1 00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:03,360 Speaker 1: It's time to get inside the Giants Hut. Let's go, 2 00:00:03,480 --> 00:00:04,800 Speaker 1: Let's go Giants. 3 00:00:05,120 --> 00:00:05,480 Speaker 2: I like it. 4 00:00:05,519 --> 00:00:08,000 Speaker 1: Out of my Giants, Mobule, gim me some jobs out 5 00:00:08,039 --> 00:00:12,039 Speaker 1: of the Giants podcast Networks. Welcome to the Giants Huddle Podcast, 6 00:00:12,080 --> 00:00:14,800 Speaker 1: brought to you by Citizens, the official bank of the 7 00:00:14,840 --> 00:00:18,239 Speaker 1: New York Giants. I'm Paul Deatino, and it's my pleasure 8 00:00:18,720 --> 00:00:21,480 Speaker 1: to be joined by a writer who has been around 9 00:00:21,480 --> 00:00:23,680 Speaker 1: the NFL for an awful long time. I think I'm 10 00:00:23,680 --> 00:00:26,440 Speaker 1: going to date both he and I because we are 11 00:00:26,600 --> 00:00:30,680 Speaker 1: old timers. The author of Once a Giant, Gary Myers. 12 00:00:31,080 --> 00:00:33,680 Speaker 1: It is the story of the nineteen eighty six Super 13 00:00:33,720 --> 00:00:37,519 Speaker 1: Bowl twenty one championship New York Giants, and Gary, I 14 00:00:37,520 --> 00:00:40,080 Speaker 1: think the important thing for people to remember it's not 15 00:00:40,520 --> 00:00:44,360 Speaker 1: just about football. This is about the personalities, the stories 16 00:00:44,440 --> 00:00:48,479 Speaker 1: behind the guys who made the Giants champions. And you 17 00:00:48,560 --> 00:00:52,720 Speaker 1: also weave in background and to put everything at the context. 18 00:00:52,960 --> 00:00:54,920 Speaker 1: And I think that's what will make a lot of 19 00:00:54,960 --> 00:00:57,720 Speaker 1: young folks want to read this book because they need 20 00:00:57,760 --> 00:01:01,840 Speaker 1: to understand more about what those parcels Giants were about. 21 00:01:02,440 --> 00:01:05,160 Speaker 2: Absolutely, and I had two goals in writing this book. 22 00:01:05,240 --> 00:01:08,399 Speaker 2: One is it couldn't be like a game by game 23 00:01:08,440 --> 00:01:11,440 Speaker 2: account of what happened in eighty six, because that was 24 00:01:11,480 --> 00:01:13,440 Speaker 2: done in tons of books that were written after that 25 00:01:13,480 --> 00:01:16,399 Speaker 2: Super Bowl. But I wanted to get people a feel 26 00:01:16,560 --> 00:01:21,960 Speaker 2: for the brotherhood that was formed in nineteen eighty six 27 00:01:22,000 --> 00:01:25,000 Speaker 2: and a very unusual brotherhood. And like you mentioned, you 28 00:01:25,040 --> 00:01:29,320 Speaker 2: know how thirty seven years later, I mean, these guys 29 00:01:29,319 --> 00:01:31,600 Speaker 2: are still tight as can be and they help each 30 00:01:31,640 --> 00:01:34,920 Speaker 2: other out. But the main focus of the book and 31 00:01:35,280 --> 00:01:38,679 Speaker 2: my inspiration for doing it, was I really wanted to 32 00:01:38,720 --> 00:01:41,840 Speaker 2: tell the story of life after football. And I think 33 00:01:41,880 --> 00:01:45,560 Speaker 2: it's such a crucial topic. It's been moved to the 34 00:01:45,600 --> 00:01:48,840 Speaker 2: forefront somewhat in the last ten years with all the 35 00:01:48,880 --> 00:01:52,200 Speaker 2: talk about CTE and concussion lawsuits and stuff, but it 36 00:01:52,240 --> 00:01:55,560 Speaker 2: goes the issues go much deeper than that. So what 37 00:01:56,040 --> 00:01:59,600 Speaker 2: I did was I got into who these players were 38 00:01:59,640 --> 00:02:01,760 Speaker 2: and maybe talked about a player or two that was 39 00:02:01,760 --> 00:02:04,560 Speaker 2: so instrumental in helping the Giants win that first championship, 40 00:02:05,360 --> 00:02:07,120 Speaker 2: and then I would tell what's going on in their 41 00:02:07,160 --> 00:02:12,680 Speaker 2: lives now and those who were in position to help 42 00:02:13,560 --> 00:02:16,440 Speaker 2: those who needed to help. So it's filled with heartbreaking 43 00:02:16,480 --> 00:02:18,680 Speaker 2: stories but also some real heart warming stories. 44 00:02:19,440 --> 00:02:21,959 Speaker 1: You know. The patriarch of that team, and it will 45 00:02:21,960 --> 00:02:25,320 Speaker 1: always be Bill Parcelves. Let's not kid ourselves. This is 46 00:02:25,360 --> 00:02:28,040 Speaker 1: the guy, the tuna who made it all happen, who 47 00:02:28,080 --> 00:02:30,640 Speaker 1: you and I both know because we covered that team together. 48 00:02:31,080 --> 00:02:33,520 Speaker 1: Was not always liked by the players in the locker room. 49 00:02:33,840 --> 00:02:36,880 Speaker 1: But as time has gone on, I think their affection 50 00:02:37,120 --> 00:02:39,520 Speaker 1: for what it is that he tried to do and 51 00:02:39,600 --> 00:02:43,000 Speaker 1: accomplished with them has grown so much over time. And 52 00:02:43,080 --> 00:02:45,440 Speaker 1: obviously in reading some of the chapters of your book, 53 00:02:45,480 --> 00:02:47,440 Speaker 1: including the one where you talk about how he has 54 00:02:47,480 --> 00:02:52,320 Speaker 1: helped so many unfortunate players, is really the legacy of 55 00:02:52,360 --> 00:02:54,120 Speaker 1: what Parcels meant to those guys. 56 00:02:54,680 --> 00:02:56,960 Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, Paul, I mean you know as well 57 00:02:57,000 --> 00:02:59,639 Speaker 2: as anybody, that was a love hate relationship that those 58 00:02:59,680 --> 00:03:02,680 Speaker 2: players has had with Bill. They loved the winning, they 59 00:03:02,720 --> 00:03:06,799 Speaker 2: hated the process because he really worked them hard. Those 60 00:03:06,800 --> 00:03:09,520 Speaker 2: were the days in training camp where you can put 61 00:03:09,560 --> 00:03:12,520 Speaker 2: him in pads twice a day and by the end 62 00:03:12,560 --> 00:03:15,640 Speaker 2: of the second practice, these guys were beat and and 63 00:03:15,800 --> 00:03:18,480 Speaker 2: during the season you're allowed to practice in pads, I 64 00:03:18,480 --> 00:03:20,800 Speaker 2: mean you still are, but you know, coaches to do 65 00:03:20,800 --> 00:03:22,800 Speaker 2: it maybe once a week with Parcels will do it. 66 00:03:22,840 --> 00:03:26,200 Speaker 2: You know, at least twice a week, and so you know, 67 00:03:26,320 --> 00:03:30,160 Speaker 2: getting to that championship, a lot of their motivation was 68 00:03:30,240 --> 00:03:32,480 Speaker 2: like to stick at the parcels because he drove them 69 00:03:32,520 --> 00:03:35,560 Speaker 2: so hard. But you know, but still Simms has a 70 00:03:35,880 --> 00:03:39,560 Speaker 2: great line in the book about how the players and 71 00:03:40,040 --> 00:03:42,400 Speaker 2: he always had a very interesting relationship with Bill, but 72 00:03:43,400 --> 00:03:45,920 Speaker 2: how the players have come to appreciate Bill because of 73 00:03:46,000 --> 00:03:48,480 Speaker 2: what he meant to them, not only in their football lives, 74 00:03:49,000 --> 00:03:51,760 Speaker 2: but in off they're off the field life and how 75 00:03:52,200 --> 00:03:54,960 Speaker 2: he taught them, taught them so many life lessons along 76 00:03:55,000 --> 00:03:59,520 Speaker 2: the way that they still quote him on today. And 77 00:03:59,520 --> 00:04:04,040 Speaker 2: and like you mentioned, financially, he's helped out about twenty 78 00:04:04,080 --> 00:04:06,200 Speaker 2: players who have come to him, and he realizes when 79 00:04:06,240 --> 00:04:09,120 Speaker 2: they do it's a matter of last resort because they 80 00:04:09,120 --> 00:04:12,000 Speaker 2: have to be embarrassed going to their former coach and 81 00:04:12,080 --> 00:04:14,560 Speaker 2: asking for money. But you know, he set aside some 82 00:04:14,640 --> 00:04:18,080 Speaker 2: money of all the money that he's made that he 83 00:04:18,120 --> 00:04:21,159 Speaker 2: has earmark just to help his former players. And you know, 84 00:04:21,200 --> 00:04:23,120 Speaker 2: when I asked him why he did that, why he 85 00:04:23,200 --> 00:04:26,880 Speaker 2: does that, and he said, they just sacrificed so much 86 00:04:27,279 --> 00:04:30,480 Speaker 2: for him that helped him win two Super Bowls and 87 00:04:30,520 --> 00:04:34,360 Speaker 2: become a Hall of Fame coach that he feels it's 88 00:04:34,360 --> 00:04:38,400 Speaker 2: a responsibility and obligation because he's in a position to 89 00:04:38,440 --> 00:04:39,520 Speaker 2: help that he wants to help. 90 00:04:40,360 --> 00:04:43,520 Speaker 1: You know, Gary, all the years that you spent compiling this, 91 00:04:43,760 --> 00:04:45,600 Speaker 1: and obviously you had had a head start because you 92 00:04:45,680 --> 00:04:48,600 Speaker 1: covered the team, but then all of the interviews you did, 93 00:04:48,800 --> 00:04:51,640 Speaker 1: the travel you did, sitting down with people, including Lawrence 94 00:04:51,680 --> 00:04:54,400 Speaker 1: Taylor at a golf tournament, which I know how that's 95 00:04:54,440 --> 00:04:56,320 Speaker 1: a great story in the book near the back end, 96 00:04:57,480 --> 00:05:00,520 Speaker 1: could you tell me in new works, what do you 97 00:05:00,560 --> 00:05:04,080 Speaker 1: think a parcels guy is? To find that guy for me? 98 00:05:05,720 --> 00:05:08,240 Speaker 2: You know, That's what that's funny about that question is 99 00:05:08,279 --> 00:05:11,919 Speaker 2: that we knew who the parcels guys were and we 100 00:05:12,000 --> 00:05:15,039 Speaker 2: kind of figured out why, but we never asked Bill, like, 101 00:05:15,240 --> 00:05:19,040 Speaker 2: what's the definition of a parcels guy? And you know, 102 00:05:19,120 --> 00:05:23,760 Speaker 2: considering that group was you know, Phil and Harry and 103 00:05:24,080 --> 00:05:30,800 Speaker 2: Carl Banks and Lawrence and George Martin, obviously you look 104 00:05:30,800 --> 00:05:32,880 Speaker 2: at the common traits that those guys have, you know, 105 00:05:33,240 --> 00:05:39,480 Speaker 2: ultra competitive, good locker room guys other than Lawrence obviously, 106 00:05:39,800 --> 00:05:43,880 Speaker 2: uh to carry themselves off the field. Lawrence was a 107 00:05:43,880 --> 00:05:47,000 Speaker 2: good locker room guy. Players love them off the field. 108 00:05:47,000 --> 00:05:49,400 Speaker 2: They had no idea you know what he did at 109 00:05:49,440 --> 00:05:52,040 Speaker 2: the end of the day, And in those days it 110 00:05:52,120 --> 00:05:56,320 Speaker 2: wasn't as well known as it would be today. But 111 00:05:56,480 --> 00:05:58,760 Speaker 2: I would I would say it was guys that he 112 00:05:58,800 --> 00:06:00,920 Speaker 2: could count on in the locker. I mean, the famous 113 00:06:00,960 --> 00:06:03,960 Speaker 2: line was he always used to if something was bothering Bill, 114 00:06:04,040 --> 00:06:06,000 Speaker 2: he would go to Harry or George and just say 115 00:06:06,440 --> 00:06:10,160 Speaker 2: fix it. And they would know what he wanted fix 116 00:06:10,200 --> 00:06:12,320 Speaker 2: and they would carry it out for him. And there 117 00:06:12,320 --> 00:06:14,640 Speaker 2: were parcels guys at each of his other stops, and 118 00:06:14,720 --> 00:06:20,159 Speaker 2: Curtis Martin was a parcels guy. I'm trying to think 119 00:06:20,200 --> 00:06:24,400 Speaker 2: you know who else who in New England was there 120 00:06:24,440 --> 00:06:27,120 Speaker 2: was a fullback there that he really liked, whose name 121 00:06:27,320 --> 00:06:32,400 Speaker 2: right now? You know Blitzo was originally because he drafted 122 00:06:32,480 --> 00:06:37,839 Speaker 2: him in Dallas. He had his guys. Tony Romo was obviously, 123 00:06:38,360 --> 00:06:42,360 Speaker 2: you know, one of his guys. But you know clearly 124 00:06:42,880 --> 00:06:46,000 Speaker 2: the parcels guys were the ones with the giants. 125 00:06:46,279 --> 00:06:49,240 Speaker 1: Yeah, I think one of the important things, and you 126 00:06:49,320 --> 00:06:52,440 Speaker 1: mentioned this in the book, Gary, that the only member 127 00:06:52,480 --> 00:06:54,559 Speaker 1: of that eighty six team who had had a Super 128 00:06:54,600 --> 00:06:58,040 Speaker 1: Bowl ring was Kenny Hill, the former Raider who eventually, 129 00:06:58,080 --> 00:07:00,000 Speaker 1: and I have a feeling because of Al Davis's can 130 00:07:00,000 --> 00:07:02,320 Speaker 1: act the Parcels, that's one of the reasons Parcels wound 131 00:07:02,400 --> 00:07:05,120 Speaker 1: up getting him on the Giants. But I think it's 132 00:07:05,160 --> 00:07:08,040 Speaker 1: important to understand that none of those guys were champions 133 00:07:08,360 --> 00:07:12,040 Speaker 1: until they were champions together, right, And I think that's 134 00:07:12,080 --> 00:07:15,160 Speaker 1: an added part of why their bond is like crazy group. 135 00:07:16,440 --> 00:07:20,120 Speaker 2: Yeah, I totally agree with you. They learned, Like I 136 00:07:20,160 --> 00:07:23,080 Speaker 2: mentioned in the book, they learned how to win together, 137 00:07:24,320 --> 00:07:26,800 Speaker 2: and they learned a lot of that from Parcels because 138 00:07:26,840 --> 00:07:28,600 Speaker 2: he knew what it took to win, although he had 139 00:07:28,640 --> 00:07:35,000 Speaker 2: never been a champion himself, so they were experiencing this 140 00:07:35,840 --> 00:07:40,400 Speaker 2: for the first time together. And you know also also 141 00:07:40,440 --> 00:07:42,760 Speaker 2: the fact that it was the Giants' first championship in 142 00:07:42,840 --> 00:07:47,600 Speaker 2: thirty years that made it even even more special. I mean, 143 00:07:47,720 --> 00:07:51,880 Speaker 2: you've been around all the Giants' Super Bowl teams, and 144 00:07:52,200 --> 00:07:55,160 Speaker 2: I would say that the eighty sixteen because it was 145 00:07:55,200 --> 00:07:58,119 Speaker 2: the first, and because it had all these iconic names 146 00:07:58,160 --> 00:08:01,160 Speaker 2: on there on the team that is a team that 147 00:08:01,200 --> 00:08:04,520 Speaker 2: has embraced and romanticized the most out of the four 148 00:08:04,600 --> 00:08:09,440 Speaker 2: championship teams, I think the clearly the best game out 149 00:08:09,440 --> 00:08:11,640 Speaker 2: of the four Super Bowl I mean two out of 150 00:08:11,640 --> 00:08:13,480 Speaker 2: the four were really good. 151 00:08:13,480 --> 00:08:13,920 Speaker 1: You know, the. 152 00:08:13,840 --> 00:08:17,040 Speaker 2: Norwood game, that was a tremendous game. But the fact 153 00:08:17,080 --> 00:08:20,400 Speaker 2: that the seven team beat an undefeated team in the 154 00:08:20,400 --> 00:08:24,160 Speaker 2: Super Bowl and was coached by Belichick, that that was 155 00:08:24,200 --> 00:08:29,400 Speaker 2: probably the greatest victory, single game victory in the Giants history. 156 00:08:29,720 --> 00:08:31,640 Speaker 2: But there's no question in my mind that the eighty 157 00:08:31,720 --> 00:08:34,440 Speaker 2: six team was the most popular. The seven team was 158 00:08:34,480 --> 00:08:37,240 Speaker 2: just kind of an ordinary team that got really hot 159 00:08:37,840 --> 00:08:39,760 Speaker 2: in the playoffs, which obviously is the best time to 160 00:08:39,800 --> 00:08:44,520 Speaker 2: get hot. But the eighty six team was great from 161 00:08:44,559 --> 00:08:47,240 Speaker 2: beginning to end. You know, despite losing that opening game 162 00:08:47,280 --> 00:08:50,480 Speaker 2: in the herschel Walker run SA, they only lost one 163 00:08:50,480 --> 00:08:52,560 Speaker 2: more game the rest of the year. 164 00:08:53,480 --> 00:08:56,800 Speaker 3: You loved turf. You're good at it, so you started 165 00:08:56,840 --> 00:09:01,880 Speaker 3: turf business grows, your savings grow, become the most celebrated 166 00:09:01,960 --> 00:09:06,640 Speaker 3: name in terse. Are you ready for all that life rings? 167 00:09:08,720 --> 00:09:10,840 Speaker 1: You mentioned Bill Belichick a couple of minutes ago, and 168 00:09:10,880 --> 00:09:12,560 Speaker 1: I want to go back to that because there's a 169 00:09:12,600 --> 00:09:14,560 Speaker 1: part of the book where you talk about tracking him 170 00:09:14,600 --> 00:09:17,720 Speaker 1: down and Belichick was never the most vocal guy. We 171 00:09:17,800 --> 00:09:20,400 Speaker 1: all know that, but you track him down and he 172 00:09:20,600 --> 00:09:23,280 Speaker 1: sends you back, literally pages and pages and pages of 173 00:09:23,320 --> 00:09:27,440 Speaker 1: emails to contribute to this book. And I don't think 174 00:09:27,440 --> 00:09:31,200 Speaker 1: anybody who knows Belichick would be surprised that he would participate, 175 00:09:31,720 --> 00:09:35,800 Speaker 1: because we saw when he was brought to the Old 176 00:09:35,800 --> 00:09:40,120 Speaker 1: Giant Stadium how emotional he got. He's got that blue 177 00:09:40,160 --> 00:09:43,000 Speaker 1: blood in his veins. And I was so happy to 178 00:09:43,040 --> 00:09:45,800 Speaker 1: hear that he did participate in your project. 179 00:09:46,679 --> 00:09:50,600 Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, the backstory to that is for a 180 00:09:50,760 --> 00:09:54,120 Speaker 2: really long time, more than a decade, you know, Bill 181 00:09:54,160 --> 00:09:56,360 Speaker 2: and I didn't speak because I was very critical of 182 00:09:56,440 --> 00:10:00,520 Speaker 2: him for the Spygate nonsense, right, I mean, that was 183 00:10:00,600 --> 00:10:04,440 Speaker 2: legitimate cheating what he was doing. It wasn't to me, 184 00:10:04,640 --> 00:10:06,440 Speaker 2: whether one of many games not, I don't know, but 185 00:10:06,480 --> 00:10:08,880 Speaker 2: it was certainly against the rules. But I was very 186 00:10:08,880 --> 00:10:12,040 Speaker 2: critical of him. And then in twenty twenty, and you know, 187 00:10:12,120 --> 00:10:14,680 Speaker 2: just during that period of time, from say, oh seven 188 00:10:14,760 --> 00:10:17,840 Speaker 2: to twenty twenty, I would go to the press conferences 189 00:10:17,960 --> 00:10:20,640 Speaker 2: up in New England, and you know, he would answer 190 00:10:20,720 --> 00:10:23,560 Speaker 2: my questions, you know, really quickly, and if I ever 191 00:10:23,640 --> 00:10:26,160 Speaker 2: tried to talk to him coming off the podium, he 192 00:10:26,280 --> 00:10:27,839 Speaker 2: kind of brushed me off because I knew he was 193 00:10:27,880 --> 00:10:30,000 Speaker 2: mad at me, and that's okay. I never had a 194 00:10:30,000 --> 00:10:32,960 Speaker 2: problem with coaches or plays mad at me. You know, 195 00:10:32,960 --> 00:10:34,920 Speaker 2: it's just part of the job. But in twenty twenty, 196 00:10:35,720 --> 00:10:37,400 Speaker 2: you know, I'm part of the Hall of Fame committee 197 00:10:37,440 --> 00:10:40,720 Speaker 2: and they formed a separate committee for that year to 198 00:10:40,840 --> 00:10:46,600 Speaker 2: pick the centennial class. So we're in Canton, and this 199 00:10:46,679 --> 00:10:49,839 Speaker 2: is two or three days after the Patriots were eliminated 200 00:10:49,840 --> 00:10:52,000 Speaker 2: by the Titans and would turned out to be Brady's 201 00:10:52,080 --> 00:10:55,760 Speaker 2: last game for the Patriots, and Bill and I wound 202 00:10:55,840 --> 00:10:58,800 Speaker 2: up sitting next to each other, and I was thinking 203 00:10:58,840 --> 00:11:01,360 Speaker 2: to myself, this is gonna be a really long eight 204 00:11:01,400 --> 00:11:04,600 Speaker 2: hours if we don't talk at all, and so I 205 00:11:04,720 --> 00:11:06,319 Speaker 2: just kind of figured I'm going to break the eye. 206 00:11:06,360 --> 00:11:08,320 Speaker 2: Said if he wants to ignore me, you know, so 207 00:11:08,440 --> 00:11:11,160 Speaker 2: be it. At least I gave it a shot, and Paul, 208 00:11:11,440 --> 00:11:13,920 Speaker 2: we had the best time, and it made me really 209 00:11:13,960 --> 00:11:15,680 Speaker 2: regret that I hadn't talked to him for such a 210 00:11:15,720 --> 00:11:18,840 Speaker 2: long time, because, you know, he was asking me questions 211 00:11:19,480 --> 00:11:21,480 Speaker 2: about the Hall of Fame process, knowing I had been 212 00:11:21,480 --> 00:11:24,360 Speaker 2: on the committee for a long time. We were putting 213 00:11:24,360 --> 00:11:28,199 Speaker 2: in a lot of senior players who, you know, none 214 00:11:28,240 --> 00:11:30,960 Speaker 2: of us saw play, but Bill studied the tape, so 215 00:11:31,080 --> 00:11:33,319 Speaker 2: I'd ask him about that and we just really had 216 00:11:33,320 --> 00:11:36,400 Speaker 2: a nice time. And since then we've exchanged a lot 217 00:11:36,440 --> 00:11:38,360 Speaker 2: of emails. You know, I wish him luck every season, 218 00:11:38,400 --> 00:11:40,880 Speaker 2: and he writes me back it with some thoughts on 219 00:11:40,920 --> 00:11:44,040 Speaker 2: Hall of Famers coming up. So anyhow, and it's a 220 00:11:44,040 --> 00:11:48,200 Speaker 2: really long answer, but I emailed him to ask him 221 00:11:48,280 --> 00:11:49,920 Speaker 2: if he would help me with this book, you know, 222 00:11:49,920 --> 00:11:53,080 Speaker 2: because I really wanted his insight. And I said, you know, 223 00:11:53,160 --> 00:11:55,280 Speaker 2: I'll come up to Foxborough. This is during training camp. 224 00:11:55,760 --> 00:11:57,040 Speaker 2: I said, I'll come up at the end of your 225 00:11:57,120 --> 00:11:59,079 Speaker 2: day at two o'clock or the beginning of your day 226 00:11:59,080 --> 00:12:02,280 Speaker 2: at six o'clock, whatever works out best for you. And 227 00:12:02,320 --> 00:12:04,439 Speaker 2: he said, I'm telling you this honestly, and it's not 228 00:12:04,480 --> 00:12:06,240 Speaker 2: because I don't want you to sit in my office. 229 00:12:06,640 --> 00:12:09,640 Speaker 2: He goes, I'll just give you better answers by email 230 00:12:10,160 --> 00:12:12,439 Speaker 2: because I'll think about them and i'll give you much 231 00:12:12,480 --> 00:12:15,480 Speaker 2: more insightful stuff. So I said, well, you know that's great. 232 00:12:15,520 --> 00:12:17,000 Speaker 2: You know I'd rather do it in person, but if 233 00:12:17,040 --> 00:12:20,440 Speaker 2: you think your contribution will be better and better for 234 00:12:20,520 --> 00:12:25,640 Speaker 2: me by email, fine, So I said him fifteen questions, 235 00:12:25,640 --> 00:12:26,880 Speaker 2: I said, just try to get it back to me 236 00:12:26,920 --> 00:12:28,760 Speaker 2: by the end of the season, because at that point 237 00:12:28,760 --> 00:12:32,840 Speaker 2: I wasn't in a tremendous rush. And about two months 238 00:12:32,920 --> 00:12:36,520 Speaker 2: later he sends me back about twenty five hundred words, 239 00:12:37,160 --> 00:12:41,040 Speaker 2: answering fourteen out of the fifteen questions. My agreement with 240 00:12:41,160 --> 00:12:43,400 Speaker 2: him ahead of time weren't I wasn't gonna ask him 241 00:12:43,400 --> 00:12:47,120 Speaker 2: any Patriot questions because I really it wasn't about the Patriots, right. 242 00:12:47,760 --> 00:12:51,040 Speaker 2: But the one question he wouldn't answer was, I said, Bill, 243 00:12:52,440 --> 00:12:54,320 Speaker 2: how do you think your eighty six team would have 244 00:12:54,360 --> 00:12:56,560 Speaker 2: done against the best of your Patriot teams? I said, 245 00:12:56,600 --> 00:12:58,440 Speaker 2: I think it was the seventeen even though you didn't 246 00:12:58,440 --> 00:13:02,400 Speaker 2: win the Super Bowl. And I said, I'm just trying 247 00:13:02,400 --> 00:13:04,360 Speaker 2: to compare errors, That's all I'm probably trying to do. 248 00:13:05,200 --> 00:13:08,000 Speaker 2: So he gave me a three word answer, and no, 249 00:13:08,160 --> 00:13:13,360 Speaker 2: it was not on to Cincinnati. It was I don't know. 250 00:13:14,240 --> 00:13:17,600 Speaker 2: Now he knows, you know, he just didn't want to 251 00:13:17,600 --> 00:13:22,000 Speaker 2: get into it, right. But you know, the truth of 252 00:13:22,000 --> 00:13:26,359 Speaker 2: the matter is, really he loved his time with the Giants, 253 00:13:26,679 --> 00:13:30,319 Speaker 2: and as you mentioned in that Football Life documentary, when 254 00:13:30,360 --> 00:13:34,680 Speaker 2: they brought him to Giants Stadium before they played before 255 00:13:34,679 --> 00:13:36,560 Speaker 2: the Patriots played, the Giants, in a preseason game. They 256 00:13:36,559 --> 00:13:39,640 Speaker 2: took him into the locker room and he was basically crying. 257 00:13:40,200 --> 00:13:42,679 Speaker 2: And he told me when I asked him about that 258 00:13:43,800 --> 00:13:46,680 Speaker 2: in these emails that as he was answering my question, 259 00:13:46,720 --> 00:13:49,880 Speaker 2: he was getting emotional just thinking about that. So he 260 00:13:50,000 --> 00:13:56,600 Speaker 2: really does bleed blue. I have to admit at some 261 00:13:56,840 --> 00:13:59,920 Speaker 2: point I thought it might happen that he would come 262 00:14:00,080 --> 00:14:03,360 Speaker 2: back and coach the Giants, because I really think that's 263 00:14:03,400 --> 00:14:06,040 Speaker 2: the ultimate job for him. But then he started hitting 264 00:14:06,080 --> 00:14:08,640 Speaker 2: all these Super Bowls with the greatest quarterback who ever played, 265 00:14:09,240 --> 00:14:13,120 Speaker 2: and it just never made any sense. But I think 266 00:14:13,120 --> 00:14:15,720 Speaker 2: that's the only job he would have ever taken to 267 00:14:15,840 --> 00:14:17,679 Speaker 2: leave New England with what he had built there. 268 00:14:18,679 --> 00:14:21,120 Speaker 1: I need to go to where you started. You mentioned. 269 00:14:21,120 --> 00:14:24,120 Speaker 1: I believe that Harry Carson was the first subject that 270 00:14:24,160 --> 00:14:26,800 Speaker 1: you went to when you started this book. And of 271 00:14:26,800 --> 00:14:30,640 Speaker 1: course we all know Harry as captain for life with 272 00:14:30,800 --> 00:14:34,840 Speaker 1: this Giants organization, and this is another guy who has 273 00:14:35,040 --> 00:14:37,840 Speaker 1: taken it well beyond the bounds of just being a 274 00:14:37,880 --> 00:14:40,440 Speaker 1: captain on the football field, to be kind of an 275 00:14:40,480 --> 00:14:44,960 Speaker 1: overseer and a caretaker for so many of these former teammates. 276 00:14:45,760 --> 00:14:47,640 Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm going to have a couple of stories in 277 00:14:47,680 --> 00:14:51,280 Speaker 2: the book about you know, how he took Parcels to 278 00:14:51,960 --> 00:14:54,400 Speaker 2: the hospital in New York. Parcels stated at his house, 279 00:14:54,520 --> 00:14:57,360 Speaker 2: at Jim Bird's house, I'm sorry that was a Jim 280 00:14:57,400 --> 00:14:59,200 Speaker 2: Bird story. I'm getting myself confused here. 281 00:14:59,360 --> 00:15:02,280 Speaker 1: Yeah, he was going to throw ourselves off the cliff, 282 00:15:02,320 --> 00:15:02,640 Speaker 1: I remember. 283 00:15:04,160 --> 00:15:06,440 Speaker 2: But before I tell you Harry stroke, Jim Bird is 284 00:15:06,440 --> 00:15:09,960 Speaker 2: another one who is really embraced taking care of his 285 00:15:10,040 --> 00:15:14,800 Speaker 2: former teammates. I mean he really he considers that, you know, 286 00:15:15,240 --> 00:15:19,440 Speaker 2: because he is really doing well and he wants to 287 00:15:19,480 --> 00:15:22,360 Speaker 2: help anybody who's not. But the story about Harry that 288 00:15:22,880 --> 00:15:27,240 Speaker 2: is really, you know, accentuates his degree of dedication to 289 00:15:27,280 --> 00:15:30,640 Speaker 2: his former teammates is in the early two thousands. But 290 00:15:30,720 --> 00:15:33,120 Speaker 2: I don't know if you remember when Jeff Rutlig's gone 291 00:15:33,160 --> 00:15:36,840 Speaker 2: to a really bad car accident in Tennessee. I mean, 292 00:15:37,520 --> 00:15:40,040 Speaker 2: by you know, talking to Jeff about it, I mean 293 00:15:40,040 --> 00:15:42,960 Speaker 2: he was lucky he survived it. He was he was 294 00:15:43,040 --> 00:15:45,000 Speaker 2: driving on a highway down there, I think, on his 295 00:15:45,000 --> 00:15:48,880 Speaker 2: way to Nashville or Memphis, and he looked down at 296 00:15:48,880 --> 00:15:51,720 Speaker 2: his phone, which we all know, you know, you can't do, 297 00:15:52,120 --> 00:15:54,000 Speaker 2: and there was an eighteen wheeler right in front of him, 298 00:15:54,040 --> 00:15:55,600 Speaker 2: so he tried to avoid it, and he hit the 299 00:15:55,600 --> 00:15:59,360 Speaker 2: guardrail and he broke every bone in his face, which 300 00:15:59,400 --> 00:16:05,320 Speaker 2: is un fathomable. So once Harry found out that Rutlige 301 00:16:05,400 --> 00:16:08,200 Speaker 2: was out of the hospital and his house in Nashville, 302 00:16:08,640 --> 00:16:12,680 Speaker 2: Harry was visiting family in Florence, South Carolina. He gets 303 00:16:12,800 --> 00:16:15,920 Speaker 2: picked up and got in his car, didn't tell Retligi 304 00:16:16,080 --> 00:16:18,880 Speaker 2: was coming, and drove about seven and a half hours 305 00:16:18,920 --> 00:16:21,960 Speaker 2: from South Carolina to Nashville, part of it through the 306 00:16:21,960 --> 00:16:24,960 Speaker 2: Blue Ridge Mountains, which Harry described to me. You know, 307 00:16:25,000 --> 00:16:28,480 Speaker 2: it's not it's not quite as treacherous as driving on 308 00:16:28,480 --> 00:16:33,000 Speaker 2: the Crossbox expressly necessarily, but you you don't really want 309 00:16:33,040 --> 00:16:35,120 Speaker 2: to be driving through the Blue Ridge Mountains, and especially 310 00:16:35,160 --> 00:16:39,520 Speaker 2: because he stayed for about an hour or two, was 311 00:16:39,560 --> 00:16:42,600 Speaker 2: satisfied that Rutligi was on the road to recovery and 312 00:16:42,720 --> 00:16:46,640 Speaker 2: turned around and drove back to South Carolina. And I 313 00:16:46,680 --> 00:16:51,120 Speaker 2: mean that is taking Captain for Life to an extreme 314 00:16:51,280 --> 00:16:54,760 Speaker 2: that I mean, I can't imagine there's another story like 315 00:16:54,840 --> 00:16:58,960 Speaker 2: that anywhere. And that's what makes this team really really 316 00:16:59,040 --> 00:17:00,520 Speaker 2: I mean, it was a great group of guys, as 317 00:17:00,560 --> 00:17:04,920 Speaker 2: you know, but how they feel about each other all 318 00:17:04,960 --> 00:17:08,000 Speaker 2: these years later is to me, it's just really really unique. 319 00:17:08,200 --> 00:17:10,359 Speaker 1: Well, there's another story you relate in the book Gary 320 00:17:10,400 --> 00:17:13,760 Speaker 1: about how when he helps to deliver a woman's baby 321 00:17:14,320 --> 00:17:16,959 Speaker 1: and it was a teammate's child, it wasn't even his. 322 00:17:19,040 --> 00:17:20,800 Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean. 323 00:17:20,640 --> 00:17:22,879 Speaker 1: It's unbelievable what Harry Carson has done. 324 00:17:23,119 --> 00:17:25,679 Speaker 2: Yeah, he one of his teammates had broken up with 325 00:17:25,720 --> 00:17:30,040 Speaker 2: his girlfriend. Harry knew the woman and said, I'm here 326 00:17:30,119 --> 00:17:32,800 Speaker 2: for you if you need me. He didn't necessarily expect 327 00:17:32,840 --> 00:17:36,560 Speaker 2: to get a call from the hospital that morning saying 328 00:17:36,600 --> 00:17:39,399 Speaker 2: that he was requested in the delivery room. But he 329 00:17:39,480 --> 00:17:41,639 Speaker 2: got in his car and he went and he was 330 00:17:41,680 --> 00:17:46,040 Speaker 2: just there for her. And that's just I mean, it 331 00:17:46,280 --> 00:17:48,960 Speaker 2: sounds like a cliche, really, Paul, but that's really the 332 00:17:49,040 --> 00:17:53,280 Speaker 2: kind of guy that Harry is. And nobody takes advantage 333 00:17:53,280 --> 00:17:55,639 Speaker 2: of him, but they know he's there for them, and 334 00:17:55,760 --> 00:17:58,760 Speaker 2: I think that's a really a reassuring thing for a 335 00:17:58,800 --> 00:18:00,639 Speaker 2: lot of players. I mean, he was just responsible. Ten 336 00:18:00,720 --> 00:18:02,440 Speaker 2: years after Jim Burt, this is where I got the 337 00:18:02,480 --> 00:18:05,560 Speaker 2: stories mixed up. Ten years after Jim Burt retired, the 338 00:18:05,600 --> 00:18:08,200 Speaker 2: only time he had been to the doctor was for 339 00:18:08,320 --> 00:18:11,000 Speaker 2: back surgery. Right, You wouldn't go to the doctor for 340 00:18:11,280 --> 00:18:15,440 Speaker 2: annual checkups until Harry insisted that he goes and Bert said, 341 00:18:15,440 --> 00:18:18,959 Speaker 2: I'm only going if you go with me. So Harry 342 00:18:18,960 --> 00:18:21,159 Speaker 2: and his wife picked up Bert to take him to 343 00:18:21,200 --> 00:18:25,480 Speaker 2: the doctor, and then Bert insisted that Harry come with 344 00:18:25,560 --> 00:18:28,479 Speaker 2: him into the examining room. I mean, if you can 345 00:18:28,520 --> 00:18:30,360 Speaker 2: imagine that, And then no, I know. 346 00:18:30,880 --> 00:18:33,800 Speaker 3: You're ready for a change. Payday comes early with citizens, 347 00:18:33,960 --> 00:18:37,200 Speaker 3: So go to that retreat. Knew you move to the country. 348 00:18:37,920 --> 00:18:41,400 Speaker 3: Now you're raising goats and launching a lifestyle brand. Are 349 00:18:41,440 --> 00:18:45,840 Speaker 3: you ready for all that life brings? 350 00:18:45,880 --> 00:18:48,479 Speaker 1: And Harry had often told me that he felt if 351 00:18:48,520 --> 00:18:50,280 Speaker 1: he had gotten van Pelt to go to the doctor, 352 00:18:50,400 --> 00:18:53,080 Speaker 1: yes find out about the heart ailment, maybe van Pelt 353 00:18:53,119 --> 00:18:54,040 Speaker 1: wouldn't have passed away. 354 00:18:54,400 --> 00:18:59,199 Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, and that van pell passed away prior 355 00:19:00,080 --> 00:19:03,760 Speaker 2: to I believe taking Bert to the hospital. I mean, 356 00:19:03,800 --> 00:19:08,320 Speaker 2: said a doctor. But Harry was has been determined since 357 00:19:09,200 --> 00:19:13,959 Speaker 2: Brad van Pelt died that never to let a player 358 00:19:14,040 --> 00:19:18,040 Speaker 2: refusing to go to the doctor result in him passing away. 359 00:19:18,200 --> 00:19:20,880 Speaker 2: So he checks up on all these guys. I mean, 360 00:19:20,880 --> 00:19:23,720 Speaker 2: it's almost like a full time job. But the funniest 361 00:19:23,720 --> 00:19:28,760 Speaker 2: part about the Birt story was that Harry insisted he was, 362 00:19:29,000 --> 00:19:31,639 Speaker 2: that Bert made him stay in the room the entire time. 363 00:19:32,560 --> 00:19:35,720 Speaker 2: And for any man who watched watching this, you know 364 00:19:35,800 --> 00:19:40,159 Speaker 2: of the age of needing a colonoscopy, I mean, not 365 00:19:40,200 --> 00:19:42,760 Speaker 2: a colonoscopy, but something that would lead to a colonosopy, 366 00:19:43,040 --> 00:19:45,919 Speaker 2: you know, checking prostate, you know what I mean. That 367 00:19:46,000 --> 00:19:49,560 Speaker 2: exam is not necessarily something you want anybody but the 368 00:19:49,600 --> 00:19:52,960 Speaker 2: doctor in the examining room. So Harry insists that he 369 00:19:53,040 --> 00:19:54,600 Speaker 2: was in there and just turned his head the other 370 00:19:54,680 --> 00:19:57,560 Speaker 2: way where Bert, you know, basically said that Harry was 371 00:19:57,560 --> 00:19:59,159 Speaker 2: full of it, that he would never want to let 372 00:19:59,240 --> 00:20:01,000 Speaker 2: him stay, and that's. 373 00:20:00,840 --> 00:20:02,080 Speaker 1: The I don't know, I wasn't there. 374 00:20:02,119 --> 00:20:03,800 Speaker 2: I'm not sure what the truth is, but it's pretty 375 00:20:03,800 --> 00:20:06,800 Speaker 2: funny to hear them, you know, arguing through me about 376 00:20:06,800 --> 00:20:09,359 Speaker 2: whether Harry was still in the room at that point. 377 00:20:10,080 --> 00:20:12,359 Speaker 1: Gary. That's one of the things I really love about 378 00:20:12,359 --> 00:20:14,880 Speaker 1: what you did with your book is that you had 379 00:20:14,880 --> 00:20:17,560 Speaker 1: a number of stories and comments that guys would say, 380 00:20:17,560 --> 00:20:20,520 Speaker 1: but it's clear that you were referring those stories to 381 00:20:20,760 --> 00:20:24,080 Speaker 1: other subjects and then got their reactions, so that there 382 00:20:24,160 --> 00:20:28,400 Speaker 1: was by play written into your book, which anybody who 383 00:20:28,480 --> 00:20:31,560 Speaker 1: knows those eighty six giants, knows that that was part 384 00:20:31,600 --> 00:20:34,399 Speaker 1: of the charm of that roster. You know. 385 00:20:34,480 --> 00:20:36,680 Speaker 2: One of the this is my sixth book, and one 386 00:20:36,720 --> 00:20:42,119 Speaker 2: of my favorite techniques that I use is trying to 387 00:20:42,160 --> 00:20:47,920 Speaker 2: reconstruct conversations. And you know, in this case, I used 388 00:20:47,960 --> 00:20:52,040 Speaker 2: it two different ways. One was reconstructing a conversation that 389 00:20:52,160 --> 00:20:56,720 Speaker 2: happened in nineteen eighty six by getting the individuals involved 390 00:20:57,280 --> 00:20:59,800 Speaker 2: to recall, you know, what was said at the time. 391 00:21:00,000 --> 00:21:02,359 Speaker 2: The other way I used it in this book was, 392 00:21:03,560 --> 00:21:07,439 Speaker 2: you know, having a comment from Harry Carson about something 393 00:21:07,480 --> 00:21:10,080 Speaker 2: and then going to Jim Burton getting his comment about it, 394 00:21:10,280 --> 00:21:14,760 Speaker 2: and doing that in real time on something that was 395 00:21:14,800 --> 00:21:17,920 Speaker 2: happening today or you know, since nineteen eighty six. And 396 00:21:18,480 --> 00:21:21,280 Speaker 2: I know, when I read books, I love when the 397 00:21:21,359 --> 00:21:26,080 Speaker 2: author can reconstruct a conversation. And you know, obviously you 398 00:21:26,400 --> 00:21:28,320 Speaker 2: really have to trust the person that you're talking to 399 00:21:28,440 --> 00:21:33,760 Speaker 2: that he's recalling it accurately. But I have a lot 400 00:21:33,800 --> 00:21:37,240 Speaker 2: of that in the book, and there's some really funny stuff. 401 00:21:37,520 --> 00:21:40,119 Speaker 2: Would I use that way, some really stuff? 402 00:21:40,200 --> 00:21:46,240 Speaker 1: Yeah. Obviously the Bavaro section has been pulled out, and 403 00:21:46,760 --> 00:21:49,920 Speaker 1: it's been pulled out in newspapers folks, I'm sure you've 404 00:21:49,960 --> 00:21:52,600 Speaker 1: read about it. I won't go through much detail here 405 00:21:52,720 --> 00:21:57,200 Speaker 1: other than obviously it's a tough game. It's a violent game. 406 00:21:57,640 --> 00:22:00,200 Speaker 1: There are difficulties that a number of players who have 407 00:22:00,320 --> 00:22:03,560 Speaker 1: had to go through over the years. But I think 408 00:22:03,600 --> 00:22:05,919 Speaker 1: the one thing that comes through in your book, no 409 00:22:05,960 --> 00:22:08,760 Speaker 1: matter which of the stories that you talk about, is 410 00:22:08,800 --> 00:22:11,960 Speaker 1: that somehow, some way, most of these guys have come 411 00:22:12,040 --> 00:22:16,600 Speaker 1: through on the other side. And it's because partly because 412 00:22:16,640 --> 00:22:19,280 Speaker 1: of the bond that they all shared together, because they 413 00:22:19,320 --> 00:22:21,720 Speaker 1: all do check up on each other. They all do 414 00:22:21,800 --> 00:22:25,440 Speaker 1: have these these reunions where Harry Carson takes a picture 415 00:22:25,480 --> 00:22:27,600 Speaker 1: to make sure that everybody knows that they were at 416 00:22:27,600 --> 00:22:28,359 Speaker 1: that reunion. 417 00:22:28,480 --> 00:22:31,359 Speaker 2: That's right. I'll give you a story that's in the 418 00:22:31,359 --> 00:22:35,280 Speaker 2: book that I really haven't shared with anybody yet. Curtis McGriff. 419 00:22:37,680 --> 00:22:41,240 Speaker 2: You know, his wife was telling him, you know, he 420 00:22:41,359 --> 00:22:43,399 Speaker 2: was changing as a person, that he was having a 421 00:22:43,400 --> 00:22:48,040 Speaker 2: hard time controlling his temper. Curtis had was a teacher's 422 00:22:48,160 --> 00:22:52,440 Speaker 2: assistant at a school for troubled kids in North Jersey, 423 00:22:53,200 --> 00:22:56,000 Speaker 2: and one day a kid wandered out of the classroom 424 00:22:57,200 --> 00:23:00,280 Speaker 2: and was by himself in another classroom, and these kids 425 00:23:00,359 --> 00:23:03,639 Speaker 2: really had to be watched full time. So a teacher 426 00:23:03,680 --> 00:23:07,560 Speaker 2: came into McGriff's classroom and said, hey, you better get 427 00:23:07,960 --> 00:23:09,960 Speaker 2: you know him, the kid out of the classroom. So 428 00:23:10,280 --> 00:23:13,199 Speaker 2: Curtis goes and the kid had locked himself in the 429 00:23:13,280 --> 00:23:17,800 Speaker 2: room and Curtis finally got in and he felt like 430 00:23:17,880 --> 00:23:21,240 Speaker 2: his temper boiling over in him, and he said the 431 00:23:21,320 --> 00:23:23,639 Speaker 2: thought crossed his mind to throw the kid out the window. 432 00:23:24,240 --> 00:23:26,719 Speaker 2: Oh my yeah, it was on the second floor, but 433 00:23:26,760 --> 00:23:31,640 Speaker 2: that still, you know, would have been horrific. And once 434 00:23:31,680 --> 00:23:34,360 Speaker 2: he calmed down, he didn't do that. He went down 435 00:23:34,359 --> 00:23:37,719 Speaker 2: and resigned his position at the school because he said, 436 00:23:37,840 --> 00:23:40,879 Speaker 2: these kids don't deserve that part that from me, because 437 00:23:40,880 --> 00:23:43,680 Speaker 2: they're coming here, because they're coming from broken homes or 438 00:23:43,680 --> 00:23:45,760 Speaker 2: trouble homes, and they're coming to school to be comforted. 439 00:23:45,800 --> 00:23:49,160 Speaker 2: They can't have somebody like me around. And he went 440 00:23:49,200 --> 00:23:55,439 Speaker 2: home and called Harry and he told Harry that what 441 00:23:55,600 --> 00:23:59,920 Speaker 2: happened and that he was I don't know, it's hard 442 00:23:59,920 --> 00:24:03,840 Speaker 2: to measure this, but that he was somewhat suicidal, and 443 00:24:04,760 --> 00:24:08,239 Speaker 2: Harry kind of talked him down a little bit and 444 00:24:09,080 --> 00:24:12,000 Speaker 2: got him to calm down and said, I'm here for you. 445 00:24:12,119 --> 00:24:15,639 Speaker 2: Twenty four to seven, any of these starts into your 446 00:24:15,640 --> 00:24:19,159 Speaker 2: mind again, you have to call me. Curtis went and 447 00:24:19,240 --> 00:24:25,640 Speaker 2: got help, and within a year or so he moved 448 00:24:25,640 --> 00:24:28,800 Speaker 2: back to Alabama with his wife. And when I talked 449 00:24:28,800 --> 00:24:30,119 Speaker 2: to him, he was doing great. 450 00:24:31,119 --> 00:24:31,960 Speaker 1: Oh that's wonderful. 451 00:24:32,040 --> 00:24:37,720 Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, all those problems had subsided. He didn't. 452 00:24:37,920 --> 00:24:40,320 Speaker 2: He was at the point now where Paul he didn't 453 00:24:40,320 --> 00:24:45,280 Speaker 2: feel comfortable when he's out of town going by himself, 454 00:24:45,640 --> 00:24:48,840 Speaker 2: or driving a lot by himself. Because with a lot 455 00:24:48,840 --> 00:24:50,720 Speaker 2: of these guys, they get to this point after they've 456 00:24:50,760 --> 00:24:53,399 Speaker 2: been banging heads for all those years in the NFL. 457 00:24:54,160 --> 00:24:58,800 Speaker 2: You know, they have some memory loss issues, and so 458 00:24:58,920 --> 00:25:02,919 Speaker 2: Curtis is smart and to know that he needs to 459 00:25:02,920 --> 00:25:06,359 Speaker 2: have somebody by his side, you know, other than he's 460 00:25:06,800 --> 00:25:09,879 Speaker 2: They have a hotel that he and his sister started 461 00:25:09,880 --> 00:25:12,119 Speaker 2: a business and it's doing very well. And you know, 462 00:25:12,160 --> 00:25:14,000 Speaker 2: other than just getting back and forth from his house 463 00:25:14,040 --> 00:25:16,000 Speaker 2: to the hotel, which I don't even think it really 464 00:25:17,040 --> 00:25:19,720 Speaker 2: it evolves much driving. If he does have to go 465 00:25:19,800 --> 00:25:22,359 Speaker 2: out of town, there's always somebody with him. But you know, 466 00:25:22,440 --> 00:25:25,359 Speaker 2: fortunately for him, he was one of the five guys 467 00:25:25,359 --> 00:25:26,760 Speaker 2: that I write about in the book All of it 468 00:25:26,840 --> 00:25:30,920 Speaker 2: on the record who contemplated suicide for one reason or another. 469 00:25:30,960 --> 00:25:33,560 Speaker 2: A lot of it traced back to the football injuries, 470 00:25:34,160 --> 00:25:38,960 Speaker 2: and but you know, fortunately took care of it by 471 00:25:38,960 --> 00:25:42,760 Speaker 2: seeking help or seeking teammates like McGriff did with Carson, 472 00:25:42,800 --> 00:25:46,360 Speaker 2: and then taking the extra step by getting medical help. 473 00:25:47,440 --> 00:25:49,879 Speaker 1: Final thoughts here, Gary, because we only have about ninety 474 00:25:49,920 --> 00:25:54,280 Speaker 1: seconds or so, laughed. It seems to me that because 475 00:25:54,359 --> 00:25:56,959 Speaker 1: of the way the National Football League has changed the business, 476 00:25:57,080 --> 00:26:00,159 Speaker 1: the rules, the salary cap, the free agency. You know, 477 00:26:00,400 --> 00:26:02,960 Speaker 1: it's not just about the personalities of this New York 478 00:26:03,000 --> 00:26:05,960 Speaker 1: Giants championship team of eighty six, but because of the 479 00:26:06,000 --> 00:26:08,679 Speaker 1: business of the league and how the league is now constructed, 480 00:26:08,720 --> 00:26:12,439 Speaker 1: you'll never see a team of this ilk in my 481 00:26:12,560 --> 00:26:13,560 Speaker 1: opinion ever again. 482 00:26:13,880 --> 00:26:17,440 Speaker 2: Agree or disagree, Oh, one hundred percent agree, But it's 483 00:26:17,760 --> 00:26:20,640 Speaker 2: not It's like the eighty four nine Ers and eighty 484 00:26:20,680 --> 00:26:22,840 Speaker 2: five Bears and eighty six Giants. To me, those are 485 00:26:22,880 --> 00:26:26,760 Speaker 2: the three best teams of the Super Bowl era. And 486 00:26:26,800 --> 00:26:30,080 Speaker 2: the reason that the Giants in particular are so close 487 00:26:30,160 --> 00:26:32,200 Speaker 2: knit is, as you know, it was before the free 488 00:26:32,200 --> 00:26:35,720 Speaker 2: agency era. So these teams stayed together. The players, you know, 489 00:26:35,760 --> 00:26:38,200 Speaker 2: they couldn't go anywhere So in eighty four and eighty 490 00:26:38,240 --> 00:26:40,800 Speaker 2: five the Giants won a wildcard game and lost in 491 00:26:40,800 --> 00:26:43,800 Speaker 2: the divisional round to the eventual Super Bowl champion. They 492 00:26:43,840 --> 00:26:47,440 Speaker 2: went into eighty six very confident that it was their turn, 493 00:26:47,680 --> 00:26:50,560 Speaker 2: and then when they achieved that it just as as 494 00:26:50,600 --> 00:26:53,919 Speaker 2: Parcels always says, when you win a championship, it creates 495 00:26:53,920 --> 00:26:57,600 Speaker 2: a blood kinship. And I really do think there's something 496 00:26:57,640 --> 00:27:00,879 Speaker 2: to that, because I saw it and felt it in 497 00:27:01,000 --> 00:27:04,560 Speaker 2: interviewing all these guys for this book. It's not just 498 00:27:04,640 --> 00:27:08,320 Speaker 2: lip service that Parcels was paining to this. It's a 499 00:27:08,400 --> 00:27:11,000 Speaker 2: reality that the guys. I've been around a lot of 500 00:27:11,000 --> 00:27:14,000 Speaker 2: teams covering the league over forty years. Yep, these guys 501 00:27:14,000 --> 00:27:18,360 Speaker 2: are closer together than any other team I can ever recall. 502 00:27:18,359 --> 00:27:19,600 Speaker 2: I mean, it's just amazing. 503 00:27:20,760 --> 00:27:23,480 Speaker 1: He is Gary Myers. The book is once a giant. 504 00:27:23,680 --> 00:27:28,159 Speaker 1: It is done by public Affairs. They are the publishers, folks. 505 00:27:28,160 --> 00:27:30,920 Speaker 1: You can get it anywhere books are sold, Amazon or 506 00:27:30,960 --> 00:27:33,520 Speaker 1: all your favorite bookstores. I will tell you this as 507 00:27:33,560 --> 00:27:35,760 Speaker 1: someone who lived with that team that was my fourth 508 00:27:35,840 --> 00:27:38,439 Speaker 1: year on the beat. Gary is not only telling you 509 00:27:38,560 --> 00:27:40,600 Speaker 1: all the great stuff about those guys, but a lot 510 00:27:40,640 --> 00:27:43,520 Speaker 1: of behind the scenes stories that made me chuckle, and 511 00:27:43,600 --> 00:27:46,160 Speaker 1: a bunch that just brought me back to like yesterday, 512 00:27:46,440 --> 00:27:48,439 Speaker 1: and a bunch of stuff that I didn't even know. 513 00:27:48,880 --> 00:27:51,919 Speaker 1: So Gary, it was a thrill to relive those moments 514 00:27:52,000 --> 00:27:54,480 Speaker 1: through your book and through our conversation. Thank you so 515 00:27:54,560 --> 00:27:56,720 Speaker 1: much for your time, Paul, Thanks so much for having 516 00:27:56,720 --> 00:27:57,920 Speaker 1: me on. I really appreciate it.