WEBVTT - Blowing in the Wind

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<v Speaker 1>Brought to you by Toyota. Let's go places. Welcome to

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<v Speaker 1>Forward Thinking, Taylor, everyone, and welcome to Forward Thinking, the

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<v Speaker 1>podcast that looks at the future and says, did you

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<v Speaker 1>ever know that you're my hero? I'm Jonathan Strickland. Come on,

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<v Speaker 1>I'm Jonathan Strickland, I'm Lauren voc Obama, I'm Jim mcfarwick.

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<v Speaker 1>That's the best one yet. Yeah, yeah, well, I mean

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<v Speaker 1>it's thematic, right. We're talking about wind power today, the future, Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>the future of wind power. But a big fan. He

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<v Speaker 1>has big fans, increasingly large, one the size of planets. Yes,

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<v Speaker 1>we're we're a little loopie today. We're talking about wind

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<v Speaker 1>power today, and before we talk about the future of it,

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<v Speaker 1>obviously we should probably set up, you know, the fact

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<v Speaker 1>that what's the past of wind power? What is wind power?

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<v Speaker 1>How do we harness wind power? And how long have

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<v Speaker 1>we been doing that? Well, I think the important fact

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<v Speaker 1>here to to think about is how is wind created?

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<v Speaker 1>And that is that is, basically, when the sun heats

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<v Speaker 1>an area of land and the air above that land

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<v Speaker 1>absorbs some of the heat, making it warmer and therefore

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<v Speaker 1>less dense than than air that might be hanging out

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<v Speaker 1>above it um. At a certain point, it will suddenly

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<v Speaker 1>rise in that cooler above. It will rush down to

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<v Speaker 1>build a space. That is how wind is essentially created, right,

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<v Speaker 1>And wind exerts a force it pushes. So anything that

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<v Speaker 1>pushes has the capacity to do some sort of work

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<v Speaker 1>if we can only figure out a way of channeling

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<v Speaker 1>it and harnessing it. Uh, the ancients did. Actually they

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<v Speaker 1>had wind turbines too. They were called windmills. Yeah, wind

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<v Speaker 1>mills very very similar to to turbines. In this case,

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<v Speaker 1>you're not talking about generating electricity. You're talking about turning

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<v Speaker 1>some sort of mill that could crush stuff. Right, You're

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<v Speaker 1>just moving kinetic force from one place to another. You're

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<v Speaker 1>translating it a little bit. But say, yeah, you you

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<v Speaker 1>build a big tower and you make some big blades

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<v Speaker 1>that the wind will turn when it blows, and that

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<v Speaker 1>turns a crank that say, crushes grain into flower. Right

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<v Speaker 1>or maybe um like moves the water wheel or water

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<v Speaker 1>pump to um water up from a river lake yep, yep.

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<v Speaker 1>And also we've been harnessing wind in other ways. Obviously,

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<v Speaker 1>sailing would be a big win using sales had sailboats

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<v Speaker 1>since about three thousand BC, and the fancy windmills. You're

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<v Speaker 1>you're getting up there, and we've had fancy windmills since

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<v Speaker 1>about what it's it's people people aren't really sure. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>there's there's not something between two hundred and two thousand BC.

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<v Speaker 1>I know that that's a large time. Yeah, things like

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<v Speaker 1>that don't tend to last throughout the millennia. But we've

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<v Speaker 1>been using the wind to do work for us for

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<v Speaker 1>quite some time now. As far as using wind in

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<v Speaker 1>the sense of creating electricity, that's far more recent. In fact,

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<v Speaker 1>it was really around the nineteen eighties when that technology

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<v Speaker 1>had reached a level of sophistication where we could, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>put it to practical use right in rural areas. As

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<v Speaker 1>early as like the nineteen twenties or thirties, windmills were

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<v Speaker 1>supplying a little bit of electricity where basically the power

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<v Speaker 1>lines weren't going. Yeah yeah, But for anything for like

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<v Speaker 1>a significant amount of electricity, you really have to look

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<v Speaker 1>at the fairly recent past. And even then it was

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<v Speaker 1>a little shaky. A lot of the wind turbines that

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<v Speaker 1>went up in the eighties were made out of material

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<v Speaker 1>that wasn't necessarily um ideal, didn't last very long. There

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<v Speaker 1>were a lot of maintenance issues. Wind power turbines broke

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<v Speaker 1>down fairly frequently those early wind farms and covered in

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<v Speaker 1>all those neon signs. They were really only producing about

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<v Speaker 1>a hundred and fifty kilowatts like ideally of energy, which

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<v Speaker 1>is nothing really compared to today, right right, and so

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<v Speaker 1>you know they're they're actually there's some some interesting abandoned

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<v Speaker 1>wind farms in various parts of the United States, including Hawaii.

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<v Speaker 1>I've seen some uh some pictures of a wind farm

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<v Speaker 1>in Hawaii. The the turbines haven't been producing electricity for years,

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<v Speaker 1>but they're still standing there. No one's yeah, yeah, And

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<v Speaker 1>in fact, there are there are some wind turbines out

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<v Speaker 1>there that are not producing electricity. They turn because the

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<v Speaker 1>companies want them to continue to turn to force oil

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<v Speaker 1>through the various uh workings of the system, but they're

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<v Speaker 1>not actually generating electricity. However, to an outside observer who

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<v Speaker 1>doesn't know that that's what's going on, it may look

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<v Speaker 1>like they're fully functional. However, let's talk about what they're

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<v Speaker 1>actually doing. How they're converting kinetic energy into electric energy.

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<v Speaker 1>And it's pretty simple design really. So you've got these

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<v Speaker 1>long rotor blades that are designed to you know, catch

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<v Speaker 1>the wind. The wind will push these blades and turn

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<v Speaker 1>the turn them there on a hub that rotates. The

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<v Speaker 1>hub is actually attached to a main shaft, and the

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<v Speaker 1>main shaft will also turn you know, it's it rotates

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<v Speaker 1>as well due to the rotational force that we get

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<v Speaker 1>from these blade aids, and uh, it usually runs through

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<v Speaker 1>some sort of gearbox where the gears will translate that

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<v Speaker 1>into a faster rotational force because you know, if you

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<v Speaker 1>use different sized gears, you can, uh you can change

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<v Speaker 1>the speed the revolutions per minted. Really that will then

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<v Speaker 1>go through a generator, and a generator essentially uses magnets

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<v Speaker 1>to rotate past a conductor. And that you know, once

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<v Speaker 1>you have a conductor in the presence of a fluctuating

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<v Speaker 1>magnetic field, you induce current to flow. Right, So if

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<v Speaker 1>you are able, you just just look at me like

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<v Speaker 1>you're talking magic talk like magnets. But how do they work?

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<v Speaker 1>That's an excellent question. We'll cover that in a different episode.

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<v Speaker 1>So anyway, uh, yeah, the rotational motion of the magnets

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<v Speaker 1>creates this fluctuating magnetic field, which you then with the conductor,

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<v Speaker 1>can use to generate electricity. Um so that's that's the

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<v Speaker 1>basic design, and that's pretty much been the same way

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<v Speaker 1>since we started building wind turbines. And it's very similar

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<v Speaker 1>to the way other turbines work, not just wind turbines.

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<v Speaker 1>Steam turbines are very similar. You know, obviously it's using

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<v Speaker 1>steam not wind, but the same sort of general idea. Um, now,

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<v Speaker 1>you guys have i've guess seen wind turbines. I don't

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<v Speaker 1>know if you ever seen them in person. Have you

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<v Speaker 1>ever seen one in person, like an actual like wind farm.

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<v Speaker 1>I don't think I have. I think I might have

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<v Speaker 1>flown over them at one point, but I think I've

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<v Speaker 1>seen them in California. I've seen them in Salt Lake City.

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<v Speaker 1>There's uh, there was a an area I went to

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<v Speaker 1>in Salt Lake City where there's a wind farm right

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<v Speaker 1>outside of Salt Lake and uh, there are quite a

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<v Speaker 1>few there. Actually, it was kind of interesting. We kept

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<v Speaker 1>driving by it and realizing, oh good, now we're thirty

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<v Speaker 1>minutes away from the hotel. I tell you what I've

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<v Speaker 1>seen a lot of though, is stock images. For some reason,

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<v Speaker 1>we are just rich with stock images. That is true. Well,

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<v Speaker 1>if you've seen them in person or even just an image,

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<v Speaker 1>As long as you get a sense of scale, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>is that they're pretty tall right there there. There could

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<v Speaker 1>be a couple of hundred feet tall, three feet tall sometimes.

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, these are big structures. And the reason for

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<v Speaker 1>that is that the winds tend to be more stable

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<v Speaker 1>and steady at higher altitudes. At ground level, you may

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<v Speaker 1>not be able to get a steady wind for any

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<v Speaker 1>length of time, and it may not be you know,

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<v Speaker 1>strong enough to turn the turbines. They really need to

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<v Speaker 1>turn at the speed of about what you need to

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<v Speaker 1>get a wind of around twelve to fourteen miles per

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<v Speaker 1>hour minimum, which is about nineteen to twenty two kilometers

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<v Speaker 1>per hour in force for it to really turn these

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<v Speaker 1>these blades properly, and you get a much better uh,

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<v Speaker 1>steady supply of wind at a higher altitude, which is

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<v Speaker 1>why these things are so tall. And they do tend

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<v Speaker 1>to generate between around fifty to lots of energy depending

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<v Speaker 1>upon the design of the turbine. No two turbines are,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, they aren't created equally, depending upon who made

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<v Speaker 1>them and how they were designed, and um, they're not.

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<v Speaker 1>Their efficiency ranges quite a bit too, and that depends

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<v Speaker 1>heavily on where you put them and uh and just

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<v Speaker 1>the design of the wind turbine as well. And by efficiency,

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<v Speaker 1>I mean how frequently how often are they actually generating electricity.

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<v Speaker 1>So a lot of the capacity for a wind turbine

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<v Speaker 1>is is determined by if the turbine were turning at

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<v Speaker 1>twenty four hours a day, seven days a week constantly,

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<v Speaker 1>if there was a constant supply of wind, here's how

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<v Speaker 1>much electricity that turbine would generate. And then you have

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<v Speaker 1>the number. But in reality that tends to be a

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<v Speaker 1>much smaller percentage than the overall in those places the

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<v Speaker 1>wind is not going twenty four hours, right Yeah, I

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<v Speaker 1>would imagine that gets more business and during the daytime,

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<v Speaker 1>right well, it all depends, all depends on where it

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<v Speaker 1>is early. But uh, well, when we talk we'll talk

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<v Speaker 1>a bit about the pros and cons of wind energy

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<v Speaker 1>when we get towards the end of this episode, and

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<v Speaker 1>I'll give a few more details on percentages as for

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<v Speaker 1>you know, how efficient these things can be, and it

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<v Speaker 1>really heavily depends upon where you put them. But you know,

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<v Speaker 1>we we've we've got that basic design down. Uh. It's

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<v Speaker 1>people have recognized that it's got a it's it's got

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<v Speaker 1>an interesting approach to harvesting uh, the wind and getting

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<v Speaker 1>electricity out of it. That's something that appeals to a

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<v Speaker 1>lot of people because it means being able to shift

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<v Speaker 1>some of our dependency on say, uh greenhouse gas emitting

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<v Speaker 1>forms of generating electricity. But it's there's still some problems

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<v Speaker 1>with it. So there have been a lot of people

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<v Speaker 1>looking into ways of innovating in the space, and I

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<v Speaker 1>wanted to talk about some of those. So have you

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<v Speaker 1>guys heard of the solar wind energy tower? Look, Joe,

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<v Speaker 1>have you heard about this? Right? You're just kind of

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<v Speaker 1>grinning at me. You want to hear what it looks? No? No, no, no, sorry, no, no, no,

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<v Speaker 1>it's not one in China. This is one that are

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<v Speaker 1>actually they're they're talking about building one in like the

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<v Speaker 1>Mojave Desert. But um, alright, so imagine imagine a tower.

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<v Speaker 1>It looks, you know, kind of like a cooling tower

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<v Speaker 1>that you would see at a nuclear power plant. But

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<v Speaker 1>all right, So this tower is hollow, It's like a

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<v Speaker 1>hollow cylinder and at the base of the tower is

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<v Speaker 1>a ring of turbines that faces so that the blades

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<v Speaker 1>are facing so that they're facing into the tower. So

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<v Speaker 1>wind coming from the middle of the tower going out

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<v Speaker 1>would turn the turbine blades. Okay, Now you put this

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<v Speaker 1>in a desert where the air is very very hot

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<v Speaker 1>and very very dry, and at the very top of

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<v Speaker 1>the tower is a water injection system and they pump

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<v Speaker 1>water up the tower. The water gets sprayed in a

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<v Speaker 1>fine mist. That fine mist ends up saturating that dry,

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<v Speaker 1>hot air, which makes it heavier and makes it start

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<v Speaker 1>to rush down the center of the tower. And so

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<v Speaker 1>it's kind of like a reverse chimney in a way.

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<v Speaker 1>That air rushes down and it hits the ground and

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<v Speaker 1>goes out through the turbines, turning the turbine blades. So

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<v Speaker 1>rather than harvesting wind, you're creating your own. Yeah, you're

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<v Speaker 1>making wind sounds like that's a terrible way of putting it.

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<v Speaker 1>Kind of similar to geothermal somehow and pouring water down

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<v Speaker 1>there to create the steam from the heat. Yeah, in

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<v Speaker 1>this case, you're just using a very fine mist to

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<v Speaker 1>create heavy air, and then you channel that heavy air

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<v Speaker 1>down through the turbine blades. Uh. It's an interesting idea. Supposedly,

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<v Speaker 1>the wind speeds hit pretty a pretty gusty level when

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<v Speaker 1>it gets to the bomb somewhere around fifty miles per hour.

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<v Speaker 1>So that's that's decent. That's a decent breeze. Um, there

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<v Speaker 1>are some disadvantages. These things are are tall, they're big,

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<v Speaker 1>They're like two feet tall. That's so it's still, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>a large thing that you have to build, and you're

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<v Speaker 1>limited to where you can build them. You can you know,

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<v Speaker 1>you can't just put these suckers like in here in

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<v Speaker 1>the southeast, we've got really high humidity, so injecting the

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<v Speaker 1>air with water would not necessarily create the effect we

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<v Speaker 1>would need. We would have to have it in a

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<v Speaker 1>very dry right. You put one of those suckers in

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<v Speaker 1>Florida and people are like, there's no change. It's like

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<v Speaker 1>a swamp cooler in Florida. Doesn't many good though. Uh,

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<v Speaker 1>pretty much all wind power is subject to geographical limitation.

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<v Speaker 1>Wind power is very dependent on places where there's a

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<v Speaker 1>lot of wind. Yes, obvious, that's one of the odd

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<v Speaker 1>things about it. Yeah, I know, it's it's it really

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<v Speaker 1>does make it challenging. I mean your point, your point

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<v Speaker 1>is extremely valid. I mean, because the electricity you generate,

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<v Speaker 1>you're likely not going to be transporting that huge distances, right,

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<v Speaker 1>It's not like the uh, the Mojave Desert is going

0:12:16.880 --> 0:12:20.240
<v Speaker 1>to generate all the electricity for everybody on the Eastern seaboard.

0:12:20.280 --> 0:12:23.160
<v Speaker 1>That doesn't That doesn't really make any sense. So uh,

0:12:23.200 --> 0:12:26.000
<v Speaker 1>these are That's another limitation that we have to talk about.

0:12:26.480 --> 0:12:27.880
<v Speaker 1>But that was one of those things that I thought

0:12:27.880 --> 0:12:31.600
<v Speaker 1>was kind of interesting, this idea of this this tower system. Uh,

0:12:31.760 --> 0:12:34.360
<v Speaker 1>it's really more like a a proof of concept right now.

0:12:34.520 --> 0:12:37.160
<v Speaker 1>It's not like something has been widely rolled out. You

0:12:37.200 --> 0:12:41.000
<v Speaker 1>can go to their website and check out the information there.

0:12:41.040 --> 0:12:44.480
<v Speaker 1>They have lots of of little videos and things. The

0:12:44.559 --> 0:12:47.000
<v Speaker 1>solar Wind Energy Tower is what I'm talking about, So

0:12:47.040 --> 0:12:50.040
<v Speaker 1>go check that out and you can see exactly, you know,

0:12:50.080 --> 0:12:52.280
<v Speaker 1>like little animations on how this is supposed to work.

0:12:52.840 --> 0:12:55.880
<v Speaker 1>But another one is kind of the you know, the

0:12:55.960 --> 0:12:58.120
<v Speaker 1>idea of if you go to those higher altitudes, you

0:12:58.120 --> 0:13:01.920
<v Speaker 1>can harness uh those steady winds, but even three feet

0:13:01.960 --> 0:13:05.480
<v Speaker 1>may not be high enough. And yet you don't want

0:13:05.480 --> 0:13:09.320
<v Speaker 1>to build towers that are going way up into the sky.

0:13:09.480 --> 0:13:11.959
<v Speaker 1>It makes it very dangerous and not a lot of

0:13:11.960 --> 0:13:14.000
<v Speaker 1>people will be very thrilled with that. So what if

0:13:14.000 --> 0:13:17.080
<v Speaker 1>you could just fly something up at the right altitude

0:13:17.120 --> 0:13:20.960
<v Speaker 1>and then channel the electricity you generate back down. Yeah.

0:13:21.000 --> 0:13:24.240
<v Speaker 1>These these air drones, yeah that we talked about and

0:13:24.360 --> 0:13:27.400
<v Speaker 1>or you talked about. I wasn't there in the video episode. Yeah. Yeah,

0:13:27.480 --> 0:13:31.480
<v Speaker 1>there's one called the mccannie power Drone, which is kind

0:13:31.480 --> 0:13:33.560
<v Speaker 1>of interesting. All right, So imagine a wing, a flying

0:13:33.559 --> 0:13:38.280
<v Speaker 1>wing that's design. It doesn't quite look like that. It

0:13:38.280 --> 0:13:42.000
<v Speaker 1>looks almost like uh for the early sketches, look more

0:13:42.040 --> 0:13:44.800
<v Speaker 1>like a biplane almost, but it's it's supposed to be

0:13:44.800 --> 0:13:48.240
<v Speaker 1>a flying wing that is at least partially designed to

0:13:48.600 --> 0:13:52.599
<v Speaker 1>mimic a the end of a blade on one of

0:13:52.640 --> 0:13:56.840
<v Speaker 1>these turbines. So it has these little propellers on the

0:13:56.880 --> 0:14:00.120
<v Speaker 1>front that connect as both propellers and turbine blades. So

0:14:00.160 --> 0:14:02.080
<v Speaker 1>if you spend them one way, they're propellers, and then

0:14:02.080 --> 0:14:03.800
<v Speaker 1>if you let the wind blow them the other way

0:14:03.840 --> 0:14:05.560
<v Speaker 1>you turn off the power, you let the wind blow them.

0:14:05.559 --> 0:14:09.600
<v Speaker 1>They can actually turn a direct generator uh and generate electricity. Uh.

0:14:10.559 --> 0:14:13.560
<v Speaker 1>This is all playing into the fact that all of these,

0:14:13.600 --> 0:14:16.960
<v Speaker 1>all of these turbines, the air foils are designed to

0:14:16.960 --> 0:14:19.560
<v Speaker 1>create lift the same way that an airplane would um

0:14:19.600 --> 0:14:21.840
<v Speaker 1>in order to take off. And you know that that's

0:14:21.920 --> 0:14:25.800
<v Speaker 1>just creating a an area of pressure differential between the

0:14:26.080 --> 0:14:28.640
<v Speaker 1>top and the bottom, or I guess top and bottom

0:14:28.680 --> 0:14:31.960
<v Speaker 1>doesn't really apply necessarily to vertical blades, but yes, you're

0:14:31.960 --> 0:14:34.120
<v Speaker 1>creating a low pressure system that's going to end up

0:14:35.160 --> 0:14:37.600
<v Speaker 1>turning this. Yeah, creating that, creating that force of turning,

0:14:37.640 --> 0:14:40.880
<v Speaker 1>because otherwise if you if you didn't angle it just right,

0:14:40.920 --> 0:14:43.680
<v Speaker 1>then you wouldn't get that that rotational force out of it.

0:14:44.040 --> 0:14:46.440
<v Speaker 1>So the way this one works is imagine that you've

0:14:46.400 --> 0:14:48.800
<v Speaker 1>got a little pedestal and on that pestle, you have

0:14:48.880 --> 0:14:51.120
<v Speaker 1>this this drone thing that looks like a biplane with

0:14:51.160 --> 0:14:53.640
<v Speaker 1>several little propellers in the front of it. Uh the

0:14:53.720 --> 0:14:56.640
<v Speaker 1>wind at the right elevation, which would be between two

0:14:56.760 --> 0:14:59.600
<v Speaker 1>hundred fifty to six hundred meters that's about a hundred

0:14:59.600 --> 0:15:03.600
<v Speaker 1>to nineteen fifty feet somewhere around that range. Let's say

0:15:03.600 --> 0:15:07.240
<v Speaker 1>that the wind is perfect, so the pedestal would tilt back,

0:15:08.280 --> 0:15:11.760
<v Speaker 1>putting the aircraft into launch positions. So now the little

0:15:11.760 --> 0:15:15.440
<v Speaker 1>propellers are facing essentially straight up, they start spinning. It

0:15:15.800 --> 0:15:19.120
<v Speaker 1>creates the left the powers being channeled through a tether.

0:15:19.440 --> 0:15:22.040
<v Speaker 1>So there's a tether on a ground station that's also

0:15:22.080 --> 0:15:24.800
<v Speaker 1>attached to this little aircraft. Now the aircraft doesn't have

0:15:24.840 --> 0:15:26.560
<v Speaker 1>to have batteries, it doesn't have to have fuel because

0:15:26.560 --> 0:15:28.880
<v Speaker 1>it's getting all of its electricity through that tether. That

0:15:28.920 --> 0:15:32.400
<v Speaker 1>means that the aircraft itself is incredibly light. So then

0:15:32.440 --> 0:15:34.480
<v Speaker 1>we'll take off until it gets to the right altitude,

0:15:34.480 --> 0:15:37.840
<v Speaker 1>the tether will become taut and it will then tilt

0:15:37.920 --> 0:15:41.000
<v Speaker 1>into the wind and fly in a kind of wacky

0:15:41.960 --> 0:15:45.120
<v Speaker 1>well almost like well circular formation that more or less

0:15:45.600 --> 0:15:48.960
<v Speaker 1>mimics the pathway that a turbine blade would go through,

0:15:49.320 --> 0:15:52.600
<v Speaker 1>and uh, it would do this harnessing the wind power.

0:15:52.800 --> 0:15:55.360
<v Speaker 1>The wind would be blowing. Those little propellers of now

0:15:55.440 --> 0:15:59.080
<v Speaker 1>are turbine blades, and they don't have to go through

0:15:59.720 --> 0:16:03.160
<v Speaker 1>uh a mainshaft gearbox kind of thing. They have a

0:16:03.240 --> 0:16:06.080
<v Speaker 1>direct Uh they just have a little tiny magnets there.

0:16:06.080 --> 0:16:09.280
<v Speaker 1>They have a direct generator right there on the aircraft itself,

0:16:09.280 --> 0:16:12.400
<v Speaker 1>which reduces the complexity and size of the aircraft. And

0:16:12.440 --> 0:16:15.040
<v Speaker 1>then all the electricity goes back down through the tether

0:16:15.360 --> 0:16:17.640
<v Speaker 1>to the ground station, which is pretty cool. Now. So

0:16:17.720 --> 0:16:20.400
<v Speaker 1>that means you can actually harness the air that's at

0:16:20.440 --> 0:16:23.440
<v Speaker 1>a higher altitude without building a huge tower. Uh. It

0:16:23.480 --> 0:16:26.760
<v Speaker 1>takes up less space, It takes up less materials to

0:16:26.800 --> 0:16:31.040
<v Speaker 1>build it. According to the website, Uh, the typical aircraft

0:16:31.080 --> 0:16:34.400
<v Speaker 1>would cost fifty of a traditional turbine, so you have

0:16:34.560 --> 0:16:38.200
<v Speaker 1>cost savings from that's on that side of things. And um,

0:16:38.240 --> 0:16:41.200
<v Speaker 1>it was it's such an interesting idea that a very

0:16:41.280 --> 0:16:44.640
<v Speaker 1>large company took interest in it and decided to help

0:16:44.680 --> 0:16:47.000
<v Speaker 1>them out, but to the tune of acquiring the company,

0:16:47.240 --> 0:16:50.040
<v Speaker 1>So that would be Google. That is true. Google in

0:16:50.120 --> 0:16:53.840
<v Speaker 1>May of purchased mccani Power and now it is part

0:16:53.880 --> 0:16:56.840
<v Speaker 1>of Google X, which is their division where they really

0:16:56.840 --> 0:17:01.840
<v Speaker 1>look into environmentally friendly ways of generating electricity, both because

0:17:01.920 --> 0:17:05.000
<v Speaker 1>you know, Google kind of has this mission to um

0:17:05.160 --> 0:17:09.240
<v Speaker 1>to really help help just the environment in general, but

0:17:09.359 --> 0:17:13.280
<v Speaker 1>also how can they provide electricity to their massive data

0:17:13.320 --> 0:17:17.000
<v Speaker 1>centers in a way that's you know, environmentally responsible and

0:17:17.040 --> 0:17:21.760
<v Speaker 1>also economically feasible. You know. So, and they just generally

0:17:21.760 --> 0:17:24.840
<v Speaker 1>seem to be into making the future happen. Yeah, yeah,

0:17:24.840 --> 0:17:26.960
<v Speaker 1>they're they're kind of yeah, they well, and they're definitely

0:17:27.000 --> 0:17:30.600
<v Speaker 1>not afraid of trying things, even if those things never

0:17:31.000 --> 0:17:36.760
<v Speaker 1>really out. So there there are people who are skeptical

0:17:37.080 --> 0:17:40.440
<v Speaker 1>that this approach and the other air based ones I'm

0:17:40.440 --> 0:17:43.120
<v Speaker 1>about to talk about are are going to work out,

0:17:43.160 --> 0:17:46.720
<v Speaker 1>but it's possible another one. Actually, I'll go ahead and

0:17:46.720 --> 0:17:50.000
<v Speaker 1>and pair two of these together. There's one called ampis

0:17:50.520 --> 0:17:53.360
<v Speaker 1>and one called windlift. Both of these use a very

0:17:53.440 --> 0:17:59.119
<v Speaker 1>similar method to generate electricity. So these are two gliding

0:17:59.640 --> 0:18:01.800
<v Speaker 1>type aircraft. One of them is more like a kite

0:18:01.920 --> 0:18:04.160
<v Speaker 1>that's wind left, and the other one looks more like

0:18:04.840 --> 0:18:07.400
<v Speaker 1>it looks kind of similar to the mccannie power one,

0:18:07.720 --> 0:18:12.840
<v Speaker 1>but in each case these are uh designed to fly

0:18:13.040 --> 0:18:16.800
<v Speaker 1>up into the air to glide it at these altitudes,

0:18:17.280 --> 0:18:19.920
<v Speaker 1>and the way they generate electricity is not by turning

0:18:19.960 --> 0:18:25.199
<v Speaker 1>little turbines. The tether itself ends up allowing them to

0:18:25.359 --> 0:18:30.000
<v Speaker 1>have a ground paced generator, and pulling the tether ends

0:18:30.080 --> 0:18:33.480
<v Speaker 1>up creating the the kinetic energy you need to generate

0:18:33.480 --> 0:18:36.280
<v Speaker 1>the electricity on the ground. So instead of generating the

0:18:36.320 --> 0:18:38.280
<v Speaker 1>electricity in the air and sending it down, it's like,

0:18:38.320 --> 0:18:40.480
<v Speaker 1>you know, kind of like if you have this is a

0:18:40.440 --> 0:18:43.399
<v Speaker 1>a totally different model here, but let's say you need

0:18:43.440 --> 0:18:46.119
<v Speaker 1>to start your motor on your gag on your your lawnmower,

0:18:46.640 --> 0:18:49.360
<v Speaker 1>getting the sky to start your lawnmower. Yeah, it's kind

0:18:49.400 --> 0:18:51.359
<v Speaker 1>of like that, except instead of a motor. We're talking

0:18:51.400 --> 0:18:54.840
<v Speaker 1>about a generator, but yes, similar, similar idea, and both

0:18:54.880 --> 0:18:56.760
<v Speaker 1>of them are designed to do that. So the way

0:18:56.760 --> 0:18:59.080
<v Speaker 1>it works is that you let the wind pull the

0:18:59.400 --> 0:19:03.399
<v Speaker 1>the the aircraft out to the maximum length of the tether,

0:19:03.800 --> 0:19:08.080
<v Speaker 1>and then you then start to have the aircraft dive down.

0:19:08.400 --> 0:19:11.200
<v Speaker 1>And then you gently taken the slack of the tether,

0:19:11.640 --> 0:19:15.800
<v Speaker 1>which will actually consume some of the electricity that you've generated,

0:19:15.840 --> 0:19:18.520
<v Speaker 1>but hopefully a much smaller amount than the overall amount

0:19:18.560 --> 0:19:20.720
<v Speaker 1>you've generated, and you let it go back out again,

0:19:20.760 --> 0:19:23.400
<v Speaker 1>generating more electricity, and you do that over and over

0:19:23.400 --> 0:19:25.600
<v Speaker 1>and over again. What I'm thinking is that really we

0:19:25.600 --> 0:19:28.400
<v Speaker 1>can capitalize on children's ability to play with kites if

0:19:28.440 --> 0:19:31.360
<v Speaker 1>we just if we just send an army of children

0:19:31.520 --> 0:19:38.160
<v Speaker 1>out with attached to generators. I'm just saying, here's here's

0:19:38.200 --> 0:19:42.320
<v Speaker 1>how I say, forget the kites. If this power is

0:19:42.359 --> 0:19:45.800
<v Speaker 1>generated by pulling, you know, pulling a cord attached to

0:19:45.800 --> 0:19:48.600
<v Speaker 1>a generator. Just attached the cord directly to the kids

0:19:48.600 --> 0:19:51.040
<v Speaker 1>and have them run around there. You got it. That's it.

0:19:51.240 --> 0:19:54.000
<v Speaker 1>Take the kites out of it. Energy problem solved, you guys,

0:19:54.040 --> 0:19:57.879
<v Speaker 1>Good work, right, We we solve two problems. Kids and

0:19:57.920 --> 0:20:02.040
<v Speaker 1>our electricity crisis. No. So so moving on, there are

0:20:02.040 --> 0:20:04.359
<v Speaker 1>two more air based ones I want to talk about.

0:20:04.359 --> 0:20:08.240
<v Speaker 1>They're very similar in that these are two lighter than

0:20:08.359 --> 0:20:13.760
<v Speaker 1>air solutions. So there's one that's the majorin power, which

0:20:13.800 --> 0:20:16.960
<v Speaker 1>is a helium based one where it's they have a

0:20:18.280 --> 0:20:25.680
<v Speaker 1>gadget called MARS, which is their inflatable helium balloon generator thing.

0:20:25.760 --> 0:20:30.160
<v Speaker 1>Think about like a giant inflatable turbine. So it's it's

0:20:30.240 --> 0:20:31.840
<v Speaker 1>kind of tricky to think about, all right, So think

0:20:31.840 --> 0:20:35.400
<v Speaker 1>of like a big balloon. All right, it's round dish, uh,

0:20:35.440 --> 0:20:38.760
<v Speaker 1>and you've got on either side of the balloon, along

0:20:38.760 --> 0:20:42.280
<v Speaker 1>its horizontal axis, you've got the little generators that are

0:20:42.280 --> 0:20:44.600
<v Speaker 1>hooked up to a tether that go down to the ground.

0:20:45.880 --> 0:20:49.000
<v Speaker 1>And uh, if you were to look along the edge

0:20:49.000 --> 0:20:51.320
<v Speaker 1>of the balloon like a if you were to cut

0:20:51.359 --> 0:20:54.160
<v Speaker 1>the balloon in half vertically, instead of cutting it in half,

0:20:54.200 --> 0:20:57.399
<v Speaker 1>along that slice, you've got little ridges where the wind

0:20:57.440 --> 0:21:00.000
<v Speaker 1>can catch. So if the wind catches the balloon there,

0:21:00.080 --> 0:21:03.600
<v Speaker 1>it makes the balloon turn along that horizontal axis. So

0:21:03.640 --> 0:21:07.480
<v Speaker 1>the entire balloon is like a giant inflatable turbine. You

0:21:07.560 --> 0:21:10.439
<v Speaker 1>put that up into the right altitude you let the

0:21:10.440 --> 0:21:13.160
<v Speaker 1>wind turn this balloon in the air, that in turn

0:21:13.200 --> 0:21:16.680
<v Speaker 1>allows the generators to generate electricity. You send that back

0:21:16.680 --> 0:21:20.240
<v Speaker 1>down to the ground. The other one is the al Terris,

0:21:20.760 --> 0:21:29.920
<v Speaker 1>which is a donut shaped balloon. Yeah favorite silly word, right, yeah, exactly.

0:21:30.280 --> 0:21:33.040
<v Speaker 1>Um is so you can imagine the sort of donut

0:21:33.040 --> 0:21:36.040
<v Speaker 1>shape this this balloon shell. In the center where the

0:21:36.080 --> 0:21:39.400
<v Speaker 1>hole is, that's where you have a turbine mounted there.

0:21:39.440 --> 0:21:44.360
<v Speaker 1>It's got uh some uh some some mounting um rods

0:21:44.560 --> 0:21:47.760
<v Speaker 1>that hold it in place from the center of this

0:21:47.960 --> 0:21:51.080
<v Speaker 1>donut hole, and that you can float up to the

0:21:51.200 --> 0:21:53.639
<v Speaker 1>right altitude and then wind will blow the turbine blades

0:21:53.720 --> 0:21:56.280
<v Speaker 1>just as it would if it were supported on a stand,

0:21:56.320 --> 0:21:58.480
<v Speaker 1>as opposed to being suspended in the middle of this

0:21:58.520 --> 0:22:03.840
<v Speaker 1>giant helium balloon. And uh all of these are interesting ideas.

0:22:03.960 --> 0:22:08.400
<v Speaker 1>They've all been shown off in various prototype stages. Uh.

0:22:08.520 --> 0:22:12.560
<v Speaker 1>We don't have any real like wide uh rollout of

0:22:12.640 --> 0:22:17.280
<v Speaker 1>any of these yet, but they all seem at least feasible.

0:22:17.680 --> 0:22:20.200
<v Speaker 1>I don't know how plausible it is to have them

0:22:20.240 --> 0:22:25.640
<v Speaker 1>as uh as generating meaningful amounts of power, but it's

0:22:25.800 --> 0:22:28.520
<v Speaker 1>interesting to see the innovation and I hope that it

0:22:28.640 --> 0:22:33.080
<v Speaker 1>leads to practical application. Oh, certainly, yeah, no, based on

0:22:33.440 --> 0:22:35.600
<v Speaker 1>I mean because some of the some of the problems

0:22:35.600 --> 0:22:38.480
<v Speaker 1>that people have with wind turbines are are the fact

0:22:38.480 --> 0:22:42.399
<v Speaker 1>that they that they are potentially changing the environment that

0:22:42.400 --> 0:22:44.840
<v Speaker 1>they're in. Sure. Yeah, let's talk about some of the

0:22:44.840 --> 0:22:48.800
<v Speaker 1>pros and cons of of wind turbines and wind power. Alright,

0:22:48.840 --> 0:22:52.840
<v Speaker 1>so I mean, okay, uh, smaller greenhouse gas emission, smaller

0:22:52.880 --> 0:22:58.200
<v Speaker 1>carbon footprint. Right, Oh yeah, absolutely, that's actually okay. Well,

0:22:58.280 --> 0:23:02.639
<v Speaker 1>so here's one thing it's that people have started to

0:23:02.680 --> 0:23:06.720
<v Speaker 1>realize is helpful. UM Because obviously, when a wind turbine

0:23:06.760 --> 0:23:10.960
<v Speaker 1>is turning, it's not burning any any carbon based thing,

0:23:11.000 --> 0:23:14.800
<v Speaker 1>it's not releasing any greenhouse gases doing that. Right, Some

0:23:14.800 --> 0:23:17.680
<v Speaker 1>some vertical access wind turbines, UM do need a little

0:23:17.680 --> 0:23:20.760
<v Speaker 1>bit of startup juice. But but for the most part, Yeah,

0:23:20.760 --> 0:23:25.600
<v Speaker 1>but it's not like running a car and just a spilling.

0:23:25.720 --> 0:23:32.439
<v Speaker 1>But the production, the implementation um, all power sources do

0:23:32.600 --> 0:23:36.639
<v Speaker 1>have some kind of greenhouse gas emission UM. And so

0:23:36.760 --> 0:23:39.280
<v Speaker 1>one thing that's important to look at is the life

0:23:39.280 --> 0:23:44.120
<v Speaker 1>cycle analysis of a kilowatt hour produced by any given

0:23:44.359 --> 0:23:48.800
<v Speaker 1>type of energy. So how does wind power stack up

0:23:49.560 --> 0:23:52.880
<v Speaker 1>from you know this cradle to grave analysis, Well, according

0:23:52.920 --> 0:23:57.520
<v Speaker 1>to a report I found UM it was reprinted by

0:23:57.520 --> 0:24:04.600
<v Speaker 1>the National Renewable Energy Laboratory, Thank nice, thank you, that's

0:24:04.640 --> 0:24:08.720
<v Speaker 1>funded by the Department of Energy, and they offered an

0:24:08.760 --> 0:24:13.080
<v Speaker 1>overall l c A report that found wind, both offshore

0:24:13.119 --> 0:24:16.680
<v Speaker 1>and land based together produced about eleven grams of c

0:24:16.880 --> 0:24:21.359
<v Speaker 1>O two equivalent per kilowatt hour of electricity. That's compared

0:24:21.440 --> 0:24:26.520
<v Speaker 1>to about a thousand grams for coal, so significantly a

0:24:26.600 --> 0:24:31.560
<v Speaker 1>bunch more than yea more than two, yeah, are not

0:24:31.600 --> 0:24:35.440
<v Speaker 1>more than two more less than two yes, So it's

0:24:35.600 --> 0:24:39.560
<v Speaker 1>uh so yeah, like compared to fossil fuel burning. The

0:24:39.640 --> 0:24:43.080
<v Speaker 1>overall life cycle analysis says wind is a whole lot

0:24:43.119 --> 0:24:48.000
<v Speaker 1>better in terms of greenhouse gas eractions. It's um generally

0:24:48.280 --> 0:24:54.639
<v Speaker 1>considered pretty comparable to other renewables like like solar or hydroelectric, right, so,

0:24:54.720 --> 0:24:56.560
<v Speaker 1>and that's that's another key is that we're talking about

0:24:56.600 --> 0:25:00.280
<v Speaker 1>renewable energy source. It's not like it's not like something

0:25:00.320 --> 0:25:03.399
<v Speaker 1>that we could feasibly run out of. Although, as we

0:25:03.400 --> 0:25:06.560
<v Speaker 1>were saying before we started this podcast, there is always

0:25:06.600 --> 0:25:10.679
<v Speaker 1>the chance that climate change over time could shift where

0:25:10.680 --> 0:25:13.320
<v Speaker 1>the windiest spots are. So if you're talking about some

0:25:13.359 --> 0:25:18.040
<v Speaker 1>of the more permanent wind farms, that could potentially maybe

0:25:18.080 --> 0:25:20.320
<v Speaker 1>and it may not be for a really long time,

0:25:20.720 --> 0:25:23.639
<v Speaker 1>but it could potentially change how effective they are, just

0:25:23.760 --> 0:25:25.560
<v Speaker 1>whether or not they get as much wind as they

0:25:25.600 --> 0:25:29.040
<v Speaker 1>did when you first built them. Yeah, that's true. Wind

0:25:29.119 --> 0:25:31.520
<v Speaker 1>is not going away, but it might be going somewhere,

0:25:31.600 --> 0:25:34.800
<v Speaker 1>meaning that weather patterns changing, especially due to something like

0:25:34.920 --> 0:25:38.240
<v Speaker 1>climate change, could say, move a jet stream from one

0:25:38.240 --> 0:25:41.439
<v Speaker 1>place to another. Right, There's also some evidence that that

0:25:41.600 --> 0:25:46.200
<v Speaker 1>wind farms themselves could be causing local weather changes. What say,

0:25:46.240 --> 0:25:48.720
<v Speaker 1>what No, There was a study published in Nature Climate

0:25:48.760 --> 0:25:52.439
<v Speaker 1>Change in and this was taking satellite data from from

0:25:52.560 --> 0:25:56.160
<v Speaker 1>NASA's aquand Terrace satellites, and it found that the land

0:25:56.200 --> 0:25:59.560
<v Speaker 1>surface temperature around four Texas wind farms had warmed at

0:25:59.560 --> 0:26:02.439
<v Speaker 1>a rate point seven two degrees celsius, which is about

0:26:02.440 --> 0:26:05.879
<v Speaker 1>one point three degrees fahrenheit over over the course of

0:26:05.880 --> 0:26:09.160
<v Speaker 1>about ten years of data. That's a that's a significant warming,

0:26:09.280 --> 0:26:10.680
<v Speaker 1>which is which is a bunch Yeah, if you guys

0:26:10.720 --> 0:26:12.880
<v Speaker 1>listen to our climate change episode, I mean that's that's

0:26:13.080 --> 0:26:17.000
<v Speaker 1>that's significant. That's bunch um. And they think that what's

0:26:17.000 --> 0:26:20.800
<v Speaker 1>going on here is that the turbines are mixing that

0:26:20.880 --> 0:26:23.679
<v Speaker 1>hot and cool air, especially at night, they're they're pulling

0:26:23.720 --> 0:26:25.840
<v Speaker 1>warm air that's risen during the day back down to

0:26:25.880 --> 0:26:29.119
<v Speaker 1>the ground and causing this warming and and that you know,

0:26:29.160 --> 0:26:30.879
<v Speaker 1>they don't know what's going to happen with that, and

0:26:30.960 --> 0:26:33.679
<v Speaker 1>so no one really knows what effect this could possibly have.

0:26:33.920 --> 0:26:36.840
<v Speaker 1>I mean, you know, not only on whether or not

0:26:37.000 --> 0:26:39.919
<v Speaker 1>the wind pattern is going to change, but obviously on

0:26:40.080 --> 0:26:42.960
<v Speaker 1>the environment around these wind farms. And there are other

0:26:43.480 --> 0:26:48.080
<v Speaker 1>environmental concerns as well. For example, I've often heard concerns

0:26:48.160 --> 0:26:53.600
<v Speaker 1>about wind farms and the health of the local wildlife,

0:26:53.960 --> 0:26:56.760
<v Speaker 1>specifically bats and birds. Birds and bats, Yeah did did you?

0:26:56.880 --> 0:26:59.280
<v Speaker 1>Did you look into this one, Joe? You're you're giving

0:26:59.280 --> 0:27:01.199
<v Speaker 1>me a blank look of fear. Yeah, well, I know,

0:27:01.359 --> 0:27:04.119
<v Speaker 1>I don't know about birds, but I think but with bat's,

0:27:04.400 --> 0:27:06.840
<v Speaker 1>one of the theories is that, Okay, so they've got

0:27:06.880 --> 0:27:10.160
<v Speaker 1>all these dead bats around wind farms, and and it's

0:27:10.200 --> 0:27:12.359
<v Speaker 1>not that they're getting caught up in the turbines or

0:27:12.400 --> 0:27:15.680
<v Speaker 1>something like that. There's a theory that the low pressure

0:27:15.720 --> 0:27:20.240
<v Speaker 1>area is created by the mixing agency of of of

0:27:20.440 --> 0:27:24.399
<v Speaker 1>that wind um. Bat lungs are very sensitive and so

0:27:24.480 --> 0:27:27.600
<v Speaker 1>when they enter very suddenly a pocket of low pressure air.

0:27:27.920 --> 0:27:30.560
<v Speaker 1>They could be swelling and expanding so much that they

0:27:30.640 --> 0:27:34.160
<v Speaker 1>burst blood vessels and kind of spontaneously just just drop

0:27:36.160 --> 0:27:39.080
<v Speaker 1>beyond that. I know that a lot of wind farms

0:27:39.080 --> 0:27:42.560
<v Speaker 1>tend to generate sounds that are well outside the frequency

0:27:42.600 --> 0:27:45.120
<v Speaker 1>of human hearing, but I imagine that that for some

0:27:45.240 --> 0:27:48.280
<v Speaker 1>animals might be somewhat distressing as well. And for a

0:27:48.440 --> 0:27:51.560
<v Speaker 1>sound yes, um, and this this is a big part

0:27:51.640 --> 0:27:55.280
<v Speaker 1>of what is referred to as wind turbine syndrome, which

0:27:55.680 --> 0:27:59.080
<v Speaker 1>is not okay. It has never been proved or disproved

0:27:59.119 --> 0:28:01.840
<v Speaker 1>in a laboratory anywhere. It was named by a pediatrician,

0:28:02.160 --> 0:28:05.600
<v Speaker 1>Dr Nina pear Point, whose husband happens to be an

0:28:05.600 --> 0:28:10.359
<v Speaker 1>anti wind activist, and whose study involved a small sample

0:28:10.440 --> 0:28:14.080
<v Speaker 1>of phone interviews with no controls or peer reviewing involved.

0:28:14.880 --> 0:28:18.080
<v Speaker 1>UM so but but but but lots of people have

0:28:18.200 --> 0:28:22.879
<v Speaker 1>reported UM kind of colloquially from living around wind farms.

0:28:23.080 --> 0:28:26.240
<v Speaker 1>UM all kinds of symptoms, from headaches to sleep problems,

0:28:26.720 --> 0:28:29.879
<v Speaker 1>night terrors and learning disabilities and children ringing in the ears,

0:28:29.960 --> 0:28:34.119
<v Speaker 1>mood problems, concentration, memory problems, and UH issues with like

0:28:34.200 --> 0:28:37.560
<v Speaker 1>with like dizziness and nausea. So and I would say,

0:28:37.600 --> 0:28:40.240
<v Speaker 1>I mean, my my first inclination here is to say

0:28:40.280 --> 0:28:45.880
<v Speaker 1>that people are uh are identifying symptoms and then are

0:28:45.960 --> 0:28:48.680
<v Speaker 1>going in search of a problem. That that would be

0:28:48.760 --> 0:28:52.080
<v Speaker 1>my that's my inclination. I'm not saying that that's what's happening,

0:28:52.120 --> 0:28:54.040
<v Speaker 1>but that's that's kind of the feeling to get simply

0:28:54.080 --> 0:28:57.080
<v Speaker 1>because we've seen this sort of thing happen in other

0:28:58.040 --> 0:29:02.600
<v Speaker 1>areas before, things like living near power lines or being

0:29:03.160 --> 0:29:06.800
<v Speaker 1>really sensitive to WiFi that whenever we put this up

0:29:06.840 --> 0:29:10.240
<v Speaker 1>to any kind of double blind test, the the supposed

0:29:10.880 --> 0:29:14.760
<v Speaker 1>effects seem to disappear. Now this has not been put

0:29:14.800 --> 0:29:18.160
<v Speaker 1>to that, and because the infrasound, there is at least

0:29:18.640 --> 0:29:23.640
<v Speaker 1>a uh, maybe not plausible, but a possible explanation that

0:29:23.720 --> 0:29:26.640
<v Speaker 1>it could it could very well be contributing to some

0:29:26.920 --> 0:29:30.400
<v Speaker 1>effects that we don't fully understand. So it's, you know,

0:29:30.520 --> 0:29:32.520
<v Speaker 1>one of those things where we definitely need someone to

0:29:32.560 --> 0:29:35.000
<v Speaker 1>take a look at it from a very scientific point

0:29:35.000 --> 0:29:37.480
<v Speaker 1>of view and find out if there really is an

0:29:37.520 --> 0:29:41.560
<v Speaker 1>actual effect here, because that could be the case. I'm skeptical,

0:29:41.880 --> 0:29:44.840
<v Speaker 1>but it doesn't mean that it's impossible. Certainly, there have

0:29:44.960 --> 0:29:49.080
<v Speaker 1>been laboratory studies that have confirmed that infrasound has an

0:29:49.080 --> 0:29:52.840
<v Speaker 1>effect on human people. I mean, but biologically speaking, there

0:29:52.920 --> 0:29:55.600
<v Speaker 1>there aren't a lot of things recorded. When when you

0:29:55.640 --> 0:29:58.200
<v Speaker 1>get intense enough infrasound for long enough, you can have

0:29:58.240 --> 0:30:00.760
<v Speaker 1>stuff like hearing loss. We know that from people working

0:30:00.760 --> 0:30:03.480
<v Speaker 1>in factories, for example, But in these are modern times,

0:30:03.480 --> 0:30:06.840
<v Speaker 1>we're surrounded by infrasound. It's it's not like it's nowhere,

0:30:06.920 --> 0:30:11.240
<v Speaker 1>and and basically the primary effect is annoyance, which clinically speaking,

0:30:11.320 --> 0:30:14.160
<v Speaker 1>is is a mix of sensitivity to a noise and

0:30:14.520 --> 0:30:18.480
<v Speaker 1>anxiety about your sensitivity to the noise, which which kind

0:30:18.480 --> 0:30:21.520
<v Speaker 1>of conflates into something that can that can cause things

0:30:21.520 --> 0:30:23.440
<v Speaker 1>like chronic sleep loss which has a lot of the

0:30:23.480 --> 0:30:26.280
<v Speaker 1>symptoms that are reported, and wind turbine syndrome. So, I mean,

0:30:26.360 --> 0:30:30.520
<v Speaker 1>so you're you're you're talking about minor body body vibration um,

0:30:30.560 --> 0:30:33.840
<v Speaker 1>you know, increased sensitivity to and and a lack of

0:30:33.880 --> 0:30:37.680
<v Speaker 1>coping with a continual noise um, which can lead to

0:30:37.720 --> 0:30:41.600
<v Speaker 1>other psychological stuff like lower work performance and increased stress. Right,

0:30:41.640 --> 0:30:44.240
<v Speaker 1>and then you have the addition of any other symptoms

0:30:44.280 --> 0:30:47.320
<v Speaker 1>you might be suffering from completely unrelated sources which you

0:30:47.360 --> 0:30:51.200
<v Speaker 1>attribute then to which goes into that anxiety exactly. Yeah,

0:30:51.240 --> 0:30:53.760
<v Speaker 1>then you have the escalation of anxiety problems, and so

0:30:53.840 --> 0:30:56.320
<v Speaker 1>it just becomes a big issue. Is and we honestly

0:30:56.320 --> 0:31:00.040
<v Speaker 1>we don't know. Again, like I said, uh, what of

0:31:00.160 --> 0:31:04.120
<v Speaker 1>any extent the wind farms contribute to this sort of stuff.

0:31:04.520 --> 0:31:06.840
<v Speaker 1>There are people who have gone so far as to say, yes,

0:31:06.880 --> 0:31:09.880
<v Speaker 1>this is what is causing all these issues, but we

0:31:09.920 --> 0:31:12.400
<v Speaker 1>don't have any actual scientific evidence of that. I And

0:31:12.600 --> 0:31:15.360
<v Speaker 1>like I said, I'm pretty skeptical that they're as rough

0:31:15.440 --> 0:31:18.200
<v Speaker 1>as as they've been made out to be. Uh. Seems

0:31:18.240 --> 0:31:19.880
<v Speaker 1>like the kind of thing that it would be fairly

0:31:19.920 --> 0:31:23.440
<v Speaker 1>easy to design a very good scientific test. Oh, sure,

0:31:23.520 --> 0:31:26.320
<v Speaker 1>it would be very easy. And and record. I mean,

0:31:26.360 --> 0:31:29.200
<v Speaker 1>you can certainly record the vibration of wind farms. And

0:31:29.240 --> 0:31:33.520
<v Speaker 1>there there are technologies that are being research and implemented

0:31:33.560 --> 0:31:38.000
<v Speaker 1>into dampening the vibration of of of sound and equipment

0:31:38.080 --> 0:31:40.920
<v Speaker 1>around wind farms. Um you know from from from pads

0:31:41.040 --> 0:31:44.520
<v Speaker 1>that that dampened the structure vibration to um like counter

0:31:44.600 --> 0:31:46.920
<v Speaker 1>vibrations to cancel out things that are being created by

0:31:46.920 --> 0:31:50.240
<v Speaker 1>the turbines. Got you. That's kind of interesting. So there

0:31:50.240 --> 0:31:53.240
<v Speaker 1>are other some other issues with wind turbines obviously they're

0:31:53.280 --> 0:31:56.280
<v Speaker 1>one of them. Is the whole concept of intermittency, just

0:31:56.400 --> 0:31:58.080
<v Speaker 1>same issue that you have with a lot of other

0:31:58.080 --> 0:32:01.160
<v Speaker 1>renewable sources like solar energy, which is that it's not

0:32:01.200 --> 0:32:04.440
<v Speaker 1>always windy, just like it's not always sunny except in Philadelphia.

0:32:04.840 --> 0:32:08.720
<v Speaker 1>UM So you've got this issue where if it's not

0:32:08.760 --> 0:32:10.360
<v Speaker 1>if the wind is not always blowing, then you're never

0:32:10.440 --> 0:32:13.840
<v Speaker 1>going to be producing electricity at full capacity. So remember

0:32:13.840 --> 0:32:16.760
<v Speaker 1>earlier I said that wind turbines typically if you you

0:32:16.840 --> 0:32:20.320
<v Speaker 1>hear like, oh well, it generates three kilowatts, that's based

0:32:20.360 --> 0:32:24.719
<v Speaker 1>on it operating at full capacity for as long as

0:32:24.760 --> 0:32:27.120
<v Speaker 1>it's upbring life is, which tends to be a couple

0:32:27.120 --> 0:32:30.880
<v Speaker 1>of decades twenty to thirty years in general. Um So

0:32:31.760 --> 0:32:34.480
<v Speaker 1>that's great if it were operating at full capacity all

0:32:34.480 --> 0:32:37.200
<v Speaker 1>the time, but it's not. In fact, most of them

0:32:37.200 --> 0:32:40.680
<v Speaker 1>are operating it around twenty capacity. Um if you are

0:32:40.720 --> 0:32:45.120
<v Speaker 1>able to build them off shore where winds are more consistent,

0:32:45.560 --> 0:32:47.360
<v Speaker 1>you might be able to get that up to about

0:32:48.440 --> 0:32:51.200
<v Speaker 1>but that's still guess I mean compared to solar panels,

0:32:51.240 --> 0:32:53.360
<v Speaker 1>you're doing pretty good there well, And even then you're

0:32:53.360 --> 0:32:56.680
<v Speaker 1>talking about it's of the time it's operational it's not

0:32:56.720 --> 0:32:59.200
<v Speaker 1>even not saying it's forty percent efficiency in the sense

0:32:59.240 --> 0:33:03.400
<v Speaker 1>of it's converting the wind into energy, which is what

0:33:03.440 --> 0:33:05.640
<v Speaker 1>we're talking about with solar energy. Is like, you know,

0:33:05.680 --> 0:33:08.160
<v Speaker 1>out of the of solar energy that's hitting a solar

0:33:08.160 --> 0:33:14.000
<v Speaker 1>panel on a really good day, you're talking about Yeah, yeah,

0:33:14.000 --> 0:33:16.600
<v Speaker 1>if you're talking about a really good technology, you're talking

0:33:17.680 --> 0:33:19.640
<v Speaker 1>in the lab. You might be able to boost that

0:33:20.240 --> 0:33:23.200
<v Speaker 1>just below fift but that's in the lab, which, as

0:33:23.200 --> 0:33:25.080
<v Speaker 1>we all know, most of the solar panels not in

0:33:25.120 --> 0:33:28.600
<v Speaker 1>the lab. Um. So, yeah, intermittency is a problem, and

0:33:28.640 --> 0:33:31.680
<v Speaker 1>efficiency is a problem. Uh And the amount of power

0:33:31.720 --> 0:33:34.320
<v Speaker 1>they can provide that all depends again on the the

0:33:34.400 --> 0:33:38.320
<v Speaker 1>design of the solar solar panel, the wind turbine and

0:33:38.520 --> 0:33:42.400
<v Speaker 1>uh like some of them could generate enough power to

0:33:42.640 --> 0:33:45.840
<v Speaker 1>supply six homes on a single wind turbine, which is

0:33:45.880 --> 0:33:49.080
<v Speaker 1>pretty interesting. If you've got a wind farm of significant size,

0:33:49.440 --> 0:33:53.600
<v Speaker 1>you could definitely support a small to medium sized community,

0:33:53.880 --> 0:33:55.920
<v Speaker 1>which is not a bad thing at all, I mean,

0:33:56.000 --> 0:33:58.960
<v Speaker 1>but it's still you know, it's it's it's small potatoes

0:33:58.960 --> 0:34:01.320
<v Speaker 1>when you compare it to the overall population of a

0:34:01.360 --> 0:34:04.800
<v Speaker 1>country as large as say the United States. Clearly wind

0:34:04.920 --> 0:34:08.080
<v Speaker 1>energy at least in the implementations that we have right now.

0:34:08.120 --> 0:34:11.799
<v Speaker 1>And I would argue, even in the case that we

0:34:11.840 --> 0:34:14.239
<v Speaker 1>are able to create these new and improved type of

0:34:14.280 --> 0:34:17.160
<v Speaker 1>wind farms, I don't think we're gonna say that wind

0:34:17.239 --> 0:34:20.600
<v Speaker 1>energy is going to become the patch that's going to

0:34:20.680 --> 0:34:24.200
<v Speaker 1>replace carbon based UH power systems right now, but it

0:34:24.239 --> 0:34:27.960
<v Speaker 1>can certainly offset them. Yeah. As of I think for

0:34:28.040 --> 0:34:31.320
<v Speaker 1>the end of twenty eleven about three of all US

0:34:31.480 --> 0:34:35.640
<v Speaker 1>power was coming from wind farms, So you know, room

0:34:35.680 --> 0:34:38.960
<v Speaker 1>to improve, Yes, certainly, that's more than I would guess.

0:34:39.560 --> 0:34:42.360
<v Speaker 1>There's there's some There are a lot of surveys that

0:34:42.400 --> 0:34:47.240
<v Speaker 1>talk or reports that talk about the amazing growth of

0:34:47.239 --> 0:34:49.960
<v Speaker 1>of the wind power industry, but you have to remember

0:34:50.440 --> 0:34:55.640
<v Speaker 1>that when you have so few comparatively speaking, UH, even

0:34:55.680 --> 0:34:58.319
<v Speaker 1>doubling in size doesn't mean that it's a lot of

0:34:58.360 --> 0:35:00.680
<v Speaker 1>times right Like if I had three wind farms and

0:35:00.680 --> 0:35:03.800
<v Speaker 1>now I've got six wind farms, I experienced percent growth,

0:35:04.120 --> 0:35:07.719
<v Speaker 1>but but it doesn't you know, that doesn't translate into

0:35:07.760 --> 0:35:10.920
<v Speaker 1>an overwhelming amount of electricity in the long run. There

0:35:10.960 --> 0:35:13.600
<v Speaker 1>are a lot of people who have brought up the

0:35:13.680 --> 0:35:19.160
<v Speaker 1>economic problems of wind farms. Specifically, they are pretty expensive

0:35:19.200 --> 0:35:22.279
<v Speaker 1>to build, and they can be expensive to continue to

0:35:22.360 --> 0:35:24.879
<v Speaker 1>have them working in proper order. I mean, depending upon

0:35:25.160 --> 0:35:27.640
<v Speaker 1>who it was that made the parts, it may be

0:35:28.360 --> 0:35:30.600
<v Speaker 1>very difficult to keep them in working order. And if

0:35:30.800 --> 0:35:33.880
<v Speaker 1>if the company that made those parts goes out of business,

0:35:33.920 --> 0:35:36.520
<v Speaker 1>then you have to figure out how to repair things

0:35:36.560 --> 0:35:40.040
<v Speaker 1>that break down over time. Uh. And I think I

0:35:40.080 --> 0:35:41.800
<v Speaker 1>think there are a lot of parts in the world

0:35:42.680 --> 0:35:45.760
<v Speaker 1>they are kind of burnt out on wind power because

0:35:45.840 --> 0:35:48.480
<v Speaker 1>in those early days in the nineteen eighties, when these

0:35:48.840 --> 0:35:51.040
<v Speaker 1>these wind farms were popping up all over the place

0:35:51.040 --> 0:35:53.960
<v Speaker 1>because a lot of governments were giving major subsidies, were

0:35:54.000 --> 0:35:56.200
<v Speaker 1>also having a big oil crisis around the world. Then

0:35:56.400 --> 0:35:58.560
<v Speaker 1>exactly we had an oil crisis, so there was a

0:35:58.719 --> 0:36:02.440
<v Speaker 1>huge incentive to get off of oil as much as possible. Uh.

0:36:02.480 --> 0:36:04.920
<v Speaker 1>And then we had the government subsidies that were very

0:36:05.040 --> 0:36:07.879
<v Speaker 1>very much attractive to investors who thought they could make

0:36:08.080 --> 0:36:11.680
<v Speaker 1>huge amounts of money back by investing in wind farms. Uh. It.

0:36:12.239 --> 0:36:14.840
<v Speaker 1>The overall result was that not all the wind farms

0:36:14.880 --> 0:36:17.839
<v Speaker 1>that went up were particularly well built. Uh. Not all

0:36:17.880 --> 0:36:19.840
<v Speaker 1>of them were able to be maintained. Because once the

0:36:19.880 --> 0:36:23.000
<v Speaker 1>subsidies started to drift away, the there was kind of

0:36:23.040 --> 0:36:25.440
<v Speaker 1>like a bubble burst, right. It's kind of like seeing

0:36:25.520 --> 0:36:28.240
<v Speaker 1>you know this, if the government support starts to go away,

0:36:28.400 --> 0:36:33.600
<v Speaker 1>then the major source of actual money going into that that, uh,

0:36:33.640 --> 0:36:37.520
<v Speaker 1>that whole venture has gone away. It makes the thing

0:36:38.200 --> 0:36:41.360
<v Speaker 1>kind of dissipate, which is sad because obviously we do

0:36:41.440 --> 0:36:45.000
<v Speaker 1>have a need for clean, renewable energy. There's no denying that.

0:36:45.320 --> 0:36:47.360
<v Speaker 1>It's just that if you can't make the money work,

0:36:47.960 --> 0:36:51.840
<v Speaker 1>because the way the world works, that really means that

0:36:51.960 --> 0:36:54.120
<v Speaker 1>it's kind of uh, you know, it's it's sort of

0:36:54.120 --> 0:36:56.960
<v Speaker 1>a dream. I like to think that with companies like

0:36:57.000 --> 0:37:02.400
<v Speaker 1>Google behind wind power, we'll see some innovations that you know,

0:37:02.440 --> 0:37:04.400
<v Speaker 1>it might take a generation or two for them to

0:37:04.480 --> 0:37:07.040
<v Speaker 1>be implemented in a way that's uh, that's a pretty

0:37:07.080 --> 0:37:12.040
<v Speaker 1>wide form. Yeah, but I'm optimistic that that will happen.

0:37:12.680 --> 0:37:14.480
<v Speaker 1>I don't think it's going to happen as quickly as

0:37:14.520 --> 0:37:16.319
<v Speaker 1>most people would like. I think it's going to be

0:37:16.440 --> 0:37:19.239
<v Speaker 1>much more gradual than that. That is no reason to

0:37:19.280 --> 0:37:22.200
<v Speaker 1>give up. There's no reason to say if it's not

0:37:22.239 --> 0:37:26.320
<v Speaker 1>gonna happen tomorrow, then I don't want to work on this, right, Yeah, totally.

0:37:26.880 --> 0:37:28.680
<v Speaker 1>I really like some of these ideas that that you

0:37:28.840 --> 0:37:30.560
<v Speaker 1>that you brought in to tell us about today. Yeah,

0:37:30.560 --> 0:37:32.480
<v Speaker 1>there's some some pretty cool ones. I love the I

0:37:32.520 --> 0:37:34.759
<v Speaker 1>love the idea of the balloon based ones. I really

0:37:34.760 --> 0:37:36.759
<v Speaker 1>want to see a specifically, want to see the Mars

0:37:36.800 --> 0:37:39.040
<v Speaker 1>one in action, that giant balloon that's just turning in

0:37:39.080 --> 0:37:41.279
<v Speaker 1>the sky. I kind of want to see what that

0:37:41.320 --> 0:37:44.800
<v Speaker 1>looks like. So um yeah, if if anyone wants to

0:37:44.840 --> 0:37:46.680
<v Speaker 1>send me out and take a look at this in person,

0:37:46.960 --> 0:37:49.600
<v Speaker 1>I'll take I'll take that ticket, I'll go see it.

0:37:50.000 --> 0:37:52.200
<v Speaker 1>I don't mind. How can they get in touch with

0:37:52.239 --> 0:37:54.480
<v Speaker 1>us in order to send you you know what, We've

0:37:54.520 --> 0:37:57.799
<v Speaker 1>got a website and it is awesome. Joe, you do

0:37:57.880 --> 0:38:01.399
<v Speaker 1>a great job working on that website. Why thank you, sir.

0:38:01.640 --> 0:38:03.719
<v Speaker 1>You are welcome. That website, by the way, is f

0:38:03.960 --> 0:38:05.759
<v Speaker 1>wh thinking dot com. And if you would like to

0:38:05.800 --> 0:38:08.799
<v Speaker 1>see the hard work that Joe puts in, go to

0:38:08.880 --> 0:38:11.040
<v Speaker 1>f W Thinking dot com. That's where we have the videos,

0:38:11.120 --> 0:38:14.120
<v Speaker 1>the blog post podcast, we have links to articles. There's

0:38:14.160 --> 0:38:16.040
<v Speaker 1>a lot of really cool stuff in there. You can

0:38:16.080 --> 0:38:19.280
<v Speaker 1>also follow us on social media. We are on Twitter,

0:38:19.320 --> 0:38:21.719
<v Speaker 1>we're on Facebook. Look for f W Thinking at both

0:38:21.719 --> 0:38:24.080
<v Speaker 1>of those locations and we will talk to you again,

0:38:24.560 --> 0:38:31.120
<v Speaker 1>really sooner. For more on this topic and the future

0:38:31.120 --> 0:38:45.000
<v Speaker 1>of technology, visit forward thinking dot com, brought to you

0:38:45.040 --> 0:38:47.280
<v Speaker 1>by Toyota. Let's Go Places,