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Speaker 1: A few years ago, I say maybe five, six years ago,

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Speaker 1: seven years ago, I don't really remember. Now. My wife

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Speaker 1: and I were on our way to Asheville, North Carolina.

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Speaker 1: We were going up to see some friends and spend

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Speaker 1: some time there. Almost a decade after working on the

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Speaker 1: Holy Cross case, Private Detective Mike Zuvis was driving down

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Speaker 1: a rural country road on vacation. He wasn't working, but

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Speaker 1: he's a p I. He's observant, and those instincts kicked

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Speaker 1: in when he pulled up behind a big silver Lincoln

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Speaker 1: town car full of people, all dressed in black robes.

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Speaker 1: And what struck me immediately was how many people were

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Speaker 1: in it. It looked like it was a circus car.

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Speaker 1: There were heads, three or four heads in the back

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Speaker 1: seat and a couple of heads in the front seat,

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Speaker 1: and I go, holy moly. So I kind of pulled

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Speaker 1: up a little bit. I put the cop hat on,

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Speaker 1: and I pulled up to look, and I looked at

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Speaker 1: it was Father Abbott sitting in the passenger front seat

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Speaker 1: next to the window driving the car. Was petrol surprised

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Speaker 1: to see the monks he knew from Florida. Zubas drove closer,

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Speaker 1: he hit the horn and signaled for them to pull over.

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Speaker 1: When Father Abbott went saw Zuvis, he recognized the private

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Speaker 1: investigator immediately his eyes got this big. You know, he's

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Speaker 1: wonder what in the hell am I doing on a

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Speaker 1: North Carolina highway? You know. So they pulled over and

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Speaker 1: I got out, walked over to the car and say, hey,

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Speaker 1: what are you guys doing here? He said, let me

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Speaker 1: ask you what you're doing here? And I go, just joking, right,

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Speaker 1: So I'm following you, you know, And they acted a

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Speaker 1: little nervous about all of that. Did it strike you

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Speaker 1: weird that they got a little nervous when he said

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Speaker 1: I'm following you guys? Yeah, I mean you know, it

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Speaker 1: did absolutely. And so you know we've been each other farewell.

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Speaker 1: And that was that, and uh, I never saw him again.

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Speaker 1: A few years after that run in, Zubas says he

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Speaker 1: got curious about the monks from Holy Cross. He went

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Speaker 1: to his computer and typed in the site where he

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Speaker 1: found them not long after that last encounter, but everything

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Speaker 1: was gone. Their website no longer existed. Father's went and

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Speaker 1: Damien Petro Trenta and the other monks had all disappeared.

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Speaker 1: And now even the private investigator couldn't find them. I'm

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Speaker 1: Paula Burrows and I'm Melanie Bartley, and this is sacred scandal.

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Speaker 1: You can't have truth without accountability and transparency. Sunlight is

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Speaker 1: the best disinfectant. In the years after the murder at

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Speaker 1: Holy Cross, Mike remained adamant that he was sexually abused

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Speaker 1: by the priest who ran the school, and as the

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Speaker 1: investigation into those allegations continued, the attorneys prosecuting Mike for

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Speaker 1: the murder of Sister Michelle eventually came to believe that

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Speaker 1: he was being honest with his claims. The defense and

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Speaker 1: prosecution worked hard to find more evidence to corroborate Mike's allegations.

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Speaker 1: They traveled all the way to Ukraine looking for answers,

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Speaker 1: and the process of serving subpoenas and scheduling interviews with

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Speaker 1: the priests and mon asked the candidates took years to

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Speaker 1: organize in Miami's busy criminal justice system, but everything was

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Speaker 1: a dead end. Fathers went and Damien remained silent, and

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Speaker 1: none of the former monastic candidates ever said they were abused.

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Speaker 1: To the monastic candidates left. Assistant State Attorney Gail Levine

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Speaker 1: frustrated those boys as stiff as they were to us

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Speaker 1: and as robotic as they were to us, were the

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Speaker 1: same that they were to the sexual battery detectives. So again,

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Speaker 1: a brick wall. You keep hitting a brick wall. Nobody's

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Speaker 1: giving you any other information. We then tried uh different ways.

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Speaker 1: We brought in Department of Children and Family Services of

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Speaker 1: the State of Florida, they found nothing. We brought in immigration.

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Speaker 1: We we tried all different avenues and the only person

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Speaker 1: that ever admitted to being abused was Mikhaelo cop and

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Speaker 1: he had committed a murder and a violent one, so

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Speaker 1: he was not a defendant that could turn into a

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Speaker 1: very sympathetic victim. So no, the investigation was closed after

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Speaker 1: all of the avenues were explored. With the case closed,

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Speaker 1: it left Mike's defense team to speculate on why they

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Speaker 1: were unable to corroborate Mike's claims of sexual abuse. One

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Speaker 1: of those defense attorneys, Ray Tassif, has his own theory.

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Speaker 1: I don't believe that they sexually abused all of these

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Speaker 1: people by any means. I think they were very, very

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Speaker 1: um selective as to who would be involved in terms

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Speaker 1: of who they thought they could control the most, and

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Speaker 1: so they were very careful about that. That's my own sense,

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Speaker 1: but I think the others had some sense that something

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Speaker 1: was wrong or or something was going on, or were,

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Speaker 1: if now programmed, it was in their own interest to

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Speaker 1: sort of play along with this. Edith Georgie, the lead

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Speaker 1: attorney from Mike's defense, was left frustrated by other elements

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Speaker 1: of the sexual abuse in investigation. There was basic police

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Speaker 1: work that she says needed to happen as soon as

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Speaker 1: the allegations were made, but never did. I think one

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Speaker 1: of the biggest mysteries of this case that remains unsolved

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Speaker 1: is when Mikaylo made the allegations about father Abbott and

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Speaker 1: father Damien, the police had reason to search Damiens and

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Speaker 1: Abbot's residences, and they were never searched either. What would

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Speaker 1: have been found in their residences, One can only imagine.

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Speaker 1: Miami Dade Metro Dade Police Department has all the resources

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Speaker 1: in the world to do this kind of thing. They

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Speaker 1: didn't do it. The priests moved off campus soon after

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Speaker 1: Mike's confession, and as days turned into weeks and years,

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Speaker 1: the likelihood of finding any evidence in those rooms diminished. Now,

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Speaker 1: with the sexual assault investigation closed, the focus shifted back

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Speaker 1: to Mike's trial for the murder of sister Michelle. Though

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Speaker 1: the sex abuse case was inconclusive, Mike's defense team still

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Speaker 1: planned to use his allegations as part of an insanity

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Speaker 1: defense at trial. Edith Georgie says she gathered enough fragments

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Speaker 1: of evidence from the testimony of the monastic candidates, things

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Speaker 1: like the late night footsteps or hotel sleeping arrangements, that

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Speaker 1: could maybe convince a jury that Mike was telling the truth,

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Speaker 1: But she knew the insanity defense was still a risk

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Speaker 1: in the courtroom. And I think that testimony in particular

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Speaker 1: confirmed much of what we already suspected and new and

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Speaker 1: wanted to present as part of our defense. So our

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Speaker 1: defense was shaping up, shall we say. And I think

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Speaker 1: Ms Levine recognized that we also had huge problems because

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Speaker 1: there was clearly some preparation by Mikhailo, even though he

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Speaker 1: drank himself silly that night. Um alcohol is a defense

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Speaker 1: in the state of Florida. Insanity is, and he did

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Speaker 1: face the prospect of spending the rest of his life

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Speaker 1: in prison, that's life without parole, if he were found

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Speaker 1: guilty by a jury. Juries don't really like the insanity defense.

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Speaker 1: They often rejected. Maybe about one in fifty well accepted,

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Speaker 1: and that might be generous, so he ran the real

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Speaker 1: risk of never getting out of prison. On the other side,

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Speaker 1: prosecutor Gail Levin was worried about more than the testimony

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Speaker 1: of the monastic candidates. She knew that father went and

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Speaker 1: Father Damien's silence could also be damaging. If the priest

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Speaker 1: came to court, she knew they would plead the fifth

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Speaker 1: to every question, but if they weren't called to testify

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Speaker 1: at all, that could also have an impact on the jury.

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Speaker 1: Now would that have looked very suspicious? Of course, people

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Speaker 1: would have said, gee, maybe it's a second degree murder

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Speaker 1: because he was so enraged and he really did and

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Speaker 1: have the premeditated designs to thel and I hate those priests.

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Speaker 1: They didn't even show up. Blah blah blah blah blah

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Speaker 1: blah blah blah. She couldn't argue where are they, So

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Speaker 1: they would have said they were going to take the

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Speaker 1: fifth and you can't put somebody on that's going to

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Speaker 1: take the fifth and the jury can never hear that.

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Speaker 1: So the judge was going to exclude them, so she

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Speaker 1: could throw a lot of doubt about what's happening at

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Speaker 1: this church? What happening at the church, and make a

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Speaker 1: lot of his confession. But am I going to get

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Speaker 1: that first degree murder? Am I going to get that

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Speaker 1: death penalty? I knew that was waning. Gail was also

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Speaker 1: worried that the judge would make it difficult for her

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Speaker 1: to get a harsher sentence if this case went to trial,

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Speaker 1: and that also had to do with the priests. I

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Speaker 1: had a very liberal judge, and that judge was a Catholic,

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Speaker 1: and that judge had said things in front of Miss

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Speaker 1: georgian I that made me feel that he felt that

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Speaker 1: those kids were being sexually molested. He'd roll his eyes

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Speaker 1: during the depositions where they were taking the fifth. He

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Speaker 1: seemed very angry that they were taking the fifth. So

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Speaker 1: my concern was he wasn't going to give him the

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Speaker 1: twenty three or twenty two years. That was the bottom

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Speaker 1: that he could give him. And now I'm getting for

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Speaker 1: ninety two stab wounds, I'm getting maybe ten years, maybe

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Speaker 1: I'm getting probation. I wasn't willing to take that risk

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Speaker 1: with that judge. The fear was that he wasn't going

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Speaker 1: to be punished for what he did, and I don't

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Speaker 1: think that it was worth ten years. I think it

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Speaker 1: was worth much more than that. I think it was

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Speaker 1: worth thirty years, and that was the number I wanted.

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Speaker 1: Gail said that by this time she felt the death

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Speaker 1: penalty was no longer on the table because I think

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Speaker 1: he had mitigation. So in Florida, in order to get

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Speaker 1: the death penalty, aggravating circumstances must weigh mitigating factors. He

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Speaker 1: wasn't in a gang, the person wasn't over sixty five

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Speaker 1: or under twelve. He wasn't on probation or community control.

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Speaker 1: He did have the temporaneous crime, which was the burglary,

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Speaker 1: so we had to But did I think that in

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Speaker 1: the end I was going to get seven people that

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Speaker 1: thought he was the worst of the worst. There's fifteen

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Speaker 1: reasons for death penalty. Those two in his circumstance did

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Speaker 1: not weigh against the mitigation. In the build up to

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Speaker 1: the trial, both sides knew they were taking a risk,

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Speaker 1: so they came together to work out a plea deal

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Speaker 1: for Mike. There would be no trial and no possibility

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Speaker 1: of Mike spending the rest of his life in prison,

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Speaker 1: but there would also be no chance of him serving

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Speaker 1: a light sentence, So we did some negotiating the prosecution

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Speaker 1: and our team worked very hard with Mikhailo. That was

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Speaker 1: a very difficult decision for him to make, to accept

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Speaker 1: even a term of years. That he did because in

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Speaker 1: his heart and in his mind, he knew and we

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Speaker 1: knew that he really lost control because of everything that

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Speaker 1: had happened to him. But we had to weigh that

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Speaker 1: against the likelihood that he'd never get out of prison,

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Speaker 1: and that's a real hard thing. In the end, it

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Speaker 1: would be Mike's decision. He pled guilty to second degree

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Speaker 1: murder and burglary, and I accepted a thirty year prison sentence. Yes,

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Speaker 1: it was his choice, of course, when he had the

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Speaker 1: wig these alternatives. He gets out not guilty by reason

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Speaker 1: of insanity, he gets found guilty, spends life in prison,

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Speaker 1: or he works out something in the middle, and the

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Speaker 1: middle course is the safer course. It's probably what I

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Speaker 1: would recommend if he were my child, because I would

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Speaker 1: never want to see my child in prison for life.

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Speaker 1: You know, He's got so many positive features that we

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Speaker 1: knew he'd be okay as long as he could eventually

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Speaker 1: get out of prison, and he'd know that he had

198
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Speaker 1: a lot going for him, and no one wanted to

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Speaker 1: see him brought for the rest of his life in prison.

200
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Speaker 1: By the time of mike sentencing, it was February two

201
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Speaker 1: thousand and five, almost four years since the night that

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Speaker 1: he stabbed sister Michelle more than ninety times. But even now,

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Speaker 1: with the sexual abuse case closed and Mike about to

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Speaker 1: spend the next three decades in prison, things would not

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Speaker 1: just go back to normal at Holy Cross, because by

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Speaker 1: now the school was nothing more than a memory that's

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Speaker 1: coming up after a break. Welcome back to Sacred Scandal. Immediately,

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Speaker 1: the rumors surrounding the murder started flying. The details were

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Speaker 1: so dramatic. It was either twice with an axe or

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Speaker 1: a hundred times of the fire poker, you know, or

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Speaker 1: he had a pistol, or it was rape. I heard

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Speaker 1: a lot of different stories as to what he did.

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Speaker 1: You know, that he was caught stealing from the accounting office,

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Speaker 1: and that Sister Michelle had said that she was going

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Speaker 1: to report him. I remember hearing that he was trying

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Speaker 1: to get his documentations that he could leave, and that

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Speaker 1: sister Michelle stumbled upon him and they had an altercation

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Speaker 1: that somehow ended in her death. It seemed like everything

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Speaker 1: was going downhill. I guess there was enough scrutiny in

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Speaker 1: the media that I just went on hill. You know,

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Speaker 1: this is what life was like at Holy Cross after

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Speaker 1: the murder of Sister Michelle. It was a swirl of

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Speaker 1: rumors and stories about her, Mike and the priests, and

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Speaker 1: each new discovery in the case made it to look

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Speaker 1: TV or the newspaper, and that fed those stories more

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Speaker 1: and more. But the priest didn't really talk about the

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Speaker 1: murder or the allegations against them. There were a few

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Speaker 1: letters home to parents reassuring them that everything was fine,

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Speaker 1: but I don't even recall seeing them around as much

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Speaker 1: for the rest of that school year. One of the

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Speaker 1: times I do recall hearing from them, though, was in

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Speaker 1: the days right after the murder, at an assembly where

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Speaker 1: Father went asked us all to pray for sister Michelle

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Speaker 1: and Mike. One of my former teachers, Jennifer Vida, remembered

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Speaker 1: Father wentz words that day too, and then the next

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Speaker 1: kind of thing that he said before it was sort

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Speaker 1: of all said and done that like shook me to

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Speaker 1: my core, was when he said, you know, this is

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Speaker 1: very difficult news. This is definitely very hard to hear.

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Speaker 1: Hard to handle. This is hard for our community. If

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Speaker 1: you need to talk to someone, or you need, you know,

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Speaker 1: to deal with your grief or however he phrased it,

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Speaker 1: you can certainly seek counsel from myself or father Damien,

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Speaker 1: or you can go to your teachers. And like, my

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Speaker 1: heart stopped at that moment because I turned around to

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Speaker 1: my co teacher, who was teaching English part time, and

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Speaker 1: just looked at her and we she just also looked

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Speaker 1: like she had been like smacked in the face. And

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Speaker 1: we're both looking at each other, like what is happening here?

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Speaker 1: Like we haven't even been able to process this information ourselves.

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Speaker 1: Why because again, like none of this had been digested

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Speaker 1: I think by any of us. I remembered this moment also,

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Speaker 1: and it always felt weird to me that the only

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Speaker 1: counseling that they ever thought to bring in after to

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Speaker 1: the murder was people at the school and never anyone else.

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Speaker 1: So it was surprising for me to hear that one

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Speaker 1: of my teachers felt the same. I don't know. I

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Speaker 1: guess that I expected naively that that would not be

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Speaker 1: a position that we would be put in because we

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Speaker 1: are not trained at all to deal with that level

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Speaker 1: of grief, to provide any kind of therapeutic interventions, to

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Speaker 1: do counseling. I mean, these are there are people who

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Speaker 1: go to school for years for these types of things,

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Speaker 1: and we are not it. I am teaching you all

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Speaker 1: poetry and diagramming sentences, and yes, we're learning about the

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Speaker 1: humanities through art and we're exploring like life themes and

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Speaker 1: stuff in our classes. But that is incredibly different from like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: let's sit together and talk about like how it feels

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Speaker 1: like nothing makes sense in your entire world is crumbling

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Speaker 1: and you don't know how to deal with your emotions

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Speaker 1: right now. Neither do I. Interestingly enough, um, now, I guess,

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Speaker 1: on looking back, why do you think it was that

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Speaker 1: father went went that route with not offering outside counseling

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Speaker 1: and didn't want to bring in experts. Gosh, I have

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Speaker 1: no I have no idea. You know, the community was

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Speaker 1: pretty close knit, and it's one of those things where

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Speaker 1: like we deal with our own things, you know, we

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Speaker 1: keep it in the family, like we have a very

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Speaker 1: specific way that we do things, and we want things run,

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Speaker 1: you know. I speculated that perhaps they had some kind

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Speaker 1: of like an insurance company giving them direction as to

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Speaker 1: what statements to make, how to respond, what to do?

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Speaker 1: You know, grief counselors and those types of things cost

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Speaker 1: a lot of money. There may have been financial I mean,

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Speaker 1: it's like I really there could be numerous reasons why

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Speaker 1: they decided to go that route. I have no clue.

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Speaker 1: The year after the murder was a hard time for

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Speaker 1: Holy Cross Academy. Some people no longer wanted to be

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00:19:06,960 --> 00:19:10,159
Speaker 1: associated with the school where the nun was killed, and

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00:19:10,280 --> 00:19:14,800
Speaker 1: parents pulled their kids. My parents were some of them.

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00:19:14,840 --> 00:19:17,840
Speaker 1: I graduated that spring after the murder, but over the

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00:19:17,880 --> 00:19:20,959
Speaker 1: summer my parents decided that my little sister would not

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Speaker 1: be going back to Holy Cross. Teachers left too, and

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Speaker 1: the following school year, as the stories about the murder,

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00:19:31,760 --> 00:19:35,320
Speaker 1: the sex abuse, and the eparchy investigation made the news,

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00:19:36,359 --> 00:19:41,080
Speaker 1: more parents and teachers started to lose faith. At some point,

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Speaker 1: about a year after the murder, ms Vidas says she

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Speaker 1: was asked to sign a letter to parents showing her

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Speaker 1: loyalty to the school, but by then her mind was

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Speaker 1: made up. The priest's silence had gotten to her. I

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Speaker 1: was asked by someone in a position of authority if

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00:20:00,640 --> 00:20:04,639
Speaker 1: I would consider signing a letter that was to be

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00:20:04,680 --> 00:20:09,959
Speaker 1: sent to the parents, essentially saying that I was planning

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Speaker 1: on coming back next year and that I, you know,

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00:20:13,359 --> 00:20:17,679
Speaker 1: believed in the education that Holy Cross offered and in

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Speaker 1: the student body and all of that, and that I

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Speaker 1: was committed to returning to the school the following year.

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Speaker 1: And it was an unequivocal no, And not because I

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Speaker 1: was trying to be difficult, not because I was even

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Speaker 1: upset at the way that everything had been handled. It

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Speaker 1: was because I had already made a decision and I

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Speaker 1: was not, under any circumstances going to stay upset at

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Speaker 1: how everything had been handled after the murder. Are you

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Speaker 1: only referring to the lack of counseling or were there

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Speaker 1: other ways that they dealt with the aftermath that you

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Speaker 1: didn't agree with or that stood out to you that

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Speaker 1: you were like, yeah, I mean it was just essentially, yes,

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Speaker 1: that was a big piece of it. The lack of

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Speaker 1: transparency around the issue with the community at large. And

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Speaker 1: you know, I understand enough about communications and just generally

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Speaker 1: moving through the world that like your staff or whatever,

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Speaker 1: it's like you're addressing the world because information is not contained,

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Speaker 1: So you totally understand that there are from a legal perspective,

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Speaker 1: and just from protections risk management perspective, a lot of

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Speaker 1: things that could not be shared. But there was zero transparency,

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Speaker 1: and I watched the students and quite frankly, the teachers

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Speaker 1: like battle with that. In the aftermath, as attendance twindled,

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Speaker 1: not every teacher had the choice to come back. Nan Gardner,

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Speaker 1: who was father once assistant headmaster, and the students told

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Speaker 1: us that the decision was not up to her. No,

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Speaker 1: it wasn't bound. They came and told me who couldn't

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Speaker 1: need me? The next year, I had a full year

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Speaker 1: after the murder, and I understood that the enrollment was

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Speaker 1: way down and just that was the end. I was

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00:22:16,480 --> 00:22:20,359
Speaker 1: okay with it. Marietta Fernandez was deeply a part of

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Speaker 1: the school. Her kids went to hold a Cross since kindergarten.

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Speaker 1: She says that in the year after the murder, it

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Speaker 1: felt like things were starting to come and done. So

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Speaker 1: did things begin to feel like they had unraveled? I

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00:22:35,359 --> 00:22:39,080
Speaker 1: think so. I feel that yes it did. But we

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00:22:39,200 --> 00:22:46,120
Speaker 1: felt a great loss, a lot of disorientation, and as

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00:22:46,920 --> 00:22:51,280
Speaker 1: the year progressed, it was very hard and very bad

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Speaker 1: because the parents were getting so involved and creating. I

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00:22:57,040 --> 00:23:04,480
Speaker 1: believe so much rumor that was untrue. At some point

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Speaker 1: during this time, people at Holy Cross found out about

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Speaker 1: the eparchies investigation. So now there were rumors about whether

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00:23:12,080 --> 00:23:17,040
Speaker 1: Father Went and Damien were really priests. Then Father Went

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00:23:17,200 --> 00:23:21,480
Speaker 1: gave in unbroke his silence. Marietta said, he gathered parents

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Speaker 1: and showed them a book from Miami's Latin Catholic Diocese.

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Speaker 1: He told them the book proved he was an ordained

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Speaker 1: Catholic priest. She said that helped, but not for long.

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00:23:33,920 --> 00:23:37,600
Speaker 1: It got a little bit tranquil for a short time,

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Speaker 1: but then you have something in the media that was

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00:23:40,640 --> 00:23:44,159
Speaker 1: happening every day, you know, and people that want to

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Speaker 1: be that way and create that kind of havoc, and

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Speaker 1: it's in their nature to do that, they're going to

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Speaker 1: do it. But we were such a tight knit community,

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Speaker 1: We were such a family. You know, at this time,

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00:23:58,160 --> 00:24:02,200
Speaker 1: the school had grown a lot more, The school was beautiful,

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00:24:02,720 --> 00:24:06,280
Speaker 1: the high level of education remained there. But you know,

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00:24:06,359 --> 00:24:13,200
Speaker 1: we had a lot of ins and outs. So yes,

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00:24:13,400 --> 00:24:16,920
Speaker 1: it was felt, but I think we could have made

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Speaker 1: it through had we stuck together and remained as a family.

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Speaker 1: You know, that was very sad. A lot of people,

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00:24:26,000 --> 00:24:30,359
Speaker 1: you know, separated at this point, A lot of friendships

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00:24:30,800 --> 00:24:36,760
Speaker 1: were broken. It was ugly, it was bad, it was sad.

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Speaker 1: The castle on Sunset Drive was slowly starting to empty.

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00:24:47,560 --> 00:24:51,119
Speaker 1: Holy Crossed lasted just three full school years after the

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Speaker 1: murder of Sister Michelle in the final one two thousand

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00:24:55,040 --> 00:24:58,320
Speaker 1: three to two thousand four, and Rollman was down to

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00:24:58,440 --> 00:25:04,960
Speaker 1: about half as many students and teachers. Even some of

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00:25:05,000 --> 00:25:08,200
Speaker 1: the monastic candidates did not return on the final day

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Speaker 1: of school. All that remained was Father Went, his adopted

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Speaker 1: son of Petarenta, Father Damien, and two other monastic candidates,

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Speaker 1: Bastille Copage and Joseph Lembach, who came to Holy cost

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00:25:21,640 --> 00:25:25,960
Speaker 1: the year of the murder for Father's Went and Damien.

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Speaker 1: The dream they built was gone, but they would start over.

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00:25:31,280 --> 00:25:33,560
Speaker 1: The group would leave Miami and set up a new

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00:25:33,600 --> 00:25:37,439
Speaker 1: monastery in the mountains of North Carolina. They bought a

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Speaker 1: house and some land in a rural area called Weaverville,

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00:25:40,680 --> 00:25:45,520
Speaker 1: just outside Asheville. They funded their new project by selling

382
00:25:45,560 --> 00:25:48,040
Speaker 1: off the land where they built the school and the monastery.

383
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Speaker 1: Property that was purchased over decades for about eight hundred

384
00:25:52,760 --> 00:25:56,399
Speaker 1: and seventy five thousand dollars was sold for a total

385
00:25:56,480 --> 00:26:01,439
Speaker 1: of about nine point eight million dollars, and the Byzantine

386
00:26:01,440 --> 00:26:05,520
Speaker 1: eparchy who wanted to take that property back got nothing,

387
00:26:06,240 --> 00:26:10,320
Speaker 1: because even before the academy closed, the priests were beyond

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Speaker 1: even the Vatican's reach. More on that after the break

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Speaker 1: Welcome back to Sacred Scandal. I'm Paula Barrows and I'm

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Speaker 1: Melanie Bartley. Back around the time that Mike's Pleadio was

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00:26:44,280 --> 00:26:47,879
Speaker 1: coming together and enrollment began to drop a holy across academy,

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00:26:48,400 --> 00:26:51,720
Speaker 1: the sexual abuse scandal in the Catholic Church started to

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Speaker 1: overtake headlines across the country. But in the mid two thousands,

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Speaker 1: there was a lesser known church scandal that kicked off

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00:27:00,040 --> 00:27:03,280
Speaker 1: right around the same time, and it also brought decades

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00:27:03,359 --> 00:27:08,280
Speaker 1: of church secrets to the surface. But this wasn't in

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00:27:08,320 --> 00:27:12,040
Speaker 1: the Catholic Church. This scandal happened in the Orthodox Church

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Speaker 1: in America, which is more commonly known as the o

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00:27:15,359 --> 00:27:19,280
Speaker 1: c A. In the context of the scandals in the

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00:27:19,320 --> 00:27:21,960
Speaker 1: o c A, we called this the time of troubles.

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Speaker 1: This is Mark Stoko. He used to be a member

402
00:27:25,119 --> 00:27:28,600
Speaker 1: of the o c S governing body called the Metropolitan Council.

403
00:27:29,240 --> 00:27:32,760
Speaker 1: That council is made up of bishops priests and lay

404
00:27:32,880 --> 00:27:36,840
Speaker 1: people from the church. During the time of troubles, Mark

405
00:27:36,920 --> 00:27:40,800
Speaker 1: ran an independent accountability website called o c A news

406
00:27:40,880 --> 00:27:44,119
Speaker 1: dot org. He started the site at the beginning of

407
00:27:44,160 --> 00:27:46,760
Speaker 1: two thousand and six, when the initial O c A

408
00:27:46,800 --> 00:27:50,480
Speaker 1: scandals started to become public, and kept it active until

409
00:27:50,560 --> 00:27:54,160
Speaker 1: two thousand eleven. So for about five years we would

410
00:27:54,160 --> 00:27:59,359
Speaker 1: publish stories about the ongoing scandal and scandals in the

411
00:27:59,400 --> 00:28:03,760
Speaker 1: o c A to try and force the administration to

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00:28:03,880 --> 00:28:09,280
Speaker 1: reform itself, and we were ultimately rather successful in that.

413
00:28:10,840 --> 00:28:13,359
Speaker 1: So the short story of the time of troubles starts,

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00:28:13,400 --> 00:28:17,960
Speaker 1: like many scandals with money. Large sums were missing from

415
00:28:17,960 --> 00:28:20,640
Speaker 1: the o Cier's budget, and we're found to be going

416
00:28:20,680 --> 00:28:24,200
Speaker 1: to an unused bank account that only two people knew about.

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Speaker 1: One was the o SIS Metropolitan it's pope like spiritual leader.

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00:28:30,520 --> 00:28:33,840
Speaker 1: The other was the church's chancellor, a leader on the

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00:28:33,840 --> 00:28:38,480
Speaker 1: Metropolitan Council. And Mark told us that the main copra

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00:28:38,600 --> 00:28:43,160
Speaker 1: here was that chancellor, a priest named Father Robert Kundratic.

421
00:28:44,280 --> 00:28:48,680
Speaker 1: So from through two thousand and five, the o CIER

422
00:28:48,760 --> 00:28:54,120
Speaker 1: paid approximately two million dollars of the Chancellor that's basically

423
00:28:54,160 --> 00:28:56,800
Speaker 1: the CEO, who's not a bishop who was a priest.

424
00:28:57,320 --> 00:29:00,160
Speaker 1: They paid two million dollars of his family's credit our

425
00:29:00,240 --> 00:29:04,240
Speaker 1: charges covering twenty personal credit cards and two corporate cards.

426
00:29:04,960 --> 00:29:08,040
Speaker 1: There was no documentation or receipts to support any of

427
00:29:08,080 --> 00:29:13,040
Speaker 1: these purchases were by the o c A. They included

428
00:29:13,560 --> 00:29:17,560
Speaker 1: personal travel and lodging to places like Aruba and Las Vegas,

429
00:29:18,120 --> 00:29:22,600
Speaker 1: tanning in hair, salon charges, jewelry store purchases, and ordinary

430
00:29:22,640 --> 00:29:27,400
Speaker 1: living expenses such as groceries, wine, newspaper, magazine subscriptions, cable bills,

431
00:29:27,720 --> 00:29:32,120
Speaker 1: clothes and shoes. Mike said the o c AS annual

432
00:29:32,160 --> 00:29:35,640
Speaker 1: budget at this time was around that same amount, two

433
00:29:35,680 --> 00:29:39,240
Speaker 1: million dollars a year, and he told us his money

434
00:29:39,360 --> 00:29:41,480
Speaker 1: came from a lot of sources, the chance that I

435
00:29:41,560 --> 00:29:45,480
Speaker 1: would have had a hand in, like fundraisers. For example,

436
00:29:45,640 --> 00:29:48,440
Speaker 1: in two thousand and four, three hundred and thirty three

437
00:29:48,440 --> 00:29:51,200
Speaker 1: people were killed in a terrorist attack on a school

438
00:29:51,240 --> 00:29:55,320
Speaker 1: in Russia. About half of the dead were children. The

439
00:29:55,400 --> 00:29:57,360
Speaker 1: O c A raised money to help the area in

440
00:29:57,360 --> 00:30:00,640
Speaker 1: the aftermath, and Mark says the Chancellor was tasked with

441
00:30:00,720 --> 00:30:03,680
Speaker 1: delivering the money that was donated, but not all of

442
00:30:03,680 --> 00:30:07,240
Speaker 1: it got there. We raised around a hundred and sixty

443
00:30:07,760 --> 00:30:13,320
Speaker 1: dollars from parishioners in a solicitation to help do this

444
00:30:13,480 --> 00:30:19,480
Speaker 1: Christian active charity, and he took eight thousand dollars of

445
00:30:19,560 --> 00:30:26,320
Speaker 1: that for his own use. Eventually, Chundratic was ousted and

446
00:30:26,440 --> 00:30:29,800
Speaker 1: the group was assembled to investigate how he was able

447
00:30:29,840 --> 00:30:33,480
Speaker 1: to hide what he was doing. That group issued a

448
00:30:33,560 --> 00:30:36,840
Speaker 1: report that claimed other people with influence at the o

449
00:30:37,000 --> 00:30:40,440
Speaker 1: c A Knew about the missing money, but had their

450
00:30:40,440 --> 00:30:44,960
Speaker 1: own scandalous reasons for not stopping him. One of those

451
00:30:45,040 --> 00:30:50,440
Speaker 1: named was the church's spiritual leader, Metropolitan Herman. I'll just

452
00:30:50,480 --> 00:30:54,040
Speaker 1: read you a quote from what it said. Several interviewees

453
00:30:54,160 --> 00:30:58,000
Speaker 1: claimed that a significant source of chundratics power over members

454
00:30:58,000 --> 00:31:01,160
Speaker 1: of the Holy Synod and other clergy was his knowledge

455
00:31:01,480 --> 00:31:05,840
Speaker 1: of their alleged personal moral failings, specifically with chemical addictions

456
00:31:05,880 --> 00:31:09,800
Speaker 1: and sexual improprieties. The report goes on to say at

457
00:31:09,880 --> 00:31:14,080
Speaker 1: least three sources informed the Special Investigative Committee that met

458
00:31:14,160 --> 00:31:18,000
Speaker 1: Bault and Hermann affirmed that Chundratic had blackmail herble material

459
00:31:18,320 --> 00:31:21,560
Speaker 1: of a sexual nature about each of them. Just an

460
00:31:21,560 --> 00:31:26,440
Speaker 1: old fashioned story. At this point, you're probably wondering why

461
00:31:26,480 --> 00:31:29,640
Speaker 1: we're talking about this completely different scandal in a totally

462
00:31:29,680 --> 00:31:33,960
Speaker 1: different church. Well, not long before the o c as

463
00:31:34,000 --> 00:31:36,840
Speaker 1: time of troubles began and all of this came to light,

464
00:31:37,720 --> 00:31:41,960
Speaker 1: Chancellor Chundratic was in Miami. He made a special trip

465
00:31:42,160 --> 00:31:45,760
Speaker 1: to inspect a school and monastery that were interested in

466
00:31:45,880 --> 00:31:49,840
Speaker 1: joining the O c A. Then, not long after that

467
00:31:49,960 --> 00:31:54,320
Speaker 1: trip October of two thousand three, during Holy Cross's final

468
00:31:54,400 --> 00:31:58,600
Speaker 1: year in operation, Metropolitan Herman arrived on campus to formally

469
00:31:58,640 --> 00:32:02,920
Speaker 1: accept Father's and and Damien and all the monastic candidates

470
00:32:03,360 --> 00:32:07,480
Speaker 1: as members of the Orthodox Church in America. Now that

471
00:32:07,560 --> 00:32:11,400
Speaker 1: they were no longer Bysantine Catholics, the priests, the school,

472
00:32:11,480 --> 00:32:15,280
Speaker 1: and the monastery were completely outside the reach of the

473
00:32:15,320 --> 00:32:21,360
Speaker 1: Eperchy or Vatican investigations. Right, So here's something you probably

474
00:32:21,400 --> 00:32:28,520
Speaker 1: don't know. In the nineteen eighties, the monks first approach

475
00:32:28,600 --> 00:32:31,080
Speaker 1: to join the o c A to start a monastery

476
00:32:31,080 --> 00:32:36,160
Speaker 1: in Miami, and that plan went askew because just as

477
00:32:36,200 --> 00:32:39,280
Speaker 1: they were about to announce all this, there was a

478
00:32:39,440 --> 00:32:44,240
Speaker 1: group of former Episcopalians who had become Orthodox that ran

479
00:32:44,320 --> 00:32:49,080
Speaker 1: a boy's school and farm in Piau in Mississippi that

480
00:32:49,200 --> 00:32:55,120
Speaker 1: was accused of sexual misconduct, and that school was closed.

481
00:32:55,480 --> 00:32:58,320
Speaker 1: Everything was hushed up, as it was in those days,

482
00:32:58,640 --> 00:33:02,440
Speaker 1: but it eliminated a possibility of starting the same sort

483
00:33:02,480 --> 00:33:06,920
Speaker 1: of thing in Miami. And then the next year the

484
00:33:07,000 --> 00:33:11,560
Speaker 1: monks start the monastery as a Byzantine Catholic monastery and

485
00:33:11,600 --> 00:33:15,400
Speaker 1: a few years later they start to school. So then

486
00:33:15,960 --> 00:33:20,200
Speaker 1: fast forward after the murder. A year after the murder,

487
00:33:20,680 --> 00:33:24,200
Speaker 1: the o CIER has its national convention in Miami in

488
00:33:24,320 --> 00:33:27,320
Speaker 1: July of two thousand and two, and that's where the

489
00:33:27,360 --> 00:33:30,240
Speaker 1: monks first show up on the o CIS radar again.

490
00:33:33,600 --> 00:33:38,440
Speaker 1: And they are all observers at this national convention of

491
00:33:38,440 --> 00:33:42,960
Speaker 1: the o c A. So they were obviously scoping things

492
00:33:43,000 --> 00:33:48,920
Speaker 1: out and meeting people at that meeting. And then eight

493
00:33:48,960 --> 00:33:52,440
Speaker 1: months later they wrote a letter saying that they wanted

494
00:33:52,440 --> 00:33:56,480
Speaker 1: to join the o c A. Father Condratic was sent

495
00:33:56,560 --> 00:34:01,640
Speaker 1: down to investigate them, and he said there's no reason

496
00:34:01,680 --> 00:34:04,239
Speaker 1: they can't be accepted in the o c A, and

497
00:34:04,320 --> 00:34:09,880
Speaker 1: so Metropolitan Herman accepted them and he went down himself

498
00:34:10,400 --> 00:34:15,960
Speaker 1: to receive them into the o c A. When Chindratic

499
00:34:16,040 --> 00:34:19,480
Speaker 1: and Metropolitan Herman accepted Holy Cross into the o c A,

500
00:34:20,200 --> 00:34:24,960
Speaker 1: the murder and sex abuse investigations were still ongoing, and

501
00:34:25,120 --> 00:34:27,880
Speaker 1: Mark says that Father Chindratic the Chancellor of the o

502
00:34:28,040 --> 00:34:33,520
Speaker 1: c A. Personally investigating Holy crosts is strange. He told us.

503
00:34:33,520 --> 00:34:38,280
Speaker 1: It's typically the local bishops that do these sources of inspections.

504
00:34:38,280 --> 00:34:42,359
Speaker 1: But the diocesan bishop at that time was the same

505
00:34:42,400 --> 00:34:46,759
Speaker 1: bishop back in the nineteen eighties who had originally been

506
00:34:47,040 --> 00:34:49,640
Speaker 1: willing to receive them, and so when they tried to

507
00:34:49,640 --> 00:34:52,759
Speaker 1: do it thirty years later, according to my sources, he

508
00:34:52,880 --> 00:34:55,400
Speaker 1: was not really happy with this idea at all, although

509
00:34:55,400 --> 00:34:58,680
Speaker 1: he said nothing publicly and didn't stop it, so they

510
00:34:58,680 --> 00:35:01,600
Speaker 1: saw no red flags after there had been a murder

511
00:35:02,280 --> 00:35:06,560
Speaker 1: in their monastery. Well, according to the quote unquote investigative

512
00:35:06,560 --> 00:35:10,160
Speaker 1: team that was Father Kendratic and the secretary of the

513
00:35:10,200 --> 00:35:13,239
Speaker 1: Metropolitan there was no reason not to accept them into

514
00:35:13,280 --> 00:35:17,799
Speaker 1: the o c A. When the Holy Cross became Orthodox.

515
00:35:18,280 --> 00:35:23,480
Speaker 1: We put information about the accusations on our website, and

516
00:35:24,800 --> 00:35:28,240
Speaker 1: almost immediately I think we got a letter from Father

517
00:35:28,360 --> 00:35:32,560
Speaker 1: once attorneys telling us that we needed to take it

518
00:35:32,640 --> 00:35:36,640
Speaker 1: down or they would see us in state court. Melanie

519
00:35:36,719 --> 00:35:40,400
Speaker 1: Dakota is a former lawyer and support coordinator for an

520
00:35:40,520 --> 00:35:45,560
Speaker 1: organization called SNAP Survivors Network of Those Abuse by Priests.

521
00:35:46,280 --> 00:35:50,200
Speaker 1: It's an organization started working with after witnessing abuse at

522
00:35:50,239 --> 00:35:54,040
Speaker 1: her own Orthodox church in California. When the Holy Cross

523
00:35:54,120 --> 00:35:56,799
Speaker 1: monks joined the o c A, she was part of

524
00:35:56,840 --> 00:36:00,200
Speaker 1: a website called popcrof dot org, a nonp off it

525
00:36:00,320 --> 00:36:03,759
Speaker 1: for survivors of church sex abuse and a network to

526
00:36:03,800 --> 00:36:08,160
Speaker 1: share information about priests accused of abuse. That's where she

527
00:36:08,239 --> 00:36:12,800
Speaker 1: posted information about Mike's allegations against the priests of Holy Cross.

528
00:36:13,040 --> 00:36:15,960
Speaker 1: It was probably one of our first letters, so we

529
00:36:15,960 --> 00:36:18,560
Speaker 1: were a little taken a bag. As I said, Um,

530
00:36:18,600 --> 00:36:20,600
Speaker 1: you know, it came in handy that I had gone

531
00:36:20,600 --> 00:36:24,240
Speaker 1: to law school, so I wasn't quite as worried about

532
00:36:24,280 --> 00:36:27,040
Speaker 1: it because I knew that they couldn't sue us in

533
00:36:27,120 --> 00:36:30,160
Speaker 1: state court, probably because we didn't have ties to Florida.

534
00:36:30,400 --> 00:36:32,960
Speaker 1: Melanie says there were a number of things that stood

535
00:36:32,960 --> 00:36:35,360
Speaker 1: out about Holy Crosses transition to the o c A

536
00:36:35,880 --> 00:36:40,040
Speaker 1: from the very start. The other thing that struck me

537
00:36:40,320 --> 00:36:44,240
Speaker 1: was that they literally changed everything. They changed their names,

538
00:36:44,920 --> 00:36:50,480
Speaker 1: they changed the name of their monastery, they changed their affiliation,

539
00:36:50,800 --> 00:36:54,880
Speaker 1: and then after Mr Crawford was convicted, they moved to

540
00:36:54,920 --> 00:37:06,359
Speaker 1: North Carolina. And it's suspicious now in the o c A.

541
00:37:06,440 --> 00:37:10,320
Speaker 1: The monastery became Protection of the Most Holy Theoto coast.

542
00:37:11,040 --> 00:37:14,919
Speaker 1: Father Abbot Gregory went was now our command right Gregory,

543
00:37:15,400 --> 00:37:21,239
Speaker 1: Father Damien became a human. Damien, Petro was Nicholas, the

544
00:37:21,280 --> 00:37:25,839
Speaker 1: monk fa Seal was called Seraphim, and Yosip was Mark.

545
00:37:29,000 --> 00:37:31,840
Speaker 1: But soon the bigger scandal in the CIA would begin

546
00:37:32,719 --> 00:37:35,600
Speaker 1: and the Monks of Holy Cross would go unnoticed in

547
00:37:35,640 --> 00:37:39,640
Speaker 1: the wake of those larger issues. In the meantime, the

548
00:37:39,719 --> 00:37:43,160
Speaker 1: group from Holy Cross would start building that new monastery

549
00:37:43,280 --> 00:37:47,400
Speaker 1: in North Carolina. They would work on creating a community

550
00:37:47,800 --> 00:37:51,360
Speaker 1: and sell religious books in the area. But at a

551
00:37:51,440 --> 00:37:54,520
Speaker 1: time of troubles continued to bring forward scandals in the

552
00:37:54,520 --> 00:37:57,680
Speaker 1: o c A. It wouldn't be long before it found

553
00:37:57,680 --> 00:38:02,879
Speaker 1: the monks from Holy Cross. Here is Marks Stoko. When

554
00:38:02,880 --> 00:38:06,440
Speaker 1: these monks were accepted into the o c A, you know,

555
00:38:06,480 --> 00:38:10,080
Speaker 1: it was kind of done under the radar. It didn't

556
00:38:10,120 --> 00:38:13,800
Speaker 1: make headlines. No one knew very much about it all

557
00:38:14,000 --> 00:38:19,200
Speaker 1: outside of the small area around Miami. It was only

558
00:38:20,560 --> 00:38:25,160
Speaker 1: four five years later, in the midst of the time

559
00:38:25,200 --> 00:38:31,319
Speaker 1: of troubles that so one of the scandals in the

560
00:38:31,360 --> 00:38:35,239
Speaker 1: o c A. In two two thousand and nine, the

561
00:38:35,400 --> 00:38:43,120
Speaker 1: Archbishop of Canada, Archbishop Seraphim, was accused of sexual misconduct

562
00:38:43,680 --> 00:38:51,040
Speaker 1: with a young boy actually two years earlier, and this

563
00:38:51,239 --> 00:38:56,959
Speaker 1: raised questions naturally, and an investigation was launched. And as

564
00:38:57,120 --> 00:39:01,759
Speaker 1: Archbishop Seraphim was a frequent visitor to the monks when

565
00:39:01,800 --> 00:39:04,839
Speaker 1: they lived in Weaverville, North Carolina, that is after they've

566
00:39:04,880 --> 00:39:08,560
Speaker 1: been accepted into the o c A, that brought those

567
00:39:08,680 --> 00:39:14,360
Speaker 1: monks on the radar because people said, why is he

568
00:39:14,400 --> 00:39:20,480
Speaker 1: always going down to North Carolina. And as a result,

569
00:39:21,239 --> 00:39:24,800
Speaker 1: there began to be calls for investigations into these monks,

570
00:39:24,840 --> 00:39:28,080
Speaker 1: like who are these guys? And it's like, wait a minute,

571
00:39:28,120 --> 00:39:30,080
Speaker 1: these are the guys There was a murderer at their

572
00:39:30,120 --> 00:39:33,800
Speaker 1: monastery and they were Busydian Catholics, and who are these guys?

573
00:39:35,280 --> 00:39:38,640
Speaker 1: Members of the o c S Metropolitan Council started to

574
00:39:38,680 --> 00:39:42,600
Speaker 1: look into the North Carolina monastery. They found out about

575
00:39:42,600 --> 00:39:47,359
Speaker 1: Sister Michelle's murder, Mike's allegations of sexual abuse, and even

576
00:39:47,400 --> 00:39:51,960
Speaker 1: the Byzantine bishop's case against them. Now the o c

577
00:39:52,160 --> 00:39:55,440
Speaker 1: A was on the alert, and once they were on

578
00:39:55,480 --> 00:40:00,719
Speaker 1: the radar, people started going there and they, you know,

579
00:40:00,800 --> 00:40:04,760
Speaker 1: were shocked that there was a triple wired electric fence

580
00:40:04,800 --> 00:40:08,200
Speaker 1: around the property, that there were security cameras everywhere. This

581
00:40:08,280 --> 00:40:11,520
Speaker 1: is not what you see in an Orthodox monastery, and

582
00:40:11,640 --> 00:40:14,520
Speaker 1: people wondered, you know, why is there a swimming pool,

583
00:40:14,880 --> 00:40:19,640
Speaker 1: Why is there a spa? People were saying, what's going on?

584
00:40:20,360 --> 00:40:25,320
Speaker 1: Who's in charge here? And as a result, the Metropolitan

585
00:40:25,360 --> 00:40:30,960
Speaker 1: Council decided that they would delegate three people, including a

586
00:40:31,000 --> 00:40:35,440
Speaker 1: member of the legal committee who was assistant federal attorney,

587
00:40:35,480 --> 00:40:37,719
Speaker 1: to go and investigate these guys and do it in

588
00:40:37,760 --> 00:40:40,000
Speaker 1: a serious basis. How did they get in the o

589
00:40:40,160 --> 00:40:44,279
Speaker 1: c A, what have they been doing? And parentheses, what's

590
00:40:44,320 --> 00:40:48,080
Speaker 1: our liability if any of this comes out, if all

591
00:40:48,120 --> 00:40:52,160
Speaker 1: this smoke shows that there's fire somewhere. And at that point,

592
00:40:53,040 --> 00:40:58,280
Speaker 1: Metropolitan Jonah, who had replaced Metropolitan Herman after he retired,

593
00:40:58,680 --> 00:41:05,520
Speaker 1: Metropolitan Jonah stopped the investigation. And I can't tell you why.

594
00:41:08,960 --> 00:41:11,640
Speaker 1: Mark told us that he saw signs that the monks

595
00:41:11,640 --> 00:41:14,920
Speaker 1: were rattled by the o C as investigation. As part

596
00:41:14,960 --> 00:41:19,120
Speaker 1: of the beginning of the investigation into them by the

597
00:41:19,200 --> 00:41:23,720
Speaker 1: Metropolitan Council. We have the property records, the transferred titles,

598
00:41:24,160 --> 00:41:26,880
Speaker 1: and it's a pretty clear pattern. Every time there were

599
00:41:27,000 --> 00:41:32,360
Speaker 1: questions raised, beginning in two thousand and four, so the

600
00:41:32,400 --> 00:41:35,479
Speaker 1: title of all these properties got transferred from one thing

601
00:41:35,520 --> 00:41:38,800
Speaker 1: to another thing. And you can see these title changes

602
00:41:38,880 --> 00:41:42,400
Speaker 1: happening if you look at the public records. The ownership

603
00:41:42,440 --> 00:41:46,359
Speaker 1: of the property in North Carolina moves between three companies.

604
00:41:47,200 --> 00:41:50,040
Speaker 1: It starts with Holy Cross Economy in two thousand four

605
00:41:50,520 --> 00:41:53,800
Speaker 1: when they first bought the land. Then a few months

606
00:41:53,880 --> 00:41:57,400
Speaker 1: later it moved to a newly formed company called St.

607
00:41:57,480 --> 00:42:03,200
Speaker 1: Nicholas Brotherhood. In two thousand and ten, when Archbishop Seraphim

608
00:42:03,239 --> 00:42:07,600
Speaker 1: was being investigated for sexual abuse, ownership of the monastery

609
00:42:07,640 --> 00:42:11,960
Speaker 1: moved again, this time to the Protection of Most Holy

610
00:42:12,040 --> 00:42:16,160
Speaker 1: Theoto Coast Monastery. A few months later it moved back

611
00:42:16,200 --> 00:42:20,520
Speaker 1: to St. Nicholas Brotherhood. These companies all are held by

612
00:42:20,560 --> 00:42:25,040
Speaker 1: some combination of Father went Father Damien, and Petro Trenta,

613
00:42:26,239 --> 00:42:29,520
Speaker 1: so it's impossible to figure out, you know, who owns it,

614
00:42:29,560 --> 00:42:33,959
Speaker 1: but it always goes back to Win and Uh. When

615
00:42:34,040 --> 00:42:38,080
Speaker 1: the o c began asking questions, the monastery was transferred

616
00:42:38,400 --> 00:42:41,600
Speaker 1: and that was I would assume because questions are raised,

617
00:42:41,600 --> 00:42:50,480
Speaker 1: well does the o c A own this monastery. The

618
00:42:50,560 --> 00:42:53,960
Speaker 1: o c A also wanted to know how Holy Cross

619
00:42:53,960 --> 00:42:58,640
Speaker 1: with the open sex abuse investigation, the Eprochy investigation, and

620
00:42:58,760 --> 00:43:02,200
Speaker 1: the fact that Mike's still hadn't been sentenced, had gotten

621
00:43:02,200 --> 00:43:07,000
Speaker 1: through any initial inspections to join the church. Melanie Sakota

622
00:43:07,520 --> 00:43:10,319
Speaker 1: said there were theories tying it all back to the

623
00:43:10,320 --> 00:43:13,759
Speaker 1: original ci A scandals, and one of the things that

624
00:43:13,880 --> 00:43:16,839
Speaker 1: was uncovered in that scandal was that a lot of

625
00:43:16,880 --> 00:43:19,920
Speaker 1: donations that were sent into the o c A we're

626
00:43:19,960 --> 00:43:25,760
Speaker 1: being siphoned off into an account or accounts that were

627
00:43:25,800 --> 00:43:31,120
Speaker 1: available to the Metropolitan and to his chancellor, and so

628
00:43:31,360 --> 00:43:37,440
Speaker 1: I think the speculation was that the monastery was accepted

629
00:43:38,440 --> 00:43:44,040
Speaker 1: because they paid toll to the troll. Now I don't

630
00:43:44,080 --> 00:43:49,200
Speaker 1: know if that was uncovered, but it was some speculation

631
00:43:49,320 --> 00:43:54,640
Speaker 1: because the Chancellor and the Metropolitan at the time came

632
00:43:54,640 --> 00:44:00,080
Speaker 1: down personally to oversee the acceptance into the o c A.

633
00:44:00,080 --> 00:44:04,400
Speaker 1: At that point, perhaps money could have changed hands, but

634
00:44:04,680 --> 00:44:08,839
Speaker 1: nothing was ever proved. A year after the investigation into

635
00:44:09,000 --> 00:44:13,280
Speaker 1: Archbishop Seraphim from Canada started, the priests did the same

636
00:44:13,320 --> 00:44:17,640
Speaker 1: thing they did only a few years before they switched churches,

637
00:44:19,680 --> 00:44:23,360
Speaker 1: though their release wasn't announced until the following February. The

638
00:44:23,400 --> 00:44:26,040
Speaker 1: group from Holy Cross officially left the o c A

639
00:44:26,320 --> 00:44:30,880
Speaker 1: in October two thousand eleven, almost exactly eight years after

640
00:44:30,920 --> 00:44:36,719
Speaker 1: they joined. Once they got investigated by the Byzantine Catholics,

641
00:44:37,080 --> 00:44:40,239
Speaker 1: they jumped ship to the o c A. And when

642
00:44:40,280 --> 00:44:43,120
Speaker 1: the O c A actually began to investigate them, they

643
00:44:43,200 --> 00:44:47,360
Speaker 1: jumped ship and join the church in the Ukraine. But

644
00:44:47,719 --> 00:44:50,560
Speaker 1: they didn't go back to Catholicism or even join another

645
00:44:50,640 --> 00:44:54,920
Speaker 1: church in the United States. The monastery in Weaverville was

646
00:44:54,960 --> 00:44:59,640
Speaker 1: now part of the Ukrainian Orthodox Church, not just Ukrainian

647
00:44:59,760 --> 00:45:06,720
Speaker 1: in name, but the actual church in Ukraine. Mark says

648
00:45:06,760 --> 00:45:09,720
Speaker 1: that this is not uncommon for Orthodox groups which troubled

649
00:45:09,719 --> 00:45:13,040
Speaker 1: pasts to do this as a way of covering their tracks.

650
00:45:13,760 --> 00:45:18,400
Speaker 1: It's called jurisdiction hopping. So there are thirty different Orthodox

651
00:45:18,480 --> 00:45:23,040
Speaker 1: jurisdictions in the United States, and oftentimes people that get

652
00:45:23,080 --> 00:45:28,040
Speaker 1: in trouble in one jump to another, and as there's

653
00:45:28,640 --> 00:45:33,040
Speaker 1: up until recently been little communication between them, they were

654
00:45:33,080 --> 00:45:37,400
Speaker 1: successful in doing that. It always struck Paula and I

655
00:45:37,520 --> 00:45:39,680
Speaker 1: how easy it was for the priests to move from

656
00:45:39,800 --> 00:45:43,640
Speaker 1: church to church to stay We're Catholic, now, we're Orthodox,

657
00:45:44,120 --> 00:45:47,759
Speaker 1: now we're something else. The thing is, the Bysantine Church,

658
00:45:47,960 --> 00:45:51,480
Speaker 1: the c A on the Ukrainian Orthodox Church all share

659
00:45:51,520 --> 00:45:55,279
Speaker 1: the same liturgy. The Orthodox churches just aren't under the

660
00:45:55,360 --> 00:45:59,279
Speaker 1: Pope in Rome. So though they are structurally different, their

661
00:45:59,320 --> 00:46:04,000
Speaker 1: beliefs and act this are a lot alike. But the

662
00:46:04,080 --> 00:46:06,919
Speaker 1: church they were a part of now was not new

663
00:46:07,000 --> 00:46:11,600
Speaker 1: for the monastic candidates. The Ukrainian Orthodox Church that they

664
00:46:11,719 --> 00:46:15,480
Speaker 1: joined back in two thousand and eleven has its leadership

665
00:46:15,520 --> 00:46:22,320
Speaker 1: in Moscow. It's essentially the church the remaining monastic candidates Petro,

666
00:46:22,680 --> 00:46:26,680
Speaker 1: Yoseph and Vasile were forced to join back before the

667
00:46:26,719 --> 00:46:30,000
Speaker 1: fall of the Soviet Union. When we talked to a

668
00:46:30,120 --> 00:46:33,759
Speaker 1: Seal's cousin, Elia Hertzok earlier this year about his own

669
00:46:33,800 --> 00:46:37,279
Speaker 1: experience as monastic candidate, we also asked him what he

670
00:46:37,360 --> 00:46:40,399
Speaker 1: thought of the group moving to the Ukrainian Orthodox Church.

671
00:46:42,080 --> 00:46:45,400
Speaker 1: What do you feel about them changing religions? It was

672
00:46:46,640 --> 00:46:49,560
Speaker 1: a little bit weird because it was the things that

673
00:46:49,640 --> 00:46:53,640
Speaker 1: we ran from before. We were allowed to go only

674
00:46:53,760 --> 00:46:57,880
Speaker 1: to Moscow church here and I was it was like

675
00:46:58,239 --> 00:47:02,520
Speaker 1: underground church, so and the forbidden church Catholic. It was

676
00:47:02,560 --> 00:47:08,600
Speaker 1: forbidden and for me it was swird. Why was Hell

677
00:47:08,600 --> 00:47:14,520
Speaker 1: staying there? And what's for sure, would if he had

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00:47:14,520 --> 00:47:18,120
Speaker 1: the choice, he would go, I believe. But when he stayed,

679
00:47:26,400 --> 00:47:29,520
Speaker 1: when private investigator Mike Zubs got on his computer to

680
00:47:29,600 --> 00:47:32,279
Speaker 1: search for the monks from Holy Cross, the ones he

681
00:47:32,320 --> 00:47:34,960
Speaker 1: saw driving in that big silver car through the hills

682
00:47:34,960 --> 00:47:38,320
Speaker 1: of North Carolina. There was a reason why he couldn't

683
00:47:38,360 --> 00:47:42,000
Speaker 1: find them. The jump to the Ukrainian church would not

684
00:47:42,120 --> 00:47:48,040
Speaker 1: be the group's final move. Not long after that switch went, Damien,

685
00:47:48,160 --> 00:47:52,600
Speaker 1: Petro Vasile and Josiph packed up and started a new

686
00:47:52,640 --> 00:47:56,960
Speaker 1: monastery in the mountains of Ukraine. And that's where it

687
00:47:57,000 --> 00:48:01,879
Speaker 1: seems like the story ends. The solved case closed, Mike

688
00:48:01,960 --> 00:48:05,640
Speaker 1: in prison, the monks and priests in a different country,

689
00:48:05,800 --> 00:48:11,640
Speaker 1: outside the reach of any Byzantine, Orthodox or police investigations.

690
00:48:11,640 --> 00:48:13,840
Speaker 1: But for Melanie and me and so many of the

691
00:48:13,920 --> 00:48:18,480
Speaker 1: former teachers, parents and students we talked to Father when

692
00:48:18,640 --> 00:48:22,160
Speaker 1: and Father Damien, silence still hangs heavy over everything that

693
00:48:22,239 --> 00:48:26,920
Speaker 1: happened at Holy Cross. So next time on Sacred Scandal,

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00:48:27,480 --> 00:48:30,520
Speaker 1: We're gonna go on a five thousand mile trip to

695
00:48:30,640 --> 00:48:46,720
Speaker 1: try and break that silence. Sacred Scandal is a production

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00:48:46,760 --> 00:48:50,360
Speaker 1: of Exile Content Studio and partnership with I Heart Radios

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00:48:50,400 --> 00:48:55,400
Speaker 1: Michael Duda Podcast Network. Sacred Scandal was created and produced

698
00:48:55,480 --> 00:49:00,840
Speaker 1: by Melanie Bartley and me Paula Barrows. Our senior producer

699
00:49:00,960 --> 00:49:05,920
Speaker 1: is Dennis Bunk of Written and Air. The executive producers

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00:49:05,960 --> 00:49:11,520
Speaker 1: are Rose Red and Nando Villa. Production mixing and sound

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00:49:11,520 --> 00:49:17,440
Speaker 1: design by Helena de grout. Our production assistant is Imani Leonard.

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00:49:18,560 --> 00:49:23,560
Speaker 1: The show is fact checked by Kimberly Winston. Original music

703
00:49:23,640 --> 00:49:28,240
Speaker 1: and final audio mixing comes from Patrick Hart and special

704
00:49:28,280 --> 00:49:31,960
Speaker 1: thanks on this episode to George Drake Jr. Elissa Martine,

705
00:49:32,520 --> 00:49:37,640
Speaker 1: Corey Chikowski, Michael Haziza, and Travis Roych. If you'd like

706
00:49:37,719 --> 00:49:40,840
Speaker 1: to reach out, email us at hello at Sacred Scandal

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00:49:40,920 --> 00:49:45,040
Speaker 1: podcast dot com, and you can follow us on Instagram

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00:49:45,080 --> 00:49:46,200
Speaker 1: at Sacred Scandal