1 00:00:05,160 --> 00:00:07,600 Speaker 1: Hey, this is Annie and Samantha. I'm welcome to stuff 2 00:00:07,560 --> 00:00:18,919 Speaker 1: I've never told your production of iHeart Radio. And it 3 00:00:19,000 --> 00:00:22,120 Speaker 1: is time for another edition of Female First, which means 4 00:00:22,320 --> 00:00:25,239 Speaker 1: we are once again joined by the splendid, the stupendous 5 00:00:25,600 --> 00:00:31,120 Speaker 1: Eeves spoke of Eaves. Hello, Hello, always good to see you, 6 00:00:31,240 --> 00:00:35,440 Speaker 1: even if it's virtually you too. Yes, and as you know, 7 00:00:35,920 --> 00:00:39,599 Speaker 1: we love checking in on your adventures. But what you're 8 00:00:39,680 --> 00:00:41,519 Speaker 1: up to? What's been going on? Eves? 9 00:00:42,240 --> 00:00:45,520 Speaker 2: Yeah, So there's a heat wave right now. First of all, 10 00:00:45,600 --> 00:00:47,479 Speaker 2: I feel like I have to preface with that. So 11 00:00:47,560 --> 00:00:49,360 Speaker 2: it is very hot today, it has been for the 12 00:00:49,400 --> 00:00:51,880 Speaker 2: last few days. There have been lots of warnings like 13 00:00:51,920 --> 00:00:53,559 Speaker 2: don't go out, don't be doing a lot, don't be 14 00:00:53,560 --> 00:00:56,080 Speaker 2: doing all the hikes and going out midday without putting 15 00:00:56,080 --> 00:00:59,160 Speaker 2: your sunscreen on and going to the beach and all 16 00:00:59,160 --> 00:01:02,400 Speaker 2: these things. So I'm in the midst of that. But 17 00:01:02,400 --> 00:01:05,960 Speaker 2: also it doesn't feel too unfamiliar because one thing that 18 00:01:06,040 --> 00:01:09,240 Speaker 2: I have been tapped into since I've gotten here here, 19 00:01:09,319 --> 00:01:12,040 Speaker 2: so people are listening. No, I'm in Cape Town, South Africa. 20 00:01:12,600 --> 00:01:16,520 Speaker 2: There's very Mediterranean climate here, so it's not like we're 21 00:01:16,640 --> 00:01:19,560 Speaker 2: used to in Atlanta. In the deep summer where it's 22 00:01:19,600 --> 00:01:25,480 Speaker 2: like full full throttle humidity, full throttle heat at the 23 00:01:25,480 --> 00:01:28,000 Speaker 2: same time, and it doesn't change throughout the day. It's 24 00:01:28,000 --> 00:01:29,880 Speaker 2: like you get in the night what you get during 25 00:01:29,880 --> 00:01:33,880 Speaker 2: the day, basically with maybe a little reprieve. So it's 26 00:01:33,959 --> 00:01:35,560 Speaker 2: usually you know, it cools off at night, but it 27 00:01:35,600 --> 00:01:38,759 Speaker 2: has definitely been warm at night and there is relative umunity, 28 00:01:38,800 --> 00:01:43,000 Speaker 2: so it's pretty warm. So that is that is tempering everything, 29 00:01:43,680 --> 00:01:48,840 Speaker 2: including I feel like my lethargy. However, I did do 30 00:01:48,960 --> 00:01:52,400 Speaker 2: some outdoor things when it was a little cooler last week, 31 00:01:52,440 --> 00:01:56,280 Speaker 2: and I took my first surf lesson and that went 32 00:01:56,360 --> 00:01:58,960 Speaker 2: a lot better than I thought it would go, because 33 00:01:59,000 --> 00:02:02,360 Speaker 2: I have been I had heard tell that it was 34 00:02:02,680 --> 00:02:09,560 Speaker 2: very difficult and very tiring, and I enjoyed it and 35 00:02:10,000 --> 00:02:13,320 Speaker 2: I wasn't fully exhausted by the end. I thought I 36 00:02:13,360 --> 00:02:18,200 Speaker 2: wasn't gonna stand, and I did, and like I caught 37 00:02:18,240 --> 00:02:23,480 Speaker 2: a few waves if you can call that little baby waves. 38 00:02:24,600 --> 00:02:27,400 Speaker 2: So yeah, no, I really truly enjoyed it, though I 39 00:02:27,480 --> 00:02:32,200 Speaker 2: had no expectations, but it was full the full experience 40 00:02:32,240 --> 00:02:32,880 Speaker 2: of joy for me. 41 00:02:34,520 --> 00:02:38,120 Speaker 3: Oh you actually stood on your first time, like trying 42 00:02:38,320 --> 00:02:38,760 Speaker 3: out there? 43 00:02:38,880 --> 00:02:39,400 Speaker 1: Wow? 44 00:02:39,720 --> 00:02:41,960 Speaker 2: Yes, yes, And I went for a while, like I rode. 45 00:02:42,560 --> 00:02:44,600 Speaker 2: I wrote it for a little minute too, like I 46 00:02:44,639 --> 00:02:47,080 Speaker 2: stayed on and then so then I felt weightless. I 47 00:02:47,160 --> 00:02:48,679 Speaker 2: was like, oh, this is possible. It's kind of like 48 00:02:48,760 --> 00:02:52,239 Speaker 2: doing your first headstanding and when you're practicing yoga, it's like, oh, 49 00:02:52,320 --> 00:02:54,080 Speaker 2: I got all doing your first crow post. It's like 50 00:02:54,200 --> 00:02:56,360 Speaker 2: I understand, I understand that I might have had this 51 00:02:56,400 --> 00:02:58,840 Speaker 2: strength all alone. The capability is there, and it's just 52 00:02:58,840 --> 00:03:02,560 Speaker 2: a matter of all the puzzle pieces clicking together, which 53 00:03:02,639 --> 00:03:07,720 Speaker 2: was very It gave me a lot of optimism because 54 00:03:08,040 --> 00:03:10,079 Speaker 2: I mean, I think anytime I'm learning a new thing, 55 00:03:10,160 --> 00:03:13,040 Speaker 2: I'm like, there is so much that's beyond me. There 56 00:03:13,080 --> 00:03:15,920 Speaker 2: is so much I don't know. I'm starting late all 57 00:03:16,000 --> 00:03:19,360 Speaker 2: of these things. But when the things click together, it 58 00:03:19,520 --> 00:03:24,040 Speaker 2: just inspires more confidence because it makes me think, oh, 59 00:03:24,160 --> 00:03:29,880 Speaker 2: this isn't beyond my grasp. It's not insanely hard. It's 60 00:03:30,040 --> 00:03:35,600 Speaker 2: just practice, you know. It's just accumulative, cumulative knowledge that 61 00:03:35,680 --> 00:03:39,160 Speaker 2: must that I must embody before I get to a 62 00:03:39,200 --> 00:03:40,920 Speaker 2: point where I'm like, all right, I feel good in 63 00:03:40,960 --> 00:03:41,320 Speaker 2: this thing. 64 00:03:42,640 --> 00:03:43,320 Speaker 1: I love it. 65 00:03:43,920 --> 00:03:46,520 Speaker 3: You definitely are the epitome of like, yes, I can 66 00:03:46,560 --> 00:03:48,680 Speaker 3: get out there and I can do this. You're talking 67 00:03:48,720 --> 00:03:50,920 Speaker 3: about all these like yoga poses and you said head 68 00:03:50,920 --> 00:03:53,040 Speaker 3: and stand like everybody does it. And I'm like, no, 69 00:03:54,880 --> 00:03:58,440 Speaker 3: that's a you thing, that's a you experience. Yeah, which 70 00:03:58,480 --> 00:04:00,720 Speaker 3: is amazing. But then being able to do all that, now, 71 00:04:00,720 --> 00:04:02,160 Speaker 3: are you addicted? Are you ready to go? 72 00:04:02,320 --> 00:04:02,400 Speaker 2: Like? 73 00:04:02,440 --> 00:04:03,920 Speaker 3: Have been going back more and more? 74 00:04:04,240 --> 00:04:06,800 Speaker 2: I am, But let me tell you, so, I wanted 75 00:04:06,800 --> 00:04:10,640 Speaker 2: to set my next lesson for this week for reasons 76 00:04:10,960 --> 00:04:15,040 Speaker 2: I can't, and I'm about to travel too. I am like, like, so, 77 00:04:16,680 --> 00:04:20,000 Speaker 2: I actually do think I really could get pretty addicted 78 00:04:20,040 --> 00:04:22,560 Speaker 2: to it, Like I could be really into it and 79 00:04:22,640 --> 00:04:25,280 Speaker 2: want to get out there a lot. I had this 80 00:04:25,360 --> 00:04:27,120 Speaker 2: moment where I was on the board and I'm not 81 00:04:27,440 --> 00:04:29,799 Speaker 2: I have to say, also, I'm not a water person. 82 00:04:30,520 --> 00:04:33,039 Speaker 2: Like I don't spend I don't spend a ton. I 83 00:04:33,040 --> 00:04:34,680 Speaker 2: haven't spent a ton of time in the water over 84 00:04:34,720 --> 00:04:37,400 Speaker 2: my life. Over the course of my life, I haven't 85 00:04:37,400 --> 00:04:39,120 Speaker 2: spent I definitely haven't spent a ton of time in 86 00:04:39,120 --> 00:04:42,800 Speaker 2: the ocean. I know how to swim, I know how 87 00:04:42,800 --> 00:04:45,200 Speaker 2: to do certain things, but I wouldn't say I'm a 88 00:04:45,200 --> 00:04:48,320 Speaker 2: water person. I'm definitely not a water sports person. But 89 00:04:48,520 --> 00:04:52,280 Speaker 2: it felt quite natural and like I could get into 90 00:04:52,320 --> 00:04:57,800 Speaker 2: the zone and it just felt like I had no 91 00:04:59,040 --> 00:05:03,120 Speaker 2: It just felt freeing because I wasn't attached to any outcome. 92 00:05:03,800 --> 00:05:05,920 Speaker 2: It was just like I'm really out there having fun 93 00:05:05,960 --> 00:05:08,360 Speaker 2: and that was my only goal. And so I think 94 00:05:08,400 --> 00:05:10,840 Speaker 2: I could get I could really get addicted for that reason. 95 00:05:10,880 --> 00:05:14,680 Speaker 2: And it's and it's I like things that are low investment, 96 00:05:14,920 --> 00:05:17,280 Speaker 2: and it's like it's the board and the body in 97 00:05:17,320 --> 00:05:21,359 Speaker 2: the wetsuit and really it's like, you know, that is 98 00:05:21,400 --> 00:05:23,120 Speaker 2: what it is. And the people who I met through 99 00:05:23,160 --> 00:05:27,039 Speaker 2: it were super super cool and very kind, very nice. 100 00:05:27,040 --> 00:05:28,760 Speaker 2: They seemed they had it was a lot of camaraderie 101 00:05:28,839 --> 00:05:33,960 Speaker 2: there and I really appreciated that. But I will say 102 00:05:34,400 --> 00:05:37,120 Speaker 2: it's gonna be hard for me though, because the dilemma 103 00:05:37,160 --> 00:05:39,200 Speaker 2: for that I'm facing right now is that I'm about 104 00:05:39,200 --> 00:05:43,800 Speaker 2: to get some piercings, and piercings in water don't go together, 105 00:05:43,920 --> 00:05:47,120 Speaker 2: like I cannot submerge them, so that means I would 106 00:05:47,160 --> 00:05:49,160 Speaker 2: have to be out of lessons for many months and 107 00:05:49,320 --> 00:05:51,560 Speaker 2: the timing is just poor. I have to work around 108 00:05:51,640 --> 00:05:54,520 Speaker 2: piercing timing for other reasons, and. 109 00:05:54,520 --> 00:06:02,040 Speaker 3: Like, yeah, it sucks for that, that's awesome. Also, like 110 00:06:02,080 --> 00:06:04,760 Speaker 3: that's the opposite of what I know of according to 111 00:06:05,040 --> 00:06:08,039 Speaker 3: surf movies, where they are all like competitive with each other. 112 00:06:09,120 --> 00:06:10,240 Speaker 3: I guess that's the drama of it. 113 00:06:10,640 --> 00:06:15,839 Speaker 1: Yeah, exactly. I think it makes sense. Surfing can be 114 00:06:15,960 --> 00:06:20,760 Speaker 1: very meditative, and you are someone who enjoys that. It 115 00:06:20,800 --> 00:06:23,320 Speaker 1: makes sense to me you you do have the skill set. 116 00:06:24,200 --> 00:06:29,479 Speaker 1: I think people underestimate because I only tried surfing once 117 00:06:29,720 --> 00:06:31,640 Speaker 1: and I was not very good at it. But I 118 00:06:31,640 --> 00:06:34,839 Speaker 1: think people underestimate the arm strength you need because you 119 00:06:34,880 --> 00:06:38,479 Speaker 1: have to push yourself up really quickly and then find 120 00:06:38,520 --> 00:06:42,960 Speaker 1: your balance very quickly. And so yeah, I think you've 121 00:06:42,960 --> 00:06:43,320 Speaker 1: got that. 122 00:06:44,320 --> 00:06:47,640 Speaker 2: Yeah, you know what it is. When when my instructor 123 00:06:48,000 --> 00:06:51,840 Speaker 2: was showing me how to get up on the board, 124 00:06:52,000 --> 00:06:54,280 Speaker 2: I was like, I do that a million times. I've 125 00:06:54,279 --> 00:06:57,320 Speaker 2: done that exact action a million times in a row 126 00:06:57,680 --> 00:07:00,160 Speaker 2: through my younger practice. It's like a vinyasa in and 127 00:07:00,279 --> 00:07:03,120 Speaker 2: viasa yoga. And so I was like, oh, I got 128 00:07:03,120 --> 00:07:06,120 Speaker 2: that downpack. Now if I can learn to balance once 129 00:07:06,160 --> 00:07:08,359 Speaker 2: I'm standing, then na's where it is. But I'm like, 130 00:07:08,400 --> 00:07:11,240 Speaker 2: that'll be fine because I practice balance a lot. It's 131 00:07:11,240 --> 00:07:13,080 Speaker 2: not the same as balancing on a board in the water, 132 00:07:13,240 --> 00:07:16,600 Speaker 2: but like, I know some skill that I can translate 133 00:07:16,760 --> 00:07:20,000 Speaker 2: is there? But I did learn. I was like, this paddling, 134 00:07:20,120 --> 00:07:23,120 Speaker 2: I'm gonna have to I'm gonna have to hit the 135 00:07:23,240 --> 00:07:26,600 Speaker 2: whatever the calisthenics moves are that I need that are translatable. 136 00:07:26,640 --> 00:07:28,320 Speaker 2: I have to look into that. I don't know if 137 00:07:28,320 --> 00:07:30,800 Speaker 2: it's the pull ups, if it's the dead hangs. Something 138 00:07:30,800 --> 00:07:34,080 Speaker 2: about the lats and the shoulders is like, is they 139 00:07:34,160 --> 00:07:40,480 Speaker 2: need to be worked on for that specific action. It's like, okay, 140 00:07:40,800 --> 00:07:42,680 Speaker 2: but I wasn't super sore of the day afterwards, so 141 00:07:42,680 --> 00:07:45,040 Speaker 2: I was like, I won't I'm not far. We can 142 00:07:45,080 --> 00:07:51,960 Speaker 2: do it. Dang, you weren't. No, Surprisingly. 143 00:07:51,760 --> 00:07:53,360 Speaker 1: Well, I can't wait to hear more about this. I 144 00:07:53,360 --> 00:07:56,120 Speaker 1: can't wait to get more updates about this. This is fantastic. 145 00:07:56,480 --> 00:07:58,040 Speaker 1: This is why we love checking in with you. It's 146 00:07:58,080 --> 00:08:01,840 Speaker 1: so great. So I have a question before getting into 147 00:08:01,880 --> 00:08:05,720 Speaker 1: this one. This is my transition question because we've talked 148 00:08:05,840 --> 00:08:10,080 Speaker 1: about photography before on this show. But I'm curious what 149 00:08:10,120 --> 00:08:13,320 Speaker 1: your thoughts are Eve, as someone who travels a lot, 150 00:08:13,680 --> 00:08:19,080 Speaker 1: on taking photos and when not to take photos and 151 00:08:19,120 --> 00:08:22,880 Speaker 1: when you regret not taking photos later, Like, do you 152 00:08:22,920 --> 00:08:23,760 Speaker 1: have thoughts about that? 153 00:08:24,160 --> 00:08:26,960 Speaker 2: I do, but I want to ask a clarifying question, 154 00:08:27,320 --> 00:08:31,000 Speaker 2: do you mean of myself or of other people who 155 00:08:31,080 --> 00:08:32,560 Speaker 2: are in the locale that I'm going to. 156 00:08:33,720 --> 00:08:36,959 Speaker 1: Of I would say just anything I was thinking more of, like, oh, 157 00:08:37,000 --> 00:08:40,800 Speaker 1: I'm traveling, here's this beautiful, because I'm somebody who's I 158 00:08:40,920 --> 00:08:42,360 Speaker 1: used to take a lot of photos, and now I 159 00:08:42,400 --> 00:08:47,120 Speaker 1: never I hardly ever take photos just of the landscape 160 00:08:47,440 --> 00:08:52,080 Speaker 1: or I'm definitely usually not in them. So just however 161 00:08:52,160 --> 00:08:55,240 Speaker 1: you would interpret how you usually take photos when you. 162 00:08:55,200 --> 00:09:01,680 Speaker 2: Travel, I don't ever take enough photos. I don't. I've 163 00:09:01,679 --> 00:09:08,880 Speaker 2: gotten a lot better at it in the past two years, maybe, 164 00:09:09,440 --> 00:09:12,800 Speaker 2: but I always find myself saying afterwards like I didn't 165 00:09:12,840 --> 00:09:15,400 Speaker 2: take enough photos, And that doesn't mean that there might 166 00:09:15,400 --> 00:09:17,480 Speaker 2: be a good, a decent volume of photos. So I 167 00:09:17,559 --> 00:09:22,400 Speaker 2: might still have taken a thousand photos, but I'm always 168 00:09:22,440 --> 00:09:24,800 Speaker 2: missing something. I'm like, well, wait, when we went into 169 00:09:24,800 --> 00:09:28,000 Speaker 2: that cake shop, I didn't get a picture of us 170 00:09:28,000 --> 00:09:29,960 Speaker 2: when we were there and we were eating. Or I 171 00:09:30,040 --> 00:09:33,120 Speaker 2: actually didn't get a picture of me at all at 172 00:09:33,120 --> 00:09:36,480 Speaker 2: this monumental site. I just got a picture of like 173 00:09:37,080 --> 00:09:44,280 Speaker 2: you know, this turret or this flying buttress or this 174 00:09:45,040 --> 00:09:48,880 Speaker 2: I don't know, stupid, like very specific architectural feature or 175 00:09:48,880 --> 00:09:52,559 Speaker 2: something like silly of that place rather than like some 176 00:09:52,640 --> 00:09:55,280 Speaker 2: more contextual picture or a picture with me in it. I 177 00:09:55,360 --> 00:09:59,520 Speaker 2: remember my mother in law, I think I was. I 178 00:09:59,520 --> 00:10:01,960 Speaker 2: think it was. I was sending some pictures too, but 179 00:10:02,200 --> 00:10:06,439 Speaker 2: I just like set pictures of everything else, like the streets, 180 00:10:06,520 --> 00:10:09,680 Speaker 2: the sites, you know. And she was like, can you 181 00:10:09,679 --> 00:10:11,320 Speaker 2: send me some pictures with you and it? And I 182 00:10:11,360 --> 00:10:15,400 Speaker 2: was like, I don't, really, I don't have those. So 183 00:10:15,640 --> 00:10:18,000 Speaker 2: I'm trying to do better at that. And I need 184 00:10:18,040 --> 00:10:21,800 Speaker 2: some looks too. So my husband I traveled together a lot, 185 00:10:21,880 --> 00:10:24,240 Speaker 2: I gotta get him on board with like you got 186 00:10:24,240 --> 00:10:28,079 Speaker 2: to give me a look, like for whatever reason, you know, 187 00:10:28,360 --> 00:10:29,320 Speaker 2: he doesn't really want. 188 00:10:29,200 --> 00:10:29,760 Speaker 1: To do that with me. 189 00:10:29,880 --> 00:10:32,200 Speaker 2: Like he's good at doing that with everything else, Like 190 00:10:32,280 --> 00:10:37,120 Speaker 2: he's good at photographing his surroundings and things. But I 191 00:10:37,160 --> 00:10:40,440 Speaker 2: need some looks at me too. So yeah, I'm trying 192 00:10:40,440 --> 00:10:42,240 Speaker 2: to get better at that as well. 193 00:10:43,000 --> 00:10:48,720 Speaker 1: That's interesting because I had a friend who she basically 194 00:10:49,280 --> 00:10:51,280 Speaker 1: was like if I don't if I'm not in the picture, 195 00:10:51,400 --> 00:10:54,920 Speaker 1: then was I even there? So she always was like 196 00:10:55,160 --> 00:10:58,640 Speaker 1: taking the picture, I had to have her in it. No, 197 00:10:58,800 --> 00:11:02,120 Speaker 1: I think I the concept of like when to take 198 00:11:02,160 --> 00:11:05,240 Speaker 1: pictures and not take pictures is just an interesting one 199 00:11:05,280 --> 00:11:09,079 Speaker 1: to me. And I used to similar to journaling, when 200 00:11:09,080 --> 00:11:13,120 Speaker 1: I would get back from somewhere, I would caption every 201 00:11:13,160 --> 00:11:16,040 Speaker 1: picture so I could remember, this is where you were, 202 00:11:16,840 --> 00:11:19,240 Speaker 1: this is how you felt. And it was a very 203 00:11:19,320 --> 00:11:23,000 Speaker 1: cathartic and kind of like closing the book on that 204 00:11:23,720 --> 00:11:26,920 Speaker 1: journey type of thing. And I'd like it, like I 205 00:11:27,040 --> 00:11:29,439 Speaker 1: like looking back, and you know, years and years later, 206 00:11:29,480 --> 00:11:31,520 Speaker 1: I can be like, oh, yeah, I do remember that. 207 00:11:31,600 --> 00:11:34,800 Speaker 1: I'm glad I made that note since I wasn't in 208 00:11:34,840 --> 00:11:36,360 Speaker 1: the picture or whatever it is. 209 00:11:36,920 --> 00:11:39,800 Speaker 2: Yes, And I realized that I forgot one threat that 210 00:11:39,840 --> 00:11:41,240 Speaker 2: I wanted to touch on in this that I was 211 00:11:41,280 --> 00:11:44,080 Speaker 2: thinking when I asked that first clarifying question, which is 212 00:11:44,200 --> 00:11:48,680 Speaker 2: just that I have been thinking recently about how many 213 00:11:48,679 --> 00:11:51,400 Speaker 2: photos to take, how much I need to take photos 214 00:11:51,400 --> 00:11:54,480 Speaker 2: and document a place, and I just have more been 215 00:11:54,520 --> 00:11:56,240 Speaker 2: going in a direction I feel like I've settled on 216 00:11:56,360 --> 00:11:59,880 Speaker 2: recently that it's important for me in terms of documentation, 217 00:12:00,120 --> 00:12:03,720 Speaker 2: in terms of my own personal narrative, and in terms 218 00:12:03,800 --> 00:12:10,120 Speaker 2: of archiving, because I'm not the greatest at personal archiving, 219 00:12:11,080 --> 00:12:15,000 Speaker 2: and I realize how much I regret that in certain 220 00:12:15,040 --> 00:12:17,560 Speaker 2: ways I'm better. I'm best at it most when it 221 00:12:17,559 --> 00:12:22,920 Speaker 2: comes to journaling. But even in that, the level of 222 00:12:24,520 --> 00:12:28,480 Speaker 2: organization I have within that and the level of detail 223 00:12:28,480 --> 00:12:31,119 Speaker 2: that I have within that, I find myself regretting sometimes. 224 00:12:31,559 --> 00:12:35,199 Speaker 2: And I know that photo and video because I like 225 00:12:35,240 --> 00:12:38,559 Speaker 2: to take video too, that that isn't important. That can 226 00:12:38,679 --> 00:12:42,480 Speaker 2: that can be a very powerful element within that, you know, 227 00:12:42,559 --> 00:12:44,440 Speaker 2: the archive personal archiving process. 228 00:12:44,480 --> 00:12:51,280 Speaker 1: For me, Yeah, it's interesting too because I had a video. 229 00:12:51,440 --> 00:12:55,160 Speaker 1: I used to love taking video, and of one of 230 00:12:55,200 --> 00:12:57,680 Speaker 1: the tragic losses of my life when it comes to 231 00:12:58,880 --> 00:13:01,839 Speaker 1: it comes to like photos that are lost, our video 232 00:13:01,880 --> 00:13:04,640 Speaker 1: that's lost, is when the first time I really traveled 233 00:13:05,520 --> 00:13:07,920 Speaker 1: by myself was in Australia, and I took all of 234 00:13:07,960 --> 00:13:11,520 Speaker 1: this video and then the technology just changed and it 235 00:13:11,600 --> 00:13:13,920 Speaker 1: just didn't work anywhere. And I wonder if that's going 236 00:13:13,960 --> 00:13:16,160 Speaker 1: to be a problem anymore. If that was a unique 237 00:13:16,800 --> 00:13:22,400 Speaker 1: for when I was traveling, it just became obsolete. It 238 00:13:22,559 --> 00:13:24,960 Speaker 1: just wouldn't work, and so I lost all of that video. 239 00:13:25,800 --> 00:13:29,360 Speaker 2: Oh I'm sorry. That's I really feel for you, because 240 00:13:29,600 --> 00:13:34,880 Speaker 2: losing things that are so sentimental and are specific, like 241 00:13:35,080 --> 00:13:37,840 Speaker 2: super exciting and fun moments in life can be very 242 00:13:38,720 --> 00:13:43,040 Speaker 2: very difficult. But that just made me think. When I 243 00:13:43,120 --> 00:13:46,000 Speaker 2: was going back through some of my old files, I 244 00:13:46,120 --> 00:13:48,920 Speaker 2: found some videos from shows I had went to, and 245 00:13:48,960 --> 00:13:51,520 Speaker 2: I went to a lot of shows and I had 246 00:13:51,559 --> 00:13:54,360 Speaker 2: so much fun at them. So it's a very positive 247 00:13:54,440 --> 00:13:56,880 Speaker 2: memory for me, and I loved being able to see 248 00:13:56,920 --> 00:14:00,960 Speaker 2: it again, but I haven't. It was on my little Nokia, 249 00:14:01,760 --> 00:14:05,200 Speaker 2: like tiny, tiny phone that I can hold like between 250 00:14:05,200 --> 00:14:08,560 Speaker 2: these two fingers, and it was one of the ones 251 00:14:08,600 --> 00:14:11,200 Speaker 2: that had because I love music, it's like one of 252 00:14:11,200 --> 00:14:14,080 Speaker 2: the ones that had the like three the play and 253 00:14:14,120 --> 00:14:17,000 Speaker 2: the fast forward and back buttons on the left side 254 00:14:17,000 --> 00:14:18,680 Speaker 2: of the screen or the right side of the screen. 255 00:14:19,400 --> 00:14:20,840 Speaker 2: It was like it was one of those phones where 256 00:14:20,840 --> 00:14:22,520 Speaker 2: they were like you can listen to music with this, 257 00:14:22,600 --> 00:14:24,760 Speaker 2: you know, And that was that was a it was 258 00:14:25,440 --> 00:14:30,240 Speaker 2: a touted feature of that phone, and I remember like 259 00:14:30,280 --> 00:14:32,360 Speaker 2: taking it on that phone and I don't know what 260 00:14:32,360 --> 00:14:34,280 Speaker 2: the file was I was. I looked at that file 261 00:14:35,480 --> 00:14:37,400 Speaker 2: type and I was like, I don't know what M 262 00:14:37,560 --> 00:14:41,000 Speaker 2: four WP is, but it's playing on the computer right now, 263 00:14:41,040 --> 00:14:44,240 Speaker 2: but will it five years from now? I have no idea. 264 00:14:44,560 --> 00:14:46,920 Speaker 2: It was so grainy, but it was just like I 265 00:14:46,960 --> 00:14:50,240 Speaker 2: could feel I could feel the energy in the room, 266 00:14:50,320 --> 00:14:54,000 Speaker 2: the people around me yell like me. Hearing myself yell 267 00:14:54,040 --> 00:14:57,360 Speaker 2: along with the lyrics was just it's such a such 268 00:14:57,360 --> 00:15:02,000 Speaker 2: a joyful experience. But yeah, I think maybe those things 269 00:15:02,040 --> 00:15:04,000 Speaker 2: won't exist in a way, and we have to be 270 00:15:04,320 --> 00:15:06,640 Speaker 2: I have to be okay with that, you don't. I 271 00:15:06,720 --> 00:15:09,880 Speaker 2: have to be okay with that level of teaching me 272 00:15:09,960 --> 00:15:12,120 Speaker 2: non attachment is what I have to tell myself. 273 00:15:12,960 --> 00:15:17,000 Speaker 1: Yeah, you're so wise, You're always so wise. What about 274 00:15:17,040 --> 00:15:18,880 Speaker 1: you smitha. 275 00:15:18,440 --> 00:15:20,440 Speaker 3: No, Well, all of this is just kind of reminds 276 00:15:20,440 --> 00:15:23,520 Speaker 3: me of the fact my mother there was a big 277 00:15:23,560 --> 00:15:26,960 Speaker 3: service after the fact. You know, the types of cameras 278 00:15:27,000 --> 00:15:30,080 Speaker 3: that have changed throughout time going digital, and there are 279 00:15:30,120 --> 00:15:33,800 Speaker 3: services that happened where like my mom had videos from 280 00:15:33,840 --> 00:15:37,200 Speaker 3: the nineteen sixties nineteen seventies the reels and then had 281 00:15:37,240 --> 00:15:40,800 Speaker 3: them transferred over into vhs, then eventually had to transfer 282 00:15:40,920 --> 00:15:44,200 Speaker 3: those over into DVDs, and now that it would be 283 00:15:44,240 --> 00:15:47,120 Speaker 3: a digital format in a different way. So it's interesting 284 00:15:47,160 --> 00:15:50,400 Speaker 3: to think like how it has progressed and how people 285 00:15:50,600 --> 00:15:53,840 Speaker 3: have worked, and there's businesses that have worked in order 286 00:15:53,920 --> 00:15:57,760 Speaker 3: to keep those processes alive even though it's less and less, 287 00:15:57,960 --> 00:16:00,240 Speaker 3: especially when we have like cloud services and all that. 288 00:16:00,280 --> 00:16:02,960 Speaker 3: But again, as you're talking like we may not have 289 00:16:03,800 --> 00:16:08,800 Speaker 3: that level of storage and the nondescript cloud, like what 290 00:16:08,800 --> 00:16:11,440 Speaker 3: does that even mean? So it will disappear, So how 291 00:16:11,480 --> 00:16:14,000 Speaker 3: do you, you know, save that unless you have something 292 00:16:14,040 --> 00:16:16,640 Speaker 3: that's working, Because I think about that with our like VHS. 293 00:16:16,680 --> 00:16:19,560 Speaker 3: We've talked about this because I have a huge box 294 00:16:19,960 --> 00:16:23,480 Speaker 3: of VHS. This because I thought in my childhood, I'm 295 00:16:23,480 --> 00:16:25,200 Speaker 3: going to save these and these are going to be 296 00:16:25,280 --> 00:16:28,680 Speaker 3: amazing and I'm gonna collect I collected them. I don't know. 297 00:16:28,760 --> 00:16:30,840 Speaker 3: I don't know why, and now I don't have a 298 00:16:30,920 --> 00:16:33,920 Speaker 3: VHS player, and I'm like, oh no, what do I 299 00:16:33,960 --> 00:16:36,000 Speaker 3: do with these? But I also don't want to throw 300 00:16:36,040 --> 00:16:38,000 Speaker 3: them away because it feels so sentimental. 301 00:16:38,720 --> 00:16:41,640 Speaker 2: Well, I actually a couple of things. I got pretty 302 00:16:41,680 --> 00:16:46,520 Speaker 2: overwhelmed thinking about how much data, like how much actual 303 00:16:46,560 --> 00:16:50,200 Speaker 2: storage I need, and how that's only growing exponentially for me, 304 00:16:50,240 --> 00:16:53,120 Speaker 2: because like I do take a lot of video when 305 00:16:53,160 --> 00:16:56,240 Speaker 2: I go places, and so the file sizes are huge 306 00:16:56,280 --> 00:16:58,560 Speaker 2: and a lot of times there long and for me, 307 00:16:58,840 --> 00:17:00,920 Speaker 2: even moments that don't have a to say, I might 308 00:17:00,920 --> 00:17:03,440 Speaker 2: have forty minutes of that, But I still don't want 309 00:17:03,440 --> 00:17:05,399 Speaker 2: to let it go because it was still a moment 310 00:17:05,440 --> 00:17:07,679 Speaker 2: in time that says something about that moment in time. 311 00:17:08,119 --> 00:17:11,239 Speaker 2: And so that has been difficult for me to grapple with, 312 00:17:11,440 --> 00:17:13,280 Speaker 2: and it's kind of been blowing my mind, and I 313 00:17:13,280 --> 00:17:16,520 Speaker 2: haven't been able to think about it too much because 314 00:17:17,359 --> 00:17:20,080 Speaker 2: it's kind of scary to me that like things will 315 00:17:20,119 --> 00:17:22,680 Speaker 2: have to go and heart drives die too, and then 316 00:17:22,880 --> 00:17:24,359 Speaker 2: you have to back up to the backup and then 317 00:17:24,400 --> 00:17:26,359 Speaker 2: back up to that backup, and then that backup dies. 318 00:17:26,720 --> 00:17:30,480 Speaker 2: You can't count on anything. Everything's precarious. But the second 319 00:17:30,480 --> 00:17:33,120 Speaker 2: thing is and forgive me if I mentioned this before, 320 00:17:33,800 --> 00:17:35,439 Speaker 2: but I don't think it would hurt for me to 321 00:17:35,480 --> 00:17:40,119 Speaker 2: say it again. And that's just that I also planned on. 322 00:17:40,600 --> 00:17:42,439 Speaker 2: So I'm traveling back to the States, so when I 323 00:17:42,440 --> 00:17:44,560 Speaker 2: get back, I have some archiving I want to do, 324 00:17:45,320 --> 00:17:49,200 Speaker 2: and a library that's near me has a free archiving 325 00:17:49,280 --> 00:17:55,040 Speaker 2: service so people, So that's file types, files of different types, 326 00:17:55,040 --> 00:17:57,480 Speaker 2: two so that I might be photos. You know, they 327 00:17:57,520 --> 00:18:00,640 Speaker 2: probably do VHS's as well. I think they're in there's 328 00:18:00,760 --> 00:18:06,760 Speaker 2: a lot of media formats that the library does for 329 00:18:06,880 --> 00:18:10,280 Speaker 2: your personal archives, and it's for free for the freeze. 330 00:18:10,760 --> 00:18:15,400 Speaker 2: So if any anybody who's like interested in this topic, 331 00:18:15,920 --> 00:18:18,240 Speaker 2: has personal art, coving they want to do, has VHS's, 332 00:18:18,400 --> 00:18:21,879 Speaker 2: or they have records, or they have any photos that 333 00:18:21,880 --> 00:18:25,720 Speaker 2: they want to archive. But it's overwhelming. And I know 334 00:18:25,760 --> 00:18:27,239 Speaker 2: it's like that for a lot of us because our 335 00:18:27,280 --> 00:18:31,040 Speaker 2: family members often a bunch of home videos, a bunch 336 00:18:31,080 --> 00:18:34,600 Speaker 2: of printed photos that can help us with the process 337 00:18:34,600 --> 00:18:36,119 Speaker 2: and ease a little bit of the stress. And I 338 00:18:36,119 --> 00:18:38,280 Speaker 2: think it's also very helpful in the wake of some 339 00:18:39,280 --> 00:18:43,000 Speaker 2: loved one's death too, when it's like, definitely might be overwhelming. 340 00:18:43,960 --> 00:18:46,200 Speaker 2: But I think that's relevant to our conversations here too, 341 00:18:46,280 --> 00:18:50,280 Speaker 2: on female first, because we talk so much about what's 342 00:18:50,320 --> 00:18:53,679 Speaker 2: available and what's not available, how much scholarship there is 343 00:18:53,720 --> 00:18:57,000 Speaker 2: on something, how much archiving there was done with somebody's history, 344 00:18:57,280 --> 00:19:00,840 Speaker 2: how many how much they wrote in their memoirs, and 345 00:19:00,880 --> 00:19:04,280 Speaker 2: give us all of it, Like, tell us everything, share 346 00:19:04,320 --> 00:19:06,760 Speaker 2: everything you're willing to write, David. If you don't, you know, 347 00:19:06,840 --> 00:19:09,200 Speaker 2: think it'll anybody, it'll ever see the light of day 348 00:19:09,240 --> 00:19:13,920 Speaker 2: beyond you. Just like take note of it. That mosquito 349 00:19:14,000 --> 00:19:16,639 Speaker 2: just bit you on the arm, made you really annoyed. 350 00:19:16,760 --> 00:19:19,320 Speaker 2: I mean, let us know. You don't put it down 351 00:19:19,320 --> 00:19:22,280 Speaker 2: in your journal. I'm just saying like those like even 352 00:19:22,320 --> 00:19:25,040 Speaker 2: the things that we think are so little to us 353 00:19:25,080 --> 00:19:27,560 Speaker 2: in a specific moment could just mean so much to 354 00:19:27,880 --> 00:19:31,200 Speaker 2: somebody else or to us later in life. 355 00:19:31,480 --> 00:19:36,639 Speaker 1: Yes, absolutely, And once again, libraries are awesome. Good Tip Eaves, 356 00:19:47,280 --> 00:19:49,520 Speaker 1: who are we talking about you today? 357 00:19:49,560 --> 00:19:53,000 Speaker 2: We're talking about Felicia Abon and she was the first 358 00:19:53,000 --> 00:19:59,359 Speaker 2: female professional photographer in Ghana. So this is a super 359 00:19:59,400 --> 00:20:07,160 Speaker 2: interesting It's an ongoing story because Felicia Abond passed away 360 00:20:07,200 --> 00:20:11,040 Speaker 2: not too long ago, so there's a lot of work 361 00:20:11,080 --> 00:20:15,960 Speaker 2: that's still being done around her legacy and documenting that. 362 00:20:16,359 --> 00:20:20,880 Speaker 2: But it also reminded me of an episode we had recently. 363 00:20:20,960 --> 00:20:24,240 Speaker 2: We were talking about Hamaya Vera Wala and she was 364 00:20:24,280 --> 00:20:27,000 Speaker 2: a photographer as well, and she also did work in 365 00:20:27,040 --> 00:20:30,440 Speaker 2: the political realm of taking photos, and she was a 366 00:20:30,480 --> 00:20:35,560 Speaker 2: photo journalist and she was in this transitional period between 367 00:20:36,240 --> 00:20:38,040 Speaker 2: Indian independence. 368 00:20:37,720 --> 00:20:38,720 Speaker 1: From the British. 369 00:20:39,119 --> 00:20:41,280 Speaker 2: She saw the before and after and she was there 370 00:20:41,320 --> 00:20:45,840 Speaker 2: to document it with photography. And so this was a 371 00:20:45,880 --> 00:20:50,440 Speaker 2: story that was rattling around in my mind too as 372 00:20:50,520 --> 00:20:53,919 Speaker 2: I was looking at Felicia A. Bond's story because she 373 00:20:54,040 --> 00:20:57,800 Speaker 2: was also there in this transitional period. There's this period 374 00:20:57,840 --> 00:21:02,919 Speaker 2: of independence in Ghana that she was around for. The 375 00:21:03,000 --> 00:21:05,800 Speaker 2: years were a little different, but Felicia bay and I'm 376 00:21:05,800 --> 00:21:08,359 Speaker 2: really excited to talk about her today. 377 00:21:08,520 --> 00:21:13,760 Speaker 1: So yeah, yes, So shall we get into the history. 378 00:21:15,320 --> 00:21:20,120 Speaker 2: So Felicia was born Felicia Eru Rossi Asa in nineteen 379 00:21:20,160 --> 00:21:24,919 Speaker 2: thirty five in a second d Gold Coast colony that 380 00:21:25,200 --> 00:21:30,720 Speaker 2: was a coastal city and this was what Ghana was 381 00:21:30,800 --> 00:21:35,119 Speaker 2: called until it's independence in nineteen fifty Gold Coast. But 382 00:21:35,680 --> 00:21:39,600 Speaker 2: Felicia was the oldest child of six children and she 383 00:21:39,840 --> 00:21:43,639 Speaker 2: was the only daughter, and her mother was a trader 384 00:21:43,920 --> 00:21:48,600 Speaker 2: and her father, Joseph Asa, was a pianist, playwright, painter, 385 00:21:48,760 --> 00:21:52,680 Speaker 2: photographer was he did many things and in the nineteen 386 00:21:52,760 --> 00:21:57,840 Speaker 2: forties her father opened a photography studio. There was really 387 00:21:57,840 --> 00:21:59,960 Speaker 2: good clients for him in the place where they lived. 388 00:22:00,200 --> 00:22:05,040 Speaker 2: That included the wealthy Gnayan families and British naval officers 389 00:22:05,040 --> 00:22:08,520 Speaker 2: who lived in Seconde and the sister city of Takarate, 390 00:22:09,480 --> 00:22:15,520 Speaker 2: and Felicia got really interested in practicing photography, and I 391 00:22:15,520 --> 00:22:17,360 Speaker 2: would imagine that would be the case. She was surrounded 392 00:22:17,400 --> 00:22:20,800 Speaker 2: by so much art with her father. But when she 393 00:22:20,840 --> 00:22:23,040 Speaker 2: went to she went with her dad to a client's 394 00:22:23,080 --> 00:22:27,280 Speaker 2: home and she saw photos on the walls. So she 395 00:22:27,440 --> 00:22:30,560 Speaker 2: started an apprenticeship at her dad's studio when she was 396 00:22:30,600 --> 00:22:33,760 Speaker 2: fourteen years old, and at the time she was also 397 00:22:33,840 --> 00:22:37,159 Speaker 2: going to day school and taking care of her younger siblings. 398 00:22:37,880 --> 00:22:41,760 Speaker 2: And she ended up doing that apprenticeship for about four 399 00:22:41,840 --> 00:22:45,040 Speaker 2: years or so, and she learned how to do the 400 00:22:45,080 --> 00:22:48,240 Speaker 2: things that are required of you when you're doing studio photography, 401 00:22:48,320 --> 00:22:54,240 Speaker 2: like using backdrops, the props, how to mix chemicals, developing film, 402 00:22:54,440 --> 00:22:59,000 Speaker 2: and how to actually take the photos. And one of 403 00:22:59,040 --> 00:23:02,280 Speaker 2: the stories that is recounted, I must say there is 404 00:23:02,720 --> 00:23:06,119 Speaker 2: information if people are interested in reading this thesis that 405 00:23:06,320 --> 00:23:09,120 Speaker 2: I pulled a lot of information about Felicia Abond from. 406 00:23:09,240 --> 00:23:13,159 Speaker 2: It's called Dress, Politics and Framing Self and Ghana the 407 00:23:13,200 --> 00:23:17,200 Speaker 2: Studio Photographs of Felicia Abon by doctor Laurien R. Bowles. 408 00:23:17,800 --> 00:23:20,479 Speaker 2: It's something about tim pages. So y'all can go and 409 00:23:20,560 --> 00:23:23,440 Speaker 2: read that and learn a little bit more about her 410 00:23:23,640 --> 00:23:27,280 Speaker 2: and dig a little bit more into the context around 411 00:23:27,560 --> 00:23:31,719 Speaker 2: fashion and clothing, because we're not going to touch too 412 00:23:31,800 --> 00:23:36,040 Speaker 2: much on that today. But yeah, so she learned all 413 00:23:36,080 --> 00:23:38,160 Speaker 2: of these things in the studio, and there's this story 414 00:23:38,560 --> 00:23:43,280 Speaker 2: about her father and it pretty much characterizes her father 415 00:23:43,480 --> 00:23:48,360 Speaker 2: as strict, at least around the art making process. So 416 00:23:48,560 --> 00:23:51,439 Speaker 2: Felicia said that once her dad asked her to create 417 00:23:51,920 --> 00:23:54,800 Speaker 2: half inch white borders around a bunch of the negatives, 418 00:23:55,400 --> 00:24:00,720 Speaker 2: and she had this quick turnaround, she accidentally did quarter 419 00:24:00,800 --> 00:24:04,680 Speaker 2: inch borders instead of half inch borders, and her father 420 00:24:05,000 --> 00:24:08,280 Speaker 2: was upset with her mistake and slapped her across the 421 00:24:08,320 --> 00:24:10,760 Speaker 2: face with the pictures that she messed up, and she 422 00:24:10,840 --> 00:24:14,280 Speaker 2: had to go back and process the film again, and 423 00:24:14,320 --> 00:24:16,480 Speaker 2: she said that it was a hard lesson, but that 424 00:24:16,640 --> 00:24:19,240 Speaker 2: was just a kind of education that helped her confidence 425 00:24:19,880 --> 00:24:23,800 Speaker 2: as she moved forward in her photography career. So it 426 00:24:23,840 --> 00:24:29,160 Speaker 2: seems like she viewed these this tough love, this kind 427 00:24:29,200 --> 00:24:34,520 Speaker 2: of really like I'm I'm gonna make sure you know 428 00:24:34,600 --> 00:24:37,480 Speaker 2: what you did wrong in a very visceral way. That 429 00:24:37,600 --> 00:24:39,959 Speaker 2: kind of education from her father, it seems like she 430 00:24:40,240 --> 00:24:43,200 Speaker 2: valued that and saw the good and at least in hindsight, 431 00:24:44,080 --> 00:24:45,720 Speaker 2: I'm not so sure if she felt that way in 432 00:24:45,760 --> 00:24:50,200 Speaker 2: the moment, but yeah, so she In nineteen fifty three, 433 00:24:50,320 --> 00:24:54,000 Speaker 2: she met this designer named Robert Avon, and he was 434 00:24:54,040 --> 00:24:57,400 Speaker 2: a textile buyer who was based in Akra and he 435 00:24:58,240 --> 00:25:02,199 Speaker 2: worked on behalf of doctor Kawal Kruma's Convention People's Party, 436 00:25:03,000 --> 00:25:07,200 Speaker 2: and he even later designed the commemorative cloth that featured 437 00:25:07,240 --> 00:25:10,879 Speaker 2: in Kruma's portrait for Goddess Independence. So people may have 438 00:25:10,960 --> 00:25:16,199 Speaker 2: seen these commemorative cloths before. They'll have these illustrative patterns 439 00:25:16,280 --> 00:25:18,399 Speaker 2: on them, and then they'll have in a like a 440 00:25:18,440 --> 00:25:23,160 Speaker 2: portraiture style image of the person that they are commemorating 441 00:25:23,200 --> 00:25:27,199 Speaker 2: for that moment. And Robert Abon was the one who 442 00:25:27,280 --> 00:25:31,320 Speaker 2: made the one for doctor Kwaman Kruma around the time 443 00:25:31,359 --> 00:25:36,359 Speaker 2: of Goddes's independence. So Robert and Felicia met at the 444 00:25:36,440 --> 00:25:39,280 Speaker 2: port while he was on a business trip, and a 445 00:25:39,320 --> 00:25:43,400 Speaker 2: couple of weeks after they met, he asked Felicia's dad 446 00:25:43,840 --> 00:25:47,240 Speaker 2: to marry her. And at this point she had kind 447 00:25:47,240 --> 00:25:51,000 Speaker 2: of she was she was full steam ahead into life, 448 00:25:51,119 --> 00:25:55,640 Speaker 2: like she was running most of the financial dealings and 449 00:25:55,760 --> 00:26:00,359 Speaker 2: the photography work at Ansa studio, and it seemed like 450 00:26:00,640 --> 00:26:03,240 Speaker 2: their parents, it seems like her parents felt like the 451 00:26:03,320 --> 00:26:07,160 Speaker 2: marriage was a good match. So she was done with school, 452 00:26:07,560 --> 00:26:10,080 Speaker 2: she could run a business, she could run a home, 453 00:26:10,800 --> 00:26:14,680 Speaker 2: and he was moving up in politics and their families 454 00:26:14,800 --> 00:26:20,040 Speaker 2: apparently already had ties. But Felicia's father was not ready 455 00:26:20,080 --> 00:26:23,479 Speaker 2: to let her leave the studio and go to a cra. 456 00:26:24,800 --> 00:26:27,680 Speaker 2: He required that they stay engaged for a year before 457 00:26:27,760 --> 00:26:34,360 Speaker 2: he approved the marriage, and Felicia's dad also required that 458 00:26:34,600 --> 00:26:38,159 Speaker 2: Robert get a rental where Felicia could open a photo 459 00:26:38,200 --> 00:26:41,080 Speaker 2: studio in a cra which I'm like, okay, Like he 460 00:26:41,160 --> 00:26:42,960 Speaker 2: made sure that she was set up. He knew she 461 00:26:43,040 --> 00:26:46,040 Speaker 2: was going to leave. He was like, the work needs 462 00:26:46,080 --> 00:26:49,960 Speaker 2: to be accounted for, and like, you know, I mean, 463 00:26:50,000 --> 00:26:52,280 Speaker 2: obviously I wasn't there for the conversation that they had, 464 00:26:52,320 --> 00:26:55,199 Speaker 2: but it's like Felicia seemingly was the one who was 465 00:26:55,240 --> 00:26:59,520 Speaker 2: inspired on her own, of her own accord to start 466 00:26:59,560 --> 00:27:02,440 Speaker 2: photograph continue working it. So he ensured that she would 467 00:27:02,480 --> 00:27:06,560 Speaker 2: be able to continue to fulfill her creative desires instead 468 00:27:06,600 --> 00:27:10,199 Speaker 2: of being you know, pulled into everything else beyond Like 469 00:27:10,440 --> 00:27:13,080 Speaker 2: I really liked that part of her story and seeing 470 00:27:13,080 --> 00:27:15,840 Speaker 2: how she was set up in that way. But Robert 471 00:27:15,880 --> 00:27:19,520 Speaker 2: made good on the goal. Felicia soon had her new studio. 472 00:27:19,800 --> 00:27:23,120 Speaker 2: It was called Missus Felicia Abond's Day and Night Quality 473 00:27:23,200 --> 00:27:27,639 Speaker 2: Art Studio, which I love that name. I love so 474 00:27:27,680 --> 00:27:29,639 Speaker 2: many things about that name. I love how it starts 475 00:27:29,680 --> 00:27:31,840 Speaker 2: with missus Felicia Abon. She was like, y'all don't know 476 00:27:32,560 --> 00:27:35,400 Speaker 2: who I am in this new city that I'm in, Okay, 477 00:27:36,359 --> 00:27:40,639 Speaker 2: and y'all don't know that is quality, So nobody is 478 00:27:40,680 --> 00:27:45,280 Speaker 2: confused what we're doing here. So she opened the studio 479 00:27:45,600 --> 00:27:48,280 Speaker 2: and I've seen nineteen fifty five. In nineteen fifty six, 480 00:27:48,800 --> 00:27:51,800 Speaker 2: but it was just before the time that Ghana gained 481 00:27:51,800 --> 00:27:56,680 Speaker 2: this independence, and her business was close to this other 482 00:27:56,760 --> 00:28:00,560 Speaker 2: studio called Dio Gracchus, which was the old the studio 483 00:28:00,760 --> 00:28:04,399 Speaker 2: in the city, and it was owned by JK. Bruce 484 00:28:04,520 --> 00:28:08,600 Speaker 2: Vanderpuoy and he was a very well known photographer at 485 00:28:08,640 --> 00:28:10,879 Speaker 2: the time. His studio was doing really well, but she 486 00:28:11,040 --> 00:28:14,320 Speaker 2: was very close to it, and it took some time 487 00:28:14,440 --> 00:28:18,159 Speaker 2: for her studio to gain steam in the city. But 488 00:28:18,760 --> 00:28:24,600 Speaker 2: she had a creative promo idea and she ended up 489 00:28:24,680 --> 00:28:27,800 Speaker 2: taking self portraits before she would go out to these 490 00:28:27,800 --> 00:28:31,680 Speaker 2: fancy political events with Robert. So, because Robert was tapped 491 00:28:31,680 --> 00:28:33,880 Speaker 2: into that side, she would go out to all these events, 492 00:28:33,920 --> 00:28:37,040 Speaker 2: and she decided that she would come to her studio 493 00:28:37,119 --> 00:28:42,400 Speaker 2: beforehand and that she would take photos of herself in 494 00:28:42,400 --> 00:28:47,200 Speaker 2: her studio. She talked about the process of going to 495 00:28:47,280 --> 00:28:50,400 Speaker 2: the studio before a big event, and how that set 496 00:28:50,480 --> 00:28:52,960 Speaker 2: the tone for the night, and that kept her from 497 00:28:53,160 --> 00:28:57,240 Speaker 2: getting too excited. And there was something about that that 498 00:28:57,880 --> 00:29:01,440 Speaker 2: I could really relate to, because sometimes if I have 499 00:29:01,520 --> 00:29:03,600 Speaker 2: something to do, that'll be the thing that takes up 500 00:29:04,240 --> 00:29:07,840 Speaker 2: so much space in my mind. And it seems like 501 00:29:09,120 --> 00:29:12,040 Speaker 2: this was grounding for her. It was like the thing 502 00:29:12,080 --> 00:29:16,200 Speaker 2: that she loved to do. But also it's the work 503 00:29:16,240 --> 00:29:23,560 Speaker 2: of self portraiture where you're it's self determining. It's so expressive, 504 00:29:23,760 --> 00:29:28,400 Speaker 2: it can be a very emotional process, and I just 505 00:29:29,280 --> 00:29:33,360 Speaker 2: I appreciate the mix of how that was like artistic 506 00:29:33,440 --> 00:29:39,640 Speaker 2: expression but also strategic at the same time. So I 507 00:29:39,680 --> 00:29:43,800 Speaker 2: really love that part of her story. But she would 508 00:29:43,920 --> 00:29:47,120 Speaker 2: display these photos in a glass case between that was 509 00:29:47,160 --> 00:29:50,320 Speaker 2: between the entryway reception and the portrait stage in the studio, 510 00:29:51,000 --> 00:29:53,080 Speaker 2: and there would be If you look at the photos, 511 00:29:53,080 --> 00:29:55,840 Speaker 2: you see how much of an emphasis there is on 512 00:29:55,880 --> 00:29:59,320 Speaker 2: her clothing and her hairstyles, which are always she's always 513 00:29:59,320 --> 00:30:02,920 Speaker 2: done to the to the nines like her Even though 514 00:30:02,920 --> 00:30:05,200 Speaker 2: they're in black and white, you can see the patterns. 515 00:30:05,800 --> 00:30:08,640 Speaker 2: You can see a lot of her gaze if it's 516 00:30:08,840 --> 00:30:11,959 Speaker 2: directly at the camera, or just not quite looking at 517 00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:16,120 Speaker 2: the lens. Is very in some ways. I feel like 518 00:30:16,160 --> 00:30:21,240 Speaker 2: I could describe it as regal in some moments, very upstanding. 519 00:30:22,080 --> 00:30:27,120 Speaker 2: And the ways that she took these photos and how 520 00:30:27,120 --> 00:30:31,560 Speaker 2: she displayed them would help affirm her social status. But 521 00:30:31,640 --> 00:30:35,200 Speaker 2: at the same time her photography skills and they essentially 522 00:30:35,240 --> 00:30:38,880 Speaker 2: function as calling cars that she could use to promo 523 00:30:38,920 --> 00:30:42,200 Speaker 2: the studios. She's like, Okay, I'm not getting a lot 524 00:30:42,240 --> 00:30:45,880 Speaker 2: of clients right now, but I can do this myself, 525 00:30:45,960 --> 00:30:47,920 Speaker 2: and then through this, people will see who I am 526 00:30:47,960 --> 00:30:51,160 Speaker 2: as a photographer, and they'll also see the work that 527 00:30:51,200 --> 00:30:56,600 Speaker 2: I'm capable of producing for them. So she would send 528 00:30:56,840 --> 00:31:02,560 Speaker 2: out copies of these self portraits to family, maybe after 529 00:31:02,640 --> 00:31:07,040 Speaker 2: they left the display case, and in some of those 530 00:31:07,040 --> 00:31:10,680 Speaker 2: self portraits that were taken around nineteen fifty nine to 531 00:31:10,760 --> 00:31:14,120 Speaker 2: nineteen sixty four, she would wear things like kine cloth 532 00:31:14,240 --> 00:31:20,600 Speaker 2: and dashiki and the photos that she took of other 533 00:31:20,680 --> 00:31:23,040 Speaker 2: people as well, so she did it wasn't just self 534 00:31:23,080 --> 00:31:26,160 Speaker 2: portraits she was taking, so she was able to take 535 00:31:26,240 --> 00:31:29,640 Speaker 2: photos of other people as well. Of course, her clientele 536 00:31:29,680 --> 00:31:34,400 Speaker 2: picked up and in them they would all be black 537 00:31:34,440 --> 00:31:37,440 Speaker 2: and white. People would be seated or standing in the 538 00:31:37,480 --> 00:31:40,000 Speaker 2: middle of the frame. Sometimes it was just one or 539 00:31:40,040 --> 00:31:43,160 Speaker 2: two people, sometimes it was groups of people. But she 540 00:31:43,240 --> 00:31:46,920 Speaker 2: also took photos of people outside of the studio just 541 00:31:47,320 --> 00:31:52,520 Speaker 2: living their everyday lives. You can go see pictures of 542 00:31:52,680 --> 00:31:56,600 Speaker 2: people just out in the street, people of various ages. 543 00:31:56,800 --> 00:31:59,200 Speaker 2: There's one photo she has that she took when she 544 00:31:59,280 --> 00:32:05,520 Speaker 2: was at a funeral. All sorts of documentation of everyday 545 00:32:05,560 --> 00:32:10,680 Speaker 2: life there just as that form of vernacular photography. So 546 00:32:11,920 --> 00:32:16,920 Speaker 2: when she was covering a presidential event, she ended up 547 00:32:16,960 --> 00:32:21,160 Speaker 2: grabbing the attention of President Kwaman Kruma and he offered 548 00:32:21,200 --> 00:32:24,960 Speaker 2: her a job as a member of the Presidential Press Corps. 549 00:32:25,760 --> 00:32:28,160 Speaker 2: And so she was running her studio, but at the 550 00:32:28,160 --> 00:32:31,840 Speaker 2: same time she was also a stringer photographer at Guinea 551 00:32:31,880 --> 00:32:35,240 Speaker 2: Press Limited, which was the publishing house of the Convention 552 00:32:35,400 --> 00:32:40,760 Speaker 2: People's Party under President Kwamen and Kruma, and the Guinea 553 00:32:40,760 --> 00:32:45,160 Speaker 2: Press Limited later became the Ghanaan Times. The Guinea Press 554 00:32:45,200 --> 00:32:48,360 Speaker 2: Is published the newspapers the Ghana Evening News and the 555 00:32:48,400 --> 00:32:53,120 Speaker 2: Guinea Times. But so she went on assignments for that 556 00:32:53,200 --> 00:32:56,720 Speaker 2: work as well. For instance, in nineteen sixty one, she 557 00:32:56,960 --> 00:33:01,880 Speaker 2: covered Queen Elizabeth and Prince Phillips visit to Ghana. She 558 00:33:01,960 --> 00:33:07,360 Speaker 2: also did other freelance jobs. She photographed weddings, birthday ceremonies, 559 00:33:07,880 --> 00:33:13,760 Speaker 2: child naming ceremonies. In February of nineteen sixty six, she 560 00:33:13,840 --> 00:33:17,720 Speaker 2: took a short break from photography, but later that year, 561 00:33:17,760 --> 00:33:20,480 Speaker 2: in December, she was featured in this column and Drum 562 00:33:20,480 --> 00:33:23,960 Speaker 2: magazine and it was called lookout men, because here come 563 00:33:24,000 --> 00:33:29,680 Speaker 2: the girls, and then like she's a she's a woman photographer, 564 00:33:30,440 --> 00:33:36,440 Speaker 2: and it was like so many so like that's ridiculous, 565 00:33:38,440 --> 00:33:40,880 Speaker 2: over the top watch out miss. 566 00:33:40,720 --> 00:33:45,040 Speaker 3: Especially because you say girls. 567 00:33:43,960 --> 00:33:52,719 Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, yeah, yeah. Definitely definitely a specific energy there, 568 00:33:52,760 --> 00:33:56,080 Speaker 2: but it was a thing that there were far more 569 00:33:57,400 --> 00:34:03,320 Speaker 2: men photographers at the time. She photographed tons of people though, 570 00:34:03,360 --> 00:34:08,320 Speaker 2: so even though she was working closely with President Kwaman 571 00:34:08,320 --> 00:34:12,319 Speaker 2: and Kruma and she was doing her studio work, she 572 00:34:12,760 --> 00:34:18,480 Speaker 2: photographed other people like Jerry Rawlings, who was Ghana's longest 573 00:34:18,520 --> 00:34:24,520 Speaker 2: serving president, and Marian Arka, the wife of Ghana's first 574 00:34:24,600 --> 00:34:27,560 Speaker 2: vice president under the Fourth Republic, and many other people. 575 00:34:28,600 --> 00:34:32,919 Speaker 2: But she continued her photography work. In nineteen ninety eight, 576 00:34:33,080 --> 00:34:37,560 Speaker 2: she became the chair of the Ghana Union of Professional Photographers. 577 00:34:38,600 --> 00:34:41,000 Speaker 2: These are a couple more first for her so she's 578 00:34:41,040 --> 00:34:45,440 Speaker 2: the first woman president of that union and she's also 579 00:34:45,920 --> 00:34:50,000 Speaker 2: the first woman to have joined Ghana's presidential team of photographers. 580 00:34:50,760 --> 00:34:54,600 Speaker 2: She ended up retiring in twenty thirteen after her arthritis 581 00:34:55,000 --> 00:34:59,000 Speaker 2: got worse and she completely retired from her practice around 582 00:34:59,040 --> 00:35:03,120 Speaker 2: twenty seventeen. That was the year that she had her 583 00:35:03,600 --> 00:35:06,680 Speaker 2: first public exhibition of her work and it was in 584 00:35:06,719 --> 00:35:10,160 Speaker 2: a group show called Acras Portraits of a City that 585 00:35:10,320 --> 00:35:13,600 Speaker 2: was at the A and O Gallery in Nacras, and 586 00:35:13,719 --> 00:35:16,760 Speaker 2: that show was curated by an art historian and writer 587 00:35:16,920 --> 00:35:22,400 Speaker 2: named Nana alfouriata Ayim and he was a art She 588 00:35:22,680 --> 00:35:26,000 Speaker 2: Felicia avan Now was from an artistic family because her 589 00:35:26,040 --> 00:35:29,560 Speaker 2: siblings also were artists, like one was a fashion designer, 590 00:35:29,880 --> 00:35:34,799 Speaker 2: one was a filmmaker, one was a musician. And she 591 00:35:35,520 --> 00:35:39,320 Speaker 2: and Felicia Abon. Her work was exhibited in the first 592 00:35:39,400 --> 00:35:43,120 Speaker 2: ever Ghana pavilion at the Venice Bienal in twenty nineteen. 593 00:35:44,080 --> 00:35:50,959 Speaker 2: So there's still work that continued to be done over 594 00:35:51,000 --> 00:35:52,920 Speaker 2: the later years of her life. When it came to 595 00:35:53,120 --> 00:35:55,720 Speaker 2: archiving her work, there were people who went and interview 596 00:35:55,800 --> 00:35:59,120 Speaker 2: her and talked to her, like the person the doctor 597 00:35:59,280 --> 00:36:04,440 Speaker 2: Laurian Arts who I mentioned, who wrote the thesis that 598 00:36:04,480 --> 00:36:07,480 Speaker 2: I mentioned at the beginning of this episode. There were 599 00:36:07,520 --> 00:36:12,080 Speaker 2: other people who were able to interview her while she 600 00:36:12,280 --> 00:36:14,920 Speaker 2: was still living, and there were members of this group 601 00:36:14,960 --> 00:36:17,840 Speaker 2: that was called the Exit Frame Collective who were working 602 00:36:17,880 --> 00:36:21,320 Speaker 2: to archive her work and make it available for research 603 00:36:21,600 --> 00:36:28,600 Speaker 2: and exhibition. And Felicia Bond died on January fourth, twenty 604 00:36:28,680 --> 00:36:34,160 Speaker 2: twenty four, in a crap and so yeah, very recent, 605 00:36:34,520 --> 00:36:39,200 Speaker 2: but there there. If you go look up more stuff 606 00:36:39,239 --> 00:36:43,080 Speaker 2: about Felicia Bon you'll see these words mentioned like come up. 607 00:36:43,120 --> 00:36:45,600 Speaker 2: We come across so many times in episodes of Female 608 00:36:45,680 --> 00:36:50,960 Speaker 2: First where they say this uncovering or discovering, and I 609 00:36:51,000 --> 00:36:54,840 Speaker 2: think in some in some ways that work can be 610 00:36:57,160 --> 00:37:01,319 Speaker 2: applied to her work, but that's also it's such a 611 00:37:01,360 --> 00:37:05,319 Speaker 2: loaded word and all the implications that come around that. 612 00:37:06,800 --> 00:37:09,960 Speaker 2: But there's still scholarship being done on her work, and 613 00:37:09,960 --> 00:37:13,120 Speaker 2: I'm sure a lot more to come, a lot more 614 00:37:13,160 --> 00:37:17,200 Speaker 2: to come, seems like her her family, her estate has 615 00:37:17,320 --> 00:37:22,480 Speaker 2: provided people with photos and so everybody who wants to 616 00:37:22,480 --> 00:37:24,279 Speaker 2: look at some of the photos that she took, they can. 617 00:37:24,320 --> 00:37:29,760 Speaker 2: You can see some of them online. 618 00:37:36,880 --> 00:37:39,040 Speaker 1: This is one of the things I love about Female 619 00:37:39,080 --> 00:37:42,080 Speaker 1: First eves, as you bring us so many people from 620 00:37:42,080 --> 00:37:45,839 Speaker 1: different time periods and different places, and so yeah, that 621 00:37:45,880 --> 00:37:50,680 Speaker 1: does feel relatively recent, and I suggest to listeners go 622 00:37:51,400 --> 00:37:54,760 Speaker 1: look up the images you can, because they are really, 623 00:37:54,760 --> 00:37:58,600 Speaker 1: really striking. But I do think one of my favorite 624 00:37:58,600 --> 00:38:02,600 Speaker 1: parts of her story is certainly the I'm gonna take 625 00:38:02,640 --> 00:38:04,799 Speaker 1: some self portraits and this is what's going to get 626 00:38:04,800 --> 00:38:06,640 Speaker 1: people to come in. I love that. 627 00:38:07,440 --> 00:38:11,040 Speaker 2: Yeah. She was kind of ahead of her time, wasn't she. 628 00:38:11,560 --> 00:38:17,200 Speaker 1: Yeah, she's like, okay, not getting enough business. I know 629 00:38:17,280 --> 00:38:19,240 Speaker 1: what I'll do. It's fantastic. 630 00:38:21,719 --> 00:38:25,520 Speaker 2: Yeah, and I love her photos. I love her self 631 00:38:25,560 --> 00:38:29,239 Speaker 2: portraits too. It was like really a joy to be 632 00:38:29,360 --> 00:38:33,800 Speaker 2: able to see her because that's not always the case, 633 00:38:33,880 --> 00:38:36,439 Speaker 2: like from the photographers we talked about in the past 634 00:38:36,480 --> 00:38:40,440 Speaker 2: and all photographers, you know, they won't necessarily take self portraits. 635 00:38:40,520 --> 00:38:45,160 Speaker 2: So it's nice to be able to see her as 636 00:38:45,320 --> 00:38:49,040 Speaker 2: conceived of by herself through her own medium and where 637 00:38:49,040 --> 00:38:53,400 Speaker 2: she's usually on the other side of the camera in 638 00:38:53,440 --> 00:38:53,799 Speaker 2: that way. 639 00:38:56,360 --> 00:38:59,680 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's going back to what we were talking about before, 640 00:39:00,719 --> 00:39:04,640 Speaker 1: which obviously we have a lot of thoughts on about, 641 00:39:04,880 --> 00:39:10,760 Speaker 1: you know, capturing those moments and telling when you're looking 642 00:39:10,800 --> 00:39:15,279 Speaker 1: back on somebody having having something like that, and it 643 00:39:15,480 --> 00:39:18,800 Speaker 1: sounds like, you know, there's not a lot. There's not 644 00:39:18,920 --> 00:39:22,279 Speaker 1: as like she wrote journal kind of entries that we have, 645 00:39:22,400 --> 00:39:26,319 Speaker 1: but we do have these self portraits, and they do 646 00:39:27,400 --> 00:39:30,600 Speaker 1: tell a story about how she sees herself. 647 00:39:31,760 --> 00:39:37,480 Speaker 2: Exactly yeah, and that she even had the confidence and 648 00:39:37,600 --> 00:39:41,239 Speaker 2: bravery to say, I want to put pictures of me 649 00:39:41,440 --> 00:39:44,600 Speaker 2: up in this place where people don't really know me 650 00:39:44,760 --> 00:39:50,919 Speaker 2: like that. So I think that's quite an interesting idea too, 651 00:39:51,080 --> 00:39:56,440 Speaker 2: because I think I'm thinking about the mass, how important 652 00:39:56,560 --> 00:40:01,520 Speaker 2: marketing and self branding is these days, and how someone 653 00:40:01,600 --> 00:40:04,680 Speaker 2: today might be like, nobody knows you, so let's not 654 00:40:05,160 --> 00:40:06,839 Speaker 2: your name, don't even need to be at the top 655 00:40:06,880 --> 00:40:09,120 Speaker 2: of this. Your face doesn't need to be at the 656 00:40:09,160 --> 00:40:11,120 Speaker 2: top of this, because that's not the thing that's going 657 00:40:11,160 --> 00:40:12,799 Speaker 2: to sell. We have to sell this some other way 658 00:40:12,840 --> 00:40:15,239 Speaker 2: because people don't know you here. It's like if she 659 00:40:15,400 --> 00:40:21,080 Speaker 2: was getting if she was getting advice from a manager 660 00:40:21,080 --> 00:40:23,120 Speaker 2: at that point in time, maybe they would have been like, 661 00:40:23,160 --> 00:40:25,600 Speaker 2: I don't know if that's going to work. But so 662 00:40:25,680 --> 00:40:31,640 Speaker 2: I appreciate like seeing things from that perspective and how 663 00:40:31,640 --> 00:40:34,560 Speaker 2: she was thinking about I have to do what I 664 00:40:34,600 --> 00:40:38,480 Speaker 2: have to do to be able to grow my clientele 665 00:40:38,800 --> 00:40:42,600 Speaker 2: and my visibility in this new place, and I know 666 00:40:42,640 --> 00:40:45,480 Speaker 2: that I have the skill for it. And this is 667 00:40:46,000 --> 00:40:50,120 Speaker 2: missus Felicia Obind's Quality Art Studio. 668 00:40:50,360 --> 00:40:56,160 Speaker 1: Okay, it's great. She was she was backing up the 669 00:40:56,239 --> 00:41:02,920 Speaker 1: name of the store. It's a great story. Listeners, please 670 00:41:03,000 --> 00:41:08,200 Speaker 1: go look up the images. They really are fantastic. Thank you, 671 00:41:08,239 --> 00:41:13,200 Speaker 1: as always Eves for coming on, for bringing these stories 672 00:41:13,200 --> 00:41:16,320 Speaker 1: to us and for keeping us updated on your life. 673 00:41:16,960 --> 00:41:20,400 Speaker 1: We love hearing from you. Where can the good listeners 674 00:41:20,440 --> 00:41:20,839 Speaker 1: find you? 675 00:41:21,640 --> 00:41:24,240 Speaker 2: Y'all can find me. You can go to my website 676 00:41:24,360 --> 00:41:29,160 Speaker 2: Evesjeffcoat dot com. That's spelled y v E S J 677 00:41:29,360 --> 00:41:32,640 Speaker 2: E F F C O A T dot com. You 678 00:41:32,680 --> 00:41:35,040 Speaker 2: can get to all of the other things from there. 679 00:41:35,080 --> 00:41:37,360 Speaker 2: You can sign up for my email list. If you 680 00:41:37,600 --> 00:41:40,520 Speaker 2: want to be on Instagram, then you can go to 681 00:41:41,600 --> 00:41:47,120 Speaker 2: at not Apologizing and you can find me there. I'll 682 00:41:47,120 --> 00:41:53,200 Speaker 2: post more stuff on there about my surfing trials and 683 00:41:53,320 --> 00:41:56,319 Speaker 2: all the other things that I have going on, and 684 00:41:56,520 --> 00:42:00,000 Speaker 2: many many other episodes of stuff Mom never told you, 685 00:42:00,680 --> 00:42:05,640 Speaker 2: doing female first stories of women throughout history who had 686 00:42:05,800 --> 00:42:09,360 Speaker 2: some pioneering accomplishments. 687 00:42:10,120 --> 00:42:14,359 Speaker 1: Yes, listeners, go check out all of that stuff. If 688 00:42:14,400 --> 00:42:17,759 Speaker 1: you have not already. If you would like to contact us, 689 00:42:17,800 --> 00:42:19,600 Speaker 1: you can. You can email us at Hello at Stuffannever 690 00:42:19,680 --> 00:42:21,239 Speaker 1: Told You dot com. You can find us on Blue 691 00:42:21,239 --> 00:42:23,680 Speaker 1: Skyte Momstuff podcast or on Instagram and TikTok at stuff 692 00:42:23,680 --> 00:42:25,680 Speaker 1: I've Never Told You for also on YouTube. We have 693 00:42:25,680 --> 00:42:27,399 Speaker 1: some merchandise at cop Bureau and we have a book 694 00:42:27,440 --> 00:42:29,200 Speaker 1: you can get wherever you get your books. Thanks to 695 00:42:29,280 --> 00:42:32,239 Speaker 1: Always Too, our superdus Christina, our executive produce, My Ander, 696 00:42:32,280 --> 00:42:35,200 Speaker 1: contributor Joey. Thank you and thanks to you for listening 697 00:42:35,239 --> 00:42:37,120 Speaker 1: Stuff I Never Told You Instruction by Heart Radio more 698 00:42:37,120 --> 00:42:38,719 Speaker 1: podcast from my Heart Radio. You can check out the 699 00:42:38,760 --> 00:42:40,759 Speaker 1: heart Radio app, Apple podcast or if you listen to 700 00:42:40,800 --> 00:42:50,759 Speaker 1: your favorite shows