Speaker 1: So here we are back for another edition of the
Speaker 1: Friday Podcast and glad to have our guests for this week,
Speaker 1: PGA Tour winner Jim Herman. Jim won the Shelle Houston
Speaker 1: Open earlier this year and thrilling fashion beating the likes
Speaker 1: of Hendrix Dentson and Dustin Johnson down the stretch to
Speaker 1: win his first PGA Tour events.
Speaker 2: So, Jim, thanks for coming on. Yeah, appreciate it. Thanks
Speaker 2: for having me on and look forward to talking to
Speaker 2: some golf and h you know what's coming up for
Speaker 2: myself in the next couple of months and what's happened.
Speaker 2: It would be fun, great, great.
Speaker 1: So I think one of the things that I find
Speaker 1: the most interesting with all pro golfers is kind of
Speaker 1: a journey and how the highs and lows of golf
Speaker 1: in general. While there's you know, those instant success stories
Speaker 1: such a Jordan Speth for a lot of guys, takes
Speaker 1: a while and as we all as golfers have felt,
Speaker 1: there are highs and lows and you know, it really
Speaker 1: kind of can kick you while you're down.
Speaker 2: And I think.
Speaker 1: You you've got just a very unique story, one where
Speaker 1: you know you you gave it a go, right out
Speaker 1: of college, and you know, you came back for a
Speaker 1: second run at it, and I'd love to just kind
Speaker 1: of hear from from your perspective about you know, getting
Speaker 1: to the tour and you know some of the great moments,
Speaker 1: some of the low moments, and you know kind of
Speaker 1: what you were thinking on your journey.
Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, you know, unlike the instant success stories like
Speaker 2: you know, like you said, Jordan's outstanding and just right
Speaker 2: out of right out of you know, a year of college,
Speaker 2: and uh, there's a lot of us that it's it's
Speaker 2: a struggle and I think it's more common to have
Speaker 2: the struggles againstant success stories and uh, you know a
Speaker 2: lot of the struggles then don't even lead to uh,
Speaker 2: you know, any time on the tour or uh, you know,
Speaker 2: maybe just a few years on the web and that
Speaker 2: then you're you're in and out and you know, just perseverance.
Speaker 2: I you know, I got a Cincinnati in two thousand,
Speaker 2: moved to South Florida. I'm gonna chase the many tours
Speaker 2: and see if i could get through the PGA Tour
Speaker 2: qualifying school in the fall. And that was the summer
Speaker 2: of one. I moved to Florida, played Golden Bear Tour
Speaker 2: and you know, just had a very you know, common summer,
Speaker 2: just made a lot of cuts, playing many tours and
Speaker 2: got through first stage of Q school and was very
Speaker 2: close at the second stage. I think I was well
Speaker 2: within the number going into the final round at second
Speaker 2: stage of Q School. And if that's the stage that
Speaker 2: everyone dreads, it's uh you have to get through to
Speaker 2: get the finals, and uh yeah, and you would have
Speaker 2: status either on a nationwide at the time or it
Speaker 2: might've been buy dot com I don't remember the name then,
Speaker 2: but you or you'll have to J tour status and
Speaker 2: if you don't get through, you're, you know, back to
Speaker 2: playing many tours or whatever you were doing before with
Speaker 2: no real certainty of your golf futures. So unfortunately for me,
Speaker 2: I didn't get through that first year, and uh nor
Speaker 2: did my second, third, fourth at sixth seventh, I'm either,
Speaker 2: So it was it was frustrating, you know, So what
Speaker 2: do you do. I've played four years of mini tours
Speaker 2: of just strictly playing golf and nothing else, you know,
Speaker 2: just working at a club the PJA village, just for
Speaker 2: a place to play and uh, you know where I
Speaker 2: could call home and practice and you know, I just
Speaker 2: couldn't get through second stage of U school, so got
Speaker 2: in the golf business. I was an assistant professional at
Speaker 2: the PJ Village and then went to New Jersey and
Speaker 2: started I was an assistant there at that Trump National
Speaker 2: And this is in seven now, so six and o
Speaker 2: seven in New Jersey. And finally that second year at UH,
Speaker 2: I was able to get through Q school. You know,
Speaker 2: I'm still going to Q school every year, but I
Speaker 2: was finally able to get through and get some status
Speaker 2: on the web dot com or the nationwide tours it
Speaker 2: was as it was called at the time, and started
Speaker 2: my touring, uh touring life, my touring golf life. That's
Speaker 2: in starting to eight. And I've been playing on tour,
Speaker 2: either on the web dot Com or the PGA Tour
Speaker 2: ever since. So pretty much the last nine years. I
Speaker 2: had four years on the Nationwide Tour and then the
Speaker 2: past five years on the PGA Tour. So it's pretty
Speaker 2: uh pretty long journey thirty eight and uh, you know,
Speaker 2: I haven't completed my fifth year on tour. I don't know,
Speaker 2: you know what how that stacks up with others If
Speaker 2: you know, after five years, if you'd be a lot
Speaker 2: younger or I'm sure of being much younger than U,
Speaker 2: you know, thirty eight. So yeah, it again takes her
Speaker 2: own Everyone takes her own road, and that's my road,
Speaker 2: and uh, you know, proud of it. You know, it
Speaker 2: wouldn't have it any other way.
Speaker 1: That I think that's a good point. It's just you know,
Speaker 1: it's everybody's journey. Do you think that you know, in
Speaker 1: the time you were away and you're being when you're
Speaker 1: in an assistant pro business, do you think the time
Speaker 1: away helped when you made kind of that second comeback.
Speaker 1: I think one of the things I find unique is
Speaker 1: that you know, you you kind of hung them up
Speaker 1: and then came back out. Do you think the time
Speaker 1: away really helped you gain perspective?
Speaker 2: Yeah, for sure. You know, I guess I put the
Speaker 2: dream of being on tour aside for about you know,
Speaker 2: ten eleven months of the year, and then then once
Speaker 2: Q school the time to send into school money and
Speaker 2: you know, think about it, you know, then I got
Speaker 2: back into it. But yeah, I definitely was committed to uh,
Speaker 2: you know, golf professional and become the PGM program with
Speaker 2: the PGA of America, and uh, I was starting down
Speaker 2: that road and it's gonna be very content with that.
Speaker 2: And uh, I love golf, and I was, you know,
Speaker 2: gonna be very content being a club professional, and uh,
Speaker 2: but I knew there was always you know, there was
Speaker 2: always two schools at the end of the year, and
Speaker 2: I knew, I could you know, find a way to
Speaker 2: raise money and uh, you know, pay the four thousand
Speaker 2: dollars every year for that, and uh, I still had
Speaker 2: a chance. And but yeah, like you said, definitely appreciated
Speaker 2: it a little a little bit more once I got
Speaker 2: out on the on the web dot com plan full
Speaker 2: full time again. And then if I would have cut
Speaker 2: out right there after the first couple of years of
Speaker 2: uh of trying.
Speaker 1: So I'd love to talk a little bit about your
Speaker 1: win at Houston this year. Obviously, for those that don't
Speaker 1: know about Jim's career, he's kind of like a cut machine,
Speaker 1: so he makes a ton of cuts. Hadn't been in
Speaker 1: you know, deep contention a lot on the on the tour,
Speaker 1: had had a couple of really good finishes, but nowhere
Speaker 1: where he was, you know, in in the league late
Speaker 1: on Sunday. So I'd love to hear a little bit about,
Speaker 1: you know, kind of what was I always think about,
Speaker 1: you know, when I'm playing in tournament golf, what other
Speaker 1: guys are thinking about. So I'd love to hear, you
Speaker 1: know a little bit about you know, what was going
Speaker 1: on in your head as you were trying to close
Speaker 1: out that uh that tournament and coming down the stretch.
Speaker 1: You know, you played a great final round and really
Speaker 1: kind of closed the door on world class players like
Speaker 1: Stenson and Dustin Johnson.
Speaker 2: Sure, that's a great question. Well, you know this, my
Speaker 2: years on tour were not exactly fantastic, like you're saying,
Speaker 2: making plenty of cuts, but just not having anything fantastic.
Speaker 2: You know. No, you know, I had one top five
Speaker 2: prior to to winning, and you know it's to say
Speaker 2: that it's not easy to contend on the tour. But
Speaker 2: that being said, you know I was having a pretty
Speaker 2: decent career. This was uh, you know, pretty good for
Speaker 2: you know, someone at thirty eight years old and you
Speaker 2: know made it out a little bit later. I was
Speaker 2: going to be you know, fully vested on the tour,
Speaker 2: having played five years on the on the tour, so
Speaker 2: you know, things weren't that bad. I was an anonymous player.
Speaker 2: There's a lot of us out there that are you
Speaker 2: know that still the Silva field, and you know, you
Speaker 2: have your superstars every week, and then you know there's
Speaker 2: one hundred and usually one hundred and fifty six golfers
Speaker 2: playing on the tour, so each week and you know,
Speaker 2: you can get lost out there and no one really
Speaker 2: knows who you are, and but we all know that
Speaker 2: we have the talent and the capability of contending, and
Speaker 2: you know, you just have to put yourself in position
Speaker 2: as many times as you can. So having said that,
Speaker 2: you know, I finished fourth at New Orleans last year.
Speaker 2: I kind of came up on on a you know,
Speaker 2: at thirty six hole Sunday afternoon, and you know, I
Speaker 2: didn't have the pressure of the final groups or anything
Speaker 2: like that. You know, put two great rounds together and
Speaker 2: I was able to finish fourth and that really helped
Speaker 2: jump start my summer or I mean, just really keep
Speaker 2: my card last year. That pretty much solidified it. And
Speaker 2: uh but I also had a seventh that's Honda. Earlier
Speaker 2: in the year, played thirty six holes with Phil Mickelson.
Speaker 2: You know, it's put into the pressure of playing with
Speaker 2: one of the superstars of the game, and I was
Speaker 2: able to, you know, play really well with him and
Speaker 2: hold my own. So I knew if I was in
Speaker 2: when I got myself in the contention, I was gonna
Speaker 2: be able to to uh handle the pressure. And Houston
Speaker 2: started out like any other week. I played well on
Speaker 2: on round one. Round two was with some weather delays
Speaker 2: and we had to come back on Saturday morning. And
Speaker 2: this is probably the key, uh for Houston, was you know,
Speaker 2: I was like in twenty fifth position with four holes
Speaker 2: to go to finish my round on Friday or my
Speaker 2: second round on who we finished on Saturday morning, and
Speaker 2: I pready too in my final four and moved inside
Speaker 2: the top ten, and you know, I was able to
Speaker 2: regroup and get a little uh you know, a couple
Speaker 2: hours off between the two rounds, and you know it's
Speaker 2: in third or fourth last pairing, and it was just
Speaker 2: a really good solid round for that Saturday round. But
Speaker 2: I was able to get up and down in the
Speaker 2: final hole on eighteen to cap off a really solid
Speaker 2: round and get myself in the final pairing. So that
Speaker 2: was really really want something I was hoping I could do.
Speaker 2: You never know what's going to happen in the final pairing,
Speaker 2: but I wanted to put myself in the position now
Speaker 2: it's uh, it's what we're what we're out there to
Speaker 2: do is to see how we're gonna compete at the
Speaker 2: highest level. And yeah, it was. It was pretty awesome.
Speaker 2: Teen off, you know, final group on a Sunday on
Speaker 2: the tour and loan of a hold. You know, things
Speaker 2: went my way. You know, I was able to handle
Speaker 2: the pressure and you know, beholding the trophy at the
Speaker 2: end of the at the end of the tournament.
Speaker 1: Uh huh, that's that's cool. It's so would you say that,
Speaker 1: you know, kind of nerves going under around was that
Speaker 1: that you know most you felt or you know, I
Speaker 1: hear from a lot of people the first p shot
Speaker 1: in their first US Open is always you know, really jittery.
Speaker 1: And how how did it compare to some other Pigma
Speaker 1: moments in your career.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I'll agree that the you know, playing in
Speaker 2: US Opens are pretty fantastic. There are great feelings and
Speaker 2: very nervous first keys. You know, my first my first
Speaker 2: PGA Tour event was was awesome playing the in the
Speaker 2: US Open. That was my first PJ tourment, you know,
Speaker 2: that was in twenty ten and U very nervous, but
Speaker 2: it was more the night before you know, just getting
Speaker 2: the Saturday night in the final group, I was tied
Speaker 2: for the lead. There were a bunch of people right
Speaker 2: behind us, behind Jamie and I, and you know, I
Speaker 2: wasn't going to just be able to go out and
Speaker 2: shoot even par I was gonna have to go win it.
Speaker 2: So it's not like I had a multiple shot lead
Speaker 2: and it was mine to lose. I just happened to
Speaker 2: be in the final pairing and I was gonna have
Speaker 2: to go shoot a good round. So I wasn't too
Speaker 2: consumed with that kind of pressure. But just it's you
Speaker 2: can't help but answer the phone or read the text
Speaker 2: or the emails and the tweets and the Facebook, and
Speaker 2: you know everyone's telling you you're gonna do it. It's
Speaker 2: a great confidence boost, but you know you're kind of
Speaker 2: getting ahead of ahead of yourself, and you got to
Speaker 2: just put that aside. And you know I was able
Speaker 2: to do that. I was able to get some good rest.
Speaker 2: I slept pretty well Saturday night, and you know, I
Speaker 2: had a good breakfast. Everything was great. And you know,
Speaker 2: my nerves has been pretty good the last few years.
Speaker 2: I'd say I was more nervous a few years ago.
Speaker 2: If I had been in that position. My short game
Speaker 2: was definitely not up to tour quality and just really
Speaker 2: having some struggles with that. And if I wouldn't have
Speaker 2: been able to get some help with my short game
Speaker 2: the last few years, I definitely would have would not
Speaker 2: been able to close it out because there were some
Speaker 2: shots that just like the up and down on eighteen
Speaker 2: on Saturday, I wouldn't have been able to hit. And
Speaker 2: then obviously I shifted on sixteen to pretty much steal
Speaker 2: or to get the lead and put myself in great position.
Speaker 2: So those are the things that were holding me back.
Speaker 2: Those that's where I've been most nervous, would have been
Speaker 2: missing a green or you know, my potter was fantastic
Speaker 2: that week, so you know, I wasn't even nervous with
Speaker 2: with the final you know, the final putts. I know
Speaker 2: I had a short one left one pretty short on seventeen,
Speaker 2: but I felt really good over the ball and they
Speaker 2: would knocking in and then two putts to win is
Speaker 2: not an easy thing. Yeah, I fought when I hit
Speaker 2: that shot on eighteen. My approach, I was really hoping
Speaker 2: it would it would crest the hill and start trickling
Speaker 2: down and leave myself just a short two putts, but
Speaker 2: it is what it is, and I was able to
Speaker 2: get it done. And uh, I mean, just what a feeling.
Speaker 2: I was overrun with emotion. I'm sure it came out
Speaker 2: on the TV, but uh, what a feeling. You know.
Speaker 2: That's something that I've been trying to accomplish ever started,
Speaker 2: ever since I started playing golf. You know, you junior
Speaker 2: golf and then the high school and college. You dream
Speaker 2: of the tour and someday being uh just a member
Speaker 2: of making the tour and then you know, to call
Speaker 2: myself a PGA Tour winner. It's just awesome and fantastic.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, that's it's really cool. I mean, it's
Speaker 1: the the I guess the next pinnacle is probably a
Speaker 1: major champion, but I mean, just getting to where you're
Speaker 1: at right now, it's it's pretty darn good. So something
Speaker 1: I'm curious about just from my so I look at
Speaker 1: my self, examine and all the time my game and
Speaker 1: playing just an amateur tournaments around you know, the state
Speaker 1: of Illinois, and I look at some of our top
Speaker 1: flight amateur players and then I look at my game
Speaker 1: and it's and you know, something that you hit on
Speaker 1: that I think, you know, I always look at its like,
Speaker 1: I think the short game is always the difference between
Speaker 1: me and some of the top players, where you know
Speaker 1: they're able to manufacture scores. Do you feel like that's
Speaker 1: kind of the you know at the PGA Tour, is
Speaker 1: that the big differentiator as well?
Speaker 2: Yes, it is. Jordan Steve Is is putting so well,
Speaker 2: and he puts himself in contention seems like every week
Speaker 2: because he puts so well. Jason Day is like number
Speaker 2: one and putting right now, So I know he drives
Speaker 2: it so well. In the irons are so well, but
Speaker 2: when he's putting, he's unbeatable. You know. Dustin Johnson drives
Speaker 2: it so well, but I think he's number one in
Speaker 2: short irons, you know, in his wedge game, and if
Speaker 2: that continues, we're all in trouble. So it's I mean
Speaker 2: Phil Mickelson, you know, he'll talk about how many, how
Speaker 2: few fairways he hits and you know, just gets it
Speaker 2: around the green, and you know, he's his short game
Speaker 2: is so good, you know it. You know I don't
Speaker 2: have that. I don't have that ability to miss, uh
Speaker 2: you know, five, six, seven, eight fairways and miss these greens.
Speaker 2: I just don't have the uh the short game to
Speaker 2: get up and down from all the spots that he's doing.
Speaker 2: So it's there. You know, you got to play to
Speaker 2: your strengths. And I know that I'm a better iron
Speaker 2: player from fairways, so I'll definitely stick to my strength.
Speaker 2: So it's hitting the fairway and then given myself, my
Speaker 2: best chance for Bertie is from the fairway and uh,
Speaker 2: low stress rounds. So I definitely try to play to
Speaker 2: my strengths as well as I can, because I know
Speaker 2: when I look back at tournaments and I look at
Speaker 2: my fairways or my greens percentage hit and if it's
Speaker 2: if it's down under sixty percent, I know I'm not
Speaker 2: going to be anywhere near the game contention, just to
Speaker 2: the fact I don't get it up and down as
Speaker 2: many times as they do. So that's definitely something I
Speaker 2: work on. I work on it every week, work on
Speaker 2: the short game with the teacher, and uh yeah, it's
Speaker 2: definitely something you have to have. It's uh, I mean,
Speaker 2: we all drive the ball reasonably, do well, and everyone
Speaker 2: hits it three hundred yards now, it seems like, and
Speaker 2: but you gotta be able to chip and putt.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's what I think. I mean, where you can
Speaker 1: gain the most most strokes on the field is consistently
Speaker 1: getting up and down. And you know, many authorities with wedges.
Speaker 1: You know, a great drive might gain you a tenth
Speaker 1: of a shot, but yeah, versus not getting up and
Speaker 1: down from an easy spot, we'll lose a whole shot
Speaker 1: on the field.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, And that was the thing. It was just
Speaker 2: just routine up and downs. You've got to get them,
Speaker 2: you know, ninety percent, you've got to get them up
Speaker 2: and down. I mean, the hard ones are going to
Speaker 2: be you know, fifty percent. You know, you'll struggle, but
Speaker 2: it's it's just the just the easy ones. You've got
Speaker 2: to be better than that, the easier shots. And uh,
Speaker 2: we're we're getting there, were making a lot of progress.
Speaker 2: So it's good, that's true.
Speaker 1: So I guess, you know, obviously with the win, you
Speaker 1: get the two year exemption, which is just huge. You've
Speaker 1: got the PGA Tour winner status, which can you know,
Speaker 1: get you into tournaments for a long time. And then
Speaker 1: obviously you've now gotten yourself into some you know, the Masters,
Speaker 1: the you know, and uh, into some of the w
Speaker 1: GC events. So tell me about you know, kind of
Speaker 1: how just regular day life has changed, and you know
Speaker 1: what you're kind of what the best thing about being
Speaker 1: a PGA Tour winner.
Speaker 2: Is then, well, life definitely changed. At first week in April,
Speaker 2: no longer not this you know at tour events and uh,
Speaker 2: you know, everyone knows who you are now, and it's
Speaker 2: it's pretty pretty much a great feeling to have a crowd, uh,
Speaker 2: you know cheering for you that you know, you know,
Speaker 2: they know who you are now and uh, you know
Speaker 2: they you can't really but they can't really state how
Speaker 2: much that helps you when you're playing. You know, it's
Speaker 2: it's just a great feeling. So, you know, getting asked
Speaker 2: for autographs, you know, outside of the golf course, people
Speaker 2: know who you are at you know, restaurants and things
Speaker 2: like that. That's just that's been a big change for me,
Speaker 2: and uh, I've embraced it. And I can't imagine how
Speaker 2: the superstars in this game or any other sports, uh,
Speaker 2: how they handle it. Uh, I mean it's just unreal
Speaker 2: the demands that they have on their time and U
Speaker 2: it's I don't have that that problem, but it's it's
Speaker 2: been pretty exciting just to have those things happen to me. Uh,
Speaker 2: you know, after golf course and off the golf course.
Speaker 2: But other than that, I'm still the same guy. Nothing
Speaker 2: for me has changed. I just you know, I was,
Speaker 2: like I said, I was having a pretty boring five
Speaker 2: year career on on the PGA Tour, and uh, I was,
Speaker 2: you know, my one of my best friends does telling me,
Speaker 2: you know that, you know, you're just doing You're doing,
Speaker 2: You're doing great. Five years on tour. You're gonna have
Speaker 2: a pension from the PJ Tour. I mean whatever. I
Speaker 2: would have loved to have said, you know, you're gonna
Speaker 2: play the tour for five years and and that's it
Speaker 2: and never win. I would have taken that. So I
Speaker 2: thought I was having a pretty pretty solid career playing
Speaker 2: golf the last nine nine years professionally, five on the
Speaker 2: PGA Tour pretty pretty exciting stuff. But then to throw
Speaker 2: a win, it's just just amazing. And you know, two
Speaker 2: more years on the tour guaranteed, and uh, you know,
Speaker 2: I'm I'm gonna have played all the all four majors
Speaker 2: in one year. You know, I'm in the Open next
Speaker 2: week and uh PGA to follow up a few weeks
Speaker 2: after that. That's just things that would have never even
Speaker 2: thought were possible. And Uh, now here they are. Those
Speaker 2: are the only things that have really changed on my
Speaker 2: end is just the tournaments I've gotten in as a
Speaker 2: result of the win, and just not having to look
Speaker 2: very far down the patic couples to see my name.
Speaker 2: That's that's a pretty that's a pretty cool feeling.
Speaker 1: Less growing is always better, That's right. So you know,
Speaker 1: with the with the Open coming up next week, why
Speaker 1: didn't you.
Speaker 2: Talk it through?
Speaker 1: You know, how you're preparing differently for you know, the
Speaker 1: weather conditions, the style of golf, and kind of your
Speaker 1: experience so far with links golf in your life and career.
Speaker 2: Well, spend the summer with my wife, My wife and
Speaker 2: my kids. We spend it in Philadelphia with her mom
Speaker 2: and dad. It's just easy to travel out of Philly
Speaker 2: and we can get to a lot of locations here
Speaker 2: from here, and that we do in South Florida. Uh,
Speaker 2: And it's not as hot on a regular basis as
Speaker 2: it is in Florida. So we're up here and I'm
Speaker 2: gonna play a few great golf courses here the next
Speaker 2: few days. And I've been very fortunate those members at
Speaker 2: the great clubs here at Philly, and uh, you know,
Speaker 2: Mary and being being one of them. That's one of
Speaker 2: my all time favorite golf courses. So I'm gonna play
Speaker 2: out there on Friday. And another hidden gym here in Philly,
Speaker 2: uh Rolling Green Country Club, but I think I'm playing
Speaker 2: there tomorrow and William Flynn just a great golf course.
Speaker 2: Will be my first time around there, so I'm not
Speaker 2: playing anything anything different with golf courses. But you know,
Speaker 2: while I'm playing, I'm probably gonna just be aware of
Speaker 2: how high I'm teen, and I know we'll definitely try
Speaker 2: to keep this keep the t shots lower. I'm probably
Speaker 2: gonna just take my hybrid out and not even have
Speaker 2: it with me because I'm pretty sure i'm gonna be
Speaker 2: using a three iron or two iron instead of a hybrid,
Speaker 2: and uh, just with when I'm around greens, I'm probably
Speaker 2: just gonna be aware of just going low. I know
Speaker 2: we'll be putting the ball in the on the ground
Speaker 2: as much as possible. But one other thing is just
Speaker 2: having been over there, the bunkers get really deep and severe,
Speaker 2: So you know, just gonna put in some practice here
Speaker 2: at home just getting my bunker shots up as quickly
Speaker 2: as possible. I know that, you know, the sad faced
Speaker 2: bunkers over there are just just brutals. So those are
Speaker 2: just a few things, and but other than that, it's
Speaker 2: it's just gonna be It's gonna be great. Uh my first,
Speaker 2: my first Open championship, and Oil Troon looks like it
Speaker 2: is quite the test. It's your classic out and in
Speaker 2: of course, I think the first uh seven are straight
Speaker 2: out coaching stamp on the eighth and then it turns
Speaker 2: around and then it starts coming back and heard the
Speaker 2: when you come back, you better have been under par
Speaker 2: on your way out because you're going to give it
Speaker 2: back the way yet. So it's, uh, it's here. We're
Speaker 2: gonna have some weather, so it's it's gonna be in
Speaker 2: the fifties, sixties and kind of rainy, and uh you know,
Speaker 2: it's probably par for the course over there during most
Speaker 2: of the opens. Uh. I've been over to Scotland once,
Speaker 2: took a trip with a couple of friends of mine
Speaker 2: and we were over on the other side of scott
Speaker 2: Owner and Andrews and Carnoski and Mierfield and Aberdeen and
Speaker 2: played some really great golf courses over there. But so
Speaker 2: I have an idea of what scott if golf's all about.
Speaker 2: We also took a trip to England and played the
Speaker 2: road of courses in Northern England or We'll live in
Speaker 2: Saint Anne's and hoy Lake and Royal Birkdale and those
Speaker 2: were just some fabulous golf courses. But looking forward to it.
Speaker 2: My wife's gonna go with me and just the two
Speaker 2: of us and the caddie all the year over there
Speaker 2: with us as well. But looking forward to the test
Speaker 2: of the British Open and seeing how I can do
Speaker 2: and we'll see what happens.
Speaker 1: Yeah, you just got a channel. That drive you hit
Speaker 1: on eighteen at Houston is that low bullet? That thing
Speaker 1: was awesome.
Speaker 2: Yeah, definitely need more of those. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So going back to golf courses, we're I'm really into
Speaker 1: golf course architecture. I think it's a kind of avenue
Speaker 1: of further enjoyment of the game that more and more
Speaker 1: people need to get into. And I'd love to hear
Speaker 1: kind of your favorite tour stops from a golf course perspective,
Speaker 1: you know, whether you play well at the course or not,
Speaker 1: you know, and then also kind of your favorite courses
Speaker 1: that you've gotten the chance to play across the country
Speaker 1: and the world, as in in the golf Yuh as
Speaker 1: a golf bro.
Speaker 2: Well, I've been very fortunate. I'm gonna start off there too.
Speaker 2: Before I was on tour, you know, I worked in
Speaker 2: some in South Florida, and then I obviously worked in
Speaker 2: New Jersey. And it's very fortunate to be able to
Speaker 2: play a lot of break golf courses in New Jersey
Speaker 2: and spent my time there, and uh just became a
Speaker 2: fan of the architecture side of golf at that time
Speaker 2: as well. And uh played a lot of C. B.
Speaker 2: McDonald and SETH Rayner's in the northeast, and uh, and
Speaker 2: then get here there's a lot of Donald Rosses up
Speaker 2: there as well. So a couple of courses right there
Speaker 2: in Jersey that I loved were Somerset Hills and uh
Speaker 2: Mountain Ridge, and just those are two of my all
Speaker 2: time favorites there in New Jersey, and then here, spent
Speaker 2: a lot of time in Philly, and very like I
Speaker 2: said before, very fortunate to uh you know, some members
Speaker 2: and they've been very gracious and happy out and uh,
Speaker 2: you know, just Hugh Wilson's Marian is just just a gentleman.
Speaker 2: I'd love it there. I love playing Mary and it's
Speaker 2: just a treat. And then uh, you know, we have
Speaker 2: so many other great ones Aronomic and Philly Cricket and
Speaker 2: just across the way in New Jersey with Pine Valley
Speaker 2: and uh, such such a hot bed for golf up
Speaker 2: here in golf, great golf courses, in great golf architecture,
Speaker 2: and very blessed to uh be able to uh get
Speaker 2: around there, get around on those courses here in the summer. Yeah,
Speaker 2: but on I'm sorry, on tour, there's obviously, uh my
Speaker 2: my couple of my favorites are Pebble Beach. How can
Speaker 2: you not like Pebble Beach. It's just uh, I played
Speaker 2: my first Open at Double and uh, you know, just
Speaker 2: love playing the at and t there every year. And
Speaker 2: then uh, Ross down in Greensboro at Sedgefield is just
Speaker 2: one of my other favorites, don't I don't know if
Speaker 2: I'm gonna play there this year or not, but it's
Speaker 2: always one of my favorite spots. And then gotta gotta
Speaker 2: throw in the golf cub of Houston now is one
Speaker 2: of my favorite tour stops for the favorite tour courses.
Speaker 2: So you know it's they they have it manicure just
Speaker 2: just so we can get ready for Augusta, and they
Speaker 2: do a great job. Every every blade of grass is
Speaker 2: perfectly maintained and it's it's just a great, great venue,
Speaker 2: a lot of risk reward holes. And and then non
Speaker 2: tour golf courses. I think I have a fondness for
Speaker 2: Trump National in Bedminster, New Jersey, having worked there a
Speaker 2: few years. And they're going to be hosting the Women's
Speaker 2: Open next summer and then when the Men's PGA and
Speaker 2: twenty twenty two, so it'll fit into it being a
Speaker 2: tour course at some point. But obviously his best work,
Speaker 2: Trump's best work is at Trump National Bedminster. And then
Speaker 2: a great course back home in Cincinnati, Coldstream Country Club.
Speaker 2: Comargo gets a lot of the love for the finest
Speaker 2: golf course in Cincinnati, but I think Coldstream might be
Speaker 2: my favorite. It's definitely my favorite. I have a little
Speaker 2: biased there, one of the city Amateur tournament there, but
Speaker 2: Dick Wilson is just a great, great golf course there.
Speaker 2: And then one of my favorite ones in Florida is
Speaker 2: Jupiter Hills, George Fazio design and just has lots of
Speaker 2: character and plenty of elevation for being right, you know,
Speaker 2: a quarter mile from the ocean and yeah, that point
Speaker 2: the beach.
Speaker 1: I drive by it all the time, and I mean
Speaker 1: it's amazing how many hills they have there versus the
Speaker 1: rest of the terrain.
Speaker 2: And uh, in that area it's so flat, and.
Speaker 1: You know that course has so many hills. I'm I'm excited.
Speaker 1: I haven't gotten to play a ton of golf in
Speaker 1: the Northeast and and I'm heading out to Philly in
Speaker 1: a couple of weeks for a wedding and I'm flying
Speaker 1: out a few days early and going to get some
Speaker 1: some courses them out there. So that's that'll be exciting.
Speaker 1: But uh, in terms of kind of favorite architects, you've
Speaker 1: hit on a few, you know, kind of who stands
Speaker 1: out as your favorite architects.
Speaker 2: Well, I mean having played a bunch of the C
Speaker 2: B McDonald Steth rainers, Uh, they you know there you
Speaker 2: see their work most as you travel all over the country,
Speaker 2: and I know they did so many golf courses across
Speaker 2: the country, and their their work is you know, you
Speaker 2: just can't get a better design than you know, like
Speaker 2: that radiant, the radan hole that they have. There's so
Speaker 2: many great radans. Chicago Golf Club has maybe the hardest
Speaker 2: hardest dance Part three in the country. Uh, Tomargo has
Speaker 2: a great dance.
Speaker 1: But yeah, we just did a big piece on dance.
Speaker 1: We're doing We're I'm writing like detailed kind of detailed
Speaker 1: articles with overviews evolved the template holes and then extensive
Speaker 1: pictures of different clubs and their version of the radan.
Speaker 1: I mean, I think it's so cool how they have
Speaker 1: these template holes and you know, you look at them
Speaker 1: from course to course and they're different, but they're you know,
Speaker 1: kind of the same, and it's just observing how they
Speaker 1: use the land so much differently. Is uh, is the
Speaker 1: coolest part about it?
Speaker 2: I think, Oh, it sure is. And then just for
Speaker 2: people that don't know, uh, and I didn't know, like
Speaker 2: when you see the Barritz full you know, I was
Speaker 2: playing Camargo and Cincinnati and the US Amateur Qualifier. I'm
Speaker 2: just always wondering about this. You know, what is this?
Speaker 2: You know eight foot dipth in the green or in
Speaker 2: front of the green? Like, what is that about? And
Speaker 2: then you just learn about it and read up and
Speaker 2: it's it's such a great feature and it's all over
Speaker 2: the golf courses. Uh, you know, and like you said,
Speaker 2: in the template holes across the country and there's so
Speaker 2: many great Barrits holes as well, and it's so unique.
Speaker 2: And like you said, they they had their temple, but
Speaker 2: they you know, they used the land that they were
Speaker 2: given and blended it in and uh that's uh. I
Speaker 2: just enjoyed playing those those golf courses and especially uh
Speaker 2: uh like I said, I think Camargo is A is
Speaker 2: a great one there in Sinci and Chicago golf is
Speaker 2: one of my one of my all time favorites.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's the uh as a Chicago and the one
Speaker 1: course that I haven't checked off here and.
Speaker 2: Just driving me, you won't be disappointed. I know.
Speaker 1: Every year I just crossed my fingers that this is
Speaker 1: bigger that I'll somehow get invite it out there. But
Speaker 1: it's uh, you just gotta sit and wait. It's a
Speaker 1: waiting game for a lot of the great golf courses.
Speaker 2: Sure is.
Speaker 1: But yeah, So in terms of kind of I always
Speaker 1: am curious with different tour pros, what what do you
Speaker 1: do in your downtime when you're at say a tournament
Speaker 1: and reno or you know, and uh, and lots of
Speaker 1: like not me, not lots of things, but you know,
Speaker 1: these these tournaments you know, when you're not playing, what
Speaker 1: are you doing?
Speaker 2: For the most part, you mentioned two favorite. You know,
Speaker 2: any any course that has a casino, lots of lots
Speaker 2: of opportunity for entertainment. So unfortunately, uh, you know, I'm
Speaker 2: probably like ninety percent of the pghor golfers. We all
Speaker 2: like the gambles. So if there's a casine on your
Speaker 2: we're always in there just playing some black jack, just
Speaker 2: passing the time. But you know, on the road, it
Speaker 2: all depends if my family's with me or not. If
Speaker 2: I'm alone, it just seems like I'm pretty low key.
Speaker 2: I watch a lot of movies or you know, a
Speaker 2: lot of Netflix in the room, and get a lot
Speaker 2: of take out and you know, burrito joints, Chipotle or
Speaker 2: mos And I'm very very easy, so I don't do
Speaker 2: a whole lot. It's pretty sad actually when you think
Speaker 2: about it. But it's the families with me. We try
Speaker 2: to get out and you know, get something. Uh you know,
Speaker 2: we're just planning, planning the day around the kids and
Speaker 2: in my golf schedule. So you know, we do as
Speaker 2: much as we can together and if I can't join them,
Speaker 2: I love when my wife takes we have a six
Speaker 2: year old and two year old. UH to the zoos
Speaker 2: and in each city or in DC a couple of
Speaker 2: weeks ago they went to the Rains Base Museum and
Speaker 2: just great things for them to uh to experience and uh,
Speaker 2: but we we definitely like the zoos in each town.
Speaker 2: The kids love the animals and uh uh downtime at
Speaker 2: home when I'm not playing, you know, I just try
Speaker 2: to do whatever I can to be with the family.
Speaker 2: Depends if it's a summer or in school. My daughter
Speaker 2: will be in first grade, so you know, it'll be
Speaker 2: hard for them to travel as much once that starts
Speaker 2: back up in late August. And to be honest, I
Speaker 2: play a lot of golf when I'm the home, and
Speaker 2: you know, it's uh, I can turn the switch off
Speaker 2: and on between tournament golf and casual golf. I love playing.
Speaker 2: I just love playing golf with friends and uh, you know,
Speaker 2: It's just always been a part of my life and
Speaker 2: it'll it'll continue to be a part of my life
Speaker 2: after touring is over or when I'm when I'm at home,
Speaker 2: do a lot of fantasy sports and really enjoy the
Speaker 2: following that stuff. And I'm just a sports fan in general,
Speaker 2: so I might as well do the fantasy on top
Speaker 2: of it.
Speaker 1: So, yeah, the Bengals. You gotta be a Bengals.
Speaker 2: Fan, right, I'm definitely a Bengals fan. So it's uh,
Speaker 2: it's been hard at times, but we're gonna we're gonna
Speaker 2: break through this year. We're gonna get get deep into
Speaker 2: the playoffs this year. So we're we've been close the
Speaker 2: last five years. We're gonna do it. So Reds are
Speaker 2: struggling right now, so it's all in the Bengals.
Speaker 1: So yeah, yeah, my Coveyes are beating us the central teams.
Speaker 2: So films are doing well. They're killing the Reds today,
Speaker 2: I think.
Speaker 1: All right, So I got a couple questions if you
Speaker 1: if you got a little bit more time from our
Speaker 1: some of our readers, thanks again for taking the time.
Speaker 1: But so from Stuart Smith, Uh, you want to know,
Speaker 1: is the driver close to being obsolete on the PGA
Speaker 1: Tour when classic courses are the hosts.
Speaker 2: Well you definitely see that. You know, let's just take
Speaker 2: Plainfield last year for the Barclays. You know, a classic
Speaker 2: Donald Ross and I was using hybrid quite a bit.
Speaker 2: So when they pinched the pinched the fairways and the
Speaker 2: bunkers are positions like they are. Yeah, there's not going
Speaker 2: to be a whole lot of drivers except for you know,
Speaker 2: the guys that hit driver no matter what. I think
Speaker 2: Dustin is a one guy that is going to hit
Speaker 2: the driver no matter what. So you know he showed
Speaker 2: you at Oakmont. I don't know how. You know. Oakmont
Speaker 2: was just impossible if you did not drive it in
Speaker 2: the fairway and he drove it long and he drove straight.
Speaker 2: So when that's your best, if that's your straightest club,
Speaker 2: you will always continue to hit driver. I think, uh,
Speaker 2: you know, we don't go to there's only a handful
Speaker 2: of tournaments that go to classic courses. So I don't
Speaker 2: think that's going to be much of an issue on
Speaker 2: the tour anymore. I mean, we've played a lot of
Speaker 2: tPCS and you know, just golf clubs like Houston that
Speaker 2: were made for drivers, and you know they're stretching them
Speaker 2: out seventy five hundred yards, you know, like a Congressional.
Speaker 2: We just played Congressional seventy five seventy six hundred yards. It's, uh,
Speaker 2: that's the norm. I think we get some golf courses
Speaker 2: like Hilton Head, you know where you really have to
Speaker 2: position your ball well and uh, you know, even the
Speaker 2: course like well, we just played in an acron that
Speaker 2: the firestone, you know, with the there's a lot of
Speaker 2: overgrown trees and you've got to be positioned pretty well
Speaker 2: all and we definitely hit some hybrids and three woods
Speaker 2: off tas. I think hit three wood on eighteen three
Speaker 2: of the four days and uh, and you just got
Speaker 2: to be positioned pretty well. So yeah, it is unfortunate
Speaker 2: with the U with the length of the drives these days,
Speaker 2: that some courses are becoming uh obsolete for TJA Tour
Speaker 2: or major golfs. And uh, we'll see what happens. I
Speaker 2: don't know what the answer is going to be. But
Speaker 2: the ball is going a long way pulls.
Speaker 1: You know, and like you said, for you you've got
Speaker 1: to be in the fairway to hit the greens and
Speaker 1: that's your keys to good tournaments. So you know, for
Speaker 1: ye the driver might you know, not make as much
Speaker 1: sense at a tighter golf course because you want to
Speaker 1: hit the fairway. Sure so in terms of uh so,
Speaker 1: we have another question from Michael Michael Carocelli here he
Speaker 1: wants to know in terms of pre round routine on
Speaker 1: the range and putting green. You know, kind of what
Speaker 1: your your pre round routine is and how many drivers
Speaker 1: do you hit on the range before a round?
Speaker 2: Okay, great question. I arrived at the putting green an
Speaker 2: hour before my teats my starting time, and I take
Speaker 2: about ten minutes of of just long speed drills. Just
Speaker 2: no specific amount, but it just seems like it always
Speaker 2: has to be about ten minutes and just working on pace,
Speaker 2: just trying to get some feel, and you know, working
Speaker 2: on just some longer putts twenty footers, thirty footers, just
Speaker 2: back and forth and just kind of just letting out
Speaker 2: some you know, the nerves and just an easy way
Speaker 2: to start into your routine. And then just depending if
Speaker 2: the if they have a pitching green or chipping green nearby,
Speaker 2: I'll move on to that next and hit a few
Speaker 2: bunker shots as well, another ten or so minutes and
Speaker 2: then move on to the range and good, you know,
Speaker 2: good twenty minutes of full shots, just go right up
Speaker 2: the bag from the love wedge. Usually go every other
Speaker 2: club and you know, just five or six balls with
Speaker 2: each club, and again once you get to the woods,
Speaker 2: it's there's no set amount, but usually it'll end up
Speaker 2: about six to seven drivers and it usually takes up
Speaker 2: about twenty to thirty minutes and head back to the
Speaker 2: putting greens for a quick little run through of you
Speaker 2: know inside ten feet, inside five feet, to seeing the ball,
Speaker 2: you know, get onto some straight puts, to seeing the
Speaker 2: ball going in the hole, and just getting your confidence
Speaker 2: up and getting ready to go. So no specific number
Speaker 2: of shots, but it just seems to work out the
Speaker 2: same way age time.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's kind of similar to you know a lot
Speaker 1: you hear, it's a little bit of everything and just
Speaker 1: really building confidence. Huh m hm, Well that's awesome. Well,
Speaker 1: we really appreciate the time that you were able to
Speaker 1: give us, especially you know, a week before a big major.
Speaker 1: We'll be pulling for you over there. And then uh,
Speaker 1: what's uh when you get done with the British, what's
Speaker 1: the schedule look like they're on out.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a pretty packed summer. We had the the Open,
Speaker 2: and then we had the US Open, and then we
Speaker 2: had the Bridge Stone and now it's Greenbrier was canceled,
Speaker 2: which was this week due to the flooding, and my goodness,
Speaker 2: that was just terrible. Hopefully, uh, everything gets cleaned up
Speaker 2: down there and UH, but off the off to the
Speaker 2: Open and then just trying to put together the final
Speaker 2: UH thoughts on the schedule. I've got Canada right after
Speaker 2: the Open. Whether I'm playing it or not, I got
Speaker 2: to make that decision this week and then UH and
Speaker 2: then right into the PGA Campion. So if I play all,
Speaker 2: if I play Canada, I'll play these three weeks and
Speaker 2: it will be three great tournaments, three great venues and
Speaker 2: U and then then it's gonna be a little bit
Speaker 2: of off time to get get back to Florida, get settled,
Speaker 2: get my daughter ready for UH for first grade, and
Speaker 2: then the playoffs will be starting up. So there'll be
Speaker 2: three three events Travelers John Deere in the Greensboro Greater Greensboro,
Speaker 2: and I'll probably play one of them, Greensboro being more
Speaker 2: likely the UH the one that I might play right
Speaker 2: before the playoffs. And then it's four weeks of playoffs.
Speaker 2: Hopefully I'm you know, looking good to be in the
Speaker 2: first three events, the Barclays, the Deutsche Bank and the
Speaker 2: BMW and in Indiana. I think it's in the Indiana
Speaker 2: this year at crook a Stick, not in Chicago this year,
Speaker 2: but looking forward to that. It's close to home. Uh,
Speaker 2: I'm sure I'll have a lot of family and friends
Speaker 2: out from Cincinnati and look forward to that and trying
Speaker 2: to get into the Tour Championship. That's been my h.
Speaker 2: I've got two goals left on the year. I've accomplished
Speaker 2: a lot this year, but finishing the top thirty uh
Speaker 2: and making the Tour Championship and then obviously uh making
Speaker 2: the Ryder Cup to be the final goals. So we'll
Speaker 2: see if we can we can get those two and yeah,
Speaker 2: we'll be just be an awesome year.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's already been a good one and hopefully I
Speaker 1: could be a great one with you know, you get
Speaker 1: another winner, another couple of top fives in there, and
Speaker 1: that's definitely a possibility, right.
Speaker 2: That's right, it's all it's all good stuff. So it's
Speaker 2: very blessed to be on the tour and you know,
Speaker 2: just winning was just fabulous and really proud of the
Speaker 2: hard work that went into it. But thanks for having
Speaker 2: me on, and this is great talk and love talking
Speaker 2: to golf and golf architecture and everything that is that
Speaker 2: this great game of golf offers.
Speaker 1: So yeah, let us know if you're in town and
Speaker 1: we'll uh we'll go uh, we'll get you out to
Speaker 1: some of the some of the courses up here and
Speaker 1: then uh yeah, so look forward to look forward to
Speaker 1: watching you this next week at the British and uh,
Speaker 1: thanks so much for your time. We really appreciate it.
Speaker 2: Thank you so much.