WEBVTT - TechStuff Classic: The History of Area 51 - Part One 0:00:04.400 --> 0:00:07.800 Welcome to Tech Stuff, a production from I Heart Radio. 0:00:12.080 --> 0:00:14.640 Hey there, and welcome to tech Stuff. I'm your host, 0:00:14.800 --> 0:00:17.960 Jonathan Strickland. I'm an executive producer with I Heart Radio 0:00:18.000 --> 0:00:20.279 and a lot of all things tech. Is time for 0:00:20.320 --> 0:00:25.600 a classic episode. This episode originally published back on September two, 0:00:25.640 --> 0:00:28.560 thousand fourteen. It is the first part of a multi 0:00:28.560 --> 0:00:31.000 part episode, so we're gonna be doing this over the 0:00:31.040 --> 0:00:34.519 next couple of Fridays. This is titled The History of 0:00:34.640 --> 0:00:40.400 Area fifty one, Part one. Area fifty one has gone through, obviously, 0:00:40.479 --> 0:00:46.720 cycles of infamy as being a top secret location where 0:00:47.520 --> 0:00:50.920 all sorts of stuff whereas going on. Some people just said, okay, 0:00:50.960 --> 0:00:54.400 well that's just it's it is a top secret facility, 0:00:54.480 --> 0:00:58.800 but it's one where regular terrestrial kind of aircraft are 0:00:58.840 --> 0:01:01.720 being tested. Others were saying, no, no, no no. Area fifty 0:01:01.720 --> 0:01:06.039 one is a secret base where alien technology exists and 0:01:06.200 --> 0:01:10.120 is being studied. Um, so let's listen in on the 0:01:10.160 --> 0:01:16.319 actual history of Area fifty one. So we decided I 0:01:16.360 --> 0:01:19.600 had talked about doing an episode about Area fifty one 0:01:19.840 --> 0:01:22.720 for years. Threatening might be the better word for it. 0:01:22.800 --> 0:01:25.039 I've been threatening to do an episode about Area fifty 0:01:25.080 --> 0:01:28.319 one for years. And just it was one of those 0:01:28.319 --> 0:01:30.440 things that we kept on putting off because it's a 0:01:30.480 --> 0:01:33.039 it's a big topic, and it's so big that Ben 0:01:33.080 --> 0:01:35.520 has been very generous with his time and he and 0:01:35.560 --> 0:01:39.520 I are going to be doing three episodes about this subject. 0:01:39.600 --> 0:01:43.240 So the first two episodes are a history of this 0:01:43.319 --> 0:01:47.680 facility and what what is actually documented as having happened there, 0:01:48.320 --> 0:01:51.680 the real history, mind you. The third episode will be 0:01:51.720 --> 0:01:54.520 the mythology of Area fifty one and some of the 0:01:55.200 --> 0:01:59.640 stories that have been attributed to that area, some of 0:01:59.680 --> 0:02:03.960 which border on um whacka doodle. I think it's a 0:02:04.000 --> 0:02:06.320 good way of putting in. Yeah. So yeah, So we're 0:02:06.320 --> 0:02:08.600 gonna cover all of that. So this episode we're gonna 0:02:08.639 --> 0:02:11.119 look at the history. And if you've heard the term 0:02:11.160 --> 0:02:15.120 Area fifty one, but you've only seen the depictions in 0:02:15.240 --> 0:02:19.360 pop culture, like in science fiction, you probably aren't entirely 0:02:19.440 --> 0:02:22.600 sure what it is now. First of all, Area fifty 0:02:22.639 --> 0:02:27.880 one isn't necessarily the the proper designation for this facility. 0:02:27.919 --> 0:02:32.080 It's the popular one, but really it's more often referred 0:02:32.080 --> 0:02:35.760 to within within UM documents official documentation as Groom Lake, 0:02:36.200 --> 0:02:39.600 and that's because there's a big dry lake bed in 0:02:39.680 --> 0:02:44.600 Nevada called Groom Lake. And this facility is built right 0:02:44.680 --> 0:02:48.560 on there, right, and it's built there for a reason. 0:02:48.840 --> 0:02:53.680 It's in Nevada. And you you've got some great notes 0:02:53.720 --> 0:02:57.520 on this all the way down to latitude and longitude. Yeah, 0:02:57.639 --> 0:02:59.600 because because this was the thing, you know, for years 0:02:59.600 --> 0:03:03.760 and years and years, the government would would very very 0:03:03.800 --> 0:03:08.200 carefully disavow any inform any knowledge of such a facility. 0:03:08.200 --> 0:03:10.919 They would say that, you know, nothing out there exists 0:03:11.040 --> 0:03:14.160 Groom Lake. What what is that? Why would you groom 0:03:14.160 --> 0:03:18.320 a late there's purpose a dry lake. You are speaking 0:03:18.360 --> 0:03:22.200 crazy talk. So yeah, but but one of the big 0:03:22.240 --> 0:03:25.520 reasons why it's out there is cause a dry lake 0:03:25.600 --> 0:03:29.760 bed in Nevada tends to be pretty darn flat. And 0:03:29.800 --> 0:03:33.799 if you want to say have a remote location where 0:03:33.960 --> 0:03:38.760 you can develop and test secret aircraft, and you need 0:03:38.800 --> 0:03:41.920 that space in order to take off and land the aircraft, 0:03:42.200 --> 0:03:46.880 a big dry lake beds a pretty good you know location, right, Yeah, 0:03:46.920 --> 0:03:52.320 it's fantastic. It's also far enough inland that the any 0:03:52.480 --> 0:03:56.760 foreign observers at the time of Groom Lakes construction would 0:03:56.840 --> 0:04:01.040 have a really difficult time observing anything happened there without 0:04:01.040 --> 0:04:03.720 being noticed. First absolutely, because at the time. This is 0:04:03.800 --> 0:04:06.920 before we get into satellites, right, So if you are 0:04:07.000 --> 0:04:10.640 trying to spy upon the construction of Area fifty one, 0:04:10.680 --> 0:04:13.720 it was built back in the fifties, then you essentially 0:04:13.720 --> 0:04:16.200 had to have a spy plane flying over the United States, 0:04:16.200 --> 0:04:20.160 which was a pretty risky thing to do. But meanwhile, 0:04:20.400 --> 0:04:22.920 that's exactly what was going on at Area fifty one 0:04:22.960 --> 0:04:26.160 was the development and testing of spy planes. So it's 0:04:26.200 --> 0:04:30.280 also known as Homey Airport. That's more. That's a more 0:04:30.279 --> 0:04:35.839 recent moniker over there. Um and it's uh, it's probably 0:04:36.240 --> 0:04:37.720 I have it in my notes. I have it as 0:04:37.760 --> 0:04:44.200 the most famous secret facility, worst kept. Yeah, it's the 0:04:44.240 --> 0:04:46.840 it's the secret facility everyone has heard of, which is 0:04:46.880 --> 0:04:49.080 kind of funny. But but they still managed to keep 0:04:49.120 --> 0:04:54.880 the actual activities within the the facility itself largely secret. 0:04:54.880 --> 0:04:57.919 There's been some reports that have come out. Some of 0:04:57.920 --> 0:05:00.480 them are credible, some of them are less so. But 0:05:00.640 --> 0:05:03.040 it's it's one of those things that that secrecy has 0:05:03.080 --> 0:05:06.880 also led to some serious issues that will get to 0:05:07.040 --> 0:05:09.400 more in the second part. Some things that have happened 0:05:09.839 --> 0:05:13.760 that that bring up the question of accountability, like how 0:05:13.800 --> 0:05:17.680 can you be accountable if you can't acknowledge the stuff 0:05:17.720 --> 0:05:21.360 that goes on at that site, right, And it's no 0:05:21.400 --> 0:05:25.320 wonder we know that whenever there is a lack of transparency, 0:05:25.839 --> 0:05:28.440 we find a plethora and I'm using that word correctly 0:05:28.800 --> 0:05:32.280 of speculation, absolutely, because we have to fill in the gaps. Right. Yeah, 0:05:32.320 --> 0:05:34.719 it's like a Hitchcock movie. The monster you don't see 0:05:34.920 --> 0:05:37.920 is always going to be worse than the monster on screen. Absolutely. 0:05:38.120 --> 0:05:41.000 But let's go to UH as as they say in 0:05:41.440 --> 0:05:44.200 Alice in Wonderland, let's start at the beginning. What do 0:05:44.200 --> 0:05:48.040 you say? Absolutely, So let's say that you are uh, 0:05:48.120 --> 0:05:51.919 you are a country that is involved in a little 0:05:51.960 --> 0:05:56.320 altercation called World War two, and as a result, you 0:05:56.360 --> 0:06:00.920 need to start building out your own military uh capabilities. Well, 0:06:01.000 --> 0:06:04.719 the United States was very much concerned with this and 0:06:04.800 --> 0:06:08.160 started to look for all sorts of places where they 0:06:08.160 --> 0:06:13.960 could build various airport, landing strips or military purposes. So 0:06:14.000 --> 0:06:16.080 they identified this one spot. And you mentioned I had 0:06:16.120 --> 0:06:18.000 the latitude and longitude. I'm gonna go ahead and give it. 0:06:18.480 --> 0:06:21.760 It's at thirty seven degrees fourteen minutes north latitude and 0:06:21.800 --> 0:06:26.120 one fifteen degrees forty eight minutes west longitude, which means 0:06:26.120 --> 0:06:29.320 it's right. It's within a hundred miles or hundred sixty 0:06:29.320 --> 0:06:32.880 one kilometers of Las Vegas. Uh, that's that's to the 0:06:32.920 --> 0:06:36.320 south of Every fifty one. And then the closest town 0:06:36.400 --> 0:06:39.039 is actually called Rachel, Nevada, and that's about twenty five 0:06:39.120 --> 0:06:43.680 miles or forty kilometers to the north. And uh, the 0:06:43.680 --> 0:06:46.880 the original purpose of the facility, which wasn't really even 0:06:46.880 --> 0:06:49.599 a facility, was just a couple of landing strips, like 0:06:49.680 --> 0:06:52.400 more like a little compound or small airport. Yeah, it 0:06:52.520 --> 0:06:57.680 was meant to be a training place for gunner schools, 0:06:57.720 --> 0:06:59.960 for for people who are actually working on on gun 0:07:00.000 --> 0:07:04.840 are positions within aircraft. So it's a training facility. And 0:07:05.040 --> 0:07:09.520 uh it was created by the Army Air Corps. Notice 0:07:10.000 --> 0:07:14.240 we didn't say Army Air Force. Yeah, this is before 0:07:14.280 --> 0:07:16.800 the Air Force was ever a thing. So yeah, it 0:07:16.840 --> 0:07:20.040 was Army Air Corps. Uh. They ended up using it, 0:07:20.080 --> 0:07:22.880 like I said, during the forties. By the end of it, 0:07:22.920 --> 0:07:27.080 they essentially they didn't formally decommission it because there wasn't 0:07:27.160 --> 0:07:29.600 really enough there to do that. Yeah, they just sort 0:07:29.600 --> 0:07:31.840 of stopped using it. Yeah, they're kind of like, well, 0:07:32.200 --> 0:07:34.800 the war is done, let's pack up and go and 0:07:34.800 --> 0:07:37.360 they left it kind of where it was. Now, that 0:07:37.440 --> 0:07:41.200 didn't mean that that was the only you only organization 0:07:41.240 --> 0:07:45.200 to use that area. Uh, there was something else that happened. 0:07:45.240 --> 0:07:48.680 So in the nineteen fifties, and this is jumping around 0:07:48.680 --> 0:07:50.480 a little bit because I don't actually have it right 0:07:50.480 --> 0:07:52.760 here in my notes, But in the nineteen fifties, two 0:07:52.760 --> 0:07:55.080 things are going on. One is you have the rise 0:07:55.080 --> 0:07:57.760 of the Cold War, which means that now we no 0:07:57.840 --> 0:08:02.040 longer have an active armed conflict going on, but we 0:08:02.120 --> 0:08:06.200 do have an escalating political conflict between the United States 0:08:06.520 --> 0:08:09.640 and the Soviet Union. And a bunch of spine, Yes, 0:08:09.680 --> 0:08:12.400 a bunch of spine, which would factor in heavily. We 0:08:12.480 --> 0:08:15.960 also had that same time on both sides. Both the 0:08:16.000 --> 0:08:19.480 United States and Soviet Union had an era of developing 0:08:19.560 --> 0:08:23.360 nuclear weapons. Right, so the part of the developing them 0:08:23.440 --> 0:08:25.840 was testing them to make sure that one they worked 0:08:25.840 --> 0:08:29.880 and two you you wanted you wanted other countries to 0:08:29.960 --> 0:08:33.400 know you had them without knowing specifically what your armament was, 0:08:33.720 --> 0:08:38.160 right and without you explicitly admitting that you had them either, right, 0:08:38.320 --> 0:08:42.760 it was tricky stuff. So the the waste lands of 0:08:42.880 --> 0:08:47.880 Nevada were often areas that uh, the Atomic Energy Commission 0:08:47.880 --> 0:08:50.200 would use to test this stuff. And there was this 0:08:50.559 --> 0:08:54.920 grid of land that they were using to test various 0:08:54.960 --> 0:08:58.600 types of atomic weapons, including some that were developed by 0:08:58.760 --> 0:09:02.960 Edward Teller. Joe McCormick and I recorded an episode about 0:09:03.040 --> 0:09:05.840 five technologies that were supposed to bring an into World 0:09:05.840 --> 0:09:09.439 War but didn't. And Edward Teller is the father of 0:09:09.440 --> 0:09:12.520 the hydrogen bombs, so several of his designs were tested 0:09:12.520 --> 0:09:15.600 in this area. That grid had thirty squares in it, 0:09:15.880 --> 0:09:18.240 and each square was called an area alright, so he 0:09:18.280 --> 0:09:22.520 had areas one through Area thirty. This particular parcel of 0:09:22.600 --> 0:09:27.080 land where the former Army Air Corps facility was was 0:09:27.120 --> 0:09:30.360 more or less adjacent to a square known as Area fifteen. 0:09:30.840 --> 0:09:34.720 So it's possible that the Area fifty one name comes 0:09:34.800 --> 0:09:38.240 from transposing the one in five and saying, all right, 0:09:38.240 --> 0:09:40.640 well that was Area fifteen. This is Area fifty one. 0:09:41.400 --> 0:09:43.960 It was not part of the grid originally. In fact, 0:09:43.960 --> 0:09:48.240 when when the facility was constructed, the grid had not expanded. 0:09:48.280 --> 0:09:51.400 It did expand gradually. I think it eventually had something 0:09:51.440 --> 0:09:54.280 like two squares to it. Testing increased and they built 0:09:54.280 --> 0:09:56.920 the fake towns and everything right right, yeah, And then 0:09:57.000 --> 0:10:00.520 you see Indiana Jones getting the refrigerator. Knew. I knew 0:10:00.600 --> 0:10:02.199 we were going to say that, Yeah, that's the new 0:10:02.280 --> 0:10:04.599 Jump the Shark, isn't it. Yeah. Yeah, there's Jump the 0:10:04.640 --> 0:10:07.960 Shark and Jump in the Fridge, which which did not 0:10:08.080 --> 0:10:10.440 work out for Punky Brewster but did work out for 0:10:10.480 --> 0:10:15.160 Indiana Jones. Um. So, I mean, while we've got this 0:10:15.280 --> 0:10:17.880 testing going on in this remote part of Nevada, which 0:10:18.160 --> 0:10:20.160 I don't know if you're aware of. This turns out 0:10:20.200 --> 0:10:22.680 that if you're testing lots of nuclear weapons in an area, 0:10:23.120 --> 0:10:25.400 it tends to be a deterrent for people to come 0:10:25.400 --> 0:10:29.520 snooping around. Oh that's what we did wrong. We weren't 0:10:29.520 --> 0:10:34.800 we weren't actively testing new devices around the office. Oh yeah, 0:10:35.040 --> 0:10:39.960 so yeah, that's true. There's a there's a profound effect. 0:10:40.040 --> 0:10:44.000 And I know it sounds like we're jokingly noting something 0:10:44.040 --> 0:10:48.959 that is glaringly obvious. But even at that time, before 0:10:49.040 --> 0:10:52.439 there had been the before we had had such extensive 0:10:52.480 --> 0:10:56.800 research on the effects of this sort of weaponry. Uh, 0:10:56.920 --> 0:10:59.640 everybody kind of saw the writing on the wall. Yeah. 0:11:00.240 --> 0:11:02.640 So at that same time, like you were saying, with 0:11:02.679 --> 0:11:04.520 all the spying going on, and there was a lot 0:11:04.559 --> 0:11:06.720 of it, we've we've done episodes on tech stuff about 0:11:06.720 --> 0:11:10.080 spy tech before, and we've even done episodes on specific 0:11:10.120 --> 0:11:13.040 spy planes, like the the YouTube plane being one of 0:11:13.080 --> 0:11:16.760 the most famous. There needed to be some way of 0:11:16.840 --> 0:11:20.760 developing this technology and testing it without people being aware 0:11:20.800 --> 0:11:24.000 of it, so that we can maintain that superiority of 0:11:24.320 --> 0:11:26.720 folks not knowing what we're we are and are not 0:11:26.840 --> 0:11:32.479 capable of doing so. That led to the Central Intelligence 0:11:32.559 --> 0:11:35.640 Agency trying to find a good spot for this. And 0:11:35.679 --> 0:11:37.800 you might say, wait, the c i A. Aren't they 0:11:37.800 --> 0:11:41.400 for an intelligence They are foreign intelligence. So these were 0:11:41.520 --> 0:11:44.040 going to be mostly spy plane spying on other places, 0:11:44.080 --> 0:11:46.839 not the United States. We have plenty of agencies that 0:11:46.880 --> 0:11:49.120 are here to spy on us, and it isn't the 0:11:49.200 --> 0:11:52.600 Air Force already involved. So that's what you would think, right, like, 0:11:52.720 --> 0:11:55.960 why why the CIA? Why not the Air Force? Well, 0:11:56.120 --> 0:11:59.680 it comes down to and been I know you've heard 0:11:59.720 --> 0:12:03.360 this to black budgets, right, Yeah, the idea that you 0:12:03.400 --> 0:12:07.640 need to have a budget that is impenetrable people. People 0:12:07.760 --> 0:12:10.480 approve them, but they cannot see what the budgets are 0:12:10.520 --> 0:12:14.559 actually for. And it's all under the umbrella of national security. 0:12:14.600 --> 0:12:17.160 And the reason that this exists now. I know these 0:12:17.200 --> 0:12:21.840 get a tough time nowadays, and and they should. There's 0:12:21.880 --> 0:12:25.560 a great argument for the transparency at this time. Just 0:12:25.640 --> 0:12:28.520 to be fair we have to play devil's advocate and 0:12:28.679 --> 0:12:32.760 say that the argument against transparency is, of course, during 0:12:32.800 --> 0:12:36.840 the Cold War, when people are trying to mask their capabilities, 0:12:37.920 --> 0:12:43.199 anyone with the right amount of subterfusion influence could find 0:12:43.760 --> 0:12:46.520 uh something that wasn't a black budget all the way 0:12:46.600 --> 0:12:50.640 down to individual components, the literal nuts and bolts. So 0:12:51.000 --> 0:12:53.920 at the time their argument will be that this is 0:12:54.040 --> 0:12:57.840 necessity and if you want something secret, you put it 0:12:57.960 --> 0:13:00.760 under At this time in America history, you put it 0:13:00.840 --> 0:13:04.000 under the CIA. Yeah. Yeah, because the Air Force would 0:13:04.040 --> 0:13:06.640 end up having a budget that was reviewable by Congress, 0:13:06.720 --> 0:13:09.000 right exactly. And so this would at least mean that 0:13:09.080 --> 0:13:13.000 everyone in Congress and plus all the congressional aids would 0:13:13.080 --> 0:13:15.760 have access to those budgets, which could mean that that's 0:13:15.760 --> 0:13:18.400 a security risk that that information could leak out and 0:13:18.440 --> 0:13:21.960 it would get into the hands of of of foreign 0:13:22.000 --> 0:13:26.680 agents that would end up having the advantage because now 0:13:26.760 --> 0:13:28.680 they know what we were capable of. By having it 0:13:28.720 --> 0:13:31.120 as a black budget, you take that out. It also 0:13:31.200 --> 0:13:33.600 means that again, you don't have that transparency and you 0:13:33.760 --> 0:13:37.680 leave the world wide open to just speculate on what's 0:13:37.720 --> 0:13:40.600 actually going on. So there's a there's another edge to 0:13:40.679 --> 0:13:43.960 that sword. So the CIA is in charge of this. 0:13:44.080 --> 0:13:46.000 They work with the Air Force, but I mean when 0:13:46.000 --> 0:13:49.520 we talk about testing these planes, it was CIA pilots 0:13:49.559 --> 0:13:52.200 that we're doing the testing, right, not Air Force pilots. 0:13:52.240 --> 0:13:55.719 It's very important distinct. So they were civilians who then 0:13:55.840 --> 0:14:00.720 got classification of top secret access through the c I A. 0:14:01.640 --> 0:14:04.720 I think I've talked about this before, way way back. 0:14:04.760 --> 0:14:06.720 But top secret, by the way, does not mean you 0:14:06.720 --> 0:14:10.240 automatically have access to everything that's classified top secret right 0:14:10.320 --> 0:14:13.640 spot on intelligence at that level is often what they 0:14:13.679 --> 0:14:17.760 call compartmentalized altely. Yeah, so you have access to one 0:14:17.880 --> 0:14:21.920 specific branch, but anything outside of that you don't. So 0:14:22.080 --> 0:14:24.360 you may be able to go to the very furthest 0:14:24.880 --> 0:14:27.360 lengths in that branch, but it doesn't mean you have 0:14:27.400 --> 0:14:29.720 access to everything. It doesn't mean, for instance, So then 0:14:30.000 --> 0:14:33.440 just to illustrate this, the c i A pilot let's 0:14:33.440 --> 0:14:35.840 call him Mr. Smith because that's not a sketchy name, 0:14:36.000 --> 0:14:39.040 that's perfect. Mr Smith might be They call it being 0:14:39.080 --> 0:14:42.040 read onto a program. So Mr Smith might be read 0:14:42.120 --> 0:14:45.480 onto a program for a particular plane, or even something 0:14:45.520 --> 0:14:48.680 as small as just a particular engine or design of 0:14:48.680 --> 0:14:53.240 a plane. Everything else about that is a mystery, and 0:14:53.400 --> 0:14:55.760 it is understood that he is not even supposed to 0:14:55.760 --> 0:14:58.760 pretend that he thought of asking. We're gonna take a 0:14:58.840 --> 0:15:01.640 quick break, but will be back to talk about more 0:15:01.760 --> 0:15:04.600 of the history of Area fifty one in just a moment. 0:15:12.160 --> 0:15:15.000 Everyone who was working at Area fifty one, whether you're 0:15:15.000 --> 0:15:17.400 a pilot or an engineer, you were only really allowed 0:15:17.440 --> 0:15:21.280 to know about whatever it was your specific project was 0:15:21.720 --> 0:15:24.400 was concerned with, right, yeah, Yeah, even if you're in 0:15:24.440 --> 0:15:28.400 the private industry, which also was involved with this. A 0:15:28.440 --> 0:15:30.920 couple of people are familiar with this story. You're probably 0:15:31.320 --> 0:15:35.680 waiting and they're saying, Jonathan Ben sure, the CIA, the 0:15:35.760 --> 0:15:38.520 Air Force, but why aren't you talking about the people 0:15:38.520 --> 0:15:41.520 who actually built the planes. So you're talking about Lockheed 0:15:41.880 --> 0:15:46.160 hold On one. So Lockheed is a military contractor among 0:15:46.200 --> 0:15:48.960 other things, but they do a lot of work with 0:15:49.000 --> 0:15:52.720 the United States military, and so Lockheed was going to 0:15:52.760 --> 0:15:56.480 be the company that was largely responsible for building the 0:15:56.520 --> 0:15:59.680 planes that we're going to be tested at Area fifty one. 0:16:00.240 --> 0:16:03.000 So when we get down to this point where the 0:16:03.080 --> 0:16:06.560 CIA is ready to find a site for this, they 0:16:06.600 --> 0:16:10.120 work with Lockeed And there is a designer at Lockeed 0:16:10.120 --> 0:16:16.920 who is absolutely famous in the spy world, Clarence Kelly Johnson. Yeah, 0:16:17.000 --> 0:16:21.600 it's you if you've heard some of the stories about 0:16:21.640 --> 0:16:24.640 this stuff. He's definitely famous in the spy world. But 0:16:24.880 --> 0:16:27.440 he is a I think we're a family show here, 0:16:27.480 --> 0:16:31.440 so I'll just say he is a gosh darn good designer. Absolutely. Yeah. 0:16:31.480 --> 0:16:34.120 As a matter of fact, he's the top dog at Lockey. 0:16:34.280 --> 0:16:38.880 Jonathan earlier mentioned the YouTube spy playing that is our 0:16:38.920 --> 0:16:44.760 boy Kelly. Yeah. He also ended up largely defining skunk 0:16:44.760 --> 0:16:47.080 Works at Lockeed, and we've done an episode on Tech 0:16:47.120 --> 0:16:50.560 Stuff about skunk Works as well. Skunk Works now is 0:16:50.600 --> 0:16:52.920 just a general term that a lot of companies used 0:16:52.920 --> 0:16:56.600 to describe their secret R and D projects that aren't 0:16:56.880 --> 0:17:00.160 aren't meant for public consumption. This is stuff that is 0:17:00.160 --> 0:17:03.680 going to end up becoming part of products maybe five 0:17:03.800 --> 0:17:07.000 or ten years down the line. But that was defined 0:17:07.160 --> 0:17:11.200 at Lockheed. That was the top secret development lab where 0:17:11.720 --> 0:17:14.560 anyone outside of that lab was not aware of what 0:17:14.640 --> 0:17:16.880 was going on, and even people within the lab may 0:17:16.880 --> 0:17:19.240 only be aware of very small parts of what is 0:17:19.280 --> 0:17:23.880 going on. So uh with you two and skunk Works. Obviously, 0:17:23.880 --> 0:17:27.000 he had already kind of developed this reputation of being 0:17:27.160 --> 0:17:29.400 the go to guy when it comes to this kind 0:17:29.400 --> 0:17:31.639 of thing. So the CIA consulted with him as well 0:17:31.680 --> 0:17:34.800 as some other military folks, and they started looking around. Now, 0:17:34.880 --> 0:17:37.960 Johnson had said that the facility needed to be remote 0:17:38.080 --> 0:17:41.280 enough to escape casual attention, so you couldn't have it 0:17:41.320 --> 0:17:45.480 close to any kind of metropolitan area or or settlement. Um, 0:17:45.520 --> 0:17:49.240 it also had to be close enough to a major 0:17:49.280 --> 0:17:52.080 city so that you could get supplies for all the 0:17:52.160 --> 0:17:54.600 stuff you need in order to do the testing, the 0:17:54.640 --> 0:17:57.159 building and and all of that kind of stuff. Now, 0:17:57.200 --> 0:18:00.400 a lot of these vehicles were not actually constructed at 0:18:00.440 --> 0:18:03.000 Area fifty one. They'd be built in another facility and 0:18:03.040 --> 0:18:06.000 then would be transported Area fifty one for all the testing. 0:18:06.720 --> 0:18:08.760 But even so, like you have to get all the 0:18:08.800 --> 0:18:11.200 food there, you have to you know, all the all 0:18:11.240 --> 0:18:13.560 the basic the fuel that you would need, you would 0:18:13.600 --> 0:18:16.000 have to have all of that shipped to Area fifty 0:18:16.080 --> 0:18:17.879 one in some way. So there were a lot of 0:18:17.880 --> 0:18:19.840 logistics involved, which meant that it had to be far 0:18:19.920 --> 0:18:22.439 enough away from a city to avoid uh notice, but 0:18:22.520 --> 0:18:24.640 not so far as to make it impossible to get 0:18:24.680 --> 0:18:28.320 stuff there. It had to be inconvenient but not inaccessible. 0:18:28.359 --> 0:18:31.879 There's a Goldilocks zone here, uh, sort of like in 0:18:32.600 --> 0:18:35.400 Star Trek where everybody's looking for an M class planet. 0:18:35.560 --> 0:18:38.080 That's a very good way of putting it. So as 0:18:38.119 --> 0:18:40.879 they were looking around, uh, there was a member on 0:18:41.040 --> 0:18:45.600 the search team named Colonel Osman Ritland who had actually 0:18:45.640 --> 0:18:49.120 trained at the gunnery school that had existed at Groom Lake, 0:18:49.760 --> 0:18:51.239 and so he said, hey, you know, there was this 0:18:51.320 --> 0:18:53.960 place that I had to work at when during World 0:18:54.000 --> 0:18:57.160 War Two that might be worth checking out. And so 0:18:57.200 --> 0:18:59.080 they ended up going there and as soon as Johnson 0:18:59.119 --> 0:19:01.359 saw it, he said that that was the perfect spot. 0:19:01.720 --> 0:19:03.440 It would mean that they would have to do obviously 0:19:03.440 --> 0:19:05.959 a lot of work to make it ready for it 0:19:06.000 --> 0:19:08.840 to actually be a test facility, but he said, this, 0:19:08.840 --> 0:19:11.680 this meets all the requirements I had in mind. So 0:19:11.720 --> 0:19:17.520 he called it Paradise Ranch, right, which, uh, you have 0:19:17.600 --> 0:19:20.400 a great note about this. Yeah, it says, uh, it's 0:19:20.400 --> 0:19:23.199 a little more attractive than quote site adjacent to a 0:19:23.240 --> 0:19:26.679 former nuclear test area end quote. Uh. In fact, it 0:19:26.720 --> 0:19:29.639 wasn't even former, it was a current nuclear test area. 0:19:29.680 --> 0:19:32.880 There were times when the Atomic Energy Commission in later 0:19:32.920 --> 0:19:37.080 the Nevada Test site ended up having to evacuate Area 0:19:37.119 --> 0:19:38.959 fifty one because they were going to be doing some 0:19:39.000 --> 0:19:42.640 tests and it's possible that wind could carry radioactive particles 0:19:42.640 --> 0:19:44.800 over towards the facility. I mean, you win some, you 0:19:44.800 --> 0:19:48.240 lose some, right, Yeah. So the other term you could 0:19:48.240 --> 0:19:52.560 have used is desolate hell whole, but that also not 0:19:52.720 --> 0:19:57.040 so attractive if you're trying to get uh, civilians interested 0:19:57.480 --> 0:20:02.280 in helping out. So they actually did employ civilians to 0:20:02.359 --> 0:20:07.359 help construct, right, Yeah, from us surrounding Las Vegas area 0:20:07.359 --> 0:20:10.560 and from Rachel, Nevada as well. Yeah, and it meant 0:20:10.640 --> 0:20:14.440 it meant that people had to pass some pretty stringent 0:20:14.520 --> 0:20:19.080 background checks and they had to sign silence oaths. And 0:20:19.320 --> 0:20:21.399 for the most part, people have been really good at 0:20:21.480 --> 0:20:23.160 keeping those oaths. I mean there's only been a few 0:20:23.160 --> 0:20:26.080 people who have ever talked about Area fifty one, which 0:20:26.080 --> 0:20:28.440 is pretty amazing because we talked about how it's really 0:20:28.440 --> 0:20:32.920 hard to keep secrets, right, especially in that that difficulty 0:20:33.000 --> 0:20:37.520 increases exponentially the more people involved with this secret. But 0:20:37.680 --> 0:20:40.200 in this in this part too, It's important for us 0:20:40.200 --> 0:20:43.080 to remember that even the people who had signed the 0:20:43.160 --> 0:20:48.120 secrets didn't really have that much access. They were they 0:20:48.119 --> 0:20:52.920 were limited by necessity, which meant that even first of all, 0:20:53.000 --> 0:20:56.720 if you were to communicate outside of area fifty one, 0:20:57.160 --> 0:21:00.240 it would very quickly become obvious who was talking because 0:21:00.240 --> 0:21:03.199 it would all be dependent upon what they knew. So 0:21:03.240 --> 0:21:05.199 if you were talking about stuff that you knew but 0:21:05.280 --> 0:21:08.320 you didn't know other things, that narrows down that list 0:21:08.320 --> 0:21:12.360 of suspects, and there could be some pretty serious penalties. 0:21:12.720 --> 0:21:16.439 We're talking like scary, scary penalties that could go against 0:21:16.440 --> 0:21:19.159 you if you were to spell the beans and those people. Also, 0:21:19.280 --> 0:21:21.239 this is a side note, but I think this is 0:21:21.359 --> 0:21:25.520 a illustrative of the kind of scrutiny that these folks 0:21:25.520 --> 0:21:29.679 were under. Afterwards. The I R s UH keeps a 0:21:29.960 --> 0:21:35.040 tab for on these people afterward to verify that they're 0:21:35.040 --> 0:21:39.520 not suddenly coming into inexplicable amounts of income, to make 0:21:39.560 --> 0:21:42.640 sure that they're not like secrets, right what even though 0:21:42.680 --> 0:21:44.800 if you I mean, even though, if you think about it, man, 0:21:44.840 --> 0:21:48.440 those secrets I'm air quoting so hard here, folks. Those 0:21:48.440 --> 0:21:52.159 secrets would be things like, um, I was paid to 0:21:52.840 --> 0:21:57.639 drive a truck from Rachel to this location drop off fuel. 0:21:58.080 --> 0:22:01.800 Right and and I did you know there were three gates? 0:22:01.800 --> 0:22:04.479 I got into one or something like that. Um, And 0:22:04.520 --> 0:22:06.800 that's you know, that's for sake of example. I don't 0:22:06.840 --> 0:22:10.000 know if there was a number of tiered gates. Please 0:22:10.960 --> 0:22:13.520 don't don't come after us. We have not been there, 0:22:13.600 --> 0:22:18.480 nor have we tried to look. Um. So, the during 0:22:18.520 --> 0:22:22.480 the lifetime of the the test site, which again bordered 0:22:22.640 --> 0:22:25.600 Area fifty one, it was pretty active. They did a 0:22:25.680 --> 0:22:29.000 hundred and five above ground explosions and more than eight 0:22:29.080 --> 0:22:33.320 hundred underground explosions. They would do their last test in 0:22:33.440 --> 0:22:36.199 nine two, So this was kind of a just a 0:22:36.320 --> 0:22:39.080 fact of life at Area fifty one, is that nuclear 0:22:39.160 --> 0:22:42.000 testing was going on. I mean several miles away. I 0:22:42.000 --> 0:22:44.040 don't want to give the implication that it was like 0:22:44.680 --> 0:22:47.880 just outside the gates, but it was certainly close enough 0:22:47.920 --> 0:22:53.320 for it to be a concerned Yeah. Because and also 0:22:53.359 --> 0:22:55.400 a lot of people are probably surprised to hear that 0:22:55.400 --> 0:23:00.720 that continued until nineteen two. So, you know, most people 0:23:00.760 --> 0:23:03.199 will place the end of the Cold War in the 0:23:03.320 --> 0:23:08.640 late eighties. But this doesn't mean that the testing would 0:23:08.680 --> 0:23:12.440 stop completely because just as a cold war has kind 0:23:12.440 --> 0:23:15.760 of a hazy conflict zone. It also has a hazy 0:23:15.760 --> 0:23:18.680 beginning and end, whereas we can trace World War Two 0:23:18.760 --> 0:23:22.840 with some concrete dates, right yeah, I mean, if nothing else, 0:23:22.880 --> 0:23:24.760