WEBVTT - Are we obsessed with goals? 0:00:00.320 --> 0:00:02.880 Brought to you by the reinvented two thousand twelve camera. 0:00:03.200 --> 0:00:07.440 It's ready. Are you welcome to you stuff you should 0:00:07.480 --> 0:00:16.239 know from House Stuff Works dot Com. Hey, and welcome 0:00:16.280 --> 0:00:18.880 to the podcast. I'm Josh Clark. With me is always 0:00:18.880 --> 0:00:22.439 this Charles W. Chuck Bryant, and he's here because he 0:00:22.560 --> 0:00:26.000 decided to be here and he met that goal. You're 0:00:26.000 --> 0:00:28.880 a successful human being, Chuck. I wake up every day 0:00:29.080 --> 0:00:31.319 and I set goals for myself. Do you like, just 0:00:31.400 --> 0:00:33.559 get out of bed, Get out of bed, take that 0:00:33.600 --> 0:00:39.000 shower takes from Josh. Good again, clean those armpits, Chuck. Done, 0:00:39.840 --> 0:00:44.280 good going, Chuck. You're a real go getter. Uh. Yes, 0:00:44.760 --> 0:00:47.440 I have a bit of an intro. Okay, slightly anecdotal. 0:00:47.520 --> 0:00:51.000 It's not necessarily newsy. Maybe this time last year it 0:00:51.040 --> 0:00:54.640 was Newsy. But um, Chuck, you heard of the occupy movement? 0:00:54.680 --> 0:00:57.160 Of course. Yeah, if you go down West Peachtree, you'll 0:00:57.160 --> 0:01:02.360 see like Babe fourteen stouthearted Peel's still there. Man. Yeah, 0:01:02.440 --> 0:01:07.119 hats off to him. Um, But the the whole occupied 0:01:07.200 --> 0:01:10.320 movement one of the big criticisms of it that I remember, 0:01:10.440 --> 0:01:13.679 and I think it's still floated pretty frequently because I 0:01:13.720 --> 0:01:16.320 was just discussing this with my aunt and Umi, right, 0:01:17.240 --> 0:01:19.920 and my aunts and old Lefty and um, she has 0:01:20.000 --> 0:01:23.880 like very pronounced ideas about the occupy movement, what a 0:01:23.920 --> 0:01:26.440 great thing it is and all that, right, Um and 0:01:26.560 --> 0:01:29.600 she she was saying, we were talking about whether or 0:01:29.640 --> 0:01:33.080 not a successful and one of the criticisms of the 0:01:33.200 --> 0:01:36.440 occupy movements that they didn't have any goals. They were 0:01:36.480 --> 0:01:41.600 goalless and so how could you ever think about being 0:01:41.640 --> 0:01:45.080 successful if there's no goals? Right, So my aunt was saying, well, no, 0:01:45.240 --> 0:01:47.880 they were successful in like spreading awareness that there's like 0:01:47.920 --> 0:01:51.480 a plutocracy and you know, there's this one percent and 0:01:51.480 --> 0:01:53.560 they're in charge. So they were successful like that. They 0:01:53.560 --> 0:01:56.040 didn't need a goal. And that's kind of part of 0:01:56.040 --> 0:01:59.160 the point. You We made the point that um we 0:02:00.840 --> 0:02:04.240 the Arab spring that it was based on all had goals. 0:02:04.320 --> 0:02:06.760 They had a stated goal and mostly it was getting 0:02:06.800 --> 0:02:08.919 this one person out of power. So there was a 0:02:08.960 --> 0:02:11.440 measure of success or failure. And most of the time 0:02:11.440 --> 0:02:13.600 it was a success, right, or at least there was 0:02:13.639 --> 0:02:18.799 an ongoing, continued goal. So when I said that, though, 0:02:18.800 --> 0:02:20.200 when I was like, well, you know, they didn't have 0:02:20.240 --> 0:02:22.240 any goals, I feel like such a shmell, like just 0:02:22.320 --> 0:02:26.239 a corporate like dude, It's like, well, they didn't have 0:02:26.240 --> 0:02:29.920 any goals, so they failed at it. And I'm curious, Like, 0:02:30.360 --> 0:02:32.520 I feel like we in this country are very much 0:02:32.560 --> 0:02:37.280 obsessed with goals and we are um, we equate success 0:02:37.960 --> 0:02:41.880 with goals, reaching your goals and not just here. No, 0:02:41.919 --> 0:02:46.480 but it seems like the West, the West. Okay, um, 0:02:46.760 --> 0:02:51.000 I think we should explore that. Okay, without any research whatsoever, 0:02:51.080 --> 0:02:53.800 let's just start talking right now. Well, I was, I was. 0:02:54.040 --> 0:02:56.360 It was interesting reading in this research because I was. 0:02:56.400 --> 0:02:58.519 I was kind of all over the place, Like part 0:02:58.560 --> 0:03:01.200 of me was like, because we're gonna talk about like 0:03:01.600 --> 0:03:04.200 sometimes goals are great, sometimes there's a downside to them, 0:03:04.240 --> 0:03:08.119 and here's sometimes you can achieve them, sometimes you won't. Um. 0:03:08.160 --> 0:03:11.079 I was vacillating all over the place with it. Emotionally, 0:03:11.160 --> 0:03:13.880 it was I was on a roller coaster. I was like, Man, 0:03:14.880 --> 0:03:17.320 goals aren't that great to set? Sometimes you should just 0:03:17.360 --> 0:03:23.080 be mindful and prideful about doing great. No, you can't 0:03:23.120 --> 0:03:25.600 be prideful if you're a religious type, because probably it 0:03:25.880 --> 0:03:28.080 is a sin. He wants that to do with the 0:03:28.080 --> 0:03:30.640 goals though, well, you're saying you have to be prideful. 0:03:31.080 --> 0:03:33.440 You can't be prideful. You're hands strong if you're religious. 0:03:33.560 --> 0:03:37.440 Right out of the gate, Okay, I'm talking about myself. Uh, 0:03:37.520 --> 0:03:40.440 And then other parts of me said, no, you know, 0:03:40.520 --> 0:03:42.560 goals are great, and so I think where I landed 0:03:42.680 --> 0:03:47.920 was sometimes goals are great. Sometimes there they shouldn't be around. Yeah. 0:03:47.960 --> 0:03:51.320 I guess that it probably is context specific and individual 0:03:51.400 --> 0:03:56.480 specific and all. Um. But at the same time, I 0:03:56.520 --> 0:03:59.120 think part of the problem is, like with this obsession, 0:03:59.200 --> 0:04:02.160 is that they're we try to figure out how to 0:04:02.200 --> 0:04:07.720 streamline things, whether it's achieving goals or whatever, and so 0:04:07.960 --> 0:04:09.880 we try to shove a one size fits all things 0:04:09.920 --> 0:04:12.040 down people's throats. And in this case with goals, it's 0:04:12.200 --> 0:04:15.320 set goals and achieve them or be unsuccessful. Yeah. And 0:04:15.360 --> 0:04:17.280 there's also sort of two parts to this which will 0:04:17.320 --> 0:04:22.720 be intermingled, which is um, personal goals and like corporate 0:04:23.080 --> 0:04:26.480 type goals. And it's interesting if you look up goals 0:04:26.480 --> 0:04:31.039 on the internet, Um, you gotta go a long way 0:04:31.160 --> 0:04:36.480 to get past financial advice. Almost everything is like financial goals. 0:04:36.520 --> 0:04:40.320 Financial goals. If you're twenty, you can think about retirement, yeah, 0:04:40.400 --> 0:04:43.320 stuff like that, or you run into that guy who's 0:04:43.360 --> 0:04:48.039 like go and for those of you who are like 0:04:48.080 --> 0:04:51.200 blinking in disbelief, Yes, we're talking about goals, g O 0:04:51.360 --> 0:04:54.080 A L S. And let's define what we're talking about. 0:04:54.240 --> 0:04:56.680 Everyone has an idea of goals, but we don't want 0:04:56.720 --> 0:05:02.760 it to get confused with um something like uh um drive, ambition, 0:05:03.520 --> 0:05:08.960 um intention. So say, Chuck, you are you're like, I 0:05:09.000 --> 0:05:11.920 want to I want to be a guitar player. That's 0:05:11.960 --> 0:05:14.400 an intention, right, Yeah, I want to be a good 0:05:14.400 --> 0:05:18.320 guitar player. Saying a good guitar player would be a goal. 0:05:18.360 --> 0:05:20.800 That wouldn't I guess, But you want to play guitar. Okay, 0:05:20.800 --> 0:05:23.440 we'll just say that's an intention saying I want to 0:05:23.480 --> 0:05:26.359 be you know, am, I want to be able. I 0:05:26.400 --> 0:05:30.440 want to be a performing quality guitar player within the 0:05:30.480 --> 0:05:33.680 next six months. That's a goal, right, that's a stated goal. 0:05:33.839 --> 0:05:36.000 Or I want to learn the solo for carry on 0:05:36.080 --> 0:05:39.400 my wayward Son by next Thursday night. You better man, 0:05:39.400 --> 0:05:42.720 you've got that show my kansascover band. You've been You've 0:05:42.760 --> 0:05:44.920 been talking a lot of smack. You better be able 0:05:44.920 --> 0:05:48.960 to deliver. Uh. My kansascover band is actually called wayward Son. 0:05:49.680 --> 0:05:52.920 Oh yeah, every Kansas cover band is called wayward son. Yeah, 0:05:52.960 --> 0:05:55.360 we have a club. Uh so where should we start? 0:05:55.360 --> 0:05:58.160 Should we start with the downside of goals? And then 0:05:58.200 --> 0:05:59.880 some of the more positives and like how to achieve 0:05:59.880 --> 0:06:02.760 the merder? Let's talk about goals and how to achieve them? 0:06:03.120 --> 0:06:05.000 There are this is There's been a tremendous amount of 0:06:05.040 --> 0:06:10.440 study since the seventies and eighties, especially in um organizational psychology. 0:06:10.839 --> 0:06:13.760 The field of psychology is to blame for a goal obsession. 0:06:13.800 --> 0:06:16.159 I guess a lot of people say, yeah, and especially 0:06:16.200 --> 0:06:18.680 in the seventies and eighties, not just starting there, but 0:06:18.880 --> 0:06:22.159 that was when people were way into that kind of thing. Yeah. Um, 0:06:22.200 --> 0:06:25.160 my family has this book, you know, the family bookshelf 0:06:26.040 --> 0:06:30.480 from like stuff like that, like what color is your parachute? Um, 0:06:30.560 --> 0:06:33.360 there's one that I still have never I've never been 0:06:33.400 --> 0:06:35.400 brave enough to crack it open because I don't want 0:06:35.440 --> 0:06:38.080 to like accidentally just get the snippet of information and 0:06:38.120 --> 0:06:41.919 I'm ruined as a creative person. But it's called, um, 0:06:42.120 --> 0:06:45.479 becoming a more creative person. You could tell it's like 0:06:45.520 --> 0:06:48.920 a goal oriented self help book to become more creative? 0:06:49.160 --> 0:06:51.440 Is this at your dad's house? Yeah, it's that my house. 0:06:51.440 --> 0:06:55.520 Now I've adopted it. Maybe it's like it's one of 0:06:55.520 --> 0:07:01.800 those have never opened it up. So, um, what I 0:07:01.880 --> 0:07:05.039 bring up psychology because there's a lot there's been a 0:07:05.080 --> 0:07:09.680 decent amount of study that under certain circumstances, you know, goals, 0:07:09.880 --> 0:07:14.120 setting goals can be helpful. Right. The problem is if 0:07:14.160 --> 0:07:15.880 you go to the internet or you get one of 0:07:15.880 --> 0:07:18.720 those self help books, or you start listening to self 0:07:18.720 --> 0:07:22.080 help gurus, you're gonna get um a lot of information 0:07:22.440 --> 0:07:26.040 and not all of it is good. Um. But of 0:07:26.080 --> 0:07:29.680 course all you can do is sort of study and 0:07:29.720 --> 0:07:32.560 ask questions on people who do reach their goals. Uh. 0:07:32.680 --> 0:07:34.880 So it's kind of hard to determine what is good advice. 0:07:35.480 --> 0:07:38.480 But um, I thought this one article in particular was 0:07:38.480 --> 0:07:41.120 pretty good because they listened out ten things, only about 0:07:41.160 --> 0:07:43.320 half of which were good advice. But you will find 0:07:43.680 --> 0:07:47.440 these ten things listed commonly and they are should we 0:07:47.480 --> 0:07:50.760 just go through them? Uh? Number one step by step plan. 0:07:51.760 --> 0:07:54.480 Make a step by step plan to motivate yourself by 0:07:54.520 --> 0:07:57.600 focusing on someone else who has achieved a similar goal, 0:07:58.360 --> 0:08:01.120 Like look at Josh with smoking and he lost a 0:08:01.160 --> 0:08:03.640 lot of weight, and think about me all the time 0:08:03.720 --> 0:08:07.040 all the time. Drive yourself mad. Number three, tell other 0:08:07.040 --> 0:08:09.320 people about your goal. You hear that a lot, so 0:08:09.400 --> 0:08:13.880 you're sort of publicly accountable. Um. Think about bad things 0:08:13.880 --> 0:08:15.760 that will happen if you do not achieve the goal. 0:08:16.760 --> 0:08:20.640 I think that's negative recently, Okay, go ahead. Number five. 0:08:20.760 --> 0:08:22.320 Talk about the good things that happened if you do 0:08:22.360 --> 0:08:26.280 achieve the goal. UM Number six. Suppress unhelpful or negative 0:08:26.320 --> 0:08:30.520 thoughts about your goal. Number seven. Reward yourself for making progress. 0:08:30.880 --> 0:08:33.920 Number eight. Rely on will power. Number nine record your progress. 0:08:34.280 --> 0:08:37.520 Number ten. Fantasize or visualize how great your life is 0:08:37.520 --> 0:08:39.439 going to be when you achieve that goal. So those 0:08:39.440 --> 0:08:42.520 are ten that probably the top ten techniques, according to 0:08:42.559 --> 0:08:46.280 a psychologist named Richard Wiseman, who wrote a book I 0:08:46.320 --> 0:08:48.720 believe in two thousand ten called fifty nine seconds about 0:08:48.760 --> 0:08:51.600 goal setting and goal achievement. Right, those are the top 0:08:51.640 --> 0:08:56.040 ten techniques cold from thousands of people. Do you want 0:08:56.040 --> 0:08:58.240 to give him the big surprise? The big twist to 0:08:58.280 --> 0:09:01.760 that list? That list has a twist to it, Chuck had. 0:09:02.160 --> 0:09:07.400 Half of them are proven to make goal achievement harder. 0:09:07.679 --> 0:09:11.439 That's right. Uh. The the even numbered ones were ones 0:09:11.480 --> 0:09:15.319 that people who try those techniques usually don't succeed it 0:09:15.559 --> 0:09:18.400 at meeting their goals. The odd number ones were proven 0:09:18.480 --> 0:09:24.680 techniques that UM that Wiseman found, uh, we're commonly used 0:09:24.720 --> 0:09:28.680 by people who set a goal and met it. And sadly, 0:09:28.679 --> 0:09:32.079 in his study of the thousands of participants who had 0:09:32.120 --> 0:09:36.440 like stated goals like quitting smoking, losing x amount of weight, 0:09:36.559 --> 0:09:39.640 whatever it was, UM, only ten percent of them met 0:09:39.679 --> 0:09:43.520 their goals. But of those ten percent, those odd numbered 0:09:44.080 --> 0:09:48.200 techniques were the ones that that were that proved successful. Right. 0:09:48.240 --> 0:09:50.000 And he gives on to point out that you can't 0:09:50.200 --> 0:09:54.520 prove that that caused It's one of those causation things. 0:09:54.520 --> 0:09:58.280 Correlated does not prove causations, right, So quickly again the 0:09:58.280 --> 0:10:00.439 odd number ones, these are ones that would help you 0:10:00.480 --> 0:10:05.000 out make the step by step plan um. And there's 0:10:05.040 --> 0:10:09.240 all kinds of articles on being concrete with your goals. Yeah, 0:10:09.320 --> 0:10:13.280 and also it breaks them down into um sub goals 0:10:13.480 --> 0:10:16.240 or something smaller in bite size. So like this big 0:10:16.240 --> 0:10:19.480 amorphous goal like becoming a good guitar player in six 0:10:19.520 --> 0:10:22.760 months becomes you know, I don't know anything about guitars, 0:10:22.800 --> 0:10:25.800 but learning this chord today and then this and when 0:10:25.800 --> 0:10:28.280 you put it all together and you've been keeping track 0:10:28.320 --> 0:10:32.360 and writing it down, it's it's it's controllable. Your control 0:10:32.400 --> 0:10:34.240 freak for doing this in the first place, and now 0:10:34.360 --> 0:10:38.320 you are able to graphically display that habit. That's right. Uh, 0:10:38.440 --> 0:10:41.160 so make the plan. Tell other people about your goal. 0:10:41.200 --> 0:10:43.360 They say that's a good thing to do. Um, think 0:10:43.360 --> 0:10:45.400 about the good things that will happen. But they say 0:10:45.400 --> 0:10:49.440 to draw the line at like fantasyland, right, don't do that. No, 0:10:50.000 --> 0:10:52.640 Like when once you find yourself bathing in a lake 0:10:52.679 --> 0:10:55.559 of chocolate, you've gone too far. And also, I want 0:10:55.600 --> 0:10:58.240 to say, um, telling other people about your goal. You know, 0:10:58.280 --> 0:11:01.240 there's like whole website set up like publicly shame you 0:11:02.000 --> 0:11:05.920 to keep you on track when you're sending when you're 0:11:05.920 --> 0:11:08.160 doing a goal. There's this guy I wish you could 0:11:08.200 --> 0:11:11.520 remember his name. He did. He He came up with 0:11:11.559 --> 0:11:15.040 basically the Twitter diet, where you tweet to your followers Okay, 0:11:15.040 --> 0:11:16.840 I'm gonna do this, and then every day you weigh 0:11:16.880 --> 0:11:19.480 yourself and you tweet the results, and then if you've 0:11:19.480 --> 0:11:22.240 gained a little weight, everybody on you and calls you 0:11:22.320 --> 0:11:27.040 a loser or whatever. Keeps you on your on on track, 0:11:27.280 --> 0:11:29.920 And apparently it's been proven to work. There's other ones 0:11:29.920 --> 0:11:34.319 where you you log in and you track your progress 0:11:34.320 --> 0:11:36.680 and as long as you're not a liar, it shows 0:11:36.720 --> 0:11:39.840 that it keeps you on track. Um for things like 0:11:39.880 --> 0:11:41.480 quinning smoke or something like that. If you go and 0:11:41.480 --> 0:11:43.920 say I had a cigarette today or whatever, this thing 0:11:43.960 --> 0:11:48.200 will actually deduct a certain amount from your bank account 0:11:48.520 --> 0:11:51.360 that's connected to it to pay paler and they just 0:11:51.360 --> 0:11:54.160 take your money, like say, every time I have a cigarette, 0:11:54.160 --> 0:11:56.240 I have to pay twenty bucks. And when you go 0:11:56.320 --> 0:11:58.679 on and and keep track, this thing just takes your 0:11:58.679 --> 0:12:00.800 money out of your account and it's been shown to work. 0:12:01.240 --> 0:12:05.280 And that interesting because people like money exactly. I love money, 0:12:05.520 --> 0:12:07.760 you know. I've thought about declaring something like on a 0:12:07.800 --> 0:12:09.839 weight loss plan to like the stuff you should know army, 0:12:09.880 --> 0:12:12.800 because that's a good They keep you honest for sure. Well, 0:12:12.840 --> 0:12:14.679 but they're too supportive on most people will be like, 0:12:14.720 --> 0:12:17.120 oh it's okay, Chuck, you had any layer, like, don't 0:12:17.160 --> 0:12:19.040 worry about it, we still love you. It's like, no 0:12:19.040 --> 0:12:22.040 one would hold my feet to the buyer. You think 0:12:23.800 --> 0:12:26.120 you know, you do pose a pretty good is I 0:12:26.160 --> 0:12:28.400 think you might be right. I mean people would be 0:12:28.480 --> 0:12:30.320 very encouraging, but I think they would like you know, 0:12:30.440 --> 0:12:32.440 I see, I see what you mean you need some 0:12:32.559 --> 0:12:36.520 sort of um huh, it's too bad that we don't 0:12:36.559 --> 0:12:41.760 have like, um, I don't know, like a fitness podcast 0:12:41.880 --> 0:12:46.400 or something like that. Those people really hold you to it, dude, 0:12:46.520 --> 0:12:49.559 give a shot. Oh, I don't know, give it. Give 0:12:49.600 --> 0:12:53.160 it a shot, America, Chuck. Chuck is going to need 0:12:53.160 --> 0:12:54.800 his feet held to the fire, and you're gonna do 0:12:54.840 --> 0:12:57.320 it well. On that note, though, what I'm doing now 0:12:57.480 --> 0:13:01.520 is I found that a poundage goal. It's just in 0:13:01.679 --> 0:13:04.640 getting on that scale is no good. So I'm working 0:13:04.679 --> 0:13:09.000 on like literally weekly in daily goals, Like I've got 0:13:09.000 --> 0:13:11.760 my little calendar up on my refrigerator and my little 0:13:11.800 --> 0:13:15.000 marker next to it, and I mark publicly in my 0:13:15.080 --> 0:13:17.360 household if I went to the gym that day, and 0:13:17.480 --> 0:13:19.760 the goal each week is, you know, four times a week, 0:13:20.280 --> 0:13:22.640 good for you, and the week said I don't go 0:13:22.679 --> 0:13:25.040 four times, it's I'm sitting there looking at it, and 0:13:25.080 --> 0:13:28.240 it's shaming. I think you mean and I are going 0:13:28.280 --> 0:13:30.680 to go in together and get Emily a riding crop 0:13:31.360 --> 0:13:34.720 to smack your thighs with. Every time you you don't get, 0:13:35.160 --> 0:13:37.720 you don't reach your daily goal. Yeah, the poundage goal 0:13:37.800 --> 0:13:39.520 just I had someone tell me He's like, don't get 0:13:39.520 --> 0:13:41.480 on a scale, just like, well, if you want a 0:13:41.520 --> 0:13:44.360 way to obsess, like there, you have it right there. 0:13:44.720 --> 0:13:47.400 But it also it works for some people. And exactly 0:13:47.480 --> 0:13:49.600 we're coming around right here, like if that makes sense 0:13:49.640 --> 0:13:52.800 to you and you have, then do that. But it 0:13:52.880 --> 0:13:54.760 works for some people. For other people it's just a 0:13:54.760 --> 0:13:58.760 little too much, okay, So quickly the remaining odd things 0:13:58.760 --> 0:14:02.319 that should help you reward your self for making progress, um. 0:14:02.440 --> 0:14:05.439 And that doesn't mean if you're dieting, I'm trying to 0:14:05.480 --> 0:14:07.760 lose weight. You reward yourself with like the hot fudge 0:14:07.760 --> 0:14:13.920 Sunday necessarily um, and then record your progress. And that 0:14:14.040 --> 0:14:18.600 all ties into the accountability and writing stuff down instead 0:14:18.640 --> 0:14:22.120 of just visualizing and thinking about things. They say to 0:14:22.160 --> 0:14:24.440 be really concrete, like write it down, look at it, 0:14:24.880 --> 0:14:27.360 make it physical and real, right, And that's why they 0:14:27.400 --> 0:14:31.480 think that goals work. When they work, is they take 0:14:31.520 --> 0:14:34.480 things out of the subjective and put them into the objective. 0:14:34.560 --> 0:14:38.280 So um. The there was a study from the seventies 0:14:38.320 --> 0:14:40.960 Bandur and Simon, And I can't remember Bandura's name, but 0:14:41.040 --> 0:14:43.200 his name is really familiar to me. He came up 0:14:43.200 --> 0:14:47.359 with something else. I guess it was habit formation. But um, 0:14:47.480 --> 0:14:51.600 they they figured out that. I guess they took a 0:14:51.600 --> 0:14:55.600 bunch of severely obese people and divided them into so 0:14:55.640 --> 0:14:57.680 the control group was told to just do their best 0:14:57.720 --> 0:15:02.160 at losing weight. The other group, um, we're told, like, 0:15:02.520 --> 0:15:04.680 you need to lose x number pounds by this weekend, 0:15:04.760 --> 0:15:07.400 x number pounds by this week. There they set goals, 0:15:08.240 --> 0:15:13.360 and um they lost something like twice, you know, twice 0:15:13.400 --> 0:15:15.720 as much. The people who said the goals lost twice 0:15:15.720 --> 0:15:17.760 as much of the people who were just told to 0:15:18.200 --> 0:15:22.440 do their best. And I think it's probably because it's 0:15:22.480 --> 0:15:25.240 just saying I have something to focus on, to pay attention, 0:15:25.280 --> 0:15:28.480 to quantify my progress, rather than you know, what is 0:15:28.560 --> 0:15:32.000 doing your best means? Well, there's ambiguity there because someone 0:15:32.080 --> 0:15:34.720 might said, well I did my best, and my best 0:15:34.760 --> 0:15:37.400 just isn't good enough. Well we'll get to that in 0:15:37.440 --> 0:15:41.120 a little bit, and that's that's absolutely correct. And then 0:15:41.120 --> 0:15:43.040 not not just with weight loss, I mean like people 0:15:43.280 --> 0:15:47.680 during this whole goal obsessed seventies and eighties, Um, there 0:15:47.800 --> 0:15:50.880 there were studies of how setting goals could reduce like 0:15:51.080 --> 0:15:55.880 accidents in the workplace, um, how they could reduce sick days. 0:15:55.920 --> 0:16:00.960 Like it became an obsession with companies, Yeah, to basically 0:16:01.000 --> 0:16:03.440 say like, hey, everybody set a goal and we're going 0:16:03.480 --> 0:16:07.040 to make a bunch of money. Um. And there's there's 0:16:07.040 --> 0:16:10.360 also this thing called stretch goals. I've never heard of 0:16:10.400 --> 0:16:12.840 that I had neither, and I was like that smacks 0:16:12.840 --> 0:16:15.920 of corporate buzz speak. You're gonna look that up and 0:16:16.480 --> 0:16:20.080 hanging fruit. It was. Yeah, stretch goals was coined by 0:16:20.320 --> 0:16:25.440 the legendary um G E CEO Jack Welch, and he 0:16:25.920 --> 0:16:29.160 basically said, like, a stretch goal is something that you 0:16:29.400 --> 0:16:33.239 some virtually unattainable goal that you give to your employees 0:16:33.280 --> 0:16:37.080 to shake them out of their out of their ruts basically, 0:16:38.400 --> 0:16:42.120 which isn't great people are finding out no companies. At 0:16:42.160 --> 0:16:45.960 least it does bring us to a two question though, Chuck, Like, 0:16:47.280 --> 0:16:49.600 this whole the whole point of what we're talking about 0:16:50.120 --> 0:16:55.520 is there is why don't why can't we just achieve 0:16:55.560 --> 0:17:01.400 our goals when we're the only obstacle. Well, Um, there's 0:17:01.440 --> 0:17:05.200 been a little research done on the brain, and research 0:17:05.280 --> 0:17:07.720 does show that the brain tries to protect you from 0:17:07.880 --> 0:17:13.120 change really, um, like anything that's scary or fearful, um, 0:17:13.200 --> 0:17:15.680 which could be any kind of change in your patterns 0:17:16.000 --> 0:17:19.320 in your daily habits is threatening basically, but not only that. 0:17:19.440 --> 0:17:21.800 Like even remember when we were talking about chunking and 0:17:21.840 --> 0:17:25.040 habit formation on the video podcast. Yeah, same thing. The 0:17:25.080 --> 0:17:27.880 brain is looking for a way to streamline a process 0:17:27.920 --> 0:17:29.840 so that it can use up the least amount of 0:17:29.920 --> 0:17:32.960 energy possible in carrying out something. And the way to 0:17:33.040 --> 0:17:34.560 do that is just get you to do the same 0:17:34.600 --> 0:17:38.560 thing over and over again. Habit formation. So our brains 0:17:38.560 --> 0:17:41.439 are naturally inclined, we think at this point in the 0:17:41.680 --> 0:17:46.320 this this point in neuroscience to finding the path of 0:17:46.400 --> 0:17:50.600 least resistance in carrying out something. So that's habit formation. 0:17:51.080 --> 0:17:55.800 Aubrey Daniels has a book called oops Uh Thirteen Management 0:17:55.800 --> 0:17:59.360 practices that Waste time and money, and he argues that 0:17:59.760 --> 0:18:02.560 the stretch goals are not good for your company because, 0:18:03.320 --> 0:18:07.960 um he's his sided studies that when people and departments 0:18:08.000 --> 0:18:12.639 failed to reach their goals, then there's a performance decline afterward. 0:18:12.960 --> 0:18:17.840 So you set up these almost unattainable goals and it's 0:18:17.880 --> 0:18:19.760 sort of a big bummer for everyone when you don't 0:18:19.800 --> 0:18:23.879 reach them. Yeah, especially if they've they've been really really 0:18:23.920 --> 0:18:28.080 working hard to achieve them. I imagine there's like an 0:18:28.160 --> 0:18:30.240 aftermath where you're just like, well, what's the point in 0:18:30.280 --> 0:18:32.280 any of this? If sure, we're gonna work our tails 0:18:32.280 --> 0:18:34.520 off and still fail. Well, And that's one of the 0:18:34.560 --> 0:18:37.439 points is that with goals, it's sort of looked at 0:18:37.480 --> 0:18:41.399 as a past failed thing you could. I mean, I 0:18:41.400 --> 0:18:44.440 guess some some managers are better at saying, well, we 0:18:44.440 --> 0:18:47.520 we got towards our goal, and that's really great, But 0:18:47.680 --> 0:18:49.680 most of the time it's we didn't reach our goal, 0:18:49.760 --> 0:18:52.520 so we failed, right, and that's Um. That's an inherent 0:18:52.560 --> 0:18:55.000 problem with goals, is what we were talking about with 0:18:55.160 --> 0:18:59.880 subjectivity and objectivity, where just do your best or raise 0:18:59.920 --> 0:19:05.000 a hundred thousand dollars in six months? Sure, right, Um. 0:19:05.119 --> 0:19:07.720 The good thing about goals is that they take away 0:19:07.760 --> 0:19:10.359 that subjectivity, but at the same time, like you were saying, 0:19:10.600 --> 0:19:15.200 they set you up for the measure of success is perfection, 0:19:16.280 --> 0:19:20.840 and um, that can be a problem for losers. Adam 0:19:20.880 --> 0:19:24.840 Glinski is a professor at Northwestern University's Kellogg School of Management, 0:19:25.320 --> 0:19:26.960 and he is a co author of a book called 0:19:27.000 --> 0:19:30.400 Goals Gone Wild. Very clever, but he has a quote 0:19:30.400 --> 0:19:32.240 in here I thought was really relevant, and he says 0:19:32.280 --> 0:19:34.760 that goal setting has been treated like an over the 0:19:34.800 --> 0:19:37.360 counter medication when it should really be treated with more 0:19:37.400 --> 0:19:41.000 care as a prescription strength of medication. Yeah, and I 0:19:41.040 --> 0:19:43.560 think you're too willy nilly with it right. Well, yeah, 0:19:43.920 --> 0:19:46.639 it's it seems like a way to solve a big 0:19:46.680 --> 0:19:49.600 problem all at once. And there is a dude named 0:19:49.680 --> 0:19:53.600 sim Uh sikin At Duke who did a study of 0:19:53.640 --> 0:19:57.440 companies that do stretch goals, and a stretch goal, UM 0:19:57.800 --> 0:20:01.359 and a way to quantify it says to uh, to 0:20:01.480 --> 0:20:05.920 be like the number eleven in flight magazine in the country, 0:20:06.119 --> 0:20:08.800 and to say, Uh, you're you're gonna be number one 0:20:09.040 --> 0:20:11.239 in two quarters. We're gonna be the number one in 0:20:11.240 --> 0:20:17.080 flight magazine in the country two quarters. Yeah, that's a 0:20:17.200 --> 0:20:20.840 that's a huge stretch goal. And they found sim Sitkin, 0:20:21.040 --> 0:20:24.760 who's got one of the better business school professor's names 0:20:24.760 --> 0:20:28.480 of all time. UM found that companies that engage in 0:20:28.520 --> 0:20:35.280 stretch goals typically are already desperate and embattled and um, 0:20:35.320 --> 0:20:38.199 if they fail at the stretch goal, they're in big trouble. 0:20:38.600 --> 0:20:41.080 Like it's a last ditch thing, and it's a lot 0:20:41.119 --> 0:20:43.120 to ask of your employees, and it's kind of unfair. 0:20:43.520 --> 0:20:46.520 Rather than saying, okay, you know what's wrong with our 0:20:46.640 --> 0:20:49.119 organization that led us to this point? How else can 0:20:49.240 --> 0:20:51.080 how can we do this incrementally? It's kind of like 0:20:51.080 --> 0:20:54.959 a hail Mary passes a stretch goal. Uh. Interestingly too, 0:20:55.000 --> 0:21:00.000 they've also found out that UM setting goals that PETE 0:21:00.000 --> 0:21:02.600 will don't meet lead people to unethical behavior, like when 0:21:02.600 --> 0:21:05.520 they're tasked to keep track of their own goals and 0:21:05.600 --> 0:21:10.080 report they will lie UM when they don't reach their goals. Yeah, 0:21:10.240 --> 0:21:14.040 just to say they have reached that you know, ethereal goal. 0:21:14.119 --> 0:21:17.240 But it's also you're asking somebody in as many words 0:21:17.240 --> 0:21:19.880 and not so many words, did you are you a success? 0:21:19.960 --> 0:21:22.080 Or are you a failure? When you're saying did you 0:21:22.119 --> 0:21:25.800 reach your goal or not? And UM. The other the 0:21:25.840 --> 0:21:30.120 other aspect of UM unethical behavior related to goal setting 0:21:30.760 --> 0:21:34.480 is this UM the idea that when you focus on 0:21:34.520 --> 0:21:39.120 a goal, it's your it's easier to compromise your everyday 0:21:39.160 --> 0:21:43.800 morality to achieve that goal. And apparently like that's that's 0:21:43.800 --> 0:21:48.000 a that's a possible outcome of of goal setting is 0:21:48.040 --> 0:21:51.600 that people just start kind of cutting corners and cheating 0:21:51.680 --> 0:21:55.440 and writing whatever they need to to achieve that goal. 0:21:55.520 --> 0:21:59.920 Slash be successful well or do weird and dangerous things 0:22:00.119 --> 0:22:04.040 like my father who like ate soup every day for 0:22:04.160 --> 0:22:06.879 like a year and that's it, like a bowl of 0:22:06.920 --> 0:22:10.000 soup and wore like one of those plastic suits around 0:22:10.000 --> 0:22:13.439 and then like July heat in Atlanta, or you know, 0:22:13.520 --> 0:22:16.440 I just won't eat anymore. Or although he I think 0:22:16.440 --> 0:22:19.119 he ate like cabbage soup for literally like six or 0:22:19.160 --> 0:22:22.919 eight months straight and it's it's not like it's not healthy. 0:22:22.960 --> 0:22:26.760 You know. That's a great example. Is something he otherwise 0:22:26.800 --> 0:22:30.359 wouldn't have done. That's kind of dangerous. Um it's also 0:22:30.680 --> 0:22:34.000 uh so it's dangerous. It can lead to unethical behavior. 0:22:34.520 --> 0:22:39.240 Another downside that people have suggested about goals is that, um, 0:22:39.400 --> 0:22:44.240 they they can keep you from learning. Yeah, you're so 0:22:44.320 --> 0:22:48.240