Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg Business Week from Bloomberg Radio. I'm Jason
Speaker 1: Kelly and I'm Carol Masser. Welcome to the Bloomberg Business
Speaker 1: Week Extra. It's our weekly podcast. Bring you an interview
Speaker 1: you'll not hear anywhere else. And seriously, I was not
Speaker 1: going to hear this anywhere else. I went on vacation
Speaker 1: and you went off and did a great interview about
Speaker 1: the future of vacations with the CEO and president of Carnival. Right,
Speaker 1: we're talking about Arnold Donald and Carnival. It's the world's
Speaker 1: largest cruising group and the cruise industry. Jason, you and
Speaker 1: I know this. We've been talking about it a lot.
Speaker 1: It's one of the hardest hit industries by the coronavirus.
Speaker 1: Carnival alone has seen its stock plummet. It's sold off ships,
Speaker 1: it's lost billions of dollars. It's raised billions more to
Speaker 1: get through the crisis. Bottom line, though, it's really all
Speaker 1: about getting ships back to seat. Check out this conversation. Arnold.
Speaker 1: It is great to have you back with us. How
Speaker 1: are you doing, Carol, Thanks for asking. I'm great. How
Speaker 1: are you doing? Yeah? Kind of getting used to a
Speaker 1: new world order. And I guess the million dollar are
Speaker 1: billion dollar question, Arnold. You know that everybody has on
Speaker 1: their mind is how do you get the cruise industry?
Speaker 1: How do you get passengers back on ships? How do
Speaker 1: you get ships back at sea safely and responsible responsibly
Speaker 1: around the world. Well, you know, Carol, the first of all,
Speaker 1: you know, our primary responsibilities and therefore our top priority
Speaker 1: is always compliance, environmental protection and the health, safety and
Speaker 1: well being of our guests, of the people in the
Speaker 1: places we go, and of course our carnival family, our
Speaker 1: shipboard and short side personnel. So you know, the interests
Speaker 1: of public health is always in the forefront for us.
Speaker 1: And how do we get people back on ships when
Speaker 1: there's some social gathering and society has developed the compensating
Speaker 1: measures that is comfortable with that we have effectively mitigated
Speaker 1: the spread of COVID nineteen and then we'll be able
Speaker 1: to cruise again. And there are a lot of people,
Speaker 1: as you know, Carrol, who are ready to cruise right now.
Speaker 1: And in fact, we're looking at starting up in Europe
Speaker 1: where the spread has been mitigate it substantially in places
Speaker 1: like Germany and Italy, and we're looking at starting up
Speaker 1: in September. There and a few um cruise lines have,
Speaker 1: but there's a lot of pin up demand, you know,
Speaker 1: for travel in general, and especially for cruise. Well, and
Speaker 1: what I wonder Arnold, though, can you kind of drill
Speaker 1: down a little bit what are some of the specific
Speaker 1: protocols that you might put in place to get ships
Speaker 1: safely back at sea. I've been reading, you know, about
Speaker 1: different folks and what they might be considering different cruise lines.
Speaker 1: They're talking about no buffets, constant um temperature checks, constant testing,
Speaker 1: maybe no excursions. What specific protocols will you be putting
Speaker 1: in place? Well, again, as you well know, we we
Speaker 1: have a lot of measures in place already on cruise
Speaker 1: that often short side destinations don't already have or didn't
Speaker 1: have prior to COVID nineteen. We do medical screens, we
Speaker 1: were already doing temperature checks in many cases. Um, we
Speaker 1: had hand sanitizers throughout the ship and signs all over
Speaker 1: about washing your hands because we've had to deal with
Speaker 1: viruses and the over seven hundred parts and destinations we
Speaker 1: go to annually for many years now. Course, CORVID nineteen
Speaker 1: is especially unique because the whole world is shut down,
Speaker 1: and because of that, there's still a lot of learning
Speaker 1: around COVID nineteen. As you know from all the scientists,
Speaker 1: there's still a lining around epidemiology. They're lying around testing,
Speaker 1: they're lying around the role of testing. The one thing
Speaker 1: everybody right now is aligned on, though, is that you know,
Speaker 1: good personal care in terms of wearing a mask, washing
Speaker 1: your hands, um, using hand sanitizers, you know, physical distancing
Speaker 1: at appropriate times, but wearing a mask is a great
Speaker 1: way to mitigate the spread. So for the time being,
Speaker 1: any cruises that will happen will certainly incorporate some physical
Speaker 1: distancing and you know, wearing masks, and of course what
Speaker 1: we already had was the the hand sanitizers, etcetera. Beyond that, um,
Speaker 1: there's a plethora of possibilities, but it depends on the destination,
Speaker 1: depends on the level of community spreading that destination, etcetera.
Speaker 1: So there could be various testing protocols. I mean, that's
Speaker 1: a possibility for the US is premature. You know, we're
Speaker 1: not ready to sail here yet. Obviously the community spread
Speaker 1: is still pretty vibrant here in the US, and when
Speaker 1: went out of position to sail here, and we're walking
Speaker 1: cautiously in the other places too, because our primary interests
Speaker 1: is to stand what everyone else in mitigating the spread
Speaker 1: of COVID nineteen. But I did read your your coster
Speaker 1: cruise is safety protocols and you talked about three tests
Speaker 1: for crew members before boarding. Um. You also talked about,
Speaker 1: of course social distancing, new filters. UM Entertainment will have
Speaker 1: more shows on during the day so that they're smaller groups.
Speaker 1: And then also no self service restaurants, so no buffets,
Speaker 1: which for many of you go on a cruise, they're
Speaker 1: pretty used to it. So there are some changes coming.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, absolutely for the ones that are going to
Speaker 1: sail now, we have to be ready, just like hotels today,
Speaker 1: any hotel that's opened the day has to deal with
Speaker 1: the current situation and the limited knowledge thereas. And so
Speaker 1: for Costa we are deploying a number of testing protocols.
Speaker 1: Obviously for our crew we have not only testing but quarantine.
Speaker 1: Except because it's really important for us to have the
Speaker 1: clue crew UM, you know, safe from the beginning and
Speaker 1: then to keep them safe. And obviously UM once we
Speaker 1: get guests on board, will have protocolls on board for them.
Speaker 1: I do wonder how you do it safely. I mean, Arnold,
Speaker 1: you know this industry better than everyone, uh and better
Speaker 1: than most in terms of lay personnel. But I wonder
Speaker 1: how you do it safely because there have been some
Speaker 1: smaller cruise operations that have come out of Europe, come
Speaker 1: out of Alaska, Tahiti, UM, and I believe there are
Speaker 1: less at least ten crew members aboard UM. Your I
Speaker 1: eat a cruise ships out of Germany that contacted the
Speaker 1: virus ahead of you getting ready to kind of get
Speaker 1: back to the seas UM. That was in August. So
Speaker 1: I just wonder how do you do this safely when
Speaker 1: even when some small cruise operations are starting to go
Speaker 1: back out on the water and still having problems with
Speaker 1: the virus and people are contacting the virus. Carol, think
Speaker 1: those two stage Just one is you want to reduce
Speaker 1: the risk of having UM the COVID nineteen come on
Speaker 1: board from shore. So that's the first thing. So you
Speaker 1: test UM, you monitor, and you quarantine in the case
Speaker 1: of the crew. So the ones you mentioned on Aida,
Speaker 1: you know, those crew members were tested before they left
Speaker 1: their home country, and then they were tested again once
Speaker 1: they arrived in Germany and we got some positives. They
Speaker 1: were then retested again and a couple of In several
Speaker 1: of those cases, the individuals got a double negative test
Speaker 1: after that, which meant they had a false positive, and
Speaker 1: then the others were obviously isolated in quarantine and so
Speaker 1: the risk of them spreading it on board with zero
Speaker 1: because we wouldn't have them sail. Okay. Now, once you're
Speaker 1: at that level, the next question is what else are
Speaker 1: you're doing to mitigate spread? And that's why all the
Speaker 1: other practices on board. Any event you do get someone
Speaker 1: on board who has COVID nineteen, if it's in society, um,
Speaker 1: if it's out there in general, chances are you eventually
Speaker 1: will have someone on board the ship that will have it.
Speaker 1: And so the trick then, of course, is to make
Speaker 1: certain that you are able to quickly identify, that you
Speaker 1: can isolate the person, and that during the time they
Speaker 1: were exposed there was plenty of mitigation and of risk
Speaker 1: protocols in place, so the probability of spread has been
Speaker 1: greatly reduced. And that's where you know, wearing masks, physical distancing,
Speaker 1: washing your hands, um, using a handstand, the size, et cetera,
Speaker 1: all come into play. Arnold, I do also wonder you know,
Speaker 1: what are your plans for passengers and crew members who
Speaker 1: do get sick in the future. You know, you know
Speaker 1: the horror stories of ships that were you know, basically
Speaker 1: lost at sea they couldn't find a homeport. You I know,
Speaker 1: and your team have spent you know, a long time
Speaker 1: repaytrading you know, your crew members back home. So what
Speaker 1: do you do? Will there be a way to airlift
Speaker 1: passengers off ships? What will you do? You're absolutely right,
Speaker 1: you know, we had to repay trade over eighty thousand
Speaker 1: crew members, and it took us quite a while with
Speaker 1: boorders closed and airlines shut down, et cetera. So it
Speaker 1: took us several months to effectively do that, but we
Speaker 1: were eventually able to do it. In regards to now,
Speaker 1: you know that was before now, there's enough understanding we
Speaker 1: would not go to a destination where we did not
Speaker 1: have a plan already in the event that there was
Speaker 1: COVID on board. We're not going to tie up thousands
Speaker 1: of people off of one positive COVID case or a
Speaker 1: couple of positive COVID cases. You know, we would have
Speaker 1: the protocols in place to ensure one that the individual
Speaker 1: is taken care of whoever has it, that we can
Speaker 1: get them the care they need. Um. And then number
Speaker 1: two that everyone else, uh is an effect that you know,
Speaker 1: we would have some form of contact tracing on our boards,
Speaker 1: so we know who we're the most exposed people. But
Speaker 1: we have to have those protocols for each destination. We
Speaker 1: go to seven hundred ports and destinations around the world,
Speaker 1: so they're all not going to have the exact same protocols.
Speaker 1: And and but we will not go to a place
Speaker 1: where we haven't established exactly any event there is a
Speaker 1: COVID case exactly what's going to happen, all right, But
Speaker 1: you're not worried about as we know this virus you know,
Speaker 1: spread so so quickly, um, that you could go out
Speaker 1: to see and end up with a handful of passengers
Speaker 1: or a lot more passengers, hundreds of passengers and be
Speaker 1: kind of stuck at sea. And I mean, I'm just curious,
Speaker 1: what would you do that we won't. We won't sail
Speaker 1: on the situation where we can be stuck at sea.
Speaker 1: I think again, there's a lot more knowledge now than
Speaker 1: when that was happening. Number one, you know, we will
Speaker 1: have some capability of testing on board. When that happened before,
Speaker 1: we didn't. We we will. There's a lot of understanding
Speaker 1: now about how to mitigate spread. Back then, nobody was
Speaker 1: talking about you know, why you were cruising. You know,
Speaker 1: potentially wearing masks are physical distancing that that kind of thing. UM.
Speaker 1: And similarly, we have to look at the incidents of
Speaker 1: spreading a community. You know, we're not going to probably
Speaker 1: sell out of a community where the incidents are spread
Speaker 1: is very high because you're almost certainly they're gonna have it,
Speaker 1: have it on board. UM, so we we have to
Speaker 1: have the protocols. We have a great UM group of
Speaker 1: advisors UM scientific advisors. A number of them participated in
Speaker 1: a summit on COVID that we held with the World
Speaker 1: Travel on Tourism Council. Wasn't about travel, it wasn't about cruise,
Speaker 1: it was about the science of COVID and UM a
Speaker 1: number of our advisors participated in that um that that
Speaker 1: we we produced and and my co hosted with Gloria
Speaker 1: Gavira from w TCC. And so we're using their advice.
Speaker 1: And of course every destination is studying this, every port,
Speaker 1: every city, every nation and will as always be in compliance. UH.
Speaker 1: And so we'll all have a protocol in place because
Speaker 1: no one wants, you know, thousands of people you know
Speaker 1: stuck s C. Nobody wants no doubt about that, and
Speaker 1: I am curious about guidance from the CDC. I mean,
Speaker 1: what are you hearing, Arnold right now from the CDC
Speaker 1: about what they want to see specifically from Carnival before
Speaker 1: heading out at sea again. Well, CDC is concentrating initially
Speaker 1: on what we call the pause. You know, a number
Speaker 1: of US volunteer to stop sailing and so on in
Speaker 1: the CDC issued on no sale orders, and so they've
Speaker 1: concentrated on the ships because even though we're in a pause,
Speaker 1: we still have twelve thousand crew required to minimally man
Speaker 1: our ships. The ships are still out there to still operate,
Speaker 1: and so the CDC focus on that initially. UH. And
Speaker 1: now they've started beginning to ask for public input and
Speaker 1: UH to be submitted in terms of consideration um for
Speaker 1: crews going forward, but there have been no specific direction
Speaker 1: given on what's expected. What we're gonna do is again
Speaker 1: use our expert advisory group to inform us, to use
Speaker 1: the experiences around the world that we have and others have,
Speaker 1: and we'll put together you know, the appropriate protocol at
Speaker 1: the time we think that it makes sense to begin
Speaker 1: to consider cruising again, um out of the U S.
Speaker 1: So the CDC isn't say anything, aren't like, okay, positivity
Speaker 1: rates who want to see it, you know, below ten percent,
Speaker 1: below five percent, they're not giving you any kind of
Speaker 1: guidance like that specific items. No, not at this time.
Speaker 1: And I don't think you know, I don't. I think
Speaker 1: it's fine that they're not again, you know, right now,
Speaker 1: look at the US in many places where talking still
Speaker 1: talking about shell training, place stay at home. Very limited
Speaker 1: universities are figuring out what to do. Schools are figuring
Speaker 1: out what to do. And as long as we're not
Speaker 1: you know, just comfortably socially gathering, then we shouldn't be
Speaker 1: talking about cruise. Now you can comfortably socially gather with
Speaker 1: different protocols, physical distancing where I masks, et cetera. And
Speaker 1: and at that point when when we're comfortably doing that
Speaker 1: in US society, then we can seriously, you know, take
Speaker 1: a look at cruise. Yeah, no, listen, I I get it.
Speaker 1: It's my first day back in our headquarters here in
Speaker 1: New York City. I have been home since mid March. Hey, listen,
Speaker 1: it's like it's crazy, right, Like as we've tried to
Speaker 1: figure this out. One thing I want to ask you
Speaker 1: while we're talking about the c d C, I mean
Speaker 1: the c d C. You know, um, you guys have
Speaker 1: read everything that they have put out. They have put
Speaker 1: out a strongly worded order as they continue to do
Speaker 1: the no sale and push that off for ships sailing
Speaker 1: here out of the US. They say, the current scientific
Speaker 1: evidence suggests that cruise ships is a greater risk of
Speaker 1: COVID nineteen transmission than other settings. And you know, they
Speaker 1: talk specifically some of the research that you know, the
Speaker 1: Carnival Diamond Princess back in February, they talked about it
Speaker 1: transmitting COVID nineteen at a reproduction rate that was four
Speaker 1: times roughly four times higher than what we saw at
Speaker 1: the epicenter of Wuhan. You know, do you agree with
Speaker 1: the CDC's assessment that cruise ships pose a greater risk
Speaker 1: of COVID nineteen transmission than anywhere else. I think what
Speaker 1: the industry will do is show the history that we
Speaker 1: have um with other viruses UM for example, um naul
Speaker 1: virus and other viruses that happen, and show how, in fact,
Speaker 1: you know, historically the industry has successfully mitigated the risk
Speaker 1: of spread on ships, um you know, lowered the risk
Speaker 1: relative even to short side type of activities. Now we
Speaker 1: can't make that claim today for COVID nineteen, but obviously
Speaker 1: that's what we aspire to what we're working on, and
Speaker 1: I think we'll show a body of evidence um to
Speaker 1: the CDC, which I'm sure they are also accessing. As
Speaker 1: I mentioned, we're being informed by very capable scientists and
Speaker 1: medical professionals around the world UM to to take a
Speaker 1: look at this. But let me assure you as a
Speaker 1: company and as an industry, the cruise industry in RUS
Speaker 1: as a company one to expose any guests to greater
Speaker 1: risk than they would have in similar activities short side,
Speaker 1: and so our focus is to make certain that you know,
Speaker 1: we are managing that risk at minimum, you know, relative
Speaker 1: to what they would experience short side. And we aspire
Speaker 1: of course that when they cruise was with us, they
Speaker 1: have less risk than the same experience short side. And
Speaker 1: when you talk with the Diamond Princess, I think people
Speaker 1: have to remember at number one, that happened really early on,
Speaker 1: when there was very little understanding of COVID nineteen. Number two,
Speaker 1: that ship was a quarantine ship. The ship was in
Speaker 1: quarantine for two weeks. It was not just a normal cruise,
Speaker 1: okay it was, it was a quarantine ship. And so
Speaker 1: while it's an example of something that can happen, I
Speaker 1: think the practices today would be dramatically different than what
Speaker 1: existed at the time of the Diamond Princess, which and
Speaker 1: was different than what it was, different than what happened
Speaker 1: on subsequent sales. So or do you think if that
Speaker 1: happened today, um, and forgive me for interrupting, do you
Speaker 1: think if it happened today, you would you would have
Speaker 1: shut down immediately in terms of all operations. No new
Speaker 1: ships would go out. Because I do wonder when you
Speaker 1: look back at February March, you know, what did you learn?
Speaker 1: What regrets that you have that maybe do you wish
Speaker 1: you had shut down ships? You know, right after the
Speaker 1: news of some of the virus cases on Diamond Princess Carol.
Speaker 1: And you know it's uh, not any analogy or breakdown
Speaker 1: if you push it too far. But but should the
Speaker 1: world have shut down immediately once Wuhan Province had a situation?
Speaker 1: You know with COVID nineteen, I think you can only
Speaker 1: operating the time you're in with the information you have.
Speaker 1: You know, back when Diamond Princess first started, there was
Speaker 1: not community spread around the world on COVID nineteen. There
Speaker 1: was very limited understanding of it. And even at the
Speaker 1: time of assailing the Diamond Princess, there was very little
Speaker 1: understanding you know, about COVID nineteen. Even now, we are
Speaker 1: still learning every day, you know, about this virus. And
Speaker 1: so it's not to make an excuse, it's just simply
Speaker 1: to point out that at that point in time, we
Speaker 1: did what we always do and what we will continue
Speaker 1: to do. We complied. We we complied with every authority
Speaker 1: there was, the World Health Organization, the Japanese Ministry of Health.
Speaker 1: Actually we didn't manage the quarantine or any of that,
Speaker 1: you know, as soon as we identified it, you know,
Speaker 1: we went to the Japanese the Japanese Ministry of Health
Speaker 1: told us what to do. And so you know, our
Speaker 1: number one priority, our highest responsibility is compliance, environmental protection
Speaker 1: and health, safety and well being. And so you know
Speaker 1: we would do that today. You know, whatever is the
Speaker 1: informed you know knowledge um that exists, uh and whatever
Speaker 1: authority is telling us you know what we need to do,
Speaker 1: We're going to comply with that as as we always would.
Speaker 1: You know, it's interesting and I think we all feel
Speaker 1: this way, Arnold, even those of us UM in the
Speaker 1: media world. I think we were hearing stories and trying
Speaker 1: to make sense of it. But I think I do
Speaker 1: wonder do you feel like you got good advice from
Speaker 1: the w H O, from the c d C. Do
Speaker 1: you feel like out of Washington that the information decision
Speaker 1: making that you were getting at that time, that it
Speaker 1: wasn't really good, that it was rather muddled. I think, look,
Speaker 1: at the time, you know, Washington had very little to
Speaker 1: do with, for example, the incident in Japan, Okay, very
Speaker 1: little to do with that. And I think that all
Speaker 1: of these agencies are made up of people who are
Speaker 1: trying to serve the best interests of society and the
Speaker 1: public health, and so I think they do the best
Speaker 1: job they can with the information they have at the time. UM.
Speaker 1: And I think, again, our mistakes made. Of course, mistakes
Speaker 1: are made, UM, but but it's not because of you know,
Speaker 1: just irresponsible behavior. UM. Is because people are genuinely trying
Speaker 1: to analyze and figure out what to do. And this
Speaker 1: is new and we just have to keep in mind
Speaker 1: it's not like there was COVID nineteam popped up one
Speaker 1: day and that was perfect knowledge. Even today, we are
Speaker 1: still learning every day about this virus, and I think
Speaker 1: that we just all have to stand together, you know,
Speaker 1: around the world, uh and share the knowledge and learnings
Speaker 1: and experience and figure out what are the best protocols
Speaker 1: to mitigate spread of this virus while at the same
Speaker 1: time allowing society not to create other unintended consequences, whether
Speaker 1: they be economic or the health issues. So talk to
Speaker 1: me a little bit about your timeline for getting back
Speaker 1: to see because I know when we initially talked about
Speaker 1: doing this interview, we thought that there would be ships
Speaker 1: this past week and or yesterday coming out of Germany,
Speaker 1: and I know all of this is being kind of
Speaker 1: pushed off to September. So tell me about your expectations
Speaker 1: for September. Do you anticipate, you know, a lot of
Speaker 1: ships coming out at sea. Give us a little idea,
Speaker 1: and I do wonder. I know the no sale order
Speaker 1: has been pushed off certainly here in the United States.
Speaker 1: What are your expectations for the US market? Well, first
Speaker 1: of all, yes, September, we will start in Germany and
Speaker 1: we plan to start in Italy. UM. We didn't start
Speaker 1: previously in Germany, even though we have a German brand
Speaker 1: AIDA which sources Germans. The ships are flagged in Italy
Speaker 1: and so we weren't able to get Italy flag clearance.
Speaker 1: But now we have it and we also have it
Speaker 1: UM for Italy, and so we'll start with a few ships.
Speaker 1: Initially the ships will be cruisers to nowhere. They'll they'll
Speaker 1: go out to sea and then come back, so just
Speaker 1: a few days of cruising that that will do multiple things.
Speaker 1: The one it allows us to manage effectively, you know,
Speaker 1: the folks on board UH to handle the new processes,
Speaker 1: make sure all the training we've given our people in
Speaker 1: the new way to conduct and handle things is practiced
Speaker 1: in an efficient way. And it mitigates any risk of
Speaker 1: you know, spread from stopping at the destination where you
Speaker 1: might bring COVID on board after you've you know, I'm
Speaker 1: screening initiative to get started. So that's the initial but
Speaker 1: then shortly thereafter we will have you know, some longer
Speaker 1: cruises and we will go to some destinations again approved
Speaker 1: by you know, the flag states and by the destinations
Speaker 1: with the protocols in place that they want. But it
Speaker 1: will be a few ships at a time initially, and
Speaker 1: I suspect that overall the industry will roll out slowly.
Speaker 1: With regards to the US, Carol is early. We'll we'll
Speaker 1: see what happens. We've extended a number of our brands,
Speaker 1: have gone beyond the no sale order already, intern Or
Speaker 1: do you think it's more? I think, I know. I
Speaker 1: think there's a possibility if if we can get the
Speaker 1: mitigation of spread down and with people going back to
Speaker 1: college and high school and elementary schools and movement of people,
Speaker 1: if we can manage the mitigation of spread where we're seeing,
Speaker 1: instead of a surge, a real decline, then I think
Speaker 1: we can begin to consider, you know, um, social activities,
Speaker 1: of which, of course, cruise this one. Hey listen. Just
Speaker 1: got about time for one last question, Arnold, What is
Speaker 1: Carnival going forward? I've seen analysts of Verstiphil. They've talked
Speaker 1: about a leaner Carnival corporation, that the pandemic has allowed
Speaker 1: you to get rid of some assets that maybe needed
Speaker 1: to uh and that longer term this is a positive.
Speaker 1: What kind of company is Carnival going forward? Just got
Speaker 1: about a minute left. We'll be smaller um with in
Speaker 1: terms of number of ships, we had a hundred and
Speaker 1: six ships or so. We've already um either recycled or
Speaker 1: sold about fifteen ships. Uh. Those ships that would have
Speaker 1: happened over a few years. It just happened this year
Speaker 1: because obviously not going to generating revenue in a sharp
Speaker 1: term here, and we can eliminate some costs as we
Speaker 1: prepare a longer runway to withstand you know, have along
Speaker 1: this thing last um. But all of all, we're going
Speaker 1: to be a stronger company. UM. You know, it's painful.
Speaker 1: We we've had to take some people actions, but we
Speaker 1: have a deep bench and once we once we start
Speaker 1: up again, we'll be bringing a number of those people
Speaker 1: back and we'll ask some new talent. But but we'll
Speaker 1: be leaner and stronger, but most importantly, will still be
Speaker 1: the best vacation experience there is. And that one of
Speaker 1: the best vacation values there is. That was Carnival Corporation
Speaker 1: President and CEO Arnold Donald. And what's interesting, Jason, we
Speaker 1: had expected that we would be talking about ships back
Speaker 1: at sea, because that was the expectation that the weekend
Speaker 1: before this interview that was going to happen. And they
Speaker 1: had to delay it again. These are delays over in
Speaker 1: Germany and Italy. They are expecting to get chips back
Speaker 1: out to see come September. The US market, that's a
Speaker 1: lot more uncertain at this point, but I gotta say
Speaker 1: it's going to be tough, going so tough. I mean,
Speaker 1: listening to that interview, you're just reminded that the world
Speaker 1: is very different and it's not coming back to normal
Speaker 1: any times. A great interview. You've been listening to Bloomberg
Speaker 1: Business Week Extra, and be sure to check out our
Speaker 1: Bloomberg Business Week Daily Show on radio. It airs live
Speaker 1: Monday through Friday at two pm Wall Street Time. I'm
Speaker 1: Carol Massara and I'm chasing Kelly. This is Bloomberg