WEBVTT - Businessweek Extra-Arnold Donald 0:00:02.520 --> 0:00:06.600 This is Bloomberg Business Week from Bloomberg Radio. I'm Jason 0:00:06.680 --> 0:00:09.319 Kelly and I'm Carol Masser. Welcome to the Bloomberg Business 0:00:09.360 --> 0:00:12.120 Week Extra. It's our weekly podcast. Bring you an interview 0:00:12.200 --> 0:00:15.000 you'll not hear anywhere else. And seriously, I was not 0:00:15.040 --> 0:00:17.320 going to hear this anywhere else. I went on vacation 0:00:17.600 --> 0:00:20.720 and you went off and did a great interview about 0:00:20.840 --> 0:00:24.720 the future of vacations with the CEO and president of Carnival. Right, 0:00:24.760 --> 0:00:28.520 we're talking about Arnold Donald and Carnival. It's the world's 0:00:28.600 --> 0:00:30.920 largest cruising group and the cruise industry. Jason, you and 0:00:31.000 --> 0:00:32.720 I know this. We've been talking about it a lot. 0:00:33.000 --> 0:00:35.519 It's one of the hardest hit industries by the coronavirus. 0:00:35.720 --> 0:00:38.600 Carnival alone has seen its stock plummet. It's sold off ships, 0:00:38.600 --> 0:00:41.159 it's lost billions of dollars. It's raised billions more to 0:00:41.240 --> 0:00:44.040 get through the crisis. Bottom line, though, it's really all 0:00:44.080 --> 0:00:47.560 about getting ships back to seat. Check out this conversation. Arnold. 0:00:47.600 --> 0:00:49.839 It is great to have you back with us. How 0:00:49.880 --> 0:00:53.680 are you doing, Carol, Thanks for asking. I'm great. How 0:00:53.720 --> 0:00:57.360 are you doing? Yeah? Kind of getting used to a 0:00:57.400 --> 0:01:00.120 new world order. And I guess the million dollar are 0:01:00.160 --> 0:01:02.440 billion dollar question, Arnold. You know that everybody has on 0:01:02.480 --> 0:01:05.160 their mind is how do you get the cruise industry? 0:01:05.200 --> 0:01:07.440 How do you get passengers back on ships? How do 0:01:07.520 --> 0:01:11.679 you get ships back at sea safely and responsible responsibly 0:01:11.760 --> 0:01:14.920 around the world. Well, you know, Carol, the first of all, 0:01:15.120 --> 0:01:19.440 you know, our primary responsibilities and therefore our top priority 0:01:19.520 --> 0:01:23.560 is always compliance, environmental protection and the health, safety and 0:01:23.600 --> 0:01:26.319 well being of our guests, of the people in the 0:01:26.360 --> 0:01:29.479 places we go, and of course our carnival family, our 0:01:29.560 --> 0:01:33.320 shipboard and short side personnel. So you know, the interests 0:01:33.360 --> 0:01:35.640 of public health is always in the forefront for us. 0:01:35.640 --> 0:01:37.920 And how do we get people back on ships when 0:01:37.920 --> 0:01:43.480 there's some social gathering and society has developed the compensating 0:01:43.520 --> 0:01:47.640 measures that is comfortable with that we have effectively mitigated 0:01:47.720 --> 0:01:50.600 the spread of COVID nineteen and then we'll be able 0:01:50.640 --> 0:01:52.279 to cruise again. And there are a lot of people, 0:01:52.520 --> 0:01:54.880 as you know, Carrol, who are ready to cruise right now. 0:01:55.440 --> 0:01:57.960 And in fact, we're looking at starting up in Europe 0:01:57.960 --> 0:02:02.080 where the spread has been mitigate it substantially in places 0:02:02.120 --> 0:02:04.760 like Germany and Italy, and we're looking at starting up 0:02:04.760 --> 0:02:07.800 in September. There and a few um cruise lines have, 0:02:08.320 --> 0:02:10.320 but there's a lot of pin up demand, you know, 0:02:10.400 --> 0:02:13.120 for travel in general, and especially for cruise. Well, and 0:02:13.120 --> 0:02:15.399 what I wonder Arnold, though, can you kind of drill 0:02:15.440 --> 0:02:17.040 down a little bit what are some of the specific 0:02:17.040 --> 0:02:19.320 protocols that you might put in place to get ships 0:02:19.320 --> 0:02:21.919 safely back at sea. I've been reading, you know, about 0:02:21.960 --> 0:02:24.800 different folks and what they might be considering different cruise lines. 0:02:24.800 --> 0:02:29.880 They're talking about no buffets, constant um temperature checks, constant testing, 0:02:30.240 --> 0:02:33.480 maybe no excursions. What specific protocols will you be putting 0:02:33.480 --> 0:02:35.960 in place? Well, again, as you well know, we we 0:02:36.040 --> 0:02:38.680 have a lot of measures in place already on cruise 0:02:38.760 --> 0:02:43.000 that often short side destinations don't already have or didn't 0:02:43.000 --> 0:02:46.040 have prior to COVID nineteen. We do medical screens, we 0:02:46.040 --> 0:02:49.200 were already doing temperature checks in many cases. Um, we 0:02:49.400 --> 0:02:52.520 had hand sanitizers throughout the ship and signs all over 0:02:52.560 --> 0:02:54.640 about washing your hands because we've had to deal with 0:02:54.720 --> 0:02:57.760 viruses and the over seven hundred parts and destinations we 0:02:57.800 --> 0:03:01.160 go to annually for many years now. Course, CORVID nineteen 0:03:01.840 --> 0:03:04.400 is especially unique because the whole world is shut down, 0:03:04.720 --> 0:03:06.800 and because of that, there's still a lot of learning 0:03:07.000 --> 0:03:10.120 around COVID nineteen. As you know from all the scientists, 0:03:10.120 --> 0:03:13.680 there's still a lining around epidemiology. They're lying around testing, 0:03:13.720 --> 0:03:16.480 they're lying around the role of testing. The one thing 0:03:16.520 --> 0:03:21.000 everybody right now is aligned on, though, is that you know, 0:03:21.120 --> 0:03:24.960 good personal care in terms of wearing a mask, washing 0:03:24.960 --> 0:03:29.239 your hands, um, using hand sanitizers, you know, physical distancing 0:03:29.280 --> 0:03:32.000 at appropriate times, but wearing a mask is a great 0:03:32.040 --> 0:03:35.400 way to mitigate the spread. So for the time being, 0:03:35.600 --> 0:03:39.960 any cruises that will happen will certainly incorporate some physical 0:03:40.000 --> 0:03:43.160 distancing and you know, wearing masks, and of course what 0:03:43.240 --> 0:03:47.800 we already had was the the hand sanitizers, etcetera. Beyond that, um, 0:03:47.840 --> 0:03:51.640 there's a plethora of possibilities, but it depends on the destination, 0:03:52.040 --> 0:03:55.720 depends on the level of community spreading that destination, etcetera. 0:03:55.800 --> 0:03:58.920 So there could be various testing protocols. I mean, that's 0:03:58.920 --> 0:04:02.600 a possibility for the US is premature. You know, we're 0:04:02.640 --> 0:04:06.480 not ready to sail here yet. Obviously the community spread 0:04:06.560 --> 0:04:09.960 is still pretty vibrant here in the US, and when 0:04:10.000 --> 0:04:12.760 went out of position to sail here, and we're walking 0:04:13.080 --> 0:04:16.320 cautiously in the other places too, because our primary interests 0:04:16.520 --> 0:04:19.080 is to stand what everyone else in mitigating the spread 0:04:19.160 --> 0:04:21.400 of COVID nineteen. But I did read your your coster 0:04:21.480 --> 0:04:23.880 cruise is safety protocols and you talked about three tests 0:04:23.880 --> 0:04:27.480 for crew members before boarding. Um. You also talked about, 0:04:27.520 --> 0:04:31.440 of course social distancing, new filters. UM Entertainment will have 0:04:31.560 --> 0:04:34.000 more shows on during the day so that they're smaller groups. 0:04:34.000 --> 0:04:37.120 And then also no self service restaurants, so no buffets, 0:04:37.120 --> 0:04:38.760 which for many of you go on a cruise, they're 0:04:38.760 --> 0:04:41.039 pretty used to it. So there are some changes coming. 0:04:41.680 --> 0:04:43.520 Oh yeah, absolutely for the ones that are going to 0:04:43.600 --> 0:04:46.360 sail now, we have to be ready, just like hotels today, 0:04:46.360 --> 0:04:48.599 any hotel that's opened the day has to deal with 0:04:48.640 --> 0:04:51.800 the current situation and the limited knowledge thereas. And so 0:04:51.920 --> 0:04:55.640 for Costa we are deploying a number of testing protocols. 0:04:55.720 --> 0:04:59.560 Obviously for our crew we have not only testing but quarantine. 0:04:59.600 --> 0:05:02.080 Except because it's really important for us to have the 0:05:02.160 --> 0:05:05.400 clue crew UM, you know, safe from the beginning and 0:05:05.440 --> 0:05:08.360 then to keep them safe. And obviously UM once we 0:05:08.400 --> 0:05:11.479 get guests on board, will have protocolls on board for them. 0:05:11.680 --> 0:05:13.839 I do wonder how you do it safely. I mean, Arnold, 0:05:13.880 --> 0:05:16.960 you know this industry better than everyone, uh and better 0:05:17.000 --> 0:05:19.960 than most in terms of lay personnel. But I wonder 0:05:20.000 --> 0:05:21.800 how you do it safely because there have been some 0:05:21.839 --> 0:05:24.920 smaller cruise operations that have come out of Europe, come 0:05:24.960 --> 0:05:27.920 out of Alaska, Tahiti, UM, and I believe there are 0:05:28.000 --> 0:05:30.440 less at least ten crew members aboard UM. Your I 0:05:30.560 --> 0:05:33.000 eat a cruise ships out of Germany that contacted the 0:05:33.080 --> 0:05:36.120 virus ahead of you getting ready to kind of get 0:05:36.120 --> 0:05:39.320 back to the seas UM. That was in August. So 0:05:39.440 --> 0:05:41.800 I just wonder how do you do this safely when 0:05:41.839 --> 0:05:44.760 even when some small cruise operations are starting to go 0:05:44.839 --> 0:05:46.880 back out on the water and still having problems with 0:05:46.920 --> 0:05:49.920 the virus and people are contacting the virus. Carol, think 0:05:49.960 --> 0:05:52.400 those two stage Just one is you want to reduce 0:05:52.440 --> 0:05:56.080 the risk of having UM the COVID nineteen come on 0:05:56.120 --> 0:05:58.640 board from shore. So that's the first thing. So you 0:05:58.720 --> 0:06:02.440 test UM, you monitor, and you quarantine in the case 0:06:02.520 --> 0:06:04.800 of the crew. So the ones you mentioned on Aida, 0:06:04.880 --> 0:06:07.159 you know, those crew members were tested before they left 0:06:07.160 --> 0:06:09.279 their home country, and then they were tested again once 0:06:09.279 --> 0:06:12.240 they arrived in Germany and we got some positives. They 0:06:12.279 --> 0:06:15.119 were then retested again and a couple of In several 0:06:15.160 --> 0:06:17.839 of those cases, the individuals got a double negative test 0:06:17.880 --> 0:06:21.000 after that, which meant they had a false positive, and 0:06:21.040 --> 0:06:24.400 then the others were obviously isolated in quarantine and so 0:06:24.760 --> 0:06:27.240 the risk of them spreading it on board with zero 0:06:27.360 --> 0:06:30.400 because we wouldn't have them sail. Okay. Now, once you're 0:06:30.440 --> 0:06:33.320 at that level, the next question is what else are 0:06:33.360 --> 0:06:35.400 you're doing to mitigate spread? And that's why all the 0:06:35.400 --> 0:06:38.880 other practices on board. Any event you do get someone 0:06:38.960 --> 0:06:43.039 on board who has COVID nineteen, if it's in society, um, 0:06:43.080 --> 0:06:46.240 if it's out there in general, chances are you eventually 0:06:46.240 --> 0:06:48.440 will have someone on board the ship that will have it. 0:06:48.960 --> 0:06:51.320 And so the trick then, of course, is to make 0:06:51.320 --> 0:06:54.120 certain that you are able to quickly identify, that you 0:06:54.120 --> 0:06:57.159 can isolate the person, and that during the time they 0:06:57.200 --> 0:07:00.520 were exposed there was plenty of mitigation and of risk 0:07:00.600 --> 0:07:03.920 protocols in place, so the probability of spread has been 0:07:03.960 --> 0:07:08.080 greatly reduced. And that's where you know, wearing masks, physical distancing, 0:07:08.560 --> 0:07:11.600 washing your hands, um, using a handstand, the size, et cetera, 0:07:11.640 --> 0:07:14.040 all come into play. Arnold, I do also wonder you know, 0:07:14.120 --> 0:07:17.440 what are your plans for passengers and crew members who 0:07:17.480 --> 0:07:19.480 do get sick in the future. You know, you know 0:07:19.560 --> 0:07:22.280 the horror stories of ships that were you know, basically 0:07:22.320 --> 0:07:24.840 lost at sea they couldn't find a homeport. You I know, 0:07:25.160 --> 0:07:27.120 and your team have spent you know, a long time 0:07:27.160 --> 0:07:29.600 repaytrading you know, your crew members back home. So what 0:07:29.640 --> 0:07:31.800 do you do? Will there be a way to airlift 0:07:31.920 --> 0:07:35.840 passengers off ships? What will you do? You're absolutely right, 0:07:35.880 --> 0:07:38.560 you know, we had to repay trade over eighty thousand 0:07:38.680 --> 0:07:40.600 crew members, and it took us quite a while with 0:07:40.760 --> 0:07:44.400 boorders closed and airlines shut down, et cetera. So it 0:07:44.440 --> 0:07:47.280 took us several months to effectively do that, but we 0:07:47.280 --> 0:07:49.640 were eventually able to do it. In regards to now, 0:07:49.800 --> 0:07:52.840 you know that was before now, there's enough understanding we 0:07:52.880 --> 0:07:55.640 would not go to a destination where we did not 0:07:55.800 --> 0:07:58.800 have a plan already in the event that there was 0:07:58.880 --> 0:08:01.520 COVID on board. We're not going to tie up thousands 0:08:01.600 --> 0:08:04.560 of people off of one positive COVID case or a 0:08:04.640 --> 0:08:07.200 couple of positive COVID cases. You know, we would have 0:08:07.200 --> 0:08:11.040 the protocols in place to ensure one that the individual 0:08:11.080 --> 0:08:13.480 is taken care of whoever has it, that we can 0:08:13.520 --> 0:08:16.080 get them the care they need. Um. And then number 0:08:16.120 --> 0:08:19.880 two that everyone else, uh is an effect that you know, 0:08:19.920 --> 0:08:23.800 we would have some form of contact tracing on our boards, 0:08:23.800 --> 0:08:25.760 so we know who we're the most exposed people. But 0:08:25.800 --> 0:08:28.480 we have to have those protocols for each destination. We 0:08:28.560 --> 0:08:31.760 go to seven hundred ports and destinations around the world, 0:08:32.120 --> 0:08:34.760 so they're all not going to have the exact same protocols. 0:08:35.000 --> 0:08:37.320 And and but we will not go to a place 0:08:37.600 --> 0:08:41.640 where we haven't established exactly any event there is a 0:08:41.720 --> 0:08:45.040 COVID case exactly what's going to happen, all right, But 0:08:45.120 --> 0:08:48.440 you're not worried about as we know this virus you know, 0:08:48.480 --> 0:08:52.640 spread so so quickly, um, that you could go out 0:08:52.679 --> 0:08:55.560 to see and end up with a handful of passengers 0:08:55.679 --> 0:08:58.560 or a lot more passengers, hundreds of passengers and be 0:08:58.679 --> 0:09:01.000 kind of stuck at sea. And I mean, I'm just curious, 0:09:02.720 --> 0:09:05.240 what would you do that we won't. We won't sail 0:09:05.320 --> 0:09:07.520 on the situation where we can be stuck at sea. 0:09:07.720 --> 0:09:10.800 I think again, there's a lot more knowledge now than 0:09:10.840 --> 0:09:14.040 when that was happening. Number one, you know, we will 0:09:14.080 --> 0:09:17.199 have some capability of testing on board. When that happened before, 0:09:17.280 --> 0:09:20.679 we didn't. We we will. There's a lot of understanding 0:09:20.720 --> 0:09:23.880 now about how to mitigate spread. Back then, nobody was 0:09:23.920 --> 0:09:26.280 talking about you know, why you were cruising. You know, 0:09:26.440 --> 0:09:31.280 potentially wearing masks are physical distancing that that kind of thing. UM. 0:09:31.480 --> 0:09:34.480 And similarly, we have to look at the incidents of 0:09:34.520 --> 0:09:37.200 spreading a community. You know, we're not going to probably 0:09:37.200 --> 0:09:39.400 sell out of a community where the incidents are spread 0:09:39.520 --> 0:09:42.840 is very high because you're almost certainly they're gonna have it, 0:09:42.960 --> 0:09:45.520 have it on board. UM, so we we have to 0:09:45.559 --> 0:09:48.960 have the protocols. We have a great UM group of 0:09:49.000 --> 0:09:52.920 advisors UM scientific advisors. A number of them participated in 0:09:52.960 --> 0:09:56.640 a summit on COVID that we held with the World 0:09:56.720 --> 0:09:59.840 Travel on Tourism Council. Wasn't about travel, it wasn't about cruise, 0:10:00.120 --> 0:10:02.640 it was about the science of COVID and UM a 0:10:02.760 --> 0:10:05.559 number of our advisors participated in that um that that 0:10:05.600 --> 0:10:09.040 we we produced and and my co hosted with Gloria 0:10:09.080 --> 0:10:12.960 Gavira from w TCC. And so we're using their advice. 0:10:13.040 --> 0:10:16.559 And of course every destination is studying this, every port, 0:10:16.679 --> 0:10:22.679 every city, every nation and will as always be in compliance. UH. 0:10:22.760 --> 0:10:25.760 And so we'll all have a protocol in place because 0:10:25.800 --> 0:10:29.320 no one wants, you know, thousands of people you know 0:10:29.400 --> 0:10:32.240 stuck s C. Nobody wants no doubt about that, and 0:10:32.280 --> 0:10:34.400 I am curious about guidance from the CDC. I mean, 0:10:34.440 --> 0:10:36.520 what are you hearing, Arnold right now from the CDC 0:10:36.760 --> 0:10:40.600 about what they want to see specifically from Carnival before 0:10:40.880 --> 0:10:45.079 heading out at sea again. Well, CDC is concentrating initially 0:10:45.160 --> 0:10:48.160 on what we call the pause. You know, a number 0:10:48.160 --> 0:10:50.839 of US volunteer to stop sailing and so on in 0:10:50.920 --> 0:10:53.760 the CDC issued on no sale orders, and so they've 0:10:53.760 --> 0:10:56.480 concentrated on the ships because even though we're in a pause, 0:10:57.280 --> 0:11:00.760 we still have twelve thousand crew required to minimally man 0:11:00.800 --> 0:11:03.520 our ships. The ships are still out there to still operate, 0:11:04.040 --> 0:11:07.040 and so the CDC focus on that initially. UH. And 0:11:07.120 --> 0:11:11.320 now they've started beginning to ask for public input and 0:11:11.840 --> 0:11:15.280 UH to be submitted in terms of consideration um for 0:11:15.440 --> 0:11:19.400 crews going forward, but there have been no specific direction 0:11:19.520 --> 0:11:23.760 given on what's expected. What we're gonna do is again 0:11:23.960 --> 0:11:28.400 use our expert advisory group to inform us, to use 0:11:28.440 --> 0:11:32.160 the experiences around the world that we have and others have, 0:11:32.600 --> 0:11:35.920 and we'll put together you know, the appropriate protocol at 0:11:35.920 --> 0:11:39.160 the time we think that it makes sense to begin 0:11:39.240 --> 0:11:42.080 to consider cruising again, um out of the U S. 0:11:42.120 --> 0:11:44.959 So the CDC isn't say anything, aren't like, okay, positivity 0:11:45.040 --> 0:11:47.240 rates who want to see it, you know, below ten percent, 0:11:47.320 --> 0:11:49.000 below five percent, they're not giving you any kind of 0:11:49.000 --> 0:11:51.920 guidance like that specific items. No, not at this time. 0:11:51.960 --> 0:11:54.320 And I don't think you know, I don't. I think 0:11:54.320 --> 0:11:57.520 it's fine that they're not again, you know, right now, 0:11:57.880 --> 0:12:00.679 look at the US in many places where talking still 0:12:00.720 --> 0:12:04.280 talking about shell training, place stay at home. Very limited 0:12:04.559 --> 0:12:07.120 universities are figuring out what to do. Schools are figuring 0:12:07.160 --> 0:12:09.520 out what to do. And as long as we're not 0:12:09.920 --> 0:12:14.200 you know, just comfortably socially gathering, then we shouldn't be 0:12:14.200 --> 0:12:18.760 talking about cruise. Now you can comfortably socially gather with 0:12:18.880 --> 0:12:22.680 different protocols, physical distancing where I masks, et cetera. And 0:12:22.679 --> 0:12:25.520 and at that point when when we're comfortably doing that 0:12:25.679 --> 0:12:28.360 in US society, then we can seriously, you know, take 0:12:28.400 --> 0:12:30.960 a look at cruise. Yeah, no, listen, I I get it. 0:12:30.960 --> 0:12:33.400 It's my first day back in our headquarters here in 0:12:33.400 --> 0:12:36.839 New York City. I have been home since mid March. Hey, listen, 0:12:37.520 --> 0:12:39.520 it's like it's crazy, right, Like as we've tried to 0:12:39.559 --> 0:12:41.280 figure this out. One thing I want to ask you 0:12:41.320 --> 0:12:43.360 while we're talking about the c d C, I mean 0:12:43.920 --> 0:12:46.680 the c d C. You know, um, you guys have 0:12:46.760 --> 0:12:50.120 read everything that they have put out. They have put 0:12:50.160 --> 0:12:52.679 out a strongly worded order as they continue to do 0:12:52.720 --> 0:12:55.440 the no sale and push that off for ships sailing 0:12:55.440 --> 0:12:58.480 here out of the US. They say, the current scientific 0:12:58.520 --> 0:13:00.840 evidence suggests that cruise ships is a greater risk of 0:13:00.880 --> 0:13:03.839 COVID nineteen transmission than other settings. And you know, they 0:13:03.880 --> 0:13:07.200 talk specifically some of the research that you know, the 0:13:07.240 --> 0:13:10.960 Carnival Diamond Princess back in February, they talked about it 0:13:11.000 --> 0:13:14.600 transmitting COVID nineteen at a reproduction rate that was four 0:13:14.640 --> 0:13:17.480 times roughly four times higher than what we saw at 0:13:17.480 --> 0:13:20.440 the epicenter of Wuhan. You know, do you agree with 0:13:20.480 --> 0:13:23.680 the CDC's assessment that cruise ships pose a greater risk 0:13:23.800 --> 0:13:27.480 of COVID nineteen transmission than anywhere else. I think what 0:13:27.520 --> 0:13:30.600 the industry will do is show the history that we 0:13:30.679 --> 0:13:35.320 have um with other viruses UM for example, um naul 0:13:35.440 --> 0:13:38.680 virus and other viruses that happen, and show how, in fact, 0:13:39.080 --> 0:13:43.760 you know, historically the industry has successfully mitigated the risk 0:13:43.800 --> 0:13:46.840 of spread on ships, um you know, lowered the risk 0:13:46.960 --> 0:13:50.120 relative even to short side type of activities. Now we 0:13:50.200 --> 0:13:53.880 can't make that claim today for COVID nineteen, but obviously 0:13:53.880 --> 0:13:55.880 that's what we aspire to what we're working on, and 0:13:55.920 --> 0:13:58.960 I think we'll show a body of evidence um to 0:13:59.040 --> 0:14:02.360 the CDC, which I'm sure they are also accessing. As 0:14:02.360 --> 0:14:06.760 I mentioned, we're being informed by very capable scientists and 0:14:06.840 --> 0:14:10.160 medical professionals around the world UM to to take a 0:14:10.160 --> 0:14:12.840 look at this. But let me assure you as a 0:14:12.840 --> 0:14:16.920 company and as an industry, the cruise industry in RUS 0:14:17.000 --> 0:14:22.040 as a company one to expose any guests to greater 0:14:22.160 --> 0:14:26.320 risk than they would have in similar activities short side, 0:14:26.760 --> 0:14:30.160 and so our focus is to make certain that you know, 0:14:30.240 --> 0:14:34.760 we are managing that risk at minimum, you know, relative 0:14:34.880 --> 0:14:37.880 to what they would experience short side. And we aspire 0:14:37.920 --> 0:14:40.920 of course that when they cruise was with us, they 0:14:40.920 --> 0:14:45.080 have less risk than the same experience short side. And 0:14:45.120 --> 0:14:47.720 when you talk with the Diamond Princess, I think people 0:14:47.760 --> 0:14:51.080 have to remember at number one, that happened really early on, 0:14:51.160 --> 0:14:55.720 when there was very little understanding of COVID nineteen. Number two, 0:14:56.080 --> 0:14:58.880 that ship was a quarantine ship. The ship was in 0:14:58.960 --> 0:15:03.200 quarantine for two weeks. It was not just a normal cruise, 0:15:03.680 --> 0:15:06.880 okay it was, it was a quarantine ship. And so 0:15:07.240 --> 0:15:10.960 while it's an example of something that can happen, I 0:15:11.000 --> 0:15:14.440 think the practices today would be dramatically different than what 0:15:14.560 --> 0:15:16.920 existed at the time of the Diamond Princess, which and 0:15:17.040 --> 0:15:19.480 was different than what it was, different than what happened 0:15:19.840 --> 0:15:22.840 on subsequent sales. So or do you think if that 0:15:22.880 --> 0:15:25.640 happened today, um, and forgive me for interrupting, do you 0:15:25.640 --> 0:15:27.560 think if it happened today, you would you would have 0:15:27.600 --> 0:15:30.560 shut down immediately in terms of all operations. No new 0:15:30.600 --> 0:15:32.560 ships would go out. Because I do wonder when you 0:15:32.600 --> 0:15:36.560 look back at February March, you know, what did you learn? 0:15:36.680 --> 0:15:38.840 What regrets that you have that maybe do you wish 0:15:38.840 --> 0:15:42.320 you had shut down ships? You know, right after the 0:15:42.320 --> 0:15:46.600 news of some of the virus cases on Diamond Princess Carol. 0:15:46.640 --> 0:15:49.880 And you know it's uh, not any analogy or breakdown 0:15:49.880 --> 0:15:51.760 if you push it too far. But but should the 0:15:51.760 --> 0:15:56.720 world have shut down immediately once Wuhan Province had a situation? 0:15:57.200 --> 0:16:00.200 You know with COVID nineteen, I think you can only 0:16:00.240 --> 0:16:02.520 operating the time you're in with the information you have. 0:16:03.000 --> 0:16:05.360 You know, back when Diamond Princess first started, there was 0:16:05.400 --> 0:16:08.320 not community spread around the world on COVID nineteen. There 0:16:08.360 --> 0:16:10.840 was very limited understanding of it. And even at the 0:16:10.840 --> 0:16:13.160 time of assailing the Diamond Princess, there was very little 0:16:13.240 --> 0:16:17.080 understanding you know, about COVID nineteen. Even now, we are 0:16:17.080 --> 0:16:20.840 still learning every day, you know, about this virus. And 0:16:20.920 --> 0:16:23.240 so it's not to make an excuse, it's just simply 0:16:23.320 --> 0:16:25.800 to point out that at that point in time, we 0:16:25.840 --> 0:16:28.200 did what we always do and what we will continue 0:16:28.240 --> 0:16:33.240 to do. We complied. We we complied with every authority 0:16:33.280 --> 0:16:37.160 there was, the World Health Organization, the Japanese Ministry of Health. 0:16:37.200 --> 0:16:40.160 Actually we didn't manage the quarantine or any of that, 0:16:40.440 --> 0:16:42.400 you know, as soon as we identified it, you know, 0:16:42.440 --> 0:16:44.600 we went to the Japanese the Japanese Ministry of Health 0:16:44.640 --> 0:16:47.280 told us what to do. And so you know, our 0:16:47.360 --> 0:16:53.400 number one priority, our highest responsibility is compliance, environmental protection 0:16:53.400 --> 0:16:55.840 and health, safety and well being. And so you know 0:16:56.160 --> 0:16:59.000 we would do that today. You know, whatever is the 0:16:59.040 --> 0:17:03.600 informed you know knowledge um that exists, uh and whatever 0:17:03.640 --> 0:17:05.719 authority is telling us you know what we need to do, 0:17:05.880 --> 0:17:08.440 We're going to comply with that as as we always would. 0:17:08.520 --> 0:17:10.040 You know, it's interesting and I think we all feel 0:17:10.080 --> 0:17:12.800 this way, Arnold, even those of us UM in the 0:17:12.800 --> 0:17:15.440 media world. I think we were hearing stories and trying 0:17:15.440 --> 0:17:17.639 to make sense of it. But I think I do 0:17:17.760 --> 0:17:20.320 wonder do you feel like you got good advice from 0:17:20.359 --> 0:17:22.359 the w H O, from the c d C. Do 0:17:22.400 --> 0:17:26.040 you feel like out of Washington that the information decision 0:17:26.040 --> 0:17:28.160 making that you were getting at that time, that it 0:17:28.240 --> 0:17:31.359 wasn't really good, that it was rather muddled. I think, look, 0:17:31.400 --> 0:17:33.879 at the time, you know, Washington had very little to 0:17:33.920 --> 0:17:37.600 do with, for example, the incident in Japan, Okay, very 0:17:37.640 --> 0:17:41.040 little to do with that. And I think that all 0:17:41.080 --> 0:17:45.480 of these agencies are made up of people who are 0:17:45.560 --> 0:17:49.240 trying to serve the best interests of society and the 0:17:49.280 --> 0:17:51.680 public health, and so I think they do the best 0:17:51.760 --> 0:17:54.800 job they can with the information they have at the time. UM. 0:17:54.840 --> 0:17:58.600 And I think, again, our mistakes made. Of course, mistakes 0:17:58.600 --> 0:18:02.439 are made, UM, but but it's not because of you know, 0:18:02.600 --> 0:18:06.680 just irresponsible behavior. UM. Is because people are genuinely trying 0:18:06.720 --> 0:18:09.280 to analyze and figure out what to do. And this 0:18:09.359 --> 0:18:11.280 is new and we just have to keep in mind 0:18:11.320 --> 0:18:14.080 it's not like there was COVID nineteam popped up one 0:18:14.119 --> 0:18:17.520 day and that was perfect knowledge. Even today, we are 0:18:17.560 --> 0:18:21.520 still learning every day about this virus, and I think 0:18:21.600 --> 0:18:24.600 that we just all have to stand together, you know, 0:18:24.640 --> 0:18:27.840 around the world, uh and share the knowledge and learnings 0:18:27.840 --> 0:18:31.600 and experience and figure out what are the best protocols 0:18:31.920 --> 0:18:35.320 to mitigate spread of this virus while at the same 0:18:35.400 --> 0:18:40.280 time allowing society not to create other unintended consequences, whether 0:18:40.280 --> 0:18:43.159 they be economic or the health issues. So talk to 0:18:43.160 --> 0:18:45.080 me a little bit about your timeline for getting back 0:18:45.119 --> 0:18:46.800 to see because I know when we initially talked about 0:18:46.840 --> 0:18:48.719 doing this interview, we thought that there would be ships 0:18:48.720 --> 0:18:52.160 this past week and or yesterday coming out of Germany, 0:18:52.240 --> 0:18:53.720 and I know all of this is being kind of 0:18:53.720 --> 0:18:57.800 pushed off to September. So tell me about your expectations 0:18:57.800 --> 0:19:00.919 for September. Do you anticipate, you know, a lot of 0:19:00.920 --> 0:19:03.000 ships coming out at sea. Give us a little idea, 0:19:03.160 --> 0:19:05.040 and I do wonder. I know the no sale order 0:19:05.920 --> 0:19:09.080 has been pushed off certainly here in the United States. 0:19:09.119 --> 0:19:12.160 What are your expectations for the US market? Well, first 0:19:12.160 --> 0:19:15.480 of all, yes, September, we will start in Germany and 0:19:15.560 --> 0:19:18.879 we plan to start in Italy. UM. We didn't start 0:19:18.880 --> 0:19:21.480 previously in Germany, even though we have a German brand 0:19:21.480 --> 0:19:26.320 AIDA which sources Germans. The ships are flagged in Italy 0:19:26.760 --> 0:19:29.480 and so we weren't able to get Italy flag clearance. 0:19:29.600 --> 0:19:31.840 But now we have it and we also have it 0:19:32.040 --> 0:19:34.920 UM for Italy, and so we'll start with a few ships. 0:19:35.040 --> 0:19:38.080 Initially the ships will be cruisers to nowhere. They'll they'll 0:19:38.080 --> 0:19:39.959 go out to sea and then come back, so just 0:19:40.040 --> 0:19:43.000 a few days of cruising that that will do multiple things. 0:19:43.040 --> 0:19:47.000 The one it allows us to manage effectively, you know, 0:19:47.040 --> 0:19:51.160 the folks on board UH to handle the new processes, 0:19:51.240 --> 0:19:53.119 make sure all the training we've given our people in 0:19:53.160 --> 0:19:56.800 the new way to conduct and handle things is practiced 0:19:56.840 --> 0:20:00.119 in an efficient way. And it mitigates any risk of 0:20:00.359 --> 0:20:02.879 you know, spread from stopping at the destination where you 0:20:02.960 --> 0:20:05.800 might bring COVID on board after you've you know, I'm 0:20:05.840 --> 0:20:09.520 screening initiative to get started. So that's the initial but 0:20:09.600 --> 0:20:12.399 then shortly thereafter we will have you know, some longer 0:20:12.440 --> 0:20:15.280 cruises and we will go to some destinations again approved 0:20:15.359 --> 0:20:18.520 by you know, the flag states and by the destinations 0:20:18.800 --> 0:20:21.119 with the protocols in place that they want. But it 0:20:21.119 --> 0:20:23.560 will be a few ships at a time initially, and 0:20:23.640 --> 0:20:26.800 I suspect that overall the industry will roll out slowly. 0:20:26.840 --> 0:20:30.400 With regards to the US, Carol is early. We'll we'll 0:20:30.440 --> 0:20:33.560 see what happens. We've extended a number of our brands, 0:20:33.560 --> 0:20:37.800 have gone beyond the no sale order already, intern Or 0:20:37.840 --> 0:20:40.239 do you think it's more? I think, I know. I 0:20:40.280 --> 0:20:43.800 think there's a possibility if if we can get the 0:20:43.880 --> 0:20:46.679 mitigation of spread down and with people going back to 0:20:46.760 --> 0:20:50.520 college and high school and elementary schools and movement of people, 0:20:50.840 --> 0:20:55.359 if we can manage the mitigation of spread where we're seeing, 0:20:55.359 --> 0:20:58.080 instead of a surge, a real decline, then I think 0:20:58.080 --> 0:21:01.639 we can begin to consider, you know, um, social activities, 0:21:01.680 --> 0:21:04.119 of which, of course, cruise this one. Hey listen. Just 0:21:04.160 --> 0:21:07.239