind of music. I need

1253
01:02:51,000 --> 01:02:53,760
Speaker 1: more songs about cheese. All right, you guys follow Nicole

1254
01:02:54,280 --> 01:02:56,200
Speaker 1: uh nick and night music. But in I C and

1255
01:02:56,360 --> 01:02:59,919
Speaker 1: N I T. I mean, it's no. If this becomes

1256
01:02:59,920 --> 01:03:01,400
Speaker 1: a thing, you gotta get it. You're gonna have to

1257
01:03:01,400 --> 01:03:03,240
Speaker 1: switch your name to something people could just say easily,

1258
01:03:03,560 --> 01:03:05,080
Speaker 1: and I have to explain it because if I would

1259
01:03:05,080 --> 01:03:07,040
Speaker 1: just go Nick and nite music, they wouldn't find it.

1260
01:03:07,360 --> 01:03:08,840
Speaker 1: But if I go and I and then I complained

1261
01:03:08,840 --> 01:03:10,560
Speaker 1: for thirty seconds and a second is three minutes just

1262
01:03:10,600 --> 01:03:12,040
Speaker 1: to go follow up. That's how you know who your

1263
01:03:12,040 --> 01:03:14,880
Speaker 1: two fans are. Phil Phill do a deep dive. That's true,

1264
01:03:14,920 --> 01:03:16,600
Speaker 1: and then they tell you you got to change it,

1265
01:03:17,160 --> 01:03:19,240
Speaker 1: all right, you guys follow Nicole. We put up her

1266
01:03:19,320 --> 01:03:22,600
Speaker 1: name up up in this as well, and congratulations, thank

1267
01:03:22,600 --> 01:03:25,000
Speaker 1: you for having me. And I'll see in a few years.

1268
01:03:25,040 --> 01:03:26,440
Speaker 1: But well, and I'll see in a few weeks on

1269
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Speaker 1: today's shot. A few weeks, all right, Bye,