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Speaker 1: From Marhart where Innovation, Money and power Collie in Silicon Valley, NBN.

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Speaker 2: This is Bloomberg Technology with Caroline Hyde and Ed Loved Love.

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Speaker 3: And Live from New York and San Francisco. This is

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Speaker 3: Bloomberg Technology coming up. Apple iPhone confidence but regulatory risks.

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Speaker 4: Details ahead, Plus Business Week's definitive story on Rivian's ev

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Speaker 4: turnaround plan, and.

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Speaker 3: A look at Neuralink and its competitors as Musk tease

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Speaker 3: up a new implant.

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Speaker 5: The first.

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Speaker 3: Let's check in on the broader tech index right now, Ed,

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Speaker 3: I'm afraid that soothing of concerns around inflation has not

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Speaker 3: driven up the tech stocks.

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Speaker 5: Bond markets.

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Speaker 3: Yes, they are on fire, but today the NASAC is

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Speaker 3: off by one point two percent. Some key players on

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Speaker 3: the downside in video being one, but you're looking at

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Speaker 3: us the key names that are currently under pressure.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, Apple, and Apple is a big points drag. There

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Speaker 4: are so many headlines out in the first instance, with

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Speaker 4: the stock at one point in the session on track

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Speaker 4: for its biggest drop since March. Bank of America up

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Speaker 4: raising its price target to two hundred and fifty six

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Speaker 4: dollars a share from two hundred and thirty, seeing confidence

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Speaker 4: in a refresh cycle for the iPhone. Then there's the

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Speaker 4: Bloomberg reporting that Apple is said to its suppliers, we

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Speaker 4: want to boost iPhone shipments by ten percent. There's some

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Speaker 4: growing momentum around the iPhone story, up eighteen percent or

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Speaker 4: so year to date, but by no means one of

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Speaker 4: the best performers on the Nasdaq one hundred. And then

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Speaker 4: there's that that you talked about regulatory risk Apple avoiding

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Speaker 4: sanctioned in the EU.

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Speaker 6: Give me the details.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I really think though at the moment, we are

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Speaker 3: seeing this Apple concern at the moment, and the fact

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Speaker 3: that EU regulators are basically forcing them to open up

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Speaker 3: the wallets situation, the fact that we're seeing fintech being

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Speaker 3: our eyes on the prize may be a boost to PayPal,

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Speaker 3: but ultimately this is the way in which regulators have

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Speaker 3: decided that big techniques stop opening up their walled gardens.

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Speaker 3: And Anna rag Rana is exactly the person we should

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Speaker 3: speak to about this bingleg intelligence and just I set

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Speaker 3: for us Apple under pressure big tech more broadly on

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Speaker 3: the day. But as that articulates, there's some good moon

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Speaker 3: music around iPhone supply and demand, but at the same

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Speaker 3: time there are the these regulatory risks that are forcing

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Speaker 3: business model change.

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Speaker 5: Yeah.

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Speaker 7: You know, Apple's performed really well over the last few months,

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Speaker 7: and you know, if you go back in April, I

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Speaker 7: mean I think it's up what thirty five forty percent

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Speaker 7: since then, it's you know, the rebound has been driven

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Speaker 7: a lot by Apple's AI story, which I think has

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Speaker 7: resonated well with investors. Now, yesterday was probably the first

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Speaker 7: big time news we got in terms of iPhone shipment improvement,

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Speaker 7: and I don't remember in the last several years really

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Speaker 7: looking at that kind of a news, and I think

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Speaker 7: that really says that there is a lot of you know,

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Speaker 7: if you could say, hype slash expectations about the iPhone

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Speaker 7: sixteen and what it could do to Apple's top line.

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Speaker 4: And the other big story is that Apple has avoided

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Speaker 4: a fine from the EU because it's opened up it's

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Speaker 4: mobile wallets technology to others. It's made a concession. How

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Speaker 4: do you think that impacts the iOS ecosystem?

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Speaker 7: Yeah, you know, the the Apple CFO commented a few

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Speaker 7: quarters ago that the app store revenue form EU you know,

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Speaker 7: accounts for about seven percent of that particular radio's sales,

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Speaker 7: so it's really not that big of a deal. Frankly,

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Speaker 7: now this is nothing new. We are seeing EU really

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Speaker 7: cracking down on all big US firms. I don't think

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Speaker 7: it's going to stop anytime soon. I don't think these

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Speaker 7: cases are going to go away. But frankly, speaking from

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Speaker 7: a financial point of view, it's not going to hurt

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Speaker 7: them as much as you know.

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Speaker 6: The headline suggest.

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Speaker 4: Anirag Rana or Bloomberg Intelligence. Thank you very much. I

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Speaker 4: mentioned there were many headlines about Apple. Apple and Microsoft

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Speaker 4: have dropped plans to take board roles at open Ai

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Speaker 4: in a surprise decision amid growing regularly regulatory screws. Me

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Speaker 4: here in San Francisco, Bloomberg Technology Senior executive edit said

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Speaker 4: Tom Giles, give us the details of this Bloomberg reporting.

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Speaker 4: Microsoft's investment in open Ai as well known. But Apple

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Speaker 4: was due to get a board observer role. Now neither

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Speaker 4: of those are going to have a board and solve

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Speaker 4: observer role.

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Speaker 6: Yeah ed.

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Speaker 1: Open AI's board was starting to get really crowded with

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Speaker 1: big powerful tech company, the most powerful tech companies in

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Speaker 1: the world. That's a bad look when you are under

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Speaker 1: regulatory scrutiny, when everybody is worried about a concentration of

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Speaker 1: power and money around open ai. The basically one of

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Speaker 1: the biggest, if not the biggest LM biggest generative AI companies,

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Speaker 1: was just getting too chummy with Microsoft and Apple.

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Speaker 5: That was the concern, a concern that actually is global.

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Speaker 6: Tom.

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Speaker 3: We were just talking how the EU has been focused

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Speaker 3: in on Apple. They were focused in on Microsoft sort

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Speaker 3: of ultimately doing a form of M and A here

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Speaker 3: by stealth. Now without the board seats, does that drive home?

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Speaker 5: That isn't the case.

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Speaker 1: So Microsoft is the biggest investor in open ai, to

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Speaker 1: the tune of thirteen billion dollars. It's a massive investment.

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Speaker 1: Microsoft is weaving open AI's technology into a lot of

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Speaker 1: its own products. Apple is doing the very same thing.

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Speaker 1: It's not an investor to that degree, but it is

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Speaker 1: using open ais technology throughout its software to make it

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Speaker 1: basically to get people to spend more time on their iPhone,

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Speaker 1: to make the iPhone more useful. Both of these things

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Speaker 1: are basically showing how important open ai is and how

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Speaker 1: important the relationship is with big tech companies that want

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Speaker 1: to get a piece of the hottest generative AI property

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Speaker 1: in the world. And that's where regulators are having a

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Speaker 1: hard time. They're worried about competition. They're worried about other

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Speaker 1: companies getting access to this technology. They're worried about concentration.

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Speaker 1: And this is where you're seeing it start to come unraveled.

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Speaker 1: Removing those board observer rules for both of them, and.

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Speaker 4: Even that might not be enough. Sources telling Bloomberg that

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Speaker 4: you know, regulators here in the s will still look

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Speaker 4: at Microsoft because they're like, you didn't notify us in

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Speaker 4: advance about this deal. Bloomboks Tom Giles, who leads our

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Speaker 4: technology coverage around the world, thank you so much sticking

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Speaker 4: with big tech. We're also watching shares of Google and HubSpot.

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Speaker 4: Google down, Alphabet the parent company of two percent, HubSpot

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Speaker 4: up nine ten percent. The reporting the Alphabet has shelved

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Speaker 4: this interest in HubSpot. A story of beIN tracking here

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Speaker 4: across the newsroom, Caro, what's up next in the show?

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Speaker 3: Oh, a story that is beautifully written by Nana Man

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Speaker 3: and yourself. We're talking Rivian's race against Tesla more and

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Speaker 3: how the company is taking an alternative route to woo

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Speaker 3: those Tesla customers.

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Speaker 5: As a Bloomberg Technology.

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Speaker 4: It's time for talking tech and first up, Leap Motors

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Speaker 4: makes a deal to go global Stalantis has partnered with

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Speaker 4: the little known Chinese EV maker, investing one point six

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Speaker 4: billion dollars for a twenty one percent stake. The joint

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Speaker 4: venture would allow Stilantis to access Leap motors advanced tech

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Speaker 4: features while allowing Leap Motors to build and sell their cars.

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Speaker 4: Installance's global network plus Lucid Motors says they're still continuing

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Speaker 4: to raise cash. Bloomberg spoke with CEO Peter Rawlinson earlier today.

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Speaker 8: This is a capital invents intensive business and we do

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Speaker 8: need to raise more money.

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Speaker 6: And we will at opportune moments in time on the future.

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Speaker 6: Our vision is to be a major player here.

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Speaker 4: The company has license deals with the likes of Aston

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Speaker 4: Martin and said they're in discussions with others and auto

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Speaker 4: plants get a lifeline. The Biden administrations awarding one point

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Speaker 4: seven billion dollars to retool at risk or show to

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Speaker 4: manufacturing and assembly plants across eight states, converting them to

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Speaker 4: support EV manufacturing. The funding is being made available through

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Speaker 4: the Inflation Reduction Act and is subject to negotiations and

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Speaker 4: other reviews before becoming final.

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Speaker 3: Character Look, we are going to stick on this EV

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Speaker 3: train ed yourself and mister Max Traffkin are out with

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Speaker 3: a really in depth piece on Rivian and VW's partnership.

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Speaker 3: What sparked it, how the ev maker is basically banking

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Speaker 3: on the anti Tesla crowd, and Ed just walks through.

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Speaker 5: Who you first spoke to.

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Speaker 3: There's this particular well sort of person we hear from

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Speaker 3: who sums up how a lot of Tesla people and

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Speaker 3: owners feel right now.

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Speaker 4: As we spoke to many of them. There's like this

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Speaker 4: great body of former Tesla fans, fanboys, owners, you know,

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Speaker 4: that community online that's basically defected to Rivian for lots

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Speaker 4: of reasons. And I think Max would agree it's not

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Speaker 4: very difficult to find them, is it, Max? You know,

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Speaker 4: this was one case study. We spoke to several of them,

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Speaker 4: the point being that that was Rivian's original audience. Is

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Speaker 4: that audience now and they got a lot to do.

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Speaker 3: Right Yeah.

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Speaker 9: And what you see when you talk to a lot

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Speaker 9: of Rivian owners, it's it's kind of it's interesting because

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Speaker 9: it tells you a lot about the where the ev

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Speaker 9: industry is going and maybe also where Tesla's going or

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Speaker 9: where Tesla has at times gone wrong. It's not that

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Speaker 9: these people are necessarily big Tesla haters. They're not the

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Speaker 9: folks on X who are you know, you know, talking

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Speaker 9: talking about shorting the stock or anything. They are just

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Speaker 9: often just car people who are interested in EV's, much

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Speaker 9: more interested in evs, say than in robotaxis or wild

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Speaker 9: promises about brain implants or whatever, and also interested in

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Speaker 9: new models. I mean, and when you when you look

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Speaker 9: at where Tesla has has arguably made some mistakes and

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Speaker 9: where Rivian has done well, I mean, I think if

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Speaker 9: Tesla comes out with a cyber truck that looks something

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Speaker 9: like the Rivian R one t, which is their pickup truck,

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Speaker 9: I think it would have been a much more successful launch.

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Speaker 9: And so it's it's an interesting sort of cross road situation.

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Speaker 4: I really wanted to do this story, Caroline, because I've

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Speaker 4: covered Rivian for many years and I've never had an

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Speaker 4: experience in my career where a company has gone from

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Speaker 4: like such ethoric highs to like really down in the doldrums. Right,

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Speaker 4: this was the sixth biggest IPO in US history, you know,

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Speaker 4: the biggest since Facebook, and now the stock would make

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Speaker 4: you think that it's like a Fiscal or Elucid, but

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Speaker 4: to their credit, like Rivian's a different beast Carrot.

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Speaker 5: They actually make evs.

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Speaker 4: What we wanted to do is explain how they're going

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Speaker 4: to get to that next stage, which is to get

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Speaker 4: nearer to Tesla.

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Speaker 3: I like that they actually make evs a max to

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Speaker 3: that point, though they haven't been producing them at the

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Speaker 3: rapid clip. The many thought, and well, they have got

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Speaker 3: a new prototype that actually is just a prototype.

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Speaker 5: When we kind of get the R three.

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Speaker 9: Yeah, you have sort of two situations going on. One

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Speaker 9: is just their car manufacturing is difficult, and you know

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Speaker 9: it's we've seen this with many of these automotive startups.

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Speaker 6: It takes them longer than they want.

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Speaker 9: Rivian also faced a lot of supply chainallenges, especially during

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Speaker 9: the pandemic. The thing is with evs, right, they've they're

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Speaker 9: selling a lot of these very expensive SUVs and pickup trucks.

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Speaker 9: They are getting really good reviews. But the truth is

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Speaker 9: and and R J. Scurringe, the CEO of Rivian, UH

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Speaker 9: spoke to Ed and I about this, but like, there's

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Speaker 9: just a limited number of people who want these things.

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Speaker 9: What what the industry needs and what climate advocates need

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Speaker 9: is more affordable cars, and and Rivian is trying to

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Speaker 9: get there and get there as quickly as they can.

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Speaker 9: We have the art they're working on the R two,

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Speaker 9: the factory in normal Illinois, that's Central Illinois. They're they're

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Speaker 9: they're really starting to get ready already. Uh you know

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Speaker 9: when I was out there a few weeks ago. And

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Speaker 9: and the plan, the long term plan is this R three,

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Speaker 9: which is again this kind of like almost mythical at

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Speaker 9: this point, cheap electric car, the electric car that everyone

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Speaker 9: can afford, but it definitely is a long way from

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Speaker 9: being real.

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Speaker 6: Well, it's also like they're.

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Speaker 4: Running out of cash. And I think that one of

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Speaker 4: the important points that we make in the story is

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Speaker 4: some of the reasons why they pivoted to write Max,

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Speaker 4: and that is they were running out in money, partly because,

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Speaker 4: according to our sources, the DOE said, if you want

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Speaker 4: some of this money from the Inflation Reduction Act, you

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Speaker 4: have to change your position on unions. And we understand

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Speaker 4: that that's just not happening right now.

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Speaker 9: Yeah, you had this frantic scramble. I mean, the weird

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Speaker 9: thing is Rivian of course has lots of cash. It's

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Speaker 9: just that the automotive that that making cars is so

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Speaker 9: expensive that they're burning even more. And it was looking

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Speaker 9: you know, you know, as we wrote this story, increasingly

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Speaker 9: unlikely that they were going to be able to open

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Speaker 9: this plan in Georgia, Ed, as you said, looking to

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Speaker 9: the to the Biden administration, to the to the federal government,

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Speaker 9: like many companies, and you know, ultimately.

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Speaker 5: Not getting there.

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Speaker 9: As we report in the story, these negotiations are ongoing.

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Speaker 9: It's possible they will reach some sort of deal. But

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Speaker 9: in the meantime, this VW infusion is huge for Rivian.

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Speaker 9: It takes a lot of the pressure that this company

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Speaker 9: is on and of course that's why the stock you know,

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Speaker 9: went way up when when the deal was announced.

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Speaker 5: And I love how we stock. We started on stock and.

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Speaker 3: One of the greatest pieces that you have out of

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Speaker 3: there is is how the main owner of Tesla say

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Speaker 3: there's two types of Teslo owners, those who are the

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Speaker 3: stock owners and those who actually own the cars.

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Speaker 5: All of this is such great reporting from both of you.

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Speaker 3: Thank you, Max Chafkin and of course Ed Lulo just

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Speaker 3: across the RJ Scarrange story.

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Speaker 4: Okay, Today for our AI and Action segment, we're joined

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Speaker 4: by Lynn Chow, who's the CEO of Fireworks AI, to

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Speaker 4: discuss the company's latest Series B funding round. Fifty two

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Speaker 4: million dollars, but also their plans for the future of AI.

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Speaker 4: So Fireworks is interesting to me, LeAnn and welcome to

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Speaker 4: the program. You describe yourselves as lightning fast inference platform.

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Speaker 4: So in the first instance, the basics of what a

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Speaker 4: lightning fast inference platform.

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Speaker 10: Is definitely Thanks for having me here, d and Fireworks

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Speaker 10: we are. We have deliver one of the fastest, the

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Speaker 10: most cost efficient infrast engine using our propriety technology. By that,

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Speaker 10: we want to address the challenge of many applications. They

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Speaker 10: require very low latency to drive responsive product experience and

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Speaker 10: very low costs to deliver viable, sustainable business.

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Speaker 5: It's very difficult because.

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Speaker 10: Large language models are big, so deliver all these prec

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Speaker 10: requirements are really challenging, and here we focus on helping

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Speaker 10: those applications to get there.

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Speaker 4: This is something that is targeted at both developers but

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Speaker 4: also potentially enterprise customers. So if I were one of

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Speaker 4: those two groups, a developer or running a large enterprise,

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Speaker 4: how would I use Fireworks? Give me some examples or

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Speaker 4: case studies.

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Speaker 10: Yeah, we have many customers ranging from leading startups to

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Speaker 10: fortune five hundred companies using Fireworks to disrupt the status

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Speaker 10: called and the startups using fireworks to drive iterative new

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Speaker 10: creative ideas and native companies using fireworks to deliver new

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Speaker 10: products events, Fortune five hundred companies to use fireworks to

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Speaker 10: drive productivity. We have leading airsrs like Krasna, Cursor, Sourceware, Liner,

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Speaker 10: our Prime.

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Speaker 3: We've seen some of your clients. Now we're seeing actually

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Speaker 3: some of your investors as well. I mean this is

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Speaker 3: a who's who of not just VC, but of strategic

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Speaker 3: investors in videos, in AMDs, in Mongo dB, is in Lynn.

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Speaker 3: How was the fundraising experience?

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Speaker 10: Yeah, we are blessed to be supported by so many,

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Speaker 10: like the industry leading investors of Sekoya. We also have

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Speaker 10: investors for Nvidia, MD and Mongo dB joining force. We

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Speaker 10: plan to use this funding to signific investing in following areas.

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Speaker 10: Number One, to expand our influence offering and our ecosystem,

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Speaker 10: to expand into the best and latest hardware provider about

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Speaker 10: Nvidia and MD right and build much tighter integration with

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Speaker 10: factor database and database management systems. And starting with Mongo

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Speaker 10: dB strategy partnership.

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Speaker 3: We're actually looking at sort of how the system works

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Speaker 3: a little bit right now, just going back to your

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Speaker 3: affordable basically generative AI production platform. That's we see what

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Speaker 3: you are, your production platform. You're helping companies use general

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Speaker 3: to AI. But what I like is the fact that

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Speaker 3: you think the generative AI's future isn't in large language models,

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Speaker 3: not these massive closed source ones, but actually think it's

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Speaker 3: about open source models, smaller ones, finer tuned. What is

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Speaker 3: the future compound AI systems?

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Speaker 6: Right, So we.

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Speaker 10: Started for our large language model because the larger groups

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Speaker 10: model are very powerful and magical, but those single models

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Speaker 10: are now sufficient as we're surrounded by rich content as

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Speaker 10: we're having this interview and conversation, we actually use audio

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Speaker 10: and the visual information and fireworks. We want to use

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Speaker 10: the new funding to make a big shift towards a

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Speaker 10: compound AIR system that can orchestrate across multiple single models

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Speaker 10: with various different modalities, and then air tools to reach,

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Speaker 10: for example, the latest news from Bloomberg or my personal

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Speaker 10: calendars or personal to do list, and build the totality

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Speaker 10: of a great application experience.

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Speaker 4: I think it'd be really beneficial to our audience to

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Speaker 4: explain how different it is building on an application, specifically

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Speaker 4: in the inference domain, relative to the training process of

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Speaker 4: a large language model. I think a lot of what

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Speaker 4: Caroline and I have focused on in the last two

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Speaker 4: years or so, is everyone everywhere building large language models

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Speaker 4: or other words training the model on specific data sets.

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Speaker 4: So what's that experience been like for you as you've

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Speaker 4: built fireworks right?

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Speaker 10: So we are hyper focused on our inference for the

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Speaker 10: following reasons. Because most of the technology they are going

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Speaker 10: to power a consumer facing or developer facing application, and

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Speaker 10: those applications has a lot of users. And when you

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Speaker 10: scale your product, that means you're going to quickly scale

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Speaker 10: your business and your influenced costs will also quickly scale.

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Speaker 10: So scalability, reliability and maintaining very expensive models in production

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Speaker 10: in a reliable way is very important. So we predict

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Speaker 10: that market is going to create a huge amount of

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Speaker 10: expense and that's where the enterprise is leading into to

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Speaker 10: solve influenced problems.

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Speaker 3: Minchaw cfi Works AI on the latest funding round and

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Speaker 3: thank you for your time now. Earlier at Back of

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Speaker 3: America Breakthrough Technology Dialogue, Blimba caught up with but Jills Meyer,

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Speaker 3: partner likes being venture partners to discuss look AI and

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Speaker 3: come to markets, take a listen.

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Speaker 11: What we're obviously seeing and I think we would have

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Speaker 11: anticipated seeing is is API core pricing coming down? Now,

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Speaker 11: I think the most dangerous our perspective is perhaps the

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Speaker 11: most dangerous perspective to have at times like this, when

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Speaker 11: technologies are changing so rapidly, is to think that we

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Speaker 11: know what the answer is going to be. We don't, right,

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Speaker 11: But here's what we believe, which is that in a

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Speaker 11: world in which the volume of calls expands exponentially, which

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Speaker 11: we will is more and we will see as more

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Speaker 11: and more enterprises adopt generative AI. And now, if you

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Speaker 11: think about an agentic world where each of us may

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Speaker 11: have multiple agents operating on our behalf, and enterprises will

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Speaker 11: have agents operating on their behalf also making calls, well,

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Speaker 11: then the volume of calls that are made on these

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Speaker 11: foundation models is going to be absolutely massive, right, And

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Speaker 11: so while the price per call may come down, the

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Speaker 11: volume of calls will be extremely high, and we expect

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Speaker 11: compute costs to decline. And so I would argue in

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Speaker 11: that world, these companies at scale will absolutely be able.

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Speaker 6: To make a profit. It, right, But we don't know.

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Speaker 6: These are things that we don't know.

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Speaker 11: But I think it's it's dangerous to be too rigid

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Speaker 11: with a particular point of view, and we're remaining open

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Speaker 11: minded about all of these possibilities.

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Speaker 8: Is there pressure that you put on some of these

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Speaker 8: some of these companies around monetization. Are you getting to

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Speaker 8: that point where you're having those conversations you need to

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Speaker 8: start monetizing some of these products.

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Speaker 11: Well, look, I think I think these founding teams recognize,

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Speaker 11: given the cost of compute and the capital intensity of

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Speaker 11: these businesses, there's only two ways you can you can

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Speaker 11: manage the capital intensity. One is you will keep raising capital.

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Speaker 11: The other is you've got to you've got to earn revenue.

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Speaker 11: And I think the answer will be both. You can't

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Speaker 11: rely on the capital markets. The private markets have been

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Speaker 11: have embraced these companies so far, right with these companies

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Speaker 11: raising billions of dollars and most recently Xai raising close

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Speaker 11: to seven billion dollars. So capital is available, but you

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Speaker 11: can't you can't.

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Speaker 6: Assume that will always be the case.

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Speaker 11: And I think we're beginning to see companies like open

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Speaker 11: Ai and Anthropic begin to scale revenue very fast.

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Speaker 8: Okay, interesting in terms of the venture capital world and

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Speaker 8: the structure within that sect. So Lightspeed's done something really interesting,

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Speaker 8: which is looking at this continuation funds, so essentially allowing

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Speaker 8: investors or to take about a billion dollars of stakes

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Speaker 8: in your portfolio company, so freeing up about a billion

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Speaker 8: dollars across a portfolio. It's a P style structure. What

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Speaker 8: is the rationale behind that?

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Speaker 11: Yeah, the rationale behind that is that companies are staying

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Speaker 11: private for longer, and at the same time we want

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Speaker 11: to be.

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Speaker 6: Able to support those companies.

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Speaker 11: Yet recognize that some of our LPs that are investors

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Speaker 11: in the funds that are invested in those companies, it's

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Speaker 11: important to drive liquidity back to them. And so how

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Speaker 11: do we solve both of those problems. Well, it is,

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Speaker 11: for example, to take a set of what are still

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Speaker 11: very healthy companies that are compounding in value and put

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Speaker 11: them into what we call a continuation vehicle where the

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Speaker 11: underlying LP base may change. Right.

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Speaker 6: That provides liquidity.

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Speaker 11: To LPs that want it, others may not, and they

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Speaker 11: can roll over, and it enables Lightspeed to continue to

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Speaker 11: steward those positions and continue to be a partner to

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Speaker 11: those companies.

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Speaker 3: Coming up, we discuss in the Brain synchron CEO on

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Speaker 3: how the company's brain computer interface is using open ais tech.

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Speaker 5: This is Bloomberg Technology.

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Speaker 4: Welcome back to Bloomberg Technology.

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Speaker 5: Ed love Low in San Francisco, Parin Hi right here

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Speaker 5: in New York and Ed. We had some big macro

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Speaker 5: data today.

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Speaker 3: CPI cooling once again, that inflationtory pressure dialing back.

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Speaker 5: But it is not good news for stocks.

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Speaker 3: Sure money paus into the bomb market as we start

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Speaker 3: to anticipate could it even be three.

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Speaker 5: Rate cuts this year?

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Speaker 3: But we're down one point seven percent on the bigger

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Speaker 3: benchmarkin a's that one hundred. Why, I mean largely because

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Speaker 3: we've got big tech selling off in video, Apple, Alphabeta

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Speaker 3: and who's who of the big tech candidates. Maybe we're

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Speaker 3: seeing profit taking at this moment. Maybe you're questioning valuations.

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Speaker 3: Just remember New Street Research put out a note but

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Speaker 3: yesterday saying maybe we do think that we're fully priced

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Speaker 3: in at these levels in video, for example.

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Speaker 5: But move on to some of the individual movers.

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Speaker 3: TSMC actually down almost three and a half percent this

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Speaker 3: after they hit a new record. Remember one trillion dollar company,

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Speaker 3: eighth biggest in the world. Their numbers showed forty percent

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Speaker 3: growth in the previous quarter. But once again, maybe we're

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00:23:13,040 --> 00:23:16,240
Speaker 3: seeing some profit taking for TSMC, Netflix. We've got earnings

442
00:23:16,240 --> 00:23:18,560
Speaker 3: coming up city getting a little cautious ahead of those

443
00:23:18,640 --> 00:23:22,120
Speaker 3: numbers Tesla of five five ten percent. It had had

444
00:23:22,680 --> 00:23:26,240
Speaker 3: almost an eleven day running streak. A Musk has more

445
00:23:26,280 --> 00:23:27,880
Speaker 3: on his mind, it would see made at the moment too.

446
00:23:28,359 --> 00:23:30,440
Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean, it's Musk all the time. Because of

447
00:23:30,480 --> 00:23:32,399
Speaker 4: all of the companies that ease at the helm of

448
00:23:32,520 --> 00:23:36,520
Speaker 4: one of them, must's brain computers startup. Neuralink aims to

449
00:23:36,560 --> 00:23:40,600
Speaker 4: implant its device into a second human patient in about

450
00:23:40,600 --> 00:23:42,480
Speaker 4: a week and to have devices and a few more

451
00:23:42,520 --> 00:23:45,000
Speaker 4: patients by the end of this year. It's all according

452
00:23:45,040 --> 00:23:48,040
Speaker 4: to a video update we got from Elon Musk yesterday.

453
00:23:48,440 --> 00:23:51,040
Speaker 4: Joining me on set in San Francisco is Bloomberg Sarah McBride,

454
00:23:51,040 --> 00:23:53,640
Speaker 4: who does a very good job of keeping across not

455
00:23:53,680 --> 00:23:56,639
Speaker 4: just Neuralink chaos, but I would say brain implant related

456
00:23:56,680 --> 00:23:59,640
Speaker 4: technology stories. I mean, that's the news right that they

457
00:24:00,040 --> 00:24:02,960
Speaker 4: say they're making progress towards a second patient. But what

458
00:24:03,000 --> 00:24:04,359
Speaker 4: else did you learn in the presentation?

459
00:24:04,600 --> 00:24:07,640
Speaker 2: Well, it was very interesting when they implanted the first patient,

460
00:24:07,800 --> 00:24:10,480
Speaker 2: it went wrong a little bit, some of the threads

461
00:24:10,480 --> 00:24:13,320
Speaker 2: started retracting from his brain. So to me, the most

462
00:24:13,320 --> 00:24:15,920
Speaker 2: interesting thing was the steps they said they would take

463
00:24:15,960 --> 00:24:19,840
Speaker 2: to mitigate for that. So one of the things they're

464
00:24:19,840 --> 00:24:24,320
Speaker 2: going to do, for example, is implant the device more

465
00:24:24,359 --> 00:24:28,320
Speaker 2: aligned with the curvature of the skull, and they're going

466
00:24:28,440 --> 00:24:32,680
Speaker 2: to try to place the threads that drop down from

467
00:24:32,800 --> 00:24:37,320
Speaker 2: that device in a more targeted way in the brain tissue,

468
00:24:37,680 --> 00:24:39,760
Speaker 2: and they're going to implant them deeper.

469
00:24:40,480 --> 00:24:43,600
Speaker 4: This was kind of classic. This was it was classic

470
00:24:43,640 --> 00:24:47,919
Speaker 4: Elon Musk related company stuff where he's like on X

471
00:24:47,960 --> 00:24:49,960
Speaker 4: the platform he owns, and saying, oh, by the way,

472
00:24:49,960 --> 00:24:52,040
Speaker 4: we're going to go live in five minutes. And yet

473
00:24:52,080 --> 00:24:55,120
Speaker 4: this team of people in like a conference room who

474
00:24:55,160 --> 00:24:57,600
Speaker 4: were some of those people, I guess we're not as

475
00:24:57,640 --> 00:25:00,200
Speaker 4: familiar with Neuralink as we might be with space X

476
00:25:00,240 --> 00:25:02,880
Speaker 4: and Tesla on those other important people around.

477
00:25:02,720 --> 00:25:06,000
Speaker 2: Him, right, So he had a team of for execs

478
00:25:06,000 --> 00:25:10,800
Speaker 2: with him. Sitting immediately to his right was doctor Matthew McDougall,

479
00:25:11,000 --> 00:25:16,360
Speaker 2: the chief surgeon at Neuralink, who kind of i'd say

480
00:25:16,400 --> 00:25:18,919
Speaker 2: gave most of the updates, and to the rate of

481
00:25:19,000 --> 00:25:23,840
Speaker 2: him was Djsio, the president of Neuralink. He's recently been

482
00:25:23,920 --> 00:25:30,200
Speaker 2: promoted to president. They also had the person in charge

483
00:25:30,240 --> 00:25:34,760
Speaker 2: of software and also in charge of the brain implants

484
00:25:35,040 --> 00:25:36,400
Speaker 2: in the bases themselves.

485
00:25:36,920 --> 00:25:37,160
Speaker 5: Sarah.

486
00:25:37,200 --> 00:25:40,040
Speaker 3: There was the mixture, of course of short term practical

487
00:25:40,160 --> 00:25:43,280
Speaker 3: use cases of brain injury, spinal injuries enabling people to

488
00:25:43,520 --> 00:25:46,119
Speaker 3: use phones and computers. But then there's the long term

489
00:25:46,480 --> 00:25:49,399
Speaker 3: and then there's the brash elong coming front and center

490
00:25:49,400 --> 00:25:51,240
Speaker 3: once again. What do you say is to mitigate the

491
00:25:51,240 --> 00:25:55,720
Speaker 3: longest civilizational risk of AI? Can you articulate why he

492
00:25:55,760 --> 00:25:57,080
Speaker 3: thinks neuralink is apart for that?

493
00:25:58,840 --> 00:26:03,159
Speaker 2: Well, his ideas that AI could end up being a

494
00:26:03,240 --> 00:26:07,040
Speaker 2: malevolent force and so our brains will need aug mending

495
00:26:07,119 --> 00:26:11,399
Speaker 2: to combat that, and if you put implants in our brains,

496
00:26:11,440 --> 00:26:15,720
Speaker 2: we'll kind of have superhuman powers. He's talked about how

497
00:26:15,760 --> 00:26:20,520
Speaker 2: we might be able to communicate wordlessly or just download

498
00:26:20,640 --> 00:26:24,480
Speaker 2: languages essentially into our brains, and he thinks those types

499
00:26:24,520 --> 00:26:30,040
Speaker 2: of superior functions will help us fight AI if we need.

500
00:26:29,880 --> 00:26:33,760
Speaker 3: To, Sarah McBride on the latest and in fact, we

501
00:26:33,840 --> 00:26:35,400
Speaker 3: now want to talk about the fact that there are

502
00:26:35,400 --> 00:26:38,360
Speaker 3: competitors in the space, Sara mcgriders. We've been writing about one,

503
00:26:38,480 --> 00:26:41,880
Speaker 3: of course, when it comes to neurotech and the neuralink

504
00:26:41,960 --> 00:26:42,800
Speaker 3: rival is Syncrom.

505
00:26:42,840 --> 00:26:43,920
Speaker 5: We're going to talk about it's just.

506
00:26:43,880 --> 00:26:47,080
Speaker 3: Announcing that it's actually partnering more with AI, tapping open

507
00:26:47,119 --> 00:26:51,160
Speaker 3: AI's news technology to really help paralyzed patients communicate by

508
00:26:51,280 --> 00:26:55,560
Speaker 3: using their brain device. Here for more synchron Ceo Tom Oxley, Tom,

509
00:26:55,560 --> 00:26:58,320
Speaker 3: it's great to have you in the studio, and sometimes

510
00:26:58,520 --> 00:27:01,639
Speaker 3: I imagine it feels as neuralink takes the oxygen in

511
00:27:01,680 --> 00:27:03,400
Speaker 3: that out of the room when it comes to these

512
00:27:03,960 --> 00:27:07,760
Speaker 3: neurotech devices. But you have got ten patients using yours,

513
00:27:08,320 --> 00:27:11,280
Speaker 3: and how is open AI's integration going to be helping them?

514
00:27:12,040 --> 00:27:14,600
Speaker 12: So the idea of a BCI is that you can

515
00:27:14,600 --> 00:27:18,080
Speaker 12: help people who are paralyzed who can't control their bodies

516
00:27:18,119 --> 00:27:22,560
Speaker 12: to express themselves. So the problem with paralysis is a

517
00:27:22,680 --> 00:27:25,159
Speaker 12: lack of autonomy, and it's a problem in medicine that

518
00:27:25,320 --> 00:27:29,040
Speaker 12: hasn't really got many treatment options. If you're paralyzed, you

519
00:27:29,080 --> 00:27:32,000
Speaker 12: do rehab and there's not many treatment options. So huge

520
00:27:32,200 --> 00:27:37,000
Speaker 12: unmet need, massive potential for a large market to develop.

521
00:27:37,680 --> 00:27:40,439
Speaker 12: So it's exciting. I think ALON for focusing on this

522
00:27:40,480 --> 00:27:43,160
Speaker 12: field is great. I'm not sure about that future vision

523
00:27:43,160 --> 00:27:46,480
Speaker 12: around the idea about fighting AI, where I think there's

524
00:27:46,480 --> 00:27:48,640
Speaker 12: a much more important short term use case to help

525
00:27:48,680 --> 00:27:52,119
Speaker 12: a massive medical need and so we're very focused on

526
00:27:52,240 --> 00:27:55,560
Speaker 12: applications that are going to improve patient's autonomy. And so

527
00:27:56,359 --> 00:28:01,040
Speaker 12: when the Chatchipit four O, the multimodal GPT came out,

528
00:28:01,119 --> 00:28:04,840
Speaker 12: we realized that there was this was a huge ability

529
00:28:04,880 --> 00:28:07,320
Speaker 12: for patients who lack the ability to engage in the

530
00:28:07,320 --> 00:28:11,240
Speaker 12: world to improve both inputs and outputs with the system.

531
00:28:11,280 --> 00:28:14,800
Speaker 3: How can you give us explanations of how GPT four

532
00:28:15,160 --> 00:28:18,240
Speaker 3: is going to enable those that can't as you communicate,

533
00:28:18,440 --> 00:28:20,800
Speaker 3: interact with what's happening around them in the room for example.

534
00:28:21,040 --> 00:28:25,240
Speaker 12: So the multimodal it takes inputs from text, from vision,

535
00:28:25,359 --> 00:28:28,800
Speaker 12: and from audio, so multimodal inputs, and then it can

536
00:28:28,880 --> 00:28:32,000
Speaker 12: use all that to generate prompts that enable the users.

537
00:28:32,720 --> 00:28:34,960
Speaker 12: In our case, we can use our hands to interact

538
00:28:34,960 --> 00:28:38,000
Speaker 12: with prompts. In patients that are paralyzed, you can't engage

539
00:28:38,000 --> 00:28:41,200
Speaker 12: with prompts. So we took the opportunity to build into

540
00:28:41,200 --> 00:28:43,640
Speaker 12: a chat feature, which we just released a demo of today,

541
00:28:44,080 --> 00:28:47,600
Speaker 12: where the multimodal GPT generates the language prompt for our

542
00:28:47,720 --> 00:28:50,680
Speaker 12: users and then so that's the input. The output is

543
00:28:50,720 --> 00:28:53,760
Speaker 12: the selection of the prompt to then generate a next action.

544
00:28:53,920 --> 00:28:57,400
Speaker 12: But the BCI sits in the middle. The BCI sits

545
00:28:57,440 --> 00:28:59,640
Speaker 12: in the middle. The BCI represents your ability to make

546
00:28:59,680 --> 00:29:02,520
Speaker 12: a true and that's what you lose if you're paralyzed.

547
00:29:02,520 --> 00:29:04,840
Speaker 12: You lose your ability to engage and make choices. You

548
00:29:04,920 --> 00:29:08,920
Speaker 12: become dependent on other people. So the BCI is a

549
00:29:08,960 --> 00:29:11,560
Speaker 12: digital representation of what you want to do, and the

550
00:29:11,600 --> 00:29:14,800
Speaker 12: future of the link between BCI and AI is how

551
00:29:15,000 --> 00:29:17,200
Speaker 12: the direct link from the brain to make selections with

552
00:29:17,320 --> 00:29:20,280
Speaker 12: prompts lets you engage with the digital world.

553
00:29:21,200 --> 00:29:23,200
Speaker 4: Tom, it's good to see you again, Carrie. Tom and

554
00:29:23,280 --> 00:29:25,600
Speaker 4: I were on stage together a couple of months ago

555
00:29:25,640 --> 00:29:28,760
Speaker 4: in San Francisco, and you were talking at that time

556
00:29:28,800 --> 00:29:32,840
Speaker 4: about the progress that could be made with your your

557
00:29:32,880 --> 00:29:35,960
Speaker 4: different delivery system. Right, So Neurer link is straight into

558
00:29:35,960 --> 00:29:39,120
Speaker 4: the brain through the skull. You guys do this through

559
00:29:39,160 --> 00:29:45,200
Speaker 4: the cardiovascular system. What has the LM unlocked in terms

560
00:29:45,200 --> 00:29:48,560
Speaker 4: of your cadence of putting it into the real world.

561
00:29:48,600 --> 00:29:50,240
Speaker 4: You know that was something I was fixated on with

562
00:29:50,320 --> 00:29:51,240
Speaker 4: you when we were talking.

563
00:29:52,200 --> 00:29:53,680
Speaker 5: Yeah, So there are advantages.

564
00:29:53,800 --> 00:29:56,600
Speaker 12: So they're really we see two approaches of getting into

565
00:29:56,600 --> 00:29:59,160
Speaker 12: the brain, cutting open the head and going in with

566
00:29:59,400 --> 00:30:03,240
Speaker 12: cables or coming in through a blood vessel using a

567
00:30:03,280 --> 00:30:07,560
Speaker 12: stent based procedure, and so that's how we're differentiated. We

568
00:30:07,640 --> 00:30:10,960
Speaker 12: think this is going to be the natural solution in medicine.

569
00:30:10,960 --> 00:30:16,360
Speaker 12: There's many examples of minimally invasive approaches scaling into market stents, pacemakers,

570
00:30:16,880 --> 00:30:21,360
Speaker 12: and critically. The infrastructure to deliver its scale already exists,

571
00:30:21,440 --> 00:30:23,600
Speaker 12: and we think that's going to be the natural progression

572
00:30:23,600 --> 00:30:26,640
Speaker 12: of this technology. The challenge is that we don't have

573
00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:29,040
Speaker 12: as much information coming out of the brain. So the

574
00:30:29,160 --> 00:30:31,320
Speaker 12: key has been how can we use the information out

575
00:30:31,360 --> 00:30:34,520
Speaker 12: of the brain to deliver navigate and select, which is

576
00:30:34,560 --> 00:30:38,280
Speaker 12: basically how you control a platform. So we have a

577
00:30:38,360 --> 00:30:41,840
Speaker 12: interaction method which delivers navigate and select. We're using that

578
00:30:41,920 --> 00:30:45,240
Speaker 12: Apple iOS accessibility platform to deliver that, and now we're

579
00:30:45,240 --> 00:30:49,240
Speaker 12: infusing LM such as Multi Medal Chat GPT to allow

580
00:30:49,320 --> 00:30:51,840
Speaker 12: our users to make choices interacting with prompts in a

581
00:30:51,840 --> 00:30:55,800
Speaker 12: way which is amazing. So Mark, one of our users

582
00:30:55,840 --> 00:30:58,800
Speaker 12: in Pittsburgh, has been using this system and we just

583
00:30:58,840 --> 00:31:00,640
Speaker 12: released the demo today of how he's using it, and

584
00:31:00,640 --> 00:31:05,120
Speaker 12: we're really excited about, you know, using especially our open

585
00:31:05,160 --> 00:31:07,120
Speaker 12: AI are going to be moving forward with the new

586
00:31:07,160 --> 00:31:10,200
Speaker 12: programs bringing in video as an endpoint into the RAPI

587
00:31:10,320 --> 00:31:13,120
Speaker 12: is going to be very exciting for our patients. But

588
00:31:13,160 --> 00:31:16,760
Speaker 12: that's going to be the future. AI for Knowledge and Selections,

589
00:31:16,840 --> 00:31:18,600
Speaker 12: BCI for expression of intent.

590
00:31:19,400 --> 00:31:23,000
Speaker 3: This is beyond hard, complicated and expensive.

591
00:31:23,880 --> 00:31:25,920
Speaker 5: Are you looking to raise funds? Do you have a

592
00:31:25,960 --> 00:31:28,360
Speaker 5: healthy pipe rune of people interested.

593
00:31:27,920 --> 00:31:29,640
Speaker 3: In backing and expanding your project.

594
00:31:30,480 --> 00:31:34,760
Speaker 12: We're very lucky to have investors that we're excited about.

595
00:31:34,840 --> 00:31:37,560
Speaker 12: Kosler and Archventures and Bill Gates and Jeff Bezos.

596
00:31:38,240 --> 00:31:38,560
Speaker 6: We have.

597
00:31:38,960 --> 00:31:42,239
Speaker 12: We have decent runway for a little while, but we

598
00:31:42,280 --> 00:31:43,760
Speaker 12: will be We'll be looking to raise shortly.

599
00:31:45,160 --> 00:31:48,920
Speaker 4: Saint Chron CEO Tom Oxley, thank you, Caroline. I want

600
00:31:48,960 --> 00:31:52,560
Speaker 4: to bring you some breaking news from myself and Dana Hole.

601
00:31:53,120 --> 00:31:57,320
Speaker 4: Tesla plans to delay the unveiling of its Robotaxi or

602
00:31:57,360 --> 00:32:02,240
Speaker 4: its Robotaxi day until Octo. You remember, Caroline, that it

603
00:32:02,280 --> 00:32:04,800
Speaker 4: had been scheduled for August eighth. But what I'm hearing

604
00:32:04,800 --> 00:32:08,200
Speaker 4: from sources, and what Danna's heard from her sources, is

605
00:32:08,200 --> 00:32:11,720
Speaker 4: that they just want more prototypes. I'm actually also hearing

606
00:32:11,760 --> 00:32:14,520
Speaker 4: that there's a bit of a rethink on the design

607
00:32:14,960 --> 00:32:16,440
Speaker 4: and that this is all kind of happened in the

608
00:32:16,520 --> 00:32:20,360
Speaker 4: last twenty four hours or so. It's an interesting development.

609
00:32:21,920 --> 00:32:23,240
Speaker 4: I don't really know what to make of it, other

610
00:32:23,280 --> 00:32:26,600
Speaker 4: than you see the stock their carrot moving down significantly.

611
00:32:26,600 --> 00:32:27,440
Speaker 6: What does that tell you?

612
00:32:27,640 --> 00:32:30,320
Speaker 3: Sudden plunge that everyone had started to look at August

613
00:32:30,320 --> 00:32:30,640
Speaker 3: the eighth.

614
00:32:31,000 --> 00:32:33,000
Speaker 5: This was the fixation, wasn't it. When we got the

615
00:32:33,000 --> 00:32:34,800
Speaker 5: delivery numbers that underwhelmed.

616
00:32:35,120 --> 00:32:37,680
Speaker 3: The excuse coming from the street was that no, but

617
00:32:37,800 --> 00:32:39,720
Speaker 3: everyone wants to think.

618
00:32:39,600 --> 00:32:41,240
Speaker 5: About what August the eighth means.

619
00:32:41,280 --> 00:32:44,760
Speaker 3: What's the longer term vision ultimately of Teza. Their share

620
00:32:44,800 --> 00:32:47,040
Speaker 3: price run up ahead of this headline ed has been

621
00:32:47,080 --> 00:32:47,719
Speaker 3: pretty phenomenal.

622
00:32:47,840 --> 00:32:48,440
Speaker 5: Last ten days.

623
00:32:48,480 --> 00:32:51,640
Speaker 3: We've had forty billion dollars in market capitalization and suddenly

624
00:32:51,680 --> 00:32:53,360
Speaker 3: we sell off. What an amazing scoot that you've just

625
00:32:53,360 --> 00:32:53,800
Speaker 3: brought us.

626
00:32:54,440 --> 00:32:58,239
Speaker 4: Well, you know, I've asked Elon Musk what's going on.

627
00:32:58,360 --> 00:33:00,200
Speaker 4: We've asked him to come on the progress and to

628
00:33:00,240 --> 00:33:02,760
Speaker 4: comment on the story, etc. The big picture here is

629
00:33:02,800 --> 00:33:05,920
Speaker 4: really interesting because the original thesis was when you buy

630
00:33:06,120 --> 00:33:08,360
Speaker 4: a vehicle from Tesla, it comes with all the hardware

631
00:33:08,520 --> 00:33:10,880
Speaker 4: and software you need for self driving. So when your

632
00:33:10,920 --> 00:33:13,880
Speaker 4: lease ends, either Tesla takes a vehicle back from you

633
00:33:13,960 --> 00:33:15,960
Speaker 4: and they put it into a fleet or the middle

634
00:33:16,000 --> 00:33:18,880
Speaker 4: ground was that you can opt in to put your

635
00:33:19,040 --> 00:33:21,520
Speaker 4: ev from Tesla into the fleet, much like you might

636
00:33:21,520 --> 00:33:25,000
Speaker 4: put your home on Airbnb. But the third iteration that

637
00:33:25,040 --> 00:33:27,880
Speaker 4: was outlined to us at the AGM was that they

638
00:33:27,920 --> 00:33:30,520
Speaker 4: want to also do a purpose built ROBOTAXI, so you'd

639
00:33:30,560 --> 00:33:34,040
Speaker 4: have a combinational three on what is a proprietary app,

640
00:33:34,640 --> 00:33:37,040
Speaker 4: much like an uber. The stock now down four percent,

641
00:33:37,080 --> 00:33:39,560
Speaker 4: and I guess it investors to your point are saying, well,

642
00:33:39,720 --> 00:33:41,479
Speaker 4: this was supposed to be it like we were going

643
00:33:41,520 --> 00:33:43,200
Speaker 4: to learn what the plan is, and now we might

644
00:33:43,240 --> 00:33:44,560
Speaker 4: be waiting a little longer.

645
00:33:45,040 --> 00:33:47,440
Speaker 3: And we can now bring in one Max Chafkin who

646
00:33:47,520 --> 00:33:50,360
Speaker 3: races back to set to be discussing that this was

647
00:33:50,920 --> 00:33:53,960
Speaker 3: the fixation of so many not the Tesla owners, but

648
00:33:54,040 --> 00:33:57,560
Speaker 3: the Tsla owners, a lot of those that particularly believe

649
00:33:57,560 --> 00:33:59,880
Speaker 3: in the long term vision is about robotax division.

650
00:34:00,080 --> 00:34:03,200
Speaker 9: Yeah, absolutely, And I mean there were huge questions when

651
00:34:03,280 --> 00:34:05,560
Speaker 9: Elon Musk said they were going to have this launch

652
00:34:05,600 --> 00:34:07,960
Speaker 9: on August. Dave, you know, there was you know, is

653
00:34:08,000 --> 00:34:10,160
Speaker 9: it going to be an affordable car and the sense

654
00:34:10,160 --> 00:34:11,719
Speaker 9: of a car you might want to buy. Is it

655
00:34:11,760 --> 00:34:14,000
Speaker 9: going to be a ROBOTAXI, is it gonna have a

656
00:34:14,040 --> 00:34:17,000
Speaker 9: steering wheel? You know, lots of questions like that, and

657
00:34:17,920 --> 00:34:20,040
Speaker 9: I think investors were sort of just going with it,

658
00:34:20,160 --> 00:34:22,359
Speaker 9: right because Elon Musk, as we've talked about on this

659
00:34:22,520 --> 00:34:26,240
Speaker 9: show many times, has a very good track record. And again,

660
00:34:26,760 --> 00:34:29,440
Speaker 9: the reaction you're seeing from the stock is a reaction

661
00:34:29,600 --> 00:34:32,480
Speaker 9: to the uncertainty and like, is it If it's just

662
00:34:32,520 --> 00:34:35,480
Speaker 9: a few months delay, probably no big deal. But I

663
00:34:35,480 --> 00:34:39,480
Speaker 9: think there are real questions, profound questions about robotaxis and

664
00:34:39,560 --> 00:34:42,399
Speaker 9: how real this is in the near term. And then

665
00:34:42,440 --> 00:34:46,120
Speaker 9: on top of that, you have questions about Tesla's ability.

666
00:34:45,840 --> 00:34:46,840
Speaker 6: To market cars.

667
00:34:46,920 --> 00:34:49,480
Speaker 9: Right, well, what does this mean for someone who just

668
00:34:49,560 --> 00:34:53,239
Speaker 9: wants to buy an affordable electric car NX.

669
00:34:53,280 --> 00:34:55,120
Speaker 4: I'm just looking at the Bloomberg terminal, you know, a

670
00:34:55,160 --> 00:34:57,680
Speaker 4: decline of five point five percent for what it's worth

671
00:34:57,800 --> 00:35:00,919
Speaker 4: is putting tests on track for it biggest drop since

672
00:35:00,960 --> 00:35:03,880
Speaker 4: April thirtieth, now down more than six percent, So investors

673
00:35:03,880 --> 00:35:06,200
Speaker 4: are kind of looking at this. I also want to

674
00:35:06,239 --> 00:35:08,840
Speaker 4: talk with you about the kind of academic approach to

675
00:35:08,880 --> 00:35:12,239
Speaker 4: self driving. So Tesla has a vision based platform. It

676
00:35:12,280 --> 00:35:15,040
Speaker 4: does not use lidar radar, but Karen and I were

677
00:35:15,040 --> 00:35:17,920
Speaker 4: talking while you're running down the stairs the set about

678
00:35:17,920 --> 00:35:20,920
Speaker 4: the idea that initially this was if you owned a Tesla,

679
00:35:21,239 --> 00:35:23,640
Speaker 4: that Tesla would end up in a fleet, much like

680
00:35:23,680 --> 00:35:26,880
Speaker 4: you put your home on Airbnb, and then to our surprise,

681
00:35:27,160 --> 00:35:29,880
Speaker 4: they go to a purpose built robotaxi. So what do

682
00:35:29,920 --> 00:35:32,279
Speaker 4: you make of the purpose built robotaxi bit? And I

683
00:35:32,280 --> 00:35:35,800
Speaker 4: guess the delay is in part a lack of information

684
00:35:35,960 --> 00:35:37,000
Speaker 4: about that strategy.

685
00:35:38,080 --> 00:35:41,399
Speaker 9: I think there are probably a number of things going

686
00:35:41,440 --> 00:35:44,320
Speaker 9: on here. I mean, as we know from previous reporting,

687
00:35:44,600 --> 00:35:47,960
Speaker 9: there has been a lot of tension inside of Tesla

688
00:35:48,360 --> 00:35:51,000
Speaker 9: over exactly how this should go. I mean Elon Musk

689
00:35:51,200 --> 00:35:55,800
Speaker 9: as he personally has made clear, you know, believes in robotaxis.

690
00:35:56,040 --> 00:35:59,600
Speaker 9: I think there are many people inside of Tesla who

691
00:35:59,719 --> 00:36:02,279
Speaker 9: liked the as a vision, but are are sort of

692
00:36:02,320 --> 00:36:04,760
Speaker 9: more open to the skeptical arguments.

693
00:36:04,960 --> 00:36:05,120
Speaker 5: You know.

694
00:36:05,200 --> 00:36:08,400
Speaker 9: The thing that I've thought all along making this a

695
00:36:08,440 --> 00:36:11,680
Speaker 9: somewhat unrealistic plan is just that you have companies like

696
00:36:11,840 --> 00:36:14,759
Speaker 9: Cruise and Waimo that have been working very hard and

697
00:36:14,800 --> 00:36:18,560
Speaker 9: spending billions of dollars and making lots of you know,

698
00:36:18,640 --> 00:36:21,440
Speaker 9: doing lots of work to negotiate with various local partners

699
00:36:21,640 --> 00:36:25,000
Speaker 9: and so on, and they haven't gotten that far right,

700
00:36:25,040 --> 00:36:27,880
Speaker 9: Like like waimo is doesn't have that many vehicles, it

701
00:36:27,920 --> 00:36:30,600
Speaker 9: isn't in that many locations. It's going to be very

702
00:36:30,640 --> 00:36:33,520
Speaker 9: hard for Elon Musk to just switch this on. And

703
00:36:33,560 --> 00:36:35,879
Speaker 9: I think if you're talking about like the trade offs

704
00:36:35,880 --> 00:36:38,840
Speaker 9: between a personal vehicle and a robotaxi vehicle, that creates

705
00:36:38,920 --> 00:36:40,160
Speaker 9: an additional complication.

706
00:36:41,880 --> 00:36:44,080
Speaker 4: As we point out, you know, he often doesn't get

707
00:36:44,080 --> 00:36:45,680
Speaker 4: it in the timeline he says he will, but he

708
00:36:45,719 --> 00:36:47,799
Speaker 4: often gets there in the end with those products. Max

709
00:36:47,880 --> 00:36:48,600
Speaker 4: traffickin thank.

710
00:36:48,480 --> 00:36:48,960
Speaker 6: You so much.

711
00:36:56,600 --> 00:37:00,920
Speaker 3: Heusing so Europeans thought up developing AI software for just

712
00:37:01,040 --> 00:37:03,920
Speaker 3: raised rather mammoth three hundred and eighty seven million dollars.

713
00:37:04,280 --> 00:37:06,560
Speaker 3: It plans to use this new funding to expand its

714
00:37:06,600 --> 00:37:09,640
Speaker 3: presence in European nations bordering Russia.

715
00:37:09,719 --> 00:37:10,880
Speaker 5: And what are you looking at?

716
00:37:12,120 --> 00:37:14,600
Speaker 4: I'm looking at all the things a Bloomberg anchor is

717
00:37:14,640 --> 00:37:20,360
Speaker 4: expected to look at, Caroline, global inflation, interest rates, macro uncertainty,

718
00:37:20,560 --> 00:37:23,799
Speaker 4: because they've all pulled down global VC deal making. But

719
00:37:24,239 --> 00:37:26,600
Speaker 4: in US at least, it's an oil doom and gloom

720
00:37:26,640 --> 00:37:30,160
Speaker 4: with deal activity increasing on account basis for each of

721
00:37:30,200 --> 00:37:34,120
Speaker 4: the past three quarters a positive sign that deals are

722
00:37:34,239 --> 00:37:37,840
Speaker 4: getting done. Speaking all downward, Carl Stanford, lead VC analyst

723
00:37:38,200 --> 00:37:41,160
Speaker 4: at Pitchburg. You know, the data is so important, even

724
00:37:41,200 --> 00:37:44,080
Speaker 4: if it's backward looking, Kyle, because you know, we get

725
00:37:44,120 --> 00:37:46,360
Speaker 4: a lot of the reporting each quarter about deals that

726
00:37:46,440 --> 00:37:48,959
Speaker 4: are done, but then you see it in aggregate after

727
00:37:49,000 --> 00:37:52,280
Speaker 4: the fact. Those three macro points. Why in the US

728
00:37:53,280 --> 00:37:55,960
Speaker 4: is there less pressure from them?

729
00:37:56,280 --> 00:37:58,359
Speaker 13: So I don't I don't think that there is less

730
00:37:58,360 --> 00:38:00,680
Speaker 13: pressure when you actually died deep into the data. What

731
00:38:00,719 --> 00:38:03,400
Speaker 13: we're seeing now is companies coming back to market that

732
00:38:03,520 --> 00:38:06,480
Speaker 13: haven't raised since twenty twenty one or early twenty twenty two,

733
00:38:06,840 --> 00:38:09,080
Speaker 13: and so the time that they spent you know, kind

734
00:38:09,080 --> 00:38:11,920
Speaker 13: of kicking the can down the road for financing, through layoffs,

735
00:38:12,000 --> 00:38:15,279
Speaker 13: through slower growth, through extending their run their can. Now

736
00:38:15,320 --> 00:38:18,000
Speaker 13: they're coming back to market to raise. There's still a

737
00:38:18,040 --> 00:38:19,839
Speaker 13: huge amount of dry powder in the in the US

738
00:38:19,880 --> 00:38:22,080
Speaker 13: as well. We're talking about two hundred ninety five billion

739
00:38:22,080 --> 00:38:24,080
Speaker 13: in dry powder then needs to be put to work.

740
00:38:24,120 --> 00:38:26,600
Speaker 13: So there is equity deals getting done, which is a

741
00:38:26,600 --> 00:38:29,959
Speaker 13: positive sign from an interest standpoint, But many of those

742
00:38:30,000 --> 00:38:33,279
Speaker 13: companies are just now coming back to market and kind

743
00:38:33,320 --> 00:38:35,319
Speaker 13: of inflating the number of companies raising at the.

744
00:38:35,239 --> 00:38:38,000
Speaker 3: Moment, So they've white knuckled it. They managed to get through.

745
00:38:38,120 --> 00:38:39,799
Speaker 3: How many of them have had to make themselves an

746
00:38:39,800 --> 00:38:41,239
Speaker 3: AI related play as well.

747
00:38:42,719 --> 00:38:45,000
Speaker 13: But we're seeing about twenty six percent of deals being

748
00:38:45,000 --> 00:38:48,360
Speaker 13: completed into AI companies, whether they are you know, foundational

749
00:38:48,400 --> 00:38:53,560
Speaker 13: true foundational models with llms or kind of vertical applications

750
00:38:54,320 --> 00:38:57,040
Speaker 13: using open AI to do some sort of their business model,

751
00:38:57,960 --> 00:39:00,480
Speaker 13: you know, fifty percent of deal value as well. I

752
00:39:00,480 --> 00:39:03,759
Speaker 13: think everything is pointing toward AI. If you're an LP,

753
00:39:04,239 --> 00:39:06,000
Speaker 13: you want to get into an AI fund, If you're

754
00:39:06,040 --> 00:39:08,400
Speaker 13: an investor, you want to get into an AI company.

755
00:39:08,400 --> 00:39:10,360
Speaker 13: If you're a company you want to somehow pivot to

756
00:39:10,760 --> 00:39:12,920
Speaker 13: an AI business model. I think it's kind of the

757
00:39:13,200 --> 00:39:14,520
Speaker 13: big talk of the market right now.

758
00:39:15,360 --> 00:39:18,680
Speaker 4: So we're showing us VC deal activity by quarter backward

759
00:39:18,760 --> 00:39:22,200
Speaker 4: looking and then two Q extrapolate out about what you

760
00:39:22,239 --> 00:39:23,560
Speaker 4: see for the rest of the year.

761
00:39:23,640 --> 00:39:25,200
Speaker 6: Kyle, Sure.

762
00:39:25,200 --> 00:39:26,520
Speaker 13: The first thing I want to point out is that

763
00:39:26,560 --> 00:39:29,280
Speaker 13: of that fifty five point six billion, about fifteen billion

764
00:39:29,320 --> 00:39:31,520
Speaker 13: of it is from two deals, the core Weave, you know,

765
00:39:32,320 --> 00:39:34,480
Speaker 13: eight point five billion dollar deal and then the open

766
00:39:34,520 --> 00:39:37,719
Speaker 13: AI or XAI I'm sorry, six billion dollar deal, right,

767
00:39:37,719 --> 00:39:40,520
Speaker 13: So that's really inflating the top line value. Where we

768
00:39:40,560 --> 00:39:42,520
Speaker 13: see the rest of the year going is obviously going

769
00:39:42,520 --> 00:39:44,960
Speaker 13: to be driven by any large deals that happen, but

770
00:39:45,000 --> 00:39:47,799
Speaker 13: it's going to be continued to be relatively slow for

771
00:39:48,040 --> 00:39:50,920
Speaker 13: the middle of the pack to the lower quality companies.

772
00:39:51,040 --> 00:39:53,440
Speaker 13: I think what we're seeing now is high quality companies

773
00:39:53,440 --> 00:39:55,680
Speaker 13: getting those deals done. If you look in the data,

774
00:39:55,840 --> 00:40:00,120
Speaker 13: valuations look really high compared to really any year. But

775
00:40:00,200 --> 00:40:02,120
Speaker 13: what is again what is happening is was companies are

776
00:40:02,160 --> 00:40:04,560
Speaker 13: raised on high valuations in the past are coming and

777
00:40:04,640 --> 00:40:07,200
Speaker 13: raising again now. And if they're higher quality that it's

778
00:40:07,239 --> 00:40:09,799
Speaker 13: boosting up that median value or pre money valuation they

779
00:40:09,840 --> 00:40:12,840
Speaker 13: were seen. It's not necessarily the market strength that it

780
00:40:12,880 --> 00:40:15,560
Speaker 13: would actually portray from just looking at the data.

781
00:40:16,600 --> 00:40:19,960
Speaker 3: Carl Stanfan always bringing us the latest and greatest in VC.

782
00:40:20,440 --> 00:40:27,200
Speaker 5: We thank you from pitchbook. This is meg Technology.

783
00:40:34,000 --> 00:40:37,400
Speaker 4: President Biden is steadily losing support from a part of

784
00:40:37,440 --> 00:40:41,600
Speaker 4: the country that knows image and stagecraft the best Hollywood.

785
00:40:41,960 --> 00:40:45,440
Speaker 4: Since the debate, heavy hitters including George Clooney, Super Agent,

786
00:40:45,520 --> 00:40:49,759
Speaker 4: Aria Manual, Netflix's read Hastings in Airess, Abigail Disney have

787
00:40:49,840 --> 00:40:53,239
Speaker 4: all called on Biden to drop his re election bid.

788
00:40:53,280 --> 00:40:56,840
Speaker 4: Clooney is a lifelong Democrat who helped raise thirty million

789
00:40:56,880 --> 00:40:59,600
Speaker 4: dollars for the president at an event last month and

790
00:40:59,640 --> 00:41:03,600
Speaker 4: said Democrats can pray for a miracle in November, or

791
00:41:03,640 --> 00:41:05,799
Speaker 4: they can speak the truth. Some in Hollywood are now

792
00:41:05,880 --> 00:41:09,960
Speaker 4: even turning against media mogul Jeffrey Katzenberg, who serves as

793
00:41:09,960 --> 00:41:13,239
Speaker 4: a co chair of Biden's reelection campaign, and it's one

794
00:41:13,239 --> 00:41:16,480
Speaker 4: of the president's top donors who they say has intentionally

795
00:41:16,520 --> 00:41:19,040
Speaker 4: shielded Biden's decline until now.

796
00:41:19,520 --> 00:41:22,759
Speaker 3: Karen and onto the other candidate in the presidential race,

797
00:41:22,800 --> 00:41:26,440
Speaker 3: Donald Trump. He's going to speak at Bitcoin twenty twenty

798
00:41:26,480 --> 00:41:28,800
Speaker 3: four conference. It's this month and it's all according to

799
00:41:28,800 --> 00:41:30,960
Speaker 3: the events organizers, and it's going to be an address

800
00:41:31,000 --> 00:41:33,840
Speaker 3: that would highlight well his growing embrace at the crypto industry.

801
00:41:34,280 --> 00:41:38,120
Speaker 3: That's discussed with Bluemotion, Shinali Bassak and Wes got all

802
00:41:38,200 --> 00:41:40,799
Speaker 3: of crypto Twitter talking that he's going to be at

803
00:41:40,840 --> 00:41:43,000
Speaker 3: this event, and it does seem to be more and

804
00:41:43,080 --> 00:41:45,640
Speaker 3: more of the Republican viewpoint that this is something to

805
00:41:45,680 --> 00:41:46,800
Speaker 3: win on that has.

806
00:41:46,680 --> 00:41:49,439
Speaker 14: Been a massive debate and that is seemingly where things

807
00:41:49,440 --> 00:41:52,640
Speaker 14: are coming off, especially when you've had such serious pushback year,

808
00:41:52,960 --> 00:41:56,040
Speaker 14: not only from the Securities and Exchange Commission, but President

809
00:41:56,080 --> 00:41:59,080
Speaker 14: Biden himself when it comes to certain aspects here the

810
00:41:59,120 --> 00:42:04,160
Speaker 14: Biden Ministry's approach to how legislation has been crossing the

811
00:42:04,200 --> 00:42:06,839
Speaker 14: lines in Congress. And so remember we're sending here at

812
00:42:06,840 --> 00:42:09,080
Speaker 14: a moment where such little progress has been made on

813
00:42:09,239 --> 00:42:12,640
Speaker 14: key stable coin bills, for example, and there's a hope

814
00:42:12,640 --> 00:42:15,960
Speaker 14: here that perhaps a change in an administration will really

815
00:42:16,000 --> 00:42:18,719
Speaker 14: start to dilute some of the influence some of the

816
00:42:19,440 --> 00:42:23,640
Speaker 14: stronger voiced ancher crypto members of Congress have had, think

817
00:42:23,719 --> 00:42:25,440
Speaker 14: Shared Brown, think Elizabeth Warren.

818
00:42:26,000 --> 00:42:27,800
Speaker 5: The idea here that a more.

819
00:42:28,719 --> 00:42:32,280
Speaker 14: Republican president, but also more Republican lawmakers in Congress overall

820
00:42:32,440 --> 00:42:34,960
Speaker 14: will really start to cause a dent in how the

821
00:42:35,040 --> 00:42:37,200
Speaker 14: industry has been approached in the last four years.

822
00:42:38,520 --> 00:42:41,759
Speaker 4: Italies, with the reporting that we had that Vivek Ramaswami

823
00:42:42,160 --> 00:42:45,120
Speaker 4: mask Trump and Crypto is the common point for the emotion.

824
00:42:45,239 --> 00:42:47,160
Speaker 4: Ali Bassett, thank you, good.

825
00:42:47,040 --> 00:42:50,640
Speaker 3: Show character, what a thick of fass show, great reporting

826
00:42:50,680 --> 00:42:53,120
Speaker 3: on Rivian and has great breaking news on Tesla from

827
00:42:53,160 --> 00:42:53,600
Speaker 3: you as well.

828
00:42:53,760 --> 00:42:55,200
Speaker 5: That does it from this edition of Being Bag.

829
00:42:55,120 --> 00:42:58,600
Speaker 4: Technology recapital in the podcast, we missed a few shows

830
00:42:58,600 --> 00:43:00,640
Speaker 4: this week, but we are back of New York and

831
00:43:00,680 --> 00:43:04,960
Speaker 4: San Francisco. This is Bloomberg Technology